# Surf Cup



## soccer4us (Nov 12, 2020)

I'm curious what Nor Cal clubs/ages are planning to attend Surf Cup in Phoenix end of December/early January. 

Hopefully the event takes place but appears to be a toss up if cases/hospitalizations continue rising for the next 4-5 weeks.


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## dad4 (Nov 13, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> I'm curious what Nor Cal clubs/ages are planning to attend Surf Cup in Phoenix end of December/early January.
> 
> Hopefully the event takes place but appears to be a toss up if cases/hospitalizations continue rising for the next 4-5 weeks.


If cases get worse, it makes sense to put it off yet again.  Too many flights/hotels/restaurants/crowds.  At some point, individual kids cancel, but I don’t know when that is. 

That said, I really wish the state would carve out some kind of loophole to allow some kind of local games.  Even two games a month would be enough to keep my kid happy through June.


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## happy9 (Nov 13, 2020)

dad4 said:


> If cases get worse, it makes sense to put it off yet again.  Too many flights/hotels/restaurants/crowds.  At some point, individual kids cancel, but I don’t know when that is.
> 
> That said, I really wish the state would carve out some kind of loophole to allow some kind of local games.  Even two games a month would be enough to keep my kid happy through June.


Honestly, I wish they would just cancel already.  It would be nice to give players a natural break for the holidays.  Stay home, be with your families, etc.  It's a narrow view, but AZ players would benefit from the natural winter break.  

For AZ teams, this forces players to make decisions, unless  HS winter sports are pushed back into late JAN, which is possible at this point.  Hell, it's possible that the county pulls the plug on fields over the holidays.   

I know the CA teams haven't played as much and would like to get in some games.  It's too bad that CA can't figure out how to safely play youth soccer, keep people from traveling outside of the state, etc.  I know surf sports l needs a revenue generating event and Phoenix area hospitality industry would also certainly benefit.  We will see what happens.


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## ITFC Blues (Nov 13, 2020)

Travel Advisory
					






					www.cdph.ca.gov
				












						West Coast states recommend 2-week travel quarantine
					

They're also urging everyone to stay local.




					www.sfgate.com
				




The *recommended* 14 day quarantine upon return for California, Oregon, and Washington will make people think twice about going to Surf Cup.


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## whatithink (Nov 13, 2020)

happy9 said:


> Honestly, I wish they would just cancel already.  It would be nice to give players a natural break for the holidays.  Stay home, be with your families, etc.  It's a narrow view, but AZ players would benefit from the natural winter break.
> 
> For AZ teams, this forces players to make decisions, unless  HS winter sports are pushed back into late JAN, which is possible at this point.  Hell, it's possible that the county pulls the plug on fields over the holidays.
> 
> I know the CA teams haven't played as much and would like to get in some games.  It's too bad that CA can't figure out how to safely play youth soccer, keep people from traveling outside of the state, etc.  I know surf sports l needs a revenue generating event and Phoenix area hospitality industry would also certainly benefit.  We will see what happens.


HS soccer has been pushed with no date set, dependent on some dashboard or other. I agree that there's no guarantee that it'll start before Christmas.

I see Brophy just told all parents that you *can't *do club sports and in-person learning, no exceptions. So online for any kids that want to do club.


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## soccer4us (Nov 13, 2020)

If I had to guess in CA, it could be summer before games allowed. MAYBE April if a vaccine readily available to the masses in CA but that will be delayed because of Newsome's lack of trust in vaccine being made right now. 

If I had to bet 100k, I'd say Mayors and Surf cup will get cancelled but hopeful they can occur. The trend is just not good and most likely will get worse with thanksgiving. 

What is Brophy?


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## whatithink (Nov 14, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> If I had to guess in CA, it could be summer before games allowed. MAYBE April if a vaccine readily available to the masses in CA but that will be delayed because of Newsome's lack of trust in vaccine being made right now.
> 
> If I had to bet 100k, I'd say Mayors and Surf cup will get cancelled but hopeful they can occur. The trend is just not good and most likely will get worse with thanksgiving.
> 
> What is Brophy?


The Brophy comment was in reply to an AZ comment. Its an all boys private school in Phoenix. It's also packed full of top sports talent from across the valley and across clubs, so multiple MLS Next and ECNL players (and other leagues in AZ). Its had a lot of COVID clusters in its sports teams, football, swimming, wrestling etc. 

On the AZ front, some school districts are starting to go back into online from 11/23. I'd say Surf Cup in Phoenix is at best touch and go at this point.


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## soccer4us (Nov 14, 2020)

whatithink said:


> The Brophy comment was in reply to an AZ comment. Its an all boys private school in Phoenix. It's also packed full of top sports talent from across the valley and across clubs, so multiple MLS Next and ECNL players (and other leagues in AZ). Its had a lot of COVID clusters in its sports teams, football, swimming, wrestling etc.
> 
> On the AZ front, some school districts are starting to go back into online from 11/23. I'd say Surf Cup in Phoenix is at best touch and go at this point.


Thanks. It seems wild to me a school can have that control over families. While I understand the school wants to keep itself and students/faculy safe, so unfair to the children to that on them. 

I agree with you on surf cup. I heard some from some at the current AZ ecnl event good chance it's cancelled. I imagine we'll know more shortly after thanksgiving or so. I believe Nevada is seeing how the next 2 weeks ago before making a decision on Mayors Cup.


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## lafalafa (Nov 14, 2020)

If the NCAA extends the D1 blackout period again (March 2021) like anticipated next week Surf once again is cursed it seems and another reschedule could be coming especially with the recent upticks.

Since a high majority of teams are travelling to this event and advisories have been published at this point it's sort of a gamble to plan on attending.


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## happy9 (Nov 14, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> Thanks. It seems wild to me a school can have that control over families. While I understand the school wants to keep itself and students/faculy safe, so unfair to the children to that on them.
> 
> I agree with you on surf cup. I heard some from some at the current AZ ecnl event good chance it's cancelled. I imagine we'll know more shortly after thanksgiving or so. I believe Nevada is seeing how the next 2 weeks ago before making a decision on Mayors Cup.


ASA (Arizona Soccer Association) put out a notice yesterday that for now, Soccer in AZ remains viable.  There hasn't been any report of spread  within a single team, club, or between opponents.  Teams have been quarantined due to positive test, but spread hasn't occurred within teams.    Sounds like protocols have been working.  Was at a game last night where everyone on the sideline was wearing masks. I must say, it's the first time I've seen everyone wearing masks once they are situated on the sideline.  Put on your mask and call it a day - there are bigger grenades to jump on than mask wearing.  I think it's silly to wear a mask outside when more than 10 ft apart from others but oh well, kids are playing soccer. 

Players and parents don't want to be the reason that protocols aren't being followed.  If the county/state decides to shut things down, so be it.  But it won't be because club soccer is driving bad metrics. 

Some school districts are going to distance learning next week and others are  calling parents and telling them they are no where close to exceeding metrics that require moving to online.

If a player/family has concerns, don't play, don't come watch, stay home and stay safe.


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## Speed (Nov 14, 2020)

wh


whatithink said:


> HS soccer has been pushed with no date set, dependent on some dashboard or other. I agree that there's no guarantee that it'll start before Christmas.
> 
> I see Brophy just told all parents that you *can't *do club sports and in-person learning, no exceptions. So online for any kids that want to do club.


o is Brophy?


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## SoccerLocker (Nov 14, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> Thanks. It seems wild to me a school can have that control over families. While I understand the school wants to keep itself and students/faculy safe, so unfair to the children to that on them.


This cuts both ways.  Private schools can make their own rules.  They were everyone's favorite when they opened in person before public schools.  They can also tell you to stay home.

Brophy just ended a 32 year in a row state championship streak in swimming, due to not being able to compete b/c COVID.


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## soccer4us (Nov 14, 2020)

I'm hearing today CA will put out youth sports update this week and will include NO travel out of start until at least Jan. 1st which would kill mayors cup and Surf cup I'm guessing too. On a positive, If you're in the orange  tier or yellow, soccer game vs team in county or bordering county will be allowed. I'm guessing many counties even in orange tiers today may drop to red soon though but soccer games wouldn't be allowed. Anyone else hear this?? This is just rumors for now but makes some sense based on patterns set forth by the state.


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## NorcalsoccerYNWA (Nov 14, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> I'm hearing today CA will put out youth sports update this week and will include NO travel out of start until at least Jan. 1st which would kill mayors cup and Surf cup I'm guessing too. On a positive, If you're in the orange  tier or yellow, soccer game vs team in county or bordering county will be allowed. I'm guessing many counties even in orange tiers today may drop to red soon though but soccer games wouldn't be allowed. Anyone else hear this?? This is just rumors for now but makes some sense based on patterns set forth by the state.


I’ve heard similar...very hard to now tell people planning to fly for a tournament for thanksgiving or Mayors Cup to cancel flights, hotels, car rental etc and not lose some money in the process...hopefully the update comes out early in the week so people can plan...I wonder what penalties will be for those breaking the rules...


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## Footy30 (Nov 14, 2020)

NorcalsoccerYNWA said:


> I’ve heard similar...very hard to now tell people planning to fly for a tournament for thanksgiving or Mayors Cup to cancel flights, hotels, car rental etc and not lose some money in the process...hopefully the update comes out early in the week so people can plan...I wonder what penalties will be for those breaking the rules...


The only good thing (if you can call it that) is almost all airlines and hotels are giving full refunds if plans are canceled due to Covid/Covid restrictions.  I say almost all because I'm sure there is one airline/hotel that will try to credit you.


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## jimlewis (Nov 14, 2020)

Oh boy, that guidance will go over like a cough in church.


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## soccer4us (Nov 14, 2020)

jimlewis said:


> Oh boy, that guidance will go over like a cough in church.


Unless counties/cities/school districts take fields from clubs, expect many to keep traveling assuming events aren't cancelled. Newsome is probably calling Mayor's and Surf to pay them off to cancel their tournaments!


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## dad4 (Nov 14, 2020)

.t


soccer4us said:


> I'm hearing today CA will put out youth sports update this week and will include NO travel out of start until at least Jan. 1st which would kill mayors cup and Surf cup I'm guessing too. On a positive, If you're in the orange  tier or yellow, soccer game vs team in county or bordering county will be allowed. I'm guessing many counties even in orange tiers today may drop to red soon though but soccer games wouldn't be allowed. Anyone else hear this?? This is just rumors for now but makes some sense based on patterns set forth by the state.


 It may be a while before we can get back to orange.

But local games would be great.   I am happy if this means we give up Surf but get leagues again.  

Only really stinks for south central valley clubs who don't have good teams in neighboring counties.


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## soccer4us (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> .t
> 
> It may be a while before we can get back to orange.
> 
> ...


And Newsome knows that very well most of the main populated counties will be in Red very soon if not already. Why couldn't something like this been done 2-3 months ago in terms of the tiers/what sports allowed? Many could have been playing local games like most of the country without risking traveling out of state. My other big question would be, is it Newsome alone who decides when youth sports can travel again? If so, very scary having one person with that much power. I guess we'll see if they announce something next week


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> And Newsome knows that very well most of the main populated counties will be in Red very soon if not already. Why couldn't something like this been done 2-3 months ago in terms of the tiers/what sports allowed? Many could have been playing local games like most of the country without risking traveling out of state. My other big question would be, is it Newsome alone who decides when youth sports can travel again? If so, very scary having one person with that much power. I guess we'll see if they announce something next week


Agree the change could and should have happened months go.

My county is moving back to red, too.  

But I am mostly mad at the county for opening up indoor dining.  We had the CDC report.  We knew indoor dining was a risk.  And they did it anyway.  

Now cases are four times as high, and restaurants are closed again.  It gave them a grand total of four weeks of revenue, and screwed up our disease control program for months.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> Agree the change could and should have happened months go.
> 
> My county is moving back to red, too.
> 
> ...


Did they share the number of cases that are linked to indoor dining?


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> Did they share the number of cases that are linked to indoor dining?


We wouldn’t know.   Our contact tracing stinks.  The vast majority of cases are not linked to anything.   

If you had to go by contact tracing, you would conclude that the disease spreads by magic.

There are good studies on restaurants/bars causing covid transmission, but they are on the statistical analysis level, not the individual case level.  We can tell you that we are 99.9% certain that indoor dining raises covid rates, but we can’t tell you whether Bob got covid at McDonald’s.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> We wouldn’t know.   Our contact tracing stinks.  The vast majority of cases are not linked to anything.
> 
> If you had to go by contact tracing, you would conclude that the disease spreads by magic.
> 
> There are good studies on restaurants/bars causing covid transmission, but they are on the statistical analysis level, not the individual case level.  We can tell you that we are 99.9% certain that indoor dining raises covid rates, but we can’t tell you whether Bob got covid at McDonald’s.


The studies are without social distancing, limiting of patrons and other protocols.  See, that is the problem.  Decisions are being made based on science without protocols.


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> The studies are without social distancing, limiting of patrons and other protocols.  See, that is the problem.  Decisions are being made based on science without protocols.


The studies are of the summer reopenings, complete with restricted capacity, social distancing, and the rest of it.

We tried opening with lots of clorox and putting a tape X on the seats.  Turns out, it is still a bad idea for people from 5-10 different homes to go to the same room, all take their masks off, and eat and talk for 75 minutes.

It just got worse, because now the restaurant closes their windows because it is cold.  When they did the studies, those windows were open.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> We wouldn’t know.   Our contact tracing stinks.  The vast majority of cases are not linked to anything.
> 
> If you had to go by contact tracing, you would conclude that the disease spreads by magic.
> 
> There are good studies on restaurants/bars causing covid transmission, but they are on the statistical analysis level, not the individual case level.  We can tell you that we are 99.9% certain that indoor dining raises covid rates, but we can’t tell you whether Bob got covid at McDonald’s.


Doubtful indoor dining is the cause of your spike.  I looked at the top 7 zip codes making up 40% of your cases.   They are low income areas which is consistent with the pattern throughout California.

Please show the studies you are referring to.


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> Doubtful indoor dining is the cause of your spike.  I looked at the top 7 zip codes making up 40% of your cases.   They are low income areas which is consistent with the pattern throughout California.
> 
> Please show the studies you are referring to.


Our restaurant workers all live in low income areas.  Mostly east San Jose.  Lots of restaurants there, too.  They tend to be cheaper and more crowded.

The most recent is from Stanford and Northwestern, published in Nature.









						Mobility network models of COVID-19 explain inequities and inform reopening - Nature
					

An epidemiological model that integrates fine-grained mobility networks illuminates mobility-related mechanisms that contribute to higher infection rates among disadvantaged socioeconomic and racial groups, and finds that restricting maximum occupancy at locations is especially effective for...




					www.nature.com
				




The best known is the CDC study.









						Community and Close Contact Exposures Associated with COVID-19 ...
					

Community and close contact exposures continue to drive the coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) pandemic. CDC and other public health authorities recommend community mitigation strategies ...




					www.cdc.gov
				




I’m not saying that home gatherings aren’t a major problem, too.  They are.  It’s the same phenomenon.  People from multiple households go to the same room, take off their masks, and spend 90 minutes eating and talking.

(Yes, we are doing a solo Turkey day this year.  Probably a zoom Christmas as well.  Bleah.   There it is.)


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> Our restaurant workers all live in low income areas.  Mostly east San Jose.  Lots of restaurants there, too.  They tend to be cheaper and more crowded.
> 
> The most recent is from Stanford and Northwestern, published in Nature.
> 
> ...


Your first article proves the point I was making: "Our model also correctly predicts higher infection rates among disadvantaged racial and socioeconomic groups2–8 solely from differences in mobility: we find that disadvantaged groups have not been able to reduce mobility as sharply, and that the POIs they visit are more crowded and therefore higher-risk."

The second study does not show a causal link just a guess based on activities and it doesn't consider the adequacy of protocols in place nor compliance with those protocols.

The fact our State doesn't have an adequate contract tracing program to make informed decisions does not give them the right to guess at causes and make decisions from that information.

You will be traveling to play soccer so please stop with the holier than though attitude.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> Your first article proves the point I was making: "Our model also correctly predicts higher infection rates among disadvantaged racial and socioeconomic groups2–8 solely from differences in mobility: we find that disadvantaged groups have not been able to reduce mobility as sharply, and that the POIs they visit are more crowded and therefore higher-risk."
> 
> The second study does not show a causal link just a guess based on activities and it doesn't consider the adequacy of protocols in place nor compliance with those protocols.
> 
> ...


"thou"


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> "thou"


No problem.  I'm the self appointed covid police, not the self appointed grammar police.


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## Copa9 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> The studies are without social distancing, limiting of patrons and other protocols.  See, that is the problem.  Decisions are being made based on science without protocols.


And you know this for fact, how, quote your source.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

Copa9 said:


> And you know this for fact, how, quote your source.


Look at the studies that Dad4 posted.


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> Your first article proves the point I was making: "Our model also correctly predicts higher infection rates among disadvantaged racial and socioeconomic groups2–8 solely from differences in mobility: we find that disadvantaged groups have not been able to reduce mobility as sharply, and that the POIs they visit are more crowded and therefore higher-risk."
> 
> The second study does not show a causal link just a guess based on activities and it doesn't consider the adequacy of protocols in place nor compliance with those protocols.
> 
> ...


What do you want them to do?  

Do nothing while waiting for evidence?

Or take their best guess and make decisions based on inadequate evidence?  

There is not a third choice.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> What do you want them to do?
> 
> Do nothing while waiting for evidence?
> 
> ...


I want them to pull their head out of their ass and make decisions to solve the problems they have created like outdoor sports being ignored resulting in about 100k of people traveling every weekend to play sports and playing outdoor sports in indoor facilities that is currently on the rise.

I want them to look at the zip codes of where the spike in cases are, look at what has been learned in other states where there was no restriction on a given activity, and weigh the risk of death now (has decreased by 30% since beginning) to the overall impact resulting from restriction decisions.  Maybe they should call in some business analysts to help them with decision trees because they obviously lack the basics.

I want them to stop making decisions as if there is no information available.

I want them to stop with the blanket restrictions and restrict where the risk is identified.

There are alternatives they just lack the experience or organizational structure to accomplish it.


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## Keepermom2 (Nov 15, 2020)

Maybe they should take the money they have allotted for reviewing a vaccine that will already be reviewed by the FDA and invest in some analysts to help with analyzing the information.  

I am out on this argument because I need to help my daughter spend the $20k she made from unemployment because government systems are so antiquated that they can't even allow for variables like....if part time, pay this or if earnings rate is X than pay Y.


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## Kicker4Life (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> What do you want them to do?


Remove the unconstitutional restrictions would be a starts.


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Kicker4Life said:


> Remove the unconstitutional restrictions would be a starts.


You lost me.  Is that your plan to help limit covid infections?


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## Speed (Nov 15, 2020)

soccer4us said:


> I'm hearing today CA will put out youth sports update this week and will include NO travel out of start until at least Jan. 1st which would kill mayors cup and Surf cup I'm guessing too. On a positive, If you're in the orange  tier or yellow, soccer game vs team in county or bordering county will be allowed. I'm guessing many counties even in orange tiers today may drop to red soon though but soccer games wouldn't be allowed. Anyone else hear this?? This is just rumors for now but makes some sense based on patterns set forth by the state.


You're trying to make me flip out.


dad4 said:


> Agree the change could and should have happened months go.
> 
> My county is moving back to red, too.
> 
> ...


did those restaurants open up to 100% capacity or did they limit indoor dining?


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## Kicker4Life (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> You lost me.  Is that your plan to help limit covid infections?


I thought we agree infections wasn’t a good barometer.


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## dad4 (Nov 15, 2020)

Kicker4Life said:


> I thought we agree infections wasn’t a good barometer.


You're still avoiding the question.


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## Kicker4Life (Nov 15, 2020)

dad4 said:


> You're still avoiding the question.


Or refusing to go down that never ending rabbit hole with you.....


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## happy9 (Nov 15, 2020)

Keepermom2 said:


> I want them to pull their head out of their ass and make decisions to solve the problems they have created like outdoor sports being ignored resulting in about 100k of people traveling every weekend to play sports and playing outdoor sports in indoor facilities that is currently on the rise.
> 
> I want them to look at the zip codes of where the spike in cases are, look at what has been learned in other states where there was no restriction on a given activity, and weigh the risk of death now (has decreased by 30% since beginning) to the overall impact resulting from restriction decisions.  Maybe they should call in some business analysts to help them with decision trees because they obviously lack the basics.
> 
> ...


What you are saying is that you are tired of a government entity not being able to do anything beyond prepare an impressively detailed power point slide.  That power point slide neatly lays out a theoretical plan, dreamt up by some person in a basement somewhere and approved by a conglomerate of woefully incapable  and overpaid government employees.

Tax payer dollars at work.


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