# Bailing out before season ends....



## labanLB (Jan 2, 2018)

To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


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## LBSoccer (Jan 2, 2018)

It really is no big deal. Even with college soccer and the pros, people switch all the time. Why stay in an unhappy situation if you don't want to and why force it on a little if they are not happy. I have bought projects, started them, not what I envisioned and then tossed them. Sometimes its not worth it and the benefits outweigh. Cut your losses.


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## SoccerFrenzy (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


Wait doesn't season end after Thanksgiving?


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## labanLB (Jan 2, 2018)

LBSoccer said:


> It really is no big deal. Even with college soccer and the pros, people switch all the time. Why stay in an unhappy situation if you don't want to and why force it on a little if they are not happy. I have bought projects, started them, not what I envisioned and then tossed them. Sometimes its not worth it and the benefits outweigh. Cut your losses.


You are missing the point LBSoccer.  This isn't college or the pros.  What parents are teaching their kids is bail when things aren't going their way.  Sounds like you are a part of the problem of this new generation.  Bail when the ish get rough.  How to be a coward 101.


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## labanLB (Jan 2, 2018)

SoccerFrenzy said:


> Wait doesn't season end after Thanksgiving?


The year doesn't end until State Cup is done.


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## SoccerFrenzy (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> The year doesn't end until State Cup is done.


I don't think League sees it that way unfortunately.


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## Frank (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> The year doesn't end until State Cup is done.


Says who?  maybe your club who wants to lock in its paying customers, but CalSouth says it ends after thanksgiving which is why players can freely transfer after. They are the governing body and if it wasn't Ok they wouldn't allow it.


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## SoccerFrenzy (Jan 2, 2018)

Frank said:


> Says who?  maybe your club who wants to lock in its paying customers, but CalSouth says it ends after thanksgiving which is why players can freely transfer after. They are the governing body and if it wasn't Ok they wouldn't allow it.


Bingo! Club may have it in their contracts but we all know those contracts can't be held up if anyone decides to leave


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## Soccer Bum 06 (Jan 2, 2018)

I think parents should have their children finish out the year which to me ends with State Cup. With that said clubs should also wait to have tryouts until after the season and also not invite new players onto the team for State Cup. We shouldn’t hold parents to a standard the clubs themselves will not follow.


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## labanLB (Jan 2, 2018)

SoccerFrenzy said:


> I don't think League sees it that way unfortunately.





Frank said:


> Says who?  maybe your club who wants to lock in its paying customers, but CalSouth says it ends after thanksgiving which is why players can freely transfer after. They are the governing body and if it wasn't Ok they wouldn't allow it.


I understand CalSouth transfer rule.  I'm talking on principle, but I guess that just shows how youth soccer as a whole is messed up.


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## Kicker4Life (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> I understand CalSouth transfer rule.  I'm talking on principle, but I guess that just shows how youth soccer as a whole is messed up.


I have always told my kids you will always finish what you start. However, there are also always “extenuating circumstances” (bullies, problematic coaches, etc) that would be addressed as such. So I’m ahort I agree with you. However, like you said, it is youth soccer so my question is, what happened to piss you off so much?


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## LBSoccer (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> You are missing the point LBSoccer.  This isn't college or the pros.  What parents are teaching their kids is bail when things aren't going their way.  Sounds like you are a part of the problem of this new generation.  Bail when the ish get rough.  How to be a coward 101.


It's got you all worked up. Relax. It's just littles soccer. Bail when it gets rough? Nah but I have seen kids get screwed over in more ways than one just because they stuck around in a bad situation because of people that reacted the way you are. They later regretted it and said they should have left sooner. I'm just saying sometimes its not worth it to stick around.


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## broshark (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> You are missing the point LBSoccer.  This isn't college or the pros.  What parents are teaching their kids is bail when things aren't going their way.  Sounds like you are a part of the problem of this new generation.  Bail when the ish get rough.  How to be a coward 101.


The kids aren't the ones who scheduled tryouts a month or two prior to State Cup.


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## Striker17 (Jan 2, 2018)

The kids aren't also the ones who have turned low level soccer into a year round affair. 
Sorry but if my son wants to play baseball or lacrosse or water polo or even golf goodbye. 
Clubs stopped caring about families along time ago save me the righteous act.


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## fantasyfutbol (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


Why on God’s green flat earth would YOU...an adult...care if a little kid goes to play on another team?  Is this some high moral stand you are taking?? Nope.  You are that parent on the sideline with the passive aggressive snarky comments to the refs and other little kids...”good job teaching your kids”  lines when you mean the opposite.  Haha grow up and learn to use direct speech not snarky sarcastic valley girl rants on a forum.

The truth is your state cup dreams have been dashed by the actions of another parent who moved thier kid.  Just be honest...you are throwing a tantrum...Remember it’s ulittle soccer. It’s not that serious.


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## LBSoccer (Jan 2, 2018)

fantasyfutbol said:


> Why on God’s green flat earth would YOU...an adult...care if a little kid goes to play on another team?  Is this some high moral stand you are taking?? Nope.  You are that parent on the sideline with the passive aggressive snarky comments to the refs and other little kids...”good job teaching your kids”  lines when you mean the opposite.  Haha grow up and learn to use direct speech not snarky sarcastic valley girl rants on a forum.
> 
> The truth is your state cup dreams have been dashed by the actions of another parent who moved thier kid.  Just be honest...you are throwing a tantrum...Remember it’s ulittle soccer. It’s not that serious.


I remember our 2nd year of club soccer. Daughter was ready to move on and attended a try out during the same month as state cup. We were upfront with the coach and told him were looking and our daughter would be moving on after state cup ended. Next game he benched her and right before game started pulled her aside along with the other two girls going elsewhere and asked them if they knew why they weren't starting.  They did know, they were 10, ulittles.   He had already told us he would bench her and would focus on the girls staying on the team.   We thought we were doing the right thing by letting him know. The following season we stay on through state cup and spring. During spring kids start making choices to go elsewhere. We weren't sure if we would stay or move on because the team was changing after each practice and we let coach know. Again she is pulled from her starter spot with the reason being Coach will focus on players who have committed to team. This was at u11 (different coach). We learned there is not really any loyalty or commitment to anyone other than your kid and your family and sometimes it is better if you don't take the "moral road".


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## MakeAPlay (Jan 2, 2018)

LBSoccer said:


> It's got you all worked up. Relax. It's just littles soccer. Bail when it gets rough? Nah but I have seen kids get screwed over in more ways than one just because they stuck around in a bad situation because of people that reacted the way you are. They later regretted it and said they should have left sooner. I'm just saying sometimes its not worth it to stick around.


Sometimes it is just better to leave.  The only loyalty that you need to have is to your own child.  Unfortunately 95% of all clubs/coaches will do whatever is in their best interest.  Do what is in your player's best interest especially at the younger ages.  They are the most critical.  If my daughter had stayed on her first club team I doubt that she would be playing D1 soccer now and clearly not because of her ability.

I pulled my player from her first club team 2 weeks into the league season due to the coach not holding up her end of the bargain.  I told all the parents and that coach a month ahead of time if things don't change we weren't going to wait until the season ended and that they would be giving us a full refund.  We got the refund, she moved to a team in the same division and proceeded to kick her old teams a$$ the couple of times that they played them that year.


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## clueless parent (Jan 2, 2018)

Sometimes a situation is toxic for a child, especially a ulittle.  There are some cruel coaches that exist.  There are some younger teammates and/or parents that are abusive bullies (often the rare bully child and parent combine efforts).  After a few years in club soccer, I know that there are certain circumstances where a parent needs to remove a child from a deeply damaging situation.  LabanLB, I do not know you or the journey of your child/children.  If you have experience in the sport as a parent - your opinion will garner respect if you share the years you have been a parent in club soccer and the ages of your children.  You present a challenging question for all parents.  Upon what do you base your opinion?  Have you had one or more children stay when you knew the experience would be difficult/challenging/toxic/and or growing?  Where are you coming from?


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## Gokicksomegrass (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


Yo, ulittle's coach. These parents have no ethics. Sad! Think of the children!
I guess you need to find some new privates...oops, I mean starters for your team
since they are all leaving now. Real nasty those parents. Shame!!!


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## espola (Jan 2, 2018)

MakeAPlay said:


> Sometimes it is just better to leave.  The only loyalty that you need to have is to your own child.  Unfortunately 95% of all clubs/coaches will do whatever is in their best interest.  Do what is in your player's best interest especially at the younger ages.  They are the most critical.  If my daughter had stayed on her first club team I doubt that she would be playing D1 soccer now and clearly not because of her ability.
> 
> I pulled my player from her first club team 2 weeks into the league season due to the coach not holding up her end of the bargain.  I told all the parents and that coach a month ahead of time if things don't change we weren't going to wait until the season ended and that they would be giving us a full refund.  We got the refund, she moved to a team in the same division and proceeded to kick her old teams a$$ the couple of times that they played them that year.


I'm sure the coach was happy to see you gone.


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## Multi Sport (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


Guilty as charged... twice.

Daughter was playing on a Boys team and I informed the coach that she would leave to go play National Cup on a Girls team.

After two seasons with the same team she left to go play post season with another team. This was after I had expressed my displeasure with the coach on how he handled a situation that involved us. I would have pulled my daughter immediately but you know, commitment first. Finish the season, then leave.


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## Multi Sport (Jan 2, 2018)

fantasyfutbol said:


> Haha grow up and learn to use direct speech not snarky sarcastic valley girl rants on a forum.


Just laughed @ the Valley Girl refrence... you should Nicolas Cage as your avatar.


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## Lurker (Jan 2, 2018)

Funny that anyone would expect a high moral standard from a club player when clubs treat players as commodities rather than human beings.  Survival of the the fittest is the name of the game in the highly unethical club soccer world!


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## INFAMEE (Jan 2, 2018)

Your kid ain't getting playing time? 

The coach only subs the same players every game. The usual 5 or 6 never get subbed?

The coach doesn' want the kids dribbling or playing with ball. Just send it up.

Coach blames and gives long lame speeches after every loss.

Coach doesn't give a damn about Christiano Ronaldo??



DROP THE TEAM! Preferable in front of everybody during a game. Be very vocal too, don' forget to mention that this kick ball shit is the reason u.s. isn't in the world cup!


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## mirage (Jan 2, 2018)

LOL, this what happens when we're not out on the field with our kids playing....

*Bailing out THIS THREAD before season ends....*


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## boomer (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


Parents gotta do what they think is best for their kid, even if you don't think so. Plenty of legit reasons to pull a player from a team prior to when you think "the season ends". You come off as nothing more than a pissed off parent, team mom, or coach who's dreams of winning "Mayor's/Governor's/President's/Asst to the Travelling Secretary's Cup" were dashed by the departure of a player. Why do you give a shit enough to post here?

Hey INFAMEE, perfect time to bust out the crying baby pic. You dropped the ball here.


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## Not_that_Serious (Jan 2, 2018)

Season ends in Nov. If team applies for State/Nat Cup then kid is cup tied - if its a transfer from SCDSL to SCDSL club. If kid isnt happy, for various reasons, fine to move on. Sometimes not being able to play State Cup isnt the end of the world. Coach is paid to work with what they have - probably happier to know who is in and who is out. Ski trips, baseball, lacrosee, trips to Cern to blow up atoms or staying home to kill a FIFA18 league: reason is irrelevant. Messed up would be a parent saying "im in" and bailing weekend of State Cup. This isnt Champions League and State Cup isnt obligation. Would be awesome if those who could play would commit but not serious enough to go General Hospital on a youth soccer site


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## ajaxahi (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB:  You suck as a parent if you let your ulittle leave their team before SC.  Right?  Who’s with me?!!

Forum:  Stop whining you idiot.

labanLB:  Yeah!!  Wait what?


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## smellycleats (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> To all the parents looking to switch their ulittle to another team before the season is over, good job teaching your kids to cur out before the season ends.  It's freakin ulittle soccer not college soccer.


I value loyalty. I wish loyalty or integrity made any sense in the world of club soccer. The club does what’s best for the club, a parent has to do what’s best for their player. There are many ways to teach work ethic and follow through to your child. Forcing them to play soccer on a team thats a poor fit is not one of them. Too many hours and too much money spent to stay in a situation that isn’t working.

Weve played on teams where coaches were actively recruiting players prior to state cup while at the same time giving current players less and less playing time- only minutes per game- at U9. OP are  you suggesting that it’s ok for  clubs and coaches not to honor their commitment to players on their teams but families should stay and honor theirs while their players suffer? What’s the lesson learned there? It’s a double standard.


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## uburoi (Jan 2, 2018)

labanLB said:


> You are missing the point LBSoccer.  This isn't college or the pros.  What parents are teaching their kids is bail when things aren't going their way.  Sounds like you are a part of the problem of this new generation.  Bail when the ish get rough.  How to be a coward 101.


I’m sorry that the team broke up. We’ve all been there. It’s club soccer after all. Maybe the coach was great but too hard on the kiddos. Maybe the coach wasn’t great and parents left for better coaching. State cup is one weekend for most teams and a lot of fanfare and driving and only worth it if the team is committed.


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## uburoi (Jan 2, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> I value loyalty. I wish loyalty or integrity made any sense in the world of club soccer. The club does what’s best for the club, a parent has to do what’s best for their player. There are many ways to teach work ethic and follow through to your child. Forcing them to play soccer on a team thats a poor fit is not one of them. Too many hours and too much money spent to stay in a situation that isn’t working.
> 
> Weve played on teams where coaches were actively recruiting players prior to state cup while at the same time giving current players less and less playing time- only minutes per game- at U9. OP are  you suggesting that it’s ok for  clubs and coaches not to honor their commitment to players on their teams but families should stay and honor theirs while their players suffer? What’s the lesson learned there? It’s a double standard.


Brilliant response.


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## MakeAPlay (Jan 3, 2018)

espola said:


> I'm sure the coach was happy to see you gone.


If you say so.  Let's just say the coach was fired at the end of the season and losing my player for no good reason was only a small part of it.

Nice try Magoo.


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## Sheriff Joe (Jan 3, 2018)

MakeAPlay said:


> Sometimes it is just better to leave.  The only loyalty that you need to have is to your own child.  Unfortunately 95% of all clubs/coaches will do whatever is in their best interest.  Do what is in your player's best interest especially at the younger ages.  They are the most critical.  If my daughter had stayed on her first club team I doubt that she would be playing D1 soccer now and clearly not because of her ability.
> 
> I pulled my player from her first club team 2 weeks into the league season due to the coach not holding up her end of the bargain.  I told all the parents and that coach a month ahead of time if things don't change we weren't going to wait until the season ended and that they would be giving us a full refund.  We got the refund, she moved to a team in the same division and proceeded to kick her old teams a$$ the couple of times that they played them that year.


I agree, depending on the age of the player, 1 lost year is huge at 12-15.


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## Fact (Jan 3, 2018)

I take the middle ground on this issue. If your club and coach have treated your child fairly stay until after State/National Cup when your sole reason is to find a higher performing team.  However, if they have not been honest, your child's self esteem is involved or your fair that the coach will retaliate by benching your child for not signing up for a new season move.


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## ToonArmy (Jan 3, 2018)

At u9 was with a flight 3 team who's club had tryouts and offers given out months before state cup. 3 girls got offers on flight 2 teams 2 within the same club and 1 with another club. All 3 families stayed committed thru state cup bought hotel rooms in san diego for the first round weekend and all 3 girls were benched for large parts of all games and put in goal which none have ever played before and team got smashed 3 games.

This season u13 different club and team is blowing up it is already known long before national cup because once again these clubs have tryouts in nov and dec and offers are given out i have gotten 3 phone calls from the club wanting me to make my decision and at same time they are letting us know they hope we honor our obligation to finish remaining tournaments and nat cup. I am choosing to play and hoping she doesnt get benched out of respect for coach team and club but if some parents dont i dont blame them i been bit before and the clubs cause this chaos way too early vegas and national cup are expensive and after tryouts when on a team this is knowingly blowing up everyone is over it


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## Keepermom2 (Jan 3, 2018)

And...I can't think of one job I worked at where I gave a 2 to 3 month notice of leaving.  How awkward is it to make a kid stay on a team for 2 to 3 months when they have already committed to another team.  I cannot think of one real work world example where that would be the case.    In addition, since all of the clubs are doing early tryouts shouldn't the club get used to playing with what they will be playing with on an on going basis? As I understand it, State Cup is a tournament.  There are many tournaments through out the year that people can't make for whatever reason.  What is the difference?


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## Josep (Jan 4, 2018)

I’m going to take a diff position that OP isn’t a coach.  That’s what makes this worse.  He’s a parent, and he really wanted to “win” state cup.  

No offense, but state cup is nothing. 85% of the teams entering won’t/can’t win. If you do, who cares?  Nobody remembers, it doesn’t mean much and I’ll bet you that within 2 years, at least 50% of the kids won’t be there.  Within 4 years, 80% of team will be different.  

Clubs are shady.  Coaches are shady.  Parents are shady.  Whether it’s the coach sneakily building the new roster with new kids in december before you get to state:national up in Feb/March to clubs threatening you to sign or else, but being very vague in what you’re commitment actually is to parents trying to take “our core” to a “better team”.   

I used to be a believer in stay the whole way through but I’ve also experience terrible situations.  Try finishing a season with kids who have either signed elsewhere or know they are cut from the team starting the next week.  It’s unpleasant.   The kids are phoning it in, the coach is a jerk to some, and the parents are nasty.   I’ve experienced this at all levels through ECNL.  

Yes the system is broken because every part of the equation is out for their best interest.  Clubs hold tryouts the next week after Thanksgiving. The coaches are scouting and recruiting all season, and little Stephanie’s dad is shopping her around and feverish emailing coaches. 

I’ve always thought that the season should be considered full from March to December.  Do Spring league or form your team, play your summer tourneys, start fall league in late August, run state/national cup in December.  

Make the cal south cut off dec 31, and make January tryout and movement month with some moving ino February.  

Now I know this won’t work, because there are too many tourneys in dec and Jan that would lose out to this plan.   And we can’t have lost revenue.  

So it will remain broken.


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## Striker17 (Jan 4, 2018)

Great post! Wow. I agree soccer season is way too long. At ulittle there is no reason for the length of season and it's a shame to see what the Kids are losing out on. They push them to specialization and rather than specialize they quit


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## Not_that_Serious (Jan 4, 2018)

Josep said:


> I’m going to take a diff position that OP isn’t a coach.  That’s what makes this worse.  He’s a parent, and he really wanted to “win” state cup.
> 
> No offense, but state cup is nothing. 85% of the teams entering won’t/can’t win. If you do, who cares?  Nobody remembers, it doesn’t mean much and I’ll bet you that within 2 years, at least 50% of the kids won’t be there.  Within 4 years, 80% of team will be different.
> 
> ...


Yep. Those parents,coaches, kids who are ethical are usually the ones who get short end of the stick. Move state cup to Mid Dec-Mid Jan. Every kid released by mid Jan. Will elim much of the BS. But then youll get tryouts thanksgiving break. Haha


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## outside! (Jan 4, 2018)

Not_that_Serious said:


> Yep. Those parents,coaches, kids who are ethical are usually the ones who get short end of the stick. Move state cup to Mid Dec-Mid Jan. Every kid released by mid Jan. Will elim much of the BS. But then youll get tryouts thanksgiving break. Haha


What about High School season (~December-February)?


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## Hired Gun (Jan 4, 2018)

outside! said:


> What about High School season (~December-February)?


I think this arrangement was more geared for U littles...


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## sdb (Jan 4, 2018)

For youngers, State cup could be run from mid November to mid December (with a break for Thanksgiving) without an issue. Coast and SCDSL are both finished by then. Then tryouts in early Jan for a Feb start. Very logical but then that’s never been a consideration.


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## Soccer43 (Jan 4, 2018)

sdb said:


> For youngers, State cup could be run from mid November to mid December (with a break for Thanksgiving) without an issue. Coast and SCDSL are both finished by then. Then tryouts in early Jan for a Feb start. Very logical but then that’s never been a consideration.


youth soccer = logical and what is in best interest of the customer (players and families)?  hahahhaaha


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## sdb (Jan 4, 2018)

Parents should band together and run a player combine, charge the clubs to attend. Take back the power as the customer.


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## Eagle33 (Jan 4, 2018)

sdb said:


> Parents should band together and run a player combine, charge the clubs to attend. Take back the power as the customer.


They already have this. It's call AYSO.


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## Chalklines (Jan 4, 2018)

I wish travel ball and club sports still actually meant something so we wouldn't need to have these stupid discussions.

Its a vicious circle going on. The problem is clubs are diluted with kids who shouldn't even be considered especially at the younger ages, Too many A,B,C,D & so on teams at every level. 

If it wasn't so easy to join a team, movement would slow and amazingly more teams would be "the right fit" for the player.


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## smellycleats (Jan 4, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> I wish travel ball and club sports still actually meant something so we wouldn't need to have these stupid discussions.
> 
> Its a vicious circle going on. The problem is clubs are diluted with kids who shouldn't even be considered especially at the younger ages, Too many A,B,C,D & so on teams at every level.
> 
> If it wasn't so easy to join a team, movement would slow and amazingly more teams would be "the right fit" for the player.


I disagree with you. Kids can change and develop drastically over their ulittle years. Sometimes kids are small but fast, some are athletic but have low soccer IQ, or have a great attitude, hustle, and want to learn or visa versa....Hard to tell what kind of player they will develop into at a young age. If a kid  has a few areas of strength and wants to compete why not play for coach who is paid to be there and with a team of other competitive players?  As other  experienced parents on this forum have told us, sometimes ulittle players start out on second teams and end up with college scholarships and sometimes superstars quit at age 13. Who are you to say who belongs there and who doesn’t?


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## LBSoccer (Jan 4, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> I wish travel ball and club sports still actually meant something so we wouldn't need to have these stupid discussions.
> 
> Its a vicious circle going on. The problem is clubs are diluted with kids who shouldn't even be considered especially at the younger ages, Too many A,B,C,D & so on teams at every level.
> 
> If it wasn't so easy to join a team, movement would slow and amazingly more teams would be "the right fit" for the player.


I disagree. Where are kids who "should not even be considered" play? My kid started on a B team. I had already signed her up for AYSO the season she was recruited so she played both. By the end of AYSO season you could see AYSO was no longer a teaching ground for her. B and C teams serve a purpose and not all kids stay at that level. My kid was playing on a top team most of her club years but growth and fundamentals were definitely what helped her and that came from her early year club years and not necessarily from A teams.


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## espola (Jan 4, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> I wish travel ball and club sports still actually meant something so we wouldn't need to have these stupid discussions.
> 
> Its a vicious circle going on. The problem is clubs are diluted with kids who shouldn't even be considered especially at the younger ages, Too many A,B,C,D & so on teams at every level.
> 
> If it wasn't so easy to join a team, movement would slow and amazingly more teams would be "the right fit" for the player.


The more the merrier the way I see it.


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## Zdrone (Jan 4, 2018)

sdb said:


> For youngers, State cup could be run from mid November to mid December (with a break for Thanksgiving) without an issue.


I don’t think we can handle 3 practices, at least 1 game Each weekend AND tryouts in September/October.
Just too much


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## Kicker4Life (Jan 4, 2018)

Zdrone said:


> I don’t think we can handle 3 practices, at least 1 game Each weekend AND tryouts in September/October.
> Just too much


Clubs couldn’t handle it either!  Try-outs are a Huge drain on resources, so by default it would push back tryouts.


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## sdb (Jan 4, 2018)

Kicker4Life said:


> Clubs couldn’t handle it either!  Try-outs are a Huge drain on resources, so by default it would push back tryouts.


Which would be a good thing.


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## Kicker4Life (Jan 4, 2018)

sdb said:


> Which would be a good thing.


Win, win!


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## Chalklines (Jan 5, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> I disagree with you. Kids can change and develop drastically over their ulittle years. Sometimes kids are small but fast, some are athletic but have low soccer IQ, or have a great attitude, hustle, and want to learn or visa versa....Hard to tell what kind of player they will develop into at a young age. If a kid  has a few areas of strength and wants to compete why not play for coach who is paid to be there and with a team of other competitive players?  As other  experienced parents on this forum have told us, sometimes ulittle players start out on second teams and end up with college scholarships and sometimes superstars quit at age 13. Who are you to say who belongs there and who doesn’t?


Before the days of over saturated club sports and entitled parents kids had to earn roster spots and trophies. 

Now,  both are handed out a dime a dozen and the same arguments always "who are you to say little Jimmy's not good enough to play and take home a trophy". That exact stereotype soccer mom attitude is killing youth sports across the board. 

Clubs have caved and have now opened up multiple teams at every level to take your money. Why? Because it's all become a bussiness and Jimmy's parents moneys green just like everyone else's. 

Times have changed for youth sports. I get it. Doesn't mean I like it. 

The b, c & d teams have killed rec leagues because parents are willing to shell out top dollar for AYSO coaching at club level for ulittles.
Its truly a shame 5 - 10 year olds need to make a full year's commitment just to play competitive soccer.


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## smellycleats (Jan 5, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> Before the days of over saturated club sports and entitled parents kids had to earn roster spots and trophies.
> 
> Now,  both are handed out a dime a dozen and the same arguments always "who are you to say little Jimmy's not good enough to play and take home a trophy". That exact stereotype soccer mom attitude is killing youth sports across the board.
> 
> ...


We can agree to disagree on some issues. I’m with you on your last point though.  Ridiculous that young children should specialize in one sport or one activity for that matter, at such a young age. 

and I resent the soccer mom reference. Just because I’m a mom and my kids play soccer does NOT mean that I’m for the over wussification of our little suburban kids and the existence of ninth place trophies.


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## MyDaughtersAKeeper (Jan 5, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> Before the days of over saturated club sports and entitled parents kids had to earn roster spots and trophies.
> 
> Now,  both are handed out a dime a dozen and the same arguments always "who are you to say little Jimmy's not good enough to play and take home a trophy". That exact stereotype soccer mom attitude is killing youth sports across the board.
> 
> ...


I don’t get the idea that more kids playing is somehow not a good thing.  More kids playing a sport and, learning teamwork, getting exercise and bonding with their friends is a win to me. 

When someone says this junk I think of the same person complaining about how times have changed at the country club; damn  club is letting in minorities, women, Jews.  What is the world coming to?  Get over yourself.


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## Grace T. (Jan 5, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> parents are willing to shell out top dollar for AYSO coaching at club level for ulittles.
> .


Part of the problem with AYSO is that it's been a victim of it's own success and it's own philosophy of balanced teams and everybody plays.  In order to create balanced teams, you aren't allowed to pick your coach.  But because AYSO relies on volunteers, you get a lot of parents that haven't played soccer trying to coach (one even wrote an article confessing he didn't know what he was doing).  The problem is worse in soccer than in other rec sports because not everyone grew up playing soccer.  Theoretically, with time that means as time goes by there will be less of a need for c, d, e teams, but the problem there is that parents are now stretched for time more than they were before and AYSO has an enormous problem trying to get parents who do know how to play to volunteer.  Finally, there is the problem of equal playing time which means if you are trying to develop a player he or she will play an equivalent amount with another player who can't even get their foot on the ball...a problem which often leads to the "get it to Sally" school of AYSO coaching and can be frustrating for Sally since she's only learning to running and shoot and not learning to move around the ball. 

I'd be more sympathetic to AYSO's predicament but they've also made the problem worse by creating the United & Extras competitive programs.  And while these programs answer the question about what to do about parents who don't know how to coach, or players who can't play, it has further cannibalized the basic program by removing the best coaches and players.  We can have our soccer competitive, developmental, or open to everyone/cheap....pick 2.


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## boomer (Jan 5, 2018)

Grace T. said:


> Part of the problem with AYSO is that it's been a victim of it's own success and it's own philosophy of balanced teams and everybody plays.  In order to create balanced teams, you aren't allowed to pick your coach.  But because AYSO relies on volunteers, you get a lot of parents that haven't played soccer trying to coach (one even wrote an article confessing he didn't know what he was doing).  The problem is worse in soccer than in other rec sports because not everyone grew up playing soccer.  Theoretically, with time that means as time goes by there will be less of a need for c, d, e teams, but the problem there is that parents are now stretched for time more than they were before and AYSO has an enormous problem trying to get parents who do know how to play to volunteer.  Finally, there is the problem of equal playing time which means if you are trying to develop a player he or she will play an equivalent amount with another player who can't even get their foot on the ball...a problem which often leads to the "get it to Sally" school of AYSO coaching and can be frustrating for Sally since she's only learning to running and shoot and not learning to move around the ball.
> 
> I'd be more sympathetic to AYSO's predicament but they've also made the problem worse by creating the United & Extras competitive programs.  And while these programs answer the question about what to do about parents who don't know how to coach, or players who can't play, it has further cannibalized the basic program by removing the best coaches and players.  We can have our soccer competitive, developmental, or open to everyone/cheap....pick 2.


AYSO's  philosophies of "balanced teams" and "everybody plays"  is a problem? Seriously? It's rec ball for shit's sake. It's supposed to be fun.

Unbalanced teams lead to lop-sided ass-whoopings. What the good in that? Getting your ass handed to you 12-0 isn't fun.

Better players should play more than "kids who can't even get their foot on the ball" who should either be benched or not be allowed to play at all for fear of getting in the way of Sally's development? That's what you're suggesting, right? If so, you as Sally's mom need to rethink where you have her playing. You have zero clue.

AYSO is purely recreational. Always has been. It's about having fun and developing as a person, not as a player. It's about getting kids moving, teamwork, competition, and playing to the best of their ability. Anyone expecting any real player development needs a reality check. There are places for kids that really want to improve to train and play, but AYSO isn't it.


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## Grace T. (Jan 5, 2018)

boomer said:


> AYSO's  philosophies of "balanced teams" and "everybody plays"  is a problem? Seriously? It's rec ball for shit's sake. It's supposed to be fun.
> 
> Unbalanced teams lead to lop-sided ass-whoopings. What the good in that? Getting your ass handed to you 12-0 isn't fun.
> 
> ...


You don't say anything I disagree with, and I think AYSO serves an enormously great function.  But it's one of the reasons we have c, d and e teams that Chalklines complains about.  Some people are looking for more, for a variety of reasons, which is why there generally is an explosion in club enrollment around age ten and a decline in AYSO enrollment.  You can have your soccer competitive, developmental or open to everyone/cheap.  Pick 2.


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## smellycleats (Jan 5, 2018)

Chalklines said:


> Before the days of over saturated club sports and entitled parents kids had to earn roster spots and trophies.
> 
> Now,  both are handed out a dime a dozen and the same arguments always "who are you to say little Jimmy's not good enough to play and take home a trophy". That exact stereotype soccer mom attitude is killing youth sports across the board.
> 
> ...


And by the way if there were no B, C, and D teams you would be paying significantly more for your A team player.   More kids playing means people actually give a damn about soccer.   More viewership, more interest, more college scholarships ...it would be like 30 years ago when no one really  gave a damn about soccer in the US.  It was a Third World sport.  Without those kids “who don’t deserve to be there”, surf cup, national cup, DA games, would be like a bear fartin in the woods. No one would hear it and no one would care.


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## Grace T. (Jan 6, 2018)

ATRTDT said:


> What a lot of people are missing here is the B & C team competition level is exactly what AYSO had years ago with out the grind and cost of a club. Families could always start fresh each season with a new team and coach.


That's simply not correct.  With ayso you don't get to pick your coach (unless you are it).  Most club coaches at least have played the game and know what they are doing (there's lots of articles from ayso coaches confessing they don't know what they are doing).  With ayso everyone, whether a star athlete or borderline handicapped, experienced or complete novice, plays in the same team. With club kids of similar ability tend to settle at the same level.  With ayso there are equal time rules, with kids who miss practice or who swing and miss playing equally with a kid playing 5 days a week.  With club, the rules may vary but rarely is there mandated equal time. With ayso the emphasis is on having fun and practice is usually limited to twice a week. With club, though it doesn't always obtain the ideal, the emphasis is on competition and development and practices are usually a minimum of two days a week.  Even the skill level between the average ayso team and the average b club team differs greatly.  My sons mediocre bronze team had routinely torn up ayso extras teams.  Sure the cost is cheaper in ayso but they don't pay their coaches. Ayso coaches are volunteers and sometimes don't know what they are doing. They are no where near equivalents nor should they be.


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## Grace T. (Jan 6, 2018)

ATRTDT said:


> Read my response again.
> 
> Never said you get to pick your coach once, nor did I mention the disaster of AYSO as we know it today.
> 
> What I did say is B & C competition at club now was found years ago at AYSO.


The only reason that was because C/D/E level players currently in club played AYSO.  But the product was essentially the same.  I came up through the AYSO ranks myself when it was just starting out.  The competition was arguably better just because you had better athletes locked into AYSO (particularly on the girls side since in the 70s and 80s soccer was largely a girls thing in our area).  The coaches still didn't know what they were doing (arguably they know better now because some of the parents have some experience).  There was no VIP program so one year we even had a Down Syndrome player on my team, who also got equal time.  The big difference now is that parents have choices, and that's a good thing.  AYSO isn't a disaster...it does what it's supposed to do well....it's an introduction to the sport and it's there for kids to have fun.  Given the way it's structured, we can't really expect more from it, which is why we have the B,C,D,E teams.


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## INFAMEE (Jan 6, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> And by the way if there were no B, C, and D teams you would be paying significantly more for your A team player.   More kids playing means people actually give a damn about soccer.   More viewership, more interest, more college scholarships ...it would be like 30 years ago when no one really  gave a damn about soccer in the US.  It was a Third World sport.  Without those kids “who don’t deserve to be there”, surf cup, national cup, DA games, would be like a bear fartin in the woods. No one would hear it and no one would care.


You're an imbecile.smh

Players would pay the same amount if there wasn't a- z team. Its a business and clubs charge the same amount regardless of level or teams.

Surf Cup and all that other crap you mentioned is meaningless and useless. College would simply pick players from high school, the same quality you get at club soccer.

Club parents don't give a crap about soccer. It's just another opportunity to get college scholarships without any skill involved.


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## INFAMEE (Jan 7, 2018)

lol@joebieber & keepermom

It is what it is


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## Sparky9 (Jan 7, 2018)

More kids playing any sport or doing any worthwhile activity like music is better than them sitting on the couch, playing video games, or staring at a computer all day.


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## Keepermom2 (Jan 7, 2018)

INFAMEE said:


> lol@joebieber & keepermom
> 
> It is what it is


What I disagree with is that "Club parents don't give a crap about soccer.  It's just another opportunity to get college scholarships without any skill involved."   I for one chose club soccer because my daughter wasn't being challenged in rec.  I coached the last year she played rec. (because I was the only parent that showed up to discuss what we were going to do about a coach) and I would simply put my daughter in Goal for 3/4's of the game and then put her forward to score.  She outgrew rec.  She will have many opportunities for scholarships/financial aid just because I am single and I adopted her from an orphanage in another Country.  I in fact laugh when I hear the sales pitch of college scholarship at the age of 11 because I don't even know if she will still like soccer next year.  I love soccer and love watching my daughter play soccer and grow in the Keeper position.  I love what she is learning in that position that will help her in life.   I am not the only one so a sweeping statement like you made is not completely accurate.


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## smellycleats (Jan 7, 2018)

INFAMEE said:


> You're an imbecile.smh
> 
> Players would pay the same amount if there wasn't a- z team. Its a business and clubs charge the same amount regardless of level or teams.
> 
> ...


Infamee you lack a basic understanding of economics if you don’t understand that B, C, and D team fees subsidize your A team player. 
Your argument is weak and obviously meant to provoke a reaction from the forum. Without a solid argument, you resort to name calling.


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## Sheriff Joe (Jan 7, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> Infamee you lack a basic understanding of economics if you don’t understand that B, C, and D team fees subsidize your A team player.
> Your argument is weak and obviously meant to provoke a reaction from the forum. Without a solid argument, you resort to name calling.


Does your A team player have no fees? Mine does.
I am sure different clubs have different fee structures. I know my daughter's travel softball team top team paid 0, 0 for everything, but that was 1 team in the whole organization.


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## smellycleats (Jan 7, 2018)

Sheriff Joe said:


> Does your A team player have no fees? Mine does.
> I am sure different clubs have different fee structures. I know my daughter's travel softball team top team paid 0, 0 for everything, but that was 1 team in the whole organization.





Sheriff Joe said:


> Does your A team player have no fees? Mine does.
> I am sure different clubs have different fee structures. I know my daughter's travel softball team top team paid 0, 0 for everything, but that was 1 team in the whole organization.





Sheriff Joe said:


> Does your A team player have no fees? Mine does.
> I am sure different clubs have different fee structures. I know my daughter's travel softball team top team paid 0, 0 for everything, but that was 1 team in the whole organization.


Definition of subsidize:

1. Pay part of the cost of producing something; to reduce the cost for the buyer

2. To support an organization financially


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## INFAMEE (Jan 7, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> Definition of subsidize:
> 
> 1. Pay part of the cost of producing something; to reduce the cost for the buyer
> 
> 2. To support an organization financially


This is false.

Ask any forum member? Fees are same for A and B or C teams. 

I.E. Surf for example. Coach B03 cares less what 2 other 03 teams charge regardless of level. Go on give them a call. Lol I'll wait.


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## Fact (Jan 7, 2018)

INFAMEE said:


> You're an imbecile.smh
> 
> Players would pay the same amount if there wasn't a- z team. Its a business and clubs charge the same amount regardless of level or teams.
> 
> ...


Another way of subsidizing the A team is thru scholarships.  How many b-z teams do you know that have scholarship players?  None.


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## smellycleats (Jan 7, 2018)

Fact said:


> Another way of subsidizing the A team is thru scholarships.  How many b-z teams do you know that have scholarship players?  None.





Fact said:


> Another way of subsidizing the A team is thru scholarships.  How many b-z teams do you know that have scholarship players?  None.


thank you for explaining this to Infamee.


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## INFAMEE (Jan 8, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> Infamee you lack a basic understanding of economics if you don’t understand that B, C, and D team fees subsidize your A team player.
> Your argument is weak and obviously meant to provoke a reaction from the forum. Without a solid argument, you resort to name calling.


Sheriff Joe's A team player does not get subsidized because of b, c, or z team therefore your argument doesn't hold water.


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## Sheriff Joe (Jan 8, 2018)

smellycleats said:


> Definition of subsidize:
> 
> 1. Pay part of the cost of producing something; to reduce the cost for the buyer
> 
> 2. To support an organization financially


I am not disagreeing, I only know about our club.
From what I know, top players parents ask for scholarships because they are top players, not because of financial hardships. I don't want to pay for any kid to play soccer other than mine. If you can't afford club than go play rec.


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## Chalklines (Jan 11, 2018)

any specific stories anyone's willing to share on why they jumped ship early?

was it actually your player pushing to leave the situation?


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## outside! (Jan 11, 2018)

DD's original team was not going to play in State Cup anyway, and thanks to another knowledgeable parent who told me "she needs to be on a better team" we moved as soon as fall league was over. Looking back I could have told her original coach we were looking around before the move, but at the time I felt that protecting her from potential retaliation by the club was more important. Every other time our players have moved clubs, we waited until State Cup was over.


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## Bananacorner (Jan 11, 2018)

Left our original club for a club who was hiring a new, female coach.  My daughter was tired of all the testosterone and yelling of her previous (male) coaches, and was intrigued, so I let her switch.  Coach was not good, practices were a waste of time.  Then the coach stopped showing up regularly for practices, girls were left with college student or parent.  Then coach actually didn't show up for a game.  Five minutes before game time parents (Dads) were jockeying for position to see who got to coach the game.  My then 9-year old lost it.  After that incident, she refused to go to practices.  She told me it was a complete waste of time and then asked me, "how can we have a real team if we don't even have a real coach?"  I thought she had a point, and I let her leave the team, even though I realized it wasn't "fair" to the other players.  My daughter can't stand going to practices and wasting time, not learning anything, and she doesn't like playing for a coach (or other players) who don't take it seriously.  That being said, I wouldn't have let her quit just because the coach sucked -- it wasn't until I found myself watching a game with a coach/parent yelling "boot the ball!" at my daughter that I agreed to quit.


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## GoldenFjord (Jan 12, 2018)

It's club soccer not Vietnam. If you are shopping around for a new team mid-season you obviously did a terrible job of planning in the first place and you are failing as a parent by teaching your precious little star athlete to bail when the going gets tough. There are exceptions like in Banana's case but even so it sounds like the multiple games and practices provided ample opportunity to find a solution and instead everyone shrugged their shoulders.


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