# FWR



## Frank (Jun 24, 2018)

Heard a bunch of Calsouth teams were DQ’d at FWR for illegal players?  Any details?


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## younothat (Jun 24, 2018)

Ah I was wondering why some teams that apparently "won" didn't move on? or are the posted scores / team names incorrect?

https://www.usyouthsoccer.org/tournaments/2018-far-west-regional-championships/schedule/18u-boys/division-1/
Strikers FC South Bay (CA-S) 3–4
Santa Monica United FC 2000 (CA-S)
Did SMU get DQ'd? since Strikers appeared in the Final

https://www.usyouthsoccer.org/tournaments/2018-far-west-regional-championships/schedule/14u-boys/division-1/
LAGSB 04 Elite (CA-S) 3–0
LV Revolution FC Gunners 04 (NV)
Did LAGSB get DQ'd?   since LV appeared in the Final?


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## Kicknit22 (Jun 24, 2018)

Frank said:


> Heard a bunch of Calsouth teams were DQ’d at FWR for illegal players?  Any details?


How F-ing pathetic!!  It’s YOUTH SPORTS!!  No excuse for it. Ban anyone involved, period.  Why do parents/adults always have to F things up? What an embarrassment!!!


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## SBFDad (Jun 24, 2018)

younothat said:


> Ah I was wondering why some teams that apparently "won" didn't move on? or are the posted scores / team names incorrect?
> 
> https://www.usyouthsoccer.org/tournaments/2018-far-west-regional-championships/schedule/18u-boys/division-1/
> Strikers FC South Bay (CA-S) 3–4
> ...


For LAGSB 2004s...Yes, DQed for fielding an ineligible player. Apparently they transferred in a Cup tied player, a transfer that CalSouth approved. Not sure of the full details yet.

I also heard that Santa Monica’s 2000 rostered several ineligible players, one a DA kid.

Others?


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## OCsoccerdad7777 (Jun 24, 2018)

Kicknit22 said:


> How F-ing pathetic!!  It’s YOUTH SPORTS!!  No excuse for it. Ban anyone involved, period.  Why do parents/adults always have to F things up? What an embarrassment!!!


Agreed need to suspend the coach's license for a couple of years minimum IF knowingly involved. Fine the club.


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## timbuck (Jun 25, 2018)

Fly all the way to Hawaii with an illegal roster?  If it happens on this stage, imagine what goes on when you can just drive 15 minutes to a local field.


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## Frank (Jun 25, 2018)

timbuck said:


> Fly all the way to Hawaii with an illegal roster?  If it happens on this stage, imagine what goes on when you can just drive 15 minutes to a local field.


I ref'd a game in Nat Cup this year where we caught 3 illegal players during check in who were trying to play under another players ID.  CalSouth got involved and didn't let the players play, however the game continued and the coach coached the game.  Personally, I thought they should have been forfeited out of the tourney right then and coach banned, however as a ref I do what CS asks and did the game.


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## InTheValley (Jun 25, 2018)

SBFDad said:


> For LAGSB 2004s...Yes, DQed for fielding an ineligible player. Apparently they transferred in a Cup tied player, a transfer that CalSouth approved. Not sure of the full details yet.
> 
> I also heard that Santa Monica’s 2000 rostered several ineligible players, one a DA kid.
> 
> Others?


How ironic, eh, @David Parsio?  It looks like National Cup could use more rule abiding teams like that Brazilian Golden State FC squad.


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## Fact (Jun 25, 2018)

Frank said:


> I ref'd a game in Nat Cup this year where we caught 3 illegal players during check in who were trying to play under another players ID.  CalSouth got involved and didn't let the players play, however the game continued and the coach coached the game.  Personally, I thought they should have been forfeited out of the tourney right then and coach banned, however as a ref I do what CS asks and did the game.


Sounds similar to Anaheim Surf’s G06 from 2017.  Without ramifications to the coach and club, the reward of trying this by unscrupulous coaches is worth the effort of finding a few willing ringer players.


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## SMUfan (Jun 25, 2018)

Santa Monica United FC B00 were disqualified for an illegal roster during Far West Regionals in Hawaii. This was brought to the attention of FWR committee after our team beat Strikers South Bay 4-3 in the Round of 16.  Strikers SB had beaten us 6-0 in the Cal South National Cup final back in May.  Our FWR roster had been public for 2 weeks prior to us leaving for Hawaii.  The player in question was transferred to our roster by an employee from Cal South.  Given that the employee is responsible for Far West and National Cup rosters for Cal South, we believed because Cal South transferred the player to our roster, the player was now eligible for FWR.

Strikers South Bay was aware that one of the players we have added for the 2018-2019 season was cup tied with another club.  Strikers South Bay saw us play in Hawaii and per the rule Strikers South Bay should have protested the roster prior to the match.  Instead, Strikers South Bay protested after losing the quarter final match to us and opened up the FWR committee looking into more Cal South teams with illegal rosters.  2 other clubs and teams were DQ’ed and we were not the club that rostered a DA player.

To provide some context, five days before the Santa Monica United B2002 team left for Utah for Presidents Cup Far West Regionals, Cal South reviewed all of the traveling teams' rosters and contacted the team to let them know that one of the players was ineligible to play in Utah.  The player was removed from the roster and did not play in Far West Regional Presidents Cup.  The precedent was set.  Cal South should review all of their rosters for eligibility before teams start their travel.  How they handled Utah was the way we thought they would handle Hawaii.   We received no call or notification from our Cal South contact before we traveled to Hawaii that we had an eligibility issue.


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## LASTMAN14 (Jun 25, 2018)

SBFDad said:


> For LAGSB 2004s...Yes, DQed for fielding an ineligible player. Apparently they transferred in a Cup tied player, a transfer that CalSouth approved. Not sure of the full details yet.
> 
> I also heard that Santa Monica’s 2000 rostered several ineligible players, one a DA kid.
> 
> Others?


If a player was rostered only Cal South can handle. Far West creates individual player cards. Obviously Cal South fouled that up.


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## LASTMAN14 (Jun 25, 2018)

SMUfan said:


> Santa Monica United FC B00 were disqualified for an illegal roster during Far West Regionals in Hawaii. This was brought to the attention of FWR committee after our team beat Strikers South Bay 4-3 in the Round of 16.  Strikers SB had beaten us 6-0 in the Cal South National Cup final back in May.  Our FWR roster had been public for 2 weeks prior to us leaving for Hawaii.  The player in question was transferred to our roster by an employee from Cal South.  Given that the employee is responsible for Far West and National Cup rosters for Cal South, we believed because Cal South transferred the player to our roster, the player was now eligible for FWR.
> 
> Strikers South Bay was aware that one of the players we have added for the 2018-2019 season was cup tied with another club.  Strikers South Bay saw us play in Hawaii and per the rule Strikers South Bay should have protested the roster prior to the match.  Instead, Strikers South Bay protested after losing the quarter final match to us and opened up the FWR committee looking into more Cal South teams with illegal rosters.  2 other clubs and teams were DQ’ed and we were not the club that rostered a DA player.
> 
> To provide some context, five days before the Santa Monica United B2002 team left for Utah for Presidents Cup Far West Regionals, Cal South reviewed all of the traveling teams' rosters and contacted the team to let them know that one of the players was ineligible to play in Utah.  The player was removed from the roster and did not play in Far West Regional Presidents Cup.  The precedent was set.  Cal South should review all of their rosters for eligibility before teams start their travel.  How they handled Utah was the way we thought they would handle Hawaii.   We received no call or notification from our Cal South contact before we traveled to Hawaii that we had an eligibility issue.


That’s a quagmire of an issue. FUBAR. Total bummer.


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## LASTMAN14 (Jun 25, 2018)

Kicknit22 said:


> How F-ing pathetic!!  It’s YOUTH SPORTS!!  No excuse for it. Ban anyone involved, period.  Why do parents/adults always have to F things up? What an embarrassment!!!


Our process to make sure our girls were clear took 3 weeks with Cal South and consistent follow ups from me personally to ensure players would not be in eligible and to avoid any entanglements.


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## jpeter (Jun 25, 2018)

SMUfan said:


> Santa Monica United FC B00 were disqualified for an illegal roster during Far West Regionals in Hawaii. This was brought to the attention of FWR committee after our team beat Strikers South Bay 4-3 in the Round of 16.  Strikers SB had beaten us 6-0 in the Cal South National Cup final back in May.  Our FWR roster had been public for 2 weeks prior to us leaving for Hawaii.  The player in question was transferred to our roster by an employee from Cal South.  Given that the employee is responsible for Far West and National Cup rosters for Cal South, we believed because Cal South transferred the player to our roster, the player was now eligible for FWR.
> 
> Strikers South Bay was aware that one of the players we have added for the 2018-2019 season was cup tied with another club.  Strikers South Bay saw us play in Hawaii and per the rule Strikers South Bay should have protested the roster prior to the match.  Instead, Strikers South Bay protested after losing the quarter final match to us and opened up the FWR committee looking into more Cal South teams with illegal rosters.  2 other clubs and teams were DQ’ed and we were not the club that rostered a DA player.
> 
> To provide some context, five days before the Santa Monica United B2002 team left for Utah for Presidents Cup Far West Regionals, Cal South reviewed all of the traveling teams' rosters and contacted the team to let them know that one of the players was ineligible to play in Utah.  The player was removed from the roster and did not play in Far West Regional Presidents Cup.  The precedent was set.  Cal South should review all of their rosters for eligibility before teams start their travel.  How they handled Utah was the way we thought they would handle Hawaii.   We received no call or notification from our Cal South contact before we traveled to Hawaii that we had an eligibility issue.


That's unfortunate but with multiple player's?   Take some responsibility  CS could  have done a more through jobs of roster review but don't think your club could have checked better prior to adding players.

The adds after the initial comps have played sometime create controversy, some might say it's gaming the system unless the roster are short but lately most teams seems to taking advantage with fuller rosters.


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## timbuck (Jun 25, 2018)

I'm sure there are a lot worse jobs out there-  But sitting in a Cal-South Office reviewing rosters for rule breaking youth soccer players can't be a very rewarding activity.

This also brings up the whole "Why are teams recruiting/having tryouts/taking on new players while their season is still happening?"  - I realize that most teams are done by now, but the December tryout season that takes place when a team is playing until June (or July if going to Nationals) is a mess.


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## GunninGopher (Jun 25, 2018)

timbuck said:


> I'm sure there are a lot worse jobs out there-  But sitting in a Cal-South Office reviewing rosters for rule breaking youth soccer players can't be a very rewarding activity.


What are there, about 60 teams to go over in a month? I think someone can handle 3 - 5 per day. It isn't a lot to ask. Cal South has a stake in getting this right, they are partially to blame. The teams are also to blame. It isn't enough to say, 'well the player was on my roster for 3 weeks sand nobody said anything!". A classic cop-out and the other players deserve better. I give it 30% Cal South and 70% Manager/Coach/,Registrar depending on how involved/aware the coach is.

I think part of the problem is that for National Cup the registered player is clearly ID's as tied to another team. I have to assume that it goes away when teams advance.

My daughter's team came close enough to advancing this year that we wondered if a new player could play if the team advanced. There is something in the rules that cause one to thing that they might. I looked into and and said "probably not, but we'll see". She had played Nat Cup youngers and joined my daughter's older's team after her team was finished. I would have made damn sure she was eligible, including after arriving in Hawaii before allowing her to suit up. The team deserves better and I know it would be devastating to a player to be responsible for a forfeit. A similar thing happened on teams I'm aware of before and the player feels awful, even though it isn't their fault.


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## galaxydad (Jun 25, 2018)

I have an amazing idea- play the far west regionals with the same team that got you there. I’m amazed at how many teams crap on a couple players that have been with them all year to “tighten” up their roster for the big run. Have some loyalty and play with the kids that have given you blood,sweat and tears for the whole season and National Cup. It’s crazy this is even an issue

Also, having been there before Cal South really does struggle with the Regional and National Cup rules. I have seen emails from Cal South approving of roster changes and assuring that they are eligible and then then next email they say the opposite. 

But again- be loyal and play with your team


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## SMUfan (Jun 25, 2018)

A couple things to keep in consideration for us.  We played in the U18 age group which is comprised of Juniors and Seniors.  We lost 6 players to graduation and going to college.  Only 1 committed to come play in Hawaii the others had graduation stuff and trips planned long ahead.  We had a player who had committed to school trip to Iceland and another player was injured.  We did not win National Cup and we were offered a spot as a wild card.  When Cal South asked us to attend we said we could do it do it but only if 5 players who signed for next season could also attend.  We waited for a response from Cal South and on the final day they approved the roster on 6/4.  Of the 18 players on the list our registrar approved 17 and the Cal South employee approved the 1 player in question.

We trusted that Cal South as our governing body approved that our roster was compliant.  Cal South made the player transfer AND with the precedent of SMU's B2002 team (we expected Cal South would alert us if there were any problems), we traveled to Hawaii believing that we were in compliance. We would want to get verification from Far West that our roster was compliant but Far West pushes that back to the state association and makes every state association sign an affidavit declaring all their rosters comply.  So, Cal South signed an affidavit saying we and every other Cal South team were in compliance.

The confusing aspect of this is that rules change from year to year and no one seems to have a good handle on them.  I can assure you moving forward there will be a lot more checks and balances on rosters when traveling out of state.


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## coachrefparent (Jun 25, 2018)

SMUfan said:


> A couple things to keep in consideration for us.  We played in the U18 age group which is comprised of Juniors and Seniors.  We lost 6 players to graduation and going to college.  Only 1 committed to come play in Hawaii the others had graduation stuff and trips planned long ahead.  We had a player who had committed to school trip to Iceland and another player was injured.  We did not win National Cup and we were offered a spot as a wild card.  When Cal South asked us to attend we said we could do it do it but only if 5 players who signed for next season could also attend.  We waited for a response from Cal South and on the final day they approved the roster on 6/4.  Of the 18 players on the list our registrar approved 17 and the Cal South employee approved the 1 player in question.
> 
> We trusted that Cal South as our governing body approved that our roster was compliant.  Cal South made the player transfer AND with the precedent of SMU's B2002 team (we expected Cal South would alert us if there were any problems), we traveled to Hawaii believing that we were in compliance. We would want to get verification from Far West that our roster was compliant but Far West pushes that back to the state association and makes every state association sign an affidavit declaring all their rosters comply.  So, Cal South signed an affidavit saying we and every other Cal South team were in compliance.
> 
> The confusing aspect of this is that rules change from year to year and no one seems to have a good handle on them.  I can assure you moving forward there will be a lot more checks and balances on rosters when traveling out of state.


It sounds like the club's m-o is to roster players that they shouldn't, then hope Cal South or whoever "approves" the bad roster.  If caught, they then the blame the association, and claim ignorance. Cal South caught it for the Utah bound team, but not the Hawaii team.  If the system isn't zero tolerance, then teams will continue to try to sneak improper players through. Then when caught by their competition (the best enforcers) , they will make a bunch of excuses as to why it was an innocent mistake, or they didn't know the rules, etc, etc.  

It's certainly possible that these were two mere mistakes (seems a bit like a pattern though), but the consequences were applied in accordance with the rules.


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## GunninGopher (Jun 25, 2018)

SMUfan said:


> A couple things to keep in consideration for us.  We played in the U18 age group which is comprised of Juniors and Seniors.  We lost 6 players to graduation and going to college.  Only 1 committed to come play in Hawaii the others had graduation stuff and trips planned long ahead.  We had a player who had committed to school trip to Iceland and another player was injured.  We did not win National Cup and we were offered a spot as a wild card.  When Cal South asked us to attend we said we could do it do it but only if 5 players who signed for next season could also attend.  We waited for a response from Cal South and on the final day they approved the roster on 6/4.  Of the 18 players on the list our registrar approved 17 and the Cal South employee approved the 1 player in question.
> 
> We trusted that Cal South as our governing body approved that our roster was compliant.  Cal South made the player transfer AND with the precedent of SMU's B2002 team (we expected Cal South would alert us if there were any problems), we traveled to Hawaii believing that we were in compliance. We would want to get verification from Far West that our roster was compliant but Far West pushes that back to the state association and makes every state association sign an affidavit declaring all their rosters comply.  So, Cal South signed an affidavit saying we and every other Cal South team were in compliance.
> 
> The confusing aspect of this is that rules change from year to year and no one seems to have a good handle on them.  I can assure you moving forward there will be a lot more checks and balances on rosters when traveling out of state.


That sucks. I take back my percentages in your case.


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## galaxydad (Jun 26, 2018)

I also take back my reply- that sucks


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## Toch (Jun 26, 2018)

100% team admin, Coach & Club are to blame. Don’t find excuses.


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## equipo (Jun 26, 2018)

Nice win by Beach FC DPL G03.  How did Beach qualify for FWR?  I'm pretty sure it wasn't through CRL or National Cup, right?


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## Fact (Jun 26, 2018)

I think Espola missed this thread. Otherwise we would have heard for the millionth time how CalSouth not his team screwed up thirty years ago.


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## GunninGopher (Jun 28, 2018)

equipo said:


> Nice win by Beach FC DPL G03.  How did Beach qualify for FWR?  I'm pretty sure it wasn't through CRL or National Cup, right?


I don't know who won, but did the DPL winner get an auto bid too?


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## equipo (Jun 28, 2018)

GunninGopher said:


> I don't know who won, but did the DPL winner get an auto bid too?


That's right, Beach finished first in last season DPL.  Is that how they got in to FWR?


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## SitByMyself (Jun 28, 2018)

equipo said:


> That's right, Beach finished first in last season DPL.  Is that how they got in to FWR?


I believe SDSC 03 Navy was offered a wild card spot from Cal South.  They declined the spot.    So I assume since Beach was 4th in CRL they were offered this spot.

Congrats to Beach!


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## G03_SD (Jun 28, 2018)

equipo said:


> That's right, Beach finished first in last season DPL.  Is that how they got in to FWR?


Norcal didn't send a team so SoCal got a wild card. I believe it went to next finisher of CRL who was SDSC Navy who declined. Then it went to 3rd place finisher who was Beach.


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