# 2 games a day



## Eagle33 (Sep 7, 2021)

Just got a message from SoCal that players are now allowed to play 2 games per day. 
What a great way to give freedom to big clubs to have their ECNL, Discovery and Flt 1 players play on Flt 3 and 4 teams. 
Way to go SoCal!

*CLUB PASS RULE:*
If you have a player(s) from your club that is going to club pass to your team (and are age appropriate), write the players name and player id# on all 3 copies of the game report. Players MUST HAVE THEIR PLAYER ID CARD (US CLUB SOCCER card) in order to be eligible to play in the game. A photo of the player card is acceptable as well.

*FOR FALL 2021 - Players can play in TWO games PER DAY. There is no special card for the club pass, the player just needs their player ID cards (or photo of their player ID card).

NOTE ON CLUB PASS RULE:*
Players can only club pass between teams, from their own club with US Club Soccer player cards. Players from other leagues (CSL, Presidio, GA, MLS Next, EA DPL) may NOT club pass to an SOCAL team within your club unless they have a US CLUB SOCCER player card.
ECNL and ECRL players are US Club sanctioned and are eligible to use their ECNL or ECRL player cards to club pass, per the criteria in the Rules & Regulations to SOCAL teams.

There is no roster freeze week-to-week for club passing players and they can be written on the Games Reports even on game day.


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## toucan (Sep 7, 2021)

SoCal (fka SCDSL) has always been generous when it comes to intra-club loaning.  That was one of the reasons for forming the SCDSL in the first place.  It is better than the more restrictive rules of CSL.

Having a gang of ECNL players guesting for a Flight 4 team would be abusive.  I have not seen this happen.  Nevertheless, I agree that there should be some kind of rule to prevent abusive loaning practices.  

There are positives to the SoCal rule.  In this Covid year, when there are fewer players overall, this will allow teams with small rosters to borrow from within their own club, and thus ensure that they will not have to play short.  Players on teams with a long roster will have a chance to guest with other intra-club teams, and thereby get extra time on the field.


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## espola (Sep 7, 2021)

From the game-day instructions page --

"IMPORTANT: READ THE RULES and REGULATIONS on the website. Print them and keep them with you for reference."

Can't find'em.  HELP!?!?


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## timbuck (Sep 7, 2021)

This is because too many teams played "Roster Chicken" over the past 3 months. They had 9 players coming to practice all summer and told players/parents "we'll be fine.  There are players coming out to practice next week."
And now here we are with a week to go before our first game and that team now has 10 players. While the team an age group below them as 13 players. So those younger players will get the "privilege" of playing up with the older team.

I hope everyone has an injury free season.


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## timbuck (Sep 7, 2021)

Or-  The "A" Team has 19 players on the roster.  The "B" team has 12.


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## BIGD (Sep 7, 2021)

I'm hearing of several teams on the boys side, even at the top level, having trouble filling rosters.  Curious if this is an indication of a consumer shift in club soccer or if this is the usual for this time of year.


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## lafalafa (Sep 7, 2021)

BIGD said:


> I'm hearing of several teams on the boys side, even at the top level, having trouble filling rosters.  Curious if this is an indication of a consumer shift in club soccer or if this is the usual for this time of year.


Yeah participation numbers in youth sports after certain ages has seen a drop off in recent years and the covid year has accelerated that trend.

Somebody this weekend told me there is a about a 20-5% decline in local rec players this year compared to the last full year in 2019.   Wonder about the club numbers how much there off peak from 2018-19?

About the socal league flexibility and use of the Usclub cards to pass has some pros and cons. Playing down is one of the cons, ECNL players really shouldn't be playing down in the Socal league.

Play at the same level or above rule like CSL is a good one.    Same with discovery NPL which is stated at the top flight, passing those players down  to flight 1-3 seems like a flaxy way to develop and maybe not a equitable solution to those players on those teams.


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## timbuck (Sep 7, 2021)

I heard that approximately 60 teams dropped out since the schedule came out.  No idea which age groups.


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## lafalafa (Sep 7, 2021)

timbuck said:


> I heard that approximately 60 teams dropped out since the schedule came out.  No idea which age groups.


So the hype or promises didn't live up to reality when the schedule came out, the travel was too much, or did the clubs really have trouble filling those teams?


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## socalkdg (Sep 7, 2021)

lafalafa said:


> About the socal league flexibility and use of the Usclub cards to pass has some pros and cons. Playing down is one of the cons, ECNL players really shouldn't be playing down in the Socal league.
> 
> Play at the same level or above rule like CSL is a good one.    Same with discovery NPL which is stated at the top flight, passing those players down  to flight 1-3 seems like a flaxy way to develop and maybe not a equitable solution to those players on those teams.


Agree.  Move up, never down.   Playing twice in the day at 90 minute games might not be the smartest choice though.  CSL allowed keepers to play twice in the same day.  No one else.


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## timbuck (Sep 7, 2021)

lafalafa said:


> So the hype or promises didn't live up to reality when the schedule came out, the travel was too much, or did the clubs really have trouble filling those teams?


Just my speculation here-  But the ECNL/ECRL/GA/DPL/MLS Next/ETC teams have no problem filling rosters.  They'll take 20 kids at older age groups (which is needed)  But that same club will try and field teams in SoCalLeague and have trouble filling 15 spots.  (Or a local club that doesn't have ecnl/etc can't get kids because they've either moved to ecnl/etc or decided to hang up their cleats).
Covid didn't help-  It certainly accelerated the demise of some teams.


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## BIGD (Sep 7, 2021)

timbuck said:


> Just my speculation here-  But the ECNL/ECRL/GA/DPL/MLS Next/ETC teams have no problem filling rosters.  They'll take 20 kids at older age groups (which is needed)  But that same club will try and field teams in SoCalLeague and have trouble filling 15 spots.  (Or a local club that doesn't have ecnl/etc can't get kids because they've either moved to ecnl/etc or decided to hang up their cleats).
> Covid didn't help-  It certainly accelerated the demise of some teams.


Interestingly the teams I was referring to are MLS Next or ECNL.


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## Speed (Sep 7, 2021)

i looked really fast yesterday and saw some so cal ECNL/ECRL boys teams had 34-36 on rosters?? can this be true--I didn't have time to look closely to see if there are dual rostered players. and I think that may have been 20-21 season


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## Speed (Sep 7, 2021)

36 players-Pateodores U16


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## MyDaughtersAKeeper (Sep 7, 2021)

socalkdg said:


> Agree.  Move up, never down.   Playing twice in the day at 90 minute games might not be the smartest choice though.  CSL allowed keepers to play twice in the same day.  No one else.


Because keepers are crazy!!!  Actually, I have changed my thinking on this as my kid has gotten older.  1 game per day unless it is a tournament, and those should be kept to a minimum.  Too much wear and tear on the field players.  The keepers could have a weekend with nothing to do, then again they could face tons of shots and lots of breakaways - too little reward for the risk. 

I won't tell others what to do, but I encourage parents keep their kids minutes down to a manageable level.


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## timbuck (Sep 7, 2021)

Speed said:


> 36 players-Pateodores U16


Is that 36 on ecnl and 36 on ecnl-rl?  
Or is it 36 between the 2 teams (which would be 18 per roster). Not a bad idea and by rostering players on both teams, it makes the game day procedure easier if players can move up and down between ecnl and rl.


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## Footy30 (Sep 7, 2021)

Speed said:


> 36 players-Pateodores U16


I don't know anything about the Pats (roster wise) but If you're looking at the ECNL website a lot of rosters haven't been updated, it still shows players on the roster of my kids teams who have left for other clubs, so it's showing more players. Look at the app rosters  they're  updated. I do know it's  common for teams to carry 20 (sometimes with only 1 GK)


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## lafalafa (Sep 7, 2021)

Speed said:


> i looked really fast yesterday and saw some so cal ECNL/ECRL boys teams had 34-36 on rosters?? can this be true--I didn't have time to look closely to see if there are dual rostered players. and I think that may have been 20-21 season


30 per team is max roster but x2 teams so 34-36 between the two seems reasonable.   18 game day so > 36 and somebody is not playing unless you have 2 a weekend.


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## timbuck (Sep 8, 2021)

2 games per day can work during a tournament because they "usually" try to spread out the games and they are all played at the same venue.
During the spring season, it was allowed - but rarely worked out.  One team would be playing at 11:30 at field A.  The other team would be playing at 1:30 at field B that is 40 miles away.
Not many parents are going to make that drive.  And for older kids that drive themselves-  They don't want to play two 90 minute games per day.


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## lafalafa (Sep 8, 2021)

timbuck said:


> 2 games per day can work during a tournament because they "usually" try to spread out the games and they are all played at the same venue.
> During the spring season, it was allowed - but rarely worked out.  One team would be playing at 11:30 at field A.  The other team would be playing at 1:30 at field B that is 40 miles away.
> Not many parents are going to make that drive.  And for older kids that drive themselves-  They don't want to play two 90 minute games per day.


90 minutes in the heat of Silverlakes Norco and lots of players can't even go full time in one game.

Maybe for the youngers on the smaller fields with less time.

The "write" in a guest player on the game day roster and bring their USclub card from another league is almost like we don't care about your roster just bring whoever you want that's age appropriate for the the socal league.


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## Speed (Sep 8, 2021)

Footy30 said:


> I don't know anything about the Pats (roster wise) but If you're looking at the ECNL website a lot of rosters haven't been updated, it still shows players on the roster of my kids teams who have left for other clubs, so it's showing more players. Look at the app rosters  they're  updated. I do know it's  common for teams to carry 20 (sometimes with only 1 GK)


you're right my DD plays ecnl and her current roster shows 43 so need the update


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## soccersc (Sep 8, 2021)

Eagle33 said:


> Just got a message from SoCal that players are now allowed to play 2 games per day.
> What a great way to give freedom to big clubs to have their ECNL, Discovery and Flt 1 players play on Flt 3 and 4 teams.
> Way to go SoCal!
> 
> ...


This is all part of the all new US Club Soccer scam.  US Club Soccer lets the leagues monitor and lets them make their own rules, US Club will only get involved if its a major conflict, so they stay out of most of it.  So, think about this, leagues have all the control, so who runs the leagues? Take a look, its all the DOCs from the major clubs.  Now you have all the big clubs running the league and making rules that benefit them!!! Small clubs don't have a huge Player Pool to pull from, its the big clubs that will borrow top players to make sure their team place well.  Funny all the Directors and Technical committee have ECNL teams, which they allow to pull from, but of course teams with EA and MLS Next can't pull players from those teams....this is craziness!!!!

The clubs aren't dumb, they know teams that win bring in the kids....the more you win, the better chance you have of growing your club...so sad they take advantage of parents and kids...At least when Cal South was involved there was some checks and balances....it's only going to get worse...I just don't get it, sure seems like there's a conflict of interest here? 

Board of Directors
Rick Hough         President            West Coast FC
Howard Fink       Vice President   LAFC So Cal
Robert Simon     Treasurer            Beach FC
Dave Mildrew    Member-at-large             So Cal Blues
Greg Gluchowski    Member-at-large       South Slammers              

Technical Committee
Alberto Bru         LAFC So Cal
Tad Bobak           So Cal Blues
Mauricio Ingrassia            Beach FC
Don Ebert            Strikers FC
Reggie Rivas       CA Athletic SC
Josh Hodges       Legends FC
Teddy Chronopolous      Pateadores


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## lafalafa (Sep 8, 2021)

soccersc said:


> This is all part of the all new US Club Soccer scam.  US Club Soccer lets the leagues monitor and lets them make their own rules, US Club will only get involved if its a major conflict, so they stay out of most of it.  So, think about this, leagues have all the control, so who runs the leagues? Take a look, its all the DOCs from the major clubs.  Now you have all the big clubs running the league and making rules that benefit them!!! Small clubs don't have a huge Player Pool to pull from, its the big clubs that will borrow top players to make sure their team place well.  Funny all the Directors and Technical committee have ECNL teams, which they allow to pull from, but of course teams with EA and MLS Next can't pull players from those teams....this is craziness!!!!
> 
> The clubs aren't dumb, they know teams that win bring in the kids....the more you win, the better chance you have of growing your club...so sad they take advantage of parents and kids...At least when Cal South was involved there was some checks and balances....it's only going to get worse...I just don't get it, sure seems like there's a conflict of interest here?
> 
> ...


Club soccer has a lot of fictitious marketing with a bunch of made up names and rules that can benefit a smaller group of players and clubs often.  Everyone does just about anything they can do to game some sort of advantages.

Kind of like demographic capitalism, it works better for top of the food chain,  the future you move down not so much,  the middle tiers get some token rewards and decent standards but it's the 1-5% at the top that get the most out of things.


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## Woodwork (Sep 8, 2021)

Obviously this is in the interest of player development. I mean, it is called Southern California Developmental Soccer League.  Has "developmental" right there in the name.


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## Woodwork (Sep 8, 2021)

soccersc said:


> This is all part of the all new US Club Soccer scam.  US Club Soccer lets the leagues monitor and lets them make their own rules, US Club will only get involved if its a major conflict, so they stay out of most of it.  So, think about this, leagues have all the control, so who runs the leagues? Take a look, its all the DOCs from the major clubs.  Now you have all the big clubs running the league and making rules that benefit them!!! Small clubs don't have a huge Player Pool to pull from, its the big clubs that will borrow top players to make sure their team place well.  Funny all the Directors and Technical committee have ECNL teams, which they allow to pull from, but of course teams with EA and MLS Next can't pull players from those teams....this is craziness!!!!
> 
> The clubs aren't dumb, they know teams that win bring in the kids....the more you win, the better chance you have of growing your club...so sad they take advantage of parents and kids...At least when Cal South was involved there was some checks and balances....it's only going to get worse...I just don't get it, sure seems like there's a conflict of interest here?
> 
> ...


I agree with the general sentiment, but I believe you can pay for a second US Soccer card for players in the other leagues.


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## soccersc (Sep 8, 2021)

Woodwork said:


> Obviously this is in the interest of player development. I mean, it is called Southern California Developmental Soccer League.  Has "developmental" right there in the name.


haha...maybe that's why they took the "developmental" out of the name now, they realized people weren't buying it anymore!!! Maybe they have a little bit of a conscious?


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## lafalafa (Sep 8, 2021)

Woodwork said:


> I agree with the general sentiment, but I believe you can pay for a second US Soccer card for players in the other leagues.


Yes If your club is a member of USclub you can get a player card pretty easily by paying the fee and submitting the waviers and paperwork. Of course the club and league name is normally required.

Clubs have a right to register teams with multiple organizations for USclub.  One card can be used for all most of the time unless at state association required something additional.


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## espola (Sep 8, 2021)

Woodwork said:


> Obviously this is in the interest of player development. I mean, it is called Southern California Developmental Soccer League.  Has "developmental" right there in the name.


Not any more.


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## Woodwork (Sep 8, 2021)

espola said:


> Not any more.


SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA DEVELOPMENTAL SOCCER LEAGUE


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## timbuck (Sep 8, 2021)

Anyone know who runs their web hosting?  Sooooo sllooooowwwwwwwwww


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## lafalafa (Sep 8, 2021)

timbuck said:


> Anyone know who runs their web hosting?  Sooooo sllooooowwwwwwwwww


Some Japanese holding company (Nippon T&T) Provider in a town:  Greenwood Village, Colorado that nobody knows about.  Must have cheap land,  electricity or hosting rates or something?

At least they updated the look and feel from that middle schoolers design they had for years previously.


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## RedCard (Sep 8, 2021)

MyDaughtersAKeeper said:


> *Because keepers are crazy!!!*  Actually, I have changed my thinking on this as my kid has gotten older.  1 game per day unless it is a tournament, and those should be kept to a minimum.  Too much wear and tear on the field players.  *The keepers could have a weekend with nothing to do, then again they could face tons of shots and lots of breakaways* - too little reward for the risk.
> 
> I won't tell others what to do, but I encourage parents keep their kids minutes down to a manageable level.


As a dad of U17 twin keepers (boy and girl), I agree to these 2 statements in bold...lol


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## kickingandscreaming (Sep 8, 2021)

MyDaughtersAKeeper said:


> Because keepers are crazy!!!  Actually, I have changed my thinking on this as my kid has gotten older.  1 game per day unless it is a tournament, and those should be kept to a minimum.  Too much wear and tear on the field players.  The keepers could have a weekend with nothing to do, then again they could face tons of shots and lots of breakaways - too little reward for the risk.
> 
> I won't tell others what to do, but I encourage parents keep their kids minutes down to a manageable level.


Professionals play, at most, two 90 minute games per WEEK, right? There's a good reason they don't have games more often because they'd make more money if they did. Not only are games hard on players physically, but they also take a lot out of the player emotionally. They need downtime.


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## timbuck (Sep 8, 2021)

lafalafa said:


> Some Japanese holding company (Nippon T&T) Provider in a town:  Greenwood Village, Colorado that nobody knows about.  Must have cheap land,  electricity or hosting rates or something?
> 
> *At least they updated the look and feel from that middle schoolers design they had for years previously.*


Just the front end.  The schedules/standings are the same as before.

*"Due to increased traffic, team pages are temporarily unavailable. Peak traffic is usually between the hours of 6PM-8PM and between 10PM-1AM Eastern For peak performance, please consider logging in outside of peak times. The team pages should be available again in approximately 20 minutes"*

Nope-  Been trying throughout the day and can't get in.


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## JumboJack (Sep 8, 2021)

timbuck said:


> This is because too many teams played "Roster Chicken" over the past 3 months. They had 9 players coming to practice all summer and told players/parents "we'll be fine.  There are players coming out to practice next week."
> And now here we are with a week to go before our first game and that team now has 10 players. While the team an age group below them as 13 players. So those younger players will get the "privilege" of playing up with the older team.
> 
> I hope everyone has an injury free season.


This is my DD’s team. But they have 12 players so I guess we’re lucky.


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## keeprunning (Sep 9, 2021)

BIGD said:


> I'm hearing of several teams on the boys side, even at the top level, having trouble filling rosters.  Curious if this is an indication of a consumer shift in club soccer or if this is the usual for this time of year.


Too many clubs.


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## soccerchaffeur (Sep 9, 2021)

RedCard said:


> As a dad of U17 twin keepers (boy and girl), I agree to these 2 statements in bold...lol


You must be so proud! I have twin boys who both play club, and they actually share the keeper position(half & half). They're only 2012's, so they play the field as well. I love your story!


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## Surfref (Sep 10, 2021)

espola said:


> From the game-day instructions page --
> 
> "IMPORTANT: READ THE RULES and REGULATIONS on the website. Print them and keep them with you for reference."
> 
> Can't find'em.  HELP!?!?


I was looking for the rules also and could not find them.


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## bubster (Sep 10, 2021)

lafalafa said:


> So the hype or promises didn't live up to reality when the schedule came out, the travel was too much, or did the clubs really have trouble filling those teams?


The travel is ridiculous at best. It's like they don't know how to use Google maps. If you are going to have 2 flights in San Diego you don't go with east and west, you go with north and south. As it is we have teams travelling almost 70 miles for 8am and 9am games.


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