Second Year of Comp: Questions and Advice

G

Gamer0126

BRONZE
I want to be a better informed parent for my daughter, she is 2012. Last year we were invited to three clubs however we either we had a run of bad luck or just picked the wrong club. The problems my daughter faced was: placed on a different team after we paid, 3 coaches with in a season, teammates who were never really invested, and the final coach was not conductive to her progression. I can get into details but I rather not I have wasted enough energy with my complaints.

Now she has five invites based on other coaches seeing her on the field and being invited to tryouts and evaluations. I really don't want to make the wrong decision, and at the current club she was selected to be moved up to the top team. She is excited with this and wants to stay with the few friends she has. Honestly I was too because they found what I thought was a good coach on paper, however after a day of coaching he left and we have a new temp coach, how long will he stay I am not sure.

In the end my daughter has played one year on a Flight 4 team up one year (2011), during try outs several coaches asked why she was on Flight 4? I have no experience with American Soccer Competitive politics so I didn't know I can ask for her to moved up. My experience has been hours and hours of pick up ball, where you play all day until the sun goes down. I have no clue how to navigate this, all I know is how to train properly and my daughter has the drive and focus. Most of the invites are flight2/1, we are waiting on one more which might be at DPL, which I think may be too big of a jump for her. However she knows it will be alot of running and training and is looking forward to it. Now with this background I have the following questions:
  • Is it normal for a club to go through so many coaches with in the season?
    • I see the posts here and it seems coaches change but not within the season.
  • How can I meet the specific coach and see the team, without paying?
    • I asked this during the try outs and the executive guy seemed to not like that question and stated we typically do not do that.
    • Is this a normal request or am I being crazy?
    • The reason is on our current team the practice is not well organized and the teammates do not respect/listen to the coach.
  • Experience with Albion Central San Diego?
    • I see several posts about Albion specifically East County, but is Central San Diego comparable.
Based off all the tryouts, I think Albion is the most organized at least the Central San Diego. Rebels is very well organized too. I will not make negative comments of the other because it will be based off of my very brief interaction with the club during tryouts. However we are definitely moving clubs because of the high turn over rate in coaching we have seen.

Thanks in advance for any replies.
 
It is absolutely not normal to burn through several coaches on the same team in the same season. Something internal is not right and it exists in a place that parents are not privy to seeing. You won't know "what" is wrong but you definitely know something is wrong. Crap rolls downhill. So if there is discontent amongst your Board of Directors, Executive staff and coaches, then eventually the kids will pick up on the dysfunction, even if they can't tell exactly what is wrong. That will tank morale and people will start to abandon ship.

If you ask to meet a coach ahead of time or watch the team practice a couple of times, there should never be any push back. Any response otherwise means they have something to hide. Walk away. Directors who are confident and proud about what they have to offer you can't wait to get you in front of their product. Practice is already occurring so watching it doesn't cost anyone anything. It is your time - why would a director or coach care if you spent your time to view it? If you asked for test drive at the car lot, you don't have to sign a contract or make a non refundable down payment do you? The same applies here.

Albion San Diego (Ocean Beach/Robb Field) is a very large club. Is it well run? I have no clue. And at any given club, the girls program might be very different from the boys program. I can tell you that there are very few high level girls programs that are large and well established in San Diego County. Albion SD happens to be one of them. Rebels (Chula Vista) is another along with City Carlsbad and of course, Surf (Del Mar).

The key is to find a club that will place your daughter in an appropriate setting and develop her. It would be nice if that club was flexible enough to allow for her to move teams mid season should her skills allow - but that varies from club to club. Some make a choice based of tryouts and even if they made a mistake, they wont move that player up or down until next season. That's a club culture that will vary. What you want for her is consistency from the staff and consistency from her fellow teammates.

In my experience, the higher the flight level, the better the attendance is from the players and the better behaved they are during practice with the coach. Those teams have players who are serious about their sport and it shows. Flight 3 and 4 can sometimes just be full of rec minded players or worse, recreation level minded parents who don't care either way. I hope your daughter finds the right place because it will completely replenish the joy she once had for the sport.
 
Very Important rule for So Cal Soccer --Act Broke--
Never pay full price
Never pay in full
Ask for monthly payments

If you pay full pop in the beginning, your stuck, even when we were happy I was told to do this and I always had good success, others I know paid thousands upfront only to lose it when they decided to leave

Going Forward Pay monthly , say you can't afford to not do this.
 
Gamer0126 said:
I want to be a better informed parent for my daughter, she is 2012. Last year we were invited to three clubs however we either we had a run of bad luck or just picked the wrong club. The problems my daughter faced was: placed on a different team after we paid, 3 coaches with in a season, teammates who were never really invested, and the final coach was not conductive to her progression. I can get into details but I rather not I have wasted enough energy with my complaints.

Now she has five invites based on other coaches seeing her on the field and being invited to tryouts and evaluations. I really don't want to make the wrong decision, and at the current club she was selected to be moved up to the top team. She is excited with this and wants to stay with the few friends she has. Honestly I was too because they found what I thought was a good coach on paper, however after a day of coaching he left and we have a new temp coach, how long will he stay I am not sure.

In the end my daughter has played one year on a Flight 4 team up one year (2011), during try outs several coaches asked why she was on Flight 4? I have no experience with American Soccer Competitive politics so I didn't know I can ask for her to moved up. My experience has been hours and hours of pick up ball, where you play all day until the sun goes down. I have no clue how to navigate this, all I know is how to train properly and my daughter has the drive and focus. Most of the invites are flight2/1, we are waiting on one more which might be at DPL, which I think may be too big of a jump for her. However she knows it will be alot of running and training and is looking forward to it. Now with this background I have the following questions:
  • Is it normal for a club to go through so many coaches with in the season?
    • I see the posts here and it seems coaches change but not within the season.
  • How can I meet the specific coach and see the team, without paying?
    • I asked this during the try outs and the executive guy seemed to not like that question and stated we typically do not do that.
    • Is this a normal request or am I being crazy?
    • The reason is on our current team the practice is not well organized and the teammates do not respect/listen to the coach.
  • Experience with Albion Central San Diego?
    • I see several posts about Albion specifically East County, but is Central San Diego comparable.
Based off all the tryouts, I think Albion is the most organized at least the Central San Diego. Rebels is very well organized too. I will not make negative comments of the other because it will be based off of my very brief interaction with the club during tryouts. However we are definitely moving clubs because of the high turn over rate in coaching we have seen.

Thanks in advance for any replies.
Click to expand...
I'm Speechless

1741099972523.png
 
NewUser27 said:
Very Important rule for So Cal Soccer --Act Broke--
Never pay full price
Never pay in full
Ask for monthly payments

If you pay full pop in the beginning, your stuck, even when we were happy I was told to do this and I always had good success, others I know paid thousands upfront only to lose it when they decided to leave

Going Forward Pay monthly , say you can't afford to not do this.
Click to expand...
The is probably the best advice I've read on here. One year I was so broke, I didn't even have to act. I will say for a few years I never had to pay anything, but that deal also comes with a price. I paid full price once and learned my lesson to act poor all the time.

I think the Act Broke will keep you from not only being broke from this travel soccer leagues that now have more flights them O'Hara airport. Act Broke when everyone wants you to go eat after the game. This can be very expensive, especially if one of the parents takes off without paying. If you act broke, someone will pay for you. It worked when I was broke, so I know if you act broke, you won't go broke.
 
1741101609803.png

It sucks to get stuck and were all here to help. My heart goes out to you and all parents who get stuck with bullshit in pay for play youth soccer.

Tryouts

Parent: Hey tryout Executive, can I meet the coach for my daughters' potential new team

Executive: Yes, after you pay in full and meet him/her at first practice

Parent: The socal soccer forum for parents to help each other (except when I asked for help in 2018, I was attacked) is saying I should under no circumstance pay in full and only pay when I know who the coach is so I can meet him and have a face to face.

Executive: Truth be told, we have no coach and I'm trying to find one. I know how to pick them, trust me. I see lot's of potential in your daughter. I got two spots left and I want it for you. Pay in full is my advice because were now offering 15% off. The other club is only 10%

Lastly, as an empath, this is sad and truly with zero satire, what a complete mess. Always feel free to ask us questions OP. Were here for you and believe me, we feel your pain and frustration.
 
SuckItTrebek said:
If you ask to meet a coach ahead of time or watch the team practice a couple of times, there should never be any push back. Any response otherwise means they have something to hide. Walk away. Directors who are confident and proud about what they have to offer you can't wait to get you in front of their product. Practice is already occurring so watching it doesn't cost anyone anything. It is your time - why would a director or coach care if you spent your time to view it? If you asked for test drive at the car lot, you don't have to sign a contract or make a non refundable down payment do you? The same applies here.
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100%. Clubs have this odd mentality where they believe they're the customer and you should be grateful that they're training your kid. Parents are not to be seen or heard, only to write a check. To add to your car analogy, in what other service industry do you prepay for services to be rendered and not as they're rendered? It's one of the major drawbacks to pay to play. If parents took back some of the power, we might be able to improve youth soccer; however, too many parents believe the club BS and have FOMO.
 
Contact coaches directly and ask to come practice with the team. After the practice, ask your player for their opinion. Their opinion should be the primary driver on selecting a team. When my DD tried out with the team she stayed until ageing out, she got in the car and said "I love this team!"
 
NewUser27 said:
Very Important rule for So Cal Soccer --Act Broke--
Never pay full price
Never pay in full
Ask for monthly payments

If you pay full pop in the beginning, your stuck, even when we were happy I was told to do this and I always had good success, others I know paid thousands upfront only to lose it when they decided to leave

Going Forward Pay monthly , say you can't afford to not do this.
Click to expand...
This 100% best advice on here
 
watfly said:
100%. Clubs have this odd mentality where they believe they're the customer and you should be grateful that they're training your kid. Parents are not to be seen or heard, only to write a check. To add to your car analogy, in what other service industry do you prepay for services to be rendered and not as they're rendered? It's one of the major drawbacks to pay to play. If parents took back some of the power, we might be able to improve youth soccer; however, too many parents believe the club BS and have FOMO.
Click to expand...
Parents need a voice for sure. Tad always asked me, "crush, who are the customers?" I thought and before I could make a guess, he said, "the parents." The light went on. He then asked a question I didn't know the answer. "What do the paying customers want for paying."
 
Gamer0126 said:
I want to be a better informed parent for my daughter, she is 2012. Last year we were invited to three clubs however we either we had a run of bad luck or just picked the wrong club. The problems my daughter faced was: placed on a different team after we paid, 3 coaches with in a season, teammates who were never really invested, and the final coach was not conductive to her progression. I can get into details but I rather not I have wasted enough energy with my complaints.

Now she has five invites based on other coaches seeing her on the field and being invited to tryouts and evaluations. I really don't want to make the wrong decision, and at the current club she was selected to be moved up to the top team. She is excited with this and wants to stay with the few friends she has. Honestly I was too because they found what I thought was a good coach on paper, however after a day of coaching he left and we have a new temp coach, how long will he stay I am not sure.

In the end my daughter has played one year on a Flight 4 team up one year (2011), during try outs several coaches asked why she was on Flight 4? I have no experience with American Soccer Competitive politics so I didn't know I can ask for her to moved up. My experience has been hours and hours of pick up ball, where you play all day until the sun goes down. I have no clue how to navigate this, all I know is how to train properly and my daughter has the drive and focus. Most of the invites are flight2/1, we are waiting on one more which might be at DPL, which I think may be too big of a jump for her. However she knows it will be alot of running and training and is looking forward to it. Now with this background I have the following questions:
  • Is it normal for a club to go through so many coaches with in the season?
    • I see the posts here and it seems coaches change but not within the season.
  • How can I meet the specific coach and see the team, without paying?
    • I asked this during the try outs and the executive guy seemed to not like that question and stated we typically do not do that.
    • Is this a normal request or am I being crazy?
    • The reason is on our current team the practice is not well organized and the teammates do not respect/listen to the coach.
  • Experience with Albion Central San Diego?
    • I see several posts about Albion specifically East County, but is Central San Diego comparable.
Based off all the tryouts, I think Albion is the most organized at least the Central San Diego. Rebels is very well organized too. I will not make negative comments of the other because it will be based off of my very brief interaction with the club during tryouts. However we are definitely moving clubs because of the high turn over rate in coaching we have seen.

Thanks in advance for any replies.
Click to expand...
Literally just tell them you're not paying until you've tried a team out for a couple months. Get to know the other parents on that team and ask them how the prior year went. Ask them if any players left the team since the prior year. Ask them about the coach and if the club is well run. Don't part with a dollar until you're absolutely sure. They will tell you there's a deadline, but if your player is one of the top on the team she is training with, then there really isn't a deadline.
 
watfly said:
100%. Clubs have this odd mentality where they believe they're the customer and you should be grateful that they're training your kid. Parents are not to be seen or heard, only to write a check. To add to your car analogy, in what other service industry do you prepay for services to be rendered and not as they're rendered? It's one of the major drawbacks to pay to play. If parents took back some of the power, we might be able to improve youth soccer; however, too many parents believe the club BS and have FOMO.
Click to expand...
Also remember, if your child is one of the top players on her team, you're not just the customer - you're also the product. DOCs and coaches are selling your daughter's team as the place to be and your child is the top selling point. "Look at our top team with these great players." We all would have so much power, if we would only use it. Don't ever be bashful about asking for what your child deserves.
 
TopesWin said:
Also remember, if your child is one of the top players on her team, you're not just the customer - you're also the product. DOCs and coaches are selling your daughter's team as the place to be and your child is the top selling point. "Look at our top team with these great players." We all would have so much power, if we would only use it. Don't ever be bashful about asking for what your child deserves.
Click to expand...

Sure - but this is completely dependent on where the coach feels the player fits in. On one extreme - the parent doesn't need to pay anything, and the coach is begging them to just show up, and they can have all the playtime they want at their preferred position. A "normal" player on the team gets none of these privileges, and pays full freight, or loses their spot. A more tenuous player on the other side of the bench is not only paying full freight, but knows if they (or their parents) complain about literally anything, they will likely be dropped from the team at the earliest opportunity.

It's a good gig for some - it can be a challenging environment for others.
 
TopesWin said:
Also remember, if your child is one of the top players on her team, you're not just the customer - you're also the product. DOCs and coaches are selling your daughter's team as the place to be and your child is the top selling point. "Look at our top team with these great players." We all would have so much power, if we would only use it. Don't ever be bashful about asking for what your child deserves.
Click to expand...
Just make sure your kid is actually the top player, and not that you just think they're the top player. ;)
 
Thank you so much for all the feedback, as advised I held my ground about the practice and paying. The pressure to pay from some of these coaches is crazy however I do understand the need they want a committed roster so they know they have a team put together. We attended a couple of practices and my daughter interacted with the teammates. As mentioned in previous posts in these higher Flights the girls are completely focused listening to the coach, also what I saw was little to no social cliques. We did sign on and like mentioned before we are on a monthly plan, even to the extent of mailing by check instead of credit card, so they do not have my credit card information. I should have gotten the hint from this past team how bad it was going to be because I know of three families who left the team after having paid the fees in full. Then went onto another club to pay the fees there.

In regards to top player, I don't consider my daughter to be a top player, possibly third or second in regards to the team she has left. We have a list of items she has to work on and we do when her and I have training sessions. She has seen the teammates of the team she chose and she knows she will have to work hard for the next couple of weeks/months to step up her game, no sugar coating it, she will more than likely not start. She started on her previous team, but not in the position she wanted.

Which brings me to something I struggled with in her past season. I do not complain to the coach, it is his team and his name is on the roster not mine. I will train my daughter and work on the items I see on the field where she needs cleaning up. However I did notice something very odd with this team. The players the coach picked to be starters, or the players he picked for positions seemed not choices I think would be best for example, not running as a winger to the ball when the pass is made down the line, disinterest in challenging for the ball (no body shielding) I could go on but I will limit it. These same players were the same kids of the parents who would complain to the coach in a loud and often cruel manner after practices, things such as: she doesn't run because she has diabetes, she doesn't like running, she is bored with sprints.

Given these examples is it normal to have to complain to the coach for my daughter to see field time? I hope the answer is no, but again I come from a background where I just played pick up. It also ties into asking for what my child deserves.

As a side note my Dad who did played professionally in his home country mentioned, what I took in a joking matter at first, was to give a "mordidad" to the coach. He left his team because the coach asked for this upfront he was very poor. I spoke to people I play pick up with and they seemed to say it wouldn't surprise them if there was something going on in the background which would account for this.

In the end we are moving on from this club, and we will never interact with this coach. I hope for my daughters sake this season will be more structured and she will get to experience a normal season with a committed group.

Thanks again for all the advice.
 
Gamer0126 said:
Thank you so much for all the feedback, as advised I held my ground about the practice and paying. The pressure to pay from some of these coaches is crazy however I do understand the need they want a committed roster so they know they have a team put together. We attended a couple of practices and my daughter interacted with the teammates. As mentioned in previous posts in these higher Flights the girls are completely focused listening to the coach, also what I saw was little to no social cliques. We did sign on and like mentioned before we are on a monthly plan, even to the extent of mailing by check instead of credit card, so they do not have my credit card information. I should have gotten the hint from this past team how bad it was going to be because I know of three families who left the team after having paid the fees in full. Then went onto another club to pay the fees there.

In regards to top player, I don't consider my daughter to be a top player, possibly third or second in regards to the team she has left. We have a list of items she has to work on and we do when her and I have training sessions. She has seen the teammates of the team she chose and she knows she will have to work hard for the next couple of weeks/months to step up her game, no sugar coating it, she will more than likely not start. She started on her previous team, but not in the position she wanted.

Which brings me to something I struggled with in her past season. I do not complain to the coach, it is his team and his name is on the roster not mine. I will train my daughter and work on the items I see on the field where she needs cleaning up. However I did notice something very odd with this team. The players the coach picked to be starters, or the players he picked for positions seemed not choices I think would be best for example, not running as a winger to the ball when the pass is made down the line, disinterest in challenging for the ball (no body shielding) I could go on but I will limit it. These same players were the same kids of the parents who would complain to the coach in a loud and often cruel manner after practices, things such as: she doesn't run because she has diabetes, she doesn't like running, she is bored with sprints.

Given these examples is it normal to have to complain to the coach for my daughter to see field time? I hope the answer is no, but again I come from a background where I just played pick up. It also ties into asking for what my child deserves.

As a side note my Dad who did played professionally in his home country mentioned, what I took in a joking matter at first, was to give a "mordidad" to the coach. He left his team because the coach asked for this upfront he was very poor. I spoke to people I play pick up with and they seemed to say it wouldn't surprise them if there was something going on in the background which would account for this.

In the end we are moving on from this club, and we will never interact with this coach. I hope for my daughters sake this season will be more structured and she will get to experience a normal season with a committed group.

Thanks again for all the advice.
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It's generally (YMMV) a bad idea to individually coach you own kid for a number of reasons:
1. Especially if the parent is of the same gender (father-son; mother-daughter), it will contribute to the tension typically felt as the child rebels especially as they enter the teen years. While I have heard (mostly on these forums) instances of it working out, it generally ends badly (which is why a lot of pros in various sports get others to coach their kids).
2. The parent may not have the knowledge to properly incorrect the child or to see everything which is potentially going wrong. As a pro family, that likely is less of the case for you
3. It places the parent in the role of instructor. The parent begins to see the child's failings as their failings for not getting the results hoped for. The child begins to fear disappointing their instructor. It places the parent also in the role of having to discipline the child for failure to respond to their instruction, instead of letting the child make their own mind whether to adhere to the advice. So it tends to degrade the relationship and take away from the parents primary role (which after bank, is to be there to be supportive of the athlete).
4. It places the parent in the role of taskmaster. As a result of 3, the parent may feel the need to push the child to practice. The parent may get emotional because the parent cares more about the result (in which they are now invested in as an instructor) than the child. The surest fire failure and way for your kid to quit is if the parent cares more than the kid.
5. It invests the parent in the performance of the team. So as a result the parent may see things the coach is doing that are wrong. The parent may become a vocal critic on the sideline. The parent may become a nuisance to the coach because they are trying to control things. The parent may go on messaging boards and bemoan how the coach is operating the team. A lot of goalkeeper parents have this problem...because coaches aren't knowledgeable it forces us to become knowledgeable to protect our kids, but then we need to learn to keep ourselves in check.

In short, it's usually better, if you can afford it, to have someone else take responsibility for individual coaching and to have the child responsible for asking when to train. YMMV. If you are a chill about everything, don't freak out about how coaches assign playing time or assess your kid, don't pressure the kid, it might work out. But most people aren't that evolved: I've seen some really bad crash outs.
 
Gamer0126 said:
Which brings me to something I struggled with in her past season. I do not complain to the coach, it is his team and his name is on the roster not mine. I will train my daughter and work on the items I see on the field where she needs cleaning up. However I did notice something very odd with this team. The players the coach picked to be starters, or the players he picked for positions seemed not choices I think would be best for example, not running as a winger to the ball when the pass is made down the line, disinterest in challenging for the ball (no body shielding) I could go on but I will limit it. These same players were the same kids of the parents who would complain to the coach in a loud and often cruel manner after practices, things such as: she doesn't run because she has diabetes, she doesn't like running, she is bored with sprints.

Given these examples is it normal to have to complain to the coach for my daughter to see field time? I hope the answer is no, but again I come from a background where I just played pick up. It also ties into asking for what my child deserves.
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This is always dependent on the coach and club, in my experience. However, take that with a grain of salt: my kid is not a star player, I'm a sucker (per other commenters here) who pays full price for club, and I don't feel like I'm in a position to ask for special treatment.

That said, my kid has always been a starter and valuable player on his team. I, also, work on areas with my kid where I think he needs to improve, review game recordings with him independently, and sometime emphasize different things than the club does. I've talked with the coach a few times about play style, things he looks for, etc., but always in a friendly way, and 1-1. There are things which the coaches do which I do not understand, and decisions which are made which are not the same as what I would do, and that's normal.

There is, undoubtedly, some amount of "pay to play" within some clubs (eg: if you pay for privates with the coach, you will get preferential play time). I haven't experienced much of this personally, and I don't do privates, but it's club and coach specific. I find that the best approach, for me, when I'm dissatisfied with how the coach is playing my kid, is to have a friendly 1-1 discussion where I ask what he needs to improve in order to get to where the coach will play him as I would want. I've been happy with the results in my instance, but if you are not, then it may not be the right environment for your kid to thrive.

Anyway, that's my 2c.
 
Gamer0126 said:
Given these examples is it normal to have to complain to the coach for my daughter to see field time? I hope the answer is no, but again I come from a background where I just played pick up. It also ties into asking for what my child deserves.
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In our own expereince, it's more effective to let your daughter have that conversation with the coach herself (maybe from U9 and up). It's never too early for kids to learn to speak for themselves. It doesn't need to be a long discussion. Simple questions such as "What do I need to do to get more playing time?", or "If we are up by 3 goals in a game, can I play some winger instead of always playing centerback?".

Coaches get offended when parents want to have a say in roster construction and playing time, i.e. you're telling him how to make his soccer team better. It's more genuine and less confrontational when the request comes from a kid.
 
Regarding training my daughter I am the father (*Maury Povich voice*), but in all seriousness. I train her with ball touches (left and right), sprints, first touch and direction, Brazilians, and body direction. Confidence comes from touching the ball more and handling the ball during sprints. If we didn't do these things, she definitely wouldn't have made it to any of the teams she has offers from. The instructions the previous coach had given her were very little to nothing. The only thing I ask of her during our training is her focus and trying hard. I don't expect perfection during our training sessions nor during the game, because everyone makes mistakes and when things go bad you have to keep your composure. She is on the field not me, she will be in her head and if I am criticizing every movement she will be more prone to mistakes. Every kid makes mistakes on the field or the plan you had just doesn't go the way you wanted to but you tried. I leave it up to the Coach to correct any mistakes.

She went up to the Coach herself and asked what do I need to do to be moved to midfield, his answer was "Just Keep doing what you are doing". He did put her in mid at one point and she was good for a majority of the half, great passes, great stops on transitions but she did miss one ball on a throw in at which point the coach pulled her out and I quote stated "See you are not ready for that position, I knew you would not be ready". There are more examples of his interaction with other players but again I rather not waste more energy on him. Really at this point it doesn't matter we have moved on, but the belittling of the team and of a couple of choice teammates (which my daughter was one of) lead to scores of 0-8, 0-6, 0-10.

I am a big believer in her taking ownership of her communication with the Coach because she needs to have confidence within herself and with the team. We are also part of Lego Robotics and that is one key factor in the competitions, communicating with your team and deliberating with the Lego Robotics Judges for scoring points on the field.

Regarding a private coach we do have one, he works on her finishing kick, her handling the ball under pressure, and reflexes. He has really elevated her power kicks and her reflexes. I have no clue on how to train some one on how to do a power kick or reflexes.
 
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