# Girls Development Academy



## Swoosh

New developments coming soon, 8-10 Southern California clubs is what I'm hearing.


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## bababooey

Names? Or are you just stating 8-10 without having any details?

If I had to guess some of the clubs in the 8-10 not already listed, I would go with the following:
LA Galaxy SD (formerly Carlsbad United)
Strikers
West Coast
Legends
FC Golden State
Albion
Slammers OC (I know they were identified with the LAFA group, but that is for LA County, right?)

I'm sure there could be others, but that seems reasonable to me.


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## Generik

I do not remember seeing Arsenal listed in the original list that came out last week...so I would add them to this list too.


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## Lightning Red

I know you are spot on with one that you have listed.


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## Kicker4Life

I'm going out on a limb and sayin only 3 possibly 4 more SoCal teams:

Legends
Real SoCal
LAGSD or Albion
Strikers


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## CaliKlines

Lightning Red said:


> I know you are spot on with one that you have listed.


Maybe even 2 of those that are listed...I wish they would hurry up and announce it already.


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## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> I'm going out on a limb and sayin only 3 possibly 4 more SoCal teams:
> 
> Legends
> Real SoCal
> LAGSD or Albion
> Strikers


I wouldn't bet my money on Strikers.


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## Kicker4Life

NoGoal said:


> I wouldn't bet my money on Strikers.


Ok....valid point!  But I believe there will be one more OC based team in the mix.


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## mirage

It might help to look at the boys side and the philosophy a bit.

Only few full DA for boys exist per area:

LA: LAG, LAFC, RSC, FCGS
OC: Pats, Strikers
IE: Arsenal
SD: Surf, Nomads

There are others that have just U14 and below like LAUFA, Albion and so on, and even more for U12 like West Coast.

There are about 100 clubs in the entire US with the full DA (meaning that a club has U18/16/14/12 DA teams) status and we have 9 or about 10% of the total.  When DA started, there were less than 70 clubs across the country.

One of the key decision criteria for USSF is the distribution of clubs in the region versus total player population.  It would be a real change in their approach if they choose to put more concentration in a single area than the boys side.

Just passing along a different perspective and bit of DA track record....


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## MakeAPlay

I think that they did enough in SoCal already.  If you add more then US Soccer's true intention isn't to develop players for the national team.  All they will do is dilute the player pool.   This is clearly a money grab.  Surf, Blues and Slammers send plenty of players to the national teams and Beach has several quality coaches.  I could see RSC and Arsenal making a geographic argument.  The rest just aren't clubs that really do much.  I didn't think that the NWSL affiliated clubs that were approved deserved it based upon their actual accomplishments but clearly they are NWSL clubs which trumps all in the US Soccer world.


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## NoGoal

mirage said:


> It might help to look at the boys side and the philosophy a bit.
> 
> Only few full DA for boys exist per area:
> 
> LA: LAG, LAFC, RSC, FCGS
> OC: Pats, Strikers
> IE: Arsenal
> SD: Surf, Nomads
> 
> There are others that have just U14 and below like LAUFA, Albion and so on, and even more for U12 like West Coast.
> 
> There are about 100 clubs in the entire US with the full DA (meaning that a club has U18/16/14/12 DA teams) status and we have 9 or about 10% of the total.  When DA started, there were less than 70 clubs across the country.
> 
> One of the key decision criteria for USSF is the distribution of clubs in the region versus total player population.  It would be a real change in their approach if they choose to put more concentration in a single area than the boys side.
> 
> Just passing along a different perspective and bit of DA track record....


IMO, US Soccer isn't putting to much weight, if the club already has a Boys DA.  I say this, because SoCal Blues, Slammers and Beach FC do NOT have a boys DA program.  What they do have in common are all 3 are successful girls club.

If I was placing a bet and US Soccer is adding  4 additional SoCal clubs.  My picks would be WCFC, Legends, Eagles and RSC in no particular order.


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## Glen

What's going to happen with ECNL, especially if more SoCal clubs are picked?  Does it become the B team for these clubs?

Also, how long can ECNL survive?  I get the talent pool argument in SoCal, but out of Socal won't the good ECNL teams turn into DA teams?  Without the DA players, is it worth it to travel to play the B++ players  from out of state when, I would predict, that there will better ECNL and non-ECNL clubs all over SoCal?

I guess I'm looking for thoughts on how DA is going to impact ECNL clubs outside of SoCal.  In turn, how is that going to impact SoCal soccer.  I know that may be the tail wagging the dog, but ECNL will only be as good as the collective level of play.


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## NoGoal

Glen said:


> What's going to happen with ECNL, especially if more SoCal clubs are picked?  Does it become the B team for these clubs?
> 
> Also, how long can ECNL survive?  I get the talent pool argument in SoCal, but out of Socal won't the good ECNL teams turn into DA teams?  Without the DA players, is it worth it to travel to play the B++ players  from out of state when, I would predict, that there will better ECNL and non-ECNL clubs all over SoCal?
> 
> I guess I'm looking for thoughts on how DA is going to impact ECNL clubs outside of SoCal.  In turn, how is that going to impact SoCal soccer.  I know that may be the tail wagging the dog, but ECNL will only be as good as the collective level of play.


SoCal Girls DA clubs can only produce 10-12 players per club, per HS graduation year, because of the combined age groups.  That is a total of only 96 SoCal players committing to play college soccer, thus ECNL will still be a viable option for college exposure.


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## rock_solid

FC Golden State should not under any circumstance qualify for having a girls DA.  The FCGS girls side over the last 4 years was shambolic.


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## mirage

NoGoal said:


> IMO, US Soccer isn't putting to much weight, if the club already has a Boys DA.  I say this, because SoCal Blues, Slammers and Beach FC do NOT have a boys DA program.  What they do have in common are all 3 are successful girls club.
> 
> If I was placing a bet and US Soccer is adding  4 additional SoCal clubs.  My picks would be WCFC, Legends, Eagles and RSC in no particular order.


I wasn't saying that boys clubs will automatically get girls program.  I doubt it, actually.  I believe each will be judged on their own merit.

The only reason to bring up the boys side is to talk about numbers.  The three you've mentioned are a part of the launching 25 clubs announced (Beach, Slammers, Blues) along with Surf.  That's 4 out of 25 clubs or 16% of the total.

All I am saying is that it is highly unlikely that they will add 4 more So Cal teams as they expand at this point.  Perhaps as the expansion occurs over the next few years but for now, there is 1 in LA (Beach), 2 in OC (Blues and Slammers, but who knows where Slammers girls DA will be given that it has LAFC attached to it so it may be doing double duty), and 1 in SD (Surf). Definitely need one in the valley (RSC?) but that's about it.

The practical side is the travel and game schedule.  They need certain amount of teams in a region to setup the games.  So I do expect more teams but there is the entire west coast to cover.  There are total of 9 teams now in the Western region so that's minimum of 16 games.  Play each other twice, home and away.  Not enough games for a 10 months season so they'll need more teams, but where is the question.....


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## Kicker4Life

There will need to be representation in the east...Legends or Arsenal and my money is on Legends.


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## Nicole13

Kicker4Life said:


> There will need to be representation in the east...Legends or Arsenal and my money is on Legends.


Same.


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## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> There will need to be representation in the east...Legends or Arsenal and my money is on Legends.


I agree there has to Girls DA in the IE and in the San Fernando Valley/Ventura area.  So a minimum of 2 more girls DA clubs.


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## gunner

It definitely looks like Los Angeles proper, is not truly represented either.


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## NoGoal

mirage said:


> I wasn't saying that boys clubs will automatically get girls program.  I doubt it, actually.  I believe each will be judged on their own merit.
> 
> The only reason to bring up the boys side is to talk about numbers.  The three you've mentioned are a part of the launching 25 clubs announced (Beach, Slammers, Blues) along with Surf.  That's 4 out of 25 clubs or 16% of the total.
> 
> All I am saying is that it is highly unlikely that they will add 4 more So Cal teams as they expand at this point.  Perhaps as the expansion occurs over the next few years but for now, there is 1 in LA (Beach), 2 in OC (Blues and Slammers, but who knows where Slammers girls DA will be given that it has LAFC attached to it so it may be doing double duty), and 1 in SD (Surf). Definitely need one in the valley (RSC?) but that's about it.
> 
> The practical side is the travel and game schedule.  They need certain amount of teams in a region to setup the games.  So I do expect more teams but there is the entire west coast to cover.  There are total of 9 teams now in the Western region so that's minimum of 16 games.  Play each other twice, home and away.  Not enough games for a 10 months season so they'll need more teams, but where is the question.....


Mirage, I have been hearing rumors that US Soccer will be releasing more SoCal Girls DA clubs for the Fall of 2017.  As you posted,  there will need to be additional SoCal DA clubs in order to keep league travel costs down.  I highly doubt the clubs can absorb free training fees and free travel costs for NorCal and Northwest league games.


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## Swoosh

Here is my estimate:

*Inland Empire:*  Legends
*San Diego #2: * LA Galaxy San Diego

*My definite no list*:  Strikers, Arsenal, FC Golden State Albion.

*Still with a chance:*  Real So Cal, WCFC

Everything else past six teams in So Cal depends on geographical travel partners and how deep they want to go this first year


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## Flojo

The Girls DA is a great idea, but it sucks to see how it came about. ECNL was doing its job fine. Sucks there were conflicting egos that disallowed ECNL and USSDA to combine.

My problem with the Girls DA is that they say it will be fully funded. On the boys' side, a lot of the money comes from the MLS, correct? Where is the money for the girls side going to come from? NWSL? They hardly have the money to pay their own players, let alone fund a youth academy. Correct me if I'm wrong, which I probably am. I just doubt this will be more cost-efficient for the parents. Just let the kids play soccer.


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## Justafan

NoGoal said:


> SoCal Girls DA clubs can only produce 10-12 players per club, per HS graduation year, because of the combined age groups.  That is a total of only 96 SoCal players committing to play college soccer, thus ECNL will still be a viable option for college exposure.


How many girls do D1 schools typically take in per year?


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## ECNL

ECNL finals (u15-17) without any SoCal teams.  It looks like dominance at youngers (u10-14) which fades at olders (u15-18).  As a Socal parent I find this troubling.


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## Kicker4Life

Flojo said:


> The Girls DA is a great idea, but it sucks to see how it came about. ECNL was doing its job fine. Sucks there were conflicting egos that disallowed ECNL and USSDA to combine.
> 
> My problem with the Girls DA is that they say it will be fully funded. On the boys' side, a lot of the money comes from the MLS, correct? Where is the money for the girls side going to come from? NWSL? They hardly have the money to pay their own players, let alone fund a youth academy. Correct me if I'm wrong, which I probably am. I just doubt this will be more cost-efficient for the parents. Just let the kids play soccer.


ECNL IMHO, didn't do a great job of spreading the love.  4 teams in OC, one in SD, one in the I.E., one in Thousand Oaks and one in Camarillo.  Huge gap north of the OC, South of Thousand Oaks and East of the I.E.


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## Flojo

Kicker4Life said:


> ECNL IMHO, didn't do a great job of spreading the love.  4 teams in OC, one in SD, one in the I.E., one in Thousand Oaks and one in Camarillo.  Huge gap north of the OC, South of Thousand Oaks and East of the I.E.


I agree with this. What I meant was ECNL was doing fine when it came to college exposure and producing youth national team players. If they could spread the teams throughout the state, drop clubs and add clubs here and there in CA as well as other states, ECNL could've easily combined with US Soccer to create something great for the girls side.


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## MakeAPlay

ECNL said:


> ECNL finals (u15-17) without any SoCal teams.  It looks like dominance at youngers (u10-14) which fades at olders (u15-18).  As a Socal parent I find this troubling.



It doesn't fade so stop using the same old argument.  Being an Arizona parent you probably missed the fact that 21 Cal South players are in YNT camp right now.  I'm going to guess that makes a difference.  Also if the dominance fades then why did Slammers win the U18 title?  I bet if you asked any college coach if they were restricted to recruiting entirely from one region/country/state then SoCal would be picked damn near 100% of the time.


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## MakeAPlay

The problem with the new forum already is old trolls with new screen names.


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## Sombitch

ECNL said:


> ECNL finals (u15-17) without any SoCal teams.  It looks like dominance at youngers (u10-14) which fades at olders (u15-18).  As a Socal parent I find this troubling.


Slammers U15 is in the final for the second year in a row


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## Sombitch

Swoosh said:


> Here is my estimate:
> 
> *Inland Empire:*  Legends
> *San Diego #2: * LA Galaxy San Diego
> 
> *My definite no list*:  Strikers, Arsenal, FC Golden State Albion.
> 
> *Still with a chance:*  Real So Cal, WCFC
> 
> Everything else past six teams in So Cal depends on geographical travel partners and how deep they want to go this first year





Swoosh said:


> Here is my estimate:
> 
> *Inland Empire:*  Legends
> *San Diego #2: * LA Galaxy San Diego
> 
> *My definite no list*:  Strikers, Arsenal, FC Golden State Albion.
> 
> *Still with a chance:*  Real So Cal, WCFC
> 
> Everything else past six teams in So Cal depends on geographical travel partners and how deep they want to go this first year


Legends and Carlsbad are both in.


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## MakeAPlay

Sombitch said:


> Slammers U15 is in the final for the second year in a row


Som don't you know that would mess up Sweetsplat's narrative.


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## Kicker4Life

Sombitch said:


> Legends and Carlsbad are both in.


I like how you still call them Carlsbad!  Both very deserving organizations!


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## MakeAPlay

Sombitch said:


> Legends and Carlsbad are both in.


If that is true I am curious as to why.  Neither of those clubs did anything prior to ECNL.  This is such a sham it isn't even funny.

No disrespect to any of the players for either club.  They do have some talented players in both clubs.


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## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> If that is true I am curious as to why.  Neither of those clubs did anything prior to ECNL.  This is such a sham it isn't even funny.
> 
> No disrespect to any of the players for either club.  They do have some talented players in both clubs.


Ok....staying within those geographical areas, who would you have chosen and why?


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## Round

Sombitch said:


> Legends and Carlsbad are both in.


I hope they are smarter than that.  Carlsbad is too far north to be an option for most SD County players.  They would compete with Surf and the South OC families.  If it's about money, than Carlsbad should be in.  There are no good San Diego clubs for girls right now other than Surf, thanks to Surf.


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## ECNL

My DD would love for Carlsbad as an option instead of REAL.


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## ECNL

MakeAPlay said:


> 21 Cal South players are in YNT camp right now.  I'm going to guess that makes a difference.


I don't think it makes that much of a difference because great TEAMS find ways to win.  To be honest, I think it is fair to say that not a single player in the current pool will ever make a WNT roster.


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## Kicker4Life

ECNL said:


> I don't think it makes that much of a difference because great TEAMS find ways to win.  To be honest, I think it is fair to say that not a single player in the current pool will ever make a WNT roster.


Interesting that your trolling is so very unbiased.  There are at least 3 across the age groups that will make their respective camp final rosters starting with the u20's and Savana DeMelo.


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## NoGoal

ECNL said:


> I don't think it makes that much of a difference because great TEAMS find ways to win.  To be honest, I think it is fair to say that not a single player in the current pool will ever make a WNT roster.


Well Ashley Sanchez already attended a WNT camp, so she is pretty dam close.


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## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> Interesting that your trolling is so very unbiased.  There are at least 3 across the age groups that will make their respective camp final rosters starting with the u20's and Savana DeMelo.


ECNL, is posting that none of the current YNT players will make the Sr team.


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## Sombitch

Round said:


> I hope they are smarter than that.  Carlsbad is too far north to be an option for most SD County players.  They would compete with Surf and the South OC families.  If it's about money, than Carlsbad should be in.  There are no good San Diego clubs for girls right now other than Surf, thanks to Surf.


Too far? As compared to which other San Diego option currently?  

As for legends and Carlsbad not doing anything before ECNL,..you are saying only ECNL clubs should get Academy?  There are plenty of shit ECNL clubs one of which who received Academy status.  

Haven't Carlsbad and Legends both won USYS National Titles?  Haven't they both placed girls in the National Team?  Isn't that part of the criteria?


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## Round

NoGoal said:


> ECNL, is posting that none of the current YNT players will make the Sr team.


Maybe a couple make it, for a limited time.  Then they end up pimping soccer camps at best.


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## Round

Sombitch said:


> Too far? As compared to which other San Diego option currently?
> 
> As for legends and Carlsbad not doing anything before ECNL,..you are saying only ECNL clubs should get Academy?  There are plenty of shit ECNL clubs one of which who received Academy status.
> 
> Haven't Carlsbad and Legends both won USYS National Titles?  Haven't they both placed girls in the National Team?  Isn't that part of the criteria?


I like Carlsbad. Their b teams are better than Surf B teams. That means something.  There are no SD options but there could be if US soccer helped develope one.  Albion can't be helped.


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## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> If that is true I am curious as to why.  Neither of those clubs did anything prior to ECNL.  This is such a sham it isn't even funny.
> 
> No disrespect to any of the players for either club.  They do have some talented players in both clubs.


The criteria doesn't go back 6+ years.  But you're wrong on Legends, they won championships before ECNL.  The criteria is quality of the staff, facilities, players on the national team, pro players, etc.


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## Swoosh

I forgot about Eagles.  They also have a chance.  It will be them or Real So Cal.


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## NoGoal

Sombitch said:


> As for legends and Carlsbad not doing anything before ECNL,..you are saying only ECNL clubs should get Academy?  There are plenty of shit ECNL clubs one of which who received Academy status.
> 
> Haven't Carlsbad and Legends both won USYS National Titles?  Haven't they both placed girls in the National Team?  Isn't that part of the criteria?


I believe MakeAPlay was questioning, if Beach FC or Legends would have won multiple USYS National Championships if the ECNL clubs still participate?  The poster has a valid point.    We can look at TopHat who played ECNL this past season and previously dominated USYS National League like Beach FC and Legends have done.  Tophat performed well in their ECNL conference, but when playoffs rolled around.  NOT a single Tophat team finished on top of their Champions League bracket in San Diego.  You know the cliche, big fish in a small pond.


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## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> I believe MakeAPlay was questioning, would have Beach FC and Legends won multiple USYS National Championships if the ECNL clubs still participate?  The poster has a valid point.    We can look at TopHat who played ECNL thus past season and previously dominated USYS National League.  Tophat performed well in their conference play, but when playoffs rolled around not one of their teams made the ECNL Final 4 this weekend.


They didn't dominate in the Girls U15 bracket last year at the USYS National Championship. Their U15 team that became their U16 ECNL team didn't make it out of pool play, and didn't win a single match.


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## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> They didn't dominate in the Girls U15 bracket last year at the USYS National Championship. Their U15 team that became their U16 ECNL team didn't make it out of pool play, and didn't win a single match.


Didn't that Tophat team qualified for National League?  Are you saying, National League is actually watered down and the competition isn't really that good afterall?


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## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> They didn't dominate in the Girls U15 bracket last year at the USYS National Championship. Their U15 team that became their U16 ECNL team didn't make it out of pool play, and didn't win a single match.


Wrap your mind around this.  The ECNL clubs have reshuffled their teams As purely 98/99, 00, 01, etc.  Why didn't Legends break up your DDs team?  Why not merged the 99 players on your DDs team including your DD with the U19 98/99 team. Instead the 99s on your DDs team are playing U18, when the 99s on her team should have been reshuffled and playing against their U19 98/99 peers this fall.

Tell me, why didn't Legends reshuffle the team, like the other ECNL clubs?


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## CaliKlines

No, I am directly refuting your assertion that Tophat "dominated" the USYS competition, and then didn't do much in the ECNL playoffs. I am saying that the Tophat U16 ECNL side couldn't get out of pool play in the U15 USYS National Championships. I am saying that that ECNL side didn't win a match against the non-ECNL competition, and one can only assume that since they didn't perform well in the non-ECNL National Championships, they figured they would join the ECNL, where they might have a better chance of success.


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## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> No, I am directly refuting your assertion that Tophat "dominated" the USYS competition, and then didn't do much in the ECNL playoffs. I am saying that the Tophat U16 ECNL side couldn't get out of pool play in the U15 USYS National Championships. I am saying that that ECNL side didn't win a match against the non-ECNL competition, and one can only assume that since they didn't perform well in the non-ECNL National Championships, they figured they would join the ECNL, where they might have a better chance of success.


Do you actually believe what you write? Ha!  TopHat joined ECNL purely for the college exposure, just like Legends has applied for ECNL the last 8 years.  Even the MOST dominant U16 SoCal Blues team couldn't finish on top of their ECNL playoff bracket.


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## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Wrap your mind around this.  The ECNL clubs have reshuffled their teams As purely 98/99, 00, 01, etc.  Why didn't Legends break up your DDs team?  Why not merged the 99 players on your DDs team with the U19 98/99 team. Instead the 99s on your DDs team is playing U18, when the 99s on her team should have been reshuffled and playing against their U19 peers this fall.
> 
> Tell me, why didn't Legends reshuffle the team?  If I'm not mistake your DD is a 99er,  she should he playing U19 even though she is a 2018 HS grad.


Change the subject much? There are many reasons to keep the team together. Chemistry, friendships, and the opportunity to win as many National Championships as possible.


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## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Change the subject much? There are many reasons to keep the team together. Chemistry, friendships, and the opportunity to win as many National Championships as possible.


Weak excuse, Legends should be doing what is best for the girls.  Isn't that the philosophy for Girls DA?  Allowing girls to compete among the best in their peer group or even playing up?  Kind of the opposite, if you ask me.  Don't kid yourself, if Legends got ECNL this Fall....they would have reshuffled your DDs team.

Your 2 Pac12 commits D.A., B.D. and the other 1999 2017 commits on your DDs team should be playing against their peers in the GU19 99/98 age group.  I would bet their parents would love to see their DDs play against their U19 2017 college commit peers in the U19 age group.  You should insist your DDs team play U19 tournaments/showcases, what is there to worry about? Except, play against the BEST U19 ECNL teams.


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## gkrent

MakeAPlay said:


> Also if the dominance fades then why did Slammers win the U18 title?  .


I would venture to say that some of their fiercest competitors either opted out of the playoffs or played in USYSA nationals.  Not to diminish the team...they are awesome and were able to bring back some of their D-1 players.


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## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> I believe MakeAPlay was questioning, if Beach FC or Legends would have won multiple USYS National Championships if the ECNL clubs still participate?  The poster has a valid point.    We can look at TopHat who played ECNL this past season and previously dominated USYS National League like Beach FC and Legends have done.  Tophat performed well in their ECNL conference, but when playoffs rolled around.  NOT a single Tophat team finished on top of their Champions League bracket in San Diego.  You know the cliche, big fish in a small pond.


Impossible to answer.  I think now that the teams are on level ground, this question will have its answer shortly.  I will reserve my personal opinion as I suspect it may make your blood pressure rise.


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## Swoosh

gkrent said:


> I would venture to say that some of their fiercest competitors either opted out of the playoffs or played in USYSA nationals.  Not to diminish the team...they are awesome and were able to bring back some of their D-1 players.


They also added the WCFC forward from SDSU (now at usc) who scored in the final.  That didn't hurt, great pick up.


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## ECNL

NoGoal said:


> ECNL, is posting that none of the current YNT players will make the Sr team.


Correct.  In the end, it is the only team that matters.


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## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Impossible to answer.  I think now that the teams are on level ground, this question will have its answer shortly.  I will reserve my personal opinion as I suspect it may make your blood pressure rise.


Doesn't matter to me, if Legends gets DA.  My DD will have aged out when the fall of 2017 rolls around.


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## mirage

NoGoal said:


> Mirage, I have been hearing rumors that US Soccer will be releasing more SoCal Girls DA clubs for the Fall of 2017.  As you posted,  there will need to be additional SoCal DA clubs in order to keep league travel costs down.  I highly doubt the clubs can absorb free training fees and free travel costs for NorCal and Northwest league games.


I guess my belief is why would the girls side be different than the boys side.  Boys DA teams go up and down the west coast for games.  Often the cost of travel is shared between the club and the player family.  And not all DA programs are free.  Many are paid to play.  I expect the girls side to be the same....


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## NoGoal

mirage said:


> I guess my belief is why would the girls side be different than the boys side.  Boys DA teams go up and down the west coast for games.  Often the cost of travel is shared between the club and the player family.  And not all DA programs are free.  Many are paid to play.  I expect the girls side to be the same....


I know when I hear BS, especially when posters type that US Soccer DA players will be fully subsidized. I already know it's not fully subsidize on the Boys side, except for the most part the DA MLS franchise teams.

If SoCal girls DA teams are required to travel to Norcal and the Northwest for league games (not college showcases).  Then ECNL had a better conference format by allowing SoCal teams to play locally.  They knew SoCal has the deepest talent pool in the nation and only traveled once a year to play Las Vegas and Phoenix teams.


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## Swoosh

LA Premier.  Wow didn't see that coming.


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## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> LA Premier.  Wow didn't see that coming.


If your post is true, lmao!  What has LA Premier ever won or for that matter produced?


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## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> If your post is true, lmao!  What has LA Premier ever won or for that matter produced?


The Academy will use the following criteria when evaluating the application of each club for membership:

Leadership of the club and quality of the coaching staff.
Desire to embrace and promote the core values of the program.
U.S. Soccer license levels of coaching staff.
Infrastructure of the club and the resources currently being invested in development (facilities, scholarships, staff to player ratio, etc.).
History of player production for youth National Teams, the Women's National Team, and professional leagues.
Market with player depth, geographic location, proximity to other elite clubs and travel implications.
Trophies won is not a criteria.  Still didn't see it coming.


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## gkrent

NoGoal said:


> If your post is true, lmao!  What has LA Premier ever won or for that matter produced?


Their coaching staff has either been US soccer staff or has strong relationships with current US soccer staff. 

Curious where  swoosh heard this.


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## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> The Academy will use the following criteria when evaluating the application of each club for membership:
> 
> Leadership of the club and quality of the coaching staff.
> Desire to embrace and promote the core values of the program.
> U.S. Soccer license levels of coaching staff.
> Infrastructure of the club and the resources currently being invested in development (facilities, scholarships, staff to player ratio, etc.).
> History of player production for youth National Teams, the Women's National Team, and professional leagues.
> Market with player depth, geographic location, proximity to other elite clubs and travel implications.
> Trophies won is not a criteria.  Still didn't see it coming.


Like I posted what have they produced, as in girls? Do you even know the history of LA Premier?  If not here is a quick recap.  Originally they were LAFC, then took the moniker LAFC-Chelsea and merged with the Legends boys teams who originated from Stampede FC in Chino Hills.  They merged with the Legends boys team to strengthen their DA boys program. They then lost the Chelsea backing and eventually their Boys DA status.  Yes, LOST their boys DA status and I believe given to FC Goldenstate a couple of years afterwards.  What was left of the pieces became LA Premier.  In short they were always known as a boys club destination.

LA Premier is NOT a club known for being a small club yet developing girls the right way!


----------



## NoGoal

gkrent said:


> Their coaching staff has either been US soccer staff or has strong relationships with current US soccer staff.
> 
> Curious where  swoosh heard this.


I figured that one out, if true how else would have LA Premier gotten Girls DA? Except for politics!

If filling geographical location is a priority, might as well fill another hole by giving girls DA status to Santa Monica United.  If US Soccer wanted to fill a geographical gap for the Pasadena area.  The families there are only a 30 min drive west in traffic to Real SoCal.


----------



## gunner

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/u-s-soccer-announces-28-more-girls-development-academy-clubs/


----------



## eddiegraphic

NoGoal said:


> I figured that one out, if true how else would have LA Premier gotten Girls DA? Except for politics!


Or perhaps they simply checked all the boxes.


----------



## CaliKlines

Congratulations to Eagles SC, LA Galaxy/Carlsbad, LA Premier, and Legends FC on the selection to United States Soccer Girls Development Academy!!

2017 US Girls Development Academy Clubs
Blues
Beach
Eagles
LA Galaxy/Carlsbad
LA Premier
Legends FC
Slammers/LAFC
Surf


----------



## NoGoal

eddiegraphic said:


> Or perhaps they simply checked all the boxes.


Convince yourself of that, lol.


----------



## rock_solid

I'm not surprised at all about LA Premier being awarded a girl's DA. LAPFC has had a very strong girl's olders program for years. (It's their boys program that is absolute crap unless full squads from other clubs come over and land at their feet) But Manny, Barry, Louie and Tracy have had very strong teams. Just because they weren't in ECNL doesn't mean they weren't producing D1 players. The problem is Manny (now at U of Oregon), Louie (Surf) and Tracy (head of Seattle Reign USSDA) have all moved on. Oh well. I'm sure coaches will now flock there to get a piece of that pie. But this is great news for girls in this LA area. Now girls in greater LA area have a choice outside of the western San Fernando Valley-Real So Cal, Eagles in Ventura County and the 99 thousand ECNL teams in Orange County.


----------



## NoGoal

rock_solid said:


> I'm not surprised at all about LA Premier being awarded a girl's DA. LAPFC has had a very strong girl's olders program for years. (It's their boys program that is absolute crap unless full squads from other clubs come over and land at their feet) But Manny, Barry, Louie and Tracy have had very strong teams. Just because they weren't in ECNL doesn't mean they weren't producing D1 players. The problem is Manny (now at U of Oregon), Louie (Surf) and Tracy (head of Seattle Reign USSDA) have all moved on. Oh well. I'm sure coaches will now flock there to get a piece of that pie. But this is great news for girls in this LA area. Now girls in greater LA area have a choice outside of the western San Fernando Valley-Real So Cal, Eagles in Ventura County and the 99 thousand ECNL teams in Orange County.


You're so right, what am I thinking.  The Power 5 conferences are littered with LA Premier girls.  LMAO!

3 of their 4 Pac12 2016 players are Oregon players, because their former club coach is the assistant coach at Oregon.

I can be as candid about girls DA as I want, because it has NO bearing on my DD club future.  Also no sour grapes here, because my DDs club has ECNL and Girls DA!


----------



## rock_solid

Hey Bruh get over yourself. How could that club possibly have players "littered" through the power five conferences when ECNL had a monopoly on how girls are pipelined to those conferences? Obviously LAPFC is not an ECNL club so suggesting that they don't have large numbers of players in top conferences is a capt obvious comment.. Doesn't negate the quality of their top teams over the years. The fact that they have coaches who currently coach D1 level and head USSDA academy programs speaks to the quality of their olders girls teams. Comparing what they have managed to do while as a non-ECNL program to those established ECNL programs is petty.


----------



## Lightning Red

http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-da-welcomes-28-additional-clubs


----------



## NoGoal

rock_solid said:


> Hey Bruh get over yourself. How could that club possibly have players "littered" through the power five conferences when ECNL had a monopoly on how girls are pipelined to those conferences? Obviously LAPFC is not an ECNL club so suggesting that they don't have large numbers of players in top conferences is a capt obvious comment.. Doesn't negate the quality of their top teams over the years. The fact that they have coaches who currently coach D1 level and head USSDA academy programs speaks to the quality of their olders girls teams. Comparing what they have managed to do while as a non-ECNL program to those established ECNL programs is petty.


Point being, if they were doing everything right as a prior poster commented, "maybe they checked all of the boxes".  Then ECNL wouldn't matter right?  Legends and Beach have both proven themselves without ECNL more so then LA Premier has.  Let's be honest...there was a geographical gap between Eagles in Ventura County and Legends in San Bernardino County.  So by geographical default and US Soccer connections LA Premier got the nod.  If RSC was located a few miles east in Burbank instead of Woodland Hills.  They would have gotten the nod over LA Premier any day of the week.


----------



## 17SquirrelsDad

WTH happened to Albion? I thought for sure they'd get the nod before a couple of the aforementioned. WOW!


----------



## rock_solid

NoGoal said:


> Ah aren't you the LA Premier homer, lol.


Ah aren't you the LA Premier hater, lol.


----------



## NoGoal

rock_solid said:


> Ah aren't you the LA Premier hater, lol.


Don't get butt hurt, because I'm throwing shade on your DDs club.  You should be worrying more about top talent from the San Fernando and San Gabriel Valley pushing your DD to the B team.  For the record, several years back my son was offered a spot on their LA Premier CSL Premier boys team.  So no hate here!

Everyone including yourself was surprised LA Premier got Girls DA!  WCFC and RSC are both more deserving than LA Premier, but they didn't fit the geographical map.


----------



## timbuck

Butt hurt and throwing shade?
Who talks like that besides the Kardashians?


----------



## NoGoal

timbuck said:


> Butt hurt and throwing shade?
> Who talks like that besides the Kardashians?


You need to keep up with the times and I'm also re-inventing myself on the new forum.  I also learned how to use the term vibing recently


----------



## outside!

17SquirrelsDad said:


> WTH happened to Albion? I thought for sure they'd get the nod before a couple of the aforementioned. WOW!


Agree that they would be a good choice.


----------



## shales1002

Maybe I'm wrong, but what's so good about D.A. ? 23 girls on a team split evenly; only three subs per game which means only 14 girls will get an opportunity to play in a game; participating girls can't do ECNL, ODP, or high school. Seems like a lot to give up for something that isn't proven. We all see how the the boys side has produced stellar players  and results (insert sarcasm).


----------



## Sombitch

Still more teams to come - round three on its way!


----------



## socalsoccercoach

Are we sure there is a round 3..word was about 50 clubs not at 53...Who else would they add?


----------



## NoGoal

Sombitch said:


> Still more teams to come - round three on its way!





socalsoccercoach said:


> Are we sure there is a round 3..word was about 50 clubs not at 53...Who else would they add?


adding 2-3 more SoCal clubs would water down the conference.  ECNL was only able to field 6 out of 8 strong competitive clubs in SoCal.


----------



## Sombitch

Initial word is roughly 70 clubs


----------



## espola

shales1002 said:


> Maybe I'm wrong, but what's so good about D.A. ? 23 girls on a team split evenly; only three subs per game which means only 14 girls will get an opportunity to play in a game; participating girls can't do ECNL, ODP, or high school. Seems like a lot to give up for something that isn't proven. We all see how the the boys side has produced stellar players  and results (insert sarcasm).


I have been saying for years that all those restrictions interfere with the supposed goal of _development_.  Unless, of course, they are mostly concerned with developing coaches or admins.


----------



## MakeAPlay

gkrent said:


> I would venture to say that some of their fiercest competitors either opted out of the playoffs or played in USYSA nationals.  Not to diminish the team...they are awesome and were able to bring back some of their D-1 players.



I can think of at least one team that was better than Slammers but they were missing their 3 best players due to YNT camp.  Even Slammers coach admitted to one of their players that they were benefitting because those players were gone.


----------



## Flojo

shales1002 said:


> Maybe I'm wrong, but what's so good about D.A. ? 23 girls on a team split evenly; only three subs per game which means only 14 girls will get an opportunity to play in a game; participating girls can't do ECNL, ODP, or high school. Seems like a lot to give up for something that isn't proven. We all see how the the boys side has produced stellar players  and results (insert sarcasm).


That's another problem with the DA academy. If they over-saturate a team with equally good players, only so many are getting the minutes they need in a real match. Sure, it teaches kids to fight for a starting position. But at this age, they need an equal amount of competitiveness and playing time. Which brings up the question: Do kids risk losing playing time to get "maximum" exposure to college and national team scouts and play academy, or do they have a better opportunity at more playing time against good teams as well, but risk not getting the most exposure? It's truly amazing the amount of politics that is in a kids' sport.


----------



## NoGoal

Flojo said:


> That's another problem with the DA academy. If they over-saturate a team with equally good players, only so many are getting the minutes they need in a real match. Sure, it teaches kids to fight for a starting position. But at this age, they need an equal amount of competitiveness and playing time. Which brings up the question: Do kids risk losing playing time to get "maximum" exposure to college and national team scouts and play academy, or do they have a better opportunity at more playing time against good teams as well, but risk not getting the most exposure? It's truly amazing the amount of politics that is in a kids' sport.


Great point and why I think the clubs that have DA and ECNL status can offer more opportunities for a player. Especially, if the player isn't good enough to crack playtime with the DA team. Yet as the player continues to develop she still gets the opportunity to attend ECNL college showcases.


----------



## SOCCERMINION

DA- IS HERE , MORE SOCCER TO LOVE>>>
Now my DD can forgo playing any youth soccer or AYSO and still make Flight 1 Soccer Program in her teens...Yah!!!
(Slammers Model Example)
Slammers - DA Program $$ (23 players)
Slammers - ECNL $$$ (18 Players)
Slammers -ECNL Reserve $$$ (18 Players)
Slammers- EGSL $$$ (18 Players)
Slammers- Flight 1 $$$ (18 Players)
The New DA Clubs Buisness model owns, recuitment and marketing genius move, we will all be lineing up....(remenber to keep paying for speed training, private trainings  futsal and taking personal initiative to develope your DD's to ensure they have a chance to qualify to be picked to be one of these developement programs for a  year.


----------



## smellycleats

NoGoal said:


> Great point and why I think the clubs that have DA and ECNL status can offer more opportunities for a player. Especially, if the player isn't good enough to crack playtime with the DA team. Yet as the player continues to develop she still gets the opportunity to attend ECNL college showcases.


Its my understanding that clubs who get DA teams will most likely lose ECNL. Its one or the other.


----------



## NoGoal

smellycleats said:


> Its my understanding that clubs who get DA teams will most likely lose ECNL. Its one or the other.


Not sure how reliable your sources are, but the 2 clubs that I know having both DA and ECNL status stated,  they will field teams in both leagues.  If you think about it, it makes perfect sense, because Girls DA combines 2 age groups, thus only the top 8-10 players in each calender year will be rostered only.

Also do you think ECNL or US Soccer wants to lose Blues, Slammers, Surf, Dallas Texans, PDA, Crossfire, Tophat, Michigan Hawks, Colorado Rush, Eclipse Select from their league?  I highly doubt it.


----------



## shales1002

smellycleats said:


> Its my understanding that clubs who get DA teams will most likely lose ECNL. Its one or the other.


It was my understanding that the girls will have to play one or the other. They can't do both.  That will be a hard pill to swallow for some of our top athletes. If you select the top 9 from the age group, you now have 4 elite girls not playing at all in any given game, or possibly receiving playing time every other year.


----------



## shales1002

Flojo said:


> That's another problem with the DA academy. If they over-saturate a team with equally good players, only so many are getting the minutes they need in a real match. Sure, it teaches kids to fight for a starting position. But at this age, they need an equal amount of competitiveness and playing time. Which brings up the question: Do kids risk losing playing time to get "maximum" exposure to college and national team scouts and play academy, or do they have a better opportunity at more playing time against good teams as well, but risk not getting the most exposure? It's truly amazing the amount of politics that is in a kids' sport.


A lot of playing time will be lost. The DA will not be able to implement that THIS IS THE ONLY PATHWAY to the National team . To do so would be quite foolish, and that's counter-productive to being the best in world. Besides our women are/were great without D.A. . What is it actually going to improve?


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> It was my understanding that the girls will have to play one or the other. They can't do both.  That will be a hard pill to swallow for some of our top athletes. If you select the top 9 from the age group, you now have 4 elite girls not playing at all in any given game, or possibly receiving playing time every other year.


And why I think you will see the YNT pool players and the next level of players below maybe current ODP team, ID2, and US Training Center players comprise the DA teams.

If I had a ulittle DD going through this now.  I would take her to a club that has both league affiliations. I would then game the system and have her play U odd years with ECNL and U even years with DA.  This way she gets maximum playtime and college exposure.


----------



## espola

NoGoal said:


> Great point and why I think the clubs that have DA and ECNL status can offer more opportunities for a player. Especially, if the player isn't good enough to crack playtime with the DA team. Yet as the player continues to develop she still gets the opportunity to attend ECNL college showcases.


No scholarships for bench players


----------



## smellycleats

shales1002 said:


> It was my understanding that the girls will have to play one or the other. They can't do both.  That will be a hard pill to swallow for some of our top athletes. If you select the top 9 from the age group, you now have 4 elite girls not playing at all in any given game, or possibly receiving playing time every other year.


Let me clarify. I was told that ECNL will drop clubs who accept DA status. Ultimately there will be "ECNL clubs" and "DA clubs "
but both organizations will not co-exist I the same club. I agree with other posters, it doesn't seem feasible economically and it would likely create a massive shift of players. I can't imagine that ECNL would want to lose Blues, etc. but it might explain some of the choices that were made. Some of the clubs that you would have expected to see in the DA list will remain as ECNL clubs. I'm sure I'm wrong, but it's a interesting scenario to consider.


----------



## Sombitch

smellycleats said:


> Let me clarify. I was told that ECNL will drop clubs who accept DA status. Ultimately there will be "ECNL clubs" and "DA clubs "
> but both organizations will not co-exist I the same club. I agree with other posters, it doesn't seem feasible economically and it would likely create a massive shift of players. I can't imagine that ECNL would want to lose Blues, etc. but it might explain some of the choices that were made. Some of the clubs that you would have expected to see in the DA list will remain as ECNL clubs. I'm sure I'm wrong, but it's a interesting scenario to consider.


This is false


----------



## smellycleats

Sombitch said:


> This is false


That is excellent news.


----------



## Glen

smellycleats said:


> Its my understanding that clubs who get DA teams will most likely lose ECNL. Its one or the other.


This is what I've heard too - but it's that a player can't play both.  ECNL is obviously not going to be the same once you take out the top 700 or so girls from each age group from that league.  They'll have to rename it to the "almost elite" club national league.  It's too bad, because ECNL seemed like it was really working.  It will never be the same (particularly the showcases), but it will be interesting to see in what form it sticks around as a next option.  My guess is that it dies, but the clubs that have DA/ECNL will still have the best second-team options whatever you call the league they play in.  Although if you are at a club with ECNL but no DA status, that will tough.  I'm sure there will be some clubs that figure out a was like Legends/Beach did without ECNL status.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> This is what I've heard too - but it's that a player can't play both.  ECNL is obviously not going to be the same once you take out the top 700 or so girls from each age group from that league.  They'll have to rename it to the "almost elite" club national league.  It's too bad, because ECNL seemed like it was really working.  It will never be the same (particularly the showcases), but it will be interesting to see in what form it sticks around as a next option.  My guess is that it dies, but the clubs that have DA/ECNL will still have the best second-team options whatever you call the league they play in.  Although if you are club with ECNL but no DA status, that will tough.  I'm sure there some clubs that figure out a was like Legends/Beach did without ECNL status.


I actually view it the opposite. SoCal DA clubs will only be able to produce 70-84 of the uber elite players per age group, per HS graduation class in SoCal.  To put it in perspective.  SoCal has 11 D1 soccer college programs alone.  They recruit 7-8 players per HS graduation year on average....so, if every SoCal DA player committed to those schools....which of course wouldn't happen.  That still leaves many D1-D3 colleges in SoCal and the Western states scrambling for college level players.  This is where ECNL will still fill that market need.

It's the Girls DA clubs without ECNL who will be challenged retaining their very good B team players.  As those girls will now head to ECNL teams.  The Beach, Legends, Carlsbad, LA Premier clubs top 8-10 players will be playing DA and leaving question marks, if their remaining players can qualify for USYS National League in the coming years.


----------



## timbuck

I heard that Blues is dropping ECNL completely.  Heard from a u14 parent.


----------



## NoGoal

timbuck said:


> I heard that Blues is dropping ECNL completely.  Heard from a u14 parent.


Actually, I was told by a Blues head coach.  They will be fielding ECNL and DA teams.

Think of it logically,  if Blues dropped ECNL.  How would a girls only club be able to fund their DA program or keep their club solvent?  Especially since the DA program has to be subsidize (I highly doubt it will be fully subsidized) by the club.


----------



## timbuck

I thought it sounded weird. It may have just been a coach telling a parent why their team wasn't the ECNL team.


----------



## Flojo

It makes more sense from a parents'/players' perspective to keep the club in both leagues. But why was the Girls DA created in the first place, separate from ECNL? Conflicting egos. I would like to see all the future DA clubs keep ECNL status if they have enough kids to field two good teams. However, it'll be interesting to see how US Soccer and ECNL feel about that. It seems like a repeat of the same petty arguments between US Youth Soccer and US Club soccer.


----------



## Goalie1310

In no particular order I think Strikers and Arsenal should be on the next list. They both have very good programs as do the others on the list I am very interested in seeing what it looks like at the end. Disclaimer my daughter plays for Strikers North and my son plays for Strikers South Bay but they have played as guest players on many teams on the list and i am happy my kids get to experience so many quality clubs in Southern California.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> I actually view it the opposite. SoCal DA clubs will only be able to produce 70-84 of the uber elite players per age group, per HS graduation class in SoCal.  To put it in perspective.  SoCal has 11 D1 soccer college programs alone.  They recruit 7-8 players per HS graduation year on average....so, if every SoCal DA player committed to those schools....which of course wouldn't happen.  That still leaves many D1-D3 colleges in SoCal and the Western states scrambling for college level players.  This is where ECNL will still fill that market need.
> 
> It's the Girls DA clubs without ECNL who will be challenged retaining their very good B team players.  As those girls will now head to ECNL teams.  The Beach, Legends, Carlsbad, LA Premier clubs top 8-10 players will be playing DA and leaving question marks, if their remaining players can qualify for USYS National League in the coming years.


ECNL without the top players doesn't make sense.  It's like trying to sell EGSL all over again.


----------



## Swoosh

Goalie1310 said:


> In no particular order I think Strikers and Arsenal should be on the next list. They both have very good programs as do the others on the list I am very interested in seeing what it looks like at the end. Disclaimer my daughter plays for Strikers North and my son plays for Strikers South Bay but they have played as guest players on many teams on the list and i am happy my kids get to experience so many quality clubs in Southern California.


Legends squashed the Arsenal, and Strikers does not check the boxes.  Slim to none of the chances.  RSC and WCFC are next up, thats IF they go to 10.


----------



## ECNL

Goalie1310 said:


> They both have very good programs as do the others on the list I am very interested in seeing what it looks like at the end.


Have you checked the u14-18 ECNL tables lately?  Strikers requires relegation out of ECNL.....which is likely going to  happen since they are on probation.  Give them DA?  I think not.  You should seriously consider moving your DD ASAP.


----------



## Flojo

Goalie1310 said:


> In no particular order I think Strikers and Arsenal should be on the next list. They both have very good programs as do the others on the list I am very interested in seeing what it looks like at the end. Disclaimer my daughter plays for Strikers North and my son plays for Strikers South Bay but they have played as guest players on many teams on the list and i am happy my kids get to experience so many quality clubs in Southern California.


I don't know where any of these teams stand from a geographic standpoint as my DD is a discovery player, but I would think Real So Cal would be the next team to get in, then Arsenal. I couldn't see Strikers getting in before Real So Cal, and I would think Arsenal would get in before Strikers. Unbiased opinion, Real So Cal is an overall stronger side than both of the clubs.


----------



## TD1

I never thought RSC girls side ever fully recovered after Scott Murray left.  Always thought as a human being he was kinda a jerk, but when he left the club has been in slow decline.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> ECNL without the top players doesn't make sense.  It's like trying to sell EGSL all over again.


How is that?  I would agree, if DA fielded teams in every age group, but they DO NOT! The clubs will take the top 9-10 players from a U15 and top 9-10 players from a U16 team for example.

Are you saying the depth chart from #11-20 on each age group aren't very good?  Well here are some facts for you.   The U17 Blues-Dodge team has 17 players committed, Surf U17 and Slammers U17 has just as many.  I will bet their U16 teams have similar number of players committed too.  Not all of their committed players on their U16 and U17 teams would make their DA teams.  In simple math terms: 2 age groups at these big clubs have on average 36-38 committed players.  DA will only be able to roster what 18-20 players (only 14 see the pitch).  It displaces 16-18 players who were previously on the A teams and where ECNL fills that void.


----------



## Goalie1310

I don't know much about RSC but WCFC is legitimate in my humble opinion. Strikers north is 
North Oc/South East Los Angeles area and strikers South Bay is based out of El Segundo Manhattan beach Hermosa beach Torrance to give you an ideal. My kids are 2006 and 2007 I am only basing my opinion  off of training I see with the u little and we have trained with many teams on the csl and scdsl side. I have not checked the u14-u18 table because Im just not their yet but I will out of curiosity nowBut I tend to judge a club by how they train their young players because to me that gives me insight to what they will be in the future as a club. I'm not looking to move them just yet as we are happy with the training.I really do appreciate the information as I will check some of these teams out I'm trying to learn as much as possible thanks! Check us out on Instagram @ soccerkeeper1310


----------



## shales1002

NoGoal said:


> How is that?  I would agree, if DA fielded teams in every age group, but they DO NOT! The clubs will take the top 9-10 players from a U15 and top 9-10 players from a U16 team for example.
> 
> Are you saying the depth chart from #11-20 on each age group aren't very good?  Well here are some facts for you.   The U17 Blues-Dodge team has 17 players committed, Surf U17 and Slammers U17 has just as many.  I will bet their U16 teams have similar number of players committed too.  Not all of their committed players on their U16 and U17 teams would make their DA teams.  In simple math terms: 2 age groups at these big clubs have on average 36-38 committed players.  DA will only be able to roster what 18-20 players (only 14 see the pitch).  It displaces 16-18 players who were previously on the A teams and where ECNL fills that void.


Are you saying the DA will be s better avenue for the already committed player ECNL for the uncommitted? If so, makes sense.


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> Are you saying the DA will be s better avenue for the already committed player ECNL for the uncommitted? If so, makes sense.


Not at all.  Maybe showing it visually will help more.

Current U15 ECNL team:
U15= 20 rostered players all are A team players
1-10 will move to the Girls DA U15/U16 combined team.
11-20 will remain on the U15 ECNL team, but get 10 new teammates

Current U16 ECNL:
U16= 20 rostered players all are A team players
1-10 will move to the Girls DA U15/16 combined team
11-20 will remain on the U16 ECNL team, but get 10 new teammates.

Final resulting reshuffle:
U15/16 DA team will comprise of 1-10 from U15 and 1-10 from U16
U15 ECNL will comprise 11-20, plus 10 new teammates
U16 ECNL will comprise 11-20, plus 10 new teammates.


----------



## Harrypotter03

NoGoal said:


> Actually, I was told by a Blues head coach.  They will be fielding ECNL and DA teams.
> 
> Think of it logically,  if Blues dropped ECNL.  How would a girls only club be able to fund their DA program or keep their club solvent?  Especially since the DA program has to be subsidize (I highly doubt it will be fully subsidized) by the club.


Can someone please explain how much the DA program will be subsidized? And how that translates to club, player, etc?  Thanks. I've been asking my club and feel like I'm getting a run around answer.


----------



## NoGoal

Harrypotter03 said:


> Can someone please explain how much the DA program will be subsidized? And how that translates to club, player, etc?  Thanks. I've been asking my club and feel like I'm getting a run around answer.


I don't think they have figured out how the subsidy is going to work out yet.  I've read US Soccer will give each club a certain amount, but still not enough to fully fund all the age groups.  So the rest will have to come from somewhere provided within the club.  My guess, higher club fees are going to be paid by the non-DA teams at the club to fund the DA teams or families will still pay, just like the boys DA clubs.


----------



## TD1

Harrypotter03 said:


> Can someone please explain how much the DA program will be subsidized? And how that translates to club, player, etc?  Thanks. I've been asking my club and feel like I'm getting a run around answer.


What do you mean how are they going to pay for this?  Lol just let me say no one whose kid plays on the B, C, D or E teams should act surprised when they see their club and league fees go up.

Let's be truthful with ourselves, none of these clubs are signing up for this because they think they will make less money.  So do the math.  24 players per team getting something like $2000 fees waived comes out to just about $50k per DA team (2 DA teams per club) each year in additional revenue that each of these clubs will need to raised just to break even.

Hopefully nobody is so naive to think US soccer is going to plop down $50k+ per year to each of the 100 or so DA teams to balance the books do you?  Where's the money going to come from haha!


----------



## ECNL

TD1 said:


> Where's the money going to come from haha!


It is a pyramid scheme.  *Pyramid schemes* are doomed to *fail* because their success depends on the ability to recruit more and more naive parents. Since there are only a limited number of naive parents in a given community, all *pyramid schemes* will ultimately collapse. The only people who make money are those few successful DOC's who are on the top of the DA *pyramid* and US Soccer.


----------



## TD1

ECNL said:


> It is a pyramid scheme.  *Pyramid schemes* are doomed to *fail* because their success depends on the ability to recruit more and more naive parents. Since there are only a limited number of naive parents in a given community, all *pyramid schemes* will ultimately collapse. The only people who make money are those few who are on the top of the *pyramid *(i.e., DOC's).


I agree with you ECNL, there is some fuzzy math going on.


----------



## NoGoal

ECNL said:


> It is a pyramid scheme.  *Pyramid schemes* are doomed to *fail* because their success depends on the ability to recruit more and more naive parents. Since there are only a limited number of naive parents in a given community, all *pyramid schemes* will ultimately collapse. The only people who make money are those few successful DOC's who are on the top of the DA *pyramid* and US Soccer.


I say Ponzi Scheme, every family pays the annual club fees with dreams of a college scholarship and only a few players get it.


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> The DA will not be able to implement that THIS IS THE ONLY PATHWAY to the National team .


Why not? The US WNT roster has 24 spots, and there are going to be approximately 70 Girls DA clubs, with 3 teams per club, with 23 players per team. That means that every year, they will have a pool of 1610 stud players feeding those 24 spots. That seems very doable.



shales1002 said:


> Besides our women are/were great without D.A. .


Yes, they have been successful, but their type of play has been exposed, and it is not a viable, long term style. The stated goal of the DA is to rely less on game/league results and concentrate more on the technical side of soccer with more training than games, run by more advanced and accredited coaches.


----------



## smellycleats

ECNL said:


> It is a pyramid scheme.  *Pyramid schemes* are doomed to *fail* because their success depends on the ability to recruit more and more naive parents. Since there are only a limited number of naive parents in a given community, all *pyramid schemes* will ultimately collapse. The only people who make money are those few successful DOC's who are on the top of the DA *pyramid* and US Soccer.


----------



## smellycleats

This is really depressing. I think Ill go and watch the news instead.


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> Why not? The US WNT roster has 24 spots, and there are going to be approximately 70 Girls DA clubs, with 3 teams per club, with 23 players per team. That means that every year, they will have a pool of 1610 stud players feeding those 24 spots. That seems very doable.
> 
> 
> Why not? More than 3/4 of the country is excluded. Will the U.S. not look at a player because the D.A. market is not geographically close by?  23 players goes back to my original point , if I'm one of the best, is possibly riding the bench on an elite team the best decision.
> 
> Yes, they have been successful, but their type of play has been exposed, and it is not a viable, long term style. The stated goal of the DA is to rely less on game/league results and concentrate more on the technical side of soccer with more training than games, run by more advanced and accredited coaches.


Not sure how they've been exposed. They are still producing results.  Although the DA goal is stated, they picked almost the exact same clubs that are currently ECNL.  This negates the more accredited aspect. Men's side however, has done nothing in comparison with the DA having been around for 10 years.


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> Not sure how they've been exposed. They are still producing results.  Although the DA goal is stated, they picked almost the exact same clubs that are currently ECNL.  This negates the more accredited aspect. Men's side however, has done nothing in comparison with the DA having been around for 10 years.


Don't mind CaliKlines, he's still floating on cloud nine that Legends was awarded DA.  So for him everything has been righted by US Soccer.


----------



## shales1002

NoGoal said:


> Not at all.  Maybe showing it visually will help more.
> 
> Current U15 ECNL team:
> U15= 20 rostered players all are A team players
> 1-10 will move to the Girls DA U15/U16 combined team.
> 11-20 will remain on the U15 ECNL team, but get 10 new teammates
> 
> Current U16 ECNL:
> U16= 20 rostered players all are A team players
> 1-10 will move to the Girls DA U15/16 combined team
> 11-20 will remain on the U16 ECNL team, but get 10 new teammates.
> 
> Final resulting reshuffle:
> U15/16 DA team will comprise of 1-10 from U15 and 1-10 from U16
> U15 ECNL will comprise 11-20, plus 10 new teammates
> U16 ECNL will comprise 11-20, plus 10 new teammates.



 Thanks for the clarification.  So being outside the top 6  in each age group  or players 15-20would suck. You will not be able to sub in. Some very talented players riding the bench.


----------



## TD1

CaliKlines said:


> Why not? The US WNT roster has 24 spots, and there are going to be approximately 70 Girls DA clubs, with 3 teams per club, with 23 players per team. That means that every year, they will have a pool of 1610 stud players feeding those 24 spots. That seems very doable.


So basically your thought is they should reduce the pool of national team players to only kids who live within a couple hours of these 70 clubs?  I see how that makes sense from the prospective of the 70 clubs and their bottom line.  But I don't see how that's a smart play if the goal is to find the best players?  



CaliKlines said:


> Yes, they have been successful, but their type of play has been exposed, and it is not a viable, long term style. The stated goal of the DA is to rely less on game/league results and concentrate more on the technical side of soccer with more training than games, run by more advanced and accredited coaches.


I agree with what you're saying here, but I'm not sure how the DA changes this dynamic?  Honestly seems like were talking about the same coaches and pretty much same clubs.  Expecting that these same coaches and clubs are going to start teaching a wildly different style of soccer then what they have always done seems unrealistic.


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> Thanks for the clarification.  So being outside the top 6  in each age group  or players 15-20would suck. You will not be able to sub in. Some very talented players riding the bench.


Pertaining to the Girls DA team, you got it!

I have been told, DA requires bench players #15-20 to start games. What I don't know and maybe someone on the Boys DA side can answer.  Will the bench players #15-20 get the same amount of starts as the starting #1-11 players on the team?


----------



## eastbaysoccer

What people are underestimating is how important HS sports are to the girls.  And that there is no money at the end of the journey.  

We will find out soon.  ECNL should boot out every GDA club and replace them with a nearby club. Touché'.


----------



## shales1002

NoGoal said:


> Pertaining to the Girls DA team, you got it!
> 
> I have been told, DA requires bench players #15-20 to start games. What I don't know and maybe someone on the Boys DA side can answer.  Will the bench players #15-20 get the same amount of starts as the starting #1-11 players on the team?


Glad I got it. I'm not sure how they can enforce 15-20 starting. Who are the going to ask ? Parents


----------



## NoGoal

eastbaysoccer said:


> What people are underestimating is how important HS sports are to the girls.  And that there is no money at the end of the journey.
> 
> We will find out soon.  ECNL should boot out every GDA club and replace them with a nearby club. Touché'.


IDK, Eclipse Select Was awarded Girls DA and didn't their DOC create ECNL?  I highly doubt he will kick out his own club out of ECNL.


----------



## fun on the pitch

On the boys DA at u14,  the top 1-6 players are almost always starters. They try to balance play time with players 7-14. If you're lower than that you are screwed. As for 16's and 18's the best play. It's about winning. DA also has sub rules. You can not re enter like ECNL in halves or scdsl. DA once you are out you are out. Galaxy is the only truly free academy. Every academy pays something $$$


----------



## NoGoal

fun on the pitch said:


> On the boys DA at u14,  the top 1-6 players are almost always starters. They try to balance play time with players 7-14. If you're lower than that you are screwed. As for 16's and 18's the best play. It's about winning. DA also has sub rules. You can not re enter like ECNL in halves or scdsl. DA once you are out you are out. Galaxy is the only truly free academy. Every academy pays something $$$


Listen to fun on the pitch, he knows more about DA than any of us based on his own experience!


----------



## Round

CaliKlines said:


> Why not? The US WNT roster has 24 spots, and there are going to be approximately 70 Girls DA clubs, with 3 teams per club, with 23 players per team. That means that every year, they will have a pool of 1610 stud players feeding those 24 spots. That seems very doable.
> 
> 
> Yes, they have been successful, but their type of play has been exposed, and it is not a viable, long term style. The stated goal of the DA is to rely less on game/league results and concentrate more on the technical side of soccer with more training than games, run by more advanced and accredited coaches.


You have it right.  This whole thing has been bad for soccer, focusing on dreams that wont happen and should not be in the first place.  This was supposed to be about being a player on a team plain a sport that was fun and sometimes your team, the team you grew with, would be the one that wins.  Now we have a mess.  College, keep paying for those stupid camps.  You are better off saving the money and time unless your kid is way better than the best, and doesn't change her mind at 17.


----------



## Swoosh

We are the number one team in the world in women's soccer, yet our U20s lost to Japan 5-0 a month ago.  If that's the future for us, we are in trouble.  US Soccer is trying to change our future.


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> Not sure how they've been exposed. They are still producing results.


If wins are your only criteria for success, then you are correct. They win many matches, and it makes me happy when they do. Although the US WNT did not win the 2011 WC, and they were exposed by a smaller, more technical Japanese side. And the gap is closing. Brazil teaches technical futbol, and they always give us a game.



shales1002 said:


> Although the DA goal is stated, they picked almost the exact same clubs that are currently ECNL.  This negates the more accredited aspect.


Uh, exact same clubs? Half is not the exact same. Half is half. They picked the best, most accomplished sides from the ECNL, along with the most accomplished non-ECNL clubs that have the talent and ability to teach technical soccer...and LA Premier, a geo-political selection.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> How is that?  I would agree, if DA fielded teams in every age group, but they DO NOT! The clubs will take the top 9-10 players from a U15 and top 9-10 players from a U16 team for example.
> 
> Are you saying the depth chart from #11-20 on each age group aren't very good?  Well here are some facts for you.   The U17 Blues-Dodge team has 17 players committed, Surf U17 and Slammers U17 has just as many.  I will bet their U16 teams have similar number of players committed too.  Not all of their committed players on their U16 and U17 teams would make their DA teams.  In simple math terms: 2 age groups at these big clubs have on average 36-38 committed players.  DA will only be able to roster what 18-20 players (only 14 see the pitch).  It displaces 16-18 players who were previously on the A teams and where ECNL fills that void.


You think Slammers G15 minus their top 10 players is worth watching for a college coach?


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> We are the number one team in the world in women's soccer, yet our U20s lost to Japan 5-0 a month ago.  If that's the future for us, we are in trouble.  US Soccer is trying to change our future.


YNT results isn't indicative to Sr team results, because D1 college soccer success is what filters the YNT players before being invited to a Sr camp/team.  Except of course for Mallory Pugh or Ashley Sanchez.


----------



## Round

Swoosh said:


> You think Slammers G15 minus their top 10 players is worth watching for a college coach?


Have any of you researched what happens to girls that picked a college due to soccer?

Economics majors?  Real longitudinal study?  I only know from who I know but it's not good, or not worth it.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> You think Slammers G15 minus their top 10 players is worth watching for a college coach?


Yes, especially for mid-major D1 programs such as UC Davis, UCI, Long Beach St, SDSU, LMU, and alike along with D2-D3 schools.  These Universities don't get the Blue Chip recruits.  Blue Chippers usually commit to Power 5 conference schools along with Pepperdine and Santa Clara.

You have to be a ulittle parent or still going through the recruiting process, because it seems like you don't know.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> If wins are your only criteria for success, then you are correct. They win many matches, and it makes me happy when they do. Although the US WNT did not win the 2011 WC, and they were exposed by a smaller, more technical Japanese side. And the gap is closing. Brazil teaches technical futbol, and they always give us a game.
> 
> 
> 
> Uh, exact same clubs? Half is not the exact same. Half is half. They picked the best, most accomplished sides from the ECNL, along with the most accomplished non-ECNL clubs that have the talent and ability to teach technical soccer...and LA Premier, a geo-political selection.



Most of the picks were political.  The non-ECNL clubs mostly have done nothing.  This is a house of cards that is bound to come down.  I'm going to enjoy watching this all unfold and I am incredibly thankful that it will be as a non-stakeholder.  I guarantee that it's going to be a cluster "F" out of the gates.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> We are the number one team in the world in women's soccer, yet our U20s lost to Japan 5-0 a month ago.  If that's the future for us, we are in trouble.  US Soccer is trying to change our future.


The US WNT are the current Olympic and WC Champions.  They crushed Japan in the WC finals 5-2, avenging their WC defeat to Japan in PKs.  The team is even better now with Mallory Pugh and Crystal Dunn!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> You think Slammers G15 minus their top 10 players is worth watching for a college coach?


Yes.  They typically get 20-30 players per grad year committed so I would say so.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Yes, especially for mid-major D1 programs such as UC Davis, UCI, Long Beach St, SDSU, LMU, and alike.  They don't usually get the elite recruits.  Those players commit to Power 5 schools along with Pepperdine and Santa Clara.
> 
> You have to be a ulittle parent!


An ECNL team minus many starters is closer in quality to a current EGSL team than not.  None of the Universities you mention above recruit from EGSL teams as a norm.  This is a clueless post.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> An ECNL team minus many starters is equal to a current EGSL team, you have to be clueless.


 You just confirmed you haven't been through the recruiting process making an idiotic post like that.  

I hope your DD is a highly ranked player posting the way you do.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> You just confirmed you haven't been through the recruiting process making an idiotic post like that.


hahaha.  Keep drinking the Kool-Aid.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> hahaha.  Keep drinking the Kool-Aid.


Kool-aid?  My DD is already committed and graduates this coming May.  I am only posting to give back what I learned going through the process with my DD.  The new DA league will case ripples than the tidal wave ECNL did when it dethroned National League and CSL Premier as the #1 gaming circuit in the country. Then again you wouldn't know would you.

Where as you are posting garbage that doesn't help ulittle parents navigate through the changing club soccer landscape.  You have nothing to offer to the forum!


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> If wins are your only criteria for success, then you are correct. They win many matches, and it makes me happy when they do. Although the US WNT did not win the 2011 WC, and they were exposed by a smaller, more technical Japanese side. And the gap is closing. Brazil teaches technical futbol, and they always give us a game.
> 
> Isn't winning what it's about at that level? The USWNT is comprised of professional women athletes.  Who cares if the gap is closing? Aren't the results currently being produced? The women are champions without any assistance from the DA. Men are not champions as a result of the DA.
> 
> Uh, exact same clubs? Half is not the exact same. Half is half. They picked the best, most accomplished sides from the ECNL, along with the most accomplished non-ECNL clubs that have the talent and ability to teach technical soccer...and LA Premier, a geo-political selection.


Sorry, they picked the clubs who had the money to buy in. I can't wait to hear about how much fees have increased. 

Just for the record, I would totally support the DA if they were actually providing something different. Selecting the same clubs, and a few clubs that have been begging for ECNL doesn't count as change.


----------



## Sombitch

Swoosh said:


> You think Slammers G15 minus their top 10 players is worth watching for a college coach?


Yes absolutely because some of their studs were still there.


----------



## Sombitch

Swoosh said:


> An ECNL team minus many starters is equal to a current EGSL team, you have to be clueless.


Surf U17 without their three national players was far from an EGSL team

slammers GU15 without their national teamer wasn't even close to an EGSL team

My DD GU15 team this past season without their three national teamers was still far from an EGSL team and won a very competitive southwest conference

I am not pro or anti ecnl, every kid needs a certain environment to thrive. Merely showing the statistics


----------



## NoGoal

Sombitch said:


> Surf U17 without their three national players was far from an EGSL team
> 
> slammers GU15 without their national teamer wasn't even close to an EGSL team
> 
> My DD GU15 team this past season without their three national teamers was still far from an EGSL team and won a very competitive southwest conference
> 
> I am not pro or anti ecnl, every kid needs a certain environment to thrive. Merely showing the statistics


Sombitch, We must both be clueless!


----------



## Swoosh

Sombitch said:


> Surf U17 without their three national players was far from an EGSL team
> 
> slammers GU15 without their national teamer wasn't even close to an EGSL team
> 
> My DD GU15 team this past season without their three national teamers was still far from an EGSL team and won a very competitive southwest conference
> 
> I am not pro or anti ecnl, every kid needs a certain environment to thrive. Merely showing the statistics


Appreciate your post.  Think of your team minus not one, not three, but minus the 10 best players, that's all I'm pointing out.  Maybe not quite an EGSL team but closer to one than not.  Just my opinion.  And I completely agree with your last statement.

Now for NoGoal posting that mid majors would recruit the remaining talent, it may be true, but mostly from their ID camps if they show well.  Their recruiting budget will be mainly for the DA. ECNL will still operate, but minus the best players will not be the same.  Smart parents will now shop for the quality of the coaching rather than a patch.  There were already many marginal games within ECNL, imagine now without the top talent.  There are many great coaches inside the ECNL, as well as outside.  Just mho.


----------



## Technician72

NoGoal said:


> Kool-aid?  My DD is already committed and graduates this coming May.  I am only posting to give back what I learned going through the process with my DD.  The new DA league will case ripples than the tidal wave ECNL did when it dethroned National League and CSL Premier as the #1 gaming circuit in the country. Then again you wouldn't know would you.
> 
> Where as you are posting garbage that doesn't help ulittle parents navigate through the changing club soccer landscape.  You have nothing to offer to the forum!





Sombitch said:


> Surf U17 without their three national players was far from an EGSL team
> 
> slammers GU15 without their national teamer wasn't even close to an EGSL team
> 
> My DD GU15 team this past season without their three national teamers was still far from an EGSL team and won a very competitive southwest conference
> 
> I am not pro or anti ecnl, every kid needs a certain environment to thrive. Merely showing the statistics


Thank you for posting and sharing your experiences, always good to see the parents who have gone through it pass along information to help others make the best decision the possibly can for their kids. Keep it coming!


----------



## Swoosh

According to those "in the know" there will not be any more clubs added in Southern California for the Development Academy.  IF this is true, WCFC and RSC will have wait a year and try to get in on expansion next year.


----------



## timbuck

Random thoughts and questions about DA and ECNL.
When ECNL was created, was there the same type of (negative and positive) buzz?
Does anyone know the economics for ECNL clubs now versus what it was like before ECNL?  Have fees for their non-encl teams increased more than teams that don't have ECNL status?  Have they increased their total player population more than non-ecnl clubs?
How many players on an ECNL team receive some sort of financial help from the club?
How will funding for DA clubs work?  If US Soccer is giving each team a stipend, is there a requirement that it be allocated for player fees / travel?  Does each team get equal funding? Or can a club do whatever it wants with the money? (IE - Give the DOC a raise, hire more coaches, spend money on coach education, buy equipment, build a clubhouse, etc).   Do clubs need to provide US Soccer with financials for all teams under their umbrella?  (Because it seems that a club could do some funny accounting stuff with this.)
Many clubs have coaches that also coach in high school.  How will this be impacted by the no HS for DA players rule?

And unless being a professional female soccer player can become a viable career for more than 30 women in the US, I don't quite understand the need for DA for females.


----------



## Eusebio

TD1 said:


> What do you mean how are they going to pay for this?  Lol just let me say no one whose kid plays on the B, C, D or E teams should act surprised when they see their club and league fees go up.
> 
> [...]
> 
> Hopefully nobody is so naive to think US soccer is going to plop down $50k+ per year to each of the 100 or so DA teams to balance the books do you?  Where's the money going to come from haha!


Pretty much.

If a club is fielding 3 DA teams, then all they need to do is add 8 uLittle "C", "D", and "E" teams all run by two coaches who are fresh out of college. Those eight ulittle teams can generate an excess of 300K (~15 players per team X $2,500 = $37,500  X 8 = $300K). Pay the two college grad coaches $35k each. Make the parents pay for uniforms and tournaments. Stick the teams on a 20x20 ft. postage stamp space on fields the club is already renting. Then the club still comes out on top of roughly $250K in profit off "elite/academy" bronze ulittle teams. And the DA and ECNL branding will just attract even more ulittle parents ready and willing to pay $2,500 a year to be on the new "F" teams with the hope of climbing the ladder. After all, there are so many success stories of clubs promoting from within. 

Pretty good "Non-Profit" racket they got going on.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Same coaches, new name.  How does this help?

The best athletes and players would be the best regardless of ECNL, GDA, etc.

99% of the so cal girls will never set foot on the pitch for the US NT.  Some of these girls on the team play there for a good 10 years!!!!  Once the marketing dollars get behind PUGH there will be no one in so cal replacing her for 10-15 years.

Also there no money in professional soccer for the majority who make it.  The janitor at your local elementary school makes more and has better benefits.  

The goal should be play 2 years in college, then switch your major to something of substance so you can earn over six figures.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Now for NoGoal posting that mid majors would recruit the remaining talent, it may be true, but mostly from their ID camps if they show well.  Their recruiting budget will be mainly for the DA. ECNL will still operate, but minus the best players will not be the same.  Smart parents will now shop for the quality of the coaching rather than a patch.  There were already many marginal games within ECNL, imagine now without the top talent.  There are many great coaches inside the ECNL, as well as outside.  Just mho.


Ummm, from what I heard on the Boys DA side.  Boys DA does NOT hold as many college showcase events!  So how exactly will that eat into a mid-majors coaches budget?  Also do you think mid-majors conference coaches like a Wyoming or Boise St. will be focusing all their time, effort and budget trying to recruit Blue Chippers on a DA team?

I never posted ECNL wouldn't be the same, of course DA will take some bite out of ECNL, but until DA fields teams in every age group vs 2 year combined age groups.  ECNL will still be a viable option for the next level of players below....and why Blues, Slammers, Surf, and Eagles in SoCal will have a inherit advantage over the other clubs only offering DA or ECNL.


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Also do you think mid-majors conference coaches like a Wyoming or Boise St. will be focusing all their time, effort and budget trying to recruit Blue Chippers on a DA team?.


So, are you saying that the ECNL is going to be the main focus of Wyoming and Boise State, and other like institutions?


----------



## Glen

My only prediction is that this conversation isn't going to end well . . .


----------



## gkrent

Swoosh said:


> Smart parents will now shop for the quality of the coaching rather than a patch.


Hit the nail on the head


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> So, are you saying that the ECNL is going to be the main focus of Wyoming and Boise State, and other like institutions?



I can tell you that those schools don't waste time with blue chip players that are never going to go there.  If one of the top 50 players in the country happen to be from their home state then maybe they make a play at them.  Otherwise they don't waste the time.  The other side of the coin is that the players that land mostly YNT players are going to continue to do their scouting at YNT camps with players that have for the most part already been identified.  DA will not change that.  Also many of the top schools identify players that are YNT before they even get on US soccer's radar.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

GDA's goal is to produce national players for their team not for college.  Let's not forget that.
US soccer's self preservation is reliant on the success of the national team.  They could care less if our girls play, attend or flunk out of college.  Let's get real here.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Low mid majors like Wyoming, UOP, UC Davis, D2 and D3 schools lose 99% of any blue chips they chase.  These schools have to work very hard in the recruiting process to find those kids that develop late.


----------



## MakeAPlay

eastbaysoccer said:


> Same coaches, new name.  How does this help?
> 
> The best athletes and players would be the best regardless of ECNL, GDA, etc.
> 
> 99% of the so cal girls will never set foot on the pitch for the US NT.  Some of these girls on the team play there for a good 10 years!!!!  Once the marketing dollars get behind PUGH there will be no one in so cal replacing her for 10-15 years.
> 
> Also there no money in professional soccer for the majority who make it.  The janitor at your local elementary school makes more and has better benefits.
> 
> The goal should be play 2 years in college, then switch your major to something of substance so you can earn over six figures.


I agree with most everything that you said.  However, Sanchez is in line to supplement not replace Pugh.  Plus there are several other positions that will become available in the next 5-6 years.  Lloyd is going to get married after the Olympics so count on her being gone in the next 4 years (she is 32 and isn't going to wait past 36 to start a family).  A-Rod and Sydney Leroux are likely not coming back or will be gone for good in the next 5 years too.  There is definitely going to be a lot more opportunity to break into the girls club in the next 5 years and Pugh and company are just the beginning.


----------



## MakeAPlay

eastbaysoccer said:


> GDA's goal is to produce national players for their team not for college.  Let's not forget that.
> US soccer's self preservation is reliant on the success of the national team.  They could care less if our girls play, attend or flunk out of college.  Let's get real here.


They don't develop national team players.  D1 college soccer does.  Horan is the exception.  Pugh will be reporting to UCLA in a month and a half.  The DA will not change that.  They miss a ton of players that college soccer uncovers.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> So, are you saying that the ECNL is going to be the main focus of Wyoming and Boise State, and other like institutions?


Uh, I already posted ECNL will be a viable option for D1 mid-major conferences, D2-D3.

With that said, parts of the country will not have DA.  So, those ECNL clubs will still be a viable destination for players seeking to be recruited by Power 5 conference schools.


----------



## casper

DA vs ECNL

DA goal to get girls to the National teams from U14 WNT- Senior WNT. This elite group of players represents less than 0.0000001% of the girls that play soccer in those age groups. Recently the WNT U14 called 48 players to camp and they just concluded a 2nd camp with only 36 players called back from the original 48. These 36 were representing all of the US girls in the 02 and 03 age groups in the country. Out of those very talented 36 maybe 2 or 3 ever make it to the senior WNT. So for 99.999999% of the girls playing DA they will never reach that goal. Doesn't mean the training won't be excellent nor won't open up opportunities for them on the College front. In all likely hood it will be another great vehicle for those talented players to get to the collegiate level. Until there is a viable pro league in the US it's College or playing pro overseas. ECNL was designed to get girls to college and for those select few that were scouted and selected to YNT from ECNL teams it served that purpose as a secondary role. International football is another beast and to play for the US it's a very unlikely and competitive road.  I am sure DA and ECNL will coexist as the other leagues do and hopefully whatever your dd's goals are she will find the right fit for her and give herself the best opportunity to reach those goals.


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## ECNL

Edit:  It looks like Casper and I were thinking the same thing.  He beat me to it by 20 minutes or so.



CaliKlines said:


> The US WNT roster has 24 spots, and there are going to be approximately 70 Girls DA clubs, with 3 teams per club, with 23 players per team. That means that every year, they will have a pool of 1610 stud players feeding those 24 spots.





eastbaysoccer said:


> 99% of the so cal girls will never set foot on the pitch for the US NT.  Some of these girls on the team play there for a good 10 years!!!!


It is closer to 99.99999% of all female soccer players in the USA from all age ranges across multiple generations.  In reality, one new player makes the roster every other year on the WNT.  In my opinion it is another scheme to transfer wealth from families to US Soccer and their respective DOC's.  The only thing I like about the DA is that it may conceivably give a kid an opportunity to play at a high level of soccer that she would not have otherwise had due to low social-economic status (SES) of her family.  However, low SES YNT potential girls usually play on scholarship anyway so in the end I think it is a moot point.

Here is the reality:  approximately 70 GDA clubs, 1 team (u18/19 players only ~ with very rare exceptions) per club, 1 top player per team.  That means every year the WNT (Senior only - the rest does not matter) will have 70 stud players to replace 1 roster spot every couple years.  If your DD is one of those 70 it increases your chance to make the WNT roster to .02%.

Here is my suggestion.  If you have a daughter that has a good deal of skill in soccer, encourage her to chase her dreams but be a realistic parent.  Lovingly share this realism with your DD.  Then, use soccer as leverage to get into the college of her dreams, or her 2nd or 3rd choice, or ANY college she would not have otherwise been able to attend.  Have her play the beautiful game and watch her flourish and fail, and if you have the rare opportunity to watch her play in college (with or without a scholarship) you should pat yourself on the back.  I will be one of the first to say "well done."


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## picaboo

Why no Arsenal? My neighbor told me they were the best thing going in IE.


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## CaliKlines

picaboo said:


> Why no Arsenal? My neighbor told me they were the best thing going in IE.


Is your neighbor's last name Brown? Or Lassiter? Or maybe their definition of the IE is "Inner England".


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## picaboo

CaliKlines said:


> Is your neighbor's last name Brown? Or Lassiter? Or maybe their definition of the IE is "Inner England".


? Jorgensen


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## socalsoccercoach

Swoosh said:


> According to those "in the know" there will not be any more clubs added in Southern California for the Development Academy.  IF this is true, WCFC and RSC will have wait a year and try to get in on expansion next year.


That is interesting and will have an interesting influence on the landscape...do most DA clubs in socal stay with ECNL as well?


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## CaliKlines

PJ Brown is DOC of Arsenal. Randy Brown in an Arsenal ECNL coach. Mr. Lassiter is another ECNL coach. "Inner England" is a joke meant to be a play on words with the Inland Empire. Inner England would refer to the Premier League club called Arsenal FC, which is located in London.


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## Swoosh

CaliKlines said:


> PJ Brown is DOC of Arsenal. Randy Brown in an Arsenal ECNL coach. Mr. Lassiter is another ECNL coach. "Inner England" is a joke meant to be a play on words with the Inland Empire. Inner England would refer to the Premier League club called Arsenal FC, which is located in London.


Would Legends be considered Iceland then?


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## Swoosh

socalsoccercoach said:


> That is interesting and will have an interesting influence on the landscape...do most DA clubs in socal stay with ECNL as well?


Yes.  ECNL will be for their second teams, as their top players will play in the DA.  The other four DA Clubs will place their teams in the CRL and the National League provided they qualify.


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## picaboo

Swoosh said:


> Would Legends be considered Iceland then?


Where do I go to get good information on Arsenal and Legends. Unbiased.


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## Technician72

picaboo said:


> Where do I go to get good information on Arsenal and Legends. Unbiased.


My girls played for both clubs at U-Little.

Both have the reach to recruit talented players, but in my opinion Legends is better managed. Arsenal has never found it's direction since the Kooimans left the club.

Legends was and still is more considerate to their teams outside the "A" team.

Cost, they're basically the same.

Legends has a deeper coaching pool, Arsenal tends to have 30 teams coached by RB every year and that makes for a lot of games with fill in coaches just winging it. However, I think Coach Anthony Glenn at Arsenal is a very good coach.

I know friends who play for both clubs and the one at Legends are considerably happier with their experiences.


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## timbuck

Would it be a fair statement to say that most of the so called "top teams" are great at recruiting and marketing?  They may have good coaches, but give a u6 dad coach a team of u17 studs and I bet they win 40% of their games.


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## picaboo

Technician72 said:


> My girls played for both clubs at U-Little.
> 
> Both have the reach to recruit talented players, but in my opinion Legends is better managed. Arsenal has never found it's direction since the Kooimans left the club.
> 
> Legends was and still is more considerate to their teams outside the "A" team.
> 
> Cost, they're basically the same.
> 
> Legends has a deeper coaching pool, Arsenal tends to have 30 teams coached by RB every year and that makes for a lot of games with fill in coaches just winging it. However, I think Coach Anthony Glenn at Arsenal is a very good coach.
> 
> I know friends who play for both clubs and the one at Legends are considerably happier with their experiences.


Thank you


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## MakeAPlay

picaboo said:


> Where do I go to get good information on Arsenal and Legends. Unbiased.


Legends does not have a long record of success whereas Arsenal does.  When my daughter started club there was no such thing as Legends.  Josh Hodges is a marketer and has done a good job marketing his area of influence.  If Cle and Noah Kooiman had never left Arsenal this wouldn't even be a question as they are both vastly superior coaches to anything either club has now.  It's a damn shame that the kids in the IE lost out on the opportunity to play for them.  There is some outstanding talent in the 909/951 area and it sucks that they don't get the same opportunities that are available in the OC.


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## TD1

picaboo said:


> Where do I go to get good information on Arsenal and Legends. Unbiased.


How old is your kid?

The best path is to call up both clubs and arrange for your kid to go out and attend several practices.  Personally I would start with the club that is closer to where you live and go from there.


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## NoGoal

picaboo said:


> Where do I go to get good information on Arsenal and Legends. Unbiased.


I live in the IE and can give you unbaised information on the 2 clubs.  My DD and son both played for Legends, when they were originally Gendora Football Club aka GFC.  My DD played 2 years of ulittles at Legends and son for 8 years. Both kids took 3 years of private training wih Matt Evans who is the Legends technical director.  I know more about Legends than the biggest homer on this forum does....cough CaliKlines!

As MakeAPlay has pointed out Arsenal Girls ECNL has struggled to attract top players in the IE.  The biggest mistake the club did was allow the Kooiman's to stop running the club.  Cle now runs IE Surf and Noah coaches at Albion.  Once, both Kooiman's left, Legends became the dominant club in the IE.

Legends is a good club, but didn't have ECNL.  That was their biggest knock and why so many top players in my DDs U18/19 age group ended up commuting to ECNL clubs.  Legends getting Girls DA, will give them a HUGE lift in convincing top players in the area from going elsewhere.  They are financially stable, because they have tons of teams in every age group.  If there is any club who can actually fully fund Girls DA,  Legends is probably the club.

If I had a stud ulittle DD, I would have her tryout and see if she could make Legends DA team.  If not, I would then have her tryout for another DA club or have her play ECNL with a club outside the IE.


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## picaboo

We are an AYSO family but have been told we should have her play club. I like the term "ulittle" . She will be 9 in August. Thanks for all the information. We have homework to do. I am probably on the wrong thread but it was interesting.


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## MakeAPlay

timbuck said:


> Would it be a fair statement to say that most of the so called "top teams" are great at recruiting and marketing?  They may have good coaches, but give a u6 dad coach a team of u17 studs and I bet they win 40% of their games.


It depends upon the coach.  There are some outstanding teachers out there that will do wonders for your daughter's game.  They can be found at big and small clubs.  There are also some extremely horrible coaches that have supremely talented teams and they do very little with them.  It is all about the coach.  My daughters first club which was an ECNL club had their best coach working with the "C" team!  My daughter was on the "B" team at the time and we begged for him but they wouldn't have him coach above the third team.  He was her coach for private trainings for a couple years (until his schedule wouldn't allow it) and he did amazing things with her.

The bottom line is the coach is the most important thing.


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## TD1

picaboo said:


> We are an AYSO family but have been told we should have her play club. I like the term "ulittle" . She will be 9 in August. Thanks for all the information. We have homework to do.


What a great age.  Mine played for AYSO until U11 when we moved her to the local club.  Spent next two years at small local clubs, and then bounced to one of the big clubs at U13.  Legend? Arsenal?  Save yourself some money and time and don't buy into the college hype with a kid so young.  Truthfully it's pretty hard to tell if a kid will have the chops to play college ball until they are quite a bit older, and no matter how much you spend if they don't love putting in the work and have loads of natural talent neither club is going to change that.


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## Technician72

picaboo said:


> We are an AYSO family but have been told we should have her play club. I like the term "ulittle" . She will be 9 in August. Thanks for all the information. We have homework to do. I am probably on the wrong thread but it was interesting.


I have to echo what the posters have said before, have fun watching her play and develop. Focus on details such as skills / touch / vision but keep it fun! Find a good coach and the club becomes secondary, best of luck!


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## NoGoal

picaboo said:


> We are an AYSO family but have been told we should have her play club. I like the term "ulittle" . She will be 9 in August. Thanks for all the information. We have homework to do. I am probably on the wrong thread but it was interesting.


At ulittle, have your DD play for a great coach who allows her to enjoy the game, develop her skills and be creative on the pitch.   There is no need to play for a big club until U14 and older.


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## picaboo

When did most of your (posters) daughters start club? We thought about maybe a select AYSO team instead. Haven't really talked to my daughter about what she wants. Maybe it's to early to throw money at one sport? Possible putting the "Cart before the horse"


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## NoGoal

picaboo said:


> When did most of your (posters) daughters start club? We thought about maybe a select AYSO team instead. Haven't really talked to my daughter about what she wants. Maybe it's to early to throw money at one sport? Possible putting the "Cart before the horse"


Unless she is freak athlete, get her in club as soon as possible, my DD began club at U8-U9.  Dam almost 10 years ago.

Enjoy the journey and the lasting memories!


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## Generik

picaboo said:


> Where do I go to get good information on Arsenal and Legends. Unbiased.


You're in the right place now...ask away and these Forum members are great resources!

We've all experienced "the good, the bad, and the ugly" that is SoCal youth soccer - and most of us here want to give our "two-cents" worth of past experiences to help out our fellow families.

Everyone will have a different opinion...but the more information you have, the better choices you can make.

Good luck...and give your neighbor RB my love!


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## timbuck

picaboo said:


> When did most of your (posters) daughters start club? We thought about maybe a select AYSO team instead. Haven't really talked to my daughter about what she wants. Maybe it's to early to throw money at one sport? Possible putting the "Cart before the horse"


I coach an AYSO Extra (select) team. It's been a great program for the girls in it. We started at u9 and we will be u12 this Fall. 
We've had a few girls leave for club teams and a few girls join us from club teams. 
As mentioned above, it's all about the coach. (Not saying I'm the best, but I certainly put in a ton of effort). But almost as important at the younger ages, it's about the families that are on your team.


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## timbuck

Also-  my rule of thumb-  don't pick one sport if your kid still believes in Santa Claus.


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## outside!

picaboo said:


> We are an AYSO family but have been told we should have her play club. I like the term "ulittle" . She will be 9 in August. Thanks for all the information. We have homework to do. I am probably on the wrong thread but it was interesting.


DD started club at U10. She was always BFS but tended to rely on speed over technique. She has worked hard on skills and if all works out will be playing D1 with a great program and school in 2018. She was never on an ECNL team, but has gotten lots of exposure through USYS National League. The start of GDA changes the landscape going forward however.

Emphasize skill training and first touch with futsal, privates and individual work. For a club soccer, coach and teammates matter more than the name on the jersey. Get her on a team where she will start, but is not the best player. If she keeps working, she will become one of the best players at which time it will probably be time to move on to a higher level team. Aim to be on a top team at an ECNL or GDA club by around U13 if she still loves it. Despite what some say, juggling helps and is one of the things that helped DD get noticed. Make time for other sports if she is interested while she is younger.


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## devupa2.0

Picaboo - you have a number of good choices in your area at ulittle.

Legends, I.E. Surf, I.E. Surf West all have coaches that work to develop skills in players at the young ages. This is not an exhaustive list, there are others too.

My point would be that the first priority is that your DD is at a spot that she enjoys and sees plenty of time on the field with the following keys (just my thoughts and others might add/edit):

1. She shouldn't be the best player on the team. This allows her to be pushed by some other players that will challenge her.
2. The coach should be almost completely focused on skills development. A focus on team play develops over time, but at this age great coaches will work to get players confident on the ball. The concepts of moving the ball around as a team are good, but overrated at the younger ages. This will be taught and emphasized later. In the earlier years your DD should become as technical and confident as possible on the ball.
3. The coach should not identify specific positions for players. Your DD should have the chance to be all over the field, thus getting familiar with many roles.
4. Winning is fun and may be important for some of your daughter's confidence, but the coach should not seem super focused on this. resist the temptation to go to a team/club because that team has a great record. Focus more on the coaching philosophy (see #2 and #3).
5. She has to enjoy her team and you need to enjoy the parents. Club soccer ends up commanding a lot of time (yours and hers), so you want to like the folks your with. If you find the right group, it can be a tremendous journey and a ton of fun!

The water is warm - time to dive in!


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> They don't develop national team players.  D1 college soccer does.  Horan is the exception.  Pugh will be reporting to UCLA in a month and a half.  The DA will not change that.  They miss a ton of players that college soccer uncovers.


US Soccer is trying to build a better foundation for players, so that they will reach a higher ceiling after high school.  What you do early on in development is very important.  Our culture of winning at all costs sometimes deters this.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> Legends does not have a long record of success whereas Arsenal does.  When my daughter started club there was no such thing as Legends.  Josh Hodges is a marketer and has done a good job marketing his area of influence.  If Cle and Noah Kooiman had never left Arsenal this wouldn't even be a question as they are both vastly superior coaches to anything either club has now.  It's a damn shame that the kids in the IE lost out on the opportunity to play for them.  There is some outstanding talent in the 909/951 area and it sucks that they don't get the same opportunities that are available in the OC.


Josh is very passionate about his club and it shows.  He has thrived and is now being rewarded.  Legends is the obvious choice in the IE.

The Kooiman's were great for the IE as well.  But have not been able to replicate the same success they had a Arsenal.


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## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Josh is very passionate about his club and it shows.  He has thrived and is now being rewarded.  Legends is the obvious choice in the IE.
> 
> The Kooiman's were great for the IE as well.  But have not been able to replicate the same success they had a Arsenal.


The more you post the more you sound like a Legends homer, particulary a coach!  I see you are 29 years old and guess who is about the same age.  A certain DOC's little brother.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> The more you post the more you sound like a Legends homer, particulary a coach!  I see you are 29 years old and guess who is about the same age.  A certain DOC's little brother.


Here is what happens when you share an opinion that is contrary to what the resident bully thinks:  First I haven't been thru the recruiting process, then my post is idiotic, and now I'm Josh Hodges' little brother, the Legends homer.  Nice try though.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Here is what happens when you share an opinion that is contrary to what the resident bully thinks:  First I haven't been thru the recruiting process, then my post is idiotic, and now I'm Josh Hodges' little brother, the Legends homer.  Nice try though.


Last I check you were the individual that posted the first insult....remember clueless!  You must suffer from selective memory.

Nice try sure,  like you would admit it.  Keep posting though, everyone slips eventually!


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## eastbaysoccer

GDA is hogwash.  Never on the basketball court in the hood, on the gridiron or on the baseball field do kids and coaches talk development.  These athletics studs just go out there and play the game to win and they do it well.  As a kid when I played it was all about winning.

INhave never coached soccer before but give me better and faster players then Bobak at the so cal blues and I'll beat him every time.


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## 17SquirrelsDad

Shared from Twitter: U.S. Soccer’s new girls Development Academy has its first public dissenter

http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/the91stminute/2016/07/u-s-soccers-new-girls-development-academy-has-its-first-public-dissenter/


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## G98dad

picaboo said:


> When did most of your (posters) daughters start club? We thought about maybe a select AYSO team instead. Haven't really talked to my daughter about what she wants. Maybe it's to early to throw money at one sport? Possible putting the "Cart before the horse"


Mine started club at 12 coming from a successful AYSO Plus team that moved en masse to Cypress FC. Two moves later and she is now with Beach on a team that has a chance at winning USYS National League title. Just the facts, for your info Picaboo.


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## Rev234

The essential question is posed after the observation.  
"The fact that girls soccer here isn’t _really_ broken muddies the waters. There are plenty of issues – the high cost, prizing of sheer athleticism over technical ability, the ECNL is decidedly top heavy – but were they so bad that another league generating a jagged rift in the middle of American girls soccer development was a necessary step?"


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## CaliKlines

There are plenty of public dissenters on the Girls Development Academy, just read these forums. But there are also many more supporters of the GDA, such as Christian Lavers, the president of the ECNL. His club, Eclipse, just joined the Girls Development Academy. I'd say that is a pretty big endorsement.

And Rev, to answer your question, it depends on which side of the fence you're standing. You will not convince a non-DA club supporter of the necessity of DA until they are admitted, or maybe never if they drank enough ECNL Kool-Aid. Just as you will not convince a DA club supporter that women's soccer was fine "as is".


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> US Soccer is trying to build a better foundation for players, so that they will reach a higher ceiling after high school.  What you do early on in development is very important.  Our culture of winning at all costs sometimes deters this.


I don't disagree with your statements at all as a matter of fact I totally agree with it.  What I don't agree with is how they are going about it.  The player pool isn't deep enough to merit it.  If they really were looking to develop the uber elite players why not do a residential academy that is fully funded by US soccer?  Invite the true national pool of 40-50 players and take them out of the system and develop an "A" and "B" team that plays each other all of the time.  Let's be clear in SoCal in each birth year there are maybe 20-25 players per birth year that are truly elite and maybe 5 that are uber elite.  Let US soccer focus on them and let the rest focus on college soccer.


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## CaliKlines

G98dad said:


> Mine started club at 12 coming from a successful AYSO Plus team that moved en masse to Cypress FC. Two moves later and she is now with Beach on a team that has a chance at winning USYS National League title. Just the facts, for your info Picaboo.


And Picaboo, additional FYI...The US Youth Soccer (USYS) National Championship Series is the country's most prestigious national youth soccer tournament, providing approximately 185,000 players on over 10,000 teams from US Youth Soccer State Associations the opportunity to showcase their soccer skills against the best competition in the nation while emphasizing teamwork, discipline and fair play. This is why we play State/National Cup in Southern California.

The US Youth Soccer National Championships cap a yearlong series of competitions for boys and girls teams in multiple age brackets as teams earn their way from the top teams in their state to the regional championship tournaments. US Youth Soccer State Champions and selected wildcard teams through US Youth Soccer Regional Leagues in most age groups are eligible to compete in one of four US Youth Soccer Regional Championships. The champions in the Under-13 through Under-19 age brackets from each regional event will converge in July for the US Youth Soccer National Championships. (Watch them live here eventually, once they get the broadcast schedule finalized...http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/live/)

Annually the US Youth Soccer National Championship Series provides the nation's top collegiate coaches with the premier stage to identify and scout the most coveted players in the country. In 2012, over 600 coaches attended the US Youth Soccer Regional Championships including the majority of the top 25 men's and women's programs based on the final 2011 NSCAA National Rankings for NCAA Division I schools.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> There are plenty of public dissenters on the Girls Development Academy, just read these forums. But there are also many more supporters of the GDA, such as Christian Lavers, the president of the ECNL. His club, Eclipse, just joined the Girls Development Academy. I'd say that is pretty big endorsement.
> 
> And Rev, to answer your question, it depends on which side of the fence you're standing. You will not convince a non-DA club supporter of the necessity of DA until they are admitted. Just as you will not convince a DA club supporter that women's soccer was fine "as is".



I wouldn't say that it matters if a club is in DA or not.  My player's club is a DA club although she is now in college.  I have no dog in this fight and if my player was a '00 or younger she would definitely be a coveted player and would have DA as an option.  For me it comes down to what US soccer's true motive is.  It is not developing players for the WNT because college soccer is where they pick most of their players from.  If they were truly being genuine in their stated goal then they would have a residential academy like on the boys side and it is as simple as that.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Josh is very passionate about his club and it shows.  He has thrived and is now being rewarded.  Legends is the obvious choice in the IE.
> 
> The Kooiman's were great for the IE as well.  But have not been able to replicate the same success they had a Arsenal.



I agree that Hodges is passionate and also a good soccer player in his own right.  I wouldn't say that they are the obvious choice in the IE but a good choice nonetheless.  The Kooiman's problem since leaving has been Surf down in SD being the 800 pound gorilla that is Surf.  Unfortunately Cle has to deal with Legends and Arsenal in the IE.


----------



## Pitch pop

Good or bad the DA is here, but I do have a few questions. 

1) Is this model really going to benefit the overall development of players outside of the top .001% that are being evaluated as and groomed as WNT caliber?

From what I can figure, given the substitution restrictions and age ranges set forth by the DA, the olders in each age group will get the lion share of the playing time (or they wouldn't made the team as an older) while the youngers will be left with much less playing time (of course there will be exceptions, I am speaking in terms of the majority). 

2) Is the one extra practice a week going to outweigh less playing time due to fewer scheduled games each season and even less playing time every other year when each girl will be a younger on a given team?

3) Are there going to be really any philosophical changes given the same DOC's and coaches are going to be in charge, just under a different league banner?

I'm still having a difficult time understanding how this will benefit the majority of top level girls outside of the .001%. Obviously training with top level girls all season is a huge advantage. Is it however, worth the sacrifice in potential game minutes? Was the training that much inferior at the ECNL or other top level clubs to begin with? If so how much are you really changing things when many of the same coaches and DOC's are going to be training the DA players. 

Not trying to be a naysayer, just trying to understand it all. 

Who knows maybe the DA will revolutionize women's soccer in the United States, just as it has on the men's side. Good luck in Rio boys!!....... Oh wait. 

Sorry couldn't resist.


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## GunninGopher

Earlier before the flames started, there was speculation about which clubs would be added. Goal Nation just posted an update:

http://goalnation.com/u-s-soccer-girls-da-adds-28-more-clubs/


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## Pitch pop

Oh, I almost forgot. It seems as though much of the discussions on this forum has assumed that there will be buy in from a vast majority of players out there. Personally, I think people are underestimating the value girls place on high school soccer compared to the boys side. I would be curious how the conversations goes with the DD's out there when the time comes. School pride and spirit can be a powerful thing. As much as having mom, dad and grandma on the sidelines of a club game can be riveting for a teenager. Having your peers, schoolmates and friends at a home game may be a little more intreaguing for some.


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## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> And Rev, to answer your question, it depends on which side of the fence you're standing. You will not convince a non-DA club supporter of the necessity of DA until they are admitted, or maybe never if they drank enough ECNL Kool-Aid. Just as you will not convince a DA club supporter that women's soccer was fine "as is".


Then there are the clubs that have DA and ECNL!


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## TD1

Pitch pop said:


> Oh, I almost forgot. It seems as though much of the discussions on this forum has assumed that there will be buy in from a vast majority of players out there. Personally, I think people are underestimating the value girls place on high school soccer compared to the boys side. I would be curious how the conversations goes with the DD's out there when the time comes. School pride and spirit can be a powerful thing. As much as having mom, dad and grandma on the sidelines of a club game can be riveting for a teenager. Having your peers, schoolmates and friends at a home game may be a little more intreaguing for some.


I was thinking the same.  With the boys, the DA is the only really viable path for kids in socal to one day play pro.  It gives the clubs a lot of leverage to keep everyone in line. 

But there isn't a parallel on the girls side.  If they haven't figured out how to lower the cost, the DA doesn't really offer anything you can't get on an ECNL team (i.e. they are can offer the same exposure to the college coaches).  Meaning it's going to be very hard to herd the cats when the parents have so many options to choose from.


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## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree that Hodges is passionate and also a good soccer player in his own right.  I wouldn't say that they are the obvious choice in the IE but a good choice nonetheless.  The Kooiman's problem since leaving has been Surf down in SD being the 800 pound gorilla that is Surf.  Unfortunately Cle has to deal with Legends and Arsenal in the IE.


Josh Hodges played college soccer at Azusa Pacific University when they were a NAIA school. Cle Kooiman actually played in a World Cup back in the 90s.


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## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Josh Hodges played college soccer at Azusa Pacific University when they were a NAIA school. Cle Kooiman actually played in a World Cup back in the 90s.


Oh don't get me wrong.  The Kooiman's are two of the best coaches in SoCal and the country.  I know that they have their playing accolades too.  Trust me if the Kooimans were still at Arsenal then Legends wouldn't have gotten DA.


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## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> There are plenty of public dissenters on the Girls Development Academy, just read these forums. But there are also many more supporters of the GDA, such as Christian Lavers, the president of the ECNL. His club, Eclipse, just joined the Girls Development Academy. I'd say that is pretty big endorsement.
> 
> And Rev, to answer your question, it depends on which side of the fence you're standing. You will not convince a non-DA club supporter of the necessity of DA until they are admitted, or maybe never if they drank enough ECNL Kool-Aid. Just as you will not convince a DA club supporter that women's soccer was fine "as is".


You can't be serious? . You sound like someone who just got DA and never had ECNL.  The fact of the matter is DA is not creating something new . Player 15-20 will get little to NO time. The same clubs that are DA are also ECNL.  To be one of the top ten now is a blessing and a curse.


----------



## timbuck

What does a high end female player do after college?
I get the argument that being an athlete can open doors to colleges that might be out of reach otherwise.
But -  Aside from 5-10 females in the entire country, there is no living to be made as a professional soccer player.
I saw this post on Hope Solo's blog about the deplorable conditions that NWSL players deal with.  All for a measly $8-$14,000 per year.
http://hopesolo.com/2016/07/12/time-for-change/


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## Rev234

timbuck said:


> What does a high end female player do after college?
> I get the argument that being an athlete can open doors to colleges that might be out of reach otherwise.
> But -  Aside from 5-10 females in the entire country, there is no living to be made as a professional soccer player.
> I saw this post on Hope Solo's blog about the deplorable conditions that NWSL players deal with.  All for a measly $8-$14,000 per year.
> http://hopesolo.com/2016/07/12/time-for-change/


Have to focus on academics.  Too many stories of highly recruited ladies getting into D1, D2 etc.   schools getting redshirted,  injured or losing interest in the game,  then  and not being able to stay in school due to poor academic ability.  Our kids are all working to be the best  on the field,  but the academics are  what will ensure future success.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> And Rev, to answer your question, it depends on which side of the fence you're standing. You will not convince a non-ECNL club supporter of the necessity of ECNL until they are admitted, or maybe never if they drank enough National League Kool-Aid. Just as you will not convince a ECNL club supporter that women's soccer was fine "as is".


It's ironic what we uncover by simply switching out a few words in RED.


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## NoGoal

timbuck said:


> What does a high end female player do after college?
> I get the argument that being an athlete can open doors to colleges that might be out of reach otherwise.
> But -  Aside from 5-10 females in the entire country, there is no living to be made as a professional soccer player.
> I saw this post on Hope Solo's blog about the deplorable conditions that NWSL players deal with.  All for a measly $8-$14,000 per year.
> http://hopesolo.com/2016/07/12/time-for-change/


And why my DD knows her soccer playing days ends during or after college.  The only women making a living playing professional women soccer are the rostered Womens National Team players, which is a roster of 22.  Based on prior US Soccer tax filings, if the women win Olympic Gold in Rio...they will get somewhere around a 180K bonus with the victory tour they will play afterwards.


----------



## splinter

DA isn't all it is cracked up to be for kids that want more to their life than soccer.   My son played preacademy last year and decided not to do academy because he wanted to play high school with his friends and was looking to play one other sport also.  Also, my son decided the travel and 4 days of practice a week would be tough with the top academic program he is taking. 
I know my daughters both really want to play high school soccer and volleyball as well.   They both have a very good chance of making DA but I am leaving it up to them.   I think Beach and Legends have showed in the past that you don't have to play the top  gaming circuit to get to a good college.


----------



## MakeAPlay

I want to focus on this excerpt from US soccer's press release:

The 25 teams accepted originally into the program have produced 307 players for U.S. Soccer’s National Teams (youth and senior) as well as 84 professional players. These clubs will provide 276 full scholarships with a total of $1.49 million of scholarship funds being contributed.

Creating the Girl’s Development Academy allows U.S. Soccer to continue to develop world class players because it supports an improved player development model in which players can focus solely on training together four times per week and play meaningful games on the weekend nearly year-round.



Every player has a choice to play high school soccer or be part of the Development Academy. High school soccer will continue to have an important place in the girls’ soccer landscape.

http://goalnation.com/u-s-soccer-girls-da-adds-28-more-clubs/

This says that they are full scholarships which means all but 5 girls per club are going to be paying full pop for travel and training.  also they emphasize that they can play DA or high school soccer.  Missing high school soccer wouldn't have worked for my player.  She missed enough games due to outside soccer commitments and wouldn't have wanted to opt out entirely.


----------



## chiefs

With this math, which seems logical. I can see the ecnl team stronger the the DA squad that has youngers.


----------



## chiefs

If DA isn't free, what's the benefit to move?


----------



## Rev234

Ultimately I think that those clubs that used ecnl as the end all be all will eventually  have to come up with a different sales pitch to keep their top level players from jumping ship.  Maybe that free soccer pitch will continue to work,  or not.   Change is good. Makes everyone work harder.


----------



## timbuck

If a club is both DA and ECNL, how will they decide who plays where?
In "theory", the better players go to DA.
But what if 16 year old Suzie wants to also play in HS and sticks turns down the DA spot and decides to stay with her ECNL team.  Does the club then go to the next ranked player on the team and offer her the spot that they originally offered to Suzie?  Or do they try to poach a player from a club that doesn't have DA?
Gonna be fun just like the age group change was.


----------



## davin

With the DA's substitution rules(3 subs/game, no re-entry), that means only 14 players play each game. I don't see what the incentive is for a kid who is not one of the top 12-13 players on the team to remain in the DA. If you are not one of the top players, you will barely see the field. Couple that with the DA's restrictive rules for playing high school ball,  ECNL seems to be the much more attractive option.


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## NoGoal

So many different posters seem to have the same concerns about Girls DA and why I believe ECNL will still be a viable option for many players/families.


----------



## Rev234

NoGoal said:


> So many different posters seem to have the same concerns about Girls DA and why I believe ECNL will still be a viable option for many players/families.


ECNL will be to DA what Premier is to ECNL. So many folks jumped to less than optimal situations just for the ecnl distinction.  Plenty of players on the roster that would be better served elsewhere.  A "reputable"  or at least well know coach was over heard telling parents that every girl who is on an ecnl team gets a scholarship.  Easy to fool the under informed.


----------



## davin

And another thing. One of the main reasons that US soccer gave for the Pure birth year changes is that it combats the relative age effect(which I thought was bogus anyway because all it did was shift the birthmonths of the kids who would feel the effect). With the DA combining 2 birth years on the same team, it looks to me that they are actually increasing the relative age effect for these DA teams. Every other year, the kids who were born in November/December will be having to compete with kids almost 2 years older than they are. Again, this is another reason why I'd steer my daughter to ECNL, although I probably don't need to since she would likely choose ECNL anyway because she wants to play high school soccer and run track.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Pre and post Armageddon of the So Cal Forum this has been quite a detailed thread and very interesting to read. A few posters have eluded to it, but no one has gone in to detail about it...but will the DA implement a curriculum on how they want to instruct technical and tactical instruction? In my opinion no change will come without one. Nor will growth of our national team, college players, etc. Which supposedly is the point of the DA. However, from what I understand neither does the ECNL. Just clubs or coaches dis-jointly applying their methods.


----------



## shales1002

timbuck said:


> What does a high end female player do after college?
> I get the argument that being an athlete can open doors to colleges that might be out of reach otherwise.
> But -  Aside from 5-10 females in the entire country, there is no living to be made as a professional soccer player.
> I saw this post on Hope Solo's blog about the deplorable conditions that NWSL players deal with.  All for a measly $8-$14,000 per year.
> http://hopesolo.com/2016/07/12/time-for-change/


Thanks for sharing. I was completely floored by these conditions. Isn't the NWSL suppose to sponsor/assist the GDA?


----------



## timbuck

Pretty terrible.  We wouldn't put up with our kids playing in these conditions. 
But, we are the "customer" and pay good money to expect decent fields and facilities.


----------



## Pitch pop

Rev234 said:


> ECNL will be to DA what Premier is to ECNL. So many folks jumped to less than optimal situations just for the ecnl distinction.  Plenty of players on the roster that would be better served elsewhere.  A "reputable"  or at least well know coach was over heard telling parents that every girl who is on an ecnl team gets a scholarship.  Easy to fool the under informed.


I would agree if it wasn't for the rule changes  and playing restrictions in the DA.  It's going to be very difficult to mange those and keep parents and players happy. ECNL didn't have as many of those issues to contend with when it came along as another option to Premiere.


----------



## pooka

timbuck said:


> What does a high end female player do after college?
> I get the argument that being an athlete can open doors to colleges that might be out of reach otherwise.
> But -  Aside from 5-10 females in the entire country, there is no living to be made as a professional soccer player.
> I saw this post on Hope Solo's blog about the deplorable conditions that NWSL players deal with.  All for a measly $8-$14,000 per year.
> http://hopesolo.com/2016/07/12/time-for-change/


This is crazy! They could play on high school fields and it would be better than a baseball outfield! It looks like the league doesn't plan at all! Couldn't they use college facilities? This is a shame, I know it isn't a huge moneymaker, but damn our u14 team travels and plays in better condition.


----------



## socalsoccercoach

The ECNL and DA situation will be interesting with clubs in proximity where a club has DA and ECNL and one club has ECNL only..could stand to reason the DA club could also attract the best ECNL kids with lure of DA teams in the club...the landscape could change a bit...


----------



## Generik

Back in the "good-old-days" we used to get excited about the time our girls/teams transitioned from 8v8 to the "big field!"

Nowadays...change seems to be our new "normal" - we haven't even really started with the calendar-age play yet and we are already getting bombarded with many more significant changes that we are trying to understand in order to make the best decisions for our families.

Just when we thought we had it all "figured out" we now get to deal with Development Academy for the girls side.

Don't get me wrong...I am a firm believer that change is positive...you have to keep moving forward and evolving or you will get left behind with the dinosaurs...I just wish our change was spread-out a bit more than it is since our dd's only have a few more years left enjoying this journey - assuming they finish out their playing years.

All this change will benefit some...pose as obstacles to others...and be transparent to many - I just hope it is not too late for those trying to figure things out that ultimately are impacted...so they can still react accordingly for the player.

Someone needs to take some screen-shots of this thread...so when this Forum database gets deleted one day (fingers crossed it doesn't happen!), we can all look back on this dialogue and laugh about these "good-old-days" when parents/players only had to deal with the new world of DA for their girls - no doubt this change will pass-by us all...because coming around another corner is more change...we just don't know what it is just yet.

Good luck to everyone trying to navigate this new soccer world order...and keep posting all the great insight and opinions!


----------



## NoGoal

Rev234 said:


> ECNL will be to DA what Premier is to ECNL. So many folks jumped to less than optimal situations just for the ecnl distinction.  Plenty of players on the roster that would be better served elsewhere.  A "reputable"  or at least well know coach was over heard telling parents that every girl who is on an ecnl team gets a scholarship.  Easy to fool the under informed.


Thanks to 17SD posting this article in another thread.  The executive director and president of Real Colorado, has the same opinion as I do.  That DA combining 2 age groups leaves out college level players from the mix, unless the club as GA and ECNL.

"Now you merge everything into three [GDA] teams, so there’s tons of players left over. And all these players are going to colleges and they’re playing ball; what do you do with them? So we’re playing in both leagues,” said Donaldson. “You have to. Because you can’t have somebody who is going to go play college ball and say, ‘you can no longer play for Real Colorado.’ We have enough players and we have enough good coaches that we can make it work. So this group, it’s the last go-round for them, because some of them are 99s and some of them are 2000s.”

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/ecnl/its-bullst-let-the-girls-play-real-colorado-coach-rips-ussfs-ecnl-scheduling-snub/


----------



## TD1

Great post Nogoal. I'm just glad my dd is done with the club scene and I don't have to give any of those suckers another dime.  

P.s. Wasn't BJ Snow the coach at UCLA who tricked a bunch of the girls to sign away their scholarships when he took over the colleges soccer program (slipped the forms in with a bunch of other paperwork he asked them to sign)?  What a great guy.


----------



## espola

TD1 said:


> Great post Nogoal. I'm just glad my dd is done with the club scene and I don't have to give any of those suckers another dime.
> 
> P.s. Wasn't BJ Snow the coach at UCLA who tricked a bunch of the girls to sign away their scholarships when he took over the colleges soccer program (slipped the forms in with a bunch of other paperwork he asked them to sign)?  What a great guy.


Did he coach for  local club before the UCLA job?


----------



## MakeAPlay

TD1 said:


> Great post Nogoal. I'm just glad my dd is done with the club scene and I don't have to give any of those suckers another dime.
> 
> P.s. Wasn't BJ Snow the coach at UCLA who tricked a bunch of the girls to sign away their scholarships when he took over the colleges soccer program (slipped the forms in with a bunch of other paperwork he asked them to sign)?  What a great guy.


If he did that he is a despicable person. The current coaching staff is excellent.


----------



## NoGoal

TD1 said:


> Great post Nogoal. I'm just glad my dd is done with the club scene and I don't have to give any of those suckers another dime.
> 
> P.s. Wasn't BJ Snow the coach at UCLA who tricked a bunch of the girls to sign away their scholarships when he took over the colleges soccer program (slipped the forms in with a bunch of other paperwork he asked them to sign)?  What a great guy.


Noway did he really do that?


----------



## TD1

NoGoal said:


> Noway did he really do that?


That was the rumor, but I certainly am in no position to confirm.  Hope it's not true.


----------



## 17SquirrelsDad

TD1 said:


> Great post Nogoal. I'm just glad my dd is done with the club scene and I don't have to give any of those suckers another dime.


Count me in as happy too. DD is out of soccer, with 1 year left, but no regrets (other than painful coaches/doc speeches about getting DDs scholarship monies... what a  bunch of shit!). Still have great memories of seeing Marley Canales play club/HS; and seeing Mallory in person playing; along with watching some great players playing ECNL (actual, REAL soccer!). Shout out to Abdul - YOUR dd made it, Congrats!


----------



## Swoosh

*Second girls DA expansion worrying for ECNL*
Article Written by Will Parchman
Published: July 12, 2016
Comments

There was never much of a chance the ECNL would be able to throw a velvet rope of exclusivity around its biggest, most prestigious clubs. As the girls Development Academy elbowed itself into the discussion about who develops the best and brightest in the country, there would always be some bleed-over.

For the ECNL, the task was always about limiting the damage and continuing to prop up the tenets of development that got them here. The latter is unassailable, buttressed by a massive number of U.S. YNT players and a seven-year history that’s given them unique perspective. Whatever U.S. Soccer does with its academy, it will never be able to usurp those hard-won lessons.

But the former is suddenly on shaky ground. Damage limitation in the form of defecting clubs is suddenly more untenable than ever.

The U.S. Soccer-led girls Development Academy made waves in early July by announcing 25 clubs had agreed to join for the 2017 season. It was the first wave of additions, and while it was an important stepping stone it didn’t tell us everything. PDA led the charge, and 60 percent of the NWSL was represented, but there were still some huge clubs left out of the mix. Were they abstaining, or were they simply biding their time?

After the first jab, U.S. Soccer came across with a haymaker on July 9. It announced it added 28 more clubs for the 2017-18 season, bringing the total to 53. And it emphatically answered the question as to whether the ECNL had something to worry about in its new club competition.

After this second wave of additions, the answer, emphatically, is yes. The ECNL has something to worry about. Here’s what we learned after the girls DA’s second significant round of expansion.

— PDA was the club the DA needed in its first round of expansion to cement the league as a going concern for the ECNL. The NWSL clubs were nice, as were a few of the other heavy hitters, but PDA made it all very real. Even if PDA keeps teams in the ECNL, there’s a significant chance their most prestigious teams and their best players are shuttled off to U.S. Soccer’s league. The ECNL simply couldn’t afford to lose another major pillar.

The second round of expansion was another crushing body blow. Not only did the girls DA add another NWSL team (the Washington Spirit), but it folded in the Dallas Sting, Dallas Texans and Eclipse Select, three of the 10 biggest girls soccer development operations in the country. All three routinely pump out national team-quality players, and the fact that both are headed for the DA does not bode particularly well for the ECNL.

Of course that doesn’t mean all three are abandoning the ECNL. It’s unclear how teams will partition their players in the future, and whether some go all-in on the DA or opt to split time between the two. But the writing is on the wall that the new thing is gathering steam as big club after big club signs up for its ranks. As one joins after another, the ECNL is left wondering how many exclusive clubs it’ll have at the end of the 2016-17 season.

— Speaking of 2016-17, the upcoming season is a big one for the ECNL. It’s the league’s last as a lone wolf atop the girls development apparatus in this country, and they’ll have to make good use of it if they hope to stave off the charge of the DA. What that means is still up the air. Does the ECNL opt to use its brief bit of leverage to attempt to sway its clubs to keep their more muscled half in the league? It has the unique advantage over the DA for the next 12 months of having these clubs’ collective ear while they still have their best players stashed in the league. They could well pull off a coup in that time.

But it’s clear U.S. Soccer has newness on its side, and that’s an intriguing prospect for much of the league. For clubs dissatisfied with the ECNL’s more relaxed standards as opposed to what’s being offered by U.S. Soccer, this could be the opportunity they’ve been awaiting for years.

— Of course some clubs don’t agree. Not long after the first round of expansion went live, Ohio Elite, an ECNL member club since the league arrived in 2009, went public with its pledge to stay in the ECNL. Among their gripes with the DA, they simply stated that they had no real reason to jump for the new league. How many clubs follow their lead is uncertain, but they increasingly look like outliers after this recent 28-club announcement. The DA is now at 53 clubs with a year left to get to the boys benchmark of around 80, which is also generally where the ECNL settles. It looks like they should have little trouble adding big names too, another trend that has to be somewhat dissatisfying for the ECNL.

— The ECNL long hung its hat on its fully national organizational model. It has clubs all over the country in every major market and in a bunch of minor ones too, and it has long said that each of those needs to be dealt with differently. That drove the ECNL’s more hands-off approach with its requirements, allowing each club to determine what was best for them in the confines of their unique market. If the ECNL couldn’t determine what was best for those clubs, they reasoned, the boots on the ground certainly could.

The ECNL’s best chance at avoiding a mass exodus to the DA was essentially hoping its clubs agreed. After years of allowing them to make their own big decisions, it had to hope they appreciated that approach and didn’t buy into U.S. Soccer’s more heavy-handed view toward development.

But it appears that hasn’t happened. Even if the Ohio Elites opted to not leave the ECNL in any form, the nation’s biggest clubs - the PDAs, the Dallas Stings, the So Cal Blues’ - were of more interest in that they likely felt (and feel) as if they have as good a grasp on how to produce players as anyone based on their track record. Big clubs tend to be more intractable in how they view development, and convincing them they needed more help was always going to be a difficult sell.

Credit U.S. Soccer. They’ve already brought many of the country’s biggest girls clubs on board, and at least one more round of significant expansion should tell us even more about how far the girls DA has already come in such a short period of time. But either way, if the ECNL wasn’t worried before, it should be now.


----------



## socalsoccercoach

To me it is simple the ECNL must allow clubs in the DA and in ECNL to continue to be in the ECNL while this will diminish the level some I believe it will allow the ECNL to do what it has done well and that is get players in college.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

No.  The correct thing to do is accept applications to the ecnl and be poised to replace every GDA club with a club in close proximity.  

IMO GDA will be battling the unknown.  We don't know if girls are willing to give up so much for so little.  Only a less than 1% shot take the YNT awaits them.   Million dollar contracts don't exist for them.


----------



## espola

eastbaysoccer said:


> No.  The correct thing to do is accept applications to the ecnl and be poised to replace every GDA club with a club in close proximity.
> 
> IMO GDA will be battling the unknown.  We don't know if girls are willing to give up so much for so little.  Only a less than 1% shot take the YNT awaits them.   Million dollar contracts don't exist for them.


Give up so much what?


----------



## NoGoal

eastbaysoccer said:


> No.  The correct thing to do is accept applications to the ecnl and be poised to replace every GDA club with a club in close proximity.


Looks like that isn't going to happen.  A buddy text this to me yesterday.  DA clubs are not leaving ECNL as ECNL is marketing that the most successful clubs are playing ECNL the 2017-2018 season during DA's inaugural season.
http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/home/920431.html

As I posted prior, there will be clubs participating in both Girls DA and ECNL.  These are the clubs that will dominant the market in SoCal.  The Girls DA only clubs such as Legends, Beach, LA Premier and Carlsbad.  When they conduct open tryouts the spring of 2017 and over half of their A team players DO NOT make the DA team will be very upset.  I can almost guarantee families will feel a sense of betrayal after the club cuts their DDs.  What is the club going to say, "we had a lot of new talent trying out for the DA teams, unfortunately we can only offer your DD a spot on our B team that will be playing National League". They will then go to other DA clubs to tryout and if they don't make it there....ECNL will be the final destination for those players.

The same can be said, for the ECNL clubs who do not have DA status.  Their best Ulittle players will be trying out for DA clubs.  Why are they gonna play for an ECNL only club?  When they can play for a club that has ECNL and DA affiliation. This way there is an opportunity to be called up to the DA team.


----------



## smellycleats

espola said:


> Give up so much what?


Playing for a highschool team primarily


----------



## espola

smellycleats said:


> Playing for a highschool team primarily


What has happened often in the Boys DA is that Seniors (or even Juniors with firm early college commitments) bail out of DA and enjoy the game with their HS friends.


----------



## shales1002

espola said:


> Give up so much what?


 Playing time if not in the top 8 players, high school soccer, ecnl, odp, playing other sports, anything else that a normal teenager likes to do.


----------



## smellycleats

espola said:


> What has happened often in the Boys DA is that Seniors (or even Juniors with firm early college commitments) bail out of DA and enjoy the game with their HS friends.


That's good to know. It's the early years of high school though, that are so important for fitting in and finding your group.  Being a part of a high school team in freshman and sophomore years can really help a girl navigate through her high school experience. In the interest of having a happy confident well rounded child, it's not something we're willing to forgo.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Pro DA people are assuming girls want to play soccer like a job.  Practice 4x per week, with less games and potentially less play if the rosters are huge.  

Also u are assuming the girls will have the same  same thinking as the boy do with regard to giving up high school.  Girls commit earlier so are we  r "talking  about them leaving DA as juniors?


----------



## dfbmike

CaliKlines said:


> Why not? The US WNT roster has 24 spots, and there are going to be approximately 70 Girls DA clubs, with 3 teams per club, with 23 players per team. That means that every year, they will have a pool of 1610 stud players feeding those 24 spots. That seems very doable.


Yup, you get the big picture.


----------



## shales1002

Swoosh said:


> *Second girls DA expansion worrying for *
> For clubs dissatisfied with the ECNL’s more relaxed standards as opposed to what’s being offered by U.S. Soccer, this could be the opportunity they’ve been awaiting for years.
> 
> The ECNL long hung its hat on its fully national organizational model. It has clubs all over the country in every major market and in a bunch of minor ones too, and it has long said that each of those needs to be dealt with differently. That drove the ECNL’s more hands-off approach with its requirements, allowing each club to determine what was best for them in the confines of their unique market. If the ECNL couldn’t determine what was best for those clubs, they reasoned, the boots on the ground certainly could.


Thanks for sharing another interesting perspective. IMHO no one wants to be controlled more. Really? Clubs dissatisfied because the standards are relaxed and they get to make decisions on their OWN.  Now, we have another entity ,GDA, that we have begging to be controlled by? Honestly, no teacher (coach) wants someone telling them to do with their team as every team has their own dynamics. Sounds like one size fits all approach to soccer, and we all know how that's worked out in our schools


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## dfbmike

eastbaysoccer said:


> GDA's goal is to produce national players for their team not for college.  Let's not forget that.
> US soccer's self preservation is reliant on the success of the national team.  They could care less if our girls play, attend or flunk out of college.  Let's get real here.


Indeed


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Looks like that isn't going to happen.  A buddy text this to me yesterday.  DA clubs are not leaving ECNL as ECNL is marketing that the most successful clubs are playing ECNL the 2017-2018 season during DA's inaugural season.
> http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/home/920431.html
> 
> As I posted prior, there will be clubs participating in both Girls DA and ECNL.  These are the clubs that will dominant the market in SoCal.  The Girls DA only clubs such as Legends, Beach, LA Premier and Carlsbad.  When they conduct open tryouts the spring of 2017 and over half of their A team players DO NOT make the DA team will be very upset.  I can almost guarantee families will feel a sense of betrayal after the club cuts their DDs.  What is the club going to say, "we had a lot of new talent trying out for the DA teams, unfortunately we can only offer your DD a spot on our B team that will be playing National League". They will then go to other DA clubs to tryout and if they don't make it there....ECNL will be the final destination for those players.
> 
> The same can be said, for the ECNL clubs who do not have DA status.  Their best Ulittle players will be trying out for DA clubs.  Why are they gonna play for an ECNL only club?  When they can play for a club that has ECNL and DA affiliation. This way there is an opportunity to be called up to the DA team.


Dude, you really are an Agatha Christie. Now you are telling youngers and olders how their soccer experience is going to be? While you're writing fiction about how much better a DA/ECNL club is better than a DA/National League club is, I think it is a step in a positive direction that you are acknowledging that ECNL will be the B team. And not being on a DA roster but playing in the United States Youth Soccer National League is a great way to develop as a player and get recruited by a Power 5 conference.


----------



## picaboo

Swoosh said:


> Josh is very passionate about his club and it shows.  He has thrived and is now being rewarded.  Legends is the obvious choice in the IE.
> 
> The Kooiman's were great for the IE as well.  But have not been able to replicate the same success they had a Arsenal.


Google Josh Legends soccer and Cle Kooiman. Impressed with Kooimans career wow! Impressed with what I read regarding Josh comments on soccer and Legends club. Another question is about the ESCL. What is it and are they automatically DA because they are all elite? Lastly Surf is a strange name for a club in the IE?


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## CaliKlines

Mr. Boo, perhaps a southern California soccer primer is required...here is a website that has alot of information, including links to other sites, that can reveal many details about soccer in the southland.
http://socalsoccermom.com/

As for more information about the Legends FC organization, here is a short video that describes the club in detail:


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## cheaper2keeper

picaboo said:


> Lastly Surf is a strange name for a club in the IE?


This is how they surf in the IE or is it Land sailing?


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Dude, you really are an Agatha Christie. Now you are telling youngers and olders how their soccer experience is going to be? While you're writing fiction about how much better a DA/ECNL club is better than a DA/National League club is, I think it is a step in a positive direction that you are acknowledging that ECNL will be the B team. And not being on a DA roster but playing in the United States Youth Soccer National League is a great way to develop as a player and get recruited by a Power 5 conference.


Of course you are going to post this.  You're the Legends HOMER, which BTW should have been your new alias.  If ECNL is the B team League then National League is the C team league.  LMAO

Again, I have no dog in this fight as my DD will be in college this time next year.  Your DD on the other hand will still be with Legends and playing the inaugural DA season and why your posts are baised towards Legends, DA and National League.


----------



## NoGoal

picaboo said:


> Google Josh Legends soccer and Cle Kooiman. Impressed with Kooimans career wow! Impressed with what I read regarding Josh comments on soccer and Legends club. Another question is about the ESCL. What is it and are they automatically DA because they are all elite? Lastly Surf is a strange name for a club in the IE?


You love Legends so much! Josh must bend you over and you must take it like a champ.  Do you also say, "Josh may I have another please"

I believe I posted my unbaised opinion about Arsenal and Legends already. As for their playing resume and if I had to start a team...I would draft Cle Kooiman over Josh Hodges as a player every day of the year.  Cle Kooiman played in a World Cup with the US Mens National Team.  Enough said!


----------



## espola

NoGoal said:


> You are funny, Josh must bend you over and you take like a champ. Since, you love Legends so much!
> 
> I believe I posted my unbaised opinion about Arsenal and Legends already. As for their playing resume and if I had to start a team...I would draft Cle Kooiman over Josh Hodges as a player every day of the year.  Cle Kooiman played in the World Cup with the US Mens National Team.  Enough said!


How good a coach is he?


----------



## dfbmike

CaliKlines said:


> Dude, you really are an Agatha Christie. Now you are telling youngers and olders how their soccer experience is going to be? While you're writing fiction about how much better a DA/ECNL club is better than a DA/National League club is, I think it is a step in a positive direction that you are acknowledging that ECNL will be the B team. And not being on a DA roster but playing in the United States Youth Soccer National League is a great way to develop as a player and get recruited by a Power 5 conference.


Cali, I've been reading No Goals posts for some time and it appears that he is floating on his college soccer cloud and no one better disagree because he thinks he knows it all, proud little papa for sure.  No Goals only endgame is college and money, nothing else, but little does he actually know and it is starting to get a little annoying.  It is one thing to have an opinion, its another to belittle everyone that doesn't agree.  What he fails to realize is that college soccer is not everyone's dream or end goal and I am talking strictly from an athletic standpoint, some kids actually really do want to make the USN SR squad, or SR squad of their country of heritage and represent their country and/or play real soccer, professionally and some just play for fun and then quit, nothing wrong with that either.  National team/Pro soccer should be on a different path than college/amateur soccer (and yes no goal your kids will be playing amateur soccer, so calm down), we need players committed to the cause no half in/half out and suddenly jumping ship and go for that schollie once things get a little rough.  Wanting to get an education and wanting to be a professional athlete, should have nothing to do with each other, but that is a discussion for another day.  
Is pursuing a professional soccer career the most financially wise decision right now?  probably not, but neither is becoming an actor, musician, boxer, mma fighter, you name it and US soccer is trying to change ALL that on the soccer front and hopefully one day there will be an established women's league where these players can keep developing and continue to play the sport they love, it will happen, no doubt.
Making the Olympic team for any other sport is probably not the financially wisest decision either, yet we have plenty of people who do and we clean up the medal count every 2 years.  Not everyone comes from the same economic background, so different strokes for different folks, some amazing stories out there every Olympic cycle.   
We are in a unique situation here on many fronts, we have the best athletes in the world, we have a huge country with many different cultures, many different states and not many countries take school sports as serious as we do, so it presents unique challenges in trying to evolve and align at the same time.  One has to wonder how many stars the USMNT has lost in the shuffle because those players went to college, played some garbage college soccer and got a job instead of taking on some risk and pursuing what i'm sure was their original dream, to play professionally or for a SR Squad.  The other issue probably was that back in the day US soccer scouted mostly college playing athletes, well that creates a bit of a  void as we all know our best soccer players don't always end up in college and it was evident by the way US soccer played, like a college team.  
US soccer's job is to be able to compete on the International stage both men and women and that is what they are trying to accomplish, but you won't if you show up to the world cup with 24 college players.  Right now it is working on the womens side because to be quite honest no one else in the world gave 2 "cents" about the womens game until recently.  There were what 12 countries in the womens "world cup" in the 90's?  Some countries don't even have the finances to support the mens national teams let alone the womens.  So the US womens game is working for now but needs to keep evolving to stay ahead of the curve.  What US soccer is doing is a huge step in the right direction from an athletic standpoint and if we can be the first country to have a nice professional league for women I'd be all for it.  The DA system is a proven feeder system in SOCCER.


----------



## CaliKlines

dfbmike said:


> Cali, I've been reading No Goals posts for some time and it appears that he is floating on his college soccer cloud and no one better disagree because he thinks he knows it all, proud little papa for sure.  No Goals only endgame is college and money, nothing else, but little does he actually know and it is starting to get a little annoying.  It is one thing to have an opinion, its another to belittle everyone that doesn't agree.  What he fails to realize is that college soccer is not everyone's dream or end goal and I am talking strictly from an athletic standpoint, some kids actually really do want to make the USN SR squad, or SR squad of their country of heritage and represent their country and/or play real soccer, professionally and some just play for fun and then quit, nothing wrong with that either.  National team/Pro soccer should be on a different path than college/amateur soccer (and yes no goal your kids will be playing amateur soccer, so calm down), we need players committed to the cause no half in/half out and suddenly jumping ship and go for that schollie once things get a little rough.  Wanting to get an education and wanting to be a professional athlete, should have nothing to do with each other, but that is a discussion for another day.
> Is pursuing a professional soccer career the most financially wise decision right now?  probably not, but neither is becoming an actor, musician, boxer, mma fighter, you name it and US soccer is trying to change ALL that on the soccer front and hopefully one day there will be an established women's league where these players can keep developing and continue to play the sport they love, it will happen, no doubt.
> Making the Olympic team for any other sport is probably not the financially wisest decision either, yet we have plenty of people who do and we clean up the medal count every 2 years.  Not everyone comes from the same economic background, so different strokes for different folks, some amazing stories out there every Olympic cycle.
> We are in a unique situation here on many fronts, we have the best athletes in the world, we have a huge country with many different cultures, many different states and not many countries take school sports as serious as we do, so it presents unique challenges in trying to evolve and align at the same time.  One has to wonder how many stars the USMNT has lost in the shuffle because those players went to college, played some garbage college soccer and got a job instead of taking on some risk and pursuing what i'm sure was their original dream, to play professionally or for a SR Squad.  The other issue probably was that back in the day US soccer scouted mostly college playing athletes, well that creates a bit of a  void as we all know our best soccer players don't always end up in college and it was evident by the way US soccer played, like a college team.
> US soccer's job is to be able to compete on the International stage both men and women and that is what they are trying to accomplish, but you won't if you show up to the world cup with 24 college players.  Right now it is working on the womens side because to be quite honest no one else in the world gave 2 "cents" about the womens game until recently.  There were what 12 countries in the womens "world cup" in the 90's?  Some countries don't even have the finances to support the mens national teams let alone the womens.  So the US womens game is working for now but needs to keep evolving to stay ahead of the curve.  What US soccer is doing is a huge step in the right direction from an athletic standpoint and if we can be the first country to have a nice professional league for women I'd be all for it.  The DA system is a proven feeder system in SOCCER.


Bravo! But actually, under all the ECNL bluster, NoGoal is quite harmless, and maybe even a nice guy. Just a little misguided.


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Of course you are going to post this.  You're the Legends HOMER, which BTW should have been your new alias.  If ECNL is the B team League then National League is the C team league.  LMAO
> 
> Again, I have no dog in this fight as my DD will be in college this time next year.  Your DD on the other hand will still be with Legends and playing the inaugural DA season and why your posts are baised towards Legends, DA and National League.


Yes, I am a Legends FC supporter. But you are wrong about the inaugural DA season. I am not sure my daughter will be good enough to make it.


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> Cali, I've been reading No Goals posts for some time and it appears that he is floating on his college soccer cloud and no one better disagree because he thinks he knows it all, proud little papa for sure.  No Goals only endgame is college and money, nothing else, but little does he actually know and it is starting to get a little annoying.  It is one thing to have an opinion, its another to belittle everyone that doesn't agree.  What he fails to realize is that college soccer is not everyone's dream or end goal and I am talking strictly from an athletic standpoint, some kids actually really do want to make the USN SR squad, or SR squad of their country of heritage and represent their country and/or play real soccer, professionally and some just play for fun and then quit, nothing wrong with that either.  National team/Pro soccer should be on a different path than college/amateur soccer (and yes no goal your kids will be playing amateur soccer, so calm down), we need players committed to the cause no half in/half out and suddenly jumping ship and go for that schollie once things get a little rough.  Wanting to get an education and wanting to be a professional athlete, should have nothing to do with each other, but that is a discussion for another day.
> Is pursuing a professional soccer career the most financially wise decision right now?  probably not, but neither is becoming an actor, musician, boxer, mma fighter, you name it and US soccer is trying to change ALL that on the soccer front and hopefully one day there will be an established women's league where these players can keep developing and continue to play the sport they love, it will happen, no doubt.
> Making the Olympic team for any other sport is probably not the financially wisest decision either, yet we have plenty of people who do and we clean up the medal count every 2 years.  Not everyone comes from the same economic background, so different strokes for different folks, some amazing stories out there every Olympic cycle.
> We are in a unique situation here on many fronts, we have the best athletes in the world, we have a huge country with many different cultures, many different states and not many countries take school sports as serious as we do, so it presents unique challenges in trying to evolve and align at the same time.  One has to wonder how many stars the USMNT has lost in the shuffle because those players went to college, played some garbage college soccer and got a job instead of taking on some risk and pursuing what i'm sure was their original dream, to play professionally or for a SR Squad.  The other issue probably was that back in the day US soccer scouted mostly college playing athletes, well that creates a bit of a  void as we all know our best soccer players don't always end up in college and it was evident by the way US soccer played, like a college team.
> US soccer's job is to be able to compete on the International stage both men and women and that is what they are trying to accomplish, but you won't if you show up to the world cup with 24 college players.  Right now it is working on the womens side because to be quite honest no one else in the world gave 2 "cents" about the womens game until recently.  There were what 12 countries in the womens "world cup" in the 90's?  Some countries don't even have the finances to support the mens national teams let alone the womens.  So the US womens game is working for now but needs to keep evolving to stay ahead of the curve.  What US soccer is doing is a huge step in the right direction from an athletic standpoint and if we can be the first country to have a nice professional league for women I'd be all for it.  The DA system is a proven feeder system in SOCCER.


So long....If DA is the way to the promise land, then why are the US MNT still stagnant after a decade of BOYS DA? I used to post the same garbage 8-9 years ago that the rest of the world is catching the USWNT, because we had a huge head start.  That they haven't won a womens world cup, since 1999.   Well within the last 8 years they have finished runner up and are the current World Cup Champs!  The #1 reason why the US WNT will always be a force to be reckon with?  Title IX!  Even international women players are attending US Universities and getting a free/reduced college education and while playing D1 college soccer.

Lastly, dam straight I am a proud dad.  I recall Josh Hodges telling me college coaches ALL want big, fast, strong athletic players when my DD was ulittle.  Well my DD being 5'2" and 110 lbs, concentrated on being technical with a clean 1st touch broke that mold!


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Yes, I am a Legends FC supporter. But you are wrong about the inaugural DA season. I am not sure my daughter will be good enough to make it.


Then she can play ECNL her last year in club.  Why would you have your DD play National League when all of the best players are playing DA and the next level of players playing ECNL? That won't prepare her for college soccer competition in the ACC!

As for misguided, far from it.  I am probably the least loyal club parent on this forum.  My wife and I made sure we did what was always best for our DD, even if it meant leaving winning club teams (4 times)! In order to find coaches who knew how to develop her strengths and improve her weakness.  You see my wife and I don't eat the garbage club coaches/DOC's tried feeding us.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Dude, you really are an Agatha Christie. Now you are telling youngers and olders how their soccer experience is going to be? While you're writing fiction about how much better a DA/ECNL club is better than a DA/National League club is, I think it is a step in a positive direction that you are acknowledging that ECNL will be the B team. And not being on a DA roster but playing in the United States Youth Soccer National League is a great way to develop as a player and get recruited by a Power 5 conference.


We do not know which league will be the "B" league yet.  The top players are going to determine that.  If it had started 2 years ago then DA would be the "B" league because not many of the top players in the 2016 grad class would have jumped ship and the best of the class is already on the Olympic team.


----------



## picaboo

NoGoal said:


> You love Legends so much! Josh must bend you over and you must take it like a champ.  Do you also say, "Josh may I have another please"
> 
> I believe I posted my unbaised opinion about Arsenal and Legends already. As for their playing resume and if I had to start a team...I would draft Cle Kooiman over Josh Hodges as a player every day of the year.  Cle Kooiman played in a World Cup with the US Mens National Team.  Enough said!


Huh? I googled them because I am trying to learn more regarding possibly taking my daughter to one of the clubs. Did you not understand my post?


----------



## MakeAPlay

dfbmike said:


> Cali, I've been reading No Goals posts for some time and it appears that he is floating on his college soccer cloud and no one better disagree because he thinks he knows it all, proud little papa for sure.  No Goals only endgame is college and money, nothing else, but little does he actually know and it is starting to get a little annoying.  It is one thing to have an opinion, its another to belittle everyone that doesn't agree.  What he fails to realize is that college soccer is not everyone's dream or end goal and I am talking strictly from an athletic standpoint, some kids actually really do want to make the USN SR squad, or SR squad of their country of heritage and represent their country and/or play real soccer, professionally and some just play for fun and then quit, nothing wrong with that either.  National team/Pro soccer should be on a different path than college/amateur soccer (and yes no goal your kids will be playing amateur soccer, so calm down), we need players committed to the cause no half in/half out and suddenly jumping ship and go for that schollie once things get a little rough.  Wanting to get an education and wanting to be a professional athlete, should have nothing to do with each other, but that is a discussion for another day.
> Is pursuing a professional soccer career the most financially wise decision right now?  probably not, but neither is becoming an actor, musician, boxer, mma fighter, you name it and US soccer is trying to change ALL that on the soccer front and hopefully one day there will be an established women's league where these players can keep developing and continue to play the sport they love, it will happen, no doubt.
> Making the Olympic team for any other sport is probably not the financially wisest decision either, yet we have plenty of people who do and we clean up the medal count every 2 years.  Not everyone comes from the same economic background, so different strokes for different folks, some amazing stories out there every Olympic cycle.
> We are in a unique situation here on many fronts, we have the best athletes in the world, we have a huge country with many different cultures, many different states and not many countries take school sports as serious as we do, so it presents unique challenges in trying to evolve and align at the same time.  One has to wonder how many stars the USMNT has lost in the shuffle because those players went to college, played some garbage college soccer and got a job instead of taking on some risk and pursuing what i'm sure was their original dream, to play professionally or for a SR Squad.  The other issue probably was that back in the day US soccer scouted mostly college playing athletes, well that creates a bit of a  void as we all know our best soccer players don't always end up in college and it was evident by the way US soccer played, like a college team.
> US soccer's job is to be able to compete on the International stage both men and women and that is what they are trying to accomplish, but you won't if you show up to the world cup with 24 college players.  Right now it is working on the womens side because to be quite honest no one else in the world gave 2 "cents" about the womens game until recently.  There were what 12 countries in the womens "world cup" in the 90's?  Some countries don't even have the finances to support the mens national teams let alone the womens.  So the US womens game is working for now but needs to keep evolving to stay ahead of the curve.  What US soccer is doing is a huge step in the right direction from an athletic standpoint and if we can be the first country to have a nice professional league for women I'd be all for it.  The DA system is a proven feeder system in SOCCER.



I'm sorry but there will likely never be a viable non-subsidized professional women's soccer league in America.  The country only gets excited every few years about girl's soccer.  Also, the US doesn't have a monopoly on the best athletes in the world.  Not by any stretch of the imagination.  Club soccer in general is a middle to upper middle class sport in America and doesn't even have the best American athletes.  The USWNT as a goal is great for a kid to have but a parents job is to mitigate that dream with some preparation for the point that all athletes get to whether they are professionals or not and that is real life.  There is a reason that Mallory Pugh chose to turn down being the top amateur player in this year's NWSL draft and chose to enroll at UCLA.  Her and her family understand that even the top of the women's soccer pyramid is lower than where a world class education can lead her once her playing days are over.  

Also let's be clear that US soccer's true goal isn't to develop better players for the national team.  It is to control the process.  If it was truly to develop world class players (which we are doing already) then they would have a residential academy like they do on the boys side.  The truth is that each DA club sill have the equivalent of 5 full scholarships worth of money and they will still have the pay to play model that currently exists.  Until that changes and we field a team from South Central LA or the 5th Ward in Houston with athletes that boggle the mind and no charge, we aren't serious at all about development.  It's just more window dressing.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Yes, I am a Legends FC supporter. But you are wrong about the inaugural DA season. I am not sure my daughter will be good enough to make it.


You are fooling yourself if you think that the best players who are already in the YNT system AND committed to colleges are going to bolt for DA their last year or two.  Why would they?  They get called into camps pretty often and miss enough club games anyway.  Not to mention that they want to do senior stuff!!  My player missed her prom due to soccer but it wasn't because of a game with her club team!

DA will only be the top league when the top players and their families decide to put them there.  It is not going to be an easy sell to the families of top players.  Top players don't need the DA or any league for that matter.  The league needs the top players...


----------



## NoGoal

picaboo said:


> Huh? I googled them because I am trying to learn more regarding possibly taking my daughter to one of the clubs. Did you not understand my post?


My bad, sorry Picaboo, I didn't mean to reply to your post.  It was meant for Cali!


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I'm sorry but there will likely never be a viable non-subsidized professional women's soccer league in America.  The country only gets excited every few years about girl's soccer.  Also, the US doesn't have a monopoly on the best athletes in the world.  Not by any stretch of the imagination.  Club soccer in general is a middle to upper middle class sport in America and doesn't even have the best American athletes.  The USWNT as a goal is great for a kid to have but a parents job is to mitigate that dream with some preparation for the point that all athletes get to whether they are professionals or not and that is real life.  There is a reason that Mallory Pugh chose to turn down being the top amateur player in this year's NWSL draft and chose to enroll at UCLA.  Her and her family understand that even the top of the women's soccer pyramid is lower than where a world class education can lead her once her playing days are over.
> 
> Also let's be clear that US soccer's true goal isn't to develop better players for the national team.  It is to control the process.  If it was truly to develop world class players (which we are doing already) then they would have a residential academy like they do on the boys side.  The truth is that each DA club sill have the equivalent of 5 full scholarships worth of money and they will still have the pay to play model that currently exists.  Until that changes and we field a team from South Central LA or the 5th Ward in Houston with athletes that boggle the mind and no charge, we aren't serious at all about development.  It's just more window dressing.


And most likely those 5 DA scholarships will be allotted for YNT players, even if they can afford to pay. IMO, it should be used for players good enough to play on a DA team who really need the subsidy.  Not to mention the YNT players will also get the most athletic scholarship money when they commit to play college ball anyways.  US Soccer needs to make it affordable for the lower class income population.


----------



## madcow

NoGoal said:


> US Soccer needs to make it affordable for the lower class income population.


They will. USSF is kicking in 5 million dollars. After they hire all of the "soccer people" there should be plenty left over to subsidize the people who need it most....


----------



## eastbaysoccer

A lot of assumptions are being made here.  In theory it sounds good, but what will happen is another story.

US Soccer will in the end not contribute enough money to to make it FREE for all.  The day it is free for 18 rostered players per group is the day I will stand on my feet and clap. 

 My kid can play DA but she won't be.  In her place will be a girl who is not as good but willing to pay.  So what do you have now?  A watered down GDA and ECNL.  New league same issues.


----------



## CaliKlines

eastbaysoccer said:


> A lot of assumptions are being made here.
> 
> My kid can play DA but she won't be.  In her place will be a girl who is not as good but willing to pay.


Boy, talk about assumptions and an ego! There is always someone better around the corner and down the street.



eastbaysoccer said:


> So what do you have now?  A watered down GDA and ECNL.  New league same issues.


Guess what, it won't be up to you. It won't even be up to the clubs in Southern CA. If the rest of the country (62 clubs) treat the DA as the top league, then it will be the top league with the best players and there is not anything "the ECNL" or the dual DA/ECNL clubs in southern California can do about it. And after reading thru some of the forums in TX, Illinois, and the east coast, the DA is going to be a huge collector of talent.


----------



## NoGoal

eastbaysoccer said:


> A lot of assumptions are being made here.  In theory it sounds good, but what will happen is another story.
> 
> US Soccer will in the end not contribute enough money to to make it FREE for all.  The day it is free for 18 rostered players per group is the day I will stand on my feet and clap.
> 
> My kid can play DA but she won't be.  In her place will be a girl who is not as good but willing to pay.  So what do you have now?  A watered down GDA and ECNL.  New league same issues.


I highly doubt it will be free for everyone on a GDA team.  It isn't 100% subsidized on the BDA and their program has been around for a decade.


----------



## dfbmike

MakeAPlay said:


> I'm sorry but there will likely never be a viable non-subsidized professional women's soccer league in America.  The country only gets excited every few years about girl's soccer.


Not sure I should even answer this, but it is ok to come out from under your rock. Dont be so naive, things are always evolving.
Womens soccer is still in its infancy and hasn't even exploded yet.  Not sure if you read my post but the first womens world cup was in the 90s, not the 60s, 70s or 80s, the 90s, that is 25 years ago, with 12 teams.  Do some research on when the mens wc started.  
In the future there will be many more soccer opportunities for those females that believe and those that want them, but someone has to get us there and someone has to be first.  The senior women and current up and coming players are working to create those opportunities for future players.
I trust US soccer more than you arm chair gms or parents that became "soccer/soccer system experts" through your kids.  
Im glad your kids get to play amateur soccer and get either a partially free or fully funded edumication because of soccer, doesnt mean you have to be arrogant about it.  In the end they are stiil playing amateur soccer just like everyone else here.
Out.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Boy, talk about assumptions and an ego! There is always someone better around the corner and down the street.
> 
> 
> 
> Guess what, it won't be up to you. It won't even be up to the clubs in Southern CA. If the rest of the country (62 clubs) treat the DA as the top league, then it will be the top league with the best players and there is not anything "the ECNL" or the dual DA/ECNL clubs in southern California can do about it. And after reading thru some of the forums in TX, Illinois, and the east coast, the DA is going to be a huge collector of talent.


A lot of the announced DA clubs are current ECNL clubs.  The ECNL clubs already have 85-90% of the top talent nationally. So, if the top players wanted to play DA at their club they will only shift leagues.

What does dual DA/ECNL clubs have anything to do with your post?


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> Boy, talk about assumptions and an ego! There is always someone better around the corner and down the street.
> 
> Guess what, it won't be up to you. It won't even be up to the clubs in Southern CA. If the rest of the country (62 clubs) treat the DA as the top league, then it will be the top league with the best players and there is not anything "the ECNL" or the dual DA/ECNL clubs in southern California can do about it. And after reading thru some of the forums in TX, Illinois, and the east coast, the DA is going to be a huge collector of talent.



A collector of talent sitting on the bench. What parent wouldn't want that? (Insert sarcasm as usual) . Before you insert anything about my DD she's a gk, so time has NEVER been an issue.


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> Not sure I should even answer this, but it is ok to come out from under your rock. Dont be so naive, things are always evolving.
> Womens soccer is still in its infancy and hasn't even exploded yet.  Not sure if you read my post but the first womens world cup was in the 90s, not the 60s, 70s or 80s, the 90s, that is 25 years ago, with 12 teams.  Do some research on when the mens wc started.
> In the future there will be many more soccer opportunities for those females that believe and those that want them, but someone has to get us there and someone has to be first.  The senior women and current up and coming players are working to create those opportunities for future players.
> I trust US soccer more than you arm chair gms or parents that became "soccer/soccer system experts" through your kids.
> Im glad your kids get to play amateur soccer and get either a partially free or fully funded edumication because of soccer, doesnt mean you have to be arrogant about it.  In the end they are stiil playing amateur soccer just like everyone else here.
> Out.


You must also believe in a utopian society.  If anybody wanted their DDs to play a pro sport and make millions....well girls soccer is NOT it.  We all missed the boat and should have had them play TENNIS or GOLF.   Both sports offer athletic college scholarhips too.


----------



## TD1

madcow said:


> They will. USSF is kicking in 5 million dollars. After they hire all of the "soccer people" there should be plenty left over to subsidize the people who need it most....


Yes, after they hire "soccer people" there will be lots left for them to make it rain on the soccer players.  Think the bs detector just started ringing in my head.


----------



## TD1

shales1002 said:


> A collector of talent sitting on the bench. What parent wouldn't want that? (Insert sarcasm as usual) . Before you insert anything about my DD she's a gk, so time has NEVER been an issue.


To me the biggest issue will be merging of two age groups.  Are folks ready to watch their team get split apart every year as the older half of the team ages out, and a group of younger's gets added to the team?  Even for goalkeepers, when they move up in age and your kid is now the younger keeper on the team, will she be okay with the real implications that this will have on play time?


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Assumptions.  Less games, more practice and restrictions, with a small chance to make a YNT and really no chance to make a lot of  money.

We the people will decide if it is worth it.  The economics tell me it's not.  Good luck to those that go.  It will be a 50/50 split.


----------



## shales1002

TD1 said:


> To me the biggest issue will be merging of two age groups.  Are folks ready to watch their team get split apart every year as the older half of the team ages out, and a group of younger's gets added to the team?  Even for goalkeepers, when they move up and are the younger keeper on the team, will they be okay with the real implications that this will have on play time?


We just did the spilt the team apart and it was exhausting to say the least. Who would be okay with not playing ?


----------



## gkrent

The professional circuit in Europe and US recruit mostly from college player pool.   Best option is Europe for those who won't be part of the starting 11 in NWSL.  Pays better and you get some pretty great experience.  Some players don't even get NT call ups until they've played pro!  I agree with those who aren't sold on the idea that DA is the only route to Pro or NT.  Anyone here who has a kid in the NT pool knows that there is a heavy political component to the whole process, too.


----------



## Bored

I am not for the DA.  my dd is part of the ECNL and her club joined.  Same coaches mean same ol stuff.  So they are practicing 4 times a week.  Between her 3 practices a week and work with a speed and agility coach she already practices 4 times a week.  So if she makes a DA team, will she even want it?  given the choice I think she would choose the ECNL team.  She is a starter on her current ecnl team and plays pretty much every minute.  And her team is good.  Makes the Champions League every year. But please tell me what the DA is gonna do different.  I have heard nothing yet.  Just a power struggle.  And it showed last weekend with the U17s  calling a camp during the Finals.  I know the Colorado coach was pissed.  

The DA has obviously done nothing for the boys.  ECNL should have been quicker to take away the patch from consistently under performing clubs giving it to more deserving clubs.  I think the model was there but just wasn't handled right in the first place.  But as long as the coaches are the same, the teams will be the same.  The only ones that are thrilled about this are the non ecnl clubs that got accepted and the delusional idiots that think it will be free for their little sally.  Keep dreaming you morons.  For the ECNL clubs, that got accepted it changes nothing.  Except with an already established league and plenty of good players left over because of the 2 year age grouping, the DA/ECNL clubs will become even richer with 2 elite leagues to play in.  ECNL will become what many hoped the EGSL would become.  A viable 2nd league.  Many girls who are already committed to play in college will be fine with playing in the ECNL.  I know mine would.  By the way Caliklines, you're a kook.  Remember when the 99s last played the blues the gap had widened considerably.  Legends top teams couldn't compete with the top ECNL teams.


----------



## Bored

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/ecnl/its-bullst-let-the-girls-play-real-colorado-coach-rips-ussfs-ecnl-scheduling-snub/

Colorado's Coach doesn't hold back.


----------



## Swoosh

http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/07/13/17/42/160713-u18wnt-falls-to-england-u18-1-0-in-burton-upon-trent?sf30903761=1

The ECNL girls lost to England.  That's how far behind we have gotten.


----------



## Bored

U-18 Group is weak.  U-17s are the group to watch.


----------



## Bored

Swoosh said:


> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/07/13/17/42/160713-u18wnt-falls-to-england-u18-1-0-in-burton-upon-trent?sf30903761=1
> 
> The ECNL girls lost to England.  That's how far behind we have gotten.


The funny thing is, if the ECNL girls on that team are the best we have to offer than the Non ECNL girls must be really bad.


----------



## Swoosh

Thank you US Soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Bored said:


> U-18 Group is weak.  U-17s are the group to watch.


The U18's aren't weak.  They are missing several players and are cycling lots of players in and out for looks.  They will be transitioning to the U20 team in January and several players will not be missing.  This team scrimmaged the U17 team and lost.  However, they were up 1-0 at the half and the 2nd unit gave up 2 goals in 10 minutes to the U17 first unit and one of the goals was a pass by the 3rd keeper (her only camp ever) to one of their forwards for a tap in goal.  I would watch the U18 play first before you say that because most of their players individually are superior to the U17 players.  The difference is that this team is prepping for 2018 and are still working out the pool.


----------



## NoGoal

gkrent said:


> The professional circuit in Europe and US recruit mostly from college player pool.   Best option is Europe for those who won't be part of the starting 11 in NWSL.  Pays better and you get some pretty great experience.  Some players don't even get NT call ups until they've played pro!  I agree with those who aren't sold on the idea that DA is the only route to Pro or NT.  Anyone here who has a kid in the NT pool knows that there is a heavy political component to the whole process, too.


Like Allie Long!  First time she made the Sr team roster and she is 28 years old.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/07/13/17/42/160713-u18wnt-falls-to-england-u18-1-0-in-burton-upon-trent?sf30903761=1
> 
> The ECNL girls lost to England.  That's how far behind we have gotten.


Ever think maybe it's the YNT coaches fault? I will go out on a limb and post....the U20 YNT will have a difficult time winning the U20 Womens WC.  Several of the top eligible college players skipped playing for the U20 YNT.  4 players from Stanford, 1 player from Duke and I think 1 from Teaxas A&M.  They all didn't want to take a mandatory redshirt year to play for the U20 team.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Bored said:


> The funny thing is, if the ECNL girls on that team are the best we have to offer than the Non ECNL girls must be really bad.


There are some great 'offerings' outside ECNL - non kool-aid kids lurking in the darkness, being trained skills and not bulldozer, ignoring coaches trying to give them colorful drinks...


----------



## MakeAPlay

Here is a great post on this subject by Eddie K on another forum that I frequent.


Can the US continue to compete (women) or hope to compete (men) for regional and World Cups with the current 'pay to play' model? Where access to higher level competition and coaching is limited to those that can afford it. 

Clearly, if you like the current system, you may not want to support kids and families that can't pay their way. This seems to be what US Soccer is doing. Your dollars indirectly subsidizing elite youth soccer. Since there just isn't a professional club-based model broad enough in the US to be relied upon (also debatable perhaps for the men). 

So, will those scholarships mentioned for the girls DA really be used for needy players?
Will clubs have to look for and recruit needy players to get those scholarship dollars?
Will those dollars keep coming throughout the career of a needy player? 
Will clubs be limited in the revenue they can make from DA kids/families? At least be required to make the DA program revenue-neutral or even revenue-negative. That is, keep costs down for the DA with other revenue (from tournaments, sponsors, etc). This is what the boys are doing, or supposed to be doing. 

It's an interesting dilemma. Will players be drawn to something that costs less than the ECNL or USYSA alternative team? When the revenue constraints may keep some very good coaches away from it. They want to make a living and if DA budgets are controlled, why do it for less money? Prestige doesn't pay the mortgage. 

On the girls side, this is a special dilemma because the players themselves will not be a source of revenue. No one is selling these players to pro clubs for the benefit of the home club like they are, or can, on the boys side. 

And for the players, even for the handful or so any given year that may make it to the USWNT pool, its still all about a college scholarship. I believe only one NT player (Horan) has bypassed college. Men are doing it all the time and making good money (Agudelo, Yedlin, Pulisic, etc) Even if you are a top women's pro player, the NWSL max is 40K unless you get the US Soccer money. Some make only 10K. That's crazy. Only 20 or so players are making 100K+ and a dozen great women's pro players "retire" every year at age 24/25 after a year or 2 in the league to get real jobs. 

IMHO, this effort is to be applauded but I have lots of doubts about both the implementation and the outcome. I mean what is the goal anyway? If this team goes to Rio and wins gold, how much better do we get??


----------



## gunner

Swoosh said:


> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/07/13/17/42/160713-u18wnt-falls-to-england-u18-1-0-in-burton-upon-trent?sf30903761=1
> 
> The ECNL girls lost to England.  That's how far behind we have gotten.


Based on the roster and picture, this team could use some diversity. Hopefully DA can help with that.


----------



## NoGoal

gunner said:


> Based on the roster and picture, this team could use some diversity. Hopefully DA can help with that.


I've been telling that to my buddy for years.  A prerequisite to make the US YNT is being blonde with blue/green eyes.

This is what a true US team should look like.
http://www.teamusa.org/News/2016/July/10/US-Olympic-Team-Trials-For-Womens-Gymnastics


----------



## Glen

It gets worse as they get older.


----------



## Glen

MakeAPlay said:


> Here is a great post on this subject by Eddie K on another forum that I frequent.
> 
> 
> Can the US continue to compete (women) or hope to compete (men) for regional and World Cups with the current 'pay to play' model? Where access to higher level competition and coaching is limited to those that can afford it.
> 
> Clearly, if you like the current system, you may not want to support kids and families that can't pay their way. This seems to be what US Soccer is doing. Your dollars indirectly subsidizing elite youth soccer. Since there just isn't a professional club-based model broad enough in the US to be relied upon (also debatable perhaps for the men).
> 
> So, will those scholarships mentioned for the girls DA really be used for needy players?
> Will clubs have to look for and recruit needy players to get those scholarship dollars?
> Will those dollars keep coming throughout the career of a needy player?
> Will clubs be limited in the revenue they can make from DA kids/families? At least be required to make the DA program revenue-neutral or even revenue-negative. That is, keep costs down for the DA with other revenue (from tournaments, sponsors, etc). This is what the boys are doing, or supposed to be doing.
> 
> It's an interesting dilemma. Will players be drawn to something that costs less than the ECNL or USYSA alternative team? When the revenue constraints may keep some very good coaches away from it. They want to make a living and if DA budgets are controlled, why do it for less money? Prestige doesn't pay the mortgage.
> 
> On the girls side, this is a special dilemma because the players themselves will not be a source of revenue. No one is selling these players to pro clubs for the benefit of the home club like they are, or can, on the boys side.
> 
> And for the players, even for the handful or so any given year that may make it to the USWNT pool, its still all about a college scholarship. I believe only one NT player (Horan) has bypassed college. Men are doing it all the time and making good money (Agudelo, Yedlin, Pulisic, etc) Even if you are a top women's pro player, the NWSL max is 40K unless you get the US Soccer money. Some make only 10K. That's crazy. Only 20 or so players are making 100K+ and a dozen great women's pro players "retire" every year at age 24/25 after a year or 2 in the league to get real jobs.
> 
> IMHO, this effort is to be applauded but I have lots of doubts about both the implementation and the outcome. I mean what is the goal anyway? If this team goes to Rio and wins gold, how much better do we get??


Interesting take from Eddie K; thanks for sharing.  Although Eddie K must not consider U of Akron a college.  I thought that strange, but realized that I don't really consider Akron a college either.  I must meet this Eddie K.


----------



## CaliKlines

Bored said:


> The funny thing is, if the ECNL girls on that team are the best we have to offer than the Non ECNL girls must be really bad.


Guess we'll find out once the DA starts up, because up until then, the ECNL has limited the amount of competition. I have always declared that the ECNL produces some great teams and some great players...and some mediocre teams....and some just outright plain bad teams. The top non ECNL teams can compete with the top ECNL teams on any day of the week. Why do you think the ECNL teams have to recruit so heavily from the non ECNL sides? I guess we will find out in the fall of 2017! Or what will the excuses be then? "It's not really our best team...we've decided to have the ECNL team become the A side." Quit ducking and start playing.

And calling people names because our statements trigger your insecurities? Kook? Delusional idiots? Morons? Very mature.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Guess we'll find out once the DA starts up, because up until then, the ECNL has limited the amount of competition. I have always declared that the ECNL produces some great teams and some great players...and some mediocre teams....and some just outright plain bad teams. The top non ECNL teams can compete with the top ECNL teams on any day of the week. Why do you think the ECNL teams have to recruit so heavily from the non ECNL sides? I guess we will find out in the fall of 2017! Or what will the excuses be then? "It's not really our best team...we've decided to have the ECNL team become the A side." Quit ducking and start playing.
> 
> And calling people names because our statements trigger your insecurities? Kook? Delusional idiots? Morons? Very mature.


Every league will have a poorly performing club.   My prediction for SoCal Girls DA.  LA Premier will be the doormat of the SoCal conference!


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> My prediction for SoCal Girls DA.  LA Premier will be the doormat of the SoCal conference!


Unless Strikers or Arsenal are invited.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Unless Strikers or Arsenal are invited.


I say those 2 clubs beat LA Premier too.  The players from RSC will play for Eagles opposite traffic, before they commute in traffic to LA Premier.  Carlsbad will also be challenged being sandwiched between Blues and Surf.  The biggest question mark, will the best players in the South Bay return home to play for Beach FC or continue commuting to Slammers or Blues?


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> I say those 2 clubs beat LA Premier too.


Whatever you are smoking, you should share because that must be some good sh*t.



NoGoal said:


> The biggest question mark, will the best players in the South Bay return home to play for Beach FC or continue commuting to Slammers or Blues?


The biggest question is not about the existing players, although that will be interesting. The biggest question is how will the Slammers and Blues (and Arsenal to some extent) get along without being able to recruit at the younger ages from the South Bay, and north OC/Inland Empire. Their pipeline is going to dry up.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Whatever you are smoking, you should share because that must be some good sh*t.
> 
> 
> The biggest question is not about the existing players, although that will be interesting. The biggest question is how will the Slammers and Blues (and Arsenal to some extent) get along without being able to recruit at the younger ages from the South Bay, and north OC/Inland Empire. Their pipeline is going to shrink up.


IMO, Slammers and Blues will be fine.  They will divvy up the 10 best players from each age group from WCFC and the few at Strikers.


----------



## Soccer43

the forum is an interesting indicator......"Girls Development Academy" thread 312 messages; "ECNL" thread 0 messages.  Lots of interest in the DA despite the dissenters.  

Just because someone plays in ECNL now it doesn't mean they are happy with ECNL and think it is the best.  Lots of parents and girls will be curious and interested in making the move and it is nice to have some fresh air on the horizon with new options.


----------



## NoGoal

Soccer43 said:


> the forum is an interesting indicator......"Girls Development Academy" thread 312 messages; "ECNL" thread 0 messages.  Lots of interest in the DA despite the dissenters.
> 
> Just because someone plays in ECNL now it doesn't mean they are happy with ECNL and think it is the best.  Lots of parents and girls will be curious and interested in making the move and it is nice to have some fresh air on the horizon with new options.


Well there are no posts on the ECNL thread, because Dom just put it up today!  The old forum had tons of ECNL posts.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Ever think maybe it's the YNT coaches fault? I will go out on a limb and post....the U20 YNT will have a difficult time winning the U20 Womens WC.  Several of the top eligible college players skipped playing for the U20 YNT.  4 players from Stanford, 1 player from Duke and I think 1 from Teaxas A&M.  They all didn't want to take a mandatory redshirt year to play for the U20 team.


I actually do feel the coaching is less than stellar at the USYNT level.  As for the U20s, no matter who is or isn't missing, the favorite is Japan.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> I actually do feel the coaching is less than stellar at the USYNT level.  As for the U20s, no matter who is or isn't missing, the favorite is Japan.


Imagine, 6 of the best U20 college players have indirectly said, my college education is more important than playing for a U20 WC title.


----------



## picaboo

Sorry it's ECNL not ESCL. My bad.


----------



## CaliKlines

Justafan said:


> How many girls do D1 schools typically take in per year?


Depending on the program needs + the number of graduating seniors and transfers, I'd say the average is 6-8 players per program per year. Here is the recruit list. If you go to the "By College" tab, you will see how many players are in the 2016 class, which is 99.99% done.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IbB3V_l4dzMu1PnuLIjX9bJyT9r9zn2voE_qefyFYko/htmlembed?widget=false#


----------



## Keaysdad

Does anyone know the cost that is incurred by a club that is accepted to the DA. ? I hear that is not cheap! And some clubs could lose their spots over time and new clubs could be accepted over time as openings become available. I'm not really sure some of the accepted clubs can afford this right now....thoughts?


----------



## shales1002

Keaysdad said:


> Does anyone know the cost that is incurred by a club that is accepted to the DA. ? I hear that is not cheap! And some clubs could lose their spots over time and new clubs could be accepted over time as openings become available. I'm not really sure some of the accepted clubs can afford this right now....thoughts?


225k is the number I was told.


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> 225k is the number I was told.


225K sounds right for 3 teams.  I wonder if that includes travel expense.  Well Madcow posted US Soccer is giving 5 million.  If so, it will be divide equally among 53 girls DA clubs.  That is about 96K each.  Obviously the math doesn't add up to GDA being fully funded, means somebody is going to have to pay for the shortfall.


----------



## madcow

NoGoal said:


> 225K sounds right for 3 teams.  I wonder if that includes travel expense.  Well Madcow posted US Soccer is giving 5 million.  If so, it will be divide equally among 53 girls DA clubs.  That is about 96K each.  Obviously the math doesn't add up to GDA being fully funded, means somebody is going to have to pay for the shortfall.


Ahhh, that 5 Million is before the "soccer people" get paid...


----------



## SOCCERMINION

NoGoal said:


> 225K sounds right for 3 teams.  I wonder if that includes travel expense.  Well Madcow posted US Soccer is giving 5 million.  If so, it will be divide equally among 53 girls DA clubs.  That is about 96K each.  Obviously the math doesn't add up to GDA being fully funded, means somebody is going to have to pay for the shortfall.


Dont worry the extra money will come from the influx of parents eager to pay threw the nose to get on the clubs DA or  DA -reserve team. This will be enough money to ensure the top 11 girls always play for free on the DA teams.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

The National Women's Soccer League took an embarrassing hit over the weekend when it allowed a match to be played on a narrow field and now Hope Solo, the goalie for the U.S. women's national team and the Seattle Reign, believes it's another sign that "we have a crisis on our hands."

Solo, who has become one of the national team's leaders in the fight for pay and conditions that are equal to those given the men's team, ripped the league for the 58-yard wide field as well as for its financial, travel and equipment arrangements.


So this is the endpoint after GDA????


----------



## Eusebio

Looks like they were playing on a U9 field.


----------



## Swoosh

Embarrassing. Hope some heads rolled over this.

But why did the coaches agree to play?
Why did the players agree to play?
Nobody has any common sense?  BUNCH OF MORONS


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> 225K sounds right for 3 teams.  I wonder if that includes travel expense.  Well Madcow posted US Soccer is giving 5 million.  If so, it will be divide equally among 53 girls DA clubs.  That is about 96K each.  Obviously the math doesn't add up to GDA being fully funded, means somebody is going to have to pay for the shortfall.


GDA is not fully funded on the boys side with the exception of MLS sides and maybe a few others.  It won't be fully funded on the girls side either.  My guess is it will cost about the same as people are paying now.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Every league will have a poorly performing club.   My prediction for SoCal Girls DA.  LA Premier will be the doormat of the SoCal conference!


You're going out on a limb here NoGoal, very brave statement!


----------



## Swoosh

CaliKlines said:


> Unless Strikers or Arsenal are invited.


Strikers would come in dead last.  Arsenal could compete better. Shocked at Real and West Coast not getting in.  If they can keep their clubs afloat ala Beach and Legends, they should be in next year on expansion for sure.  We will see if players flock away though.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> GDA is not fully funded on the boys side with the exception of MLS sides and maybe a few others.  It won't be fully funded on the girls side either.  My guess is it will cost about the same as people are paying now.


Thanks, but I already knew that and posted it on this thread.  Read post #60!  I was illustrating to posters...Girls DA will not be fully funded as many ulittle parents might be thinking and hoping. Please keep up!

The 225K is a low end estimate.  Club fee and ECNL travel fee combined is about 5-6K a year per player in SoCal, so it would be closer to 300K for 3 teams totaling a minimum of 60 girls.  Add in 2 additional training days (club coaches won't be training for free), field expense and lights.  The cost is even higher.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> You're going out on a limb here NoGoal, very brave statement!


Want me to go on a limb?  Your club will finish dead last, ha!


----------



## eastbaysoccer

If the US WNT team was playing on TV vs. the Victoria Secret Bikini Powder puff mud tackle football game I could guarantee you the latter would win in a TV ratings by a landslide.  Nobody is interested in seeing Lloyd, klingberg, Wombach and rapinoe.   They are interested in Pugh, Leroux, Morgan and Press.  

The fact is GDA is trying to bring women soccer to parity with the men is a joke.  And to think that people actually believe this is possible is a joke because the level of play is NOT equal by any stretch.  GDA will do nothing to improve the women's game as it stands now.  The US Women are at the top of their game presently.  Frankly the only direction from the ceiling is down and when this happens GDA and Henrich will be held responsible for the decline.


----------



## SOCCERMINION

eastbaysoccer said:


> If the US WNT team was playing on TV vs. the Victoria Secret Bikini Powder puff mud tackle football game I could guarantee you the latter would win in a TV ratings by a landslide.  Nobody is interested in seeing Lloyd, klingberg, Wombach and rapinoe.   They are interested in Pugh, Leroux, Morgan and Press.
> 
> The fact is GDA is trying to bring women soccer to parity with the men is a joke.  And to think that people actually believe this is possible is a joke because the level of play is NOT equal by any stretch.  GDA will do nothing to improve the women's game as it stands now.  The US Women are at the top of their game presently.  Frankly the only direction from the ceiling is down and when this happens GDA and Henrich will be held responsible for the decline.


The facts are clear and EBAY is correct on viewers :
*+212%* 2014 Men's World Cup group stage vs. 2015 Women's World Cup group stage
*+87%* 2014 men's send-off games vs. 2015 women's send-off games
*+70%* 2015 men's friendlies vs. women's friendlies

Even when you include the record 25,400,000 viewers who watched the 2015 USA-Japan final on Fox, the U.S. men outdrew the U.S. women by 74 percent for their World Cup games.

But what I believe is the majority of Growth and interest of US soccer is not going to come from the men but from the Women's side. Americans gravitate to winners and in the USA only the Women are doing that. Sorry everyone, but in the USA sports participations is declining and soccer is still not the top sport chossen by our boys or girls . ( http://as.pn/play2016 ) The younge athetic males in the USA unfortunitly still have litttle to no interest in the soccer for many reasons, my money litterally is on the growth of womens soccer to help increase interest in sport. 
So get behind our women and thank them for putting  up with crappy playing conditions low pay and little chance of making a living at it now, to help advance Soccer in the USA for our kids future. GDA bring it on....


----------



## devupa2.0

eastbaysoccer said:


> If the US WNT team was playing on TV vs. the Victoria Secret Bikini Powder puff mud tackle football game I could guarantee you the latter would win in a TV ratings by a landslide.  Nobody is interested in seeing Lloyd, klingberg, Wombach and rapinoe.   They are interested in Pugh, Leroux, Morgan and Press.




I really disagree with this part of your comment.

I enjoy watching soccer in general. However, I really enjoy watching good women's soccer as compared to other women's sports. I think the level of competitive fire and skill that has been developed in women's soccer really makes for good viewing. In some technical ways I also think that the best women in the US are playing BETTER soccer than the men. More connections, more passing back and switching the field to take advantage of numbers, more creativity in the attack, more use of the goal keeper as a field player. There is a lot to be said for the quality of their play and seeing raw ratings as high as we have seen is significant.

However, I think there is an even more important factor that will continue to increase the popularity in the women's game. Young girls playing soccer now have the ability to watch their idols play the sport they love at the highest level of the game, on tv and in person, and they are WOMEN! My daughter doesn't have to watch men playing the game to see perfect examples of technique and willpower. She has tons of examples of phenomenal female players that are getting publicity and being hailed as excellent athletes.

The more that these top women are showcased and our young girls are able to see that, then the more the growth will feed on itself. Softball, volleyball, even basketball haven't seen that kind of stardom and focus on the women's side. I don't ever remember being able to sit in a bar and have hundreds of people cheering for a women's sporting event quite the way we've seen for women's soccer in the last few years. Possibly for some Olympic events, but even then I'm not sure.

And it has crossed over to some folks that don't really even follow soccer. The success of the women's national team has put soccer on the radar screen for many parents that might not have considered soccer as an option for their daughters. This will only grow the momentum.

I know Ronaldo's looks have helped his marketability. I'm sure Hope Solo's looks help her too. However, I know a ton of people that are interested in watching both men and women play good soccer. It's the good soccer part that attracts the viewers. If they are playing the game at the highest level, then I don't think their looks will matter that much. Messi isn't the best looking kid around, but a ton of people want to see him play because he is incredible.

As long as our top women continue playing excellent soccer and doing well on the international scene, it will help feed the dreams of DD's around the nation - that will only grow the sport and its ratings.


----------



## timbuck

Since sports programming is really the only thing on TV these days that people watch live, I do think the NWSL will get a decent TV deal in the very near future.  I'd watch women's soccer if it was on TV. My daughters would love it.


----------



## tenacious

Interesting topic.  I like the idea of a girls DA. Although I think they could have come up with a better setup.  Made it like a champions league and bring all the winners from the different leagues together (from the year before); and crown a true US Champion.  Set themselves up as the gold standard, by bringing US Youth & Club leagues back together in the way that only US Soccer could have done.  It woulda been a "comic con" for the soccer world.

Let all of soccer see what was really working.  Be relevant, educate and let the tide raise all the boats.


----------



## tenacious

And they should put Gary Sparks in charge of it.  I really missed him when ECNL broke off from coast soccer.  He didn't put up with much bs out of the clubs.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Want me to go on a limb?  Your club will finish dead last, ha!


Who spiked the Kool-Aid???


----------



## mbeach

It would be fun to have access to the posts in the old blog, to reproduce the opinions of some frequent posters here. I remember making the case for girls DA, just to be attacked simultaneously by three or four posters busy echoing their opinions. I remember saying that most ECNL clubs would apply to DA, just to be laughed off with statements such as "we do not need DA", or "most ECNL clubs will not apply". Well, it is clear that the wishes of those parents were not aligned with the actions of the  leadership of the ECNL clubs.


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## mbeach

In another thread the posters in the know were making lists of the clubs that would get DA. Guess what, the majority opinion was that all ECNL clubs would get DA (except for Blues, because they did not have enough girls to fund the new program), and maybe Legends. Fast forward and 50% of the teams that get DA are non ECNL, and Blues and Beach are among the first four chosen.  Of course, everything must be a money grab because the  posters in the know have much better judgment that the US Soccer Federation.


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## mbeach

Why would clubs with DA and ECNL be the place to be? If I were to make a guess, I would say that DA will strengthen CRL and National Cup, as the non ECNL clubs with DA will have more talented players than in the past, and therefore much better B teams (the A team will be DA). On the other hand, moving forward the ECNL teams should be weaker than in the past, as the top talent moves to the DA teams. Of course, all this is pure speculation, and we will have to wait to see how things develop. I am not going to claim here that I know more than anybody else, and that everybody else is chopped liver, just because my daughter is a college recruit and I am not supposedly biased.


----------



## mbeach

The argument that college soccer will keep the US WSNT on top is laughable, and anybody who knows something about how top soccer talent develops (and the US Soccer Federation  knows about this more than anybody in this forum) laughs about it. It worked in the past because no other nation did anything on women soccer development, and therefore the very small contribution that college  does on development at such advanced age could make a difference. In the near future, with traditional soccer powers starting to take seriously women soccer, college soccer will be a minor contributor to development. Hence US Soccer is trying to take a step in the right direction by creating the girls DA.
If college soccer were such a great developmental tool the US MSNT  would have been the soccer superpower for the last 50 years, which clearly was not.


----------



## mbeach

I personally was surprised with LA Galaxy not getting a nod. I am probably biased, because I was only concerned with how well some of their teams play (I am familiar with their 05s/Diego Souza's last U10 team), and do not know anything about total number of teams, coaching licenses, etc. I was hoping that some posters with daughters in the current 05 elite team, and former players of DS, could chime in, to say whether it was a surprise, if they plan to move to other clubs, etc.  Thanks!


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## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> Why would clubs with DA and ECNL be the place to be? If I were to make a guess, I would say that DA will strengthen CRL and National Cup, as the non ECNL clubs with DA will have more talented players than in the past, and therefore much better B teams (the A team will be DA). On the other hand, moving forward the ECNL teams should be weaker than in the past, as the top talent moves to the DA teams. Of course, all this is pure speculation, and we will have to wait to see how things develop. I am not going to claim here that I know more than anybody else, and that everybody else is chopped liver, just because my daughter is a college recruit and I am not supposedly biased.


So are you posting, if your DD didn't make the Beach GDA team.  You will have her play on the Beach B team during college recuiting years?


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## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> I personally was surprised with LA Galaxy not getting a nod. I am probably biased, because I was only concerned with how well some of their teams play (I am familiar with their 05s/Diego Souza's last U10 team), and do not know anything about total number of teams, coaching licenses, etc. I was hoping that some posters with daughters in the current 05 elite team, and former players of DS, could chime in, to say whether it was a surprise, if they plan to move to other clubs, etc.  Thanks!


Yes, you are baised, the South Bay area doesn't have enough talent for 2 GDA clubs.  You should be happy LA Galaxy/Carlsbad got the nod, instead of the LA Galaxy in the South Bay, because Beach wouldn't have.

05, what is that 6th graders.  Half of those girls won't even be playing club in 3 years, yet alone at LA Galaxy when college recruiting rolls around.


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> The argument that college soccer will keep the US WSNT on top is laughable, and anybody who knows something about how top soccer talent develops (and the US Soccer Federation  knows about this more than anybody in this forum) laughs about it. It worked in the past because no other nation did anything on women soccer development, and therefore the very small contribution that college  does on development at such advanced age could make a difference. In the near future, with traditional soccer powers starting to take seriously women soccer, college soccer will be a minor contributor to development. Hence US Soccer is trying to take a step in the right direction by creating the girls DA.
> If college soccer were such a great developmental tool the US MSNT  would have been the soccer superpower for the last 50 years, which clearly was not.


Really, the same US Soccer Federation who has had BDA the last decade.  Last I checked the US MNT is ranked lower than they were 10 years go.  Christian Pulisic who has dual-citizenship.....knew he had to go to Europe,  so he could continue developing his game at one of the best mens club (Dortmund) and compete against the Elite Euro players.  Follow closely now will yeah.

The deepest and most talented women soccer nation is, drum roll please....the USA.  Where do the best women players play, before being drafted by the NWSL?  College D1 Soccer!  Why do you think the best Canadian players and several women international players are playing US college D1 soccer (beside getting a college degree).


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## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Who spiked the Kool-Aid???


I don't drink Kool-Aid, but I will soon be drinking grape flavored.


----------



## MakeAPlay

mbeach said:


> In another thread the posters in the know were making lists of the clubs that would get DA. Guess what, the majority opinion was that all ECNL clubs would get DA (except for Blues, because they did not have enough girls to fund the new program), and maybe Legends. Fast forward and 50% of the teams that get DA are non ECNL, and Blues and Beach are among the first four chosen.  Of course, everything must be a money grab because the  posters in the know have much better judgment that the US Soccer Federation.



You clearly have a bias towards Beach which is okay.  They have a few good teams and several excellent coaches.  If you can't see that this truly has little to do with development and a lot to do with control then you really are seeing what you want to see.   If development was the goal then a residential style academy for the truly elite players would be the direction they would go in as they have had for a long time on the men's side.  A lot of US soccer's decisions are based on favorites and recommendations from the "network" of individuals that decide things many times not on actual performance but on what fits their style.  DA will only be the top league if the top players flock there.  I would bet my players scholarship that the first few years will not see the majority of the top players flocking there at the older ages simply because there is no benefit to them and most will be unwilling to give up high school soccer.  Now before you call me a homer I must disclose that my player is in college, is already in the YNT system and her club is a DA club so I have no dog in this fight.  However, when you look at the YNT rosters and the college recruiting spreadsheet it is pretty obvious which clubs are succeeding in SoCal and the country.  Until any of those non-ECNL clubs can do more in these arenas it is really just a power grab that your club benefitted from.  Are you really proud of that?  I can tell you that the ECNL clubs have been doing it for years and with or without labels they will continue to do it.  Look for yourself.

https://sites.google.com/site/soccerrecruits/


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## LASTMAN14

mbeach said:


> I personally was surprised with LA Galaxy not getting a nod. I am probably biased, because I was only concerned with how well some of their teams play (I am familiar with their 05s/Diego Souza's last U10 team), and do not know anything about total number of teams, coaching licenses, etc. I was hoping that some posters with daughters in the current 05 elite team, and former players of DS, could chime in, to say whether it was a surprise, if they plan to move to other clubs, etc.  Thanks!


As a parent from LAGSB and whose daughters both play for DS 06's  and SD 05's; our club not getting the DA is not entirely a surprise, but in a way could be. Historically this club has been more of a boys program with a lot of success. When the club was SB Force it had some talent scattered through all the girls teams. It was not till MQ (now the boys director) put his stamp on the girls side. About 6-7 years ago he began working with the younger's and providing technical and tactical instruction which you can still see in the older girls with the club. With the merger with Exiles our girls program saw another new emergence. SD and DS came in wanting to further what MQ had begun. In just two years you can see their influence on the game our girls play from the 09's- 03's. However, without much success in the older's I am sure US Soccer favored other clubs. I do feel our club meets many of the other requirements, but the geographical piece also could have played a big role in Galaxy not getting the nod. At this time I have no desire to take my girls to DA club for many reasons that have been stated earlier throughout this thread. We have stayed with LAGSB because of the style of play, the technical and tactical training my girls have been exposed to. There are few coaches that instruct and play this style and it is one that I want my daughters to play. I believe for our family at this time it is the best kind of training.


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## Rev234

"Until any of those non-ECNL clubs can do more in these arenas it is really just a power grab that your club benefitted from. Are you really proud of that?"

This makes me chuckle.   Saw a recent post by an ecnl  coach saying how proud he and his club were of his "soccer daughters"   making odp.   4 of the 5 girls in the picture were just added to the club  2 weeks prior to the photo.   Everyone takes credit for someone else's work.


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## NoGoal

Is it me or does it seem that Legends, Beach and non-ECNL parents actually believe Girls DA was created for what is best for youth development.  Where as ECNL parents see it more as a power grab, including the parents who have DDs playing on a DA/ECNL club.


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## LASTMAN14

NoGoal said:


> Yes, you are baised, the South Bay area doesn't have enough talent for 2 GDA clubs.  You should be happy LA Galaxy/Carlsbad got the nod, instead of the LA Galaxy in the South Bay, because Beach wouldn't have.
> 
> 05, what is that 6th graders.  Half of those girls won't even be playing club in 3 years, yet alone at LA Galaxy when college recruiting rolls around.


I believe MBeach is not a Galaxy parent. So not sure they are biased at all. Long Beach is not considered the SB. LAGSB and Beach LB are not much different in distance than Slammers and Blues. So theoretically speaking why couldn't two non ECNL clubs that are 15 to 20 miles away not be added based upon solely on geographic's? There really is no true affiliation between LAGSB and LAGSD their separate relationships are more with LAG.

O5 players in fall will be both comprised of 6th and 5th graders.


NoGoal said:


> Is it me or does it seem that Legends, Beach and non-ECNL parents actually believe Girls DA was created for what is best for youth development.  Where as ECNL parents see it more as a power grab, including the parents who have DDs playing on a DA/ECNL club.


Unless US Soccer implements a curriculum that all DA clubs have to adhere to and be held accountable for, then yes it could appear that this is a power grab.


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## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Is it me or does it seem that Legends, Beach and non-ECNL parents actually believe Girls DA was created for what is best for youth development.  Where as ECNL parents see it more as a power grab, including the parents who have DDs playing on a DA/ECNL club.


Who better to know about a power grab than current ECNL parents?


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## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Who better to know about a power grab than current ECNL parents?


You can't be referring to me, because my DD plays for current GDA/ECNL club.

You must be reflecting back to when your DD played for Strikers and was the team captain.


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## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> In another thread the posters in the know were making lists of the clubs that would get DA. Guess what, the majority opinion was that all ECNL clubs would get DA (except for Blues, because they did not have enough girls to fund the new program), and maybe Legends. Fast forward and 50% of the teams that get DA are non ECNL, and Blues and Beach are among the first four chosen.  Of course, everything must be a money grab because the  posters in the know have much better judgment that the US Soccer Federation.


IDK what other ECNL parents were posting, I do recall when I posted in the old forum that for US Soccer to run a credible GDA league.  They would need to have the buy-in from Slammers, Blues, Surf, Dallas Texans, Crossfire, PDA and the other nationally recognized brand name clubs participating in ECNL.  What does GDA do....exactly that!

Imagine if GDA didn't have the buy-in of the clubs mentioned above and had a SoCal league with Legends, Beach, Carlsbad, LA Premier, FC GoldenState, Pateadores, and LA Galaxy South Bay.  No offense, but yikes that would have been CRL!


----------



## gkrent

NoGoal said:


> Is it me or does it seem that Legends, Beach and non-ECNL parents actually believe Girls DA was created for what is best for youth development.  Where as ECNL parents see it more as a power grab, including the parents who have DDs playing on a DA/ECNL club.


And some parents just see it as another layer of BS to navigate.   It will all come down to this:

1.  Is your kid a standout?  If yes, play DA, ECNL or a top 100 team.  How do you choose?

2.  Does your kid want to play high school?  Then not DA

3.  Is your kid YNT or in the pool?  Where does her YNT coaches recommend she play? Probably DA

4.  Does your kid want to play in college?  ECNL at least until recruited

5.  Does your kid have an opportunity to play for excellent coach she loves with excellent college/pro contacts?  Kid should play there no matter league.

6.  Does your kid want to rack up titles?  Play for top USYSA national league team.

7.  Which team is your kid geographically close to?  Play there.


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## Rev234

gkrent said:


> And some parents just see it as another layer of BS to navigate.   It will all come down to this:
> 
> 1.  Is your kid a standout?  If yes, play DA, ECNL or a top 100 team.  How do you choose?
> 
> 2.  Does your kid want to play high school?  Then not DA
> 
> 3.  Is your kid YNT or in the pool?  Where does her YNT coaches recommend she play? Probably DA
> 
> 4.  Does your kid want to play in college?  ECNL at least until recruited
> 
> 5.  Does your kid have an opportunity to play for excellent coach she loves with excellent college/pro contacts?  Kid should play there no matter league.
> 
> 6.  Does your kid want to rack up titles?  Play for top USYSA national league team.
> 
> 7.  Which team is your kid geographically close to?  Play there.


This is the best flow map I've ever seen .


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## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> You can't be referring to me, because my DD plays for current GDA/ECNL club.
> 
> You must be reflecting back to when your DD played for Strikers and was the team captain.


----------



## mbeach

MakeAPlay said:


> You clearly have a bias towards Beach which is okay.  They have a few good teams and several excellent coaches.  If you can't see that this truly has little to do with development and a lot to do with control then you really are seeing what you want to see  ...


Sure, it is a power grab, to improve the state of women soccer in this country. And all DA teams (ECNL and non ECNL) will benefit from it. It is a power grab because the previous top league, ECNL, has not done a good job at development (which is not its mission), as proven by the poor results of the younger teams in international competition in the last few years. US Soccer would  be negligent if they did not step in and try to fix the situation. Ultimately I trust more the judgment of the US Soccer Federation than yours (no personal attack here). Your argument that in the past ECNL had most of the top players is simply that, it does not imply that ECNL did a great job at development. The point of the US Soccer Federation is that those top players have not been properly developed (in ECNL clubs or elsewhere).    
I have a girl going to the US Soccer Training Center, and when the time comes, she most likely will not play HS soccer. Training at the majority of HS in SoCal is a joke, specially compared to club training. If she can choose between training year round at her club or skipping club training to play HS soccer, she will choose the former. Furthermore, if you read the DA application, you will see that DA clubs will  play their top girls in their DA teams. DA teams formed by B players is wishful thinking. 
Since the ECNL clubs have been, and will continue being so great, it is clear that they did not have to bolt to DA. You must then deeply disagree with what the leadership of the ECNL clubs has done. I am curious to know what you think about that, why did the ECNL clubs applied en mass to DA. I am curious to know why you think you have better judgement not only than US Soccer, but also than the ECNL clubs.


----------



## ECNL

ECNL does not "develop" soccer players.  The clubs and coaches who work with the teams develop the players.  ECNL runs the league.  So, if the girls are not being properly developed it would be the fault of the clubs/coaches.  What is US soccer communicating to its customers when they pick the same clubs/coaches with no guidelines (other than a new league) or curriculum?  It has nothing to do with development.


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## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> Sure, it is a power grab, to improve the state of women soccer in this country. And all DA teams (ECNL and non ECNL) will benefit from it. It is a power grab because the previous top league, ECNL, has not done a good job at development (which is not its mission), as proven by the poor results of the younger teams in international competition in the last few years. US Soccer would  be negligent if they did not step in and try to fix the situation. Ultimately I trust more the judgment of the US Soccer Federation than yours (no personal attack here). Your argument that in the past ECNL had most of the top players is simply that, it does not imply that ECNL did a great job at development. The point of the US Soccer Federation is that those top players have not been properly developed (in ECNL clubs or elsewhere).
> I have a girl going to the US Soccer Training Center, and when the time comes, she most likely will not play HS soccer. Training at the majority of HS in SoCal is a joke, specially compared to club training. If she can choose between training year round at her club or skipping club training to play HS soccer, she will choose the former. Furthermore, if you read the DA application, you will see that DA clubs will  play their top girls in their DA teams. DA teams formed by B players is wishful thinking.
> Since the ECNL clubs have been, and will continue being so great, it is clear that they did not have to bolt to DA. You must then deeply disagree with what the leadership of the ECNL clubs has done. I am curious to know what you think about that, why did the ECNL clubs applied en mass to DA. I am curious to know why you think you have better judgement not only than US Soccer, but also than the ECNL clubs.


So your DD attends US Soccer training center and from that you already know your DD doesn't want to play HS soccer.  Seriously? I can tell you there are a ton of posters who's DDs have also attended US Training Centers and went on to play HS soccer.

Every parent knows HS soccer for the most part is crap, but that is okay.  This is why my DD LOVES HS Soccer.   She can play with and for her HS friends and school pride.   All of her friends finally get an opportunity to see her play, cheering for the team and for her.  It's her Sr year and I asked if she is playing HS soccer this year.  She said, of course...I want and look forward to playing HS Soccer and yes she knows the level of play is 2 or 3 steps below her club team.

Lastly, you do know Mallory Pugh and the current WNT players played for their HS soccer team right.  If you trust US Soccer, obviously those girls turned out okay since they are on the US WNT.


----------



## Justafan

CaliKlines said:


> Depending on the program needs + the number of graduating seniors and transfers, I'd say the average is 6-8 players per program per year. Here is the recruit list. If you go to the "By College" tab, you will see how many players are in the 2016 class, which is 99.99% done.
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IbB3V_l4dzMu1PnuLIjX9bJyT9r9zn2voE_qefyFYko/htmlembed?widget=false#



Thanks Cali.  On another note, the first thing that struck me with the DA is that there are still going to be plenty of talented girls left over for ECNL.  The SoCal DA teams will have approximately 600 players (8 clubs X 3 teams X 25 players per team). ECNL currently has a total of 1,000 players (8 clubs x 5 teams x 25 players/team).   So theoretically, DA will take the top 60%, or players 1-15.  That leaves players 16-25, and if some of the top 15 don't go DA, ECNL should still be a solid option.


----------



## ajaxahi

mbeach said:


> I personally was surprised with LA Galaxy not getting a nod. I am probably biased, because I was only concerned with how well some of their teams play (I am familiar with their 05s/Diego Souza's last U10 team), and do not know anything about total number of teams, coaching licenses, etc. I was hoping that some posters with daughters in the current 05 elite team, and former players of DS, could chime in, to say whether it was a surprise, if they plan to move to other clubs, etc.  Thanks!


My daughter plays for LAGSB 05. Although there was some hope early on that LAGSB would get DA because of the club's DA status on the boy's side, I wouldn't say I was surprised LAGSB didn't get it.  The admission criteria seem to emphasize success at the olders and I don't know if Galaxy SB has the track record yet on the girls side. SD and DS and their staff are doing an outstanding  job with the youngers at LAGSB and hopefully this will carry forward to older teams in the future, but that will ultimately hinge on their ability to keep the talent they developed from jumping ship. 

As far as whether we plan to move to another club, I don't think this changes anything for us. I have no idea yet if DA will be the right thing for my kid.  So far our decisions on where to play are year to year, based more on finding the right coach and mix of players that would be best for our daughter's soccer development, instead of basing it on the club. Right now there is nobody out there developing technical players with high soccer IQs better than SD and DS at Galaxy SB, so we are very happy where we are.  I would say that if US Soccer is really serious about changing things on the women's side and developing more technical players, they should keep LAGSB on their radar because they are doing things there that no other club is doing. But with the DA selections it recently announced, it seems to be sticking more to the status quo.

I also want to address NoGoal's comment that the South Bay doesn't have enough talent for two GDA teams. That's just wrong. Let's not forget about a little city of 4 million people just to the north called Los Angeles, a hotbed of soccer talent that is totally underserved by club soccer.  The talent in LA (that has the means) has to travel somewhere and many make their way to the South Bay to play. Our family lives in the middle of LA and LAGSB has worked for us because their territory up near LAX isn't such a bad hike. If DA is limited to Long Beach (Beach) or Pasadena (LA Premier), that would make the logistics of travel very difficult for many LA families like us, and possibly exclude a ton of talent from the DA system.


----------



## CaliKlines

CaliKlines said:


> Who better to know about a power grab than current ECNL parents?





NoGoal said:


> You can't be referring to me, because my DD plays for current GDA/ECNL club.
> 
> You must be reflecting back to when your DD played for Strikers and was the team captain.


Riddle me this....what organization did the first power grab, and messed it all up? Let me give you a hint: LENC

I guarantee you that none of the accepted DA clubs will provide the poorly managed and screwed up ECNL experience of my daughter. Thankfully, as a group, the DA clubs are much more organized and better managed as the ECNL clubs, as a group.


----------



## CaliKlines

Justafan said:


> Thanks Cali.  On another note, the first thing that struck me with the DA is that there are still going to be plenty of talented girls left over for ECNL.  The SoCal DA teams will have approximately 600 players (8 clubs X 3 teams X 25 players per team). ECNL currently has a total of 1,000 players (8 clubs x 5 teams x 25 players/team).   So theoretically, DA will take the top 60%, or players 1-15.  That leaves players 16-25, and if some of the top 15 don't go DA, ECNL should still be a solid option.


Absolutely...just as a USYS National League team provides some very solid options as well. I would also say that there are some ECNL programs that most definitely are NOT a solid option.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Absolutely...just as a USYS National League team provides some very solid options as well. I would also say that there are some ECNL programs that most definitely are NOT a solid option.


You have to let go of the Strikers experience.  Maybe you should have tried WCFC, Blues, or Slammers in the OC and got that poor Strikers club experience behind you.  ECNL was not the cause for a poor Strikers club experience, it was Strikers and only Strikers.

I never blamed ECNL when my DD wasn't called up to the Blues U14 ECNL team 4 years ago or when she ended up being a dual carded Blues player at U15.  ECNL had no involvment in the Blues coaching decisions.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Riddle me this....what organization did the first power grab, and messed it all up? Let me give you a hint: LENC
> 
> I guarantee you that none of the accepted DA clubs will provide the poorly managed and screwed up ECNL experience of my daughter. Thankfully, as a group, the DA clubs are much more organized and better managed as the ECNL clubs, as a group.


What did LENC mess up? In some alternate universe.  ECNL was never created, CSL Premier is still the #1 league in the nation.  USYS National Championship is still the undisputed champion and Legends would still be without a USYS National Championship (competing against the best clubs nationally).  Legends never grew to the mega club they are today, because CSL would have capped them at 3 teams per age group.  GDA is never formed.

But because of ECNL, Legends didn't have to compete with the best clubs nationally for USYS Championship titles.  SCDSL was created, Legends grew to the size they are today and after many years of being denied ECNL status.  US Soccer has created GDA and with 4 USYS Championships under their belt, gained approval into the league.  So I would say, ECNL didn't mess up anything for Legends.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Rev234 said:


> "Until any of those non-ECNL clubs can do more in these arenas it is really just a power grab that your club benefitted from. Are you really proud of that?"
> 
> This makes me chuckle.   Saw a recent post by an ecnl  coach saying how proud he and his club were of his "soccer daughters"   making odp.   4 of the 5 girls in the picture were just added to the club  2 weeks prior to the photo.   Everyone takes credit for someone else's work.


I can only speak of my players situation and all of her development occurred under ECNL coaches in ECNL clubs and she is in college now with a great scholarship and is a YNT pool player.  Her YNT pool is about 85% ECNL players.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I can only speak of my players situation and all of her development occurred under ECNL coaches in ECNL clubs and she is in college now with a great scholarship and is a YNT pool player.  Her YNT pool is about 85% ECNL players.


And if US Soccer was so dissatisfied with the players developed by ECNL clubs.  Why do they have so many of the ECNL players in their YNT pool and team?    They could have had more non-ECNL players, but that isn't the case.


----------



## MakeAPlay

mbeach said:


> Sure, it is a power grab, to improve the state of women soccer in this country. And all DA teams (ECNL and non ECNL) will benefit from it. It is a power grab because the previous top league, ECNL, has not done a good job at development (which is not its mission), as proven by the poor results of the younger teams in international competition in the last few years. US Soccer would  be negligent if they did not step in and try to fix the situation. Ultimately I trust more the judgment of the US Soccer Federation than yours (no personal attack here). Your argument that in the past ECNL had most of the top players is simply that, it does not imply that ECNL did a great job at development. The point of the US Soccer Federation is that those top players have not been properly developed (in ECNL clubs or elsewhere).
> I have a girl going to the US Soccer Training Center, and when the time comes, she most likely will not play HS soccer. Training at the majority of HS in SoCal is a joke, specially compared to club training. If she can choose between training year round at her club or skipping club training to play HS soccer, she will choose the former. Furthermore, if you read the DA application, you will see that DA clubs will  play their top girls in their DA teams. DA teams formed by B players is wishful thinking.
> Since the ECNL clubs have been, and will continue being so great, it is clear that they did not have to bolt to DA. You must then deeply disagree with what the leadership of the ECNL clubs has done. I am curious to know what you think about that, why did the ECNL clubs applied en mass to DA. I am curious to know why you think you have better judgement not only than US Soccer, but also than the ECNL clubs.



They are picking mostly the same ECNL clubs other than the NWSL clubs, some clubs that have coaches/DOC's that are national team coaches/scouts and a couple clubs that have won USYS championships since the ECNL teams stopped competing in the USYS championship.  Please post one of the accepted clubs that doesn't fit those descriptions.

Regarding HS soccer, of course it is a joke.  That doesn't mean the girls don't want to play.  My player was MVP of her high school team and first team all league as a freshman.  That doesn't mean that she didn't enjoy it.  Even Mallory Pugh played HS and she is about as far along as any player in the last two decades of women's soccer.  Every single truly elite player in my daughter's SoCal grad class and her recruiting class played high school soccer and it was one of the best classes in the country.  Don't be surprised if your daughter changes her mind about high school especially when she realizes how much better she is than the rank and file player.  All of a sudden school pride matters when her friends grind her about playing.  Peer pressure is much more significant than parental pressure trust me on that one.

Finally regarding the leadership of the ECNL and their position.  Once it became clear to them that the DA was going to happen of course they applied.  They clearly weren't happy about being forced into the situation but what are you going to do when your federation decides that they are going to push forward without input from the top clubs on the front lines?  Clearly they are going to adapt to the new situation.  At the end of the day it will be the same coaches doing the same things and if you can't see that then there is no point arguing it any further.  You have a dog in this fight and I can understand it being hard to have perspective as it would have likely been hard for me if I had a ULittle at this time.  The last time a big soccer schism happened I stuck with a good coach and a club with a solid record of developing college and national team players and it worked out.  I hope it works out for you and yours whatever path you choose.


----------



## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> You have to let go of the Strikers experience.  Maybe you should have tried WCFC, Blues, or Slammers in the OC and got that poor Strikers club experience behind you.  ECNL was not the cause for a poor Strikers club experience, it was Strikers and only Strikers.


NG - u know that ain't gonna happen. My boy Cali's scarred....for life.


----------



## tenacious

Rev234 said:


> "Until any of those non-ECNL clubs can do more in these arenas it is really just a power grab that your club benefitted from. Are you really proud of that?"
> 
> This makes me chuckle.   Saw a recent post by an ecnl  coach saying how proud he and his club were of his "soccer daughters"   making odp.   4 of the 5 girls in the picture were just added to the club  2 weeks prior to the photo.   Everyone takes credit for someone else's work.


Yes there are a lot of shameless characters in youth soccer.  But in terms of the bigger picture there is another truth the picture is pointing to also.  And thats that there aren't enough good players out there- and recruiting is a big part of the game.  At least at my dd's RSC team, fielding a team with a quality roster took a lot of work.  Yes there was a market for parents of so-so players chasing the dream of college ball, but even with just ECNL it could be tough to find quality players.

And while it's nice to think the DA's new league will start churning out star players with their superior training, I'd say it's more likely what you'll see is the DA try and recruit their way to the top, and a lot of lower talented players get brought into the sport to round out the rosters.  So while I like that US soccer is getting more involved.  I just question the wisdom of creating a new league in a sport that seems already over saturated with different leagues, and just putting up another fence that was keeping the top players apart.


----------



## tenacious

Zerodenero said:


> NG - u know that ain't gonna happen. My boy Cali's scarred....for life.


Cali's a good egg!  His kid is going to play in the ACC, really doesn't get much better then that.


----------



## NoGoal

tenacious said:


> Cali's a good egg!  His kid is going to play in the ACC, really doesn't get much better then that.


Got to love Cali's passion for Legends.  Josh really sunk his claws into him


----------



## tenacious

gkrent said:


> And some parents just see it as another layer of BS to navigate.   It will all come down to this:
> 
> 1.  Is your kid a standout?  If yes, play DA, ECNL or a top 100 team.  How do you choose?
> 
> 2.  Does your kid want to play high school?  Then not DA
> 
> 3.  Is your kid YNT or in the pool?  Where does her YNT coaches recommend she play? Probably DA
> 
> 4.  Does your kid want to play in college?  ECNL at least until recruited
> 
> 5.  Does your kid have an opportunity to play for excellent coach she loves with excellent college/pro contacts?  Kid should play there no matter league.
> 
> 6.  Does your kid want to rack up titles?  Play for top USYSA national league team.
> 
> 7.  Which team is your kid geographically close to?  Play there.


I agree with most of this except the part about this is play ECNL until recruited.  Little Susie Cheesecake gets recruited and then the college coach is going to be okay with her just dropping down to the B team for the next couple years til she goes to college?  I'm not sure that's really how it works...


----------



## gkrent

tenacious said:


> I agree with most of this except the part about this is play ECNL until recruited.  Little Susie Cheesecake gets recruited and then the college coach is going to be okay with her just dropping down to the B team for the next couple years til she goes to college?  I'm not sure that's really how it works...


It's working fine for my kid.  Wouldn't call her current team the B team though, just not ECNL.


----------



## Zerodenero

tenacious said:


> Cali's a good egg!  His kid is going to play in the ACC, really doesn't get much better then that.


Agreed. However, I must say theres a "Striking" resemblance between NCState's results in the ACC & Strikers in the ECNL.....quite a coinkydink.

May the past not be a prediction of the future.


----------



## mbeach

NoGoal said:


> Christian Pulisic who has dual-citizenship.....knew he had to go to Europe,  so he could continue developing his game at one of the best mens club (Dortmund) and compete against the Elite Euro players.  Follow closely now will yeah.


You won me over with this argument. Pulisic, choosing to go to that barren club in the fifth division of the Republic of Tubebistan, instead of staying put in an American BDA, is a clear indictment on the US Soccer Federation. God forbid had he gone to the Barcelona or Real Madrid academies, that would have been a clear proof of the incompetence of the US government.  
I think that you are uncovering a general principle here, one that can be used for example to establish the incompetence of the California Board of Education:  my neighbor Joe Tudin got accepted into CSULB, but had to go to Harvard to obtain his BS. CBoE, you suck, you forced little Joey out of California!
Now, I must confess that I did not understand the comment about his dual citizenship. Was that a curveball, or maybe a hidden reference to the location of the Holy Grail?


----------



## mbeach

MakeAPlay said:


> They are picking mostly the same ECNL clubs other than the NWSL clubs, some clubs that have coaches/DOC's that are national team coaches/scouts and a couple clubs that have won USYS championships since the ECNL teams stopped competing in the USYS championship.  Please post one of the accepted clubs that doesn't fit those descriptions.


There are many objective reasons for me to welcome the DA development: for example the training load is doubled, there will be real pressure on the clubs to do things well, and I am not forced to drive  50x2 minutes everyday if I want my daughter to play in the top league. Everybody in this forum has a dog on the fight, but as long as the comments remain civil it stays a pleasurable read, and everybody can analyze and decide what is right/wrong for them.


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> You won me over with this argument. Pulisic, choosing to go to that barren club in the fifth division of the Republic of Tubebistan, instead of staying put in an American BDA, is a clear indictment on the US Soccer Federation. God forbid had he gone to the Barcelona or Real Madrid academies, that would have been a clear proof of the incompetence of the US government.
> I think that you are uncovering a general principle here, one that can be used for example to establish the incompetence of the California Board of Education:  my neighbor Joe Tudin got accepted into CSULB, but had to go to Harvard to obtain his BS. CBoE, you suck, you forced little Joey out of California!
> Now, I must confess that I did not understand the comment about his dual citizenship. Was that a curveball, or maybe a hidden reference to the location of the Holy Grail?


5th division? Borussia Dortmund plays in the Bundesliga and has qualified for the Champions League 5 out of the last 6 years. In case you didn't know what country the Bundesliga is played in.......it's Germany!

Dual-European citizenship affords a player between the age of 16-18 to play overseas. Pulisic was 16 when he signed with Dortmund. Dual-citzenship allowed him to fulfill #2B of article 19. http://www.espnfc.us/blog/fifa/243/post/2786732/fifa-transfer-regulations-article-19
So in a way, it is a road map to the holy grail, which is being able to further develop his game under the guidance at a top European soccer club, instead of remaining stagnant playing BDA for a MLS academy.


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> There are many objective reasons for me to welcome the DA development: for example the training load is doubled, there will be real pressure on the clubs to do things well, and I am not forced to drive  50x2 minutes everyday if I want my daughter to play in the top league. Everybody in this forum has a dog on the fight, but as long as the comments remain civil it stays a pleasurable read, and everybody can analyze and decide what is right/wrong for them.


Dog in the fight? Maybe for ulittle parents.  Your a Beach FC parent and why you posted, CRL and National Cup are a viable option for Beach FC's B teams.  Is this the sales pitch the club is serving the Beach FC parents?  When in truth, ECNL is a better path for college exposure through their showcases compared to CRL and National Cup. 

BTW, clubs with DA/ECNL status and DD's verbally committed don't have a dog in this fight.


----------



## NoGoal

Zerodenero said:


> Agreed. However, I must say theres a "Striking" resemblance between NCState's results in the ACC & Strikers in the ECNL.....quite a coinkydink.
> 
> May the past not be a prediction of the future.


OMG, you went there


----------



## mbeach

NoGoal said:


> 5th division? Borussia Dortmund plays in the Bundesliga and has qualified for the Champions League 5 out of the last 6 years. In case you didn't know what country the Bundesliga is played in.......it's Germany!
> 
> Dual-European citizenship affords a player between the age of 16-18 to play overseas. Pulisic was 16 when he signed with Dortmund. Dual-citzenship allowed him to fulfill #2B of article 19. http://www.espnfc.us/blog/fifa/243/post/2786732/fifa-transfer-regulations-article-19
> So in a way, it is a road map to the holy grail, which is being able to further develop his game under the guidance at a top European soccer club, instead of remaining stagnant playing BDA for a MLS academy.


Very funny! Great reply to post #378


----------



## Soccer18

TD1 said:


> I never thought RSC girls side ever fully recovered after Scott Murray left.  Always thought as a human being he was kinda a jerk, but when he left the club has been in slow decline.


You're an idiot.


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> Very funny! Great reply to post #378


At first I thought maybe you were a Bayern Munich fan and was posting crap on Dortmund, because of their rivalry.


----------



## Harrypotter03

A question I have and it may seem silly to those that have more knowledge than me, and that's why we use this forum, but won't the DA have college exposure too? Perhaps not as much as ECNL offers but I know for me, who has a child playing at a recent DA accepted club, and is she's an impact player,  college is far more important than recruiting to the NWSL. Any thoughts or knowledge regarding college and DA ?


----------



## CaliKlines

Harrypotter03 said:


> A question I have and it may seem silly to those that have more knowledge than me, and that's why we use this forum, but won't the DA have college exposure too? Perhaps not as much as ECNL offers but I know for me, who has a child playing at a recent DA accepted club, and is she's an impact player,  college is far more important than recruiting to the NWSL. Any thoughts or knowledge regarding college and DA ?


In all likelihood, the girls DA will have more exposure to college coaches than the ECNL. The pro-ECNL crowd tries to espouse the ECNL as the greatest league ever. (Far from it.) Eventually, a greater percentage of players in the girls DA will be committed to college programs than girls in the ECNL. Plain and simple. It might be to a cellar dweller in the toughest women's soccer conference in the country, or it could be somewhere else. But the DA girls will have their choice of schools, whereas the ECNL players will be getting whatever is leftover.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> In all likelihood, the girls DA will have more exposure to college coaches than the ECNL. The pro-ECNL crowd tries to espouse the ECNL as the greatest league ever. (Far from it.) Eventually, A greater percentage of players in the girls DA will be committed to college programs than girls in the ECNL. Plain and simple. It might be to a cellar dweller in the toughest women's soccer conference in the country, or it could be somewhere else. But the DA girls will have their choice of schools, whereas the ECNL players will be getting whatever is leftover.


Cali I like your passion but this statement is blatantly untrue.  The players with accolades will always get recruited over players without them regardless of the league that they play in and that will never change.  The GDA has no track record and no format in writing so how can you make this statement?

I'm sorry that your daughter had such a bad experience with ECNL but making up lies to sway people is very Trumpish.  Most people had a good experience with it.  Maybe your daughter should have tried out for Blues, WCFC, Slammers or Surf.  I bet she would have had a better experience.  Maybe if she had gotten a YNT call up while with the Strikers you would have a different opinion.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

CaliKlines said:


> In all likelihood, the girls DA will have more exposure to college coaches than the ECNL. The pro-ECNL crowd tries to espouse the ECNL as the greatest league ever. (Far from it.) Eventually, A greater percentage of players in the girls DA will be committed to college programs than girls in the ECNL. Plain and simple. It might be to a cellar dweller in the toughest women's soccer conference in the country, or it could be somewhere else. But the DA girls will have their choice of schools, whereas the ECNL players will be getting whatever is leftover.


Bold statement from a person that backs a league that has not produced results with the boys.  That also doesn't acknowledge the importance of high school sports to girls.  That also doesn't understand they actually is a difference between boys and girls.  

In theory one magic expect GDA to make over but I say there are two many variables to really say.  Let's see what happens and who actually jumps.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

devupa2.0 said:


> I really disagree with this part of your comment.
> 
> I enjoy watching soccer in general. However, I really enjoy watching good women's soccer as compared to other women's sports. I think the level of competitive fire and skill that has been developed in women's soccer really makes for good viewing. In some technical ways I also think that the best women in the US are playing BETTER soccer than the men. More connections, more passing back and switching the field to take advantage of numbers, more creativity in the attack, more use of the goal keeper as a field player. There is a lot to be said for the quality of their play and seeing raw ratings as high as we have seen is significant.
> 
> However, I think there is an even more important factor that will continue to increase the popularity in the women's game. Young girls playing soccer now have the ability to watch their idols play the sport they love at the highest level of the game, on tv and in person, and they are WOMEN! My daughter doesn't have to watch men playing the game to see perfect examples of technique and willpower. She has tons of examples of phenomenal female players that are getting publicity and being hailed as excellent athletes.
> 
> The more that these top women are showcased and our young girls are able to see that, then the more the growth will feed on itself. Softball, volleyball, even basketball haven't seen that kind of stardom and focus on the women's side. I don't ever remember being able to sit in a bar and have hundreds of people cheering for a women's sporting event quite the way we've seen for women's soccer in the last few years. Possibly for some Olympic events, but even then I'm not sure.
> 
> And it has crossed over to some folks that don't really even follow soccer. The success of the women's national team has put soccer on the radar screen for many parents that might not have considered soccer as an option for their daughters. This will only grow the momentum.
> 
> I know Ronaldo's looks have helped his marketability. I'm sure Hope Solo's looks help her too. However, I know a ton of people that are interested in watching both men and women play good soccer. It's the good soccer part that attracts the viewers. If they are playing the game at the highest level, then I don't think their looks will matter that much. Messi isn't the best looking kid around, but a ton of people want to see him play because he is incredible.
> 
> As long as our top women continue playing excellent soccer and doing well on the international scene, it will help feed the dreams of DD's around the nation - that will only grow the sport and its ratings.



Abbey Wambach net worth - 4 million
Mia Hamm net worth - 10 million
alex morgan net worth - 3 million

Ann Kournikova net worth - 50 million
Venus Williams net worth - 75 million
Chris Everett - 32.5 million


----------



## eastbaysoccer

devupa2.0 said:


> I really disagree with this part of your comment.
> 
> I enjoy watching soccer in general. However, I really enjoy watching good women's soccer as compared to other women's sports. I think the level of competitive fire and skill that has been developed in women's soccer really makes for good viewing. In some technical ways I also think that the best women in the US are playing BETTER soccer than the men. More connections, more passing back and switching the field to take advantage of numbers, more creativity in the attack, more use of the goal keeper as a field player. There is a lot to be said for the quality of their play and seeing raw ratings as high as we have seen is significant.
> 
> However, I think there is an even more important factor that will continue to increase the popularity in the women's game. Young girls playing soccer now have the ability to watch their idols play the sport they love at the highest level of the game, on tv and in person, and they are WOMEN! My daughter doesn't have to watch men playing the game to see perfect examples of technique and willpower. She has tons of examples of phenomenal female players that are getting publicity and being hailed as excellent athletes.
> 
> The more that these top women are showcased and our young girls are able to see that, then the more the growth will feed on itself. Softball, volleyball, even basketball haven't seen that kind of stardom and focus on the women's side. I don't ever remember being able to sit in a bar and have hundreds of people cheering for a women's sporting event quite the way we've seen for women's soccer in the last few years. Possibly for some Olympic events, but even then I'm not sure.
> 
> And it has crossed over to some folks that don't really even follow soccer. The success of the women's national team has put soccer on the radar screen for many parents that might not have considered soccer as an option for their daughters. This will only grow the momentum.
> 
> I know Ronaldo's looks have helped his marketability. I'm sure Hope Solo's looks help her too. However, I know a ton of people that are interested in watching both men and women play good soccer. It's the good soccer part that attracts the viewers. If they are playing the game at the highest level, then I don't think their looks will matter that much. Messi isn't the best looking kid around, but a ton of people want to see him play because he is incredible.
> 
> As long as our top women continue playing excellent soccer and doing well on the international scene, it will help feed the dreams of DD's around the nation - that will only grow the sport and its ratings.


Disagree.  For women the audience is interested in hot looking players that win.


----------



## NoGoal

eastbaysoccer said:


> Abbey Wambach net worth - 4 million
> Mia Hamm net worth - 10 million
> alex morgan net worth - 3 million
> 
> Ann Kournikova net worth - 50 million
> Venus Williams net worth - 75 million
> Chris Everett - 32.5 million


Maria Sharapova -195 million
Serena Williams - 160 million
Annika Sorenstam - 40 million
Marta - 13 million, US WNT players are no where near Marta!

Kerri Walsh and Misty May Treanor volleyball and Amanda Beard (swimming) all have the same net worth as Abby Wambach at 4 million.

Gabby Douglas (gymnastics) 20 yrs old has the same net worth as Alex Morgan! 

Allyson Felix net worth running track is 8.5 million!


----------



## timbuck

I wonder what the net worth is of the woman that keeps popping up on the ad for "Date a Rich Woman".


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> Cali I like your passion but this statement is blatantly untrue.  The players with accolades will always get recruited over players without them regardless of the league that they play in and that will never change.


Please show me where I said anything to the contrary? I have never indicated that players without accolades will get recruited over girls with accolades. It is my contention that the girls with the accolades will be playing in the DA. Blues, Surf, Slammers, and Eagles have committed to putting their best players on their DA teams, as have Beach, Legends FC, Galaxy SD, and LA Premier. Those clubs usually produce players with some very strong pedigrees. Concur? So if the players with the accolades are playing in the DA, then where are the college coaches going to recruit? Won't the coaches recruit from the strongest league with the strongest players?



MakeAPlay said:


> I'm sorry that your daughter had such a bad experience with ECNL but making up lies to sway people is very Trumpish.  Most people had a good experience with it.  Maybe your daughter should have tried out for Blues, WCFC, Slammers or Surf.  I bet she would have had a better experience.  Maybe if she had gotten a YNT call up while with the Strikers you would have a different opinion.


We had a great experience with Strikers. Met some wonderful players and families, but unfortunately, something was missing on the pitch. I take umbrage at the oft-repeated notion that "the ECNL is the best place to have your player." That is the Trumpish lie designed to sway people away from high performing, non-ECNL clubs like Beach, LA Galaxy (north and south), Albion, and of course, the 4x national champions, Legends FC. Strikers is "the ECNL". Correct? So when you say how great the ECNL is, aren't you referring to Strikers? And Arsenal? And RSC? As well as NC Fusion, Santa Rosa United, Utah Avalanche, FC Boston, and even the ECNL President's FC Wisconsin Eclipse? Give me a break...my kid would never be where she is today if she had stayed in "the ECNL". And she won't be riding the pine in the rain when she gets to the next level either.


----------



## ECNL

CaliKlines said:


> Give me a break...my kid would never be where she is today if she had stayed in "the ECNL". And she won't be riding the pine in the rain when she gets to the next level either.


I not sure I agree with your first sentence.  Good luck to your DD and her education.

NC State Women's Soccer
2015 - 4-wins-15 -losses
2014 - 2-wins-15-losses
2013 - 7 wins - 12 - losses
2012 - 5 wins - 14 losses


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:
			
		

> Give me a break...my kid would never be where she is today if she had stayed in "the ECNL". And she won't be riding the pine in the rain when she gets to the next level either.


IMO, If your DD played on a top half ECNL SoCal club.   She would have been recruited either way.  I've seen players without any individual accolades who only played ECNL and suprised at the university they committed to (positive surprise of course).


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> IMO, If your DD played on a top half ECNL SoCal club.   She would have been recruited either way.  I've seen players without any individual accolades who only played ECNL and suprised at the university they committed to (positive surprise of course).


Maybe, but who knows? The reality is that she was recruited and committed to the school of her choice without any assistance from the ECNL. Maybe in the future, you should just call it "the EC".


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Maybe, but who knows? The reality is that she was recruited and committed to the school of her choice without any assistance from the ECNL. Maybe in the future, you should just call it "the EC".


As long as your DD committed to the school she feel in love with.  That's all that matters!


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Please show me where I said anything to the contrary? I have never indicated that players without accolades will get recruited over girls with accolades. It is my contention that the girls with the accolades will be playing in the DA. Blues, Surf, Slammers, and Eagles have committed to putting their best players on their DA teams, as have Beach, Legends FC, Galaxy SD, and LA Premier. Those clubs usually produce players with some very strong pedigrees. Concur? So if the players with the accolades are playing in the DA, then where are the college coaches going to recruit? Won't the coaches recruit from the strongest league with the strongest players?
> 
> 
> 
> We had a great experience with Strikers. Met some wonderful players and families, but unfortunately, something was missing on the pitch. I take umbrage at the oft-repeated notion that "the ECNL is the best place to have your player." That is the Trumpish lie designed to sway people away from high performing, non-ECNL clubs like Beach, LA Galaxy (north and south), Albion, and of course, the 4x national champions, Legends FC. Strikers is "the ECNL". Correct? So when you say how great the ECNL is, aren't you referring to Strikers? And Arsenal? And RSC? As well as NC Fusion, Santa Rosa United, Utah Avalanche, FC Boston, and even the ECNL President's FC Wisconsin Eclipse? Give me a break...my kid would never be where she is today if she had stayed in "the ECNL". And she won't be riding the pine in the rain when she gets to the next level either.



Okay let me try to respond in order.  First, the girls with accolades will play where the families choose to play which initially likely will not be the DA for many of the committed players.   I like that you say that the clubs have committed to putting players somewhere when the families of the players will be making that decision not the clubs.  Second, not one of those non-ECNL clubs that you mentioned has a better record of producing national team and/or college players than ANY of the ECNL clubs in SoCal.  Regarding where your kid would be that is your judgement as I don't know your kid.  Kinda weird that you mentioned riding the pine.  I can assure you my player won't be riding the pine this year and I won't get into where but it is a top program.  I repeat that the coaches will recruit the players with accolades first and foremost.

Sorry about your experience with Strikers.  They seem to have plenty of strong players going to good schools.  You mention the 4X USYS national championship Legends club.  How many of those titles came prior to the ECNL clubs pulling out of the USYS championships?  We all know that the number is a big fat zero.  That is the same for Beach and Albion, LA Premier and Galaxy have yet to win a title in the watered down USYS so what does that say about their worthiness?  We won't even mention the NWSL teams because they are just complicit beneficiaries of the power grab and aren't expected to have actually done anything.


----------



## Zerodenero

MakeAPlay said:


> Okay let me try to respond in order.  First, the girls with accolades will play where the families choose to play which initially likely will not be the DA for many of the committed players.   I like that you say that the clubs have committed to putting players somewhere when the families of the players will be making that decision not the clubs.  Second, not one of those non-ECNL clubs that you mentioned has a better record of producing national team and/or college players than ANY of the ECNL clubs in SoCal.  Regarding where your kid would be that is your judgement as I don't know your kid.  Kinda weird that you mentioned riding the pine.  I can assure you my player won't be riding the pine this year and I won't get into where but it is a top program.  I repeat that the coaches will recruit the players with accolades first and foremost.
> 
> Sorry about your experience with Strikers.  They seem to have plenty of strong players going to good schools.  You mention the 4X USYS national championship Legends club.  How many of those titles came prior to the ECNL clubs pulling out of the USYS championships?  We all know that the number is a big fat zero.  That is the same for Beach and Albion, LA Premier and Galaxy have yet to win a title in the watered down USYS so what does that say about their worthiness?  We won't even mention the NWSL teams because they are just complicit beneficiaries of the power grab and aren't expected to have actually done anything.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> Okay let me try to respond in order.  First, the girls with accolades will play where the families choose to play which initially likely will not be the DA for many of the committed players.   I like that you say that the clubs have committed to putting players somewhere when the families of the players will be making that decision not the clubs.  Second, not one of those non-ECNL clubs that you mentioned has a better record of producing national team and/or college players than ANY of the ECNL clubs in SoCal.  Regarding where your kid would be that is your judgement as I don't know your kid.  Kinda weird that you mentioned riding the pine.  I can assure you my player won't be riding the pine this year and I won't get into where but it is a top program.  I repeat that the coaches will recruit the players with accolades first and foremost.
> 
> Sorry about your experience with Strikers.  They seem to have plenty of strong players going to good schools.  You mention the 4X USYS national championship Legends club.  How many of those titles came prior to the ECNL clubs pulling out of the USYS championships?  We all know that the number is a big fat zero.  That is the same for Beach and Albion, LA Premier and Galaxy have yet to win a title in the watered down USYS so what does that say about their worthiness?  We won't even mention the NWSL teams because they are just complicit beneficiaries of the power grab and aren't expected to have actually done anything.


Say what you want, but the top league will be the DA.  All clubs of interest (ECNL or not) are kissing US Soccer ass right now, the ones that got in and the ones that didn't.  There are a couple of VERY DESPERATE clubs in SoCal still trying to get in, and they wear the patch.  

Take out Blues, Slammers, and Surf, and nobody else in SoCal ECNL contributes to your USYNT argument.

I imagine your daughter as fast, either to get on the end of a long ball up front, or to run everything down in the back.  I hope she is on the U20 WC roster along with the other NON-ECNL High School seniors.  If not, then this is precisely why US Soccer is wanting to influence development, so a great athlete like your daughter reaches her full potential in the future.  

FYI--Legends was winning State National Cups prior to ECNL.  Excluding them just eliminated the competition.  Beach is a much younger club.  Both contributing to the national team programs in a healthy way, and at a better rate than most SoCal ECNL teams.


----------



## CaliKlines

Swoosh said:


> Say what you want, but the top league will be the DA.  All clubs of interest (ECNL or not) are kissing US Soccer ass right now, the ones that got in and the ones that didn't.  There are a couple of VERY DESPERATE clubs in SoCal still trying to get in, and they wear the patch.
> 
> Take out Blues, Slammers, and Surf, and nobody else in SoCal ECNL contributes to your USYNT argument.
> 
> I imagine your daughter as fast, either to get on the end of a long ball up front, or to run everything down in the back.  I hope she is on the U20 WC roster along with the other NON-ECNL High School seniors.  If not, then this is precisely why US Soccer is wanting to influence development, so a great athlete like your daughter reaches her full potential in the future.
> 
> FYI--Legends was winning State National Cups prior to ECNL.  Excluding them just eliminated the competition.  Beach is a much younger club.  Both contributing to the national team programs in a healthy way, and at a better rate than most SoCal ECNL teams.


AMEN, brother.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Say what you want, but the top league will be the DA.  All clubs of interest (ECNL or not) are kissing US Soccer ass right now, the ones that got in and the ones that didn't.  There are a couple of VERY DESPERATE clubs in SoCal still trying to get in, and they wear the patch.
> 
> Take out Blues, Slammers, and Surf, and nobody else in SoCal ECNL contributes to your USYNT argument.
> 
> I imagine your daughter as fast, either to get on the end of a long ball up front, or to run everything down in the back.  I hope she is on the U20 WC roster along with the other NON-ECNL High School seniors.  If not, then this is precisely why US Soccer is wanting to influence development, so a great athlete like your daughter reaches her full potential in the future.
> 
> FYI--Legends was winning State National Cups prior to ECNL.  Excluding them just eliminated the competition.  Beach is a much younger club.  Both contributing to the national team programs in a healthy way, and at a better rate than most SoCal ECNL teams.


Winning National Cups is a far cry fom winning a USYS National Championship prior to ECNL.  You must go far back with Legends to remember winning National Cups prior to ECNL even though Legends was what 1 year removed from merging GFC with Stampede.  Wasn't it a U11 National Cup?  Keep posting, because you are slipping.

US Soccer loves to to pick their YNT players from ECNL clubs.http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/which-youth-clubs-produce-the-most-u-s-girls-national-team-players/


----------



## ECNL

Swoosh said:


> If not, then this is precisely why US Soccer is wanting to influence development.........


US Soccer is not influencing development, it is capitalizing on it.  The same soccer clubs, the same coaches, no curriculum.  The only thing US Soccer is doing is creating a new league and throwing 5 million at some DOC's and calling it "development."  I believe US Soccer will take all the showcase fees, profits on uniform kits, parking fees, hotel kickbacks, etc. and invest it back into the boys academies.  They don't give a crap about women's soccer.


----------



## Rev234

A  very pertinent excerpt from an article on the  state of woman's soccer.  
*Time for change*

The USWNT is currently operating within a system designed for a previous world: one of tiny talent pools and limited resources. But looking forward, there's reason to be far more optimistic. As the NWSL develops, as more money filters into women's soccer, the old models make less and less sense. We may not quite have reached the tipping point yet, but it's coming.

It would be too much to ask for immediate, wholesale reconfiguration of the system. The economics of women's soccer are still fragile, after all, and rocking the boat too aggressively could conceivably threaten the financial (and competitive) success of the WNT. But in the long-term, change is inevitable. And it's in the interest of everyone involved (from fans to players to officials) to help usher in a new, more modern, more sustainable model for the US women's squad.

http://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2016/6/30/11816748/uswnt-elusive-dream


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Winning National Cups is a far cry fom winning a USYS National Championship prior to ECNL.


What do you mean? Prior to ECNL, it was THE tournament to win. Winning National Cup from CalSouth meant that you were the best in Southern CA, because it was before ECNL took their ball and ran away.



NoGoal said:


> US Soccer loves to to pick their YNT players from ECNL clubs.http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/which-youth-clubs-produce-the-most-u-s-girls-national-team-players/


 Or do you mean DA clubs? Because in the future, the YNT players will be developed by DA clubs. From your link provided, here is the club list: Michigan Hawks (DA), Surf (DA), Blues (DA), PDA (DA), Real Colorado (DA), Eagles (DA), FC Stars (DA), TopHat (DA), Colorado Rush (DA)



ECNL said:


> US Soccer is not influencing development, it is capitalizing on it.  The same soccer clubs, the same coaches, no curriculum.  The only thing US Soccer is doing is creating a new league and throwing 5 million at some DOC's and calling it "development."  I believe US Soccer will take all the showcase fees, profits on uniform kits, parking fees, hotel kickbacks, etc. and invest it back into the boys academies.  They don't give a crap about women's soccer.


And did you know that US Soccer is helping create accreditation for a Club Technical Director position that will be licensed, just like a coach A license? I believe that is the first step in creating a unified curriculum for technical development for the DA clubs, and a very positive step in the right direction.


----------



## Bored

Bottom line this is nothing but a power grab.  USWNT really had no say and no way to make money off club soccer.  Now they have a way.  I'm sure the premium to play in the new leagues will be astronomical.  They are changing nothing.  Same Coaches.  Big wow.  Training 4 days a week.  Neat.  Most teams do anyways. No High School Soccer.  Great.  Less Games.  ECNL was already doing that.  We play 1 tournament and like 3 showcases.  And the article above talks about the old model being based on tiny talent pools and limited resources.  Yet they want to consolidate 2 age groups and make the top teams fewer.  3 teams per club yet there are so many good players especially her in southern California.  So top players with be forced to play in so called "B" leagues now.  Will the national team coaches be coaching the teams?  If so we're out.  Most are mediocre at best.  But we will still have to pay and even if we don't have to pay there is something in me that just doesn't feel right about the lower level teams paying higher fees so my kid can play for free?    That's Straight up Obama Soccer right there.  ECNL model was great.  Were all the teams in the ECNL great?  Of course not.  Just like not all the teams in National League are great.  Just cause Cali-Klines had a bad experience when his daughter was in Jr High with Strikers doesn't mean the whole league is bad as he makes it sound. That's his fault for taking her to strikers in the first place.  But the ECNL did it's job in showcasing the girls and putting them in front of Tons of college coaches.  Legends management had to work twice as hard to get their girls seen.  Hold 2 of their own College Showcases.  Show up to the the Carlsbad piggy back scrimmages where a few coaches would show up.  ECNL teams can just show up to a showcase and know there are tons of D1 coaches attending.   JH said he would have loved to play in the ECNL.  Would have made his job a thousand times easier.  He applied every year.  If they would have been accepted would you have left the club Caliklines?   You make it sound as though the league was the problem and not the club.  And by the way, you weren't there for all the Championships.  I remember when you got pissy because her club wouldn't release her so she could ride the coat tails of the players who earned the berth.  

Please someone who isn't just happy to be part of it because they were kept out of the ECNL sell me on this.  I see no positives.  What will this do for my daughter who only wants to play college ball.  Isn't that the end game for most of the girls currently playing?


----------



## ECNL

CaliKlines said:


> I believe that is the first step in creating a unified curriculum for technical development for the DA clubs, and a very positive step in the right direction.


What are you smoking?  This position will go to the Head Coach/DOC of the club that has the GDA, just as it is with the BDA. 

The BDA has been around for years.  Here is what they have on their website for development:  http://www.ussoccer.com/coaching-education/resources/2015-player-development-initiatives - Yes, a Birth Year Chart!  I believe this should sum up the importance of "development" for everyone interested in US Soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Say what you want, but the top league will be the DA.  All clubs of interest (ECNL or not) are kissing US Soccer ass right now, the ones that got in and the ones that didn't.  There are a couple of VERY DESPERATE clubs in SoCal still trying to get in, and they wear the patch.
> 
> Take out Blues, Slammers, and Surf, and nobody else in SoCal ECNL contributes to your USYNT argument.
> 
> _False_
> 
> I imagine your daughter as fast, either to get on the end of a long ball up front, or to run everything down in the back.  I hope she is on the U20 WC roster along with the other NON-ECNL High School seniors.  If not, then this is precisely why US Soccer is wanting to influence development, so a great athlete like your daughter reaches her full potential in the future.
> 
> _She might be fast but she is extremely technical so what of it?_
> 
> FYI--Legends was winning State National Cups prior to ECNL.  Excluding them just eliminated the competition.  Beach is a much younger club.  Both contributing to the national team programs in a healthy way, and at a better rate than most SoCal ECNL teams.
> 
> _False.  Please check your fact on this one._


*
Your fact check grade is a big PANTS ON FIRE!!!*

So you are saying that Eagles, WCFC, Strikers, RSC and Arsenal have no YNT players?  That is completely false and you may or may not know that.  Please double check the various national team pools. 

Regarding my daughter and the U20 WWC, there is only two high school seniors on the U20 WWC team and only one of them actually deserves it.  Now what if my player is on the U20 WWC team?  Does that change the fact that this is strictly a power grab and half of the DA clubs have done nothing to deserve selection?  My daughter may or may not be fast and is not relevant to this conversation.  I can say that she has and will continue to play internationally.

Oh and you mentioned Legends State and National Cup titles with has nothing to do with what I said.  I will repeat it.  All of Legends' 4 USYS NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS (not National or State Cup) came AFTER the ECNL teams stopped participating and likely would have never occurred had they continued.  Riddle me this, how many Legend's players went to more than one YNT camp.  I can only think of Ally Prisock of USC (a wonderful player).


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Whatdo you mean? Prior to ECNL, it was THE tournament to win. Winning National Cup from CalSouth meant that you were the best in Southern CA, because it was before ECNL took their ball and ran away.


MakeAPlay posted Legends NEVER won a USYS Championship prior to ECNL, which is FACT.  Swoosh or should I say a Legends coach got butthurt and had to post, but we won Nationa Cup.  National Cup is NOT a USYS Championship.  It's a SoCal Champion and NOT a Regional or National Champion.



CaliKlines said:


> WhatOr do you mean DA clubs? Because in the future, the YNT players will be developed by DA clubs. From your link provided, here is the club list: Michigan Hawks (DA), Surf (DA), Blues (DA), PDA (DA), Real Colorado (DA), Eagles (DA), FC Stars (DA), TopHat (DA), Colorado Rush (DA)


Aren't you putting the cart before the horse, GDA doesn't start until Fall of 2017.  Actually all of the above are DA/ECNL clubs.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Just so we are clear I hope the DA succeeds.  I just think that the intent behind it is less than honorable and the manner in which they went about creating it is classic government backroom deal making BS.


----------



## CaliKlines

Bored said:


> Bottom line this is nothing but a power grab.  USWNT really had no say and no way to make money off club soccer.  Now they have a way.  I'm sure the premium to play in the new leagues will be astronomical.  They are changing nothing.  Same Coaches.  Big wow.  Training 4 days a week.  Neat.  Most teams do anyways. No High School Soccer.  Great.  Less Games.  ECNL was already doing that.  We play 1 tournament and like 3 showcases.  And the article above talks about the old model being based on tiny talent pools and limited resources.  Yet they want to consolidate 2 age groups and make the top teams fewer.  3 teams per club yet there are so many good players especially her in southern California.  So top players with be forced to play in so called "B" leagues now.  Will the national team coaches be coaching the teams?  If so we're out.  Most are mediocre at best.  But we will still have to pay and even if we don't have to pay there is something in me that just doesn't feel right about the lower level teams paying higher fees so my kid can play for free?    That's Straight up Obama Soccer right there.  ECNL model was great.  Were all the teams in the ECNL great?  Of course not.  Just like not all the teams in National League are great.  Just cause Cali-Klines had a bad experience when his daughter was in Jr High with Strikers doesn't mean the whole league is bad as he makes it sound. That's his fault for taking her to strikers in the first place.  But the ECNL did it's job in showcasing the girls and putting them in front of Tons of college coaches.  Legends management had to work twice as hard to get their girls seen.  Hold 2 of their own College Showcases.  Show up to the the Carlsbad piggy back scrimmages where a few coaches would show up.  ECNL teams can just show up to a showcase and know there are tons of D1 coaches attending.   JH said he would have loved to play in the ECNL.  Would have made his job a thousand times easier.  He applied every year.  If they would have been accepted would you have left the club Caliklines?   You make it sound as though the league was the problem and not the club.  And by the way, you weren't there for all the Championships.  I remember when you got pissy because her club wouldn't release her so she could ride the coat tails of the players who earned the berth.
> 
> Please someone who isn't just happy to be part of it because they were kept out of the ECNL sell me on this.  I see no positives.  What will this do for my daughter who only wants to play college ball.  Isn't that the end game for most of the girls currently playing?


You're clueless. No, it is not the end game for most of the girls currently playing. Most are playing for the fun, enjoyment, and competition. For those that are looking further, I have mentioned many times that the ECNL is an acceptable route to the next level. It is however, not the only route. I know many, many families that have been thrilled with their experience at Beach, Galaxy/Carlsbad, Galaxy SB, Albion, and Legends FC.

And if Legends FC had been invited to join the ECNL, we would not have left. Why would I leave a club that works twice as hard, by your own admission, as other clubs? We didn't "take her to join the strikers in the first place". They couldn't develop their own players, so they recruited our entire team to join. Yes, we made the decision to leave Strikers when I was asked by the coach to help recruit outside players to the ECNL team because they didn't know who the impact players were in the age group, but I harbored no ill will. Then I became unhappy when my daughter was denied the opportunity to leave the club when she wanted to leave. That was just wrong, selfish, and short sighted.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> You're clueless. No, it is not the end game for most of the girls currently playing. Most are playing for the fun, enjoyment, and competition. For those that are looking further, I have mentioned many times that the ECNL is an acceptable route to the next level. It is however, not the only route. I know many, many families that have been thrilled with their experience at Beach, Galaxy/Carlsbad, Galaxy SB, Albion, and Legends FC.
> 
> And if Legends FC had been invited to join the ECNL, we would not have left. Why would I leave a club that works twice as hard, by your own admission, as other clubs? We didn't "take her to join the strikers in the first place". They couldn't develop their own players, so they recruited our entire team to join. Yes, we made the decision to leave Strikers when I was asked by the coach to help recruit outside players to the ECNL team because they didn't know who the impact players were in the age group, but I harbored no ill will. Then I became unhappy when my daughter was denied the opportunity to leave the club when she wanted to leave. That was just wrong, selfish, and short sighted.


It is so funny how you say that ECNL is an "acceptable route" yet you rave about the wonderful experiences at those other clubs.  Truth be told, your daughter had one year of ECNL experience at U14 (not a recruting age).  To say that Strikers doesn't develop players and only recruits is simply false.  I can think of several players that have been developed by them that are impact players.  Not to mention that their youngers teams are having lot's of success.  

Regarding recruiting players didn't your daughter get "recruited" by Legends from an ECNL team?  Don't all of the top teams recruit to fill needs?  How many players on your daughter's Legends team were there at U9?  I would say leaving a team midseason for no good reason is wrong and shortsighted in my book.  Especially if she was captain as you keep repeating.  

The bottom line is I think that you are a good person.  You did what you thought was best for your daughter and now she is going to NC State, a good academic school that is the cellar dweller in a great soccer conference.  Sounds curiously like the Strikers team that your daughter bailed on.  What is the difference between them and NC State?  You better hope that the coach doesn't get fired though because it could be tough to secure an equivalent offer should he get fired in the next two years.

Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## NoGoal

This thread is SoCal Soccer at its BEST!


----------



## BornToRun

I think ECNL has done a good job and has helped to make great stride for women's soccer. However, they, the affiliate clubs, made a crucial error by not expanding or realigning to include deserving clubs-- in SoCal, most notably Legends and Beach-- who are producing strong teams and players of such quality that they've had some amount of success placing them in college and YNT without the benefit of ECNL. And yes, I have heard, that has been quite a feat-- not just on the level of college exposure, but also in terms of holding onto these players in the first place. It also would've been nice for them to make ECNL more accessible to players based on geography.  A player from West L.A. should not have to drive 2 hours up or down the 405 for a good soccer club.  Clearly, we don't need 4 ECNL clubs within a 15 or so mile radius in O.C!   Instead of madly poaching these clubs (not to mention each other) and creating a hostile environment, ECNL should have been striving for greater unity. But now, by failing to do so, ECNL may have created its own demise. By being a bit more fair and inclusive of worthy clubs, ECNL could have had more power in this huge SoCal market as well as in others, and a unified front, and may have had more to say about the plans of U.S. Soccer.

Now it will be interesting to see how ECNL can rationalize excluding these clubs-- they are good enough for GDA, but not good enough for ECNL?


----------



## NoGoal

BornToRun said:


> I think ECNL has done a good job and has helped to make great stride for women's soccer. However, they, the affiliate clubs, made a crucial error by not expanding or realigning to include deserving clubs-- in SoCal, most notably Legends and Beach-- who are producing strong teams and players of such quality that they've had some amount of success placing them in college and YNT without the benefit of ECNL. And yes, I have heard, that has been quite a feat-- not just on the level of college exposure, but also in terms of holding onto these players in the first place. It also would've been nice for them to make ECNL more accessible to players based on geography.  A player from West L.A. should not have to drive 2 hours up or down the 405 for a good soccer club.  Clearly, we don't need 4 ECNL clubs within a 15 or so mile radius in O.C!   Instead of madly poaching these clubs (not to mention each other) and creating a hostile environment, ECNL should have been striving for greater unity. But now, by failing to do so, ECNL may have created its own demise. By being a bit more fair and inclusive of worthy clubs, ECNL could have had more power in this huge SoCal market as well as in others, and a unified front, and may have had more to say about the plans of U.S. Soccer.
> 
> Now it will be interesting to see how ECNL can rationalize excluding these clubs-- they are good enough for GDA, but not good enough for ECNL?


Again it's been posted that Legends and Beach never won a USYS Championship prior to ECNL's creation and winning a Championship was one of the requirements for admission. Both clubs grew to where they are today, indirectly because of ECNL.  Both clubs won their USYS Championships after the elite clubs were no longer participating.  How would they have done vs ECNL competition? Refer to Tophats ECNL Champions League results.

LV Premier was kicked out last season and sure there can be an argument that Strikers should have been kicked out of ECNL for their overall poor club performance too.  This would have opened 2 spots in the Southwest Conference and IMO Legends and Beach should have gotten the nod.

With that said,  GDA was going to be implemented by US Soccer no matter what!  NOT because Legends and Beach were NOT playing ECNL.


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> MakeAPlay posted Legends NEVER won a USYS Championship prior to ECNL, which is FACT.  .


So that means Legends could never win a USYS title if the ECNL teams were included? Is that what you and MAP are alluding too? Well, quess what...you are wrong again. Another outright falsehood. The Legends G99 team won a  U13 USYS National Championship against ALL of the teams in the country, even all of the ECNL club U13 teams. Blues. West Coast. Slammers. Eagles. Arsenal. Strikers. RSC. Surf. PDA. Texans. Eclipse, ....and we had to beat the Michigan Hawks in the final to do it. (Weren't the Hawks the team that your article listed as being the #1 supplier of talent to the YNT?) All of those clubs wanted the title, but only one club won it. And what happened next? All of those clubs pulled their best teams into a protected league called the ECNL and then proceeded to downplay the impact and importance of the USYS National Championship by calling it "watered down". I guess if you can't win it, then the next best thing is to try to minimize it in a public soccer forum to sway public opinion.




NoGoal said:


> Aren't you putting the cart before the horse, GDA doesn't start until Fall of 2017.  Actually all of the above are DA/ECNL clubs.


You're right. They are all DA clubs, as I mentioned. There is no reason to stop believing that those clubs will continue to produce YNT players, is there? Or are you saying that Slammers, Blues, and the others will no longer produce high quality players in the future?


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> So that means Legends could never win a USYS title if the ECNL teams were included? Is that what you and MAP are alluding too? Well, quess what...you are wrong again. Another outright falsehood. The Legends G99 team won a  U13 USYS National Championship against ALL of the teams in the country, even all of the ECNL club U13 teams. Blues. West Coast. Slammers. Eagles. Arsenal. Strikers. RSC. Surf. PDA. Texans. Eclipse, ....and we had to beat the Michigan Hawks in the final to do it. (Weren't the Hawks the team that your article listed as being the #1 supplier of talent to the YNT?) All of those clubs wanted the title, but only one club won it. And what happened next? All of those clubs pulled their best teams into a protected league called the ECNL and then proceeded to downplay the impact and importance of the USYS National Championship. I guess if you can't win it, then the next best thing is to try to minimize it in a public soccer forum to sway public opinion.


Never won a USYS Championsuip PRIOR to ECNL being formed.  The G99 team won after ECNL was formed!


CaliKlines said:


> You're right. They are all DA clubs, as I mentioned. There is no reason to stop believing that those clubs will continue to produce YNT players, is there? Or are you saying that Slammers, Blues, and the others will no longer produce high quality players in the future?


WTF, I never posted the clubs would stop producing the YNT players.  I know you are being attacked from a lot of posters, but take a deep breath, relax and then post.


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoal said:


> Never won a USYS Championsuip PRIOR to ECNL being formed.


What do you mean by this statement? I assume you mean that Legends FC could not win a USYS Championship if the ECNL teams were involved. That is what you are implying, correct? Or are you going to duck out on your meaning? Guess what, they did and they have. And the latest ECNL club to join, TopHat from Georgia, couldn't even get out of pool play in the most recent USYS National Championship.


NoGoal said:


> WTF, I never posted the clubs would stop producing the YNT players.  Take a deep breath, relax and then post.


 No, but you did post that US Soccer loves to pick YNT from ECNL rosters. Where do you think US Soccer will pick their YNT from in the future? C'mon, spit it out. Even you can spell D-A.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> What do you mean by this statement? I assume you mean that Legends FC could not win a USYS Championship if the ECNL teams were involved. That is what you are implying, correct? Or are you going to duck out on your meaning? Guess what, they did and they have. And the latest ECNL club to join, TopHat from Georgia, couldn't even get out of pool play in the most recent USYS National Championship.
> No, but you did post that US Soccer loves to pick YNT from ECNL rosters. Where do you think US Soccer will pick their YNT from in the future? C'mon, spit it out. Even you can spell D-A.


Cali you are fooling yourself.  The G99 team that won beat exactly who to get there?  Was your daughter a part of that team too?  How many teams in the Champions League did Tophat have that made it out of pool play?  The Southeast Conference in ECNL is notoriously weak and incestuous.  Nice example.  What happened to Legends the last time that team played Blues or any of the other SoCal ECNL teams?  If you want to make this about Legends then please name one repeat YNT player produced by the club other than Ally Prisock.  Name one elite player developed by the club other than Ally Prisock.  If you want to say Kodi Lavrusky she sat the bench at UCLA until her senior year and that was their worst team ever and I would hardly call her elite.


----------



## Glen

What is a repeat YNT player?


----------



## madcow

Glen said:


> What is a repeat YNT player?


Someone invited to more than one YNT camp.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> ...winning a Championship was one of the requirements for (ECNL) admission.


This is exactly the type of thinking that motivated GDA.  Great slogan for the Kool Aid container though .


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> If you want to make this about Legends then please name one repeat YNT player produced by the club other than Ally Prisock.  Name one elite player developed by the club other than Ally Prisock.


You want more than one? OK, here are the current Legends YNT players:

*T-15. Legends FC (6)*
Goalkeepers: Vianey Lopez (U15)

Defenders: Savannah Kessler (U15)

Midfielders: Jessica Carlton (U14)

Forwards: Vanessa Buso (U15), Laney Carroll (U15), Emily Knous (U17)

Here is the article that this list was derived from, just so that you don't think I am making stuff up. And I know of at least 2 more that would be on that list, if it weren't for inopportune injuries.
http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/which-youth-clubs-produce-the-most-u-s-girls-national-team-players/2/



MakeAPlay said:


> If you want to say Kodi Lavrusky she sat the bench at UCLA until her senior year and that was their worst team ever and I would hardly call her elite.


Kind of hard to score the winning goal in the NCAA Finals from the bench. She won an NCAA National Championship, I would call that elite. Or wait, do you reserve that title only for Elite Club National League players? Give the kid some credit.


----------



## CaliKlines

CaliKlines said:


> You want more than one? OK, here are the current Legends YNT players:
> 
> *T-15. Legends FC (6)*
> Goalkeepers: Vianey Lopez (U15)
> 
> Defenders: Savannah Kessler (U15)
> 
> Midfielders: Jessica Carlton (U14)
> 
> Forwards: Vanessa Buso (U15), Laney Carroll (U15), Emily Knous (U17)
> 
> Here is the article that this list was derived from, just so that you don't think I am making stuff up. And I know of at least 2 more that would be on that list, if it weren't for inopportune injuries.
> http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/which-youth-clubs-produce-the-most-u-s-girls-national-team-players/2/


I'm sorry...I didn't notice your qualifier of "repeat" YNT player. So now it is not good enough to produce YNT players, they must be repeat YNT players. These kids are young...give them time.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> not one of those non-ECNL clubs that you mentioned has a better record of producing national team...than ANY of the ECNL clubs in SoCal.


Here you go...per soccer wire article that No Goal so graciously shared (not sure how accurate that is):


*Legends 6*
Arsenal 6
West Coast 3
Real So Cal 2
Strikers 0


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> What do you mean by this statement? I assume you mean that Legends FC could not win a USYS Championship if the ECNL teams were involved. That is what you are implying, correct? Or are you going to duck out on your meaning? Guess what, they did and they have. And the latest ECNL club to join, TopHat from Georgia, couldn't even get out of pool play in the most recent USYS National Championship.


Exactly you assumed!!! Let me be clear for a 100th time that I probably have posted this.....Legends did NOT get into ECNL, because at the time ECNL was formed 8 or so years ago.  One of their requirements was winning a USYS National Championship.  Legends was in it's infancy having just merged Glendora FC and Stampede FC same goes for Beach FC.  Both clubs had no history of winning anything.  Legends and Beach both benefit after ECNL was formed.  How did they benefit NoGoal?  I am glad you asked CaliKlines, because without the ECNL clubs they were able to win multiple USYS Championships and dominate the USYS gaming circuit without the best clubs in the nation competing.  Now if Legends or Beach were admitted into ECNL they wouldn't dominant like they did in USYS National League or Championship series.  For example Tophat also had a lot of success in the USYS gaming circuit, did well in a weak ECNL Southeastern Conference....but, did NOT dominant the ECNL Champions League playoffs.

USYS was dominated by 3 clubs; Legends, Beach and Tophat.  As the cliche goes,  big fish in a small pond.   Even though my DD won't be playing club soccer the fall of 2017 and I won't be following club soccer anymore.  Beach and Legends will NOT dominate GDA nationally or locally....meaning ALL 3 AGE GROUPS!  Anybody from Beach or Legends to post they will dominate GDA is full of crap.





CaliKlines said:


> No, but you did post that US Soccer loves to pick YNT from ECNL rosters. Where do you think US Soccer will pick their YNT from in the future? C'mon, spit it out. Even you can spell D-A.


I posted that my DDs club is ECNL and DA.  I posted DA lots of times already.   My point is you're already posting DA and the league doesn't start for over a year from now.  What is it that you don't understand that my DDs club is both DA and ECNL?  If DA started this fall, she would be on the DA team, since she made the 2016 98-99 combined age group.  What do I mean by 98-99 age group?  It means the club already took the best players from the birth year of 1998 and 1999 to from a U19 team.  The exact same way DA will be forming teams, by combining the best players from 2 age groups.

Thanks for clarifying NG, you're welcome....sheesh!


----------



## Desert Hound

Will any club in AZ get a DA offer? We only have 2 ECNL teams.


----------



## picaboo

This is entertaining. All I am really getting however is Cali like Legends and Nogoal doesn't. Legends was not good enough for ECNL but they are for the academy league.


----------



## NoGoal

picaboo said:


> This is entertaining. All I am really getting however is Cali like Legends and Nogoal doesn't. Legends was not good enough for ECNL but they are for the academy league.


I have no issues with Legends as a club.  Best club in the IE for sure.  Both of my kids played for Legends.  My son played for Legends longer than Cali's DD has and get this, my wife and I were former team managers at the club for 2 different teams


----------



## cheaper2keeper

picaboo said:


> This is entertaining. All I am really getting however is Cali like Legends and Nogoal doesn't. Legends was not good enough for ECNL but they are for the academy league.


...and that Legends never would have made it this far without the ECNL giving them the opportunity.  Especially when it comes to national championships, they surely wouldn't have won ant of those. 

BTW if national championships were a prerequisite for entry into the original ECNL, it doesn't explain why most of the original clubs didn't have a girls national championship win.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> You want more than one? OK, here are the current Legends YNT players:
> 
> *T-15. Legends FC (6)*
> Goalkeepers: Vianey Lopez (U15)
> 
> Defenders: Savannah Kessler (U15)
> 
> Midfielders: Jessica Carlton (U14)
> 
> Forwards: Vanessa Buso (U15), Laney Carroll (U15), Emily Knous (U17)
> 
> Here is the article that this list was derived from, just so that you don't think I am making stuff up. And I know of at least 2 more that would be on that list, if it weren't for inopportune injuries.
> http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/which-youth-clubs-produce-the-most-u-s-girls-national-team-players/2/
> 
> 
> Kind of hard to score the winning goal in the NCAA Finals from the bench. She won an NCAA National Championship, I would call that elite. Or wait, do you reserve that title only for Elite Club National League players? Give the kid some credit.



Okay my bad VB and VL both went to two camps but neither were invited to the most recent ones.  Very impressive to even get one callback.


----------



## NoGoal

cheaper2keeper said:


> ...and that Legends never would have made it this far without the ECNL giving them the opportunity.  Especially when it comes to national championships, they surely wouldn't have won ant of those.
> 
> BTW if national championships were a prerequisite for entry into the original ECNL, it doesn't explain why most of the original clubs didn't have a girls national championship win.


From what I remember in SoCal at the time Surf, Slammers, Blues, RSC, Arsenal and Eagles all had USYS National titles.  WCFC and Strikers got in during the inaugural season, when other clubs such as Blues and Eagles waited to see if the league would gain traction.  ECNL actually told Blues and Eagles to get in or they will not get in for several years afterwards.  The biggest club that was snubbed at the time with (I think) 2 USYS Championships was Laguna Hills Eclipse.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> From what I remember in SoCal at the time Surf, Slammers, Blues, RSC and Eagles all had USYS National titles.  WCFC and Strikers got in during the inaugural season, when other clubs such as Blues and Eagles waited to see if the league would gain traction.  ECNL actually told Blues and Eagles to get in or they will not get in for several years afterwards.


WCFC and Strikers both had a girls USYS national title as did Arsenal.


----------



## cheaper2keeper

What year did Arsenal girls win? I can't find it on the usys website.


----------



## BornToRun

Oh for goodness sakes, let's flash forward to NOW.  So NOW, how can a team possibly qualify for ECNL if, as you keep repeating, they have to win a National Championship with the ECNL teams involved?  That ain't happening. So please, outside of the YNT players, colegiates, and yes, National Championships, explain to me how clubs NOW are supposed to qualify for the Elite league?


----------



## NoGoal

cheaper2keeper said:


> What year did Arsenal girls win? I can't find it on the usys website.


I was when Cle


BornToRun said:


> Oh for goodness sakes, let's flash forward to NOW.  So NOW, how can a team possibly qualify for ECNL if, as you keep repeating, they have to win a National Championship with the ECNL teams involved?  That ain't happening. So please, outside of the YNT players, colegiates, and yes, National Championships, explain to me how clubs NOW are supposed to qualify for the "Elite" league?  Just face it: The reason clubs like Legends and Beach are not in is simple:  The ECNL clubs want to benefit from their player development systems by poaching their players.  Nuff said. But, just to clue you old timers in, it has not been working as well lately with the youngers.  The tide is shifting and it's because of the same attitude that is being thrown around on this thread. People just aren't drinking it up anymore. As for me, I am an ECNL supporter, but all this makes even me say, "Bring it on, GDA!"


Problem is ECNL already has 8 SoCal clubs, unless they kick out a club.  There isn't enough top players to form 8 competitive teams now.  IMO, it's why GDA has 7 clubs at this early stage and consolidating 2 age groups per team.  This will weed out the weak and send them to LA Premier....haha!

As for the ulittle parents, you will realize how important college exposure is when your DDs come of age.  Unless the player has YNT, ODP team, or ID2 on their resume....it will be difficult for your DD to distinguish themselves from players who are guaranteed 3-4 ECNL showcases a year.  Next year add GDA team players to that mix.  The result will be the small boutique clubs/teams have to WIN USYS National Cup, Regionals and Nationals...to gain guaranteed acceptance into Surf Cup and Surf College Cup to get in front of college coaches.


----------



## MakeAPlay

BornToRun said:


> Oh for goodness sakes, let's flash forward to NOW.  So NOW, how can a team possibly qualify for ECNL if, as you keep repeating, they have to win a National Championship with the ECNL teams involved?  That ain't happening. So please, outside of the YNT players, colegiates, and yes, National Championships, explain to me how clubs NOW are supposed to qualify for the "Elite" league?  Just face it: The reason clubs like Legends and Beach are not in is simple:  The ECNL clubs want to benefit from their player development systems by poaching their players.  Nuff said. But, just to clue you old timers in, it has not been working as well lately with the youngers.  The tide is shifting and it's because of the same attitude that is being thrown around on this thread. People just aren't drinking it up anymore. As for me, I am an ECNL supporter, but all this makes even me say, "Bring it on, GDA!"


Let's see what you say in 2018 when the dust starts to settle.  I will be curious as to how it will work out.  I'm tired of this thread as it is all speculation.  I know what actually has worked and for the last 5 years I have seen the best youth competition platform from up close.  I have seen the majority of the YNT pool and many of the players that are the future of US soccer.  

Please don't listen to what I have to say.  I'm just a soccer mom who no longer has a dog in this fight.  This fall I can honestly say that the only youth soccer games that I will see are a couple of my friends daughters U11 games.  Outside of that it will be strictly college and U20/17 WWC games.  I hope that your daughter is a top 25 player in SoCal in her age group so that this is moot.  Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## shales1002

Desert Hound said:


> Will any club in AZ get a DA offer? We only have 2 ECNL teams.


That's one of the many problem with all of this. DA clubs  were not made available to 80% of the country. Essentially the DA is saying girls living in certain geographical locations cannot participate. However, places like Nevada and Arizona simply don't have the pool to form both ECNL and DA teams.


----------



## push_up

shales1002 said:


> However, places like Nevada and Arizona simply don't have the pool to form both ECNL and DA teams.


This post is SoCal snobbery at its finest as the #1  u17 team in the SW conference this season was SCDS.  The u15 SCDS team finished 4th.  Arizona definitely has enough talent for a GDA and an ECNL team.


----------



## shales1002

push_up said:


> This post is SoCal snobbery at its finest as the #1  u17 team in the SW conference this season was SCDS.  The u15 SCDS team finished 4th.  Arizona definitely has enough talent for a GDA and an ECNL team.


First my DD plays in the desert; secondly, I NEVER said places like Arizona or Nevada didn't have the talent, I said "the talent pool wasn't large enough/deep enough to field both like it is in SoCal. It simply doesn't equate." I said the problem was that 80% of the population will not have access because of our geographical locations.  Nevada has one club with ecnl; Arizona has 2. You mentioned two teams out the 10 ecnl teams in Arizona. Those in the southwest conference know the real. In states with smaller population pools it will be one or the other in order for it to work, that's if they have the 225 k to get in.


----------



## Desert Hound

Based on population how does San Diego end up doing well..ie ECNL and now a DA? Their population in the county is approx the same size as the Phx metro area. Are they just pulling in players from the county...or are people commuting in from LA?


----------



## dfbmike

CaliKlines said:


> In all likelihood, the girls DA will have more exposure to college coaches than the ECNL. The pro-ECNL crowd tries to espouse the ECNL as the greatest league ever. (Far from it.) Eventually, a greater percentage of players in the girls DA will be committed to college programs than girls in the ECNL. Plain and simple. It might be to a cellar dweller in the toughest women's soccer conference in the country, or it could be somewhere else. But the DA girls will have their choice of schools, whereas the ECNL players will be getting whatever is leftover.


The big picture here is that in 5 to 10 years, maybe closer to 10, GDA will be the direct path to professional womens soccer, not college, college soccer will eventually drop off the map, as it should...unless US soccer discontinues the path it is currently trying to establish...many of our kids will probably not be affected by all this or reap the benefits, but our kids will play a role in and be part of the change that creates a better soccer environment for future generations..this is a long term project


----------



## dfbmike

anybody here know when the report for the audit from double pass is due to come out?  really interested in its findings and recommendations given our unique circumstances.
lack of a proper soccer pyramid and getting rid of so many unlinked leagues should probably top that list


----------



## shales1002

Desert Hound said:


> Based on population how does San Diego end up doing well..ie ECNL and now a DA? Their population in the county is approx the same size as the Phx metro area. Are they just pulling in players from the county...or are people commuting in from LA?


L.A . County girls have very long commutes!


----------



## Desert Hound

shales1002 said:


> L.A . County girls have very long commutes!


I can only imagine. I like LA...but the traffic drives me nuts.


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> The big picture here is that in 5 to 10 years, maybe closer to 10, GDA will be the direct path to professional womens soccer, not college, college soccer will eventually drop off the map, as it should...unless US soccer discontinues the path it is currently trying to establish...many of our kids will probably not be affected by all this or reap the benefits, but our kids will play a role in and be part of the change that creates a better soccer environment for future generations..this is a long term project


Boys DA has been around for a decade and boys are still playing college soccer!  Why would it be any different on the girls side?


----------



## dfbmike

NoGoal said:


> Boys DA has been around for a decade and boys are still playing college soccer!  Why would it be any different on the girls side?


Its called infancy, MLS is still evolving and slowly trying to become a reputable league, boys DA is still evolving, US soccer in general is still evolving and playing catch up, many things to be figured out and corrected still...GDA is barely in its first trimester of pregnancy with a due date of next year, womens pro soccer doesn't even really exist YET...long term brother, you can be on here all day arguing your case if you like but things are changing and will be different in the future, it will be ok...you must really love that world class college soccer being on here 24/7 arguing its case?


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> I was when Cle
> 
> Problem is ECNL already has 8 SoCal clubs, unless they kick out a club.  There isn't enough top players to form 8 competitive teams now.  IMO, it's why GDA has 7 clubs at this early stage and consolidating 2 age groups per team.  This will weed out the weak and send them to LA Premier....haha!
> 
> As for the ulittle parents, you will realize how important college exposure is when your DDs come of age.  Unless the player has YNT, ODP team, or ID2 on their resume....it will be difficult for your DD to distinguish themselves from players who are guaranteed 3-4 ECNL showcases a year.  Next year add GDA team players to that mix.  The result will be the small boutique clubs/teams have to WIN USYS National Cup, Regionals and Nationals...to gain guaranteed acceptance into Surf Cup and Surf College Cup to get in front of college coaches.


https://usys-assets.ae-admin.com/assets/929/15/Past_NCS_Champions_by_State_15_1.pdf

I don't see any Arsenal girl's championships listed.  The first championship was in ECNL the first year the club joined the league (kind of ironic).


----------



## Bored

push_up said:


> This post is SoCal snobbery at its finest as the #1  u17 team in the SW conference this season was SCDS.  The u15 SCDS team finished 4th.  Arizona definitely has enough talent for a GDA and an ECNL team.


How did those teams do in the Championships?


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> Its called infancy, MLS is still evolving and slowly trying to become a reputable league, boys DA is still evolving, US soccer in general is still evolving and playing catch up, many things to be figured out and corrected still...GDA is barely in its first trimester of pregnancy with a due date of next year, womens pro soccer doesn't even really exist YET...long term brother, you can be on here all day arguing your case if you like but things are changing and will be different in the future, it will be ok...you must really love that world class college soccer being on here 24/7 arguing its case?


The only way it evolves is when corporations INVEST  in purchasing TV commercial adds in the millions to billions.  Then mens salary can increase across the board.  Refer to NBA's new TV deal!  MLS is not in it's infancy, I believe the league has been around for 2 decades.  Tough to be a major U.S. mens sports attraction competing against matured leagues like the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL, NASCAR, PGA and European Soccer Leagues such as La Liga, EPL and Bundesliga for lucrative TV adds.

You live in lala land, if you seriously think womens soccer will be a major sports attraction.  US WNT is #1 in the world and already draws millions to watch them play in the Olympics and World Cup, yet NWSL continues to struggle drawing any form of attendance at their games.   Women soccer has been around for almost 3 decades in the US (world leader in the womens game) it sure is taking a long time to evolve.  Wait, it has evolved after 2 defunct leagues...NWSL learned they have to pay their rank and file players poverty level salaries to remain solvent.  Refer to Hope Solo's recent article.  Yet, you post with US Soccer creating a GDA that will all change in a decade.  I will bet you $$$$, that a decade from now....it will be the same!

In conclusion, yes...I will inform my DD to play college soccer, get her degree, continue working hard when she enters the work force and the result will be guaranteed a higher salary than the average NWSL player!


----------



## timbuck

Heck, the average female coaching gu12 players in So Cal makes more $$ than most NWSL players.


----------



## offthecrossbar

ECNL said:


> I not sure I agree with your first sentence.  Good luck to your DD and her education.
> 
> NC State Women's Soccer
> 2015 - 4-wins-15 -losses
> 2014 - 2-wins-15-losses
> 2013 - 7 wins - 12 - losses
> 2012 - 5 wins - 14 losses


NC State's ACC conference record.

2015- 0 wins and 10 losses
2014- o wins and 10 losses
2013- 2 wins and 8 losses

The head coach better start looking for a new job.


----------



## Zerodenero

CaliKlines said:


> What do you mean by this statement? I assume you mean that Legends FC could not win a USYS Championship if the ECNL teams were involved. That is what you are implying, correct? Or are you going to duck out on your meaning? Guess what, they did and they have. And the latest ECNL club to join, TopHat from Georgia, couldn't even get out of pool play in the most recent USYS National Championship.
> No, but you did post that US Soccer loves to pick YNT from ECNL rosters. Where do you think US Soccer will pick their YNT from in the future? C'mon, spit it out. Even you can spell D-A.


Cali - Your zeal is admirable. But dang, you suffer from selective dementia and a twist of denial.....don't you recall the beat down your beloved L99's received the last 2 - 3 times they played the blues? But like Tophat, blues/defending ecnl champ _"didn't even make it out of pool play" _at this years ecnl playoffs. 

They say be careful what you wish for....... 2017/18 is your year compadre, time to get outta the kitty pool and into the sea.


----------



## Zerodenero

timbuck said:


> Heck, the average female coaching gu12 players in So Cal makes more $$ than most NWSL players.


True. Based on the amount of female youth/HS & college players from Socal, you'd think we'd have more female coaching involvement from former players still wanting to be evolved in the game and put f$$d on the table.


----------



## SpeedK1llz

Can somebody please bash the other's club, league choice, daughter or college selection? There hasn't been a post in over 12 hours and I am going through serious withdraw symptoms...


----------



## dfbmike

So in summary,
Let us keep education and soccer on the same path (apperently, because you keep talking about education and degrees, while i am talking about soccer in a soccer discussion) and have the majority of our homegrown talent age out and hang em up at 24, because it is more important to find a regular job
We will never have a successful professional womens league ( not sure who on here said it would be a major sports attraction)

Got it, US Soccer should have hired you as a consultant instead bro


NoGoal said:


> The only way it evolves is when corporations INVEST  in purchasing TV commercial adds in the millions to billions.  Then mens salary can increase across the board.  Refer to NBA's new TV deal!  MLS is not in it's infancy, I believe the league has been around for 2 decades.  Tough to be a major U.S. mens sports attraction competing against matured leagues like the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL, NASCAR, PGA and European Soccer Leagues such as La Liga, EPL and Bundesliga for lucrative TV adds.
> 
> You live in lala land, if you seriously think womens soccer will be a major sports attraction.  US WNT is #1 in the world and already draws millions to watch them play in the Olympics and World Cup, yet NWSL continues to struggle drawing any form of attendance at their games.   Women soccer has been around for almost 3 decades in the US (world leader in the womens game) it sure is taking a long time to evolve.  Wait, it has evolved after 2 defunct leagues...NWSL learned they have to pay their rank and file players poverty level salaries to remain solvent.  Refer to Hope Solo's recent article.  Yet, you post with US Soccer creating a GDA that will all change in a decade.  I will bet you $$$$, that a decade from now....it will be the same!
> 
> In conclusion, yes...I will inform my DD to play college soccer, get her degree, continue working hard when she enters the work force and the result will be guaranteed a higher salary than the average NWSL player!



You keep talking about degrees and education....i am not talking about degrees and education, i am talking about soccer, stop intertwining soccer with education and maybe you will be fully able to grasp the concept of what some of us are talking about and what DA is about...i told you since day one i am talking strictly about soccer...soccer, the current quality, possible improvements, development etc etc...you keep going back to "i'm telling my daughter to get a degree and a job and to make lots of money", although that's great and all that is not what my point of this discussion is about.  I am here to talk about soccer and to discuss making someones dream of playing professional soccer a reality.
If you don't want to be a professional player than yes go play college soccer and age out, be done.  
If you want to play professionally as a job and you have the skills it takes early and full commitment as well as many risks and that is what DA is for both men and someday women.  If you don't like those risks then don't friggin do it.  Opportunities are still slim, but things are growing and evolving.
My point is that the DA system is a proven system to develop PROFESSIONAL soccer players and a proven feeder system to both professional clubs and national squads around the soccer playing world and we are using a broken system, with no pyramid and a system were college soccer is way to high up on the chain.  College soccer can be part of a soccer pyramid, no doubt but it has to be on the amateur level and way lower than it currently is and right now it is right below MLS's only "flight".
How many of our good players hang em up at 24 or leave the country to go play level 2, 3 or 4 soccer because there are no other good playing opportunities here after college other than one flight of MLS?  Thats the age when most good players in other nations are starting to rake in good contracts (mens side).
secondly no one here ever said that a womens soccer league would me a major sports attraction ,lets dial it back a few notches and go back to what i actually said which is a "successful league", meaning it can survive, pay competitive wages and benefits.  If you think i'm in lala land on that more power to you.  You probably thought women would never have the ability to vote either, yes?  
you don't think the majority would have rather had a professional soccer career if that path was available than having to go to college and play and the hang them up, which currently is the only option?  c'mon man i'm talking about soccer and soccer players that are passionate about the sport they play, not education and degrees.

there is a reason US soccer rolled out DA, there is a bigger picture and plan, you just either don't see it or you don't want to see it.  and that's ok.  for the 5th time probably, this is a long term project with a bigger picture at the end of the tunnel.
embrace the change and be part of it or get left behind my man, either way I could care less.


----------



## CaliKlines

OK SpeedK1llz, here you go...



MakeAPlay said:


> What happened to Legends the last time that team played Blues or any of the other SoCal ECNL teams?


Sure you want to know Mappy? There is a very limited history of Legends FC G99 v. ECNL teams since the ECNL decided to limit the number of teams that they had to play against starting in the U14 season. But since you asked...in the most recent 11 meetings of Legends v. ECNL teams, Legends FC G99 has had 9 wins and 2 losses. This record does not include our first National Championship victory against the ECNL Michigan Hawks, in which all teams (ECNL, pre-ECNL, EGSL, ECNL Reserve, Pre-ECNL Private Special Grand Reserva, and non-ECNL) participated. These results are from the beginning of the U14 ECNL for this age group, which started following the last true national championship at U13.

As for details:
Beat West Coast ECNL-5/30/2015
Beat Blues ECNL twice, lost once-5/29/2015, 9/2/2013, 1/20/14
Beat Arsenal ECNL twice-8/3/2014, 8/4/2013
Beat Eagles ECNL 1/19/2014
Beat Real So Cal ECNL 9/2/2013
Beat Mustang ECNL 8/31/2013
Beat Strikers ECNL 8/31/2013
Lost to Slammers ECNL 8/5/2013

In a bid for honest and open disclosure, Legends FC G99 also lost to the Blues in a friendly within the past year in which the score was 4-0. I have said many times, they are a good team. ECNL is an acceptable route...but it is not the only route to the next level.


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> So in summary,
> Let us keep education and soccer on the same path (apperently, because you keep talking about education and degrees, while i am talking about soccer in a soccer discussion) and have the majority of our homegrown talent age out and hang em up at 24, because it is more important to find a regular job
> We will never have a successful professional womens league ( not sure who on here said it would be a major sports attraction)
> 
> Got it, US Soccer should have hired you as a consultant instead bro
> 
> 
> 
> You keep talking about degrees and education....i am not talking about degrees and education, i am talking about soccer, stop intertwining soccer with education and maybe you will be fully able to grasp the concept of what some of us are talking about and what DA is about...i told you since day one i am talking strictly about soccer...soccer, the current quality, possible improvements, development etc etc...you keep going back to "i'm telling my daughter to get a degree and a job and to make lots of money", although that's great and all that is not what my point of this discussion is about.  I am here to talk about soccer and to discuss making someones dream of playing professional soccer a reality.
> If you don't want to be a professional player than yes go play college soccer and age out, be done.
> If you want to play professionally as a job and you have the skills it takes early and full commitment as well as many risks and that is what DA is for both men and someday women.  If you don't like those risks then don't friggin do it.  Opportunities are still slim, but things are growing and evolving.
> My point is that the DA system is a proven system to develop PROFESSIONAL soccer players and a proven feeder system to both professional clubs and national squads around the soccer playing world and we are using a broken system, with no pyramid and a system were college soccer is way to high up on the chain.  College soccer can be part of a soccer pyramid, no doubt but it has to be on the amateur level and way lower than it currently is and right now it is right below MLS's only "flight".
> How many of our good players hang em up at 24 or leave the country to go play level 2, 3 or 4 soccer because there are no other good playing opportunities here after college other than one flight of MLS?  Thats the age when most good players in other nations are starting to rake in good contracts (mens side).
> secondly no one here ever said that a womens soccer league would me a major sports attraction ,lets dial it back a few notches and go back to what i actually said which is a "successful league", meaning it can survive, pay competitive wages and benefits.  If you think i'm in lala land on that more power to you.  You probably thought women would never have the ability to vote either, yes?
> you don't think the majority would have rather had a professional soccer career if that path was available than having to go to college and play and the hang them up, which currently is the only option?  c'mon man i'm talking about soccer and soccer players that are passionate about the sport they play, not education and degrees.
> 
> there is a reason US soccer rolled out DA, there is a bigger picture and plan, you just either don't see it or you don't want to see it.  and that's ok.  for the 5th time probably, this is a long term project with a bigger picture at the end of the tunnel.
> embrace the change and be part of it or get left behind my man, either way I could care less.


I understand what you are posting, I know about international soccer academies-my stepfather played for the Dortmund Development Youth Division until U17 and told me the entire process when he grow up in Germany.

US Soccer does have a level below MLS.... It's the USL, I recently read aligned with MLS teams and is now considered their minor league.  This was created for boys wanting to skip college soccer, yet Jordan Morris played for Stanford and was still drafted and plays for the Sounders.  If his career is cut short he always has his Stanford/college degree to fall back on.  If being drafted by a MLS team meant millions of money out of HS, then yes he probably would have skipped college like baseball players do....then again, that isn't the case at the present is it?

Yes, I comprehend you are posting about girls dreaming of playing professional women's soccer.  The problem still remains there is NO FINANCIAL incentive to skip playing college soccer altogether and make a comfortable living playing professional women's soccer.  The only player that gave up her college eligibility was Lindsey Horan and she was a YNT starter.  So for non-YNT starters and below....which is probably 99.999999% of the girls playing.  It's NOT going to happen.  Thus, why I said you are in lala land, which is okay....because, there always needs to be a dreamer in this world.

You are also _*assuming ,*_ US Soccer created a Girls DA league as an alternative route for girls to skip college altogether and play womens soccer professionally.  Please post an article that April Heinrich or Jill Ellis stated just that.

NOW for USSDA......there is the huge difference and you should know this.  US BOYS and GIRLS DA are NOT fully funded (except MLS teams), where as on the international level (at least) on the boys side it is, inculding smaller professional level 3/4 clubs.  I have no clue, if the international girls academies are fully funded, but I would say it is....because, the Euro leagues revenues are in multi-millions and are capable to subsidize a womens team.


----------



## madcow

dfbmike said:


> So in summary,
> Let us keep education and soccer on the same path (apperently, because you keep talking about education and degrees, while i am talking about soccer in a soccer discussion) and have the majority of our homegrown talent age out and hang em up at 24, because it is more important to find a regular job
> We will never have a successful professional womens league ( not sure who on here said it would be a major sports attraction)
> 
> Got it, US Soccer should have hired you as a consultant instead bro
> 
> 
> 
> You keep talking about degrees and education....i am not talking about degrees and education, i am talking about soccer, stop intertwining soccer with education and maybe you will be fully able to grasp the concept of what some of us are talking about and what DA is about...i told you since day one i am talking strictly about soccer...soccer, the current quality, possible improvements, development etc etc...you keep going back to "i'm telling my daughter to get a degree and a job and to make lots of money", although that's great and all that is not what my point of this discussion is about.  I am here to talk about soccer and to discuss making someones dream of playing professional soccer a reality.
> If you don't want to be a professional player than yes go play college soccer and age out, be done.
> If you want to play professionally as a job and you have the skills it takes early and full commitment as well as many risks and that is what DA is for both men and someday women.  If you don't like those risks then don't friggin do it.  Opportunities are still slim, but things are growing and evolving.
> My point is that the DA system is a proven system to develop PROFESSIONAL soccer players and a proven feeder system to both professional clubs and national squads around the soccer playing world and we are using a broken system, with no pyramid and a system were college soccer is way to high up on the chain.  College soccer can be part of a soccer pyramid, no doubt but it has to be on the amateur level and way lower than it currently is and right now it is right below MLS's only "flight".
> How many of our good players hang em up at 24 or leave the country to go play level 2, 3 or 4 soccer because there are no other good playing opportunities here after college other than one flight of MLS?  Thats the age when most good players in other nations are starting to rake in good contracts (mens side).
> secondly no one here ever said that a womens soccer league would me a major sports attraction ,lets dial it back a few notches and go back to what i actually said which is a "successful league", meaning it can survive, pay competitive wages and benefits.  If you think i'm in lala land on that more power to you.  You probably thought women would never have the ability to vote either, yes?
> you don't think the majority would have rather had a professional soccer career if that path was available than having to go to college and play and the hang them up, which currently is the only option?  c'mon man i'm talking about soccer and soccer players that are passionate about the sport they play, not education and degrees.
> 
> there is a reason US soccer rolled out DA, there is a bigger picture and plan, you just either don't see it or you don't want to see it.  and that's ok.  for the 5th time probably, this is a long term project with a bigger picture at the end of the tunnel.
> embrace the change and be part of it or get left behind my man, either way I could care less.


As I say to my kids, "you have a lot of words" 
Here is my opinion (if I understand what you are saying).
You are saying there will be a successful women's league and when that happens, the DA will be there to start the groundwork for quality Pro level talent.  Successful in your opinion is a league that can support itself and pay competitive wages.

NoGoal is saying there will never be a women's league that is a major sports attraction, so college is all there is for most. Some will finish college and go pro, or go pro after being on the WNT.

I think there are two different issues here. First, I think in order for the women's league to be "successful" they really do need to be a major sports attraction (Maybe not NFL, NBA or MLB level, but up there). I think the biggest women's team sport in the US is basketball. We have the best players in the world playing in this league. Yet, they couldn't survive without the support of the NBA. So, going back to your definition of what a successful league is (self supported while offering competitive wages), even the WNBA isn't successful. So, lets say that they just need to have the ability to survive over the foreseeable future and pay competitive wages, like the WNBA.

Then I would think they would need to attach themselves to the MLS. But, that would mean the MLS will need to be a major sports attraction. Because they would need to be big enough to support themselves and a women's league.

As to your next point of the DA providing the framework to the professional league(s), I agree. But, I also think the ECNL as well as USYSA is/ were doing the same thing. I don't believe we have any lack of talent on the women's side of the ball. I also don't see where the DA will provide anything different than what is already out there.

The issue when talking about each of these leagues is, we are talking about "youth" sports, then Pro sports. There needs to be another layer of competition between "youth" sports and the pros (on the women's side). Currently that next layer is college. I think for your vision to become a reality, the NWSL needs to be that next layer and the WMLS needs to be the tip of the pyramid. But, until the MLS reaches the point that it can support itself and a women's league, I don't see it happening. So, the problem is on the men's side of the ball 

For my daughter's sake, I hope there is a successful women's league, but I think she will be long out of the sport if/ when it does happen.

Damn it, now I have a lot of words


----------



## SpeedK1llz

madcow said:


> As I say to my kids, "you have a lot of words"
> Here is my opinion (if I understand what you are saying).
> You are saying there will be a successful women's league and when that happens, the DA will be there to start the groundwork for quality Pro level talent.  Successful in your opinion is a league that can support itself and pay competitive wages.
> 
> NoGoal is saying there will never be a women's league that is a major sports attraction, so college is all there is for most. Some will finish college and go pro, or go pro after being on the WNT.
> 
> I think there are two different issues here. First, I think in order for the women's league to be "successful" they really do need to be a major sports attraction (Maybe not NFL, NBA or MLB level, but up there). I think the biggest women's team sport in the US is basketball. We have the best players in the world playing in this league. Yet, they couldn't survive without the support of the NBA. So, going back to your definition of what a successful league is (self supported while offering competitive wages), even the WNBA isn't successful. So, lets say that they just need to have the ability to survive over the foreseeable future and pay competitive wages, like the WNBA.
> 
> Then I would think they would need to attach themselves to the MLS. But, that would mean the MLS will need to be a major sports attraction. Because they would need to be big enough to support themselves and a women's league.
> 
> As to your next point of the DA providing the framework to the professional league(s), I agree. But, I also think the ECNL as well as USYSA is/ were doing the same thing. I don't believe we have any lack of talent on the women's side of the ball. I also don't see where the DA will provide anything different than what is already out there.
> 
> The issue when talking about each of these leagues is, we are talking about "youth" sports, then Pro sports. There needs to be another layer of competition between "youth" sports and the pros (on the women's side). Currently that next layer is college. I think for your vision to become a reality, the NWSL needs to be that next layer and the WMLS needs to be the tip of the pyramid. But, until the MLS reaches the point that it can support itself and a women's league, I don't see it happening. So, the problem is on the men's side of the ball
> 
> For my daughter's sake, I hope there is a successful women's league, but I think she will be long out of the sport if/ when it does happen.
> 
> Damn it, now I have a lot of words


Well said!


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> OK SpeedK1llz, here you go...
> 
> 
> 
> Sure you want to know Mappy? There is a very limited history of Legends FC G99 v. ECNL teams since the ECNL decided to limit the number of teams that they had to play against starting in the U14 season. But since you asked...in the most recent 11 meetings of Legends v. ECNL teams, Legends FC G99 has had 9 wins and 2 losses. This record does not include our first National Championship victory against the ECNL Michigan Hawks, in which all teams (ECNL, pre-ECNL, EGSL, ECNL Reserve, Pre-ECNL Private Special Grand Reserva, and non-ECNL) participated. These results are from the beginning of the U14 ECNL for this age group, which started following the last true national championship at U13.
> 
> As for details:
> Beat West Coast ECNL-5/30/2015
> Beat Blues ECNL twice, lost once-5/29/2015, 9/2/2013, 1/20/14
> Beat Arsenal ECNL twice-8/3/2014, 8/4/2013
> Beat Eagles ECNL 1/19/2014
> Beat Real So Cal ECNL 9/2/2013
> Beat Mustang ECNL 8/31/2013
> Beat Strikers ECNL 8/31/2013
> Lost to Slammers ECNL 8/5/2013
> 
> In a bid for honest and open disclosure, Legends FC G99 also lost to the Blues in a friendly within the past year in which the score was 4-0. I have said many times, they are a good team. ECNL is an acceptable route...but it is not the only route to the next level.


I love it Cali.  Defiant to the end.  No worries.  The great thing about speculation is eventually it can be proven right or wrong.  I'm bored with this.  You are going to stick with whatever narrative justifies your current position.  At the end of the day the only one that has to deal with sleeping in your skin is you.  Let's hope that it works out for you and yours.  Good luck.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> I'm sorry...I didn't notice your qualifier of "repeat" YNT player. So now it is not good enough to produce YNT players, they must be repeat YNT players. These kids are young...give them time.


So are you saying that any player that gets a one time call up to a YNT performs poorly and never gets called back in is something that a club should be proud of?  Either is an honor , however, my thinking is that multiple call ins means that the player is performing at a high enough level that they are in the group of players that may actually advance upwards through the ranks.  It takes more than a coaches recommendation to get the latter versus the former.


----------



## soccerobserver

Interesting reading...Seeeems like DA is sitting in command in the drivers seat...what happens to ECNL when DA announces two or three seasons from now that they are expanding to 1 team per age/year instead of 1 team per 2 age group/years ?


----------



## madcow

soccerobserver said:


> Interesting reading...Seeeems like DA is sitting in command in the drivers seat...what happens to ECNL when DA announces two or three seasons from now that they are expanding to 1 team per age/year instead of 1 team per 2 age group/years ?


Im not sure. But US Soccer confuses me.
Wasn't it USSF that said the best way to develop youth soccer players was to have everyone play with their birth year? Then they turn around and create a league in which they combine 2 age bands? Doesn't that go against what they said was the best soccer practice?
Maybe I misunderstood them.


----------



## MessiFTW

CaliKlines said:


> OK SpeedK1llz, here you go...


Ok CaliKlines, here you go.......the great liberal academic institution your daughter is going to be attending....

http://dailycaller.com/2016/07/20/christians-win-in-north-carolina-take-down-university-speech-code/

A Christian group at North Carolina State University (NC State) won a substantial legal victory, as the university agreed to revise a speech code that blocked them from talking to fellow students without a permit.

Until now, NC State’s speech policy included a provision stating that groups had to obtain a permit prior to approaching students, whether it’s for commercial or non-commercial speech.

Grace Christian Life sued the school in April, arguing the policy was selectively enforced in order to keep the group from handing out fliers or inviting students to upcoming events. The group claimed they were first ordered to obtain a permit, and then after doing so, they were told they could only speak with other students if they remained behind a table set up by the group.

NC State defended the permit process, saying it was necessary for maintaining safety and order on campus. *(RELATED: NC State Warns That ‘Land Of Opportunity’ Is A Microaggression)*

The settlement comes a month after Judge James Dever granted a preliminary injunction against NC State’s speech policy, finding that Grace Christian Life was very likely to succeed in its challenge.

The Alliance Defending Freedom, a conservative legal group that backed the lawsuit, lauded the outcome in a statement.

“Students of any religious, political, or ideological persuasion should be able to freely and peacefully speak with their fellow students about their views without interference from university officials who may prefer one view over another,” the group said in a statement. “NC State did the right thing in revising its policy to reflect this instead of continuing to defend its previous policy, which was not constitutionally defensible.”


----------



## Zerodenero

MakeAPlay said:


> So are you saying that any player that gets a one time call up to a YNT performs poorly and never gets called back in is something that a club should be proud of?  Either is an honor , however, my thinking is that multiple call ins means that the player is performing at a high enough level that they are in the group of players that may actually advance upwards through the ranks.  It takes more than a coaches recommendation to get the latter versus the former.


Its interesting Make - so you're probably 100% accurate, yet you've got 4 thumbs down......I bet if the their dd was in the same sitch, perspective would be different,  and ya get the thumbs up

That said, one call up to YNT goes a long way outside the top 5-10 soccer schools for recruiting


----------



## Zerodenero

MessiFTW said:


> Ok CaliKlines, here you go.......the great liberal academic institution your daughter is going to be attending....
> 
> http://dailycaller.com/2016/07/20/christians-win-in-north-carolina-take-down-university-speech-code/
> 
> A Christian group at North Carolina State University (NC State) won a substantial legal victory, as the university agreed to revise a speech code that blocked them from talking to fellow students without a permit.
> 
> Until now, NC State’s speech policy included a provision stating that groups had to obtain a permit prior to approaching students, whether it’s for commercial or non-commercial speech.
> 
> Grace Christian Life sued the school in April, arguing the policy was selectively enforced in order to keep the group from handing out fliers or inviting students to upcoming events. The group claimed they were first ordered to obtain a permit, and then after doing so, they were told they could only speak with other students if they remained behind a table set up by the group.
> 
> NC State defended the permit process, saying it was necessary for maintaining safety and order on campus. *(RELATED: NC State Warns That ‘Land Of Opportunity’ Is A Microaggression)*
> 
> The settlement comes a month after Judge James Dever granted a preliminary injunction against NC State’s speech policy, finding that Grace Christian Life was very likely to succeed in its challenge.
> 
> The Alliance Defending Freedom, a conservative legal group that backed the lawsuit, lauded the outcome in a statement.
> 
> “Students of any religious, political, or ideological persuasion should be able to freely and peacefully speak with their fellow students about their views without interference from university officials who may prefer one view over another,” the group said in a statement. “NC State did the right thing in revising its policy to reflect this instead of continuing to defend its previous policy, which was not constitutionally defensible.”


----------



## NoGoal

Zerodenero said:


> Its interesting Make - so you're probably 100% accurate, yet you've got 4 ......I bet if the their dd was in the same sitch, perspective would be different,  and ya get the thumbs up
> 
> That said, one call up to YNT goes a long way outside the top 5-10 soccer schools for recruiting


ZD, Exactly all it takes is for a DOC to recommend one of their top players to a US Soccer head coach.  Even if the player is cycled out after 1 camp.  TopDrawerSoccer will then rank the player as a top 150 recruit.  The player then gets a ton of recuiting action.  The parents after gulping down 5 gallons of the DOC Kool-Aid saying, see what I can do for your DD.  The parents are hooked for life.


----------



## dfbmike

t


NoGoal said:


> I understand what you are posting, I know about international soccer academies-my stepfather played for the Dortmund Development Youth Division until U17 and told me the entire process when he grow up in Germany.
> 
> US Soccer does have a level below MLS.... It's the USL, I recently read aligned with MLS teams and is now considered their minor league.  This was created for boys wanting to skip college soccer, yet Jordan Morris played for Stanford and was still drafted and plays for the Sounders.  If his career is cut short he always has his Stanford/college degree to fall back on.  If being drafted by a MLS team meant millions of money out of HS, then yes he probably would have skipped college like baseball players do....then again, that isn't the case at the present is it?
> 
> Yes, I comprehend you are posting about girls dreaming of playing professional women's soccer.  The problem still remains there is NO FINANCIAL incentive to skip playing college soccer altogether and make a comfortable living playing professional women's soccer.  The only player that gave up her college eligibility was Lindsey Horan and she was a YNT starter.  So for non-YNT starters and below....which is probably 99.999999% of the girls playing.  It's NOT going to happen.  Thus, why I said you are in lala land, which is okay....because, there always needs to be a dreamer in this world.
> 
> You are also _*assuming ,*_ US Soccer created a Girls DA league as an alternative route for girls to skip college altogether and play womens soccer professionally.  Please post an article that April Heinrich or Jill Ellis stated just that.
> 
> NOW for USSDA......there is the huge difference and you should know this.  US BOYS and GIRLS DA are NOT fully funded (except MLS teams), where as on the international level (at least) on the boys side it is, inculding smaller professional level 3/4 clubs.  I have no clue, if the international girls academies are fully funded, but I would say it is....because, the Euro leagues revenues are in multi-millions and are capable to subsidize a womens team.


ok, now you have my undivided attention
Morris skipped his senior year, partially at the advice of his NT coach and I think it was wise, nagbe skipped a year, pulisic, altidore, shea, agudelo skipped college altogether...pulisic should be ahead of the curve from morris and nagbe as he is playing Bundesliga at 17/18 while Morris and Nagbe played you know, college....lets see how that plays out in comparison as all 3 will be the next wave of hugely improved american players
again this is my personal opinion, but college soccer as it currently stands is a detriment to the development of 18-22 y/o soccer players as compared to the professional players from successful footballing nations, it leaves a huge 3 to 4 year void.  heck what is the first thing any college soccer parent will tell you on here?  to find a school based on academics not soccer, correct?  So is it soccer centric development?  
The NCAA don't even give a crap about college soccer, heck they don't even play by fifa rules, a full soccer season cramped into 1 semester?  
Lets improve college soccer while we are at it as well, why not.

and as for the assumption, that is 100% correct, that is my assumption and the outlook that i personally have...one would assume US soccer did not create DA just for the hell of it, but with an endgame in mind.
out of 25 original teams selected 6 were NWSL and 2 MLS, i think that is a good start, agreed?  now those leagues have to keep expanding, evolving and US soccer has to add additional layers, which they are as you mentioned.

I do understand DA is not fully funded yet, never said it was....those are all things that double pass is currently consulting US Soccer on and trying to resolve.  As i've said all along, it is a long process, maybe your stepfather can tell you when european academies were formed, even they still are in the early stages, really.


----------



## It won't matter later

I am late to this. All I have to add are these points:
1.The u17 ECNL Strikers team beat Legends when they played in Surf Cup in summer 2015.
2. At the end of this season, that team had 4 2016 commits, 10 2017 commits and 1 2018 commit.  2 more 2016s declined D1 offers to play JUCO first.
3.The club and ECNL did its job.

CaliKlines you seem to be a good guy interested in your daughter's success.  Can you dial back the anti-Strikers message and just focus on being happy you left?


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> t
> 
> 
> ok, now you have my undivided attention
> Morris skipped his senior year, partially at the advice of his NT coach and I think it was wise, nagbe skipped a year, pulisic, altidore, shea, agudelo skipped college altogether...pulisic should be ahead of the curve from morris and nagbe as he is playing Bundesliga at 17/18 while Morris and Nagbe played you know, college....lets see how that plays out in comparison as all 3 will be the next wave of hugely improved american players
> again this is my personal opinion, but college soccer as it currently stands is a detriment to the development of 18-22 y/o soccer players as compared to the professional players from successful footballing nations, it leaves a huge 3 to 4 year void.  heck what is the first thing any college soccer parent will tell you on here?  to find a school based on academics not soccer, correct?  So is it soccer centric development?
> The NCAA don't even give a crap about college soccer, heck they don't even play by fifa rules, a full soccer season cramped into 1 semester?
> Lets improve college soccer while we are at it as well, why not.
> 
> and as for the assumption, that is 100% correct, that is my assumption and the outlook that i personally have...one would assume US soccer did not create DA just for the hell of it, but with an endgame in mind.
> out of 25 original teams selected 6 were NWSL and 2 MLS, i think that is a good start, agreed?  now those leagues have to keep expanding, evolving and US soccer has to add additional layers, which they are as you mentioned.
> 
> I do understand DA is not fully funded yet, never said it was....those are all things that double pass is currently consulting US Soccer on and trying to resolve.  As i've said all along, it is a long process, maybe your stepfather can tell you when european academies were formed, even they still are in the early stages, really.


You are now comparing apples and oranges in regards to the development path between boys and girls! Pulisic is better and will continue to be better than Morris no doubt about that.  Better training and competition in Germany as long as he continues to earn playing time there. Proving USSDA Boys is inferior leaving at 16 yrs of age for Dortmund.  After a decade of boys USSDA developing 12 yr olds, who are now 22, yet the Mens U23 FAILED to qualify for the Olympics.  USDDA sure is progressing the Boys development.

As for women, different environment and where we differ.  You assuming, is exactly that assuming.

My stepfather is in his 60s, Dortmund's youth academy has been around before him and he will tell you their German club boys academies are NOT in it's early stages....it was free for him to attend their academy which includes free board and education....duh!  Want to hear his exact words, when he asked why parents pay for club soccer? It's STUPID to be paying for soccer, itshould be FREE!


----------



## MakeAPlay

dfbmike said:


> t
> 
> 
> ok, now you have my undivided attention
> Morris skipped his senior year, partially at the advice of his NT coach and I think it was wise, nagbe skipped a year, pulisic, altidore, shea, agudelo skipped college altogether...pulisic should be ahead of the curve from morris and nagbe as he is playing Bundesliga at 17/18 while Morris and Nagbe played you know, college....lets see how that plays out in comparison as all 3 will be the next wave of hugely improved american players
> again this is my personal opinion, but college soccer as it currently stands is a detriment to the development of 18-22 y/o soccer players as compared to the professional players from successful footballing nations, it leaves a huge 3 to 4 year void.  heck what is the first thing any college soccer parent will tell you on here?  to find a school based on academics not soccer, correct?  So is it soccer centric development?
> The NCAA don't even give a crap about college soccer, heck they don't even play by fifa rules, a full soccer season cramped into 1 semester?
> Lets improve college soccer while we are at it as well, why not.
> 
> and as for the assumption, that is 100% correct, that is my assumption and the outlook that i personally have...one would assume US soccer did not create DA just for the hell of it, but with an endgame in mind.
> out of 25 original teams selected 6 were NWSL and 2 MLS, i think that is a good start, agreed?  now those leagues have to keep expanding, evolving and US soccer has to add additional layers, which they are as you mentioned.
> 
> I do understand DA is not fully funded yet, never said it was....those are all things that double pass is currently consulting US Soccer on and trying to resolve.  As i've said all along, it is a long process, maybe your stepfather can tell you when european academies were formed, even they still are in the early stages, really.


http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=4200&ATCLID=211070289


This is the type of decisions that US soccer forces players into.  This girl was a starter on the U20 WWC team that won it all in 2012.  4 years later she is done with soccer.  It's just the reality of the world that we live in.  US soccer is not really trying to change that.  To me it seems to simply be paying lip service and trying to do something so that it doesn't look like they are doing nothing.  Even if what they are doing is ill conceived.


----------



## NoGoal

It won't matter later said:


> I am late to this. All I have to add are these points:
> 1.The u17 ECNL Strikers team beat Legends when they played in Surf Cup in summer 2015.
> 2. At the end of this season, that team had 4 2016 commits, 10 2017 commits and 1 2018 commit.  2 more 2016s declined D1 offers to play JUCO first.
> 3.The club and ECNL did its job.
> 
> CaliKlines you seem to be a good guy interested in your daughter's success.  Can you dial back the anti-Strikers message and just focus on being happy you left?


And for those who don't know.  IWML's DD is committed to a Big10 school!


----------



## NoGoalItAll

I'm still looking for that pre-ECNL Arsenal girls championship.  Any help MakeItUp?  Where's that article you posted before you got "bored"?


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoalItAll said:


> I'm still looking for that pre-ECNL Arsenal girls championship.  Any help MakeItUp?  Where's that article you posted before you got "bored"?



Hey douche bag.  Or should I call you Legends homer.  Why don't you focus on how great your club is and how talented your kid is and the amazingly lame school that she is going to.  Or are you a coach?  If you are JH or ME or any of those other tools or even if you are not, please message me directly and I will be more than happy to put you in your place.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoalItAll said:


> I'm still looking for that pre-ECNL Arsenal girls championship.  Any help MakeItUp?  Where's that article you posted before you got "bored"?


I see that you blocked your page.  Are you afraid of something?  Keep hanging with Cali and the Legends clown show.  I am way out of your league.


----------



## Sped

soccerobserver said:


> Interesting reading...Seeeems like DA is sitting in command in the drivers seat...what happens to ECNL when DA announces two or three seasons from now that they are expanding to 1 team per age/year instead of 1 team per 2 age group/years ?


I don't think it matters. There are still plenty of talented girls who may not make the DA cut who would love to play ECNL.


----------



## MessiFTW

NoGoal said:


> And for those who don't know.  IWML's DD is committed to a Big10 school!


I have never seen her play nor do I care to but playing in the Big 10 simply means she is big and borderline fast and lacking technical skill.


----------



## NoGoal

MessiFTW said:


> I have never seen her play nor do I care to but playing in the Big 10 simply means she is big and borderline fast and lacking technical skill.


That is so rude and since you haven't seen her play.  You should NEVER stereotype a player.  Fact is her DD is very good on the ball and passes the ball well and yes I have seen her play.

Rose Lavelle plays for Wisconsin (Big10) and she is as technically as it gets!  I have also seen Northwestern play on cable and they also knock the ball on the ground.


----------



## timbuck

Can we stop this pissing match?
Summary

DA- might be good, might be bad
ECNL- gets kids to college. Good for some, bad for others. 
Other- kids get college scholarships in a variety of ways. The above options aren't the only way 
Pro soccer for women isn't (currently) a great long term career choice. 
Some people hold weird grudges against teams
Some people are too involved in the lives of others


----------



## NoGoal

timbuck said:


> Can we stop this pissing match?
> Summary
> 
> DA- might be good, might be bad
> ECNL- gets kids to college. Good for some, bad for others.
> Other- kids get college scholarships in a variety of ways. The above options aren't the only way
> Pro soccer for women isn't (currently) a great long term career choice.
> Some people hold weird grudges against teams
> Some people are too involved in the lives of others


I'm 25 feet from the mark, pissing down wind of course.


----------



## MessiFTW

NoGoal said:


> You should NEVER stereotype a player.


I am only stereotyping the typical SoCal player.  Defensive backs that kick it to a sprinting forward.  No technical ability or midfield required.


----------



## Livinthedream

MessiFTW said:


> I am only stereotyping the typical SoCal player.  Defensive backs that kick it to a sprinting forward.  No technical ability or midfield required.


IDIOT!!


----------



## MessiFTW

Call me names all you want but have you seen the Slammers play lately?  It is total U10 boot ball.  It is embarrassing to watch.  Another pathetic boot ball club is Surf, they come in a close second.  Both have fast players to chase down those balls......


----------



## Zerodenero

MakeAPlay said:


> I see that you blocked your page.  Are you afraid of something?  Keep hanging with Cali and the Legends clown show.  I am way out of your league.


Dang Mama-P.....you're on beast mode - Love it!!


----------



## Zerodenero

MessiFTW said:


> Call me names all you want but have you seen the Slammers play lately?  It is total U10 boot ball.  It is embarrassing to watch.  Another pathetic boot ball club is Surf, they come in a close second.  Both have fast players to chase down those balls......





MessiFTW said:


> I am only stereotyping the typical SoCal player.  Defensive backs that kick it to a sprinting forward.  No technical ability or midfield required.


Ahh dang!!!!...I always thought we here in Socal were doing our kids wrong. 

That's it Boss, we coming to join you in in AZ so our DD's can learn to play real soccer


----------



## NoGoal

MessiFTW said:


> Call me names all you want but have you seen the Slammers play lately?  It is total U10 boot ball.  It is embarrassing to watch.  Another pathetic boot ball club is Surf, they come in a close second.  Both have fast players to chase down those balls......


U10, your DD is U10.


----------



## Livinthedream

MessiFTW said:


> Call me names all you want but have you seen the Slammers play lately?  It is total U10 boot ball.  It is embarrassing to watch.  Another pathetic boot ball club is Surf, they come in a close second.  Both have fast players to chase down those balls......


Have you ever seen Beach play? Possession out of the back. Nothing like you Arizonians play.


----------



## MessiFTW

The only club in CA that trains and plays possession soccer is DeAnza.  The rest of Cali relies on athletic ability.  Beach is irrelevant until you win something that matters.  Zoom Zoom >>>>>>>>>>>>


----------



## Livinthedream

MessiFTW said:


> The only club in CA that trains and plays possession soccer is DeAnza.  The rest of Cali relies on athletic ability.  Beach is irrelevant until you win something that matters.  Zoom Zoom >>>>>>>>>>>>


I guess 3 National Championships are irrelevant...get a rep.


----------



## timbuck

Here's the funny thing about the discussion of possession vs boot ball-
A team could possess the ball 80% of the game. But they score a goal on a quick counter by sending a forward on a through ball.  That team wins 1-0 and everyone says "well, they only scored because they play kickball". 
Soccer should be dynamic.  Play with your strengths.  Play with what the other team gives you.  Hopefully the players recognize the cues to play different styles. But if a coach instructs some tactical changes to win a game, it's not the end of the world.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

MessiFTW said:


> The only club in CA that trains and plays possession soccer is DeAnza.  The rest of Cali relies on athletic ability.  Beach is irrelevant until you win something that matters.  Zoom Zoom >>>>>>>>>>>>


Possession soccer can be stuffed with quicker and better athletes.  The 98 De Anza team is no more.  Deza is way overrated as it's easy to be good when you have the best players in nor cal.

At the end of the day it's about winning.  De Anza can posses the ball 90% of the time but if two long balls get thru they lose 2-0.


----------



## MessiFTW

I love how the socal parents justify playing the beautiful game, ugly.  It is funny.


----------



## Swoosh

eastbaysoccer said:


> Possession soccer can be stuffed with quicker and better athletes.


Genius.  I didn't know possession soccer could be stopped.  Can direct soccer be stopped too?


----------



## Swoosh

MessiFTW said:


> The only club in CA that trains and plays possession soccer is DeAnza.  The rest of Cali relies on athletic ability.  Beach is irrelevant until you win something that matters.  Zoom Zoom >>>>>>>>>>>>


Because youth championships matter.


----------



## dfbmike

NoGoal said:


> You are now comparing apples and oranges in regards to the development path between boys and girls! Pulisic is better and will continue to be better than Morris no doubt about that.  Better training and competition in Germany as long as he continues to earn playing time there. Proving USSDA Boys is inferior leaving at 16 yrs of age for Dortmund.  After a decade of boys USSDA developing 12 yr olds, who are now 22, yet the Mens U23 FAILED to qualify for the Olympics.  USDDA sure is progressing the Boys development.
> 
> As for women, different environment and where we differ.  You assuming, is exactly that assuming.
> 
> My stepfather is in his 60s, Dortmund's youth academy has been around before him and he will tell you their German club boys academies are NOT in it's early stages....it was free for him to attend their academy which includes free board and education....duh!  Want to hear his exact words, when he asked why parents pay for club soccer? It's STUPID to be paying for soccer, itshould be FREE!


USSDA is progressing boys development, college is the depriment to american soccer, we have plenty of good young soccer players that are left behind in the ages of 18 and 22 not 10 to 17 in pure soccer development, I already said that, and I stand by it.  and US soccer happens to agree, hence they are in repair mode.  apples and oranges, I believe you brought Jordan Morris into this discussion?
our u23 team is made up of mostly what?  college players?  players who have to subsidise their own trg and hope they can catch on to a pdl team close by to get additional playing time and exposure during A LOT of soccer down time?  Our u23 compete against international teams who have you know academy and professional players?

My assumptions are closer to reality than your assumptions of a womens league that will supposedly never prosper.
With only 10 teams in the NWSL 6 now have a direct player pipeline through DA, that is 60% and it will grow as will the league.  it is only a matter of time before more young men sign pro contracts at 18 and bypass college and that dumb draft and women will follow suit, it is the natural progression.  MLS and NWSl will grow, they will create jobs, they will create even more soccer interest, it will create soccer minds and with that will come more player opportunities.  Expansions will come and with that new academies will form.  how do you know what goes on behind the scenes and what new affiliations are being formed?  How do we know what the actuall criteria were to be selected into DA, one would assume a path to professional soccer is one.

I'm not stretching this discussion more by adding additional topics such as you wanting to play for free and the history of german soccer academies.  I played in Germany until 1996(not saying I was any good) and yes it was free.

That is it for me my man, this discussion with you is going nowhere because you do not have an open mind and you don't believe in growth and creating additional opportunities for others.
Good luck with your outlook.


----------



## Legendary FC

Swoosh said:


> Because youth championships matter.


Youth championships matter?


----------



## Swoosh

Legendary FC said:


> Youth championships matter?


Apparently.


----------



## Legendary FC

dfbmike said:


> USSDA is progressing boys development, college is the depriment to american soccer, we have plenty of good young soccer players that are left behind in the ages of 18 and 22 not 10 to 17 in pure soccer development, I already said that, and I stand by it.  and US soccer happens to agree, hence they are in repair mode.
> our u23 team is made up of mostly what?  college players?  players who have to subsidise their own trg and hope they can catch on to a pdl team close by to get additional playing time and exposure during A LOT of soccer down time?  Our u23 compete against international teams who have you know academy and professional players?
> 
> My assumptions are closer to reality than your assumptions of a womens league that will supposedly never prosper.
> With only 10 teams in the NWSL 6 now have a direct player pipeline through DA, that is 60% and it will grow as will the league.  it is only a matter of time before more young men sign pro contracts at 18 and bypass college and that dumb draft and women will follow suit, it is the natural progression.  MLS and NWSl will grow, they will create jobs, they will create even more soccer interest, it will create soccer minds and with that will come more player opportunities.  Expansions will come and with that new academies will form.  how do you know what goes on behind the scenes and what new affiliations are being formed?  How do we know what the actuall criteria were to be selected into DA, one would assume a path to professional soccer is one.
> 
> I'm not stretching this discussion more by adding additional topics such as you wanting to play for free and the history of german soccer academies.  I played in Germany until 1996 and yes it was free.
> 
> That is it for me my man, this discussion with you is going nowhere because you do not have an open mind and you don't believe in growth and creating additional opportunities for others.
> Good luck with your outlook.





Swoosh said:


> Apparently.



To whom?


----------



## Zerodenero

Legendary FC said:


> To whom?


1) The player 2) The parent 3) prospective college coach


----------



## Legendary FC

Zerodenero said:


> 1) The player 2) The parent 3) prospective college coach


I get that it matters to the player.  Not sure why it would matter to the parent or the college coach.  Parents should support their kids regardless of whether they are on a championship team or not.  College coaches recruit players not teams.


----------



## Zerodenero

dfbmike said:


> USSDA is progressing boys development, college is the depriment to american soccer, we have plenty of good young soccer players that are left behind in the ages of 18 and 22 not 10 to 17 in pure soccer development, I already said that, and I stand by it.  and US soccer happens to agree, hence they are in repair mode.
> our u23 team is made up of mostly what?  college players?  players who have to subsidise their own trg and hope they can catch on to a pdl team close by to get additional playing time and exposure during A LOT of soccer down time?  Our u23 compete against international teams who have you know academy and professional players?
> 
> My assumptions are closer to reality than your assumptions of a womens league that will supposedly never prosper.
> With only 10 teams in the NWSL 6 now have a direct player pipeline through DA, that is 60% and it will grow as will the league.  it is only a matter of time before more young men sign pro contracts at 18 and bypass college and that dumb draft and women will follow suit, it is the natural progression.  MLS and NWSl will grow, they will create jobs, they will create even more soccer interest, it will create soccer minds and with that will come more player opportunities.  Expansions will come and with that new academies will form.  how do you know what goes on behind the scenes and what new affiliations are being formed?  How do we know what the actuall criteria were to be selected into DA, one would assume a path to professional soccer is one.
> 
> I'm not stretching this discussion more by adding additional topics such as you wanting to play for free and the history of german soccer academies.  I played in Germany until 1996 and yes it was free.
> 
> That is it for me my man, this discussion with you is going nowhere because you do not have an open mind and you don't believe in growth and creating additional opportunities for others.
> Good luck with your outlook.


DFmike - Appreciate the shared insight/perspective.


----------



## Zerodenero

Legendary FC said:


> I get that it matters to the player.  Not sure why it would matter to the parent or the college coach.  Parents should support their kids regardless of whether they are on a championship team or not.  College coaches recruit players not teams.


Intrinsically it just does.


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> USSDA is progressing boys development, college is the depriment to american soccer, we have plenty of good young soccer players that are left behind in the ages of 18 and 22 not 10 to 17 in pure soccer development, I already said that, and I stand by it.  and US soccer happens to agree, hence they are in repair mode.
> our u23 team is made up of mostly what?  college players?  players who have to subsidise their own trg and hope they can catch on to a pdl team close by to get additional playing time and exposure during A LOT of soccer down time?  Our u23 compete against international teams who have you know academy and professional players?
> 
> My assumptions are closer to reality than your assumptions of a womens league that will supposedly never prosper.
> With only 10 teams in the NWSL 6 now have a direct player pipeline through DA, that is 60% and it will grow as will the league.  it is only a matter of time before more young men sign pro contracts at 18 and bypass college and that dumb draft and women will follow suit, it is the natural progression.  MLS and NWSl will grow, they will create jobs, they will create even more soccer interest, it will create soccer minds and with that will come more player opportunities.  Expansions will come and with that new academies will form.  how do you know what goes on behind the scenes and what new affiliations are being formed?  How do we know what the actuall criteria were to be selected into DA, one would assume a path to professional soccer is one.
> 
> I'm not stretching this discussion more by adding additional topics such as you wanting to play for free and the history of german soccer academies.  I played in Germany until 1996 and yes it was free.
> 
> That is it for me my man, this discussion with you is going nowhere because you do not have an open mind and you don't believe in growth and creating additional opportunities for others.
> Good luck with your outlook.


Yawn, didn't even finish reading your post! Especially, when it takes you a day to reply.

BTW, keep dreaming...the world needs dreamers!  Also, if you have a daughter playing soccer.  I highly suggest having her play college soccer vs chasing a NWSL contract, but that's up to you.......BRO!


----------



## dfbmike

NoGoal said:


> Yawn, didn't even finish reading your post!"


 Sure. deuces


----------



## Legendary FC

Zerodenero said:


> Intrinsically it just does.


Fair enough.  I love your avatar!


----------



## offthecrossbar

Where is CaliKlines?  Quick, somebody pull him out of his director of coachings arse.


----------



## Zerodenero

Legendary FC said:


> Fair enough.  I love your avatar!


Cool Cool.......Yours truly -  Jules


----------



## CaliKlines

offthecrossbar said:


> Where is CaliKlines?  Quick, somebody pull him out of his director of coachings arse.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Here is post on the subject on another forum that I follow from member chch:

from best I can tell GDA is basically a big power play to crush ECNL club based control.

Mallory Pugh's ex coach and director of her ECNL team basically said as much. US soccer had a camp (not a game) during an ECNL showcase/playoff for no apparent reason other than to pull out the ECNL players.

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/club...lorado-coach-rips-ussfs-ecnl-scheduling-snub/

Also, the game amount/schedule seems identical to current ECNL per year.

The only differences seem actually potentially "bad" for the players and families. (1) Only 5 substitutions with no re-entry on rosters with 23 players. (2) A mandated 4th practice a week - balancing School is vitally important for girls since they have no chance of making decent income in soccer. 3 practices a week that are far enough away in addition to occasionally missing a Friday of school are bad enough. (3) mandated no high school soccer. I hope GDA is stupid enough to start with everyone banned from high school but I predict they will be savvy enough to grandfather it in.

I will take this all back if (1) GDA is basically free or close to it and (2) teams must have at least 5 players rostered whose household income is <$100,000


----------



## chiefs

dfbmike said:


> USSDA is progressing boys development, college is the depriment to american soccer, we have plenty of good young soccer players that are left behind in the ages of 18 and 22 not 10 to 17 in pure soccer development, I already said that, and I stand by it.  and US soccer happens to agree, hence they are in repair mode.  apples and oranges, I believe you brought Jordan Morris into this discussion?
> our u23 team is made up of mostly what?  college players?  players who have to subsidise their own trg and hope they can catch on to a pdl team close by to get additional playing time and exposure during A LOT of soccer down time?  Our u23 compete against international teams who have you know academy and professional players?
> 
> My assumptions are closer to reality than your assumptions of a womens league that will supposedly never prosper.
> With only 10 teams in the NWSL 6 now have a direct player pipeline through DA, that is 60% and it will grow as will the league.  it is only a matter of time before more young men sign pro contracts at 18 and bypass college and that dumb draft and women will follow suit, it is the natural progression.  MLS and NWSl will grow, they will create jobs, they will create even more soccer interest, it will create soccer minds and with that will come more player opportunities.  Expansions will come and with that new academies will form.  how do you know what goes on behind the scenes and what new affiliations are being formed?  How do we know what the actuall criteria were to be selected into DA, one would assume a path to professional soccer is one.
> 
> I'm not stretching this discussion more by adding additional topics such as you wanting to play for free and the history of german soccer academies.  I played in Germany until 1996(not saying I was any good) and yes it was free.
> 
> That is it for me my man, this discussion with you is going nowhere because you do not have an open mind and you don't believe in growth and creating additional opportunities for others.
> Good luck with your outlook.


See ya in 50+ years....when discussions can actually be in closer to reality.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Here is post on the subject on another forum that I follow from member chch:
> 
> from best I can tell GDA is basically a big power play to crush ECNL club based control.
> 
> Mallory Pugh's ex coach and director of her ECNL team basically said as much. US soccer had a camp (not a game) during an ECNL showcase/playoff for no apparent reason other than to pull out the ECNL players.
> 
> http://www.soccerwire.com/news/club...lorado-coach-rips-ussfs-ecnl-scheduling-snub/
> 
> Also, the game amount/schedule seems identical to current ECNL per year.
> 
> The only differences seem actually potentially "bad" for the players and families. (1) Only 5 substitutions with no re-entry on rosters with 23 players. (2) A mandated 4th practice a week - balancing School is vitally important for girls since they have no chance of making decent income in soccer. 3 practices a week that are far enough away in addition to occasionally missing a Friday of school are bad enough. (3) mandated no high school soccer. I hope GDA is stupid enough to start with everyone banned from high school but I predict they will be savvy enough to grandfather it in.
> 
> I will take this all back if (1) GDA is basically free or close to it and (2) teams must have at least 5 players rostered whose household income is <$100,000


The limited substitutions takes the "D" out of GDA. 

The high school restrictions are politically  foolish.  The boys PDA program has shown players and families how to evade it, anyway.

$100,000 seems like kind of a high threshold.


----------



## Sped

I love the Arizona/CA discussion.  The only problem with AZ is that it takes an entire state to put a decent team together.  Imagine what SoCal would do if it only had 2 or 3 clubs to choose from!


----------



## Desert Hound

Sped said:


> I love the Arizona/CA discussion.  The only problem with AZ is that it takes an entire state to put a decent team together.  Imagine what SoCal would do if it only had 2 or 3 clubs to choose from!


I am curious how Surf puts together a good team. The population of SD country is about the same as the Phx metro area. I assume there are a lot of other clubs in the SD area as well. 

And of course if CA put together an all star team...it would be better vs the best in AZ.


----------



## gkrent

Desert Hound said:


> And of course if CA put together an all star team...it would be better vs the best in AZ.


That's what they are doing when CalSouth puts together an ODP squad.  The girls 99 team won the National title twice in a row.


----------



## picaboo

Anyone have inside info on Freedom FC?


----------



## cheaper2keeper

picaboo said:


> Anyone have inside info on Freedom FC?


You didn't hear it from me...but....They're probably not getting girls DA anytime soon.


----------



## It won't matter later

NoGoal said:


> That is so rude and since you haven't seen her play.  You should NEVER stereotype a player.  Fact is her DD is very good on the ball and passes the ball well and yes I have seen her play.
> 
> Rose Lavelle plays for Wisconsin (Big10) and she is as technically as it gets!  I have also seen Northwestern play on cable and they also knock the ball on the ground.


Thanks NG.   Now I remember why I thought twice about signing into the new forum... one post and my kid gets insulted.  Ugh.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> U10, your DD is U10.


I posted this yesterday (see above), but just now received 3 negatives all in consecutive minutes?  Hummmm, smells fishy...I bet all 3 of these aliases belong to the same person.


----------



## NoGoal

Here are screen shots of additional dislikes and likes by the same alias ( different post #'s)...anybody see a common denominator?  I will bet if posters pull up their dislikes....all the dislikes were posted within minutes of each other.


----------



## MessiFTW

A conspiracy of likes, dislikes, and dumb ratings.  Call 911.  Ha Ha.


----------



## 17SquirrelsDad

Desert Hound said:


> I am curious how Surf puts together a good team.


Simple - they have a very good product, e.g. a very good club. Some hate, some appreciate, some envy.


----------



## NoGoal

MessiFTW said:


> A conspiracy of likes, dislikes, and dumb ratings.  Call 911.  Ha Ha.


WRONG,  it reveals how HARD UP and mentally unstable YOU are to need 4 maybe 5 aliases for the forum, Sweetsplat!

Needing to log in and out or switch between aliases to post multiple dislikes and likes? PSYCHO!


----------



## Rev234

NoGoal said:


> I posted this yesterday (see above), but just now received 3 negatives all in consecutive minutes?  Hummmm, smells fishy...I bet all 3 of these aliases belong to the same person.
> View attachment 26


I thought your U10 comment was spot on. Lots of folks get too riled up way before they need to.


----------



## 3thatplay

NoGoal said:


> WRONG,  it reveals how HARD UP and mentally unstable YOU are to need 4 maybe 5 aliases for the forum, Sweetsplat!
> 
> Needing to log in and out or switch between aliases to post multiple dislikes and likes? PSYCHO!



You need a life.  Spending the time it took to review posted times of likes and dislikes and then making screenshots of them and posting your findings on a soccer forum is insane.  Go take a dip in the ocean and cool off.


----------



## NoGoal

3thatplay said:


> You need a life.  Spending the time it took to review posted times of likes and dislikes and then making screenshots of them and posting your findings on a soccer forum is insane.  Go take a dip in the ocean and cool off.


When a posters attacks a poster (IWML) who I know personally.  I will research to reveal who the moron is! 

As for you, you're like reading the headlines of a newspaper,  because you are the father of K.W. who plays for Carlsbad Elite U17 team and committed to Colorado for the class of 2018.  I hope your DD asked why Colorado had 7-8 players transfer off their team this off season, including a few who were starters. Rumor has it there is a lack of team chemistry. Idiot!


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> You are now comparing apples and oranges in regards to the development path between boys and girls! Pulisic is better and will continue to be better than Morris no doubt about that.  Better training and competition in Germany as long as he continues to earn playing time there. Proving USSDA Boys is inferior leaving at 16 yrs of age for Dortmund.  After a decade of boys USSDA developing 12 yr olds, who are now 22, yet the Mens U23 FAILED to qualify for the Olympics.  USDDA sure is progressing the Boys development.
> 
> As for women, different environment and where we differ.  You assuming, is exactly that assuming.
> 
> My stepfather is in his 60s, Dortmund's youth academy has been around before him and he will tell you their German club boys academies are NOT in it's early stages....it was free for him to attend their academy which includes free board and education....duh!  Want to hear his exact words, when he asked why parents pay for club soccer? It's STUPID to be paying for soccer, itshould be FREE!


One of the first things Klingsmann said about soccer in the United states. US soccer will never catch the rest of the world due to the simple fact that you have to pay for youth soccer here. For boys you maybe eliminating 30 % of the player pool just due to cost. Soccer is a great game it's just not being developed properly in the US... it's difficult to watch the men's national team play they r getting better but still difficult to watch.


----------



## Silky Johnston

Silky Johnston said:


> One of the first things Klingsmann said about soccer in the United states. US soccer will never catch the rest of the world due to the simple fact that you have to pay for youth soccer here. For boys you maybe eliminating 30 % of the player pool just due to cost. Soccer is a great game it's just not being developed properly in the US... it's difficult to watch the men's national team play they r getting better but still difficult to watch.


I didn't notice the Pulisic comment but the best thing he did was leave the US to go to BVB he is the future of US Mens soccer what's he going to learn here? To be the best you must train and play with best. It's not about standing out its about continuous improvement.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> When a posters attacks a poster (IWML) who I know personally.  I will research to reveal who the moron is!
> 
> As for you, you're like reading the headlines of a newspaper,  because you are the father of K.W. who plays for Carlsbad Elite U17 team and committed to Colorado for the class of 2018.  I hope your DD asked why Colorado had 7-8 players transfer off their team this off season, including a few who were starters. Rumor has it there is a lack of team chemistry. Idiot!



Ouch.  I was wondering why so many girls have been leaving some were even seniors!  Something must be rotten in Boulder.


----------



## Silky Johnston

CaliKlines said:


> I'm sorry...I didn't notice your qualifier of "repeat" YNT player. So now it is not good enough to produce YNT players, they must be repeat YNT players. These kids are young...give them time.


the u 15 gk for Legends isn't even the starter. Legends has a ton of talent but your wasting your time arguing the point in here. There is so much talent in So California it doesn't even matter who u play for ecnl non ecnl. Ecnl is the better Avenue for College at this point in a couple of years it might change to DA but who knows. I would never count on US soccer to do the right thing. There is ton of money to be made with girls soccer so until development is the primary focus instead of $ it will still have the same fundamental flaws just with a different group running it


----------



## Rev234

Speaking of  development Academy,  ecnl or odp.  Anyone watch the uswnt game?  Even though Costa Rica is horrible,  the US team didn't look much better.  Lots of kick n go.  Most disciplined player is the one non professional.  So I hope what ever program eventually becomes the norm we continue to develop the best athletes.


----------



## MessiFTW

Rev234 said:


> Lots of kick n go.


The team is playing the SoCal way.  Athletic ability over technical ability for the win!  No midfield required.


----------



## Silky Johnston

I wouldn't call it the So Cal way more like the US soccer way but the difference is they are there to win games not to play beautiful soccer.  They have the horses so why not use them? Would you rather them lose but play beautiful soccer.? I am sure if when Ellis goes in for her reviews with a losing record they will let her keep her job if she tells them but we play such beautiful soccer though. It's a whole different scenario for the USWNT


----------



## ladoctorr

USWNT has the ability to play possession when they want to...wish they wanted to more....playing direct and winning is easier....Pugh has vision beyond her years. Andres Deza should be part of our  ladies Youth National Development program.


----------



## Rev234

Ok.  So in short,  it's OK for uswnt to play ugly soccer because they are out to win? If you don't see the flaws in that logic,  and the negative effects it can have on young players,  then we have a whole new problem to deal with.


----------



## espola

17SquirrelsDad said:


> Simple - they have a very good product, e.g. a very good club. Some hate, some appreciate, some envy.


Which other "very good club" in So Cal has a coach in prison for raping girls on his team, had a coach dismissed from ODP staff for recruiting during practice, and threatened to sue people who tell the truth about them?


----------



## Silky Johnston

ladoctorr said:


> USWNT has the ability to play possession when they want to...wish they wanted to more....playing direct and winning is easier....Pugh has vision beyond her years. Andres Deza should be part of our  ladies Youth National Development program.


I am sure they can play whatever style they WANT direct / possession but the foundation has been layed previously it would take a total commitment to change to a pure possession style and imo  they are too deep to commit to an overhaul not at this point. They are implementing more passing but to get to want some people want it will have to come in small chunks. The USWNT is built for winning and our team has many advantages over the other countries at this point and one of them is definitely  athleticism there aren't many Morgan's or Wombachs on other teams.


----------



## espola

Silky Johnston said:


> I am sure they can play whatever style they WANT direct / possession but the foundation has been layed previously it would take a total commitment to change to a pure possession style and imo  they are too deep to commit to an overhaul not at this point. They are implementing more passing but to get to want some people want it will have to come in small chunks. The USWNT is built for winning and our team has many advantages over the other countries at this point and one of them is definitely  athleticism there aren't many Morgan's or Wombachs on other teams.


You get no points for possession.


----------



## Silky Johnston

Rev234 said:


> Ok.  So in short,  it's OK for uswnt to play ugly soccer because they are out to win? If you don't see the flaws in that logic,  and the negative effects it can have on young players,  then we have a whole new problem to deal with.


The problem isn't new it's been like this for years. What club does your DD play for? Do they play possession ? The system is flawed it has been for years but regardless the goals for the USWNT are not the same for youth soccer. You are comparing grapes and watermelons. It all starts with the youth programs and that starts with quality coaching. How many quality coaches are coaching u10 or less? Why do the better coaches coach olders? This system isn't built on development it's built on $ . We are all apart of the same hypocrisy. Trust me my favorite Womens team to watch is Japan I am all for changing to possession.


----------



## Silky Johnston

espola said:


> You get no points for possession.


Brownie points ... but that doesn't allow Ellis to keep her job.


----------



## espola

Silky Johnston said:


> The problem isn't new it's been like this for years. What club does your DD play for? Do they play possession ? The system is flawed it has been for years but regardless the goals for the USWNT are not the same for youth soccer. You are comparing grapes and watermelons. It all starts with the youth programs and that starts with quality coaching. How many quality coaches are coaching u10 or less? Why do the better coaches coach olders? This system isn't built on development it's built on $ . We are all apart of the same hypocrisy. Trust me my favorite Womens team to watch is Japan I am all for changing to possession.


It is possible, but unlikely, that a team will score without possessing the ball.  The point of possessing the ball is to put it in the other team's net, and prevent them from doing it to you.

That "beautiful game" mantra starts with coaches of losing GU10 teams.


----------



## meaningless

17SquirrelsDad said:


> Simple - they have a very good product, e.g. a very good club. Some hate, some appreciate, some envy.



Very good at the younger ages. Wouldn't say they are having all that much success these days at the ECNL level (relatively speaking) with more and more San Diego kids heading north for teams like Blues, West Coast, and Slammers. I expect DA will bring some real challenges for Surf as they will no longer be the only game in town for the top players.


----------



## Rev234

Silky Johnston said:


> The problem isn't new it's been like this for years. What club does your DD play for? Do they play possession ? The system is flawed it has been for years but regardless the goals for the USWNT are not the same for youth soccer. You are comparing grapes and watermelons. It all starts with the youth programs and that starts with quality coaching. How many quality coaches are coaching u10 or less? Why do the better coaches coach olders? This system isn't built on development it's built on $ . We are all apart of the same hypocrisy. Trust me my favorite Womens team to watch is Japan I am all for changing to possession.


The game has really changed for my DD as we move into U14.  Allmost exclusively all possession.  Small passes play out of the back. Reset,  re build and use the entire width of the field.   A much slower pace.   It's pretty to watch.   Girls are learning  to play more of a cerebral game (I know it sounds pretensions,  but not sure how to better describe it)  thought to execute against hyper aggressive teams.  Btw.   I love to. Watch woman's  France and brasil teams  as well


----------



## Silky Johnston

Rev234 said:


> The game has really changed for my DD as we move into U14.  Allmost exclusively all possession.  Small passes play out of the back. Reset,  re build and use the entire width of the field.   A much slower pace.   It's pretty to watch.   Girls are learning  to play more of a cerebral game (I know it sounds pretensions,  but not sure how to better describe it)  thought to execute against hyper aggressive teams.  Btw.   I love to. Watch woman's  France and brasil teams  as well


----------



## espola

I don't know how to respond to that.


----------



## Legendary FC

meaningless said:


> Very good at the younger ages. Wouldn't say they are having all that much success these days at the ECNL level (relatively speaking) with more and more San Diego kids heading north for teams like Blues, West Coast, and Slammers. I expect DA will bring some real challenges for Surf as they will no longer be the only game in town for the top players.



What do you consider success at the ECNL level?  Surf year in and year out is either the top club or the second best club.  Not to mention that they had more top recruits than any other club and more national team players too.  I doubt that Carlsbad will be a serious threat to Surf.  Results speak for themselves and Surf has the results.


----------



## MessiFTW

Very few of the Surf girls were developed by Surf.  They transferred in from somewhere else.  FACT.


----------



## Rev234

MessiFTW said:


> Very few of the Surf girls were developed by Surf.  They transferred in from somewhere else.  FACT.


I hear the same about arsenal Slammers.  This list could go on forever.


----------



## Rev234

Rev234 said:


> I hear the same about arsenal Slammers.  This list could go on forever.


Consider the big clubs to be like a finishing school of sorts.


----------



## NoGoal

Over the years I have come to learn possession soccer doesn't always dominate.  Barcelona doesn't always win with their possession game. As the Spanish national team has aged, they to haven't been able to repeat the same success from a few years ago. Pep taking over Bayern and implementing his style of possession soccer wasn't able to win a UEFA Champions league crown. Arsenal hasn't won an EPL crown since forever.

Teams that can play both possession and direct with an organized defense seem to have more success now.  Athletico, Real, Portugal, and even a defensive counter attacking team like Leicester City have won recent championships.


----------



## meaningless

Legendary FC said:


> What do you consider success at the ECNL level?  Surf year in and year out is either the top club or the second best club.  Not to mention that they had more top recruits than any other club and more national team players too.  I doubt that Carlsbad will be a serious threat to Surf.  Results speak for themselves and Surf has the results.



http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/ecnl-releases-overall-club-championship-final-rankings-for-2015-2016/

Just stating the facts...


----------



## outside!

Legendary FC said:


> What do you consider success at the ECNL level?  Surf year in and year out is either the top club or the second best club.  Not to mention that they had more top recruits than any other club and more national team players too.  I doubt that Carlsbad will be a serious threat to Surf.  Results speak for themselves and Surf has the results.


Depends on the age group. At the current U16 age group I would not rank Surf's ECNL team as the best in the county. The last two times they played Carlsbad, they lost 2-0. The two teams are roughly equal in getting their players committed to D1 schools.  There are some great players on that Surf team, but the team has had too much turmoil over the years and does not have a lock on the best players in the county. This points out the problem with closed systems/monopolies like ECNL and now GDA. Without relegation and a way for competitive teams to earn a spot, there is less incentive for clubs on the inside of the system to provide good service to the players and parents. At least now that both Surf and Carlsbad have GDA, one club will not have a monopoly in San Diego county. Carlsbad (now LA Galaxy San Diego) is one of the biggest clubs in the county and will be a threat to Surf since they now have the carrot to keep players from wandering. Make no mistake, GDA is a power grab by USYS, just as ECNL was a power grab by US Club Soccer. Unfortunately USSF is showing their usual complete lack of leadership.


----------



## espola

outside! said:


> Depends on the age group. At the current U16 age group I would not rank Surf's ECNL team as the best in the county. The last two times they played Carlsbad, they lost 2-0. The two teams are roughly equal in getting their players committed to D1 schools.  There are some great players on that Surf team, but the team has had too much turmoil over the years and does not have a lock on the best players in the county. This points out the problem with closed systems/monopolies like ECNL and now GDA. Without relegation and a way for competitive teams to earn a spot, there is less incentive for clubs on the inside of the system to provide good service to the players and parents. At least now that both Surf and Carlsbad have GDA, one club will not have a monopoly in San Diego county. Carlsbad (now LA Galaxy San Diego) is one of the biggest clubs in the county and will be a threat to Surf since they now have the carrot to keep players from wandering. Make no mistake, GDA is a power grab by USYS, just as ECNL was a power grab by US Club Soccer. Unfortunately USSF is showing their usual complete lack of leadership.


Power grab?  Or responding to market demand?

My daughter moved out of club soccer after her U10 year, so I have no direct experience with ECNL.  However, from what I have read, the biggest selling point for ECNL was enhanced exposure to college coaches and thus better chances of getting scholarships and/or admissions help.  How is that working out, compared to what was happening before?


----------



## Ghostwriter

Girls Development Soccer Academy is a power play/$$$ grab by US Soccer.  There is no need for a Girls US Soccer Academy league.  None of our girls will ever set stage on WNT Senior team.  The closes any of our daughters will get to there is maybe a YNT call up to an ID Camp or once a month practice with the US Soccer Federation.  Even that is a very rare event and only 1 out of hundreds of those kids will ever get a cap on the Youth National stage, forget about the Senior team that will never happen.  Reading posters post about how spots will open up when player X retires on the National team makes me laugh.  If I had a nickel for every parent that I have heard say little Susie has a good shot on playing on the National Team one day because she made ODP, US Soccer Federation Camp, or was the star of her youth team I would have a lot of nickels.  The whole National team could retire tomorrow and still none of our daughters will make it.  So what is Academy for the girls side?  Oh that's right it is a path for our daughters to play for $8,000 a year playing in the NWSL.  If that is your daughters end game then Academy is for you.  Oh then there is the argument it will be the top league, so after a year or two the college coaches will focus on that league.  Sure that is a possibility but what void does that fill?  Doesn't that league already exist?  So what is the end game for Girls Development Soccer Academy?  Bragging rights for 8 So Cal Clubs that either deserve or don't desrve the nod?  Where is the development?  Have you looked at the youngers in some of these selected Academy Girls Clubs?  There is no development going on its all about recruiting someone else's product once they hit U14 or older.  ECNL has been a good vehicle to getting kids college exposure but has made once proud clubs lazy because they don't invest in the development of youngers they just recruit at U14 and older for their ECNL squads.  I mean don't we have a development league already in play "SCDSL"  how has that been working out? The one thing US Soccer has going for it is the sheer number of players playing the game and the resources parents put into the development of their own kids. You all want to know why the US is #1 in the world is because of parents.  The amount of money spent annually by soccer mom's and dad's is the reason we are #1.  I haven't seen one good reason why we need GDA and until there is viable money making pro league for women then there is no reason.  As I stated above it has nothing to do with the National Team because that is a fantasy.  Don't get me wrong I am sure GDA will be a fine gaming circuit and will be the new shiny toy that many will want or hope will benefit their daughter in ways the other leagues may not have.  I am not anti-GDA, ECNL, FWRL, CRL, SCDSL, SDDA, CSL, or AYSO.  I don't care I am glad parents support their daughters in athletics and football is an amazing sport.  I hope the women's game continues to evolve and grow in popularity and everyone looks back when their daughters are done playing and remember the good times.  Just keep in mind club soccer is a business and no matter which league someone is hyping learn about it and always put your daughter first.  In the foreseeable future College is the end game for Women's soccer after club is over and unless your daughter can play Nationally for another country or is willing to play pro overseas that should be your sole focus no matter how many WNT players retire.


----------



## Legendary FC

meaningless said:


> http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/ecnl-releases-overall-club-championship-final-rankings-for-2015-2016/
> 
> Just stating the facts...



I can do that too.

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/ecnl-announces-2014-2015-top-10-overall-clubs/

http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/home/828196.html

http://www.crossfiresoccer.org/home/642296.html

http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/docs/2010-2011 Final Overall Club Ranking.pdf

It seems like most years they are near the top.


----------



## Legendary FC

espola said:


> Power grab?  Or responding to market demand?
> 
> My daughter moved out of club soccer after her U10 year, so I have no direct experience with ECNL.  However, from what I have read, the biggest selling point for ECNL was enhanced exposure to college coaches and thus better chances of getting scholarships and/or admissions help.  How is that working out, compared to what was happening before?


You can't honestly think that the market is demanding a path to the women's national team.  That path already exists.  ECNL has worked out pretty well and I would say has streamlined the recruiting process versus before.  You not having a daughter that went through the process would be unable to discern that.


----------



## espola

Legendary FC said:


> You can't honestly think that the market is demanding a path to the women's national team.  That path already exists.  ECNL has worked out pretty well and I would say has streamlined the recruiting process versus before.  You not having a daughter that went through the process would be unable to discern that.


I didn't mention national team at all.  My daughter didn't stick with soccer, but many of her friends did and we followed their paths through the recruiting mill.  Several of her friends (and my sons' friends as well) received significant athletic scholarships, but none through ECNL team exposure.


----------



## Legendary FC

espola said:


> I didn't mention national team at all.  My daughter didn't stick with soccer, but many of her friends did and we followed their paths through the recruiting mill.  Several of her friends (and my sons' friends as well) received significant athletic scholarships, but none through ECNL team exposure.


I know dozens upon dozens that received significant to full athletic scholarships through participation in ECNL including my own.  What is your point?


----------



## madcow

MessiFTW said:


> Very few of the Surf girls were developed by Surf.  They transferred in from somewhere else.  FACT.


Actually, that's not true. My daughter's team is U17. 10 girls played on either the A or B team (or younger) since U10 or 11. Another 6 girls have been on the team since U12/ 13. We have had a few people come from across the US and other countries to be on this team, but the bulk of the team has been with this club since they were little.


----------



## Sped

madcow said:


> Actually, that's not true. My daughter's team is U17. 10 girls played on either the A or B team (or younger) since U10 or 11. Another 6 girls have been on the team since U12/ 13. We have had a few people come from across the US and other countries to be on this team, but the bulk of the team has been with this club since they were little.


This is, of course, true, but it doesn't fit the "we hate Surf" agenda.  The 2005 EGLS team at Surf this year is a bulldozer and is made up largely of girls that have been with Surf for quite some time.  

The truth is that there are a lot of good clubs, with a lot of good teams filled with a lot of good players.  All this rancor about which club is better is just parents being parents.  Find a club that your kid likes, let her play, and see what happens.  Pretty easy.


----------



## meaningless

Legendary FC said:


> I can do that too.
> 
> http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/ecnl-announces-2014-2015-top-10-overall-clubs/
> 
> http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/home/828196.html
> 
> http://www.crossfiresoccer.org/home/642296.html
> 
> http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/docs/2010-2011 Final Overall Club Ranking.pdf
> 
> It seems like most years they are near the top.



Sorry should have been more specific...  

TODAY'S FACTS


----------



## Legendary FC

meaningless said:


> Sorry should have been more specific...
> 
> TODAY'S FACTS


So what you are saying is because they had one year where at least one team wasn't in the national championships signifies that they are struggling?  That's a pretty big reach.  Surf is and will continue to be one of the tops clubs in the country and the best in SoCal for long term development bar none.


----------



## Flojo

Legendary FC said:


> So what you are saying is because they had one year where at least one team wasn't in the national championships signifies that they are struggling?  That's a pretty big reach.  Surf is and will continue to be one of the tops clubs in the country and the best in SoCal for long term development bar none.


This. It'll take many consecutive years of bottom of the table performances for Surf's reputation as a club to drop, and I don't see it happening.


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> When a posters attacks a poster (IWML) who I know personally.  I will research to reveal who the moron is!
> 
> As for you, you're like reading the headlines of a newspaper,  because you are the father of K.W. who plays for Carlsbad Elite U17 team and committed to Colorado for the class of 2018.  I hope your DD asked why Colorado had 7-8 players transfer off their team this off season, including a few who were starters. Rumor has it there is a lack of team chemistry. Idiot!


Wrong team.


----------



## LadiesMan217

I love reading this poo!


----------



## meaningless

Legendary FC said:


> So what you are saying is because they had one year where at least one team wasn't in the national championships signifies that they are struggling?  That's a pretty big reach.  Surf is and will continue to be one of the tops clubs in the country and the best in SoCal for long term development bar none.



Let's hope you're right


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> Wrong team.


Nice try, but 3thatplay based on his profile lives in San Marcos and has Colorado as his avatar.  The only player committed to Colorado who lives in San Marcos is KW (refer to Google committment spreadsheet) who plays for Carlsbad/Galaxy and class of 2018.  Circumstantial evidence proves otherwise.

If you are referring to Colorado not haven't 7-8 players transfering out this offseason.  That is a FACT!


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Nice try, but 3thatplay based on his profile lives in San Marcos.  The only player committed to Colorado is KW from San Marcos (refer to Google committment spreadsheet) who plays for Carlsbad/Galaxy.  Lastly 3thatplat has Colorado as his avatar.
> 
> If you are referring to Colorado not haven't 7-8 players transfering out this offseason.  That is a FACT!


You are some sort of cross between Sherlock Holmes and Batman.  Please don't ID me.  I am transferring 10 crispy Benjamin's to your PayPal account.


----------



## pulguita

gkrent said:


> The professional circuit in Europe and US recruit mostly from college player pool.   Best option is Europe for those who won't be part of the starting 11 in NWSL.  Pays better and you get some pretty great experience.  Some players don't even get NT call ups until they've played pro!  I agree with those who aren't sold on the idea that DA is the only route to Pro or NT.  Anyone here who has a kid in the NT pool knows that there is a heavy political component to the whole process, too.


I guess this is as good a place as any to jump into this new revamped forum!  Gk excellent observation.  Here is another.  If you are going to the DA or whatever to try to get to the NT you are a fool.  Only here in the US has soccer been sold that the goal is the NT.  For the rest of the world the goal is to become a professional soccer player.  The NT is the cherry on top for every soccer dominating country in the world.  Until there are viable professional leagues where there is lucrative money the US will be behind or caught up to.  As NG has pointed out that the best option right now is for the truly passionate female soccer player to pursue soccer get a great education and have a great collegiate career.  If you do that well perhaps you go pro.  If you do well as a pro you get called into the NT.  Unfortunately there is no money being a female pro soccer player so it becomes a labor of love.  Until that changes things will trickle along.


----------



## Redman

Anyone know if any DA/ECNL teams will be playing against each other in Surf Cup?


----------



## madcow

Redman said:


> Anyone know if any DA/ECNL teams will be playing against each other in Surf Cup?


In their own bracket next year? Or in this upcoming Surf Cup?


----------



## CaliKlines

Redman said:


> Anyone know if any DA/ECNL teams will be playing against each other in Surf Cup?


Many Beach, Legends, Carlsbad/Galaxy SD teams are at the Youth Soccer National Championships in Frisco, TX right now thru the upcoming weekend.


----------



## Redman

madcow said:


> In their own bracket next year? Or in this upcoming Surf Cup?


In this upcoming surf cup.


----------



## Flojo

Redman said:


> In this upcoming surf cup.


Girls DA/Boys ECNL will start in the 2017/18 season.


----------



## Legendary FC

pulguita said:


> I guess this is as good a place as any to jump into this new revamped forum!  Gk excellent observation.  Here is another.  If you are going to the DA or whatever to try to get to the NT you are a fool.  Only here in the US has soccer been sold that the goal is the NT.  For the rest of the world the goal is to become a professional soccer player.  The NT is the cherry on top for every soccer dominating country in the world.  Until there are viable professional leagues where there is lucrative money the US will be behind or caught up to.  As NG has pointed out that the best option right now is for the truly passionate female soccer player to pursue soccer get a great education and have a great collegiate career.  If you do that well perhaps you go pro.  If you do well as a pro you get called into the NT.  Unfortunately there is no money being a female pro soccer player so it becomes a labor of love.  Until that changes things will trickle along.



Where have you been Pulgita!!  You hit the nail on the head!!  Good luck to your DD's team in Texas this week and good luck to her Trojan's in all but one game this year!


----------



## Legendary FC

CaliKlines said:


> Many Beach, Legends, Carlsbad/Galaxy SD teams are at the Youth Soccer National Championships in Frisco, TX right now thru the upcoming weekend.



Many of them are at home without an invite to either event.  I hope that the DA is all that you hope that it is going to be.  I wonder what will happen when your daughter switches clubs this time.  Let's see if you trash talk Legends.  Maybe Hodges has his hand far enough up your posterior that it doesn't matter.  Maybe you sober up over the course of the next two years. 

I am happy to continue being entertained by your unabashed and unapologetic cheerleading for your position regardless of how transparent it is.  Please carry on.


----------



## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> Nice try, but 3thatplay based on his profile lives in San Marcos and has Colorado as his avatar.  The only player committed to Colorado who lives in San Marcos is KW (refer to Google committment spreadsheet) who plays for Carlsbad/Galaxy and class of 2018.  Circumstantial evidence proves otherwise.
> 
> If you are referring to Colorado not haven't 7-8 players transfering out this offseason.  That is a FACT!
> 
> View attachment 35
> View attachment 36


----------



## Redman

Legendary FC said:


> Many of them are at home without an invite to either event.  I hope that the DA is all that you hope that it is going to be.  I wonder what will happen when your daughter switches clubs this time.  Let's see if you trash talk Legends.  Maybe Hodges has his hand far enough up your posterior that it doesn't matter.  Maybe you sober up over the course of the next two years.
> 
> I am happy to continue being entertained by your unabashed and unapologetic cheerleading for your position regardless of how transparent it is.  Please carry on.


My DD has played for both Arsenal FC and Legends FC. From early on, I remember the competitiveness between the two clubs and their leadership. While at AFC we were sold the hope for ECNL. At Legends we are sold development, "National titles" and college exposer. Both clubs hate on each other. Girls moving back and forth between clubs over the years. Both clubs have pluses and minuses. Time will tell who will be best as parents and players decided their paths with either ECNL or DA.


----------



## Silky Johnston

Redman said:


> My DD has played for both Arsenal FC and Legends FC. From early on, I remember the competitiveness between the two clubs and their leadership. While at AFC we were sold the hope for ECNL. At Legends we are sold development, "National titles" and college exposer. Both clubs hate on each other. Girls moving back and forth between clubs over the years. Both clubs have pluses and minuses. Time will tell who will be best as parents and players decided their paths with either ECNL or DA.


I have played at both also the only plus AFC has is ECNL. If you disagree please list anything I have missed...


----------



## Rev234

How bout SC blues 5-0 NJ Rush.?


----------



## MakeAPlay

How about Carlsbad.  Let's hear Cali's excuse on this one.

http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/u16g_carlsbad_gets_first_nationals_win_over_defending_national_champs_legends/


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> How about Carlsbad.  Let's hear Cali's excuse on this one.
> 
> http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/u16g_carlsbad_gets_first_nationals_win_over_defending_national_champs_legends/


No excuses. Why would I have to have an excuse? They played great. They are a DA club. Great ball movement from both teams. The only excuse I have is for the ice cold Shiner bock in my hand...there is some tremendously hot and humid weather in this godforsaken state.


----------



## Zerodenero

CaliKlines said:


> No excuses. Why would I have to have an excuse? They played great. They are a DA club. Great ball movement from both teams. The only excuse I have is for the ice cold Shiner bock in my hand...there is some tremendously hot and humid weather in this godforsaken state.


You must be sippin on some strong $h!t.....

COMMON Cali- Do your thing......give us some sort of excuse for us to churn on


----------



## offthecrossbar

CaliKlines said:


> No excuses. Why would I have to have an excuse? They played great. They are a DA club. Great ball movement from both teams. The only excuse I have is for the ice cold Shiner bock in my hand...there is some tremendously hot and humid weather in this godforsaken state.


Great Legends ball movement like this game?


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> No excuses. Why would I have to have an excuse? They played great. They are a DA club. Great ball movement from both teams. The only excuse I have is for the ice cold Shiner bock in my hand...there is some tremendously hot and humid weather in this godforsaken state.


Well played Cali I have to give you some credit for walking into a room knowing that you are going to get the business.  If you played it this way all of the time you know cool and collected kind of like a samurai,  you probably wouldn't get nearly the hassling that you get.  Although I couldn't choke down a shinerbock I'm more of a Dorado or Sculpin kinda girl.  That DA comment is pretty funny because as of now neither club is anything right now.  I hope for your sake that DA turns out to be more than a power play but based on the track record that I have seen for US Soccer this one is going to be another slow motion train wreck.


----------



## MakeAPlay

offthecrossbar said:


> Great Legends ball movement like this game?


Ouch!!


----------



## MessiFTW

offthecrossbar said:


> Great Legends ball movement like this game?


Legends are the Division II ambassadors of SoCal kick ball (behind D1 Slammers and Surf) at its finest or lowest, depending on your perspective.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> Legends are the Division II ambassadors of SoCal kick ball (behind D1 Slammers and Surf) at its finest or lowest, depending on your perspective.


It's funny because they would smash your daughters weak SC Del Sol team sweetchuck.  If you had half a brain (doubtful) you would focus less on Legends and SoCal and focus more on your mediocre (at best) club and getting your clearly bad to mediocre player committed to a JUCO or something useful.  I hear that Slammers and Surf could use some scrubs for their "G" teams!


----------



## Zerodenero

MakeAPlay said:


> It's funny because they would smash your daughters weak SC Del Sol team sweetchuck.  If you had half a brain (doubtful) you would focus less on Legends and SoCal and focus more on your mediocre (at best) club and getting your clearly bad to mediocre player committed to a JUCO or something useful.  I hear that Slammers and Surf could use some scrubs for their "G" teams!


Dang you're good!

I think I'm in love


----------



## MessiFTW

I will just focus on trolling you.  It is working well so far.  You do have a tendency to go after kids though.  It is shameful character flaw.  It is your modus operandi when you get upset.

Shame (think Game of Thrones)
Shame
Shame
Shame
Shame


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> Nice try, but 3thatplay based on his profile lives in San Marcos and has Colorado as his avatar.  The only player committed to Colorado who lives in San Marcos is KW (refer to Google committment spreadsheet) who plays for Carlsbad/Galaxy and class of 2018.  Circumstantial evidence proves otherwise.
> 
> If you are referring to Colorado not haven't 7-8 players transfering out this offseason.  That is a FACT!
> 
> View attachment 35
> View attachment 36


But you still have the wrong team. I will give you a clue, next week, things will be different. As far as Avatars go, can you name the surf spot in mine?

Regarding the whole AZ vs. SoCal thing, why would anyone of us adults say negative things about any of these players (I am not talking about NoGoal here)? They are minors in case some of you  have forgotten. It is also considered to be somewhat in poor taste to post full names of minors on the forums. Maybe it is just me, but I have a tremendous amount of respect for these young women and feel privileged to watch them play. The ride is over soon, can't we just all get along and be happy to be involved with such an amazing group of athletes? The facts are that SoCal teams could get plenty of competition by playing other SoCal teams, but the artificial divide created by ECNL and soon to be GDA prevents that. If the AZ teams want to play SoCal teams, then let them come to SoCal if for no other reason than savings in jet fuel and hotel dollars. There are many good AZ teams and players, but the facts are that the population density of AZ does not allow for the same number of high level teams. 

I have nothing against ECNL teams. ECNL is for now the best way to get college exposure, but NOT the only way. The fact that top level players come from non-ECNL clubs proves that. GDA will change things in ways that will not concern many of us. The younger's parents will have to navigate that situation and I wish them luck. Remember, we are all caught in a fight for power and money between USYS and US Club Soccer, but that is certainly no reason to wish ill will on another team. ECNL and GDA certainly do not give a crap about the players or the parents. They only care about the money. ECNL is a closed monopoly that excludes many teams that could be competive. From the looks of it, GDA will be the same. If (and this is a big if), it is good for youth development to have teams from around the country compete with each other then it would seem to me that there should be a way for any team to earn a spot. Notice that I said TEAM, not CLUB. Why would you want to exclude and up and coming coach and team from a small club.

As far as Legends U16 goes, when they are firing on all cylinders, they can compete with anyone in their age group. We will never see that though due to the fact that the grownups that "manage" youth soccer can't get along.


----------



## NoGoal

MessiFTW said:


> Legends are the Division II ambassadors of SoCal kick ball (behind D1 Slammers and Surf) at its finest or lowest, depending on your perspective.


Yup, you are Sweetsplat alright.  You use to post in the old forum that everything outside of ECNL was the JV league and always attacking SoCal teams!


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> But you still have the wrong team. I will give you a clue, next week, things will be different. As far as Avatars go, can you name the surf spot in mine?


You have twice posted "wrong team", but not the wrong individual.  As for teams are you saying, 3thatplay's DD is moving to Surf or another club.  "next week things will be different", so she is still playing for Carlsbad in Texas for USYS Championships and it concludes this weekend.  My guess, his DD is moving to Surf to play ECNL this fall (DA doesn't begin yet), so she can play against girls she will be competing against in the Pac12 conference in 2 years time.

As for your avatar, I don't surf...but, obviously you do. I will take a guess though, Trestles.


----------



## MessiFTW

NoGoal said:


> Yup, you are Sweetsplat alright.  You use to post in the old forum that everything outside of ECNL was the JV league and always attacking SoCal teams!


I am definitely not Sweetsplat but I guess I have kinda taken that banner and run with it.  I post under this same user name on the AZ forum.


----------



## NoGoal

MessiFTW said:


> I am definitely not Sweetsplat but I guess I have kinda taken that banner and run with it.  I post under this same user name on the AZ forum.


You already admitted on the AZ forum that your DD plays for Del Sol U17, so be cognizant what you post, if you are running with his banner.  You could end up like Sweetsplat with threating private messages.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I will just focus on trolling you.  It is working well so far.  You do have a tendency to go after kids though.  It is shameful character flaw.  It is your modus operandi when you get upset.
> 
> Shame (think Game of Thrones)
> Shame
> Shame
> Shame
> Shame



If you think that it is working please keep it up I enjoy smacking you down.  You are transparent buddy.  I wonder if things are working out well with you and your wife.  I've seen lots like you come and go.  Especially when you realize that things aren't working out like you saw them working out.  

I get it.  You have to drive your kid out to California every other weekend and you are frustrated by the beat downs that you are watching your little Mia endure.  She is getting frustrated and thinking about taking up other activities (boys?) and it is pissing you off because you have been spending $10k a year since she was in 8th grade on soccer.  Not to mention that she isn't committed (like most of the players on her team) and you are starting to lose your faith in the platform provided by the ECNL.  You want to blame someone and since it can't be you then it has to be the kickball California teams that ARE getting their players into schools. 

I get it.  Not gonna work.  Nice try.  NEXT...


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> You already admitted on the AZ forum that your DD plays for Del Sol U17, so be cognizant what you post, if you are running with his banner.  You could end up like Sweetsplat with threating private messages.


oh no not another keyboard gangster


----------



## MakeAPlay

Silky Johnston said:


> oh no not another keyboard gangster


He wasn't making a threat.  He was referring to the threats that sweet splat received on the other forum that forced him to start his new persona on this and the Arizona forum.  He is a serious A-hole.


----------



## NoGoal

Silky Johnston said:


> oh no not another keyboard gangster


I highly suggest you read the AZ forum and you will know what happened to Sweetsplat!


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> I highly suggest you read the AZ forum and you will know what happened to Sweetsplat!


thanks but I have better things to waste my time on...


----------



## Silky Johnston

Silky Johnston said:


> thanks but I have better things to waste my time on...


it just made me laugh when he said that he was sending threatening PMs.. pretty comical.


----------



## NoGoal

Silky Johnston said:


> thanks but I have better things to waste my time on...


Like on this forum, lol


----------



## NoGoal

Silky Johnston said:


> it just made me laugh when he said that he was sending threatening PMs.. pretty comical.


What is comical?  Nothing is funny, if Sweetsplat was receiving threatening PM's from AZ posters.


No one on the forum is anonymous.  Everyone leaves a trail of bread crumbs that eventually reveals their identity and why MessiFTW should be careful, if he is carrying the Sweetsplat banner now.

For example: Sweetsplat used to post A LOT of crap on SoCal players and teams.  He was easy to ID, because he concentrated his post on 2 age groups.  He was pro ECNL, lived in AZ.  There are only 2 ECNL clubs in AZ.  He posted a lot about Sereno winning an ECNL Championship, so it was a subconscious tell that his older DD played on that team.  Cross reference that Sereno team roster with the younger ECNL roster (age group he posts on) for matching last names.  Then Google the player's first, last name and ECNL.... Viola identity uncovered.  Some crazy parents post their private information like home address, phone number and email on their DD's ECNL bio.   Good thing it's a new forum and ALL the bread crumbs have been swept away.


----------



## espola

NoGoal said:


> What is comical?  Nothing is funny, if Sweetsplat was receiving threatening PM's from AZ posters.
> View attachment 37
> 
> No one on the forum is anonymous.  Everyone leaves a trail of bread crumbs that eventually reveals their identity and why MessiFTW should be careful, if he is carrying the Sweetsplat banner now.
> 
> For example: Sweetsplat used to post crap on SoCal players and teams.  He was easy to ID, because he concentrated his post on 2 age groups.  He was pro ECNL, lived in AZ.  There are only 2 ECNL clubs in AZ.  He posted a lot about Sereno winning a ECNL Championship, so it was a subconscious tell his older DD played on that team.  Cross refernce the Sereno team with the younger ECNL roster for matching last names and identity revealed.  Some parents post on their DD's ECNL bio their home address and phone number. Walla identity uncovered.   Good thing it's a new forum and ALL the bread crumbs have been swept away.


Walla?


----------



## NoGoal

espola said:


> Walla?


Misspelled meant Voila.


----------



## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> What is comical?  Nothing is funny, if Sweetsplat was receiving threatening PM's from AZ posters.
> View attachment 37
> 
> No one on the forum is anonymous.  Everyone leaves a trail of bread crumbs that eventually reveals their identity and why MessiFTW should be careful, if he is carrying the Sweetsplat banner now.
> 
> For example: Sweetsplat used to post A LOT of crap on SoCal players and teams.  He was easy to ID, because he concentrated his post on 2 age groups.  He was pro ECNL, lived in AZ.  There are only 2 ECNL clubs in AZ.  He posted a lot about Sereno winning an ECNL Championship, so it was a subconscious tell that his older DD played on that team.  Cross reference that Sereno team roster with the younger ECNL roster (age group he posts on) for matching last names.  Then Google the player's first, last name and ECNL.... Viola identity uncovered.  Some crazy parents post their private information like home address, phone number and email on their DD's ECNL bio.   Good thing it's a new forum and ALL the bread crumbs have been swept away.


Nogogot, u got the 411....My buddies who are with various agencies would be impressed - for real.


----------



## Desert Hound

NoGoal said:


> Like on this forum, lol


All I can say is the AZ forum is generally speaking rather boring. Not enough people on it. This forum is more entertaining for sure.


----------



## MakeAPlay

So I just watched the replay of the Legends vs. CUP game and I have to tell you Cali, the Legends team is not a possession soccer team.  CUP held more possession and connected many more passes.  The PK call on the first goal could have gone either way and the second goal had no buildup and was simply a great individual effort from the outside back or wide mid that made the run and scored the goal.  Not sure what exquisite coaching Hodges does for that team but it isn't possession based.

I did like the black holding mid.  She bails the team out a lot and she does a good job of stopping threats up the middle and getting the attack going.  She doesn't turn with the ball with a defender on her back but she has all of the tools to be a successful college player and wouldn't be surprised if she is going to a power 5 conference school.  She will be a good college player but it probably has more to do with her and her parents and less about the Legends development machine.

Outside of her I wasn't impressed.  Just keeping it real.


----------



## bababooey

This thread is so much fun. Thank you to all that contribute.

I have found that coming back to this thread roughly every three days is better than daily. I like when there are a lot of posts to read.

Keep up the good work!


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> So I just watched the replay of the Legends vs. CUP game and I have to tell you Cali, the Legends team is not a possession soccer team.  CUP held more possession and connected many more passes.  The PK call on the first goal could have gone either way and the second goal had no buildup and was simply a great individual effort from the outside back or wide mid that made the run and scored the goal.  Not sure what exquisite coaching Hodges does for that team but it isn't possession based.
> 
> I did like the black holding mid.  She bails the team out a lot and she does a good job of stopping threats up the middle and getting the attack going.  She doesn't turn with the ball with a defender on her back but she has all of the tools to be a successful college player and wouldn't be surprised if she is going to a power 5 conference school.  She will be a good college player but it probably has more to do with her and her parents and less about the Legends development machine.
> 
> Outside of her I wasn't impressed.  Just keeping it real.


MAP, are you posting that Legends didn't get Girls DA, because of their player development and exquiste passing?  

BTW, I agree the Legends G99 holding mid is a great player and you nailed it.  She is committed to Arizona.


----------



## Silky Johnston

MakeAPlay said:


> So I just watched the replay of the Legends vs. CUP game and I have to tell you Cali, the Legends team is not a possession soccer team.  CUP held more possession and connected many more passes.  The PK call on the first goal could have gone either way and the second goal had no buildup and was simply a great individual effort from the outside back or wide mid that made the run and scored the goal.  Not sure what exquisite coaching Hodges does for that team but it isn't possession based.
> 
> I did like the black holding mid.  She bails the team out a lot and she does a good job of stopping threats up the middle and getting the attack going.  She doesn't turn with the ball with a defender on her back but she has all of the tools to be a successful college player and wouldn't be surprised if she is going to a power 5 conference school.  She will be a good college player but it probably has more to do with her and her parents and less about the Legends development machine.
> 
> Outside of her I wasn't impressed.  Just keeping it real.


one persons trash is another man's gold. There is a lot of talent on that legends team . What do u mean by legends development machine? Care to clarify.


----------



## NoGoal

Silky Johnston said:


> one persons trash is another man's gold. There is a lot of talent on that legends team . What do u mean by legends development machine? Care to clarify.


MAP was being sarcastic.  BTW, your posts are starting to sound as if you are a Legends parent....you are dropping bread crumbs!


----------



## SpeedK1llz

bababooey said:


> This thread is so much fun. Thank you to all that contribute.
> 
> I have found that coming back to this thread roughly every three days is better than daily. I like when there are a lot of posts to read.
> 
> Keep up the good work!


I could not agree more! That said, I am both entertained and sickened at the same time. It's one thing to bash the other guy's league, team, post, etc. but I am downright astonished at the trash talking about other poster's daughters! And then to name them by name and critique their play and/ or college choice is just wrong.

In case anybody forgot, none of us are out there on the field playing. If any girl goes to college at any level and gets to continue playing the game they love, who cares where they played or for whom?


----------



## NoGoalItAll

SpeedK1llz said:


> I could not agree more! That said, I am both entertained and sickened at the same time. It's one thing to bash the other guy's league, team, post, etc. but I am downright astonished at the trash talking about other poster's daughters! And then to name them by name and critique their play and/ or college choice is just wrong.
> 
> In case anybody forgot, none of us are out there on the field playing. If any girl goes to college at any level and gets to continue playing the game they love, who cares where they played or for whom?


It’s like reading a written audition for the Real Housewives of Rancho Santa Fe with a heavy Orwellian influence.


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> MAP was being sarcastic.  BTW, your posts are starting to sound as if you are a Legends parent....you are dropping bread crumbs!


I was just asking what MAP meant by development machine just a little clarification is all. No crumbs being dropped nothing to hide. I didn't know it was now protocol to divulge who your daughter plays for or who you are with. Just like I asked the Arsenal parent to name any reason I may have missed other than ECNL to play there. Pretty simple and straight forward.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> MAP, are you posting that Legends didn't get Girls DA, because of their player development and exquiste passing?
> 
> BTW, I agree the Legends G99 holding mid is a great player and you nailed it.  She is committed to Arizona.


All that I am saying is this.  The game that I watched that they played in today was different than how Caliklines described the team as playing.  Also, the player on the Legends 99 team that I noticed as a standout was the holding mid.  She is an African American girl and she is a very good player that seemed to break up attack after attack and initiate the counterattacking efforts of the Legends team.

Regarding DA, if this is the flagship team that they hang their "development" mantra on, then to me it seems that they either have an inside deal with God to send them great athletes or the parents have great genetics and passion for pushing their kids to be the best that they can be.  You decide which is the more plausible scenario.

Now if Hodges was Andres Deza I would be much more likely to believe that it was about development although even his DeAnza Force '98 team recruited a starter on the U17 YNT for ECNL nationals.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Silky Johnston said:


> one persons trash is another man's gold. There is a lot of talent on that legends team . What do u mean by legends development machine? Care to clarify.


What I was saying is the team has individual talent the brightest of which was their holding mid IMHO.  Not that there was some masterful development plan going on.  He clearly sniped a player from an ECNL team in Caliklines daughter (showing you some love Cali) and I seem to remember EK playing for Arsenal at some point.  Great marketing by Hodges and a great job of building a business and a brand.  Not great develpment and clearly not why they were chosen for the DA.  #IEtalentmatters


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> MAP was being sarcastic.  BTW, your posts are starting to sound as if you are a Legends parent....you are dropping bread crumbs!


Exactly NG.  I was just trying to rattle Cali's cage.  I don't really care that much my player is in college making moves.  I just like to mess with Cali.


----------



## Silky Johnston

MakeAPlay said:


> All that I am saying is this.  The game that I watched that they played in today was different than how Caliklines described the team as playing.  Also, the player on the Legends 99 team that I noticed as a standout was the holding mid.  She is an African American girl and she is a very good player that seemed to break up attack after attack and initiate the counterattacking efforts of the Legends team.
> 
> Regarding DA, if this is the flagship team that they hang their "development" mantra on, then to me it seems that they either have an inside deal with God to send them great athletes or the parents have great genetics and passion for pushing their kids to be the best that they can be.  You decide which is the more plausible scenario.
> 
> Now if Hodges was Andres Deza I would be much more likely to believe that it was about development although even his DeAnza Force '98 team recruited a starter on the U17 YNT for ECNL nationals.


see a little clarification.


----------



## Legendary FC

bababooey said:


> This thread is so much fun. Thank you to all that contribute.
> 
> I have found that coming back to this thread roughly every three days is better than daily. I like when there are a lot of posts to read.
> 
> Keep up the good work!



I agree this thread is funny!


----------



## Swoosh

Another stellar United States Development Academy clubs match-up today: 
Legends G99 2- CUP Gold 0

At this level and point in the season, it's about the result.  Legends bounced back in a must win with character and class.  The excellent development of players has the team competing for a national championship as the defending national champs.

You see this is the true national championship, the others are merely league championships.

Pull it out gently people, it's obvious Legends has it in you.


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> Exactly NG.  I was just trying to rattle Cali's cage.  I don't really care that much my player is in college making moves.  I just like to mess with Cali.


Unfortunately, mission not accomplished...I don't have a cage, and your opinion is worth less than the cost of admission to the SoCal Soccer Forum, despite your protestations that "I am connected". So, as I pop the top on another Shiner Black, not Bock, and fight off the enveloping humidity cloud, I laugh in your general direction and rejoice in the beautiful north Texas sunset.


----------



## espola

I was about to comment on MessiFTW's last ugly post, but I see it has disappeared.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Another stellar United States Development Academy clubs match-up today:
> Legends G99 2- CUP Gold 0
> 
> At this level and point in the season, it's about the result.  Legends bounced back in a must win with character and class.  The excellent development of players has the team competing for a national championship as the defending national champs.
> 
> You see this is the true national championship, the others are merely league championships.
> 
> Pull it out gently people, it's obvious Legends has it in you.


Sounds more like a sales pitch to the parents at the club.


----------



## NoGoal

Silky Johnston said:


> I was just asking what MAP meant by development machine just a little clarification is all. No crumbs being dropped nothing to hide. I didn't know it was now protocol to divulge who your daughter plays for or who you are with. Just like I asked the Arsenal parent to name any reason I may have missed other than ECNL to play there. Pretty simple and straight forward.



I'm NOT trying to pick  on you.  Only pointing out you are leaving a trail without even knowing it.



Silky Johnston said:


> There is a lot of talent on that legends team.


A few more posts like that along with these below.



Silky Johnston said:


> the u 15 gk for Legends isn't even the starter. Legends has a ton of talent but your wasting your time arguing the point in here.





Silky Johnston said:


> I have played at both also the only plus AFC has is ECNL. If you disagree please list anything I have missed...


You confirmed (replied post) your DD played for both Legends and Arsenal FC.  Your quote "the only plus AFC has is ECNL". Can be comprehended as a slight towards Arsenal and points to she plays for Legends.


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> I'm NOT trying to pick  on you.  Only pointing out you are leaving a trail without even knowing it.
> 
> 
> 
> A few more posts like that along with these below.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You confirmed (replied post) your DD played for both Legends and Arsenal FC.  Your quote "the only plus AFC has is ECNL". Can be comprehended as a slight towards Arsenal and points to she plays for Legends.


I have thick skin and I didn't think you were picking on me I was just letting you know I wasn't worried about who was trying to connect the dots as to where my daughter played. I didn't realize anyone cared where she played. Regardless of where we are at I call them as I see them. No axes to grind with anyone.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Another stellar United States Development Academy clubs match-up today:
> Legends G99 2- CUP Gold 0
> 
> At this level and point in the season, it's about the result.  Legends bounced back in a must win with character and class.  The excellent development of players has the team competing for a national championship as the defending national champs.
> 
> You see this is the true national championship, the others are merely league championships.
> 
> Pull it out gently people, it's obvious Legends has it in you.


Pull it out? I can't feel it Legends are you sure it's in?

Very funny post.  Glad that you can have a sense of humor because this is just a forum and for entertainment and occasionally a little bit of information.  Actually after watching that game clearly most Legends parents must have a great sense of humor.  You better hope that holding mid doesn't bolt for ECNL this year.  It's going to be one hell of a year considering the DA starting the following year and her not being a part of it.  If you are more than a coach I would be offering her a free senior year since ECNL U18 teams don't get on a plane for good games.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Unfortunately, mission not accomplished...I don't have a cage, and your opinion is worth less than the cost of admission to the SoCal Soccer Forum, despite your protestations that "I am connected". So, as I pop the top on another Shiner Black, not Bock, and fight off the enveloping humidity cloud, I laugh in your general direction and rejoice in the beautiful north Texas sunset.


Hey Cali I like that you can still laugh.  How one takes a loss by a team, no an organization that one is so invested in is good indication of their character and you seem to have a lot of character and care a lot for your daughter.  It's great to see Hodges stick to "possession" soccer with the team's back against the wall.  I don't ever remember posting that I was connected.  What I did say is that I know people.  It happens when you've done this club soccer thing with your little girl for 10 years.  What also happens is you gain perspective.  Hopefully you gain some in this world as I imagine you must have in your real life.

I have to really laugh at the visual you gave me of you sweating your behind off in sticky 'ol Texas.  Not really sure what Shiner Black is but you really should try something from Ballast Point or Stone or any of the other 100+ breweries down in our neighbor to the south.

Good luck to your daughter and her team tomorrow.  Kickball or not I hope you win it for Cal South.


----------



## offthecrossbar

Swoosh said:


> Pull it out gently people, it's obvious Legends has it in you.


Are you suggesting Legends is a long thick piece of crap that needs to be shitted out?  Please someone pass me a laxative.


----------



## CopaMundial

MakeAPlay said:


> Pull it out? I can't feel it Legends are you sure it's in?
> 
> Very funny post.  Glad that you can have a sense of humor because this is just a forum and for entertainment and occasionally a little bit of information.  Actually after watching that game clearly most Legends parents must have a great sense of humor.  You better hope that holding mid doesn't bolt for ECNL this year.  It's going to be one hell of a year considering the DA starting the following year and her not being a part of it.  If you are more than a coach I would be offering her a free senior year since ECNL U18 teams don't get on a plane for good games.



She don't need to. It's called "Discovery Player".


----------



## MakeAPlay

CopaMundial said:


> She don't need to. It's called "Discovery Player".


True.  I am well aware of the rule.  But why not play with your peers getting ready for the upcoming college season.  I am pretty sure if this player is going to Arizona that her family is going to want her to be ready to play.  It's all about the competition and getting your player ready to step onto the college field as a senior in case this is your first go around.  Either way she is a good player.


----------



## madcow

Swoosh said:


> Another stellar United States Development Academy clubs match-up today:
> Legends G99 2- CUP Gold 0
> 
> At this level and point in the season, it's about the result.  Legends bounced back in a must win with character and class.  The excellent development of players has the team competing for a national championship as the defending national champs.
> 
> You see this is the true national championship, the others are merely league championships.
> 
> Pull it out gently people, it's obvious Legends has it in you.


Sooo, Are the Pink Panthers another Stellar United States Development Academy team? I heard the Blue Dragons may get accepted. Maybe you will play them later?


----------



## gkrent

madcow said:


> Sooo, Are the Pink Panthers another Stellar United States Development Academy team? I heard the Blue Dragons may get accepted. Maybe you will play them later?


I thought this was a complete joke until I saw a CalSouth tweet today!!! LOL!!


----------



## Flojo




----------



## Swoosh

madcow said:


> Sooo, Are the Pink Panthers another Stellar United States Development Academy team? I heard the Blue Dragons may get accepted. Maybe you will play them later?


The club is FCKC which is the youth side of the NWSL side.  I was worried and kept checking about Development Academy status but rest easy as all is good.  Legends is and will continue to be a Development Academy Club.  One of 53 in the entire country.  Guess what?  Legends could stand on fifth avenue and shoot people and they would still be a United States Soccer Development Academy Club.  Gotta admit that's quite an impressive feat for a little non ecnl club.  Does the league plan on keeping the first letter of their monicker?  Because you know it may be a matter of time before people start to complain that they're paying for Elite but the elite has gone away..........


----------



## CaliKlines

madcow said:


> Sooo, Are the Pink Panthers another Stellar United States Development Academy team? I heard the Blue Dragons may get accepted. Maybe you will play them later?


You know what is really funny...you guys still call Strikers part of the *Elite* Clubs National League. But I guess you're hung up on names (valid or not), and not on performance or achievement. Those Pink Kitties would crush many ECNL sides. Me-f-ing-ow!


----------



## Swoosh

CaliKlines said:


> You know what is really funny...you guys still call Strikers part of the *Elite* Clubs National League. But I guess you're hung up on names (valid or not), and not on performance or achievement. Those Pink Kitties would crush many ECNL sides. Me-f-ing-ow!


Cali the Real are not so real, the west coast may be eroding, the strikers are not striking, and the arsenal maybe don't quite have the arsenal...the Elite are still Elite though, I'm sure of that.  What I'm also sure of is that the Elite is going to the DA, which leaves the CNL.  The CNL will still have showcases without coaches.  They will still be competitive without the best players.  They will still be the CNL.


----------



## Silky Johnston

MakeAPlay said:


> All that I am saying is this.  The game that I watched that they played in today was different than how Caliklines described the team as playing.  Also, the player on the Legends 99 team that I noticed as a standout was the holding mid.  She is an African American girl and she is a very good player that seemed to break up attack after attack and initiate the counterattacking efforts of the Legends team.
> 
> Regarding DA, if this is the flagship team that they hang their "development" mantra on, then to me it seems that they either have an inside deal with God to send them great athletes or the parents have great genetics and passion for pushing their kids to be the best that they can be.  You decide which is the more plausible scenario.
> 
> Now if Hodges was Andres Deza I would be much more likely to believe that it was about development although even his DeAnza Force '98 team recruited a starter on the U17 YNT for ECNL nationals.


sounds to me that you may have an issue with JH? Unlike like most  my opinions are based on what I see not if I or my daughter has been slighted by a team or coach. Fortunately for us it hasn't happened to us yet. I don't follow every u 14 or 15 teams roster like some of u in here and I can guarantee I am not looking for bread crumbs to see where someone's DD plays. But I don't see much development happening at any of the clubs in So Cal development starts way before u 14 so like I said previously who is developing these kids? The only coaches who could probably claim credit for their present teams success is the Fabulous Baker Brothers as they have had their group since u11.


----------



## Zerodenero

CaliKlines said:


> You know what is really funny........Those Pink Kitties would crush many ECNL sides. Me-f-ing-ow!


Ah yes.....and apparently they started with Legends flagship 99's.


----------



## madcow

CaliKlines said:


> Those Pink Kitties would crush many ECNL sides. Me-f-ing-ow!


 I don't doubt it. They sound pretty tough. I did hear they were a second half team. But that was mainly because of the orange slices and juice boxes they got at halftime. If we ever find ourselves in such a prestigious tournament that we face a Pink Panther team, I will make sure we pack both juice boxes and orange slices so we don't fall to the same fate as the mighty Legends squad.


----------



## Silky Johnston

madcow said:


> I don't doubt it. They sound pretty tough. I did hear they were a second half team. But that was mainly because of the orange slices and juice boxes they got at halftime. If we ever find ourselves in such a prestigious tournament that we face a Pink Panther team, I will make sure we pack both juice boxes and orange slices so we don't fall to the same fate as the mighty Legends squad.


Do u think the Pink Panthers ride together to the games in the Mystery Machine?


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Cali the Real are not so real, the west coast may be eroding, the strikers are not striking, and the arsenal maybe don't quite have the arsenal...the Elite are still Elite though, I'm sure of that.  What I'm also sure of is that the Elite is going to the DA, which leaves the CNL.  The CNL will still have showcases without coaches.  They will still be competitive without the best players.  They will still be the CNL.


Good thing Legends got girls DA, because there were no Legends team who qualified from GU13-15 and U18 at USYS Championship finals.  In my DDs U17 age group everyone knows how average that Legends team is, yet made the finals.


----------



## 3thatplay

Cor


NoGoal said:


> You have twice posted "wrong team", but not the wrong individual.  As for teams are you saying, 3thatplay's DD is moving to Surf or another club.  "next week things will be different", so she is still playing for Carlsbad in Texas for USYS Championships and it concludes this weekend.  My guess, his DD is moving to Surf to play ECNL this fall (DA doesn't begin yet), so she can play against girls she will be competing against in the Pac12 conference in 2 years time.
> 
> As for your avatar, I don't surf...but, obviously you do. I will take a guess though, Trestles.


Mr. Smith,
Right individual, and again wrong team.  Which means she will play for the LA Galaxy SD 99 U18 team, yep another name change, not Surf or Blues as you have reported before.  And she is attending CU as you pointed out not ONLY due to soccer but mostly due to our roots in Colorado and what it has to offer her and what she might eventually want to study.   As for you, I wish Kennedy all the best in her studies and endeavors and I hope she sticks with soccer long enough for our daughter to meet on the field.  You usually have good insight in the youth soccer world but your forum obsession is rather disturbing.  Again good luck to your dd and your future enjoyment of watching her play.


----------



## Silky Johnston

3thatplay said:


> Cor
> 
> Mr. Smith,
> Right individual, and again wrong team.  Which means she will play for the LA Galaxy SD 99 U18 team, yep another name change, not Surf or Blues as you have reported before.  And she is attending CU as you pointed out not ONLY due to soccer but mostly due to our roots in Colorado and what it has to offer her and what she might eventually want to study.   As for you, I wish Kennedy all the best in her studies and endeavors and I hope she sticks with soccer long enough for our daughter to meet on the field.  You usually have good insight in the youth soccer world but your forum obsession is rather disturbing.  Again good luck to your dd and your future enjoyment of watching her play.


Is Mr Smith his Christian name?


----------



## madcow

Who is Kennedy?


----------



## MakeAPlay

madcow said:


> Who is Kennedy?


He mistakenly thinks that NoGoal's daughter is KS from Strikers U18 ECNL who is a 2016 UDub commit.


----------



## MakeAPlay

3thatplay said:


> Cor
> 
> Mr. Smith,
> Right individual, and again wrong team.  Which means she will play for the LA Galaxy SD 99 U18 team, yep another name change, not Surf or Blues as you have reported before.  And she is attending CU as you pointed out not ONLY due to soccer but mostly due to our roots in Colorado and what it has to offer her and what she might eventually want to study.   As for you, I wish Kennedy all the best in her studies and endeavors and I hope she sticks with soccer long enough for our daughter to meet on the field.  You usually have good insight in the youth soccer world but your forum obsession is rather disturbing.  Again good luck to your dd and your future enjoyment of watching her play.



Wrong person.  I will say that KS is a sweet girl and will do well in college.  She is a fiercely loyal kid and her parents are absolutely wonderful people.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> The club is FCKC which is the youth side of the NWSL side.  I was worried and kept checking about Development Academy status but rest easy as all is good.  Legends is and will continue to be a Development Academy Club.  One of 53 in the entire country.  Guess what?  Legends could stand on fifth avenue and shoot people and they would still be a United States Soccer Development Academy Club.  Gotta admit that's quite an impressive feat for a little non ecnl club.  Does the league plan on keeping the first letter of their monicker?  Because you know it may be a matter of time before people start to complain that they're paying for Elite but the elite has gone away..........


Legends hasn't put out an Elite team in years.  Hodges is as much a soccer coach as Kanye West is a fashion designer.  I can't believe that you are trying to defend your flagship team losing to a friggin AYSO side called the Pink Panthers!!  Kickball didn't work this time what is DA going to achieve for your daughter?  Or are you a coach/admin and this is part of your social media strategy?  You are looking worse than Cali!!  At least he doesn't deny that he is a Hodges puppet/lap dog and that he likes having the top guys hand up his rear!!

You are pretty funny.


----------



## NoGoal

3thatplay said:


> Cor
> 
> Mr. Smith,
> Right individual, and again wrong team.  Which means she will play for the LA Galaxy SD 99 U18 team, yep another name change, not Surf or Blues as you have reported before.  And she is attending CU as you pointed out not ONLY due to soccer but mostly due to our roots in Colorado and what it has to offer her and what she might eventually want to study.   As for you, I wish Kennedy all the best in her studies and endeavors and I hope she sticks with soccer long enough for our daughter to meet on the field.  You usually have good insight in the youth soccer world but your forum obsession is rather disturbing.  Again good luck to your dd and your future enjoyment of watching her play.



I've been posting for 9 years and your pathetic guess was that my DD plays for Strikers, especially after I already posted not once, but TWICE in this very thread that my DD plays for a ECNL/DA club.  Anyone with any common sense knows Strikers didn't get DA, thus Strikers couldn't have been my DDs club.  Let me make this easy for you, my DD plays for Eagles.

I NAILED your identity and you (LMAO) attempted to return the favor, but FAILED miserably in the process.  BTW, why bother explaining the reason your DD choose Colorado?  As the Rock use to say on the WWE, "it doesn't matter why she choose Colorado!" The fact of the matter is, Colorado had 7-8 players transferred out of Boulder this off season.  Which is a HUGE number for any soccer program without a head coaching change.

BTW, do you like eggs?  Because, it's all over your face for totally putting someone and their DD on blast 

For the record, the snapshot I posted of you and your DD was public information and I never had to type either of your names.  You have to admit it was pretty clever


----------



## MakeAPlay

Silky Johnston said:


> sounds to me that you may have an issue with JH? Unlike like most  my opinions are based on what I see not if I or my daughter has been slighted by a team or coach. Fortunately for us it hasn't happened to us yet. I don't follow every u 14 or 15 teams roster like some of u in here and I can guarantee I am not looking for bread crumbs to see where someone's DD plays. But I don't see much development happening at any of the clubs in So Cal development starts way before u 14 so like I said previously who is developing these kids? The only coaches who could probably claim credit for their present teams success is the Fabulous Baker Brothers as they have had their group since u11.



Okay you've got a ton of false statements that I want to rebuke.

First, JH is the Kanye West of SoCal youth soccer and is all marketing no training.  He is a great salesman and he apparently has got you.

Second, they have never slighted me or my daughter.  I did my research once I decided to move my player and believe me Legends wasn't even considered.  They would kill to have a player of her quality.

Next, there are plenty of coaches in SoCal that are AMAZING developers of talent and the coach that my player had for most of her time from U14-U18 did amazing things to continue her development so you are way off on that.

Finally, my daughter trained with the Bakers for a year and she chose to stop due to non-soccer issues.  They are good skills trainers but if my daughter was in the age groups that they coach I would absolutely never consider letting her play for them.  I can't even see how the Junipero Serra HS parents put up with it!


----------



## Silky Johnston

MakeAPlay said:


> Okay you've got a ton of false statements that I want to rebuke.
> 
> First, JH is the Kanye West of SoCal youth soccer and is all marketing no training.  He is a great salesman and he apparently has got you.
> 
> Second, they have never slighted me or my daughter.  I did my research once I decided to move my player and believe me Legends wasn't even considered.  They would kill to have a player of her quality.
> 
> Next, there are plenty of coaches in SoCal that are AMAZING developers of talent and the coach that my player had for most of her time from U14-U18 did amazing things to continue her development so you are way off on that.
> 
> Finally, my daughter trained with the Bakers for a year and she chose to stop due to non-soccer issues.  They are good skills trainers but if my daughter was in the age groups that they coach I would absolutely never consider letting her play for them.  I can't even see how the Junipero Serra HS parents put up with it!


whoa. Someone get into the Scotch a little to heavy last night? U need to reread the post I made.  I didn't say anything about you other than you had an issue with JH which is obvious to everyone but you. I don't care one way or the other. I never said you were slighted . I said like many in here. You said continue her development I said talent developers that means at the early ages not u14 and above. The comment about the Bakers is true whether you like them or not . I know your smarter than me and amazing judge of talent (I am referencing the comment about the amazing luck any club would have if they landed your daughter) so please just let it go. You win your right.


----------



## ECNL

NoGoal said:


> BTW, do you like eggs?  Because, it's all over your face for totally putting someone and their DD on blast
> 
> For the record, the snapshot I posted of you and your DD was public information and I never had to type either of your names.  You have to admit it was pretty clever


I would like to encourage NoGoal, 3thatplay, MAP as well as other members to stop posting information about other people's DD's on this forum.  No good thing will come out of it in the end.  It only makes you a cyberbully and creates needless stress and animosity.  If you feel the need to be negative please keep your cross-hairs aimed at forum members, coaches, clubs, and teams (if you can't help yourself).  There is no need to go after children.


----------



## Silky Johnston

ECNL said:


> I would like to encourage NoGoal, Silky, MAP as well as other members to stop posting information about other people's DD's on this forum.  No good thing will come out of it in the end.  It only makes you a cyberbully and creates needless stress and animosity in both directions.  If you feel the need to be negative please keep your cross-hairs aimed at forum members, coaches, clubs, and teams (if you can't help yourself).  There is no need to go after children.


I agree with your post but I haven't mentioned anything abut anyone's kids.


----------



## NoGoal

ECNL said:


> I would like to encourage NoGoal, 3thatplay, MAP as well as other members to stop posting information about other people's DD's on this forum.  No good thing will come out of it in the end.  It only makes you a cyberbully and creates needless stress and animosity.  If you feel the need to be negative please keep your cross-hairs aimed at forum members, coaches, clubs, and teams (if you can't help yourself).  There is no need to go after children.


Posters are allowed to post positive public information about players, such as...YNT, ODP, ID2, and college committment lists. There is nothing negative about posting a snapshot of the Google committment spreadsheet. Neither is posting factual information about players transferring from a university-which is also reported on the Google committment spreadsheet.

As for 3thatplay, he totally botched his post!  Bigtime FAILURE!


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Another stellar United States Development Academy clubs match-up today:
> Legends G99 2- CUP Gold 0
> 
> At this level and point in the season, it's about the result.  Legends bounced back in a must win with character and class.  The excellent development of players has the team competing for a national championship as the defending national champs.
> 
> You see this is the true national championship, the others are merely league championships.


No update after the Legends U16 and U17 teams were eliminated from group play? Here let me post it for you.  The girls played their hearts out, did everything that was demanded of them.  Unfortunately, it wasn't their year.  We will continue improving and look forward to returning to this true national championship next year. 

I believe, I believe, I believe that we can win, I believe we can win......next year!


----------



## Sped

The level of parent sh*tiness on this thread is epic.  I can only imagine what your daughters would think if they read this thread.


----------



## Round

Sped said:


> The level of parent sh*tiness on this thread is epic.  I can only imagine what your daughters would think if they read this thread.


Some have dedicated their life to this and are down to the last months, then even less people will care.  A little sad.


----------



## Zerodenero

ECNL said:


> I would like to encourage NoGoal, 3thatplay, MAP as well as other members to stop posting information about other people's DD's on this forum.  No good thing will come out of it in the end.  It only makes you a cyberbully and creates needless stress and animosity.  If you feel the need to be negative please keep your cross-hairs aimed at forum members, coaches, clubs, and teams (if you can't help yourself).  There is no need to go after children.


**remember......._*SAVE THE CHILDREN*_!!!!!**

Look at the upside guys.....this is nowhere near the fear we all once faced from the late.... great... Mr. Size 13 - Abdul......_*"say it again, say it again".....*_


----------



## Zerodenero

Round said:


> Some have dedicated their life to this and are down to the last months, then even less people will care.  A little sad.


So good to see you around....round


----------



## espola

Sped said:


> The level of parent sh*tiness on this thread is epic.  I can only imagine what your daughters would think if they read this thread.


It's becoming worse than Twitter.


----------



## NoGoal

Round said:


> Some have dedicated their life to this and are down to the last months, then even less people will care.  A little sad.


But, there is a women's college soccer forum on BigSoccer.
http://forums.bigsoccer.com/forums/womens-college.66/

CaliKlines, they even post about NC State's head coach being on the hot seat, if they have another poor season.

3TP, they have a Colorado thread just for you. You should catch up on the reading.


----------



## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> But, there is a women's college soccer forum on BigSoccer.
> http://forums.bigsoccer.com/forums/womens-college.66/.


Dang NG......I already fight the urge to check this dam site, now ya gonna get me hooked on another - crack fest galore


----------



## Silky Johnston

Zerodenero said:


> Dang NG......I already fight the urge to check this dam site, now ya gonna get me hooked on another - crack fest galore


what a break for those posters. Is MAP going to join that forum also?


----------



## Zerodenero

Silky Johnston said:


> what a break for those posters. Is MAP going to join that forum also?


----------



## MessiFTW

I don't think her IQ is high enough.


----------



## Swoosh

Legends bows out early in order to get ready for DA.  Yes NoGoal, our girls are going to college just like yours, but we have a lot less miles on our cars, have saved quite a bit of gas, were able to enjoy these great teenage years without long commutes, and can talk about multiple national championships won. What great memories!  What are your memories?  From the bitterness of your posts I can only imagine.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Legends bows out early in order to get ready for DA.  Yes NoGoal, our girls are going to college just like yours, but we have a lot less miles on our cars, have saved quite a bit of gas, were able to enjoy these great teenage years without long commutes, and can talk about multiple national championships won. What great memories!  What are your memories?  From the bitterness of your posts I can only imagine.


Is that all you GOT!  I can afford to buy new cars, so driving and gas was never an issue, especially being self-employed and the ability to schedule my own client appointments.  I thank GOD for putting my family in a position we're in, so distance was NEVER an issue like for so many other families having to settle for IE clubs.

Winning multiple Championships maybe for the U16 team.  The Legends U17, now U19 team is average at best.  Now lets get into the nitty gritty of the U19 Legends team who lost the following players over it's age cycle.  Player who eventually went on to commit to; Stanford, UCLA, UDub, San Francisco, LMU and USC.  That doesn't include the other players from the IE who commute past Legends to play for OC ECNL clubs. Hopefully, with Legends getting DA that changes now...especially with the ulittle teams unable to qualify for USYS Championships this past season.

As for winning, that is where you FALL short and sounding more like a DOC!  I knew back at U11 when my DD played for Legends that the girls side of the club was NEVER about development and more about WINNING.  It was the #1 reason my wife and I pulled our DD from your club.  The club goal and our DD's long term goal to develop as a technical and creative player didn't match. Especially, being the smallest player on the team.  It was her only fighting chance, if she wanted to be recruited and play college soccer.  Goal accomplished!


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Is that all you GOT!  I can afford to buy new cars, so driving and gas was never an issue, especially being self-employed and the ability to schedule my own client appointments.  I thank GOD for putting my family in a position were in, so we didn't have to play local!
> 
> Winning multiple Championships maybe for the U16 team.  The Legends U17, now U19 team is weak with only 1 decent commit to Wash St.  That U19 Legends team lost the following players over the years, players who eventually committed to: Stanford, UCLA, UDub, San Francisco, LMU and USC.  That doesn't include the other players from the IE who commute past Legends to play for OC ECNL clubs. Hopefully, with DA that changes now!
> 
> As for winning, that was NEVER the goal.  It was for my DD to develop as a player and play college soccer.  Goal accomplished!


So your memories include sitting in the car?  Driving to client appointments before practice?  You're all over the place focus on the question!

I'm glad you were able to reach your goal.  For me it was always about the journey.  And what a journey it has been!  And we are not done yet! We get to finish it in the brand new league, the DA!  Couldn't ask for a better soccer experience.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Legends bows out early in order to get ready for DA.  Yes NoGoal, our girls are going to college just like yours, but we have a lot less miles on our cars, have saved quite a bit of gas, were able to enjoy these great teenage years without long commutes, and can talk about multiple national championships won. What great memories!  What are your memories?  From the bitterness of your posts I can only imagine.



I believe that his daughter won an ODP national championship.  You have no idea..


----------



## Silky Johnston

Swoosh said:


> So your memories include sitting in the car?  Driving to client appointments before practice?  You're all over the place focus on the question!
> 
> I'm glad you were able to reach your goal.  For me it was always about the journey.  And what a journey it has been!  And we are not done yet! We get to finish it in the brand new league, the DA!  Couldn't ask for a better soccer experience.


man can you feel the love?? I guess I need to pull up and seat and watch this pissing contest continue. Go get em  boys and girls


----------



## cheaper2keeper

The anger filled rants and quick replies remind me of something.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> So your memories include sitting in the car?  Driving to client appointments before practice?  You're all over the place focus on the question!
> 
> I'm glad you were able to reach your goal.  For me it was always about the journey.  And what a journey it has been!  And we are not done yet! We get to finish it in the brand new league, the DA!  Couldn't ask for a better soccer experience.


I think you are the one who needs to focus.  Where you think it's about driving and sitting in the car.  For my wife and I, the lasting memories as we drove our DD to and from soccer practice will be about talking about life in general, laughing about stories or teasing her how tone deaf she is singing her heart out to a One Direction song.  You couldn't appreciate that, because you aren't married and do NOT have any kids and why winning soccer tournaments is what you consider "YOUR MEMORIES".  Winning was never the goal, but by focusing on her development she end up winning a National Cup, ODP Regional Championship and earned a lot of individual accolades in the process as her journey continues.

Brand new league, good for you and your club.  Girls DA has no barring on my DD who will be in college, during the inaugural Girls DA Fall 2017 season.  As for the use of the word journey, do you know who loves to use the word "JOURNEY" at the Legends .....JOSHUA HODGES!  BTW,  if this is JH how is your Audi A6?  I haven't ran into you at the car wash lately.


----------



## tugs

3thatplay said:


> Cor
> 
> Mr. Smith,
> Right individual, and again wrong team.  Which means she will play for the LA Galaxy SD 99 U18 team, yep another name change, not Surf or Blues as you have reported before.  And she is attending CU as you pointed out not ONLY due to soccer but mostly due to our roots in Colorado and what it has to offer her and what she might eventually want to study.   As for you, I wish Kennedy all the best in her studies and endeavors and I hope she sticks with soccer long enough for our daughter to meet on the field.  You usually have good insight in the youth soccer world but your forum obsession is rather disturbing.  Again good luck to your dd and your future enjoyment of watching her play.



The head coach and assistant coach of CU gave our DD team a tour of the campus, facilities, and program when we were there for FWR this summer.  Just amazing athletic facilities and beautiful campus right in Boulder.  Very grateful for coaching staff for accommodating us and the team.  Good luck to your DD there.


----------



## Silky Johnston

tugs said:


> The head coach and assistant coach of CU gave our DD team a tour of the campus, facilities, and program when we were there for FWR this summer.  Just amazing athletic facilities and beautiful campus right in Boulder.  Very grateful for coaching staff for accommodating us and the team.  Good luck to your DD there.


come on Tugs why would you disrupt the hate with something positive that happened to one or DDs?


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> I think you are the one who needs to focus.  Where you think it's about driving and sitting in the car.  For my wife and I, the lasting memories as we drove our DD to and from soccer practice will be about talking about life in general, laughing about stories or teasing her how tone deaf she is signing her heart out to a One Direction song.  You couldn't appreciate that, because you aren't married and do NOT have any kids and why winning soccer tournaments is what you consider "YOUR MEMORIES".  Winning was never the goal, but by focusing on her development she end up winning a National Cup, ODP Regional Championship and earned a lot of individual accolades in the process as her journey continues.
> 
> Brand new league, good for you and your club.  Girls DA has no barring on my DD who will be in college, during the inaugural Girls DA Fall 2017 season.  As for the use of the word journey, do you know who loves to use the word "JOURNEY" at the Legends .....JOSHUA HODGES!  BTW,  if this is JH how is your Audi A6?  I haven't ran into you at the car wash lately.


Not JOSHUA HODGES haha nice try though.  I feel bad now you're pissy.  I will stop badgering I'm just glad you have multiple people in the car for your commute so you can be free to post, repost, edit posts, look up people's DDs, put others down, search recruiting databases, search other states forums, promote ECNL (minus the E), bash our federation, figure out who is who in anonymous forums, etc. what a kick!  No pun intended 

You may be tempted but please don't text and drive!


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Not JOSHUA HODGES haha nice try though.  I feel bad now you're pissy.  I will stop badgering I'm just glad you have multiple people in the car for your commute so you can be free to post, repost, edit posts, look up people's DDs, put others down, search recruiting databases, search other states forums, promote ECNL (minus the E), bash our federation, figure out who is who in anonymous forums, etc. what a kick!  No pun intended
> 
> You may be tempted but please don't text and drive!


Not pissy at all, I'm actually at the gym.

You're not JH, sure if you say so.  You are definately not a parent though.  A huge tell is when you posted we put our girls in college.  The key word is "OUR", meaning you are a coach at the club.  A parent would type Legends puts girls in college or they help my DD with college exposure.

See how this works,  I keep replying to your posts to draw you to post more.  The more you post the more you unveil yourself.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Not pissy at all, I'm actually at the gym.
> 
> You're not JH, sure if you say so.  You are definately not a parent though.  A huge tell is when you posted we put our girls in college.  The key word is "OUR", meaning you are a coach at the club.  A parent would type Legends puts girls in college or they help my DD with college exposure.
> 
> See how this works,  I keep replying to your posts to draw you to post more.  The more you post the more you unveil yourself.


You are a genius!  Not about me being a coach though, nice try.  I told you I'm done and I truly am.  I just don't like how you bully others on here.  There is my truth.  Over and out.  (Maybe I'm a cop now)


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> You are a genius!  Not about me being a coach though, nice try.  I told you I'm done and I truly am.  I just don't like how you bully others on here.  There is my truth.  Over and out.  (Maybe I'm a cop now)


I am more than happy to play the antagonist role on the forum.

Like a Legends coach would ever admit to posting on the forum, but if you must run along, adios coach!


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> Not pissy at all, I'm actually at the gym.
> 
> You're not JH, sure if you say so.  You are definately not a parent though.  A huge tell is when you posted we put our girls in college.  The key word is "OUR", meaning you are a coach at the club.  A parent would type Legends puts girls in college or they help my DD with college exposure.
> 
> See how this works,  I keep replying to your posts to draw you to post more.  The more you post the more you unveil yourself.


awesome.. we went from bashing to counter espionage this forum is great. Who knew on a youth soccer forum you could get all this..  Keep up the good work boys..


----------



## Round

I first learned the term "hater's gonna hate" after my kids team lost to a Surf team 9 years ago.  Funny that is still around.

Enough of this Legends hate.  How about how bad the Surf B and C teams will be now, how are they going to keep selling what they sell to chubby blonde people?

There.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I don't think her IQ is high enough.


Sweet chuck don't get mad because I won't date you and your kid and her team suck.  I know that there are some quality Jucos out in Phoenix.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Round said:


> I first learned the term "hater's gonna hate" after my kids team lost to a Surf team 9 years ago.  Funny that is still around.
> 
> Enough of this Legends hate.  How about how bad the Surf B and C teams will be now, how are they going to keep selling what they sell to chubby blonde people?
> 
> There.


Surf will keep being Surf.  They will continue to get the top talent in San Diego and produce fantastic players.


----------



## Round

MakeAPlay said:


> Surf will keep being Surf.  They will continue to get the top talent in San Diego and produce fantastic players.


Surf used to produce a lot more, at least 2 good teams in each age group, not anymore.  Used to be able to keep kids with real potential on the bench while they watched kids from other places play in their place because there was no where else to go.

Not anymore.


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> Surf will keep being Surf.  They will continue to get the top talent in San Diego and produce fantastic players.


Progress is impossible without change, and those who cannot change their minds cannot change anything. -GBS


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> Sweet chuck don't get mad because I won't date you and your kid and her team suck.  I know that there are some quality Jucos out in Phoenix.


Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are. -JW


----------



## MakeAPlay

I love the Legends social media strategy.  Swoosh did you guys come up with the strategy as a group or was it all you?


----------



## Zerodenero

MakeAPlay said:


> I love the Legends social media strategy.  Swoosh did you guys come up with the strategy as a group or was it all you?


Not sure but quoting the John Wooden is starting to swoon me over


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are. -JW


Is this a pivot?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Round said:


> Surf used to produce a lot more, at least 2 good teams in each age group, not anymore.  Used to be able to keep kids with real potential on the bench while they watched kids from other places play in their place because there was no where else to go.
> 
> Not anymore.


I'm not too up on the current state of affairs.  They always seem to be deep on talent from all over the county.  Clubs always have problems with fielding multiple good teams at the older ages due to lots of reasons unrelated to what you are getting at.  Attrition is normal as the girls age.  Only the most dedicated are around at U18 not necessarily the most talented.  Either way there is plenty of room in Surf's club for players of all skill levels.  They aren't afraid to develop players and you might be surprised at how many move up through the ranks.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are. -JW


Who cares this is a soccer forum-NG


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> Is this a pivot?


No. This is a pivot.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> No. This is a pivot.


I love it!!  See Cali you really do know how to have fun!!  Good luck to you and your daughter!


----------



## MessiFTW

MakeAPlay said:


> Is this a pivot?


He is just pointing out you have poor character.


----------



## MessiFTW

NoGoal said:


> Who cares this is a soccer forum-NG


*“The true test of a man’s character is what he does when no one is watching.”*
― John Wooden


----------



## Sped

Round said:


> Surf used to produce a lot more, at least 2 good teams in each age group, not anymore.  Used to be able to keep kids with real potential on the bench while they watched kids from other places play in their place because there was no where else to go.
> 
> Not anymore.


I have seen several Surf B teams play other SD clubs' A teams very tough or for the win this season.  That said, there's certainly enough good soccer to go around in SD these days.


----------



## Round

Sped said:


> I have seen several Surf B teams play other SD clubs' A teams very tough or for the win this season.  That said, there's certainly enough good soccer to go around in SD these days.


There was a timethat their teams were two of the top 5 in every age group, some times the b teams beat the a teams. Ended with ECNL.  We will see how it goes.  I don't  think they have any coaches left from those days.


----------



## Rev234

http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/story/two-youth-teams-apparently-fixed-a-match-at-a-tournament-072916
Ooh, scandalous!   On the upside,  neither legends or surf was involved  so hopefully that whole mess will die down.


----------



## Swoosh

Rev234 said:


> http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/story/two-youth-teams-apparently-fixed-a-match-at-a-tournament-072916
> Ooh, scandalous!   On the upside,  neither legends or surf was involved  so hopefully that whole mess will die down.


Let the kids play.  Suspend the coaches.


----------



## NoGoal

Rev234 said:


> http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/story/two-youth-teams-apparently-fixed-a-match-at-a-tournament-072916
> Ooh, scandalous!   On the upside,  neither legends or surf was involved  so hopefully that whole mess will die down.


Rescind Carlsbad's GDA status.


----------



## Round

Rev234 said:


> http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/story/two-youth-teams-apparently-fixed-a-match-at-a-tournament-072916
> Ooh, scandalous!   On the upside,  neither legends or surf was involved  so hopefully that whole mess will die down.


That's it.  Bring Carlsbad into it.  Now how about something regarding SC Blues, maybe Fram?


----------



## gkrent

MessiFTW said:


> *“The true test of a man’s character is what he does when no one is watching.”*
> ― John Wooden


You revealed your character in that post that was deleted.


----------



## Rev234

Watched (skipped through)  SC blues v solar Chelsea today.   Not sure what to make of that game. The ball was in the air a whole lot. Former team played v SC blues in CRL (they hung 10 on us)  I know they can pass the ball around  like a pro team, but that game today was tough to watch.   Anyway.  I will always  cheer for a SoCal team in national competition.


----------



## BornToRun

Round said:


> That's it.  Bring Carlsbad into it.  Now how about something regarding SC Blues, maybe Fram?


Well what is all this talk of Legends, Arsenal, Surf... I thought the local I.E. "Elite" club was in San Juan Capistrano anyway...


----------



## SpeedK1llz

Rev234 said:


> http://www.foxsports.com/soccer/story/two-youth-teams-apparently-fixed-a-match-at-a-tournament-072916
> Ooh, scandalous!   On the upside,  neither legends or surf was involved  so hopefully that whole mess will die down.


Wow! This is sickening. The two coaches should be fired from their respective clubs and have their coaching licenses suspended for a year. The two teams should have to forfeit their "tie" and vacate the points earned.


----------



## madcow

The best part of that video was watching the ref run around. In his defense, he was always in good position to see the ball...


----------



## Zoro

Swoosh said:


> Let the kids play.  Suspend the coaches.


If the kids want to play, send them to a park.  
I agree with both coaches here.  They are trying to win the tournament.


NoGoal said:


> Rescind Carlsbad's GDA status.


Joking?  WIN!  There was no cheating, no crime, no unkindness.  Just a strategy to win the tournament.


----------



## NoGoal

I just read US Soccer is re-activating the boys residency program.  I guess after a decade of Boys DA and still no super star, maybe Pulisic....then again he had to move to Dortmund at 16 years of age.

IMO, a US Soccer residency program is the BEST way to develop future national team players and potential pro soccer players.  They are taking only the ELITE players who want to play professionally.  They need to keep the players they want in the program, until they decide to cut the player for someone better.  This way, the players get a compounding development effect.

They need to start a program for the girls too! Then all the leagues are just that club soccer leagues!


----------



## G Zen

Rev234 said:


> Watched (skipped through)  SC blues v solar Chelsea today.   Not sure what to make of that game. The ball was in the air a whole lot. Former team played v SC blues in CRL (they hung 10 on us)  I know they can pass the ball around  like a pro team, but that game today was tough to watch.   Anyway.  I will always  cheer for a SoCal team in national competition.


Normally, I like SoCal teams as winners, but Blues Baker played kick ball for most of this game. I mean, I can count the number of 3-pass connected sequences on just 1 hand. And what's with the double cartwheels after Blues' first goal? Very glad to see the Chelsea team come back to beat Blues for the U13 Championship.


----------



## madcow

G Zen said:


> And what's with the double cartwheels after Blues' first goal?


I know. There is nothing worse than little kids acting like little kids...


----------



## Orgulho Português

G Zen said:


> Normally, I like SoCal teams as winners, but Blues Baker played kick ball for most of this game. I mean, I can count the number of 3-pass connected sequences on just 1 hand. And what's with the double cartwheels after Blues' first goal? Very glad to see the Chelsea team come back to beat Blues for the U13 Championship.


So awesome to see the Masters of the kickball go down.......Cartwheel? really coach?


----------



## G Zen

madcow said:


> I know. There is nothing worse than little kids acting like little kids...


Then you must be mad or a cow. Or both.


----------



## soccermanifesto

US News and World Report Top 26 Universities
+
Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years

1. Princeton: LA Premier 1, Surf 1, Real So Cal 1, Slammers 1
2. Harvard: WC 1, Blues 1
3. Yale: Blues 1
4. Columbia: Real So Cal 1, Eagles 1
5. Stanford: Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3
6. University of Chicago:  0
7. M.I.T.: N/A
8. Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2
9. University of Pennsylvania : 0 
10. California Institute of Technology: N/A
11. Johns Hopkins University: 0 
12. Dartmouth: WC 1
13: Northwestern: Legends 1, Beach 1
14. Brown: Real So Cal 1, Beach 1
15: Cornell: 0
16. Vanderbilt:  Slammers 1
17. Washington University in St. Louis: NA
18. Rice: WC 1
19. Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 1
20. Cal: Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
21. Emory: 0
22. Georgetown: Surf 2
23. Carnegie Mellon: FRAM 1
24: UCLA: Surf 3, Blues 6, WC 3, Slammers 1
25. USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
26. Virginia: 0

That's the scoreboard. Keep it in mind as you comment on clubs and coaches and players in So Cal.  Carry on.


----------



## Zoro

Can you do a pivot table and show commitments by club?  I guess there is an app for that, but thought you might post.

Also look how USNews ranks.  Use Forbes. 
USNews uses
Money spent/student = more expensive building adds to rank, as well as matching their ratios of race.

Forbes uses - Will they learn, will the succeed, will they make the money.

USNews excludes the Service Academies.  West Point, Navy, USAFA (and the other two) - not there.  Although those grads have a higher mid career pay than Princeton. 
What makes  that more interesting is the Princeton/Stanford - group go in with higher grades and test scores.  15 years later the average they achieve is less pay, let alone the other parts.   And US News excludes them.


----------



## Zerodenero

soccermanifesto said:


> US News and World Report Top 26 Universities
> +
> Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years
> 
> 1. Princeton: LA Premier 1, Surf 1, Real So Cal 1, Slammers 1
> 2. Harvard: WC 1, Blues 1
> 3. Yale: Blues 1
> 4. Columbia: Real So Cal 1, Eagles 1
> 5. Stanford: Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3
> 6. University of Chicago:  0
> 7. M.I.T.: N/A
> 8. Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2
> 9. University of Pennsylvania : 0
> 10. California Institute of Technology: N/A
> 11. Johns Hopkins University: 0
> 12. Dartmouth: WC 1
> 13: Northwestern: Legends 1, Beach 1
> 14. Brown: Real So Cal 1, Beach 1
> 15: Cornell: 0
> 16. Vanderbilt:  Slammers 1
> 17. Washington University in St. Louis: NA
> 18. Rice: WC 1
> 19. Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 1
> 20. Cal: Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
> 21. Emory: 0
> 22. Georgetown: Surf 2
> 23. Carnegie Mellon: FRAM 1
> 24: UCLA: Surf 3, Blues 6, WC 3, Slammers 1
> 25. USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
> 26. Virginia: 0
> 
> That's the scoreboard. Keep it in mind as you comment on clubs and coaches and players in So Cal.  Carry on.


Of the current DA clubs on this list ....seeing patterns of productivity. Gettin the feelin like WC & RSC got the shaft.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zerodenero said:


> Of the current DA clubs on this list ....seeing patterns of productivity. Gettin the feelin like WC & RSC got the shaft.



Winner, winner chicken dinner!!


----------



## BornToRun

soccermanifesto said:


> US News and World Report Top 26 Universities
> +
> Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years
> 
> 1. Princeton: LA Premier 1, Surf 1, Real So Cal 1, Slammers 1
> 2. Harvard: WC 1, Blues 1
> 3. Yale: Blues 1
> 4. Columbia: Real So Cal 1, Eagles 1
> 5. Stanford: Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3
> 6. University of Chicago:  0
> 7. M.I.T.: N/A
> 8. Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2
> 9. University of Pennsylvania : 0
> 10. California Institute of Technology: N/A
> 11. Johns Hopkins University: 0
> 12. Dartmouth: WC 1
> 13: Northwestern: Legends 1, Beach 1
> 14. Brown: Real So Cal 1, Beach 1
> 15: Cornell: 0
> 16. Vanderbilt:  Slammers 1
> 17. Washington University in St. Louis: NA
> 18. Rice: WC 1
> 19. Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 1
> 20. Cal: Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
> 21. Emory: 0
> 22. Georgetown: Surf 2
> 23. Carnegie Mellon: FRAM 1
> 24: UCLA: Surf 3, Blues 6, WC 3, Slammers 1
> 25. USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
> 26. Virginia: 0
> 
> That's the scoreboard. Keep it in mind as you comment on clubs and coaches and players in So Cal.  Carry on.


Beach had a Stanford and Blues had a University of Chicago in that time frame also (2016 grads) just to add to your list.-- I agree with your sentiment.


----------



## madcow

Zerodenero said:


> Of the current DA clubs on this list ....seeing patterns of productivity. Gettin the feelin like WC & RSC got the shaft.


While I understand your point, these are top educational schools. I bet USSF only cares about the top soccer schools. That list might be the same, though. I don't know.


----------



## Zoro

madcow said:


> While I understand your point, these are top educational schools. I bet USSF only cares about the top soccer schools. That list might be the same, though. I don't know.


It is surprising how well they correlate.  The soccer school ranking do change 10-20 spots each year or two, but in general they are the same.
Who am I missing that are in both besides?
Duke, ND, Stanford, UNC, Virginia

This group I think need to make final four a few more times to be "both"
UCLA and USC


----------



## Zerodenero

Zoro said:


> It is surprising how well they correlate.  The soccer school ranking do change 10-20 spots each year or two, but in general they are the same.
> Who am I missing that are in both besides?
> Duke, ND, Stanford, UNC, Virginia
> 
> This group I think need to make final four a few more times to be "both"
> UCLA and USC


UNC on the academic side is suspect....


----------



## KeepTheBall

NoGoal said:


> I just read US Soccer is re-activating the boys residency program.  I guess after a decade of Boys DA and still no super star, maybe Pulisic....then again he had to move to Dortmund at 16 years of age.
> 
> IMO, a US Soccer residency program is the BEST way to develop future national team players and potential pro soccer players.  They are taking only the ELITE players who want to play professionally.  They need to keep the players they want in the program, until they decide to cut the player for someone better.  This way, the players get a compounding development effect.
> 
> They need to start a program for the girls too! Then all the leagues are just that club soccer leagues!


The Residency program never stopped so how could they reactivate it?


----------



## Zerodenero

BornToRun said:


> Beach had a Stanford and Blues had a University of Chicago in that time frame also (2016 grads) just to add to your list.-- I agree with your sentiment.


Also missing is a 2018 Upenn commit from surf.


----------



## Zoro

Zerodenero said:


> UNC on the academic side is suspect....


Yea - on the edge.  But, like UCLA and USC all in the 20s rank (using my not favorite USA News ranking).
Need a thread on rankings how-they-do because some stuff may not be in-line with what parents value - but that is a different thread.


----------



## Glen

Zerodenero said:


> Also missing is a 2018 Upenn commit from surf.


What does it mean to "commit" to an Ivy League school?  There are a ton of 5th year high schools that exist back east for kids that were deferred - including athletes.  They "committed" to go as well.  It's a meaningless term - let's stop using it.


----------



## espola

Glen said:


> What does it mean to "commit" to an Ivy League school?  There are a ton of 5th year high schools that exist back east for kids that were deferred - including athletes.  They "committed" to go as well.  It's a meaningless term - let's stop using it.


It is still meaningful after NLI day.


----------



## ADPSOCCER

soccermanifesto said:


> US News and World Report Top 26 Universities
> +
> Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years
> 
> 1. Princeton: LA Premier 1, Surf 1, Real So Cal 1, Slammers 1
> 2. Harvard: WC 1, Blues 1
> 3. Yale: Blues 1
> 4. Columbia: Real So Cal 1, Eagles 1
> 5. Stanford: Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3
> 6. University of Chicago:  0
> 7. M.I.T.: N/A
> 8. Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2
> 9. University of Pennsylvania : 0
> 10. California Institute of Technology: N/A
> 11. Johns Hopkins University: 0
> 12. Dartmouth: WC 1
> 13: Northwestern: Legends 1, Beach 1
> 14. Brown: Real So Cal 1, Beach 1
> 15: Cornell: 0
> 16. Vanderbilt:  Slammers 1
> 17. Washington University in St. Louis: NA
> 18. Rice: WC 1
> 19. Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 1
> 20. Cal: Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
> 21. Emory: 0
> 22. Georgetown: Surf 2
> 23. Carnegie Mellon: FRAM 1
> 24: UCLA: Surf 3, Blues 6, WC 3, Slammers 1
> 25. USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
> 26. Virginia: 0
> 
> That's the scoreboard. Keep it in mind as you comment on clubs and coaches and players in So Cal.  Carry on.


Missing from LA Premier:
1 Stanford 2016 (AK)
1 Harvard 2017 (CD)


----------



## NoGoal

KeepTheBall said:


> The Residency program never stopped so how could they reactivate it?


My bad, I thought I read it was on hiatus.  Then again, the Residency program is only for U17s.  They need to implement it from Ulittles to HS graduation to be effective.


----------



## Zoro

Glen said:


> What does it mean to "commit" to an Ivy League school?  ...


A coach sponsors you.  Meaning they tell you they will use you as one of their quota to get you through Admin.  While they don't give money, they have only so many Admin will allow.   It should come with a pre-admit reading from Admin and an e-mail indicating intent, referencing Admin.  That was the process pretty much described at each school.

That is as good as any other commit as most commits come before signing day anyway and any athlete is late to the party if that falls through.

But - I agree commits on a Google spreadsheet are suspect.  Many change.


----------



## Zerodenero

Glen said:


> What does it mean to "commit" to an Ivy League school?  There are a ton of 5th year high schools that exist back east for kids that were deferred - including athletes.  They "committed" to go as well.  It's a meaningless term - let's stop using it.


Yes, there are several key 5th year college preps (i.e. Andover, Hotchkiss, Taft etc).....do you know of any Socal kids attending those that aren't on the list? 

I suppose for arguments sake, all verbal "commits" are "meaningless" until you sign on the dotted line.


----------



## Glen

espola said:


> It is still meaningful after NLI day.


They don't have NLI because they don't give scholarships.  But I would agree that the timing of NLI is when kids receive early admission or likely letters to Ivys.  Then again, looking at the schools' actual rosters would make a lot more sense then looking at "commitment" lists.


----------



## Zerodenero

Glen said:


> They don't participate in NLI because they don't give scholarships.  But I would agree that the timing of NLI is when kids receive early admission to Ivys.  Then again, looking at the schools' actual rosters would make a lot more sense then looking at "commitment" lists.


A picture is worth more than a thousand words.....

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/photos-711929-day-events.html
Circa 2016:


----------



## Glen

Zoro said:


> A coach sponsors you.  Meaning they tell you they will use you as one of their quota to get you through Admin.  While they don't give money, they have only so many Admin will allow.   It should come with a pre-admit reading from Admin and an e-mail indicating intent, referencing Admin.  That was the process pretty much described at each school.
> 
> That is as good as any other commit as most commits come before signing day anyway and any athlete is late to the party if that falls through.
> 
> But - I agree commits on a Google spreadsheet are suspect.  Many change.


By league rule, this cannot happen until after July 1 before a kid's senior year (at the earliest).  The "commitment" list includes kids much younger - rising juniors and sophomores.  So either the commitment list is wrong or the term commitment is used differently than what you describe.  I do agree with your description of the process, however.  Although it is important to note that the level of support a coach gives varies substantially, and that can be the difference between getting in.  

Let's look at the schools actual rosters!


----------



## Glen

Zerodenero said:


> A picture is worth more than a thousand words.....
> 
> http://www.ocregister.com/articles/photos-711929-day-events.html
> Circa 2016:


Yes, kids go to ivys.  But no, none of these kids signed a letter of intent.  There is no such thing.  I'm glad the schools let them celebrate in the day's events.


----------



## Glen

Zerodenero said:


> A picture is worth more than a thousand words.....
> 
> http://www.ocregister.com/articles/photos-711929-day-events.html
> Circa 2016:


Or, here is Harvard describes it:  http://www.thecrimson.com/blog/the-back-page/article/2014/2/6/harvard-signing-day-intent/


----------



## Glen

Zerodenero said:


> Yes, there are several key 5th year college preps (i.e. Andover, Hotchkiss, Taft etc).....do you know of any Socal kids attending those that aren't on the list?
> 
> I suppose for arguments sake, all verbal "commits" are "meaningless" until you sign on the dotted line.


No, I don't know any current kids.  But I did know several athletes that didn't get in after receiving a coaches "support" or had to go to 5th year high school.  It's why it seems so crazy to me that sophomores or juniors would be on this list.


----------



## Zerodenero

Glen said:


> Yes, kids go to ivys.  But no, none of these kids signed a letter of intent.  There is no such thing.  I'm glad the schools let them celebrate in the day's events.


yaya ok ok.....getting back on point with post 713 by Soccermanifesto.....

Based on the academic list, still feeling like WC and RSC got the shaft


----------



## cr7

Rev234 said:


> Watched (skipped through)  SC blues v solar Chelsea today.   Not sure what to make of that game. The ball was in the air a whole lot. Former team played v SC blues in CRL (they hung 10 on us)  I know they can pass the ball around  like a pro team, but that game today was tough to watch.   Anyway.  I will always  cheer for a SoCal team in national competition.


Just watched the game myself.  Solar Chelsea played some pretty soccer on the ground and connected from back to front.  Blues played kick ball all game and ran out of gas with very few subs.  With their stud center defender injured in 1st game, their defense was never the same.  In the box, Blues was vulnerable.   Solar Chelsea was by far the more dominant team and deserved the Championship. For once kickball soccer didn't prevail. Cheers to Solar Chelsea!! Good luck to the Team in Surf Cup!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zoro said:


> It is surprising how well they correlate.  The soccer school ranking do change 10-20 spots each year or two, but in general they are the same.
> Who am I missing that are in both besides?
> Duke, ND, Stanford, UNC, Virginia
> 
> This group I think need to make final four a few more times to be "both"
> UCLA and USC


Zoro,

UCLA has made it to more college cups than Virginia or Stanford.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_Women's_Soccer_Championship

I would say that qualifies.


----------



## socalkdg

NoGoal said:


> What is comical?  Nothing is funny, if Sweetsplat was receiving threatening PM's from AZ posters.
> View attachment 37
> 
> No one on the forum is anonymous.  Everyone leaves a trail of bread crumbs that eventually reveals their identity and why MessiFTW should be careful, if he is carrying the Sweetsplat banner now.
> 
> For example: Sweetsplat used to post A LOT of crap on SoCal players and teams.  He was easy to ID, because he concentrated his post on 2 age groups.  He was pro ECNL, lived in AZ.  There are only 2 ECNL clubs in AZ.  He posted a lot about Sereno winning an ECNL Championship, so it was a subconscious tell that his older DD played on that team.  Cross reference that Sereno team roster with the younger ECNL roster (age group he posts on) for matching last names.  Then Google the player's first, last name and ECNL.... Viola identity uncovered.  Some crazy parents post their private information like home address, phone number and email on their DD's ECNL bio.   Good thing it's a new forum and ALL the bread crumbs have been swept away.


Do people really do this?

New to these forums and got caught up into this thread, but why do people get so angry with other people on this forum?  Aren't we all just soccer fans with kids that play soccer?

By the way, the Pink Panther comments made me laugh since I coached an AYSO team last year named the Purple Panthers.  Our banner looked great.


----------



## cr7

Zerodenero said:


> yaya ok ok.....getting back on point with post 713 by Soccermanifesto.....
> 
> Based on the academic list, still feeling like WC and RSC got the shaft


Do we think that there will be 1 more list of clubs to be given Academy status in the 1st year?  Doesn't seem like there are enough clubs compared to the boys academy?


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> Yes, kids go to ivys.  But no, none of these kids signed a letter of intent.  There is no such thing.  I'm glad the schools let them celebrate in the day's events.


So, if any player verbally commits to play a college sport, but didn't get an athletic scholarship offer.  Does the player still sign a LOI in February iof their Sr year?


----------



## Zoro

Glen said:


> Yes, kids go to ivys.  But no, none of these kids signed a letter of intent.  There is no such thing.  I'm glad the schools let them celebrate in the day's events.


Those be rowing schools.   Princeton coach spent the day with us, assigned a rower to son and took him to class.  Funny, it was an economics class that got him so interested in econ, that is what he wants (now) for his major.  I think i posted this.  I love this coach Martin Crotty.  He makes a subtle comment about "this boat" and feel and swagger.  They destroyed all but the USNT 4 weeks later. 
I just love rowing.  but my kid did not - even for an Ivy.
But I got video...


----------



## Zoro

NoGoal said:


> So, if any player verbally commits to play a college sport, but didn't get an athletic scholarship offer.  Does the player still sign a LOI in February iof their Sr year?


No.   But schools and clubs will honor them in the the celebration.
In this case - same as an Ivy athlete.

For parents not concerned about the money part so much, I think this is absolutely the best way to go.
Use soccer to get you in.  Player has way more choices and is free to leave.  Player does not have pressure to perform or leave school.  It is gut wrenching sad (to me) to see a player leave the team and go to another school because for whatever reason coach can't fund them anymore.  

There is a push toward 4 year agreements.  While I dislike the money for sports in college idea, I think once a player takes the "job" they need some protection.


----------



## Zoro

MakeAPlay said:


> Zoro,
> 
> UCLA has made it to more college cups than Virginia or Stanford.
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_Women's_Soccer_Championship
> 
> I would say that qualifies.


Final Four counts - College Cup pool does not. 
So count Final Four appearances last 20 years with last 10 being most important.  finals being even more important and Winning - the most.  

I don't know the numbers for that. 

UCLA may be there, but a great soccer school has never had the season UCLA did last year.

It is of course a subjective ranking.  UCLA/USC could be there.  As UNC could be on the academic list.


----------



## soccermanifesto

*US News and World Report Top 26 Universities
+
Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years (updated)*

1. Princeton: LA Premier 1, Surf 1, Real So Cal 1, Slammers 1
2. Harvard: WC 1, Blues 1, LA Premier 1
3. Yale: Blues 1
4. Columbia: Real So Cal 1, Eagles 1
5. Stanford: Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3, Beach 1, La Premier 1
6. University of Chicago: Blues 1
7. M.I.T.: N/A
8. Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 2, Real So Cal 2
9. University of Pennsylvania : Surf 1
10. California Institute of Technology: N/A
11. Johns Hopkins University: 0
12. Dartmouth: WC 1
13: Northwestern: Legends 1, Beach 1
14. Brown: Real So Cal 1, Beach 1
15: Cornell: 0
16. Vanderbilt: Slammers 1
17. Washington University in St. Louis: NA
18. Rice: WC 1
19. Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 2
20. Cal: Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
21. Emory: 0
22. Georgetown: Surf 2
23. Carnegie Mellon: FRAM 1
24: UCLA: Surf 3, Blues 6, WC 3, Slammers 1
25. USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
26. Virginia: 0


*NCAA Women’s Soccer Rankings  Top 26 
+
Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years*

Penn State: Slammers 2
Florida State: Surf 1
Rutgers: Slammers 1
Virginia: 0
Stanford:  Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3, Beach 1, La Premier 1
Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 2, Real So Cal 2
West Virginia: 0
Florida: 0
UConn: 0
Clemson: 0
Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 2
Auburn: Blues 2
Virginia Tech: WC 1
USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
North Carolina: Eagles 1
Texas A& M: 0
Southern Alabama: 0
Texas Tech: Legends 1
South Florida: 0
Arizona: WC 1, Surf 2, Slammers 1, Legends 2, Blues 4
Ohio State: Real So Cal 1, WC 1, Carlsbad United 1
BYU: Albion 1, WC 1, Arsenal 1
Cal:  Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
Ole Miss: Surf Inland Empire 1
Cal State Fullerton: Carlsbad United 2, WC 2, Beach 1, Real So Cal 2, Albion 1, Eagles 1, Slammers 1
Santa Clara: WC 3, Slammers 1, La Galaxy South Bay 1, Beach 1, Surf 1, Blues 1
Lists are now revised to reflect Top Academics AND Top 26 soccer programs as reported by the NCAA.  Penn State is obviously the National Champs.  Very few 2019 So Cal recruits but there are several.


----------



## espola

soccermanifesto said:


> *US News and World Report Top 26 Universities
> +
> Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years (updated)*
> 
> 1. Princeton: LA Premier 1, Surf 1, Real So Cal 1, Slammers 1
> 2. Harvard: WC 1, Blues 1, LA Premier 1
> 3. Yale: Blues 1
> 4. Columbia: Real So Cal 1, Eagles 1
> 5. Stanford: Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3, Beach 1, La Premier 1
> 6. University of Chicago: Blues 1
> 7. M.I.T.: N/A
> 8. Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2
> 9. University of Pennsylvania : Surf 1
> 10. California Institute of Technology: N/A
> 11. Johns Hopkins University: 0
> 12. Dartmouth: WC 1
> 13: Northwestern: Legends 1, Beach 1
> 14. Brown: Real So Cal 1, Beach 1
> 15: Cornell: 0
> 16. Vanderbilt: Slammers 1
> 17. Washington University in St. Louis: NA
> 18. Rice: WC 1
> 19. Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 1
> 20. Cal: Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
> 21. Emory: 0
> 22. Georgetown: Surf 2
> 23. Carnegie Mellon: FRAM 1
> 24: UCLA: Surf 3, Blues 6, WC 3, Slammers 1
> 25. USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
> 26. Virginia: 0
> 
> 
> *NCAA Women’s Soccer Rankings  Top 26
> +
> Southern California Girls Recruits 2016-2019 Graduation Years*
> 
> Penn State: Slammers 2
> Florida State: Surf 1
> Rutgers: Slammer 1
> Virginia: 0
> Stanford:  Strikers 2, Slammers 2, Eagles 1, Blues 3, WC 1, Real So Cal 3, Beach 1, La Premier 1
> Duke: Surf 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2
> West Virginia: 0
> Florida: 0
> UConn: 0
> Clemson: 0
> Notre Dame: Real So Cal 2, Blues 2, Slammers 1
> Auburn: Blues 2
> Virginia Tech: WC 1
> USC: Carlsbad United 1, Surf 2, Eagles 1, Slammers 1, Real So Cal 2, Beach 2, Blues 2
> North Carolina: Eagles 1
> Texas A& M: 0
> Southern Alabama: 0
> Texas Tech: Legends 1
> South Florida: 0
> Arizona: WC 1, Surf 2, Slammers 1, Legends 2, Blues 4
> Ohio State: Real So Cal 1, WC 1, Carlsbad United 1
> BYU: Albion 1, WC 1
> Cal:  Blues 1, Surf 2, Beach 1, Legends 2
> Ole Miss: Surf Inland Empire 1
> Cal State Fullerton: Carlsbad United 2, WC 2, Beach 1, Real So Cal 2, Albion 1
> Santa Clara: WC 3, Slammers 1, La Galaxy South Bay 1, Beach 1, Surf 1, Blues 1
> Lists are now revised to reflect Top Academics AND Top 26 soccer programs as reported by the NCAA.  Penn State is obviously the National Champs.  Very few 2019 So Cal recruits but there are several.


Is that NCAA top 26 just last year's final RPI?


----------



## soccermanifesto

espola said:


> Is that NCAA top 26 just last year's final RPI?


Yes.  Rankings from the NCAA website.  Everything else is projections and speculation. 

Worth noting that some of the Top 26 Academic schools will deny admissions usually claiming grades but not always.  College Coaches keep in touch with their recruits, know their grades and talk to their recruits about their academics, and provided the student's grades & test scores are not a disaster, the Coaches have some level of sway with the Admissions Board.

So you can decide for yourself if there is buyers remorse by Coaches at a University with a player denied admission... Said "denied" player would cost scholarship money the Coach may now want to commit elsewhere (but was cleverly taken off the market to rival colleges, which now leaves the kid scrambling) OR if the recruit was denied admission for legitimate reasons.


----------



## Zoro

Look at some others:
http://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/list/#tab:rank
http://www.payscale.com/college-salary-report/bachelors

Or this...most of these may be difficult playing soccer at a top 100 soccer school.
http://www.payscale.com/college-salary-report/majors-that-pay-you-back/bachelors


----------



## soccermanifesto

I find that Forbes list suspect. I know a little bit about Haverford, lovely school, but not number 23 in the nation in my opinion.   US News has traditionally been considered the definitive list, its the one Admissions Deans and School Presidents freak out about when the list comes out, but your mileage may vary.

The pay list is suspect also.  It is based on graduates "who completed the[ir] pay scale survey."   Plus I would quibble with the salary ceiling of # 1 ranked SUNY Maritime College.

That said, any of the top 26 on any of those lists are pretty good Academic institutions.


----------



## soccermanifesto

I am not a statistician, but I would say if your kid starts on a Blues ECNL team, I really like their odds of getting recruited by a top school.  How much of that is the power of the Blues Brand and great coaching or whether they REALLY have all the top talent in the area can be debated.   But the numbers are what they are. 

ECNL homers:  Blues, Slammers, Real So Cal, West Coast, and Surf simply crush the number of recruits to top Academic and top D1 Soccer schools versus non-ECNL clubs.

ECNL dissenters: Beach and Legends have roughly the same number of recruits to top schools, and outnumber the number of ECNL stalwarts Eagles, Arsenal, and Strikers to top Academic and D1 soccer schools.

West Coast and Real So Cal have a great case to make to become DAs, unless they chose not to or don't meet some unknown criteria. 

If your daughter got into a college she loves because of soccer whether its Division 1 or Division 3 that she might normally have not gotten into so easily, that's all that matters.


----------



## Zerodenero

soccermanifesto said:


> If your daughter got into a college she loves because of soccer whether its Division 1 or Division 3 that she might normally have not gotten into so easily, that's all that matters.


DA/ECNL - doesn't matter how you get there....as long as you get there.


----------



## SOCCERMINION

cr7 said:


> Just watched the game myself.  Solar Chelsea played some pretty soccer on the ground and connected from back to front.  Blues played kick ball all game and ran out of gas with very few subs.  With their stud center defender injured in 1st game, their defense was never the same.  In the box, Blues was vulnerable.   Solar Chelsea was by far the more dominant team and deserved the Championship. For once kickball soccer didn't prevail. Cheers to Solar Chelsea!! Good luck to the Team in Surf Cup!!


Hats off to Chelsea, and to Blues for a great game. Game sure had a USA vrs France feel to it. Teams obvioulsy had differnt styles of play and It was a very great matchup. All the girls should be proud of their performances. I have to admit, I was disappointed at the result, as I was cheering for Blues, (Socal) the Home Team. It was great to be able to watch and cheer on the Socal Teams at home. Chelsea took the Game that mattered to be crowned Champs, but i think Blues would win most of the time these teams played eachother.......


----------



## BornToRun

I'm sorry, I think you said, but where are the recruit numbers coming from? For example-- if you go on Blues website and look under teams, they have the 2016-17 commits up and, while impressive,  it doesn't look quite like this breakdown.


----------



## soccermanifesto

The list includes known 2016, 2017, 2018 graduates and a handful of 2019 graduates. 

The list is pulled from 3 sources: 

Soccercbg's list and spreadsheet on google... He's also on Twitter. When some schools get a verbal commitment they tell him "off the record" so other teams back off...

Topdrawersoccer's commitments list

People here who reported some recent recruits that I included on the honor system.


----------



## BornToRun

Also, kudos to those two non-ECNL clubs for getting that number and caliber of college for their girls WITHOUT the benefit of ECNL.  If you go to Beach's site and click on College Commits, go back a couple years, you will see Princeton, more Brown, University of Chicago, along with NYU, Boston College, Amherst etc.   They obviously work very hard for their girls.  And I'd imagine that's true of any club with good numbers on these lists. I always think it's important to do your research before joining a club-- those with good numbers of top college commits show a dedication to helping girls succeed in soccer and in life.


----------



## BornToRun

soccermanifesto said:


> The list includes known 2016, 2017, 2018 graduates and a handful of 2019 graduates.
> 
> The list is pulled from 3 sources:
> 
> Soccercbg's list and spreadsheet on google... He's also on Twitter. When some schools get a verbal commitment they tell him "off the record" so other teams back off...
> 
> Topdrawersoccer's commitments list
> 
> People here who reported some recent recruits that I included on the honor system.


Thanks for your efforts. It's interesting!


----------



## soccerobserver

SoccoManFest, in the Los Angeles area there are at least three clubs that have been sending kids to the Ivy's as well as little Ivy's and the teams are not ECNL much less DA. Also, I notice that these committed kids are never picked up by the likes of Top Drawer or other websites that track commits. It seems as though the larger clubs get the press but some of the smaller clubs are having notable success with placement of their players.

When many of us started this process it was just for fun and development. Then along the way some of us realized that soccer could be a great way to get the "golden ticket" into seleticve colleges. Nowadays, it seems to me that there is a broader awareness of how useful soccer can be in addition to just being fun... but for us it did not start that way.


----------



## socalkdg

Having a 10 year old, I'll take just being able to watch my kid play soccer into her college years.  I think any parents that have been able to have this come true are truly blessed.  

Off topic a bit, and since I've always been a UCLA fan, how much did they improve with their current recruiting class?

Lastly, womens coaches rankings are out and updated Aug. 2

http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/soccer-women/d1/nscaa-coaches


----------



## NoGoal

socalkdg said:


> Having a 10 year old, I'll take just being able to watch my kid play soccer into her college years.  I think any parents that have been able to have this come true are truly blessed.
> 
> Off topic a bit, and since I've always been a UCLA fan, how much did they improve with their current recruiting class?
> 
> Lastly, womens coaches rankings are out and updated Aug. 2
> 
> http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/soccer-women/d1/nscaa-coaches


They have the #1 recruiting class, including Mallory Pugh and Jessie Fleming who both started for the US WNT and Canadian NT Olympic teams respectively yesterday.  Pugh is redshirting this year, because she is also playing in the U20 WWC though.


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> They have the #1 recruiting class, including Mallory Pugh and Jessie Fleming who both started for the US WNT and Canadian NT Olympic teams respectively yesterday.  Pugh is redshirting this year, because she is also playing in the U20 WWC though.


I read that Pugh is deferring enrollment.  If she was redshirting, she would be enrolled taking classes.  If what I read was correct, I think that moves her to 2017 (assuming she enrolls).


----------



## Zoro

socalkdg said:


> Having a 10 year old, I'll take just being able to watch my kid play soccer into her college years.  I think any parents that have been able to have this come true are truly blessed.
> 
> Off topic a bit, and since I've always been a UCLA fan, how much did they improve with their current recruiting class?
> 
> Lastly, womens coaches rankings are out and updated Aug. 2
> 
> http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/soccer-women/d1/nscaa-coaches


UCLA currently in an RPI hole ranking of 92.  I expect they will get out of that, but I don't think talent was the reason for where they are.   At least two were DD's teammates and others club mates.
IMO having the #1 class for talent should keep you in the coaches poll, but it takes talent and more to keep yourself in the top half of the group.  I have not seen UCLA do that yet.  

If not using soccer for entrance into college then there are lots of options to have them play in college from Varsity to club to rec.  The very best players my DD every played with are on Co-Rec league.  They allow two girls.  She has a couple off eligibility NCAA Champion players, some that never played college she says are pro good and a bunch that focus on school more than varsity.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> I read that Pugh is deferring enrollment.  If she was redshirting, she would be enrolled taking classes.  If what I read was correct, I think that moves her to 2017 (assuming she enrolls).


I heard deferring enrollment for the Spring, because Michelle French mandated that any college player playing in the U20 WWC has to redshirt. IMO, that is silly and why 5 of the top eligible players from rigorous academic universities at Stanford and Duke decided to skip the U20 WWC this Fall.

As for Pugh, who knows....if the US WNT team wins GOLD, she may decide to announce she is foregoing her college eligibility by turning pro so she can cash in on the gold medal bonus money and sign a Nike endorsement contract


----------



## espola

Zoro said:


> UCLA currently in an RPI hole ranking of 92.  I expect they will get out of that, but I don't think talent was the reason for where they are.   At least two were DD's teammates and others club mates.
> IMO having the #1 class for talent should keep you in the coaches poll, but it takes talent and more to keep yourself in the top half of the group.  I have not seen UCLA do that yet.
> 
> If not using soccer for entrance into college then there are lots of options to have them play in college from Varsity to club to rec.  The very best players my DD every played with are on Co-Rec league.  They allow two girls.  She has a couple off eligibility NCAA Champion players, some that never played college she says are pro good and a bunch that focus on school more than varsity.


The "RPI hole" is not current - those are numbers released at the end of last season.  Right now everybody is tied for first place.

Th co-ed leagues I am aware of don't "allow" a certain number of girls - they require a minimum number of them.


----------



## Zoro

espola said:


> The "RPI hole" is not current - those are numbers released at the end of last season.  Right now everybody is tied for first place.
> 
> Th co-ed leagues I am aware of don't "allow" a certain number of girls - they require a minimum number of them.


Her team is maxed out on girls.  That was an issue.  It was a friend or her, friend did something else.
Other leagues don't allow club players.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Glen said:


> I read that Pugh is deferring enrollment.  If she was redshirting, she would be enrolled taking classes.  If what I read was correct, I think that moves her to 2017 (assuming she enrolls).


She actually stays in the 2016 recruiting class.  It is unlikely that she will stay past the 4th year even if she has an additional year of eligibility.  2019 is a WWC year and 2020 is an Olympic year.  There is a good likelihood that she will be the face of US soccer by then with Alex Morgan handing off the torch in 2019 and doing a farewell tour at the Olympics.


----------



## MakeAPlay

socalkdg said:


> Having a 10 year old, I'll take just being able to watch my kid play soccer into her college years.  I think any parents that have been able to have this come true are truly blessed.
> 
> Off topic a bit, and since I've always been a UCLA fan, how much did they improve with their current recruiting class?
> 
> Lastly, womens coaches rankings are out and updated Aug. 2
> 
> http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/soccer-women/d1/nscaa-coaches


They will be quite improved.  They cut some players and some transferred and the roster is down to a lean and mean 24 with Pugh making it 25 in January.  They will make the sweet 16 this year maybe final 8 and next year will be the big year with Pugh and AS joining the attack.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zoro said:


> Final Four counts - College Cup pool does not.
> So count Final Four appearances last 20 years with last 10 being most important.  finals being even more important and Winning - the most.
> 
> I don't know the numbers for that.
> 
> UCLA may be there, but a great soccer school has never had the season UCLA did last year.
> 
> It is of course a subjective ranking.  UCLA/USC could be there.  As UNC could be on the academic list.


You did say the college cup aka the Final Four for college soccer right?  I am not sure what you mean by the college cup pool.  The final 4 is the college cup.  I follow college soccer closely and you confused me with this one.

Not sure what last season has to do with UCLA being a great soccer school.  More than half the time that they make the tournament they end up in the final 4.  the only schools that can say that have had more success are North Carolina, Notre Dame and Florida State.  Is this just you pumping up your daughter's school or is this a serious statement?


----------



## Zoro

MakeAPlay said:


> You did say the college cup aka the Final Four for college soccer right?  I am not sure what you mean by the college cup pool.  The final 4 is the college cup.  I follow college soccer closely and you confused me with this one.
> 
> Not sure what last season has to do with UCLA being a great soccer school.  More than half the time that they make the tournament they end up in the final 4.  the only schools that can say that have had more success are North Carolina, Notre Dame and Florida State.  Is this just you pumping up your daughter's school or is this a serious statement?


The women's tournament is College Cup, I should not have capitalized the Fs.  I meant those that reach the Semi's is what I was referring to.  The Final Four tournament names I know of are for basket ball. 

This is a good history page that you have to dig deeper to find the final four.  I used to do that.   I think I said in my post I didn't know the numbers and recognized they could be there.  I've typically heard coaches say it is making the semi's that count.  Maybe making the knockout rounds.  While not privy to the details it felt as a little financial kicker was in it for making it to the semi's.  I'm not thinking the same was true for quarters as I remember that being a somewhat disappointing year.

For finals:
UCLA 4X
Stanford 3X
Notre Dame 8X
UNC 24+
Florida State 3X
Duke 3X


http://www.ncaa.com/history/soccer-women/d1
*Championship History*
*YEAR* *TEAM (RECORD)* *SCORE* *RUNNER-UP* *SITE*
2015 Penn State (22-3-2) 1-0 Duke Cary, N.C.
2014 Florida State (23-1-1) 1-0 Virginia Boca Raton, Fla.
2013 UCLA (22-1-3) 1-0 (OT) Florida State Cary, N.C.
2012 North Carolina (15-5-3) 4-1 Penn State San Diego, Calif.
2011 Stanford (25-0-1) 1-0 Duke Kennesaw, Ga.
2010 Notre Dame (21-2-2) 1-0 Stanford Cary, N.C.
2009 North Carolina (23-3-1) 1-0 Stanford Texas A&M
2008 North Carolina (25-1-2) 2-1 Notre Dame Cary, N.C.
2007 Southern California (20-3-2) 2-0 Florida State Texas A&M
2006 North Carolina (27-1) 2-1 Notre Dame Cary, N.C.
2005 Portland (23-0-2) 4-0 UCLA Texas A&M
2004 *Notre Dame (25-1-1) 1-1 (2 ot, pk) UCLA Cary, N.C.
2003 North Carolina (27-0) 6-0 Connecticut Cary, N.C.
2002 Portland (20-4-2) 2-1 (2 ot) Santa Clara Austin, Texas
2001 Santa Clara (23-2) 1-0 North Carolina SMU
2000 North Carolina (21-3) 2-1 UCLA San Jose State
1999 North Carolina (24-2) 2-0 Notre Dame San Jose State
1998 Florida (26-1) 1-0 North Carolina UNC Greensboro
1997 North Carolina (27-0-1) 2-0 Connecticut UNC Greensboro
1996 North Carolina (25-1) 1-0 (2 ot) Notre Dame Santa Clara
1995 Notre Dame (21-2-2) 1-0 (3 ot) Portland North Carolina
1994 North Carolina (25-1-1) 5-0 Notre Dame Portland
1993 North Carolina (23-0) 6-0 George Mason North Carolina
1992 North Carolina (25-0) 9-1 Duke North Carolina
1991 North Carolina (25-0) 3-1 Wisconsin North Carolina
1990 North Carolina (24-0) 6-0 Connecticut North Carolina
1989 North Carolina (24-0-1) 2-0 Colorado College North Carolina State
1988 North Carolina (18-0-3) 4-1 North Carolina State North Carolina
1987 North Carolina (23-0-1 1-0 Massachusetts Massachusetts
1986 North Carolina (24-0-1) 2-0 Colorado College George Mason
1985 George Mason (18-2-1) 2-0 North Carolina George Mason
1984 North Carolina (24-0-1) 2-0 Connecticut North Carolina
1983 North Carolina (19-1) 4-0 George Mason UCF
1982 North Carolina (19-2) 2-0 UCF UCF


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zoro said:


> UCLA currently in an RPI hole ranking of 92.  I expect they will get out of that, but I don't think talent was the reason for where they are.   At least two were DD's teammates and others club mates.
> IMO having the #1 class for talent should keep you in the coaches poll, but it takes talent and more to keep yourself in the top half of the group.  I have not seen UCLA do that yet.
> 
> If not using soccer for entrance into college then there are lots of options to have them play in college from Varsity to club to rec.  The very best players my DD every played with are on Co-Rec league.  They allow two girls.  She has a couple off eligibility NCAA Champion players, some that never played college she says are pro good and a bunch that focus on school more than varsity.



UCLA was lacking in talent.  The recruits that BJ and Jill committed for 2013 and 2014 were hit and miss.  They had one bad year and plummeted.  They have the #1 schedule in the nation and will have plenty of opportunities to take down teams and climb into the poll.  The NSCAA poll is quite suspect especially considering a couple of things:
1. Florida St. at number 1 is questionable even for the FSU fans.  42% of their roster are freshman and they lose all of their starting forwards.

2. Penn St. has 5 starters redshirting due to the U20 WWC and will struggle.

3.North Carolina will be missing 2 starters due to the WWC and arguably their best player will be sitting out due to injury.

4. Virginia loses about half of their starting lineup a year after underachieving.

5. Rutgers at 10 is the biggest joke.  They lose like 8 starters and aren't known for picking up powerhouse classes.

The top five should be
Stanford
Duke
Texas A&M
Florida
USC

Everything else will sort itself out on the field.


----------



## espola

Zoro said:


> The women's tournament is College Cup, I should not have capitalized the Fs.  I meant those that reach the Semi's is what I was referring to.  The Final Four tournament names I know of are for basket ball.
> 
> This is a good history page that you have to dig deeper to find the final four.  I used to do that.   I think I said in my post I didn't know the numbers and recognized they could be there.  I've typically heard coaches say it is making the semi's that count.  Maybe making the knockout rounds.  While not privy to the details it felt as a little financial kicker was in it for making it to the semi's.  I'm not thinking the same was true for quarters as I remember that being a somewhat disappointing year.


What NCAA calls the "College Cup" is the three games at the end of the Tournament, the semi-finals and the final.  Actually, there are 6 "College Cups" every year - men and women in all three divisions.  The location is announced years in advance and tickets go on sale early in the season.

The only NCAA Tournament that pays anything to the competing schools is D1 men's basketball, and that money goes to the conferences ($260,000 per game played, and the payments to the conferences continue for years).  That became a Title IX issue the last few years because the D1 women's teams and their conferences are paid nothing.  I have heard from people I trust that the NCAA covers all the teams' travel expenses to the tournament in all sports, so that's something.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/26/opinion/the-ncaas-women-problem.html?_r=0


----------



## Zoro

espola said:


> What NCAA calls the "College Cup" is the three games at the end of the Tournament, the semi-finals and the final. ...


Not super clear from some of their stuff.  But I can see that.  Apologies to those teams not shown at the bottom of the bracket.
http://www.ncaa.com/interactive-bracket/soccer-women/d1


----------



## Robert Walker

This is obviously a cash snatch. Surf, Blues and Slammers send a lot of players to the national groups and Beach has a few quality mentors. I could see RSC and Arsenal making a geographic argument.SoCal Girls DA clubs can just create 10-12 players for every club, per HS graduation year, in light of the joined age bunches. That is a sum of just 96 SoCal players resolving to play school soccer, hence ECNL will even now be a feasible alternative for school introduction.


----------



## dfbmike

NoGoal said:


> As for Pugh, who knows....if the US WNT team wins GOLD, she may decide to announce she is foregoing her college eligibility by turning pro so she can cash in on the gold medal bonus money and sign a Nike endorsement contract


Sarcasm or are you coming around on the idea that those opportunities are starting to be available?  Especially for her....


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> Sarcasm or are you coming around on the idea that those opportunities are starting to be available?  Especially for her....


She is the exception to the rule.....And falls in line with the Alex Morgan's of the world, aka once in a generation player.  Your funny, if you think 1 out of the millions girls who play girls youth soccer proves your point that girls soccer players will become the norm, by turning pro to make millions.  She won't be making millions as US Soccer pays 1 time 187K bonus for each WC or Olympic Championship. She isn't going to pull Marta money, even with her Nike deal.   She on the contrary proves my point, unless your a phenom....posters and readers better forget having their DDs even thinking about playing professionally, if they have no shot at making the US WNT, a roster of 22 players.  They will make more money playing college soccer, getting their education and entering the work force.

Read a dose of reality!

http://www.takepart.com/feature/2015/06/05/womens-world-cup-womens-pro-soccer

BTW, she was is not just a by product of US Soccer.  She played ECNL and HS soccer.


----------



## dfbmike

NoGoal said:


> She is the exception to the rule.....And falls in line with the Alex Morgan's of the world, aka once in a generation player.  Your funny, if you think 1 out of millions girls who play girls soccer is now the norm and proves your point that women soccer players will become the norm by turning pro to make making millions.  she won't be making millions either.  US Soccer pays 1 time 187K bonus for each WC or Olympic Championship. She isn't going to pull Marta money.
> 
> BTW, she was is not just a by product of US Soccer.  She played ECNL and HS soccer.



irrelevant, always said depriment to soccer development here is between ages 17 and 22...college years...we have maybe the best and most athletic youth players in the world right here in socal and the US, continuation and improvement of their development in college and opportunities thereafter is what fails them.  and you happen to be incorrect, there are other players on the squad (at least 1 that bypassed college to sign a pro contract in europe)...i care less if players make it to pro leagues through ecnl or da as long as that option is available.  
right now the sole purpose of a DA is to develop players as a pipeline to porfessional soccer, if ecnl wants to hop on that wagon more power to them.
i am not watching this olympic soccer but every time the uswnt plays it is pure advertising for the nwsl and womens pro soccer, stepping stone...if pugh were to sign pro it would be another stepping stone, all it takes is one baby.  there are plenty of other players who signed pro straight out of HS, but she would be the biggest story and i wouldn't even go as far as calling her a once in a generation player, yet, she is 17.
NWSL will sign a new tv deal the next couple of years and many mls teams are waiting in line to join the league for expansion, i am sure they would be happy to have someone like pugh on board.  
Soccer careers are short, get what you can, make that dough first, you can always get that education later.  might not be the popular opinion, but who cares.  you love your ecnl and college soccer, i get it, but dont be bitter because future players male or female will have better opps than our kids will or did.


----------



## NoGoal

dfbmike said:


> irrelevant, always said depriment to soccer development here is between ages 17 and 22...college years...we have maybe the best and most athletic youth players in the world right here in socal and the US, continuation and improvement of their development in college and opportunities thereafter is what fails them.  and you happen to be incorrect, there are other players on the squad (at least 1 that bypassed college to sign a pro contract in europe)...i care less if players make it to pro leagues through ecnl or da as long as that option is available.
> right now the sole purpose of a DA is to develop players as a pipeline to porfessional soccer, if ecnl wants to hop on that wagon more power to them.
> i am not watching this olympic soccer but every time the uswnt plays it is pure advertising for the nwsl and womens pro soccer, stepping stone...if pugh were to sign pro it would be another stepping stone, all it takes is one baby.  there are plenty of other players who signed pro straight out of HS, but she would be the biggest story and i wouldn't even go as far as calling her a once in a generation player, yet, she is 17.
> NWSL will sign a new tv deal the next couple of years and many mls teams are waiting in line to join the league for expansion, i am sure they would be happy to have someone like pugh on board.
> Soccer careers are short, get what you can, make that dough first, you can always get that education later.  might not be the popular opinion, but who cares.  you love your ecnl and college soccer, i get it, but dont be bitter because future players male or female will have better opps than our kids will or did.


Again, I didn't read your post! 

Read the article:

http://www.takepart.com/feature/2015/06/05/womens-world-cup-womens-pro-soccer

Like, I posted prior keep dreaming the world needs dreamers!

I'm OUT, dueces, LMAO!


----------



## BornToRun

Pro Football players go to college.  They make millions later. Why on Earth shouldn't female soccer players?


----------



## Zoro

NoGoal said:


> She is the exception to the rule.....And falls in line with the Alex Morgan's of the world, aka once in a generation player.  Your funny, if you think 1 out of the millions girls who play girls youth soccer proves your point that girls soccer players will become the norm, by turning pro to make millions.  She won't be making millions as US Soccer pays 1 time 187K bonus for each WC or Olympic Championship. She isn't going to pull Marta money, even with her Nike deal.   She on the contrary proves my point, unless your a phenom....posters and readers better forget having their DDs even thinking about playing professionally, if they have no shot at making the US WNT, a roster of 22 players.  They will make more money playing college soccer, getting their education and entering the work force.
> 
> Read a dose of reality!
> 
> http://www.takepart.com/feature/2015/06/05/womens-world-cup-womens-pro-soccer
> 
> BTW, she was is not just a by product of US Soccer.  She played ECNL and HS soccer.


One of DD's teammates will be playing pro, another is a Chemical Engineer who was hired by Deloitte (guess they like smart kids with no experience). 
By 4th year of college there are very different ideas of what is successful.  Even if being a pro were an option, many are done, would not take it or want it.  It is a hard life.


----------



## NoGoal

Zoro said:


> One of DD's teammates will be playing pro, another is a Chemical Engineer who was hired by Deloitte (guess they like smart kids with no experience).
> By 4th year of college there are very different ideas of what is successful.  Even if being a pro were an option, many are done, would not take it or want it.  It is a hard life.


They hired her because she is bright and one of the very few women with a degree in chemical engineering is my guess.

It's a hard life for a women pro soccer player, because there is no money to be made.  They are playing purely for the love of the game, except for 22-23 US women national team players who's salary are subsidized by US Soccer.


----------



## NoGoal

BornToRun said:


> Pro Football players go to college.  They make millions later. Why on Earth shouldn't female soccer players?


I hope this is a rhetorical question?


----------



## socalkdg

NoGoal said:


> I hope this is a rhetorical question?


I think he meant they should still go to college, then try an make money as soccer players(not millions).   Once done with that, they start their career.   I believe the stat is 1.6% actually make the NFL after college football. Thus even with the chances at millions, boys/men should be playing for the love of the game and getting their college education.

Based off the info we have, wouldn't it be in everyone's best interest to set the goal for girls soccer to be college soccer(besides all the other benefits that they get from playing), while improving the training they get there in college, then take the girls from colleges for the US program?  Or is soccer so different from baseball, football, mens and womens basketball, that this won't work?


----------



## dfbmike

definition of a successful professional athletes for some of you=multi millionaire and must play in one of the top leagues of the world= got it.


----------



## dfbmike

BornToRun said:


> Pro Football players go to college.  They make millions later. Why on Earth shouldn't female soccer players?


ahh always love the nfl/nba and soccer comparisons.
are football players eligible to join nfl teams straight outta high school?  it is called a money making monopoly for everyone=no other options.  would those players go to college if there were other options?
things aren't always black n white.


----------



## dfbmike

NoGoal said:


> Again, I didn't read your post!
> 
> Read the article:
> 
> http://www.takepart.com/feature/2015/06/05/womens-world-cup-womens-pro-soccer
> 
> Like, I posted prior keep dreaming the world needs dreamers!
> 
> I'm OUT, dueces, LMAO!


i have indeed come to the realization that facts of growth of the sport of soccer in this country and its corresponding changes, increase of opportunities and opening of new doors, for both male and female players, that you are not used to incapacitates your ability to read.

I could post plenty of articles and successful stories (eye of the beholder i guess) here backing my angle as well, but i wont.  and again i'm not talking about education or becoming an engineer, right or wrong, high risk vs low risk, good choice vs bad choice, millions vs poverty line....i'm talking about soccer development and professional playing opportunities which many athletes dream of, train hard for and make many sacrifices because its what they love to do, even more so as a job.  and its not for everyone.

you are a funny guy, i don't care what they say about you.  keep up the good work.


----------



## MakeAPlay

This is a moot argument.  Until the DA actually comes around and produces one YNT player let alone one WNT player it is all speculation.  I know players with pro potential that are betting on their education not the US developmental system.  I also know players that are going to Mexico to play professionally.  I also know a female player that went overseas to play pro and is  back now and headed to a JUCO when she could have got a great scholarship.

Let's wait for it to happen and we can debate the results later.  Let's hope the NWSL doesn't fold before then.


----------



## MakeAPlay

I'm sorry but it still boggles my mind that there is a debate about women's pro soccer.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I'm sorry but it still boggles my mind that there is a debate about women's pro soccer.


Amen brother, many are delusional about riches being had playing professional womens soccer.  If there were even mid to high 6 figure multi year contracts available being drafted outright after high school as a non-WNT player.  That is the path many players should take similar to baseball, but that isn't the case.  To each their own though.

To put in perspective, by 2021 (my DD college grad year) the minimum wage will be $15 an hour ($31,200 a yr) and working at Wal-Mart as a greeter or flipping burgers at McDonalds will make more than a NWSL player.


----------



## Zoro

dfbmike said:


> definition of a successful professional athletes for some of you=multi millionaire and must play in one of the top leagues of the world= got it.


To me it means a vocation that enables you to support the life you want, and provides a path into retirement without *needing* to be supported by others. 
Pretty tough in women's soccer.  Pretty tough in many men's sports too.
The idea of a sport as a vocation removes a wee bit of the romance for me - and I expect for many that do it.


----------



## BornToRun

dfbmike said:


> ahh always love the nfl/nba and soccer comparisons.
> are football players eligible to join nfl teams straight outta high school?  it is called a money making monopoly for everyone=no other options.  would those players go to college if there were other options?
> things aren't always black n white.


It is an honor to be able to attend a top university in this country, and a great privilege to be given money to do so.  I will be grateful if my daughter gets the opportunity to play the sport she loves at the collegiate level. That alone is reserved for a select few.


----------



## NoGoal

BornToRun said:


> It is an honor to be able to attend a top university in this country, and a great privilege to be given money to do so.  I will be grateful if my daughter gets the opportunity to play the sport she loves at the collegiate level. That alone is reserved for a select few.


I would like to add, if a family's DD gets a 50% scholarship offer from an out of state or private university.  The university is actually paying the student more to play for the school and getting their education than the NWSL pays their drafted players afterwards.

Thank you NFL and NBA for making college football and basketball programs profitable.


----------



## espola

NoGoal said:


> I would like to add, if a family's DD gets a 50% scholarship offer from an out of state or private university.  The university is actually paying the student more to play for the school and getting their education than the NWSL pays their drafted players afterwards.
> 
> Thank you NFL and NBA for making college football and basketball programs profitable.


How many college football and basketball programs do you think are profitable?


----------



## Zoro

espola said:


> How many college football and basketball programs do you think are profitable?


I know one is    This whole sports in school is a big game.  I'm not saying it is corrupt, but where and how that money goes is an art.

But the other thing that is hard to figure is the donation that come because of teams.  Someone donated millions for a new hockey stadium - but the money goes someplace else - maybe (see below).  You can't really tie that money to ticket sales, or the profitability of the sport, or can you?  It is part of this "fund accounting" and done well sports bring in a lot of other benefit to colleges.

If the money is funneled correctly, say given to the library, new architecture building - just saying - that donation can increased points for college rankings because a new building (in the right place) means increased spending/student!

From: http://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings
_"Financial resources (10 percent): Generous per-student spending indicates that a college can offer a wide variety of programs and services. U.S. News measures financial resources by using the average spending per student on instruction, research, student services and related educational expenditures in the 2013 and 2014 fiscal years. *Spending on sports, dorms and hospitals doesn't count*. "_

My guess is about 50 College football teams are profitable.  No idea about basketball.


----------



## Zerodenero

dfbmike said:


> i have indeed come to the realization that facts of growth of the sport of soccer in this country and its corresponding changes, increase of opportunities and opening of new doors, for both male and female players, that you are not used to incapacitates your ability to read.
> 
> I could post plenty of articles and successful stories (eye of the beholder i guess) here backing my angle as well, but i wont.  and again i'm not talking about education or becoming an engineer, right or wrong, high risk vs low risk, good choice vs bad choice, millions vs poverty line....i'm talking about soccer development and professional playing opportunities which many athletes dream of, train hard for and make many sacrifices because its what they love to do, even more so as a job.  and its not for everyone.
> 
> you are a funny guy, i don't care what they say about you.  keep up the good work.


Dfb- So, your position of an athlete doing what they want to do....following their passion....go after their dream of playing female pro ball is probably based on your personal playing experience in Deutschland(you previously shared). I'm sure it was a great experience, given u great memories and if you were good male player, probably made yourself some $$.

The challenge most parents have with your position is promoting a career path that doesn't sustain independence..... The whole "following your dream"....."playing for passion for the game" goes out the window when the "dream" becomes reality...and the reality is that in women's pro soccer,  u can't pay your bills - that's reality.

Will things change for the better for women's pro soccer...probably. For me, I'm simply unable to encourage my daughter to be the William Wallce, better yet, Joan of Arc for the cause and passion for the game. Naw....The encouragement ive given my dd (and clearly others) is utilize the game she loves and parlay to get into the best opprotunity to for the rest of her life.

That mindset has afforded her the opprotunity to play soccer in college and be amongst future heads of state, CEO's, and possibly (_if financially profitable)_  owning a women's pro soccer team - now that's taking a "dream" and turning it into reality


----------



## Zoro

I could have written that.  But likely not as well or without someone getting mad at me.


----------



## Zerodenero

Zoro said:


> I could have written that.  But likely not as well or without someone getting mad at me.


A good case in point is a former local socal player (quite prolific in club/college) who played at ND ..... A few months ago, This player was home between proseason. She shared with a mutual friend that she is sort of lost.....you see, her whole youth she wanted to and was tracking to be on the WNT. For one reason or another she didn't make it (tho was YNT for years)....her degree from ND wasn't of substance (communications or of the like). When WNT didn't come to fruition, she played overseas, following her dream but not making $$..... Great experience she says, but at the end of the day, not sure what to do with the rest of her life.

Now she'll be fine, will find her way, and will have memorable experiences. Is her path wrong...not at all.

Just different than I'd hope and/or encourage for my kid.


----------



## NoGoal

Zerodenero said:


> Dfb- So, your position of an athlete doing what they want to do....following their passion....go after their dream of playing female pro ball is probably based on your personal playing experience in Deutschland(you previously shared). I'm sure it was a great experience, given u great memories and if you were good male player, probably made yourself some $$.


Winner winner chicken dinner.  I posted something similar early this morning, but it wasn't as nice.  I decided to delete it.  This is the tell with the post below.  He subconsciously posted his personal experience below.  Have to read between the lines.


dfbmike said:


> definition of a successful professional athletes for some of you=multi millionaire and must play in one of the top leagues of the world= got it.


----------



## Zoro

Zerodenero said:


> ...her degree from ND wasn't of substance (communications or of the like). ...


This is a hard one.  Most schools have programs and degrees that are not that difficult.  I still tend to think the brand outweighs the degree.  But sure - an engineering degree from state x is likely better than an art appreciation from big brand.  

ND has programs that do not interfere with soccer, and or not so much of substance.   My DD's program did interfere with soccer - as I posted, that is why mine quit.  
But some schools - have no where to hide.  There are no easy classes.   That makes having a top soccer team a bit more difficult.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

If GDA is free and subsidized by US Soccer then it works.  If not, it won't.  US soccer will not fund GDA therefore  it won't work.  

My advice is if you try out for GDA make sure they are ECNL also.


----------



## madcow

eastbaysoccer said:


> If GDA is free and subsidized by US Soccer then it works.  If not, it won't.  US soccer will not fund GDA therefore  it won't work.
> 
> My advice is if you try out for GDA make sure they are ECNL also.


I asked my club about USSF subsidizing the DA. From what I was told, USSF is investing in advancing the coach's training. The coaches are expected to be on an A license track. And USSF will pay for that training to hopefully get everyone to an A.

I also asked about the 2 year age band and was told it was a financial decision. Basically USSF cant afford to fund that many coaches (see above), but will get to a 1 year age band soon.


----------



## espola

madcow said:


> I asked my club about USSF subsidizing the DA. From what I was told, USSF is investing in advancing the coach's training. The coaches are expected to be on an A license track. And USSF will pay for that training to hopefully get everyone to an A.
> 
> I also asked about the 2 year age band and was told it was a financial decision. Basically USSF cant afford to fund that many coaches (see above), but will get to a 1 year age band soon.


It remains to be seen that coaches with advanced licenses will be better coaches, in the sense of developing the quality of players that the USSF investment is hoping to get for their money.


----------



## cheaper2keeper

In case anyone missed this article from a month ago. This highlights the lack of coaches with advanced licenses and the high cost of getting those licenses. 

http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/the91stminute/2016/07/the-high-cost-of-american-coaching/


----------



## dfbmike

I believe this is the same route Iceland took as well, invested tons of money and time into advanced coaching education and licensing


----------



## eastbaysoccer

madcow said:


> I asked my club about USSF subsidizing the DA. From what I was told, USSF is investing in advancing the coach's training. The coaches are expected to be on an A license track. And USSF will pay for that training to hopefully get everyone to an A.
> 
> I also asked about the 2 year age band and was told it was a financial decision. Basically USSF cant afford to fund that many coaches (see above), but will get to a 1 year age band soon.


An A Licensed coach is not always a good coach.

A good coach is not always A licensed.

How many shitty licensed coaches do you know?  I know a lot.  US Soccer needs to pay for the fees of the players!!!!


----------



## NoGoal

madcow said:


> I asked my club about USSF subsidizing the DA. From what I was told, USSF is investing in advancing the coach's training. The coaches are expected to be on an A license track. And USSF will pay for that training to hopefully get everyone to an A.
> 
> I also asked about the 2 year age band and was told it was a financial decision. Basically USSF cant afford to fund that many coaches (see above), but will get to a 1 year age band soon.





cheaper2keeper said:


> In case anyone missed this article from a month ago. This highlights the lack of coaches with advanced licenses and the high cost of getting those licenses.
> 
> http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/the91stminute/2016/07/the-high-cost-of-american-coaching/


So USSF is paying the Girls DA coaches to get their A license.  Does this mean the money USSF is giving goes right back to themselves, since US Soccer issues the A and B licenses.  Brilliant!

Wouldn't it make more sense for US Soccer to offer free A and B coaching licenses to Girls DA coaches and use the money, I don't know to subsidize the players.


----------



## outside!

But that would be logical and we can't have that.


----------



## mbeach

NoGoal said:


> So USSF is paying the Girls DA coaches to get their A license.  Does this mean the money USSF is giving goes right back to themselves, since US Soccer issues the A and B licenses.  Brilliant!
> 
> Wouldn't it make more sense for US Soccer to offer free A and B coaching licenses to Girls DA coaches and use the money, I don't know to subsidize the players.


I have no idea whether US Soccer will pay for training coaches or not, but posting that there are no costs involved on this is slandering at its best, and is at odds with your self-proclaimed impartiality. I am guessing that instructors, facilities, hotel, travel etc. are provided by volunteers, after all isn't US Soccer just an extension of AYSO? Or the licensing is simply stamping a paper?


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> I have no idea whether US Soccer will pay for training coaches or not, but posting that there are no costs involved on this is slandering at its best, and is at odds with your self-proclaimed impartiality. I am guessing that instructors, facilities, hotel, travel etc. are provided by volunteers, after all isn't US Soccer just an extension of AYSO? Or the licensing is simply stamping a paper?


I suggest you re-read my post.  It references the posts I was replying to.  Pertaining to what Madcow was told at his DD's DA club.

Will you please keep up.



madcow said:


> I asked my club about USSF subsidizing the DA. From what I was told, USSF is investing in advancing the coach's training. The coaches are expected to be on an A license track. And USSF will pay for that training to hopefully get everyone to an A.
> 
> I also asked about the 2 year age band and was told it was a financial decision. Basically USSF cant afford to fund that many coaches (see above), but will get to a 1 year age band soon.


----------



## mbeach

NoGoal said:


> I suggest you re-read my post.  It references the posts I was replying to.  Pertaining to what Madcow was told at his DD's DA club.
> 
> Will you please keep up.


No, you are the one who has to keep up. You wrote:

"Does this mean the money USSF is giving goes right back to themselves, since US Soccer issues the A and B licenses. Brilliant!"

which is slandering of USSF because you are suggesting that this would be a fake subsidy. It is not, USSF has to pay for trainers, facilities, travel, etc.


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> No, you are the one who has to keep up. You wrote:
> 
> "Does this mean the money USSF is giving goes right back to themselves, since US Soccer issues the A and B licenses. Brilliant!"
> 
> which is slandering of USSF because you are suggesting that this would be a fake subsidy. It is not, USSF has to pay for trainers, facilities, travel, etc.


Slander, lmao!

As you can see I posted "Does this mean".  I didn't post "this means".  Do you know the difference?


----------



## mbeach

NoGoal said:


> Slander, lmao!
> 
> As you can see I posted "Does this mean".  I didn't post "this means".  Do you know the difference?


It is pretty obvious what you wrote and what you meant, a juvenile acronym cannot deny it.


----------



## Juve 50

Pinning all our hopes on Coaches getting better because of a License is foolish.  I have seen coaches that have gone from D Licensed Coaches to A Licensed Coaches.  The bad coaches were still bad and the good coaches were still good.  I have seen young Coaches get better over the years through experience and because they were willing to learn and change.  But soccer coaches are a strange bunch.  Once they find their style they pretty much stick to it.  And some are better than others at teaching their style.  But so many other factors go into coaching.  And the classes don't teach a lot of the intangibles.  Like, how well this person connects with his players.  Then there are the mental aspects of this game.  Some have the right personality and are better suited to coach girls.  Some are better for boys.  Some are just bad and will never get better.  No license in the world will give some of these guys the personality needed to connect with his players.   Maybe he can train but can he actually coach?  In American Football there is no Licensing system. You sink or swim.  They hold clinics where you can go and learn from the more experienced coaches.  You try and take something from each of them.  But at the end of the day, if you are a bad coach you will still be a bad coach.  But football is different than Soccer.  As there is no right way to score.  But soccer has all these so called purists who will criticize you if you do not teach the right way.  I have been coaching Youth Sports/HS Sports/Semi-Pro sports for over 22 years.  It's my passion.  Only in HS have I taken a pay check.  Had I known what I know now I would have focused my efforts on coaching Soccer with the pay these guys get for something I gladly do for free. 

  Not everyone was meant to do this job.   And no licensing system can fix that.  Priorities here are all wrong.  They should put the money into Marketing or Branding the Professional women's league.  Getting the people out there.  And not forcing bad coaches to get an A License.  Obviously USSF does not have a good grasp on what the sport actually needs.  They really care about what USSF needs and wants.  And that's control.  Don't buy the hype. 

This is coming from someone with a daughter on a DA/ECNL Club and a daughter on a DA Club.


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> It is pretty obvious what you wrote and what you meant, a juvenile acronym cannot deny it.


So, you are a federal judge now?  ROFLMAO!

You should change your alias from mbeach to m(female dog).


----------



## mbeach

NoGoal said:


> So, you are a federal judge now?  ROFLMAO!
> 
> You should change your alias from mbeach to m(female dog).


When you are left without arguments all you can do is carry on with insults.
I used to read your posts, until I realized that you are soccer illiterate. On top if this you are extremely naive. Prolific poster, lack of knowledge and naivete make for an explosive (like in filling a blog with trash) combination.


----------



## Zerodenero

Dang...BOOM!!


----------



## NoGoal

mbeach said:


> When you are left without arguments all you can do is carry on with insults.
> I used to read your posts, until I realized that you are soccer illiterate. On top if this you are extremely naive. Prolific poster, lack of knowledge and naivete make for an explosive (like in filling a blog with trash) combination.


There is no argument!

In your opinion, you draw the conclusion that I was slandering US Soccer, which is just that your opinion.   I know I did not post it, to slander.  So why don't you get your lawyer and file a civil lawsuit.

Makes me wonder....why you're so bothered by my post, unless you have something at stake.

Let's pencil this out for shits and giggles, based on your argument on the license training cost expense.  The Topdrawer article states it cost 7K to get an A and B soccer license.  Lets say each DA club needs 3 coaches to get their advance licenses. In SoCal alone...that would be 21 coaches and the cost would total 147K which US Soccer will subsidize on behalf of the DA Girls clubs.  I highly doubt it would cost 147K for US Soccer to fly out 2 coaches to conduct their A and B license course for the 21 DA coaches.  I'm not a tax accountant, maybe someone on the forum can correct me. Can't US Soccer write off their trainer's salary, flight, hotel, car rental, pier diem and classroom cost.  Seriously, what is there to subsidize? The course is conducted by US Soccer a non-profit organization, it's their own courses?  If you know more about this process than I do, please educate me.  Post your estimated costs proving, it is necessary for US Soccer to subsidize the 147K to license 21 DA girls coaches.  For all I know, maybe that certificate is made out of real GOLD afterall.

BTW, are you (mbeach) also offended, if I suggest US Soccer should offer a one time free A and B license courses for Girls DA coaches. They should add a stipluation any Girls DA coaches who fail to pass the free one time A and B course are then required to retake the course on their own dime.   As a parent who has a DD who plays club soccer.  I firmly believe US Soccer should allocate the money to subsidize DA players club fees instead.  I will bet not many parents would disagree with me that the money should be used to subsidze DA players and not subsidize a coaches A and B license.

http://www.ussoccer.com/coaching-education/licenses/a-youth-course

Now all of this is a MUTE point, if US Soccer is "NOT" actually subsidizing Girls DA coaches getting advance coaching licenses.


----------



## NoGoal

Ah, when reading the Q and A section of the US Soccer license course.  Isn't this ironic, US Soccer already subsidizes 50% for these courses in general, so why can't they offer Girls DA coaches free A and B license courses?


----------



## SoccerSeeker

I wonder if Real So Cal players will now be trying out for Eagles since they got accepted into the academy. I would assume that the Eagles coaches would prioritize their own players when picking the DA teams, right?


----------



## smellycleats

SoccerSeeker said:


> I wonder if Real So Cal players will now be trying out for Eagles since they got accepted into the academy. I would assume that the Eagles coaches would prioritize their own players when picking the DA teams, right?


That's funny!


----------



## eastbaysoccer

GDA just took a hit after the wnt team lost.  Another loss and we can see GDA go bye-bye fast.   Very clear the men get all the money despite producing results.


----------



## BornToRun

eastbaysoccer said:


> GDA just took a hit after the wnt team lost.  Another loss and we can see GDA go bye-bye fast.   Very clear the men get all the money despite producing results.


Why would it hurt GDA?  The women playing out there would be seen as the product of the current (ECNL, ODP, Id'ing etcetc) system. Coaches will take a hit if they continue to lose of course. But for GDA, if anything, a loss like this could be used to bolster it up as a prescription for the future.  In reality, it should once again remind coaches everywhere to make sure their players practice PKs (sheesh as if Messi wasn't enough!).


----------



## NoGoal

BornToRun said:


> Why would it hurt GDA?  The women playing out there would be seen as the product of the current (ECNL, ODP, Id'ing etcetc) system. Coaches will take a hit if they continue to lose of course. But for GDA, if anything, a loss like this could be used to bolster it up as a prescription for the future.  In reality, it should once again remind coaches everywhere to make sure their players practice PKs (sheesh as if Messi wasn't enough!).


But, it's US Soccer's style of play and according to Hope Solo.  The team dominated possession, dictated the play and still lost.  This is what US Soccer wants the Girls DA coaches to teach at the DA level.


----------



## Glen

What?  The US plays very direct - always has.  Just because Sweden sat back doesn't turn the US into a "possession" team.  If the US was a great possession team, the team would have carved up Sweden.  They didn't.  Pia knows you can't athlete a team that packs the box.

Who relies on Hope Solo for anything?  She is a terrible, terrible person.  I'm glad this will likely be the last we will see of her.  Do they still leave her poster up at UW for recruits?  They took Ray Rice's poster down at Rutgers.  But Ray Rice was at least remorseful.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> What?  The US plays very direct - always has.  Just because Sweden sat back doesn't turn the US into a "possession" team.  If the US was a great possession team, the team would have carved up Sweden.  They didn't.  Pia knows you can't athlete a team that packs the box.
> 
> Who relies on Hope Solo for anything?  She is a terrible, terrible person.  I'm glad this will likely be the last we will see of her.  Do they still leave her poster up at UW for recruits?  They took Ray Rice's poster down at Rutgers.  But Ray Rice was at least remorseful.


I know US Soccer isn't possession.  Just because a team dominated possession doesn't mean they play tiki-taka. Even Real Madrid and Chelsea will have more possession than their opponents, but it doesn't mean their style is tiki-taka too.

Do you believe US Soccer girls and boys are going to play tiki-taka soccer in the future? It isn't going to happen.....just watch the US YNT's style of play.  It's exactly the same as the Sr teams.  US Soccer will always lean towards athleticism over technical ability.  What they are trying to do though is play direct with the ball on the ground vs longball over the top.  Defensive organization, playing with heart, high pressure, being extremely fit and strong will always be the US foundation though.

Hope Solo may NOT be a role model, or the best human being and I have never been a huge fan of hers, but she is arguably the best womens national team GK the US has ever produced.  Anybody to post she isn't is silly!

As for comparing Ray Rice to Hope Solo.  Both of their cases were dismissed by their judges, but Ray Rice knocked out his wife, dragged her lifeless body out of the elevator and it was all caught on video.  Hope Solo, on the other hand assaulted her nephew who is 6'9" 280 lbs and I'm sure was easily able to defend himself. I will admit both assaults are wrong and against the law, but you tell me which is worse? Do you think Rice Rice's assault is better, because he was at least remorseful?  Come on now, a man should never hit a women!  He was probably remorseful, because he realized he flushed his multi-million dollar NFL career down the toilet.


----------



## SoccerSeeker

NoGoal said:


> US Soccer will always lean towards athleticism over technical ability.


 If this is true then that is unfortunate for my kid. She has the most skill and technique I've seen in her age group (04), and it's what got her invited to the national training centers and on the team she's on right now. She is pretty short and not the quickest, so I really hope your argument about US Soccer leaning towards athleticism isn't valid.


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> I know US Soccer isn't possession.  Just because a team dominated possession doesn't mean they play tiki-taka. Even Real Madrid and Chelsea will have more possession than their opponents, but it doesn't mean their style is tiki-taka too.
> 
> Do you believe US Soccer girls and boys are going to play tiki-taka soccer in the future? It isn't going to happen.....just watch the US YNT's style of play.  It's exactly the same as the Sr teams.  US Soccer will always lean towards athleticism over technical ability.  What they are trying to do though is play direct with the ball on the ground vs longball over the top.  Defensive organization, playing with heart, high pressure, being extremely fit and strong will always be the US foundation though.
> 
> Hope Solo may NOT be a role model, or the best human being and I have never been a huge fan of hers, but she is arguably the best womens national team GK the US has ever produced.  Anybody to post she isn't is silly!  As for comparing Ray Rice to Hope Solo, Rice was guilty of knocking out his wife in the elevator on camera.  Hope Solo's charge was dismissed by the judge.


Hope Solo's charge is pending.  As you would say, keep up!  It was initially dismissed on a technicality (which Solo dispicably proceeded to lie about and claim she was vindicated).  Then the charge was reinstated in late 2015.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2016/06/09/hope-solo-fails-in-attempt-to-halt-domestic-violence-case-against-her/ .  Rice's charge was dismissed (which is troubling for its own reasons).  http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2015/05/21/judge-dismissed-domestic-violence-charges-against-ray-rice/27709875/ .   

I agree with almost all of the rest of what you say about US soccer - including the talent Solo once had.  But I didn't mention tiki-taka.  And given all that you write, what the heck was your point about GDA?


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> I know US Soccer isn't possession.  Just because a team dominated possession doesn't mean they play tiki-taka. Even Real Madrid and Chelsea will have more possession than their opponents, but it doesn't mean their style is tiki-taka too.
> 
> Do you believe US Soccer girls and boys are going to play tiki-taka soccer in the future? It isn't going to happen.....just watch the US YNT's style of play.  It's exactly the same as the Sr teams.  US Soccer will always lean towards athleticism over technical ability.  What they are trying to do though is play direct with the ball on the ground vs longball over the top.  Defensive organization, playing with heart, high pressure, being extremely fit and strong will always be the US foundation though.
> 
> Hope Solo may NOT be a role model, or the best human being and I have never been a huge fan of hers, but she is arguably the best womens national team GK the US has ever produced.  Anybody to post she isn't is silly!
> 
> As for comparing Ray Rice to Hope Solo.  Both of their cases were dismissed by their judges, but Ray Rice knocked out his wife, dragged her lifeless body out of the elevator and it was all caught on video.  Hope Solo, on the ofher hand assaulted her nephew who is 6'9" 280 lbs.  I will admit both assaults are wrong and against the law, but you tell me which is worse? A man should never hit a women!


A person should never hit a person.  Solo beat her sister and her nephew.  You should read everything that is out there.  You clearly haven't if you think that Solo's case has been dismissed.

And, yes, I do respect people more when they are remorseful for bad behavior.  Solo did the opposite - she went on a public tour claiming she was the victim of domestic violence.  It was shameful.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> A person should never hit a person.  Solo also beat her sister.


Assault is wrong period, but man vs man or women vs women is always better than man beating on a women.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> A person should never hit a person.  Solo beat her sister and her nephew.  You should read everything that is out there.  You clearly haven't if you think that Solo's case has been dismissed.
> 
> And, yes, I do respect people more when they are remorseful for bad behavior.  Solo did the opposite - she went on a public tour claiming she was the victim of domestic violence.  It was shameful.


Like I said, I am not a big fan of Hope Solo and obviously I don't follow her like you seem to do.  Remorseful?  Lol, like I posted prior, he was probably remorseful, because he didn't realized he was caught on video, could be facing jail time, and his NFL career was in jeopardy.  He was caught red handed! What else could he say, but SORRY!  In case anybody has been living under a rock and never seen the video.  Here you go.






You still respect a male individual who knocks out his wife and drags out her body...because, he was remorseful.  I have no respect for that period!


----------



## NoGoal

SoccerSeeker said:


> If this is true then that is unfortunate for my kid. She has the most skill and technique I've seen in her age group (04), and it's what got her invited to the national training centers and on the team she's on right now. She is pretty short and not the quickest, so I really hope your argument about US Soccer leaning towards athleticism isn't valid.


If you haven't noticed, US Soccer usually has 1 maybe 2 technical players on their team.  US WNT it's obvious...those 2 players are Morgan Brian and Tobin Heath.  The rest of the players favor their athleticism more so then their technical ability.  

What you will also notice, if your DD is on a YNT is that they also favor converting forwards and attacking mids to defenders.  Forwards usually being more athletic of course.  I hope your not thinking US Soccer is going to be changing their philosophy to tiki-taka.


----------



## madcow

Glen said:


> And given all that you write, what the heck was your point about GDA?


Not going to put words in NoGoal's mouth, but my take on it is, the USWNT got a huge financial bump after their WC win. Money was dumped in their direction. Will that money still continue to be funneled that way? If they were funding the DA with this new money, will they continue to if the well dries up a bit? I don't know.

My take on it is, the clubs with DA will stay in the DA (even if USSF does or doesn't subsidize the costs), girls at the DA clubs will still continue to play DA. Some girls will still move to the DA clubs for exposure, experience, competition, etc. But I think the thing that will change (if they don't subsidize the costs) is girls who couldn't afford a national league travel team, still won't be able to move to that club. 

Again, this is just assuming NoGoal is right about USSF's financial support of the GDA.


----------



## NoGoal

madcow said:


> Not going to put words in NoGoal's mouth, but my take on it is, the USWNT got a huge financial bump after their WC win. Money was dumped in their direction. Will that money still continue to be funneled that way? If they were funding the DA with this new money, will they continue to if the well dries up a bit? I don't know.
> 
> My take on it is, the clubs with DA will stay in the DA (even if USSF does or doesn't subsidize the costs), girls at the DA clubs will still continue to play DA. Some girls will still move to the DA clubs for exposure, experience, competition, etc. But I think the thing that will change (if they don't subsidize the costs) is girls who couldn't afford a national league travel team, still won't be able to move to that club.
> 
> Again, this is just assuming NoGoal is right about USSF's financial support of the GDA.


To boil it down, IMO the girls didn't need DA.  If the US WNT doesn't win anymore....will US Soccer take ownership, because of their implementation of Girls DA?

Anyone know if all of the DA clubs are required to follow the US Soccer development philosophy?


----------



## Silky Johnston

NoGoal said:


> To boil it down, IMO the girls didn't need DA.  If the US WNT doesn't win anymore....will US Soccer take ownership, because of their implementation of Girls DA?
> 
> Anyone know if all of the DA clubs are required to follow the US Soccer development philosophy?


Yep..  433 with not enough technical players to play the system. I don't favor the 433 to much space because kids are not learning or better yet not being taught how to properly defend in that system. The 442 is making a comeback thanks to Athletico  Madrid and some others. Much prefer 352 don't like tika taka prefer Bayern b4 Pep will see what he does at City. Spain/ Barca play Tika taka because size of their defenders. It works but Prefer new Barca with Luis Enrique but a major reason there improved is having Suarez over Villa.


----------



## Kopi

NoGoal said:


> But, it's US Soccer's style of play and according to Hope Solo.  The team dominated possession, dictated the play and still lost.  This is what US Soccer wants the Girls DA coaches to teach at the DA level.


Yikes!! Quoting Hope Solo you've hit a new low NG Lol!!


----------



## soccermanifesto

Kopi said:


> Yikes!! Quoting Hope Solo you've hit a new low NG Lol!!


It was nice of the cowardly Swedes not to point out that on the goal she gave up, Hope was out of position (should have been at the 6) and too far to her left to cut off the angle and make the save.   Ask any reputable, knowledgeable GK coach.

Hope gets away with a lot of tactically unsound stuff  in recent years because of her athleticism and she plays behind a great defense.


----------



## espola

Silky Johnston said:


> Yep..  433 with not enough technical players to play the system. I don't favor the 433 to much space because kids are not learning or better yet not being taught how to properly defend in that system. The 442 is making a comeback thanks to Athletico  Madrid and some others. Much prefer 352 don't like tika taka prefer Bayern b4 Pep will see what he does at City. Spain/ Barca play Tika taka because size of their defenders. It works but Prefer new Barca with Luis Enrique but a major reason there improved is having Suarez over Villa.


A well-drilled 3-5-2, with the outside midfielders staying aware of the game situation and adjusting with the flow would be interesting.  I fear that teams will not stay together long enough to work out all the kinks.


----------



## Arsenal Parent

I think the 1st year of GDA will be a lot of trial and error. I was told the players can play high school up until the 2019 season. For the 2018's that are already committed GDA is a non-factor.


----------



## espola

Arsenal Parent said:


> I think the 1st year of GDA will be a lot of trial and error. I was told the players can play high school up until the 2019 season. For the 2018's that are already committed GDA is a non-factor.


Some have expressed the opinion that once a player has a commitment, he/she should stop playing altogether.


----------



## Zerodenero

Arsenal Parent said:


> I think the 1st year of GDA will be a lot of trial and error. I was told the players can play high school up until the 2019 season. For the 2018's that are already committed GDA is a non-factor.









Where u have been AP????


----------



## Arsenal Parent

I have been watching my Daughter play and waiting for her to compete for playing time at UC Irvine in Aug 2018.


----------



## Desert Hound

Any idea as to when they will have the full slate of clubs selected/announced for their first season?


----------



## Zerodenero

Arsenal Parent said:


> I have been watching my Daughter play and waiting for her to compete for playing time at UC Irvine in Aug 2018.


Congrats


----------



## Swoosh

New DA announcements this week.  It's gonna get REAL in SO CAL, that's all I know.


----------



## cheaper2keeper

Swoosh said:


> New DA announcements this week.  It's gonna get REAL in SO CAL, that's all I know.


Albion-est I didn't think they would get it...


----------



## Eagle33

Here you go, just in:

FC Kansas City
Cedar Stars Academy
Real So Cal
SC Del Sol
Oakwood
Empire United
La Roca
Indiana Academy
West Coast FC
Sporting
PCV Union
Pennsylvania Classics
NY Flash
Pateadores
Houston Dash
Sereno
Texas Rush
FC United
FC Fury
Burlingame SC/MVLA
Houston United
Michigan Nationals


----------



## Desert Hound

So both AZ ECNL clubs got DA as well.


----------



## push_up

AZ having two GDA's dumb.  It is proof USsoccer is more interested in market share than development.


----------



## Lightning Red

http://goalnation.us1.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=ed502548e7df6bdf099b108f9&id=a4da6fdf41&e=21bc54c1b4


"3" New Clubs added from So Cal:
RSC, Pats, West Coast


----------



## MakeAPlay

Anyone still think DA is some grand development plan?  I'm sorry but most of those clubs aren't very successful and develop anyone for anything.  This is a power grab plain and simple and is getting pretty funny.  So Pats and most of those clubs that I have never heard of and have never won anything are going to start developing national team players?  I honestly cannot stop laughing because all of you parents of youngers are going to get SCREWED!


----------



## outside!

Just because a club has never won anything does not mean they don't develop players. Many of the big successful clubs got that way at least partly by recruiting players developed at other clubs. Note that I also think GDA is a power grab, just like ECNL was.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Going from 8 ECNL clubs to 11 DA is about development.  Subbing out 2 ECNL clubs for 4 nobody clubs and Beach?  Pretty funny stuff.


----------



## Desert Hound

push_up said:


> AZ having two GDA's dumb.  It is proof USsoccer is more interested in market share than development.


I am surprised they gave 2 to AZ as well.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> Just because a club has never won anything does not mean they don't develop players. Many of the big successful clubs got that way at least partly by recruiting players developed at other clubs. Note that I also think GDA is a power grab, just like ECNL was.


Maybe it is just me but I seem to think that clubs that develop players tend to win things.  Most of the successful ECNL clubs got that way by developing most of their players.  In my players graduating class most of the players going to the top schools were at an ECNL club for at least 3 years and many for much longer than that.  My player was on one for 9 years.  Outside of Beach most of those clubs that are not in the DA are pretty mediocre.


----------



## MakeAPlay

push_up said:


> AZ having two GDA's dumb.  It is proof USsoccer is more interested in market share than development.


And you are pretty dumb for having 4 screen names.  Loser.


----------



## MakeAPlay

push_up said:


> This post is SoCal snobbery at its finest as the #1  u17 team in the SW conference this season was SCDS.  The u15 SCDS team finished 4th.  Arizona definitely has enough talent for a GDA and an ECNL team.


So Arizona has one good ECNL team out of 10 potential teams and that makes them good?  And let's be honest if a certain players family didn't move from Seattle it would be zero good teams!


----------



## BornToRun

push_up said:


> AZ having two GDA's dumb.  It is proof USsoccer is more interested in market share than development.


Orange County alone has 4  DA Clubs


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> Anyone still think DA is some grand development plan?  I'm sorry but most of those clubs aren't very successful and develop anyone for anything.  This is a power grab plain and simple and is getting pretty funny.  So Pats and most of those clubs that I have never heard of and have never won anything are going to start developing national team players?  I honestly cannot stop laughing because all of you parents of youngers are going to get SCREWED!


Sorry you must be in the dark if you have not heard of Pats.  They have boys USSDA and have been pretty successful not being  MLS affiliated and they also happen to be the largest club is SoCal.  All those areas of Pats are under one roof - 196 teams.  No other club in SoCal can make that claim.  Not Surf, Slammers, Strikers, Legends anyone.  All those other locales are their own club using the name.  If anyone can support DA Pats can.


----------



## NoGoal

BornToRun said:


> Orange County alone has 4  DA Clubs


and we already know what happens with 4 ECNL clubs in the OC.  Question is what will happen with 3 DA clubs all along the 210-101 fwy corridor.  Is there already a Girls DA club over saturation in SoCal and the league doesn't start play until next year.

I will admit,  very smart move by Girls DA to admit 75% of the ECNL clubs in SoCal.  Girls DA checked ECNL's king and took their queen in the process.


----------



## soccerobserver

The walking dead? I think when GDA expands to 1 team per age band then ECNL will get really diluted down as there will be two redundant national leagues. By definition, only one will be truly elite. The other will be elite in name only. After all, if DA has conferred elite status on so many then what is ECNL left with really?  For families like  mine who have no interest in that level of commitment to a national league,  CSL and SCDSL will also be interesting. Will GDA impact them also by having more local games and rivalries and less national travel ?  In hindsight, limiting ECNL to 8 clubs  might have backfired on ECNL in some sense now that GDA has cast such a wide net. Kind of like limiting the clubs to 3 teams per age group helped create the conditions for SCDSL to break out and enable the mega clubs to pursue unfettered growth and expansion. In 2-3 years when GDA has 1 team per age band I wonder if GDA will have checkmated everybody.


----------



## Dos Equis

pulguita said:


> Sorry you must be in the dark if you have not heard of Pats.  They have boys USSDA and have been pretty successful not being  MLS affiliated and they also happen to be the largest club is SoCal.  All those areas of Pats are under one roof - 196 teams.  No other club in SoCal can make that claim.  Not Surf, Slammers, Strikers, Legends anyone.  All those other locales are their own club using the name.  If anyone can support DA Pats can.


No doubt Pats is a large club, but those 196 teams help support the Boys DA, since they are not MLS affiliated.  Now they have to support the girls DA as well.  Not so simple.  I have not been able to find the long list of girls college commits, or short list of YNT/ID2/ODP/PRO+ players that Pats has produced in any period on the girls side, so their track record is unknown.   Their boys program is impressive and a true accomplishment, and clearly they have some administrative and coaching prowess.  But most successful coaches (both boys and girls) will tell you training and coaching girls and boys require very different skill sets and approaches (sorry if that seems old fashioned, the truth often is).   

As for the power play, it is and always has been a power play at the top of youth soccer, particularly in Socal.


----------



## NoGoal

Something to think about, if ECNL was doing so poorly developing players.  Why did US Soccer approve 75% of the SoCal and 100% of the AZ ECNL clubs for Girls DA?  As a lot of posters have been posting.....it's all about money and power!  US Soccer will be getting a large slice of the players registration fees, hotel kickbacks, and Nike merchandise sales at the college showcases.


----------



## Desert Hound

NoGoal said:


> Something to think about, if ECNL was doing so poorly developing players.  Why did US Soccer approve 75% of the ECNL SoCal clubs for Girls DA?  As a lot of posters have been posting.....it's all about money and power!


BINGO!!


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> Something to think about, if ECNL was doing so poorly developing players.  Why did US Soccer approve 75% of the SoCal and 100% of the AZ ECNL clubs for Girls DA?  As a lot of posters have been posting.....it's all about money and power!  US Soccer will be getting a large slice of the players registration fees, hotel kickbacks, and Nike merchandise sales at the college showcases.


I don't see it as a GDA vs. ECNL issue.  This is about the development of girls soccer as a whole, which happens to include ECNL clubs.  If even the best clubs could be doing better to develop players, I think we should all see this as a good thing.  And you would want to include the best clubs, not exclude them from the process.  The rise of GDA is not knock on ECNL.  It just serves a different purpose.  Whether it will actually work, I have no idea.  Also consider that you yourself noted that the women's national team lacks technical players.  ECNL or not, we obviously could be doing something better to develop players.

As for the money, I thought one problem is that the girl's academy system is not fiscally viable.   Now it's a grab for money?


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> As for the money, I thought one problem is that the girl's academy system is not fiscally viable.   Now it's a grab for money?


It can be  fiscally viable, if the parents are paying for the club fee and travel expense.  I was always a skeptic about Girls DA being promoted as being fully funded aka free.

Wasn't one of the purpose of Girls DA to lower the cost?  Seriously, someone explain how does training 4 days a week and still playing 1-2 weekend games any different than it is now.  I'm not sold US will start favoring technical players and begin playing with Brazilian flair.


----------



## Silky Johnston

Glen said:


> I don't see it as a GDA vs. ECNL issue.  This is about the development of girls soccer as a whole, which happens to include ECNL clubs.  If even the best clubs could be doing better to develop players, I think we should all see this as a good thing.  And you would want to include the best clubs, not exclude them from the process.  The rise of GDA is not knock on ECNL.  It just serves a different purpose.  Whether it will actually work, I have no idea.  Also consider that you yourself noted that the women's national team lacks technical players.  ECNL or not, we obviously could be doing something better to develop players.
> 
> As for the money, I thought one problem is that the girl's academy system is not fiscally viable.   Now it's a


isn't imitation the sincerest form of flattery. This has never been about development it's a business plain and simple and us soccer is proving it. LA Premiere and Pats? Do they play girls soccer at those clubs? This is ECNL with us soccer running it. The development model for girls soccer in the US isn't very good. We are just very fortunate that the rest of the world doesn't hold women's soccer in the same regard as we do. The rest of the world is catching up to us were just to arrogant to see it. If the US soccer group was interested in true development they would send someone to Japan for a year and see how they do it. That's the model for development.


----------



## NoGoal

Girls DA is sold as a development program.  It's stated in the 2nd paragrph as the "elite development model."

http://www.ussoccerda.com/USSoccer-to-Launch-Girls-Development-Academy-Fall-2017


----------



## pulguita

NoGoal said:


> It can be  fiscally viable, if the parents are paying for the club fee and travel expense.  I was always a skeptic about Girls DA being promoted as being fully funded aka free.
> 
> Wasn't one of the purpose of Girls DA to lower the cost?  Seriously, someone explain how does training 4 days a week and still playing 1-2 weekend games any different than it is now.  I'm not sold US will start favoring technical players and begin playing with Brazilian flair.


Its not 100% subsidized.  Around $2-2.5 k all travel subsidized.  So 4 days training and all travel subsidized.  That is less than ECNL.


----------



## soccerobserver

Silky J, how do they handle development  in Japan?


----------



## pulguita

soccerobserver said:


> Silky J, how do they handle development  in Japan?


Well first you hire one of the main guys out of Brasil to head your program 10 to 15 years ago and you build it with a blueprint.  You constantly send your best staff to Spain and Barcelona to learn at their academy and NT centers and you implement it in your system.   That goes for player identification, training etc.  The ground up.  Its taken Barca 25 years to get where they are at.  Its taken the Germans 20 years.  That's starting with the right plan and acting on it.  Not changing it every 3-5 years like we have done.


----------



## BornToRun

pulguita said:


> Well first you hire one of the main guys out of Brasil to head your program 10 to 15 years ago and you build it with a blueprint.  You constantly send your best staff to Spain and Barcelona to learn at their academy and NT centers and you implement it in your system.   That goes for player identification, training etc.  The ground up.  Its taken Barca 25 years to get where they are at.  Its taken the Germans 20 years.  That's starting with the right plan and acting on it.  Not changing it every 3-5 years like we have done.


We want instant results here and it will be hard with a sport that has been flourishing elsewhere for many, many years prior to our interest or involvement in it.  We have come a long way already and have actually been pretty darn successful despite our shortcomings, due to our amazing athletes and enormous wealth.  But we will stop at nothing short of complete domination (as we should)  But we may need to be patient... and that is not an American strong-point.


----------



## Dos Equis

pulguita said:


> Its not 100% subsidized.  Around $2-2.5 k all travel subsidized.  So 4 days training and all travel subsidized.  That is less than ECNL.


Please clarify this statement.  Is this relating to a specific DA club?  I could not find this statement in the Academy Application, and indeed the list of things US Soccer subsidizes (inclded in the FAQ section for players/parents) does not include travel.  There are scholarship applications for that, but no blanket coverage.  US Soccer pays for entry fee and ref fees for tournaments/games, and provides balls and other branded items from corporate sponsors.


----------



## mbeach

Dos Equis said:


> Please clarify this statement.  Is this relating to a specific DA club?  I could not find this statement in the Academy Application, and indeed the list of things US Soccer subsidizes (inclded in the FAQ section for players/parents) does not include travel.  There are scholarship applications for that, but no blanket coverage.  US Soccer pays for entry fee and ref fees for tournaments/games, and provides balls and other branded items from corporate sponsors.


Most definitely not blanket coverage. When filling the DA application, the clubs had to write down the fees that they will charge to DA players, and the number of scholarships. I am guessing that to make their application competitive clubs have been "generous" with these two items. I have heard what US Soccer thought a reasonable fee would be, and it is lees than what I am currently paying. It seems clear that players/club will pay for travel, but here in SoCal, with 11 teams, it seems that most games will be local.


----------



## Silky Johnston

soccerobserver said:


> Silky J, how do they handle development  in Japan?





soccerobserver said:


> Silky J, how do they handle development  in Japan?





soccerobserver said:


> Silky J, how do they handle development  in Japan?


go to jfa.jp/eng and read about their program.


----------



## mbeach

Although I was guessing that most SoCal ECNL clubs would apply to DA, I have been surprised by the fact that most have actually applied. It was clear that once one or two ECNL clubs applied, the rest had to because of the competitive advantage that these one or two deserters would gain. But, at the end of the day,  by not sticking together as a group, they have lost a fraction of the advantage they have had in recruiting top talent and number of players/fees.
The arrival of girls DA is a great thing for the top players that will make it and are truly dedicated to soccer, and probably for the next group of players that are in the B teams, in and out of the DA teams. I personally do not care about the $600 that I would save if my girls made the DA team,  but I do care about the improved training and coaching. In addition, with so many DA clubs in SoCal, shortening driving times to pratise is a plus. But, at the end of the day, the clubs will have to come up with the money needed to partially fund DA teams. Although for now it may not be much with only three teams per club, in the absence of sponsors the money will have to come from other teams in the club, and in a logical word that means that the clubs will have to show all parents that the situation of all/most players are improving with the adoption of DA. Eventually, DA clubs may have to form their own intramural league for B teams.


----------



## SoccerDad77

pulguita said:


> Sorry you must be in the dark if you have not heard of Pats.  They have boys USSDA and have been pretty successful not being  MLS affiliated and they also happen to be the largest club is SoCal.  All those areas of Pats are under one roof - 196 teams.  No other club in SoCal can make that claim.  Not Surf, Slammers, Strikers, Legends anyone.  All those other locales are their own club using the name.  If anyone can support DA Pats can.


I'm not in the dark... And I've never even seen a girls Pats team anywhere to be completely honest with you. I didn't even know they existed until I read this post... Would you rate them as one of the best 4 GIRLS clubs in OC? Would you rate them as one of the top 10 even? That's great they have a million teams, how many of those are girls? How many of those are elite? How many of those are even competitive flight 1 teams?.... That's embarrassing.


----------



## Gragg

mbeach said:


> Although I was guessing that most SoCal ECNL clubs would apply to DA, I have been surprised by the fact that most have actually applied. It was clear that once one or two ECNL clubs applied, the rest had to because of the competitive advantage that these one or two deserters would gain. But, at the end of the day,  by not sticking together as a group, they have lost a fraction of the advantage they have had in recruiting top talent and number of players/fees.
> The arrival of girls DA is a great thing for the top players that will make it and are truly dedicated to soccer, and probably for the next group of players that are in the B teams, in and out of the DA teams. I personally do not care about the $600 that I would save if my girls made the DA team,  but I do care about the improved training and coaching. In addition, with so many DA clubs in SoCal, shortening driving times to pratise is a plus. But, at the end of the day, the clubs will have to come up with the money needed to partially fund DA teams. Although for now it may not be much with only three teams per club, in the absence of sponsors the money will have to come from other teams in the club, and in a logical word that means that the clubs will have to show all parents that the situation of all/most players are improving with the adoption of DA. Eventually, DA clubs may have to form their own intramural league for B teams.


Please elaborate on your thought on improved training and coaching.  How is it going to be better? From my take,  DA will have the same coaches and training as ECNL?


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Sorry you must be in the dark if you have not heard of Pats.  They have boys USSDA and have been pretty successful not being  MLS affiliated and they also happen to be the largest club is SoCal.  All those areas of Pats are under one roof - 196 teams.  No other club in SoCal can make that claim.  Not Surf, Slammers, Strikers, Legends anyone.  All those other locales are their own club using the name.  If anyone can support DA Pats can.


So that we are clear I am very familiar with Pats.  My player was a high level club player and actually knows your daughter very well.  With Pats having 196 teams how many are successful and how many top level female players have they produced in the last 5 years?  I have a good idea of the answer.  They are a great boys club.


----------



## mbeach

Gragg said:


> Please elaborate on your thought on improved training and coaching.  How is it going to be better? From my take,  DA will have the same coaches and training as ECNL?


I have no idea how ECNL training is, but I am guessing that there is not a a unified ECNL way of doing it (each ECNL clubs does what is best for them), nor accountability (does the ECNL league really remove/correct clubs for underperforming?), and that may be part of the problem identified by US Soccer in the current development environment. Furthermore, keep in mind that nobody has forced the ECNL clubs to get rid of the status quo, they have done it voluntarily. 
On my side, going from two days of practice plus one day of skills to four days of practice is an obvious improvement. And, even if you do not believe it, same coaches with improved education (higher certification and taking extra courses/qualified advise on a regular bases) makes a huge difference. There is plenty of room to improve the technical and tactical education of our coaches, and once this is done development will necessarily improve. Just look at the game that Manchester City played against Steau two days ago in champions league. A simple tactical trick of the MC coaching staff destroyed another professional team: in possession, MC shifted a full back to the holding midfielder position, to create superiority in the opposite side of the field; then, they either took advantage of that superiority, or would send the ball to the winger who had plenty of space in the sideline vacated by the full back. When have you seen these tactical tricks employed in your daughter's games? Of course, I am not saying that DA teams will play like Barcelona, I am just saying that improving the knowledge of our coaches will be great for development.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> So that we are clear I am very familiar with Pats.  My player was a high level club player and actually knows your daughter very well.  With Pats having 196 teams how many are successful and how many top level female players have they produced in the last 5 years?  I have a good idea of the answer.  They are a great boys club.


As the saying goes you have me a a disadvantage sir as I do not know who your daughter is.  However, lets not beat around the bush but Pats has suffered on the girls side being squarely put in the middle of 4 ECNL clubs in their major draw area.  US Soccer recognizes the quality of the organization and the coaching staff and their dedication to the boys side in terms of DA.  With that being said I am sure that now that Pats will be on an equal playing field with this movement US Soccer is probably pretty confident that players will move to Pats due to their coaching reputation and club organization.  Further, now the old ECNL clubs will have to produce according to the DA guidelines or they will be removed.  Something that doesn't happen with ECNL currently.  There is no standards of training, coaching quality or education level in ECNL.  That all is mandated in the DA.  Produce to their satisfaction or you are out.


----------



## meatsweats

pulguita said:


> Further, now the old ECNL clubs will have to produce according to the DA guidelines or they will be removed.  Something that doesn't happen with ECNL currently.  There is no standards of training, coaching quality or education level in ECNL.  That all is mandated in the DA.  Produce to their satisfaction or you are out.


Does this happen on the boys side? Are there underperforming clubs that are kicked out and replaced with better performing? I like the idea of relegation, but with 74 GDA clubs currently and maybe more to be added, I don't see it as all that exclusive.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> As the saying goes you have me a a disadvantage sir as I do not know who your daughter is.  However, lets not beat around the bush but Pats has suffered on the girls side being squarely put in the middle of 4 ECNL clubs in their major draw area.  US Soccer recognizes the quality of the organization and the coaching staff and their dedication to the boys side in terms of DA.  With that being said I am sure that now that Pats will be on an equal playing field with this movement US Soccer is probably pretty confident that players will move to Pats due to their coaching reputation and club organization.  Further, now the old ECNL clubs will have to produce according to the DA guidelines or they will be removed.  Something that doesn't happen with ECNL currently.  There is no standards of training, coaching quality or education level in ECNL.  That all is mandated in the DA.  Produce to their satisfaction or you are out.


Hey I get it.  It's a shiny new object.  However if ECNL was doing so poorly why admit most of the ECNL clubs?  it is strictly a power play.  I know you truly believe as I do that if they were serious about development on the girls side that they would open a residential academy like they have for the boys (I believe you said this several times to me).  At the end of the day it is about the player, the family and the coach.

Good luck to your daughter this weekend.  That Chinese team will be better than Santa Clara!


----------



## soccerobserver

SoccerDad77 said:


> I'm not in the dark... And I've never even seen a girls Pats team anywhere to be completely honest with you. I didn't even know they existed until I read this post... Would you rate them as one of the best 4 GIRLS clubs in OC? Would you rate them as one of the top 10 even? That's great they have a million teams, how many of those are girls? How many of those are elite? How many of those are even competitive flight 1 teams?.... That's embarrassing.


SD77, just looking at how the chips are laid out, I am not sure the Executives at GDA care about getting the best of the best from a "pure soccer" standpoint...Pats appears to have success, size and scale as an organization...maybe GDA executing a multi-year strategy...Stage 1 obtain the biggest  market share possible with the biggest "organizations" not necessarily the best "girls soccer" clubs...in stage 2  upgraded coaching credentials and the increased practices create visible, tangible differences between the GDA and everybody else...better players with 1,000's more touches on the ball per year as well as higher credentialed coaches...in stage 3 maybe there will be some consolidation ...over time ECNL slowly morphs into something else but the biggest exodus to come when when DA expands  to 1 team per age band...CSL and SCDSL stay basically the same w DA Clubs feeding their most ambitious soccer families into GDA???...


----------



## mahrez

meatsweats said:


> Does this happen on the boys side? Are there underperforming clubs that are kicked out and replaced with better performing? I like the idea of relegation, but with 74 GDA clubs currently and maybe more to be added, I don't see it as all that exclusive.


In theory or on paper yes in reality not so much.  USSF stated they regularly review / audit DA clubs but they have been slow doing so or very selective.

Have yet to see any club kicked out.  May have been sent areas to correct during eval or not approved for full status but those full DA clubs seem to have very strong connectios.

Is DA or ECNL operations that much different than club? Same old boys network running they show so really more of a extension of club for all those but mls organizatios.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> Hey I get it.  It's a shiny new object.  However if ECNL was doing so poorly why admit most of the ECNL clubs?  it is strictly a power play.  I know you truly believe as I do that if they were serious about development on the girls side that they would open a residential academy like they have for the boys (I believe you said this several times to me).  At the end of the day it is about the player, the family and the coach.
> 
> Good luck to your daughter this weekend.  That Chinese team will be better than Santa Clara!


I have said a residency program for the girls?  If so was I drunk?  With no money in womens soccer that would be lunacy.  Just to get players for the NT?  How many times have I said the NT is not the goal.  Lucrative pro soccer is the goal.  The NT happens from the outcome of lucrative pro soccer.  The US has it backwards.  If they truly want to move forward they have to fix that.  Who makes the money? Barca and Real Madrid or the Spanish Federation?  Who trains the players the clubs or the federation.  That is what is wrong here.  We can't get that figured out.  BTW Santa Clara is an RPI game Beijing is a scrimmage.  So Sunday might be another play 29 game and figure out some more personal combinations.  Should be fun.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> I have said a residency program for the girls?  If so was I drunk?  With no money in womens soccer that would be lunacy.  Just to get players for the NT?  How many times have I said the NT is not the goal.  Lucrative pro soccer is the goal.  The NT happens from the outcome of lucrative pro soccer.  The US has it backwards.  If they truly want to move forward they have to fix that.  Who makes the money? Barca and Real Madrid or the Spanish Federation?  Who trains the players the clubs or the federation.  That is what is wrong here.  We can't get that figured out.  BTW Santa Clara is an RPI game Beijing is a scrimmage.  So Sunday might be another play 29 game and figure out some more personal combinations.  Should be fun.



i remember you saying that if they were serious that was what they would do.  I didn't think that you were advocating it you were just stating that it would be a sign that they were serious.  To give you context we were talking about the Japanese team and what they were doing right.  I also believe that you mentioned the lengths that the Japanese Federation was going through in order to improve their program.  We did discuss pro women's soccer and many other topics.  We usually see eye to eye on most issues.

I hear you about the Santa Clara game mattering more but that Beijing team is gonna be the tougher of the two.  With the upcoming schedule they have KM will want to get some things figured out and probably won't go that deep down the roster again.  Good luck to your daughter again.  She is a sweet kid and my player thinks the world of her.


----------



## soccermanifesto

outside! said:


> Just because a club has never won anything does not mean they don't develop players. Many of the big successful clubs got that way at least partly by recruiting players developed at other clubs. Note that I also think GDA is a power grab, just like ECNL was.


Based on recruitment by the top academic and top division 1 soccer universities, you cannot make the case that Pateadores develops elite players.   All other GDA clubs at least have 3 players (if not many more in the case of Blues, Slammers, Real, and WC) recruited by the top schools.

There is a reason Pateadores was admitted, but developing great female players ain't it.


----------



## outside!

soccermanifesto said:


> Based on recruitment by the top academic and top division 1 soccer universities, you cannot make the case that Pateadores develops elite players.   All other GDA clubs at least have 3 players (if not many more in the case of Blues, Slammers, Real, and WC) recruited by the top schools.
> 
> There is a reason Pateadores was admitted, but developing great female players ain't it.


I always thought development happened at the younger ages as well. How many of the top OC/LA area teams have players that may have started their development at Pats?


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> I always thought development happened at the younger ages as well. How many of the top OC/LA area teams have players that may have started their development at Pats?


In my DDs U18/19 age group, NOT many.  Matter of fact, I can't even name one who played for a Pats ulittle team and on an ECNL team today.  Who in the OC is going to have their DDs play on a Pats Ulittle girls team 9 or so years ago when their DDs could play for Blues, WCFC, Slammers, and Eclipse (before Strikers merger)?

Pats was an all boys club 8-9 years ago.
http://www.pateadores.org/Default.aspx?tabid=147314&articleType=ArticleView&articleId=17


----------



## eastbaysoccer

well folks we get to determine if this works.  Based on the Nor cal, so cal, Arizona, TX and OR forums it's split and no slam dunk.  
To me this will be just more talent dilution that really will do nothing to improve development  but will  put more money in coaches pockets.


----------



## goldentoe

soccermanifesto said:


> Based on recruitment by the top academic and top division 1 soccer universities, you cannot make the case that Pateadores develops elite players.   All other GDA clubs at least have 3 players (if not many more in the case of Blues, Slammers, Real, and WC) recruited by the top schools.
> 
> There is a reason Pateadores was admitted, but developing great female players ain't it.


For what it's worth, my daughter's team played up and  was grouped with 2 Pats team in the U18 age group of Player's Showcase last year.  The two teams varied widely in quality.  The stronger of the 2 was very good.  They were strong, fast, technical....pretty much a handful.I had a brief conversation with one of the parents.  His daughter was committed to Pepperdine.  She was a very pacey, wing attacking player. He said that many of the girls were committed to Division 1 programs.  To give you a reference point for my comments, my daughter's team competed in Virginia in the ECNL U16 finals in 2015.  So I don't know much about Peteadores as a whole, but that particular team we played can compete with just about anyone.


----------



## dfbmike

pulguita said:


> I have said a residency program for the girls?  If so was I drunk?  With no money in womens soccer that would be lunacy.  Just to get players for the NT?  How many times have I said the NT is not the goal.  Lucrative pro soccer is the goal.  The NT happens from the outcome of lucrative pro soccer.  The US has it backwards.  If they truly want to move forward they have to fix that.  Who makes the money? Barca and Real Madrid or the Spanish Federation?  Who trains the players the clubs or the federation.  That is what is wrong here.


While I agree with most of your post and you seem to get it, winning a world cup or other major international championship can actually funnel a lot of $$$ into your national program.


----------



## soccermanifesto

goldentoe said:


> For what it's worth, my daughter's team played up and  was grouped with 2 Pats team in the U18 age group of Player's Showcase last year.  The two teams varied widely in quality.  The stronger of the 2 was very good.  They were strong, fast, technical....pretty much a handful.I had a brief conversation with one of the parents.  His daughter was committed to Pepperdine.  She was a very pacey, wing attacking player. He said that many of the girls were committed to Division 1 programs.  To give you a reference point for my comments, my daughter's team competed in Virginia in the ECNL U16 finals in 2015.  So I don't know much about Peteadores as a whole, but that particular team we played can compete with just about anyone.


Pepperdine is a great Academic institution ranked 52nd in the nation, and is well-coached and scrappy based on 2 fairly recent games I've seen, better than their NCAA 133rd rank would indicate. A year ago I think it was, I watched them upset USC. 

Presently in the 2016 -2018  graduating classes from So Cal, Pepperdine has 1 Real So Cal recruit, 3 from Slammers, 2 from Eagles, 1 from Surf, a GK from Strikers, 1 from WC, and 1 from non-ECNL Carlsbad Elite. 

While I'm sure they have some good players, I do think its telling that Pateadores, as far as I know, hasn't got a single 2016-2018 commit in the top 26 Academic and NCAA ranked teams, whereas non-ECNL Legends, LA Premier, and Carlsbad all have several.   They seem to be the one head-scratcher on the girls side of the GDA announcements.


----------



## NoGoal

goldentoe said:


> For what it's worth, my daughter's team played up and  was grouped with 2 Pats team in the U18 age group of Player's Showcase last year.  The two teams varied widely in quality.  The stronger of the 2 was very good.  They were strong, fast, technical....pretty much a handful.I had a brief conversation with one of the parents.  His daughter was committed to Pepperdine.  She was a very pacey, wing attacking player. He said that many of the girls were committed to Division 1 programs.  To give you a reference point for my comments, my daughter's team competed in Virginia in the ECNL U16 finals in 2015.  So I don't know much about Peteadores as a whole, but that particular team we played can compete with just about anyone.


A alot of those players were not developed at Pateadores.  A few players followed Neil Powell from Eclipse or Strikers after Neil elected not to coach at Strikers after the club merger.  That team was formed 2 years ago, 3 years tops.


----------



## gkrent

soccermanifesto said:


> Pepperdine is a great Academic institution ranked 52nd in the nation, and is well-coached and scrappy based on 2 fairly recent games I've seen, better than their NCAA 133rd rank would indicate. A year ago I think it was, I watched them upset USC.
> 
> Presently in the 2016 -2018  graduating classes from So Cal, Pepperdine has 1 Real So Cal recruit, 3 from Slammers, 2 from Eagles, 1 from Surf, a GK from Strikers, 1 from WC, and 1 from non-ECNL Carlsbad Elite.
> 
> While I'm sure they have some good players, I do think its telling that Pateadores, as far as I know, hasn't got a single 2016-2018 commit in the top 26 Academic and NCAA ranked teams, whereas non-ECNL Legends, LA Premier, and Carlsbad all have several.   They seem to be the one head-scratcher on the girls side of the GDA announcements.


The GK is at pats now.  The other Pepp committ isn't listed on the Google spreadsheet.  Neither is the San Francisco commit nor the others.


----------



## gkrent

NoGoal said:


> A alot of those players were not developed at Pateadores.  A few players followed Neil Powell from Eclipse or Strikers after Neil elected not to coach at Strikers after the club merger.  That team was formed 2 years ago, 3 years tops.


Both academy teams at Pats are a combination of ex strikers players that followed NP and top players from existing pats teams.   NP started a program at Pats that follows the boys Academy structure.


----------



## outside!

I know that there is a Pats player born in 1999 that made the ODP regional team.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> I know that there is a Pats player born in 1999 that made the ODP regional team.


That is GKrent's DD who began as a ulittle Eclipse player.


----------



## outside!

The player I am talking about started at SD United. She is a great player and a nice person as well.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> The player I am talking about started at SD United. She is a great player and a nice person as well.


Okay, I'll bite how is the player a Pats player and a SD United player when referring back to your last 2 posts?


----------



## outside!

The family moved from SD area to Pats area.


----------



## SoccerDad77

gkrent said:


> Both academy teams at Pats are a combination of ex strikers players that followed NP and top players from existing pats teams.   NP started a program at Pats that follows the boys Academy structure.


What structure would that be? Recruit as much as you can? Hope to get lucky and "develop" a player or two from within your 196 team player pool?... It works for them on the boys side, so I assume it will work on the girls. But on merit alone, there's no argument to made they belong in the same sentence as blues, WCFC, slammers etc.


----------



## goldentoe

soccermanifesto said:


> Pepperdine is a great Academic institution ranked 52nd in the nation, and is well-coached and scrappy based on 2 fairly recent games I've seen, better than their NCAA 133rd rank would indicate. A year ago I think it was, I watched them upset USC.
> 
> Presently in the 2016 -2018  graduating classes from So Cal, Pepperdine has 1 Real So Cal recruit, 3 from Slammers, 2 from Eagles, 1 from Surf, a GK from Strikers, 1 from WC, and 1 from non-ECNL Carlsbad Elite.
> 
> While I'm sure they have some good players, I do think its telling that Pateadores, as far as I know, hasn't got a single 2016-2018 commit in the top 26 Academic and NCAA ranked teams, whereas non-ECNL Legends, LA Premier, and Carlsbad all have several.   They seem to be the one head-scratcher on the girls side of the GDA announcements.


Kind of like a few years after the ECNL rolled out, it was obvious there were some head scratchers there also.  Looking back, there were a few clubs  the ECNL took in based only on the success of one team, and most of the time the one good team wasn't even developed by that club. It would not be surprising to see history repeat itself. It would be more surprising if it didn't.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> i remember you saying that if they were serious that was what they would do.  I didn't think that you were advocating it you were just stating that it would be a sign that they were serious.  To give you context we were talking about the Japanese team and what they were doing right.  I also believe that you mentioned the lengths that the Japanese Federation was going through in order to improve their program.  We did discuss pro women's soccer and many other topics.  We usually see eye to eye on most issues.
> 
> I hear you about the Santa Clara game mattering more but that Beijing team is gonna be the tougher of the two.  With the upcoming schedule they have KM will want to get some things figured out and probably won't go that deep down the roster again.  Good luck to your daughter again.  She is a sweet kid and my player thinks the world of her.


Ah hah!  My deductive Sherlock homes reasoning has it figured out.  I will not let the cat out of the bag.  You are right I did say that about 6-7 years ago.  Has it been that long?  F'n -a.  I must admit I was a bit naive back then and hadn't realized the impact that High School has on young ladies. Our kids weren't even thinking about that they were just happy playing any chance they got.  Could you imagine blowing that experience all off with the hopes of making - $30 K a year if you are lucky and maybe securing a 1-4 spot slot every 4 years by spending it in a residency program.  I will stand by my most recent comment - lunacy.  If it was millions or hundreds of thousands maybe.  Now that I've changed -  haha , get an outstanding degree, if you can play a bit and travel after college do it.  If you kick ass and get called in great.  But again tell their is lucrative money residency would nuts.


----------



## Silky Johnston

pulguita said:


> Ah hah!  My deductive Sherlock homes reasoning has it figured out.  I will not let the cat out of the bag.  You are right I did say that about 6-7 years ago.  Has it been that long?  F'n -a.  I must admit I was a bit naive back then and hadn't realized the impact that High School has on young ladies. Our kids weren't even thinking about that they were just happy playing any chance they got.  Could you imagine blowing that experience all off with the hopes of making - $30 K a year if you are lucky and maybe securing a 1-4 spot slot every 4 years by spending it in a residency program.  I will stand by my most recent comment - lunacy.  If it was millions or hundreds of thousands maybe.  Now that I've changed -  haha , get an outstanding degree, if you can play a bit and travel after college do it.  If you kick ass and get called in great.  But again tell their is lucrative money residency would nuts.


Funny but you can probably make more $ coaching youth club soccer than you can actually playing women's pro soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Ah hah!  My deductive Sherlock homes reasoning has it figured out.  I will not let the cat out of the bag.  You are right I did say that about 6-7 years ago.  Has it been that long?  F'n -a.  I must admit I was a bit naive back then and hadn't realized the impact that High School has on young ladies. Our kids weren't even thinking about that they were just happy playing any chance they got.  Could you imagine blowing that experience all off with the hopes of making - $30 K a year if you are lucky and maybe securing a 1-4 spot slot every 4 years by spending it in a residency program.  I will stand by my most recent comment - lunacy.  If it was millions or hundreds of thousands maybe.  Now that I've changed -  haha , get an outstanding degree, if you can play a bit and travel after college do it.  If you kick ass and get called in great.  But again tell their is lucrative money residency would nuts.



I figured you would remember.  Yes it was many moons ago but you don't have to remind me about how crazy this journey was and how fast it went by now that we are done with club.  I agree 100% with you as I usually do. 

Yes.  Get an outstanding degree from a great institution.  Play for fun and if you get a call into the USWNT then great.  Otherwise use it to travel to some nice places, make some great friends and have a great experience.  Tell your little lady that we wish her luck and I look forward to seeing you both in November.


----------



## Silky Johnston

MakeAPlay said:


> I figured you would remember.  Yes it was many moons ago but you don't have to remind you about how crazy this journey was and how fast it went by now that we are done with club.  I agree 100% with you as I usually do.
> 
> Yes.  Get an outstanding degree from a great institution.  Play for fun and if you get a call into the USWNT then great.  Otherwise use it to travel to some nice places, make some great friends and have a great experience.  Tell your little lady that we wish her luck and I look forward to seeing you both in November.


you should post that 2ND paragraph on the younger forum. Very true


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> I figured you would remember.  Yes it was many moons ago but you don't have to remind you about how crazy this journey was and how fast it went by now that we are done with club.  I agree 100% with you as I usually do.
> 
> Yes.  Get an outstanding degree from a great institution.  Play for fun and if you get a call into the USWNT then great.  Otherwise use it to travel to some nice places, make some great friends and have a great experience.  Tell your little lady that we wish her luck and I look forward to seeing you both in November.


Ditto!


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Nor cal GDA clubs are combining:

Davis and San Juan
MVLA and Burlingame

Will so cal do the same?


----------



## BornToRun

eastbaysoccer said:


> Nor cal GDA clubs are combining:
> 
> Davis and San Juan
> MVLA and Burlingame
> 
> Will so cal do the same?


Wow.  Any predictions?
Would be interesting since I'm not sure there's a whole lotta love between the SoCal clubs. Could make a good reality show in some cases


----------



## espola

eastbaysoccer said:


> Nor cal GDA clubs are combining:
> 
> Davis and San Juan
> MVLA and Burlingame
> 
> Will so cal do the same?


Maybe all those SoCal clubs sharing the names Surf, Arsenal, and Galaxy will become Surf or Arsenal or Galaxy United.


----------



## meatsweats

espola said:


> Maybe all those SoCal clubs sharing the names Surf, Arsenal, and Galaxy will become Surf or Arsenal or Galaxy United.


Oh I'd love to see that happen. Hilarious!!! Surf are the masters of branding. Give up the name? Not in a million years!! LOL!


----------



## Glen

pulguita said:


> I have said a residency program for the girls?  If so was I drunk?  With no money in womens soccer that would be lunacy.  Just to get players for the NT?  How many times have I said the NT is not the goal.  Lucrative pro soccer is the goal.  The NT happens from the outcome of lucrative pro soccer.  The US has it backwards.  If they truly want to move forward they have to fix that.  Who makes the money? Barca and Real Madrid or the Spanish Federation?  Who trains the players the clubs or the federation.  That is what is wrong here.  We can't get that figured out.  BTW Santa Clara is an RPI game Beijing is a scrimmage.  So Sunday might be another play 29 game and figure out some more personal combinations.  Should be fun.


So who was tougher?  Beijing Normal or SCU?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Glen said:


> So who was tougher?  Beijing Normal or SCU?


Pretty funny.  Clearly Santa Clara was tougher.  They clearly were without their WNT players that they had against the U20's.  Funny though.  His daughter played well.  That is probably what mattered most to him.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

overzealous parents best not push their kids into GDA... They could end up like this guy:

*Former Raiders QB Todd Marinovich found naked, booked for drugs*


----------



## eastbaysoccer

37 ECNL clubs went DA.  The other either didn't apply or were not accepted.  So that's 40+ ECNL clubs.


----------



## Zerodenero

eastbaysoccer said:


> overzealous parents best not push their kids into GDA... They could end up like this guy:
> 
> *Former Raiders QB Todd Marinovich found naked, booked for drugs*



Ebay .....are u an ECNL board member? (_We'll just keep it between u & I) _


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I love how the socal parents justify playing the beautiful game, ugly.  It is funny.



I love how Arizona tools talk about stuff they have no idea about!  Your kid sucks deal with it loser!


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> A conspiracy of likes, dislikes, and dumb ratings.  Call 911.  Ha Ha.


You are about as stupid as it gets.  There are some spots open at Beijing Normal University for your daughter.  Nevermind she couldn't even make that squad.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> The team is playing the SoCal way.  Athletic ability over technical ability for the win!  No midfield required.


Versus playing the Arizona way and losing!


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> The only club in CA that trains and plays possession soccer is DeAnza.  The rest of Cali relies on athletic ability.  Beach is irrelevant until you win something that matters.  Zoom Zoom >>>>>>>>>>>>


You clearly know very little so please stop proving it.  Work with your kid.  Tool!


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I am only stereotyping the typical SoCal player.  Defensive backs that kick it to a sprinting forward.  No technical ability or midfield required.


You wouldn't know technical ability if it bit you in the ass.  That is why your kid is still going nowhere.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> Call me names all you want but have you seen the Slammers play lately?  It is total U10 boot ball.  It is embarrassing to watch.  Another pathetic boot ball club is Surf, they come in a close second.  Both have fast players to chase down those balls......


You have got to be the dumbest person in Arizona and that says a lot.   No wonder they threatened you.  Tool!


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I have never seen her play nor do I care to but playing in the Big 10 simply means she is big and borderline fast and lacking technical skill.


Too bad your kid will never get there!


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> Ok CaliKlines, here you go.......the great liberal academic institution your daughter is going to be attending....
> 
> http://dailycaller.com/2016/07/20/christians-win-in-north-carolina-take-down-university-speech-code/
> 
> A Christian group at North Carolina State University (NC State) won a substantial legal victory, as the university agreed to revise a speech code that blocked them from talking to fellow students without a permit.
> 
> Until now, NC State’s speech policy included a provision stating that groups had to obtain a permit prior to approaching students, whether it’s for commercial or non-commercial speech.
> 
> Grace Christian Life sued the school in April, arguing the policy was selectively enforced in order to keep the group from handing out fliers or inviting students to upcoming events. The group claimed they were first ordered to obtain a permit, and then after doing so, they were told they could only speak with other students if they remained behind a table set up by the group.
> 
> NC State defended the permit process, saying it was necessary for maintaining safety and order on campus. *(RELATED: NC State Warns That ‘Land Of Opportunity’ Is A Microaggression)*
> 
> The settlement comes a month after Judge James Dever granted a preliminary injunction against NC State’s speech policy, finding that Grace Christian Life was very likely to succeed in its challenge.
> 
> The Alliance Defending Freedom, a conservative legal group that backed the lawsuit, lauded the outcome in a statement.
> 
> “Students of any religious, political, or ideological persuasion should be able to freely and peacefully speak with their fellow students about their views without interference from university officials who may prefer one view over another,” the group said in a statement. “NC State did the right thing in revising its policy to reflect this instead of continuing to defend its previous policy, which was not constitutionally defensible.”



Do you have any original thoughts or are you a typical Arizona d-bag?


----------



## soccermanifesto

I am left to conclude that Messi FTW has been banned?

But I would say this in response to his ridiculous claims... Stanford and Notre Dame and UCLA and the rest of the top 25 NCAA universities recruit many, MANY more players from the So Cal ECNL teams than the Arizona ones.   They heavily recruit Blues, Slammers, WC, and Real.  Arizona would kill to have their players recruited by those institutions the way Slammers players  (who he denigrates) are.

So either he is a soccer savante who should be handed the reigns of the US National Team asap, and knows more than the coaches of the top 25 women's soccer universities in the United States, or the facts and his uniformed opinions are at odds.

In short, he is a boob spouting boob opinions based on homer nonsense rather than the facts.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zoro said:


> I have no doubt your DD is less of a soccer player (Mine the only SoCal girl picked up by the NCAA champs)  and less of a student (top math student in the district) than mine.
> And there is no point in comparing you to me.
> I really don't get your attitude.  I will no longer see your posts after tomorrow.  You offer nothing to the dialog.  I recommend other folks just use the features of this forum to make you non existent.
> 
> What is so cool is I just refreshed and I see no evidence you ever posted.  My post somehow stands alone.  So cool.   I apologize if you had some significant response.  If it is important please email me at David@xGlobal.com.  Cheers.


You would be wrong on both of your statements Zoro.  I won't even get into the fact that your daughter never played in an NCAA non exhibition game for Notre Dame and was never in line to do so yet you paint this picture that it was because she was an architecture major.  She got nothing more than book money yet you act like she was some goalkeeping wunderkind.  Plenty of outstanding players have tougher majors than that and excel.  Some players actually play a lot in top 25 D1 games, have tough majors and play on youth national teams.

You are just full of excuses.  Just like your theories on college soccer being solely about BFS players.  I remember all of the useless crap that you posted on the old forum and I'm glad that it has been wiped clean in this new incarnation.

You don't know me or anything about my player yet I know tons about you.  I could post your home address but I won't have people know where in San Clemente you live you narcissist.

Don't try and get into it with me Zoro I am out of your league and so is my player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zoro said:


> I have no doubt your DD is less of a soccer player (Mine the only SoCal girl picked up by the NCAA champs)  and less of a student (top math student in the district) than mine.
> And there is no point in comparing you to me.
> I really don't get your attitude.  I will no longer see your posts after tomorrow.  You offer nothing to the dialog.  I recommend other folks just use the features of this forum to make you non existent.
> 
> What is so cool is I just refreshed and I see no evidence you ever posted.  My post somehow stands alone.  So cool.   I apologize if you had some significant response.  If it is important please email me at David@xGlobal.com.  Cheers.


You are so wrong it's funny.  My player played more minutes in her first game this weekend than your even sees on her college club team and oh yeah Notre Dame was interested but TR isn't in the same league as her coach.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> You would be wrong on both of your statements Zoro.  I won't even get into the fact that your daughter never played in an NCAA non exhibition game for Notre Dame and was never in line to do so yet you paint this picture that it was because she was an architecture major.  She got nothing more than book money yet you act like she was some goalkeeping wunderkind.  Plenty of outstanding players have tougher majors than that and excel.  Some players actually play a lot in top 25 D1 games, have tough majors and play on youth national teams.
> 
> You are just full of excuses.  Just like your theories on college soccer being solely about BFS players.  I remember all of the useless crap that you posted on the old forum and I'm glad that it has been wiped clean in this new incarnation.
> 
> You don't know me or anything about my player yet I know tons about you.  I could post your home address but I won't have people know where in San Clemente you live you narcissist.
> 
> Don't try and get into it with me Zoro I am out of your league and so is my player.


You have some interesting points.  I agree that a lot of Zoro's statements about college soccer recruiting are unusual to the point of uselessness.  However, you personal style is abhorrent to most participants here.  Are you a Trump supporter, perhaps?

You are wrong about Zoro's girl not playing a game.  She played part of 2 games.  If you knew as much as you claim you would have known that.


----------



## soccermanifesto

MakeAPlay said:


> You are so wrong it's funny.  My player played more minutes in her first game this weekend than your even sees on her college club team and oh yeah Notre Dame was interested but TR isn't in the same league as her coach.


Am I crazy or has Romagnolo been there only  2 years?  How can you make that statement when she hasn't even had a chance to fully stock her own team yet?

Starting and playing for the Fighting Irish is a big deal in 99% of circles. Only on a message board would it be diminished. 

Who is this coach you are taking credit for or is this more trolling and homerism based on nonsense?


----------



## espola

soccermanifesto said:


> Am I crazy or has Romagnolo been there only  2 years?  How can you make that statement when she hasn't even had a chance to fully stock her own team yet?
> 
> Starting and playing for the Fighting Irish is a big deal in 99% of circles. Only on a message board would it be diminished.
> 
> Who is this coach you are taking credit for or is this more trolling and homerism based on nonsense?


Football, basketball, and ice hockey are big deals at Notre Dame.  Soccer is an "other" sport.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zoro said:


> I have no doubt your DD is less of a soccer player (Mine the only SoCal girl picked up by the NCAA champs)  and less of a student (top math student in the district) than mine.
> And there is no point in comparing you to me.
> I really don't get your attitude.  I will no longer see your posts after tomorrow.  You offer nothing to the dialog.  I recommend other folks just use the features of this forum to make you non existent.
> 
> What is so cool is I just refreshed and I see no evidence you ever posted.  My post somehow stands alone.  So cool.   I apologize if you had some significant response.  If it is important please email me at David@xGlobal.com.  Cheers.


Oh and your daughter wasn't the only SoCal recruit but you forgot that the google doc goes back to 2012.  Remember Riley McCurrie for WCFC?  What about Elyse Hight the other keeper that ended up playing?


----------



## Zerodenero

Zoro said:


> I have no doubt your DD is less of a soccer player (Mine the only SoCal girl picked up by the NCAA champs)  and less of a student (top math student in the district) than mine.
> And there is no point in comparing you to me.
> I really don't get your attitude.  I will no longer see your posts after tomorrow.  You offer nothing to the dialog.  I recommend other folks just use the features of this forum to make you non existent.
> 
> What is so cool is I just refreshed and I see no evidence you ever posted.  My post somehow stands alone.  So cool.   I apologize if you had some significant response.  If it is important please email me at David@xGlobal.com.  Cheers.


Z- By no means am I the public defendant, but in Makes defense, prior to unleashing forum-fury on MessiFTW & aka's.....much of Makes post had solid informational Content. Was it wrapped in a bit of bravado of his/her DD - sure..... So are my post.....and so is yours. But it's all good, we're proud parents who have info to share. Especially for  parents who have younger dd's with dreams to play ball in HS, college and beyond...

But at the end of the day this is a forum with Free flowin info and thoughts...if the free flowin gets a bit raw for the eyes ...by all means do what u gotta do - block away.


----------



## soccermanifesto

espola said:


> Football, basketball, and ice hockey are big deals at Notre Dame.  Soccer is an "other" sport.


And yet, according to Wikipedia, ND women's soccer won NCAA National Championships in 1995, 2004, and 2010.

How many NCAA national championships does their hockey team have?  I'll give you a hint,  it rhymes with zero.

There really is little point posting on here sometimes.  I await someone crapping on Stanford's recruiting class or Penn State's style of play any moment. I suspect people are ragging on ND because of Zoro, but it's a top 20 school and program well represented with SoCal recruits in 2016-2018...including Real, Blues, and Slammers.

Where I grew up people wanted to play for the Irish, period.  Some real ill informed cynics on here.


----------



## espola

soccermanifesto said:


> And yet, according to Wikipedia, ND women's soccer won NCAA National Championships in 1995, 2004, and 2010.
> 
> How many NCAA national championships does their hockey team have?  I'll give you a hint,  it rhymes with zero.
> 
> There really is little point posting on here sometimes.  I await someone crapping on Stanford's recruiting class or Penn State's style of play any moment. I suspect people are ragging on ND because of Zoro, but it's a top 20 school and program well represented with SoCal recruits in 2016-2018...including Real, Blues, and Slammers.
> 
> Where I grew up people wanted to play for the Irish, period.  Some real ill informed cynics on here.


Notre Dame is a big deal in womens soccer.  Womens soccer is not a big deal at Notre Dame.


----------



## NoGoal

espola said:


> Football, basketball, and ice hockey are big deals at Notre Dame.  Soccer is an "other" sport.


Womens soccer was strong at Notre Dame when Randy Waldrum was the head coach.  He was able to recruit a ton of YNT players.  At the present TR hasn't had the same magic though.


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> And yet, according to Wikipedia, ND women's soccer won NCAA National Championships in 1995, 2004, and 2010.
> 
> How many NCAA national championships does their hockey team have?  I'll give you a hint,  it rhymes with zero.
> 
> There really is little point posting on here sometimes.  I await someone crapping on Stanford's recruiting class or Penn State's style of play any moment. I suspect people are ragging on ND because of Zoro, but it's a top 20 school and program well represented with SoCal recruits in 2016-2018...including Real, Blues, and Slammers.
> 
> Where I grew up people wanted to play for the Irish, period.  Some real ill informed cynics on here.


I would say it's safe to assume since TR (prior associate coach at Stanford) and DB (prior assistant at Fullerton) both favor recruiting SoCal players. Question is are the BEST non-YNT SoCal players good enough to beat FSU who recruits international YNT players, UNC, Virginia and Duke who recruit from the YNT pools?  We will find out soon enough.


----------



## soccermanifesto

espola said:


> Notre Dame is a big deal in womens soccer.  Womens soccer is not a big deal at Notre Dame.


Got it.  What college doesn't fit your meme?  

UCLA is a big deal in womens soccer.  Womens soccer is not a big deal at UCLA.

Substitute Penn State, Stanford, Duke, Florida State, etc.


----------



## espola

soccermanifesto said:


> Got it.  What college doesn't fit your meme?
> 
> UCLA is a big deal in womens soccer.  Womens soccer is not a big deal at UCLA.
> 
> Substitute Penn State, Stanford, Duke, Florida State, etc.


Portland and Santa Clara come quickly to mind.  There may be others.

And back at ND -- women's soccer home games average about 1000 attendance, a little less than 50% capacity of their stadium.  A few years ago, men's ice hockey attendance jumped to about double the average the previous few years, from a little over 2000 per game to a little under 5000.  The jump is easily explained - they built a bigger arena - new capacity 5022 (although they reported slightly higher numbers a few games).


----------



## Zerodenero

Realty is we are bantering about a segment of very-very-small-small circles.....circles that 85% ~ of parents with college applicants would LOVE to be in. Unfortuntely....in the heat of debate, ugly can come out making us come off as elitist (I'm included)....irony on this is that many on this board (including myself) grew up FAR (VERY FAR)  from elite. 

ND, Ucla (u name the top 25 u want) are AMAZING schools (playing ball or not). Say it out loud...."my kid is going to" ND...STANFORD....UCLA. Etc.

Let's put down the guns.....celebrate the accomplishment


----------



## Zerodenero

soccermanifesto said:


> But I would say this in response to his ridiculous claims... Stanford and Notre Dame and UCLA and the rest of the top 25 NCAA universities recruit many, MANY more players from the So Cal ECNL teams than the Arizona ones.   They heavily recruit Blues, Slammers, WC, and Real.  Arizona would kill to have their players recruited by those institutions the way Slammers players  (who he denigrates) are.









As my boy Herm Edwards says...."The numbers don't  lie".

Great point Manifesto!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccermanifesto said:


> Am I crazy or has Romagnolo been there only  2 years?  How can you make that statement when she hasn't even had a chance to fully stock her own team yet?
> 
> Starting and playing for the Fighting Irish is a big deal in 99% of circles. Only on a message board would it be diminished.
> 
> Who is this coach you are taking credit for or is this more trolling and homerism based on nonsense?


Yes Notre Dame's coach has been there for 2 full seasons and started recruiting with my player's recruiting class.  I'm not really concerned with how she stocks her team.  Within my player's career they will be hard pressed to put as good a team on the field and that is simply the facts.  I understand that in 99% of circles starting and playing for Notre Dame is a big deal (Zoro's daughter did not start for Notre Dame nor play for them in any NCAA non-exhibition game).  If my player was at Notre Dame she would most assuredly be a starter.

I'm not going to mention the coaches name as I am not interested in any extra attention.  Several posters know me and can confirm what I am saying without revealing anything.

This is between me and Zoro (who's daughter no longer plays organized soccer by the way).


----------



## outside!

Are we sure MAP is not the same person as Sweetsplat?


----------



## Kicker4Life

Zerodenero said:


> Realty is we are bantering about a segment of very-very-small-small circles.....circles that 85% ~ of parents with college applicants would LOVE to be in. Unfortuntely....in the heat of debate, ugly can come out making us come off as elitist (I'm included)....irony on this is that many on this board (including myself) grew up FAR (VERY FAR)  from elite.
> 
> ND, Ucla (u name the top 25 u want) are AMAZING schools (playing ball or not). Say it out loud...."my kid is going to" ND...STANFORD....UCLA. Etc.
> 
> Let's put down the guns.....celebrate the accomplishment


Very well said!


----------



## MessiFTW

outside! said:


> Are we sure MAP is not the same person as Sweetsplat?


I agree.  This makes the most sense.  MAP is Sweetsplat.  Sweetsplat is MAP.  MAP is also all the other alias' that he/she claims as Sweetsplat's.  MAP/Sweetsplat, in all probability, has multiple personality disorder.  We know MAP/Sweetsplat is not taking his/her medication based on what he/she writes and comments about.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I agree.  This makes the most sense.  MAP is Sweetsplat.  Sweetsplat is MAP.  MAP is also all the other alias' that he/she claims as Sweetsplat's.  MAP/Sweetsplat, in all probability, has multiple personality disorder.  We know MAP/Sweetsplat is not taking his/her medication based on what he/she writes and comments about.


I am definitely not Sweetsplat/MessiFTW/Clarino or any of his other multiple personalities.  You are free to believe whatever you like.  Zoro needed a smack down.  He is fighting above his weight class and thought that his daughter had accomplished more than my player and he is dead wrong.  I don't have to reveal where my player attends or any of that in order to confirm anything.  Anybody who has a kid in a similar situation can infer the truth of my words.  Anybody that had half a brain and followed college soccer would realize that with all of the talent in SoCal what I say isn't a stretch as there are plenty of players from our region that are having an impact in D1 soccer at top programs.

I don't have to put a 10 on a 20.  My avatar isn't a picture of my player in a club uniform.  My avatar isn't of my player's school.  She makes her statements on the field and doesn't need me to speak for her.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MessiFTW said:


> I agree.  This makes the most sense.  MAP is Sweetsplat.  Sweetsplat is MAP.  MAP is also all the other alias' that he/she claims as Sweetsplat's.  MAP/Sweetsplat, in all probability, has multiple personality disorder.  We know MAP/Sweetsplat is not taking his/her medication based on what he/she writes and comments about.


Oh by the way.  You are a tool!!


----------



## pulguita

outside! said:


> Are we sure MAP is not the same person as Sweetsplat?


MAP is not Sweetsplat - guaranteed.


----------



## socalkdg

Just the opportunity to watch my daughter at "any" college playing soccer would be a dream come true.  I can only hope that she still has a passion for soccer and that her passion drives her skills to a level that allows college soccer.   If she does make it, it won't be due to anything that I've done, but her hard work and talent.


----------



## meatsweats

socalkdg said:


> Just the opportunity to watch my daughter at "any" college playing soccer would be a dream come true.  I can only hope that she still has a passion for soccer and that her passion drives her skills to a level that allows college soccer.   If she does make it, it won't be due to anything that I've done, but her hard work and talent.


Agreed!!! And will also add that I hope and pray my daughter and others that do want to play in college and beyond, stay healthy. Too many girls getting hurt lately. Hoping all your DD's stay healthy and strong this coming season. If you don't have a performance and injury prevention plan, get one started. Our girls only have one body. Take care of it!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Interesting... 

http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/commit-draws-inspiration-from-wnt_aid19965


----------



## MakeAPlay

Oh my bad she played in two games for 36 minutes while the other freshman keeper won the starting job.  Then "architecture" started to take up too much time.  Was it architecture or sitting on the bench for 4 years that did it?

http://www.und.com/sports/w-soccer/spec-rel/042612aab.html

http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nd/sports/w-soccer/auto_pdf/2012-13/stats/season_stats.pdf


----------



## MessiFTW

MakeAPlay said:


> Oh my bad she played in two games for 36 minutes while the other freshman keeper won the starting job.  Then "architecture" started to take up too much time.  Was it architecture or sitting on the bench for 4 years that did it?
> 
> http://www.und.com/sports/w-soccer/spec-rel/042612aab.html
> 
> http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nd/sports/w-soccer/auto_pdf/2012-13/stats/season_stats.pdf


You really are a sick human being.  You disgust me.


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> Am I crazy or has Romagnolo been there only  2 years?  How can you make that statement when she hasn't even had a chance to fully stock her own team yet?
> 
> Starting and playing for the Fighting Irish is a big deal in 99% of circles. Only on a message board would it be diminished.
> 
> Who is this coach you are taking credit for or is this more trolling and homerism based on nonsense?


Why would TR have to restock?  She inherited a ND Randy Waldrum team stocked of YNT players and verbal committments prior to her arrival.  Question is can she keep the stock coming and based on her player committments so far, NOT so much.


----------



## soccermanifesto

NoGoal said:


> Why would TR have to restock?  She inherited a ND Randy Waldrum team stocked of YNT players and verbal committments prior to her arrival.  Question is can she keep the stock coming and based on her player committments so far, NOT so much.


Here's the most recent analysis I could find to take the homerism and boob message board opinions out of it.  Mind you, if getting the most top recruits always = championships, Stanford and North Carolina should have a lot more than they do. 

Top 10 2018 Recruiting class as of 2/22/16. (241 players verbally committed)

1. 9.02 Stanford
2. 8.97 Virginia
3. 8.93 UNC
4. 8.25 Penn State
5. 8.00 Florida State
6. 7.77 Notre Dame
7. 7.67 Washington
8. 7.10 Duke
9. 7.00 Boston College
10. 6.33 Michigan


By your logic, she should just take Randy's players regardless of the system she wants to run and "make it work."  I have no idea if TR is a brilliant coach.  Neither do you.  But she should be given the chance to recruit her type of players and put her team together before people  judge.  

if there's a coach to be criticized right now, it's Anson Dorrance at UNC.  What's his excuse?


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> Here's the most recent analysis I could find to take the homerism and boob message board opinions out of it.  Mind you, if getting the most top recruits always = championships, Stanford and North Carolina should have a lot more than they do.
> 
> Top 10 2018 Recruiting class as of 2/22/16. (241 players verbally committed)
> 
> 1. 9.02 Stanford
> 2. 8.97 Virginia
> 3. 8.93 UNC
> 4. 8.25 Penn State
> 5. 8.00 Florida State
> 6. 7.77 Notre Dame
> 7. 7.67 Washington
> 8. 7.10 Duke
> 9. 7.00 Boston College
> 10. 6.33 Michigan
> 
> 
> By your logic, she should just take Randy's players regardless of the system she wants to run and "make it work."  I have no idea if TR is a brilliant coach.  Neither do you.  But she should be given the chance to recruit her type of players and put her team together before people  judge.
> 
> if there's a coach to be criticized right now, it's Anson Dorrance at UNC.  What's his excuse?


Your post is garbage as soon as I read "UNC should be winning more championships".  They have won 22 NCAA Championships in Womens Soccer!

Waldrum's Notre Dame teams were always ranked in the top 10 and he won 3 NCAA Championships with his recruits.  If TR inherited YNT players and my DD having played with and againsr YNT players....the YNT players can play any system that is presented to them.


----------



## soccermanifesto

NoGoal said:


> Your post is garbage as soon as I read "UNC should be winning more championships".  They have won 22 NCAA Championships in Womens Soccer!
> 
> Waldrum's Notre Dame teams were always ranked in the top 10 and he won 3 NCAA Championships with his recruits.  If TR inherited YNT players and my DD having played with and againsr YNT players....the YNT players can play any system that is presented to them.


Ok mark it down.  UNC will win at least one national championship in the next 3 years because they are LOADED.  And have been for some time. 

Yeah, YNT players can play in any system.  They're like magical unicorns.  Ok.

I'm not TR's agent.  You win. She's a crappy recruiter and lousy coach and should win with other people's players.   Way to brag about your daughter being on the YNT.   I'm pretty  sure I've seen her play... Multiple times.  As to how that is, I'll let you guess.


----------



## NoGoal

Good thing you deleted that last post, because UNC last won a NCAA Championship in 2012 and not in 2008!


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> Ok mark it down.  UNC will win at least one national championship in the next 3 years because they are LOADED.  And have been for some time.
> 
> Yeah, YNT players can play in any system.  They're like magical unicorns.  Ok.


Obviously, you are parent with a DD under U15.  Dorrance will be challenged to win more Championships than the past 2 decades, because women soccer talent is much deeper.  If you look at who has won NCAA Championships, you will notice the pattern is towards YNT players in the US or internationally starting with last year's Penn St roster filled with YNT players.

http://www.ncaa.com/history/soccer-women/d1

And note Portland use to be able to recruit YNT players back in the early 2000's under Clive Charles.


----------



## soccermanifesto

NoGoal said:


> Obviously, you are parent with a DD under U15.  Dorrance will be challenged to win more Championships than the past 2 decades, because women soccer talent is much deeper.  If you look at who has won NCAA Championships, you will notice the pattern is towards YNT players in the US or internationally.


He has more than a boatload of YNT players (his 2017 class is insane) and will have more than a half dozen YNT players riding the bench.  Is he still rotating fresh players in with that fast break high pressure attack?  No one's expecting that or figured it out yet


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> Ok mark it down.  UNC will win at least one national championship in the next 3 years because they are LOADED.  And have been for some time.
> 
> Yeah, YNT players can play in any system.  They're like magical unicorns.  Ok.
> 
> I'm not TR's agent.  You win. She's a crappy recruiter and lousy coach and should win with other people's players.   Way to brag about your daughter being on the YNT.   I'm pretty  sure I've seen her play... Multiple times.  As to how that is, I'll let you guess.





soccermanifesto said:


> He has more than a boatload of YNT players (his 2017 class is insane) and will have more than a half dozen YNT players riding the bench.  Is he still rotating fresh players in with that fast break high pressure attack?  No one's expecting that or figured it out yet


Doesn't matter, Anson is already 65 and I heard the last class he will graduate out at UNC will be his verbal commits of 2017.  They graduate college in 2021.


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> Ok mark it down.  UNC will win at least one national championship in the next 3 years because they are LOADED.  And have been for some time.
> 
> Yeah, YNT players can play in any system.  They're like magical unicorns.  Ok.
> 
> I'm not TR's agent.  You win. She's a crappy recruiter and lousy coach and should win with other people's players.   Way to brag about your daughter being on the YNT.   I'm pretty  sure I've seen her play... Multiple times.  As to how that is, I'll let you guess.


My DD is not a YNT player, but she has had teammates on her club team and ODP teams who have advanced onto the U20/U17 YNT as starters and they are talented as hell.


----------



## soccermanifesto

NoGoal said:


> Doesn't matter Anson will be retiring by 2020.


Don't get me wrong, I take nothing away from Anson.  Legendary coach.  But I see so many YNT players commit to UNC when they literally will be riding the bench.  If you get a championship it's worth it, I guess.  But you'd think stocked as he is, he would be more dominant in recent years.  Mind you, yes, I have a recency bias in that I only started watching UNC the past couple of years.

But maybe I'm throwing dirt on him too soon.  Maybe he will pull one more out.  He should based on talent.  No excuses really.


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccermanifesto said:


> Here's the most recent analysis I could find to take the homerism and boob message board opinions out of it.  Mind you, if getting the most top recruits always = championships, Stanford and North Carolina should have a lot more than they do.
> 
> Top 10 2018 Recruiting class as of 2/22/16. (241 players verbally committed)
> 
> 1. 9.02 Stanford
> 2. 8.97 Virginia
> 3. 8.93 UNC
> 4. 8.25 Penn State
> 5. 8.00 Florida State
> 6. 7.77 Notre Dame
> 7. 7.67 Washington
> 8. 7.10 Duke
> 9. 7.00 Boston College
> 10. 6.33 Michigan
> 
> 
> By your logic, she should just take Randy's players regardless of the system she wants to run and "make it work."  I have no idea if TR is a brilliant coach.  Neither do you.  But she should be given the chance to recruit her type of players and put her team together before people  judge.
> 
> if there's a coach to be criticized right now, it's Anson Dorrance at UNC.  What's his excuse?


At least give credit to the guy that came up with those "unofficial" recruiting class rankings.  You got those from a forum.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> At least give credit to the guy that came up with those "unofficial" recruiting class rankings.  You got those from a forum.


Yes -- google is your friend.

Does he give anywhere his method of coming up with numbers accurate to three places?


----------



## NoGoal

soccermanifesto said:


> Don't get me wrong, I take nothing away from Anson.  Legendary coach.  But I see so many YNT players commit to UNC when they literally will be riding the bench.  If you get a championship it's worth it, I guess.  But you'd think stocked as he is, he would be more dominant in recent years.  Mind you, yes, I have a recency bias in that I only started watching UNC the past couple of years.
> 
> But maybe I'm throwing dirt on him too soon.  Maybe he will pull one more out.  He should based on talent.  No excuses really.


Not many of the UNC YNT players ride the bench.  His high pressure and always attacking style of play combined with college sub rules, affords him to use his entire squad during a game.  If you haven't seen it yet, it looks like an actual hockey line change when he subs his players in.


----------



## NoGoal

espola said:


> Yes -- google is your friend.
> 
> Does he give anywhere his method of coming up with numbers accurate to three places?


He did and his player points ranking goes something like this:
10 YNT starting players
9 YNT sub and YNT international
8 YNT camp
7 ODP regional team
6 ODP state team
5 ODP pool
So forth and so on....he posted for the most part, he gets is info from the Google committment spreadsheet.  The problem is the Google spreadsheet isn't always accurate.  For example, my DD played on 2 ODP interregional teams (Thanksgiving Tournaments) and both are not listed.  There are 3 other players who also played on her ODP regional team that are not showing on the spreadsheet too.


----------



## espola

NoGoal said:


> He did and his player points ranking goes something like this:
> 10 YNT starting players
> 9 YNT sub and YNT international
> 8 YNT camp
> 7 ODP regional team
> 6 ODP state team
> 5 ODP pool
> So forth and so on....he posted he gets is info from the Google committment spreadsheet for the most part.  The Google spreadsheet isn't always accurate, my DD played on 2 ODP interregional teams (Thanksgiving Tournaments) and both are not listed.  She also has 3 other committed teammates that were on the same team and also not listed.


So the number are just arbitrary, although they appear to be more or less in the right order.

What is his divisor?  11?  Total number of recruits?  Total number on roster?


----------



## NoGoal

espola said:


> So the number are just arbitrary, although they appear to be more or less in the right order.
> 
> What is his divisor?  11?  Total number of recruits?  Total number on roster?


My guess is # of committed players for the recruiting class.


----------



## espola

NoGoal said:


> My guess is # of committed players for the recruiting class.


So if two schools have the same number of committed players, having 3 "ODP Pool" players is better than 1 "YNT" player?  Strange math  indeed.


----------



## picaboo

So...... We decided to go with AYSO region 66. Gonna let our little athlete try many sports and see what happens. After the Olympics and gymnastics my wallet is hoping she doesn't go that route. She seemed to like watching it.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

espola said:


> So if two schools have the same number of committed players, having 3 "ODP Pool" players is better than 1 "YNT" player?  Strange math  indeed.


Depends if the YNT team player is that much better than the odp players.


----------



## espola

eastbaysoccer said:


> Depends if the YNT team player is that much better than the odp players.


That was my point -"depends".


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Mustang FC  in Nor cal pulls out of the GDA.  Whoa.  next?


----------



## Soccerlife2

eastbaysoccer said:


> Mustang FC  in Nor cal pulls out of the GDA.  Whoa.  next?


Sereno pulled out. 

As well as Match Fit Academy in NJ.


----------



## pooka

Where are you all seeing that clubs pulled out? That's interesting news...


----------



## NoGoal

Girls DA hasn't begun and clubs already dropping out? Interesting development if true.


----------



## SOCCERMINION

Please add  Link/Source for your posts stating that Clubs are pulling out of GDA , other wise just say you heard or saw it on another forum.Please don't propigate the BS from other forums here.


----------



## Desert Hound

SOCCERMINION said:


> Please add  Link/Source for your posts stating that Clubs are pulling out of GDA , other wise just say you heard or saw it on another forum.Please don't propigate the BS from other forums here.


http://www.azsoccertalk.com/index.php?attachments/upload_2016-9-21_7-24-35-png.18/


----------



## espola

Desert Hound said:


> http://www.azsoccertalk.com/index.php?attachments/upload_2016-9-21_7-24-35-png.18/


"You must be logged in to do that."


----------



## outside!

I have no idea when this happened, but Mustang FC's website says (bold is by me):

The current League structure in Nor Cal is as follows:

ECNL (Elite Clubs National League / Girls Only)
EGSL (Elite Girls Soccer League / Girls Only)
USSDA Academy  (US Soccer Academy League / Boys Only / *Mustang no longer is a participant*)
NPL 1 (National Premier League)
NPL 2 (National Premier League)
Gold 
Silver Elite
Silver 1
Silver 2
Bronze
Copper

http://www.mustangsoccer.com/competitive/index_E.html?1474914823


----------



## Desert Hound

espola said:


> "You must be logged in to do that."


Ok I uploaded the image.


----------



## Dos Equis

Mustang pulled out of the Boys Academy several years ago when they transfered it to San Jose Earthquakes (http://www.mustangsoccer.com/USSF_DA/index_E.html).  Not saying I have any insight on the girls side, but I do not think the referenced page is addressing the Girls Academy.  As for Sereno, the statement clearly says they are staying in the ECNL, but is it clear they are declining the Girls Academy invitation?  Are they doing both?


----------



## shales1002

Dos Equis said:


> Mustang pulled out of the Boys Academy several years ago when they transfered it to San Jose Earthquakes (http://www.mustangsoccer.com/USSF_DA/index_E.html).  Not saying I have any insight on the girls side, but I do not think the referenced page is addressing the Girls Academy.  As for Sereno, the statement clearly says they are staying in the ECNL, but is it clear they are declining the Girls Academy invitation?  Are they doing both?




If you read the NorCal  soccer forum, they are saying Mustangs are not participating in GDA 2017/18.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Any word on girls DA coaches yet?
Message me if you prefer anonymity.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> According to those "in the know" there will not be any more clubs added in Southern California for the Development Academy.  IF this is true, WCFC and RSC will have wait a year and try to get in on expansion next year.


Obviously those "in the know" didn't KNOW!


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> For me it was always about the journey.  And what a journey it has been!  And we are not done yet! We get to finish it in the brand new league, the DA!  Couldn't ask for a better soccer experience.


This is a classic Hodges line!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> This is a classic Hodges line!


Oh man,  Swoosh keep posting brotha!
Facts about Swoosh
1. Swoosh is a Legends Homer
2. Swoosh is a USC Homer
3. Swoosh posts about USC having a great back line
4. Swoosh still is a Legends Homer...meaning he must have a DD still at Legends
5. Swoosh sounds like the Hodges, because he is punch drunk on the Legends Kool-aid.

Swoosh does your younger DD go to EM like her older sister did?

Anybody care to take a guess who Swoosh's DD?


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

So there's a rumor going round that it's now harder to get into AYSO than the DA?


----------



## Kicker4Life

LA Galaxy SB was just added and will be "Fullu Funded". 

http://www.lagalaxy.com/post/2016/10/11/la-galaxy-launch-girls-academy-teams?autoplay=true


----------



## CaliKlines

Here is the final make up of the GDA for the inaugural 2017 season...along with the regional map. There are some very strong clubs involved in this new league.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-da-final-member-clubs-announcement


----------



## mahrez

Kicker4Life said:


> LA Galaxy SB was just added and will be "Fullu Funded".
> 
> http://www.lagalaxy.com/post/2016/10/11/la-galaxy-launch-girls-academy-teams?autoplay=true


Galaxy did but SB is just affiliated and a separate entity.

All the clubs for 2017 season final list:
http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-da-final-member-clubs-announcement


----------



## ESPNANALYST

And Albion!
http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/10/11/21/05/161011-girls-development-academy-adds-four-additional-clubs-regional-divisions-inaugural-season


----------



## Kicker4Life

mahrez said:


> Galaxy did but SB is just affiliated and a separate entity.
> 
> All the clubs for 2017 season final list:
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-da-final-member-clubs-announcement


USSDA expanded it to all LA Galaxy including affiliates!

http://www.lagalaxy.com/post/2016/10/11/la-galaxy-launch-girls-academy-teams?autoplay=true


----------



## mahrez

Kicker4Life said:


> USSDA expanded it to all LA Galaxy including affiliates!
> 
> http://www.lagalaxy.com/post/2016/10/11/la-galaxy-launch-girls-academy-teams?autoplay=true


What's it?  LA Galaxy is going to have (3) teams just like all the other member's.

Galaxy SD is a affiliate and they have (3) teams also.

LA Galaxy will be looking for the best players not just those on the other affiliated teams like SB, Bakersfield, etc


----------



## Kicker4Life

I believe they will each have DA teams based in how the article framed it. could be wrong!


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Kicker4Life said:


> I believe they will each have DA teams based in how the article framed it. could be wrong!


I understood it the same way- just that Carson will be fully funded only difference ?


----------



## mahrez

ESPNANALYST said:


> I understood it the same way- just that Carson will be fully funded only difference ?


Nope there are only (6) Galaxy teams in the da league for girls total:  (3) LA Galaxy & (3) Galaxy SD.


----------



## BornToRun

Does this put pressure on other clubs to fund their DA teams as well ?


----------



## LadiesMan217

BornToRun said:


> Does this put pressure on other clubs to fund their DA teams as well ?


Many are going this route - my DD is being courted by 2 SoCal teams with $0 fees.


----------



## Kicker4Life

BornToRun said:


> Does this put pressure on other clubs to fund their DA teams as well ?


No...


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Kicker4Life said:


> No...


I think it would be more of a talented player going to a fully paid system. 
Why pay 6k if you don't have to? If you have the talent?


----------



## Kicker4Life

ESPNANALYST said:


> I think it would be more of a talented player going to a fully paid system.
> Why pay 6k if you don't have to? If you have the talent?


Not sure my DD is DA material, but my decision would be based on the staff and the system. Fully Funded would be icing on the cake.


----------



## bababooey

Very cool that LAG is offering a fully funded GDA program. I hope that other So Cal programs follow suit. I think many of the organizations that have been accepted can afford a fully funded GDA program, but the question is "Will they?"


----------



## Striker17

Kicker4Life said:


> Not sure my DD is DA material, but my decision would be based on the staff and the system. Fully Funded would be icing on the cake.


Looking forward to being able to determine what system if any are a good fit. I assume one of the 12 DA will be ramping up information soon


----------



## Kicker4Life

Striker17 said:


> Looking forward to being able to determine what system if any are a good fit. I assume one of the 12 DA will be ramping up information soon


I don't know how much Clubs can or will share as they are still receiving information/"recommemdations" from the USSDA.   Hopefully the dust will begin to settle and Clubs can finalize their plans and start sharing information.  

 I am with you!!!


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

bababooey said:


> Very cool that LAG is offering a fully funded GDA program. I hope that other So Cal programs follow suit. I think many of the organizations that have been accepted can afford a fully funded GDA program, but the question is "Will they?"


No way. With "Maybe" the exception of Surf. I don't think there's any club that could afford to carry a fully funded Academy Program.


----------



## Glen

Sunil Illuminati said:


> No way. With "Maybe" the exception of Surf. I don't think there's any club that could afford to carry a fully funded Academy Program.


Couldn't Slammers afford it since the club is affiliated with LAFC?


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

Glen said:


> Couldn't Slammers afford it since the club is affiliated with LAFC?


Maybe LAFC can. If Slammer's were making enough to fund a whole Academy on their own why bother merging with another affiliate?


----------



## mahrez

Each da team is more than double what a normal club team costs around 6k per player or more so about 200k a year.

For full funding you have to have some very deep pockets, get scholarship $, and there is still separate travel costs.  For most pay to play will still be likley the norm to some degree, reduced fees from club subsides or some scholarship $ available based on  income levels from ussda


----------



## Glen

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Maybe LAFC can. If Slammer's were making enough to fund a whole Academy on their own why bother merging with another affiliate?


That's what I was assuming too - the affiliation with LAFC was going to help, at least in part, to fund the program (even if not fully fund).  

With 9 out of 10 NWSL clubs (3 of those MLS affiliated) and 4 MLS teams fielding Girls DA teams, it will be interesting to see what happens with funding.  Free soccer is going to be a big draw for most.  So if a few clubs start doing it in a region, it will put a lot of pressure on other clubs in the region that want to remain competitive.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Sunil Illuminati said:


> No way. With "Maybe" the exception of Surf. I don't think there's any club that could afford to carry a fully funded Academy Program.


Hmmm
I would think Surf would be the bottom with Blues with ability to fund. 
I would think Legends, Pats, CBAD, Albion would all be able to shoulder a great portion of cost due to sheer size of their clubs.
I haven't resercahed Beach or RSC or Eagles and number of teams per age to determine that.
I agree I think a lot of people like the free aspect vs the let's look at the program aspect. So many of us have been on the scene for so long so we know you can't slap DA onto a system that doesn't change it's curriculum or coaches and expect change. But hey free? People are willing to overlook a lot for that ...


----------



## Glen

mahrez said:


> Each da team is more than double what a normal club team costs around 6k per player or more so about 200k a year.
> 
> For full funding you have to have some very deep pockets, get scholarship $, and there is still separate travel costs.  For most pay to play will still be likley the norm to some degree, reduced fees from club subsides or some scholarship $ available based on  income levels from ussda


I think your numbers are way off.  Let's assume it's 6K per player.  16/18 players per team (that's all they need).  That's only 96K to 108K.  But the 6K number is way too high.  That's the amount that parents pay, that's not the actual cost to the club.  The big cost for clubs is coaching, which I would guess would cost the club less than $100K spit over the three teams.

As for the free part, I don't think it is really relevant to people participating on this forum.  We are already sucked into the system and we can afford it.  The funding hopefully will attract people that aren't playing soccer because it's too expensive.  Maybe we will start getting the talented athletes we need so we can continue to out athlete the rest of the world.


----------



## mahrez

Glen said:


> I think your numbers are way off.  Let's assume it's 6K per player.  16/18 players per team (that's all they need).  That's only 96K to 108K.  But the 6K number is way too high.  That's the amount that parents pay, that's not the actual cost to the club.  The big cost for clubs is coaching, which I would guess would cost the club less than $100K spit over the three teams.
> 
> As for the free part, I don't think it is really relevant to people participating on this forum.  We are already sucked into the system and we can afford it.  The funding hopefully will attract people that aren't playing soccer because it's too expensive.  Maybe we will start getting the talented athletes we need so we can continue to out athlete the rest of the world.


Have you ever looked at real costs or how much organization spend on fully funded teams in the full da league?   I have seen them:  20-23 players x 6k plus 60k travel or more is close to 200k per teams.

Training 4 days a week, playing 9 months field fees are rather large, not to mention multiple A & B coaches, the trainers, etc.  Big costs all around and the 6k is about the average for what the scholarship apps says for the players that apply in the da leagues

I have no idea what parents pay but the clubs estimate that each player costs them those amounts.


----------



## MakeAPlay

mahrez said:


> Have you ever looked at real costs or how much organization spend on fully funded teams in the full da league?   I have seen them:  20-23 players x 6k plus 60k travel or more is close to 200k per teams.
> 
> Training 4 days a week, playing 9 months field fees are rather large, not to mention multiple A & B coaches, the trainers, etc.  Big costs all around and the 6k is about the average for what the scholarship apps says for the players that apply in the da leagues
> 
> I have no idea what parents pay but the clubs estimate that each player costs them those amounts.


That is a HUGE number and nowhere near what I payed per year in ECNL.  If it is fully funded or subsidized I am all for it (minus the no high school thing, families should be able to decide what's best for THEIR player this isn't China).


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Free is a good thing.  Things won't be free forever.   Other sports are not free, I just can't see clubs or MLS funding this for the long term.  
But Take advantage of it while it's here!


----------



## 3thatplay

I stated you needed a life...



3thatplay said:


> You need a life.  Spending the time it took to review posted times of likes and dislikes and then making screenshots of them and posting your findings on a soccer forum is insane.  Go take a dip in the ocean and cool off.





NoGoal said:


> When a posters attacks a poster (IWML) who I know personally.  I will research to reveal who the moron is!
> 
> As for you, you're like reading the headlines of a newspaper,  because you are the father of K.W. who plays for Carlsbad Elite U17 team and committed to Colorado for the class of 2018.  I hope your DD asked why Colorado had 7-8 players transfer off their team this off season, including a few who were starters. Rumor has it there is a lack of team chemistry. Idiot!


...so you attacked my daughter's decision to go to the school of her dreams since our family is from Colorado AND play soccer...



NoGoal said:


> Funny, my DD never choose the school based on how many championships they won.  It also doesn't change the fact that my wife and I will only be paying 6K a year which includes books, tuition and boarding for our DD to attend UDub.  What is awesome is their football team is ranked #5 could be #4 (tomorrow) in the nation!


And now that Washington is having an off year in soccer and an on year in Football you state that she chose the school based on everything but soccer.  Washington is a great school and I think the soccer program will bounce back easily next year, maybe even due to your DD playing there.

You have a lot of info that could help others but you choose to share in a bullying way.  

Thank you for the BigSoccer tip.  I choose to read that forum now way more than SoCalSoccer mostly due to you and the other jerks on this site.

Cool off and enjoy your daughter's successes, and nice scholarship, and then try to add to the conversation instead of being a narcissistic ass.


----------



## SublimeSricker

Slammers FC will have a fully funded Academy Team


----------



## SublimeSricker

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Maybe LAFC can. If Slammer's were making enough to fund a whole Academy on their own why bother merging with another affiliate?


It's a huge opportunity to affiliate yourself with a big club who will have a woman's league in a few years


----------



## genesis

Remember your adages: if it sounds too good to be true & you get what you $ for. People, these professional teams do not care about girls soccer.  Only trying to double their fan bases with girls and assuming those pro teams are still viable in the future as few make serious money, perhaps the kids of our kids will mean more future ticket sales. How many Galaxy shirts do they sell in England compared with EPL shirts sold in the states.  Do the math.  With the import of worldwide albeit has-been players who demand outrageous salaries in MLS, they can only afford to lose money for so long.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

The data suggests DA has not helped the men's team.  They looked terrible in their loss to Costa Rica.  They also lost to Mexico.  

So why should I believe GDA will be helpful when without the women are doing just fine?


----------



## genesis

eastbaysoccer said:


> The data suggests DA has not helped the men's team. They looked terrible in their loss to Costa Rica. They also lost to Mexico.
> 
> So why should I believe GDA will be helpful when without the women are doing just fine?


Good soccer is relative.  Both stink but agree DA is not the solution because there is no solution. I will say it again; it's a players game.


----------



## outside!

eastbaysoccer said:


> The data suggests DA has not helped the men's team.  They looked terrible in their loss to Costa Rica.  They also lost to Mexico.
> 
> So why should I believe GDA will be helpful when without the women are doing just fine?


Shhhh! Here, have some cool-aid. If you watched the U17 and U20 Women's World Cup, you wouldn't say the women are doing fine. The positive I see with GDA is that it fixed some problems with ECNL in SoCal and especially in San Diego county. Hopefully there are now enough GDA teams in SoCal that travel out of the area will be limited. I still think any closed system is problematic, and in that sense GDA is no better than ECNL. Well performing teams should be able to earn a spot.


----------



## NoGoal

3thatplay said:


> I stated you needed a life...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...so you attacked my daughter's decision to go to the school of her dreams since our family is from Colorado AND play soccer...
> 
> 
> 
> And now that Washington is having an off year in soccer and an on year in Football you state that she chose the school based on everything but soccer.  Washington is a great school and I think the soccer program will bounce back easily next year, maybe even due to your DD playing there.
> 
> You have a lot of info that could help others but you choose to share in a bullying way.
> 
> Thank you for the BigSoccer tip.  I choose to read that forum now way more than SoCalSoccer mostly due to you and the other jerks on this site.
> 
> Cool off and enjoy your daughter's successes, and nice scholarship, and then try to add to the conversation instead of being a narcissistic ass.


I just read this post and why I am replying late!  This is good information for parents just starting the recruiting process as well.  Obviously, many posters like 3thatplay don't know that student athlete transfers can affect a athletic program.

One great year by the Buffs and your sticking your chest out. Unfortunately, it doesn't change the fact what I posted about the Buffs having 7-8 players who transferred out this off season.  That is still a red flag  and you should NOT be sticking your head in the sand ignoring it, just because the Buffs had a winning season and losing to South Carolina in the 2nd round of NCAA playoffs last night doesn't change anything.

Need some information why that should be of concern to you and your DD?  It hurts the Buffs NCAA APR score.  You are probably asking yourself, what is that?  Well read up! A reason why I posted my DD didn't select a school based on NCAA titles College Cup titles!
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/division-i-academic-progress-rate-apr
http://web1.ncaa.org/maps/aprRelease.jsp

APR is used to evaluate a coaches athletic program.  The NCAA gives scores based on graduate rates.  The more transfers or players quit their sport before they graduate at the Univeristy counts against them.  If a low APR pattern continues (7-8 transfer will drastically lower the Buffs score for the 2015-2016 season) it suggest the program is more focused on graduating their student athletes.  A couple of consequences NCAA could impose are loss of team scholarships, probation, training restrictions, etc.
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/division-i-student-athletes-still-making-gains-apr

You are welcome, LMAO!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> I just read this post and why I am replying late!  This is good information for parents just starting the recruiting process as well.  Obviously, many posters like 3thatplay don't know that student athlete transfers can affect a athletic program.
> 
> One great year by the Buffs and your sticking your chest out. Unfortunately, it doesn't change the fact what I posted about the Buffs having 7-8 players who transferred out this off season.  That is still a red flag  and you should NOT be sticking your head in the sand ignoring it, just because the Buffs had a winning season and losing to South Carolina in the 2nd round of NCAA playoffs last night doesn't change anything.
> 
> Need some information why that should be of concern to you and your DD?  It hurts the Buffs NCAA APR score.  You are probably asking yourself, what is that?  Well read up! A reason why I posted my DD didn't select a school based on NCAA titles College Cup titles!
> http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/division-i-academic-progress-rate-apr
> http://web1.ncaa.org/maps/aprRelease.jsp
> 
> APR is used to evaluate a coaches athletic program.  The NCAA gives scores based on graduate rates.  The more transfers or players quit their sport before they graduate at the Univeristy counts against them.  If a low APR pattern continues (7-8 transfer will drastically lower the Buffs score for the 2015-2016 season) it suggest the program is more focused on graduating their student athletes.  A couple of consequences NCAA could impose are loss of team scholarships, probation, training restrictions, etc.
> http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/division-i-student-athletes-still-making-gains-apr
> 
> You are welcome, LMAO!


Correction, I meant to post the lower an APR score specifically 930 or below, suggest the athletic program is NOT focused on graduating their student athletes! It also a 930 APR triggers NCAA restriction consequences. Better check that Buffs score come spring time or figure out how it's calculated.


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> Correction, I meant to post the lower an APR score specifically 930 or below, suggest the athletic program is NOT focused on graduating their student athletes! It also a 930 APR triggers NCAA restriction consequences. Better check that Buffs score come spring time or figure out how it's calculated.


NoGoal,

Where are you finding the number of student athlete transfers?


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> NoGoal,
> 
> Where are you finding the number of student athlete transfers?


Great question there isn't any and why NCAA APR should be reviewed.  I happen to know about the Buffs, because I read Bigsoccer forum. You can also do it manually, comparing the unversity's roster from the previous year minus graduating Sr's.  Then see if the frosh, sooh and Jr players are their in the current season.


----------



## timmyh

Rumor in Phoenix last week is that the ECNL has apparently told many members that if they put their best players/teams in the DA, their ECNL membership would be revoked.
Could lead to some difficult choices for some clubs.


----------



## MakeAPlay

I hear more teams have opted out of the GDA.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

MakeAPlay said:


> I hear more teams have opted out of the GDA.


Yeah, I heard Arsenal opted out.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> I just read this post and why I am replying late!  This is good information for parents just starting the recruiting process as well.  Obviously, many posters like 3thatplay don't know that student athlete transfers can affect a athletic program.
> 
> One great year by the Buffs and your sticking your chest out. Unfortunately, it doesn't change the fact what I posted about the Buffs having 7-8 players who transferred out this off season.  That is still a red flag  and you should NOT be sticking your head in the sand ignoring it, just because the Buffs had a winning season and losing to South Carolina in the 2nd round of NCAA playoffs last night doesn't change anything.
> 
> Need some information why that should be of concern to you and your DD?  It hurts the Buffs NCAA APR score.  You are probably asking yourself, what is that?  Well read up! A reason why I posted my DD didn't select a school based on NCAA titles College Cup titles!
> http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/division-i-academic-progress-rate-apr
> http://web1.ncaa.org/maps/aprRelease.jsp
> 
> APR is used to evaluate a coaches athletic program.  The NCAA gives scores based on graduate rates.  The more transfers or players quit their sport before they graduate at the Univeristy counts against them.  If a low APR pattern continues (7-8 transfer will drastically lower the Buffs score for the 2015-2016 season) it suggest the program is more focused on graduating their student athletes.  A couple of consequences NCAA could impose are loss of team scholarships, probation, training restrictions, etc.
> http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/division-i-student-athletes-still-making-gains-apr
> 
> You are welcome, LMAO!


U Wash APR = 997
CU APR = 997

It doesn't look like our Buff buddies should be concerned about APR.  Buy, hey, nice shift from the Buffs' "chemistry problems" to meaningless APR nonsense.  I guess that's the only thing  left after the Buffs finished top 3 in the Pac-12 this year - obviously little chemistry problems.  What place did the Dawgs finish?


----------



## CaliKlines

NoGoalItAll said:


> Yeah, I heard Arsenal opted out.


And Strikers...to concentrate on ECNL.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Out of state teams have opted out dipshit.


----------



## MakeAPlay

I am still curious to see how it shakes out.  I bet things change a ton in the next 9 months.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> U Wash APR = 997
> CU APR = 997
> 
> It doesn't look like our Buff buddies should be concerned about APR.  Buy, hey, nice shift from the Buffs' "chemistry problems" to meaningless APR nonsense.  I guess that's the only thing  left after the Buffs finished top 3 in the Pac-12 this year - obviously little chemistry problems.  What place did the Dawgs finish?


I see that you were able to pull your head out of your rear end.  Congrats!

IDIOT, you posted the 2014-2015 APR, which doesn't take into account the 7-8 player transfers this past Summer. Yes this year is 2016! Those transfers will reflect on the Buffs 2015-2016 APR Spring report which I guaranteed will be lower!


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> I see that you were able to pull your head out of your rear end.  Congrats!
> 
> IDIOT, that is 2014-2015 APR and doesn't take into account the 7-8 player transfers this past Summer. Yes this year is 2016! Those transfers will reflect on the Buffs 2015-2016 APR Spring report which I guaranteed will be lower!


In other words, it's the team's current APR.  And wow, you predict that their APR will drop to what?  990?  Who cares?  It's meaningless.  That score would still be way better than UCLA and other, much better academic institutions.  Would your DD choose UW over UCLA because of UW's APR higher score?  Please.  Keep spinning.


----------



## Kicker4Life

CaliKlines said:


> And Strikers...to concentrate on ECNL.


You have to be "IN" to opt out....


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> In other words, it's the team's current APR.  And wow, you predict that their APR will drop to what?  990?  Who cares?  It's meaningless.  That score would still be way better than UCLA and other, much better academic institutions.  Would your DD choose UW over UCLA because of UW's APR higher score?  Please.  Keep spinning.


You really are an idiot!  Learn some basic math.  1 point for each player divided by 1 point for each semester/quarter competed.   4 years = 8 semester points.  If a sophomore transferred out after 2 yrs that is 4 points out of 8 = 500 APR. Then take the rest of the roster and do the same.  7-8 transfers will drop well below 990.

As for my DD committing to UDub.  She isn't a YNT player and I know UCLA and Stanford recruits from the YNT team, so why bother barking up the wrong tree.  Many girls committing to those schools without YNT experience will be challenged to find any pitch time.  How many girls are going to beat out Mallory, Fleming and Ashley for playing time? Not many at all.  Same applies for Stanford.  USC, she didn't like the surrounding area outside of USC.  CAL they committed 5 players in my DDs class many from Surf before the 3-4 Surf players ended up decommitting from CAL their HS Jr year.

My DD was also looking for the following, wanted to attend an out of state, large student body, academically ranked University (UDub ranked #54 by U.S. News), offers her major, cooler weather and rain doesn't bother her (she hates hot weather), team that plays the ball on the ground, large city, school with football team.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> You really are an idiot!  Learn some basic math.  1 point for each player divided by 1 point for each semester/quarter competed.   4 years = 8 semester points.  If a sophomore transferred out after 2 yrs that is 4 points out of 8 = 500 APR. Then take the rest of the roster and do the same.  7-8 transfers will drop well below 990.
> 
> As for my DD committing to UDub.  She isn't a YNT player and I know UCLA and Stanford recruits from the YNT team, so why bother barking up the wrong tree.  Many girls committing to those schools without YNT experience will be challenged to find any pitch time.  How many girls are going to beat out Mallory, Fleming and Ashley for playing time? Not many at all.  Same applies for Stanford.  USC, she didn't like the surrounding area outside of USC.  CAL they committed 5 players in my DDs class many from Surf before the 3-4 Surf players ended up decommitting from CAL their HS Jr year.
> 
> My DD was also looking for the following, wanted to attend an out of state, large student body, academically ranked University (UDub ranked #54 by U.S. News), offers her major, cooler weather and rain doesn't bother her (she hates hot weather), team that plays the ball on the ground, large city, school with football team.


Not to mention she got one helluva coach in Gallimore!!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> In other words, it's the team's current APR.  And wow, you predict that their APR will drop to what?  990?  Who cares?  It's meaningless.  That score would still be way better than UCLA and other, much better academic institutions.  Would your DD choose UW over UCLA because of UW's APR higher score?  Please.  Keep spinning.


In case you didn't know.  Academic Pac12 rankings according to US News are:
1. Stanford #5
2. CAL #20
3. USC #23 (UCLA and USC always flip flops depending on the year)
4. UCLA #24
5. UDub #54
6. Colorado #92
The rest are not in the top 100.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> Not to mention she got one helluva coach in Gallimore!!


Exactly!  23 years coaching in the Pac12 and Amy Griffin the Associate HC 20 years along side her.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> You really are an idiot!  Learn some basic math.  1 point for each player divided by 1 point for each semester/quarter competed.   4 years = 8 semester points.  If a sophomore transferred out after 2 yrs that is 4 points out of 8 = 500 APR. Then take the rest of the roster and do the same.  7-8 transfers will drop well below 990.
> 
> As for my DD committing to UDub.  She isn't a YNT player and I know UCLA and Stanford recruits from the YNT team, so why bother barking up the wrong tree.  Many girls committing to those schools without YNT experience will be challenged to find any pitch time.  How many girls are going to beat out Mallory, Fleming and Ashley for playing time? Not many at all.  Same applies for Stanford.  USC, she didn't like the surrounding area outside of USC.  CAL they committed 5 players in my DDs class many from Surf before the 3-4 Surf players ended up decommitting from CAL their HS Jr year.
> 
> My DD was also looking for the following, wanted to attend an out of state, large student body, academically ranked University (UDub ranked #54 by U.S. News), offers her major, cooler weather and rain doesn't bother her (she hates hot weather), team that plays the ball on the ground, large city, school with football team.


Don't forget, UW also had an APR of 997.  That's another terrific reason to attend.  

On the other hand, University of Kentucky's men's basketball team got a 1000 (perfect score), so I guess APR doesn't say too much, now does it.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> You really are an idiot!  Learn some basic math.  1 point for each player divided by 1 point for each semester/quarter competed.   4 years = 8 semester points.  If a sophomore transferred out after 2 yrs that is 4 points out of 8 = 500 APR. Then take the rest of the roster and do the same.  7-8 transfers will drop well below 990.
> 
> As for my DD committing to UDub.  She isn't a YNT player and I know UCLA and Stanford recruits from the YNT team, so why bother barking up the wrong tree.  Many girls committing to those schools without YNT experience will be challenged to find any pitch time.  How many girls are going to beat out Mallory, Fleming and Ashley for playing time? Not many at all.  Same applies for Stanford.  USC, she didn't like the surrounding area outside of USC.  CAL they committed 5 players in my DDs class many from Surf before the 3-4 Surf players ended up decommitting from CAL their HS Jr year.
> 
> My DD was also looking for the following, wanted to attend an out of state, large student body, academically ranked University (UDub ranked #54 by U.S. News), offers her major, cooler weather and rain doesn't bother her (she hates hot weather), team that plays the ball on the ground, large city, school with football team.


Oh yeah almost forgot, she wanted a school by water....and UDub is on the Pugent Sound.  UDub students have the option to canoe, rowboat or paddle board up and down the sound!  

https://www.washington.edu/ima/waterfront/canoe-boat-rentals/


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> In case you didn't know.  Academic Pac12 rankings according to US News are:
> 1. Stanford #5
> 2. CAL #20
> 3. USC #23 (UCLA and USC always flip flops depending on the year)
> 4. UCLA #24
> 5. UDub #54
> 6. Colorado #92
> The rest are not in the top 100.


Academic rankings are important, but not everything. Some of the top schools don't offer the types of degrees that some players want (like kinesiology). In most cases for undergraduate degrees the amount of effort put in matters more than the academic rating.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> Don't forget, UW also had an APR of 997.  That's another terrific reason to attend.
> 
> On the other hand, University of Kentucky's men's basketball team got a 1000 (perfect score), so I guess APR doesn't say too much, now does it.


Love how posters try to bring up exceptions to the rule.  I will bet non-revenue sports such as women soccer are unable to skirt the rules.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> In case you didn't know.  Academic Pac12 rankings according to US News are:
> 1. Stanford #5
> 2. CAL #20
> 3. USC #23 (UCLA and USC always flip flops depending on the year)
> 4. UCLA #24
> 5. UDub #54
> 6. Colorado #92
> The rest are not in the top 100.


These are "university" rankings.  Our kids go to college, some of them go to college at universities.  Use the college rankings.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> Love how posters try to bring up exceptions to the rule.  I will bet non-revenue sports such as women soccer are unable to skirt the rules.


It's not an exception - its a mathematical score.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> Academic rankings are important, but not everything. Some of the top schools don't offer the types of degrees that some players want (like kinesiology). In most cases for undergraduate degrees the amount of effort put in matters more than the academic rating.


Yes, I agree like anything else a player must weigh everything....including their GPA, athletic ability, style of play and major of interesr.  The academic rankings are not an end all be all, but is still a great reference when weeding out universities.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> It's not an exception - its a mathematical score.


Obviously it's not correct, unless they don't count undergrad players who declare for the draft and end up playing professionally. Maybe you can do your homework and find out!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> These are "university" rankings.  Our kids go to college, some of them go to college at universities.  Use the college rankings.


Why don't you post the overall college academic rankings, if your DD wants to attend a NAIA, D2, D3 school.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> These are "university" rankings.  Our kids go to college, some of them go to college at universities.  Use the college rankings.


You don't seem to be the sharpest tool in the shed.  So here is the Forbes college rankings.  Pac 12 academic rankings.

1. Stanford #1
2. Cal #40
3. UCLA #46
4. USC #65
5. UDub #75
no other Pac12 school is ranked in the top 100

http://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/list/3/#tab:rank


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> Obviously it's not correct, unless they don't count undergrad players who declare for the draft and end up playing professionally. Maybe you can do your homework and find out!


It's correct.  Check for yourself.  http://web1.ncaa.org/maps/aprRelease.jsp 

So yeah, APR is meaningless.  But thanks for the spin.  Are there still rumors of chemistry problems at CU?


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> You don't seem to be the sharpest tool in the shed.  So here is the Forbes college rankings.  Pac 12 academic rankings.
> 
> 1. Stanford #1
> 2. Cal #40
> 3. UCLA #46
> 4. USC #65
> 5. UDub #75
> no other Pac12 school is ranked in the top 100
> 
> http://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/list/3/#tab:rank


Thanks.  Now we can stop pretending that the Pac-12 is full of top academic institutions.


----------



## SublimeSricker

CaliKlines said:


> And Strikers...to concentrate on ECNL.


Strikers couldn't compete with slammers and blues , plus coaches are leaving for other clubs a lot of  trouble with strikers


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> Thanks.  Now we can stop pretending that the Pac-12 is full of top academic institutions.


Who posted the Pac12 is full top academic universities?     Let me guess you are a typical Pac12 HATER, because your DD wasn't recruited or committed to a Pac12 school.   Don't let it discourage you, there are many top academic D1 mid-major schools like; UCI, UC Davis, UCSB, Pepperdine and alike.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> Who posted the Pac12 is full top academic universities?     Let me guess you are a typical Pac12 HATER, because your DD wasn't recruited or committed to a Pac12 school.   Don't let it discourage you, there are many top academic D1 mid-major schools like; UCI, UC Davis, UCSB, Pepperdine and alike.


Don't forget Long Beach State, Mount San Antonio College, and Cal Poly Pomona.  All first rate institutions.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> Don't forget Long Beach State.


Hence the word and alike!

LB State, SLO and SDSU are also good regional universities.  Their acceptance rates are in the 30%, because of the vast student population in California.  It's not a given a student is admitted into those schools with a less than overall 3.75 GPA.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> Don't forget Long Beach State, Mount San Antonio College, and Cal Poly Pomona.  All first rate institutions.


Is that supposed to offend me?  It doesn't!  

I didn't grow up rich.  I had to attend a JUCO, transferred to Cal Poly Pomona and worked full-time when going to school.  I worked hard, climbed my way up the corporate ladder, now self-employed and do very well for myself.  The typical American dream and like any parent want a life that is better for my kids!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Is that supposed to offend me?  It doesn't!
> 
> I didn't grow up rich.  I had to attend a JUCO, transferred to Cal Poly Pomona and worked full-time when going to school.  I worked hard, climbed my way up the corporate ladder, now self-employed and do very well for myself.  The typical American dream and like any parent want a life that is better for my kids!


And as for my son, he is a Sr at Long Beach State, currently has a 3.6 GPA and will be graduating with a BS Degree in Kinesiology.  Best of all he will have "ZERO" college debt! Afterwards he be going to graduate school.

Nice try, but takes a lot to insult me!


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> And as for my son, he is a Sr at Long Beach State, currently has a 3.6 GPA and will be graduating with a BS Degree in Kinesiology.  Best of all he will have "ZERO" college debt! Afterwards he be going to graduate school.
> 
> Nice try, but takes a lot to insult me!


Yes it does.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Yes it does.


Takes a lot to insult you too.  It must be, because you are independently wealthy.  I recall my mentor when working at PacifiCare now UnitedHealthcare.  He was a heavy set guy, made A LOT of money and had the most confidence in the world.  If I didn't know any better I would swear he thought he was Brad Pitt.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Takes a lot to insult you too.  It must be, because you are independently wealthy.  I recall my mentor when working at PacifiCare now UnitedHealthcare.  He was a heavy set guy, made A LOT of money and had the most confidence in the world.  If I didn't know any better I would swear he thought he was Brad Pitt.


Funny, so I need to look for a da club somewhere near North OC, any suggestions?


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Funny, so I need to look for a da club somewhere near North OC, any suggestions?


There isn't a Girls DA in the North OC.  The club soccer landscape is already changing from when my DD committed a couple of years ago.  If your DD is on a YNT pool, she doesn't have to play DA, because college coaches will recruit from the YNT games and scrimmages. It's the golden ticket!

In 2 years the Cal South ODP team, ID2, US Soccer training accolades will probably fade like the boys side did, because of DA restrictions.  With Girls DA playing restrictions.  There will be less accolades outside of YNT pool/player.  The club players will have a tougher time distinguishing themselves in their player resume from another Girls DA player and there 11 Girls DA clubs in SoCal now.   So, I would recommend having your DD play for Blues, Slammers or Surf,  maybe even Galaxy if it's fully funded.   The big name clubs have major pull attracting college coaches.  Those clubs are like the luxury auto brand maker of club soccer. Sure a Cadillac is nice, but I would still want a Benz over a Cadillac.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> There isn't a Girls DA in the North OC.  The club soccer landscape is already changing from when my DD committed a couple of years ago.  If your DD is on a YNT pool, she doesn't have to play DA, because college coaches will recruit from the YNT games and scrimmages. It's the golden ticket!
> 
> In 2 years the Cal South ODP team, ID2, US Soccer training accolades will probably fade like the boys side did, because of DA restrictions.  With Girls DA playing restrictions.  There will be less accolades outside of YNT pool/player.  The club players will have a tougher time distinguishing themselves in their player resume from another Girls DA player and there 11 Girls DA clubs in SoCal now.   So, I would recommend having your DD play for Blues, Slammers or Surf,  maybe even Galaxy if it's fully funded.   The big name clubs have major pull attracting college coaches.  Those clubs are like the luxury auto brand maker of club soccer. Sure a Cadillac is nice, but I would still want a Benz over a Cadillac.


I agree 98%.  It depends upon the Benz and depends upon the Cadillac.  Teams recruit for need just like teams in the NFL draft for need and people primarily buy cars for need.  If I have 4 kids there is no way that you are selling me an SLR Benz no matter how nice it is.  You will however sell me an Escalade.  Although aren't Benz Sprinter Vans the new status symbol vehicle among us soccer moms these days?


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree 98%.  It depends upon the Benz and depends upon the Cadillac.  Teams recruit for need just like teams in the NFL draft for need and people primarily buy cars for need.  If I have 4 kids there is no way that you are selling me an SLR Benz no matter how nice it is.  You will however sell me an Escalade.  Although aren't Benz Sprinter Vans the new status symbol vehicle among us soccer moms these days?


If anyone can afford an SLR AMG, they can also afford the Benz Sprinter van   The van is so ugly though.

The Benz GLE and GLS are also sweet for a big family.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

outside! said:


> Academic rankings are important, but not everything. Some of the top schools don't offer the types of degrees that some players want (like kinesiology). In most cases for undergraduate degrees the amount of effort put in matters more than the academic rating.


It's who you know not where you go once you have experience int he work world.   I know plenty of successful CAL state grads.


----------



## genesis

NoGoalItAll said:


> Yeah, I heard Arsenal opted out.


Hehe


----------



## Swoosh

How do I get my kid on the Mexican ECNL?


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Swoosh said:


> How do I get my kid on the Mexican ECNL?


Isn't mexican ecnl playing college soccer?  something US soccer is at odds with.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

The U20 team is knocked out of the U20 world cup by North Korea and were outshot 25 to single digits.

The DA is as good as dead now.  Many forums are calling for a house cleaning today.

In theory the DA was a great idea but with no financial support from US Soccer and boneheaded upper leaderships this really never had a chance.


----------



## Kicker4Life

US soccer needs an overhaul starting at the top!!!


----------



## Justafan

eastbaysoccer said:


> The U20 team is knocked out of the U20 world cup by North Korea and were outshot 25 to single digits.
> 
> The DA is as good as dead now.  Many forums are calling for a house cleaning today.
> 
> In theory the DA was a great idea but with no financial support from US Soccer and boneheaded upper leaderships this really never had a chance.



They were also outplayed by Mexico for about 85 minutes.


----------



## timbuck

eastbaysoccer said:


> The U20 team is knocked out of the U20 world cup by North Korea and were outshot 25 to single digits.
> 
> The DA is as good as dead now.  Many forums are calling for a house cleaning today.
> 
> In theory the DA was a great idea but with no financial support from US Soccer and boneheaded upper leaderships this really never had a chance.


Huh?  This was the Womens U20 team.  There is not a female DA yet.  It starts in 2017.  Can't blame the US WOMENS YNT losses on the Development Academy.  If anything, this is a reason to say that "ECNL isn't working."
Now - you can blame the failure to qualify for the olympics and failures for the mens/boys YNT on DA.  Just now the girlsl (yet).


----------



## Lone Wolf

Posted this on the 04  group but want thoughts on this as well.........My 2cents Hoping after this meeting in Chicago US Soccer realizes what a huge mistake they made by combining the age groups AGAIN. I think there is a very good chance they make a change back to age pure as that is the only way they can take down ECNL. To many very good 04's will jump to a ECNL team (depending on distance) if this doesn't happen is my educated guess. I know 95% of the 04 age group hopes this happens and US Soccer makes this easy correction. If so all will be good with the world.


----------



## Kicknit22

Lone Wolf said:


> Posted this on the 04  group but want thoughts on this as well.........My 2cents Hoping after this meeting in Chicago US Soccer realizes what a huge mistake they made by combining the age groups AGAIN. I think there is a very good chance they make a change back to age pure as that is the only way they can take down ECNL. To many very good 04's will jump to a ECNL team (depending on distance) if this doesn't happen is my educated guess. I know 95% of the 04 age group hopes this happens and US Soccer makes this easy correction. If so all will be good with the world.


Please explain how this is the ONLY way to take down ECNL?


----------



## NoGoal

timbuck said:


> Huh?  This was the Womens U20 team.  There is not a female DA yet.  It starts in 2017.  Can't blame the US WOMENS YNT losses on the Development Academy.  If anything, this is a reason to say that "ECNL isn't working."
> Now - you can blame the failure to qualify for the olympics and failures for the mens/boys YNT on DA.  Just now the girlsl (yet).


The issue are not the players. It's the YNT head coaches, the player selection, who and how they play them in their tactical formation.   Not to mention, they don't know how to play and teach possession soccer.  The YNT coaches have been training the U17 and U20 teams for the past 2 years....so yes, US Womens Soccer needs to take responsibility for their recent failures. 

Now US soccer wants to implement their best practice training programs at each girls DA clubs.  The same best practice which hasn't been bearing fruit.  Parents should have doubt about US soccer best practices.

I want to know why Michelle French didn't play a midfielder who knows how to boss the midfield and a midfielder who can pull the strings.  Instead it was always get the ball to the forwards Ashley, Mallory and Scarpa and go at it yourselves.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/growing-list-of-youth-clubs-reconsider-decline-girls-da-membership/

Things are starting to unravel.  As soon as a big power in the SW leaves the DA this thing ends before it starts.

.......I agree on the YNT coaches.  Gotta go.  All of them.


----------



## soccerobserver

eastbaysoccer said:


> http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/growing-list-of-youth-clubs-reconsider-decline-girls-da-membership/
> 
> Things are starting to unravel.  As soon as a big power in the SW leaves the DA this thing ends before it starts.
> 
> .......I agree on the YNT coaches.  Gotta go.  All of them.


Thanks EastBayS...The comments from OK were telling and seem really practical...just curious for those who are in the know...how many ECNL clubs have excellent B teams in the same age group? In my neck of the woods, my observation has been that kids --especially ambitious parents--  desperately want their kid to be on the A team and will leave the club rather than play on a B team if they truly have talent. It seems that if a club does not have ECNL then DA makes sense but if the club is ECNL it will be a challenge to support a truly elite second team.

Further, if Suzy Cupcakes wants to be DA will she leave her ECNL team for a rival DA team bc her legacy club would not promote her to DA? S0mething will have to give... in sports talent is distributed along a bell curve...if you distribute the top 2% of players over a 40% increase in the number of "elite" teams then something has to give...also bc DA expanded the number of participating clubs the increase in "elite" teams is probably over 100% per age band chasing the same 2% of players on the elite tail end of the bell curve...

Same as it ever was? After this massive dilutions sets in I wonder if the top clubs in the land will continue to be the top clubs in the land just as the top clubs from old CSL Premier seem to be the top clubs in the new leagues.  Maybe the new paradigm will be kids just following successful coaches regardless of the league they play in. Coaches with the best Rolodex of college coaches, whose teams get into the the best college showcases and whose teams consistently perform well against top teams regardless of the league. In other words same as it ever was.


----------



## Lambchop

soccerobserver said:


> Thanks EastBayS...The comments from OK were telling and seem really practical...just curious for those who are in the know...how many ECNL clubs have excellent B teams in the same age group? In my neck of the woods, my observation has been that kids --especially ambitious parents--  desperately want their kid to be on the A team and will leave the club rather than play on a B team if they truly have talent. It seems that if a club does not have ECNL then DA makes sense but if the club is ECNL it will be a challenge to support a truly elite second team.
> 
> Further, if Suzy Cupcakes wants to be DA will she leave her ECNL team for a rival DA team bc her legacy club would not promote her to DA? S0mething will have to give... in sports talent is distributed along a bell curve...if you distribute the top 2% of players over a 40% increase in the number of "elite" teams then something has to give...also bc DA expanded the number of participating clubs the increase in "elite" teams is probably over 100% per age band chasing the same 2% of players on the elite tail end of the bell curve...
> 
> Same as it ever was? After this massive dilutions sets in I wonder if the top clubs in the land will continue to be the top clubs in the land just as the top clubs from old CSL Premier seem to be the top clubs in the new leagues.  Maybe the new paradigm will be kids just following successful coaches regardless of the league they play in. Coaches with the best Rolodex of college coaches, whose teams get into the the best college showcases and whose teams consistently perform well against top teams regardless of the league. In other words same as it ever was.


Please join the twenty-first century and do not refer to girls/young women as "Suzy Cupcakes".


----------



## The Driver

They lost to a fully funded system who made it to the final to face another fully funded system.


----------



## full90

It was pretty clear watching Mexico out pass, out possess and out think our u20's that the issue is in the coaching. I knew that a moment of individual brilliance would probably still win it for us (and it did) but it was really interesting that the Mexico kids are in the same clubs and colleges as the US kids yet could play such better soccer. That point has to be crystal clear to the powers that be? 

And again, we won the game, so maybe all is well in their minds, but from a US soccer fan's viewpoint, that game was really discouraging. What will it take for change to happen? 

DA is not the answer. It's poorly designed and implemented and offers no hope for any change to the status quo. It was pretty telling that Heinrichs condemned ECNL for lack of great development and then anointed THOSE SAME clubs to DA. I guess the magic DA fairy dust makes those clubs and coaches just wonderful developmental programs.


----------



## It won't matter later

NoGoal said:


> You really are an idiot!  Learn some basic math.  1 point for each player divided by 1 point for each semester/quarter competed.   4 years = 8 semester points.  If a sophomore transferred out after 2 yrs that is 4 points out of 8 = 500 APR. Then take the rest of the roster and do the same.  7-8 transfers will drop well below 990.
> 
> As for my DD committing to UDub.  She isn't a YNT player and I know UCLA and Stanford recruits from the YNT team, so why bother barking up the wrong tree.  Many girls committing to those schools without YNT experience will be challenged to find any pitch time.  How many girls are going to beat out Mallory, Fleming and Ashley for playing time? Not many at all.  Same applies for Stanford.  USC, she didn't like the surrounding area outside of USC.  CAL they committed 5 players in my DDs class many from Surf before the 3-4 Surf players ended up decommitting from CAL their HS Jr year.
> 
> My DD was also looking for the following, wanted to attend an out of state, large student body, academically ranked University (UDub ranked #54 by U.S. News), offers her major, cooler weather and rain doesn't bother her (she hates hot weather), team that plays the ball on the ground, large city, school with football team.


Correction to your post NG: school with a *FANTASTIC *football team.

And btw, anyone doubting the academic strength of UDub, just hop onto your kid's Naviance program and see how many kids from the school apply and how many get in.  

And further, large public institutions are at a disadvantage with APR as many take walk-ons and they end up transferring out at a higher percentage when they realize they are not going to get time.  Nothing wrong with it, but it does skew the APR.


----------



## Soccer123

eastbaysoccer said:


> The U20 team is knocked out of the U20 world cup by North Korea and were outshot 25 to single digits.
> 
> The DA is as good as dead now.  Many forums are calling for a house cleaning today.
> 
> In theory the DA was a great idea but with no financial support from US Soccer and boneheaded upper leaderships this really never had a chance.


North Korea was a delight to watch. They outplayed the US in every position except for goalie. I thought Mallory Pugh was overrated and plays better with the older's. Sanchez was a pure delight to watch. What a treat to be so talented for a youngster.  Watt would have made a difference had she not gotten injured.  The US just didn't bring it the last 30 min of extra time. North Korea played like it was the 1st minute in extra time. It is going to be a great Championship game! I am rooting for North Korea!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Soccer123 said:


> North Korea was a delight to watch. They outplayed the US in every position except for goalie. I thought Mallory Pugh was overrated and plays better with the older's. Sanchez was a pure delight to watch. What a treat to be so talented for a youngster.  Watt would have made a difference had she not gotten injured.  The US just didn't bring it the last 30 min of extra time. North Korea played like it was the 1st minute in extra time. It is going to be a great Championship game! I am rooting for North Korea!


All I can say is WOW!!  I'm going to guess you don't have a player of Pugh's caliber.

Mallory Pugh overrated?  You sound like Pulgita now.  Pugh is amazing.  The tactics and surrounding cast, not so much.  Sanchez is talented but she is no Pugh.  You will get to see them both on the same team all the time next year.  I'm take any bet that Pugh fills up the stat sheet more even with teams focused on her.  If you have never seen Pugh play live you need to hold off on any ignorant comments regarding her.  It's like watching Lebron James live.  It's hard to appreciate the effect that he has on the game when you are watching what the TV camera wants you to see and not everything else.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

I have seen Pugh live when she was in real CO.  Good player. 

Have you seen the Najee Harris the high school football #1 Recruit in America?  Go to you tube.  Dude is amazing and she's nothing close to what he is compared to their relative standards.  
So when people talk about her like she's the second coming of Mia Hamm I just laugh.  Pure marketing at play.  However no doubt one of the better players on the U20 team.


----------



## MakeAPlay

eastbaysoccer said:


> I have seen Pugh live when she was in real CO.  Good player.
> 
> Have you seen the Najee Harris the high school football #1 Recruit in America?  Go to you tube.  Dude is amazing and she's nothing close to what he is compared to their relative standards.
> So when people talk about her like she's the second coming of Mia Hamm I just laugh.  Pure marketing at play.  However no doubt one of the better players on the U20 team.


I just saw Mr. Harris and I have to tell you I noticed two things right away that are going to be a big shock for him come his first D1 game.  He runs too high and leaves his feet too much.  Let's revisit this next year about this time and see who had done more for their respective teams.  You are right about there being no comparison and I think the player getting shortchanged is Pugh.


----------



## Mystery Train

MakeAPlay said:


> I just saw Mr. Harris and I have to tell you I noticed two things right away that are going to be a big shock for him come his first D1 game.  He runs too high and leaves his feet too much.  Let's revisit this next year about this time and see who had done more for their respective teams.  You are right about there being no comparison and I think the player getting shortchanged is Pugh.


Agreed on Pugh being the one shortchanged there.  She's already playing against elite competition and doing well.  In HS football, he's a man among boys, so it will be hard to project his impact until he's regularly competing with other grown men.  His tape shows him running over a lot of 190lb kids.   Not to hijack the thread, but I will say that his running style shouldn't be a big problem given his size.  Upright running-style is bad for little guys, but when you are 6'3, 230+ with speed, it can work.  Reminds me of Eddie George.  Jalen Hurd (formerly) of Tennessee also had a lot of success running like that.  However, if he keeps growing, he won't be a running back for long.  He could easily put on 40 lbs in college, and if he wants to play in the NFL, he'll have to do it at another position.  I see a kid that big in HS and I imagine he's going to be a LB or TE eventually.


----------



## Soccer123

MakeAPlay said:


> All I can say is WOW!!  I'm going to guess you don't have a player of Pugh's caliber.
> 
> Mallory Pugh overrated?  You sound like Pulgita now.  Pugh is amazing.  The tactics and surrounding cast, not so much.  Sanchez is talented but she is no Pugh.  You will get to see them both on the same team all the time next year.  I'm take any bet that Pugh fills up the stat sheet more even with teams focused on her.  If you have never seen Pugh play live you need to hold off on any ignorant comments regarding her.  It's like watching Lebron James live.  It's hard to appreciate the effect that he has on the game when you are watching what the TV camera wants you to see and not everything else.


My own personal opinion, overrated in this game.  I just don't think she did much for an impact player, but as you alluded to, it may have had something to do with her surrounding cast, b/c at times, she got frustrated at them. I am a Pugh fan and recently a Sanchez fan and can appreciate talent when I see it.  Love to see our Blues girl playing with the best and representing!  Look forward to seeing them be amazing together at UCLA!   I think they both will fill up the stat sheet and be incredible together!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Soccer123 said:


> My own personal opinion, overrated in this game.  I just don't think she did much for an impact player, but as you alluded to, it may have had something to do with her surrounding cast, b/c at times, she got frustrated at them. I am a Pugh fan and recently a Sanchez fan and can appreciate talent when I see it.  Love to see our Blues girl playing with the best and representing!  Look forward to seeing them be amazing together at UCLA!   I think they both will fill up the stat sheet and be incredible together!!


Fair enough.  I agree that they both will do well next year so you will get plenty of opportunities to see them live.  I suggest you bring your daughter out to see them.


----------



## Soccer123

MakeAPlay said:


> Fair enough.  I agree that they both will do well next year so you will get plenty of opportunities to see them live.  I suggest you bring your daughter out to see them.


My DD will definitely be catching some of their games.  It will be a treat for all of us to watch the talent out there.  Can't wait!


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Soccer123 said:


> My DD will definitely be catching some of their games.  It will be a treat for all of us to watch the talent out there.  Can't wait!


Hope fully my dd will have an opportunity to play against them and test her metal.  UCLA will win it all next year.  Feel sorry for the UCLA seniors that will be sitting pine.


----------



## NoGoal

It won't matter later said:


> Correction to your post NG: school with a *FANTASTIC *football team.
> 
> And btw, anyone doubting the academic strength of UDub, just hop onto your kid's Naviance program and see how many kids from the school apply and how many get in.
> 
> And further, large public institutions are at a disadvantage with APR as many take walk-ons and they end up transferring out at a higher percentage when they realize they are not going to get time.  Nothing wrong with it, but it does skew the APR.


IWML, Congrats to your son.....Pac12 Football Champs! Your family must be so PROUD, Go Dawgs!


----------



## It won't matter later

NoGoal said:


> IWML, Congrats to your son.....Pac12 Football Champs! Your family must be so PROUD, Go Dawgs!


Thank you!  Yes, it is such an exciting time.    Off to Atlanta now, where hopefully they can give Alabama a challenge.   Who'd have ever imagined they could go from barely bowl eligible to Semi-Finals in one year.  Craziness!


----------



## MakeAPlay

eastbaysoccer said:


> Hope fully my dd will have an opportunity to play against them and test her metal.  UCLA will win it all next year.  Feel sorry for the UCLA seniors that will be sitting pine.


What seniors will be sitting pine?  The only two players that will be seniors who start are on the backline and aren't going anywhere.  Winters and Matulich are valuable off the bench.  The Bruins started 6 freshman, a sophomore, 2 juniors and 2 seniors in their last few games.  They are going to have hockey line changes on offense next year.  I agree they are going to be the odds on favorite to win.  Let's see if the the natty by the ladies of Troy motivates them.  They tied West Virginia and beat $C when they played them.  They will be in good shape next year.


----------



## Lambchop

Any news out of Chicago's Tuesday meeting for girls DA?


----------



## Kicker4Life

You mean today's meeting in Chicago?


----------



## Lambchop

Kicker4Life said:


> You mean today's meeting in Chicago?


Yesterday, today, whenever. Any news.


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://www.socceramerica.com/article/71034/april-heinrichs-on-under-17-world-cup-development.html

Please read the comments at the bottom after the article.  Interesting discussions.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> Yesterday, today, whenever. Any news.


Why do you care chopped liver?


----------



## ADPSOCCER

LA Premier Girls DA information starting to be released on website: http://www.lapremierfc.com/football/girlsacademy

G03/04 tryout dates released have also been released.
Nick Gumpert (LAPFC Girls DOC and USSF A license coach will head this age group).

The tryouts are going to be held at La Canada High School Stadium Field:

*Fri, Feb 3: 7:00 pm - 8:30 pm*
*Girls 2003 and 2004 ACADEMY (Joint Session) - Tryout #1*

*Sat, Feb 4: 10:00 am - 11:30 am*
*Girls 2004 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #2*

*Sat, Feb 4: 12:00 pm - 1:30 pm*
*Girls 2003 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #2*

*Sun, Feb 5: 10:00 am - 11:30 am*
*Girls 2004 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #3*

*Sun, Feb 5: 12:00 pm - 1:30 pm*
*Girls 2003 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #3*


----------



## The Driver

That Sunday Tryout will have the heavy hitters or will it be Saturday's. @ADPSOCCER what do you think 4th or the 5th?


----------



## ADPSOCCER

The Driver said:


> That Sunday Tryout will have the heavy hitters or will it be Saturday's. @ADPSOCCER what do you think 4th or the 5th?


Not sure, lots of info to come out before then. Other club dates, Academy II, etc. I feel It's going to be an interesting January.


----------



## The Driver

ADPSOCCER said:


> LA Premier Girls DA information starting to be released on website: http://www.lapremierfc.com/football/girlsacademy
> 
> G03/04 tryout dates released have also been released.
> Nick Gumpert (LAPFC Girls DOC and USSF A license coach will head this age group).
> 
> The tryouts are going to be held at La Canada High School Stadium Field:
> 
> *Fri, Feb 3: 7:00 pm - 8:30 pm*
> *Girls 2003 and 2004 ACADEMY (Joint Session) - Tryout #1*
> 
> *Sat, Feb 4: 10:00 am - 11:30 am*
> *Girls 2004 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #2*
> 
> *Sat, Feb 4: 12:00 pm - 1:30 pm*
> *Girls 2003 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #2*
> 
> *Sun, Feb 5: 10:00 am - 11:30 am*
> *Girls 2004 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #3*
> 
> *Sun, Feb 5: 12:00 pm - 1:30 pm*
> *Girls 2003 ONLY ACADEMY - Tryout #3*


Most soccer or futbol players has a sister. I would flood the 03 boys threads with your mixtape. You are by 210 speed that you just have to convert to soccer cleats. Fair Play LA


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://herosports.com/news/odds-womens-soccer-player-going-pro-d1-womens-soccer-nwsl

Just some numbers for perspective.  What are they actually giving up everything else for?


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> http://herosports.com/news/odds-womens-soccer-player-going-pro-d1-womens-soccer-nwsl
> 
> Just some numbers for perspective.  What are they actually giving up everything else for?


Great post Swami.  Now how much do the .002% make?  This ain't the NFL, NBA, MLB or NHL.  Most "average college grads" will make more in multiples than these ladies.  Hell a fast food kid with the new $15 minimum wage will make more than these gals. Pretty sad.  Better do it for the love of the game and the perks cause it won't be for the dollars.  Hell our kids will get more perks from their universities than they will from the NWSL.


----------



## The Driver

It takes a special player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> It takes a special player.


Or in more common terms a unicorn.


----------



## Lone Wolf

God rest ECNL. Game over.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Lone Wolf said:


> God rest ECNL. Game over.


The introduction of the Age pure '04 GDA is definitely a game changer.


----------



## Sandypk

Kicker4Life said:


> The introduction of the Age pure '04 GDA is definitely a game changer.


Word gets out fast on these forums!
Question:  will the rosters still be set at @22 players per team with the new pure age groups?  That's a lot of 03s and 04s per DA team.  Developing more younger players is a good idea in my opinion.


----------



## MarkM

Thanks for the update on the new age group.  Any link to the announcement?


----------



## Kicker4Life

Don't know how official it is but my inbox has been blowing up for the past 20 hours or so.  Had I only heard it from one person I would not believe it but I've now heard it from multiple, unrelated sources.


----------



## Justafan

Kicker4Life said:


> Don't know how official it is but my inbox has been blowing up for the past 20 hours or so.  Had I only heard it from one person I would not believe it but I've now heard it from multiple, unrelated sources.


For this upcoming year?  If so, Pats is going to have to do a new round of tryouts for the 04's.


----------



## The Driver

Justafan said:


> For this upcoming year?  If so, Pats is going to have to do a new round of tryouts for the 04's.


I was just thinking the same thing.


----------



## The Driver

Ms. Jill is not playing around.


----------



## Kicker4Life

I go back to wondering why any Club holds a DA try-out so early.  But that is for another thread.....well played GDA!  I'm sure it won't be perfect but this move gives me a little bit of hope.


----------



## The Driver

Kicker4Life said:


> I go back to wondering why any Club holds a DA try-out so early.  But that is for another thread.....well played GDA!  I'm sure it won't be perfect but this move gives me a little bit of hope.


Only thing left to do is go fully funded across the board and pay the top coaches. I would gulp that kool-aid.


----------



## Kicknit22

The Driver said:


> Only thing left to do is go fully funded across the board and pay the top coaches. I would gulp that kool-aid.


Is this "Age Pure" only in the '04?


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> Ms. Jill is not playing around.


A change of heart?  No, they are making it up as they go.  Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## avh

Kicker4Life said:


> The introduction of the Age pure '04 GDA is definitely a game changer.


Did they announce this for the girls also, or just for the boys?  I've only seen the announcement for the boys side.


----------



## Justafan

MakeAPlay said:


> A change of heart?  No, they are making it up as they go.  Good luck to you and yours.


Maybe they read the post on the Pats DA thread that said all the elite 04's were going to play ECNL this upcoming year and then alternate DA and ECNL the rest of the way.


----------



## The Driver

Justafan said:


> Maybe they read the post on the Pats DA thread that said all the elite 04's were going to play ECNL this upcoming year and then alternate DA and ECNL the rest of the way.


 That Pats thread needs to be swept for Bugs


----------



## Kicker4Life

avh said:


> Did they announce this for the girls also, or just for the boys?  I've only seen the announcement for the boys side.


Yes, GirlsDA.  Clubs where notified yesterday.


----------



## Real Deal

Does "Age Pure" mean "04s only" mandated?... or "04 and under?"


----------



## Kicker4Life

Real Deal said:


> Does "Age Pure" mean "04s only" mandated?... or "04 and under?"


I'm sure there are some '05's that will have a chance to play up.


----------



## ADPSOCCER

Confirmed by US Soccer in an email to all academy clubs, posted details of update:
http://lapremierfc.com/football/girlsacademy


----------



## Real Deal

Kicker4Life said:


> I'm sure there are some '05's that will have a chance to play up.


I see that Lambchop disagreed.  Lambchop?


----------



## LASTMAN14

Real Deal said:


> I see that Lambchop disagreed.  Lambchop?


There is a G05 playing for TFA and playing ODP 04. I'm sure she will be playing up if they decide to go DA.


----------



## LASTMAN14

LASTMAN14 said:


> There is a G05 playing for TFA and playing ODP 04. I'm sure she will be playing up if they decide to go DA.


Sorry forgot to mention. She is playing on the boys side.


----------



## Surfref

ALL of the High School girls coaches I have talked too are not happy with the GDA.  They all have ECNL players that plan to play GDA even though they know they will not be able to play high school soccer.  Most of the coaches seemed pissed off that they would be losing their best players to GDA.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

Good or bad, the one thing it continues to clarify is that the one's leading the pack have no idea what they're doing. More and more top US players are going to forge their careers in Europe. Other nations are catching up quickly and our response is to build a program on the fly with the same old dinosaurs who led us down this path calling the shots! Come on USSDA hire someone independent with experience and qualification, who isn't incestuously linked to one of the current US Staff and lets put a real program together.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Good or bad, the one thing it continues to clarify is that the one's leading the pack have no idea what they're doing. More and more top US players are going to forge their careers in Europe. Other nations are catching up quickly and our response is to build a program on the fly with the same old dinosaurs who led us down this path calling the shots! Come on USSDA hire someone independent with experience and qualification, who isn't incestuously linked to one of the current US Staff and lets put a real program together.


I wouldn't say "no idea" what they are doing as they have setup the program and gave pretty good reasoning behind many aspects of the program. The whole age group part you are probably correct since they never really gave a sound reason for it. Anything else about the GDA give you the belief they have no idea? Any general questions you (or others) want answered by US Soccer?


----------



## outside!

Surfref said:


> ALL of the High School girls coaches I have talked too are not happy with the GDA.  They all have ECNL players that plan to play GDA even though they know they will not be able to play high school soccer.  Most of the coaches seemed pissed off that they would be losing their best players to GDA.


Then again, it is not like high schools, HS Athletic Directors and CIF have reached out and tried to make HS a better experience for elite players. CIF and many HS AD's still act as if it is still the 1980's and this whole annoying girls soccer thing has been forced on them by Title IX. I personally think that HS soccer could be an integral, positive part of youth soccer in the United States, but instead over the years the HS side has provided the absolute minimum support required by law and this allowed the club side to grow large enough to become the dominant force in youth soccer. CIF treats female soccer players as second class athletes and actively discourages them from college recruitment opportunities. Club soccer has no adult supervision looking out for the overall welfare of the players and is making a power grab where it sees an opening. On the plus side, soccer will continue to become more popular in the US and the absence of elite players in HS soccer will provide opportunities for others to play (further increasing the player base and popularity). Having said that, there are many, many great people doing their best for the kids at many levels, but unfortunately there are not enough to contain the power hoarding kingdom protectors.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

LadiesMan217 said:


> I wouldn't say "no idea" what they are doing as they have setup the program and gave pretty good reasoning behind many aspects of the program. The whole age group part you are probably correct since they never really gave a sound reason for it. Anything else about the GDA give you the belief they have no idea? Any general questions you (or others) want answered by US Soccer?


Reason for age banding was the belief by US soccer that better players should play with older players to expedite development. I think that's a fairly logical reason and now it's seemingly deemed as "not that important!" I don't know that they have created anything that didn't already exist except in name. They've seen another organization have success and essentially hijacked the process by flexing their weight! The lack of clear communication to clubs, coaches, players and parents really does nothing to alleviate my opinion that they are winging it, but that's just my little old opinion. Imagine asking club's to apply to enter a program that would host 3 teams, accepting the clubs, then telling them that now they're in, they now need to budget for a new team, which will need another highly qualified coach, training field, game field etc.....oh and did I mention that we 're also thinking about adding a reserve team in each age group! Seems they're more intent on sticking it to ECNL than creating a clearly defined pathway for what's best for the kids.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Reason for age banding was the belief by US soccer that better players should play with older players to expedite development. I think that's a fairly logical reason and now it's seemingly deemed as "not that important!" I don't know that they have created anything that didn't already exist except in name. They've seen another organization have success and essentially hijacked the process by flexing their weight! The lack of clear communication to clubs, coaches, players and parents really does nothing to alleviate my opinion that they are winging it, but that's just my little old opinion. Imagine asking club's to apply to enter a program that would host 3 teams, accepting the clubs, then telling them that now they're in, they now need to budget for a new team, which will need another highly qualified coach, training field, game field etc.....oh and did I mention that we 're also thinking about adding a reserve team in each age group! Seems they're more intent on sticking it to ECNL than creating a clearly defined pathway for what's best for the kids.


Do you know that these things were forced (as implied) on all the clubs or were they voted upon and the majority won?


----------



## Technician72

Kicker4Life said:


> I'm sure there are some '05's that will have a chance to play up.





Real Deal said:


> I see that Lambchop disagreed.  Lambchop?





LASTMAN14 said:


> There is a G05 playing for TFA and playing ODP 04. I'm sure she will be playing up if they decide to go DA.





LASTMAN14 said:


> Sorry forgot to mention. She is playing on the boys side.


Change in age bands separating the 04s from the 03s will definitely leave the door open for the top 05s to explore the DA option, including the player mentioned above and a few others.


----------



## tugs

So is it only a matter of time before they announce dedicated age pure '02 teams now too?  That'll be in the nail in the coffin for high school and ECNL.


----------



## mbeach

Real Deal said:


> I see that Lambchop disagreed.  Lambchop?


There are a few 05s that could  play (actually they already do) with 04s, just like there are a few 04s that can play up, while making an impact in the game. But why would you like to do that when you are currently playing in a top 05 team?
The main reasons would be the superior training and exposure to US Soccer trainers. But these girls are already getting this (I'm sure most practice two additional days with the older girls, and they are invited to YNT sessions), and the same diet will continue next year. On the other hand, when playing up they do not get to be total studs like they are right now in their age group, which actually is pretty important for the psychology of the player.   
If she played in a top team and got the additional training with the older girls, I would rather have her playing one last year of great summer tournaments, CRL, National Cup, etc. In the worst case I would ask for a Developmental Player slot, but what is the point of taking it from an older girl that could be rewarded with this? DA is not going away, it will be there next year waiting for her.


----------



## JCsoccer

wow.. so if the plans to split the U-14/15 age groups happen.. does that mean there will two DA teams for each age group as well.. 03 DA1, 03DA2, 04DA1, 04DA2 ?  Will DA2 teams be allowed to play SCDSL/Coast,etc?

Does this basically mean SCDSL/Coast, etc just lost their entire Flight 1/Gold brackets for these age groups?


----------



## younothat

JCsoccer said:


> wow.. so if the plans to split the U-14/15 age groups happen.. does that mean there will two DA teams for each age group as well.. 03 DA1, 03DA2, 04DA1, 04DA2 ?  Will DA2 teams be allowed to play SCDSL/Coast,etc?
> 
> Does this basically mean SCDSL/Coast, etc just lost their entire Flight 1/Gold brackets for these age groups?


No one team per club per age group in the ussda league for a total of (4) four per club......IE:  LA Galaxy U14, U15 the other age groups are not split yet just like the boys:  U16/17 & U18/19

No but those leagues will be diluted the first year just like boys were this past season; eventually things might level out but if  more leagues and comp's are added, more dilution is possible.


----------



## shales1002

tugs said:


> So is it only a matter of time before they announce dedicated age pure '02 teams now too?  That'll be in the nail in the coffin for high school and ECNL.


Certainly not the nail in the coffin. As is most of the country is not participating in GDA. Again , what U.S. Is saying is that essentially the best players live in SoCal and the northeast part of the country. So, ECNL will continue to thrive with 3/4 of the country not able to participate in GDA.


----------



## LadiesMan217

shales1002 said:


> Certainly not the nail in the coffin. As is most of the country is not participating in GDA. Again , what U.S. Is saying is that essentially the best players live in SoCal and the northeast part of the country. So, ECNL will continue to thrive with 3/4 of the country not able to participate in GDA.


U.S. Soccer is not saying that (although probably true). Only two ECNL states are not represented IA and AL - no GDA options for the kids on those teams unless they want a 4 hour drive. All other kids have nearby GDA options.


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> Certainly not the nail in the coffin. As is most of the country is not participating in GDA. Again , what U.S. Is saying is that essentially the best players live in SoCal and the northeast part of the country. So, ECNL will continue to thrive with 3/4 of the country not able to participate in GDA.


3/4? "Most of the country"? What are you basing this percentage on? The Girls Development Academy is spread throughout the major population centers of the country, and provides an opportunity to most (90%) of the girls that are playing organized soccer in the US. Granted, my percentage is an educated guess, derived from the attached map of GDA clubs.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory

Most of the country is serviced by US Soccer GDA.


----------



## Kicknit22

CaliKlines said:


> 3/4? "Most of the country"? What are you basing this percentage on? The Girls Development Academy is spread throughout the major population centers of the country, and provides an opportunity to most (90%) of the girls that are playing organized soccer in the US. Granted, my percentage is an educated guess, derived from the attached map of GDA clubs.
> 
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory
> 
> Most of the country is serviced by US Soccer GDA.


I think it's a bit of wishful thinking on Shales part.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> I think it's a bit of wishful thinking on Shales part.


And Cali's is admittedly guessing.  And following the drumbeat.


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> 3/4? "Most of the country"? What are you basing this percentage on? The Girls Development Academy is spread throughout the major population centers of the country, and provides an opportunity to most (90%) of the girls that are playing organized soccer in the US. Granted, my percentage is an educated guess, derived from the attached map of GDA clubs.
> 
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory
> 
> Most of the country is serviced by US Soccer GDA.


 Based on the GDA map, 45 states would be 90%.  Once again that is NOT happening.  Now, ECNL is a viable option for my DD.  She will get her looks regardless of where she plays. But, my end goal is for her to follow my or her father's footsteps anything more is a bonus.  

GDA does not allow for players to  "discovery" play. Some of our Vegas girls who currently play ECNL in SoCal were told that they would have to commit to a minimum of 3 practices a week in order to participate in GDA. Essentially that's asking families to relocate. Perhaps because you have it in SoCal, you are blinded or unaware as to what's happening for a lot of girls who may want to participate. Perhaps you are excited that you, CaliKlines,  finally have a label...who knows. I don't believe there is anything wrong with GDA  YET.   What I do know is that if the GDA is about finding and developing the talent, this process will excluded many in the vast areas where the nearest GDA is 4 hours away, and yes that's over half of the country.  However, I know the best will get looked at wherever they may be and regardless of label.


----------



## MakeAPlay

shales1002 said:


> Based on the GDA map, 45 states would be 90%.  Once again that is NOT happening.  Now, ECNL is a viable option for my DD.  She will get her looks regardless of where she plays. But, my end goal is for her to follow my or her father's footsteps anything more is a bonus.
> 
> GDA does not allow for players to  "discovery" play. Some of our Vegas girls who currently play ECNL in SoCal were told that they would have to commit to a minimum of 3 practices a week in order to participate in GDA. Essentially that's asking families to relocate. Perhaps because you have it in SoCal, you are blinded or unaware as to what's happening for a lot of girls who may want to participate. Perhaps you are excited that you, CaliKlines,  finally have a label...who knows. I don't believe there is anything wrong with GDA  YET.   What I do know is that if the GDA is about finding and developing the talent, this process will excluded many in the vast areas where the nearest GDA is 4 hours away, and yes that's over half of the country.  However, I know the best will get looked at wherever they may be and regardless of label.


Preach it sister!!


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> Based on the GDA map, 45 states would be 90%.  Once again that is NOT happening.


 So, it is your contention that every state, regardless of population, should have a GDA club? If you look at the GDA map, the vast majority of players, not states, are located within a 1 hour drive of a GDA club. I am sorry about the 3 girls in Las Vegas (and the 2 girls in South Dakota) that do not have GDA closer. However, it makes the most sense for the league to concentrate their focus on the population centers throughout the country.


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> So, it is your contention that every state, regardless of population, should have a GDA club? If you look at the GDA map, the vast majority of players, not states, are located within a 1 hour drive of a GDA club. I am sorry about the 3 girls in Las Vegas (and the 2 girls in South Dakota) that do not have GDA closer. However, it makes the most sense for the league to concentrate their focus on the population centers throughout the country.


It is not my contention that every state should have a GDA. It is my contention that ECNL definitely reaches far more players and successfully. There are some excellent players in Hawaii, Nevada, Ohio.  There are no GDA clubs. 

There are more than three girls from Vegas playing in SoCal but hey you said 90% of girls will be servicesd by GDA. Secondly, your map reading skills aren't up to par. Perhaps a geography course would help. 

That being said, labels don't matter. The best will be discovered.


----------



## LadiesMan217

shales1002 said:


> Based on the GDA map, 45 states would be 90%.  Once again that is NOT happening.  Now, ECNL is a viable option for my DD.  She will get her looks regardless of where she plays. But, my end goal is for her to follow my or her father's footsteps anything more is a bonus.
> 
> GDA does not allow for players to  "discovery" play. Some of our Vegas girls who currently play ECNL in SoCal were told that they would have to commit to a minimum of 3 practices a week in order to participate in GDA. Essentially that's asking families to relocate. Perhaps because you have it in SoCal, you are blinded or unaware as to what's happening for a lot of girls who may want to participate. Perhaps you are excited that you, CaliKlines,  finally have a label...who knows. I don't believe there is anything wrong with GDA  YET.   What I do know is that if the GDA is about finding and developing the talent, this process will excluded many in the vast areas where the nearest GDA is 4 hours away, and yes that's over half of the country.  However, I know the best will get looked at wherever they may be and regardless of label.


Discovery players as defined by ECNL are: "A Discovery Player is a player that plays on a team for a non-ECNL club that you want to play with your team. This is a great way for the Discovery Player to experience what it is like to play ECNL competition and for a team to have the assistance of a key player.".  GDA is about player development, not having a kid show up at games to play. How many practices do these Vegas girls attend per week today?


----------



## shales1002

LadiesMan217 said:


> Discovery players as defined by ECNL are: "A Discovery Player is a player that plays on a team for a non-ECNL club that you want to play with your team. This is a great way for the Discovery Player to experience what it is like to play ECNL competition and for a team to have the assistance of a key player.".  GDA is about player development, not having a kid show up at games to play. How many practices do these Vegas girls attend per week today?



That's a fair question. The girls go down once a week to my knowledge. With parents rotating the responsibility. You are right about the discovery player.  I personally would be upset if a discovery player was playing more than my child who showed up to all the practices. I agree with you with regards to the goal of GDA. The point that I am making is that GDA is lacking geographically.


----------



## MarkM

shales1002 said:


> That's a fair question. The girls go down once a week to my knowledge. With parents rotating the responsibility. You are right about the discovery player.  I personally would be upset if a discovery player was playing more than my child who showed up to all the practices. I agree with you with regards to the goal of GDA. The point that I am making is that GDA is lacking geographically.


First, I agree, good players will be discovered wherever they play.  But to counter the geography point, there are zero ECNL clubs located in the City of Los Angeles.  I believe the City of Los Angles is way more populated than the entire state of Nevada with some of the worst traffic in the country.  I don't know if GDA is going to work or not, but GDA in SoCal will serve a far broader population base because of the geographic spread.


----------



## LASTMAN14

MarkM said:


> First, I agree, good players will be discovered wherever they play.  But to counter the geography point, there are zero ECNL clubs located in the City of Los Angeles.  I believe the City of Los Angles is way more populated than the entire state of Nevada with some of the worst traffic in the country.  I don't know if GDA is going to work or not, but GDA in SoCal will serve a far broader population base because of the geographic spread.


Your right on the population of Nevada being smaller than LA. Nevada has 2.9 million state wide. LA has 4.1 million.


----------



## shales1002

MarkM said:


> First, I agree, good players will be discovered wherever they play.  But to counter the geography point, there are zero ECNL clubs located in the City of Los Angeles.  I believe the City of Los Angles is way more populated than the entire state of Nevada with some of the worst traffic in the country.  I don't know if GDA is going to work or not, but GDA in SoCal will serve a far broader population base because of the geographic spread.


I believe that is a problem. Ecnl SHOULD be in Los Angeles. I lived there 30 years, and I can't imagine how parents were/are making the commutes to ECNL clubs, but at least you had the option. Girls outside of the radius for GDA do not have the same option.  Hopefully we can both agree, millions of people are bring left out.


----------



## LadiesMan217

shales1002 said:


> That's a fair question. The girls go down once a week to my knowledge. With parents rotating the responsibility. You are right about the discovery player.  I personally would be upset if a discovery player was playing more than my child who showed up to all the practices. I agree with you with regards to the goal of GDA. The point that I am making is that GDA is lacking geographically.


I'm not sure it is much different than ECNL geographically. Are these girls playing for another club? If not, all they have to do is signup for the club and they can become 'Developmental Players'; but, that does restrict the number of games they can play and no playing in finals. Developmental Players practicing once a week with Academy team is not uncommon (although they do play on another team within the club and most likely practice with them).


----------



## shales1002

LadiesMan217 said:


> I'm not sure it is much different than ECNL geographically. Are these girls playing for another club? If not, all they have to do is signup for the club and they can become 'Developmental Players'; but, that does restrict the number of games they can play and no playing in finals. Developmental Players practicing once a week with Academy team is not uncommon (although they do play on another team within the club and most likely practice with them).


Yes, they play for another club. It will be interesting to see what options they explore as they don't want the limitations you mentioned. It's a lot of traveling involved for one game and one practice  a week. We here are curious to see how Phoenix or the one Utah team manages.


----------



## outside!

Everybody seems to be arguing over a point that is an issue for both GDA and ECNL. They are both closed systems with no relegation and more importantly, no way for a deserving team from a small club to get in. At least with USYS Nationals, there is a path for any team from anywhere to make it to the top levels and get exposure (for both the players and the coaches).

ECNL did many good things for girls soccer, but was not serving southern California effectively the last few years. GDA is better for SoCal than ECNL since it broke the Surf monopoly in San Diego county and let in Legends. I also think GDA serves LA/OC better than ECNL since there the clubs cover a larger area. With such a large population of quality players, I don't believe SoCal teams need to travel out of SoCal for good competition on a regular basis. Now if only there were a way for individual teams to break in...


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> It is not my contention that every state should have a GDA. It is my contention that ECNL definitely reaches far more players and successfully. There are some excellent players in Hawaii, Nevada, Ohio.  There are no GDA clubs.
> 
> There are more than three girls from Vegas playing in SoCal but hey you said 90% of girls will be servicesd by GDA. Secondly, your map reading skills aren't up to par. Perhaps a geography course would help.


Sorry Shales, but here was your original contention:


shales1002 said:


> Certainly not the nail in the coffin. As is most of the country is not participating in GDA.  3/4 of the country not able to participate in GDA.


I can't believe that I am having this discussion with you...My map reading skills are phenomenal, and geography is a hobby. Maybe your comprehension of population concentration is off, or maybe you are just trying to promote ECNL over the United States Soccer Girls Development Academy. Either way, you can't be so naive to think that 75% of the country is not able to participate in the GDA. (75% is a fancy way of saying 3/4.) Capeesh? Do you really think that only 25% of the country is exposed to the GDA? Isn't that exactly what you said? Or "most of the country is not participating in GDA"? Just to help you out, again, way more than half of the US population is being serviced by GDA clubs, and colloquially, I would say it is reaching 90% of the population.



shales1002 said:


> There are some excellent players in Hawaii, Nevada, Ohio.  There are no GDA clubs.


There is 1 GDA club in Ohio, 1 in Indiana, 3 in Michigan, and 3 in Illinois.  Yes, unfortunately, there are a few good players in some unrepresented areas, but to say that "most of the country", or 75% of the country, is not able to participate in the GDA is blatantly false and completely disingenuous.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> Everybody seems to be arguing over a point that is an issue for both GDA and ECNL. They are both closed systems with no relegation and more importantly, no way for a deserving team from a small club to get in. At least with USYS Nationals, there is a path for any team from anywhere to make it to the top levels and get exposure (for both the players and the coaches).
> 
> ECNL did many good things for girls soccer, but was not serving southern California effectively the last few years. GDA is better for SoCal than ECNL since it broke the Surf monopoly in San Diego county and let in Legends. I also think GDA serves LA/OC better than ECNL since there the clubs cover a larger area. With such a large population of quality players, I don't believe SoCal teams need to travel out of SoCal for good competition on a regular basis. Now if only there were a way for individual teams to break in...


What can I say.  You had me up until you revealed your true anti-Surf agenda .  Look everyone can argue the position which benefits one's own best interest all day.  

To say that LA is underserved is somewhat true but it came about because the ECNL picked its membership based primarily upon a club's history of winning USYS championships and producing college and national team players.  It's sad to say but when the two clubs that would become Real So Cal merged they owned all of the LA county national titles on the girls side for LA.  The clubs that have more recently won national titles like Beach, Legends and Carlsbad have done so without having to compete against most of the best teams in the country.  

Now let's talk about the Surf "monopoly" in San Diego.  Geographically Surf is  clearly the largest producer and developer of talent not to mention they win.  Carlsbad has come on the scene recently but as I said before they don't have to play the ECNL teams.  How many age groups can you honestly say that the Carlsbad team is better than the Surf team?  It doesn't matter I guess because now with the DA the talent in San Diego is going to be more spread out.  Speaking from my own self interest I prefer talent concentration.  Opportunity for more players is good but how much time do north county kids really save going to Carlsbad instead of Del Mar?

I don't want to spend much time on Legends other than to say really?  Legends is so new money.  All flash no substance.  They are like Tomny Hilfiger.  All marketing no R & D.

Finally regarding SoCal and it's monopoly of great players.  Although Cal South produces more great players than any area we definitely don't have a monopoly on elite players.  Great players come from all over.  Some areas do a much better job at concentrating their talent so the local competition is not nearly what it is here.  However, there is a lot of value in playing those elite out of state teams. 

 The bottom line in that in SoCal the DA is going to do two things, dilute the talent pool and give US Soccer more control.  I would be okay with giving US Soccer control except they fail more often than they succeed and the previous system was working 99.99% of the time.  If they were serious the top .01% would be in a residential academy like on the boys side.

Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## gkrent

MakeAPlay said:


> I don't want to spend much time on Legends other than to say really?  Legends is so new money.  All flash no substance.  They are like Tomny Hilfiger.  All marketing no R & D.


LOL!!

So which club is driving an old beat up Volvo to their 10,000sf horse barn in Eastern PA?


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> Sorry Shales, but here was your original contention:
> 
> 
> I can't believe that I am having this discussion with you...My map reading skills are phenomenal, and geography is a hobby. Maybe your comprehension of population concentration is off, or maybe you are just trying to promote ECNL over the United States Soccer Girls Development Academy. Either way, you can't be so naive to think that 75% of the country is not able to participate in the GDA. (75% is a fancy way of saying 3/4.) Capeesh? Do you really think that only 25% of the country is exposed to the GDA? Isn't that exactly what you said? Or "most of the country is not participating in GDA"? Just to help you out, again, way more than half of the US population is being serviced by GDA clubs, and colloquially, I would say it is reaching 90% of the population.
> 
> 
> 
> There is 1 GDA club in Ohio, 1 in Indiana, 3 in Michigan, and 3 in Illinois.  Yes, unfortunately, there are a few good players in some unrepresented areas, but to say that "most of the country", or 75% of the country, is not able to participate in the GDA is blatantly false and completely disingenuous.



As I have said time and time again, I have nothing against GDA YET.  It's not a make or break for me. However, it sounds like it's something you've been begging for and you are finally in a position to get a patch of some sort . Most of the country will be underserved. That's a fact. No need to go back and forth. The map you provided earlier displayed the limited areas to which the GDA will cover. Also, thanks for the math lesson, BUT I am actually quite good at converting fractions; you however have already proven my point just by displaying 
http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory. 

Enjoy the GDA patch...it's obvious you need it for validation.


----------



## shales1002

MakeAPlay said:


> To say that LA is underserved is somewhat true but it came about because the ECNL picked its membership based primarily upon a club's history of winning USYS championships and producing college and national team players.
> 
> Regarding SoCal and it's monopoly of great players.  Although Cal South produces more great players than any area we definitely don't have a monopoly on elite players.  Great players come from all over.  Some areas do a much better job at concentrating their talent so the local competition is not nearly what it is here.  However, there is a lot of value in playing those elite out of state teams.
> 
> The bottom line in that in SoCal the DA is going to do two things, dilute the talent pool and give US Soccer more control.  I would be okay with giving US Soccer control except they fail more often than they succeed and the previous system was working 99.99% of the time.  If they were serious the top .01% would be in a residential academy like on the boys side.
> 
> Good luck to you and yours.


It's all about control and like you said if they were serious there would be a residential component. 
 Unfortunately, even with the residential component the boy's side hasn't produced positive results on the world stage that  ECNL has produced on the girl's side.


----------



## outside!

MAP, I have no "anti-Surf" agenda. I am not in favor of monopolies however. The problem with one club controlling an area with a population as large as San Diego's is that if there are coaching problems with a team, there are no nearby alternatives. In any age group, there are more than one teams worth of elite level players in San Diego county. The club with the monopoly also has less incentive to treat players well. Like ALL clubs, Surf has had issues with coaches and some teams/age groups were more effected than others. While Surf is currently the strongest club overall, at some age groups other clubs have stronger teams. LAGSD is the largest club in San Diego county. Does it really make sense to exclude them from elite level play?. Albion serves south San Diego better than either and with that being a prime growth area for young player, it also does not make sense to ignore. Even though it shares many of the same problems as ECNL, GDA is going to happen. GDA will have its problems, but I think for elite players in SoCal, it will be the best alternative in the near future. With only one more year of club soccer, it doesn't matter much anymore to us. Besides, if I were the ruler ECNL, GDA and DA would all be one big organization where the right group of players with an inspired coach could build a team to take on the world. Oh, and none of that would start until about U15. Youngers don't need to travel that far.

Residential academies are not a bad idea, but I think regional may be better. If SoCal had a regional residential academy, I bet it could turn out teams superior to the current youth "National Teams". Team work matters.


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> As I have said time and time again, I have nothing against GDA YET.  It's not a make or break for me. However, it sounds like it's something you've been begging for and you are finally in a position to get a patch of some sort . Most of the country will be underserved. That's a fact. No need to go back and forth. The map you provided earlier displayed the limited areas to which the GDA will cover. Also, thanks for the math lesson, BUT I am actually quite good at converting fractions; you however have already proven my point just by displaying
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory.
> 
> Enjoy the GDA patch...it's obvious you need it for validation.


Never said you had anything against GDA...I said you were attempting to promote ECNL. Rather than admit when you are wrong, you lash out at me. Sadly, you still have not learned...


shales1002 said:


> Most of the country will be underserved. That's a fact. No need to go back and forth. The map you provided earlier displayed the limited areas to which the GDA will cover.


Most of the country _will_ be served by GDA. Approaching 90%. It's not about land mass. It's about population density. Get it? Land mass does not participate in the sport...humans do. So I'm not sure why you keep saying GDA will be underserving the country.

As for my player's situation, who knows if she will even be offered a spot on an Academy team? Not sure if she is good enough. And if she is offered a spot, who knows if she will take it? She only has 1 year left, and she may want to play out her high school career. It is her call. Not mine. She has never chased a patch..quite the opposite.


----------



## Swoosh

shales1002 said:


> ... with the residential component the boy's side hasn't produced positive results on the world stage that  ECNL has produced on the girl's side.


You mean like the U20s beating Mexico 2-1 while being thoroughly outshot and thoroughly outplayed with superstar Pugh on the field?

I'd like to know what you consider as "positive results on the world stage" because that's the biggest gripe against ECNL.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> You mean like the U20s beating Mexico 2-1 while being thoroughly outshot and thoroughly outplayed with superstar Pugh on the field?
> 
> I'd like to know what you consider as "positive results on the world stage" because that's the biggest gripe against ECNL.


I disagree, it's rather silly to blame the U20s failure on ECNL.  I'm sure you are aware most of the U20s rostered players were college players.  Then shouldn't you be blaming D1 college soccer?  I don't, because Michelle French had a lot of time preparing this team.  She made ALL of the players redshirt this college season, except Ashley who is still in HS.  I blame the failure on the YNT coaches style of play and tactics, not the players.

In case you overlooked it.  Several of those U20 Mexican players played ECNL.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> I disagree, it's rather silly to blame the U20s failure on ECNL.  I'm sure you are aware most of the U20s rostered players are college players.  Then shouldn't you be blaming D1 college soccer?  I don't, because Michelle French had a lot of time preparing this team.  She even made the players redshirt this college season.  I blame the failure on the YNT coaches style of play and tactics.
> 
> In case you overlooked it.  Several of those U20 Mexican players played ECNL.


There are many failures for many reasons (U17 as well as U20) and not many successes like Shales claims.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> There are many failures for many reasons (U17 as well as U20) and not many successes like Shales claims.


Like I posted blame YNT coaches.  In this case blame BJ Snow's style of play and tactics.  He left off Taryn Torres (UVA commit) who was probably his most skillful player and pulled the strings during the 2 year undefeated run-up to the U17 World Cup.  Then when the games got tough reverted to defend and counter kick and run....same style as Michelle French.

Like all PRO sports.  If the team doesn't win you fire the coach, yet US soccer doesn't fire their YNT coaches.  Go figure!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> You mean like the U20s beating Mexico 2-1 while being thoroughly outshot and thoroughly outplayed with superstar Pugh on the field?
> 
> I'd like to know what you consider as "positive results on the world stage" because that's the biggest gripe against ECNL.


So now you are blaming the league?  What about the coaches that select the teams?  The U17 and U20 teams were not all of the best players.  Why else would they have high school aged kids on the team?  US Soccer f****d up and now we give them more control?  That's giving the inmates not only the keys to the asylum but letting them run the whole damn healthcare system.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Like I posted blame YNT coaches.  In this case blame BJ Snow's style of play and tactics.  He left off Taryn Torres (UVA commit) who was probably his most skillful player and pulled the strings during the 2 year undefeated run-up to the U17 World Cup.  Then when the games got tough reverted to defend and counter kick and run....same style as Michelle French.
> 
> Like all PRO sports.  If the team doesn't win you fire the coach, yet US soccer doesn't fire their YNT coaches.  Go figure!


Bingo.  It's the coaching and roster selection not the players.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> So now you are blaming the league?  What about the coaches that select the teams?  The U17 and U20 teams were not all of the best players.  Why else would they have high school aged kids on the team?  US Soccer f****d up and now we give them more control?  That's giving the inmates not only the keys to the asylum but letting them run the whole damn healthcare system.



You make my point:  not many successes on the world stage.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> MAP, I have no "anti-Surf" agenda. I am not in favor of monopolies however. The problem with one club controlling an area with a population as large as San Diego's is that if there are coaching problems with a team, there are no nearby alternatives. In any age group, there are more than one teams worth of elite level players in San Diego county. The club with the monopoly also has less incentive to treat players well. Like ALL clubs, Surf has had issues with coaches and some teams/age groups were more effected than others. While Surf is currently the strongest club overall, at some age groups other clubs have stronger teams. LAGSD is the largest club in San Diego county. Does it really make sense to exclude them from elite level play?. Albion serves south San Diego better than either and with that being a prime growth area for young player, it also does not make sense to ignore. Even though it shares many of the same problems as ECNL, GDA is going to happen. GDA will have its problems, but I think for elite players in SoCal, it will be the best alternative in the near future. With only one more year of club soccer, it doesn't matter much anymore to us. Besides, if I were the ruler ECNL, GDA and DA would all be one big organization where the right group of players with an inspired coach could build a team to take on the world. Oh, and none of that would start until about U15. Youngers don't need to travel that far.
> 
> Residential academies are not a bad idea, but I think regional may be better. If SoCal had a regional residential academy, I bet it could turn out teams superior to the current youth "National Teams". Team work matters.



Again you make some very valid points.  I really like the regional academy idea a lot.  I am not really that experienced with Albion.  They have decent teams but the only elite team I ever remember them having was the team that Noah Kooiman brought over from Arsenal (they were the first U14 ECNL national champs).  They fell off as several of their best players (Leah Pruitt, Julia Bingham, Marissa Everett, Ayana Robles) left for ECNL clubs that were closer once he took the team down south.  That was a real shame.

I agree that teamwork matters.  Maybe the problem is that there really should be separate competitive tracks for the truly elite players and the really good players.  GDA is going to have a bunch of really good players.  Even in SoCal only a handful per age group are truly elite and that is just the truth.  Just look at the 2016 graduating class.  Lots of players went on to have good first years of college but less than a dozen had a significant impact on the national scale and even fewer are still in the YNT pipeline.  GDA isn't going to solve this issue in SoCal.  With so many choices the teams are only going to be weaker than the top ECNL teams are now.

No worries.  As you said, your player only has one season left and mine isn't a youth player any longer.  Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> You make my point:  not many successes on the world stage.


Our full national team has done fine and our U20 team along with Germany and North Korea are the most successful programs in the world.  We did make it to the final 4 with horrible tactics and questionable player selection.  You sound like an Alabama fan.  Just because you didn't win it all doesn't mean that there weren't any successes.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> Our full national team has done fine and our U20 team along with Germany and North Korea are the most successful programs in the world.  We did make it to the final 4 with horrible tactics and questionable player selection.  You sound like an Alabama fan.  Just because you didn't win it all doesn't mean that there weren't any successes.


You're going off tangents.  ECNL=not many successes on the world stage as was claimed by the earlier poster.  For many reasons I'm sure we can point those out.  

U20 program overall success and full team success not much to do with last 7 years of ECNL influence.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> You're going off tangents.  ECNL=not many successes on the world stage as was claimed by the earlier poster.  For many reasons I'm sure we can point those out.
> 
> U20 program overall success and full team success not much to do with last 7 years of ECNL influence.


I get it you are a Legends homer but that doesn't make your point valid.  The ECNL is made up of clubs that had success in producing not only USYS championships but college and national team players.  Or to put it very slowly for you those players that were on the many successful U20(U19) WNT's and the full WNT played mostly for ECNL clubs.  Please look this stuff up so you don't sound silly to those that actually do the research.

Now here is a tangent.  How are your Trojan's looking?


----------



## bababooey

MakeAPlay said:


> because the ECNL picked its membership based primarily upon a club's history of winning USYS championships and producing college and national team players.


MAP: based on the statement you made above, how do you explain Strikers OC being a part of ECNL? To the best of my knowledge, they don't have a strong history of success or USWNT players.

I am not trying to pick a fight, just asking for edification purposes.


----------



## MakeAPlay

bababooey said:


> MAP: based on the statement you made above, how do you explain Strikers OC being a part of ECNL? To the best of my knowledge, they don't have a strong history of success or USWNT players.
> 
> I am not trying to pick a fight, just asking for edification purposes.


Irvine Strikers does have one USYS national championship in 2006.  Striker's OC is a spinoff.  If any club got screwed out of ECNL membership it was Laguna Hills Eclipse (they have 2 USYS championships prior to ECNL).  Here is a useful link that is pretty self explanatory.

http://www.calsouth.com/es/youth-champ-archive/usyouthsoccer-nationals/


----------



## MakeAPlay

Here is a cute article about Julie Foudy's team that won the first Cal South USYS national championship.

http://articles.latimes.com/1987-02-19/sports/sp-4134_1_laguna-hills


----------



## MakeAPlay

Another great article.  Things haven't changed that much...

http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jun/19/news/mn-48085/2


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Here is a cute article about Julie Foudy's team that won the first Cal South USYS national championship.
> 
> http://articles.latimes.com/1987-02-19/sports/sp-4134_1_laguna-hills


Does Southern Section still have that 5-player rule?


----------



## MakeAPlay

https://youth1.com/soccer/1360811-which-youth-clubs-produce-the-most-u-s-girl-national-team-players-

This is pretty self explanatory and I doubt that the GDA will change it.


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> Does Southern Section still have that 5-player rule?


I don't think so but I can't confirm that.  Nowadays with how spread out players are you would be hard pressed to get 5 elite players on a team from 4 graduating years let alone from one graduating class or team.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> Again you make some very valid points.  I really like the regional academy idea a lot.  I am not really that experienced with Albion.  They have decent teams but the only elite team I ever remember them having was the team that Noah Kooiman brought over from Arsenal (they were the first U14 ECNL national champs).  They fell off as several of their best players (Leah Pruitt, Julia Bingham, Marissa Everett, Ayana Robles) left for ECNL clubs that were closer once he took the team down south.  That was a real shame.
> 
> I agree that teamwork matters.  Maybe the problem is that there really should be separate competitive tracks for the truly elite players and the really good players.  GDA is going to have a bunch of really good players.  Even in SoCal only a handful per age group are truly elite and that is just the truth.  Just look at the 2016 graduating class.  Lots of players went on to have good first years of college but less than a dozen had a significant impact on the national scale and even fewer are still in the YNT pipeline.  GDA isn't going to solve this issue in SoCal.  With so many choices the teams are only going to be weaker than the top ECNL teams are now.
> 
> No worries.  As you said, your player only has one season left and mine isn't a youth player any longer.  Good luck to you and yours.


 I agree with the notion that GDA SoCal Conference will be watered down.  ECNL has 8 SoCal clubs, Strikers and Arsenal had a hard time fielding competitive teams.  GDA has what 14 clubs?  Even if we add, Legends, Beach, and Carlsbad into the count....that would total 9 competitive clubs minus Arsenal and Strikers.  There are 5 additional clubs that isn't needed in SoCal.


----------



## Round

outside! said:


> MAP, I have no "anti-Surf" agenda. I am not in favor of monopolies however. The problem with one club controlling an area with a population as large as San Diego's is that if there are coaching problems with a team, there are no nearby alternatives. In any age group, there are more than one teams worth of elite level players in San Diego county. The club with the monopoly also has less incentive to treat players well. Like ALL clubs, Surf has had issues with coaches and some teams/age groups were more effected than others. While Surf is currently the strongest club overall, at some age groups other clubs have stronger teams. LAGSD is the largest club in San Diego county. Does it really make sense to exclude them from elite level play?. Albion serves south San Diego better than either and with that being a prime growth area for young player, it also does not make sense to ignore. Even though it shares many of the same problems as ECNL, GDA is going to happen. GDA will have its problems, but I think for elite players in SoCal, it will be the best alternative in the near future. With only one more year of club soccer, it doesn't matter much anymore to us. Besides, if I were the ruler ECNL, GDA and DA would all be one big organization where the right group of players with an inspired coach could build a team to take on the world. Oh, and none of that would start until about U15. Youngers don't need to travel that far.
> 
> Residential academies are not a bad idea, but I think regional may be better. If SoCal had a regional residential academy, I bet it could turn out teams superior to the current youth "National Teams". Team work matters.


I am pretty sure that you are more altrustic about the whole issue than most here.  So far from what I have seen, the Albion inclusion is not so good for the majority of San Diego area players.  There just aren't enough kids/parents for this.  will see.  I suspect this will be a problem across the country.  Maybe this is best, a lot of mid level and unconnected clubs will probably have to change their modle.


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> Never said you had anything against GDA...I said you were attempting to promote ECNL. Rather than admit when you are wrong, you lash out at me. Sadly, you still have not learned...
> 
> 
> Most of the country _will_ be served by GDA. Approaching 90%. It's not about land mass. It's about population density. Get it? Land mass does not participate in the sport...humans do. So I'm not sure why you keep saying GDA will be underserving the country.
> 
> As for my player's situation, who knows if she will even be offered a spot on an Academy team? Not sure if she is good enough. And if she is offered a spot, who knows if she will take it? She only has 1 year left, and she may want to play out her high school career. It is her call. Not mine. She has never chased a patch..quite the opposite.



I am not promoting ECNL; I am merely making the point that US Soccer did not care for our girls until ECNL found a void and filled it. Now they feel the sense of urgency to take over because the ladies won the World Cup ???? 

It's okay for you to be label hungry especially if you haven't had one before. I know a lot of parents that chase them. Needless to say I perhaps I was wrong about geography and lesson needed is comprehension.


----------



## chargerfan

Round said:


> I am pretty sure that you are more altrustic about the whole issue than most here.  So far from what I have seen, the Albion inclusion is not so good for the majority of San Diego area players.  There just aren't enough kids/parents for this.  will see.  I suspect this will be a problem across the country.  Maybe this is best, a lot of mid level and unconnected clubs will probably have to change their modle.



What did you hear about Albion? I don't know anyone at that club currently but they are the only DA team in that area. They don't have elite teams this year but it seems like they could pick up from area clubs.


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> It's okay for you to be label hungry especially if you haven't had one before. I know a lot of parents that chase them. Needless to say I perhaps I was wrong about geography and lesson needed is comprehension.


Well, from those sentences, it is obvious that a basic English lesson is required. Good luck with that.


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> Well, from those sentences, it is obvious that a basic English lesson is required. Good luck with that.


I guess we both have some work to do. I can admit that I didn't proofread. But, if that's the only grammatical error that you found in all of my posts, I guess my Ph.D was well earned.

Remember your areas of remediation are geography and comprehension okay.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> I get it you are a Legends homer but that doesn't make your point valid.  The ECNL is made up of clubs that had success in producing not only USYS championships but college and national team players.  Or to put it very slowly for you those players that were on the many successful U20(U19) WNT's and the full WNT played mostly for ECNL clubs.  Please look this stuff up so you don't sound silly to those that actually do the research.
> 
> Now here is a tangent.  How are your Trojan's looking?


Where is the success of the ECNL era?  You do well to point out the past but you didn't pay attention to the original post.  I see zero success from the formation of ECNL.  We have gone backwards!  Korea and Japan run circles around us, and Mexico outplayed us!  U20 disaster...u17 disaster x2...World Cup champs yes but you can't credit ecnl for that one although I bet you might.  

Do you mean the Trojans that are sizing up their fingers?  Good luck this spring!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Where is the success of the ECNL era?  You do well to point out the past but you didn't pay attention to the original post.  I see zero success from the formation of ECNL.  We have gone backwards!  Korea and Japan run circles around us, and Mexico outplayed us!  U20 disaster...u17 disaster x2...World Cup champs yes but you can't credit ecnl for that one although I bet you might.
> 
> Do you mean the Trojans that are sizing up their fingers?  Good luck this spring!


Okay let's get your facts straight.  First let me point out the fact that the first class to actually go through the ECNL from start to finish just graduated high school last year and they for the most part didn't compete in the U17 or U20 WWC (they were U18/19).  A couple played up but it wasn't an age pure competition for them so it's a stretch to judge the success of the development platform with incomplete information.

Second, as I clearly stated the shortcomings in both WWC age groups had more to do with coaching and player selection than it had to do with a league.  They put together a U20 team good enough to make it to the semi finals with the clear knowledge that some of the preferred players had taken themselves out of contention.  There were some of the best players on the team but not all of them.  They had two years to build a team and with the federation calling the shots they failed.

Third, the U17's epic failure had everything to do with horrendous coaching and player selection.  Not to mention that they were lulled into thinking that they were invincible by their success against a schedule of mostly cupcakes.

Blaming a league for the failures of the federation are either just plain dumb or in the worst case malicious and insincere.  To think that the perpetrators of the failure are going to fix it from the top down with the GDAis laughable and Trumpian.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Do you mean the Trojans that are sizing up their fingers?  Good luck this spring!


Yeah those same Trojans.  Congrats they successfully kickballed and pummeled their way to the national championship!  Weird how you complain about it from the national teams but for your precious Trojans it is perfectly acceptable to play rugby/kickball.  I will be watching them very closely next year and let's see if they can do better than their 3-4 record against the other California schools.


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Where is the success of the ECNL era?   I see zero success from the formation of ECNL.
> 
> Do you mean the Trojans that are sizing up their fingers?  Good luck this spring!


USC has a lot of ECNL players, especially those who contributed a lot during this past championship season.

Morgan Andrews-FC Mass. Stars
Kayla Mills-Slammers
Sammy Prudhomme-SC Blues
Alex Anthony-Real Colorado
Julia Bingham-Slammers
Katie Johnson-Arsenal
Savannah Levin-Slammers
Leah Pruitt-Arsenal/WCFC
Nicole Molen-Real SoCal
Amanda Rooney-Albertson Elite

And almost all of USC's incoming 2017 class are ECNL players, but I don't credit ECNL for their development.  That belongs to the youth clubs they played for and why I don't blame ECNL players losing in the U17 and U20 WWC.


----------



## domestictravler

Swoosh said:


> Where is the success of the ECNL era?  You do well to point out the past but you didn't pay attention to the original post.  I see zero success from the formation of ECNL.  We have gone backwards!  Korea and Japan run circles around us, and Mexico outplayed us!  U20 disaster...u17 disaster x2...World Cup champs yes but you can't credit ecnl for that one although I bet you might.
> 
> Do you mean the Trojans that are sizing up their fingers?  Good luck this spring!


I agree with what you say, but I put partial blame on the ODP system that doesn't scout,  select, or train the proper youth players.  Years and Years of political games selecting by the recommendation of coaches have assisted in providing years and years of unsuccesful youth NT results.


----------



## The Driver

MakeAPlay said:


> Yeah those same Trojans.  Congrats they successfully kickballed and pummeled their way to the national championship!  Weird how you complain about it from the national teams but for your precious Trojans it is perfectly acceptable to play rugby/kickball.  I will be watching them very closely next year and let's see if they can do better than their 3-4 record against the other California schools.


How disrespectful you were in this post to a Natty. The way you described it was low-key Hater. A Natty Map you dissed a Natty?


----------



## Kicknit22

domestictravler said:


> I agree with what you say, but I put partial blame on the ODP system that doesn't scout,  select, or train the proper youth players.  Years and Years of political games selecting by the recommendation of coaches have assisted in providing years and years of unsuccesful youth NT results.


Nails it.


----------



## NoGoal

domestictravler said:


> I agree with what you say, but I put partial blame on the ODP system that doesn't scout,  select, or train the proper youth players.  Years and Years of political games selecting by the recommendation of coaches have assisted in providing years and years of unsuccesful youth NT results.


Careful, Swoosh's DD was a Cal-South ODP team and YNT player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

domestictravler said:


> I agree with what you say, but I put partial blame on the ODP system that doesn't scout,  select, or train the proper youth players.  Years and Years of political games selecting by the recommendation of coaches have assisted in providing years and years of unsuccesful youth NT results.


The proper players?  Wow.


----------



## NoGoal

domestictravler said:


> I agree with what you say, but I put partial blame on the ODP system that doesn't scout,  select, or train the proper youth players.  Years and Years of political games selecting by the recommendation of coaches have assisted in providing years and years of unsuccesful youth NT results.


Um, let me guess either your DD didn't get an Cal-South ODP invite or was cut during tryouts.


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> How disrespectful you were in this post to a Natty. The way you described it was low-key Hater. A Natty Map you dissed a Natty?


A hater?  You are very mistaken.  If my player had even considered that school they would have happily had her trust me compadre.  Yes they kickballed their way to a Natty.  There are several players on the Trojans that I personally like but the team doesn't play soccer and if it wasn't for Sammy Jo saving their ass in PK's we wouldn't even be having this conversation.  

I trust my eyes and when I saw them play in person this year they were clearly overmatched and played extremely physical.  Their record against teams from their home state was 3-4.  That is 3 wins and 4 losses against the teams that they are competing against for recruits.  They beat Stanford (literally they beat the crap out of them) which was their signature win and they succeeded in doing the same to several other teams. 

They did what they had to do to win but did you ever watch them play this year?  Do the ends justify the means in your eyes?  If so then you are going down a rabbit hole that won't lead to a great place.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Um, let me guess either your DD didn't get an Cal-South ODP invite or was cut during tryouts.


You forgot that she is better than the players on the team that won the ODP national championship.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> You forgot that she is better than the players on the team that won the ODP national championship.


My bad, I forgot his DD played for Legends!


----------



## domestictravler

NoGoal said:


> Careful, Swoosh's DD was a Cal-South ODP team and YNT player.


 I am discussing the process in selecting the ODP teams. It's more exclusive than inclusive due to Coaches making the recommendations. I am sure there are wonderful players on the ODP, but the results translate that it's a broken system.


----------



## The Driver

Map I said low-key. I am vegan on this forum NO Beef at all. I just find it strange when a team can muscle and kickball themselves to a Natty.


----------



## NoGoal

domestictravler said:


> I am discussing the process in selecting the ODP teams. It's more exclusive than inclusive due to Coaches making the recommendations. I am sure there are wonderful players on the ODP, but the results translate that it's a broken system.


Really? That's why ODP scouts are at ulittle national and state cup as well as at CRL events. Even if your DD wasn't recommended like mine wasn't.  It doesn't mean they can't stand-out on the pitch and receive an invite all on their own merits.  Then those players still have to tryout with over 130 girls to be named to a final 18 team with 4 alternates?  Please!


----------



## domestictravler

NoGoal said:


> Really? That's why ODP scouts are at ulittle national and state cup as well as at CRL events. Even if your DD wasn't recommended like mine wasn't.  It doesn't mean they can't stand-out on the pitch and receive an invite all on their own merits.  Then those players still have to tryout with over 130 girls to be named to a final 18 team with 4 alternates?  Please!


People need to get their head out of the sand, to actually realize, that there is a problem. Good Luck!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Really? That's why ODP scouts are at ulittle national and state cup as well as at CRL events. Even if your DD wasn't recommended like mine wasn't.  It doesn't mean they can't stand-out on the pitch and receive an invite all on their own merits.  Then those players still have to tryout with over 130 girls to be named to a final 18 team with 4 alternates?  Please!


With Girls DA coming Fall season.  Cal-South ODP will no longer field the best players anymore.


----------



## NoGoal

domestictravler said:


> People need to get their head out of the sand, to actually realize, that there is a problem. Good Luck!


You have no idea, because your DD hasn't gone through the process. #haters


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> Map I said low-key. I am vegan on this forum NO Beef at all. I just find it strange when a team can muscle and kickball themselves to a Natty.


I hear you.  It was a surprise to me that they were able to pull it off.  Just check out a replay of any of their tournament games especially the ones against Georgetown or West Virginia.  You want to see a team use it against them watch their games against Cal and UCLA.


----------



## NoGoal

domestictravler said:


> People need to get their head out of the sand, to actually realize, that there is a problem. Good Luck!


You're a 2003 ulittle parent who went to watch the A bracket at Vegas Cup this past weekend. You seriously clueless! Maybe you'll have better luck this Fall with Girls DA.


----------



## Kicknit22

NoGoal said:


> With Girls DA coming Fall season.  Cal-South ODP will no longer field the best players anymore.


Cal South ODP has NEVER fielded all the "best" players.  You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.  Excellent players, for sure, that can and usually do beat all other regions.  I will say "Some" of the best, to be fair.    I have said this before, Cal south could field multiple Allstar teams to go compete regionally, and finish as a group at the top.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicknit22 said:


> Cal South ODP has NEVER fielded all the "best" players.  You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.  Excellent players, for sure, that can and usually do beat all other regions.  I will say "Some" of the best, to be fair.    I have said this before, Cal south could field multiple Allstar teams to go compete regionally, and finish as a group at the top.


Ulittle parents need to understand and this applies to CRL, ECNL, ODP, ID2, PDP, YNT, college recruiting and soon Girls DA. A player being selected to any ID team or recruited for college soccer is based on a coaches player preference fitting their style of play.  If you are hating ODP now, you will hate on the college recruiting process.  It's all the same!


----------



## Kicknit22

NoGoal said:


> Ulittle parents need to understand and this applies to CRL, ECNL, ODP, ID2, PDP, YNT, and college recruiting.  A player being selected to any ID team or recruited for college soccer is based on a coaches players preference.  If you are hating ODP now, you will hate on the college recruiting process.  It's all the same!


Not hating on ODP, at all.  Just throwing some realism about it.  Just not a believer in the process or structure.  Been there, done that with one of mine.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> Cal South ODP has NEVER fielded all the "best" players.  You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.  Excellent players, for sure, that can and usually do beat all other regions.  I will say "Some" of the best, to be fair.    I have said this before, Cal south could field multiple Allstar teams to go compete regionally, and finish as a group at the top.


When my player was first in ODP it was 99% of the best players in her birth year.  When she was a junior in their last year of ODP about 6-8 players that should have been on the team opted out (mostly Slammers players) and one player who was a starter a year before didn't make the roster for some reason (and she was recently called into U23 WNT camp!).

ODP was good for my player and most of her national championship team has been called into at least one YNT camp.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> When my player was first in ODP it was 99% of the best players in her birth year.  When she was a junior in their last year of ODP about 6-8 players that should have been on the team opted out (mostly Slammers players) and one player who was a starter a year before didn't make the roster for some reason (and she was recently called into U23 WNT camp!).
> 
> ODP was good for my player and most of her national championship team has been called into at least one YNT camp.


Again, never said ODP wasn't good for players.  It certainly is.  Great for the resume.  But, no MAP, even for your players time, it did not represent 99% of the best.  That's your opinion.  Makes sense you would think so.  Even if ALL 18 + 4 went on to have decorated futures, doesn't make your assessment fact.  Sorry.


----------



## CaliKlines

Kicknit22 said:


> Not hating on ODP, at all.  Just throwing some realism about it.  Just not a believer in the process or structure.  Been there, done that with one of mine.


Kick, if you disagree with them you are labeled a "HATER" and your posts are denoted as "Dumb". It is actually kind of funny, if it weren't so juvenile. Just don't have an opinion and you'll be alright.


----------



## clueless parent

NoGoal said:


> I agree with the notion that GDA SoCal Conference will be watered down.  ECNL has 8 SoCal clubs, Strikers and Arsenal had a hard time fielding competitive teams.  GDA has what 14 clubs?  Even if we add, Legends, Beach, and Carlsbad into the count....that would total 9 competitive clubs minus Arsenal and Strikers.  There are 5 additional clubs that isn't needed in SoCal.


Are we talking about competition or development?   "GDA SoCal Conference will be watered down" seems to target competitiveness - that is, is it hard to beat teams within the GDA conference.  A challenging league schedule appears to be a hallmark of the ECNL league schedule.  Teams work hard to win each game.  This is a very team-centered paradigm.  The best teams in a given year become ECNL championship teams.

By contrast, the GDA purports to shift to a player-centered paradigm where team wins and losses are not the focus.  The process of player development is the measure for success, not championship teams.  The GDA wants to develop great players, which the GDA believes will lead to great national teams in the future.  The GDA purports to forego current team wins for the larger goal of creating great players to populate future national teams.

I think it is fair to say that the GDA will waterdown the SoCal team competitions when compared to the ECNL model of team championships.  The crux of the debate is whether great future national teams are created through player-centered development models (GDA) or through hard fought elite team competition such as the ECNL model.

We can agree that the GDA will develop a larger base of girls in SoCal over a four-year period (as compared to the smaller number of ECNL rosters).  Only time will tell if that larger development pool will yield a higher quality of player that GDA seems to want.  When the same clubs and coaches are merely shifting from ECNL to GDA, it seems far less likely that anything will change.  Thus, the focus on the competitiveness of the proposed GDA SoCal Conference.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Kick, if you disagree with them you are labeled a "HATER" and your posts are denoted as "Dumb". It is actually kind of funny, if it weren't so juvenile. Just don't have an opinion and you'll be alright.


Your another parent who's DD was never invited to tryout for the 1999 ODP team right.  It's why you thanked Domestictravelers post. 

Do you think your DD could have beaten out Brooke Reddington (Stanford commit) on the Cal-South G1999 team at holding mid?


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> I hear you.  It was a surprise to me that they were able to pull it off.  Just check out a replay of any of their tournament games especially the ones against Georgetown or West Virginia.  You want to see a team use it against them watch their games against Cal and UCLA.


There is plenty of ugly soccer being played at the college level (USC and SDSU come to mind). There is also plenty of ugly soccer at the elite youth level. I have seen ECNL championship games that were ugly kickball. I have also seen good possession teams reduced to playing kickball when they face an opponent that won't let them play their normal game.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> Again, never said ODP wasn't good for players.  It certainly is.  Great for the resume.  But, no MAP, even for your players time, it did not represent 99% of the best.  That's your opinion.  Makes sense you would think so.  Even if ALL 18 + 4 went on to have decorated futures, doesn't make your assessment fact.  Sorry.


If you say so.  We probably have different ideas of what elite is and I am looking in my rearview mirror.  You know what they say about hindsight being 20/20.  I have a very good understanding of the player pool that my player was in and I have seen every good or better team that was in her age group over the course of 10 years.  I know who the players are so you can think what you want to think.  You are probably one of those people that believe that there are hundreds of elite players in each age group in SoCal which simply isn't true.  Most players aren't elite.  Again there are >30 elite players per age group in all of SoCal and there are maybe 5-7 that are special.  Here is something that will help you figure out who the elite players are https://sites.google.com/site/soccerrecruits/.  The ones that are 2019's and already committed to the top schools.  Not a lot per age group at this early a stage.

I'm not going to debate this with you as you are speculating and really don't have any experience to draw on.  Cheers.


----------



## NoGoal

clueless parent said:


> Are we talking about competition or development?   "GDA SoCal Conference will be watered down" seems to target competitiveness - that is, is it hard to beat teams within the GDA conference.  A challenging league schedule appears to be a hallmark of the ECNL league schedule.  Teams work hard to win each game.  This is a very team-centered paradigm.  The best teams in a given year become ECNL championship teams.
> 
> By contrast, the GDA purports to shift to a player-centered paradigm where team wins and losses are not the focus.  The process of player development is the measure for success, not championship teams.  The GDA wants to develop great players, which the GDA believes will lead to great national teams in the future.  The GDA purports to forego current team wins for the larger goal of creating great players to populate future national teams.
> 
> I think it is fair to say that the GDA will waterdown the SoCal team competitions when compared to the ECNL model of team championships.  The crux of the debate is whether great future national teams are created through player-centered development models (GDA) or through hard fought elite team competition such as the ECNL model.
> 
> We can agree that the GDA will develop a larger base of girls in SoCal over a four-year period (as compared to the smaller number of ECNL rosters).  Only time will tell if that larger development pool will yield a higher quality of player that GDA seems to want.  When the same clubs and coaches are merely shifting from ECNL to GDA, it seems far less likely that anything will change.  Thus, the focus on the competitiveness of the proposed GDA SoCal Conference.


And tell me what were the results of the US Soccer trained U17 and U20 teams? The US Soccer coaches trained these girls almost once a week, every month for the last 2 years with their so called best practice methods. 

You actually believe, since US Soccer is heading Girls DA that club coaches will train and develop their players differently?  Girls DA is comprised of 80% of the same ECNL clubs.

For 99% of Girls DA players the goal will be college soccer.  The net net is players and parents will continue to place their kids where they will get the maximum college exposure.  In this case with 15 Girls DA clubs, it will boil down to who is fully subsidized and/or get their players committed to the best university relative to scholarship offers and team competitivness.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Kick, if you disagree with them you are labeled a "HATER" and your posts are denoted as "Dumb". It is actually kind of funny, if it weren't so juvenile. Just don't have an opinion and you'll be alright.


Cali you are ridiculous.  You disagree with anything that isn't pro Legends.  You really have no original thoughts.  You used to be rah rah for the Strikers and when you left the ECNL you changed your tune.  You are comic relief and don't even realize it.  You should go into politics.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> There is plenty of ugly soccer being played at the college level (USC and SDSU come to mind). There is also plenty of ugly soccer at the elite youth level. I have seen ECNL championship games that were ugly kickball. I have also seen good possession teams reduced to playing kickball when they face an opponent that won't let them play their normal game.


Oh man....you posted the natty USC plays ugly soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

clueless parent said:


> Are we talking about competition or development?   "GDA SoCal Conference will be watered down" seems to target competitiveness - that is, is it hard to beat teams within the GDA conference.  A challenging league schedule appears to be a hallmark of the ECNL league schedule.  Teams work hard to win each game.  This is a very team-centered paradigm.  The best teams in a given year become ECNL championship teams.
> 
> By contrast, the GDA purports to shift to a player-centered paradigm where team wins and losses are not the focus.  The process of player development is the measure for success, not championship teams.  The GDA wants to develop great players, which the GDA believes will lead to great national teams in the future.  The GDA purports to forego current team wins for the larger goal of creating great players to populate future national teams.
> 
> I think it is fair to say that the GDA will waterdown the SoCal team competitions when compared to the ECNL model of team championships.  The crux of the debate is whether great future national teams are created through player-centered development models (GDA) or through hard fought elite team competition such as the ECNL model.
> 
> We can agree that the GDA will develop a larger base of girls in SoCal over a four-year period (as compared to the smaller number of ECNL rosters).  Only time will tell if that larger development pool will yield a higher quality of player that GDA seems to want.  When the same clubs and coaches are merely shifting from ECNL to GDA, it seems far less likely that anything will change.  Thus, the focus on the competitiveness of the proposed GDA SoCal Conference.


Then are you saying that the boys DA is watered down in SoCal?  They sure seem to be focused on winning the DA championships.  Are you really buying into the marketing pitch that they are looking to develop more national team players?  All but one national team player got there through their performances in college and then the pros and that is a fact.  The YNT pipeline did nothing to develop these players.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Kick, if you disagree with them you are labeled a "HATER" and your posts are denoted as "Dumb". It is actually kind of funny, if it weren't so juvenile. Just don't have an opinion and you'll be alright.


Cali you remind me of Anakin Skywalker.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> If you say so.  We probably have different ideas of what elite is and I am looking in my rearview mirror.  You know what they say about hindsight being 20/20.  I have a very good understanding of the player pool that my player was in and I have seen every good or better team that was in her age group over the course of 10 years.  I know who the players are so you can think what you want to think.  You are probably one of those people that believe that there are hundreds of elite players in each age group in SoCal which simply isn't true.  Most players aren't elite.  Again there are >30 elite players per age group in all of SoCal and there are maybe 5-7 that are special.  Here is something that will help you figure out who the elite players are https://sites.google.com/site/soccerrecruits/.  The ones that are 2019's and already committed to the top schools.  Not a lot per age group at this early a stage.
> 
> I'm not going to debate this with you as you are speculating and really don't have any experience to draw on.  Cheers.


Don't care to debate either.  Particularly with someone that is full of assumptions and thinks they know all.  BTW, if you can't get the symbol right, just say "less than" <.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> There is plenty of ugly soccer being played at the college level (USC and SDSU come to mind). There is also plenty of ugly soccer at the elite youth level. I have seen ECNL championship games that were ugly kickball. I have also seen good possession teams reduced to playing kickball when they face an opponent that won't let them play their normal game.


We are in agreement.  I've seen some serious crap.  I have also seen to possession teams battle it out and have it decided on a golden goal.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Cali you remind me of Anakin Skywalker.


I just spit my drink out on my desk!  That is soooo funny.  And true...


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> Don't care to debate either.  Particularly with someone that is full of assumptions and thinks they know all.  BTW, if you can't get the symbol right, just say "less than" <.


I never said I know it all just that you don't know my players peers and I do.  You can think what you want.  I don't care.  My player is in good hands and is in the pipeline for what YOU think DA is going to achieve.  I hope that it works out for your player.  I have proven many people wrong on this forum over the last 6 or so years and I accurately predicted at 12 where my player was going to be at 18.  Not to mention I predicted what would happen with the ECNL split years ago too.  My record is pretty good.  

I promise that I won't say I told you so.  Let's hope that yours is still playing at U16.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I just spit my drink out on my desk!  That is soooo funny.  And true...


Funny like the ACC being a stronger conference than the Pac12 the last 6 years. LOL!


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> And tell me what were the results of the US Soccer trained U17 and U20 teams? The US Soccer coaches trained these girls almost once a week, every month for the last 2 years with their so called best practice methods.
> 
> You actually believe, since US Soccer is heading Girls DA that club coaches will train and develop their players differently?  Girls DA is comprised of 80% of the same ECNL clubs.
> 
> For 99% of Girls DA players the goal will be college soccer.  The net net is players and parents will continue to place their kids where they will get the maximum college exposure.  In this case with 15 Girls DA clubs, it will boil down to who is fully subsidized and/or get their players committed to the best university relative to scholarship offers and team competitivness.


The ECNL clubs that signed up for DA have agreed to changing how they develop and train the players. It was a big part of the meetings, requirements, and agreements for the clubs joining GDA. Everything from training program to coaching credentials; so, I believe he/she has a right to believe. My DD trained with 4 of the top 4 SoCal ECNL teams multiple times and only 1 actually trained the girls and corrected issues. One coach sat on his cell phone for 90% of 3 practices she attended while the girls scrimmaged playing their kickball crap. I can only see things getting better IMO.


----------



## clueless parent

MakeAPlay said:


> Then are you saying that the boys DA is watered down in SoCal?  They sure seem to be focused on winning the DA championships.  Are you really buying into the marketing pitch that they are looking to develop more national team players?  All but one national team player got there through their performances in college and then the pros and that is a fact.  The YNT pipeline did nothing to develop these players.


MakeAPlay, I do not know anything about the boys DA.  Thus, I will not foolishly respond to a question of which I know nothing.

The DA marketing pitch is that they want to develop more players.  But I am NOT buying it until I see it.  Let's see what effect the GDA has over these ECNL coaches/clubs.

Since this is a blog, I will allow myself to dream a bit.  I like the concept that the GDA aims to develop a larger number of girls during the high school years.  In my opinion, there is too much early sorting of girls.  This has been especially true in markets where a single ECNL club monopolized the market.  There is a saying that power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.  It sounds as though your daughter is a unicorn.  No doubt she has always belonged at the top of the pyramid.  I love your rear-view mirror perspective.  Looking back, do you see any girls that were on your daughter's ECNL teams (Surf in San Diego?) that may not have been the most qualified?  Looking back, do you see any girls that were overlooked by your daughter's ECNL team?  If there were any overlooked girls, do thing the GDA would have netted them?  Truly looking forward to hearing your thoughts.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> The ECNL clubs that signed up for DA have agreed to changing how they develop and train the players. It was a big part of the meetings, requirements, and agreements for the clubs joining GDA. Everything from training program to coaching credentials; so, I believe he/she has a right to believe. My DD trained with 4 of the top 4 SoCal ECNL teams multiple times and only 1 actually trained the girls and corrected issues. One coach sat on his cell phone for 90% of 3 practices she attended while the girls scrimmaged playing their kickball crap. I can only see things getting better IMO.


Please tell me, for the last decade do all of the Boys DA teams play and train the same also?  Doubt it!

IMO, what the clubs will follow are the 2 training days, 1 film/class session and 1 conditioning day per week. 

The 2 ECNL clubs my DD have been part of.  Her coaches were never on the phone during practice.


----------



## NoGoal

clueless parent said:


> MakeAPlay, I do not know anything about the boys DA.  Thus, I will not foolishly respond to a question of which I know nothing.
> 
> The DA marketing pitch is that they want to develop more players.  But I am NOT buying it until I see it.  Let's see what effect the GDA has over these ECNL coaches/clubs.
> 
> Since this is a blog, I will allow myself to dream a bit.  I like the concept that the GDA aims to develop a larger number of girls during the high school years.  In my opinion, there is too much early sorting of girls.  This has been especially true in markets where a single ECNL club monopolized the market.  There is a saying that power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.  It sounds as though your daughter is a unicorn.  No doubt she has always belonged at the top of the pyramid.  I love your rear-view mirror perspective.  Looking back, do you see any girls that were on your daughter's ECNL teams (Surf in San Diego?) that may not have been the most qualified?  Looking back, do you see any girls that were overlooked by your daughter's ECNL team?  If there were any overlooked girls, do thing the GDA would have netted them?  Truly looking forward to hearing your thoughts.


I don't know about MAP, but from my very own experience.  My own DD was over looked, but my wife and I didn't blame the league or club.  As I posted prior, player selection is based on a coaches preference.  Instead we told our DD to use it as motivation as a chip on her shoulder to work harder and improve her game.


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/growing-list-of-youth-clubs-reconsider-decline-girls-da-membership/


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> The ECNL clubs that signed up for DA have agreed to changing how they develop and train the players. It was a big part of the meetings, requirements, and agreements for the clubs joining GDA. Everything from training program to coaching credentials; so, I believe he/she has a right to believe. My DD trained with 4 of the top 4 SoCal ECNL teams multiple times and only 1 actually trained the girls and corrected issues. One coach sat on his cell phone for 90% of 3 practices she attended while the girls scrimmaged playing their kickball crap. I can only see things getting better IMO.


Mine played on two ECNL teams and I never saw the coach even take his phone out of his pocket.  I still talk to one of the coaches all of the time.  It sounds like a coaching problem.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> Mine played on two ECNL teams and I never saw the coach even take his phone out of his pocket.  I still talk to one of the coaches all of the time.  It sounds like a coaching problem.


Nah, it's a club/league problem and Girls DA will fix it ALL.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> I never said I know it all just that you don't know my players peers and I do.  You can think what you want.  I don't care.  My player is in good hands and is in the pipeline for what YOU think DA is going to achieve.  I hope that it works out for your player.  I have proven many people wrong on this forum over the last 6 or so years and I accurately predicted at 12 where my player was going to be at 18.  Not to mention I predicted what would happen with the ECNL split years ago too.  My record is pretty good.
> 
> I promise that I won't say I told you so.  Let's hope that yours is still playing at U16.


Oh, MAP.  Again with the assumptions!  Show me a post of mine where I even mention what DA is going to achieve.  You DO care what I think, as well as what anyone else thinks.  It's why you can't help but keep responding and debating.  I don't know you or your daughter (player?) nor do I care to.  I applaud the accomplishments of your daughter, though.  We see things differently, that's all.  No amount of rhetoric you come up with will change that.  Your circle agrees with you, I'm confident of that. Peace.


----------



## MakeAPlay

clueless parent said:


> MakeAPlay, I do not know anything about the boys DA.  Thus, I will not foolishly respond to a question of which I know nothing.
> 
> The DA marketing pitch is that they want to develop more players.  But I am NOT buying it until I see it.  Let's see what effect the GDA has over these ECNL coaches/clubs.
> 
> Since this is a blog, I will allow myself to dream a bit.  I like the concept that the GDA aims to develop a larger number of girls during the high school years.  In my opinion, there is too much early sorting of girls.  This has been especially true in markets where a single ECNL club monopolized the market.  There is a saying that power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.  It sounds as though your daughter is a unicorn.  No doubt she has always belonged at the top of the pyramid.  I love your rear-view mirror perspective.  Looking back, do you see any girls that were on your daughter's ECNL teams (Surf in San Diego?) that may not have been the most qualified?  Looking back, do you see any girls that were overlooked by your daughter's ECNL team?  If there were any overlooked girls, do thing the GDA would have netted them?  Truly looking forward to hearing your thoughts.


Here is what I saw.  There were definitely girls on my player's team that were in over their head but they still got college scholarships so what do I know.  There were definitely players that were top notch that played on other teams outside of the ECNL for various reasons but not because they were overlooked.  Selfishly I would only want elite players playing with my daughter so if I was just starting this journey I would have probably wanted her to be in the GDA.  Realistically, even if everyone is talented you need chiefs and you need Indians to have a successful team.  

My selection of teams for my player had nothing to do with the ECNL it was all about the coach.  I took the position that I knew she had the athletic and mental gifts to be a top level athlete in whatever she chose as her primary sport.  She had the tools for success and just needed the right coach to get her there.  My analogy that I used to tell her is that she had the ingredients to be a chocolate cake and that we just needed the right chef to put them all together.  This was when she was on the "B" team of a very successful club playing in the Bronze flight.  I didn't like the coach at the club that she was at but we were fairly new and I was unaware of the non-soccer BS that exists in club soccer.  I also noticed that the coach in the club with the highest licensing, best resume as a player and a coach was coaching the "C" teams!  That confused me and they wouldn't let me put her on that team yet the coach of the "A" team never gave her a shot.  About a year later she ripped the "A" team a new one playing for her eventual club.  The coach even asked who she was and one of his players told them she used to be on the "B" team and had been at tryouts the year before.  That taught me three things.  First, beauty is in the eye of the beholder so find a coach that sees the beauty in your player.  Second, the only loyalty that matters is to your player because a coach/DOC/club/federation care about their agenda and not about your kid.  Finally, it's all about having a quality coach.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicknit22 said:


> Cal South ODP has NEVER fielded all the "best" players.  You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.  Excellent players, for sure, that can and usually do beat all other regions.  I will say "Some" of the best, to be fair.    I have said this before, Cal south could field multiple Allstar teams to go compete regionally, and finish as a group at the top.


IMO they are fielding the "best players", but the coaches are picking the "best players" who will help them "WIN" the Regional and National Championships at the present.  They are not projecting 2-3 years from now.  I have posted this in the old forum several years back.  If Cal-South fielded 2 ODP teams, the 2 teams in the Regional finals would be the Cal-South teams.

I have witness the final 36 player selections at Summer and Winter camps.  At the camp the coaches eventually divide the players into A team (1-18) and B team (19-36).  The teams then girls scrimmage each other for 30 minutes. Those games always end in a 1 goal difference.  The parents, I always hear complain about ODP selecting the same players, eventually their DDs never make the final 18 roster.  The parents who's kid kept working hard, eventually did.  Yes, each year Cal South assigns a new coach and the incumbent players have a HUGE advantage, but believe it or not.  I have seen girls work their way to the first team and vice versa for some A team players being cycled out.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> Here is what I saw.  There were definitely girls on my player's team that were in over their head but they still got college scholarships so what do I know.  There were definitely players that were top notch that played on other teams outside of the ECNL for various reasons but not because they were overlooked.  Selfishly I would only want elite players playing with my daughter so if I was just starting this journey I would have probably wanted her to be in the GDA.  Realistically, even if everyone is talented you need chiefs and you need Indians to have a successful team.
> 
> My selection of teams for my player had nothing to do with the ECNL it was all about the coach.  I took the position that I knew she had the athletic and mental gifts to be a top level athlete in whatever she chose as her primary sport.  She had the tools for success and just needed the right coach to get her there.  My analogy that I used to tell her is that she had the ingredients to be a chocolate cake and that we just needed the right chef to put them all together.  This was when she was on the "B" team of a very successful club playing in the Bronze flight.  I didn't like the coach at the club that she was at but we were fairly new and I was unaware of the non-soccer BS that exists in club soccer.  I also noticed that the coach in the club with the highest licensing, best resume as a player and a coach was coaching the "C" teams!  That confused me and they wouldn't let me put her on that team yet the coach of the "A" team never gave her a shot.  About a year later she ripped the "A" team a new one playing for her eventual club.  The coach even asked who she was and one of his players told them she used to be on the "B" team and had been at tryouts the year before.  That taught me three things.  First, beauty is in the eye of the beholder so find a coach that sees the beauty in your player.  Second, the only loyalty that matters is to your player because a coach/DOC/club/federation care about their agenda and not about your kid.  Finally, it's all about having a quality coach.


Love the story, MAP.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> Oh, MAP.  Again with the assumptions!  Show me a post of mine where I even mention what DA is going to achieve.  You DO care what I think, as well as what anyone else thinks.  It's why you can't help but keep responding and debating.  I don't know you or your daughter (player?) nor do I care to.  I applaud the accomplishments of your daughter, though.  We see things differently, that's all.  No amount of rhetoric you come up with will change that.  Your circle agrees with you, I'm confident of that. Peace.


I don't care what you or anyone else on this forum thinks.


----------



## clueless parent

MakeAPlay said:


> First, beauty is in the eye of the beholder so find a coach that sees the beauty in your player. Second, the only loyalty that matters is to your player because a coach/DOC/club/federation care about their agenda and not about your kid. Finally, it's all about having a quality coach.


MakeAPlay, this is quote is a keeper.  Thanks.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> I don't care what you or anyone else on this forum thinks.


Fix it?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> Love the story, MAP.


Thanks.  I call it as I see it.


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> Nah, it's a club/league problem and Girls DA will fix it ALL.


I love people who throw out such statements as you just made. It says a lot about who you are in many ways.


----------



## shales1002

NoGoal said:


> With Girls DA coming Fall season.  Cal-South ODP will no longer field the best players anymore.


I can finally agree to something.


----------



## CaliKlines

shales1002 said:


> I can finally agree to something.


Now let's get you to agree that GDA provides a playing opportunity for most of the players in the United States. That'd be real progress.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> I love people who throw out such statements as you just made. It says a lot about who you are in many ways.


Sure, yet I'm not the one complaining in this thread am I. Unlike yourself and others blaming a league, ODP program and/or the YNT players for YNT WC failures.  Like other players could have done better, they would have failed as well with the same YNT coaches at the helm.


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> I'm not the one complaining in this thread. Unlike others blaming such as yourself, blaming a league, ODP program and or the players for YNT failures.


Ok, I'll bite - please refer me to a post where I was blaming as I am old and might not remember.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Ok, I'll bite - please refer me to a post where I was blaming as I am old and might not remember.


You're a big boy and can do it yourself!


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> You're a big boy and can do it yourself!


I cannot do the impossible. Again, another post that says a lot about you.


----------



## MarkM

NoGoal said:


> I agree with the notion that GDA SoCal Conference will be watered down.  ECNL has 8 SoCal clubs, Strikers and Arsenal had a hard time fielding competitive teams.  GDA has what 14 clubs?  Even if we add, Legends, Beach, and Carlsbad into the count....that would total 9 competitive clubs minus Arsenal and Strikers.  There are 5 additional clubs that isn't needed in SoCal.


SoCal ECNL clubs play in the SW conference with 11 teams, not just in SoCal.  There are 14 teams in the GDA conference.  That's three more clubs in the conference.  The move also takes clubs out of NV and AZ, two weak clubs in ECNL with small populations (I am speaking generally) and replace them with SoCal clubs/kids with areas not served by ECNL.  Even assuming pure age groups, the competition won't be materially different.


----------



## MarkM

domestictravler said:


> I am discussing the process in selecting the ODP teams. It's more exclusive than inclusive due to Coaches making the recommendations. I am sure there are wonderful players on the ODP, but the results translate that it's a broken system.


ODP is designed to be exclusive.  Don't coaches decide who makes a team in all sports?  And what results are you referring to?  SoCal dominated Region IV.


----------



## MarkM

MakeAPlay said:


> I don't care what you or anyone else on this forum thinks.


Thanks for making me laugh on a depressing day.


----------



## Swoosh

MakeAPlay said:


> Okay let's get your facts straight.  First let me point out the fact that the first class to actually go through the ECNL from start to finish just graduated high school last year and they for the most part didn't compete in the U17 or U20 WWC (they were U18/19).  A couple played up but it wasn't an age pure competition for them so it's a stretch to judge the success of the development platform with incomplete information.
> 
> Second, as I clearly stated the shortcomings in both WWC age groups had more to do with coaching and player selection than it had to do with a league.  They put together a U20 team good enough to make it to the semi finals with the clear knowledge that some of the preferred players had taken themselves out of contention.  There were some of the best players on the team but not all of them.  They had two years to build a team and with the federation calling the shots they failed.
> 
> Third, the U17's epic failure had everything to do with horrendous coaching and player selection.  Not to mention that they were lulled into thinking that they were invincible by their success against a schedule of mostly cupcakes.
> 
> Blaming a league for the failures of the federation are either just plain dumb or in the worst case malicious and insincere.  To think that the perpetrators of the failure are going to fix it from the top down with the GDAis laughable and Trumpian.


*On first point:*
Agreed, nice to agree for a change.  Although I wasn't arguing for the failure of ECNL, I was only stating that there haven't been the successes that the poster claimed.  Maybe more time is needed, although my personal opinion is that we would continue to fall behind.

*On second point:*
Coaching was bad...no doubt there.  But I don't believe that the players left behind make any significant impact to that fact that Korea and Japan are heads and shoulders above the USA in individual quality. 

*On third point:*
See point above. 

_*And lastly:*_
*The best thing about the GDA is that this is US Soccer's last card left to play, nowhere left to point fingers.  I do agree with you that they are utterly failing on both the men and the women's sides.  And don't get me started on MLS.*


----------



## younothat

There are hundreds of thousands of players in the US that don't even know about GDA exist or have any clue about the program.  There are players hundreds of miles away from a club that has GDA or DA

There is 16-20 players per team per age group x 5 teams or whatever a club has.   This is a very small group of soccer players in USA and most of the players are already playing club soccer so don't let what SoCAL has in density and availability skew you into thinking the rest of country is like that.

Give GDA some time, ten years from now we will see how many players are in the program.   AYSO,  local leagues, High School is what's available to most players in the US.   Club soccer and these other leagues only get a small % of players due to many factors.

I'm a support of ussda and ECNL, been good to both my kids but I know many others who wanted to play in those leagues and have the skills to do so but their families couldn't find a way to make that happen for various reasons.  Be happy for your kid(s) if you have the disposable income & can support the 3-4 weeks of training, travel,  games schedule, etc.


----------



## NoGoal

MarkM said:


> SoCal ECNL clubs play in the SW conference with 11 teams, not just in SoCal.  There are 14 teams in the GDA conference.  That's three more clubs in the conference.  The move also takes clubs out of NV and AZ, two weak clubs in ECNL with small populations (I am speaking generally) and replace them with SoCal clubs/kids with areas not served by ECNL.  Even assuming pure age groups, the competition won't be materially different.


SoCal kids not served by ECNL clubs?  The only area is the South Bay/LB area.  Yet, the best players from that area commute to OC clubs.  I do admit ECNL should have given Beach FC affiliation years ago.

I admit, I didn't realize the AZ club was part of the Southwest Girls DA club count.  SoCal Girls DA clubs will have 13 clubs while ECNL has 6 competitive clubs, add Legend, Beach and Carlsbad and we still have only 9 competitive clubs.  4 more than needed and it will water down the competition.  There aren't that many elite players in SoCal as many ulittle posters want to believe.  I have been there done that and reality doesn't hit home for families until their DDs are Juniors in HS.  Believe or not as the girls get older, the players who don't improve are weeded out, play another sport, discover boys, stop playing because they aren't recruited by the universities they targeted, get burned out, constant injuries, etc.  Yet, I understand ulittle parents will have to experience it themselves to understand what will happen.  Girls DA isn't going to get more girls college scholarships, but good luck trying.


----------



## shales1002

CaliKlines said:


> Now let's get you to agree that GDA provides a playing opportunity for most of the players in the United States. That'd be real progress.


Not at all on GDA. They provide opportunity to SoCal .


----------



## MarkM

NoGoal said:


> SoCal kids not served by ECNL clubs?  The only area is the South Bay/LB area.  Yet, the best players from that area commute to OC clubs.  I do admit ECNL should have given Beach FC affiliation years ago.
> 
> I admit, I didn't realize the AZ club was part of the Southwest Girls DA club count.  SoCal Girls DA clubs will have 13 clubs while ECNL has 6 competitive clubs, add Legend, Beach and Carlsbad and we still have only 9 competitive clubs.  4 more than needed and it will water down the competition.  There aren't that many elite players in SoCal as many ulittle posters want to believe.  I have been there done that and reality doesn't hit home for families until their DDs are Juniors in HS.  Believe or not as the girls get older, the players who don't improve are weeded out, play another sport, discover boys, stop playing because they aren't recruited by the universities they targeted, get burned out, constant injuries, etc.  Yet, I understand ulittle parents will have to experience it themselves to understand what will happen.  Girls DA isn't going to get more girls college scholarships, but good luck trying.


You are right, anytime you add spots, it will reduce the overall "quality" of the competition.  I still don't think that it will be material.  Arizona will be better, for example.  But the overall league should be more competitive even if the quality is marginally worse - all the top girls are still going to play GDA.  It looks like the additional practice days are going to force more kids to stick around at their local clubs.  It's going to spread the talent around better.  It's really seems like a trade-off - more competitive games, but perhaps reduced quality.  I would reference the landscape pre-ECNL - there are more competitive teams until ECNL sucks all the other kids up.

One caveat to your list, LA Galaxy will do well - very good coaching and they have top pre-ECNL teams.

Out of curiosity, which ECNL club(s) do you perceive serve west, central, and east Los Angeles?


----------



## NoGoal

MarkM said:


> You are right, anytime you add spots, it will reduce the overall "quality" of the competition.  I still don't think that it will be material.  Arizona will be better, for example.  But the overall league should be more competitive even if the quality is marginally worse - all the top girls are still going to play GDA.  It looks like the additional practice days are going to force more kids to stick around at their local clubs.  It's going to spread the talent around better.  It's really seems like a trade-off - more competitive games, but perhaps reduced quality.  I would reference the landscape pre-ECNL - there are more competitive teams until ECNL sucks all the other kids up.
> 
> One caveat to your list, LA Galaxy will do well - very good coaching and they have top pre-ECNL teams.
> 
> Out of curiosity, which ECNL club(s) do you perceive serve west, central, and east Los Angeles?


West LA they commute to RSC.  Some in the Santa Monica even commute to Eagles that I know of.  As for East LA,  they probably commute to the OC or don't play ECNL.  Then again I don't know to many elite girls playing club soccer who live in the east LA and central LA area and is most likely correlated to affordability.  For those unserved area's a player could be a discovery player for an ECNL team too.

LA Galaxy will do well, because they are going to fully subsidize their Girls DA teams (According to this forum).

I do remember the CSL Premier days when a small club can earn their way to the 12 invited spots.  Then again, if you look at the CSL Premier past history.  It was the same elite girls club; Blues, Slammers, RSC, Eagles, Laguna Hills Eclipse and in some cases the B teams from those clubs would earn their way to Premier.  Not to mention when a team was relegated from Premier, the best players would move to the clubs who weren't relegated.  Surf was still the gorilla in San Diego Presidio League.

The net is the players will still end up at the clubs who place the most girls in college soccer.  A 45min to 1 hour commute isn't going to change that.


----------



## soccerobserver

NoGoal said:


> West LA they commute to RSC.  Some in the Santa Monica even commute to Eagles that I know of.  As for East LA,  they probably commute to the OC or don't play ECNL.  Then again I don't know to many elite girls playing club soccer who live in the east LA and central LA area and is most likely correlated to affordability.  For those unserved area's a player could be a discovery player for an ECNL team too.
> 
> LA Galaxy will do well, because they are going to fully subsidize their Girls DA teams (According to this forum).
> 
> I do remember the CSL Premier days when a small club can earn their way to the 12 invited spots.  Then again, if you look at the CSL Premier past history.  It was the same elite girls club; Blues, Slammers, RSC, Eagles, Laguna Hills Eclipse and in some cases the B teams from those clubs would earn their way to Premier.  Not to mention when a team was relegated from Premier, the best players would move to the clubs who weren't relegated.  Surf was still the gorilla in San Diego Presidio League.
> 
> The net is the players will still end up at the clubs who place the most girls in college soccer.  A 45min to 1 hour commute isn't going to change that.


GDA's expansion doesn't provide much relief to players from west LA who desire to play at the most ultimate levels. The inclusion of LAPFC will help provide local opportunity to play at the elite level for players in the Pasadena/La Canada/San Gabriel Valley areas. No such luck for westsiders. The commute from WLA to RSC via the 405N and then the 101N is beyond brutal. What I find interesting is that one club in WLA saw it's girls side more than double in size _after_ ECNL was formed. This was counter intuitive since it was assumed that female players would depart the westside soccer clubs to join RSC from west LA.


----------



## NoGoal

soccerobserver said:


> GDA's expansion doesn't provide much relief to players from west LA who desire to play at the most ultimate levels. The inclusion of LAPFC will help provide local opportunity to play at the elite level for players in the Pasadena/La Canada/San Gabriel Valley areas. No such luck for westsiders. The commute from WLA to RSC via the 405N and then the 101N is beyond brutal. What I find interesting is that one club in WLA saw it's girls side more than double in size _after_ ECNL was formed. This was counter intuitive since it was assumed that female players would depart the westside soccer clubs to join RSC from west LA.


I know top players from the San Gabriel Valley, cities like West Covina, Arcadia, Duarte are either traveling East to Legends (traffic), West to RSC (210 fwy) or South (57 fwy) to the OC.  Ashley Sanchez comes to mind as she lives in the San Gabriel Valley and started at a local club, then Legends and finally at Blues.  I also know of several others residing in the same vacinity and their DDs commute to Slammers, Albion OC, WCFC and Blues.  It's not a bad commute, because once on the 57 fwy there is the carpool lane and traveling south (opposite traffic).


----------



## soccerobserver

NoGoal said:


> I know top players from the San Gabriel Valley, cities like West Covina, Arcadia, Duarte are either traveling East to Legends (traffic), West to RSC (210 fwy) or South (57 fwy) to the OC.  Ashley Sanchez comes to mind as she lives in the San Gabriel Valley and started at a local club, then Legends and finally at Blues.  I also know of several others residing in the same vacinity and their DDs commute to Slammers, Albion OC, WCFC and Blues.  It's not a bad commute, because once on the 57 fwy there is the carpool lane and traveling south (opposite traffic).


This is all true but La Canada HS/LAPFC is 11 minutes from Arcadia, for example. Now there will be a local alternative. 2-3 years ago LAPFC had a very elite team coached by MM. I think they had 2 YNT pool players maybe more. LAPFC/GDA gives local kids there a much more convenient alternative to having to schlep east on the 210- brutal- then to the 57...the same cannot be said for the west LA players.


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccerobserver said:


> This is all true but La Canada HS/LAPFC is 11 minutes from Arcadia, for example. Now there will be a local alternative. 2-3 years ago LAPFC had a very elite team coached by MM. I think they had 2 YNT pool players maybe more. LAPFC/GDA gives local kids there a much more convenient alternative to having to schlep east on the 210- brutal- then to the 57...the same cannot be said for the west LA players.


The teams coached by Manny Martins were good but they were maybe top 11-15 in the age group.  The tow YNT players were one and done and are both in college.  I think one starts for Oregon but the other is a backup.  If they still had Manny and Lou they would be a destination.  As it stands the are going to have to hang their hats on having a fully funded academy team and a WPSL team.


----------



## soccerobserver

MakeAPlay said:


> The teams coached by Manny Martins were good but they were maybe top 11-15 in the age group.  The tow YNT players were one and done and are both in college.  I think one starts for Oregon but the other is a backup.  If they still had Manny and Lou they would be a destination.  As it stands the are going to have to hang their hats on having a fully funded academy team and a WPSL team.


As I recall they ranked higher than that...were well looked at by all the top colleges...Another passed through MM and plays for Stanford...


----------



## NoGoal

soccerobserver said:


> This is all true but La Canada HS/LAPFC is 11 minutes from Arcadia, for example. Now there will be a local alternative. 2-3 years ago LAPFC had a very elite team coached by MM. I think they had 2 YNT pool players maybe more. LAPFC/GDA gives local kids there a much more convenient alternative to having to schlep east on the 210- brutal- then to the 57...the same cannot be said for the west LA players.


IDK about all that.  LA Premier was originally LAFC then became Chelsea/LAFC and was a Boys DA club, before being stripped of the affiliation or something in those lines.  LA Premier or LAFC was never an elite girls club or destination.  A lot of the top players in the San Gabriel Valley and IE woul commute to the OC than play for LAFC or LA Premier girls team.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> IDK about all that.  LA Premier was originally LAFC then became Chelsea/LAFC and was a Boys DA club, before being stripped of the affiliation or something in those lines.  LA Premier or LAFC was never an elite girls club or destination.  A lot of the top players in the San Gabriel Valley and IE woul commute to the OC than play for LAFC or LA Premier girls team.


 correction, the beat players in the San Gabriel and IE would rather play for Arsenal FC when the Kooimans ran the club.


----------



## soccerobserver

NoGoal said:


> correction, the beat players in the San Gabriel and IE would rather play for Arsenal FC when the Kooimans ran the club.


My points stand nonetheless.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> The teams coached by Manny Martins were good but they were maybe top 11-15 in the age group.  The tow YNT players were one and done and are both in college.  I think one starts for Oregon but the other is a backup.  If they still had Manny and Lou they would be a destination.  As it stands the are going to have to hang their hats on having a fully funded academy team and a WPSL team.


I would also add, LA Premier having one strong team which graduated out last year.  Doesn't make them an elite girls club.   It will be interesting to see, since they are Girls DA and if they can compete with RSC and Legends for the elite players in their own backyard.


----------



## soccerobserver

NoGoal said:


> I would also add, LA Premier having one strong team which graduated out last year.  Doesn't make them an elite girls club.   It will be interesting to see, since they are Girls DA and if they can compete with RSC and Legends for the elite players in their area.


Yes they have an opening and kids in the area might get a local opportunity if the club can get any traction. In the end I still think the top clubs and coaches will still be the top clubs and coaches no matter what league they are in...there are some new openings for clubs to compete now that GDA has expanded the included clubs... maybe GDA will relegate and promote clubs over time in a way that ECNL did not...heck GDA has already done that with the ECNL clubs they excluded...


----------



## NoGoal

soccerobserver said:


> Yes they have an opening and kids in the area might get a local opportunity if the club can get any traction. In the end I still think the top clubs and coaches will still be the top clubs and coaches no matter what league they are in...there are some new openings for clubs to compete now that GDA has expanded the included clubs... maybe GDA will relegate and promote clubs over time in a way that ECNL did not...heck GDA has already done that with the ECNL clubs they excluded...


Actually, ECNL did drop 2 clubs in the past 2 or so years for poor performances.  A club in Virginia and a Las Vegas club.

I have read on this thread supposedly Girls DA is "ALL" about developement.  What I find ironic, if Girls and Boys DA is about development....then why did the Boys DA dropped a couple clubs for poor performances?  As long as they are developing players, who cares if the team wins or loses right?  So there is no need to promote or relegate.


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccerobserver said:


> As I recall they ranked higher than that...were well looked at by all the top colleges...Another passed through MM and plays for Stanford...


She was a player for RSC and Strikers when she got committed to Stanford.  LA Premier was her last destination.  I know this player and her mother very well.  Trust me they made the commute to Strikers to play for a better team with better players and she was not the best player on the team.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Actually, ECNL did drop 2 clubs in the past 2 or so years for poor performances.  A club in Virginia and a Las Vegas club.
> 
> I have read on this thread supposedly Girls DA is "ALL" about developement.  What I find ironic, if Girls and Boys DA is about development....then why did the Boys DA dropped a couple clubs for poor performances?  As long as they are developing players, who cares if the team wins or loses right?  So there is no need to promote or relegate.


It's because the window dressing is development but the truth is control...


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> It's because the window dressing is development but the truth is control...


Definitely not incorrect, but the 2 Boys DA clubs that were dropped...is it outside the realm of possibility that they were dropped for reasons beyond their record?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> Definitely not incorrect, but the 2 Boys DA clubs that were dropped...is it outside the realm of possibility that they were dropped for reasons beyond their record?


It's entirely possible.  You would have to ask somebody with a boy in the DA.


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> Actually, ECNL did drop 2 clubs in the past 2 or so years for poor performances.  A club in Virginia and a Las Vegas club.
> 
> I have read on this thread supposedly Girls DA is "ALL" about developement.  What I find ironic, if Girls and Boys DA is about development....then why did the Boys DA dropped a couple clubs for poor performances?  As long as they are developing players, who cares if the team wins or loses right?  So there is no need to promote or relegate.


So, U.S. Soccer dropped a couple of teams for poor win/loss records? Show me or just name the team and I will tell you why they were dropped.


----------



## espola

LadiesMan217 said:


> So, U.S. Soccer dropped a couple of teams for poor win/loss records? Show me or just name the team and I will tell you why they were dropped.


I was told the DA didn't grade "performance" strictly by win/loss record.


----------



## LadiesMan217

espola said:


> I was told the DA didn't grade "performance" strictly by win/loss record.


Correct.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> So, U.S. Soccer dropped a couple of teams for poor win/loss records? Show me or just name the team and I will tell you why they were dropped.


This post tells me a lot about what kind of person you are.....lazy!  Why don't you post question on the boys thread.


----------



## NoGoal

espola said:


> I was told the DA didn't grade "performance" strictly by win/loss record.


And that brings up a bigger question.  How is US soccer objectively evaluating performance?  The players at the club didn't get any YNT invites, they don't connect 15 passes in a game, to much kick and run,  not playing high pressure, to much possession, bunkering to much, players not being recruited by college coaches, what is it?


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> This post tells me a lot about what kind of person you are.....lazy!  Why don't you post question on the boys thread.


I actually know the answers. You just keep avoiding questions that put you on the spot.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> I actually know the answers. You just keep avoiding questions that put you on the spot.


Actually, I don't really care.  I'm just trolling!

My family doesn't have to worry about Girls DA, my DD is graduating in May!


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> Actually, I don't really care.  I'm just trolling!
> 
> My family doesn't have to worry about Girls DA, my DD is graduating in May!


Awesome


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Awesome


That's right it is awesome, you ulittle parents have to figure this Girls DA crap out.....LMAO!

I'm just glad I was able to cash out on the greatest Ponzi Scheme they call club soccer.


----------



## 3thatplay

NoGoal said:


> ...I'm just glad I was able to cash out on the greatest Ponzi Scheme they call club soccer.


Completely agree!  The Klines also cashed out in the scheme but gave this post a "dislike".  I understand that you rub many the wrong way but when you hit the nail on the head you shouldn't get a down vote unless it is just a Pavlovian response.


----------



## CaliKlines

3thatplay said:


> Completely agree!  The Klines also cashed out in the scheme but gave this post a "dislike".  I understand that you rub many the wrong way but when you hit the nail on the head you shouldn't get a down vote unless it is just a Pavlovian response.


3TP, he doesn't rub me at all. I just think it is a disservice to call all of club soccer a Ponzi scheme. That may have been his reality, but we paid for a service that provided great training and development for my player, and created a great passion for the sport in her. It was never a goal to have her play college ball, but when the opportunity presented itself and she had the desire, then she pursued it. Even if she didn't want to play in college, club soccer would have been a great investment in her time and my money. It was a very positive experience that kept her occupied during the tumultuous middle school and high school years in a healthy peer group. And the per hour cost was way less than gymnastics, dance, volleyball and other club sports in which she had an aptitude. Calling it a Ponzi scheme paints it as a fraudulent, negative experience. And I disagree. Again, my opinion.


----------



## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> That's right it is awesome, you ulittle parents have to figure this Girls DA crap out.....LMAO!
> 
> I'm just glad I was able to cash out on the greatest Ponzi Scheme they call club soccer.


A good book once said ..."_What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun"._ E1:9

If we rewind the clock, I'm sure parents/players were thinking the same during the period leading up to the Ecnl era....yet somehow, someway, kids were still making it to the college field & beyond, with and without "the patch" of Ecnl.

So don't fret young padawan parents.....DA, Schmee-A....just be sure to do your homework, study/investigate the players who play(ed) at the goal/destination (i.e. college/pro), work backwards, and comprise a plan (w/your player) and execute on that plan


----------



## bababooey

CaliKlines said:


> 3TP, he doesn't rub me at all. I just think it is a disservice to call all of club soccer a Ponzi scheme. That may have been his reality, but we paid for a service that provided great training, and development for my player, and created a great passion for the sport in her. It was never a goal to have her play "at the next level", but when the opportunity presented itself and she had the desire, then she pursued it. Even if she didn't want to play in college, club soccer would have been a great investment in her time and my money. It was a very positive experience that kept her occupied during the tumultuous middle school and high school years in a healthy peer group. And the per hour cost was way less than gymnastics, dance, volleyball and other club sports in which she had an aptitude. Calling it a Ponzi scheme paints it as a fraudulent, negative experience. And I disagree. Again, my opinion.


Spot on post Cali. Many thanks.

My dd will be a freshman at HS next year, so I still have at least four more years of soccer ahead of me (assuming she does not abruptly quit playing). We as parents are paying for a service with club soccer. Do I agree with every aspect of club soccer, no. However, the overall experience has been positive. I have made multiple new friends along the way and she has made many new friends that may end up being life-long friends.

I believe college soccer is a possibility for my dd, but that is not what club soccer is teaching her. There are many things that structured sports teaches our children, but some of the things I really appreciate with this experience is teaching her that a commitment is to be taken seriously (getting up early for games or practices, going to practices when you would rather stay home and watch tv, going to games when your school friends are going to the mall, etc.). What she is learning from club soccer can be applied to many facets of life and that is really what I am paying for. Watching her play a sport she loves is just the icing on the cake.


----------



## bababooey

Kicker4Life said:


> Definitely not incorrect, but the 2 Boys DA clubs that were dropped...is it outside the realm of possibility that they were dropped for reasons beyond their record?


Kicker: is it possible that these two DA clubs were dropped because they were not following the guidelines of development that US Soccer mandates? I definitely do not know all aspects of the DA program, but I believe that all DA clubs must adhere to specific development goals/guidelines and if those clubs deviate from those goals/guidelines, they can be dropped by US Soccer.

I would be disappointed if US Soccer dropped a DA club due to a poor W/L record.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> 3TP, he doesn't rub me at all. I just think it is a disservice to call all of club soccer a Ponzi scheme. That may have been his reality, but we paid for a service that provided great training, and development for my player, and created a great passion for the sport in her. It was never a goal to have her play "at the next level", but when the opportunity presented itself and she had the desire, then she pursued it. Even if she didn't want to play in college, club soccer would have been a great investment in her time and my money. It was a very positive experience that kept her occupied during the tumultuous middle school and high school years in a healthy peer group. And the per hour cost was way less than gymnastics, dance, volleyball and other club sports in which she had an aptitude. Calling it a Ponzi scheme paints it as a fraudulent, negative experience. And I disagree. Again, my opinion.


I call it a ponzi scheme, because there are thousands of club players of which only a small percentage will ever get a sniff at being recruited by a college coach.  Let's be brutally honest.  The players on C-F teams at large clubs should ALL be playing AYSO for $100 (estimation) a year, but it's not sexy to play AYSO.  Now with Girls DA, some of these clubs will be fully funded and who exactly will be paying for these players?  Oh yeah the B-F teams,  brilliant!  At least the ECNL families had to pay, except for the families in financial need.

There are clubs who put on a club wide annual production parading their college commits in front of their ulittle players and parents.  If that isn't selling a dream and pie in the sky to a family I don't know what is.  Anything to keep the gravy train rolling! It's like some sort of TV evangelist taping on individuals emotions to donate money.

Yet, there are parents who think with weekly skills training....their DD with 2 left feet (to be fair or 2 right feet) will get there.  We have all seen the delusional parents, who thought their ulittle DDs was the next Marta.  Only to see that ulittle girl being replaced by a better player from another team who was recruited by very own club coach.   What about the club coaches who accepts ulittle package deals of 4-5 players moving to their club from another team, when in fact the club only wanted 1-2 of the players.  It's why I never packaged my DD, lol.


----------



## Sane65

CaliKlines said:


> 3TP, he doesn't rub me at all. I just think it is a disservice to call all of club soccer a Ponzi scheme. That may have been his reality, but we paid for a service that provided great training, and development for my player, and created a great passion for the sport in her. It was never a goal to have her play "at the next level", but when the opportunity presented itself and she had the desire, then she pursued it. Even if she didn't want to play in college, club soccer would have been a great investment in her time and my money. It was a very positive experience that kept her occupied during the tumultuous middle school and high school years in a healthy peer group. And the per hour cost was way less than gymnastics, dance, volleyball and other club sports in which she had an aptitude. Calling it a Ponzi scheme paints it as a fraudulent, negative experience. And I disagree. Again, my opinion.


Well said CaliKlines.  Agree.  Club soccer is a great experience whether you play on top level or mid level teams.  Our soccer players should be making friends, learning discipline and how to operate within a team.  Organized sports are a wonderful outlet for kids these days to be athletic and have fun.  To call it a "Ponzi" scheme is completely unfair.  After all, NO one forces your player to try out and commit to a team and you to write the check.  Just sayin...


----------



## NoGoal

bababooey said:


> Spot on post Cali. Many thanks.
> 
> My dd will be a freshman at HS next year, so I still have at least four more years of soccer ahead of me (assuming she does not abruptly quit playing). We as parents are paying for a service with club soccer. Do I agree with every aspect of club soccer, no. However, the overall experience has been positive. I have made multiple new friends along the way and she has made many new friends that may end up being life-long friends.


That's how you get sucked in, even if your DD isn't good enough for college soccer (I have no idea if she has the goods or not, if so great) are you going to pull your little princess from the friends she created in her team?  A DOC once told me, he prefers girls over boys teams, because for some reason parents will "PAY" for their daughters, but not for there sons.  



			
				bababooey said:
			
		

> I believe college soccer is a possibility for my dd, but that is not what club soccer is teaching her. There are many things that structured sports teaches our children, but some of the things I really appreciate with this experience is teaching her that a commitment is to be taken seriously (getting up early for games or practices, going to practices when you would rather stay home and watch tv, going to games when your school friends are going to the mall, etc.). What she is learning from club soccer can be applied to many facets of life and that is really what I am paying for. Watching her play a sport she loves is just the icing on the cake.


She could have learned that playing for AYSO Select or whatever they call the travel squad nowadays.


----------



## TheBonus

Beach FC Announces DA Coaches:

http://beachfutbolclub.com/beach-futbol-club-development-academy-announcement/


----------



## CaliKlines

TheBonus said:


> Beach FC Announces DA Coaches:
> 
> http://beachfutbolclub.com/beach-futbol-club-development-academy-announcement/


Wow, good job...Go Beach!


----------



## NoGoal

Sane65 said:


> Well said CaliKlines.  Agree.  Club soccer is a great experience whether you play on top level or mid level teams.  Our soccer players should be making friends, learning discipline and how to operate within a team.  Organized sports are a wonderful outlet for kids these days to be athletic and have fun.  To call it a "Ponzi" scheme is completely unfair.  After all, NO one forces your player to try out and commit to a team and you to write the check.  Just sayin...


The kids on the C-F teams could have learned those lessons and made those friends on their AYSO select teams and saved you thousands for their college fund.  Just saying, lol!

BTW, post something controversial and it's how you get parents to post on the forum.  See how that works!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zerodenero said:


> A good book once said ..."_What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun"._ E1:9
> 
> If we rewind the clock, I'm sure parents/players were thinking the same during the period leading up to the Ecnl era....yet somehow, someway, kids were still making it to the college field & beyond, with and without "the patch" of Ecnl.
> 
> So don't fret young padawan parents.....DA, Schmee-A....just be sure to do your homework, study/investigate the players who play(ed) at the goal/destination (i.e. college/pro), work backwards, and comprise a plan (w/your player) and execute on that plan


ZD as always sage advice.  You been sitting with Luke Skywalker and Yoda somewhere going all Zen on us?


----------



## NoGoal

If my DD didn't end up playing college soccer.  I would probably be posting the same thing; organized sports teaches life lessons for a teenager, she has made life long friends, money spent can't replace the life long experience, etc, etc. 

It's part of the 5 stages of grief.


----------



## MakeAPlay

TheBonus said:


> Beach FC Announces DA Coaches:
> 
> http://beachfutbolclub.com/beach-futbol-club-development-academy-announcement/


DA2 League?  WTF?  I am going to continue to watch this unfold.  I like 3 of those coaches and have no knowledge of the others.  I am surprised that Rob Demelo doesn't have a DA team.  I agree NoGoal and I am also glad that I got out more from the ponzi scheme than I put in.  I would have preferred to have her run track.  It's cheaper and she could have ended up at the same school.  I could have gotten a few more vacations versus spending $2500-$4000 for soccer (although the last year was free).  I saw plenty go by the wayside and end up at worse schools than they could have gotten into based on academics alone. 

 I am not going to minimize the value that the passion and lessons learned through soccer provide but I come from the old school where you don't pay for a social circle.  One of the reasons that my player left her first team is because she cared about getting better and winning and her team being the "B" team was more concerned with the team functions.  I definitely felt that if she wasn't on the club's top team that it was more a social circle and less about true development.  Now I am not saying that all clubs are like that and my daughter's last club definitely promoted from within.  I am saying that you could easily cut the number of club teams in half and it would only help the quality of play throughout SoCal.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> DA2 League?  WTF?  I am going to continue to watch this unfold.  I like 3 of those coaches and have no knowledge of the others.  I am surprised that Rob Demelo doesn't have a DA team.  I agree NoGoal and I am also glad that I got out more from the ponzi scheme than I put in.  I would have preferred to have her run track.  It's cheaper and she could have ended up at the same school.  I could have gotten a few more vacations versus spending $2500-$4000 for soccer (although the last year was free).  I saw plenty go by the wayside and end up at worse schools than they could have gotten into based on academics alone.
> 
> I am not going to minimize the value that the passion and lessons learned through soccer provide but I come from the old school where you don't pay for a social circle.  One of the reasons that my player left her first team is because she cared about getting better and winning and her team being the "B" team was more concerned with the team functions.  I definitely felt that if she wasn't on the club's top team that it was more a social circle and less about true development.  Now I am not saying that all clubs are like that and my daughter's last club definitely promoted from within.  I am saying that you could easily cut the number of club teams in half and it would only help the quality of play throughout SoCal.


Exactly, I find it hard to believe that several clubs have 4-6 teams in an age group.  Why? Easy money that's why.

I know a smaller well known club.  I asked the coach, why does the club only have 2 teams, when they could easily have 4-5 teams per age group. His reply, because we believe in quality over quantity.  As the club gets bigger, it becomes harder and harder to find quality coaches also.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> 3TP, he doesn't rub me at all. I just think it is a disservice to call all of club soccer a Ponzi scheme. That may have been his reality, but we paid for a service that provided great training, and development for my player, and created a great passion for the sport in her. It was never a goal to have her play "at the next level", but when the opportunity presented itself and she had the desire, then she pursued it. Even if she didn't want to play in college, club soccer would have been a great investment in her time and my money. It was a very positive experience that kept her occupied during the tumultuous middle school and high school years in a healthy peer group. And the per hour cost was way less than gymnastics, dance, volleyball and other club sports in which she had an aptitude. Calling it a Ponzi scheme paints it as a fraudulent, negative experience. And I disagree. Again, my opinion.


Cali the people who get out of a Ponzi scheme before it collapses do pretty well (unrealistic returns).  Same thing with club soccer.  Those that go in it with an 8 or 9 year old and come out with a significant college scholarship worth more (or significantly more) than they paid essentially "won" in the Ponzi scheme.  

If somebody walked up to you today and said that if you give them $30K (about what I spent) and said that they would hand me back $120k I would definitely not believe it.  That is what you get if you have a player that navigates through all of the BS and ends up with a scholarship.  The life lessons that they learn are amazing and valuable but that comes down to parenting not to spending money on sports.  Trust me if you are good enough in a sport cost is never an issue.  For the ULittle parents starting today if they end up having one of the 200 or so SoCal kids that get a decent scholarship or get into an AMAZING institution due to soccer they are the "winners" of the Ponzi scheme and the 10,000 that didn't may not be losers in the real sense but in terms of what they got from club soccer versus AYSO select or the Mexican league is honestly very little other than maybe some lifelong friends (we are talking about girls so lifelong is relative too!!).


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

NoGoal said:


> Exactly, I find it hard to believe that several clubs have 4-6 teams in an age group.  Why? Easy money that's why.
> 
> I know a smaller well known club.  I asked the coach, why does the club only have 2 teams, when they could easily have 4-5 teams per age group. His reply, because we believe in quality over quantity.  As the club gets bigger, it becomes harder and harder to find quality coaches also.


You might be surprised to know that many of the kids on the 3,4,5th teams are just delighted that they can participate in a club, probably have no aspirations of playing at a higher level, but still take great pride in pulling on their club jerseys. Different level but still important to them.


----------



## NoGoal

Sunil Illuminati said:


> You might be surprised to know that many of the kids on the 3,4,5th teams are just delighted that they can participate in a club, probably have no aspirations of playing at a higher level, but still take great pride in pulling on their club jerseys. Different level but still important to them.


Like I posted, playing AYSO is not sexy! It's okay if your on the C-F team, I will pay the $2000 club fee without the travel expense and get you on that club team princess.

I would tell my DD...honey, let's try dance!


----------



## Sane65

NoGoal said:


> The kids on the C-F teams could have learned those lessons and made those friends on their AYSO select teams and saved you thousands for their college fund.  Just saying, lol!
> 
> BTW, post something controversial and it's how you get parents to post on the forum.  See how that works!


Over-complicating a very simple issue...  Nothing any of us here don't see right through.  Club soccer is not controversial.  Different vehicles to promote athleticism, team spirit, discipline and having fun.  It is merely the parent's choice as to which avenue they would like to choose.  If you are passionate about the sport, then I would think ANY soccer opportunity is a good one.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

NoGoal said:


> Like I posted, playing AYSO is not sexy! So let me put you on the C-F team, pay my $2000 club fee without the travel expense and I will give you my club jersey with the crest.


Unless things have changed, AYSO plays two 8-10 week seasons. Most Clubs play year round, train two/three times a week, enter tournaments...A different level of commitment and experience altogether. Not sure Sexy applies to kids soccer, but sounds like you've got your own ideas as to how things should be done!


----------



## NoGoal

If anybody's DD is playing club and only made their HS JV team.  Get out of club soccer now and sock the money towards their col


Sane65 said:


> Over-complicating a very simple issue...  Nothing any of us here don't see right through.  Club soccer is not controversial.  Different vehicles to promote athleticism, team spirit, discipline and having fun.  It is merely the parent's choice as to which avenue they would like to choose.  If you are passionate about the sport, then I would think ANY soccer opportunity is a good one.


Really,  nothing any of us here don't see right through...are you posting "alternative facts".


----------



## Kicker4Life

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Unless things have changed, AYSO plays two 8-10 week seasons. Most Clubs play year round, train two/three times a week, enter tournaments...A different level of commitment and experience altogether. Not sure Sexy applies to kids soccer, but sounds like you've got your own ideas as to how things should be done!


And despite the fact their DD's are no longer playing at the Club level, they spend hours telling us we are all fools for falling for the trap (that they also participated in).  hindsight is 20/20 and it worked out for them, but as they've reminded us many times across many threads, our DD's don't have a chance.


----------



## NoGoal

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Unless things have changed, AYSO plays two 8-10 week seasons. Most Clubs play year round, train two/three times a week, enter tournaments...A different level of commitment and experience altogether. Not sure Sexy applies to kids soccer, but sounds like you've got your own ideas as to how things should be done!


Did you forget AYSO travel select, spring soccer, playing for the local hispanic league which is also year round and the players all get a jersey?  Like the DOC told me years ago for some reason parents will pay for their daughters to play club soccer.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

NoGoal said:


> Like the DOC told me years ago for some reason parents will pay for their daughters to play club soccer.


Was that on your daily call?


----------



## outside!

I am all for anything that gets more players playing soccer. I have watched a few rec and AYSO games over the past year. Most of those games and players were playing at a much lower level than most B-D club teams I have watched (I have never seen an E or F team play). I have known players that moved from club to rec and were so much better than everyone else that they quickly moved back to a club team. I do think that in the future when all of our kids are the volunteer rec coaches, rec soccer will be played at a higher level and there will be less of a need for club soccer.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> And despite the fact their DD's are no longer playing at the Club level, they spend hours telling us we are all fools for falling for the trap (that they also participated in).  hindsight is 20/20 and it worked out for them, but as they've reminded us many times across many threads, our DD's don't have a chance.


My DD is still playing club soccer.  I'm being brutally honest, there are girls who belong in club soccer and my guess is 80% of the posters on this forum have DDs who play on A or B teams.  Unless reality is hitting home, you shouldn't be offended.

Anybody can play club soccer, it's no longer a vehicle where the best players play club soccer unlike 10-15 years ago.  It's probably why there is a market for ECNL and now Girls DA.  To seperate the wheat from the chaff. It's okay, I have a club jersey for your DD though.


----------



## NoGoal

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Was that on your daily call?


It sure was, all the way to my DD committing to a strong academic university in the Pac12.  Nice try though!


----------



## Real Deal

TheBonus said:


> Beach FC Announces DA Coaches:
> 
> http://beachfutbolclub.com/beach-futbol-club-development-academy-announcement/


That is a great line-up of high-caliber coaches for Beach.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> I am all for anything that gets more players playing soccer. I have watched a few rec and AYSO games over the past year. Most of those games and players were playing at a much lower level than most B-D club teams I have watched (I have never seen an E or F team play). I have known players that moved from club to rec and were so much better than everyone else that they quickly moved back to a club team. I do think that in the future when all of our kids are the volunteer rec coaches, rec soccer will be played at a higher level and there will be less of a need for club soccer.


I have seen many ulittle B team players who end up recruited for college soccer when older.  It's the ulittle C to F teams that I have an issue with.  Those are the same club players and don't make their HS varsity team as freshmens.

I agree with your post when our kids become parents they quality of rec coaches will vastly improve.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

NoGoal said:


> It sure was, all the way to my DD committing to a strong academic university in the Pac12.  Nice try though!


Yes. I teed you up so you could get it off your chest. We all knew it was making your fingers twitch. Congrats btw.


----------



## NoGoal

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Yes. I teed you up so you could get it off your chest. We all knew it was making your fingers twitch. Congrats btw.


Who cares she is committed, the hard work for her is just getting started, since she is wanting to play college soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> And despite the fact their DD's are no longer playing at the Club level, they spend hours telling us we are all fools for falling for the trap (that they also participated in).  hindsight is 20/20 and it worked out for them, but as they've reminded us many times across many threads, our DD's don't have a chance.


What do you mean?  His daughter plays club and mine might play this spring as she is still age eligible.  Come on now.  If you don't want to read what he or I post the ignore feature is handy.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> What do you mean?  His daughter plays club and mine might play this spring as she is still age eligible.  Come on now.  If you don't want to read what he or I post the ignore feature is handy.


Trust me, I've contemplated it.  However, when the 2 of you aren't putting the rest of us down, calling Club soccer a joke or toughting how amazing your DD is (which by all accounts they are), you actually have some valuable insight.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> Trust me, I've contemplated it.  However, when the 2 of you aren't putting the rest of us down, calling Club soccer a joke or toughting how amazing your DD is (which by all accounts they are), you actually have some valuable insight.


Club soccer is "NOT" a joke,  at the youth level I see it more as a money grab for lower level players.

Lower to mid club soccer is glorified recreational soccer with a paid coach.  If there was an opportunity for AYSO Select players to be recruited for college soccer....80-90% of the parents wouldn't be playing club.  We all heard the quote "build it and they will come".


----------



## Sane65

NoGoal said:


> It sure was, all the way to my DD committing to a strong academic university in the Pac12.  Nice try though!


Of course.


----------



## MakeAPlay

For those that care,  It's good read.

http://www.fourfourtwo.com/us/features/us-soccer-youth-development-academy-field-sizes-curriculum-confusion


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> Trust me, I've contemplated it.  However, when the 2 of you aren't putting the rest of us down, calling Club soccer a joke or toughting how amazing your DD is (which by all accounts they are), you actually have some valuable insight.


If it will make you happy I will keep my opinions and experience to myself and stick to the only threads that I care about the D1 soccer and WNT threads.  I will block you so I don't see your comments and we won't ever have to cross paths.  Debating ULittle parents is like beating my head against the wall anyway.  Watching the disaster in Washington unfold is probably going to be more entertaining anyway.  Good luck to you and yours!  And that Miller can in your picture has got to go.  You don't really drink that stuff do you?

Peace in the Middle East!


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> If it will make you happy I will keep my opinions and experience to myself and stick to the only threads that I care about the D1 soccer and WNT threads.  I will block you so I don't see your comments and we won't ever have to cross paths.  Debating ULittle parents is like beating my head against the wall anyway.  Watching the disaster in Washington unfold is probably going to be more entertaining anyway.  Good luck to you and yours!  And that Miller can in your picture has got to go.  You don't really drink that stuff do you?
> 
> Peace in the Middle East!


Only in certain occasions i.e. Playing Ace's on a Friday afternoon at my local net. I'm more of an IPA guy when it comes to beer.   I will say I can relate to the brick wall comment...already have a headache


----------



## NoGoal

Sane65 said:


> Of course.


Of course what?


----------



## Legendary FC

Swoosh said:


> The criteria doesn't go back 6+ years.  But you're wrong on Legends, they won championships before ECNL.  The criteria is quality of the staff, facilities, players on the national team, pro players, etc.


I'm curious as to what year they won a championship?  ECNL started in 2009,


----------



## NoGoal

Love the "alternative facts", but Legends did NOT win a National Championship prior to ECNL.

Legends won their 1st championship in 2012 and ECNL has been around more than 5 years.
http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/nationals/2012_usyouthsoccer_national_champions/


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> It sure was, all the way to my DD committing to a strong academic university in the Pac12.  Nice try though!


How to make friends and influence people.
No Goal is good at that as well as being humble.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> How to make friends and influence people.
> No Goal is good at that as well as being humble.


Read the thread within the contexts.  Sunil Illuminati was taking a dig at me.  Insinuating that I was having daily discussions with the DOC as to why I keep paying a club soccer fee for my DD at ulittle.  Ha!

This is bragging, that's right.  My DD will be signing her National Letter of Intent a week from now.  I bet you all wish, your DDs were in her shoes! Now that is bragging!


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> Love the "alternative facts", but Legends did NOT win a National Championship prior to ECNL.
> 
> Legends won their 1st championship in 2012 and ECNL has been around more than 5 years.
> http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/nationals/2012_usyouthsoccer_national_champions/


Get a hold of yourself ulittle man.  That's all very old stuff.  I believe it was you and Make It Up that claimed Arsenal won a NC prior to ECNL.  You went silent on this topic once it was obvious that you were full of it.  Let's not rehash.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> Get a hold of yourself ulittle man.  That's all very old stuff.  I believe it was you and Make It Up that claimed Arsenal won a NC prior to ECNL.  You went silent on this topic once it was obvious that you were full of it.  Let's not rehash.


Ah to scared to post under your true alias?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Ah to .scared to post under your true alias?


I hope your daughter is taking English, you need some help. If you want, you can use my editor, E.
Congratulations to your daughter, her mom must be a hell of an athlete to drown out your genes.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Read the thread within the contexts.  Sunil Illuminati was taking a dig at me.  Insinuating that I was having daily discussions with the DOC as to why I keep paying a club soccer fee for my DD at ulittle.  Ha!
> 
> This is bragging, that's right.  My DD will be signing her National Letter of Intent a week from now.  I bet you all wish, your DDs were in her shoes! Now that is bragging!


Is she a junior?


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> Read the thread within the contexts.  Sunil Illuminati was taking a dig at me.  Insinuating that I was having daily discussions with the DOC as to why I keep paying a club soccer fee for my DD at ulittle.  Ha!
> 
> This is bragging, that's right.  My DD will be signing her National Letter of Intent a week from now.  I bet you all wish, your DDs were in her shoes! Now that is bragging!


Although I congratulate your DD I do not wish my daughter was in her shoes - that would most likely be a soccer skill drop for her .


----------



## Sheriff Joe

LadiesMan217 said:


> Although I congratulate your DD I do not wish my daughter was in her shoes - that would most likely be a soccer skill drop for her .


Congratulations, you are now down to nogoal and maps level by talking about someone's kid.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Although I congratulate your DD I do not wish my daughter was in her shoes - that would most likely be a soccer skill drop for her .


Ha that was funny, but she is actually an attacking mid and projected to play wingback in college.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Sheriff Joe said:


> Congratulations, you are now down to nogoal and maps level by talking about someone's kid.


Oh snap. Oops. I did congratulate her so not bad....


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Congratulations, you are now down to nogoal and maps level by talking about someone's kid.


It's NOT the first time, I heard it all when my DD was playing ulittle.  She isn't fast enough, she isn't big enough, etc, etc.  Who care what others thinks.  All that matters is what her college coaches like.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Oh snap. Oops. I did congratulate her so not bad....





Sheriff Joe said:


> I hope your daughter is taking English, you need some help. If you want, you can use my editor, E.
> Congratulations to your daughter, her mom must be a hell of an athlete to drown out your genes.


You can both shove your congrats up your arse, she doesn't need your congrats. LOL!


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Is she a junior?


Hey Brains,  what class year do you think a HS player signs their official national letter of intent?  Have you been keeping up with the thread.  I posted a few pages back she is graduating in May.  Sheesh!


----------



## Sheriff Joe

LadiesMan217 said:


> Oh snap. Oops. I did congratulate her so not bad....


Yes, you don't want to be mentioned in the same breath with them.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Hey Brains,  what class year do you think a HS player signs their official national letter of intent?  Have you been keeping up with the thread.  I posted a few pages back she is graduating in May.  Sheesh!


I wouldn't know, obviously because my daughter is in 8th grade which means you are probably much older than I am. I just hop in and out of this thread to keep track of you.
So you verbal in your junior year and sign in your senior year. Got it. I will let you know if I need any more info when the time comes.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> You can both shove your congrats up your arse, she doesn't need your congrats. LOL!


Yes, I think you have that covered by yourself.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> I wouldn't know, obviously because my daughter is in 8th grade which means you are probably much older than I am. I just hop in and out of this thread to keep track of you.
> So you verbal in your junior year and sign in your senior year. Got it. I will let you know if I need any more info when the time comes.


My DD committed her Sophomore year (December).  The better players commit their sophomore year and the YNT players usually their Freshmen year.  These players are evaluated the year prior.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Hey Brains,  what class year do you think a HS player signs their official national letter of intent?  Have you been keeping up with the thread.  I posted a few pages back she is graduating in May.  Sheesh!


So your daughter had to go to all 4 years of HS? Mine will finish in 3, that is where the confusion is, my bad.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> So your daughter had to go to all 4 years of HS? Mine will finish in 3, that is where the confusion is, my bad.


Good one Sloppy Joe, but your DD being home schooled doesn't count.


----------



## NoGoal

Insane65, aren't you a newbie poster?  I read a few of your posts.  Don't worry about 03/04 Girls DA clubs making offers.  If your DD is a stud....a Girls DA club will find a roster spot for her.


----------



## Swoosh

NoGoal said:


> Good one Sloppy Joe, but your DD being home schooled doesn't count.


Is there a height requirement for college soccer?


----------



## NoGoal

Swoosh said:


> Is there a height requirement for college soccer?


Nope, but your DDs DOC told me years go that college coaches prefer recruiting Big, Fast, Strong players.  I don't know if he has spoken to UCLA college coaches, but their roster has several smaller athletic technical players.


----------



## NoGoal

TCD said:


> NoGoal - don't paint with such a broad stroke. Plenty of Surf ECNL players on Torrey Pines JV squad (last year). Now on Varsity as sophomores but still some damn fine sophomores and juniors still on JV from other top club teams in the area.


I'm not sure how strong the Surf ECNL team is for your DDs age group.  Just because a player is ECNL doesn't mean they are great players.  Are the girls who are on the JV team ECNL subs?  Are varsity soccer players at Torrey Pines HS all older Surf ECNL players?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> I'm not sure how strong the Surf ECNL team is for your DDs age group.  Just because a player is ECNL doesn't mean they are great players.  Are the girls who are on the JV team ECNL subs?  Are varsity soccer players at Torrey Pines HS all older Surf ECNL players?


What are you doing up so late, you sleeping on the couch? Don't you have to go to the welfare office early this morning or are you going to the women's march?


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> What are you doing up so late, you sleeping on the couch? Don't you have to go to the welfare office early this morning or are you going to the women's march?


You had a good one prior, now you're back to your weak material.  I see you haven't kicked the habit of needing to read the forum when you wake up at 4:52 am.  Loser!


----------



## NoGoal

TCD said:


> The Surf ECNL team that won nationals two years ago (I think) was U15 last year and now the 00 team. A bunch of starters that are already being recruited by DI schools played JV as freshmen. Only 2 of them were on varsity and one was a bench player for the Surf team. My point is - I disagree with your assessment. Being a great club player doesn't always translate to making varsity in high school. Especially when your school is loaded with talent like TPHS (oh and the coach puts all of his sub par club players on varsity and JV whether they deserve a spot or not). I know that sounds like sour grapes but take it for what it is.


Are you posting about Catarina Macario and Julie Doyle's G99 Surf ECNL team?  I think the G00 Surf team is weaker than the G99 team, but haven't been following ECNL standings for the past year.  None the less, you may disagree, but looks like your HS coach is the problem after reading the end of your post.  Seems like he favors seniority over talent.  So, I stand by my post.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> You had a good one prior, now you're back to your weak material.  I see you haven't kicked the habit of needing to read the forum when you wake up at 4:52 am.  Loser!


You sound like your in a bad mood, you should really have invested in a better couch. Crate and Barrel is what I would recommend, that garage sale furniture you have just don't cut it.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> You sound like your in a bad mood, you should really have invested in a better couch. Crate and Barrel is what I would recommend, that garage sale furniture you have just don't cut it.


I'm not in a bad mood.  Crate and Barrel couch (trying to hard), sorry but I actually have Thomasville furniture.  #nicetry


----------



## Bananacorner

TCD said:


> The Surf ECNL team that won nationals two years ago (I think) was U15 last year and now the 00 team. A bunch of starters that are already being recruited by DI schools played JV as freshmen. Only 2 of them were on varsity and one was a bench player for the Surf team. My point is - I disagree with your assessment. Being a great club player doesn't always translate to making varsity in high school. Especially when your school is loaded with talent like TPHS (oh and the coach puts all of his sub par club players on varsity and JV whether they deserve a spot or not). I know that sounds like sour grapes but take it for what it is.



The other time I've seen amazingly talented players not make varsity as Freshmen is when the coach is an idiot and plays "direct" (kickball) and doesn't want any smaller, skilled players on the field.  These kids get slotted on JV because they aren't fast and big enough to play crapball.  You think I lie, but I know a HS coach who was new and asked his players, "do we play with a size 4 or size 5 ball?"  As you might guess, he also wasn't that good at assessing talent.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Swoosh said:


> Is there a height requirement for college soccer?


Is their a penis size required for douchebag $C posters?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Is their a penis size required for douchebag $C posters?


Woe, I am not getting in the middle of this one.


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> Are you posting about Catarina Macario and Julie Doyle's G99 Surf ECNL team?  I think the G00 Surf team is weaker than the G99 team, but haven't been following ECNL standings for the past year.  None the less, you may disagree, but looks like your HS coach is the problem after reading the end of your post.  Seems like he favors seniority over talent.  So, I stand by my post.


There is no Surf G99 ECNL team. The 99 team and 98 team are combined. CM was never on the 99 team, she always played up on the 98 team except for her first games in the US, when she guested with the 99 B team for Legends Cup. The team that would have become the 99 ECNL team after the age year changeover went through many coaching changes/issues over the years (anyone remember HH?), lost many players to Albion and was not the dominant team in their age group in San Diego county over the years. The 98 team was always very strong, partly as a result of having the best 99 players.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> There is no Surf G99 ECNL team. The 99 team and 98 team are combined. CM was never on the 99 team, she always played up on the 98 team except for her first games in the US, when she guested with the 99 B team for Legends Cup. The team that would have become the 99 ECNL team after the age year changeover went through many coaching changes/issues over the years (anyone remember HH?), lost many players to Albion and was not the dominant team in their age group in San Diego county over the years. The 98 team was always very strong, partly as a result of having the best 99 players.


My bad outside, that's what I meant G98/99 Surf ECNL team.   Thanks for the clarification!


----------



## Sane65

NoGoal said:


> Insane65, aren't you a newbie poster?  I read a few of your posts.  Don't worry about 03/04 Girls DA clubs making offers.  If your DD is a stud....a Girls DA club will find a roster spot for her.


Yawn...sigh.  Anyone have any substance on this thread anymore?  Too much trolling.


----------



## Desert Hound

Sane65 said:


> Yawn...sigh.  Anyone have any substance on this thread anymore?  Too much trolling.


Ok...how about this. From SC del Sol in AZ. They just came out with an announcement for tryouts. On the FAQ page you find this.

So they are talking about having what appears to be a 2nd team (Academy II) and there will be league play for them as well? 

Interesting? First I heard anything about this. 

Q. How will you address the combined age groups?
A. With two of the Development Academy age groups being combined, these Academy teams will be made up of a combination of elite players from the two age groups, we will also have Academy II teams - these teams will be made up of younger players who are preparing for the next season's Academy team and older players who we feel may have the ability to make the current Academy team. If not rostered full time, Academy II players may also be called up to play a limited number of games as “Developmental Players” with the current Academy team. League play structure for Academy II teams is still TBD - we are working with all our fellow Academy Clubs in the Division.

http://www.scdelsolda.com/


----------



## LadiesMan217

Sane65 said:


> Yawn...sigh.  Anyone have any substance on this thread anymore?  Too much trolling.


Here is something to ponder/discuss (although I am sure some well known trolls will troll away to defend their Surf Turf) - what happens to Surf Cup and Surf College Cup next year - there is more to what happened in Silverlakes last year than meets the eye.


----------



## Kicker4Life

I believe Surf Cup was on the DA list of events, but don't quote me on that.


----------



## gkrent

Desert Hound said:


> So they are talking about having what appears to be a 2nd team (Academy II) and there will be league play for them as well?
> 
> Interesting? First I heard anything about this.


Yes there will be a DA2 league and those teams will not be participating in SCDSL (in socal) or ECNL or anything similar.  It supposedly is regional.


----------



## Round

chargerfan said:


> What did you hear about Albion? I don't know anyone at that club currently but they are the only DA team in that area. They don't have elite teams this year but it seems like they could pick up from area clubs.


It is all new so we will see.  From my past, I couldn't say much positive about theclub, but some coaches are good and they let them be good.  They just have too many people who make soccer their full time job.  Check out how many teams some of them coach.

So far what I have seen as a problem is the number of clubs that are trying to secure players really early, I assume before Albion gets them.  Albion can create extra teams and there is a lot of coach movement.  None of this is good for little girl soccer.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Kicker4Life said:


> I believe Surf Cup was on the DA list of events, but don't quote me on that.


You are correct. I will quote you.


----------



## chargerfan

Round said:


> None of this is good for little girl soccer.


I agree with that 100%. It's too much for 7th and 8th graders. I wonder how many will give up the sport for that reason? when it has stopped being fun, and started being about parents pipe dreams?


----------



## MakeAPlay

chargerfan said:


> I agree with that 100%. It's too much for 7th and 8th graders. I wonder how many will give up the sport for that reason? when it has stopped being fun, and started being about parents pipe dreams?


Sports should always be player driven.  Some 7th and 8th graders are incredibly focused and know what they want.  Some just want to please mom and dad.  Having the ability to recognize where somebody's player fits in is key.


----------



## Soccer123

chargerfan said:


> I agree with that 100%. It's too much for 7th and 8th graders. I wonder how many will give up the sport for that reason? when it has stopped being fun, and started being about parents pipe dreams?


The great part of being a part of club soccer is that there a lot of options and no pressure to be a part of DA. You have ECNL and hs and odp, you have DAII and hs and odp, and you have DAI. Many great options and hopefully dd's are choosing what is best for them and not the parents choosing what is best for the parent's ego's.  Great time to be a part of Club Soccer and embrace all of the changes!!


----------



## chargerfan

MakeAPlay said:


> Sports should always be player driven.  Some 7th and 8th graders are incredibly focused and know what they want.  Some just want to please mom and dad.  Having the ability to recognize where somebody's player fits in is key.


Agreed... let me say MOST 7th and 8th graders. Mine loves soccer and is very motivatated to be the best, but I don't know if she would love it as much after a year of that many practices, and having to give up playing high school with friends from other clubs.


----------



## Round

chargerfan said:


> I agree with that 100%. It's too much for 7th and 8th graders. I wonder how many will give up the sport for that reason? when it has stopped being fun, and started being about parents pipe dreams?


I have one of those and there are at least a couple others on the team in the same place.  They want to play but....The number of players really starts to drop at 12 and 13,  that drop seams to be getting larger and the choices left smaller.  Calsouth probably has the numbers, more or less since ecnl/scdsl?  I have a guess.


----------



## avh

Round said:


> ... So far what I have seen as a problem is the number of clubs that are trying to secure players really early ...


What do you mean by securing players really early?  It seems to me that tryouts are happening at about the same time or even a little later than last year.


----------



## Round

avh said:


> What do you mean by securing players really early?  It seems to me that tryouts are happening at about the same time or even a little later than last year.


Not in San Diego, at least some of the clubs.  Some already done, a couple will be next week and want you committed before National Cup. Surf is later, not sure why that is.  Albion is about the same.


----------



## avh

Round said:


> Not in San Diego, at least some of the clubs.  Some already done, a couple will be next week and want you committed before National Cup. Surf is later, not sure why that is.  Albion is about the same.


The clubs I looked at last year and this year for the 04's in San Diego are mostly about the same or later.

Albion's are a week later this year, CSC is the same week, Liverpool is a month later, Notts is the same week, Rebels is a week and a half earlier, SDSC is the same week (or a week later, my note is unclear), and Surf is a month and a half later.  Those are just the ones I had notes on because of the calendar year change from last year.  Maybe you're looking at different clubs than I did, but it seems about the same or later to me.  And it seems every year that each club wants you committed and paid, or on a payment plan, immediately after tryouts.  Nothing new here.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

avh said:


> The clubs I looked at last year and this year for the 04's in San Diego are mostly about the same or later.
> 
> Albion's are a week later this year, CSC is the same week, Liverpool is a month later, Notts is the same week, Rebels is a week and a half earlier, SDSC is the same week (or a week later, my note is unclear), and Surf is a month and a half later.  Those are just the ones I had notes on because of the calendar year change from last year.  Maybe you're looking at different clubs than I did, but it seems about the same or later to me.  And it seems every year that each club wants you committed and paid, or on a payment plan, immediately after tryouts.  Nothing new here.


Confused by this post for many reasons, mostly because SDSC, and Surf have already secured their top teams. LAGSD has been doing kick arounds since Nov and Carl has been great and involved with telling you where he sees your girl. Blues are done, West Coast done, Pats calling around. Arsenal is done already too! 
I don't know about South Bat clubs at all?


----------



## ESPNANALYST

avh said:


> What do you mean by securing players really early?  It seems to me that tryouts are happening at about the same time or even a little later than last year.


What I am shocked MORE about this year and maybe it has always been this way but my club has never allowed it is- the before State Cup transfers to the team they will be on. No one seems to be talking about it but our high profile teams have several new faces that everyone will be seeing at CRL and National Cup. Find it to be odd especially when they go from a B team to another B team but that's also what has been happening!


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Also just going to throw this one out there ECNL is dead. When the ECNL teams are low level B teams at clubs I think we can say it's dead. All top talent at 03 and 04 going to DA. Have not met one family of a great player "choosing to stay on ECNL". Also clubs are offering scholarships BIG TIME for DA. The clubs with the deepest pockets are LAGSB, Pats and Legends so far.
 High sticker price and low level B team I wish this clubs were being more honest about this it's a consumer lie. Sad to see parents excited about "being on ECNL" but have no idea the sticker price and the caliber of their team


----------



## ESPNANALYST

NoGoal said:


> It's NOT the first time, I heard it all when my DD was playing ulittle.  She isn't fast enough, she isn't big enough, etc, etc.  Who care what others thinks.  All that matters is what her college coaches like.


BEST ADVICE MAP EVER GAVE ME! Focus on your own and the coach


----------



## Round

ESPNANALYST said:


> Confused by this post for many reasons, mostly because SDSC, and Surf have already secured their top teams. LAGSD has been doing kick arounds since Nov and Carl has been great and involved with telling you where he sees your girl. Blues are done, West Coast done, Pats calling around. Arsenal is done already too!
> I don't know about South Bat clubs at all?


Tryouts have nothing or little to do with a teams on the special kid clubs.  Most of our kids are not special.  This is about the clubs trying to get enough teams to pay for special people like you.  Other clubs just trying to maintain.

You need us, build that wall and you won't have anyone left to pay for it, or care.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Round said:


> Tryouts have nothing or little to do with a teams on the special kid clubs.  Most of our kids are not special.  This is about the clubs trying to get enough teams to pay for special people like you.  Other clubs just trying to maintain.
> 
> You need us, build that wall and you won't have anyone left to pay for it, or care.


Huh? 
Easy there sport. Happen to love Ryan Marquez just have no idea when his tryouts are.
Also if you follow me you would know I think most of it is a scam and brand doesn't mean crap anymore. In other words I think a coach is more important hence why I know Ryan very well. I assume you know Gabe is coming back to Surf too? 
My point was it's done in most places do don't get deluded about bringing Sally to a tryout.
Again it's done at B level Too.
Maybe you should ease off the CNN because you are bringing politics into little girls soccer


----------



## Justafan

ESPNANALYST said:


> Confused by this post for many reasons, mostly because SDSC, and Surf have already secured their top teams. LAGSD has been doing kick arounds since Nov and Carl has been great and involved with telling you where he sees your girl. Blues are done, West Coast done, Pats calling around. Arsenal is done already too!
> I don't know about South Bat clubs at all?


So Surf, Blues, & WCFC are set with their 04 DA teams, and Arsenal with their ECNL team?


----------



## Round

avh said:


> The clubs I looked at last year and this year for the 04's in San Diego are mostly about the same or later.
> 
> Albion's are a week later this year, CSC is the same week, Liverpool is a month later, Notts is the same week, Rebels is a week and a half earlier, SDSC is the same week (or a week later, my note is unclear), and Surf is a month and a half later.  Those are just the ones I had notes on because of the calendar year change from last year.  Maybe you're looking at different clubs than I did, but it seems about the same or later to me.  And it seems every year that each club wants you committed and paid, or on a payment plan, immediately after tryouts.  Nothing new here.


I guess I'll have to find my notes.  I'm pretty sure notts and albion used to go two weeks, notts always trying to schedule with albion in mind.  Sdsc is definitely early this year, same with hotspurs.  All three, not Albion, are evidence of the problem, fear of the power of academy status.

 I have no idea why surf and sharks are so late, but I like what they are doing.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Again 
Surf is done. Top team done. ECNL aka B team basically formed. You are trying out in March for a C team and I would encourage you to see who that coach of ECNL or that c team is before you go! Not worth the $$
Notts is STRONG. 
Shannon is going what Shannon always does and respecting parents and players.


----------



## avh

ESPNANALYST said:


> Confused by this post for many reasons, mostly because SDSC, and Surf have already secured their top teams. LAGSD has been doing kick arounds since Nov and Carl has been great and involved with telling you where he sees your girl. Blues are done, West Coast done, Pats calling around. Arsenal is done already too!
> I don't know about South Bat clubs at all?


Again, no different than last year.  Most of the clubs were having "calender year" practices, open to all players, well ahead of their tryout dates, and those were starting in November.  All of the big clubs had their top teams secured long before their tryout dates.  Tryouts for these clubs were to fill their lower teams.  If your kid had a dream of playing for one of these clubs top team, they better have practiced with them a couple of times before tryouts, ... and caught the coaches eye.  I would argue that, at least for the clubs like Surf, it's been that way for years.  It would be very rare for someone to just walks on at tryouts and makes the top team.  That is all preordained.  This is nothing new.  The then ECNL clubs, and now DA clubs are following the same pattern as they always have.


----------



## MakeAPlay

avh said:


> Again, no different than last year.  Most of the clubs were having "calender year" practices, open to all players, well ahead of their tryout dates, and those were starting in November.  All of the big clubs had their top teams secured long before their tryout dates.  Tryouts for these clubs were to fill their lower teams.  If your kid had a dream of playing for one of these clubs top team, they better have practiced with them a couple of times before tryouts, ... and caught the coaches eye.  I would argue that, at least for the clubs like Surf, it's been that way for years.  It would be very rare for someone to just walks on at tryouts and makes the top team.  That is all preordained.  This is nothing new.  The then ECNL clubs, and now DA clubs are following the same pattern as they always have.


I've seen a few players walk on the pitch at Surf and get an offer that day.  Of course those players are unicorns that anyone would love to have.


----------



## Sandypk

ESPNANALYST said:


> What I am shocked MORE about this year and maybe it has always been this way but my club has never allowed it is- the before State Cup transfers to the team they will be on. No one seems to be talking about it but our high profile teams have several new faces that everyone will be seeing at CRL and National Cup. Find it to be odd especially when they go from a B team to another B team but that's also what has been happening!


What club does your dd play for?  Question:  Can ECNL players make a switch right now to a non-ECNL team before National Cup and during the last few games of CRL?  That can make a huge impact for some already good teams.  Another question is: What team will these top ECNL players join?  And:  Will they stop their long commutes and return home to a closer club?  I guess time will tell...  I actually can't wait to see it all unfold from the sidelines.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Round said:


> I guess I'll have to find my notes.  I'm pretty sure notts and albion used to go two weeks, notts always trying to schedule with albion in mind.  Sdsc is definitely early this year, same with hotspurs.  All three, not Albion, are evidence of the problem, fear of the power of academy status.
> 
> I have no idea why surf and sharks are so late, but I like what they are doing.


That is the first time in like 6 years that I have seen you compliment Surf!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Round said:


> Tryouts have nothing or little to do with a teams on the special kid clubs.  Most of our kids are not special.  This is about the clubs trying to get enough teams to pay for special people like you.  Other clubs just trying to maintain.
> 
> You need us, build that wall and you won't have anyone left to pay for it, or care.


I agree.  With the way things are headed it seems that it is clear that the elite players are going to get a free ride on the backs of everyone else.  It's sad to say but that isn't much different than in corporate America. Warren Buffet makes about 10,000 times what his highly paid secretary makes yet pays a lower percentage of taxes.  Great players now are going to get a free ride and better college offers.  That's pretty gangster...


----------



## Round

MakeAPlay said:


> That is the first time in like 6 years that I have seen you compliment Surf!!


I had some, long time ago.  Here's some, good organization, not as expensive as people think, Surf cup pay is good, good fields, most of the unscrupulous coaches don't last.  They are kind of like thr Patriots, keep dominating no matter who the players are.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Sandypk said:


> What club does your dd play for?  Question:  Can ECNL players make a switch right now to a non-ECNL team before National Cup and during the last few games of CRL?  That can make a huge impact for some already good teams.  Another question is: What team will these top ECNL players join?  And:  Will they stop their long commutes and return home to a closer club?  I guess time will tell...  I actually can't wait to see it all unfold from the sidelines.


Antecdotal so take it with grain of salt
1. Several teams have brought players into their teams for last games of CRL
It isn't against the rules which I found odd but oh well. If they are "on the team" they can play 
2. The current ECNL teams are either being offered DA spot and stay or not. Due to the fact that these are middle schoolers I think majority are going DA because we don't have to make a choice until 9th grade anyway. 
3. They are going closer to homes. They are getting big scholarships and some people don't want to play for certain coaches at big name clubs which is why they are leaving. We are not talking about a few either- it's substantial and dust has already settled and those girls are talking to other DA. 
What I am trying to say is that everything that has been said-
- the top clubs will still be top clubs 
-people will want to go to proven clubs 
- ecnl will still be a great league 

Is being openly and rashly challenged by the parents. People I NEVER thought would go to Pats are getting full ride and going. Legends has secured TOP talent.


----------



## Round

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree.  With the way things are headed it seems that it is clear that the elite players are going to get a free ride on the backs of everyone else.  It's sad to say but that isn't much different than in corporate America. Warren Buffet makes about 10,000 times what his highly paid secretary makes yet pays a lower percentage of taxes.  Great players now are going to get a free ride and better college offers.  That's pretty gangster...


Warren Buffet is a dick, that's a different thing.  People with more average players won't keep doing this if they are clearly being told that their kids have no importance or chane.  We will go back to small local clubs, that's probably a good thing.

I've had kids in this since the mid 2000's.  Things have really changed and not for the better.  

Sorry, that college stuff is mostly bs for most kids.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree.  With the way things are headed it seems that it is clear that the elite players are going to get a free ride on the backs of everyone else.  It's sad to say but that isn't much different than in corporate America. Warren Buffet makes about 10,000 times what his highly paid secretary makes yet pays a lower percentage of taxes.  Great players now are going to get a free ride and better college offers.  That's pretty gangster...


No different than AAU. That's where we are headed. 
Totally gangster- know one parent who got 2k from a certain club and called another and said hey you can have her for full ride and went. People are ABSOLUTELY aging for full ride thing. Of course clubs are doing usual cloak and mirrors game too- "I can give you 2kbut don't tell anyone".. 
again buyer beware. Like I said I want to see the B team ECNL faces when they see the sticker price UNLESS ECNL will decrease the fees this year


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Round said:


> Warren Buffet is a dick, that's a different thing.  People with more average players won't keep doing this if they are clearly being told that their kids have no importance or chane.  We will go back to small local clubs, that's probably a good thing.
> 
> I've had kids in this since the mid 2000's.  Things have really changed and not for the better.
> 
> Sorry, that college stuff is mostly bs for most kids.


Agree a lot. Also agree though with people being honest because these clubs only exist because we do this- we say yes I am buying into the fact that my kid at 14 is going to "move up". That's not healthy either to continually do this to kids.
I see it every year club hoppers, new coaches etc. 
Find a coach who believes in your daughter and go from there.
If you are bored on Netflix watch "AT ALL COSTS" . It's an eye opener. 
I personally do not see anything wrong with going back to the ONE REGIONAL TEAM OF ELITE PLAYERS with a strong id program in place. 
The poll is diluted now. It just is and it's weird that no one is seeing or saying that yet...


----------



## MakeAPlay

ESPNANALYST said:


> Antecdotal so take it with grain of salt
> 1. Several teams have brought players into their teams for last games of CRL
> It isn't against the rules which I found odd but oh well. If they are "on the team" they can play
> 2. The current ECNL teams are either being offered DA spot and stay or not. Due to the fact that these are middle schoolers I think majority are going DA because we don't have to make a choice until 9th grade anyway.
> 3. They are going closer to homes. They are getting big scholarships and some people don't want to play for certain coaches at big name clubs which is why they are leaving. We are not talking about a few either- it's substantial and dust has already settled and those girls are talking to other DA.
> What I am trying to say is that everything that has been said-
> - the top clubs will still be top clubs
> -people will want to go to proven clubs
> - ecnl will still be a great league
> 
> Is being openly and rashly challenged by the parents. People I NEVER thought would go to Pats are getting full ride and going. Legends has secured TOP talent.



Perhaps it is being challenged but a free Hyundai is still a Hyundai and not a Lexus.  Hodges may try to comp all the talent that he wants to but players that can't play quality soccer are cycled out of the YNT and don't play a lot in college.  A diamond is still a diamond and a cubic zirconia may look like a diamond and the price may be right but it isn't a diamond.  I guess if you mix a few diamonds in you can fool people.  You just can't fool them when it matters like when they are playing against real ones.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

MakeAPlay said:


> Perhaps it is being challenged but a free Hyundai is still a Hyundai and not a Lexus.  Hodges may try to comp all the talent that he wants to but players that can't play quality soccer are cycled out of the YNT and don't play a lot in college.  A diamond is still a diamond and a cubic zirconia may look like a diamond and the price may be right but it isn't a diamond.  I guess if you mix a few diamonds in you can fool people.  You just can't fool them when it matters like when they are playing against real ones.


Love you but you don't know whose coaching at the "bigs" 
A free Hyundai for a year is better than a gutted out Mercedes just saying...and a smart consumer knows that 7 and 8 graders still got a tad bit of time. Plus most of them have private trainers anyway so it washes out


----------



## MakeAPlay

ESPNANALYST said:


> Agree a lot. Also agree though with people being honest because these clubs only exist because we do this- we say yes I am buying into the fact that my kid at 14 is going to "move up". That's not healthy either to continually do this to kids.
> I see it every year club hoppers, new coaches etc.
> Find a coach who believes in your daughter and go from there.
> If you are bored on Netflix watch "AT ALL COSTS" . It's an eye opener.
> I personally do not see anything wrong with going back to the ONE REGIONAL TEAM OF ELITE PLAYERS with a strong id program in place.
> The poll is diluted now. It just is and it's weird that no one is seeing or saying that yet...


Great post I agree 100%.  Like Kevin Spacey said in THE USUAL SUSPECTS, "the greatest trick that the devil pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist."


----------



## MakeAPlay

ESPNANALYST said:


> Love you but you don't know whose coaching at the "bigs"
> A free Hyundai for a year is better than a gutted out Mercedes just saying...and a smart consumer knows that 7 and 8 graders still got a tad bit of time. Plus most of them have private trainers anyway so it washes out


As I say focus on your player and her coach and you can't go wrong.

Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## NoGoal

Sandypk said:


> What club does your dd play for?  Question:  Can ECNL players make a switch right now to a non-ECNL team before National Cup and during the last few games of CRL?  That can make a huge impact for some already good teams.  Another question is: What team will these top ECNL players join?  And:  Will they stop their long commutes and return home to a closer club?  I guess time will tell...  I actually can't wait to see it all unfold from the sidelines.


Players and parents commuting will probably not play for a club closer to home.  They commute for a reason, stronger club brand, a certain coach, stronger history of getting girls college offers, etc.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Players and parents commuting will probably not play for a club closer to home.  They commute for a reason, stronger club brand, a certain coach, stronger history of getting girls college offers, etc.


Some might even start commuting, if the Girls DA club is "FREE".


----------



## MakeAPlay

All of the NorCal ECNL clubs pulled out of the DA.  In NorCal it is going to be a bunch of less successful clubs (other than PSV Union) leading development.  What a crazy turf war.


----------



## Bananacorner

NorCal thinks they have it all figured out, and are digging their heels in.  I think some of the clubs that declined think they can always pick up a DA later if it looks like ECNL isn't cutting it, but I'm not so sure that's the case.   At any rate, NorCal ECNL will probably be more competitive given many other ECNL teams will be "B" teams.


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> All of the NorCal ECNL clubs pulled out of the DA.  In NorCal it is going to be a bunch of less successful clubs (other than PSV Union) leading development.  What a crazy turf war.


What club*(s)* backed out? What is the indication of success and why can't the GDA clubs meet, or reach/exceed the same success? If ECNL/YNT/ODP/D1 are a measure of success, I am sure many of the NorCal kids that got to that level came from what you categorize as less successful clubs before they moved to an ECNL club (since ECNL was the highest level).



Bananacorner said:


> NorCal thinks they have it all figured out, and are digging their heels in.  I think some of the clubs that declined think they can always pick up a DA later if it looks like ECNL isn't cutting it, but I'm not so sure that's the case.   At any rate, NorCal ECNL will probably be more competitive given many other ECNL teams will be "B" teams.


Many of the best girls will most likely leave ECNL clubs for GDA clubs. Same question - which ECNL clubs declined GDA in NorCal?


----------



## Bananacorner

Mustang dropped first, then Burlingame/MVLA became just Burlingame (MVLA was hedging by partnering with Burlingame, and then dropped?)
DeAnza is hard to figure out what they are doing, sounds like their DA will be part of Portland Thorns (called California Thorns)
Davis Legacy got DA, then got ECNL, then seemed to drop DA and instead there is "California Storm" DA up there.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Bananacorner said:


> Mustang dropped first, then Burlingame/MVLA became just Burlingame (MVLA was hedging by partnering with Burlingame, and then dropped?)
> DeAnza is hard to figure out what they are doing, sounds like their DA will be part of Portland Thorns (called California Thorns)
> Davis Legacy got DA, then got ECNL, then seemed to drop DA and instead there is "California Storm" DA up there.


Thanks.


----------



## davin

MakeAPlay said:


> All of the NorCal ECNL clubs pulled out of the DA.  In NorCal it is going to be a bunch of less successful clubs (other than PSV Union) leading development.  What a crazy turf war.


PSV is going to have problems competing outside of NorCal in the DA. Their coach is really abrasive and rubs many people the wrong way. Many players and parents can't handle him and end up leaving the club. Because of this, they never have enough players to form a full team at each age group. Their teams usually have many girls that are rostered on multiple teams across age groups and are playing 1 or 2 years up so that their teams can have enough players. That is not a good recipe for success, especially at the younger ages, when they will now have to compete nationally. The rest of the NorCal DA clubs haven't had much history of success and 2 of them are brand new, created just for the DA. I don't hear much talk from ECNL families in NorCal of moving their players to the DA. It looks to me that NorCal DA teams are going to be in a world of hurt when they compete out of NorCal next year.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> What club*(s)* backed out? What is the indication of success and why can't the GDA clubs meet, or reach/exceed the same success? If ECNL/YNT/ODP/D1 are a measure of success, I am sure many of the NorCal kids that got to that level came from what you categorize as less successful clubs before they moved to an ECNL club (since ECNL was the highest level).
> 
> 
> 
> Many of the best girls will most likely leave ECNL clubs for GDA clubs. Same question - which ECNL clubs declined GDA in NorCal?


What makes you so sure that they came from less successful clubs?  ECNL has done a great job of developing players in SoCal.  In the most recent two graduating classes very few players who are having success post club are from non-ECNL clubs and that is a fact.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> What makes you so sure that they came from less successful clubs?  ECNL has done a great job of developing players in SoCal.  In the most recent two graduating classes very few players who are having success post club are from non-ECNL clubs and that is a fact.


That is not a fact.  That is your presumption, and that is a fact. Lol


----------



## The Driver

davin said:


> PSV is going to have problems competing outside of NorCal in the DA.


How about their 03 group?


----------



## Bananacorner

The Driver said:


> How about their 03 group?


Good point 03 is strong.


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> What makes you so sure that they came from less successful clubs?  ECNL has done a great job of developing players in SoCal.  In the most recent two graduating classes very few players who are having success post club are from non-ECNL clubs and that is a fact.


I don't because I don't believe in your definition of what makes a less successful club. I do know many ECNL players joined ECNL from non-ECNL clubs.

ECNL develops nothing - it provides a competition platform (maybe it's iD program does 'some' development). Yes, of course successful players are on ECNL clubs because that is (was) the top tier so best players play there to play against the best. What standards does ECNL enforce on clubs other than competition rules?


----------



## The Driver

Bananacorner said:


> Good point 03 is strong.


Don't say strong


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> I don't because I don't believe in your definition of what makes a less successful club. I do know many ECNL players joined ECNL from non-ECNL clubs.
> 
> ECNL develops nothing - it provides a competition platform (maybe it's iD program does 'some' development). Yes, of course successful players are on ECNL clubs because that is (was) the top tier so best players play there to play against the best. What standards does ECNL enforce on clubs other than competition rules?


I get it now, your DD must play for one of those non-ECNL clubs which was awarded Girls DA.


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> I get it now, your DD must play for one of those non-ECNL clubs which was awarded Girls DA.


Wrong.


----------



## MarkM

Bananacorner said:


> Mustang dropped first, then Burlingame/MVLA became just Burlingame (MVLA was hedging by partnering with Burlingame, and then dropped?)
> DeAnza is hard to figure out what they are doing, sounds like their DA will be part of Portland Thorns (called California Thorns)
> Davis Legacy got DA, then got ECNL, then seemed to drop DA and instead there is "California Storm" DA up there.


The GDA clubs for 2017-2018 have already been listed by US Soccer.  There are 5 clubs listed in NoCal.  Have any of these been dropped?   http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory  De Anza did announce a partnership with the Thorns for its GDA program.  I would imagine De Anza is all in on GDA if they are announcing this partnership.    http://nocalsoccer.com/index.php?threads/portland-thorns-breaking-into-bay-area-by-partnering-with-force.982/#post-13027


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Wrong.


Yeah, if you say so!


----------



## davin

The Driver said:


> How about their 03 group?


PSV 03's came in 4th in their fall NPL league, behind MVLA and DeAnza. They're good, but there are at least 5 NorCal team better than them currently, and not many kids will jump ship to play for that coach.


----------



## The Driver

So GDA will have discovery players as well but they are D2 players only within the same club?


----------



## davin

MarkM said:


> The GDA clubs for 2017-2018 have already been listed by US Soccer.  There are 5 clubs listed in NoCal.  Have any of these been dropped?   http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory  De Anza did announce a partnership with the Thorns for its GDA program.  I would imagine De Anza is all in on GDA if they are announcing this partnership.    http://nocalsoccer.com/index.php?threads/portland-thorns-breaking-into-bay-area-by-partnering-with-force.982/#post-13027


You have to read the entire thread in the link you posted from the Nocal site to get the entire picture. DeAnza announced the partnership on their website, then scrubbed all references to the partnership a couple of weeks after it was announced.


----------



## MarkM

davin said:


> You have to read the entire thread in the link you posted from the Nocal site to get the entire picture. DeAnza announced the partnership on their website, then scrubbed all references to the partnership a couple of weeks after it was announced.


I totally missed that.  Thanks for point that out!


----------



## Bananacorner

MarkM said:


> The GDA clubs for 2017-2018 have already been listed by US Soccer.  There are 5 clubs listed in NoCal.  Have any of these been dropped?   http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-club-directory  De Anza did announce a partnership with the Thorns for its GDA program.  I would imagine De Anza is all in on GDA if they are announcing this partnership.    http://nocalsoccer.com/index.php?threads/portland-thorns-breaking-into-bay-area-by-partnering-with-force.982/#post-13027


Burlingame (without MVLA), De Anza/Thorns, PSV, LaMorinda, California Storm, and San Jose Earthquakes are presumably all still "in."


----------



## NoGoal

Good read for the ulittle parents.
http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/games-thrones-ecnl-vs-girls-development-academy-cold-war-rages/

Let the battle for the almighty club dollar begin!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> That is not a fact.  That is your presumption, and that is a fact. Lol


Okay name one.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> I don't because I don't believe in your definition of what makes a less successful club. I do know many ECNL players joined ECNL from non-ECNL clubs.
> 
> ECNL develops nothing - it provides a competition platform (maybe it's iD program does 'some' development). Yes, of course successful players are on ECNL clubs because that is (was) the top tier so best players play there to play against the best. What standards does ECNL enforce on clubs other than competition rules?


That is a flat out lie.  My daughter was developed by the ECNL.  What does the DA plan to do?  Trust the same clubs.  

Baa baaa.  I here sheep....


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> That is not a fact.  That is your presumption, and that is a fact. Lol[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> LadiesMan217 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't because I don't believe in your definition of what makes a less successful club. I do know many ECNL players joined ECNL from non-ECNL clubs.
> 
> ECNL develops nothing - it provides a competition platform (maybe it's iD program does 'some' development). Yes, of course successful players are on ECNL clubs because that is (was) the top tier so best players play there to play against the best. What standards does ECNL enforce on clubs other than competition rules?
> 
> 
> 
> Name one player on a tournament team that was a starter or key contributor that played for a non ECNL club other than Tavia Leachman?
Click to expand...


----------



## EastBaySoccerFan

It is very interesting being from Norcal and reading the Socal Forums.  Seems like all top players in Socal are going to DA.  But, here in Norcal, it seems like all ECNL all the way.  Who knows what will go on in the next few months, but as of now, it seems as though the level of DA teams in Norcal will be very low!


----------



## Bananacorner

EastBaySoccerFan said:


> It is very interesting being from Norcal and reading the Socal Forums.  Seems like all top players in Socal are going to DA.  But, here in Norcal, it seems like all ECNL all the way.  Who knows what will go on in the next few months, but as of now, it seems as though the level of DA teams in Norcal will be very low!


Baahaa, no one cares what the level of DA teams in Norcal will be!  Good luck with ECNL!


----------



## NoGoal

EastBaySoccerFan said:


> It is very interesting being from Norcal and reading the Socal Forums.  Seems like all top players in Socal are going to DA.  But, here in Norcal, it seems like all ECNL all the way.  Who knows what will go on in the next few months, but as of now, it seems as though the level of DA teams in Norcal will be very low!


NorCal's club soccer market will be interesting to follow the next few years.  That region will be a battleground between ECNL vs Girls DA.  The clubs up there are apparently squared off against each other.


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> That is a flat out lie.  My daughter was developed by the ECNL.  What does the DA plan to do?  Trust the same clubs.
> 
> Baa baaa.  I here sheep....


How did ECNL develop your daughter? Surf is a great club with some real good coaches that I am sure developed your daughter; but, what did ECNL do other than provide the competition platform? I am trying to be educated in what ECNL offers - no lies just questions and observations.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> How did ECNL develop your daughter? Surf is a great club with some real good coaches that I am sure developed your daughter; but, what did ECNL do other than provide the competition platform? I am trying to be educated in what ECNL offers - no lies just questions and observations.


You are punch drunk with Girls DA Kool-aid.  #sheep, #sucker


----------



## Bananacorner

The DA vs ECNL debate won't be decided by Northern CA.  Its a bit bigger than bay area and sacra-tomato.  Now if SoCal defected and everyone dropped DA, then maybe you would have an issue early on, but even then if the rest of the US moved to DA SoCal ECNL would get bored playing themselves all the time.


----------



## NoGoal

Bananacorner said:


> The DA vs ECNL debate won't be decided by Northern CA.  Its a bit bigger than bay area and sacra-tomato.  Now if SoCal defected and everyone dropped DA, then maybe you would have an issue early on, but even then if the rest of the US moved to DA SoCal ECNL would get bored playing themselves all the time.


You're looking at the small picture.  The bigger picture is, if NorCal ECNL outperforms NorCal's Girls DA clubs.  Such as more YNT player invites and college commits.  It could reverberate nationally.

As for SoCal getting bored playing each other, that wasn't the case with CSL Premier League and Surf dominating the Presidio League prior the ECNL's birth.  Truth be told, ECNL and Girls DA needs the best SoCal clubs than the clubs needing either leagues.  The college coaches all know how deep the talent is here!


----------



## younothat

NoGoal said:


> Good read for the ulittle parents.
> http://www.soccerwire.com/blog-posts/games-thrones-ecnl-vs-girls-development-academy-cold-war-rages/
> 
> Let the battle for the almighty club dollar begin!


Instead of working together ussf (DA) , usclub (ecnl) , and usys (cal south) are competing against each other for the same "elite" pool of player in their own separate "elite" leagues with different philosophies and players mandates.

I'm not sure how any of this benefits players. parents and clubs taking sides about which is the better league.  #Local problems of the privileged few 

All the above orgs are closed systems without promotion or regulations that heavily they favor the establishment over everything else.

The smaller grassroots community clubs have little or no chance to get in so they struggle to retain players after a certain age.

If the established clubs don't perform or develop players they still retain membership in these leagues, the auditing that is supposed to be done for both ussf and usclub is sorely lacking or not good enough.

Having another "elite" league doesn't improve the quality or style of play.  parents might be happier because they think that membership gets them something...

Better coaching, technical training, and more competitive play are what players need and these league might help in that area but the top down approach leaves a lot of players out of the equation and that's what needs to change.


----------



## Dos Equis

younothat said:


> Instead of working together ussf (DA) , usclub (ecnl) , and usys (cal south) are competing against each other for the same "elite" pool of player in their own separate "elite" leagues with different philosophies and players mandates.
> 
> I'm not sure how any of this benefits players. parents and clubs taking sides about which is the better league.  #Local problems of the privileged few
> 
> All the above orgs are closed systems without promotion or regulations that heavily they favor the establishment over everything else.
> 
> The smaller grassroots community clubs have little or no chance to get in so they struggle to retain players after a certain age.
> 
> If the established clubs don't perform or develop players they still retain membership in these leagues, the auditing that is supposed to be done for both ussf and usclub is sorely lacking or not good enough.
> 
> Having another "elite" league doesn't improve the quality or style of play.  parents might be happier because they think that membership gets them something...
> 
> Better coaching, technical training, and more competitive play are what players need and these league might help in that area but the top down approach leaves a lot of players out of the equation and that's what needs to change.


While I would agree with much of what you say, you are incorrect in characterizing USYS/Calsouth as a closed system.  Their tournaments (state/national cup) are open, and primary leagues (CRL/National League) are structured so any team can qualify or earn an invitation to participate in play-ins.  There is subjectivitiy in the annual invites, but it is not closed.  

While all three groups are guilty of hubris, and to often equate what is best for them as being what is best for youth soccer, what U.S. Club Soccer (ECNL) and U.S. Soccer (DA) take to another level is their desire to close the system and pick the winners.    

I applaud U.S. Soccer for focusing on improving coaching standards, advocating player technical development at younger ages, as well as trying to make elite soccer more accessible by lowering the cost through needs based scholarships.  However, I am not a big fan of them wanting to control and limit competition.  Creativity and innovation are more often born in small start-ups than within a large entity, where challenging the status quo is rarely encouraged nor rewarded.


----------



## soccerobserver

MakeAPlay said:


> All of the NorCal ECNL clubs pulled out of the DA.  In NorCal it is going to be a bunch of less successful clubs (other than PSV Union) leading development.  What a crazy turf war.[/





younothat said:


> Instead of working together ussf (DA) , usclub (ecnl) , and usys (cal south) are competing against each other for the same "elite" pool of player in their own separate "elite" leagues with different philosophies and players mandates.
> 
> I'm not sure how any of this benefits players. parents and clubs taking sides about which is the better league.  #Local problems of the privileged few
> 
> All the above orgs are closed systems without promotion or regulations that heavily they favor the establishment over everything else.
> 
> The smaller grassroots community clubs have little or no chance to get in so they struggle to retain players after a certain age.
> 
> If the established clubs don't perform or develop players they still retain membership in these leagues, the auditing that is supposed to be done for both ussf and usclub is sorely lacking or not good enough.
> 
> Having another "elite" league doesn't improve the quality or style of play.  parents might be happier because they think that membership gets them something...
> 
> Better coaching, technical training, and more competitive play are what players need and these league might help in that area but the top down approach leaves a lot of players out of the equation and that's what needs to change.


Unothat, I submit that GDA does have promotion and relegation.

The non-ECNL clubs that are "in" have been promoted to the most elite level available in the country. Clubs like Beach, Legends, Pats, LAPFC have been promoted _de facto_... 

Also GDA has relegated some clubs...the ECNL clubs that were not invited to GDA have been relegated _de facto_ as well...

Since clubs can apply to GDA it seems that from time to time clubs may be included and excluded based upon results and the financial fitness of the applicants...just speculation on my part but their platform seems to allow for promotion and culling in a way that was not so clear w the ECNL oligopoly...


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccerobserver said:


> Unothat, I submit that GDA does have promotion and relegation.
> 
> The non-ECNL clubs that are "in" have been promoted to the most elite level available in the country. Clubs like Beach, Legends, Pats, LAPFC have been promoted _de facto_...
> 
> Also GDA has relegated some clubs...the ECNL clubs that were not invited to GDA have been relegated _de facto_ as well...
> 
> Since clubs can apply to GDA it seems that from time to time clubs may be included and excluded based upon results and the financial fitness of the applicants...just speculation on my part but their platform seems to allow for promotion and culling in a way that was not so clear w ECNL...


How many Boys DA clubs have been demoted?  The director of the Boys DA is running things on the girls side too.  I think that the number will shock you.


----------



## Desert Hound

MakeAPlay said:


> How many Boys DA clubs have been demoted?  The director of the Boys DA is running things on the girls side too.  I think that the number will shock you.


I will bite. How many boys DA clubs have been demoted?


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> How did ECNL develop your daughter? Surf is a great club with some real good coaches that I am sure developed your daughter; but, what did ECNL do other than provide the competition platform? I am trying to be educated in what ECNL offers - no lies just questions and observations.


Who said that my daughter was developed by Surf?


----------



## Lone Wolf

MakeAPlay said:


> Who said that my daughter was developed by Surf?


Go Hoya's


----------



## Bananacorner

Lone Wolf said:


> Go Hoya's


Aaaalright, ok that's enough now.  No more clues, you super sleuths.  TMI sharing


----------



## MakeAPlay

Desert Hound said:


> I will bite. How many boys DA clubs have been demoted?


http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/da/report-u-s-soccer-drops-fc-wisconsin-nationals-out-of-development-academy-for-next-season/

This is the only one that I have seen mentioned although it does say another club or two has been kicked out.  My point is that getting kicked out is extremely rare and not very likely.


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> Who said that my daughter was developed by Surf?


Strikers/Surf whatever - ECNL did little.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> Strikers/Surf whatever - ECNL did little.


Nice try.  My daughter would disagree with you but okay.  You are right ECNL did little it was all magic.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Nice try.  My daughter would disagree with you but okay.  You are right ECNL did little it was all magic.


Other than set up the schedule, what does ECNL do specifically to "develop" players?


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> Nice try.  My daughter would disagree with you but okay.  You are right ECNL did little it was all magic.


My honest belief is Strikers and/or Surf did it. I think ECNL just gave the competitive platform. I am trying to be educated, not troll. What did ECNL specifically do? They have no minimum coaching standards etc. correct? If you know something please share...


----------



## chargerfan

LadiesMan217 said:


> My honest belief is Strikers and/or Surf did it. I think ECNL just gave the competitive platform. I am trying to be educated, not troll. What did ECNL specifically do? They have no minimum coaching standards etc. correct? If you know something please share...


It seems like playing with and against top talent would develop a player.


----------



## LadiesMan217

chargerfan said:


> It seems like playing with and against top talent would develop a player.


Without a doubt.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> My honest belief is Strikers and/or Surf did it. I think ECNL just gave the competitive platform. I am trying to be educated, not troll. What did ECNL specifically do? They have no minimum coaching standards etc. correct? If you know something please share...


The ECNL provided the teammates and competition along with the more motivated and dedicated coaches that pushed my daughter to constantly hone her craft into what it is today.  She was motivated to constantly work on improving every aspect of her game and to strive to be the best player on the pitch.  The ECNL contained the majority of the elite players in the USA which constantly gave her the ability to measure herself against the best.  Her performance in this cauldron focused her not only athletically but also academically (I told her I wouldn't spend the money without her getting straight A's).  It developed her time management, it forced her to have to make grown up decisions (I have to skip the dance/movie/whatever because of a game).  The ECNL did plenty to develop my player but like any major project it took a village (ECNL, her coaches, her parents, her teammates) in order to get her to where she is today and it will continue to be a group effort to get her to where she wants to go.


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> The ECNL provided the teammates and competition along with the more motivated and dedicated coaches that pushed my daughter to constantly hone her craft into what it is today.  She was motivated to constantly work on improving every aspect of her game and to strive to be the best player on the pitch.  The ECNL contained the majority of the elite players in the USA which constantly gave her the ability to measure herself against the best.  Her performance in this cauldron focused her not only athletically but also academically (I told her I wouldn't spend the money without her getting straight A's).  It developed her time management, it forced her to have to make grown up decisions (I have to skip the dance/movie/whatever because of a game).  The ECNL did plenty to develop my player but like any major project it took a village (ECNL, her coaches, her parents, her teammates) in order to get her to where she is today and it will continue to be a group effort to get her to where she wants to go.


Thanks. I understand your train of thought on how the ECNL developed your DD.


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-boys/development-academy-adds-17-new-clubs-for-2017-2018-season/

On the boys side there seems to be waaaay too many DA clubs.  I see that Rebels was added.  You have to seriously wonder if there is enough elite level talent in San Diego to support 5 academy clubs.  US soccer talks about developing talent for the national team but the reality is that it is about control and access to a revenue stream.  Madoff would be proud.


----------



## DefenseWins

MakeAPlay said:


> http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-boys/development-academy-adds-17-new-clubs-for-2017-2018-season/
> 
> On the boys side there seems to be waaaay too many DA clubs.  I see that Rebels was added.  You have to seriously wonder if there is enough elite level talent in San Diego to support 5 academy clubs.  US soccer talks about developing talent for the national team but the reality is that it is about control and access to a revenue stream.  Madoff would be proud.


Rebels was added at the U12 age group only.  There is plenty of talent in San Diego at this level for multiple academy teams.  When it comes to the national team recruitment, they aren't recruiting out of the U12 age group.  But this does give them control over the development of the players that are coming out of the rebels geographical location, which will eventually feed into the academy clubs that have the age groups that they recruit from.


----------



## MakeAPlay

DefenseWins said:


> Rebels was added at the U12 age group only.  There is plenty of talent in San Diego at this level for multiple academy teams.  When it comes to the national team recruitment, they aren't recruiting out of the U12 age group.  But this does give them control over the development of the players that are coming out of the rebels geographical location, which will eventually feed into the academy clubs that have the age groups that they recruit from.


I keep hearing that there is enough talent but I am talking elite level talent.  I just am not convinced that there are 90 elite kids in any birth year in all of SoCal.   I have a pretty high bar for what I consider elite.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> I keep hearing that there is enough talent but I am talking elite level talent.  I just am not convinced that there are 90 elite kids in any birth year in all of SoCal.   I have a pretty high bar for what I consider elite.


The what about the ELITE Clubs National League?


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> The what about the ELITE Clubs National League?


In 5 years of my daughter playing in the ECNL I didn't think that all of the players where elite even in a small market like San Diego where Surf had most of the best players in each age group on one team.  Some age groups are a little different than other.  The 99/98 Surf team has a roster of top players many of which are elite.

Elite players are easy to recognize.  They are the players that dominate games between top level teams.  In SoCal per age group there are 30 kids or less that qualify.  I think the problem is threefold.  First, most don't recognize elite talent because their idea of elite is their kid.  Second, unless you go see the top teams play each other, it is hard to see who is dominating those games.  Finally, elite at 12 isn't elite at 18 and as players age it is easier to recognize who is truly elite and who is just an early bloomer.


----------



## DefenseWins

MakeAPlay said:


> I keep hearing that there is enough talent but I am talking elite level talent.  I just am not convinced that there are 90 elite kids in any birth year in all of SoCal.   I have a pretty high bar for what I consider elite.


I think most parents of elite kids who play on elite teams have a very skewed view of what elite is, and as you mentioned, we hold that standard very high.  

I've seen players whom I didn't consider 'elite' move on and have success with other 'elite' teams (as have you I'm sure).  It's not always because the coach is a better coach, I've seen situations where that player just fits better into a different system, or into a different set of players.  Exposing and developing  their individual strengths, allowing that player to master them, and eventually rise to 'elite' status.  I personally think having too few 'inclusive' teams at the younger age groups leaves out a lot of 'talented' kids with 'elite' potential.  It forces the 'talented' kids at that moment to play a certain way (because we are a society that likes to win) that won't necessarily develop them to their fullest 'elite' potential.  These types of players are being completely shut out of our current system.  A system that US Soccer has no control over.  Therefore, I think it's completely reasonable for US Soccer to want to control the pipeline that feeds their system.

You're right, elite players are easy to recognize.  What is not so easy to recognize is 'talent' with 'elite' potential, and how to develop that.


----------



## bababooey

Let me play devil's advocate here MAP. Are there 90 elite players in San Diego County or Orange County or LA County at any given age group, not likely. With ECNL, I doubt very few teams at any age level have more than four or five elite level players on their roster.

However at U12, I have no issues with more Academy teams than less Academy teams. With any sport, those that dominate at 12 years old may not be elite level talent at college age. Conversely, the players who dominate at college level age may be average/above average at 12 years old. Let more players in at this age and see how it washes out.

If the parents are willing to pay the price and the player is willing to make the commitment to Academy, then why should we limit the amount of teams?


----------



## The Driver

bababooey said:


> Let me play devil's advocate here MAP. Are there 90 elite players in San Diego County or Orange County or LA County at any given age group, not likely. With ECNL, I doubt very few teams at any age level have more than four or five elite level players on their roster.
> 
> However at U12, I have no issues with more Academy teams than less Academy teams. With any sport, those that dominate at 12 years old may not be elite level talent at college age. Conversely, the players who dominate at college level age may be average/above average at 12 years old. Let more players in at this age and see how it washes out.
> 
> If the parents are willing to pay the price and the player is willing to make the commitment to Academy, then why should we limit the amount of teams?


Lets say We invite the semi's of SCDSL and CSL then hold open tryouts to just those league members. How do you think 4 teams out of that group of players would fair again the SW ECNL in a league format? Wait no discovery players though.


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> Lets say We invite the semi's of SCDSL and CSL then hold open tryouts to just those league members. How do you think 4 teams out of that group of players would fair again the SW ECNL in a league format? Wait no discovery players though.


ECNL would wax all of the teams.  They could play their bench and beat almost all of them.


----------



## The Driver

MakeAPlay said:


> ECNL would wax all of the teams.  They could play their bench and beat almost all of them.


In the 03 group?


----------



## The Driver

MakeAPlay said:


> ECNL would wax all of the teams.  They could play their bench and beat almost all of them.


Proof the Academy is needed.


----------



## MakeAPlay

DefenseWins said:


> I think most parents of elite kids who play on elite teams have a very skewed view of what elite is, and as you mentioned, we hold that standard very high.
> 
> I've seen players whom I didn't consider 'elite' move on and have success with other 'elite' teams (as have you I'm sure).  It's not always because the coach is a better coach, I've seen situations where that player just fits better into a different system, or into a different set of players.  Exposing and developing  their individual strengths, allowing that player to master them, and eventually rise to 'elite' status.  I personally think having too few 'inclusive' teams at the younger age groups leaves out a lot of 'talented' kids with 'elite' potential.  It forces the 'talented' kids at that moment to play a certain way (because we are a society that likes to win) that won't necessarily develop them to their fullest 'elite' potential.  These types of players are being completely shut out of our current system.  A system that US Soccer has no control over.  Therefore, I think it's completely reasonable for US Soccer to want to control the pipeline that feeds their system.
> 
> You're right, elite players are easy to recognize.  What is not so easy to recognize is 'talent' with 'elite' potential, and how to develop that.


I agree with you.  My daughter was a relatively late bloomer.  She would always make the ODP cut down to 24 or 36 players but was an alternate to regional's until her freshman year of high school.  In my opinion, the only reason that she didn't fall through the cracks is that she had good coaches that knew that she had the tools to be successful and simply continued to push her to improve.

I agree that more teams at a younger age would cast a wider net and catch more of the elite players.  I just don't think that is what they are doing.  As it seems to me, they are diluting the player pool and the odds of putting together a super team (which benefits the truly elite players the most) are much lower.  It won't prevent the extremely special players from showing that they are special but it may affect the next level of players that benefit from playing with the best.  We will see soon enough.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> ECNL would wax all of the teams.  They could play their bench and beat almost all of them.


The last two times Surf played Carlsbad '99, Carlsbad dominated both games 2-0. Carlsbad out passed them, out dribbled them, was more creative and out shot them. One of those games was the 1/4 finals of Surf Cup (I don't think they were playing their bench). The next season, that Surf team lost impact players to Albion. This age group is one of the reasons I  believe the ECNL monopoly in San Diego county was counterproductive. With the talk of late bloomers, I know there have been impact players on the WNT that bloomed in late college. Now GDA is repeating the same close system mistake that ECNL had, but at least it solved some SoCal issues and to be honest I don't really care about the rest of the country. SoCal does have enough elite players to field a team that could compete with the National Team at any age group. The US is so big, I think regional teams make more sense.


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> Proof the Academy is needed.


How is that proof?


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> The last two times Surf played Carlsbad '99, Carlsbad dominated both games 2-0. Carlsbad out passed them, out dribbled them, was more creative and out shot them. One of those games was the 1/4 finals of Surf Cup (I don't think they were playing their bench). The next season, that Surf team lost impact players to Albion. This age group is one of the reasons I  believe the ECNL monopoly in San Diego county was counterproductive. With the talk of late bloomers, I know there have been impact players on the WNT that bloomed in late college. Now GDA is repeating the same close system mistake that ECNL had, but at least it solved some SoCal issues and to be honest I don't really care about the rest of the country. SoCal does have enough elite players to field a team that could compete with the National Team at any age group. The US is so big, I think regional teams make more sense.


Outside, I admire your passion and it may be true in your daughter's isolated age group but it simply is not true when you look at all of the age groups.  Regarding a SoCal team beating a national team it simply isn't true.  The younger aged youth national teams routinely scrimmage CalSouth all star and ODP teams that are older aged and lose to them.  I have seen them with my own eyes.  I would bet that the U16 YNT could beat any U17/18 team in SoCal including the ones with YNT players.  I have seen it happen.  My daughter was on an all star team along with two other players that were on the YNT and they lost to the U16 YNT last season.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> ECNL would wax all of the teams.  They could play their bench and beat almost all of them.


Unfortunately your statement has little merit.  I would agree that top to bottom ECNL has the the edge by a decent amount but to say "ECNL would wax all of the teams" is simply a stretch.  Beach FC's '02 Academy tied Slammers ECNL 1-1  at the Thanksgiving College Showcase. My DD and I watched the game because our neighbors DD plays for the Slammers ECNL team (currently sit in 2nd place in the SW region).   Both teams were only missing 1 player.  

The youngers landscape has changed a lot since your DD played, I'm sure you can at least agree with that much.


----------



## outside!

Kicker4Life said:


> Unfortunately your statement has little merit.  I would agree that top to bottom ECNL has the the edge by a decent amount but to say "ECNL would wax all of the teams" is simply a stretch.  Beach FC's '02 Academy tied Slammers ECNL 1-1  at the Thanksgiving College Showcase. My DD and I watched the game because our neighbors DD plays for the Slammers ECNL team (currently sit in 2nd place in the SW region).   Both teams were only missing 1 player.
> 
> The youngers landscape has changed a lot since your DD played, I'm sure you can at least agree with that much.


There are more examples in the age group I am familiar with as well. Check out the ECNL record of TopHat 99. They have done well in ECNL. The last time they played in the USYS National Championships however, they didn't make it out of group play The top teams in the two organizations are very competitive with one another. I think it is good that DA and GDA are paying attention to all of San Diego county. The huge growth in North county over the past 3o years produced a lot of kids to make it a soccer powerhouse. But that growth spurt is leveling off and the population is now aging (just as it did earlier for central San Diego). South San Diego county is growing by leaps and bounds and it is a good idea to offer local opportunities to those players. Right now, the top HS teams are usually in North County. I predict in 15 years some of the top HS teams will be from East Lake/Chula Vista.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> Unfortunately your statement has little merit.  I would agree that top to bottom ECNL has the the edge by a decent amount but to say "ECNL would wax all of the teams" is simply a stretch.  Beach FC's '02 Academy tied Slammers ECNL 1-1  at the Thanksgiving College Showcase. My DD and I watched the game because our neighbors DD plays for the Slammers ECNL team (currently sit in 2nd place in the SW region).   Both teams were only missing 1 player.
> 
> The youngers landscape has changed a lot since your DD played, I'm sure you can at least agree with that much.


I can't honestly remember a game against a non-ECNL team (including Surf Cup) where my player's coach played to win.  Usually the subs played as much or more than the starters.  during my daughter's next to last Surf Cup (U17) once they had clinched a spot in the quarterfinals the coach started most of the bench and the game ended in a draw to a team that they waxed the last time they played. 

 When you are on the outside looking in it's hard to tell what is going on.  Now I don't know your daughter's friend's team, but I bet I know the coach.  If they were playing to win then congrats but I never saw it.

Yes the landscape has changed in the last year.  Not that much though.


----------



## CaliKlines

And in late November, Legends FC 99 team played against the older ECNL (U19) teams of Slammers FC (beat them 4-0), West Coast (beat them 1-0), and tied SC Del Sol 1-1. Let the excuses begin...remember you said "they would wax any non-ECNL team."


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> There are more examples in the age group I am familiar with as well. Check out the ECNL record of TopHat 99. They have done well in ECNL. The last time they played in the USYS National Championships however, they didn't make it out of group play The top teams in the two organizations are very competitive with one another. I think it is good that DA and GDA are paying attention to all of San Diego county. The huge growth in North county over the past 3o years produced a lot of kids with to make it a soccer powerhouse. But that growth spurt is leveling off and the population is now aging (just as it did earlier for central San Diego). South San Diego county is growing by leaps and bounds and it is a good idea to offer local opportunities to those players.


Please see post #1465 above.  I can tell you that in my daughter's age group the team that won the U16 ECNL championships won the USYS championship that same year with mostly subs and "B" team players.  They didn't compete the next year as it was a strain on the players and coaches and the exposure was significantly lower than at the ECNL showcases and championships.

Let's come at it from a different angle.  There were only two players that played for non-ECNL teams in my daughter's graduating class that had a significant impact on a top 25 team this season and about a dozen from ECNL teams.  There are several that played and had an impact just not on a top team.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> And in late November, Legends FC 99 team played against the older ECNL (U19) teams of Slammers FC (beat them 4-0), West Coast (beat them 1-0), and tied SC Del Sol 1-1. Let the excuses begin...remember you said "they would wax any non-ECNL team."


Cali I don't have to make any excuses.  Your Legends team has done a good job of not playing the top players.  The only players on that team that will have any impact in college over the next two years are the black holding mid and the black forward.  The athletic players that schools would want anyway.  Great job of development.  The rest of the team is small market.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> And in late November, Legends FC 99 team played against the older ECNL (U19) teams of Slammers FC (beat them 4-0), West Coast (beat them 1-0), and tied SC Del Sol 1-1. Let the excuses begin...remember you said "they would wax any non-ECNL team."


Just because your daughter was on a bad ECNL team doesn't mean that is the case with the rest.  Have you ever asked yourself why your daughter couldn't get her team into the Champions league?  Mine did 3 years in a row.  What is your excuse?


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> Cali I don't have to make any excuses.  Your Legends team has done a good job of not playing the top players.  The only players on that team that will have any impact in college over the next two years are the black holding mid and the black forward.  The athletic players that schools would want anyway.  Great job of development.  The rest of the team is small market.


And they "waxed" the ECNL teams they competed against.


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> And they "waxed" the ECNL teams they competed against.


If that is how you remember it.  Why wasn't your daughter good enough to elevate her team?  Elite players can do that....

You get no street cred for joining a team that is already good.  And I use that term loosely.  I wish my daughter got a chance to play against that 99 Legends team so that she could lay waste to it.


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> If that is how you remember it.  Why wasn't your daughter good enough to elevate her team?  Elite players can do that....


I'd say it's in pretty poor taste to single out a player in a team sport...but she was good enough to help elevate her non-ECNL team to "wax" the older ECNL teams they just played.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> And in late November, Legends FC 99 team played against the older ECNL (U19) teams of Slammers FC (beat them 4-0), West Coast (beat them 1-0), and tied SC Del Sol 1-1. Let the excuses begin...remember you said "they would wax any non-ECNL team."


Did you really think you were playing the 98/99 ECNL teams?


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> I'd say it's in pretty poor taste to single out a player in team sport...but she was good enough to help elevate her non-ECNL team to "wax" the older ECNL teams they just played.


You tied Del Sol 1-1, not sure if you played the true Slammers ECNL team and as for WCFC you beat their ECNL Composite team aka B team 1-0 only.


----------



## LBSoccer

NoGoal said:


> You tied Del Sol 1-1, not sure if you played the true Slammers ECNL team and as for WCFC you beat their ECNL Composite team aka B team 1-0 only.


If the late November games were played at the Silverlakes showcase then the Slammers ECNL team was what was listed on the schedule but the players on the field were from the composite team. We have friends on both teams and it was definitely the composite team that was there that weekend.


----------



## NoGoal

LBSoccer said:


> If the late November games were played at the Silverlakes showcase then the Slammers ECNL team was what was listed on the schedule but the players on the field were from the composite team. We have friends on both teams and it was definitely the composite team that was there that weekend.


I believe you LBSoccer, because you know the 98/99 age group unlike CaliKlines does.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Did you really think you were playing the 98/99 ECNL teams?


Do you not believe MAP can handle herself? You are a pathetic little puppy,  looking to petted.


----------



## Dos Equis

Of course, whenever a non-ECNL team plays an ECNL team and wins, it was never the actual ECNL roster that played, the ECNL team was experimenting with different lineups, and was in development mode.  Everyone who plays in ECNL accepts that as an axiom.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Do you not believe MAP can handle herself? You are a pathetic little puppy,  looking to petted.


I was replying to CaliKlines, because he actual though he was playing the actual ECNL teams at Silverlakes.  It is my DD's age group and know that wasn't the case, idiot!


----------



## NoGoal

Dos Equis said:


> Of course, whenever a non-ECNL team plays an ECNL team and wins, it was never the actual ECNL roster that played, the ECNL team was experimenting with different lineups, and was in development mode.  Everyone who plays in ECNL accepts that as an axiom.


I would believe it if it were the truth, but when a poster posted his DDs team beat ECNL teams when in fact it was the WCFC and Slammers B teams.  You have to question the source!


----------



## MrXor

I noticed that there are probably 10-12ish parents who post frequently with dds almost done with club and transitioning into college ball.

1. What are things that you did to help your dd along to become "elite" players? Or what did they accomplish at U-X to be sought as
potential elite players? Like a checklist. 

2. How did you know beyond parental loving eyes that your child was going beyond most parent's expectations? 
How did you know that your child was an "exceptional player"? 

3. If your dd can be U12 again, what would you do differently or the same? What are the most important things to focus on
until U-14? Beyond U-14? Please list mistakes you or your dd made and how your dd recovered from it. 

4. Bonus question if it happened to your dd: If your dd dislikes 1-2 players and they equally dislike your dd where they go extra hard
to thump each other during practice and scrimmages,  is this pretty normal for hyper-competitive players? Should I tell my dd to 
calm down or just let nature take its course? I am afraid my dd will hurt the girl since she is way bigger and stronger than her.

Thanks!


----------



## NoGoal

MrXor said:


> I noticed that there are probably 10-12ish parents who post frequently with dds almost done with club and transitioning into college ball.
> 
> 1. What are things that you did to help your dd along to become "elite" players? Or what did they accomplish at U-X to be sought as
> potential elite players? Like a checklist.


I don't consider my DD an elite player. IMO, she is a solid player who is quick, aggressive, hard working, solid technical skills and very coachable.  She is NOT a freak of nature athlete.  What got her on the map was making the ODP Region IV team for 2 years and getting 2 ODP National camp invites.  She never got a YNT camp invite though.



MrXor said:


> 2. How did you know beyond parental loving eyes that your child was going beyond most parent's expectations?
> How did you know that your child was an "exceptional player"?


.

I knew when my DD would train 2.5-3.5 additional hours a week outside of her club practices and games. I knew there were many girls who didn't put in the extra work.  I like to call this the compounding effect.  Also when she didn't make the final 18 player roster for ge Cal-South ODP team.  She worked her tail off the next 1 1/2 years to finally make the team.


MrXor said:


> 3. If your dd can be U12 again, what would you do differently or the same? What are the most important things to focus on
> until U-14? Beyond U-14? Please list mistakes you or your dd made and how your dd recovered from it.


If I had to do it all over again.  I would have moved my DD to Blues at U9 instead of at U12.  I would focused less on chasing a winning team at ulittles and instead on a team where she was having fun, starting and playing a lot of minutes. I would say at U15 it is important to olay against top teams.  The game is faster and more physical.  My DD has played for a few coaches, so what she benefited from is learning different styles of play from possession, kick and run (her least favorite, to defending and counter attacking soccer.  I would highly suggest making sure your DD is a 2 way player (playe offense and defense) and knows multiple postions.


MrXor said:


> 4. Bonus question if it happened to your dd: If your dd dislikes 1-2 players and they equally dislike your dd where they go extra hard
> to thump each other during practice and scrimmages,  is this pretty normal for hyper-competitive players? Should I tell my dd to
> calm down or just let nature take its course? I am afraid my dd will hurt the girl since she is way bigger and stronger than her.
> 
> Thanks!


Yes, that is pretty normal if girls don't like each other on a team.  Top players play with an edge that other regular players don't.  Now if your DD doesn't like the team and the coach.  Then it's best to discuss as a family if it's better to move to another team where it could be a better fit.  As for girls getting hurt, usually the coach will address it, because the last thing he wants is for his players to get hurt at practice.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> I don't consider my DD an elite player. IMO, she is a solid player who is quick, aggressive, hard working, solid technical skills and very coachable.  She is NOT a freak of nature athlete.  What got her on the map was making the ODP Region IV team for 2 years and getting 2 ODP National camp invites.  She never got a YNT camp invite though.
> 
> .
> 
> I knew when my DD would train 2.5-3.5 additional hours a week outside of her club practices and games. I knew there were many girls who didn't put in the extra work.  I like to call this the compounding effect.  Also when she didn't make the final 18 player roster for ge Cal-South ODP team.  She worked her tail off the next 1 1/2 years to finally make the team.
> 
> 
> If I had to do it all over again.  I would have moved my DD to Blues at U9 instead of at U12.  I would focused less on chasing a winning team at ulittles and instead on a team where she was having fun, starting and playing a lot of minutes. I would say at U15 it is important to olay against top teams.  The game is faster and more physical.  My DD has played for a few coaches, so what she benefited from is learning different styles of play from possession, kick and run (her least favorite, to defending and counter attacking soccer.  I would highly suggest making sure your DD is a 2 way player (playe offense and defense) and knows multiple postions.
> 
> Yes, that is pretty normal if girls don't like each other on a team.  Top players play with an edge that other regular players don't.  Now if your DD doesn't like the team and the coach.  Then it's best to discuss as a family if it's better to move to another team where it could be a better fit.  As for girls getting hurt, usually the coach will address it, because the last thing he wants is for his players to get hurt at practice.


 Thanks for sharing this. BIG Ups to your dd


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> Please see post #1465 above.  I can tell you that in my daughter's age group the team that won the U16 ECNL championships won the USYS championship that same year with mostly subs and "B" team players.  They didn't compete the next year as it was a strain on the players and coaches and the exposure was significantly lower than at the ECNL showcases and championships.
> 
> Let's come at it from a different angle.  There were only two players that played for non-ECNL teams in my daughter's graduating class that had a significant impact on a top 25 team this season and about a dozen from ECNL teams.  There are several that played and had an impact just not on a top team.


You know your DD's age group, I know mine. At the 2015 USYS National Championships in Tulsa, TopHat was not yet an ECNL club, they become ECNL right after that and kept the same roster. They were playing all their starters including their NT team player that our NT player knew. I am also very familiar with what was then (before the age/year thing) the 99/2000 Surf ECNL team when we played them at Surf Cup, they were also playing their starters. It may have been different if that team had CM and the other 99's that were playing on the 98/99 ECNL team. The politics and coaching issues (like CC cussing at them and threatening them during half time at Albion Cup) at Surf didn't do that team any favors. One more problem with letting one organization have a monopoly. The fact that Surf does not currently have a 99 ECNL team kind of proves my point. I do not think GDA will solve everything, but I do think it has solved some problems locally.

So you are saying that North Korea can put together a team that beats our NT, but Southern California couldn't put a team together that would be competitive (which is the adjective I used)?


----------



## NoGoal

MrXor said:


> I noticed that there are probably 10-12ish parents who post frequently with dds almost done with club and transitioning into college ball.
> 
> 1. What are things that you did to help your dd along to become "elite" players? Or what did they accomplish at U-X to be sought as
> potential elite players? Like a checklist.
> 
> 2. How did you know beyond parental loving eyes that your child was going beyond most parent's expectations?
> How did you know that your child was an "exceptional player"?
> 
> 3. If your dd can be U12 again, what would you do differently or the same? What are the most important things to focus on
> until U-14? Beyond U-14? Please list mistakes you or your dd made and how your dd recovered from it.
> 
> 4. Bonus question if it happened to your dd: If your dd dislikes 1-2 players and they equally dislike your dd where they go extra hard
> to thump each other during practice and scrimmages,  is this pretty normal for hyper-competitive players? Should I tell my dd to
> calm down or just let nature take its course? I am afraid my dd will hurt the girl since she is way bigger and stronger than her.
> 
> Thanks!


And MOST of all, make your DD learn to play with BOTH feet.  There are an abundance of players (including college players), who can't trap, dribble, pass and shoot (my DD still can't shoot) with their weak foot.  They become more dangerous, if they can attack going left and right instead of their strong side.


----------



## Zerodenero

CaliKlines said:


> And they "waxed" the ECNL teams they competed against.


Uh....are you sure?


----------



## outside!

MrXor said:


> I noticed that there are probably 10-12ish parents who post frequently with dds almost done with club and transitioning into college ball.
> 
> 1. What are things that you did to help your dd along to become "elite" players? Or what did they accomplish at U-X to be sought as
> potential elite players? Like a checklist.
> 
> 2. How did you know beyond parental loving eyes that your child was going beyond most parent's expectations?
> How did you know that your child was an "exceptional player"?
> 
> 3. If your dd can be U12 again, what would you do differently or the same? What are the most important things to focus on
> until U-14? Beyond U-14? Please list mistakes you or your dd made and how your dd recovered from it.
> 
> 4. Bonus question if it happened to your dd: If your dd dislikes 1-2 players and they equally dislike your dd where they go extra hard
> to thump each other during practice and scrimmages,  is this pretty normal for hyper-competitive players? Should I tell my dd to
> calm down or just let nature take its course? I am afraid my dd will hurt the girl since she is way bigger and stronger than her.
> 
> Thanks!


1. I was totally clueless at first. Back then she was usually the fastest player on the field and she loved the game. When I told her she needed to work on her ball skills since she wouldn't always be the fastest, she started juggling more and asked for private lessons. It was actually one of the team parents that told me she needed to be on a better team. A couple of years later we were again looking around at teams and after one practice with her current team she said "I love this team." She lucked into a team with very little drama and players that care for one another (and cool parents as a bonus).

2. I don't know that she is exceptional, but she is a great team player that will play anywhere on the field with positive results. She is lucky enough to be "ambi-footerous" and can shoot, trap and pass with either foot. 

3. At U12, I wish she had had the opportunity to play more futsal. The futsal she did helped her foot skills a lot. Some people don't think it matters, but I think juggling has helped a lot. Injury prevention training is good to start at this age.

4. She has been on teams with players that did not like her, but rarely would they get physical with her at practice. Like I said, she lucked out finding a team where all the girls get along and those issues went away. If the situation with your DD's teammates is effecting game play repeatedly (won't pass to her or bad attitude), it is time to move on.

Best of luck to you and your DD. This whole club soccer team is crazy, but we have met wonderful people and learned a lot along the way. As a bonus, our kids are not couch potatoes! I would personally recommend you get a video camera and video the games. PM me for details if you are interested.


----------



## CaliKlines

Zerodenero said:


> Uh....are you sure?


Uh, yes. Absolutely positive...

*Silverlakes College Showcase 2016*
27 Nov 16 WEST COAST FC ECNL COMPOSITE (U19) 1 - 0 38.74
26 Nov 16 SLAMMERS FC ECNL (U19) 4 - 0 

	
	
		
		
	


	




 38.98
25 Nov 16 SC DEL SOL ECNL (U19) 1 - 1 40.57


----------



## The Driver

Hey what kinda wax yall talking bout 98/99 wax?


----------



## Zerodenero

The Driver said:


> Hey what kinda wax yall talking bout 98/99 wax?


Sort of....He forgot about a group of disbanded huckleberries that had their number for years. Revisionist history I guess.


----------



## The Driver

Ok good 03s ain't taking waxing from Nobody as a group. Very level neck to neck.


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Uh, yes. Absolutely positive...
> 
> *Silverlakes College Showcase 2016*
> 27 Nov 16 WEST COAST FC ECNL COMPOSITE (U19) 1 - 0 38.74
> 26 Nov 16 SLAMMERS FC ECNL (U19) 4 - 0
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 38.98
> 25 Nov 16 SC DEL SOL ECNL (U19) 1 - 1 40.57


You truely don't know the 98/99 age group....I know LBSoccer and her DD.  I believe when she posted it was the Slammers composite team players.   I would also trust KidGretsky, because he also knows the top players in the 98/99 age group.  You do NOT!

I already asked a parent who's DD plays on the Slammers ECNL 98/99 team, if they played at SilverLakes and they reply was.  They didn't!


----------



## gkrent

NoGoal said:


> You truely don't know the 98/99 age group....I know LBSoccer and her DD.  I believe when she posted it was the Slammers composite team players.   I would also trust KidGretsky, because he also knows the top players in the 98/99 age group.  You do NOT!
> 
> I already asked a parent who's DD plays on the Slammers ECNL 98/99 team, if they played at SilverLakes and they reply was.  They didn't!


We played in that tournament and that slammers team was not the normal ECNL team it was a composite of some top u17 and u18 players helping out the uncommitted girls from some of their other squads.


----------



## NoGoal

gkrent said:


> We played in that tournament and that slammers team was not the normal ECNL team it was a composite of some top u17 and u18 players helping out the uncommitted girls from some of their other squads.


That is exactly what my buddy on the Slammers team told me.  The Slammers team was using the ECNL moniker to attract college coaches for their uncommitted players.


----------



## madcow

outside! said:


> The fact that Surf does not currently have a 99 ECNL team kind of proves my point.


Ahhh, no. The reason Surf doesn't have a 99 ECNL team is that ECNL merged the 98 and 99 birth years this year. There are no 99 ECNL teams, just U17, then U18/19.
Nice try though.


----------



## madcow

gkrent said:


> We played in that tournament and that slammers team was not the normal ECNL team it was a composite of some top u17 and u18 players helping out the uncommitted girls from some of their other squads.


I spoke to Walid earlier this year. He confirmed (and I noticed) that he left all of his committed girls home when we played them. Filled the roster with younger and B team players.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> I was replying to CaliKlines, because he actual though he was playing the actual ECNL teams at Silverlakes.  It is my DD's age group and know that wasn't the case, idiot!


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Uh, yes. Absolutely positive...
> 
> *Silverlakes College Showcase 2016*
> 27 Nov 16 WEST COAST FC ECNL COMPOSITE (U19) 1 - 0 38.74
> 26 Nov 16 SLAMMERS FC ECNL (U19) 4 - 0
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 38.98
> 25 Nov 16 SC DEL SOL ECNL (U19) 1 - 1 40.57


Sorry to burst your bubble, but looks like your DDs team didn't wax older ECNL teams after all.


----------



## Kicker4Life

NoGoal said:


> Sorry to burst your bubble, but looks like your DDs team didn't wax older ECNL teams after all.


The quote was, "ECNL would wax all of the teams. *They could play their bench and beat almost all of them*."


----------



## outside!

madcow said:


> Ahhh, no. The reason Surf doesn't have a 99 ECNL team is that ECNL merged the 98 and 99 birth years this year. There are no 99 ECNL teams, just U17, then U18/19.
> Nice try though.


Thanks, I didn't know that ECNL was not having 99 teams this year. That does not change the history of the 99/00 team that would have become the 99 team with the age year change however. I do think that Surf has made many positive changes in the past couple of years. The new DOC seems to be doing good things.


----------



## Zerodenero

NoGoal said:


> Sorry to burst your bubble, but looks like your DDs team didn't wax older ECNL teams after all.


Heck, I remeber when Hodges wanted his flagship 99's to be featured in his college showcase as the sole,  "fri night lights" game vs Rennie/Bobaks 99's.....Cali's 99s got waxed all over chino as they got beat down 3-0 (or something like that)....Tads girls never got invite back (_what a coinkidink_)


----------



## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> The quote was, "ECNL would wax all of the teams. *They could play their bench and beat almost all of them*."


And Cali used the phrase in this post below that his DDs Legends 99 team waxed older ECNL teams at Silverlakes, which weren't the actual ECNL teams afterall.



CaliKlines said:


> And they "waxed" the ECNL teams they competed against.


----------



## CaliKlines

Zerodenero said:


> Heck, I remeber when Hodges wanted his flagship 99's to be featured in his college showcase as the sole,  "fri night lights" game vs Rennie/Bobaks 99's.....Cali's 99s got waxed all over chino as they got beat down 3-0 (or something like that)....Tads girls never got invite back (_what a coinkidink_)


Aw shucks, dem huckleberries are da best ECNL team in all the land, and since it was just a lil old college showcase, we only played our non-committed and younger players.

_


madcow said:



			I spoke to Walid earlier this year. He confirmed (and I noticed) that he left all of his committed girls home when we played them. Filled the roster with younger and B team players.
		
Click to expand...

_


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Aw shucks, dem huckleberries are da best ECNL team in all the land, and since it was just a lil old college showcase, we only played our non-committed and younger players.


D-Nile ain't just a river in Egypt.  It's okay we are getting lots of "alternative facts" nowadays...


----------



## goldentoe

CaliKlines said:


> And in late November, Legends FC 99 team played against the older ECNL (U19) teams of Slammers FC (beat them 4-0), West Coast (beat them 1-0), and tied SC Del Sol 1-1. Let the excuses begin...remember you said "they would wax any non-ECNL team."


 You know what, I'm not going pile on here and tell you  the Del Sol team you tied wasn't the normal squad.  Who am I to steal your thunder.  Please, by all means, enjoy the tie!


----------



## NoGoal

goldentoe said:


> You know what, I'm not going pile on here and tell you  the Del Sol team you tied wasn't the normal squad.  Who am I to steal your thunder.  Please, by all means, enjoy the tie!


When a team beats the GoldenState Warriors without; Durant, Green, Thompson and Curry.  Did the team really beat the GoldenState Warriors?


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> When a team beats the GoldenState Warriors without; Durant, Green, Thompson and Curry.  Did the team really beat the GoldenState Warriors?


Is that a trick question?  The answer is Yes.  Let's not get into Orwellian double-speak.  We hear too much of it these days.


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> When a team beats the GoldenState Warriors without; Durant, Green, Thompson and Curry.  Did the team really beat the GoldenState Warriors?


Yes.


----------



## NoGoal

If a team beat the GoldenState Warriors D league team.  Did the team really beat GoldenState Warriors?


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> If a team beat the GoldenState Warriors D league team.  Did the team really beat GoldenState Warriors?


No, that team would have beaten the Santa Cruz Warriors.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> No, that team would have beaten the Santa Cruz Warriors.


And if the Golden State Warriors played their D league roster, instead of their 12 man roster in a non-league game.  Did that team beat the GoldenState Warriors?


----------



## NoGoal

If you kept on answering my post, NoGoal is the puppet master and  stringing you along.


----------



## pulguita

NoGoal said:


> When a team beats the GoldenState Warriors without; Durant, Green, Thompson and Curry.  Did the team really beat the GoldenState Warriors?


Yes.  Otherwise by your logic every team that competes has to have their full roster at their disposal for anything to really count. And that as we know is total BS and then no one really wins any sort of championship or game what so ever by your definition cause it wasn't "the real team".  So if Brady didn't play last Sunday and the Falcons ended up winning there would be an asterisk in the stats that the win didn't really count?  I have yet to hear this BS in any other sport other than here in the US in any non-professional soccer event.


----------



## NoGoal

pulguita said:


> Yes.  Otherwise by your logic every team that competes has to have their full roster at their disposal for anything to really count. And that as we know is total BS and then no one really wins any sort of championship or game what so ever by your definition cause it wasn't "the real team".  So if Brady didn't play last Sunday and the Falcons ended up winning there would be an asterisk in the stats that the win didn't really count?  I have yet to hear this BS in any other sport other than here in the US in any non-professional soccer event.


If it was a league game yes, it counts.  If it were a preseason or exhibition game all pro teams don't play their starters or if they did it's at most 50% of the game if that.  So how does this apply to club soccer easy.   College Showcases are technically exhibition games, because there are no winners. So apply the same logic to the SilverLakes Showcase in which CaliKlines thinks his DD Legends team beat ECNL teams.....ha!

FWIW, the actual ECNL players played the prior week at the AZ ECNL Showcase and yes the games there counts for wild card playoff standings.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> If it was a league game yes, it counts.  If it were a preseason or exhibition game all pro teams don't play their starters or if they did it's at most 50% of the game if that.  So how does this apply to club soccer easy.   College Showcases are technically exhibition games, because there are no winners. So apply the same logic to the SilverLakes Showcase in which CaliKlines thinks his DD Legends team beat ECNL teams.....ha!
> 
> FWIW, the actual ECNL players played the prior week at the AZ ECNL Showcase and yes the games there counts for wild card playoff standings.


How do we know it's an exhibtion game or not.  A healthy Tom Brady wouldn't sit out a league game more a Super Bowl.  Slammers and Del Sol healthy (committed) ECNL starters didn't play at SilverLakes...many of their B team and uncommitted players did!

So did they really beat ECNL teams, when it really counts? Especially when one was the WCFC composite team!


----------



## pulguita

NoGoal said:


> If it was a league game yes, it counts.  If it were a preseason or exhibition game all pro teams don't play their starters or if they did it's at most 50% of the game if that.  So how does this apply to club soccer easy.   College Showcases are technically exhibition mataches, because there are no winners. So apply the same logic to the SilverLakes Showcase in which CaliKlines thinks his DD Legends team beat ECNL teams.....ha!
> 
> FWIW, the actual ECNL players played the prior week at the AZ ECNL Showcase and yes the games there counts for wild card playoff standings.


Ah yes but its also pretty hard to explain to your parents when your A team gets their asses handed to them by some non ECNL team when you play your starters so coaches can justify anything.  Not saying that was always the motive but a lot of time its probably the case.  Especially when they were playing clubs that they know should have been ECNL and the only advantage they had was they were in and the others weren't.  Dude, listen ECNL is over in So Cal.  There isn't enough kids to go around.  The league will be watered down at least here in SoCal.  Went through 3 seasons of playing the second tier ECNL teams and they all sucked. In fact the only good teams were non ECNL.   This is what ECNL will become.  Sad but true.


----------



## madcow

pulguita said:


> . In fact the only good teams were non ECNL.


Really? The only good teams in So Cal the last 3 years are Non ECNL teams?


----------



## NoGoal

pulguita said:


> Ah yes but its also pretty hard to explain to your parents when your A team gets their asses handed to them by some non ECNL team when you play your starters so coaches can justify anything.  Not saying that was always the motive but a lot of time its probably the case.  Especially when they were playing clubs that they know should have been ECNL and the only advantage they had was they were in and the others weren't.  Dude, listen ECNL is over in So Cal.  There isn't enough kids to go around.  The league will be watered down at least here in SoCal.  Went through 3 seasons of playing the second tier ECNL teams and they all sucked. In fact the only good teams were non ECNL.   This is what ECNL will become.  Sad but true.


I agree ECNL is going to be the B league in SoCal.  I am not debating that.  I am also not debating if a non-ECNL team beats an ECNL team especially if the team beat the actual ECNL rostered players.  But, when CaliKlines assumed his DD waxed older ECNL teams when confirmed by a few parents that wasn't the case.  We have to question the credibility of the poster, especially when we all know he is a Legends propaganda machine!

I will bet money, his DDs 99/00 Legends team next year gets waxed in Girls DA his Fall..  The best players from that team are class of 2017 players!


----------



## pulguita

madcow said:


> Really? The only good teams in So Cal the last 3 years are Non ECNL teams?


Sorry MC, should have clarified that in our experience in the SCDSL league our best 3 games a season were teams from non ECNL clubs.


----------



## pulguita

NoGoal said:


> I agree ECNL is going to be the B league in SoCal.  I am not debating that.  I am also not debating if a non-ECNL team beats an ECNL team especially if the team beat the actual ECNL rostered players.  But, when CaliKlines assumed his DD waxed older ECNL teams when confirmed by a few parents that wasn't the case.  We have to question the credibility of the poster, especially when we all know he is a Legends propaganda machine!
> 
> I will bet money, his DDs 99/00 Legends team next year gets waxed in Girls DA next year.  The best players from that team are class of 2017 players!


I will agree in that case.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Ah yes but its also pretty hard to explain to your parents when your A team gets their asses handed to them by some non ECNL team when you play your starters so coaches can justify anything.  Not saying that was always the motive but a lot of time its probably the case.  Especially when they were playing clubs that they know should have been ECNL and the only advantage they had was they were in and the others weren't.  Dude, listen ECNL is over in So Cal.  There isn't enough kids to go around.  The league will be watered down at least here in SoCal.  Went through 3 seasons of playing the second tier ECNL teams and they all sucked. In fact the only good teams were non ECNL.   This is what ECNL will become.  Sad but true.


Hold on now.  Come on now that is simply not true.  What ECNL teams did you play outside of Arsenal post Kooiman that sucked?  My players ECNL team was not a top 3 team and several of your daughters team played for them prior to the club switch!  So if you are saying that they sucked then that simply isn't true.  Your daughter was a DP on that team!  To say that they sucked is false.  Take your daughter, TL and SD from their team and they were slightly above average.  To be honest both should be playing with my daughter now.  So that they can win multiple national championships like they did in ODP.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> Hold on now.  Come on now that is simply not true.  What ECNL teams did you play outside of Arsenal post Kooiman that sucked?  My players ECNL team was not a top 3 team and several of your daughters team played for them prior to the club switch!  So if you are saying that they sucked then that simply isn't true.  Your daughter was a DP on that team!  To say that they sucked is false.  Take your daughter, TL and SD from their team and they were slightly above average.  To be honest both should be playing with my daughter now.  So that they can win multiple national championships like they did in ODP.


Why is everyone confusing what I said?  My statement was in reference to playing EGSL teams during our SCDSL season and a National Cup or 2.  All of them were poor. They were the B teams.  I was comparing DA team to the ECNL team at ECNL clubs.  There is simply not enough talent in SoCal therefore the DA will be the 1st team and ECNL will be the 2nd team.  Thus equal to the old EGSL.  That is why I made the statement that ECNL in SoCal will be subpar.  As far as DP and SD in Westwood?  No dirty laundry here.  My kid bleeds Trojan blood and she couldn't be happier.  As far as National championships you of all people should know better.  Just cause you have a roster of so and so is no guarantee.  How many "great" teams have not won year after year?  There are breaks and a little luck along the way that is required no matter how good you are especially in soccer and with such a short compacted season I think it gets multiplied.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Why is everyone confusing what I said?  My statement was in reference to playing EGSL teams during our SCDSL season and a National Cup or 2.  All of them were poor. They were the B teams.  I was comparing DA team to the ECNL team at ECNL clubs.  There is simply not enough talent in SoCal therefore the DA will be the 1st team and ECNL will be the 2nd team.  Thus equal to the old EGSL.  That is why I made the statement that ECNL in SoCal will be subpar.  As far as DP and SD in Westwood?  No dirty laundry here.  My kid bleeds Trojan blood and she couldn't be happier.  As far as National championships you of all people should know better.  Just cause you have a roster of so and so is no guarantee.  How many "great" teams have not won year after year?  There are breaks and a little luck along the way that is required no matter how good you are especially in soccer and with such a short compacted season I think it gets multiplied.


No argument here.  Who said anything about Westwood?  I simply said that your daughter and SD should be playing with my daughter.  I'm fine with her bleeding whatever the Trojans call their colors but do you disagree?  I agree about getting the breaks being a part of winning a national championship but I feel pretty good about things right now and if Vegas were making the odds they would be 3 to 1 against the field.  I would love to rehash this conversation come December.  Good luck to your daughter and I look forward to seeing you on the sideline this season.


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccerobserver said:


> Unothat, I submit that GDA does have promotion and relegation.
> 
> The non-ECNL clubs that are "in" have been promoted to the most elite level available in the country. Clubs like Beach, Legends, Pats, LAPFC have been promoted _de facto_...
> 
> Also GDA has relegated some clubs...the ECNL clubs that were not invited to GDA have been relegated _de facto_ as well...
> 
> Since clubs can apply to GDA it seems that from time to time clubs may be included and excluded based upon results and the financial fitness of the applicants...just speculation on my part but their platform seems to allow for promotion and culling in a way that was not so clear w the ECNL oligopoly...


There is no relegation in GDA.  They haven't even put together the rules yet.  Some clubs that were very undeserving in SoCal got GDA namely pretty much all of the non-ECNL clubs.  Just look at their records.  Zero national championships prior to the ECNL teams leaving and very few National team players.  It's not that hard to win a national championship when most of the best teams and players aren't competing.


----------



## megnation

http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/02/16/17/44/20170216-news-gda--miriam-hickey-named-director-of-us-soccer-girls-development-academy


----------



## MakeAPlay

megnation said:


> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/02/16/17/44/20170216-news-gda--miriam-hickey-named-director-of-us-soccer-girls-development-academy


1544 players to received scholarships.  Divide that by 70 academies and 4 age groups which works out to 22 scholarships per club and 5.5 scholarships per team or about 1/4 of the roster.  So are they just going to scholarship the players that the coach considers "elite" or is it going to be a recruiting tool?  Hey soccermom your Mia is going to get  a full ride from us if you come over from (insert Surf, Blues or Slammers here).  We will include all travel costs too!  Are travel costs part of the scholarship?  I like that they finally hired someone to lead this project even if it is only 5 months from kickoff.  It would be nice if we got some specifics.


----------



## megnation

MakeAPlay said:


> 1544 players to received scholarships.  Divide that by 70 academies and 4 age groups which works out to 22 scholarships per club and 5.5 scholarships per team or about 1/4 of the roster.  So are they just going to scholarship the players that the coach considers "elite" or is it going to be a recruiting tool?  Hey soccermom your Mia is going to get  a full ride from us if you come over from (insert Surf, Blues or Slammers here).  We will include all travel costs too!  Are travel costs part of the scholarship?  I like that they finally hired someone to lead this project even if it is only 5 months from kickoff.  It would be nice if we got some specifics.


I did get this article right after the announcement

http://www.socceramerica.com/article/72347/girls-da-director-miriam-hickey-federation-is-bes.html


----------



## MakeAPlay

megnation said:


> I did get this article right after the announcement
> 
> http://www.socceramerica.com/article/72347/girls-da-director-miriam-hickey-federation-is-bes.html



You have to read the comments at the bottom because they are spot on.  I have a little trouble with this statement although it does have it's positives too:

*SA: When you go to watch DA games, what will you be looking for?*

*MIRIAM HICKEY:* There’s not one right way to play. Sometimes the team that plays the long ball wins the game. And at the top level, it’s about winning. But in youth development programs, it’s about players being able to recognize situations on the field. To be able to adjust what they’re doing and react to it and solve those soccer problems on their own without someone on the sidelines telling them what they need to do.

When I watch a team under pressure not use their goalkeeper to relieve pressure, and instead kicking the ball out of bounds to reset, that’s usually a sign that you have a coach who’s not developing their team.

If a goalkeeper makes a save and all she looks for is to punt it – she doesn’t look if there are opportunities to build out of the back -- that’s usually an indicator the team has not been given the opportunity to develop.

At 14 and 15, it’s already a little late. That needs to be taught when they’re 8, 9, 10. That’s when you don’t care if you get scored on five times -- as long as over the course of a year these players learn to recognize those situations.

For me, it’s a player’s game. I’m looking for coaches who inspire their players. Who let their players make decisions. Coaches who are giving information instead of, “Hey that was a good job” or just telling them what they did wrong.

I believe in short information and letting the game flow.


----------



## MakeAPlay

I think that this article is better and it is by Anson Dorrance who actually won a World Cup and has coached 23 national championship teams at the D1 level.

http://www.socceramerica.com/article/72332/anson-dorrance-on-girls-da-vs-ecnl-and-why-the.html


----------



## NoGoal

She was quoted, "pathway directly to professional clubs".  Who in there right minds would have their DDs skip their college education for a NWSL salary? #yikes #cuckoo

*MIRIAM HICKEY:* What this program does is it simplifies the landscape. It also provides the pathway directly to professional clubs and the national youth teams … with U.S. Soccer being in charge


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> She was quoted, "pathway directly to professional clubs".  Who in there right minds would have their DDs skip their college education for a NWSL salary? #yikes #cuckoo
> 
> *MIRIAM HICKEY:* What this program does is it simplifies the landscape. It also provides the pathway directly to professional clubs and the national youth teams … with U.S. Soccer being in charge



I agree.  The starting median salary at my players school for grads is more than a max contract in the NWSL.  She told me that she isn't even considering going pro.  It's funny because she will be on Chris Henderson's top 25 draft prospects for 2020 that he is releasing in the next week and I will bet money that she is in the top 10.


----------



## 3thatplay

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree.  The starting median salary at my players school for grads is more than a max contract in the NWSL.  She told me that she isn't even considering going pro.  It's funny because she will be on Chris Henderson's top 25 draft prospects for 2020 that he is releasing in the next week and I will bet money that she is in the top 10.


That will be awesome


----------



## krazysoccer

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree.  The starting median salary at my players school for grads is more than a max contract in the NWSL.  She told me that she isn't even considering going pro.  It's funny because she will be on Chris Henderson's top 25 draft prospects for 2020 that he is releasing in the next week and I will bet money that she is in the top 10.


MAP, if your DD was an 03, what would you recommend, DA or ECNL? Or play 02 ECNL?


----------



## MakeAPlay

krazysoccer said:


> MAP, if your DD was an 03, what would you recommend, DA or ECNL? Or play 02 ECNL?


It depends upon the coach and the club.  I can tell you that my player wouldn't give up high school.  I tried to get her to do it and it worked for about 7 games then she missed it.  Ask your daughter what she wants to do.  Tell her the pros and cons and let her decide.  Soccer girls are pretty smart.  Then find her the best available coach at one of the clubs that has what she is looking for.  Make sure to check the clubs record prior to 2009.


----------



## MakeAPlay

3thatplay said:


> That will be awesome


I told her about it when the "best of the rest" was released today and she didn't care.  She just wanted me to transfer her some money for the weekend.  She loves soccer but for sure is a student first.


----------



## Glen

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree.  The starting median salary at my players school for grads is more than a max contract in the NWSL.  She told me that she isn't even considering going pro.  It's funny because she will be on Chris Henderson's top 25 draft prospects for 2020 that he is releasing in the next week and I will bet money that she is in the top 10.


Unless your DD plans to go straight to grad school or has another clear career path, your DD should take the contract if she still likes soccer.  She and her friends won't be making that much coming out of UCLA without an additional degree.  They'll struggle to get jobs at all - that's reality.  Nationally, less than 15% of seniors have real jobs lined up.  UCLA is around 30% employment, and that's six months after graduation (so query where you got the median salary info?).  UCLA is also notoriously unethical about their job statistics, although most are bad.  UCLA got really shady during the recession.  

Have her play a couple of years while she figures out grad school.  Most grad schools now don't want kids right out of school, so a few years playing would be perfect.


----------



## pooka

So again I will ask this again: If you live in a city or state where you cannot even get to a DA practice weekly, does that make you not elite? Lol thats bull and y'all know it. The only reason why So Cal is embracing it is because of population density. The parents of kids on current B teams think this is their ticket to finally be seen.  This is laughable, the Miriam chick is a joke. And honestly, most girls on the youth national teams dont even make the full national team. So whats the point? 

And yes I'm irritated by the whole thing.


----------



## shales1002

Glen said:


> Unless your DD plans to go straight to grad school or has another clear career path, your DD should take the contract if she still likes soccer.  She and her friends won't be making that much coming out of UCLA without an additional degree.  They'll struggle to get jobs at all - that's reality.  Nationally, less than 15% of seniors have real jobs lined up.  UCLA is around 30% employment, and that's six months after graduation (so query where you got the median salary info?).  UCLA is also notoriously unethical about their job statistics, although most are bad.  UCLA got really shady during the recession.
> 
> Have her play a couple of years while she figures out grad school.  Most grad schools now don't want kids right out of school, so a few years playing would be perfect.


They will be making more than NWSL. It's absolutely ridiculous the salaries they pay these women. You could teach part time, or work at Walmart full time and make more money . You could coach youth soccer and 

As a UCLA grad, my degrees have served me very well. For that matter, everyone I know did well. No struggles EVER staying employed . UCLA is about career paths not jobs. 

If one wants to play NWSL by all means, go for it. The reality is until there is a livable wage for women's soccer, your better off beginning your career or post graduate program.


----------



## Don't deport me love USA

MakeAPlay said:


> 1544 players to received scholarships.  Divide that by 70 academies and 4 age groups which works out to 22 scholarships per club and 5.5 scholarships per team or about 1/4 of the roster.  So are they just going to scholarship the players that the coach considers "elite" or is it going to be a recruiting tool?  Hey soccermom your Mia is going to get  a full ride from us if you come over from (insert Surf, Blues or Slammers here).  We will include all travel costs too!  Are travel costs part of the scholarship?  I like that they finally hired someone to lead this project even if it is only 5 months from kickoff.  It would be nice if we got some specifics.


Only 4 of 70 clubs are fully funded 2 in Socal, so 1544 divide by 4 across all age groups give you all players in fully funded academies are now playing for free for at least next season.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Don't deport me love USA said:


> Only 4 of 70 clubs are fully funded 2 in Socal, so 1544 divide by 4 across all age groups give you all players in fully funded academies are now playing for free for at least next season.


Agree it's not equal. There are fully funded girls I know as well in those specific clubs.
More commonly - as I have friends now who have been offered at four clubs they are getting fifty percent scholarships - basically playing for about 1$ k .
I don't know how this is being offered but I assume it's the usual backdoor politics. 
Interestingly enough one smaller but prestigious club does not have the funds to do this and is having some difficulties.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Don't deport me love USA said:


> Only 4 of 70 clubs are fully funded 2 in Socal, so 1544 divide by 4 across all age groups give you all players in fully funded academies are now playing for free for at least next season.


Again dependant. They haven't even set the regional showcase schedule up yet. I assume because there are so many clubs that travel would be limited actually. 
From what I have seen with my stud friends they are getting full offers and then some. So far everyone has been very happy with the outcomes honestly I haven't heard a lot of dissent


----------



## Dos Equis

MakeAPlay said:


> I think that this article is better and it is by Anson Dorrance who actually won a World Cup and has coached 23 national championship teams at the D1 level.
> 
> http://www.socceramerica.com/article/72332/anson-dorrance-on-girls-da-vs-ecnl-and-why-the.html


This is a must read.  

I do not know Hickey, but this quote from her is priceless and sums up the entire issue .. _"The ECNL league, I understand, will continue and they will do their thing and we will do our thing …"  
_
US Soccer only cares about "their thing," a focus on building the YNT, and has historically shown mostly disdain for the rest of the youth soccer landscape.  So far, the Girls DA roll-out has been consistent with this attitude.  

While I have been critical of the ECNL and their exclusion of certain clubs and its geographic distribution here in Socal, I will admit they do an excellent job of listening to and meeting the needs of all of their customers (college coaches, club DOC's and coaches, and players).  That is the differentiation ECNL should continue to promote, as it will help them separate themsleves from the DA and provide a real alternative, not just more of the same.


----------



## outside!

The saddest part is that ECNL and US Soccer could not figure out how to cooperate. It reminds me of the whole CSL/Gary Sparks/ECNL/SCDSL fiasco.


----------



## bababooey

pooka said:


> So again I will ask this again: If you live in a city or state where you cannot even get to a DA practice weekly, does that make you not elite? Lol thats bull and y'all know it. The only reason why So Cal is embracing it is because of population density. The parents of kids on current B teams think this is their ticket to finally be seen.  This is laughable, the Miriam chick is a joke. And honestly, most girls on the youth national teams dont even make the full national team. So whats the point?
> 
> And yes I'm irritated by the whole thing.


Pooka: you bring up a good question about GDA in an area that is underserved. Think about it from US Soccer's standpoint....is it better to offer multiple organizations the GDA program in So Cal where there are multitudes of players and coaches along with a history of producing star players or try to offer GDA in all locations? In an ideal world, there would be a GDA club within 15 miles of every female soccer player in America, but that is not going to happen. Let's be honest, ECNL was not serving all of the U.S. either. There are many parts of the U.S. where a female soccer player would have to travel great distance to get to an ECNL club.

As for So Cal embracing GDA, did you expect anything different? It is the shiny new toy in the soccer landscape. That alone will spark a lot of interest. But, it will be paramount for the GDA to produce results like ECNL did since its inception to keep the "elite" players and their parents interested in the product. I suspect the marketing tactic of getting girls to the YNT teams easier will work for many players and parents.


----------



## outside!

bababooey said:


> Pooka: you bring up a good question about GDA in an area that is underserved. Think about it from US Soccer's standpoint....is it better to offer multiple organizations the GDA program in So Cal where there are multitudes of players and coaches along with a history of producing star players or try to offer GDA in all locations? In an ideal world, there would be a GDA club within 15 miles of every female soccer player in America, but that is not going to happen. Let's be honest, ECNL was not serving all of the U.S. either. There are many parts of the U.S. where a female soccer player would have to travel great distance to get to an ECNL club.


There are advantages and disadvantages of living anywhere. Parents that choose to live far from a large metropolitan area have chosen to limit these types of opportunities for their children in exchange for the advantages of living in a small town or rural setting. Soccer players from these rural areas will just have to work harder to get noticed.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> The saddest part is that ECNL and US Soccer could not figure out how to cooperate. It reminds me of the whole CSL/Gary Sparks/ECNL/SCDSL fiasco.


If I am not mistaken, Christian Lavers (ECNL) wanted to work with US Soccer.....US Soccer pretty much said, pound sand.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Glen said:


> Unless your DD plans to go straight to grad school or has another clear career path, your DD should take the contract if she still likes soccer.  She and her friends won't be making that much coming out of UCLA without an additional degree.  They'll struggle to get jobs at all - that's reality.  Nationally, less than 15% of seniors have real jobs lined up.  UCLA is around 30% employment, and that's six months after graduation (so query where you got the median salary info?).  UCLA is also notoriously unethical about their job statistics, although most are bad.  UCLA got really shady during the recession.
> 
> Have her play a couple of years while she figures out grad school.  Most grad schools now don't want kids right out of school, so a few years playing would be perfect.



First, who said that my player goes to UCLA and are you a UCLA alum?  Second, payscale.com has pretty good stats (even Forbes quotes them), and they are right there in black and white.  Not to mention, I know quite a few alumni from my daughter's school and I have a good grasp of what the job market will be like for her.  Third, my player will be graduating from school prior to completing her college eligibility and will likely have her first two post grad years paid for.  She is a science major and will either be getting a masters or an MD.  She isn't your average player, she came in with over 40 credits and went to summer school (and will be going this summer too).

Some kids see the soccer as a labor of love but are smart enough to see school as the most important thing.  Pro soccer isn't something that she cares about and if she isn't in line to compete in a WWC or Olympics by 2020 or 2023 she will hang up her cleats with no regrets.  It's just women's soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> There are advantages and disadvantages of living anywhere. Parents that choose to live far from a large metropolitan area have chosen to limit these types of opportunities for their children in exchange for the advantages of living in a small town or rural setting. Soccer players from these rural areas will just have to work harder to get noticed.


I wouldn't call Vegas a small metropolitan area.  It is top 30 in the US.


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> I wouldn't call Vegas a small metropolitan area.  It is top 30 in the US.


Wasn't there a turf war issue though? It was about five years ago and resulted in a permenant fissure. That's when the Vegas girls started to be DP players as well


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Wasn't there a turf war issue though? It was about five years ago and resulted in a permenant fissure. That's when the Vegas girls started to be DP players as well


I don't think that grown up turf wars should govern development for our young ladies.  Vegas is an area that is fertile with athletic talent.


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> I don't think that grown up turf wars should govern development for our young ladies.  Vegas is an area that is fertile with athletic talent.


Obviously agree! My point was that was what started the migration to Surf. Those players should have never had to commute for that. 
There are TEN YEAR OLDS WHO COMMUTE NOW LORD HELP US ALL. 
Not even joking


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Obviously agree! My point was that was what started the migration to Surf. Those players should have never had to commute for that.
> There are TEN YEAR OLDS WHO COMMUTE NOW LORD HELP US ALL.
> Not even joking


I hear you.  My player didn't commute far (15-20 minutes) until her last year (1 hour).  At 10 the focus should just be on fundamental skills.  There are too many salepeople in club soccer and not enough teachers.


----------



## Nutmeg

MakeAPlay said:


> I hear you.  My player didn't commute far (15-20 minutes) until her last year (1 hour).  At 10 the focus should just be on fundamental skills.  There are too many salepeople in club soccer and not enough teachers.


I've always found it kinda arrogant for parents who live in an area and don't have to commute to say that we didn't have to so therefore it's ridiculous for anybody to. Not saying Map is going that far with this comment, but if we stayed where we live there is no way in hell my DD would be where she is today. I understand the argument that my player didn't commute and they are only (insert age) but if a player wants more training more opportunity and better coaching, facility's  etc than what is offered where they live,than why not commute. The current landscape does not allow for players to be seen enough from outlining areas for things like NTC, ODP, or ID2. Do we need to do these things? NO but what kid doesn't at least wan the chance for it. hard to get better playing against rec players. Could do all the foot skills we wanted still need to play against the best week in and week out in Socal. Other wise I doubt we get to where you guys are. So NO, we shouldn't HAVE to commute but guess what WE HAVE to commute.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Nutmeg said:


> I've always found it kinda arrogant for parents who live in an area and don't have to commute to say that we didn't have to so therefore it's ridiculous for anybody to. Not saying Map is going that far with this comment, but if we stayed where we live there is no way in hell my DD would be where she is today. I understand the argument that my player didn't commute and they are only (insert age) but if a player wants more training more opportunity and better coaching, facility's  etc than what is offered where they live,than why not commute. The current landscape does not allow for players to be seen enough from outlining areas for things like NTC, ODP, or ID2. Do we need to do these things? NO but what kid doesn't at least wan the chance for it. hard to get better playing against rec players. Could do all the foot skills we wanted still need to play against the best week in and week out in Socal. Other wise I doubt we get to where you guys are. So NO, we shouldn't HAVE to commute but guess what WE HAVE to commute.


i think that you misunderstood my comment.  My player had a club that was a 5 minute walk from the house and was where she initially started but we chose to change clubs.  The best club for her was a couple of cities over so were fortunate to have a short commute.  Her last year the best fit for her was in the next county so she commuted an hour.  If I lived in Vegas like some posters do the best fit might have been in SoCal still.  

I believe that you should always do what is best for your player.  It is how we managed our player and if that includes driving for the right fit or a higher level and that is what is best for your player then I HIGHLY RECOMMEND IT!

Good luck to you and yours.


----------



## Nutmeg

MakeAPlay said:


> i think that you misunderstood my comment.  My player had a club that was a 5 minute walk from the house and was where she initially started but we chose to change clubs.  The best club for her was a couple of cities over so were fortunate to have a short commute.  Her last year the best fit for her was in the next county so she commuted an hour.  If I lived in Vegas like some posters do the best fit might have been in SoCal still.
> 
> I believe that you should always do what is best for your player.  It is how we managed our player and if that includes driving for the right fit or a higher level and that is what is best for your player then I HIGHLY RECOMMEND IT!
> 
> Good luck to you and yours.


MAP, thanks for that. I didn't mean to single you out. I'm having a bad soccer month! I just wanted to speak to the bigger topic. Keep up the good work


----------



## clarino1

Not trying to beat a dead horse, but that 99 SC Del Sol ECNL team that went to Silverlakes in 2016 consisted of maybe 2/3 of the original roster. Several key starters did not travel because they wanted to stay home for Thanksgiving. Didn't see any point in going to a showcase when they have already committed (not condoning their decisions, just pointing it out). So for example, the GK was a borrowed 00 player.  A handful were NPL players. So no, the 1-1 was not against the full, original starters for that team. Not even close.


----------



## MakeAPlay

clarino1 said:


> Not trying to beat a dead horse, but that 99 SC Del Sol ECNL team that went to Silverlakes in 2016 consisted of maybe 2/3 of the original roster. Several key starters did not travel because they wanted to stay home for Thanksgiving. Didn't see any point in going to a showcase when they have already committed (not condoning their decisions, just pointing it out). So for example, the GK was a borrowed 00 player.  A handful were NPL players. So no, the 1-1 was not against the full, original starters for that team. Not even close.


Isn't their forward enrolling early at Santa Clara too?


----------



## shales1002

outside! said:


> There are advantages and disadvantages of living anywhere. Parents that choose to live far from a large metropolitan area have chosen to limit these types of opportunities for their children in exchange for the advantages of living in a small town or rural setting. Soccer players from these rural areas will just have to work harder to get noticed.


We 


Striker17 said:


> Wasn't there a turf war issue though? It was about five years ago and resulted in a permenant fissure. That's when the Vegas girls started to be DP players as well



One Vegas club lost their ECNL status. The other club already had their ECNL team. The girls, to my knowledge, had no choice but to make the commute if they wanted to play ECNL.


----------



## shales1002

outside! said:


> There are advantages and disadvantages of living anywhere. Parents that choose to live far from a large metropolitan area have chosen to limit these types of opportunities for their children in exchange for the advantages of living in a small town or rural setting. Soccer players from these rural areas will just have to work harder to get noticed.



Vegas is not anything rural. Merely stating GDA overlooked major cities in their process. Honestly, I feel like it's easier to get noticed when you are a big fish in a small pond of 2 million anyways.


----------



## NoGoal

clarino1 said:


> Not trying to beat a dead horse, but that 99 SC Del Sol ECNL team that went to Silverlakes in 2016 consisted of maybe 2/3 of the original roster. Several key starters did not travel because they wanted to stay home for Thanksgiving. Didn't see any point in going to a showcase when they have already committed (not condoning their decisions, just pointing it out). So for example, the GK was a borrowed 00 player.  A handful were NPL players. So no, the 1-1 was not against the full, original starters for that team. Not even close.


I already knew that by the 1-1 tie, but don't post facts.  Let CaliKlines enjoy believing they waxed 98/99 older ECNL teams.


----------



## Glen

shales1002 said:


> They will be making more than NWSL. It's absolutely ridiculous the salaries they pay these women. You could teach part time, or work at Walmart full time and make more money . You could coach youth soccer and
> 
> As a UCLA grad, my degrees have served me very well. For that matter, everyone I know did well. No struggles EVER staying employed. UCLA is about career paths not jobs.
> 
> If one wants to play NWSL by all means, go for it. The reality is until there is a livable wage for women's soccer, your better off beginning your career or post graduate program.


I'm not really trying to put down UCLA.  It's a fine school.  But this belief that 40K for playing soccer for 6 months is far from "ridiculous."  First, every league starts that way:  players and coaches from the NFL, MLB, and the NBA all were part time wages earners and had jobs in the offseason.  The only thing that is ridiculous is the outrageous  sense of entitlement to higher salaries when no one really goes or watches NWLS games.  I wish it was different, but it's not. 

Second, it is a fact (don't let that get in your way) that most kids, even at UCLA, won't be employed after they graduate.  Let's head down to the UCLA career service office together.  Maybe you can start handing out all those "careers" that are available to the UCLA grads.  Believe me, they are looking.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> I'm not really trying to put down UCLA.  It's a fine school.  But this belief that 40K for playing soccer for 6 months is far from "ridiculous."  First, every league starts that way:  players and coaches from the NFL, MLB, and the NBA all were part time wages earners and had jobs in the offseason.  The only thing that is ridiculous is the outrageous  sense of entitlement to higher salaries when no one really goes or watches NWLS games.  I wish it was different, but it's not.
> 
> Second, it is a fact (don't let that get in your way) that most kids, even at UCLA, won't be employed after they graduate.  Let's head down to the UCLA career service office together.  Maybe you can start handing out all those "careers" that are available to the UCLA grads.  Believe me, they are looking.


Sorry, but 40K is NOT the starting salary for the average NWSL player(non-Sr WNT). It was just released they are doubling the minimum for those players from 7K to 14K a year. You can make as much without a college education flipping burgers (choose your fast food restaurant).


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Sorry, but 40K is NOT the starting salary for the average NWSL player(non-Sr WNT). It was just released they are doubling the minimum for those players from 7K to 14K a year. You can make as much without a college education flipping burgers (choose your fast food restaurant).


Correction it's 15K.  Attached is the source from topdrawersoccer 8th paragraph, last sentence. 
http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/college-soccer-articles/top-womens-players-eye-opportunity-abroad_aid41463


----------



## Dos Equis

Glen said:


> But this belief that 40K for playing soccer for 6 months is far from "ridiculous."


$40,000, or more correctly, $39,700 was the maximum salary allowed for non-National Team players, not an average.  The $278,000 salary cap was being split amongst around 18-20 players, and since many clubs did not even spend to the cap, compensation is closer to $15,000 per player average.  Further, each club is allowed up to 10 amateur players who get paid $0, and are allowed to play in games.

They raised the minimum salary to $15,000 for next year, but unlikely it will have a huge impact on overall averages as they are not going to risk the league by doubling the salary cap, and most clubs do not spend to the cap anyway.  

Two other leagues have proven that paying these women more does not result in longevity, but we need to be honest. If you are not on the WNT, you are not making a lot for your 6 months of work.


----------



## Don't deport me love USA

ESPNANALYST said:


> Again dependant. They haven't even set the regional showcase schedule up yet. I assume because there are so many clubs that travel would be limited actually.
> From what I have seen with my stud friends they are getting full offers and then some. So far everyone has been very happy with the outcomes honestly I haven't heard a lot of dissent





Dos Equis said:


> $40,000, or more correctly, $39,700 was the maximum salary allowed for non-National Team players, not an average.  The $278,000 salary cap was being split amongst around 18-20 players, and since many clubs did not even spend to the cap, compensation is closer to $15,000 per player average.  Further, each club is allowed up to 10 amateur players who get paid $0, and are allowed to play in games.
> 
> They raised the minimum salary to $15,000 for next year, but unlikely it will have a huge impact on overall averages as they are not going to risk the league by doubling the salary cap, and most clubs do not spend to the cap anyway.
> 
> Two other leagues have proven that paying these women more does not result in longevity, but we need to be honest. If you are not on the WNT, you are not making a lot for your 6 months of work.


thought the idea was to become famous enough to eventually get paid for all of your snap chats and tweets like Alex Morgan!


----------



## NoGoal

Dos Equis said:


> $40,000, or more correctly, $39,700 was the maximum salary allowed for non-National Team players, not an average.  The $278,000 salary cap was being split amongst around 18-20 players, and since many clubs did not even spend to the cap, compensation is closer to $15,000 per player average.  Further, each club is allowed up to 10 amateur players who get paid $0, and are allowed to play in games.
> 
> They raised the minimum salary to $15,000 for next year, but unlikely it will have a huge impact on overall averages as they are not going to risk the league by doubling the salary cap, and most clubs do not spend to the cap anyway.
> 
> Two other leagues have proven that paying these women more does not result in longevity, but we need to be honest. If you are not on the WNT, you are not making a lot for your 6 months of work.


IMO, the NWSL is squarely designed to provide a professional league obviously to benefit the WNT rostered players and the US Soccer Federation.  The Federation wants the #1 ranked womens team and the players to remain sharp for international competition (WC and Olympics) without having to move to Europe.  The vast majority of the players in the league are roster fillers who make peanuts and live with sponsored familes.


----------



## NoGoal

For Glen and other parents who need to know the reality of a womens professional (NON-US WNT) player in the NWSL. It's a couple of years old, but still applies today.

https://www.google.com/amp/sportsworld.nbcsports.com/nwsl-players-chasing-the-dream/amp/?client=safari


----------



## Dos Equis

NoGoal said:


> IMO, the NWSL is squarely designed to provide a professional league obviously to benefit the WNT rostered players and the US Soccer Federation.  The Federation wants the #1 ranked womens team and the players to remain sharp for international competition (WC and Olympics) without having to move to Europe.  The vast majority of the players in the league are roster fillers who make peanuts and live with sponsored familes.


C0uld not agree more -- the Girls DA has the exact same singular goal of improving the USWNT.  Any other benefits are incidental.  

Therin lies the issue.  They could try to actually benefit more female youth soccer players, develop female coaches, and build the women's game, but that is not their goal.  And the ladies on the USWNT are starting to realize it.


----------



## Kicker4Life

I believe the recent move of Morgan, Dunn and Lloyd is the beginning of a new trend to play outside our borders.  Creating new and alternative futures for female players.


----------



## Glen

NoGoal said:


> Sorry, but 40K is NOT the starting salary for the average NWSL player(non-Sr WNT). It was just released they are doubling the minimum for those players from 7K to 14K a year. You can make as much without a college education flipping burgers (choose your fast food restaurant).


I concede, I concede!!  I thought MAP's "player" would be a max player.  My mistake.


----------



## shales1002

Glen said:


> I concede, I concede!!  I thought MAP's "player" would be a max player.  My mistake.


MAP's daughter....could be very well be a max player AND 40k is STILL a shitty salary.  Besides, NoGoal posted actual salary info 7k-14k.  No one sends their DD to college to make 14k a year or essentially volunteering to play soccer . Glen your comprehension and sense of humor sucks!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Glen said:


> I concede, I concede!!  I thought MAP's "player" would be a max player.  My mistake.


Whether she would be a max player or not a starting NWSL salary would be less than what she can make coming out of her school with her degree not even considering that she will have a masters in hand or 2 years of medical school completed.

I understood your original post Glen and I want to thank you for your kindness.  My player loves soccer but she has specific goals outside of soccer. If she does decide to play professionally for a couple years I would imagine that it would be across the pond unless she is a WNT subsidized player.  She did like England and Spain a lot and she really likes Chelsea's women's coach.

At the end of the day I simply want her to follow her passion and to enjoy these next 6-7 years because life sneaks up on you quickly.  Right now she is having fun, training hard just trying to win a national title and continue getting straight A's.  If she decides she wants to make beans for a little while in order to try and make a WWC or Olympic roster I will do what I have always done.  Support her fully with my cheers and my checkbook.  That's what we parents do.  Thanks again Glen.


----------



## MakeAPlay

shales1002 said:


> MAP's daughter....could be very well be a max player AND 40k is STILL a shitty salary.  Besides, NoGoal posted actual salary info 7k-14k.  No one sends their DD to college to make 14k a year or essentially volunteering to play soccer . Glen your comprehension and sense of humor sucks!


Personally I want my player to be like @shales1002.  Talented and smart with a big time degree and an NCAA championship.


----------



## Glen

MakeAPlay said:


> Whether she would be a max player or not a starting NWSL salary would be less than what she can make coming out of her school with her degree not even considering that she will have a masters in hand or 2 years of medical school completed.
> 
> I understood your original post Glen and I want to thank you for your kindness.  My player loves soccer but she has specific goals outside of soccer. If she does decide to play professionally for a couple years I would imagine that it would be across the pond unless she is a WNT subsidized player.  She did like England and Spain a lot and she really likes Chelsea's women's coach.
> 
> At the end of the day I simply want her to follow her passion and to enjoy these next 6-7 years because life sneaks up on you quickly.  Right now she is having fun, training hard just trying to win a national title and continue getting straight A's.  If she decides she wants to make beans for a little while in order to try and make a WWC or Olympic roster I will do what I have always done.  Support her fully with my cheers and my checkbook.  That's what we parents do.  Thanks again Glen.


I shouldn't have said anything.  It's your kid and you have a handle on it.  

But as I think you grasped, I wasn't advocating that she make a career of it (although maybe she is one of the few that could).  Most kids are still struggling to figure out what they want to do when they graduate and it's hard sledding.  To have what I perceive as a luxury, and go play soccer for a few years to figure it out ain't so bad.  If they don't need that time, even better.


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> MAP's daughter....could be very well be a max player AND 40k is STILL a shitty salary.  Besides, NoGoal posted actual salary info 7k-14k.  No one sends their DD to college to make 14k a year or essentially volunteering to play soccer . Glen your comprehension and sense of humor sucks!


Especially when the new US soccer DA girls director was quoted as saying Girls DA leads to a path directly to professional teams.  50% college athletic scholarships (the average) pay more than the NWSL minimum salary of 15K.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Glen said:


> I shouldn't have said anything.  It's your kid and you have a handle on it.
> 
> But as I think you grasped, I wasn't advocating that she make a career of it (although maybe she is one of the few that could).  Most kids are still struggling to figure out what they want to do when they graduate and it's hard sledding.  To have what I perceive as a luxury, and go play soccer for a few years to figure it out ain't so bad.  If they don't need that time, even better.


I agree and thanks again for the kind words.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> I concede, I concede!!  I thought MAP's "player" would be a max player.  My mistake.


Even Mallory Pugh turned down a pro contract and she  was on the US WNT roster.  Instead she took the UCLA college scholarship to enjoy being a college student athlete. IMO, she and her family made a very wise decision, because part of her compensation would have been a player bonus estimated at 170K,  if the team won the Olympics.  Which the team didn't.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Even Mallory Pugh turned down a pro contract and she  was on the US WNT roster.  Instead she took the UCLA college scholarship to enjoy being a college student athlete. IMO, she and her family made a very wise decision, because part of her compensation would have been a player bonus estimated at 170K,  if the team won the Olympics.  Which the team didn't.


I remember the debate well.  She has an excellent support system around her and like most soccer girls she is really smart and an excellent student.  Her parents are outstanding people and are very good at managing the circus surrounding their teenager.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> Personally I want my player to be like @shales1002.  Talented and smart with a big time degree and an NCAA championship.


I'd say more like DP!  She's got  three and in 3 years will have all four!


----------



## clarino1

"Isn't their forward enrolling early at Santa Clara too?" - MAP
Didn't want to leave this unanswered, but yes, she did leave at end of first half of ECNL season and did not travel to Silverlake. 
Also, have been busy with the U18 WNT.


----------



## MakeAPlay

clarino1 said:


> "Isn't their forward enrolling early at Santa Clara too?" - MAP
> Didn't want to leave this unanswered, but yes, she did leave at end of first half of ECNL season and did not travel to Silverlake.
> Also, have been busy with the U18 WNT.


My player saw her in camp with the U18's although that was before the end of the year.  I believe that she has matriculated to the U19's.  She will do well at Santa Clara.  

Thanks for the update.


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://equalizersoccer.com/2017/02/27/girls-da-launch-means-crossroads-for-many-players/


----------



## younothat

MakeAPlay said:


> http://equalizersoccer.com/2017/02/27/girls-da-launch-means-crossroads-for-many-players/


"According to its website, 1,224 of 1,346 ECNL seniors graduating in 2016 will go on to play soccer in college. And 969 (79 percent) of them, are signed to NCAA Division I programs. In addition, ECNL players account for more than 80 percent of the total U.S. Soccer Youth national team player pool.

It’s difficult to understand why U.S. Soccer would create a developmental program for girls when the ECNL already serves that purpose; several top club coaches in the Washington Metropolitan area said an alliance might be more beneficial, as this setup is sure to dilute rosters. Plus, a decade in, and the USMNT is still waiting for the academy to spring the next superstar. The USWNT has seen wave after wave of them. And 18-year-old Mallory Pugh, who reportedly remained loyal to her high school squad despite her busy schedule and national team call-ups, seems to be leading the next one—last summer she became the youngest player in U.S. history to score in the Olympics, according to U.S. Soccer’s website"

"As with the boys’ academy, there is sure to be a learning curve with the girl’s program over the next few years. But for now, young girls stand at a crossroads in their respective soccer careers, and it’s hard to know which is the best path to take.

“If you take away camaraderie, the aspect of playing for your team, from the girls side…I think if you gave the top players in the country the choice of playing at a high level for ECNL and the ability to play high school, or the ability to play at an equivalent level at the academy, you’ll lose kids because they want to play for high school,” Wiese said. “I think high school soccer is much closer to the [team-oriented] college soccer environment.”

That last sentence is one of the reasons my junior DD is not interested in DA at the moment.


----------



## MakeAPlay

younothat said:


> "According to its website, 1,224 of 1,346 ECNL seniors graduating in 2016 will go on to play soccer in college. And 969 (79 percent) of them, are signed to NCAA Division I programs. In addition, ECNL players account for more than 80 percent of the total U.S. Soccer Youth national team player pool.
> 
> It’s difficult to understand why U.S. Soccer would create a developmental program for girls when the ECNL already serves that purpose; several top club coaches in the Washington Metropolitan area said an alliance might be more beneficial, as this setup is sure to dilute rosters. Plus, a decade in, and the USMNT is still waiting for the academy to spring the next superstar. The USWNT has seen wave after wave of them. And 18-year-old Mallory Pugh, who reportedly remained loyal to her high school squad despite her busy schedule and national team call-ups, seems to be leading the next one—last summer she became the youngest player in U.S. history to score in the Olympics, according to U.S. Soccer’s website"
> 
> "As with the boys’ academy, there is sure to be a learning curve with the girl’s program over the next few years. But for now, young girls stand at a crossroads in their respective soccer careers, and it’s hard to know which is the best path to take.
> 
> “If you take away camaraderie, the aspect of playing for your team, from the girls side…I think if you gave the top players in the country the choice of playing at a high level for ECNL and the ability to play high school, or the ability to play at an equivalent level at the academy, you’ll lose kids because they want to play for high school,” Wiese said. “I think high school soccer is much closer to the [team-oriented] college soccer environment.”
> 
> That last sentence is one of the reasons my junior DD is not interested in DA at the moment.


It is a true statement.  She does almost everything with her teammates.  I was against high school soccer but I am glad that she did.  It is much different socially than a club team.


----------



## LadiesMan217

younothat said:


> "According to its website, 1,224 of 1,346 ECNL seniors graduating in 2016 will go on to play soccer in college. And 969 (79 percent) of them, are signed to NCAA Division I programs. In addition, ECNL players account for more than 80 percent of the total U.S. Soccer Youth national team player pool.
> 
> It’s difficult to understand why U.S. Soccer would create a developmental program for girls when the ECNL already serves that purpose; several top club coaches in the Washington Metropolitan area said an alliance might be more beneficial, as this setup is sure to dilute rosters. Plus, a decade in, and the USMNT is still waiting for the academy to spring the next superstar. The USWNT has seen wave after wave of them. And 18-year-old Mallory Pugh, who reportedly remained loyal to her high school squad despite her busy schedule and national team call-ups, seems to be leading the next one—last summer she became the youngest player in U.S. history to score in the Olympics, according to U.S. Soccer’s website"
> 
> "As with the boys’ academy, there is sure to be a learning curve with the girl’s program over the next few years. But for now, young girls stand at a crossroads in their respective soccer careers, and it’s hard to know which is the best path to take.
> 
> “If you take away camaraderie, the aspect of playing for your team, from the girls side…I think if you gave the top players in the country the choice of playing at a high level for ECNL and the ability to play high school, or the ability to play at an equivalent level at the academy, you’ll lose kids because they want to play for high school,” Wiese said. “I think high school soccer is much closer to the [team-oriented] college soccer environment.”
> 
> That last sentence is one of the reasons my junior DD is not interested in DA at the moment.


I get all bothered when people refer to ECNL as a development program . ECNL is a competition platform. The clubs/coaches are the development platform utilizing the ECNL competition platform to drive and further develop via game play. It is that simple. All the stats are impressive but they should be since most of the best girls play under the ECNL competition platform. To me ECNL is just a label of the league my DD is playing and her level of play. I do not expect anything more from ECNL other than providing a high level of competition. I expect development from the coach and play time.


----------



## glen_dandy

Sorry if this has been posted somewhere earlier in this thread, but I'm just looking for confirmation of the following, and also asking some questions.

Of the 14 Southwest DA clubs, the top team of each club will of course play in the DA.  But the second teams will play, where?  I've heard the second teams for Slammers, Surf, Blues, and West Coast will play ECNL.

Are the second teams for Albion, Beach, Eagles, Galaxy, LAGSD, Legends, LA Premier, Pateadores, RSC, and SC del Sol all playing in Academy II?  

My understanding is that Academy II is a Southwest-specific enterprise and thus this is the only area of the country creating this second Academy league.  Academy II will play 9 games in the fall and 9 in the spring.  Academy II will be on hiatus over the winter so that players can play HS soccer.  Unlike the DA, there will be no showcases.  Also, as they are required to play by the DA rules and will be carded in the DA only, they cannot play in any tournaments that have multiple games in one day.  So, in short, Academy II means you play 18 games and that's it.  

How much parity will there be among the Academy II teams?  Certainly Legends and Beach should dominate and the clubs building a DA from scratch should be at a disadvantage, right?  And if you were a strong player on the Legends/Beach Academy II team with aspirations of playing in college, will the 18 game/no showcases/no tournaments schedule be enough to get you noticed by college coaches?


----------



## shales1002

glen_dandy said:


> Sorry if this has been posted somewhere earlier in this thread, but I'm just looking for confirmation of the following, and also asking some questions.
> 
> Of the 14 Southwest DA clubs, the top team of each club will of course play in the DA.  But the second teams will play, where?  I've heard the second teams for Slammers, Surf, Blues, and West Coast will play ECNL.
> 
> Are the second teams for Albion, Beach, Eagles, Galaxy, LAGSD, Legends, LA Premier, Pateadores, RSC, and SC del Sol all playing in Academy II?
> 
> My understanding is that Academy II is a Southwest-specific enterprise and thus this is the only area of the country creating this second Academy league.  Academy II will play 9 games in the fall and 9 in the spring.  Academy II will be on hiatus over the winter so that players can play HS soccer.  Unlike the DA, there will be no showcases.  Also, as they are required to play by the DA rules and will be carded in the DA only, they cannot play in any tournaments that have multiple games in one day.  So, in short, Academy II means you play 18 games and that's it.
> 
> How much parity will there be among the Academy II teams?  Certainly Legends and Beach should dominate and the clubs building a DA from scratch should be at a disadvantage, right?  And if you were a strong player on the Legends/Beach Academy II team with aspirations of playing in college, will the 18 game/no showcases/no tournaments schedule be enough to get you noticed by college coaches?


 I believe that SC Del Sol removed DA II information from their website. Correct me if I'm wrong. DA II sounds like a bust out of the gate. Why would anyone want to give up so much ? Again, it's a SoCal only thing.


----------



## gkrent

glen_dandy said:


> Sorry if this has been posted somewhere earlier in this thread, but I'm just looking for confirmation of the following, and also asking some questions.
> 
> Of the 14 Southwest DA clubs, the top team of each club will of course play in the DA.  But the second teams will play, where?  I've heard the second teams for Slammers, Surf, Blues, and West Coast will play ECNL.
> 
> Are the second teams for Albion, Beach, Eagles, Galaxy, LAGSD, Legends, LA Premier, Pateadores, RSC, and SC del Sol all playing in Academy II?
> 
> My understanding is that Academy II is a Southwest-specific enterprise and thus this is the only area of the country creating this second Academy league.  Academy II will play 9 games in the fall and 9 in the spring.  Academy II will be on hiatus over the winter so that players can play HS soccer.  Unlike the DA, there will be no showcases.  Also, as they are required to play by the DA rules and will be carded in the DA only, they cannot play in any tournaments that have multiple games in one day.  So, in short, Academy II means you play 18 games and that's it.
> 
> How much parity will there be among the Academy II teams?  Certainly Legends and Beach should dominate and the clubs building a DA from scratch should be at a disadvantage, right?  And if you were a strong player on the Legends/Beach Academy II team with aspirations of playing in college, will the 18 game/no showcases/no tournaments schedule be enough to get you noticed by college coaches?


It was *my* understanding from the recent Pats Academy tryouts that the DA Reserve/II team would play in the usual showcases and play in SCDSL flight 1 "or equivalent"


----------



## Realmadrid

According to our club there will be two silver lakes showcases and a Vegas one.  I don't have the details yet since National cup is still going on.  I contacted the USDA girls via phone and DAII is something they are looking at in other region's but currently in the southwest as previously stated.


----------



## CaliKlines

Just announced, it looks like ECNL club World Class is going all in with New York City FC (NYCFC) to form their girls DA program to make it the top program in their club.
http://www.nycfc.com/post/2017/02/27/new-york-city-fc-announces-new-nycfc-girls-soccer-academy


----------



## DJB

glen_dandy said:


> Sorry if this has been posted somewhere earlier in this thread, but I'm just looking for confirmation of the following, and also asking some questions.
> 
> Of the 14 Southwest DA clubs, the top team of each club will of course play in the DA.  But the second teams will play, where?  I've heard the second teams for Slammers, Surf, Blues, and West Coast will play ECNL.
> 
> Are the second teams for Albion, Beach, Eagles, Galaxy, LAGSD, Legends, LA Premier, Pateadores, RSC, and SC del Sol all playing in Academy II?
> 
> My understanding is that Academy II is a Southwest-specific enterprise and thus this is the only area of the country creating this second Academy league.  Academy II will play 9 games in the fall and 9 in the spring.  Academy II will be on hiatus over the winter so that players can play HS soccer.  Unlike the DA, there will be no showcases.  Also, as they are required to play by the DA rules and will be carded in the DA only, they cannot play in any tournaments that have multiple games in one day.  So, in short, Academy II means you play 18 games and that's it.
> 
> How much parity will there be among the Academy II teams?  Certainly Legends and Beach should dominate and the clubs building a DA from scratch should be at a disadvantage, right?  And if you were a strong player on the Legends/Beach Academy II team with aspirations of playing in college, will the 18 game/no showcases/no tournaments schedule be enough to get you noticed by college coaches?


From what I have heard around DAII you are mostly correct.

Top team will be DA
Depending on the club 2nd team will be either ECNL or DAII 
DAII is being marketed and pushed as 2nd team as it allows for the girls to move up/down more easily
This is similar to the PDA concept on the boys side.  Clubs will stack the majority of the DA team with older boys while the younger age PDA team will be a feeder to the DA team the following year.

The unknown is where ECNL/EGSL and DAII will intersect and compete.  For teams that have a DA but not in ECNL it is an easy choice.  The challenge will be for Slammers, West Coast and other DA teams that are in ECNL and how they balance the 3 or 4 options.
I was under the impression that the DA II teams will be able to attend showcase/tournaments aligned with the DA as well as outside (Surf cup, National cup, etc.)


----------



## mahrez

DJB said:


> From what I have heard around DAII you are mostly correct.
> 
> Top team will be DA
> Depending on the club 2nd team will be either ECNL or DAII
> DAII is being marketed and pushed as 2nd team as it allows for the girls to move up/down more easily
> This is similar to the PDA concept on the boys side.  Clubs will stack the majority of the DA team with older boys while the younger age PDA team will be a feeder to the DA team the following year.
> 
> The unknown is where ECNL/EGSL and DAII will intersect and compete.  For teams that have a DA but not in ECNL it is an easy choice.  The challenge will be for Slammers, West Coast and other DA teams that are in ECNL and how they balance the 3 or 4 options.
> I was under the impression that the DA II teams will be able to attend showcase/tournaments aligned with the DA as well as outside (Surf cup, National cup, etc.)


You heard a lot or marketing and wishful thinking.
http://usclubsoccer.org/2016/02/24/us-club-soccer-statement-on-u-s-soccer-girls-development-academy/

USSF runs DA , US club soccer (member association) is behind the prep academy concept some refer to as DA II but they are different org all together (different registration, guidelines, etc you can't just easily move players between the two for example)

US club wants to get a bigger footprint in SC and try to appeal to other players or clubs that maybe looking at options outside of usys /cal south or other leagues.

DA is a framework: 10 month program, 30 games + showcases & playoffs, 3-4x training a week, no HS play,  player mandates, no outside comp,  etc.

US club soccer wants to pick or choose what suites them from the framework and call it something its not.   One of the reasons you don't see any real actual info posted anywhere on either of those org  sites about a new league,  clubs have tried to put there own spin on this or claim this or that but so far no go.

There is around 8 clubs interested in this new prep league so they can market something to players that may look elsewhere for higher level play but the deadlines are approach for SCDSL and CSL league apps so don't be surprised if these 2nd or 3rd prep teams actually end up back there.  

Until you see real info posted this new league is no more than marketing


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

mahrez said:


> You heard a lot or marketing and wishful thinking.
> http://usclubsoccer.org/2016/02/24/us-club-soccer-statement-on-u-s-soccer-girls-development-academy/
> 
> USSF runs DA , US club soccer (member association) is behind the prep academy concept some refer to as DA II but they are different org all together (different registration, guidelines, etc you can't just easily move players between the two for example)
> 
> US club wants to get a bigger footprint in SC and try to appeal to other players or clubs that maybe looking at options outside of usys /cal south or other leagues.
> 
> DA is a framework: 10 month program, 30 games + showcases & playoffs, 3-4x training a week, no HS play,  player mandates, no outside comp,  etc.
> 
> US club soccer wants to pick or choose what suites them from the framework and call it something its not.   One of the reasons you don't see any real actual info posted anywhere on either of those org  sites about a new league,  clubs have tried to put there own spin on this or claim this or that but so far no go.
> 
> There is around 8 clubs interested in this new prep league so they can market something to players that may look elsewhere for higher level play but the deadlines are approach for SCDSL and CSL league apps so don't be surprised if these 2nd or 3rd prep teams actually end up back there.
> 
> Until you see real info posted this new league is no more than marketing


I think you'll see DA2. US soccer just wants everyone to sweat a little so they know who the boss is!


----------



## Kicknit22

I keep hearing about DAII as if it were all set and actually a true option for those that don't want to give up HS sports.  Is this really just wishful thinking on the Southwest Region group, or is it a done deal?


----------



## younothat

Kicknit22 said:


> I keep hearing about DAII as if it were all set and actually a true option for those that don't want to give up HS sports.  Is this really just wishful thinking on the Southwest Region group, or is it a done deal?


Ussda doesn't run programs just for one region nor will they disregard part of their framework, I seriously doubt you will see them offer something counter to there primary program for  2nd level teams.   Just cost to much money to do something like that for one thing. 

Maybe another org like us club soccer will offer something eventually but calling it DA II is marketing non-sense.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

younothat said:


> Ussda doesn't run programs just for one region nor will they disregard part of their framework, I seriously doubt you will see them offer something counter to there primary program for  2nd level teams.   Just cost to much money to do something like that for one thing.
> 
> Maybe another org like us club soccer will offer something eventually but calling it DA II is marketing non-sense.


@younothat Thank you for all the posts and information you provide about DA!


----------



## Real Deal

What about "Development Player" They have that on the boy side. Is it available for the girls yet?


----------



## LadiesMan217

Real Deal said:


> What about "Development Player" They have that on the boy side. Is it available for the girls yet?


Yes - same rules.


----------



## younothat

Real Deal said:


> What about "Development Player" They have that on the boy side. Is it available for the girls yet?


Yes but there scope is more limited than most post about. 

DP = 0-6 games, not subject to min playing time requirements.  Not typically  used much in quantity  some teams have none to maybe 3 a season although rules permit up 10 on each team max per season but not more than 6 at a time.  The scouting and auditing reports tracks this so using DP's in quantity is not normally a good reflection on the program.


----------



## Sandypk

younothat said:


> Yes but there scope is more limited than most post about.
> 
> DP = 0-6 games, not subject to min playing time requirements.  Not typically  used much in quantity  some teams have none to maybe 3 a season although rules permit up 10 on each team max per season but not more than 6 at a time.  The scouting and auditing reports tracks this so using DP's in quantity is not normally a good reflection on the program.


How many girls will make up a DA 1 team?  Do you know?


----------



## younothat

Sandypk said:


> How many girls will make up a DA 1 team?  Do you know?


Rules for 16-17 might be some some minor changes for 17-18
https://ussoccer.box.com/s/ddh3x0fztgwufv8x1bc3dep1i97t0q5h

2003 & 2004:  16 min, 20 max but only 18 on the game day roster
2002,01: combined min of 32, combined max of 46, but only 18 on the game day roster per team
00,99: combined min of 32, combined max of 46, but only 18 on the game day roster per team

"Each roster shall be published on the official U.S. Soccer Development Academy registration website, and shall be considered the official roster of the Academy club. There is a minimum of 32 full-time (FT) players per Academy club combined in the U-15/16 and U-17/18 age group and 16 full-time players each in both the U-13 & U-14 age groups. There is a maximum of 20 full-time players at both the U-13 & U-14 age groups and 46 full-time players combined between the U-15/16 and U-17/18 age groups. At the U-12 age group, there may be between 24-26 full-time players. There is no limit to the number of rostered players that do not have United States citizenship.

Only 11 players on the field and 3 sub movements plus half time so typically half the bench may get into games depending on the situations.


----------



## Dos Equis

younothat said:


> Rules for 16-17 might be some some minor changes for 17-18
> https://ussoccer.box.com/s/ddh3x0fztgwufv8x1bc3dep1i97t0q5h
> 
> 2003 & 2004:  16 min, 20 max but only 18 on the game day roster
> 2002,01: combined min of 32, combined max of 46, but only 18 on the game day roster per team
> 00,99: combined min of 32, combined max of 46, but only 18 on the game day roster per team
> 
> "Each roster shall be published on the official U.S. Soccer Development Academy registration website, and shall be considered the official roster of the Academy club. There is a minimum of 32 full-time (FT) players per Academy club combined in the U-15/16 and U-17/18 age group and 16 full-time players each in both the U-13 & U-14 age groups. There is a maximum of 20 full-time players at both the U-13 & U-14 age groups and 46 full-time players combined between the U-15/16 and U-17/18 age groups. At the U-12 age group, there may be between 24-26 full-time players. There is no limit to the number of rostered players that do not have United States citizenship.
> 
> Only 11 players on the field and 3 sub movements plus half time so typically half the bench may get into games depending on the situations.


Those may be the boys rules, but the applications for the girls academy outlined the following (apologize for the format):

**************
Roster Management:

Development Academy clubs will be required to field teams that consist of the top players from the club's entire player pool. Clubs have the flexibility to register any age combination of players across all 3 age groups, provided they do not exceed 69 full-time players 

Player pools will include a minimum number of 16 full-time registered players in each combined age group. 
On average, player pools will include a maximum of 23 full-time players per combined age group; however, the club could register more younger players in an age group, with the intention of playing those players up in an older age group. 

A Development Player (DP) is a “bubble player” in any age group that trains with your GDA player pool, but is better suited playing games with a “second level” team from within the club (provided the club has full oversight and connection with this group, group operates out of same facility, and player does not come from an affiliate club)

Registering a DP is a serious and careful decision that should be part of a planned opportunity for the player to get meaningful game experience in an Academy game. Clubs can have a maximum of 10 DPs registered at a single time within their player pool; DPs may play in a maximum of 6 games and can later move to full-time, provided the club has roster moves and full-time roster space available


----------



## younothat

Dos Equis said:


> Those may be the boys rules, but the applications for the girls academy outlined the following (apologize for the format):
> 
> **************
> Roster Management:
> 
> Development Academy clubs will be required to field teams that consist of the top players from the club's entire player pool. Clubs have the flexibility to register any age combination of players across all 3 age groups, provided they do not exceed 69 full-time players
> 
> Player pools will include a minimum number of 16 full-time registered players in each combined age group.
> On average, player pools will include a maximum of 23 full-time players per combined age group; however, the club could register more younger players in an age group, with the intention of playing those players up in an older age group.
> 
> A Development Player (DP) is a “bubble player” in any age group that trains with your GDA player pool, but is better suited playing games with a “second level” team from within the club (provided the club has full oversight and connection with this group, group operates out of same facility, and player does not come from an affiliate club)
> 
> Registering a DP is a serious and careful decision that should be part of a planned opportunity for the player to get meaningful game experience in an Academy game. Clubs can have a maximum of 10 DPs registered at a single time within their player pool; DPs may play in a maximum of 6 games and can later move to full-time, provided the club has roster moves and full-time roster space available


Yes on the app but things have changed to the four age groups: U-14, U-15, U-16/17, and U-18/19.  Going to be minor changes in 17-18',  boys & girls should very similar:  min 16,  max 18 game day single age groups:   23 max combed age groups which is just the half of the 46 as it is now for the boys for both U15/16  & U17/18

DP rules: https://ussoccer.box.com/s/7y8c97ea6hqc0bk1tulf1yvpn9zij4dh


----------



## glen_dandy

mahrez said:


> USSF runs DA , US club soccer (member association) is behind the prep academy concept some refer to as DA II but they are different org all together (different registration, guidelines, etc you can't just easily move players between the two for example)
> 
> US club wants to get a bigger footprint in SC and try to appeal to other players or clubs that maybe looking at options outside of usys /cal south or other leagues.


I agree that DAII has nothing to do with the DA.  DAII is a completely made up league created by the DA clubs whose second teams are not doing ECNL.  I was told at a parent meeting that the DAII would use the same rules and carding as the DA, which in hindsight is strange because if the DA had nothing to do with DAII, why would the players be carded with the DA?

I had not heard that the DAII players would card with USClub.  This would be the best outcome so that the players could do tournaments.

I did not hear that DAII players could move up to the DA team.  However, perhaps they could move up as discovery players.


----------



## DJB

glen_dandy said:


> I agree that DAII has nothing to do with the DA.  DAII is a completely made up league created by the DA clubs whose second teams are not doing ECNL.  I was told at a parent meeting that the DAII would use the same rules and carding as the DA, which in hindsight is strange because if the DA had nothing to do with DAII, why would the players be carded with the DA?
> 
> I had not heard that the DAII players would card with USClub.  This would be the best outcome so that the players could do tournaments.
> 
> I did not hear that DAII players could move up to the DA team.  However, perhaps they could move up as discovery players.



My understanding is similar to yours with the following exceptions:

DA II is connected USSF and the DA program
DAII players can/will get called up to play on DA teams as a part of the DP program
DA II is not a USClub sponsored league
DAII will play other DAII teams for regular events and within the DA showcase program
The miss information is due to the fight over ECNL and DA...who has the power?


----------



## NoGoal

DJB said:


> My understanding is similar to yours with the following exceptions:
> 
> DA II is connected USSF and the DA program
> DAII players can/will get called up to play on DA teams as a part of the DP program
> DA II is not a USClub sponsored league
> DAII will play other DAII teams for regular events and within the DA showcase program
> The miss information is due to the fight over ECNL and DA...who has the power?


USSF oversees the majority of the affiliated leagues such as USYS which USYS National League falls under or US Club Soccer which ECNL and NPL falls under.

From what I have read.  Parents in the know are posting.....DAII will fall under US Club soccer and not directly under USSF like Girls DA will be.

For visual posters:
USSF ----> Girls DA
USSF ----> US Club Soccer ----> DAII
USSF ----> US Club Soccer ----> ECNL
USSF ----> USYS ----> National League
USSF ----> USYS ----> Coast Soccer League
USSF ----> USYS ----> ODP


----------



## gkrent

glen_dandy said:


> I agree that DAII has nothing to do with the DA.  DAII is a completely made up league created by the DA clubs whose second teams are not doing ECNL.


Then why was Slammer creating "Reserve" teams well in advance of DA announcements?


----------



## Kicknit22

gkrent said:


> Then why was Slammer creating "Reserve" teams well in advance of DA announcements?


I suspect they did this in may order to keep those players and the $$ , in the club.  Nice foresight. Depending on what is the truth about DAII, a lot of those people could have been played.


----------



## Kicknit22

Strike the "may"


----------



## Realmadrid

I called the USDA yesterday.  The talks are ongoing and the DAII may be sanctioned by the DA and it may not.  There is logistics, referees, and the showcases as well as will it line up with what the DA wants not the club's.  So currently some of you are correct this is marketing but according to the representative on the phone it has greater than 50/50 chance of getting done.


----------



## Realmadrid

Sorry to keep on this but think about the 9 proposed club's and the 17 or so DD that will be signing up in fact some already have.  That's a lot of people affected by marketing.  Plus this has been well discussed this is also about the power play by US soccer and ECNL.  They will have to get this figured out really soon.  With SCDL and Coast deadlines coming up.  I was apart of a USDA presentation at our club that sold DA2 as a sanctioned league.  My line of thinking was top talent will all be DA1 now so where can my DD have a platform to compete at a high level.  With beach, legends, galaxy etc minus the blues, surf and the other ecnl in the southwest that's a lot of DD that are going to be on a reserve or DA2 team hence SCDL and Coast will be really watered down....  At the end of the day labels are labels I don't care if it's DA2 or whatever just want good competition so my DD can continue to develop.


----------



## glen_dandy

Realmadrid said:


> Sorry to keep on this but think about the 9 proposed club's and the 17 or so DD that will be signing up in fact some already have.  That's a lot of people affected by marketing.  Plus this has been well discussed this is also about the power play by US soccer and ECNL.  They will have to get this figured out really soon.  With SCDL and Coast deadlines coming up.  I was apart of a USDA presentation at our club that sold DA2 as a sanctioned league.  My line of thinking was top talent will all be DA1 now so where can my DD have a platform to compete at a high level.  With beach, legends, galaxy etc minus the blues, surf and the other ecnl in the southwest that's a lot of DD that are going to be on a reserve or DA2 team hence SCDL and Coast will be really watered down....  At the end of the day labels are labels I don't care if it's DA2 or whatever just want good competition so my DD can continue to develop.


Agreed.  With so much uncertainty about DA2, I'd prefer if my daughter's team (and the other non-ECNL second teams) just opted to play SCDSL this year.


----------



## Realmadrid

glen_dandy said:


> Agreed.  With so much uncertainty about DA2, I'd prefer if my daughter's team (and the other non-ECNL second teams) just opted to play SCDSL this year.


I would tend to agree but if the teams I mentioned before are all holding 17 DD's I see the Coast,SCDL being weaker .....someone really needs to figure this out.


----------



## Kicknit22

Realmadrid said:


> Sorry to keep on this but think about the 9 proposed club's and the 17 or so DD that will be signing up in fact some already have.  That's a lot of people affected by marketing.  Plus this has been well discussed this is also about the power play by US soccer and ECNL.  They will have to get this figured out really soon.  With SCDL and Coast deadlines coming up.  I was apart of a USDA presentation at our club that sold DA2 as a sanctioned league.  My line of thinking was top talent will all be DA1 now so where can my DD have a platform to compete at a high level.  With beach, legends, galaxy etc minus the blues, surf and the other ecnl in the southwest that's a lot of DD that are going to be on a reserve or DA2 team hence SCDL and Coast will be really watered down....  At the end of the day labels are labels I don't care if it's DA2 or whatever just want good competition so my DD can continue to develop.


You were part of the presentation of the DA at your DD 's club?  I'm sorry to say it, but I think you were, at the very least, mislead.  But, I would really call it being flat out lied to.  Sorry man!  Maybe it will still work out.


----------



## NoGoal

So if I'm getting this right.

Girls DA aka A teams = Albion, Beach, Blues, Eagles, Galaxy SD, LA Galaxy, LA Premier, Legends, Pats, RSC, Slammers, Surf, and WCFC

ECNL = A teams are Strikers, Arsenal and Del Mar Sharks (clubs not Girls DA)
ECNL = B teams are Blues, Eagles, RSC, Slammers, Surf and WCFC

DAII = B teams are Albion, Beach, LA Galaxy, Galaxy SD, LA Premier, Legends and Pats

National League = why bother


----------



## DJB

NoGoal said:


> So if I'm getting this right.
> 
> Girls DA aka A teams = Albion, Beach, Blues, Eagles, Galaxy SD, LA Galaxy, LA Premier, Legends, Pats, RSC, Slammers, Surf, and WCFC
> 
> ECNL = A teams are Strikers, Arsenal and Del Mar Sharks (clubs not Girls DA)
> ECNL = B teams are Blues, Eagles, RSC, Slammers, Surf and WCFC
> 
> DAII = B teams are Albion, Beach, LA Galaxy, Galaxy SD, LA Premier, Legends and Pats
> 
> National League = why bother



Eagles and RSC will not have ECNL teams, they will be DAII


----------



## Kicknit22

NoGoal said:


> So if I'm getting this right.
> 
> Girls DA aka A teams = Albion, Beach, Blues, Eagles, Galaxy SD, LA Galaxy, LA Premier, Legends, Pats, RSC, Slammers, Surf, and WCFC
> 
> ECNL = A teams are Strikers, Arsenal and Del Mar Sharks (clubs not Girls DA)
> ECNL = B teams are Blues, Eagles, RSC, Slammers, Surf and WCFC
> 
> DAII = B teams are Albion, Beach, LA Galaxy, Galaxy SD, LA Premier, Legends and Pats
> 
> National League = why bother


Kinda makes your head hurt, right?


----------



## Kicknit22

DJB said:


> Eagles and RSC will not have ECNL teams, they will be DAII


Or, will they? Lol!   Or so you've been told.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Kicknit22 said:


> Or, will they? Lol!   Or so you've been told.


Maybe. ! Right now the word from good sources are the only DA teams staying in ECNL are Slammers, West Coast, Blues, and Surf. Or are they?


----------



## mahrez

NoGoal said:


> USSF oversees the majority of the affiliated leagues such as USYS which USYS National League falls under or US Club Soccer which ECNL and NPL falls under.
> 
> From what I have read.  Parents in the know are posting.....DAII will fall under US Club soccer and not directly under USSF like Girls DA will be.
> 
> For visual posters:
> USSF ----> Girls DA
> USSF ----> US Club Soccer ----> DAII
> USSF ----> US Club Soccer ----> ECNL
> USSF ----> USYS ----> National League
> USSF ----> USYS ----> Coast Soccer League
> USSF ----> USYS ----> ODP


...US Club ---> ENPL, NPL, id2
....USYS ---> Cal South ---> CSL, SCDSL, Presidio, CRL

According to ZW, LA Galaxy academy won't be fielding or having 2nd or B girls teams in any league.   Doubt this proposed II alternative league is worth it for what 7-8 teams, too much work and $ for such a small group of teams for one area only.


----------



## Realmadrid

so it's 9 and galaxy is apart of it IF it happens...

The USDA said that the southwest model is being looked at for the country..


----------



## NoGoal

mahrez said:


> ...US Club ---> ENPL, NPL, id2
> ....USYS ---> Cal South ---> CSL, SCDSL, Presidio, CRL
> 
> According to ZW, LA Galaxy academy won't be fielding or having 2nd or B girls teams in any league.   Doubt this proposed II alternative league is worth it for what 7-8 teams, too much work and $ for such a small group of teams for one area only.


Thanks, I forgot about the Cal-South layer after USYS.


----------



## Real Deal

Okay, this rule regarding Development Players (from US Soccer Development player rules) is truly interesting:

"*Areas to consider and avoid with DP*: A DP is NOT a false promise, or a label, or a status given to a player to help keep the player in the club. A DP is NOT a means to protect a player from recruiting regulations. A DP is NOT a way to help spread or divide pay to play costs amongst a larger group of players. When misused, DP’s can cause confusion within the club and in particular for the player."


----------



## Real Deal

Kicknit22 said:


> Kinda makes your head hurt, right?


I had a hard enough time back in the day with:
Black Team
White Team
Red Team


----------



## chargerfan

Real Deal said:


> I had a hard enough time back in the day with:
> Black Team
> White Team
> Red Team


Oh, the days before US Soccer realized how much $$$$$ they could make in girls soccer. Simpler times.


----------



## mahrez

Real Deal said:


> Okay, this rule regarding Development Players (from US Soccer Development player rules) is truly interesting:
> 
> "*Areas to consider and avoid with DP*: A DP is NOT a false promise, or a label, or a status given to a player to help keep the player in the club. A DP is NOT a means to protect a player from recruiting regulations. A DP is NOT a way to help spread or divide pay to play costs amongst a larger group of players. When misused, DP’s can cause confusion within the club and in particular for the player."


At least now you know the difference between reality and marketing  & why those clubs that tried to promote a entire 2nd team "as considered DP's" had to strike that wishful thinking.   Any  player that's registered to the Academy Club’s non-Academy between August 1 and March 1 of the current Academy seasonal year can be considered for a DP slot,  this new proposed league does'nt help or change that & as you can see below, limited use for 0-3 players is what they expect.  From the same document:

"U.S. Soccer Support and Guidance: U.S. Soccer’s technical staff and scouts will also evaluate training sessions and friendly games to determine individual player readiness for DA level games. The Technical Advisor may require a Training Center (TC) level or Youth National Team (YNT) level player to move to FT status if viewed to be best for the player’s IDP. U.S. Soccer reserves the right to refuse the addition of a DP player if it is determined that the club is mismanaging their allocation of the DP pool or if it is negatively impacting their FT players.

Academy-wide DP Averages for the 2015-16 Academy Season

Age Group
U-13/14 U-15/16 U-17/18
Avg # of DPs per team 2.85 3.22 1.30

Age Group
U-13/14 U-15/16 U-17/18
Avg # of DPs with zero games 0.13 0.20 0.15


----------



## Real Deal

mahrez said:


> At least now you know the difference between reality and marketing  & why those clubs that tried to promote a entire 2nd team "as considered DP's" had to strike that wishful thinking.   Any  player that's registered to the Academy Club’s non-Academy between August 1 and March 1 of the current Academy seasonal year can be considered for a DP slot,  this new proposed league does'nt help or change that & as you can see below, limited use for 0-3 players is what they expect.  From the same document:
> 
> "U.S. Soccer Support and Guidance: U.S. Soccer’s technical staff and scouts will also evaluate training sessions and friendly games to determine individual player readiness for DA level games. The Technical Advisor may require a Training Center (TC) level or Youth National Team (YNT) level player to move to FT status if viewed to be best for the player’s IDP. U.S. Soccer reserves the right to refuse the addition of a DP player if it is determined that the club is mismanaging their allocation of the DP pool or if it is negatively impacting their FT players.
> 
> Academy-wide DP Averages for the 2015-16 Academy Season
> 
> Age Group
> U-13/14 U-15/16 U-17/18
> Avg # of DPs per team 2.85 3.22 1.30
> 
> Age Group
> U-13/14 U-15/16 U-17/18
> Avg # of DPs with zero games 0.13 0.20 0.15



Yes there were generally only 1 or 2 players from the White Team who got to guest on the Black Team... haha


But this time frame is confusing-- "between August 1 and March 1".  So if a kid is registered tomorrow (March 4) to a non-Academy team, are they still eligible to be a DP?


----------



## mahrez

Real Deal said:


> Yes there were generally only 1 or 2 players from the White Team who got to guest on the Black Team... haha
> 
> 
> But this time frame is confusing-- "between August 1 and March 1".  So if a kid is registered tomorrow (March 4) to a non-Academy team, are they still eligible to be a DP?


Nope that player is not eligible and DP's can't start the season on the roster either, than can only be activated after 1st week in Oct after about the 5th week of the season.  Really a special case with narrow focus not meant to be marketed as a general use carrot for 2nd teams. 

DA can be a good fit for starters or even the first ones off the bench but for the others playing 25% or less not so much unless the training can keep your player happy and improving.


----------



## Real Deal

mahrez said:


> Nope that player is not eligible and DP's can't start the season on the roster either, than can only be activated after 1st week in Oct after about the 5th week of the season.  Really a special case with narrow focus not meant to be marketed as a general use carrot for 2nd teams.
> 
> DA can be a good fit for starters or even the first ones off the bench but for the others playing 25% or less not so much unless the training can keep your player happy and improving.


Ok wow.  So do you think the time frame is true for the girls?  (since there has technically not been an academy season)?  If so, I think parents need to know this before they sign up for their DAII or whatever teams.

What a mess.


----------



## NoGoal

mahrez said:


> DA can be a good fit for starters or even the first ones off the bench but for the others playing 25% or less not so much unless the training can keep your player happy and improving.


Mahrez,  you seem to know a lot about DA.  Do you have a son playing Boys DA, because your posted above is exactly what a friend told him about DA.  My buddy also told me the Boys DA league standings show which players start the most games and which players play the least.  I looked for myself and he was right players 1-15 seem play the most games/minutes.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Mahrez,  you seem to know a lot about DA.  Do you have a son playing Boys DA, because your posted above is exactly what a friend told him about DA.  My buddy also told me the Boys DA league standings show which players start the most games and which players play the least.  I looked for myself and he was right players 1-15 seem play the most games/minutes.


Here is a link that shows....the number of players who start vs games played DA games.  It even breaks down the percent of games the players starts. Posters should browse the combine age groups.  You will notice.....the older birth year plays more than the younger birth year.  Matter of fact the roster is dominated by the older player.  

http://rlsc.ussoccerda.com/sam/teams/index.php?team=1655771


----------



## mahrez

NoGoal said:


> Here is a link that shows....the number of players who start vs games played DA games.  It even breaks down the percent of games the players starts. Posters should browse the combine age groups.  You will notice.....the older birth year plays more than the younger birth year.  Matter of fact the roster is dominated by the older player.
> 
> http://rlsc.ussoccerda.com/sam/teams/index.php?team=1655771


Yes during his HS years until the 2nd half of his senior year when he finally left to play for his school team, something he always want to do.  DA was very good for him and he really grew and enjoyed the experience but would tell you that the no HS play rule is not necessary.

With the split age groups many would take a year off academy and come back when they were older or not, but my player never did that and he was one of those 90% players you see.  He thought he played too much actually and would ask for sub's out of exhaustion sometimes but still remained in mostly.   Notice that team has no DP's.


----------



## NoGoal

mahrez said:


> Yes during his HS years until the 2nd half of his senior year when he finally left to play for his school team, something he always want to do.  DA was very good for him and he really grew and enjoyed the experience but would tell you that the no HS play rule is not necessary.
> 
> With the split age groups many would take a year off academy and come back when they were older or not, but my player never did that and he was one of those 90% players you see.  He thought he played too much actually and would ask for sub's out of exhaustion sometimes but still remained in mostly.   Notice that team has no DP's.


Thanks for the 411.  IMO, a few parents (except starters + 1st 3 subs) are going to have a rude awakening this fall, if their DD's are playing Girls DA. By the looks of things the 16th- 26th rostered players will be practicing more and playing less.   Even if the training is free/reduced on the Girls DA team.....Riding the bench will lead to problems.


----------



## 3thatplay

NoGoal said:


> Thanks for the 411.  IMO, a few parents (except starters + 1st 3 subs) are going to have a rude awakening this fall, if their DD's are playing Girls DA. By the looks of things the 16th- 26th rostered players will be practicing more and playing less.   Even if the training is free/reduced on the Girls DA team.....Riding the bench will lead to problems.


NoGoal is usually spot on, but the substitution rules state (page 15):


> 2. Substitutions: All U-15/16 and U-17/18 Academy games will have a maximum of five (5) substitutions per game with no re-entry across three “opportunities”. U-13, U-14 Academy games will have a maximum of seven (7) substitutions per game with no re-entry across three “opportunities”. TheU-12 Academy games will have unlimited substitutions with re-entry


So there will be slightly less disgruntled parents.   "But he does state 16-26th..." (this is an EDIT)

The rules also state that for most age groups every rostered player must start 25% of the Academy games...  With reimbursement to players that do not receive those starts. (page 11)


> c. Should an Academy player not meet the minimum start requirement (not inclusive of the suggested playing time recommendations at U-12 and U-13(, the player may be entitled to a refund of all team fees excluding travel expenses from the Academy Club unless such refund is excused by Academy Staff for medical or disciplinary reasons.  U.S. Soccer has the ability to apply a financial fine to the club or disallow the addition of new players. This may impact the end-of-year evaluation in the player development category should a club consistently be unable to fulfill the start requirement


----------



## NoGoal

3thatplay said:


> NoGoal is usually spot on, but the substitution rules state (page 15):
> 
> 
> So there will be slightly less disgruntled parents.   "But he does state 16-26th..." (this is an EDIT)
> 
> The rules also state that for most age groups every rostered player must start 25% of the Academy games...  With reimbursement to players that do not receive those starts. (page 11)​


There should be less play time issues with the U13 and U14 age groups, because of the 7 sub limit along with it being a specific age group (no olders).  College coaches aren't heavily recruiting these age groups anyway.

It's the U15/16 and U17/18 combined age group where I see red flags.  Max 5 subs the ENTIRE game (not per half) and usually GKs and defenders are not subbed out unlike midfielders and forwards.  The subsititution pattern will most likely be similar to the Pro game.  Substitution will takes place during the 2nd half after the 60th minute or later.  Meaning the subs that do get in will not be getting a lot of play time. Overall means less opportunities for bench players to be seen during showcase games. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  Note: 25% rostered players will need to play...it's obvious the top half of the standings teams will start the subs against the last 3-4 placed teams to meet the 25% rostered player rule.

It also states, start 25% of rostered players.  The loop hole is....start the sub gs the bad teams and then sub them out at half-time or before and bring in my starters.  Flip the subbing pattern to meet the criteria.


----------



## espola

3thatplay said:


> NoGoal is usually spot on, but the substitution rules state (page 15):
> 
> 
> So there will be slightly less disgruntled parents.   "But he does state 16-26th..." (this is an EDIT)
> 
> The rules also state that for most age groups every rostered player must start 25% of the Academy games...  With reimbursement to players that do not receive those starts. (page 11)​


Restricting substitutions is a sign that the supposed "development" is a fraud.


----------



## cheaper2keeper

espola said:


> Restricting substitutions is a sign that the supposed "development" is a fraud.


Not if you truly only care about developing the top 1% of all the academies.


----------



## timbuck

I'd say a 22 player roster is more of a sign than sub restrictions. 
Older kids (15+) should be match fit and not sub off and on after everytime they make a long run.


----------



## younothat

NoGoal said:


> There should be less play time issues with the U13 and U14 age groups, because of the 7 sub limit along with it being a specific age group (no olders).  College coaches aren't heavily recruiting these age groups anyway.
> 
> It's the U15/16 and U17/18 combined age group where I see red flags.  Max 5 subs the ENTIRE game (not per half) and usually GKs and defenders are not subbed out unlike midfielders and forwards.  The subsititution pattern will most likely be similar to the Pro game.  Substitution will takes place during the 2nd half after the 60th minute or later.  Meaning the subs that do get in will not be getting a lot of play time. Overall means less opportunities for bench players to be seen during showcase games. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  Note: 25% rostered players will need to play...it's obvious the top half of the standings teams will start the subs against the last 3-4 placed teams to meet the 25% rostered player rule.
> 
> It also states, start 25% of rostered players.  The loop hole is....start the sub gs the bad teams and then sub them out at half-time or before and bring in my starters.  Flip the subbing pattern to meet the criteria.


Playing time is/can be a issue even at those younger age groups, there were talking about this all week in the B2003 forum
http://glxy.ussoccerda.com/sam/teams/index.php?team=1654414

Between the two teams that played last week: 5 players not rooster-ed, 14 subs, two of which got into the game but the 2nd one only played 5 mins.  Basically 17-18 players from two teams not playing that week.  Yes there are 7 subs but about 0- to half of those are normally used and remember these is only 3 times plus half times that you can sub so multiple numbers would have to be subed to get 7 on which again doesn't happen much.

Subing for the last 5-10 minutes or only getting a 15 min start doesn't help players that much and what I've seen over the years my kid has been involved is players looking to move at the first transfer window due to lack of playing time among other things.   The suggested playing time recommendations are just that and not guarantee of playing times, some follow those better than others.

The reports and audits the clubs receive sometime touch upon this and others times not so much but the stats are keep and the end of year totals can be interesting.   The transfer process has a whole bunch of provisions that you can look up in the rules but if you don't have the 25% of time its a easy process but players may not train or otherwise participate with a Development Academy team that they are not officially rostered with prior to approval of a transfer request, that both team must agree to or if disputed there are other provisions.

The is also a sequence of Development Academy games that all clubs must conform to for example U-17/18 games must be played prior to U-15/16 games and b. U-14 games must be played prior to U-13 games.  This makes adding 2nd teams to the mix highly unlikely simply not enough field space or time slots unless everybody is playing at complexes which they are not.


----------



## espola

timbuck said:


> I'd say a 22 player roster is more of a sign than sub restrictions.
> Older kids (15+) should be match fit and not sub off and on after everytime they make a long run.


If a coach were to abuse an open substitution policy, that's a problem the program should address with that coach, not make all the other coaches' jobs more difficult.


----------



## NoGoal

younothat said:


> Playing time is/can be a issue even at those younger age groups, there were talking about this all week in the B2003 forum
> http://glxy.ussoccerda.com/sam/teams/index.php?team=1654414
> 
> Between the two teams that played last week: 5 players not rooster-ed, 14 subs, two of which got into the game but the 2nd one only played 5 mins.  Basically 17-18 players from two teams not playing that week.  Yes there are 7 subs but about 0- to half of those are normally used and remember these is only 3 times plus half times that you can sub so multiple numbers would have to be subed to get 7 on which again doesn't happen much.
> 
> Subing for the last 5-10 minutes or only getting a 15 min start doesn't help players that much and what I've seen over the years my kid has been involved is players looking to move at the first transfer window due to lack of playing time among other things.   The suggested playing time recommendations are just that and not guarantee of playing times, some follow those better than others.
> 
> The reports and audits the clubs receive sometime touch upon this and others times not so much but the stats are keep and the end of year totals can be interesting.   The transfer process has a whole bunch of provisions that you can look up in the rules but if you don't have the 25% of time its a easy process but players may not train or otherwise participate with a Development Academy team that they are not officially rostered with prior to approval of a transfer request, that both team must agree to or if disputed there are other provisions.
> 
> The is also a sequence of Development Academy games that all clubs must conform to for example U-17/18 games must be played prior to U-15/16 games and b. U-14 games must be played prior to U-13 games.  This makes adding 2nd teams to the mix highly unlikely simply not enough field space or time slots unless everybody is playing at complexes which they are not.


Dam, I appreciate the parents with boys DA experience sharing their insights.  By the looks of things, DA is catering to the starters plus the 3 subs.  I totally forgot the club coach doesn't have to use their 5-7 sub maximum per game (depending on age group).

There will some juicy sideline drama this inaugural season for the Girls DA.  I am counting my blessing that my DD will be aging out in a couple of months


----------



## chargerfan

cheaper2keeper said:


> Not if you truly only care about developing the top 1% of all the academies.


You hit the nail on the head. It is all about developing the top 1%, and keeping them and their parents happy. Everyone else is just shelling out serious money and time to say their daughter plays DA.


----------



## NoGoal

The posters who are in a euphoric state because Girls DA is launching this fall.  Have any of you read the B2003 Academy thread?  If not read page 12 and 13.....subs are not frequently used.
http://www.socalsoccer.com/threads/academy-season.267/page-13

Some of the parents are going to miss ECNL and the sub rule per half.  lmao!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> The posters who are in a euphoric state because Girls DA is launching this fall.  Have any of you read the B2003 Academy thread?  If not read page 12 and 13.....subs are not frequently used.
> http://www.socalsoccer.com/threads/academy-season.267/page-13
> 
> Some of the parents are going to miss ECNL and the sub rule per half.  lmao!


If Girls DA players are training 4-5 days a week.  This means the players will be more fit and able to play the whole game.  Meaning,  there is no need to sub the starters.  I'm getting it now....it's a whole new way of thinking.

Lots of girls will be riding the pine!


----------



## clueless parent

chargerfan said:


> You hit the nail on the head. It is all about developing the top 1%, and keeping them and their parents happy. Everyone else is just shelling out serious money and time to say their daughter plays DA.


DA is making sense.  US Soccer is creating a system to train future national team players.  If your daughter is not national team material (or not interested in that level of play and commitment), GDA may not be the right place for her.

I am interested to see if GDA is the only option for a girl interested in playing at the collegiate level.  There are some amazing colleges that play D3.  Will D3 only be interested in GDA?  We are in uncharted territory.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> If Girls DA players are training 4-5 days a week.  This means the players will be more fit and able to play the whole game.  Meaning,  there is no need to sub the starters.  I'm getting it now....it's a whole new way of thinking.


Have you been drinking again?


----------



## NoGoal

clueless parent said:


> DA is making sense.  US Soccer is creating a system to train future national team players.  If your daughter is not national team material (or not interested in that level of play and commitment), GDA may not be the right place for her.
> 
> I am interested to see if GDA is the only option for a girl interested in playing at the collegiate level.  There are some amazing colleges that play D3.  Will D3 only be interested in GDA?  We are in uncharted territory.


Yeah right, Girls DA was created to ID 22 future rostered Sr national team players.  If that's the case, then I am right about club soccer especially Girls DA being ponzi scheme.  lmao!


----------



## chargerfan

clueless parent said:


> DA is making sense.  US Soccer is creating a system to train future national team players.  If your daughter is not national team material (or not interested in that level of play and commitment), GDA may not be the right place for her.
> 
> I am interested to see if GDA is the only option for a girl interested in playing at the collegiate level.  There are some amazing colleges that play D3.  Will D3 only be interested in GDA?  We are in uncharted territory.


I fail to see what their plan is with DA that wasn't in place before with ECNL. It's the same clubs and the same coaches. The top girls will continue to be the top girls, and receive the most playing time, to the detriment of the bottom of the bench. I don't foresee much changing. They are responding to a girls soccer culture that has become about club and coach egos, parents' crazy ideas about their daughter being national team worthy and their willingness to give up a lot of time and money to make that happen.

Plenty of non-ECNL girls play in college, and plenty of non-DA girls will play in college. Talent is talent is talent. I guess I am just not too concerned with this "uncharted territory" as I am much more concerned with my daughter's academic future than her soccer one. If she's lucky enough to play in college, I will be cheering her on like crazy from the sidelines, but my goal for her is only a fantastic education that will help her land a good job.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Yeah right, Girls DA was created to ID 22 future rostered Sr national team players.  If that's the case, then I am right about club soccer especially Girls DA being ponzi scheme.  lmao!


Let this figure stew for a minute.  If, Girls DA is for the LUCKY 24 future Sr team players.  In which the players are cycled in and out of the team.  Let's say and it's not unreasonable to say the team roster will turned over every decade.  It means ONLY 2.4 players per calender year have a shot making the Sr team.

There are 16,000 D1 women college players playing per year.  A player making the Sr team is .00006%


----------



## younothat

NoGoal said:


> Yeah right, Girls DA was created to ID 22 future rostered Sr national team players.  If that's the case, then I am right about club soccer especially Girls DA being ponzi scheme.  lmao!



"....designed to accelerate the development of world-class female players"

Sr team or aboard? this seems like more of a narrow focus vs boys  but same things are noted but w/ stronger tie to MLS teams on the boys side?.

How many women professional org are there involved initially in the girls DA?  Both our locals are: LA Galaxy and LAFC (Slammers)

Developing homegrown player for our domestic league is something they publicize on the boys side.

For the GNT or YNT;  Something like Scouts ID-->Age group training center's each two months (X) --->Quarterly Pools (48)---->Team Camp (36) Games or scrimmages--->Call back players X3 (20) + 18 (New each quarter)---> Final team end of season

Since those are nation wide the number of players for one area tends to be small quantities especially when you get to the camps but maybe SC will have a disproportion?  Couple 2-3 from each age group?

Will the pools be ~85  for the DA like the boys, no way I would venture to quess for the girls. 10 yrs from now maybe?


----------



## Dos Equis

NoGoal said:


> Yeah right, Girls DA was created to ID 22 future rostered Sr national team players.  If that's the case, then I am right about club soccer especially Girls DA being ponzi scheme.  lmao!


Actually, you are right.  Not about the Ponzi scheme, but about the primary goal of the DA.


----------



## 3thatplay

NoGoal said:


> Let this figure stew for a minute.  If, Girls DA is for the LUCKY 24 future Sr team players.  In which the players are cycled in and out of the team.  Let's say and it's not unreasonable to say the team roster will turned over every decade.  It means ONLY 2.4 players per calender year have a shot making the Sr team.
> 
> There are 16,000 D1 women college players playing per year.  *A player making the Sr team is .00006%*


 .   I think your math is off.  Your number is 1 in 1.67 Million.   When you add the percentage sign you need to move the decimal two spots.


----------



## Kicknit22

I can't  help but agree with you chargerfan.  The change is only with regard to who is running the show, I think.  My DD has not been part of the ECNL (because of us, logistics, etc.), so if she decides to go DA, we will experience a difference.  Totally unchartered waters for us.  The only thing we ARE certain of is the fact that our DD will go to a great school, regardless.  As a family, we are not relying on soccer to get her there.  If this is the more direct path to her dream of playing at the highest level, great. Sometimes there are sacrifices that are necessary to achieve ones dreams.  Personally, I hate that those sacrifices are HS sports, as does she.  So, the ultimate decision is hers.


----------



## Lambchop

Kicknit22 said:


> I can't  help but agree with you chargerfan.  The change is only with regard to who is running the show, I think.  My DD has not been part of the ECNL (because of us, logistics, etc.), so if she decides to go DA, we will experience a difference.  Totally unchartered waters for us.  The only thing we ARE certain of is the fact that our DD will go to a great school, regardless.  As a family, we are not relying on soccer to get her there.  If this is the more direct path to her dream of playing at the highest level, great. Sometimes there are sacrifices that are necessary to achieve ones dreams.  Personally, I hate that those sacrifices are HS sports, as does she.  So, the ultimate decision is hers.





Dos Equis said:


> Actually, you are right.  Not about the Ponzi scheme, but about the primary goal of the DA.


I think the ultimate goal of raising the level of play across the country even for girls who don't make the national team is a good thing.  If you love soccer and are passionate about it, you might understand.  Every sport is expensive. Some families even move to different states to provide their athlete the best coaching and facilities.  Nothing new here.  Maybe it is the AYSO thinking where everyone plays, costs are low and therefore the same thing should continue.  AYSO is a good place to start with the little ones to see if their interests are with soccer.  There are many sports available for kids to participate in if that is what you want and your child wants.  At some point you make an educated decision with your child on their future in the game and if it is worth it.  No need to keep bashing a new path for soccer. Change is inevitable.  The US women have been at the top of the soccer world for a long time but the rest of the world is catching up. Nothing wrong with change.


----------



## Kicknit22

Lambchop said:


> I think the ultimate goal of raising the level of play across the country even for girls who don't make the national team is a good thing.  If you love soccer and are passionate about it, you might understand.  Every sport is expensive. Some families even move to different states to provide their athlete the best coaching and facilities.  Nothing new here.  Maybe it is the AYSO thinking where everyone plays, costs are low and therefore the same thing should continue.  AYSO is a good place to start with the little ones to see if their interests are with soccer.  There are many sports available for kids to participate in if that is what you want and your child wants.  At some point you make an educated decision with your child on their future in the game and if it is worth it.  No need to keep bashing a new path for soccer. Change is inevitable.  The US women have been at the top of the soccer world for a long time but the rest of the world is catching up. Nothing wrong with change.


Very well put Lamb.


----------



## chargerfan

NoGoal said:


> Let this figure stew for a minute.  If, Girls DA is for the LUCKY 24 future Sr team players.  In which the players are cycled in and out of the team.  Let's say and it's not unreasonable to say the team roster will turned over every decade.  It means ONLY 2.4 players per calender year have a shot making the Sr team.
> 
> There are 16,000 D1 women college players playing per year.  A player making the Sr team is .00006%





Kicknit22 said:


> Very well put Lamb.


We have been involved in competitive level basketball and baseball, both which can lead to very lucrative playing careers, but youth soccer takes the cake as far as delusion of parents. I think it's because soccer isn't a sport we grew up with so we feel we need to hand  over thousands of dollars to a guy with adidas gear and a cool accent to "develop" them. There are definitely good coaches and good clubs out there that are really developing, and it is a shame they are losing players whose parents think they need to leave to find the next best thing.


----------



## NoGoal

Lambchop said:


> I think the ultimate goal of raising the level of play across the country even for girls who don't make the national team is a good thing.  If you love soccer and are passionate about it, you might understand.  Every sport is expensive. Some families even move to different states to provide their athlete the best coaching and facilities.  Nothing new here.  Maybe it is the AYSO thinking where everyone plays, costs are low and therefore the same thing should continue.  AYSO is a good place to start with the little ones to see if their interests are with soccer.  There are many sports available for kids to participate in if that is what you want and your child wants.  At some point you make an educated decision with your child on their future in the game and if it is worth it.  No need to keep bashing a new path for soccer. Change is inevitable.  The US women have been at the top of the soccer world for a long time but the rest of the world is catching up. Nothing wrong with change.


Sure the landscape changes, but what do you think Girls DA will change?  I understand their marketing and valued added philosophy is development with 4-5 training sessions per week?  Do you think US Soccer evolves into a possession style? It's really about development over wins (read Boys DA 2003 thread).  They will pick less athletic, but more technical players over superior athletic players made into soccer players? Non-National team players will be sign a 6 figure income, if drafted by NWSL teams?

Seriously, I would like to know your thoughts.


----------



## Lambchop

NoGoal said:


> Sure the landscape changes, but what do you think Girls DA will change?  I understand their marketing and valued added philosophy is development with 4-5 training sessions per week?  Do you think US Soccer evolves into a possession style? It's really about development over wins (read Boys DA 2003 thread).  They will pick less athletic, but more technical players over superior athletic players made into soccer players? Non-National team players will be sign a 6 figure income, if drafted by NWSL teams?
> 
> Seriously, I would like to know your thoughts.


The USMNT U20 team just won the CONCACAF!  Most are products of the boys DA!  
Congratulations to our young men on their victories.


----------



## Kicknit22

Hey NG, I am not answering for Lambchop here, but I wanted to offer up my thoughts.  As Chargerfan put it, not much different from what ECNL was providing prior to this power play by US SOCCER.  However, the big "change" is the elevated demand of commitment expected.  4-5 days a week and NO outside sports.  I think the style of play will always be shifting as it always has.  As far as the "type" of player they will be looking for, I can only hope that there will be less of a cookie cutter approach to identifying.  As a father to 2 daughters that love this sport, I am encouraged by the changing landscape.  Most would agree that the sport is gaining popularity in this country and throughout the world.  The fight for equal pay of today's women will only benefit the next generation of young ladies.  I, for one, am rooting for them.


----------



## NoGoal

Lambchop said:


> The USMNT U20 team just won the CONCACAF!  Most are products of the boys DA!
> Congratulations to our young men on their victories.


Concacaf?  Um....the Mens National team already beat concacaf teams....USA Mens team have qualified for the World Cup going since 1990.  The 2 best countries in the Concacaf are USA and Mexico. So don't get all jazzed about our U20 menas team winning Concacaf. 

BTW, Girls YNT and the Sr team already beat Concacaf teams as well. 

Next?


----------



## NoGoal

Kicknit22 said:


> Hey NG, I am not answering for Lambchop here, but I wanted to offer up my thoughts.  As Chargerfan put it, not much different from what ECNL was providing prior to this power play by US SOCCER.  However, the big "change" is the elevated demand of commitment expected.  4-5 days a week and NO outside sports.  I think the style of play will always be shifting as it always has.  As far as the "type" of player they will be looking for, I can only hope that there will be less of a cookie cutter approach to identifying.  As a father to 2 daughters that love this sport, I am encouraged by the changing landscape.  Most would agree that the sport is gaining popularity in this country and throughout the world.  The fight for equal pay of today's women will only benefit the next generation of young ladies.  I, for one, am rooting for them.


I'm sorry, but if your DD wasn't already training 4-5 days a week since U10. Then your DD is already behind.  My DD and many others I know....have been doing it for years already without US Soccer needing to dictate down.  These players were training 2 days with their club team, 1-2 day of training on their own....e.g. ball to the wall skills drills/shooting. 1 day of speed and agility training started at 12 yrs old.

So what is supposedly different?  My DD's club coach already told me...the US Soccer philosophy is 2-3 days of training, mixed in with 1 day of conditioning and 1 day of board/video work.m

As for YNT camp invites, how will it be different than watching ECNL showcase games substitute now for Girls DA showcase games.  Also, throw in the typical DOC recommending their best players to the YNT scouts/head coaches.


----------



## NoGoal

I find it ironic that I'm sounding more and more like Zoro (a former uolders poster).  I use to disagree with him years ago when I was a ulittle parent.


----------



## Dos Equis

Lambchop said:


> I think the ultimate goal of raising the level of play across the country even for girls who don't make the national team is a good thing.  If you love soccer and are passionate about it, you might understand.  Every sport is expensive. Some families even move to different states to provide their athlete the best coaching and facilities.  Nothing new here.  Maybe it is the AYSO thinking where everyone plays, costs are low and therefore the same thing should continue.  AYSO is a good place to start with the little ones to see if their interests are with soccer.  There are many sports available for kids to participate in if that is what you want and your child wants.  At some point you make an educated decision with your child on their future in the game and if it is worth it.  No need to keep bashing a new path for soccer. Change is inevitable.  The US women have been at the top of the soccer world for a long time but the rest of the world is catching up. Nothing wrong with change.


If the ultimate goal was "raising the level of play across the country", then U.S. Soccer would not be putting so much resources into an effort that will touch, at most, 0.01% of the youth soccer players in this country.  

For those who do love soccer and are passionate enough to have some interaction with and resulting insight into U.S. Soccer, and  understand their motivation, know their goal with the DA is to create elite players, develop the U.S. version of a Messi, Ronaldo, and build a U.S. National team that will compete for and win World Cups as soon as possible (or in the women's case, stay at the top).  Nothing wrong with agreeing with that goal, particularly if it aligns with your own.  But pointing out what the new path (the "DA") actually is, even pointing out some of the risks and consequences in their strategy, is not bashing it.   

And change may be invetible, but sometimes change can be wrong.


----------



## NoGoal

IMO, US womens soccer will never evolve into a pure possession style of play like Barca on the mens side or Japan, Korea and France on the women's side.  Overall we don't have the club coaches who know how to ID or develop these types of players....where the sum is greater than the parts.  There are not many Andres Deza (DeAnza girls coach) who grow up in Spain and know their development philosophy.

Think about this....Jill Ellis is originally from England and April Heinrich is a UNC product. Do they know how to run a Spanish, Japanese or French type program?  I did read the new Girls DA Director Miriam Hickey has Dutch training.  Let's see, if she has the power to influence the Girls DA club teams.  I just hope  US Womens Soccer doesn't forget what made them great in their pursuit to remain #1 in the world.


----------



## chargerfan

NoGoal said:


> I'm sorry, but if your DD wasn't already training 4-5 days a week since U10. Then your DD is already behind.  My DD and many others I know....have been doing it for years already without US Soccer needing to dictate down.  These players were training 2 days with their club team, 1-2 day of training on their own....e.g. ball to the wall skills drills/shooting. 1 day of speed and agility training started at 12 yrs old.
> 
> So what is supposedly different?  My DD's club coach already told me...the US Soccer philosophy is 2-3 days of training, mixed in with 1 day of conditioning and 1 day of board/video work.m
> 
> As for YNT camp invites, how will it be different than watching ECNL showcase games substitute now for Girls DA showcase games.  Also, throw in the typical DOC recommending their best players to the YNT scouts/head coaches.


I think most girls who love soccer already play 4-5 days a week. But playing outside with your brother or at an indoor league is different than getting on your practice clothes on again and getting in the car again and spending your whole week at practice. Year after year of 4x week soccer practice to the exclusion of other sports and activities isn't good for most girls. If you are a very top player, I can see it, but the vast majority of our daughters aren't.


----------



## NoGoal

chargerfan said:


> I think most girls who love soccer already play 4-5 days a week. But playing outside with your brother or at an indoor league is different than getting on your practice clothes on again and getting in the car again and spending your whole week at practice. Year after year of 4x week soccer practice to the exclusion of other sports and activities isn't good for most girls. If you are a very top player, I can see it, but the vast majority of our daughters aren't.


I agree this 4-5 days of training isn't for everyone.  A player who wants to play at a high level should have already been making this sacrifice long ago and not because Girls DA is doing it this fall.  I'm not posting about kicking the ball back and forth with their older siblings like you posted above either.  

The top players sacrifice, going out with friends on weekends, skip dances, hanging with friends for the love of soccer.  If they aren't or have a hard time doing it now in high school....it's what they will have to do eventually playing college soccer.  Believe me my DD is already doing her college workout/conditioning packet and it's 5 additional days of hard work on top of club practice.


----------



## clueless parent

chargerfan said:


> I fail to see what their plan is with DA that wasn't in place before with ECNL. It's the same clubs and the same coaches. The top girls will continue to be the top girls, and receive the most playing time, to the detriment of the bottom of the bench. I don't foresee much changing. They are responding to a girls soccer culture that has become about club and coach egos, parents' crazy ideas about their daughter being national team worthy and their willingness to give up a lot of time and money to make that happen.
> 
> Plenty of non-ECNL girls play in college, and plenty of non-DA girls will play in college. Talent is talent is talent. I guess I am just not too concerned with this "uncharted territory" as I am much more concerned with my daughter's academic future than her soccer one. If she's lucky enough to play in college, I will be cheering her on like crazy from the sidelines, but my goal for her is only a fantastic education that will help her land a good job.


Chargerfan and NoGoal,

I do not pretend to understand soccer for children.  I am learning and often thinking aloud.  Your posts seem condescending toward my thoughts.  I readily admit that I am learning as I go.  The tone of your posts indicate contempt and ridicule.  Earnest people may opt out of a forum of intolerant, insensitive, and rude participants of public discourse.  I for one am done.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

clueless parent said:


> Chargerfan and NoGoal,
> 
> I do not pretend to understand soccer for children.  I am learning and often thinking aloud.  Your posts seem condescending toward my thoughts.  I readily admit that I am learning as I go.  The tone of your posts indicate contempt and ridicule.  Earnest people may opt out of a forum of intolerant, insensitive, and rude participants of public discourse.  I for one am done.


and this is the nice nogoal you have been dealing with, good decision on your part


----------



## 3thatplay

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree.  The starting median salary at my players school for grads is more than a max contract in the NWSL.  She told me that she isn't even considering going pro.  It's funny because she will be on Chris Henderson's top 25 draft prospects for 2020 that he is releasing in the next week and I will bet money that she is in the top 10.


Just saw the list.  Some very complimentary words for your DD.  Good luck to her!


----------



## chargerfan

clueless parent said:


> Chargerfan and NoGoal,
> 
> I do not pretend to understand soccer for children.  I am learning and often thinking aloud.  Your posts seem condescending toward my thoughts.  I readily admit that I am learning as I go.  The tone of your posts indicate contempt and ridicule.  Earnest people may opt out of a forum of intolerant, insensitive, and rude participants of public discourse.  I for one am done.


Maybe I was playing devils advocate, but my intention was not to be rude or condescending. I just know too many parents who are willing to sign up their children for any and everything that they think will get them on the national team or a spot at Stanford/ucla. These parents, and their willingness to blindly drink all the kool aid, make it harder for the rest of our kids to play at the highest level without giving up other sports, homework time, or god forbid, a social life.


----------



## chargerfan

NoGoal said:


> I agree this 4-5 days of training isn't for everyone.  A player who wants to play at a high level should have already been making this sacrifice long ago and not because Girls DA is doing it this fall.  I'm not posting about kicking the ball back and forth with their older siblings like you posted above either.
> 
> The top players sacrifice, going out with friends on weekends, skip dances, hanging with friends for the love of soccer.  If they aren't or have a hard time doing it now in high school....it's what they will have to do eventually playing college soccer.  Believe me my DD is already doing her college workout/conditioning packet and it's 5 additional days of hard work on top of club practice.


 I bought my daughter a ladder and some other conditioning stuff , and she is in the garage almost daily using it. She has a small group of neighborhood boys she plays with using Pug goals in the backyard, and I can't tell you how much that has improved her game, and no driving or $ on my part. It's also nice to see her motivated to improve on her own, and not  coach, team, or parental motivation. 

Congrats to your daughter! You must be so proud to see her play in college. I'd be bursting with pride! Good luck to her!


----------



## Blue Card

chargerfan said:


> You hit the nail on the head. It is all about developing the top 1%, and keeping them and their parents happy. Everyone else is just shelling out serious money and time to say their daughter plays DA.


Put aside travel (which is probably naive), but if you've got a kid who loves and is dedicated to soccer and are lucky enough to have a DA club nearby which for So Cal is now just as or more likely than having an ECNL club nearby, make it, and get comfortable with playing time, how drastically different (at least at the pre-high school years) are you assuming it is in terms of cost and time?  Say your high quality but non-DA club practices 2-3 times per week, plays league games and tourneys all over So Cal in San Diego, OC, LA and Ventura counties, you do outside training once a week, and your team plays lot of tournaments including frequently 3-5 games in a single weekend.  Now maybe you're trading the separate outside training once a week (and its cost) for a 3rd or 4th (very high quality if you buy into everything) practice and freeing yourself up from the frequent 4-5 game per weekend slog.  Based on the only info someone has put up here of about $2800 for a non-funded DA and assuming no scholarship--that's say $500-$1000 more for the year (again the hole here could be travel but looks like there are a lot of So Cal DA teams) but you're not paying ref fees, uniform fees and maybe cutting down somewhat on outside training.  I guess it all depends on the circumstances but doesn't seem so obviously drastically different in terms of cost and time, at least for the younger ages of DA and at the younger ages you're not giving up high school sports...Shoot this full of holes, lots of people trying to figure this new thing out, but in any event I wouldn't assume the only interest is because it's cool to say "My DD is DA" or because they think there's a real chance DD is going to be on the WNT or even the YNT.


----------



## younothat

chargerfan said:


> Maybe I was playing devils advocate, but my intention was not to be rude or condescending. I just know too many parents who are willing to sign up their children for any and everything that they think will get them on the national team or a spot at Stanford/ucla. These parents, and their willingness to blindly drink all the kool aid, make it harder for the rest of our kids to play at the highest level without giving up other sports, homework time, or god forbid, a social life.


Good to have different perspectives....everybody has different ways....

My DD is friends with a YNT/WNT player going to Stanford who has Ucla on her short list for colleges.  She plays because she loves the game, teammates, having fun.  Dreams are possible as are long shots, when you see them come in...gives  hope now matter the odds...

She doesn't aspire to play college soccer and wants to constraint on academies and other social or civic programs she is part of.  The journey for us  has been very positive, so much fun watching her over the years grow so much, I'm happy she's done things her way, DA is not on her radar as a HS Junior.


----------



## outside!

LA GALAXY SAN DIEGO JOINS WPSL

http://lagalaxysd.com/lagsd-joins-wpsl/

It is good to see the WPSL expanding. This will offer some of the graduated players a chance to stay fresh.


----------



## chargerfan

Blue Card said:


> Put aside travel (which is probably naive), but if you've got a kid who loves and is dedicated to soccer and are lucky enough to have a DA club nearby which for So Cal is now just as or more likely than having an ECNL club nearby, make it, and get comfortable with playing time, how drastically different (at least at the pre-high school years) are you assuming it is in terms of cost and time?  Say your high quality but non-DA club practices 2-3 times per week, plays league games and tourneys all over So Cal in San Diego, OC, LA and Ventura counties, you do outside training once a week, and your team plays lot of tournaments including frequently 3-5 games in a single weekend.  Now maybe you're trading the separate outside training once a week (and its cost) for a 3rd or 4th (very high quality if you buy into everything) practice and freeing yourself up from the frequent 4-5 game per weekend slog.  Based on the only info someone has put up here of about $2800 for a non-funded DA and assuming no scholarship--that's say $500-$1000 more for the year (again the hole here could be travel but looks like there are a lot of So Cal DA teams) but you're not paying ref fees, uniform fees and maybe cutting down somewhat on outside training.  I guess it all depends on the circumstances but doesn't seem so obviously drastically different in terms of cost and time, at least for the younger ages of DA and at the younger ages you're not giving up high school sports...Shoot this full of holes, lots of people trying to figure this new thing out, but in any event I wouldn't assume the only interest is because it's cool to say "My DD is DA" or because they think there's a real chance DD is going to be on the WNT or even the YNT.



$2800 plus at least two out of state tournaments travel cost totals quite a bit more than we pay. I think most top teams practice 3 times a week, what about that 4th practice justifies an extra  $800-1000? 

We must not know the same type of parents because I know many that are sacrificing a lot of time and money thinking DA is their child's only option if they want to be on the national team or play at a good college. A lot of it is about status and bragging rights in my opinion. Look at the trashing of ecnl, odp, scdsl etc on this board since DA was announced. A lot of parents suddenly think their daughters are too good for the things that they were happy with before!


----------



## clueless parent

chargerfan said:


> Maybe I was playing devils advocate, but my intention was not to be rude or condescending. I just know too many parents who are willing to sign up their children for any and everything that they think will get them on the national team or a spot at Stanford/ucla. These parents, and their willingness to blindly drink all the kool aid, make it harder for the rest of our kids to play at the highest level without giving up other sports, homework time, or god forbid, a social life.


Thanks Chargerfan.  I now understand your point of view.


----------



## Blue Card

chargerfan said:


> $2800 plus at least two out of state tournaments travel cost totals quite a bit more than we pay. I think most top teams practice 3 times a week, what about that 4th practice justifies an extra  $800-1000?
> 
> We must not know the same type of parents because I know many that are sacrificing a lot of time and money thinking DA is their child's only option if they want to be on the national team or play at a good college. A lot of it is about status and bragging rights in my opinion. Look at the trashing of ecnl, odp, scdsl etc on this board since DA was announced. A lot of parents suddenly think their daughters are too good for the things that they were happy with before!


Yeah, different kinds of professional help needed, but parents probably need professional help if either their self esteem comes from the level of their DD's soccer team or if shelling out thousands of buck for kids' soccer is viewed as a wise financial investment.  Issues for another thread.  It's a huge amount of $ and I'm not suggesting the extra is justified or that the base for a non DA club is justified.  Was just saying if you look at it closely, how DIFFERENT is it really and help me think about it...So on the 800-1000 difference, say the uniform set is $200 you otherwise do one group semiprivate at $30 a session three times a month but won't now that you have 4 practices a week and say you do that 8 months out of the year.  24X30=$720 plus $200 for the uniform is $920 you're now not paying.  + ref fees you're not paying.  + tournament entry fees you're not paying.  Again, extremely expensive and silly if looked at as an investment, but how DIFFERENT overall is that?  I offered up in the first instance that travel was the black hole I didn't know about.  But many teams would do Vegas and/or Dallas and/or a different out of state tourney anyway, right?  So you're swapping where out of state you go?  And who knows with the concentration of the CA teams and the good weather maybe many of the tourneys would actually be in Cali?


----------



## chargerfan

Blue Card said:


> Yeah, different kinds of professional help needed, but parents probably need professional help if either their self esteem comes from the level of their DD's soccer team or if shelling out thousands of buck for kids' soccer is viewed as a wise financial investment.  Issues for another thread.  It's a huge amount of $ and I'm not suggesting the extra is justified or that the base for a non DA club is justified.  Was just saying if you look at it closely, how DIFFERENT is it really and help me think about it...So on the 800-1000 difference, say the uniform set is $200 you otherwise do one group semiprivate at $30 a session three times a month but won't now that you have 4 practices a week and say you do that 8 months out of the year.  24X30=$720 plus $200 for the uniform is $920 you're now not paying.  + ref fees you're not paying.  + tournament entry fees you're not paying.  Again, extremely expensive and silly if looked at as an investment, but how DIFFERENT overall is that?  I offered up in the first instance that travel was the black hole I didn't know about.  But many teams would do Vegas and/or Dallas and/or a different out of state tourney anyway, right?  So you're swapping where out of state you go?  And who knows with the concentration of the CA teams and the good weather maybe many of the tourneys would actually be in Cali?


I've been lucky enough to not have to pay for out of state tournaments, with the exception of Vegas one year. It looks like I will have to shell out more for travel this year, but I still think you can't beat the competition here in so cal.

I know I really am playing devils advocate with the DA, but I still don't see what it offers that ECNL doesnt, and without the perk of being able to play high school sports. All I'm seeing right now is a money grab by US soccer and parents obsessed with a shiny new toy.


----------



## Blue Card

chargerfan said:


> I've been lucky enough to not have to pay for out of state tournaments, with the exception of Vegas one year. It looks like I will have to shell out more for travel this year, but I still think you can't beat the competition here in so cal.
> 
> I know I really am playing devils advocate with the DA, but I still don't see what it offers that ECNL doesnt, and without the perk of being able to play high school sports. All I'm seeing right now is a money grab by US soccer and parents obsessed with a shiny new toy.


Fair enough and don't disagree in many respects.  It was the gist of someone's "you've got to be insane to think about DA because of the all of the extra time and $ it takes [over high level club I assumed]" thread that spurred me to try to get info from others to see what I may thinking about incorrectly because I had casually been thinking about that and didn't really see such a huge difference in time or $--certain not enough difference to catapult someone into the category of mental illness anyway.


----------



## Dos Equis

chargerfan said:


> I know I really am playing devils advocate with the DA, but I still don't see what it offers that ECNL doesnt, and without the perk of being able to play high school sports. All I'm seeing right now is a money grab by US soccer and parents obsessed with a shiny new toy.


Not an advocate of DA, but this is not a money grab, it is a power play.  U.S. Soccer will fund DA tournaments, fund some travel scholarships for players, and pay for all admin/overhead.  The registration fees they make likely do not come close to offsetting those costs. It is an investment by U.S. Soccer, with the return to them increased control and a better pool of players (in their opinion) for the national teams.

What it offers parents/players versus ECNL (in theory) is higher coach licensing requirments, more mandated training, different substitution rules, protecting your player from the hazards of outside competition, and a geographically more accessible selection of  clubs (here in Socal).  And for those who play for a fully funded DA program, a much lower cost.


----------



## NoGoal

chargerfan said:


> I bought my daughter a ladder and some other conditioning stuff , and she is in the garage almost daily using it. She has a small group of neighborhood boys she plays with using Pug goals in the backyard, and I can't tell you how much that has improved her game, and no driving or $ on my part. It's also nice to see her motivated to improve on her own, and not  coach, team, or parental motivation.
> 
> Congrats to your daughter! You must be so proud to see her play in college. I'd be bursting with pride! Good luck to her!


Your family gets it and if your DD has ambitions playing college soccer.  Your family will think it through and choose the best path to accomplish that goal, besides following the sheep to Girls DA.  If Girls DA is the best route...awesome, if not there will still be plenty of opportunities to be showcased outside of Girls DA.  No different than players outside of ECNL committing to college soccer now.


----------



## chargerfan

Dos Equis said:


> Not an advocate of DA, but this is not a money grab, it is a power play.  U.S. Soccer will fund DA tournaments, fund some travel scholarships for players, and pay for all admin/overhead.  The registration fees they make likely do not come close to offsetting those costs. It is an investment by U.S. Soccer, with the return to them increased control and a better pool of players (in their opinion) for the national teams.
> 
> What it offers parents/players versus ECNL (in theory) is higher coach licensing requirments, more mandated training, different substitution rules, protecting your player from the hazards of outside competition, and a geographically more accessible selection of  clubs (here in Socal).  And for those who play for a fully funded DA program, a much lower cost.


Two of the 04 DA coaches in San Diego were already coaching 04 teams. Surf is keeping the same coach. If you want a coach with a top license, there were already options. I don't think the new sub rules encourage development at all. "Hazards of outside competition"? Just say it- they think they are too good for high school soccer, and don't want to lose that control. For the large majority of girls (about 98%), soccer will not be a career or money maker, so why not let them play with their friends in high school?


----------



## NoGoal

Blue Card said:


> Put aside travel (which is probably naive), but if you've got a kid who loves and is dedicated to soccer and are lucky enough to have a DA club nearby which for So Cal is now just as or more likely than having an ECNL club nearby, make it, and get comfortable with playing time, how drastically different (at least at the pre-high school years) are you assuming it is in terms of cost and time?  Say your high quality but non-DA club practices 2-3 times per week, plays league games and tourneys all over So Cal in San Diego, OC, LA and Ventura counties, you do outside training once a week, and your team plays lot of tournaments including frequently 3-5 games in a single weekend.  Now maybe you're trading the separate outside training once a week (and its cost) for a 3rd or 4th (very high quality if you buy into everything) practice and freeing yourself up from the frequent 4-5 game per weekend slog.  Based on the only info someone has put up here of about $2800 for a non-funded DA and assuming no scholarship--that's say $500-$1000 more for the year (again the hole here could be travel but looks like there are a lot of So Cal DA teams) but you're not paying ref fees, uniform fees and maybe cutting down somewhat on outside training.  I guess it all depends on the circumstances but doesn't seem so obviously drastically different in terms of cost and time, at least for the younger ages of DA and at the younger ages you're not giving up high school sports...Shoot this full of holes, lots of people trying to figure this new thing out, but in any event I wouldn't assume the only interest is because it's cool to say "My DD is DA" or because they think there's a real chance DD is going to be on the WNT or even the YNT.


This is my take,  if the ultimate goal is women college soccer....which should be 99% of the parents/readers in this forum.  There is no rush to play Girls DA at U12, U13 or even U14.   "IF" your DD is a great little player and has a great club coach who knows how to develop players, along with doing skills training, training on her own (parent supervising), speed and agility.   She will be fine, unfortunately....eventually, she will need to make the leap to a Girls DA team no later than U15, because she will need to play at a faster pace, deal with physical players, and most important be seen by the greatest amount of college coaches.  

There are plenty of players who are playing on a top team at ulittles who won't be there come uolders (U14 and older).  I've seen it, previous uolders posters posted it and it will continue today and into the future. 

If she is good player, then maybe U14....because, she will need a year to adjust to the speed of play.


----------



## NoGoal

Blue Card said:


> Yeah, different kinds of professional help needed, but parents probably need professional help if either their self esteem comes from the level of their DD's soccer team or if shelling out thousands of buck for kids' soccer is viewed as a wise financial investment.  Issues for another thread.  It's a huge amount of $ and I'm not suggesting the extra is justified or that the base for a non DA club is justified.  Was just saying if you look at it closely, how DIFFERENT is it really and help me think about it...So on the 800-1000 difference, say the uniform set is $200 you otherwise do one group semiprivate at $30 a session three times a month but won't now that you have 4 practices a week and say you do that 8 months out of the year.  24X30=$720 plus $200 for the uniform is $920 you're now not paying.  + ref fees you're not paying.  + tournament entry fees you're not paying.  Again, extremely expensive and silly if looked at as an investment, but how DIFFERENT overall is that?  I offered up in the first instance that travel was the black hole I didn't know about.  But many teams would do Vegas and/or Dallas and/or a different out of state tourney anyway, right?  So you're swapping where out of state you go?  And who knows with the concentration of the CA teams and the good weather maybe many of the tourneys would actually be in Cali?


IMO, Girls DA training session of 4-5 days a week vs non-DA team 2 days a week, plus additional tailored personal training plus speed and agility. The team training is to improve the overall team and not so much the individual player.  Where as the tailored personal training will help improve the areas a player needs improvement on, like shooting, trapping, gate turning, quickness, etc.


----------



## Kicknit22

NoGoal said:


> Your family gets it and if your DD has ambitions playing college soccer.  Your family will think it through and choose the best path to accomplish that goal, besides following the sheep to Girls DA.  If Girls DA is the best route...awesome, if not there will still be plenty of opportunities to be showcased outside of Girls DA.  No different than players outside of ECNL committing to college soccer now.


I agree in part NG.  My 2 have always put in extra days and work on their own, due to intrinsic motivation.  Non-ECNL, and luckily, it's all worked 
out for my older one.  But, it was very difficult.  As I stated before, I agree that this is a power play by USSOCCER.  Basically, taking the baton from ECNL, IMO.  But, this is the same thing that was being said by all that were not included at the inception of ECNL.  It clearly turned out to be great for all that were able to take advantage of it.  Now, it's going to be DA.  In hindsight, I am still glad my older missed having to deal with this.  Now, my younger has very high aspirations in this sport, and I am hoping it will provide all the benefits that ECNL has.  Exposure, exposure, exposure.  She'll take care of the rest.  I don't think the sheep comment applies at all.


----------



## Kicker4Life

I'm wondering if there were posters calling everyone who was excited about ECNL "sheep" back when ECNL was the shiny new toy?

I guess it takes one to know one.....


----------



## gkrent

Follow the coach..and if it leads to ECNL or DA then so be it!


----------



## Sane65

NoGoal said:


> I agree this 4-5 days of training isn't for everyone.  A player who wants to play at a high level should have already been making this sacrifice long ago and not because Girls DA is doing it this fall.  I'm not posting about kicking the ball back and forth with their older siblings like you posted above either.
> 
> The top players sacrifice, going out with friends on weekends, skip dances, hanging with friends for the love of soccer.  If they aren't or have a hard time doing it now in high school....it's what they will have to do eventually playing college soccer.  Believe me my DD is already doing her college workout/conditioning packet and it's 5 additional days of hard work on top of club practice.





NoGoal said:


> I agree this 4-5 days of training isn't for everyone.  A player who wants to play at a high level should have already been making this sacrifice long ago and not because Girls DA is doing it this fall.  I'm not posting about kicking the ball back and forth with their older siblings like you posted above either.
> 
> The top players sacrifice, going out with friends on weekends, skip dances, hanging with friends for the love of soccer.  If they aren't or have a hard time doing it now in high school....it's what they will have to do eventually playing college soccer.  Believe me my DD is already doing her college workout/conditioning packet and it's 5 additional days of hard work on top of club practice.


Maybe it isn't a sacrifice.  It won't be for everyone.  Which is precisely why it will elevate US Women's soccer.  Maximize growth and potential thru training time for those that truly desire to play with a full commitment.


----------



## Dos Equis

Kicker4Life said:


> I'm wondering if there were posters calling everyone who was excited about ECNL "sheep" back when ECNL was the shiny new toy?
> 
> I guess it takes one to know one.....


Not many were calling those who went to ECNL sheep, it took a couple of years to build momentum in that league, and the first two years of ECNL were still a work in progress.  More took issue with the condescension often directed at non-ECNL clubs and players by ECNL participants once the ECNL settled in.  

There were, however, plenty of comments on those who followed the ECNL clubs when they formed SCDSL, but I recall the term used when it came to the smaller clubs (Infinity, Eclipse, Exiles, to name a few) who did so was "lemmings."  That league too has evolved and continues to change.

For those of us who have seen the creation of multiple leagues in the past 10 years (ECNL, SCDSL, EGSL, two NPLs, CRL, ...and boys and girls DA) what seems overly optimistic is that so many parents seem to believe that the girls DA will not have the same early issues and growing pains every other league experiences.  That does not diminish the quality of the clubs and players who will participate, but the experience may be bumpy for all during this transition.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> I'm wondering if there were posters calling everyone who was excited about ECNL "sheep" back when ECNL was the shiny new toy?
> 
> I guess it takes one to know one.....


Poster did post those moving to ECNL sheep.  My DD didn't start playing ECNL full time until U16 though.


----------



## NoGoal

Sane65 said:


> Maybe it isn't a sacrifice.  It won't be for everyone.  Which is precisely why it will elevate US Women's soccer.  Maximize growth and potential thru training time for those that truly desire to play with a full commitment.


US Soccer is assuming Girls DA will elevate US Womens Soccer.  That result is a decade away, before we know it's effectiveness.  US Womens Soccer is #1 in the World.  After a decade, if the women fall to #2 or lower....it's a failure, right? Or is everyone happy if the team plays possession soccer and fall below #1 it's acceptable? Example: Arsenal plays possession soccer, but can't win a UEFA title.

There is opportunity cost involved, when make a choice.  Thus there is always a sacrifice being made.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Dos Equis said:


> Not many were calling those who went to ECNL sheep, it took a couple of years to build momentum in that league, and the first two years of ECNL were still a work in progress.  More took issue with the *condescension often directed at non-ECNL clubs and players by ECNL participants *once the ECNL settled in.
> 
> There were, however, plenty of comments on those who followed the ECNL clubs when they formed SCDSL, but I recall the term used when it came to the smaller clubs (Infinity, Eclipse, Exiles, to name a few) who did so was "lemmings."  That league too has evolved and continues to change.
> 
> For those of us who have seen the creation of multiple leagues in the past 10 years (ECNL, SCDSL, EGSL, two NPLs, CRL, ...and boys and girls DA) what seems overly optimistic is that so many parents seem to believe that the girls DA will not have *the same early issues and growing pains every other league experiences*.  That does not diminish the quality of the clubs and players who will participate, but the experience may be bumpy for all during this transition.


The more things change, the more they stay the same.....


----------



## Kicknit22

NoGoal said:


> This is my take,  if the ultimate goal is women college soccer....which should be 99% of the parents/readers in this forum.  There is no rush to play Girls DA at U12, U13 or even U14.   "IF" your DD is a great little player and has a great club coach who knows how to develop players, along with doing skills training, training on her own (parent supervising), speed and agility.   She will be fine, unfortunately....eventually, she will need to make the leap to a Girls DA team no later than U15, because she will need to play at a faster pace, deal with physical players, and most important be seen by the greatest amount of college coaches.
> 
> There are plenty of players who are playing on a top team at ulittles who won't be there come uolders (U14 and older).  I've seen it, previous uolders posters posted it and it will continue today and into the future.
> 
> If she is good player, then maybe U14....because, she will need a year to adjust to the speed of play.


Can't argue with any of this NG!  I completely agree.


----------



## Sane65

NoGoal said:


> US Soccer is assuming Girls DA will elevate US Womens Soccer.  That result is a decade away, before we know it's effectiveness.  US Womens Soccer is #1 in the World.  After a decade, if the women fall to #2 or lower....it's a failure, right? Or is everyone happy if the team plays possession soccer and fall below #1 it's acceptable? Example: Arsenal plays possession soccer, but can't win a UEFA title.
> 
> There is opportunity cost involved, when make a choice.  Thus there is always a sacrifice being made.


I wonder if you call today's performance by Arsenal "possession soccer". Bayern is world class.  You can't resist that one NG.


----------



## NoGoal

I didn't watch France beat our WNT 3-0.  I did read about it though and we want Jill Ellis, April Heinrich and cronies to implement and head a Girls DA league? Ha....like I posted, these coaches don't know how to train or develop a possession player...more how to play it.  

Read up:  http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/uswnt-v-france-she-believes-march-7-pre-pbp-post.2039380/page-5


----------



## NoGoal

Sane65 said:


> I wonder if you call today's performance by Arsenal "possession soccer". Bayern is world class.  You can't resist that one NG.


I didn't watch the game, but you do know Bayern is also a possession team right?

Watch any Arsenal EPL game and you will always hear the analyist criticize Arsenal for wanting to walk the ball into goal vs taking a shot.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> I didn't watch France beat our WNT 3-0.  I did read about it though and we want Jill Ellis, April Heinrich and cronies to implement and head a Girls DA league? Ha....like I posted, these coaches don't know how to train or develop a possession player...more how to play it.
> 
> Read up:  http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/uswnt-v-france-she-believes-march-7-pre-pbp-post.2039380/page-5


Jill Ellis somehow won a WWC, flamed out in the Olympics, last place in the She Believes Cup, U17 didn't get out of group play at U17 WC and U20 finished 4th at U20 WC.  Time to clean house!

I'm affaid the US WNT is losing their identity.  They were never the most technical, but played dam stingy defense, fast and athletic as hell and scored on the counter attack.  Im also sorry to post this, because I believe in a technical game....US wins by playing a USC (defending NCAA Champs) style of play.


----------



## NoGoal

Caught the last 20-25 mins of the US WNT vs France. 

Get rid of the 3-2-3-2 formation and go back to a 4-3-3...call back Klingenberg to play as a wingback.

Maybe time for Jill Ellis to make a phone call to Hope Solo.


----------



## Real Deal

NoGoal said:


> Caught the last 20-25 mins of the US WNT vs France.
> 
> Get rid of the 3-2-3-2 formation and go back to a 4-3-3...call back Klingenberg to play as a wingback.
> 
> Maybe time for Jill Ellis to make a phone call to Hope Solo.


Aww come on-- in all this country there are no other good keepers besides Solo?  I know at least 3 good 2005s...

And no way is 0-3 the keeper's fault...


----------



## shales1002

Real Deal said:


> Aww come on-- in all this country there are no other good keepers besides Solo?  I know at least 3 good 2005s...
> 
> And no way is 0-3 the keeper's fault...


Keepers job is to save the game . Blame the keeper .


----------



## NoGoal

Real Deal said:


> Aww come on-- in all this country there are no other good keepers besides Solo?  I know at least 3 good 2005s...
> 
> And no way is 0-3 the keeper's fault...


I didn't post it was the keepers fault.  I posted ditch the 3-2-3-2 formation aka 3 center backs well at least in a 3 back system it should be 3 center backs.  My point is call back Hope Solo, because she had command of her back line.  Can't deny it, Solo holds the record for most  clean sheets.

http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/05/31/22/34/160531-wnt-hope-solo-shutouts-by-the-numbers


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> Keepers job is to save the game . Blame the keeper .


Unlike field players...Goalkeepers are like fine wine.  They get better with age! Tim Howard is 38 and still on the Mens NT.  Solo is only 35 and was originally a forward and why she is  a freakish athletic GK.  Even if she lost a step of her athleticism.  It's still probably better than 99.99% of other GKs out there.


----------



## shales1002

NoGoal said:


> Unlike field players...Goalkeepers are like fine wine.  They get better with age! Tim Howard is 38 and still on the Mens NT.  Solo is only 35 and was originally a forward and why she is  a freakish athletic GK.  Even if she lost a step of her athleticism.  It's still probably better than 99.99% of other GKs out there.


I totally agree with you as usual. Watching the game, I honestly believe Solo would have stopped two of the goals scored.


----------



## Kicknit22

If the plan is to stick with the 3-2-3-2 and have Ally Long in back, we are in BIG trouble.  She looked absolutey horrible and got beat.  Why she is playing ahead of Johnston is mind boggling


----------



## Kicknit22

Back on the topic of DA, has anyone else heard any more on the DAII thing?  I am hearing it has been set in place, yet not seeing any announcement anywhere.  Does it have anything to do with USSDA? Is it just another new league created by the Southwest Region of DA club's to pitch at thier club members that may not want the full DA commitment? Or the ones that aren't good enough for it?


----------



## Kicker4Life

Kicknit22 said:


> Back on the topic of DA, has anyone else heard any more on the DAII thing?  I am hearing it has been set in place, yet not seeing any announcement anywhere.  Does it have anything to do with USSDA? Is it just another new league created by the Southwest Region of DA club's to pitch at thier club members that may not want the full DA commitment? Or the ones that aren't good enough for it?


My understanding is that the SW region is the only region pushing for it at this point. USSDA has not yet sanctioned the league but is working with the 10 teams in the SW region that are organizing it.

If they come up with a successful (whatever that means) model it may expand to other regions in the future.


----------



## leomessi

Kicknit22 said:


> Back on the topic of DA, has anyone else heard any more on the DAII thing?  I am hearing it has been set in place, yet not seeing any announcement anywhere.  Does it have anything to do with USSDA? Is it just another new league created by the Southwest Region of DA club's to pitch at thier club members that may not want the full DA commitment? Or the ones that aren't good enough for it?


DAII is officially dead.  Two days ago, US Soccer told the clubs they would not sanction it and admonished those clubs that were already advertising it.  The clubs are now scrambling to try and create their own league through US Club but the enthusiasm for a non-DA sanctioned league is just not the same.


----------



## Striker17

leomessi said:


> DAII is officially dead.  Two days ago, US Soccer told the clubs they would not sanction it and admonished those clubs that were already advertising it.  The clubs are now scrambling to try and create their own league through US Club but the enthusiasm for a non-DA sanctioned league is just not the same.


I know some posters here have been in direct contact with USSF hopefully everyone can clarify before tryouts are over so families can make choices. That would be the difference between a SURF OR sharks ECNL vs a Carlsbad for some families


----------



## Dos Equis

leomessi said:


> DAII is officially dead.  Two days ago, US Soccer told the clubs they would not sanction it and admonished those clubs that were already advertising it.  The clubs are now scrambling to try and create their own league through US Club but the enthusiasm for a non-DA sanctioned league is just not the same.


Thanks for the info. 

Why is it that so few want to look at U.S. Soccer's strategy with the boys development academy to understand how they allocate their resources, and what the most likely outcome will be for the girls?  

DAII is not aligned with U.S. soccer's goal to identify and develop elite players for the national team programs.


----------



## Fact

leomessi said:


> DAII is officially dead.  Two days ago, US Soccer told the clubs they would not sanction it and admonished those clubs that were already advertising it.  The clubs are now scrambling to try and create their own league through US Club but the enthusiasm for a non-DA sanctioned league is just not the same.


DA 2 is not dead. It NEVER existed in the first place.  It was the figment of the imagination of a man in a track suit. Sorry for the parents that bought into this lie and have already committed. I would be interested to hear of any parents that balk and get all their money back although I have a feeling that it is too late for most to get on an ENCL team.


----------



## Striker17

Fact said:


> DA 2 is not dead. It NEVER existed in the first place.  It was the figment of the imagination of a man in a track suit. Sorry for the parents that bought into this lie and have already committed. I would be interested to hear of any parents that balk and get all their money back although I have a feeling that it is too late for most to get on an ENCL team.


Carlsbad was telling my friend last night at tryouts about The league ...hmmmmmm
That's bad. 
Run to Sharks ECNL today!


----------



## bababooey

Why is there so much criticism about the DA II league? If it comes to pass, good. If it does not come to pass, good too!

Do you really make your decision about where your dd plays based on the league? I am sure there are those out there that will say they joined ECNL because of the league. Or others may say that they are joining DA I for the league, but shouldn't the focus be on the training environment? Shouldn't the coach who will be spending a lot of time with our dd's matter more than the league?

My dd has joined a DA II team and the playing circuit never mattered in our decision. In my mind, the training and the HC mattered the most. In my dd's mind, the HC and teammates mattered the most.


----------



## mahrez

Fact said:


> DA 2 is not dead. It NEVER existed in the first place.  It was the figment of the imagination of a man in a track suit. Sorry for the parents that bought into this lie and have already committed. I would be interested to hear of any parents that balk and get all their money back although I have a feeling that it is too late for most to get on an ENCL team.


Have been telling posters about the wishful thinking league since day one and people would just repeat the marketing stick that they where feed by a few clubs.

Those clubs that jumped the gun you really have to think more carefully about Integrity next time, don't put or make up nonsense that's taken down days later to lure players during tryouts.

Remember if you don't see it on a official press release or those orgs web sites it's just a proposal or wishfull thinking.  Buyers beware, don't just blindly accept marketing that goes against a existing framework and common sense.


----------



## Fact

bababooey said:


> Why is there so much criticism about the DA II league? If it comes to pass, good. If it does not come to pass, good too!
> 
> Do you really make your decision about where your dd plays based on the league? I am sure there are those out there that will say they joined ECNL because of the league. Or others may say that they are joining DA I for the league, but shouldn't the focus be on the training environment? Shouldn't the coach who will be spending a lot of time with our dd's matter more than the league?
> 
> My dd has joined a DA II team and the playing circuit never mattered in our decision. In my mind, the training and the HC mattered the most. In my dd's mind, the HC and teammates mattered the most.


Baba- You cannot see the forest through the trees.  Your dd did NOT join a DA II team.  It never existed.  It was just marketing, especially by one track suit wearing coach in particular to get more $$. For your club to promise you DA II was a lie, unethical and completely lacks integrity.  

You are right that we should all focus on the coach and training.  But to get here you need to have trust in the club.  How could you trust a coach at a club that made you a false promise?  What do all the girls do that were on the bubble of the DA I team but opted for DA II to get playing time.  Now they are squeezed out.  If my dd was not already in HS and did not make DA I, I would find the best coach regardless of level and sit this year out while they filter through the garbage.  As other posters have said, the time could be spent on privates.  Remember people, integrity matters, at least for some of us.


----------



## LadiesMan217

I love watching how people on this forum get information from a first time/unknown user and run with it. Bwahahahaha.


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

shales1002 said:


> Keepers job is to save the game . Blame the keeper .


A keeper's job is not to save the game... It is to do the most to try and save the game. In the end, the ball went past 10 other players on the field before it got to Naeher, who was in goal. The third goal came from a lack of communication when two different players tried to clear it and only took each other out in the end. The second, a breakaway from France's forward who is insanely fast, the whole team was, causing Naeher to challenge, causing the penalty. The blame never goes to the keeper, and you really must have a lack of soccer IQ to ever say that it does. We got beat. Straight and Fair. Also, on what RD said, Naeher and Harris are good keepers. We see that they have the technique and potential, just not the maturity at that level due to the lack of playing time they received due to Solo's obvious dominance over the position. Give them time, because not only is the goalkeeper position changing, but the whole team. Their style of play, their formation, their main squad. It's a difficult transition that Jill Ellis is trying to make, but that's why she's doing it now, 2 years before the next world cup


----------



## Realmadrid

I just hung up with the USSF the DA2 is not dead.  Its still being discussed but you're right it never existed.  They hope to have decsions within the month.  When are coast and scdsl deadlines?

Weird times...


----------



## Fact

LadiesMan217 said:


> I love watching how people on this forum get information from a first time/unknown user and run with it. Bwahahahaha.


Sorry, but Leo had is right. DA 2 never existed. When USSF found out about it, they asked for input from all clubs.  It does not exist and for any club to tell you otherwise is lying! End of story.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Fact said:


> Sorry, but Leo had is right. DA 2 never existed. When USSF found out about it, they asked for input from all clubs.  It does not exist and for any club to tell you otherwise is lying! End of story.


You work for ECNL?


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

NoGoal said:


> Jill Ellis somehow won a WWC, flamed out in the Olympics, last place in the She Believes Cup, U17 didn't get out of group play at U17 WC and U20 finished 4th at U20 WC.  Time to clean house!
> 
> I'm affaid the US WNT is losing their identity.  They were never the most technical, but played dam stingy defense, fast and athletic as hell and scored on the counter attack.  Im also sorry to post this, because I believe in a technical game....US wins by playing a USC (defending NCAA Champs) style of play.


The game is evolving. How can you not see that? The time where any team can be extremely dominant like we were is coming to an end, and tbh, for the good of women's soccer. Because, even in the men's game, which had years and years to evolve and grow stronger before the women's game was even invented, there are no teams that are extremely dominant and never expected to win. ANY team can lost. That's what makes it the beautiful game. It's the beginning of a new era for women's soccer. If you can't appreciate it, even though the US lost, then leave the subject alone.


----------



## younothat

Kicker4Life said:


> My understanding is that the SW region is the only region pushing for it at this point. USSDA has not yet sanctioned the league but is working with the 10 teams in the SW region that are organizing it.
> 
> If they come up with a successful (whatever that means) model it may expand to other regions in the future.


Who ever told you this


Realmadrid said:


> I just hung up with the USSF the DA2 is not dead.  Its still being discussed but you're right it never existed.  They hope to have decsions within the month.  When are coast and scdsl deadlines?
> 
> Weird times...


Are you the same poster that called last week, week before and keeps posting that this BS II league is something ussf/ussda is considering?


----------



## Fact

LadiesMan217 said:


> You work for ECNL?


No I don't work for ENCL and actually like DA.  It was good for my family and DA is not the one putting out this garbage.

I work for my kids finding the best fit, where they will be happy, healthy and thrive. Dishonesty is a huge red flag to me.

And while I am not a fan of some things Surf has done lately, they did not make the false DA II promise since they already have ENCL. They probably could have recruited more players with a DA II, but did not.  They at least limit the number of teams in each age group.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Fact said:


> Baba- You cannot see the forest through the trees.  Your dd did NOT join a DA II team.  It never existed.  It was just marketing, especially by one track suit wearing coach in particular to get more $$. For your club to promise you DA II was a lie, unethical and completely lacks integrity.
> 
> You are right that we should all focus on the coach and training.  But to get here you need to have trust in the club.  How could you trust a coach at a club that made you a false promise?  What do all the girls do that were on the bubble of the DA I team but opted for DA II to get playing time.  Now they are squeezed out.  If my dd was not already in HS and did not make DA I, I would find the best coach regardless of level and sit this year out while they filter through the garbage.  As other posters have said, the time could be spent on privates.  Remember people, integrity matters, at least for some of us.


So then tell me....what is the difference between labeling a Team DAII versus Reserve?  What about the use of Pre-ECNL?  What if the best Coaching environment is a team labeled DAII, should we avoid it because of he nomenclature?

Our club has a DAII team and was straight forward about the status of the proposed DAII league. I would have to say that it is only a false promise if a promise was made.  

I will agree that there is more to be looked at when making a decision about playing for a team than the suffix attached to it.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Fact said:


> No I don't work for ENCL and actually like DA.  It was good for my family and DA is not the one putting out this garbage.
> 
> I work for my kids finding the best fit, where they will be happy, healthy and thrive. Dishonesty is a huge red flag to me.
> 
> And while I am not a fan of some things Surf has done lately, they did not make the false DA II promise since they already have ENCL. They probably could have recruited more players with a DA II, but did not.  They at least limit the number of teams in each age group.


Which club(s) made a false DA II promise and what was promised that was false?


----------



## chargerfan

LadiesMan217 said:


> Which club(s) made a false DA II promise and what was promised that was false?


I was looking through the DA material various clubs have posted to see exactly what was promised. One thing that really stood out is that there is no mandate for DA coaches to have a least a B license until 2021. That's 4 years from now!


----------



## LadiesMan217

chargerfan said:


> I was looking through the DA material various clubs have posted to see exactly what was promised. One thing that really stood out is that there is no mandate for DA coaches to have a least a B license until 2021. That's 4 years from now!


Yeah, the B license thing until 2021 caught me off guard because US Soccer is (or was) saying otherwise. The Internet of Lies.


----------



## Real Deal

Um still looking for that ECNL club in the Westside/South Bay and/or mid-city LA area....
Come on ECNL!  You'd have instant revenue with the kids who don't want the DA restrictions, even before you factor in DAII (aka SCDSL flight 1 as the case may end up being).


----------



## LadiesMan217

www.usdaii.com is dark right now (was up a few days ago). LAGSD marketing guy is the owner of the domain .


----------



## Kicker4Life

Real Deal said:


> Um still looking for that ECNL club in the Westside/South Bay and/or mid-city LA area....
> Come on ECNL!  You'd have instant revenue with the kids who don't want the DA restrictions, even before you factor in DAII (aka SCDSL flight 1 as the case may end up being).


That would be an astute move by ECNL if they have indeed revoked EAGLES AND RSC's status as posted on another thread.


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> The game is evolving. How can you not see that? The time where any team can be extremely dominant like we were is coming to an end, and tbh, for the good of women's soccer. Because, even in the men's game, which had years and years to evolve and grow stronger before the women's game was even invented, there are no teams that are extremely dominant and never expected to win. ANY team can lost. That's what makes it the beautiful game. It's the beginning of a new era for women's soccer. If you can't appreciate it, even though the US lost, then leave the subject alone.


Your funny, I've preached it almost a decade ago that the US Soccer needs to evolve.  I see it, problem is you don't comprehend that for the most part US Soccer coaches don't have the training, coaching philosophy, develop and style of play the Japanese, French, and Spanish do.  You are leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves.  Refer to the US Mens National team after a decade of Boys DA.

Example: it's like a teacher trying to teach Calculus with knowledge of only Algebra to straight A students.

Want the US game to truly evolve hire a French or Spanish head coach to lead the change and NOT an English coach (Ellis).


----------



## Real Deal

Kicker4Life said:


> That would be an astute move by ECNL if they have indeed revoked EAGLES AND RSC's status as posted on another thread.


What??  Seriously?  So glad our kids get to be stuck in the middle of what looks to be some giant turf war.
Maybe "someone" can make me a birth certificate that says my kid is either 2011 or 1999 so I can avoid it all.


----------



## Real Deal

NoGoal said:


> Your funny, I've preached it almost a decade ago that the US Soccer needs to evolve.  I see it, problem is you don't comprehend that for the most part US Soccer coaches don't have the training, coaching philosophy, develop and style of play the Japanese, French, and Spanish do.  You are leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves.  Refer to the US Mens National team after a decade of Boys DA.
> 
> Example: it's like a teacher trying to teach Calculus with knowledge of only Algebra to straight A students.
> 
> Want the US game to truly evolve hire a French or Spanish head coach to lead the change and NOT an English coach (Ellis).


Don't worry I'm sure the loss means "big changes" will be coming to girls youth soccer.


----------



## timbuck

NoGoal said:


> Your funny, I've preached it almost a decade ago that the US Soccer needs to evolve.  I see it, problem is you don't comprehend that for the most part US Soccer coaches don't have the training, coaching philosophy, develop and style of play the Japanese, French, and Spanish do.  You are leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves.  Refer to the US Mens National team after a decade of Boys DA.
> 
> Example: it's like a teacher trying to teach Calculus with knowledge of only Algebra to straight A students.
> 
> Want the US game to truly evolve hire a French or Spanish head coach to lead the change and NOT an English coach (Ellis).


What is the setup for womens soccer in other countries around the age of 18?
For men, playing in college in Europe is like being in the D or E team  (maybe lower).  In the US, (for now anyway), getting a college scholarship is the end game for most players (and their parents).
The womens game here in the US is the same.  Play high level youth soccer, get into college to play soccer.  Graduate and get a real job.  For the .001%'ers of females, they can make  a living playing.
If other countries are developing the womens game the way they have the mens game, then we should expect to fall behind the rest of the world.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Your funny, I've preached it almost a decade ago that the US Soccer needs to evolve.  I see it, problem is you don't comprehend that for the most part US Soccer coaches don't have the training, coaching philosophy, develop and style of play the Japanese, French, and Spanish do.  You are leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves.  Refer to the US Mens National team after a decade of Boys DA.
> 
> Example: it's like a teacher trying to teach Calculus with knowledge of only Algebra to straight A students.
> 
> Want the US game to truly evolve hire a French or Spanish head coach to lead the change and NOT an English coach (Ellis).


And I almost forgot the 1st 2 goals by France was typical US Soccer tactics, high pressure in the opponents defensive half of the field, get the turnover and score with their speedy forward. 2nd goal was an over the top ball to a speedy forward.  Ironic isn't it!


----------



## NoGoal

timbuck said:


> What is the setup for womens soccer in other countries around the age of 18?
> For men, playing in college in Europe is like being in the D or E team  (maybe lower).  In the US, (for now anyway), getting a college scholarship is the end game for most players (and their parents).
> The womens game here in the US is the same.  Play high level youth soccer, get into college to play soccer.  Graduate and get a real job.  For the .001%'ers of females, they can make  a living playing.
> If other countries are developing the womens game the way they have the mens game, then we should expect to fall behind the rest of the world.


I don't know how other countries set-up their womens soccer program.  I have to imagine it's the same process as their mens though and it's NOT pay to play (sorry Girls DA is pay to play). 

Besides having better coaches in France and Japan in the womens game.  Europe has an advantage with their pro mens clubs financially backing their female teams.


----------



## chargerfan

LadiesMan217 said:


> Yeah, the B license thing until 2021 caught me off guard because US Soccer is (or was) saying otherwise. The Internet of Lies.


Does anyone have an answer to this? Is it this year, or 2021? It seems like a lot is still TBD.


----------



## chargerfan

LadiesMan217 said:


> www.usdaii.com is dark right now (was up a few days ago). LAGSD marketing guy is the owner of the domain .


Thanks to US Soccer telling DA clubs to stop promoting DAII!


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

NoGoal said:


> Your funny, I've preached it almost a decade ago that the US Soccer needs to evolve.  I see it, problem is you don't comprehend that for the most part US Soccer coaches don't have the training, coaching philosophy, develop and style of play the Japanese, French, and Spanish do.  You are leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves.  Refer to the US Mens National team after a decade of Boys DA.
> 
> Example: it's like a teacher trying to teach Calculus with knowledge of only Algebra to straight A students.
> 
> Want the US game to truly evolve hire a French or Spanish head coach to lead the change and NOT an English coach (Ellis).


I was not simply talking about the US game... I'm talking about *women's soccer *as a whole. I am saying that *women's soccer* is evolving, and, contrary to what seems to be your belief, that statement applies to all other countries. When I say women's soccer is evolving, I am not referring to the style of play or coaching or development of US players. Which I am not denying that there needs to be a serious change when it comes to out youth system. However, when I refer to women's soccer starting to evolve and change, I'm talking about how in the France vs USA game, one of the French forwards attempted a laces down volley off a cross. That's never been attempted before on such a large stage. That is REVOLUTIONARY. It's always been just doing what you can to score, so in another situation, they might have tried to take a touch and shoot or side volley it. The speed of play, the depth, the talent, the creativity: it is getting closer and closer to, for lack of a better reference, the men's game. It's talking about how intense and fast the games were in the She Believes Cup. Women's soccer as a whole, not a single program that varies from country to country, but as a game shared and is evolving through each of these countries, is changing. When I say that "even though the US lost", I mean that the way the game is evolving, there should not be a completely dominant team or country, and I definitely am not talking about "leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves". 
Because here is the thing YOU do not comprehend. _I don't care how you feel about US Soccer and their coaches. _While I myself hold a very high level of respect for the foundation and those at the highest level in it, ultimately, I care about soccer, for it is all I do. Yes, US Soccer has issues it needs to fix, but all you seem to be is a critic typing his opinions on a forum that is, for the most part, insignificant. You are not the one out there putting in the work, trying to keep up with this evolving sport. Trying to change the game not for yourself but for the bigger picture. For the future. You sit on here and take pride in arguing with people here and always being right. Do not insult my intelligence. I don't just want the "US game to evolve" I want soccer to evolve because in the end, the game is what matters. Not where the players are from, because that is not soccer. THAT is not the game that brings the world together. Like I said before, if you can't have the objectivity to see and _appreciate_ that the change in the game is good, and not only that but the fact that Ellis and the WNT sparked this change in their initial dominance and then their efforts to evolve their own game (though this is a very shaky time in the world of US Soccer from the National team down to the club level), I suggest you leave the subject alone


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> I was not simply talking about the US game... I'm talking about *women's soccer *as a whole. I am saying that *women's soccer* is evolving, and, contrary to what seems to be your belief, that statement applies to all other countries. When I say women's soccer is evolving, I am not referring to the style of play or coaching or development of US players. Which I am not denying that there needs to be a serious change when it comes to out youth system. However, when I refer to women's soccer starting to evolve and change, I'm talking about how in the France vs USA game, one of the French forwards attempted a laces down volley off a cross. That's never been attempted before on such a large stage. That is REVOLUTIONARY. It's always been just doing what you can to score, so in another situation, they might have tried to take a touch and shoot or side volley it. The speed of play, the depth, the talent, the creativity: it is getting closer and closer to, for lack of a better reference, the men's game. It's talking about how intense and fast the games were in the She Believes Cup. Women's soccer as a whole, not a single program that varies from country to country, but as a game shared and is evolving through each of these countries, is changing. When I say that "even though the US lost", I mean that the way the game is evolving, there should not be a completely dominant team or country, and I definitely am not talking about "leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves".
> Because here is the thing YOU do not comprehend. _I don't care how you feel about US Soccer and their coaches. _While I myself hold a very high level of respect for the foundation and those at the highest level in it, ultimately, I care about soccer, for it is all I do. Yes, US Soccer has issues it needs to fix, but all you seem to be is a critic typing his opinions on a forum that is, for the most part, insignificant. You are not the one out there putting in the work, trying to keep up with this evolving sport. Trying to change the game not for yourself but for the bigger picture. For the future. You sit on here and take pride in arguing with people here and always being right. Do not insult my intelligence. I don't just want the "US game to evolve" I want soccer to evolve because in the end, the game is what matters. Not where the players are from, because that is not soccer. THAT is not the game that brings the world together. Like I said before, if you can't have the objectivity to see and _appreciate_ that the change in the game is good, and not only that but the fact that Ellis and the WNT sparked this change in their initial dominance and then their efforts to evolve their own game (though this is a very shaky time in the world of US Soccer from the National team down to the club level), I suggest you leave the subject alone


You are getting excited about a women one timing a shot off a crossbar.....I've seen it happen in club ages.

Such a long diatribe. "I suggest you leave the subject alone" Yawn, FYI....I'm not the only one with the same opinion. Read up and while at it...create a username and post it in this forum that they should leave the subject alone too. Haha!

http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/uswnt-v-france-she-believes-march-7-pre-pbp-post.2039380/page-6


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

You're so childish, and I am not saying that US soccer doesn't need to improve, as I already said. I don't need to "read up". Can you ever consider what someone else is saying? Or even listen? Yawn, FYI.... making your point doesn't always have to have an insult next to it :/ and I'm not the only one with the same opinion. If you need me to type it again - I'm not saying that US Soccer doesn't have its problems. Like you said about the pay to play system, it prohibits a lot of talent the opportunity to play. It screwed me over for quite a long time. So I agree with you, however, I WASN'T TALKING ABOUT US SOCCER IN THE FIRST PLACE. and you don't seem to be grasping that concept.
On the other hand, for anyone who is wondering, in Europe the men side start extremely young, being recruited to play, train, and live in academies that can range from being extremely close, to in another country. The follow strict training regimens and if they can't keep up as they get older, they are let go of. If you don't know college is free in most European countries, so they can go into college, but most opt to go pro, and they are bought by clubs like a professional player. The women's soccer is much less supported over there, whilst they do have more more financially leeway because the men's' teams supports them financially.


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> I was not simply talking about the US game... I'm talking about *women's soccer *as a whole. I am saying that *women's soccer* is evolving, and, contrary to what seems to be your belief, that statement applies to all other countries. When I say women's soccer is evolving, I am not referring to the style of play or coaching or development of US players. Which I am not denying that there needs to be a serious change when it comes to out youth system. However, when I refer to women's soccer starting to evolve and change, I'm talking about how in the France vs USA game, one of the French forwards attempted a laces down volley off a cross. That's never been attempted before on such a large stage. That is REVOLUTIONARY. It's always been just doing what you can to score, so in another situation, they might have tried to take a touch and shoot or side volley it. The speed of play, the depth, the talent, the creativity: it is getting closer and closer to, for lack of a better reference, the men's game. It's talking about how intense and fast the games were in the She Believes Cup. Women's soccer as a whole, not a single program that varies from country to country, but as a game shared and is evolving through each of these countries, is changing. When I say that "even though the US lost", I mean that the way the game is evolving, there should not be a completely dominant team or country, and I definitely am not talking about "leaving this so called evolution of the beautiful game to coach who are figuring it out themselves".
> Because here is the thing YOU do not comprehend. _I don't care how you feel about US Soccer and their coaches. _While I myself hold a very high level of respect for the foundation and those at the highest level in it, ultimately, I care about soccer, for it is all I do. Yes, US Soccer has issues it needs to fix, but all you seem to be is a critic typing his opinions on a forum that is, for the most part, insignificant. You are not the one out there putting in the work, trying to keep up with this evolving sport. Trying to change the game not for yourself but for the bigger picture. For the future. You sit on here and take pride in arguing with people here and always being right. Do not insult my intelligence. I don't just want the "US game to evolve" I want soccer to evolve because in the end, the game is what matters. Not where the players are from, because that is not soccer. THAT is not the game that brings the world together. Like I said before, if you can't have the objectivity to see and _appreciate_ that the change in the game is good, and not only that but the fact that Ellis and the WNT sparked this change in their initial dominance and then their efforts to evolve their own game (though this is a very shaky time in the world of US Soccer from the National team down to the club level), I suggest you leave the subject alone


Do you like this volley skill goal by Alex Morgan





And to add more shine.  A video of women volley goals.  Enjoy....


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> You're so childish, and I am not saying that US soccer doesn't need to improve, as I already said. I don't need to "read up". Can you ever consider what someone else is saying? Or even listen? Yawn, FYI.... making your point doesn't always have to have an insult next to it :/ and I'm not the only one with the same opinion. If you need me to type it again - I'm not saying that US Soccer doesn't have its problems. Like you said about the pay to play system, it prohibits a lot of talent the opportunity to play. It screwed me over for quite a long time. So I agree with you, however, I WASN'T TALKING ABOUT US SOCCER IN THE FIRST PLACE. and you don't seem to be grasping that concept.
> On the other hand, for anyone who is wondering, in Europe the men side start extremely young, being recruited to play, train, and live in academies that can range from being extremely close, to in another country. The follow strict training regimens and if they can't keep up as they get older, they are let go of. If you don't know college is free in most European countries, so they can go into college, but most opt to go pro, and they are bought by clubs like a professional player. The women's soccer is much less supported over there, whilst they do have more more financially leeway because the men's' teams supports them financially.


Yawn,  my stepfather grew up playing in the Borussia Dortmund (Germany) youth system until U18....my next door neighbor played for the Honduras National team and both shared with me their experience and how those countries ID players.  Next!


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

NoGoal said:


> Do you like this volley skill goal by Alex Morgan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And to add more shine.  A video of women volley goals.  Enjoy....


A large majority of those are still under the ball rather than the side, aren't straight shots, rather mostly "rainbows". Of course no disrespect to the women in these videos. But that's sweet of you to go and find videos for me that don't prove you point. And Morgan's goal, also a pivotal point in women's soccer, it was obviously amazing - but the goal itself wasn't.. nevermind you can't see what I see, I respect that, I'm leaving this alone now. Do you see up until recently, the talent pool internationally for women's goalkeepers wasn't adequate? That also allows in some goals that otherwise wouldn't be, the volley I'm talking about, not matter who the keeper was, had it been on target, would have gone in. It would have been a goal that required skill, power, and class. That's all I meant to say


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

NoGoal said:


> Yawn,  my stepfather grew up playing in the Borussia Dortmund (Germany) youth system until U18....my next door neighbor played for the Honduras National team and both shared with me their experience and how those countries ID players.  Next!


I wasn't talking to you


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> A large majority of those are still under the ball rather than the side, aren't straight shots, rather mostly "rainbows". Of course no disrespect to the women in these videos. But that's sweet of you to go and find videos for me that don't prove you point. And Morgan's goal, also a pivotal point in women's soccer, it was obviously amazing - but the goal itself wasn't.. nevermind you can't see what I see, I respect that, I'm leaving this alone now. Do you see up until recently, the talent pool internationally for women's goalkeepers wasn't adequate? That also allows in some goals that otherwise wouldn't be, the volley I'm talking about, not matter who the keeper was, had it been on target, would have gone in. It would have been a goal that required skill, power, and class. That's all I meant to say


Don't get all heated, those are volley goals.  Just enjoy the video, since you haven't see it performed by female players.   Is his the lace down volley goal you are posting about.  Like Rose LaVelle did in the 44 second in this video.  She even struck the ball on the ground like the men do.


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> I wasn't talking to you


Well, you are replying to me too...if you are quoting my post. #genius


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

as I said "On the other hand, for anyone who is wondering" because I was looking at what the earlier posters asked #can'tread


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

NoGoal said:


> Don't get all heated, those are volley goals.  Just enjoy the video, since you haven't see it performed by female players.   Is his the lace down volley goal you are posting about.  Like Rose LaVelle did in the 44 second in this video.  She even struck the ball on the ground like the men do.


Do you know the definition of a side volley?


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> as I said "On the other hand, for anyone who is wondering" because I was looking at what the earlier posters asked #can'tread


I can read it, I'm just trolling you now.  #lol


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> Do you know the definition of a side volley?


Side volley, foot below the ball volley, foot above the volley....1st strike volley goal is a 1st strike volley goal.  Nobody says, WOW that was a side volley goal by a female player, except you.


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

A side volley is when you hit the ball on the side, and swing your hips across it, pointing your toe like you would in any sort of shot, so as to prevent it from going wild above the bar. And I don't say that because it doesn't happen. I comment on her technique and admire the idea and nerve to try it... as well as several other people I know. Don't bring her sex into in because you don't know mine and therefore can't assume I'm only saying what I'm saying because she's female. How could it be a SIDE volley if her foot is under the ball?


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Side volley, foot below the ball volley, foot above the volley....1st strike volley goal is a 1st strike volley goal.  Nobody says, WOW that was a side volley goal by a female player, except you.


BTW I don't know about you, but the side volley goal in minute 2:44 is as impressive as any male doing it.


----------



## ThtGoaldnKeeper

yes it is a nice volley (not a side volley).


----------



## Kicker4Life

Any chance of letting it go and getting back on topic?!?!?!?


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> A side volley is when you hit the ball on the side, and swing your hips across it, pointing your toe like you would in any sort of shot, so as to prevent it from going wild above the bar. And I don't say that because it doesn't happen. I comment on her technique and admire the idea and nerve to try it... as well as several other people I know. Don't bring her sex into in because you don't know mine and therefore can't assume I'm only saying what I'm saying because she's female. How could it be a SIDE volley if her foot is under the ball?


I know what it is, it's like a baseball swing and the leg is the bat.  I use to do a shooting drill like that with my DD and yes she said it's hard as hell and still is.  IMO, she isn't athletic enough to execute it, but that is okay.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> Any chance of letting it go and getting back on topic?!?!?!?


NO, lol!


----------



## mahrez

LadiesMan217 said:


> Which club(s) made a false DA II promise and what was promised that was false?





LadiesMan217 said:


> www.usdaii.com is dark right now (was up a few days ago). LAGSD marketing guy is the owner of the domain .


Oh look a spoof URL, that's one club right there

Another one:
http://www.socalsoccer.com/threads/pateadores-girls-da-03-04-observations.1120/

"2. Pats will not allow Academy team players to play HS soccer. The Academy II players can play HS soccer"

He said that at the recent GDA meetings, the Academy II teams were sanctioned (I think that was the word he used) by US Soccer. Not sure what that means but I suspect it is good.
"DA II league is happening based on meeting in Chicago and all but 4 SoCal teams have agreed that second club tier will be DA II -vs- ECNL"

Could go on and on about all the marketing nonsense that's been posted so much material.

" All d2 players can be considered DP,s

" Easily moved from d2 to da"

"D2 teams will play with the da same day & venue vs other D2 teams"

"Da Showcases will include D2 teams"

Tell us which of any of these are not misrepresentations.

Tier 1 or equivalent: playing in x leagues would have been fine like the other clubs used but this other alternative "name"  deal is more nothing more than use of fictious or sounds like marketing spam.


----------



## NoGoal

ThtGoaldnKeeper said:


> yes it is a nice volley (not a side volley).


I call BS, I paused the side volley goal at the 2:44 and 2:45 frame. Her foot wasn't under the ball.  Matter of fact, the ball had no spin on it and was struck "straight" into the net.  It even look like she struck the top half of the ball with her laces and has top spin on it.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> I call BS, I paused the side volley goal at the 2:44 and 2:45 frame. Her foot wasn't under the ball.  Matter of fact, the ball had no spin on it and was struck "straight" into the net.  It even look like she struck the top half of the ball with her laces and has top spin on it.


The goal doesn't look much different than a Suarez side volley goal in minute 1:01 and replay afterwards.


----------



## Real Deal

mahrez said:


> Oh look a spoof URL, that's one club right there
> 
> Another one:
> http://www.socalsoccer.com/threads/pateadores-girls-da-03-04-observations.1120/
> 
> "2. Pats will not allow Academy team players to play HS soccer. The Academy II players can play HS soccer"
> 
> He said that at the recent GDA meetings, the Academy II teams were sanctioned (I think that was the word he used) by US Soccer. Not sure what that means but I suspect it is good.
> "DA II league is happening based on meeting in Chicago and all but 4 SoCal teams have agreed that second club tier will be DA II -vs- ECNL"
> 
> Could go on and on about all the marketing nonsense that's been posted so much material.
> 
> " All d2 players can be considered DP,s
> 
> " Easily moved from d2 to da"
> 
> "D2 teams will play with the da same day & venue vs other D2 teams"
> 
> "Da Showcases will include D2 teams"
> 
> Tell us which of any of these are not misrepresentations.
> 
> Tier 1 or equivalent: playing in x leagues would have been fine like the other clubs used but this other alternative "name"  deal is more nothing more than use of fictious or sounds like marketing spam.


But what I'd like to know is: Do the coaches have B licenses or E licenses or are they parent volunteers?


----------



## NoGoal

mahrez said:


> Oh look a spoof URL, that's one club right there
> 
> Another one:
> http://www.socalsoccer.com/threads/pateadores-girls-da-03-04-observations.1120/
> 
> "2. Pats will not allow Academy team players to play HS soccer. The Academy II players can play HS soccer"
> 
> He said that at the recent GDA meetings, the Academy II teams were sanctioned (I think that was the word he used) by US Soccer. Not sure what that means but I suspect it is good.
> "DA II league is happening based on meeting in Chicago and all but 4 SoCal teams have agreed that second club tier will be DA II -vs- ECNL"
> 
> Could go on and on about all the marketing nonsense that's been posted so much material.
> 
> " All d2 players can be considered DP,s
> 
> " Easily moved from d2 to da"
> 
> "D2 teams will play with the da same day & venue vs other D2 teams"
> 
> "Da Showcases will include D2 teams"
> 
> Tell us which of any of these are not misrepresentations.
> 
> Tier 1 or equivalent: playing in x leagues would have been fine like the other clubs used but this other alternative "name"  deal is more nothing more than use of fictious or sounds like marketing spam.


Mahrez, don't waste your time.  The kool-aid some posters have drank is to strong.


----------



## Kicker4Life

NoGoal said:


> Mahrez, don't waste your time.  The kool-aid some posters have drank is to strong.


As is the HaterAide....plenty to go around for us all


----------



## NoGoalItAll

NoGoal said:


> Yawn,  my stepfather grew up playing in the Borussia Dortmund (Germany) youth system until U18....my next door neighbor played for the Honduras National team and both shared with me their experience and how those countries ID players.  Next!


How do the Philippines ID players?  Isn't your DD in that player pool?


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoalItAll said:


> How do the Philippines ID players?  Isn't your DD in that player pool?


Thanks for asking, actually my DD received an official invite to tryout for Sr Philippine National team 2 weeks ago.  To bad the tryouts are this week in the Philippines and we have to foot the bill for her airfare.  If she made the squad she would have to remain there for another 5-6 weeks for training and the Asian qualifyer for the 2019 Womens World Cup.  To much of a conflict with HS, since she is a Sr and will graduating in May and currently working on her college conditioning and strength packet.

Oh you ask how do they ID players,  easy they identified her at a camp in the US when she was U14 and have been keeping track of her ever since.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Real Deal said:


> But what I'd like to know is: Do the coaches have B licenses or E licenses or are they parent volunteers?


This is all I can tell you - based on what I know and I am often wrong.

1) The US Soccer website makes no mention of 2021 and says they have to be "B" or above.
2) One of the teams that bailed from GDA could not afford the coaching changes 
3) The reference to 2021 showed up by a club website and I have been told they are wrong by another club coach.

Who the fack knows.


----------



## LadiesMan217

I think my DD will play AYSO next year.


----------



## NoGoal

Kicker4Life said:


> As is the HaterAide....plenty to go around for us all


HaterAide? Me? If so, Girls DA has no bearing on my DD's soccer.


----------



## Kicker4Life

NoGoal said:


> HaterAide? Me? If so, Girls DA has no bearing on my DD's soccer.


Just an overall comment, but if the shoe fits.....


----------



## LadiesMan217

Here is a list of the DA II clubs that are working to build the league for anyone interested: 

Albion SC, Beach Futbol Club, Eagles SC,  SC del Sol, LA Galaxy Academy, LA Galaxy San Diego, LA Premier FC, Legends FC, Pateadores, Real So Cal. 

3 of the clubs are planning on leaving ECNL.

One of the DOCs from one of these clubs (starts with an L) that is promoting DA II said the plans have changed and US Soccer is aligned. The plan is to have a solidified plan this month LOL.

If your DD is DA II level, tryout, agree to join if asked, then bail when ENCL tryouts come along if DA II is not what they said it was or is nonexistent at that time. Not a big deal; so, don't make a big deal out of it. Relax people.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Here is a list of the DA II clubs that are working to build the league for anyone interested:
> 
> Albion SC, Beach Futbol Club, Eagles SC,  SC del Sol, LA Galaxy Academy, LA Galaxy San Diego, LA Premier FC, Legends FC, Pateadores, Real So Cal.
> 
> 3 of the clubs are planning on leaving ECNL.
> 
> One of the DOCs from one of these clubs (starts with an L) that is promoting DA II said the plans have changed and US Soccer is aligned. The plan is to have a solidified plan this month LOL.
> 
> If your DD is DA II level, tryout, agree to join if asked, then bail when ENCL tryouts come along if DA II is not what they said it was or is nonexistent at that time. Not a big deal; so, don't make a big deal out of it. Relax people.


"L" come on!  That doesn't help that could be LA Galaxy, LA Galaxy SD, LA Premier and Legends.  

What color are the uniforms?


----------



## Striker17

The good news in all of this is that Facebook now has a function where you can label something as fake news. So if a club, GOAL NATION or any other ridiculousness occurs you can report and then click "I think that this is fake news" and it takes it down. Give it a whirl- save a ulittle parent lol


----------



## Striker17

Kicker4Life said:


> Just an overall comment, but if the shoe fits.....


Agree. I wonder aloud how many people thought SCDSL was a waste, or ECNL or anything before it became the gold standard. I love ECNL and all that it has done for everyone. Times are changing though


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> "L" come on!  That doesn't help that could be LA Galaxy, LA Galaxy SD, LA Premier and Legends.
> 
> What color are the uniforms?


They also have an "a" in their name.


----------



## chargerfan

mahrez said:


> Oh look a spoof URL, that's one club right there
> 
> Another one:
> http://www.socalsoccer.com/threads/pateadores-girls-da-03-04-observations.1120/
> 
> "2. Pats will not allow Academy team players to play HS soccer. The Academy II players can play HS soccer"
> 
> He said that at the recent GDA meetings, the Academy II teams were sanctioned (I think that was the word he used) by US Soccer. Not sure what that means but I suspect it is good.
> "DA II league is happening based on meeting in Chicago and all but 4 SoCal teams have agreed that second club tier will be DA II -vs- ECNL"
> 
> Could go on and on about all the marketing nonsense that's been posted so much material.
> 
> " All d2 players can be considered DP,s
> 
> " Easily moved from d2 to da"
> 
> "D2 teams will play with the da same day & venue vs other D2 teams"
> 
> "Da Showcases will include D2 teams"
> 
> Tell us which of any of these are not misrepresentations.
> 
> Tier 1 or equivalent: playing in x leagues would have been fine like the other clubs used but this other alternative "name"  deal is more nothing more than use of fictious or sounds like marketing spam.


Thanks for this response. I have no problem calling those lies, not misrepresentations.


----------



## Striker17

Striker17 said:


> The good news in all of this is that Facebook now has a function where you can label something as fake news. So if a club, GOAL NATION or any other ridiculousness occurs you can report and then click "I think that this is fake news" and it takes it down. Give it a whirl- save a ulittle parent lol


Negative reaction from a Club guy. Heading to Facebook now lol


----------



## Fact

Beach is one club that I have not heard of making false promises, so good for them.  But as Mahrez has pointed out, others have made false representations about DA II, including 1 DOC to his coaches. At this point it is nothing more than another acronym like Academy, Premier, Reserve.  It is not supported nor approved by US Soccer so to represent that it is a done deal is wrong. 

I will not get into the argument of whether ENCL or DA is better.  I believe it depends on the player and their goals so both have something to offer as well as all the non ENCL and non DA clubs.


----------



## younothat

Fact said:


> Beach is one club that I have not heard of making false promises, so good for them.  But as Mahrez has pointed out, others have made false representations about DA II, including 1 DOC to his coaches. At this point it is nothing more than another acronym like Academy, Premier, Reserve.  It is not supported nor approved by US Soccer so to represent that it is a done deal is wrong.
> 
> I will not get into the argument of whether ENCL or DA is better.  I believe it depends on the player and their goals so both have something to offer as well as all the non ENCL and non DA clubs.


Might want to take a look at this:
http://myemail.constantcontact.com/BEACH-FUTBOL-CLUB---DEVELOPMENT-ACADEMY-ANNOUNCEMENT.html?soid=1104906689478&aid=QpfcIg5BZzE

They took some liberties in those premature announcements

Some of the  alternative fact posters have listed as the group of 9 interested are not in fact if you ask  the right people who actually work for them.   LA Galaxy Academy for one accord to ZW, The AZ club, etc.


----------



## LadiesMan217

younothat said:


> Might want to take a look at this:
> http://myemail.constantcontact.com/BEACH-FUTBOL-CLUB---DEVELOPMENT-ACADEMY-ANNOUNCEMENT.html?soid=1104906689478&aid=QpfcIg5BZzE
> 
> They took some liberties in those premature announcements
> 
> Some of the  alternative fact posters have listed as the group of 9 interested are not in fact if you ask  the right people who actually work for them.   LA Galaxy Academy for one accord to ZW, The AZ club, etc.


My list of 10 clubs comes right from the www.usdaii.com website (well the website that is supposedly being updated right now)... The cached version is here: Weeeeeee.


----------



## younothat

LadiesMan217 said:


> My list of 10 clubs comes right from the www.usdaii.com website (well the website that is supposedly being updated right now)... The cached version is here: Weeeeeee.


So now your referencing a alternative facts website that spoof real sites. 
http://www.scamadviser.com/check-website/usdaii.com

You want to tell us who parked a domain at goodaddy 42 days ago,  Oh wait I know who that is

http://www.ussoccerda.com/home.php is the real deal


----------



## Kicker4Life

younothat said:


> So now your referencing a alternative facts website that spoof real sites.
> http://www.scamadviser.com/check-website/usdaii.com
> 
> You want to tell us who parked a domain at goodaddy 42 days ago,  Oh wait I know who that is
> 
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/home.php is the real deal


So what your saying is, USSDA has not made an official statement on DAII, whether or not they do support it, if they would sanction it or who would be in it.  Therefore we are all speculating in some way, one way or another. 

Beach FC and others may have taken some liberties, but Beach made no promises and were very upfront about DAII in their presentation.


----------



## chargerfan

Kicker4Life said:


> So what your saying is, USSDA has not made an official statement on DAII, whether or not they do support it, if they would sanction it or who would be in it.  Therefore we are all speculating in some way, one way or another.
> 
> Beach FC and others may have taken some liberties, but Beach made no promises and were very upfront about DAII in their presentation.


USSDA made a statement to the DA clubs to stop promoting DAII, as it is not sanctioned by USSDA. It doesn't sound like there is any sort of real plan for this league anyways, beyond a few clubs having discussions about it.


----------



## Fact

younothat said:


> Might want to take a look at this:
> http://myemail.constantcontact.com/BEACH-FUTBOL-CLUB---DEVELOPMENT-ACADEMY-ANNOUNCEMENT.html?soid=1104906689478&aid=QpfcIg5BZzE
> 
> They took some liberties in those premature announcements
> 
> Some of the  alternative fact posters have listed as the group of 9 interested are not in fact if you ask  the right people who actually work for them.   LA Galaxy Academy for one accord to ZW, The AZ club, etc.


Sorry I was wrong. Beach is just as guilty.  See how easy it is to admit I am wrong you DA2 fans. You should try it.


----------



## LadiesMan217

younothat said:


> So now your referencing a alternative facts website that spoof real sites.
> http://www.scamadviser.com/check-website/usdaii.com
> 
> You want to tell us who parked a domain at goodaddy 42 days ago,  Oh wait I know who that is
> 
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/home.php is the real deal


I already told the forum who made this site.


----------



## dreamz

chargerfan said:


> USSDA made a statement to the DA clubs to stop promoting DAII, as it is not sanctioned by USSDA. It doesn't sound like there is any sort of real plan for this league anyways, beyond a few clubs having discussions about it.


This is correct. As of a phone call on earlier this week DA II died. US Soccer made it very clear they were not supporting it, not sanctioning it and would have no part of it. Think about it, boys DA has been in existence for almost 10 years. If US Soccer wanted a DA II program they would have implemented it on the boys side years ago. Several of the bozos from clubs heavily promoting DA II were whining over it. MD, BR, NG all begged and pleaded because they had promised their families something that never existed. Asking US Soccer "what are we supposed to tell our families now?" US Soccer said "Not our problem you spoke out of turn". These guys are the main offenders of making empty promises thinking they could push US Soccer in to doing what they wanted. Truth be told, they probably chased US Soccer away with all of their ridiculous ideas and requests. They can all be overbearing, whiny and have a strong sense of entitlement for no reason.
I must admit I thought DA II would eventually happen. In fact the clubs wanting DA II are still planning to meet to try and salvage the promises they falsely made. Several problems with this non-existent program....
1. They want a fall/spring league. This means Cal South won't sanction it because it takes the teams out of National Cup. They can't play National Cup and Spring League games, there aren't enough play dates AND this league would conflict directly with CRL which is the feather in Cal South's cap.
2. They could sanction it through US Club but that means no USYS National Cup. Only NPL/US Club Cup (leaves ALOT to be desired).
3. There are no other DA II programs anywhere else so no showcase, no playoffs, no exposure = no motivation for the players or families to buy in to this flat program.
4. So for teams that have a fall/spring league with no hopes of playoffs, National Cup or showcases, what's left?
5. Players won't be registered through US Soccer like the bozo brigade promised so they can't say the are "DA" players. This was always lipstick on a pig anyways. You either ARE or you AREN'T a DA player. Trying to disguise it by calling it DA II league with high school doesn't make you a DA player.
So they are going to try and figure out the escape plan. They will try and figure out how to make it happen but that will be a massive challenge. Honestly, the B team players are better off on the path they are currently on. Play fall league, play high school, play National Cup, qualify in to CRL, play showcase events summer and spring (because now with the DA teams OUT of those events there is more room for the B teams) and work to find the best college showcase opportunities possible. There are plenty of showcases out there where college coaches show up. Playing in a DA II doesn't provide any type of exposure directly from the league so why change the model? 
It all boils down to a massive unsubstantiated sales pitch and undeliverable promises by DOC's who are trying to make more $$$ and keep players who don't make DA teams from leaving to go play for other clubs.
It will be interesting to see what the bozo brigade comes up with next.


----------



## Striker17

dreamz said:


> This is correct. As of a phone call on earlier this week DA II died. US Soccer made it very clear they were not supporting it, not sanctioning it and would have no part of it. Think about it, boys DA has been in existence for almost 10 years. If US Soccer wanted a DA II program they would have implemented it on the boys side years ago. Several of the bozos from clubs heavily promoting DA II were whining over it. MD, BR, NG all begged and pleaded because they had promised their families something that never existed. Asking US Soccer "what are we supposed to tell our families now?" US Soccer said "Not our problem you spoke out of turn". These guys are the main offenders of making empty promises thinking they could push US Soccer in to doing what they wanted. Truth be told, they probably chased US Soccer away with all of their ridiculous ideas and requests. They can all be overbearing, whiny and have a strong sense of entitlement for no reason.
> I must admit I thought DA II would eventually happen. In fact the clubs wanting DA II are still planning to meet to try and salvage the promises they falsely made. Several problems with this non-existent program....
> 1. They want a fall/spring league. This means Cal South won't sanction it because it takes the teams out of National Cup. They can't play National Cup and Spring League games, there aren't enough play dates AND this league would conflict directly with CRL which is the feather in Cal South's cap.
> 2. They could sanction it through US Club but that means no USYS National Cup. Only NPL/US Club Cup (leaves ALOT to be desired).
> 3. There are no other DA II programs anywhere else so no showcase, no playoffs, no exposure = no motivation for the players or families to buy in to this flat program.
> 4. So for teams that have a fall/spring league with no hopes of playoffs, National Cup or showcases, what's left?
> 5. Players won't be registered through US Soccer like the bozo brigade promised so they can't say the are "DA" players. This was always lipstick on a pig anyways. You either ARE or you AREN'T a DA player. Trying to disguise it by calling it DA II league with high school doesn't make you a DA player.
> So they are going to try and figure out the escape plan. They will try and figure out how to make it happen but that will be a massive challenge. Honestly, the B team players are better off on the path they are currently on. Play fall league, play high school, play National Cup, qualify in to CRL, play showcase events summer and spring (because now with the DA teams OUT of those events there is more room for the B teams) and work to find the best college showcase opportunities possible. There are plenty of showcases out there where college coaches show up. Playing in a DA II doesn't provide any type of exposure directly from the league so why change the model?
> It all boils down to a massive unsubstantiated sales pitch and undeliverable promises by DOC's who are trying to make more $$$ and keep players who don't make DA teams from leaving to go play for other clubs.
> It will be interesting to see what the bozo brigade comes up with next.


I am consistently amazed at how connected and aware everyone is on this forum. This info doesn't affect me personally but several close friends. At no point has ANY DOC Said this what a shame in the middle of tryout season.
Thank you for taking the time @dreamz
Something tells me some people's cell phones may be ringing a lot today at various clubs


----------



## Dos Equis

dreamz said:


> Truth be told, they probably chased US Soccer away with all of their ridiculous ideas and requests.


While I cannot comment on the veracity of your update, I do disagree with this conjecture.   US Soccer is not interested in helping these clubs with their B teams, and you cannot chase away someone who as never there.   

Instead of further diluting the competition in Socal by forming yet another new league, why not put their egos aside for a moment, and as a group pick an existing league to compete in?  CSL may not work because they would have to earn their bracket placement every year.  So go to SCDSL.  They helped create and already manage that league, so how about Beach, Legends, RSC and the rest keep their prior SCDSL promises and commitments, instead of doing their best to make it a league full of  "C" teams playing 11v11 scrimmages.


----------



## Fact

dreamz said:


> This is correct. As of a phone call on earlier this week DA II died. US Soccer made it very clear they were not supporting it, not sanctioning it and would have no part of it. Think about it, boys DA has been in existence for almost 10 years. If US Soccer wanted a DA II program they would have implemented it on the boys side years ago. Several of the bozos from clubs heavily promoting DA II were whining over it. MD, BR, NG all begged and pleaded because they had promised their families something that never existed. Asking US Soccer "what are we supposed to tell our families now?" US Soccer said "Not our problem you spoke out of turn". These guys are the main offenders of making empty promises thinking they could push US Soccer in to doing what they wanted. Truth be told, they probably chased US Soccer away with all of their ridiculous ideas and requests. They can all be overbearing, whiny and have a strong sense of entitlement for no reason.
> I must admit I thought DA II would eventually happen. In fact the clubs wanting DA II are still planning to meet to try and salvage the promises they falsely made. Several problems with this non-existent program....
> 1. They want a fall/spring league. This means Cal South won't sanction it because it takes the teams out of National Cup. They can't play National Cup and Spring League games, there aren't enough play dates AND this league would conflict directly with CRL which is the feather in Cal South's cap.
> 2. They could sanction it through US Club but that means no USYS National Cup. Only NPL/US Club Cup (leaves ALOT to be desired).
> 3. There are no other DA II programs anywhere else so no showcase, no playoffs, no exposure = no motivation for the players or families to buy in to this flat program.
> 4. So for teams that have a fall/spring league with no hopes of playoffs, National Cup or showcases, what's left?
> 5. Players won't be registered through US Soccer like the bozo brigade promised so they can't say the are "DA" players. This was always lipstick on a pig anyways. You either ARE or you AREN'T a DA player. Trying to disguise it by calling it DA II league with high school doesn't make you a DA player.
> So they are going to try and figure out the escape plan. They will try and figure out how to make it happen but that will be a massive challenge. Honestly, the B team players are better off on the path they are currently on. Play fall league, play high school, play National Cup, qualify in to CRL, play showcase events summer and spring (because now with the DA teams OUT of those events there is more room for the B teams) and work to find the best college showcase opportunities possible. There are plenty of showcases out there where college coaches show up. Playing in a DA II doesn't provide any type of exposure directly from the league so why change the model?
> It all boils down to a massive unsubstantiated sales pitch and undeliverable promises by DOC's who are trying to make more $$$ and keep players who don't make DA teams from leaving to go play for other clubs.
> It will be interesting to see what the bozo brigade comes up with next.


This is spot on except that it NEVER existed in the first place other than being another acronym for marketing.  You even got the lead track suit wearing bozo brigade right but I would put their culpability in the reverse order.  NG has been going around acting like the great champion of DA 2 with MD right behind him. Let's see what they say now.  Bring on the Kool-aide!


----------



## younothat

Striker17 said:


> I am consistently amazed at how connected and aware everyone is on this forum. This info doesn't affect me personally but several close friends. At no point has ANY DOC Said this what a shame in the middle of tryout season.
> Thank you for taking the time @dreamz
> Something tells me some people's cell phones may be ringing a lot today at various clubs


Yes Good summary @dreamz.   For those of us involved with ussda for a while now we could tell this would be a non-started &  the few clubs pushing it where not going about it with the most honorable of attentions.

What amazes me is/was the amount of posters who continued to basically be mouth pieces for clubs since Dec of last year and just blindly repeated information that was not accurate.  Next time please do some research or diligent  and provide reference material: press releases,  links to actual real web sites run by the orgs your refereeing to instead of speculating or repeating adnauseam.    I'm sure most had good intentions but if you're going to represent have more respect and accurate real info to give out, when you mislead by accident or not just correct those over-sites, apologize,and move on so people know you have some integrity.


----------



## chargerfan

younothat said:


> Yes Good summary @dreamz.   For those of us involved with ussda for a while now we could tell this would be a non-started &  the few clubs pushing it where not going about it with the most honorable of attentions.
> 
> What amazes me is/was the amount of posters who continued to basically be mouth pieces for clubs since Dec of last year and just blindly repeated information that was not accurate.  Next time please do some research or diligent  and provide reference material: press releases,  links to actual real web sites run by the orgs your refereeing to instead of speculating or repeating adnauseam.    I'm sure most had good intentions but if you're going to represent have more respect and accurate real info to give out, when you mislead by accident or not just correct those over-sites, apologize,and move on so people know you have some integrity.


Thank you! The biggest reason we didn't consider DA was because we weren't getting answers to questions we had. Maybe I am cynical and inquisitive by nature, but there is still a lot that makes me want to sit back and see how it all unfolds before making that commitment. If these DOCs are willing to lie about a made up league, what other lies are telling? Some parents are just like trump followers- believing everything they are told without doing their own research!


----------



## chargerfan

Striker17 said:


> I am consistently amazed at how connected and aware everyone is on this forum. This info doesn't affect me personally but several close friends. At no point has ANY DOC Said this what a shame in the middle of tryout season.
> Thank you for taking the time @dreamz
> Something tells me some people's cell phones may be ringing a lot today at various clubs


So unethical


----------



## NoGoal

dreamz said:


> Honestly, the B team players are better off on the path they are currently on. Play fall league, play high school, play National Cup, qualify in to CRL, play showcase events summer and spring (because now with the DA teams OUT of those events there is more room for the B teams) and work to find the best college showcase opportunities possible. There are plenty of showcases out there where college coaches show up. Playing in a DA II doesn't provide any type of exposure directly from the league so why change the model?
> It all boils down to a massive unsubstantiated sales pitch and undeliverable promises by DOC's who are trying to make more $$$ and keep players who don't make DA teams from leaving to go play for other clubs.
> It will be interesting to see what the bozo brigade comes up with next.


Girls DA will be the #1 gaming league in SoCal for sure.

There is an option for the B team players though.  The girls who don't make a DA roster, should then tryout for an ECNL team.  There are few top clubs nationwide (refer to NorCal) who have turned down Girls DA affiliation, meaning ECNL will have A teams in the league still.

They have established college showcases with a playoff system that will still attract college coaches, because Girls DA will not be able to fill all of the college recruiting needs....especially with U15/16 and U17/18 dual age banded teams. If your DD is on the younger side and know she won't play much on the U15/16 age banded team, thus less college exposure.  It would be wiser having her play on a ECNL U15 team, start and been seen by college coaches instead.

These clubs probably saw that having dual age bands at U15/16 and U16/17 meant less revenue.  Here is why, having 2 separate U15 and U16 A teams with 22 rostered players each = 44 players.  Dual age band is only 22 players....thus cutting half of their revenue stream. Girls DAII would have been a good bridge and marketing tool to prevent the players from leaving for ECNL teams.


----------



## LadiesMan217

DA II league announced today by US Soccer: US Soccer Announces DA II League.


----------



## Desert Hound

LadiesMan217 said:


> DA II league announced today by US Soccer: US Soccer Announces DA II League.


For all you haters out there...above is the official link for DA II. About time!


----------



## chargerfan

Why isn't US Soccer, if they are so interested in development, taking more control over the coaching at the younger ages. Isn't that when development really happens- u8 to u12? I have seen some really bad coaching at those ages, and a lot of times kickball rules the day because it's easy to coach and can lead to wins.


----------



## younothat

chargerfan said:


> Why isn't US Soccer, if they are so interested in development, taking more control over the coaching at the younger ages. Isn't that when development really happens- u8 to u12? I have seen some really bad coaching at those ages, and a lot of times kickball rules the day because it's easy to coach and can lead to wins.


They care thus the small sided mandates and other things for the ulittles that's been implemented but yeah they could do more with the coaching

The cost of DA is high 2x what normal 2 day a week clubs train &  play fall season for so that one other reason.

On  the boys side the new 18' SC NPL run by US club has many da clubs in that one and supposedly that's for "B" teams like the EGSL is for girls in the spring.  Instead of the CS Nt/St cup they play the usclub playoffs after the spring season ends so maybe that could be a options for the girls b teams:  play your normal fall league...transition to  EGSL or something like that for spring?


----------



## amgkag0304

chargerfan said:


> Thank you! The biggest reason we didn't consider DA was because we weren't getting answers to questions we had. Maybe I am cynical and inquisitive by nature, but there is still a lot that makes me want to sit back and see how it all unfolds before making that commitment. If these DOCs are willing to lie about a made up league, what other lies are telling? Some parents are just like trump followers- believing everything they are told without doing their own research!


Don't start talking shit on Trump.


----------



## shales1002

amgkag0304 said:


> Don't start talking shit on Trump.


It's amazing you caught that one line on  NINETY pages worth of dialogue.  A bit sensitive aren't we . It's was a great analogy.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

chargerfan said:


> Why isn't US Soccer, if they are so interested in development, taking more control over the coaching at the younger ages. Isn't that when development really happens- u8 to u12? I have seen some really bad coaching at those ages, and a lot of times kickball rules the day because it's easy to coach and can lead to wins.


What makes you think they're interested in development? Have you watched the USWNT in the last few years? Elite level kickball. Don't be fooled by the badge. US Soccer wouldn't know a development pathway if it was presented on national TV in a gift wrapped box.


----------



## chargerfan

amgkag0304 said:


> Don't start talking shit on Trump.


I could talk shit about trump all day long, so don't tempt me!


----------



## chargerfan

Sunil Illuminati said:


> What makes you think they're interested in development? Have you watched the USWNT in the last few years? Elite level kickball. Don't be fooled by the badge. US Soccer wouldn't know a development pathway if it was presented on national TV in a gift wrapped box.


I was kinda trying to make the point that if they were actually interested in development, they would get involved at ulittles.  I tend to agree with everything you are saying.


----------



## pooka

bababooey said:


> Pooka: you bring up a good question about GDA in an area that is underserved. Think about it from US Soccer's standpoint....is it better to offer multiple organizations the GDA program in So Cal where there are multitudes of players and coaches along with a history of producing star players or try to offer GDA in all locations? In an ideal world, there would be a GDA club within 15 miles of every female soccer player in America, but that is not going to happen. Let's be honest, ECNL was not serving all of the U.S. either. There are many parts of the U.S. where a female soccer player would have to travel great distance to get to an ECNL club.
> 
> As for So Cal embracing GDA, did you expect anything different? It is the shiny new toy in the soccer landscape. That alone will spark a lot of interest. But, it will be paramount for the GDA to produce results like ECNL did since its inception to keep the "elite" players and their parents interested in the product. I suspect the marketing tactic of getting girls to the YNT teams easier will work for many players and parents.


Hey sorry I haven't been on in a while. The difference is although ECNL wasn't in every city, you could still discovery play if parents were willing to drive. DA has cut that. So my kid ( who has played with or against every elite 03 in socal, in several formats, and can and should remain with that group) is now shut out. That's my issue. Or it was. I e since gotten over it lol. My DD looked at our options and made a choice. I'm lucky she'll be an 8th grader next year so we can see how this all shakes out.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

chargerfan said:


> Thank you! The biggest reason we didn't consider DA was because we weren't getting answers to questions we had. Maybe I am cynical and inquisitive by nature, but there is still a lot that makes me want to sit back and see how it all unfolds before making that commitment. If these DOCs are willing to lie about a made up league, what other lies are telling? Some parents are just like trump followers- believing everything they are told without doing their own research!


And now a message from your President, Mr The Donald Trump,

MAKING AMERICA GREAT AGAIN,
You are welcome, snowflake.


----------



## shales1002

Sheriff Joe said:


> And now a message from your President, Mr The Donald Trump,
> View attachment 720
> MAKING AMERICA GREAT AGAIN,
> You are welcome, snowflake.


Sorry Agent Orange is doing nothing for this country! Making Americans Stupid Again. Besides who is the real snowflake here??? Y'all are sensitive AF.

Now,  let's get back on topic! I'll even try to redirect.

I read earlier that athletes who play two sports are staying put in ECNL? In the 2004 thread someone suggested that people were paying for tryouts for GDA? Is that true?


----------



## Striker17

shales1002 said:


> Sorry Agent Orange is doing nothing for this country! Making Americans Stupid Again. Besides who is the real snowflake here??? Y'all are sensitive AF.
> 
> Now,  let's get back on topic! I'll even try to redirect.
> 
> I read earlier that athletes who play two sports are staying put in ECNL? In the 2004 thread someone suggested that people were paying for tryouts for GDA? Is that true?


My daughter is a dual sport athlete and we are doing DA. We have time since it officially starts Aug. We are in middle school though and in my area we noticed the ECNL teams are the majority of the former B and C team players.
I have not heard or anyone paying for a DA tryout. I have heard of a club wanting to be paid for "tryout session" but it wasn't a DA.


----------



## Striker17

pooka said:


> Hey sorry I haven't been on in a while. The difference is although ECNL wasn't in every city, you could still discovery play if parents were willing to drive. DA has cut that. So my kid ( who has played with or against every elite 03 in socal, in several formats, and can and should remain with that group) is now shut out. That's my issue. Or it was. I e since gotten over it lol. My DD looked at our options and made a choice. I'm lucky she'll be an 8th grader next year so we can see how this all shakes out.


Very confused here because DP is an option in DA and the coach can carry them ?


----------



## ESPNANALYST

chargerfan said:


> I was kinda trying to make the point that if they were actually interested in development, they would get involved at ulittles.  I tend to agree with everything you are saying.


One of the mandates initially was a DA coach also had to a have a "developmental team". I know at our club this was a big deal because people actually were excited that a B or C team would have a "star coach". This faded away but when the concept was rolled out it made sense to me. 
I know women have no pathway to any real money or career but Two posters on here are very accurate In that you should look at the boys academy and the good/bad points and make decisions based on FACTS that are readily available. I also think that most parents are not aware of the philosophy and structure of program. A parent said yesterday "my daughter will just go crazy if she doesn't play games and tourneys and all she does is practice". That isn't DA. That parent made the wrong choice.


----------



## chargerfan

Sheriff Joe said:


> And now a message from your President, Mr The Donald Trump,
> View attachment 720
> MAKING AMERICA GREAT AGAIN,
> You are welcome, snowflake.


 So your type is now trolling a youth soccer website?


----------



## chargerfan

Striker17 said:


> Very confused here because DP is an option in DA and the coach can carry them ?


I thought DP's had to come from within the club?


----------



## shales1002

Striker17 said:


> Very confused here because DP is an option in DA and the coach can carry them ?


I thought DP were only limited to 5 games.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

chargerfan said:


> So your type is now trolling a youth soccer website?


What type am I? I didn't start it, snowflake.


----------



## Striker17

The problem with me posting this is that it's boys side- they quote that regulations will be "vastly the same tho"
https://m.box.com/shared_item/https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/ddh3x0fztgwufv8x1bc3dep1i97t0q5h


----------



## chargerfan

Sheriff Joe said:


> What type am I? I didn't start it, snowflake.


Your type?

The rest of us are discussing the futures of our badass daughters of all races and religions who will one day become badass women. The same sort of women Trump calls "nasty"' ,rates numerically (remember you can't be a 10 without big boobs), says you have to tread like shit, grabs the genitals of without consent, etc. Your type then of course chimes in with a lameass insult and a creepy picture of our modern-day hitler. 

Your type also has a few screws lose, as evidenced by that post, so you're not worth engaging. Bye.


----------



## Striker17

@shales1002 I also have a power point if you need that as well


----------



## timbuck

Local guy told me "my DD is going to be on the DA 2 team.  This means she can play with her team, the DA1 team and the ECNL team".  He seemed to think DA2 is the best thing going.  
Wonder how that Kool Aid tastes now?  Wonder if he'll continue shopping.


----------



## Striker17

timbuck said:


> Local guy told me "my DD is going to be on the DA 2 team.  This means she can play with her team, the DA1 team and the ECNL team".  He seemed to think DA2 is the best thing going.
> Wonder how that Kool Aid tastes now?  Wonder if he'll continue shopping.


No this is just a parent who needs to be educated. They have no concept of Discovery players and when they can be utilized. I would expect any DP to be chosen until Oct anyway.
Reminder people can be added until Oct - what the Academy roster looks like now will be very different in Oct I believe. We still have lots of time for movement


----------



## Striker17

chargerfan said:


> Your type?
> 
> The rest of us are discussing the futures of our badass daughters of all races and religions who will one day become badass women. The same sort of women Trump calls "nasty"' ,rates numerically (remember you can't be a 10 without big boobs), says you have to tread like shit, grabs the genitals of without consent, etc. Your type then of course chimes in with a lameass insult and a creepy picture of our modern-day hitler.
> 
> Your type also has a few screws lose, as evidenced by that post, so you're not worth engaging. Bye.


I can't see who you are messaging because I use the ignore function. If a poster is rude just ignore them on their home page and it goes away. Lots of asinine people here need to be put on ignore~ that clown spends all his time debating politics in another part of the forum I wish they would go back to their sandbox and argue


----------



## Sheriff Joe

chargerfan said:


> Your type?
> 
> The rest of us are discussing the futures of our badass daughters of all races and religions who will one day become badass women. The same sort of women Trump calls "nasty"' ,rates numerically (remember you can't be a 10 without big boobs), says you have to tread like shit, grabs the genitals of without consent, etc. Your type then of course chimes in with a lameass insult and a creepy picture of our modern-day hitler.
> 
> Your type also has a few screws lose, as evidenced by that post, so you're not worth engaging. Bye.


You and yours started the political discussion, I am merely contributing some deep and meaningful points,
 but I will leave you snowflakes alone.
I am sorry I intruded into your safe space.
One last question,
which one are you?


----------



## chargerfan

Striker17 said:


> I can't see who you are messaging because I use the ignore function. If a poster is rude just ignore them on their home page and it goes away. Lots of asinine people here need to be put on ignore~ that clown spends all his time debating politics in another part of the forum I wish they would go back to their sandbox and argue


I just ignored. What a loser.


----------



## younothat

Striker17 said:


> My daughter is a dual sport athlete and we are doing DA. We have time since it officially starts Aug. We are in middle school though and in my area we noticed the ECNL teams are the majority of the former B and C team players.
> I have not heard or anyone paying for a DA tryout. I have heard of a club wanting to be paid for "tryout session" but it wasn't a DA.


For hopeful prospective girls DA players doing anything other than track or a short seasonal thing + a 10-month soccer program is going to very challenging.  Middle school might make that task easier but with the demands of the 3-4x practices, games on the weekend plus school work doesn't leave a lot of time for much else.

In either case consider being up front with the soccer coach, they will notice or find out eventually either way most of the time sooner or later.

What typically happens with new prospective DA players is they get a initial group together they play in spring, players are coming and going.  The tournaments come along some players rise & fall, new ones are added to see how they do at the next tournament or training for a few weeks.   The pool of players narrows and teams/coaches start to think about there potential rosters, typically  some last minute bubble decisions are players trying to switch, around august things get real and the registration process starts.

Bottom line long way to go  and some coaches will choose the most dedicated players full committed.  I've seen several outstanding players not make it to the end of the process of a number of reason , each case can be different but it can be higher competitive for those DA roster slots,  players missing the training, practices, scrimmages, tourneys,  or showing up tired is not in there  best interest unless cleared with the coaches in advance.

Pats used to do the pay to play 6 week potential DA trial deal for new teams on the boys side but not sure they are still doing that?

Doubt you will see different rules and regs for boys vs girls, what you see now might be slightly modified but there will likely just be one set that applies to both.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

younothat said:


> For hopeful prospective girls DA players doing anything other than track or a short seasonal thing + a 10-month soccer program is going to very challenging.  Middle school might make that task easier but with the demands of the 3-4x practices, games on the weekend plus school work doesn't leave a lot of time for much else.
> 
> In either case consider being up front with the soccer coach, they will notice or find out eventually either way most of the time sooner or later.
> 
> What typically happens with new prospective DA players is they get a initial group together they play in spring, players are coming and going.  The tournaments come along some players rise & fall, new ones are added to see how they do at the next tournament or training for a few weeks.   The pool of players narrows and teams/coaches start to think about there potential rosters, typically  some last minute bubble decisions are players trying to switch, around august things get real and the registration process starts.
> 
> Bottom line long way to go  and some coaches will choose the most dedicated players full committed.  I've seen several outstanding players not make it to the end of the process of a number of reason , each case can be different but it can be higher competitive for those DA roster slots,  players missing the training, practices, scrimmages, tourneys,  or showing up tired is not in there  best interest unless cleared with the coaches in advance.
> 
> Pats used to do the pay to play 6 week potential DA trial deal for new teams on the boys side but not sure they are still doing that?
> 
> Doubt you will see different rules and regs for boys vs girls, what you see now might be slightly modified but there will likely just be one set that applies to both.


Applause.
Academy is doable with a track season which you pointed out. I think what the girls families do not get yet though is exactly what you pointed out:
1. It's no longer about a "team" it's player 
2. The roster will change significantly between now and August 
3. Their practices from April to August will more than likely have a number of people who want to move from a different team onto their Academy team

What is your thought on this though? In SoCal girls seem to move around a lot and we have a high number of club hoppers. I have several nephews in Academy and they tell me that transferring from one Academy to another is not easy and requires letters etc. granted they are at the premier one in Dallas but they say it's not easy. How is it here?


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Also noticing a lot of hate on here for certain clubs.
Some clubs do Boys Academy very very well. People may want to temper their reactions until they look at boys success of academies across the spectrum. This is a new system and if a club does it well on the boys side I would think the would have a good shot on the girls as well.
Of course certain clubs wouldn't want you to ever look at their boys Academy though...


----------



## Sheriff Joe

chargerfan said:


> I just ignored. What a loser.


Bye Bye snowflake, safe zone dweller.


----------



## younothat

ESPNANALYST said:


> Applause.
> Academy is doable with a track season which you pointed out. I think what the girls families do not get yet though is exactly what you pointed out:
> 1. It's no longer about a "team" it's player
> 2. The roster will change significantly between now and August
> 3. Their practices from April to August will more than likely have a number of people who want to move from a different team onto their Academy team
> 
> What is your thought on this though? In SoCal girls seem to move around a lot and we have a high number of club hoppers. I have several nephews in Academy and they tell me that transferring from one Academy to another is not easy and requires letters etc. granted they are at the premier one in Dallas but they say it's not easy. How is it here?


Yeah @ESPNANALYST  that's a good summary

For existing DA players transfers are not the easiest, depends on the timing also.

You can transfer existing DA players but that is treated just like other adds but they are *limited number of adds* once the season starts and has to be done by the  week of April.

On top of that  "A player who wishes to transfer to a new Academy team must obtain a release from their original Academy club in writing before transferring or communicating with another club. If the original Academy club does not agree to release the player (and the player will not meet the 25% start requirement, U-12 players excluded), the transfer will be allowed and the player must sit at least 3 games, plus any head-to-head games that season. In all other circumstances, the Academy club has the discretion to release or not release the player during the Academy Season. Players may not train or otherwise participate with a Development Academy team that they are not officially rostered with prior to approval of a transfer request. If a player trains with another Academy team prior to receiving a release, he may not be permitted to transfer to that Academy club. Clubs wishing to speak to a player registered with another Academy club must state their intentions in writing to the player’s club, the Academy Staff, and their respective Technical Advisors. Releases must be sent to Academy Staff and the staff shall review and have the authority to approve or deny a transfer of a player in all circumstances. Regardless of the scenario, any transfer player will sit all head-to-head regular season fixtures between former and current club regardless of being released by their previous club (this does not apply to preseason or the postseason). If there are no head-to-head fixtures that remain in the current season, the player will be eligible to participate pending any other suspensions to serve"

As far as DP's my suggestion to others is to forgot about those in your decision process, they are really a special case limited use option,  no min playing time, have to be with the club already, etc.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

My nephews describe their experience in Dallas as a "marriage" to my DD. They are very stern with her telling her this a long term choice. Do you see that type of experience here in SoCal on the boys side? 
ECNL allowed transfers etc and I saw a large number of players transfer between WCFC, Blues and Surf every season. Do you think academies will be like this in this landscape or hat the prevailing Academy dynamics will override a culture?


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Also simply out of Curiosity because some parents are already gaming the system here- I have heard DA players will be rostering to ECNL teams from May to Aug 1 the moving to Academy. The parents want them to play ECNL during spring and summer "for touches and tourneys we do not have a gaming schedule yet"
I thought this was not allowed but can't be sure? This practice seems to go against philosophy and again I can only go with what I know on Boys Side but once they are identified they are tied to a DA.


----------



## younothat

ESPNANALYST said:


> My nephews describe their experience in Dallas as a "marriage" to my DD. They are very stern with her telling her this a long term choice. Do you see that type of experience here in SoCal on the boys side?
> ECNL allowed transfers etc and I saw a large number of players transfer between WCFC, Blues and Surf every season. Do you think academies will be like this in this landscape or hat the prevailing Academy dynamics will override a culture?


There are very limited numbers of transfers each season in DA.    Handful per age group, most clubs teams don't have much roster or add space,  take outsiders over in house for injury fill in, etc and look at it long term so they don't want club hoppers much.   There is a big investment for the clubs for DA players so the have some incentive to retain or promote from within.

For players not yet in DA or those new playing spring or other leagues could work until August first year only but after that no,  don't expect to see players switching in and out in numbers.   Perhaps your refereeing to the younger age groups in your other post, my older DD's ECNL  team has a few interested in DA for 17-18' but haven't heard for her there is much talk about that at this point.

One thing that's maybe different for new parents considering DA is that the coaching staff or directors normally don't like to discuss playing time, positions, or anything about players (yours included) with parents.    Almost all those communications should to be through the player(s) and it's good for them if they handle that IMO.   Besides thanking the staff I've had very few conversations about anything playing related unless specifically asked over the years.   My player has done a good job without me having to do much besides arrange transportation or accommodations.  He handles it all else pretty much through text, email, phone, etc. and lets me know. 

For the pay to play clubs there are other reasons why they want reserve or 2nd teams; combined training some of time during preseason  to move players around until rosters are solidified and so they have a place to put players.   The numbers on the reserves are keep low on purpose so there is room for later movement.  Some coaches are hesitant  to put the DA stamp on players until they are have to that leaving some wondering  until the end.

For the funded or sponsored ones cut comes and players don't always have those options so they look to other da clubs after that or back to the affiliates or to other options.


----------



## US Soccer

chargerfan said:


> Thank you! If these DOCs are willing to lie about a made up league, what other lies are telling? Some parents are just like trump followers- believing everything they are told without doing their own research!


Okay,
Time to address some of the ballerinas posting asinine  political thoughts on a soccer forum about our president.   If you would like we can discuss in detail taxes, economy, sanctuary cities, pro criminal agendas, pro terrorist agendas,   Anti-police policies of far left activists.  The difference is I can back up everything with tracks while you, Mr. ballerina, are speaking on emotion and are ill informed. 


amgkag0304 said:


> Don't start talking shit on Trump.


----------



## Striker17

US Soccer said:


> Okay,
> Time to address some of the ballerinas posting asinine  political thoughts on a soccer forum about our president.   If you would like we can discuss in detail taxes, economy, sanctuary cities, pro criminal agendas, pro terrorist agendas,   Anti-police policies of far left activists.  The difference is I can back up everything with tracks while you, Mr. ballerina, are speaking on emotion and are ill informed.


If you want to do that I am actually being dead serious there are several lovely threads on this forum about that with other spirited opinions


----------



## US Soccer

Striker17 said:


> If you want to do that I am actually being dead serious there are several lovely threads on this forum about that with other spirited opinions


Agreed! I am simply responding to a lot of hate for our president. I guess they have very short memories


----------



## MakeAPlay

US Soccer said:


> Okay,
> Time to address some of the ballerinas posting asinine  political thoughts on a soccer forum about our president.   If you would like we can discuss in detail taxes, economy, sanctuary cities, pro criminal agendas, pro terrorist agendas,   Anti-police policies of far left activists.  The difference is I can back up everything with tracks while you, Mr. ballerina, are speaking on emotion and are ill informed.


This is a pretty ridiculous post.  We can also talk about lies, Russia, Alpha Bank and the Alt Right.  Stop distracting from the conversation with your Trump Chump BS.

If you want to debate GDA let's do it but keep your Fox News inspired tripe away from this thread.


----------



## MakeAPlay

US Soccer said:


> Agreed! I am simply responding to a lot of hate for our president. I guess they have very short memories


Your President.  My memory is not short at all and I write down stuff too.


----------



## Striker17

I pray MAP posts a Cali inspired not today quote. 
Like my other favorite one...ugh can't remember it


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> Your President.  My memory is not short at all and I write down stuff too.


Sorry MAP, but until you renounce your citizenship and move out of the country he is our president.  I'm not a fan but the facts are the facts.  

Dividing ourselves isn't going to make it better but unity will. 

Hmmm....think US Soccer and ECNL should have heard that speech, then where would we be?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> I pray MAP posts a Cali inspired not today quote.
> Like my other favorite one...ugh can't remember it


I'm having a good day.  My player is enjoying her college experience.  I am doing a brewery hop and shopping tomorrow.  Life's good.


----------



## chargerfan

US Soccer said:


> Okay,
> Time to address some of the ballerinas posting asinine  political thoughts on a soccer forum about our president.   If you would like we can discuss in detail taxes, economy, sanctuary cities, pro criminal agendas, pro terrorist agendas,   Anti-police policies of far left activists.  The difference is I can back up everything with tracks while you, Mr. ballerina, are speaking on emotion and are ill informed.


I can back up everything with facts that don't come from InfoWars or Bretitbart. How about you? I'm sorry, but I can't take anyone who would follow a habitual liar, sexual predator, and obvious con man that seriously. Not worth my time. Stick to soccer, Mr. US Soccer


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Your President.  My memory is not short at all and I write down stuff too.


Unlike the Kenyan, Mr Trump will be everyone's president, not just the ones that look like him as Obama did.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

chargerfan said:


> I can back up everything with facts that don't come from InfoWars or Bretitbart. How about you? I'm sorry, but I can't take anyone who would follow a habitual liar, sexual predator, and obvious con man that seriously. Not worth my time. Stick to soccer, Mr. US Soccer


Why bring BJ Bill Clinton into the discussion?


----------



## Eusebio

Just got caught up on all the DAII nonsense. Absolutely shameful.

And these clubs are supposedly "Non-Profit" organizations?


----------



## NoGoal

chargerfan said:


> I can back up everything with facts that don't come from InfoWars or Bretitbart. How about you? I'm sorry, but I can't take anyone who would follow a habitual liar, sexual predator, and obvious con man that seriously. Not worth my time. Stick to soccer, Mr. US Soccer


Ah man, here we go....Sheriff Joe in 3, 2, 1.......


----------



## Sparemethedrama

Eusebio said:


> Just got caught up on all the DAII nonsense. Absolutely shameful.
> 
> And these clubs are supposedly "Non-Profit" organizations?


Did your nonsense come via email today too?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Ah man, here we go....Sheriff Joe in 3, 2, 1.......


Obviously chargerfan is a little sensitive so I will let him go, I don't want anyone getting the wrong idea about me.
How was your daughter's HS season?


----------



## US Soccer

chargerfan said:


> I can back up everything with facts that don't come from InfoWars or Bretitbart. How about you? I'm sorry, but I can't take anyone who would follow a habitual liar, sexual predator, and obvious con man that seriously. Not worth my time. Stick to soccer, Mr. US Soccer


So....you're anti Bill Clinton, Correct?  Because that's whom you just described.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

US Soccer said:


> So....you're anti Bill Clinton, Correct?  Because that's whom you just described.


Great minds think alike. Check out my earlier post #1837


----------



## chargerfan

US Soccer said:


> So....you're anti Bill Clinton, Correct?  Because that's whom you just described.


Your best response is a pivot to a guy that hasn't been president in almost 20 years? Lightweight. As Striker17 suggested, take it to the politics section. Maybe someone there will actually take you seriously.


----------



## espola

US Soccer said:


> Okay,
> Time to address some of the ballerinas posting asinine  political thoughts on a soccer forum about our president.   If you would like we can discuss in detail taxes, economy, sanctuary cities, pro criminal agendas, pro terrorist agendas,   Anti-police policies of far left activists.  The difference is I can back up everything with tracks while you, Mr. ballerina, are speaking on emotion and are ill informed.


Coocoo.


----------



## espola

Sheriff Joe said:


> Unlike the Kenyan, Mr Trump will be everyone's president, not just the ones that look like him as Obama did.


And this is from loser joe, who has declared on multiple occasions that his purpose here is just to post lie to piss people off.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

espola said:


> And this is from loser joe, who has declared on multiple occasions that his purpose here is just to post lie to piss people off.


It's spelled lies, you should know how to spell it, you do it with every post. Now go change your diaper, you old, lying curmudgeon.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Unlike the Kenyan, Mr Trump will be everyone's president, not just the ones that look like him as Obama did.


Did you get beat up a lot as a kid?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> It's spelled lies, you should know how to spell it, you do it with every post. Now go change your diaper, you old, lying curmudgeon.


Let's hope that your daughter takes after her mom.  Or the cable guy.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Why bring BJ Bill Clinton into the discussion?


Were you dropped on your head as a kid?


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Obviously chargerfan is a little sensitive so I will let him go, I don't want anyone getting the wrong idea about me.
> How was your daughter's HS season?


She had a good year.  Thanks for asking.  She was coming back from an injury, but has recovered nicely and playing well.

Is your DD playing HS next year or going all in with Girls DA?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Did you get beat up a lot as a kid?


Yes


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Were you dropped on your head as a kid?


Yes


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> She had a good year.  Thanks for asking.  She was coming back from an injury, but has recovered nicely and playing well.
> 
> Is your DD playing HS next year or going all in with Girls DA?


Cool, mine missed 4 or 5 months last year with injuries. We will see where she lands after the season ends, she really wants to play HS though.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Let's hope that your daughter takes after her mom.  Or the cable guy.


MAP, you are my new friend, I am going to be extra nice to you. Who knows, you and I might end up together, forever.


----------



## Anomaly

I am going to refer back to page 91 where people were discussing DP's, just to clear up some confusion and possibly be corrected if I am wrong.

DP's in ECNL and DA are different. In ECNL, it is a Discovery Player. The team can have up to 2, they don't need to live a certain amount of miles within the team, doesn't need to practice with the team*, etc.

In the DA, a DP is a Developmental Player. A team can have up to 10 of them, can only play a certain amount of games with the team, comes within the same club, obiovusly has to attend the club's practices, etc.

So the DA clubs are exclusive to those living within the designated area, whereas ECNL players could DP where they please. Last season, a lot of Vegas kids DP'd with teams out of state. In the DA, this won't be possible as all players have to be live in the vicinity.

As discussed, US Soccer awarded DA to areas deemed fit. It makes sense to load the SoCal area with DA teams and not give one to NV, NM, etc. However, I agree with Pooka in that the top talent of these areas shouldn't be ignored and that the cream of the crop won't necessarily gravitate towards DA teams, in both the younger and older ages.

This opens a new topic of discussion. Boys' DA teams have residencies and host families to bring in out-of-state players and allow them to play DA. There were two from the boys' side of my DD's club that have done this, one at a resedential academy and the other with a host family. Several other boys from other clubs have also gone down that route and stay with host families.

Will some of DA teams on the girls' side offer this as well? Will the DA be an option for the kids that don't live in the area? Parents already sacrifice enough to allow their kids to play club soccer. There would be a very, very small percentage of parents that would move their family out of state just to play DA. However, is residency or host families become an option, will the top girls' talent in neighboring states move in with a host family to play at what is being argued as the next top level of competition for girls' soccer? There's no doubt SoCal, along with some other areas (Texas, some east coast states, etc.), are already loaded with top talent. But some of their top talent won't opt for DA. It will be interesting to see if the Girls' side does begin to mimic the Boys', in that players and parents that live in neighboring states will sacrifice even more and allow their kids to move just to play soccer.

At the end of the day, what makes your kid happy is the priority (and what is feasible for your wallet) as I stated in a separate thread.

*I believe in the old forum, it was discussed that DP's would have to make half the practices or something like that, but I didn't include it because there was no true way for that to be enforced.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

US soccer ended their residency program for boys at IMG last Friday.
Specifically they stated that with the DA in place it is accomplishing the goals that the residential academy had. 
I would love to meet the person who wanted a residential or out of state option for their daughter. With no livable wage at the pros what a horrible future. Not sugar coating it. 
Education education education!


----------



## Anomaly

ESPNANALYST said:


> US soccer ended their residency program for boys at IMG last Friday.
> Specifically they stated that with the DA in place it is accomplishing the goals that the residential academy had.
> I would love to meet the person who wanted a residential or out of state option for their daughter. With no livable wage at the pros what a horrible future. Not sugar coating it.
> Education education education!


Sorry, I didn't specify. I'm not talking about the national team residency, but residencies offered in Casa Grande (RSL Academy), LA Galaxy residency, and I'm sure some other MLS-affiliated DA clubs have it also.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Anomaly said:


> Sorry, I didn't specify. I'm not talking about the national team residency, but residencies offered in Casa Grande (RSL Academy), LA Galaxy residency, and I'm sure some other MLS-affiliated DA clubs have it also.


Casa Grande and the LAG one have always intrigued me but again the boys are very different! I know several who attended the Dominguez Hills one and then went on to a UC FULLY paid for and now play MLS. Their salaries range from 59k to 180k a year and both are sponsored. They truly at 24-25 would like to move past MLS. 
I would be shocked if they offered this for girls and even more shocked if girls actually attended this.


----------



## Anomaly

ESPNANALYST said:


> Casa Grande and the LAG one have always intrigued me but again the boys are very different! I know several who attended the Dominguez Hills one and then went on to a UC FULLY paid for and now play MLS. Their salaries range from 59k to 180k a year and both are sponsored. They truly at 24-25 would like to move past MLS.
> I would be shocked if they offered this for girls and even more shocked if girls actually attended this.


I think it's an interesting dynamic if offered on the Girls' side, but I agree that, at least right now, it wouldn't fare as well as it does on the Boys' side.

However, to play at the "top" level, some may consider allowing their kids to stay at least with a host family and attend school out of state. It depends on how people view the future and fate of the Girls' DA I guess.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Anomaly said:


> I think it's an interesting dynamic if offered on the Girls' side, but I agree that, at least right now, it wouldn't fare as well as it does on the Boys' side.
> 
> However, to play at the "top" level, some may consider allowing their kids to stay at least with a host family and attend school out of state. It depends on how people view the future and fate of the Girls' DA I guess.


Agree. I know three families that have opted out of Club entirely and work with a private trainer and also an agility formal program. They also homeschool. These are three girls who WILL be on a YNT list. Coaches know them parents don't.
Then we all know the most special of all- the 05 who plays Boys DA. Homeschooled I believe. Already visiting colleges. Our very own OM. Again hays an example of a special player.
My point with this the kids who will be wearing the crest one day are already putting in these hoirs, trainings, nutrition etc. They are not relying on a club or a coach- they are putting in the work themselves. Can a residential facility help them- yes probably but the majority of us don't have that special player and I would be happy if my DD could avoid Snapchat for a day. I would probably stroke out if she came to me with nutritional guidelines for post recovery.


----------



## Dos Equis

ESPNANALYST said:


> Agree. I know three families that have opted out of Club entirely and work with a private trainer and also an agility formal program. They also homeschool. These are three girls who WILL be on a YNT list. Coaches know them parents don't.
> Then we all know the most special of all- the 05 who plays Boys DA. Homeschooled I believe. Already visiting colleges. Our very own OM. Again hays an example of a special player.
> My point with this the kids who will be wearing the crest one day are already putting in these hoirs, trainings, nutrition etc. They are not relying on a club or a coach- they are putting in the work themselves. Can a residential facility help them- yes probably but the majority of us don't have that special player and I would be happy if my DD could avoid Snapchat for a day. I would probably stroke out if she came to me with nutritional guidelines for post recovery.


Does the "M" in "OM" stand for Marinovich?

Opting out of club entirely?  No one informed them that soccer is a team sport?   Working well with others is actually a benefit?

They will look great in college ID and YNT training camps, where passing the ball is rarely seen nor valued.  Then they will get selected to our USWNT, and the public will wonder why our terrific athletes, who have devoted their entire youth to perfecting their individual skills, get their shorts handed to them by teams from France and Japan.  U.S. Soccer will blame it on bad habits they developed in college, and encourage all to skip the future impairing practice of getting a college education.


----------



## Striker17

Uh did you read my post? Apparently not. 
OM plays Boys DA. So doubtful she will get passed up. She can run circles around pretty much anyone. Sorry sad but true. 
As for your other assessment I think there is nothing wrong with focusing on your child's technique and play and speed until 13-14. They played 6-10. They all play futsal with boys. Then you introduce a highly skilled player into a system with a coach you trust. Shock you avoid burnout and overuse injuries. Maybe even she has joy of the game like CM when she came over from Brazil after no formal training? 
I believe they are doing just fine. 
Again wouldn't expect people on this board to be able to look at anything with fresh eyes or objectivity. It doesn't fit the needs of the herd


----------



## chargerfan

Anomaly said:


> I think it's an interesting dynamic if offered on the Girls' side, but I agree that, at least right now, it wouldn't fare as well as it does on the Boys' side.
> 
> However, to play at the "top" level, some may consider allowing their kids to stay at least with a host family and attend school out of state. It depends on how people view the future and fate of the Girls' DA I guess.


If you are willing to send your child to live in another state with another family just to play soccer, you should have your head checked.


----------



## Striker17

Dos Equis said:


> Does the "M" in "OM" stand for Marinovich?
> 
> Opting out of club entirely?  No one informed them that soccer is a team sport?   Working well with others is actually a benefit?
> 
> They will look great in college ID and YNT training camps, where passing the ball is rarely seen nor valued.  Then they will get selected to our USWNT, and the public will wonder why our terrific athletes, who have devoted their entire youth to perfecting their individual skills, get their shorts handed to them by teams from France and Japan.  U.S. Soccer will blame it on bad habits they developed in college, and encourage all to skip the future impairing practice of getting a college education.


Second part- let me know when soccer becomes a team sport in SOCAL. I am just a little fish responding to the pond at which I swimming in- aka look out for number one. 
This is what I see
Them taking a bunch of kids and changing their positions at ODP, DA, and YNT. 
Them frequently overlooking all defenders at all levels of identification. 
Them playing boot ball to a talented and fast forward and ignoring the vision of mids
Then not treating soccer as a thinking mans sport- ignoring all cerebral applications of the game 
Rewarding all parents who are nuts in the process 

Change the culture and change the problem but it WILL NEVER BE Changed.


----------



## NoGoal

ESPNANALYST said:


> Agree. I know three families that have opted out of Club entirely and work with a private trainer and also an agility formal program. They also homeschool. These are three girls who WILL be on a YNT list. Coaches know them parents don't.
> Then we all know the most special of all- the 05 who plays Boys DA. Homeschooled I believe. Already visiting colleges. Our very own OM. Again hays an example of a special player.
> My point with this the kids who will be wearing the crest one day are already putting in these hoirs, trainings, nutrition etc. They are not relying on a club or a coach- they are putting in the work themselves. Can a residential facility help them- yes probably but the majority of us don't have that special player and I would be happy if my DD could avoid Snapchat for a day. I would probably stroke out if she came to me with nutritional guidelines for post recovery.


On the girls side, the US YNT head coaches recommend to their players (fixtures on the team) home school instead of normal HS.  The reasoning is the girls will miss an abundance of school days and will fall behind.  I know 3 players and their parents.  2 didn't go the home school route and 1 did.  IMO, it depends how bright the individual is and if they can keep up with the normal HS school work.  BTW, all 3 still played with their club teams....when they weren't called in for YNT duties.


----------



## pooka

Striker17 said:


> Uh did you read my post? Apparently not.
> OM plays Boys DA. So doubtful she will get passed up. She can run circles around pretty much anyone. Sorry sad but true.
> As for your other assessment I think there is nothing wrong with focusing on your child's technique and play and speed until 13-14. They played 6-10. They all play futsal with boys. Then you introduce a highly skilled player into a system with a coach you trust. Shock you avoid burnout and overuse injuries. Maybe even she has joy of the game like CM when she came over from Brazil after no formal training?
> I believe they are doing just fine.
> Again wouldn't expect people on this board to be able to look at anything with fresh eyes or objectivity. It doesn't fit the needs of the herd


 Hey @Striker17 I wanted to clarify the answers to your question from my post. As anomaly posted, DP in ECNL is different the DP in DA. DP in echo is why there are girls from Kansas playing ECNL in Oklahoma, girls from Louisiana playing in Texas, and so on and so forth. It allowed girls who were not geographically located near an ECNL team to still participate. DP in DA is available for second team players or bubble players to gain experience on the DA team I guess. but its for a limited number of games per season. 
I personally would not want to send my daughter away to a host family, but I know that ice skating and gymnastics do it all the time. It just wouldn't work for us.


----------



## Dos Equis

Striker17 said:


> Uh did you read my post? Apparently not.
> OM plays Boys DA. So doubtful she will get passed up. She can run circles around pretty much anyone. Sorry sad but true.
> As for your other assessment I think there is nothing wrong with focusing on your child's technique and play and speed until 13-14. They played 6-10. They all play futsal with boys. Then you introduce a highly skilled player into a system with a coach you trust. Shock you avoid burnout and overuse injuries. Maybe even she has joy of the game like CM when she came over from Brazil after no formal training?
> I believe they are doing just fine.
> Again wouldn't expect people on this board to be able to look at anything with fresh eyes or objectivity. It doesn't fit the needs of the herd


My friend, the literacy issues is yours, not mine.  I was referring to the kids you mentioned who are no longer playing club or team soccer, not OM, and clearly said all of them are sure to get selected and end up on our YNT, not passed up. 

OM and the rest may be the next great thing, not sad nor sorry about that, but right they now have a higher probability of having a career ending injury before 18 than making professional soccer a career.  That is just a matter of statistics.

I do not see focusing on skills development and being on a team as mutually exclusive activities, in my fresh eyes you can do both and experience a more well-rounded development.  Objectively, avoiding team soccer until 13-14 carries at least as many risks as potential benefits, and the coaches and systems available to you at U11-U13 are not so very different than those at U15-U16, whether you call the, ECNL, DA, or whatever the next great thing will be. 

I think I saw a couple of former child prodigy athletes running cirles around everyone and the craps tables in Vegas this weekend, before passing out on the floor.  They said they were doing just fine.


----------



## Striker17

Dos Equis said:


> My friend, the literacy issues is yours, not mine.  I was referring to the kids you mentioned who are no longer playing club or team soccer, not OM, and clearly said all of them are sure to get selected and end up on our YNT, not passed up.
> 
> OM and the rest may be the next great thing, not sad nor sorry about that, but right they now have a higher probability of having a career ending injury before 18 than making professional soccer a career.  That is just a matter of statistics.
> 
> I do not see focusing on skills development and being on a team as mutually exclusive activities, in my fresh eyes you can do both and experience a more well-rounded development.  Objectively, avoiding team soccer until 13-14 carries at least as many risks as potential benefits, and the coaches and systems available to you at U11-U13 are not so very different than those at U15-U16, whether you call the, ECNL, DA, or whatever the next great thing will be.
> 
> I think I saw a couple of former child prodigy athletes running cirles around everyone and the craps tables in Vegas this weekend, before passing out on the floor.  They said they were doing just fine.


Although I enjoy the experienced parents perspectives there are many ways to navigate this new landscape. I presented additional ideas, and did not endorse one way or the other. I also think it's clear I was talking about one percenters here!
I for one think it takes a tremendous amount of courage to recognize that your daughter would be better served in a non traditional route and working towards that goal. It doesn't make it "wrong". Not participating in club for two years 11-13 will in fact not "hurt" anyone at all, especially if you have a gifted athlete. If you look at the very premise of DA it serves what they are doing- more specialized and focused training, limited games, film study. If they are getting touches with boys in futsal, as I wrote, they are enjoying a team aspect. If you have a private coach who is mentoring and teaming your daughter at the same cost of a club coach exactly how is that bad?
Some people are focused on goals that I would never personally be focused on. I would not endorse limiting my daughters social life by homeschooling but I also don't have a very special player who is featured on Instagram and Facebook , is meeting with YNT reps at 10-13 and takes pictures with soccer legends.
As for your last paragraph, I think it's obvious to anyone that child prodigy stars have a long road ahead. Unlike you though I support my friends choices, cheer on their daughters and would never hope they end up face down on a floor. Statistically I concur with you but I am not their parent. For me I would funnel money into a robotics coach or SAT prep over anything to do with soccer. 
We didn't choose this system. 04 got our teams ripped to shreds then had DA dual band put upon us, then single band. Our age group has spent the last seven months not knowing what was happening and families are pretty much exasperated. 
The older parents have all said the same thing- to be cautious about DA and what it means. Our ECNL teams are B teams at 04. So what exactly is wrong with a family deciding not only is DA not a golden ticket but their daughters are not B team ECNL players? Nothing. 
What is wrong with families choosing an even more "off the radar choice" by choosing a local club with a great coach? Not a star team or club that they could have easily made?
Rate it dumb all you want ladies and gentleman my focus is my kid and doing the right thing for her and I will support any family who feels the same way.


----------



## Dos Equis

Striker17 said:


> Our ECNL teams are B teams at 04.
> 
> What is wrong with families choosing an even more "off the radar choice" by choosing a local club with a great coach? Not a star team or club that they could have easily made?
> 
> Rate it dumb all you want ladies and gentleman my focus is my kid and doing the right thing for her and I will support any family who feels the same way.


Arsenal, Strikers, Sereno, Heat, Del Mar, pretty much all of NorCal ECNL and a significant amount of the prior ECNL teams (~50 teams, or 60%) who either declined, never applied or were not invited to DA would argue against ECNL being all B teams.  

I did not believe every Beach, Legends, LA Premier, Pats, etc. team was a B team when they were not in ECNL, nor do I grant them elite status just by joining DA.  Same coaches, same fields, and more than likely many of the same players.  They will not suddenly change their style of play and coaching because they have a new patch.  

If you have a great coach and positive team/club culture, and the speed of play of your team, league, or private sessions are at a level to help you achieve your soccer goals, you should be happy.  

Doing what is right for our kid is what we all try to achieve -- raising our children is our primary responsibility as parents.  I think we can all agree on that.


----------



## Striker17

I said at 04 our B teams. That is the fact.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Changing the patch is not gonna make your kid a better soccer player.

A mixture of a good club coach, personal trainer (soccer and weightlifting) and some discovery play at big showcases will be enough to give your kid a shot at the national team.

The data shows BDA has not produced a winning World Cup team.  What makes anyone think the girls side will be any different?   Has everyone noticed how other countries are catching up to the WNT??  Not sure ECNL or NPL is the answer either.


----------



## Kicker4Life

eastbaysoccer said:


> Changing the patch is not gonna make your kid a better soccer player.
> 
> A mixture of a good club coach, personal trainer (soccer and weightlifting) and some discovery play at big showcases will be enough to give your kid a shot at the national team.
> 
> The data shows BDA has not produced a winning World Cup team.  What makes anyone think the girls side will be any different?   Has everyone noticed how other countries are catching up to the WNT??  Not sure ECNL or NPL is the answer either.


Neither will the status quo....everyone has the opinion DA isn't the answer, well, then what is?  ECNL hasn't pushed the WNT forward enough to outpace teams like France, Japan, Korea, ect.  US soccer and the ECNL brass couldn't work together to do what is best for the growth of the Women's game so it has become even more fractured. 

As I've stated before, I'm not sold that DA is going to live up to the hype. But for an '04 DD who can play locally under a great coach in a great organization that happens to be DA why wouldn't you?


----------



## chargerfan

Kicker4Life said:


> Neither will the status quo....everyone has the opinion DA isn't the answer, well, then what is?  ECNL hasn't pushed the WNT forward enough to outpace teams like France, Japan, Korea, ect.  US soccer and the ECNL brass couldn't work together to do what is best for the growth of the Women's game so it has become even more fractured.
> 
> As I've stated before, I'm not sold that DA is going to live up to the hype. But for an '04 DD who can play locally under a great coach in a great organization that happens to be DA why wouldn't you?


I think it's more important to focus on skills at the younger ages. There are a lot of poor ulittle coaches and those kids are developing bad habits at 8-11 that are hard to fix later on. I see a lot of girls in our age group who cannot correctly collect a ball and have a bad first touch. DA will not fix that. More oversight of coaching at the younger ages will.


----------



## chiefs

eastbaysoccer said:


> Changing the patch is not gonna make your kid a better soccer player.
> 
> A mixture of a good club coach, personal trainer (soccer and weightlifting) and some discovery play at big showcases will be enough to give your kid a shot at the national team.
> 
> The data shows BDA has not produced a winning World Cup team.  What makes anyone think the girls side will be any different?   Has everyone noticed how other countries are catching up to the WNT??  Not sure ECNL or NPL is the answer either.


With the other countries catching up or surpassing the USWNT, it had exposed the domestic player scouting process as flawed.  I understand that DA is a money grab and power play from ECNl. But I am not so naive to think that the powers at be want a different process than ODP.


----------



## Kicker4Life

chargerfan said:


> More oversight of coaching at the younger ages will.


I am lead to believe that is one of the main points of DA, but who knows. Based on the balance of your point, you are reaffirming our decision to go DA and remain with her coach.


----------



## chargerfan

Kicker4Life said:


> I am lead to believe that is one of the main points of DA, but who knows. Based on the balance of your point, you are reaffirming our decision to go DA and remain with her coach.


Da doesn't start until age 12-13. Too late to teach those skills. Any girl who wants to play da should have a good first touch and ability to collect a ball and have her head up to make a smart play. I don't see that being the case right now. US soccer should be taking more control over the real development ages, instead of stepping in at 12. If your Da coach is a good coach, and your daughter wants to make that commitment, by all means stay. But don't discount that taking control of the younger ages would be more effective in creating a greater pool of top players.


----------



## outside!

San Diego area GDA tryouts.

Albion appears to be the first to have official tryouts starting this Friday, March 24th (see bottom of page).
http://www.albionsoccer.org/tryoutinfo/161391.html?1490121233

LA Galaxy San Diego has been having kick-arounds and some open practices depending on age group. It appears that there are tryouts for the 2001/2002's starting March 29th.
http://lagalaxysd.com/tryout/

Surf does not have any tryout dates listed yet, but they do have a very good FAQ page.
http://www.surfsoccer.com/ussda-girls/


----------



## Kicker4Life

chargerfan said:


> Da doesn't start until age 12-13. Too late to teach those skills. Any girl who wants to play da should have a good first touch and ability to collect a ball and have her head up to make a smart play. I don't see that being the case right now. US soccer should be taking more control over the real development ages, instead of stepping in at 12. If your Da coach is a good coach, and your daughter wants to make that commitment, by all means stay. But don't discount that taking control of the younger ages would be more effective in creating a greater pool of top players.


I agree with your assessment 100%.


----------



## Glen

chargerfan said:


> I think it's more important to focus on skills at the younger ages. There are a lot of poor ulittle coaches and those kids are developing bad habits at 8-11 that are hard to fix later on. I see a lot of girls in our age group who cannot correctly collect a ball and have a bad first touch. DA will not fix that. More oversight of coaching at the younger ages will.


There is some recognition of this by US Soccer.  That's why they are putting in place the small-standards this year from u-6 through u-12.  
http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2015/08/24/18/07/150824-coaching-player-development-initiatives-rel 

Better coaching would be awesome, but's it tough to find high-level a coach that wants to coach 10 year olds all their life.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Scouting is a big deal.  Does anyone here think U soccer has better scouts that the NFL or NBA? Heck no.....they earn less and don't have the big money to truly evaluate and vet players. 

IMO the fist thing scouts should look is mental toughness.  Can u play at a high level when u are sick and injured?  Do u raise your game when it counts?  Do you make the biggest plays in the biggest moments?  

Busts -  Sam Bowie, Ryan leaf, Jared Geoff, heath Schuler, Greg Oden,. Perhaps US soccer has scouts with the same eyes that scouted these dopes.

I believe we can fix this area right away.


----------



## Soccer123

chargerfan said:


> Da doesn't start until age 12-13. Too late to teach those skills. Any girl who wants to play da should have a good first touch and ability to collect a ball and have her head up to make a smart play. I don't see that being the case right now. US soccer should be taking more control over the real development ages, instead of stepping in at 12. If your Da coach is a good coach, and your daughter wants to make that commitment, by all means stay. But don't discount that taking control of the younger ages would be more effective in creating a greater pool of top players.


I agree 200% with you!  These skills need to be taught and mastered at a young age to be able to play at a high level and be successful at an older age!  I don't think there are enough "technical" coaches at the younger ages hence why some players are missing these skills later on.  I would say CB has spent much of his soccer life with 10 year old's and he has mastered how to teach technical soccer. If only we could clone him.


----------



## outside!

This weekend in Vegas I asked someone much more knowledgable than I for his opinion of GDA. He has a son in Academy, and a daughter who has played with various ages of the US YNT. He is also a pretty good player himself. He is glad for the change from ECNL to GDA. He says the schedule is better and the increase in practice time his son has had in DA is very beneficial.


----------



## Kicknit22

chargerfan said:


> Da doesn't start until age 12-13. Too late to teach those skills. Any girl who wants to play da should have a good first touch and ability to collect a ball and have her head up to make a smart play. I don't see that being the case right now. US soccer should be taking more control over the real development ages, instead of stepping in at 12. If your Da coach is a good coach, and your daughter wants to make that commitment, by all means stay. But don't discount that taking control of the younger ages would be more effective in creating a greater pool of top players.


Completely agree. I don't think anyone  should believe that it is the DA intention to do so, either.  Fine tuning, elevating, advancing within a team concept, yes.  However, I would think that certain players that have been identified already within a club, already possess these skills.  I would expect tryouts to identify the rest.  If not, it's just the same teams of players with a different acronym in front of the team name.   I think the idea is to get as many of the best players as possible playing together.  This IS how individuals elevate their game, being surrounded by as good or better than you players.  Don't kid yourself in thinking that ODP coaches are teaching skills to anyone.  No, they are just managing a great group of players. Again, the theory of DA is good.  Just as ECNL is/was.  We will see if it all works out.


----------



## Kicknit22

JMHO, but one big difference between a DA club and an ECNL club, is the fact that teams are pretty much set for the age groups.  Sure, each year and from time to time there might be individual adds and drops, but there is no "graduation" into DA.  Whereas, say an 04 "team" at an ECNL club, promotes and becomes ECNL at U14.  Same team, bigger pedestal.


----------



## Striker17

I would kindly disagree. Maybe I am misreading but I think some things may be very hard for DA players even if we have made a team. There are hidden pitfalls within the DA system that I suppose separate the girls:
1. Lack of playing time
2. Learning how to focus on training- making training days 100 percent as opposed to a "practice mentality" that I see now in my DD team. Proving yourself at training and not waiting for "game day" to show up or that "big tourney"
3. Lack of unlimited substitutions- learning how to be impactful to the game or you will be subbed out and not get that chance to go back in 
4. A very real chance that if you are 11-18 on a DA you may start in as little as 25 percent of games and you have to find a way to "break in" to the top 11. How do you do that? How do you "prove" worth at training because there will be fewer games 
5. It's a grind and so the motivation can't come from parents- it has to come from players to "show up" four days a week. Can they?
6. Ten month season and at the end your 11-18 player can be replaced. It has the potential to be a much more cut throat arena especially if the DA records are poor. I haven't seen the quantifers but I can only assume there will be some discussions with families that girls aren't cutting it or families leaving out of exasperation no play time etc
7. I think that the truly elite would have no issue going DA to DA- but the rest of us won't be able to change teams and clubs so freely anymore. I would think that in theory some clubs with depth would want to move up current girls in a system within their club vs an outside DA unless she was very elite 
8. ECNL was my dream for my DD prior to all this because it appeared to be a beautiful balance of competition and lifestyle and social. Now there is more pressure and some girls will not thrive in that role or environment
9. Studying the game and being an actual student of the game vs "just playing". Some girls are not good in school or learning new concepts but are instinctual athletes. Can those who have relied on athleticism start learning space, movement, off the ball involvement?  These are things my coach never taught my daughter 
I know a ramble. Just being honest about some challenges my DD may not even know are coming. 
To be sure, my DD thinks she "made a team". I don't think she gets it yet


----------



## Striker17

One more thing :
There is so much talk about ECNL vs DA but it's the same coaches. The issue becomes can US soccer from afar actually make impactful change?
If they do the gaps should widen significantly at the 04 level between an ECNL or a DA player in theory. In theory the ECNL girls or non DA will have to work that much harder to "break into a system"
The "system" at our age group is plagued probably like most with family alliances, money, politics. Will clubs forego concerns about records and retain the "fringe player" who has made a team due to non merit or will they adhere to the "system".
That will surely be an interesting outcome but not one seen until 2018 at the earliest for our age group. I have a feeling my previous 9 concerns will have a potential to "weed out" players who have coasted onto teams thus far


----------



## chargerfan

Glen said:


> There is some recognition of this by US Soccer.  That's why they are putting in place the small-standards this year from u-6 through u-12.
> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2015/08/24/18/07/150824-coaching-player-development-initiatives-rel
> 
> Better coaching would be awesome, but's it tough to find high-level a coach that wants to coach 10 year olds all their life.


I think


Striker17 said:


> One more thing :
> There is so much talk about ECNL vs DA but it's the same coaches. The issue becomes can US soccer from afar actually make impactful change?
> If they do the gaps should widen significantly at the 04 level between an ECNL or a DA player in theory. In theory the ECNL girls or non DA will have to work that much harder to "break into a system"
> The "system" at our age group is plagued probably like most with family alliances, money, politics. Will clubs forego concerns about records and retain the "fringe player" who has made a team due to non merit or will they adhere to the "system".
> That will surely be an interesting outcome but not one seen until 2018 at the earliest for our age group. I have a feeling my previous 9 concerns will have a potential to "weed out" players who have coasted onto teams thus far


No doubt there is politics and money involved already. And believe me, it will not be pretty when those girls are getting playing time and those more worthy are sitting.


----------



## Kicknit22

Striker17 said:


> I would kindly disagree. Maybe I am misreading but I think some things may be very hard for DA players even if we have made a team. There are hidden pitfalls within the DA system that I suppose separate the girls:
> 1. Lack of playing time
> 2. Learning how to focus on training- making training days 100 percent as opposed to a "practice mentality" that I see now in my DD team. Proving yourself at training and not waiting for "game day" to show up or that "big tourney"
> 3. Lack of unlimited substitutions- learning how to be impactful to the game or you will be subbed out and not get that chance to go back in
> 4. A very real chance that if you are 11-18 on a DA you may start in as little as 25 percent of games and you have to find a way to "break in" to the top 11. How do you do that? How do you "prove" worth at training because there will be fewer games
> 5. It's a grind and so the motivation can't come from parents- it has to come from players to "show up" four days a week. Can they?
> 6. Ten month season and at the end your 11-18 player can be replaced. It has the potential to be a much more cut throat arena especially if the DA records are poor. I haven't seen the quantifers but I can only assume there will be some discussions with families that girls aren't cutting it or families leaving out of exasperation no play time etc
> 7. I think that the truly elite would have no issue going DA to DA- but the rest of us won't be able to change teams and clubs so freely anymore. I would think that in theory some clubs with depth would want to move up current girls in a system within their club vs an outside DA unless she was very elite
> 8. ECNL was my dream for my DD prior to all this because it appeared to be a beautiful balance of competition and lifestyle and social. Now there is more pressure and some girls will not thrive in that role or environment
> 9. Studying the game and being an actual student of the game vs "just playing". Some girls are not good in school or learning new concepts but are instinctual athletes. Can those who have relied on athleticism start learning space, movement, off the ball involvement?  These are things my coach never taught my daughter
> I know a ramble. Just being honest about some challenges my DD may not even know are coming.
> To be sure, my DD thinks she "made a team". I don't think she gets it yet


All very valid points Striker.  Trust that I meant no slight.  Honestly, I have no experience with ECNL, except mine being asked to DP.  The substitution thing, I get.  The 10 month commitment is what it is. That's the nature of our youth sports landscape now.  In nearly every sport!  Agree or disagree, it's simply the truth.  I personally don't prefer it.  I long for the days (like when I was a teen) where you could be a multi sport athlete, no conflict.  I also agree, the player MUST be intrinsically motivated, or it could very well be a waste of time and sacrifice.  The decision is 100% my DD's.  I could care less what the club or coach pushes for or says where she should be.  Who knows, we could be relocating to play ECNL in lieu of DA.  I, like a lot of others out there, am very curious how this will all shake out.  Best of luck to you and your DD. Whatever works out, is meant to be.  If you believe in that line of thought.


----------



## Kicknit22

chargerfan said:


> I think
> 
> 
> No doubt there is politics and money involved already. And believe me, it will not be pretty when those girls are getting playing time and those more worthy are sitting.


Something we can NEVER seem to be clear of.


----------



## Striker17

Kicknit22 said:


> All very valid points Striker.  Trust that I meant no slight.  Honestly, I have no experience with ECNL, except mine being asked to DP.  The substitution thing, I get.  The 10 month commitment is what it is. That's the nature of our youth sports landscape now.  In nearly every sport!  Agree or disagree, it's simply the truth.  I personally don't prefer it.  I long for the days (like when I was a teen) where you could be a multi sport athlete, no conflict.  I also agree, the player MUST be intrinsically motivated, or it could very well be a waste of time and sacrifice.  The decision is 100% my DD's.  I could care less what the club or coach pushes for or says where she should be.  Who knows, we could be relocating to play ECNL in lieu of DA.  I, like a lot of others out there, am very curious how this will all shake out.  Best of luck to you and your DD. Whatever works out, is meant to be.  If you believe in that line of thought.


No I took no slight at all! My issue was that I think getting into a roster on the DA represents the very beginning of what could be some rough terrain. ECNL had some options for my DD, and a way to soften the blow to speak due to structure of play.
This has the potential to be a system that many girls will simply not be able to compete in from my perspective.


----------



## chargerfan

Striker17 said:


> No I took no slight at all! My issue was that I think getting into a roster on the DA represents the very beginning of what could be some rough terrain. ECNL had some options for my DD, and a way to soften the blow to speak due to structure of play.
> This has the potential to be a system that many girls will simply not be able to compete in from my perspective.


I agree that it will be harder for girls to break into the top 11. Especially those that "show" better at games than practice.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Perhaps girls need to go through a combine like college football players go through.  

The current system is so subjective.  Why copy Europe,  do something different.  We've been trying to copy them and it's not working.


----------



## Anomaly

eastbaysoccer said:


> Perhaps girls need to go through a combine like college football players go through.
> 
> The current system is so subjective.  Why copy Europe,  do something different.  We've been trying to copy them and it's not working.


It's not necessarily the act of mimicking that is the issue, but the motives and intentions that come along with it. When you have the wrong people in charge of what is otherwise a "successful" system, the results aren't favorable. Until soccer in the United States becomes less about money and more about development, and more importantly, the KIDS, no system can be successfully implemented.

But that's just my 2 cents.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Agree but we also shoulder the blame for being uninformed and not caring about what matters. 
Just now on the other forum some parent "can't believe that highly competitive people are not supposed to care about scores".
Ummmm yeah. 
Again another person missing the actual point.
On the 04 we have a standings guy- everyone loves him. I think standings and tracking them is a joke


----------



## timmyh

I hear rumor out of Chicago is that today US soccer decided to have a U13 GDA age group for next fall.
Can anyone confirm?!


----------



## soccer4us

Eventually I'm sure that will happen. Will they add another age group already? Who knows

I agree until the u8-12 is being looked after to make sure kids are developing, coming in at u12/13 only helps so much. Easy to argue a big reason why the US 17 and 20's have struggled recently is because their not taught the technical side consistently or mandated to play a certain way. Now that some countries are catching up to us in results and style, we're all of sudden worried we need to change to be clearly the number 1 again. Let's not forget USSF staff have the full power to call up which kids they want. If they aren't bringing in  the skilled and intelligent but go for average skill, speed, and power they only can blame themselves when Korea, Japan, France, etc look better and sharper on the ball vs us. Do we need more of these skilled players? yes, many to choose from in order form a team or at least large portion of a team....should they choose


----------



## LASTMAN14

timmyh said:


> I hear rumor out of Chicago is that today US soccer decided to have a U13 GDA age group for next fall.
> Can anyone confirm?!


That's a whopper of a rumor! If its true...Wow!


----------



## Anomaly

LA Galaxy DA tryouts announced:
http://www.lagalaxy.com/post/2017/03/23/la-galaxy-announce-tryout-information-la-galaxy-girls-academy


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Folks unless this is free and subsidized by someone this is just another league with a different patch.   Same old coaches, different clubs.

Maybe it takes over, maybe not.  I envision a spilt based on the needs of each individual player.  ECNL ran a good business model and executed where others did not.  The question is can US Soccer execute their plan as ECNL operates well simultaneously.  I suppose it's good to have some competition because it makes both raise their game to attract customers....


----------



## SocalSoccerMom

Anomaly said:


> LA Galaxy DA tryouts announced:
> http://www.lagalaxy.com/post/2017/03/23/la-galaxy-announce-tryout-information-la-galaxy-girls-academy


No mention of DAII.


----------



## ESPNANALYST

Agree it's a matter of if and when US soccer actually enforces what they say they will. I don't have high hopes but on paper I am optimistic.
I can't do much until after Aug 1. Then I can pass judgement


----------



## MrXor

http://www.ussoccerda.com/20170324-reign-academy-expands-through-partnership-with-seattle-united-fc-and-eastside-fc

In Washington State. Not really DA2, but...is it? Blessings from US Soccer it appears.

"Reign Academy2 teams, which are overseen by Reign Academy, provide a pathway for players with the potential to make the leap to the DA level of play. Players in the Reign Academy2 program will train under the Reign Academy curriculum, can be called up as Developmental Players to the full DA teams, and are permitted to play with their high school teams."


----------



## NoGoal

MrXor said:


> http://www.ussoccerda.com/20170324-reign-academy-expands-through-partnership-with-seattle-united-fc-and-eastside-fc
> 
> In Washington State. Not really DA2, but...is it? Blessings from US Soccer it appears.
> 
> "Reign Academy2 teams, which are overseen by Reign Academy, provide a pathway for players with the potential to make the leap to the DA level of play. Players in the Reign Academy2 program will train under the Reign Academy curriculum, can be called up as Developmental Players to the full DA teams, and are permitted to play with their high school teams."


Don't read to much into it.  It's simply Reign DA naming their B teams Reign Academy2.   No different than other clubs using colors to distinguish their B teams.  Example: Slammers Maroon = B team


----------



## Kicknit22

MrXor said:


> http://www.ussoccerda.com/20170324-reign-academy-expands-through-partnership-with-seattle-united-fc-and-eastside-fc
> 
> In Washington State. Not really DA2, but...is it? Blessings from US Soccer it appears.
> 
> "Reign Academy2 teams, which are overseen by Reign Academy, provide a pathway for players with the potential to make the leap to the DA level of play. Players in the Reign Academy2 program will train under the Reign Academy curriculum, can be called up as Developmental Players to the full DA teams, and are permitted to play with their high school teams."


I don't see any "blessing"at all in the article.  Notice how Reign simply calls the team "Reign Academy2" not DA2.  That team  will likely continue to play in the same leagues as they always have, tournaments, showcases, etc.


----------



## Kicknit22

Fine print.....
"While we don't feel, at this time, your player is at the level of DA, we would like to retain you as a paying customer, however (with a slight increase), and offer you a spot on our DAII team.  When or where this team will play has yet to be determined, but we can assure you it exists......_kinda.  _Upon receipt of your payment, your player will have the opportunity to train extra days, play less games, and maybe play up to six (6) games with the DA team (assuming payments are current).   Your player will also be able to play HS soccer, as DA will be taking that time to rest the full DA players. So to clarify, your player will continue Soccer as usual, except without the summer tournaments or showcases, National/State Cup, but will be able to tell thier friends that they play DA-II.  We thank you for your patronage "


----------



## rainbow_unicorn

timmyh said:


> I hear rumor out of Chicago is that today US soccer decided to have a U13 GDA age group for next fall.
> Can anyone confirm?!


Is it not out of the realm of possibility that girls DA will add U13 and U12 similar to the boys in the upcoming years?


----------



## outside!

outside! said:


> San Diego area GDA tryouts.
> 
> Albion appears to be the first to have official tryouts starting this Friday, March 24th (see bottom of page).
> http://www.albionsoccer.org/tryoutinfo/161391.html?1490121233
> 
> LA Galaxy San Diego has been having kick-arounds and some open practices depending on age group. It appears that there are tryouts for the 2001/2002's starting March 29th.
> http://lagalaxysd.com/tryout/
> 
> Surf does not have any tryout dates listed yet, but they do have a very good FAQ page.
> http://www.surfsoccer.com/ussda-girls/


Updates:
Albion already had some GDA tryouts (see above link). Anybody go and care to give a report?

LA Galaxy San Diego
*2002-1999 *(all levels)

GIRLS 2002 – Tue, 05/02, Wed, 05/03 & Thur, 05/04 from 4:00-5:30pm @Poinsettia Park
GIRLS 2001 – Tue, 05/02, Wed, 05/03 & Thur, 05/04 from 5:30-7:00pm @Poinsettia Park
GIRLS 2000 – Tue, 05/02, Wed, 05/03 & Thur, 05/04 from 7:00-8:30pm @Poinsettia Park
GIRLS 1999 – Tue, 05/02, Wed, 05/03 & Thur, 05/04 from 7:00-8:30pm @Poinsettia Park

BOYS 2002 – Mon, 05/01 & Wed, 05/03 from 4:00-5:30pm @Aviara Park
BOYS 2001 – Tue, 05/02 & Thur, 05/04 from 4:30-6:00pm @Aviara Park
BOYS 2000 – Tue, 05/02 & Thur, 05/04 from 6:00-7:30pm @Aviara Park
BOYS 1999 –  Wed, 05/03 from 5:30-7:00pm & Thur, 05/04 from 7:30-9:00pm @Aviara Park
If you wish to come out and practice with any of our older teams please email:
GIRLS – Email 2002-99 Girls HOPD Courtney Drummond at: courtney@lagalaxysd.com
BOYS – Email 2002-99 Boys HOPD Sean Gurley at: sean@lagalaxysd.com

*LAGSD WOMEN’S WPSL TEAM*

Monday, May 8, 7:30-9:00pm @ Pine Avenue Park
Wednesday, May 10, 7:30-9:00pm @ Poinsettia Community Park
Surf:
I can't find any tryout information. Does anyone know anything about tryouts?


----------



## GoWest

Couldn't find anything on Surf DA tryouts but I'm sure one of the good folks at Surf DA listed here with email addresses might be able to help?

http://surf.ussoccerda.com/club-staff

Cheers


----------



## outside!

GoWest said:


> Couldn't find anything on Surf DA tryouts but I'm sure one of the good folks at Surf DA listed here with email addresses might be able to help?
> 
> http://surf.ussoccerda.com/club-staff
> 
> Cheers


Thanks, I was just trying to get official information for San Diego county out to the public. It does not matter for my players. With Albion and LAGSD having publicly announced tryouts, I would expect Surf to announce soon. If not there will be plenty of conspiracy theories.


----------



## DJB

Recent article on DA vs. ECNL...

*How youth teams are straddling the ECNL, Development Academy divide*
Written by Will Parchman
Once the initial shockwaves subsided, we were left wondering exactly how the newly announced Girls Development Academy from U.S. Soccer would divide the elite girls youth soccer landscape in the U.S. And now we might have some semblance of an idea.

The ECNL, of course, has been the top girls club soccer league in the country since its foundation in 2009. It was a spin-off of US Club Soccer’s, an institution that shares a step in the U.S. development pyramid with US Youth Soccer. The ECNL was always a set-apart entity from U.S. Soccer, although USSF did heavily recruit out of its ranks for USYNT players. Pretty much every girls player of record in the current U17 and U20 setups, as well as the vast majority of the top women’s college players in the country, spent more time in the ECNL as teens than anywhere else.

That meant that U.S. Soccer’s Girls DA, which opens its doors to games for the first time this fall, was a direct competitor with ECNL. This, needless to say, did not sit well with everyone.

The broadest questions in the aftermath of the initial shock were how exactly the split would happen. Both U.S. Soccer and the ECNL have been adamant that a club would not have to devote the entirety of its resources to one league or the other. A number of the biggest clubs in the country currently have teams that compete in a variety of leagues in different associations. So while the ECNL and DA wouldn’t directly share teams – i.e., a single U17 team couldn’t compete in both leagues – they could set up different U17 teams with the express purpose of allocating one to one league and one to the other.

But we didn’t have confirmation of that fact. Until now.

ECNL and DA rosters similar in age will be different teams with their own identities, both will compete at high levels #DAandECNLTryoutspic.twitter.com/c6zlHS6o1Q

— Eclipse Select SC (@EclipseSelectSC) April 5, 2017

Eclipse Select is annually one of the ECNL’s heavy hitters, and it’s pumped out youth national team talent like Zoe Redei and full national teamers like Amy LePeilbet. So what it does matters, and it’s likely a course other major talent producers with the means to do so will follow; clubs like PDA, So Cal Blues and Dallas Sting. While smaller clubs with more focused talent pools will likely have to choose one over the other (and some already have), the big ones can afford to segment.

What this means, essentially, is that Eclipse Select (and presumably others like them) will create two tracks for its players: either go DA or go ECNL. And in the present climate, it’s hard to imagine the ECNL track not suffering for it.

For one, U.S. Soccer is the behemoth in the equation, and it can easily brush aside the ECNL in the matter of resources. One of the primary reasons the ECNL was so attractive to top players wasn’t necessarily that it was particularly competitive from top to bottom. It wasn’t, as a number of regional scorelines can attest. Rather, the biggest value was in the national team pipeline and the college scouting. The ECNL offered unparalleled access to both college coaches and national team coaches at showcase events.

That probably won’t dry up entirely at ECNL events, at least not initially. But the migration will likely be noticeable as U.S. Soccer’s WNT scouts cannibalize their own events (they have financial reasons to do this, too) and increasingly turn away from ECNL’s spate of showcases and playoffs. And while the ECNL will still be a respectable place to play your soccer, and will still provided a pipeline to college soccer, it’s hard not to see that pipeline narrowing significantly with a direct competitor fronting vastly superior resources.

The question now in front of young girls soccer players in America is no longer about which college to choose, or even which academy. It’s which team _in_ that academy. So clubs like Eclipse Select will open up two distinct tracks for its top players: DA or ECNL. This might not hinder overall development – it might even help it. But it’ll certainly muddy the waters as the nation’s top recruits puzzle through their next steps in an uncertain future.


----------



## Legendary FC

http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/the91stminute/2016/07/u-s-soccers-new-girls-development-academy-has-its-first-public-dissenter/


----------



## Lambchop

Legendary FC said:


> http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/the91stminute/2016/07/u-s-soccers-new-girls-development-academy-has-its-first-public-dissenter/


This article is from last July.  Of course most of the top college players and YNT players were ECNL, it is was the major platform.  ECNL did not develop the players, it provided the venue for them to play against other top players.


----------



## Legendary FC

Lambchop said:


> This article is from last July.  Of course most of the top college players and YNT players were ECNL, it is was the major platform.  ECNL did not develop the players, it provided the venue for them to play against other top players.


Is that what the top players say or what you say?  Have you asked any of those players?  I have.


----------



## Legendary FC

Lambchop said:


> This article is from last July.  Of course most of the top college players and YNT players were ECNL, it is was the major platform.  ECNL did not develop the players, it provided the venue for them to play against other top players.


Did you get the point of the article?  Or are you like @CaliKlines  and @Kicker4Life and drink whatever koolaid is the flavor of the month?  US soccer could do much better with the money than trying to develop 12 year olds.  Especially when 99.9999% of them will never wear the USA crest in a game and 95% will never play for a top college team.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Lambchop said:


> This article is from last July.  Of course most of the top college players and YNT players were ECNL, it is was the major platform.  ECNL did not develop the players, it provided the venue for them to play against other top players.


Hard to believe no ECNL team developed or at least help develop players.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Legendary FC said:


> Did you get the point of the article?  Or are you like @CaliKlines  and @Kicker4Life and drink whatever koolaid is the flavor of the month?  US soccer could do much better with the money than trying to develop 12 year olds.  Especially when 99.9999% of them will never wear the USA crest in a game and 95% will never play for a top college team.


How?


----------



## Legendary FC

Sheriff Joe said:


> Hard to believe no ECNL team developed or at least help develop players.


Especially since the ECNL coaches are now going to be the DA coaches.  Will they be developing players now that they have a different label?


----------



## Legendary FC

Sheriff Joe said:


> How?


Plug the money into the pro league where the players that have already proven themselves to be pros play their club ball.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Legendary FC said:


> Did you get the point of the article?  Or are you like @CaliKlines  and @Kicker4Life and drink whatever koolaid is the flavor of the month?  US soccer could do much better with the money than trying to develop 12 year olds.  Especially when 99.9999% of them will never wear the USA crest in a game and 95% will never play for a top college team.


You haven't done your homework big guy.


----------



## Lambchop

Sheriff Joe said:


> Hard to believe no ECNL team developed or at least help develop players.


The players developed because of their trainers, coaches and playing with other top players, weather it be their team mates or other team players. ECNL platform did not develop them.


----------



## NoGoalItAll

Lambchop said:


> The players developed because of their trainers, coaches and playing with other top players, weather it be their team mates or other team players. ECNL platform did not develop them.


Don't forget high school soccer.  It's vital to development as well.


----------



## Legendary FC

Kicker4Life said:


> You haven't done your homework big guy.


Keep thinking that.


----------



## timmyh

So ECNL has confirmed U13 teams for this fall. The DA should be following soon, right?

Here is the letter to ECNL clubs:

2017-18 ECNL Member Clubs,

Please read the below correspondence in regards to the ECNL U13 Division being introduced in the 2017-18 ECNL Season. 

The ECNL U13 Division will be created as a formal ECNL competition age group beginning in the 2017-18 season. While the age group will be formally supported by the league (see below), participation will be optional due to the different travel demands across the country. Additionally, based on the age of the players and the philosophy of the league, there will be no national champion or championship event.

The ECNL U13 Division will provide an option for member clubs to introduce their U13 players to the ECNL structure and competition, while focusing on development and learning. 

ECNL U13 Division Basics: 

Participation in the ECNL U13 Division is optional. All clubs must submit a survey response to the league (see below) indicating their desire to participate. Based upon these responses, the league will create conference schedules. Once committing to participate, the commitment is binding and will be enforced as at other ECNL age groups. 
Participating teams in the ECNL U13 Division must complete the ECNL U13 Division season in its entirety as laid out and approved by the league.
The ECNL U13 Division Team must be the “first team” of the club in the U13 age group.
The specific competition format for the ECNL U13 Division will be determined by the league. It may mirror the format of the U14 schedule, or be structured differently, based on participating clubs.
ECNL U13 Division players must be carded under the ECNL and will be subject to ECNL roster rules. Players can play for both the ECNL U13 Team and any other ECNL Team, provided all ECNL Rules and Regulations are followed.
ECNL U13 Division players may participate in any ECNL National Event for which they are age eligible.
There will be no standings or post-season competition for ECNL U13 Division teams.

ECNL Support: 
The ECNL will support the ECNL U13 Division in the following ways:
ECNL will have a U13 Division schedule on the ECNL website
ECNL will host at least one optional (1) ECNL U13 Division Showcase during the season 

Jen Winnagle
Commissioner
Elite Clubs National League


----------



## ESPNANALYST

I am shocked they didn't go to 06 too.
This will be the new norm to replace the revenue they are losing.
Just like 06 Odp.
Of course it works well for everyone because parents believe their DD is super special because she plays on an ECNL team now well played ECNL well played !


----------



## timmyh

Apparently the DA announcement for a U13 league this fall is expected early next week.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/d...lease_ECNL.pdf

Dallas Sting pull out.


----------



## Kicknit22

eastbaysoccer said:


> http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/d...lease_ECNL.pdf
> 
> Dallas Sting pull out.


Makes sense.  Most other regions, besides Atlantic and Northeast have a lot of distance between member clubs.  I don't know the Landscape of the ECNL layout for all the regions, but it looks like Dallas has determined it still represents a better fit for them.  Good choice.


----------



## GoWest

Kicknit22 said:


> Makes sense.  Most other regions, besides Atlantic and Northeast have a lot of distance between member clubs.  I don't know the Landscape of the ECNL layout for all the regions, but it looks like Dallas has determined it still represents a better fit for them.  Good choice.


I agree, if a club either isn't ready "philosophically" or from an operations perspective or parents stage a coup or .....you name it, then staying in whatever league a club is in (ECNL, NPL, Johnnie's Soccer Freaks, etc) is a sure bet to buy time for more discussion. I paste here my thoughts from another thread where the Sting article was brought up....I think Solar, Lonestar, FC Dallas and (newbie) Houston will carry the DA in Texas. Sting is a very good club (not the best but close) and I appreciate their perspective for the 2017-2018 season per their press release. Seems they know their players / parents well. I think the "DA rules" (do we have those yet other than the link to the boys DA rules?) were too restrictive to their liking......and I agree. Rarely is anything "perfect" right out of the gate (Seattle Slew circa 1977 aside) but give them a year to figure their internal issues out and Sting will be a dual membership club. I also wonder if they have the #'s to carry both?


----------



## Sane65

NoGoalItAll said:


> Don't forget high school soccer.  It's vital to development as well.


Help me answer this question:  Can you invite coaches from other ECNL teams to come watch your DD play in her ECNL game prior to May 1st?

Recruiting; No-Tampering. ECNL Member Clubs may recruit players for participation on ECNL Teams at any time during the year (subject to these Regulations). Notwithstanding the foregoing, ECNL Member Clubs may not train, invite a player to train, invite a player to tryout or try out a player from an ECNL Team of another ECNL Member Club prior to May 1 of the ECNL Season, unless the player has been released by their current ECNL Member Club. The months of May and June will therefore be “open” months for players to train and tryout with a variety of ECNL Member Clubs if desired. Note: ECNL coaches and administrators may be subject to the rules of other U.S. Soccer organization members regarding recruitment and tryouts, if they compete in other competitions or leagues outside of the ECNL.


----------



## Dos Equis

Sane65 said:


> Help me answer this question:  Can you invite coaches from other ECNL teams to come watch your DD play in her ECNL game prior to May 1st?


Not sure, but the Blues '03-'01 coaching staff watched the Arsenal vs. Strikers ECNL games this fall in Norco.  Hard to miss them on the sidelines.

Maybe they were acting in their capacity as a DA club.


----------



## GoWest

Any ideas if/when Blues, LAFC Slammers, Surf and West Coast are "holding GDA tryouts?" Actually, I hear they have populated much of their initial rosters with their talented soon-to-be-former top ECNL teams but I also understand they are adding selectively. Anyone heard anything?


----------



## bababooey

GoWest said:


> Any ideas if/when Blues, LAFC Slammers, Surf and West Coast are "holding GDA tryouts?" Actually, I hear they have populated much of their initial rosters with their talented soon-to-be-former top ECNL teams but I also understand they are adding selectively. Anyone heard anything?


I'll bet one dollar that the DA I teams for these four clubs are already set. Not sure about WCFC, but the reputation alone of the other three allows those coaches to just recruit the players they want. No need for an open tryout for those three.

I am curious if GDA clubs are obligated to provide open tryouts when they form teams?


----------



## espola

bababooey said:


> I'll bet one dollar that the DA I teams for these four clubs are already set. Not sure about WCFC, but the reputation alone of the other three allows those coaches to just recruit the players they want. No need for an open tryout for those three.
> 
> I am curious if GDA clubs are obligated to provide open tryouts when they form teams?


Obligated?  I think it works the other way around - are players who get a call from DA recruiters obligated to attend the tryout?


----------



## The Driver

bababooey said:


> I'll bet one dollar that the DA I teams for these four clubs are already set.


I'll take that bet for one dollar.


----------



## Kicker4Life

I was told USSDA directed Clubs away from holding DA specific try-outs.


----------



## MakeAPlay

bababooey said:


> I'll bet one dollar that the DA I teams for these four clubs are already set. Not sure about WCFC, but the reputation alone of the other three allows those coaches to just recruit the players they want. No need for an open tryout for those three.
> 
> I am curious if GDA clubs are obligated to provide open tryouts when they form teams?


No team is obligated to hold an open tryout.


----------



## transplant

GoWest said:


> Any ideas if/when Blues, LAFC Slammers, Surf and West Coast are "holding GDA tryouts?" Actually, I hear they have populated much of their initial rosters with their talented soon-to-be-former top ECNL teams but I also understand they are adding selectively. Anyone heard anything?


Looks like WCFC has their joint ECNL and DA tryout announced now.  Questions are what teams need players?  Certainly smart to advertise them together and cast a wider net but are they giving their current ECNL players the choice of high school or no high school soccer?  Are their ECNL teams staying intact and the have a DA squad to field?  The collection of the clubs in south Orange County have some interesting dynamics to work through!


----------



## Xoloman

This entire season will be one big experiment.  Coaches are going to realize they made mistakes as well as players and families.  Let's get this started so the girls can play.


----------



## Kicker4Life

transplant said:


> Looks like WCFC has their joint ECNL and DA tryout announced now.  Questions are what teams need players?  Certainly smart to advertise them together and cast a wider net but are they giving their current ECNL players the choice of high school or no high school soccer?  Are their ECNL teams staying intact and the have a DA squad to field?  The collection of the clubs in south Orange County have some interesting dynamics to work through!


Ok, that said can anyone explain the ECNL 2 team they are promoting?


----------



## LASTMAN14

transplant said:


> Looks like WCFC has their joint ECNL and DA tryout announced now.  Questions are what teams need players?  Certainly smart to advertise them together and cast a wider net but are they giving their current ECNL players the choice of high school or no high school soccer?  Are their ECNL teams staying intact and the have a DA squad to field?  The collection of the clubs in south Orange County have some interesting dynamics to work through!


Where are WC's 04's in all this? Are they by passing that age group for DA?


----------



## Striker17

DA tryouts were actually ECNL tryouts which were in dec. teams formed for ECNL at that time because 04 DA wasn't announced. Offers were made before Christmas and then DA announced. 
I know majority of team was done in Jan but a few snuck in late


----------



## Striker17

Kicker4Life said:


> I was told USSDA directed Clubs away from holding DA specific try-outs.


Correct there is actual verbiage:

Anyone interested in playing for a Girls' Academy club will need to contact the club directly for specific information regarding the player selection process. The Girls' Development Academy firmly believes that the traditional open tryout is a highly flawed and ineffective model for player identification and evaluation. The expectation is that Academy clubs move to using a more systematic scouting model to identify and recruit new talents and invite these players to trial for an extended period with the current player pool. Clubs may not charge a registration fee for tryouts, which includes fees for equipment, apparel or etc.

Once clubs are announced, you will find club contact information on the Academy website at www.ussoccerda.com.


----------



## Striker17

Well now that they have something called an ECNL 2 team I am sure people will flock to them lol .
Hey why isn't anyone freaking out over that fake team name? Report them to the ECNL Commish!


----------



## Kicknit22

What happened to EGSL? I thought this was the 2nd team to ECNL.  Is there a change a brewin? Maybe, since they have DA and ECNL, they don't want the EGSL thought of as *3rd *team.  Even though it is, but put a 2 next to it and it changes everything.


----------



## Striker17

Egsl was always a fake league ran by the same people who ran SCDSL. 
Still is now it's just even worse- it was a way to play spring when they were ULITTLE. Now it's just a bad bad scene for Spring


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Egsl was always a fake league ran by the same people who ran SCDSL.
> Still is now it's just even worse- it was a way to play spring when they were ULITTLE. Now it's just a bad bad scene for Spring


I like you and the fact that you are all about your player.  The difference between EGSL and DA2 is that EGSL was cleared by the sanctioning league.  DA2 is not.


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> I like you and the fact that you are all about your player.  The difference between EGSL and DA2 is that EGSL was cleared by the sanctioning league.  DA2 is not.


Truth and solid point. But let's be clear here - Hey are all in bed together. Not hard to make a fake league up when you are SCDSL


----------



## transplant

Striker17 said:


> Egsl was always a fake league ran by the same people who ran SCDSL.
> Still is now it's just even worse- it was a way to play spring when they were ULITTLE. Now it's just a bad bad scene for Spring


What EGSL does (did?) for club marketing was 2 things - first gave the affiliate clubs of Surf, Slammers, etc (Murrieta Surf, South Slammers FC, etc)  a brand to add to their #1 team that they could tie to ECNL.  Grabbing that halo effect of ECNL without any real tie to it.  Second it gave primary ECNL clubs some way to make their B teams feel special even though they were still the B team.  True result of both is a spring league that is just a sub-set of SCDSL.  No additional exposure and playing the same set of teams that they likely played in the fall SCDSL league.  Interesting side note - I think often non-EGSL teams win the SCDSL leagues (i.e. Beach, Legends) - because these are the A teams of the non-ECNL clubs.  Bottom line EGSL is all marketing & the same could be achieved with no extra label - just play SCDSL spring league.

Now ECNL2?  More of the same except now on the ECNL2 teams this will be the C team after GDA team and the ECNL team.  I suspect a lot of folks have figured out EGSL means very little to a new brand is required.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Truth and solid point. But let's be clear here - Hey are all in bed together. Not hard to make a fake league up when you are SCDSL


It is true that this is a high level game of chess and unfortunately the girls are caught in the middle.  All a parent can do is be informed and make the best decision for their player based upon that information.


----------



## Striker17

transplant said:


> What EGSL does (did?) for club marketing was 2 things - first gave the affiliate clubs of Surf, Slammers, etc (Murrieta Surf, South Slammers FC, etc)  a brand to add to their #1 team that they could tie to ECNL.  Grabbing that halo effect of ECNL without any real tie to it.  Second it gave primary ECNL clubs some way to make their B teams feel special even though they were still the B team.  True result of both is a spring league that is just a sub-set of SCDSL.  No additional exposure and playing the same set of teams that they likely played in the fall SCDSL league.  Interesting side note - I think often non-EGSL teams win the SCDSL leagues (i.e. Beach, Legends) - because these are the A teams of the non-ECNL clubs.  Bottom line EGSL is all marketing & the same could be achieved with no extra label - just play SCDSL spring league.
> 
> Now ECNL2?  More of the same except now on the ECNL2 teams this will be the C team after GDA team and the ECNL team.  I suspect a lot of folks have figured out EGSL means very little to a new brand is required.


Alas but when this brainchild came out years ago no one flipped out. It was accepted because the almighty ECNL clubs blessed it. Now don't get me wrong I bought the initial "sister team" verbiage but it was a scam.
MAP is right though the only difference was EGSL was "sanctioned" albeit by another paper tiger before they rolled this out. 
People are all fired up about this but I think there are marketing bombs every year. Every single season there is some clown show about something- difference is the big leagues are usually spinning the sh**show and have traditionally been in charge of the mass media with the likes of Beach, Legends, cBad as the red headed step children. In the past we have all been expected to believe that a trip to Sweden or England was "a big deal", that a regional futsal team was "a big deal", that you had to play Spring or you sucked, that EGSL was a "sister team". I can go on and on about the sewage that has spewed from the "bigs"
I have always been a member of an ECNL Club by the way but I also know it's all business. I hold no illusions about what all this is


----------



## jose

The Driver said:


> I'll take that bet for one dollar.


ill take an easy buck also.  One of the clubs DA isn't working out like they thought is was going to. They are in a high speed wobble right now.


----------



## GoWest

jose said:


> ill take an easy buck also.  One of the clubs DA isn't working out like they thought is was going to. They are in a high speed wobble right now.


If I understand correctly, you are speaking of a specific club.....which one?


----------



## B.B.

jose said:


> ill take an easy buck also.  One of the clubs DA isn't working out like they thought is was going to. They are in a high speed wobble right now.


----------



## Striker17

jose said:


> ill take an easy buck also.  One of the clubs DA isn't working out like they thought is was going to. They are in a high speed wobble right now.


One? Try four...easily four.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Striker17 said:


> One? Try four...easily four.


Spill the beans....or just PM me. I'm curious.


----------



## MASA3

LASTMAN14 said:


> Where are WC's 04's in all this? Are they by passing that age group for DA?


WCFC '04 DS is playing DA next season.. The club will also field an ECNL squad, I think AF is coaching that team


----------



## gkrent

MASA3 said:


> . The club will also field an ECNL squad, I think AF is coaching that team


----------



## Kicknit22

Kicker4Life said:


> Spill the beans....or just PM me. I'm curious.


No, no, no!  This is an open forum.  No PMing, lol.  Do tell.  We won't tell anyone.


----------



## Striker17

@Lambchop hey quick question is there extra time allowed at National Cup ? Too soon?


----------



## LASTMAN14

MASA3 said:


> WCFC '04 DS is playing DA next season.. The club will also field an ECNL squad, I think AF is coaching that team


Got it. I asked because they were not listed on the try out schedule. Thought they may have opted out of that age group.


----------



## silverstreak

thoughts on DA for the 02's wanting to stay with their current ecnl team?....which clubs will be strong at the 02/01 DA........and which clubs will be strong at 02 and 01 ECNL ......does anyone know any inside info on specific clubs or teams in the shake up??? which clubs hold  the strongest position in each platform.......


----------



## Striker17

Bakers 
They are staying in ECNL with their current 01 and 02.


----------



## silverstreak

oh wow, what does that do to their DA 02/01?


----------



## Soccer43

I have been told that the best players of the clubs have to be on the DA team per US Soccer.  Is that a US Soccer requirement or optional club to club.  They just like to win and he can't win if he can't sub 5-6 players at one time 3-4 times a game.


----------



## meatsweats

Soccer43 said:


> I have been told that the best players of the clubs have to be on the DA team per US Soccer.  Is that a US Soccer requirement or optional club to club.  They just like to win and he can't win if he can't sub 5-6 players at one time 3-4 times a game.


Where is this mandate that you heard about? Also, do you think DA teams will not want to win? And I have a younger at Blues and have watched Baker kids play. If they wanted to put together a DA 01/02 team, it would be amazing. From what I hear, there are other strong clubs doing the same for their olders. 02 and older are already being recruited, they don't want to shake things up and do NOT want to wonder into the unknown. It's dumb for USSF to implement something across the board for olders. If they wanted to kill ECNL, they should have went age pure and allowed HS play. Until then.....meh!


----------



## pooka

baker 02 can win with no subs ever I believe.... hell they can win playing 8v11.


----------



## silverstreak

silverstreak said:


> thoughts on DA for the 02's wanting to stay with their current ecnl team?....which clubs will be strong at the 02/01 DA........and which clubs will be strong at 02 and 01 ECNL ......does anyone know any inside info on specific clubs or teams in the shake up??? which clubs hold  the strongest position in each platform.......



sorry El Soccer Loco.........i know its probably an old topic, but I have not set aside the time to come here everyday and keep up on all 99 pages of conversation........to busy training my kids, but maybe you have an intelligent reply or possibly some insight?


----------



## gkrent

Soccer43 said:


> I have been told that the best players of the clubs have to be on the DA team per US Soccer. .


Thats inaccurate info.  Exactly how would that be enforced?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

pooka said:


> baker 02 can win with no subs ever I believe.... hell they can win playing 8v11.


My daughter actually scored against them, once. Would that be something for her resume?


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> My daughter actually scored against them, once. Would that be something for her resume?


Actually, if it was recent and you have it on video.  You could send it as a link to a college coaches with her player resume.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Actually, if it was recent and you have it on video.  You could send it as a link to a college coaches with her player resume.


I am just messing around with the resume thing, no video however.


----------



## Soccer

gkrent said:


> Thats inaccurate info.  Exactly how would that be enforced?


It is a rule.  But like you say how would you enforce. It's all subjective.


----------



## Soccer

silverstreak said:


> thoughts on DA for the 02's wanting to stay with their current ecnl team?....which clubs will be strong at the 02/01 DA........and which clubs will be strong at 02 and 01 ECNL ......does anyone know any inside info on specific clubs or teams in the shake up??? which clubs hold  the strongest position in each platform.......



I think this is a question the DOC's of these clubs want to know too.  Meaning it is going to be interesting on who (players) choose what league.

The crap show starts next week.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Soccer said:


> It is a rule.  But like you say how would you enforce. It's all subjective.


I would love to see them try to tell me which team my kid is going to play on.  If I am writing checks I am deciding where those checks are going.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> I would love to see them try to tell me which team my kid is going to play on.  If I am writing checks I am deciding where those checks are going.


Sometimes parents just do what they are told so not to make any waves in fear of retribution, I experienced it on my sons HS baseball team. $1200 a year for a public school to play baseball, the treasurer told me that only 1 of the starting players were paying. If your kid is a stud it is easier to play hardball with the coach, but for those on the bubble not quite that easy.


----------



## pooka

Sheriff Joe said:


> My daughter actually scored against them, once. Would that be something for her resume?


Hell yes!


----------



## Soccer43

pooka said:


> baker 02 can win with no subs ever I believe.... hell they can win playing 8v11.


why would you say that?  When have you ever seen them play without subs?  They sub 5-6 players at a time every 15 minutes or so.  Have watched them play many times over the years and have never seen them play without tons of subs so I don't know if they could win without that.


----------



## NoGoal

meatsweats said:


> Where is this mandate that you heard about? Also, do you think DA teams will not want to win? And I have a younger at Blues and have watched Baker kids play. If they wanted to put together a DA 01/02 team, it would be amazing. From what I hear, there are other strong clubs doing the same for their olders. 02 and older are already being recruited, they don't want to shake things up and do NOT want to wonder into the unknown. It's dumb for USSF to implement something across the board for olders. If they wanted to kill ECNL, they should have went age pure and allowed HS play. Until then.....meh!


Bingo, and I heard the Pepperdine coaches were at the Blues-Baker practice this evening evaluating players. Girls DA doesn't effect the Uolder players who are being recruited.


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> Bingo, and I heard the Pepperdine coaches were at the Blues-Baker practice this evening evaluating players. Girls DA doesn't effect the Uolder players who are being recruited.


I would agree with you that it doesn't "effect Uolders who are being recruited." If you were good enough to catch U of XYZ on yesterdays ECNL team, no worries on tomorrow's GDA team. However, it does effect a players ability to continue to prep for the (D1 Power 5 and high-midmajors) college level in that the level of talent and competition around your player remains at the highest level possible. A parent can put their Unicorn on the "easiest" team in the "easiest" conference or they can keep challenging them on a team that plays with and against good to great competition.


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> I would agree with you that it doesn't "effect Uolders who are being recruited." If you were good enough to catch U of XYZ on yesterdays ECNL team, no worries on tomorrow's GDA team. However, it does effect a players ability to continue to prep for the (D1 Power 5 and high-midmajors) college level in that the level of talent and competition around your player remains at the highest level possible. A parent can put their Unicorn on the "easiest" team in the "easiest" conference or they can keep challenging them on a team that plays with and against good to great competition.


Seriously?  You actually think those players will be taking a step backwards by not playing Girls DA? Laughable at best!

I'm sure the Baker players get more than enough competition among each other in their own practices.  Why do you think the Pepperdine coaches were their evaluating players?  I highly doubt they were saying to each other, but they aren't playing Girls DA. #enoughsaid


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> I would agree with you that it doesn't "effect Uolders who are being recruited." If you were good enough to catch U of XYZ on yesterdays ECNL team, no worries on tomorrow's GDA team. However, it does effect a players ability to continue to prep for the (D1 Power 5 and high-midmajors) college level in that the level of talent and competition around your player remains at the highest level possible. A parent can put their Unicorn on the "easiest" team in the "easiest" conference or they can keep challenging them on a team that plays with and against good to great competition.


BTW, put down the Girls DA kool-aid.  You have had enough to drink already. #lmao


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> Seriously?  You actually think those players will be taking a step backwards by not playing Girls DA? Laughable at best!
> 
> I'm sure the Baker players get more than enough competition among each other in their own practices.  Why do you thnk the Pepperdine coaches were their evaluating players?  #enoughsaid


I really do see your point. Great teams just simply attract but how does a recruiter know that a kid is great? How many times s/he juggles? How hard / accurate s/he shoots the ball in practice? My point is you must MUST challenge your player against better players (not just playing up against bigger meatheads on the same club) to continually get them to improve all areas of their game...psychological, tactical, in game technical, etc.


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> I really do see your point. Great teams just simply attract but how does a recruiter know that a kid is great? How many times s/he juggles? How hard / accurate s/he shoots the ball in practice? My point is you must MUST challenge your player against better players (not just playing up against bigger meatheads on the same club) to continually get them to improve all areas of their game...psychological, tactical, in game technical, etc.


Meatheads at the same club?  It's SoCal Blues who have a litany of top players on every age group committed to Pac12 and top mid-major schools.  

You must be a ulittle parent.


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> BTW, put down the Girls DA kool-aid.  You have had enough to drink already. #lmao


I see the value in the idea just like I embraced ECNL years ago while the naysayers ranted. Whether DA proves in the end to have the same value that ECNL has brought to the girls soccer landscape is yet to be seen. I'm not shy about my DA intrigue.


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> I see the value in the idea just like I embraced ECNL years ago while the naysayers ranted. Whether DA proves in the end to have the same value that ECNL has brought to the girls soccer landscape is yet to be seen. I'm not shy about my DA intrigue.


That was obvious!


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> Meatheads at the same club?  It's SoCal Blues who have a litany of top players on every age group committed to Pac12 and top mid-major schools.
> 
> You must be a ulittle parent.


Blues is an elite club. They have "no meatheads." Str#$@%$ is not an elite club. They have "meatheads." My point was if everything was equal, you want your player on Blues because "all things Blues" will bring the challenge for growth against other elite level competition like "all things Slammers, Surf, Michigan Hawks, Top hat, PDA, etc.

All things = coaches, tech trainers that understand the game and have a vested interest in bettering the "best of the best".


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> That was obvious!


I like that!


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> Blues is an elite club. They have "no meatheads." Str#$@%$ is not an elite club. They have "meatheads." My point was if everything was equal, you want your player on Blues because "all things Blues" will bring the challenge for growth against other elite level competition like "all things Slammers, Surf, Michigan Hawks, Top hat, PDA, etc.
> 
> All things = coaches, tech trainers that understand the game and have a vested interest in bettering the "best of the best".


Um, the discussion was Blues-Baker and you posted can't play older meatheads at the club.  Meaning Blues older teams.  You had no reference to Strikers!

Have you bothered to look up the Blues-Baker teams ECNL record in the U16 and U15 age group? They are both undefeated!  As I posted, they will be fine not playing Girls DA.  If you know the history of the Bakers you will know their Breakaway team didn't play CSL Premier or National League for a year (before ECNL took off).  They did some sort of college campus tour throughout the state instead. The team came back the following year and still performed at a high level, beating top clubs you mentioned.


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> Um, the discussion was Blues-Baker and you posted can't play older meatheads at the club.  Meaning Blues older teams.  You had no reference to Strikers!
> 
> Have you bothered to look up the Blues-Baker teams ECNL record in the U16 and U15 age group? They are both undefeated!  As I posted, they will be fine not playing Girls DA.  If you know the history of the Bakers you will know their Breakaway team didn't play CSL Premier or National League for a year (before ECNL took off).  They did some sort of college campus tour throughout the state instead. The team came back the following year and still performed at a high level, beating top clubs you mentioned.


I think there is some confusion which I will take responsibility for. We are saying pretty much the same thing. Your BluesBaker example is in harmony with the point I was trying to make...they played (or at least attempted to play) better competition via college tour then ECNL. That's my point as well. I can't imagine Rodman accepting anything less.


----------



## meatsweats

Soccer43 said:


> why would you say that?  When have you ever seen them play without subs?  They sub 5-6 players at a time every 15 minutes or so.  Have watched them play many times over the years and have never seen them play without tons of subs so I don't know if they could win without that.


The U13 national championship game was streamed last year and the bench looked very light to me. That would have been the '02 group. This was also during surf cup. If I'm not mistaken, they won that too, with torn teams and age group changes. I'd have to look though. Anyway, the top ECNL teams I have seen, all have a large bench and even bigger roster. It's nothing new.


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> Um, the discussion was Blues-Baker and you posted can't play older meatheads at the club.  Meaning Blues older teams.  You had no reference to Strikers!
> 
> Have you bothered to look up the Blues-Baker teams ECNL record in the U16 and U15 age group? They are both undefeated!  As I posted, they will be fine not playing Girls DA.  If you know the history of the Bakers you will know their Breakaway team didn't play CSL Premier or National League for a year (before ECNL took off).  They did some sort of college campus tour throughout the state instead. The team came back the following year and still performed at a high level, beating top clubs you mentioned.


@NoGoal serious question, are BluBkr u15 and u16 forgoing DA?


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> @NoGoal serious question, are BluBkr u15 and u16 forgoing DA?


IDK, but it wouldn't surprise me any.  The Baker Bros always do their own thing.


----------



## Dos Equis

gkrent said:


> Thats inaccurate info.  Exactly how would that be enforced?


The application/contract signed by each club's DOC when the applied to DA specifically required they place their best players in the club onto the DA teams.  It was (and still is) online, so you can look it up.  It spoke volumes about how US Soccer viewed the role of the parent/player in the actual decision making process of controlling their own development.  Arrogant is a word that comes to mind.

What is not surprising is that clubs who were awarded DA did not make this clear to their members/players at that time nor during tryouts.  Likely clubs also asked themselves how that provision would be enforced, decided it would be difficult, at best, for US Soccer to do so, so they ignored it.  Good for them.

As for Baker Blues and other '02 and up ECNL teams, my bet is that ECNL continues to be a stronger league than DA for these age groups, by a wide margin, even in Socal.


----------



## PLSAP

NoGoal said:


> Meatheads at the same club?  It's SoCal Blues who have a litany of top players on every age group committed to Pac12 and top mid-major schools.
> 
> You must be a ulittle parent.


Yeah, why are TEENAGE GIRLS even being referred to as meatheads? (Not talking about every single player in the world in this example, but) This isn't high school American football where there players get in by being giants and some are, not to be rude, but just simply "meatheads" that are literally just weight and that's about it. Even the least fit and the least knowledgeable player in a club shouldn't be referred to as a meathead.


----------



## Striker17

GoWest said:


> @NoGoal serious question, are BluBkr u15 and
> 
> Apparently yes.
> Also remember everyone you must have an A license. Some mythical coaches do not.
> I will saw again what I always do- Blues is great by me but spare me that "all Blues teams are great" act. Olders maybe - 04 is a hot mess.


----------



## Striker17

GoWest said:


> I see the value in the idea just like I embraced ECNL years ago while the naysayers ranted. Whether DA proves in the end to have the same value that ECNL has brought to the girls soccer landscape is yet to be seen. I'm not shy about my DA intrigue.


Thank you for being reasonable. It's so odd to me that everyone ranting about the DA or "who has concerns" doesn't have a kid in the DA.
It's bizarre


----------



## Kicker4Life

^ or playing in club for that matter.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Thank you for being reasonable. It's so odd to me that everyone ranting about the DA or "who has concerns" doesn't have a kid in the DA.
> It's bizarre


I hear you and I don't have a kid in the DA.  However, if you have been around as long as I have you start to notice patterns and you realize there is a big cycle that you only recognize if you have the benefit of time and perspective.  I think that you are doing what you think is best for your player.  That is what you are supposed to do and I applaud you for that.  My advice to you would be continue to keep your eyes open and don't believe everything you are told by someone that has a financial incentive to tell you something.


----------



## Striker17

You know how much I respect you. In my line of business we recognize patterns as well- in only six years of this I have seen patterns which is why I can so unemotionally watch and react to this club soccer silliness. To me the results and end game are clear. I also see very clear patterns occurring right now that I am shocked other people can not recognize as a seismic shift. That to me is the BAFFLING concern. 
I think what needs to be stated here is the concept of credibility. You have a daughter at the upper echelon and so you have credibility . Your experience and view is valuable. A lot of people making commentary do not and to the gentle reader that needs to be exposed for what it is- garbage.


----------



## Striker17

Re certain coaches:
Certain coaches don't have an A license and can't do a DA 
Certain coaches let their A License lapse so other certain baby coaches are "helping out"
I hope that helps @GoWest
Things really aren't complicated. Everything is spin and so it's important to dig deeper as to why certain decisions are being made


----------



## Striker17

meatsweats said:


> The U13 national championship game was streamed last year and the bench looked very light to me. That would have been the '02 group. This was also during surf cup. If I'm not mistaken, they won that too, with torn teams and age group changes. I'd have to look though. Anyway, the top ECNL teams I have seen, all have a large bench and even bigger roster. It's nothing new.


This is accurate. Teams were split and they came back that Sunday to play. 
It was impressive


----------



## Lambchop

NoGoal said:


> Um, the discussion was Blues-Baker and you posted can't play older meatheads at the club.  Meaning Blues older teams.  You had no reference to Strikers!
> 
> Have you bothered to look up the Blues-Baker teams ECNL record in the U16 and U15 age group? They are both undefeated!  As I posted, they will be fine not playing Girls DA.  If you know the history of the Bakers you will know their Breakaway team didn't play CSL Premier or National League for a year (before ECNL took off).  They did some sort of college campus tour throughout the state instead. The team came back the following year and still performed at a high level, beating top clubs you mentioned.


Just watch out for flying clipboards that hit girls in the face!


----------



## GoWest

Dos Equis said:


> The application/contract signed by each club's DOC when the applied to DA specifically required they place their best players in the club onto the DA teams.  It was (and still is) online, so you can look it up.  It spoke volumes about how US Soccer viewed the role of the parent/player in the actual decision making process of controlling their own development.  Arrogant is a word that comes to mind.
> 
> What is not surprising is that clubs who were awarded DA did not make this clear to their members/players at that time nor during tryouts.  Likely clubs also asked themselves how that provision would be enforced, decided it would be difficult, at best, for US Soccer to do so, so they ignored it.  Good for them.
> 
> As for Baker Blues and other '02 and up ECNL teams, my bet is that ECNL continues to be a stronger league than DA for these age groups, by a wide margin, even in Socal.


Some good points. I think ECNL ruling the roost for the next few years is a stretch. I anticipate an immediate negative impact on ECNL, especially in the SW conference, starting August 1, 2017. Just watch, teams like Heat and even newbie DMC will "all of a sudden" be able to compete. Maybe even sneak into the ECNL champions league. Let's revisit this in about a year or so when the 2017-2018 season is coming to a close. I have zero problem admitting when I am wrong but in this case, I just dont see it happening.

Unless the Baker Bros go their own way, I think we just might see them coaching a couple GDA teams starting in August.


----------



## Lambchop

pooka said:


> baker 02 can win with no subs ever I believe.... hell they can win playing 8v11.


As long as a clip board doesn't come flying through the air to hit a player.


----------



## GoWest

Striker17 said:


> Re certain coaches:
> Certain coaches don't have an A license and can't do a DA
> Certain coaches let their A License lapse so other certain baby coaches are "helping out"
> I hope that helps @GoWest
> Things really aren't complicated. Everything is spin and so it's important to dig deeper as to why certain decisions are being made


Agree! Thanks for the clarification.


----------



## Dos Equis

Striker17 said:


> You know how much I respect you. In my line of business we recognize patterns as well- in only six years of this I have seen patterns which is why I can so unemotionally watch and react to this club soccer silliness. To me the results and end game are clear. I also see very clear patterns occurring right now that I am shocked other people can not recognize as a seismic shift. That to me is the BAFFLING concern.
> I think what needs to be stated here is the concept of credibility. You have a daughter at the upper echelon and so you have credibility . Your experience and view is valuable. A lot of people making commentary do not and to the gentle reader that needs to be exposed for what it is- garbage.


I do not think anyone who has a player active is truly unemotional or objective --  we all have opinions based on experiences and personal goals.  I would be interested in your insight into the results and endgame, though, since the appear to be clear.

While US Soccer has clearly shaken things up, I do not think anyone who has been part of this for a long time would make a prediction, or view this as some sort of paradigm shift, yet.  ECNL, in the end, was not.  The better coaches, clubs and organizations stayed at the top, they just wore a different patch. Yes a few rise, a few fall, but no seismic event.  

And in the end, it will be the players and parents who decide.  US Soccer is going to figure that out.


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> Some good points. I think ECNL ruling the roost for the next few years is a stretch. I anticipate an immediate negative impact on ECNL, especially in the SW conference, starting August 1, 2017. Just watch, teams like Heat and even newbie DMC will "all of a sudden" be able to compete. Maybe even sneak into the ECNL champions league. Let's revisit this in about a year or so when the 2017-2018 season is coming to a close. I have zero problem admitting when I am wrong but in this case, I just dont see it happening.
> 
> Unless the Baker Bros go their own way, I think we just might see them coaching a couple GDA teams starting in August.


Dos Equis stated those age groups as in Uolders will still rule the roost for a few years.


----------



## NoGoal

Striker17 said:


> Re certain coaches:
> Certain coaches don't have an A license and can't do a DA
> Certain coaches let their A License lapse so other certain baby coaches are "helping out"
> I hope that helps @GoWest
> Things really aren't complicated. Everything is spin and so it's important to dig deeper as to why certain decisions are being made


This is not accurate.  I believe US Soccer is giving the DA coaches a couple of years to obtain their A license.  I know a Girls DA club in which only the DOC has an A license.


----------



## dreamz

Dos Equis said:


> The application/contract signed by each club's DOC when the applied to DA specifically required they place their best players in the club onto the DA teams.  It was (and still is) online, so you can look it up.  It spoke volumes about how US Soccer viewed the role of the parent/player in the actual decision making process of controlling their own development.  Arrogant is a word that comes to mind.
> 
> What is not surprising is that clubs who were awarded DA did not make this clear to their members/players at that time nor during tryouts.  Likely clubs also asked themselves how that provision would be enforced, decided it would be difficult, at best, for US Soccer to do so, so they ignored it.  Good for them.
> 
> As for Baker Blues and other '02 and up ECNL teams, my bet is that ECNL continues to be a stronger league than DA for these age groups, by a wide margin, even in Socal.


For the clubs that do not follow the US Soccer mandate about the top players playing in GDA, 2 things will happen:
1. Probation
2. Elimination

The BDA clubs tried this because players, who were committed, wanted to play high school and stay with their regular teams and not participate in BDA. After Step #1 above, they all fell in line and started following the mandates because they all feared #2.

US Soccer isn't going to let clubs with teams like the Baker's decide to opt out of GDA. As soon as they catch wind of this #1 is coming with demands for immediate changes. 
You also have to imagine that if this does start happening nationally, US Soccer will find a way to eliminate ECNL altogether. Call them bullies but they do have all the power. Right or wrong it is what it is.


----------



## NoGoal

Striker17 said:


> Re certain coaches:
> Certain coaches don't have an A license and can't do a DA
> Certain coaches let their A License lapse so other certain baby coaches are "helping out"
> I hope that helps @GoWest
> Things really aren't complicated. Everything is spin and so it's important to dig deeper as to why certain decisions are being made


Here is the website! 

It's the #7 question on application facts. 
http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-faqs


----------



## Kicker4Life

NoGoal said:


> This is not accurate.  I believe US Soccer is giving the DA coaches a couple of years to obtain their A license.  I know a Girls DA club in which only the DOC has an A license.


You are correct.


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> Dos Equis stated those age groups as in Uolders will still rule the roost for a few years.


I caught that too. I still stand by my position even in the "olders" age groups. U17 LAFC / Slammers (or whatever they are going to be called in the GDA) for instance are moving their elite players (and adding a couple elite players no doubt) to GDA. So, after winning back-to-back ECNL national championships at U14 and U15 (team stayed pretty much the same skipping U16 do to age change in 2016) and leading the SW conference so far this season, I'm pretty sure the 2017-2018 ECNL season will be a bit more challenging for them. The rosters will tell the full story in the end. Of course, it's just my opinion but I will look to around this time next year to see if I laid an egg.


----------



## NoGoal

dreamz said:


> For the clubs that do not follow the US Soccer mandate about the top players playing in GDA, 2 things will happen:
> 1. Probation
> 2. Elimination
> 
> The BDA clubs tried this because players, who were committed, wanted to play high school and stay with their regular teams and not participate in BDA. After Step #1 above, they all fell in line and started following the mandates because they all feared #2.
> 
> US Soccer isn't going to let clubs with teams like the Baker's decide to opt out of GDA. As soon as they catch wind of this #1 is coming with demands for immediate changes.
> You also have to imagine that if this does start happening nationally, US Soccer will find a way to eliminate ECNL altogether. Call them bullies but they do have all the power. Right or wrong it is what it is.


US Soccer will find a way to eliminate ECNL altogether?  I didn't know US soccer was the mafia, lmao!


----------



## NoGoal

GoWest said:


> I caught that too. I still stand by my position even in the "olders" age groups. U17 LAFC / Slammers (or whatever they are going to be called in the GDA) for instance are moving their elite players (and adding a couple elite players no doubt) to GDA. So, after winning back-to-back ECNL national championships at U14 and U15 (team stayed pretty much the same skipping U16 do to age change in 2016) and leading the SW conference so far this season, I'm pretty sure the 2017-2018 ECNL season will be a bit more challenging for them. Of course, it's just my opinion but I will look to around this time next year to see if I laid an egg.


This is your 3rd or 4th post referencing Slammers.  My guess is you're DD plays for Slammers.


----------



## GoWest

NoGoal said:


> This is your 3rd or 4th post referencing Slammers.  My guess is you're DD plays for Slammers.


LOL! No but I am a fan of good soccer and that particular team has accomplished alot.


----------



## PLSAP

GoWest said:


> Some good points. I think ECNL ruling the roost for the next few years is a stretch. I anticipate an immediate negative impact on ECNL, especially in the SW conference, starting August 1, 2017. Just watch, teams like Heat and even newbie DMC will "all of a sudden" be able to compete. Maybe even sneak into the ECNL champions league. Let's revisit this in about a year or so when the 2017-2018 season is coming to a close. I have zero problem admitting when I am wrong but in this case, I just dont see it happening.
> 
> Unless the Baker Bros go their own way, I think we just might see them coaching a couple GDA teams starting in August.


Well on the website, it shows they will be in charge of the new 01/02 GDA team, but they are also keeping their ECNL teams, which we will see what players are on and I think that is the debate here rather than IF the Baker Bros will coach a DA team.


----------



## LadiesMan217

PLSAP said:


> Well on the website, it shows they will be in charge of the new 01/02 GDA team, but they are also keeping their ECNL teams, which we will see what players are on and I think that is the debate here rather than IF the Baker Bros will coach a DA team.


The DA will have the current ECNL players. Don't listen to message board noobs. My DD is playing DA.


----------



## shales1002

GoWest said:


> Some good points. I think ECNL ruling the roost for the next few years is a stretch. I anticipate an immediate negative impact on ECNL, especially in the SW conference, starting August 1, 2017. Just watch, teams like Heat and even newbie DMC will "all of a sudden" be able to compete. Maybe even sneak into the ECNL champions league. Let's revisit this in about a year or so when the 2017-2018 season is coming to a close. I have zero problem admitting when I am wrong but in this case, I just dont see it happening.
> 
> Unless the Baker Bros go their own way, I think we just might see them coaching a couple GDA teams starting in August.


Are you saying that players 14-22 aren't good enough to make champions league?

As a parent I would certainly want to know where my dd is 1-18 before I would commit. Seriously that's a lot of time, money, and effort to be all in for a player that's number 11 per the coach. 

@GoWest I'm unsure why you are so sold on something that hasn't even started and doesn't have receipts. Don't take it as a knock against you, I just don't get you constantly going to bat for something that only looks half way decent on paper.

Most parents that I know going into this aren't thrilled about GDA. It's been more of a wait and see approach.

You can't automatically assume it's the best because "they" said so.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> The DA will have the current ECNL players. Don't listen to message board noobs. My DD is playing DA.



I get that she will be in the GDA.  The question is for what team?  Lot's of options in the OC....


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> I get that she will be in the GDA.  The question is for what team?  Lot's of options in the OC....


We are talking baker bums


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> We are talking baker bums


I figured.  They are lucky to have your kid.


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> I figured.  They are lucky to have your kid.


Ummmm.... She is leaning towards a new GDA club right now. Shhhhh.


----------



## pulguita

shales1002 said:


> Are you saying that players 14-22 aren't good enough to make champions league?
> 
> As a parent I would certainly want to know where my dd is 1-18 before I would commit. Seriously that's a lot of time, money, and effort to be all in for a player that's number 11 per the coach.
> 
> @GoWest I'm unsure why you are so sold on something that hasn't even started and doesn't have receipts. Don't take it as a knock against you, I just don't get you constantly going to bat for something that only looks half way decent on paper.
> 
> Most parents that I know going into this aren't thrilled about GDA. It's been more of a wait and see approach.
> 
> You can't automatically assume it's the best because "they" said so.


Ya know MAP and I used to go round and round on this topic.  When ECNL was first introduced in SoCal there were the 8 and then probably 3-4 additional that could always mix it up at any relevant age group.  With DA there is going to be DA and 3-4 teams (ECNL or whatever) that will probably be able to mix it up.  Nothing has really changed since the days when SoCal had the best league in the country called Premier.  There are not more elite players available now then there was 7- 10 years ago. There is only so many to go around.  Who are going to be the top 3-4 outside DA ?  I don't know but it would be fair to reason that getting into Champions league from the SW just got a lot easier.


----------



## NoGoal

pulguita said:


> Ya know MAP and I used to go round and round on this topic.  When ECNL was first introduced in SoCal there were the 8 and then probably 3-4 additional that could always mix it up at any relevant age group.  With DA there is going to be DA and 3-4 teams (ECNL or whatever) that will probably be able to mix it up.  Nothing has really changed since the days when SoCal had the best league in the country called Premier.  There are not more elite players available now then there was 7- 10 years ago. There is only so many to go around.  Who are going to be the top 3-4 outside DA ?  I don't know but it would be fair to reason that getting into Champions league from the SW just got a lot easier.


Pulguita, but US Soccer has spoken and with over 10 Girls DA clubs in SoCal.  There are well over 200+ elite players per age group now.


----------



## dreamz

NoGoal said:


> US Soccer will find a way to eliminate ECNL altogether?  I didn't know US soccer was the mafia, lmao!


They are the governing body and can make life difficult for ECNL. Look how difficult they have made life in youth soccer in general.
They switched to true birth years. 
They added all kinds of mandates, buildout lines, 7 v 7, 9 v 9 eliminating 8 v 8, etc.
They added GDA and are asking for something that will be difficult for clubs and players to commit to.
I don't think ECNL would pose a big problem for them when they are ready to take from there. It's all going to depend on this year and if the best players play GDA. If not, US soccer could mandate some more rules that ECNL wouldn't like with sub rules and no re-entry.
They will tolerate ECNL for a year or so but if the players don't move to GDA look for ECNL to be a distant memory sooner rather than later. If the players are gravitating to GDA then ECNL may survive as a second or third tier league but US Soccer can outspend and out market ECNL at every turn when they are ready to do so.
Ever been to a BDA showcase? No entry fee. ECNL is $1000 per event. If you think the college coach tents are awesome at ECNL, wait until you see how US Soccer does it up. It's impressive. 
US Soccer isn't the mafia but they sure can make things disappear if driven to do so.


----------



## shales1002

pulguita said:


> I don't know but it would be fair to reason that getting into Champions league from the SW just got a lot easier.


Would it be fair to say because Socal is being watered down?


----------



## NoGoal

dreamz said:


> They are the governing body and can make life difficult for ECNL. Look how difficult they have made life in youth soccer in general.
> They switched to true birth years.
> They added all kinds of mandates, buildout lines, 7 v 7, 9 v 9 eliminating 8 v 8, etc.
> They added GDA and are asking for something that will be difficult for clubs and players to commit to.
> I don't think ECNL would pose a big problem for them when they are ready to take from there. It's all going to depend on this year and if the best players play GDA. If not, US soccer could mandate some more rules that ECNL wouldn't like with sub rules and no re-entry.
> They will tolerate ECNL for a year or so but if the players don't move to GDA look for ECNL to be a distant memory sooner rather than later. If the players are gravitating to GDA then ECNL may survive as a second or third tier league but US Soccer can outspend and out market ECNL at every turn when they are ready to do so.
> Ever been to a BDA showcase? No entry fee. ECNL is $1000 per event. If you think the college coach tents are awesome at ECNL, wait until you see how US Soccer does it up. It's impressive.
> US Soccer isn't the mafia but they sure can make things disappear if driven to do so.


That's strong Kool-Aid you've been drinking.  By any chance are you and GoWest drinking from the same pitcher?

I know, I know, your DD is playing Girls DA and is on a top team and will be heavily recruited by all of the best universities in the country. #yeahyeah


----------



## shales1002

dreamz said:


> Ever been to a BDA showcase? No entry fee. ECNL is $1000 per event. If you think the college coach tents are awesome at ECNL, wait until you see how US Soccer does it up. It's impressive.


It should be impressive they only have one per year...in December . Unless you are including the playoffs in June???


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Ya know MAP and I used to go round and round on this topic.  When ECNL was first introduced in SoCal there were the 8 and then probably 3-4 additional that could always mix it up at any relevant age group.  With DA there is going to be DA and 3-4 teams (ECNL or whatever) that will probably be able to mix it up.  Nothing has really changed since the days when SoCal had the best league in the country called Premier.  There are not more elite players available now then there was 7- 10 years ago. There is only so many to go around.  Who are going to be the top 3-4 outside DA ?  I don't know but it would be fair to reason that getting into Champions league from the SW just got a lot easier.


I remember those debates and trying to get your player and her running mate to come over to the darkside.  That would have been more than 40% of the Cal South ODP national champions on one roster.  If we could have had Mauricio coach them that would truly have been something...


----------



## dreamz

NoGoal said:


> That's strong Kool-Aid you've been drinking.  By any chance are you and GoWest drinking from the same pitcher?
> 
> I know, I know, your DD is playing Girls DA and is on a top team and will be heavily recruited by all of the best universities in the country. #yeahyeah


Gosh how did you know?


----------



## jojosoccer

Yes Baker is coaching DA
They will use Larry's (and others) A license until Baker gets his own A. Players through out south county are indeed foregoing HS to play with better players, and play better soccer. The cream rises to the top, and you won't get better playing crappy boot ball in HS.
I know of one club coach telling those players if you don't join this DA team now, there probably will not be a spot for you next year or whenever you decide to consider DA. So that player is planning on joining the DA team due to his threat.


----------



## NoGoal

dreamz said:


> Gosh how did you know?


Because you remind me of A LOT of the posters when my DD was U13 and U14. #wherearetheynow

You teed that one up!


----------



## PLSAP

LadiesMan217 said:


> The DA will have the current ECNL players. Don't listen to message board noobs. My DD is playing DA.


No, I know that. I just meant in reference to what the Baker Bros will do, as coaches, that they will keep their ECNL teams and have a DA team for the same ages.


----------



## jojosoccer

Yes
Baker will have multiple teams- same age.... just like other coaches are doing. Not a big deal to have multiple teams in different leagues.


----------



## Striker17

LadiesMan217 said:


> The DA will have the current ECNL players. Don't listen to message board noobs. My DD is playing DA.


Glad to hear that. For the record that is not the buzz at the Ranch. I am not a newbie


----------



## Striker17

jojosoccer said:


> Yes
> Baker will have multiple teams- same age.... just like other coaches are doing. Not a big deal to have multiple teams in different leagues.


If that is Happening I bet they get a HUGE turnout. They have never had dual teams in the same age group and if you want to play for them that is a pretty great opportunity


----------



## LadiesMan217

Striker17 said:


> Glad to hear that. For the record that is not the buzz at the Ranch. I am not a newbie


Noob


----------



## GoWest

shales1002 said:


> Are you saying that players 14-22 aren't good enough to make champions league?
> 
> As a parent I would certainly want to know where my dd is 1-18 before I would commit. Seriously that's a lot of time, money, and effort to be all in for a player that's number 11 per the coach.
> 
> @GoWest I'm unsure why you are so sold on something that hasn't even started and doesn't have receipts. Don't take it as a knock against you, I just don't get you constantly going to bat for something that only looks half way decent on paper.
> 
> Most parents that I know going into this aren't thrilled about GDA. It's been more of a wait and see approach.
> 
> You can't automatically assume it's the best because "they" said so.


I appreciate your perspective and your approach to how you communicate your position. That's cool. I guess we will see what we see in a year or so. Like I've stated before, I may be wrong but let's at least give it a season before we draw final conclusions.


----------



## Lambchop

jojosoccer said:


> Yes
> Baker will have multiple teams- same age.... just like other coaches are doing. Not a big deal to have multiple teams in different leagues.


I don't think US Soccer will allow coaches the throw clipboards when they are mad.  That may put a crimp in his/their style.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Lambchop said:


> I don't think US Soccer will allow coaches the throw clipboards when they are mad.  That may put a crimp in his/their style.


Skip the clipboard - I hope US Soccer makes Blues top teams learn something other than direct kickball soccer. They have  some great players but what they are learning is only the part of the game and it makes me sad. I would rather my DD learn the whole game and lose than this shit. It's also sad watching the parents on the sidelines eat this crap soccer up.


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> Skip the clipboard - I hope US Soccer makes Blues top teams learn something other than direct soccer. They have  some great players but what they are learning is only the part of the game and it makes me sad. I would rather my DD learn the whole game and lose than this shit. It's also sad watching the parents on the sidelines eat this crap soccer up.


I used to be so hung up on my DD learning possession soccer and trying to find that team.  What I learned in the process after so many years is a player learning multiple ways to play is beneficial, may it be possession, direct, or defensive counter attacking soccer.  Why, because the vast majority of universities do NOT play possession soccer.

Looking back what I overlooked as well as other parents is their DDs developing into a 2 way player.


----------



## LadiesMan217

NoGoal said:


> I used to be so hung up on my DD learning possession soccer and trying to find that team.  What I learned in the process after so many years is a player learning multiple ways to play is beneficial, may it be possession, direct, or defensive counter attacking soccer.  Why, because the vast majority of universities do NOT play possession soccer.
> 
> Looking back what I overlooked as well as other parents is their DDs developing into a 2 way player.


Agree. As long as my DD does not develop into a 3-way until she moves out of the house.


----------



## Dos Equis

NoGoal said:


> Looking back what I overlooked as well as other parents is their DDs developing into a 2 way player.


After one of my DD's best games as a forward, with multiple assists, a goal off a header, several quality crosses and well-placed direct kicks, and some creative passing with very few turnovers, I asked one of the most experienced coaches in women's soccer, someone who has coached more national team players than anyone who is/was not an actual WNT coach, and has sent as many girls on to college as any current coach in Socal, and who had watched her play, what my daughter needed to get to the next level.  In truth, I thought it a rhetorical question and he would tell me she was ready.   His answer -- "She needs to work on her defending."


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/05/01/18/04/20170501-news-u16gnt-will-travel-to-belgium-for-three-matches

Congrats to the 4 SoCal players named to the roster!  That is 20% of the team!!  Funny how 3 of the 4 players play for Arsenal which will not be getting ECNL.  I bet Legends have been hounding them non stop to be part of their GDA team.  It doesn't seem like they need it.


----------



## PLSAP

MakeAPlay said:


> Funny how 3 of the 4 players play for Arsenal which will not be getting ECNL.


Wait what do you mean by that?


----------



## bababooey

PLSAP said:


> Wait what do you mean by that?


MAP definitely doesn't need anyone speaking on her behalf, but I suspect she meant to say "Funny how 3 of the 4 players play for Arsenal which will not be getting *GDA*."


----------



## bababooey

MakeAPlay said:


> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/05/01/18/04/20170501-news-u16gnt-will-travel-to-belgium-for-three-matches
> 
> Congrats to the 4 SoCal players named to the roster!  That is 20% of the team!!  Funny how 3 of the 4 players play for Arsenal which will not be getting ECNL.  I bet Legends have been hounding them non stop to be part of their GDA team.  It doesn't seem like they need it.


Congrats to the four So Cal players that made the team. I am especially interested in the 04 that made the team. Any idea which player? I wonder why US Soccer would place the 04 on the GU16 team versus the GU15 team? Speaking along the same lines, why are the 03's not playing on the GU15 team?


----------



## MakeAPlay

PLSAP said:


> Wait what do you mean by that?


I meant that won't be getting GDA and that they will be playing ECNL this year.  Sorry sometimes I am typing on a phone and not a computer or tablet and I type something that isn't that clear.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> I meant that won't be getting GDA and that they will be playing ECNL this year.  Sorry sometimes I am typing on a phone and not a computer or tablet and I type something that isn't that clear.


Not such a bad thing, right? Arsenal plays a more direct style, don't they?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Not such a bad thing, right? Arsenal plays a more direct style, don't they?


I am not sure what you are asking.


----------



## gkrent

bababooey said:


> Congrats to the four So Cal players that made the team. I am especially interested in the 04 that made the team. Any idea which player? I wonder why US Soccer would place the 04 on the GU16 team versus the GU15 team? Speaking along the same lines, why are the 03's not playing on the GU15 team?


They might want to see how the 04 plays with the U16s.  The way US soccer decides who plays in what age group is, shall we say, "fluid"


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> I am not sure what you are asking.


Ecnl isn't bad at this point and does Arsenal play direct?
Just trying to find a good fit in the next year or so for my Daughter.


----------



## pulguita

NoGoal said:


> I used to be so hung up on my DD learning possession soccer and trying to find that team.  What I learned in the process after so many years is a player learning multiple ways to play is beneficial, may it be possession, direct, or defensive counter attacking soccer.  Why, because the vast majority of universities do NOT play possession soccer.
> 
> Looking back what I overlooked as well as other parents is their DDs developing into a 2 way player.


Dude do not beat yourself up for the possession factor.  If your kid can play possession any other style can be learned.   Possession teaches all the technical skills which become the tools of the game.  It is not true for the opposite.  Your last sentence sums it up.  If possession could be taught so easily than all the colleges would be doing it right?  And most of them learned the opposite from their wonderful ECNL environment.  Just look at our past ODP teams that dominate everyone.  A few could play possession  but most had no clue.  Our teams could have been off the charts with the talent but most weren't taught possession so we always would end up with sort a  possession.  Your kid will be fine.  Oh yeah and in my kids review?  We want you to be Busquets and Xavi but most importantly?  We want you to play nasty defense!


----------



## chiefs

NoGoal said:


> I used to be so hung up on my DD learning possession soccer and trying to find that team.  What I learned in the process after so many years is a player learning multiple ways to play is beneficial, may it be possession, direct, or defensive counter attacking soccer.  Why, because the vast majority of universities do NOT play possession soccer.
> 
> Looking back what I overlooked as well as other parents is their DDs developing into a 2 way player.


I agree being versatile with Direct v. Possession but at the end of the day I want my DD playing for a possession coach. She will get 4/5 times more touches in a game v Direct. I also believe it's much easier to learn Direct v . Possession. My DD can do either one but it took much longer to learn nuances of possession soccer. Again, at the end of day she's more versatile.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Ecnl isn't bad at this point and does Arsenal play direct?
> Just trying to find a good fit in the next year or so for my Daughter.


I haven't seen the team play so I am not sure how they play.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Dude do not beat yourself up for the possession factor.  If your kid can play possession any other style can be learned.   Possession teaches all the technical skills which become the tools of the game.  It is not true for the opposite.  Your last sentence sums it up.  If possession could be taught so easily than all the colleges would be doing it right?  And most of them learned the opposite from their wonderful ECNL environment.  Just look at our past ODP teams that dominate everyone.  A few could play possession  but most had no clue.  Our teams could have been off the charts with the talent but most weren't taught possession so we always would end up with sort a  possession.  Your kid will be fine.  Oh yeah and in my kids review?  We want you to be Busquets and Xavi but most importantly?  We want you to play nasty defense!


My kid's review wanted her to take more risks.  Especially regarding switching the field and chipping the back line when they are out of position.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> I haven't seen the team play so I am not sure how they play.


Thank you.


----------



## NoGoal

pulguita said:


> Dude do not beat yourself up for the possession factor.  If your kid can play possession any other style can be learned.   Possession teaches all the technical skills which become the tools of the game.  It is not true for the opposite.  Your last sentence sums it up.  If possession could be taught so easily than all the colleges would be doing it right?  And most of them learned the opposite from their wonderful ECNL environment.  Just look at our past ODP teams that dominate everyone.  A few could play possession  but most had no clue.  Our teams could have been off the charts with the talent but most weren't taught possession so we always would end up with sort a  possession.  Your kid will be fine.  Oh yeah and in my kids review?  We want you to be Busquets and Xavi but most importantly?  We want you to play nasty defense!


I hear you! IMO, the closest team my DD played on which resembled anything to a possession style was her Cal-South ODP team and I attribute that to the talent on the team.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> I hear you! IMO, the closest team my DD played on which resembled anything to a possession style was her Cal-South ODP team and I attribute that to the talent on the team.


And I know a team with practically the same talent and they play garbage soccer.


----------



## NoGoal

chiefs said:


> I agree being versatile with Direct v. Possession but at the end of the day I want my DD playing for a possession coach. She will get 4/5 times more touches in a game v Direct. I also believe it's much easier to learn Direct v . Possession. My DD can do either one but it took much longer to learn nuances of possession soccer. Again, at the end of day she's more versatile.


True, as long as a player has the 1st touch, skill and IQ.  They can learn possession style of play. Example, IMO Luca Modric from Real Madrid has the abilities to play for Barca.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Sheriff Joe said:


> Thank you.


MAP,you will never see me get personal with you again, my bad.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> MAP,you will never see me get personal with you again, my bad.


Did hell just freeze over and I missed the news report?


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Did hell just freeze over and I missed the news report?


Don't fucking tell anyone.


----------



## NoGoal

Sheriff Joe said:


> Don't fucking tell anyone.


Get a room you to.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

NoGoal said:


> Get a room you to.


I've been hacked!


----------



## Sidekick

MakeAPlay said:


> http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/05/01/18/04/20170501-news-u16gnt-will-travel-to-belgium-for-three-matches
> 
> Congrats to the 4 SoCal players named to the roster!  That is 20% of the team!!  Funny how 3 of the 4 players play for Arsenal which will not be getting ECNL.  I bet Legends have been hounding them non stop to be part of their GDA team.  It doesn't seem like they need it.


----------



## Soccer43

If the Arsenal girls stay at their ECNL team then how does US Soccer explain that they don't need to be on a GDA team?  If the goal of the GDA is to properly train girls for US Soccer then why would US soccer not insist they train on a GDA team?  If they stay on an ECNL team then who needs the GDA?  I think that is a bit of a predicament for US Soccer - they didn't think that Arsenal deserved a GDA but yet three of the current roster comes from Arsenal.


----------



## NoGoal

Soccer43 said:


> If the Arsenal girls stay at their ECNL team then how does US Soccer explain that they don't need to be on a GDA team?  If the goal of the GDA is to properly train girls for US Soccer then why would US soccer not insist they train on a GDA team?  If they stay on an ECNL team then who needs the GDA?  I think that is a bit of a predicament for US Soccer - they didn't think that Arsenal deserved a GDA but yet three of the current roster comes from Arsenal.


The irony!


----------



## Dos Equis

Soccer43 said:


> If the Arsenal girls stay at their ECNL team then how does US Soccer explain that they don't need to be on a GDA team?  If the goal of the GDA is to properly train girls for US Soccer then why would US soccer not insist they train on a GDA team?  If they stay on an ECNL team then who needs the GDA?  I think that is a bit of a predicament for US Soccer - they didn't think that Arsenal deserved a GDA but yet three of the current roster comes from Arsenal.


One of the players was a product of neither the ECNL nor the DA, but was part of a pretty good Fullerton Rangers squad, until recently.  
"Where they come" from is a great mystery US Soccer is still trying to solve, or more accurate, resolve.


----------



## CuriousOne

bababooey said:


> Congrats to the four So Cal players that made the team. I am especially interested in the 04 that made the team. Any idea which player? I wonder why US Soccer would place the 04 on the GU16 team versus the GU15 team? Speaking along the same lines, why are the 03's not playing on the GU15 team?


The 04 has been in the 02 GNT pool since last year. Naturally, she's smaller than the other girls, but she's incredibly skilled and has very high soccer IQ. On top of that, she's very speedy and shifty, so even though she's small, she knows when to get rid of the ball and therefore avoids getting knocked off.

Before the age group change, she was playing on an 01/02 team and was running circles around the older players, and some really good players! In GNT, there tends to be one or two very special yet younger players who will be playing up with older girls. The 04 is in the GNT U15 pool with the new cycle this year.  She's just been called up for the U16 tournament.


----------



## CuriousOne

Dos Equis said:


> One of the players was a product of neither the ECNL nor the DA, but was part of a pretty good Fullerton Rangers squad, until recently.
> "Where they come" from is a great mystery US Soccer is still trying to solve, or more accurate, resolve.


While it's true one of the girls isn't a product of Arsenal until last year, there are 4 other girls who are (2 weren't called up for the U16 tournament). So there are a total of 5 players (2 '02s and 3 '03s) in the GNT pool, 4 are Arsenal "homegrown".  That's still pretty impressive coming from one team. 

The question is why Arsenal isn't killing it in 02 ECNL. They've never missed more than 2 GNT players for a game, and they have lost even with full strength. In addition to the GNT players, they have other players on the ODP team, yet they are currently 5th in the 02 ECNL SW standings...


----------



## Soccer43

Yes, that is one of the big mysteries in the SW ECNL.  Not only have they been invited to the GNT camps but also a large group of the team played together on the championship Cal South ODP team.  Is it a coaching issue?  or too many individual superstars that don't know how to play together successfully?   I have heard many times the complaint about US Soccer selecting "superstars" but missing the boat about the girls being able to play as a team.


----------



## transplant

CuriousOne said:


> The question is why Arsenal isn't killing it in 02 ECNL. They've never missed more than 2 GNT players for a game, and they have lost even with full strength. In addition to the GNT players, they have other players on the ODP team, yet they are currently 5th in the 02 ECNL SW standings...


That is interesting.  I wonder is it is a case of what often seems to happen on higher level teams where there are 3-4 exceptional players and a cast of really good players filling out the roster.  Could be that Arsenal talent drops off a little quicker than other ECNL teams in the area or there is a big upset to the team dynamics when 2 GNT players are missing?  Hard to say looking in but an interesting observation none the less.


----------



## CuriousOne

Soccer43 said:


> Yes, that is one of the big mysteries in the SW ECNL.  Not only have they been invited to the GNT camps but also a large group of the team played together on the championship Cal South ODP team.  Is it a coaching issue?  or too many individual superstars that don't know how to play together successfully?   I have heard many times the complaint about US Soccer selecting "superstars" but missing the boat about the girls being able to play as a team.


Speaking of playing as a team, the CalSouth 01 ODP team with at least 8 players who have been called up to the YNT (2 played up in U17 World Cup last year) lost 4-1 to the FL team (no YNT players) in the ODP National Championship. Granted the CalSouth team doesn't regularly play together, but neither does the FL ODP team.


----------



## NoGoal

transplant said:


> That is interesting.  I wonder is it is a case of what often seems to happen on higher level teams where there are 3-4 exceptional players and a cast of really good players filling out the roster.  Could be that Arsenal talent drops off a little quicker than other ECNL teams in the area or there is a big upset to the team dynamics when 2 GNT players are missing?  Hard to say looking in but an interesting observation none the less.


There are 2 other teams that I know of in another age group.  1 had 3 YNT players and the other had 4 YNT players and both never won an ECNL Championship nor their own conference title.  So it's NOT an isolated issue.


----------



## transplant

NoGoal said:


> There are 2 other teams that I know of in another age group.  1 had 3 YNT players and the other had 4 YNT players and both never won an ECNL Championship nor their own conference title.  So it's NOT an isolated issue.


I guess that also points to the corollary to this argument - which is top/elite players don't make the team successful.  The middle 8-10 non-YNT, non-ODP could be the ultimate source of a team's ability to win it all.


----------



## LASTMAN14

transplant said:


> I guess that also points to the corollary to this argument - which is top/elite players don't make the team successful.  The middle 8-10 non-YNT, non-ODP could be the ultimate source of a team's ability to win it all.


Agreed. Blue collar players. Every team has them from youth to the professional level.


----------



## PLSAP

CuriousOne said:


> While it's true one of the girls isn't a product of Arsenal until last year, there are 4 other girls who are (2 weren't called up for the U16 tournament). So there are a total of 5 players (2 '02s and 3 '03s) in the GNT pool, 4 are Arsenal "homegrown".  That's still pretty impressive coming from one team.
> 
> The question is why Arsenal isn't killing it in 02 ECNL. They've never missed more than 2 GNT players for a game, and they have lost even with full strength. In addition to the GNT players, they have other players on the ODP team, yet they are currently 5th in the 02 ECNL SW standings...


I don't know if you are including the other two that came from Fullerton Rangers, but they are also in the YNT team pool. In all honesty, half of that team isn't completely "Arsenal homegrown" as several of those players were pulled in/came from other clubs, and I believe there is even a player who lives in Vegas, as I was told by someone who is close to the team. (HOWEVER, there are hardly any teams, if any, in the big clubs that have 100% of their players from the same club since they started club, even though that team is an extreme example and then this can turn into an ethics debate about RB) .

On the other note, I think there are way more consistent YNT players on that team:

There is a circuit of 3 '03's in the U15/16 pool/team
There are 4 '02's in the U16/17 pool/team

That isn't incluiding those who were cycled out and those who have recieved a call up here and there.

About their league play: 
From my understanding, they have chemistry problems. Up until a year ago, it was a completely different team, and only half the current team was there last season. They have some pretty phenomenal players, including both the ones that were pulled in but also the ones from the core team (RB was pretty brutal with the cuts to make the ECNL team and to be dropped down to the EGSL team). The problem is getting them to be good together.


----------



## NoGoal

transplant said:


> I guess that also points to the corollary to this argument - which is top/elite players don't make the team successful.  The middle 8-10 non-YNT, non-ODP could be the ultimate source of a team's ability to win it all.


IMO, has to do with team chemistry, how much the girls like each other translates to how much they will play for each other.  Not to mention, the coach!  

If it was all about talent and how many YNT players a team has.  Stanford should be the current 3 peat NCAA college cup champs.


----------



## LadiesMan217

If your DD could join any 2001/2002 DA team, which team would you as a parent want her to join and why?


----------



## outside!

LadiesMan217 said:


> If your DD could join any 2001/2002 DA team, which team would you as a parent want her to join and why?


A team where she got along with her teammates, where we got along with the parents, and the coach respects the players while teaching a possession/passing style of soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> If your DD could join any 2001/2002 DA team, which team would you as a parent want her to join and why?


I don't know the age groups very well but for my player it would be Surf or Beach.  It depends upon the coach.  At Beach it would have to be Mauricio, Jeff or Rob Demelo.  At Surf I would be a little more flexible but would like Pauly.  They coach the style of play that suits my player and are most similar to her coach she had for most of her career and that had the most impact.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> If your DD could join any 2001/2002 DA team, which team would you as a parent want her to join and why?


If your player could join any college team what team would it be and why?


----------



## Lambchop

Soccer43 said:


> Yes, that is one of the big mysteries in the SW ECNL.  Not only have they been invited to the GNT camps but also a large group of the team played together on the championship Cal South ODP team.  Is it a coaching issue?  or too many individual superstars that don't know how to play together successfully?   I have heard many times the complaint about US Soccer selecting "superstars" but missing the boat about the girls being able to play as a team.


Or maybe politics.


----------



## MakeAPlay

http://www.soccerwire.com/news/clubs/youth-girls/sky-blue-fc-new-york-sc-partner-to-join-u-s-soccer-girls-da/

Notice the last line.


----------



## windnsea26

For those that are in DA, is your team planning on going to Lakewood Ranch, FL this winter for that DA Showcase?  I've been trying to find some concrete dates so I can start looking into flights already but haven't found anything.  I did look at the previous results and it looks like it could be in the first weekend of December for about 5 days.


----------



## 2SoccerGirls

Question- with rumors about girls being offered special deals to come to practice only one day a week and girls flying in from other states, is there any requirement that rostered players have to commit to actually attending the 3-4 weekly practices?  Seems like US Soccer keeps such detailed records about starting percentages and games played, but do they look at who is actually coming to practice or is that up to the individual coach/club?  I have no clue if the rumors are true- I'm just curious. (I'm sure there are always ways to make exceptions even if there is a rule- lol)


----------



## OCsoccerMANiac

2SoccerGirls said:


> Question- with rumors about girls being offered special deals to come to practice only one day a week and girls flying in from other states, is there any requirement that rostered players have to commit to actually attending the 3-4 weekly practices?  Seems like US Soccer keeps such detailed records about starting percentages and games played, but do they look at who is actually coming to practice or is that up to the individual coach/club?  I have no clue if the rumors are true- I'm just curious. (I'm sure there are always ways to make exceptions even if there is a rule- lol)


From what I have heard and read, this is pretty regulated by random audits and logs. I'm sure the DA will not allow any "special deals or exceptions" regardless of the club


----------



## Justafan

outside! said:


> A team where she got along with her teammates, where we got along with the parents, and the coach respects the players while teaching a possession/passing style of soccer.


I guess you're not going to be playing DA.


----------



## GoWest

ECNL said:


> Have you checked the u14-18 ECNL tables lately?  Strikers requires relegation out of ECNL.....which is likely going to  happen since they are on probation.  Give them DA?  I think not.  You should seriously consider moving your DD ASAP.


Is Strikers still on probation?

One would guess that leaving underperforming clubs in the SW --- like Sereno, Heat, Strikers --- alone would be a good choice? Next season's softer ECNL SW conference might balance out the level of competition for those types of clubs / talent? It's all about the money and membership I would also guess?


----------



## PLSAP

GoWest said:


> Is Strikers still on probation?
> 
> One would guess that leaving underperforming clubs in the SW --- like Sereno, Heat, Strikers --- alone would be a good choice? Next season's softer ECNL SW conference might balance out the level of competition for those types of clubs / talent? It's all about the money and membership I would also guess?


Why are they on probation?


----------



## bababooey

GoWest said:


> Is Strikers still on probation?
> 
> One would guess that leaving underperforming clubs in the SW --- like Sereno, Heat, Strikers --- alone would be a good choice? Next season's softer ECNL SW conference might balance out the level of competition for those types of clubs / talent? It's all about the money and membership I would also guess?


With ECNL under assault from the GDA, I don't think this is the time to start pulling the badge from member clubs.


----------



## SoccerLife75

Looks like we will see our first action of DA teams at Legends College Cup.  LAPFC, Legends, and Beach Academy some ECNL teams and DA2 teams will be there as well.

Looks like a lot of Academy teams still trying to get there rosters together.


----------



## transplant

I would have to guess that the clubs with ECNL and DA are scrambling to lock things down.  Some ECNL teams still have post season in June & July - but they also have girls out shopping and making commitments.  I would be surprised to see teams from those clubs make public appearances before surf cup.  The non-ECNL clubs were able to (or chose to) get a much earlier start in putting things together.

I would expect it is really turbulent for these ECNL/DA clubs in 2001 & 2002 age groups.  Lots of decisions and lot of moving parts for players, coaches and parents as they plan for both this year and next year.


----------



## CaliKlines

transplant said:


> I would have to guess that the clubs with ECNL and DA are scrambling to lock things down.  Some ECNL teams still have post season in June & July - but they also have girls out shopping and making commitments.  I would be surprised to see teams from those clubs make public appearances before surf cup.  The non-ECNL clubs were able to (or chose to) get a much earlier start in putting things together.


Except for those non-ECNL teams that will be competing for a National Championship in Dallas, TX in late July.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

SoccerLife75 said:


> Looks like we will see our first action of DA teams at Legends College Cup.  LAPFC, Legends, and Beach Academy some ECNL teams and DA2 teams will be there as well.
> 
> Looks like a lot of Academy teams still trying to get there rosters together.


Where have you seen the schedule or the list of accepted teams?


----------



## MakeAPlay

CaliKlines said:


> Except for those non-ECNL teams that will be competing for a National Championship in Dallas, TX in late July.


You mean the "national" championship...


----------



## SoccerLife75

Simisoccerfan said:


> Where have you seen the schedule or the list of accepted teams?


It was up this morning, at https://tgs.totalglobalsports.com/public/master.aspx?eid=400
Looks like they took it down.  For 2003's Beach had two teams Academy 1 & 2.  All other Acedemy 2's were in Flight 2.


----------



## CaliKlines

Simisoccerfan said:


> Where have you seen the schedule or the list of accepted teams?


Here is where the schedule will be posted...and the official word is "soon".

https://tgs.totalglobalsports.com/public/master.aspx?eid=400

Here is the informational material for the event at the most highly regarded soccer facility on the west coast...Silverlakes Soccer Complex.

http://www.legendsfc.net/college-showcase/


----------



## Sandypk

SoccerLife75 said:


> It was up this morning, at https://tgs.totalglobalsports.com/public/master.aspx?eid=400
> Looks like they took it down.  For 2003's Beach had two teams Academy 1 & 2.  All other Acedemy 2's were in Flight 2.


So Beach DA and Beach DPL will be playing each other in flight one?


----------



## The Driver

Sandypk said:


> So Beach DA and Beach DPL will be playing each other in flight one?


If the director of the tournament (or whatever they are called in soccer) can avoid it they shouldn't play each other until the finals but sometimes it's can't be avoided. Big Ups to Beach for putting both teams in flight 1. Beach steel sharpens Beach steel.


----------



## Sandypk

The Driver said:


> If the director of the tournament (or whatever they are called in soccer) can avoid it they shouldn't play each other until the finals but sometimes it's can't be avoided. Big Ups to Beach for putting both teams in flight 1. Beach steel sharpens Beach steel.


Are there finals in Showcase events?


----------



## The Driver

Sandypk said:


> Are there finals in Showcase events?


 So what's the problem?


----------



## The Driver

Only problem would be a D1 teams  getting smacked by a D2.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

The Driver said:


> Only problem would be a D1 teams  getting smacked by a D2.


Ouch! There would be hell to pay.


----------



## The Driver

Sheriff Joe said:


> Ouch! There would be hell to pay.


 remember it's only a showcase


----------



## The Driver

It's not like picking your homecoming game....  Haha


----------



## Soccer43

I would be careful not to put too much stock in the scores of these games or how the teams play.  It is way too early for the rosters to be even close to finalized.  Non-ECNL teams are having to wait for some of their ECNL players to join the DA team while the ECNL season concludes and ECNL clubs that are expecting their players to hang around for their DA team might see those players leaving for other DA teams as soon as the ECNL season is done.


----------



## Hired Gun

Soccer43 said:


> I would be careful not to put too much stock in the scores of these games or how the teams play.  It is way too early for the rosters to be even close to finalized.  Non-ECNL teams are having to wait for some of their ECNL players to join the DA team while the ECNL season concludes and ECNL clubs that are expecting their players to hang around for their DA team might see those players leaving for other DA teams as soon as the ECNL season is done.


Baseball errr...  Soccer Free Agency at it's finest... That Dodger infield of Garvey, Lopes, Russell and Cey is no longer - get use to "Free Agency" in youth soccer - it's here to stay...unfortunately...


----------



## Dos Equis

Soccer43 said:


> I would be careful not to put too much stock in the scores of these games or how the teams play.  It is way too early for the rosters to be even close to finalized.  Non-ECNL teams are having to wait for some of their ECNL players to join the DA team while the ECNL season concludes and ECNL clubs that are expecting their players to hang around for their DA team might see those players leaving for other DA teams as soon as the ECNL season is done.


In summary, you appear to be asking us not to judge the non-ECNL DA clubs' performance yet, because they are going to get a lot of ECNL players joining them in July.

Between commitments to prior teams, ODP training, school and family conflicts (prom, graduations, etc.), vacations, and injuries, my experience is that the roster issues faced by each team in June (and throughout the summer) tend to average out, and the performance of these teams is a pretty good indication of what their seasons will look like, with few exceptions.  

Also, DA tryouts (even for olders) began almost 2 months before this showcase, non-ECNL DA clubs have been actively recruiting ECNL players since the DA list was released, and ECNL players are free to tryout with other ECNL clubs May 1st, so I respecfully disagree that rosters are far from finalized.  If a team is in need of an impact player at this point, or trying to fill a gap in their starting 11, the coach has not done his/her job, and/or the team needs to adjust its expectations.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

The Driver said:


> remember it's only a showcase


Maybe, our 02 team beat our 01 team in a scrimmage and the 01 parents were ready to quit.
Pretty funny.


----------



## Kicknit22

I agree with 2X, there won't be any major shifting going on.  DA teams are formed for the most part. Anyone who was planning to move, should have. If they didn't, they may have missed the boat.


----------



## The Driver

Kicknit22 said:


> I agree with 2X, there won't be any major shifting going on.  DA teams are formed for the most part. Anyone who was planning to move, should have. If they didn't, they may have missed the boat.


 Most teams are still scrambling. Not an oraganized scramble like Tom Brady but a scramble like a chicken with its head chopped off.


----------



## GoWest

Sheriff Joe said:


> Maybe, our 02 team beat our 01 team in a scrimmage and the 01 parents were ready to quit.
> Pretty funny.


Is your 01 DA team made up of all former ECNL players or is it a new team altogether?


----------



## The Driver

Sheriff Joe said:


> Maybe, our 02 team beat our 01 team in a scrimmage and the 01 parents were ready to quit.
> Pretty funny.


It happens all the time. Big Ups to your 02s


----------



## SoccerLife75

Dos Equis said:


> In summary, you appear to be asking us not to judge the non-ECNL DA clubs' performance yet, because they are going to get a lot of ECNL players joining them in July.
> 
> Between commitments to prior teams, ODP training, school and family conflicts (prom, graduations, etc.), vacations, and injuries, my experience is that the roster issues faced by each team in June (and throughout the summer) tend to average out, and the performance of these teams is a pretty good indication of what their seasons will look like, with few exceptions.
> 
> Also, DA tryouts (even for olders) began almost 2 months before this showcase, non-ECNL DA clubs have been actively recruiting ECNL players since the DA list was released, and ECNL players are free to tryout with other ECNL clubs May 1st, so I respecfully disagree that rosters are far from finalized.  If a team is in need of an impact player at this point, or trying to fill a gap in their starting 11, the coach has not done his/her job, and/or the team needs to adjust its expectations.



Looks like even though they put Non DA teams in flight 1 they really did not pair up any 2nd team with a DA1 team.


----------



## Lambchop

Kicknit22 said:


> I agree with 2X, there won't be any major shifting going on.  DA teams are formed for the most part. Anyone who was planning to move, should have. If they didn't, they may have missed the boat.


We shall all have to wait until National ECNL finals are over,  for olders July 8  and youngers June 27.  We shall see. Rosters won't be final until August.


----------



## Lambchop

Sandypk said:


> Are there finals in Showcase events?


No


----------



## Dos Equis

Lambchop said:


> We shall all have to wait until National ECNL finals are over,  for olders July 8  and youngers June 27.  We shall see. Rosters won't be final until August.


While this year is unique in terms of the start of the DA, most experienced players and parents know that the time to change is almost over, and most teams know what their rosters will look like.  Players may be fulfilling their ECNL commitments, but barring a team falling apart, necessitating the movemement of their remaining top players, the players who are moving have practiced with hteir new teams already.

Now, if you are implying people are planning to move and have yet to informed their current coaches (and their teams), then the teams who get these players I somewhat pity.


----------



## Sane65

Dos Equis said:


> While this year is unique in terms of the start of the DA, most experienced players and parents know that the time to change is almost over, and most teams know what their rosters will look like.  Players may be fulfilling their ECNL commitments, but barring a team falling apart, necessitating the movemement of their remaining top players, the players who are moving have practiced with hteir new teams already.
> 
> Now, if you are implying people are planning to move and have yet to informed their current coaches (and their teams), then the teams who get these players I somewhat pity.


Only somewhat?  You imply that these players are not top players.  Yet none of us know the true motivation and reasons for club moves.  Each player is unique in their drive, skill, quality and IQ.  These are tumultuous times with so many changes happening in girls soccer.  There should be support for all of these kids who are trying to find the right fit... experience or not.


----------



## The Driver

Rosters are. Finalized until


Sane65 said:


> Only somewhat?  You imply that these players are not top players.  Yet none of us know the true motivation and reasons for club moves.  Each player is unique in their drive, skill, quality and IQ.  These are tumultuous times with so many changes happening in girls soccer.  There should be support for all of these kids who are trying to find the right fit... experience or not.


 Especially when they hit this age entering high school.


----------



## The Driver

@MakeAPlay Pugh=Tevin  Campell


----------



## Kicknit22

Lambchop said:


> We shall all have to wait until National ECNL finals are over,  for olders July 8  and youngers June 27.  We shall see. Rosters won't be final until August.


Maybe for the clubs with both DA and ECNL.


----------



## The Driver

It's really hard keeping an alpha off that school team bus heading to that rival school.


----------



## Kicknit22

The Driver said:


> It's really hard keeping an alpha off that school team bus heading to that rival school.


Huh?


----------



## Soccer43

Dos Equis said:


> In summary, you appear to be asking us not to judge the non-ECNL DA clubs' performance yet, because they are going to get a lot of ECNL players joining them in July.
> 
> Between commitments to prior teams, ODP training, school and family conflicts (prom, graduations, etc.), vacations, and injuries, my experience is that the roster issues faced by each team in June (and throughout the summer) tend to average out, and the performance of these teams is a pretty good indication of what their seasons will look like, with few exceptions.
> 
> Also, DA tryouts (even for olders) began almost 2 months before this showcase, non-ECNL DA clubs have been actively recruiting ECNL players since the DA list was released, and ECNL players are free to tryout with other ECNL clubs May 1st, so I respecfully disagree that rosters are far from finalized.  If a team is in need of an impact player at this point, or trying to fill a gap in their starting 11, the coach has not done his/her job, and/or the team needs to adjust its expectations.[/QUOTE
> I was talking about all/any of the teams that might be playing in showcases or tournaments in June.  Current ECNL rosters will change as players move from an ECNL team to another DA club that may be a better fit or closer.  Just because you are on an ECNL team at an ECNL/DA club does not mean that is the club you would be at if you have other choices.  There are players coming from other teams that are not freed up yet to be fully committed to practices and games because they are still in their ECNL season and going to play in the championships.  They may have already decided to make a change but that change may not happen till Surf Cup.  You cannot look at teams playing in the Legends Showcase and make a decision about whether their DA team will be strong or not.  Also, some ECNL players have not told their clubs yet about leaving because of concerns about problems from the club.


----------



## Soccer43

I was talking about all/any of the teams that might be playing in showcases or tournaments in June. Current ECNL rosters will change as players move from an ECNL team to another DA club that may be a better fit or closer. Just because you are on an ECNL team at an ECNL/DA club does not mean that is the club you would be at if you have other choices. There are players coming from other teams that are not freed up yet to be fully committed to practices and games because they are still in their ECNL season and going to play in the championships. They may have already decided to make a change but that change may not happen till Surf Cup. You cannot look at teams playing in the Legends Showcase and make a decision about whether their DA team will be strong or not. Also, some ECNL players have not told their clubs yet about leaving because of concerns about problems from the club.


----------



## Kicknit22

I don't completely disagree Soccer43. But, yes, the Legends Showcase will certainly give an indication of how EVERY team might be.  I mean, come on, it's not like the team that plays in it is going to completely change.  So they might be missing 1 or 2 players MAYBE.  Any team that is reliant on 1 or 2 players to be good, isn't good anyway.


----------



## Striker17

No lots of changes still. People not adding until Aug 1, vacation (and I mean big time vacation because a lot of people aren't playing this summer because they know we have to go to four days a week), etc.
I agree the tournaments are not a good indicator.
Another very prevalent issue we saw was that with all of this mixing our coaches are just getting to know people and where they play. 
It's a wild summer


----------



## Striker17

So for the record I do believe when a roster is as awesome as some of these are I can only assume it will be a great team but as it has been pointed out to me a lot of rosters have not gotten things done so...it's all about chemistry .


----------



## Kicknit22

Striker17 said:


> No lots of changes still. People not adding until Aug 1, vacation (and I mean big time vacation because a lot of people aren't playing this summer because they know we have to go to four days a week), etc.
> I agree the tournaments are not a good indicator.
> Another very prevalent issue we saw was that with all of this mixing our coaches are just getting to know people and where they play.
> It's a wild summer


Wow! Seriously? There are clubs waiting until Aug.1 to form their teams?


----------



## Striker17

Kicknit22 said:


> Wow! Seriously? There are clubs waiting until Aug.1 to form their teams?


It's not "forming" it's adding. It's a process. Again the days of a Jan tryout and the team is the team is gone. People can be added or dropped until the start of a DA season.


----------



## Dos Equis

Striker17 said:


> It's not "forming" it's adding. It's a process. Again the days of a Jan tryout and the team is the team is gone. People can be added or dropped until the start of a DA season.


That has always been the case, Aug 1st was always the freeze date, and players are added until then. But I also expect, as has always been the case, most DA rosters are 90-100% complete by 6/1.   People may take a break until the 8/1 start date, but what about those USSDA Surf Cup Brackets in late July?


----------



## Kicknit22

Striker17 said:


> It's not "forming" it's adding. It's a process. Again the days of a Jan tryout and the team is the team is gone. People can be added or dropped until the start of a DA season.


Okay, I get that. But to say that the teams you see now aren't gong to be the same Aug. 1, is a big stretch.  Besides, who cares how these teams do out of the gate, anyway? None of this matters.  What matters is, how did your DD Showcase herself? In the long run, this is what matters at these events. Am I wrong?


----------



## Striker17

No and I never contended otherwise. 
The very premise that people actually care about team scores and "how they do at tournaments" which is what all of you were talking about is not appropriate.
The focus should always be your player and how she develops. 
Coaches recruit players not teams. People don't get that.


----------



## Justafan

Striker17 said:


> No and I never contended otherwise.
> The very premise that people actually care about team scores and "how they do at tournaments" which is what all of you were talking about is not appropriate.
> The focus should always be your player and how she develops.
> Coaches recruit players not teams. People don't get that.


Granted, W's & L's shouldn't matter and it should all be about the player, especially when your on a platform with maximum exposure to college recruiters and YNT's.  However, scores and standings ALWAYS matter in SoCal.  It's our nature, we can't help it.  We're like that scorpion hitching a ride on the frog.


----------



## Striker17

Justafan said:


> Granted, W's & L's shouldn't matter and it should all be about the player, especially when your on a platform with maximum exposure to college recruiters and YNT's.  However, scores and standings ALWAYS matter in SoCal.  It's our nature, we can't help it.  We're like that scorpion hitching a ride on the frog.


I hear you but I am quite content letting success on the field or in the classroom speak for itself. There are plenty of highly sought after and talented girls who aren't in the DA who will do just fine. One exciting player I know continues to play at a local club you never see represented and is frequently contacted by the "bigs"
I am just saying you have to have perspective. W and L don't matter and definitely not at 04 and below. They just do not


----------



## C.A.M.

Justafan said:


> Granted, W's & L's shouldn't matter and it should all be about the player, especially when your on a platform with maximum exposure to college recruiters and YNT's.  However, scores and standings ALWAYS matter in SoCal.  It's our nature, we can't help it.  We're like that scorpion hitching a ride on the frog.


I am cracking up because it's true.  I want to see my girl and her teammates develop and perform well.


----------



## Striker17

We all want that- its human nature. That being said a W Doesn't mean that they are playing or performing well. If a W is tied to your happiness while watching youth sports then a serious self reflection needs to occur.
I am a winner and a competitor. I just get tired of seeing the same thing over and over again in this sport. My children all play Three sports- and no I don't see this ANYWHERE else and the closest I have seen to this delusion are the dance/cheer/gymnastics parents.


----------



## C.A.M.

My 06 son lost in the Finals at Cerritos this weekend.  He is a keeper and  had what may be his finest set of 6 games ever.  Sadly made some errors in the Finals and they lost 4-3.  Someone was consoling me saying he was fabulous because I looked annoyed and angry and I was.  Not because he made errors, but that a team playing kickball won and that they coaches were bragging about how they worked so hard to develop the players.  

Not hating on the victory because that team played hard! I just don't see what the kids get out of it in the long run beyond a medal and some bragging rights.  It was an exciting game because of the events of the game, but frustrating to see because it stopped being fun to watch. 

I love seeing these kids execute and perform like the big ballers on tv with the passing, skills and organization.  The win at all cost on this level is not something I enjoy participating in at this stage of the game.  Coaches need wins, but kids need development and it's such a hard line to walk balanced.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> We all want that- its human nature. That being said a W Doesn't mean that they are playing or performing well. If a W is tied to your happiness while watching youth sports then a serious self reflection needs to occur.
> I am a winner and a competitor. I just get tired of seeing the same thing over and over again in this sport. My children all play Three sports- and no I don't see this ANYWHERE else and the closest I have seen to this delusion are the dance/cheer/gymnastics parents.


Gymnastics parents are a pretty special bunch....


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> My 06 son lost in the Finals at Cerritos this weekend.  He is a keeper and  had what may be his finest set of 6 games ever.  Sadly made some errors in the Finals and they lost 4-3.  Someone was consoling me saying he was fabulous because I looked annoyed and angry and I was.  Not because he made errors, but that a team playing kickball won and that they coaches were bragging about how they worked so hard to develop the players.
> 
> Not hating on the victory because that team played hard! I just don't see what the kids get out of it in the long run beyond a medal and some bragging rights.  It was an exciting game because of the events of the game, but frustrating to see because it stopped being fun to watch.
> 
> I love seeing these kids execute and perform like the big ballers on tv with the passing, skills and organization.  The win at all cost on this level is not something I enjoy participating in at this stage of the game.  Coaches need wins, but kids need development and it's such a hard line to walk balanced.


I'm glad that you noticed the true situation.  This is why some of us parents of older players sound jaded and skeptical.  We have been through a lot of the hype, sales pitches and lies and once you get to the end of the road you are left with what occurred not with what was supposed to occur and the two are oftentimes not in alignment.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Gymnastics parents are a pretty special bunch....


Along with softball parents too.  They earned their place in this conversation.


----------



## Striker17

I don't know softball parents dangit. Baseball parents are colorful but more fun so they can be tolerated. Perhaps it's that the games are 18 hours long so food and drink go a long way in creating unity. 
If I hear one more person talk about scholarships and wins at 04 I may lose it.
Also the latest soccer crazy thing...@Makeaplay what is your take on marketing a ten year old? Parents are creating Instagrams for their children and "running them". What's your take on that?


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I'm glad that you noticed the true situation.  This is why some of us parents of older players sound jaded and skeptical.  We have been through a lot of the hype, sales pitches and lies and once you get to the end of the road you are left with what occurred not with what was supposed to occur and the two are oftentimes not in alignment.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


Thank you.  We realized it a few years ago.  I must admit the hard part was getting out of the "big name only" mind state and changed it to the right name mind state.  I knew it after my girl aged up top flight and performed well.  Came back to her age group the next season and the coach treated her poorly.  I'm amazed he never told an 10 year old he was proud of her courage and desire to challenge herself.  Knew right then this is all a business.

Now we act like our kids agents for soccer and not their parents.  We scout teams that fit their goals, desires and needs to develop and that we can accommodate (including driving 1.5-2 hrs one way).  They go and work on the field and communicate with their coaches like pros do.  We oversee and stamp the big decisions and counsel them on how their careers are going.  Each has a situation tailored for them and we gave up the dream of one club for one family.  

I really don't think most people could do what we do because having two separate relationship situations with your children is so unconventional.  We do what works for us.  In fact this is what saved my relationship with my daughter.  

I know this sounds personal, but I put it out there because I meet and speak to a lot of parents on the fields facing the same choices.  What the DA system has taught me is these coaches want as little contact with us crazy parents as possible and us crazy parents have a hard time dealing with that. They want a coach/player relationship and guess what - so do our kids.  It's a lot easier to handle when you know the coach is doing his/her job.


----------



## chargerfan

Striker17 said:


> I don't know softball parents dangit. Baseball parents are colorful but more fun so they can be tolerated. Perhaps it's that the games are 18 hours long so food and drink go a long way in creating unity.
> If I hear one more person talk about scholarships and wins at 04 I may lose it.
> Also the latest soccer crazy thing...@Makeaplay what is your take on marketing a ten year old? Parents are creating Instagrams for their children and "running them". What's your take on that?


My take is those parents need a life! Anyone who thinks constant parental pressure, overinvolvement, and making a sport top priority is a good idea, should take a look at Tiger Woods. His dad really did a number on him, and it left him a messed up guy.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> Thank you.  We realized it a few years ago.  I must admit the hard part was getting out of the "big name only" mind state and changed it to the right name mind state.  I knew it after my girl aged up top flight and performed well.  Came back to her age group the next season and the coach treated her poorly.  I'm amazed he never told an 10 year old he was proud of her courage and desire to challenge herself.  Knew right then this is all a business.
> 
> Now we act like our kids agents for soccer and not their parents.  We scout teams that fit their goals, desires and needs to develop and that we can accommodate (including driving 1.5-2 hrs one way).  They go and work on the field and communicate with their coaches like pros do.  We oversee and stamp the big decisions and counsel them on how their careers are going.  Each has a situation tailored for them and we gave up the dream of one club for one family.
> 
> I really don't think most people could do what we do because having two separate relationship situations with your children is so unconventional.  We do what works for us.  In fact this is what saved my relationship with my daughter.
> 
> I know this sounds personal, but I put it out there because I meet and speak to a lot of parents on the fields facing the same choices.  What the DA system has taught me is these coaches want as little contact with us crazy parents as possible and us crazy parents have a hard time dealing with that. They want a coach/player relationship and guess what - so do our kids.  It's a lot easier to handle when you know the coach is doing his/her job.


How did it "save" your relationship with her? A parent-child bond should not be in trouble over something as dumb as soccer.


----------



## C.A.M.

Striker17 said:


> I don't know softball parents dangit. Baseball parents are colorful but more fun so they can be tolerated. Perhaps it's that the games are 18 hours long so food and drink go a long way in creating unity.
> If I hear one more person talk about scholarships and wins at 04 I may lose it.
> Also the latest soccer crazy thing...@Makeaplay what is your take on marketing a ten year old? Parents are creating Instagrams for their children and "running them". What's your take on that?


Striker I hope you don't mind if I answer.

I have no problem with it because I understand how the hype machine works, but I just can't f'ing do it.  I am a substance over style guy who believes development usually occurs out of the spotlight whether that is the training program or the school work.  A little bit of glam here and there is cool, but all day every day for a player whose medals and wins mean absolutely nothing in the long run seems more like a marketing test than anything.  

I hope shorty can show up and perform at a high level set of tryouts or in my boys case, 2.5 month trial.  Substance matters most.


----------



## Striker17

See that's why I ask. It's all medals and achievements. It's also trainings and ice baths. It's CRAZY


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> Thank you.  We realized it a few years ago.  I must admit the hard part was getting out of the "big name only" mind state and changed it to the right name mind state.  I knew it after my girl aged up top flight and performed well.  Came back to her age group the next season and the coach treated her poorly.  I'm amazed he never told an 10 year old he was proud of her courage and desire to challenge herself.  Knew right then this is all a business.
> 
> Now we act like our kids agents for soccer and not their parents.  We scout teams that fit their goals, desires and needs to develop and that we can accommodate (including driving 1.5-2 hrs one way).  They go and work on the field and communicate with their coaches like pros do.  We oversee and stamp the big decisions and counsel them on how their careers are going.  Each has a situation tailored for them and we gave up the dream of one club for one family.
> 
> I really don't think most people could do what we do because having two separate relationship situations with your children is so unconventional.  We do what works for us.  In fact this is what saved my relationship with my daughter.
> 
> I know this sounds personal, but I put it out there because I meet and speak to a lot of parents on the fields facing the same choices.  What the DA system has taught me is these coaches want as little contact with us crazy parents as possible and us crazy parents have a hard time dealing with that. They want a coach/player relationship and guess what - so do our kids.  It's a lot easier to handle when you know the coach is doing his/her job.


What I also learned are club coaches are poor communicators, especially since most parents are older than the club coaches.


----------



## C.A.M.

chargerfan said:


> How did it "save" your relationship with her? A parent-child bond should not be in trouble over something as dumb as soccer.


Great question and I agree with you 100%.

She was pretty damaged coming out the aforementioned situation.  She was ready to give up on soccer.  Our relationship was very rocky because I refused to let her give up on her dream.  Not because she has to make it, but because I'll be damned if she walks away from anything in life she loves because of someone else's problems being dumped on her.  She saw me as the bad guy in the situation because I was the only person saying things were wrong and it had to change because they won everything.  She was too young and inexperienced in life to see what I was doing.  She thought it was about me and so did everyone else.

Now 3 years later she sees the whole picture.  She is happy being her in every situation and makes the choices she needs to for her.  Went to 2 different teams in 3 years where she knew no one and rocked it and got back to the top of the food chain.  Her mom and I never spoke one word to her DA coach until after she got the offer.  I am extremely proud of the young lady.  In the meantime we had to devise a way to work with each other because there was animosity, etc...


----------



## NoGoal

chargerfan said:


> My take is those parents need a life! Anyone who thinks constant parental pressure, overinvolvement, and making a sport top priority is a good idea, should take a look at Tiger Woods. His dad really did a number on him, and it left him a messed up guy.


TW downward spiral happened after his dad died.  Read the SI article on TW.  It's a great read.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> What I also learned are club coaches are poor communicators, especially since most parents are older than the club coaches.


Exactly.  Which is why transparency and communication from the club and coach are one of our main check points.


----------



## C.A.M.

Tiger is painful watch man.  Life balance is so important.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Thank you.  We realized it a few years ago.  I must admit the hard part was getting out of the "big name only" mind state and changed it to the right name mind state.  I knew it after my girl aged up top flight and performed well.  Came back to her age group the next season and the coach treated her poorly.  I'm amazed he never told an 10 year old he was proud of her courage and desire to challenge herself.  Knew right then this is all a business.
> 
> Now we act like our kids agents for soccer and not their parents.  We scout teams that fit their goals, desires and needs to develop and that we can accommodate (including driving 1.5-2 hrs one way).  They go and work on the field and communicate with their coaches like pros do.  We oversee and stamp the big decisions and counsel them on how their careers are going.  Each has a situation tailored for them and we gave up the dream of one club for one family.
> 
> I really don't think most people could do what we do because having two separate relationship situations with your children is so unconventional.  We do what works for us.  In fact this is what saved my relationship with my daughter.
> 
> I know this sounds personal, but I put it out there because I meet and speak to a lot of parents on the fields facing the same choices.  What the DA system has taught me is these coaches want as little contact with us crazy parents as possible and us crazy parents have a hard time dealing with that. They want a coach/player relationship and guess what - so do our kids.  It's a lot easier to handle when you know the coach is doing his/her job.



Amazing!!  You have it figured out.  Your daughter and her career are in good hands.  Good job!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> I don't know softball parents dangit. Baseball parents are colorful but more fun so they can be tolerated. Perhaps it's that the games are 18 hours long so food and drink go a long way in creating unity.
> If I hear one more person talk about scholarships and wins at 04 I may lose it.
> Also the latest soccer crazy thing...@Makeaplay what is your take on marketing a ten year old? Parents are creating Instagrams for their children and "running them". What's your take on that?


At 10 I would be more concerned with the right fit for my player and her touches on the ball.  Marketing to coaches comes much later IMHO.  I am a Gen X'er so outside of a Linkedin and a not so secret twitter account to keep track of my player I am not very social media savvy.  At the end of the day my goal has always been to set my children up for success in whatever they want to do.  Part of setting them up for success is getting them to take control of their journey (with parental guidance/interference along the way of course!) and to emphasize the value of education as well as the experiential learning and values that come with being a part of a team.  Everything else just wasn't part of my player's journey.  We never sent out videos and she only went to the camp of the school that she currently attends.  Our focus was always on her being prepared for her opportunities that we knew would come so the wins and losses and hype meant very little to us.  Not to mention that the iphone had just come out her first year of club so social media wasn't nearly as prevalent as it is today.


----------



## timbuck

chargerfan said:


> My take is those parents need a life! Anyone who thinks constant parental pressure, overinvolvement, and making a sport top priority is a good idea, should take a look at Tiger Woods. His dad really did a number on him, and it left him a messed up guy.


He was living the great life for a lot of years though.  I'm sure his dad, mom and those around him thought "This was amazing.  We did everything right. Look at how great our 25 year old son is doing.  He's on top of the world."
Hard to tell what damage was done or help was given until a little later in life.
(A bit off topic. Sorry)


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> At 10 I would be more concerned with the right fit for my player and her touches on the ball.  Marketing to coaches comes much later IMHO.  I am a Gen X'er so outside of a Linkedin and a not so secret twitter account to keep track of my player I am not very social media savvy.  At the end of the day my goal has always been to set my children up for success in whatever they want to do.  Part of setting them up for success is getting them to take control of their journey (with parental guidance/interference along the way of course!) and to emphasize the value of education as well as the experiential learning and values that come with being a part of a team.  Everything else just wasn't part of my player's journey.  We never sent out videos and she only went to the camp of the school that she currently attends.  Our focus was always on her being prepared for her opportunities that we knew would come so the wins and losses and hype meant very little to us.  Not to mention that the iphone had just come out her first year of club so social media wasn't nearly as prevalent as it is today.


Old School


----------



## Lambchop

Striker17 said:


> Uh did you read my post? Apparently not.
> OM plays Boys DA. So doubtful she will get passed up. She can run circles around pretty much anyone. Sorry sad but true.
> As for your other assessment I think there is nothing wrong with focusing on your child's technique and play and speed until 13-14. They played 6-10. They all play futsal with boys. Then you introduce a highly skilled player into a system with a coach you trust. Shock you avoid burnout and overuse injuries. Maybe even she has joy of the game like CM when she came over from Brazil after no formal training?
> I believe they are doing just fine.
> Again wouldn't expect people on this board to be able to look at anything with fresh eyes or objectivity. It doesn't fit the needs of the herd


Ahhh, but wait, puberty will hit soon.


----------



## Striker17

Lambchop said:


> Ahhh, but wait, puberty will hit soon.


I have not seen the drop off at our age group I expected yet. When does it usually happen- right before high school?
We still have hanger ons.


----------



## The Driver

Striker17 said:


> I have not seen the drop off at our age group I expected yet. When does it usually happen- right before high school?
> We still have hanger ons.


You play in a controlled environment it won't show up until high school or the latter parts of the Championship season in whatever circuit you play in.


----------



## Striker17

The Driver said:


> You play in a controlled environment it won't show up until high school or the latter parts of the Championship season in whatever circuit you play in.


We play in the same circuit I believe.


----------



## C.A.M.

Striker17 said:


> We play in the same circuit I believe.


All the veteran parents have told me the drop offs happen a few different times: 
1. Going to the big field and higher level of competition.  CHECK.
2. Ages 14-16.  High School, opposite sex, injuries, lack of interest, no longer developing. - this is where we are now.
3. Ages 18-19.  College, opposite sex, injuries, lack of interest, no longer developing.


----------



## Striker17

We are two now as well- early stage though and I have not seen this decline I was warned of. 
On some ways I feel like it's worse because we have so many "platforms" now


----------



## C.A.M.

Striker17 said:


> We are two now as well- early stage though and I have not seen this decline I was warned of.
> On some ways I feel like it's worse because we have so many "platforms" now


Aha. Now I understand the controlled environment statement and have to say I agree mostly. 

I still believe the Academy curriculum will facilitate the drop off.  I am only speaking of the way out Academy is being coached of course and using that as a marker.  Not trying to get into that argument again


----------



## Striker17

C.A.M. said:


> Aha. Now I understand the controlled environment statement and have to say I agree mostly.
> 
> I still believe the Academy curriculum will facilitate the drop off.  I am only speaking of the way out Academy is being coached of course and using that as a marker.  Not trying to get into that argument again


I absolutely understand your intent don't worry about me!
I was speaking more philosophically and wondering if we have seen a decrease in those drop offs due to the increase in available platforms for families to pursue.
In the past it seemed a little bit more funneled- and ECNL year start was a big drop off year. I have not seen that at all this year


----------



## C.A.M.

Striker17 said:


> I absolutely understand your intent don't worry about me!
> I was speaking more philosophically and wondering if we have seen a decrease in those drop offs due to the increase in available platforms for families to pursue.
> In the past it seemed a little bit more funneled- and ECNL year start was a big drop off year. I have not seen that at all this year


Awesome cause I just want good conversation and information.  

There is a gigantic drop off between the Academy team we are on now and the SCSDL Tier 1 squad we were on last season for a few reasons and athleticism isn't even the highest.   With a lot of people scrambling to find an Academy the selection process seems to have been more selective and refined.  I am seeing these differences:

1. Players with better attitudes towards teamwork (less drama so far). Fingers crossed.  The girls are really working for each other and the game play style is more "advanced" in my opinion.

2. Players with higher soccer IQs.  This is leading to more robust and intense practice sessions focused on real development of the team and not just select players.   The pace is vastly increased mentally and physically and the A level coaching is more direct and clear.  Classroom workdays and physical fitness only days allow for growth to occur off the field also.

My DD hasn't been this happy as a player who loves to learn the game and play with other smart players in years.  Just dropped her off and her excitement level for her 3rd practice of the week was just as high as the first day.  She loves the challenge.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> I absolutely understand your intent don't worry about me!
> I was speaking more philosophically and wondering if we have seen a decrease in those drop offs due to the increase in available platforms for families to pursue.
> In the past it seemed a little bit more funneled- and ECNL year start was a big drop off year. I have not seen that at all this year


There are two reasons that you might not have seen it since I believe that you are truly paying attention.  

1. You are at the beginning of the drop off.   

There are lots of players, lots of teams and lots of leagues.  Losing a player here or there on every team is pretty common especially when you consider how today is the age of having to switch teams every year due to some top down mandate.  This is usually balanced out by new players coming onto a team from other clubs and new players entering club for the first time.  This creates new teams which makes it seem endless.  There becomes a point where many lower level players start giving up club for other activities (rec soccer, HS soccer, dance, lacrosse, rowing, etc.) especially if the expense is a considerable amount. At the beginning of the decline it really starts among the players that aren't trying to do something in/with soccer.  It starts at the fringes with the players that aren't passionate about it.  When you are in a crowd of people heading towards a ledge, it's easy to miss seeing the ledge.  Especially when you are at the back.  The shift is subtle but there is a shift happening.

2. The higher the level your player competes at the more you are insulated from the  dropoff.

There are plenty of players that are not competing at the highest level yet and that are just waiting on the chance to take an available spot on a high level team.  In addition there are top players that migrate to higher level teams later in the process for various reasons.  This causes the rosters of the top teams in an age group to always be at capacity with a seemingly endless supply of mercenaries ready to come in and take an existing players minutes.  On the highest levels roster sizes don't peak until U16/17 and it could be upwards of 25 players with 7 not getting to play.  It is a " first world" problem.  Plenty of the lower level teams barely have 15-16 players.

I'm going to clue you into some bad news about the top teams with the truly elite players.  If you haven't already figured it out the top players tend to miss a lot of time for YNT camps which can significantly alter the outcome of individual games.  With next year being a U17 WWC year I imagine some teams are going to be SIGNIFICANTLY AFFECTED.

Here is a way to describe it:

Think of now as a gradual decline in the number of overall players which leads to less teams.  Think about club soccer as a huge multi room nightclub.  When you are in the front part of the line and turn around it seems really busy.   As you filter in and the club reaches capacity it's hard to tell how many people are in there especially if you get into the VIP room.  People come and go throughout the night but at some point the amount of people leaving exceeds the amount coming in.  It's still hard to notice all that if you are in the VIP room because that is always at its capacity.  What you will notice is that even in the VIP room towards the end of the night the real ballers have after parties to go to and even that section is empty before the doors close.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## Striker17

Thank you! Always so insightful!


----------



## NoGoal

Striker17 said:


> I absolutely understand your intent don't worry about me!
> I was speaking more philosophically and wondering if we have seen a decrease in those drop offs due to the increase in available platforms for families to pursue.
> In the past it seemed a little bit more funneled- and ECNL year start was a big drop off year. I have not seen that at all this year


What age group is your DD?  Statistics are in 6 yrs an entire roster almost turns over. Look back at your DDs U10 team and how many of those players are still playing or going to be recruited to play college soccer.

Lucking back on my DDs U11 club team 7 years ago.  4 players on that team  ended up playing college soccer this fall.  Of those 4 only 1 is still at that club.


----------



## C.A.M.

At MakeAPlay and NoGoal - Damn thanks for the knowledge drop. It is so important having that perspective of what we are really dealing with.  No joke this is a journey.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> There are two reasons that you might not have seen it since I believe that you are truly paying attention.
> 
> 1. You are at the beginning of the drop off.
> 
> There are lots of players, lots of teams and lots of leagues.  Losing a player here or there on every team is pretty common especially when you consider how today is the age of having to switch teams every year due to some top down mandate.  This is usually balanced out by new players coming onto a team from other clubs and new players entering club for the first time.  This creates new teams which makes it seem endless.  There becomes a point where many lower level players start giving up club for other activities (rec soccer, HS soccer, dance, lacrosse, rowing, etc.) especially if the expense is a considerable amount. At the beginning of the decline it really starts among the players that aren't trying to do something in/with soccer.  It starts at the fringes with the players that aren't passionate about it.  When you are in a crowd of people heading towards a ledge, it's easy to miss seeing the ledge.  Especially when you are at the back.  The shift is subtle but there is a shift happening.
> 
> 2. The higher the level your player competes at the more you are insulated from the  dropoff.
> 
> There are plenty of players that are not competing at the highest level yet and that are just waiting on the chance to take an available spot on a high level team.  In addition there are top players that migrate to higher level teams later in the process for various reasons.  This causes the rosters of the top teams in an age group to always be at capacity with a seemingly endless supply of mercenaries ready to come in and take an existing players minutes.  On the highest levels roster sizes don't peak until U16/17 and it could be upwards of 25 players with 7 not getting to play.  It is a " first world" problem.  Plenty of the lower level teams barely have 15-16 players.
> 
> I'm going to clue you into some bad news about the top teams with the truly elite players.  If you haven't already figured it out the top players tend to miss a lot of time for YNT camps which can significantly alter the outcome of individual games.  With next year being a U17 WWC year I imagine some teams are going to be SIGNIFICANTLY AFFECTED.
> 
> Here is a way to describe it:
> 
> Think of now as a gradual decline in the number of overall players which leads to less teams.  Think about club soccer as a huge multi room nightclub.  When you are in the front part of the line and turn around it seems really busy.   As you filter in and the club reaches capacity it's hard to tell how many people are in there especially if you get into the VIP room.  People come and go throughout the night but at some point the amount of people leaving exceeds the amount coming in.  It's still hard to notice all that if you are in the VIP room because that is always at its capacity.  What you will notice is that even in the VIP room towards the end of the night the real ballers have after parties to go to and even that section is empty before the doors close.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


You know what I am waiting for is someone savvy enough to sue both US Soccer and the clubs.  In the pay to play system I as a customer am paying for a product.  That product includes the coaching staff, the team and its team environment and the events that my team is in or has the potential to be in.  In essence the devolpment environment for my kid and the exposure for my kid.  If enough high level players are missing due to US Soccer I would say that environment is greatly reduced or destroyed.  Hence breach of contract?  Further since US Soccer doesn't give a shit about anybody but themselves I would figure out how to drag them through the mud.  They certainly didn't give a crap about Manchester Cup, ECNL, High School or National championships?


----------



## C.A.M.

pulguita said:


> You know what I am waiting for is someone savvy enough to sue both US Soccer and the clubs.  In the pay to play system I as a customer am paying for a product.  That product includes the coaching staff, the team and its team environment and the events that my team is in or has the potential to be in.  In essence the devolpment environment for my kid and the exposure for my kid.  If enough high level players are missing due to US Soccer I would say that environment is greatly reduced or destroyed.  Hence breach of contract?  Further since US Soccer doesn't give a shit about anybody but themselves I would figure out how to drag them through the mud.  They certainly didn't give a crap about Manchester Cup, ECNL, High School or National championships?


Ok I don't get the rage.  I thought the idea was to have players develop enough to go to those US Teams.  I know the clubs love it because they get to advertise they are able to develop kids well and use them as the example.  I understand politics play apart, but the clubs still get the free publicity and can recruit better players due to it.

I agree we play for development and need to receive it, but I don't see how this makes your point.  Please explain.


----------



## pulguita

C.A.M. said:


> Ok I don't get the rage.  I thought the idea was to have players develop enough to go to those US Teams.  I know the clubs love it because they get to advertise they are able to develop kids well and use them as the example.  I understand politics play apart, but the clubs still get the free publicity and can recruit better players due to it.
> 
> I agree we play for development and need to receive it, but I don't see how this makes your point.  Please explain.


I might have a different perspective.  My kid is one of those kids.  My kid was ripped from a team that would have won Manchester Cup had not three left to go to camp - mine being one of those.  A U14 camp which at the time is a "big deal" but looking back and becoming more wise (jaded) now can say it meant jack squat in the real scheme of things.  US Soccer knew when the tournament was but they scheduled a camp anyways.  Mine and other kids had to go cause if you don't well you wouldn't want to piss mother off shall we say.  Not trying to be an egomaniac but that team was greatly reduced one those three players left for camp.  All those parents paid a lot of money to be on a team to make that trip and I believe got short changed due to US Soccer.  Have you figured out I don't care too much for them?  And yes we have been on both ends.  I just thru a bomb out there for the heck of it to see if there would be any discussion or reaction.  The real topic is your second sentence.  Who does the development?  US Soccer or the clubs?  The clubs.  Why does US Soccer place themselves at the top of the pyramid if the clubs do the developing?  Why is US  Soccer calling the shots?  Do you think the RFEF in Spain calls the shots?  No the clubs call the shots.  They decide if they will release "their players" to the National Team.  Until that happens in the US the others will keep gaining and we will keep diminishing.


----------



## C.A.M.

pulguita said:


> I might have a different perspective.  My kid is one of those kids.  My kid was ripped from a team that would have won Manchester Cup had not three left to go to camp - mine being one of those.  A U14 camp which at the time is a "big deal" but looking back and becoming more wise (jaded) now can say it meant jack squat in the real scheme of things.  US Soccer knew when the tournament was but they scheduled a camp anyways.  Mine and other kids had to go cause if you don't well you wouldn't want to piss mother off shall we say.  Not trying to be an egomaniac but that team was greatly reduced one those three players left for camp.  All those parents paid a lot of money to be on a team to make that trip and I believe got short changed due to US Soccer.  Have you figured out I don't care too much for them?  And yes we have been on both ends.  I just thru a bomb out there for the heck of it to see if there would be any discussion or reaction.  The real topic is your second sentence.  Who does the development?  US Soccer or the clubs?  The clubs.  Why does US Soccer place themselves at the top of the pyramid if the clubs do the developing?  Why is US  Soccer calling the shots?  Do you think the RFEF in Spain calls the shots?  No the clubs call the shots.  They decide if they will release "their players" to the National Team.  Until that happens in the US the others will keep gaining and we will keep diminishing.


I see your point.  I don't put too much in winning tourneys like Manchester Cup and such, but my girl has tons of those championship medals and I was spoiled by that success and she puts more value in the experience in those games versus the medals.  I know most kids play for and parents pay for those championships so your point is very clear.

I know a group of eligible girls just went to Mexico to participate in the Mexican OD Tourney.  Every single one of those girls had to be released from their clubs.  I'm not sure if that is the same for US Soccer camps and stuff.

I will venture to say that won't be such an issue moving forward in the DA system since it was made directly for that purpose.  I mean losing 3 top players devastates any squad, but when you come in with that being the focus it changes the outlook may be?


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> I see your point.  I don't put too much in winning tourneys like Manchester Cup and such, but my girl has tons of those championship medals and I was spoiled by that success and she puts more value in the experience in those games versus the medals.  I know most kids play for and parents pay for those championships so your point is very clear.
> 
> I know a group of eligible girls just went to Mexico to participate in the Mexican OD Tourney.  Every single one of those girls had to be released from their clubs.  I'm not sure if that is the same for US Soccer camps and stuff.


Just making sure you know the former Nike Manchester Cup is different than the Manchester City Cup.

The Nike Manchester Cup was a invite only tournament for the best teams several years back and held at Nike headquarters.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> Just making sure you know the former Nike Manchester Cup is different than the Manchester City Cup.
> 
> The Nike Manchester Cup was a invite only tournament for the best teams several years back and held at Nike headquarters.


Good catch.  I didn't know that.  Thanks for clarifying.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Just making sure you know the former Nike Manchester Cup is different than the Manchester City Cup.
> 
> The Nike Manchester Cup was a invite only tournament for the best teams several years back and held at Nike headquarters.


It was a great tournament with a who's who of top teams and players.  I remember my players team being in the bracket with Pugh's Real Colorado team and Madison Haley's Dallas Texans being among the teams the year Pulgita's player and mine were there.  It was about as elite a tournament as existed in the US.  The winner got an all expense paid trip to the Gothia Cup to represent the US.  It was awesome.  Very sad to see it go.


----------



## El Clasico

pulguita said:


> I might have a different perspective.  My kid is one of those kids.  My kid was ripped from a team that would have won Manchester Cup had not three left to go to camp - mine being one of those.  A U14 camp which at the time is a "big deal" but looking back and becoming more wise (jaded) now can say it meant jack squat in the real scheme of things.  US Soccer knew when the tournament was but they scheduled a camp anyways.  Mine and other kids had to go cause if you don't well you wouldn't want to piss mother off shall we say.  Not trying to be an egomaniac but that team was greatly reduced one those three players left for camp.  All those parents paid a lot of money to be on a team to make that trip and I believe got short changed due to US Soccer.  Have you figured out I don't care too much for them?  And yes we have been on both ends.  I just thru a bomb out there for the heck of it to see if there would be any discussion or reaction.  The real topic is your second sentence.  Who does the development?  US Soccer or the clubs?  The clubs.  Why does US Soccer place themselves at the top of the pyramid if the clubs do the developing?  Why is US  Soccer calling the shots?  Do you think the RFEF in Spain calls the shots?  No the clubs call the shots.  They decide if they will release "their players" to the National Team.  Until that happens in the US the others will keep gaining and we will keep diminishing.


Little Flea, if you understood the true purpose of US Soccer (not stated, but through actions), you might not get so upset.  US Soccer has demonstrated that their only goal is to grow the _income_ base, not necessarily the player base (GDA as an example) but if player base grows, it is merely a side benefit.  Your passion for the sport has clouded your vision.  Do you not see the posts on this board of all the parents praising the GDA and all its achievements? Really quite impressive when you consider that, for all real purposes, it hasn't even started yet.  Having watched the implementation of Boys DA and seen what a disaster the results are, I fear that the USWNT, who was so dominant for so long, will continue it's decline on the world stage.  What makes the rise of the European teams that much more impressive is that they are still years away from their culture fully buying into girls soccer.  Yes, girls have been playing there for years but on average, the buy in is nothing like here in the states.  I have yet to see a girls European U8 club circuit, but I digress.

To cite an example of your point about who calls the shots...didn't Schalke 04's refuse to release three American players (U20s, I think) for our Olympic qualifiers?

US Soccer continues to look for ways to get more dollars from the public's wallet without having to deliver results. What a business model. I don't expect to see that change anytime soon.


----------



## Dos Equis

How amazing.  People actually understand the purpose of the DA model, and the consequences.  Like most situations, when the organization's goals are aligned with yours, all is great.  And at this point, with everything new and mostly unknown, people are transferring their own desires onto the GDA, and claiming what an amazing concept and success it is.  

While control and money are always a motivation, their primary goal is producing a winning USWNT/USMNT, regardless of the impact on individual players, teams, clubs, schools, colleges or any other outside groups.   We can debate whether the DA structure is the best way to produce that result, and opinions will vary.  But it is good to see people are not ignoring the unintended (and often intended) consequences.


----------



## C.A.M.

El Clasico said:


> Little Flea, if you understood the true purpose of US Soccer (not stated, but through actions), you might not get so upset.  US Soccer has demonstrated that their only goal is to grow the _income_ base, not necessarily the player base (GDA as an example) but if player base grows, it is merely a side benefit.  Your passion for the sport has clouded your vision.  Do you not see the posts on this board of all the parents praising the GDA and all its achievements? Really quite impressive when you consider that, for all real purposes, it hasn't even started yet.  Having watched the implementation of Boys DA and seen what a disaster the results are, I fear that the USWNT, who was so dominant for so long, will continue it's decline on the world stage.  What makes the rise of the European teams that much more impressive is that they are still years away from their culture fully buying into girls soccer.  Yes, girls have been playing there for years but on average, the buy in is nothing like here in the states.  I have yet to see a girls European U8 club circuit, but I digress.
> 
> To cite an example of your point about who calls the shots...didn't Schalke 04's refuse to release three American players (U20s, I think) for our Olympic qualifiers?
> 
> US Soccer continues to look for ways to get more dollars from the public's wallet without having to deliver results. What a business model. I don't expect to see that change anytime soon.


As a parent in today's soccer we better all know the main object is money.  That's why we act as our kids agents and find them the best club for their development on the road to riches (scholarships, pro team, yada yada).

As a life time sales rep I just don't know if I agree US Soccer believes they don't have to show results to get the AMOUNT of money they want.  With both my kids playing DA now there has been a very clear move to producing a high level product (players playing productive, winning and beautiful soccer) with HUGE investments coming in at the club level.  Now that may be the clubs (lucky us) we have chosen/been chosen by, but I'm seeing a movement towards this with the competitors also.

Another factor is competing federations are starting to snatch up our "not as marketable" higher level talent on the girls side.  With these other federations starting to see success with American born/raised players and the players being open to going, it is changing the playing field a bit.  No longer does US Soccer have to put all it's top talent on the US teams to show it is building / developing productive high level players that are international worthy.

Many of my kids teammates have opportunities outside the US.  So many can play for the Philippines, Mexico, Nigeria, Sweden, Jamaica, Costa Rica, etc.... And are doing that at the youth level teams (this is the girls as the boys are too young).  More power to them.  If your kid can play in the Olympics and World Cup and the US doesn't want them, oh well.  Get in where you fit in.

My point is this is a win win for the players and US Soccer when we play it right and stay focused on the long term goals of college scholarships and keeping these damn kids out of trouble so they can have productive adult lives.  Some of us know who the big pimps on the block are.  US Soccer, NCAA, ECNL, the Clubs.  We are navigating the red light district the best we can without being used and abused ourselves.  

Thing is, this is the system we have.  I can hate it, but my kids love the game and are playing at the higher levels so I have to buy in, but with open eyes.  See the pitfalls, listen to the vets and get them to the finish line wherever that ends up.


----------



## pulguita

C.A.M. said:


> Good catch.  I didn't know that.  Thanks for clarifying.


With the winner getting an all expense paid trip to Gothia Sweden for the World Championship.  Really sucks that they do not play this tournament anymore.  I am sure ECNL, DA, whatever totally hosed this up.  Nike gets more out of ECNL and DA than they were getting from Manchester.


El Clasico said:


> Little Flea, if you understood the true purpose of US Soccer (not stated, but through actions), you might not get so upset.  US Soccer has demonstrated that their only goal is to grow the _income_ base, not necessarily the player base (GDA as an example) but if player base grows, it is merely a side benefit.  Your passion for the sport has clouded your vision.  Do you not see the posts on this board of all the parents praising the GDA and all its achievements? Really quite impressive when you consider that, for all real purposes, it hasn't even started yet.  Having watched the implementation of Boys DA and seen what a disaster the results are, I fear that the USWNT, who was so dominant for so long, will continue it's decline on the world stage.  What makes the rise of the European teams that much more impressive is that they are still years away from their culture fully buying into girls soccer.  Yes, girls have been playing there for years but on average, the buy in is nothing like here in the states.  I have yet to see a girls European U8 club circuit, but I digress.
> 
> To cite an example of your point about who calls the shots...didn't Schalke 04's refuse to release three American players (U20s, I think) for our Olympic qualifiers?
> 
> US Soccer continues to look for ways to get more dollars from the public's wallet without having to deliver results. What a business model. I don't expect to see that change anytime soon.


I thought I have revealed exactly what US Soccer is.  That's why it would be fascinating to watch someone kick them in the teeth.


----------



## pulguita

C.A.M. said:


> As a parent in today's soccer we better all know the main object is money.  That's why we act as our kids agents and find them the best club for their development on the road to riches (scholarships, pro team, yada yada).
> 
> As a life time sales rep I just don't know if I agree US Soccer believes they don't have to show results to get the AMOUNT of money they want.  With both my kids playing DA now there has been a very clear move to producing a high level product (players playing productive, winning and beautiful soccer) with HUGE investments coming in at the club level.  Now that may be the clubs (lucky us) we have chosen/been chosen by, but I'm seeing a movement towards this with the competitors also.
> 
> Another factor is competing federations are starting to snatch up our "not as marketable" higher level talent on the girls side.  With these other federations starting to see success with American born/raised players and the players being open to going, it is changing the playing field a bit.  No longer does US Soccer have to put all it's top talent on the US teams to show it is building / developing productive high level players that are international worthy.
> 
> Many of my kids teammates have opportunities outside the US.  So many can play for the Philippines, Mexico, Nigeria, Sweden, Jamaica, Costa Rica, etc.... And are doing that at the youth level teams (this is the girls as the boys are too young).  More power to them.  If your kid can play in the Olympics and World Cup and the US doesn't want them, oh well.  Get in where you fit in.
> 
> My point is this is a win win for the players and US Soccer when we play it right and stay focused on the long term goals of college scholarships and keeping these damn kids out of trouble so they can have productive adult lives.  Some of us know who the big pimps on the block are.  US Soccer, NCAA, ECNL, the Clubs.  We are navigating the red light district the best we can without being used and abused ourselves.
> You are missing the boat.  Do the players want a lucrative professional playing career for the next 10-15 years or do they want to just try to help the US win a world cup
> Thing is, this is the system we have.  I can hate it, but my kids love the game and are playing at the higher levels so I have to buy in, but with open eyes.  See the pitfalls, listen to the vets and get them to the finish line wherever that ends up.





C.A.M. said:


> As a parent in today's soccer we better all know the main object is money.  That's why we act as our kids agents and find them the best club for their development on the road to riches (scholarships, pro team, yada yada).
> 
> As a life time sales rep I just don't know if I agree US Soccer believes they don't have to show results to get the AMOUNT of money they want.  With both my kids playing DA now there has been a very clear move to producing a high level product (players playing productive, winning and beautiful soccer) with HUGE investments coming in at the club level.  Now that may be the clubs (lucky us) we have chosen/been chosen by, but I'm seeing a movement towards this with the competitors also.
> 
> Another factor is competing federations are starting to snatch up our "not as marketable" higher level talent on the girls side.  With these other federations starting to see success with American born/raised players and the players being open to going, it is changing the playing field a bit.  No longer does US Soccer have to put all it's top talent on the US teams to show it is building / developing productive high level players that are international worthy.
> 
> Many of my kids teammates have opportunities outside the US.  So many can play for the Philippines, Mexico, Nigeria, Sweden, Jamaica, Costa Rica, etc.... And are doing that at the youth level teams (this is the girls as the boys are too young).  More power to them.  If your kid can play in the Olympics and World Cup and the US doesn't want them, oh well.  Get in where you fit in.
> 
> My point is this is a win win for the players and US Soccer when we play it right and stay focused on the long term goals of college scholarships and keeping these damn kids out of trouble so they can have productive adult lives.  Some of us know who the big pimps on the block are.  US Soccer, NCAA, ECNL, the Clubs.  We are navigating the red light district the best we can without being used and abused ourselves.
> 
> Thing is, this is the system we have.  I can hate it, but my kids love the game and are playing at the higher levels so I have to buy in, but with open eyes.  See the pitfalls, listen to the vets and get them to the finish line wherever that ends up.


Here it is in a nutshell.  Do the players want to enjoy a lucrative professional soccer career for the next 12-15 years (tip MLS and NWSL aren't it) playing a game they love or do they want to help the US win a world cup or do better once every 4 years?  Everywhere else in the world the clubs develop players to either sell and make money or strengthen their 1st team.  The players in those systems are there to be a professional and make $.  If they get to the national team it is icing on the cake.  The US is the only soccer country that is backwards.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> As a parent in today's soccer we better all know the main object is money.  That's why we act as our kids agents and find them the best club for their development on the road to riches (scholarships, pro team, yada yada).
> 
> As a life time sales rep I just don't know if I agree US Soccer believes they don't have to show results to get the AMOUNT of money they want.  With both my kids playing DA now there has been a very clear move to producing a high level product (players playing productive, winning and beautiful soccer) with HUGE investments coming in at the club level.  Now that may be the clubs (lucky us) we have chosen/been chosen by, but I'm seeing a movement towards this with the competitors also.
> 
> Another factor is competing federations are starting to snatch up our "not as marketable" higher level talent on the girls side.  With these other federations starting to see success with American born/raised players and the players being open to going, it is changing the playing field a bit.  No longer does US Soccer have to put all it's top talent on the US teams to show it is building / developing productive high level players that are international worthy.
> 
> Many of my kids teammates have opportunities outside the US.  So many can play for the Philippines, Mexico, Nigeria, Sweden, Jamaica, Costa Rica, etc.... And are doing that at the youth level teams (this is the girls as the boys are too young).  More power to them.  If your kid can play in the Olympics and World Cup and the US doesn't want them, oh well.  Get in where you fit in.
> 
> My point is this is a win win for the players and US Soccer when we play it right and stay focused on the long term goals of college scholarships and keeping these damn kids out of trouble so they can have productive adult lives.  Some of us know who the big pimps on the block are.  US Soccer, NCAA, ECNL, the Clubs.  We are navigating the red light district the best we can without being used and abused ourselves.
> 
> Thing is, this is the system we have.  I can hate it, but my kids love the game and are playing at the higher levels so I have to buy in, but with open eyes.  See the pitfalls, listen to the vets and get them to the finish line wherever that ends up.


Don't mistaken Christian Pulisic rise and credit it to the US Soccer DA system.  His parents knew better and applied for Croatian dual citizenship (Croatian heritage), so their son could get training at 15/16 years old with Borussia Dortmund's Academy (arguably Germany's best youth boys academy).  As for the other young men,  it is difficult for US only teenage boys to play for a European Development Academy, because of FIFA bylaws.  Refer to Ben Lederman.


----------



## NoGoal

pulguita said:


> Here it is in a nutshell.  Do the players want to enjoy a lucrative professional soccer career for the next 12-15 years (tip MLS and NWSL aren't it) playing a game they love or do they want to help the US win a world cup or do better once every 4 years?  Everywhere else in the world the clubs develop players to either sell and make money or strengthen their 1st team.  The players in those systems are there to be a professional and make $.  If they get to the national team it is icing on the cake.  The US is the only soccer country that is backwards.


Past their prime Euro players can make good retirement money in the MLS, LOL.  See: Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard, Pirlo, Villa, etc


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> Past their prime Euro players can make good retirement money in the MLS, LOL.  See: Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard, Pirlo, Villa, etc


Now don't kill me for this, but here is my reasoning.  Ok She is 14 this month and he is 11.5.  If they were to go pro before college (don't go there ) I have 4 years and 7 years before they are done with high school.  If they can make 60k+ per diem as pro athletes that's better than what most people are getting in this job market.  Decent living to play the game you love and be in supreme shape.  Low on the professional scale.  If they go overseas and play they may bump that income up another 10-25% depending on the exchange rate and standard pay.  He is a keeper with the backing of coaches connected in the EPL.  The Championship in England pays pretty damn good compared to the MLS.  

If they can get more it only makes it sweeter.  The leagues have time to grow the fan bases and $ investments.  They look way better than I do so endorsements could always net more than the salary.  

My idea is this - have them be the best they can be and ready to take advantage of the positive opportunities that come their way. Keep them out of the hands of the soul snatching crap coaches and have them grow, grow and grow.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> Now don't kill me for this, but here is my reasoning.  Ok She is 14 this month and he is 11.5.  If they were to go pro before college (don't go there ) I have 4 years and 7 years before they are done with high school.  If they can make 60k+ per diem as pro athletes that's better than what most people are getting in this job market.  Decent living to play the game you love and be in supreme shape.  Low on the professional scale.  If they go overseas and play they may bump that income up another 10-25% depending on the exchange rate and standard pay.  He is a keeper with the backing of coaches connected in the EPL.  The Championship in England pays pretty damn good compared to the MLS.
> 
> If they can get more it only makes it sweeter.  The leagues have time to grow the fan bases and $ investments.  They look way better than I do so endorsements could always net more than the salary.
> 
> My idea is this - have them be the best they can be and ready to take advantage of the positive opportunities that come their way. Keep them out of the hands of the soul snatching crap coaches and have them grow, grow and grow.


Nothing wrong with aiming for the stars.  Just know your DD better be the #1 or #2 player in her birth year and retains her ranking throughout her development including college and is being fast tracked to the Sr WNT.  If not, good luck to her trying to make 60K playing NWSL as a professional player, the average is 25K a season.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> Nothing wrong with aiming for the stars.  Just know your DD better be the #1 or #2 player in her birth year and retains her ranking throughout her development including college and is being fast tracked to the Sr WNT.  If not, good luck to her trying to make 60K playing NWSL as a professional player, the average is 25K a season.


That's today's average.  I'm accounting for inflation and the sports growth.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> That's today's average.  I'm accounting for inflation and the sports growth.


Like I said, good luck with that.  Especially if you think in 10 yrs the NWSL average salary will more than double in salary.  The NWSL clubs can't even pay their US WNT players salaries on their own.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> Like I said, good luck with that.  Especially if you think in 10 yrs the NWSL average salary will more than double in salary.  The NWSL clubs can't even pay their US WNT players salaries on their own.


I know.  Not necessarily tlthinking NWSL.  Her game fits how the Euro women play and the financial backing from those leagues SEEMS better.  Like I said - get as good as possible and explore the options available.  She wants to be a plastic surgeon so the pro game isn't the end all be all for her.  I know she would do it if available though.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Now don't kill me for this, but here is my reasoning.  Ok She is 14 this month and he is 11.5.  If they were to go pro before college (don't go there ) I have 4 years and 7 years before they are done with high school.  If they can make 60k+ per diem as pro athletes that's better than what most people are getting in this job market.  Decent living to play the game you love and be in supreme shape.  Low on the professional scale.  If they go overseas and play they may bump that income up another 10-25% depending on the exchange rate and standard pay.  He is a keeper with the backing of coaches connected in the EPL.  The Championship in England pays pretty damn good compared to the MLS.
> 
> If they can get more it only makes it sweeter.  The leagues have time to grow the fan bases and $ investments.  They look way better than I do so endorsements could always net more than the salary.
> 
> My idea is this - have them be the best they can be and ready to take advantage of the positive opportunities that come their way. Keep them out of the hands of the soul snatching crap coaches and have them grow, grow and grow.


I would never kill somebody for optimism.  Out of curiosity are you a former or current professional athlete?


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> I know.  Not necessarily tlthinking NWSL.  Her game fits how the Euro women play and the financial backing from those leagues SEEMS better.  Like I said - get as good as possible and explore the options available.  She wants to be a plastic surgeon so the pro game isn't the end all be all for her.  I know she would do it if available though.


Only the highest of the high level US players get lucrative offers to play overseas.  Most of the players that go overseas weren't desirable enough to get offers to play in the NWSL although there are exceptions.  I like the plastic surgery idea as plan "A" and the pro soccer as plan "B".  If your dd is thinking about pro soccer abroad she better be on the YNT by U18.  Good luck to you and both of your players.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I would never kill somebody for optimism.  Out of curiosity are you a former or current professional athlete?


No, but was surrounded by high level athletes.  D1 and pro athletes came out of my neighborhood and school.  I played the wrong sports from that, but watching them go through the process taught me a lot.  Plenty of pros in basketball, football and baseball.  

Best friend was D1 in water polo and played on the national teams.  Me being his road dog showed me the ropes.  We actually discuss and plan for my kids since no one expected me to have the ballers.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Only the highest of the high level US players get lucrative offers to play overseas.  Most of the players that go overseas weren't desirable enough to get offers to play in the NWSL although there are exceptions.  I like the plastic surgery idea as plan "A" and the pro soccer as plan "B".  If your dd is thinking about pro soccer abroad she better be on the YNT by U18.  Good luck to you and both of your players.


Education first always.  One bad play can end any career right?  Thank you.  

We are realistic that even if she is 5x better and he is a stud, his prospects are much better.  American keepers have more overseas opportunities than field players. Pro athletics is a pipe dream.  Thing is, the streets are flooded with product so we can all get high.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> Now don't kill me for this, but here is my reasoning.  Ok She is 14 this month and he is 11.5.  If they were to go pro before college (don't go there ) I have 4 years and 7 years before they are done with high school.  If they can make 60k+ per diem as pro athletes that's better than what most people are getting in this job market.  Decent living to play the game you love and be in supreme shape.  Low on the professional scale.  If they go overseas and play they may bump that income up another 10-25% depending on the exchange rate and standard pay.  He is a keeper with the backing of coaches connected in the EPL.  The Championship in England pays pretty damn good compared to the MLS.
> 
> If they can get more it only makes it sweeter.  The leagues have time to grow the fan bases and $ investments.  They look way better than I do so endorsements could always net more than the salary.
> 
> My idea is this - have them be the best they can be and ready to take advantage of the positive opportunities that come their way. Keep them out of the hands of the soul snatching crap coaches and have them grow, grow and grow.


Your daughter is 03? I can think of 2, maybe 3 03's where this is maybe  an option. Realistically, your daughter has a better shot at becoming president. Focus on grades.


----------



## C.A.M.

So where are all your kids in the process?  Are they at universities?  Are they looking at going pro?  How are they feeling about their soccer careers when looking back!


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> So where are all your kids in the process?  Are they at universities?  Are they looking at going pro?  How are they feeling about their soccer careers when looking back!


My DD is reporting to her college team next Sunday.  She knows her college education comes first and to also enjoy the experience and have fun.  To keep soccer in perspective, my wife and I explained to her she should treat her athletic scholarship has a salary and her college coaches are her manager and supervisors.  To listen and do as they ask of her.  She is not even thinking about playing professionally.


----------



## C.A.M.

chargerfan said:


> Your daughter is 03? I can think of 2, maybe 3 03's where this is maybe  an option. Realistically, your daughter has a better shot at becoming president. Focus on grades.


One thing I learned from being around all those pros - many of the ones who made it weren't the ones people thought they would be.  The ones who made it were above average kids whose growth in the game exploded after 16 years old.  My view of what makes a solid pro who can play for years is different than what most think.  

Kind of like how the best defensive ends in the NFL are usually just really good college guys that surpass what the highly projected players do.  Why, because these guys were ironing out their flaws and working to be consistent at the high level.  Pro and D1 coaches value certain things in a player that is overlooked by coaches at the lower levels.  That's why the term "the ultimate professional" exists.  

Talent matters, but talent isn't only physical.​


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> My DD is reporting to her college team next Sunday.  She knows her college education comes first and to also enjoy the experience and have fun.  To keep soccer in perspective, my wife and I explained to her she should treat her athletic scholarship has a salary and her college coaches are her manager and supervisors.  To listen and do as they ask of her.  She is not even thinking about playing professionally.


Very happy for you all.  It's awesome to hear about this type of success.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> One thing I learned from being around all those pros - many of the ones who made it weren't the ones people thought they would be.  The ones who made it were above average kids whose growth in the game exploded after 16 years old.  My view of what makes a solid pro who can play for years is different than what most think.
> 
> Kind of like how the best defensive ends in the NFL are usually just really good college guys that surpass what the highly projected players do.  Why, because these guys were ironing out their flaws and working to be consistent at the high level.  Pro and D1 coaches value certain things in a player that is overlooked by coaches at the lower levels.  That's why the term "the ultimate professional" exists.
> 
> Talent matters, but talent isn't only physical.​


At least you have a plan.

True cautionary tale.  I heard of a parent a few years back.  She had a U12/13 DD who was a GK and had a son playing club soccer too.  The parent got so caught up and lost all perspective.   She had both kids home schooled, so they could have more time training on their soccer game.  I never heard what happened to those kids, but I did know at the time they were both "NOT" YNT players.  She was a poster on the old forum format.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> One thing I learned from being around all those pros - many of the ones who made it weren't the ones people thought they would be.  The ones who made it were above average kids whose growth in the game exploded after 16 years old.  My view of what makes a solid pro who can play for years is different than what most think.
> 
> Kind of like how the best defensive ends in the NFL are usually just really good college guys that surpass what the highly projected players do.  Why, because these guys were ironing out their flaws and working to be consistent at the high level.  Pro and D1 coaches value certain things in a player that is overlooked by coaches at the lower levels.  That's why the term "the ultimate professional" exists.
> 
> Talent matters, but talent isn't only physical.​


Well that is even more of a unicorn situation. what percentage of the uswnt  wasn't identified as a top player by the age of 16?


----------



## NoGoal

chargerfan said:


> Well that is even more of a unicorn situation. what percentage of the uswnt  wasn't identified as a top player by the age of 16?


I agree, seems like the US women head coaches like to ID talent at a young age.  Then fast track the most promising to the Sr team.  Think Mallory Pugh, Ashley Sanchez, Brianna Pinto and Jaelin Howell.  There are few who get a call up late like Rose LaVelle though.


----------



## Striker17

NoGoal said:


> At least you have a plan.
> 
> True cautionary tale.  I heard of a parent a few years back.  She had a U12/13 DD who was a GK and had a son playing club soccer too.  The parent got so caught up and lost all perspective.   She had both kids home schooled, so they could have more time training on their soccer game.  I never heard what happened to those kids, but I did know at the time they were both "NOT" YNT players.  She was a poster on the old forum format.


This is COMMON at our age group. Also they all have instagrams and work with trainers who then film and try to promote their centers etc. is all extremely common now!!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> So where are all your kids in the process?  Are they at universities?  Are they looking at going pro?  How are they feeling about their soccer careers when looking back!


Mine is playing in college on a pretty good team at a pretty good school in a pretty nice state.  Looking back at her soccer career, she feels pretty good about it.  She has more that she wants to accomplish like winning an NCAA title like pulgita's dd.  She might want to play in the U20 WWC but only if she doesn't miss more than a game or two of college.  She might want to play a year of pro soccer before finishing grad school but that would likely be in England.  She will probably be a first round NWSL draft pick, but likely would still go abroad if she isn't in the pipeline for the full WNT by then.  School is her priority which is why she is carrying a 3.9 GPA even while playing over 1800 minutes as a freshman.

My baby loves soccer but because she has had to work really hard to get where she is, she is realistic about the WNT.  Her birth year already has it's purple unicorn.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## Kicknit22

Dos Equis said:


> How amazing.  People actually understand the purpose of the DA model, and the consequences.  Like most situations, when the organization's goals are aligned with yours, all is great.  And at this point, with everything new and mostly unknown, people are transferring their own desires onto the GDA, and claiming what an amazing concept and success it is.
> 
> While control and money are always a motivation, their primary goal is producing a winning USWNT/USMNT, regardless of the impact on individual players, teams, clubs, schools, colleges or any other outside groups.   We can debate whether the DA structure is the best way to produce that result, and opinions will vary.  But it is good to see people are not ignoring the unintended (and often intended) consequences.


WHO is calling GDA a success? Real curious what makes you say this.


----------



## Dos Equis

Kicknit22 said:


> WHO is calling GDA a success? Real curious what makes you say this.


Really -- just browse these boards and read the glowing reports.  Training is incredible, techincal skills valued over athleticism, coaches have seen the light and do not care about results, teams singing Kumbaya at the end of each practice, tournamanets only held in ideal temperatures on perfect fields, commute times down to nothing, every other team and league decimated, free soccer for the "best of the best" (copyright Surf Cup 2004).


----------



## Kicknit22

Funny.  It hasn't even started yet!  Could it be that you are drawing conclusions, based on people's expressed optimism? I've been reading all over this forum, and no, I have not read anyone saying GDA is a "success"


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Awesome cause I just want good conversation and information.
> 
> There is a gigantic drop off between the Academy team we are on now and the SCSDL Tier 1 squad we were on last season for a few reasons and athleticism isn't even the highest.   With a lot of people scrambling to find an Academy the selection process seems to have been more selective and refined.  I am seeing these differences:
> 
> 1. Players with better attitudes towards teamwork (less drama so far). Fingers crossed.  The girls are really working for each other and the game play style is more "advanced" in my opinion.
> 
> 2. Players with higher soccer IQs.  This is leading to more robust and intense practice sessions focused on real development of the team and not just select players.   The pace is vastly increased mentally and physically and the A level coaching is more direct and clear.  Classroom workdays and physical fitness only days allow for growth to occur off the field also.
> 
> My DD hasn't been this happy as a player who loves to learn the game and play with other smart players in years.  Just dropped her off and her excitement level for her 3rd practice of the week was just as high as the first day.  She loves the challenge.


@Kicknit22 



Kicknit22 said:


> Funny.  It hasn't even started yet!  Could it be that you are drawing conclusions, based on people's expressed optimism? I've been reading all over this forum, and no, I have not read anyone saying GDA is a "success"


I quoted a post that contradicts this statement and it is a couple posts before yours.  My question is are you being disingenuous, sinister or lazy?


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Mine is playing in college on a pretty good team at a pretty good school in a pretty nice state.  Looking back at her soccer career, she feels pretty good about it.  She has more that she wants to accomplish like winning an NCAA title like pulgita's dd.  She might want to play in the U20 WWC but only if she doesn't miss more than a game or two of college.  She might want to play a year of pro soccer before finishing grad school but that would likely be in England.  She will probably be a first round NWSL draft pick, but likely would still go abroad if she isn't in the pipeline for the full WNT by then.  School is her priority which is why she is carrying a 3.9 GPA even while playing over 1800 minutes as a freshman.
> 
> My baby loves soccer but because she has had to work really hard to get where she is, she is realistic about the WNT.  Her birth year already has it's purple unicorn.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


Thank you and WOW! That is great to hear.  I mean the grades and the success on the field at that level.  From my extremely outside view, I could see many deserving players not being on the radar for WNT.  Those players on the team seem pretty engrained with very little influx of fresh talent except for the last 1.5 years.

Appreciate the best wishes.


----------



## C.A.M.

Striker17 said:


> This is COMMON at our age group. Also they all have instagrams and work with trainers who then film and try to promote their centers etc. is all extremely common now!!!


Alright.  Here is where it gets good.  I am as old as the people with kids in college, but started with kids later.  I'm old school, but realize that the club scene is rapidly changing from what we blindly leaped into 6-7 years ago.  

The saying is the more things change, the more they stay the same. That is where we have to navigate this journey with our kids by using the advise of the vets while keeping up with the ever changing parameters our younger kids are facing that weren't there even 2, 3, 4 years ago.

This reminds me of what we saw in basketball a few years back when kids were jumping straight to the NBA from high school and even with the age limit they have now.  The  player who stayed in college for 3-4 years quickly went from the highest valued commodity to a near after thought.  They became "kids not good enough to go pro early" and not young adults "getting a great education, maturing and enjoying life before entering the real world".  Look at the upcoming NBA draft and everyone in the top 15 is one and done, two and done or foreign players.

Now I'm not saying that our girls are to that point or even close.  The boys are starting to get there with the MLS Homegrown movement and Mexican teams snatching up our kids for their leagues second teams.  Please don't think I'm smoking crack this early in the morning.  What I'm saying is it seems to me that we are hitting a major shift in the landscape like that and there are a few factors speeding up the process.

1. High school is a mess just like it was for us, but 24 hour social media has really expanded the mess. Charter schools and independent study is becoming a real option for kids who don't have great public schools or private schools available or desired and even for those who do. Add in those looking to achieve in sports and can add physical training to the regiment and the appeal is there.  This has been the case for football and basketball for over a decade and soccer is just joining the frey.  With the addition of the DA and no high school soccer, there is even less incentive to stay in the crazy high school environment with less concentrated learning curriculums.  

Gaining social skills for future jobs is quickly becoming the best reason to keep a kid in a traditional high school.  

2. Club soccer isn't really local anymore.  Kids don't play with the same kids they go to school with nearly as much as they previously did. For many of us to find the right teams for our kids, we travel far outside of the neighborhood for the everyday team. The kids intermingle their school circle with the team circle through social media and people who have never met are starting to know who each other and hang out on friend trips to the theme parks.  Just having high school friends isn't as important as it was. 

My son's team is off the 710/60/10.  We all are coming from San Fernando Valley, San Diego, Inland Empire and even one kid from above Bakersfield.  The reach of this club is amazing because we ALL pass two or three other high level clubs/DAs to get there.  If you asked me 3 years ago I would have bet any amount of money that our family wouldn't do this.  

My girls' team is fielding kids from the IE, OC, and San Fernando Valley and it's in the north LA area.  Now the reach isn't as large here because the $ investment from the club isn't the same (no billionaire owner with multimillionaire investors), but the curriculum and dedication from the club is the same making it ultra attractive.  Having a current D1 coach come run a practice and see your DD up close is the exposure we all are looking for.  

With the DA here I think we may be building new roads to get to the same ole destination.  The WPSL and overseas pro leagues are options after college for more players.  Hopefully they continue to grow and expand so more girls can actually play longer and financially reap the benefits too.

I think the last old school part to change will be the national teams.  Like you guys said, they identify young and don't expand that search to later developing players often.  Plus it's hard to force change when your team is always top 3 in the world.  The only country I have ever seen revamp and reinvent its youth system while still an international power was Germany on the men's side 10-12 years ago.


----------



## C.A.M.

Hey I wanted to thank you all in this thread.  This damn soccer journey is not something I planned on as a parent and discussing the different points of view without tearing down each others kids is really helpful in seeing the big picture.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> @Kicknit22
> 
> 
> 
> I quoted a post that contradicts this statement and it is a couple posts before yours.  My question is are you being disingenuous, sinister or lazy?


Disclaimer alert -
I speak of the DA as a success for my kids. One who has done it for 3+ years and the other of course just starting and seeing the benefits immediately. Opinions and results may vary.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Disclaimer alert -
> I speak of the DA as a success for my kids. One who has done it for 3+ years and the other of course just starting and seeing the benefits immediately. Opinions and results may vary.


@C.A.M. I like your spunk and focus on your players.  Good work.  I'm not enamored with your daughters club if it is the one that I think that it is, but your approach to navigating this crazy landscape is the right way to go about it.  Keep up the great work!


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Thank you and WOW! That is great to hear.  I mean the grades and the success on the field at that level.  From my extremely outside view, I could see many deserving players not being on the radar for WNT.  Those players on the team seem pretty engrained with very little influx of fresh talent except for the last 1.5 years.
> 
> Appreciate the best wishes.


The grades were always what I focused on.  She loves the soccer but here journey was one that was filled with a lot of hard work.  It built up her character though and is the reason why college has been such an easy transition for her.  She was one of those kids that once she committed to her school she wanted to do everything that she could to make an impact once she got there.  Her school is one that is super competitive so in order to see the field you not only have to be talented but you have to fight through the Hunger Games to see the field.  Although that type of an environment isn't for everyone because of the hard work she has always had to put in during her journey she thrives in it.  It's to the point now that when she watches most college teams and pretty much all club teams play she thinks that they play "too slow."  I'm looking forward to a pretty amazing season this year.  Good luck to you and your players.


----------



## C.A.M.

Anyone seeing 2017/18 DA laws of the game?  I'm wondering what the official word is going to be on high school play and if it will differ for the girls than the boys.


----------



## C.A.M.

From: http://www.ussoccerda.com/girls-academy-faqs

Are the rules & regulations exactly the same as the boys' DA?
The Academy program has been developed over time to create the ideal everyday environment for player development. The Academy has continually grown and adapted over the 9 years of existence and will use key learnings and best practices for the girls' program. The vast majority of the current Academy rules and regulations will be the same. The Girls' Development Academy staff will create or modify any rules or regulations as deemed necessary.


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## LadiesMan217

C.A.M. said:


> Anyone seeing 2017/18 DA laws of the game?  I'm wondering what the official word is going to be on high school play and if it will differ for the girls than the boys.


The official word, although I cannot show you anything official, is that girls can play only high school soccer next year and then no more. Many DA teams are officially not allowing the this official rule.


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## C.A.M.

I was old that it is up to the club to allow for it for the DA, but it is highly suggested by US Soccer for them not to play high school.  

I'm wondering if it will be like the current rule for boys where it has to be for a kid getting assistance to go to school and playing is mandatory at the school is a stipulation of the assistance.  In those cases the player still has to get 25% of the starts, but cannot re-enter the Academy system once he plays high school.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> @Kicknit22
> 
> 
> 
> I quoted a post that contradicts this statement and it is a couple posts before yours.  My question is are you being disingenuous, sinister or lazy?


Well, smack my ass and call me Susan.  I guess I'll have to go with lazy.  While C.A.M. certainly sounds like it's a success at his club or at least for his DD, I don't see a contradiction to my statement.  I hear optimism, that's all. At most, an appreciation for a different structure. But "it's a success!", No.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicknit22 said:


> Well, smack my ass and call me Susan.  I guess I'll have to go with lazy.  While C.A.M. certainly sounds like it's a success at his club or at least for his DD, I don't see a contradiction to my statement.  I hear optimism, that's all. At most, an appreciation for a different structure. But "it's a success!", No.


Look I am the first person to say that the season hasn't happened yet so it is hard to judge the results.  At the same time it's hard to deny that there are an extremely hard core group of pro-GDA parents that have been posting about how "different" everything is and how they have seen "growth" from their player already.  If you look around hard enough you will find plenty of claims.  I guess that we will see the evidence soon enough.  I am eagerly awaiting it.  Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## gkrent

MakeAPlay said:


> She might want to play a year of pro soccer before finishing grad school but that would likely be in England.


It is extremely difficult to for an American to play pro soccer in England...she should start researching what paperwork she needs now as it could take some time...


----------



## MakeAPlay

gkrent said:


> It is extremely difficult to for an American to play pro soccer in England...she should start researching what paperwork she needs now as it could take some time...


She has an in at one of the top clubs in their setup. If she still wants to go in 2 years she already has at least one party that is interested.  Our conversations right now are about resting her injury (she doesn't want to get out of shape with only 6 weeks left), winning a Natty this year and getting ready to take the MCAT next year.  The idea of a gap year to play soccer isn't very appealing to me but when she gets an idea in her head she makes it happen.

Thanks for the info.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> She has an in at one of the top clubs in their setup. If she still wants to go in 2 years she already has at least one party that is interested.  Our conversations right now are about resting her injury (she doesn't want to get out of shape with only 6 weeks left), winning a Natty this year and getting ready to take the MCAT next year.  The idea of a gap year to play soccer isn't very appealing to me but when she gets an idea in her head she makes it happen.
> 
> Thanks for the info.


We are so involved with our children.  It's nice to see because so many of our parents were so focused in surviving and "kids are made to be seen, not heard".

I look forward to reading about her continued successes!


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> We are so involved with our children.  It's nice to see because so many of our parents were so focused in surviving and "kids are made to be seen, not heard".
> 
> I look forward to reading about her continued successes!


We Gen Xers may be helicopter parents but I would rather be accused of that than the opposite.  I was a latch key kid with two working parents so outside of drop offs and pickups and showing up for games, my parents were waaaaay to busy to be as involved as I have been with my daughter's career.  In my parents defense they had significantly more children than I have with a much smaller birth year gap in between each of us.


----------



## Kicknit22

MakeAPlay said:


> Look I am the first person to say that the season hasn't happened yet so it is hard to judge the results.  At the same time it's hard to deny that there are an extremely hard core group of pro-GDA parents that have been posting about how "different" everything is and how they have seen "growth" from their player already.  If you look around hard enough you will find plenty of claims.  I guess that we will see the evidence soon enough.  I am eagerly awaiting it.  Good luck to you and your player.


Agree. Only time will tell.  Why not be optimistic.  I hope it works out. I want it to be everything it's claiming to be, of course.  My kid would be a beneficiary. But, "luck" is where preparation meets opportunity.  Your daughter didn't get where she is by luck, IMO.  So, like yours, my kid is working her ass off so when opportunity presents itself, she'll be prepared. If this "new" system provides more opportunities, great! But, I honestly believe  it's going to work out for her no matter.


----------



## C.A.M.

Alright back to the Academy discussion.  We had a few girls "guesting" with us this weekend.  Really we were all trying each other out.  It just confirmed my thoughts that being great athletes will not be enough to succeed under this curriculum.  

Girls are going to be challenged mentally in a way most have never been.  It will be more than just the fastest, most powerful athletes getting fed the ball by some really good tactical players.  I think they will have to be more complete in the following ways:

Better understanding of the possession based game.  
Better understanding at varying tempos and the ability to succeed at slow, medium and fast paced tempos.
Better understanding of the team game.  Especially in trusting and the usage of teammates in all parts of the field.
Expanding knowledge of different formations and the varying strategies used in each formation.  
*ENJOYMENT OF THE GAME* - coaching occurs in practice with little in game instruction allowing the players to relax and "do their thing".


----------



## Striker17

So cal showcase? Heard it was some "interesting soccer". That's code for it's going to be a real mess until they gel...


----------



## C.A.M.

Striker17 said:


> So cal showcase? Heard it was some "interesting soccer". That's code for it's going to be a real mess until they gel...


Definitely could see the difference between the girls working in the system for the last few months and those who haven't been.  Also could see the vast difference in style and "game objective" between the DA and non DA teams.  

Here is what I noticed:

Non DA teams were much more direct (launching and chasing). They also subbed more to stay fresh in the terrible heat.  I can hate on that.  They came to win nd put it all on the line.

DA teams were working on connecting, building out of the back and creating chances though off ball player movement.  Subs were much less generous with the girls prepping to play longer with the no re-entry rule.  I know we wanted to win, but were more focused on executing what they learned in practice in real game situations.  We had varied success depending on the personnel playing.

From an outside view it looks worse than it actually was.  In our case we had 4 girls who haven't been at one single practice.  One played with us at Legends College Showcase and the other 3 had never played with the team.  It really, really showed as they weren't accustomed to the style of play.  I will go so far to say it killed our rhythm at times, while still being successful in the overall win column. It's not their fault though.

I have maintained that this will be a major change for the majority of players coming over.  The only untrained girl who would have played our style would have been the one who naturally plays that way.   I really saw why we train 4 days a week.  The DA doesn't want a super ugly product to sell it's dream.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> Definitely could see the difference between the girls working in the system for the last few months and those who haven't been.  Also could see the vast difference in style and "game objective" between the DA and non DA teams.
> 
> Here is what I noticed:
> 
> Non DA teams were much more direct (launching and chasing). They also subbed more to stay fresh in the terrible heat.  I can hate on that.  They came to win nd put it all on the line.
> 
> DA teams were working on connecting, building out of the back and creating chances though off ball player movement.  Subs were much less generous with the girls prepping to play longer with the no re-entry rule.  I know we wanted to win, but were more focused on executing what they learned in practice in real game situations.  We had varied success depending on the personnel playing.
> 
> From an outside view it looks worse than it actually was.  In our case we had 4 girls who haven't been at one single practice.  One played with us at Legends College Showcase and the other 3 had never played with the team.  It really, really showed as they weren't accustomed to the style of play.  I will go so far to say it killed our rhythm at times, while still being successful in the overall win column. It's not their fault though.
> 
> I have maintained that this will be a major change for the majority of players coming over.  The only untrained girl who would have played our style would have been the one who naturally plays that way.   I really saw why we train 4 days a week.  The DA doesn't want a super ugly product to sell it's dream.


Any new player that joins or is guest playing will be at a disadvantage not knowing the style of play and her teammates.  You can't judge a player after a couple or so games.  If the guest player is being recruited, obviously your head coach sees something he/she likes.  Maybe he/she sees she has a higher ceiling than the other girls he has now or she fills a need the team is lacking such as a forward with pace to stretch an opposing defense.  You never know and why I suggest don't be so quick to write off a new player.  Focus your attention to improving your DD instead, because that is all that matters in the grand scheme of things.

BTW, I'm pretty sure your DD plays for LA Premier.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> Definitely could see the difference between the girls working in the system for the last few months and those who haven't been.  Also could see the vast difference in style and "game objective" between the DA and non DA teams.
> 
> Here is what I noticed:
> 
> Non DA teams were much more direct (launching and chasing). They also subbed more to stay fresh in the terrible heat.  I can hate on that.  They came to win nd put it all on the line.
> 
> DA teams were working on connecting, building out of the back and creating chances though off ball player movement.  Subs were much less generous with the girls prepping to play longer with the no re-entry rule.  I know we wanted to win, but were more focused on executing what they learned in practice in real game situations.  We had varied success depending on the personnel playing.
> 
> From an outside view it looks worse than it actually was.  In our case we had 4 girls who haven't been at one single practice.  One played with us at Legends College Showcase and the other 3 had never played with the team.  It really, really showed as they weren't accustomed to the style of play.  I will go so far to say it killed our rhythm at times, while still being successful in the overall win column. It's not their fault though.
> 
> I have maintained that this will be a major change for the majority of players coming over.  The only untrained girl who would have played our style would have been the one who naturally plays that way.   I really saw why we train 4 days a week.  The DA doesn't want a super ugly product to sell it's dream.


That IE surf team has some good players and they definitely don't play kickball. They also got very far in national cup with only 12. It is probably not a good idea to come on here subtly trashing a team.


----------



## Nutmeg

If you can't play you will be found out. Can't hide behind two letters. If DA was an open market many a DA team would be exposed. As it stands there is a reason Blues, Surf, PDA, Etc are always on top. Consistency. DA is not about development it's not about getting better over time, or we almost won. In its purest form DA is simple a new venue for national team caliber players to play and be seen and evaluated against other national team caliber players.  Consistent teams play that way, train that way and expect their teammates to play that way. Coaches who say unlucky or let the game be the teacher, or do your thing.  Sigh. So yes training 4 days a week might help but only to a point. The gap already exists across the spectrum of DA. Good luck because it might be a long season for lots of teams across the county.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> Any new player that joins or is guest playing will be at a disadvantage not knowing the style of play and her teammates.  You can't judge a player after a couple or so games.  If the guest player is being recruited, obviously your head coach sees something he/she likes.  Maybe he/she sees she has a higher ceiling than the other girls he has now or she fills a need the team is lacking such as a forward with pace to stretch an opposing defense.  You never know and why I suggest don't be so quick to write off a new player.  Focus your attention to improving your DD instead, because that is all that matters in the grand scheme of things.
> 
> BTW, I'm pretty sure your DD plays for LA Premier.


She does and I'm not writing any of the guest players off.  I'm extremely familiar with the clubs and styles they come from and was expecting just what I saw.  

I can definitely see what the coach sees in these kids and have no qualms with them being there this weekend.  The positives outweigh the negatives by far.  It just shows talent isn't enough.  The training clearly matters.

Now I see why my sons club has kids doing 2-4 month trials before signing them.  It was a frustrating process, but once you see the team continuity it's clear the process vetts out those who don't fit.  And by don't fit, I do not mean not talented.


----------



## push_up

Holy crap CAM!  Please lay off the DA kool-aid!


----------



## Nutmeg

Maybe US Soccer should save it's money and just ask CAM who's talented.


----------



## C.A.M.

chargerfan said:


> That IE surf team has some good players and they definitely don't play kickball. They also got very far in national cup with only 12. It is probably not a good idea to come on here subtly trashing a team.


1. Never said they didnt have good players.  They sure the hell wouldn't have beat us if they didn't.  Other teams playing their way still were shut out and controlled.  We had our chances and didn't finish.  They had theirs and did.  In fact, they are right behind some other IE/ECNL powerhouses with their style.  They beat Beach Demelo in National Cup which is no easy feat.  They were playing to win the tournament.  We were playing to perfect our style and try to win within the system we play.  Neither of us accomplished our goal.
2.  Didn't subtly trash the team.  I explained the differences I saw between the DA and non DA teams. I don't do anything subtly.  I say what I mean.  Not trying to fight with you, just asking you not to put a spin on my words please.  I didn't say any team was bad.  
3. I didn't see their other games.  Against us they played EXTREMELY DIRECT.  We would have them buried deep in their own end and they were launching the ball from their defenders to however far they could for their players to run on.  It wasn't tactical counter attacking.  It was kick and chase and they are damn good at it.  I have seen the video and man that ball was flying in the air back and forth and not to feet.  That's my version of kickball.


----------



## C.A.M.

Get o





push_up said:


> Holy crap CAM!  Please lay off the DA kool-aid!


I could have swore I was in the Girls DA forum.


----------



## Sandypk

C.A.M. said:


> 1. Never said they didnt have good players.  They sure the hell wouldn't have beat us if they didn't.  Other teams playing their way still were shut out and controlled.  We had our chances and didn't finish.  They had theirs and did.  In fact, they are right behind some other IE/ECNL powerhouses with their style.  They beat Beach Demelo in National Cup which is no easy feat.  They were playing to win the tournament.  We were playing to perfect our style and try to win within the system we play.  Neither of us accomplished our goal.
> 2.  Didn't subtly trash the team.  I explained the differences I saw between the DA and non DA teams. I don't do anything subtly.  I say what I mean.  Not trying to fight with you, just asking you not to put a spin on my words please.  I didn't say any team was bad.
> 3. I didn't see their other games.  Against us they played EXTREMELY DIRECT.  We would have them buried deep in their own end and they were launching the ball from their defenders to however far they could for their players to run on.  It wasn't tactical counter attacking.  It was kick and chase and they are damn good at it.  I have seen the video and man that ball was flying in the air back and forth and not to feet.  That's my version of kickball.


BTW, IE Surf didn't beat Beach in National Cup.


----------



## C.A.M.

C.A.M. said:


> Get o
> 
> I could have swore I was in the Girls DA forum.


Ok since I started the firestorm.  Where are all the posts with players in the Academy who doesn't like what the kids are learning or working on?

Give the other side of the picture.  That's what we're here for.  Don't come hating on me.  Spill your venom about what you don't like about the DA and bring the balance.  Otherwise deal with it.


----------



## C.A.M.

Sandypk said:


> BTW, IE Surf didn't beat Beach in National Cup.


Can you tell me who did then?  I could have swore it was them.


----------



## NoGoal

push_up said:


> Holy crap CAM!  Please lay off the DA kool-aid!


That was funny!  CAM is just an over zealous parent who has DD on a DA team.


----------



## Sandypk

C.A.M. said:


> Can you tell me who did then?  I could have swore it was them.


Galaxy San Diego.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> 1. Never said they didnt have good players.  They sure the hell wouldn't have beat us if they didn't.  Other teams playing their way still were shut out and controlled.  We had our chances and didn't finish.  They had theirs and did.  In fact, they are right behind some other IE/ECNL powerhouses with their style.  They beat Beach Demelo in National Cup which is no easy feat.  They were playing to win the tournament.  We were playing to perfect our style and try to win within the system we play.  Neither of us accomplished our goal.
> 2.  Didn't subtly trash the team.  I explained the differences I saw between the DA and non DA teams. I don't do anything subtly.  I say what I mean.  Not trying to fight with you, just asking you not to put a spin on my words please.  I didn't say any team was bad.
> 3. I didn't see their other games.  Against us they played EXTREMELY DIRECT.  We would have them buried deep in their own end and they were launching the ball from their defenders to however far they could for their players to run on.  It wasn't tactical counter attacking.  It was kick and chase and they are damn good at it.  I have seen the video and man that ball was flying in the air back and forth and not to feet.  That's my version of kickball.


I have never seen them play kickball but then again it was about 100 degrees so I can understand how it would get to that point. But the underlying comment was basically DA teams were trying to play the "right" way and non-DA teams not. Something about their objectives being different.... as in, only the DAa teams was there to develop and improve. If this is the first time you have been on a team where winning less important than development, then you have been doing it wrong. There are a lot of non-DA clubs and coaches that have been teaching a nice possession, play out the back style for years. And while your team may have struggled with that, I can name several non DA teams that wouldn't because they have been doing it for years. 

Basically in conclusion don't trash another team just because yours lost. And yes calling them direct, kickball, with only goal of winning is trashing them.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

When kids are only 14 you can win consistently playing direct.  Especially if you have kids that have matured early.  The issue is that by the time your kids turn 16/17 you can't win consistently playing that style.  But let's not confuse kickball with playing direct.  To me kickball means the player kicks the ball when they see it with little or no thought in actually passing to an open player.  Playing direct means kicking from the back to a fast forward who can beat a defender and run on to the ball hopefully scoring. 

Yes, a direct style has its place especially if you can create a breakaway but by the older ages the goalies and defenders usually can shut down that style of play.  Learning to play out of the back with possession can be brutal at first but well worth it in the end.  It eventually gives a team more options but it can take several years to develop this style of play.  The truly great teams can modify their style of play to what works best against their opponent.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> When kids are only 14 you can win consistently playing direct.  Especially if you have kids that have matured early.  The issue is that by the time your kids turn 16/17 you can't win consistently playing that style.  But let's not confuse kickball with playing direct.  To me kickball means the player kicks the ball when they see it with little or no thought in actually passing to an open player.  Playing direct means kicking from the back to a fast forward who can beat a defender and run on to the ball hopefully scoring.
> 
> Yes, a direct style has its place especially if you can create a breakaway but by the older ages the goalies and defenders usually can shut down that style of play.  Learning to play out of the back with possession can be brutal at first but well worth it in the end.  It eventually gives a team more options but it can take several years to develop this style of play.  The truly great teams can modify their style of play to what works best against their opponent.


I agree with you, however, I have seen plenty of college teams that can't stop direct play.  Defender is one of the hardest positions to play at a high level and it is even harder to recruit because it's so hard to know which kids are going to easily adapt to the college game.  There are so many subtleties to defending at the highest levels that few teams have what I would consider a good defense.  You will also be surprised to see how many kickball college teams there are.  A direct team won the National Championship this year.  We are probably a generation away from that changing and it starts at the top.


----------



## PLSAP

MakeAPlay said:


> Mine is playing in college on a pretty good team at a pretty good school in a pretty nice state.


understatement lol


----------



## Simisoccerfan

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree with you, however, I have seen plenty of college teams that can't stop direct play.  Defender is one of the hardest positions to play at a high level and it is even harder to recruit because it's so hard to know which kids are going to easily adapt to the college game.  There are so many subtleties to defending at the highest levels that few teams have what I would consider a good defense.  You will also be surprised to see how many kickball college teams there are.  A direct team won the National Championship this year.  We are probably a generation away from that changing and it starts at the top.


I understand.  My dd become a defender two years ago.  She very rarely gets beat but when she does it could very well lead to a goal.  A striker can fail most of the time and is looking for  the opportunity to get it right once or twice a game.  A defender needs to get it right every time.  Add to the equation that she is expected to get forward in the attack also and it results in a very complex position to play.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> I understand.  My dd become a defender two years ago.  She very rarely gets beat but when she does it could very well lead to a goal.  A striker can fail most of the time and is looking for  the opportunity to get it right once or twice a game.  A defender needs to get it right every time.  Add to the equation that she is expected to get forward in the attack also and it results in a very complex position to play.



Complex yet extremely valuable...


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I agree with you, however, I have seen plenty of college teams that can't stop direct play.  Defender is one of the hardest positions to play at a high level and it is even harder to recruit because it's so hard to know which kids are going to easily adapt to the college game.  There are so many subtleties to defending at the highest levels that few teams have what I would consider a good defense.  You will also be surprised to see how many kickball college teams there are.  A direct team won the National Championship this year.  We are probably a generation away from that changing and it starts at the top.


and why I roll my eyes reading.....my team is DA and the players are being trained to play the right way, because as time passes younger parents will realize there are a lot of direct college teams who don't play possession.

The players need to learn how to play both ways!


----------



## NoGoal

Simisoccerfan said:


> I understand.  My dd become a defender two years ago.  She very rarely gets beat but when she does it could very well lead to a goal.  A striker can fail most of the time and is looking for  the opportunity to get it right once or twice a game.  A defender needs to get it right every time.  Add to the equation that she is expected to get forward in the attack also and it results in a very complex position to play.


Unfortunately, defending is not the responsibility of only the back 4....All of the field players are defenders also and this should have been taught by the club coaches.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> and why I roll my eyes reading.....my team is DA and the players are being trained to play the right way, because as time passes younger parents will realize there are a lot of direct college teams who don't play possession.
> 
> The players need to learn how to play both ways!


I honestly think that the reason that $C won the championship last season because they were willing and able to play direct against the teams that were superior to them.  A team with a tough defense and the ability to get in behind an opponents backline is tough.  It also helps if they can strike from distance and are extremely physical too.


----------



## MakeAPlay

NoGoal said:


> Defending is not just the back 4....All of the field players are defenders also.


The best defensive teams have forwards that track back and midfielders that don't let player run free at the backline.  The less often a centerback gets pulled away from the middle the better.  A certain centerback that I know of gets pretty upset when she gets pulled away from the middle due to midfielders and wide players not tracking runners.


----------



## tugs

NoGoal said:


> Unfortunately, defending is not the responsibility of only the back 4....All of the field players are defenders also and this should have been taught by the club coaches.


Exactly.  Which is why the defensive (holding) midfielder is such a tough position as well.  Responsible for defending, maintaining possession and initiating offense.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> I honestly think that the reason that $C won the championship last season because they were willing and able to play direct against the teams that were superior to them.  A team with a tough defense and the ability to get in behind an opponents backline is tough.  It also helps if they can strike from distance and are extremely physical too.


and why the strategy vs possession teams is to drop deep aka park the bus and counter attack.  We see it all levels of the game from club, YNT, national teams and pro teams.

Everyone talks about Barca and their possession game, but let's not forget the back to back reigning UEFA Champs is Real Madrid.


----------



## outside!

tugs said:


> Exactly.  Which is why the defensive (holding) midfielder is such a tough position as well.  Responsible for defending, maintaining possession and initiating offense.


Where are the easy positions to play?


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> Where are the easy positions to play?


If you ask my DD who has played the 10, a false 9, 7 and 11, and the 2 and 3 positions.  She will say the 7 and 11 positions.


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> If you ask my DD who has played the 10, a false 9, 7 and 11, and the 2 and 3 positions.  She will say the 7 and 11 positions.


Thanks NG, but I was being a smart ass with my question. Since you responded, my DD has played every position with her current team (including GK a few weeks ago). When they play a 3-5-2, she says outside mid is the most running since they play box to box. I think all the positions are difficult to play well. Its like asking which symphony instrument is easiest to play well.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> Thanks NG, but I was being a smart ass with my question. Since you responded, my DD has played every position with her current team (including GK a few weeks ago). When they play a 3-5-2, she says outside mid is the most running since they play box to box. I think all the positions are difficult to play well. Its like asking which symphony instrument is easiest to play well.


My DD said the same, winger/wingback runs a lot defends and has to attack.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> Thanks NG, but I was being a smart ass with my question. Since you responded, my DD has played every position with her current team (including GK a few weeks ago). When they play a 3-5-2, she says outside mid is the most running since they play box to box. I think all the positions are difficult to play well. Its like asking which symphony instrument is easiest to play well.


The 8 on my player's team routinely has her GPS hit 9-9 and a half miles in a game!  She almost hit a 60 on her beep test so she is extremely fit (and has to be).


----------



## pulguita

NoGoal said:


> and why the strategy vs possession teams is to drop deep aka park the bus and counter attack.  We see it all levels of the game from club, YNT, national teams and pro teams.
> 
> Everyone talks about Barca and their possession game, but let's not forget the back to back reigning UEFA Champs is Real Madrid.


Thanks NoGoal you beat me to it.  RM has never really been identified as a possession team.  Sure they play in Spain, La Liga which is possession oriented but they are a counterattacking/direct team.  I don't see anyone diminishing the fact that Real won two Champions Leagues ( I hate em and am I Barca Homer) by saying yeah they won but they won direct. They won!  Map get over it. I will take $SC anyday over fascist UC!  They won a Natty.  The only people that try to diminish it are a few on here that think they play "possession" more than SC. UCLA does not play Barca possession so get over it.  They play sorta possession.  USC played sorta possession against Stanford and NC last year and smashed them.  They did not play sorta possession against WVU.  As Nogoal profoundly described it, we absorbed the pressure and countered/played direct and won.  There are quite a few on our team that could play possession. But definitely not enough in the final or enough with the proper IQ to play it under those circumstances.  Who remembers WVU?  Oh they played possession - and they lost!  Who the f' cares. WVU was the only team we played all year that was more athletic than us.  They choked in the mental/tactical department.  Possession soccer is a fundamental teaching tool.  If you have that foundation you can play any style and employ any tactic.   I believe it is not vice versa.  If you only have learned to play direct jungle soccer you cannot play possession.  You do not have the fundamental tools.  If there are those that believe that the DA is going to change it you are confused.  For the "most" part the same tools that were coaching in ECNL that US  Soccer didn't like are now the DA coaches.  What do you think you are going to get?  Is there going to be a revolution of possession oriented new female soccer players being created?  Doubt it.  The only ones that will be developing them are the ones that were doing it before whether in or out of DA/ECNL/not in either.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Thanks NoGoal you beat me to it.  RM has never really been identified as a possession team.  Sure they play in Spain, La Liga which is possession oriented but they are a counterattacking/direct team.  I don't see anyone diminishing the fact that Real won two Champions Leagues ( I hate em and am I Barca Homer) by saying yeah they won but they won direct. They won!  Map get over it. I will take $SC anyday over fascist UC!  They won a Natty.  The only people that try to diminish it are a few on here that think they play "possession" more than SC. UCLA does not play Barca possession so get over it.  They play sorta possession.  USC played sorta possession against Stanford and NC last year and smashed them.  They did not play sorta possession against WVU.  As Nogoal profoundly described it, we absorbed the pressure and countered/played direct and won.  There are quite a few on our team that could play possession. But definitely not enough in the final or enough with the proper IQ to play it under those circumstances.  Who remembers WVU?  Oh they played possession - and they lost!  Who the f' cares. WVU was the only team we played all year that was more athletic than us.  They choked in the mental/tactical department.  Possession soccer is a fundamental teaching tool.  If you have that foundation you can play any style and employ any tactic.   I believe it is not vice versa.  If you only have learned to play direct jungle soccer you cannot play possession.  You do not have the fundamental tools.  If there are those that believe that the DA is going to change it you are confused.  For the "most" part the same tools that were coaching in ECNL that US  Soccer didn't like are now the DA coaches.  What do you think you are going to get?  Is there going to be a revolution of possession oriented new female soccer players being created?  Doubt it.  The only ones that will be developing them are the ones that were doing it before whether in or out of DA/ECNL/not in either.



First of all @pulguita I love you to death and agree with you 95% of the time so let me start with that.  Now let's talk about $C and possession.  You say that the only team that was more athletic than your beloved Trojans was WVU but I clearly remember them looking pretty thugish and bad against a more athletic, more possession oriented and just plain better UCLA team.  Next, to say that UCLA doesn't play possession is just down right false and you know it.  Do they play like Barca?  Of course not.  Do they have the best possession pieces in the country?  Ask the U20 WNT what they think about UCLA's possession.  Yes the $C rugby team won the national championship last year.  Mills still plays like a thug in the league.  Johnson still looks average in front of g0al.  Prudhomme still hasn't gotten into a game.  Freeman is the only one that is playing well as a pro and I can show you video of her getting megged by a UCLA player in that game (not to mention she wasn't even the best defender on the field that night!).  I also remember a certain player laying Morgan Andrews out just to send her a message and dispossessing her repeatedly.  Was Alex Anthony even in that game?  I ask because my player said that she wasn't very good and she made her look pretty average.  You know that $C isn't a possession team.  They have the chance to prove it this year.  They will be preseason number one but we all know the truth.

Enjoy the Natty.  My player plans on getting one herself this year along with plenty of hardware to come along with it.


----------



## NoGoal

I love the friendly banter!  It doesn't end at the college too


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> First of all @pulguita I love you to death and agree with you 95% of the time so let me start with that.  Now let's talk about $C and possession.  You say that the only team that was more athletic than your beloved Trojans was WVU but I clearly remember them looking pretty thugish and bad against a more athletic, more possession oriented and just plain better UCLA team.  Next, to say that UCLA doesn't play possession is just down right false and you know it.  Do they play like Barca?  Of course not.  Do they have the best possession pieces in the country?  Ask the U20 WNT what they think about UCLA's possession.  Yes the $C rugby team won the national championship last year.  Mills still plays like a thug in the league.  Johnson still looks average in front of g0al.  Prudhomme still hasn't gotten into a game.  Freeman is the only one that is playing well as a pro and I can show you video of her getting megged by a UCLA player in that game (not to mention she wasn't even the best defender on the field that night!).  I also remember a certain player laying Morgan Andrews out just to send her a message and dispossessing her repeatedly.  Was Alex Anthony even in that game?  I ask because my player said that she wasn't very good and she made her look pretty average.  You know that $C isn't a possession team.  They have the chance to prove it this year.  They will be preseason number one but we all know the truth.
> 
> Enjoy the Natty.  My player plans on getting one herself this year along with plenty of hardware to come along with it.


Totally agree on the UCLA game but one league game does not a National Championship make.   I know what my kid is and at her heart she is a possession player.  There are a few more on her team and it will be up to them to tilt the scale in their favor.  At the end of the day they play the way the staff wants them too.  You know it will be a struggle when an unnamed individual says ya know if Beach played in the ECNL  you wouldn't play the way you do.  That unknowingly and unintentionally was probably the greatest complement he could have paid her.  It also pretty much sums up the mentality here in the US.  Although it seems nice what the U20 WNT says I would not be quoting anything the NT has to say about anybody as a definitive complementary comment.  They have no clue what this or that looks like as evidence by theirs and every other NT level of play.  People would be insane to rank SC as preseason number one.  They lost 6 senior starters?  I am excited that your player has those aspirations I would expect nothing less.  Their are those that have a certain mentality and those that don't.  Ours are winners that's just the way they think.  I have always tried to focus mine on do whatever you have to to help the team and if you are successful everything else falls into place.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> That was funny!  CAM is just an over zealous parent who has DD on a DA team.


I'm only overzealous for wanting to discuss the pro & cons and ins and outs of this new system.  People have to put personal feelings about teams and singular players aside for that to work and this is really the wrong place for it.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I honestly think that the reason that $C won the championship last season because they were willing and able to play direct against the teams that were superior to them.  A team with a tough defense and the ability to get in behind an opponents backline is tough.  It also helps if they can strike from distance and are extremely physical too.


Agreed.  Have to say the season seemed to turn around when the young lady at the 6 found her passing groove to go along with her outstanding defense.  I'm eager to see how they replace all those outstanding upper classmen.  That from an UCLA fan.


----------



## C.A.M.

pulguita said:


> Thanks NoGoal you beat me to it.  RM has never really been identified as a possession team.  Sure they play in Spain, La Liga which is possession oriented but they are a counterattacking/direct team.  I don't see anyone diminishing the fact that Real won two Champions Leagues ( I hate em and am I Barca Homer) by saying yeah they won but they won direct. They won!  Map get over it. I will take $SC anyday over fascist UC!  They won a Natty.  The only people that try to diminish it are a few on here that think they play "possession" more than SC. UCLA does not play Barca possession so get over it.  They play sorta possession.  USC played sorta possession against Stanford and NC last year and smashed them.  They did not play sorta possession against WVU.  As Nogoal profoundly described it, we absorbed the pressure and countered/played direct and won.  There are quite a few on our team that could play possession. But definitely not enough in the final or enough with the proper IQ to play it under those circumstances.  Who remembers WVU?  Oh they played possession - and they lost!  Who the f' cares. WVU was the only team we played all year that was more athletic than us.  They choked in the mental/tactical department.  Possession soccer is a fundamental teaching tool.  If you have that foundation you can play any style and employ any tactic.   I believe it is not vice versa.  If you only have learned to play direct jungle soccer you cannot play possession.  You do not have the fundamental tools.  If there are those that believe that the DA is going to change it you are confused.  For the "most" part the same tools that were coaching in ECNL that US  Soccer didn't like are now the DA coaches.  What do you think you are going to get?  Is there going to be a revolution of possession oriented new female soccer players being created?  Doubt it.  The only ones that will be developing them are the ones that were doing it before whether in or out of DA/ECNL/not in either.


DAs were given strategies, formations and curriculum to use by US Soccer.  It very detailed and tailored to every position.  There are enough variations to have coaches adjust for their personnel available, but all teams are suppose to be using that format.  The object being any girl called up will be able to play the system with minimal introduction.  I have read the actual information (so did my DD), so it's not hearsay.  I'm not sure if there are repercussions for not doing following the guidelines. That wasn't included with what we were given and of course would be a deterrent from not following the guidelines.

I have no clue if ECNL did that or does that.

This is why I said we went to So Cal Showcase with objective one being to put into effect what we have been training on and having guests who never practiced with us scuttled that.  

It wasn't a right way, wrong way thing.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> The 8 on my player's team routinely has her GPS hit 9-9 and a half miles in a game!  She almost hit a 60 on her beep test so she is extremely fit (and has to be).


A good game for my girl at the 8 varies between 6-8.5 miles a game.  Depends on the competition level.  She does 5-7 miles when playing the 6 and 4-5 when playing the 4&5.  Played the 10 for the first time in a long time the other day but she didn't wear it.  Would have been nice to see it.


----------



## C.A.M.

Simisoccerfan said:


> I understand.  My dd become a defender two years ago.  She very rarely gets beat but when she does it could very well lead to a goal.  A striker can fail most of the time and is looking for  the opportunity to get it right once or twice a game.  A defender needs to get it right every time.  Add to the equation that she is expected to get forward in the attack also and it results in a very complex position to play.


Crazy thing is a defender can be in the right place but have the hips turned wrong and boom - own goal.  I have a special affection for defenders because the only position with more pressure to not make mistakes or the team pays is goalkeeper.  I just happen to have one of those too.


----------



## C.A.M.

chargerfan said:


> I have never seen them play kickball but then again it was about 100 degrees so I can understand how it would get to that point. But the underlying comment was basically DA teams were trying to play the "right" way and non-DA teams not. Something about their objectives being different.... as in, only the DAa teams was there to develop and improve. If this is the first time you have been on a team where winning less important than development, then you have been doing it wrong. There are a lot of non-DA clubs and coaches that have been teaching a nice possession, play out the back style for years. And while your team may have struggled with that, I can name several non DA teams that wouldn't because they have been doing it for years.
> 
> Basically in conclusion don't trash another team just because yours lost. And yes calling them direct, kickball, with only goal of winning is trashing them.


I don't veil words.  It's one of my major faults because I'm not concerned with the feelings.  The words were meant as I said it. Each team had two different objectives.  

If me saying your team trying to win a tourney you paid to play in is considered a slight, we don't have the same perception.  Let's agree to disagree.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> I don't veil words.  It's one of my major faults because I'm not concerned with the feelings.  The words were meant as I said it. Each team had two different objectives.
> 
> If me saying your team trying to win a tourney you paid to play in is considered a slight, we don't have the same perception.  Let's agree to disagree.


You are cherry picking what I said but that's fine. I'm just surprised you guys couldn't pull out a win since apparently your girls move and pass the ball like the uswnt.


----------



## Striker17

Question CAM- sincere curiosity you have an 04. Where did she play BEFORE the DA?


----------



## C.A.M.

chargerfan said:


> You are cherry picking what I said but that's fine. I'm just surprised you guys couldn't pull out a win since apparently your girls move and pass the ball like the uswnt.


I'm not.  You took my original statement and twisted the heck out of it to make it seem like a supremacy statement because I said Surf went to win, played a style that gave them that opportunity and the coach subbed like he was keeping kids fresh in the heat.  To me that means he came to win the tournament.  He should have since they paid to come to it.  His team looks pretty set, the girls know what they are doing and they don't have the same set of rules to work with come September. 

On our end the first objective was to put into effect what we have been training on.  Our roster isn't set and he started 4 guests players who never have practiced with us to take a really good look at them to see if they are a good fit.  He subbed 2-3 players at a time every 15 minutes and didn't take advantage of the unlimited sub rules.  We knew that would be the case coming in because our rules come September are 5 subs max and no re-entry.  That doesn't make it feasible to have girls trying to learn a system and get major playtime.  

So it doesn't matter what we think of the styles played and which is better.  My version of "direct" is connect and counter, others feel it is blast the ball and chase.  In the end while the kids all play to win, we actually had an objective that trumped that in this tourney.  You can call that arrogant.  I call it survival because we have to build our game around the parameters we have set in front of us.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> I'm not.  You took my original statement and twisted the heck out of it to make it seem like a supremacy statement because I said Surf went to win, played a style that gave them that opportunity and the coach subbed like he was keeping kids fresh in the heat.  To me that means he came to win the tournament.  He should have since they paid to come to it.  His team looks pretty set, the girls know what they are doing and they don't have the same set of rules to work with come September.
> 
> On our end the first objective was to put into effect what we have been training on.  Our roster isn't set and he started 4 guests players who never have practiced with us to take a really good look at them to see if they are a good fit.  He subbed 2-3 players at a time every 15 minutes and didn't take advantage of the unlimited sub rules.  We knew that would be the case coming in because our rules come September are 5 subs max and no re-entry.  That doesn't make it feasible to have girls trying to learn a system and get major playtime.
> 
> So it doesn't matter what we think of the styles played and which is better.  My version of "direct" is connect and counter, others feel it is blast the ball and chase.  In the end while the kids all play to win, we actually had an objective that trumped that in this tourney.  You can call that arrogant.  I call it survival because we have to build our game around the parameters we have set in front of us.


I twisted nothing. You have been on here the past month making these claims about your daughter and her team that weren't backed up by the tournament results, so you made excuses while insinuating that is surf a kickball team whose goal isn't development. From what I have seen and heard from that team, that's not true at all.


----------



## chargerfan

chargerfan said:


> I twisted nothing. You have been on here the past month making these claims about your daughter and her team that weren't backed up by the tournament results, so you made excuses while insinuating that is surf a kickball team whose goal isn't development. From what I have seen and heard from that team, that's not true at all.


I shouldn't be so specific. You said all non-DA teams so I guess Cda slammers, la galaxy sd and fram are more concerned with winning by playing the wrong kind of soccer soccer than development too.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> I'm not.  You took my original statement and twisted the heck out of it to make it seem like a supremacy statement because I said Surf went to win, played a style that gave them that opportunity and the coach subbed like he was keeping kids fresh in the heat.  To me that means he came to win the tournament.  He should have since they paid to come to it.  His team looks pretty set, the girls know what they are doing and they don't have the same set of rules to work with come September.
> 
> On our end the first objective was to put into effect what we have been training on.  Our roster isn't set and he started 4 guests players who never have practiced with us to take a really good look at them to see if they are a good fit.  He subbed 2-3 players at a time every 15 minutes and didn't take advantage of the unlimited sub rules.  We knew that would be the case coming in because our rules come September are 5 subs max and no re-entry.  That doesn't make it feasible to have girls trying to learn a system and get major playtime.
> 
> So it doesn't matter what we think of the styles played and which is better.  My version of "direct" is connect and counter, others feel it is blast the ball and chase.  In the end while the kids all play to win, we actually had an objective that trumped that in this tourney.  You can call that arrogant.  I call it survival because we have to build our game around the parameters we have set in front of us.


Why did your head coach start 4 guest players in the final?  Couldn't he have seen the guest players play at practice by scrimmaging an older team at the club? Tells me, he really wants to sign those 4 players.


----------



## chargerfan

NoGoal said:


> Why did your head coach start 4 guest players in the final?  Couldn't he have seen the guest players play at practice by scrimmaging an older team at the club? Tells me, he really wants to sign those 4 players.


Says a lot when a coach not only has 4 guests at a tournament, but starts all 4.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Totally agree on the UCLA game but one league game does not a National Championship make.   I know what my kid is and at her heart she is a possession player.  There are a few more on her team and it will be up to them to tilt the scale in their favor.  At the end of the day they play the way the staff wants them too.  You know it will be a struggle when an unnamed individual says ya know if Beach played in the ECNL  you wouldn't play the way you do.  That unknowingly and unintentionally was probably the greatest complement he could have paid her.  It also pretty much sums up the mentality here in the US.  Although it seems nice what the U20 WNT says I would not be quoting anything the NT has to say about anybody as a definitive complementary comment.  They have no clue what this or that looks like as evidence by theirs and every other NT level of play.  People would be insane to rank SC as preseason number one.  They lost 6 senior starters?  I am excited that your player has those aspirations I would expect nothing less.  Their are those that have a certain mentality and those that don't.  Ours are winners that's just the way they think.  I have always tried to focus mine on do whatever you have to to help the team and if you are successful everything else falls into place.



Your player and her running mate have the ability to change things if they are allowed to do so.  I also like AJ coming in and they have plenty of returning players.  You know how rankings go.  They only matter before the game is played.  The Trojans will be preseason #1 and they have enough pieces assembled that it would not be inconceivable for them to be undefeated going into league play.  That is when the season is going to really be fun.  The way I see it the conference will have two great teams, 4 really good teams, one good team and 5 decent teams.  There will be at least 6 ranked teams and this could be a year with 8 that get into the dance.  Although it is hard for me to say I would be shocked if $C doesn't at least make the sweet 16.  I guess I can dream though.  I look forward to catching you on the pitch this season.  As always, good luck to you and your player.


----------



## NoGoal

chargerfan said:


> Says a lot when a coach not only has 4 guests at a tournament, but starts all 4.


and in the final over the girls who have been training in the Girls DA system.


----------



## C.A.M.

NoGoal said:


> Why did your head coach start 4 guest players in the final?  Couldn't he have seen the guest players play at practice by scrimmaging an older team at the club? Tells me, he really wants to sign those 4 players.


Whoa.  Who said it was a final? This is how this whole thing ballooned up.  People are twisting words, adding in what they think someone is saying, etc...  It's hard to imagine that the game of telephone where what is originally said gets twisted by the end applies to the written word also.

I reassert my main point on the DA is the system is different and doing what our girls have done for the last 6-7 years will not guarantee success for any team or player by how they will be judged moving forward in it if US SOCCER evaluates the girls in the system how they do the boys side.

There are people who don't like that statement or disagree.  That's fine.  It will all work itself out in the next few years and we will be able to reflect.

Chargerfan: Your girls played their tails off.  It was a high intensity game and the shot efficiency made the difference.  You deserved the win.  Also, you are right. It does say a lot when you bring 4 guest players to a tournament.  It says you are still building your roster and you have quality players interested in joining your program.  

Don't take umbrage to my observations about DA vs non DA play styles.  It was an observation, not a slight.  The rule changes (limited subs with no re-entry) and play curriculum dictate that DA and DA2 teams have a lot of stuff to work on. The season is around the corner and I noticed DA teams were working on the required play style.  Girls are learning and coming along at different paces in the process and working out the kinks seemed to be the call of the weekend. 

I know we put LA Galaxy SD DA2 on their heels early and they stuck to the game plan.  They played out the back the whole game while we pressured the crap out of them.  They could have punted and went direct, but they weren't there to do that because it wouldn't help them in the long run.  They sacrificed attempting to get back in the game and win for developing their game play because you have to do it vs real competition to get good at it. 

No Goal: Believe what you will.  We had our reasons for the guests to be there when they were and for them to play how much they did. 

**Someone asked if my girl was an 04 and what teams she played on. She is an 03.  She's been at a few clubs.


----------



## NoGoal

C.A.M. said:


> Whoa.  Who said it was a final? This is how this whole thing ballooned up.  People are twisting words, adding in what they think someone is saying, etc...  It's hard to imagine that the game of telephone where what is originally said gets twisted by the end applies to the written word also.
> 
> I reassert my main point on the DA is the system is different and doing what our girls have done for the last 6-7 years will not guarantee success for any team or player by how they will be judged moving forward in it if US SOCCER evaluates the girls in the system how they do the boys side.
> 
> There are people who don't like that statement or disagree.  That's fine.  It will all work itself out in the next few years and we will be able to reflect.
> 
> Chargerfan: Your girls played their tails off.  It was a high intensity game and the shot efficiency made the difference.  You deserved the win.  Also, you are right. It does say a lot when you bring 4 guest players to a tournament.  It says you are still building your roster and you have quality players interested in joining your program.
> 
> Don't take umbrage to my observations about DA vs non DA play styles.  It was an observation, not a slight.  The rule changes (limited subs with no re-entry) and play curriculum dictate that DA and DA2 teams have a lot of stuff to work on. The season is around the corner and I noticed DA teams were working on the required play style.  Girls are learning and coming along at different paces in the process and working out the kinks seemed to be the call of the weekend.
> 
> I know we put LA Galaxy SD DA2 on their heels early and they stuck to the game plan.  They played out the back the whole game while we pressured the crap out of them.  They could have punted and went direct, but they weren't there to do that because it wouldn't help them in the long run.  They sacrificed attempting to get back in the game and win for developing their game play because you have to do it vs real competition to get good at it.
> 
> No Goal: Believe what you will.  We had our reasons for the guests to be there when they were and for them to play how much they did.
> 
> **Someone asked if my girl was an 04 and what teams she played on. She is an 03.  She's been at a few clubs.


Relax no need for the diatribe.  I'm just messing with you. I get it, your DD was previously at some small-medium club prior.  She made a DA team, you're thrilled to pieces, you think she will play college (probably Stanford or UCLA), then NWSL or Europe and make 60K and why your posting the DA song and dance.

Better check with Dom, because I think CaliKlines hanked your account?


----------



## chargerfan

NoGoal said:


> Relax no need for the diatribe.  I'm just messing with you. I get it, your DD was previously at some small-medium club prior.  She made a DA team, you're thrilled to pieces, you think she will play college (probably Stanford or UCLA), then NWSL or Europe and make 60K and why your posting the DA song and dance.
> 
> Better check with Dom, because I think CaliKlines hanked your account?


A small-medium club that didn't play possession or out of the back since this seems like a new thing to him.


----------



## chargerfan

C.A.M. said:


> Whoa.  Who said it was a final? This is how this whole thing ballooned up.  People are twisting words, adding in what they think someone is saying, etc...  It's hard to imagine that the game of telephone where what is originally said gets twisted by the end applies to the written word also.
> 
> I reassert my main point on the DA is the system is different and doing what our girls have done for the last 6-7 years will not guarantee success for any team or player by how they will be judged moving forward in it if US SOCCER evaluates the girls in the system how they do the boys side.
> 
> There are people who don't like that statement or disagree.  That's fine.  It will all work itself out in the next few years and we will be able to reflect.
> 
> Chargerfan: Your girls played their tails off.  It was a high intensity game and the shot efficiency made the difference.  You deserved the win.  Also, you are right. It does say a lot when you bring 4 guest players to a tournament.  It says you are still building your roster and you have quality players interested in joining your program.
> 
> Don't take umbrage to my observations about DA vs non DA play styles.  It was an observation, not a slight.  The rule changes (limited subs with no re-entry) and play curriculum dictate that DA and DA2 teams have a lot of stuff to work on. The season is around the corner and I noticed DA teams were working on the required play style.  Girls are learning and coming along at different paces in the process and working out the kinks seemed to be the call of the weekend.
> 
> I know we put LA Galaxy SD DA2 on their heels early and they stuck to the game plan.  They played out the back the whole game while we pressured the crap out of them.  They could have punted and went direct, but they weren't there to do that because it wouldn't help them in the long run.  They sacrificed attempting to get back in the game and win for developing their game play because you have to do it vs real competition to get good at it.
> 
> No Goal: Believe what you will.  We had our reasons for the guests to be there when they were and for them to play how much they did.
> 
> **Someone asked if my girl was an 04 and what teams she played on. She is an 03.  She's been at a few clubs.


We are not at IE surf 03. Wrong age group, wrong county. We found coaches that taught possession and building out the back early, because it's harder to learn at u14, as you are finding out.


----------



## MakeAPlay

chargerfan said:


> We are not at IE surf 03. Wrong age group, wrong county. We found coaches that taught possession and building out the back early, because it's harder to learn at u14, as you are finding out.


It's all about the coach...  Thank goodness for that.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> It's all about the coach...  Thank goodness for that.


I'd say that goes for any "league" your child is playing in whether it is DA, ECNL,  SCDSL, SDDA, Presidio or CSL. USSDA guidelines (like Common Core Math) are useless if you don't have the right person teaching it.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Kicker4Life said:


> I'd say that goes for any "league" your child is playing in whether it is DA, ECNL,  SCDSL, SDDA, Presidio or CSL. USSDA guidelines (like Common Core Math) are useless if you don't have the right person teaching it.


It's always about the coaching.


----------



## Striker17

Also it's about your DD strengths and weakness- my DD doesn't have the same needs now that she did at 10! THere are some great "teams" with lots of talent due to recruiting but their coach isn't the right fit stylistically for my DD at this time. Likewise already heard about some coaching changes and I wouldn't bring my DD to some other "great teams" because that coach is a more abstract and cerebral guy. MY DD does better with a certain type. Being that she's 11 I am sure that will change 900 more times in the next five years.


----------



## Real Deal

Striker17 said:


> Also it's about your DD strengths and weakness- my DD doesn't have the same needs now that she did at 10! THere are some great "teams" with lots of talent due to recruiting but their coach isn't the right fit stylistically for my DD at this time. Likewise already heard about some coaching changes and I wouldn't bring my DD to some other "great teams" because that coach is a more abstract and cerebral guy. MY DD does better with a certain type. Being that she's 11 I am sure that will change 900 more times in the next five years.


More coaching changes out there??  Do tell.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Also it's about your DD strengths and weakness- my DD doesn't have the same needs now that she did at 10! THere are some great "teams" with lots of talent due to recruiting but their coach isn't the right fit stylistically for my DD at this time. Likewise already heard about some coaching changes and I wouldn't bring my DD to some other "great teams" because that coach is a more abstract and cerebral guy. MY DD does better with a certain type. Being that she's 11 I am sure that will change 900 more times in the next five years.


You are smart to focus on your player and her changing needs!  Keep on this track and she will find the perfect college fit!


----------



## MakeAPlay

I guess going forward I am an Albion fan.  My protege's daughter is a starter on one of their GDA teams now and she has looked up to my daughter since she was 7.  Her team is in CRL this year (yes she is a ULittle).


----------



## LASTMAN14

MakeAPlay said:


> I guess going forward I am an Albion fan.  My protege's daughter is a starter on one of their GDA teams now and she has looked up to my daughter since she was 7.  Her team is in CRL this year (yes she is a ULittle).


Agreed. Albion has done quite a bit to bolster their program on the girls side. MW has been a great addition on the 06 girls side.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LASTMAN14 said:


> Agreed. Albion has done quite a bit to bolster their program on the girls side. MW has been a great addition on the 06 girls side.


My friend's daughter really loves her new team and situation.  She has improved a bunch and seems to get more excited every time I see her.  What I like the most is in the last 5 years her game has evolved.  My friend says that she always wants to work on something soccer related which is a very good sign.  She watched my player go through the process, commit to her school and now she goes to her games and watches her on TV and that according to my friend has put the biggest carrot out their for her daughter.  She knows it's real because she has seen the process and she understands that it is linked to the work that you put in.

I am excited that Albion has a coach for a younger team that can motivate a tween girl.  Go Albion!


----------



## LASTMAN14

MakeAPlay said:


> My friend's daughter really loves her new team and situation.  She has improved a bunch and seems to get more excited every time I see her.  What I like the most is in the last 5 years her game has evolved.  My friend says that she always wants to work on something soccer related which is a very good sign.  She watched my player go through the process, commit to her school and now she goes to her games and watches her on TV and that according to my friend has put the biggest carrot out their for her daughter.  She knows it's real because she has seen the process and she understands that it is linked to the work that you put in.
> 
> I am excited that Albion has a coach for a younger team that can motivate a tween girl.  Go Albion!


That's a great situation for your friends daughter. She has a role model she knows. My youngest daughters team has played MW teams a few times and I like what he is teaching them and how he addresses them over the course of the game. We have a friend whose daughter plays for him and can't say enough about him.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> I guess going forward I am an Albion fan.  My protege's daughter is a starter on one of their GDA teams now and she has looked up to my daughter since she was 7.  Her team is in CRL this year (yes she is a ULittle).


05 or 06?  My youngest plays the '06's on Sat....


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> 05 or 06?  My youngest plays the '06's on Sat....


She is an '05.


----------



## Striker17

In my research I am finding over and over again - even with Jen lalor in a recent news article- that players are defining their "aha moments" between 17-20 and often times playing "up" in various leagueS.
I did some basic research and can only find that WPSL and you have to be 18. 
I know one of my most favorite talents to watch Surf ECNL 18 group all played recreationally in leagues. Does anyone know where or how that occurred? I am curious


----------



## MakeAPlay

This is a great hire for US Soccer and their GDA plans!  My player loves Jen Lalor!  Weird how it says that she will be the technical advisor for 7 SoCal and Arizona GDA clubs.  It looks like they are going to split up the region.

http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2017/06/30/22/32/20170630-news-academy-jen-lalor-joins-us-soccer-da-as-southwest-division-technical-advisor


----------



## Striker17

Jen has always run the training center so I can't see the problems with identification going away. I was actually hopeful when I saw it was all new blood- her hire Friday actually made me sad because it's same old same old here I bet. Nothing personal it's just like what you say- their "identification" has been pretty bad and ruled by DOC and coaches. Can we actually believe that this person who has been a part of this system for so long under the old guard is suddenly going to employ new scouting techniques and allow for RAE and other factors that have never come into play? 
Doubt it
For the record great coach and great person. I just feel that he system needs an overhaul and she was the one In charge of the training center debacle


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Jen has always run the training center so I can't see the problems with identification going away. I was actually hopeful when I saw it was all new blood- her hire Friday actually made me sad because it's same old same old here I bet. Nothing personal it's just like what you say- their "identification" has been pretty bad and ruled by DOC and coaches. Can we actually believe that this person who has been a part of this system for so long under the old guard is suddenly going to employ new scouting techniques and allow for RAE and other factors that have never come into play?
> Doubt it
> For the record great coach and great person. I just feel that he system needs an overhaul and she was the one In charge of the training center debacle


I have been trying to tell you that nothing is going to change.  It's sort of like when you buy a house and then paint the exterior and add some plants.  It's still the same house just more curb appeal for the person that you are selling it to.  I am sorry to say it but you will come around to my thinking eventually.  Everyone either does or they stop posting when they realize that I was speaking the truth the whole time. 

Good luck to you and your daughter.


----------



## Striker17

Hey you love me


----------



## Dos Equis

MakeAPlay said:


> I have been trying to tell you that nothing is going to change.  It's sort of like when you buy a house and then paint the exterior and add some plants.  It's still the same house just more curb appeal for the person that you are selling it to.  I am sorry to say it but you will come around to my thinking eventually.  Everyone either does or they stop posting when they realize that I was speaking the truth the whole time.
> 
> Good luck to you and your daughter.


I agreed with you all along, but it was your humility that really won me over.    

The harder you work, the luckier you get.  I expect you know that as well.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Hey you love me


I do.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Dos Equis said:


> I agreed with you all along, but it was your humility that really won me over.
> 
> The harder you work, the luckier you get.  I expect you know that as well.


And I miss your old avatar.


----------



## Dos Equis

Times, and avatars, change.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Dos Equis said:


> Times, and avatars, change.


I agree.  I guess that is one of the advantages of age.  Wisdom gained through experience.


----------



## Dos Equis

Not wanting to hijack their recruiting thread within this forum, but it seems clear that the south bay only needed one DA club (if DA was intended to aggregate and develop elite talent).  US Soccer could not help themselves when the MLS club showed up late to the party and offered full funding. 

In my ideal world, US Soccer would limit the number of DA programs to half the current horde, promote/support areas having both a DA and ECNL option, allow the DA clubs/teams to play friendlies with local/regional competition outside of their DA tournaments (like the YNTs do when they train), and the adults would have gotten along.  Create a situation that might reward creativity and innovaton.


----------



## Soccer43

Dos Equis said:


> Not wanting to hijack their recruiting thread within this forum, but it seems clear that the south bay only needed one DA club (if DA was intended to aggregate and develop elite talent).  US Soccer could not help themselves when the MLS club showed up late to the party and offered full funding.
> 
> In my ideal world, US Soccer would limit the number of DA programs to half the current horde, promote/support areas having both a DA and ECNL option, allow the DA clubs/teams to play friendlies with local/regional competition outside of their DA tournaments (like the YNTs do when they train), and the adults would have gotten along.  Create a situation that might reward creativity and innovaton.


Well, that would make a lot of sense and be in the best interest of the players and families.  We can't have that going on...


----------



## Justafan

Dos Equis said:


> Not wanting to hijack their recruiting thread within this forum, but it seems clear that the south bay only needed one DA club (if DA was intended to aggregate and develop elite talent).  US Soccer could not help themselves when the MLS club showed up late to the party and offered full funding.


I recognize that you think half the DA teams/clubs should be cut, but why are you so specific on the South Bay? Legitimately curious.


----------



## Dos Equis

Justafan said:


> I recognize that you think half the DA teams/clubs should be cut, but why are you so specific on the South Bay? Legitimately curious.


The thread I was referring to was an inquiry by the LA Galaxy, a new South Bay DA club, seeking additional players. Hence my focus on  that market,

However, I base my opinon on twelve years of watching girls youth soccer in the South Bay.  In a very good year, in any given age group, 3-5 *elite *players can be found on a SBF/Exiles (now SB Galaxy) roster, perhaps 4-6 at Beach (not always on the same team), and maybe 1-3 at Fram.  Add another 4-6 who commute to OC clubs (historically Blues or Slammers), and a few random others, and you have the makings of one very good DA team full of mostly South Bay players.  That is just the way it is -- we could get into a long discusson on why there is not more talent, but that is for another thread.  If the DA is trying to produce YNT players, that is the pool they should work with.

So you know, I would argue OC only needs 2 DA clubs using the same analysis, San Diego 2 as well, the Inland Empire one, the Pasadena/LA Market market one, and Thousand Oaks/Camarillo one. You end up with a Socal DA bracket of 8.  If the DA clubs focused solely on that program (and the related DPL/DA2 teams) and did not have dual DA/ECNL programs, you could also have around 8 solid ECNL only clubs covering those same markets, offering a very good soccer alternative.  One ECNL club would be in the Suuth Bay.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Dos Equis said:


> The thread I was referring to was an inquiry by the LA Galaxy, a new South Bay DA club, seeking additional players. Hence my focus on  that market,
> 
> However, I base my opinon on twelve years of watching girls youth soccer in the South Bay.  In a very good year, in any given age group, 3-5 *elite *players can be found on a SBF/Exiles (now SB Galaxy) roster, perhaps 4-6 at Beach (not always on the same team), and maybe 1-3 at Fram.  Add another 4-6 who commute to OC clubs (historically Blues or Slammers), and a few random others, and you have the makings of one very good DA team full of mostly South Bay players.  That is just the way it is -- we could get into a long discusson on why there is not more talent, but that is for another thread.  If the DA is trying to produce YNT players, that is the pool they should work with.
> 
> So you know, I would argue OC only needs 2 DA clubs using the same analysis, San Diego 2 as well, the Inland Empire one, the Pasadena/LA Market market one, and Thousand Oaks/Camarillo one. You end up with a Socal DA bracket of 8.  If the DA clubs focused solely on that program (and the related DPL/DA2 teams) and did not have dual DA/ECNL programs, you could also have around 8 solid ECNL only clubs covering those same markets, offering a very good soccer alternative.  One ECNL club would be in the Suuth Bay.



Stop putting it so eloquently....


----------



## Lambchop

Dos Equis said:


> The thread I was referring to was an inquiry by the LA Galaxy, a new South Bay DA club, seeking additional players. Hence my focus on  that market,
> 
> However, I base my opinon on twelve years of watching girls youth soccer in the South Bay.  In a very good year, in any given age group, 3-5 *elite *players can be found on a SBF/Exiles (now SB Galaxy) roster, perhaps 4-6 at Beach (not always on the same team), and maybe 1-3 at Fram.  Add another 4-6 who commute to OC clubs (historically Blues or Slammers), and a few random others, and you have the makings of one very good DA team full of mostly South Bay players.  That is just the way it is -- we could get into a long discusson on why there is not more talent, but that is for another thread.  If the DA is trying to produce YNT players, that is the pool they should work with.
> 
> So you know, I would argue OC only needs 2 DA clubs using the same analysis, San Diego 2 as well, the Inland Empire one, the Pasadena/LA Market market one, and Thousand Oaks/Camarillo one. You end up with a Socal DA bracket of 8.  If the DA clubs focused solely on that program (and the related DPL/DA2 teams) and did not have dual DA/ECNL programs, you could also have around 8 solid ECNL only clubs covering those same markets, offering a very good soccer alternative.  One ECNL club would be in the Suuth Bay.


That sounds all well and good but the reality is that would involve a lot of driving for practice and games.  You could say the same for all high school sports, pick the elite players from each high school for whatever sport you choose, combine them into one or two local schools and voila, you have an elite team.  The elite players in all sports will be the ones to move on to the college level and/or pro level no need to stress over who is elite or who isn't, which team will win the big one, who will win CIF, ECNL, be the top DA team, win Nationals,  etc. etc. etc. etc.


----------



## Dos Equis

Lambchop said:


> That sounds all well and good but the reality is that would involve a lot of driving for practice and games.  You could say the same for all high school sports, pick the elite players from each high school for whatever sport you choose, combine them into one or two local schools and voila, you have an elite team.  The elite players in all sports will be the ones to move on to the college level and/or pro level no need to stress over who is elite or who isn't, which team will win the big one, who will win CIF, ECNL, be the top DA team, win Nationals,  etc. etc. etc. etc.


Participating in sports at an elite level (and the DA is supposed to be elite) has always involved a lot of driving/commuting, and sometimes even family or child re-location.  We are more fortunate than most here in Socal.  It is unrealistic and perhaps even oxymoronic to think you can create an elite development system that is convenient for everyone, without also diluting the talent and creating a system less effective at achieving your goals.  If US Soccer worked with other leagues and sanctioning organizations (and vice versa), they could help insure there are great youth soccer options, including ECNL and other leagues, in areas with more difficult/limited access to DA clubs. 

I am not talking about all-star teams.  If it serves some greater purpose to subject an ever increasing number of youth players to a system that prohibits HS play, limits games for all and playing time for non-starters through the substitution rules, and is closed to outside competition, all for a primary purpose of producing 3-4 future national team players per age group, that greater purpose is lost on me.  I think such a system should be for a very limited group of clubs/players at the top of a more inclusive and coordinated pyramid, one that provides options, allows for more creativity, and  expands its reach and player base through cooperation, not control.


----------



## MakeAPlay

This is an excellent interview of Anson Dorrance.  He touches on the GDA, ECNL, college soccer and international soccer.  Very insightful.  Notice what he says about college soccer and it's value in the 18-22 age band globally.

https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/ask-a-coach:-uncs-anson-dorrance_aid42067


----------



## timbuck

MakeAPlay said:


> This is an excellent interview of Anson Dorrance.  He touches on the GDA, ECNL, college soccer and international soccer.  Very insightful.  Notice what he says about college soccer and it's value in the 18-22 age band globally.
> 
> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/ask-a-coach:-uncs-anson-dorrance_aid42067


Interesting comments on the substitution rules allowing for players born in the back half of the year to get on the field.


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> This is an excellent interview of Anson Dorrance.  He touches on the GDA, ECNL, college soccer and international soccer.  Very insightful.  Notice what he says about college soccer and it's value in the 18-22 age band globally.
> 
> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/ask-a-coach:-uncs-anson-dorrance_aid42067


Except Mal Pugh. I am glad he said what he did and even more happy that they aren't pushing these minor leagues onto the girls. I don't want this training Into baseball where they graduate high school and spend two years at a minor league or JC to "live the dream".


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> Except Mal Pugh. I am glad he said what he did and even more happy that they aren't pushing these minor leagues onto the girls. I don't want this training Into baseball where they graduate high school and spend two years at a minor league or JC to "live the dream".


I agree.  Mal Pugh is a purple unicorn.  The funny thing is my player thinks that Fleming is a tougher player to mark and she chose to remain in school even though her national team coach wants her to go pro too.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> This is an excellent interview of Anson Dorrance.  He touches on the GDA, ECNL, college soccer and international soccer.  Very insightful.  Notice what he says about college soccer and it's value in the 18-22 age band globally.
> 
> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/ask-a-coach:-uncs-anson-dorrance_aid42067


Great article. I have a similar feeling about substitutions in youth soccer as Anson but had not realized the effect it has on minimizing the birth month anomaly. I probably disagree with him however about substitutions in the college game. Unlimited substitutions in the college game allow his 90 minute high pressure style of play which tends to be very direct. I believe this style of play at the college level does not prepare players for the international game. College players are adults. While I agree that college soccer is currently is the best soccer development option for most 18-22 year old women, that will decrease over time as women's professional leagues around the world get larger and play by FIFA rules. NCAA soccer and FIFA soccer are two different games.

I also found it interesting that he says the pool of "very good" soccer players is larger than in the past.


----------



## NoGoal

outside! said:


> I also found it interesting that he says the pool of "very good" soccer players is larger than in the past.


The pool of very good soccer players is larger purely by the fact there are more and more girls playing club soccer.


----------



## timbuck

NoGoal said:


> The pool of very good soccer players is larger purely by the fact there are more and more girls playing club soccer.


He also mentioned that he thinks coaching has gotten better.
Maybe not to the Euro or South America level, but I bet 15-20 years ago, a female soccer player became "good" by genetics and a bit of luck.  Speed, aggressiveness and strength.  I bet that most 15 year old girls today have more soccer "Skill" than many USWNT players had in 1999.
Coaching isn't perfect and there are some bad ones out there.  But most coach are actually teaching a bit of soccer/futbol these days around the US.


----------



## outside!

NoGoal said:


> The pool of very good soccer players is larger purely by the fact there are more and more girls playing club soccer.


Which would have been a good reason for ECNL to admit more clubs, but they missed that boat and now we are stuck with two competing, closed systems.


----------



## LASTMAN14

MakeAPlay said:


> And I miss your old avatar.


I liked it when you had the Duke Avatar.


----------



## Bananacorner

May have posted this in the wrong thread, sorry for the duplicate:



Looks like for girls are required to have 32 players minimum for the combined age group teams (similar to boys DA), but for separate age groupings, it is unclear. Is this saying that for U14 and U15 you need to have 32 minimum on each team? Or 32 between U15 and U14? Does that mean you could have 13 players on U14 and 19 players on U15 and you would meet the requirement?

Rosters need to meet the minimum by August 18th at 5:00 pm CST. No DPs allowed until October 2nd.

https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/6pblyk29e2y8gup4qns1nm6i2yv2yilf


----------



## Desert Hound

What are the substitution rules for Girls DA?

I came across this in the girls da application. What does for example seven subs across three opportunities mean? 

Substitution rules: no re
-entry; seven substitutions across three “opportunities” for U
-14/15;
*five substitutions across three “opportunities” for U
-16/17 and U-
18/19*


----------



## Eagle33

Bananacorner said:


> May have posted this in the wrong thread, sorry for the duplicate:
> View attachment 1208
> 
> 
> Looks like for girls are required to have 32 players minimum for the combined age group teams (similar to boys DA), but for separate age groupings, it is unclear. Is this saying that for U14 and U15 you need to have 32 minimum on each team? Or 32 between U15 and U14? Does that mean you could have 13 players on U14 and 19 players on U15 and you would meet the requirement?
> 
> Rosters need to meet the minimum by August 18th at 5:00 pm CST. No DPs allowed until October 2nd.
> 
> https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/6pblyk29e2y8gup4qns1nm6i2yv2yilf


The numbers you see is for 2 teams combined


----------



## Kicker4Life

Still awaiting final word. There was discussion about allowing re-entry into a game (just not in the same half) for the u14's


----------



## Not From Around Here

Desert Hound said:


> What are the substitution rules for Girls DA?
> 
> I came across this in the girls da application. What does for example seven subs across three opportunities mean?
> 
> Substitution rules: no re
> -entry; seven substitutions across three “opportunities” for U
> -14/15;
> *five substitutions across three “opportunities” for U
> -16/17 and U-
> 18/19*


It was explained to me that if you plan to use 7 subs, you have to do it in pairs/groups rather than subbing 1 girl each at 7 different times.  Instead of opportunities, I heard the term "moments."  So a coach can not disrupt the flow of the game with 7 separate substitution "moments."  It was not clear to me if halftime counted as a "moment."


----------



## espola

Not From Around Here said:


> It was explained to me that if you plan to use 7 subs, you have to do it in pairs/groups rather than subbing 1 girl each at 7 different times.  Instead of opportunities, I heard the term "moments."  So a coach can not disrupt the flow of the game with 7 separate substitution "moments."  It was not clear to me if halftime counted as a "moment."


One of the functions of league administrators seems to be to make up rules that inhibit kids from playing.


----------



## younothat

Not From Around Here said:


> It was explained to me that if you plan to use 7 subs, you have to do it in pairs/groups rather than subbing 1 girl each at 7 different times.  Instead of opportunities, I heard the term "moments."  So a coach can not disrupt the flow of the game with 7 separate substitution "moments."  It was not clear to me if halftime counted as a "moment."


For USSDA 11v11;   3 substitution times (moments) plus half time,  7 players can be substituted total during those (3) times + half time.    Half time is not considered a moment, game is not moving.

A change like ECNL does with reentry in another half would help but I kind of doubt you will see that in 11v11 in DA.


----------



## Dos Equis

younothat said:


> For USSDA 11v11;   3 substitution times (moments) plus half time,  7 players can be substituted total during those (3) times + half time.    Half time is not considered a moment, game is not moving.
> 
> A change like ECNL does with reentry in another half would help but I kind of doubt you will see that in 11v11 in DA.


No re-entry is the controversial rule, for both development and safety.  On development, there are valid arguments on both sides.  But from a safety standpoint, while it might seem a cautious approach (injured kids cannot return), in practice the opposite is more likely (kids who get knocked around hide the pain lest their day end with a substitution).  At 13-16 years old, not something to encourage. I have known too many "tough" soccer players who were always playing through the pain, particularly on the girls side, whose bodies start breaking down between ages 17-21.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Dos Equis said:


> No re-entry is the controversial rule, for both development and safety.  On development, there are valid arguments on both sides.  But from a safety standpoint, while it might seem a cautious approach (injured kids cannot return), in practice the opposite is more likely (kids who get knocked around hide the pain lest their day end with a substitution).  At 13-16 years old, not something to encourage. I have known too many "tough" soccer players who were always playing through the pain, particularly on the girls side, whose bodies start breaking down between ages 17-21.


@Dos Equis I have to say that I agree with you 100%.  I swear that we used to be on opposite sides of the argument on the old forum back in the old SCDSL/CSL split days.  I still can't figure out if it was my opinion that changed or yours?  Or maybe I just imagined it all.


----------



## outside!

I agree with Dos Equis (and MAP). I think limited subs in the youth game could lead to injuries. The place for limited subs is in the adult game (college) to better prepare adult players for the international game.


----------



## The Driver

Shame on coaches who don't


outside! said:


> I agree with Dos Equis (and MAP). I think limited subs in the youth game could lead to injuries. The place for limited subs is in the adult game (college) to better prepare adult players for the international game.


Limited subs will prevent more injuries from happening IMO. Recovery is key to development unless you are a Unicorn. So now coaches will have to rest players maybe circle key games and rest groups of Unicorns at a time. Unless you're a purple Unicorns you need to rest.


----------



## Dos Equis

MakeAPlay said:


> @Dos Equis I have to say that I agree with you 100%.  I swear that we used to be on opposite sides of the argument on the old forum back in the old SCDSL/CSL split days.  I still can't figure out if it was my opinion that changed or yours?  Or maybe I just imagined it all.


Perhaps experience has helped us better understand each other.


----------



## espola

outside! said:


> I agree with Dos Equis (and MAP). I think limited subs in the youth game could lead to injuries. The place for limited subs is in the adult game (college) to better prepare adult players for the international game.


Which begs the question of why international play needs limited subs.


----------



## outside!

espola said:


> Which begs the question of why international play needs limited subs.


For whatever reason the international game has limited subs. Since the US is trying to be competitive in the international game, we should practice it. In my opinion, unlimited subs at the college level allows for the continuation of the direct, "kick and run" style game that many club teams use.


----------



## The Driver

outside! said:


> For whatever reason the international game has limited subs. Since the US is trying to be competitive in the international game, we should practice it. In my opinion, unlimited subs at the college level allows for the continuation of the direct, "kick and run" style game that many club teams use.


Well put


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> For whatever reason the international game has limited subs. Since the US is trying to be competitive in the international game, we should practice it. In my opinion, unlimited subs at the college level allows for the continuation of the direct, "kick and run" style game that many club teams use.


Title IX is in the way but I agree with you.


----------



## Dos Equis

outside! said:


> For whatever reason the international game has limited subs. Since the US is trying to be competitive in the international game, we should practice it. In my opinion, unlimited subs at the college level allows for the continuation of the direct, "kick and run" style game that many club teams use.


Depends on the age. For the purposes of development, at the younger ages, even the international game believes in more flexible subsitution rules.

At the college ages, limited subs would also require a reduction in frequency of games.  Not unusual for our college teams to average 3 games per week.  That would not be practical nor safe without more liberal substitution rules (and perhaps is not wise even now).

Too often, we cherry pick which practices to follow and end up worse off, not understanding how the parts fit together to create the whole.

That seems to be the fate of US Soccer.


----------



## Lambchop

Dos Equis said:


> No re-entry is the controversial rule, for both development and safety.  On development, there are valid arguments on both sides.  But from a safety standpoint, while it might seem a cautious approach (injured kids cannot return), in practice the opposite is more likely (kids who get knocked around hide the pain lest their day end with a substitution).  At 13-16 years old, not something to encourage. I have known too many "tough" soccer players who were always playing through the pain, particularly on the girls side, whose bodies start breaking down between ages 17-21.


The tough players continue to play even with unlimited subbing.  Perhaps older players whose bodies start "breaking down" as you say are not properly conditioned, trained or the player is  just plain burned out  and is done.  I have seen plenty of that.


----------



## The Driver

Lambchop said:


> The tough players continue to play even with unlimited subbing.  Perhaps older players whose bodies start "breaking down" as you say are not properly conditioned, trained or the player is  just plain burned out  and is done.  I have seen plenty of that.


The best conditioned athletes can only stress themselves for so long. Breaking down or burning out happens to the best of the best. Even the ones who mentally get through fatigue end up suffering in other places like the classroom or health wise. I watch our dds run up and down the field and it upsets me when the running mechanics are shot and the coaches don't subbed.


----------



## Not From Around Here

younothat said:


> For USSDA 11v11;   3 substitution times (moments) plus half time,  7 players can be substituted total during those (3) times + half time.    Half time is not considered a moment, game is not moving.
> 
> A change like ECNL does with reentry in another half would help but I kind of doubt you will see that in 11v11 in DA.


Found this in the current DA rules:

_Substitutions: All U15/16 and U17/18 Academy games will have a maximum of five(5) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”. 
U13, U14 Academy games will have a maximum of seven (7) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”. The U12 Academy games will have unlimited substitutions with reentry.
_
With fewer subs at the older age groups, you will have 2 girls not play if a team brings 18 players.


----------



## espola

Not From Around Here said:


> Found this in the current DA rules:
> 
> _Substitutions: All U15/16 and U17/18 Academy games will have a maximum of five(5) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”.
> U13, U14 Academy games will have a maximum of seven (7) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”. The U12 Academy games will have unlimited substitutions with reentry.
> _
> With fewer subs at the older age groups, you will have 2 girls not play if a team brings 18 players.


Forget the players.  The coaches have their rules.


----------



## The Driver

Not From Around Here said:


> Found this in the current DA rules:
> 
> _Substitutions: All U15/16 and U17/18 Academy games will have a maximum of five(5) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”.
> U13, U14 Academy games will have a maximum of seven (7) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”. The U12 Academy games will have unlimited substitutions with reentry.
> _
> With fewer subs at the older age groups, you will have 2 girls not play if a team brings 18 players.


 Bright coaches will flourish under these settings. Bright coaches who puts winning over development will end up with some lame Stallions when it's said and done, plus some upset parents who's dds didn't get much game time action. Hope that makes sense iT was truly a freestyle


----------



## younothat

Not From Around Here said:


> Found this in the current DA rules:
> 
> _Substitutions: All U15/16 and U17/18 Academy games will have a maximum of five(5) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”.
> U13, U14 Academy games will have a maximum of seven (7) substitutions per game with no reentry across three “opportunities”. The U12 Academy games will have unlimited substitutions with reentry.
> _
> With fewer subs at the older age groups, you will have 2 girls not play if a team brings 18 players.


For the Boys last season that was the case.   Could very well be the same for the girls DA in 17-18' but haven't seen the official posted substitution rules for them yet but I would guess they will be the same.

In any case does depend on what coaches do to some extent but generally in DA the starters get the majority of playing and subs not very much and likely less minutes than their used to.

Normally unless injured starters are not sub'ed prior to the half.  At half some but not many coaches will make a sub,  most wait until about half way or later until 2nd half to start subbing.  

Some close rival games will see almost no of very few subs.   The blowout games or vs less comp will see subs starting or getting into the games more often.   

Overall most coaches I've seen sub only about 3-4 players when they have 7 subs or 2-3 when there is 5 subs per  game if that many, some more some less but rarely do you see the full 5-7 possibles get into games.    3-4 many only get 10-20 minutes of play typically with the 7's and 1-3 with the 5's,  YMMV.


----------



## Striker17

The Driver said:


> Bright coaches will flourish under these settings. Bright coaches who puts winning over development will end up with some lame Stallions when it's said and done, plus some upset parents who's dds didn't get much game time action. Hope that makes sense iT was truly a freestyle


Agree . Bright parents will not gravitate to superstar teams unless their DD is a top five player. Parents haven't figured this one out yet which I believe will hurt recruitment. I anticipate massive movement once players on certain DA teams realize 15 minutes a game while the coach showcases his favorite six isn't going to get you noticed


----------



## bababooey

To me, the toughest decision for a parent of any serious player is this.........Do I try to get my dd on the very best team possible where she might only play half or a third of the game and is not considered an impact player for that team - OR - do I get my dd on a lesser team where she plays the majority of the games and is considered an impact player? I have my opinion on this matter, but what works for me and my dd doesn't apply to every other parent and dd.


----------



## Striker17

bababooey said:


> To me, the toughest decision for a parent of any serious player is this.........Do I try to get my dd on the very best team possible where she might only play half or a third of the game and is not considered an impact player for that team - OR - do I get my dd on a lesser team where she plays the majority of the games and is considered an impact player? I have my opinion on this matter, but what works for me and my dd doesn't apply to every other parent and dd.


Half or third is very different than 10-15 minutes. 
I am seeing DA teams that are playing girls 10-15 min and parents are bragging about being on that team.
If your daughter is playing half a game, enjoying her coach and teammates and is training hard that is an extremely different situation than what I described. 
If you have a DD who wants to play college, is barely playing or the 13-18 on a star roster it's not smart. There is not enough of his talk when discussing placement.


----------



## Striker17

PSS there is room for one unicorn per team and position. You got a good middie? Be careful about going to a team where one already exists. It's a waste of time. Again something people are sorely lacking in thinking about for whatever reason this year


----------



## LadiesMan217

bababooey said:


> To me, the toughest decision for a parent of any serious player is this.........Do I try to get my dd on the very best team possible where she might only play half or a third of the game and is not considered an impact player for that team - OR - do I get my dd on a lesser team where she plays the majority of the games and is considered an impact player? I have my opinion on this matter, but what works for me and my dd doesn't apply to every other parent and dd.


'Highest level team with best coach' -vs- best team since we tend rate teams based on record. Sometimes the lesser team has the better development. I would hope people are paying club fees for development and not winning games or prestige (although I know that is usually not the case).


----------



## Striker17

LadiesMan217 said:


> 'Highest level team with best coach' -vs- best team since we tend rate teams based on record. Sometimes the lesser team has the better development. I would hope people are paying club fees for development and not winning games or prestige (although I know that is usually not the case).


We have found the "best club" had the two worst coaches of our age group. The other "best club" had one great developer with stacked team so play time limited. Our best choice was a "lower team" with the best coach and total minutes. 
It's a math equation!


----------



## SoccerLife75

Any DA score updates from surf or silverlakes? Any surprises?


----------



## MakeAPlay

https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/san-diego-to-host-boys-girls-da-playoffs_aid42166

Looks like Surf got in on the deal with GDA....


----------



## gkrent

Pats 00/99 crushed PSV union 4-0.  Yes, Im filled with glee.


----------



## Furinner

Watched a few 01/02 games. 10-15 college coaches on the sideline. The talent difference was pretty shocking, as reflected by the scores. The ECNL clubs seemed to do well, with some exceptions, the new DA-nonECNL clubs seemed woeful.


----------



## Surfref

gkrent said:


> Pats 00/99 crushed PSV union 4-0.  Yes, Im filled with glee.


Good start for Pats.

4-0 isn't crushing another team, but GDA 04: SD Surf - 11 vs Burlingame - 1 is crushing and then stepping on them again just to make sure nothing is left.


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/san-diego-to-host-boys-girls-da-playoffs_aid42166
> 
> Looks like Surf got in on the deal with GDA....


Surf cup sports you mean! Listen I am all for it. Connerly and company do a great job, a great product and I know it can cost but it's the best every time. I am happy for their success and for the location! I know they get a lot of grief but I was ecstatic to see this and happy for their success


----------



## NoGoal

Striker17 said:


> Agree . Bright parents will not gravitate to superstar teams unless their DD is a top five player. Parents haven't figured this one out yet which I believe will hurt recruitment. I anticipate massive movement once players on certain DA teams realize 15 minutes a game while the coach showcases his favorite six isn't going to get you noticed


Striker17 you have come into the light!  #bravo


----------



## NoGoal

LadiesMan217 said:


> 'Highest level team with best coach' -vs- best team since we tend rate teams based on record. Sometimes the lesser team has the better development. I would hope people are paying club fees for development and not winning games or prestige (although I know that is usually not the case).


Another has come into the light!


----------



## Striker17

NoGoal said:


> Striker17 you have come into the light!  #bravo


Aww shucks. Only took me five years


----------



## mkg68

Surfref said:


> Good start for Pats.
> 
> 4-0 isn't crushing another team, but GDA 04: SD Surf - 11 vs Burlingame - 1 is crushing and then stepping on them again just to make sure nothing is left.


From lurking in the 04 forum, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Surf team that won 11-1 is the B team as the DA team is in Kansas or Texas or wherever playing in the USYS National Finals.


----------



## chargerfan

mkg68 said:


> From lurking in the 04 forum, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Surf team that won 11-1 is the B team as the DA team is in Kansas or Texas or wherever playing in the USYS National Finals.


From also lurking on the 04 forum, I saw that Burlingame team is a flight 2/3 level team. I would expect a much different result tomorrow if it is in fact surf B playing against solar.


----------



## PLSAP

The only close score in the 01/02 DA bracket was 2-2 RSC- Crossfire
Worst was Surf vs PSV 10-0


----------



## Justafan

chargerfan said:


> From also lurking on the 04 forum, I saw that Burlingame team is a flight 2/3 level team.


Somebody has to pull Burlingame's DA card already, they are getting blown out all over the place.  They've been outscored 30-1 in 3 games in the 04, 03, & 01/02 DA games. Damn!


----------



## espola

Justafan said:


> Somebody has to pull Burlingame's DA card already, they are getting blown out all over the place.  They've been outscored 30-1 in 3 games in the 04, 03, & 01/02 DA games. Damn!


It's development.  Winning doesn't matter.


----------



## LASTMAN14

espola said:


> It's development.  Winning doesn't matter.


Why do you bother? Ugh...


----------



## PLSAP

espola said:


> It's development.  Winning doesn't matter.


Losing 11-0 isn't development. Nor is 8-0, or 11-1. 

Development comes from an environment that is the correct level for the girls to be competitive in and still execute what they are working on on their practice field. NOT an 11-0 slaughter that only puts down their confidence, and prohibits the girls on the losing side to try much of anything and were probably spending more time focusing on not having to take the ball out of the net again rather than their skills on the field. 

How is a 11-0 game meaningful or develop anybody who was on that field, winning side or losing?


----------



## PLSAP

LASTMAN14 said:


> Why do you bother? Ugh...


I'm starting to regret even replying ...


----------



## LASTMAN14

PLSAP said:


> I'm starting to regret even replying ...


To E. Yes. Never reply.


----------



## Striker17

Well the good news is this is only Surf Cup. I am looking forward to seeing how Surf gracefully navigates winning their Natty tomorrow at u14 to a team they slaughtered 8-0 on Monday. Will we see 30 passes before a goal? Will we see a mercy rule? Once they get to 3-0 will they have to play with lefts only? 
So maybe instead of lamenting about DA we should question a National championship where every team other than our stars doesn't belong there. 
Ahh the questions ..


----------



## espola

PLSAP said:


> Losing 11-0 isn't development. Nor is 8-0, or 11-1.
> 
> Development comes from an environment that is the correct level for the girls to be competitive in and still execute what they are working on on their practice field. NOT an 11-0 slaughter that only puts down their confidence, and prohibits the girls on the losing side to try much of anything and were probably spending more time focusing on not having to take the ball out of the net again rather than their skills on the field.
> 
> How is a 11-0 game meaningful or develop anybody who was on that field, winning side or losing?


Did you see the game?


----------



## Striker17

Justafan said:


> Somebody has to pull Burlingame's DA card already, they are getting blown out all over the place.  They've been outscored 30-1 in 3 games in the 04, 03, & 01/02 DA games. Damn!


I would be curious as to what happened. I know in one game a lot of youngers were playing up and there was the typical hit to forward action. I don't care much for scores- anything more than 3-0 is usually a really horrible game anyway


----------



## Fact

Reading the Nocalforum it looks like the best teams in Northern Cal are staying with ECNL.  If and when ECNL folds, might this change the quality of the norcal DA teams?  Also who are the Thorns?  Did they take over a club or are they brand new?


----------



## Striker17

Fact said:


> Reading the Nocalforum it looks like the best teams in Northern Cal are staying with ECNL.  If and when ECNL folds, might this change the quality of the norcal DA teams?  Also who are the Thorns?  Did they take over a club or are they brand new?


The NorCal teams at 04 are awesome. MVLA is incredible! Deza took everyone to Earthquakes so they are going to be great. If you like soccer the videos of Surf vs MVLA last year are great to watch or have your daughter watch! Highly suggest
@davin and @kickingandscreaming are the best to answer. The Thorns are non stop marketing geniuses on social media and Brandi Chastain is coaching them. Brand new affiliated with MLS.


----------



## Kicking it

Kicking it said:


> That Burlin


The Thorns are the De Anza Force's GDA


----------



## Fact

Striker17 said:


> The NorCal teams at 04 are awesome. MVLA is incredible! Deza took everyone to Earthquakes so they are going to be great. If you like soccer the videos of Surf vs MVLA last year are great to watch or have your daughter watch! Highly suggest
> @davin and @kickingandscreaming are the best to answer. The Thorns are non stop marketing geniuses on social media and Brandi Chastain is coaching them. Brand new affiliated with MLS.


I was actually expecting all of the Earthquake teams to put up double digits. My niece has a friend on one of the older teams and drives a distance for the Quakes and I know boys in SF that have been driving to SJ for DA teams. MVLA stayed ECNL?  I was just wondering what clubs did Thorns players come from?


----------



## Striker17

Really? The soccer god himself Deza is at Earthquakes I thought? Surely they went with him? 
Ok and since I am in it whose the other Barca genius they have up there ?
NorCal no joke!


----------



## Striker17

@Fact check out the 04 Surf Cup thread they have it all listed and discussed start at beginning the NorCal guys are very cool and involved.
Oh and if you can see any team play yes DEZA teams or MVLA. 
Look at the video they posted


----------



## Fact

So before DA the Bay Area had ECNL - MVLA, Mustang, Rage and De Anza.  Now they have ENCL - MVLA and DA - Earthquakes, Burlingame, and Thorns.  Am I missing Rage and Mustangs?


----------



## davin

Striker17 said:


> Really? The soccer god himself Deza is at Earthquakes I thought? Surely they went with him?
> Ok and since I am in it whose the other Barca genius they have up there ?
> NorCal no joke!


Deza left for the Quakes in the middle of the spring season. His 04 team didn't finish the season so they could keep training with him. Most of his older teams finished out their seasons with DeAnza. From what I hear, for the older teams,'only about half chose to follow Deza to the Quakes. The other half stayed.

DeAnza got threatened by ECNL in the spring to take get their membership taken away when EcNL found them straddling the fence between DA and ECNL with their partnership with the Thorns. DeAnza tried to keep their membership by disavowing their affiliation with the Thorns, but in the end ECNL kicked them out anyway. Now the partnership is in full effect and DeAnza is putting their top trams(what's left of them anyway) into the Thorns DA.


----------



## davin

Fact said:


> So before DA the Bay Area had ECNL - MVLA, Mustang, Rage and De Anza.  Now they have ENCL - MVLA and DA - Earthquakes, Burlingame, and Thorns.  Am I missing Rage and Mustangs?


ECNL is MVLA, Rage, Mustang, San Juan, Santa Rosa, and Davis Legacy

DA is Quakes, Thorns, Burlingame, PSV, Lamorinda, and Placer.


----------



## The Driver

Justafan said:


> Somebody has to pull Burlingame's DA card already, they are getting blown out all over the place.  They've been outscored 30-1 in 3 games in the 04, 03, & 01/02 DA games. Damn!


Who do you give it to?


----------



## The Driver

Any southern California card need pulling?


----------



## Kicking it

Striker17 said:


> @Fact check out the 04 Surf Cup thread they have it all listed and discussed start at beginning the NorCal guys are very cool and involved.
> Oh and if you can see any team play yes DEZA teams or MVLA.
> Look at the video they posted


@Striker17 I can't seem to find that thread in Nocal forum. Can you help?


----------



## Fact

davin said:


> ECNL is MVLA, Rage, Mustang, San Juan, Santa Rosa, and Davis Legacy
> 
> DA is Quakes, Thorns, Burlingame, PSV, Lamorinda, and Placer.


So at least looking at the Bay Area which I include Rage, Mustang, MVLA, Thorns, Quakes and Thorns, having the DA did not further dilute the player pool.  So where did all the best players go?  Funny how everyone was concerned that having both DA and ECNL in socal would dilute the teams to the point of not being competitive.  But look how great Surfs 04 B team did today.


----------



## Fact

The Driver said:


> Who do you give it to?


No one. It does not appear that that area can support another top team.


----------



## davin

Fact said:


> So at least looking at the Bay Area which I include Rage, Mustang, MVLA, Thorns, Quakes and Thorns, having the DA did not further dilute the player pool.  So where did all the best players go?  Funny how everyone was concerned that having both DA and ECNL in socal would dilute the teams to the point of not being competitive.  But look how great Surfs 04 B team did today.


The talent pool is very diluted. Between SF and San Jose, last year there were 2 ECNL clubs. Now there are 4 DA clubs and 1 ECNL club in the same area. There are not that many elite girls to go around in this area. 
As far as where the best players went, it looks like the ECNL clubs' teams stayed mostly intact. From what I hear DeAnza's 04s followed Deza to the Quakes, and half the kids from his older teams followed him as well. The other half stayed with DeAnza and will play for the Thorns DA. 
I wouldn't read too much into Surfs second team beating Burlingame by the big margin. They played Norcal gold last year which would be equivalent to your flight 2 or 3.


----------



## Fact

I was always surprised that MVLA and De Anza were so close geographically and then there was nothing going north for an hour and a half.  So someone living in SF had a long trek north, south or east.  Now they have added Quakes in the same area and Burlingame not that far away (20 minutes from DeAnza?).  I wonder if a club in SF received DA status instead of Burlingame and/or Quakes would have helped?


----------



## davin

Fact said:


> I was always surprised that MVLA and De Anza were so close geographically and then there was nothing going north for an hour and a half.  So someone living in SF had a long trek north, south or east.  Now they have added Quakes in the same area and Burlingame not that far away (20 minutes from DeAnza?).  I wonder if a club in SF received DA status instead of Burlingame and/or Quakes would have helped?


SF, although it has a large population, doesn't have a whole lot of kids. Not very many families in the city, proportionally. The clubs there are really weak, so that wouldn't make sense to give any club in San Francisco DA status.


----------



## Fact

davin said:


> SF, although it has a large population, doesn't have a whole lot of kids. Not very many families in the city, proportionally. The clubs there are really weak, so that wouldn't make sense to give any club in San Francisco DA status.


I guess I was being optimistic thinking that girls DA had an opportunity to do what is best for the players.  I don't put much stock in giving the best clubs DA status.  I believe that giving DA status, coaches and players will come regardless of the prior status of the club.  I would have rather had all the clubs spread out to give the most players the opportunity to play DA.  At least if a SF club received DA status, it would split the distance between Santa Rosa and Thorns, as well as to the east.

In Socal, I think they did an ok job despite the concentration in OC, which is justified given the talent.


----------



## davin

Fact said:


> I guess I was being optimistic thinking that girls DA had an opportunity to do what is best for the players.  I don't put much stock in giving the best clubs DA status.  I believe that giving DA status, coaches and players will come regardless of the prior status of the club.  I would have rather had all the clubs spread out to give the most players the opportunity to play DA.  At least if a SF club received DA status, it would split the distance between Santa Rosa and Thorns, as well as to the east.
> 
> In Socal, I think they did an ok job despite the concentration in OC, which is justified given the talent.


Well, Burlingame was given DA status and the players and coaches obviously didn't come, based on today's Surf results.


----------



## Fact

davin said:


> Well, Burlingame was given DA status and the players and coaches obviously didn't come, based on today's Surf results.


Burlingame is too close to the other clubs.  I meant that if it were spread out, there probably is a pool of players that have not been willing to travel.

@MakeALoser- Glad to see I got under your scales.  Wasting time marking all my posts a dumb...get life Loser!


----------



## smsummers

davin said:


> Well, Burlingame was given DA status and the players and coaches obviously didn't come, based on today's Surf results.


MVLA's doc runs the GDA program at Burlingame. MVLA has one foot in the door seeing what happens with GDA. As far as I know none of the MVLA girls have moved to Burlingame's GDA hence the scores that were reflected from today. My guess is if MVLA's  top teams can not find meaniful competition, they will move to Burlingame's GDA. The powers to be thought Burlingame would be competitive without the MVLA teams but that is clearly not the case. Will be interesting if GDA gives Burlingame an ultimatum. Put all MVLA's best players in GDA or lose your membership.


----------



## The Driver

Part of development is learning how to deal with not winning. I suggest the Burlingame staff makes sure the dds get frozen yogurt after game like the one today. Frozen yogurt has probiotics which is good for their tummies after playing in the heat. It's also makes you forget stuff quick. Development isn't a sprint especially on the dd side of the game.


----------



## Kicking it

Does anyone know if the Surf Cup games are being live streamed?


----------



## LASTMAN14

davin said:


> Deza left for the Quakes in the middle of the spring season. His 04 team didn't finish the season so they could keep training with him. Most of his older teams finished out their seasons with DeAnza. From what I hear, for the older teams,'only about half chose to follow Deza to the Quakes. The other half stayed.
> 
> DeAnza got threatened by ECNL in the spring to take get their membership taken away when EcNL found them straddling the fence between DA and ECNL with their partnership with the Thorns. DeAnza tried to keep their membership by disavowing their affiliation with the Thorns, but in the end ECNL kicked them out anyway. Now the partnership is in full effect and DeAnza is putting their top trams(what's left of them anyway) into the Thorns DA.


Read the NorCal Soccer Forum on this matter. It's like 20 plus pages of why Deza left, ECNL, etc...and  a TMZ saga.


----------



## Striker17

Fact said:


> I was always surprised that MVLA and De Anza were so close geographically and then there was nothing going north for an hour and a half.  So someone living in SF had a long trek north, south or east.  Now they have added Quakes in the same area and Burlingame not that far away (20 minutes from DeAnza?).  I wonder if a club in SF received DA status instead of Burlingame and/or Quakes would have helped?


I was always surprised that they were so close and the style was SO DIFFERENT. I know coach dependent but the difference in the two was startling. Always great soccer


----------



## Striker17

smsummers said:


> MVLA's doc runs the GDA program at Burlingame. MVLA has one foot in the door seeing what happens with GDA. As far as I know none of the MVLA girls have moved to Burlingame's GDA hence the scores that were reflected from today. My guess is if MVLA's  top teams can not find meaniful competition, they will move to Burlingame's GDA. The powers to be thought Burlingame would be competitive without the MVLA teams but that is clearly not the case. Will be interesting if GDA gives Burlingame an ultimatum. Put all MVLA's best players in GDA or lose your membership.


That is interesting. I thought they didn't have a choice! Well honestly if that MVLA 04 team is moving in please let me know because I would like to be able to mentally prep for the beating before I can't even imagine thinking we would be playing Burlingame and then MVLA showing LOL!!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Fact said:


> Burlingame is too close to the other clubs.  I meant that if it were spread out, there probably is a pool of players that have not been willing to travel.
> 
> @MakeALoser- Glad to see I got under your scales.  Wasting time marking all my posts a dumb...get life Loser!


@Fact You are such a scrub nothing you could do would bother me. You are still hoping and dreaming that your kid will get on a good team and find a good coach and hope that she can continue her soccer career.  You are the one talking about $hitty teams and hoping that your player can get into a good position. None of those things concern me!  You are trying your best but stupidity and athleticism is genetic so you can't blame yourself or your kid. It's okay I hear that lacrosse is a good place for unskilled players that wash out of soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Fact said:


> So at least looking at the Bay Area which I include Rage, Mustang, MVLA, Thorns, Quakes and Thorns, having the DA did not further dilute the player pool.  So where did all the best players go?  Funny how everyone was concerned that having both DA and ECNL in socal would dilute the teams to the point of not being competitive.  But look how great Surfs 04 B team did today.


Does your kid even play in a decent team?  She probably sucks.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Does your kid even play in a decent team?  She probably sucks.


Oh, you're that parent.


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> @Fact You are such a scrub nothing you could do would bother me. You are still hoping and dreaming that your kid will get on a good team and find a good coach and hope that she can continue her soccer career.  You are the one talking about $hitty teams and hoping that your player can get into a good position. None of those things concern me!  You are trying your best but stupidity and athleticism is genetic so you can't blame yourself or your kid. It's okay I hear that lacrosse is a good place for unskilled players that wash out of soccer.


http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/estimated-probability-competing-college-athletics

Hey now! Maybe some of us are just smart .... 
Oh and by the way USC and UCLA are going from Club to NCAA status so about that......
I would take boys lax any day over soccer!!! Any day!! 
My girl is harder to convince


----------



## MakeAPlay

@CaliKlines I saw your players Legends team play and to be quite honest your daughter was a ghost and had zero impact on the game.  If I was you I would consider cross country because she will never play at NC State and my money is on her transferring after one year.  @Fact you should just invest in tutors and SAT prep and ROTC.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/estimated-probability-competing-college-athletics
> 
> Hey now! Maybe some of us are just smart ....
> Oh and by the way USC and UCLA are going from Club to NCAA status so about that......
> I would take boys lax any day over soccer!!! Any day!!
> My girl is harder to convince


I know some LAX players and they are definitely badass!  Nothing against LAX it's a pretty cool game.


----------



## davin

Wow. That got ugly fast. LOL.


----------



## NoGoal

MakeAPlay said:


> @CaliKlines I saw your players Legends team play and to be quite honest your daughter was a ghost and had zero impact on the game.  If I was you I would consider cross country because she will never play at NC State and my money is on her transferring after one year.  @Fact you should just invest in tutors and SAT prep and ROTC.


Cross Country requires running though.


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> Oh, you're that parent.


Yup I am that parent that will go for the jugular so you might not want to attack me because like Kim Jong Un I will start WWIII if you try but I have all the ammo.


----------



## MakeAPlay

davin said:


> Wow. That got ugly fast. LOL.


I apologize to those that are trying to get info.  When the pansy crowd comes out and starts picking fights out of their weight class things can escalate quickly.

I apologize to you for having to read it.


----------



## PLSAP

Definitely not  completely the same RSC ECNL 00 team, although I am aware the keeper is at the ECNL training camp.

I see that the Burlingame team was trying to pass the ball around, so respect for that. It's just highlights, and mainly toward the RSC team, so I am taking that with a grain of salt, however, this is not development. This did nothing for either team. I don't know how to explain common sense.


----------



## MakeAPlay

PLSAP said:


> Definitely not  completely the same RSC ECNL 00 team, although I am aware the keeper is at the ECNL training camp.


Their keeper that is at the camp is stud.  She will do well at Stanford.


----------



## Striker17

As stated many times tons of movement I am not seeing the same teams at all. Lots of guests, lots of missing players (half in some cases).


----------



## Striker17

MakeAPlay said:


> I know some LAX players and they are definitely badass!  Nothing against LAX it's a pretty cool game.


It's chess at this point for me- don't want early specialization and have a coach who is great and allowing the three sports. Four days a week started and it's still ok but let's see when school begins how it works. Shes clearly the highest level of fitness on her team - she doesn't have that "soccer run" that unfit soccer players get it you know what I mean? She has a totally different gait and I attribute it to the explosivity she requires at the other sports. A lot of these girls I am seeing are completely unfit


----------



## CaliKlines

MakeAPlay said:


> @CaliKlines I saw your players Legends team play and to be quite honest your daughter was a ghost and had zero impact on the game.  If I was you I would consider cross country because she will never play at NC State and my money is on her transferring after one year.  @Fact you should just invest in tutors and SAT prep and ROTC.


Thanks for the constructive criticism, and I agree that she didn't play her normal game. But guess what, it is just one game, and she will take the loss and continue to work hard and improve during her senior year. She'll get better, but you, on the other hand, won't. You'll still be a dick a year from now. And for probably many more years to come.


----------



## Kicking it

PLSAP said:


> Definitely not  completely the same RSC ECNL 00 team, although I am aware the keeper is at the ECNL training camp.
> 
> I see that the Burlingame team was trying to pass the ball around, so respect for that. It's just highlights, and mainly toward the RSC team, so I am taking that with a grain of salt, however, this is not development. This did nothing for either team. I don't know how to explain common sense.


@PLSAP Where can I see live stream of surf cup games?


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Yup I am that parent that will go for the jugular so you might not want to attack me because like Kim Jong Un I will start WWIII if you try but I have all the ammo.


Someone already commented on your lack of humility, so I won't.


----------



## PLSAP

Kicking it said:


> @PLSAP Where can I see live stream of surf cup games?


I don't think there is. This is just a highlight reel from one of RSC's parent who records their games. Sorry


----------



## NoGoal

CaliKlines said:


> Thanks for the constructive criticism, and I agree that she didn't play her normal game. But guess what, it is just one game, and she will take the loss and continue to work hard and improve during her senior year. She'll get better, but you, on the other hand, won't. You'll still be a dick a year from now. And for probably many more years to come.


I believe MAP was posting about the live stream replay game from Thursday.  You are posting about your DD playing poorly today during today's semi final loss.  Carry on!


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> I believe MAP was posting about the live stream replay game from Thursday.  You are posting about your DD playing poorly today during today's semi final loss.  Carry on!


For the record, I have always been critical on my DD's play.  "NO" coddling here.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> For the record, I have always been critical on my DD's play.  "NO" coddling here.


 Is she allowed make her argument after being critiqued? 

I just asking because I study alpha Dds.


----------



## The Driver

The Driver said:


> Is she allowed make her argument after being critiqued?
> 
> I just asking because I study alpha Dds.


Because I have one and many of you do as well. It cracks me up seeing the energy from 3 parents who have D1 players. I believe I've seen all 3 play and they all are D1 players. I would love to be the dealer of Texas Holdem with all 3 mic'd just to ear hustle. I wish they would play nice because they are local heros to some dds in the area hnmmm They won't though cause they are cut from a cloth that isn't hypoallergenic so it may irritate many.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> Is she allowed make her argument after being critiqued?
> 
> I just asking because I study alpha Dds.


Don't you worry, she still got her ice cream afterwards.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> Because I have one and many of you do as well. It cracks me up seeing the energy from 3 parents who have D1 players. I believe I've seen all 3 play and they all are D1 players. I would love to be the dealer of Texas Holdem with all 3 mic'd just to ear hustle. I wish they would play nice because they are local heros to some dds in the area hnmmm They won't though cause they are cut from a cloth that isn't hypoallergenic so it may irritate many.


Can you re-post in English please?


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Don't you worry, she still got her ice cream afterwards.


Wasn't worried at all. We alway do the frozen yogurt but we don't all get the toppings. Most of the time we go H. A. M. with the Toppings.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Can you re-post in English please?


You underdug what I was saying. Don't get upset with me fellow soccer pops. We thread the same currents. I don't go at no one on this forum. I come in respect.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> You underdug what I was saying. Don't get upset with me fellow soccer pops. We thread the same currents. I don't go at no one on this forum. I come in respect.


You're a 03 Blues parent.....I am former Blues parent myself, so not upset at all.

Seriously, I didn't get your post.  It was all over the place.  Are you posting 3 parents on the 03 Blues Rennie/Bobak team are hard on their DDs and they are projected to be future D1 players?


----------



## The Driver

My flip flop doesn't have the grammarly app on it and sorry for being all over the place. I am the Driver Formerly Known as a Blues Parent.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> My flip flop doesn't have the grammarly app on it and sorry for being all over the place. I am the Driver Formerly Known as a Blues Parent.


Smart move, if your DD left for a DA team.  Blues typically doesn't promote from their sister teams.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Smart move, if your DD left for a DA team.  Blues typically doesn't promote from their sister teams.


Then again personally, there were a few A teams and clubs where I didn't want my DD playing at/for.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Then again personally, there were a few A teams and clubs where I didn't want my DD playing at/for.


My daughter enjoyed every minute playing for the Blues. We don't get caught up in the A or B team business. All the chicken knew who the Hens were at the Ranch. My DD played by ear and now she needs to learn how to Read music that's the only reason for the move. Forever Live the 18 yard club and the Black and Blue 6 yard lounge.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> My daughter enjoyed every minute playing for the Blues. We don't get caught up in the A or B team business. All the chicken knew who the Hens were at the Ranch. My DD played by ear and now she needs to learn how to Read music that's the only reason for the move. Forever Live the 18 yard club and the Black and Blue 6 yard lounge.


And a few of those chickens developed into roosters, surpassing those hens.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> And a few of those chickens developed into roosters, surpassing those hens.


No rosters at the Ranch it's a all chicken or Hen show.


----------



## SoccerMum1988

PLSAP said:


> Definitely not  completely the same RSC ECNL 00 team, although I am aware the keeper is at the ECNL training camp.
> 
> I see that the Burlingame team was trying to pass the ball around, so respect for that. It's just highlights, and mainly toward the RSC team, so I am taking that with a grain of salt, however, this is not development. This did nothing for either team. I don't know how to explain common sense.


You can't blame RSC because Surf does the scheduling of games. I mean 10-0 is over the top but it just sounds as if the other team was just not the same caliber. The majority of the RSC team is the same team. Some of the girls were on KWs RSC ECNL team but they are 2018 so they moved to ABs DA 00 team. KM the goalie is at camp but the goalie for this game is very good. She's also from KWs RSC team and going to CSUF in the fall. But seriously ZH #13 was on fire and poorly marked; she's a player though, she a Oregon Duck come 2018. My DD has played with a lot of these girls but she's at another academy club. Besides the WA Crossfire team, it appears most of the CAS teams are dominating the bracket anyway.


----------



## NoGoal

SoccerMum1988 said:


> You can't blame RSC because Surf does the scheduling of games. I mean 10-0 is over the top but it just sounds as if the other team was just not the same caliber. The majority of the RSC team is the same team. Some of the girls were on KWs RSC ECNL team but they are 2018 so they moved to ABs DA 00 team. KM the goalie is at camp but the goalie for this game is very good. She's also from KWs RSC team and going to CSUF in the fall. But seriously ZH #13 was on fire and poorly marked; she's a player though, she a Oregon Duck come 2018. My DD has played with a lot of these girls but she's at another academy club. Besides the WA Crossfire team, it appears most of the CAS teams are dominating the bracket anyway.


ZH is a great player!


----------



## SoccerMum1988

NoGoal said:


> ZH is a great player!


I agree....I didn't mean for it to sound otherwise. It's just after she scored 4+ goals on them...they still couldn't figure out how to mark her!!


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> Someone already commented on your lack of humility, so I won't.


@espola I really don't care what you think Mr. Magoo.


----------



## The Driver

Protip:
Roosters are boys chickens.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> @espola I really don't care what you think Mr. Magoo.


So why did you use that particular nickname?


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> So why did you use that particular nickname?


Why don't you go ahead and ponder the reason.  You remember the character don't you?


----------



## espola

espola said:


> So why did you use that particular nickname?


I ask a question, and you respond with a "Dumb" flag?


----------



## Kicknit22

Funny thing is, as I sit here with my IPad sippin  In one hand and reading along, I notice as I scroll with my right thumb that I accidentally hit a rating.  I can't help but wonder how many inadvertent "dumb" or "creative" ratings I've handed out lol!!


----------



## The Driver

Loose leaf?


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> Protip:
> Roosters are boys chickens.


Don't read things so literaly!

CaliKlines, so did your DD really have poor back to back games?


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Don't read things so literaly!


Sir I don't at all.


----------



## Striker17

The Driver said:


> Protip:
> Roosters are boys chickens.


What are old roosters with expired A licenses called .
Sorry I had to


----------



## The Driver

Striker17 said:


> What are old roosters with expired A licenses called .
> Sorry I had to


I wouldn't know


----------



## push_up

MakeAPlay said:


> Why don't you go ahead and ponder the reason.  You remember the character don't you?


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Why don't you go ahead and ponder the reason.  You remember the character don't you?


Are you embarrassed to admit you have nothing?


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Why don't you go ahead and ponder the reason.  You remember the character don't you?


Mr Magoo the cartoon character was old, bald, and had bad vision and Jim Backus' voice.  I have most of my original hair, I can read both the book in my lap and the label on the Viet Huong fish sauce bottle in the other side of the next room, and I have a pleasing tenor voice.  You're mocking me because I am old?  How classy.


----------



## PLSAP

SoccerMum1988 said:


> You can't blame RSC because Surf does the scheduling of games. I mean 10-0 is over the top but it just sounds as if the other team was just not the same caliber. The majority of the RSC team is the same team. Some of the girls were on KWs RSC ECNL team but they are 2018 so they moved to ABs DA 00 team. KM the goalie is at camp but the goalie for this game is very good. She's also from KWs RSC team and going to CSUF in the fall. But seriously ZH #13 was on fire and poorly marked; she's a player though, she a Oregon Duck come 2018. My DD has played with a lot of these girls but she's at another academy club. Besides the WA Crossfire team, it appears most of the CAS teams are dominating the bracket anyway.


Please don't get me wrong. I was not blaming RSC. It's a strong team. I know several players on that team are complete studs, and some others are pretty darn close. Including KM and ZH, and I did not mean to make it sound like the other keeper was not up to level. I wouldn't even blame Surf either. It's not their fault that they had to create a limited bracket with unbalanced teams.


----------



## NoGoal

Well with Surf Cup and Silverlakes unveiling Girls DA teams this weekend isn't anyone going to post about the mandated style of play for the teams? Is it possession based with the ball on the ground? How was the play time for the subs?  Any subbing during the 1st half?  Did the subs get ample pitch time in front of college coaches?


----------



## Kicknit22

NoGoal said:


> Well with Surf Cup and Silverlakes unveiling Girls DA teams this weekend isn't anyone going to post about the mandated style of play for the teams? Is it possession based with the ball on the ground? How was the play time for the subs?  Any subbing during the 1st half?  Did the subs get ample pitch time in front of college coaches?


Nothing is mandated until August 1. I'm sure they just played normal tournament rules.


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> Mr Magoo the cartoon character was old, bald, and had bad vision and Jim Backus' voice.  I have most of my original hair, I can read both the book in my lap and the label on the Viet Huong fish sauce bottle in the other side of the next room, and I have a pleasing tenor voice.  You're mocking me because I am old?  How classy.


I'm actually mocking you because you are extremely repetitive and annoying.  I am mocking your myopia.  I am mocking the fact that you are trying to get involved in an "A" and "B" conversation.  I am mocking you because to be quite honest it is a waste of my time to respond to you.  I can spend a bunch more time mocking you but it isn't worth my time.


----------



## The Driver

@MakeAPlay do you know what a hen or group of hens would do to another hen if she crowed/mocked like a rooster? That's the special thing about the chicken and hen side of soccer everything they do is Purdy no matter the style of play.

Ps those bonus hens with the nuggets at the bottom were roosters not Cornish.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> I'm actually mocking you because you are extremely repetitive and annoying.  I am mocking your myopia.  I am mocking the fact that you are trying to get involved in an "A" and "B" conversation.  I am mocking you because to be quite honest it is a waste of my time to respond to you.  I can spend a bunch more time mocking you but it isn't worth my time.


The question was why Magoo?  You don't know?


----------



## The Driver

I will take the ratings as long as it's shifts away from talking about dds on this forum.


----------



## The Driver

Protip: 
When you see a young girl crash into another girl 

They are most likely tired. 

So don't Yell COME ON WHAT WAS THAT!!!! Just sounds so bad.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> Protip:
> When you see a young girl crash into another girl
> 
> They are most likely tired.
> 
> So don't Yell COME ON WHAT WAS THAT!!!! Just sounds so bad.


Really, that is bad?

Good thing when your DD was at Blues she didn't play for a GB.


----------



## The Driver

No Goal I watched  the Bakers run many practices and small group sessions and I never once heard neither yell. One of the things I paid close attention to was how the chickens walked to the Bakers sessions and they always seemed in great moods. I only watched maybe half dozen games though and I didn't notice anything bad.

No Goal only problem I  had with the Ranch was the No Fishing Sign.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> No Goal I watched  the Bakers run many practices and small group sessions and I never once heard neither yell. One of the things I paid close attention to was how the chickens walked to the Bakers sessions and they always seemed in great moods. I only watched maybe half dozen games though and I didn't notice anything bad.
> 
> No Goal only problem I  had with the Ranch was the No Fishing Sign.


Protip: coaching practice vs coaching games are two different atmospheres.

If you were offended that a coach yelled "what is that".  Sorry but you need thicker skin.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Protip: coaching practice vs coaching games are two different atmospheres.


@NoGoal I would let my DD play for the Bakers with volume turnt up in terms of coaching cues. Like I said the chickens seems to all be happy around the Bakers. Not much yelling at the Ranch that I witnessed. This is coaching not AP testing.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> @NoGoal I would let my DD play for the Bakers with volume turnt up in terms of coaching cues. Like I said the chickens seems to all be happy around the Bakers. Not much yelling at the Ranch that I witnessed. This is coaching not AP testing.


Sure you would and I not all those chickens were happy as a couple of his starting players moved to another club.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Protip: coaching practice vs coaching games are two different atmospheres.
> 
> If you were offended that a coach yelled "what is that".  Sorry but you need thicker skin.


It's was a group of parents not a coach. You know the ones @NoGoal.


----------



## NoGoal

NoGoal said:


> Sure you would and I not all those chickens were happy as a couple of his starting players moved to another club.


You can say 2 chickens flew the coop.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> It's was a group of parents not a coach. You know the ones @NoGoal.


No I don't I'm quite on the sidelines.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> No I don't I'm quit on the sidelines.


You hear them.


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> You hear them.


Get use to it, they're on all the A teams.  Look at it this way, at least it's "NOT" the coach.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Get use to it, they're on all the A teams.  Look at it this way, at least it's "NOT" the coach.


It was a ulittle game but nevermind that 

Does A team stand for better then the B team or does it mean there are 2 teams at that age group?


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> It was a ulittle game but nevermind that
> 
> Does A team stand for better then the B team or does it mean there are 2 teams at that age group?


Um you should know by now that Ulitte parents are the worst.  They all think their DD's are the next Marta. All you to do, if don't want to hear their comments.....use your Iphone headphones and play music.

It means both.


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> Sure you would and I not all those chickens were happy as a couple of his starting players moved to another club.


Not at all Sir. Like I said my DD is no longer with the Blues so that 'sure you would' is funny. Big Ups to the Blues though I have nothing bad to say @NoGoal


----------



## Striker17

NoGoal said:


> Um you should know by now that Ulitte parents are the worst.  They all think their DD's are the next Marta. All you to do, if don't want to hear their comments.....use your Iphone headphones and play music.
> 
> It means both.


I hope it ends at 14. Please tell me it ends at 14. Between the promotional Instagrams and parents LYING about who wants Their DD the atmosphere is baaaadd


----------



## NoGoal

The Driver said:


> Not at all Sir. Like I said my DD is no longer with the Blues so that 'sure you would' is funny. Big Ups to the Blues though I have nothing bad to say @NoGoal


Not sure you understood what sure you would meant.  I meant sure you would have your DD play for a GB team, especially with a parent yelling "what was that" on the sidelines.


----------



## NoGoal

Striker17 said:


> I hope it ends at 14. Please tell me it ends at 14. Between the promotional Instagrams and parents LYING about who wants Their DD the atmosphere is baaaadd


It ends after specific college coaches extends athletic scholarships revealing just how good a player really is.


----------



## chargerfan

NoGoal said:


> It ends after specific college coaches extends athletic scholarships revealing just how good a player really is.


I'm sure that shuts a lot of parents up


----------



## The Driver

NoGoal said:


> It ends after specific college coaches extends athletic scholarships revealing just how good a player really is.


Thus removing the tag projected


----------



## Striker17

NoGoal said:


> It ends after specific college coaches extends athletic scholarships revealing just how good a player really is.


Hopefully NCAA will wake up and recognize RAE in girls this age and quit buying u13-u14 lemons.


----------



## PLSAP

Striker17 said:


> RAE


what does that stand for?


----------



## Striker17

Relative age effect


----------



## The Driver

Striker17 said:


> Relative age effect


Is it 18-22 like most women's team sports or is soccer's different?


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> @NoGoal I would let my DD play for the Bakers with volume turnt up in terms of coaching cues. Like I said the chickens seems to all be happy around the Bakers. Not much yelling at the Ranch that I witnessed. This is coaching not AP testing.


@The Driver I am not sure about what you saw. but I can tell you that only once has my player asked for a different coach.  To each his/her own.


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> @MakeAPlay do you know what a hen or group of hens would do to another hen if she crowed/mocked like a rooster? That's the special thing about the chicken and hen side of soccer everything they do is Purdy no matter the style of play.
> 
> Ps those bonus hens with the nuggets at the bottom were roosters not Cornish.


I'm not sure what you mean but an Alpha is always an Alpha and a Beta can try to be an Alpha but that doesn't change anything.


----------



## Fact

NoGoal said:


> Um you should know by now that Ulitte parents are the worst.  They all think their DD's are the next Marta. All you to do, if don't want to hear their comments.....use your Iphone headphones and play music.
> 
> It means both.


I would not say Ulittle parents are the worst.  From the looks of it, 2 know it all parents, one with a college player and one with a soon to be college player on a forum for youth soccer that are living vicariously thru their DDs and feel the need to constantly bash other peoples' kids are the worst.


----------



## NoGoal

Fact said:


> I would not say Ulittle parents are the worst.  From the looks of it, 2 know it all parents, one with a college player and one with a soon to be college player on a forum for youth soccer that are living vicariously thru their DDs and feel the need to constantly bash other peoples' kids are the worst.


Ah lookie here, FACT you're proving my point.  You're one of those Ulittle parents.  Don't worry you won't posting in a year or two, after the college coaches sort things out for you.

 I've seen many posters like you come and go!


----------



## PLSAP

The Driver said:


> @NoGoal I would let my DD play for the Bakers with volume turnt up in terms of coaching cues. Like I said the chickens seems to all be happy around the Bakers. Not much yelling at the Ranch that I witnessed. This is coaching not AP testing.


That's how it always is. Them and their parents, when asked about it, will say, "Oh, it's just a different coaching style", but if they leave, and I've seen it time and time again, from the kids and the parents, it turns into, "oh, he was horrible" "yeah, so and so was a douche bag" "he was an @#$".  It's this weird little things, they'll defend the coach out of loyalty, out of fear, out of not knowing better, but then they leave. They get a new coach, they see a good example of a coach. It's like they'll only either see or admit it once their are completely separated from the team/coach. In situations like that, what you're supposed to be looking for is what players and parents say after leaving, not the players and parents there.


----------



## espola

Fact said:


> I would not say Ulittle parents are the worst.  From the looks of it, 2 know it all parents, one with a college player and one with a soon to be college player on a forum for youth soccer that are living vicariously thru their DDs and feel the need to constantly bash other peoples' kids are the worst.


I have seen the effect last all the way through the child's college career.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Fact said:


> I would not say Ulittle parents are the worst.  From the looks of it, 2 know it all parents, one with a college player and one with a soon to be college player on a forum for youth soccer that are living vicariously thru their DDs and feel the need to constantly bash other peoples' kids are the worst.


You are pretty funny @Fact.  I'm sorry that your rectum is so sore but that will pass too.  Keep on posting you look like an idiot.  Why don't you start talking about team rankings and other stupid ULittle stuff.  Your day of reckoning will be coming sooner than you think.  Throwing stones at me is a big waste of your time because this is entertainment for me.  Stirring the pot and watching dumb ULittle parents go ape$hit is pretty funny.  I have to laugh about the living vicariously part because you are the one still searching for the right fit.  Carry on.


----------



## The Driver

MakeAPlay said:


> You are pretty funny @Fact.  I'm sorry that your rectum is so sore but that will pass too.  Keep on posting you look like an idiot.  Why don't you start talking about team rankings and other stupid ULittle stuff.  Your day of reckoning will be coming sooner than you think.  Throwing stones at me is a big waste of your time because this is entertainment for me.  Stirring the pot and watching dumb ULittle parents go ape$hit is pretty funny.  I have to laugh about the living vicariously part because you are the one still searching for the right fit.  Carry on.


@MakeAPlay I  how you say it so soccer mom mean.


----------



## espola

espola said:


> I have seen the effect last all the way through the child's college career.


I  gather by the negative ratings I got for this statement that other people know better about what I have seen than I do.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> You are pretty funny @Fact.  I'm sorry that your rectum is so sore but that will pass too.  Keep on posting you look like an idiot.  Why don't you start talking about team rankings and other stupid ULittle stuff.  Your day of reckoning will be coming sooner than you think.  Throwing stones at me is a big waste of your time because this is entertainment for me.  Stirring the pot and watching dumb ULittle parents go ape$hit is pretty funny.  I have to laugh about the living vicariously part because you are the one still searching for the right fit.  Carry on.


Are you admitting that you are not really as big an asshole as you act here - you just do it to "stir the pot"?


----------



## glen_dandy

espola said:


> I  gather by the negative ratings I got for this statement that other people know better about what I have seen than I do.


Oof.  I though you were being sarcastic/joking.  As in, folks overuse the RAE excuse so much, some even will say it about the college game.


----------



## espola

glen_dandy said:


> Oof.  I though you were being sarcastic/joking.  As in, folks overuse the RAE excuse so much, some even will say it about the college game.


Perhaps we are on different tracks.  I was referring to parents who have unrealistic opinions of their children's abilities, even to the point of harassing college coaches and teammate's parents.


----------



## gkrent

PLSAP said:


> That's how it always is. Them and their parents, when asked about it, will say, "Oh, it's just a different coaching style", but if they leave, and I've seen it time and time again, from the kids and the parents, it turns into, "oh, he was horrible" "yeah, so and so was a douche bag" "he was an @#$".  It's this weird little things, they'll defend the coach out of loyalty, out of fear, out of not knowing better, but then they leave. They get a new coach, they see a good example of a coach. It's like they'll only either see or admit it once their are completely separated from the team/coach. In situations like that, what you're supposed to be looking for is what players and parents say after leaving, not the players and parents there.


Guilty!  In my case I actually believed he was"just an oddball" until my DD made a choice that he disagreed with....then the douchebaggery floodgates opened!

Edited to add that I really believed he was just odd and thought he was a good coach until things went way sideways.  I think that might be the case with a lot of parents.


----------



## push_up

espola said:


> Are you admitting that you are not really as big an asshole as you act here - you just do it to "stir the pot"?


MAP is a mediocre former gymnast who is far from a perfect "10."  Thankfully, the apple does occasionally fall far from the tree.  

In response to this post, she is going to rip on my player.  It is all pretty sick, imo.  It is also sick that Dom allows her to insult children for her entertainment.


----------



## Fact

push_up said:


> MAP is a mediocre former gymnast who is far from a perfect "10."  Thankfully, the apple does occasionally fall far from the tree.
> 
> In response to this post, she is going to rip on my player.  It is all pretty sick, imo.  It is also sick that Dom allows her to insult children for her entertainment.


Thank you Push Up.  I have always valued your opinion on this forum.  If I remember correctly, her X (aka Size 13 because he was going to ram it up someone) was on a forced timeout from posting and somehow still managed to insult Dom's kid which resulted in Dom banning him.


----------



## espola

Fact said:


> Thank you Push Up.  I have always valued your opinion on this forum.  If I remember correctly, her X (aka Size 13 because he was going to ram it up someone) was on a forced timeout from posting and somehow still managed to insult Dom's kid which resulted in Dom banning him.


Do you mean that it is possible for someone to pose as another in order to pursue a personal vendetta?


----------



## SoccerLife75

Does anyone know, since Academy teams have nothing schedule for the rest of august, are the academy players allowed to guest in any of the August tournaments with other teams?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Fact said:


> Thank you Push Up.  I have always valued your opinion on this forum.  If I remember correctly, her X (aka Size 13 because he was going to ram it up someone) was on a forced timeout from posting and somehow still managed to insult Dom's kid which resulted in Dom banning him.


You are so foolish and I haven't quite figured out if you are sweetsplat/push_up talking to himself or some other old idiot poster.


----------



## MakeAPlay

push_up said:


> MAP is a mediocre former gymnast who is far from a perfect "10."  Thankfully, the apple does occasionally fall far from the tree.
> 
> In response to this post, she is going to rip on my player.  It is all pretty sick, imo.  It is also sick that Dom allows her to insult children for her entertainment.


And @push_up is a troll from Arizona with a former screen name of sweetsplat among others with a small penis who soccer reality is starting to hit.  It is pretty entertaining that all you can do is whine about it and watch my predictions come true.  His feelings are hurt and panties are constantly in a bunch.  Which I find entertaining for sure.


----------



## push_up

MakeAPlay said:


> And @push_up is a troll from Arizona with a former screen name of sweetsplat among others with a small penis who soccer reality is starting to hit.  It is pretty entertaining that all you can do is whine about it and watch my predictions come true.  His feelings are hurt and panties are constantly in a bunch.  Which I find entertaining for sure.


I am surprised Ms. Mediocre did not directly ripped on my player.  I am actually quite happy you fought against your natural instinct to insult her.  My player inks with power 5 on Wed, Feb. 6th, 2019.   Your predication is fail.

Oh and by the way, the only Christmas tree you are lighting up is the one with a ladder.


----------



## Striker17

So it is sweetsplat?! Wasn't he banned before ?


----------



## MakeAPlay

push_up said:


> I am surprised Ms. Mediocre did not directly ripped on my player.  I am actually quite happy you fought against your natural instinct to insult her.  My player inks with power 5 on Wed, Feb. 6th, 2019.   Your predication is fail.
> 
> Oh and by the way, the only Christmas tree you are lighting up is the one with a ladder.


You are so lame.  You couldn't wait to tell me that your little Mia is going to a P5.  Let me guess is it Oklahoma, Colorado or is it in state?  Quite the academic heft you have there.  You are pretty pathetic.  You assume other people's identity and then try to take a swipe at me?  We are in totally different orbits.  I believe that your kid is going P5 when I see it.  I honestly can't believe that you brought up your daughter getting committed as a junior. 

 You are still playing checkers..  I can't stop laughing at you.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> So it is sweetsplat?! Wasn't he banned before ?


Yes but who cares.  He is weak sauce and is still trying to prove to me that his kid is good enough.  Pathetic if you ask me.  I personally don't care what anyone other than my player's coach thinks of her.  His chains are so easy to rattle...


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Yes but who cares.  He is weak sauce and is still trying to prove to me that his kid is good enough.  Pathetic if you ask me.  I personally don't care what anyone other than my player's coach thinks of her.  His chains are so easy to rattle...


I think the time is past for you to prove you are "good enough" to be a decent human being.


----------



## The Driver

Protip 03s: 

Give your coach your dds school schedule and classes freshman year 

Look him or her in the eye and say

RUN WITH IT

If they stutter get ghost


----------



## Striker17

Or if they make the robotic team or debate team and have a major competition and are told "soccer is first" run...


----------



## espola

Striker17 said:


> Or if they make the robotic team or debate team and have a major competition and are told "soccer is first" run...


In 8th grade, my son joined the local lacrosse league.   At the first parents orientation meeting, the head coach declared "The following are not valid excuses for missing practice -- soccer, baseball, football, tennis, track, wrestling..."  Some people left without signing up.  We stuck with it for a year, even though his inexcusable absences for soccer events relegated him to the B team.

My daughter, on the other hand, joined the girls lacrosse team in 6th grade.  They were a much easier group to get along with.  The girls supported each other, even to the point that the high school girls volunteered to coach the younger kids.  She came to visit us this weekend, and spent a good deal of time with her high school lacrosse buddies.


----------



## offthecrossbar

espola said:


> In 8th grade, my son joined the local lacrosse league.   At the first parents orientation meeting, the head coach declared "The following are not valid excuses for missing practice -- soccer, baseball, football, tennis, track, wrestling..."  Some people left without signing up.  We stuck with it for a year, even though his inexcusable absences for soccer events relegated him to the B team.
> 
> My daughter, on the other hand, joined the girls lacrosse team in 6th grade.  They were a much easier group to get along with.  The girls supported each other, even to the point that the high school girls volunteered to coach the younger kids.  She came to visit us this weekend, and spent a good deal of time with her high school lacrosse buddies.


So!


----------



## espola

espola said:


> I think the time is past for you to prove you are "good enough" to be a decent human being.


...has passed...


----------



## push_up

MakeAPlay said:


> Yes but who cares.  He is weak sauce and is still trying to prove to me that his kid is good enough.  Pathetic if you ask me.  I personally don't care what anyone other than my player's coach thinks of her.  His chains are so easy to rattle...


Is that what you think I am trying to do, Amy?


----------



## SS22

Is Oklahoma and Colorado not good schools to get offers from?


----------



## push_up

SS22 said:


> Is Oklahoma and Colorado not good schools to get offers from?


Not according to Amy.  You also do not want an offer from ASU or UofA.  In addition, being committed as a Junior is also bad.  I think Ms. Mediocre Thorne should add these thoughts to the College Recruiting threat for the ulittles.


----------



## NoGoal

push_up said:


> Not according to Amy.  You also do not want an offer from ASU or UofA.  In addition, being committed as a Junior is also bad.  I think Ms. Mediocre Thorne should add these thoughts to the College Recruiting threat for the ulittles.


You are sweetsplat, lmao!


----------



## Livinthedream

NoGoal said:


> You are sweetsplat, lmao!


He's more like "Creepy Stocker Guy"


----------



## MakeAPlay

push_up said:


> Not according to Amy.  You also do not want an offer from ASU or UofA.  In addition, being committed as a Junior is also bad.  I think Ms. Mediocre Thorne should add these thoughts to the College Recruiting threat for the ulittles.


You are pretty dumb.  I have you all up in your feelings.  All I have to do is push and you keep on spilling your pathetic little guts.  Where is your daughter committed to sweetsplat?  Where has the club hopping landed you?  Is it still SC Del Sol?  They have GDA now and I know how obsessed you are with labels.  There are plenty of good community colleges in Arizona.


----------



## The Driver

Are we really dropping GOVERNMENT NAMES in the forum. 

All is fair in Love and War


----------



## The Driver

I don't break for:

Mama jokes

DD jokes 

And if someone post Pookie Jenkins it's on


----------



## MakeAPlay

The Driver said:


> Are we really dropping GOVERNMENT NAMES in the forum.
> 
> All is fair in Love and War


He is in desperation mode.  Not to worry this guy is way out of his league.


----------



## Livinthedream

SS22 said:


> Is Oklahoma and Colorado not good schools to get offers from?


if your DD is getting FREE money to attend school and play soccer, it's all GOOD! Both are great schools with a lot of school spirit and pride. Colorado is a strong up and coming program who has been aggressively recruiting strong talent. I don't know much about Oklahoma...but they are strong in every other sport, so I'm thinking soccer should be competitive. Hope this helps.


----------



## The Driver

MakeAPlay said:


> He is in desperation mode.  Not to worry this guy is way out of his league.


Roger that


----------



## The Driver

Livinthedream said:


> if your DD is getting FREE money to attend school and play soccer, it's all GOOD! Both are great schools with a lot of school spirit and pride. Colorado is a strong up and coming program who has been aggressively recruiting strong talent. I don't know much about Oklahoma...but they are strong in every other sport, so I'm thinking soccer should be competitive. Hope this helps.


Well said


----------



## MakeAPlay

SS22 said:


> Is Oklahoma and Colorado not good schools to get offers from?


I would say yes but it really depends upon the kid.  For some they are great, for some not so great and for some a disaster.  Just like most things everyone's situation is a little different.


----------



## SS22

Livinthedream said:


> if your DD is getting FREE money to attend school and play soccer, it's all GOOD! Both are great schools with a lot of school spirit and pride. Colorado is a strong up and coming program who has been aggressively recruiting strong talent. I don't know much about Oklahoma...but they are strong in every other sport, so I'm thinking soccer should be competitive. Hope this helps.


Thank you. My dd is, I guess you can say in the recruiting stage, and any help from parents/players with experiences who's gone through this process is GREATLY appreciated


----------



## SS22

MakeAPlay said:


> I would say yes but it really depends upon the kid.  For some they are great, for some not so great and for some a disaster.  Just like most things everyone's situation is a little different.


Thank you


----------



## push_up

Please be advised that Lisa's experience is atypical because she is not normal.


----------



## Bananacorner

Back to the topic -- Girls Development Academy

Rosters are "due" this Friday, Aug 18th (although names can be added after), we should be able to see the rosters up on the DA site shortly thereafter.  I know some clubs have been scrambling last minute to add 1-2 players, so should be interesting.


----------



## SocalPapa

Harsh criticism for Girls DA yesterday from a New York-based sports reporter who's covered soccer for 20 years... http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/sports/soccer/blogs/daily-devo/2017/08/23/soccer-players-parents-being-sold-bill-goods-development-academy/594677001/


----------



## Livinthedream

SocalPapa said:


> Harsh criticism for Girls DA yesterday from a New York-based sports reporter who's covered soccer for 20 years... http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/sports/soccer/blogs/daily-devo/2017/08/23/soccer-players-parents-being-sold-bill-goods-development-academy/594677001/


All U.S. Soccer has to do is make a statement that DA will take a High School break between December to March. But if they do that then they would have to change the league name to ECNL...just sayin.


----------



## El Clasico

SocalPapa said:


> Harsh criticism for Girls DA yesterday from a New York-based sports reporter who's covered soccer for 20 years... http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/sports/soccer/blogs/daily-devo/2017/08/23/soccer-players-parents-being-sold-bill-goods-development-academy/594677001/


The most telling line in the article...

"News flash: If you're good enough, recruiters will find you.  Trust me."

That's the crux of the problem though.  From what I can tell, in So Cal anyway, you have a couple of types that are buying into the hype of DA.
1. Those at clubs that have been shut out of the "Elite Players" group..
2. Those that know that their players aren't good enough for the recruiters to "find" them so they literally buy into anything that portends a shot at a scholarship for their child
3. Those that incredibly think that their player is the next Mia Hamm and the DA will deliver them to the promise land.

I wonder how many more parents there are, like a dear friend of mine, who has essentially forced the DA issue onto their child and now brags to strangers about how it was his daughter's choice and she is doing it for....insert whole list of BS reasons.

Just how much are parents willing to make their children give up so they those kids can pursue their parent's dreams? If you are wondering who those parents are, just look below and see who clicked "dumb" on this post.


----------



## MakeAPlay

El Clasico said:


> The most telling line in the article...
> 
> "News flash: If you're good enough, recruiters will find you.  Trust me."
> 
> That's the crux of the problem though.  From what I can tell, in So Cal anyway, you have a couple of types that are buying into the hype of DA.
> 1. Those at clubs that have been shut out of the "Elite Players" group..
> 2. Those that know that their players aren't good enough for the recruiters to "find" them so they literally buy into anything that portends a shot at a scholarship for their child
> 3. Those that incredibly think that their player is the next Mia Hamm and the DA will deliver them to the promise land.
> 
> I wonder how many more parents there are, like a dear friend of mine, who has essentially forced the DA issue onto their child and now brags to strangers about how it was his daughter's choice and she is doing it for....insert whole list of BS reasons.
> 
> Just how much are parents willing to make their children give up so they those kids can pursue their parent's dreams? If you are wondering who those parents are, just look below and see who clicked "dumb" on this post.


You forgot to mention those like @CaliKlines will just push "old."


----------



## timbuck

Bananacorner said:


> Back to the topic -- Girls Development Academy
> 
> Rosters are "due" this Friday, Aug 18th (although names can be added after), we should be able to see the rosters up on the DA site shortly thereafter.  I know some clubs have been scrambling last minute to add 1-2 players, so should be interesting.


Are rosters published somewhere?  Or is it up to each club to put them on their own website.


----------



## Bananacorner

timbuck said:


> Are rosters published somewhere?  Or is it up to each club to put them on their own website.


http://www.ussoccerda.com/all-clubs

Click the club of interest and then the team of interest.  They are at the top before the schedule.

Many aren't up, but Here is an example
http://lefc.ussoccerda.com/sam/teams/index.php?team=3951420


----------



## Simisoccerfan

I think you are all kidding yourselves if you don't believe that the girls playing DA or ECNL will have way more exposure to college coaches than those not.  At the end of the day I fully believe it should be the kids decision to play in those leagues and not the parents.  If you look at the recruiting classes for every major college most players played ECNL.  I heard their was an insane amount of coaches on the sidelines at Chicago.  I personally have seem dozens and dozens of coaches on the sidelines of DA games at the summer showcases and way less coaches for all other teams.   So if your kid wants to maximize their chances of playing in College, DA/ECNL is clearly the way to go.   I believe you can make it playing on a CSL/SCDSL team but you better be working extra hard at getting seen by writing/calling coaches and attending camps.


----------



## SocalPapa

Bananacorner said:


> http://www.ussoccerda.com/all-clubs
> 
> Click the club of interest and then the team of interest.  They are at the top before the schedule.
> 
> Many aren't up, but Here is an example
> http://lefc.ussoccerda.com/sam/teams/index.php?team=3951420


Very interesting.  So I just pulled up the DA rosters for several SCDSL clubs:

1) Legends 01/02 DA team 

It turns out there are only three 2002 birth year players on the roster.  Last fall those 3 girls played for 1) Legends FC G02 Academy I, 2) Arsenal FC ECNL, and 3) Legends FC G01 Academy (playing up).  So there is only ONE former Flight 1 G02 player on that whole DA roster.

Yet, Legends pulled BOTH their Academy I and Academy II teams out of the SCDSL G02 Champions bracket this year.  There were 34 girls on those two teams.  So where did they all go?  Even if 18 chose to go to Legend's DPL (unlikely but possible), that still leaves 15 unaccounted for.  There's a Legends FC West team that has had a good summer and will play in Champions this fall.  Is the talent there now?

It seems so.  Perhaps this is how it played out...

1) Originally, both Legends A and B teams played in SCDSL last fall;
2) Their new Academy 01/02 team drew only 1 player from either of its prior SCDSL teams;
3) The rest of their former G02 A team moved to DPL;
4) Much of their roster from their former B team is still in SCDSL (now playing for a team called Legends FC West).

2) Beach 01/02 DA team

They are a little different than Legends.  They have 7 G02 Academy players and ALL 7 had previously played on their Beach FC G02 Academy team (which finished 1st in the SCDSL G02 Champions division last fall).

But unlike Legends, they only pulled one team from SCDSL.  So perhaps the remaining players from that SCDSL champion team now make up the core of their DPL team and SCDSL was otherwise unaffected?

3) West Coast FC's 01/02 team

They have only three 02 players on their Academy team and all 3 came over from their ECNL team.  So no impact on SCDSL.  (They're not a DPL club so no potential impact there either.)

Real So Cal, LA Galaxy and LAFC Slammers haven't posted their rosters, so I can't tell how they were impacted.  But for those first 3 clubs, it looks like Girls DA/DPL may have cost SCDSL only two quality Flight 1 G02 teams in total.


----------



## chargerfan

Simisoccerfan said:


> I think you are all kidding yourselves if you don't believe that the girls playing DA or ECNL will have way more exposure to college coaches than those not.  At the end of the day I fully believe it should be the kids decision to play in those leagues and not the parents.  If you look at the recruiting classes for every major college most players played ECNL.  I heard their was an insane amount of coaches on the sidelines at Chicago.  I personally have seem dozens and dozens of coaches on the sidelines of DA games at the summer showcases and way less coaches for all other teams.   So if your kid wants to maximize their chances of playing in College, DA/ECNL is clearly the way to go.   I believe you can make it playing on a CSL/SCDSL team but you better be working extra hard at getting seen by writing/calling coaches and attending camps.


That's because the very top talent went to ECNL. Coaches go where the talent is. That's now the case with DA, although it seems to be a lot more watered down due to the number of teams. My guess is that right now it is probably better to be very top of the bench at an ECNL or top flight 1 team than bottom of the bench at DA to get looks. Probably better to be a top ECNL team than a bottom DA team as far as getting looks. Although we are still a year away, so what do I know except we are all spending a lot of time and money on a dream that may never happen!


----------



## GoWest

chargerfan said:


> My guess is that right now it is probably better to be very top of the bench at an ECNL or top flight 1 team than bottom of the bench at DA to get looks


I agree for this next season at least.


----------



## FourFourTwo

ECNL's Instagram posted a picture of a side by side ECNL alumni roster for the Standford vs Florida game. 40 total ECNL alumni between the 2 schools. That's impressive. We will have wait and see if DA can match that type of success.


----------



## SocalPapa

FourFourTwo said:


> ECNL's Instagram posted a picture of a side by side ECNL alumni roster for the Standford vs Florida game. 40 total ECNL alumni between the 2 schools. That's impressive. We will have wait and see if DA can match that type of success.


San Diego Surf ECNL's Catarina Macario is a freshman at Stanford and has already scored 3 goals in her first 2 games (the first a mere 7 minutes after being subbed in).  Perhaps not a surprise though.  She's the all-time top ECNL scorer.


----------



## soccer661

FourFourTwo said:


> ECNL's Instagram posted a picture of a side by side ECNL alumni roster for the Standford vs Florida game. 40 total ECNL alumni between the 2 schools. That's impressive. We will have wait and see if DA can match that type of success.


Yes--I think DA will have that success...if you look at commitments for Stanford in coming years-- I am guessing most of those girls - that were ECNL last year, will be playing DA this year-- some may not have had much of a choice--because if their club is going DA and no longer have ECNL, geographic reasons, girls wanting to stay with their team/coach if movement, etc...unless the girl really really wants to play high school-- that is the one big reason I am hearing for a girl staying ECNL over DA....but not too many of those girls in our area doing that, most are opting out of high school soccer to play DA...


----------



## Real Deal

El Clasico said:


> I wonder how many more parents there are, like a dear friend of mine, who has essentially forced the DA issue onto their child and now brags to strangers about how it was his daughter's choice and she is doing it for....insert whole list of BS reasons.
> 
> Just how much are parents willing to make their children give up so they those kids can pursue their parent's dreams? If you are wondering who those parents are, just look below and see who clicked "dumb" on this post.



I completely agree that if parents are forcing DA and its rigors on their children, that is just crazy and a really bad scene, especially if they are players who won't get much playing time. There are no doubt better fits for those kids to play and be happy. 

However, at this early point, seems the majority of the players are happy to participate and enjoy the extra hours- others will be weeded out no doubt- just really too bad if a parent can't see it.  Not every kid wants or needs to play soccer past high school!


----------



## GoWest

soccer661 said:


> ...unless the girl really really wants to play high school-- that is the one big reason I am hearing for a girl staying ECNL over DA....


Yup. Similar situation. Players can get the "best of ECNL, HS and DA worlds" if they have really thought it through. At least the 2017-2018 season IMHO.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> San Diego Surf ECNL's Catarina Macario is a freshman at Stanford and has already scored 3 goals in her first 2 games (the first a mere 7 minutes after being subbed in).  Perhaps not a surprise though.  She's the all-time top ECNL scorer.


Those were against tomato cans.  Let's see what she does at 2pm PST today against a real team...

I think that she is an amazing player but you can't tell much from playing teams that aren't tournament quality.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Those were against tomato cans.  Let's see what she does at 2pm PST today against a real team...
> 
> I think that she is an amazing player but you can't tell much from playing teams that aren't tournament quality.


How many goals would be a good season for a D1 striker?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> How many goals would be a good season for a D1 striker?


9+ is good.  13+ is great, 17+ is leading the nation.


----------



## Lambchop

El Clasico said:


> The most telling line in the article...
> 
> "News flash: If you're good enough, recruiters will find you.  Trust me."
> 
> That's the crux of the problem though.  From what I can tell, in So Cal anyway, you have a couple of types that are buying into the hype of DA.
> 1. Those at clubs that have been shut out of the "Elite Players" group..
> 2. Those that know that their players aren't good enough for the recruiters to "find" them so they literally buy into anything that portends a shot at a scholarship for their child
> 3. Those that incredibly think that their player is the next Mia Hamm and the DA will deliver them to the promise land.
> 
> I wonder how many more parents there are, like a dear friend of mine, who has essentially forced the DA issue onto their child and now brags to strangers about how it was his daughter's choice and she is doing it for....insert whole list of BS reasons.
> 
> Just how much are parents willing to make their children give up so they those kids can pursue their parent's dreams? If you are wondering who those parents are, just look below and see who clicked "dumb" on this post.


You are making a whole lot of assumptions.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> 9+ is good.  13+ is great, 17+ is leading the nation.


Thank you, how is the knee?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Thank you, how is the knee?


It's not 100% but she is still grinding.  Thanks for asking.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> Those were against tomato cans.  Let's see what she does at 2pm PST today against a real team...
> 
> I think that she is an amazing player but you can't tell much from playing teams that aren't tournament quality.


Wisconsin may not be a top team, but they aren't exactly a tomato can either.  They had the 3rd best defense in the Big 10 last year and have their star 5th-year senior keeper back.  So they were a decent test for a freshman playing her second official college match.  Agreed though that Florida will be much more of a test today.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> Wisconsin may not be a top team, but they aren't exactly a tomato can either.  They had the 3rd best defense in the Big 10 last year and have their star 5th-year senior keeper back.  So they were a decent test for a freshman playing her second official college match.  Agreed though that Florida will be much more of a test today.


I hear you and again I think that she is a great player and will be on the PAC 12 all-freshman team.  However, Wisconsin was 9-5-8 WITH Rose Lavelle and is much worse now.  They are not a tournament team.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> I hear you and again I think that she is a great player and will be on the PAC 12 all-freshman team.  However, Wisconsin was 9-5-8 WITH Rose Lavelle and is much worse now.  They are not a tournament team.


Let me put it this way.  In those 22 games last year Lavelle held 18 teams to LESS than 2 goals.  So it's at least moderately impressive that Macario scored 2 by herself against her in the 46 minutes she was on the field.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> I hear you and again I think that she is a great player and will be on the PAC 12 all-freshman team.  However, Wisconsin was 9-5-8 WITH Rose Lavelle and is much worse now.  They are not a tournament team.


Okay.  Now Macario's scored a goal against Florida (at the 26 minute mark).  Am I allowed to be impressed yet?


----------



## chargerfan

SocalPapa said:


> Okay.  Now Macario's scored a goal against Florida (at the 26 minute mark).  Am I allowed to be impressed yet?


She is a remarkable player.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

chargerfan said:


> That's because the very top talent went to ECNL. Coaches go where the talent is. That's now the case with DA, although it seems to be a lot more watered down due to the number of teams. My guess is that right now it is probably better to be very top of the bench at an ECNL or top flight 1 team than bottom of the bench at DA to get looks. Probably better to be a top ECNL team than a bottom DA team as far as getting looks. Although we are still a year away, so what do I know except we are all spending a lot of time and money on a dream that may never happen!


I can agree that it is probably better to be at the top of the bench on an ECNL team then the bottom at a DA team but I can't agree with you throwing in Flight 1 to this comparison.  Essentially you are saying being the top of the bench at an ECNL team is the same as being on a Flight 1 team?  It's far better to be on a DA or ECNL roster than on a Flight 1 team.  Even the bottom of the DA bench is guaranteed to start 25% of the time.  It remains to be seen but I believe time will tell that it is even better to be on a DPL team then all but the very best Flight 1 or CSL teams.


----------



## SocalPapa

chargerfan said:


> She is a remarkable player.


Impressive off-ball movement and volley on Macario's goal too.  Amazing poise for a freshman.  https://twitter.com/StanfordWSoccer/status/901195413633380353


----------



## Livinthedream

the 





MakeAPlay said:


> I hear you and again I think that she is a great player and will be on the PAC 12 all-freshman team.  However, Wisconsin was 9-5-8 WITH Rose Lavelle and is much worse now.  They are not a tournament team.


I'm still laughing at the "Tomato Can" reference...lol. I haven't heard that saying in a long time...


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> I hear you and again I think that she is a great player and will be on the PAC 12 all-freshman team.


A little perspective on how good Macario has been out of the gate:

Macario now has 4 goals on 11 shots (6 on goal) in 3 games. 

Stanford's all-time leading goal scorer is current USWNT striker Christen Press.  In Press' freshman year she had 8 goals on 60 shots in 21 games.  (That earned her Pac-10 Freshman of the Year and First-team Freshman All-American honors.)  Macario needs to score only 1 goal every 5 games or so from here on out to match Press.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> A little perspective on how good Macario has been out of the gate:
> 
> Macario now has 4 goals on 11 shots (6 on goal) in 3 games.
> 
> Stanford's all-time leading goal scorer is current USWNT striker Christen Press.  In Press' freshman year she had 8 goals on 60 shots in 21 games.  (That earned her Pac-10 Freshman of the Year and First-team Freshman All-American honors.)  Macario needs to score only 1 goal every 5 games or so from here on out to match Press.


I am well aware of her and I know Jose well too.  It's hard to explain what the grind of a season does to a player.  She will definitely be in the running for freshman of the year but there are several outstanding freshman spread throughout 4 or 5 teams that are going to be in the running.  Let's see what happens next weekend.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> Okay.  Now Macario's scored a goal against Florida (at the 26 minute mark).  Am I allowed to be impressed yet?


Be as impressed as you want.  I would just give her some time.  The PAC 12 is the toughest conference top to bottom in the country.  Lots of things happen.  Look how all of the top 4 teams lost today yet lowly Penn State and UCLA took care of business.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> Impressive off-ball movement and volley on Macario's goal too.  Amazing poise for a freshman.  https://twitter.com/StanfordWSoccer/status/901195413633380353


You can be impressed and amazed.  It's a LONG season.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> I am well aware of her and I know Jose well too.  It's hard to explain what the grind of a season does to a player.  She will definitely be in the running for freshman of the year but there are several outstanding freshman spread throughout 4 or 5 teams that are going to be in the running.  Let's see what happens next weekend.


You crack me up.  You keep moving the bar.  Okay, so Florida wasn't the test after all.  It's actually next weekend that counts.  Got it.  

I'm sure you know Macario better than me, but I've been a fan of Stanford Women's Soccer going on 30 years now and I honestly can't recall anyone making such an immediate offensive impact for the team.  Maybe I've forgotten (it's been a lot of seasons), but it's at least rare.  Who knows what will happen the rest of the season, but it's a great start.


----------



## socalkdg

SocalPapa said:


> Impressive off-ball movement and volley on Macario's goal too.  Amazing poise for a freshman.  https://twitter.com/StanfordWSoccer/status/901195413633380353


Keeper should have just snagged the first shot out of the air instead of batting it away.       At least that is what the keeper coaches keep yelling at my daughter when she doesn't catch it.   It was a very nice touch shot by Macario.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> You crack me up.  You keep moving the bar.  Okay, so Florida wasn't the test after all.  It's actually next weekend that counts.  Got it.
> 
> I'm sure you know Macario better than me, but I've been a fan of Stanford Women's Soccer going on 30 years now and I honestly can't recall anyone making such an immediate offensive impact for the team.  Maybe I've forgotten (it's been a lot of seasons), but it's at least rare.  Who knows what will happen the rest of the season, but it's a great start.


I never said Florida wasn't a test.  Her father and I talked about it on Sunday (he was at my player's game).  She is playing well and starting for Stanford is fantastic (and not unexpected since they don't have many finishers).  All I said is give her some time.  All freshmen hit a slump at some point.  You can read into my post all you want but this type of freshman year is eye popping.   http://floridagators.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2999

Can she get there?  Yes.  Does she have some elite tools?  Yes.  Are their some glaring weaknesses to her game?  Yes.  Can she be a full WNT player?  Absolutely if she keeps working.  All that I am saying is don't go overboard with the expectations.  I have seen her play since she was 12.  Let's just let her keep doing her thing and grade it in November when it really counts.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> You crack me up.  You keep moving the bar.  Okay, so Florida wasn't the test after all.  It's actually next weekend that counts.  Got it.
> 
> I'm sure you know Macario better than me, but I've been a fan of Stanford Women's Soccer going on 30 years now and I honestly can't recall anyone making such an immediate offensive impact for the team.  Maybe I've forgotten (it's been a lot of seasons), but it's at least rare.  Who knows what will happen the rest of the season, but it's a great start.



Here is the standard....

http://www.gostanford.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=9092

She lead the conference in goals, was PAC 10 freshman of the year, 1st team all PAC 10 and was 2nd team all-American.  How's that?


----------



## timbuck

SocalPapa said:


> Impressive off-ball movement and volley on Macario's goal too.  Amazing poise for a freshman.  https://twitter.com/StanfordWSoccer/status/901195413633380353


Nice goal for sure.  If I'm the keeper or the coach I lose it on my back line for ball watching the save.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> Here is the standard....
> 
> http://www.gostanford.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=9092
> 
> She lead the conference in goals, was PAC 10 freshman of the year, 1st team all PAC 10 and was 2nd team all-American.  How's that?


Taylor had a GREAT freshman season.  (Playing with Kelley O'Hara and Christen Press certainly helped.)  And I agree all should be impressed if Macario matches it.  But Macario's had the more impressive start.   Taylor scored 2 goals in her first 3 games.  Macario's scored 4 in her 3 games, including the one she scored 7 minutes into her Stanford career and the one against (now #2) Florida.


----------



## socalkdg

timbuck said:


> Nice goal for sure.  If I'm the keeper or the coach I lose it on my back line for ball watching the save.


Why is that.  Even men's professional stand and watch. Or throw their hand up crying for offside.


----------



## GoWest

Opening weekend for the GDA inaugural season.....just saying


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Not so sure the DA program is all it's cut out to be, I am very surprised at level of some of the girls that have made  DA teams. I know it is still early and I will wait to pass final judgment on this issue.
My daughter does not play in the DA or ECNL.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Sheriff Joe said:


> Not so sure the DA program is all it's cut out to be, I am very surprised at level of some of the girls that have made  DA teams. I know it is still early and I will wait to pass final judgment on this issue.
> My daughter does not play in the DA or ECNL.


I am not at all surprised at the level of some girls that made DA teams - not enough talent to fill all the spots at the highest level. As for training and program logistics, I am very impressed with what I have seen from teams that have invested in the program.


----------



## LASTMAN14

LadiesMan217 said:


> I am not at all surprised at the level of some girls that made DA teams - not enough talent to fill all the spots at the highest level. As for training and program logistics, I am very impressed with what I have seen from teams that have invested in the program.


Would be interested to hear your thoughts on which programs thus far...


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> I am not at all surprised at the level of some girls that made DA teams - not enough talent to fill all the spots at the highest level. As for training and program logistics, I am very impressed with what I have seen from teams that have invested in the program.


Like I said a long time ago there are about 25-35 elite players per age group in all of SoCal.  That is enough for 2-3 teams max.  The remaining 8-10 teams worth of players are good but they hold back the elite players and really defeat the "purpose" of GDA.  

The situation makes me think of two quotes.  "You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig."  And, "a rose by any other name would smell just as sweet."  Forget about league or team.  It's a numbers game and there are only so many roses out there but plenty of the other thing.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Sheriff Joe said:


> Not so sure the DA program is all it's cut out to be, I am very surprised at level of some of the girls that have made  DA teams. I know it is still early and I will wait to pass final judgment on this issue.
> My daughter does not play in the DA or ECNL.


If your dd is not involved, how much of the DA have you seen since league has started?  Have you seen practices? Games? Multiple teams and age groups?  Or is your opinion based on a few girls that you know made a team?  I think you need to provide this information to back up your comment.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Simisoccerfan said:


> If your dd is not involved, how much of the DA have you seen since league has started?  Have you seen practices? Games? Multiple teams and age groups?  Or is your opinion based on a few girls that you know made a team?  I think you need to provide this information to back up your comment.


Like I said, I will wait to judge, my comments are based on players that I know who made a DA team, that is all.
I have heard the training is superior and they take care of the players, I have also heard there are DA teams that are getting beat by HUGE margins.


----------



## Nutmeg

couple of things, first soccer as a game at the level that DA aspires to be,  member teams at any age level should not be losing a game by more than 3 goals. There are teams losing by wide margins while also being shutout. Not just in Socal also, NoCal, east coast, Florida. Teams with little tactical understanding of the basic elements of soccer, 1v1 defending, team defending, defensive shape, transition from defense to offensive and back again, off the ball movement, providing support to your teammates when in possession, etc. the learning curve is just too great with some teams. Sure coaches will try to develop this over time, but even with a whole season and training 4x a week you can't address everything. Far too many players and clubs are chasing a patch and coding development with delusion of success through failure and calling it development.  Not just failure in results but slow failure through mediocre training.  My contention is that training at DA teams is not better than years past it is just move frequent. Training 2x a week with high level intensity against the best level of talent is vastly different than training 4x a week against marginal ability at a low level of skill. The players at the top are already at a higher level.  the skill gap even at the 04, 03 age group is imo too great to close for most players between the top and the bottom.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Nutmeg said:


> couple of things, first soccer as a game at the level that DA aspires to be,  member teams at any age level should not be losing a game by more than 3 goals. There are teams losing by wide margins while also being shutout. Not just in Socal also, NoCal, east coast, Florida. Teams with little tactical understanding of the basic elements of soccer, 1v1 defending, team defending, defensive shape, transition from defense to offensive and back again, off the ball movement, providing support to your teammates when in possession, etc. the learning curve is just too great with some teams. Sure coaches will try to develop this over time, but even with a whole season and training 4x a week you can't address everything. Far too many players and clubs are chasing a patch and coding development with delusion of success through failure and calling it development.  Not just failure in results but slow failure through mediocre training.  My contention is that training at DA teams is not better than years past it is just move frequent. Training 2x a week with high level intensity against the best level of talent is vastly different than training 4x a week against marginal ability at a low level of skill. The players at the top are already at a higher level.  the skill gap even at the 04, 03 age group is imo too great to close for most players between the top and the bottom.


Nice post!  Please share your credentials and the basis of your evaluation.  How many DA games have you watched this year?  What age groups and teams?  How many practices have you witnessed to draw these conclusions?  It sounds like you have watched multiple DA games for various ages and teams and witnessed a wide variety of practices to draw your conclusions.  What is your background to allow you to draw these conclusions?  I am curious because your post tends to imply that you are deeply involved and have the background and knowledge to post meaningful information here.


----------



## Livinthedream

Simisoccerfan said:


> Nice post!  Please share your credentials and the basis of your evaluation.  How many DA games have you watched this year?  What age groups and teams?  How many practices have you witnessed to draw these conclusions?  It sounds like you have watched multiple DA games for various ages and teams and witnessed a wide variety of practices to draw your conclusions.  What is your background to allow you to draw these conclusions?  I am curious because your post tends to imply that you are deeply involved and have the background and knowledge to post meaningful information here.


Cricket Cricket...


----------



## Nutmeg

Simisoccerfan said:


> Nice post!  Please share your credentials and the basis of your evaluation.  How many DA games have you watched this year?  What age groups and teams?  How many practices have you witnessed to draw these conclusions?  It sounds like you have watched multiple DA games for various ages and teams and witnessed a wide variety of practices to draw your conclusions.  What is your background to allow you to draw these conclusions?  I am curious because your post tends to imply that you are deeply involved and have the background and knowledge to post meaningful information here.


Didn't you know that I am the all knowing, been there done that soccer parent guru of all time. I travel the vast regions of the soccer landscape to root out all evil doer soccer coaches and fake developers of mediocre over priced soccer.  No not really just your average every day socal soccer dwelling poster who has spent way too much time watching and playing youth, college, pro, etc soccer to know the difference between what is and what is not. Maybe I'm the person sitting next to you, or across from you, maybe you even know me. Or maybe I'm just the voice in your head. Who knows. So um no I won't be giving you my credentials today or my SS# or my home address, but just my fair and honest opinion as I see it.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Simisoccerfan said:


> Nice post!  Please share your credentials and the basis of your evaluation.  How many DA games have you watched this year?  What age groups and teams?  How many practices have you witnessed to draw these conclusions?  It sounds like you have watched multiple DA games for various ages and teams and witnessed a wide variety of practices to draw your conclusions.  What is your background to allow you to draw these conclusions?  I am curious because your post tends to imply that you are deeply involved and have the background and knowledge to post meaningful information here.


A little defensive, are we? Just because someone doesn't think DA is what you think DA is, there is no reason to get butt hurt about it. Obviously you are involved in it somehow so maybe you can tell us how these 9-0 and 10-0 games are happening.


----------



## timbuck

Hard to judge a team by only a few games.  See how they improve over the course of the season.  It is a "Development" Academy and not a 2 week All-Star program.


----------



## MarkM

Sheriff Joe said:


> Like I said, I will wait to judge, my comments are based on players that I know who made a DA team, that is all.
> I have heard the training is superior and they take care of the players, I have also heard there are DA teams that are getting beat by HUGE margins.


What games are you referring to in SoCal?  Competition level seems comparable to ECNL last year, but it is early.  Some great teams, some solid teams, and a couple of bad teams.


----------



## Nutmeg

timbuck said:


> Hard to judge a team by only a few games.  See how they improve over the course of the season.  It is a "Development" Academy and not a 2 week All-Star program.





timbuck said:


> Hard to judge a team by only a few games.  See how they improve over the course of the season.  It is a "Development" Academy and not a 2 week All-Star program.


Its actually not hard to judge a team in a few games. It's super easy actually. So what the team that is losng 10-0 only loses 6-0 in April and that is development? No that's lunacy. Even a game score of 3-0 can be embarrassing when one team can't even posses the ball for 3 or more passes. But DA is and should only be about individual players not teams.


----------



## Nutmeg

In my opinion this convo is being viewed the wrong way. Take teams out of it, coaches out of it, take scores out it. Watch a DA game any game and what you will see is 5-7 players total in any game who can actually play. Players who can determine and effect the outcome of a game. The rest are there as cones. And if you are not sure what you are then you might be the cone.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Sheriff Joe said:


> A little defensive, are we? Just because someone doesn't think DA is what you think DA is, there is no reason to get butt hurt about it. Obviously you are involved in it somehow so maybe you can tell us how these 9-0 and 10-0 games are happening.


Who said that I don't agree with Nutmeg?  I was just calling him (or her) out a bit to understand his (or her) background since that part was left out (which would help to understand the context of their comments).  By the way I do not currently have a kid playing DA but it doesn't take much to figure out why blowouts are happening.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MarkM said:


> What games are you referring to in SoCal?  Competition level seems comparable to ECNL last year, but it is early.  Some great teams, some solid teams, and a couple of bad teams.


west coast 10 psv union 0
legends 9 Burlingame 0
lafc 6 la galaxie 1
beach 4 albion 0


----------



## Nutmeg

Simisoccerfan said:


> Who said that I don't agree with Nutmeg?  I was just calling him (or her) out a bit to understand his (or her) background since that part was left out (which would help to understand the context of their comments).  By the way I do not currently have a kid playing DA but it doesn't take much to figure out why blowouts are happening.


Simi your aces in my book. No worries, healthy questioning and skepticism is what your supposed to do. Otherwise this forum becomes boring. Feel free to DM.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Simisoccerfan said:


> Who said that I don't agree with Nutmeg?  I was just calling him (or her) out a bit to understand his (or her) background since that part was left out (which would help to understand the context of their comments).  By the way I do not currently have a kid playing DA but it doesn't take much to figure out why blowouts are happening.


I know it is the first part of the first year, growing pains.


----------



## SocalPapa

Nutmeg said:


> So um no I won't be giving you my credentials today or my SS# or my home address, but just my fair and honest opinion as I see it.


No need to go that far @Nutmeg.  We already got your SS# and home address from the Experian hack.


----------



## shortBUTslow

Simisoccerfan said:


> Who said that I don't agree with Nutmeg?  I was just calling him (or her) out a bit to understand his (or her) background since that part was left out (which would help to understand the context of their comments).  By the way I do not currently have a kid playing DA but it doesn't take much to figure out why blowouts are happening.


And what are your credentials?  You made a comment above that it is probably better to be on a DPL team than a top SCDSL or CSL team, which is utterly asinine.   No one gives a shit about the DPL, and some of those teams are beyond awful.  As much as I hate to say it, MAP is exactly right when she points out that there are roughly 30-40 elite players across SoCal.  Only the most threatened of parents would see anything positive about there being 3 closed leagues. (DA, ECNL and DPL)   Look at the results in all the leagues.  The top teams are destroying the bottom teams.  There is nothing that even closely resembles parity.  How is that good for anyone?

At this stage in the process, nothing else matters except getting my DD into the right college (for academics and soccer).  The league is totally irrelevant, and the team matters only to the extent it performs well enough to get her seen.  That box is checked.  The rest matters not.


----------



## Monkey

Simisoccerfan said:


> Who said that I don't agree with Nutmeg?  I was just calling him (or her) out a bit to understand his (or her) background since that part was left out (which would help to understand the context of their comments).  By the way I do not currently have a kid playing DA but it doesn't take much to figure out why blowouts are happening.


@Simi is a DPL parent dreaming of the big times after being fed a bunch of crap.  Maybe Simi would like to share her/his credentials?


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> Like I said a long time ago there are about 25-35 elite players per age group in all of SoCal.  That is enough for 2-3 teams max.  The remaining 8-10 teams worth of players are good but they hold back the elite players and really defeat the "purpose" of GDA.


How are you defining elite?  Div I quality?  If so, I would think the number would be over 100.  I've seen 30 Div. I commits for the Class of 2018 from Slammers (12), Blues (11) and Strikers (7) alone.  

Though, even with Div. I quality as the definition, I admit you'd need closer to 300 to support consistently elite soccer for the 13 girls DA and 7 ECNL teams per age group currently in SoCal.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> How are you defining elite?  Div I quality?  If so, I would think the number would be over 100.  I've seen 30 Div. I commits for the Class of 2018 from Slammers (12), Blues (11) and Strikers (7) alone.
> 
> Though, even with Div. I quality as the definition, I admit you'd need closer to 300 to support consistently elite soccer for the 13 girls DA and 7 ECNL teams per age group currently in SoCal.


Not D1 quality.  I have seen a group of 17 year olds beat a D1 team.  Very few D1 teams are elite.  Most are kickball teams.  I truly believe that any kid that wants to play college soccer at some level can do it.  At the same time there are only about 25-35 players per age group that make you go wow.  That is elite.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Sheriff Joe said:


> west coast 10 psv union 0
> legends 9 Burlingame 0
> lafc 6 la galaxie 1
> beach 4 albion 0


U16/U17 I see...

The kicker on the LAFC game is they were looking flat until this game so they brought in 2 younger U15 DPs and one scored 5 goals in the last 35 minutes LOL.

Burlingame's U16/U17 defensive players run a 7.5 second 40 and get run over like a snail crossing the freeway - the team moves the ball OK - offense has speed issues also. 

Haven't seen PSV Union yet but I can't fathom anyone losing by 10 goals to West Coast U16/U17.

Beach is a good team - haven't seen Albion play yet.


----------



## younothat

LadiesMan217 said:


> U16/U17 I see...
> 
> The kicker on the LAFC game is they were looking flat until this game so they brought in 2 younger U15 DPs and one scored 5 goals in the last 35 minutes LOL.
> 
> Burlingame's U16/U17 defensive players run a 7.5 second 40 and get run over like a snail crossing the freeway - the team moves the ball OK - offense has speed issues also.
> 
> Haven't seen PSV Union yet but I can't fathom anyone losing by 10 goals to West Coast U16/U17.
> 
> Beach is a good team - haven't seen Albion play yet.


That's why LAFC #11  is on the national team; 5 goals from a 2003 playing up for only 5o or so minutes.

Funny thing is LAFC Slammers has 5 or so players on the U16/17 teams that played for the Galaxy SB affiliate including #7 the other scorers &  #11 but they where late to party and couldn't hang on to them.


----------



## MakeAPlay

younothat said:


> That's why LAFC #11  is on the national team; 5 goals from a 2003 playing up for only 5o or so minutes.
> 
> Funny thing is LAFC Slammers has 5 or so players on the U16/17 teams that played for the Galaxy SB affiliate including #7 the other scorers &  #11 but they where late to party and couldn't hang on to them.



https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/girls-dev-acad-weekly-standout_aid42815

Is this who you are referring to?


----------



## timbuck

Sheriff Joe said:


> west coast 10 psv union 0
> legends 9 Burlingame 0
> lafc 6 la galaxie 1
> beach 4 albion 0


There is a local So Cal DA team that has had some trouble this year too.
They are 1-1-10 across all of their age groups. Allowed 34 goals and scored 10.
Their coach is a u19 NT scout.  Did they just not get the players that other teams did this year?


----------



## MakeAPlay

timbuck said:


> There is a local So Cal DA team that has had some trouble this year too.
> They are 1-1-10 across all of their age groups. Allowed 34 goals and scored 10.
> Their coach is a u19 NT scout.  Did they just not get the players that other teams did this year?


If his plan was to use the GDA moniker to recruit talented players in order to compete, then that is never a good plan.


----------



## SoccerLife75

MakeAPlay said:


> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/girls-dev-acad-weekly-standout_aid42815
> 
> Is this who you are referring to?



Interesting site.  What is the selection process to getting on the list of Top Drawer Players.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SoccerLife75 said:


> Interesting site.  What is the selection process to getting on the list of Top Drawer Players.


I'm not sure.  They seem to insert themselves anywhere they think that "elite" soccer is going on and they rank it.  It's basically click bait but it works.  I have had a subscription for 3 years even though I think most of what they right is absolute drivel.


----------



## Livinthedream

MakeAPlay said:


> I'm not sure.  They seem to insert themselves anywhere they think that "elite" soccer is going on and they rank it.  It's basically click bait but it works.  I have had a subscription for 3 years even though I think most of what they right is absolute drivel.


Agree...but it's nice to see your kid with some stars next to their name


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/girls-dev-acad-weekly-standout_aid42815
> 
> Is this who you are referring to?


I been wondering why the Blues '02 ECNL team has lost some of their punch this fall.  Her moving to LAFC Slammers DA seems to explain it.

What does it say about DA though that one player can dominate a game to that extent?


----------



## Kicker4Life

SocalPapa said:


> I been wondering why the Blues '02 ECNL team has lost some of their punch this fall.  Her moving to LAFC Slammers DA seems to explain it.
> 
> What does it say about DA though that one player can dominate a game to that extent?


Pretty sure she was a dominant player in ECNL too. I do know her commute got a whole lot shorter by switching to LAFC.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> I been wondering why the Blues '02 ECNL team has lost some of their punch this fall.  Her moving to LAFC Slammers DA seems to explain it.
> 
> What does it say about DA though that one player can dominate a game to that extent?


I saw it happen a couple of times in ECNL games but those players are truly elite.  One is on the full USWNT at 19 years old.  This looks simply like talent dilution.


----------



## Soccer43

MakeAPlay said:


> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/girls-dev-acad-weekly-standout_aid42815
> 
> Is this who you are referring to?


If the coach tells all the players that their job is to get the ball to the Italian, then the Italian can sit up top, not worry about creating plays, and score a lot of goals


----------



## LadiesMan217

timbuck said:


> There is a local So Cal DA team that has had some trouble this year too.
> They are 1-1-10 across all of their age groups. Allowed 34 goals and scored 10.
> Their coach is a u19 NT scout.  Did they just not get the players that other teams did this year?


Which club? I am too lazy to look but will give you thoughts...


----------



## timbuck

LadiesMan217 said:


> Which club? I am too lazy to look but will give you thoughts...


Guess?


----------



## terrence

timbuck said:


> Guess?


Pats


----------



## Bananacorner

DPs can come on board in 6.  Look for some interesting changes in the rosters and playing time.


----------



## SoccerLife75

Bananacorner said:


> DPs can come on board in 6.  Look for some interesting changes in the rosters and playing time.


I don't see how that will be possible as DP rosters an Academy rosters on most teams are very low.   Unless they plan on swapping Academy players with DP players.  Taking 2-3 players from most DP teams will hurt the DP teams tremendously.


----------



## Bananacorner

DPs are Developmental Players who can continue to play on their previous roster (whether it be DPL or another team) in addition to playing with the DA team.   I already know one club who has picked their DP players and will have them start practicing with DA immediately (in addition to continuing to play with their previous team).


----------



## timbuck

How does the DP role work in academy?  Can a player be pulled from any team within the same club?  Or from any team in Cal-South?
Are they able to play Academy and SCDSL (or other league) at the same time or once they get "Called up" are they frozen?


----------



## Bananacorner

They have to be within the same club (unlike ECNL Discovery player).  They can play with both teams but they are limited to 6 games with DA

https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/7y8c97ea6hqc0bk1tulf1yvpn9zij4dh


----------



## younothat

timbuck said:


> How does the DP role work in academy?  Can a player be pulled from any team within the same club?  Or from any team in Cal-South?
> Are they able to play Academy and SCDSL (or other league) at the same time or once they get "Called up" are they frozen?


Any player that is currently registered on a clubs no-ussda team within the same club, they can remain on the roster in other league. Other than not playing the same day with two different teams there is no freeze.

"A Development Player must be registered in accordance with all registration guidelines. A Developmental Player may appear in a maximum of six (6) Academy games per season. Developmental Players cannot participate in the
Academy Playoffs or Academy Championships and are not eligible for year end awards. Developmental Players can only change their status to full time once during the Academy season and cannot return to Developmental Player status.
Furthermore, a Developmental Player does not automatically garner full time status after participating in their sixth game. The club needs to submit their intentions in writing to the Academy Staff by the weekly registration deadline
to move the player to full time"
More info at: https://ussoccer.box.com/s/7y8c97ea6hqc0bk1tulf1yvpn9zij4dh

Most team have between 0-3 DP's as you can see in the above doc with the avg's that are down as the ages go up.  Cost $ to register even DP's and you have to go through the whole Reg process including the impact testing. 

DP's must be training regularly with the DA players team to qualify.   Yes I've seen/heard of players denied DP's status due to several factors, clubs not following the guidelines, players not accounted for at training with the ussda folks come by, etc.


----------



## SocalPapa

terrence said:


> Pats


That's not the only club with a slow start so far: http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/ss/schedule.php?containerID=Mzk5OTcwMA==&v=3

Is the plan to pare down the SW region at some point?  I was surprised to see 14 clubs given the boys' SW DA region has only 12 clubs and the other girls regions have 8, 9 or at most 11 clubs.


----------



## LadiesMan217

SocalPapa said:


> That's not the only club with a slow start so far: http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/ss/schedule.php?containerID=Mzk5OTcwMA==&v=3
> 
> Is the plan to pare down the SW region at some point?  I was surprised to see 14 clubs given the boys' SW DA region has only 12 clubs and the other girls regions have 8, 9 or at most 11 clubs.


Seeing how these teams do early next year will be a good indication of development LOL.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Bananacorner said:


> DPs are Developmental Players who can continue to play on their previous roster (whether it be DPL or another team) in addition to playing with the DA team.   I already know one club who has picked their DP players and will have them start practicing with DA immediately (in addition to continuing to play with their previous team).


I can confirm that this is happening.


----------



## timbuck

Simisoccerfan said:


> I can confirm that this is happening.


How does this show up on a roster?


----------



## younothat

timbuck said:


> How does this show up on a roster?


DA roster status says DP instead of FT
U15+ only 16 players (starting 11 + 5 subs)  can play any given  game, w / the min 16 already using DP's so early outside of injuries is not normally done much.  Historically, much more common to see DP's  2nd half of the season, especially last 6-8 weeks.


----------



## LadiesMan217

timbuck said:


> How does this show up on a roster?


White shirt on DA Game Report


----------



## Simisoccerfan

We will have to wait till October to see how this is really done since the only thing to go on right now is the boy's program in past years.   From my brief look at rosters the boys programs seem to carry more players so that must have effected their use (or lack of use) of DP's in the past.   I would also expect that if someone is being DP'd for a game its because they are going to play that game not ride the bench.


----------



## jpeter

Simisoccerfan said:


> We will have to wait till October to see how this is really done since the only thing to go on right now is the boy's program in past years.   From my brief look at rosters the boys programs seem to carry more players so that must have effected their use (or lack of use) of DP's in the past.   I would also expect that if someone is being DP'd for a game its because they are going to play that game not ride the bench.


You DP with a plan not just for a game. 1 to maybe 2 at a time. Not really used or encouraged much this early with roster sizes meeting requirements.  There are no playing time requirements or % starts for DP, normally at the end of bench, few minutes or to start for injury coverage.

Used later in season way more often to help supplemental declining numbers( injury & HS) or for those players who have logged good amt of minutes elsewhere and they don't mind limited minute's, last 10-25min of game type of role


----------



## timmyh

http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/regevent/index.php?containerId=NDAzMzc2MA==&partialGames=0

The U13 DA league is in full swing in Texas. 
Will this be coming to SoCal next year?


----------



## LASTMAN14

timmyh said:


> http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/regevent/index.php?containerId=NDAzMzc2MA==&partialGames=0
> 
> The U13 DA league is in full swing in Texas.
> Will this be coming to SoCal next year?


It's suppose to. The 05 age group will be the next round. There are also rumors that 06 may start next year too.


----------



## Real Deal

LASTMAN14 said:


> It's suppose to. The 05 age group will be the next round. There are also rumors that 06 may start next year too.


U13 in Texas is 05s now if I'm not mistaken. 05s will be U14 next year.  So I guess it (U13 DA) would be for the 06 group next year if it were to be in SoCal.  Are you saying they will go down to U12 next year as well? (like on the boys side)?  That'd be the 07 group currently.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Real Deal said:


> U13 in Texas is 05s now if I'm not mistaken. 05s will be U14 next year.  So I guess it (U13 DA) would be for the 06 group next year if it were to be in SoCal.  Are you saying they will go down to U12 next year as well? (like on the boys side)?  That'd be the 07 group currently.


The other poster shared that DA at 05 is in motion in Texas. Here it is not and that 05 will be up and running here next spring of 2018. And that they may also add the 06 age group. From what I was told US Soccer is possibly trying to get 06 going but more than likely won't.


----------



## younothat

LASTMAN14 said:


> The other poster shared that DA at 05 is in motion in Texas. Here it is not and that 05 will be up and running here next spring of 2018. And that they may also add the 06 age group. From what I was told US Soccer is possibly trying to get 06 going but more than likely won't.


Applications for 18-19' season open on October 11, 2017 and all the info about the ages groups will be there.


----------



## GoWest

Does anyone have any insight / info on the age groups for GDA 2018/2019 season? Are they retaining the (U13?), U14, U15, U16/17 and U18/19 formatting? I had heard US Soccer was considering splitting the U16/17 into two distinct age groupings...true? False? #curious


----------



## Jack23

younothat said:


> Applications for 18-19' season open on October 11, 2017 and all the info about the ages groups will be there.


Any news on this?


----------



## younothat

Jack23 said:


> Any news on this?


Membership Applications for the 2018-2019 
Girls Application
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSe4cvBsF6Lv9ugdsyl3f27UyOWul5z7SvcNrESeL641KjfOzw/viewform


----------



## younothat

GoWest said:


> Does anyone have any insight / info on the age groups for GDA 2018/2019 season? Are they retaining the (U13?), U14, U15, U16/17 and U18/19 formatting? I had heard US Soccer was considering splitting the U16/17 into two distinct age groupings...true? False? #curious


DA Age Groups 18-19 from the application:

U-12 (2007), U-13 (2006), U-14 (2005), U-15 (2004), U-16/17 (2002/2003), & U-18/19 (2000/2001) 6 total


----------



## timbuck

younothat said:


> Membership Applications for the 2018-2019
> Girls Application
> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSe4cvBsF6Lv9ugdsyl3f27UyOWul5z7SvcNrESeL641KjfOzw/viewform


Are they really using a basic Google Docs form to accept applications?
I guess the technology works fine, but it seems pretty lame that this is what our federation uses to accept applications.
I am considering filling one out and entering "US Soccer Sucks.  What does the development academy develop?" into every free form box.


----------



## younothat

younothat said:


> DA Age Groups 18-19 from the application:
> 
> U-12 (2007), U-13 (2006), U-14 (2005), U-15 (2004), U-16/17 (2002/2003), & U-18/19 (2000/2001) 6 total


That is for the Boys DA,  the girls are doing something different apparently 

"The Girls’ Development Academy is currently in the first year of the program. Academy Leadership is in the stage of observation and analysis about any potential age groups for expansion, e.g. U-13, U-16 single age, etc. If the Academy were to expand, all clubs that complete this application would also be considered for additional potential age groups and would receive communication prior to confirming participation. Note: Existing Academy Clubs do not need to apply for any potential expansion, they will automatically be considered for any additional age group expansion"


----------



## GoWest

younothat said:


> DA Age Groups 18-19 from the application:
> 
> U-12 (2007), U-13 (2006), U-14 (2005), U-15 (2004), U-16/17 (2002/2003), & U-18/19 (2000/2001) 6 total


Thanks for the age group update. Appreciated! How long does it take US Soccer to get a decision back to the applying club? #curious


----------



## genesis

Hey Sunil, how's that academy working out for you?


----------



## Kicker4Life

genesis said:


> Hey Sunil, how's that academy working out for you?


Sunil is busy figuring out how to keep his job!


----------



## LASTMAN14

Over the last few weeks I have looked at game cards for the DA. It lists number of minutes played by players and who scored. It would be nice to know who assisted on the goals and why some players did not play. Where they on IR?


Kicker4Life said:


> Sunil is busy figuring out how to keep his job!


Actually I think he is trying to figure out how to fire himself but he keeps running into to much red tape. Who knew?


----------



## eastbaysoccer

The next best thing is coming after Gulati is canned.  The DA was in existence for 10 years and the results are in.  It did not work.


----------



## jojosoccer

Do they still have U17 residency in Bradenton FL? Because if they do....that didn't work either.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> I never said Florida wasn't a test.  Her father and I talked about it on Sunday (he was at my player's game).  She is playing well and starting for Stanford is fantastic (and not unexpected since they don't have many finishers).  All I said is give her some time.  All freshmen hit a slump at some point.  You can read into my post all you want but this type of freshman year is eye popping.   http://floridagators.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2999
> 
> Can she get there?  Yes.  Does she have some elite tools?  Yes.  Are their some glaring weaknesses to her game?  Yes.  Can she be a full WNT player?  Absolutely if she keeps working.  All that I am saying is don't go overboard with the expectations.  I have seen her play since she was 12.  Let's just let her keep doing her thing and grade it in November when it really counts.


You were right MAP, Macario did hit a bit of a slump the past few games.  But wow, she sure woke up from it last night.  2 goals and an assist against Oregon, each a beautiful strike.  She now leads all PAC-12 players in points (29).  In second is UCLA's Halie Mace (27), who has played 192 more minutes than Macario this season.  Next week will be the toughest part of the Cardinal's conference schedule with UCLA and USC on tap.  Can't wait to watch!


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> You were right MAP, Macario did hit a bit of a slump the past few games.  But wow, she sure woke up from it last night.  2 goals and an assist against Oregon, each a beautiful strike.  She now leads all PAC-12 players in points (29).  In second is UCLA's Halie Mace (27), who has played 192 more minutes than Macario this season.  Next week will be the toughest part of the Cardinal's conference schedule with UCLA and USC on tap.  Can't wait to watch!


She is a special talent.  She will go as far as she is willing to work hard to get.  She is a sweet kid too.


----------



## Monkey

Just curious, now that the season is underway, what are the costs associated with DA , especially compared to ECNL? Are costs coming in as expected? I was looking at the game reports of Albion and was wondering why they would take so many coaches to Arizona this weekend, including Gins and Crowe who have traditionally been more focused on the boys?  Why not just watch the local games?  Does US Soccer pick up their tab and are other clubs sending an entourage to out of area games?


----------



## #goals

Monkey said:


> Just curious, now that the season is underway, what are the costs associated with DA , especially compared to ECNL? Are costs coming in as expected? I was looking at the game reports of Albion and was wondering why they would take so many coaches to Arizona this weekend, including Gins and Crowe who have traditionally been more focused on the boys?  Why not just watch the local games?  Does US Soccer pick up their tab and are other clubs sending an entourage to out of area games?


I think it was great that Gins was there and getting to see the girls side.. Looks like the boys played Saturday and there were several games being played and with DA rules they were probably needed to make sure each game had the appropriate coach amount covered. As far as cost I would say it is probably comparable to ECNL.. it's a commitment for sure but if your kid is dedicated, talented and wanting the best competition and opportunities to be seen then DA is a great fit. Not for everyone but my kid is loving it!


----------



## timmyh

GoWest said:


> Does anyone have any insight / info on the age groups for GDA 2018/2019 season? Are they retaining the (U13?), U14, U15, U16/17 and U18/19 formatting? I had heard US Soccer was considering splitting the U16/17 into two distinct age groupings...true? False? #curious


The U13 DA pilot program for the Frontier conference is going well. I expect it will be expanded nationally next year.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/regevent/index.php?containerId=NDAzMzc2MA==&partialGames=0


----------



## Fact

#goals said:


> I think it was great that Gins was there and getting to see the girls side.. Looks like the boys played Saturday and there were several games being played and with DA rules they were probably needed to make sure each game had the appropriate coach amount covered. As far as cost I would say it is probably comparable to ECNL.. it's a commitment for sure but if your kid is dedicated, talented and wanting the best competition and opportunities to be seen then DA is a great fit. Not for everyone but my kid is loving it!


 Nice to see that Gins has Crowe involved on the girls side.  Crowe is the best asset Albion has and really should be running the club.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

It will be interesting to see how these lists compare as the events get closer.

https://admin.totalglobalsports.com/public/collgecoachattending.aspx?eid=507

https://scoutingzone.com/TournamentArea/SurfCollegeCup/ScoutAttendees


----------



## Fact

#goals said:


> I think it was great that Gins was there and getting to see the girls side.. Looks like the boys played Saturday and there were several games being played and with DA rules they were probably needed to make sure each game had the appropriate coach amount covered. As far as cost I would say it is probably comparable to ECNL.. it's a commitment for sure but if your kid is dedicated, talented and wanting the best competition and opportunities to be seen then DA is a great fit. Not for everyone but my kid is loving it!


I don't see any boys games on Saturday in Arizona and the girls games were spread out every 2 hours.  You seem to imply
that DA requires more than 1 coach at a game.  Is this true?  Would be a benefit for players sitting on the bench to talk to a coach during the game.  Much better than reviewing film.


----------



## Lightning Red

Typically you will find anywhere from 2-5 coaches on any DA's team bench during the DA games.  Of course, you will see more of this during the home games as it is much easier from a logistical standpoint.  At our club we have fostered an environment where direction and coaching comes from within all DA coaches on the staff.  This occurs during the practices as well.  The girls appreciate not only the support but also the different vantage points and approach to the games and training.


----------



## soccer661

It's 5 weeks out....has anyone heard when the DA schedules for Florida Dec showcase are coming out?


----------



## jojosoccer

Looking at the coaches lists for Silverlakes Vs Surf Cup.
Mostly DI at Silverlakes and Surf has some DI and more DII DIII & NAIA 
DI coaches aren't recruiting 99, 00, 01s
Silver lakes for the younger ages for sure.


----------



## Fact

Lightning Red said:


> Typically you will find anywhere from 2-5 coaches on any DA's team bench during the DA games.  Of course, you will see more of this during the home games as it is much easier from a logistical standpoint.  At our club we have fostered an environment where direction and coaching comes from within all DA coaches on the staff.  This occurs during the practices as well.  The girls appreciate not only the support but also the different vantage points and approach to the games and training.


If other clubs do this, this is a significant + for playing DA.


----------



## Fact

jojosoccer said:


> Looking at the coaches lists for Silverlakes Vs Surf Cup.
> Mostly DI at Silverlakes and Surf has some DI and more DII DIII & NAIA
> DI coaches aren't recruiting 99, 00, 01s
> Silver lakes for the younger ages for sure.


Are you sure you are not looking at last year's list?  I wa curious to see which coaches would attend given that DA teams are not playing.


----------



## Striker17

jojosoccer said:


> Looking at the coaches lists for Silverlakes Vs Surf Cup.
> Mostly DI at Silverlakes and Surf has some DI and more DII DIII & NAIA
> DI coaches aren't recruiting 99, 00, 01s
> Silver lakes for the younger ages for sure.


This seems odd is it true? 
Last year a lot of coaches were listed on Silverlakes that did not in fact go. I know this. 
Just because is a list doesn’t mean anything would love some verification. 
I have a hard time believing Surf is rolling over


----------



## Simisoccerfan

soccer661 said:


> It's 5 weeks out....has anyone heard when the DA schedules for Florida Dec showcase are coming out?


And where will this information be posted?  It seems like you can never find the schedules for the boys events at the USSDA website.


----------



## Trump4Pres

Striker17 said:


> This seems odd is it true?
> Last year a lot of coaches were listed on Silverlakes that did not in fact go. I know this.
> Just because is a list doesn’t mean anything would love some verification.
> I have a hard time believing Surf is rolling over


Last year we contacted a number of coaches that were listed as attending on the Silverlakes website. None said they were planning to attend, and a few hadn't heard of the tournament. I would take their list with a grain of salt.


----------



## Dos Equis

jojosoccer said:


> Looking at the coaches lists for Silverlakes Vs Surf Cup.
> Mostly DI at Silverlakes and Surf has some DI and more DII DIII & NAIA
> DI coaches aren't recruiting 99, 00, 01s
> Silver lakes for the younger ages for sure.


----------



## LadiesMan217

jojosoccer said:


> Looking at the coaches lists for Silverlakes Vs Surf Cup.
> Mostly DI at Silverlakes and Surf has some DI and more DII DIII & NAIA
> DI coaches aren't recruiting 99, 00, 01s
> Silver lakes for the younger ages for sure.


D1 coaches aren't recruiting 00's and 01's? What are you drinking???  You know 15-20 00 and 01 girls get recruited weekly (yes weekly) by D1 schools and this will continue for a long while until it shifts to 01's and o2's in April 2018 or so. Now 99's is another story - maybe a half dozen a month - maybe.


----------



## soccer661

Has any club gotten any word on GDA schedules for Florida showcase yet?
They are still not posted on website...


----------



## tugs

No list of scouts attending either...


----------



## GoWest

Trump4Pres said:


> Last year we contacted a number of coaches that were listed as attending on the Silverlakes website. None said they were planning to attend, and a few hadn't heard of the tournament. I would take their list with a grain of salt.


Interesting. Please share a few of the coaches you contacted that were on last years list that in fact "hadn't heard of the tournament" or didn't actually attend even thought listed. #curious


----------



## Kicker4Life

GoWest said:


> Interesting. Please share a few of the coaches you contacted that were on last years list that in fact "hadn't heard of the tournament" or didn't actually attend even thought listed. #curious


I’m gonna bet you don’t get a real answer. There are a few on this forum who pop up to sh!t on anything SilverLakes right before the events take place. I’m definately not a SilverLakes homer (despite my dD’s club affiliation and the fact we play in just about every SilverLakes event).


----------



## Soccer

soccer661 said:


> Has any club gotten any word on GDA schedules for Florida showcase yet?
> They are still not posted on website...


US Soccer said in a meeting held in Chicago this past Monday.  The schedules will be released after the final fall Weekend of play.  So after the 19th.


----------



## Josep

Curious if they’ve decided on next year’s age play.  Single ages or shifting into the format this year.


----------



## Monkey

Question - When can a DA player move from one DA team to another DA team?  Are there windows during the season?  If releasing team agrees? And what is a player's family moves, within a DA region, can they switch teams immediately or do they have to wait. Thanks.


----------



## younothat

Josep said:


> Curious if they’ve decided on next year’s age play.  Single ages or shifting into the format this year.


According to the 18-19' join page & application
http://www.ussoccerda.com/overview-join-the-academy

"Girls' Applications*: New clubs can apply for full Academy at the following age groups: U-14, U-15, U-16/17 & U-18/19.

_*The Girls' Development Academy is currently in the first year of the program. Academy Leadership is in the stage of observation and analysis about any potential age groups for expansion, e.g. U-13, U-16 single age, etc. If the Academy were to expand, all clubs that complete this application would also be considered for additional potential age groups and would receive communication prior to confirming participation. Note: Existing Academy Clubs do not need to apply for any potential expansion, they will automatically be considered for any additional age group expansion._

The combine U16/17 group seems like a step back but that's  the status quo for now, maybe that will change but I would think they would have to change the boys groups also so I kind of doubt that at this point.  I guess the final answer has to come by Feb or so during the confirming process.


----------



## Soccer

Josep said:


> Curious if they’ve decided on next year’s age play.  Single ages or shifting into the format this year.


In the meeting held this week.  They said they are reviewing the survey's sent out to the clubs that were turned in by the 5th.  They will let all clubs know at the showcase in December. 

If I were to bet next year we will have the following age groups:

U14= 2005
U15= 2004
U16=2003
U17=2002
U18/19=01/00

I am not sure we will see an 06 age group (U13).  It was very mixed if that will happen.  The Pilot group in the Texas Region is only going OK.  The biggest complaint is that it is to much travel for that age.   On the boys side they have more clubs with just this age group, so they can have more regional games.  The girls side will be an all ages or nothing for now.  So hard to make it regional, especially in some geographic locations.


----------



## Soccer

Monkey said:


> Question - When can a DA player move from one DA team to another DA team?  Are there windows during the season?  If releasing team agrees? And what is a player's family moves, within a DA region, can they switch teams immediately or do they have to wait. Thanks.


The process is outlined in the rules.  But basically you need outgoing club Approval to practice with a DA club.  Then to transfer you need approval from outgoing club to incoming club from the DOC.   It is actually a simple process.


----------



## Lambchop

Kicker4Life said:


> I’m gonna bet you don’t get a real answer. There are a few on this forum who pop up to sh!t on anything SilverLakes right before the events take place. I’m definately not a SilverLakes homer (despite my dD’s club affiliation and the fact we play in just about every SilverLakes event).





younothat said:


> According to the 18-19' join page & application
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/overview-join-the-academy
> 
> "Girls' Applications*: New clubs can apply for full Academy at the following age groups: U-14, U-15, U-16/17 & U-18/19.
> 
> _*The Girls' Development Academy is currently in the first year of the program. Academy Leadership is in the stage of observation and analysis about any potential age groups for expansion, e.g. U-13, U-16 single age, etc. If the Academy were to expand, all clubs that complete this application would also be considered for additional potential age groups and would receive communication prior to confirming participation. Note: Existing Academy Clubs do not need to apply for any potential expansion, they will automatically be considered for any additional age group expansion._
> 
> The combine U16/17 group seems like a step back but that's  the status quo for now, maybe that will change but I would think they would have to change the boys groups also so I kind of doubt that at this point.  I guess the final answer has to come by Feb or so during the confirming process.


Boy's DA and girl's DA are slightly different, boys already have U12 and U13 I believe.   So as far as age split they don't have to be exactly the same.


----------



## Soccer

*Winter Showcase Game Schedule*: The Winter Showcase game schedule will be released on Bonzi by Friday, November 17th. Any schedule questions can be sent to Clay McClatchie atcmcclatchie@ussoccer.org.


----------



## tugs

Florida DA showcase list of scouts attending:
http://www.ussoccerda.com/2017-da-ws-college-coach-scout-attendee-list

Anyone have link to schedule which should be posted today?


----------



## Josep

Schedule is out.  In normal schedules.  Good matchups.


----------



## Fact

Soccer said:


> The process is outlined in the rules.  But basically you need outgoing club Approval to practice with a DA club.  Then to transfer you need approval from outgoing club to incoming club from the DOC.   It is actually a simple process.


Without approval of outgoing DOC, are kids stuck on a team until the end of the season?  An interesting question came up because DA season goes to the end of July I believe?  But what if new kids are brought onto the team from ECNL teams and non DA/non ECNL teams midway thru the season. Despite having minimum play requirements, a player could all of a sudden have a huge cut back in playing time yet be stuck with the team since Calsouth does not control DA teams.


----------



## espola

Fact said:


> Without approval of outgoing DOC, are kids stuck on a team until the end of the season?  An interesting question came up because DA season goes to the end of July I believe?  But what if new kids are brought onto the team from ECNL teams and non DA/non ECNL teams midway thru the season. Despite having minimum play requirements, a player could all of a sudden have a huge cut back in playing time yet be stuck with the team since Calsouth does not control DA teams.


A player registered with DA is an unregistered free agent with respect to Cal South, unless the club has double-booked him.


----------



## Kicker4Life

espola said:


> A player registered with DA is an unregistered free agent with respect to Cal South, unless the club has double-booked him.


Or Her!


----------



## GoWest

When will DA tryouts be in 2018....Jan, Feb, March.....? I think we did it in May of this year for inaugural season. #curious


----------



## Fact

Fact said:


> Without approval of outgoing DOC, are kids stuck on a team until the end of the season?  An interesting question came up because DA season goes to the end of July I believe?  But what if new kids are brought onto the team from ECNL teams and non DA/non ECNL teams midway thru the season. Despite having minimum play requirements, a player could all of a sudden have a huge cut back in playing time yet be stuck with the team since Calsouth does not control DA teams.





espola said:


> A player registered with DA is an unregistered free agent with respect to Cal South, unless the club has double-booked him.


Yes I understand that CalSouth does not control DA. Look at my last sentence.  So you did not answer my question. I remember one boy telling his club that he was on scholarship for HS and so they released him to play HS thinking that he would come back afterwards.  But it was just his parents outplaying the DOC and he joined a new team right after HS season.

I would have hoped things evolved in favor of players suck on a team that was not even trying to develop them.  I guess players make a commitment to a DA team and then are suck for almost a whole year without any recourse if they are not playing or were lied to about playing time, no. of players on a team etc.  What a sad system.


----------



## Lambchop

GoWest said:


> When will DA tryouts be in 2018....Jan, Feb, March.....? I think we did it in May of this year for inaugural season. #curious


July?


----------



## GoWest

Lambchop said:


> July?


Are tryout dates mandated by US Soccer or do clubs have some flexibility setting the dates?


----------



## espola

Fact said:


> Yes I understand that CalSouth does not control DA. Look at my last sentence.  So you did not answer my question. I remember one boy telling his club that he was on scholarship for HS and so they released him to play HS thinking that he would come back afterwards.  But it was just his parents outplaying the DOC and he joined a new team right after HS season.
> 
> I would have hoped things evolved in favor of players suck on a team that was not even trying to develop them.  I guess players make a commitment to a DA team and then are suck for almost a whole year without any recourse if they are not playing or were lied to about playing time, no. of players on a team etc.  What a sad system.


The whole house of cards rests on people accepting the fiction that they are actually doing any development.  Because of its limited size, they are able to recruit the best players in any given year, and then proudly display the results of how many have made if to the highest levels - national team, age-group teams, and college rosters.  The best of those players were headed to those destinations anyway. 

The primary objective of this program has been (or should have been) to elevate USA soccer into the top ranks of FIFA teams.  Now we are at the 10-year mark which was the propagandized target year at the beginning, and where are we?  Sitting at home with Canada watching Mexico, Costa Rica, and Panama play.


----------



## LadiesMan217

espola said:


> The whole house of cards rests on people accepting the fiction that they are actually doing any development.  Because of its limited size, they are able to recruit the best players in any given year, and then proudly display the results of how many have made if to the highest levels - national team, age-group teams, and college rosters.  The best of those players were headed to those destinations anyway.
> 
> The primary objective of this program has been (or should have been) to elevate USA soccer into the top ranks of FIFA teams.  Now we are at the 10-year mark which was the propagandized target year at the beginning, and where are we?  Sitting at home with Canada watching Mexico, Costa Rica, and Panama play.


A few of the GDA clubs are actually doing things a lot different then I have seen in club soccer. In general you are correct but then again Soccer is a low totem pole for men in the US. The rest of the world has soccer as the main sport, here it is like a boys 5th sport for the athletes. Don't see that changing for a long time - not even in my lifetime.


----------



## espola

LadiesMan217 said:


> A few of the GDA clubs are actually doing things a lot different then I have seen in club soccer. In general you are correct but then again Soccer is a low totem pole for men in the US. The rest of the world has soccer as the main sport, here it is like a boys 5th sport for the athletes. Don't see that changing for a long time - not even in my lifetime.


Ding what things different?


----------



## Grow The Game

Are people pleased with the Girls Development Academy so far?  I am curious since the high school break is coming and we will see if any players choose to forgo their commitments for high school glory.


----------



## jose

Grow The Game said:


> Are people pleased with the Girls Development Academy so far?  I am curious since the high school break is coming and we will see if any players choose to forgo their commitments for high school glory.


girls especially miss it. It is a huge social thing for girls, I'm sure with the boy too.  Simple fix. DA just shut down for 3 months.  What are you going to teach in 3 months that will be drastically improved.  If my kid had a decision Id say play high school. You can't put a price on those memories


----------



## Josep

jose said:


> girls especially miss it. It is a huge social thing for girls, I'm sure with the boy too.  Simple fix. DA just shut down for 3 months.  What are you going to teach in 3 months that will be drastically improved.  If my kid had a decision Id say play high school. You can't put a price on those memories


HS is fun. No doubt.  But it’s also really bad soccer.  If you’re playing DA, there’s a good chance you’re really excited about going to Florida.  Also, kids don’t like spending all winter break at HS practice.  One of my kids had it every day except Xmas day and NYD.  

Three months of DA training, 4 days a week is very beneficial.  That’s 8 hours a week for 12 weeks.  Injuries are a factor in HS too. You just have clunky kids charging in.  Fewer refs to watch it all.  Yes, it’s fun, but that’s the only thing you’re missing out of. 

I’d also say if your kid is in DA, and they aren’t having as much or more fun, perhaps DA isn’t for you.  I’ve seen some really strong bonds out there.


----------



## timbuck

Josep said:


> HS is fun. No doubt.  But it’s also really bad soccer.  If you’re playing DA, there’s a good chance you’re really excited about going to Florida.  Also, kids don’t like spending all winter break at HS practice.  One of my kids had it every day except Xmas day and NYD.
> 
> Three months of DA training, 4 days a week is very beneficial.  That’s 8 hours a week for 12 weeks.  Injuries are a factor in HS too. You just have clunky kids charging in.  Fewer refs to watch it all.  Yes, it’s fun, but that’s the only thing you’re missing out of.
> 
> I’d also say if your kid is in DA, and they aren’t having as much or more fun, perhaps DA isn’t for you.  I’ve seen some really strong bonds out there.


Isn't this a bit of a contradiction?  They don't want to practice over break but they go to DA practice 4 days a week.
I'd like to see DA/US Soccer try to get more involved with HS soccer and try to have a mutually beneficial relationship.  Can HS soccer become better soccer with a bit of help?


----------



## Josep

timbuck said:


> Isn't this a bit of a contradiction?  They don't want to practice over break but they go to DA practice 4 days a week.
> I'd like to see DA/US Soccer try to get more involved with HS soccer and try to have a mutually beneficial relationship.  Can HS soccer become better soccer with a bit of help?



DA is on break during that time. 

Tim, you’ve been around this form for a long time.  I think you know outside a few schools that have consistently good HS programs, it’s pretty poor.  I’ve heard from other coaches that it’s much worse (summer leagues) because of the DA arriving. 

It doesn’t make sense.  It’s mostly club soccer coaches, and club soccer players.  Yet the one think you hear from club coaches after HS break is, “now I have to undo all the bad habits of HS.”   That to me is the real oxymoron.


----------



## jose

Josep said:


> HS is fun. No doubt.  But it’s also really bad soccer.  If you’re playing DA, there’s a good chance you’re really excited about going to Florida.  Also, kids don’t like spending all winter break at HS practice.  One of my kids had it every day except Xmas day and NYD.
> 
> Three months of DA training, 4 days a week is very beneficial.  That’s 8 hours a week for 12 weeks.  Injuries are a factor in HS too. You just have clunky kids charging in.  Fewer refs to watch it all.  Yes, it’s fun, but that’s the only thing you’re missing out of.
> 
> I’d also say if your kid is in DA, and they aren’t having as much or more fun, perhaps DA isn’t for you.  I’ve seen some really strong bonds out there.


agree but club anything is better than HS level.


----------



## tugs

My DDs a sophomore and made varsity for a large north county public high school in san diego.  She said during tryouts she asked one of the gals what positioned she played and gal replied "position?  I don't know...".  Pretty much sums up level of HS ball.


----------



## outside!

With GDA keeping many of the higher level female soccer players out of HS soccer, this season of HS Girls soccer will be interesting. On the plus side, it will allow more players to play soccer as teenagers, which is not a terrible thing.


----------



## MakeAPlay

tugs said:


> My DDs a sophomore and made varsity for a large north county public high school in san diego.  She said during tryouts she asked one of the gals what positioned she played and gal replied "position?  I don't know...".  Pretty much sums up level of HS ball.


HS Soccer on the girls side isn't about the soccer.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

jose said:


> girls especially miss it. It is a huge social thing for girls, I'm sure with the boy too.  Simple fix. DA just shut down for 3 months.  What are you going to teach in 3 months that will be drastically improved.  If my kid had a decision Id say play high school. You can't put a price on those memories


Not that simple.  HS soccer is a winter sport here but a spring sport in some areas and a fall sport in other areas of the country.  Hard to have a national program with those conflicts.


----------



## jose

Simisoccerfan said:


> Not that simple.  HS soccer is a winter sport here but a spring sport in some areas and a fall sport in other areas of the country.  Hard to have a national program with those conflicts.


good point.  i seriously hope that the people at the top of this could figure that part out.  either way it national games wouldn't take place while kids are in school. Im guessing.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Kids miss school for Winter and Spring showcases


----------



## SocalPapa

Simisoccerfan said:


> Not that simple.  HS soccer is a winter sport here but a spring sport in some areas and a fall sport in other areas of the country.  Hard to have a national program with those conflicts.


Not that hard.  ECNL is able to do it.  Even ECNL clubs offering a full 10-month schedule are able to work it out:  https://www.michiganwolveshawks.com/ecnl-info/ecnl-and-high-school.html


----------



## Simisoccerfan

SocalPapa said:


> Not that hard.  ECNL is able to do it.  Even ECNL clubs offering a full 10-month schedule are able to work it out:  https://www.michiganwolveshawks.com/ecnl-info/ecnl-and-high-school.html


 How does that work for the ECNL  games being played during the HS season?


----------



## eastbaysoccer

HS soccer is not about soccer.  It’s about playing for your school, your friends, with upper class man and in front of teachers and peers.  GDA is a waste of time for 99% of the kids.   Only the few will make the WNT.


----------



## Kicker4Life

eastbaysoccer said:


> GDA is a waste of time for 99% of the kids.   Only the few will make the WNT.


Please elaborate on how it is a waste of time?  Prior to GDA, would you say the same thing about ECNL?  Cause the percentages don’t change.  Or are you just saying that playing against some of the best players and teams possible is dumb?


----------



## Grow The Game

If the percentages don't change why was the girls development academy created in the first place?  Seems like every thing was going fine with the system that was in place.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Grow The Game said:


> If the percentages don't change why was the girls development academy created in the first place?  Seems like every thing was going fine with the system that was in place.


The answer to that question is above my pay grade. ECNL wasn’t an option for my DD based on geography and GDA is in our back yard. I don’t agree with the need for multiple leagues. Would be nice to have a single, geographically diverse, ECNL type league.


----------



## Mackerel Sam

Kicker4Life said:


> I don’t agree with the need for multiple leagues. Would be nice to have a single, geographically diverse, ECNL type league.


Maybe there is a need for multiple leagues. As long as they have different philosophies and different rules (e.g. allowing kids to play high school), then over time the results might speak for themselves and then people will have more actual data on what works and what does not. In the long run, trying different things  is usually a good idea. Might not be great for the individual who gets caught up in something new and untried (such as the GDA), but over time there is a useful collective learning from having tried something new.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Mackerel Sam said:


> Maybe there is a need for multiple leagues. As long as they have different philosophies and different rules (e.g. allowing kids to play high school), then over time the results might speak for themselves and then people will have more actual data on what works and what does not. In the long run, trying different things  is usually a good idea. Might not be great for the individual who gets caught up in something new and untried (such as the GDA), but over time there is a useful collective learning from having tried something new.


Money and control is what it's all about.
Switching teams or trying a new league can lead to a lost year, at the wrong time if you are an 01,02 or 03.


----------



## Sandypk

Josep said:


> Schedule is out.  In normal schedules.  Good matchups.


Do these games count for overall records?


----------



## espola

Sandypk said:


> Do these games count for overall records?


Why would records count if the purpose is player development?


----------



## Sandypk

espola said:


> Why would records count if the purpose is player development?


Why can't you just answer the question without responding with another question?  Just don't respond if you don't have an answer.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Sandypk said:


> Why can't you just answer the question without responding with another question?  Just don't respond if you don't have an answer.


I can see why JAP use to go at it with him on the old forum. It was better when they did this to each other and left us out of it. But JAP has gone into semi-retirement (only engaging from time to time) and their war has waned. But a new front has begun and now you are involved.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Sandypk said:


> Do these games count for overall records?


I heard they count.


----------



## Sandypk

Simisoccerfan said:


> I heard they count.


Thank you.


----------



## espola

Sandypk said:


> Why can't you just answer the question without responding with another question?  Just don't respond if you don't have an answer.


Here is an answer - if the stated purpose is player development, recording win-loss-tie results is measuring the wrong thing.


----------



## outside!

espola said:


> Here is an answer - if the stated purpose is player development, recording win-loss-tie results is measuring the wrong thing.


I somewhat agree, for the youngers. For the olders, the competition is needed to push the players.


----------



## espola

outside! said:


> I somewhat agree, for the youngers. For the olders, the competition is needed to push the players.


Nonsense.  What is needed is a method of measuring what is allegedly being provided, with real consequences for the players, coaches, and teams/clubs that do not measure up.


----------



## MarkM

espola said:


> Here is an answer - if the stated purpose is player development, recording win-loss-tie results is measuring the wrong thing.


The stated purpose is to develop better soccer players so that they *win games* at higher levels of competition.  Development is not a goal in of itself.  If you are developing players, they should learn to win the right way at the lower levels and then work their way up to higher levels.  Competition also drives kids to become better and develop under a more intense environment.  Everyone knows there is a big difference in intensity between playing showcase games and, for instance, tournament games.  The only reason not to keep win/loss records is that competition drives some parents/coaches to use tactics that are not in the best interest of a player's long-term development.  But the misuse of tactics by some doesn't mean win/losses an irrelevant data point when assessing development.  Are wins over emphasized by some? Certainly.  Irrelevant?  Hardly.  

Also, there are a lot of people that would argue that we should put more emphasis on winning and losing through promotion and relegation of clubs.  

For those interested, there was a great HBO segment on development of soccer in Japan.  



  It really challenges the common belief on this forum that Americans don't know how to develop soccer players.  The youtube clip doesn't give justice to Tom Byer's influence on soccer in Japan.  You need to watch the full segment to get a sense of how he helped change Japanese soccer culture.


----------



## Josep

Mark,

That was a fantastic segment on HBO.  I showed that to my wife and kids.


----------



## Justafan

MarkM said:


> For those interested, there was a great HBO segment on development of soccer in Japan.
> 
> 
> 
> It really challenges the common belief on this forum that Americans don't know how to develop soccer players.  The youtube clip doesn't give justice to Tom Byer's influence on soccer in Japan.  You need to watch the full segment to get a sense of how he helped change Japanese soccer culture.


Other countries have soccer balls all over the house, we have the Fisher-Price adjustable basketball hoop.  We don't lack creativity in basketball.


----------



## Lambchop

Kicker4Life said:


> Please elaborate on how it is a waste of time?  Prior to GDA, would you say the same thing about ECNL?  Cause the percentages don’t change.  Or are you just saying that playing against some of the best players and teams possible is dumb?


ECNL was the top program for girls, so they played with and against the best and were able to play HS if they wanted to.  They also didn't follow FIFA sub rules.  If the National team players can't adjust to FIFA sub rules after playing one game then there is a bigger problem with the players than US soccer is aware of. Only the top 1% will ever, ever play under FIFA  sub rules.


espola said:


> Why would records count if the purpose is player development?





Justafan said:


> Other countries have soccer balls all over the house, we have the Fisher-Price adjustable basketball hoop.  We don't lack creativity in basketball.


We have soccer balls everywhere!  Watch your step in our house!


----------



## Bananacorner

Highly recommend


----------



## espola

Lambchop said:


> ECNL was the top program for girls, so they played with and against the best and were able to play HS if they wanted to.  They also didn't follow FIFA sub rules.  If the National team players can't adjust to FIFA sub rules after playing one game then there is a bigger problem with the players than US soccer is aware of. Only the top 1% will ever, ever play under FIFA  sub rules.
> 
> 
> We have soccer balls everywhere!  Watch your step in our house!


FIFA substitution rules originated with team owners who did not want to pay for more players.


----------



## T1k1Taka24

I'm sure this has been discussed somewhere in this thread  and I hate to be redundant but 136 pages is a lot to sift through so...


Even after only half a year of DA, the players that are getting maximum playing time should be improving simply as a result of the caliber of their competition.

*I'm particularly curious to hear opinions of those whose players are getting 5 - 20 minutes a game (or not getting any playing time at all).*  It's one thing to practice against the best competition, but it's hard to improve if those skills developed during practice aren't given time to be applied under game conditions.


----------



## smellycleats

espola said:


> Here is an answer - if the stated purpose is player development, recording win-loss-tie results is measuring the wrong thing.


 But if the players are developing as a whole wouldn’t they play better and win more?  What am I missing?


----------



## MyDaughtersAKeeper

smellycleats said:


> But if the players are developing as a whole wouldn’t they play better and win more?  What am I missing?


I would assume the other teams and players are also improving.


----------



## timbuck

smellycleats said:


> But if the players are developing as a whole wouldn’t they play better and win more?  What am I missing?


Could be that some teams are playing 12-14 girls for most of every game.  And they win because these are the strongest players. 
Another team could be giving quality minutes to a larger pool from their roster and they lose because of it. 
Another possibility is that the team took the best 18 players that showed up, without regard for the position they play. And now they are putting the pieces together/teaching girls something new.


----------



## espola

smellycleats said:


> But if the players are developing as a whole wouldn’t they play better and win more?  What am I missing?


Better and more than what?


----------



## LASTMAN14

smellycleats said:


> But if the players are developing as a whole wouldn’t they play better and win more?  What am I missing?


Not necessarily. I see the better teams lose all the time. I've seen it from professional to youth. For example just a week or two ago I watched ManU beat Arsenal but the Gunners were the better team.


----------



## Soccer

No 06 age group next year.  06’s can play up with 05’s.

No splitting of 02/03 age groups, next year.

No change in sub rules.

Atlantic division and Frontier division will piolet 06 age group.  They will also piolet U16 and U17 split.


----------



## Josep

This will be a massive storm now for many clubs, coaches, teams and players.


----------



## Mullet

Any word on possible U12 expansion pilot programs?


----------



## ChipShot

Soccer said:


> No 06 age group next year.  06’s can play up with 05’s.
> 
> No splitting of 02/03 age groups, next year.


Has this been published anywhere or just from "sources in the know"?


----------



## Soccer

ChipShot said:


> Has this been published anywhere or just from "sources in the know"?



Yes today on the Webinar.
2018-2019 Age Groups
U-13/U-14 (2006/2005) 
U-15 (2004)
U-16/17 (2003/2002) 
U-18/19 (2001/2000)


----------



## Soccer

Mullet said:


> Any word on possible U12 expansion pilot programs?



Only in Atlantic and Frontier Divisions for 2018 -2019


----------



## Soccer

Soccer said:


> No 06 age group next year.  06’s can play up with 05’s.
> 
> No splitting of 02/03 age groups, next year.
> 
> No change in sub rules.
> 
> Atlantic division and Frontier division will piolet 06 age group.  They will also piolet U16 and U17 split.


I was wrong on one.  Only Frontier Division will pilot U16 and U17 split.  Not Atlantic.  Both will Pilot 06 Age Group.  Frontier has it now.


----------



## Mullet

So Atlantic and Frontier Divisions would look like:
U12- 07
U13- 06
U14- 05 
U15- 04
U16- 03
U17- 02
U18/19- 01-00?


----------



## Lambchop

Soccer said:


> Yes today on the Webinar.
> 2018-2019 Age Groups
> U-13/U-14 (2006/2005)
> U-15 (2004)
> U-16/17 (2003/2002)
> U-18/19 (2001/2000)


Once again, 02 and 03 girls being s.......


Mullet said:


> Any word on possible U12 expansion pilot programs?


Not happening here


----------



## Kicker4Life

Soccer said:


> Yes today on the Webinar.
> 2018-2019 Age Groups
> U-13/U-14 (2006/2005)
> U-15 (2004)
> U-16/17 (2003/2002)
> U-18/19 (2001/2000)


So you’re telling us ‘04 is the only age pure age group?


----------



## Mullet

Kicker4Life said:


> So you’re telling us ‘04 is the only age pure age group?


I think outside of Atlantic and Frontier the 05 U14 age group will allow 06 play-ups? This isn't really new as play-ups have always been encouraged.


----------



## Lambchop

Soccer said:


> I was wrong on one.  Only Frontier Division will pilot U16 and U17 split.  Not Atlantic.  Both will Pilot 06 Age Group.  Frontier has it now.


Why "pilot" a program? As a famous character said, "Do or do not, there is no try".


----------



## Kicker4Life

Mullet said:


> I think outside of Atlantic and Frontier the 05 U14 age group will allow 06 play-ups? This isn't really new as play-ups have always been encouraged.


Ummm, every age group allows kids to play up.  For example, we  have 2 05’s and playing at ‘04 and an ‘05 playing ‘03 at our club and I know an ‘06 playing ‘04 at another.  

So why show the new ‘05 Age Group as split?


----------



## Mullet

Kicker4Life said:


> Ummm, every age group allows kids to play up.  For example, we  have 2 05’s and playing at ‘04 and an ‘05 playing ‘03 at our club and I know an ‘06 playing ‘04 at another.
> 
> So why show the new ‘05 Age Group as split?


Exactly. I'm just trying to make sense of the post as you are.


----------



## Josep

I know of  two clubs that have emailed this out.


----------



## Mullet

Josep said:


> I know of  two clubs that have emailed this out.


Can you post the email? Redacted of course


----------



## Dabizness

Soccer said:


> Yes today on the Webinar.
> 2018-2019 Age Groups
> U-13/U-14 (2006/2005)
> U-15 (2004)
> U-16/17 (2003/2002)
> U-18/19 (2001/2000)


Where is the link to the webinar? Where is it posted? I Want to see...


----------



## CopaMundial

Soccer said:


> No 06 age group next year.  06’s can play up with 05’s.
> No splitting of 02/03 age groups, next year.
> No change in sub rules.
> Atlantic division and Frontier division will piolet 06 age group.  They will also piolet U16 and U17 split.


Please do post the webinar link or info about this.

Does not sound like ANYTHING that most of SoCal big dog DA clubs were expecting. In particular, for the '02 and '03 age groups. We continue to dilute player talent by having DA and ECNL compete for players. If anything, I figured USSF was going to put the nail in ECNL by going age pure and be top dog once and for all. Not sure the logic here.


----------



## Lambchop

CopaMundial said:


> Please do post the webinar link or info about this.
> 
> Does not sound like ANYTHING that most of SoCal big dog DA clubs were expecting. In particular, for the '02 and '03 age groups. We continue to dilute player talent by having DA and ECNL compete for players. If anything, I figured USSF was going to put the nail in ECNL by going age pure and be top dog once and for all. Not sure the logic here.


This will hit the largest age group in the country the hardest, the 03 group.  Approximately half of all the 03 DA group will be cut and most likely be moving to ECNL, which also means half of the ECNL group might be affected. The 02 group already plays dual age so won't be affected as much.  Way to go US soccer.  Is this their way of forcing a cut to the very talented 03 group after going single age group for this year?  Are they giving the very large Frontier division an advantage by keeping the 03 group in DA thus providing more training and exposure to college coaches in the very important soph. year of high school. Also, is having the second showcase back east an attempt to get more west coast girls to attend schools back east? There is a ton of talent out west, many ECNL girls could easily compete against some of the DA girls in other parts of the country.  Just like there aren't too many Olympic Alpine skiers in So. Calif., Arizona and Nevada, location will always play a part in how many athletes select a specific sport. There is always a hidden agenda beneath there public decisions.


----------



## NTX07Soccer

Anyone hearing that ECNL will make the dual ECNL/DA clubs choose between the two?


----------



## Striker17

Big news thanks everyone for the updates. This impacts everyone!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> This will hit the largest age group in the country the hardest, the 03 group.  Approximately half of all the 03 DA group will be cut and most likely be moving to ECNL, which also means half of the ECNL group might be affected. The 02 group already plays dual age so won't be affected as much.  Way to go US soccer.  Is this their way of forcing a cut to the very talented 03 group after going single age group for this year?  Are they giving the very large Frontier division an advantage by keeping the 03 group in DA thus providing more training and exposure to college coaches in the very important soph. year of high school. Also, is having the second showcase back east an attempt to get more west coast girls to attend schools back east? There is a ton of talent out west, many ECNL girls could easily compete against some of the DA girls in other parts of the country.  Just like there aren't too many Olympic Alpine skiers in So. Calif., Arizona and Nevada, location will always play a part in how many athletes select a specific sport. There is always a hidden agenda beneath there public decisions.


You really don't think that US Soccer cares about the product (players) do you?  One of my players teammates was pressured to turn pro at 19.  Tell me that is all about the player's best interest.  US Soccer cares about one thing and it isn't soccer...


----------



## Striker17

I am totally confused you mean MP wasn't excited about the chance of a lifetime to play for the world class Spirit rather than attend A top rated institution and have a social life with her fun peers? Shocking!


----------



## Ghostwriter

Currently the 01/02 split age group has 74% 01s, 25% 02s, and 1% 03s.  This would give some insight on the breakdown of what the 02/03 combine age group would look like next year.  The only factors that could swing this to 60/40 split instead of a 75/25 split in favor of the 02s would be if a large portion of the 02s currently playing with the 01s go up to the 00/01 age group next year. Either way a good portion of the 03s playing DA this year will move to ECNL or DA II squads depending on their club next year.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> You really don't think that US Soccer cares about the product (players) do you?  One of my players teammates was pressured to turn pro at 19.  Tell me that is all about the player's best interest.  US Soccer cares about one thing and it isn't soccer...


Pressured how?  With money?

Shameful --- NOT!!


----------



## espola

NTX07Soccer said:


> Anyone hearing that ECNL will make the dual ECNL/DA clubs choose between the two?


Making up rules that inhibit children from playing soccer is what adults do best.


----------



## Striker17

I don't have an 03. 
They don't have to play ECNL or second team- they can transfer to another DA. Honestly in a recruiting year that's what I would do- take my on the bubble 03 and go to a DA that would take her. 
If you are a Surf DA 03 and going to be moved down try Carlsbad or Albion!


----------



## Ghostwriter

Striker17 said:


> I don't have an 03.
> They don't have to play ECNL or second team- they can transfer to another DA. Honestly in a recruiting year that's what I would do- take my on the bubble 03 and go to a DA that would take her.
> If you are a Surf DA 03 and going to be moved down try Carlsbad or Albion!



I am just giving you the breakdown and average of the current 01/02 age group that is made up of 75% 01s.  Every kid can look at her options but if the numbers next year for the 02/03 age group are anywhere close to this years 01/02 age group 75% to 60% of the current 03s playing DA will be looking for a new gig.  We haven't even got to playing time yet. This isn t a knock on the DA or the 03 age group it's just the reality of being the younger age in a combined age group similar to what the 02s had to do this year.


----------



## Striker17

Didn't take it that way. Agree with your assessment. My point is if you are a 10-20 on a current 03 DA rather than take your seat on the second team why not shop?
This is a business A next year is a recruiting year for an 03. I wouldn't be on a team that couldn't maximize the exposure.


----------



## Ghostwriter

Striker17 said:


> Didn't take it that way. Agree with your assessment. My point is if you are a 10-20 on a current 03 DA rather than take your seat on the second team why not shop?
> This is a business A next year is a recruiting year for an 03. I wouldn't be on a team that couldn't maximize the exposure.


Absolutely everyone should always look out for their dd. Just remember every club currently has an ECNL 02 team or a DA II 02 team and those players will be battling for 02/03 DA spots next year. Plus 02s from non DA and ECNL clubs will battle for those spots as well. Its a highly competitive and a combine age player pool makes it twice as competitive.


----------



## Striker17

The 03 age group is so talented. I cannot imagine the job of assembling teams and cutting any of these girls! I don't know much about 02 at all. 
I can't imagine though any girls on a third team or ECNL team taking priority over a current Surf Da 03. That team is loaded. You can take the bottom 10 on that team and they are better than someone else's starting 10. Those girls should shop.
Wonder if the clubs have spread the news yet? Doubtful!


----------



## Striker17

NTX07Soccer said:


> Anyone hearing that ECNL will make the dual ECNL/DA clubs choose between the two?


I really hope they figure this out quick. This should impact movement massively! 
If you have a bubble player 03 and assume you will "just play on ECNL" you will get stripped.
Better to go to a different Da is you can get in that if this is fact accurate. 
What a tough pill to swallow in a solid recruiting year geesh


----------



## Ghostwriter

Striker17 said:


> The 03 age group is so talented. I cannot imagine the job of assembling teams and cutting any of these girls! I don't know much about 02 at all.
> I can't imagine though any girls on a third team or ECNL team taking priority over a current Surf Da 03. That team is loaded. You can take the bottom 10 on that team and they are better than someone else's starting 10. Those girls should shop.
> Wonder if the clubs have spread the news yet? Doubtful!


The 03 age group is talented so is the 02 age group. The 02 players on Surfs ECNL team aren't on the 2nd team they are on the 1st team for that age group as the 01/2 DA team is made up of all 01s.  So all the 02 ECNL surf girls will compete for DA spots against the 03 DA Surf girls next year.  My point is many of the 02s not playing DA this year is because clubs went with a majority of 01s. Next year if that trend holds the 02/03 combined age group will be made up with a majority of 02s.


----------



## Striker17

I am saying outside 03 ECNL or non Da having a shot at penetrating this DA not likely...
Think about the current ECNL girls too- down to the c team!


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

What did everyone expect? US Soccer has a proven track record in not understanding what they are doing or necessarily caring about the impact. A waste of resources, energy and unfortunately kids futures and lets face how boring and sterile are 90% of the games?


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> Pressured how?  With money?
> 
> Shameful --- NOT!!


Yeah dumba$$.  Just watch her developmental arc over the next 3 years.  Tell me outside of the money that it was the best decision for her.  She sure spent a lot of time with the team during the run to the College Cup.  In your silly little myopic world you probably think that money is everything.  I'm sure that your wife would disagree....  You should focus on her needs.  You don't even have a female soccer player so again you are just being a prick of a dilettante.

Pathetic little man.


----------



## Striker17

I also think it's cute i got under someone's skin so bad a month ago that he follows me and clicks dumb on all my posts. Love it! Keep on clicking darlin


----------



## MakeAPlay

Striker17 said:


> I am totally confused you mean MP wasn't excited about the chance of a lifetime to play for the world class Spirit rather than attend A top rated institution and have a social life with her fun peers? Shocking!


She did not end up in the city that she thought that she would end up end that is for sure.  She has scored one international goal in the last year.  She could have won a national title on a full ride while only building her brand.  She literally would have hundreds of kids lined up to get an autograph and often had to cut out early after signing a few dozen.  Even one or two years of building her brand while STILL getting called up for caps with the WNT.  Playing 4 years in college didn't hurt Mia Hamm, Alex Morgan, Abby Wambach, etc so I doubt that playing 2 would have done anything but help her.

It's water under the bridge though.  I wish her much success.  She is a sweet kid.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Yeah dumba$$.  Just watch her developmental arc over the next 3 years.  Tell me outside of the money that it was the best decision for her.  She sure spent a lot of time with the team during the run to the College Cup.  In your silly little myopic world you probably think that money is everything.  I'm sure that your wife would disagree....  You should focus on her needs.  You don't even have a female soccer player so again you are just being a prick of a dilettante.
> 
> Pathetic little man.


Calm down big guy - you'll split your helmet.  I was just amused at your use of the word "pressured".

My son turned down a couple of offers so he could finish school and keep his current job, but I wouldn't say he was "pressured".


----------



## Dos Equis

Ghostwriter said:


> The 03 age group is talented so is the 02 age group. The 02 players on Surfs ECNL team aren't on the 2nd team they are on the 1st team for that age group as the 01/2 DA team is made up of all 01s.  So all the 02 ECNL surf girls will compete for DA spots against the 03 DA Surf girls next year.  My point is many of the 02s not playing DA this year is because clubs went with a majority of 01s. Next year if that trend holds the 02/03 combined age group will be made up with a majority of 02s.


A possible flaw in your assumption is that '02 girls stayed ECNL because they could not make DA (or that clubs made the decision for them).  In the case of Surf and Blues, might it be that they stayed in ECNL because they saw no need to play DA in their age group (for college recruiting or competition), or preferred flexibility that ECNL provided?  In the case of Arsenal and Strikers, perhaps they understood who they would be playing against in ECNL, and also did not see the need to switch to a DA club?

I do not want to turn this into an ECNL vs. DA thread, but the '02 and above players faced a far different landscape and decision than the '03 and below, and I am not sure what facts have changed that will cause them to change their decision next year.  

As for DA2/Reserve '02 players who will now get the chance, all marketing aside, I really do not see that much DA level talent waiting on those teams, taking spots away from DA worthy '03 players.  

The Socal '03 age group may get a far more even representation in DA than you expect.


----------



## Mullet

MakeAPlay said:


> She did not end up in the city that she thought that she would end up end that is for sure.  She has scored one international goal in the last year.  She could have won a national title on a *full ride while only building her brand*.  She literally would have hundreds of kids lined up to get an autograph and often had to cut out early after signing a few dozen.  Even one or two years of building her brand while STILL getting called up for caps with the WNT.  Playing 4 years in college didn't hurt Mia Hamm, Alex Morgan, Abby Wambach, etc so I doubt that playing 2 would have done anything but help her.
> 
> It's water under the bridge though.  I wish her much success.  She is a sweet kid.


The college game would not have helped her in the way that a professional environment would. "Build her brand"? You know that she could never cash in on "her brand" during those four years at college right? And she currently still gets kids lined up to get her autograph after games. I wasn't aware that 9 year olds girls follow the college game to line up for player autographs but ok.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> The college game would not have helped her in the way that a professional environment would. "Build her brand"? You know that she could never cash in on "her brand" during those four years at college right? And she currently still gets kids lined up to get her autograph after games. I wasn't aware that 9 year olds girls follow the college game to line up for player autographs but ok.


Gotta disagree. UCLA and being in L.A. while also being one of if not the most high profile young American soccer stars, while utilizing the resources and connections of UCLA would of done more to build and develop a brand. Cashing in on a brand is only part of the equation, and being in a small east Coast market playing mediocre “pro” Soccer will accomplish very little brand wise, not to mention having the resources to utilize for training, medical, conditioning, in off season etc. 9 year old girls are only a small fraction of brand designation, but yes they do line up for autographs and yes girls do follow Soccer, and yes girls know who Fleming, and Sanchez are, they matter, and they have a brand already. And in my opinion mater sometimes more than the senior national team players. More visible, accessible. That’s how you grow your market.


----------



## Lambchop

Ghostwriter said:


> Currently the 01/02 split age group has 74% 01s, 25% 02s, and 1% 03s.  This would give some insight on the breakdown of what the 02/03 combine age group would look like next year.  The only factors that could swing this to 60/40 split instead of a 75/25 split in favor of the 02s would be if a large portion of the 02s currently playing with the 01s go up to the 00/01 age group next year. Either way a good portion of the 03s playing DA this year will move to ECNL or DA II squads depending on their club next year.


Exactly, US soccer doubled the number of 03 girls in DA this year by going to single age band, now after the girls have worked hard practicing four days a week, plus extra training, big expenses, US soccer decides to cut over half of them.


----------



## Ghostwriter

Dos Equis said:


> A possible flaw in your assumption is that '02 girls stayed ECNL because they could not make DA (or that clubs made the decision for them).  In the case of Surf and Blues, might it be that they stayed in ECNL because they saw no need to play DA in their age group (for college recruiting or competition), or preferred flexibility that ECNL provided?  In the case of Arsenal and Strikers, perhaps they understood who they would be playing against in ECNL, and also did not see the need to switch to a DA club?
> 
> I do not want to turn this into an ECNL vs. DA thread, but the '02 and above players faced a far different landscape and decision than the '03 and below, and I am not sure what facts have changed that will cause them to change their decision next year.
> 
> As for DA2/Reserve '02 players who will now get the chance, all marketing aside, I really do not see that much DA level talent waiting on those teams, taking spots away from DA worthy '03 players.
> 
> The Socal '03 age group may get a far more even representation in DA than you expect.


Blues 01 and 02 players stayed in ECNL because many wanted to play for JSerra and other HS team's and wanted to keep both those powerhouse team's together.  They don't factor in the current 01/02 age group so even if none play DA next year they won't factor in the 02/03 ratio either.  As far as Strikers and Arsenal both clubs loss players to DA this year from the 01, 02, and 03 age groups.  Not sure if they will lose any next year but that won't factor in the ratio either.  As far as DA ECNL team's besides Blues the 02s will make a big push onto those rosters next year, also even if only half or a 3rd of the DA II 02s make an Academy roster next year and combine those with 25% 02s already playing DA it will create a 60/40 ratio at the minimum.

The point isn t that the 03s aren't a tremendous age group the point is when you combine the 02/03 age groups next year you will have at the very least a 60/40 split in favor of the 02s and that is being generous from the current 01/02 age group with a current 75/25 split in favor of the 01s.  Its just simple math the big factor that could change that is if the majority of 02s playing in the DA 01/02 age group play up next year or play with their own age group. If some play up you could have a 55/45 split in favor of the 02s.


----------



## Nutmeg

Lambchop said:


> Exactly, US soccer doubled the number of 03 girls in DA this year by going to single age band, now after the girls have worked hard practicing four days a week, plus extra training, big expenses, US soccer decides to cut over half of them.


I only have a theory here. But I believe USSOCCER, did this at member clubs request in order to increase $ across multiple platforms and age groups at both olders and youngers.


----------



## Dos Equis

Lambchop said:


> Exactly, US soccer doubled the number of 03 girls in DA this year by going to single age band, now after the girls have worked hard practicing four days a week, plus extra training, big expenses, US soccer decides to cut over half of them.


And they would cut 90% of them if the could viably create a competitive league with the rest.  It is a funnel, and US Soccer ultimatley cares about roughly .05% of any age group -- the girls who may one day make the training pool or a national team.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> Gotta disagree. UCLA and being in L.A. while also being one of if not the most high profile young American soccer stars, while utilizing the resources and connections of UCLA would of done more to build and develop a brand. Cashing in on a brand is only part of the equation, and being in a small east Coast market playing mediocre “pro” Soccer will accomplish very little brand wise, not to mention having the resources to utilize for training, medical, conditioning, in off season etc. 9 year old girls are only a small fraction of brand designation, but yes they do line up for autographs and yes girls do follow Soccer, and yes girls know who Fleming, and Sanchez are, they matter, and they have a brand already. And in my opinion mater sometimes more than the senior national team players. More visible, accessible. That’s how you grow your market.


Pro soccer, as mediocre as you call it, it still far better than the college game. But I'm sure she is better off not playing against Rapinoe, Marta, Morgan and other National Team players every week. Dedicating completely to soccer instead of bookending her classes with practices would be better for her soccer too I suppose. You may not appreciate the pro game but watching Spirit subs essentially clean the floor with UNCs best in a scrimmage shows the separation between the college and the pro game.

For long term soccer development, Pugh absolutely made the right decision to go Pro.

And as a East Coaster, no her brand would absolutely not have been expanded by playing in college. Only being on the NT would have elevated her status. Outside of your bubble nobody cares.


----------



## Nutmeg

Dos Equis said:


> And they would cut 90% of them if the could viably create a competitive league with the rest.  It is a funnel, and US Soccer ultimatley cares about roughly .05% of any age group -- the girls who may one day make the training pool or a national team.


More to the point they care about growing their market base and increasing money into their coffers. Soccer is secondary


----------



## Lambchop

Ghostwriter said:


> Currently the 01/02 split age group has 74% 01s, 25% 02s, and 1% 03s.  This would give some insight on the breakdown of what the 02/03 combine age group would look like next year.  The only factors that could swing this to 60/40 split instead of a 75/25 split in favor of the 02s would be if a large portion of the 02s currently playing with the 01s go up to the 00/01 age group next year. Either way a good portion of the 03s playing DA this year will move to ECNL or DA II squads depending on their club next year.


And what will that do to all the current ECNL players?


Dos Equis said:


> And they would cut 90% of them if the could viably create a competitive league with the rest.  It is a funnel, and US Soccer ultimatley cares about roughly .05% of any age group -- the girls who may one day make the training pool or a national team.


They should have never gone to single age band, that again, doubled the number of girls in this group. It is a funnel but they screwed a lot more girls for this next year.


----------



## Fact

Lambchop said:


> Exactly, US soccer doubled the number of 03 girls in DA this year by going to single age band, now after the girls have worked hard practicing four days a week, plus extra training, big expenses, US soccer decides to cut over half of them.


 So what I don't understand is that most people on this board have complained that too many DA teams have watered down the top teams. Now that only the cream of the crop will make the teams, the same people are complaining?


----------



## Fact

Lambchop said:


> And what will that do to all the current ECNL players?
> 
> They should have never gone to single age band, that again, doubled the number of girls in this group. It is a funnel but they screwed a lot more girls for this next year.


Instead of saying they screwed a lot of girls why can't you say they gave these girls the opportunity to get a taste of DA.  They had the opportunity to take advantage of their increased coaching and step up their game.  If they did not make full use of this opportunity and or cannot step up their game to compete with girls in many cases just a few months older than them, too bad.  You have a case of the trophy for all mentality.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Mullet said:


> The college game would not have helped her in the way that a professional environment would. "Build her brand"? You know that she could never cash in on "her brand" during those four years at college right? And she currently still gets kids lined up to get her autograph after games. I wasn't aware that 9 year olds girls follow the college game to line up for player autographs but ok.


You cash in on a brand once you have results to back it up.  At this point outside of high school she has no results to point to.  If you haven't seen little girls lined up to get autographs then you haven't been to a top college game.  If you don't think that her game would improve playing at UCLA then you haven't watched them play and I will leave it at that.  UCLA lost to the Seattle Reign 3-2 without Pugh, Sanchez or Fleming and they were leading 2-1 with 20 minutes left in the game.  I get that you have your opinion but at least WATCH before you say anything.  As the saying goes, "God gave us two ears and one mouth for a reason.  We should do twice as much listening as talking."  I will add that you should watch a team before you comment.  If you did you would know that even with her she wasn't going to be the main player on the team and she was far from dominant in training.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> Pro soccer, as mediocre as you call it, it still far better than the college game. But I'm sure she is better off not playing against Rapinoe, Marta, Morgan and other National Team players every week. Dedicating completely to soccer instead of bookending her classes with practices would be better for her soccer too I suppose. You may not appreciate the pro game but watching Spirit subs essentially clean the floor with UNCs best in a scrimmage shows the separation between the college and the pro game.
> 
> For long term soccer development, Pugh absolutely made the right decision to go Pro.
> 
> And as a East Coaster, no her brand would absolutely not have been expanded by playing in college. Only being on the NT would have elevated her status. Outside of your bubble nobody cares.


Classic east coast mentality. Yeah your right nobody cares about Los Angeles, everybody always talks about the Soccer hotbed of Bethesda. Hey how’s that NWSL franchise is WEST NY. Oh wait they moved. UNC played there subs in that game, and I watched UCLA play the Reign and put in a clinic, all the while more people cared about the college team than the pro one. And your right....The American pro game is poor not mediocre. It’s poor in salary, facilities, structure, media, marketing, coaching, training, etc. The on field product is just mediocre, and serves no point other than providing a place for national team players to train for 5 months and play against other US Nationals. Should Pugh have gone Pro, maybe but it should have been in Paris or London, or Berlin, not small market Soccer purgatory.


----------



## Ghostwriter

Lambchop said:


> And what will that do to all the current ECNL players?
> 
> I don't know. Obviously for every 02 player that leaves an ECNL spot for DA spot opens up an ECNL spot. For every 03 DA player that loses a DA spot to an 02 player than depending on where that 03 goes she could play ECNL, DA II, or tryout for another DA team taking a spot from another player.  Eventually it will settle and those 03s that were displaced will be the top dog in the 2019 season when most are Juniors in HS regardless if DA does a single 03 age group or an 03/04 age group in two years.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> Classic east coast mentality. Yeah your right nobody cares about Los Angeles, everybody always talks about the Soccer hotbed of Bethesda. Hey how’s that NWSL franchise is WEST NY. Oh wait they moved. UNC played there subs in that game, and I watched UCLA play the Reign and put in a clinic, all the while more people cared about the college team than the pro one. And your right....The American pro game is poor not mediocre. It’s poor in salary, facilities, structure, media, marketing, coaching, training, etc. The on field product is just mediocre, and serves no point other than providing a place for national team players to train for 5 months and play against other US Nationals. Should Pugh have gone Pro, maybe but it should have been in Paris or London, or Berlin, not small market Soccer purgatory.


The point is nobody cares outside of their bubble period. 

I understand how awesome sauce southern cal Soccer is but that doesn’t mean college is better for developing than the pro game is.


----------



## Nutmeg

In an 


Mullet said:


> The point is nobody cares outside of their bubble period.
> 
> I understand how awesome sauce southern cal Soccer is but that doesn’t mean college is better for developing than the pro game is.


In an ideal soccer world yes the pro game would be better but for women that model has not proven out to be so yet.


----------



## Dos Equis

Ghostwriter said:


> Blues 01 and 02 players stayed in ECNL because many wanted to play for JSerra and other HS team's and wanted to keep both those powerhouse team's together.  They don't factor in the current 01/02 age group so even if none play DA next year they won't factor in the 02/03 ratio either.  As far as Strikers and Arsenal both clubs loss players to DA this year from the 01, 02, and 03 age groups.  Not sure if they will lose any next year but that won't factor in the ratio either.  As far as DA ECNL team's besides Blues the 02s will make a big push onto those rosters next year, also even if only half or a 3rd of the DA II 02s make an Academy roster next year and combine those with 25% 02s already playing DA it will create a 60/40 ratio at the minimum.
> 
> The point isn t that the 03s aren't a tremendous age group the point is when you combine the 02/03 age groups next year you will have at the very least a 60/40 split in favor of the 02s and that is being generous from the current 01/02 age group with a current 75/25 split in favor of the 01s.  Its just simple math the big factor that could change that is if the majority of 02s playing in the DA 01/02 age group play up next year or play with their own age group. If some play up you could have a 55/45 split in favor of the 02s.


Whatever the final 02/03 ratio, I expect any deserving '03 who wants to, will find a spot on a 02/03 DA team.  If half of the current '03 DA players are not in DA next year, that is the goal of the DA system -- to be a funnel for US Soccer to develop and identify national team players.


----------



## Striker17

^a humbling truth that again is not shared or talked about but should be with parents across the age groups


----------



## MakeAPlay

Nutmeg said:


> Gotta disagree. UCLA and being in L.A. while also being one of if not the most high profile young American soccer stars, while utilizing the resources and connections of UCLA would of done more to build and develop a brand. Cashing in on a brand is only part of the equation, and being in a small east Coast market playing mediocre “pro” Soccer will accomplish very little brand wise, not to mention having the resources to utilize for training, medical, conditioning, in off season etc. 9 year old girls are only a small fraction of brand designation, but yes they do line up for autographs and yes girls do follow Soccer, and yes girls know who Fleming, and Sanchez are, they matter, and they have a brand already. And in my opinion mater sometimes more than the senior national team players. More visible, accessible. That’s how you grow your market.



Correct.  UCLA is on TV much more than any NWSL team.  UCLA's facilities are much better than any NWSL team.  I wish her luck but I know 100% that she would have liked to have been with the team during their run to the college cup.  She sat with the team on the bench during the playoffs and would come out to dinner after the games with the team.  It sucks that she was put in that position.  Even the NBA and NFL (where real money is made) make players wait a year or two before they go pro.


----------



## Mullet

MakeAPlay said:


> Correct.  UCLA is on TV much more than any NWSL team.  UCLA's facilities are much better than any NWSL team.  I wish her luck but I know 100% that she would have liked to have been with the team during their run to the college cup.  She sat with the team on the bench during the playoffs and would come out to dinner after the games with the team.  It sucks that she was put in that position.  Even the NBA and NFL (where real money is made) make players wait a year or two before they go pro.


You mean like Kobe and LeBron?

Not outside of LA.  Again our bubbles are different. I’m not saying that NWSL bubble is big but UCLA isn’t on TV on the East Coast.

Regardless. Pro>College.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Correct.  UCLA is on TV much more than any NWSL team.  UCLA's facilities are much better than any NWSL team.  I wish her luck but I know 100% that she would have liked to have been with the team during their run to the college cup.  She sat with the team on the bench during the playoffs and would come out to dinner after the games with the team.  It sucks that she was put in that position.  Even the NBA and NFL (where real money is made) make players wait a year or two before they go pro.


Yep, those chances are hard to come by.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Lambchop said:


> And what will that do to all the current ECNL players?
> 
> They should have never gone to single age band, that again, doubled the number of girls in this group. It is a funnel but they screwed a lot more girls for this next year.


It depends what their end game is, money or national type players. I would bet on the former.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> In an
> 
> In an ideal soccer world yes the pro game would be better but for women that model has not proven out to be so yet.


You contend that a college team would beat any NWSL team? 

A dedicated professional environment will almost always be better than college. MP is far more challenged in her pro games than she ever would be in college. Sorry, but it is a fact. 

Sure, the sentimentality says college but long term for soccer development she made the right choice.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> You contend that a college team would beat any NWSL team?
> 
> A dedicated professional environment will almost always be better than college. MP is far more challenged in her pro games than she ever would be in college. Sorry, but it is a fact.
> 
> Sure, the sentimentality says college but long term for soccer development she made the right choice.


It’s not about beating anybody. It’s not about being challenged. She made her choice for her and that’s fine. Has her brand appeal grown. NO, endorsements, NO.  No one cares now, not until 2019.  Are her games on TV, NO. Its about the fact that the NWSL is s... show. There is no dedicated pro environment in America of which you speak. Trust me. NWSL players are simply college players in worse cities and less resources. Unless you got a kid in it you don’t know. Training on a city field and making just below the poverty line is not a pro environment.


----------



## Lambchop

Dos Equis said:


> Whatever the final 02/03 ratio, I expect any deserving '03 who wants to, will find a spot on a 02/03 DA team.  If half of the current '03 DA players are not in DA next year, that is the goal of the DA system -- to be a funnel for US Soccer to develop and identify national team players.


That is true, but the big mistake that US soccer did was go single age band that was a dual age band and thus doubled the number in DA for that age group as well as the 04's.  Why the pilot program next year in Frontier division where there is a single age band for 03's?  Always politics.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> It’s not about beating anybody. It’s not about being challenged. She made her choice for her and that’s fine. Has her brand appeal grown. NO, endorsements, NO.  No one cares now, not until 2019.  Are her games on TV, NO. Its about the fact that the NWSL is s... show. There is no dedicated pro environment in America of which you speak. Trust me. NWSL players are simply college players in worse cities and less resources. Unless you got a kid in it you don’t know. Training on a city field and making just below the poverty line is not a pro environment.


And I’m sorry but the challenge in college simply isn’t the same. She is practicing with and against National team players from all over. 

Who in the college game is even comparable to playing against Marta? Or playing against Marta and Alex Morgan in the same game? Please stop, College is great but MP is far more challenged where she is now. You really should look at the rosters a little more closely.


----------



## Multivitamin

DA Players/Parents - read the fine print in your paperwork this Springs tryouts!
DA is making a push for U21 and U23 DA teams - *The kick back is NO COLLEGE BALL!!!!*

*DID YOU HEAR THAT NO COLLEGE BALL!!!! Pathetic!!*


----------



## Mullet

Multivitamin said:


> DA Players/Parents - read the fine print in your paperwork this Springs tryouts!
> DA is making a push for U21 and U23 DA teams - *The kick back is NO COLLEGE BALL!!!!*
> 
> *DID YOU HEAR THAT NO COLLEGE BALL!!!! Pathetic!!*


Good. The rest of the world thinks playing soccer in College is silly. 

College sports has only proven to be a true developmental platform and pathway for uniquely American sports.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> And I’m sorry but the challenge in college simply isn’t the same. She is practicing with and against National team players from all over.
> 
> Who in the college game is even comparable to playing against Marta? Or playing against Marta and Alex Morgan in the same game? Please stop, College is great but MP is far more challenged where she is now. You really should look at the rosters a little more closely.


I know the rosters very well. Better than you do I’m sure. The NWSL right now is the 3rd best women’s league in the world, and getting worse.  I’m not making a college vs NWSL argument. I’m
Making a branding, money, facility, infrastructure argument.  But you go in ahead and keep banging your drum of playing against Morgan 2x a year makes you better BS. It doesn’t all it does is demonstrate that one makes 975,000$ a year and the other makes 75,000$ just from the fact that one is more marketable with a higher international profile.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> Good. The rest of the world thinks playing soccer in College is silly.
> 
> College sports has only proven to be a true developmental platform and pathway for uniquely American sports.


Your talking about men. For women the top 10 programs in College are a legit platform for most Europeans, south and North American players. The U21 U23 DA talk is a money grab and nothing more. The cost benefit analysis of a college degree vs entry level pro salary is no where close for women players.


----------



## espola

Nutmeg said:


> Your talking about men. For women the top 10 programs in College are a legit platform for most Europeans, south and North American players. The U21 U23 DA talk is a money grab and nothing more. The cost benefit analysis of a college degree vs entry level pro salary is no where close for women players.


Unless they are being pressured.


----------



## Lambchop

Striker17 said:


> I really hope they figure this out quick. This should impact movement massively!
> If you have a bubble player 03 and assume you will "just play on ECNL" you will get stripped.
> Better to go to a different Da is you can get in that if this is fact accurate.
> What a tough pill to swallow in a solid recruiting year geesh


First the age change, then DA  single age bracket, then back to dual age, what else will US soccer throw at the 03 girls?  What a mess next summer will be.  None of the DA girls can try out anywhere until after playoffs which end June 28.


----------



## pulguita

Mullet said:


> You contend that a college team would beat any NWSL team?
> 
> A dedicated professional environment will almost always be better than college. MP is far more challenged in her pro games than she ever would be in college. Sorry, but it is a fact.
> 
> Sure, the sentimentality says college but long term for soccer development she made the right choice.


A dedicated professional environment?  You're not serious are you?  That would maybe be true if the coaching was unequivocally better.  Watching what I could stomach of the games this year - ie the semis and finals (unwatchable) I can clearly say that the professional coaching in the NWSL leaves a lot to be desired.   I can guarantee you that every PAC12 school has better facilities than everyone maybe outside of Portland.  And I will guarantee that the facilities at Oregon are better than that of the Thorns.  Do you think the NWSL teams have a better travel budget than USC, Stanford, UCLA, on and on?  You obviously haven't talked to many returning players that come back to their universities to train after their NWSL season and hear the bush stories of how it is in the great "women's professional league".  Single A ball clubs get treated better than NWSL teams.  The attendance is off the charts for all those NWSL games - yawn.  There were more people at the SC - UCLA game than there were at the NWSL Championship Final.  The only thing positive is the money that the NT players can make if they are on the roster.  For the rest it is "for the love of the game" cause you can make more flipping burgers than the average NWSL player makes.


----------



## CopaMundial

Nutmeg said:


> I only have a theory here. But I believe USSOCCER, did this at member clubs request in order to increase $ across multiple platforms and age groups at both olders and youngers.


Disagree here. Sorry. But it's my understanding, that member clubs wanted an '03 and '02 age pure DA situation. At least in SoCal and from what I heard from Surf, Slammers and Blues parents/coaches. So, not sure what the hell happened now.


----------



## Nutmeg

CopaMundial said:


> Disagree here. Sorry. But it's my understanding, that member clubs wanted an '03 and '02 age pure DA situation. At least in SoCal and from what I heard from Surf, Slammers and Blues parents/coaches. So, not sure what the hell happened now.


Nope, don’t believe anything coaches tell you. Most have little to no power. Club directors and club boards along with sanctioning states leagues control what happens.  member clubs want multiple revenue streams in order to maximize profits. That is accomplished by multiple teams playing in every league, increasing total player club numbers all paying club fees and all vying for the dangled carrot of USSOCCER.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> I know the rosters very well. Better than you do I’m sure. The NWSL right now is the 3rd best women’s league in the world, and getting worse.  I’m not making a college vs NWSL argument. I’m
> Making a branding, money, facility, infrastructure argument.  But you go in ahead and keep banging your drum of playing against Morgan 2x a year makes you better BS. It doesn’t all it does is demonstrate that one makes 975,000$ a year and the other makes 75,000$ just from the fact that one is more marketable with a higher international profile.


Winning a World Cup is what makes one marketable not a NCAA Championship.


----------



## CopaMundial

Nutmeg said:


> Nope, don’t believe anything coaches tell you. Most have little to no power. Club directors and club boards along with sanctioning states leagues control what happens.  member clubs want multiple revenue streams in order to maximize profits. That is accomplished by multiple teams playing in every league, increasing total player club numbers all paying club fees and all vying for the dangled carrot of USSOCCER.


In two instances, it was direct from the DOC to parents from two separate clubs.  No one has any power at this point, except USSF. That's as obvious as it gets. I'm just trying to understand their decisions, because it's obvious Lies are told from the top down, that's the only truth out there.


----------



## Mullet

pulguita said:


> A dedicated professional environment?  You're not serious are you?  That would maybe be true if the coaching was unequivocally better.  Watching what I could stomach of the games this year - ie the semis and finals (unwatchable) I can clearly say that the professional coaching in the NWSL leaves a lot to be desired.   I can guarantee you that every PAC12 school has better facilities than everyone maybe outside of Portland.  And I will guarantee that the facilities at Oregon are better than that of the Thorns.  Do you think the NWSL teams have a better travel budget than USC, Stanford, UCLA, on and on?  You obviously haven't talked to many returning players that come back to their universities to train after their NWSL season and hear the bush stories of how it is in the great "women's professional league".  Single A ball clubs get treated better than NWSL teams.  The attendance is off the charts for all those NWSL games - yawn.  There were more people at the SC - UCLA game than there were at the NWSL Championship Final.  The only thing positive is the money that the NT players can make if they are on the roster.  For the rest it is "for the love of the game" cause you can make more flipping burgers than the average NWSL player makes.


Yup, and the other college players parlay their college “branding” into a Youth club coaching gig. 

The college game is a terrific experience but if a player has serious chops as MP does, then go pro. Frankly she disagrees with yo, as much as she was supportive and hung around when the rubber hit the road she chose development.  

And if NWSL is the 3rd worst pro league in the world then College is a distant fourth. We will not stay on top in World Soccer pushing college as a path when Europe isn’t.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> Your talking about men. For women the top 10 programs in College are a legit platform for most Europeans, south and North American players. The U21 U23 DA talk is a money grab and nothing more. The cost benefit analysis of a college degree vs entry level pro salary is no where close for women players.


Not for much longer. European clubs are just expanding their pro academy model to the women’s game. 

And EVERYTHING is a money grab. We live in a Capitalist society. Bottled water is a money grab.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> Winning a World Cup is what makes one marketable not a NCAA Championship.


Nope try again. Winning has nothing to do with being marketable.  Being marketable is not success driven but rather relies on many other factors in order to monetize. If the act of winning a World Cup was the key than the members of the last two US Soccer teams would all be marketable, and would be financially stable. They are not. Players like Whitney Egen would still be playing and not back in school.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> Not for much longer. European clubs are just expanding their pro academy model to the women’s game.
> 
> And EVERYTHING is a money grab. We live in a Capitalist society. Bottled water is a money grab.


Laughable. Some European clubs are just starting to invest some money into pro women’s teams. Not youth. Go talk to the 14 year old in Manchester England and ask her about how much investment there is in her Academy team. Go to Ajax and see how many young girls are training compared to boys sides. You believe to much of what you read.


----------



## pulguita

Mullet said:


> Yup, and the other college players parlay their college “branding” into a Youth club coaching gig.
> 
> The college game is a terrific experience but if a player has serious chops as MP does, then go pro. Frankly she disagrees with yo, as much as she was supportive and hung around when the rubber hit the road she chose development.
> 
> And if NWSL is the 3rd worst pro league in the world then College is a distant fourth. We will not stay on top in World Soccer pushing college as a path when Europe isn’t.


Sorry but my kid will be parlaying her BA degree, Masters, school pedigree (read Alumni) and natty ring for a six figure income after she plays a few years in the pros "for the love of the game" and the experience.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> Yup, and the other college players parlay their college “branding” into a Youth club coaching gig.
> 
> The college game is a terrific experience but if a player has serious chops as MP does, then go pro. Frankly she disagrees with yo, as much as she was supportive and hung around when the rubber hit the road she chose development.
> 
> And if NWSL is the 3rd worst pro league in the world then College is a distant fourth. We will not stay on top in World Soccer pushing college as a path when Europe isn’t.


The fact you used the words developement and chops is telling.


----------



## Nutmeg

CopaMundial said:


> In two instances, it was direct from the DOC to parents from two separate clubs.  No one has any power at this point, except USSF. That's as obvious as it gets. I'm just trying to understand their decisions, because it's obvious Lies are told from the top down, that's the only truth out there.


Ok then, keep having these inside DOC conversations. DOC are always honest they never ever are less than trustworthy, never will they ever say one thing than do the opposite.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> The fact you used the words developement and chops is telling.


The fact that you think a pretty stadium means development.

Based on your criteria of what is important the Cowboys should always win the Super Bowl.

The thing is MP agrees with me and not you.

And just let it die because this is severely derailing this thread.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> The fact that you think a pretty stadium means development.
> 
> Based on your criteria of what is important the Cowboys should always win the Super Bowl.
> 
> The thing is MP agrees with me and not you.
> 
> And just let it die because this is severely derailing this thread.


Ok superstar Soccer guy, anything you say. I will let the NWSL players I just left know that you have the insider info on what to do.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

pulguita said:


> Sorry but my kid will be parlaying her BA degree, Masters, school pedigree (read Alumni) and natty ring for a six figure income after she plays a few years in the pros "for the love of the game" and the experience.


I have a son that she would love.


----------



## CopaMundial

Nutmeg said:


> Ok then, keep having these inside DOC conversations. DOC are always honest they never ever are less than trustworthy, never will they ever say one thing than do the opposite.


I didn't say DOCs don't lie. I said EVERYONE lies and it starts with USSF and their ever changing mind and ideas of what is supposedly good for the future of the youth soccer landscape in America. All of it at the expense of the players. And these aren't inside DOC conversations. It was general talk and knowledge amongst many clubs that '03 would remain age pure, following the last meeting. If that wasn't the general info given to many clubs, DOCS, coaches, etc., just a few months ago, then we wouldn't all be shocked right now and even discussing it!!! Period.


----------



## NoGoal

Mullet said:


> Yup, and the other college players parlay their college “branding” into a Youth club coaching gig.
> 
> The college game is a terrific experience but if a player has serious chops as MP does, then go pro. Frankly she disagrees with yo, as much as she was supportive and hung around when the rubber hit the road she chose development.
> 
> And if NWSL is the 3rd worst pro league in the world then College is a distant fourth. We will not stay on top in World Soccer pushing college as a path when Europe isn’t.


Pugh left UCLA not for the development, but for the money.  If you recall, the US WNT players just reworked their USSF player contract last year.  Once the new player contract was announced, Pugh announced she was turning pro a week later.  Pugh was already on the US WNT, but was not being paid...thus, being college eligible.


----------



## NoGoal

Mullet said:


> Good. The rest of the world thinks playing soccer in College is silly.
> 
> College sports has only proven to be a true developmental platform and pathway for uniquely American sports.


That’s true for the men’s game. The women’s goes through college soccer.  Fleming (Canadian WNT) and many other international players line the women college soccer rosters.


----------



## NoGoal

Mullet said:


> And I’m sorry but the challenge in college simply isn’t the same. She is practicing with and against National team players from all over.
> 
> Who in the college game is even comparable to playing against Marta? Or playing against Marta and Alex Morgan in the same game? Please stop, College is great but MP is far more challenged where she is now. You really should look at the rosters a little more closely.


Ummmm, have you been watching any women’s college soccer?  Obviously you haven’t seen Catarina Macario play at Surf or now at Stanford.  Catarina is a Brazilian born player like Marta!  Ashley Sanchez and Jessie Fleming at UCLA are both skillful and fun to watch.  All 3 will be drafted in the NWSL 1st round.

Alex Morgan, lol....any fast 5’8” forward in the Pac12 or ACC has similar athletic chops as Alex Morgan.  Hallie Mace at UCLA comes to mind.

Oh yeah, USC last year had 5 players drafted by the NWSL.


----------



## CopaMundial

NoGoal said:


> Ummmm, have you been watching any women’s college soccer?  Obviously you haven’t seen Catarina Macario play at Surf or now at Stanford.  Catarina is Brazillian born player like Marta!  Ashley Sanchez and Jessie Fleming at UCLA are both skillful and fun to watch.  All 3 will be drafted in the NWSL 1st round.
> 
> Alex Morgan, lol....any fast 5’8” forward in the Pac12 or ACC has similar athletic chops as Alex Morgan.  Hallie Mace at UCLA comes to mind.


Fleming and Sanchez are fun to watch, but Macario is absolute quality!!! Does anyone know if she will play for the US or Brazil on the National Level going forward?


----------



## Mullet

MakeAPlay said:


> You cash in on a brand once you have results to back it up.  At this point outside of high school she has no results to point to.  If you haven't seen little girls lined up to get autographs then you haven't been to a top college game.  If you don't think that her game would improve playing at UCLA then you haven't watched them play and I will leave it at that.  UCLA lost to the Seattle Reign 3-2 without Pugh, Sanchez or Fleming and they were leading 2-1 with 20 minutes left in the game.  I get that you have your opinion but at least WATCH before you say anything.  As the saying goes, "God gave us two ears and one mouth for a reason.  We should do twice as much listening as talking."  I will add that you should watch a team before you comment.  If you did you would know that even with her she wasn't going to be the main player on the team and she was far from dominant in training.


Pretty hard to watch a game that isn’t on TV.


NoGoal said:


> Ummmm, have you been watching any women’s college soccer?  Obviously you haven’t seen Catarina Macario play at Surf or now at Stanford.  Catarina is Brazillian born player like Marta!  Ashley Sanchez and Jessie Fleming at UCLA are both skillful and fun to watch.  All 3 will be drafted in the NWSL 1st round.
> 
> Alex Morgan, lol....any fast 5’8” forward in the Pac12 or ACC has similar athletic chops as Alex Morgan.  Hallie Mace at UCLA comes to mind.


Jesus, nobody watches women’s college soccer. That’s why the idea of “building your brand” by staying in college is ludicrous.


----------



## NoGoal

CopaMundial said:


> Fleming and Sanchez are fun to watch, but Macario is absolute quality!!! Does anyone know if she will play for the US or Brazil on the National Level going forward?


From what I have heard.   Once, she gets her US citizenship....she will play for US Womens Soccer.


----------



## NoGoal

Mullet said:


> Pretty hard to watch a game that isn’t on TV.


. It’s not hard....Pac-12 network and ACC ESPN3 app.  



Mullet said:


> Jesus, nobody watches women’s college soccer. That’s why the idea of “building your brand” by staying in college is ludicrous.


Building a brand, lol...you are flip-flopping.  1st you say Pugh left, because of development and now it’s for her branding.  Which is it?


----------



## Mullet

NoGoal said:


> . It’s not hard....Pac-12 network and ACC ESPN3 app.
> 
> 
> Building a brand, lol...you are flip-flopping.  1st you say Pugh left, because of development and now it’s for her branding.  Which is it?


I’m mocking the building a brand argument. That is not a flip flop


----------



## Mullet

NoGoal said:


> . It’s not hard....Pac-12 network and ACC ESPN3 app.
> 
> 
> Building a brand, lol...you are flip-flopping.  1st you say Pugh left, because of development and now it’s for her branding.  Which is it?


I could also find “Droan Racing” on TV too. I’m glad you guys all love the women’s college game but only alum, friends and family care about it.


----------



## Mullet

CopaMundial said:


> Fleming and Sanchez are fun to watch, but Macario is absolute quality!!! Does anyone know if she will play for the US or Brazil on the National Level going forward?


Let me know where my kids can buy their posters. I want to support “the brand” ya know.


----------



## Glen

Nutmeg said:


> Your talking about men. For women the top 10 programs in College are a legit platform for most Europeans, south and North American players. The U21 U23 DA talk is a money grab and nothing more. The cost benefit analysis of a college degree vs entry level pro salary is no where close for women players.


Playing women's pro soccer in the US and getting a college degree are not mutually exclusive.  NWSL is not full time - many players have other jobs.  You can go to school and play pro, either concurrently or consecutively.   

NWSL conditions and pay are just as good as when the NFL and NBA started.  Maybe better.  We are under the illusion that a newly formed league should operate like other established pro sports in the US when those sports took decades to achieve their popularity and stable finances.


----------



## Nutmeg

Mullet said:


> I could also find “Droan Racing” on TV too. I’m glad you guys all love the women’s college game but only alum, friends and family care about it.


Did you lose a bet and have to be a complete dick on the forums today or what.


----------



## Nutmeg

Glen said:


> Playing women's pro soccer in the US and getting a college degree are not mutually exclusive.  NWSL is not full time - many players have other jobs.  You can go to school and play pro, either concurrently or consecutively.
> 
> NWSL conditions and pay are just as good as when the NFL and NBA started.  Maybe better.  We are under the illusion that a newly formed league should operate like other established pro sports in the US when those sports took decades to achieve their popularity and stable finances.


Jesus are you for real or what? If you think the NWSL is not full time than you are really out of touch or just dumb. It’s full time. The reason players work is not because they want to it’s becasue they want to eat and pay their bills. Players on the national team are fine enough the rest of the roster is left to eek out an existence that puts their status in jeopardy if their not in playing shape to stay in a roster. That can’t happen by working a regular job. But I guess the women should just be quiet little things and just be happy they have a place to play right. The leagues salaries are suppressed because USSOCCER controls the league. If UsSoccer wanted to invest in the overall game it would. Your argument that because the league is only 5 years old players should make next to nothing is lame.


----------



## NoGoal

Mullet said:


> I could also find “Droan Racing” on TV too. I’m glad you guys all love the women’s college game but only alum, friends and family care about it.


You are indirectly admitting you don’t know the quality of players playing D1 college soccer.  Especially, in the Pac12 or ACC level.


----------



## NoGoal

Glen said:


> Playing women's pro soccer in the US and getting a college degree are not mutually exclusive.  NWSL is not full time - many players have other jobs.  You can go to school and play pro, either concurrently or consecutively.
> 
> NWSL conditions and pay are just as good as when the NFL and NBA started.  Maybe better.  We are under the illusion that a newly formed league should operate like other established pro sports in the US when those sports took decades to achieve their popularity and stable finances.


Pro womens soccer leagues has been around for 20 years with 2 leagues already going under.  If it wasn’t for the USSF, Canadian SF, and Mexican SF proping up the NWSL by paying for their national team players salaries....a 3rd league would have already folded.


----------



## Mullet

NoGoal said:


> You are indirectly admitting you don’t know the quality of players playing D1 college soccer.  Especially, in the Pac12 or ACC level.


You have obviously not seen the quality of droan racing.


----------



## Mullet

Nutmeg said:


> Did you lose a bet and have to be a complete dick on the forums today or what.


I’m just trying to “build my brand”


----------



## LASTMAN14

Mullet said:


> You have obviously not seen the quality of droan racing.


It’s right up there with pong.


----------



## Mullet

LASTMAN14 said:


> It’s right up there with pong.


And so is women’s college soccer by and large.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Mullet said:


> And so is women’s college soccer by and large.


Nah, but the MLS is.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Mullet said:


> I could also find “Droan Racing” on TV too. I’m glad you guys all love the women’s college game but only alum, friends and family care about it.


Not entirely true......I won’t argue it is likely  more of a regional thing, but there is a lot of interest outside of just friends and family


----------



## NoGoal

Mullet said:


> You have obviously not seen the quality of droan racing.


Deflect much?

Only 1 US WNT womens player never played college soccer and Horan isn’t tearing up the NWSL or international play on the US WNT.  She also isn’t a high profile player.


----------



## Lambchop

NoGoal said:


> Deflect much?
> 
> Only 1 US WNT womens player never played college soccer and Horan isn’t tearing up the NWSL or international play on the US WNT.  She also isn’t a high profile player.


Hmm, there is a different thread for "college" recruiting and for all your good thoughts and information. This is the Girls Development Academy thread. Easy to go off on other tracks.


----------



## Lambchop

CopaMundial said:


> Disagree here. Sorry. But it's my understanding, that member clubs wanted an '03 and '02 age pure DA situation. At least in SoCal and from what I heard from Surf, Slammers and Blues parents/coaches. So, not sure what the hell happened now.


Yes, and on top of it all the Frontier division gets the pure age division as a "pilot" program.  What is there to pilot other than "politics"!


----------



## CopaMundial

Mullet said:


> Let me know where my kids can buy their posters. I want to support “the brand” ya know.


Maybe not posters, but jerseys. Prime example. Took DD to see USWNT play at Candlestick park, 2013. Walked up to buy jersey. DD wanted Dunn's jersey. Why? Dunn had no brand. BUT, DD had watched her play at the NCAA playoffs in San Diego in 2012 and Dunn was tearing it up since she was a freshman, even winning the NCAA championships with UNC that year. She knew she would make it to the USWNT and wanted to be the first to have a jersey. They made her a Dunn jersey there that day. 

So, yes, kids do want to spend money on players they follow, admire and think are game changers.  Brand player? Eh, don't care. She's a good role model tho. Why are you on the girls DA thread and keep shredding the girls game, brand, college programs, future, etc.?  This is the GIRLS DA thread, right? So yes, agreed. Back on track!


----------



## Mullet

CopaMundial said:


> Maybe not posters, but jerseys. Prime example. Took DD to see USWNT play at Candlestick park, 2013. Walked up to buy jersey. DD wanted Dunn's jersey. Why? Dunn had no brand. BUT, DD had watched her play at the NCAA playoffs in San Diego in 2012 and Dunn was tearing it up since she was a freshman, even winning the NCAA championships with UNC that year. She knew she would make it to the USWNT and wanted to be the first to have a jersey. They made her a Dunn jersey there that day.
> 
> So, yes, kids do want to spend money on players they follow, admire and think are game changers.  Brand player? Eh, don't care. She's a good role model tho. Why are you on the girls DA thread and keep shredding the girls game, brand, college programs, future, etc.?  This is the GIRLS DA thread, right? So yes, agreed. Back on track!


They didn’t have the jersey. That IS the point. I’m glad they made the jersey for her though. 

My kid has selfies with Dunn and I’ve watched let kids get selfies via piggy back from her as well. 

I’ve watched Alex Morgan give a girl her cleats after a game. I’ve talked with Krieger’s Mother during a game. They have met Hope Solo, Marta, Pugh, and more and not at a college game. 

Meanwhile at a college game. 

Me: Hey girls let’s go to a UNC game!

DD: Great! 

At game:

DD: Who is she? 

Me: That is ____ ____, she is on the National Team

DD: WOW! She plays with Alex Morgan?

Me: Ummm, no, she is on the U20 team. But she might get called to the National Team camp.

DD: Whaa.....?

Me: It’s complicated. 

DD: Ok That is still cool.  Oh, look over there, who is she?

Me: ummmm Let’s check the program.  Oh, yes, here she is. It says here she is a Journalism Major. 

DD: oh... What’s a “Major”?

The point is, college sports appeal to college sports fans. I love the NFL but I could care less about the college game. My college lacked a large D1 program itself so that opportunity didn’t draw me in either. And why would I bother to watch or cheer for a team where I didn’t go to school? That is just weird. So why would I just decide to watch a UCLA women’s soccer game? 

So go ahead and love the women’s college game. Appreciate it for what it is but please do not overstate it’s general appeal. Until the kids actually play on the international stage most folks don’t know or care who they are and there is nothing wrong with that. Almost all of the women from the National Championship roster from five years ago hopefully are happy and settled in their 9-5 job now and possibly raising a family. If we are very lucky, they may coach their kids and their kids friends.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Mullet said:


> You mean like Kobe and LeBron?
> 
> Not outside of LA.  Again our bubbles are different. I’m not saying that NWSL bubble is big but UCLA isn’t on TV on the East Coast.
> 
> Regardless. Pro>College.


That was prior to the NBA changing their rules.  Also who outside of basketball junkies had heard of Lebron or Kobe prior to the draft?  I saw Lebron play against Mater Dei in high school at Pauley Pavilion but I bet you had no idea of who they were.  Now that the rules have changed kids spend one year in college building their brand on TV.  Regarding women's soccer (which is what we are talking about) the California PAC 12 teams are on television no less than 15 times a year and my kid's team was on TV including ESPNU 20+ times this year.  Of course the television audience isn't the same as NFL or NBA it would be absurd to think that it would be.  However, more people watch women's college soccer than women's pro soccer and due to Title IX (WooHoo!!) much more money is spent on women's college soccer than in the NWSL and that is a fact!

Have you ever spoken to MP?  You should.  Good luck to you and your daughter.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> That was prior to the NBA changing their rules.  Also who outside of basketball junkies had heard of Lebron or Kobe prior to the draft?  I saw Lebron play against Mater Dei in high school at Pauley Pavilion but I bet you had no idea of who they were.  Now that the rules have changed kids spend one year in college building their brand on TV.  Regarding women's soccer (which is what we are talking about) the California PAC 12 teams are on television no less than 15 times a year and my kid's team was on TV including ESPNU 20+ times this year.  Of course the television audience isn't the same as NFL or NBA it would be absurd to think that it would be.  However, more people watch women's college soccer than women's pro soccer and due to Title IX (WooHoo!!) much more money is spent on women's college soccer than in the NWSL and that is a fact!
> 
> Have you ever spoken to MP?  You should.  Good luck to you and your daughter.


"...building their brand..."

That's funny stuff.


----------



## Mullet

MakeAPlay said:


> That was prior to the NBA changing their rules.  Also who outside of basketball junkies had heard of Lebron or Kobe prior to the draft?  I saw Lebron play against Mater Dei in high school at Pauley Pavilion but I bet you had no idea of who they were.  Now that the rules have changed kids spend one year in college building their brand on TV.  Regarding women's soccer (which is what we are talking about) the California PAC 12 teams are on television no less than 15 times a year and my kid's team was on TV including ESPNU 20+ times this year.  Of course the television audience isn't the same as NFL or NBA it would be absurd to think that it would be.  However, more people watch women's college soccer than women's pro soccer and due to Title IX (WooHoo!!) much more money is spent on women's college soccer than in the NWSL and that is a fact!
> 
> Have you ever spoken to MP?  You should.  Good luck to you and your daughter.


Every player they have met couldn’t have been nicer and more accommodating. When they see girls line up some “sisterhood” thing kicks in and they understand and see their impact on the games growth.


----------



## Lambchop

Mullet said:


> Every player they have met couldn’t have been nicer and more accommodating. When they see girls line up some “sisterhood” thing kicks in and they understand and see their impact on the games growth.


To all the posters discussing the pros and cons of college players, pro players etc.. etc, please take your postings to the appropriate thread if you can figure it out.


----------



## Dos Equis

Mullet said:


> So go ahead and love the women’s college game. Appreciate it for what it is but please do not overstate it’s general appeal. Until the kids actually play on the international stage most folks don’t know or care who they are and there is nothing wrong with that. Almost all of the women from the National Championship roster from five years ago hopefully are happy and settled in their 9-5 job now and possibly raising a family. If we are very lucky, they may coach their kids and their kids friends.


Who is watching besides alumni --  my daughter and the several thousand club girls who are in the college recruiting process, and their parents.  They all need, and most want, to watch women's college soccer to understand the different teams, leagues and coaching styles.  My daughter probably watched (or attended) over 30 college games last season, often with her teammates. She watched MAP's daughter play a lot more than MP, and knows most of the rosters of nearly every team that made the sweet 16.  

College soccer has always been the endgame for girls club soccer, and while I sincerely hope for the survival and success of the NWSL (and even more so the European women's leagues), we all know that getting a top college degree will have a much more significant long term impact on 99.99% of these girls' lives than trying to play pro at age 18-19.  That is why there is so much talk about college in the DA thread, and concern when decisions the DA makes may seem at odds to the goal of playing in college. 

I am not an expert building a brand, but if you desire to build a foundation for your future, while still playing soccer at a high level, there is no better path than women's college soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> "...building their brand..."
> 
> That's funny stuff.


Do you deny that the top young NBA players don't spend their one year in college building their brand?  If you don't think so check out their twitter and instagram accounts.  I mean if you know what either of those things are....


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> To all the posters discussing the pros and cons of college players, pro players etc.. etc, please take your postings to the appropriate thread if you can figure it out.


It's called a thread Lamby.  It goes where it goes.  This is America not Russia.


----------



## Lambchop

MakeAPlay said:


> It's called a thread Lamby.  It goes where it goes.  This is America not Russia.


Well, now you know, take it where it belongs.


----------



## Sane65

Lambchop said:


> Well, now you know, take it where it belongs.


...Anyone interested in starting FURTHER academy discussions on age bands?  I would like to hear more opinions on the 2002/2003 dual age band.  The path of MP is not that interesting. No disrespect to her.  I will jump onto the 03 or 02 threads under girls.  See you there....


----------



## Desert Hound

So what is the benefit of dual band vs single age band?


----------



## Mullet

Desert Hound said:


> So what is the benefit of dual band vs single age band?


In theory talent concentration.


----------



## Dos Equis

Mullet said:


> In theory talent concentration.


More than just theory, that is the goal.

Before starting a girls academy, US Soccer struggled with the competing goals of creating the most competitive league, while at the same time having enough teams in each region to avoid excessive travel for league games.  Dual age bands for olders helps accomplish both goals (club participation does start to fall after U13), while at the same time starting to narrow the field and control their event costs at the older age groups.

Now it may be they will go to a single age bracket for girls.  I think that would be a positive for the college recruiting goals of the players (and perhaps for college coaches as well looking to have one primary league to scout).   But on the boys side, they have not done so, primarily becasue it adds nothing to their ultimate goal of identifying and developing US National Team players.


----------



## chargerfan

Dos Equis said:


> More than just theory, that is the goal.
> 
> Before starting a girls academy, US Soccer struggled with the competing goals of creating the most competitive league, while at the same time having enough teams in each region to avoid excessive travel for league games.  Dual age bands for olders helps accomplish both goals (club participation does start to fall after U13), while at the same time starting to narrow the field and control their event costs at the older age groups.
> 
> Now it may be they will go to a single age bracket for girls.  I think that would be a positive for the college recruiting goals of the players (and perhaps for college coaches as well looking to have one primary league to scout).   But on the boys side, they have not done so, primarily becasue it adds nothing to their ultimate goal of identifying and developing US National Team players.


Hopefully nobody went into this thinking US Soccer’s goal was to place these players into college. The goal was only to identify the top .5%, and they don’t care if the rest play local leagues.  Will the clubs with both DA and ECNL make their current 03 ECNL teams the C team? Also, will 03s at non-ECNL clubs be happy to play in an unsuccessful DPL league?


----------



## Sons of Pitches

Lambchop said:


> Exactly, US soccer doubled the number of 03 girls in DA this year by going to single age band, now after the girls have worked hard practicing four days a week, plus extra training, big expenses, US soccer decides to cut over half of them.


Lambchop - It sucks, you are right, but it has been this way from the beginning.  US soccer screwed this whole thing up from the beginning.  If your coach/club sold you on a 2003 single age group be mad at your coach/club, not US soccer.    

Try having a December 02 daughter.  Ghost Writers - numbers get even worse if you have a daughter born in the second half of the younger birth year.  In the Current 2001/02 configuration, less than 5% of the players are 7/1/02  to 12/31/02.  So if you have a young 2003, unless she is a Unicorn, good luck.  When DA held tryouts last year, an 8th grade female born (12/02) who had never played high school soccer before was competing against 01/2001 10th graders who had 2 years of high school experience and were 23 months older.


----------



## Lambchop

chargerfan said:


> Hopefully nobody went into this thinking US Soccer’s goal was to place these players into college. The goal was only to identify the top .5%, and they don’t care if the rest play local leagues.  Will the clubs with both DA and ECNL make their current 03 ECNL teams the C team? Also, will 03s at non-ECNL clubs be happy to play in an unsuccessful DPL league?


They, US soccer, have always been able to identify the top .5%.


----------



## Soccer

Someone asked on here about ECNL making clubs choose.  There is a rumor going around if you have both DA and ECNL and your ECNL teams are struggling that ECNL is going to make you choose.  This si a rumor, that I have heard from a few clubs, not directly from ECNL.  Clubs have not been told anything yet either.


----------



## Soccer

Burlingame kicked out of DA.  Fact not rumor.


----------



## Desert Hound

Soccer said:


> Burlingame kicked out of DA.  Fact not rumor.


Info came from where? 

And if true...not surprising. They have been anything BUT competitive in DA.


----------



## Soccer

Desert Hound said:


> Info came from where?
> 
> And if true...not surprising. They have been anything BUT competitive in DA.


US Soccer of course.


----------



## zags77

So if Burlingame is out does that mean Mustang is back in?


----------



## Kicker4Life

zags77 said:


> So if Burlingame is out does that mean Mustang is back in?


ECNL may not like that!


----------



## Soccer

zags77 said:


> So if Burlingame is out does that mean Mustang is back in?


Burlingame is out NOW.  No more Ganes  the rest of this season per US Soccer email.

Does Mustang get back in, next year?  Not sure


----------



## Simisoccerfan

chargerfan said:


> Hopefully nobody went into this thinking US Soccer’s goal was to place these players into college. The goal was only to identify the top .5%, and they don’t care if the rest play local leagues.  Will the clubs with both DA and ECNL make their current 03 ECNL teams the C team? Also, will 03s at non-ECNL clubs be happy to play in an unsuccessful DPL league?


What is your criteria and experience to say DPL is unsuccessful?  Are you basing it on the criticisms found here on the forum from those on the outside lamenting another league diluting talent?  My direct experience was that the league was well run, games were competitive, and the overall experience was good.   I have no complaints about the league based on our experience.  In fact I thought the fields that we played on were consistently better than the fields that we had played on in past leagues.


----------



## MyDaughtersAKeeper

Soccer said:


> Burlingame is out NOW.  No more Ganes  the rest of this season per US Soccer email.
> 
> Does Mustang get back in, next year?  Not sure


It is clear that the club is struggling based on their Wins/Losses/GF and GA (all 3 girls age groups), but it just seems wrong to kick them out before the end of the year.  Advise them that they are not returning, but to kill it off during the season seems wrong, and it will hurt the girls on the club.


----------



## MarkM

chargerfan said:


> Hopefully nobody went into this thinking US Soccer’s goal was to place these players into college. The goal was only to identify the top .5%, and they don’t care if the rest play local leagues.  Will the clubs with both DA and ECNL make their current 03 ECNL teams the C team? Also, will 03s at non-ECNL clubs be happy to play in an unsuccessful DPL league?


The goals stated for ECNL and DA are the same.  Neither league was created with a goal to get kids in college soccer, but both provide platforms for college recruiting through showcases.  Stop trolling.


----------



## JoeBieber

Soccer said:


> Burlingame is out NOW.  No more Ganes  the rest of this season per US Soccer email.
> 
> Does Mustang get back in, next year?  Not sure


All Burlingame matches are still scheduled. They return to play in a month. 

You are the sole source of this information that they have been removed halfway through the season.


----------



## splinter

We received an email that Burlingame had pulled out of DA and our game with them was canceled in April.


----------



## Lambchop

splinter said:


> We received an email that Burlingame had pulled out of DA and our game with them was canceled in April.


If this is true, then all their games should be discounted for standings, goals scored etc. Hope it isn't true.


----------



## chargerfan

Simisoccerfan said:


> What is your criteria and experience to say DPL is unsuccessful?  Are you basing it on the criticisms found here on the forum from those on the outside lamenting another league diluting talent?  My direct experience was that the league was well run, games were competitive, and the overall experience was good.   I have no complaints about the league based on our experience.  In fact I thought the fields that we played on were consistently better than the fields that we had played on in past leagues.


I was basing this on the number of DPL families I know or have heard of that are currently unhappy and discussing other options for next year , and now also basing it on the number of  DA 03 families  at DPL clubs that as of today are looking for backup in case they don’t make the DA team. I don’t know enough about the league to argue with you, but it doesn’t seem everyone had the same positive experience you guys had.


----------



## chargerfan

MarkM said:


> The goals stated for ECNL and DA are the same.  Neither league was created with a goal to get kids in college soccer, but both provide platforms for college recruiting through showcases.  Stop trolling.


ECNL doesn’t cut approximately 75% of an age group in an important recruiting year.


----------



## Chris Knight

CopaMundial said:


> I didn't say DOCs don't lie. I said EVERYONE lies and it starts with USSF and their ever changing mind and ideas of what is supposedly good for the future of the youth soccer landscape in America. All of it at the expense of the players. And these aren't inside DOC conversations. It was general talk and knowledge amongst many clubs that '03 would remain age pure, following the last meeting. If that wasn't the general info given to many clubs, DOCS, coaches, etc., just a few months ago, then we wouldn't all be shocked right now and even discussing it!!! Period.


Surely copa you don't believe that the USSDA told this/these DOC(s) that the 03 group would remain solo into their U16 year.  Don't ya think that this mighta been speculation spawned from a handsome amount of wishful thinking?  If we're honest with ourselves and had to bet on the true origination here, I think we'd err on the pipe dream side of things wouldn't we?


----------



## Kicker4Life

chargerfan said:


> I was basing this on the number of DPL families I know or have heard of that are currently unhappy and discussing other options for next year , and now also basing it on the number of  DA 03 families  at DPL clubs that as of today are looking for backup in case they don’t make the DA team. I don’t know enough about the league to argue with you, but it doesn’t seem everyone had the same positive experience you guys had.


How many people do you know outside of the SD/North County area?


----------



## Kicker4Life

chargerfan said:


> ECNL doesn’t cut approximately 75% of an age group in an important recruiting year.


Point for ECNL!  Leaves a lot of talent in LA County with not a lot of options.


----------



## Chris Knight

Lambchop said:


> Yes, and on top of it all the Frontier division gets the pure age division as a "pilot" program.  What is there to pilot other than "politics"!


Speaking of "easy to go off".

Same exact post twice in a seven hour span chop ... seems you're a bit chapped about this.  You know, Frontier Division has U16 pilot this year as well ... Guess the piloting continues into perpetuity --

What is it that you believe the devious, thumb twiddling politicians over at USSDA have against the GDA Southwest?  Must be a conspiracy?  Has to be --


----------



## chargerfan

Kicker4Life said:


> How many people do you know outside of the SD/North County area?


We know families at both DPL clubs in San Diego. Is the general feeling about DPL different in OC/LA? I’m just going by what I have heard.


----------



## CopaMundial

Chris Knight said:


> Surely copa you don't believe that the USSDA told this/these DOC(s) that the 03 group would remain solo into their U16 year.  Don't ya think that this mighta been speculation spawned from a handsome amount of wishful thinking?  If we're honest with ourselves and had to bet on the true origination here, I think we'd err on the pipe dream side of things wouldn't we?


No, I don't think any mandate was given, but after the Chicago meeting and the desire for most of the larger clubs across the country voting to keep '03 age pure....maybe, USSF would listen as '02 was hit hard this season with the same scenario. I will say though, ECNL hasn't missed a step and '02's are getting recruited. However, the college coaches have been honest is saying that it's getting harder to recruit when they are spread so thin and trying to find talent while deciding between all the different showcases, events, etc. 

I don't have an '03, but I think it's an injustice to these kids to have to move in a pivotal year. I'm just saying that the majority of DOCs and clubs, got the impression '02 and '03 would be their own teams. Obviously there is some truth to what USSF implied, or they wouldn't be doing a "pilot" program now would they?


----------



## Chris Knight

CopaMundial said:


> No, I don't think any mandate was given, but after the Chicago meeting and the desire for most of the larger clubs across the country voting to keep '03 age pure....maybe, USSF would listen as '02 was hit hard this season with the same scenario. I will say though, ECNL hasn't missed a step and '02's are getting recruited. However, the college coaches have been honest is saying that it's getting harder to recruit when they are spread so thin and trying to find talent while deciding between all the different showcases, events, etc.
> 
> I don't have an '03, but I think it's an injustice to these kids to have to move in a pivotal year. I'm just saying that the majority of DOCs and clubs, got the impression '02 and '03 would be their own teams. Obviously there is some truth to what USSF implied, or they wouldn't be doing a "pilot" program now would they?


I certainly agree that the U16 group in SoCal this year and next are getting the shaft considering the circumstances, and am confused myself as to why Frontier is piloting age pure U16s all alone for two straight years.  And no doubt a valid concern regarding the college coaches being spread thin ... Especially given that even in it's infancy and in what will be it's least attended Showcase, GDA Winter Showcase drew 415 college coaches and 45 USYNT staff --


----------



## Kicker4Life

chargerfan said:


> We know families at both DPL clubs in San Diego. Is the general feeling about DPL different in OC/LA? I’m just going by what I have heard.


Yah, for the most part. Some wish the competition was a little better.  The GDA v ECNL v DPL  battle plays out in OC and SD more so than LA and Ventura.


----------



## Dos Equis

Chris Knight said:


> ... Especially given that even in it's infancy and in what will be it's least attended Showcase, GDA Winter Showcase drew 415 college coaches and 45 USYNT staff --


45 USYNT staff?  So you are saying around 10 coaches/scouts per age group? 

US Soccer needs to take a close look at where they are spending their money, if that is true.


----------



## Chris Knight

Dos Equis said:


> 45 USYNT staff?  So you are saying around 10 coaches/scouts per age group?
> 
> US Soccer needs to take a close look at where they are spending their money, if that is true.


Can't argue with you there, but yes ...

8 YNT Coaches, 9 US Soccer Technical Advisors, 28 US Soccer Scouts attended the GDA Winter Showcase -


----------



## MakeAPlay

Chris Knight said:


> Can't argue with you there, but yes ...
> 
> 8 YNT Coaches, 9 US Soccer Technical Advisors, 28 US Soccer Scouts attended the GDA Winter Showcase -


Damn that's a lot of people to find 2-4 players per birth year to make the full WNT in some far off future date.

Am I missing something?


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> Damn that's a lot of people to find 2-4 players per birth year to make the full WNT in some far off future date.
> 
> Am I missing something?


True that!  But on the flip side, there were a lot of offers and interest/follow-up calls from Colleges during and after the event.  #silverlining


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> True that!  But on the flip side, there were a lot of offers and interest/follow-up calls from Colleges during and after the event.  #silverlining


Which is the purpose of the event I thought thus the term showcase.  I really hope that everyone keeps an eye on that truth.  Even for the girls destined for the senior WNT college is the path for 99.5% of them.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## zags77

From a Burlingame family I have heard that the memo went out yesterday that they are done with DA in June 2018.  They will be allowed to finish the season but NOT be allowed to travel to AWAY games.

Albertin Montoya will fully focus on MVLA now....


----------



## Soccer

JoeBieber said:


> All Burlingame matches are still scheduled. They return to play in a month.
> 
> You are the sole source of this information that they have been removed halfway through the season.


You can believe me or not. Just providing the facts. US Soccer is working on the schedule issues.  The question I had, is what happens to games already played by the teams that went up there.

Like what was said if you are traveling up there to play then you were notified yesterday. 

Separate email went out to DOC’s.

There are others on the verge.  Long Island for one.  They Had teams drop from going to showcase the Saturday before.


----------



## chiefs

Soccer said:


> You can believe me or not. Just providing the facts. US Soccer is working on the schedule issues.  The question I had, is what happens to games already played by the teams that went up there.
> 
> Like what was said if you are traveling up there to play then you were notified yesterday.
> 
> Separate email went out to DOC’s.
> 
> There are others on the verge.  Long Island for one.  They Had teams drop from going to showcase the Saturday before.


Free from bias or injustice from US Soccer (if they have any), all games that Burlingame played previously should be voided. There should be no wiggle room from handing down this decision.


----------



## Lambchop

Chris Knight said:


> Speaking of "easy to go off".
> 
> Same exact post twice in a seven hour span chop ... seems you're a bit chapped about this.  You know, Frontier Division has U16 pilot this year as well ... Guess the piloting continues into perpetuity --
> 
> What is it that you believe the devious, thumb twiddling politicians over at USSDA have against the GDA Southwest?  Must be a conspiracy?  Has to be --


Being able to keep a team together is a real advantage, having all the 03 DA girls get an extra year of team training four days a week with great coaches, games, having more girls viewed by more college coaches, yes that is an advantage.  No doubt that US soccer will find a plausible answer as to why the Frontier division was given this opportunity. And, it is an opportunity and advantage for those girls.  Chris, if you attended the US soccer presentation on DA, which since you are so knowledgeable about, you must have, you would know how they (US soccer not DOC's) presented the scenario for these 2003, 2004 girls.


----------



## timbuck

Chris Knight said:


> Speaking of "easy to go off".
> 
> Same exact post twice in a seven hour span chop ... seems you're a bit chapped about this.  You know, Frontier Division has U16 pilot this year as well ... Guess the piloting continues into perpetuity --
> 
> What is it that you believe the devious, thumb twiddling politicians over at USSDA have against the GDA Southwest?  Must be a conspiracy?  Has to be --


What are they trying to "pilot" exactly? Usually, a pilot program has some type of hypothesis or metric that is being tracked to see if it is successful.  Or to prepare for any issues that might arise if they do a full blown rollout.  Seems that if US Soccer was going to "pilot" something, it should have been the Birth Year Mandate, Small Sided Games and Build-Out-Line initiatives.


----------



## Mullet

timbuck said:


> What are they trying to "pilot" exactly? Usually, a pilot program has some type of hypothesis or metric that is being tracked to see if it is successful.  Or to prepare for any issues that might arise if they do a full blown rollout.  Seems that if US Soccer was going to "pilot" something, it should have been the Birth Year Mandate, Small Sided Games and Build-Out-Line initiatives.


The couple of DOCs who I have talked to never believed the combined age group would last very long. I suspect outside of the pilot divisions next year would be the last year of the combined U15/16 age group. 

The U18/19 would remain combined to account for trapped seniors.


----------



## mulliganmom

What is the pilot program they are doing and how will it work.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> Which is the purpose of the event I thought thus the term showcase.  I really hope that everyone keeps an eye on that truth.  Even for the girls destined for the senior WNT college is the path for 99.5% of them.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


100% agree....and thank you!


----------



## Soccer

chiefs said:


> Free from bias or injustice from US Soccer (if they have any), all games that Burlingame played previously should be voided. There should be no wiggle room from handing down this decision.


I agree.


----------



## pulguita

MakeAPlay said:


> Which is the purpose of the event I thought thus the term showcase.  I really hope that everyone keeps an eye on that truth.  Even for the girls destined for the senior WNT college is the path for 99.5% of them.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


Bud you are being generous.  In 2017 the stats say there were 9383 D1 Women soccer players.  If we say 25% are seniors that is 2346 seniors.  If 5 make it to the full WNT (yeah right with the current staff) per year that is .2%.   That doesn't even include the other Divisions or the reality that those 5 (ahem) really only come from about 20 universities max.  What a misguided system we have created to focus an entire soccer bureaucracy for so little.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

chargerfan said:


> I was basing this on the number of DPL families I know or have heard of that are currently unhappy and discussing other options for next year , and now also basing it on the number of  DA 03 families  at DPL clubs that as of today are looking for backup in case they don’t make the DA team. I don’t know enough about the league to argue with you, but it doesn’t seem everyone had the same positive experience you guys had.



I agree that if you are a DA 03 player and might not be the one that makes the combined age group team for next year DPL/SCDSL/CSL would be a step down.  That doesn't make DPL a failure.  Instead its an option to consider if they could make the DA team again when they are in the top half the age bracket.   For those you know that actually played DPL this past year I would be interested in what the specific reasons are that they are unhappy.  Those reasons could very well have nothing to do with the league and could be the general unhappiness that many parents have (such as playing time, parent and parent interactions, coaches).


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Dos Equis said:


> 45 USYNT staff?  So you are saying around 10 coaches/scouts per age group?
> 
> US Soccer needs to take a close look at where they are spending their money, if that is true.


Every game we played at the showcase had a US Soccer scout present for the entire game.  Except for the last game on the get away day we had over 60 coaches at each of our games.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Bud you are being generous.  In 2017 the stats say there were 9383 D1 Women soccer players.  If we say 25% are seniors that is 2346 seniors.  If 5 make it to the full WNT (yeah right with the current staff) per year that is .2%.   That doesn't even include the other Divisions or the reality that those 5 (ahem) really only come from about 20 universities max.  What a misguided system we have created to focus an entire soccer bureaucracy for so little.


What do you mean so little?  Those US Soccer staff people have generous salaries, benefits, travel allowances.  Of course you need 45 staff members in Florida in December, don't you know it is cold in most of the rest of the country at that time?  Sort of like those $10k tank bolts and $50k toilets that the US military was getting gouged for back in the day (?).


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> Every game we played at the showcase had a US Soccer scout present for the entire game.  Except for the last game on the get away day we had over 60 coaches at each of our games.


Sounds very similar to ECNL.  Except you could play high school soccer and other sports.  And most of the talent was concentrated in one place.  Now that is very much not the case.  Just doing the math you are talking a couple of elite players per team and the rest are good players but nothing that you would have to travel to see.  I'm sure that the US soccer people enjoyed the trip.  We will see how many "NEW" invites come out of this scouting and/or how many "technical staff" recommendations arise.  I have my theory on what will come of this.  

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

MakeAPlay said:


> Sounds very similar to ECNL.  Except you could play high school soccer and other sports.  And most of the talent was concentrated in one place.  Now that is very much not the case.  Just doing the math you are talking a couple of elite players per team and the rest are good players but nothing that you would have to travel to see.  I'm sure that the US soccer people enjoyed the trip.  We will see how many "NEW" invites come out of this scouting and/or how many "technical staff" recommendations arise.  I have my theory on what will come of this.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


Thanks!  She is just trying to get recruited.   ECNL is not an option for us since we live in Ventura Co.   She is still playing HS this season since was a DP and has been offered DA full time after HS season.


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> What do you mean so little?  Those US Soccer staff people have generous salaries, benefits, travel allowances.  Of course you need 45 staff members in Florida in December, don't you know it is cold in most of the rest of the country at that time?  Sort of like those $10k tank bolts and $50k toilets that the US military was getting gouged for back in the day (?).


Never happened.  There was the case of a so-called "$600 toilet seat", but it turned out to be not just a seat but a complete toilet including seat, flush-water tank and holding tank, engineered to fit a particular aircraft.  But continue with your rants - I find them amusing.

(And don't forget to hit the "Dumb" button on your way out.)


----------



## Justafan

pulguita said:


> Bud you are being generous.  In 2017 the stats say there were 9383 D1 Women soccer players.  If we say 25% are seniors that is 2346 seniors.  If 5 make it to the full WNT (yeah right with the current staff) per year that is .2%.   That doesn't even include the other Divisions or the reality that those 5 (ahem) really only come from about 20 universities max.  What a misguided system we have created to focus an entire soccer bureaucracy for so little.


You know I was only going to give you the green check mark, then I saw the list of the "medal" posters and I chickened out.


----------



## SocalPapa

zags77 said:


> From a Burlingame family I have heard that the memo went out yesterday that they are done with DA in June 2018.  They will be allowed to finish the season but NOT be allowed to travel to AWAY games.


Unfortunately, Burlingame has been, by far, the least competitive DA club in the country.  Each of their teams was being outscored by more than 5 goals a game.  I consider this a positive development both for the Burlingame DA players and the DA program as a whole.  Best to move on.

Burlingame Soccer Club Average Goal Differential (through Dec. 10th):
U-14 -5.17
U-15 -5.33
U-16/17 -6.42
U-18/19 -6.00
In Total -5.73


----------



## SocalPapa

chiefs said:


> Free from bias or injustice from US Soccer (if they have any), all games that Burlingame played previously should be voided. There should be no wiggle room from handing down this decision.


If by "travel to away games" they mean "travel to play games in So Cal," then I think it would only be 2 games per team that will be cancelled.  Since the odds of their winning those games were so slim in the first place, simply recording those games as forfeits would seem reasonable.


----------



## espola

SocalPapa said:


> Unfortunately, Burlingame has been, by far, the least competitive DA club in the country.  Each of their teams was being outscored by more than 5 goals a game.  I consider this a positive development both for the Burlingame DA players and the DA program as a whole.  Best to move on.
> 
> Burlingame Soccer Club Average Goal Differential (through Dec. 10th):
> U-14 -5.17
> U-15 -5.33
> U-16/17 -6.42
> U-18/19 -6.00
> In Total -5.73


Where are the Burlingame players going to move to?


----------



## espola

SocalPapa said:


> If by "travel to away games" they mean "travel to play games in So Cal," then I think it would only be 2 games per team that will be cancelled.  Since the odds of their winning those games were so slim in the first place, simply recording those games as forfeits would seem reasonable.


Who cares?


----------



## LASTMAN14

espola said:


> Who cares?


I liked their response as it added to the conversation. Your reply on the other hand sounds more like a remark JAP would make. You have said that he lied about you. That's fine (I actually think he did), but is it a lie to say you sound like JAP again and again?


----------



## espola

LASTMAN14 said:


> I liked their response as it added to the conversation. Your reply on the other hand sounds more like a remark JAP would make. You have said that he lied about you. That's fine (I actually think he did), but is it a lie to say you sound like JAP again and again?


Have I ever told a lie about you?


----------



## LASTMAN14

espola said:


> Where are the Burlingame players going to move to?


If I said, "Who Cares" would I sound like JAP or Espola? Hmmm...


----------



## LASTMAN14

espola said:


> Have I ever told a lie about you?


Great pull from the quiver of JAP quotes.


----------



## Chris Knight

Mullet said:


> The couple of DOCs who I have talked to never believed the combined age group would last very long. I suspect outside of the pilot divisions next year would be the last year of the combined U15/16 age group.
> 
> The U18/19 would remain combined to account for trapped seniors.


Yessir --

Same that I heard from DOCs in my area.  We're hoping and praying that this is the case going into '19-'20.


----------



## JoeBieber

LASTMAN14 said:


> If I said, "Who Cares" would I sound like JAP or Espola? Hmmm...


They somehow melted together and are now identical. JAP was a little better at derailing threads and extracting effort from others like some sort of internet argument vampire. But at this point I just skip over espola's posts.


----------



## Kicker4Life

JoeBieber said:


> They somehow melted together and are now identical. JAP was a little better at derailing threads and extracting effort from others like some sort of internet argument vampire. But at this point I just skip over espola's posts.


Can’t bite on the Magoo mush.....poor old bird doesn’t have anything better to do other than change his Depends.


----------



## espola

JoeBieber said:


> They somehow melted together and are now identical. JAP was a little better at derailing threads and extracting effort from others like some sort of internet argument vampire. But at this point I just skip over espola's posts.


My question was aimed at someone concerned what to do about unplayed games in a league that supposedly doesn't care about win-loss records.


----------



## espola

Kicker4Life said:


> Can’t bite on the Magoo mush.....poor old bird doesn’t have anything better to do other than change his Depends.


Now that's a lie just like JaP would post.


----------



## Chris Knight

MakeAPlay said:


> Sounds very similar to ECNL.  Except you could play high school soccer and other sports.  And most of the talent was concentrated in one place.  Now that is very much not the case.  Just doing the math you are talking a couple of elite players per team and the rest are good players but nothing that you would have to travel to see.  I'm sure that the US soccer people enjoyed the trip.  We will see how many "NEW" invites come out of this scouting and/or how many "technical staff" recommendations arise.  I have my theory on what will come of this.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


It's fair that you're a champion for the ECNL and I can certainly respect your stance at the moment.  And there's no arguing that the ability to play other sports (not necessarily HS soccer) is great for the girls, and that before GDA, talent was more concentrated.  But there has to be a bit of trepidation building up over there right?  

Have there been any recent ECNL events that drew 415 college coaches, let alone 45 YNT staff?  I heard that the ECNL events this year (AZ + FL) are averaging around 250 coaches attending with the Fall Phoenix event garnering somewhere in the 100s.  I understand that is still good exposure but how long will this last considering that 415 attended the weakest GDA Showcase of the year and that budgets are tight for those guys?  Not to mention, a few college coaches that attended the Fall ECNL event in Phoenix I spoke with at Silverlakes each mentioned that they were astounded at the drop off in talent they witnessed there.  Furthermore, we were recently told directly from our regional US Soccer representative that going forward, scouting for the MTCs, as well as the invitations extended would be done exclusively within GDA.  While it makes a lot of sense in my area, I understand that it isn't as logical in some areas (NoCal, Vegas, etc).  My guess is that it is a power play to force the hands of many more top clubs, in hopes of squelching the logistical excuses many have to not participate.

Interested to hear the theory you mentioned you have --

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## outside!

espola said:


> My question was aimed at someone concerned what to do about unplayed games in a league that supposedly doesn't care about win-loss records.


It would have been helpful if you just said that upfront.


----------



## Dos Equis

espola said:


> Never happened.  There was the case of a so-called "$600 toilet seat", but it turned out to be not just a seat but a complete toilet including seat, flush-water tank and holding tank, engineered to fit a particular aircraft.  But continue with your rants - I find them amusing.
> 
> (And don't forget to hit the "Dumb" button on your way out.)


Having spent time in the distant past consulting a defense company concerning their inventory accounting system, while I never saw a $600 toilet, I can confirm that there was a simple tool available for less than $20 at your local hardware store that cost the company and the US Government several  hundred dollars each due to procurement rules, contract terms and politics.  The company would have far preferred to buy the tool from Sears (pre-Home Depot) than make it. 

As a metaphor, the $600 toilet was, unfortunately, accurate.


----------



## pulguita

Dos Equis said:


> Having spent time in the distant past consulting a defense company concerning their inventory accounting system, while I never saw a $600 toilet, I can confirm that there was a simple tool available for less than $20 at your local hardware store that cost the company and the US Government several  hundred dollars each due to procurement rules, contract terms and politics.  The company would have far preferred to buy the tool from Sears (pre-Home Depot) than make it.
> 
> As a metaphor, the $600 toilet was, unfortunately, accurate.


Having worked in the industry for the last 33 years as an ME that would be one cheap toilet.  If it was as Espola described I would say multiply by magnitude of 100 if design time, manufacturing time, procurement etc is included let alone number of units.  I find it intriguing watching movies such as Star Trek and skipping over the technology issues and just imagining from an engineering perspective what it would cost to put a space port in orbit and build something like the Enterprise.  It would surpass the GNP of the Earth.  Yeah I know I'm a geek sorry to diverge!


----------



## Lambchop

Dos Equis said:


> 45 USYNT staff?  So you are saying around 10 coaches/scouts per age group?
> 
> US Soccer needs to take a close look at where they are spending their money, if that is true.[/QUOTE
> 
> With 78 teams per age group, 10 per age group is not a lot, and there were at the least 50-60 college scouts at each game, with the exception of the last game which maybe had 12-15.





Mullet said:


> The couple of DOCs who I have talked to never believed the combined age group would last very long. I suspect outside of the pilot divisions next year would be the last year of the combined U15/16 age group.
> 
> The U18/19 would remain combined to account for trapped seniors.[/QUOTE





Chris Knight said:


> It's fair that you're a champion for the ECNL and I can certainly respect your stance at the moment.  And there's no arguing that the ability to play other sports (not necessarily HS soccer) is great for the girls, and that before GDA, talent was more concentrated.  But there has to be a bit of trepidation building up over there right?
> 
> Have there been any recent ECNL events that drew 415 college coaches, let alone 45 YNT staff?  I heard that the ECNL events this year (AZ + FL) are averaging around 250 coaches attending with the Fall Phoenix event garnering somewhere in the 100s.  I understand that is still good exposure but how long will this last considering that 415 attended the weakest GDA Showcase of the year and that budgets are tight for those guys?  Not to mention, a few college coaches that attended the Fall ECNL event in Phoenix I spoke with at Silverlakes each mentioned that they were astounded at the drop off in talent they witnessed there.  Furthermore, we were recently told directly from our regional US Soccer representative that going forward, scouting for the MTCs, as well as the invitations extended would be done exclusively within GDA.  While it makes a lot of sense in my area, I understand that it isn't as logical in some areas (NoCal, Vegas, etc).  My guess is that it is a power play to force the hands of many more top clubs, in hopes of squelching the logistical excuses many have to not participate.
> 
> Interested to hear the theory you mentioned you have --
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.





SocalPapa said:


> If by "travel to away games" they mean "travel to play games in So Cal," then I think it would only be 2 games per team that will be cancelled.  Since the odds of their winning those games were so slim in the first place, simply recording those games as forfeits would seem reasonable.


It is my understanding that a forfeit usually only always one goal to opposing team. In this case beBurlingame cause


SocalPapa said:


> If by "travel to away games" they mean "travel to play games in So Cal," then I think it would only be 2 games per team that will be cancelled.  Since the odds of their winning those games were so slim in the first place, simply recording those games as forfeits would seem reasonable.


All games should be voided as a previous poster noted.  Goals against, goals for, etc. should be eliminated.  A forfeit usually only allows one goal for the opponent, this would unfairly penalize those who are scheduled to play them.


----------



## shales1002

Chris Knight said:


> It's fair that you're a champion for the ECNL and I can certainly respect your stance at the moment.  And there's no arguing that the ability to play other sports (not necessarily HS soccer) is great for the girls, and that before GDA, talent was more concentrated.  But there has to be a bit of trepidation building up over there right?
> 
> Have there been any recent ECNL events that drew 415 college coaches, let alone 45 YNT staff?  I heard that the ECNL events this year (AZ + FL) are averaging around 250 coaches attending with the Fall Phoenix event garnering somewhere in the 100s.  I understand that is still good exposure but how long will this last considering that 415 attended the weakest GDA Showcase of the year and that budgets are tight for those guys?  Not to mention, a few college coaches that attended the Fall ECNL event in Phoenix I spoke with at Silverlakes each mentioned that they were astounded at the drop off in talent they witnessed there.  Furthermore, we were recently told directly from our regional US Soccer representative that going forward, scouting for the MTCs, as well as the invitations extended would be done exclusively within GDA.  While it makes a lot of sense in my area, I understand that it isn't as logical in some areas (NoCal, Vegas, etc).  My guess is that it is a power play to force the hands of many more top clubs, in hopes of squelching the logistical excuses many have to not participate.
> 
> Interested to hear the theory you mentioned you have --
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


Have you ever been to an ECNL showcase? Seriously there were 60+ coaches watching the 2002 games at the fall showcase in Phoenix .  It’s certainly not a drop off in talent but more of a dilution of it ACROSS the board. This is what I have heard from my college connects. They also mentioned that the dual age groups makes recruiting a little bit more challenging . We all saw a lot of the 02s stay in ECNL this season for recruiting purposes and to continuing playing HS or outside sports. Curious to see what the 03s do? Do you risk being at the bottom of the totem pole during your prime recruiting year?  If they wanted it to be single age band ,they would have just rolled it up and left it in tact. 

As many others have said, regardless of what’s said about GDA will be the only avenue of recruiting for the TC... that’s simply foolish and everyone knows it. We know they will go to  Timbuktu and there’s no DA there either.

As for the numbers you saw, it was the first showcase and people were curious including the college coaches , and yes ECNL has still been attracting the crowds. I just need the three colleges that my player wants to show up, to show up.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Why do I keep reading on here that US Soccer does not allow GDA player to play high school soccer or other sports? And please stop saying there is not a drop off in talent in ECNL - that is  just total stupidity.


----------



## CopaMundial

LadiesMan217 said:


> Why do I keep reading on here that US Soccer does not allow GDA player to play high school soccer or other sports? And please stop saying there is not a drop off in talent in ECNL - that is  just total stupidity.


Any top 3 ECNL team in So Cal could contend with the top 3 DA team in the same age group. Trust that! Many of them scrimmage regularly and there are no blowouts at the top levels. That's not a secret. Any others, feel free to chime in.


----------



## LadiesMan217

CopaMundial said:


> Any top 3 ECNL team in So Cal could contend with the top 3 DA team in the same age group. Trust that! Many of them scrimmage regularly and there are no blowouts at the top levels. That's not a secret. Any others, feel free to chime in.


So that means there was not a drop in talent in ECNL? Nice try. Oh, and why are you comparing to DA?


----------



## CopaMundial

LadiesMan217 said:


> So that means there was not a drop in talent in ECNL? Nice try.


It also means that DA is not "ALL THAT". Complete dilution. That's a fact, at least in So Cal. I don't need to try, it's a fact!


----------



## LadiesMan217

CopaMundial said:


> It also means that DA is not "ALL THAT". Complete dilution. That's a fact, at least in So Cal. I don't need to try, it's a fact!


So dilution caused DA and ECNL to have a drop in talent - so we agree. Move on.


----------



## CopaMundial

LadiesMan217 said:


> So dilution caused DA and ECNL to have a drop in talent - so we agree. Move on.


----------



## Chris Knight

shales1002 said:


> Have you ever been to an ECNL showcase? Seriously there were 60+ coaches watching the 2002 games at the fall showcase in Phoenix .  It’s certainly not a drop off in talent but more of a dilution of it ACROSS the board. This is what I have heard from my college connects. They also mentioned that the dual age groups makes recruiting a little bit more challenging . We all saw a lot of the 02s stay in ECNL this season for recruiting purposes and to continuing playing HS or outside sports. Curious to see what the 03s do? Do you risk being at the bottom of the totem pole during your prime recruiting year?  If they wanted it to be single age band ,they would have just rolled it up and left it in tact.
> 
> As many others have said, regardless of what’s said about GDA will be the only avenue of recruiting for the TC... that’s simply foolish and everyone knows it. We know they will go to  Timbuktu and there’s no DA there either.
> 
> As for the numbers you saw, it was the first showcase and people were curious including the college coaches , and yes ECNL has still been attracting the crowds. I just need the three colleges that my player wants to show up, to show up.


Sure shales ... who hasn't?   And of course the ECNL events are still attracting the crowds ... They are 9+ years and 40+ Showcases in aren't they?  GDA has been around a few months and has had 1, which makes these numbers even more telling doesn't it?  Saying that the reason for the large numbers at GDA Winter was due to 'curiosity' sounds a bit like a desperate reach.

I did not, however, attend the Fall Phoenix event ... But it'd be tough to argue that the perennial powerhouses attending from SoCal and NTX weren't a massive let down considering that they are second or third teams for the most part now.  Regardless, I'd have a tough time believing that 1/3+ of all coaches that attended the event would've been at one match at the same time but this isn't all that relevant here. 

I'll preface this by saying for the o2s and older, it doesn't matter either way.  But the real meat of my point is that there has to be a bit of anxiety building up in those on the ECNL side of things with 03s and younger given the reality of the changing landscape.  I know, I know ... You're stuck in Vegas so _have_ to convince yourselves otherwise and root like hell for the relevance of the ECNL to continue -- I'd be doing the same thing.  In all likelihood however, you can expect (whether you like it or not) that the GDA will eventually come to you.  

I gather from your response that you didn't buy much of what I said, but let's just say for grins that what I mentioned about what our US Soccer MTC rep (any a couple of the US Soccer liaisons from clubs in my area) told us was true.  Wouldn't it be a bit naive to believe that USSDA won't follow through on what they directly told us in an effort to potentially draw top talent from non GDA clubs to GDA clubs (consolidation) in the coming year?  In turn, in some areas (NoCal, Vagas) those clubs that have denied a GDA invitation might reconsider given they are either losing talent to GDA clubs or have pressure from unsatisfied parents and kiddos.  We've literally already witnessed this happening ... twice actually.

That being said, I am also intrigued as to what will come about with the deep pool of '03 GDA talent in SoCal next year ... very unfortunate situation.


----------



## Striker17

Wasn't it you who said that ECNL would pull out of clubs who also had GDA? If that's the case seems like it would be shooting themselves again in the foot- this is the off year for the 03 coming up and i would expect ECNL to be extremely strong for 03. 
04 it's absolutely not.


----------



## SocalPapa

Lambchop said:


> All games should be voided as a previous poster noted.  Goals against, goals for, etc. should be eliminated.  A forfeit usually only allows one goal for the opponent, this would unfairly penalize those who are scheduled to play them.


Yep, that's how forfeits work in just about every tournament/league.  The compromise is they give you the win without playing, but only give you credit for one goal.

I don't know what they plan to do, but recording forfeits seems the best option here.  We're talking about maybe 8 forfeited games vs about 100 total DA games Burlingame teams will play this season.  And voiding other games that were actually played creates its own set of problems.  For one, not all DA clubs play the same opponents.  So the clubs that had Burlingame on the schedule this year would end up a game short in determining their standings.  Further, any girls on the DA scoring leaderboards that had played Burlingame would have actual goals scored taken away.  Your proposal just makes a difficult situation worse.


----------



## MakeAPlay

pulguita said:


> Having worked in the industry for the last 33 years as an ME that would be one cheap toilet.  If it was as Espola described I would say multiply by magnitude of 100 if design time, manufacturing time, procurement etc is included let alone number of units.  I find it intriguing watching movies such as Star Trek and skipping over the technology issues and just imagining from an engineering perspective what it would cost to put a space port in orbit and build something like the Enterprise.  It would surpass the GNP of the Earth.  Yeah I know I'm a geek sorry to diverge!


This is one of the reasons why I love chatting with you so much.  The facts are NEVER lost on you.


----------



## SocalPapa

espola said:


> My question was aimed at someone concerned what to do about unplayed games in a league that supposedly doesn't care about win-loss records.


There is a difference between girls DA showcase events and league play.  League standings determine participation in playoffs and, ultimately, the opportunity to claim a DA championship.  The decision of how to treat the games Burlingame will and will not play will directly affect some So Cal DA teams in that regard.

And even when it comes to showcase events, some DA clubs can't help but promote their teams based on wins/losses, as evidenced by these recent Beach tweets...


----------



## tugs

A word of warning regarding DA spring showcase in North Carolina; DA made a mistake on the webinar when it posted dates for GU15 (originally posted that play would be April 6, 7 or 8th and 9th).  On the webinar they stated play would be April 7, 8th or 9th and 10th).  They have graciously admitted their mistake to our club/DOC but said they cannot undo the webinar stated dates.  So to those affected families who have already made travel plans, they said to contact them and they would try to provide assistance (I have no idea what that means).  Hope your GU15 family was not affected.


----------



## Gameon1

LadiesMan217 said:


> Why do I keep reading on here that US Soccer does not allow GDA player to play high school soccer or other sports? And please stop saying there is not a drop off in talent in ECNL - that is  just total stupidity.


Are you kidding, you think that Blues 01 and 02 ECNL Baker has a drop off and can't compete with the DA teams. Wrong.


----------



## Livinthedream

Gameon1 said:


> Are you kidding, you think that Blues 01 and 02 ECNL Baker has a drop off and can't compete with the DA teams. Wrong.


Ok, time to chime in. Blues Baker is a different situation all together. Baker convinced his parents NOT to go DA and to keep their Championship ECNL team intact. As a matter of fact, a lot of his players are enrolled at J Serra. Remember DA players don’t play High School...ECNL players can play High School. Baker gets to keep his ECNL team intact and he gets to keep his Championship High School Team stacked. I’m pretty sure other then Blues being the exception. A Club that has both DA and ECNL teams, the DA team is the stronger of the two. As for being looked at by US Soccer...DA has US Reps at training sessions and games. Now parents will get on here and talk about how good their DD is and how they really want to play high school and stay on their ECNL team. But if they made the team they would be playing DA. Argue all you want but it’s true.


----------



## Kicker4Life

I know one player who left Baker to Play DA, she is a Freshman in High School and is also on the Varsity Tennis team. Needless to say, she is not enrolled at JSerra.....


----------



## LadiesMan217

Gameon1 said:


> Are you kidding, you think that Blues 01 and 02 ECNL Baker has a drop off and can't compete with the DA teams. Wrong.


What are you talking about? When did I say Baker's kickball team lost talent? The original comment I responded to was there was not a drop in ECNL talent. That is a dumb statement and I called it out. ECNL is not just SoCal Blues. So many girls that had no chance of making ECNL last year are now playing because of the player movement to GDA. ECNL has lost talent. It is stupid to say otherwise.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Kicker4Life said:


> I know one player who left Baker to Play DA, she is a Freshman in High School and is also on the Varsity Tennis team. Needless to say, she is not enrolled at JSerra.....


Go RUHS!


----------



## Chris Knight

Gameon1 said:


> Are you kidding, you think that Blues 01 and 02 ECNL Baker has a drop off and can't compete with the DA teams. Wrong.


Straw Grasping ^ ?


----------



## Lambchop

Dos Equis said:


> 45 USYNT staff?  So you are saying around 10 coaches/scouts per age group?
> 
> US Soccer needs to take a close look at where they are spending their money, if that is true.[/QUOTE
> 
> With 78 teams per age group, 10 per age group is not a lot, and there were at the least 50-60 college scouts at each game, with the exception of the last game which maybe had 12-15.





Mullet said:


> The couple of DOCs who I have talked to never believed the combined age group would last very long. I suspect outside of the pilot divisions next year would be the last year of the combined U15/16 age group.
> 
> The U18/19 would remain combined to account for trapped seniors.[/QUOTE





Chris Knight said:


> It's fair that you're a champion for the ECNL and I can certainly respect your stance at the moment.  And there's no arguing that the ability to play other sports (not necessarily HS soccer) is great for the girls, and that before GDA, talent was more concentrated.  But there has to be a bit of trepidation building up over there right?
> 
> Have there been any recent ECNL events that drew 415 college coaches, let alone 45 YNT staff?  I heard that the ECNL events this year (AZ + FL) are averaging around 250 coaches attending with the Fall Phoenix event garnering somewhere in the 100s.  I understand that is still good exposure but how long will this last considering that 415 attended the weakest GDA Showcase of the year and that budgets are tight for those guys?  Not to mention, a few college coaches that attended the Fall ECNL event in Phoenix I spoke with at Silverlakes each mentioned that they were astounded at the drop off in talent they witnessed there.  Furthermore, we were recently told directly from our regional US Soccer representative that going forward, scouting for the MTCs, as well as the invitations extended would be done exclusively within GDA.  While it makes a lot of sense in my area, I understand that it isn't as logical in some areas (NoCal, Vegas, etc).  My guess is that it is a power play to force the hands of many more top clubs, in hopes of squelching the logistical excuses many have to not participate.
> 
> Interested to hear the theory you mentioned you have --
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.





SocalPapa said:


> If by "travel to away games" they mean "travel to play games in So Cal," then I think it would only be 2 games per team that will be cancelled.  Since the odds of their winning those games were so slim in the first place, simply recording those games as forfeits would seem reasonable.


It is my understanding that a forfeit usually only always one goal to opposing team. In this case beBurlingame cause


mulliganmom said:


> What is the pilot program they are doing and how will it work.





SocalPapa said:


> Yep, that's how forfeits work in just about every tournament/league.  The compromise is they give you the win without playing, but only give you credit for one goal.
> 
> I don't know what they plan to do, but recording forfeits seems the best option here.  We're talking about maybe 8 forfeited games vs about 100 total DA games Burlingame teams will play this season.  And voiding other games that were actually played creates its own set of problems.  For one, not all DA clubs play the same opponents.  So the clubs that had Burlingame on the schedule this year would end up a game short in determining their standings.  Further, any girls on the DA scoring leaderboards that had played Burlingame would have actual goals scored taken away.  Your proposal just makes a difficult situation worse.


100 games?? Seriously?  DA teams do not play 100 games per age group. Are you counting DA all ages and all non DA games.   Just eliminate league games , games counted toward standings and all those scores.  If they were averaging 5-6 against them per game, that gives the teams they played an unfair advantage for playoffs, as opposed to only 1 goal awarded for games to be forfeited. It does matter.


----------



## Lambchop

Gameon1 said:


> Are you kidding, you think that Blues 01 and 02 ECNL Baker has a drop off and can't compete with the DA teams. Wrong.


I guess if you don't mind getting hit with an angry, flying clipboard, that team will be highly competitive, until they graduate next year.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Lambchop said:


> It is my understanding that a forfeit usually only always one goal to opposing team. In this case beBurlingame cause
> 
> 
> 100 games?? Seriously?  DA teams do not play 100 games per age group. Are you counting DA all ages and all non DA games.   Just eliminate league games , games counted toward standings and all those scores.  If they were averaging 5-6 against them per game, that gives the teams they played an unfair advantage for playoffs, as opposed to only 1 goal awarded for games to be forfeited. It does matter.


GF/GA only count in cases of a tie breaker, so it’s really not that big of a deal standings wise...You still get the 3 points.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> What are you talking about? When did I say Baker's kickball team lost talent? The original comment I responded to was there was not a drop in ECNL talent. That is a dumb statement and I called it out. ECNL is not just SoCal Blues. So many girls that had no chance of making ECNL last year are now playing because of the player movement to GDA. ECNL has lost talent. It is stupid to say otherwise.


Luckily colleges recruit players not teams.  It's everybody for themselves when it comes to getting offers.  You don't even need to be on a great team.  The player just has to be great.


----------



## SocalPapa

Lambchop said:


> It is my understanding that a forfeit usually only always one goal to opposing team. In this case beBurlingame cause
> 
> 
> 100 games?? Seriously?  DA teams do not play 100 games per age group. Are you counting DA all ages and all non DA games.   Just eliminate league games , games counted toward standings and all those scores.  If they were averaging 5-6 against them per game, that gives the teams they played an unfair advantage for playoffs, as opposed to only 1 goal awarded for games to be forfeited. It does matter.


Yes, counting all games and all age groups, it looks like 8 would have to be forfeited out of 100 total DA games on Burlingame's schedule for the season.

What you need to consider is that DA teams play some games out of their division.  Take Burlingame's U15 team for example.  So far they have played (and lost) four league games against So Cal teams (Real So Cal, LA Premier, Legends and Beach).  They have two remaining games in So Cal (LA Galaxy and Eagles) that look like they will have to be forfeited.  There's also one home game left against a So Cal team (LAFC).  If you void those 7 games, all 7 of those teams will be one game short when it comes to determining the final standings of the 14 teams in the Southwest - U-15 West Division.

And yes, LA Galaxy and Eagles will be deprived of an opportunity to run up the score in their games, but there are 7 teams in the Southwest - U-15 West Division that aren't schedule to play Burlingame at all.  Any team from So Cal that had Burlingame on the schedule got a benefit this season (forfeit or no).


----------



## shales1002

Chris Knight said:


> Sure shales ... who hasn't?   And of course the ECNL events are still attracting the crowds ... They are 9+ years and 40+ Showcases in aren't they?  GDA has been around a few months and has had 1, which makes these numbers even more telling doesn't it?  Saying that the reason for the large numbers at GDA Winter was due to 'curiosity' sounds a bit like a desperate reach.
> 
> I did not, however, attend the Fall Phoenix event ... But it'd be tough to argue that the perennial powerhouses attending from SoCal and NTX weren't a massive let down considering that they are second or third teams for the most part now.  Regardless, I'd have a tough time believing that 1/3+ of all coaches that attended the event would've been at one match at the same time but this isn't all that relevant here.
> 
> I'll preface this by saying for the o2s and older, it doesn't matter either way.  But the real meat of my point is that there has to be a bit of anxiety building up in those on the ECNL side of things with 03s and younger given the reality of the changing landscape.  I know, I know ... You're stuck in Vegas so _have_ to convince yourselves otherwise and root like hell for the relevance of the ECNL to continue -- I'd be doing the same thing.  In all likelihood however, you can expect (whether you like it or not) that the GDA will eventually come to you.
> 
> I gather from your response that you didn't buy much of what I said, but let's just say for grins that what I mentioned about what our US Soccer MTC rep (any a couple of the US Soccer liaisons from clubs in my area) told us was true.  Wouldn't it be a bit naive to believe that USSDA won't follow through on what they directly told us in an effort to potentially draw top talent from non GDA clubs to GDA clubs (consolidation) in the coming year?  In turn, in some areas (NoCal, Vagas) those clubs that have denied a GDA invitation might reconsider given they are either losing talent to GDA clubs or have pressure from unsatisfied parents and kiddos.  We've literally already witnessed this happening ... twice actually.
> 
> That being said, I am also intrigued as to what will come about with the deep pool of '03 GDA talent in SoCal next year ... very unfortunate situation.



You cannot be that clueless @Chris Knight  ...well perhaps you can be. It's not desperation to state the obvious.  GDA essentially FORCED all teams to be in Florida during semester exams or face the consequences. Obviously, getting girls committed wasn't on their minds as who would do such a foolish thing and jeopardize grades? Oh wait ...we already know the answer. The girls played second fiddle once again to their male counterparts who obviously had the better dates. Furthermore , we all know the one club in NorCal who didn't show up who recently got the axe. Just taking a quick glance, Burlingame isn't  the only club giving up over 5 goals per game. One can look at IMG as a testament to that argument. 

As for the Phoenix event in Fall, myself and many others were there. I know what I saw in Phoenix , and I know what you didn't see. Again foolish to assume colleges and U.S. scouts are only there for SoCal and Texas and that ECNL is filled with second and third tier teams. 

I don't have to convince myself about ECNL's relevance as I'm getting the desired results. Would I like for it to be more competitive...absolutely. Unfortunately that's hard to do with 21 "Elite" teams in SoCal. As for being "stuck" in Vegas...that she is not. It's a choice to have my DD play here. Seriously not convinced about the GDA product. 

Just looking over the YNT rosters, players are from all of the country and not just exclusively SoCal or Texas. NorCal sends a lot of its players , and they are still primarily ECNL. So, keep believing that MTC Rep if you want.   If you believe that YNT will only be players from GDA, then I'd like to sale you ocean front property in Idaho.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

My dd attended Florida and managed just fine with her finals and grades.


----------



## MarkM

Simisoccerfan said:


> My dd attended Florida and managed just fine with her finals and grades.


I didn't even know my DD had final exams on December 6-8.  Gosh darn-it!


----------



## shales1002

Simisoccerfan said:


> My dd attended Florida and managed just fine with her finals and grades.


You are missing my point. Why put the girls in that situation? Your DD did fine , honestly glad to hear. I know several girls who didn't attend because it was the week of exams, the week prior to exams, or in A.P. Classes the essay portion of exams. Parents didn't want to risk it.


----------



## Lambchop

Kicker4Life said:


> GF/GA only count in cases of a tie breaker, so it’s really not that big of a deal standings wise...You still get the 3 points.





Kicker4Life said:


> GF/GA only count in cases of a tie breaker, so it’s really not that big of a deal standings wise...You still get the 3 points.


For league standings it does count.  Since Burlingame has lost every single game, that is a win for all the teams that have played them, thus if the record is tied you look at goals for and against.  Simple eliminate  any game counting for league and all is righted. Tournament games don't count.


----------



## Lambchop

shales1002 said:


> You cannot be that clueless @Chris Knight  ...well perhaps you can be. It's not desperation to state the obvious.  GDA essentially FORCED all teams to be in Florida during semester exams or face the consequences. Obviously, getting girls committed wasn't on their minds as who would do such a foolish thing and jeopardize grades? Oh wait ...we already know the answer. The girls played second fiddle once again to their male counterparts who obviously had the better dates. Furthermore , we all know the one club in NorCal who didn't show up who recently got the axe. Just taking a quick glance, Burlingame isn't  the only club giving up over 5 goals per game. One can look at IMG as a testament to that argument.
> 
> As for the Phoenix event in Fall, myself and many others were there. I know what I saw in Phoenix , and I know what you didn't see. Again foolish to assume colleges and U.S. scouts are only there for SoCal and Texas and that ECNL is filled with second and third tier teams.
> 
> I don't have to convince myself about ECNL's relevance as I'm getting the desired results. Would I like for it to be more competitive...absolutely. Unfortunately that's hard to do with 21 "Elite" teams in SoCal. As for being "stuck" in Vegas...that she is not. It's a choice to have my DD play here. Seriously not convinced about the GDA product.
> 
> Just looking over the YNT rosters, players are from all of the country and not just exclusively SoCal or Texas. NorCal sends a lot of its players , and they are still primarily ECNL. So, keep believing that MTC Rep if you want.   If you believe that YNT will only be players from GDA, then I'd like to sale you ocean front property in Idaho.


Well since YNT is a two year cycle and very little changes in off years, and DA has only been around for a few months there probably is a lot of ECNL players.  The next few years will be telling.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

shales1002 said:


> You are missing my point. Why put the girls in that situation? Your DD did fine , honestly glad to hear. I know several girls who didn't attend because it was the week of exams, the week prior to exams, or in A.P. Classes the essay portion of exams. Parents didn't want to risk it.


There are only so many weekends when this event could take place.   You have finals and Christmas coming up fast.  Thanksgiving weekend just occurred.  Obviously they need to pick a weekend after the College season is over so coaches can attend.   So your left with Thanksgiving weekend when the later rounds of college playoffs is still occurring, the next weekend when the boys showcase occurred (and their DA program has been established for years) and the weekend that the event occurred.   I think they chose the right weekend.  There is a lot of downtime between games so there is plenty of time to study.


----------



## Real Deal

Lambchop said:


> For league standings it does count.  Since Burlingame has lost every single game, that is a win for all the teams that have played them, thus if the record is tied you look at goals for and against.  Simple eliminate  any game counting for league and all is righted. Tournament games don't count.


Yes it does seem unfair.   Maybe just make all the Burlingame games forfeits?  That'd work too without changing win/loss records.  I wondered why non-league games count anyway.


----------



## SocalPapa

Real Deal said:


> Yes it does seem unfair.   Maybe just make all the Burlingame games forfeits?  That'd work too without changing win/loss records.  I wondered why non-league games count anyway.


While Burlingame's U15 team has lost every game, its other 3 teams actually managed two wins and a tie among them.  And then there's the home games yet to be played.  Who knows, maybe they'll get inspired and win another game or two.

Forfeits always stink (mostly because the girls get cheated out of a game).  But I wouldn't call them unfair.  Forfeits can happen for a variety of reasons.  That's why there is a rule established ahead of time for how to account for them in the teams' records.


----------



## Lambchop

Simisoccerfan said:


> There are only so many weekends when this event could take place.   You have finals and Christmas coming up fast.  Thanksgiving weekend just occurred.  Obviously they need to pick a weekend after the College season is over so coaches can attend.   So your left with Thanksgiving weekend when the later rounds of college playoffs is still occurring, the next weekend when the boys showcase occurred (and their DA program has been established for years) and the weekend that the event occurred.   I think they chose the right weekend.  There is a lot of downtime between games so there is plenty of time to study.


US soccer needs to alternate the dates each year for the boys DA showcase and the girls DA showcase. Problem solved, or at least solved every other year.


----------



## Zen

MarkM said:


> I didn't even know my DD had final exams on December 6-8.  Gosh darn-it!


No need to mock and belittle someone just because DA isn't a fit, and they have a different formula that works for their DD.  Or insinuate/flatly state that someones DD is a second tier player with no options because they choose ECNL.  Shales has a valid point.  I heard a lot of negative feedback from DA parents on the schedule as well as those that didn't go.  He's not saying it's the case for everyone.  I'm happy for athletes that have found a league that works for them, be it DA, AYSO, whatever.  I'm happy DA is a huge success in Socal and working for many girls.  ECNL in Norcal is still a viable path for national training center and college scholarships.  ECNL players are still in the norcal national training pools.  There was an ECNL *discovery* player that was recently recommended to a local pool event, and received a full ride from every school on her dream list.  Get visibility in whatever way works for your daughter.  Top talent will get noticed regardless.


----------



## chiefs

Kicker4Life said:


> GF/GA only count in cases of a tie breaker, so it’s really not that big of a deal standings wise...You still get the 3 points.


If your a So Cal team that didnt play against Burlingame, it's a huuuuuge disadvantage. That's why the only fair decision is voiding all the games.


----------



## Kicker4Life

chiefs said:


> If your a So Cal team that didnt play against Burlingame, it's a huuuuuge disadvantage. That's why the only fair decision is voiding all the games.


make them all Forfeits....that works


----------



## Chris Knight

MakeAPlay said:


> Luckily colleges recruit players not teams.  It's everybody for themselves when it comes to getting offers.  You don't even need to be on a great team.  The player just has to be great.


Right ^ ... the sky is blue and the grass is green as well.


shales1002 said:


> You cannot be that clueless @Chris Knight  ...well perhaps you can be. It's not desperation to state the obvious.  GDA essentially FORCED all teams to be in Florida during semester exams or face the consequences. Obviously, getting girls committed wasn't on their minds as who would do such a foolish thing and jeopardize grades? Oh wait ...we already know the answer. The girls played second fiddle once again to their male counterparts who obviously had the better dates. Furthermore , we all know the one club in NorCal who didn't show up who recently got the axe. Just taking a quick glance, Burlingame isn't  the only club giving up over 5 goals per game. One can look at IMG as a testament to that argument.
> 
> As for the Phoenix event in Fall, myself and many others were there. I know what I saw in Phoenix , and I know what you didn't see. Again foolish to assume colleges and U.S. scouts are only there for SoCal and Texas and that ECNL is filled with second and third tier teams.
> 
> I don't have to convince myself about ECNL's relevance as I'm getting the desired results. Would I like for it to be more competitive...absolutely. Unfortunately that's hard to do with 21 "Elite" teams in SoCal. As for being "stuck" in Vegas...that she is not. It's a choice to have my DD play here. Seriously not convinced about the GDA product.and your kid will be
> 
> Just looking over the YNT rosters, players are from all of the country and not just exclusively SoCal or Texas. NorCal sends a lot of its players , and they are still primarily ECNL. So, keep believing that MTC Rep if you want.   If you believe that YNT will only be players from GDA, then I'd like to sale you ocean front property in Idaho.


Riiiggghhht.  So I've finally touched a nerve shales -- sorry about that.  I woulda thought an 'ole vet like yourself that has posted more than 200 times here would know better than to let emotion into this stuff.  Guess I shoulda included the disclaimer, "we all know it doesn't matter for your kid either" in my earlier post (to be honest, I actually considered it).  Yes ... We are aware that you are "getting the desired results" Sir.  As I mentioned to you before - It's glaringly obvious who your kid is.  

And Exams huh?  Is this what your defense has come to ... phone calls and foot lockers?  I won't get down on your level here, but I know someone as smart as you doesn't think that all the schools across the nation have exams at the same time -- a bit silly don't ya think? 

Speaking of 'what I didn't see' ... how about you Sir?  Have you been to a GDA Showcase?  Have you even been to a GDA match?  Training session?  Considering you just wrote, "Seriously not convinced about the GDA product", I doubt it.  I have, however seen all of this with ECNL.  And it's not just you shales ... I've found it fascinating of the past few months that almost all of those out there feverishly searching for holes to expose in GDA, have zero experience with it, while most of those that may be construed as GDA defenders, have intimate knowledge of the ECNL experience as well ... curious isn't it?

Rather than continue to state the obvious ... You know, that there are kids from ECNL still being recruited and making YNT rosters ... How bout something along the lines of an explanation as to why I'm nuts to think that GDA is trending in the positive while ECNL is trending in the opposite in just about every aspect?  Who knows ... Maybe you can "sale" us all!  

A few other compelling picadillos from your post that are just too darn tempting to avoid ...

_Please tell us about all of the ECNL teams from clubs with GDA from SoCal and NTX that aren't second tier now.

I for one would love to see this list of 21 "Elite" teams per age group in SoCal.

And what exactly did you mean by this ... not convinced about the GDA product."and your kid will be" ?  This is especially intriguing given that it came just after you had referenced your own kid a couple times._


----------



## LadiesMan217

Chris Knight said:


> Speaking of 'what I didn't see' ... how about you Sir?  Have you been to a GDA Showcase?  Have you even been to a GDA match?  Training session?  Considering you just wrote, "Seriously not convinced about the GDA product", I doubt it.  I have, however seen all of this with ECNL.  And it's not just you shales ... I've found it fascinating of the past few months that almost all of those out there feverishly searching for holes to expose in GDA, have zero experience with it, while most of those that may be construed as GDA defenders, have intimate knowledge of the ECNL experience as well ... curious isn't it?


^BUMP^


----------



## shales1002

Chris Knight said:


> Right ^ ... the sky is blue and the grass is green as well.
> 
> 
> Riiiggghhht.  So I've finally touched a nerve shales -- sorry about that.  I woulda thought an 'ole vet like yourself that has posted more than 200 times here would know better than to let emotion into this stuff.  Guess I shoulda included the disclaimer, "we all know it doesn't matter for your kid either" in my earlier post (to be honest, I actually considered it).  Yes ... We are aware that you are "getting the desired results" Sir.  As I mentioned to you before - It's glaringly obvious who your kid is.
> 
> 
> _And what exactly did you mean by this ... not convinced about the GDA product."and your kid will be" ?  This is especially intriguing given that it came just after you had referenced your own kid a _



Emotion? Yeah okay... whatever. This is discourse. Simply put I don’t agree with your take on ECNL. For the record, I’ve never stated anything negative about the actual GDA showcase other than it’s timing and girls getting crappy dates. Nor did I state anything negative about GDA, just that it’s not for my DD at this time. We are not willing to give everything thing else up for a new patch. No need for disclaimers, most don’t know who my DD is anyways. Sure you can find her if you dig a little.

Yes, Exams!  Parents will hopefully make a responsible decision that works for their player. As others posted their was down time to study for EXAMS. It’s not silly to understand their significance, it’s SILLY NOT to acknowledge it.

Have you been to a GDA Showcase?
Nope, they have only had one that was 2,382 miles from my house. That’s a bit far dontcha think ?

Have you even been to a GDA match?
Yup, it was very lope-sided. If I remember the score was like 7-0... could be wrong on the score.
Maybe 7-1.

Training session?
Yup, it wasn’t anything out of the ordinary.

So, yes I have enough experience with GDA to know, I’m not getting anything any different for my DD at this point in time,  other  than a new shiny patch .

No need to sale anyone on anything. It’s not my place, and besides I personally hate sales. However, that’s what USSF should be doing a better job of.   GDA hasn’t sold me on anything. Case in point ... them screwing over the 2003’s for 18/19 season. Now, if they change it before the season, Kudos to them.

I said their are more REGIONS in this vast country than SoCal and NTX and I have consistently stated that 21 “elite”  anything shouldn’t exist anywhere and doesn’t.

And you kid will be ... that’s a typo. Oof !


----------



## NoGoal

shales1002 said:


> Emotion? Yeah okay... whatever. This is discourse. Simply put I don’t agree with your take on ECNL. For the record, I’ve never stated anything negative about the actual GDA showcase other than it’s timing and girls getting crappy dates. Nor did I state anything negative about GDA, just that it’s not for my DD at this time. We are not willing to give everything thing else up for a new patch. No need for disclaimers, most don’t know who my DD is anyways. Sure you can find her if you dig a little.
> 
> Yes, Exams!  Parents will hopefully make a responsible decision that works for their player. As others posted their was down time to study for EXAMS. It’s not silly to understand their significance, it’s SILLY NOT to acknowledge it.
> 
> Have you been to a GDA Showcase?
> Nope, they have only had one that was 2,382 miles from my house. That’s a bit far dontcha think ?
> 
> Have you even been to a GDA match?
> Yup, it was very lope-sided. If I remember the score was like 7-0... could be wrong on the score.
> Maybe 7-1.
> 
> Training session?
> Yup, it wasn’t anything out of the ordinary.
> 
> So, yes I have enough experience with GDA to know, I’m not getting anything any different for my DD at this point in time,  other  than a new shiny patch .
> 
> No need to sale anyone on anything. It’s not my place, and besides I personally hate sales. However, that’s what USSF should be doing a better job of.   GDA hasn’t sold me on anything. Case in point ... them screwing over the 2003’s for 18/19 season. Now, if they change it before the season, Kudos to them.
> 
> I said their are more REGIONS in this vast country than SoCal and NTX and I have consistently stated that 21 “elite”  anything shouldn’t exist anywhere and doesn’t.
> 
> And you kid will be ... that’s a typo. Oof !


I spoke recently to a D1 assistant/recruiting coach.  We ended up on the subject of showcases and leagues.  What he told me was, the leagues are ALL watered down now.  It’s not like last year where ECNL had the concentration of the talent.  He said, he has watched several DA games this year of which a few of the scores where blow-outs and wondered.  Is this team that good or is the competition that bad.  A lot of the college coaches he said are going to be leaning more on the club coaches opinions based on what they evaluated and what they say.  Reason why the club coaches relationship with college coaches will be even more important going forward.


----------



## Lambchop

Zen said:


> No need to mock and belittle someone just because DA isn't a fit, and they have a different formula that works for their DD.  Or insinuate/flatly state that someones DD is a second tier player with no options because they choose ECNL.  Shales has a valid point.  I heard a lot of negative feedback from DA parents on the schedule as well as those that didn't go.  He's not saying it's the case for everyone.  I'm happy for athletes that have found a league that works for them, be it DA, AYSO, whatever.  I'm happy DA is a huge success in Socal and working for many girls.  ECNL in Norcal is still a viable path for national training center and college scholarships.  ECNL players are still in the norcal national training pools.  There was an ECNL *discovery* player that was recently recommended to a local pool event, and received a full ride from every school on her dream list.  Get visibility in whatever way works for your daughter.  Top talent will get noticed regardless.


Full ride? Wow, so few of those unless it is needs based, academic and partial athletic, unless of course you are on the national team.


Simisoccerfan said:


> There are only so many weekends when this event could take place.   You have finals and Christmas coming up fast.  Thanksgiving weekend just occurred.  Obviously they need to pick a weekend after the College season is over so coaches can attend.   So your left with Thanksgiving weekend when the later rounds of college playoffs is still occurring, the next weekend when the boys showcase occurred (and their DA program has been established for years) and the weekend that the event occurred.   I think they chose the right weekend.  There is a lot of downtime between games so there is plenty of time to study.


Well, now US soccer can rotate the dates to be fair.


----------



## SocalPapa

Chris Knight said:


> _Please tell us about all of the ECNL teams from clubs with GDA from SoCal and NTX that aren't second tier now.
> 
> I for one would love to see this list of 21 "Elite" teams per age group in SoCal._


I realize it is too early to do an analysis like this, but...

I was curious to try to get a sense of which types of teams the top recruits are playing for now so I took a close look at class of 2021 recruits that have already committed (per Top Drawer Soccer).  As best I can tell the 28 girls that have already committed from the Class of 2021 are currently playing for the following categories of teams:

Dual DA/ECNL Clubs 16
ECNL Only Clubs 4
DA Clubs that Left ECNL Last Year 3
Not DA or ECNL 3
DA only w/no ECNL History 2

11 of these players are from Texas (most from Solar Soccer Club) and 4 are from So Cal.  The rest are spread about the country (plus 1 Canadian).

As I've mentioned before, the dual clubs had been generally the strongest clubs in ECNL and they are now among the strongest in DA.  Their success in drawing players that get recruited seems to have continued as well.  So the recruiting success seems more of a club thing than a DA vs ECNL thing.  (And a lot of these early recruits have YNT experience.  With that accolade on their resume, their home club may not have even mattered much.)

Nonetheless, the committed players that I saw playing for dual clubs were almost all currently playing for their club's DA team rather than their ECNL teams.  So for 2003's (single year age group) looks like most of these clubs are, in fact, treating DA as their A team and ECNL as the B team.  The best players will want to play for their club's best team, so if these clubs are saying DA is the best, presumably that's where they will want to go.

Dual DA/ECNL clubs are the minority.  What I don't see (yet) is any trend that clubs with no elite soccer history (what I call the "DA only" clubs) are doing any better than ECNL clubs.  I would argue that how this trend develops going forward will demonstrate whether the way DA develops/showcases players is any better than the ECNL system.  Notably the two DA-only recruits are both from So Cal: Legends and LA Galaxy San Diego.  (The other 2 So Cal committed players are from Surf and Slammers.)

Given the comparatively poor game performance by DA-only clubs in other parts of the country, I'll be very curious as to how they end up doing in recruiting.  As is evidenced by Burlingame's case, putting DA on the uniform and adding practices won't magically make the roster more athletic.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Lambchop said:


> Full ride? Wow, so few of those unless it is needs based, academic and partial athletic, unless of course you are on the national team.


Or of course if it was a lie (most likely).[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]


----------



## Zen

LadiesMan217 said:


> Or of course if it was a lie (most likely).


[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
Guess you’ll have to wait and see...stay tuned, Pac 12, 2021.


----------



## davin

LadiesMan217 said:


> Or of course if it was a lie (most likely).


[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm


----------



## LadiesMan217

[/QUOTE]
Guess you’ll have to wait and see...stay tuned, Pac 12, 2021.[/QUOTE]

[/QUOTE]
http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm[/QUOTE]

Not sure I will ever see the financial details or the other 'dream schools' with 'full rides' offers to her; but, being her dream school was Cal I believe it is a full ride for an in state player. Good for her!


----------



## Zen

Guess you’ll have to wait and see...stay tuned, Pac 12, 2021.[/QUOTE]

[/QUOTE]
http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm[/QUOTE]

Not sure I will ever see the financial details or the other 'dream schools' with 'full rides' offers to her; but, being her dream school was Cal I believe it is a full ride for an in state player. Good for her![/QUOTE]
Why add the slight?  She could’ve gone anywhere she wanted, full ride, out of state, where ever, track or soccer.  No need to prove it to bloggers and haters.  You’ll ‘see’ in 2021.  
In the meantime here is something to help you get the haters in formation:


----------



## LadiesMan217

Zen said:


> Guess you’ll have to wait and see...stay tuned, Pac 12, 2021.


[/QUOTE]
http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm[/QUOTE]

Not sure I will ever see the financial details or the other 'dream schools' with 'full rides' offers to her; but, being her dream school was Cal I believe it is a full ride for an in state player. Good for her![/QUOTE]
Why add the slight?  She could’ve gone anywhere she wanted, full ride, out of state, where ever, track or soccer.  No need to prove it to bloggers and haters.  You’ll ‘see’ in 2021. 
In the meantime here is something to help you get the haters in formation:




[/QUOTE]

I add the slight towards the post because I was responding to 'full ride to all her dream schools'. Hear the 'full ride' comment all the time and it is usually a parent pumping up their kid via exaggeration. Nothing against this kid at all, just someone coming on here and talking about another kid getting full rides to all the schools they were looking at. They have no idea and 90+% of the time it is a lie. Again, I believe she got a full ride to Cal as an in-state student. My DD just got an offer from a school for full tuition and I asked the coach why did he give Suzy a full ride and offering my DD just tuition. He laughed and said 'Trust me, Suzy didn't get much'. So many people exaggerate and I am sure this very talented player did not get full ride to all her dream schools unless Cal and all the other CA state schools were her dreams. Not a big deal - I spent too much time on this


----------



## Zen

http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm[/QUOTE]

Not sure I will ever see the financial details or the other 'dream schools' with 'full rides' offers to her; but, being her dream school was Cal I believe it is a full ride for an in state player. Good for her![/QUOTE]
Why add the slight?  She could’ve gone anywhere she wanted, full ride, out of state, where ever, track or soccer.  No need to prove it to bloggers and haters.  You’ll ‘see’ in 2021.
In the meantime here is something to help you get the haters in formation:




[/QUOTE]

I add the slight towards the post because I was responding to 'full ride to all her dream schools'. Hear the 'full ride' comment all the time and it is usually a parent pumping up their kid via exaggeration. Nothing against this kid at all, just someone coming on here and talking about another kid getting full rides to all the schools they were looking at. They have no idea and 90+% of the time it is a lie. Again, I believe she got a full ride to Cal as an in-state student. My DD just got an offer from a school for full tuition and I asked the coach why did he give Suzy a full ride and offering my DD just tuition. He laughed and said 'Trust me, Suzy didn't get much'. So many people exaggerate and I am sure this very talented player did not get full ride to all her dream schools unless Cal and all the other CA state schools were her dreams. Not a big deal - I spent too much time on this [/QUOTE]

Congrats to your daughter!  Full tuition is awesome!  I understand where you are coming from.  Soccer parents being delusional about their kids - no way!  in this case full ride reference came from the coach, and no I’m not the parent.  My daughter is an 04.  We haven’t started the recruitment process yet.  Fingers crossed for next year.  This girl is a unique talent.


----------



## Zen

Congrats to your daughter!  Full tuition is awesome!  I understand where you are coming from.  Soccer parents being delusional about their kids - no way!  in this case full ride reference came from the coach, and no I’m not the parent.  My daughter is an 04.  We haven’t started the recruitment process yet.  Fingers crossed for next year.  This girl is a unique talent.[/QUOTE]

Clarifying I'm referring to the committed player as the unique talent, not my daughter.  Fingers crossed on her recruitment process when she starts high school next  year.


----------



## StinkMeaner

[/QUOTE]
http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm[/QUOTE]

Cool story.  Nobody does less with more talent that the Bears.


----------



## StinkMeaner

I know that some surprising schools give out full rides for some odd reason.  Most of the top schools don't have to give out full rides although some players earn them through performance.  The two teams in the College Cup final didn't collect that amount of talent by giving away "the Farm."  I know that they both have players getting 75% or more but since Pugh left nobody (including Sullivan) was getting a full ride.  If Cal thinks that giving everything to one player that they will get the results then they haven't been paying attention.  Soccer is a team sport unlike a lot of American sports that require a superstar in order to be great.  This is one case where two 5's may be better than a 10.

I do wish the player well.


----------



## SocalPapa

Dos Equis said:


> Whatever the final 02/03 ratio, I expect any deserving '03 who wants to, will find a spot on a 02/03 DA team.  If half of the current '03 DA players are not in DA next year, that is the goal of the DA system -- to be a funnel for US Soccer to develop and identify national team players.


I assume US Soccer also figured in some natural attrition (due to girls switching to other sports or activities).  Age 14 is a peak year for soccer participation and it drops off rather dramatically after that, especially for girls.


----------



## Lambchop

SocalPapa said:


> I assume US Soccer also figured in some natural attrition (due to girls switching to other sports or activities).  Age 14 is a peak year for soccer participation and it drops off rather dramatically after that, especially for girls.
> 
> View attachment 1912View attachment 1913


Yep, and that's why they expanded DA for the 03, 04 girls, right, oh, and Frontier division keeps single age band for those girls next year, yep, and 03 is the only age loosing it, yep.  High school always sees a drop off, nothing new there.


----------



## SocalPapa

Lambchop said:


> Yep, and that's why they expanded DA for the 03, 04 girls, right, oh, and Frontier division keeps single age band for those girls next year, yep, and 03 is the only age loosing it, yep.  High school always sees a drop off, nothing new there.


I can't understand your point through all the snarkiness.  Are you agreeing or disagreeing with me?

You agree high school sees a drop off, right?  So wouldn't continuing to place older girls on dual-age-band teams and younger girls on single-age-band teams be consistent with that?  Or is that not in fact what's happening (Frontier division excepted)?

In any event, natural attrition will reduce the number of '03s that will end up actually being cut next year, which is the main point I was trying to make.


----------



## Lambchop

SocalPapa said:


> I can't understand your point through all the snarkiness.  Are you agreeing or disagreeing with me?
> 
> You agree high school sees a drop off, right?  So wouldn't continuing to place older girls on dual-age-band teams and younger girls on single-age-band teams be consistent with that?  Or is that not in fact what's happening (Frontier division excepted)?
> 
> In any event, natural attrition will reduce the number of '03s that will end up actually being cut next year, which is the main point I was trying to make.


The 03's started high school this year and are single age band, no problem with attrition there.  US soccer lead a lot of coaches, DOC's  and players to believe the 03 would continue as a single age band next year.  So much for US soccer presentations.


----------



## Monkey

Lambchop said:


> The 03's started high school this year and are single age band, no problem with attrition there.  US soccer lead a lot of coaches, DOC's  and players to believe the 03 would continue as a single age band next year.  So much for US soccer presentations.


Are you sure it was a US soccer presentation and not wishful thinking of the DA clubs that though they could add one more team to line their pockets?

Just like your continual flying clipboard comments, your it's not fair to the 03s whining is draining me.  This is not a trophy for all, DA is survival of the fittest and if your kid gets cut too bad. Find another DA team or maybe just maybe they don't belong in DA.  Remember the cream floats to the top.


----------



## Monkey

shales1002 said:


> Emotion? Yeah okay... whatever. This is discourse. Simply put I don’t agree with your take on ECNL. For the record, I’ve never stated anything negative about the actual GDA showcase other than it’s timing and girls getting crappy dates. Nor did I state anything negative about GDA, just that it’s not for my DD at this time. We are not willing to give everything thing else up for a new patch. No need for disclaimers, most don’t know who my DD is anyways. Sure you can find her if you dig a little.
> 
> Yes, Exams!  Parents will hopefully make a responsible decision that works for their player. As others posted their was down time to study for EXAMS. It’s not silly to understand their significance, it’s SILLY NOT to acknowledge it.
> 
> Have you been to a GDA Showcase?
> Nope, they have only had one that was 2,382 miles from my house. That’s a bit far dontcha think ?
> 
> Have you even been to a GDA match?
> Yup, it was very lope-sided. If I remember the score was like 7-0... could be wrong on the score.
> Maybe 7-1.
> 
> Training session?
> Yup, it wasn’t anything out of the ordinary.
> 
> So, yes I have enough experience with GDA to know, I’m not getting anything any different for my DD at this point in time,  other  than a new shiny patch .
> 
> No need to sale anyone on anything. It’s not my place, and besides I personally hate sales. However, that’s what USSF should be doing a better job of.   GDA hasn’t sold me on anything. Case in point ... them screwing over the 2003’s for 18/19 season. Now, if they change it before the season, Kudos to them.
> 
> I said their are more REGIONS in this vast country than SoCal and NTX and I have consistently stated that 21 “elite”  anything shouldn’t exist anywhere and doesn’t.
> 
> And you kid will be ... that’s a typo. Oof !


Your dd could play AYSO and have no problem being discovered.


----------



## Monkey

Has anyone heard about DA clubs already signing player up for next season?  The season is only half way through.  If I were a sophomore or junior and was able to commit to a college in the next few months, I might not want to play DA for the final year or two if I had a long drive or wanted to play high school. Or I might want to switch to another DA team that had players that also committed to the same college. We've talked about tryouts before State Cup being the root of multiple problems.  In effect, making players commit to a DA team  5-6 months before the end of the season seems much worse.


----------



## G03_SD

http://m.morganhilltimes.com/sports/girls-soccer-lema-a-rising-sensation/article_eaa001d2-f6f7-11e7-aac3-a7cb4fc1326c.html?mode=jqm[/QUOTE]

Cool story.  Nobody does less with more talent that the Bears.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for this. My daughter guested with this team a couple times and we could not be more happy for her and the family. Great kid great player, and she is very fast


----------



## Lambchop

Monkey said:


> Are you sure it was a US soccer presentation and not wishful thinking of the DA clubs that though they could add one more team to line their pockets?
> 
> Just like your continual flying clipboard comments, your it's not fair to the 03s whining is draining me.  This is not a trophy for all, DA is survival of the fittest and if your kid gets cut too bad. Find another DA team or maybe just maybe they don't belong in DA.  Remember the cream floats to the top.


Monkey, the problem is that DA went single age band for 03, 04 this year now they are backtracking going dual age band for 03 EXCEPT for 9 different clubs in the Frontier division who are staying single age band for these two groups next year. They are "piloting" 03 single age band, yep,  right.


----------



## Fact

Lambchop said:


> Monkey, the problem is that DA went single age band for 03, 04 this year now they are backtracking going dual age band for 03 EXCEPT for 9 different clubs in the Frontier division who are staying single age band for these two groups next year. They are "piloting" 03 single age band, yep,  right.


That's like saying the 2008s play 9 v 9 so it is not fair if they move them to a bigger field next year and play 11 v 11, they are going to get less touches.  Get over it.


----------



## Fact

Monkey said:


> Has anyone heard about DA clubs already signing player up for next season?  The season is only half way through.  If I were a sophomore or junior and was able to commit to a college in the next few months, I might not want to play DA for the final year or two if I had a long drive or wanted to play high school. Or I might want to switch to another DA team that had players that also committed to the same college. We've talked about tryouts before State Cup being the root of multiple problems.  In effect, making players commit to a DA team  5-6 months before the end of the season seems much worse.


Is that allowed per DA rules and other than losing your fees you paid in advance, is there anything stopping you from changing your mind once you commit but before you sign the paperwork as it pertains to US Soccer? A lot of things can change in 5 month and for clubs to demand payment now seems unethical?


----------



## Real Deal

Fact said:


> That's like saying the 2008s play 9 v 9 so it is not fair if they move them to a bigger field next year and play 11 v 11, they are going to get less touches.  Get over it.


No-- its more like saying the 05s will go back to playing 9v9 next season except for Frontier Division who will pilot staying  11v11.  A lot of 03s will lose their spots, (except in Frontier Division).


----------



## Fact

Real Deal said:


> No-- its more like saying the 05s will go back to playing 9v9 next season except for Frontier Division who will pilot staying  11v11.  A lot of 03s will lose their spots, (except in Frontier Division).


Players on top teams lose their spot when a more skilled player comes in.  Players also lose playing time when they are not performing.  The cream rises.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

Monkey said:


> Are you sure it was a US soccer presentation and not wishful thinking of the DA clubs that though they could add one more team to line their pockets?


Lol. "Line their Pockets" Clubs are more likely to go out of business than lining their pockets with another DA team. 12 more months and I'd be surprised if we don't see teams leave the due to the financial strain of hosting the DA program.


----------



## Striker17

Please elaborate- because there is a huge disparity of what some people get for the money they spend so please break this down for me.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Lol. "Line their Pockets" Clubs are more likely to go out of business than lining their pockets with another DA team. 12 more months and I'd be surprised if we don't see teams leave the due to the financial strain of hosting the DA program.


I am sure the Fully Funded DA Clubs are happiest about keeping the number of teams at 4.


----------



## Desert Hound

I think next year AZ will have another DA team.

Real Salt Lake next year will have a partnership with a new club called RSL-AZ. Sereno just merged with Legacy and together they will be RSL-AZ.

https://www.rsl.com/post/2018/01/11/real-salt-lake-arizona-re-established-phoenix-based-sereno-legacy-clubs-join-forces

"Real Salt Lake is refocusing its Academy in Arizona with Sereno to help develop and support the players of Arizona and surrounding areas. The training and match facilities for RSL-AZ will be in the heart of Phoenix for easy access for players from across the Valley and state.

In addition to the boys Academy, the RSL-Sereno partnership also introduces an RSL-Arizona girls academy to facilitate upward movement to the new Utah Royals FC of the National Women's Soccer League (NWSL), which kicks off its season at Rio Tinto Stadium in Utah this Spring. The RSL-Arizona Academy expands the depth and breadth of elite girls' academies with a direct connection to a NWSL team."


----------



## Monkey

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Lol. "Line their Pockets" Clubs are more likely to go out of business than lining their pockets with another DA team. 12 more months and I'd be surprised if we don't see teams leave the due to the financial strain of hosting the DA program.


The line your pockets comment was meant for the clubs with DPL that are selling the dream of DA to these families.  They already have 1 team per age, but will lose a revenue source as families realize that they don't have a chance to make the DA team and decide to go elsewhere.


----------



## MarkM

Desert Hound said:


> I think next year AZ will have another DA team.
> 
> Real Salt Lake next year will have a partnership with a new club called RSL-AZ. Sereno just merged with Legacy and together they will be RSL-AZ.
> 
> https://www.rsl.com/post/2018/01/11/real-salt-lake-arizona-re-established-phoenix-based-sereno-legacy-clubs-join-forces
> 
> "Real Salt Lake is refocusing its Academy in Arizona with Sereno to help develop and support the players of Arizona and surrounding areas. The training and match facilities for RSL-AZ will be in the heart of Phoenix for easy access for players from across the Valley and state.
> 
> In addition to the boys Academy, the RSL-Sereno partnership also introduces an RSL-Arizona girls academy to facilitate upward movement to the new Utah Royals FC of the National Women's Soccer League (NWSL), which kicks off its season at Rio Tinto Stadium in Utah this Spring. The RSL-Arizona Academy expands the depth and breadth of elite girls' academies with a direct connection to a NWSL team."


Thanks for the update Desert Hound.  Do you view DA expansion as positive for AZ soccer?


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Monkey said:


> The line your pockets comment was meant for the clubs with DPL that are selling the dream of DA to these families.  They already have 1 team per age, but will lose a revenue source as families realize that they don't have a chance to make the DA team and decide to go elsewhere.


Totally disagree.  DPL costs are very similar to what other top non DA/ECNL teams charge.  I don't see it costing more versus SCDSL or CSL unless you go to a club with volunteer coaches.  Looking at match reports for the DA there already have been a number of DPL players getting time as DP's for the DA.  DPL clubs have been getting into all the right showcases so that is working to.  Finally in our case it did create a path to full time DA.  I even know of some DPL kids that have committed to college.


----------



## Desert Hound

MarkM said:


> Thanks for the update Desert Hound.  Do you view DA expansion as positive for AZ soccer?


Well for starters I think the merger is a positive. The combined club should over time be able to field better teams vs Sereno alone or Legacy alone. The typical teams will continue to train in their respective areas within the metro area. However for the very top teams they are going to move the training to an area far more central. Sereno should continue to have/keep most of their current players on their ECNL teams for example. However moving to a more central training area will now bring in kids whose parents were unwilling to drive so far. By far I mean to where Sereno currently trains or where del Sol trains (both clubs are currently pretty close to each other.  Essentially they now bring in the entire east valley into play while keeping what they currently have.

It now makes for a very strong club.

It is a very interesting development.


----------



## SocalPapa

Simisoccerfan said:


> Totally disagree.  DPL costs are very similar to what other top non DA/ECNL teams charge.  I don't see it costing more versus SCDSL or CSL unless you go to a club with volunteer coaches.  Looking at match reports for the DA there already have been a number of DPL players getting time as DP's for the DA.  DPL clubs have been getting into all the right showcases so that is working to.  Finally in our case it did create a path to full time DA.  I even know of some DPL kids that have committed to college.


@Monkey can speak for himself, but I thought the point he was making is that the 03's in these clubs are moving from a situation with two full rosters (DA and DPL) to a roster and a half (at best) with the full roster being the reserve team.  Consider the math.  First, half a roster has to go somewhere.  (Will they really choose to play for the club's C level team when there might be a seemingly better opportunity for them out there?  And, if so, what happens to the C team's roster?)  And would DPL players that hadn't managed to crack DA yet really ALL want to stick with the club with only half (or fewer) DA roster spots to aspire too?  Logically the DA/DPL clubs are going to lose paying customers as a result of this decision.  Further, I don't see it as a DPL-killer, but if DPL clubs had hoped to corner the market on the top talent in So Cal some day, losing half a roster or so of talent at the critical u16 level is going to make that goal much more difficult.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

SocalPapa said:


> @Monkey can speak for himself, but I thought the point he was making is that the 03's in these clubs are moving from a situation with two full rosters (DA and DPL) to a roster and a half (at best) with the full roster being the reserve team.  Consider the math.  First, half a roster has to go somewhere.  (Will they really choose to play for the club's C level team when there might be a seemingly better opportunity for them out there?  And, if so, what happens to the C team's roster?)  And would DPL players that hadn't managed to crack DA yet really ALL want to stick with the club with only half (or fewer) DA roster spots to aspire too?  Logically the DA/DPL clubs are going to lose paying customers as a result of this decision.  Further, I don't see it as a DPL-killer, but if DPL clubs had hoped to corner the market on the top talent in So Cal some day, losing half a roster or so of talent at the critical u16 level is going to make that goal much more difficult.


I agree about the potential to lose have of the DA roster that does not want to step back to DPL.  But here is what they need to consider.  Can they make another DA team? If not then ECNL could be an option if they live near a team (not much of an option north of the OC).  So where do they go?  Flight 1? Premier?  Those are not really better options than DPL which is the B team for most of the DA teams not the C team.  If they want to get back to the DA they are probably better off staying with the same club but stepping down to DPL for one year until they are in the upper half of the age bracket and can move back to DA.

Regarding DPL players sticking with DPL unless they can make an ECNL or another DA team I don't see other options that are clearly better.


----------



## azsnowrider

Desert Hound said:


> Well for starters I think the merger is a positive. The combined club should over time be able to field better teams vs Sereno alone or Legacy alone. The typical teams will continue to train in their respective areas within the metro area. However for the very top teams they are going to move the training to an area far more central. Sereno should continue to have/keep most of their current players on their ECNL teams for example. However moving to a more central training area will now bring in kids whose parents were unwilling to drive so far. By far I mean to where Sereno currently trains or where del Sol trains (both clubs are currently pretty close to each other.  Essentially they now bring in the entire east valley into play while keeping what they currently have.
> 
> It now makes for a very strong club.
> 
> It is a very interesting development.


Combining definitely created a local superclub, but I'm still concerned with talent dilution for 2 DAs. I hope it works out,but if they keep ECNL and add DA can we support 3 platforms in AZ? I'm hoping our local state teams don't take to much of a hit as well. Still lots of unknowns on this. Interesting for sure


----------



## Desert Hound

azsnowrider said:


> Combining definitely created a local superclub, but I'm still concerned with talent dilution for 2 DAs. I hope it works out,but if they keep ECNL and add DA can we support 3 platforms in AZ? I'm hoping our local state teams don't take to much of a hit as well. Still lots of unknowns on this. Interesting for sure


Well we should find out pretty soon if they get DA status. In Feb US Soccer will announce new clubs per their website information.


----------



## Soccerbabe3

Per a conversation a few days ago, is it true that for DA 2018-2019, it will be a combined 2005/2006 bracket? Any updates from clubs on this, especially the ones that have completed tryouts? Just curious.


----------



## azsnowrider

Soccerbabe3 said:


> Per a conversation a few days ago, is it true that for DA 2018-2019, it will be a combined 2005/2006 bracket? Any updates from clubs on this, especially the ones that have completed tryouts? Just curious.


Yes, in Az we got the notice.


----------



## Desert Hound

azsnowrider said:


> Yes, in Az we got the notice.


Yep...here is the link showing age bands https://www.scdelsolda.com/iddates


----------



## Bananacorner

OK, I understand combined age bands after puberty -- the level of play isn't as age-dependent when you are looking at girls that are 15 and 16 years old.  But when you are talking about girls that are 11, 12 and 13, there is a HUGE difference between the average top competitive athlete at age 13 and the same athlete at 11 or 12.  A middle-of-the road player on the top competitive team 2005 can often beat out the top of the 2006.  Maturity, size, speed often plays a big part of that.    

Obviously, if you are comparing a player on a lower level 2005 team, that is different, but I am talking about the top players in the 2005 and 2006 age group at a top club.

So how many 2006 players will these top DA teams really put on their roster?  Oh wait, I forgot -- its about development.  So does that mean a promising 2005 is kicked from the DA roster for a 2006 to get on and "develop?"  Then you put the 2005 back on the next year when it goes to single age again?  What a disaster...


----------



## 2kDad

Bananacorner said:


> OK, I understand combined age bands after puberty -- the level of play isn't as age-dependent when you are looking at girls that are 15 and 16 years old.  But when you are talking about girls that are 11, 12 and 13, there is a HUGE difference between the average top competitive athlete at age 13 and the same athlete at 11 or 12.  A middle-of-the road player on the top competitive team 2005 can often beat out the top of the 2006.  Maturity, size, speed often plays a big part of that.
> 
> Obviously, if you are comparing a player on a lower level 2005 team, that is different, but I am talking about the top players in the 2005 and 2006 age group at a top club.
> 
> So how many 2006 players will these top DA teams really put on their roster?  Oh wait, I forgot -- its about development.  So does that mean a promising 2005 is kicked from the DA roster for a 2006 to get on and "develop?"  Then you put the 2005 back on the next year when it goes to single age again?  What a disaster...


CalSouth had 5 "2006" girls make the ODP Regional team, I'm sure there are more out there that can hang with the best '05 players.  I have a feeling most '06's will stay put though


----------



## Bananacorner

2kDad said:


> CalSouth had 5 "2006" girls make the ODP Regional team, I'm sure there are more out there that can hang with the best '05 players.  I have a feeling most '06's will stay put though


Agreed, there are always exceptions, but just doesn't seem logical to create age bands at this age.  The 2005 teams could put those specific 2006 players on their 2005 DA team anyway, you don't need to create "bands" to do that.  This year there are several 2004 teams that have 1 or more 2005 players on them, which is fine for a select few that have the maturity and skill to play up at a young age.

 Going across the years having Band, No Band, Band, Band doesn't make sense to me --I would think it will create this weird vacuum in the U15 year where they don't have enough players for the roster.


----------



## MarkM

Bananacorner said:


> Agreed, there are always exceptions, but just doesn't seem logical to create age bands at this age.  The 2005 teams could put those specific 2006 players on their 2005 DA team anyway, you don't need to create "bands" to do that.  This year there are several 2004 teams that have 1 or more 2005 players on them, which is fine for a select few that have the maturity and skill to play up at a young age.
> 
> Going across the years having Band, No Band, Band, Band doesn't make sense to me --I would think it will create this weird vacuum in the U15 year where they don't have enough players for the roster.


Has US Soccer actually approved a dual age group for 05/06?  Or is this just listed on Del Sol's website to encourage 06 players to try out for the 05 team?


----------



## younothat

MarkM said:


> Has US Soccer actually approved a dual age group for 05/06?  Or is this just listed on Del Sol's website to encourage 06 players to try out for the 05 team?


At this point there is no girls combined age group for o5/06' in ussda.

These are the current planned age groups for 18-19':

U-14 (2005), U-15 (2004), U-16/17 (2002/2003), & U-18/19 (2000/2001) 4 total for the girls

Composite or combined age groups don't start until U16 boys or girls.

Some of the boys clubs advertised   U11/U12 as the start of the age bands this past season but boys da actually starts at U12 and the U11 bit was selective marketing, of course some played up but there is not a specific age  group U13 grop (06') for the girls just like no U11 for the boys.


----------



## Justafan

Bananacorner said:


> So how many 2006 players will these top DA teams really put on their roster?  Oh wait, I forgot -- its about development.  So does that mean a promising 2005 is kicked from the DA roster for a 2006 to get on and "develop?"  Then you put the 2005 back on the next year when it goes to single age again?  What a disaster...


When DA first started they were all going to be dual age bands.  The official Q & A specifically stated that clubs were supposed to try as much as possible to have a 50/50 split.  The theory was that it was good for development to have youngers play against olders every other year.  

When posters here started saying some clubs were loading the teams with the older age group, I pointed out that Q & A, and no one really acknowledged it.  

So the moral of story is, we are SoCal, we can't help ourselves.  Barcelona trainers could come and promise us 5 world cups in a row if we commit to dual age bands with a 50/50 split, but we'd have to sacrifice winning along the way.  I don't think we could do it.


----------



## Chris Knight

MarkM said:


> Has US Soccer actually approved a dual age group for 05/06?  Or is this just listed on Del Sol's website to encourage 06 players to try out for the 05 team?


Yep.

https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/mzlyw0ld7v1c0wkbojo8o7m5bfy54c69


----------



## Zen

Chris Knight said:


> Yep.
> 
> https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/mzlyw0ld7v1c0wkbojo8o7m5bfy54c69


Thanks for sharing.  Feels like the borg is taking over by any means necessary.  I feel bad for all the players that will be negatively impacted by the churn.  These are kids who love the sport at the end of the day.  Yes, the ‘cream will rise’ regardless.  This new system is unnecessary...but I’m sure another fancy slideshow will be distributed next year ‘proving’ otherwise.  Sorry, not trying to shoot the messenger...just shaking my head at the direction and decisions.  Thx again for sharing!


----------



## Gokicksomegrass

I think it was two 06' calsouth G05 ODP travel team and some more in the pool.
Not a biggie, I think it is a power play against ECNL for going U13.
Cheaper to dual band rather than create a new band and get the same results.

But if I were a money grubbing schemer trying to pick the pockets of parents,
I would have more clear answer. I apologize. Sincerely.


----------



## Chris Knight

Gokicksomegrass said:


> I think it was two 06' calsouth G05 ODP travel team and some more in the pool.
> Not a biggie, I think it is a power play against ECNL for going U13.
> Cheaper to dual band rather than create a new band and get the same results.
> 
> But if I were a money grubbing schemer trying to pick the pockets of parents,
> I would have more clear answer. I apologize. Sincerely.


Happened in the reverse in NTX/Frontier.  GDA announced the U13 group (solo age band this year) prior to ECNL creating theirs.  And with the addition of boys, it seems the ECNL are the reactive side.


----------



## Desert Hound

Chris Knight said:


> Happened in the reverse in NTX/Frontier.  GDA announced the U13 group (solo age band this year) prior to ECNL creating theirs.  And with the addition of boys, it seems the ECNL are the reactive side.


I think certainly ECNL is reacting with the addition of boys and the u13 group. They are trying to figure out the new landscape.

That said if DA is going to stay dual age band that really keeps ECNL alive and viable. 

Why? 

Well if according to ECNL 93% of their graduating class goes on to play in college and if that is correct then...
Since DA currently has dual age bands that means their graduating group each year is going to be roughly half (assuming the ages in each dual band is roughly 50-50) of what ECNL was producing with single age bands. As such colleges are still going to have to heavily recruit ECNL and other leagues in order to get the numbers they need. 

Correct?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Zen said:


> Thanks for sharing.  Feels like the borg is taking over by any means necessary.  I feel bad for all the players that will be negatively impacted by the churn.  These are kids who love the sport at the end of the day.  Yes, the ‘cream will rise’ regardless.  This new system is unnecessary...but I’m sure another fancy slideshow will be distributed next year ‘proving’ otherwise.  Sorry, not trying to shoot the messenger...just shaking my head at the direction and decisions.  Thx again for sharing!



I love the Borg reference as a Trekkie....


----------



## LadiesMan217

MakeAPlay said:


> I love the Borg reference as a Trekkie....


He wasn't a true trek fan because he said 'taken over' instead of 'assimilated'


----------



## 2kDad

Gokicksomegrass said:


> I think it was two 06' calsouth G05 ODP travel team and some more in the pool.
> Not a biggie, I think it is a power play against ECNL for going U13.
> Cheaper to dual band rather than create a new band and get the same results.
> 
> But if I were a money grubbing schemer trying to pick the pockets of parents,
> I would have more clear answer. I apologize. Sincerely.


5  '06's made the '05 ODP Regional team of 22,  3 got to travel to AZ & 2 were alternates.  I think it was Beach, Legends, & West Coast and they brought home the championship.


----------



## azsnowrider

Bananacorner said:


> Agreed, there are always exceptions, but just doesn't seem logical to create age bands at this age.  The 2005 teams could put those specific 2006 players on their 2005 DA team anyway, you don't need to create "bands" to do that.  This year there are several 2004 teams that have 1 or more 2005 players on them, which is fine for a select few that have the maturity and skill to play up at a young age.
> 
> Going across the years having Band, No Band, Band, Band doesn't make sense to me --I would think it will create this weird vacuum in the U15 year where they don't have enough players for the roster.


I agree with you, here in AZ we have a few girls playing up in age but they are the rare ones. There is no reason to create a Dual band at the 05/06 age, personally I think its to young as the majority of these kids have not matured and the commitment is to much at this age. Here DA practices 4-5 days a week and the field is a hike, so its a lot of windshield time. It impacts school and just them being kids, but the clubs prey on the parents. I still don't understand the single age band for just 04, in AZ our largest age group is the 03 and if any are single age band next year it should be the 03. It's single this current season but not next year so some current 03 kids may be left out.


----------



## Kicker4Life

azsnowrider said:


> I agree with you, here in AZ we have a few girls playing up in age but they are the rare ones. There is no reason to create a Dual band at the 05/06 age, personally I think its to young as the majority of these kids have not matured and the commitment is to much at this age. Here DA practices 4-5 days a week and the field is a hike, so its a lot of windshield time. It impacts school and just them being kids, but the clubs prey on the parents. I still don't understand the single age band for just 04, in AZ our largest age group is the 03 and if any are single age band next year it should be the 03. It's single this current season but not next year so some current 03 kids may be left out.


I’m going out on a limb, but I think having 5 DA teams would have out a large financial burden on the DA Clubs. 5 teams Training 4 nights a week creates time and space issues (DA teams are supposed to train at the same place on the same days). Also,  hosting 5 DA games on a given day creates a time issue doesn’t it?  4 x 90 Min games with 1o Min halftimes and 30 Min between each game, plus 1 additional 80 Min game with a 10 Min half runs over 10 hours.  

I am most likely just finding excuses for why they didn’t just add an ‘05 without Age Banding the ‘03’s.....but as it is with most things it could be the money. 

Still a bummer!!!!

Especially with no other real alternative that offers the exposure of GDA or ECNL north of the OC.....so, will ECNL recognize the void and add an LA Club or will US Soccer get more behind DPL in order to keep ECNL From gaining strength?  Maybe a good topic for another thread.


----------



## azsnowrider

Kicker4Life said:


> I’m going out on a limb, but I think having 5 DA teams would have out a large financial burden on the DA Clubs. 5 teams Training 4 nights a week creates time and space issues (DA teams are supposed to train at the same place on the same days). Also,  hosting 5 DA games on a given day creates a time issue doesn’t it?  4 x 90 Min games with 1o Min halftimes and 30 Min between each game, plus 1 additional 80 Min game with a 10 Min half runs over 10 hours.
> 
> I am most likely just finding excuses for why they didn’t just add an ‘05 without Age Banding the ‘03’s.....but as it is with most things it could be the money.
> 
> Still a bummer!!!!
> 
> Especially with no other real alternative that offers the exposure of GDA or ECNL north of the OC.....so, will ECNL recognize the void and add an LA Club or will US Soccer get more behind DPL in order to keep ECNL From gaining strength?  Maybe a good topic for another thread.


One thing I have learned is money is king in club soccer. But, your spot on about the fields and time. In AZ we have field issues as it is, and field rentals almost bankrupted one club. AZ DA games are mostly held in Casa Grande which is about 1.5 hours away for most of the families in DA, plus they are shared with the Barca Academy which always has something going on over the weekends. I'm still not sure about the DPL thing, here we see it as a marketing play, no knock on the kids at all but it's a state team that plays CA for about 8 games. Great for them as So Cal is our measuring stick, but we kind of get a chuckle when they tell everyone they are in the DA when they aren't.  But, they are kids so let them have fun with it.


----------



## Chris Knight

Desert Hound said:


> I think certainly ECNL is reacting with the addition of boys and the u13 group. They are trying to figure out the new landscape.
> 
> That said if DA is going to stay dual age band that really keeps ECNL alive and viable.
> 
> Why?
> 
> Well if according to ECNL 93% of their graduating class goes on to play in college and if that is correct then...
> Since DA currently has dual age bands that means their graduating group each year is going to be roughly half (assuming the ages in each dual band is roughly 50-50) of what ECNL was producing with single age bands. As such colleges are still going to have to heavily recruit ECNL and other leagues in order to get the numbers they need.
> 
> Correct?


Sure ...

If you assume that the age bands are 50-50 -- (closer to 20-80 from what I've seen this year),

_and_

that none of the kids participating in ECNL last year are participating in GDA now -- (Didn't 1/4-1/3 of those kids across the country migrate over this year?),

_and_

that the majority of the top talent hasn't already (and won't continue to) migrate from ECNL to GDA in those markets that have/had both -- (absolutely the case in NTX, SoCal and a many top clubs across the country)

Of course, they'll always have to recruit from ECNL and others but I'd bet you'll tend to see the majority a major D1s recruiting primarily from GDA in the very near future.


----------



## Desert Hound

Chris Knight said:


> Sure ...
> 
> If you assume that the age bands are 50-50 -- (closer to 20-80 from what I've seen this year),


So if this year..80% of the oldest team graduates. Next year are they light as currently 20% of those teams are the younger age? Or do suddenly in the very last year of DA you get a huge influx of kids not previously in the program? 

I am not saying my estimate of 50-50 is correct mind you. I think over time though the breakdowns start to stabilize though. 

And clearly most of the top kids have moved from ECNL to DA.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

And clearly most of the top kids have moved from ECNL to DA.[/QUOTE]

Almost all the top players will move to DA as the league becomes more established.  if you were a 2002 player, playing ECNL already being recruited, etc... why would you leave? But if you were a 2003 player and the process had not quite started yet, you probably leaned to DA but may have stuck with ECNL.  If you are a 2004 player and have both options available, you would almost certainly have chosen DA over ECNL.  So when the 2004's have reached their senior year in High School, IMO the DA will be the top tier and ECNL will be a step down.  

but who the hell knows, next year we may throw the whole thing on its head, and start over.  Maybe a new head of US Soccer, will get all these competing leagues on the same page?


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

If USSDA was trying to stick it to ECNL they just gave them a great lifeline by splitting the 03 age group. It's clear they have no idea what they are doing. Was clear from day one. All it does is spreads the talent across more clubs. If they want to build a real product Eliminate a 1/3rd of the clubs that have no business in the USSDA. Even those that give it away for free.


----------



## shales1002

@Sons of Pitches ...Or if 2004 becomes a dual age band ...that changes everything too.


----------



## El Macho

Sunil Illuminati said:


> If USSDA was trying to stick it to ECNL they just gave them a great lifeline by splitting the 03 age group. It's clear they have no idea what they are doing. Was clear from day one. All it does is spreads the talent across more clubs. If they want to build a real product Eliminate a 1/3rd of the clubs that have no business in the USSDA. Even those that give it away for free.


I agree but believe DA should not be given to any Club. DA should be its own entity seperated by regions. Its time US soccer gets serious and invests in youth development. If a Club has such a great coaching staff have the US hire them. Giving DA to individual Clubs is was not wise. If DA was seperated and not tied to any Club the pool of players would not be stained by Club politics.


----------



## MarkM

El Macho said:


> I agree but believe DA should not be given to any Club. DA should be its own entity seperated by regions. Its time US soccer gets serious and invests in youth development. If a Club has such a great coaching staff have the US hire them. Giving DA to individual Clubs is was not wise. If DA was seperated and not tied to any Club the pool of players would not be stained by Club politics.


Interesting idea El Macho - sounds like ODP on steroids.  IMO, the politics of US Soccer may be worse than Club politics.  At least with Clubs, you can move your kid to a better situation.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

El Macho said:


> I agree but believe DA should not be given to any Club. DA should be its own entity seperated by regions. Its time US soccer gets serious and invests in youth development. If a Club has such a great coaching staff have the US hire them. Giving DA to individual Clubs is was not wise. If DA was seperated and not tied to any Club the pool of players would not be stained by Club politics.


Sounds like you’re recreating the MLS and IMO that’s not a model to replicate. Clubs need autonomy to develop individuality and competition but it only really works if there is accountability and consequences to performance.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

It don't see listing the 06's with the 05's as any real change since the current 05's have been able to play up with the 04's already.   The real challenge is the 03's stepping from their own team into a dual age bracket.   The current U16/U17 group probably is made of between 10% and 30% 02's.  Those girls will still be on the team.  Then you have other 02's not playing DA who could not make the team when they were on the younger side of the bracket but will make it next year.   This leaves maybe 30% of the slots open for the 03's.  Where do the others go?  Is it better to step back to a B team for a year and stay with a club hoping to get back to the DA?  Or do you burn your bridges with that DA program by leaving the club for hopefully greener pastures?  This issue doesn't exist afterwards since almost all U19 are already in college.   The only thing I know for sure is it will be very chaotic and it will affect all leagues as 03's try to find their place.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

The "new system" continues to reward the "Older" more physically developed players. Sure their are some outliers, but it's essentially a process producing the same type of player the old system already delivered. Players who are losing ground to the rest of the World...but that's ok...because after failing at the next World Cup which we will...the USSF will blame the coaches in the Club System for not developing players in the Academy. You see how it works now?


----------



## smellycleats

MakeAPlay said:


> I love the Borg reference as a Trekkie....


Resistance is futile...


----------



## Lambchop

younothat said:


> At this point there is no girls combined age group for o5/06' in ussda.
> 
> These are the current planned age groups for 18-19':
> 
> U-14 (2005), U-15 (2004), U-16/17 (2002/2003), & U-18/19 (2000/2001) 4 total for the girls
> 
> Composite or combined age groups don't start until U16 boys or girls.
> 
> Some of the boys clubs advertised   U11/U12 as the start of the age bands this past season but boys da actually starts at U12 and the U11 bit was selective marketing, of course some played up but there is not a specific age  group U13 grop (06') for the girls just like no U11 for the boys.


Unless you are the favored nine clubs in the "Frontier Division".  Isn't politics wonderful?


----------



## Lambchop

Lambchop said:


> Unless you are the favored nine clubs in the "Frontier Division".  Isn't politics wonderful?


Make A Play,  how do you justify letting Frontier division have a single age band for 03's next year after all 78 clubs had it this year? Frontier division  is "piloting" it next year, seriously?  I am quite curious to hear your theory, I am not being sarcastic. I have listened to a lot of people who are all trying to figure this out, especially after the US soccer presentation last summer.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

All 78 clubs did not have a single age band for U16/U17 this year.  None of them had it.  There was a single age band for U15's this year.  03's are graduating up (as is all other ages) to the U16/17 age group.  The fact that they are testing one division of U16/17 as a U16 age group is something new in the structure.


----------



## ajaxahi

Seems like a lot of people are upset about the recent girls DA age group news.  With respect to those who are complaining, and as an outsider with no inside information, I just have a few thoughts/observations based on common sense.

1) Age groups for the current 17/18 season are 2004, 2003, 2001/02, 1999/2000.  Age groups for the upcoming 18/19 season are 2005(and a sprinkling of 06s), 2004, 2002/03, 2000/01.  The setup appears to be unchanged from last year, just with age groups moved up one year, so why are so many posters surprised?

2) As some have commented here, the approach girls DA is taking seems to be one of “funneling” players as they get older.  Casting a bigger net with the younger age groups and whittling down the talent as the players get older. Maybe I’m missing something, but this approach to identifying players seems totally logical to me. 

3) I have heard many people on and off this forum observe that the talent pool in girls DA is diluted this year, with only a handful of “elite”players (i.e. true USYNT pool prospects) on each team and many clubs offering spots to players people consider to be not part of Socal’s “elite” talent.  If this is true then combining age groups is an obvious way to address this and concentrate talent as players get older. 

4) Some attribute the watering down of player talent to girls DA admitting too many clubs into the program. To fix this issue they propose shrinking the number of girls DA clubs.  It seems to me that part of the reason DA chose to concentrate talent through dual age bands in the older years instead of admitting fewer clubs is so they can have a broader geographic reach, again with the goal of casting a broader net to identify talent. Fewer clubs means longer drives and maybe missing out on a few gems whose families couldn’t make it work.

5) Some are complaining about how the girls DA setup is messing with their college recruiting plans. It seems pretty obvious to me that your college recruiting plans are not the DA’s top priority. The truth is DA might not be the best fit for everyone’s player, but luckily if your player is good enough there seems to be plenty of other options to get exposure and get recruited.  

DA is obviously not for everyone. Do your homework, stop trying to “keep up with the Joneses,” and find the best situation/league/coach/group of players for your daughter so she can achieve her soccer dreams, whatever they might be.  Good luck to all of you and your players!


----------



## Desert Hound

Simisoccerfan said:


> All 78 clubs did not have a single age band for U16/U17 this year.  None of them had it.  There was a single age band for U15's this year.  03's are graduating up (as is all other ages) to the U16/17 age group.  The fact that they are testing one division of U16/17 as a U16 age group is something new in the structure.


Question is...what exactly are they testing? 

Also..what happens in the showcases? I guess they get hammered playing u16/17 teams.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

Desert Hound said:


> Question is...what exactly are they testing?
> 
> Also..what happens in the showcases? I guess they get hammered playing u16/17 teams.


I imagine in showcases they will take their best combined team 2002/03, just like every other club outside the Frontier League.  The 2003 age band will be for league play only.


----------



## Chris Knight

ajaxahi said:


> 1) Age groups for the current 17/18 season are 2004, 2003, 2001/02, 1999/2000.  Age groups for the upcoming 18/19 season are 2005(and a sprinkling of 06s), 2004, 2002/03, 2000/01.  The setup appears to be unchanged from last year, just with age groups moved up one year, so why are so many posters surprised?
> 
> 2) As some have commented here, the approach girls DA is taking seems to be one of “funneling” players as they get older.  Casting a bigger net with the younger age groups and whittling down the talent as the players get older. Maybe I’m missing something, but this approach to identifying players seems totally logical to me.


*
^ THANK YOU!!!*


----------



## Lambchop

Simisoccerfan said:


> All 78 clubs did not have a single age band for U16/U17 this year.  None of them had it.  There was a single age band for U15's this year.  03's are graduating up (as is all other ages) to the U16/17 age group.  The fact that they are testing one division of U16/17 as a U16 age group is something new in the structure.


You are correct, 78 clubs had single age bands for the 03's, now only 9 clubs in the Frontier division will have single age band for 03's, U16 going forward.


----------



## Lambchop

ajaxahi said:


> Seems like a lot of people are upset about the recent girls DA age group news.  With respect to those who are complaining, and as an outsider with no inside information, I just have a few thoughts/observations based on common sense.
> 
> 1) Age groups for the current 17/18 season are 2004, 2003, 2001/02, 1999/2000.  Age groups for the upcoming 18/19 season are 2005(and a sprinkling of 06s), 2004, 2002/03, 2000/01.  The setup appears to be unchanged from last year, just with age groups moved up one year, so why are so many posters surprised?
> 
> 2) As some have commented here, the approach girls DA is taking seems to be one of “funneling” players as they get older.  Casting a bigger net with the younger age groups and whittling down the talent as the players get older. Maybe I’m missing something, but this approach to identifying players seems totally logical to me.
> 
> 3) I have heard many people on and off this forum observe that the talent pool in girls DA is diluted this year, with only a handful of “elite”players (i.e. true USYNT pool prospects) on each team and many clubs offering spots to players people consider to be not part of Socal’s “elite” talent.  If this is true then combining age groups is an obvious way to address this and concentrate talent as players get older.
> 
> 4) Some attribute the watering down of player talent to girls DA admitting too many clubs into the program. To fix this issue they propose shrinking the number of girls DA clubs.  It seems to me that part of the reason DA chose to concentrate talent through dual age bands in the older years instead of admitting fewer clubs is so they can have a broader geographic reach, again with the goal of casting a broader net to identify talent. Fewer clubs means longer drives and maybe missing out on a few gems whose families couldn’t make it work.
> 
> 5) Some are complaining about how the girls DA setup is messing with their college recruiting plans. It seems pretty obvious to me that your college recruiting plans are not the DA’s top priority. The truth is DA might not be the best fit for everyone’s player, but luckily if your player is good enough there seems to be plenty of other options to get exposure and get recruited.
> 
> DA is obviously not for everyone. Do your homework, stop trying to “keep up with the Joneses,” and find the best situation/league/coach/group of players for your daughter so she can achieve her soccer dreas, whatever they might be.  Good luck to all of you and your players!


Agree with most of your post except, why do 03's continue with single age band in Frontier division if US soccer is funneling talent?  US soccer has always been able to identify talent, nothing new there.  You ask why so many people are surprised, well if you had been at the US soccer presentation on DA you wouldn't be wondering.  Well, end of discussion.


----------



## Fact

Lambchop said:


> Agree with most of your post except, why do 03's continue with single age band in Frontier division if US soccer is funneling talent?  US soccer has always been able to identify talent, nothing new there.  You ask why so many people are surprised, well if you had been at the US soccer presentation on DA you wouldn't be wondering.  Well, end of discussion.


Obviously despite Ajax's well thought out reply you still cannot accept the truth.  So here what you want.  US soccer's favorite Division is the Frontier Division because they bribe US Soccer.  Many of the US Soccer employees also have 03 dd's in the Frontier Division and many have buddies that coach in the Frontier Division. They want to make sure every other kid is screwed and gets second crack at colleges after the 03
Frontier girls are placed. So they lied to you to lure you away from ECNL where your dd would have gotten a lot of college offers.  You fell for it hard and they are glad you are suffering. Happy?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> You are correct, 78 clubs had single age bands for the 03's, now only 9 clubs in the Frontier division will have single age band for 03's, U16 going forward.


I'm sure you understand what "beta testing" is. Let it go.  US Soccer folks don't care about the individual ants on the farm.  They care about staying employed, making money, making the final sixteen of the World Cup on the senior men's side, winning World Cups and Olympics at the senior women's level and finally development.  In that order.

Sad but true so don't go getting your panties in a bunch.  Focus on your player.  Good luck to you and your daughter.


----------



## Lambchop

Fact said:


> Obviously despite Ajax's well thought out reply you still cannot accept the truth.  So here what you want.  US soccer's favorite Division is the Frontier Division because they bribe US Soccer.  Many of the US Soccer employees also have 03 dd's in the Frontier Division and many have buddies that coach in the Frontier Division. They want to make sure every other kid is screwed and gets second crack at colleges after the 03
> Frontier girls are placed. So they lied to you to lure you away from ECNL where your dd would have gotten a lot of college o ffers.  You fell for it hard and they are glad you are suffering. Happy?


Someone posted earlier that Frontier division had 11 players from their 9 clubs going to National camp and 
So. Cal had 4 from their 14 clubs in this age group, I guess more talent there, you may be more correct than you realize. You are right, players fell for the "development" agenda.


----------



## chiefs

Fact said:


> Obviously despite Ajax's well thought out reply you still cannot accept the truth.  So here what you want.  US soccer's favorite Division is the Frontier Division because they bribe US Soccer.  Many of the US Soccer employees also have 03 dd's in the Frontier Division and many have buddies that coach in the Frontier Division. They want to make sure every other kid is screwed and gets second crack at colleges after the 03
> Frontier girls are placed. So they lied to you to lure you away from ECNL where your dd would have gotten a lot of college offers.  You fell for it hard and they are glad you are suffering. Happy?


Thanks Facts for exposing more of the political hacks that is titled USSDA. You should see the NT training list; there some doozies there.  I guess with So Cal domination at the showcase was too much for US Soccer.


----------



## smellycleats

So can those who know help me out with something.?  Cal South has a roster unfreeze November/December.  Is there something similar for DA?  When can a player move from one DA team to another?  Please forgive me if this is been answered already.  I looked and could not find a discussion about this specifically.


----------



## 4DaLuvoftheGM

Im hearing chatter Southwest (possibly Northwest) conference may get u16 single age group like Frontier.  The uproar is being heard by USSF. Lets see how this plays out.


----------



## Lambchop

smellycleats said:


> So can those who know help me out with something.?  Cal South has a roster unfreeze November/December.  Is there something similar for DA?  When can a player move from one DA team to another?  Please forgive me if this is been answered already.  I looked and could not find a discussion about this specifically.


Season ends June 28 for girls I believe, boys a few days later.  DA girls are able to tryout for different clubs, teams etc. after that. Of course we all know the phone is ringing for months before this.


----------



## Real Deal

Lambchop said:


> For league standings it does count.  Since Burlingame has lost every single game, that is a win for all the teams that have played them, thus if the record is tied you look at goals for and against.  Simple eliminate  any game counting for league and all is righted. Tournament games don't count.


Interesting if you look on DA schedules, it has a Feb 10(future)  game Galaxy vs  Burlingame U14s listed as 3-0 Galaxy win.  If that was the compromise, shouldn't all the games then be 3-0?  Anyone know?  I don't care much but it is curious.


----------



## Lambchop

Real Deal said:


> Interesting if you look on DA schedules, it has a Feb 10(future)  game Galaxy vs  Burlingame U14s listed as 3-0 Galaxy win.  If that was the compromise, shouldn't all the games then be 3-0?  Anyone know?  I don't care much but it is curious.


Absolutely, but then we know it won't happen.  Gosh it would take goals away from the leaders.


----------



## Real Deal

Lambchop said:


> Absolutely, but then we know it won't happen.  Gosh it would take goals away from the leaders.


Speaking of goals for the leaders-- when is soccer, as a whole, gonna take PKs out as a "goal scored?"  Come on, that is mostly a gimme based on who the coach allows to take the PKs as most players can hit one.  I cracked up a couple days ago when Ronaldo had a "brace" in a game that was actually because he made 2 pks in one game.  I think that should be a different stat (uh, like maybe, "PKs scored"?).  Whomever takes the PKs gets some freebie goals.  As for kids, that could be like 5-6 extra freebie goals in a league season. It should at least get a ** or something so it is "noted" as a PK instead of an actual goal.


----------



## Trump4Pres

smellycleats said:


> So can those who know help me out with something.?  Cal South has a roster unfreeze November/December.  Is there something similar for DA?  When can a player move from one DA team to another?  Please forgive me if this is been answered already.  I looked and could not find a discussion about this specifically.


All DA clubs have an "add/transfer" window in which new players can be added and players can transfer from one DA club to another. You can also add DP players after October, I believe.


----------



## espola

Real Deal said:


> Speaking of goals for the leaders-- when is soccer, as a whole, gonna take PKs out as a "goal scored?"  Come on, that is mostly a gimme based on who the coach allows to take the PKs as most players can hit one.  I cracked up a couple days ago when Ronaldo had a "brace" in a game that was actually because he made 2 pks in one game.  I think that should be a different stat (uh, like maybe, "PKs scored"?).  Whomever takes the PKs gets some freebie goals.  As for kids, that could be like 5-6 extra freebie goals in a league season. It should at least get a ** or something so it is "noted" as a PK instead of an actual goal.


They are not freebies and they count the same as any other goal.  Many times in a player's career he will have scoring chances a lot easier than one-on-one from 12 yards, and those all count.  

However, in my opinion, balls that go in the net during the tiebreaker circus should not be counted as heavily as regular PK goals.  In fact, I would be in favor of eliminating the circus completely.


----------



## Justafan

Real Deal said:


> Speaking of goals for the leaders-- when is soccer, as a whole, gonna take PKs out as a "goal scored?"  Come on, that is mostly a gimme based on who the coach allows to take the PKs as most players can hit one.


While we’re at it, let’s take away the “clean sheet” when the GK is never meaningfully challenged.  They should have a stat like an error in baseball.  If you could have and should have had the save but you didn’t, then it’s an error. That would give a truer evaluation of a keeper based on how many actual shots they make a difference on.


----------



## Real Deal

espola said:


> They are not freebies and they count the same as any other goal.  Many times in a player's career he will have scoring chances a lot easier than one-on-one from 12 yards, and those all count.
> 
> However, in my opinion, balls that go in the net during the tiebreaker circus should not be counted as heavily as regular PK goals.  In fact, I would be in favor of eliminating the circus completely.


Aw come on.  Keeper is not allowed to come off his line during a pk so no way is a 1v1 as easy since the keeper can come out and challenge.  Any play where the shooter is moving, and the defenders and keeper can challenge, is harder than a PK.




Justafan said:


> While we’re at it, let’s take away the “clean sheet” when the GK is never meaningfully challenged.  They should have a stat like an error in baseball.  If you could have and should have had the save but you didn’t, then it’s an error. That would give a truer evaluation of a keeper based on how many actual shots they make a difference on.


"Error" is an interesting idea for a stat.  Soccer needs more stats in the USA as we need it to be a viable Fantasy Sport to truly be popular .

It's also not great that goals and saves are the only commonly noted stats here, and not assists, key passes (defined as either passes that start a goal or passes that the forward should've put in, but didn't), defensive tackles, or anything else.  A cherry-pickin forward can look pretty good on paper, even if it's the mids and D doing all the work.  Europe is fixing that and adding stat categories.  We need that too.  We  stats!


----------



## espola

Real Deal said:


> Aw come on.  Keeper is not allowed to come off his line during a pk so no way is a 1v1 as easy since the keeper can come out and challenge.  Any play where the shooter is moving, and the defenders and keeper can challenge, is harder than a PK.


Keeper knows where the shot is coming from, and the shooter is allowed only oine shot. If the shooter had the ball in the same situation in live play he would be an idiot not to try a feint or dribble in closer.


----------



## smellycleats

Trump4Pres said:


> All DA clubs have an "add/transfer" window in which new players can be added and players can transfer from one DA club to another. You can also add DP players after October, I believe.


MAP-you rated this poster as dumb. Is this info not correct?


----------



## MakeAPlay

smellycleats said:


> MAP-you rated this poster as dumb. Is this info not correct?


I don't know about the info but I'm not big on the screen name.


----------



## 4DaLuvoftheGM

I see there isn't no real talk about DA season ending June 30th then a week later the start of Semifinals and Finals, location TBA. Please, please let it stay in Cali.... Who has that extra cash laying around to books flights less than a week out, let's say to New Jersey, if championships are held there.


----------



## outside!

Many of the U18/19 teams will have disbanded by June 30th as the players go off to college.


----------



## 4DaLuvoftheGM

outside! said:


> Many of the U18/19 teams will have disbanded by June 30th as the players go off to college.


Championship if for U15 and U16/17 only


----------



## Trump4Pres

Trump4Pres said:


> All DA clubs have an "add/transfer" window in which new players can be added and players can transfer from one DA club to another. You can also add DP players after October, I believe.


It's correct - Players can transfer between clubs until April-ish. Even if the club the player is leaving from objects, US Soccer will still transfer them but they have to sit for three games and cannot play vs their old club for the rest of the season. The rule is something like that, from memory last time I looked it up.


----------



## Lambchop

4DaLuvoftheGM said:


> I see there isn't no real talk about DA season ending June 30th then a week later the start of Semifinals and Finals, location TBA. Please, please let it stay in Cali.... Who has that extra cash laying around to books flights less than a week out, let's say to New Jersey, if championships are held there.


Agree, playoffs are to be in San Diego.


----------



## tugs

Playoffs, yes, but dunno where semis/finals will be.  Am unfamiliar with boys side of DA; does the US soccer foot bill for players to travel for final 4?


----------



## Lambchop

tugs said:


> Playoffs, yes, but dunno where semis/finals will be.  Am unfamiliar with boys side of DA; does the US soccer foot bill for players to travel for final 4?


All games to be in San Diego. Maybe clubs foot the bill not sure.


----------



## Fact

tugs said:


> Playoffs, yes, but dunno where semis/finals will be.  Am unfamiliar with boys side of DA; does the US soccer foot bill for players to travel for final 4?


Like u can't afford it??


----------



## 4DaLuvoftheGM

They problem I see should playoff teams book hotels in advance for three weeks if Semis and Finals in San Diego?
32 teams are placed in 8 group of 4
3 group games played:
June 23rd, 25th & 27th -  Pool play
June 29th -  Quarterfinal (Group winners)
July 6-13th - Semi and Finals (Location TBA)


----------



## LadiesMan217

Lambchop said:


> Agree, playoffs are to be in San Diego.


Next year too. Multi-year deal. Oceanside CA


----------



## Desert Hound

LadiesMan217 said:


> Next year too. Multi-year deal. Oceanside CA


Clearly over time...playoffs have to be held all around the country. There are lots of teams in TX or on the East Coast. Personally I prefer CA...but realistically the rest of the clubs will demand it gets spread around in terms of location.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Don't agree.  We already go to Florida in the Fall and North Carolina in the Spring.  Maybe those events will change sites but the San Diego contract is for the next 5 years.


----------



## younothat

This might be the first or only year where Pool Play, Quarters, Semi- & Finals might be at one location over two weeks.

Stubhub center has been used a bunch in the past either for Pool Play, Quarters, or Semi's.     Sometimes there has been three different locations over three weeks.  Last year we went to:
Wk1: Indiana, Grand Park for the Pool Play   
Wk2: Various States for the Quarters (Home teams fields;  Atlanta United,    Toyota Soccer Center Tx, etc )
Wk3: Semi's / Finals: Stub Hub center.

All this didn't finish until Mid July last year for example.

All clubs are responsible for their own travel expenses;  ussda does provide scholarship funds for travel on a individual basis based on economic needs at the start of the year  but those go back to the club so unless your a fully funded club that covers travel or received a sponsorship  accept to pay for travel.  Even the scholarship funds may not be enough to cover the amt of trips needs. 
_


_


----------



## Chris Knight

Simisoccerfan said:


> Don't agree.  We already go to Florida in the Fall and North Carolina in the Spring.  Maybe those events will change sites but the San Diego contract is for the next 5 years.


And?  ...  So do the teams from the Northwest, Midwest, CO and TX.  That agreement is for the Summer Showcase/early playoff rounds isn't it?  

And I thought the announcement referred to the agreement as "multi year" -- Could be wrong but five years sounds like a stretch.


----------



## Soccer

Chris Knight said:


> And?  ...  So do the teams from the Northwest, Midwest, CO and TX.  That agreement is for the Summer Showcase/early playoff rounds isn't it?
> 
> And I thought the announcement referred to the agreement as "multi year" -- Could be wrong but five years sounds like a stretch.


It is for early round playoffs/ Showcase not the July Semi and Final.

The July venue is TBD.  But US Soccer covers the cost of the final 4 teams to the TBD venue.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

To my understanding the agreement says Playoffs.  To me that means the whole thing. I don’t see anywhere that indicates that the end of the playoffs may be elsewhere.


----------



## Soccer

Simisoccerfan said:


> To my understanding the agreement says Playoffs.  To me that means the whole thing. I don’t see anywhere that indicates that the end of the playoffs may be elsewhere.


You know what they say when you assume:
https://m.box.com/shared_item/https://ussoccer.box.com/s/mzlyw0ld7v1c0wkbojo8o7m5bfy54c69

Go to U15 and U16/17 playoffs.  Semi and Final location TBD.

They said they will announce this in March.  But for sure it will not be Stub Hub like in years past for the boys.

So your understanding is not correct.


----------



## Striker17

Thank you for the link- great stuff


----------



## Simisoccerfan

No need to be a *ick about it.  You had access to information that I did not have and was not posted on the USSDA website (or I could not find it).  You could have just said there is additional information not generally available and shared it.  I know what part of assUme applies here.


----------



## GoWest

Does anyone know when US Soccer will announce the new GDA clubs, if any? I had heard February but can't confirm.


----------



## Desert Hound

GoWest said:


> Does anyone know when US Soccer will announce the new GDA clubs, if any? I had heard February but can't confirm.


That is the last I heard as well. Something along the lines decisions will be made in Feb and clubs have until March to accept.


----------



## Desert Hound

*http://www.ussoccerda.com/overview-join-the-academy

Application Timeline:*

October 11, 2017 - Application Opens
December 3, 2017 - Final Day to Submit Applications
February 2018 - Application Decisions Announced
February/March 2018 - New Clubs Confirm Participation
September 1, 2018 - Start of the 2018-19 Academy Season


----------



## GoWest

Desert Hound said:


> That is the last I heard as well. Something along the lines decisions will be made in Feb and clubs have until March to accept.


Thanks for the information.


----------



## sophia joseph

Hello

Real Colorado serves as a standard-bearer in the inaugural season of the Girls' Development Academy.

____________________________
Best Cheap Assignment Help in Australia


----------



## Chris Knight

sophia joseph said:


> Hello
> 
> Real Colorado serves as a standard-bearer in the inaugural season of the Girls' Development Academy.
> 
> ____________________________
> Best Cheap Assignment Help in Australia


Hello

Hmmm ... Can you define "standard-bearer" for us?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Interesting opinion by Anson Dorrance.

http://equalizersoccer.com/2018/02/17/anson-dorrance-girls-development-academy-and-ecnl-need-to-work-together/


----------



## espola

MakeAPlay said:


> Interesting opinion by Anson Dorrance.
> 
> http://equalizersoccer.com/2018/02/17/anson-dorrance-girls-development-academy-and-ecnl-need-to-work-together/


Good quote --

"Please don’t try and pretend because 70 percent of the players on a youth national team are from the DA, you’re developing them,” he told Soccer America. “You and I both know they ripped these kids off from ECNL teams.”


----------



## outside!

espola said:


> Good quote --
> 
> "Please don’t try and pretend because 70 percent of the players on a youth national team are from the DA, you’re developing them,” he told Soccer America. “You and I both know they ripped these kids off from ECNL teams.”


And who did the ECNL teams rip them off from? ECNL had some good ideas, but being a closed league that gave a monopoly to the guys in track suits was not one of them. Unfortunately, DA followed the same model.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> And who did the ECNL teams rip them off from? ECNL had some good ideas, but being a closed league that gave a monopoly to the guys in track suits was not one of them. Unfortunately, DA followed the same model.


i would think that US Soccer would be above that and actually be trying to improve the state of soccer in America.  Clearly US Soccer is a money making organization.  What would you think if the US military's primary goal was to make money (sell tech to other countries) other than defending America?  They need to stick to the Prime Directive....


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> i would think that US Soccer would be above that and actually be trying to improve the state of soccer in America.  Clearly US Soccer is a money making organization.  What would you think if the US military's primary goal was to make money (sell tech to other countries) other than defending America?  They need to stick to the Prime Directive....


I am not following your analogy. I am pretty certain ECNL was set up to make money as well. ECNL and GDA have more in common than not and should be combined. There should also be a way for good coaches with good teams to earn a spot. Some of the best coaches I know of are not at ECNL or DA clubs. The primary goal of US Soccer should be to increase the popularity of the sport. All the other goals will follow from that.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> I am not following your analogy. I am pretty certain ECNL was set up to make money as well. ECNL and GDA have more in common than not and should be combined. There should also be a way for good coaches with good teams to earn a spot. Some of the best coaches I know of are not at ECNL or DA clubs. The primary goal of US Soccer should be to increase the popularity of the sport. All the other goals will follow from that.


ECNL is not US Soccer.  US Soccer's mission should be to advance Soccer in America not make a profit.  Answer these questions for me.  Why does US Soccer have a $150 million dollar war chest yet they need to get into the for profit youth soccer business?  Why didn't they use $5 million of that surplus to save the Boston Breakers NWSL team?  Why isn't the money that they allocated to the NWSL given to each team instead of specific national team players?  Within the answers to those questions are an understanding of why US Soccer (SUM Marketing) don't care about developing soccer in the US.  They care about promoting the MLS due to their ownership stake in it and the revenue generated by it.  That is the connection...

@outside! you have to think bigger.


----------



## Nutmeg

The hypocrisy of some in the women’s soccer game is beyond funny. So Dorrance speaks out against a system that he benefits from and more to the point uses to his advantage better than most coaches. If he was so offended by US Soccer listing DA players in their call ups maybe he shouldn’t recruit them. Or maybe don’t recruit a 12 year old while your at it. But no one asked him that question. US Soccer is a machine designed to make money through marketing, merchandise, tv rights, etc. It’s main vehicles for that on the men’s side is the MLS. Onthe Women’s side it is the National Team. NWSL is a joke. 2 or 3 allocates players make any money at all and the rest are living in poverty. 3 NWSL teams have folded in 2 seasons, no one cares. Especially US Soccer. Is Dorrance commenting on that? Nope. Why? Because he benefited from it. Getting the NC Courage in his backyard. And yet no one cares.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

Spot on MAP!!!  Look at the difference between the English Football Association mission statement and the closest thing I could find to a mission statement on the US Soccer Federation website - 

https://www.ussoccer.com/about/about-us-soccer
http://www.thefa.com/about-football-association/what-we-do/strategy

The "About" US soccer page reads like a press release from a marketing company trying to sell TV rights, with an oh by the way, we are trying to train better coaches.  The conflict of interest between MLS/SUM/USSF is so glaring you gotta wear shades!   

The Football Assocation page has clearly defined goals, measurable goals, accountability to reach those goals.  The English women's team will be better than the US team in 2023.  I doubt our US women's team will be top 5 in 2023.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

Spot on MAP!!!  Look at the difference between the English Football Association mission statement and the closest thing I could find to a mission statement on the US Soccer Federation website - 

https://www.ussoccer.com/about/about-us-soccer
http://www.thefa.com/about-football-association/what-we-do/strategy

The "About" US soccer page reads like a press release from a marketing company trying to sell TV rights, with an oh by the way, we are trying to train better coaches.  The conflict of interest between MLS/SUM/USSF is so glaring you gotta wear shades!   

The Football Assocation page has clearly defined goals, measurable goals, accountability to reach those goals.  The English women's team will be better than the US team in 2023.  I doubt our US women's team will be top 5 in 2023.


----------



## outside!

I would like to see Dorrance speak out against the NCAA rules that prevent colleges from playing the international game. These are the same rules that will lead to college soccer becoming irrelevant for producing world players in the future, since the best players will skip college. This is already happening and is just the tip of the iceberg. High school sports which are basically run by a bunch of old football, basketball and baseball AD's, has already made itself irrelevant for soccer. The NCAA (which is also basically run by a bunch of old football, basketball and baseball guys) won't learn that lesson in time.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Does anyone really disagree that if we could go back in time and negotiate the rift between US Soccer and ECNL in that there would only be one league “Closed League” right now that we would collectively be in a better place?


----------



## Real Deal

Kicker4Life said:


> Does anyone really disagree that if we could go back in time and negotiate the rift between US Soccer and ECNL in that there would only be one league “Closed League” right now that we would collectively be in a better place?


That kind of depends on the geographical locations of the closed league clubs and, of course, the politics involved with choosing which clubs got into the closed league.  As it stands, there are either ECNL or DA options for players in more geographic areas.  Should they be consolidated?  Probably.  But who is to do the choosing?  The politics of ECNL, and their reluctance to include worthy clubs in order to maintain their ability to poach players from them, created this problem.

That is why it may be a bit ironic to imply that US Soccer GDA poached players from ECNL.


----------



## outside!

I believe that closed leagues are not good for youth sports.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sons of Pitches said:


> Spot on MAP!!!  Look at the difference between the English Football Association mission statement and the closest thing I could find to a mission statement on the US Soccer Federation website -
> 
> https://www.ussoccer.com/about/about-us-soccer
> http://www.thefa.com/about-football-association/what-we-do/strategy
> 
> The "About" US soccer page reads like a press release from a marketing company trying to sell TV rights, with an oh by the way, we are trying to train better coaches.  The conflict of interest between MLS/SUM/USSF is so glaring you gotta wear shades!
> 
> The Football Assocation page has clearly defined goals, measurable goals, accountability to reach those goals.  The English women's team will be better than the US team in 2023.  I doubt our US women's team will be top 5 in 2023.


That is such a contrast in Mission Statements that it is sickening!!  Thank you for pointing it out.  I love how the FA has a clear mission to grow the women's side of the game.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Real Deal said:


> That kind of depends on the geographical locations of the closed league clubs and, of course, the politics involved with choosing which clubs got into the closed league.  As it stands, there are either ECNL or DA options for players in more geographic areas.  Should they be consolidated?  Probably.  But who is to do the choosing?  The politics of ECNL, and their reluctance to include worthy clubs in order to maintain their ability to poach players from them, created this problem.
> 
> That is why it may be a bit ironic to imply that US Soccer GDA poached players from ECNL.



The clubs that were neglected by ECNL initially either didn't apply or had no national track record at the time and that is a fact.  The Legends, Beaches and Carlsbad Elite's of the world benefited from the ECNL teams no longer competing in USYS events.  If the ECNL clubs had never pulled out those 3 SOCAL clubs would have never won anything.  Sorry to share that with you....


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> I believe that closed leagues are not good for youth sports.


I believe that profit motives are not good for youth sports.


----------



## mbeach

MakeAPlay said:


> ... If the ECNL clubs had never pulled out those 3 SOCAL clubs would have never won anything.  Sorry to share that with you....


Not really, that is just your guess. What I know as fact is that Beach teams where my girls have played did win Surf Cup and CRL, competing against the best teams of ECNL clubs. Furthermore one simply needs to see  where Legends and Beach teams are in the DA standings now. It is very simple, as recent as a few years ago the ECNL clubs of SoCal did not accept these clubs because they wanted to keep their monopoly, forcing parents like me to drive at least 2 hours every day to go practice. Thank god that is not the case anymore.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> The clubs that were neglected by ECNL initially either didn't apply or had no national track record at the time and that is a fact.  The Legends, Beaches and Carlsbad Elite's of the world benefited from the ECNL teams no longer competing in USYS events.  If the ECNL clubs had never pulled out those 3 SOCAL clubs would have never won anything.  Sorry to share that with you....


Sorry, but that is not entirely true. Carlsbad Elite's 99's beat Surf's 99's every time they played, including at Surf Cup. In the Surf Cup finals, Carlsbad lost to West Coast in PK's. Are you going to try to say those ECNL teams weren't really trying at Surf Cup?

ECNL spent too much time making sure Surf kept it's ECNL monopoly and it cost them the market. It doesn't matter now as it is in the past. The adults at ECNL and GDA need to kiss and make up for the good of the players. They need to also find a way to open the league to outside challengers.


----------



## push_up

MakeAPlay said:


> I believe that profit motives are not good for youth sports.


You are dumb.  There is nothing wrong with earning/making money.


----------



## Real Deal

mbeach said:


> Not really, that is just your guess. What I know as fact is that Beach teams where my girls have played did win Surf Cup and CRL, competing against the best teams of ECNL clubs. Furthermore one simply needs to see  where Legends and Beach teams are in the DA standings now. It is very simple, as recent as a few years ago the ECNL clubs of SoCal did not accept these clubs because they wanted to keep their monopoly, forcing parents like me to drive at least 2 hours every day to go practice. Thank god that is not the case anymore.


Yes clubs like those and Carlsbad also fought, successfully, to get their girls recruited to top schools, and with some presence on YNTs without the benefit of ECNL, and that is a testament to their coaching and commitment. ECNL should've taken that into account.

No knock on anyone here.  It's all good, plus water under the bridge.  The new crop of players are starting to stay home-- hence the standings.  So what's wrong with a little more good competition?


----------



## mbeach

Real Deal said:


> Yes clubs like those and Carlsbad also fought, successfully, to get their girls recruited to top schools, and with some presence on YNTs without the benefit of ECNL, and that is a testament to their coaching and commitment. ECNL should've taken that into account.
> 
> They also lost a ton of players, whom they had developed, to those same ECNL clubs. The new crop of players are starting to stay home-- hence the standings.
> 
> No knock on anyone here.  It's all good.  But what's wrong with a little more good competition?


Very true. 
And compare the argument in your first paragraph with the twisted argument that those clubs were better because they were prevented from participating in the top league ... Ridiculous


----------



## Trump4Pres

outside! said:


> Sorry, but that is not entirely true. Carlsbad Elite's 99's beat Surf's 99's every time they played, including at Surf Cup. In the Surf Cup finals, Carlsbad lost to West Coast in PK's. Are you going to try to say those ECNL teams weren't really trying at Surf Cup?


I'm all for open competition, but it's pretty well known that a few years ago before the DA, the top ECNL programs rolled right from National Finals into Surf Cup and most used Surf Cup to get minutes for the kids who didn't get them at ECNL Championships. Not saying the kids weren't playing to win, but I believe that Surf team just won the ECNL Finals the week before. 2014?


----------



## outside!

Trump4Pres said:


> I'm all for open competition, but it's pretty well known that a few years ago before the DA, the top ECNL programs rolled right from National Finals into Surf Cup and most used Surf Cup to get minutes for the kids who didn't get them at ECNL Championships. Not saying the kids weren't playing to win, but I believe that Surf team just won the ECNL Finals the week before. 2014?


I am sure that the players that needed minutes got lots of play leading up to the semi-finals. But are you trying to tell me that Surf did not play their starters in a semi-final game at their own "Best of the Best" tournament or that West Coast did not play their starters in the Finals? That just is not believable. Besides, I was there and am familiar with Surf's players. They were playing the starters including BC on offense, CW on defense. The board member's daughter was probably also in goal. Thank you however for reminding me that Carlsbad Elite 99's beat the ECNL National Champs in their own semi-final in 2014 by 2-0.


----------



## MakeAPlay

mbeach said:


> Not really, that is just your guess. What I know as fact is that Beach teams where my girls have played did win Surf Cup and CRL, competing against the best teams of ECNL clubs. Furthermore one simply needs to see  where Legends and Beach teams are in the DA standings now. It is very simple, as recent as a few years ago the ECNL clubs of SoCal did not accept these clubs because they wanted to keep their monopoly, forcing parents like me to drive at least 2 hours every day to go practice. Thank god that is not the case anymore.


Did Beach ever win Surf Cup, National Cup or CSL League Cup prior to the ECNL teams departing?  I already know the answer...  I was there.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> Sorry, but that is not entirely true. Carlsbad Elite's 99's beat Surf's 99's every time they played, including at Surf Cup. In the Surf Cup finals, Carlsbad lost to West Coast in PK's. Are you going to try to say those ECNL teams weren't really trying at Surf Cup?
> 
> ECNL spent too much time making sure Surf kept it's ECNL monopoly and it cost them the market. It doesn't matter now as it is in the past. The adults at ECNL and GDA need to kiss and make up for the good of the players. They need to also find a way to open the league to outside challengers.


Surf 99's?  Do you realize that the 99's were U9 at the time of the split?  You might not understand what I am saying.  Please look at the National Cup, National League and USYS National Championship results PRIOR to 2009 when the split happened.  You had a ULittle at the time that might not even have been playing club....


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> I am sure that the players that needed minutes got lots of play leading up to the semi-finals. But are you trying to tell me that Surf did not play their starters in a semi-final game at their own "Best of the Best" tournament or that West Coast did not play their starters in the Finals? That just is not believable. Besides, I was there and am familiar with Surf's players. They were playing the starters including BC on offense, CW on defense. The board member's daughter was probably also in goal. Thank you however for reminding me that Carlsbad Elite 99's beat the ECNL National Champs in their own semi-final in 2014 by 2-0.


My player her last year of club played for Surf and has played in Surf Cup on 4 different occasions and there are entire games that she sat out during Surf Cup due to them trying to get the uncommitted players seen.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> My player her last year of club played for Surf and has played in Surf Cup on 4 different occasions and there are entire games that she sat out during Surf Cup due to them trying to get the uncommitted players seen.


My player played at Surf for about 1 1/2 years, so perhaps I was more familiar with the club than you? As I said before, you know your DD's age group, I know my DD's age group. I know who was on the field. What happened in 2009 has no bearing on this particular game other than the fact that is when the ECNL split happened. Not all the best 99 players in the county played at Surf, and some left (do we need to bring up all the coaching issues the 99 Surf team had?). For the 2014 Surf Cup, most of the '99 players were between 8th and 9th grade. There were very few if any college coaches at that game and probably no committed players on either team. The '99 Surf team was a great team, but they were not the best '99 team in San Diego county.


----------



## mbeach

MakeAPlay said:


> Did Beach ever win Surf Cup, National Cup or CSL League Cup prior to the ECNL teams departing?  I already know the answer...  I was there.


It would have been difficult to win those at that time (or 200 years earlier for that matter) because Beach probably did not exist, or was a couple of years old. But clubs were later added all over the country, so one has to wonder why Beach, Legends, Carlsbad etc. were not included. It is a 3-4 drive between Real So Cal and Irvine in the afternoon, and an area with several million people.  Obviously the existing ECNL clubs in SoCal wanted to keep their monopoly.
Your argument that these clubs became good because they were not included in the ECNL league is ridiculous. That became good despite the unfair competition by ECNL clubs (that poached many of their top players) is short of a miracle (well, coaching and parents refusing to do the long drive). We'll have to wait to see what happens with the current level playing field, the first year has been good this far.


----------



## Trump4Pres

outside! said:


> I am sure that the players that needed minutes got lots of play leading up to the semi-finals. But are you trying to tell me that Surf did not play their starters in a semi-final game at their own "Best of the Best" tournament or that West Coast did not play their starters in the Finals? That just is not believable. Besides, I was there and am familiar with Surf's players. They were playing the starters including BC on offense, CW on defense. The board member's daughter was probably also in goal. Thank you however for reminding me that Carlsbad Elite 99's beat the ECNL National Champs in their own semi-final in 2014 by 2-0.


No, Surf probably didn't play their starters. West Coast for sure didn't, because my daughter was one of the ones who started that game but wasn't a starter in the regular season. It all worked out because she connected with her eventual college coach that weekend. Not to take anything away from that team in 2014, they were definitely good!


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> My player played at Surf for about 1 1/2 years, so perhaps I was more familiar with the club than you? As I said before, you know your DD's age group, I know my DD's age group. I know who was on the field. What happened in 2009 has no bearing on this particular game other than the fact that is when the ECNL split happened. Not all the best 99 players in the county played at Surf, and some left (do we need to bring up all the coaching issues the 99 Surf team had?). For the 2014 Surf Cup, most of the '99 players were between 8th and 9th grade. There were very few if any college coaches at that game and probably no committed players on either team. The '99 Surf team was a great team, but they were not the best '99 team in San Diego county.


You keep bringing up one specific team that are seniors this year.  

Lets try this again.  PRIOR to the ECNL teams choosing to no longer compete in National Cup the Legends, Beaches and Carlsbad Elites won no major titles (National Cup, Surf Cup, USYS National championship.  Is that clear enough?  They may have won AFTER the split but none won prior. Get it?


----------



## Lambchop

outside! said:


> I am sure that the players that needed minutes got lots of play leading up to the semi-finals. But are you trying to tell me that Surf did not play their starters in a semi-final game at their own "Best of the Best" tournament or that West Coast did not play their starters in the Finals? That just is not believable. Besides, I was there and am familiar with Surf's players. They were playing the starters including BC on offense, CW on defense. The board member's daughter was probably also in goal. Thank you however for reminding me that Carlsbad Elite 99's beat the ECNL National Champs in their own semi-final in 2014 by 2-0.


It's a game. Colleges recruit players not teams.


----------



## outside!

Trump4Pres said:


> No, Surf probably didn't play their starters. West Coast for sure didn't, because my daughter was one of the ones who started that game but wasn't a starter in the regular season. It all worked out because she connected with her eventual college coach that weekend. Not to take anything away from that team in 2014, they were definitely good!


Fair enough, I am not and was not familiar with West Coast players. I did know the Surf roster. They played their starters in the semi-final. One thing you may not know. On the Friday evening before Surf Cup, Carlsbad had a college ID camp and ran the girls for more than 2 hours. It was stupid and all the parents disagreed with it, but non-ECNL clubs had to be creative back then to get exposure for the players. By the final, Carlsbad was pretty wobbly on their pins. The mere fact that a local, non-ECNL team made it to the finals of Surf Cup proves that the Surf/ECNL monopoly of San Diego County was not working out. The same thing will happen (and probably is happening) with non-GDA, non-ECNL teams somewhere in the country. There will be or already are teams that can compete at the highest level that are not included. There are enough high quality teams in SoCal that the need to travel out of SoCal should be minimized (not eliminated, just minimized).


----------



## MakeAPlay

mbeach said:


> It would have been difficult to win those at that time (or 200 years earlier for that matter) because Beach probably did not exist, or was a couple of years old. But clubs were later added all over the country, so one has to wonder why Beach, Legends, Carlsbad etc. were not included. It is a 3-4 drive between Real So Cal and Irvine in the afternoon, and an area with several million people.  Obviously the existing ECNL clubs in SoCal wanted to keep their monopoly.
> Your argument that these clubs became good because they were not included in the ECNL league is ridiculous. That became good despite the unfair competition by ECNL clubs (that poached many of their top players) is short of a miracle (well, coaching and parents refusing to do the long drive). We'll have to wait to see what happens with the current level playing field, the first year has been good this far.


I didn't say those clubs became good because quite honestly they are only okay.  What I implied was that once all the big dogs were no longer competing the "other" clubs had a chance to win due to significantly weaker competition.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> You keep bringing up one specific team that are seniors this year.
> 
> Lets try this again.  PRIOR to the ECNL teams choosing to no longer compete in National Cup the Legends, Beaches and Carlsbad Elites won no major titles (National Cup, Surf Cup, USYS National championship.  Is that clear enough?  They may have won AFTER the split but none won prior. Get it?


Yes, I get it. But after the split, Surf still did not have all the best players in the county. That is the problem with monopolies. Get it? Things change and ECNL was blind to the changes (or more likely bought and payed for by the SoCal clubs that were ECNL). Since club soccer is so expensive, we still do not have all the best players at the elite level. That is why it is a shame that high school is becoming meaningless for elite players, and college soccer will be within 20 years simply because a bunch of old guys want to protect their fiefdom.


----------



## mbeach

MakeAPlay said:


> I didn't say those clubs became good because quite honestly they are only okay.  .


Again, just your opinion which happens to be at odds with the DA standings. Let me see, which one should I trust ... Of course, I should trust the dinosaur. Freudian slip avatar?


----------



## MakeAPlay

mbeach said:


> Again, just your opinion which happens to be at odds with the DA standings. Let me see, which one should I trust ... Of course, I should trust the dinosaur. Freudian slip avatar?


Again my opinion just like it is your opinion that they are good.  And yes I am a dinosaur apparently because I didn't trust a club to develop my player and it seems to have worked out.  I hope that your club loyalty works out for your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> Yes, I get it. But after the split, Surf still did not have all the best players in the county. That is the problem with monopolies. Get it? Things change and ECNL was blind to the changes (or more likely bought and payed for by the SoCal clubs that were ECNL). Since club soccer is so expensive, we still do not have all the best players at the elite level. That is why it is a shame that high school is becoming meaningless for elite players, and college soccer will be within 20 years simply because a bunch of old guys want to protect their fiefdom.


I never said that Surf ever had all of the best players in the county because that has never been the case.  Carlsbad, Sam Diego United, PQ Premier, FC San Diego, Albion and plenty of Orange County clubs have poached great players from San Diego County that for one reason or another did not want to play for Surf.  I am all for free elite soccer for all but let's be realistic.  We can't even get health care for all what are the chances of getting anything for a sport that quite honestly is a country club sport for girls.


----------



## futboldad1

mbeach said:


> We'll have to wait to see what happens with the current level playing field, the first year has been good this far.


How is it "currently a level playing field"? It seems DA is a closed league that gives huge benefit to clubs like Beach over clubs such as Oceanside or Rebels who don't have it.


----------



## outside!

futboldad1 said:


> How is it "currently a level playing field"? It seems DA is a closed league that gives huge benefit to clubs like Beach over clubs such as Oceanside or Rebels who don't have it.


While I agree with your post, I believe mbeach was referring to the fact that the top teams at the historic ECNL clubs and the new GDA but non-ECNL clubs are playing in the same league this year for the first time since 2009. Apparently that is the only way to actually win a meaningful game since before this year ECNL teams never played their best when playing against the hoi polloi.


----------



## RiverRat

futboldad1 said:


> How is it "currently a level playing field"? It seems DA is a closed league that gives huge benefit to clubs like Beach over clubs such as Oceanside or Rebels who don't have it.


da is a closed league?? did ecnl ever boot out a club in ca, even before the first full season was over?


----------



## mbeach

futboldad1 said:


> How is it "currently a level playing field"? It seems DA is a closed league that gives huge benefit to clubs like Beach over clubs such as Oceanside or Rebels who don't have it.


Your club can apply to DA, and if it meet the requirements it should be accepted.


----------



## Nutmeg

mbeach said:


> Your club can apply to DA, and if it meet the requirements it should be accepted.


OK! Sure


----------



## C.A.M.

Nutmeg said:


> OK! Sure


The requirements are made clear.  They do not seem easy to meet though.  One thing is proximity to other clubs according to the talent pool.  SoCal has 9 in a 150 mile radius.  No other region in the country has half that many teams close to each other.  They are traveling hundreds of miles to play weekly.

San Diego county already has Surf, Galaxy SD and Albion.  Where do clubs like Rebels and Carlsbad fit in for what the DA is pushing? I'll elaborate a bit so I don't come off condescending or insulting.

The main difference between DA and any other league is the sub rule.  The rule is once subbed there is no re-entry.  5 subs are allowed. This means a max of 16 girls play, but no subs have to be made.  On a 18 player roster 2 never play EVERY game. The only requirement is a player must start 25% of the total games the team plays.  There is no guideline to minutes so she can get pulled after 1 minute and it counts as a start. So once a player gets her mandatory 25% of starts, she can be set for very long stretches of non activity.  That is not appealing to anyone.  I have two kids in the DA and it is a constant discussion with the parents.

Without the shuffling in and out of players,  it's much harder to hide players who aren't up to par technically,  mentally or physically.  

What I'm saying is the DA really isn't made for big rosters if the focus is really development. I would say 18 because of injuries and players unable to show for whatever reason. Rosters of 24 are just absurd and in most cases the kids on the fringe aren't ready yet and will have trouble becoming ready with little to no playtime.

Add in the age banding, where the clubs usually go higher age heavy.  It seems as if US Soccer isn't concerned with developing the best talent at each age group and the talent pool dwindles further.  The 02s paid for it this season and the 03s will pay next season and so on.

Is there enough talent for Rebels and Carlsbad to compete in this environment? Real question because I don't know.

On another note, the Burlingame club is reeling.  It's hard to justify the travel costs, time away and overall energy when your teams are 0 and everything.  It's hard not to argue that ECNL or a similar setup isn't better for them. Let me be clear, they are well coached, but don't have the athletes to compete.  I saw them play a great style of soccer and their kids understood what they are doing.  The only teams I have seen hold their shape better are Beach and West Coast. They just can't physically hold their own.  Therefore,  they pay for nearly every mistake they make.

Now a club like IMG can afford to keep pushing because they are a private school setup and those attending are very well off.  They will simply adjust their recruiting tactics and infuse coaching and player talent if their Academy deems it worthy.  They started off just as poor in football and have made themselves into a national powerhouse quickly.


----------



## Lightning Red

C.A.M. said:


> The requirements are made clear.  They do not seem easy to meet though.  One thing is proximity to other clubs according to the talent pool.  SoCal has 9 in a 150 mile radius.  No other region in the country has half that many teams close to each other.  They are traveling hundreds of miles to play weekly.
> 
> San Diego county already has Surf, Galaxy SD and Albion.  Where do clubs like Rebels and Carlsbad fit in for what the DA is pushing? I'll elaborate a bit so I don't come off condescending or insulting.
> 
> The main difference between DA and any other league is the sub rule.  The rule is once subbed there is no re-entry.  5 subs are allowed. This means a max of 16 girls play, but no subs have to be made.  On a 18 player roster 2 never play EVERY game. The only requirement is a player must start 25% of the total games the team plays.  There is no guideline to minutes so she can get pulled after 1 minute and it counts as a start. So once a player gets her mandatory 25% of starts, she can be set for very long stretches of non activity.  That is not appealing to anyone.  I have two kids in the DA and it is a constant discussion with the parents.
> 
> Without the shuffling in and out of players,  it's much harder to hide players who aren't up to par technically,  mentally or physically.
> 
> What I'm saying is the DA really isn't made for big rosters if the focus is really development. I would say 18 because of injuries and players unable to show for whatever reason. Rosters of 24 are just absurd and in most cases the kids on the fringe aren't ready yet and will have trouble becoming ready with little to no playtime.
> 
> Add in the age banding, where the clubs usually go higher age heavy.  It seems as if US Soccer isn't concerned with developing the best talent at each age group and the talent pool dwindles further.  The 02s paid for it this season and the 03s will pay next season and so on.
> 
> Is there enough talent for Rebels and Carlsbad to compete in this environment? Real question because I don't know.
> 
> On another note, the Burlingame club is reeling.  It's hard to justify the travel costs, time away and overall energy when your teams are 0 and everything.  It's hard not to argue that ECNL or a similar setup isn't better for them. Let me be clear, they are well coached, but don't have the athletes to compete.  I saw them play a great style of soccer and their kids understood what they are doing.  The only teams I have seen hold their shape better are Beach and West Coast. They just can't physically hold their own.  Therefore,  they pay for nearly every mistake they make.
> 
> Now a club like IMG can afford to keep pushing because they are a private school setup and those attending are very well off.  They will simply adjust their recruiting tactics and infuse coaching and player talent if their Academy deems it worthy.  They started off just as poor in football and have made themselves into a national powerhouse quickly.


Carlsbad is LA Galaxy San Diego by the way.


----------



## Nutmeg

C.A.M. said:


> The requirements are made clear.  They do not seem easy to meet though.  One thing is proximity to other clubs according to the talent pool.  SoCal has 9 in a 150 mile radius.  No other region in the country has half that many teams close to each other.  They are traveling hundreds of miles to play weekly.
> 
> San Diego county already has Surf, Galaxy SD and Albion.  Where do clubs like Rebels and Carlsbad fit in for what the DA is pushing? I'll elaborate a bit so I don't come off condescending or insulting.
> 
> The main difference between DA and any other league is the sub rule.  The rule is once subbed there is no re-entry.  5 subs are allowed. This means a max of 16 girls play, but no subs have to be made.  On a 18 player roster 2 never play EVERY game. The only requirement is a player must start 25% of the total games the team plays.  There is no guideline to minutes so she can get pulled after 1 minute and it counts as a start. So once a player gets her mandatory 25% of starts, she can be set for very long stretches of non activity.  That is not appealing to anyone.  I have two kids in the DA and it is a constant discussion with the parents.
> 
> Without the shuffling in and out of players,  it's much harder to hide players who aren't up to par technically,  mentally or physically.
> 
> What I'm saying is the DA really isn't made for big rosters if the focus is really development. I would say 18 because of injuries and players unable to show for whatever reason. Rosters of 24 are just absurd and in most cases the kids on the fringe aren't ready yet and will have trouble becoming ready with little to no playtime.
> 
> Add in the age banding, where the clubs usually go higher age heavy.  It seems as if US Soccer isn't concerned with developing the best talent at each age group and the talent pool dwindles further.  The 02s paid for it this season and the 03s will pay next season and so on.
> 
> Is there enough talent for Rebels and Carlsbad to compete in this environment? Real question because I don't know.
> 
> On another note, the Burlingame club is reeling.  It's hard to justify the travel costs, time away and overall energy when your teams are 0 and everything.  It's hard not to argue that ECNL or a similar setup isn't better for them. Let me be clear, they are well coached, but don't have the athletes to compete.  I saw them play a great style of soccer and their kids understood what they are doing.  The only teams I have seen hold their shape better are Beach and West Coast. They just can't physically hold their own.  Therefore,  they pay for nearly every mistake they make.
> 
> Now a club like IMG can afford to keep pushing because they are a private school setup and those attending are very well off.  They will simply adjust their recruiting tactics and infuse coaching and player talent if their Academy deems it worthy.  They started off just as poor in football and have made themselves into a national powerhouse quickly.


Not sure your point. Sure your observations are ones that many have but... the guidelines as you read them online might appear to be straightforward but they are not. USSoccer is the gate keeper they alone decide who and how a club can enter THEIR CLOSED LEAGUE or REMAIN in it. That is the issue at hand. Their is no merit based system in which a team or a club can earn their way in. That reason alone is a huge part of why DA is Socal is so watered down. Legends, Surf, Beach, Blues, all have second teams that can and would compete with the bottom teams in DA. Yet those players and those teams are left out of DAs closed league system because of the rules rather than the play. 
As far as playing time, if you decide to play DA and you can’t get QUALITY minutes than you need to re-evaluate your situation. Stagnation kills far to many players. Leave, get better, change positions, etc. DA is designed as a funnel for national team scouting, and for controlling profits from other closed leagues.


----------



## C.A.M.

Lightning Red said:


> Carlsbad is LA Galaxy San Diego by the way.


Thank you. They are doing alright then.


----------



## C.A.M.

Nutmeg said:


> Not sure your point. Sure your observations are ones that many have but... the guidelines as you read them online might appear to be straightforward but they are not. USSoccer is the gate keeper they alone decide who and how a club can enter THEIR CLOSED LEAGUE or REMAIN in it. That is the issue at hand. Their is no merit based system in which a team or a club can earn their way in. That reason alone is a huge part of why DA is Socal is so watered down. Legends, Surf, Beach, Blues, all have second teams that can and would compete with the bottom teams in DA. Yet those players and those teams are left out of DAs closed league system because of the rules rather than the play.
> As far as playing time, if you decide to play DA and you can’t get QUALITY minutes than you need to re-evaluate your situation. Stagnation kills far to many players. Leave, get better, change positions, etc. DA is designed as a funnel for national team scouting, and for controlling profits from other closed leagues.


The national team scouting part is the selling point, but really isn't a factor for the majority of there.  Some kids want to play at the highest level of competition.  No different than when ECNL came along. 

I agree 100% with the stagnation part and if a kid isn't good enough to play than reevaluate. 

I wasn't arguing that the DA isn't a closed league.  SoCal is full of closed leagues; DA, ECNL, CRL, SCSDL, Coast Soccer League, etc.....  Are you proposing we all play in the same league and just have different levels of the single competition?

On your comment of the 2nd teams of some clubs beating the lower ranked clubs, I disagree.  

Legends, Blues and Del Sol are better athletic teams than the rest of us.  Del Sol still is mid pack and Legends has went from 1st to 3rd since the winter break.  Beach is the best technical team in the SoCal DA and has went from 3rd to 1st since the break.  For the rest of us, the games are usually dog fights won and lost by a mental error or two. Yes, I'm including Surf.  My daughter is on a lower producing team and the only teams to blow us out are Legends, Blues and Beach.  We beat the current group of Legends players in the 2nd match, got demolished by Beach and just played a close game vs Blues without 3 of their top players while blown out when they had them.  Most of our other losses are by 1 or 2 goals and we have a bunch of ties.  I watch a lot of games and the second tier kids would struggle in this league with these rules.


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> The national team scouting part is the selling point, but really isn't a factor for the majority of there.  Some kids want to play at the highest level of competition.  No different than when ECNL came along.
> 
> I agree 100% with the stagnation part and if a kid isn't good enough to play than reevaluate.
> 
> I wasn't arguing that the DA isn't a closed league.  SoCal is full of closed leagues; DA, ECNL, CRL, SCSDL, Coast Soccer League, etc.....  Are you proposing we all play in the same league and just have different levels of the single competition?
> 
> On your comment of the 2nd teams of some clubs beating the lower ranked clubs, I disagree.
> 
> Legends, Blues and Del Sol are better athletic teams than the rest of us.  Del Sol still is mid pack and Legends has went from 1st to 3rd since the winter break.  Beach is the best technical team in the SoCal DA and has went from 3rd to 1st since the break.  For the rest of us, the games are usually dog fights won and lost by a mental error or two. Yes, I'm including Surf.  My daughter is on a lower producing team and the only teams to blow us out are Legends, Blues and Beach.  We beat the current group of Legends players in the 2nd match, got demolished by Beach and just played a close game vs Blues without 3 of their top players while blown out when they had them.  Most of our other losses are by 1 or 2 goals and we have a bunch of ties.  I watch a lot of games and the second tier kids would struggle in this league with these rules.


SCDSL and CSL are "closed leagues"?


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> SCDSL and CSL are "closed leagues"?


You have to be a member or invited to compete correct? Has that changed?


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> You have to be a member or invited to compete correct? Has that changed?


But any  club can become a member by paying the fees, not like the real closed leagues.


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> But any  club can become a member by paying the fees, not like the real closed leagues.


Is that the case with SCDSL and Coast?  I though you had to apply for them also?


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> Is that the case with SCDSL and Coast?  I though you had to apply for them also?


Is any club ever rejected?


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> Is any club ever rejected?


Not sure about Coast but there were teams rejected from SCDSL when it originally started.


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> Not sure about Coast but there were teams rejected from SCDSL when it originally started.


Who and why?


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> Who and why?


That was like 5 years ago and I don't remember who.  I remember clubs not being admitted.  It was a big deal at the time.


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> That was like 5 years ago and I don't remember who.  I remember clubs not being admitted.  It was a big deal at the time.


I remember that Surf had some issues with CSL so they left on their own, then helped form SCDSL, then left Presidio due to what they called lack of adequate competition, which the Presidio members remembered when Surf tried to get back in - and was rejected by member vote.


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> I remember that Surf had some issues with CSL so they left on their own, then helped form SCDSL, then left Presidio due to what they called lack of adequate competition, which the Presidio members remembered when Surf tried to get back in - and was rejected by member vote.


Yeah they are all closed to me.  They will expand and contract when it suits them financially.


----------



## Nutmeg

C.A.M. said:


> The national team scouting part is the selling point, but really isn't a factor for the majority of there.  Some kids want to play at the highest level of competition.  No different than when ECNL came along.
> 
> I agree 100% with the stagnation part and if a kid isn't good enough to play than reevaluate.
> 
> I wasn't arguing that the DA isn't a closed league.  SoCal is full of closed leagues; DA, ECNL, CRL, SCSDL, Coast Soccer League, etc.....  Are you proposing we all play in the same league and just have different levels of the single competition?
> 
> On your comment of the 2nd teams of some clubs beating the lower ranked clubs, I disagree.
> 
> Legends, Blues and Del Sol are better athletic teams than the rest of us.  Del Sol still is mid pack and Legends has went from 1st to 3rd since the winter break.  Beach is the best technical team in the SoCal DA and has went from 3rd to 1st since the break.  For the rest of us, the games are usually dog fights won and lost by a mental error or two. Yes, I'm including Surf.  My daughter is on a lower producing team and the only teams to blow us out are Legends, Blues and Beach.  We beat the current group of Legends players in the 2nd match, got demolished by Beach and just played a close game vs Blues without 3 of their top players while blown out when they had them.  Most of our other losses are by 1 or 2 goals and we have a bunch of ties.  I watch a lot of games and the second tier kids would struggle in this league with these rules.


Here’s where I would challenge you. It does not matter whether or not most players do not care about national team and just want to play against the best.  The national team does care. They set the parameters of completion so the players end up having to navigate based on that system. This does have an effect on their development.  That is the point. Also the Bottom DA clubs in terms of record often times do not play players up because they do. It have enough quality to do so and still compete. Most have set rosters that have remained unchanged. The teams in the upper third constantly move the top 2-3 players up for games. This is a good thing, but might scew a game result or two. So it’s not an apples to apples comparison of DA teams at any age group for a result based argument.  Also with recent YNT call ups effecting some teams more than others some games since January have been impacted.  Your  use of code words like “athletic” and “technical “ applied to Legends and Beach is IMO is based on old conceptions of what used to be. Both those DA clubs players are athletic and technical. Your also wrong by calling them second tier kids. They might be viewed as that but that again is the point. Just because a crap team plays in DA does not mean they deserve to be there, or that a group not in DA wouldn’t kick their butt.


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> Yeah they are all closed to me.  They will expand and contract when it suits them financially.


Coocoo.


----------



## avh

espola said:


> But any  club can become a member by paying the fees, not like the real closed leagues.


Any club willing to bring 10 teams can apply for membership. 


From SCDSL rules said:


> a. Club Application
> New Clubs can apply to the SCDSL by completing the Club Application located on the SCDSL website
> (www.scdslsoccer.com). Criteria for consideration in to the SCDSL includes:
>  Club must identify a minimum of 10 teams to participate in the SCDSL.
> ...
>  Geographical location of the club applying will be considered.


Smaller clubs may have a hard time coming up with 10 quality teams.  But they could have a few that would thus be excluded.


----------



## C.A.M.

Nutmeg said:


> Here’s where I would challenge you. It does not matter whether or not most players do not care about national team and just want to play against the best.  The national team does care. They set the parameters of completion so the players end up having to navigate based on that system. This does have an effect on their development.  That is the point. Also the Bottom DA clubs in terms of record often times do not play players up because they do. It have enough quality to do so and still compete. Most have set rosters that have remained unchanged. The teams in the upper third constantly move the top 2-3 players up for games. This is a good thing, but might scew a game result or two. So it’s not an apples to apples comparison of DA teams at any age group for a result based argument.  Also with recent YNT call ups effecting some teams more than others some games since January have been impacted.  Your  use of code words like “athletic” and “technical “ applied to Legends and Beach is IMO is based on old conceptions of what used to be. Both those DA clubs players are athletic and technical. Your also wrong by calling them second tier kids. They might be viewed as that but that again is the point. Just because a crap team plays in DA does not mean they deserve to be there, or that a group not in DA wouldn’t kick their butt.


You have some valid points, but some misses also. Beach is more technical than everyone else.  They don't place a player on the field with a bad first touch or inability to run off the ball into  space properly.  They hold their shape extremely well and are extremely disciplined.  They deserve to be applauded and recognized for it.  It was a beautiful demolition of our team. They have athletes, but not on the scale of Blues, Del Sol and Legends.  #5 on the 03s is beyond a fabulous athlete.  She ran by us, but I watched them play Legends and all that was negated.  

We just played Blues and 3 of their players totaling 50 of their 70 plus goals didn't play.   It didn't negate the fact they were much, much better athletes than us.  Are they good technically, yes.  Not on the level Beach is though. Still their ability to dominate us how they did with those players was considerably lessened. 

We were blown out by Legends the first match due to three reasons: the heat the forward and the CB.  We missed our one chance to take the lead early on and the CB shut down everything the rest of the game. Then when everyone else melted in the 105 degree plus heat, The Forward destroyed our defense in the second half.  The second match they don't have the CB as she moved up to 01-02, we have a better offensive presence in the midfield and we got a bit lucky.  Also one of their best mids is playing high school.  Those two players not there make a big difference.  We were able to sustain attacks and their offense had less rhythm and bite.  Still, they hit the post 2 or 3 times. 

You said the 2nd teams could beat the lower teams.  Most second team players will contain one of these flaws: unable to keep up physically, below par technically, lower soccer IQ, inconsistent focus or lack of desire to compete at this level (dedication).  All it takes is one player like that on the field in this league and you will get beat.  Against the top teams, demolished. I know who we have and haven't played against and I know the difference in the teams and result.  I'm not assuming.


----------



## Nutmeg

C.A.M. said:


> You have some valid points, but some misses also. Beach is more technical than everyone else.  They don't place a player on the field with a bad first touch or inability to run off the ball into  space properly.  They hold their shape extremely well and are extremely disciplined.  They deserve to be applauded and recognized for it.  It was a beautiful demolition of our team. They have athletes, but not on the scale of Blues, Del Sol and Legends.  #5 on the 03s is beyond a fabulous athlete.  She ran by us, but I watched them play Legends and all that was negated.
> 
> We just played Blues and 3 of their players totaling 50 of their 70 plus goals didn't play.   It didn't negate the fact they were much, much better athletes than us.  Are they good technically, yes.  Not on the level Beach is though. Still their ability to dominate us how they did with those players was considerably lessened.
> 
> We were blown out by Legends the first match due to three reasons: the heat the forward and the CB.  We missed our one chance to take the lead early on and the CB shut down everything the rest of the game. Then when everyone else melted in the 105 degree plus heat, The Forward destroyed our defense in the second half.  The second match they don't have the CB as she moved up to 01-02, we have a better offensive presence in the midfield and we got a bit lucky.  Also one of their best mids is playing high school.  Those two players not there make a big difference.  We were able to sustain attacks and their offense had less rhythm and bite.  Still, they hit the post 2 or 3 times.
> 
> You said the 2nd teams could beat the lower teams.  Most second team players will contain one of these flaws: unable to keep up physically, below par technically, lower soccer IQ, inconsistent focus or lack of desire to compete at this level (dedication).  All it takes is one player like that on the field in this league and you will get beat.  Against the top teams, demolished. I know who we have and haven't played against and I know the difference in the teams and result.  I'm not assuming.


Just because BeastMode comes to Beach training sessions don’t mean their more technical than anyone else.  USSOCCER plays a pretty non technical style of soccer. And yes maybe some girls don’t want to train 4x a week with a team but that don’t mean a damn thing. If you think that the DA patch means anything other than a patch than we can agree to disagree. Their simply is not enough elite players. I mean really elite. There are maybe maybe 20 elite girls across all age bands in all so cal. All the rest are varied degrees of good. And on anyday will and can lose. Lose the game and lose individually on the field. The problem with DA is when it is viewed exclusively as elite just because you paid to be there.  The only thing elite about it is that the people in it and running it say it is. In the end just do what’s best for yours and enjoy it.


----------



## C.A.M.

Nutmeg said:


> Just because BeastMode comes to Beach training sessions don’t mean their more technical than anyone else.  USSOCCER plays a pretty non technical style of soccer. And yes maybe some girls don’t want to train 4x a week with a team but that don’t mean a damn thing. If you think that the DA patch means anything other than a patch than we can agree to disagree. Their simply is not enough elite players. I mean really elite. There are maybe maybe 20 elite girls across all age bands in all so cal. All the rest are varied degrees of good. And on anyday will and can lose. Lose the game and lose individually on the field. The problem with DA is when it is viewed exclusively as elite just because you paid to be there.  The only thing elite about it is that the people in it and running it say it is. In the end just do what’s best for yours and enjoy it.


Last year most of the best players played ECNL.  Not all. Most.  This year most of the best players play DA. Not all. Most.  At no time will a patch or a team you pay to be on determine who is the best team.  That is determined in practice and on the field by the coaches and players.  These previous comments are high majority geralizations and not all inclusive statements.  Another team from another league is always capable of mopping the floor with any so called giant. Heck we beat Legends and I was expecting a 6-0 blowout for them.  Stuff happens and every team matches up different. 

The rules of the game dictate style.  The rules of the DA make it hard for some players who were good to remain good and makes it easier to be better for others.  For my daughter, the rules compliment her mentality and game play style so she is thriving, even when the team isn't. These rules make it hard for many of the players due to what they have been trained to do for years, which is play extremely direct.  Old habits are hard to break. Players that have adjusted are doing well.  Players that haven't are not progressing.  The same will happen when they go to the college game and for those that make it, the pro game. 

My kid isn't at Beach. My kids do have the BeastMode videos.  They work if you work on them.  I see how Beach plays and the technical ability of their teams and I am impressed.  Is that because of the one day a week with David? Not completely.  He will tell you it's the dedication they put into it off the field, AT HOME.  That has always been his philosophy and teaching.  Still, whatever they are teaching is sticking because they are way beyond everyone else in game play.  They are mastering what the DA has created as curriculum.  They have been on fire since late November and deserve the praise in my opinion. It is up to the rest of us to raise our levels and compete.


----------



## Nutmeg

C.A.M. said:


> Last year most of the best players played ECNL.  Not all. Most.  This year most of the best players play DA. Not all. Most.  At no time will a patch or a team you pay to be on determine who is the best team.  That is determined in practice and on the field by the coaches and players.  These previous comments are high majority geralizations and not all inclusive statements.  Another team from another league is always capable of mopping the floor with any so called giant. Heck we beat Legends and I was expecting a 6-0 blowout for them.  Stuff happens and every team matches up different.
> 
> The rules of the game dictate style.  The rules of the DA make it hard for some players who were good to remain good and makes it easier to be better for others.  For my daughter, the rules compliment her mentality and game play style so she is thriving, even when the team isn't. These rules make it hard for many of the players due to what they have been trained to do for years, which is play extremely direct.  Old habits are hard to break. Players that have adjusted are doing well.  Players that haven't are not progressing.  The same will happen when they go to the college game and for those that make it, the pro game.
> 
> My kid isn't at Beach. My kids do have the BeastMode videos.  They work if you work on them.  I see how Beach plays and the technical ability of their teams and I am impressed.  Is that because of the one day a week with David? Not completely.  He will tell you it's the dedication they put into it off the field, AT HOME.  That has always been his philosophy and teaching.  Still, whatever they are teaching is sticking because they are way beyond everyone else in game play.  They are mastering what the DA has created as curriculum.  They have been on fire since late November and deserve the praise in my opinion. It is up to the rest of us to raise our levels and compete.


We are on two different view points. And that is great, debate is good. Good for everyone. However Unless you are Dave You don’t know anything about him other than what he wants you to know. So preach on about the method and videos. Teams don’t matter, DA don’t matter. Parents opinions don’t matter. All that really matters is your own DD.  My only point is this. If you or anyone ever thinks DA is the best because of its exclusive list of American soccer rules than that imo is the height of arrogance and stupidity.  The DA rules that you claim are helping IMO will be the death of soccer. Soccer should not be rules predetermined by a company, or national agency or club. This might sound stupid, but DA white washes and sanitizes American soccer. You like the rules because it makes it fair, it gives a standardized criteria for players to operate. It’s fake hustle. It’s look how hard I work 4x a week. Quantity does not matter, what is the quality? Is it international quality? Well good luck to you when college arrives our DDs have to play against foreign kids who did not have rules.


----------



## C.A.M.

Nutmeg said:


> We are on two different view points. And that is great, debate is good. Good for everyone. However Unless you are Dave You don’t know anything about him other than what he wants you to know. So preach on about the method and videos. Teams don’t matter, DA don’t matter. Parents opinions don’t matter. All that really matters is your own DD.  My only point is this. If you or anyone ever thinks DA is the best because of its exclusive list of American soccer rules than that imo is the height of arrogance and stupidity.  The DA rules that you claim are helping IMO will be the death of soccer. Soccer should not be rules predetermined by a company, or national agency or club. This might sound stupid, but DA white washes and sanitizes American soccer. You like the rules because it makes it fair, it gives a standardized criteria for players to operate. It’s fake hustle. It’s look how hard I work 4x a week. Quantity does not matter, what is the quality? Is it international quality? Well good luck to you when college arrives our DDs have to play against foreign kids who did not have rules.


Man I like the DA for what it is suppose to be for the kids. A true development environment where the coaching staff is dedicated to the players growth and are treated in a way that is representative in a manner that reflects the time, energy, dedication and purpose of this journey.  No other reason.  

Our family trust ourselves to have the best interests of our kids.  US Soccer has the ability to change the rules and therefore the landscape of the DA at a whim.  Same as all other governing bodies such as ECNL, SCSDL, MLS, NCAA, FIFA etc...  Just because we participate doesn't make us naive.  I grew up and athlete.  I understand coaches, schools, universities, clubs, etc.... have their best interests as the focus first and the object is to get in where you fit in so you can get what you need from the system.  

You are funny with the fake hustle and quality comments.  That is going to be a player by player and club by club determination that has nothing to do with what league a club belongs to and you damn well know it.  It doesn't stop in youth soccer either.  That's all the way to the international level around the globe.  The DA isn't OVERTLY demanding all leagues play with the curriculum it has set out.  By the age banding they have set up next year and not giving the 03 and 02 age groups their own groups they clearly aren't attempting to grab each and every player.  There is plenty of room for different styles of futbol to be played and put on display across this wonderfully large and diverse country we reside in.


----------



## Striker17

Is the blog as insightful as Goal Nation?


----------



## Lightning Red

Does anybody have any clue how they will set matchups for North Carolina?


----------



## Lightning Red

Lightning Red said:


> Does anybody have any clue how they will set matchups for North Carolina?


And why would this be “dumb”?  As this will be the first time in a DA showcase for the U14’s perhaps somebody who was in FL this winter can help to answer the question.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Lightning Red said:


> Does anybody have any clue how they will set matchups for North Carolina?


As I understand it, the ‘04’s will play Friday - Monday.  That’s all I got.


----------



## Futbol Fan

Bumping this post: tough to juggle ECNL and DA programs with quality. ECNL has put the pressure on clubs to not field subpar teams while having a DA program. WCFC/OC Surf loading up ECNL teams, pulling players from the DA teams...I guess DA is not their priority! Poor Ethics or desperate?


----------



## GoWest

Futbol Fan said:


> Bumping this post: tough to juggle ECNL and DA programs with quality. ECNL has put the pressure on clubs to not field subpar teams while having a DA program. WCFC/OC Surf loading up ECNL teams, pulling players from the DA teams...I guess DA is not their priority! Poor Ethics or desperate?


Neither IMHO. Club soccer has been doing this for years so nothing new here. Stacking teams, borrowing players, etc., is just part of the landscape good, bad or indifferent.


----------



## C.A.M.

Futbol Fan said:


> Bumping this post: tough to juggle ECNL and DA programs with quality. ECNL has put the pressure on clubs to not field subpar teams while having a DA program. WCFC/OC Surf loading up ECNL teams, pulling players from the DA teams...I guess DA is not their priority! Poor Ethics or desperate?


Until the DA creates a viable ultra competitive solution for top players who want or have to play high school or girls who aren't on teams due to the age grouping (teams are usually older player heavy), ECNL will thrive.  It has a proven format which people are attached to.


----------



## LadiesMan217

C.A.M. said:


> Until the DA creates a viable ultra competitive solution for top players who want or have to play high school or girls who aren't on *teams due to the age grouping (teams are usually older player heavy)*, ECNL will thrive.  It has a proven format which people are attached to.


Fake news...

2017/2018 GDA Facts (FT player stats)  to date:
U16/17:   48% 2002+/52% 2001 (*almost even*)
U16/17: 48 min APT 2002+/47 min APT 2001 (wow - younger players average more play time)

U18/19: 78% 2000+/22% 1999 (*younger player heavy*)
U18/19: 47 min APT 2000+/ 46 min APT 1999 (again, younger players average more play time)

If I add DP players into the mix you will be even more wrong.


----------



## G03_SD

GoWest said:


> Neither IMHO. Club soccer has been doing this for years so nothing new here. Stacking teams, borrowing players, etc., is just part of the landscape good, bad or indifferent.


I think ECNL should do the same as DA - players cannot play down to another league (SCDSL/Prez/Nat'l Cup).


----------



## LadiesMan217

Futbol Fan said:


> Bumping this post: tough to juggle ECNL and DA programs with quality. ECNL has put the pressure on clubs to not field subpar teams while having a DA program. WCFC/OC Surf loading up ECNL teams, pulling players from the DA teams...I guess DA is not their priority! Poor Ethics or desperate?


What age group is this happening?


----------



## Lambchop

Futbol Fan said:


> Bumping this post: tough to juggle ECNL and DA programs with quality. ECNL has put the pressure on clubs to not field subpar teams while having a DA program. WCFC/OC Surf loading up ECNL teams, pulling players from the DA teams...I guess DA is not their priority! Poor Ethics or desperate?


??? DA players can not play ECNL. ??? Do you mean for next year, DA players moving to ECNL?


----------



## Soccer43

ECNL and DA cannot play back and forth or "guest" back and forth but there is nothing preventing a player from leaving one league to be rostered on the other.


----------



## SocalPapa

LadiesMan217 said:


> What age group is this happening?


Good question.  If @Futbol Fan is talking about 2002 and 2003, that's presumably happening with every dual club.  You've got a roster and a half of girls with DA experience who now need to fit in to a single 02/03 roster.  That's probably 8 girls or so who need to be moved out of DA.


----------



## C.A.M.

LadiesMan217 said:


> Fake news...
> 
> 2017/2018 GDA Facts (FT player stats)  to date:
> U16/17:   48% 2002+/52% 2001 (*almost even*)
> U16/17: 48 min APT 2002+/47 min APT 2001 (wow - younger players average more play time)
> 
> U18/19: 78% 2000+/22% 1999 (*younger player heavy*)
> U18/19: 47 min APT 2000+/ 46 min APT 1999 (again, younger players average more play time)
> 
> If I add DP players into the mix you will be even more wrong.



Interesting numbers and I'm not arguing against them although they seem to differ from what I'm looking at on the DA roster sites for the limited teams I've looked at.  So here are my questions?

1.  Where did your information come from?
2.  Is it based on all the Academies nationwide?
3. Is that the trend we are seeing here in So Cal?  (I don't believe it is)


----------



## LadiesMan217

C.A.M. said:


> Interesting numbers and I'm not arguing against them although they seem to differ from what I'm looking at on the DA roster sites for the limited teams I've looked at.  So here are my questions?
> 
> 1.  Where did your information come from?
> 2.  Is it based on all the Academies nationwide?
> 3. Is that the trend we are seeing here in So Cal?  (I don't believe it is)


1. US Soccer 
2. Yes
3. Yes for all stats I provided except U-16/17 is older age heavy  68%


----------



## SocalPapa

LadiesMan217 said:


> 1. US Soccer
> 2. Yes
> 3. Yes for all stats I provided except U-16/17 is older age heavy  68%


Are you trying to suggest that So Cal DA rosters are mostly age-balanced by pointing to:

1) U16/17, an age group where 2001's take up 68% of the spots, and
2) U18/19, an age group where most '99s have graduated already?


----------



## C.A.M.

SocalPapa said:


> Are you trying to suggest that So Cal DA rosters are mostly age-balanced by pointing to:
> 
> 1) U16/17, an age group where 2001's take up 68% of the spots, and
> 2) U18/19, an age group where most '99s have graduated already?



Yes would be the answer. I'm sure the numbers are even higher when we isolate So Cal, which is my concern.  The 03's are going to have serious decisions on which league to play in if they don't make the DA group.


----------



## Lambchop

Futbol Fan said:


> Bumping this post: tough to juggle ECNL and DA programs with quality. ECNL has put the pressure on clubs to not field subpar teams while having a DA program. WCFC/OC Surf loading up ECNL teams, pulling players from the DA teams...I guess DA is not their priority! Poor Ethics or desperate?


What DA age group are they pulling players from?  That means they have quit DA mid season since they can not play in another league.


----------



## LadiesMan217

C.A.M. said:


> Yes would be the answer. I'm sure the numbers are even higher when we isolate So Cal, which is my concern.  The 03's are going to have serious decisions on which league to play in if they don't make the DA group.


This is isolating SoCal. LAFC, Beach, and Blues all follow the national trend. LAG (both), Surf, West Coast, Eagles are worse offenders (call them an ask them what's up). Again this is based on FT players. There suspected factors for the age heavy DA in SoCal are some clubs focusing on ECNL at lower age in bracket and DPL.


----------



## C.A.M.

LadiesMan217 said:


> This is isolating SoCal. LAFC, Beach, and Blues all follow the national trend. LAG (both), Surf, West Coast, Eagles are worse offenders (call them an ask them what's up). Again this is based on FT players. There suspected factors for the age heavy DA in SoCal are some clubs focusing on ECNL at lower age in bracket and DPL.


Ummmmm....

So I didn't give false news.


----------



## LadiesMan217

C.A.M. said:


> Ummmmm....
> 
> So I didn't give false news.


Every post about DA the people complain about 'that is only in SoCal', now you are the first to reverse the trend . I gave GDA statistics. You should state SoCal  lol.... You were correct for 'GDA in SoCal for U16/17'.


----------



## Lambchop

C.A.M. said:


> Yes would be the answer. I'm sure the numbers are even higher when we isolate So Cal, which is my concern.  The 03's are going to have serious decisions on which league to play in if they don't make the DA group.


A lot of rumors out there, there may be more changes coming, stay tuned.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Lambchop said:


> A lot of rumors out there, there may be more changes coming, stay tuned.


Why does everything need to be so fricken complicated?


----------



## Josep

Rain going to cause chaos at showcase?


----------



## SocalPapa

LadiesMan217 said:


> This is isolating SoCal. LAFC, Beach, and Blues all follow the national trend. LAG (both), Surf, West Coast, Eagles are worse offenders (call them an ask them what's up). Again this is based on FT players. There suspected factors for the age heavy DA in SoCal are some clubs focusing on ECNL at lower age in bracket and DPL.


Blues doesn't follow the national trend.  They aren't balanced.  They decided to keep their 2002 and 2001 ECNL teams mostly in tact and make their former '02 SCDSL Champions team the core of the DA team.  It should set them up well to have so many experienced 02 players with the 02/03 grouping next season.  Take out Blues and your numbers get even worse.

Here are the starts by birth year for each U16/17 team.  I don't know if you can call clubs "offenders" if pretty much everyone is doing it.  Slammers and Beach are really the only balanced teams.

ALBION SC   253
2001   183
2002   70
BEACH FUTBOL CLUB   274
2001   136
2002   125
2003   13
EAGLES SOCCER CLUB   219
2001   188
2002   31
LA GALAXY   244
2001   224
2002   20
LA GALAXY SAN DIEGO   264
2001   225
2002   39
LAFC SLAMMERS   213
2001   102
2002   111
LEGENDS FC   243
2001   167
2002   68
2003   8
LOS ANGELES PREMIER FC   264
2001   202
2002   62
PATEADORES   260
2001   225
2002   35
REAL SO CAL   261
2001   188
2002   59
2004   14
SAN DIEGO SURF   241
2001   221
2002   20
SC DEL SOL   267
2001   199
2002   68
SO CAL BLUES SOCCER CLUB   275
2001   107
2002   168
WEST COAST FUTBOL CLUB   248
2001   209
2002   39

*Edited to correct the LAGSD numbers.


----------



## Lambchop

SocalPapa said:


> Blues doesn't follow the national trend.  They aren't balanced.  They decided to keep their 2002 and 2001 ECNL teams mostly in tact and make their former '02 SCDSL Champions team the core of the DA team.  It should set them up well to have so many experienced 02 players with the 02/03 split next season.  Take out Blues and your numbers get even worse.
> 
> Here are the starts by birth year for each U16/17 team.  I don't know if you can call clubs "offenders" if pretty much everyone is doing it.  Slammers and Beach are really the only balanced teams.
> 
> ALBION SC   253
> 2001   183
> 2002   70
> BEACH FUTBOL CLUB   274
> 2001   136
> 2002   125
> 2003   13
> EAGLES SOCCER CLUB   219
> 2001   188
> 2002   31
> LA GALAXY   244
> 2001   224
> 2002   20
> LA GALAXY SAN DIEGO   477
> 2001   327
> 2002   150
> LAFC SLAMMERS   213
> 2001   102
> 2002   111
> LEGENDS FC   243
> 2001   167
> 2002   68
> 2003   8
> LOS ANGELES PREMIER FC   264
> 2001   202
> 2002   62
> PATEADORES   260
> 2001   225
> 2002   35
> REAL SO CAL   261
> 2001   188
> 2002   59
> 2004   14
> SAN DIEGO SURF   241
> 2001   221
> 2002   20
> SC DEL SOL   267
> 2001   199
> 2002   68
> SO CAL BLUES SOCCER CLUB   275
> 2001   107
> 2002   168
> WEST COAST FUTBOL CLUB   248
> 2001   209
> 2002   39



Rumors abound, the 2018-2019 year will be crazy!


----------



## Sheriff Joe

SocalPapa said:


> Blues doesn't follow the national trend.  They aren't balanced.  They decided to keep their 2002 and 2001 ECNL teams mostly in tact and make their former '02 SCDSL Champions team the core of the DA team.  It should set them up well to have so many experienced 02 players with the 02/03 grouping next season.  Take out Blues and your numbers get even worse.
> 
> Here are the starts by birth year for each U16/17 team.  I don't know if you can call clubs "offenders" if pretty much everyone is doing it.  Slammers and Beach are really the only balanced teams.
> 
> ALBION SC   253
> 2001   183
> 2002   70
> BEACH FUTBOL CLUB   274
> 2001   136
> 2002   125
> 2003   13
> EAGLES SOCCER CLUB   219
> 2001   188
> 2002   31
> LA GALAXY   244
> 2001   224
> 2002   20
> LA GALAXY SAN DIEGO   264
> 2001   225
> 2002   39
> LAFC SLAMMERS   213
> 2001   102
> 2002   111
> LEGENDS FC   243
> 2001   167
> 2002   68
> 2003   8
> LOS ANGELES PREMIER FC   264
> 2001   202
> 2002   62
> PATEADORES   260
> 2001   225
> 2002   35
> REAL SO CAL   261
> 2001   188
> 2002   59
> 2004   14
> SAN DIEGO SURF   241
> 2001   221
> 2002   20
> SC DEL SOL   267
> 2001   199
> 2002   68
> SO CAL BLUES SOCCER CLUB   275
> 2001   107
> 2002   168
> WEST COAST FUTBOL CLUB   248
> 2001   209
> 2002   39
> 
> *Edited to correct the LAGSD numbers.


YIKES.


----------



## SocalPapa

Sheriff Joe said:


> YIKES.


I just checked the 3 big Dallas clubs and they show the same trend.  Wonder if this might be common to large urban areas.  Perhaps areas with large talent pools are less likely to need '02s to fill out the rosters?

Total Starts:
DALLAS TEXANS 220
2001 190
2002 30
FC DALLAS 219
2001 184
2002 35
SOLAR SOCCER CLUB 209
2001 186
2002 23


----------



## Simisoccerfan

It makes total sense that the older age dominates the roster spots.


----------



## timmyh

SocalPapa said:


> I just checked the 3 big Dallas clubs and they show the same trend.  Wonder if this might be common to large urban areas.  Perhaps areas with large talent pools are less likely to need '02s to fill out the rosters?
> 
> Total Starts:
> DALLAS TEXANS 220
> 2001 190
> 2002 30
> FC DALLAS 219
> 2001 184
> 2002 35
> SOLAR SOCCER CLUB 209
> 2001 186
> 2002 23


Not apples to apples. The Frontier Conference (and Dallas) currently has 02 DA teams as a pilot program.  The Frontier this past year has single age groups for 05s through 01s. Specific U13, U14, U15, U16, U17 DA teams exist and the only combined age is U18/19. The U13 and U16 teams were pilot programs this year in the Frontier, and have been confirmed to be in place again next year. Those clubs each have six DA teams, not four like most of the country.

So, of course the Dallas teams don't have a lot of 02s on the 01 DA team. Most 02s play on the U16 DA team and most 01s play on the U17 DA team.


----------



## davin

timmyh said:


> Not apples to apples. The Frontier Conference (and Dallas) currently has 02 DA teams as a pilot program.  The Frontier this past year has single age groups for 05s through 01s. Specific U13, U14, U15, U16, U17 DA teams exist and the only combined age is U18/19. The U13 and U16 teams were pilot programs this year in the Frontier, and have been confirmed to be in place again next year. Those clubs each have six DA teams, not four like most of the country.
> 
> So, of course the Dallas teams don't have a lot of 02s on the 01 DA team. Most 02s play on the U16 DA team and most 01s play on the U17 DA team.


The FC Dallas DA webpage shows they have a combined u16/17 team this year. Same thing for all of the other teams in that division. Those plans for the pilot u16 teams are for next year.
http://fcdl.ussoccerda.com/home.php


----------



## C.A.M.

Thanks everyone for all the excellent, in-depth research.  It's crazy how much different than the rest of the country we are here in So Cal.  Guess Dallas area too.

So like I said.  The combined age groups are older player heavy.  This means as situated, a lot of 03 girls have serious decions to make. 

I know tons of 03s felt like they missed out on high school this year, so playing DPL or ECNL and practicing 3 days a week may be a welcoming call to many.

I just don't see how the DA thrives with the younger ages in combo groups having girls out of the system for a year.  Are they expected to want to return?  I'm not sure about the thought process.

Anyways, I think if you really want them developing you have to keep them in the system.  The pilot program in the Frontier group sounds like a good idea mostly.  No matter how they do it, the dedication, talent and coaching has to be there.


----------



## Overtime

C.A.M. said:


> Thanks everyone for all the excellent, in-depth research.  It's crazy how much different than the rest of the country we are here in So Cal.  Guess Dallas area too.
> 
> So like I said.  The combined age groups are older player heavy.  This means as situated, a lot of 03 girls have serious decions to make.
> 
> I know tons of 03s felt like they missed out on high school this year, so playing DPL or ECNL and practicing 3 days a week may be a welcoming call to many.
> 
> I just don't see how the DA thrives with the younger ages in combo groups having girls out of the system for a year.  Are they expected to want to return?  I'm not sure about the thought process.
> 
> Anyways, I think if you really want them developing you have to keep them in the system.  The pilot program in the Frontier group sounds like a good idea mostly.  No matter how they do it, the dedication, talent and coaching has to be there.


Word is the pilot program is coming to So Cal for the 2003 age group.  DA structure,  no high school and same showcases.


----------



## C.A.M.

Overtime said:


> Word is the pilot program is coming to So Cal for the 2003 age group.  DA structure,  no high school and same showcases.


My girl would like to play in the combo group,  but I still think this is a wonderful idea.   May be what the girls need to break years of habits and cultivate the ones needed to succeed with this style of play.


----------



## Soccer

Major changes for next year.  02 and 03 split in So Cal. Only combined age is 00/01.   7 subs in all ages except 00/01.


----------



## C.A.M.

Soccer said:


> Major changes for next year.  02 and 03 split in So Cal. Only combined age is 00/01.   7 subs in all ages except 00/01.


And where can we find out more on this?


----------



## Soccer

C.A.M. said:


> And where can we find out more on this?


You would of had to be at the meeting yesterday here in NC.  It will come out next week in a presentation re-cap.

I should add, the 03 is not nationwide.  Only So Cal and Frontier.  Might add one more.


----------



## C.A.M.

Soccer said:


> You would of had to be at the meeting yesterday here in NC.  It will come out next week in a presentation re-cap.
> 
> I should add, the 03 is not nationwide.  Only So Cal and Frontier.  Might add one more.


Ok.  I'm glad they didn't ignore the issue of players being left out in if they kept the grouping system status quo. How was the reaction during the meeting? 

Looking at the numbers,  So Cap is a gigantic reason the national percentage of olders vs youngers on the team is at 68%.


----------



## Fact

Soccer said:


> You would of had to be at the meeting yesterday here in NC.  It will come out next week in a presentation re-cap.
> 
> I should add, the 03 is not nationwide.  Only So Cal and Frontier.  Might add one more.


Thank goodness, now maybe Lambchop will stop whining that life is not fair.


----------



## Overtime

Soccer said:


> Major changes for next year.  02 and 03 split in So Cal. Only combined age is 00/01.   7 subs in all ages except 00/01.


For So Cal will it be both combo 02/03 and 03 pilot or no combo.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Rain rain go away! Will be fun for players and not much fun for spectators.


----------



## push_up

C.A.M. said:


> I just don't see how the DA thrives with the younger ages in combo groups having girls out of the system for a year.  Are they expected to want to return?  I'm not sure about the thought process.
> 
> Anyways, I think if you really want them developing you have to keep them in the system.  The pilot program in the Frontier group sounds like a good idea mostly.  No matter how they do it, the dedication, talent and coaching has to be there.


The DA only cares about the development of the unicorns.  The rest are training dummies.  The thought process is sound to achieve the goal.  Keep drinking the koolaid.


----------



## Lambchop

Fact said:


> Thank goodness, now maybe Lambchop will stop whining that life is not fair.





Fact said:


> Thank goodness, now maybe Lambchop will stop whining that life is not fair.


Point of information, I never said that.  What I said is honesty and integrity are important for what DA conveyed!  Like I said, you probably were not at the meetings.   You are very good at interrupting statements to fit what your agenda is.  Interesting that you were so concerned when you didn't  even have a dd that would be affected. If the decision does happen officially next week, I am happy for all the girls who want to continue to develop.


----------



## Fact

Lambchop said:


> Yes, and on top of it all the Frontier division gets the pure age division as a "pilot" program.  What is there to pilot other than "politics"!


This is just one post.  At least 6 more whining.


----------



## Lambchop

Fact said:


> This is just one post.  At least 6 more whining.


The interesting thing is that I guess a lot of people, coaches and clubs agreed.  Amazing what a collective voice can do.


----------



## timmyh

Soccer said:


> Major changes for next year.  02 and 03 split in So Cal. Only combined age is 00/01.   7 subs in all ages except 00/01.


Surprised Socal isn't also doing the U13 DA pilot age group, which was very successful in Frontier this year.


----------



## turftoe9

If I'm correct the pilot teams games will be playing friendlies as there be no point system or playoffs at the end of the season. Plus they will not be able to play High School. If someone has heard different I'd like to hear about how it is to workout.


----------



## Kicker4Life

turftoe9 said:


> If I'm correct the pilot teams games will be playing friendlies as there be no point system or playoffs at the end of the season. Plus they will not be able to play High School. If someone has heard different I'd like to hear about how it is to workout.


How many u13’s  play High school?


----------



## Overtime

Kicker4Life said:


> How many u13’s  play High school?


I believe he is taking about 2003 pilot single age DA “light” team.


----------



## Arnie3

Simisoccerfan said:


> Rain rain go away! Will be fun for players and not much fun for spectators.



The weather was miserable for both the players and spectators yesterday.    Temp in the low 40's, rain throughout the day and very breezy.  Not sure what the wind chill temp would have been.  Our 03's played at 3:15.  My daughter is a keeper and her hands were ice cold by the end of the game.  She couldn't really feel her fingers by the end of the game.  Gloves soaked and heavy.  Hoping for a better experience tomorrow.  Today was a beautiful day.  Crossing our fingers that the fields are in descent shape after the games today.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Beautiful day today. Fields were wet but in good condition and temps were perfect for soccer.


----------



## C.A.M.

We play at 12:30 or so Pacific Time.  Hoping we have a much better outing than Day 1.


----------



## eastbaysoccer

Michigan hawks, Eclipse And PDA leaving GDA. Other clubs in the Midwest and NE rumored to be leaving Soon this will be called So CAL GDA.


----------



## Soccer

_High School I hear is the biggest factor for these clubs leaving DA.  High School appears to be huge in the mid west and north east still._


----------



## davin

eastbaysoccer said:


> Michigan hawks, Eclipse And PDA leaving GDA. Other clubs in the Midwest and NE rumored to be leaving Soon this will be called So CAL GDA.


The official Hawks announcement.

https://www.michiganwolveshawks.com/


----------



## Dubs

I wonder how far this will ripple down.....


----------



## timbuck

Soccer said:


> _High School I hear is the biggest factor for these clubs leaving DA.  High School appears to be huge in the mid west and north east still._


While I’m sure high school played a part in their decisions-  I’d also say “follow the money”. 
Either they lost money as part of the DA program or didn’t get the expected uplift.


----------



## C.A.M.

davin said:


> The official Hawks announcement.
> 
> https://www.michiganwolveshawks.com/


The  only thing I see them canceling is the ID camp and that was due to weather.  Would you be so kind as to point out where they say they are pulling out of the DA?


----------



## Chris Knight

Wow!  Already pulled it down ... makes you wonder if they got a call from USSDA this morning --


----------



## MR.D

C.A.M. said:


> The  only thing I see them canceling is the ID camp and that was due to weather.  Would you be so kind as to point out where they say they are pulling out of the DA?
> 
> View attachment 2378


It was posted.  They took it down.


----------



## El Clasico

One has to wonder if GDA can afford to lose these clubs, particularly PDA. If PDA pulls out, that would be a very big blow to the program over there as that would make a statement as to what the market demands over there. If I were GDA, I would offer up the program to these clubs on a "pilot" basis allowing them to do whatever they want, fewer days, play H.S., etc.  In the case of PDA, I would even offer subsidies to keep them in the program.  Once Cinderella leaves the ball, the party is pretty much over. Of course, the exception is SoCal. Like one poster already stated, they can change the name to SoCal GDA.  Expect USSF to respond with some pretty big carrots.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> The  only thing I see them canceling is the ID camp and that was due to weather.  Would you be so kind as to point out where they say they are pulling out of the DA?
> 
> View attachment 2378


It was there I saw it.  They must be redoing the message.


----------



## C.A.M.

El Clasico said:


> One has to wonder if GDA can afford to lose these clubs, particularly PDA. If PDA pulls out, that would be a very big blow to the program over there as that would make a statement as to what the market demands over there. If I were GDA, I would offer up the program to these clubs on a "pilot" basis allowing them to do whatever they want, fewer days, play H.S., etc.  In the case of PDA, I would even offer subsidies to keep them in the program.  Once Cinderella leaves the ball, the party is pretty much over. Of course, the exception is SoCal. Like one poster already stated, they can change the name to SoCal GDA.  Expect USSF to respond with some pretty big carrots.



While they are a traditionally strong program,  DA is growing rapidly.  Look at this same announcement on the Michigan site.  Of course, this is a total for Boys and Girls and the majority of the adds are boys, but plenty of girls clubs and teams.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

Soccer said:


> _High School I hear is the biggest factor for these clubs leaving DA.  High School appears to be huge in the mid west and north east still._


Does anyone know if the Boys DA had this problem early on or do boys not care as much as the girls about HS soccer?


----------



## El Clasico

C.A.M. said:


> While they are a traditionally strong program,  DA is growing rapidly.  Look at this same announcement on the Michigan site.  Of course, this is a total for Boys and Girls and the majority of the adds are boys, but plenty of girls clubs and teams.
> 
> View attachment 2381


Notice my post is specific to the GDA (Girls Development Academy)


----------



## El Clasico

Sheriff Joe said:


> Does anyone know if the Boys DA had this problem early on or do boys not care as much as the girls about HS soccer?


Boys side has bigger problems....10 years in and they have yet to produce a viable product. I think it is pretty well understood by those participating, that BDA is a pathway to college rather than the original intent of developing players for the MNT.


----------



## SocalPapa

C.A.M. said:


> While they are a traditionally strong program,  DA is growing rapidly.  Look at this same announcement on the Michigan site.  Of course, this is a total for Boys and Girls and the majority of the adds are boys, but plenty of girls clubs and teams.
> View attachment 2381


Does it really matter how many clubs they add if they lose Michigan Hawks, Eclipse and PDA?  Michigan and PDA are 2 of the top 10 GDA clubs in the country.  Eclipse is top 20.  This is big news.


----------



## MakeAPlay

El Clasico said:


> Boys side has bigger problems....10 years in and they have yet to produce a viable product. I think it is pretty well understood by those participating, that BDA is a pathway to college rather than the original intent of developing players for the MNT.


It's a good starting point for the elite boys of the US.  The ones that have the chops though try to get on an international team.  FC Dallas is awesome for finding overseas destinations for players.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> Does it really matter how many clubs they add if they lose Michigan Hawks, Eclipse and PDA?  Michigan and PDA are 2 of the top 10 GDA clubs in the country.  Eclipse is top 20.  This is big news.


You are correct and if you really dig deep over the past 10 years those are 3 of the top 6 clubs in the country.


----------



## C.A.M.

SocalPapa said:


> Does it really matter how many clubs they add if they lose Michigan Hawks, Eclipse and PDA?  Michigan and PDA are 2 of the top 10 GDA clubs in the country.  Eclipse is top 20.  This is big news.


Added 3 GDAs.   Only one I heard of is Utah Royals (NWSL).  

So you feel this is a death kneel for the GDA?

I think its a big blow,  but the system will continue forward.

I'm not surprised once I looked at the schedules after the Florida showcase.  I saw how the middle of the country takes nearly a 3 month break due to weather and how far some of these teams travel.  

What are the players suppose to do during that break when their counterparts in So Cal go year around?   ECNL allows them to keep playing during high school and keep in shape and developing while playing games. Big difference.  

Thing for me is my kids play here in So Cal and the best overall competition for the $ is the GDA to me,  along with the cirriculum.   If the GDA grows like the BDA,  eventually those clubs will return and US Socxer will welcome them with open arms. Look at how many boys clubs are flocking to the DA system now. 

The real question is how much patience will US Soccer have to grow the program and make the proper adjustments?   No,  I don't see them allowing high school.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Added 3 GDAs.   Only one I heard of is Utah Royals (NWSL).
> 
> So you feel this is a death kneel for the GDA?
> 
> I think its a big blow,  but the system will continue forward.
> 
> I'm not surprised once I looked at the schedules after the Florida showcase.  I saw how the middle of the country takes nearly a 3 month break due to weather and how far some of these teams travel.
> 
> What are the players suppose to do during that break when their counterparts in So Cal go year around?   ECNL allows them to keep playing during high school and keep in shape and developing while playing games. Big difference.
> 
> Thing for me is my kids play here in So Cal and the best overall competition for the $ is the GDA to me,  along with the cirriculum.   If the GDA grows like the BDA,  eventually those clubs will return and US Socxer will welcome them with open arms. Look at how many boys clubs are flocking to the DA system now.
> 
> The real question is how much patience will US Soccer have to grow the program and make the proper adjustments?   No,  I don't see them allowing high school.



On the boys side serious dilution is going on.  When everybody is elite then nobody is elite.  The best players on the boys side don't play DA for long.  They go pro.  We have a flawed system on the boys side of DA and now we have thrown a monkey wrench in the works on the girls side.  I am curious as to how this will sort itself out.


----------



## Multivitamin

Forums around the country are verifying that these clubs below are leaving GDA.
These are high level clubs with multiple national titles and National players.
There is more but these have let it be known as of today!

PDA
ECLIPSE
FC STARS
HAWKS


----------



## El Clasico

MakeAPlay said:


> It's a good starting point for the elite boys of the US.  The ones that have the chops though try to get on an international team.  FC Dallas is awesome for finding overseas destinations for players.


I agree but it is only because DA needs FC Dallas more than FC Dallas needs DA.  The founder of FC Dallas has been very outspoken about the need for elite players to bail out of DA and head to Europe (if you have the option). You can be sure that USSF is not happy about him being outspoken and they reluctantly roster players developed in Europe out of necessity. They know they can't win without them.  I don't see this changing anytime soon. So Sad!


----------



## Multivitamin




----------



## C.A.M.

So they are going back to ECNL and will take the things they love about the DA with them such as film study,  etc.. .


----------



## davin

Multivitamin said:


> Forums around the country are verifying that these clubs below are leaving GDA.
> These are high level clubs with multiple national titles and National players.
> There is more but these have let it be known as of today!
> 
> PDA
> ECLIPSE
> FC STARS
> HAWKS


One of the others that are rumored to be leaving GDA is Crossfire Premier.


----------



## MWN

El Clasico said:


> I agree but it is only because DA needs FC Dallas more than FC Dallas needs DA.  The founder of FC Dallas has been very outspoken about the need for elite players to bail out of DA and head to Europe (if you have the option). You can be sure that USSF is not happy about him being outspoken and they reluctantly roster players developed in Europe out of necessity. They know they can't win without them.  I don't see this changing anytime soon. So Sad!


The MLS may not be happy, but I don't think the USSF really cares because the USSF knows that the DA is merely phase 1 in development.  Phase II for the men, is skip college and go play professionally for 4-6 years.  Phase III make National team.

The girls have an entirely different path.  Phase I - ECNL/DA.  Phase II - College.  Phase III make national team and keep you skills up while playing for a semi-professional financially struggling subsidized woman's team.


----------



## MakeAPlay

davin said:


> One of the others that are rumored to be leaving GDA is Crossfire Premier.


That is yet another top club....


----------



## MakeAPlay

MWN said:


> The MLS may not be happy, but I don't think the USSF really cares because the USSF knows that the DA is merely phase 1 in development.  Phase II for the men, is skip college and go play professionally for 4-6 years.  Phase III make National team.
> 
> The girls have an entirely different path.  Phase I - ECNL/DA.  Phase II - College.  Phase III make national team and keep you skills up while playing for a semi-professional financially struggling subsidized woman's team.


That is a very succinct and accurate summary.  Thank goodness that our best players go pro and the unicorns go to Europe or Mexico.


----------



## C.A.M.

Do  you guys think these programs are partially pulling out because they aren't getting the results they are use to concerning victories.  With the clubs pulling out I'm seeing that even in the divisions they lead, they aren't just dominating in most cases.  What brought this to mind is how the announcement says "most competitive regional competition possible".  Reading that I figured these clubs were just drilling the competition and dominating.  I see they are winning (like they always have since they are top clubs nationally), but they aren't dominating at will.

Check it out..

http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/league/standings.php?leagueId=MTAwOA==

Just a sample - #1 and 2 in their conference - #12 & 15 in the playoff contention.


----------



## MWN

MakeAPlay said:


> That is a very succinct and accurate summary.  Thank goodness that our best players go pro and the unicorns go to Europe or Mexico.


Thank you.  Its one of the shortest posts I have written in a very long time.  

The mistake US Soccer is making regarding the girls DA stems from the fact that the girls DA was never needed because of the player path.  Digging deeper, appreciate that he girls DA is a response to litigation threats from the women regarding inequality between the men's and woman's national team (i.e. fields and pay).  Their position was that the Federation systemically treats women unequally and used the boys DA as evidence of that.  Their argument was, we are paid less, we have to play in inferior stadiums and on artifical turf and the Federation doesn't even have a girls DA after 8 years.  The response by the federation was to increase pay for the women, avoid artificial turf fields, funnel more subsidies into the WPSL, and start the girls DA (knowing that the clubs via the parents would be paying the lion share of the cost).

At the time, everybody was happy with the ECNL, but truth be told, the women shot themselves in the foot with the girls DA by trying to play under the same rules as the boys.  Whether this works out in the end will ultimately depend on the U.S. public finding an appetite for women's team sports and soccer ... so maybe sometime in the year 2093.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Do  you guys think these programs are partially pulling out because they aren't getting the results they are use to concerning victories.  With the clubs pulling out I'm seeing that even in the divisions they lead, they aren't just dominating in most cases.  What brought this to mind is how the announcement says "most competitive regional competition possible".  Reading that I figured these clubs were just drilling the competition and dominating.  I see they are winning (like they always have since they are top clubs nationally), but they aren't dominating at will.
> 
> Check it out..
> 
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/league/standings.php?leagueId=MTAwOA==
> 
> Just a sample - #1 and 2 in their conference - #12 & 15 in the playoff contention.
> 
> View attachment 2387


Those records look pretty dominant.


----------



## MarkM

davin said:


> One of the others that are rumored to be leaving GDA is Crossfire Premier.


I'm surprised the Colorado clubs didn't lead the charge.  They love their high school soccer in Colorado.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Those records look pretty dominant.


Not to me.  They look like very good teams. 

LAFC Slammers & FC Dallas 01/02 and Solar Chelsea 99/00 look dominant to me.


----------



## MWN

C.A.M. said:


> Do  you guys think these programs are partially pulling out because they aren't getting the results they are use to concerning victories.  With the clubs pulling out I'm seeing that even in the divisions they lead, they aren't just dominating in most cases.  What brought this to mind is how the announcement says "most competitive regional competition possible".  Reading that I figured these clubs were just drilling the competition and dominating.  I see they are winning (like they always have since they are top clubs nationally), but they aren't dominating at will.
> 
> Check it out..
> 
> http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/league/standings.php?leagueId=MTAwOA==
> 
> Just a sample - #1 and 2 in their conference - #12 & 15 in the playoff contention.
> 
> View attachment 2387


I think its probably due to the fact their customer is more educated and was questioning the value.  We are talking about girl's parents, who tend to be a little bit more involved and a little more protective.  Just compare a boys U17 game v. a girls U17 game -- twice as many parents at the girls game than the boys.  Girls are also emotionally different than boys.  Much more social animals and place far more importance on what their friends think/feel.  The no HS rule is a killer for many girls, who think to themselves: "_WTF?  I can't play with my friends.  If I make the USWNT team great, but I want to go to college and be an engineer or lawyer or doctor, etc., if I can play in college and get a scholarship that is my end game_." 

Now, if its the college Coach saying don't play that is OK because the goal of college has been achieved.  

I suspect that parents figured this out after 1 year in the DA ... no real benefit over the ECNL in that part of the country.  Told the clubs ... we are moving to an ECNL team good luck.  The clubs said ... whooaaaa ... "After several month of discussion ..."


----------



## Multivitamin

C.A.M. said:


> Not to me.  They look like very good teams.
> 
> LAFC Slammers 01/02 and Solar Chelsea 99/00 look dominant.



Solar Chelsea 99/00 Dominat really???
Half their team has left for college already for the Spring graduating early.
Solars program has moved everyone up an age group so essentially the top 5-6 players accross the board in their respective age groups have moved up in the Spring to fill the gaps.

This is happening around the country and in ECNL as well.


----------



## El Clasico

MWN said:


> I think its probably due to the fact their customer is more educated and was questioning the value.  We are talking about girl's parents, who tend to be a little bit more involved and a little more protective."


Looks like we got ourselves a winner here. Here, there is more Vanity.


----------



## outside!

MWN said:


> Digging deeper, appreciate that he girls DA is a response to litigation threats from the women regarding inequality between the men's and woman's national team (i.e. fields and pay).
> 
> At the time, everybody was happy with the ECNL, ...


That is a good point about the inequality.

Back then, the ECNL club DOC's were very happy with their little monopoly, but everybody was not happy. If ECNL had not been so busy protecting certain clubs' area monopoly and had been willing to add more clubs, then GDA would have had a much more difficult time attracting clubs to join. What will happen to the lower tier clubs like Sharks that ECNL added after GDA was founded? Are they going to ignore the GDA clubs like Legends and LAGSD that should have been added to ECNL and instead keep clubs like Sharks? If they do, they will be in a very similar situation to the one they were in before, with many top clubs not included (and the same could be said for GDA). And all of this is because the grown-ups at US Soccer and ECNL could not work out a compromise.


----------



## C.A.M.

View attachment 2390


MWN said:


> I think its probably due to the fact their customer is more educated and was questioning the value.  We are talking about girl's parents, who tend to be a little bit more involved and a little more protective.  Just compare a boys U17 game v. a girls U17 game -- twice as many parents at the girls game than the boys.  Girls are also emotionally different than boys.  Much more social animals and place far more importance on what their friends think/feel.  The no HS rule is a killer for many girls, who think to themselves: "_WTF?  I can't play with my friends.  If I make the USWNT team great, but I want to go to college and be an engineer or lawyer or doctor, etc., if I can play in college and get a scholarship that is my end game_."
> 
> Now, if its the college Coach saying don't play that is OK because the goal of college has been achieved.
> 
> I suspect that parents figured this out after 1 year in the DA ... no real benefit over the ECNL in that part of the country.  Told the clubs ... we are moving to an ECNL team good luck.  The clubs said ... whooaaaa ... "After several month of discussion ..."


Great post


----------



## Kicker4Life

From what I understand, there are more dominoes yet to fall on the GDA front.  Rumors also abound regarding some Big clubs dropping  ECNL.

Who knows what will happen in the end.


----------



## C.A.M.

Multivitamin said:


> Solar Chelsea 99/00 Dominat really???
> Half their team has left for college already for the Spring graduating early.
> Solars program has moved everyone up an age group so essentially the top 5-6 players accross the board in their respective age groups have moved up in the Spring to fill the gaps.
> 
> This is happening around the country and in ECNL as well.



17-3-1 isn't dominant?

82 goals for and 19 goals against isn't dominant?

Whether they are playing their age group or not doesn't change the fact they are crushing in that age group.  The two 03s have been on the team all year (and yes both are national team players).


----------



## dreamz

MakeAPlay said:


> That is yet another top club....


Crossfire isn't going anywhere. They are fully entrenched in Boys and Girls DA and fully fund both programs. There will be others leaving GDA but Crossfire won't be one of them.


----------



## C.A.M.

Kicker4Life said:


> From what I understand, there are more dominoes yet to fall on the GDA front.  Rumors also abound regarding some Big clubs dropping  ECNL.
> 
> Who knows what will happen in the end.


Are these big clubs dropping ECNL getting DA or do they already have DA?  Also  what part of the country are they in?


----------



## dreamz

Kicker4Life said:


> From what I understand, there are more dominoes yet to fall on the GDA front.  Rumors also abound regarding some Big clubs dropping  ECNL.
> 
> Who knows what will happen in the end.


I don't think those clubs are dropping ECNL by choice. The ultimatum from ECNL is forcing them to make a choice and with any of the big clubs that have boys DA, or some form thereof, they aren't going to choose ECNL over DA for fear of losing boys DA too. 
ECNL doesn't want the under-performing B teams from the DA clubs to be part of the league. They would rather add lower-level club A-teams from other parts of the country. After all, look at the new ECNL clubs added over the past month or so. Tell me those clubs have better A teams than some of the clubs B teams that they are giving the ultimatum too.
It's easy to figure out who got the ultimatum. 

Look at the ECNL conferences.
Figure out who has DA and ECNL.
Figure out who hasn't won a National Championship in the last 3-years (the criteria for staying in ECNL with DA too)
That's who is getting the ultimatums.

Yes, some big clubs indeed having to make some tough decisions.


----------



## C.A.M.

If Tophat, Solar or the SoCal teams were dropping out,  I'd be worried.  Dallas has 3 DA clubs I believe, Atlanta is a blowing up on the soccer scene from the bottom up and we all know SoCal is a soccer mecca for girls.  

No disrespect for those clubs leaving, but I feel the system will run without them.  The NWSL / MLS clubs are big into the DA system and that is our pro path (forget national team for 99% right?).


----------



## Simisoccerfan

I have been scanning some of the various soccer forums and there are a ton of rumors flying around.  I have yet to see anything that is beyond rumor.  Hawks took down their post (not sure why).  Some of the clubs rumored to be leaving DA have members on various ECNL boards and most of them seem to be dual DA/ECNL programs.  Maybe ECNL made them pick a league.  Saw a mention of Slammers leaving DA and a mention of Surf leaving ECNL.  People speculating the drive issue is a power play by DA, by ECNL, High School soccer, cost, travel, performance, etc...   My guess is that there was always going to be change year to year especially since DA just started.


----------



## C.A.M.

dreamz said:


> I don't think those clubs are dropping ECNL by choice. The ultimatum from ECNL is forcing them to make a choice and with any of the big clubs that have boys DA, or some form thereof, they aren't going to choose ECNL over DA for fear of losing boys DA too.
> ECNL doesn't want the under-performing B teams from the DA clubs to be part of the league. They would rather add lower-level club A-teams from other parts of the country. After all, look at the new ECNL clubs added over the past month or so. Tell me those clubs have better A teams than some of the clubs B teams that they are giving the ultimatum too.
> It's easy to figure out who got the ultimatum.
> 
> Look at the ECNL conferences.
> Figure out who has DA and ECNL.
> Figure out who hasn't won a National Championship in the last 3-years (the criteria for staying in ECNL with DA too)
> That's who is getting the ultimatums.
> 
> Yes, some big clubs indeed having to make some tough decisions.



Damn!  Early power play huh. 

Well I suspect the counter punch will be US Soccer not taking ECNL girls on the national level.  For most clubs, that doesn't mean a lot, but for these power clubs who advertise it on their website, it will have a longer effect.  This looks like a NFL/AFL, NBA/ABA situation where we will one day see an assimilation or merger.

I know around here all you hear about is which girls are going to the National Team or National Center Workouts.


----------



## C.A.M.

In what other top 20 soccer country is there an organization going to war with the country's federation? 

This is what makes America great and crappy at the same time.  LOL


----------



## Lambchop

Simisoccerfan said:


> I have been scanning some of the various soccer forums and there are a ton of rumors flying around.  I have yet to see anything that is beyond rumor.  Hawks took down their post (not sure why).  Some of the clubs rumored to be leaving DA have members on various ECNL boards and most of them seem to be dual DA/ECNL programs.  Maybe ECNL made them pick a league.  Saw a mention of Slammers leaving DA and a mention of Surf leaving ECNL.  People speculating the drive issue is a power play by DA, by ECNL, High School soccer, cost, travel, performance, etc...   My guess is that there was always going to be change year to year especially since DA just started.


Another "rumor" that WCFC/OC Surf leaving ECNL.  Anyone with info on that?


----------



## SocalPapa

If the Hawks and Eclipse leave GDA, that means half of the forwards on the current U.S. U-16 Girls National Team roster would be non-DA.

*FORWARDS (6):* Trinity Byars (Solar Chelsea; Richardson, Texas),* Michelle Cooper (Michigan Hawks; Clarkston, Mich.)*, Kailyn Dudukovich (Cincinnati Development Academy; West Chester, Ohio), Dilary Heredia-Beltran (Sporting Blue Valley; Overland Park, Kan.), *Reilyn Turner (So Cal Blues; Aliso Viejo, Calif.), Kalyssa Van Zanten (Eclipse Select SC; Buffalo Grove, Ill.)*


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Seems like it’s the dual clubs that need to decide.  If they have boys DA it’s likely staying DA.  If no boys DA then some of them are choosing ECNL.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Lambchop said:


> Another "rumor" that WCFC/OC Surf leaving ECNL.  Anyone with info on that?


Let’s not forget Surf Cup Sports Multi-Uear agreement to host Summer National DA event. Could play into any decision should Surf (not just the OC branch) be given an ultimatum by ECNL.


----------



## soccer4us

Crossfire may yet go. Who will they play in their area? Seattle reign is the only DA left. This could come into play but I understand the Boys DA being part of the situation. 

Concorde fire and Tophat could go too from Atlanta. They are both fed up with DA. 

Anyways, we'll see where the dominos fall. No doubt that some clubs are standing up to the so called bully with their cray rules and restrictions. I don't think any CA clubs will pull out if some big clubs like PDA, Hawks, Eclipse, Real Colorado, Tophat, etc it will some CA people talking what really makes sense. Fun times


----------



## SOCCERMINION

Lambchop said:


> Another "rumor" that WCFC/OC Surf leaving ECNL.  Anyone with info on that?


I've herd the Rumor about WCFC/ OC dumping ECNL. That wont change much. But the rumor that all the top teams 04, 03, 02 on Blues will be ECNL next year will,  if its true.
Woooo Hoooo!  More  Super Elite Teams to choose from next year, Where is my Check book? What do the patches look like????
DA Split team
DA Pilot Team
DPL
ECNL


----------



## soccer4us

SOCCERMINION said:


> I've herd the Rumor about WCFC/ OC dumping ECNL. That wont change much. But the rumor that all the top teams 04, 03, 02 on Blues will be ECNL next year will,  if its true.
> Woooo Hoooo!  More  Super Elite Teams to choose from next year, Where is my Check book? What do the patches look like????
> DA Split team
> DA Pilot Team
> DPL
> ECNL


I hear you get a patch for shorts too!


----------



## Real Deal

SocalPapa said:


> If the Hawks and Eclipse leave GDA, that means half of the forwards on the current U.S. U-16 Girls National Team roster would be non-DA.
> 
> *FORWARDS (6):* Trinity Byars (Solar Chelsea; Richardson, Texas),* Michelle Cooper (Michigan Hawks; Clarkston, Mich.)*, Kailyn Dudukovich (Cincinnati Development Academy; West Chester, Ohio), Dilary Heredia-Beltran (Sporting Blue Valley; Overland Park, Kan.), *Reilyn Turner (So Cal Blues; Aliso Viejo, Calif.), Kalyssa Van Zanten (Eclipse Select SC; Buffalo Grove, Ill.)*


Why is the Blues girl highlighted?
FYI-- Blues already has it's 05 DA team listed and they are the top 05s at the club


----------



## MarkM

Here is the article that confirms the clubs that are leaving DA:  https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77568/girls-development-academy-defections-three-major.html


----------



## espola

MarkM said:


> Here is the article that confirms the clubs that are leaving DA:  https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77568/girls-development-academy-defections-three-major.html


USSF is trying to import all the things that make boys DA unattractive without any of the things that make it attractive.


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> USSF is trying to import all the things that make boys DA unattractive without any of the things that make it attractive.


No matter the system,  its a personal choice.   You can have twins who play and each may have different needs to reach the end goal.


----------



## Soccer43

Real Deal said:


> Why is the Blues girl highlighted?
> FYI-- Blues already has it's 05 DA team listed and they are the top 05s at the club


Because she is on the ECNL team, not the DA team.


----------



## Real Deal

Soccer43 said:


> Because she is on the ECNL team, not the DA team.


Oh ok, got you!  

We will see. You can't go back to the past. It will be interesting to see how things play out-- but still too bad for the players that there's so much confusion all the time.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> That is a good point about the inequality.
> 
> Back then, the ECNL club DOC's were very happy with their little monopoly, but everybody was not happy. If ECNL had not been so busy protecting certain clubs' area monopoly and had been willing to add more clubs, then GDA would have had a much more difficult time attracting clubs to join. What will happen to the lower tier clubs like Sharks that ECNL added after GDA was founded? Are they going to ignore the GDA clubs like Legends and LAGSD that should have been added to ECNL and instead keep clubs like Sharks? If they do, they will be in a very similar situation to the one they were in before, with many top clubs not included (and the same could be said for GDA). And all of this is because the grown-ups at US Soccer and ECNL could not work out a compromise.


You misunderstand the reason why Legends and Carlsbad weren't invited to join the ECNL.  They had no track record of success in 2008/09 when the ECNL was formed.  Every significant accolade that those clubs have earned was gained after the ECNL clubs stopped participating in USYS events.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Real Deal said:


> Oh ok, got you!
> 
> We will see. You can't go back to the past. It will be interesting to see how things play out-- but still too bad for the players that there's so much confusion all the time.


The past is destined to repeat itself.  US Soccer hasn't changed.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> If Tophat, Solar or the SoCal teams were dropping out,  I'd be worried.  Dallas has 3 DA clubs I believe, Atlanta is a blowing up on the soccer scene from the bottom up and we all know SoCal is a soccer mecca for girls.
> 
> No disrespect for those clubs leaving, but I feel the system will run without them.  The NWSL / MLS clubs are big into the DA system and that is our pro path (forget national team for 99% right?).


The clubs are the developers.  Please name one NWSL club that has a highly performing team.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> You misunderstand the reason why Legends and Carlsbad weren't invited to join the ECNL.  They had no track record of success in 2008/09 when the ECNL was formed.  Every significant accolade that those clubs have earned was gained after the ECNL clubs stopped participating in USYS events.


And you continually fail to understand that circumstances changed in the 8 years between ECNL forming and GDA starting. In 2008/09, Surf was THE dominant club in San Diego county. In 2017 they were no longer clearly dominant due to internal problems and the growth of other clubs.


----------



## Multivitamin

Very interesting developments~ We are hearing a lot more are dropping GDA real soon!


http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/2018/04/18/fc-stars-michigan-hawks-pda-and-more-are-all-in-for-2018-19/

https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77568/girls-development-academy-defections-three-major.html


----------



## Chris Knight

Multivitamin said:


> Very interesting developments~ We are hearing a lot more are dropping GDA real soon!
> 
> 
> http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/2018/04/18/fc-stars-michigan-hawks-pda-and-more-are-all-in-for-2018-19/
> 
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77568/girls-development-academy-defections-three-major.html



Vitamin --

C'mon now.  You're like a kid on Christmas morning ... literally giddy with delight.

Let's keep the propaganda over on the NTX forum.  These guys are good.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> And you continually fail to understand that circumstances changed in the 8 years between ECNL forming and GDA starting. In 2008/09, Surf was THE dominant club in San Diego county. In 2017 they were no longer clearly dominant due to internal problems and the growth of other clubs.


In your mind they may no longer be the dominant club but what exactly has Carlsbad done in GDA so far?  How much success have they actually had as a club? Please share some measurable metric since 2010 (which my player played club from 2007-2016) that backs up your statement outside of the USYS results against the non-ECNL clubs.

I get it that you are a homer but let's see some objective data.  Carlsbad Elite was good in my player's age group (Duggan coached them) and they were perhaps deserving of being in ECNL as an INDIVIDUAL team, however, overall the club had no track record of success at the regional or national level.  That is why they were excluded.  Who knows what will happen this time around.  It seems like they might have bet on the wrong horse.  Either way it's about the player not the team/club anyway.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## Toepoke

MarkM said:


> Here is the article that confirms the clubs that are leaving DA:  https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77568/girls-development-academy-defections-three-major.html


This is very telling considering the clubs leaving GDA in comparison to the new clubs being added. No disrespect to the 4 clubs mentioned in the article but the level of success of FC Stars, PDA and Hawks are hard to ignore. Anyone who has followed girls soccer over the years knows those are 3 powerhouse clubs that have proven the ability to place girls on the big stage of international competition. Hard for GDA to make the claim of being the best when replacing successful clubs with clubs that don't have the same resume or proven track record. If USSF doesn't figure something out moving forward and additional successful clubs from across the country pull out of GDA and join ECNL full time, then GDA will become the 2nd tier national league with ECNL reclaiming the throne.


----------



## Real Deal

MakeAPlay said:


> In your mind they may no longer be the dominant club but what exactly has Carlsbad done in GDA so far?  How much success have they actually had as a club? Please share some measurable metric since 2010 (which my player played club from 2007-2016) that backs up your statement outside of the USYS results against the non-ECNL clubs.
> 
> I get it that you are a homer but let's see some objective data.  Carlsbad Elite was good in my player's age group (Duggan coached them) and they were perhaps deserving of being in ECNL as an INDIVIDUAL team, however, overall the club had no track record of success at the regional or national level.  That is why they were excluded.  Who knows what will happen this time around.  It seems like they might have bet on the wrong horse.  Either way it's about the player not the team/club anyway.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


"Carlsbad,"-- and especially Legends and Beach, are all proving themselves competitive in GDA.  Shouldn't that now prove that they are (and probably were) "ECNL-worthy?"


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Its way to early to declare anything yet.  This is just the opening round of this battle.  It appears that ECNL gave some sort of ultimatum to the dual clubs.  Those with strong ties to ECNL decided to end their involvement in DA.  FC Stars, Hawks and other teams have members in the ECNL leadership and on the various ECNL boards.   PDA is not a dual club but I bet they get a lot of money from ECNL for the New Jersey event.   What is surprising is that they even flirted with the DA in the first place.  On the flip side the rumors indicate that the dual teams with a boys DA program are dropping DA.  

So what does this mean for SoCal?  If West Coast (OC Surf) and Surf drop ECNL then ECNL is down to only 5 teams in SoCal.  All of these teams south or east of LA County.  Even if LAFC Slammers and the Blues went only DA there would still be 11 SoCal DA teams.   ECNL would need to recruit some additional clubs in LA quickly to make their league play attractive.  Otherwise you add a lot of travel.


----------



## Lambchop

Toepoke said:


> This is very telling considering the clubs leaving GDA in comparison to the new clubs being added. No disrespect to the 4 clubs mentioned in the article but the level of success of FC Stars, PDA and Hawks are hard to ignore. Anyone who has followed girls soccer over the years knows those are 3 powerhouse clubs that have proven the ability to place girls on the big stage of international competition. Hard for GDA to make the claim of being the best when replacing successful clubs with clubs that don't have the same resume or proven track record. If USSF doesn't figure something out moving forward and additional successful clubs from across the country pull out of GDA and join ECNL full time, then GDA will become the 2nd tier national league with ECNL reclaiming the throne.


PDA is now not leaving DA.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Real Deal said:


> "Carlsbad,"-- and especially Legends and Beach, are all proving themselves competitive in GDA.  Shouldn't that now prove that they are (and probably were) "ECNL-worthy?"


They were not ECNL worthy as a club in it's entirety in the past.  As of now it will be again up tot he membership to decide if they want them.  They are "proving themselves" now in a divided landscape.  Legends and Beach are benefiting from talent that may have gone elsewhere prior to GDA.  We will find out in the coming years who wins.  I know who loses right now.  The players.  I am sorry that you have to deal with this during your daughter's club career especially if she is a 2021-2024 graduate.  This experiment is happening during their prime recruiting years.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> PDA is now not leaving DA.


You sure about that Lamby?

http://www.pdasoccer.org/home/940192.html


https://www.dropbox.com/s/xt8ug9rijn07ynv/Girls ECNL All In 18-19.pdf?dl=0

http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/2018/04/18/fc-stars-michigan-hawks-pda-and-more-are-all-in-for-2018-19/


----------



## Pitch pop

Lambchop said:


> PDA is now not leaving DA.


You sure about that?

http://www.pdasoccer.org/home/940192.html


----------



## espola

outside! said:


> And you continually fail to understand that circumstances changed in the 8 years between ECNL forming and GDA starting. In 2008/09, Surf was THE dominant club in San Diego county. In 2017 they were no longer clearly dominant due to internal problems and the growth of other clubs.


On the girls side, Surf was "dominant".  Their boys side teams were pretty much run of the mill, regularly getting beaten by Nomads boys and more or less even with longstanding clubs like Crusaders, Albion, Vaqueros, and Hotspurs. Surf and Nomads got the original boys San Diego County PDA slots because of soccer politics.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> Its way to early to declare anything yet.  This is just the opening round of this battle.  It appears that ECNL gave some sort of ultimatum to the dual clubs.  Those with strong ties to ECNL decided to end their involvement in DA.  FC Stars, Hawks and other teams have members in the ECNL leadership and on the various ECNL boards.   PDA is not a dual club but I bet they get a lot of money from ECNL for the New Jersey event.   What is surprising is that they even flirted with the DA in the first place.  On the flip side the rumors indicate that the dual teams with a boys DA program are dropping DA.
> 
> So what does this mean for SoCal?  If West Coast (OC Surf) and Surf drop ECNL then ECNL is down to only 5 teams in SoCal.  All of these teams south or east of LA County.  Even if LAFC Slammers and the Blues went only DA there would still be 11 SoCal DA teams.   ECNL would need to recruit some additional clubs in LA quickly to make their league play attractive.  Otherwise you add a lot of travel.


Surf and Blues are not leaving ECNL and Slammers is leaving GDA.  Those are the 3 most successful clubs in SoCal bar none.  This debate is not a new one.  If the old forum still existed you could simply pull up these same arguments from 6 years ago and they go on and on ad nauseum.

Like I said long ago this GDA idea was another half baked US Soccer initiative.


----------



## SoccerisFun

espola said:


> On the girls side, Surf was "dominant".  Their boys side teams were pretty much run of the mill, regularly getting beaten by Nomads boys and more or less even with longstanding clubs like Crusaders, Albion, Vaqueros, and Hotspurs. Surf and Nomads got the original boys San Diego County PDA slots because of soccer politics.


Not to hijack the thread, but ask anybody involved with the Boys DA "now", not 7-8 years ago, and they will tell you that Surf's Boys DA is no longer run of the mill.  They are competing with all the top teams in the Boys DA.   Surf girls, well, they're Surf girls.  They will always be one of the best.


----------



## soccer4us

Slammers is a big one if they are out.

It's pretty simple. ECNL was geared towards 100% of the players who ambition of playing college soccer. DA is geared towards .0005% playing on YNT. It's not some special formula. ECNL has common sense. US soccer well....enough said.


----------



## espola

SoccerisFun said:


> Not to hijack the thread, but ask anybody involved with the Boys DA "now", not 7-8 years ago, and they will tell you that Surf's Boys DA is no longer run of the mill.  They are competing with all the top teams in the Boys DA.   Surf girls, well, they're Surf girls.  They will always be one of the best.


"Competing with" sometimes means last place.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/sam/standings/league/standings.php?leagueId=MTAwNw==


----------



## SocalPapa

Simisoccerfan said:


> PDA is not a dual club but I bet they get a lot of money from ECNL for the New Jersey event.


Someone else corrected me on this point earlier.  Sky Blue - PDA is actually a dual GDA/ECNL club.  Apparently there are 3 clubs who have different names for their GDA and ECNL teams:  NYCFC is World Class, Fury NY is Albertson Fury, and Sky Blue - PDA is PDA.  I haven't confirmed independently.


----------



## timbuck

MakeAPlay said:


> Surf and Blues are not leaving ECNL and Slammers is leaving GDA.  Those are the 3 most successful clubs in SoCal bar none.  This debate is not a new one.  If the old forum still existed you could simply pull up these same arguments from 6 years ago and they go on and on ad nauseum.
> 
> Like I said long ago this GDA idea was another half baked US Soccer initiative.


Did I miss the news on Slammers leaving girls DA?  Is this true?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> PDA is now not leaving DA.


I wonder sometimes what magic 8 ball you get your info from.....


----------



## MakeAPlay

timbuck said:


> Did I miss the news on Slammers leaving girls DA?  Is this true?


Look at the list of ECNL only clubs on this list..
'
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xt8ug9rijn07ynv/Girls ECNL All In 18-19.pdf?dl=0


----------



## Simisoccerfan

MakeAPlay said:


> Surf and Blues are not leaving ECNL and Slammers is leaving GDA.  Those are the 3 most successful clubs in SoCal bar none.  This debate is not a new one.  If the old forum still existed you could simply pull up these same arguments from 6 years ago and they go on and on ad nauseum.
> 
> Like I said long ago this GDA idea was another half baked US Soccer initiative.


I did not imply that Blues were leaving ECNL.   In fact I was speculating that they would leave DA if they were forced to choose.  The opposite for Surf due to their DA ties on the boys side and the DA Oceanside deal.  Note that Surf is not listed on the All In list yet.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> Look at the list of ECNL only clubs on this list..
> '
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/xt8ug9rijn07ynv/Girls ECNL All In 18-19.pdf?dl=0


Wow!  Slammers has two top 5 GDA teams.  That's a huge blow.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Look at the list of ECNL only clubs on this list..
> '
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/xt8ug9rijn07ynv/Girls ECNL All In 18-19.pdf?dl=0


Daddies will let their daughters play HS if they choose, that is my guess.


----------



## soccer4us

MakeAPlay said:


> Look at the list of ECNL only clubs on this list..
> '
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/xt8ug9rijn07ynv/Girls ECNL All In 18-19.pdf?dl=0


no surf, blues...ECNL made them choose I guess


----------



## Simisoccerfan

soccer4us said:


> no surf, blues...ECNL made them choose I guess


I don't think that list is a final list.


----------



## SimpleSoccer

timbuck said:


> Did I miss the news on Slammers leaving girls DA?  Is this true?


It’s all in the name

Slammers FC are “all-in” for ECNL

LAFC Slammers are still in DA


----------



## Real Deal

MakeAPlay said:


> You misunderstand the reason why Legends and Carlsbad weren't invited to join the ECNL.  They had no track record of success in 2008/09 when the ECNL was formed.  Every significant accolade that those clubs have earned was gained after the ECNL clubs stopped participating in USYS events.


Thanks.  And _currently,_  do you feel that all the SoCal clubs on that list are more worthy than a Legends, Beach, LAGSD?


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Right now ECNL is making a move but so far they are failing to serve the 11 Million plus people that live in LA and Ventura Counties.  That's a population greater than 45 states.  Yes there are a few crazy parents that will make that drive to the OC and a few special kids that have deals where they don't need to practice with the team.   But that is a glaring omission that I wish ECNL would correct.  It would be nice to have ECNL as an option.


----------



## Pitch pop

soccer4us said:


> no surf, blues...ECNL made them choose I guess


What would the Baker teams do?


----------



## soccer4us

Simisoccerfan said:


> I don't think that list is a final list.


I agree. It's just the updated one. More to come before tryouts


----------



## El Clasico

Lambchop said:


> PDA is now not leaving DA.


What is your agenda? Always the same. Do you intentionally try to deceive or are you just stupid?


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> Right now ECNL is making a move but so far they are failing to serve the 11 Million plus people that live in LA and Ventura Counties.  That's a population greater than 45 states.  Yes there are a few crazy parents that will make that drive to the OC and a few special kids that have deals where they don't need to practice with the team.   But that is a glaring omission that I wish ECNL would correct.  It would be nice to have ECNL as an option.


Agreed.


----------



## G03_SD

Pitch pop said:


> Agreed.


_I know a family in Michigan who drives 4 hours RT so their kid can practice with an ECNL team twice a week. Not 4 hours in traffic, 4 hours due to distance.  We in CA are spoiled. We want everything in our backyard._


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> I did not imply that Blues were leaving ECNL.   In fact I was speculating that they would leave DA if they were forced to choose.  The opposite for Surf due to their DA ties on the boys side and the DA Oceanside deal.  Note that Surf is not listed on the All In list yet.


Surf is more than large enough to compete in both.  They go where the wind blows but always in the first wave...


----------



## Pitch pop

G03_SD said:


> _I know a family in Michigan who drives 4 hours RT so their kid can practice with an ECNL team twice a week. Not 4 hours in traffic, 4 hours due to distance.  We in CA are spoiled. We want everything in our backyard._


Michigan to Socal = Apples to oranges and not even close in any way, other than the fact we are talking about soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Daddies will let their daughters play HS if they choose, that is my guess.


Yup I lived that experience.  No matter what you say to them if their friends know that they are a good soccer player they will grind them until they play.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

G03_SD said:


> _I know a family in Michigan who drives 4 hours RT so their kid can practice with an ECNL team twice a week. Not 4 hours in traffic, 4 hours due to distance.  We in CA are spoiled. We want everything in our backyard._


Just because someone is crazy enough to drive 4 hours to practice doesn't make us in CA spoiled.  Most people are scraping by with two parents both working long hours to meet their family needs.   The vast majority of players don't have rich parents that can afford to take that much time off of work (or have one parent not working) or to invest that much of their free time into driving to practice.  In fact most would think that those parents are spoiling that kid by driving them 4 hours to practice.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Real Deal said:


> Thanks.  And _currently,_  do you feel that all the SoCal clubs on that list are more worthy than a Legends, Beach, LAGSD?


Yes.  I would probably allow Beach in based upon their coaching staff.  Legends and Carlsbad definitely not.


----------



## shales1002

Simisoccerfan said:


> Just because someone is crazy enough to drive 4 hours to practice doesn't make us in CA spoiled.  Most people are scraping by with two parents both working long hours to meet their family needs.   The vast majority of players don't have rich parents that can afford to take that much time off of work (or have one parent not working) or to invest that much of their free time into driving to practice.  In fact most would think that those parents are spoiling that kid by driving them 4 hours to practice.


 I think what is being implied is that many people on here complain about ECNL not being in L.A. county. When in all honesty the distance is less than 100 miles; probably less than 50.  This person, whoever it is, is driving 4 hours without traffic to do what's best for his/her DD. So simply put, time to put some miles on the car and do what you have to do.


----------



## espola

shales1002 said:


> I think what is being implied is that many people on here complain about ECNL not being in L.A. county. When in all honesty the distance is less than 100 miles; probably less than 50.  This person, whoever it is, is driving 4 hours without traffic to do what's best for his/her DD. So simply put, time to put some miles on the car and do what you have to do.


Some players are good enough that all that effort and expense is just a waste, and some are so weak it won't matter.  I guess it helps the few in the middle.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> Just because someone is crazy enough to drive 4 hours to practice doesn't make us in CA spoiled.  Most people are scraping by with two parents both working long hours to meet their family needs.   The vast majority of players don't have rich parents that can afford to take that much time off of work (or have one parent not working) or to invest that much of their free time into driving to practice.  In fact most would think that those parents are spoiling that kid by driving them 4 hours to practice.


Slammers had a player in my daughter's age group that lived in Virginia and commuted.  Her father was CEO of some Fortune 500.  Also the General Manager of the MGM Grand's daughters moved from Vegas to Newport Coast to play for Slammers.  One is at Duke and the other is on one of the Slammers teams and is allegedly going to UCLA (I say allegedly because my daughter can't confirm it and it isn't reported anywhere but in a signing day release by her school).

I try not to judge what extremes people are willing to go through for their kids because I used to drive my kid an hour an a half 3 days a week for school when she was younger.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Its great that you could make the time for that drive for school.  Most that are required to work 8-5 can't.  And the uber rich are in a league of their own.


----------



## SoccerFan

Toepoke said:


> This is very telling considering the clubs leaving GDA in comparison to the new clubs being added. No disrespect to the 4 clubs mentioned in the article but the level of success of FC Stars, PDA and Hawks are hard to ignore. Anyone who has followed girls soccer over the years knows those are 3 powerhouse clubs that have proven the ability to place girls on the big stage of international competition. Hard for GDA to make the claim of being the best when replacing successful clubs with clubs that don't have the same resume or proven track record. If USSF doesn't figure something out moving forward and additional successful clubs from across the country pull out of GDA and join ECNL full time, then GDA will become the 2nd tier national league with ECNL reclaiming the throne.


1st year for GDA  and season is not even over. Clubs have players in DA who are able to play at the highest level. These players are viewed as “having excellent soccer skills & ability to develop to their full potential”. Too soon to be making conclusions! Be patient.


----------



## espola

SoccerFan said:


> 1st year for GDA  and season is not even over. Clubs have players in DA who are able to play at the highest level. These players are viewed as “having excellent soccer skills & ability to develop to their full potential”. Too soon to be making conclusions! Be patient.


If they already have excellent soccer skills, what will be developed?


----------



## Kicker4Life

SocalPapa said:


> Wow!  Slammers has two top 5 GDA teams.  That's a huge blow.


If true, yes.  However know one knows how or if they are making a distinction between LAFC Slammers (GDA) and Slammers.


----------



## Kicker4Life

shales1002 said:


> I think what is being implied is that many people on here complain about ECNL not being in L.A. county. When in all honesty the distance is less than 100 miles; probably less than 50.  This person, whoever it is, is driving 4 hours without traffic to do what's best for his/her DD. So simply put, time to put some miles on the car and do what you have to do.


Ok, since you know so much about the LA geography. If I live Manhattan Beach, how long does it take me to get to Irvine Great Park (where 3 different ECNL clubs train) at 6pm on a week day (roughly 35 miles)?


----------



## Real Deal

shales1002 said:


> I think what is being implied is that many people on here complain about ECNL not being in L.A. county. When in all honesty the distance is less than 100 miles; probably less than 50.  This person, whoever it is, is driving 4 hours without traffic to do what's best for his/her DD. So simply put, time to put some miles on the car and do what you have to do.


I think the bigger point is that there are no ECNL clubs in LA County and 3 training at one facility in Orange County.  How does that make any sense?


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> You misunderstand the reason why Legends and Carlsbad weren't invited to join the ECNL.  They had no track record of success in 2008/09 when the ECNL was formed.  Every significant accolade that those clubs have earned was gained after the ECNL clubs stopped participating in USYS events.


The reason Carlsbad United was not invited to participate in ECNL in 2016 is because Surf wanted to maintain their monopoly in the county. During this first season of GDA LAGSD (former Carlsbad United) is very competitive against Surf. LAGSD are ranked higher in the GU15 and GU16/17 age groups and the GU18/19 age group tied Surf 2-2 in the only game they have played against one another so far. The 99/00 team also beat the Surf ECNL National Championship team 2-0 when they faced them in the quarter finals at Surf Cup. Times change and ECNL did not keep up. If ECNL had not been so busy protecting some member clubs' area monopolies, GDA would have had a much harder time getting interest from so many clubs. GDA exploited the corruption within ECNL. GDA is not perfect by any stretch of the immagination and ECNL may indeed come out on top. To say that Legends and LAGSD cannot compete in the same league with Surf (or Sharks!) is myopic however.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

I will take up that challenge.  You would leave work at 3:00 pm.  Hopefully you work fairly close to home and you leave with your kid by 4:00 pm.  Some days you make it on time but other days your stressed out and barely make it on time.  While you kid practices you either sleep in the car or talk to your other kids and spouse on the phone since you need to remain part of their life.  You pick up fast food after practice and attempt to eat it while driving home (not the best food for your kid or yourself).  You get home by 9:30 pm.  Somehow your kid manages to do their homework in the car.   You get home, say hi to the rest of the family and do whatever you need to do before going to bed at 10:30 pm.  The alarm goes off in six hours at 4:30 am.  You need to be at work by 6:00 am since you leave by 3:00 pm.  You repeat this cycle 3 days a week hoping for no early games on the weekend so you can finally get some sleep.  Hopefully you don't have more than a 30 minute drive too and from work and your spouse doesn't travel and can take care of the remainder of the family (including getting them to and from school) while you spend your life on the freeways.


----------



## shales1002

Real Deal said:


> I think the bigger point is that there are no ECNL clubs in LA County and 3 training at one facility in Orange County.  How does that make any sense?


 It makes absolutely no sense. There should be an ECNL club in L.A. County, but there isn't. The two that were BOTH went GDA although they are right next door to each other.  The point is that you do what you have to do.


----------



## shales1002

Kicker4Life said:


> Ok, since you know so much about the LA geography. If I live Manhattan Beach, how long does it take me to get to Irvine Great Park (where 3 different ECNL clubs train) at 6pm on a week day (roughly 35 miles)?


Easy! Since there is ALWAYS traffic on the 405 it would take you 2 hours.  You would have to leave and be on the road no later than 3:15 in order to "beat" the traffic. If you are lucky from Manhattan Beach, w/o traffic should take you about 1 hour.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

shales1002 said:


> It makes absolutely no sense. There should be an ECNL club in L.A. County, but there isn't. The two that were BOTH went GDA although they are right next door to each other.  The point is that you do what you have to do.


With evening traffic its at least a 45 minute drive from the pit where Real practices to field where Eagles practice.  Not as close as you think.  Certainly many OC clubs much closer to each other (though I admit Real and Eagles pull players from the same geographic area).   Its another 45 minutes plus from Real to LA Premier.  The drive to LA Galaxy is the kiss of death on the 405 and could be 2 hours.


----------



## shales1002

Simisoccerfan said:


> I will take up that challenge.  You would leave work at 3:00 pm.  Hopefully you work fairly close to home and you leave with your kid by 4:00 pm.  Some days you make it on time but other days your stressed out and barely make it on time.  While you kid practices you either sleep in the car or talk to your other kids and spouse on the phone since you need to remain part of their life.  You pick up fast food after practice and attempt to eat it while driving home (not the best food for your kid or yourself).  You get home by 9:30 pm.  Somehow your kid manages to do their homework in the car.   You get home, say hi to the rest of the family and do whatever you need to do before going to bed at 10:30 pm.  The alarm goes off in six hours at 4:30 am.  You need to be at work by 6:00 am since you leave by 3:00 pm.  You repeat this cycle 3 days a week hoping for no early games on the weekend so you can finally get some sleep.  Hopefully you don't have more than a 30 minute drive too and from work and your spouse doesn't travel and can take care of the remainder of the family (including getting them to and from school) while you spend your life on the freeways.


 Hey that's my answer


----------



## Overtime

shales1002 said:


> Easy! Since there is ALWAYS traffic on the 405 it would take you 2 hours.  You would have to leave and be on the road no later than 3:15 in order to "beat" the traffic. If you are lucky from Manhattan Beach, w/o traffic should take you about 1 hour.


Long Beach takes an nearly an hour at that time.  2 hours minimum from MB.


----------



## G03_SD

http://www.latimes.com/local/great-reads/la-me-c1-soccer-girl-20141015-story.html

I showed my daughter this article few years back. I told her to quit complaining about long car rides, anywhere, or take the bus!


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> Its great that you could make the time for that drive for school.  Most that are required to work 8-5 can't.  And the uber rich are in a league of their own.


I am a working person too.  Back then it was 9-6ish.  I would leave my house before 6 stop and get her breakfast (she would sleep on the ride) and then drop her off.  It wasn't easy but it was worth it to our family.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> Ok, since you know so much about the LA geography. If I live Manhattan Beach, how long does it take me to get to Irvine Great Park (where 3 different ECNL clubs train) at 6pm on a week day (roughly 35 miles)?


Sounds like an equation without all of the variables.  Do you have a chopper?  A motorcycle and like to take risks?  Have you ever thought about the train (the station is walking distance from the Great Park)?  You really have to be kidding with this question....


----------



## Kicker4Life

shales1002 said:


> Easy! Since there is ALWAYS traffic on the 405 it would take you 2 hours.  You would have to leave and be on the road no later than 3:15 in order to "beat" the traffic. If you are lucky from Manhattan Beach, w/o traffic should take you about 1 hour.


To bad kids don’t get out of school till 3:30 cause then they will be late to practice every time and have homework to do after dinner when they get home at 9:30’ish.  

After seeing another post, it is clear you get the point I am working towards. SoCal is one of the largest most densely populated areas and to have 3 ECNL clubs training at the same facility yet nothing else within 2 hours (North) is a bit lopsided......nevertheless, I’m just fortunate my DD has the Coaches she has and Training is now 10 Min from my house rather than an hour and despite which side of the fence you sit, GDA has been a good fit for her up to this point.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> Sounds like an equation without all of the variables.  Do you have a chopper?  A motorcycle and like to take risks?  Have you ever thought about the train (the station is walking distance from the Great Park)?  You really have to be kidding with this question....


Yes...:I was.


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> The reason Carlsbad United was not invited to participate in ECNL in 2016 is because Surf wanted to maintain their monopoly in the county. During this first season of GDA LAGSD (former Carlsbad United) is very competitive against Surf. LAGSD are ranked higher in the GU15 and GU16/17 age groups and the GU18/19 age group tied Surf 2-2 in the only game they have played against one another so far. The 99/00 team also beat the Surf ECNL National Championship team 2-0 when they faced them in the quarter finals at Surf Cup. Times change and ECNL did not keep up. If ECNL had not been so busy protecting some member clubs' area monopolies, GDA would have had a much harder time getting interest from so many clubs. GDA exploited the corruption within ECNL. GDA is not perfect by any stretch of the immagination and ECNL may indeed come out on top. To say that Legends and LAGSD cannot compete in the same league with Surf (or Sharks!) is myopic however.


I understand all the pent up angst against Surf but you are pointing to 4 data points for Carlsbad versus the thousands that are against it!!  Carlsbad wouldn't have even gotten GDA if not for the "partnership" with LA Galaxy.  I am a San Diego county resident and have been involved in club soccer since 2006/07.  If you seriously think that those 4 data points prove anything I will dispute each of those 4 points in detail.  You will see soon enough so please don't continue with this I have a couple of games that I want to watch.

Corruption within ECNL?  That is pretty funny.  You realize that US Soccer is the real criminal....


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> I will take up that challenge.  You would leave work at 3:00 pm.  Hopefully you work fairly close to home and you leave with your kid by 4:00 pm.  Some days you make it on time but other days your stressed out and barely make it on time.  While you kid practices you either sleep in the car or talk to your other kids and spouse on the phone since you need to remain part of their life.  You pick up fast food after practice and attempt to eat it while driving home (not the best food for your kid or yourself).  You get home by 9:30 pm.  Somehow your kid manages to do their homework in the car.   You get home, say hi to the rest of the family and do whatever you need to do before going to bed at 10:30 pm.  The alarm goes off in six hours at 4:30 am.  You need to be at work by 6:00 am since you leave by 3:00 pm.  You repeat this cycle 3 days a week hoping for no early games on the weekend so you can finally get some sleep.  Hopefully you don't have more than a 30 minute drive too and from work and your spouse doesn't travel and can take care of the remainder of the family (including getting them to and from school) while you spend your life on the freeways.


It takes sacrifice to make a life work.  Look at it this way.  You could be in Syria just hoping for barrel bombs to stop falling.
#FIRSTWORLDPROBLEMS


----------



## Dos Equis

Kicker4Life said:


> Ok, since you know so much about the LA geography. If I live Manhattan Beach, how long does it take me to get to Irvine Great Park (where 3 different ECNL clubs train) at 6pm on a week day (roughly 35 miles)?


Around an hour and a half there, just over an hour home.  Both subject to accident delays and occasional light traffic surprises.  There are alternate routes to use if you stay on top of traffic reports that make these times pretty much the norm.  You need to leave by 4:15 to be safe.


----------



## MakeAPlay

G03_SD said:


> http://www.latimes.com/local/great-reads/la-me-c1-soccer-girl-20141015-story.html
> 
> I showed my daughter this article few years back. I told her to quit complaining about long car rides, anywhere, or take the bus!


Great story.


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> I understand all the pent up angst against Surf but you are pointing to 4 data points for Carlsbad versus the thousands that are against it!!  Carlsbad wouldn't have even gotten GDA if not for the "partnership" with LA Galaxy.  I am a San Diego county resident and have been involved in club soccer since 2006/07.  If you seriously think that those 4 data points prove anything I will dispute each of those 4 points in detail.  You will see soon enough so please don't continue with this I have a couple of games that I want to watch.
> 
> Corruption within ECNL?  That is pretty funny.  You realize that US Soccer is the real criminal....


I have no pent up angst against Surf. It is a completely different club than it was when we were there, and my angst was only focused on a few individuals at Surf that are all gone now. Surf has many fine coaches and teams and appears to be a well run club. They are not the only game in town anymore for girls, and they never will be again. The first 3 of the 4 data points are current results. With all the changes that have taken place, the past really does not matter that much now. I have never tried to say Legends or LAGSD were better than Surf. I am only saying that they are competitive with Surf. I am sure most Surf parents would prefer to have more games with competitive relatively local opponents versus traveling out of state for roughly the same competition.

We all understand you are a Surf/ECNL homer, but things change. I agree that US Soccer is definitely a criminal organization. If ECNL limiting the number of clubs in San Diego was not the result of protecting Surf's fiefdom, then it was just stupid. So the leadership were either corrupt or stupid. If it was happening here, it probably happened elsewhere (the refusal of new clubs due to corruption or stupidity).


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Interesting that the ECNL website is down.


----------



## MarkM

Simisoccerfan said:


> Interesting that the ECNL website is down.


It must be US Soccer's fault.  US Soccer is so evil.


----------



## Toepoke

SoccerFan said:


> 1st year for GDA  and season is not even over. Clubs have players in DA who are able to play at the highest level. These players are viewed as “having excellent soccer skills & ability to develop to their full potential”. Too soon to be making conclusions! Be patient.


True it's the 1st season for GDA but losing 3 successful clubs after the first season and having Blues choose to have their top players (01-04) play ECNL can't help them claim the title of being the most competitive national league. I think that's a fair statement more than a conclusion.


----------



## SoccerFan

espola said:


> If they already have excellent soccer skills, what will be developed?


DA develops to the level of college play and possibly WNT!


----------



## Kicker4Life

Toepoke said:


> True it's the 1st season for GDA but losing 3 successful clubs after the first season and having Blues choose to have their top players (01-04) play ECNL can't help them claim the title of being the most competitive national league. I think that's a fair statement more than a conclusion.


So Blues is moving their ‘04 “best players” to ECNL next year? What happens to Kales team if that happens?


----------



## Josep

Blues 03 best team is Bobak.  They don’t play second fiddle to ARs team.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Josep said:


> Blues 03 best team is Bobak.  They don’t play second fiddle to ARs team.


No argument here!  That team stayed mostly in tact from ‘16/17 right?


----------



## 4DaLuvoftheGM

Not sure if this was posted or not.

https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77573/leaving-the-development-academy-fc-stars-director.html


----------



## Josep

Thanks for posting. 

His points are all valid.  This is the problem with the country.  They all can’t keep up with the pockets of soccer regions that are rich in players.


----------



## Desert Hound

Kicker4Life said:


> So Blues is moving their ‘04 “best players” to ECNL next year? What happens to Kales team if that happens?


Is this confirmed?


----------



## Dos Equis

MakeAPlay said:


> Yes.  I would probably allow Beach in based upon their coaching staff.  Legends and Carlsbad definitely not.


Beach was just another decent South Bay club until the PVSC/Exiles self-immolated and 16-20 teams and a bunch of coaches defected to Beach -- I recall around 5 years ago.  Beach itself has been around for 10-11 years?  Credit Mauricio and club management for the impressive growth.    Beach has done an excellent job of consolidating/recruiting coaches (and fields) from South Bay Force (now LAG), Exiles and even Fram, and have emerged as a club much more qualified to be part of ECNL/DA only in the last 3-4 years.  Who knows if they even applied to ECNL in that brief window before the GDA application went live, and I would not fault ECNL for caution, since a long track record as an organization they did not possess.    

ECNL did not have a sound geographical approach for LA County, nor for San Diego.  But arguing they were ignoring obvious additions shows a lack of understanding of the often brief history of some of the "neglected" clubs.  No doubt politics played a role, but as MAP points out regarding pre-ECNL versus post-ECNL performance, and others claim, ECNL's creation and neglect of their markets likely facilitated the growth and success of these clubs.


----------



## C.A.M.

4DaLuvoftheGM said:


> Not sure if this was posted or not.
> 
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77573/leaving-the-development-academy-fc-stars-director.html



I read it this morning.   I made a lot of these points when this all started. DA clearly isn't for everyone. Pretending it was all inclusive leads to a lot of animosity. 

In the IE we have a lot of good public schools so we don't have to worry about the waivers.   My girl plays in the Valley though and most of the girls on her team go to private schools. With the costs I can see why girls would need to play high school. The club wasn't doing waivers so I see a lot of the 01-02 players who are really good on the DPL.  Our 03 team probably lost some players due to not having waivers. 

The sub rule is a game changer.   Especially with the girls learning a brand new system.   Some people simply don't learn very fast on the fly and need to come out the game and watch then try again.  I really think it comes down to the coaching to be honest.  No matter how good a coach is at practice,  game management is the real key factor in having your team run the system right.  We get frustrated because our coach tends to keep the girls who are struggling on the field and the ones who are doing good get pulled.   I don't see that so much on other teams.   Guess its all in how the coach thinks he or she needs to develop. With game time so limited,  I prefer the reward system of playing those that get it over those that don't.

I don't have a problem with no outside competition.   My kid didn't sign up for the DA to have to play NPL the next day because the coach didn't play her.   We have been on that roller coaster before and it really doesn't help develop a player to play with lesser level competition.   Also,  some coaches use it as a punishment for a kid,  which is what happened to us.   

No one signs up not to play,  but you also have to be realistic about your level as a player. Watching kids make the same mistakes they were 7 months ago or not developing a first touch,  etc... kind of makes it clear the player isn't ready for this level.   The speed of play makes it difficult to get better if you aren't putting in the proper amount of work. No amount of game time can fix the fact you aren't working on your game outside of practice. 

One thing I told my daughter.   If you can play a whole 80 or 90 minutes at a high level in the DA,  college will be a breeze because you can actually get subbed and come back in there.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> The clubs are the developers.  Please name one NWSL club that has a highly performing team.


I was speaking more on a financial perspective.  It's a lot easier to get talented players when the cost to join and travel is $0 or close to it.  It's also easier to get good coaches when you can pay them better. 

The clubs are always the developers which is why some smaller clubs are a great place for the kids to start and stay at until it's time to get more exposure and better competition.


----------



## Dubs

Did anyone see the clip from April Heinrichs talking about the DA and Spring Showcase?  She outright said that 80% of all YNT players play in the DA.  This is such BS.  How many kids are they bypassing because they're not in DA.  The audacity/ego of these folks is cray.  Such a broken system.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> You misunderstand the reason why Legends and Carlsbad weren't invited to join the ECNL.  They had no track record of success in 2008/09 when the ECNL was formed.  Every significant accolade that those clubs have earned was gained after the ECNL clubs stopped participating in USYS events.


Also - to get into ECNL you have to have a 100% yes vote and two clubs clearly never voted yes for Legends.  You guess which two made out the most with them being out.  

US Soccer has their guidelines to becoming a member club posted on their website.  ECNL has an application which asks tons of questions about your club, but doesn't post guidelines.  I just looked it up.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Dos Equis said:


> Beach was just another decent South Bay club until the PVSC/Exiles self-immolated and 16-20 teams and a bunch of coaches defected to Beach -- I recall around 5 years ago.  Beach itself has been around for 10-11 years?  Credit Mauricio and club management for the impressive growth.    Beach has done an excellent job of consolidating/recruiting coaches (and fields) from South Bay Force (now LAG), Exiles and even Fram, and have emerged as a club much more qualified to be part of ECNL/DA only in the last 3-4 years.  Who knows if they even applied to ECNL in that brief window before the GDA application went live, and I would not fault ECNL for caution, since a long track record as an organization they did not possess.
> 
> ECNL did not have a sound geographical approach for LA County, nor for San Diego.  But arguing they were ignoring obvious additions shows a lack of understanding of the often brief history of some of the "neglected" clubs.  No doubt politics played a role, but as MAP points out regarding pre-ECNL versus post-ECNL performance, and others claim, ECNL's creation and neglect of their markets likely facilitated the growth and success of these clubs.


What teams/Coaches defected to Beach?  Their Top Coaches (Sal & Diego) and players any the younger age groups went to Galaxy which has lead to their more recent rise at the ‘o4,05 and 06 age groups. Despite Quigs moving over to boys (who arguably is and has been SBF/Galaxy’s best Coach).


----------



## Kicker4Life

Desert Hound said:


> Is this confirmed?


I seriously doubt it.  That comment was in response to the allegation that BLues was moving all their ‘04 - ‘01 best players to ECNL. I seriously doubt Draluck would allow his best players to go play for Kale and accept a lesser caliber team.


----------



## C.A.M.

SocalPapa said:


> Wow!  Slammers has two top 5 GDA teams.  That's a huge blow.


They aren't leaving.  The DA part of Slammers is LAFC Slammers.  They keep themselves separated from the other part of the club.  That's why no one is mentioning them in the articles.


----------



## Multivitamin

WHY THE FC STARS LEFT!!!

https://www.socceramerica.com/publicati ... ector.html

JASON DEWHURST: For us, with the no-entry it became tough, especially with the one-game weekends. Kids just weren’t seeing as much playing time. On the other side of that, the no outside competition. That really kind of went away from our philosophy.

An example:

If a kid was only seeing 15 to 20 minutes on a Saturday in a DA game, then we would like to say to that kid, “Guess what, you're going to play a full game tomorrow with our NPL team.”

But because of the rule of the no outside competition, we weren’t able to do that.

So that was one of the big things for us and we didn’t see that changing. That was something we constantly heard about from our members, parents.

SA: What was another important issue?

JASON DEWHURST: The second one I would say is the double age group, specifically next year at the 2002, 2003 age group. For example, we have a current U-15 team, 2003s, and these players have given up high school soccer, they’ve committed to the DA, they’ve committed to our program. And then within a year, more than likely, more than half those kids will probably be cut from the program, because it goes to a double age group -- to 02/03 [in 2018-19, U-16/17].

For us, we thought that was unacceptable for those players. To come in and give up high school soccer is a huge deal in our area. That caused a lot of anxiety from the parents as the season is coming to an end. What are we going to do next year?

That was something we brought up whenever we spoke to the Federation. We said we would like to see the single age group, and obviously that hasn’t happened.

SA: Kids having to sacrifice playing high school soccer to commit to the DA ... was that one of the main issues?

JASON DEWHURST: Yes, but more so in our area, the private school issue. We have a lot of private school players within our system and they have to play high school sports. And we as a club from Day 1 decided that we were not going to [ask for] waivers. And the reason for that is because I don’t think you can look one kid in the eye and say, “Listen, because you’re a private school kid we’re going to give you a waiver and you can play high school,” and look another kid in the eye and say, “Guess what, because you don’t go to private school, we’re going to make you give up high school soccer.”

[Editor’s note: According to the DA regulations: “Players who receive consideration or financial aid to attend a private high school based on their participation with the soccer team are eligible” for waivers to allow them “to remain on their clubs Academy roster during the high school soccer season.”]

For us, we made that decision from Day 1. We stood by it. But the reality is that prohibited a lot of our top players from playing in the DA. And that would have continued. Other clubs have done waivers.

SA: These issues -- the sub rules, ban on outside competition and high school play -- are ones the Federation doesn’t plan on altering?

JASON DEWHURST: They were three things we shared with the Federation. We’ve been very upfront about it. We’ve had very civil conversations with the Federation about what we’ve done, and the reasons we’ve done it and the process, so now we’ll move on.

SA: When U.S. Soccer launched the DA, there were some who predicted that top clubs and players would eventually migrate to the DA. How do you things will look five years from now?

JASON DEWHURST: I really don’t know. At the end of the day, we looked at it from our club’s standpoint. We did it because throughout the year the feedback we got from our families and that’s how we made the decision, because we thought it was the best for our club [to leave the DA].

Other clubs, the DA works for them, in different markets. I’m not going to say one’s better than the other.

SA: When I interviewed Anson Dorrance in February, he suggested U.S. Soccer “marry together” the Girls DA and the ECNL. Can you imagine a future in which the DA and the ECNL work together?

JASON DEWHURST: I don’t think I can even comment on that because I don’t know. People have said it would be great if they could work together. Right now, they’re two separate entities.

https://www.socceramerica.com/publicati ... ector.html


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> One thing I told my daughter.   If you can play a whole 80 or 90 minutes at a high level in the DA,  college will be a breeze because you can actually get subbed and come back in there.


With all due respect, if you think that simply playing 80-90 minutes in the DA will have your player ready for college you are in for a surprise.  D1 college soccer, especially high D1, is a whole different ball game.  My player played over 4000 minutes her first two seasons and it is a big adjustment.  Hopefully you will see.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> I was speaking more on a financial perspective.  It's a lot easier to get talented players when the cost to join and travel is $0 or close to it.  It's also easier to get good coaches when you can pay them better.
> 
> The clubs are always the developers which is why some smaller clubs are a great place for the kids to start and stay at until it's time to get more exposure and better competition.


Which DA clubs charge $0?  The NWSL clubs are mostly rebranded partnerships and most definitely aren't subsidized (the NWSL just lost two teams!).

The bottom line is this is girls soccer and not a profit center.  The GDA is not nearly the success that many thought that it would be and losing many of the top clubs won't help.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Also - to get into ECNL you have to have a 100% yes vote and two clubs clearly never voted yes for Legends.  You guess which two made out the most with them being out.
> 
> US Soccer has their guidelines to becoming a member club posted on their website.  ECNL has an application which asks tons of questions about your club, but doesn't post guidelines.  I just looked it up.


Legends is a trash club with a marketer not a soccer coach running it.  They had no history prior to ECNL (and were mediocre at most age groups) and they benefited immensely from NOT GETTING accepted into ECNL.  They along with Beach and Carlsbad were able to dominate what amounted to the 2nd circuit (USYS competition) and gained all of the accolades that you ULittle parents attribute to their successful program.  Legends is simply a recruiting operation.  How many of their players are succeeding in college right now?  In the answer lies the truth about their program....


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Legends is a trash club with a marketer not a soccer coach running it.  They had no history prior to ECNL (and were mediocre at most age groups) and they benefited immensely from NOT GETTING accepted into ECNL.  They along with Beach and Carlsbad were able to dominate what amounted to the 2nd circuit (USYS competition) and gained all of the accolades that you ULittle parents attribute to their successful program.  Legends is simply a recruiting operation.  How many of their players are succeeding in college right now?  In the answer lies the truth about their program....


Damn!!!!  That was seriously harsh.  You said that as if Legends doesn't have talented players and coaches.  No matter how you feel about the person leading it, that isn't a fair assessment that they could only compete in the 2nd circuit.  Nothing is perfect at any club and I'm not here to defend Legends, but let's stay fair on this.  BTW, my kid doesn't play for them anymore and won't so I'm not partial to them in any way.  I drive my girl 45 minutes away instead and all her friends are on the Legends team.  




MakeAPlay said:


> Which DA clubs charge $0?  The NWSL clubs are mostly rebranded partnerships and most definitely aren't subsidized (the NWSL just lost two teams!).
> 
> The bottom line is this is girls soccer and not a profit center.  The GDA is not nearly the success that many thought that it would be and losing many of the top clubs won't help.


In So Cal DA -  La Galaxy and Patedores are free.  LAFC Slammers only has you pay for travel.  We don't have an NWSL franchise here so we won't benefit from it.


----------



## SocalPapa

C.A.M. said:


> They aren't leaving.  The DA part of Slammers is LAFC Slammers.  They keep themselves separated from the other part of the club.  That's why no one is mentioning them in the articles.


Thanks.  A couple others have mentioned that now and it seems to be the case.  I'm troubled by that in two respects:

1) It takes the teeth out of any ultimatum ECNL might have made (or will make) to dual clubs.  All any dual club would have to do is re-establish its DA team as a technically separate entity while still using the club's name and coaches.

2) It makes ECNL's inclusion of these de facto dual clubs on the "all in" list misleading and, frankly, silly.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> With all due respect, if you think that simply playing 80-90 minutes in the DA will have your player ready for college you are in for a surprise.  D1 college soccer, especially high D1, is a whole different ball game.  My player played over 4000 minutes her first two seasons and it is a big adjustment.  Hopefully you will see.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


Don't build information into my statements.  I never said simply playing that many minutes would make her ready for college.  I was speaking of the sub rule and how it will effect players physically.  We all know D1 at every level is a whole different game.  You are playing with women and not girls.


----------



## C.A.M.

SocalPapa said:


> Thanks.  A couple others have mentioned that now and it seems to be the case.  I'm troubled by that in two respects:
> 
> 1) It takes the teeth out of any ultimatum ECNL might have made (or will make) to dual clubs.  All any dual club would have to do is re-establish its DA team as a technically separate entity while still using the club's name and coaches.
> 
> 2) It makes ECNL's inclusion of these de facto dual clubs on the "all in" list misleading and, frankly, silly.


Remember the exception to the duals is if you have won a national championship in the last 3 years.  They were basically speaking to the Slammers, Blues and Surfs of the world saying you can do as you please.

The Slammers thing is a very unique situation.  My son plays for the LAFC DA.  They are very particular with every connection they make.  They still haven't allowed Slammers to put the LAFC logo on their jerseys like the boys have it.  They seem to be more interested in quality over quantity, which they can afford to do with a billionaire main owner and lots of millionaire owners under that.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MakeAPlay said:


> Legends is a trash club with a marketer not a soccer coach running it.  They had no history prior to ECNL (and were mediocre at most age groups) and they benefited immensely from NOT GETTING accepted into ECNL.  They along with Beach and Carlsbad were able to dominate what amounted to the 2nd circuit (USYS competition) and gained all of the accolades that you ULittle parents attribute to their successful program.  Legends is simply a recruiting operation.  How many of their players are succeeding in college right now?  In the answer lies the truth about their program....


One facet not being taken into consideration post ECNL formation is how many ULittles (u10 - u12) left Clubs like Legends and Beach to chase the ECNL club marketing machines?

Nevertheless, the past can be debated but it won’t change the present. Good luck to all of us left to navigate this crap!


----------



## soccer4us

Dubs said:


> Did anyone see the clip from April Heinrichs talking about the DA and Spring Showcase?  She outright said that 80% of all YNT players play in the DA.  This is such BS.  How many kids are they bypassing because they're not in DA.  The audacity/ego of these folks is cray.  Such a broken system.


You can easily argue she's the biggest issue with YNT and DA. Go ask most doc's and college coaches their thoughts. Truth would come out quick.


----------



## Real Deal

MakeAPlay said:


> Legends is a trash club with a marketer not a soccer coach running it.  They had no history prior to ECNL (and were mediocre at most age groups) and they benefited immensely from NOT GETTING accepted into ECNL.  They along with Beach and Carlsbad were able to dominate what amounted to the 2nd circuit (USYS competition) and gained all of the accolades that you ULittle parents attribute to their successful program.  *Legends is simply a recruiting operation*.  How many of their players are succeeding in college right now?  In the answer lies the truth about their program....


Wait a sec, are you saying that Legends was more of a recruiting organization than a couple of the clubs (we all know who they are) that had ECNL????  That is very funny!  It must've been even more crowded than I remember around those porta-potties at the Polo Fields.  Thank you for the good laugh, MAP!


----------



## LASTMAN14

Dos Equis said:


> Beach was just another decent South Bay club until the PVSC/Exiles self-immolated and 16-20 teams and a bunch of coaches defected to Beach -- I recall around 5 years ago.  Beach itself has been around for 10-11 years?  Credit Mauricio and club management for the impressive growth.    Beach has done an excellent job of consolidating/recruiting coaches (and fields) from South Bay Force (now LAG), Exiles and even Fram, and have emerged as a club much more qualified to be part of ECNL/DA only in the last 3-4 years.  Who knows if they even applied to ECNL in that brief window before the GDA application went live, and I would not fault ECNL for caution, since a long track record as an organization they did not possess.
> 
> ECNL did not have a sound geographical approach for LA County, nor for San Diego.  But arguing they were ignoring obvious additions shows a lack of understanding of the often brief history of some of the "neglected" clubs.  No doubt politics played a role, but as MAP points out regarding pre-ECNL versus post-ECNL performance, and others claim, ECNL's creation and neglect of their markets likely facilitated the growth and success of these clubs.


I may have to respond to some of these inaccuracies. Being I am LAG (SBF) parent. And know Beach very well. But, a bit short on time now.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Damn!!!!  That was seriously harsh.  You said that as if Legends doesn't have talented players and coaches.  No matter how you feel about the person leading it, that isn't a fair assessment that they could only compete in the 2nd circuit.  Nothing is perfect at any club and I'm not here to defend Legends, but let's stay fair on this.  BTW, my kid doesn't play for them anymore and won't so I'm not partial to them in any way.  I drive my girl 45 minutes away instead and all her friends are on the Legends team.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In So Cal DA -  La Galaxy and Patedores are free.  LAFC Slammers only has you pay for travel.  We don't have an NWSL franchise here so we won't benefit from it.


I never said that Legends doesn't have talented players.  I said that they are a recruiting operation.  Their style of play does not prepare players for success.  Talent only gets you so far....

  Travel was the majority of what I paid for in terms of club costs for my player.  In other words, it isn't free.

Can anyone here confirm that travel costs for LA Galaxy and Pats is free?  I doubt it but I will believe a parent from one of those clubs....


----------



## SocalPapa

C.A.M. said:


> Remember the exception to the duals is if you have won a national championship in the last 3 years.  They were basically speaking to the Slammers, Blues and Surfs of the world saying you can do as you please.
> 
> The Slammers thing is a very unique situation.  My son plays for the LAFC DA.  They are very particular with every connection they make.  They still haven't allowed Slammers to put the LAFC logo on their jerseys like the boys have it.  They seem to be more interested in quality over quantity, which they can afford to do with a billionaire main owner and lots of millionaire owners under that.


So their being technically separate didn't actually matter then?  That would solve issue #1, but make #2 even worse.  That would mean ECNL considered them the same club and gave them an exemption specifically on that basis, yet still put them on the "all in" list.

Also, the LAFC logo is not the issue.  It's holding themselves out as a "Slammers" team (and using Slammers coaches).


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Don't build information into my statements.  I never said simply playing that many minutes would make her ready for college.  I was speaking of the sub rule and how it will effect players physically.  We all know D1 at every level is a whole different game.  You are playing with women and not girls.


Do you understand that college has unlimited substitutions?


----------



## MakeAPlay

Real Deal said:


> Wait a sec, are you saying that Legends was more of a recruiting organization than a couple of the clubs (we all know who they are) that had ECNL????  That is very funny!  It must've been even more crowded than I remember around those porta-potties at the Polo Fields.  Thank you for the good laugh, MAP!


My player spent most of her career with Strikers so I don't get the Polo Field reference.  If you think that Surf has to recruit you clearly don't have a player that played for Surf.  Top players come to Surf in order to play with other top players.  My player moved to Surf as a senior to play with two of her future college teammates (who both left other SD clubs to play for Surf) and to play for a particular coach who had coached her 4 of the 5 previous seasons.

You can be a Surf hater if you want to be but you have no clue about how things work down here.


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccer4us said:


> You can easily argue she's the biggest issue with YNT and DA. Go ask most doc's and college coaches their thoughts. Truth would come out quick.


As the poet Arthur Fonzerelli would say, "CORRECTOMUNDO!"


----------



## Real Deal

MakeAPlay said:


> My player spent most of her career with Strikers so I don't get the Polo Field reference.  If you think that Surf has to recruit you clearly don't have a player that played for Surf.  Top players come to Surf in order to play with other top players.  My player moved to Surf as a senior to play with two of her future college teammates (who both left other SD clubs to play for Surf) and to play for a particular coach who had coached her 4 of the 5 previous seasons.
> 
> You can be a Surf hater if you want to be but you have no clue about how things work down here.


I respect Surf and think it is an amazing club.  I was referring to recruiting at Surf Cup, not necessarily BY Surf.  Plus it was a joke, so you can chill.  Anyway, what's wrong if they recruit?  I don't hate recruiters.  I admire them.  Nowadays _every single club_ with DA or ECNL is a recruiting club.  Trust me.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

C.A.M. said:


> I read it this morning.   I made a lot of these points when this all started. DA clearly isn't for everyone. Pretending it was all inclusive leads to a lot of animosity.
> 
> In the IE we have a lot of good public schools so we don't have to worry about the waivers.   My girl plays in the Valley though and most of the girls on her team go to private schools. With the costs I can see why girls would need to play high school. The club wasn't doing waivers so I see a lot of the 01-02 players who are really good on the DPL.  Our 03 team probably lost some players due to not having waivers.
> 
> The sub rule is a game changer.   Especially with the girls learning a brand new system.   Some people simply don't learn very fast on the fly and need to come out the game and watch then try again.  I really think it comes down to the coaching to be honest.  No matter how good a coach is at practice,  game management is the real key factor in having your team run the system right.  We get frustrated because our coach tends to keep the girls who are struggling on the field and the ones who are doing good get pulled.   I don't see that so much on other teams.   Guess its all in how the coach thinks he or she needs to develop. With game time so limited,  I prefer the reward system of playing those that get it over those that don't.
> 
> I don't have a problem with no outside competition.   My kid didn't sign up for the DA to have to play NPL the next day because the coach didn't play her.   We have been on that roller coaster before and it really doesn't help develop a player to play with lesser level competition.   Also,  some coaches use it as a punishment for a kid,  which is what happened to us.
> 
> No one signs up not to play,  but you also have to be realistic about your level as a player. Watching kids make the same mistakes they were 7 months ago or not developing a first touch,  etc... kind of makes it clear the player isn't ready for this level.   The speed of play makes it difficult to get better if you aren't putting in the proper amount of work. No amount of game time can fix the fact you aren't working on your game outside of practice.
> 
> One thing I told my daughter.   If you can play a whole 80 or 90 minutes at a high level in the DA,  college will be a breeze because you can actually get subbed and come back in there.



Here are my thoughts:

High School - I have mixed emotions on this one.  My dd played DPL in the fall and was a DP for the DA.  She was offered full time DA just before HS started and was given the choice of moving to the DA then or after playing HS.  She chose to play HS (junior year).  She liked the friendship part and as a parent I love the packed stands, newspaper articles and accolades she received.   So on the plus side it feeds the players and parents egos.  The negative is that even though we won league the quality of soccer was quite poor.  Almost unwatchable at times.  I also think 2-3 games per week is a bit too much along a lot of cheapshots occurring between rival schools.   My dd will not play her senior year (her choice) and says she won't miss it.  Ultimately, I don't have a problem with the No HS rule for DA.  Girls that want to play HS have other options for leagues.

Substitution Rule - I don't have a problem with this rule.  The problem I would have is how a club implements it.  Carrying 22 girls on a DA roster is just way too many with this rule in place.   Ideally a team would carry 16 - 18 girls.   Then they would use their DP slots to pull players up from their reserve team as injuries occur or reserve players develop.   This allows the girls that would have filled out those last roster spots to get substantial playing time and still get DA exposure.   I think the problem occurs with clubs driven to fill their last 4-5 roster spots to make more money.

Outside Competition - I am okay with this rule for the team but not the players.   I believe DA teams should be allowed to assign players to their reserve team for an extended period of time and that they then can return to the DA in the same season.   Think of baseball and how clubs use their minor league teams for marginal or up and coming players.  For example player X gets injured and is just returning or player Y is not getting much playing time.  They still practice with the DA but they get sent on assignment to play for their reserve team until they are able to contribute to their DA team.  The time frame would need to be in weeks to avoid teams shipping players to their reserve to just to gain wins.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Kicker4Life said:


> One facet not being taken into consideration post ECNL formation is how many ULittles (u10 - u12) left Clubs like Legends and Beach to chase the ECNL club marketing machines?
> 
> Nevertheless, the past can be debated but it won’t change the present. Good luck to all of us left to navigate this crap!


What you might not realize is that when Coast Premier League was the top level the best players would leave whatever club they were on at U15/16 to go play for the teams that were in Coast Premier and they were the usual suspects: Slammer, Blues, West Coast, Arsenal, Real So Cal, Strikers, Eagles  Laguna Hills Eclipse and Southbay Force.  Beach, LA Rampage, Legends, LAFC and others came along later.  This is nothing new.


----------



## SocalPapa

C.A.M. said:


> Damn!!!!  That was seriously harsh.  You said that as if Legends doesn't have talented players and coaches.  No matter how you feel about the person leading it, that isn't a fair assessment that they could only compete in the 2nd circuit.  Nothing is perfect at any club and I'm not here to defend Legends, but let's stay fair on this.  BTW, my kid doesn't play for them anymore and won't so I'm not partial to them in any way.  I drive my girl 45 minutes away instead and all her friends are on the Legends team.


I was surprised by that take as well.  My daughter has never played for Legends, but has competed against them over the years and they have been consistently good.  Plus, their 01/02 GDA team is one of the top teams in the country and the star forward on that team (the #4 ranked class of 2020 player in Southern California) has been with Legends since at least U14.


----------



## LASTMAN14

MakeAPlay said:


> I never said that Legends doesn't have talented players.  I said that they are a recruiting operation.  Their style of play does not prepare players for success.  Talent only gets you so far....
> 
> Travel was the majority of what I paid for in terms of club costs for my player.  In other words, it isn't free.
> 
> Can anyone here confirm that travel costs for LA Galaxy and Pats is free?  I doubt it but I will believe a parent from one of those clubs....


LA Galaxy does cover all costs including travel. Tech can confirm about Pats.


----------



## LASTMAN14

MakeAPlay said:


> As the poet Arthur Fonzerelli would say, "CORRECTOMUNDO!"[/QUOT


I did not know that was a Fonzism. Had to look it up. Always thought is was Jules (Pulp Fiction) original.


----------



## Technician72

LASTMAN14 said:


> LA Galaxy does cover all costs including travel. Tech can confirm about Pats.


My DD is on Pats 04 DA, we paid for uniforms at beginning of season, approx $200 and we had to participate in a club fundraiser selling raffle tickets, 50 tickets - $10 each ($500 total). There was a small ask for food money, when our girls traveled to Arizona, NorCal, and Showcases which was very minimal.

The fundraiser was a tough one, especially if you had to buy out those tickets yourself, it's an indirect way of raising the money to fund club DA expenses.

Outside of the items mentioned above, we haven't paid anything else this season.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Do you understand that college has unlimited substitutions?


Yes.  That was the whole point.  If you can go hard for 80 or 90 minutes in the DA, you can hard for how ever long your coach allows you to on the next level.  The fact you have to be good enough to be there in the first place is assumed.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> I was surprised by that take as well.  My daughter has never played for Legends, but has competed against them over the years and they have been consistently good.  Plus, their 01/02 GDA team is one of the top teams in the country and the star forward on that team (the #4 ranked class of 2020 player in Southern California) has been with Legends since at least U14.


I had a club player before there was a Legends and unfortunately you have a player that is significantly younger than mine.   Your experience is much more recent than mine so I wouldn't expect you to know the history.  Please point out to me a player who spent most of their club career with Legends (especially the recruiting years) that is having success post high school....


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Yes.  That was the whole point.  If you can go hard for 80 or 90 minutes in the DA, you can hard for how ever long your coach allows you to on the next level.  The fact you have to be good enough to be there in the first place is assumed.


Do you understand that 90 minute players operate at a different exertion level than 10-20 minute players?  Do you know what the beep test is?


----------



## Mystery Train

Simisoccerfan said:


> Here are my thoughts:
> 
> High School - I have mixed emotions on this one.  My dd played DPL in the fall and was a DP for the DA.  She was offered full time DA just before HS started and was given the choice of moving to the DA then or after playing HS.  She chose to play HS (junior year).  She liked the friendship part and as a parent I love the packed stands, newspaper articles and accolades she received.   So on the plus side it feeds the players and parents egos.  The negative is that even though we won league the quality of soccer was quite poor.  Almost unwatchable at times.  I also think 2-3 games per week is a bit too much along a lot of cheapshots occurring between rival schools.   My dd will not play her senior year (her choice) and says she won't miss it.  Ultimately, I don't have a problem with the No HS rule for DA.  Girls that want to play HS have other options for leagues.
> 
> Substitution Rule - I don't have a problem with this rule.  The problem I would have is how a club implements it.  Carrying 22 girls on a DA roster is just way too many with this rule in place.   Ideally a team would carry 16 - 18 girls.   Then they would use their DP slots to pull players up from their reserve team as injuries occur or reserve players develop.   This allows the girls that would have filled out those last roster spots to get substantial playing time and still get DA exposure.   I think the problem occurs with clubs driven to fill their last 4-5 roster spots to make more money.
> 
> Outside Competition - I am okay with this rule for the team but not the players.   I believe DA teams should be allowed to assign players to their reserve team for an extended period of time and that they then can return to the DA in the same season.   Think of baseball and how clubs use their minor league teams for marginal or up and coming players.  For example player X gets injured and is just returning or player Y is not getting much playing time.  They still practice with the DA but they get sent on assignment to play for their reserve team until they are able to contribute to their DA team.  The time frame would need to be in weeks to avoid teams shipping players to their reserve to just to gain wins.


This underscores the maxim that everyone's situation is different and there is no single right answer.  While some people may have a worse time with these particular DA rules, in your situation, it worked fine and you got the results you were looking for.  Also in your case, it is good that the DA format worked because the ECNL options are more limited (north LA).  For others, the DA format is terrible and ECNL works better.  

All of the back and forth about the pros and cons of DA's particular format vs ECNL's format reminded me of an article I read about the marketplace battles between new tech formats like Blu-ray and HD DVD years ago, and applies to adoption rates for programming languages today and software for wireless controls.  Contrary to what I thought early on, the DA vs. ECNL battle will ultimately not be decided by the consumers (paying parents/players) but rather the alliances behind the scenes.  Here's a quote from the article about what ultimately tipped the scales in the Blu-ray tech war:  "However, practically none of these factors (the pros and cons of each format) played too great of a role in the war. One of the main reasons why each format performed the way that it did was because of the alliances established by the major corporations backing it. Hitachi, LG Electronics, Matsushita, Pioneer, Philips, Samsung, Sharp, Sony and Thomson founded the Blu-ray Disc Association, and they quickly gained support from Dell and Apple before the product was officially released. HD DVD had several supporters who remained affiliated with the DVD Forum during this time, including Toshiba, NEC, Sanyo, and Microsoft."    In the end, the movie studios started to fall in line with Sony and the others because of licensing and distribution relationships, and once a couple bigger studios went that way, it was only a matter of time before HD DVD was dead.  

In this analogy, the clubs are the studios (the content providers) and the leagues are the tech formats.  Once influential content providers (such as the PDA, Michigan Hawks, etc.) make a full commitment to ECNL over DA, this could predict similar migrations in SoCal.  I think the DA has a better chance of hanging on here because of the deep talent pool, but if the clubs across other regions put all their best teams into ECNL, and just one more influential club here follows SoCal Blues' lead and matches up their best older teams in ECNL, the dominoes will fall rapidly.  

It could go the other way too.  But these announcements by big clubs like those in New Jersey and Michigan are very significant because marketplace behavior is herd mentality all the way.


----------



## soccer dude

SocalPapa said:


> Does it really matter how many clubs they add if they lose Michigan Hawks, Eclipse and PDA?  Michigan and PDA are 2 of the top 10 GDA clubs in the country.  Eclipse is top 20.  This is big news.


After reading so many of these articles I'd love to hear what US Soccer has to say on this.  Seems like all I hear are crickets from them on big clubs leaving and them not changing the rules for the benefit of the girls as so many of us have pointed out.  Come on US Soccer, chime in.  Tired of this 1 sided argument.


----------



## jose

Kicker4Life said:


> Ok, since you know so much about the LA geography. If I live Manhattan Beach, how long does it take me to get to Irvine Great Park (where 3 different ECNL clubs train) at 6pm on a week day (roughly 35 miles)?


in traffic? 3 days


----------



## C.A.M.

Simisoccerfan said:


> Here are my thoughts:
> 
> High School - I have mixed emotions on this one.  My dd played DPL in the fall and was a DP for the DA.  She was offered full time DA just before HS started and was given the choice of moving to the DA then or after playing HS.  She chose to play HS (junior year).  She liked the friendship part and as a parent I love the packed stands, newspaper articles and accolades she received.   So on the plus side it feeds the players and parents egos.  The negative is that even though we won league the quality of soccer was quite poor.  Almost unwatchable at times.  I also think 2-3 games per week is a bit too much along a lot of cheapshots occurring between rival schools.   My dd will not play her senior year (her choice) and says she won't miss it.  Ultimately, I don't have a problem with the No HS rule for DA.  Girls that want to play HS have other options for leagues.
> 
> Substitution Rule - I don't have a problem with this rule.  The problem I would have is how a club implements it.  Carrying 22 girls on a DA roster is just way too many with this rule in place.   Ideally a team would carry 16 - 18 girls.   Then they would use their DP slots to pull players up from their reserve team as injuries occur or reserve players develop.   This allows the girls that would have filled out those last roster spots to get substantial playing time and still get DA exposure.   I think the problem occurs with clubs driven to fill their last 4-5 roster spots to make more money.
> 
> Outside Competition - I am okay with this rule for the team but not the players.   I believe DA teams should be allowed to assign players to their reserve team for an extended period of time and that they then can return to the DA in the same season.   Think of baseball and how clubs use their minor league teams for marginal or up and coming players.  For example player X gets injured and is just returning or player Y is not getting much playing time.  They still practice with the DA but they get sent on assignment to play for their reserve team until they are able to contribute to their DA team.  The time frame would need to be in weeks to avoid teams shipping players to their reserve to just to gain wins.


Thank you for the insight.  It's nice to get it from someone with an older girl in the system. 

My daughter watched enough high school soccer in the 7th and 8th grade to know she didn't want to participate as she entered high school.  Also, her high school at the time carries almost all seniors and juniors on the varsity team with freshmen and sophomores being on the JV or Freshman team.  She knew those players on the younger teams and the talent level isn't what she was looking to participate with.  We went and watched some of their games to support her friends and the game play was fast, but in general poor.  Not to mention the dirty fouls.  DA fits her perfectly. She had a friend who got a waiver and played and that team was very good.  In fact they played like a DA team so her experience was terrific.

The sub rules - I don't like it for the 04s and 03s.  Frankly, they aren't mature enough to get the proper development out of it.  Most of these girls don't watch soccer and the learning curve is slow.  Keeping a player on the field who makes the same mistakes over and over isn't getting the team or the individual a better development environment.  The 04's and 03's need to be taught.  A coach needs to be able to pull them over and say, "We don't just bomb the ball out the back anymore.  I'll give you another chance or else you're sitting the rest of the game and maybe the next game or two.", or "We need you to hold on to the ball and let the game develop more.  You are playing a bit rushed.  Watch how our movement is now and see how we are building and progressing up the field.".   Old habits die hard and as long as they are on the field, the players think they are doing it right. I would like a 3 subs per half with no re-entry that half rule.

* I won't have the problem with the sub rules since the girls will be like the boys and come in on a U12-U11 combo team that allows unlimited subs starting next season.  They should be able to understand what they need to do by U14 with two seasons under their belts.  It's this transition group I worry about.  

I agree, rosters shouldn't be more than 18 if the true aim is development.  The DPL is there to cover for the injuries, defections, etc... 

To me the issue with the DA isn't the rules everyone complains about.  It's the fact it is brand new and everyone has to make rapid adjustments and break habits that have been ingrained since these girls were 5 and 6 years old.  Keepers and defenders are being taught to play out the back now.  Mids have to have a better understanding of how the game works and not just send the ball long or carry the ball up when they can't necessarily beat these players anymore.  Forwards actually have to make multiple type of runs.  Outside backs are now wing backs that travel up and down the field and have to know how far they can go or they will get caught out of position.  It's just more sophisticated than what they are used too and it takes time to learn and get good at. 

In comparison my son plays DA U12.  Even when we play the weaker teams, the ball isn't flying around the field.  They are connecting passes and always attempting to.  They aren't just kicking the damn ball and hoping someone else gets it.  If that is what is going to happen to the girls ON ALL LEVELS, it's a great thing for soccer in the US.


----------



## jose

4DaLuvoftheGM said:


> Not sure if this was posted or not.
> 
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77573/leaving-the-development-academy-fc-stars-director.html


Wow!  that has been a few complaints around DA parents I know.  HS and the Sub in rule. both are silly thanks for the article


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> I had a club player before there was a Legends and unfortunately you have a player that is significantly younger than mine.   Your experience is much more recent than mine so I wouldn't expect you to know the history.  Please point out to me a player who spent most of their club career with Legends (especially the recruiting years) that is having success post high school....


I can't and perhaps you are right that any improvement would have been more recent.  I predict that 2020 grad I was talking about will have a great college career though.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> * I won't have the problem with the sub rules since the girls will be like the boys and come in on a U12-U11 combo team that allows unlimited subs starting next season.  They should be able to understand what they need to do by U14 with two seasons under their belts.  It's this transition group I worry about.
> 
> I agree, rosters shouldn't be more than 18 if the true aim is development.  The DPL is there to cover for the injuries, defections, etc...
> 
> To me the issue with the DA isn't the rules everyone complains about.  It's the fact it is brand new and everyone has to make rapid adjustments and break habits that have been ingrained since these girls were 5 and 6 years old.  Keepers and defenders are being taught to play out the back now.  Mids have to have a better understanding of how the game works and not just send the ball long or carry the ball up when they can't necessarily beat these players anymore.  Forwards actually have to make multiple type of runs.  Outside backs are now wing backs that travel up and down the field and have to know how far they can go or they will get caught out of position.  It's just more sophisticated than what they are used too and it takes time to learn and get good at.


My player's ECNL team played that way since U13.  If this is the first time you are seeing this it sounds like you had the wrong coach.  At this point you are just going to have to see for yourself.  GDA is not going to create a unicorn and even my player's roommate, who plays on her country's full WNT, played high school soccer.  Heck one of her teammates who got her first USWNT cap recently didn't even play ECNL until her junior year of high school!

You will see...


----------



## MarkM

SocalPapa said:


> I can't and perhaps you are right that any improvement would have been more recent.  I predict that 2020 grad I was talking about will have a great college career though.


Ally Prisock from USC.  First team all Pac-12 as a sophomore.


----------



## MakeAPlay

SocalPapa said:


> I can't and perhaps you are right that any improvement would have been more recent.  I predict that 2020 grad I was talking about will have a great college career though.


Hey I don't doubt your belief in this player.  I can tell you that the most successful SoCal players so far in my player's recruiting class weren't the ones ranked the highest as sophomores.  I think that my player wasn't ranked in the top 75 nationally and wasn't in the top 15 in SoCal by TDS but she made the Best XI freshman list and was all-conference her first two seasons and played close to as many or more minutes these past two season than all of the players ahead of her on the list combined.  Not to mention that she played every minute of the NCAA tournament including 210 minutes in the College Cup.

The success players have is intersection of their talent, their individual drive, their preparation and their support group.  Lot's of moving parts there and plenty of players think that getting committed to a school is the end goal.  The ones that are stars beyond club are the ones that realize getting committed is only the beginning.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MarkM said:


> Ally Prisock from USC.  First team all Pac-12 as a sophomore.


Incorrect.  She was not all PAC 12 as a sophomore.  I will give you that one although she never plays well against the Bruins.  I have a great shot of her getting nutmegged by my player's roommate the year that they won the natty.


----------



## Gokicksomegrass

https://twitter.com/UCLAWSoccer/status/770039816952176640

I believe those guys on the bench are UCLA men's soccer team. Sick.


----------



## SocalPapa

MakeAPlay said:


> Hey I don't doubt your belief in this player.  I can tell you that the most successful SoCal players so far in my player's recruiting class weren't the ones ranked the highest as sophomores.  I think that my player wasn't ranked in the top 75 nationally and wasn't in the top 15 in SoCal by TDS but she made the Best XI freshman list and was all-conference her first two seasons and played close to as many or more minutes these past two season than all of the players ahead of her on the list combined.  Not to mention that she played every minute of the NCAA tournament including 210 minutes in the College Cup.
> 
> The success players have is intersection of their talent, their individual drive, their preparation and their support group.  Lot's of moving parts there and plenty of players think that getting committed to a school is the end goal.  The ones that are stars beyond club are the ones that realize getting committed is only the beginning.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


I know it's early, but all signs point to college success as of now:  GNT caps and carrying a team to a top ranking in GDA, plus a 4.6 GPA, sideline-to-sideline reach, vision and good ball control (not Fleming good, but good).  We'll see.  I've been both right (Macario) and wrong (Malatskey) in my predictions before.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

MakeAPlay said:


> Incorrect.  She was not all PAC 12 as a sophomore.  I will give you that one although she never plays well against the Bruins.  I have a great shot of her getting nutmegged by my player's roommate the year that they won the natty.


I think I went to the same HS as your kid but many decades earlier.


----------



## MarkM

MakeAPlay said:


> Incorrect.  She was not all PAC 12 as a sophomore.  I will give you that one although she never plays well against the Bruins.  I have a great shot of her getting nutmegged by my player's roommate the year that they won the natty.


Oops, she was a first-team pac 12 as a junior.  

Nice comment though.  Keep up the class.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Gokicksomegrass said:


> https://twitter.com/UCLAWSoccer/status/770039816952176640
> 
> I believe those guys on the bench are UCLA men's soccer team. Sick.


I saw that play live.  I have been told that she does something like that everyday in practice.  It's one reason why my player has no problem dealing with most attacking players.  She deals with skills like this daily.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MarkM said:


> Oops, she was a first-team pac 12 as a junior.
> 
> Nice comment though.  Keep up the class.


Do be butt hurt because you were wrong.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MarkM said:


> Oops, she was a first-team pac 12 as a junior.
> 
> Nice comment though.  Keep up the class.


Keep up with the fake news.


----------



## MarkM

MakeAPlay said:


> Do be butt hurt because you were wrong.


I got her year wrong.  Big deal.  Not sure why you have to throw some dig at a random player for no reason because you were wrong.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> My player's ECNL team played that way since U13.  If this is the first time you are seeing this it sounds like you had the wrong coach.  At this point you are just going to have to see for yourself.  GDA is not going to create a unicorn and even my player's roommate, who plays on her country's full WNT, played high school soccer.  Heck one of her teammates who got her first USWNT cap recently didn't even play ECNL until her junior year of high school!
> 
> You will see...


The problem isn't that my girl hasn't seen it or done it.  It.  Her teammates haven't seen it or been made to do it before.  This was a brand new team and she was the 3rd person invited on the team.  The coaching staff watched her play a lot. We assumed (incorrectly) that he was building a team in that mold with players of the same mind states and similar skill sets that would fit in on the DA style.  Crazy thing is, when they actually do it, they are so damn good at it, but they aren't "smart" enough to understand that is what they do best.  

Here in the Southwest Division 03 age group I'm seeing varying levels of success with the girls playing possession based soccer based on building out the back.

Doing it great: Beach (best at connecting and moving without the ball), West Coast Surf (best at spreading you out), 
Doing it well when they want to: Blues, Legends (both have such good damn athletes they often go direct early until they have a lead and then they play possession),  SC Del Sol
Doing it ok or worse: Everyone else.  

The big thing is so many keepers on the girls side have only been big punters that they aren't confident playing out the back yet either.  A lot of teams have a hard time connecting in the final third and the mids hold on to the ball too long and don't see the runs the wings and forwards are making or should make.  

Even more, very few teams are using the wing backs.  The teams with the best records are not.  They stay solid with the four in the back and defensive mid not usually joining up on offense.  This helps the record, but the girls aren't learning how to connect the defense to the offense fluidly.  Only us and Blues have wing backs.  Blues has better athletes and soccer players so that is working out a lot better for them than us.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MarkM said:


> I got her year wrong.  Big deal.  Not sure why you have to throw some dig at a random player for no reason because you were wrong.



I have been throwing digs at her university for 26 years.  I'm not going to change now.  If you don't want to catch any flak don't jump into the fray.


----------



## Dos Equis

Kicker4Life said:


> What teams/Coaches defected to Beach?  Their Top Coaches (Sal & Diego) and players any the younger age groups went to Galaxy which has lead to their more recent rise at the ‘o4,05 and 06 age groups. Despite Quigs moving over to boys (who arguably is and has been SBF/Galaxy’s best Coach).


In addition to the SBF group led by Shelly Marsden (which became the Beach Redondo group) perhaps you are fogetting the entire Exiles group led by Joe Flanagan when the Exiles split a year before the remaining club "merged" with LAG  (when a few more went to Beach).  I think you and I might differ on who were the best coaches at Exiles.  There are a lot of Fram or other coaches as well who migrated to Beach, for various reasons, in the last 4-8 years.  

All credit for their growth, they have become a strong/elite club.


----------



## Dos Equis

LASTMAN14 said:


> I may have to respond to some of these inaccuracies. Being I am LAG (SBF) parent. And know Beach very well. But, a bit short on time now.


Please do.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> Incorrect.  She was not all PAC 12 as a sophomore.  I will give you that one although she never plays well against the Bruins.  I have a great shot of her getting nutmegged by my player's roommate the year that they won the natty.


Not true at all.  She played really well as a Freshman when SC went to UCLA and beat them for there for the first time.  She also played well vs them in Stub Hub when UCLA beat them in the last conference game when SC won the National Championship.  She played well this last season too, but the outside backs  simply didn't have enough speed to keep up with them and she and the other CB had too much ground to cover.  Game still went down to the wire.  Playing UCLA is a terrorizing situation for a CB on any team that doesn't drop deep and cover.


----------



## C.A.M.

Confirmation just came from our club on the 2003 DPL Pilot. Says the best 03s will play in the 02/03 combo and the rest in the Pilot.  

All the same rules for subs, no high school, 4 days a week, etc... as the 02/03 combo group.  Still going to the Winter and Summer Showcases to play vs the Pilot teams from the Frontier Division.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Not sure why you are calling it a DPL Pilot.  DPL has no association with DA.  Shouldn't be the 2003 DA Pilot?


----------



## InTheValley

Gokicksomegrass said:


> https://twitter.com/UCLAWSoccer/status/770039816952176640
> 
> I believe those guys on the bench are UCLA men's soccer team. Sick.


Scoreboard.


----------



## C.A.M.

Simisoccerfan said:


> Not sure why you are calling it a DPL Pilot.  DPL has no association with DA.  Shouldn't be the 2003 DA Pilot?


I'm calling it what they called it.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> Confirmation just came from our club on the 2003 DPL Pilot. Says the best 03s will play in the 02/03 combo and the rest in the Pilot.
> 
> All the same rules for subs, no high school, 4 days a week, etc... as the 02/03 combo group.  Still going to the Winter and Summer Showcases to play vs the Pilot teams from the Frontier Division.


I would think that if an 03 player didn’t make the DA 02/03 team at their club, that the better chance for exposure may be with an ECNL team rather than DPL. With the increase of “all in” ECNL teams this week, many of which are from some of the more talent rich markets, many of the teams at the ECNL showcases will be the top players from those areas. That will most likely draw more colleges than a DPL game where they know they are looking at “second tier” players. Obviously there will be talent in DPL but it may not be the best medium to gain exposure..... Also, with the mirroring of the DA rules/restrictions, that is a lot to give up to play on the “B” team.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> I would think that if an 03 player didn’t make the DA 02/03 team at their club, that the better chance for exposure may be with an ECNL team rather than DPL. With the increase of “all in” ECNL teams this week, many of which are from some of the more talent rich markets, many of the teams at the ECNL showcases will be the top players from those areas. That will most likely draw more colleges than a DPL game where they know they are looking at “second tier” players. Obviously there will be talent in DPL but it may not be the best medium to gain exposure..... Also, with the mirroring of the DA rules/restrictions, that is a lot to give up to play on the “B” team.


A lot of yes and a lot of no. 

No because we have already established in this thread that the combo teams are filled with olders 7 to 1.  There aren't many spots for youngers which is why this Pilot age group is being created and tried in the first place.   That said,  mine expects to be on the combo team from my conversations with her.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> A lot of yes and a lot of no.
> 
> No because we have already established in this thread that the combo teams are filled with olders 7 to 1.  There aren't many spots for youngers which is why this Pilot age group is being created and tried in the first place.   That said,  mine expects to be on the combo team from my conversations with her.


Agreed. However, if the DPL showcases  are being combined with the DA showcases, I have a hard time believing that a college coach or US scout is going to choose to watch an ‘03 DPL game over a 02/03 DA game, if they are looking for top ‘03 talent. It just doesn’t make sense. Obviously this isn’t an absolute but I would think it would still lead to less exposure overall for the DPL kids.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> Agreed. However, if the DPL showcases  are being combined with the DA showcases, I have a hard time believing that a college coach or US scout is going to chose to watch an ‘03 DPL game over a 02/03 DA game if they are looking for top ‘03 talent. It just doesn’t make sense. Obviously this isn’t an absolute but I would think it would still lead to less exposure overall for the DPL kids.


What's the difference between this year and next year when it comes to scouting?   The 03s considered the top were playing up on the older heavy squads and the rest on the 03 squads.  Same difference.   95% of the players in the 03 class will be playing in the 03 Pilot out here and in the Frontier conference.  Do you just throw them away? 

Also,  consider that politics sometimes  has lots to do with who is considered the best and worthy.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Let me be clear.  DA has nothing to do with DPL.  DPL teams will not be at DA showcases.  What I heard is that the Southwest and Frontier Divisions will pilot an 03 DA division.  These teams will be full DA.  The DA clubs in the Southwest that don’t have ECNL have DPL teams also.  So clubs will have an 03 DA team and an 03 DPL team.   There will also be 02 DA and DPL teams.  Those 02 DA teams will play other 02/03 DA teams at showcases.  03 DA age girls can always play up.  03 DA teams will play the 03 DA teams from Frontier at showcases.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> What's the difference between this year and next year when it comes to scouting?   The 03s considered the top were playing up on the older heavy squads and the rest on the 03 squads.  Same difference.   95% of the players in the 03 class will be playing in the 03 Pilot out here and in the Frontier conference.  Do you just throw them away?
> 
> Also,  consider that politics sometimes  has lots to do with who is considered the best and worthy.


The difference is fairly significant. The difference between this year and next year is that this year the 03’s are actually playing up. They are on an 01”/02 team. Next year the best 03’s won’t be playing up, they will be playing in a dual age band that includes their age 02’/03’. Additionally, with the 01’s and probably some talented 02’s moving up to the next age band, there will be more spots for 03’s than this year. If the 03’s unicorns (maybe a girl or two per team) playing up this year move up with the 01’s next year, then that will mean even more spots for a new crop of 03’s. Simply stated there will be more 03’s on the 02/03 teams next season than there are 03’s on the 01/02 teams this year and it won’t be close. I’m guessing more than 5% , but does it matter? If the clubs are willing to set aside the top 5% of a specific age group, they have made the college coaches job much easier.


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> Let me be clear.  DA has nothing to do with DPL.  DPL teams will not be at DA showcases.  What I heard is that the Southwest and Frontier Divisions will pilot an 03 DA division.  These teams will be full DA.  The DA clubs in the Southwest that don’t have ECNL have DPL teams also.  So clubs will have an 03 DA team and an 03 DPL team.   There will also be 02 DA and DPL teams.  Those 02 DA teams will play other 02/03 DA teams at showcases.  03 DA age girls can always play up.  03 DA teams will play the 03 DA teams from Frontier at showcases.


Aye yi yi..... I need a flow chart. So DPL will be third tier team within the 2003 DA not DA structure?                          1) DA 02/03.    2)DA 03.    3) DPL 03.


----------



## Pitch pop

Nefutous said:


> So some posters are saying that US Soccer is calling the 03
> pilot program DPL.  What does DPL stand for to US Soccer? And if they plan to use the name DPL, they should make the Development Player League that was formed without any affiliation to US Soccer change their name to something else. Otherwise it is going to be very confusing for some people to
> realize the benefits/drawbacks of any given team.


I think confusing is the new norm.


----------



## sdb

The relative position of teams within a club doesn't seem that confusing for either DA clubs or DA + ECNL clubs (Blues excepted) in the Southwest. Purely my POV: 

DA Only
DA 
2000/2001
2002/2003
2003 (Pilot)
2004
2005
then DPL teams in age groups if participating 
then SCDSL flight 1 teams

DA + ENCL (except Blues)
DA teams in age groups
ECNL teams in age groups
DPL teams in age groups if participating
SCDSL flight 1 teams

Blues (my understanding)
Certain DA teams / Certain ECNL teams depending on age groups
Remaining DA teams/ Remaining ECNL teams depending on age groups
SCDSL Flight 1 teams

Regarding DA, players have always been able to play up, so at some clubs a few of the current single age group teams are in actuality dual age group teams (e.g. some 2005s are currently playing with 2004 teams). The piloting of the 2003 age group team means that 2002/2003 teams will likely be majority 2002 (which has been written about prior) and the 2003 DA pilot teams will be mostly 2003s with maybe (or not) a few smattering of 2004s. Perhaps having a 2003 pilot in the Frontier and Southwest divisions is a recognition of the relative strength of the players within these regions, and US Soccer not wanting to eliminate many of these girls from the funnel quite so soon. Or perhaps it's a response to complaints by the clubs. I see the DA having been set up by US Soccer as an attempt to scout and find national team players (you can argue as to the merit and success of this 1 year in). As such, it's set up to be a funnel that narrows at the top and reduces the number of players in the system. DA doesn't really care about getting kids into college, although that's a potential side benefit now being promoted.


----------



## Josep

Simisoccerfan said:


> Let me be clear.  DA has nothing to do with DPL.  DPL teams will not be at DA showcases.  What I heard is that the Southwest and Frontier Divisions will pilot an 03 DA division.  These teams will be full DA.  The DA clubs in the Southwest that don’t have ECNL have DPL teams also.  So clubs will have an 03 DA team and an 03 DPL team.   There will also be 02 DA and DPL teams.  Those 02 DA teams will play other 02/03 DA teams at showcases.  03 DA age girls can always play up.  03 DA teams will play the 03 DA teams from Frontier at showcases.



Wrong.  The Pilot 03 DA is being called DPL by US Soccer.  They will be at showcases and will play by DA rules and within the DA schedule of games.  This is unlike what was called DPL this season.


----------



## Josep

Nefutous said:


> So some posters are saying that US Soccer is calling the 03
> pilot program DPL.  What does DPL stand for to US Soccer? And if they plan to use the name DPL, they should make the Development Player League that was formed without any affiliation to US Soccer change their name to something else. Otherwise it is going to be very confusing for some people to
> realize the benefits/drawbacks of any given team.



Agreed, but it’s up to people to do their homework.   Teams use pre-academy, academy, and premier in names all the time and have no association with the true origin of those titles.  It does seem odd that they call the 03 Pilots DPL, but that is indeed what it is called.


----------



## SoccerFan

Josep said:


> Agreed, but it’s up to people to do their homework.   Teams use pre-academy, academy, and premier in names all the time and have no association with the true origin of those titles.  It does seem odd that they call the 03 Pilots DPL, but that is indeed what it is called.


Share the US Soccer post.


----------



## Josep

SoccerFan said:


> Share the US Soccer post.


I’ve seen the e-communications.  Not sure what else to tell you.


----------



## El Clasico

Josep said:


> Wrong.  The Pilot 03 DA is being called DPL by US Soccer.  They will be at showcases and will play by DA rules and within the DA schedule of games.  This is unlike what was called DPL this season.


Can someone post a link substantiating this?


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Pitch pop said:


> Aye yi yi..... I need a flow chart. So DPL will be third tier team within the 2003 DA not DA structure?                          1) DA 02/03.    2)DA 03.    3) DPL 03.


No.  We will have DA 03 and DA 02 teams. DPL will be there 2nd teams.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Pitch pop said:


> The difference is fairly significant. The difference between this year and next year is that this year the 03’s are actually playing up. They are on an 01”/02 team. Next year the best 03’s won’t be playing up, they will be playing in a dual age band that includes their age 02’/03’. Additionally, with the 01’s and probably some talented 02’s moving up to the next age band, there will be more spots for 03’s than this year. If the 03’s unicorns (maybe a girl or two per team) playing up this year move up with the 01’s next year, then that will mean even more spots for a new crop of 03’s. Simply stated there will be more 03’s on the 02/03 teams next season than there are 03’s on the 01/02 teams this year and it won’t be close. I’m guessing more than 5% , but does it matter? If the clubs are willing to set aside the top 5% of a specific age group, they have made the college coaches job much easier.


03 currently has their own age bracket right now.  They are not currently all playing up.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Josep said:


> Wrong.  The Pilot 03 DA is being called DPL by US Soccer.  They will be at showcases and will play by DA rules and within the DA schedule of games.  This is unlike what was called DPL this season.


Proof?


----------



## C.A.M.

You want proof, I told you what our club called it.   DPL 2003 Pilot.

Btw no separate age group for 2002 DAs.   Only the combo group.

I'll give you this much...

DA Structure:

DA 2000/01
DA 2002/03
DA 2004
DA 2005
In addition to a new program:

2003 DPL Pilot
DPL teams:

2006 - Fall Only
2005 – Spring and Fall
2004 – Spring and Fall
2003 – Spring and Fall
2002 – Spring and Fall
2001/00 – Spring and Fall


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> No.  We will have DA 03 and DA 02 teams. DPL will be there 2nd teams.


So what would you consider the 02/03 dual age banded team?


----------



## Simisoccerfan

https://lagalaxysd.com/competitive/fees/

Note the names they are using for their teams.  03 Academy/DA Pilot


----------



## Simisoccerfan

And our club called it the 03 DA team in email annoucing the coaches


----------



## SoccerFan

C.A.M. said:


> You want proof, I told you what our club called it.   DPL 2003 Pilot.
> 
> Btw no separate age group for 2002 DAs.   Only the combo group.
> 
> I'll give you this much...
> 
> DA Structure:
> 
> DA 2000/01
> DA 2002/03
> DA 2004
> DA 2005
> In addition to a new program:
> 
> 2003 DPL Pilot
> DPL teams:
> 
> 2006 - Fall Only
> 2005 – Spring and Fall
> 2004 – Spring and Fall
> 2003 – Spring and Fall
> 2002 – Spring and Fall
> 2001/00 – Spring and Fall


Oh so this is not an announcement from US Soccer....thanks for the clarification!


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Pitch pop said:


> So what would you consider the 02/03 dual age banded team?


02’s


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> https://lagalaxysd.com/competitive/fees/
> 
> Note the names they are using for their teams.  03 Academy/DA Pilot


I don’t know if I’ve ever seen so many important sounding names for so many different teams?


Simisoccerfan said:


> 02’s


Huh? You might want to let US soccer know you are changing their age banding structure


----------



## C.A.M.

Then why have college showcases if they don't care? 

They sure the heck don't care about high school soccer or the standards ECNL imposed for subbing and breaks in the season.   If they didn't care then why even pretend and have the showcases? 

Its just not the top priority.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Pitch pop said:


> I don’t know if I’ve ever seen so many important sounding names for so many different teams?
> 
> Huh? You might want to let US soccer know you are changing their age banding structure


With the pilot age the age banding structure will be different for the Southwest and the Frontier.  Same everywhere else.


----------



## sdb

C.A.M. said:


> Then why have college showcases if they don't care?
> 
> They sure the heck don't care about high school soccer or the standards ECNL imposed for subbing and breaks in the season.   If they didn't care then why even pretend and have the showcases?
> 
> Its just not the top priority.


Not the top priority is probably a better way to put it.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

http://ocsurfsoccer.com/girls-2018-19/

Next years teams and coaches for OC Surf (West Coast).  Note the separate 02 and 03 DA teams and names (though ECNL is still showing).


----------



## Simisoccerfan

http://www.lapremierfc.com/football/dpl-2003-pilot-to-play-in-da-showcase


Okay now I don’t know what to believe.  Either their is a DA pilot program for the Southwest or just DPL is doing this for just the 03’s with USSDA blessing.


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> http://www.lapremierfc.com/football/dpl-2003-pilot-to-play-in-da-showcase
> 
> 
> Okay now I don’t know what to believe.  Either their is a DA pilot program for the Southwest or just DPL is doing this for just the 03’s with USSDA blessing.


Like I said....... confusion is the new norm.


----------



## Soccermom1721

http://dpleague.org/docs/pilot_program_release.pdf


----------



## Pitch pop

http://www.scblues.com/ 
even more confusion


----------



## Josep

Soccermom1721 said:


> http://dpleague.org/docs/pilot_program_release.pdf



Thank you.  This should clear up all the confusion.


----------



## Josep

Simisoccerfan said:


> http://www.lapremierfc.com/football/dpl-2003-pilot-to-play-in-da-showcase
> 
> 
> Okay now I don’t know what to believe.  Either their is a DA pilot program for the Southwest or just DPL is doing this for just the 03’s with USSDA blessing.


This is the 03 pilot.  The new DPL.   Not the backup league from last year.   Southwest vs Frontier at showcases.


----------



## Soccermom1721

http://dpleague.org/


----------



## pooka

C.A.M. said:


> To me the issue with the DA isn't the rules everyone complains about.  It's the fact it is brand new and everyone has to make rapid adjustments and break habits that have been ingrained since these girls were 5 and 6 years old.  Keepers and defenders are being taught to play out the back now.  Mids have to have a better understanding of how the game works and not just send the ball long or carry the ball up when they can't necessarily beat these players anymore.  Forwards actually have to make multiple type of runs.  Outside backs are now wing backs that travel up and down the field and have to know how far they can go or they will get caught out of position.  It's just more sophisticated than what they are used too and it takes time to learn and get good at.
> 
> .


This isn't new. The top teams have been playing like this for the past 3 years.... I say that not to be mean or demean anyone, but to illustrate that the elite players were already elite, and understood the game at a different level. DA isn't doing anything new. I'm glad that your DD is having a great experience though and I do think that DA will work to give some girls what they need.


----------



## C.A.M.

Simisoccerfan said:


> http://ocsurfsoccer.com/girls-2018-19/
> 
> Next years teams and coaches for OC Surf (West Coast).  Note the separate 02 and 03 DA teams and names (though ECNL is still showing).


It seems so odd to see OC Surf.  I actually liked the West Coast name.


----------



## Josep

No slammers DPL 03 Pilot?


----------



## Simisoccerfan

So DPL grows.  Per their website they are adding the Blues, Surf, and OC Surf (former West Coast).  In addition they are doing something different with their 03’s.  Yes this is still the same DPL, reserve, backup league as last year that everyone bashed.  And though there was no affiliation to the DA it appears their might now be some connection since they plan on playing as “Guests” at the Winter and Summer Showcases (no mention of being at the Fall Showcase).  Of course the press release is dated a week before the meetings held at the Winter Showcase and things could be different now.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Josep said:


> No slammers DPL 03 Pilot?


LAFC Slammers was not in DPL this year.  Likely keeping those girls in ECNL with the Slammers.


----------



## C.A.M.

pooka said:


> This isn't new. The top teams have been playing like this for the past 3 years.... I say that not to be mean or demean anyone, but to illustrate that the elite players were already elite, and understood the game at a different level. DA isn't doing anything new. I'm glad that your DD is having a great experience though and I do think that DA will work to give some girls what they need.


Thanks pooka.  I wouldn't say great experience as in "it's all good".  I would say great in that fact she is has had to grow immensely and recognize to reach her goals she has to have consistency and focus to a much higher level than ever before.  The other platforms simply didn't impress that upon her, no matter what I said. For some reason this one did.  May be having US Soccer scouts at each and every game makes it matter more?  Who can get into the minds of a 14 year old?


----------



## SocalPapa

Simisoccerfan said:


> So DPL grows.  Per their website they are adding the Blues, Surf, and OC Surf (former West Coast).  In addition they are doing something different with their 03’s.  Yes this is still the same DPL, reserve, backup league as last year that everyone bashed.  And though there was no affiliation to the DA it appears their might now be some connection since they plan on playing as “Guests” at the Winter and Summer Showcases (no mention of being at the Fall Showcase).  Of course the press release is dated a week before the meetings held at the Winter Showcase and things could be different now.


I wouldn't say "in addition".  I think it's highly likely that Blues, Surf, and perhaps even OC Surf's participation will be limited to that 03 pilot program.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

SocalPapa said:


> I wouldn't say "in addition" just yet.  I think it's highly likely that Blues, Surf, and perhaps OC Surf's participation will be limited to that 03 pilot program.


It’s possible.  But it sounds like OC Surf is out of ECNL.  So they need a place for their reserve teams.  Several Surf rumors out there but would be surprised if they are true.  Frankly I am very surprised to see the Blues listed.  They have had their third teams in SCDSL.  Are they staying in ECNL?   Are they leaving SCDSL at some age groups to play DPL? Same goes for Surf.  It would be a big hit to SCDSL.


----------



## Desert Hound

I think you may see another club added soon to the DPL list. There is a new DA club in AZ and they are talking up DA2 DPL


----------



## SocalPapa

Simisoccerfan said:


> It’s possible.  But it sounds like OC Surf is out of ECNL.  So they need a place for their reserve teams.  Several Surf rumors out there but would be surprised if they are true.  Frankly I am very surprised to see the Blues listed.  They have had their third teams in SCDSL.  Are they staying in ECNL?   Are they leaving SCDSL at some age groups to play DPL? Same goes for Surf.  It would be a big hit to SCDSL.


Blues has already announced their teams for next season, including all the ECNL/SCDSL teams.  http://www.scblues.com/  You'll notice the 02/03 DA age group has an extra coach (Holley).  My guess is she will take the leftover '03s and coach them (adding a few extra girls) in the special DPL pilot league.

As for OC Surf's situation, that's why I said "even perhaps".  Their Facebook page only refers to the 2003 team's participation in DPL for now so there is no confirmation either way.

This is not the big deal you seem to want to ascribe to it.  It appears the So Cal clubs are simply trying to match what the Frontier division is being allowed to do with their '03s and are using DPL as the vehicle for that.  (It is the Frontier division's quasi-DA 2003 teams that the So Cal 2003 pilot teams will play at the showcases.  There are no other DA-DPL matchups announced.)  The craziness that is going on because DA is breaking up the 2003 rosters says nothing about DPL overall and in no way suggests that Blues would choose to leave ECNL for DPL.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

SocalPapa said:


> Blues has already announced their teams for next season, including all the ECNL/SCDSL teams.  http://www.scblues.com/  You'll notice the 02/03 DA age group has an extra coach (Holley).  My guess she will take the leftover '03s and coach them (adding a few extra girls) in the special DPL pilot league.
> 
> As for OC Surf's situation, that's why I said "even perhaps".  Their Facebook page only refers to the 2003 team's participation in DPL for now so there is no confirmation either way.
> 
> This is not the big deal you seem to want to ascribe to it.  It appears the So Cal clubs are simply trying to match what the Frontier division is being allowed to do with their '03s and are using DPL as the vehicle for that.  (It is the Frontier division's quasi-DA 2003 team that the So Cal 2003 pilot teams will play at the showcases.  There are no other DA-DPL matchups announced.)  The craziness that is going on because DA is breaking up the 2003 rosters says nothing about DPL overall and in no way suggests that Blues would choose to leave ECNL for DPL.


It’s possible you are correct but we need to wait on more information from the clubs and leagues.


----------



## Pitch pop

SocalPapa said:


> Blues has already announced their teams for next season, including all the ECNL/SCDSL teams.  http://www.scblues.com/  You'll notice the 02/03 DA age group has an extra coach (Holley).  My guess is she will take the leftover '03s and coach them (adding a few extra girls) in the special DPL pilot league.
> 
> As for OC Surf's situation, that's why I said "even perhaps".  Their Facebook page only refers to the 2003 team's participation in DPL for now so there is no confirmation either way.
> 
> This is not the big deal you seem to want to ascribe to it.  It appears the So Cal clubs are simply trying to match what the Frontier division is being allowed to do with their '03s and are using DPL as the vehicle for that.  (It is the Frontier division's quasi-DA 2003 teams that the So Cal 2003 pilot teams will play at the showcases.  There are no other DA-DPL matchups announced.)  The craziness that is going on because DA is breaking up the 2003 rosters says nothing about DPL overall and in no way suggests that Blues would choose to leave ECNL for DPL.


Interesting....In speaking with 03 parents within DA clubs, many think their DD will be part of the 02/03 DA team. I’m wondering what the actual ratio of 03’s will be for these teams and how these parents will handle being placed on the DPL ‘03 team if they are wrong about where they foresee their DD playing. To me this may make ECNL more appealing for some. At least they can spin it as a choice (ie. My kid decided to play HS, or didn’t like some of the rules/regulations in DA etc. etc).  This may be more palatable than not making the top team in the age group.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Pitch pop said:


> Interesting....In speaking with 03 parents within DA clubs, many think their DD will be part of the 02/03 DA team. I’m wondering what the actual ratio of 03’s will be for these teams and how these parents will handle being placed on the DPL ‘03 team if they are wrong about where they foresee their DD playing. To me this may make ECNL more appealing for some. At least they can spin it as a choice (ie. My kid decided to play HS, or didn’t like some of the rules/regulations in DA etc. etc).  This may be more palatable than not making the top team in the age group.


Yes but unless ECNL announces more teams in California the number of ECNL teams is shrinking here so there might not be as many spots as you think.


----------



## beachbum

Simisoccerfan said:


> So DPL grows.  Per their website they are adding the Blues, Surf, and OC Surf (former West Coast).  In addition they are doing something different with their 03’s.  Yes this is still the same DPL, reserve, backup league as last year that everyone bashed.  And though there was no affiliation to the DA it appears their might now be some connection since they plan on playing as “Guests” at the Winter and Summer Showcases (no mention of being at the Fall Showcase).  Of course the press release is dated a week before the meetings held at the Winter Showcase and things could be different now.


The AZ teams have been told that there is a pilot 03 DA program that will travel with the DA teams to all league games and DA showcases.  Suppose to play Frontier teams in showcases.


----------



## Desert Hound

beachbum said:


> The AZ teams have been told that there is a pilot 03 DA program that will travel with the DA teams to all league games and DA showcases.  Suppose to play Frontier teams in showcases.


I would disagree with parents being told anything a this stage. Prying info out of these clubs out in AZ has been difficult to say the least. 

Outside of the DPL 03s...any news on what DPL will do this coming year? This year they basically played what 9 games total. Will they actually make it a league...ie home and away games and play 20 games or so?


----------



## C.A.M.

Simisoccerfan said:


> It’s possible.  But it sounds like OC Surf is out of ECNL.  So they need a place for their reserve teams.  Several Surf rumors out there but would be surprised if they are true.  Frankly I am very surprised to see the Blues listed.  They have had their third teams in SCDSL.  Are they staying in ECNL?   Are they leaving SCDSL at some age groups to play DPL? Same goes for Surf.  It would be a big hit to SCDSL.


The Blues website someone linked showed they have DA, ECNL and SCDSL.   The DPL is falling under DA for them I believe.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Desert Hound said:


> I would disagree with parents being told anything a this stage. Prying info out of these clubs out in AZ has been difficult to say the least.
> 
> Outside of the DPL 03s...any news on what DPL will do this coming year? This year they basically played what 9 games total. Will they actually make it a league...ie home and away games and play 20 games or so?


When I look at the DPL website I see a  list of participating clubs now including OC Surf, Surf and Blues.   Separately, I see a press release announcing the DPL 03 pilot which is dated over a week prior to the DA meeting at the Winter Showcase.   It does not say that those three clubs are only doing the 03 pilot and no clubs are listed on that press release.   So until we get more facts we are all guessing on how much those three clubs will be involved.  We also don't know if things have changed with the DA since the DPL press release date and whether things will proceed as shown on it or if the USSDA is making the Southwest an official pilot.


----------



## Josep

The DPL 03 Pilot league will play games, with no standings on the same day as the other DA teams.  So it is not like what was presented as DPL before.  

They will also compete against Frontier and perhaps one other division in the showcases.


----------



## Josep

Simisoccerfan said:


> When I look at the DPL website I see a  list of participating clubs now including OC Surf, Surf and Blues.   Separately, I see a press release announcing the DPL 03 pilot which is dated over a week prior to the DA meeting at the Winter Showcase.   It does not say that those three clubs are only doing the 03 pilot and no clubs are listed on that press release.   So until we get more facts we are all guessing on how much those three clubs will be involved.  We also don't know if things have changed with the DA since the DPL press release date and whether things will proceed as shown on it or if the USSDA is making the Southwest an official pilot.



Some of the people here belong to those clubs in question and have already been told where its headed.   None of the info that came down, came from DPL, it came form DA, to the DOCs and coaches that are active in the same and additional age groups.


----------



## El Clasico

Josep said:


> Some of the people here belong to those clubs in question and have already been told where its headed.   None of the info that came down, came from DPL, it came form DA, to the DOCs and coaches that are active in the same and additional age groups.


Just making sure that I understand you correctly since, I think, you alluded to this yesterday.  Are you saying that DA (USSF) is the entity that is disseminating the information on the new DPL league which is part of DA, but not part of the DPL league already in existence? I think a lot are confused and the answer to this question would help us all out.


----------



## push_up

Desert Hound said:


> I would disagree with parents being told anything a this stage. Prying info out of these clubs out in AZ has been difficult to say the least.
> 
> Outside of the DPL 03s...any news on what DPL will do this coming year? This year they basically played what 9 games total. Will they actually make it a league...ie home and away games and play 20 games or so?


Reading your blather is painful.  Please stay on the AZ side.


----------



## SocalPapa

SocalPapa said:


> Blues has already announced their teams for next season, including all the ECNL/SCDSL teams.  http://www.scblues.com/  You'll notice the 02/03 DA age group has an extra coach (Holley).  My guess is she will take the leftover '03s and coach them (adding a few extra girls) in the special DPL pilot league.


Looks like BH is indeed coaching the Blues' 2003 DPL pilot team.  This is from the Blues website, announcing a joint tryout with AR (who is coaching the Blues' 03 ECNL team next season).


----------



## Simisoccerfan

SocalPapa said:


> Looks like BH is indeed coaching the Blues' 2003 DPL pilot team.  This is from the Blues website, announcing a joint tryout with AR (who is coaching the Blues' 03 ECNL team next season).
> View attachment 2411


If it was a joint tryout wouldn't have said Teams not Team?


----------



## Desert Hound

Simisoccerfan said:


> So DPL grows.  Per their website they are adding the Blues, Surf, and OC Surf (former West Coast).  In addition they are doing something different with their 03’s.  Yes this is still the same DPL, reserve, backup league as last year that everyone bashed.  And though there was no affiliation to the DA it appears their might now be some connection since they plan on playing as “Guests” at the Winter and Summer Showcases (no mention of being at the Fall Showcase).  Of course the press release is dated a week before the meetings held at the Winter Showcase and things could be different now.


It is growing again. Word just came out that RSL AZ...ie Sereno is in DPL next year. 
https://www.serenosoccer.com/page/show/4136199-development-players-leagues


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> If it was a joint tryout wouldn't have said Teams not Team?


I think it’s implied since it’s impossible to have a ECNL/DPL team. They are separate entities.


----------



## SocalPapa

@Simisoccerfan does have a point though.  The slash and singular "team" are intriguing.  Perhaps they intend to have some dual carded players that play in both leagues?  Like ECNL/ECNL reserve teams?


----------



## Pitch pop

SocalPapa said:


> @Simisoccerfan does have a point though.  The slash and singular "team" are intriguing.  Perhaps they intend to have some dual carded players that play in both leagues?  Like ECNL/ECNL reserve teams?


Possibly.... but I think you are reaching. They could dual card at anytime. Don’t need to have a tryout for that. They are trying to fill two separate teams first and foremost. They may offer kids a choice between the two teams based off of needs. Holley has the current Blues ECNL 03 team and Rogers will be bringing his Strikers ECNL 03 team over. That’s 30+ current ECNL kids competing for spots on one ECNL team next year. You do the math on that. I’m guessing that they will try to convince some of those kids to play for the DPL. Only problem is that a majority of kids from both teams play high school.... DPL doesn’t allow high school play.


----------



## Josep

This was just posted on OC surf’s Facebook page.  

OC Surf Soccer club will be conducting Girls Development Academy evaluations for the 2018/19 season. 

Interested players should register on the tryout link and also contact age appropriate coach for time and location of team evaluations:

00/01 Gus Castaneda/ Platini Soaf
02/03 Gus Castaneda/ Platini Soaf
03 DA pilot Doug Swanson
04 Platini Soaf
05 Gus Castaneda

Tryouts for our DPL program teams and Discovery League and Flight 1 teams, see below for coaching assignments:

For information about the DPL, please visit www.dpleague.org

Girls 2000/01 

Wednesday April 25 & May 2 7:15-9pm OCGP #14

Girls 2002 DA & DA2 

Wednesday April 25 & May 2 5:30-7:15 

If you are currently on a DA roster and would like to be considered for our 2002 DA team, please contact Gus Castaneda and he will arrange for a personal evaluation.

00/01 DPL Gus Castaneda/ Platini Soaf
00/01 Discovery League Mas
00/01 flight 1 BJ McNicol

02 DPL Alex Filopovic
02 flight 1 Igor Tripovic

03 DPLNick Cucuk
03 flight 1 Gil Hernandez

04 DPL Alex Filopovic
04 flight 1 Alex Filopovic




Looks they dropped ecnl and went all in on DPL and discovery.


----------



## SocalPapa

Pitch pop said:


> Possibly.... but I think you are reaching. They could dual card at anytime. Don’t need to have a tryout for that. They are trying to fill two separate teams first and foremost. They may offer kids a choice between the two teams based off of needs. Holley has the current Blues ECNL 03 team and Rogers will be bringing his Strikers ECNL 03 team over. That’s 30+ current ECNL kids competing for spots on one ECNL team next year. You do the math on that. I’m guessing that they will try to convince some of those kids to play for the DPL. Only problem is that a majority of kids from both teams play high school.... DPL doesn’t allow high school play.


Ah, right, the HS play rule would be the problem.  I don't think AR is bringing his 03 Strikers ECNL team over though.


----------



## Pitch pop

SocalPapa said:


> Ah, right, the HS play rule would be the problem.  I don't think AR is bringing his 03 Strikers ECNL team over though.


I got that info from a parent on his team. No spots guaranteed but the thought is a majority of his ‘03 ECNL team will be trying out for next years Blues ‘03 ECNL team. They are not staying with Strikers ‘03 ECNL next year. That ECNL team will be a new team, under a new coach, out of a new location, from my understanding.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> Possibly.... but I think you are reaching. They could dual card at anytime. Don’t need to have a tryout for that. They are trying to fill two separate teams first and foremost. They may offer kids a choice between the two teams based off of needs. Holley has the current Blues ECNL 03 team and Rogers will be bringing his Strikers ECNL 03 team over. That’s 30+ current ECNL kids competing for spots on one ECNL team next year. You do the math on that. I’m guessing that they will try to convince some of those kids to play for the DPL. Only problem is that a majority of kids from both teams play high school.... DPL doesn’t allow high school play.



All the same rules for the DPL Pilot - no outside competition.  This means no dual cards.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> I got that info from a parent on his team. No spots guaranteed but the thought is a majority of his ‘03 ECNL team will be trying out for next years Blues ‘03 ECNL team. They are not staying with Strikers ‘03 ECNL next year. That ECNL team will be a new team, under a new coach, out of a new location, from my understanding.



HOLD ON!!! Abner left Strikers to go to Blues and took his 03 team with him????? When did this happen and why?  Oh wait, that has nothing to do with the DA.  Dang it.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> All the same rules for the DPL Pilot - no outside competition.  This means no dual cards.


That is correct, I misspoke. Technically no dual cards. However, I know of few ECNL kids that played with their clubs DA team this year. I think they are allowed a certain amount of games before they must be rostered, correct?


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> HOLD ON!!! Abner left Strikers to go to Blues and took his 03 team with him????? When did this happen and why?  Oh wait, that has nothing to do with the DA.  Dang it.


No but the DPL discussion does, since it’s under the DA umbrella and that’s where the conversation started. Just clarifying a few things......Bitter much?


----------



## Desert Hound

Pitch pop said:


> That is correct, I misspoke. Technically no dual cards. However, I know of few ECNL kids that played with their clubs DA team this year. I think they are allowed a certain amount of games before they must be rostered, correct?


Correct


----------



## Mystery Train

Pitch pop said:


> DPL doesn’t allow high school play.





SocalPapa said:


> Ah, right, the HS play rule would be the problem.


I hate to confuse this any further, but DPL does allow HS play.  DA doesn't.  At least as far as I know.  So is this DPL or DA '03 pilot??  LOL 

Nevermind.  I don't care.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> That is correct, I misspoke. Technically no dual cards. However, I know of few ECNL kids that played with their clubs DA team this year. I think they are allowed a certain amount of games before they must be rostered, correct?


Actually.... they aren't by the rules.  So we won't put people on blast here.  I"m sure that was vs Legends too.  Damn, there I go again.

Point is only DPL kids are supposed to be able to come through the system, but......

If a club doesn't have DPL players from the lower teams (DA considers all other teams lower teams) that receive the same type of coaching it would be allowed.  For Blues this would have been ECNL as it considered it on par with DPL for the 2nd tier of soccer in the country.


----------



## G03_SD

How many DP players can be rostered and played in a DA game? ENCL for U14-17 you can have 2 max.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Pitch pop said:


> Possibly.... but I think you are reaching. They could dual card at anytime. Don’t need to have a tryout for that. They are trying to fill two separate teams first and foremost. They may offer kids a choice between the two teams based off of needs. Holley has the current Blues ECNL 03 team and Rogers will be bringing his Strikers ECNL 03 team over. That’s 30+ current ECNL kids competing for spots on one ECNL team next year. You do the math on that. I’m guessing that they will try to convince some of those kids to play for the DPL. Only problem is that a majority of kids from both teams play high school.... DPL doesn’t allow high school play.


Wrong.  DPL is only not allowing HS for the 03's.  It appears to be okay for all other age groups.


----------



## Mystery Train

Simisoccerfan said:


> Wrong.  DPL is only not allowing HS for the 03's.  It appears to be okay for all other age groups.


Thanks for clearing that up.  I was confused because I personally know several '02 DPL players who played HS ball.  So do you know why the '03 DPL players have to get the restriction??


----------



## C.A.M.

Mystery Train said:


> I hate to confuse this any further, but DPL does allow HS play.  DA doesn't.  At least as far as I know.  So is this DPL or DA '03 pilot??  LOL
> 
> Nevermind.  I don't care.



Too late.... should have deleted the post then.  DPL Pilot 03 follows all the DA rules including no high school.

Basically US Soccer is saying..

We know you guys are gonna go extra heavy on 02s this year and we don't want to lose all the 03s we just assimilated and tortured into the system and tell them they are pure crap to us now go away if you can't make the combo team.  Please stay and be 2nd tier citizens with us instead of ECNL.

Dose of reality - this isn't really a bad idea while at the same time is a terrible idea.  The 03s need their own age group again just like the 04s do.  The 02s got done wrong this year and probably should have their own age group and all three should be DA.  Not sure how long this should go on, but maybe for a few years until kids really come through the system at U12 and get to mature under the curriculum and regulations.  It wouldn't have hurt anyone's pride to do it this way and the players who need to age up would generally do it in the clubs that allow that.  This way is actually demeaning or a case of cold reality dished out on frozen plates.


----------



## C.A.M.

Simisoccerfan said:


> Wrong.  DPL is only not allowing HS for the 03's.  It appears to be okay for all other age groups.


Not allowing HS for the 03 Pilot team.  The other DPL team is allowed to play HS.


----------



## Mystery Train

C.A.M. said:


> Too late.... should have deleted the post then.  DPL Pilot 03 follows all the DA rules including no high school.
> 
> Basically US Soccer is saying..
> 
> We know you guys are gonna go extra heavy on 02s this year and we don't want to lose all the 03s we just assimilated and tortured into the system and tell them they are pure crap to us now go away if you can't make the combo team.  Please stay and be 2nd tier citizens with us instead of ECNL.
> 
> Dose of reality - this isn't really a bad idea while at the same time is a terrible idea.  The 03s need their own age group again just like the 04s do.  The 02s got done wrong this year and probably should have their own age group and all three should be DA.  Not sure how long this should go on, but maybe for a few years until kids really come through the system at U12 and get to mature under the curriculum and regulations.  It wouldn't have hurt anyone's pride to do it this way and the players who need to age up would generally do it in the clubs that allow that.  This way is actually demeaning or a case of cold reality dished out on frozen plates.


Ah, makes perfect sense.  I mean, in that none of this really made any sense to begin with...but I get it now.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

G03_SD said:


> How many DP players can be rostered and played in a DA game? ENCL for U14-17 you can have 2 max.


For this year a club can have 12 DP's across the 01/02 and 00/99 age group or 6 DP's for the 03's.  They can play up to 6 games and there is no limit to their use in any single game.


----------



## Overtime

Simisoccerfan said:


> For this year a club can have 12 DP's across the 01/02 and 00/99 age group or 6 DP's for the 03's.  They can play up to 6 games and there is no limit to their use in any single game.


Are they altering the sub rules to more than 3 instances per game?


----------



## Simisoccerfan

The OC Surf posting on coach assignments seems to imply that DPL will no longer be running the 03 pilot and it will be a true DA pilot.  I arrive at this conclusion since they have separate coaches named for the 03 DA Pilot and the 03 DPL team.   I know our team announced the DA coaches for next year and has a 02 coach/team and a 03 coach/team.  They have not announced the DPL coaches yet.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Overtime said:


> Are they altering the sub rules to more than 3 instances per game?


DPL played unlimited subs up to the 18 that can be rostered but I believe they played no re entry in a half.


----------



## C.A.M.

Overtime said:


> Are they altering the sub rules to more than 3 instances per game?


I believe that is the international rule and what the DA will stick to.  If FIFA changes their rules, we are set to follow.  Remember top priority is to find which kids play best in the International Setting on our National team.


----------



## SocalPapa

Pitch pop said:


> I got that info from a parent on his team. No spots guaranteed but the thought is a majority of his ‘03 ECNL team will be trying out for next years Blues ‘03 ECNL team. They are not staying with Strikers ‘03 ECNL next year. That ECNL team will be a new team, under a new coach, out of a new location, from my understanding.


Wow, that's an embarrassment of riches even for the Blues.  AR's 2003 ECNL team and the Blues' 2003 DA team are both legit National Championship contenders in their respective leagues.


----------



## SoccerFan

Josep said:


> This is the 03 pilot.  The new DPL.   Not the backup league from last year.   Southwest vs Frontier at showcases.


USA Soccer has DA pilot in other regions for GDA this year correct? It app
[


Simisoccerfan said:


> When I look at the DPL website I see a  list of participating clubs now including OC Surf, Surf and Blues.   Separately, I see a press release announcing the DPL 03 pilot which is dated over a week prior to the DA meeting at the Winter Showcase.   It does not say that those three clubs are only doing the 03 pilot and no clubs are listed on that press release.   So until we get more facts we are all guessing on how much those three clubs will be involved.  We also don't know if things have changed with the DA since the DPL press release date and whether things will proceed as shown on it or if the USSDA is making the Southwest an official pilot.





C.A.M. said:


> Too late.... should have deleted the post then.  DPL Pilot 03 follows all the DA rules including no high school.
> 
> Basically US Soccer is saying..
> 
> We know you guys are gonna go extra heavy on 02s this year and we don't want to lose all the 03s we just assimilated and tortured into the system and tell them they are pure crap to us now go away if you can't make the combo team.  Please stay and be 2nd tier citizens with us instead of ECNL.
> 
> Dose of reality - this isn't really a bad idea while at the same time is a terrible idea.  The 03s need their own age group again just like the 04s do.  The 02s got done wrong this year and probably should have their own age group and all three should be DA.  Not sure how long this should go on, but maybe for a few years until kids really come through the system at U12 and get to mature under the curriculum and regulations.  It wouldn't have hurt anyone's pride to do it this way and the players who need to age up would generally do it in the clubs that allow that.  This way is actually demeaning or a case of cold reality dished out on frozen plates.


Pure crap? lol....what’s wrong with you? Most DA 2001/2002 teams this year have just 2 or 3 2002s on the roster. O3 pilot DA in 2018-2019 will still be considered the A team!


----------



## Pitch pop

SoccerFan said:


> USA Soccer has DA pilot in other regions for GDA this year correct? It app
> [
> 
> 
> 
> Pure crap? lol....what’s wrong with you? Most DA 2001/2002 teams this year have just 2 or 3 2002s on the roster. O3 pilot DA in 2018-2019 will still be considered the A team!


Minus the their 2 or 3 best players. (I’m guessing more, from what I’m hearing) .... Maybe the 03 pilot will be more like a B+ team?


----------



## C.A.M.

SoccerFan said:


> USA Soccer has DA pilot in other regions for GDA this year correct? It app
> [
> 
> 
> 
> Pure crap? lol....what’s wrong with you? Most DA 2001/2002 teams this year have just 2 or 3 2002s on the roster. O3 pilot DA in 2018-2019 will still be considered the A team!



In my statement I was very clear that I'm okay with an age division split.  What I'm saying is pure crap is that it isn't considered to be the normal division in DA.  They don't get to go to all the showcases (no 2nd one like what they just attended in North Carolina), and will their game results be available on the US Soccer Academy website like all the other DA teams?  

I have been on this forum spewing my opinion that "I love what the DA can do for the game, but DA isn't for a lot of girls" from the time we were playing vs everyone still in the Summer and we lost to a non DA/ECNL team and started getting ragged on.  I stated then... DA is a whole different beast attempting to conquer goals that the high majority of teams in other leagues have no idea or concern about and certainly don't mandate.  From passing out of and building from the back to how they want the ball to move up the field, etc......  Foreign concepts to most of our girls who have been the best athletes on in their teams in a WIN AT ALL COSTS environment that lacked this type of sophisticated development in most cases.  This also means that the coaching needs to be at a higher level than before.

My other concern was the age grouping.  I never liked it although I understood it.  The sub rule didn't concern me as much if the rosters were 18 or less.  

If a little ole obsessive soccer parent like me could see these issues coming in the largest, densest, most populous, most competitive part of the country called Southern California partaking in this venture , how couldn't the powers that be?  Here is were the parents of olders come in and say we told you US Soccer would flub this up.  Ding ding ding.

I think the DA is great and could be better if they actually took into consideration the children.... NOTICE THAT WORD  - CHILDREN, they are looking to have participate in their program and recognize that it takes more than one year to break the bad habits of the lesser quality players (mentally, physically and combined) *disclaimer - lesser quality doesn't mean you suck.  You suck means you suck.  Lesser quality means you aren't ready for prime time in the current system and need developing and time to do so*.  

You know what, may be they have and just didn't care as long as they got their 25-50 top players out of the program.  Still, if your idea is to have those 25-50 top players flourish and continue to dominate on the world stage - they better be going against the most kick ass competition they can at home.  That means makes the rules so the group has time to grow and adjust.  Those that are ahead of the curve will be placed in advanced situations with older and better competition in the beginning anyways (see the two 03's on the Slammers 01/02 team or Solar 00/99 team). This allows for long term growth and better competition.  That's how you build a system for long term growth and sustainability.  Similar to how John Wooden did at UCLA, Coach K does at Duke, Pat Summit did at Tennessee and Gene A does at  UConn in college basketball.  The one constant is they have no more than 4 years (99% of the time) to develop these young human beings who are extremely talented and turn them into successful athletes within their particular system.  All of their athletes are hand picked, same as the ones for the DA.  

The difference is they rushed to put it into effect and didn't think about the product they want to produce is HUMAN BEINGS and most humans do not adjust quickly to new circumstances.  

Like I've said, my kid is getting the looks, emails, invites, etc.... to universities, which is the main goal.  This isn't a personal rant.  My kid can play and and my kid still has a lot of dynamic growth and soccer development to come and be really good for however long she determines she wants to lace them up.  I'm just watching the whole.  Not just her team, but the whole and seeing kids struggle mightily and wonder how US Soccer didn't see this coming or if they simply didn't care? 

Beyond that.... it's the law of the jungle buddy. Cool beans and good luck.


Also - here are the FIFA 2017/18 sub rules from their website.  You can find the pdf here: http://www.fifa.com/search/?q=LAWS+OF+THE+GAME+2017-18


----------



## SoccerFan

C.A.M. said:


> In my statement I was very clear that I'm okay with an age division split.  What I'm saying is pure crap is that it isn't considered to be the normal division in DA.  They don't get to go to all the showcases (no 2nd one like what they just attended in North Carolina), and will their game results be available on the US Soccer Academy website like all the other DA teams?
> 
> I have been on this forum spewing my opinion that "I love what the DA can do for the game, but DA isn't for a lot of girls" from the time we were playing vs everyone still in the Summer and we lost to a non DA/ECNL team and started getting ragged on.  I stated then... DA is a whole different beast attempting to conquer goals that the high majority of teams in other leagues have no idea or concern about and certainly don't mandate.  From passing out of and building from the back to how they want the ball to move up the field, etc......  Foreign concepts to most of our girls who have been the best athletes on in their teams in a WIN AT ALL COSTS environment that lacked this type of sophisticated development in most cases.  This also means that the coaching needs to be at a higher level than before.
> 
> My other concern was the age grouping.  I never liked it although I understood it.  The sub rule didn't concern me as much if the rosters were 18 or less.
> 
> If a little ole obsessive soccer parent like me could see these issues coming in the largest, densest, most populous, most competitive part of the country called Southern California partaking in this venture , how couldn't the powers that be?  Here is were the parents of olders come in and say we told you US Soccer would flub this up.  Ding ding ding.
> 
> I think the DA is great and could be better if they actually took into consideration the children.... NOTICE THAT WORD  - CHILDREN, they are looking to have participate in their program and recognize that it takes more than one year to break the bad habits of the lesser quality players (mentally, physically and combined) *disclaimer - lesser quality doesn't mean you suck.  You suck means you suck.  Lesser quality means you aren't ready for prime time in the current system and need developing and time to do so*.
> 
> You know what, may be they have and just didn't care as long as they got their 25-50 top players out of the program.  Still, if your idea is to have those 25-50 top players flourish and continue to dominate on the world stage - they better be going against the most kick ass competition they can at home.  That means makes the rules so the group has time to grow and adjust.  Those that are ahead of the curve will be placed in advanced situations with older and better competition in the beginning anyways (see the two 03's on the Slammers 01/02 team or Solar 00/99 team). This allows for long term growth and better competition.  That's how you build a system for long term growth and sustainability.  Similar to how John Wooden did at UCLA, Coach K does at Duke, Pat Summit did at Tennessee and Gene A does at  UConn in college basketball.  The one constant is they have no more than 4 years (99% of the time) to develop these young human beings who are extremely talented and turn them into successful athletes within their particular system.  All of their athletes are hand picked, same as the ones for the DA.
> 
> The difference is they rushed to put it into effect and didn't think about the product they want to produce is HUMAN BEINGS and most humans do not adjust quickly to new circumstances.
> 
> Like I've said, my kid is getting the looks, emails, invites, etc.... to universities, which is the main goal.  This isn't a personal rant.  My kid can play and and my kid still has a lot of dynamic growth and soccer development to come and be really good for however long she determines she wants to lace them up.  I'm just watching the whole.  Not just her team, but the whole and seeing kids struggle mightily and wonder how US Soccer didn't see this coming or if they simply didn't care?
> 
> Beyond that.... it's the law of the jungle buddy. Cool beans and good luck.
> 
> 
> Also - here are the FIFA 2017/18 sub rules from their website.  You can find the pdf here: http://www.fifa.com/search/?q=LAWS+OF+THE+GAME+2017-18
> 
> View attachment 2413


Okay, okay


----------



## Swoosh

Easy fix to all of this:  US Soccer only calls players from academy teams.  And watch the mad scramble.  Like having a nuke.  Will they use it?


----------



## Zen

Swoosh said:


> Easy fix to all of this:  US Soccer only calls players from academy teams.  And watch the mad scramble.  Like having a nuke.  Will they use it?


In Norcal, the rumor is they already did.  It will influence minimal to no movement for ECNL players to adandon their team for DA.  Local US Training center invites are already biased toward DA.  College is the end game and most Norcal parents aren’t that disillusioned to think their daughter is the .1%.  Even parents whose daughters should actually be invited to local US trainings, maybe irritated, but not enough to abandon a coach, team, and journey they like for a pipe dream.  The real showdown for who should be on the national team will be in college.  Parents with ballers aren’t worried about it.  Regardless of youth invites or not, those deserving will be hard to deny (i.e. Hallie Mace).  Even if your end game is USNT, I doubt USSF will deny a pac-12 athletic freak and star a look because she didn’t come from a DA club.


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> I believe that is the international rule and what the DA will stick to.  If FIFA changes their rules, we are set to follow.  Remember top priority is to find which kids play best in the International Setting on our National team.


FIFA rules are appropriate for professional and international games (although I believe the "3" may be bypassed in some situations).  Limiting subs that severely for youth developmental or showcase situations is meaningless imitation that interferes with rational coaching decisions.


----------



## espola

Swoosh said:


> Easy fix to all of this:  US Soccer only calls players from academy teams.  And watch the mad scramble.  Like having a nuke.  Will they use it?


Fix?


----------



## shales1002

Swoosh said:


> Easy fix to all of this:  US Soccer only calls players from academy teams.  And watch the mad scramble.  Like having a nuke.  Will they use it?


That would be asinine. It's not the fault of the player about what their clubs or parents decide to do. I think we can all agree that are DDs are the ones caught in this tug of war. The only thing I see coming is the powers that be using SoCal to try to salvage GDA.   Believe me when I say the only mad scramble would be from those who aren't the true unicorns. True unicorns know their value. Unicorns will be found and utilized regardless of league affiliation after all they are special.


----------



## Soccer43

Zen said:


> In Norcal, the rumor is they already did.  It will influence minimal to no movement for ECNL players to adandon their team for DA.  Local US Training center invites are already biased toward DA.  College is the end game and most Norcal parents aren’t that disillusioned to think their daughter is the .1%.  Even parents whose daughters should actually be invited to local US trainings, maybe irritated, but not enough to abandon a coach, team, and journey they like for a pipe dream.  The real showdown for who should be on the national team will be in college.  Parents with ballers aren’t worried about it.  Regardless of youth invites or not, those deserving will be hard to deny (i.e. Hallie Mace).  Even if your end game is USNT, I doubt USSF will deny a pac-12 athletic freak and star a look because she didn’t come from a DA club.


Tell those Norcal parents not to worry about the US Training centers - big waste of time


----------



## Zen

shales1002 said:


> That would be asinine. It's not the fault of the player about what their clubs or parents decide to do. I think we can all agree that are DDs are the ones caught in this tug of war. The only thing I see coming is the powers that be using SoCal to try to salvage GDA.   Believe me when I say the only mad scramble would be from those who aren't the true unicorns. True unicorns know their value. Unicorns will be found and utilized regardless of league affiliation after all they are special.


Unfortunately the girls are caught in the fray.  In Norcal, 80% of regional invites are from DA clubs - 70% from 1 DA club - despite strong ECNL league presence.  No one is changing teams (that I'm aware of) because of it, but the bias is noticed.  Maybe this will influence U8 parent hopefuls, but not olders.  I look forward to seeing some of these girls play in D1.  It'll be captain obvious by then.  Our team beat the Thorns DA in a scrimmage a while back something to the order of 16-0 in the presence of a local US Soccer Scout and local college coaches.  It didn't translate to regional NTC , but college coaches know where the talent is and will not be swayed by league affiliation.


----------



## push_up

Scrimmages do not matter.  Wins and losses do not matter.  Team or club standings in GDA/ECNL do not matter.  Sub rules don't matter.  Outside of the .001 player development does not matter.  Unicorns matter.  Keep drinking that koolaid.


----------



## Desert Hound

Zen said:


> Unfortunately the girls are caught in the fray.  In Norcal, 80% of regional invites are from DA clubs - 70% from 1 DA club - despite strong ECNL league presence.  No one is changing teams (that I'm aware of) because of it, but the bias is noticed.  Maybe this will influence U8 parent hopefuls, but not olders.  I look forward to seeing some of these girls play in D1.  It'll be captain obvious by then.  Our team beat the Thorns DA in a scrimmage a while back something to the order of 16-0 in the presence of a local US Soccer Scout and local college coaches.  It didn't translate to regional NTC , but college coaches know where the talent is and will not be swayed by league affiliation.


If they are only or mainly picking girls from DA teams then they are more interested in their league vs using the best where every they come from. But as I type this I realize they are more interested in their league.


----------



## Lambchop

Zen said:


> Unfortunately the girls are caught in the fray.  In Norcal, 80% of regional invites are from DA clubs - 70% from 1 DA club - despite strong ECNL league presence.  No one is changing teams (that I'm aware of) because of it, but the bias is noticed.  Maybe this will influence U8 parent hopefuls, but not olders.  I look forward to seeing some of these girls play in D1.  It'll be captain obvious by then.  Our team beat the Thorns DA in a scrimmage a while back something to the order of 16-0 in the presence of a local US Soccer Scout and local college coaches.  It didn't translate to regional NTC , but college coaches know where the talent is and will not be swayed by league affiliation.


Scrimmage?? A scrimmage between an ECNL team and a DA team, is that what you are saying.  Winning a game does not entitle players for national training center call ups.  It is true, college coaches recruit players not teams anyway.


----------



## davin

Lambchop said:


> Scrimmage?? A scrimmage between an ECNL team and a DA team, is that what you are saying.  Winning a game does not entitle players for national training center call ups.  It is true, college coaches recruit players not teams anyway.


That DA team has the second best record in their age group in NorCal DA Their coach invited national team scouts to the game along with a couple of PAC 12 coaches. More than half their team are in the regional NTC. After that 16-0 blastibg in front all those scouts/coaches, many of us were shaking our heads about how they had so many kids invited to NTC. Something is wrong with the US soccer’s player identification process.


----------



## Zen

Lambchop said:


> Scrimmage?? A scrimmage between an ECNL team and a DA team, is that what you are saying.  Winning a game does not entitle players for national training center call ups.  It is true, college coaches recruit players not teams anyway.


Agreed.  Amused you think it’s about one data point.  We’ve played every local DA and the best Socal teams before they were GDA.  Our track record speaks for itself.


----------



## soccer4us

davin said:


> That DA team has the second best record in their age group in NorCal DA Their coach invited national team scouts to the game along with a couple of PAC 12 coaches. More than half their team are in the regional NTC. After that 16-0 blastibg in front all those scouts/coaches, many of us were shaking our heads about how they had so many kids invited to NTC. Something is wrong with the US soccer’s player identification process.


US soccer has already started the you need to be DA to play YNT in the future but very subtle. They will never make it public but like the NTC, they will try to steer that way unless an absolute starter is ECNL. They have no choice in that case. 

NTC are a bit ridiculous for sure. Come hang out with my buddies and watch my kid train a little. I guess it goes on the resume lol In nor cal a few years back they removed the coach running the NTC because they would just "recruit" kids and other top clubs complained to us soccer.


----------



## InTheValley

davin said:


> That DA team has the second best record in their age group in NorCal DA Their coach invited national team scouts to the game along with a couple of PAC 12 coaches. More than half their team are in the regional NTC. After that 16-0 blastibg in front all those scouts/coaches, many of us were shaking our heads about how they had so many kids invited to NTC. Something is wrong with the US soccer’s player identification process.


I’m not sure this is a good example of US Soccer favoring DA players or screwing up the identification process.  Of the 3 NorCal players on the U17 squad, for example, all of them can play and 2 of the 3 don’t play DA, including the captain.  

I also don’t see any Thorns teams that are 2nd in the DA and only two of their players who’ve ever been invited to a national camp in all age groups. What team are you referring to?


----------



## Zen

InTheValley said:


> I’m not sure this is a good example of US Soccer favoring DA players or screwing up the identification process.  Of the 3 NorCal players on the U17 squad, for example, all of them can play and 2 of the 3 don’t play DA, including the captain.
> 
> I also don’t see any Thorns teams that are 2nd in the DA and only two of their players who’ve ever been invited to a national camp in all age groups. What team are you referring to?


2004’s


----------



## davin

InTheValley said:


> I’m not sure this is a good example of US Soccer favoring DA players or screwing up the identification process.  Of the 3 NorCal players on the U17 squad, for example, all of them can play and 2 of the 3 don’t play DA, including the captain.
> 
> I also don’t see any Thorns teams that are 2nd in the DA and only two of their players who’ve ever been invited to a national camp in all age groups. What team are you referring to?


As mentioned by a couple of people on this thread, if a kid is obviously an elite baller, US Soccer has no choice but to select them to the NT. The example above is in reference to the regional training camp that should be a stepping stone to the NT.

The team is the 2004 team. Last I heard, Earthquakes we’re 1st, and Thorns/Placer were next with roughly the same record, but Thorns beat Placer in both head to head games.


----------



## InTheValley

davin said:


> As mentioned by a couple of people on this thread, if a kid is obviously an elite baller, US Soccer has no choice but to select them to the NT. The example above is in reference to the regional training camp that should be a stepping stone to the NT.
> 
> The team is the 2004 team. Last I heard, Earthquakes we’re 1st, and Thorns/Placer were next with roughly the same record, but Thorns beat Placer in both head to head games.


Got it. I wouldn’t worry about regional invites for the little ones.  I’d start worrying when Stanford and UCLA commits who play ECNL stop making YNTs.  Everyone who makes U17 or above should be a unicorn, so I don’t really see any impact when these YNTs start to mean something more important than a higher Topdrawer ranking. 

If US Soccer wants to bolster its tottering GDA by duping/threatening families with little kids into playing GDA because only GDA kids make regional trainings, I guess that’s their prerogative.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> In my statement I was very clear that I'm okay with an age division split.  What I'm saying is pure crap is that it isn't considered to be the normal division in DA.  They don't get to go to all the showcases (no 2nd one like what they just attended in North Carolina), and will their game results be available on the US Soccer Academy website like all the other DA teams?
> 
> I have been on this forum spewing my opinion that "I love what the DA can do for the game, but DA isn't for a lot of girls" from the time we were playing vs everyone still in the Summer and we lost to a non DA/ECNL team and started getting ragged on.  I stated then... DA is a whole different beast attempting to conquer goals that the high majority of teams in other leagues have no idea or concern about and certainly don't mandate.  From passing out of and building from the back to how they want the ball to move up the field, etc......  Foreign concepts to most of our girls who have been the best athletes on in their teams in a WIN AT ALL COSTS environment that lacked this type of sophisticated development in most cases.  This also means that the coaching needs to be at a higher level than before.
> 
> My other concern was the age grouping.  I never liked it although I understood it.  The sub rule didn't concern me as much if the rosters were 18 or less.
> 
> If a little ole obsessive soccer parent like me could see these issues coming in the largest, densest, most populous, most competitive part of the country called Southern California partaking in this venture , how couldn't the powers that be?  Here is were the parents of olders come in and say we told you US Soccer would flub this up.  Ding ding ding.
> 
> I think the DA is great and could be better if they actually took into consideration the children.... NOTICE THAT WORD  - CHILDREN, they are looking to have participate in their program and recognize that it takes more than one year to break the bad habits of the lesser quality players (mentally, physically and combined) *disclaimer - lesser quality doesn't mean you suck.  You suck means you suck.  Lesser quality means you aren't ready for prime time in the current system and need developing and time to do so*.
> 
> You know what, may be they have and just didn't care as long as they got their 25-50 top players out of the program.  Still, if your idea is to have those 25-50 top players flourish and continue to dominate on the world stage - they better be going against the most kick ass competition they can at home.  That means makes the rules so the group has time to grow and adjust.  Those that are ahead of the curve will be placed in advanced situations with older and better competition in the beginning anyways (see the two 03's on the Slammers 01/02 team or Solar 00/99 team). This allows for long term growth and better competition.  That's how you build a system for long term growth and sustainability.  Similar to how John Wooden did at UCLA, Coach K does at Duke, Pat Summit did at Tennessee and Gene A does at  UConn in college basketball.  The one constant is they have no more than 4 years (99% of the time) to develop these young human beings who are extremely talented and turn them into successful athletes within their particular system.  All of their athletes are hand picked, same as the ones for the DA.
> 
> The difference is they rushed to put it into effect and didn't think about the product they want to produce is HUMAN BEINGS and most humans do not adjust quickly to new circumstances.
> 
> Like I've said, my kid is getting the looks, emails, invites, etc.... to universities, which is the main goal.  This isn't a personal rant.  My kid can play and and my kid still has a lot of dynamic growth and soccer development to come and be really good for however long she determines she wants to lace them up.  I'm just watching the whole.  Not just her team, but the whole and seeing kids struggle mightily and wonder how US Soccer didn't see this coming or if they simply didn't care?
> 
> Beyond that.... it's the law of the jungle buddy. Cool beans and good luck.
> 
> 
> Also - here are the FIFA 2017/18 sub rules from their website.  You can find the pdf here: http://www.fifa.com/search/?q=LAWS+OF+THE+GAME+2017-18
> 
> View attachment 2413



Trusting the current leadership at US Soccer is pretty silly.  Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Not true at all.  She played really well as a Freshman when SC went to UCLA and beat them for there for the first time.  She also played well vs them in Stub Hub when UCLA beat them in the last conference game when SC won the National Championship.  She played well this last season too, but the outside backs  simply didn't have enough speed to keep up with them and she and the other CB had too much ground to cover.  Game still went down to the wire.  Playing UCLA is a terrorizing situation for a CB on any team that doesn't drop deep and cover.


I was at that game too and she got megged in that game as did the other Trojan centerback.  Check the game film it is on YouTube.  The game was very onesided as most of $C's shots were in the last 10 minutes of the game.  I would say that the game this year was closer.  Next season is going to be a severe "cleansing" if you know what I mean.  If the rumors about the lineup are true I am looking forward to it.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> Trusting the current leadership at US Soccer is pretty silly.  Good luck to you and your player.


Your daughter  experience with US soccer, what does she think?


----------



## PLSAP

InTheValley said:


> Got it. I wouldn’t worry about regional invites for the little ones.  I’d start worrying when Stanford and UCLA commits who play ECNL stop making YNTs.  Everyone who makes U17 or above should be a unicorn, so I don’t really see any impact when these YNTs start to mean something more important than a higher Topdrawer ranking.
> 
> If US Soccer wants to bolster its tottering GDA by duping/threatening families with little kids into playing GDA because only GDA kids make regional trainings, I guess that’s their prerogative.


UCLA commit on Arsenal 2002 I.L. is the only youth national team member on that team that didn't make a move to GDA. Unlike the rest of her old teammates, she hasn't had a single call up since. SMH horrible decision by US Soccer. They think they're winning in this decision, but all it does is limit the player pool, no other country would ever.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sheriff Joe said:


> Your daughter  experience with US soccer, what does she think?


My comments and opinions are my own.  My daughter is quite the opinionated person.  You are welcome to ask her yourself although she might be too left leaning for your taste.


----------



## MakeAPlay

PLSAP said:


> UCLA commit on Arsenal 2002 I.L. is the only youth national team member on that team that didn't make a move to GDA. Unlike the rest of her old teammates, she hasn't had a single call up since. SMH horrible decision by US Soccer. They think they're winning in this decision, but all it does is limit the player pool, no other country would ever.


She will get called back in once she gets closer to going to UCLA.  The coaches there have an eye for talent that US Soccer often misses.  I wouldn't worry though as 99% of all full women's  national team players played in college and her school is one that produces them.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

MakeAPlay said:


> My comments and opinions are my own.  My daughter is quite the opinionated person.  You are welcome to ask her yourself although she might be too left leaning for your taste.


I don't mind left leaning.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Great weekend of soccer!


----------



## C.A.M.

Zen said:


> Unfortunately the girls are caught in the fray.  In Norcal, 80% of regional invites are from DA clubs - 70% from 1 DA club - despite strong ECNL league presence.  No one is changing teams (that I'm aware of) because of it, but the bias is noticed.  Maybe this will influence U8 parent hopefuls, but not olders.  I look forward to seeing some of these girls play in D1.  It'll be captain obvious by then.  Our team beat the Thorns DA in a scrimmage a while back something to the order of 16-0 in the presence of a local US Soccer Scout and local college coaches.  It didn't translate to regional NTC , but college coaches know where the talent is and will not be swayed by league affiliation.



US SOCCER was clear from the start they would mostly be picking the US Teams from DA players.  No comment on if that is right or wrong.  Just saying it was clear. 



push_up said:


> Scrimmages do not matter.  Wins and losses do not matter.  Team or club standings in GDA/ECNL do not matter.  Sub rules don't matter.  Outside of the .001 player development does not matter.  Unicorns matter.  Keep drinking that koolaid.


Please define unicorns as I am ignorant about the usage here.


----------



## Dubs

Zen said:


> In Norcal, the rumor is they already did.  It will influence minimal to no movement for ECNL players to adandon their team for DA.  Local US Training center invites are already biased toward DA.  College is the end game and most Norcal parents aren’t that disillusioned to think their daughter is the .1%.  Even parents whose daughters should actually be invited to local US trainings, maybe irritated, but not enough to abandon a coach, team, and journey they like for a pipe dream.  The real showdown for who should be on the national team will be in college.  Parents with ballers aren’t worried about it.  Regardless of youth invites or not, those deserving will be hard to deny (i.e. Hallie Mace).  Even if your end game is USNT, I doubt USSF will deny a pac-12 athletic freak and star a look because she didn’t come from a DA club.


You hit the nail on the head!!!


----------



## espola

C.A.M. said:


> US SOCCER was clear from the start they would mostly be picking the US Teams from DA players.  No comment on if that is right or wrong.  Just saying it was clear.
> 
> 
> 
> Please define unicorns as I am ignorant about the usage here.


I don't think the program as exists is what US Soccer planned.

I think "unicorn" as it is used here refers to players who are obvious standouts.


----------



## MWN

@C.A.M. the "unicorn" player is that super-rare talent that transcends all others.  The kid that has speed, foot skills and a competitive drive like no other.  The kid that all agree is the best player they have ever seen.  Professional teams figure out a way to get the kid in their academy system.  Their success at the next level is all but guaranteed (e.g. Christian Pulisic).

As far as the US Youth National Teams are concerned, which are nothing more than an international all-star exhibition team, US Soccer will look to the DA first because the DA is US Soccer's baby and US Soccer has all the data on those players, so yes, Youth National teams will attempt to primarily draw from the DA for the simple reason that it knows those players best and favors the training regime and culture of the DA.

When it comes to the Senior Mens or Senior Womens USNT, the DA is not relevant.  The professional leagues are relevant.  Virtually every player on both the Mens and Womens team will have been removed from any youth program for 3-5 years.


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> FIFA rules are appropriate for professional and international games (although I believe the "3" may be bypassed in some situations).  Limiting subs that severely for youth developmental or showcase situations is meaningless imitation that interferes with rational coaching decisions.


Agreed and the FIFA laws even state adjustments are allowed regionally.

Thing is a lot coaches already don't get past their top 13 or 14 players.  There are plenty of teams with players on the end of the bench not playing / developing.  All of this before the advent of the DA.  The DA isn't the cause.  The focus of winning is the cause.  

Not that winning is bad.  At these ages I just like winning and developing combined better.


----------



## C.A.M.

MWN said:


> @C.A.M. the "unicorn" player is that super-rare talent that transcends all others.  The kid that has speed, foot skills and a competitive drive like no other.  The kid that all agree is the best player they have ever seen.  Professional teams figure out a way to get the kid in their academy system.  Their success at the next level is all but guaranteed (e.g. Christian Pulisic).
> 
> As far as the US Youth National Teams are concerned, which are nothing more than an international all-star exhibition team, US Soccer will look to the DA first because the DA is US Soccer's baby and US Soccer has all the data on those players, so yes, Youth National teams will attempt to primarily draw from the DA for the simple reason that it knows those players best and favors the training regime and culture of the DA.
> 
> When it comes to the Senior Mens or Senior Womens USNT, the DA is not relevant.  The professional leagues are relevant.  Virtually every player on both the Mens and Womens team will have been removed from any youth program for 3-5 years.



Thanks for the clarity on the "unicorn".  I like it.  I've told my girl to focus on getting to the university she wants through the DA.  Since she hasn't been identified within the the last two to three years we don't expect for a YNT call up (will take it though!).  If she is ever at that level we expect it to happen through her college play or pro play if she decides to do that.  Yes I said it like it's a guarantee.  I'm a believer.  LOL.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I was at that game too and she got megged in that game as did the other Trojan centerback.  Check the game film it is on YouTube.  The game was very onesided as most of $C's shots were in the last 10 minutes of the game.  I would say that the game this year was closer.  Next season is going to be a severe "cleansing" if you know what I mean.  If the rumors about the lineup are true I am looking forward to it.



The end of last year's game would suggest I affirm that "cleansing" you're speaking of if SC didn't bring in some serious athletes to defend the wings.  UCLA is only going to be faster and stronger this year and with next's years commits they will get even more track star speed combined with size and skills.  Scary few years.  Hope mine can continue that trend.

On the megging - being a defender in the sports I played, my mindstate is you could be all fancy, but did you get the shot/pass off and did they get to where you want them too?  If the answer is no, keep megging and I'll keep you from being effective.  I know the CB we're speaking of thinks the same.  Her partner?  No clue.


----------



## C.A.M.

espola said:


> I don't think the program as exists is what US Soccer planned.
> 
> I think "unicorn" as it is used here refers to players who are obvious standouts.



In defense of the people who need no defense because they will do whatever they please whenever they please.....

The age group unbanding and rebanding has been the issue for the past 3 seasons.  The system changes over the last few years have crushed the norm in the girls game.  

Be forewarned - the age group changes are just temporary.   Have you seen the bio-banding initiative?  This has already started in 4 DA clubs this past weekend.  If anyone has any info on the results and reactions let us know.  

https://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2018/04/05/15/45/20180405-news-us-soccer-introduces-bio-banding-initiative


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> The end of last year's game would suggest I affirm that "cleansing" you're speaking of if SC didn't bring in some serious athletes to defend the wings.  UCLA is only going to be faster and stronger this year and with next's years commits they will get even more track star speed combined with size and skills.  Scary few years.  Hope mine can continue that trend.
> 
> On the megging - being a defender in the sports I played, my mindstate is you could be all fancy, but did you get the shot/pass off and did they get to where you want them too?  If the answer is no, keep megging and I'll keep you from being effective.  I know the CB we're speaking of thinks the same.  Her partner?  No clue.


I didn't quite understand your first paragraph but $C has nothing that will bother UCLA much this upcoming season or next.  The next few years could be rough for the rivalry.  $C can bring in anybody they want they are still far behind the top SoCal destination for top players and with how their coach allocates scholarship money they will never have enough top players to beat UCLA until that changes.

Regarding the megging.  I know the player that did the megging and she is better than any midfielder in North America and that includes anyone on the US WNT.  You really should look at the film of the game so that you can have an idea of the abject terror your favored player was in (what top defenders get megged in games?).  And yes she got the shot off and this year was runner up for the MAC Hermann and will be favored to win it the next two years (if one of her teammates doesn't win it).  

You are barking up the wrong tree on this one @C.A.M.   I've watched every game $C has played over the last 3 years other than maybe a couple.  FYI, UCLA has lost just one game in the playoffs since the 2016 recruiting class arrived (#1 in the nation) and they will be juniors this year.  I am not sure exactly what you mean by I hope mine continues that trend but if your player has the chops to get offered a scholarship by the Bruins, especially in the next couple of years, then my hat is off to her.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## Real Deal

C.A.M. said:


> In defense of the people who need no defense because they will do whatever they please whenever they please.....
> 
> The age group unbanding and rebanding has been the issue for the past 3 seasons.  The system changes over the last few years have crushed the norm in the girls game.
> 
> Be forewarned - the age group changes are just temporary.   Have you seen the bio-banding initiative?  This has already started in 4 DA clubs this past weekend.  If anyone has any info on the results and reactions let us know.
> 
> https://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2018/04/05/15/45/20180405-news-us-soccer-introduces-bio-banding-initiative


Yes, please, would love to know which clubs started bio-banding.


----------



## C.A.M.




----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I didn't quite understand your first paragraph but $C has nothing that will bother UCLA much this upcoming season or next.  The next few years could be rough for the rivalry.  $C can bring in anybody they want they are still far behind the top SoCal destination for top players and with how their coach allocates scholarship money they will never have enough top players to beat UCLA until that changes.
> 
> Regarding the megging.  I know the player that did the megging and she is better than any midfielder in North America and that includes anyone on the US WNT.  You really should look at the film of the game so that you can have an idea of the abject terror your favored player was in (what top defenders get megged in games?).  And yes she got the shot off and this year was runner up for the MAC Hermann and will be favored to win it the next two years (if one of her teammates doesn't win it).
> 
> You are barking up the wrong tree on this one @C.A.M.   I've watched every game $C has played over the last 3 years other than maybe a couple.  FYI, UCLA has lost just one game in the playoffs since the 2016 recruiting class arrived (#1 in the nation) and they will be juniors this year.  I am not sure exactly what you mean by I hope mine continues that trend but if your player has the chops to get offered a scholarship by the Bruins, especially in the next couple of years, then my hat is off to her.
> 
> Good luck to you and your player.


We wear blue and gold at our house.  Read my first paragraph with that in mind.  I'm expecting for SC to get ran over for a very long time.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

I believe Anaheim Surf was the first club to try BioBanding last year, on their way to trying to win State Cup. It wasn't called Bio Banding back then though, it was called "playing over-aged players," I think is the correct term.


----------



## C.A.M.

Can we all start an initiative that all the DA games are live streamed on YouTube?

LAGSD GDA does this and it is fantastic (great job guys).  Great quality - I believe 1080p and (no announcers work for me - you hear the players and coaches).  I would really like to see my kids play and we are always split apart.  Our club is lagging on putting up the games.


----------



## outside!

C.A.M. said:


> Can we all start an initiative that all the DA games are live streamed on YouTube?
> 
> LAGSD GDA does this and it is fantastic (great job guys).  Great quality - I believe 1080p and (no announcers work for me - you hear the players and coaches).  I would really like to see my kids play and we are always split apart.  Our club is lagging on putting up the games.


Which club? DD plays at LAGSD and relatives like to watch the LiveStream games. I have been surprised that our away games are not LiveStreamed by the hosting clubs. I'm talking to you SC Del Sol. We have to trek all the way out to Phoenix for a league game, and you guys can't even broadcast the games? One more reason to kick Phoenix out and stay in SoCal for league games.


----------



## Zvezdas

No top defenders or players ever get megged, well not in the US college soccer


----------



## push_up

outside! said:


> Which club? DD plays at LAGSD and relatives like to watch the LiveStream games. I have been surprised that our away games are not LiveStreamed by the hosting clubs. I'm talking to you SC Del Sol. We have to trek all the way out to Phoenix for a league game, and you guys can't even broadcast the games? One more reason to kick Phoenix out and stay in SoCal for league games.


Del Sol does not broadcast the games because they spend their time being derogatory and berating the players through the run of play.  Another fun fact.  Del Sol removes the sound from all the games recorded so there is no evidence of their comments to players.  If it is unusually bad, they won't post the game at all.


----------



## C.A.M.

push_up said:


> Del Sol does not broadcast the games because they spend their time being derogatory and berating the players through the run of play.  Another fun fact.  Del Sol removes the sound from all the games recorded so there is no evidence of their comments to players.  If it is unusually bad, they won't post the game at all.


I was wondering why there is no sound.


----------



## C.A.M.

outside! said:


> Which club? DD plays at LAGSD and relatives like to watch the LiveStream games. I have been surprised that our away games are not LiveStreamed by the hosting clubs. I'm talking to you SC Del Sol. We have to trek all the way out to Phoenix for a league game, and you guys can't even broadcast the games? One more reason to kick Phoenix out and stay in SoCal for league games.



Who else is live streaming besides LAGSD?


----------



## Kicker4Life

outside! said:


> Which club? DD plays at LAGSD and relatives like to watch the LiveStream games. I have been surprised that our away games are not LiveStreamed by the hosting clubs. I'm talking to you SC Del Sol. We have to trek all the way out to Phoenix for a league game, and you guys can't even broadcast the games? One more reason to kick Phoenix out and stay in SoCal for league games.


We use Parascope....free and all you need is a parent willing to broadcast from their phone.


----------



## push_up

C.A.M. said:


> I was wondering why there is no sound.


One more fun fact.  How many times do you think the del sol coaches have used game film during any training session this past year?  The answer is never for the aforementioned reason.


----------



## Desert Hound

push_up said:


> One more fun fact.  How many times do you think the del sol coaches have used game film during any training session this past year?  The answer is never for the aforementioned reason.


So your kid hasn't done well at del Sol and you are bitter. As you said before... shouldn't you go back to the AZ side? Something about blather?


----------



## push_up

Desert Hound said:


> So your kid hasn't done well at del Sol and you are bitter. As you said before... shouldn't you go back to the AZ side? Something about blather?


Don't be mad because you are an idiot.  Blame your parents.

You can think what you want but what I posted is the truth.  Homer.


----------



## C.A.M.

Well I just want to be able to watch my kids play and we always have to split.  I'd be ok if the teams actually posted the game films after, but my boys club hasn't since the first game and my girls club stopped 2-3 months ago.  If it is live streamed to YouTube we can either catch the game or replay it later.  I watched the Blues vs LAGSD 2003s that way on the suggestion of a friend.  It was a real competitve game.  Fun to see.


----------



## Justafan

C.A.M. said:


> View attachment 2441


Curious as to how they will determine biological age (as opposed to chronological age), anybody have a clue?


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> Well I just want to be able to watch my kids play and we always have to split.  I'd be ok if the teams actually posted the game films after, but my boys club hasn't since the first game and my girls club stopped 2-3 months ago.  If it is live streamed to YouTube we can either catch the game or replay it later.  I watched the Blues vs LAGSD 2003s that way on the suggestion of a friend.  It was a real competitve game.  Fun to see.


Can you post a link to that game.  I am curious as to what the level of play looks like.  Mine is a '98 so these are players that I would have never seen play.


----------



## Toepoke

MakeAPlay said:


> Can you post a link to that game.  I am curious as to what the level of play looks like.  Mine is a '98 so these are players that I would have never seen play.


*LAGSD GU15 Academy v So Cal Blues *is the YouTube title


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

Justafan said:


> Curious as to how they will determine biological age (as opposed to chronological age), anybody have a clue?


Biology


----------



## Justafan

Sunil Illuminati said:


> Biology


Blood tests, estrogen/ testosterone levels??


----------



## outside!

MakeAPlay said:


> Can you post a link to that game.  I am curious as to what the level of play looks like.  Mine is a '98 so these are players that I would have never seen play.


You can find future games here:
https://lagalaxysd.com/tv/
This game in particular is


----------



## MakeAPlay

outside! said:


> You can find future games here:
> https://lagalaxysd.com/tv/
> This game in particular is


i will check this game out now.  Thank you.


----------



## C.A.M.

Justafan said:


> Curious as to how they will determine biological age (as opposed to chronological age), anybody have a clue?


Not sure.  Any one have any connections down in Texas that can give us an update on this?


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> i will check this game out now.  Thank you.


#17 on Blues is a joy to watch.  I love her swag.  

Also - Blues has an outside left back who plays like Marcelo (Real Madrid).  She isn't on the  roster this game.  I believe she was with the Mexican National Team.  Their rhythm isn't the same without her.


----------



## SocalPapa

C.A.M. said:


> The Blues website someone linked showed they have DA, ECNL and SCDSL.   The DPL is falling under DA for them I believe.


Blues updated their website. Seems to confirm their participation in DPL is limited to the 03 pilot program and ECNL 03 is a separate team.


----------



## C.A.M.

SocalPapa said:


> Blues updated their website. Seems to confirm their participation in DPL is limited to the 03 pilot program and ECNL 03 is a separate team.View attachment 2449


Removed Baker from the DA program huh.  Wouldn't be surprised if that was by choice.


----------



## InTheValley

C.A.M. said:


> In defense of the people who need no defense because they will do whatever they please whenever they please.....
> 
> The age group unbanding and rebanding has been the issue for the past 3 seasons.  The system changes over the last few years have crushed the norm in the girls game.
> 
> Be forewarned - the age group changes are just temporary.   Have you seen the bio-banding initiative?  This has already started in 4 DA clubs this past weekend.  If anyone has any info on the results and reactions let us know.
> 
> https://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2018/04/05/15/45/20180405-news-us-soccer-introduces-bio-banding-initiative


I would also love to know how this went. My guess is a couple of kids played up, a couple kids played down, and US Soccer walked away with “valuable information” that will ultimately lead to nothing at all. US Soccer got the PR it wanted and can now proclaim it’s on the “cutting edge” of “soccer innovation” without having to do a single bone density scan.  If US Soccer truly wants to be “cutting edge”, though, it should start by actually reading the data from the GPS trackers they slapped on Altidore and Bradley. Then they’d know why the MNT stinks. 

In the end, no one is going to play down in competitive matches.  If you can’t get things done in your own age group by the time you’re 14 or 15, you’re just never going to be great, and being forced to swim laps in the kiddie pool certainly isn’t going to help. Rather, you’re only going to cause a riot when the other team finds out they’re getting steamrolled because their opponent is using overage players.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

outside! said:


> You can find future games here:
> https://lagalaxysd.com/tv/
> This game in particular is


----------



## Fact

InTheValley said:


> In the end, no one is going to play down in competitive matches.  If you can’t get things done in your own age group by the time you’re 14 or 15, you’re just never going to be great, and being forced to swim laps in the kiddie pool certainly isn’t going to help. Rather, you’re only going to cause a riot when the other team finds out they’re getting steamrolled because their opponent is using overage players.


Also by the age of 14-15, kids know if they are playing just for fun, i.e. the reason they started to play soccer in the first place before adult medding.  To take away the ability for them to play with their peers would be a sure fire way to get them to immediately quit.  But hay, on the positive side of them quitting, there would be more available fields (sarcasm).


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

InTheValley said:


> I would also love to know how this went. My guess is a couple of kids played up, a couple kids played down, and US Soccer walked away with “valuable information” that will ultimately lead to nothing at all. US Soccer got the PR it wanted and can now proclaim it’s on the “cutting edge” of “soccer innovation” without having to do a single bone density scan.  If US Soccer truly wants to be “cutting edge”, though, it should start by actually reading the data from the GPS trackers they slapped on Altidore and Bradley. Then they’d know why the MNT stinks.
> 
> In the end, no one is going to play down in competitive matches.  If you can’t get things done in your own age group by the time you’re 14 or 15, you’re just never going to be great, and being forced to swim laps in the kiddie pool certainly isn’t going to help. Rather, you’re only going to cause a riot when the other team finds out they’re getting steamrolled because their opponent is using overage players.


Hard to be cutting edge three years late to the dance!

https://southamptonfc.com/news/2015-08-25/saints-hosts-worlds-first-biobanded-tournament


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> #17 on Blues is a joy to watch.  I love her swag.
> 
> Also - Blues has an outside left back who plays like Marcelo (Real Madrid).  She isn't on the  roster this game.  I believe she was with the Mexican National Team.  Their rhythm isn't the same without her.


I know who Marcelo is.  Somewhere on the college thread from last season I posted a pic my player and a couple of her teammates took with him when they trained on their field last year.

Is this the mandated style of play for the GDA?  I know these are both top 5 in the standings so they are much better than average teams for this age group.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

MakeAPlay said:


> I know who Marcelo is.  Somewhere on the college thread from last season I posted a pic my player and a couple of her teammates took with him when they trained on their field last year.
> 
> Is this the mandated style of play for the GDA?  I know these are both top 5 in the standings so they are much better than average teams for this age group.


If this is the mandated style of play it is terrible. These are two top 4 teams for the strongest division in the USSDA and they never once completed 6 passes in a row. Not once. I watched the entire game, the longest streak of passes was 5. 

That said, these are all very gifted athletes. They are aggressive, fast and they could be GREAT players but they are not playing the mandated style of play. 

It is a failure of our system in the USA.

MAP you posted a clip of UCLA passing out of the back, switching fields from the back, and a few short passes later a UCLA goal about 3 months ago. These two teams could learn from that. 

What club soccer is doing to these young players is a travesty and will lead to further decline of soccer in our country. 

As other posts have said, when is enough, enough? Or DA vs ECNL. Or promotion vs relegation.  How could we get this so wrong?  

Again, I want to make this clear this is not an indictment of the kids. They are chasing their dream, and using the platforms that are available, but we have this wrong. 

We as a soccer community are wasting talent. 

Rant over.


----------



## Pitch pop

Sons of Pitches said:


> If this is the mandated style of play it is terrible. These are two top 4 teams for the strongest division in the USSDA and they never once completed 6 passes in a row. Not once. I watched the entire game, the longest streak of passes was 5.
> 
> That said, these are all very gifted athletes. They are aggressive, fast and they could be GREAT players but they are not playing the mandated style of play.
> 
> It is a failure of our system in the USA.
> 
> MAP you posted a clip of UCLA passing out of the back, switching fields from the back, and a few short passes later a UCLA goal about 3 months ago. These two teams could learn from that.
> 
> What club soccer is doing to these young players is a travesty and will lead to further decline of soccer in our country.
> 
> As other posts have said, when is enough, enough? Or DA vs ECNL. Or promotion vs relegation.  How could we get this so wrong?
> 
> Again, I want to make this clear this is not an indictment of the kids. They are chasing their dream, and using the platforms that are available, but we have this wrong.
> 
> We as a soccer community are wasting talent.
> 
> Rant over.


Amen!  Couldn’t agree more. I wish what we saw in this game was an exception to the rule but unfortunately it isn’t. We are in trouble....


----------



## SoccerFan

Sons of Pitches said:


> If this is the mandated style of play it is terrible. These are two top 4 teams for the strongest division in the USSDA and they never once completed 6 passes in a row. Not once. I watched the entire game, the longest streak of passes was 5.
> 
> That said, these are all very gifted athletes. They are aggressive, fast and they could be GREAT players but they are not playing the mandated style of play.
> 
> It is a failure of our system in the USA.
> 
> MAP you posted a clip of UCLA passing out of the back, switching fields from the back, and a few short passes later a UCLA goal about 3 months ago. These two teams could learn from that.
> 
> What club soccer is doing to these young players is a travesty and will lead to further decline of soccer in our country.
> 
> As other posts have said, when is enough, enough? Or DA vs ECNL. Or promotion vs relegation.  How could we get this so wrong?
> 
> Again, I want to make this clear this is not an indictment of the kids. They are chasing their dream, and using the platforms that are available, but we have this wrong.
> 
> We as a soccer community are wasting talent.
> 
> Rant over.


Agree 100%.


----------



## meatsweats

C.A.M. said:


> Removed Baker from the DA program huh.  Wouldn't be surprised if that was by choice.


By choice? Whose choice? Baker hasn't been to very many DA games this season. Doesn't seem very vested.


----------



## pewpew

This was my first DA-anything as far as watching any games goes. Everything up until now has been just what I've seen on paper. I must say I was disappointed. I clicked on the link thinking I was going to see some really great soccer, especially from these two teams given their records, and especially from the #1 team in the Southwest. While there were some nice moves here and there..I saw plenty of bad touches that I didn't expect to see throughout the game. As a GK dad..another observation possibly overlooked by many:
1) LAGSD 1st-half GK was the best of the two from her side. Played out of the back multiple times/quickly
2) LAGSD 2nd-half GK played out of the back ONCE if memory serves me correct.
3) Blues GK didn't play out of the back EVER. There were many opportunities but every time she got her hands on the ball she punted. Either it's not being taught/enforced/guided/insert whatever works for you here/etc.  or they just want her to send it to midfield and let the chips fall where they may. I was just expecting more possession out of the back but didn't see it. Just my .02 (Which doesn't count for much here in DA forum)


----------



## jose

pewpew said:


> This was my first DA-anything as far as watching any games goes. Everything up until now has been just what I've seen on paper. I must say I was disappointed. I clicked on the link thinking I was going to see some really great soccer, especially from these two teams given their records, and especially from the #1 team in the Southwest. While there were some nice moves here and there..I saw plenty of bad touches that I didn't expect to see throughout the game. As a GK dad..another observation possibly overlooked by many:
> 1) LAGSD 1st-half GK was the best of the two from her side. Played out of the back multiple times/quickly
> 2) LAGSD 2nd-half GK played out of the back ONCE if memory serves me correct.
> 3) Blues GK didn't play out of the back EVER. There were many opportunities but every time she got her hands on the ball she punted. Either it's not being taught/enforced/guided/insert whatever works for you here/etc.  or they just want her to send it to midfield and let the chips fall where they may. I was just expecting more possession out of the back but didn't see it. Just my .02 (Which doesn't count for much here in DA forum)


Im not a huge soccer guy so I don't really know what to watch tactically.  I was there just watching and thought the same thing.  LAGSD looked much more like playing with a plan the other was horrible.....my  2 pesos


----------



## Hired Gun

jose said:


> Im not a huge soccer guy so I don't really know what to watch tactically.  I was there just watching and thought the same thing.  LAGSD looked much more like playing with a plan the other was horrible.....my  2 pesos


what age?


----------



## MWN

Some things to consider when watching the game:

Both teams played aggressive defensively, marking well and leaving little space.  It was easier to do this because of No. 2.
The game was on a very small, fast field.  The Army-Navy Stadium in Carlsbad is only 63x115 yards wide (15% narrower than a typical field).  Games at this level should be 75 yards wide x 115 yards.  Stripping off the extra width made defending 15% easier and finding space 15% harder.  It also renders a possession style much harder because the space is rarely to the sides, its forward and backward.
This field played fast (I think the turf is a little worn-in) so the ball rarely died and often ran past the passee.
Possession soccer against two defensively aggressive teams that mark well will rarely be successful, especially on a small, fast field.

The Blues keeper has a weak leg and did not take all of her own goalkicks, which makes playing out of the back even more difficult because you have 1 fewer option.  I suspect this weakness transcends other elements of her game, thus, her teammates don't trust her.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

pewpew said:


> This was my first DA-anything as far as watching any games goes. Everything up until now has been just what I've seen on paper. I must say I was disappointed. I clicked on the link thinking I was going to see some really great soccer, especially from these two teams given their records, and especially from the #1 team in the Southwest. While there were some nice moves here and there..I saw plenty of bad touches that I didn't expect to see throughout the game. As a GK dad..another observation possibly overlooked by many:
> 1) LAGSD 1st-half GK was the best of the two from her side. Played out of the back multiple times/quickly
> 2) LAGSD 2nd-half GK played out of the back ONCE if memory serves me correct.
> 3) Blues GK didn't play out of the back EVER. There were many opportunities but every time she got her hands on the ball she punted. Either it's not being taught/enforced/guided/insert whatever works for you here/etc.  or they just want her to send it to midfield and let the chips fall where they may. I was just expecting more possession out of the back but didn't see it. Just my .02 (Which doesn't count for much here in DA forum)


How common is it to have someone take goal kicks for the goalie? Seems odd at this level.


----------



## MWN

Sheriff Joe said:


> How common is it to have someone take goal kicks for the goalie? Seems odd at this level.


At the Flight 2 / Silver+ level, a 14 year old GK should be taking all of their own goalkicks.  I can understand it maybe she is injured, but the average 14 year old at the DA level should be as good with her feet as any defender.


----------



## outside!

MWN said:


> Some things to consider when watching the game:
> 
> Both teams played aggressive defensively, marking well and leaving little space.  It was easier to do this because of No. 2.
> The game was on a very small, fast field.  The Army-Navy Stadium in Carlsbad is only 63x115 yards wide (15% narrower than a typical field).  Games at this level should be 75 yards wide x 115 yards.  Stripping off the extra width made defending 15% easier and finding space 15% harder.  It also renders a possession style much harder because the space is rarely to the sides, its forward and backward.
> This field played fast (I think the turf is a little worn-in) so the ball rarely died and often ran past the passee.
> Possession soccer against two defensively aggressive teams that mark well will rarely be successful, especially on a small, fast field.


Small soccer fields are another negative consequence of old football guys being the people making decisions. Every time I have seen Blues play it has always been a rather direct style of play with high pressure defence.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Sons of Pitches said:


> If this is the mandated style of play it is terrible. These are two top 4 teams for the strongest division in the USSDA and they never once completed 6 passes in a row. Not once. I watched the entire game, the longest streak of passes was 5.
> 
> That said, these are all very gifted athletes. They are aggressive, fast and they could be GREAT players but they are not playing the mandated style of play.
> 
> It is a failure of our system in the USA.
> 
> MAP you posted a clip of UCLA passing out of the back, switching fields from the back, and a few short passes later a UCLA goal about 3 months ago. These two teams could learn from that.
> 
> What club soccer is doing to these young players is a travesty and will lead to further decline of soccer in our country.
> 
> As other posts have said, when is enough, enough? Or DA vs ECNL. Or promotion vs relegation.  How could we get this so wrong?
> 
> Again, I want to make this clear this is not an indictment of the kids. They are chasing their dream, and using the platforms that are available, but we have this wrong.
> 
> We as a soccer community are wasting talent.
> 
> Rant over.


You need to watch more games. Although there is a directive on style of play, every Club has their own interpretation of that style. These 2 aclu s never have been much for pure possession.  They have always been aggressive in terms of play and method of moving the ball up field.


----------



## Surfref

Sheriff Joe said:


> How common is it to have someone take goal kicks for the goalie? Seems odd at this level.


By U14 keepers at the SCDSL Tier 1 and above levels should be taking their own goal kicks and playing out of the back. A keeper at ECNL or DA level that cannot take their own goal kicks or play out of the back is handicapping the team. This will be a huge turnoff for college scouts considering the large number of quality keepers that can take their own kicks and play out of the back.


----------



## chiefs

Kicker4Life said:


> You need to watch more games. Although there is a directive on style of play, every Club has their own interpretation of that style. These 2 aclu s never have been much for pure possession.  They have always been aggressive in terms of play and method of moving the ball up field.


At the 03 DA age group for the SW division, all the teams have different styles and matchups each and every week.  The Girls just need to be ready to play whatever style is thrown their way. Wins and Loss records dont reflect style of play. While Blues and LAGSD play direct and extremely physical, West Coast and Beach play out of the back, and for the most part dominate possession, spacing and shots per game.  You should look up videos on these two teams and im sure your opinion would change.


----------



## Dubs

From what I watched, it looked like a college soccer game excluding teams like Stanford and UCLA that are able to execute possession.


----------



## C.A.M.

meatsweats said:


> By choice? Whose choice? Baker hasn't been to very many DA games this season. Doesn't seem very vested.


His choice.


----------



## timbuck

outside! said:


> You can find future games here:
> https://lagalaxysd.com/tv/
> This game in particular is


I only watched the first 20 minutes.
Definitely fast and physical teams with very good skill.  Tactically, LAGSD seemed to be patient and move the ball around pretty good.
Blues looked good, but seemed to be looking for the homerun ball.  Or when in trouble in the back - kick it far or kick it out.

I noticed there were a ton of throw-ins during that 20 minutes. Not uncommon, especially if the field is narrow (as stated above).  Every single throw in went forward into a scrum of players.  I didn't see anything that was thrown back.  And I didn't see any attempt to play the ball back to the thrower.  There are some good tactical advantages to have set patterns on throw-ins.  If you only have 2 practices a week with a technically poor team - probably not something to spend a ton of time in during practice.  But at this level, even dedicating 30 minutes a month would have an impact.

And  pet peeve of mine for all video companies -  Why not pan out and show the entire field?  The objective for a team to record a game should be to look at off the ball movement during the run of play.  Stop zooming in on the 1v1 play in the corner.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

MWN said:


> Some things to consider when watching the game:
> 
> Both teams played aggressive defensively, marking well and leaving little space.  It was easier to do this because of No. 2.
> The game was on a very small, fast field.  The Army-Navy Stadium in Carlsbad is only 63x115 yards wide (15% narrower than a typical field).  Games at this level should be 75 yards wide x 115 yards.  Stripping off the extra width made defending 15% easier and finding space 15% harder.  It also renders a possession style much harder because the space is rarely to the sides, its forward and backward.
> This field played fast (I think the turf is a little worn-in) so the ball rarely died and often ran past the passee.
> Possession soccer against two defensively aggressive teams that mark well will rarely be successful, especially on a small, fast field.
> 
> The Blues keeper has a weak leg and did not take all of her own goalkicks, which makes playing out of the back even more difficult because you have 1 fewer option.  I suspect this weakness transcends other elements of her game, thus, her teammates don't trust her.


Isn’t this LAGSD HOME FIELD?  I don’t think you can blame the fast turf for their inability to connect passes. 

Reagarding your next statement of possession soccer vs small fast field. It rarely works if you want to win at this age would be a more accurate statement. I think there  are plenty of professional teams that would welcome the high press that you see by both clubs and be more than willing to pass out of it.  The win at all cost mentality vs development argument. 

Finally, if  the players  on the field were taught to shield the ball as they dribbled or turn away from pressure while protecting the ball and cross. There was space on the opposite wings.


----------



## Real Deal

Kicker4Life said:


> You need to watch more games. Although there is a directive on style of play, every Club has their own interpretation of that style. These 2 aclu s never have been much for pure possession.  They have always been aggressive in terms of play and method of moving the ball up field.


Yet these two teams account for 3 of the girls called up to the U15 YNT national camp, so they must be doing something that is being sought after.


----------



## outside!

Sons of Pitches said:


> Isn’t this LAGSD HOME FIELD?  I don’t think you can blame the fast turf for their inability to connect passes.


Only for games. They practice at Poinsettia which got new turf within the past couple of years.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I know who Marcelo is.  Somewhere on the college thread from last season I posted a pic my player and a couple of her teammates took with him when they trained on their field last year.
> 
> Is this the mandated style of play for the GDA?  I know these are both top 5 in the standings so they are much better than average teams for this age group.


_On the girls side, if you want to see the mandated style of play you are best going to the US Soccer DA website and watching the LAFC Slammers 01/02 vs Sky Blue PDA 01/02._*  The games aren't supposed to be just the style and devoid of creativity.*

The Marcelo explanation wasn't really for you MAP.  It was for others that might not know. 

I'll point out only the teams *I feel* play the Mandated DA style well.

1.  *Beach. * Best at it.  Ball is on the ground and everyone touches it.  They attack the defenses weak spots and the player movement was second to none.  It shows as they have multiple girls with multiple goal scoring games and the shots come from the wings, crosses, through balls, give and gos, over the top and on and on.  Takes a move athletic team to stymie them and there are a few more athletic teams in the division.  Far ahead in executing the concepts. 
2. *LA Galaxy.*  Lacking that killer striker like Legends, Surf, LAG SD to really make you pay for their creativity.  They will result to long ball when under pressure defensively.  
3.  *Surf West Coast* - They spread you out.  It is different watching them as they often don't seem interested in attacking as long as they keep possession.  They have no problem trying to beat you 1 zip.
4. *SC Del Sol* - I was surprised to see the ball movement and shape.  Especially with more advanced athletes.  They can physically play with anyone in the league and the ball movement is good also.  
5. *Legends *with a lead*  -  They become a completely different team when they get one on the board before the opposition.  They really settle down and stop being as direct.  Unlike many of the other teams they can actually be successful playing direct and with ball movement because of the athletes they have.  They have one of their top attacking mids back and that will give them rhythm and life, but their best CB moving up to 01/02 has dampened their creativity a bit.  She early committed to Cal for a reason.  

The rest have catching up to do when it comes to playing the style.  

Blues is the most direct team I have seen or we have faced including the showcases.  Their goal tally shows that.  It's basically the young lady version of Liverpool right now. They are just a different team without their left back who is their true creator.  I'm actually ashamed she isn't on the US YNT.


----------



## C.A.M.

Real Deal said:


> Yet these two teams account for 3 of the girls called up to the U15 YNT national camp, *so they must be doing something that is being sought after*.


Scoring goals in bunches.  There is a reason the stats don't show assists (which is total crap).  They care about scoring.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sons of Pitches said:


> If this is the mandated style of play it is terrible. These are two top 4 teams for the strongest division in the USSDA and they never once completed 6 passes in a row. Not once. I watched the entire game, the longest streak of passes was 5.
> 
> That said, these are all very gifted athletes. They are aggressive, fast and they could be GREAT players but they are not playing the mandated style of play.
> 
> It is a failure of our system in the USA.
> 
> MAP you posted a clip of UCLA passing out of the back, switching fields from the back, and a few short passes later a UCLA goal about 3 months ago. These two teams could learn from that.
> 
> What club soccer is doing to these young players is a travesty and will lead to further decline of soccer in our country.
> 
> As other posts have said, when is enough, enough? Or DA vs ECNL. Or promotion vs relegation.  How could we get this so wrong?
> 
> Again, I want to make this clear this is not an indictment of the kids. They are chasing their dream, and using the platforms that are available, but we have this wrong.
> 
> We as a soccer community are wasting talent.
> 
> Rant over.



I'm glad that you said it and not me.  I would have been villainized for it....  I thought that it was weird to have a GK at U15 not take their own kicks and I can't remember seeing one ATTEMPT of passing out of the back by a GK off of a goal kick.  I agree that their are some individually talented players but I can say with 100% confidence that not one player in that game is ready to play sophisticated possession.  It needs to be taught at the club level or nothing will change.


----------



## C.A.M.

outside! said:


> Only for games. They practice at Poinsettia which got new turf within the past couple of years.



I'm with pitches.  They simply don't connect and you can't blame the field when the ball is in the air all the time. It's why they lost to us and I'm not bragging.  

Heck, it's why we don't win a lot more.  We could be .500 if we connected.


----------



## Pitch pop

chiefs said:


> At the 03 DA age group for the SW division, all the teams have different styles and matchups each and every week.  The Girls just need to be ready to play whatever style is thrown their way. Wins and Loss records dont reflect style of play. While Blues and LAGSD play direct and extremely physical, West Coast and Beach play out of the back, and for the most part dominate possession, spacing and shots per game.  You should look up videos on these two teams and im sure your opinion would change.


I think this is kind of the point. There shouldn’t be the vast difference in styles.  One of the big goals of the DA was to begin to develop youth players under one system and curriculum put forth by the USSA. What we are seeing is just more of the same with a different patch on the players uniform. Some teams do try and play a good brand of soccer at times sacrificing results for development and some play to win regardless of what that style looks like.  This was true before DA was around and from what I’ve seen it hasn’t improved. With the dilution of talent and the higher level more technical players spread over more teams, I would argue that it has gotten worse. It’s hard to play good soccer when half the team doesn’t yet possess the technical ability to facilitate that play. 


To be fair to the “direct style” of play, what I saw on the video wasn’t that. The direct style of play isn’t a panic under pressure and kick the ball in the general vacinity of a teammate and hope they can out muscle the opponent off a 50/50 ball. The direct style of play is a style that is used throughout the world. It’s a style that can flip a field and shred a back line with a series of 3-4 surgically placed passes. This style requires not only athleticism but a very high level of technical skills. It gets a bad name here in the states because it is often associated with kickball. The two couldn’t be anymore different.


----------



## MWN

Sons of Pitches said:


> Isn’t this LAGSD HOME FIELD?  I don’t think you can blame the fast turf for their inability to connect passes.
> 
> Reagarding your next statement of possession soccer vs small fast field. It rarely works if you want to win at this age would be a more accurate statement. I think there  are plenty of professional teams that would welcome the high press that you see by both clubs and be more than willing to pass out of it.  The win at all cost mentality vs development argument.
> 
> Finally, if  the players  on the field were taught to shield the ball as they dribbled or turn away from pressure while protecting the ball and cross. There was space on the opposite wings.


If this is the LAGSD home field, that's unfortunate and hopefully they don't use this for any groups older than U15.  But I don't know, I just know my son's U16 team played on this field last summer.  Nice stadium/stands, but small fast field that is definitely not appropriate for boys or girls playing at a level higher than Flight 3/Bronze.


----------



## C.A.M.

Sons of Pitches said:


> If this is the mandated style of play it is terrible. These are two top 4 teams for the strongest division in the USSDA and they never once completed 6 passes in a row. Not once. I watched the entire game, the longest streak of passes was 5.
> 
> That said, these are all very gifted athletes. They are aggressive, fast and they could be GREAT players but they are not playing the mandated style of play.
> 
> It is a failure of our system in the USA.
> 
> MAP you posted a clip of UCLA passing out of the back, switching fields from the back, and a few short passes later a UCLA goal about 3 months ago. These two teams could learn from that.
> 
> What club soccer is doing to these young players is a travesty and will lead to further decline of soccer in our country.
> 
> As other posts have said, when is enough, enough? Or DA vs ECNL. Or promotion vs relegation.  How could we get this so wrong?
> 
> Again, I want to make this clear this is not an indictment of the kids. They are chasing their dream, and using the platforms that are available, but we have this wrong.
> 
> We as a soccer community are wasting talent.
> 
> Rant over.



I agree and can happily say this is not the only style.  Notice my original post on watching the game the adjective I used was competitive. 

We have some teams playing really nice, complex and beautiful soccer.  Too bad LAGSD hasn't played Beach at home yet.  I didn't look for West Coast on the list.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Real Deal said:


> Yet these two teams account for 3 of the girls called up to the U15 YNT national camp, so they must be doing something that is being sought after.


Call ups at U15 mean little....  If they don't keep evolving they won't be there much longer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> I'm with pitches.  They simply don't connect and you can't blame the field when the ball is in the air all the time. It's why they lost to us and I'm not bragging.
> 
> Heck, it's why we don't win a lot more.  We could be .500 if we connected.


I agree.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

C.A.M. said:


> I agree and can happily say this is not the only style.  Notice my original post on watching the game the adjective I used was competitive.
> 
> We have some teams playing really nice, complex and beautiful soccer.  Too bad LAGSD hasn't played Beach at home yet.  I didn't look for West Coast on the list.


They have. It is on YouTube. And beach does pass and connect more. It is more pleasing to watch and more in line with a he mandated style.


----------



## MakeAPlay

MWN said:


> Some things to consider when watching the game:
> 
> Both teams played aggressive defensively, marking well and leaving little space.  It was easier to do this because of No. 2.
> The game was on a very small, fast field.  The Army-Navy Stadium in Carlsbad is only 63x115 yards wide (15% narrower than a typical field).  Games at this level should be 75 yards wide x 115 yards.  Stripping off the extra width made defending 15% easier and finding space 15% harder.  It also renders a possession style much harder because the space is rarely to the sides, its forward and backward.
> This field played fast (I think the turf is a little worn-in) so the ball rarely died and often ran past the passee.
> Possession soccer against two defensively aggressive teams that mark well will rarely be successful, especially on a small, fast field.
> 
> The Blues keeper has a weak leg and did not take all of her own goalkicks, which makes playing out of the back even more difficult because you have 1 fewer option.  I suspect this weakness transcends other elements of her game, thus, her teammates don't trust her.


My player's team can play possession on any sized field.  My player's club team never finished higher than 4th place in their division in ECNL and they coach emphasized style of play over anything else.  Her coach could have put my player and one other girl at UDub up top and played direct to them all game in order to win.  Instead, my player played defense, her best position, and the group learned how to play a more sophisticated game.  They lost some games that they could have won but at the end of the day it turned out to be the best move for the individuals on the team.  Had it not been for this coach and his emphasis on learning to play the game the right way, my player would never have fit in so seamlessly with a top 10 team as a freshman.  If the coaches at Beach can teach it why can't everyone?

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Sons of Pitches said:


> They have. It is on YouTube. And beach does pass and connect more. It is more pleasing to watch and more in line with a he mandated style.



Please post a link.  I know that the coaches at Beach do a good job with style of play.


----------



## MakeAPlay

I was very disappointed after watching the game.  Not at the players.  I was upset at the coaches and parents.  The coaches for teaching the teams to play advanced kickball and the parents for cheering for it and writing the checks.  I would never have let my player play for either of those teams for more than one season and if it was the Blues it would have been a mid-season move.  There were enough talented players to at least attempt to pass out of the back.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> I think this is kind of the point. There shouldn’t be the vast difference in styles.  One of the big goals of the DA was to begin to develop youth players under one system and curriculum put forth by the USSA. What we are seeing is just more of the same with a different patch on the players uniform.


Actually the DA guidelines allows for different styles.   What they want is the techniques used no matter what style you use and they have 2 or 3 formations you have to play out of once you are U15.

So they want to see players making different runs, keepers playing out the back, creativity on the ball and with the passes and teams keeping shape no matter what formation and style you play.  They don't encourage the direct style of play, but want goals to scored and clearly are rewarding the players who put the ball past the goal line.


----------



## Sons of Pitches

Real Deal said:


> Yet these two teams account for 3 of the girls called up to the U15 YNT national camp, so they must be doing something that is being sought after.


I am not trashing the kids. Be very clear about that. These are talented, gifted young ladies that work hard and make sacrifices.  I just


MakeAPlay said:


> Please post a link.  I know that the coaches at Beach do a good job with style of play.


oops sorry. It was Surf not beach. It was still more pleasing.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> Actually the DA guidelines allows for different styles.   What they want is the techniques used no matter what style you use and they have 2 or 3 formations you have to play out of once you are U15.
> 
> So they want to see players making different runs, keepers playing out the back, creativity on the ball and with the passes and teams keeping shape no matter what formation and style you play.  They don't encourage the direct style of play, but want goals to scored and clearly are rewarding the players who put the ball past the goal line.


None of which was present in this game.


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I was very disappointed after watching the game.  Not at the players.  I was upset at the coaches and parents.  The coaches for teaching the teams to play advanced kickball and the parents for cheering for it and writing the checks.  I would never have let my player play for either of those teams for more than one season and if it was the Blues it would have been a mid-season move.  There were enough talented players to at least attempt to pass out of the back.



THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!
THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!
THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!

My anger is sooooooooo high at watching some of these girls team play that I am a perpetual grouch.  It freaking drives me crazy!!!!!  Parents in the stands telling their girls "Great Pass" for creating 50/50 balls from long balls instead of just passing to the open girl 15 yards from them or for taking a shot when double teamed instead of making the simple pass to a runner who is wide open on an empty net or passing the buck to other players when they don't go get the ball back when they lose it, etc...  Let's not get to the "yeah girls" that come when a player does all these unnecessary skills and the defender just takes the ball off her feet or the pass is 7 yards behind the intended player.  

Then coaches emphasizing it's the thing to do by granting these players more game time like WTF????  My head is going to explode.   

What makes it worse is comparing these games to our boys U11/12 DA combo team and their competition as they execute these principles at a efficiency level that is 200% higher than what we are seeing on the girls side.  IN FACT, they haven't played *one team all season that played kick ball or ultra direct*.  Not one.  Even the ones we beat down 12, 13, 14 to very little. One team had their keeper punting the first time we played them and the next time the team just suffered through the mistakes all our keepers make when learning to play out the back.  

If we can get the girls to play half as good as the younger boys are, we will all be in a better place and I hope the DA system can get that done.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> None of which was present in this game.


agreed


----------



## C.A.M.

Sheriff Joe said:


> How common is it to have someone take goal kicks for the goalie? Seems odd at this level.


Only one I've seen at this level and this includes the U14s.


----------



## outside!

Pitch pop said:


> None of which was present in this game.


What about the older games from the same two clubs?


----------



## GoWest

Has anyone heard anything about a "coming huge DA exodus".....? Not being cryptic but is there any traction to this rumbling?


----------



## SoccerFan

jose said:


> Im not a huge soccer guy so I don't really know what to watch tactically.  I was there just watching and thought the same thing.  LAGSD looked much more like playing with a plan the other was horrible.....my  2 pesos


My DD’s team faced the same issue last weekend! The other DA team “athletes” changed their style and started to play kick ball. Could this have been encouraged at half?   Maybe, because at half they were loosing 2-0 and for the entire 2nd half their coach did not stop shouting at them. It appeared that the win at no cost mentality ruled for this game.


----------



## Sheriff Joe

SoccerFan said:


> My DD’s team faced the same issue last weekend! The other DA team “athletes” changed their style and started to play kick ball. Could this have been encouraged at half?   Maybe, because at half they were loosing 2-0 and for the entire 2nd half their coach did not stop shouting at them. It appeared that the win at no cost mentality ruled for this game.


I think Al Davis said it best,.................


----------



## Pitch pop

GoWest said:


> Has anyone heard anything about a "coming huge DA exodus".....? Not being cryptic but is there any traction to this rumbling?


Do tell.......


----------



## Sons of Pitches

Pitch pop said:


> Do tell.......


I have heard that the Eagles tryouts have been crowded with Real Socal players as players were following a coach from one club to another. But I have not heard of a mass exodus from the DA as a whole.


----------



## timbuck

GoWest said:


> Has anyone heard anything about a "coming huge DA exodus".....? Not being cryptic but is there any traction to this rumbling?


I have heard that parents feel that 4 days a week is crushing their kids.
I have heard some incoming g05 DA players/parents say "We want to play High School.  So since these girls will be in 8th/7th grade next year, this is a year for us to try it."  I'm sure some 04 players felt similar last year or are thinking more about it now that the season is coming to a close.


----------



## El Clasico

C.A.M. said:


> If we can get the girls to play half as good as the younger boys are, we will all be in a better place and I hope the DA system can get that done.


That's a lot faith in a system that has yet to get it done in ten years of trying...


----------



## GoWest

Pitch pop said:


> Do tell.......


Rumblings include 15-25 current DA clubs on the fence about leaving. Is there that much discontent with the upstart league? Things must be pretty tangled for major clubs like Hawks, Mass and PDA to simply pull the plug.


timbuck said:


> I have heard that parents feel that 4 days a week is crushing their kids.
> I have heard some incoming g05 DA players/parents say "We want to play High School.  So since these girls will be in 8th/7th grade next year, this is a year for us to try it."  I'm sure some 04 players felt similar last year or are thinking more about it now that the season is coming to a close.


Well, parents do have a say. That may be feeding the discontent?


----------



## GoWest

@davin posted this link on the ECNL thread. Good read. Thanks davin.

http://highschoolsports.nj.com/news/article/7266435192685118215/nj-based-sky-blue-pda-girls-soccer-leaving-us-girls-development-academy/


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Sons of Pitches said:


> I have heard that the Eagles tryouts have been crowded with Real Socal players as players were following a coach from one club to another. But I have not heard of a mass exodus from the DA as a whole.


I have heard the same mostly for the 02 age.


----------



## C.A.M.

El Clasico said:


> That's a lot faith in a system that has yet to get it done in ten years of trying...


I'm not sure where people are getting that the boys aren't better players coming through the DA. If this comes from the US National team that losts, they weren't Academy players.  Take a look at the players who are U20 and below and see how these young men are starting to be invited to big European teams.  We perform well in the international tournaments at the U23 and below.  It's the top team we have suffered at and nearly every player that was on the squad that bowed out was a seasoned professional.

When our younger national teams and DA teams play, it doesn't look very different than what you are seeing in Europe or South America.  People were complaining about us looking a very tight game to the younger England team and then England went and won the tourney by a much bigger margin versus a "more established" European foe in the finals.  

I like the way Tad Ramos said it, paraphrasing here... "No MLS club wants to give our  18 year old young men a chance even when they are captain of our US Youth Team Squads and Player of the Tournament, but will DP a 18 year old from South America in a minute.".  Well these young men that we are ignoring and devauling are being noticed across the pond by the best soccer countries in the world.  

And for those doing the comparing.... Our neighbors to the immediate South have a development and club system that has been in place much longer than ours.  Also, their pro league is valued higher than ours for competition level.  They have players that have been going to Europe and playing top tier longer than we have been.  Still, they haven't went any further than we have in the World Cup.  And they were a game a way from not qualifying for the World Cup itself and wouldn't have gotten there without a win from our team.

Now look at the countries that are not in the World Cup and their soccer tradition compared to ours.  All this to say.  This ish ain't easy and there is no magic formula.


----------



## El Clasico

C.A.M. said:


> I'm not sure where people are getting that the boys aren't better players coming through the DA. If this comes from the US National team that losts, they weren't Academy players.  Take a look at the players who are U20 and below and see how these young men are starting to be invited to big European teams.  We perform well in the international tournaments at the U23 and below.  It's the top team we have suffered at and nearly every player that was on the squad that bowed out was a seasoned professional.
> 
> When our younger national teams and DA teams play, it doesn't look very different than what you are seeing in Europe or South America.  People were complaining about us looking a very tight game to the younger England team and then England went and won the tourney by a much bigger margin versus a "more established" European foe in the finals.
> 
> I like the way Tad Ramos said it, paraphrasing here... "No MLS club wants to give our  18 year old young men a chance even when they are captain of our US Youth Team Squads and Player of the Tournament, but will DP a 18 year old from South America in a minute.".  Well these young men that we are ignoring and devauling are being noticed across the pond by the best soccer countries in the world.
> 
> And for those doing the comparing.... Our neighbors to the immediate South have a development and club system that has been in place much longer than ours.  Also, their pro league is valued higher than ours for competition level.  They have players that have been going to Europe and playing top tier longer than we have been.  Still, they haven't went any further than we have in the World Cup.  And they were a game a way from not qualifying for the World Cup itself and wouldn't have gotten there without a win from our team.
> 
> Now look at the countries that are not in the World Cup and their soccer tradition compared to ours.  All this to say.  This ish ain't easy and there is no magic formula.


This response helps understand the biggest problem we have here in the US.  That here in the US, first you have to figure out what the problem is and you clearly don't. You can't fix something if don't know where it is broke. The problem in the states is not the "athlete" but the people developing them and the people selecting them.  Of course we have talent that is wanted "across the pond" because they see some of our athletes, the ones who also happen to be soccer players, and say, "we should go get that guy, he has potential and, unlike the Americans, we know what to do with him and how to develop that potential. As pathetic as the MLS is, to blame them for the lack of development in our youth is comical.

Not to be taken as a dig on you but you would have to go south and across the pond and spend as much time in their system as you have in ours to see the difference...which you clearly have not done.

Bottom line...you don't know what you don't know.


----------



## splinter

timbuck said:


> I have heard that parents feel that 4 days a week is crushing their kids.
> I have heard some incoming g05 DA players/parents say "We want to play High School.  So since these girls will be in 8th/7th grade next year, this is a year for us to try it."  I'm sure some 04 players felt similar last year or are thinking more about it now that the season is coming to a close.


I have two 04’s in DA and we have decided to move them for next year so they can play multiple sports in high school.  We will do Freshman year this way and if they decide soccer is all they want we will look to come back to DA the following year.  It is tough giving up 4 hours a night between the drive and practice that many nights a week when we have a top non DA team practicing 2 minutes from our house.


----------



## push_up

El Clasico said:


> Bottom line...you don't know what you don't know.


I think your post is the nicest bitch-slap I have read in a few years.


----------



## timmyh

GoWest said:


> @davin posted this link on the ECNL thread. Good read. Thanks davin.
> 
> http://highschoolsports.nj.com/news/article/7266435192685118215/nj-based-sky-blue-pda-girls-soccer-leaving-us-girls-development-academy/


Something I have yet to see brought up yet is that it may not be a coincidence that the 3 "big" clubs who are leaving the DA for ECNL (PDA, Hawks, and PDA) all list their club leader as an ECNL board member. 
It could be interpreted that the DA defections are likely as much about politics as it is about soccer (echoing the Dallas Sting debacle last year, when another club with an ECNL board member agreed to forego DA in return for being given a 2nd ECNL spot for their ill-prepared Austin franchise).


----------



## jose

meatsweats said:


> By choice? Whose choice? Baker hasn't been to very many DA games this season. Doesn't seem very vested.





Hired Gun said:


> what age?


'04


----------



## C.A.M.

El Clasico said:


> This response helps understand the biggest problem we have here in the US.  That here in the US, first you have to figure out what the problem is and you clearly don't. You can't fix something if don't know where it is broke. The problem in the states is not the "athlete" but the people developing them and the people selecting them.  Of course we have talent that is wanted "across the pond" because they see some of our athletes, the ones who also happen to be soccer players, and say, "we should go get that guy, he has potential and, unlike the Americans, we know what to do with him and how to develop that potential. As pathetic as the MLS is, to blame them for the lack of development in our youth is comical.
> 
> Not to be taken as a dig on you but you would have to go south and across the pond and spend as much time in their system as you have in ours to see the difference...which you clearly have not done.
> 
> Bottom line...you don't know what you don't know.


We are going to clear up something - you don't know where I've been and what I've done so keep those opinions to yourself.  

Also - this discussion saying we are behind the world - is strictly on the men's side *as our Women have dominated world soccer for decades* and we can continue to do so as the game grows if we don't sit on our laurels and truly develop these young girls instead of just throwing them out to win and not learn.

Thing is we have people wanting to instill the culture of these other places into the game HERE.  *It's not going to work*.  Nothing is wrong with these other cultures, so it isn't a slight and I understand wanting to take what is successful around the globe and implementing it here to get things going down the right path.  Bringing the greatest coaches from around the world to set the baseline of technique and tactics is fine (my boys club does just that), *but they can't bring the culture.*  If you really analyze what makes the game special in other places in the world, it's the culture of the game that each country has.  The DNA for each and every country that sets them apart from it's neighbor and competitors.

If you have truly traveled the world you know one thing, Americans do things our way even if it is stupid and ass backwards.  You also know that somehow we make that crap work for us because we are a strange bunch of people. What we need to do is create the AMERICAN identity of soccer.   Take what everyone else does, keep what works for us and toss the rest.  *Just like the US Women did from day one. * Until we make the game ours and mold our play to our ideals, designs, athletes, coaches, lifestyles and thinking processes we will remain a 2nd tier team because it will be unnatural.  Stop trying to have us be European or South American.  We're not them. We don't think the same.  Embrace who we are and mold the game to us and we will flourish. 

It's OK to be in the quarter finals of the World Cup or miss it once in a while.  This is part of the growing pains.  This is the journey to greatness and it's not going to happen right away.  Like all the great coaches in soccer say, "We must suffer to win!".


----------



## C.A.M.

push_up said:


> I think your post is the nicest bitch-slap I have read in a few years.


Don't jump in with instigating statements please. Add to the conversation or step out of it.


----------



## C.A.M.

timbuck said:


> I have heard that parents feel that 4 days a week is crushing their kids.
> I have heard some incoming g05 DA players/parents say "We want to play High School.  So since these girls will be in 8th/7th grade next year, this is a year for us to try it."  I'm sure some 04 players felt similar last year or are thinking more about it now that the season is coming to a close.



For any of those parents that have had their kids playing high level soccer in So Cal, I call bull.  What's the difference with the 4th day when little Jane or Tommy were already doing an extra day of skills privates and athletic improvement?  Nada.

I'll even counter and say if the 4th day is a true film day (which it isn't for a lot of clubs right now), it's an improvement because watching the game (you and the best in the world) is a vital part of learning the game.


----------



## C.A.M.

El Clasico said:


> This response helps understand the biggest problem we have here in the US.  That here in the US, first you have to figure out what the problem is and you clearly don't. You can't fix something if don't know where it is broke.


We aren't broke. We are soccer youth.  We are young teenagers playing the game vs the grown ups.  We aren't suppose to be the best in the world.  Our growth has to come from within through mistakes and successes alike.  We are a DEVELOPING FUTBOL COUNTRY.  

We are the 4th sport in our own country.  4th sport. 4th sport. 4th sport.  

And we still get the same results as most of the other grown up countries around the world.  When the game takes hold here and we get crazy for it like the rest of the world we will take off and not look back. The game is great, we just don't love it enough yet to get the results that people would like to see.  It will happen.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

If four days a week of practice is too much for your kid, don't play DA.  If they want to play HS, don't play DA.  DA is not for everyone but does work well for those that don't want to play HS and are serious about soccer.  The nice thing is that there are choices out there.   So start with understanding what is important to your kid and then find the level of play and league that works for them.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> For any of those parents that have had their kids playing high level soccer in So Cal, I call bull.  What's the difference with the 4th day when little Jane or Tommy were already doing an extra day of skills privates and athletic improvement?  Nada.
> 
> I'll even counter and say if the 4th day is a true film day (which it isn't for a lot of clubs right now), it's an improvement because watching the game (you and the best in the world) is a vital part of learning the game.


I disagree.  If a kid is an academic star in challenging classes, is in student government, plays other sports and/or has a social life than it is way too much.  During the college season they have essentially 2 practice days a week and 2 walkthrough/film days.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> If four days a week of practice is too much for your kid, don't play DA.  If they want to play HS, don't play DA.  DA is not for everyone but does work well for those that don't want to play HS and are serious about soccer.  The nice thing is that there are choices out there.   So start with understanding what is important to your kid and then find the level of play and league that works for them.


Most girls regret not playing high school.  Almost all of the WNT played high school soccer including the 2 players that didn't play college soccer.


----------



## MakeAPlay

C.A.M. said:


> We aren't broke. We are soccer youth.  We are young teenagers playing the game vs the grown ups.  We aren't suppose to be the best in the world.  Our growth has to come from within through mistakes and successes alike.  We are a DEVELOPING FUTBOL COUNTRY.
> 
> We are the 4th sport in our own country.  4th sport. 4th sport. 4th sport.
> 
> And we still get the same results as most of the other grown up countries around the world.  When the game takes hold here and we get crazy for it like the rest of the world we will take off and not look back. The game is great, we just don't love it enough yet to get the results that people would like to see.  It will happen.


I disagree.  Soccer is not new in America and next to football is the highest youth participation sport.  We are broke and it's has more to do with Capitalism and our economic/political culture than our sports culture.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

MakeAPlay said:


> Most girls regret not playing high school.  Almost all of the WNT played high school soccer including the 2 players that didn't play college soccer.


I don't agree with your comment that most girls regret not playing HS.  Your kid is in college along with her peers.  DA did not exist when they were in HS so playing HS was the norm.  So unless you have another kid currently playing HS I think times have changed and you may not have the current perspective.  From a parent perspective I loved HS.  Friday night games with packed stands.  Newspaper articles.  It feeds a parent's ego.  From my dd perspective she was extremely frustrated by the quality of play (even though we won league) and the quality of training.   She won't be playing HS during here senior season and is looking forward to having a break since DA shuts down for about 5 weeks during December/January.  I have asked my dd whether this has been discussed with her current DA players and she tells me that really no one misses HS.  Personally I think its the parents that miss it more.


----------



## Fact

Simisoccerfan said:


> I don't agree with your comment that most girls regret not playing HS.    From a parent perspective I loved HS.    It feeds a parent's ego.


This is very telling about you.


----------



## El Clasico

C.A.M. said:


> We are going to clear up something - you don't know where I've been and what I've done so keep those opinions to yourself.
> 
> Also - this discussion saying we are behind the world - is strictly on the men's side *as our Women have dominated world soccer for decades* and we can continue to do so as the game grows if we don't sit on our laurels and truly develop these young girls instead of just throwing them out to win and not learn.
> 
> Thing is we have people wanting to instill the culture of these other places into the game HERE.  *It's not going to work*.  Nothing is wrong with these other cultures, so it isn't a slight and I understand wanting to take what is successful around the globe and implementing it here to get things going down the right path.  Bringing the greatest coaches from around the world to set the baseline of technique and tactics is fine (my boys club does just that), *but they can't bring the culture.*  If you really analyze what makes the game special in other places in the world, it's the culture of the game that each country has.  The DNA for each and every country that sets them apart from it's neighbor and competitors.
> 
> If you have truly traveled the world you know one thing, Americans do things our way even if it is stupid and ass backwards.  You also know that somehow we make that crap work for us because we are a strange bunch of people. What we need to do is create the AMERICAN identity of soccer.   Take what everyone else does, keep what works for us and toss the rest.  *Just like the US Women did from day one. * Until we make the game ours and mold our play to our ideals, designs, athletes, coaches, lifestyles and thinking processes we will remain a 2nd tier team because it will be unnatural.  Stop trying to have us be European or South American.  We're not them. We don't think the same.  Embrace who we are and mold the game to us and we will flourish.
> 
> It's OK to be in the quarter finals of the World Cup or miss it once in a while.  This is part of the growing pains.  This is the journey to greatness and it's not going to happen right away.  Like all the great coaches in soccer say, "We must suffer to win!".


Here is what I am pretty sure that I do know....You are an idiot, you haven't been anywhere, and likely haven't done anything. That is what comes through to me in your posts. Like I said pretty clear.  You don't know what you don't know.  If you were to go back and read my posts, you would see that I am one of the few that has said that one of the things that USSF is doing wrong is trying to copy someone else's identity, that if USSF just embraced who Americans are, and built a system around that culture, they would have better results. One of the glorious things about this country is it's culture. Coming from another culture, I like millions of others here appreciate the culture and see the benefits that it brings to not only soccer but to all their sports and athletes. Develop our own style!! But if you think that is what USSF is doing, and that the system is NOT broke, you have spent too much time sucking the DA pole. 

In case there is any question as to your ignorance, just look at your quote "*Just like the US Women did from day one."  *If you think for one second that the success of the women's team is due anything USSF and their system did for them or because the women had a system of "keeping what works for us and tossing the rest", you really don't understand soccer in general, or the history of women's soccer period. Title IX has done more for women's soccer in this country than USSF ever has done, or ever will do. To this day, there are still more countries without a women's team than the number that do. So yes, without taking anything away from the WNT, they have done very, very well for themselves (again, on their own and without much support from USSF) but they have also been playing with a loaded deck.  Now that that other countries have increased their involvement and participation in women's soccer, you see the women struggling much more.  So when you see, or hear poster's complain that they better get better at development and SELECTION, you now know what they are talking about. University's, High Schools and leagues like ECNL have done all the heavy lifting and as soon as the women reach their pinnacle, DA announces that they have to take over to make it great. Oh brother!! Try getting up off your knees for a minute and looking around you. It's a big, beautiful world with many paths to where you want to go. Yours is not the only one.

Oh, by the way....in this country, it's called Soccer.


----------



## Pitch pop

Simisoccerfan said:


> I don't agree with your comment that most girls regret not playing HS.  Your kid is in college along with her peers.  DA did not exist when they were in HS so playing HS was the norm.  So unless you have another kid currently playing HS I think times have changed and you may not have the current perspective.  From a parent perspective I loved HS.  Friday night games with packed stands.  Newspaper articles.  It feeds a parent's ego.  From my dd perspective she was extremely frustrated by the quality of play (even though we won league) and the quality of training.   She won't be playing HS during here senior season and is looking forward to having a break since DA shuts down for about 5 weeks during December/January.  I have asked my dd whether this has been discussed with her current DA players and she tells me that really no one misses HS.  Personally I think its the parents that miss it more.


I would say the opinion of the girls my daughter has spoke with is different, some feel like they have missed out and some don’t. Many are considering returning to high school Soccer because they regret their decision. Some of the girls that do seem to show regret,  elude to the fact that their parents were more of a factor in the decision making. Obviously that isn’t the case for everyone but I thought that was interesting. I also think which high school a kid goes to and how big the program is, plays a big factor.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Thanks Pitch!  It is good to hear different opinions and what everyone is hearing on this topic.   I also appreciate that instead of bashing my opinion you shared yours!


----------



## beachbum

Pitch pop said:


> I would say the opinion of the girls my daughter has spoke with is different, some feel like they have missed out and some don’t. Many are considering returning to high school Soccer because they regret their decision. Some of the girls that do seem to show regret,  elude to the fact that their parents were more of a factor in the decision making. Obviously that isn’t the case for everyone but I thought that was interesting. I also think which high school a kid goes to and how big the program is, plays a big factor.


I would agree with you that most girls on my daughters team feel like they would prefer to play high school  but the pressure from the club/coach/DA was to much to overcome for many of them.  They would like to play at the highest level when not in high school so they choose to stay with club and not enjoy soccer as much due to the above mentioned pressures.  IMO the ECNL had it mostly right and currently the DA has it mostly wrong.  The DA will have to adapt because their consumers are starting to go in another direction.  Another club pulled themselves from the DA today.  I think the total is 6 or 7 now and i'll bet more to follow.  Interesting article for you viewing pleasure.
https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77603/us-soccer-blundered-badly-on-high-school-soccer.html


----------



## C.A.M.

El Clasico said:


> Here is what I am pretty sure that I do know....You are an idiot, you haven't been anywhere, and likely haven't done anything. That is what comes through to me in your posts. Like I said pretty clear.  You don't know what you don't know.  If you were to go back and read my posts, you would see that I am one of the few that has said that one of the things that USSF is doing wrong is trying to copy someone else's identity, that if USSF just embraced who Americans are, and built a system around that culture, they would have better results. One of the glorious things about this country is it's culture. Coming from another culture, I like millions of others here appreciate the culture and see the benefits that it brings to not only soccer but to all their sports and athletes. Develop our own style!! But if you think that is what USSF is doing, and that the system is NOT broke, you have spent too much time sucking the DA pole.
> 
> In case there is any question as to your ignorance, just look at your quote "*Just like the US Women did from day one."  *If you think for one second that the success of the women's team is due anything USSF and their system did for them or because the women had a system of "keeping what works for us and tossing the rest", you really don't understand soccer in general, or the history of women's soccer period. Title IX has done more for women's soccer in this country than USSF ever has done, or ever will do. To this day, there are still more countries without a women's team than the number that do. So yes, without taking anything away from the WNT, they have done very, very well for themselves (again, on their own and without much support from USSF) but they have also been playing with a loaded deck.  Now that that other countries have increased their involvement and participation in women's soccer, you see the women struggling much more.  So when you see, or hear poster's complain that they better get better at development and SELECTION, you now know what they are talking about. University's, High Schools and leagues like ECNL have done all the heavy lifting and as soon as the women reach their pinnacle, DA announces that they have to take over to make it great. Oh brother!! Try getting up off your knees for a minute and looking around you. It's a big, beautiful world with many paths to where you want to go. Yours is not the only one.
> 
> Oh, by the way....in this country, it's called Soccer.


Wow.  Keyboard warrior.


----------



## timbuck

C.A.M. said:


> For any of those parents that have had their kids playing high level soccer in So Cal, I call bull.  What's the difference with the 4th day when little Jane or Tommy were already doing an extra day of skills privates and athletic improvement?  Nada.
> 
> I'll even counter and say if the 4th day is a true film day (which it isn't for a lot of clubs right now), it's an improvement because watching the game (you and the best in the world) is a vital part of learning the game.


I'd say the difference is that the 4th day is mandatory with DA.  And the 4th day could be a bit of a drive.  
If you are doing privates or athletic training on your own -  You can somewhat control the schedule.  You can cancel if the homework load is heavy.  Or if your family is planning to go out for your little sisters birthday.  Or if you are hurt, you can sit at home instead of driving 45 minutes each way to watch your team practice from the sidelines.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> I would say the opinion of the girls my daughter has spoke with is different, some feel like they have missed out and some don’t. Many are considering returning to high school Soccer because they regret their decision. Some of the girls that do seem to show regret,  elude to the fact that their parents were more of a factor in the decision making. Obviously that isn’t the case for everyone but I thought that was interesting. I also think which high school a kid goes to and how big the program is, plays a big factor.


This is the sentiment we are seeing also.  What I've noticed is the one's really focused on making it to college soccer aren't missing it because of the overall quality of play and coaching at the high school level. 

A lot of it also depends on the conversation each parent had with their kids before coming into this venture.  Many of the girls simply weren't ready for the mental or physical preparation it would take to be successful and neither were the parents.

Year one is rough.  Plus this has wrecked the quality of high school soccer even further and happened in an instance.  We shouldn't expect it to be a smooth ride.


----------



## C.A.M.

timbuck said:


> I'd say the difference is that the 4th day is mandatory with DA.  And the 4th day could be a bit of a drive.
> If you are doing privates or athletic training on your own -  You can somewhat control the schedule.  You can cancel if the homework load is heavy.  Or if your family is planning to go out for your little sisters birthday.  Or if you are hurt, you can sit at home instead of driving 45 minutes each way to watch your team practice from the sidelines.


 I can see that point as we have a 45 minute drive each way and our girl has had to go to practice and watch while injured also.  It just feels like a lack of preparation as the undertaking is more than what the parents and kids were ready for or desire to do.  We had been on a time demanding team before so our level of adjustment was basically nil. 

I believe the rules have been put into place to weed out most of the people who would participate if the rules didn't exist.  They substituted the demand of ultra dedication (no outside comp, no high school, 4 days a week, etc...) for costs.  

Funny, because as we all know - there are no guarantees even if you do everything asked.


----------



## C.A.M.

beachbum said:


> I would agree with you that most girls on my daughters team feel like they would prefer to play high school  but the pressure from the club/coach/DA was to much to overcome for many of them.  They would like to play at the highest level when not in high school so they choose to stay with club and not enjoy soccer as much due to the above mentioned pressures.  IMO the ECNL had it mostly right and currently the DA has it mostly wrong.  The DA will have to adapt because their consumers are starting to go in another direction.  Another club pulled themselves from the DA today.  I think the total is 6 or 7 now and i'll bet more to follow.  Interesting article for you viewing pleasure.
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77603/us-soccer-blundered-badly-on-high-school-soccer.html



Please detail the pressures you mentioned.  I hadn't heard that point of view yet.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> What I've noticed is the one's really focused on making it to college soccer aren't missing it because of the overall quality of play and coaching at the high school level.


On our end we have experienced just the opposite. All of the girls but one my daughter referenced, have committed to D1 college programs. The one has decided to wait a couple of months due to the new recruiting guidelines.


----------



## Gokicksomegrass

C.A.M. said:


> We are going to clear up something - you don't know where I've been and what I've done so keep those opinions to yourself.
> 
> Also - this discussion saying we are behind the world - is strictly on the men's side *as our Women have dominated world soccer for decades* and we can continue to do so as the game grows if we don't sit on our laurels and truly develop these young girls instead of just throwing them out to win and not learn.
> 
> Thing is we have people wanting to instill the culture of these other places into the game HERE.  *It's not going to work*.  Nothing is wrong with these other cultures, so it isn't a slight and I understand wanting to take what is successful around the globe and implementing it here to get things going down the right path.  Bringing the greatest coaches from around the world to set the baseline of technique and tactics is fine (my boys club does just that), *but they can't bring the culture.*  If you really analyze what makes the game special in other places in the world, it's the culture of the game that each country has.  The DNA for each and every country that sets them apart from it's neighbor and competitors.
> 
> If you have truly traveled the world you know one thing, Americans do things our way even if it is stupid and ass backwards.  You also know that somehow we make that crap work for us because we are a strange bunch of people. What we need to do is create the AMERICAN identity of soccer.   Take what everyone else does, keep what works for us and toss the rest.  *Just like the US Women did from day one. * Until we make the game ours and mold our play to our ideals, designs, athletes, coaches, lifestyles and thinking processes we will remain a 2nd tier team because it will be unnatural.  Stop trying to have us be European or South American.  We're not them. We don't think the same.  Embrace who we are and mold the game to us and we will flourish.
> 
> It's OK to be in the quarter finals of the World Cup or miss it once in a while.  This is part of the growing pains.  This is the journey to greatness and it's not going to happen right away.  Like all the great coaches in soccer say, "We must suffer to win!".


Oh, I got it. You are an unpaid intern at US Soccer hyping up GDA.
I was wondering why you so cray cray. Hey, coffee ain't going to be brewing by itself. Go  make some.


----------



## beachbum

C.A.M. said:


> Please detail the pressures you mentioned.  I hadn't heard that point of view yet.


As you may or may not know the overall DA allows you to play high school if you are a freshman this year.  Here is the U.S. Webinar that states this.  https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/pshiqv8vittgn5z5auffkhazp5ek9eeq
Some clubs went by this rule and some did not.  The ones that honored this rule found that many of their girls were going to take a break and play high school.  These clubs were surprised by this and felt they may not be able to field a competitive team during this time frame so they resorted to questionable tactics to keep the girls from going to high school.  I've heard many things from you won't be allowed back on the team; to the guilt trip of, "I'm disappointed to hear that some of you are considering high school, i thought you were better that";  High school soccer is no good;  HS coaches are no good; we will talk to your college coaches; etc...


----------



## GoWest

Simisoccerfan said:


> DA is not for everyone but does work well for those that don't want to play HS and are serious about soccer.


I do agree with you that it is nice to have options. I would add that, "ECNL is not for everyone but does work well for those that want to play HS and are serious about soccer."

This season my DD chose to stay ECNL but also trains at times during the week with the DA team. She also does private lessons to boot. She's pretty serious about soccer but also enjoys a bit more freedom playing under the ECNL banner....see HS. The P5 and high mid-major college coaches that have recruited her only seem to care about her continued enjoyment of the game along with her continuing efforts to improve her technical abilities and tactical understanding of the game. She is well-balanced and happy and most importantly is enjoying the beautiful game. This is her journey and I know everyone's is different so I'm just putting emphasis on the "options" portion of your comment which I wholeheartedly agree with but expanding your "serious about soccer" to include ECNL.

Best of everything to you and your player!


----------



## Pitch pop

GoWest said:


> I do agree with you that it is nice to have options. I would add that, "ECNL is not for everyone but does work well for those that want to play HS and are serious about soccer."
> 
> This season my DD chose to stay ECNL but also trains at times during the week with the DA team. She also does private lessons to boot. She's pretty serious about soccer but also enjoys a bit more freedom playing under the ECNL banner....see HS. The P5 and high mid-major college coaches that have recruited her only seem to care about her continued enjoyment of the game along with her continuing efforts to improve her technical abilities and tactical understanding of the game. She is well-balanced and happy and most importantly is enjoying the beautiful game. This is her journey and I know everyone's is different so I'm just putting emphasis on the "options" portion of your comment which I wholeheartedly agree with but expanding your "serious about soccer" to include ECNL.
> 
> Best of everything to you and your player!


Well said...


----------



## C.A.M.

Gokicksomegrass said:


> Oh, I got it. You are an unpaid intern at US Soccer hyping up GDA.
> I was wondering why you so cray cray. Hey, coffee ain't going to be brewing by itself. Go  make some.


It's a big experiment.  If the name was Jim Bob's Soccer Federation I wouldn't give a damn.  I also understand that this isn't getting us to the top level of soccer/futbol in the world on the mens side.  

Only having a true culture that is over the top crazy about the sport like the way we are with Football will do that.  Why?  It will bring the money to the game.  That will bring the best athletes to the game.  That will bring the best coaches.  Our top athletes like to get paid, have nice cars, fine women and fame.  That isn't what you get as a soccer player here.  That's why half the parents of the top players in the game at D1 aren't encouraging their daughters to play the game.  They don't see the need for the $ you get out of it.  It's just not practical.  

All these youth systems will be different in 10 years from now.  I'm not married to them nor am I blissfully ignorant to the flaws.  I have 3 years left for her and 6 years left for him and like Dre said, "Fuck Soccer you can have it back!".  Real talk, my kids have brought a love for this game that will never die.  I appreciate the game in a way I never thought was possible when I was a fresh 18 year old in the pubs of France wondering what the hell are you guys going nuts for.  I get it now and me getting it comes with the understanding that most Americans don't get it like that and possibly never will.  If my kids weren't good athletes and didn't get a chance to play at these high levels I wouldn't appreciate the hard work, dedication, technical ability and just plain desire to push through all the politics and bs to play a game you love for soccer.  I understood it for football, baseball and basketball, but not soccer and now I do.  

Just when it comes to people whining about high school soccer - that holds no merit for me.  I don't find that level of the game instrumental in helping girls get to the top like it once did.  The state of the Womens game allowed us the lee way to flourish through what goes on there in the past, but when you look at the focus, dedication and money other countries are putting into the game at the youth level that mimic what they have successfully done on the mens side - the gap has closed and we need to adjust.  

Will the DA be the way?  Not sure.  It just seems more people are angry about the changes being forced than the actual system itself.  Watch Beach FC DA girls play and it's hard not to be impressed and say that's some pretty stuff (no my kid doesn't play for them).  There are other avenues to the path of success if you don't like the DA.

ECNL still exists for those that don't like the DA.  All the other leagues are still there.  If you aren't a fan, than speak with your money and have your kid play elsewhere.  If enough people do that *AND* US Soccer deems it is a failed venture, the DA will disappear or be swallowed up and you can party to the lights go out.  In the end, I'm going to do what's right for my kids.  Do what's right for yours and stop acting as if there are no other paths.

The only thing personal here (beyond the attacks that you keyboard warriors enjoy lobbying at me and others who don't share your viewpoint), is assisting my kids in reaching their goals.  I also enjoy watching and assisting other good people reach their goals.  We all have different paths.  Do you and I'll do me.


----------



## C.A.M.

beachbum said:


> As you may or may not know the overall DA allows you to play high school if you are a freshman this year.  Here is the U.S. Webinar that states this.  https://ussoccer.app.box.com/s/pshiqv8vittgn5z5auffkhazp5ek9eeq
> Some clubs went by this rule and some did not.  The ones that honored this rule found that many of their girls were going to take a break and play high school.  These clubs were surprised by this and felt they may not be able to field a competitive team during this time frame so they resorted to questionable tactics to keep the girls from going to high school.  I've heard many things from you won't be allowed back on the team; to the guilt trip of, "I'm disappointed to hear that some of you are considering high school, i thought you were better that";  High school soccer is no good;  HS coaches are no good; we will talk to your college coaches; etc...



Yeah that's not cool at all.  I did know about the waiver being allowed this season, but only know one kid that took advantage of it and am glad she had a great season.  Thanks for expanding on that.


----------



## C.A.M.

GoWest said:


> I do agree with you that it is nice to have options. I would add that, "ECNL is not for everyone but does work well for those that want to play HS and are serious about soccer."
> 
> This season my DD chose to stay ECNL but also trains at times during the week with the DA team. She also does private lessons to boot. She's pretty serious about soccer but also enjoys a bit more freedom playing under the ECNL banner....see HS. The P5 and high mid-major college coaches that have recruited her only seem to care about her continued enjoyment of the game along with her continuing efforts to improve her technical abilities and tactical understanding of the game. She is well-balanced and happy and most importantly is enjoying the beautiful game. This is her journey and I know everyone's is different so I'm just putting emphasis on the "options" portion of your comment which I wholeheartedly agree with but expanding your "serious about soccer" to include ECNL.
> 
> Best of everything to you and your player!


Great post GoWest


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> On our end we have experienced just the opposite. All of the girls but one my daughter referenced, have committed to D1 college programs. The one has decided to wait a couple of months due to the new recruiting guidelines.


Have to love that.


----------



## Pitch pop

C.A.M. said:


> It's a big experiment.  If the name was Jim Bob's Soccer Federation I wouldn't give a damn.  I also understand that this isn't getting us to the top level of soccer/futbol in the world on the mens side.
> 
> Only having a true culture that is over the top crazy about the sport like the way we are with Football will do that.  Why?  It will bring the money to the game.  That will bring the best athletes to the game.  That will bring the best coaches.  Our top athletes like to get paid, have nice cars, fine women and fame.  That isn't what you get as a soccer player here.  That's why half the parents of the top players in the game at D1 aren't encouraging their daughters to play the game.  They don't see the need for the $ you get out of it.  It's just not practical.
> 
> All these youth systems will be different in 10 years from now.  I'm not married to them nor am I blissfully ignorant to the flaws.  I have 3 years left for her and 6 years left for him and like Dre said, "Fuck Soccer you can have it back!".  Real talk, my kids have brought a love for this game that will never die.  I appreciate the game in a way I never thought was possible when I was a fresh 18 year old in the pubs of France wondering what the hell are you guys going nuts for.  I get it now and me getting it comes with the understanding that most Americans don't get it like that and possibly never will.  If my kids weren't good athletes and didn't get a chance to play at these high levels I wouldn't appreciate the hard work, dedication, technical ability and just plain desire to push through all the politics and bs to play a game you love for soccer.  I understood it for football, baseball and basketball, but not soccer and now I do.
> 
> Just when it comes to people whining about high school soccer - that holds no merit for me.  I don't find that level of the game instrumental in helping girls get to the top like it once did.  The state of the Womens game allowed us the lee way to flourish through what goes on there in the past, but when you look at the focus, dedication and money other countries are putting into the game at the youth level that mimic what they have successfully done on the mens side - the gap has closed and we need to adjust.
> 
> Will the DA be the way?  Not sure.  It just seems more people are angry about the changes being forced than the actual system itself.  Watch Beach FC DA girls play and it's hard not to be impressed and say that's some pretty stuff (no my kid doesn't play for them).  There are other avenues to the path of success if you don't like the DA.
> 
> ECNL still exists for those that don't like the DA.  All the other leagues are still there.  If you aren't a fan, than speak with your money and have your kid play elsewhere.  If enough people do that *AND* US Soccer deems it is a failed venture, the DA will disappear or be swallowed up and you can party to the lights go out.  In the end, I'm going to do what's right for my kids.  Do what's right for yours and stop acting as if there are no other paths.
> 
> The only thing personal here (beyond the attacks that you keyboard warriors enjoy lobbying at me and others who don't share your viewpoint), is assisting my kids in reaching their goals.  I also enjoy watching and assisting other good people reach their goals.  We all have different paths.  Do you and I'll do me.


It would appear not everyone shares your opinion on high school, including some of top college coaches in the country. With that said, everyone is entitled to their opinion and who am I to say whose is right.... Time will tell.

https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77603/us-soccer-blundered-badly-on-high-school-soccer.html


----------



## C.A.M.

MakeAPlay said:


> I disagree.  Soccer is not new in America and next to football is the highest youth participation sport.  We are broke and it's has more to do with Capitalism and our economic/political culture than our sports culture.


Capitalism or the ability to change your status with your abilities honed to their maximum plays a part in all sports all over the world.  Cubans and Dominicans play baseball because it gets them out of poverty.  Most of the girls of the parents in this forum are playing to get scholarships at these universities so the education allows them to live better lives.  There are some who can play the game at the highest level like yours did MAP and won't, but not many.

I realized the hard way that youth soccer is a business.  A hard nose, ruthless, backstabbing, egotistical, take care of yourself first business.  Whole club teams defect to go WIN and college coaches get fired for unsuccessful seasons.  That's business.

On the girls side, we have the athletes to stay at the top of the game.  A lot of these soccer players could and some do rock at softball, basketball, etc....  Thing is they really are playing for love of the game and friendship and a desire to be the best at what they do because the pro leagues of other sports aren't enticing them away.  They don't make too much more playing any other sport, so you may as well play what you love the most and that gets you into college.

On the boys side, it's a whole different scenario.  We are the 4th option for athletes at the pro level.  More people watch pro soccer than hockey here, but hockey players make more money.  There are no bad pro athletes in any of these leagues, but let's not pretend our status wouldn't be different if the money was in MLS and we could bring in guys like Kobe, LeBron, Paul George, etc.....    *We would be France.*  Look at what they put on the field.  That is what soccer would look like if our best athletes played the game.   Skilled, fast, strong, exciting and winners.  A lot of people complaining about where we stand as a soccer country internationally would be left out.


----------



## C.A.M.

Pitch pop said:


> It would appear not everyone shares your opinion on high school, including some of top college coaches in the country. With that said, everyone is entitled to their opinion and who am I to say whose is right.... Time will tell.
> 
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77603/us-soccer-blundered-badly-on-high-school-soccer.html


I know a high school coach I respect a lot whose boy plays with mine and girl plays the year under mine in the DA and he hates the high school soccer rule.  I know a lot of people disagree.  Most do when change comes.  Like you said.. time will tell.


----------



## ToonArmy

Doesn't high school soccer also cost a lot of money nowadays depending on the school?


----------



## soccer dude

ToonArmy said:


> Doesn't high school soccer also cost a lot of money nowadays depending on the school?


Ours in the IE cost about $175  total for the entire season.  Pennies compared to club.  We make it to CIF every year (won regionals 4 years ago) and soccer is huge at our school.  I would say the training is mediocre at best and no one that I know at our school does it for the training.  They play for the fun and team environment (and of course the pre-game dinners that the girls love).  I've heard several academy players saying they're leaving due to the 4 days/week practice and sub rules.  ECNL seems to be a better path for me and my girls but since West Coast is dropping ECNL, not sure what do now.  West Coast is saying DA2 is the substitute for ECNL but I don't see that from the quality of competition ECNL brings to the table compared to playing "B" academy teams.


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Between the cost of the spirit pack and the transportation fee our costs for HS around $525.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> I don't agree with your comment that most girls regret not playing HS.  Your kid is in college along with her peers.  DA did not exist when they were in HS so playing HS was the norm.  So unless you have another kid currently playing HS I think times have changed and you may not have the current perspective.  From a parent perspective I loved HS.  Friday night games with packed stands.  Newspaper articles.  It feeds a parent's ego.  From my dd perspective she was extremely frustrated by the quality of play (even though we won league) and the quality of training.   She won't be playing HS during here senior season and is looking forward to having a break since DA shuts down for about 5 weeks during December/January.  I have asked my dd whether this has been discussed with her current DA players and she tells me that really no one misses HS.  Personally I think its the parents that miss it more.



You are wrong regarding my situation.  I was the one trying to convince my player not to play high school soccer.  I went to maybe 10 high school games my players whole career.  Her junior year she started the season as the team manager and absolutely hated it.  She ended up asking the coach to let her play (and didn't tell me until after he said yes!). 

No matter who the player is at some point they have to hang up the cleats.  My player is ecstatic to have played with the girls that she grew up with, none of which were good enough to play on her on her club or ODP team.

Good luck to you and your player.


----------



## MakeAPlay

GoWest said:


> I do agree with you that it is nice to have options. I would add that, "ECNL is not for everyone but does work well for those that want to play HS and are serious about soccer."
> 
> This season my DD chose to stay ECNL but also trains at times during the week with the DA team. She also does private lessons to boot. She's pretty serious about soccer but also enjoys a bit more freedom playing under the ECNL banner....see HS. The P5 and high mid-major college coaches that have recruited her only seem to care about her continued enjoyment of the game along with her continuing efforts to improve her technical abilities and tactical understanding of the game. She is well-balanced and happy and most importantly is enjoying the beautiful game. This is her journey and I know everyone's is different so I'm just putting emphasis on the "options" portion of your comment which I wholeheartedly agree with but expanding your "serious about soccer" to include ECNL.
> 
> Best of everything to you and your player!


Great post!  As one who has a player in college this is a great path to success.  At the end of the day they are teenage girls.  My kid and I mainly talked about Coachella and school so far this week.  Not soccer and she is on a mission to be 100% by July.
Meet them enjoy the journey that is the best way to make it last.  Continued good luck to you and your player.


----------



## push_up

El Clasico said:


> Here is what I am pretty sure that I do know....You are an idiot, you haven't been anywhere, and likely haven't done anything. That is what comes through to me in your posts. Like I said pretty clear.  You don't know what you don't know.  If you were to go back and read my posts, you would see that I am one of the few that has said that one of the things that USSF is doing wrong is trying to copy someone else's identity, that if USSF just embraced who Americans are, and built a system around that culture, they would have better results. One of the glorious things about this country is it's culture. Coming from another culture, I like millions of others here appreciate the culture and see the benefits that it brings to not only soccer but to all their sports and athletes. Develop our own style!! But if you think that is what USSF is doing, and that the system is NOT broke, you have spent too much time sucking the DA pole.
> 
> In case there is any question as to your ignorance, just look at your quote "*Just like the US Women did from day one."  *If you think for one second that the success of the women's team is due anything USSF and their system did for them or because the women had a system of "keeping what works for us and tossing the rest", you really don't understand soccer in general, or the history of women's soccer period. Title IX has done more for women's soccer in this country than USSF ever has done, or ever will do. To this day, there are still more countries without a women's team than the number that do. So yes, without taking anything away from the WNT, they have done very, very well for themselves (again, on their own and without much support from USSF) but they have also been playing with a loaded deck.  Now that that other countries have increased their involvement and participation in women's soccer, you see the women struggling much more.  So when you see, or hear poster's complain that they better get better at development and SELECTION, you now know what they are talking about. University's, High Schools and leagues like ECNL have done all the heavy lifting and as soon as the women reach their pinnacle, DA announces that they have to take over to make it great. Oh brother!! Try getting up off your knees for a minute and looking around you. It's a big, beautiful world with many paths to where you want to go. Yours is not the only one.
> 
> Oh, by the way....in this country, it's called Soccer.


This time it was a funny bitch-slapping.  Well done and back to back.


----------



## Josep

soccer dude said:


> Ours in the IE cost about $175  total for the entire season.  Pennies compared to club.  We make it to CIF every year (won regionals 4 years ago) and soccer is huge at our school.  I would say the training is mediocre at best and no one that I know at our school does it for the training.  They play for the fun and team environment (and of course the pre-game dinners that the girls love).  I've heard several academy players saying they're leaving due to the 4 days/week practice and sub rules.  ECNL seems to be a better path for me and my girls but since West Coast is dropping ECNL, not sure what do now.  West Coast is saying DA2 is the substitute for ECNL but I don't see that from the quality of competition ECNL brings to the table compared to playing "B" academy teams.


What club do these players say the academy schedule is too much?  Are these 04s?


----------



## Pitch pop

New team rankings. Take it for what it’s worth. Gonna be interesting to see what they look like next year when when some of those top ranked teams switch back to ECNL. 

https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer/club-soccer-team-rankings/women/u15/3/912


----------



## soccer dude

Josep said:


> What club do these players say the academy schedule is too much?  Are these 04s?


I spoke to parents at Legends, Pats, and West Coast.  Yes mostly 04s and some 03s.  Oh, I forgot to mention that 75% of the parents I spoke to say the 4 back-to-back practices (usually Mon-Thurs) is brutal on the girls and many are injured due to overwork and not enough recovery.  I have yet to speak to one parent that agrees or approves with the 4 practices.  Most say 3 is max.  My girl guested with west coast a few times due to 5 injured players.  Fortunately, they are all back now.  Being an ECNL parent with 2 practices I can say not one of our girls has ever been injured from overuse but I think 2 practices is too few and would prefer 3.   If we could only meet in the middle somewhere...


----------



## SoccerFan

soccer dude said:


> I spoke to parents at Legends, Pats, and West Coast.  Yes mostly 04s and some 03s.  Oh, I forgot to mention that 75% of the parents I spoke to say the 4 back-to-back practices (usually Mon-Thurs) is brutal on the girls and many are injured due to overwork and not enough recovery.  I have yet to speak to one parent that agrees or approves with the 4 practices.  Most say 3 is max.  My girl guested with west coast a few times due to 5 injured players.  Fortunately, they are all back now.  Being an ECNL parent with 2 practices I can say not one of our girls has ever been injured from overuse but I think 2 practices is too few and would prefer 3.   If we could only meet in the middle somewhere...


DA is not for everyone. My DD is doing very well......same schedule she had prior to DA because she used to do privates, groups and futsal. I’m surprise to hear some are saying the 4x practice is brutal because everyone shows up to training, even injured players when they can’t practice


----------



## Simisoccerfan

soccer dude said:


> I spoke to parents at Legends, Pats, and West Coast.  Yes mostly 04s and some 03s.  Oh, I forgot to mention that 75% of the parents I spoke to say the 4 back-to-back practices (usually Mon-Thurs) is brutal on the girls and many are injured due to overwork and not enough recovery.  I have yet to speak to one parent that agrees or approves with the 4 practices.  Most say 3 is max.  My girl guested with west coast a few times due to 5 injured players.  Fortunately, they are all back now.  Being an ECNL parent with 2 practices I can say not one of our girls has ever been injured from overuse but I think 2 practices is too few and would prefer 3.   If we could only meet in the middle somewhere...


HS teams practice 5 days a week when not playing games.  When they start playing games they usually play two games a week with practices on the other three days along with possible games on Saturdays prior the start of league.   If they complain about practice 4 days and usually just one game a week then HS has more than this.  Also away games  usually take all afternoon/evening since the quite often have to be present for the other levels of play.


----------



## CuriousOne

This game is more reflective of how soccer should be played (by both teams) even at a younger age (2004 GDA).   Kudos to the coaches for teaching these girls to play the right way.

First Half: 



Second Half:


----------



## Josep

My kid has never complained about practicing four nights a week.  But she has always worked in extra stuff beyond normal practices or practiced an age up on the off nights.  

This is a good indicator.  The 04s can make a decision if this is right for them going into HS.


----------



## ToonArmy

CuriousOne said:


> This game is more reflective of how soccer should be played (by both teams) even at a younger age (2004 GDA).   Kudos to the coaches for teaching these girls to play the right way.
> 
> First Half:
> 
> 
> 
> Second Half:


I see an 06 and an 05 for Beach


----------



## futboldad1

Pitch pop said:


> New team rankings. Take it for what it’s worth. Gonna be interesting to see what they look like next year when when some of those top ranked teams switch back to ECNL.
> 
> https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer/club-soccer-team-rankings/women/u15/3/912


Other than the top two teams, these rankings (for 05 at least) are so far off from reality it's funny. It's as bad as gotsoccer.com

youthsoccerrankings.us is the only rankings site of  value.


----------



## davin

futboldad1 said:


> Other than the top two teams, these rankings (for 05 at least) are so far off from reality it's funny. It's as bad as gotsoccer.com
> 
> youthsoccerrankings.us is the only rankings site of  value.


So true. Same thing with the 04's. There is a team which was newly added as a top 10 team to that list which got dominated 6-1 last month by a team that should be ranked. Not sure what metrics they use for their rankings, but doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to how they make these lists. At least we know how gotsoccer does their rankings. LOL.


----------



## LadiesMan217

soccer dude said:


> I spoke to parents at Legends, Pats, and West Coast.  Yes mostly 04s and some 03s.  Oh, I forgot to mention that 75% of the parents I spoke to say the 4 back-to-back practices (usually Mon-Thurs) is brutal on the girls and many are injured due to overwork and not enough recovery.  I have yet to speak to one parent that agrees or approves with the 4 practices.  Most say 3 is max.  My girl guested with west coast a few times due to 5 injured players.  Fortunately, they are all back now.  Being an ECNL parent with 2 practices I can say not one of our girls has ever been injured from overuse but I think 2 practices is too few and would prefer 3.   If we could only meet in the middle somewhere...


What was the sample set? 75% could mean you talked to 4 parents. We had a team meeting and parents had no issue with the 4 practices during general discussion other than the the people who drove from LA. The only parents I have heard complaining should take their kid and go anyways because their kid doesn't belong in DA. My DD loves it and during ECNL last year joined the boys side at least once a week. I do worry a little for 04 girls undergoing major hip growth - that can be an issue if the girl practices at high intensity.


----------



## LadiesMan217

futboldad1 said:


> Other than the top two teams, these rankings (for 05 at least) are so far off from reality it's funny. It's as bad as gotsoccer.com
> 
> youthsoccerrankings.us is the only rankings site of  value.



HAHA TopDrawer is trash.


----------



## Real Deal

ToonArmy said:


> I see an 06 and an 05 for Beach


I see Two 05s and an 06 for Beach.


----------



## soccer dude

Simisoccerfan said:


> HS teams practice 5 days a week when not playing games.  When they start playing games they usually play two games a week with practices on the other three days along with possible games on Saturdays prior the start of league.   If they complain about practice 4 days and usually just one game a week then HS has more than this.  Also away games  usually take all afternoon/evening since the quite often have to be present for the other levels of play.


Not sure what HS you play for but ours isn't like that and we make CIF Div 1 every year.  Our HS only does 2 or 3 practices a week when the season starts but can play games twice a week.  Plus, HS is a joke with training and nothing compared to club.  Plus, the HS season is short lived and so players can recover after the short 4 month season.  Are you really comparing HS training to academy training?  Not sure what you mean by "all afternoon".  We have away games but they usually are less than 20 miles away and start at 6'ish.


----------



## soccer dude

LadiesMan217 said:


> What was the sample set? 75% could mean you talked to 4 parents. We had a team meeting and parents had no issue with the 4 practices during general discussion other than the the people who drove from LA. The only parents I have heard complaining should take their kid and go anyways because their kid doesn't belong in DA. My DD loves it and during ECNL last year joined the boys side at least once a week. I do worry a little for 04 girls undergoing major hip growth - that can be an issue if the girl practices at high intensity.


First and foremost, most parents will never complain.  I have been on several teams where I was the only one who spoke up on an issue only to be approached later by parents saying they agree.  Most parents are too weak to speak the truth and would rather just wait and see.  Again, not speaking for all but for most.  I think for the right elite athlete and right training (with recovery methods), 4 days could work.  I just hear that the recovery isn't there for some of these clubs, especially at the younger ages where it's more important (like 04's, 03's).  I do agree, however, that at the 02 and above ages, 4 days is more realistic as they need to man up for college and have usually stopped growing.


----------



## Justafan

soccer dude said:


> Not sure what HS you play for but ours isn't like that and we make CIF Div 1 every year.  Our HS only does 2 or 3 practices a week when the season starts but can play games twice a week.  Plus, HS is a joke with training and nothing compared to club.  Plus, the HS season is short lived and so players can recover after the short 4 month season.  Are you really comparing HS training to academy training?  Not sure what you mean by "all afternoon".  We have away games but they usually are less than 20 miles away and start at 6'ish.



You just said everything that Simi said.  So your “20 miles”away games that start at 6ish don’t take all afternoon?  What time does the bus leave the school and what time does it get back?  I would call that “all afternoon.”


----------



## MakeAPlay

soccer dude said:


> First and foremost, most parents will never complain.  I have been on several teams where I was the only one who spoke up on an issue only to be approached later by parents saying they agree.  Most parents are too weak to speak the truth and would rather just wait and see.  Again, not speaking for all but for most.  I think for the right elite athlete and right training (with recovery methods), 4 days could work.  I just hear that the recovery isn't there for some of these clubs, especially at the younger ages where it's more important (like 04's, 03's).  I do agree, however, that at the 02 and above ages, 4 days is more realistic as they need to man up for college and have usually stopped growing.


They don't train 4 days a week in college during the season.  It's more like 2 training days plus film and walk through of specific game stuff.  Then games Thursday/Sunday or Friday/Sunday.  On my kids team the players that play 30 minutes or more don't even do regular conditioning.  It's hard for the players that play heavy minutes to recover trust me on this and the condensed schedule is brutal on those players.


----------



## Gokicksomegrass

CuriousOne said:


> This game is more reflective of how soccer should be played (by both teams) even at a younger age (2004 GDA).   Kudos to the coaches for teaching these girls to play the right way.
> 
> First Half:
> 
> 
> 
> Second Half:


OMG. I know that yelling dad filming. Coach Beach Dad, 2nd in Command, giving orders on the sideline.  
Nah, it's all good. Your player is very good and your filming is excellent.


----------



## SocalPapa

CuriousOne said:


> This game is more reflective of how soccer should be played (by both teams) even at a younger age (2004 GDA).   Kudos to the coaches for teaching these girls to play the right way.
> 
> First Half:
> 
> 
> 
> Second Half:


Is that a http://soloshot.com camera one of the other parents is using to film the game?  Are they happy with the quality/results?


----------



## outside!

SocalPapa said:


> Is that a http://soloshot.com camera one of the other parents is using to film the game?  Are they happy with the quality/results?


I have known two people that had them and both had issues.

1. Even when working correctly, they track the player and not the ball. Be sure to zoom back to get at least 1/3 of the field so you don't see your player running around, then the ball comes into the frame, the player kicks the ball and the ball goes out of the frame.
2. One dad had problems with it putting his player all the way to one side of the frame.
3. The battery is not easily replaceable. If you run out of charge, the entire camera needs to be plugged into a charger.


----------



## SocalPapa

outside! said:


> I have known two people that had them and both had issues.
> 
> 1. Even when working correctly, they track the player and not the ball. Be sure to zoom back to get at least 1/3 of the field so you don't see your player running around, then the ball comes into the frame, the player kicks the ball and the ball goes out of the frame.
> 2. One dad had problems with it putting his player all the way to one side of the frame.
> 3. The battery is not easily replaceable. If you run out of charge, the entire camera needs to be plugged into a charger.


Thanks @outside!.  Where would the player put the sensor?


----------



## MWN

It should not be outside the uniform per FIFA laws.  The arm band is illegal.  Must be under the uniform.


----------



## SocalPapa

That makes sense @MWN.  A quick search and I found that the National Federation of State High School Associations has ruled solo shot tags illegal in all cases.  Probably illegal under the FIFA rules too and not worth the hassle.


----------



## espola

SocalPapa said:


> That makes sense @MWN.  A quick search and I found that the National Federation of State High School Associations has ruled solo shot tags illegal in all cases.  Probably illegal under the FIFA rules too and not worth the hassle.
> 
> View attachment 2525


Figure out a way to wear it in the hard, unyielding shoe.


----------



## MWN

Bio sensors are worn on vests under the uniform on the back of the neck/spine, the electronics sit in padded pockets in a vest.  For the soloshot to be "legal" it needs to simply follow the model of bio tracking devices.  The problem (not insurmountable), from what I see is the solo shot transmitter is a bit bulky and could be painful to a player falling on it if on the spine.


----------



## espola

MWN said:


> Bio sensors are worn on vests under the uniform on the back of the neck/spine, the electronics sit in padded pockets in a vest.  For the soloshot to be "legal" it needs to simply follow the model of bio tracking devices.  The problem (not insurmountable), from what I see is the solo shot transmitter is a bit bulky and could be painful to a player falling on it if on the spine.


Perhaps build it into the hard, unyielding, but mandatory, shinpads.


----------



## El Clasico

Haven't seen, or even know what Bio Sensors are but my younger son would occasionally wear a DA GPS and it looked more like a bra than anything else. Why wouldn't that work for the Solo Shot GPS? Is it different technology?  I like the idea of the Solo Shot so that nobody has to rotate filming duties.


----------



## outside!

El Clasico said:


> Haven't seen, or even know what Bio Sensors are but my younger son would occasionally wear a DA GPS and it looked more like a bra than anything else. Why wouldn't that work for the Solo Shot GPS? Is it different technology?  I like the idea of the Solo Shot so that nobody has to rotate filming duties.


Until they can put the sensor in the ball, the Solo Shot camera will be of limited use for soccer.


----------



## MWN

El Clasico said:


> Haven't seen, or even know what Bio Sensors are but my younger son would occasionally wear a DA GPS and it looked more like a bra than anything else. Why wouldn't that work for the Solo Shot GPS? Is it different technology?  I like the idea of the Solo Shot so that nobody has to rotate filming duties.


Bio Sensors is the broad category name, which includes GPS.  The more advanced Bio Sensors measure additional physical attributes, pulse, temperature, lactate acid levels, etc., in addition to GPS, which just measures how far the kid ran around the pitch.  The Biosensors, like GPS modules can be relatively small because they don't transmit live data (transmitters are bulky and require more power).  It would be possible to spread the electronics out in a "bra" or "vest," to support transmitting for the solo shot, but I have yet to see that solution.


----------



## bruinblue14

A player from my kid's former team uses Solo Shot. She wears the sensor on a band around her waist under her jersey. Family says it allows you to pan out to get a wider angle which may or may not include the ball. It has some flaws, but it has some merits, too.


----------



## Multivitamin

a 4th Big soccer club based right out of Chicago is done with GDA.
ECLIPSE - ALL IN ECNL!

https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77834/illinois-eclipse-select-sc-is-latest-club-to-leav.html


----------



## timbuck

“Since being a founding member of the ECNL in 2009, the club has been a first-hand witness to the league’s proven *pathway* for individual growth and player *development*."

Must be very special.  They used the words Pathway and Development in the same sentence.


----------



## Multivitamin

RUMORED NEXT TO ANNOUNCE OUT OF GDA IS TOPHAT!


----------



## Simisoccerfan

Multivitamin said:


> RUMORED NEXT TO ANNOUNCE OUT OF GDA IS TOPHAT!


Okay we get it.  Your ACTIVELY CHEERING FOR THE DA TO FAIL.  Actually I was surprised Eclipse and the other teams leaving ever joined the DA in the first place.  After all almost all of the ones leaving were Founding Members from 2009 and help various board positions with ECNL.


----------



## MakeAPlay

timbuck said:


> “Since being a founding member of the ECNL in 2009, the club has been a first-hand witness to the league’s proven *pathway* for individual growth and player *development*."
> 
> Must be very special.  They used the words Pathway and Development in the same sentence.


Eclipse Select is unquestionably one of the absolute finest female youth soccer clubs in America. Keep making jokes about but when the best clubs leave a league it is like the guy buying all the booze leaving the party.  It ain't very long until there isn't a party anymore.

This is not insignificant....


----------



## MakeAPlay

Simisoccerfan said:


> Okay we get it.  Your ACTIVELY CHEERING FOR THE DA TO FAIL.  Actually I was surprised Eclipse and the other teams leaving ever joined the DA in the first place.  After all almost all of the ones leaving were Founding Members from 2009 and help various board positions with ECNL.


I predicted that this would not go smoothly years ago.  Don't be mad at those that weren't lemmings.  Good luck to you and your player in this confusing time.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Multivitamin said:


> RUMORED NEXT TO ANNOUNCE OUT OF GDA IS TOPHAT!


I get some of the other movement from DA back to ECNL but TopHat would surprise me.


----------



## MakeAPlay

LadiesMan217 said:


> I get some of the other movement from DA back to ECNL but TopHat would surprise me.


I bet that you are glad that this club drama is almost over for you.  College is a whole new animal....


----------



## beachbum

It won't be really major until a top Cali or TX club leave the DA.  Then the s&%t will hit the fan and floodgates will be open.  We will see how this plays out.


----------



## soccer_soccer

Can people give opinions on how you think DA landscape will change for Youngers particularly 2005-2008 age group as far as which clubs would be the best clubs to try to go for .... particularly LA Galaxy Southbay  vs.  Beach.   vs.   Slammers.   ???   Right now for the older it seems LA Galaxy SB doesn't seem to do well ... but maybe things will change as the Youngers start coming in?  Any opinions?


----------



## Soccer

beachbum said:


> It won't be really major until a top Cali or TX club leave the DA.  Then the s&%t will hit the fan and floodgates will be open.  We will see how this plays out.


Exactly.  Right now it is becoming two regionally strong leagues.  Mid West = ECNL, maybe now North East too.

So Cal = DA and Texas = DA

Might as well add to rumor mill Concorde.  They are on fence too I hear.


----------



## El Clasico

soccer_soccer said:


> Can people give opinions on how you think DA landscape will change for Youngers particularly 2005-2008 age group as far as which clubs would be the best clubs to try to go for .... particularly LA Galaxy Southbay  vs.  Beach.   vs.   Slammers.   ???   Right now for the older it seems LA Galaxy SB doesn't seem to do well ... but maybe things will change as the Youngers start coming in?  Any opinions?


Assuming Slammers holds onto DA rather than push it off on LAFC directly, I would bet....

1. Beach FC (has shown that they can develop playing a pretty form of possession in recent years)
2. Slammers FC (hopefully you understand the difference between Slammers FC and CDA Scammers FC. One is the genuine article and the other markets the name)
3. LA Galaxy (with 10 years of DA experience and a MLS parent team, has yet to demonstrate any ability to develop talent)

That is my take ONLY taking into account the 3 you mentioned.  There are other players in the game but I assume you asked about the 3 you listed based on geographical reasons.


----------



## Dos Equis

Interesting to get the perspective of someone who has been part of Boys DA experience.

https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77821/steve-gans-on-the-development-academys-flaws-the.html


----------



## Dos Equis

El Clasico said:


> Assuming Slammers holds onto DA rather than push it off on LAFC directly, I would bet....
> 
> 1. Beach FC (has shown that they can develop playing a pretty form of possession in recent years)
> 2. Slammers FC (hopefully you understand the difference between Slammers FC and CDA Scammers FC. One is the genuine article and the other markets the name)
> 3. LA Galaxy (with 10 years of DA experience and a MLS parent team, has yet to demonstrate any ability to develop talent)
> 
> That is my take ONLY taking into account the 3 you mentioned.  There are other players in the game but I assume you asked about the 3 you listed based on geographical reasons.


The commitment of a club to its players and teams can often be judged by how quickly they make adjustments and put their coaching staff together for the following season.  From what I have heard, this is the second year in a row that the LA Galaxy Girls Academy is still undecided on age group coaches going into the second week of May, and have told some it may be June before their staff is set.  There really is no such thing as a free lunch.


----------



## Fact

Dos Equis said:


> The commitment of a club to its players and teams can often be judged by how quickly they make adjustments and put their coaching staff together for the following season.  From what I have heard, this is the second year in a row that the LA Galaxy Girls Academy is still undecided on age group coaches going into the second week of May, and have told some it may be June before their staff is set.  There really is no such thing as a free lunch.


As of this last weekend I know that Albion also has not named their DA coaches for next year and all I hear is how Andre (was supposed to be temporary) wants to stop coaching the teams ASAP.


----------



## El Clasico

Dos Equis said:


> Interesting to get the perspective of someone who has been part of Boys DA experience.
> 
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77821/steve-gans-on-the-development-academys-flaws-the.html


While a bit difficult to get my point across at times, I have repeatedly made the same points here on this board. What is interesting is that here in California, his findings are magnified. With 2 boys and 2 girls, I agree girls feel the effect much more and I don't know the words to express it but Gans said it beautifully, you don't get to share, and nobody knows anything about the 1 thing that defines a lot about who the girl is.  In my own experience, and with few exceptions, the one thing that I noticed about DA after the glow of being DA wears off, is that you are left with two groups. The people that are there for free and they have boys that are ballers that came from Mex leagues and other clubs that can't pay big club fees and want more than Mex league exposure and the second group is the group that have boys that don't have the chops and out classed and may or may not know it but are happy to fill out the spot by paying and/or to have bragging rights.  What was sad is the majority in it don't know that it is not the pathway as described to them but rather it is more like the bridge to nowhere. It really is sad.


----------



## F@ct

All US Soccer has to do to permanently relegate ECNL to T2 status is to stop selecting kids for National Teams from non-DA clubs. Pretty simple.


----------



## Fact

F@ct said:


> All US Soccer has to do to permanently relegate ECNL to T2 status is to stop selecting kids for National Teams from non-DA clubs. Pretty simple.


What a loser you must be with nothing better to do.


----------



## Fact

F@ct said:


> All US Soccer has to do to permanently relegate ECNL to T2 status is to stop selecting kids for National Teams from non-DA clubs. Pretty simple.


And what a winner for thinking it is a good idea to hurt kids. DA is not geographically and financially available for everyone.


----------



## outside!

Dos Equis said:


> Interesting to get the perspective of someone who has been part of Boys DA experience.
> 
> https://www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/77821/steve-gans-on-the-development-academys-flaws-the.html


What a great article. Too bad he did not succeed Sunil.

I have a suggestion for improving GDA (and possible DA, but I have no experience on that side of the fence). On game day, a club's GDA teams play in age order at the same facility. It is nice since it makes it easy to see some of the other ages play against the same club. This is not a problem most of the time, but towards the end of the school year this causes many problems for the older players since 4:00 or 5:00 PM games interfere with things like Prom. The older players have already paid their dues, especially the seniors. GDA (and Cal South and any other youth soccer organization) need to be more cognizant of the needs of the older players. Just reversing the game order during the months that have Homecoming and Prom would help.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Fact said:


> And what a winner for thinking it is a good idea to hurt kids. DA is not geographically and financially available for everyone.


Either is ECNL for that matter.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Dos Equis said:


> The commitment of a club to its players and teams can often be judged by how quickly they make adjustments and put their coaching staff together for the following season.  From what I have heard, this is the second year in a row that the LA Galaxy Girls Academy is still undecided on age group coaches going into the second week of May, and have told some it may be June before their staff is set.  There really is no such thing as a free lunch.


They know who the coaches are. Just have not announced. I would say all the parents with players on the teams know too.


----------



## LASTMAN14

soccer_soccer said:


> Can people give opinions on how you think DA landscape will change for Youngers particularly 2005-2008 age group as far as which clubs would be the best clubs to try to go for .... particularly LA Galaxy Southbay  vs.  Beach.   vs.   Slammers.   ???   Right now for the older it seems LA Galaxy SB doesn't seem to do well ... but maybe things will change as the Youngers start coming in?  Any opinions?


LAGSB youngers from 09-06 have some talented players. If they decide to stay and play DA they will have a solid core.


----------



## LASTMAN14

El Clasico said:


> Assuming Slammers holds onto DA rather than push it off on LAFC directly, I would bet....
> 3. LA Galaxy (with 10 years of DA experience and a MLS parent team, has yet to demonstrate any ability to develop talent)


Can not argue with you on the boys side. Lots going on there. But I would say let the girls side and those that run it chart their own course and see how it looks 1-2 years from now.


----------



## Lambchop

El Clasico said:


> While a bit difficult to get my point across at times, I have repeatedly made the same points here on this board. What is interesting is that here in California, his findings are magnified. With 2 boys and 2 girls, I agree girls feel the effect much more and I don't know the words to express it but Gans said it beautifully, you don't get to share, and nobody knows anything about the 1 thing that defines a lot about who the girl is.  In my own experience, and with few exceptions, the one thing that I noticed about DA after the glow of being DA wears off, is that you are left with two groups. The people that are there for free and they have boys that are ballers that came from Mex leagues and other clubs that can't pay big club fees and want more than Mex league exposure and the second group is the group that have boys that don't have the chops and out classed and may or may not know it but are happy to fill out the spot by paying and/or to have bragging rights.  What was sad is the majority in it don't know that it is not the pathway as described to them but rather it is more like the bridge to nowhere. It really is sad.


It realllly depends on where you want to go. Two can play the game.


----------



## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> It realllly depends on where you want to go. Two can play the game.


Let's see this is a soccer forum so I would assume that he is talking about going somewhere with soccer.  It is clear you have no idea about the difference between the elite boys track and the elite girls track. 

Keep on buying the snake oil..


----------



## Fact

Kicker4Life said:


> Either is ECNL for that matter.


I agree.  That is why I have always felt that the ECNL clubs and now the DA clubs should be awards to clubs based on geography.  Spread them out so the largest percentage of kids have a chance to play.  I don’t care about club records of producing talent. That is all garbage that means they attract the best talent.  Find clubs that have good fields, make sure they have good management and are required to high solid coaches. It pains me to see 3 DA clubs practicing at the Great Park.

At U13 the best player on my son’s team moved to the Midwest for the military. They lived equal distance between the base and the only DA team anywhere near them. His drive was still 2 hours. Needless to say he stopped playing entirely.


----------



## LadiesMan217

Fact said:


> I agree.  That is why I have always felt that the ECNL clubs and now the DA clubs should be awards to clubs based on geography.  Spread them out so the largest percentage of kids have a chance to play.  I don’t care about club records of producing talent. That is all garbage that means they attract the best talent.  Find clubs that have good fields, make sure they have good management and are required to high solid coaches. It pains me to see 3 DA clubs practicing at the Great Park.
> 
> At U13 the best player on my son’s team moved to the Midwest for the military. They lived equal distance between the base and the only DA team anywhere near them. His drive was still 2 hours. Needless to say he stopped playing entirely.


Agree. Why does it bother you that multiple clubs train at a good facility?


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## F@ct

Fact said:


> And what a winner for thinking it is a good idea to hurt kids. DA is not geographically and financially available for everyone.


Typical lies from Fact. Show me where I said I thought it was a good idea. It will happen, though. The DA was created to exert control over the top players. Control their coaching, their environment, their opportunities. That's the whole point of this exercise. I would be shocked if any ECNL kids called into national teams are not told to move to a DA club, unless there just isn't one around.


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## Lambchop

MakeAPlay said:


> Let's see this is a soccer forum so I would assume that he is talking about going somewhere with soccer.  It is clear you have no idea about the difference between the elite boys track and the elite girls track.
> 
> Keep on buying the snake oil..


That is exactly what I meant.  People think their paths are so different but I might add the reality for the boys is that 90% will never amount to much in soccer in the professional world like so many of them think they will.  We know the girls have no future with soccer, at least financial. Maybe the elite boys should play the "game" and use it to get into college so they have a future.  Even for the few who play in the MLS or the even fewer who play in Europe, it will all end,  for some sooner than later.  When it ends they had better have an education to fall back onto.


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## Simisoccerfan

Lambchop said:


> That is exactly what I meant.  People think their paths are so different but I might add the reality for the boys is that 90% will never amount to much in soccer in the professional world like so many of them think they will.  We know the girls have no future with soccer, at least financial. Maybe the elite boys should play the "game" and use it to get into college so they have a future.  Even for the few who play in the MLS or the even fewer who play in Europe, it will all end,  for some sooner than later.  When it ends they had better have an education to fall back onto.


You can always go back to school to get an education after you are no longer able to play soccer.


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## MakeAPlay

Lambchop said:


> That is exactly what I meant.  People think their paths are so different but I might add the reality for the boys is that 90% will never amount to much in soccer in the professional world like so many of them think they will.  We know the girls have no future with soccer, at least financial. Maybe the elite boys should play the "game" and use it to get into college so they have a future.  Even for the few who play in the MLS or the even fewer who play in Europe, it will all end,  for some sooner than later.  When it ends they had better have an education to fall back onto.


You are still missing the point.  Let me spell it out for you slowly.  TRULY ELITE boys are in the DA for a short time and usually are firmly on a pro track.  There are many less college soccer opportunities for boys (there are about 100 more D1 women's programs than men's).  TRULY ELITE girls are on track to go to college and maybe the Alarcorn among Unicorns goes to the full WNT.  Anyone else is making less money than they could using their degrees.  Boys have many more opportunities to be professional and girls have many more college opportunities (thank you Title IX).  Treating boys and girls as if they are identical ignores a million years of evolution and the realities of our own society.

That's it.


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## MakeAPlay

Oh and for those that don't know an Alarcorn is a unicorn with wings (thank you My Little Pony).


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## Lambchop

MakeAPlay said:


> You are still missing the point.  Let me spell it out for you slowly.  TRULY ELITE boys are in the DA for a short time and usually are firmly on a pro track.  There are many less college soccer opportunities for boys (there are about 100 more D1 women's programs than men's).  TRULY ELITE girls are on track to go to college and maybe the Alarcorn among Unicorns goes to the full WNT.  Anyone else is making less money than they could using their degrees.  Boys have many more opportunities to be professional and girls have many more college opportunities (thank you Title IX).  Treating boys and girls as if they are identical ignores a million years of evolution and the realities of our own society.
> 
> That's it.


Of course they are different! If you believe that your future is MLS and you make it, how long will you play?  How many players start college in their thirties?  Just saying, There are over 200 Men's D1 programs out there.  Maybe some of those players should use the "game" to get into college.  Surely there is one school out of the 200 that would fit a player. You were missing my point.  But then I guess so many believe they are the next great player.  More power to them, barring injuries, coaches, politics , money, health, yep there will be a few who make it.


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## Desert Hound

MakeAPlay said:


> Oh and for those that don't know an Alarcorn is a unicorn with wings (thank you My Little Pony).


Well then we should use the correct spelling. Alicorn


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## outside!

Desert Hound said:


> Well then we should use the correct spelling. Alicorn


Wow, multiple Brony sitings.


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## Glen

MakeAPlay said:


> You are still missing the point.  Let me spell it out for you slowly.  TRULY ELITE boys are in the DA for a short time and usually are firmly on a pro track.  There are many less college soccer opportunities for boys (there are about 100 more D1 women's programs than men's).  TRULY ELITE girls are on track to go to college and maybe the Alarcorn among Unicorns goes to the full WNT.  Anyone else is making less money than they could using their degrees.  Boys have many more opportunities to be professional and girls have many more college opportunities (thank you Title IX).  Treating boys and girls as if they are identical ignores a million years of evolution and the realities of our own society.
> 
> That's it.


Don't mean to intrude, but I would offer one caveat to your assessment.  Title IX has certainly provided more opportunities in college for women, but that's not the reason that they have more opportunities than men.  The NCAA arbitrarily limits the number of men's scholarships in soccer, which has really nothing to do with Title IX.  There should be a much bigger discussion and push by schools to get rid of the artificial caps placed on men's sports, particularly soccer.  You get rid of those caps, development (and talent) on the boy's side would look a whole lot different.  

In sum, it's the NCAA fault.


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## davin

Glen said:


> Don't mean to intrude, but I would offer one caveat to your assessment.  Title IX has certainly provided more opportunities in college for women, but that's not the reason that they have more opportunities than men.  The NCAA arbitrarily limits the number of men's scholarships in soccer, which has really nothing to do with Title IX.  There should be a much bigger discussion and push by schools to get rid of the artificial caps placed on men's sports, particularly soccer.  You get rid of those caps, development (and talent) on the boy's side would look a whole lot different.
> 
> In sum, it's the NCAA fault.


Those limits aren’t arbitrary. Men’s and women’s athletic programs must have the equivalent amount of scholarships. With men’s foootball teams taking up 80 scholarships, they have to limit the scholarships available to other men’s sports in order to keep women’s and men’s scholarships equal, which is why men’s soccer teams have a smaller allocation of scholarships by NCAA mandate than women’s soccer.


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## Glen

davin said:


> Those limits aren’t arbitrary. Men’s and women’s athletic programs must have the equivalent amount of scholarships. With men’s foootball teams taking up 80 scholarships, they have to limit the scholarships available to other men’s sports in order to keep women’s and men’s scholarships equal, which is why men’s soccer teams have a smaller allocation of scholarships by NCAA mandate than women’s soccer.


What about schools without football?  Say UCI or UCSB? Why shouldn’t they be able to give out 15 soccer scholarships as long  as they meet Title IX proportionality requirement?  

Football gets 85.  Why 85?

FYI - limits were put in place before Title IX was even enacted.


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## davin

Glen said:


> What about schools without football?  Say UCI or UCSB? Why shouldn’t they be able to give out 15 soccer scholarships as long  as they meet Title IX proportionality requirement?
> 
> Football gets 85.  Why 85?
> 
> FYI - limits were put in place before Title IX was even enacted.


Large schools with large athletic programs, particularly the P5 schools and Notre Dame, with large football programs drive the NCAA. Those rules were put in place for programs like that in mind.
The reason they won’t allow more scholarships for programs that don’t have football is that it wouldn’t be fair for some schools to have more scholarships than others, hence each sport has the same maximum number of scholarships regardless of the school.


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## Simisoccerfan

Glen said:


> Don't mean to intrude, but I would offer one caveat to your assessment.  Title IX has certainly provided more opportunities in college for women, but that's not the reason that they have more opportunities than men.  The NCAA arbitrarily limits the number of men's scholarships in soccer, which has really nothing to do with Title IX.  There should be a much bigger discussion and push by schools to get rid of the artificial caps placed on men's sports, particularly soccer.  You get rid of those caps, development (and talent) on the boy's side would look a whole lot different.
> 
> In sum, it's the NCAA fault.


Read this:  http://www.espn.com/espnw/title-ix/article/7959799/the-silent-enemy-men-sports


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## espola

davin said:


> Those limits aren’t arbitrary. Men’s and women’s athletic programs must have the equivalent amount of scholarships. With men’s foootball teams taking up 80 scholarships, they have to limit the scholarships available to other men’s sports in order to keep women’s and men’s scholarships equal, which is why men’s soccer teams have a smaller allocation of scholarships by NCAA mandate than women’s soccer.


Almost right.  Nothing in Title IX requires identical numbers of scholarships, although that is a simple way to show that the school has made the effort to equalize opportunity.  

No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any education program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.​


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## Simisoccerfan

Simisoccerfan said:


> Read this:  http://www.espn.com/espnw/title-ix/article/7959799/the-silent-enemy-men-sports


The limits have nothing to do with Title IX.  They are in place to protect revenue sports.


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## PLSAP

MakeAPlay said:


> You are still missing the point.  Let me spell it out for you slowly.  TRULY ELITE boys are in the DA for a short time and usually are firmly on a pro track.  There are many less college soccer opportunities for boys (there are about 100 more D1 women's programs than men's).  TRULY ELITE girls are on track to go to college and maybe the Alarcorn among Unicorns goes to the full WNT.  Anyone else is making less money than they could using their degrees.  Boys have many more opportunities to be professional and girls have many more college opportunities (thank you Title IX).  Treating boys and girls as if they are identical ignores a million years of evolution and the realities of our own society.
> 
> That's it.


The Pac12 for boys soccer is really the Pac6, or Pac5 with San Diego State and that's a power5 conference. smh. No work being done to develop either pathway imo, the pro or the college pathway. The opportunity is very limited for boys... Maybe even more so for girls, who have a whole movement going for them to develop the programs in the nation, even if there are "bumps" in the road.


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## Glen

Simisoccerfan said:


> The limits have nothing to do with Title IX.  They are in place to protect revenue sports.


Bingo.


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## Glen

davin said:


> Large schools with large athletic programs, particularly the P5 schools and Notre Dame, with large football programs drive the NCAA. Those rules were put in place for programs like that in mind.
> The reason they won’t allow more scholarships for programs that don’t have football is that it wouldn’t be fair for some schools to have more scholarships than others, hence each sport has the same maximum number of scholarships regardless of the school.


I don't disagree , except for the part that "it wouldn’t be fair for some schools to have more scholarships than others".  That's not true.  The schools still have the same number of scholarships per gender.  The schools can chose to allocate the scholarships however they want per sport.  Schools can chose to maintain their football programs or allocate scholarships to other sports.  It should be choice.  The NCAA shouldn't be putting its thumb on the scale to help a minority of the institutions for the NCAA's bottom line.


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## espola

Glen said:


> I don't disagree , except for the part that "it wouldn’t be fair for some schools to have more scholarships than others".  That's not true.  The schools still have the same number of scholarships per gender.  The schools can chose to allocate the scholarships however they want per sport.  Schools can chose to maintain their football programs or allocate scholarships to other sports.  It should be choice.  The NCAA shouldn't be putting its thumb on the scale to help a minority of the institutions for the NCAA's bottom line.


Nonsense.


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## El Clasico

Glen said:


> I don't disagree , except for the part that "it wouldn’t be fair for some schools to have more scholarships than others".  That's not true.  The schools still have the same number of scholarships per gender.  The schools can chose to allocate the scholarships however they want per sport.  Schools can chose to maintain their football programs or allocate scholarships to other sports.  It should be choice.  The NCAA shouldn't be putting its thumb on the scale to help a minority of the institutions for the NCAA's bottom line.


If the NCAA doesn't worry abut it's bottom line and the revenue sports, would that not affect all sports? How do you provide scholarships to anyone if there is no money for them?


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## espola

El Clasico said:


> If the NCAA doesn't worry abut it's bottom line and the revenue sports, would that not affect all sports? How do you provide scholarships to anyone if there is no money for them?


From the student activity fees.


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## Fact

LadiesMan217 said:


> Agree. Why does it bother you that multiple clubs train at a good facility?


If they were spread out, more girls of a higher caliber  would have an opportunity to participate in DA without the need to drive an hour+.


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## Fact

F@ct said:


> Typical lies from Fact. Show me where I said I thought it was a good idea. It will happen, though. The DA was created to exert control over the top players. Control their coaching, their environment, their opportunities. That's the whole point of this exercise. I would be shocked if any ECNL kids called into national teams are not told to move to a DA club, unless there just isn't one around.


Hum JoeBieber went AWOL in Feb and reappeared on May 3, the same day you created an account. I don’t think that is a coincidence. And he was always using word play just like a slimy attorney that defended the Aneheim Surf false birth certificate issue.

What I find very telling is that you imitate me. You know imitation it the sincerest form of flattery? Please continue. Everyone that knows you is enjoying laughing at you.


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## MakeAPlay

espola said:


> From the student activity fees.


That might work at the large public schools where there are enough students to charge a small fee of a grand or two.  At the smaller private schools that would be a nonstarter as the fee could easily top $10k (think of s Notre Dame, Stanford or Duke).

The schools fudge the numbers when it comes to expenses.  My kid's school weirdly had exactly as many expenses as revenue.  I love the school but that is about as obvious as the name of Cohen's LLC "Essential Consultants."


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## Glen

El Clasico said:


> If the NCAA doesn't worry abut it's bottom line and the revenue sports, would that not affect all sports? How do you provide scholarships to anyone if there is no money for them?


How would it impact money available for sports at UCI, UCSB, or the vast majority of schools and leagues around the country?  They don't have profitable sports programs.  How many sports programs are profitable in the WCC?  Maybe Gonzaga basketball makes money?  In my mind, you are really referring to Alabama and dozen or so schools - as well as the coffers of the NCAA.  Frankly, most non-football sports programs are pretty cheap to run.  So to say that football or basketball is paying for the other programs isn't persuasive IMO-especially since so many non-football schools or small-time football schools have funding for broader sports programs.

And I'm not really calling for no scholarship cap at all.  But most men's sports are capped at less than the amount of field players, while football has scholarships for 8 times the number of field players.  That doesn't make any sense.  If the Pac 12 wants to remain the football league, that's great.  But why not allow the WCC or other leagues to become the great soccer league or flourish in other sports and provide other athletic opportunities?  That's all I'm really getting at.


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## Pitch pop

Is this still a “Girls Development Academy” thread?......uncle!


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## C.A.M.

Interesting article from a writer who critiqued bio banding and then got a call and had a conversation with the originator who happens to be with US Soccer now.   Good read to give background. 

Also,  this has started to happen on the boys side also,  but I didn't read too much on the article I saw giving details. 

U.S. Soccer Bio-Banding revisited with High Performance Director James Bunce via @OnefootballEN. Read it here:
https://1.ftb.al/tW8dtIIZZM


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## Multivitamin

Copy pasted from another forum.

ANOTHER CLUB IS ALL IN!!!!
WOW GDA top teams dropping out.

http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/2018/05/18/concorde-fire-is-all-in-for-the-2018-19-season/


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## Simisoccerfan

Multivitamin said:


> Copy pasted from another forum.
> 
> ANOTHER CLUB IS ALL IN!!!!
> WOW GDA top teams dropping out.
> 
> http://www.eliteclubsnationalleague.com/2018/05/18/concorde-fire-is-all-in-for-the-2018-19-season/


No surprise here.  They are on the board for ECNL and a founding member.  Once again surprised that they even had joined the DA in the first place.


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## Justafan

Simisoccerfan said:


> No surprise here.  They are on the board for ECNL and a founding member.  Once again surprised that they even had joined the DA in the first place.


How many more “no surprises” are out there?


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