# Kangaroo Leather Ban



## Monkey (Dec 5, 2017)

Does anyone know the current state of the kangaroo leather ban in California?  Does it look like there might be another moratorium or is this ban now finally set in place? I cannot find any current information on it and would like to get a new pair of cleats soon.


----------



## Not_that_Serious (Dec 6, 2017)

find outlets online that dont care where they ship shoes too.


----------



## younothat (Dec 6, 2017)

Monkey said:


> Does anyone know the current state of the kangaroo leather ban in California?  Does it look like there might be another moratorium or is this ban now finally set in place? I cannot find any current information on it and would like to get a new pair of cleats soon.


Ban is on,  Assembly Bill 1188 passed in May and they is no sunset date for a moratorium
http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billPdf.xhtml?bill_id=201720180AB1188

Some places like ebay or certain out of state e-sellers will sell and ship to CA.


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 6, 2017)

Monkey said:


> Does anyone know the current state of the kangaroo leather ban in California?  Does it look like there might be another moratorium or is this ban now finally set in place? I cannot find any current information on it and would like to get a new pair of cleats soon.


 Just purchase a pair from out of state, however do not try to buy on Amazon. They adhere to CA policy. I was able to find a pair of turfs for myself, but could not buy the same pair on Amazon.


----------



## Not_that_Serious (Dec 6, 2017)

kangaroo ban is pretty absurd. the only people who understand the ban is whomever came up with the idea. guess someone thought they are too cute to be used to make durable, comfortable shoes. guess cows arent that cute?


----------



## SocalPapa (Dec 6, 2017)

It's a shame California is forcing us to use cow leather over kangaroo.  I looked into this ban when my daughter had wanted to replace her old cleats.  As best I can tell it's commercial protectionism.  Kangaroo are super-abundant.  The four species of traded Australian kangaroo at issue are approaching a population of 50 million (about double the number of cattle there) and growing.  If anything, Australia has been struggling to manage their overpopulation:  http://www.nola.com/outdoors/index.ssf/2017/09/australias_kangaroo_overpopula.html


----------



## Not_that_Serious (Dec 6, 2017)

SocalPapa said:


> It's a shame California is forcing us to use cow leather over kangaroo.  I looked into this ban when my daughter had wanted to replace her old cleats.  As best I can tell it's commercial protectionism.  Kangaroo are super-abundant.  The four species of traded Australian kangaroo at issue are approaching a population of 50 million (about double the number of cattle there) and growing.  If anything, Australia has been struggling to manage their overpopulation:  http://www.nola.com/outdoors/index.ssf/2017/09/australias_kangaroo_overpopula.html


yeah. the aussie gov and people are told to kill kangaroos. they are like rabbits, but worse. so they put the roos to good use as food and products. the ban in Cali doesnt hurt the manufacturers since the gov pushed/helped them to get more product to other markets. The Aussie gov lobbies Cali to stop over symbolism. They dont want Cali to put out a false narrative. Like Cali gov/lawmakers would ever do that.


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 6, 2017)

SocalPapa said:


> It's a shame California is forcing us to use cow leather over kangaroo.  I looked into this ban when my daughter had wanted to replace her old cleats.  As best I can tell it's commercial protectionism.  Kangaroo are super-abundant.  The four species of traded Australian kangaroo at issue are approaching a population of 50 million (about double the number of cattle there) and growing.  If anything, Australia has been struggling to manage their overpopulation:  http://www.nola.com/outdoors/index.ssf/2017/09/australias_kangaroo_overpopula.html


Nokona makes some of their high-end baseball gloves out of Kangaroo too.


----------



## Fact (Dec 6, 2017)

They are a nuisance to farmers in Australia and the population of the species used for leather and food is out of control.  Was there this summer and they don't care about California's on again off again ban.  My relatives love kangaroo meat but it is too "gamey" tasting for me.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati (Dec 6, 2017)

Totally understandable. 

When was the last time you saw a Kangaroo in California?


----------



## Lambchop (Dec 6, 2017)

Not_that_Serious said:


> kangaroo ban is pretty absurd. the only people who understand the ban is whomever came up with the idea. guess someone thought they are too cute to be used to make durable, comfortable shoes. guess cows arent that cute?


----------



## Lambchop (Dec 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> They are a nuisance to farmers in Australia and the population of the species used for leather and food is out of control.  Was there this summer and they don't care about California's on again off again ban.  My relatives love kangaroo meat but it is too "gamey" tasting for me.


Agree, if you have ever lived in Australia or spent a significant amount of time there you know that kangaroos are like rats, they are everywhere.  Whoever introduced the bill is an idiot!


----------



## LBSoccer (Dec 6, 2017)

There are stores that sell them. We purchased several pairs some stores said they were illegal others said yeah we have them in stock lol


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 6, 2017)

LBSoccer said:


> There are stores that sell them. We purchased several pairs some stores said they were illegal others said yeah we have them in stock lol


Circumventing the system to get customers what they want! Agree there are stores that still have Kangaroo boots. If you find a pair of Copa's made of Kangaroo your golden.


----------



## Sheriff Joe (Dec 6, 2017)

Fact said:


> They are a nuisance to farmers in Australia and the population of the species used for leather and food is out of control.  Was there this summer and they don't care about California's on again off again ban.  My relatives love kangaroo meat but it is too "gamey" tasting for me.


It's funny, sanctuary state Ca doesn't mind if illegal aliens kill Americans but don't kill a kangaroo for shoes.
Is that about right?


----------



## coachrefparent (Dec 6, 2017)

younothat said:


> Ban is on,  Assembly Bill 1188 passed in May and they is no sunset date for a moratorium
> http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billPdf.xhtml?bill_id=201720180AB1188
> 
> Some places like ebay or certain out of state e-sellers will sell and ship to CA.


The link has nothing to do with kangaroos.


----------



## Mystery Train (Dec 6, 2017)

LBSoccer said:


> There are stores that sell them. We purchased several pairs some stores said they were illegal others said yeah we have them in stock lol


Us too.  There's a ban in place, but like a lot of things in CA, it comes down to having the resources to enforce it.  And believe me, nobody is on the streets checking soccer boots inventory.    Big chain stores will abide by it because that's how corporations operate, and any enforcement of such a ban would start with them anyway.  We bought a pair last year from a small mom & pop soccer store.  When I asked them if they would stop carrying them because of the ban, the owner was like, "Hell no.  They're our best seller."  One win for the small guys.


----------



## LBSoccer (Dec 6, 2017)

Mystery Train said:


> Us too.  There's a ban in place, but like a lot of things in CA, it comes down to having the resources to enforce it.  And believe me, nobody is on the streets checking soccer boots inventory.    Big chain stores will abide by it because that's how corporations operate, and any enforcement of such a ban would start with them anyway.  We bought a pair last year from a small mom & pop soccer store.  When I asked them if they would stop carrying them because of the ban, the owner was like, "Hell no.  They're our best seller."  One win for the small guys.


Exactly. I wasn't aware they were illegal and my daughter loves these shoes. Hers tore and she tried to buy them in san francisco and was told no at every shop stating they were illegal. Came back to our local shops in SoCal and bought her a replacement and a replacement for the replacement. Apparently The ban doesn't exist in So Cal


----------



## LBSoccer (Dec 6, 2017)

LASTMAN14 said:


> Circumventing the system to get customers what they want! Agree there are stores that still have Kangaroo boots. If you find a pair of Copa's made of Kangaroo your golden.


She prefers the Tiempos over the Copas.


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 6, 2017)

LBSoccer said:


> She prefers the Tiempos over the Copas.


She's a Nike girl! My kids wear them too.


----------



## Deadpoolscores! (Dec 6, 2017)

All I can say is Dang liberals..they complain about everything. I can hardly wait when it back fires on them.


----------



## Josep (Dec 6, 2017)

Next time your kid plays in Vegas or Arizona pick up a pair.


----------



## Surfref (Dec 6, 2017)

Having been to Australia numerous times, I can tell you that kangaroos are everywhere and a danger to drivers.  We even saw kangaroos in a park in downtown Sydney.  F’ing snowflakes don’t want to hurt the cute kangaroos.


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 6, 2017)

In Australia they take a census on the number of Kangaroos.  There are roughly 25 million Kangaroos in Australia which is slightly higher than their population. Having a census for them only made me think there really is an issue.


----------



## Monkey (Dec 6, 2017)

Thanks for the info. I guess it is just wishful thinking that there will be another moretorium.   Not many mom and pop stores in North San Diego. I guess I'll try LA.


----------



## CopaMundial (Dec 6, 2017)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Copa 17.1 is k leather and sold locally. My kiddo loves them. We got ours at soccerloco about 6 months ago. Are they not selling them any more?


----------



## coachrefparent (Dec 6, 2017)

CopaMundial said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Copa 17.1 is k leather and sold locally. My kiddo loves them. We got ours at soccerloco about 6 months ago. Are they not selling them any more?


Its against the law to sell them and you post that SL is selling them? Do you hate SL? Do you hate the opportunity to buy them?


----------



## CopaMundial (Dec 6, 2017)

coachrefparent said:


> Its against the law to sell them and you post that SL is selling them? Do you hate SL? Do you hate the opportunity to buy them?


No, but if others want them, get them now. Because we bought two pair. So I am only suggesting....wouldn't you want to know? Maybe it was an error or some sort of fluke, but take advantage when you can. SL may not even be aware. Come on, have you ever talked to those guys that work there.


----------



## Josep (Dec 6, 2017)

To my knowledge SL hasn’t been selling them
For more than a year.  It’s quite possible the sold you something other than that.  

It isn’t a salesperson that will hold those back.  They’ve been held back on the corporate level.


----------



## CopaMundial (Dec 6, 2017)

Josep said:


> To my knowledge SL hasn’t been selling them
> For more than a year.  It’s quite possible the sold you something other than that.
> 
> It isn’t a salesperson that will hold those back.  They’ve been held back on the corporate level.


To my knowledge, they are full on 17.1 and say they are KLeather. Copa 17.1 are not copa mundial, but the updated version. maybe a mistake, who knows, but it happened. Other option, try ebay and trust your luck!


----------



## SocalPapa (Dec 7, 2017)

Deadpoolscores! said:


> All I can say is Dang liberals..they complain about everything. I can hardly wait when it back fires on them.


The ban was put in place by Governor Reagan.  The legislature approved a moratorium on the ban in 2007, and extended it in 2010, but it expired in 2016.  The leading proponent for extending the moratorium was a Democratic assemblyman from So Cal (who specifically highlighted the importance of kangaroo leather in soccer) but the bill died, it seems largely because of opposition to the "gut and amend" procedure he used to introduce the bill.  When the moratorium was extended in 2010 there were a fair number of Republicans who voted against the extension (my guess to protect the California cattle industry).  It seems there's an odd alignment of interests for and against the ban.


----------



## Mystery Train (Dec 7, 2017)

SocalPapa said:


> The ban was put in place by Governor Reagan.


LOL at everyone blaming "snowflakes" when it was done on Saint Ron's watch.


----------



## SoCal GK mom (Dec 7, 2017)

Monkey said:


> Does anyone know the current state of the kangaroo leather ban in California?  Does it look like there might be another moratorium or is this ban now finally set in place? I cannot find any current information on it and would like to get a new pair of cleats soon.


The store that sells our team uniforms stocks k-leather cleats. I've also had no problem purchasing them on Nike.com and having them shipped to CA.


----------



## mirage (Dec 7, 2017)

Josep said:


> Next time your kid plays in Vegas or Arizona pick up a pair.


So Roo cleats and fireworks....

Check!


----------



## mirage (Dec 7, 2017)

Surfref said:


> Having been to Australia numerous times, I can tell you that kangaroos are everywhere and a danger to drivers....


The last time I was in Australia, I drove from Sydney to Brisbane on the backroads (roughly bit further than LA to SF distance)

There were signs posted everywhere every few miles, saying if you hit a roo, bring it to a vet and they will take care of them - no questions asked.

I'm surprised that you guys are talking about this.  Don't you all just buy $300 synthetic Nike flyknit cleats that rip every 4~5 months and replace.  Right?


----------



## Not_that_Serious (Dec 7, 2017)

SocalPapa said:


> The ban was put in place by Governor Reagan.  The legislature approved a moratorium on the ban in 2007, and extended it in 2010, but it expired in 2016.  The leading proponent for extending the moratorium was a Democratic assemblyman from So Cal (who specifically highlighted the importance of kangaroo leather in soccer) but the bill died, it seems largely because of opposition to the "gut and amend" procedure he used to introduce the bill.  When the moratorium was extended in 2010 there were a fair number of Republicans who voted against the extension (my guess to protect the California cattle industry).  It seems there's an odd alignment of interests for and against the ban.


yes because we all know the high demand for roo shoes outside of soccer. also, im sure, all the big soccer shoe manufacturers are buying the california hides in order to replace roo leather demand. if that was their thinking. it would fit in perfectly with the other brain dead people running the state


----------



## Threeke (Dec 7, 2017)

Josep said:


> To my knowledge SL hasn’t been selling them
> For more than a year.  It’s quite possible the sold you something other than that.
> 
> It isn’t a salesperson that will hold those back.  They’ve been held back on the corporate level.


Found this gem: https://twitter.com/HumaneSociety/status/684404224294281216

Looks like soccerloco was an early adopter for dropping k-leather.


----------



## Surfref (Dec 7, 2017)

mirage said:


> The last time I was in Australia, I drove from Sydney to Brisbane on the backroads (roughly bit further than LA to SF distance)
> 
> There were signs posted everywhere every few miles, saying if you hit a roo, bring it to a vet and they will take care of them - no questions asked.
> 
> I'm surprised that you guys are talking about this.  Don't you all just buy $300 synthetic Nike flyknit cleats that rip every 4~5 months and replace.  Right?


My daughter wears the top of the line Nike Tiempos which have kangaroo leather.  We have a friend who travels to Toronto on a regular basis.  He gets her cleats in Toronto since they are about $80 cheaper.  We are in Cabo this week and picked her up a new pair for $100 cheaper than we would pay in San Diego.  There are ways to get the kangaroo leather cleats, you just have to be inventive and use your resources.


----------



## mirage (Dec 7, 2017)

Surfref said:


> ......There are ways to get the kangaroo leather cleats, you just have to be inventive and use your resources.


Or not care about them at all....


----------



## Soccer Cat (Dec 7, 2017)

Does someone know of a website that will ship these to California?  I’ve been trying and can’t get them.


----------



## SoCal GK mom (Dec 7, 2017)

K-leather comes from farmed kangaroos just like calf's leather comes from farmed cows. I really don't understand why


mirage said:


> Or not care about them at all....


Nike.com


----------



## LBSoccer (Dec 8, 2017)

Soccer Cat said:


> Does someone know of a website that will ship these to California?  I’ve been trying and can’t get them.





Monkey said:


> Thanks for the info. I guess it is just wishful thinking that there will be another moretorium.   Not many mom and pop stores in North San Diego. I guess I'll try LA.


In LA county try Niky's Sports and Soccer Central. They both have multiple locations.


----------



## MWN (Dec 8, 2017)

To the extent you are buying kangaroo leather products from a California reseller, that reseller is committing a misdemeanor.  

Appreciate that California law doesn't band the possession or importation of kangaroo leather shoes for personal use.  Therefore, a legal means of obtaining kangaroo leather shoes without making a retail purchase out of state is to use a "PARCEL FORWARDING SERVICE."  There are both commercial services (google the capitalized search term in the previous sentence) or use grandma, aunts/uncles, college buddies, or friends living outside California ... just make sure they are not PETA sympathizers.

If you use a parcel forwarding service (e.g. amforward.com) pick one that operates their delivery warehouse in a State that doesn't charge sales tax, such as Oregon.  Often times, the savings of not paying sales tax is greater than the reship charge (depending on the value of the item).  Sales tax on a $200 pair of cleats is about $16, so paying the $8 reshipping charge give you another $8 for the reshipping fee.

Note California law provides:
_
Penal  653o. (a) It is unlawful to import into this state for commercial purposes, to possess with intent to sell, or to sell within the state, the dead body, or any part or product thereof, of a polar bear, leopard, ocelot, tiger, cheetah, jaguar, sable antelope, wolf (Canis lupus), zebra, whale, cobra, python, sea turtle, colobus monkey, kangaroo, vicuna, sea otter, free-roaming feral horse, dolphin or porpoise (Delphinidae), Spanish lynx, or elephant.

(b) (1) Commencing January 1, 2020, it shall be unlawful to import into this state for commercial purposes, to possess with intent to sell, or to sell within the state, the dead body, or any part or product thereof, of a crocodile or alligator.

     (2) This subdivision shall not be construed to authorize the importation or sale of any alligator or crocodilian species, or any products thereof, that are listed as endangered under the federal Endangered Species Act, or to allow the importation or sale of any alligator or crocodilian species, or any products thereof, in violation of any federal law or international treaty to which the United States is a party.

(c) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor and shall be subject to a fine of not less than one thousand dollars ($1,000) and not to exceed five thousand dollars ($5,000) or imprisonment in the county jail not to exceed six months, or both that fine and imprisonment, for each violation.

(d) The prohibitions against importation for commercial purposes, possession with intent to sell, and sale of the species listed in this section are severable. A finding of the invalidity of any one or more prohibitions shall not affect the validity of any remaining prohibitions.

(e) This section shall become operative on January 1, 2016_​


----------



## fotos4u2 (Dec 8, 2017)

MWN said:


> Note California law provides:
> _
> (b) (1) Commencing January 1, 2020, it shall be unlawful to import into this state for commercial purposes, to possess with intent to sell, or to sell within the state, the dead body, or any part or product thereof, of a crocodile or alligator._​


No alligator?!?!  My kid still occasionally has cravings for the alligator po boy we had in New Orleans!


----------



## coachrefparent (Dec 8, 2017)

Does anyone know where someone can get cocaine in the SD area?


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 8, 2017)

coachrefparent said:


> Does anyone know where someone can get cocaine in the SD area?


Just keep an eye out for a panga boat.


----------



## MWN (Dec 8, 2017)

@fotos4u2 - Just use chicken ... everything tastes like chicken.
@coachrefparent - sent you a PM with location, make sure you use the phrase "I'm dreaming of a white Christmas," when tony asks you for your favorite song.


----------



## charlie murphy (Dec 8, 2017)

Were your kids told this weekend that they needed to change their shoes? Cal South and it's umbrella organizations will now be doing pre game checks for the usual with the addition of illegal K leather shoes not being permitted at sanctioned events or league games. You will still be required to play on flooded fields and in blistering winds, fields of dirt and grass clumps and 100 mile drives for games with teams that are 5 minutes apart so you can play on a neutral field (CRL). Not a serious post .... or is it?


----------



## Sheriff Joe (Dec 8, 2017)

I have some size 5's-used for 1 practice if anyone is interested. Copas.


----------



## Socalsoccer (Dec 8, 2017)

Sheriff Joe said:


> I have some size 5's-used for 1 practice if anyone is interested. Copas.


Would be cool if there was a place on here to buy/sell soccer related stuff. Like the Calguns forum.


----------



## Sheriff Joe (Dec 8, 2017)

Socalsoccer said:


> Would be cool if there was a place on here to buy/sell soccer related stuff. Like the Calguns forum.


Funny, I was just thinking that a couple of days ago.
AR15.com


----------



## LASTMAN14 (Dec 8, 2017)

Sheriff Joe said:


> Funny, I was just thinking that a couple of days ago.
> AR15.com


If I recall AR's were also banned along with Kangaroos in CA. Is there a correlation?


----------



## coachrefparent (Dec 8, 2017)

MWN said:


> @coachrefparent - sent you a PM with location, make sure you use the phrase "I'm dreaming of a white Christmas," when tony asks you for your favorite song.


No, a PM is too logical. Please post the dealer's name, address and phone number here publicly, like people are doing with stores illegally selling kangaroo shoes.


----------



## mirage (Dec 8, 2017)

LASTMAN14 said:


> If I recall AR's were also banned along with Kangaroos in CA. Is there a correlation?


Yes, its illegal to shoot Roos with ARs in CA.....


----------



## Sheriff Joe (Dec 8, 2017)

mirage said:


> Yes, its illegal to shoot Roos with ARs in CA.....


----------



## Not_that_Serious (Dec 11, 2017)

fotos4u2 said:


> No alligator?!?!  My kid still occasionally has cravings for the alligator po boy we had in New Orleans!


them gaters gotta be the best for wet weather =)


----------



## Not_that_Serious (Dec 11, 2017)

Soccer Cat said:


> Does someone know of a website that will ship these to California?  I’ve been trying and can’t get them.


just google, find sites. see what they carry and order. if they wont send them, itll probably tell you as soon as you hit "order". 
going to start kangaleathermaps.com & corner the kanga goods delivery market.


----------

