Re-entry

“Anterior cruciate ligament injuries are generally regarded as a particular concern for female athletes, with multiple previous studies, including those by Agel et al22 and Arendt et al,17 who reported higher rates of injury among females. Unfortunately, the plethora of such studies has led to a common belief that ACL injury is a problem for female athletes only. For example, Chappell et al19 claimed simply that female athletes have a higher risk of ACL injuries than male athletes. This assertion has been perpetuated because so few researchers have evaluated the overall incidence of ACL injuries and ACL injury rates across large numbers of sports. As shown in Table 1, football, a male sport, had the largest number of ACL injuries and also the highest competition-related ACL injury rate of the 9 sports we studied. In fact, we found no significant sex difference in ACL injury rates when all 9 sports were considered, only seeing a significantly higher rate in females when limiting analyses to sex-comparable sports (soccer, basketball, and baseball or softball). This is consistent with Mountcastle et al,20 who similarly found no sex difference between overall rates of ACL injury. Rates, however, are only one way to evaluate burden; incidence should also be considered. The high incidence of ACL injuries in football compared with other sports also demonstrates that ACL injuries are not limited to female athletes. In fact, given the large number of US high school football players relative to the number of girls’ basketball and soccer players,1 in terms of numbers of patients treated, sports medicine clinicians are more likely to treat a male high school athlete with an ACL injury than a female high school athlete with an ACL injury. Thus, in terms of sex, the burden of ACL injury is relative to the clinical or research question being asked. Although effective injury-prevention programs may need to be sex specific, given the large numbers of male athletes sustaining ACL injuries, efforts to create effective pro- grams should not be solely targeted to female athletes.”

http://natajournals.org/doi/pdf/10.4085/1062-6050-48.6.03?code=nata-site
 
4 days of training often includes fitness/strength training and one 90 minute game is less risky than multiple games over the weekend tourney. My daughter plays DA and is thrilled with not being hurt/sore after games anymore because there’s only one game a day. She can also go all out every game now. All kinds of elite athletes catch flack for doing too much, or too young. Bunch of crap. Look for examples of all those who defy the limits too. Go do what you love and learn to listen to your body and take full care of it. Girls don’t need artificial limits put on them.

Your daughter's personal experience is a pretty small sample size for an ACL risk study. It's cute you think your daughter can go hard for 90 minutes straight without a significantly increased risk of an ACL injury, and that "listening to her body" can help avoid ACL injury. Which medical study gave you that advice? Regardless, your suggestion that there are only two options, play DA without reentry or play multiple games in one day is a false choice. Is your mind really so small that you can't figure out that you shouldn't be required to do either?

Placer dad, right? I get it, you had delusions of grandeur about what the GDA would do for your daughter and irrational hopes it would allow her club to leapfrog all the other clubs in the underwhelming and rather sad Sacto soccer world. I suspect you're beginning to realize, however, that the DA is going down in flames with your daughter on board, only you aren't quite in the acceptance phase yet so you're desperately trying to convince others (but mostly yourself) that its rules are gospel. But smart people know those rules are stupid, unnecessary and potentially dangerous. That paying $10K to fly to five states plus San Diego to play teams that are worse than probably 20 NorCal clubs is insane. That anyone with half a brain and a modicum of ability is far better off at one of the local ECNL clubs. Don't worry, though, soon your daughter's club will be back in the NPL where it belongs, and you'll be making day trips to Modesto and praying Stanislaus St. got your daughter's email inviting them to scout her game against Ajax. That is, if she doesn't blow out her knee first trying to "defy the limits".
 
Your daughter's personal experience is a pretty small sample size for an ACL risk study. It's cute you think your daughter can go hard for 90 minutes straight without a significantly increased risk of an ACL injury, and that "listening to her body" can help avoid ACL injury. Which medical study gave you that advice? Regardless, your suggestion that there are only two options, play DA without reentry or play multiple games in one day is a false choice. Is your mind really so small that you can't figure out that you shouldn't be required to do either?

Placer dad, right? I get it, you had delusions of grandeur about what the GDA would do for your daughter and irrational hopes it would allow her club to leapfrog all the other clubs in the underwhelming and rather sad Sacto soccer world. I suspect you're beginning to realize, however, that the DA is going down in flames with your daughter on board, only you aren't quite in the acceptance phase yet so you're desperately trying to convince others (but mostly yourself) that its rules are gospel. But smart people know those rules are stupid, unnecessary and potentially dangerous. That paying $10K to fly to five states plus San Diego to play teams that are worse than probably 20 NorCal clubs is insane. That anyone with half a brain and a modicum of ability is far better off at one of the local ECNL clubs. Don't worry, though, soon your daughter's club will be back in the NPL where it belongs, and you'll be making day trips to Modesto and praying Stanislaus St. got your daughter's email inviting them to scout her game against Ajax. That is, if she doesn't blow out her knee first trying to "defy the limits".

Whoa! Lol! I will wish peace and happiness for you.
 
Your daughter's personal experience is a pretty small sample size for an ACL risk study. It's cute you think your daughter can go hard for 90 minutes straight without a significantly increased risk of an ACL injury, and that "listening to her body" can help avoid ACL injury. Which medical study gave you that advice? Regardless, your suggestion that there are only two options, play DA without reentry or play multiple games in one day is a false choice. Is your mind really so small that you can't figure out that you shouldn't be required to do either?

Placer dad, right? I get it, you had delusions of grandeur about what the GDA would do for your daughter and irrational hopes it would allow her club to leapfrog all the other clubs in the underwhelming and rather sad Sacto soccer world. I suspect you're beginning to realize, however, that the DA is going down in flames with your daughter on board, only you aren't quite in the acceptance phase yet so you're desperately trying to convince others (but mostly yourself) that its rules are gospel. But smart people know those rules are stupid, unnecessary and potentially dangerous. That paying $10K to fly to five states plus San Diego to play teams that are worse than probably 20 NorCal clubs is insane. That anyone with half a brain and a modicum of ability is far better off at one of the local ECNL clubs. Don't worry, though, soon your daughter's club will be back in the NPL where it belongs, and you'll be making day trips to Modesto and praying Stanislaus St. got your daughter's email inviting them to scout her game against Ajax. That is, if she doesn't blow out her knee first trying to "defy the limits".
Thanks for exposing who you truly are and your agenda. Although you make a few valid points, your credibility is shot. We should have seen it when you expressed such concern over the 4 day a week training being too much. Do you know which of those days are film study? Which ones are dedicated to technical work and/or recovery? Do you know how Coaches manage player minutes throughout the season?

Do you have any experience or are you just assuming the worst and using it to shit on something you don’t know anything about?

PS- these are rhetorical, I don’t need your answers....I already have them.
 
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“Anterior cruciate ligament injuries are generally regarded as a particular concern for female athletes, with multiple previous studies, including those by Agel et al22 and Arendt et al,17 who reported higher rates of injury among females. Unfortunately, the plethora of such studies has led to a common belief that ACL injury is a problem for female athletes only. For example, Chappell et al19 claimed simply that female athletes have a higher risk of ACL injuries than male athletes. This assertion has been perpetuated because so few researchers have evaluated the overall incidence of ACL injuries and ACL injury rates across large numbers of sports. As shown in Table 1, football, a male sport, had the largest number of ACL injuries and also the highest competition-related ACL injury rate of the 9 sports we studied. In fact, we found no significant sex difference in ACL injury rates when all 9 sports were considered, only seeing a significantly higher rate in females when limiting analyses to sex-comparable sports (soccer, basketball, and baseball or softball). This is consistent with Mountcastle et al,20 who similarly found no sex difference between overall rates of ACL injury. Rates, however, are only one way to evaluate burden; incidence should also be considered. The high incidence of ACL injuries in football compared with other sports also demonstrates that ACL injuries are not limited to female athletes. In fact, given the large number of US high school football players relative to the number of girls’ basketball and soccer players,1 in terms of numbers of patients treated, sports medicine clinicians are more likely to treat a male high school athlete with an ACL injury than a female high school athlete with an ACL injury. Thus, in terms of sex, the burden of ACL injury is relative to the clinical or research question being asked. Although effective injury-prevention programs may need to be sex specific, given the large numbers of male athletes sustaining ACL injuries, efforts to create effective pro- grams should not be solely targeted to female athletes.”

http://natajournals.org/doi/pdf/10.4085/1062-6050-48.6.03?code=nata-site
Unless I'm reading the study wrong, woman in comparable sports (soccer, basketball and baseball/softball) are at least twice a likely to have an ACL injury,which sucks. Obviously there is a physiological difference of males and females and muscle formation that cause woman to have a higher incidence of these type of injuries. From what I understand there are certain strength and condition programs for woman that can help to some degree. I think the colleges are implementing programs to help but at the club level if you don't implement some type of training outside of the club yourself it probably won't get done.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3702781/
 
Unless I'm reading the study wrong, woman in comparable sports (soccer, basketball and baseball/softball) are at least twice a likely to have an ACL injury,which sucks. Obviously there is a physiological difference of males and females and muscle formation that cause woman to have a higher incidence of these type of injuries. From what I understand there are certain strength and condition programs for woman that can help to some degree. I think the colleges are implementing programs to help but at the club level if you don't implement some type of training outside of the club yourself it probably won't get done.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3702781/

Yes, ACL injuries happen most often to football players (who are usually male) as a result of contact. All soccer players are high risk but incidence in females are increasing more rapidly (probably because the number/frequency of females competing is growing more rapidly) and unlike in males most ACL injuries to females are non contact. Cross training and strength training that focuses on building up the supporting muscles around the knee and quad is an important preventative. Many running sport athletes have weak glute and hamstring muscles that need extra focus. That’s something every player can take charge of whether their HS/club/college has a program or not.
 
Thanks for exposing who you truly are and your agenda. Although you make a few valid points, your credibility is shot. We should have seen it when you expressed such concern over the 4 day a week training being too much. Do you know which of those days are film study? Which ones are dedicated to technical work and/or recovery? Do you know how Coaches manage player minutes throughout the season?

Do you have any experience or are you just assuming the worst and using it to shit on something you don’t know anything about?

PS- these are rhetorical, I don’t need your answers....I already have them.

The GDA Mafia is relentless. Seriously, you're pointing to "film study" to justify why a 15 year old girl should play in a curriculum that requires her to give up all other sports? But as long as you're here, @Simisoccerfan and @Soccerfan2 can't seem to help me, so maybe you can forward me to the medical study that says playing 90 straight minutes has no impact on ACL injury risk for a teenage girl? Or the one that says playing one sport year round also helps avoid ACL injuries? Or the one that says "listening to your body" and "defying the limits" is a proven way to avoid ACL tears? Unlike you, I'm not asking "rhetorically" (although you really meant "passive-aggressively" in your earlier post).

It is sad that GDA parents have become so desperate to save their failing league that they're willing to deny scientific fact. It's ok, we'll still take all of you anti-vaxing climate change deniers back when the roof falls in - if you're good enough and don't have the measles. We'll even let you have a few months off to play another sport or even HS soccer if that's what you want to do. We're all about flexibility and doing what's best for your particular situation. Go figure, we also put out a much better product on the pitch at a much lower cost to the consumer.

Hugs and Kisses,

ECNL
 
The GDA Mafia is relentless. Seriously, you're pointing to "film study" to justify why a 15 year old girl should play in a curriculum that requires her to give up all other sports? But as long as you're here, @Simisoccerfan and @Soccerfan2 can't seem to help me, so maybe you can forward me to the medical study that says playing 90 straight minutes has no impact on ACL injury risk for a teenage girl? Or the one that says playing one sport year round also helps avoid ACL injuries? Or the one that says "listening to your body" and "defying the limits" is a proven way to avoid ACL tears? Unlike you, I'm not asking "rhetorically" (although you really meant "passive-aggressively" in your earlier post).

It is sad that GDA parents have become so desperate to save their failing league that they're willing to deny scientific fact. It's ok, we'll still take all of you anti-vaxing climate change deniers back when the roof falls in - if you're good enough and don't have the measles. We'll even let you have a few months off to play another sport or even HS soccer if that's what you want to do. We're all about flexibility and doing what's best for your particular situation. Go figure, we also put out a much better product on the pitch at a much lower cost to the consumer.

Hugs and Kisses,

ECNL
Keep making up arguments so you can continue to entertain us all. And I’m not talking about ACL’s.
 
The GDA Mafia is relentless. Seriously, you're pointing to "film study" to justify why a 15 year old girl should play in a curriculum that requires her to give up all other sports? But as long as you're here, @Simisoccerfan and @Soccerfan2 can't seem to help me, so maybe you can forward me to the medical study that says playing 90 straight minutes has no impact on ACL injury risk for a teenage girl? Or the one that says playing one sport year round also helps avoid ACL injuries? Or the one that says "listening to your body" and "defying the limits" is a proven way to avoid ACL tears? Unlike you, I'm not asking "rhetorically" (although you really meant "passive-aggressively" in your earlier post).

It is sad that GDA parents have become so desperate to save their failing league that they're willing to deny scientific fact. It's ok, we'll still take all of you anti-vaxing climate change deniers back when the roof falls in - if you're good enough and don't have the measles. We'll even let you have a few months off to play another sport or even HS soccer if that's what you want to do. We're all about flexibility and doing what's best for your particular situation. Go figure, we also put out a much better product on the pitch at a much lower cost to the consumer.

Hugs and Kisses,

ECNL

The "Medical Study" you used in your first post was done by someone that is a senior in college. In fact it says she is an Exercise Science Major and a former D2 Soccer Player at Mount Olive University. She is not a doctor and she seems to get most of her data from 5 to 20 years ago.
 
To be fair to EOTL, I posted the article that talked about the impact of hormones on injuries. I did it in response to a question from another poster. I had never heard this before and was curious to read this article and thought others might be also. There are references to studies, that regardless of date, do seem credible.

This thread has drifted way off topic, but someone should start an ACL thread as it does seem to incite passions. Preventing ACL injuries doesn't seem like an ECNL vs GDA debate, and hopefully every league and coach is concerned about player safety and injury prevention, or at least they should be. In the absence of this concern, I definitely agree with whoever said that parents and players need to take an active role in this. I've seen an ACL injury derail a national team prospect, and our 06 team has had 1 of our top players out for the season. These injuries can be devastating.
 
The "Medical Study" you used in your first post was done by someone that is a senior in college. In fact it says she is an Exercise Science Major and a former D2 Soccer Player at Mount Olive University. She is not a doctor and she seems to get most of her data from 5 to 20 years ago.

Have you ever had one of those moments when your opponent smugly goes for the haymaker and misses badly, leaving himself exposed for the kill shot?

I did not post the article by the Mt. Olive student, although her credentials no doubt exceed yours. The article I posted was written by Mike Young, the head fitness coach for the NC Courage and owner and Director of Performance at Athletic Labs Sports Performance Training Center. Dr. Young has a PhD in biomechanics, an MS in coaching science and a BSS in exercise physiology. He has coached professional athletes in MLS, NASL, PGA, NFL, MLB and Olympic athletes in numerous other sports. The good doctor has authored two books and dozens of articles, has lectured at a number of U.S. universities and is an occasional contributor for ESPN.

Man, the discussion of the pill really got you freaked out. Still waiting on your medical study....
 
Have you ever had one of those moments when your opponent smugly goes for the haymaker and misses badly, leaving himself exposed for the kill shot?

I did not post the article by the Mt. Olive student, although her credentials no doubt exceed yours. The article I posted was written by Mike Young, the head fitness coach for the NC Courage and owner and Director of Performance at Athletic Labs Sports Performance Training Center. Dr. Young has a PhD in biomechanics, an MS in coaching science and a BSS in exercise physiology. He has coached professional athletes in MLS, NASL, PGA, NFL, MLB and Olympic athletes in numerous other sports. The good doctor has authored two books and dozens of articles, has lectured at a number of U.S. universities and is an occasional contributor for ESPN.

Man, the discussion of the pill really got you freaked out. Still waiting on your medical study....

So none of the kids on your ECNL team go 90 min? Your advice was either don’t play soccer. Don’t play DA. Learn how to run properly or take the pill. None of that was mentioned as advice in the article you attached. In fact ACL is not even mentioned. And the advice of the article was manly centered about getting proper sleep to aid recovery.
 
So none of the kids on your ECNL team go 90 min? Your advice was either don’t play soccer. Don’t play DA. Learn how to run properly or take the pill. None of that was mentioned as advice in the article you attached. In fact ACL is not even mentioned. And the advice of the article was manly centered about getting proper sleep to aid recovery.

I think you're still woozy from the head injury I inflicted on you, because you forgot your medical study again and are seriously misrepresenting what I've been saying.

The truth is families with a genetic predisposition to knee injuries should consider whether soccer is the best sport for their daughter to play at a high level. Soccer has easily the highest knee injury rate for girls besides lacrosse (the same sport, only for those who weren't good enough at soccer), more than 5x the risk of most other team sports and also significantly higher than basketball. If your child has a genetic predisposition to knee injuries and has an opportunity to succeed in a different sport, they should consider it. I don't care if you don't give a s**t about your own kids' health, but suggesting no one should even consider genetic predispositions to catastrophic knee injuries when deciding whether their kid should commit to soccer 4-6 days a week, 11 months a year is just stupid, especially if you're going to throw her into the GDA (see below).

The truth is the GDA's no reentry rule is dangerous and unnecessary. No legitimate reason exists for this rule, not one, and there is simply no denying that in-game fatigue is the most direct cause of ACL injuries. Despite overwhelming evidence, the GDA clings to rules that significantly increase the risk of catastrophic knee (and all fatigue-related) injuries. Although you said that "ACL is not even mentioned" in the article I posted, you should actually read it when you get over being red in the face from the beat down I inflicted on you earlier and can read clearly. For starters, check out the big graph in the middle of the article titled "ACL Injury Frequency by Minutes Played". Despite being a science denier, you can at least read graphs, right? If not, the short lines on the left are good, and the tall lines on the right are bad.

The truth is that learning the appropriate biomechanics of running can significantly reduce the risk of injury. I'm not sure you're even disputing this, so I'll just move on to the subject that freaks you out, menstruation and the pill. The truth is that the pill almost certainly helps reduce the risk of ACL injuries in girls, and I take it from your failure to provide any medical study to the contrary despite plenty of opportunity and repeated requests, that all you have to say is "nuh-uh". I can only imagine how much time you spent frantically running Google searches without success. Let me speed things along for everyone, because they deserve more persuasive info than your anti-science, juvenile debate tactic: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5524267/; https://ryortho.com/breaking/birth-control-pills-decrease-likelihood-of-knee-injuries/; https://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/..._of_Oral_Contraceptive_Use_on_Anterior.9.aspx. Spoiler alert, these studies were not conducted by a Mt. Olive undergrad student who played DII soccer, not that there's anything wrong with that.

I understand why your daughter is going as far away as possible for college.
 
Just curious, what is the argument that DA makes for their current sub rules? Our team playing in 06 DPL has limited subs also which seems unnecessary.
 
I think you're still woozy from the head injury I inflicted on you, because you forgot your medical study again and are seriously misrepresenting what I've been saying.

The truth is families with a genetic predisposition to knee injuries should consider whether soccer is the best sport for their daughter to play at a high level. Soccer has easily the highest knee injury rate for girls besides lacrosse (the same sport, only for those who weren't good enough at soccer), more than 5x the risk of most other team sports and also significantly higher than basketball. If your child has a genetic predisposition to knee injuries and has an opportunity to succeed in a different sport, they should consider it. I don't care if you don't give a s**t about your own kids' health, but suggesting no one should even consider genetic predispositions to catastrophic knee injuries when deciding whether their kid should commit to soccer 4-6 days a week, 11 months a year is just stupid, especially if you're going to throw her into the GDA (see below).

The truth is the GDA's no reentry rule is dangerous and unnecessary. No legitimate reason exists for this rule, not one, and there is simply no denying that in-game fatigue is the most direct cause of ACL injuries. Despite overwhelming evidence, the GDA clings to rules that significantly increase the risk of catastrophic knee (and all fatigue-related) injuries. Although you said that "ACL is not even mentioned" in the article I posted, you should actually read it when you get over being red in the face from the beat down I inflicted on you earlier and can read clearly. For starters, check out the big graph in the middle of the article titled "ACL Injury Frequency by Minutes Played". Despite being a science denier, you can at least read graphs, right? If not, the short lines on the left are good, and the tall lines on the right are bad.

The truth is that learning the appropriate biomechanics of running can significantly reduce the risk of injury. I'm not sure you're even disputing this, so I'll just move on to the subject that freaks you out, menstruation and the pill. The truth is that the pill almost certainly helps reduce the risk of ACL injuries in girls, and I take it from your failure to provide any medical study to the contrary despite plenty of opportunity and repeated requests, that all you have to say is "nuh-uh". I can only imagine how much time you spent frantically running Google searches without success. Let me speed things along for everyone, because they deserve more persuasive info than your anti-science, juvenile debate tactic: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5524267/; https://ryortho.com/breaking/birth-control-pills-decrease-likelihood-of-knee-injuries/; https://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/..._of_Oral_Contraceptive_Use_on_Anterior.9.aspx. Spoiler alert, these studies were not conducted by a Mt. Olive undergrad student who played DII soccer, not that there's anything wrong with that.

I understand why your daughter is going as far away as possible for college.

Hey, asshole! You don't know me! I have a great relationship with all of my kids. If you don't like how I respond to your posts that's fine but keep any reference to my kids out of your idiotic posts.
 
You have to look at the DA's no re-entry rule along with the rule that requires all players to start at least 25% of the time. In practice this means that most teams limit their subbing to the second half of the game. Girls that are at the end of the bench get substantial playing time when they start along with time off the bench when not starting. Without these rules I have seen almost all teams always start the same players maybe occasionally mixing up the starters with the first few subs. Girls at the end of the bench almost never start. If they do get into the game its usually only for a few minutes at a time and if they do make mistakes the coach can quickly yank them out.
 
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