# LA County latest measures



## LASoccerMom

Any word from LA County clubs if training is impacted by latest stay at home order?


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## Grace T.

LASoccerMom said:


> Any word from LA County clubs if training is impacted by latest stay at home order?


I think even the pros are trying to figure out if they are impacted. The order doesn’t exempt them either so they’ve been trying to get clarification. Haven’t seen anything forthcoming in even the news either so probably Monday.


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## Grace T.

UCLA and usc are apparently looking for the same clarification per SI.  Making preparations to call their season early if no clarification is forthcoming


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## Kicker4Life

Pandemic Takes Toll On Children's Mental Health
					

Youth depression, anxiety and suicide attempts have been on the rise during the pandemic. School shutdowns keep kids from friends and therapists, leaving social growth up to parents in many cases.




					www.npr.org


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## Dargle

LA County says its restrictions do NOT impact pro/college sports


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1332815228027899905


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## Grace T.

Interesting statement on why LAFC is permitted to train today......

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1333504383150030849


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## Jose has returned

Meanwhile in Japan there have been more suicides than death from COVID this year.  Sad.


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## Soccermaverick

Jose has returned said:


> Meanwhile in Japan there have been more suicides than death from COVID this year.  Sad.


What does Japan’s suicide rate have to do with Club soccer? Nothing!

This type of False Consciousness is dangerous.. it belittles the real problem that a communicable disease is running rampant in this country and people who call themselves adults are making jibes and playing games with people lives...

Fox News talking points using  false consciousness techniques  don’t help control Covid and open businesses back up!


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## Grace T.

Soccermaverick said:


> What does Japan’s suicide rate have to do with Club soccer? Nothing!
> 
> This type of False Consciousness is dangerous.. it belittles the real problem that a communicable disease is running rampant in this country and people who call themselves adults are making jibes and playing games with people lives...
> 
> Fox News talking points using  false consciousness techniques  don’t help control Covid and open businesses back up!


There's plenty of data out there that government interventions aren't doing very much.  They might be helping some, but not very much, and mostly are just pushing back things in time.  In particular, stopping club soccer, college soccer, pro soccer has very little macro impact on trends.  We can't really get into why that is....that would be COVID talk....though where that line is very blury now since despite the recent missives there's been massive amounts of COVID talk in the forums.


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## Grace T.

Soccermaverick said:


> Fox News talking points using  false consciousness techniques  don’t help control Covid and open businesses back up!


p.s. this reference to Fox news is a clear reference to politics and a clear no no under the current forum rules.


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## futboldad1

Grace T. said:


> p.s. this reference to Fox news is a clear reference to politics and a clear no no under the current forum rules.


As is the comment you "liked" from Jose......


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## Socal619x

Jose has returned said:


> Meanwhile in Japan there have been more suicides than death from COVID this year.  Sad.


Yet another fact that most people will not hear about because the media does not want it out there.


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## Grace T.

futboldad1 said:


> As is the comment you "liked" from Jose......



My interpretation of the rules was that opinion was verbotten.  Jose was simply stating a fact which was reported in the press.  Was it over the line?  Maybe but perhaps @Dominic can clarify.  There's been a lot worse going on, even on the thread that asked for no COVID talk, so at this point I'm not really sure at all what that line is.


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## Jose has returned

Soccermaverick said:


> What does Japan’s suicide rate have to do with Club soccer? Nothing!
> 
> This type of False Consciousness is dangerous.. it belittles the real problem that a communicable disease is running rampant in this country and people who call themselves adults are making jibes and playing games with people lives...
> 
> Fox News talking points using  false consciousness techniques  don’t help control Covid and open businesses back up!


Fox news   https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/28/asia/japan-suicide-women-covid-dst-intl-hnk/index.html


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## notintheface

Jose has returned said:


> Fox news   https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/28/asia/japan-suicide-women-covid-dst-intl-hnk/index.html


Way to answer the OP's question.


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## Jose has returned

Soccermaverick said:


> What does Japan’s suicide rate have to do with Club soccer? Nothing!
> 
> This type of False Consciousness is dangerous.. it belittles the real problem that a communicable disease is running rampant in this country and people who call themselves adults are making jibes and playing games with people lives...
> 
> Fox News talking points using  false consciousness techniques  don’t help control Covid and open businesses back up!


Who said I was referring to soccer?  The thread topic is about the "LA County latest measures", they are strict.  Japan has also been strict and has a big suicide crisis now.  That information is beneficial to members of this forum. There is nothing false about suicide and making it sound blasé is dangerous.


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## Soccermaverick

Japan has had this problem for a longer time than the pandemic!









						More people died of suicide in Japan in one month than the entire coronavirus pandemic
					

Japan is struggling under a mental health crisis as the coronavirus pandemic rages on, with more people dying in one month from suicide than from COVID-19 all year long.




					www.foxnews.com
				




American media particularly the Fox story using it as a Covid talking point is disingenuous. You using it in a Club soccer form about LA county’s response is dubious at best.

LA county has done an excellent job trying to keep our kids safe...We don’t need a Fox false consciousness talking point about another countries  internal problem mucking it up. Using media to influence  the “rubes” and giving them justification for forgoing the protections is not SAD...it’s disgusting.










						Japan suicides decline as Covid-19 lockdown causes shift in stress factors
					

April’s 20% drop compared with a year earlier may be the result of delays to start of school year, less commuting and more time with family




					www.theguardian.com


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## Kicker4Life

Soccermaverick said:


> Japan has had this problem for a longer time than the pandemic!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More people died of suicide in Japan in one month than the entire coronavirus pandemic
> 
> 
> Japan is struggling under a mental health crisis as the coronavirus pandemic rages on, with more people dying in one month from suicide than from COVID-19 all year long.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> American media particularly the Fox story using it as a Covid talking point is disingenuous. You using it in a Club soccer form about LA county’s response is dubious at best.
> 
> LA county has done an excellent job trying to keep our kids safe...We don’t need a Fox false consciousness talking point about another countries  internal problem mucking it up. Using media to influence  the “rubes” and giving them justification for forgoing the protections is not SAD...it’s disgusting.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Japan suicides decline as Covid-19 lockdown causes shift in stress factors
> 
> 
> April’s 20% drop compared with a year earlier may be the result of delays to start of school year, less commuting and more time with family
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com


Is it really a Fox New narrative if the same story was run by CNN?


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## Socal619x

Kicker4Life said:


> Is it really a Fox New narrative if the same story was run by CNN?


Good point


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## Soccermaverick

Kicker4Life said:


> Is it really a Fox New narrative if the same story was run by CNN?


Japan’s problem is multifaceted and Covid is only part of the issue.

The  narratives of both  talking points are not journalism...designed to ... influence, co opt, or deceive. Fox’s  piece is chum for the rubes... CNN is trying not to be chum but it is...A terrible story poorly sourced and executed.

And people fall for these stories and say well look at them...At least we don’t have that problem.. Projection ....always projecting !


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## Kicker4Life

Soccermaverick said:


> Japan’s problem is multifaceted and Covid is only part of the issue.
> 
> The  narratives of both  are talking points not journalism...designed to ... influence, co opt, or deceive. Fox’s  piece is chum for the rubes... CNN is trying not to be chum but it is...A terrible story poorly sourced and executed.
> 
> And people fall for these stories and say well look at them...At least we don’t have that problem.. Projection ....always projecting !


So is your official stance that these lockdowns are Not having a negative psychological impact on our children?


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## Soccermaverick

Kicker4Life said:


> So is your official stance that these lockdowns are Not having a negative psychological impact on our children?


Are we really in lockdown?  

A real lockdown ... like the one in Wuhan ... they were chaining doors to apartments.

We have what we have... Sorry about the Cheesecake Factory being closed.

Kids are outside but the risk is tangible and you can’t deny that.

I pray it doesn’t get worse!


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## Socal619x

Soccermaverick said:


> Japan’s problem is multifaceted and Covid is only part of the issue.
> 
> The  narratives of both  talking points are not journalism...designed to ... influence, co opt, or deceive. Fox’s  piece is chum for the rubes... CNN is trying not to be chum but it is...A terrible story poorly sourced and executed.
> 
> And people fall for these stories and say well look at them...At least we don’t have that problem.. Projection ....always projecting !


It is a rising statistic in the US this year, especially among teens. Not to mention ODs. No doubt in my mind what a major contributor has been.


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## Socal619x

Soccermaverick said:


> Are we really in lockdown?
> 
> A real lockdown ... like the one in Wuhan ... they were chaining doors to apartments.
> 
> We have what we have... Sorry about the Cheesecake Factory being closed.
> 
> Kids are outside but the risk is tangible and you can’t deny that.
> 
> I pray it doesn’t get worse!


You must not know parents who have not allowed their children to go anywhere or interact with other children.


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## happy9

Soccermaverick said:


> What does Japan’s suicide rate have to do with Club soccer? Nothing!
> 
> This type of False Consciousness is dangerous.. it belittles the real problem that a communicable disease is running rampant in this country and people who call themselves adults are making jibes and playing games with people lives...
> 
> Fox News talking points using  false consciousness techniques  don’t help control Covid and open businesses back up!


How is it false consciousness?


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## happy9

Soccermaverick said:


> Japan’s problem is multifaceted and Covid is only part of the issue.
> 
> The  narratives of both  talking points are not journalism...designed to ... influence, co opt, or deceive. Fox’s  piece is chum for the rubes... CNN is trying not to be chum but it is...A terrible story poorly sourced and executed.
> 
> And people fall for these stories and say well look at them...At least we don’t have that problem.. Projection ....always projecting !


huh?


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## happy9

Soccermaverick said:


> Are we really in lockdown?
> 
> A real lockdown ... like the one in Wuhan ... they were chaining doors to apartments.
> 
> We have what we have... Sorry about the Cheesecake Factory being closed.
> 
> Kids are outside but the risk is tangible and you can’t deny that.
> 
> I pray it doesn’t get worse!


Using the word lockdown to characterize what happened in Wuhan is silly.  Those people were subjugated.  Not allowing a business owner to operate their business is a lockdown.  Instituting measures that limit your movement to and from certain areas is a lockdown.  Denying health children access to school = lockdown. 

Being welded shut into your home = subjugation.


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## Kicker4Life

Soccermaverick said:


> Are we really in lockdown?
> 
> A real lockdown ... like the one in Wuhan ... they were chaining doors to apartments.
> 
> We have what we have... Sorry about the Cheesecake Factory being closed.
> 
> Kids are outside but the risk is tangible and you can’t deny that.
> 
> I pray it doesn’t get worse!


You didn’t answer the question.  

Outdoor dining was completely acceptable.

Key indicators are better today than they were in late July early August.

Kids may be outside but lack a lot extra cuticular activities and social interaction that things like  in person schooling provide.  Not to mention the many single parents, dual working households and sadly the many unemployed households all trying to navigate this and the stress that comes along with it all. You can’t deny that either.  

You once argued that, “ ... kids do not die “as much” as older adults. 

So in “your world” a kid can get infected and survive.

The kid gets it and will give it to the parents and siblings they must live with... How many parents or grand parents in your view is acceptable for that kid to lose? 1 or 2.”

We know know the risk to kids is zero.  It’s not a death sentence to grandparents (my 79 yr old Mother-in-law was virtually Asymptomatic), so I’ll ask you.....how many grandkids is it acceptable to loose by being hyper cautious?


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## Kicker4Life

LA County Supervisor dines at restaurant hours after voting to ban outdoor dining
					

Protesters gathered outside the home of LA County Supervisor Sheila Kuehl on Tuesday after a FOX 11 report revealed hours after she voted to ban outdoor dining she dined outdoors herself.




					www.foxla.com


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## Grace T.

Soccermaverick said:


> Japan has had this problem for a longer time than the pandemic!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More people died of suicide in Japan in one month than the entire coronavirus pandemic
> 
> 
> Japan is struggling under a mental health crisis as the coronavirus pandemic rages on, with more people dying in one month from suicide than from COVID-19 all year long.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> American media particularly the Fox story using it as a Covid talking point is disingenuous. You using it in a Club soccer form about LA county’s response is dubious at best.
> 
> LA county has done an excellent job trying to keep our kids safe...We don’t need a Fox false consciousness talking point about another countries  internal problem mucking it up. Using media to influence  the “rubes” and giving them justification for forgoing the protections is not SAD...it’s disgusting.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Japan suicides decline as Covid-19 lockdown causes shift in stress factors
> 
> 
> April’s 20% drop compared with a year earlier may be the result of delays to start of school year, less commuting and more time with family
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com


Oh good. Now that we are in the off topic forum.  La county is one of the worst counties in the nation. None of its measures have accomplished anything— being perpetually purple. It has actively engaged in harming children by keeping them out of school despite all the science that says they are not only low risk to themselves but also to others. Even idiot Fauci now has been backpedaling and says schools should be opened.  It closed outdoor dining despite admitting there’s no scientific evidence for spread outdoors.  And now the stupid supervisor has been caught dining outside despite saying outdoor dining is dangerous.  And now it’s stupid stay at home order has so many holes in it it is idiotically trying to regulate the 1 thing they can’t control: private gatherings.  La more than anywhere else has handled this ridiculously.


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## Kicker4Life

Grace T. said:


> Oh good. Now that we are in the off topic forum.  La county is one of the worst counties in the nation. None of its measures have accomplished anything— being perpetually purple. It has actively engaged in harming children by keeping them out of school despite all the science that says they are not only low risk to themselves but also to others. Even idiot Fauci now has been backpedaling and says schools should be opened.  It closed outdoor dining despite admitting there’s no scientific evidence for spread outdoors.  And now the stupid supervisor has been caught dining outside despite saying outdoor dining is dangerous.  And now it’s stupid stay at home order has so many holes in it it is idiotically trying to regulate the 1 thing they can’t control: private gatherings.  La more than anywhere else has handled this ridiculously.


One more question you may have the answer to, our Governor says you must quarantine if you’ve traveled out of state, but I have yet to hear anything about crossing the border.  Is there any measure in place for people crossing back and forth into Mexico?

Truly curious.....


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## Desert Hound

Kicker4Life said:


> One more question you may have the answer to, our Governor says you must quarantine if you’ve traveled out of state, but I have yet to hear anything about crossing the border.  Is there any measure in place for people crossing back and forth into Mexico?
> 
> Truly curious.....


And to add to the idiocy. They/he wants you to quarantine if for instance you go from SF to PHX. But if you take a quick trip from SF to LA, we are all good. 

None of it makes sense.


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## Bubba

Kicker4Life said:


> One more question you may have the answer to, our Governor says you must quarantine if you’ve traveled out of state, but I have yet to hear anything about crossing the border.  Is there any measure in place for people crossing back and forth into Mexico?
> 
> Truly curious.....


Hey don't bring that up , I am constantly crossing the border for my job visiting factories this whole year.


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## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> One more question you may have the answer to, our Governor says you must quarantine if you’ve traveled out of state, but I have yet to hear anything about crossing the border.  Is there any measure in place for people crossing back and forth into Mexico?
> 
> Truly curious.....


seems kind of clear that Mexico is not part of California, and therefore counts as put of state travel.

It really ought to apply to Indian casinos as well.  If they are foreign nations for purposes of public health laws, then people need to quarantine as though they visited any other foreign nation.


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## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> seems kind of clear that Mexico is not part of California, and therefore counts as put of state travel.
> 
> It really ought to apply to Indian casinos as well.  If they are foreign nations for purposes of public health laws, then people need to quarantine as though they visited any other foreign nation.


But have you heard Newsome even mention it?  Seems like out of country would be easier to enforce than out of state and I would suffice to say it affects SoCal more than Norcal.


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## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> And to add to the idiocy. They/he wants you to quarantine if for instance you go from SF to PHX. But if you take a quick trip from SF to LA, we are all good.
> 
> None of it makes sense.


SJ wants you to quarantine no matter where you went.  That makes sense.   Other than the brain dead move to open restaurants, SJ has handled it pretty well.  

Unlike, say, Arizona.  There is a reason Arizona has almost twice as many deaths per capita as CA, and four times as many as SJ or SF.


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## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> seems kind of clear that Mexico is not part of California, and therefore counts as put of state travel.
> 
> It really ought to apply to Indian casinos as well.  If they are foreign nations for purposes of public health laws, then people need to quarantine as though they visited any other foreign nation.


the language is clear the 14 day quarantine applies to other countries.  The issue is the quarantine doesn’t apply if you traveled for essential travel.  Because if you are crossing for nonessential (sports) the virus is dangerous but if you cross for essential (work) the virus knows not to attack you and you won’t be a spreader. Science!!!


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## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> But have you heard Newsome even mention it?  Seems like out of country would be easier to enforce than out of state and I would suffice to say it affects SoCal more than Norcal.


I haven’t heard him mention either Mexico or tribal lands.  Agree it would be nice if he’d deal with it.

But mostly it seems that our problem is internal.  Other than Imperial, I don’t think any county has enough cross border traffic to account for more than a fraction of cases.


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## dad4

Grace T. said:


> the language is clear the 14 day quarantine applies to other countries.  The issue is the quarantine doesn’t apply if you traveled for essential travel.  Because if you are crossing for nonessential (sports) the virus is dangerous but if you cross for essential (work) the virus knows not to attack you and you won’t be a spreader. Science!!!


No.  Some things are important enough to be worth the risk.  Some are not.  

The risk is exactly the same.  But your activity is just not that important, so you don’t get to do it without quarantining.


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## Bubba

dad4 said:


> I haven’t heard him mention either Mexico or tribal lands.  Agree it would be nice if he’d deal with it.
> 
> But mostly it seems that our problem is internal.  Other than Imperial, I don’t think any county has enough cross border traffic to account for more than a fraction of cases.


San Diego has more border crossing than Imperial county, You have SanYsidro , Otay Mesa and the CBX terminal for Tijuana Airport.
Only U.S. citizens and legal residents are allowed to cross as I understand


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## lafalafa

Grace T. said:


> Interesting statement on why LAFC is permitted to train today......
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1333504383150030849


At the same time the LAFC youth academy is not allowed to scrimmage, play, or really train beyond conditioning anywhere.   Some players have decided to move on as a result and there is no season or games planned in any time frame.

What's ok for adults is apparently not good enough for youth who are held to some other standard?


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## Kicker4Life

lafalafa said:


> At the same time the LAFC youth academy is not allowed to scrimmage, play, or really train beyond conditioning anywhere.   Some players have decided to move on as a result and there is no season or games planned in any time frame.
> 
> What's ok for adults is apparently not good enough for youth who are held to some other standard?


Despite being far less affected by the virus.  It’s really sad. 

But to their point, LAFC pro has testing protocols in place to help ensure the safety.


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## Jose has returned

Japan suicides decline as Covid-19 lockdown causes shift in stress factors
					

April’s 20% drop compared with a year earlier may be the result of delays to start of school year, less commuting and more time with family




					www.theguardian.com
				



[/QUOTE]


dad4 said:


> SJ wants you to quarantine no matter where you went.  That makes sense.   Other than the brain dead move to open restaurants, SJ has handled it pretty well.
> 
> Unlike, say, Arizona.  There is a reason Arizona has almost twice as many deaths per capita as CA, and four times as many as SJ or SF.


Curious are there more elderly in SJ a tech hub or AZ a retirement state?  OC register has 50% of deaths are people over 74 years old.   So age is a factor.


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## dad4

Bubba said:


> San Diego has more border crossing than Imperial county, You have SanYsidro , Otay Mesa and the CBX terminal for Tijuana Airport.
> Only U.S. citizens and legal residents are allowed to cross as I understand


I’m not saying SD isn’t a major port of entry.  It is.  But the population is high enough to handle it.    SD is about 1 1/2 times the size of TJ.  When you get cases from TJ, it is still small compared to your overall cases.

 Imperial County is tiny, about 2/3 the size of Chula Vista.   Imperial County is about 1/6 the size of metro Mexicali.  The same pattern there is has a much bigger impact.


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## dad4

Jose has returned said:


> Japan suicides decline as Covid-19 lockdown causes shift in stress factors
> 
> 
> April’s 20% drop compared with a year earlier may be the result of delays to start of school year, less commuting and more time with family
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com



Curious are there more elderly in SJ a tech hub or AZ a retirement state?  OC register has 50% of deaths are people over 74 years old.   So age is a factor.
[/QUOTE]
SJ is older than you’d think.

We force young families to move out of the county by refusing to allow new homes to be built.  As a result, those tech workers can’t afford to live here.  They drive in from Alameda county. 

Older families, who bought in the 1970s and 1980s, are still here.


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## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> No. Some things are important enough to be worth the risk. Some are not.
> 
> The risk is exactly the same. But your activity is just not that important, so you don’t get to do it without quarantining.


You missed the point entirely. 

Whether or not travel is essential or not, why would't essential travel also be subject to quarantine? Does the virus know you are working in an essential activity and leave you alone? 

Either way, the quarantine option is stupid and unworkable. 

You can go to S Lake Tahoe and back (SF lets say) and no quarantine would be needed. You cross that border to the other side and suddenly that makes the world of difference? 

These policies are basically throwing darts at the board. It is interesting how people take them seriously and think they are a good idea. Hey we went to Reno...quarantine up. The rest of our family went to LA but they are good to go. 

Consistency? No. Science? No. 

Feel good measure that somehow appeals to a lot of people? Yes.


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## Grace T.

Desert Hound said:


> You missed the point entirely.
> 
> Whether or not travel is essential or not, why would't essential travel also be subject to quarantine? Does the virus know you are working in an essential activity and leave you alone?
> 
> Either way, the quarantine option is stupid and unworkable.
> 
> You can go to S Lake Tahoe and back (SF lets say) and no quarantine would be needed. You cross that border to the other side and suddenly that makes the world of difference?
> 
> These policies are basically throwing darts at the board. It is interesting how people take them seriously and think they are a good idea. Hey we went to Reno...quarantine up. The rest of our family went to LA but they are good to go.
> 
> Consistency? No. Science? No.
> 
> Feel good measure that somehow appeals to a lot of people? Yes.


The subtext of what dad is saying, and what probably is the true intention of the advisory, is they want to punish you if you are traveling non-essentially, because as you point out, the risk isn't any different if you are crossing for sports, for a job, or to care for a sick relative.  They don't really care if you quarantine for 14 days (much more important that you take a COVID test).....what they care about is stopping you from traveling.


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## Grace T.

Grace T. said:


> The subtext of what dad is saying, and what probably is the true intention of the advisory, is they want to punish you if you are traveling non-essentially, because as you point out, the risk isn't any different if you are crossing for sports, for a job, or to care for a sick relative.  They don't really care if you quarantine for 14 days (much more important that you take a COVID test).....what they care about is stopping you from traveling.


My kids follow these 2 youtubers called Tara and Neil.  She's addicted to coffee and they travel around the world travel blogging, but due to the travel restrictions they spent 2020 touring the US in a van.  They were in the middle of a down the coast trip from Seattle to San Diego when they announced the 14 day quarantine.  They cancelled the downward trip due to the new restrictions, which is ultimately what the government hoped they'd do.  It didn't really care if they actually 14 day quarantined, because otherwise they could have just taken a COVID test....it just wanted them to stop their trip....being public figures and knowing they'd be raked over the coals if they ignored it, they chose to obey.


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## MacDre

Kicker4Life said:


> One more question you may have the answer to, our Governor says you must quarantine if you’ve traveled out of state, but I have yet to hear anything about crossing the border.  Is there any measure in place for people crossing back and forth into Mexico?
> 
> Truly curious.....


Stop throwing shade...Hater.


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## Kicker4Life

MacDre said:


> Stop throwing shade...Hater.


Is it really throwing shade to ask a legit question about crossing state lines even if that line is a National border?  

Now you’re just looking for things...you’re better than that!


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## 46n2

the real question is does anyone on here know E40?  One of the most unique styles in the game


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## dad4

Grace T. said:


> The subtext of what dad is saying, and what probably is the true intention of the advisory, is they want to punish you if you are traveling non-essentially, because as you point out, the risk isn't any different if you are crossing for sports, for a job, or to care for a sick relative.  They don't really care if you quarantine for 14 days (much more important that you take a COVID test).....what they care about is stopping you from traveling.


I can provide my own subtext, thanks.

A better description is that they want us to stop infecting each other.

The easy way to do that is to avoid travel.  The hard way is to quarantine before and after you travel.  

Both ways work.  And you can still take your pick.  

A few jobs are important enough to allow extra infections as part of doing the job.  "Youth soccer player" is not one of those jobs.  Sorry.


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## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> A few jobs are important enough to allow extra infections as part of doing the job.  "Youth soccer player" is not one of those jobs.  Sorry.


that’s not what it says.  It says all jobs and list of other stuff. So dog walker, candy maker, or tattoo artist > youth soccer (or Tara and Neil’s little videos). Not some jobs. I get your point but you don’t do it any favors by misrepresenting things.

funny too how you are defending this rule despite that you were so eager to go to a tournament yourself. It was directed at you in a way.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> that’s not what it says.  It says all jobs and list of other stuff. So dog walker, candy maker, or tattoo artist > youth soccer (or Tara and Neil’s little videos). Not some jobs. I get your point but you don’t do it any favors by misrepresenting things.
> 
> funny too how you are defending this rule despite that you were so eager to go to a tournament yourself. It was directed at you in a way.


It was absolutely directed at me.

My original plan was to quarantine, so all it really did was give me guidance on how long I should play hermit.  

14 days.   A little longer than I had planned, but not a big deal.  Had we gone, I would have done my 2 weeks without complaint.


----------



## watfly

Kicker4Life said:


> But have you heard Newsome even mention it?  Seems like out of country would be easier to enforce than out of state and I would suffice to say it affects SoCal more than Norcal.


I know we're all being tongue and cheek but that would be near political suicide for him to mention it.  Is there really anyone other than the hard core Kool Aid guzzlers that believe the majority of the restrictions are science based?

Although the news would never report it, the hospitals in SD that came closest to capacity during July were in the South Bay and were overrun by Covid patients from south of the border (according to the regional medical director of a major healthcare organization).


----------



## MacDre

watfly said:


> I know we're all being tongue and cheek but that would be near political suicide for him to mention it.  Is there really anyone other than the hard core Kool Aid guzzlers that believe the majority of the restrictions are science based?
> 
> Although the news would never report it, the hospitals in SD that came closest to capacity during July were in the South Bay and were overrun by Covid patients from south of the border (according to the regional medical director of a major healthcare organization).


Dear Colleagues,



I hope everyone had a nice and safe Thanksgiving. Aimee has invited me to share a COVID-19 Update this week on testing capabilities and vaccine distribution planning.



*First, Solano County and NorthBay by the Numbers:*


Solano County’s latest data shows a 7-day testing positivity rate of 12.3. This is double compared to October. There have been several days in recent weeks with daily reported cases above 150. As a comparison, the summer’s highest daily case peak was 129 on July 8. County hospitalizations were reported yesterday at 63, approximately triple compared to a month ago.
Solano has exceeded 10,000 cases to date.
Our NBMC COVID inpatient census this morning is 23 with 9 requiring an ICU level of care. Our inpatient COVID volume has been gradually trending up just not to the magnitude we are seeing in the county and state. We anticipate a continued rise in hospitalizations in the coming weeks following the multi-generational holiday gatherings. We will monitor this closely and are ready to activate our surge policy as necessary.
Our urgent care centers continue to see very high utilization with 30 positive tests received over the four-day holiday weekend. Our new Center Primary Care overflow drive-thru testing sites have been in place for several days. As of yesterday, we tested 17 patients with 4 positive cases.
The Solano numbers are sobering, reflecting the state and national trends of late. While NorthBay’s census is high in inpatient and ambulatory settings, you are all doing great work to manage throughput well with minimal need for Code Capacity discussions or use of our surge plan.



*Where Are We With Testing?*

Throughout the pandemic, our highest priority has been staff safety. If we cannot protect our NorthBay family, we cannot care for patients and our community. Testing is essential.



Our lab and supply chain leadership dedicate significant resources researching and securing maximum testing capability. These efforts sometimes result in quick changes, accompanied by confusing emails and complex algorithms.



This may be more than you want to know, but here is – in detail – a review of the COVID tests we have available now, how we are using them and the stability of our supply.



*Hospital-based PCR tests:* We are fortunate to have two types of PCR tests available in our hospital labs - BioFire and Genmark. These are high-accuracy nasopharyngeal swabs that can detect small viral loads. They are close in accuracy to the best testing available at Quest and through our county lab, but with the benefit of providing results within hours, not days. A high-sensitivity test is a mixed blessing. It picks up virus particles late in the lifecycle of the disease when a patient may no longer be contagious. However, it can also turn positive early on when a patient is just starting to be contagious, possibly before symptoms have started. Our supply of these tests is difficult to maintain because of high demand across the country. Our allocation can often be redirected to other states suffering higher rates. With a variability in supply, it is a challenge to use these tests as part of a standardized plan. Often we have no confirmation when the next delivery will arrive. We order a BioFire or Genmark test on a case-by-case basis when there is concern that our other screening tests are incorrect, especially when the patient is asymptomatic or symptoms have been present for longer than a week.



*Antigen tests:* These are our most widely used rapid nasal swab tests. They are used in our hospital labs, urgent care and at our primary care curbside testing sites (only when Urgent Care is at capacity). These are similar to rapid flu swabs we have used for years. We use two brands – Abbott BinaxNOW and the BD Veritor. These have moderate accuracy, better than some tests but not as sensitive as our PCR options. We believe it has accuracy where it counts, picking up those at risk for transmission, especially patients with symptoms. We currently use these tests as a first screen for all admissions. They are also being used for symptomatic patients in our clinics and in our staff-testing algorithm.



*Abbott ID NOW:* This is another rapid nasal swab test by Abbott, but it uses a different technology to measure the virus. It is a bit controversial because some independent studies early in the pandemic showed low sensitivity. Since then, studies have shown mixed results. Similar to our discussion about antigen tests, we feel this test has value in identifying those that are contagious. We are currently using the Abbott ID NOW for asymptomatic staff members that have a confirmed exposure through our Command Center contract tracing program.



In summary, we are constantly monitoring and researching options to provide testing to our patients and staff. Unfortunately, despite our efforts, test supplies continue to be a scarce resource. We will continue to provide as much testing capacity as possible. Our current staff testing program includes same day results for those that are symptomatic and/or have a confirmed exposure. We are making every effort to expand this program to include routine screening tests for as many staff as possible.



*Are We Getting Vaccine Soon?*

The answer likely is yes. Gov. Newsom last Monday said health care workers will be offered the vaccines first. The Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP) is voting today on this very topic. At NorthBay, we have a multi-disciplinary task force, led by our outstanding pharmacy leadership, spearheading our vaccine implementation plan. We are working with the county and CDPH learning everything we can about these vaccines. We have submitted required applications to the state. Freezers are en route. We understand every step of implementation, from shipping to injection.



What we do not know is exactly how many doses we will receive and exactly which NorthBay health care staff will be offered the vaccine during the first phase. Of course, your decision to receive the vaccine will be *voluntary*.



We remain supportive and cautiously optimistic, both in the effectiveness and safety of these new mRNA vaccines (Pfizer, Moderna for now) and the ability for these companies and our government to distribute them quickly. Data coming from these companies and reported through the media are encouraging. Pfizer reported a 95% effective rate with no serious adverse effects thus far in a Phase 3 trial of approximately 43,000 participants. The most common side effects were headache (2.0%) and fatigue (3.8%). And, Moderna just yesterday released fairly similar data.



We do not rely on company reports or media summaries to safely implement new treatments and vaccines. We need to see the data ourselves. We hope independent analysis from the FDA and California will be as encouraging. We anticipate their report to be available around Dec. 10 when the Pfizer vaccine is reviewed for an Emergency Use Authorization (EUA). When this happens, you should expect a robust summary from us discussing the effectiveness, side effects and the implementation plan moving forward.



*Summary*

As we approach one year from the outbreak of this pandemic, our priority remains to keep you safe so we are able to care for our community. Be assured:

· We will continue to monitor closely our current testing capabilities and research new options.

· We are prepared to implement a COVID vaccine program when a safe and effective option is available.

We have effective preventive measures at our disposal today that do not require any safety reviews or even a needle. Mask wearing, distancing and hand hygiene are very effective. Even if you are one of the unfortunate ones who contract COVID while wearing a mask, UCSF data have shown you have a lower risk of experiencing severe illness or any symptoms at all. These interventions, while unfortunately remaining controversial in some areas of our country are very effective at keeping you safe.



As Aimee eloquently wrote last week, at NorthBay we are most concerned about common areas. We know from Mayo Clinic and others that transmission within the organization, while rare, are mostly from break rooms. Please be diligent in your mask wearing and distancing. Do not eat together. Keep the mask up and we will get through this together.



Thank you for setting the example within the organization and within our community.


----------



## watfly

MacDre said:


> Dear Colleagues,
> 
> 
> 
> I hope everyone had a nice and safe Thanksgiving. Aimee has invited me to share a COVID-19 Update this week on testing capabilities and vaccine distribution planning.
> 
> 
> 
> *First, Solano County and NorthBay by the Numbers:*
> 
> 
> Solano County’s latest data shows a 7-day testing positivity rate of 12.3. This is double compared to October. There have been several days in recent weeks with daily reported cases above 150. As a comparison, the summer’s highest daily case peak was 129 on July 8. County hospitalizations were reported yesterday at 63, approximately triple compared to a month ago.
> Solano has exceeded 10,000 cases to date.
> Our NBMC COVID inpatient census this morning is 23 with 9 requiring an ICU level of care. Our inpatient COVID volume has been gradually trending up just not to the magnitude we are seeing in the county and state. We anticipate a continued rise in hospitalizations in the coming weeks following the multi-generational holiday gatherings. We will monitor this closely and are ready to activate our surge policy as necessary.
> Our urgent care centers continue to see very high utilization with 30 positive tests received over the four-day holiday weekend. Our new Center Primary Care overflow drive-thru testing sites have been in place for several days. As of yesterday, we tested 17 patients with 4 positive cases.
> The Solano numbers are sobering, reflecting the state and national trends of late. While NorthBay’s census is high in inpatient and ambulatory settings, you are all doing great work to manage throughput well with minimal need for Code Capacity discussions or use of our surge plan.
> 
> 
> 
> *Where Are We With Testing?*
> 
> Throughout the pandemic, our highest priority has been staff safety. If we cannot protect our NorthBay family, we cannot care for patients and our community. Testing is essential.
> 
> 
> 
> Our lab and supply chain leadership dedicate significant resources researching and securing maximum testing capability. These efforts sometimes result in quick changes, accompanied by confusing emails and complex algorithms.
> 
> 
> 
> This may be more than you want to know, but here is – in detail – a review of the COVID tests we have available now, how we are using them and the stability of our supply.
> 
> 
> 
> *Hospital-based PCR tests:* We are fortunate to have two types of PCR tests available in our hospital labs - BioFire and Genmark. These are high-accuracy nasopharyngeal swabs that can detect small viral loads. They are close in accuracy to the best testing available at Quest and through our county lab, but with the benefit of providing results within hours, not days. A high-sensitivity test is a mixed blessing. It picks up virus particles late in the lifecycle of the disease when a patient may no longer be contagious. However, it can also turn positive early on when a patient is just starting to be contagious, possibly before symptoms have started. Our supply of these tests is difficult to maintain because of high demand across the country. Our allocation can often be redirected to other states suffering higher rates. With a variability in supply, it is a challenge to use these tests as part of a standardized plan. Often we have no confirmation when the next delivery will arrive. We order a BioFire or Genmark test on a case-by-case basis when there is concern that our other screening tests are incorrect, especially when the patient is asymptomatic or symptoms have been present for longer than a week.
> 
> 
> 
> *Antigen tests:* These are our most widely used rapid nasal swab tests. They are used in our hospital labs, urgent care and at our primary care curbside testing sites (only when Urgent Care is at capacity). These are similar to rapid flu swabs we have used for years. We use two brands – Abbott BinaxNOW and the BD Veritor. These have moderate accuracy, better than some tests but not as sensitive as our PCR options. We believe it has accuracy where it counts, picking up those at risk for transmission, especially patients with symptoms. We currently use these tests as a first screen for all admissions. They are also being used for symptomatic patients in our clinics and in our staff-testing algorithm.
> 
> 
> 
> *Abbott ID NOW:* This is another rapid nasal swab test by Abbott, but it uses a different technology to measure the virus. It is a bit controversial because some independent studies early in the pandemic showed low sensitivity. Since then, studies have shown mixed results. Similar to our discussion about antigen tests, we feel this test has value in identifying those that are contagious. We are currently using the Abbott ID NOW for asymptomatic staff members that have a confirmed exposure through our Command Center contract tracing program.
> 
> 
> 
> In summary, we are constantly monitoring and researching options to provide testing to our patients and staff. Unfortunately, despite our efforts, test supplies continue to be a scarce resource. We will continue to provide as much testing capacity as possible. Our current staff testing program includes same day results for those that are symptomatic and/or have a confirmed exposure. We are making every effort to expand this program to include routine screening tests for as many staff as possible.
> 
> 
> 
> *Are We Getting Vaccine Soon?*
> 
> The answer likely is yes. Gov. Newsom last Monday said health care workers will be offered the vaccines first. The Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP) is voting today on this very topic. At NorthBay, we have a multi-disciplinary task force, led by our outstanding pharmacy leadership, spearheading our vaccine implementation plan. We are working with the county and CDPH learning everything we can about these vaccines. We have submitted required applications to the state. Freezers are en route. We understand every step of implementation, from shipping to injection.
> 
> 
> 
> What we do not know is exactly how many doses we will receive and exactly which NorthBay health care staff will be offered the vaccine during the first phase. Of course, your decision to receive the vaccine will be *voluntary*.
> 
> 
> 
> We remain supportive and cautiously optimistic, both in the effectiveness and safety of these new mRNA vaccines (Pfizer, Moderna for now) and the ability for these companies and our government to distribute them quickly. Data coming from these companies and reported through the media are encouraging. Pfizer reported a 95% effective rate with no serious adverse effects thus far in a Phase 3 trial of approximately 43,000 participants. The most common side effects were headache (2.0%) and fatigue (3.8%). And, Moderna just yesterday released fairly similar data.
> 
> 
> 
> We do not rely on company reports or media summaries to safely implement new treatments and vaccines. We need to see the data ourselves. We hope independent analysis from the FDA and California will be as encouraging. We anticipate their report to be available around Dec. 10 when the Pfizer vaccine is reviewed for an Emergency Use Authorization (EUA). When this happens, you should expect a robust summary from us discussing the effectiveness, side effects and the implementation plan moving forward.
> 
> 
> 
> *Summary*
> 
> As we approach one year from the outbreak of this pandemic, our priority remains to keep you safe so we are able to care for our community. Be assured:
> 
> · We will continue to monitor closely our current testing capabilities and research new options.
> 
> · We are prepared to implement a COVID vaccine program when a safe and effective option is available.
> 
> We have effective preventive measures at our disposal today that do not require any safety reviews or even a needle. Mask wearing, distancing and hand hygiene are very effective. Even if you are one of the unfortunate ones who contract COVID while wearing a mask, UCSF data have shown you have a lower risk of experiencing severe illness or any symptoms at all. These interventions, while unfortunately remaining controversial in some areas of our country are very effective at keeping you safe.
> 
> 
> 
> As Aimee eloquently wrote last week, at NorthBay we are most concerned about common areas. We know from Mayo Clinic and others that transmission within the organization, while rare, are mostly from break rooms. Please be diligent in your mask wearing and distancing. Do not eat together. Keep the mask up and we will get through this together.
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for setting the example within the organization and within our community.


Only second hand reports, but I've heard some encouraging things about the ability to distribute the vaccine.  It sounds like the hospitals are prepared and ready to roll.  People just have to be willing to get it.  I personally have zero concerns about getting a vaccine although given a choice I'd take the Moderna.


----------



## 46n2

Im not a vaccine person , but this vaccine is the only one Id consider to possible help the spread.  I had covid already with minor symptoms , but im over this mindset of its not real or its not bad ( sorry to say I believe one of these strongly) .
If i have to get a shot to help destroy or curb a vaccine so be it .


----------



## Bruddah IZ

If I was a vaccine making company, I would introduce the vaccine right around the time when the numbers have already been coming down.  Like now.


----------



## paytoplay

Coming down


----------

