# GAL high school play unlikely in CA



## oh canada (Apr 29, 2020)

This excerpt from Soccer America makes it sound like CA high school soccer an unlikelihood for players in GAL.  If a 10-month season is one of the staples of the league, the California HS Sports governing bodies don't allow for playing HS plus club at once.

*SA:  The Development Player League in its announcement about the Girls Academy League mentioned "offering the flexibility to play high school soccer."

RICK DERELLA: *It's going to be a 10-month season, but most states can play high school at the same time as club. In Connecticut, you cannot.

*SA: The distinction would be that instead of the Development Academy, which banned girls from playing high school, now girls will be allowed to play if it's practical and permissible.

RICK DERELLA: *The problem is, the science doesn't match. Anyone that believes in periodization can't believe in doing both.


----------



## socalkdg (Apr 29, 2020)

Honestly if club stops Thanksgiving weekend, and High School soccer goes to 3rd week in Feb., only looking at just over 2 1/2 months of High School soccer.  They can make that work.  (Yes I know a few teams played the complete month of Feb.)


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

In CA the high school league season is pretty short, mostly JAN-FEB with some playoffs going into March.  Preseason in DEC so they should be able accommodate might have to miss/skip some things on the club side but that's they way things used to be.


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

12 months of soccer is stupid for 98% of the girls.  I read that Q and A and I'm lost with words today.


----------



## timbuck (Apr 29, 2020)

Ellejustus said:


> 12 months of soccer is stupid for 98% of the girls.  I read that Q and A and I'm lost with words today.


It's not about the kids.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

Ellejustus said:


> 12 months of soccer is stupid for 98% of the girls.  I read that Q and A and I'm lost with words today.


There likely just blindly copying some of the former DA verbiage &  propaganda.


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

timbuck said:


> It's not about the kids.


No it;s not coach buck.  This is sad and leaves a pit in my tummy.  It's an addiction for sure with some.  Soccer is powerful and political.  It's been a tough few days on me emotionally with soccer but the light is much brighter today.


----------



## Eagle33 (Apr 29, 2020)

Don't know about Girls DA, but on boys side (when it existed) even though they had DA season going, they either never had games or had 1 game during Dec-March period. I could never understand why they didn't allow HS soccer.


----------



## oh canada (Apr 29, 2020)

"10-month season" would suggest weekly games at end of January, all of February, and beg. of March--that's how DA was set up.  Most high school players are playing through Feb and into March.  In comparison, after Thxg, ECNL doesn't return to games in Cali till end of March.


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

A healthy soccer year should be six months broken up into two halves and extra month if your team makes the playoffs 

ECNL- August, Sepetember and October (First league game mid-August
Surf Cup Labor Day College Showcase
League Break November thru Feb
ECNL- March, April and May
Spring Break College Showcase AZ, East Coast and Texas I guess
Championship June at Great Park


----------



## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Apr 29, 2020)

Ellejustus said:


> 12 months of soccer is stupid for 98% of the girls.  I read that Q and A and I'm lost with words today.


Tease.


----------



## socalkdg (Apr 29, 2020)

If my kid isn't playing sports her whole demeanor drops.   She physically needs to stay very active, playing soccer, basketball, and track.  Sometimes two at once.   Her grades are better, her attitude better.   Kids have been playing multiple sports year round forever.  My wife and myself did in the 70's and 80's.   Now does it need to be the same thing all the time, or completely organized, with games every week, no, but that is on us, the parents, to keep them on the right schedule.   Whether that be 6 months, 12 months, or in between, its good to have choices.


----------



## espola (Apr 29, 2020)

socalkdg said:


> Honestly if club stops Thanksgiving weekend, and High School soccer goes to 3rd week in Feb., only looking at just over 2 1/2 months of High School soccer.  They can make that work.  (Yes I know a few teams played the complete month of Feb.)


 CIS Regional Finals this year were March 7 (Regional means more or less Fresno and neighboring areas south, where everyone plays soccer after football and before baseball).  By the time the playoffs get to the final week, there are very few schools still in it, but their teams are likely to include the best players and there is increasing social pressure to stick with the HS team instead of returning to new club play.


----------



## espola (Apr 29, 2020)

Eagle33 said:


> Don't know about Girls DA, but on boys side (when it existed) even though they had DA season going, they either never had games or had 1 game during Dec-March period. I could never understand why they didn't allow HS soccer.


Power is meaningless unless exerted.


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

Eagle33 said:


> Don't know about Girls DA, but on boys side (when it existed) even though they had DA season going, they either never had games or had 1 game during Dec-March period. I could never understand why they didn't allow HS soccer.


Why?  Because that period is used by only by 6 states for HS (CA, AZ, FL, HI, LA and MI) and US Soccer likely did not want to cede league game scheduling to the clubs (like ECNL seems to do).  25 states + DC play HS in the fall and the balance in the spring.  I'm not going to defend US Soccer and the DA program (boys or girls) but I will say that to coordinate national scheduling with all the different HS seasons would be a large and challenging endeavor. Especially when they expect a certain level of participation in showcases.  For them to have allowed HS and not play "favorites" (as in, permit the winter HS states) would have required a release of scheduling control that never seemed consistent with their goals.  If they had, I think that there would have been much more broad-based buy-in from a number of the stronger clubs in our state and other states where HS soccer is big.  Would it have survived?  Hard to know but there would have been a much higher number of parents who were emotionally and financially invested in that platform's success.


----------



## Penalty Kicks Stink (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> In CA the high school league season is pretty short, mostly JAN-FEB with some playoffs going into March.  Preseason in DEC so they should be able accommodate might have to miss/skip some things on the club side but that's they way things used to be.


High School season officially starts Novemeber 18 - you are allowed (2) scrimmages where club players are allowed to play as long as they end by Thanksgiving weekend.  After that its tournaments and preseason and you are not allowed to play club


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> Why?  Because that period is used by only by 6 states for HS (CA, AZ, FL, HI, LA and MI) and US Soccer likely did not want to cede league game scheduling to the clubs (like ECNL seems to do).  25 states + DC play HS in the fall and the balance in the spring.  I'm not going to defend US Soccer and the DA program (boys or girls) but I will say that to coordinate national scheduling with all the different HS seasons would be a large and challenging endeavor. Especially when they expect a certain level of participation in showcases.  For them to have allowed HS and not play "favorites" (as in, permit the winter HS states) would have required a release of scheduling control that never seemed consistent with their goals.  If they had, I think that there would have been much more broad-based buy-in from a number of the stronger clubs in our state and other states where HS soccer is big.  Would it have survived?  Hard to know but there would have been a much higher number of parents who were emotionally and financially invested in that platform's success.


Nah there where few games like #Eagle33 says between Dec-march and only in recent years where Jan or feb games scheduled. 

First  years of DA HS play was common and willing scheduled around, was only when JK came in that changes to prohibit public HS play where implement.  Even still teams and people will attended private HS found ways to make it work.   

This is a about perception, 10-month or whatever program offers diminishing returns for majority of the players.  They never really operated for the full 10 months anyway but it was a "selling' point or whatever so people thought they where more "elite".


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

Penalty Kicks Stink said:


> High School season officially starts Novemeber 18 - you are allowed (2) scrimmages where club players are allowed to play as long as they end by Thanksgiving weekend.  After that its tournaments and preseason and you are not allowed to play club


In our section first league game starts in Jan ends in Feb.

Our local HS didn't even scrimmage until the pre season in Dec and there first competition was late Dec in a tournament.

There are lots of way to avoid any conflicts and coaches know that when they have a bunch of club players they schedule accordingly and have rosters to accommodate when players are available.


----------



## dad4 (Apr 29, 2020)

Penalty Kicks Stink said:


> High School season officially starts Novemeber 18 - you are allowed (2) scrimmages where club players are allowed to play as long as they end by Thanksgiving weekend.  After that its tournaments and preseason and you are not allowed to play club


Is the Restriction is "no club players" or "players cant play club the same month they are also playing HS"?

Second seems easier to work around.


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> In our section first league game starts in Jan ends in Feb.
> 
> Our local HS didn't even scrimmage until the pre season in Dec and there first competition was late Dec in a tournament.
> 
> There are lots of way to avoid any conflicts and coaches know that when they have a bunch of club players they schedule accordingly and have rosters to accommodate when players are available.


you are taking a California-centric view. That works for a regional league but does not for a national league.  And that was my point above.  It's not that, say, DA could have permitted California players to play HS but that that would be "unfair" to the other 44 states + DC where HS soccer is NOT played in the winter.

You can't just tell the rest of the country to get on the CA schedule as fields are just not usable in winter.  If the new league wants to centralize scheduling for all competitions (league and any showcases), it is an *enormous* undertaking if a certain number of clubs will shut down during fall, another number in winter and another number if spring.  (and if they permit dual participation- HS and club - in the states where that is allowed, they should not be administering a youth sports platform.  There is enough evidence of the injury risk of overuse that nobody needs a platform that expressly permits it)


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

dad4 said:


> Is the Restriction is "no club players" or "players cant play club the same month they are also playing HS"?
> 
> Second seems easier to work around.


CIF rules that apply to all schools in al the state's sections do not permit dual participation during the season.  If you play any "outside competition" (even a scrimmage, depending on the circumstances), you lose 2 HS games for every outside game played (and that is a first time sanction; repeat offenses is not 2:1 again but you are suspended for the season).


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> CIF rules that apply to all schools in al the state's sections do not permit dual participation during the season.  If you play any "outside competition" (even a scrimmage, depending on the circumstances), you lose 2 HS games for every outside game played (and that is a first time sanction; repeat offenses is not 2:1 again but you are suspended for the season).


Fun fact:  this even includes YNT games and ODP (and PDP up here in NorCal) games if they have not been given prior approval by CIF.  Google "Jacey Pederson/Palo Alto High School" to see what happens if not properly approved.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> you are taking a California-centric view. That works for a regional league but does not for a national league.  And that was my point above.  It's not that, say, DA could have permitted California players to play HS but that that would be "unfair" to the other 44 states + DC where HS soccer is NOT played in the winter.
> 
> You can't just tell the rest of the country to get on the CA schedule as fields are just not usable in winter.  If the new league wants to centralize scheduling for all competitions (league and any showcases), it is an *enormous* undertaking if a certain number of clubs will shut down during fall, another number in winter and another number if spring.  (and if they permit dual participation- HS and club - in the states where that is allowed, they should not be administering a youth sports platform.  There is enough evidence of the injury risk of overuse that nobody needs a platform that expressly permits it)


Nah like I said DA operated fine for a number of years when HS play was common and scheduled around.  ECNL and every other league manages so it's not about anything but exclusion and not working together.


----------



## espola (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> CIF rules that apply to all schools in al the state's sections do not permit dual participation during the season.  If you play any "outside competition" (even a scrimmage, depending on the circumstances), you lose 2 HS games for every outside game played (and that is a first time sanction; repeat offenses is not 2:1 again but you are suspended for the season).


There used to be (don't know if it still exists) allowance for games with ODP or National youth teams with appropriate notice through the coach, AD, and Principal.  

The "outside competition" included participating in scrimmages as part of a college tryout or ID camp, but some clever schools limited the scrimmaging teams to few enough players to stay out of CIF's clutches.  Even with that, you could have an attacking 5-man team play a defending 5-man team perhaps using a small goal.  

There were some CIF rule changes in the last few years that supposedly loosened up some of the college tryout restrictions, but I haven't kept up with the details.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

dad4 said:


> Is the Restriction is "no club players" or "players cant play club the same month they are also playing HS"?
> 
> Second seems easier to work around.


The only restriction is  when you start HS competitions that are officiated you can't go back to play club soccer until you play your last HS competition.

You can play a club showcase or cup in Florida in DEC as you last club completion like this year in DA or ECNL.   Next week play in DEC for a HS team in the Addias showcase.  Play your HS league games through Feb and maybe even playoffs which normally end before March unless you win a section.  Return to your club in march.  This is standard practice and what's been going on for Many years.


----------



## espola (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> Fun fact:  this even includes YNT games and ODP (and PDP up here in NorCal) games if they have not been given prior approval by CIF.  Google "Jacey Pederson/Palo Alto High School" to see what happens if not properly approved.


That's a typical CIF stance - the adults screwed up but we can't punish them, so we will take it out on the students.


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Nah like I said DA operated fine for a number of years when HS play was common and scheduled around.  ECNL and every other league manages so it's not about anything but exclusion and not working together.


The other national leagues that permit it do not schedule nationally other than playoffs and, in ECNL's case, showcases (but the clubs pick and choose in which showcases they want to participate).  But US Soccer played it differently - they centralized all scheduling and to change their policy required not just a philosophical change but a logistical change.  I don't disagree with you that there was an exclusionary aspect to this and it could have been solved with creative working together but that was never consistent with the approach (well, at least for most of the DA's existence; I have no idea if US Soccer always scheduled the boys' side but I know that at least as far back as 2011, HS was not permitted).

I'm a believer in HS participation - not b/c the soccer is great but b/c it is not really about the soccer but about being a teen, playing with and representing a community, etc.  I have one kid graduating this year who played 4 years of HS soccer and still managed to achieve at the club and national level.  She loved it for many ways that had nothing to do with soccer (and any coach who says/thinks that the kids "regress" too much during the HS season is absurd or must think that any significant injury ends a youth's soccer career since those often take them off the pitch for months at a time).


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

espola said:


> There used to be (don't know if it still exists) allowance for games with ODP or National youth teams with appropriate notice through the coach, AD, and Principal.
> 
> The "outside competition" included participating in scrimmages as part of a college tryout or ID camp, but some clever schools limited the scrimmaging teams to few enough players to stay out of CIF's clutches.  Even with that, you could have an attacking 5-man team play a defending 5-man team perhaps using a small goal.
> 
> There were some CIF rule changes in the last few years that supposedly loosened up some of the college tryout restrictions, but I haven't kept up with the details.


Yes ODP,  YNT still exempt and ID camps limited to one visit per University with  a total number limit I can't recall at the moment.


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

espola said:


> That's a typical CIF stance - the adults screwed up but we can't punish them, so we will take it out on the students.


Completely agree with you.  I have spent a lot of time on this particular rule and watching "the list" b/c of camps or trips.  I have dealt with my local section + CIF + NFHS.  The current folks do want things to work out for the kids but that has definitely not been the case. And not all ADs really understand how this works (esp if a school does not have a track record of NT participation in soccer or any other sport).  It takes time (and for any of you running into an issue next year, send me a PM and I'm happy to share the path I pursued).


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Yes ODP,  YNT still exempt and ID camps limited to one visit per University with  a total number limit I can't recall at the moment.


Not automatically exempt - if you rely on the fact that is simply ODP and YNT, you may find yourself dealing with unintended consequences.  You have to pay attention to this list:  https://www.cifstate.org/governance/odp.  If the event (YNT or ODP) does NOT appear on this list, your kid may have a problem.  This requires coordination among US Soccer, NFHS and CIF and sometimes, w/o intent, that coordination breaks down.  And that was the issue with Palo Alto HS/CCS/Pederson - nobody did anything "wrong" but a date was missed by a day or two.


----------



## Soccerfan2 (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> Not automatically exempt - if you rely on the fact that is simply ODP and YNT, you may find yourself dealing with unintended consequences.  You have to pay attention to this list:  https://www.cifstate.org/governance/odp.  If the event (YNT or ODP) does NOT appear on this list, your kid may have a problem.  This requires coordination among US Soccer, NFHS and CIF and sometimes, w/o intent, that coordination breaks down.  And that was the issue with Palo Alto HS/CCS/Pederson - nobody did anything "wrong" but a date was missed by a day or two.


How do events get on the list?


----------



## espola (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> Completely agree with you.  I have spent a lot of time on this particular rule and watching "the list" b/c of camps or trips.  I have dealt with my local section + CIF + NFHS.  The current folks do want things to work out for the kids but that has definitely not been the case. And not all ADs really understand how this works (esp if a school does not have a track record of NT participation in soccer or any other sport).  It takes time (and for any of you running into an issue next year, send me a PM and I'm happy to share the path I pursued).


CIF could solve this by allowing a simple appeal process in which "the adults screwed up" with supporting evidence would be good enough.

On another tack, I recall when a San Diego County player attended a training camp in Mexico in the summer before his HS Senior year put on by one of the pro teams there.  At the end, some players were selected to stay longer for a closer look, and some of those were offered pro contracts.  CIF announced they were investigating whether the extended tryout camp was a violation of their rules, and suggested that a final answer would not be available until the first week of Section playoffs.  The team was given the option of playing without him, or keeping him on the team with the risk of forfeiting all the games in which he participated.  The players voted unanimously to keep him (they knew he was their best player).  The school won the CIF Section playoffs in their division, and the player in question got a 4-year full ride to Creighton with a short US pro career after that.


----------



## espola (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> Not automatically exempt - if you rely on the fact that is simply ODP and YNT, you may find yourself dealing with unintended consequences.  You have to pay attention to this list:  https://www.cifstate.org/governance/odp.  If the event (YNT or ODP) does NOT appear on this list, your kid may have a problem.  This requires coordination among US Soccer, NFHS and CIF and sometimes, w/o intent, that coordination breaks down.  And that was the issue with Palo Alto HS/CCS/Pederson - nobody did anything "wrong" but a date was missed by a day or two.


I can tell you from personal experience that winning deep into a tournament playoff series and then being eliminated by forfeit over something the coaches and players had no control over is almost as good as winning the championship.  The players can always say they were the other undefeated team in the tournament - "They had to find another way to get rid of us"

And it also negates my old judgment that most youth players lose the final game they play.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

Now you know who to talk with if your given the same  old spiel on a different day


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Now you know who to talk with if your given the same  ole'  line on a different day


But the girls don;t get to make the decision, just the club or the conference?  This is not at all about HS Soccer or why that dumb league folded it's tents in the first place.  Blame it all on Corona.  It was and is about HS Soccer and control of girls and making them go to college to continue playing soccer at a world class level.  That's is exactly what happen to us two year.  The club was in control and that is 100% BS unless it's 100% free like the Pats.  That is fair.  They pay and your butts mine.  That is a choice. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________-no one can play up or play HS.  That is BS!!!!!!!


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

Ellejustus said:


> But the girls don;t get to make the decision, just the club or the conference?  This is not at all about HS Soccer or why that dumb league folded it's tents in the first place.  Blame it all on Corona.  It was and is about HS Soccer and control of girls and making them go to college to continue playing soccer at a world class level.  That's is exactly what happen to us two year.  The club was in control and that is 100% BS unless it's 100% free like the Pats.  That is fair.  They pay and your butts mine.  That is a choice. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________-no one can play up or play HS.  That is BS!!!!!!!


Yup and you know exactly who's behind that.  Those that made up the league and clubs that make your players choice for THEM if they choose that option.


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Yup and you know exactly who's behind that.  Those that made up the league and clubs that make your players choice for THEM if they choose that option.


Wow!!!


----------



## timbuck (Apr 29, 2020)

I've said it before -  If your club didn't get selected for ECNL, and you want that level of play...then you should try out for an ECNL team.  If your kid doesn't make that team, then play local club soccer.  Join a team that will play in the showcases that you think are important.


----------



## pokergod (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Now you know who to talk with if your given the same  old spiel on a different day


If most of these clubs have their top kids in ECNL or ECNR, and the second and third kids in a combination of ga and dpl teams, then how much leverage do they have in keeping kids out of high school.  Legends, Beach and Albion will, if possible, not allow this relegation to stand.  I assume they will try to make the GA a direct competitor to ECNL by next year.


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

pokergod said:


> If most of these clubs have their top kids in ECNL or ECNR, and the second and third kids in a combination of ga and dpl teams, then how much leverage do they have in keeping kids out of high school.  Legends, Beach and Albion will, if possible, not allow this relegation to stand.  I assume they will try to make the GA a direct competitor to ECNL by next year.


Zero leverage.  The only leverage those clowns had on my dd was that List.  We told them to go pound sound and you will see how stupid you are for not allowing hs soccer.  Fools in business 101.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

pokergod said:


> If most of these clubs have their top kids in ECNL or ECNR, and the second and third kids in a combination of ga and dpl teams, then how much leverage do they have in keeping kids out of high school.  Legends, Beach and Albion will, if possible, not allow this relegation to stand.  I assume they will try to make the GA a direct competitor to ECNL by next year.


Oh relegation?  That would be a improvement don't see much of that anymore more like....let's switch leagues to xyx they promised us the top flight

CSL premier->SCDSL, DA, ECNL
SCDSL->DISCO, NPL, ECRL
DA->ECNL,MLSY, GA
National league->CRL, CRL academy

Some stuff new packaging. Some regional  expansion of course so new leagues are/where inevitable but the fact they don't cross-play normally, share, or are working together is kind of disappointing with the sprawl.

One of the biggest mistakes Ussda made was not having promotion/relegation in the DA league in my opinion after critical mass.. Their misguided attempt at 2 tiers for the older boys age group was a fiasco that really upset a lot of clubs and they went searching.


----------



## pokergod (Apr 29, 2020)

Ellejustus said:


> Zero leverage.  The only leverage those clowns had on my dd was that List.  We told them to go pound sound and you will see how stupid you are for not allowing hs soccer.  Fools in business 101.


If high school sports worked for Lebron and Lamar Jackson, why can't it work for soccer?  Am I missing something?  In So Cal, we are lucky in that most of us live in areas where there are numerous options for high school, both public and private.  If a crappy high school coach is local that plays long ball and your club is possession based, then drive an extra ten minutes to the possession coach.


----------



## Ellejustus (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Does or did youth soccer really need another high priced closed league that
> 
> 
> Oh relegation?  That would be a improvement don't see much of that anymore more like....let's switch leagues to xyx they promised us the top flight
> ...


This is our last year 100%.


----------



## oh canada (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Now you know who to talk with if your given the same  old spiel on a different day


Then don't say you have a "10-month season".  Either you have a 10-month season and can't really let playres play high school (like DA), or you have a 7-8 month season and all of your teams will break for high school like ECNL, till end of March.  Or just say, "we don't really know what we're going to do right now."  That might be the real truth.


----------



## soccer4us (Apr 29, 2020)

oh canada said:


> Then don't say you have a "10-month season".  Either you have a 10-month season and can't really let playres play high school (like DA), or you have a 7-8 month season and all of your teams will break for high school like ECNL, till end of March.  Or just say, "we don't really know what we're going to do right now."  That might be the real truth.


The league is giving the DOC's an option. You know where most DOC"s will try to go. The hard part is the whole conference needs to decide one way or another. I'm sure those will be some fun fights.


----------



## Copa9 (Apr 29, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Oh relegation?  That would be a improvement don't see much of that anymore more like....let's switch leagues to xyx they promised us the top flight
> 
> CSL premier->SCDSL, DA, ECNL
> SCDSL->DISCO, NPL, ECRL
> ...


No problem, don't worry.  The top players will be playing against each other in college.  Everything else is just youth soccer, enjoy the time with your player.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

Copa9 said:


> No problem, don't worry.  The top players will be playing against each other in college.  Everything else is just youth soccer, enjoy the time with your player.


No worries 1 through college, 1 freshman, 1 class of 2021 they all had great experiences with youth soccer but the last one might be the only one to want to play in college if things improve.  Some excellent competition during those years,  but it did get harder to find that consistently as things sprawled out.


----------



## dk_b (Apr 29, 2020)

oh canada said:


> Then don't say you have a "10-month season".  Either you have a 10-month season and can't really let playres play high school (like DA), or you have a 7-8 month season and all of your teams will break for high school like ECNL, till end of March.  Or just say, "we don't really know what we're going to do right now."  That might be the real truth.


is it just a CA-based league? If so, easy to break as you say. Or is it a national league? In which case you can have a 7-8 month season but it’s a different 7-8 months for the 25 or so states that play HS in fall, the 6 that play in winter and the others that play in spring.


----------



## jpeter (Apr 29, 2020)

dk_b said:


> is it just a CA-based league? If so, easy to break as you say. Or is it a national league? In which case you can have a 7-8 month season but it’s a different 7-8 months for the 25 or so states that play HS in fall, the 6 that play in winter and the others that play in spring.


Conferences and clubs working together to account for regional difference have found a way for many years.  ECNL, USclub and yes even DA did that. 

They are start and end dates for parts of the season that are guidelines.  Some teams might have first league game early Sept  and a game of week for next 4 while others have 1-2 games in Sept and more in later months Oct-Nov or a 3 -4 week break between to accommodate Addias cup or some other comp.  This is one of reasons why the DA schedules weren't even consistent among teams in the same conference, some would play 13 games first half others 17 and the other way around 2nd half.  End Totals close but still allowed for variance between  28-33 games could be the range,  PPG used  to determine standings.

It's all doable no matter if the scheduling is centralized or not. Clubs and conference always have to give availability dates & field permits  either way so just have to work through the combos.    ECNL is a perfect example they have conference play starting up early or later depending on the region. Even in the same conference NV teams might be back later Feb but CA teams not scheduled to late March for example. It's all been rehashed and done every year, really not a problem if the proper planning and coordination is done.


----------



## dk_b (Apr 30, 2020)

jpeter said:


> Conferences and clubs working together to account for regional difference have found a way for many years.  ECNL, USclub and yes even DA did that.
> 
> They are start and end dates for parts of the season that are guidelines.  Some teams might have first league game early Sept  and a game of week for next 4 while others have 1-2 games in Sept and more in later months Oct-Nov or a 3 -4 week break between to accommodate Addias cup or some other comp.  This is one of reasons why the DA schedules weren't even consistent among teams in the same conference, some would play 13 games first half others 17 and the other way around 2nd half.  End Totals close but still allowed for variance between  28-33 games could be the range,  PPG used  to determine standings.
> 
> It's all doable no matter if the scheduling is centralized or not. Clubs and conference always have to give availability dates & field permits  either way so just have to work through the combos.    ECNL is a perfect example they have conference play starting up early or later depending on the region. Even in the same conference NV teams might be back later Feb but CA teams not scheduled to late March for example. It's all been rehashed and done every year, really not a problem if the proper planning and coordination is done.


I agree with all of that - leave to clubs. But you use Nevada as an example but Nevada plays HS in the fall (at least according to this: https://www.niaa.com/landing/index) so there is only a full match in the spring when the club schedule can line up. ECNL has managed that so I assume that the new league can. But it’s also why some ECNL teams have a complete league season played entirely in the fall or entirely in the spring while the CA teams have had a relatively balanced schedule. I’m not saying it can’t be done - I’m an advocate for it to be done by ceding league scheduling time clubs - but I’m saying that if scheduling is centralized (like for all or nearly all of DA’s existence), it’s a harder task and one that US soccer did not seem interested in taking on although it may have balked for more publicly-stated philosophical reasons re the “evil” of HS sports. I’m also saying that too often on these boards, especially California-based ones, the assumption is made that the HS soccer season for everyone is the same so it should be easy to work around. If people don’t take into account that other states don’t, or even can’t, play winter HS, the scheduling tends to be portrayed as overly simple when it is not. And last, any league can expressly permit HS participation during the club season but unless a specific state’s HS governing federation (cif for us) allows it, what the league rule says becomes largely irrelevant because kids will likely have to choose unless they want to up their risk of injury by playing simultaneously (as I mentioned elsewhere, even if a state permits it, playing what would likely be a 7 day/week schedule for a couple of months, with week after week of 4 or 5 games, is unhealthy).

This is NFHS’s link to the different state dates (at least for the current academic year):  https://nfhs.org/media/1018591/soccer-state-association-competition-dates-report-2019-20.pdf.


----------



## Woobie06 (Apr 30, 2020)

There are 10 teams in the SW GAL.  That's 18 League Games with home and away fixtures.  Unless they are playing a crazy tournament schedule, inter-league showcase schedule, and playoff schedule it's gonna be tough to fill 10 months unless you have ridiculous travel.  Maybe they play more than a single home and away against each team in their league.  Who knows....Feels like the league is just positioning we are a real league with plenty of clubs, can play a full 10 months, and we are legit.  Hopefully the adults will see clearly when the dust settles.


----------



## dad4 (Apr 30, 2020)

Woobie06 said:


> There are 10 teams in the SW GAL.  That's 18 League Games with home and away fixtures.  Unless they are playing a crazy tournament schedule, inter-league showcase schedule, and playoff schedule it's gonna be two tough to fill 10 months unless you have ridiculous travel.  Maybe they play more than a single home and away against each team in their league.  Who knows....Feels like the league is just positioning we are a real league with plenty of clubs, can play a full 10 months, and we are legit.  Hopefully the adults will see clearly when the dust settles.


If you need more games, play both GAL and the local league.  Same as norcal teams play ECNL and NPL.

Honestly, 18 League games plus scrimmages plus 4 tournaments/showcases sounds like quite a bit to me.  It's more than they do in college.


----------



## SoccerSoccer (May 1, 2020)

According to Albion, the GA league, at least for the Southwest region, will permit players to play high school.


----------



## pooka (May 4, 2020)

dk_b said:


> I agree with all of that - leave to clubs. But you use Nevada as an example but Nevada plays HS in the fall (at least according to this: https://www.niaa.com/landing/index) so there is only a full match in the spring when the club schedule can line up. ECNL has managed that so I assume that the new league can. But it’s also why some ECNL teams have a complete league season played entirely in the fall or entirely in the spring while the CA teams have had a relatively balanced schedule. I’m not saying it can’t be done - I’m an advocate for it to be done by ceding league scheduling time clubs - but I’m saying that if scheduling is centralized (like for all or nearly all of DA’s existence), it’s a harder task and one that US soccer did not seem interested in taking on although it may have balked for more publicly-stated philosophical reasons re the “evil” of HS sports. I’m also saying that too often on these boards, especially California-based ones, the assumption is made that the HS soccer season for everyone is the same so it should be easy to work around. If people don’t take into account that other states don’t, or even can’t, play winter HS, the scheduling tends to be portrayed as overly simple when it is not. And last, any league can expressly permit HS participation during the club season but unless a specific state’s HS governing federation (cif for us) allows it, what the league rule says becomes largely irrelevant because kids will likely have to choose unless they want to up their risk of injury by playing simultaneously (as I mentioned elsewhere, even if a state permits it, playing what would likely be a 7 day/week schedule for a couple of months, with week after week of 4 or 5 games, is unhealthy).
> 
> This is NFHS’s link to the different state dates (at least for the current academic year):  https://nfhs.org/media/1018591/soccer-state-association-competition-dates-report-2019-20.pdf.


You're correct Nevada does play High school soccer in the fall, and the girls that felt it was important played both, at the same time. It is definitely tough on them, but there are no high school games on the weekend, and my kiddo looked at the high school practices as extra fitness/touches on the ball. 

CA issue is CIF.


----------



## SoccerJones (May 4, 2020)

socalkdg said:


> Honestly if club stops Thanksgiving weekend, and High School soccer goes to 3rd week in Feb., only looking at just over 2 1/2 months of High School soccer.  They can make that work.  (Yes I know a few teams played the complete month of Feb.)


why would you want to make this work for your kid?  It'll literally be 12 months of soccer which means very little body recovery time.  Not a smart decision for club, player or parent.


----------

