# Chances of playing in College



## Multi Sport (Jul 8, 2017)

A friend of mine posted this. It has stats for both the boys and girls and list all college sports.

http://www.scholarshipstats.com/varsityodds.html?utm


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## Soccer43 (Jul 8, 2017)

Interesting to see the numbers.  Those are a little higher odds than what is posted at NCAA website:

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/estimated-probability-competing-college-athletics


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## espola (Jul 8, 2017)

It's even worse than the charts show, since many top-level players don't play high school, because of a year-round club or academy schedule.


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## Dargle (Jul 8, 2017)

espola said:


> It's even worse than the charts show, since many top-level players don't play high school, because of a year-round club or academy schedule.


Doesn't that cut the other way?  Presumably, a higher % of the non-high school soccer players (e.g., the DA players) go on to play college soccer, so the % of high school age soccer players (as opposed to just those who played varsity in HS) who play college soccer should be slightly higher.  You are adding a higher proportion to the numerator than the denominator compared to the proportion you had originally.

I've often thought that college is the wrong question (or at least too limited a question), since most kids actually don't ultimately try to play college soccer (self-selecting out at some point).  Most kids do, however, try to play soccer in HS, whether in HS or year-round through Academy.  The question, then, that most parents/kids should be asking themselves is whether they need to play club in order to make their HS team or a DA team.  The latter question is undoubtedly yes, so the former is the more important.  It varies wildly by HS, depending upon large public v. very small private etc.  Still, that's what parents and kids thinking of making the plunge should consider more than they do.


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## espola (Jul 8, 2017)

Dargle said:


> Doesn't that cut the other way?  Presumably, a higher % of the non-high school soccer players (e.g., the DA players) go on to play college soccer, so the % of high school age soccer players (as opposed to just those who played varsity in HS) who play college soccer should be slightly higher.  You are adding a higher proportion to the numerator than the denominator compared to the proportion you had originally.
> .


No.


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## Dargle (Jul 8, 2017)

espola said:


> No.


I checked back and see you must be referring to the fact that the number of players playing in college must already include those DA or non-HS players.  Of course, assuming those players played DA at HS age would be inaccurate too.  Nowadays, especially for boys, they are far more likely to have grown up in another country and not played in the US at all during HS years.  The percentages would be even worse if you subtracted out the foreign players in college.


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## Surfref (Jul 8, 2017)

Any good player that wants to play college soccer can find a college.  I think too many players only look at D1 colleges when there are plenty of good D2, D3, NAIA, and JC's.


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## Multi Sport (Jul 8, 2017)

Surfref said:


> Any good player that wants to play college soccer can find a college.  I think too many players only look at D1 colleges when there are plenty of good D2, D3, NAIA, and JC's.


The link shows everything from D1 to JC.


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## Surfref (Jul 8, 2017)

Multi Sport said:


> The link shows everything from D1 to JC.


I guess I worded the post wrong.  If the player is playing on an A team there is no reason they cannot play in college.  There is such a wide variety of programs that a player should be able to find a college that has a soccer program and their major.  I also think the JC option is a good choice for players that are either unsure of their major or their family cannot afford 4-5 years at a university.  My DD has a friend that played JC as a keeper the past two years and is transferring to a D2 on a good soccer and academic scholarship.  She went to the JC first because her parents could not afford to send her to a university.  Players and families just need to look at all options.


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## Victoria Quinn (Aug 3, 2017)

Multi Sport said:


> A friend of mine posted this. It has stats for both the boys and girls and list all college sports.
> 
> http://www.scholarshipstats.com/varsityodds.html?utm


This is interesting. If you do the math with 78 or so DA teams and 78 or so ECNL teams. Throw in the B team of the DA teams, even with full Rosters you are still less than 4500 players. So many parents sometimes so misinformed about B teams at top clubs. If your player is good they will be found!


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## wildcat66 (Aug 4, 2017)

The data that would interest me is the major that the players are in.  I am a late college goer, just got my degree at 50, after my military career.  As a father with college and pre-college age kids I took an interest in the college programs.  The vast majority of college players, soccer included had what I considered the easy degrees; liberal arts, business, communications.  It is very rare to see an engineering, pre med, hard sciences type in any athletic program.  With the big emphasis on STEM at the elementary and high school levels little discouraging to see so few people who want that type of degree and play soccer.


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## Victoria Quinn (Aug 4, 2017)

wildcat66 said:


> The data that would interest me is the major that the players are in.  I am a late college goer, just got my degree at 50, after my military career.  As a father with college and pre-college age kids I took an interest in the college programs.  The vast majority of college players, soccer included had what I considered the easy degrees; liberal arts, business, communications.  It is very rare to see an engineering, pre med, hard sciences type in any athletic program.  With the big emphasis on STEM at the elementary and high school levels little discouraging to see so few people who want that type of degree and play soccer.





wildcat66 said:


> The data that would interest me is the major that the players are in.  I am a late college goer, just got my degree at 50, after my military career.  As a father with college and pre-college age kids I took an interest in the college programs.  The vast majority of college players, soccer included had what I considered the easy degrees; liberal arts, business, communications.  It is very rare to see an engineering, pre med, hard sciences type in any athletic program.  With the big emphasis on STEM at the elementary and high school levels little discouraging to see so few people who want that type of degree and play soccer.


My daughter is a rising sophomore and just played in Surf Cup on a B team. She is interested in Engineering as her major! She received several letters this weekend from top  D3 schools and their Coaches with Engineering Programs. Keeping my fingers crossed that her dream of becoming an Engineer and playing soccer in College will become a reality


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## rainbow_unicorn (Aug 4, 2017)

Forget soccer.  I'm switching my daughter to Equestrian...1306 high school participants, 2295 college scholarships.


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## chargerfan (Aug 4, 2017)

Victoria Quinn said:


> My daughter is a rising sophomore and just played in Surf Cup on a B team. She is interested in Engineering as her major! She received several letters this weekend from top  D3 schools and their Coaches with Engineering Programs. Keeping my fingers crossed that her dream of becoming an Engineer and playing soccer in College will become a reality


This is fantastic. Sounds like your family has their priorities in check.


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## Dargle (Aug 4, 2017)

wildcat66 said:


> The data that would interest me is the major that the players are in.  I am a late college goer, just got my degree at 50, after my military career.  As a father with college and pre-college age kids I took an interest in the college programs.  The vast majority of college players, soccer included had what I considered the easy degrees; liberal arts, business, communications.  It is very rare to see an engineering, pre med, hard sciences type in any athletic program.  With the big emphasis on STEM at the elementary and high school levels little discouraging to see so few people who want that type of degree and play soccer.


Many moons ago, I was recruited to play soccer at a fairly prestigious D3 college with a fearsome reputation for academics.  It was starting play in a new conference that required air travel, overnight stays etc to lots of its games.  I asked about how that would fit with taking lab sciences, since the lab portions of the courses were often offered toward the end of the week in late afternoon time slots.  The coach hemmed and hawed a little.  He conceded that it would be difficult and you might have to miss some sessions to make it work.  This is probably still an issue and even more so in the D1 colleges with even more extensive travel.  Students can make up for it by loading up on those courses in the offseason or in summer, but it's not easy.  My guess is that it's not so much that the students are lazy and taking what you characterize as "easy degrees" (although I disagree with that characterization as a blanket statement - I know plenty of STEM oriented students who would die with the reading/research/writing requirements of a liberal arts major -- the view of these majors as "easy" usually is more about the ability to get a certain grade because of the department's curve rather than the amount of work or the difficulty of doing it very well), but they are forced to balance the requirements of soccer and classes and they end up constructing schedules/majors that permit for both.


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## wildcat66 (Aug 4, 2017)

Dargle said:


> Many moons ago, I was recruited to play soccer at a fairly prestigious D3 college with a fearsome reputation for academics.  It was starting play in a new conference that required air travel, overnight stays etc to lots of its games.  I asked about how that would fit with taking lab sciences, since the lab portions of the courses were often offered toward the end of the week in late afternoon time slots.  The coach hemmed and hawed a little.  He conceded that it would be difficult and you might have to miss some sessions to make it work.  This is probably still an issue and even more so in the D1 colleges with even more extensive travel.  Students can make up for it by loading up on those courses in the offseason or in summer, but it's not easy.  My guess is that it's not so much that the students are lazy and taking what you characterize as "easy degrees" (although I disagree with that characterization as a blanket statement - I know plenty of STEM oriented students who would die with the reading/research/writing requirements of a liberal arts major -- the view of these majors as "easy" usually is more about the ability to get a certain grade because of the department's curve rather than the amount of work or the difficulty of doing it very well), but they are forced to balance the requirements of soccer and classes and they end up constructing schedules/majors that permit for both.


     I guess i should have chosen better for my portrayal of easy vs hard majors....occasionally had athletes in some of my GE classes but rarely saw one in a calculus, or physics or chemistry....when I inquired about it....I went to San Diego State so can only go by what they said and what I have heard from other people... they said that many coaches avoided kids that were looking at the tougher majors and preferred/highly encouraged their players to choose classes that allowed for absences and easier work ie less study time.  It also seemed that the  liberal art professors were alot more accommodating than the science bunch.  I just think that parents and players really need to look at the long term when deciding about school.  If your kid wants to be a physicist, or electrical engineer, or marine biologist playing soccer may not be possible.


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## Daniel Miller (Aug 4, 2017)

There is a reason why playing a collegiate sport is nearly impossible to do while studying a hard-science.  From personal experience, I can tell you what it takes to get a geology degree.  Most of your first two years are filled up with a couple of geology courses (Geol. 101 plus lab; Earth History plus lab), three calculus courses, four chemistry courses (one year of general chemistry; one year of organic chemistry), two biology courses (one year), three physics courses (three semesters) and breadth requirements.  You are always taking *at least* two hard-science courses with lab.  Most labs take about 2 hours to prep for, and two actual lab hours, twice per week.  In other words, that is 8 lab hours per science course, per week, and that usually means up to 16 hours per week just for your labs.

By the time you get to your third year, you are taking very demanding geology courses with labs, and nearly every course has required field trips twice per semester.  (The geology professors work together to get them all in on different weekends.)  So, if you are a soccer player in the Fall, you usually have at least 6 weekends where there will be a conflict between your games and your field work.  

You can play collegiate soccer and get a degree in the sciences, but you better set aside about 5-6 years to do it.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 4, 2017)

Victoria Quinn said:


> My daughter is a rising sophomore and just played in Surf Cup on a B team. She is interested in Engineering as her major! She received several letters this weekend from top  D3 schools and their Coaches with Engineering Programs. Keeping my fingers crossed that her dream of becoming an Engineer and playing soccer in College will become a reality


If you keep her focusing on her school AND her soccer it will happen.  One of my player's roommates is an engineering major and their program is top 10 in the country.  She also juggles being a key player on the soccer team and moomlights playing for her country's national team.  It can happen if the player wants it bad enough!!  Good luck to you and your player!


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 4, 2017)

wildcat66 said:


> If your kid wants to be a physicist, or electrical engineer, or marine biologist playing soccer may not be possible.


I disagree with you on this one.  My player and one of her roommates are life science majors and one is an engineering major and this is at a D1 school with an extensive travel schedule.  One of the roommates even has to balance national team duty.  All of them have over a 3.6 gpa.  It can happen it is all about the kid and her support system.


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## wildcat66 (Aug 4, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> I disagree with you on this one.  My player and one of her roommates are life science majors and one is an engineering major and this is at a D1 school with an extensive travel schedule.  One of the roommates even has to balance national team duty.  All of them have over a 3.6 gpa.  It can happen it is all about the kid and her support system.


definately  not the norm


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 4, 2017)

wildcat66 said:


> definately  not the norm


I agree but it is up to the kids, family and coaching staff to make it happen.  All of the players attend summer school and they stay on top of their studies.  They still have plenty of time to be kids though.  All they have to do is want it bad enough.  I just don't think that it is some unique ability.  It just has to be important to the kid.


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## Surfref (Aug 4, 2017)

wildcat66 said:


> The data that would interest me is the major that the players are in.  I am a late college goer, just got my degree at 50, after my military career.  As a father with college and pre-college age kids I took an interest in the college programs.  The vast majority of college players, soccer included had what I considered the easy degrees; liberal arts, business, communications.  It is very rare to see an engineering, pre med, hard sciences type in any athletic program.  With the big emphasis on STEM at the elementary and high school levels little discouraging to see so few people who want that type of degree and play soccer.


My DD will be starting her third of five years of college this fall and will be making it a Red Shirt year due to her academic load.  Her college soccer coach suggested the Red Shirt.  She is a dual major Kinesiology and Athletic Trainer with a goal of Doctorate in Physical Therapy and BS in Athletic Training.  This third year is the most difficult academically with 20 class units and 100 hours of internship required.  DD coach is using her as an extra coach to help the freshman mids and forwards adjust to the 4-3-3 formation they primarily play.  The coach is fine with DD missing practices and games if she has school work to complete.  DD has two friends that completely stopped college soccer after their sophomore year.  Both are nursing majors (Illinois and South Carolina colleges) and did not have enough time to study and do internships and continue to play/practice soccer.  They along with my DD have academics as the number one priority.  DD friend that is going to an Alabama university stopped soccer after her first year to focus on her civil engineering major.  School and getting good grades should always be the first priority.


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## Simisoccerfan (Aug 4, 2017)

My personal experience tells me that it takes a special kid to be able to playing college sports while studying engineering.  Most college degrees are easier and require a lot less time.  Challenge comes down to what your friends are doing.  Likely if your playing sports your closest friends will be those you are playing with.   Unless they are studying engineering they will have more free time then you.   Free time in college usually leads to a party and if your playing sports your fit and usually popular thus your invited.   It's Wednesday night and practice just ended.  Do you join your teammates heading to a party or go to the library to do 6 hours of Thermo homework?  There is only so much time in a day and something needs to give.  For me it was the sport after trying to make it work for three years.   For many kids its the degree.  They drop engineering and become a business major.   Funny thing how my youngest daughter wants to play college soccer and study engineering!  She is a pretty intense kid and is very focused so I think she has a chance but I told her that she should be prepared to sacrifice her social life since it won't be the same as her teammates.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 4, 2017)

Simisoccerfan said:


> My personal experience tells me that it takes a special kid to be able to playing college sports while studying engineering.  Most college degrees are easier and require a lot less time.  Challenge comes down to what your friends are doing.  Likely if your playing sports your closest friends will be those you are playing with.   Unless they are studying engineering they will have more free time then you.   Free time in college usually leads to a party and if your playing sports your fit and usually popular thus your invited.   It's Wednesday night and practice just ended.  Do you join your teammates heading to a party or go to the library to do 6 hours of Thermo homework?  There is only so much time in a day and something needs to give.  For me it was the sport after trying to make it work for three years.   For many kids its the degree.  They drop engineering and become a business major.   Funny thing how my youngest daughter wants to play college soccer and study engineering!  She is a pretty intense kid and is very focused so I think she has a chance but I told her that she should be prepared to sacrifice her social life since it won't be the same as her teammates.


You hit the nail on the head.  You need to have a group of friends that are doing the same thing as you and on the same life track.  One of my player's roommates is an engineering major and her and one of the others are life science majors.  They all spend plenty of time studying (they have mandatory study hall) and they do have social lives.  They KNOW that it can be done as one of her roommates has a parent that is a doctor and was a track star in college.  Her team has several STEM majors and honestly most of the roster are dean's list students.  It can happen it just requires a plan.


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## mirage (Aug 4, 2017)

There seems to be an underlying assumption that engineering/science degree is harder than other studies and many comments are made about how much work outside the classroom that comes with these degrees.

Frankly, I disagree with this belief.  I have BS and MS in engineering and MBA.  I know what it takes to get these degrees.  Also, I teach as a guest lecturer at one of our local universities' engineering college one day a week. I see how students work and see the quality of their work.  Those who get it, gets it and they jump out at you.  Similarly, those that don't get it also jumps out at you. 

The challenge is how to get those in between into those that gets it and not into the struggling group.  Most often it has to do with their learning style and how they learn than anything else.  Unfortunately, vast majority of students don't know how they learn.  They've done whatever the teacher required of them through high school.

If you take ANY subject and requirements to do work outside of classroom (e.g., reports, reading, HW or what have you), time is time.  There is no difference what's occupying the student's time.  It just takes time.  So stop making STEM into something more than what it is.

There's a natural selection for any given subject.  Those that succeed in STEM area have affinity to the subject and will understand the material just the way an accounting major student understands general ledger.  To those that understand science, its no more difficult than those that understands accounting - its just different. 

Our society has hinder STEM by hyping it and making everyone believe its hard.  The complexity of understanding the subject to any given student depends on the suitability of the subject versus the understanding ability of that individual.

I read years ago that its lot easier to teach engineers, finances than teach CPA's physics.  Perhaps but not necessarily is what I've found over the years.  It depends on the person.

So for every example of athlete failing in "hard" or engineering subject, there is a success story for those athletes that have an affinity for those hard subjects.  Perhaps the student was led to believe he/she wanted to be a chemist or engineer, when in fact his/her affinity should have led them to a liberal arts major.

Not the students fault for this.  We should not have to declare major when applying for college.  Its a stupid system.  Just take a look at the percentage of major changes once enrolled.

Leave you with two thoughts:
I worked on the average 32 hrs/wk during my entire college days.  Paid for school by working and did not take out student loan.  Most athletes don't put in more than 32 hrs/wk unofficially (officially it has to be much less).  There are many that work like I did and successfully completes engineering or science degree, not just athletes.

The other, my older kid reports to his preseason camp next week.  He is an incoming freshman that's majoring in Physic and Economics minor.  His favorite subject was physics in high school and it came natural to him.  He understands it much like another student understands history or accounting.  Having watched him how he understand subjects and how he learns, I have no concerns for him being college athlete and studies.  Not to say its a piece of cake, but he'll get it done. Struggles will be there but nothing he can't handle.

So time demand is time demand, regardless of if 6 hrs of thermodynamic or 6hrs of literature analysis.  Its how well the kid can manage the time.  The only caveat is game travel.  That's different.  Not only is it time consuming to travel,but, missing classes hurt.  Tutors are provided for athletes to shorten the struggle but there's no substitute for missing class lecture/time.  Again, this is study subject independent issue.


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## rainbow_unicorn (Aug 4, 2017)

mirage said:


> There seems to be an underlying assumption that engineering/science degree is harder than other studies and many comments are made about how much work outside the classroom that comes with these degrees.
> 
> Frankly, I disagree with this belief.  I have BS and MS in engineering and MBA.  I know what it takes to get these degrees.  Also, I teach as a guest lecturer at one of our local universities' engineering college one day a week. I see how students work and see the quality of their work.  Those who get it, gets it and they jump out at you.  Similarly, those that don't get it also jumps out at you.


I have to disagree...most STEM is harder and requires more hours.  I remember back in school that transferring from engineering to the business school was very competitive (required something like 3.7 GPA) since people were bailing after hitting the engineering weed out classes.  But the opposite (transferring into engineering) was easy w/ regards to GPA since nobody sane wanted to go into engineering due to the workload.


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## Lambchop (Aug 4, 2017)

Daniel Miller said:


> There is a reason why playing a collegiate sport is nearly impossible to do while studying a hard-science.  From personal experience, I can tell you what it takes to get a geology degree.  Most of your first two years are filled up with a couple of geology courses (Geol. 101 plus lab; Earth History plus lab), three calculus courses, four chemistry courses (one year of general chemistry; one year of organic chemistry), two biology courses (one year), three physics courses (three semesters) and breadth requirements.  You are always taking *at least* two hard-science courses with lab.  Most labs take about 2 hours to prep for, and two actual lab hours, twice per week.  In other words, that is 8 lab hours per science course, per week, and that usually means up to 16 hours per week just for your labs.
> 
> By the time you get to your third year, you are taking very demanding geology courses with labs, and nearly every course has required field trips twice per semester.  (The geology professors work together to get them all in on different weekends.)  So, if you are a soccer player in the Fall, you usually have at least 6 weekends where there will be a conflict between your games and your field work.
> 
> You can play collegiate soccer and get a degree in the sciences, but you better set aside about 5-6 years to do it.


So many majors require five years anyway, especially at public Universities.  If a student can take 2-3 AP science classes and score a 4 or 5  on the AP test, they can earn university credit at most schools, that would make a dent in the freshman requirements and free up the class load to take another requirement.


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## Fact (Aug 4, 2017)

Any driven kid can make the time to play a college sport. The problem is missing school for travel.  Certain majors have required labs and internships (generally STEM majors) that cannot be missed.  We've found certain Ivies to be more accommodating in this respect as they know that school comes first.


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## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

Surfref said:


> My DD will be starting her third of five years of college this fall and will be making it a Red Shirt year due to her academic load.  Her college soccer coach suggested the Red Shirt.  She is a dual major Kinesiology and Athletic Trainer with a goal of Doctorate in Physical Therapy and BS in Athletic Training.  This third year is the most difficult academically with 20 class units and 100 hours of internship required.  DD coach is using her as an extra coach to help the freshman mids and forwards adjust to the 4-3-3 formation they primarily play.  The coach is fine with DD missing practices and games if she has school work to complete.  DD has two friends that completely stopped college soccer after their sophomore year.  Both are nursing majors (Illinois and South Carolina colleges) and did not have enough time to study and do internships and continue to play/practice soccer.  They along with my DD have academics as the number one priority.  DD friend that is going to an Alabama university stopped soccer after her first year to focus on her civil engineering major.  School and getting good grades should always be the first priority.


Amen Surfref, I told me wife....if our DD picks a cheesy major, she might as well quit college soccer, pack her bags and transfer as a full-time student to UC Davis where she was accepted purely on her academic achievement.


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## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

Fact said:


> Any driven kid can make the time to play a college sport. The problem is missing school for travel.  Certain majors have required labs and internships (generally STEM majors) that cannot be missed.  We've found certain Ivies to be more accommodating in this respect as they know that school comes first.


You don't know what your posting about.  There are a couple of engineering majors on my DD's college team.  If an individual is gifted in mathematics....the class will be easy for them.  No different than soccer being easy for a YNT player.


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## Surfref (Aug 4, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Amen Surfref, I told me wife....if our DD picks a cheesy major, she might as well quit college soccer, pack her bags and transfer as a full-time student to UC Davis where she was accepted purely on her academic achievement.


The college major should be the number be reason for choosing a college.  Soccer should not be the first reason for picking a school.  The education will be more important in the long run than soccer.


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## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

mirage said:


> There seems to be an underlying assumption that engineering/science degree is harder than other studies and many comments are made about how much work outside the classroom that comes with these degrees.
> 
> Frankly, I disagree with this belief.  I have BS and MS in engineering and MBA.  I know what it takes to get these degrees.  Also, I teach as a guest lecturer at one of our local universities' engineering college one day a week. I see how students work and see the quality of their work.  Those who get it, gets it and they jump out at you.  Similarly, those that don't get it also jumps out at you.
> 
> ...


And for those who can't visual or comprehend what mirage is posting about.  It might be easier to watch the movie Good Will Hunting.


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## Surfref (Aug 4, 2017)

Surfref said:


> The college major should be the number be reason for choosing a college.  Soccer should not be the first reason for picking a school.  The education will be more important in the long run than soccer.


*number one reason


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## Fact (Aug 4, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> You don't know what your posting about.  There are a couple of engineering majors on my DD's college team.  If an individual is gifted in mathematics....the class will be easy for them.  No different than soccer being easy for a YNT player.


I guess you would even disagree with me if I say the sky is blue.

I understand the point that one major is not necessarily more difficult or time consuming for a kid that is gifted in that area. But for some majors (generally STEM) that have mandatory labs or internships, you cannot miss too many of them and if you are consistently missing Thursdays and Fridays for travel and games, that is a problem.  Sorry to break it to you but I do have personal experience in this area and know that the Ivies have been better accommodating and will help you get out in 4 with summer school.


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## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

Fact said:


> I guess you would even disagree with me if I say the sky is blue.
> 
> I understand the point that one major is not necessarily more difficult or time consuming for a kid that is gifted in that area. But for some majors (generally STEM) that have mandatory labs or internships, you cannot miss too many of them and if you are consistently missing Thursdays and Fridays for travel and games, that is a problem.  Sorry to break it to you but I do have personal experience in this area and know that the Ivies have been better accommodating and will help you get out in 4 with summer school.


Sorry to break the news to you, but at my DD's university the assigned athletic sports advisors know which classes are available throughout the season and will work with their schedule.  It has to fit between conditioning and strength training in the morning and practice in the afternoons.  They also know which professors will work with the student athlete knowing very well they will be missing class during the season.  They also know which professors will not accomodate the student athlete. Whoch leads to why the university has graduate students assigned as the team tutors to help the student athlete succeed. 

My wife works for a prestigous local D3 college and if a parent truly prefers their DDs focus on academics with the sports being 2nd.  D3 is the way to go!


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## The Driver (Aug 4, 2017)

Protip:
It's very important to find a Culture that matches your players goals. Wednesday night parties don't make sense to student-athletes. Stick to the goal...  books + soccer + rest= Growth/Development


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## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Sorry to break the news to you, but at my DD's university the assigned athletic sports advisors know which classes are available throughout the season and will work with their schedule.  It has to fit between conditioning and strength training in the morning and practice in the afternoons.  They also know which professors will work with the student athlete knowing very well they will be missing class during the season.  They also know which professors will not accomodate the student athlete. Whoch leads to why the university has graduate students assigned as the team tutors to help the student athlete succeed.
> 
> My wife works for a prestigous local D3 college and if a parent truly prefers their DDs focus on academics with the sports being 2nd.  D3 is the way to go!


I would also add and learned a university based on the academic quarter system is more advantageous for a D1 soccer student athlete vs the semester system.  The quarter system year doesn't start until mid September, but the soccer training season officially begins Aug 1st. By the time the fall quarter begins.  The soccer season is almost half over.  When Winter and Spring quarter rolls around....no more traveling and missing class and that's when the student athlete can talk the tougher STEM courses without worrying about absences.

So when looking at potential schools.....don't forget to research if he university is on a quarter or semster system.


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## The Driver (Aug 4, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> I would also add and learned a university based on the academic quarter system is more advantageous for a D1 soccer student athlete vs the semester system.  The quarter system year doesn't start until mid September, but the soccer training season officially begins Aug 1st. By the time the fall quarter begins.  The soccer season is almost half over.  When Winter and Spring quarter rolls around....no more traveling and missing class and that's when the student athlete can talk the tougher STEM courses without worrying about absences.
> 
> So when looking at potential schools.....don't forget to research if he university is on a quarter or semster system.


Protip via @NoGoal


----------



## Fact (Aug 4, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> I would also add and learned a university based on the academic quarter system is more advantageous for a D1 soccer student athlete vs the semester system.  The quarter system year doesn't start until mid September, but the soccer training season officially begins Aug 1st. By the time the fall quarter begins.  The soccer season is almost half over.  When Winter and Spring quarter rolls around....no more traveling and missing class and that's when the student athlete can talk the tougher STEM courses without worrying about absences.
> 
> So when looking at potential schools.....don't forget to research if he university is on a quarter or semster system.


Protip via Nogoal-  Forget everything said about picking the school for the best academic fit.  Rather only go to a quarter system school so that academics interfere the least with soccer.


----------



## Fact (Aug 4, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Sorry to break the news to you, but at my DD's university the assigned athletic sports advisors know which classes are available throughout the season and will work with their schedule.  It has to fit between conditioning and strength training in the morning and practice in the afternoons.  They also know which professors will work with the student athlete knowing very well they will be missing class during the season.  They also know which professors will not accomodate the student athlete. Whoch leads to why the university has graduate students assigned as the team tutors to help the student athlete succeed.
> 
> My wife works for a prestigous local D3 college and if a parent truly prefers their DDs focus on academics with the sports being 2nd.  D3 is the way to go!


Sorry to break it to you but I said the Ivies are "better accommodating."  I never said that schools don't work with their athletes. Of course they want them to keep up their grades and graduate because it helps their stats.  However at schools such as D1, sports play a bigger financial role in the school culture and thus an athlete's commitment to the sport is more rigid. At Ivies school come first.


----------



## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

Fact said:


> Protip via Nogoal-  Forget everything said about picking the school for the best academic fit.  Rather only go to a quarter system school so that academics interfere the least with soccer.


Now your just talking out of your ass.  Obviously by your post about the Ivy League that you didn't know Harvard and Princeton are semester systems.  

The UC Schools are fine institutions and are on the quarter system, in case you didn't know.  Look my DD goes to UDub and is ranked like #51 in the US news report and #11 in their world university ranking.  So, pipe down....because education is highly valued in my family.


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## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

Fact said:


> Sorry to break it to you but I said the Ivies are "better accommodating."  I never said that schools don't work with their athletes. Of course they want them to keep up their grades and graduate because it helps their stats.  However at schools such as D1, sports play a bigger financial role in the school culture and thus an athlete's commitment to the sport is more rigid. At Ivies school come first.


You are posting like you know!  I didn't know your ulittle was in college already.  Ivies are still a D1 sport, so don't forget that.  It's not just the Ivies you are painting as the more accomodating univerisites.  It's based on the culture of the univeristy and how their college athletics is ran.  This is where a family needs to weight all the options at their disposal when choosing which university and program fits best with their player.

Not every kid has the academic chops to gain admissions to an Ivy and in case you didn't know they bend their academic requirements for a stud soccer player too.


----------



## NoGoal (Aug 4, 2017)

FACT, your posts would carry more weight and credibility if your DD was committed, but that isn't the case. I spoke to a Ivy league coach...please, so did I during my DDs college recruiting years.

Surfref, GKrent, MAP's are a few parents in here that can provide insight, because their DD's are currently college student athletes.  Man, even CaliKlines posts have more credibility than yours and he is wrong more often than not.


----------



## MakeAPlay (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> I guess you would even disagree with me if I say the sky is blue.
> 
> I understand the point that one major is not necessarily more difficult or time consuming for a kid that is gifted in that area. But for some majors (generally STEM) that have mandatory labs or internships, you cannot miss too many of them and if you are consistently missing Thursdays and Fridays for travel and games, that is a problem.  Sorry to break it to you but I do have personal experience in this area and know that the Ivies have been better accommodating and will help you get out in 4 with summer school.


It's not just the Ivies that make accommodations idiot.  You just don't listen do you?


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> I guess you would even disagree with me if I say the sky is blue.
> 
> I understand the point that one major is not necessarily more difficult or time consuming for a kid that is gifted in that area. But for some majors (generally STEM) that have mandatory labs or internships, you cannot miss too many of them and if you are consistently missing Thursdays and Fridays for travel and games, that is a problem.  Sorry to break it to you but I do have personal experience in this area and know that the Ivies have been better accommodating and will help you get out in 4 with summer school.


What is your experience with Ivies for this? I assume your DD already passed admissions?


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 5, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> You are posting like you know!  I didn't know your ulittle was in college already.  Ivies are still a D1 sport, so don't forget that.  It's not just the Ivies you are painting as the more accomodating univerisites.  It's based on the culture of the univeristy and how their college athletics is ran.  This is where a family needs to weight all the options at their disposal when choosing which university and program fits best with their player.
> 
> Not every kid has the academic chops to gain admissions to an Ivy and in case you didn't know they bend their academic requirements for a stud soccer player too.


Won't name the sport but a number 1 recruit just signed to Harvard and everyone is shocked because the kid has a low GPA and lots of people are wondering how said student plans on graduating or even having a conversation while at this school. There was an article in the WSJ yesterday also about a top rated football recruit choosing Princeton over the SEC as well, and how the path to the NFL can be through an IVY. 
It can be argued that this is occurring in soccer and I feel sorry for players who are committing to places when they can't even pass an AP exam- or some never even tried. Why go to Stanford or Cal? What's the point ??? It's clearly not about the kids when I see that happening.


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 5, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> It's not just the Ivies that make accommodations idiot.  You just don't listen do you?


That's why I am very interested in his reply because maybe I am running with the wrong crowd but I hear the opposite. I hear that UCLA and company for example teach the players how to cook, train etc. they have a very inclusive player program. 
I hear the Ivies are opposite. 
Again not saying my affliliation but know for example one highly rated program that had a great 2017 makes zero accommodations for soccer. Zero. It's not glamorous so you must love the game. It's absolutely hypocritical because for their top three men's sports there are MAJOR accommodations given - test dates, travel is plane vs a bus, tutors, live in special housing. For the soccer girls it's hey welcome to the team here is great swag now go take your 18 units and see you evey day at 4.


----------



## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Now your just talking out of your ass.  Obviously by your post about the Ivy League that you didn't know Harvard and Princeton are semester systems.
> 
> The UC Schools are fine institutions and are on the quarter system, in case you didn't know.  Look my DD goes to UDub and is ranked like #51 in the US news report and #11 in their world university ranking.  So, pipe down....because education is highly valued in my family.


Now you are (not "your" dumbass) just talking out of your ass.  I never even implied whether the ivy League schools are semester or quarter based.  Moreover, not all UCs are on the quarter system.  Cal for one is on the semester system.  Sorry your family had to settle #51.


----------



## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> You are posting like you know!  I didn't know your ulittle was in college already.  Ivies are still a D1 sport, so don't forget that.  It's not just the Ivies you are painting as the more accomodating univerisites.  It's based on the culture of the univeristy and how their college athletics is ran.  This is where a family needs to weight all the options at their disposal when choosing which university and program fits best with their player.
> 
> Not every kid has the academic chops to gain admissions to an Ivy and in case you didn't know they bend their academic requirements for a stud soccer player too.


The assumptions you making are just amazing.  Maybe you have been taking MakeALoser's meds and are hallucinating? I never said I  had a ulittle.

As you state, the culture of the university determines how the athletic program is run.  This is where my family has found the Ivies over PAC-12 schools to be more accommodating.   I am not saying that the PAC-12 schools don't offer many of the same benefits to athletes, but in my families experience, the Ivies which generally put less pressure on their athletic departments, have been able to provide more flexibility.  

Here's an example.  Say our kid is pre-med and your school has the luxury of having a cadaver dissection class, but it is only offered in the fall with labs on Fridays.  How does your school handle your kid missing half of the classes for road trips?


----------



## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> FACT, your posts would carry more weight and credibility if your DD was committed, but that isn't the case. I spoke to a Ivy league coach...please, so did I during my DDs college recruiting years.
> 
> Surfref, GKrent, MAP's are a few parents in here that can provide insight, because their DD's are currently college student athletes.  Man, even CaliKlines posts have more credibility than yours and he is wrong more often than not.


Making assumptions of whether I have a daughter and whether she is committed just further confirms that you are an ass.  It is great that you spoke with an Ivy league coach but get back to me when your daughter has more than 5 days of college experience.


----------



## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> That's why I am very interested in his reply because maybe I am running with the wrong crowd but I hear the opposite. I hear that UCLA and company for example teach the players how to cook, train etc. they have a very inclusive player program.
> I hear the Ivies are opposite.
> Again not saying my affliliation but know for example one highly rated program that had a great 2017 makes zero accommodations for soccer. Zero. It's not glamorous so you must love the game. It's absolutely hypocritical because for their top three men's sports there are MAJOR accommodations given - test dates, travel is plane vs a bus, tutors, live in special housing. For the soccer girls it's hey welcome to the team here is great swag now go take your 18 units and see you evey day at 4.


Even when I went to a PAC-1o school 30 years ago they had great benefits for athletes as you mention.  I am not doubting that part.  I am just saying that in our families recent experience, the Ivies have been more understanding of conflicts with school due to the pressure many athletic departments have to get wins.


----------



## MakeAPlay (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Now you are (not "your" dumbass) just talking out of your ass.  I never even implied whether the ivy League schools are semester or quarter based.  Moreover, not all UCs are on the quarter system.  Cal for one is on the semester system.  Sorry your family had to settle #51.


Cal is the ONLY school in the UC system that isn't solely a grad school that is on the semester system.


----------



## MakeAPlay (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> The assumptions you making are just amazing.  Maybe you have been taking MakeALoser's meds and are hallucinating? I never said I  had a ulittle.
> 
> As you state, the culture of the university determines how the athletic program is run.  This is where my family has found the Ivies over PAC-12 schools to be more accommodating.   I am not saying that the PAC-12 schools don't offer many of the same benefits to athletes, but in my families experience, the Ivies which generally put less pressure on their athletic departments, have been able to provide more flexibility.
> 
> Here's an example.  Say our kid is pre-med and your school has the luxury of having a cadaver dissection class, but it is only offered in the fall with labs on Fridays.  How does your school handle your kid missing half of the classes for road trips?


Hey idiot maybe you didn't realize this but at big conference schools most have options so there isn't a situation where there is only ONE class that you can possibly take ALL year.  Stop with the hypothetical bull $hit.  You are talking out of your ass because you are butt hurt.


----------



## MakeAPlay (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Even when I went to a PAC-1o school 30 years ago they had great benefits for athletes as you mention.  I am not doubting that part.  I am just saying that in our families recent experience, the Ivies have been more understanding of conflicts with school due to the pressure many athletic departments have to get wins.


In non revenue sports the pressure to win isn't any more significant than the pressure to graduate players.  All of the PAC 12 schools are pretty good academically and keeping up their reputations are important.  Graduating players matters.  You are making huge ASSumptions idiot.  Clearly you have no RECENT experience to draw upon.


----------



## NoGoal (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Now you are (not "your" dumbass) just talking out of your ass.  I never even implied whether the ivy League schools are semester or quarter based.  Moreover, not all UCs are on the quarter system.  Cal for one is on the semester system.  Sorry your family had to settle #51.


Can't come up with anything original.  Obviously you can apply common sense.  My post where to guide you that it's not just the Ivies who accomodate a student athlete.  Maybe you don't realize that Ivies need to accomodate, because their fact'in classes are HARD.

How long did it take you to Google all of the UC system academic calenders to find CAL being a semester?  Doesn't make my statement false that UC schools are on quarter system and a quarter system is still more advantageous to a soccer student athlete than a semster system, especially for a STEM student.

Settling for #51, ha...you should worry more, if your DD will be recruited and offered to play college soccer.  

Since, you brought it up. I will tell the the other 2 schools my DD was weighing, but decided to cross them off her list.  Northwestern, my DD is fine with rain, but realized that 5-8 feet of snow during the winter didn't sound fun.  Columbia, but realize she didn't want to go the East Coast and that far away from home.  Also, Ivies don't offer athletic scholarships and my family would not qualify ANY financial assistance, because my wife and I make to much. UC Davis, my DD didn't like the coach, but loved the campus. Pepperdine, love the coaches and campus, but was a small school and lacked a football team.  UCI, my DD loved Scott Juniper, but wasn't feeling the campus vibe and this was the University I wanted her to pick.

You see, my family weighed everything from elite schools, in state, midwest, east coast, big and small, private and public schools. Ultimately, she decide on Washington, because it was the best fit for her and had everything she wanted.  So settling, nice try!


----------



## NoGoal (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> The assumptions you making are just amazing.  Maybe you have been taking MakeALoser's meds and are hallucinating? I never said I  had a ulittle.
> 
> As you state, the culture of the university determines how the athletic program is run.  This is where my family has found the Ivies over PAC-12 schools to be more accommodating.   I am not saying that the PAC-12 schools don't offer many of the same benefits to athletes, but in my families experience, the Ivies which generally put less pressure on their athletic departments, have been able to provide more flexibility.
> 
> Here's an example.  Say our kid is pre-med and your school has the luxury of having a cadaver dissection class, but it is only offered in the fall with labs on Fridays.  How does your school handle your kid missing half of the classes for road trips?


Please you post a lot in the Ulittle thread.

Have you ever put some thought maybe the Ivies are accomodating, because they know just how difficult their classes are!  Thanks for your example of a semester system and validating my point that a quarter system is more advantageous for a soccer student athlete.  I highly doubt your cadaver dissecting class  example will only be offered in the Fall quarter, but yeah that can happen in a semster calender year.  

This is where a parent has to weigh if that university is the right fit for their DD or not, maybe and the wisest decision if the ultimate goal is to be a physician.....DO NOT play a SPORT in college!


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## espola (Aug 5, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Please you post a lot in the Ulittle thread.
> 
> Have you ever put some thought maybe the Ivies are accomodating, because they know just how difficult their classes are!  Thanks for your example of a semester system and validating my point that a quarter system is more advantageous for a soccer student athlete.  I highly doubt your cadaver dissecting class  example will only be offered in the Fall quarter, but yeah that can happen in a semster calender year.
> 
> This is where a parent has to weigh if that university is the right fit for their DD or not, maybe and the wisest decision if the ultimate goal is to be a physician.....DO NOT play a SPORT in college!


My son's soccer team at UC Davis had a pre-med student who stuck with both sides - playing soccer and succeeding as a student.  His path was a little non-typical, however.  He did not attend UCD primarily to play soccer, even though he had played well enough in high school and youth club soccer.  As a result, he didn't go out for the team his Freshman year, concentrating on academics.  He became a fullup team member the next year, and started a run of 4 years on the All-Conference Academic team, the last three of which were also NCAA All-American Academic.  Because he didn't play his Freshman year, he was able to get the year of competition back in his first year at UC Davis Med School.


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## NoGoal (Aug 5, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> What is your experience with Ivies for this? I assume your DD already passed admissions?


I personally would like to hear Zerodenero's take on this, since his DD is committed to an Ivy League School vs a parent who's kid isn't committed to an Ivy league school or just isn't committed period.


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## soccerobserver (Aug 5, 2017)

Dargle said:


> Many moons ago, I was recruited to play soccer at a fairly prestigious D3 college with a fearsome reputation for academics.  It was starting play in a new conference that required air travel, overnight stays etc to lots of its games.  I asked about how that would fit with taking lab sciences, since the lab portions of the courses were often offered toward the end of the week in late afternoon time slots.  The coach hemmed and hawed a little.  He conceded that it would be difficult and you might have to miss some sessions to make it work.  This is probably still an issue and even more so in the D1 colleges with even more extensive travel.  Students can make up for it by loading up on those courses in the offseason or in summer, but it's not easy.  My guess is that it's not so much that the students are lazy and taking what you characterize as "easy degrees" (although I disagree with that characterization as a blanket statement - I know plenty of STEM oriented students who would die with the reading/research/writing requirements of a liberal arts major -- the view of these majors as "easy" usually is more about the ability to get a certain grade because of the department's curve rather than the amount of work or the difficulty of doing it very well), but they are forced to balance the requirements of soccer and classes and they end up constructing schedules/majors that permit for both.


Dargle, which conference? Extensive travel is not typical of D3 conferences. The UAA D3 conference is the only one I can think of with great academic schools and air travel for regular games. But most of the top D3 academic institutions do not involve heavy travel schedules. UAA Conference includes the University of Chicago, Brandeis, Wash U and Carnegie Mellon etc.


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## Livinthedream (Aug 5, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> Can't come up with anything original.  Obviously you can apply common sense.  My post where to guide you that it's not just the Ivies who accomodate a student athlete.  Maybe you don't realize that Ivies need to accomodate, because their fact'in classes are HARD.
> 
> How long did it take you to Google all of the UC system academic calenders to find CAL being a semester?  Doesn't make my statement false that UC schools are on quarter system and a quarter system is still more advantageous to a soccer student athlete than a semster system, especially for a STEM student.
> 
> ...


NG...don't get roped in...no need to explain to someone who has no credibility. Washington at #51 is pretty Damn good. UDub was one of my DD's choices, but at the end it came down to where she felt more comfortable. Great School your DD will love her experience...who knows, if she doesn't like it she can always transfer to a warmer school in Santa Barbara...lol.


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## Livinthedream (Aug 5, 2017)

Livinthedream said:


> NG...don't get roped in...no need to explain to someone who has no credibility. Washington at #51 is pretty Damn good. UDub was one of my DD's choices, but at the end it came down to where she felt more comfortable. Great School your DD will love her experience...who knows, if she doesn't like it she can always transfer to a warmer school in Santa Barbara...lol.


Just for fun:
https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/top-public


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## The Driver (Aug 5, 2017)

A good online fist fight brings the best out of the socal soccer forum. Almost like a good diss tape .


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## Round (Aug 5, 2017)

Aside from all of the usual b.s. some spout here to support their choices, these lists are probably not the best tool to judge a school.


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## NoGoal (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Making assumptions of whether I have a daughter and whether she is committed just further confirms that you are an ass.  It is great that you spoke with an Ivy league coach but get back to me when your daughter has more than 5 days of college experience.


Numbnuts, my DD has been there for 5 weeks and NOT 5 days.  They have a freshmen summer school program for the student athletes acclimate and get a glimpse of being a college student by taking 2 GE classes.


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## Striker17 (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Even when I went to a PAC-1o school 30 years ago they had great benefits for athletes as you mention.  I am not doubting that part.  I am just saying that in our families recent experience, the Ivies have been more understanding of conflicts with school due to the pressure many athletic departments have to get wins.


That's good I hear you on that if you are talking about a large D1 vs a smaller one. I think though at the end of the day- and this may be a huge assumption so correct me if this hasn't been your experience- that an Ivy would not be sympathetic to an athletes plight unless they were in "specific classes".
I honestly don't know anymore. People got signed to Stanford this year with low GPA and scores so what I once thought could be outdated


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## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> It's not just the Ivies that make accommodations idiot.  You just don't listen do you?


You are the idiot. I never said other schools do not make accommodations.  I only said that our families experience with the Ivies it that they have been BETTER at making accommodations.  You are so full of hate, you have absolutely no objectivity.


----------



## pooka (Aug 5, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> That's why I am very interested in his reply because maybe I am running with the wrong crowd but I hear the opposite. I hear that UCLA and company for example teach the players how to cook, train etc. they have a very inclusive player program.
> I hear the Ivies are opposite.
> Again not saying my affliliation but know for example one highly rated program that had a great 2017 makes zero accommodations for soccer. Zero. It's not glamorous so you must love the game. It's absolutely hypocritical because for their top three men's sports there are MAJOR accommodations given - test dates, travel is plane vs a bus, tutors, live in special housing. For the soccer girls it's hey welcome to the team here is great swag now go take your 18 units and see you evey day at 4.


Please share which program this is.... that's good info


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## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> Cal is the ONLY school in the UC system that isn't solely a grad school that is on the semester system.


Wrong again jackass.  You act like you know everything but you don't know jack.  Cal is not the only UC on the semester system for undergrads.


----------



## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> Hey idiot maybe you didn't realize this but at big conference schools most have options so there isn't a situation where there is only ONE class that you can possibly take ALL year.  Stop with the hypothetical bull $hit.  You are talking out of your ass because you are butt hurt.


Wrong again jackass.  Look at any college's upper division classes.  Not every class is offered every semester/quarter.


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## Fact (Aug 5, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> That's good I hear you on that if you are talking about a large D1 vs a smaller one. I think though at the end of the day- and this may be a huge assumption so correct me if this hasn't been your experience- that an Ivy would not be sympathetic to an athletes plight unless they were in "specific classes".
> I honestly don't know anymore. People got signed to Stanford this year with low GPA and scores so what I once thought could be outdated


Of course it depends on the sport, mens v. womens, where the player fits into the team's hierarchy, and the coach. I would suggest to be honest with your goals before committing to any school to make sure your goals align with coach and you should be just fine.  What a lot of people overlook it that many coaches are looking for the next best thing.  So wins are very important to them and thus they may not be so accommodating if their star player misses games.


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## pooka (Aug 5, 2017)

Another view is, not everyone needs or wants to be in the stem field. Believe it or not we need additional people in other professions. So although it's good to try and check what majors the soccer team has, STEM isn't the be all end all. 

And to the person upthread who said that anything liberal arts or non-science was easy, you sound crazy.


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## NoGoal (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Wrong again jackass.  Look at any college's upper division classes.  Not every class is offered every semester/quarter.


You need to look at yourself in the mirror.  You're the heated one and posting jackass.  We have your goat!


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## NoGoal (Aug 5, 2017)

Fact said:


> Of course it depends on the sport, mens v. womens, where the player fits into the team's hierarchy, and the coach. I would suggest to be honest with your goals before committing to any school to make sure your goals align with coach and you should be just fine.  What a lot of people overlook it that many coaches are looking for the next best thing.  So wins are very important to them and thus they may not be so accommodating if their star player misses games.


Numbnuts, all college coaches care about the W's.  It's how they renew their contract, fired or are forced to resign. 

Since, you are worried about your DD missing upper division cadavar dissecting class.   I highly suggest, she commits to a school where she isn't the star player.  Best if she is a preferred walk-on!   Geez all you had to do was follow your own advice, problem solved....sheesh!


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> Wrong again jackass.  You act like you know everything but you don't know jack.  Cal is not the only UC on the semester system for undergrads.


If you are talking about Merced then you got me.  I'm not even sure if they play soccer.  You are still a poser turd who is butt hurt about something and spends a ton of time making shit up.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> You are the idiot. I never said other schools do not make accommodations.  I only said that our families experience with the Ivies it that they have been BETTER at making accommodations.  You are so full of hate, you have absolutely no objectivity.


Full of hate?  Stop reflecting your feelings back on me Trump.  If your family has had experience with an Ivy it isn't in soccer so stop trying to draw comparisons.  No two sports are alike you idiot.  Whatever sport your other kid played you are in a different arena now.

It is so clear that you have no clue.  Keep focusing on the minutiae..,


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## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> Of course it depends on the sport, mens v. womens, where the player fits into the team's hierarchy, and the coach. I would suggest to be honest with your goals before committing to any school to make sure your goals align with coach and you should be just fine.  What a lot of people overlook it that many coaches are looking for the next best thing.  So wins are very important to them and thus they may not be so accommodating if their star player misses games.


Of course they are- you have to earn it every year. I was just asking about the Ivies because the kids I have known who went or are going and just started are enjoying the moment but they have to be in love with the game because it's not like being a player at UCLA for example where they have cooking classes etc. 
What I am saying in a round about way is that they are playing soccer and then having a higher workload academically. I am extremely curious to watch LR this season Princeton committ as she was a fanstastic student and player. I am also curious to watch LH at Gtown because again know the family and she's a bright gal. I want to see how they progress and the feedback we get. 
My neighbors boy committed to Colombia last year for football- a local stud. Went out, started the season and then realized they played at 0500 on a cold field or in a gym and quit. My other side had a local stud volleyball player committ to Bucknell and came home in Jan too because of being bored in the middle of nowhere. Now both are at USC and happy as can be so it goes to show you some of these kids aren't ready to leave Cali! The parents are happy he kids are happy but sick that so much time and money was wasted - they knew they were not "good enough" to be athletes at USC but at the time he kids wanted to play.


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## Lambchop (Aug 6, 2017)

Surfref said:


> The college major should be the number be reason for choosing a college.  Soccer should not be the first reason for picking a school.  The education will be more important in the long run than soccer.





Striker17 said:


> That's good I hear you on that if you are talking about a large D1 vs a smaller one. I think though at the end of the day- and this may be a huge assumption so correct me if this hasn't been your experience- that an Ivy would not be sympathetic to an athletes plight unless they were in "specific classes".
> I honestly don't know anymore. People got signed to Stanford this year with low GPA and scores so what I once thought could be outdated


What "people" are you referring to?


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## Lambchop (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> That's why I am very interested in his reply because maybe I am running with the wrong crowd but I hear the opposite. I hear that UCLA and company for example teach the players how to cook, train etc. they have a very inclusive player program.
> I hear the Ivies are opposite.
> Again not saying my affliliation but know for example one highly rated program that had a great 2017 makes zero accommodations for soccer. Zero. It's not glamorous so you must love the game. It's absolutely hypocritical because for their top three men's sports there are MAJOR accommodations given - test dates, travel is plane vs a bus, tutors, live in special housing. For the soccer girls it's hey welcome to the team here is great swag now go take your 18 units and see you evey day at 4.


Please do tell.  What highly rated program makes zero accommodations for female soccer players.  We all need to know.


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

Lamb chop you seem so angry this morning. If you think I am outing a nice girl who barely passed high school you are incorrect!
As far as zero accommodations I believe that a swag bag and gear doesn't count. They are not given any extra help more so than other people on their same campus. 
Want to be snarky? You picked the wrong horse to do that with as I have a lot of experience with this.


----------



## pooka (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> Lamb chop you seem so angry this morning. If you think I am outing a nice girl who barely passed high school you are incorrect!
> As far as zero accommodations I believe that a swag bag and gear doesn't count. They are not given any extra help more so than other people on their same campus.
> Want to be snarky? You picked the wrong horse to do that with as I have a lot of experience with this.


not to be snarky, and I certainly don't want you to out a young lady, but I was EXTREMELY interested in knowing which school does not make any accommodations for the women soccer players. thats a major thing. because even though its a non revenue sport, the ladies still have to travel and miss classes. a school that made no allowances for that would be something to know about.


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

What is your definition  of accommodations let's start with that ? 
 I do not feel that early registration, early housing prefs, or professor preference are accommodations.  I think that should be a basic thing that occurs when you have a D1 athlete playing for your institution.
How my curiosity was peaked and my question was not answered by FACT was that he stated the Ivies were making accommodations. I want to know which one he was talking about because every single athlete I have spoken to has stated otherwise hence my curiosity was peaked about the level of accomadations. 
Now some people may think that early housing, early reg, afternoon practices with a Panera dinner is accommodating. I don't when juxtaposed against the male athletes at the same school getting any number of extra trainers, recovery, financial management, marketing exposure...you name it.


----------



## pooka (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> What is your definition  of accommodations let's start with that ?
> I do not feel that early registration, early housing prefs, or professor preference are accommodations.  I think that should be a basic thing that occurs when you have a D1 athlete playing for your institution.
> How my curiosity was peaked and my question was not answered by FACT was that he stated the Ivies were making accommodations. I want to know which one he was talking about because every single athlete I have spoken to has stated otherwise hence my curiosity was peaked about the level of accomadations.
> Now some people may think that early housing, early reg, afternoon practices with a Panera dinner is accommodating. I don't when juxtaposed against the male athletes at the same school getting any number of extra trainers, recovery, financial management, marketing exposure...you name it.


Gotcha! Granted I'm the parent of a UMiddle (u15) and still learning. 
In my mind, for a women's, non revenue sport,I in no way expect to get the same thing as the football and basketball players. It's just the way it is. So in my young mind I thought the priority housing and registrations and tutoring and all that were accommodations. I'll be honest and say when I'm looking at schools, I'm looking to see if the football or basketball money trickles down so that the women at least have nice facilities. Which is why you look at USC and go "wtf" because every other sport there has a nice ass facility, but soccer is relegated to a field down the street with 4 bleachers. I know they have the money....


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

pooka said:


> Gotcha! Granted I'm the parent of a UMiddle (u15) and still learning.
> In my mind, for a women's, non revenue sport,I in no way expect to get the same thing as the football and basketball players. It's just the way it is. So in my young mind I thought the priority housing and registrations and tutoring and all that were accommodations. I'll be honest and say when I'm looking at schools, I'm looking to see if the football or basketball money trickles down so that the women at least have nice facilities. Which is why you look at USC and go "wtf" because every other sport there has a nice ass facility, but soccer is relegated to a field down the street with 4 bleachers. I know they have the money....


I agree if I say zero that's not accurate per se. I was comparing and so that isn't correct. In the schools that I am looking at the soccer players do not have different dorms than others and they are on the same housing plan. Meanwhile the men's sports live in the best apartments on campus lol! 
I feel like priority registration of course is an accomadations but I felt like it should happen. 
Sorry for my broad brush


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

To redirect this whole thing for started because Fact felt as if the Ivies were better for making accomadations. I find that extremely promising and so I was happy to hear that. 
I have found that the big soccer schools like UWUB and UCLA et all are just over the top! Watch their social media! These girls are having the experience of a lifetime and is preseason! I am just very impressed and I don't see it in the other social media accounts- doesn't mean it's not happening I just don't see it


----------



## MakeAPlay (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> To redirect this whole thing for started because Fact felt as if the Ivies were better for making accomadations. I find that extremely promising and so I was happy to hear that.
> I have found that the big soccer schools like UWUB and UCLA et all are just over the top! Watch their social media! These girls are having the experience of a lifetime and is preseason! I am just very impressed and I don't see it in the other social media accounts- doesn't mean it's not happening I just don't see it


I saw a few smiles today.  It's hard not to like those schools.


----------



## Lambchop (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> Lamb chop you seem so angry this morning. If you think I am outing a nice girl who barely passed high school you are incorrect!
> As far as zero accommodations I believe that a swag bag and gear doesn't count. They are not given any extra help more so than other people on their same campus.
> Want to be snarky? You picked the wrong horse to do that with as I have a lot of experience with this.


I am quite serious.  If you state something like that please be specific.  There will be plenty of families who want to know, especially if given the opportunity between a couple of schools.  


Striker17 said:


> Lamb chop you seem so angry this morning. If you think I am outing a nice girl who barely passed high school you are incorrect!
> As far as zero accommodations I believe that a swag bag and gear doesn't count. They are not given any extra help more so than other people on their same campus.
> Want to be snarky? You picked the wrong horse to do that with as I have a lot of experience with this.


Most students keep their GPA's private.  Schools do not release that information for minors. Was your daughter in classes with her?  Or did she tell you personally?


----------



## The Driver (Aug 6, 2017)

Btw it was chicken shit to put the young lady out there like that. Ijs


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

No it's not- it's reality. 
Don't like the truth don't follow me. 
Grades matter to me and my family- they don't always to a school and some of you are delusional if you think they do. 
Additionally life isn't fair- so it's cute that some of you think that all Ivies and top schools want a good GPA but let's get real here. 
If I posted her name or school or any identifying factor it would be BS but I didn't so spare me your crap


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

Lambchop said:


> I am quite serious.  If you state something like that please be specific.  There will be plenty of families who want to know, especially if given the opportunity between a couple of schools.
> 
> 
> Most students keep their GPA's private.  Schools do not release that information for minors. Was your daughter in classes with her?  Or did she tell you personally?


 If I told you I would not expose it. I won't. 
If you have any questions then I am sure once you go for an ID visit or meet with admission counselors it will become obvious. Now you know what questions to ask.


----------



## The Driver (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> No it's not- it's reality.
> Don't like the truth don't follow me.
> Grades matter to me and my family- they don't always to a school and some of you are delusional if you think they do.
> Additionally life isn't fair- so it's cute that some of you think that all Ivies and top schools want a good GPA but let's get real here.
> If I posted her name or school or any identifying factor it would be BS but I didn't so spare me your crap


It's still chicken shit.


----------



## Striker17 (Aug 6, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> I saw a few smiles today.  It's hard not to like those schools.


Make up and hair done ! OH MY they looked like movie stars. Did you see SD video- laughing  love that ones spirit. Seems to me like all of them do a very fine job of balancing a great education with athletics and social life. Very special group.


----------



## Multi Sport (Aug 6, 2017)

Grades matter more at some schools then others. Do your homework to find out, especially if your kid is looking at the school. Not all schools look at weighted GPA's so if your kid knows the schools that they want to attend find out.

Quick note: At one of the major soccer power schools for women out east they are in danger of losing their field. Why? Because they are a much bigger football program and they are looking to build a new fooltball stadium and the soccer pitch is a prime location. Let's face it, football brings in the money.


----------



## The Driver (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> If I posted her name or school or any identifying factor it would be BS but I didn't so spare me your crap


You whispered it and that was chicken shit.


----------



## eastbaysoccer (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> No it's not- it's reality.
> Don't like the truth don't follow me.
> Grades matter to me and my family- they don't always to a school and some of you are delusional if you think they do.
> Additionally life isn't fair- so it's cute that some of you think that all Ivies and top schools want a good GPA but let's get real here.
> If I posted her name or school or any identifying factor it would be BS but I didn't so spare me your crap


http://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2017/08/05/i-faked-being-black-to-get-into-med-school.cnn

Life isn't fair see the video.


----------



## Multi Sport (Aug 6, 2017)

ATRTDT said:


> Your right. Real life doesn't care about GPA's.
> 
> The worst student who graduates medical school is still a doctor when all is said and done.
> 
> If your wanted by a school for athletics for any sport they will find a way if you meet the minimum criteria.


Yep... but what's the minimum criteria? Also, some schools will be able to offer your kid more if they have a better GPA.


----------



## eastbaysoccer (Aug 6, 2017)

Multi Sport said:


> Yep... but what's the minimum criteria? Also, some schools will be able to offer your kid more if they have a better GPA.



 I knew a football player that was being recruited by Occidental.  They told him a 27 ACT gets you in.  Anything lower they could not help him.


----------



## eastbaysoccer (Aug 6, 2017)

Multi Sport said:


> Yep... but what's the minimum criteria? Also, some schools will be able to offer your kid more if they have a better GPA.


 The better you academic record the less athletic money he/ she has to give you as your kid will qualify for academic  money.  I don't think we will ever know the minimum for sure.


----------



## Lambchop (Aug 6, 2017)

Lambchop said:


> What "people" are you referring to?





Striker17 said:


> If I told you I would not expose it. I won't.
> If you have any questions then I am sure once you go for an ID visit or meet with admission counselors it will become obvious. Now you know what questions to ask.


Been there done that.


----------



## NoGoal (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> No it's not- it's reality.
> Don't like the truth don't follow me.
> Grades matter to me and my family- they don't always to a school and some of you are delusional if you think they do.
> Additionally life isn't fair- so it's cute that some of you think that all Ivies and top schools want a good GPA but let's get real here.
> If I posted her name or school or any identifying factor it would be BS but I didn't so spare me your crap


You are correct, I know a player who did not get admitted into Stanford and Stanford's GPA to be admitted as a women's soccer student athlete is a 3.50.  She then committed to Harvard a couple months later and is on their roster now.  So, she didn't get into Stanford with < a 3.50 GPA, but was admitted to Harvard.


----------



## NoGoal (Aug 6, 2017)

ATRTDT said:


> Your right. Real life doesn't care about GPA's.
> 
> The worst student who graduates medical school is still a doctor when all is said and done.
> 
> If your wanted by a school for athletics for any sport they will find a way if you meet the minimum criteria.


They maybe be a Doctor on paper after graduating from medical school, but can't practice until they pass the board!


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## The Driver (Aug 6, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> They maybe be a Doctor on paper after graduating from medical school, but can't practice until they pass the board!


 Not a Doctor until you pass the board.


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## Fact (Aug 6, 2017)

@Striker going back to my original point, better accommodations for us is flexibility missing/rescheduling some training and making other arrangements for games due to internships and classes.  Those are the only accommodations we care about as school comes first due to the desire to get out in at most 4 1/2 years and for graduate school.  Cooking classes and the other pansy stuff is BS as far as we are concerned.  If someone feels the need for the fluff great, but for us it is about getting a good education while having fun continuing to do a sport that is enjoyed.


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## NoGoal (Aug 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> @Striker going back to my original point, better accommodations for us is flexibility missing/rescheduling some training and making other arrangements for games due to internships and classes.  Those are the only accommodations we care about as school comes first due to the desire to get out in at most 4 1/2 years and for graduate school.  Cooking classes and the other pansy stuff is BS as far as we are concerned.  If someone feels the need for the fluff great, but for us it is about getting a good education while having fun continuing to do a sport that is enjoyed.


Then don't have your DD play a varsity sport in college.  Sounds like she is more suited playing on the womens club soccer team or intramural soccer team.


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## Surfref (Aug 6, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> There was an article in the WSJ yesterday also about a top rated football recruit choosing Princeton over the SEC as well, and how the path to the NFL can be through an IVY.
> It can be argued that this is occurring in soccer and I feel sorry for players who are committing to places when they can't even pass an AP exam- or some never even tried. Why go to Stanford or Cal? What's the point ??? It's clearly not about the kids when I see that happening.


(Sarcasm) Maybe these Ivy League school will have a special major for the star athletes that score below a combined SAT of 400.  They could have majors in Fast Food cook and register worker, how to restock clothes at Marshals, Busboy 101.

DD had a teammate her last two years that accepted a soccer scholarship to a very respected academic D2.  She failed out after the first semester.  Her combined (3 scores) SAT was 590.  At least she chose a very respectable profession after failing out and a good way to learn and make decent pay.  She joined the Air Force.  She was recently advanced to E4, Senior Airman, as a firefighter.  She also plays soccer for the base team that plays other bases in the D.C., Virginia, Maryland area.  

We may all hope our kids go to college, get a good graduate, post grad and even doctorate degree, but sometimes life throws a wrench in the plans.  At that point I am sure most of us would support our kids and try to help them move forward and support their choices.  

I graduated from UCLA with an electrical engineering degree and could not get anyone to hire me at a decent wage.  After 9 months of being told I needed more experience I joined the Navy.  That was the beginning of a great 30+ year career with the Navy that took me all over the world and had me do things I never thought I was capable of.  

Some of our kids may go on to be soccer superstars, some may never play as an adult, but we will all still love them and support them.


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## Livinthedream (Aug 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> @Striker going back to my original point, better accommodations for us is flexibility missing/rescheduling some training and making other arrangements for games due to internships and classes.  Those are the only accommodations we care about as school comes first due to the desire to get out in at most 4 1/2 years and for graduate school.  Cooking classes and the other pansy stuff is BS as far as we are concerned.  If someone feels the need for the fluff great, but for us it is about getting a good education while having fun continuing to do a sport that is enjoyed.


You keep saying "us"...what position do you play? Also is it crowded in the dorm room with you and your DD sharing the college experience. I bet she must love you planning her future, you sound like a lot of fun...for a Dick.


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## NoGoal (Aug 6, 2017)

Surfref said:


> (Sarcasm) Maybe these Ivy League school will have a special major for the star athletes that score below a combined SAT of 400.  They could have majors in Fast Food cook and register worker, how to restock clothes at Marshals, Busboy 101.
> 
> DD had a teammate her last two years that accepted a soccer scholarship to a very respected academic D2.  She failed out after the first semester.  Her combined (3 scores) SAT was 590.  At least she chose a very respectable profession after failing out and a good way to learn and make decent pay.  She joined the Air Force.  She was recently advanced to E4, Senior Airman, as a firefighter.  She also plays soccer for the base team that plays other bases in the D.C., Virginia, Maryland area.
> 
> ...


What is wrong with being a stock boy at Marshals?


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## NoGoal (Aug 6, 2017)

Livinthedream said:


> You keep saying "us"...what position do you play? Also is it crowded in the dorm room with you and your DD sharing the college experience. I bet she must love you planning her future, you sound like a lot of fun...for a Dick.


I was thinking that too.  What would happen if Fact's DD didn't want to go to an Ivy League School.  Better yet, what if she didn't want to register for cadavar dissecting class?  He has her life all mapped out for her, poor kid!


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## genesis (Aug 6, 2017)

There is a reason why schools with demanding academic programs have athletics.


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## GoWest (Aug 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> Cooking classes and the other pansy stuff


Hey, better be careful here....Chef Gordon Ramsay may have a different opinion. Culinary arts are by no means "pansy classes" IMHO. Everyone appreciates a fine meal cooked to perfection in occasion, right?


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## espola (Aug 6, 2017)

GoWest said:


> Hey, better be careful here....Chef Gordon Ramsay may have a different opinion. Culinary arts are by no means "pansy classes" IMHO. Everyone appreciates a fine meal cooked to perfection in occasion, right?


You can get a degree from Cornell in Hotel Administration.

https://sha.cornell.edu/admissions-programs/


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## NoGoal (Aug 6, 2017)

espola said:


> You can get a degree from Cornell in Hotel Administration.
> 
> https://sha.cornell.edu/admissions-programs/


No need to go that far.  Cal Poly Pomona Collins College of Hospitality and Mgm't has a great culinary school.  The student chiefs have jobs lined up before they graduate.  If anyone wants an affordable fine dining experience. You will be pleasantly surprised what a great meal the students prepare.

http://www.cpp.edu/~rkr/
http://www.cpp.edu/~rkr/cuisine/index.shtml


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## Striker17 (Aug 7, 2017)

This is the most anyone has ever discussed the process so I am thankful for the insights. I have found it to be a very hush hush process and everyone is very tight lipped in soccer. I have found in other athletics and even with boys people are much more open and vocal about who is going where and what they are trying for.  I appreciate the general info from vets in the soccer world.


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## Striker17 (Aug 7, 2017)

Fact said:


> @Striker going back to my original point, better accommodations for us is flexibility missing/rescheduling some training and making other arrangements for games due to internships and classes.  Those are the only accommodations we care about as school comes first due to the desire to get out in at most 4 1/2 years and for graduate school.  Cooking classes and the other pansy stuff is BS as far as we are concerned.  If someone feels the need for the fluff great, but for us it is about getting a good education while having fun continuing to do a sport that is enjoyed.


I understand this completely. I have heard the same to be true - I guess it's pretty sad when our version of accomadations is another schools version of basic ha! 
I was thinking a lot about it yesterday though and it makes sense because those superstars at USC or Stanford etc really do represent the NT players etc. I would expect them to have all that they do. 
Only recently did Princeton have a top 100 football committ who passed over Power 5 schools and it made the national news on multiple outlets. 
It's all about finding the right fit


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## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

Striker17 said:


> This is the most anyone has ever discussed the process so I am thankful for the insights. I have found it to be a very hush hush process and everyone is very tight lipped in soccer. I have found in other athletics and even with boys people are much more open and vocal about who is going where and what they are trying for.  I appreciate the general info from vets in the soccer world.


It makes sense from a college coach's standpoint that he is not going to divulge his recruiting plans and tactics.  And soccer is not a headcount sport, where every student athlete receiving funds in a sport gets the same amount direct from the athletic department budget.  A soccer coach can partition a single "scholarship" out to several players, and can tap other campus (and non-campus) funding sources, such as academic awards and financial need support, as long as no player receives more than the full athletic department award for a player on a headcount team.  He can "finance" a new recruit by cutting an existing player, or reducing several players' amounts, in the upcoming year.

These extra sources make the big rich schools (the 8 Ivy League schools, plus other notable examples such as Northwestern and Stanford) to follow the old maxim that if you can get in, you and your family can afford it.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 7, 2017)

espola said:


> These extra sources make the big rich schools (the 8 Ivy League schools, plus other notable examples such as Northwestern and Stanford) to follow the old maxim that if you can get in, you and your family can afford it.


You clearly don't have experience with Stanford and their athletic awards because any athletic award you get reduces any need based award that you might have receive dollar for dollar.  They have need based money available for families with incomes all the way up to $200k.  That can still be cost prohibitive for families and here is an example.  Let's say you have a dual income family that does $180k a year.  Even if the player gets 75% in athletic aid that would reduce any need based award to zero and the family would still have to come up with $23k a year for their player to go there.  For schools like that  (not the Ivies) it is better to either be rich and really talented or needy (or have a big family) and be really talented.  The middle 80% needs to have a pretty good college saving account ($100k+) AND get at least a 50% offer.


----------



## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> You clearly don't have experience with Stanford and their athletic awards because any athletic award you get reduces any need based award that you might have receive dollar for dollar.  They have need based money available for families with incomes all the way up to $200k.  That can still be cost prohibitive for families and here is an example.  Let's say you have a dual income family that does $180k a year.  Even if the player gets 75% in athletic aid that would reduce any need based award to zero and the family would still have to come up with $23k a year for their player to go there.  For schools like that  (not the Ivies) it is better to either be rich and really talented or needy (or have a big family) and be really talented.  The middle 80% needs to have a pretty good college saving account ($100k+) AND get at least a 50% offer.


As I posted - "as long as no player receives more than the full athletic department award for a player on a headcount team".  That's not Stanford's rule - It's NCAA.


----------



## pooka (Aug 7, 2017)

Question: with average rosters of 28 ladies, can a parent assume most girls are getting 50%? With of course a couple getting more/less?


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## pooka (Aug 7, 2017)

Follow up question: we keep being told that no one gets 100%. Ok fine. So what's a good %?


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## eastbaysoccer (Aug 7, 2017)

If you are getting 75% academic+athletic that's a good offer.


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## soccerobserver (Aug 7, 2017)

pooka said:


> Follow up question: we keep being told that no one gets 100%. Ok fine. So what's a good %?


Pooka, that statement is a generalization. I assume you player is interested in D1 but if they are open to D3 or the Ivies there can be a substantial amount of  "need based" money available and as MAP alluded to it can be 100%. I often hear the statement that nobody gets 100% but they are obviously painting the college landscape with too broad of a brush or maybe they are not an educated consumer.  The key is to apply to a very wealthy school (high endowment per student) and to have very high grades and test scores, in addition to great soccer skills. The tough part is for families that are upper middle class but the kid can't quite qualify for the schools with the biggest endowments. Brown University, for example has a relatively small endowment compared to the other Ivies and as a result they are concerned about losing  athletes to other schools with whopper-sized endowments.

For those who are interested further, here is an article about this issue:  http://www.browndailyherald.com/2011/04/12/brown-struggles-to-compete-for-middleclass-recruits/


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## GoWest (Aug 7, 2017)

espola said:


> You can get a degree from Cornell in Hotel Administration.
> 
> https://sha.cornell.edu/admissions-programs/


I hear UNLV is the #1 program in the country for Hotel / Hospitality Administration degrees if a kid is interested in that degree program.


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## pulguita (Aug 7, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> You clearly don't have experience with Stanford and their athletic awards because any athletic award you get reduces any need based award that you might have receive dollar for dollar.  They have need based money available for families with incomes all the way up to $200k.  That can still be cost prohibitive for families and here is an example.  Let's say you have a dual income family that does $180k a year.  Even if the player gets 75% in athletic aid that would reduce any need based award to zero and the family would still have to come up with $23k a year for their player to go there.  For schools like that  (not the Ivies) it is better to either be rich and really talented or needy (or have a big family) and be really talented.  The middle 80% needs to have a pretty good college saving account ($100k+) AND get at least a 50% offer.


To further illustrate a point that Map is talking about.  Last year the D1 universities put a proposal together to get the approval that academic money and athletic money could be added together.  Here is what I mean.  Under the proposal the athletic department could offer 50% scholarship and a kid could get another 25% from academic money thus the student would receive a 75% scholarship with the athletic department only getting hit 50%.  Under the current policy the department gets hit with 75% regardless.  This would have helped numerous kids and the programs.  If D1 gets 14.1 scholarships for a fully funded program coaches would have been able to spread the money even more.  Unfortunately as I have been told most of the D2 schools shot this down and it did not get passed.


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## GoWest (Aug 7, 2017)

pooka said:


> Follow up question: we keep being told that no one gets 100%. Ok fine. So what's a good %?


There are a few that land 100% athletic offers. It is hard to do and your player must have the complete package athletically, plus being courted by some very high profile programs helps in the negotiations.

Just know that the soccer coaching world is "small" and these coaches already know pretty much who is really being courted and the individual value your player brings to the table.


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## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

pulguita said:


> To further illustrate a point that Map is talking about.  Last year the D1 universities put a proposal together to get the approval that academic money and athletic money could be added together.  Here is what I mean.  Under the proposal the athletic department could offer 50% scholarship and a kid could get another 25% from academic money thus the student would receive a 75% scholarship with the athletic department only getting hit 50%.  Under the current policy the department gets hit with 75% regardless.  This would have helped numerous kids and the programs.  If D1 gets 14.1 scholarships for a fully funded program coaches would have been able to spread the money even more.  Unfortunately as I have been told most of the D2 schools shot this down and it did not get passed.


Do you have a reference for that?


----------



## Zerodenero (Aug 7, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> I personally would like to hear Zerodenero's take on this, since his DD is committed to an Ivy League School vs a parent who's kid isn't committed to an Ivy league school or just isn't committed period.


Dang- just found this thread....I'll chime in ina min. (Hows dat for ivy)


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## gkrent (Aug 7, 2017)

pooka said:


> Follow up question: we keep being told that no one gets 100%.


that's not true.  Some do get 100%, probably only a couple of people on a roster at a time, though.


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## pulguita (Aug 7, 2017)

espola said:


> Do you have a reference for that?


Reference for what?  The current policy or the proposal?


----------



## mirage (Aug 7, 2017)

You guys are on the ivy/D3 needs based kick but below is what I've heard from one of the assistant coach at D1 state school, the following.

While NCAA restricts number of athletic scholarships, for state schools, its not all the same.  What he meant by it and the example he used was this (this was in context of mens program so its 9.9 ep).  UCLA, according to this particular coach said, well funded program uses 9.9 out of state costs whereas UCI uses in-state costs.  Both are at 9.9 equivalent players but aggregate dollars is quite different and how they spread amongst the roster.

You can see why some of the schools recruits more from in-state vs out of state.  But, if you can recruit in-state player using out of state cost bases, it goes much further.  Its a question worth asking the coach during the recruiting cycle.  It definitely sounds like a loophole in the system and how well the booster program is working for the program.


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## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

pulguita said:


> Reference for what?  The current policy or the proposal?


The whole story about need-based financial aid and academic awards deducting from the school's total athletic scholarship allotment.  That's different from what my son and his coach told me.


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## pulguita (Aug 7, 2017)

espola said:


> The whole story about need-based financial aid and academic awards deducting from the school's total athletic scholarship allotment.  That's different from what my son and his coach told me.


Need base is totally different than academic/athletic scholarship.  Academic and athletic are both merit and the NCAA screws this up. The kid can't be awarded and recognized for their academic achievement without the athletic department getting hit if the athletic department also want s to reward the kid.  Lets further clarify that if it is only academic and not paired with athletic the athletic department does not get hit and does not go against their scholarship count.  The problem here is that we all talk about grades and athletics.  Good grades and great athletic ability gets you in most doors and typically gets you athletic money with no academic.  Exceptional grades and great athletic ability  - now they have to look at who is going to give the most academic or athletic but adding them hits the athletic department.  Exceptional grades good athletics will get you in and probably a lot of academic money.


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## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

pulguita said:


> Need base is totally different than academic/athletic scholarship.  Academic and athletic are both merit and the NCAA screws this up. The kid can't be awarded and recognized for their academic achievement without the athletic department getting hit if the athletic department also want s to reward the kid.  Lets further clarify that if it is only academic and not paired with athletic the athletic department does not get hit and does not go against their scholarship count.  The problem here is that we all talk about grades and athletics.  Good grades and great athletic ability gets you in most doors and typically gets you athletic money with no academic.  Exceptional grades and great athletic ability  - now they have to look at who is going to give the most academic or athletic but adding them hits the athletic department.  Exceptional grades good athletics will get you in and probably a lot of academic money.


The way I understand the rules (and my understanding is limited to what we had to deal with when my son was in school 2010-2015), no single player can receive more than the "total cost of attendance", a number determined by each school subject to NCAA acceptance.  That amount can come from any source the school provides - athletic grant-in-aid, need-based funds, and academic awards (plus perhaps some other minor funds).  However, only the part that comes from the athletic department counts against its total scholarship funding level, which for women soccer players is 14 times the total cost of attendance.

For soccer, both men and women, the athletic grant-in-aid money is divided as many ways as the coach desires, so the coach encourages players to apply for need-based money as well.


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## beachbum (Aug 7, 2017)

pulguita said:


> To further illustrate a point that Map is talking about.  Last year the D1 universities put a proposal together to get the approval that academic money and athletic money could be added together.  Here is what I mean.  Under the proposal the athletic department could offer 50% scholarship and a kid could get another 25% from academic money thus the student would receive a 75% scholarship with the athletic department only getting hit 50%.  Under the current policy the department gets hit with 75% regardless.  This would have helped numerous kids and the programs.  If D1 gets 14.1 scholarships for a fully funded program coaches would have been able to spread the money even more.  Unfortunately as I have been told most of the D2 schools shot this down and it did not get passed.


That is exactly what the coaches do, they can use 50% or 25% academic to get kids more money without using up all of their athletic scholarships as long as the athlete has the grades.  The requirements are different at every school.  I don't know where you got this info but they absolutely combine academic and athletic money.  I had heard that nobody gets a 100% athletic either but that is not true either.


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## pooka (Aug 7, 2017)

Thanks for all of the info folks! 
And it's great that so many of your Children are 4.0 AP students.... is there anyone here with a child that has a 3.3? Lol what does their aid look like. 

As a side note, college can't possibly keep increasing in price at this rate right? It's crazy.


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## SageMajor (Aug 7, 2017)

For my daughter the money that she got from Academic and Athletic money combine but need based is negated by either of those.  We originally thought she would have 100 covered as her soccer and grade money covered the whole of the parent contribution.  Sad realization when the money got applied to her account and the need based money dissipated leaving us with a shortfall.  What is still strange is that we are still paying less for her to play a a private than for her to go to a state school.


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## pulguita (Aug 7, 2017)

beachbum said:


> That is exactly what the coaches do, they can use 50% or 25% academic to get kids more money without using up all of their athletic scholarships as long as the athlete has the grades.  The requirements are different at every school.  I don't know where you got this info but they absolutely combine academic and athletic money.  I had heard that nobody gets a 100% athletic either but that is not true either.


If the academic money is coming from the school and the athletic money comes from the school the combined amount is a hit on the athletic program.  Once the kid gets athletic money they are a counter and the total aid FROM THE SCHOOL counts in its entirety.   Academic money or grants from outside the school typically do not.


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## eastbaysoccer (Aug 7, 2017)

Know a kid that was offers 50% athletic and x amount of dollars for  academic.  She was told if she raises her sat score to x she would receive more money.  I don't think the academic money counts towards the programs total athletic money.  The package could hit 80%.   INhave heard of near 100% athletic and academic .  It's possible but probably only at a private school.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 7, 2017)

eastbaysoccer said:


> Know a kid that was offers 50% athletic and x amount of dollars for  academic.  She was told if she raises her sat score to x she would receive more money.  I don't think the academic money counts towards the programs total athletic money.  The package could hit 80%.   INhave heard of near 100% athletic and academic .  It's possible but probably only at a private school.


It happens at public schools too.  I pay less for university than I paid for U16 club soccer.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 7, 2017)

beachbum said:


> That is exactly what the coaches do, they can use 50% or 25% academic to get kids more money without using up all of their athletic scholarships as long as the athlete has the grades.  The requirements are different at every school.  I don't know where you got this info but they absolutely combine academic and athletic money.  I had heard that nobody gets a 100% athletic either but that is not true either.


Everything is school dependent.  My player's school has a ton of pro players but only ever gave out one full ride scholarship.


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## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

pulguita said:


> If the academic money is coming from the school and the athletic money comes from the school the combined amount is a hit on the athletic program.  Once the kid gets athletic money they are a counter and the total aid FROM THE SCHOOL counts in its entirety.   Academic money or grants from outside the school typically do not.


It's a  combined hit toward that player's limit, but not toward the athletic department budget.


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## espola (Aug 7, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> It happens at public schools too.  I pay less for university than I paid for U16 club soccer.


I paid less than room and board for about 2 and a half years, then my son got student loans to cover that himself.


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## 3thatplay (Aug 7, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> Everything is school dependent.  My player's school has a ton of pro players but only ever gave out one full ride scholarship.


Was it yours?, Abdul's or Troy Aikman's?  Or are you referring only to women's soccer?  If your dd then CONGRATS!!  Under the radar..  lol


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 7, 2017)

3thatplay said:


> Was it yours?, Abdul's or Troy Aikman's?  Or are you referring only to women's soccer?  If your dd then CONGRATS!!  Under the radar..  lol


What are you talking about?


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## pulguita (Aug 7, 2017)

espola said:


> It's a  combined hit toward that player's limit, but not toward the athletic department budget.


Sorry I should be more clear.  Since we are talking about soccer let's use my 75% scholarship as stated above.  If the athlete is a counter the combined scholarship of 50% athletic and 25% academic would count as a 75% scholarship towards the women,s soccer team allowance even though the athletic was only a 50% scholarship.  More details here:  http://www.collegesportsscholarships.com/2013/05/10/fixing-the-ncaas-approach-to-non-athletics-aid.htm


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## espola (Aug 8, 2017)

pulguita said:


> Sorry I should be more clear.  Since we are talking about soccer let's use my 75% scholarship as stated above.  If the athlete is a counter the combined scholarship of 50% athletic and 25% academic would count as a 75% scholarship towards the women,s soccer team allowance even though the athletic was only a 50% scholarship.  More details here:  http://www.collegesportsscholarships.com/2013/05/10/fixing-the-ncaas-approach-to-non-athletics-aid.htm


That appears to be mostly about football and basketball players -  "In the revenue sports of football and basketball, institutional aid is limited even further"

The relevant page of the NCAA regulations is here - http://financialaid.arizona.edu/general/ncaa-manual-bylaw-15-financial-aid-excerpts


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## Surfref (Aug 8, 2017)

Pasrents need to think beyond the scholarship when negotiating.  We negotiated in-state tuition for my DD along with the academic and soccer scholarships.  The in-state tuition saved us $11k a semester. Not all state schools can offer the in-state tuition waiver, but it is worth asking. We also negotiated that she did not have to go on the full freshman meal plan.  She went on a points type of plan that is usually only used by juniors and seniors.  Saved about $1000 a semester.


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 9, 2017)

This is a pretty good list for a full experience.  Shout out to #8 and #9 on this list.  Kicking a$$ and taking names in the Ivy League!!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/huntersharf/2017/08/02/25-top-colleges-that-dominate-academically-and-athletically/#185abe2f7c3d


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## espola (Aug 9, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> This is a pretty good list for a full experience.  Shout out to #8 and #9 on this list.  Kicking a$$ and taking names in the Ivy League!!
> 
> https://www.forbes.com/sites/huntersharf/2017/08/02/25-top-colleges-that-dominate-academically-and-athletically/#185abe2f7c3d


In what sports have #8 and #9 won their national titles?


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 9, 2017)

espola said:


> In what sports have #8 and #9 won their national titles?


You aren't doing anything else and you are the master googler why don't you tell me?  Are you just an a$$hole or do you just not have anything better to do?  You can Google this so why ask unless you are just an a$$hole?


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## espola (Aug 9, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> You aren't doing anything else and you are the master googler why don't you tell me?  Are you just an a$$hole or do you just not have anything better to do?  You can Google this so why ask unless you are just an a$$hole?


So you can "shout out", but you don't know why?


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## MakeAPlay (Aug 9, 2017)

espola said:


> So you can "shout out", but you don't know why?


I know a$$hole do you?  Yale has won more national championships that Alabama and Princeton is only 2 behind.  Please don't ask me anything.  You are a certified a$$hole with nothing but time on his hand asking questions that he can google the answer to for God knows what reason.  Please add something to a conversation and don't ask me any questions.  I used to have you blocked.  Not sure why I changed that.  Now I remember why I had you blocked. 

 I suggest that you take your wife out to Rei do Gado, grab a 20mg cialis and some Playboys and work out some of your angst....


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## Sheriff Joe (Aug 9, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> I know a$$hole do you?  Yale has won more national championships that Alabama and Princeton is only 2 behind.  Please don't ask me anything.  You are a certified a$$hole with nothing but time on his hand asking questions that he can google the answer to for God knows what reason.  Please add something to a conversation and don't ask me any questions.  I used to have you blocked.  Not sure why I changed that.  Now I remember why I had you blocked.
> 
> I suggest that you take your wife out to Rei do Gado, grab a 20mg cialis and some Playboys and work out some of your angst....


WORD.


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## cowboy (Aug 9, 2017)

rainbow_unicorn said:


> Forget soccer.  I'm switching my daughter to Equestrian...1306 high school participants, 2295 college scholarships.


My DD is a rider as well and she's done research with equestrian scholarships. She found out that you must have a horse that qualifies as well to be considered for a scholarship in most programs. That's a hefty expense . She knows of one program dropping a girl due to her horse being seriously injured. Buyer beware...


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## The Driver (Aug 9, 2017)

cowboy said:


> My DD is a rider as well and she's done research with equestrian scholarships. She found out that you must have a horse that qualifies as well to be considered for a scholarship in most programs. That's a hefty expense . She knows of one program dropping a girl due to her horse being seriously injured. Buyer beware...


You'll never see a donkey at the Kentucky Derby


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## cowboy (Aug 9, 2017)

The Driver said:


> You'll never see a donkey at the Kentucky Derby


That's debatable according to many.


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## Zerodenero (Aug 9, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> This is a pretty good list for a full experience.  Shout out to #8 and #9 on this list.  Kicking a$$ and taking names in the Ivy League!!
> 
> https://www.forbes.com/sites/huntersharf/2017/08/02/25-top-colleges-that-dominate-academically-and-athletically/#185abe2f7c3d


Pretty cool. But if 8 & 9 made this list, surprised to see Harvard didn't make the list (given the age of the school/athletic programs)


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## Zerodenero (Aug 10, 2017)

NoGoal said:


> I personally would like to hear Zerodenero's take on this, since his DD is committed to an Ivy League School vs a parent who's kid isn't committed to an Ivy league school or just isn't committed period.


Based on my DD's experience so far, the process has been very different than other committed players in her local circle. That difference was that  once she committed, dialog with her contacts at school significantly increased to every few weeks.  They were involved in her HS class selections, they often checked in on how her test are going, often check in to see how her semester grades were, sat/act test scores/results, etc. They went from recruiting/athletic staff & converted to onboarding academic admission councilors. This was different than the interaction other committed players she/we know have experienced. Based on my discussion with the coach, this has a lot to do with their academic index "AI" requirement (parents should look into this) and how she was doing (academically) as their first recruit, would affect how and who they could subsequently recruit for her incoming class. This is a process that I don't think other D1 programs have to navigate.



Striker17 said:


> To redirect this whole thing for started because Fact felt as if the Ivies were better for making accomadations. I find that extremely promising and so I was happy to hear that.
> I have found that the big soccer schools like UWUB and UCLA et all are just over the top! Watch their social media! These girls are having the experience of a lifetime and is preseason! I am just very impressed and I don't see it in the other social media accounts- doesn't mean it's not happening I just don't see it


I know if one Ivy who's getting their gear tomorrow and you might find it on social media....but instead of blinged out bags @ cool accessories like other schools,  they're bling will be shiny new HP 12C's and an introduction to their sports physiologist that they have to meet with weekly so that they don't jump off the deep end.

Ps- (Joking about the calculators, serious about the shrink)


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## Zerodenero (Aug 10, 2017)

cowboy said:


> My DD is a rider as well and she's done research with equestrian scholarships. She found out that you must have a horse that qualifies as well to be considered for a scholarship in most programs. That's a hefty expense . She knows of one program dropping a girl due to her horse being seriously injured. Buyer beware...


Not to worry cowboy.....Heres a quick tip:
(_Ivy's are always looking for a few good coxswains)_


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## genesis (Sep 5, 2017)

pooka said:


> Follow up question: we keep being told that no one gets 100%. Ok fine. So what's a good %?


A college degree!


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## pooka (Sep 6, 2017)

You can get a college degree without an athletic scholarship.I know I did.


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## socalkdg (Sep 6, 2017)

Interesting list

http://www.payscale.com/college-salary-report/bachelors?page=101

So comparing Pepperdine with mid career pay at $104K with Cal State Fullerton at $98K might help you decide if a 75%scholarship at Fullerton might be worth more than a half scholarship at Pepperdine when considering only a 6K difference per year while the cost of the school is 66K compared to 26K.    Interesting most of the California State schools are right around 98K, which is more than many out of state Universities(check out the Big 10 - Ohio State, Michigan).

Keep all your options open.


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## espola (Sep 6, 2017)

socalkdg said:


> Interesting list
> 
> http://www.payscale.com/college-salary-report/bachelors?page=101
> 
> ...


One thing about averages - no one is average.


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## socalkdg (Sep 6, 2017)

espola said:


> One thing about averages - no one is average.


Very true.

http://www.mytopbusinessideas.com/school-drop-out-billionaires-successful-entrepreneurs/


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## mirage (Sep 6, 2017)

espola said:


> One thing about averages - no one is average.


May not be exactly the average but the many are around the average; hence the bell curve at 50 percentile....

Its close enough. And statically there will be some exactly on the average too.

Also, I would argue that perhaps cal state schools may be higher than other state school has more to do with working in CA than any other aspect.  The wages are higher in CA due to the cost of living here compared to many states.  Most grads end up working close to where they attended, since the recruiting is almost always locally focused.  Clearly there are exceptions but given tens of thousands of grads each year from CA, how many of those go out of state for employment?  Even if 1 out 4 did, that means 3 out of 4 did not; hence, biasing the wage picture.

Last comparing wages at the school level is almost meaningless because its so profession dependent.  Additionally, some cal state schools are far better valued than Pepperdine (example).  Take Cal Poly engineering or architecture.  Its on par with many top schools in the country - private and public.  So the comparison over generalizes.  Besides, mid-career (10yrs out) wages has more to do with the individual performance than the school they came from.

Last, payscale.com, albeit interesting, should be looked at as a simple reference only.  Their trend is meaningful but the details are not, speaking from hiring side of things.....


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## mirage (Sep 6, 2017)

socalkdg said:


> Very true.
> 
> http://www.mytopbusinessideas.com/school-drop-out-billionaires-successful-entrepreneurs/


Love this kind of story.  Gives every kid a reason to say "see, they didn't finish college and look where they are..."

According to Forbes this year, there are 1,645 billionaires in the world.  The article shows 55 without a college degree.  That's 3.3% of the total.

That means that 96.7% do have college degree or equivalent. 

Take your odds....


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## socalkdg (Sep 6, 2017)

mirage said:


> Love this kind of story.  Gives every kid a reason to say "see, they didn't finish college and look where they are..."
> 
> According to Forbes this year, there are 1,645 billionaires in the world.  The article shows 55 without a college degree.  That's 3.3% of the total.
> 
> ...


http://fortune.com/2016/08/08/billionaires-no-degree/ 

Actually a much higher number.   30%.   Having said that,  I want both my kids going to college.   I liked your take on the cost of living and jobs paying more in California, which would apply across the board to University's and Private Schools as well in California.  

My main purpose was for people to consider all options when looking at getting financial help through a college scholarship, just as many have mentioned getting both athletic and scholastic financial aid.   Saw an interesting article on Brown where they were having trouble competing vs the other Ivy League Schools for people making 60K - 200,000K, which is a bit of a dead zone when it comes to paying for your kids college.  Too much money to get aid,  not enough to easily afford college.


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## MakeAPlay (Sep 6, 2017)

socalkdg said:


> http://fortune.com/2016/08/08/billionaires-no-degree/
> 
> Actually a much higher number.   30%.   Having said that,  I want both my kids going to college.   I liked your take on the cost of living and jobs paying more in California, which would apply across the board to University's and Private Schools as well in California.
> 
> My main purpose was for people to consider all options when looking at getting financial help through a college scholarship, just as many have mentioned getting both athletic and scholastic financial aid.   Saw an interesting article on Brown where they were having trouble competing vs the other Ivy League Schools for people making 60K - 200,000K, which is a bit of a dead zone when it comes to paying for your kids college.  Too much money to get aid,  not enough to easily afford college.


And that zone aka the middle class, is where most people fall.  I have always said that California public universities are the best deal on the planet (unless of course you can get some awesome deal on an Ivy, Stanford, MIT, Cal Tech or Harvey Mudd!) other than the military academies.  If you can get 50% you are talking $13-$15k a year out of pocket and if you get 75% or more it falls to $7k or less.  That is a little bit more than club fees.  Now if you have a unicorn and get 80%+ then you are talking $5-$6k which is what you pay on a high level club team.  The added benefit is you actually get to see your kid play more than a few times a year live.  Watching a livestream or a television broadcast is nice but nothing like being able to take your kid to dinner afterwards.


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## Multi Sport (Sep 6, 2017)

pooka said:


> You can get a college degree without an athletic scholarship.I know I did.


Sure you can. You can get scholarships of many kind but since this is a soccer forum oeople tend to post about soccer scholarships.  

My daughter's received both athletic and academic and to us it really didn't matter what they wanted to call it. All that mattered was she was getting $$ to go to school and get her degree.


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## socalkdg (Sep 6, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> The added benefit is you actually get to see your kid play more than a few times a year live.  Watching a livestream or a television broadcast is nice but nothing like being able to take your kid to dinner afterwards.


Mine wants a polar pop from Circle K after every game.   Wonder if she will still want that when she gets older.   I dad can hope.


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## MakeAPlay (Sep 6, 2017)

socalkdg said:


> Mine wants a polar pop from Circle K after every game.   Wonder if she will still want that when she gets older.   I dad can hope.


It evolves from sweet treats into sushi and shoes....  Enjoy it while it lasts.


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## MakeAPlay (Sep 6, 2017)

@push_up is a pedophile and is on the Arizona Megan's law website.  SC Del Sol parents beware you have a creep among you.


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## Monkey (Sep 6, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> @push_up is a pedophile and is on the Arizona Megan's law website.  SC Del Sol parents beware you have a creep among you.


Wow that is low even for you.  If it is possible to delete your post I suggest you did so.


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## espola (Sep 6, 2017)

MakeAPlay said:


> @push_up is a pedophile and is on the Arizona Megan's law website.  SC Del Sol parents beware you have a creep among you.


If true, that's a public service.  If not, good luck.


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## genesis (Sep 9, 2017)

pooka said:


> You can get a college degree without an athletic scholarship.I know I did.


Congratulations, did not know that.  Point was the response was to a question about what % would be good...thus my response. Try to follow along.


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## pooka (Sep 12, 2017)

Multi Sport said:


> Sure you can. You can get scholarships of many kind but since this is a soccer forum oeople tend to post about soccer scholarships.
> 
> My daughter's received both athletic and academic and to us it really didn't matter what they wanted to call it. All that mattered was she was getting $$ to go to school and get her degree.


I was replying to the post above mine. I'm aware what the forum is and it's uses.


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## pooka (Sep 12, 2017)

genesis said:


> Congratulations, did not know that.  Point was the response was to a question about what % would be good...thus my response. Try to follow along.


No your response made no sense. You try and follow along.


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