# SW Club Rankings So Far



## Desert Hound

Slow day at work. Systems are down. Lots of time to look around all corners of the internet.

Based on pts per game through both divisions. Then ranked clubs 1-17 overall.

As of what is posted online from top to bottom. Just a sum of what position they ended up in over all age groups. Some clubs had the same numbers. 



koge10legends15surf27beach31blues31slammers43rebels47sporting61lafc61royals62eagles64arsenal67strikers69heat74breakers78rising79sharks90


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## Speed

what 


Desert Hound said:


> Slow day at work. Systems are down. Lots of time to look around all corners of the internet.
> 
> Based on pts per game through both divisions. Then ranked clubs 1-17 overall.
> 
> As of what is posted online from top to bottom. Just a sum of what position they ended up in over all age groups. Some clubs had the same numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> koge10legends15surf27beach31blues31slammers43rebels47sporting61lafc61royals62eagles64arsenal67strikers69heat74breakers78rising79sharks90


what do you mean both divisions?


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## Desert Hound

Speed said:


> what
> 
> what do you mean both divisions?


Well in the SW they split it into Mojave and Sonoran. So I looked at points per game...and then per age group ranked them 1 to 17. 

Then looked at current ranking across all age groups by club. And ordered them as such.


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> Slow day at work. Systems are down. Lots of time to look around all corners of the internet.
> 
> Based on pts per game through both divisions. Then ranked clubs 1-17 overall.
> 
> As of what is posted online from top to bottom. Just a sum of what position they ended up in over all age groups. Some clubs had the same numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> koge10legends15surf27beach31blues31slammers43rebels47sporting61lafc61royals62eagles64arsenal67strikers69heat74breakers78rising79sharks90


Not a banner year for the AZ teams.  Hurts that the Rising 06 team has scored 2 goals and their 05s are underperforming.  Overall, the 06s are not doing very well.  The Royals seniors are as advertised.  Hoping for a better 2nd half and fuller rosters.


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## Footy30

Desert Hound said:


> Slow day at work. Systems are down. Lots of time to look around all corners of the internet.
> 
> Based on pts per game through both divisions. Then ranked clubs 1-17 overall.
> 
> As of what is posted online from top to bottom. Just a sum of what position they ended up in over all age groups. Some clubs had the same numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> koge10legends15surf27beach31blues31slammers43rebels47sporting61lafc61royals62eagles64arsenal67strikers69heat74breakers78rising79sharks90


haha dang hound, when I'm bored at work I am not this productive... good stuff!
Aren't Sporting and Arsenal the same team?


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## Kicker4Life

Footy30 said:


> haha dang hound, when I'm bored at work I am not this productive... good stuff!
> Aren't Sporting and Arsenal the same team?


AZ Arsenal v Sporting Arsenal


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## Kicker4Life

what-happened said:


> Hoping for a better 2nd half and fuller rosters.


I’m with you there. My youngest DD’s team has 3 starters out with ACL’s and 3 other starters out with foot/ankle injuries.  Our club his nickname the squad the MASH unit!

We should have all but one back after the high school break. We are very much looking forward to being back at full strength.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> Not a banner year for the AZ teams.  Hurts that the Rising 06 team has scored 2 goals and their 05s are underperforming.  Overall, the 06s are not doing very well.  The Royals seniors are as advertised.  Hoping for a better 2nd half and fuller rosters.


I think middle of the pack in the SW or close is pretty good for AZ clubs. Competition is tough. Now in certain age groups a club might do better. 

The AZ clubs play each other soon. Royals plays Arsenal this weekend, and Arsenal plays Rising in 3 weeks. Rising and Royals don't play until after the break.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> Not a banner year for the AZ teams.  Hurts that the Rising 06 team has scored 2 goals and their 05s are underperforming.  Overall, the 06s are not doing very well.  The Royals seniors are as advertised.  Hoping for a better 2nd half and fuller rosters.


Rising has a couple of teams dead last and not competitive. Then as you say 1 maybe 2 age groups underperforming. 

I find it interesting that at the entry age group right now Arsenal has the best team. Rising is absolutely not competitive at that age group. 

As aggressive as the Royals are, I would have expected them to currently have a better team at that age group. Arsenal is surprising due to their distant location.

That said, unless a team at that age group is really good, you will see changes to those rosters as the clubs get rid of certain players and recruit others. 

Inside AZ talk here.


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## RedHawk

Desert Hound said:


> Rising has a couple of teams dead last and not competitive. Then as you say 1 maybe 2 age groups underperforming.
> 
> I find it interesting that at the entry age group right now Arsenal has the best team. Rising is absolutely not competitive at that age group.
> 
> As aggressive as the Royals are, I would have expected them to currently have a better team at that age group. Arsenal is surprising due to their distant location.
> 
> That said, unless a team at that age group is really good, you will see changes to those rosters as the clubs get rid of certain players and recruit others.
> 
> Inside AZ talk here.


I doubt Az can compete with three clubs watering down the talent at each club.  I’m not from Az.  What club would be best positioned to attract top talent considering coaches and geography to compete with the big dogs in the SW conference??


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## Desert Hound

RedHawk said:


> I doubt Az can compete with three clubs watering down the talent at each club.  I’m not from Az.  What club would be best positioned to attract top talent considering coaches and geography to compete with the big dogs in the SW conference??


I think AZ can on average field middle of the pack type results. Very hard to go uo against the good ones in CA.

The club on paper best positioned would be Royals to answer your question.

Easily the largest club in AZ with aggressive leadership.

And yes it makes things harder with talent spread out over 3 ECNL clubs in the area


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> Rising has a couple of teams dead last and not competitive. Then as you say 1 maybe 2 age groups underperforming.
> 
> I find it interesting that at the entry age group right now Arsenal has the best team. Rising is absolutely not competitive at that age group.
> 
> As aggressive as the Royals are, I would have expected them to currently have a better team at that age group. Arsenal is surprising due to their distant location.
> 
> That said, unless a team at that age group is really good, you will see changes to those rosters as the clubs get rid of certain players and recruit others.
> 
> Inside AZ talk here.


Def inside AZ talk here.  Not much recruiting going on at the 06 age group, unless you go outside the letter leagues.  Some talent in APL there but hard to convince to come over.  DS does the best job of recruiting those players.  At the 06 age group, they have by far the best team.  West side APL recruiting coupled with recruting some overlooked talent at other top clubs have benefited them well.  They've lost a few players, but were comfortable doing so and have impact players coming off the bench (they have a bench, which has been rare) . They struggled against a very good CO Rush team, mainly style differences, but have outperformed everyone else. Weaker league by far but they are playing well.

Their 07s are also much improved.  They lost a great talent but gained more in return.  Interesting little team, score alot and play possession. The DS 05s get some key players back from injury, including top talent recruited from PR.  They did lose two key starters, which will hurt them for the rest of the season.  PR 05s have suprisinglly underperformed.  Injuries, loss of talent, etc have hurt them.  I don't know too much about Arsenal.  Do know one of their top 06 players is now at DS.

 Too many letter leagues and too many clubs dilute AZ talent and make it tough to compete better than mid pack.  The RSL seniors are the exception this year.  They are healthy and motivated.  It will be good to see the AZ teams play each other in the upcoming weeks.


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> I think AZ can on average field middle of the pack type results. Very hard to go uo against the good ones in CA.
> 
> The club on paper best positioned would be Royals to answer your question.
> 
> Easily the largest club in AZ with aggressive leadership.


I think it's age group driven.  But that can be debated forever I suppose.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> Their 07s are also much improved. They lost a great talent but gained more in return. Interesting little team, score alot and play possession. The DS 05s get some key players back from injury, including top talent recruited from PR. They did lose two key starters, which will hurt them for the rest of the season. PR 05s have suprisinglly underperformed. Injuries, loss of talent, etc have hurt them. I don't know too much about Arsenal. Do know one of their top 06 players is now at DS.


del Sol has problems. 

GA apparently is not much of a draw. 

The older teams still have players from DA era and they are OK. But going forward del Sol seems to have problems. 

Take a look at their 2 teams that were recruited when they had GA only. 

The 08 girls have not won a game. 2 ties. Have managed a total of 2 goals in 5 games. That was the team that came in fresh at the entry age of GA the first year del Sol had GA. 

What about the youngest age bracket this year? The team they brought in for their 2nd year of GA has0 wins. 0 goals vs 20 against.

The above results are in the MW division as well. 

2 yrs of GA and those are the 2 teams they were able to bring in. It appears that in Phx the best players when they have a choice are not looking at del Sol with their GA offer. 

Of further interest del Sol was not even able to field a U13 team for DPL. 

2 yrs into GA it certainly appears parents/kids are not looking to send their kids to del Sol.

From the talk here on these forums it appears GA isn't a terribly strong draw in So Cal as well with the best players looking to join nearby ECNL clubs. 

Up until last week with some DPL parent talking about their kids teams there has been so little interest in GA that the last post on that thread was from JULY.


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> del Sol has problems.
> 
> GA apparently is not much of a draw.
> 
> The older teams still have players from DA era and they are OK. But going forward del Sol seems to have problems.
> 
> Take a look at their 2 teams that were recruited when they had GA only.
> 
> The 08 girls have not won a game. 2 ties. Have managed a total of 2 goals in 5 games. That was the team that came in fresh at the entry age of GA the first year del Sol had GA.
> 
> What about the youngest age bracket this year? The team they brought in for their 2nd year of GA has0 wins. 0 goals vs 20 against.
> 
> The above results are in the MW division as well.
> 
> 2 yrs of GA and those are the 2 teams they were able to bring in. It appears that in Phx the best players when they have a choice are not looking at del Sol with their GA offer.
> 
> Of further interest del Sol was not even able to field a U13 team for DPL.
> 
> 2 yrs into GA it certainly appears parents/kids are not looking to send their kids to del Sol.
> 
> From the talk here on these forums it appears GA isn't a terribly strong draw in So Cal as well with the best players looking to join nearby ECNL clubs.
> 
> Up until last week with some DPL parent talking about their kids teams there has been so little interest in GA that the last post on that thread was from JULY.


They are an interesting club.  Plenty of disenfranchised parents who will not speak highly of the club. I've learned they don't subscribe to the typical playbook of the other clubs in AZ.  They are not looking to expand tremendously, absorb other clubs, or merge. They have parents/players at many of their practices on a weekly basis trying out for various teams.  The club tends to ignore the white noise of parents and forums. - sometimes to their detriment.  

Certainly true they don't field many teams at the youngest of age competitive age groups.  U13 isn't a priority for them, not yet.  Their model at that age is to teach and progress, then later recruit.  I agree it's a risky move and they don't have as much leverage as they once did.  They are still a brand and have managed to recruit.  How long it lasts, we don't know, frankly I don't care.

The 08s are 100% improved from last year, and that's the point. They are on track.  The hardest part about this age group is convincing parents that winning is everything.  Look at the 07, great example.  They are head and shoulders better than any other team in AZ with the exception of RSL.  It would make for a great match this year, we'll just never know since clubs won't play each other.  

No doubt the GA SW is the weakest conference in the GA. There is a reason DS opted out of the conference.  Risky move with travel but so far it appears parents aren't opposed, yet.  One trip to CO so far.  I would guess the majority of travel occurs after the HS break (NM, UT).

I don't believe they are in trouble.  They certainly have to work harder than in previous years. It feels like people say this about DS every year.  It wouldn't suprise me to see them in a different league next year.

I know their are different takes on them, many opinions out there.  At the end of the day, there are too many leagues in AZ to fully consolidate talent.  Having two leagues and 4 "top" clubs dilutes talent and makes it nearly impossible for some clubs/teams to have a good experience when traveling.  A great example is PR this year.  Between the 05s and 06s, their goal differential is -148.  Doesn't sound like fun times in CA. Arsenal and RS are faring a bit better: -23 and -45.  

Anyway, way too much AZ info.  I suppse we'll agree that too many leagues and too many clubs are not good.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> I don't believe they are in trouble. They certainly have to work harder than in previous years. It feels like people say this about DS every year. It wouldn't suprise me to see them in a different league next year.


I think they have major issues on the girls side.

To be seen and known in Phoenix means you have to have teams playing so people are aware of the club.

If you look at APL/ASL in ALL age groups combined they have exactly 1 team. That is a u12 team. And that team is in the 3rd division of APL/ASL. 

If you look at Open league they have ZERO teams.

Think about that...in all the local leagues they have exactly 1 team. That is not how you market to the Valley.

I have watched them for years. They used to do very well when they were 1 of 2 ECNL teams in the Valley and the other (Sereno) was sitting around doing nothing. Kids FLOCKED to del Sol at that time.

When they got DA they were still top dog.

Those years are now a couple past them.

What are they selling? A 2nd tier national league. The best players will go ECNL in the Valley. That is a fact. Their 2 most recent recruiting classes show that lack of interest. To be honest in years past those entry level teams were always very STRONG. Now they are exceptionally weak.

Combine the above with basically no teams in the local leagues and you have a problem. Parents in the Valley don't see del Sol around at all. And when they look now they see uncompetitive teams in the GA (at the younger years...the years you pay attention to when thinking about moving your kid to a club).

They apparently didn't have enough players to even field a U13 DPL team.

That also shows a lack of interest by players/parent regarding the club.

Rising, Royals, Arsenal besides being in ECNL/ECRL all have multiple teams in APL/ASL/Open league. Parents and kids seem them playing around the Valley and know who those clubs are. Further those 3 clubs have fairly large rec programs. del Sol is also non existent in that area.

All those factors add up to bad news for del Sol.

They have not adapted well to the changing soccer environment in which they live.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> It wouldn't suprise me to see them in a different league next year.


What league would they move to?

If ECNL wanted them, they would have most likely been brought in with the Royals.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> They are an interesting club. Plenty of disenfranchised parents who will not speak highly of the club. I've learned they don't subscribe to the typical playbook of the other clubs in AZ. They are not looking to expand tremendously, absorb other clubs, or merge. They have parents/players at many of their practices on a weekly basis trying out for various teams. The club tends to ignore the white noise of parents and forums. - sometimes to their detriment.


And I am not a parent who has any kind of grudge vs them. I do however look at what clubs are doing. 

Years ago I considered them the top spot in the Valley. And they were.

The rise of Royals and the fact that 2 other clubs have ECNL has changed the equation in a way that is not good for del Sol. 

GA is considered 2nd tier. To make their job even more difficult is the fact that their division no longer includes So Cal. Yes I know they will still play some So Cal teams. However the fact remains that is not their division.

With ECNL, clubs are playing well known marque clubs such as Blues, Surf, Slammers, and now Beach and Legends.


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> And I am not a parent who has any kind of grudge vs them. I do however look at what clubs are doing.
> 
> Years ago I considered them the top spot in the Valley. And they were.
> 
> The rise of Royals and the fact that 2 other clubs have ECNL has changed the equation in a way that is not good for del Sol.
> 
> GA is considered 2nd tier. To make their job even more difficult is the fact that their division no longer includes So Cal. Yes I know they will still play some So Cal teams. However the fact remains that is not their division.
> 
> With ECNL, clubs are playing well known marque clubs such as Blues, Surf, Slammers, and now Beach and Legends.


Certainly not insinuating you are one of those parents who hold a grudge.  There is plenty of nuance in AZ soccer, as you are likely very aware of.  There is no doubt that ECNL is the better league, especially in CA.  Not being in ECNL for DS is certainly a challenge.  Today, and for the next few years, they will have better teams in critical age groups than their counterparts.  ECNLknow that.  You can't write off  the performance of certain age groups by AZ clubs in ECNL.   Traveling to CA to get beat on is not fun.  Write off the seniors, RSL has that well in hand.  DS  younger age groups still have to develop.  Winning today doesn't mean they don't win next year or year after that.  

I don't have  crystal ball and frankly don't have anything at stake with DS.  Anyway, we could go back and forth forever.  Bottom line is too many leagues, and that's not changing, at least for this season.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> I don't have crystal ball and frankly don't have anything at stake with DS. Anyway, we could go back and forth forever. Bottom line is too many leagues, and that's not changing, at least for this season.


It would seem you have a DD at del Sol. 

Enjoy the ride.


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## rainbow_unicorn

Rising had a tough early schedule and has already played Blues, Legends, Surf, Beach and both Slammers.  Koge has yet to play those clubs.


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## Desert Hound

rainbow_unicorn said:


> Rising had a tough early schedule and has already played Blues, Legends, Surf, Beach and both Slammers.  Koge has yet to play those clubs.


I suspect Koge overall will still be very highly ranked.

Long way to go in the season.


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## SoccerLocker

Desert Hound said:


> I suspect Koge overall will still be very highly ranked.
> 
> Long way to go in the season.


Those are some very talented teams.  CL worthy across all age groups.


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> It would seem you have a DD at del Sol.
> 
> Enjoy the ride.


Had, 1 has aged out and  moved on to play at the next level, the other now plays another sport (with just as much, if not more club friction)


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## Speed

Speed said:


> what
> 
> what do you mean both divisions?


got it thank you. Curious to see the comparison of the clubs with the RL comparison. Some clubs doing really well in RL but not in ECNL. You are right though about the divisions I had forgotten about that


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## SoccerFan4Life

This is some great data.  If you slice this and take out the top 2 older groups, this will be a telling trend for those clubs that will be struggling or improving as the older age group exist the ECNL system.     In my opinion, there’s too many clubs targeting the same demographic region.   As an example blues and LAFC are both on the South OC market.  They dominate this market and the rest of the ECNL clubs will continue to get RL or worse level players. Put a club in north Orange County or Cerritos.    The fact is that the clubs that continue to struggle need to recruit in a different market or come up with some unique value compared to the top clubs.


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## Sike

SoccerFan4Life said:


> This is some great data.  If you slice this and take out the top 2 older groups, this will be a telling trend for those clubs that will be struggling or improving as the older age group exist the ECNL system.     In my opinion, there’s too many clubs targeting the same demographic region.   As an example blues and LAFC are both on the South OC market.  They dominate this market and the rest of the ECNL clubs will continue to get RL or worse level players. Put a club in north Orange County or Cerritos.    The fact is that the clubs that continue to struggle need to recruit in a different market or come up with some unique value compared to the top clubs.


There are basically four OC clubs, Koge, Blues, Slammers and Strikers.  As you state, Koge and Blues have no issue recruiting currently.  Slammers is an interesting one in that it is really the second team for Koge, but they don't seem to be struggling at all based upon the data provided (6th out of the 17 teams).  However, I think this is about the ceiling for Slammers as they will never be the top club.  Strikers has had some missteps on the girls side the past few years and need to rebuild their brand a bit.  Talent will continue to gravitate to ECNL, families are willing to drive from north OC to the great park, and this market can support four teams in ECNL.


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## crush

Desert Hound said:


> Slow day at work. Systems are down. Lots of time to look around all corners of the internet.
> 
> Based on pts per game through both divisions. Then ranked clubs 1-17 overall.
> 
> As of what is posted online from top to bottom. Just a sum of what position they ended up in over all age groups. Some clubs had the same numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> koge10legends15surf27beach31blues31slammers43rebels47sporting61lafc61royals62eagles64arsenal67strikers69heat74breakers78rising79sharks90


Great work bro.  You and Futbol dad have gifts & talents.  My dd has played for 3 of the 5 top teams in her youth soccer career.  Cal South State Cup Champs with one of them and US Youth Natty with another.  Learn amazing soccer from that other one.  Good luck to everyone who has kids playing soccer.  I will soon be departing the great youth game.  I look forward to seeing how things play out for my kid with soccer after this season. Big showcase coming in SD and I will be 100% buying you a few drinks.  I would buy anyways bro.


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## crush

SoccerFan4Life said:


> This is some great data.  If you slice this and take out the top 2 older groups, this will be a telling trend for those clubs that will be struggling or improving as the older age group exist the ECNL system.     In my opinion, there’s too many clubs targeting the same demographic region.   As an example blues and LAFC are both on the South OC market.  They dominate this market and the rest of the ECNL clubs will continue to get RL or worse level players. Put a club in north Orange County or Cerritos.    The fact is that the clubs that continue to struggle need to recruit in a different market or come up with some unique value compared to the top clubs.


Great stuff bro.  Name brand of club, the access with the connection Docs have is the key to getting what you want & need.  It's my wish today that everyone gets everything they want with soccer.


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## oh canada

Sike said:


> However, I think this is about the ceiling for Slammers as they will never be the top club.


and 90% of parents are totally fine with never being the "top" club--only the crazy soccer parents need trophies as personal validation or measure of success. Let Koge and Surf have 'em while I chill on the sidelines and tailgate with my drama-free homies from a 'non-top" club


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## crush

oh canada said:


> and 90% of parents are totally fine with never being the "top" club--only the crazy soccer parents need trophies as personal validation or measure of success. Let Koge and Surf have 'em while I chill on the sidelines and tailgate with my drama-free homies from a 'non-top" club


Some girls like medals too Oh Canada.  After 11 years, too many parents want their kids to get into a college so they can show how truly elite their player is.  The whole thing is a complete mess.  Way too many teams and parents wanting to promote elitism.


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## SoccerFan4Life

oh canada said:


> and 90% of parents are totally fine with never being the "top" club--only the crazy soccer parents need trophies as personal validation or measure of success. Let Koge and Surf have 'em while I chill on the sidelines and tailgate with my drama-free homies from a 'non-top" club


We lose more often than we win but our parents get along great and the girls are being challenged at fligjt 1.    None of us want to make the 45 minute drive (so far).  Three of our parents are coaches in other teams.  7 of our parents played in college.  Some have guest played for ecrl and ECNL in the last year.   Unfortunately if my dd wants to play in college i will eventually have to make the jump. I’m hoping college coaches will give Discovery players a chance but i doubt it.
 To your point enjoying the ride so far.


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## oh canada

crush said:


> Some girls like medals too Oh Canada.  After 11 years, too many parents want their kids to get into a college so they can show how truly elite their player is.  The whole thing is a complete mess.  Way too many teams and parents wanting to promote elitism.


I see plenty of middle-of-the-pack teams winning medals at tournaments throughout the year


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## Desert Hound

Sike said:


> There are basically four OC clubs, Koge, Blues, Slammers and Strikers.  As you state, Koge and Blues have no issue recruiting currently.  Slammers is an interesting one in that it is really the second team for Koge, but they don't seem to be struggling at all based upon the data provided (6th out of the 17 teams).  However, I think this is about the ceiling for Slammers as they will never be the top club.  Strikers has had some missteps on the girls side the past few years and need to rebuild their brand a bit.  Talent will continue to gravitate to ECNL, families are willing to drive from north OC to the great park, and this market can support four teams in ECNL.


Koge and Slammers practice in the same spot? 

If not are they close to each other? And if so which locations?


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## crush

oh canada said:


> I see plenty of middle-of-the-pack teams winning medals at tournaments throughout the year


Correction:  Top prize!!!


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## crush

Sike said:


> * Strikers has had some missteps on the girls side the past few years* and need to rebuild their brand a bit.


Let's keep in mind that the Strikers top Girls Doc bailed and took his teams to the Blues a few years ago.  Blues got two teams and Slammers was rewarded with two for one.  Not easy being a club Doc these days.  Good luck to your player


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## Sike

Desert Hound said:


> Koge and Slammers practice in the same spot?
> 
> If not are they close to each other? And if so which locations?


Yes.  Various spots in south oc, including great park.


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## Sike

crush said:


> Let's keep in mind that the Strikers top Girls Doc bailed and took his teams to the Blues a few years ago.  Blues got two teams and Slammers was rewarded with two for one.  Not easy being a club Doc these days.  Good luck to your player


I don't know what you mean when you say blues got two teams and I don't know what the strikers doc move has to do with slammers being "rewarded with two for one".  I certainly think there is room for ecnl strikers in oc and suspect they will improve over time, but they haven't had a great name on the girls side for a few years now.


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## crush

Sike said:


> I don't know what you mean when you say blues got two teams and I don't know what the strikers doc move has to do with slammers being "rewarded with two for one".  I certainly think there is room for ecnl strikers in oc and suspect they will improve over time, but they haven't had a great name on the girls side for a few years now.


Why not a good name?  Look man, when my kid was 12, we played Strikers in State Quarter Finals.  Anyone on here who has a 2021, 2022 or 2023 knows if all the Striker players stayed, they would most likely be #1.  The is fact.  AR took all his teams to the Blues because Blues had GDA and ECNL.  because Slammers stayed ECNL, they got two ECNL teams.  They had to rebuild bro because of the past Doc.  I dont talk to any coach.   My dd made the decision to play for Strikers and I can say she is learning a lot of what it will take to play in college.


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## Sike

crush said:


> Why not a good name?  Look man, when my kid was 12, we played Strikers in State Quarter Finals.  Anyone on here who has a 2021, 2022 or 2023 knows if all the Striker players stayed, they would most likely be #1.  The is fact.  AR took all his teams to the Blues because Blues had GDA and ECNL.  because Slammers stayed ECNL, they got two ECNL teams.  They had to rebuild bro because of the past Doc.  I dont talk to any coach.   My dd made the decision to play for Strikers and I can say she is learning a lot of what it will take to play in college.


Didn't mean to offend you and glad your dd found a place she is happy.  Yes, Strikers used to be very good on the girls side, but never recovered from when several coaches moved.  They just haven't been able to rebuild their brand yet since losing those coaches/players.  I am sure they will eventually, but still struggle to field top ecnl teams at most age groups on the girls side.


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## crush

Sike said:


> Didn't mean to offend you and glad your dd found a place she is happy.  Yes, Strikers used to be very good on the girls side, but never recovered from when several coaches moved.  They just haven't been able to rebuild their brand yet since losing those coaches/players.  I am sure they will eventually, but still struggle to field top ecnl teams at most age groups on the girls side.


No no, I'm sorry if I come across a little bitter.  It's all coming to an end and maybe I'm still pissed off at all the liars & cheaters from years past.  Good luck bro.


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## GT45

This is not a fair ranking at all. Clubs have played very different teams so far. In my kids age group, Koge has played a very weak slate so far. Some clubs have played a lot of top teams. So this is comparing apples to oranges at this point in the season.


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## Desert Hound

GT45 said:


> This is not a fair ranking at all. Clubs have played very different teams so far. In my kids age group, Koge has played a very weak slate so far. Some clubs have played a lot of top teams. So this is comparing apples to oranges at this point in the season.


It is an absolutely correct ranking SO FAR. Just like 7 weeks into the NFL we have rankings SO FAR. It doesn't mean that is how teams will end up. It is a point and time look at ranking. 

As the season goes on some clubs will move up or down a bit. 

I doubt you see big movement. Up a spot or 2 or down a spot or 2. 

As an aside I am not pro/anti koge. I lay money they still reside towards the top at the end of the season though.


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## crush

Desert Hound said:


> It is an absolutely correct ranking SO FAR. Just like 7 weeks into the NFL we have rankings SO FAR. It doesn't mean that is how teams will end up. It is a point and time look at ranking.
> 
> As the season goes on some clubs will move up or down a bit.
> 
> I doubt you see big movement. Up a spot or 2 or down a spot or 2.
> 
> As an aside I am not pro/anti koge. I lay money they still reside towards the top at the end of the season though.


Back in the old days I hear ECNL had two seasons in one year.  I like that for many reasons.  Lot's of girls were coming off not being able to practice or play for over a year because of Covid 19 and they didnt have access to fields like others.  So of course injuries will play a part in a season. I would like to see a Fall season and a Spring season.  A fresh start so to speak.


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## Kicker4Life

Desert Hound said:


> It is an absolutely correct ranking SO FAR. Just like 7 weeks into the NFL we have rankings SO FAR. It doesn't mean that is how teams will end up. It is a point and time look at ranking.
> 
> As the season goes on some clubs will move up or down a bit.
> 
> I doubt you see big movement. Up a spot or 2 or down a spot or 2.
> 
> As an aside I am not pro/anti koge. I lay money they still reside towards the top at the end of the season though.


I don’t think they like the fact Blues isn’t #1 on your “Current Rankings”.


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## Messi>CR7

Desert Hound said:


> Koge and Slammers practice in the same spot?
> 
> If not are they close to each other? And if so which locations?


Slammers, Blues, Strikers, Pateadores, and West Coast all have some teams practice at the Great Park.  I have seen kids trying out for new team literally at the field right next to their current team.


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## oh canada

GT45 said:


> This is not a fair ranking at all. Clubs have played very different teams so far. In my kids age group, Koge has played a very weak slate so far. Some clubs have played a lot of top teams. So this is comparing apples to oranges at this point in the season.


Look, here's the bottom line on the girls side... very few care about rankings...most of us have been asking for ONE SoCal league for years (limit travel, play competitive games locally, show that we are the best region in the country for soccer talent). Finally, we just about have one with ECNL and it seems to be working pretty well. Except for one or two SoCal clubs (you can i.d. those I'm sure), all the others are playing competitive games throughout the region and across age groups. Even a 3-0 game could be a competitive one, so don't judge a game by a scoreline.  

The biggest SoCal clubs will compete for trophies, but players at all the others will get plenty of looks (and offers) from top college scouts as well. And, that's the most important thing that we all should want for our kids and from a soccer league. Finally, we seem to be getting it.


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## GT45

Desert Hound said:


> It is an absolutely correct ranking SO FAR. Just like 7 weeks into the NFL we have rankings SO FAR. It doesn't mean that is how teams will end up. It is a point and time look at ranking.
> 
> As the season goes on some clubs will move up or down a bit.
> 
> I doubt you see big movement. Up a spot or 2 or down a spot or 2.
> 
> As an aside I am not pro/anti koge. I lay money they still reside towards the top at the end of the season though.


No it is not. You cannot accurately rank teams who have played different opponents/strengths of schedules. Every age group is different in terms of who the stronger teams are. But, until everyone plays the same schedule your are comparing apples and oranges. So, as I said, this is not accurate depiction of the strength of teams.


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## SoccerFan4Life

GT45 said:


> No it is not. You cannot accurately rank teams who have played different opponents/strengths of schedules. Every age group is different in terms of who the stronger teams are. But, until everyone plays the same schedule your are comparing apples and oranges. So, as I said, this is not accurate depiction of the strength of teams.


 As a fantasy football fanatic, rankings happen every week and even during preseason.   Strength of schedule does change things but ultimately every week the teams can move up or down in ranking.  Heck even the experts of the bcs bowl disagree in some ranked teams and they have computers to help them out.  
Like he said this is the ranking so far.   Strength of schedule will play itself out in a few more weeks. He can do another ranking at that time.    
Why so upset about this ranking?   It’s just a ranking post.


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## crush

SoccerFan4Life said:


> *Why so upset about this ranking?   It’s just a ranking post.*


That's all it is.  I loved seeing my dd top team ranked #1 in the country back in 2017.  Our pride get's pricked a lot over who is #1 and what club is the best club.


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## GT45

SoccerFan4Life said:


> As a fantasy football fanatic, rankings happen every week and even during preseason.   Strength of schedule does change things but ultimately every week the teams can move up or down in ranking.  Heck even the experts of the bcs bowl disagree in some ranked teams and they have computers to help them out.
> Like he said this is the ranking so far.   Strength of schedule will play itself out in a few more weeks. He can do another ranking at that time.
> Why so upset about this ranking?   It’s just a ranking post.


It will not play itself out in a few weeks. It will not play itself out until the end of the season (and even that is not true). Have you looked at how imbalanced some of the schedules are for this fall? Some clubs do not play each other at all until late spring. And, some clubs you play twice, others only once. So the scheduling is a mess in my opinion. Have two divisions if they want, but don't bother playing the other one. ECNL has gone down hill by adding so many clubs. It used to be easy. You played everyone twice and the cream rose to the top. Now it is all unbalanced, and on any given year, one division could be a lot stronger than the other division. For example, the M division could have the top 4 teams in an age group, yet the S division still gets three into nationals, and the 4th/5th best M team is out. If they are not competing for the same spots at nationals why not just treat them like separate conferences?

I am not upset at the ranking, I just simply stated that it is not an accurate portrayal of the clubs at this stage of the season.


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## Jason DiDomenico

GT45 said:


> It will not play itself out in a few weeks. It will not play itself out until the end of the season (and even that is not true). Have you looked at how imbalanced some of the schedules are for this fall? Some clubs do not play each other at all until late spring. And, some clubs you play twice, others only once. So the scheduling is a mess in my opinion. Have two divisions if they want, but don't bother playing the other one. ECNL has gone down hill by adding so many clubs. It used to be easy. You played everyone twice and the cream rose to the top. Now it is all unbalanced, and on any given year, one division could be a lot stronger than the other division. For example, the M division could have the top 4 teams in an age group, yet the S division still gets three into nationals, and the 4th/5th best M team is out. If they are not competing for the same spots at nationals why not just treat them like separate conferences?
> 
> I am not upset at the ranking, I just simply stated that it is not an accurate portrayal of the clubs at this stage of the season.


I thought I walked into a BCS college football thread.....


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## whatithink

what-happened said:


> Def inside AZ talk here.  Not much recruiting going on at the 06 age group, unless you go outside the letter leagues.  Some talent in APL there but hard to convince to come over.  DS does the best job of recruiting those players.  At the 06 age group, they have by far the best team.  West side APL recruiting coupled with recruting some overlooked talent at other top clubs have benefited them well.  They've lost a few players, but were comfortable doing so and have impact players coming off the bench (they have a bench, which has been rare) . They struggled against a very good CO Rush team, mainly style differences, but have outperformed everyone else. Weaker league by far but they are playing well.
> 
> Their 07s are also much improved.  They lost a great talent but gained more in return.  Interesting little team, score alot and play possession. The DS 05s get some key players back from injury, including top talent recruited from PR.  They did lose two key starters, which will hurt them for the rest of the season.  PR 05s have suprisinglly underperformed.  Injuries, loss of talent, etc have hurt them.  I don't know too much about Arsenal.  Do know one of their top 06 players is now at DS.
> 
> Too many letter leagues and too many clubs dilute AZ talent and make it tough to compete better than mid pack.  The RSL seniors are the exception this year.  They are healthy and motivated.  It will be good to see the AZ teams play each other in the upcoming weeks.


It will be interesting to see if the DS 07s stick around next year. Its the start of their prime recruiting period so do they stick with GA or move to ECNL. DS used to place their players in the better colleges relative to the other valley teams, but with no ECNL, that's not a given anymore. They do seem to have an inside track on getting kids into YNT camps to pad resumes, so there's that I suppose.

If a few leave, it could end up as a flood. If my kid was one of them, I'd be shopping hard TBH.


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## what-happened

whatithink said:


> It will be interesting to see if the DS 07s stick around next year. Its the start of their prime recruiting period so do they stick with GA or move to ECNL. DS used to place their players in the better colleges relative to the other valley teams, but with no ECNL, that's not a given anymore. They do seem to have an inside track on getting kids into YNT camps to pad resumes, so there's that I suppose.
> 
> If a few leave, it could end up as a flood. If my kid was one of them, I'd be shopping hard TBH.


I suppose they could leave.  I know parents hold their cards close but the parent group seems pretty solid.  They have a lot going for them - legit improvement year over year, coaches with college connections, winning, YNT exposure.  It's a really good team with depth. Why leave as individuals when they have the chemistry?  Who knows though, parents make decisions for their own reasons.  These types of teams tend to fall apart over time.  Parents want more playing time. No better way to get playing time than to go to a lesser team or get recruited by the competition with the promise of more playing time. 

We place almost too much value on leagues.  There is certainly an advantage to play in a league with college exposure.  Having gone through the process with my oldest and learning how P5/D1 schools recruit, league isn't the most important thing. Club and coach relationships drive the train. Off shore recruiting also makes things interesting.   With the GA and ECNL having showcases, schools will attend.  I will not argue that the GA is on par with ECNL as far as team talent, the eye test is obvious.  Doesn't mean that GA players won't play in college.  Plenty of roster slots to be filled across the country at all levels. 

Does DS have a youngers problem?  Maybe.  Parents want to win immedietedly.  Their youngers always lose at first and many parents lack patience.  It's silly to have 09s (I would also argue 08s)  traveling to far away lands to play games.  Unfortunately it's  a money grab for both leagues and parents want to feel good when they spend that kind of money.  Inflation has driven up the cost of hotels and hotel beer.


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## tjinaz

what-happened said:


> I suppose they could leave.  I know parents hold their cards close but the parent group seems pretty solid.  They have a lot going for them - legit improvement year over year, coaches with college connections, winning, YNT exposure.  It's a really good team with depth. Why leave as individuals when they have the chemistry?  Who knows though, parents make decisions for their own reasons.  These types of teams tend to fall apart over time.  Parents want more playing time. No better way to get playing time than to go to a lesser team or get recruited by the competition with the promise of more playing time.
> 
> We place almost too much value on leagues.  There is certainly an advantage to play in a league with college exposure.  Having gone through the process with my oldest and learning how P5/D1 schools recruit, league isn't the most important thing. Club and coach relationships drive the train. Off shore recruiting also makes things interesting.   With the GA and ECNL having showcases, schools will attend.  I will not argue that the GA is on par with ECNL as far as team talent, the eye test is obvious.  Doesn't mean that GA players won't play in college.  Plenty of roster slots to be filled across the country at all levels.
> 
> Does DS have a youngers problem?  Maybe.  Parents want to win immedietedly.  Their youngers always lose at first and many parents lack patience.  It's silly to have 09s (I would also argue 08s)  traveling to far away lands to play games.  Unfortunately it's  a money grab for both leagues and parents want to feel good when they spend that kind of money.  Inflation has driven up the cost of hotels and hotel beer.


I don't think DS younger's problems is the "win now" attitude I think it is the soccer mom talk. The older teams that were recruited when it was DA was considered the top are aging out and there isn't enough talent coming in behind them.  I think as a club they have 1 girls team in advanced leagues at ASL 2 in U12 at none at U13 and higher.  They have GA and DPL but really nothing else.  They don't even have a DPL team at U13.  They field fewer and fewer teams every year.  ECNL is the hot ticket and GA no longer has the pull it did.  Couple that with the air travel to away games vs driving and its a much tougher sell.  Lesser league and more expensive is a hard combination to overcome.  Some hard choices for DS on the horizon, they are heading for irrelevancy. My bet is they merge with Rising or CCV.


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## Desert Hound

tjinaz said:


> I don't think DS younger's problems is the "win now" attitude I think it is the soccer mom talk. The older teams that were recruited when it was DA was considered the top are aging out and there isn't enough talent coming in behind them.  I think as a club they have 1 girls team in advanced leagues at ASL 2 in U12 at none at U13 and higher.  They have GA and DPL but really nothing else.  They don't even have a DPL team at U13.  They field fewer and fewer teams every year.  ECNL is the hot ticket and GA no longer has the pull it did.  Couple that with the air travel to away games vs driving and its a much tougher sell.  Lesser league and more expensive is a hard combination to overcome.  Some hard choices for DS on the horizon, they are heading for irrelevancy. My bet is they merge with Rising or CCV.


The thing to watch is their next incoming team. The 2 youngest who came in when del Sol could only offer GA are terrible. It seems incoming parents have made a choice. If next yrs entry team is terrible ....they will have problems.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> We place almost too much value on leagues


This may be the case. That said that is what they are up against recruiting wise. That is just the reality.

ECNL is better in the SW and guess where parents will go given the choice of ECNL or GA?

3 clubs offer the top league along with less travel. The results are kind of baked in going forward.

The clubs in GA who could get back into ECNL jumped hard and fast. That right there tells you what the clubs think.


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> This may be the case. That said that is what they are up against recruiting wise. That is just the reality.
> 
> ECNL is better in the SW and guess where parents will go given the choice of ECNL or GA?
> 
> 3 clubs offer the top league along with less travel. The results are kind of baked in going forward.
> 
> The clubs in GA who could get back into ECNL jumped hard and fast. That right there tells you what the clubs think.


They certainly jumped hard and fast, epecially given the uncertainty of the new league.  

Some time has passed, the GA hasn' collapsed, and clubs/parents who've gone through the experience are pleasantly surprised.  To claim the GA is a harder league would be silly, especially in the SW.  Soemthing to consider is whether players continue to sign at a decent rate this time next year.  This year's class has done rather well for themselves.   How is the incoming eligible class viewed by college coaches?  This year's class had DA exposure.  There are reputable clubs in the GA with connectivity to national schools, YNT, etc.  There is plenty of room for both leagues to co-exist, plenty of roster slots throughout the country.  

I do think if top nationally recognized clubs continue to migrate to ECNL then their could be a problem.  If most stay to be the master of their domain, then the GA will be fine. GA's national events are well attended.  I see things in a positive light for DDs all over the country that may gain access to a team with the platform that may help them play at the school of their choice (not neccessarily  P5/D1).

I suppose we can put the horse back in the stall?


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## Lightning Red

I wouldn't get so caught up with the letters of the league.  If you have the talent the college coaches will find you.  Of course, you need to market yourself the right way.  Be sure that your coaches and college liaison have the connections needed to get you to the next steps in the process.  My daughters U19 GA team had "8" girls sign NLI's yesterday ("4" Power 5's) and already have another committed for next year.  We anticipate that the rest who want the college soccer path from her team will do so before the season ends.
The GA league in So Cal is certainly much weaker collectively than ECNL but it comes down to what you want to get out of it.  My oldest kid stayed for the comradery, coaching, and training aspects which we still feel are superior to the other local ECNL options at her age.  My youngest is on the ECNL path because that works for her.  College coaches will show up for the kids they are interested in.


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## rainbow_unicorn

I wouldn't get caught up with letters of the league.  But I would be concerned with the level of competition.  Playing tougher competition on a regular basis is key for development IMO.  Kids/parents will train hard after tough losses versus thinking everything is OK after a landslide win over weaker team.


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## Lightning Red

I


rainbow_unicorn said:


> I wouldn't get caught up with letters of the league.  But I would be concerned with the level of competition.  Playing tougher competition on a regular basis is key for development IMO.  Kids/parents will train hard after tough losses versus thinking everything is OK after a landslide win over weaker team.


I don't disagree just pointing out there are other options/ways to reach the promised land.


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## crush

Lightning Red said:


> *Be sure that your coaches and college liaison have the connections needed to get you to the next steps in the process.*


100%


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## myself

Anybody know the result of SD Surf U16 vs Davis Legacy U16 on the last day of the girls San Diego showcase? Still hasn't been updated on the schedule.


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## LASTMAN14

myself said:


> View attachment 12113
> 
> Anybody know the result of SD Surf U16 vs Davis Legacy U16 on the last day of the girls San Diego showcase? Still hasn't been updated on the schedule.


Saw it posted. Think it was 3 or 4 to 1 for Surf.


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## Carlsbad10

LASTMAN14 said:


> Saw it posted. Think it was 3 or 4 to 1 for Surf.


3-2 Surf, hat trick for Surf’s 9. Second hat trick of the showcase.


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## LouSag

Carlsbad10 said:


> 3-2 Surf, hat trick for Surf’s 9. Second hat trick of the showcase.


3-2 Surf over Davis Legacy is correct.  It’s likely this score (and another score involving OK Energy 2005’s) will never get reported.  ECNL’s score reporting system is weak.  In the showcase of the showcases, the final 8 at Richmond in July, ECNL managed to report 1 of the 7 games played with a correct score.  And they even managed to post a score for 2 teams that never played each other.   ECNL can, and should, do better.


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## Sike

GT45 said:


> It will not play itself out in a few weeks. It will not play itself out until the end of the season (and even that is not true). Have you looked at how imbalanced some of the schedules are for this fall? Some clubs do not play each other at all until late spring. And, some clubs you play twice, others only once. So the scheduling is a mess in my opinion. Have two divisions if they want, but don't bother playing the other one. ECNL has gone down hill by adding so many clubs. It used to be easy. You played everyone twice and the cream rose to the top. Now it is all unbalanced, and on any given year, one division could be a lot stronger than the other division. For example, the M division could have the top 4 teams in an age group, yet the S division still gets three into nationals, and the 4th/5th best M team is out. If they are not competing for the same spots at nationals why not just treat them like separate conferences?
> 
> I am not upset at the ranking, I just simply stated that it is not an accurate portrayal of the clubs at this stage of the season.


Just recalling this whole conversation from early in the season. Seems as though the early results held up pretty well through games in Seattle:

Age groups making Round of 16: Koge (6), Surf (4), Legends (3), Blues (3), Beach (2), Slammers (2), all other SW teams (0)
Age groups making Quarterfinals: Koge (5), Legends (2), Surf (1), Beach (1), all other SW teams (0)

Koge is clearly the most dominant Socal club overall this year. Who will end up with more championships after Virginia games are played: Koge or Solar?


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## Swoosh

Sike said:


> Just recalling this whole conversation from early in the season. Seems as though the early results held up pretty well through games in Seattle:
> 
> Age groups making Round of 16: Koge (6), Surf (4), Legends (3), Blues (3), Beach (2), Slammers (2), all other SW teams (0)
> Age groups making Quarterfinals: Koge (5), Legends (2), Surf (1), Beach (1), all other SW teams (0)
> 
> Koge is clearly the most dominant Socal club overall this year. Who will end up with more championships after Virginia games are played: Koge or Solar?


As a footnote, here are the So Cal Clubs with teams in the Championship:

Legends 2
Beach 1
Slammers 1


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## Sike

Swoosh said:


> As a footnote, here are the So Cal Clubs with teams in the Championship:
> 
> Legends 2
> Beach 1
> Slammers 1


Actually, Slammers also has 2 (their 18/19 team lost in the championship).


----------

