# ICC (International Champions Cup)



## MakeAPlay (Nov 12, 2019)

Pretty cool that this is happening at the U15 age group on the girls side!









						ICC Futures tournament field announced | Club Soccer | Youth Soccer
					

The ICC Futures tournament returns in December 2019, with boys and girls teams featuring at U14 and U15 age groups. Check out the teams that are heading to Florida.




					www.topdrawersoccer.com


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## LASTMAN14 (Nov 12, 2019)

MakeAPlay said:


> Pretty cool that this is happening at the U15 age group on the girls side!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


On the girls side at U15 Athletico Madrid will be the physical team coming out of Spain. They will attempt to move the ball around like most Spanish teams but have no problem getting getting dirty if need be and using their size. PSG will be one of the favorites to make the final. They play fantastic soccer that is intelligent, quick of pace, and skill based. They will defend will tenacity and grit, after winning the ball back will transition back to a beautiful game. PSG is a smaller team and their competitors who can not compete with them stylistically will resort to athleticism and physical play.


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## timbuck (Nov 12, 2019)

Very cool event. 
Any thoughts on the short game format?  25 minute halves. 
And a long way to travel the week before finals. I guess there’s time to study on the plane.


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## LASTMAN14 (Nov 12, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Very cool event.
> Any thoughts on the short game format?  25 minute halves.
> And a long way to travel the week before finals. I guess there’s time to study on the plane.


It would be nice if the halves were longer. But, I believe this is the format used in Europe.


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## SoCalsoccerDad (Dec 14, 2019)

Congrats to the group winners and good luck at the semi's and final this weekend.
Group A - ICC West all-stars
Group B- LAFC Slammers
Group C - FC Barcelona
Wildcard - Player Development Academy (Group B)


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## newwavedave (Dec 14, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Very cool event.
> Any thoughts on the short game format?  25 minute halves.
> And a long way to travel the week before finals. I guess there’s time to study on the plane.


I like the format and the teams playing. 25 minute half is lame. If one must fly across the country, this would be a good reason to do it   10 hours or so on the plane one can also get their school work done.  Watch out for that Spain team.  I hear they play dirty and physical.


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## timbuck (Dec 14, 2019)

I know a few girls on the LAFC team.  Heard a few girls haven’t gotten much (if any) playing time over the 1st 3 games. 25 minute halves can be tough to manage your bench.


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## LASTMAN14 (Dec 14, 2019)

newwavedave said:


> I like the format and the teams playing. 25 minute half is lame. If one must fly across the country, this would be a good reason to do it   10 hours or so on the plane one can also get their school work done.  Watch out for that Spain team.  I hear they play dirty and physical.


We played Atletico Madrid last June at their tourney. They can be physical.


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## FernandoFromNationalCity (Dec 14, 2019)

That Barca team is legit!


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## newwavedave (Dec 14, 2019)

timbuck said:


> I know a few girls on the LAFC team.  Heard a few girls haven’t gotten much (if any) playing time over the 1st 3 games. 25 minute halves can be tough to manage your bench.


That sucks for traveling across the country at that age.  If I were a coach I would only take 16 and make sure every kid gets some great good playing time.  Did they use international rules or ecnl?


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## timbuck (Dec 14, 2019)

I think it was free subs.  
Was fun to watch them play. Bummer to give up a goal with 10 seconds left.  Girl hit a great shot. 
Slammers controlled the first half. Had about 10 corner kicks and kept aiming for the far post. Can definitely see why that team has so much success. Great skill and fight in those girls. 
Barca in the 1st half tried to play into the wings but it seems they realized they weren’t likely to out run Slammers on the outside. Slammers put on a heavy press whenever they lost the ball and Barca had some trouble finding/connecting the easy pass. Might have been the short halves making them play with more urgency to get forward. 
The 2nd half Barca kept the ball more central in the attacking third.  They kept the ball a bit better with short, narrow passes.  Had some good chances.  Slammers keeper made a few great saves.


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## LASTMAN14 (Dec 15, 2019)

Watched the final today. Barcelona outplayed PDA up and down the field.


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## timbuck (Dec 15, 2019)

It wasn’t even close.  If this is the future, the US women dominance on the world stage is over.
ive not seen PDA play before today.  I know they are a dominant club here.  Was today evident of their usual style of play?
I was most shocked by the boot forward on the kickoff. And with the goal keeper playing everything long.  Barca also switched keepers at halftime in both games that I saw)
Barcelona looked liked a different team today than they did against LAFC. Patient. Connecting everything. 10+ pass sequences many, many times.     Playing 2 touch all over the field.  Getting back in transition.


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## newwavedave (Dec 16, 2019)

timbuck said:


> It wasn’t even close.  If this is the future, the US women dominance on the world stage is over.
> ive not seen PDA play before today.  I know they are a dominant club here.  Was today evident of their usual style of play?
> I was most shocked by the boot forward on the kickoff. And with the goal keeper playing everything long.  Barca also switched keepers at halftime in both games that I saw)
> Barcelona looked liked a different team today than they did against LAFC. Patient. Connecting everything. 10+ pass sequences many, many times.     Playing 2 touch all over the field.  Getting back in transition.


My dd favorite way to play.  No GK kicks at all and play from the back. Two touch pass and have most of the team touch the ball and then score.  It can't happen on top youth teams in USA unless you have all star team like Stanford and a youth coach who yells and demands it 24/7.  Too many players want to go 1 v1 and show off to scouts how good they are and how many hat tricks they can get in one season.  I'm not bitter anymore, I just wish everyone played Baca style.  Keep in mind coach Buck that these Spain girls are training to go pro and that's it.  99% of our girls are trying to make YNT List so they can get a full ride to top D1 college.  Why pass the rock?


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## El Clasico (Dec 16, 2019)

LASTMAN14 said:


> It would be nice if the halves were longer. But, I believe this is the format used in Europe.


Most of the time in tournaments. That is correct.


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## Yak (Dec 16, 2019)

El Clasico said:


> Most of the time in tournaments. That is correct.


Also for DA tournaments due to the one game per day rule (or 2 x 50 minute games)


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## myself (Dec 16, 2019)

timbuck said:


> It wasn’t even close.  If this is the future, the US women dominance on the world stage is over.
> ive not seen PDA play before today.  I know they are a dominant club here.  Was today evident of their usual style of play?
> I was most shocked by the boot forward on the kickoff. And with the goal keeper playing everything long.  Barca also switched keepers at halftime in both games that I saw)
> Barcelona looked liked a different team today than they did against LAFC. Patient. Connecting everything. 10+ pass sequences many, many times.     Playing 2 touch all over the field.  Getting back in transition.


Let's not draw conclusions on the future of international women's soccer based on one abbreviated game between 14 year olds. And club teams at that.

And even if we were, why use the PDA game as a reference and not the LAFC game?


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## Keepermom2 (Dec 16, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Patient. Connecting everything. 10+ pass sequences many, many times.     Playing 2 touch all over the field.  Getting back in transition.


I was astounded at the patience and confidence of 14 year old girls.  Even in the second half when PDA did the push and took the ball away a few times, Barcelona did not change and maintained their style never once just blasting forward.  Impressive.


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## timbuck (Dec 16, 2019)

myself said:


> Let's not draw conclusions on the future of international women's soccer based on one abbreviated game between 14 year olds. And club teams at that.
> 
> And even if we were, why use the PDA game as a reference and not the LAFC game?


Good point.  
Either LAFC totally disrupted Barca’s game plan or Barca had a different game plan in those 2 games. 
LAFC had a ton of corner kicks in the 1st half. Each one sent to the far post. I bet they have scored a LOT of goals that way. 
LAFC did a better job of pressing Barca and then making a nice pass to try and break forward.
I haven’t watched much youth international girls soccer. Anyone know how Barca does against other teams across Europe?  Are they the “norm” or are they the outlier?


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## LASTMAN14 (Dec 16, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Good point.
> Either LAFC totally disrupted Barca’s game plan or Barca had a different game plan in those 2 games.
> LAFC had a ton of corner kicks in the 1st half. Each one sent to the far post. I bet they have scored a LOT of goals that way.
> LAFC did a better job of pressing Barca and then making a nice pass to try and break forward.
> I haven’t watched much youth international girls soccer. Anyone know how Barca does against other teams across Europe?  Are they the “norm” or are they the outlier?


Our girls played Lyon last June. Barcelona per that game was on par with them.


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## El Clasico (Dec 16, 2019)

timbuck said:


> I haven’t watched much youth international girls soccer. Anyone know how Barca does against other teams across Europe?  Are they the “norm” or are they the outlier?


Spain is working hard to catch up but is NOT on par with their European counterparts. More machismo in spain to overcome.


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## Ansu Fati (Dec 26, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Good point.
> Either LAFC totally disrupted Barca’s game plan or Barca had a different game plan in those 2 games.
> LAFC had a ton of corner kicks in the 1st half. Each one sent to the far post. I bet they have scored a LOT of goals that way.
> LAFC did a better job of pressing Barca and then making a nice pass to try and break forward.
> I haven’t watched much youth international girls soccer. Anyone know how Barca does against other teams across Europe?  Are they the “norm” or are they the outlier?


Finally got a chance to watch the matches. I have to say, thoroughly impressed by Barca (shouldn't be too surprised give my handle lol). All around the pitch they're technical, know how to control/exploit space, and have soccer IQ. And they are true to their style, even against an athletic hard pressing team like LAFC. 

Things look promising for Spain, and if other European countries are doing similar things, not looking forward to the next 5-10 years.


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## focomoso (Dec 26, 2019)

Ansu Fati said:


> Things look promising for Spain, and if other European countries are doing similar things, not looking forward to the next 5-10 years.


I thought their best player was the American, though, so that may bode well for the US.


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## Ansu Fati (Dec 26, 2019)

focomoso said:


> I thought their best player was the American, though, so that may bode well for the US.


Wait, they have an American?


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## Ansu Fati (Dec 27, 2019)

focomoso said:


> I thought their best player was the American, though, so that may bode well for the US.


But one player doesn't necessarily bode well for the system as a whole. Look at the men's side with Pulisic- potential bigtime star on the world stage, but we are still wallowing in mediocrity.

American soccer culture values athleticism, physicality, and individualism over high technical proficiency and playing the game intelligently. This has served the women's game for the past couple of decades, but times a changing. The rest of the world is tired of American hegemony,  investing more and transferring their soccer identity to the female side, and I think we are seeing the sea change. That Barca side sure plays alot like the mens club/national team that won the CL/WC. We no longer dominate at the youth international level. It'll be interesting to see how things pan out.


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## Soccerhelper (Dec 27, 2019)

Ansu Fati said:


> But one player doesn't necessarily bode well for the system as a whole. Look at the men's side with Pulisic- potential bigtime star on the world stage, but we are still wallowing in mediocrity.
> 
> *American soccer culture values athleticism, physicality, and individualism* over *high technical proficiency and playing the game intelligently*. This has served the women's game for the past couple of decades, but times a changing. The rest of the world is tired of American hegemony,  investing more and transferring their soccer identity to the female side, and I think we are seeing the sea change. That Barca side sure plays alot like the mens club/national team that won the CL/WC. *We no longer dominate at the youth international level.* It'll be interesting to see how things pan out.


I'm confused.  Shouldn't USSF look for the players who have it ALL and then train them to be more proficient and make the smart play, not be a ball hog?  Focus on the Men and & Woman teams and maybe u20 world cup.  U17 is dumb for the girls. Pay the girl players after HS some money to play pro and train for the WNT.  BTW, the smart players who are slow and want space to do their tricks hate the FACT that faster+Bigger+stronger= better and if you have all three you're in the running to be a GOAT.  You have to have it ALL.


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## focomoso (Dec 27, 2019)

Ansu Fati said:


> Wait, they have an American?


Yes. The announces were talking about him during the game, but I can't find his name anywhere online. First name started with an "A".


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## Ansu Fati (Dec 27, 2019)

focomoso said:


> Yes. The announces were talking about him during the game, but I can't find his name anywhere online. First name started with an "A".


Ahh, I thought you meant on girls side. Only male I know of in youth ranks is Konrad de la Fuente, curious who this younger one is...


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## Ansu Fati (Dec 27, 2019)

I'm confused.  Shouldn't USSF look for the players who have it ALL and then train them to be more proficient and make the smart play, not be a ball hog?  Focus on the Men and & Woman teams and maybe u20 world cup.  U17 is dumb for the girls. Pay the girl players after HS some money to play pro and train for the WNT.  BTW, the smart players who are slow and want space to do their tricks hate the FACT that faster+Bigger+stronger= better and if you have all three you're in the running to be a GOAT.  You have to have it ALL.
[/QUOTE]

If US Soccer is looking for GOATs who "have it all", then they shouldn't have to train them to be more proficient, smarter, and less ball hoggy, right?
I think therein lies the problem.


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## Soccerhelper (Dec 27, 2019)

Ansu Fati said:


> I'm confused.  Shouldn't USSF look for the players who have it ALL and then train them to be more proficient and make the smart play, not be a ball hog?  Focus on the Men and & Woman teams and maybe u20 world cup.  U17 is dumb for the girls. Pay the girl players after HS some money to play pro and train for the WNT.  BTW, the smart players who are slow and want space to do their tricks hate the FACT that faster+Bigger+stronger= better and if you have all three you're in the running to be a GOAT.  You have to have it ALL.


If US Soccer is looking for GOATs who "have it all", then they shouldn't have to train them to be more proficient, smarter, and less ball hoggy, right?
I think therein lies the problem.
[/QUOTE]
Can USSF wait until girl is 16 or older and just take the best of the best and leave all the other leagues for the rest of us?  Their the one's who started this mess and they need to help clean it all up.  Small country's with small peeps have to play possession.  Country's with all sizes like the USA or just big ones like Germany and Sweden will always use their EURO DNA to destroy the little guy or girls.  Trying to make the game played one way is not good inho.  We have division on what style when just find the best 11 and play with what you got.  Nice to meet you btw


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## Ansu Fati (Dec 27, 2019)

Soccerhelper said:


> If US Soccer is looking for GOATs who "have it all", then they shouldn't have to train them to be more proficient, smarter, and less ball hoggy, right?
> I think therein lies the problem.


Can USSF wait until girl is 16 or older and just take the best of the best and leave all the other leagues for the rest of us?  Their the one's who started this mess and they need to help clean it all up.  Small country's with small peeps have to play possession.  Country's with all sizes like the USA or just big ones like Germany and Sweden will always use their EURO DNA to destroy the little guy or girls.  Trying to make the game played one way is not good inho.  We have division on what style when just find the best 11 and play with what you got.  Nice to meet you btw 
[/QUOTE]

Nice to meet you too

Don't pretend to know the answer, but US Soccer sure didn't help by trying to throw down the hammer with this whole DA fiasco.


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## timbuck (Dec 27, 2019)

Ansu Fati said:


> Can USSF wait until girl is 16 or older and just take the best of the best and leave all the other leagues for the rest of us?  Their the one's who started this mess and they need to help clean it all up.  Small country's with small peeps have to play possession.  Country's with all sizes like the USA or just big ones like Germany and Sweden will always use their EURO DNA to destroy the little guy or girls.  Trying to make the game played one way is not good inho.  We have division on what style when just find the best 11 and play with what you got.  Nice to meet you btw


Nice to meet you too

Don't pretend to know the answer, but US Soccer sure didn't help by trying to throw down the hammer with this whole DA fiasco.
[/QUOTE]

What if C. Lavers of ECNL said "OK, US Soccer.  You can have the top program.  Just give me $500k and I'll fold up my ECNL tent and go home."
US Soccer didn't help.  But ECNL wanted to pound their chest and claim dominance (which they've done a decent job of).  
As it stands now, I don't know how we'll ever declare a winner.  All I know is that the top is dilluted and the teams in the 2 competing leagues arent "allowed" to play each other.


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## dejong21 (Dec 27, 2019)

[/QUOTE]
What if C. Lavers of ECNL said "OK, US Soccer.  You can have the top program.  Just give me $500k and I'll fold up my ECNL tent and go home."
US Soccer didn't help.  But ECNL wanted to pound their chest and claim dominance (which they've done a decent job of).
As it stands now, I don't know how we'll ever declare a winner.  All I know is that the top is dilluted and the teams in the 2 competing leagues arent "allowed" to play each other.
[/QUOTE]

I could imagine a scenario where a winner could be declared- DA allows HS soccer. But that won't happen (any time soon).


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## Soccerhelper (Dec 27, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Nice to meet you too
> 
> Don't pretend to know the answer, but US Soccer sure didn't help by trying to throw down the hammer with this whole DA fiasco.


What if C. Lavers of ECNL said "OK, US Soccer.  You can have the top program.  Just give me $500k and I'll fold up my ECNL tent and go home."
US Soccer didn't help.  But ECNL wanted to pound their chest and claim dominance (which they've done a decent job of). 
As it stands now, I don't know how we'll ever declare a winner.  All I know is that the top is dilluted and the teams in the 2 competing leagues arent "allowed" to play each other.
[/QUOTE]
I don;t know what all happen before ECNL but it does seem to me that ECNL built a successful business that produced top college players who the USSF recruited for their YNTs.  Legends and Beach were pissed off big time every year (I don't blame them and 100% see their side in this) because one goat after another went to Arsenal, Real SoCal, Slammers, West Coast, Strikers or Blues. Surf had their own kingdom in San Diego.  Arsenal had the IE and always stole JH goats.  Surf was the wild card in all this.  They had two choices to go based on what I witnessed.  All In ECNL or All In DA+DPL+5 Year DA Playoff Contract for Surf Cup Sports +other stuff.  However, they didn't get their cake and ice cream.  Only cake with no frosting. Blues earned their cake and ice cream by winning the games on the field   It's no secret that USSF/DA and other Big Clubs would like to see Blues and Tad go away. I think their is a place for one of the longest running girls soccer clubs in the country to be a part of youth soccer.


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## timbuck (Dec 27, 2019)

What if C. Lavers of ECNL said "OK, US Soccer.  You can have the top program.  Just give me $500k and I'll fold up my ECNL tent and go home."
US Soccer didn't help.  But ECNL wanted to pound their chest and claim dominance (which they've done a decent job of).
As it stands now, I don't know how we'll ever declare a winner.  All I know is that the top is dilluted and the teams in the 2 competing leagues arent "allowed" to play each other.
[/QUOTE]

I could imagine a scenario where a winner could be declared- DA allows HS soccer. But that won't happen (any time soon).
[/QUOTE]
With a kid who is a freshman this year, (And not at a DA or ECNL level), I can understand why US Soccer doesn't want their top players in high school. But this should really be for like the Top 50 kids in an age group across the country.
High School has too many games per week.  The HS coaches want to over-rule the club coaches.  Even though the HS season is only about 2 months of "Actual season", many high schools treat it as a pseudo year round schedule with weight room/soccer class 3 days per week.  Some even have a "Spring Scrimmage Squad Season" and summer conditioning.  If you want to train with your DA team 4x per week and have some extended travel games, the High School stuff is not good for those players.


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## timbuck (Dec 27, 2019)

Soccerhelper said:


> What if C. Lavers of ECNL said "OK, US Soccer.  You can have the top program.  Just give me $500k and I'll fold up my ECNL tent and go home."
> US Soccer didn't help.  But ECNL wanted to pound their chest and claim dominance (which they've done a decent job of).
> As it stands now, I don't know how we'll ever declare a winner.  All I know is that the top is dilluted and the teams in the 2 competing leagues arent "allowed" to play each other.


I don;t know what all happen before ECNL but it does seem to me that ECNL built a successful business that produced top college players who the USSF recruited for their YNTs.  Legends and Beach were pissed off big time every year (I don't blame them and 100% see their side in this) because one goat after another went to Arsenal, Real SoCal, Slammers, West Coast, Strikers or Blues. Surf had their own kingdom in San Diego.  Arsenal had the IE and always stole JH goats.  Surf was the wild card in all this.  They had two choices to go based on what I witnessed.  All In ECNL or All In DA+DPL+5 Year DA Playoff Contract for Surf Cup Sports +other stuff.  However, they didn't get their cake and ice cream.  Only cake with no frosting. Blues earned their cake and ice cream by winning the games on the field   It's no secret that USSF/DA and other Big Clubs would like to see Blues and Tad go away. I think their is a place for one of the longest running girls soccer clubs in the country to be a part of youth soccer.
[/QUOTE]
You know what solves all of this?  
Promotion and Relegation at the age group level.
Forget a closed league. Let a team like AYSO United, CFA,  Palm Desert SC, Kickers SC, etc have a chance of competing at the highest level by letting them qualify to play in the top league.  Today, Slammers could have a bad run for a few years and still be in the top league. And still got top kids lining up to play for them because they are in the top league.
Now the only Promotion and Relegation we have is at the individual player level.  You play good - you get promoted to a new team.  You play bad, you get sent down to a lower team.


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## Soccerhelper (Dec 27, 2019)

timbuck said:


> I don;t know what all happen before ECNL but it does seem to me that ECNL built a successful business that produced top college players who the USSF recruited for their YNTs.  Legends and Beach were pissed off big time every year (I don't blame them and 100% see their side in this) because one goat after another went to Arsenal, Real SoCal, Slammers, West Coast, Strikers or Blues. Surf had their own kingdom in San Diego.  Arsenal had the IE and always stole JH goats.  Surf was the wild card in all this.  They had two choices to go based on what I witnessed.  All In ECNL or All In DA+DPL+5 Year DA Playoff Contract for Surf Cup Sports +other stuff.  However, they didn't get their cake and ice cream.  Only cake with no frosting. Blues earned their cake and ice cream by winning the games on the field   It's no secret that USSF/DA and other Big Clubs would like to see Blues and Tad go away. I think their is a place for one of the longest running girls soccer clubs in the country to be a part of youth soccer.


You know what solves all of this? 
Promotion and Relegation at the age group level.
Forget a closed league. Let a team like AYSO United, CFA,  Palm Desert SC, Kickers SC, etc have a chance of competing at the highest level by letting them qualify to play in the top league.  Today, Slammers could have a bad run for a few years and still be in the top league. And still got top kids lining up to play for them because they are in the top league.
Now the only Promotion and Relegation we have is at the individual player level.  You play good - you get promoted to a new team.  You play bad, you get sent down to a lower team.
[/QUOTE]
Awesome!!!


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## SoccerFan4Life (Dec 27, 2019)

ECNL = Pay to play for good players from rich families.  

 Bottom line, yes ECNL can get kids exposure to college scouts.   The problem is that there’s plenty of players that cannot afford ECNL or live too  far from an ECNL practice facility.    

 From an investment perspective ECNL is a break even investment if you have a starting player.  It’s a huge loss if you are a bench player.      The system needs to change quickly  because other counties are catching up really fast to the USA.


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## Soccerhelper (Dec 28, 2019)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> ECNL = Pay to play for good players from rich families.
> 
> Bottom line, yes ECNL can get kids exposure to college scouts.   The problem is that there’s plenty of players that cannot afford ECNL or live too  far from an ECNL practice facility.
> 
> From an investment perspective ECNL is a break even investment if you have a starting player.  It’s a huge loss if you are a bench player.      The system needs to change quickly  because other counties are catching up really fast to the USA.


I agree.  It's just a league to help one get into college.  I feel the financial pain too.  The dinners with the teams can be insane too.  I told my dd maybe next year for Jr year of HS we email desired local colleges and ask them to come watch her play Newport Harbor High School.  I'm telling you all, some girls play differently when they have their hs school name on their shirt.  That is the player the college coach will must likely get.  For example, my dd friend just started playing ECNL.  Played SCDSL for a few years. Showcase was interesting audition.  Fear, college coaches sitting their and btw, Ganas is not made for a lot of girls in that environment.  This same girl playing CB for her hs school is 100% bad ass and protector of the schools defensive line. Two completely different players and it's free except for fundraising time.  I told the dad get your highlights from all the HS games and send them to the coaches.  He told me, "great idea, thanks for the help."


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