# Will US Soccer schedule "friendlies" between like age Elite GDA and G/WNT circuit teams?



## GoWest (Apr 14, 2017)

Like one big happy family, will US Soccer schedule "friendlies / scrimmages" between like age Elite GDA and G/WNT circuit teams as part of ongoing evaluation processes? I mean, maybe another valuable way to evaluate individual players in "head to head" competition? I dont believe US Soccer has ever done that with ECNL but I may be wrong. Just wondering if anyone has heard anything along those lines or not.


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## NoGoal (Apr 14, 2017)

GoWest said:


> Like one big happy family, will US Soccer schedule "friendlies / scrimmages" between like age Elite GDA and G/WNT circuit teams as part of ongoing evaluation processes? I mean, maybe another valuable way to evaluate individual players in "head to head" competition? I dont believe US Soccer has ever done that with ECNL but I may be wrong. Just wondering if anyone has heard anything along those lines or not.


The YNT teams use to scrimmage the Cal South Girls ODP teams.  Last November at the ODP Thanksgiving interregional event in Florida.  The GU14 YNT scrimmaged an older ODP 2000 Region I, II, III, and IV girls teams.

http://tournaments.usyouthsoccer.org/events/2016-ODP-Girls-Interregional/Schedule/2000-Girls/Division+1/

A couple of years ago a US YNT also scrimmaged a Surf ECNL team mixed with their best 98/99 players.


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## GoWest (Apr 14, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> The YNT teams use to scrimmage the Cal South Girls ODP teams.  Last November at the ODP Thanksgiving interregional event in Florida.  The GU14 YNT scrimmaged an older ODP 2000 Region I, II, III, and IV girls teams.
> 
> http://tournaments.usyouthsoccer.org/events/2016-ODP-Girls-Interregional/Schedule/2000-Girls/Division+1/
> 
> A couple of years ago a US YNT also scrimmaged a Surf ECNL team mixed with their best 98/99 players.


Ok, thanks. Looks like there is a bit of history then. I could imagine US Soccer ramping up that idea maybe even by this Fall? Personally, I think it's a good idea to promote the US Soccer GDA venture.


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## Dos Equis (Apr 15, 2017)

I have seen them scrimmage older ODP teams, WPSL teams as well as top younger boys teams.  If they can get a good match, they have sought it out.   Perhaps GDA will make that easier, though I expect they would have younger teams play older GDA teams located near their training sites.


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## younothat (Apr 15, 2017)

For club/teams near the training center(s) there can be some opportunities. 

Not sure ussda is pushing this, seems like more of  a convenience deal arranged by certain clubs...The training center at stub hub is right next to LA Galaxy so those teams likely to have more "opportunities"


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## GoWest (Apr 15, 2017)

I'm thinking since US Soccer is over both GDA league and G/WNT circuit/campers, they would promote the idea. A stacked SoCal GDA team (Slammers and Surf come to mind) would probably be challenged by a like age bracket G/WNT group of campers and vice versa? I've always heard that some of the girls invited to the national team camps, though having solid skills, probably were juiced in because their HC or club DOC (or both) are heavy handed with the political push so to flush those players out, it would seem that a series of games like we are speaking of might be another checks and balances of sorts? I guess we'll see in the next few months.


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> I'm thinking since US Soccer is over both GDA league and G/WNT circuit/campers, they would promote the idea. A stacked SoCal GDA team (Slammers and Surf come to mind) would probably be challenged by a like age bracket G/WNT group of campers and vice versa? I've always heard that some of the girls invited to the national team camps, though having solid skills, probably were juiced in because their HC or club DOC (or both) are heavy handed with the political push so to flush those players out, it would seem that a series of games like we are speaking of might be another checks and balances of sorts? I guess we'll see in the next few months.


True the YNT players are either scouted at showcases, ID events and/or recommnded by their DOC's.  It doesn't mean they are on the team, because of their recommendation alone.  They attend the camp/s and a lot of invited players are cycled out after 1 or 2 camp invites.


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> True the YNT players are either scouted at showcases, ID events and/or recommnded by their DOC's.  It doesn't mean they are on the team, because of their recommendation alone.  They attend the camp/s and a lot of invited players are cycled out after 1 or 2 camp invites.


Prior to Girls DA this fall.  US Soccer runs their monthly ulittle US Soccer regionalized market training centers.  This is by invite only and the players are either ID'd or/are recommended by their club DOC.  If the player shows well they are invited back the following months.  The players who shine can get a YNT camp invite.

IMO, US Soccer has done a great job actually indentifying the best players in the SoCal 1999 age group. No parent in SoCal can argue there DD is better than Ashley Sanchez, Kiara Pickett, Tara McKeown, Karina Rodriguez and Arlie Jones.  Some may say, Catarina Macario, but she is not a US citizen yet.


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## GoWest (Apr 15, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Prior to Girls DA this fall.  US Soccer runs their monthly ulittle US Soccer regionalized market training centers.  This is by invite only and the players are either ID'd or/are recommended by their club DOC.  If the player shows well they are invited back the following months.  The players who shine can get a YNT camp invite.
> 
> IMO, US Soccer has done a great job actually indentifying the best players in the SoCal 1999 age group. No parent in SoCal can argue there DD is better than Ashley Sanchez, Kiara Pickett, Tara McKeown, Karina Rodriguez and Arlie Jones.  Some may say, Catarina Macario, but she is not a US citizen yet.


You make a good point especially for that group. Jones is a Nevada girl I think so goes to support even more that US Soccer is IDing great talent at a good clip. I wonder about the US Soccer coaches though. Carr seems a good fit and I think he's had a good amount of success within the US Soccer system. Not so sure about some of the other US Soccer coaches though. Not my call.


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> You make a good point especially for that group. Jones is a Nevada girl I think so goes to support even more that US Soccer is IDing great talent at a good clip. I wonder about the US Soccer coaches though. Carr seems a good fit and I think he's had a good amount of success within the US Soccer system. Not so sure about some of the other US Soccer coaches though. Not my call.


Correct Jones is from Vegas.  She played NV ODP, Region IV ODP and on the Surf ECNL team.  Her performance on all 3 teams most likely contributed to her YNT call up and making the team. Same can be said about the other SoCal players I posted previously.


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## soccer4us (Apr 15, 2017)

Just don't scrimmage FC Dallas DA team like the full national team!


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## GoWest (Apr 15, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> Just don't scrimmage FC Dallas DA team like the full national team!


Where can we get a glimpse at their roster? What age bracket is the FC Dallas team? If what I am hearing about some of the upcoming GDA teams is true (deep with talent) there are gonna be some fantastic matches and rivalries built starting in just a couple months! I just hope US Soccer builds scrimmages within the upcoming programming format that includes teams on the G/WNT circuit. I think it would fit nicely within their mission to further ID the very best players in the US. Less guess work might prove to improve US international results?


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> Where can we get a glimpse at their roster? What age bracket is the FC Dallas team? If what I am hearing about some of the upcoming GDA teams is true (deep with talent) there are gonna be some fantastic matches and rivalries built starting in just a couple months! I just hope US Soccer builds scrimmages within the upcoming programming format that includes teams on the G/WNT circuit. I think it would fit nicely within their mission to further ID the very best players in the US. Less guess work might prove to improve US international results?


I have to ask do you think the US Womens U17 and U20 YNT teams unsuccessful bid at the World Cup was do to poor player selection or the YNT head coaches and their style of play?  Yes, this is a loaded question.


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## soccer4us (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> Where can we get a glimpse at their roster? What age bracket is the FC Dallas team? If what I am hearing about some of the upcoming GDA teams is true (deep with talent) there are gonna be some fantastic matches and rivalries built starting in just a couple months! I just hope US Soccer builds scrimmages within the upcoming programming format that includes teams on the G/WNT circuit. I think it would fit nicely within their mission to further ID the very best players in the US. Less guess work might prove to improve US international results?


I was kidding and mentioned that because their boys u15 team beat our full women's national team 5-2 in a scrimmage a few weeks ago. I agree they should. I can see a u15 national team playing a 00 team or something of that sort.


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## soccer4us (Apr 15, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> I have to ask do you think the US Womens U17 and U20 YNT teams unsuccessful bid at the World Cup was do to poor player selection or the YNT head coaches and their style of play?  Yes, this is a loaded question.


I think the answer is typically both. At least for the u20's not ALL of the best were willing to forgo their college season due to scholarship issues with a 5th year needed. Do the nations best coaches coach with the youth national teams? I don't think so. Many don't want that type of job and prefer to work with kids weekly.  IMO until we get a new TD, not much will change


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> I think the answer is typically both. At least for the u20's not ALL of the best were willing to forgo their college season due to scholarship issues with a 5th year needed. Do the nations best coaches coach with the youth national teams? I don't think so. Many don't want that type of job and prefer to work with kids weekly.  IMO until we get a new TD, not much will change


You just let GoWest of the hook.


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## MakeAPlay (Apr 15, 2017)

The Albion Hurricane GDA team is going to be ridiculous.  I spoke with the parents of a Pepperdine player from Houston and they told me that they only have one GDA team for that entire metro area!  Houston is the 4th largest city in America which is crazy that San Diego has 3 and Orange County has 4 with a much smaller pool of potential players not to mention an MLS team and an NWSL team.  They told me that their issue down there is coaching.  I laughed and said that is the same everywhere.


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## GoWest (Apr 15, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> I have to ask do you think the US Womens U17 and U20 YNT teams unsuccessful bid at the World Cup was do to poor player selection or the YNT head coaches and their style of play?  Yes, this is a loaded question.


LOL! I'm glad I had to do a bit of shopping allowing time for @soccer4us to let me "off the hook!" I agree with 4us in that it is a recipe of things as mentioned. I do however, put a lot of emphasis on the coach. It seems in any sport, that's where the buck stops (or should anyways) ...the head coach. They do rely on others to help scout and recruit talent but I the HC has the final say and so, especially at the u17 level (where college conflict is NOT at play) I place the greater part of their disappointing showing on the shoulders of the coach. If memory serves, Frias, right? Was he "reallocated" to running the technical training or something like that? I may be off base here as to the most recent HC of the u17's.


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## GoWest (Apr 15, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> I was kidding and mentioned that because their boys u15 team beat our full women's national team 5-2 in a scrimmage a few weeks ago. I agree they should. I can see a u15 national team playing a 00 team or something of that sort.


I would like to see US Soccer set scrimmages / friendlies with "apples to apples" competition. Elite GDA teams only. I'm just curious as to what we would see. That was a butt whooping though....5-2!


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## GoWest (Apr 15, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> The Albion Hurricane GDA team is going to be ridiculous.  I spoke with the parents of a Pepperdine player from Houston and they told me that they only have one GDA team for that entire metro area!  Houston is the 4th largest city in America which is crazy that San Diego has 3 and Orange County has 4 with a much smaller pool of potential players not to mention an MLS team and an NWSL team.  They told me that their issue down there is coaching.  I laughed and said that is the same everywhere.


So, when are the GDA rosters and schedule supposed to be published? July?


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> LOL! I'm glad I had to do a bit of shopping allowing time for @soccer4us to let me "off the hook!" I agree with 4us in that it is a recipe of things as mentioned. I do however, put a lot of emphasis on the coach. It seems in any sport, that's where the buck stops (or should anyways) ...the head coach. They do rely on others to help scout and recruit talent but I the HC has the final say and so, especially at the u17 level (where college conflict is NOT at play) I place the greater part of their disappointing showing on the shoulders of the coach. If memory serves, Frias, right? Was he "reallocated" to running the technical training or something like that? I may be off base here as to the most recent HC of the u17's.


The U17s head coach was BJ Snow and I think has been reassigned to the US WNT U23s....or was that Michelle French?

Got to love the WNT and YNT head coaching cronyism.


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## soccer4us (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> LOL! I'm glad I had to do a bit of shopping allowing time for @soccer4us to let me "off the hook!" I agree with 4us in that it is a recipe of things as mentioned. I do however, put a lot of emphasis on the coach. It seems in any sport, that's where the buck stops (or should anyways) ...the head coach. They do rely on others to help scout and recruit talent but I the HC has the final say and so, especially at the u17 level (where college conflict is NOT at play) I place the greater part of their disappointing showing on the shoulders of the coach. If memory serves, Frias, right? Was he "reallocated" to running the technical training or something like that? I may be off base here as to the most recent HC of the u17's.


I've never seen a counties federation re-assign so many coaches for failing!! Almost all other serious countries do something called....we're firing you. Best of luck! I think You're right on Frias. I saw something he's running the u18 camp next week.  Snow was the u17 coach at World Cup and now I believe some kind of main scout focusing on college/NWSL or something of that sort. I hear if you coached with Jill at UCLA, you're not allowed to fired from us soccer


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## soccer4us (Apr 15, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> The U17s head coach was BJ Snow and I think has been reassigned to the US WNT U23s....or was that Michelle French?
> 
> Got to love the WNT and YNT head coaching cronyism.


French 23's
Klimkova 20's
Carr 17's


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> I've never seen a counties federation re-assign so many coaches for failing!! Almost all other serious countries do something called....we're firing you. Best of luck! I think You're right on Frias. I saw something he's running the u18 camp next week.  Snow was the u17 coach at World Cup and now I believe some kind of main scout focusing on college/NWSL or something of that sort. I hear if you coached with Jill at UCLA, you're not allowed to fired from us soccer


Follow the April Heinrich and Jill Ellis coaching tree and you will follow the cronyism.


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## devupa2.0 (Apr 15, 2017)

GoWest said:


> I would like to see US Soccer set scrimmages / friendlies with "apples to apples" competition. Elite GDA teams only. I'm just curious as to what we would see. That was a butt whooping though....5-2!


In the last two years my DD and I have been able to go to Stub Hub to watch a few matches that were set up during YNT training camps. It seems the typical formula is for the coaching staff to set up training sessions early in the week with scrimmages against a couple top So Cal club teams in the latter part of the week. We've seen matches with the U15 YNT camp playing against excellent So Cal club teams that were 2 years older.

Maybe GDA will result in higher caliber club teams (maybe not), but I have to say that none of the matches I watched were very close. Even with a two year age gap, the younger YNT pool team was better by a few goals and even more in terms of confidence on the ball. Two of the matches we saw were with National Championship caliber club teams. To be fair, I wasn't familiar with either of the older club teams, so I don't know if they fielded their strongest players or not, but I think the point stands regardless.

IMO - our top SoCal DA teams will be very good. However, even those teams will have 2 or 3 truly elite national-caliber players (possibly less). We can argue about whether these teams have more or less than 2 or 3 elite players, but the YNT training camps are targeting the top elite players across the nation. So, you are talking about having a younger YNT pool team with 11 elite players on the field playing against an older team club team that might have a couple elite players. In the couple match-ups I have seen, it doesn't seem to result in a fair match.


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> I've never seen a counties federation re-assign so many coaches for failing!! Almost all other serious countries do something called....we're firing you. Best of luck! I think You're right on Frias. I saw something he's running the u18 camp next week.  Snow was the u17 coach at World Cup and now I believe some kind of main scout focusing on college/NWSL or something of that sort. I hear if you coached with Jill at UCLA, you're not allowed to fired from us soccer


http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/02/24/15/09/20170224-news-wnt-us-soccer-changes-youth-womens-national-team-staff-michelle-french-bj-snow


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

devupa2.0 said:


> In the last two years my DD and I have been able to go to Stub Hub to watch a few matches that were set up during YNT training camps. It seems the typical formula is for the coaching staff to set up training sessions early in the week with scrimmages against a couple top So Cal club teams in the latter part of the week. We've seen matches with the U15 YNT camp playing against excellent So Cal club teams that were 2 years older.
> 
> Maybe GDA will result in higher caliber club teams (maybe not), but I have to say that none of the matches I watched were very close. Even with a two year age gap, the younger YNT pool team was better by a few goals and even more in terms of confidence on the ball. Two of the matches we saw were with National Championship caliber club teams. To be fair, I wasn't familiar with either of the older club teams, so I don't know if they fielded their strongest players or not, but I think the point stands regardless.
> 
> IMO - our top SoCal DA teams will be very good. However, even those teams will have 2 or 3 truly elite national-caliber players (possibly less). We can argue about whether these teams have more or less than 2 or 3 elite players, but the YNT training camps are targeting the top elite players across the nation. So, you are talking about having a younger YNT pool team with 11 elite players on the field playing against an older team club team that might have a couple elite players. In the couple match-ups I have seen, it doesn't seem to result in a fair match.


I am happy that you posted my thoughts and not me


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## NoGoal (Apr 15, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> French 23's
> Klimkova 20's
> Carr 17's


Mark Carr, BJ Snow and Michelle French were all assistant coaches for Jill Ellis at UCLA.


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## soccer4us (Apr 15, 2017)

devupa2.0 said:


> In the last two years my DD and I have been able to go to Stub Hub to watch a few matches that were set up during YNT training camps. It seems the typical formula is for the coaching staff to set up training sessions early in the week with scrimmages against a couple top So Cal club teams in the latter part of the week. We've seen matches with the U15 YNT camp playing against excellent So Cal club teams that were 2 years older.
> 
> Maybe GDA will result in higher caliber club teams (maybe not), but I have to say that none of the matches I watched were very close. Even with a two year age gap, the younger YNT pool team was better by a few goals and even more in terms of confidence on the ball. Two of the matches we saw were with National Championship caliber club teams. To be fair, I wasn't familiar with either of the older club teams, so I don't know if they fielded their strongest players or not, but I think the point stands regardless.
> 
> IMO - our top SoCal DA teams will be very good. However, even those teams will have 2 or 3 truly elite national-caliber players (possibly less). We can argue about whether these teams have more or less than 2 or 3 elite players, but the YNT training camps are targeting the top elite players across the nation. So, you are talking about having a younger YNT pool team with 11 elite players on the field playing against an older team club team that might have a couple elite players. In the couple match-ups I have seen, it doesn't seem to result in a fair match.


I agree. I think it's the reason the older national teams play younger boys teams to get the real competition.


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## GoWest (Apr 16, 2017)

devupa2.0 said:


> In the last two years my DD and I have been able to go to Stub Hub to watch a few matches that were set up during YNT training camps. It seems the typical formula is for the coaching staff to set up training sessions early in the week with scrimmages against a couple top So Cal club teams in the latter part of the week. We've seen matches with the U15 YNT camp playing against excellent So Cal club teams that were 2 years older.
> 
> Maybe GDA will result in higher caliber club teams (maybe not), but I have to say that none of the matches I watched were very close. Even with a two year age gap, the younger YNT pool team was better by a few goals and even more in terms of confidence on the ball. Two of the matches we saw were with National Championship caliber club teams. To be fair, I wasn't familiar with either of the older club teams, so I don't know if they fielded their strongest players or not, but I think the point stands regardless.
> 
> IMO - our top SoCal DA teams will be very good. However, even those teams will have 2 or 3 truly elite national-caliber players (possibly less). We can argue about whether these teams have more or less than 2 or 3 elite players, but the YNT training camps are targeting the top elite players across the nation. So, you are talking about having a younger YNT pool team with 11 elite players on the field playing against an older team club team that might have a couple elite players. In the couple match-ups I have seen, it doesn't seem to result in a fair match.


I see your point. Your experience is insightful. I do however think that the GDA in approach may (hopefully) be a different animal so to speak. I really think theu16, u17 and u18 elite GDA teams should be used to test this and set a bench mark. I believe it would serve a couple of purposes; determine just "where" the bar is or must be raised to, and also, help US Soccer better define just "who the better players are" in each age group. Certainly, keep scrimmaging olders but really make it a point to hone in on key matchups with like age groups in the GDA.


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## GoWest (Apr 16, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Mark Carr, BJ Snow and Michelle French were all assistant coaches for Jill Ellis at UCLA.


I have always taught my kids that "recycling" is a good thing!


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## MakeAPlay (Apr 17, 2017)

GoWest said:


> I see your point. Your experience is insightful. I do however think that the GDA in approach may (hopefully) be a different animal so to speak. I really think theu16, u17 and u18 elite GDA teams should be used to test this and set a bench mark. I believe it would serve a couple of purposes; determine just "where" the bar is or must be raised to, and also, help US Soccer better define just "who the better players are" in each age group. Certainly, keep scrimmaging olders but really make it a point to hone in on key matchups with like age groups in the GDA.


There is too much of a talent gap.  Only the top college teams have talent that is equal to or greater than a youth national team and even then that talent rarely goes 24 deep.  GDA won't solve that.


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## GoWest (Apr 17, 2017)

Appreciate your thoughts. You may be right but I would still like to see a game between Slammers u18/u19 GDA and WNT u18. I think it would be a battle IMO.


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## MakeAPlay (Apr 18, 2017)

GoWest said:


> Appreciate your thoughts. You may be right but I would still like to see a game between Slammers u18/u19 GDA and WNT u18. I think it would be a battle IMO.


I think that it would be a blow out.  I don't even think that it would be a good game against the U17 WNT IMHO.  It's hard to see the weaknesses of a strong team until you see them play a stronger team.  Then the player with the hard first touch gets their pocket picked or the player that is a beat too slow gets mobbed.  It's hard to imagine it until you have seen it trust me.


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## NoGoal (Apr 18, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> I think that it would be a blow out.  I don't even think that it would be a good game against the U17 WNT IMHO.  It's hard to see the weaknesses of a strong team until you see them play a stronger team.  Then the player with the hard first touch gets their pocket picked or the player that is a beat too slow gets mobbed.  It's hard to imagine it until you have seen it trust me.


I agree, I wouldn't be a close game.


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## MWN (Apr 18, 2017)

soccer4us said:


> I agree. I think it's the reason the older national teams play younger boys teams to get the real competition.


True.  @GoWest , the US WNT isn't about testing the younger women's teams or the DA for that matter.  The US WNT wants/needs to play against opponents that are physically quicker and bigger if they want to get better.   U15 boys satisfy this for the National Team and present a good training opponent because they are not as smart as they are still learning.  By the time an elite boys team hits 16+ their speed and size so far exceeds the elite woman that smarts becomes inconsequential.

The same is true for the younger WNTs, which are made up of the best players across the nation in that age group.  Sure, some girls slip through the cracks, but not many and as others have said ... a deep u19 WNT against a girls DA with 4-6 quality players isn't going to make a good game.


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## cowboy (Apr 19, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> I think that it would be a blow out.  I don't even think that it would be a good game against the U17 WNT IMHO.  It's hard to see the weaknesses of a strong team until you see them play a stronger team.  Then the player with the hard first touch gets their pocket picked or the player that is a beat too slow gets mobbed.  It's hard to imagine it until you have seen it trust me.


What's hard to imagine is how poorly the US performance has been at the u17/20 age group; something is amiss here, just doesn't add up.


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