# SW Division Updates



## Desert Hound

So this is just going out now in terms of how the SW will be split.

Slammers
Real So Cal
Eagles
Heat
Beach
LA Breakers
Arsenal FC
Legends FC
RSL/Royals

And

AZ Arsenal
Phx Rising
Surf 
Blues 
LAFC 
Rebels 
del Mar Sharks 
Strikers


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## crush

Desert Hound said:


> So this is just going out now in terms of how the SW will be split.
> 
> Slammers
> Real So Cal
> Eagles
> Heat
> Beach
> LA Breakers
> Arsenal FC
> Legends FC
> RSL/Royals
> 
> And
> 
> AZ Arsenal
> Phx Rising
> Surf
> Blues
> LAFC
> Rebels
> del Mar Sharks
> Strikers


Oh goodie Hound.  Look's like our bet is back on brother.  I was scared that the rumors were true...lol.  For U18/19 division, this split up looks fair and balanced.


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## Surf Zombie

Interesting. Did ECNL make an announcement?


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## Desert Hound

Surf Zombie said:


> Interesting. Did ECNL make an announcement?


That is the info that is starting to get sent out internally to parents.


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## Surf Zombie

Desert Hound said:


> That is the info that is starting to get sent out internally to parents.


I was curious if they’d split them 9/9 like they did up here in the north east where the two groups don’t play each other any more.


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## Desert Hound

Surf Zombie said:


> I was curious if they’d split them 9/9 like they did up here in the north east where the two groups don’t play each other any more.


Right now it is just 17 teams. We have 14 this year. They added Beach, Legends and Royals. 

My understanding from before is that in your split your club will play the other clubs 2 times. Then for the other group your club isn't part of you play them 1 time.


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## Sike

Surf, blues and lafc on the same side seems odd to me.  In general, aren't these the top 3 in most age groups?


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## Surf Zombie

The cynic in me thinks so much of this stuff is political. When they split the old northeast conference into New England and North Atlantic (9 & 9) PDA was right in the geographic middle (Massachusetts to Maryland). PDA white was placed in the New England conference and PDA Blue (their much stronger sides) were placed in the North Atlantic conference. Both PDA Blue & White train out of the same location in northern NJ.

Supposedly it was done that way so PDA Blue & Stars Blue (Stars also has two licenses they call Blue & White) could avoid each other and wouldn’t be fighting for the same champions league spots.


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## Messi>CR7

Sike said:


> Surf, blues and lafc on the same side seems odd to me.  In general, aren't these the top 3 in most age groups?


Other than splitting the two Slammers teams, it appears it was done geographically for the CA teams.  Orange and San Diego County teams are in one group, while Ventura/Los Angeles/Riverside teams are in the other.


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## Calikid

Desert Hound said:


> So this is just going out now in terms of how the SW will be split.
> 
> Slammers
> Real So Cal
> Eagles
> Heat
> Beach
> LA Breakers
> Arsenal FC
> Legends FC
> RSL/Royals
> 
> And
> 
> AZ Arsenal
> Phx Rising
> Surf
> Blues
> LAFC
> Rebels
> del Mar Sharks
> Strikers



Does ECNL ever drop clubs if they continuously perform poorly over an extended period of time?

How are the Del Mar Sharks able to stay in ECNL?


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## Carlsbad7

Calikid said:


> Does ECNL ever drop clubs if they continuously perform poorly over an extended period of time?
> 
> How are the Del Mar Sharks able to stay in ECNL?


Del Mar Sharks stay in ECNL for two reasons. The first is that they're run by a woman. In CA women owned / run businesses are in demand. The second is that Surf likes it this way. By keeping Sharks around they guarantee first shot at all up and coming recruits. If ECNL brought on Albion or City there would be competition for players.


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## Carlsbad7

Carlsbad7 said:


> Del Mar Sharks stay in ECNL for two reasons. The first is that they're run by a woman. In CA women owned / run businesses are in demand. The second is that Surf likes it this way. By keeping Sharks around they guarantee first shot at all up and coming recruits. If ECNL brought on Albion or City there would be competition for players.


If SD parents were smart theyd get together and create their own super team and use Sharks as the gateway to ECNL.


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## Vista 21

This seems like it makes some sense but does 1 club have the power to dictate the rules to a national league? The answer seems to be YES but then why would another club subject themselves to this? I appreciate being top of the pack. I appreciate being middle of the pack and battling for wins.. why on earth regularly go 1-9 and 0-13.. isn't this demoralizing for the club and team?


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## Carlsbad7

Vista 21 said:


> This seems like it makes some sense but does 1 club have the power to dictate the rules to a national league? The answer seems to be YES but then why would another club subject themselves to this? I appreciate being top of the pack. I appreciate being middle of the pack and battling for wins.. why on earth regularly go 1-9 and 0-13.. isn't this demoralizing for the club and team?


I'm oversimplifying but...

Surf was a founding member of ECNL but jumped ship to DA when they thought it was a better play. When Surf + other teams started moving to DA ECNL brought in different teams to take their place. This is how Sharks were brought into ECNL.

Last year DA blew up and Surf, Blues, others went back to ECNL.

General FYI, A couple of years ago Surf tried to "buy" DMCV Sharks like they recently "bought" SDSC. I'm using "quotes" around buy because it wasn't a true buyout. More like a patching over but they would never be part of the Surf SD club. Sharks leadership put joining out to a vote and Parents chose to decline Surfs offer.

Culturally Surf and Sharks are very different. Surf has no problem cutting / moving players around. Sharks want to win but they're a little more sensitive to the repercussions of cuts.

For what it's worth there's a lot of SD parents starting to reach out to Sharks because of ECNL now that DA's gone. Over time assuming ECNL does't offer membership to any other SD clubs the Sharks record will improve.


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## MyDaughtersAKeeper

Carlsbad7 said:


> I'm oversimplifying but...
> 
> Surf was a founding member of ECNL but jumped ship to DA when they thought it was a better play. When Surf + other teams started moving to DA ECNL brought in different teams to take their place. This is how Sharks were brought into ECNL.
> 
> Last year DA blew up and Surf, Blues, others went back to ECNL.
> 
> General FYI, A couple of years ago Surf tried to "buy" DMCV Sharks like they recently "bought" SDSC. I'm using "quotes" around buy because it wasn't a true buyout. More like a patching over but they would never be part of the Surf SD club. Sharks leadership put joining out to a vote and Parents chose to decline Surfs offer.
> 
> Culturally Surf and Sharks are very different. Surf has no problem cutting / moving players around. Sharks want to win but they're a little more sensitive to the repercussions of cuts.
> 
> For what it's worth there's a lot of SD parents starting to reach out to Sharks because of ECNL now that DA's gone. Over time assuming ECNL does't offer membership to any other SD clubs the Sharks record will improve.


Nice summary.  I just don't see the Sharks improving.  Wanting to win and being willing to do what it takes are 2 different things and thus far DMCV has not shown a willingness to do what it takes to win.  Sharks have talent, but plenty of players are willing to drive north to OC for the Blues and the Rebels are going to pull some of the talent pool that would otherwise go to DMCV, not to mention Surf is in their backyard.  DMCV seems like they would rather be "liked" than be successful.


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## Vista 21

I appreciate the answer and insight. I'm new to this formum and at first was not sure if this was just filled with crazy kooky people or actual useful information..I'm kidding. I do see some crazy but also valuable information and thoughtful comments. Thanks.


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## Calikid

Albion San Diego and City SC have much stronger teams for top to bottom than DMCV Sharks. Perhaps it would be better for the Sharks to drop ECNL and join the GA?


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## Sike

Calikid said:


> Albion San Diego and City SC have much stronger teams for top to bottom than DMCV Sharks. Perhaps it would be better for the Sharks to drop ECNL and join the GA?


So they can lose in GA instead of losing in ECNL?  I think they would end up toward the bottom in most GA age groups too.  

I'm still surprised that Albion isn't ECNL.


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## Vista 21

Why would City and/or Albion not be included in the ECNL if their teams are stronger top to bottom?


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## Technician72

Vista 21 said:


> Why would City and/or Albion not be included in the ECNL if their teams are stronger top to bottom?


There are people much closer to the situation than I, but some of the previous comments highlight the politics surrounding club soccer in the SD area coming into play.


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## Carlsbad7

Vista 21 said:


> Why would City and/or Albion not be included in the ECNL if their teams are stronger top to bottom?


You have to understand that there's politics behind who's in and who's out. The DOCs + Leadership at different clubs have all known each other for sometimes 30+ years. The only thing you can count on 100% is which way the money flows. This is why I said Surf likes having Sharks in ECNL. It gives them a monopoly on most of the talent in SD.

One thing parents need to understand is that clubs (Surf) doesn't care if players come from SDSC, Albion, Sharks, Rebels, etc. If your daughter or son is better than the players they have on their teams they'll try to recruit. This is why being a big fish in a small pond (playing at Sharks) can have it's advantages. Coaches know talent when they see it + don't really care about loyalty. (unless it's to their specific team)

Also not all Sharks teams suck. Duarte Andrade's B2009 team won presidents level state cup in 2020...




__





						Cal South Soccer - Information
					






					cysa.affinitysoccer.com


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## Surf Zombie

Technician72 said:


> There are people much closer to the situation than I, but some of the previous comments highlight the politics surrounding club soccer in the SD area coming into play.


It’s like that all over the country. If you look at most of the top clubs in the GA that haven’t been able to get into ECNL (or back in) they have a powerful ECNL club or two in the same market.

Top Hat- Concorde 
Nationals- Michigan Hawks
NEFC- FC Stars & Scorpions 
STA-PDA 
FC Virginia- Louden 
Cincinnati United- Ohio Premier 
LFA- SLSG


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## Goforgoal

I know some parents who have kids on the girls side at Sharks, and the sense I get is one of losing patience and maybe some frustration. The general thought was that with the DA folding, their ECNL teams would pick up kids from the ex-DA (now GA) clubs and 2nd team players from Surf with their joining ECNL, but that hasn't happened in any meaningful way. Maybe that will change as time goes on, but with the GA having a solid campaign season, and offering a viable alternative to ECNL for certain players (acknowledging the current competitive differences between the leagues), I see the situation getting more difficult for Sharks rather than easier. Parents and players may be more apt to stay put rather than be labeled as club hoppers, and focus more on the current coach and club environment rather than be overly fixed on the league. Losing is fine, but it does wear on a player (and parent lol), especially when the losses hit double digits with single digit wins while not seeing new talent coming in.

I think a lot of it boils down to culture as mentioned earlier. They're still run with local/neighborhood club initiatives and values, while competing for players against some really aggressive recruiting and marketing efforts and playing in national powerhouse league.

We shall see as the dust continues to settle from last year's shakeup.


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## OCSoccerDad3

Carlsbad7 said:


> You have to understand that there's politics behind who's in and who's out. The DOCs + Leadership at different clubs have all known each other for sometimes 30+ years. The only thing you can count on 100% is which way the money flows. This is why I said Surf likes having Sharks in ECNL. It gives them a monopoly on most of the talent in SD.
> 
> One thing parents need to understand is that clubs (Surf) doesn't care if players come from SDSC, Albion, Sharks, Rebels, etc. If your daughter or son is better than the players they have on their teams they'll try to recruit. This is why being a big fish in a small pond (playing at Sharks) can have it's advantages. Coaches know talent when they see it + don't really care about loyalty. (unless it's to their specific team)
> 
> Also not all Sharks teams suck. Duarte Andrade's B2009 team won presidents level state cup in 2020...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cal South Soccer - Information
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cysa.affinitysoccer.com


Correct. Sharks has had several very successful teams, some that are doing well in ECNL as we speak. San Diego parents would be wise to gravitate there if the goal is to have their kid start and play major minutes on an ECNL team with lots of opportunity for exposure. The post above is correct… the club is ripe for a parent-orchestrated super team at various age groups… both boys and girls. Not everyone can or wants to play for Surf, where the shiny new object is always waiting in the wings. Plus, Surf is instituting the player pool system for the girls under Deza, so an ECNL offer is not necessarily an ECNL offer for everyone on the team. Buyer beware.


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## Desert Hound

-


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## Desert Hound

OCSoccerDad3 said:


> Sharks has had several very successful teams, some that are doing well in ECNL as we speak


I thought I may have missed something as I read your comment.

Some are doing well in the ECNL?

Let us see.

14 clubs currently in the SW division.

Let us take a look at the various Shark age groups.

U13 - 12th place. Goal differential -30
U14 - 13th place. Goal differential -46
U15 - 13th place. Goal differential -37
U16 - 12th place. Goal differential -14
U17 - 14th place. Goal differential -36
U18/19 - 14th place. Goal differential -34
U18/19 Composite - 12th place. Goal differential -27

Help us out here. Which of the above age groups are doing well in ECNL?


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## Carlsbad7

Desert Hound said:


> I thought I may have missed something as I read your comment.
> 
> Some are doing well in the ECNL?
> 
> Let us see.
> 
> 14 clubs currently in the SW division.
> 
> Let us take a look at the various Shark age groups.
> 
> U13 - 12th place. Goal differential -30
> U14 - 13th place. Goal differential -46
> U15 - 13th place. Goal differential -37
> U16 - 12th place. Goal differential -14
> U17 - 14th place. Goal differential -36
> U18/19 - 14th place. Goal differential -34
> U18/19 Composite - 12th place. Goal differential -27
> 
> Help us out here. Which of the above age groups are doing well in ECNL?


To me this seems like Sharks are ripe at multiple levels for a parent super team to take over + make a run at ECNL.


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## tjinaz

Desert Hound said:


> I thought I may have missed something as I read your comment.
> 
> Some are doing well in the ECNL?
> 
> Let us see.
> 
> 14 clubs currently in the SW division.
> 
> Let us take a look at the various Shark age groups.
> 
> U13 - 12th place. Goal differential -30
> U14 - 13th place. Goal differential -46
> U15 - 13th place. Goal differential -37
> U16 - 12th place. Goal differential -14
> U17 - 14th place. Goal differential -36
> U18/19 - 14th place. Goal differential -34
> U18/19 Composite - 12th place. Goal differential -27
> 
> Help us out here. Which of the above age groups are doing well in ECNL?


Should Steal LVSA from GA.  That club is putting out some talent.


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## Sombitch

Desert Hound said:


> I thought I may have missed something as I read your comment.
> 
> Some are doing well in the ECNL?
> 
> Let us see.
> 
> 14 clubs currently in the SW division.
> 
> Let us take a look at the various Shark age groups.
> 
> U13 - 12th place. Goal differential -30
> U14 - 13th place. Goal differential -46
> U15 - 13th place. Goal differential -37
> U16 - 12th place. Goal differential -14
> U17 - 14th place. Goal differential -36
> U18/19 - 14th place. Goal differential -34
> U18/19 Composite - 12th place. Goal differential -27
> 
> Help us out here. Which of the above age groups are doing well in ECNL?


WOW - the 18/19 Composite numbers are actually not too bad considering they played nearly every game with 9 or 10 players.  No exaggeration.


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## Desert Hound

Sombitch said:


> WOW - the 18/19 Composite numbers are actually not too bad considering they played nearly every game with 9 or 10 players.  No exaggeration.


Right now Sharks are not fielding good teams. 

And the composite? That is an ecRl team essentially. And it will be officially one next year. It is the 2nd team at that age group. So they area about dead last compared to other 2nd teams. So I am not sure what the positive there is to be honest. 

I felt sorry (different age group) for the Sharks team when my DD's team played them. Not a good team.

Hope things change for the club/kids.

However the reality is as of now they are not CLOSE to competitive at any of the age groups.

By the way I am still waiting on @OCSoccerDad3 to let us know which of the teams he thinks *"that are doing well in ECNL as we speak".*

From afar the club has a few problems that I see.

- Surf is very close.
- Surf takes the best players in the area.
- Any good player Sharks has will eventually move to Surf.
- The terrible record that Sharks has means parents avoid sending their kids there.

All that said...Surf can only put so many kids on the field per age group. So if there were someone at Sharks with leadership and vision the club could improve.


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## Desert Hound

tjinaz said:


> Should Steal LVSA from GA.  That club is putting out some talent.


At some point in the past LVSA was kicked out of ECNL. Not sure why exactly, but whatever happened may be the reason they are not back in.


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## futboldad1

Desert Hound said:


> At some point in the past LVSA was kicked out of ECNL. Not sure why exactly, but whatever happened may be the reason they are not back in.


They asked to leave as the parents and everyone were sick of losing every week……


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## VegasParent

Desert Hound said:


> At some point in the past LVSA was kicked out of ECNL. Not sure why exactly, but whatever happened may be the reason they are not back in.


I had a friend whose kid played at LVSA when they were kicked out. From what he said they were told that they needed to have multiple age groups make the playoffs or they were out. Only one made it (the 99's). Whether this is true or just the spin he received is anyone's guess.


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## Emma

Desert Hound said:


> Right now Sharks are not fielding good teams.
> 
> And the composite? That is an ecRl team essentially. And it will be officially one next year. It is the 2nd team at that age group. So they area about dead last compared to other 2nd teams. So I am not sure what the positive there is to be honest.
> 
> I felt sorry (different age group) for the Sharks team when my DD's team played them. Not a good team.
> 
> Hope things change for the club/kids.
> 
> However the reality is as of now they are not CLOSE to competitive at any of the age groups.
> 
> By the way I am still waiting on @OCSoccerDad3 to let us know which of the teams he thinks *"that are doing well in ECNL as we speak".*
> 
> From afar the club has a few problems that I see.
> 
> - Surf is very close.
> - Surf takes the best players in the area.
> - Any good player Sharks has will eventually move to Surf.
> - The terrible record that Sharks has means parents avoid sending their kids there.
> 
> All that said...Surf can only put so many kids on the field per age group. So if there were someone at Sharks with leadership and vision the club could improve.


This is very true. And in most age groups, Surf's ECRL team is a lot better than Shark's ECNL team.  This indicates, players are more willing to play at Surf's 2nd team than Shark's ECNL team.  The flow of good players continue to be moving from Sharks to Surf. Not sure what Sharks is doing but they can't seem to compete with Surf's 2nd team.  

I would really like to see Shannon put together some better teams as I'm a big fan of hers.  Gossip around town is, Sharks doesn't know how to value and retain their good teams or players.  They don't do enough to attract good players either, not offering any incentive to join.


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## Emma

Carlsbad7 said:


> You have to understand that there's politics behind who's in and who's out. The DOCs + Leadership at different clubs have all known each other for sometimes 30+ years. The only thing you can count on 100% is which way the money flows. This is why I said Surf likes having Sharks in ECNL. It gives them a monopoly on most of the talent in SD.
> 
> One thing parents need to understand is that clubs (Surf) doesn't care if players come from SDSC, Albion, Sharks, Rebels, etc. If your daughter or son is better than the players they have on their teams they'll try to recruit. This is why being a big fish in a small pond (playing at Sharks) can have it's advantages. Coaches know talent when they see it + don't really care about loyalty. (unless it's to their specific team)
> 
> Also not all Sharks teams suck. Duarte Andrade's B2009 team won presidents level state cup in 2020...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cal South Soccer - Information
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cysa.affinitysoccer.com


Duarte is a very good coach and a fierce competitor.  He's the exception at Sharks though and his B2009 is no longer with him.  I hope they will be able to keep that team together because they are a good group and Duarte has done a good job training and recruiting great players.


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## Surf Zombie

Is there any club in the area (other than Surf) who could partner/merge with Sharks and add some depth to the program? City, Albion?

I would think the ECNL ticket that Sharks has would be of great interest.


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## Carlsbad7

Emma said:


> Duarte is a very good coach and a fierce competitor.  He's the exception at Sharks though and his B2009 is no longer with him.  I hope they will be able to keep that team together because they are a good group and Duarte has done a good job training and recruiting great players.


Duarte runs a futsal group for boys and girls https://www.socalfutsalclub.com/ and I'm sure has been recruiting for the last year. 

He'll be back with a great team.


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## Emma

Surf Zombie said:


> Is there any club in the area (other than Surf) who could partner/merge with Sharks and add some depth to the program? City, Albion?
> 
> I would think the ECNL ticket that Sharks has would be of great interest.


Great idea.  Hope City or Albion is reading this.


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## what-happened

Emma said:


> Great idea.  Hope City or Albion is reading this.


I don't see a huge advantage for either of those clubs to beg for entry into ECNL.  Sometimes it's nice being the top dog . I would add West Coast to the group.  Parents are feeling pretty good about the GA right now.  Good season, good product, good vibe.  Staffs at Albion,City, WC are well connected.  They will place girls in college and YNT pools.

Rumors are that ECNL and GA will have cross league matches in the near future.  Have no idea on specified timelines - this year, next, etc.  For now, those clubs are in a good position.  The GA didn't turn out to be the train wreck that many thought or hoped it would be.  Plenty of good soccer was played, across the country.  Yes the "top" clubs are in ECNL, but so what.  Not everyone is going to play on LAFC, Surf, Beach, Legends, etc.

For states like CA, FL, TX, 2 leagues are easily supported.


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## Emma

what-happened said:


> I don't see a huge advantage for either of those clubs to beg for entry into ECNL.  Sometimes it's nice being the top dog . I would add West Coast to the group.  Parents are feeling pretty good about the GA right now.  Good season, good product, good vibe.  Staffs at Albion,City, WC are well connected.  They will place girls in college and YNT pools.
> 
> Rumors are that ECNL and GA will have cross league matches in the near future.  Have no idea on specified timelines - this year, next, etc.  For now, those clubs are in a good position.  The GA didn't turn out to be the train wreck that many thought or hoped it would be.  Plenty of good soccer was played, across the country.  Yes the "top" clubs are in ECNL, but so what.  Not everyone is going to play on LAFC, Surf, Beach, Legends, etc.
> 
> For states like CA, FL, TX, 2 leagues are easily supported.


I think GAL is a great 2nd tier league keeping ECNL honest at the moment but in San Diego and SOCAL , there aren't many quality GAL teams to play.


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## MyDaughtersAKeeper

Surf Cup schedules are out.  Top bracket for the '05 girls is all ECNL + City's GA team and I am not sure about the Slammers FC HB team.  2nd tier has 6 ECNL teams and the non-ENCL team that won Man City.  3rd tier has DMCV, Rebels and AASC ECNL (AZ I think).4th tier has the LVSA GA team that has been getting some love on the boards. 5th tier has Albion's GA team.  

Does City belong in the top bracket over ECNL teams?  We will find out. I acknowledge I am biased against City and make no attempt to hide it.    
DMCV and Rebel's ECNL teams are playing in the 3rd tier.  Rebels just got ECNL.  Not much of an excuse at this point for DMCV to not have better results. 
The tournament should provide some insight into where each league and team is.


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## Carlsbad7

MyDaughtersAKeeper said:


> Surf Cup schedules are out.  Top bracket for the '05 girls is all ECNL + City's GA team and I am not sure about the Slammers FC HB team.  2nd tier has 6 ECNL teams and the non-ENCL team that won Man City.  3rd tier has DMCV, Rebels and AASC ECNL (AZ I think).4th tier has the LVSA GA team that has been getting some love on the boards. 5th tier has Albion's GA team.
> 
> Does City belong in the top bracket over ECNL teams?  We will find out. I acknowledge I am biased against City and make no attempt to hide it.
> DMCV and Rebel's ECNL teams are playing in the 3rd tier.  Rebels just got ECNL.  Not much of an excuse at this point for DMCV to not have better results.
> The tournament should provide some insight into where each league and team is.


I don’t think this year will be any different (results wise) than before Covid for all clubs. You have to keep in mind that recruiting and games and in general didn’t exist 6 months ago.

All you’re going to see right now is players guesting with other teams and attending random practices setting up for next year.

The big determiner for the future of youth soccer in SD will happen this fall. If ECNL lets either Albion or City in it will trigger a mass exodus to that team and/or Sharks. Nobody will want to play for the one big club that’s playing GA while everyone else is ECNL.


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## what-happened

Emma said:


> I think GAL is a great 2nd tier league keeping ECNL honest at the moment but in San Diego and SOCAL , there aren't many quality GAL teams to play.


There is no doubt the top teams in CA are in ECNL.  They would be top teams without ECNL.  Some get wrapped around the axle around the words Top Tier and 2nd Tier, many don't.  Leagues are after your money and parents are happy to write checks

There aren't enough roster slots on these "top tier" team to service the population in CA.  Give it whatever label you want, most college coaches don't really care what league you are in.  I have players in both leagues, have years of interacting with coaches, they really do not care.  ECNL, the DA, and now the GA make it easier for them to scout talent - showcases are convenient.  Coaches/scouts have broad connections across many leagues with many clubs and club/HS coaches. They go where the talent is.


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## Sike

Carlsbad7 said:


> The big determiner for the future of youth soccer in SD will happen this fall. If ECNL lets either Albion or City in it will trigger a mass exodus to that team and/or Sharks. Nobody will want to play for the one big club that’s playing GA while everyone else is ECNL.


Not sure I follow exactly.  Are you implying that Albion or City could get ecnl in the fall?  I don't think that is possible.  I also think you will see most of the movement between teams for ecnl (and ga) ahead of surf cup.


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## Sike

what-happened said:


> I don't see a huge advantage for either of those clubs to beg for entry into ECNL.  Sometimes it's nice being the top dog . I would add West Coast to the group.  Parents are feeling pretty good about the GA right now.  Good season, good product, good vibe.  Staffs at Albion,City, WC are well connected.  They will place girls in college and YNT pools.
> 
> Rumors are that ECNL and GA will have cross league matches in the near future.  Have no idea on specified timelines - this year, next, etc.  For now, those clubs are in a good position.  The GA didn't turn out to be the train wreck that many thought or hoped it would be.  Plenty of good soccer was played, across the country.  Yes the "top" clubs are in ECNL, but so what.  Not everyone is going to play on LAFC, Surf, Beach, Legends, etc.
> 
> For states like CA, FL, TX, 2 leagues are easily supported.


GA did an excellent job this year.  Kept league games going as much as possible and national playoffs couldn't have been a bigger success.  There are some very good ga teams across the country.  The local issue for ga is that there just aren't a lot of good teams for league play.  At least in SoCal, I know several girls who just left ga teams for ecnl simply to play against better competition on a week to week basis.  I hope ga is successful, but they have some work to do here in SoCal.

While possible, I would be pretty surprised to see ecnl schedule an ecnl v ga event.  There is no upside for them to do that.


----------



## Desert Hound

Sike said:


> I hope ga is successful, but they have some work to do here in SoCal.


That is true. The SW GA is not very strong.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Sike said:


> Not sure I follow exactly.  Are you implying that Albion or City could get ecnl in the fall?  I don't think that is possible.  I also think you will see most of the movement between teams for ecnl (and ga) ahead of surf cup.


I agree there's likely a reason ECNL membership hasn't been offered to Albion or City.

I'm just pointing out the possibilities.

If ECNL chooses to invite one or the other. The club that wasnt invited will be in trouble.


----------



## Footy30

I wish they would add another team to ECNL just so it would be even... my OCD kicks in overdrive when I see the uneven number of  teams... 

Only half kidding of course..

I wonder if the GA will add anymore this year? Or is it too late? the families I know that are in GA seem happy.. but they were also playing while the ECNL wasn't haha


----------



## Footy30

MyDaughtersAKeeper said:


> Surf Cup schedules are out.  Top bracket for the '05 girls is all ECNL + City's GA team and I am not sure about the Slammers FC HB team.  2nd tier has 6 ECNL teams and the non-ENCL team that won Man City.  3rd tier has DMCV, Rebels and AASC ECNL (AZ I think).4th tier has the LVSA GA team that has been getting some love on the boards. 5th tier has Albion's GA team.
> 
> Does City belong in the top bracket over ECNL teams?  We will find out. I acknowledge I am biased against City and make no attempt to hide it.
> DMCV and Rebel's ECNL teams are playing in the 3rd tier.  Rebels just got ECNL.  Not much of an excuse at this point for DMCV to not have better results.
> The tournament should provide some insight into where each league and team is.


Teams at Surf Cup sometimes end up in random brackets... I remember a few years ago Beach  was put in a low bracket and they beat up on the teams, and if I'm not mistaken they requested to be in top tier but weren't placed in it for some reason.  Beach families correct me if I'm wrong


----------



## Technician72

MyDaughtersAKeeper said:


> Does City belong in the top bracket over ECNL teams?


Looks like it some of the other higher brackets a Non-ECNL team made the cut as well. I think it's good and hopefully some of these teams make some noise. Nothing wrong with a little competition between platforms.

In general City SC and West Coast were some of the stronger Non-ECNL teams this past season.


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## Sombitch

Emma said:


> Great idea.  Hope City or Albion is reading this.


This will NEVER happen!


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## Vista 21

From what I've read here, it seems unlikely given the past history and politics that Albion or City will ever be given access to ECNL and therefore they must rely only on the GA.  If it's all politics, of course Surf brings in those large GA club teams that are a percieved threat. It's a sea of ECNL surrounding the GA. The outcomes are likely all in favor of ECNL especially here in the Southwest. The talent flows out of GA leaving good players and teams stranded and weaker. It bloats already full ECNL teams which irritates established kid's at ECNL.. 

Any wonder this forum exists.


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## soccer4us

Vista 21 said:


> From what I've read here, it seems unlikely given the past history and politics that Albion or City will ever be given access to ECNL and therefore they must rely only on the GA.  If it's all politics, of course Surf brings in those large GA club teams that are a percieved threat. It's a sea of ECNL surrounding the GA. The outcomes are likely all in favor of ECNL especially here in the Southwest. The talent flows out of GA leaving good players and teams stranded and weaker. It bloats already full ECNL teams which irritates established kid's at ECNL..
> 
> Any wonder this forum exists.


Minus Beach, Legends, and Royals Southwest GA has changed a great deal for next year. Imagine GA will have to add a few more but would be surprised if any more is added to ECNL until the 22-23 season


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## Emma

Sombitch said:


> This will NEVER happen!


I wish Sharks the best and am a huge fan of how they run their system to be more local. Just wish they would see the upside to creating a more competitive top team.  It will benefit the local players too.  It's very hard to look good in front of scouts when your team can't pass to you or make the appropriate runs for you to make a pass.  Only players that can carry the entire field will have a chance of standing out and at 11 v 11, that's a tough one. I hope they treat Duarte's 09 boys right so they can stay together like the SDSC boys do.


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## what-happened

Vista 21 said:


> From what I've read here, it seems unlikely given the past history and politics that Albion or City will ever be given access to ECNL and therefore they must rely only on the GA.  If it's all politics, of course Surf brings in those large GA club teams that are a percieved threat. It's a sea of ECNL surrounding the GA. The outcomes are likely all in favor of ECNL especially here in the Southwest. The talent flows out of GA leaving good players and teams stranded and weaker.* It bloats already full ECNL teams which irritates established kid's at ECNL*..
> 
> Any wonder this forum exists.


Only so many slots.  Less drama for now in the GA.  They have work to do in the SW for sure.  Will parents stay on teams with bloated rosters and no playing time in order show they play for an ECNL team?  I don't think so but maybe some will.  West Coast, City, and Albion will get their fare share of kids into college, with much less drama.  ECNL and clubs in ECNL love bloated rosters, it equals $$$.  

Surf, et al will always be a powerhouse.  If your DD can play there consistently, go there.  If they can't, go where they will play.

These forums will continue to debate who is best....ECNL loves it.


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## what-happened

Sike said:


> While possible, I would be pretty surprised to see ecnl schedule an ecnl v ga event.  There is no upside for them to do that.


You are probably right, there is no business upside for ECNL to do this.  Lavers and Gallimore have been on a couple of podcasts discussing the possibilities.  Likely lip service and posturing for their customer base.

End of the day it's a business.  If both are putting players in college then their customers will be happy.  Parents are always going to revert to discussion on the strength of their particular leagues, and that's fine.  Both leagues will benefit.  Until there is a better way for the process, this will be the process. Parents are happy to write checks if they think there is a positive outcome at the end of their investment lifecycle.  Some will be severely disappointed with both leagues.


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## Kicker4Life

what-happened said:


> Only so many slots.  Less drama for now in the GA.  They have work to do in the SW for sure.  Will parents stay on teams with bloated rosters and no playing time in order show they play for an ECNL team?  I don't think so but maybe some will.  West Coast, City, and Albion will get their fare share of kids into college, with much less drama.  ECNL and clubs in ECNL love bloated rosters, it equals $$$.
> 
> Surf, et al will always be a powerhouse.  If your DD can play there consistently, go there.  If they can't, go where they will play.
> 
> These forums will continue to debate who is best....ECNL loves it.


ECNL doesn’t make money on Clubs roster size, only Clubs do.


----------



## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> You are probably right, there is no business upside for ECNL to do this.  Lavers and Gallimore have been on a couple of podcasts discussing the possibilities.  Likely lip service and posturing for their customer base.
> 
> End of the day it's a business.  If both are putting players in college then their customers will be happy.  Parents are always going to revert to discussion on the strength of their particular leagues, and that's fine.  Both leagues will benefit.  Until there is a better way for the process, this will be the process. Parents are happy to write checks if they think there is a positive outcome at the end of their investment lifecycle.  Some will be severely disappointed with both leagues.


Where you will see some ECNL vs GA would be in showcases like Surf, Players, etc.


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## Emma

what-happened said:


> You are probably right, there is no business upside for ECNL to do this.  Lavers and Gallimore have been on a couple of podcasts discussing the possibilities.  Likely lip service and posturing for their customer base.
> 
> End of the day it's a business.  If both are putting players in college then their customers will be happy.  Parents are always going to revert to discussion on the strength of their particular leagues, and that's fine.  Both leagues will benefit.  Until there is a better way for the process, this will be the process. Parents are happy to write checks if they think there is a positive outcome at the end of their investment lifecycle.  Some will be severely disappointed with both leagues.


It's probably not necessary to have a GA v ECNL tourney because both leagues do not limit the outside tournament competitions their teams can attend.  Surf Cup and Albion Cup have GA v. ECNL games.  There are probably many tournaments across the country having ECNL v GA games.  The southwest is tough for the GAL girls because their competition is not great and they have to travel far for good competition when there are plenty of great teams in their backyard.  Maybe southwest GAL can play GAL showcases and more tournaments but use their local leagues to play league games instead of traveling for league games.


----------



## Surf Zombie

I think the quandary the GA is facing is having the right number of clubs to allow for manageable travel, but not adding clubs that are so weak it kills the product.

Looking at the 20+ clubs that were added to GA for next year, I only recognize a few of them, and I pay way too much attention to this stuff!

Up here in the north east GA added a club that got kicked out of DA because they were so bad. Empire United.  -100+ goal differential in every age group. And that’s not an exaggeration. My friends with kids in the GA are really concerned about whether the league can continue to attract college coaches with the types of clubs they have added.


----------



## what-happened

Emma said:


> It's probably not necessary to have a GA v ECNL tourney because both leagues do not limit the outside tournament competitions their teams can attend.  Surf Cup and Albion Cup have GA v. ECNL games.  There are probably many tournaments across the country having ECNL v GA games.  The southwest is tough for the GAL girls because their competition is not great and they have to travel far for good competition when there are plenty of great teams in their backyard.  Maybe southwest GAL can play GAL showcases and more tournaments but use their local leagues to play league games instead of traveling for league games.


I don't know what the specifics looks like.  As @Desert Hound  mentioned, some deliberate bracketing in a major showcase would likely work and scratch the itch for inter league play.  It would be great to see top teams from each league play each other from time to time.  Plenty of bragging rights to be had on both sides.

I would guess the GAs approach to SOCAL SW is fueled with a little bit of patience.  They have a good base (WC, City, Albion).  Surf is essentially straddling the fence with SDSC in the GA.  It will take time.  Population of CA is big enough to fuel two leagues.  Migration will occur.  Not enough to challenge the likes of Surf, Beach, Legends, LAFC, etc, but enough to provide a level of competition that is acceptable to parents and is useful to college coaches.  The GA leadership team is plenty experienced.  I'm sure their goal isn't to topple ECNL in CA, it's to become a respected alternative/option for the athlete population that isn't in ECNL.   Some of that talent should/could be in ECNL but aren't for many reasons.

I don't know who would argue that the best teams in CA aren't in ECNL.  That's a given, especially this year.  Youth soccer is tribal, I get it.  It's in the best interest of the leagues for parents to be tribal.


----------



## Emma

what-happened said:


> I don't know what the specifics looks like.  As @Desert Hound  mentioned, some deliberate bracketing in a major showcase would likely work and scratch the itch for inter league play.  It would be great to see top teams from each league play each other from time to time.  Plenty of bragging rights to be had on both sides.
> 
> I would guess the GAs approach to SOCAL SW is fueled with a little bit of patience.  They have a good base (WC, City, Albion).  Surf is essentially straddling the fence with SDSC in the GA.  It will take time.  Population of CA is big enough to fuel two leagues.  Migration will occur.  Not enough to challenge the likes of Surf, Beach, Legends, LAFC, etc, but enough to provide a level of competition that is acceptable to parents and is useful to college coaches.  The GA leadership team is plenty experienced.  I'm sure their goal isn't to topple ECNL in CA, it's to become a respected alternative/option for the athlete population that isn't in ECNL.   Some of that talent should/could be in ECNL but aren't for many reasons.
> 
> I don't know who would argue that the best teams in CA aren't in ECNL.  That's a given, especially this year.  Youth soccer is tribal, I get it.  It's in the best interest of the leagues for parents to be tribal.


Like Surf Zombie, my only concern about GAL in the southwest is the travel.  I can see parents willing to travel some for the top league but the southwest clubs look limited in their membership numbers, which would then require them to travel far for more games unless they are willing to play the local leagues like ECNL in northern California. 

GAL should lead the way and build a strong local based league with national exposure in showcases.  Sell it as buying local, reducing our environment footprint, and building local communities.  Hopefully everyone will follow this model and reduce our footprints and traffic along the way. Eventually we can get rid of ECNL too.  If there are only 3 annual national showcases where all the soccer coaches need to attend, it will be much better system then jumping between multiple different league showcases and championships.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Emma said:


> Like Surf Zombie, my only concern about GAL in the southwest is the travel.  I can see parents willing to travel some for the top league but the southwest clubs look limited in their membership numbers, which would then require them to travel far for more games unless they are willing to play the local leagues like ECNL in northern California.
> 
> GAL should lead the way and build a strong local based league with national exposure in showcases.  Sell it as buying local, reducing our environment footprint, and building local communities.  Hopefully everyone will follow this model and reduce our footprints and traffic along the way. Eventually we can get rid of ECNL too.  If there are only 3 annual national showcases where all the soccer coaches need to attend, it will be much better system then jumping between multiple different league showcases and championships.


Might want to check the original topic for this thread ie ECNL Southwest Division Updates...

Also, don't you think that GA would have already brought on local teams to allow less travel if they could? This is the issue there's only so much to go around and GA get the scraps ECNL doesn't want/need. Assuming nothing changes over time GA is not in a winning position.


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## jellybelly71

2021/2022 GA SW Conference Estimate of Total Games Played Per Team:
- 6 teams in SW league = 12 SW league games
- home and away weekends with NW and Frontier = 8 games
- Winter Showcase (in Norco) = 3 games
- Spring Showcase (location ?) = 3 games
- Summer Showcase (guessing Oceanside) = 3 + games

Total Games played: 29 games with three airplane trips. Maybe not ideal but not much different compared to DA or ECNL


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## soccermail2020

Surf Zombie said:


> Is there any club in the area (other than Surf) who could partner/merge with Sharks and add some depth to the program? City, Albion?
> 
> I would think the ECNL ticket that Sharks has would be of great interest.


Sd Force?


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## MyDaughtersAKeeper

soccermail2020 said:


> Sd Force?


It would make sense, but do think the DOC at Force would do that?


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## soccermail2020

MyDaughtersAKeeper said:


> It would make sense, but do think the DOC at Force would do that?


I know they have a few successful age groups, the G06 being one of them. I don’t hear much about other age groups so possibly they would consider the option if it would benefit the whole club?


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## MyDaughtersAKeeper

soccermail2020 said:


> I know they have a few successful age groups, the G06 being one of them. I don’t hear much about other age groups so possibly they would consider the option if it would benefit the whole club?


My DD played for Force for one year & the DOC was the coach, I don't think there is any chance of that happening.


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## Brav520

Couple of random questions 

I’m back into the club scene with my daughter after 20-25 years ( me and my family’s plying days ). It’s just slightly different now lol

1. why isn’t City Sc- Carlsbad in ECNL

2.My sister played for Surf way back in the day , and I remember they had battles against a  Mission Viejo club that was great in girls soccer . Did So Cal blues used to be called something different 20-25 years ago?


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## Soccer

Brav520 said:


> Couple of random questions
> 
> I’m back into the club scene with my daughter after 20-25 years ( me and my family’s plying days ). It’s just slightly different now lol
> 
> 1. why isn’t City Sc- Carlsbad in ECNL
> 
> 2.My sister played for Surf way back in the day , and I remember they had battles against a  Mission Viejo club that was great in girls soccer . Did So Cal blues used to be called something different 20-25 years ago?


You are going to get many answers to #1 above.   The answer lies in the combination of the answers you get.

#2 Mission Viejo Soccer Club was the shiznet in the day.  80 something through early 2000.  Some of the successful coaches of today were on staff then.  Julie Foudy played there, I am pretty sure.


----------



## LifeOfSoccer

Desert Hound said:


> So this is just going out now in terms of how the SW will be split.
> 
> Slammers
> Real So Cal
> Eagles
> Heat
> Beach
> LA Breakers
> Arsenal FC
> Legends FC
> RSL/Royals
> 
> And
> 
> AZ Arsenal
> Phx Rising
> Surf
> Blues
> LAFC
> Rebels
> del Mar Sharks
> Strikers


Do you think they will split the ECNL-R the same way?


----------



## Desert Hound

LifeOfSoccer said:


> Do you think they will split the ECNL-R the same way?


It would seem logical to do it the same way. That said I have not heard anything regarding ecRl.


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## Footy30

Desert Hound said:


> So this is just going out now in terms of how the SW will be split.
> 
> Slammers
> Real So Cal
> Eagles
> Heat
> Beach
> LA Breakers
> Arsenal FC
> Legends FC
> RSL/Royals
> 
> And
> 
> AZ Arsenal
> Phx Rising
> Surf
> Blues
> LAFC
> Rebels
> del Mar Sharks
> Strikers


Any more news on this split??? Our coach mentioned it but didn't give too many details... figured someone on here would know...  seems odd Slammers would be put in with the Riverside/LA teams and not with OC but what do I know?? (clearly not much)


----------



## FernandoFromNationalCity

When is the 21-22 season schedule supposed to be out?


----------



## LASTMAN14

FernandoFromNationalCity said:


> When is the 21-22 season schedule supposed to be out?


Think late August.


----------



## futboldad1

LASTMAN14 said:


> Think late August.


the league and clubs love to leave us hanging lol...... we got a provisional schedule which I am hoping sticks......... need better web dev guys but I say that every year


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## Desert Hound

futboldad1 said:


> the league and clubs love to leave us hanging lol...... we got a provisional schedule which I am hoping sticks......... need better web dev guys but I say that every year


We have a provisional one as well.


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## Wasabi

If this is true this is stupid. LAFC, Surf and Blues in same bracket? This can’t be right. Over all age groups, these are the three best teams (generally speaking). Why put all three in same group? Giving a pass to beach and legends if they don’t have to play these teams


----------



## Kicker4Life

Wasabi said:


> If this is true this is stupid. LAFC, Surf and Blues in same bracket? This can’t be right. Over all age groups, these are the three best teams (generally speaking). Why put all three in same group? Giving a pass to beach and legends if they don’t have to play these teams


It’s basically geography up to the formerly LAFC and Slammers.  Doesn’t make sense to put Surf in the North so what would you suggest?  Swap Slammers and the team formerly known as LAFC?


----------



## Wasabi

Everyone plays each other once. Then you break it up in the spring so top teams play each other for top playoff spots. Lower half plays each other in 2nd half. The way they divided it doesn’t make sense. Of course that probably wouldn’t work because ecnl plays as a club. 

Basing it on geography is an excuse. this is ecnl and everyone is aware there is travel.

The southwest conference chairperson is from the Heat. I see his team is in the other bracket


----------



## Wasabi

and if slammers is willing to play north teams (how the hell is Arsenal and legends north) why not have LAFC instead. There is no logic to this


----------



## Ellejustus

futboldad1 said:


> the league and clubs love to leave us hanging lol...... we got a provisional schedule which I am hoping sticks......... need better web dev guys but I say that every year


Can you please share the provisional with us, thanks bro


----------



## Kicker4Life

Wasabi said:


> and if slammers is willing to play north teams (how the hell is Arsenal and legends north) why not have LAFC instead. There is no logic to this


Basically North of the 91 freeway is in the North and South of the 91 freeway is South. Except for Slammers or the team formerly known as LAFC. 

What would you suggest?


----------



## Wasabi

Kicker4Life said:


> Basically North of the 91 freeway is in the North and South of the 91 freeway is South. Except for Slammers or the team formerly known as LAFC.
> 
> What would you suggest?


Switch LAFC and slammers. That would balance it a little more


----------



## Desert Hound

Wasabi said:


> Everyone plays each other once. Then you break it up in the spring so top teams play each other for top playoff spots. Lower half plays each other in 2nd half. The way they divided it doesn’t make sense. Of course that probably wouldn’t work because ecnl plays as a club.
> 
> Basing it on geography is an excuse. this is ecnl and everyone is aware there is travel.
> 
> The southwest conference chairperson is from the Heat. I see his team is in the other bracket


My understanding is that within your division a club will play every other club 2 times. Then the club will play each of the other teams in the other division 1 time. 

That is just my understanding. We will have to await ECNL and whenever they get around to announcing the changes for the coming year.


----------



## Wasabi

Base it on how clubs did as a whole.  putting  3 top clubs in one bracket doesn’t make sense, unless your club would benefit from it.


----------



## sdb

I wonder if ECNL will do what it did this year and take 4 Southwest conference teams in the top playoff bracket in June 2022. If ECNL does take only 4 and it's the top 2 from each division, then it seems like having parity in terms of divisional strength should be the most important factor in creating the divisions.


----------



## Wasabi

sdb said:


> I wonder if ECNL will do what it did this year and take 4 Southwest conference teams in the top playoff bracket in June 2022. If ECNL does take only 4 and it's the top 2 from each division, then it seems like having parity in terms of divisional strength should be the most important factor in creating the divisions.


Agree about parity in tens of strength should be most important factor. When playoffs occur, I want the top 5 teams in each age group representing our division. Am I want them to all do well. If southwest conference does well, it bodes well for all of us in this conference.
From what I have seen how ecnl handles conferences, they will give 2 playoff seeds to a 8 team bracket and 3 seeds to a nine seed bracket. This is why I think the 9th team was added to the other bracket. It’s crazy to think that they could potentially have top teams get frozen out of playoffs due to are they seated this thing. There are no accidents the way these things happen. Politics on a small scale!


----------



## Wasabi

Ok I should have proofread that last one. I hit send too quickly, lol


----------



## Wasabi

Too many spelling errors. Basically what I was saying is send the best 5 from the entire conference (no matter who it is), not the teams that landed in the right conference


----------



## Ellejustus

Wasabi said:


> Too many spelling errors. Basically what I was saying is send the best 5 from the entire conference (no matter who it is), not the teams that landed in the right conference


Pay the $15 bro and you can correct all you want.  It helps so much and way worth the investment   BTW, I'm on my last year.  11 years of club soccer and politics is the bloodline in this sport.  Good luck to your player and enjoy the ride


----------



## soccermail2020

Ellejustus said:


> Can you please share the provisional with us, thanks bro


Yesssss!  Please share!


----------



## tjinaz

Desert Hound said:


> My understanding is that within your division a club will play every other club 2 times. Then the club will play each of the other teams in the other division 1 time.
> 
> That is just my understanding. We will have to await ECNL and whenever they get around to announcing the changes for the coming year.


that is still a lot of games.  figure play everyone once = 17 then your division = 8 that is 25 games so 13 weekends.  Seems like a lot.  Max played last year was 16.


----------



## Kicker4Life

tjinaz said:


> that is still a lot of games.  figure play everyone once = 17 then your division = 8 that is 25 games so 13 weekends.  Seems like a lot.  Max played last year was 16.


Last year was shut down for half the season. Play 9 weekends before HS break and 6 or so after and your can spread the 25 games across 15 or so weekends.


----------



## tjinaz

Kicker4Life said:


> Last year was shut down for half the season. Play 9 weekends before HS break and 6 or so after and your can spread the 25 games across 15 or so weekends.


Looks like you are right.  We have 13 scheduled for the fall.  Sept 11 to Nov 20


----------



## sdb

Are schedules available somewhere?


----------



## Desert Hound

tjinaz said:


> Looks like you are right.  We have 13 scheduled for the fall.  Sept 11 to Nov 20


We are at 12 for fall. That doesn't count the ECNL PHX showcase


----------



## Footy30

tjinaz said:


> Looks like you are right.  We have 13 scheduled for the fall.  Sept 11 to Nov 20


 hey sharing is caring..... @Desert Hound haha just sayin'


----------

