# U-15 Girls National Training Camp Kansas October 6-9



## GirlsRule (Oct 7, 2019)

Just wondering how come NO INFO on Girls invited to Training Camp happening now in Kansas City. I see lots of Info regarding Boys Training Camps, how come Girls have LITTLE to NONE. Let’s be Fair!


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## Kicker4Life (Oct 7, 2019)

You know the list...why are you so anxious to have it posted.  Your DD’s in it.


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## GirlsRule (Oct 7, 2019)

Kicker4Life said:


> You know the list...why are you so anxious to have it posted.  Your DD’s in it.


Does it matter? I want publicity for all these girls to be just as equal for Girls as it is Boys. Is that so wrong? These Girls should Congratulated just as Equally as the Boys. Yet look at the publicity for the Boys compared to the Girls. It shows how from the beginning Girls are being Unrecognized for the same hard work they put in as the Boys. We fight for Equality for our US Women’s Team, so let’s start from the bottom too, some of these Girls may be our Future US Women’s Team. Is that so Wrong?


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## dad4 (Oct 7, 2019)

The last time they released the list, the lack of ECNL girls made them look vindictive, getting mad at adults and taking it out on the kids.  

Congratulations to your daughter.  Hope she has some great games.


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## GirlsRule (Oct 7, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> Does it matter? I want publicity for all these girls to be just as equal for Girls as it is Boys. Is that so wrong? These Girls should Congratulated just as Equally as the Boys. Yet look at the publicity for the Boys compared to the Girls. It shows how from the beginning Girls are being Unrecognized for the same hard work they put in as the Boys. We fight for Equality for our US Women’s Team, so let’s start from the bottom too, some of these Girls may be our Future US Women’s Team. Is that so Wrong?


By the way what is, “THE LIST” You Lost me.


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## Justus (Oct 7, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> Does it matter? I want publicity for all these girls to be just as equal for Girls as it is Boys. Is that so wrong? These Girls should Congratulated just as Equally as the Boys. Yet look at the publicity for the Boys compared to the Girls. It shows how from the beginning Girls are being Unrecognized for the same hard work they put in as the Boys. We fight for Equality for our US Women’s Team, so let’s start from the bottom too, some of these Girls may be our Future US Women’s Team. Is that so Wrong?


Girls so Rule it's not even close.  Congrats to her to make The List.  100% needs to be recognized for their sacrifice & effort the girls put in


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## justneededaname (Oct 7, 2019)

It does seem like the girls ought to be getting at least a little more press than they are as compared to the boys.

When you visit their pages on the US Soccer site, the girls team has one article from 2018 that is not specific to the U15s, an article about the Men's first team and one about the men's U23s. The boy's U15 page has a picture of the team, their results from the last few months, and three articles about games in August. Maybe the girls team just hasn't been as active, but it does seem a bit lopsided.

https://www.ussoccer.com/teams/u-15-girls-national-team

https://www.ussoccer.com/teams/u-15-boys-national-team


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## LASTMAN14 (Oct 7, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> By the way what is, “THE LIST” You Lost me.


US Soccer puts together a formal list of all the players invited. Typically that info is given to each club who has a player represented. It is then shared with families.


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## outside! (Oct 7, 2019)

justneededaname said:


> It does seem like the girls ought to be getting at least a little more press than they are as compared to the boys.
> 
> When you visit their pages on the US Soccer site, the girls team has one article from 2018 that is not specific to the U15s, an article about the Men's first team and one about the men's U23s. The boy's U15 page has a picture of the team, their results from the last few months, and three articles about games in August. Maybe the girls team just hasn't been as active, but it does seem a bit lopsided.
> 
> ...


Wait, girls matter?


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## sdb (Oct 7, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> Does it matter? I want publicity for all these girls to be just as equal for Girls as it is Boys. Is that so wrong? These Girls should Congratulated just as Equally as the Boys. Yet look at the publicity for the Boys compared to the Girls. It shows how from the beginning Girls are being Unrecognized for the same hard work they put in as the Boys. We fight for Equality for our US Women’s Team, so let’s start from the bottom too, some of these Girls may be our Future US Women’s Team. Is that so Wrong?


Post the list of attendees and then we can all give the girls props and then someone from Top Drawer Soccer will get ahold of it and write an article...


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## ladoctorr (Oct 7, 2019)

sdb said:


> Post the list of attendees and then we can all give the girls props and then someone from Top Drawer Soccer will get ahold of it and write an article...


Or better yet someone can make there first post on there recently created identity on how there coach, club/DOC, and league kept there DD from making the team.


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## Kicker4Life (Oct 7, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> By the way what is, “THE LIST” You Lost me.


Same one you asked me about when you first posted as GirlsRule on the other ‘05 thread.


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## Soccerfan2 (Oct 8, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> Does it matter? I want publicity for all these girls to be just as equal for Girls as it is Boys. Is that so wrong? These Girls should Congratulated just as Equally as the Boys. Yet look at the publicity for the Boys compared to the Girls. It shows how from the beginning Girls are being Unrecognized for the same hard work they put in as the Boys. We fight for Equality for our US Women’s Team, so let’s start from the bottom too, some of these Girls may be our Future US Women’s Team. Is that so Wrong?


So you posted asking about a roster, and clubs represented, that you already had? Smh


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## Silverlining (Oct 9, 2019)

Roster, anywhere?


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## dk_b (Oct 9, 2019)

My guess is that someone from US Soccer who had been charged with the YNT social media and other press reports has left.  The pages for the various YNT levels have fallen off and the roster for the recent U18 camp was not publicly released until after the camp started (in the past, it would appear on US Soccer's site a day or two before camp and then Top Drawer and Soccer America the same or the next day).  I think the diminished coverage is not unique to the girls' side (and most of the coverage on, say, Twitter happens only during an international trip while they cover the games (during one friendly trip in the past, they covered not just the games but also the side trips, visit with locals, etc.)


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## Justus (Oct 9, 2019)

Silverlining said:


> Roster, anywhere?


I'm so confused.  What roster are you looking for?  Is this for The List or TC National ID camp list?  Why so many asking?  Back in 2017 around this time, we all sat around the TV like Selection Sunday during March Madness waiting for our baby GOATs name to be called for U14 YNT.  I was told my goat was a lock, not bubble player either.  Probably 5th seed.  Anyway, her name was never called.  Such a bummer for a 13 year old.  I asked for some feed back on ways to improve for her and was told "I don't know who actually did the selecting" from just about every DOC in Socal, minus Beach and Real SC.  I'm still asking but the folks at USSF, her old Doc and Coach back then seem to be gone from the DA.  I hope it's shared with all to see because all these girls have worked hard and deserve recognition big time .


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## Justus (Oct 9, 2019)

LASTMAN14 said:


> US Soccer puts together a formal list of all the players invited. Typically that info is given to each club who has a player represented. It is then shared with families.


Can you dive in a little more on how US Soccer goes through the actual selection process on the player they select and why?


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## oh canada (Oct 9, 2019)

GirlsRule said:


> Just wondering how come NO INFO on Girls invited to Training Camp happening now in Kansas City. I see lots of Info regarding Boys Training Camps, how come Girls have LITTLE to NONE. Let’s be Fair!


Because youth players (boys or girls) invited to a national team pool is just not that significant.  In your household, I'm sure it's more important than Jill Ellis retiring and the women's program still not having a coach.  And you/your player should be proud of her achievement.  But, people don't really care too much about the players invited to these camps.  Especially after US Soccer began politicizing the choices.  The final rosters that travel to games - a little more interest and there will be a press release written for that.  But these camps...meh.  

This entire "equal with everything" argument is a bunch of nonsense.  It's not realistic and not how the real world works.  For a variety of reasons, Americans prefer to watch men play sports much much more than women...unless you are talking about figure skating or gymnastics.   Eyeballs = interest = $ = attention = media coverage.  And yes, I have a daughter who understands that she will need to work harder than men and will be judged by different standards than men.  But, she's up for the challenge and knows she can succeed despite the unfair disparities.


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## dad4 (Oct 9, 2019)

Silverlining said:


> Roster, anywhere?


Best not to post it.  There may be a kid on the list whose family has a privacy concern.


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## surfertwins (Oct 9, 2019)

12 young lady's from SoCal

Real So Cal = 3 one is a goalie
Beach = 2 one is a goalie
LA Galaxy = 1
Blues = 2 one is a goalie
LAFC = 1 just moved from Beach
LA Surf = 1
Surf = 2


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## Dubs (Oct 9, 2019)

Justus said:


> Can you dive in a little more on how US Soccer goes through the actual selection process on the player they select and why?


US Soccer has posted on how they have scouts that identify players, but if you really want the real scoop, you're not going to get it.  Being on a YNT is not where it's at.  It's a nice feather in the cap and good marketing for college recruitment but no real indication of what is to come.  Getting recruited and playing on good college program/team is where you can be identified/scouted to be on the U20s, U23s and Senior team.    That is real meat and potatoes.


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## Lightning Red (Oct 9, 2019)

http://bit.ly/2Oz4zSJ


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## Justus (Oct 9, 2019)

Awesome!!! Congrats on what all these young athletes have accomplished.  I like 59 too.  More is better at this young age


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## Justus (Oct 9, 2019)

surfertwins said:


> 12 young lady's from SoCal
> 
> Real So Cal = 3 one is a goalie
> Beach = 2 one is a goalie
> ...


It's cool ECNL got one pick in SoCal.  That's a good improvement from last time right?


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## dad4 (Oct 9, 2019)

Justus said:


> It's cool ECNL got one pick in SoCal.  That's a good improvement from last time right?


Still mostly looks like the DA all star team.   Not bad, but not quite a national team, either.

I wonder how long until DA and ECNL each write their own version of the offside rule......


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## Justus (Oct 9, 2019)

dad4 said:


> Still mostly looks like the DA all star team.   Not bad, but not quite a national team, either.
> 
> I wonder how long until DA and ECNL each write their own version of the offside rule......


One ECNL player for 05 in SoCal is better than zero.  So let's keep it positive dad of 4?  Holy moly bro, congrats   After my dd, it was no more


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## Imtired (Oct 9, 2019)

Dubs said:


> Being on a YNT is not where it's at.  It's a nice feather in the cap and good marketing for college recruitment but no real indication of what is to come.


And possibly why the USWNT U17's haven't won a World Cup in the past 10 years, many years not even qualifying.  With all the talent in the US, why are our younger teams doing so poorly when our senior teams do so well?


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## sdb (Oct 9, 2019)

I'm happy for the SoCal girls that got the invite.


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## Soccerfan2 (Oct 9, 2019)

dk_b said:


> My guess is that someone from US Soccer who had been charged with the YNT social media and other press reports has left.  The pages for the various YNT levels have fallen off and the roster for the recent U18 camp was not publicly released until after the camp started (in the past, it would appear on US Soccer's site a day or two before camp and then Top Drawer and Soccer America the same or the next day).  I think the diminished coverage is not unique to the girls' side (and most of the coverage on, say, Twitter happens only during an international trip while they cover the games (during one friendly trip in the past, they covered not just the games but also the side trips, visit with locals, etc.)


I don’t think so. The u16 boys just had a camp and they wrote that one up. Don’t know why they didn’t for U15 girls or maybe it’s just late.


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## Soccerfan2 (Oct 9, 2019)

Actually, it’s there now. Written up 10/6, published today. Maybe they wait until it’s over on purpose. 

https://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2019/10/fifty-nine-players-invited-to-u15-girls-ynt-talent-id-camp-in-kansas-city


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## dk_b (Oct 9, 2019)

Soccerfan2 said:


> I don’t think so. The u16 boys just had a camp and they wrote that one up. Don’t know why they didn’t for U15 girls or maybe it’s just late.


The U18 WNT just had a camp and they wrote that up - late.  My point is not that a camp does or does not get missed but that all of it has slacked in the last year or so, on both the boys' and girls' side.  It was much more robust before and I'm guessing that someone left (they have even taken down a lot of the articles, game summaries (not just scores), etc.).  And, much like the U18 WNT, US Soccer posted about the U15 GNT, just late:  https://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2019/10/fifty-nine-players-invited-to-u15-girls-ynt-talent-id-camp-in-kansas-city.

If you go by just the recent activity, it may be that there appears to be some discrimination but it is really hard to assess whether the girls are getting short shrift w/o being able to see it over the last several years (and b/c of changes in the readily viewable content, it is tough to do that).  Since I've been closely watching (3 or 4 years), my recollection is that coverage has been pretty even.

And whether or not I have a kid in the age group, I am glad they post these rosters - I am always interested to see the geographic spread, the GDA/ECNL/other split, the repeat attendees, new faces, etc.  And when my own kid has been selected, I do like that she gets the notoriety for her hard work (I will admit to that narrow interest)


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## Soccerfan2 (Oct 9, 2019)

I agree, I don’t see that they bias coverage towards the boys.


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## kickingandscreaming (Oct 10, 2019)

Dubs said:


> US Soccer has posted on how they have scouts that identify players, but if you really want the real scoop, you're not going to get it.  Being on a YNT is not where it's at.  It's a nice feather in the cap and good marketing for college recruitment but no real indication of what is to come.  Getting recruited and playing on good college program/team is where you can be identified/scouted to be on the U20s, U23s and Senior team.    That is real meat and potatoes.


Agree. Based on the limited stats I've seen of the girls rostered on the younger YNT's and that actually make "The" National Team, the YNT is not a great predictor. I assume this larger group at the younger age is US Soccer's effort to make sure they don't narrow their scope too early. It makes a lot of sense as these girls are 14 and 13. It is worth noting that US Soccer made sure the girls knew this was an "ID" camp and they asked that they not post anything on social media that has the National Team crest as they "haven't earned" that.


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## kickingandscreaming (Oct 10, 2019)

Imtired said:


> And possibly why the USWNT U17's haven't won a World Cup in the past 10 years, many years not even qualifying.  With all the talent in the US, why are our younger teams doing so poorly when our senior teams do so well?


I wonder how much of the USWNT's success had to do with other countries not putting any significant resources towards their women's program? That has changed in recent years. From my admittedly limited perspective, it appears to me that the training for the US men and US women don't differ that much in the youth programs. The US women's greater success has been due to having a higher percentage of the top female athletes in soccer than the men and other countries not putting resources into their women's program.


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## Soccerfan2 (Oct 10, 2019)

kickingandscreaming said:


> Agree. Based on the limited stats I've seen of the girls rostered on the younger YNT's and that actually make "The" National Team, the YNT is not a great predictor. I assume this larger group at the younger age is US Soccer's effort to make sure they don't narrow their scope too early. It makes a lot of sense as these girls are 14 and 13. It is worth noting that US Soccer made sure the girls knew this was an "ID" camp and they asked that they not post anything on social media that has the National Team crest as they "haven't earned" that.


Looking at the WNT roster, most (not all) of those players were in the youth pool at some point. Looking from the bottom up, of course most YNT players don’t make the full WNT but that is because the funnel narrows. 
US Soccer has explicitly said they are trying to broaden their scope. They increased the initial U14 boys pool to 120 last year (and will do the same for the U14 girls this year), and increased the initial U15 and U16 pools for both genders to 60 (vs the previous 48). 
As for your last statement about not having earned the crest, that sounds like interpretation on your part. The girls were simply asked to comply with the standard US Soccer YNT social media guidelines. They earned it the same as any pool player ever does.


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## kickingandscreaming (Oct 10, 2019)

Soccerfan2 said:


> Looking at the WNT roster, most (not all) of those players were in the youth pool at some point. Looking from the bottom up, of course most YNT players don’t make the full WNT but that is because the funnel narrows.
> US Soccer has explicitly said they are trying to broaden their scope. They increased the initial U14 boys pool to 120 last year (and will do the same for the U14 girls this year), and increased the initial U15 and U16 pools for both genders to 60 (vs the previous 48).
> As for your last statement about not having earned the crest, that sounds like interpretation on your part. The girls were simply asked to comply with the standard US Soccer YNT social media guidelines. They earned it the same as any pool player ever does.


Yes, it's good to hear they are making an effort to broaden the scope. The one statistic I was referring to was a YNT group at the youngest age - U14 I believe. As for my last statement, I didn't interpret it, but it is "second-hand". Take it for what it's worth. I don't believe it is a big deal if it was stated.


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## Justherefortheride (Oct 10, 2019)

It was not stated anywhere that they could not post on social media.  They were given the same social media guidelines that all National Team players are given, to represent the federation in a honorable way.  As the story states these players are in the U15 player pool and they have earned it.  Yes, my kid was there and she earned it like the other 59 players (there were 60 not 59).


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## Justus (Oct 10, 2019)

Justherefortheride said:


> It was not stated anywhere that they could not post on social media.  They were given the same social media guidelines that all National Team players are given, to represent the federation in a honorable way.  As the story states these players are in the U15 player pool and they have earned it.  Yes, my kid was there and she earned it like the other 59 players (there were 60 not 59).


It's an awesome accomplishment and well deserved.  59, 24, 48, 60, 120, who cares   You should be proud and stoked all in one   From this group of 60 will they put a GOAT team of 22 to play Netherlands 05 next year?  This age is very important for U17 World Cup.  That's why when 04 age was picked the first time they had 12 05's out of 48.  This group has zero 06s out of 60.  Even age kids, 02, 04 and 06 are for U18 and U20. The time to peak for 04 I guess is SR year in HS?


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## outside! (Oct 10, 2019)

Imtired said:


> And possibly why the USWNT U17's haven't won a World Cup in the past 10 years, many years not even qualifying.  With all the talent in the US, why are our younger teams doing so poorly when our senior teams do so well?


I have watched a few YNT games over the years. In my opinion the teams do not play together as a team very well. There seems to be to many dribblers, not enough accurate passers. The teams also do not do a good job of varying their point of attack but instead seem to run everything through the same few players in the games I have watched.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 10, 2019)

Interesting... I know 3 girls, personally, on that list of invitees.  One is very good... not great, #2 isn't even the best player on her team and the 3rd is listed as playing for an ECNL team when she's DA.  WTF?


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## kickingandscreaming (Oct 10, 2019)

Justherefortheride said:


> It was not stated anywhere that they could not post on social media.  They were given the same social media guidelines that all National Team players are given, to represent the federation in a honorable way.  As the story states these players are in the U15 player pool and they have earned it.  Yes, my kid was there and she earned it like the other 59 players (there were 60 not 59).


Evidently this is what happens when a language challenged mathematics major attempts to communicate.

"It is worth noting that US Soccer made sure the girls knew this was an "ID" camp and they asked that they not post anything on social media that has the National Team crest as they "haven't earned" that."

What I was attempting to communicate was not that "they couldn't post on social media", but that they shouldn't post with the National Team crest - that they hadn't "earned" the right to post AND INCLUDE the National Team crest. Obviously, they all earned the right to be there as well as post within the guidelines as stated.

My apologies for the lack of clarity. I'll go back to just reading comments and stick to confusing myself .


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## Justus (Oct 10, 2019)

outside! said:


> I have watched a few YNT games over the years. In my opinion the teams do not play together as a team very well. There seems to be to many dribblers, not enough accurate passers. The teams also do not do a good job of varying their point of attack but instead seem to run everything through the same few players in the games I have watched.


I'm told DA not trying to build a TEAM and don't give a hoot about U17.  It's sad too, to look at all the top GOATs playing at major D1 schools and and read all of their bio's. All pretty much All State in HS soccer, Team captain and some played HS Hoops too.  The 2022 and younger college players will no longer have HS Sports mentioned in Bios.  It will be "Two-time Training Center participate, "DA Super XI", "YNT Training Center ID Camp Participant" and so one.


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## Kicker4Life (Oct 10, 2019)

The Outlaw said:


> Interesting... I know 3 girls, personally, on that list of invitees.  One is very good... not great, #2 isn't even the best player on her team and the 3rd is listed as playing for an ECNL team when she's DA.  WTF?


No the “alleged” OP’s DD left DA and went to ECNL days before the season started.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 10, 2019)

Kicker4Life said:


> No the OP’s DD left DA and went to ECNL days before the season started.


Wow... I see you were paying attention in ESP class.  Well played.  My bad on the roster change but, having done some homework, see you're correct.  I'll stop now because I haven't got anything positive say about that situation.


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## Dubs (Oct 10, 2019)

Imtired said:


> And possibly why the USWNT U17's haven't won a World Cup in the past 10 years, many years not even qualifying.  With all the talent in the US, why are our younger teams doing so poorly when our senior teams do so well?


100% correct.  It takes time for players and teams to truly develop and it's obvious the federation is not interested in winning anything at the U17 level.  I agree with all the talent we should do better, but these teams most times don't have the right mix of players (maybe due to the wrong kids getting invited) needed to win.  Also at the U17 level all these kids are coming from the club environment with different philosophies/skills so it's going to be difficult to put that all together in a short amount of time.  This has been discussed at length, but that's the biggest reason we have issues at the youth level in addition to the pissing match between USSDA and ECNL.  There just isn't a way to have a group of players from all over the country to get together frequently enough to build out chemistry and a uniform style of play.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 10, 2019)

Hey, surfertwins, if you don't like me posting what I know, too fucking bad.


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## End of the Line (Oct 10, 2019)

Imtired said:


> And possibly why the USWNT U17's haven't won a World Cup in the past 10 years, many years not even qualifying.  With all the talent in the US, why are our younger teams doing so poorly when our senior teams do so well?


Easy answer, but it requires understanding what wins games at the full national team level.  It requires the best, most powerful athletes who also happen to have sufficient technical ability and vision.  Players who have the best technical ability and vision, but are lesser athletes, are always a losing recipe at the highest level on the women's side.  For example, compare Jessie Fleming to Julie Ertz.  Fleming has incredible technical ability and vision, but she is nothing compared to a beast athlete like Ertz, despite all of Ertz's technical flaws and lack of finesse.  Ertz is much bigger, stronger and faster than Fleming, and no amount of practice will ever bridge that gap. It's why Rose Lavelle is great against most teams but was a non-factor against France, the only other team that can remotely compete from top to bottom athletically to the U.S.

When US Soccer selects youth players, it knows what it's doing.  It almost always selects the best, most powerful athletes because it's looking for 1-2 per age group whom it will ultimately need for the full NT that also have sufficient soccer ability.  Sure, it sprinkles in some technical players who aren't quite as athletic both because there are only so many uber athletes in an age group and also because they help teach the horses it actually cares about. But it does not select players based on which combination is likely to win youth tournaments, because winning youth tournaments does not matter.  It does not select the best 11 circus jugglers who lack elite-level athleticism because those kids are a waste of time at the highest level, even if they may be the most likely to help win U17 games.  It is perfectly fine that any opponent has the 3rd-11th best players in the game so long as the U.S. has 1 and 2.  And as long as it has the 11 best athletes on the field in an age group, it almost always will have the 2 best overall players, because superior athleticism is relatively more important than superior ball skill. 

Also, countries with players who train together all the time have a huge advantage over the US at the youth level. Many other countries are able to have their kids train together far more often because it is almost always easier geographically, and also because their systems tend to be more centralized.  Of course, the centralized structure is also often a result of geography. In the Netherlands, for example, every single kid can be at a central location in about 2 hours.  In China (back when they cared about women's soccer), they can just make every child in the country move to one place.  But it's stupid to try to convince a critical mass of elite U.S. girls to all move to one part of the country and attend the same soccer school.  And because it takes 8 hours and a lot of money to get a kid in CA to the U18 national camp in FL, you just can't hold camps very often.  In short, when you put 11 technically great foreign youth players who train together all the time up against 11 beast athletes who get together briefly every once in a while but have no idea how to play well together, the former are going to win more often than not.  But the latter ends up having the two kids on the pitch, and that's important because those are the only ones who matter, and there will be plenty of time to incorporate them into the full NT once US Soccer figures out who they are.

And, in every country but the U.S., it's usually a really stupid idea for a girl over 18 to waste time playing soccer, so very few do it.  But it's a great idea for thousands in the U.S. because it's often a condition of their scholarship. Which means the U.S. has a massive pool of adult players to choose from, while many countries realistically only have 30-40 in an entire country.


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## Imtired (Oct 10, 2019)

outside! said:


> I have watched a few YNT games over the years. In my opinion the teams do not play together as a team very well. There seems to be to many dribblers, not enough accurate passers. The teams also do not do a good job of varying their point of attack but instead seem to run everything through the same few players in the games I have watched.


Your observation is spot on.   I read an article in (soccerwire?) after the U17's didn't get out of group stage this last World Cup.  He observed what you did, which is that US Soccer keeps looking for the same type of player: players who dribble and are good in 1v1 situations.   You need players like that, for sure, but you also need players who know how to move into space and make great passes.   Instead, US Soccer keeps getting the same type of player time and time again.   Korea made the US look like rec players this last world cup, they had both technical as well as an amazing ability to move and pass the ball.


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## Sunil Illuminati (Oct 10, 2019)

End of the Line said:


> Easy answer, but it requires understanding what wins games at the full national team level.  It requires the best, most powerful athletes who also happen to have sufficient technical ability and vision.  Players who have the best technical ability and vision, but are lesser athletes, are always a losing recipe at the highest level on the women's side.  For example, compare Jessie Fleming to Julie Ertz.  Fleming has incredible technical ability and vision, but she is nothing compared to a beast athlete like Ertz, despite all of Ertz's technical flaws and lack of finesse.  Ertz is much bigger, stronger and faster than Fleming, and no amount of practice will ever bridge that gap. It's why Rose Lavelle is great against most teams but was a non-factor against France, the only other team that can remotely compete from top to bottom athletically to the U.S.
> 
> When US Soccer selects youth players, it knows what it's doing.  It almost always selects the best, most powerful athletes because it's looking for 1-2 per age group whom it will ultimately need for the full NT that also have sufficient soccer ability.  Sure, it sprinkles in some technical players who aren't quite as athletic both because there are only so many uber athletes in an age group and also because they help teach the horses it actually cares about. But it does not select players based on which combination is likely to win youth tournaments, because winning youth tournaments does not matter.  It does not select the best 11 circus jugglers who lack elite-level athleticism because those kids are a waste of time at the highest level, even if they may be the most likely to help win U17 games.  It is perfectly fine that any opponent has the 3rd-11th best players in the game so long as the U.S. has 1 and 2.  And as long as it has the 11 best athletes on the field in an age group, it almost always will have the 2 best overall players, because superior athleticism is relatively more important than superior ball skill.
> 
> ...


I'm going to bite and say most of what you've written is nonsense. The gap is closing because the US has focused almost exclusively on the athletic nature of its athletes.

"Players who have the best technical ability and vision, but are lesser athletes, are always a losing recipe at the highest level on the women's side"

What hope have we got moving forward if we really believe this?


----------



## Imtired (Oct 10, 2019)

End of the Line said:


> When US Soccer selects youth players, it knows what it's doing.  It almost always selects the best, most powerful athletes because it's looking for 1-2 per age group whom it will ultimately need for the full NT that also have sufficient soccer ability.


I have to disagree that US Soccer knows that it's doing when it selects youth players.   There are _thousands_ of girls playing soccer out there and there is no way those representing the YNT are the "best, most powerful athletes" of all players in the US (Haley Mace is a case in point, completely overlooked by US Soccer until she played for UCLA).  They may be the "best, most powerful athletes" of a very very small sampling (i.e. mostly DA clubs), but they are _not _the best, most powerful athletes in the country.   To get stronger YNT teams they need to cast a wider net.  Of course, that takes an investment in time and money, as well as a deflation of egos (DA vs ECNL), so we know that won't happen.



End of the Line said:


> Also, countries with players who train together all the time have a huge advantage over the US at the youth level. Many other countries are able to have their kids train together far more often because it is almost always easier geographically, and also because their systems tend to be more centralized.


Not true in Germany.  In fact, a YNT Scout from Germany did a recent interview where he remarked how surprised he was about how many girls played soccer in the US versus how many play in Germany.  Yet Germany YNT steamrolled US YNT.   The US dominates at the older ages because they pull a lot of players from college.



End of the Line said:


> And, in every country but the U.S., it's usually a really stupid idea for a girl over 18 to waste time playing soccer, so very few do it.  But it's a great idea for thousands in the U.S. because it's often a condition of their scholarship. Which means the U.S. has a massive pool of adult players to choose from, while many countries realistically only have 30-40 in an entire country.


Yes, 100% agree with the above.


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## Canyon90 (Oct 10, 2019)

Lightning Red said:


> http://bit.ly/2Oz4zSJ


Interesting there are no selections from Slammers, Legends or Arsenal for CA-S.

Doesn't seem that long ago those clubs were just about a certain at this age group.

...Congrats to all the talent selected for this camp!


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## ladoctorr (Oct 10, 2019)

Canyon90 said:


> Interesting there are no selections from Slammers, Legends or Arsenal for CA-S.
> 
> Doesn't seem that long ago those clubs were just about a certain at this age group.
> 
> ...Congrats to all the talent selected for this camp!


LAFC is the Slammers, and there was one selection.


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## ladoctorr (Oct 10, 2019)

Dubs said:


> 100% correct.  It takes time for players and teams to truly develop and it's obvious the federation is not interested in winning anything at the U17 level.  I agree with all the talent we should do better, but these teams most times don't have the right mix of players (maybe due to the wrong kids getting invited) needed to win.  Also at the U17 level all these kids are coming from the club environment with different philosophies/skills so it's going to be difficult to put that all together in a short amount of time.  This has been discussed at length, but that's the biggest reason we have issues at the youth level in addition to the pissing match between USSDA and ECNL.  There just isn't a way to have a group of players from all over the country to get together frequently enough to build out chemistry and a uniform style of play.


I saw two of the YNT camps in southern California this past go around. Your statement on kids coming from different environments is valid. One camp had talented  girls from different philosophies and the soccer was more an individual game, a bit more chaotic. The other camp had several girls from a  few clubs that like to knock the ball around  and the play collectively was much better.

Can just imagine the struggle when brought in from all over our large country.


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## Youdon'tknowjack (Oct 10, 2019)

Kicker4Life said:


> No the “alleged” OP’s DD left DA and went to ECNL days before the season started.


Hey I'm the Dad of the girl that left DA and went to ECNL. We aren't the "OP" and no idea who GirlsRule is. Appreciate if you leave our "DD" out of your comments. Good luck to everyone's kids. 

Youdon'tknowJack


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## surfertwins (Oct 10, 2019)

Youdon'tknowjack said:


> Hey I'm the Dad of the girl that left DA and went to ECNL. We aren't the "OP" and no idea who GirlsRule is. Appreciate if you leave our "DD" out of your comments. Good luck to everyone's kids.
> 
> Youdon'tknowJack


My daughter said your girl played great!


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## GirlsRule (Oct 10, 2019)

Youdon'tknowjack said:


> Hey I'm the Dad of the girl that left DA and went to ECNL. We aren't the "OP" and no idea who GirlsRule is. Appreciate if you leave our "DD" out of your comments. Good luck to everyone's kids.
> 
> Youdon'tknowJack


I have no idea why your bringing me into this. I said nothing about anyone’s daughter.


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## Soccer43 (Oct 11, 2019)

Canyon90 said:


> Interesting there are no selections from Slammers, Legends or Arsenal for CA-S.
> 
> Doesn't seem that long ago those clubs were just about a certain at this age group.
> 
> ...Congrats to all the talent selected for this camp!


Slammers left DA and went back to ECNL, Arsenal also is ECNL. .... that pretty much seems like automatic disqualification from the YNT pool.  It’s a shame but as other posters have said, it doesn’t matter much until players start in college and prove themselves in that venue


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## Justus (Oct 11, 2019)

Youdon'tknowjack said:


> Hey I'm the Dad of the girl that left DA and went to ECNL. We aren't the "OP" and no idea who GirlsRule is. Appreciate if you leave our "DD" out of your comments. Good luck to everyone's kids.
> 
> Youdon'tknowJack


Jack, Welcome to the Socal Soccer Forum @Youdon'tknowjack   Kicker is usually spot on with anything DA, but it looks like he may have missed one unless of course your lying dude and just trolling and GirlsRule is really you or you are both or someone like @MARsSPEED is getting back at all the GOATs in SoCal????  Maybe Mars has his crazy dad, @PaPaJupiter and whacko bros @Pluto and @Lizard getting memes too?  Some folks think me and @Luis Andres share a room together.  So I don't know what to believe anymore.  Can you share why leave DA South Bay Beach for LAFC ECNL?  No one does that so it's frankly hard to believe one would leave South Bay Beach.  Plus, word on the street is your baby goat is baller.  Congrats on making the Top 59 or 60 DA ID Camp this year.  You can PM me and share if you want privacy or just tell me it's none of my bees wax and I wont ask again.  Good luck to all kiddos playing soccer this year


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## Justus (Oct 11, 2019)

Youdon'tknowjack said:


> Hey I'm the Dad of the girl that left DA and went to ECNL. We aren't the "OP" and no idea who GirlsRule is. Appreciate if you leave our "DD" out of your comments. Good luck to everyone's kids.
> 
> Youdon'tknowJack


Jack, Welcome to the Socal Soccer Forum @Youdon'tknowjack   Kicker is usually spot on with anything DA, but it looks like he may have missed one unless of course your lying dude and just trolling and GirlsRule is really you or you are both or someone like @MARsSPEED is getting back at all the GOATs in SoCal????  Maybe Mars has his crazy dad, @PaPaJupiter and whacko bros @Pluto and @Lizard getting avatars too?  Some folks think me and @Luis Andres share a room together.  So I don't know what to believe anymore.  Can you share why leave DA South Bay Beach for LAFC ECNL?  No one does that so it's frankly hard to believe one would leave South Bay Beach DA.  Plus, word on the street is your baby goat is baller.  Congrats on making the Top 59 or 60 DA ID Camp this year.  You can PM me and share if you want privacy or just tell me it's none of my bees wax and I wont ask again.  Good luck to all kiddos playing soccer this year


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## GirlsRule (Oct 11, 2019)

My Daughter was not in Kansas. My daughters are 2008 and 2009. The only reason I was asking about the Training Center and Camps is because we are still on the fence about DA. I am  located where I can go North or South with it looks like great DATeams and ECNL teams. Many times we are at Great Park or Norco and the traffic is bad so I wanted to go watch some of these girls play. I have time before I have to make any decisions. I hear so many positives and negatives about clubs. So just being able to go and watch different clubs and players and see for myself it would be beneficial. Then I can see how the parents are on the sidelines, watch how the teams play and how teammates and Coaches act win or lose would be valuable. Obviously if the teams that make Players who can play at the National Level, I want to go and watch. This is why I asked. The lack of information I found for Girls really bothered me compared to the Boys. So I asked the question to the forum. It literally was as simple as that.


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## End of the Line (Oct 11, 2019)

Sunil Illuminati said:


> I'm going to bite and say most of what you've written is nonsense. The gap is closing because the US has focused almost exclusively on the athletic nature of its athletes.
> 
> "Players who have the best technical ability and vision, but are lesser athletes, are always a losing recipe at the highest level on the women's side"
> 
> What hope have we got moving forward if we really believe this?


I love the "gap is closing" argument.  You do know the USWNT right now is the most dominant it has ever been relative to the rest of the world?  You know it's lost one game (a friendly) in more than two years?  You know it's won two consecutive World Cups, the only time the U.S. has ever done so?


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## Sunil Illuminati (Oct 11, 2019)

End of the Line said:


> I love the "gap is closing" argument.  You do know the USWNT right now is the most dominant it has ever been relative to the rest of the world?  You know it's lost one game (a friendly) in more than two years?  You know it's won two consecutive World Cups, the only time the U.S. has ever done so?


Like anyone else fixated on athleticism. I wouldn't expect you to see it.


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## Justus (Oct 11, 2019)

End of the Line said:


> I love the "gap is closing" argument.  You do know the USWNT right now is the most dominant it has ever been relative to the rest of the world?  You know it's lost one game (a friendly) in more than two years?  You know it's won two consecutive World Cups, the only time the U.S. has ever done so?


I'll take a bite on this too   My dd was recruited for one year by RR as 10 year old.  Some make fun but Blues did it all in the open.  All clubs not named ECNL were pissed back then.  TB would step in and finalizes his new cycle.  TB has only coached *5 teams* in 35 years and the current one is #6.  Amazing if you ask me.  Both coaches never once sold "TC" or "YNT" to my 11 year old.  They sold one thing:  To be the best soccer player possible and human being.  When you reach majority around 14-15 and you haven't been cut yet, then we talk about the future for Big Time D1 College.  They also recruit a certain type of female athlete which is their choice.  So much hate for a club and one man who does it all out in the open.  The Gap is not closing at all, the door is shut!  The new Philosophy is in full swing.  From former Netherlands Director: 
U.S. Soccer Director of Talent Identification – Girls’ Mirelle van Rijbroek is leading the training camp, assisted by U-17 WNT head coach *Tracey Kevins (English)* and the three Girls’ Talent Identification Managers: Katie Cole (Central Region), Diane Drake (East) and *Marieke Laurens (West).*

The training camp aims to introduce the players to *YNT principles* as well as *expand the pool *of 2005-birth year players before the U-15 Girls’ National Team undertakes international competition next year and moves up to the *U-17 age group in 2021.*

*Twenty-three states *are represented on the roster with the *most players, 19, coming from California*.

*YNT Principles? *Can someone with knowledge on this please explain what she means here.  I'm afraid all these woman have no clue on the SoCal Social life or life in Ohio or Michigan for that matter.  "No HS Soccer or else they say!!!" It's amazing we have no American woman helping our girls navigate through all this shit and confusion on the West Coast and from what I hear in other states.  08 and 09 dads don't know what to do either.  Can we add some red white and blue to our YNT team coaches please and also keep coaches who run Big Clubs now out of the YNT coaching gig too, just my two cents on that.      
*
Expand Pool- *Very, very good idea.  I would add 60 more and open it up to the other states 
*
23 States only-*  I guess were almost at 50% of the states represented.  It's hard to cover all the states so let's see how things improve for all the other states before we judge
*
19 Cali-* I want to be proud here but I feel other states are being left out so I don't like that.  I like sharing with others and a battle of the fittest too. 
*
12 SoCal-* 20% shows how dominant we truly are.  This is the Mecca of all things Youth Soccer.   

*U17 YNT- *I will 100% be rooting for the USA to win this for sure.  I will be the first to come on here and say I was wrong and I will eat my words if we win it all.  I promise I only I want the Americans to win all the time, regardless who makes the team.  I will never, ever root for another country, ever.  I will not watch if our girls are not playing to win.  Good luck ladies and always know Justus will be rooting this team on


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## End of the Line (Oct 11, 2019)

Imtired said:


> I have to disagree that US Soccer knows that it's doing when it selects youth players.   There are _thousands_ of girls playing soccer out there and there is no way those representing the YNT are the "best, most powerful athletes" of all players in the US (Haley Mace is a case in point, completely overlooked by US Soccer until she played for UCLA).  They may be the "best, most powerful athletes" of a very very small sampling (i.e. mostly DA clubs), but they are _not _the best, most powerful athletes in the country.   To get stronger YNT teams they need to cast a wider net.  Of course, that takes an investment in time and money, as well as a deflation of egos (DA vs ECNL), so we know that won't happen.


You are wrong that US Soccer hasn't handled its youth system properly in the past.  The reason I know you are wrong is that we have 8 years of results - 12 when you realize that the US loss to Japan in the finals back in the old days was a fluke.  Sure, they didn't find Hailie Mace, but: (1) no one is perfect; (2) Hailie Mace still hasn't done s**t, which makes her a terrible example in support of your position; (3) I don't know the real reason Mace wasn't a youth regular, so we're just speculating. 

Where you are right, however, is that USSF is certainly screwing up the WNT now and going forward because it is now favoring GDA players over other more qualified players, among the many other GDA problems that will cause the inevitable decline in the WNT.  In my earlier post, I was only answering the question about why the WNT is currently so great but youth teams are not.  USSF is still favoring better athletes over better technical players, and that's the right thing to do, but now it is doing so from a more limited pool, and that's the wrong thing to do.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 11, 2019)

Aren't these players still being 'recommended' by coaches?  Of the 3 players I mentioned earlier, only the DA (to ECNL) player would have ever been scouted and, frankly, stands out because of her size, speed and athleticism... not her technical ability.  The other 2 don't even separate themselves on their own teams... let alone region.  So until you remove club politics and forceful parents pushing their kid to be sent to id2, etc, how would it truly ever be the 'best players' open to everyone?


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## Justus (Oct 11, 2019)

The Outlaw said:


> Aren't these players still being 'recommended' by coaches?  Of the 3 players I mentioned earlier, only the DA (to ECNL) player would have ever been scouted and, frankly, stands out because of her size, speed and athleticism... not her technical ability.  The other 2 don't even separate themselves on their own teams... let alone region.  So until you remove club politics and forceful parents pushing their kid to be sent to id2, etc, how would it truly ever be the 'best players' open to everyone?


Back two years ago I believe Doc held the keys to the Kingdom


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 11, 2019)

Justus said:


> Back two years ago I believe Doc held the keys to the Kingdom


I don't want to share anymore about my example because these girls deserve to be protected and they're (well, 2 of the 3) are good kids that work their fannies off.   But if you've seen the list and watched an age group for awhile, I would imagine most of us know at least a handful of the kids on the invitation roster.  Do YOU see those kids as being the standouts of the group?  Or are they gifted by notable clubs or parents that demand attention because they pay DA or ECNL fees?


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## Justus (Oct 11, 2019)

Justherefortheride said:


> It was not stated anywhere that they could not post on social media.  They were given the same social media guidelines that all National Team players are given, to represent the federation in a honorable way.  As the story states these players are in the U15 player pool and they have earned it.  Yes, my kid was there and she earned it like the other 59 players (there were 60 not 59).


I like the word "Honorable" and it's a badge of honor to be one of 60 players chosen to represent the USA in any sport at any age!!!  The USSF and Doc that rolled out their TC Sham(e) two years ago in SD has some explaining to do.


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## Kicker4Life (Oct 11, 2019)

The Outlaw said:


> Aren't these players still being 'recommended' by coaches?  Of the 3 players I mentioned earlier, only the DA (to ECNL) player would have ever been scouted and, frankly, stands out because of her size, speed and athleticism... not her technical ability.  The other 2 don't even separate themselves on their own teams... let alone region.  So until you remove club politics and forceful parents pushing their kid to be sent to id2, etc, how would it truly ever be the 'best players' open to everyone?


Sorry Outlaw but it’ll disagree with your statement on that certain player. She has what it takes I all aspects.  She only has one thing working against her but she’s seemingly able to manage it.


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## kickingandscreaming (Oct 11, 2019)

The Outlaw said:


> Aren't these players still being 'recommended' by coaches?  Of the 3 players I mentioned earlier, only the DA (to ECNL) player would have ever been scouted and, frankly, stands out because of her size, speed and athleticism... not her technical ability.  The other 2 don't even separate themselves on their own teams... let alone region.  So until you remove club politics and forceful parents pushing their kid to be sent to id2, etc, how would it truly ever be the 'best players' open to everyone?


I hear what you are saying. Due to the incentives built into the process, this is how I expect it to go between ECNL and DA Youth National Team representation. At the VERY top, meaning, girls who US Soccer believe CURRENTLY look like they will compete for a spot on THE WNT, US Soccer will take the girls without regard to where they play. They are trying to field the best team possible and they'd look silly not taking someone who is already showing the potential to play on the top team. At each age group, this is likely fewer than 10 players, maybe fewer than 5. I'd guess that about an average of 3-5 women per birth year eventually get WNT (not YNT) time at some point. After that top group, they realize there may be some late bloomers. Here's where they will "justify" (to themselves, not publicly) taking players who might not currently be in the top X players that they have spots for in a given camp. If a player committed to training 4 times a week and is willing to forego HS for "better" club training, they will argue that player is more likely to rise in standing among peers than one who is not training 4 times a week and is playing HS. Also, for the group of players below the very top group, there is a "marketing" incentive for US Soccer to invite DA players. There is also an incentive for selecting players that come from a coach that US Soccer believes is doing an exceptional job of training. If I am correct and there isn't another significant change in the soccer landscape (big assumption), we should see a higher percentage of ECNL players on YNT rosters than the percentage of ECNL players in camps such as the one with the 60 05's.

It's worth remembering that even in the "one top league" world before DA, there was plenty of room for argument about who should have been part of a YNT Camp. It's not hard understand where we are now that another "top league" was created whose leadership is responsible for inviting players to YNT Camp.

Finally, while there are arguments to be made regarding US Soccer criteria for invites, I believe it is important to acknowledge that every girl who gets invited to these camps is worthy. They should be congratulated. They earned it. I don't believe this is inconsistent with also believing that other girls who were not invited to the camp also could have been legitimately selected.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 11, 2019)

Kicker4Life said:


> Sorry Outlaw but it’ll disagree with your statement on that certain player. She has what it takes I all aspects.  She only has one thing working against her but she’s seemingly able to manage it.


I didn't want to get any more specific but we may not be talking about the same player.  Again, I'm not sure how to be more specific without risking someone's identity and feelings.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 11, 2019)

Kicker4Life said:


> Sorry Outlaw but it’ll disagree with your statement on that certain player. She has what it takes I all aspects.  She only has one thing working against her but she’s seemingly able to manage it.


Okay, here we go.  Someone PM'd me and asked if it was a kid involved between Slammers and Beach.  That is not the kid or clubs I'm referring to.


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## LoveMyCoffee (Oct 11, 2019)

End of the Line said:


> You are wrong that US Soccer hasn't handled its youth system properly in the past.  The reason I know you are wrong is that we have 8 years of results - 12 when you realize that the US loss to Japan in the finals back in the old days was a fluke.  Sure, they didn't find Hailie Mace, but: (1) no one is perfect; (2) Hailie Mace still hasn't done s**t, which makes her a terrible example in support of your position; (3) I don't know the real reason Mace wasn't a youth regular, so we're just speculating.
> 
> Where you are right, however, is that USSF is certainly screwing up the WNT now and going forward because it is now favoring GDA players over other more qualified players, among the many other GDA problems that will cause the inevitable decline in the WNT.  In my earlier post, I was only answering the question about why the WNT is currently so great but youth teams are not.  USSF is still favoring better athletes over better technical players, and that's the right thing to do, but now it is doing so from a more limited pool, and that's the wrong thing to do.


I agree with your last point that USSF might be screwing up WNT going forward, at least if they only chose from GDA.   But maybe it will just be that those GDA players fall off the roster later on and USSF continues to grab girls from college pool for the senior WNT.  I guess we'll find out.    The problem I see with USSF making the selection process more exclusive is they risk making soccer less popular.   If the only kids who have a prayer of making it to the national team are those that can afford the cost of GDA and have a GDA club in close enough range to make it feasible, then you may see a drop-off in participation.   Kids also need heroes they can relate to.  If the sport becomes a "rich man's sport", then popularity may wane.   All that remains to be seen, of course, but I really wish the GDA/ECNL p*ssing contest would end.


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## Projustice (Oct 11, 2019)

I think its fine having two elite Leagues, U.S. Development Academy and ECNL, But if we are truly talking about developing the player and giving them the best opportunities to be scouted equally, let them play each other.  Have a huge end of the year tournament and have the 6 best D.A. teams play the 6 best ECNL teams in the country. It would be an amazing opportunity for National team scouts and College coaches to come to one tournament and watch these elite players battle it out.


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## Justus (Oct 12, 2019)

Projustice said:


> I think its fine having two elite Leagues, U.S. Development Academy and ECNL, But if we are truly talking about developing the player and giving them the best opportunities to be scouted equally, let them play each other.  Have a huge end of the year tournament and have the 6 best D.A. teams play the 6 best ECNL teams in the country. It would be an amazing opportunity for National team scouts and College coaches to come to one tournament and watch these elite players battle it out.


I would take the finalist of DA and ECNL from Oceanside/Del Mar and then have a "Unity Cup Final Four" at The Great Park to settle things once and for all.  Have #1 seed from DA play #2 seed in ECNL and vice versa. That stadium would be packed and livestream would be huge


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## Justus (Oct 12, 2019)

Justus said:


> I would take the finalist of DA and ECNL from Oceanside/Del Mar and then have a "Unity Cup Final Four" at The Great Park to settle things once and for all.  Have #1 seed from DA play #2 seed in ECNL and vice versa. That stadium would be packed and livestream would be huge


After finals, take the "Sweet 16 GOATs" from each league and have a GOAT all start game a week after in Dallas.  Now that would be a "Big Hat, Big Cattle Showcase" with a Big Horse, Big Saddle and let's not forget, Big Cowboy Boots as well    YNT Scouts and College Coaches would have plenty to scout in the summer and all the parents and girls who don't get picked for Player Pools and actual Youth National Teams will have nothing to whine and fuss about anymore.


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## Lambchop (Oct 12, 2019)

LoveMyCoffee said:


> I agree with your last point that USSF might be screwing up WNT going forward, at least if they only chose from GDA.   But maybe it will just be that those GDA players fall off the roster later on and USSF continues to grab girls from college pool for the senior WNT.  I guess we'll find out.    The problem I see with USSF making the selection process more exclusive is they risk making soccer less popular.   If the only kids who have a prayer of making it to the national team are those that can afford the cost of GDA and have a GDA club in close enough range to make it feasible, then you may see a drop-off in participation.   Kids also need heroes they can relate to.  If the sport becomes a "rich man's sport", then popularity may wane.   All that remains to be seen, of course, but I really wish the GDA/ECNL p*ssing contest would end.


There is always a drop off. It begins in high school and ends in college!


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## Soccer43 (Oct 12, 2019)

kickingandscreaming said:


> ...... US Soccer will take the girls without regard to where they play. They are trying to field the best team possible and they'd look silly not taking someone who is already showing the potential to play on the top team. .... .


I think you are being very naive about this.  It absolutely does matter where you play and who your coach is and what connections they have.  There are some DA clubs that consistently lose and are in the bottom of the bracket but still have players getting call-ups .  Often those players are one and done so it is hard to justify that those particular call ups were 100% worthy and their coaches are superior.   I am not talking about all the girls (only a few)  so all of you that get wound up about this and think  I am insulting or discrediting those players that are called up you can relax about that.  Most of the call ups are deserving.  But there are several players that deserve a call up to prove themselves that never get the opportunity because of politics and favoritism and other reasons.   It is interesting to see them go into their college level play and which top club players do continue to shine at that next level and who drops off.


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## Soccer43 (Oct 12, 2019)

By the way, if you think there isn’t a bias toward the DA on this,  just note that this thread is even in the Girls Development Academy area on the Forum


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## Justus (Oct 12, 2019)

Soccer43 said:


> I think you are being very naive about this.  It absolutely does matter where you play and who your coach is and what connections they have.  There are some DA clubs that consistently lose and are in the bottom of the bracket but still have players getting call-ups .  Often those players are one and done so it is hard to justify that those particular call ups were 100% worthy and their coaches are superior.   I am not talking about all the girls (only a few)  so all of you that get wound up about this and think  I am insulting or discrediting those players that are called up you can relax about that.  Most of the call ups are deserving.  But there are several players that deserve a call up to prove themselves that never get the opportunity because of politics and favoritism and other reasons.   It is interesting to see them go into their college level play and which top club players do continue to shine at that next level and who drops off.


Great stuff 43.  You know what you can't sell to parents of 15 and 16 year olds?


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## MARsSPEED (Oct 12, 2019)

DA/ECNL varies throughout the country...the top club on the east coast is ECNL (PDA). 

Although DA is only 3 years old, I suggest all of you look at the rosters of the top 15 D1 College teams. There is a very even mix. The most surprising element is how many D1 players on these top ranked teams played for their High School. Yes, this includes freshman. 

Also, to add to the craziness, ODP is currently revamping its program nationwide. We personally work/train with a previous USWNT player who is part of this revamp. She seems very optimistic about the future. It’s interesting but I don’t know how that will work out.

@Justus I troll this place because the egos and arrogance in SoCal are truly some next level sh*t! As much as people give me the business here for my opinion, I am actually LMAO on the other end. That is until some people go really low and insult me on a very personal level. 

Lastly, I have no idea who the other people you mentioned are but am happy some are in agreement with me here. Since I am in the minority here, it is humbling. I will say that many here need get out of the SoCal box and have some humbling experiences of their own. What I mean is, USWNT home is in SoCal but outside of that, colleges look at things much much differently...

Carry on!


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## LASTMAN14 (Oct 12, 2019)

MARsSPEED said:


> DA/ECNL varies throughout the country...the top club on the east coast is ECNL (PDA).
> 
> Although DA is only 3 years old, I suggest all of you look at the rosters of the top 15 D1 College teams. There is a very even mix. The most surprising element is how many D1 players on these top ranked teams played for their High School. Yes, this includes freshman.
> 
> ...


Based on your responses your not laughing. You become hostile and narrow. You delete posts because your ego cant handle it. And you have made insults. In fact this post is an insult.  Please stop acting the victim. Your arrogance streams through in most of your posts.


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## Fact (Oct 12, 2019)

MARsSPEED said:


> DA/ECNL varies throughout the country...the top club on the east coast is ECNL (PDA).
> 
> Although DA is only 3 years old, I suggest all of you look at the rosters of the top 15 D1 College teams. There is a very even mix. The most surprising element is how many D1 players on these top ranked teams played for their High School. Yes, this includes freshman.
> 
> ...


While I agree with you that D1 players are a mix and ECNL is top dog in other parts of the country, you have to remember that the collegiate players that were still in high school when DA rolled out had no reason to join a DA team.  Most were probably already committed to a college and kept the status quo.


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## Justus (Oct 13, 2019)

MARsSPEED said:


> DA/ECNL varies throughout the country...the top club on the east coast is ECNL (PDA).
> 
> Although DA is only 3 years old, I suggest all of you look at the rosters of the top 15 D1 College teams. There is a very even mix. The most surprising element is how many D1 players on these top ranked teams played for their High School. Yes, this includes freshman.
> 
> ...


@MARsSPEED The DA is only two years old.  I agree with you about HS Soccer and the top D1 schools. My ego and arrogance all started from my days as a kiddo.  You're not the first to say my competitiveness is "next level shit."  For example, I shared about the Mater Dei Monarchs getting Tom Lewis to leave Capo as a HS Freshman back in 81,82.  Anyway, Mated Dei is what it is today because of that move.  It birthed the #1 HS Sports Program in the country right in the heart of OC.  Hoops and Football no one can touch that school.  Anyway, we would get unlucky in the Orange Holiday Classic and get stuck with either Mated Dei or Long Beach Poly Jack Rabbits.  No mercy back in my day when I played ball Mars.  Anyway, we would lose by 60.  However, I would seek my competitive revenge at Main Beach outdoor courts in the summers in Laguna Beach.  I would catch one of the Monarchs playing pick up alone and without his all star team.  I would play extra hard and the MD guy would be "Bro, chill out, were just playing some hoops at the beach."  I didn't care and he left because I slapped him so much.  I'm sorry I said you and the family were lost in the Hills Have Eyes.  It was a joke sir.  Lastly, I came on here asking about one thing, "The List."  Now I have 10 more questions.  You came on here because of the GOATS FC getting into Blues Cup and you obviously had  a lot of questions on why this was allowed.


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## The Outlaw *BANNED* (Oct 13, 2019)

I don't have anything to say.  Just wanted to give "surfertwins" something to disagree with or "dumb" for me for since he lacks the balls to post anything himself.


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## Silverlining (Oct 13, 2019)

Soccer43 said:


> Slammers left DA and went back to ECNL, Arsenal also is ECNL. .... that pretty much seems like automatic disqualification from the YNT pool.  It’s a shame but as other posters have said, it doesn’t matter much until players start in college and prove themselves in that venue


I hear LAFC Slammers will go back to DA once their ECNL contract is up. Slammers has this in place before LAFC took over. Any truth to that? It kinda makes sense since LAFC is an MLS DA, weird for them to play against their own. Anyone have any insight? Thanks!


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## Fact (Oct 13, 2019)

The Outlaw said:


> I don't have anything to say.  Just wanted to give "surfertwins" something to disagree with or "dumb" for me for since he lacks the balls to post anything himself.


Sorry to break it to you,  but as female I don’t think Surfertwins has balls.


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## Soccer43 (Oct 14, 2019)

Silverlining said:


> I hear LAFC Slammers will go back to DA once their ECNL contract is up. Slammers has this in place before LAFC took over. Any truth to that? It kinda makes sense since LAFC is an MLS DA, weird for them to play against their own. Anyone have any insight? Thanks!


And why would they do that - didn’t have they just leave the DA last year?


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## Justus (Oct 14, 2019)

Silverlining said:


> I hear LAFC Slammers will go back to DA once their ECNL contract is up. Slammers has this in place before LAFC took over. Any truth to that? It kinda makes sense since LAFC is an MLS DA, weird for them to play against their own. Anyone have any insight? Thanks!


I think everyone on this forum has heard the following from a coach or Doc or a big monster parent who is close to the big DMs in this arena, "I hear for next season...……"  Don't believe anything and get everything in writing.  Most coaches (not all coaches) will tell you what your itching ears want to hear about how good your dd is.  My biggest mistake in the past was trying to get a head of everyone about the DA.  I was first in line to receive my packets.  That was a huge mistake.  Odds are the coach your talking with won't even be the coach next year.  Don't pay up front either.  Don't buy uniforms until the very end.  Trick coach and tell him your kid has to play CM and start or you will look around.  If he/she says, "Yes" leave.  If he say's, "You can leave" then stay and tell him/her you were just testing to see how they run their roster.  Always a Silver Lining in this mess and you won't find that out unfortunately until the season starts.


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## timbuck (Oct 14, 2019)

Silverlining said:


> I hear LAFC Slammers will go back to DA once their ECNL contract is up. Slammers has this in place before LAFC took over. Any truth to that? It kinda makes sense since LAFC is an MLS DA, weird for them to play against their own. Anyone have any insight? Thanks!


Are there “ecnl contracts”?  seems that it’s a year by year thing.  (At least it appears that way.  With so many clubs making a switch each year. 
Does LAFC exist on the youth scene outside Boys DA and the Slammers affiliation on the girls side?
Would be funny/interesting if they took over the LA Galaxy affiliates.


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## Justus (Oct 14, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Are there “ecnl contracts”?  seems that it’s a year by year thing.  (At least it appears that way.  With so many clubs making a switch each year.
> Does LAFC exist on the youth scene outside Boys DA and the Slammers affiliation on the girls side?
> Would be funny/interesting if they took over the LA Galaxy affiliates.


Slammers & LAFC is super confusing.  All I remember was "Slammers Alvarez."  Now I don't know who were playing anymore and who runs what.  I do like LAFC teams so far for the girls side.  Very well balanced and strong.  They belong playing with the top dogs in DA that's for sure.  We play both versions this weekend.  I will ask the few people who still like me what they know and I will report back to all of us here if rumor has some truth to it.


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## futboldad1 (Oct 14, 2019)

Silverlining said:


> I hear LAFC Slammers will go back to DA once their ECNL contract is up. Slammers has this in place before LAFC took over. Any truth to that? It kinda makes sense since LAFC is an MLS DA, weird for them to play against their own. Anyone have any insight? Thanks!


This is false. Got LOTS of friends there. Slammers are fully committed to ECNL. You can read what the Khoury’s said about choosing it over DA, or could ask around to see that it still rings true. They’re concentrating on trying to win a national championship as last year they failed in the quest, though their 2005 lost on overtime.


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## timbuck (Oct 14, 2019)

I’m sure the Slammers will stay ECNL. 
But what about the LAFC side of things? 
My understanding is that LAFC and Slammers got together to give Slammers an easy entry into DA. 
And now that MLS clubs are going all hands on deck with DA-  will this have an impact here?


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## Justus (Oct 14, 2019)

timbuck said:


> I’m sure the Slammers will stay ECNL.
> But what about the LAFC side of things?
> My understanding is that LAFC and Slammers got together to give Slammers an easy entry into DA.
> And now that MLS clubs are going all hands on deck with DA-  will this have an impact here?


That would be one back and forth and then back again situation for LAFC.  They would lose people with that decision.  I spoke to a reliable source and he said no way in hell they make that move.  However, he did say he was wrong when they went all in ECNL with two teams so he said take his news with a grain of salt.  Buck you might be right though.


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