# Discovery and college



## Speed (Apr 24, 2019)

Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


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## jpeter (Apr 24, 2019)

Speed said:


> Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


Discovery last season was just another league division with a new name from what I heard...   yeah can play those sanctioned tournments (Surf, Man City) or showcases (Vegas, Legends, etc) if your team gets accepted.

With the new NCCA rules showcases maybe not that popular anymore unless u16-17+


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## The Godfather (Apr 24, 2019)

Speed said:


> Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


Discovery does NOT attract college coaches.  Plus, many of the top Discovery teams in Socal will be leaving due to many of the players moving to ECNL where college coaches will most likely be spending their time.


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## The Godfather (Apr 24, 2019)

Speed said:


> Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


What club was  your team with that you are being dropped?


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## timbuck (Apr 24, 2019)

The Godfather said:


> What club was  your team with that you are being dropped?


Probably because the club found a shiny new toy (coach) that was willing to bring his team over. (I have no insight on this at all. Pure speculation on my part. But why else would an entire team move from dpl to Discovery)


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## Overtime (Apr 25, 2019)

DPL is it's own closed league.  Discovery in just another name for the highest tier of SCDSL.  Moving from DPL back to SCDSL does not guarantee a spot in Discovery.  Saying your team is dropping from DPL to Discovery implies that DPL is superior....minus Lengends (speaking of 02s) the teams in SCDSL Discovery and other levels regularly beat the DPL teams in CRL, showcases etc....There are clubs such as RSC and Beach where some of their SCDSL teams are stronger than their DPL teams.


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## Messi>CR7 (Apr 25, 2019)

jpeter said:


> Discovery last season was just another league division with a new name from what I heard...   yeah can play those sanctioned tournments (Surf, Man City) or showcases (Vegas, Legends, etc) if your team gets accepted.
> 
> With the new NCCA rules showcases maybe not that popular anymore unless u16-17+


If I'm reading the new rules correctly, doesn't it means there really is no reason to have showcases for U16 and younger?


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## socalkdg (Apr 25, 2019)

The rule modification says:  Effective May 1, 2019, college coaches will be allowed to directly initiate recruiting-related discussions with potential recruits starting on June 15 at the end of the player’s sophomore year. This is two and a half months earlier than the previous date of September 1 for players entering their junior year. 

Note that the recruiting rules changed a year ago, and that this modification allows contact sooner.   Also note this is for coaches to initiate contact, players have been and still can contact coaches on their own.


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## MA0812 (Apr 25, 2019)

Speed said:


> Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


As previously mentioned, Discovery was just another tier within SCDSL. There were no scouts at any of our games and the Discovery showcase which we didnt participate in due to CRL games was a bust. There were only 6 teams I believe and if my memory is correct 3 did not play in discovery and 2 of the 3 that did were the bottom of Discovery. 

The difference between DPL and say Discovery is all over the board in terms of which is a higher level of play.  The talent in SoCal is so spread out and everyone has their reasons for going one direction or the other. In our case specifically, we did not lose to any DPL teams from SoCal or out of state DPL teams this past year. Not sure that really is an effective measurement but that's how it played out for us.

As for other showcases, there were no restrictions and you were free to play in as many as your team wanted. As mentioned in a previous post, several teams are either moving to ECNL, ECNL II or being dispersed between the two for a few of the larger clubs that are not participating in DA. I'm not sure where that leaves Discovery in terms of the actual level of play going forward. Moving teams up from SCDSL Champions would be more semantics that anything else. Discovery was over sold, under delivered, and the only real upside (debatable) was all teams in your age group played in Norco around the same time every weekend so there was at least consistency with the field quality as opposed to the varying quality/condition of home fields for the various clubs. 

So goes the business of youth soccer I suppose as everyone chases the carrot.


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## Messi>CR7 (Apr 25, 2019)

socalkdg said:


> The rule modification says:  Effective May 1, 2019, college coaches will be allowed to directly initiate recruiting-related discussions with potential recruits starting on June 15 at the end of the player’s sophomore year. This is two and a half months earlier than the previous date of September 1 for players entering their junior year.
> 
> Note that the recruiting rules changed a year ago, and that this modification allows contact sooner.   Also note this is for coaches to initiate contact, players have been and still can contact coaches on their own.


http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/di-council-adopts-rules-curb-early-recruiting

_"The proposal for most sports would allow communication — either from or to a coach — June 15 after the sophomore year of high school and would allow visits beginning Aug. 1 before the junior year of high school."_

I could be wrong, but I read it as no contact "to" a coach either before June 15.


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## Desert Hound (Apr 25, 2019)

Messi>CR7 said:


> If I'm reading the new rules correctly, doesn't it means there really is no reason to have showcases for U16 and younger?


No that would be incorrect. 

While the coaches cannot communicate with the kids, they still need to see who is out there. So there is absolutely value to doing showcases at U16 and younger.


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## Banana Hammock (Apr 25, 2019)

Desert Hound said:


> No that would be incorrect.
> 
> While the coaches cannot communicate with the kids, they still need to see who is out there. So there is absolutely value to doing showcases at U16 and younger.


There may be some value for girls U16 but none for boys.


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## electrichead72 (Apr 25, 2019)

ok, I'm new to all of this, so why do you say no value for boys?


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## Dummy (Apr 25, 2019)

MA0812 said:


> As previously mentioned, Discovery was just another tier within SCDSL. There were no scouts at any of our games and the Discovery showcase which we didnt participate in due to CRL games was a bust. There were only 6 teams I believe and if my memory is correct 3 did not play in discovery and 2 of the 3 that did were the bottom of Discovery.
> 
> The difference between DPL and say Discovery is all over the board in terms of which is a higher level of play.  The talent in SoCal is so spread out and everyone has their reasons for going one direction or the other. In our case specifically, we did not lose to any DPL teams from SoCal or out of state DPL teams this past year. Not sure that really is an effective measurement but that's how it played out for us...
> 
> So goes the business of youth soccer I suppose as everyone chases the carrot.


We played Discovery as well and completely agree with your assessment - especially that talent is spread out.  We also beat every DPL team we faced.  We struggled against top SoCal ECNL teams.  We did not play any DA teams this season, but we beat one last season.  We probably would have struggled against top DA teams this season as well, but DA coaches were nevertheless openly recruiting our players.

D1 and academic D3 coaches from SoCal colleges would come to our Discovery games in Norco occasionally to watch the players on our team that they were recruiting.  Because they are in the middle of their own seasons, it seems that is about as good as it gets.

The majority of the team is playing college soccer next year - some D1 and others academic D3.  We were fortunate to have a great coach and dedicated families and players.  That is what made the difference.  We happened to be in Discovery, but we would have had the same experience in any league as long as our team’s internal management systems remained the same.

No college coach ever asked our players about what league our team played, but every coach asked about our players’ GPA and standardized test scores.  We always kept this in mind, and it had the effect of limiting how much we all chased.

To the original poster, good luck finding what is best for your player.


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## Desert Hound (Apr 25, 2019)

electrichead72 said:


> ok, I'm new to all of this, so why do you say no value for boys?


I have to agree with that question as well. Why no value for boys?

They don't go to college? 

There absolutely is value for them as well going to showcases younger than U16 going forward.


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## outside! (Apr 25, 2019)

Desert Hound said:


> I have to agree with that question as well. Why no value for boys?
> 
> They don't go to college?
> 
> There absolutely is value for them as well going to showcases younger than U16 going forward.


Boys mature so much later that games before U16 do not show how they might play and compare to other players when they are in college.


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## jpeter (Apr 25, 2019)

outside! said:


> Boys mature so much later that games before U16 do not show how they might play and compare to other players when they are in college.


That and the fact <U16 is middle school or freshman in high school for 4 yr schools for most boys  in SoCal.

With so many so-called showcases or ID camps hard to see the value for boys that are Sophomores going to be Juniors in the summer going forward with the new rules.

The overused /marketed showcases or camps have spread things out so much that unless a set of specific coaches/schools will be attending that a player is interested in they can become boring for the players and little or no value to them.

Personally I think the better tournments, playoffs, and coaches coming to practices (setup by your college coordinate or coaches)  to see interested players are more motivating and a better value than just another showcase or camp.  I would say they had/have 10x or more college types following them that way as opposed to some college showcases they attended but did get some interest in those as well, so I would say limited value and not a great bang for the buck or time.


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## RocketFile (Apr 25, 2019)

College coaches are generally NOT going to ECNL or Discovery or Premier or any other league games or league showcases on a fishing expedition to see what amazing recruits they may find. 

They go to games of all stripes, even high school games in some markets, to see specific kids that they have specific interest in recruiting/assessing.

Sure, the showcases and high caliber events such as Surf Cup or Jefferson Cup attract a lot of coaches simply because there are many teams in a concentrated area for 2-3 days and they can see a dozen of the kids they are already interested in.

Is there a chance that your kid may make a splash and have a moment in front of a coach that was there to recruit someone else? Sure. But it would have to check lots of other boxes both ways from fit, to geography, to grades, to position, etc. for there to be a match.

Your kid gets on the radar screen in good old fashioned ways like reaching out to coaches from programs that they are interested in and explaining their interest and providing a video tape and bragging about their grades and other accomplishments. If your kid is at the right level and plays the right style and position the coach will make every effort to seem him/her play - wherever!

These pissing contests over which league or which showcase has the most coaches are hilarious and maddening because it reeks of both total ignorance of the process and a gross lack of self belief.


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## soccerfun (Apr 25, 2019)

Speed said:


> Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


It is true that Discovery league is just another league; however,  DPL is also just another league - no better or worse than Discovery.


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## timbuck (Apr 25, 2019)

Save the money on showcases and buy a camera setup and video editing software.


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## Simisoccerfan (Apr 25, 2019)

RocketFile said:


> College coaches are generally NOT going to ECNL or Discovery or Premier or any other league games or league showcases on a fishing expedition to see what amazing recruits they may find.
> 
> They go to games of all stripes, even high school games in some markets, to see specific kids that they have specific interest in recruiting/assessing.
> 
> ...


My dd had several offers from coaches that saw her at showcase and she had never written or reached out to those schools.  In fact the school she chose to attend is one of these schools.  I also know of other girls that had the same thing happen.   It is ironic that with all of the endless reaching out to coaches on her part that this activity ended up having nothing to do with the opportunities she had.   The key though is you need to be playing ECNL or DA.  Then you will be seen for sure by alot of coaches.  If your playing DPL or some other league you need to work the system as you mentioned above.


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## El Clasico (Apr 25, 2019)

RocketFile said:


> College coaches are generally NOT going to ECNL or Discovery or Premier or any other league games or league showcases on a fishing expedition to see what amazing recruits they may find.
> 
> They go to games of all stripes, even high school games in some markets, to see specific kids that they have specific interest in recruiting/assessing.
> 
> ...


Save your breath Rocket, this has been stated over and over and over again by lots of parents on this board who have already been through the process. I think that the reason so many are concerned by an almost zero factor, like which league you play in, is because some are holding out hope where effort should be.  If the kid works hard, GETS THE GRADES, and puts in the effort to contact coaches, visit schools, research academic programs, etc., etc., they will have a much better chance at getting into the right school.  However, I do know some that have taken bread crumbs from the wrong schools/programs just to save face and be able to tell friends and family that their investment paid off just to have it all far apart very quickly afterwards.


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## The Godfather (Apr 25, 2019)

Dummy said:


> We played Discovery as well and completely agree with your assessment - especially that talent is spread out.  We also beat every DPL team we faced.  We struggled against top SoCal ECNL teams.  We did not play any DA teams this season, but we beat one last season.  We probably would have struggled against top DA teams this season as well, but DA coaches were nevertheless openly recruiting our players.
> 
> D1 and academic D3 coaches from SoCal colleges would come to our Discovery games in Norco occasionally to watch the players on our team that they were recruiting.  Because they are in the middle of their own seasons, it seems that is about as good as it gets.
> 
> ...


This is a well thought out post and well said.  Completely makes sense and I am sure why your success was so good.  Good luck to your girls.


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## DPLLove (Apr 25, 2019)

Overtime said:


> DPL is it's own closed league.  Discovery in just another name for the highest tier of SCDSL.  Moving from DPL back to SCDSL does not guarantee a spot in Discovery.  Saying your team is dropping from DPL to Discovery implies that DPL is superior....minus Lengends (speaking of 02s) the teams in SCDSL Discovery and other levels regularly beat the DPL teams in CRL, showcases etc....There are clubs such as RSC and Beach where some of their SCDSL teams are stronger than their DPL teams.


To say that DPL teams are regularly beat by Discovery Teams is completely ridiculous. Unfounded and absolutely not true!


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## MakeAPlay (Apr 26, 2019)

timbuck said:


> Save the money on showcases and buy a camera setup and video editing software.


I never made one video of my daughter playing and she did okay.  Coaches recruit players not teams or leagues.  Reaching out to schools that a player is interested in and knowing the appropriate level of play is the real key.  D1 soccer has over 320 teams on the women’s side and they vary widely in their level of play.  A kid that is a star at Mississippi Valley State might not even be able to keep up with the drills that they run at UCLA, Stanford or Florida State.


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## Toepoke (Apr 26, 2019)

MakeAPlay said:


> ...Reaching out to schools that a player is interested in and *knowing the appropriate level of play is the real key*..


This is so important. I have posted previously about doing the homework on schools before the NCAA changed its rules on recruiting and the same philosophy still applies regardless of team/league the player is a part of. But the key is being realistic at the schools the player is interested in if they want to earn time during games. Not everyone can play at a top D1 school and that's not a bad thing.


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## MakeAPlay (Apr 26, 2019)

Toepoke said:


> This is so important. I have posted previously about doing the homework on schools before the NCAA changed its rules on recruiting and the same philosophy still applies regardless of team/league the player is a part of. But the key is being realistic at the schools the player is interested in if they want to earn time during games. Not everyone can play at a top D1 school and that's not a bad thing.


As the Fonz would say, “Correctomundo!”  I have said it time and time again, there is a college program for any decent female soccer player that wants to continue playing and is willing to put in the work.


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## Overlap (Apr 29, 2019)

Speed said:


> Our team is being dropped from DPL to Discovery. For those that play Discovery are there opportunities to be seen by college coaches? I assume Vegas would be the only showcase this level would be able to play? No surf cup, etc. Am I wrong? Appreciate any input.


I'm assuming your concern is your kid is interested in playing at the collegiate level - semi short version is, it doesn't matter which "league" your kids team plays in however, what does matter is which tournaments they play in, ie, Jefferson Cup, Las Vegas Players Showcase, Surf etc., your kid needs to be "seen" and that's where the college coaches go to see if player's fit what they're looking for. If your kids team is NOT playing in any of the high profile tournaments, your odds are slim of playing on past the club level unless he/she is personally invited to attend the schools ID Camp (and not a mass email invite, he/she will know the difference when you get it), the other issue is, if the team is younger than U16 and hasn't played in the college ID tournaments prior, you run the risk of the team not getting in if they reach max numbers. They can always add their name to the tournament "guest" pool but, that's taking a risk he/she will get a call. *I received a really nice email from a player that guested with our team last year, she just committed and the coach from the school she committed to, pulled out the recruiting brochure from last year with her picture circled in red so, it does matter. Best of luck on his/her soccer journey!


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## SD_Soccer (Apr 29, 2019)

MakeAPlay said:


> I never made one video of my daughter playing and she did okay.  Coaches recruit players not teams or leagues.  Reaching out to schools that a player is interested in and knowing the appropriate level of play is the real key.  D1 soccer has over 320 teams on the women’s side and they vary widely in their level of play.  A kid that is a star at Mississippi Valley State might not even be able to keep up with the drills that they run at UCLA, Stanford or Florida State.


Spot on.  And parents and kids sometimes get hung up on level (D1, D2, D3 or NAIA) assuming D1 is always better than D2, which is always better than D3.  Go look at which clubs and teams some of the top academic and athletic D3 schools recruit from-- often better than the D1 school in the middle of nowhere with decent academics.  

The goal for all should be to get an education and a degree to help start a good career (or get into a good grad school).  Do what you can to support your child getting into a good school and getting as much financial support as they can (athletic and/or merit-based).  My daughter is going to a strong academic D3 that she got a lot more of her costs covered than many of her friends going to random D1 and D2 schools with questionable academics-- and her team would beat many of those teams if they played.  But their mom and dad can proudly say their kid is playing D1 soccer...


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## Speed (Apr 29, 2019)

Overlap said:


> I'm assuming your concern is your kid is interested in playing at the collegiate level - semi short version is, it doesn't matter which "league" your kids team plays in however, what does matter is which tournaments they play in, ie, Jefferson Cup, Las Vegas Players Showcase, Surf etc., your kid needs to be "seen" and that's where the college coaches go to see if player's fit what they're looking for. If your kids team is NOT playing in any of the high profile tournaments, your odds are slim of playing on past the club level unless he/she is personally invited to attend the schools ID Camp (and not a mass email invite, he/she will know the difference when you get it), the other issue is, if the team is younger than U16 and hasn't played in the college ID tournaments prior, you run the risk of the team not getting in if they reach max numbers. They can always add their name to the tournament "guest" pool but, that's taking a risk he/she will get a call. *I received a really nice email from a player that guested with our team last year, she just committed and the coach from the school she committed to, pulled out the recruiting brochure from last year with her picture circled in red so, it does matter. Best of luck on his/her soccer journey!


Thank you! This response confirms what I was thinking. And that is the level of the team can determine what tournaments they can go to and play in. Thank you for the detailed knowledge as I am forever grateful to learn about what I don't know. And yes, my kid does want to play in college hence the question. 

That is nice that the players family followed up with you and that you gave them the opportunity to guest.


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## outside! (Apr 30, 2019)

Overlap said:


> If your kids team is NOT playing in any of the high profile tournaments, your odds are slim of playing on past the club level unless he/she is personally invited to attend the schools ID Camp (and not a mass email invite, he/she will know the difference when you get it), the other issue is, if the team is younger than U16 and hasn't played in the college ID tournaments prior, you run the risk of the team not getting in if they reach max numbers.


Some good stuff Overlap, but a personnel invite to an ID Camp is not required. While DD was on a top level team, she was noticed by her college coach at a winter ID camp at the school. He did not know who she was until that camp. The moral of the story, there are many ways to get noticed, but when the time comes the player needs to stand out.


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## futboldad1 (Apr 30, 2019)

Dummy said:


> We played Discovery as well and completely agree with your assessment - especially that talent is spread out.  We also beat every DPL team we faced.  We struggled against top SoCal ECNL teams.  We did not play any DA teams this season, but we beat one last season.  We probably would have struggled against top DA teams this season as well, but DA coaches were nevertheless openly recruiting our players.
> 
> D1 and academic D3 coaches from SoCal colleges would come to our Discovery games in Norco occasionally to watch the players on our team that they were recruiting.  Because they are in the middle of their own seasons, it seems that is about as good as it gets.
> 
> ...


This is a very good post above, Dummy (not a good name for you!),.....so I'm reposting it.



RocketFile said:


> College coaches are generally NOT going to ECNL or Discovery or Premier or any other league games or league showcases on a fishing expedition to see what amazing recruits they may find.
> 
> They go to games of all stripes, even high school games in some markets, to see specific kids that they have specific interest in recruiting/assessing.
> 
> ...


The last paragraph by RocketFile hits the nail squarely on the head.


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## Overlap (Apr 30, 2019)

Speed said:


> Thank you! This response confirms what I was thinking. And that is the level of the team can determine what tournaments they can go to and play in. Thank you for the detailed knowledge as I am forever grateful to learn about what I don't know. And yes, my kid does want to play in college hence the question.
> 
> That is nice that the players family followed up with you and that you gave them the opportunity to guest.


Just know you can do this yourself, I did a ton of research back when my oldest was in 8th grade (way too early but, I was determined to learn how it was done), while your kid will have to do a lot of the actual communication, you don't need to pay for someone to do it for you, (unless you want to save your relationship with your kid ) I wish I knew sooner what I know now, there are many ways to make it happen, the best way is, having your kid send the emails to coaches at schools he'd like to attend, asking them to see him play, tell him not to expect a reply but, make sure to follow up with a "thank you" to all, they may or may not show up the first time and they may only see him play for a short period, just don't get discouraged and never give up as it can happen anytime Jr/Sr year, sooner if he's on their radar from seeing him play already. The MOST IMPORTANT ADVISE to your kid - GRADES MATTER, my oldest received what we thought was great package, her grades were not that good, her sister committed to the same school a few months back with terrific grades and her merit money was huge, while they're both attending the same school, one is attending for less than a CA UC school  again, best of luck!....enjoy the journey as it goes really fast


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