# Verbally Abusive Coaches



## The Godfather (Apr 28, 2021)

What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?  As you can imagine, there is always the fear of retaliation since coaches feel that they have all the power.  Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  Success stories?


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## Technician72 (Apr 29, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?  As you can imagine, there is always the fear of retaliation since coaches feel that they have all the power.  Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  Success stories?


I suppose it’s always best to go into it thinking “Blue Sky” scenario and that a coach is going to change based on feedback, so depending on the players age a conversation should be had with the coach to address the specifics, either by the player or parent.

When my kids were younger I would usually have the initial talk about my players personality when bringing them to a new team or coach and share what works best for my kid with them.

My oldest was always the kid who preferred to by taught than yelled at, she needed constructive criticism to know how to fix what needed fixing.

My youngest in contrast was very resilient when coaches would “push” her and yell and scream in frustration over their inadequacies to properly train / coach.

But overall I don’t have a success story to share, coaches who are truly verbally abusive beyond just being loud are toxic and there are too many other good coaches who can get results without using that style. My advice would be that 99% of the time you get outta of that unfixable situation. I kept my youngest in that scenario too long having confused “tough it out” with “this isn’t right” and she quit playing altogether.


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## Carlsbad7 (Apr 29, 2021)

I dont have a resolution but I can relay what I've seen happen to different coaches that yelled at kids.

Coach #1 was a Field and Futsal coach. He would yell 90% negative and 10% positive at the players in Field games. During his tenure as coach he ran all kinds of players away. In 3 years the club probably lost 20+ because of him. As a Futsal coach he'd yell even more at the players and just to be a double loser if his team was losing he'd walk off the court early leaving the players to fend for themselves. Overall 9 out of 10 parents would get away from him over time. 1 in 10 would parents seek him out I can only assume because they like being treated poorly.

Coach #2 would yell at his Field and Futsal players but you could tell that when he did it he wasnt being mean or negative about it. Players and parents (over time) loved him. Being blunt and obvious (at volume 10) made it easy for players to know how to improve. 

Coach #3 would yell at her Field teams in weird ways that didnt make sense. Comments like "try faster" or "run better". Over a 3 year tenure her teams got worse and worse (without losing players) and her competition got better and better. Leadership in the club identified the trend and limited the teams shes involved with.

None of the clubs specifically stopped coaches from yelling at kids. Also if successful I can see a situation where abusive coaches would get worse and worse (as long as their winning). Some parents seek out coaches that yell especially if they're winning. 

As a parent I always stayed away from the coaches that yell until we came across the one that was loud but not mean. Players loved him + sought him out. His results are amazing. He is primarily a boys coach but in Futsal works with girls and they like him just as much as the boys do. 

So I've discovered that there can be good coaches that yell. But, most of the time yelling + coaching are a bad combination and it doesnt work. I'm also amazed at parents at associate yelling with being a good coach.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

Carlsbad7 said:


> I dont have a resolution but I can relay what I've seen happen to different coaches that yelled at kids.
> 
> Coach #1 was a Field and Futsal coach. He would yell 90% negative and 10% positive at the players in Field games. During his tenure as coach he ran all kinds of players away. In 3 years the club probably lost 20+ because of him. As a Futsal coach he'd yell even more at the players and just to be a double loser if his team was losing he'd walk off the court early leaving the players to fend for themselves. Overall 9 out of 10 parents would get away from him over time. 1 in 10 would parents seek him out I can only assume because they like being treated poorly.
> 
> ...


Coach #1- "Stop crying.  Are you on your period again?"  
Coach #2- "Let's face it, you're fat and you need to lose weight or else."
Coach #3- "If you leave, you will be labeled a club hopper."
Coach#4-  "I know everyone in the game.  Do as I say and all will go well for you.  Don't you ever question me."
Coach #5- "If you get recruits mommy phone number, I will give you 5 candy bars.  Keep in mine I run the TC and make the selections for my area for "The List."
Coach #6- "HSS is the worse sport ever.  It sucks!!!  Do NOT play HSS.  If you do, you will be taken off the radar and blacklisted."


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> *What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?*  As you can imagine, there is *always the fear of retaliation* since *coaches feel *that they have all the *power. * Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  *Success stories?*


Speak the fuck up and say something Godfather, even if the Doc or coach make you feel that if you speak up, your kid will be blacklisted and the father will be labeled a crazy dad and all that other shit.  These rich dads who got their greedy hands on this sport need to get out because they bring the yellers and abusers to the arena.  Unfortunately, no success stories as of today, except to say it feels amazing to speak up. The prick might just be right about my kid being blocked entry.  We shall see and I hope to report back to all that a success story or two came from speaking up ((not popular to do three years ago)).  This is what happens when assholes and liars to 12 & 13 year old girls take charge of the most popular sport in the world.  I told you all that a big acid wash and bleach clean down was in order.  Ass wipes that treat girls and woman like shit need to go, now!!!!


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## Chalklines (Apr 29, 2021)

crush said:


> Speak the fuck up and say something, even if the Doc or coach make you feel that if you speak up, your kid will be blacklisted and the father will be labeled a crazy dad and all that other shit.  *These rich dads who got their greedy hands on this sport need to get out* because they bring the yellers and abusers to the arena.  Unfortunately, no success stories as of today, except to say it feels amazing to speak up. The prick might just be right about my kid being blocked entry.  We shall see and I hope to report back to all that a success came from speaking up ((not popular to do three years ago)) *when assholes and liars take charge of the most popular sport in the world*.  I told you all that a big acid wash and bleach clean down was in order.  Ass wipes that treat girls and woman like shit need to go, now!!!!


Crush nailed it.

Club soccer is infested by has not's with money trying to control clubs and coaches.

Problem with speaking up is everything he posted. Nothing gets accomplished except having some self gratitude. Be prepared to write a large check to the club along with volunteering endless hours if you want to see results in your favor.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

We are so watered down in soccer and in society that you cant share the truth because the truth hurts and when someone feels pain, they attack the messenger.  Big babies and big cheaters!!!


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## Chelsea dad g09 (Apr 29, 2021)

Technician72 said:


> I suppose it’s always best to go into it thinking “Blue Sky” scenario and that a coach is going to change based on feedback, so depending on the players age a conversation should be had with the coach to address the specifics, either by the player or parent.
> 
> When my kids were younger I would usually have the initial talk about my players personality when bringing them to a new team or coach and share what works best for my kid with them.
> 
> My oldest was always the kid who preferred to by taught than yelled at, she needed constructive criticism to know how to fix what needed fixing.


My experience in a nutshell. Should've left as soon as the coach told me it's to get them ready for college...as 10 year olds.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

Chelsea dad g09 said:


> My experience in a nutshell. Should've left as soon as the coach told me it's to get them ready for college...as 10 year olds.


I had TM & coach get all in my kids kool aid in 7th grade because she didnt bring homework on the road for study time.  They took her cell phone a way because she had no homework.  I told them never to take my kids phone away and they said sorry.  They did get a last wise crack on me saying that my kid is not ready for college and if you ever want her to go to ______________________________ you best get her to bring a freaking book to read next time.  Insane!!!!  Question to my hoop pals.  Does AAU pull this crap on 7th & 8th grade basketball players playing on the road?


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## Giesbock (Apr 29, 2021)

Praise Publicly Criticize Privately 

Questions I’d like to ask Coaches 1,2 3 and 4:

Were you a player? Did you just not make the next level and turn to coaching to stay in the game? As a player, did your coach yell and scream, or teach through instruction?

End of the day, every single coach is a reflection of the team setting he or she grew up in, just like all of us are a reflection of the home we grew up in.

Overlay the wide range of nationalities that are represented in youth soccer coaches, and you have to consider social norms from other countries.

I know that there’s training for coaches to earn their licenses, etc but curious if that training includes a behavioral component?


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

Giesbock said:


> Praise Publicly Criticize Privately
> 
> Questions I’d like to ask Coaches 1,2 3 and 4:
> 
> ...


I remember U10 like it was 7 years ago.  Two of the top teams playing for first place.  The other team put their biggest and best defender on my kid. It was the first time I ever heard the phrase "man mark her,"  I was saying, "why is that big kid attacking my kid, clipping her, pushing her down and following her everywhere she goes?"  It was the first real time where I thought to myself, "wow, she must be a good soccer player if they have to pull that stunt."  Anyway, the other team had one of the best players in Socal at the time.  Her asshole male coach with no kids was pissed off because she was taking a day off and we were up 2-0.  Dude yells, "Hey __________________________, you are the best player on the field, stop being lazy and get it together."  I kid you not.  Everyone heard that punk and we felt so embarrassed for the great player.  Last I heard she quit playing the game and the coach got arrested.


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## dad4 (Apr 29, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?  As you can imagine, there is always the fear of retaliation since coaches feel that they have all the power.  Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  Success stories?


Why do you think it is possible to make them stop?

Best of luck to your kid.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

dad4 said:


> Why do you think it is possible to make them stop?
> 
> Best of luck to your kid.


All things are possible if you and the rest speak up.  I know who won't speak up and there lies the problem.  It's not a lot, it's only a few snobs who control everything and take care of their own first.


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## Glitterhater (Apr 29, 2021)

I had a coach yell at my daughter as a 9 year old so badly that she started to tear up- the proceeded to ask my daughter if she "understood english". Mind you- this was in the middle of the entire team, practice stopped and all.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

Glitterhater said:


> I had a coach yell at my daughter as a 9 year old so badly that she started to tear up- the proceeded to ask my daughter if she "understood english". Mind you- this was in the middle of the entire team, practice stopped and all.


I'm sorry to hear that.  I had a coach ask my dd ((12 years old at the time I might add)) what her mom looked like because he said the top male coaches can tell what the finish female will look like when she's 18.  I kid you not.  Another time after my dd gave up 16 months of her early teen life to help win #10 National Championship, a Doc told her she was a lock to make the list ((he picked)) but under three conditions: "You can;t play HSS, get said recruits mom's phone number and tell your old man to STFU."


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## Carlsbad7 (Apr 29, 2021)

I have a funny story to tell about a coach that liked to yell at the players...

We were at one of those big tournaments where fields are right next to each other and multiple teams were playing at the same time. I had a splitting headache from the night before. In the field across from / next to us this coach was going off on what looked like U10 girls. The coach was being so obnoxious that I was getting annoyed. He was also being a complete ass saying negative things. About half way through their game I couldn't take it anymore + the headache was kicking in big time so I waited until a break in the action (he would take this time to dig even harder into the girls) and I yelled... (Hey $hithead stop yelling at the girls) Everyone from mutliple teams heard it and the parents in our group started to laugh. I'm sure other's were doing the same. The coach tried to stare me down but quickly realized it wasn't going to do anything. The rest of the game he was toned down enough to make my headache tolerable. I was expecting a "meet me in the parking lot" situation but it never happened.


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## lafalafa (Apr 29, 2021)

Some would say it's "tough love" other abuse. can be a thin line between the two

Now a days with all the camera phones coaches are being called on it more.

In the long term likely consider a change, if it involves threats document, escalate and speak with management.

In previous generations there was more tolerance but not so much now. Some would turn a blind eye as long as the coach was successful





						SoCal Blues
					

What is going on over at SoCal Blues?   I was told that the director of the club is now the youngers coach and that Baker is leaving the club? Can anyone confirm this?



					www.socalsoccer.com


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## watfly (Apr 29, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?  As you can imagine, there is always the fear of retaliation since coaches feel that they have all the power.  Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  Success stories?


This is based on my own experiences, so take it with a grain of salt.

Short answer:  Leave the club and email the DOC and the directors why you're leaving but don't be a whiny snowflake about it.  Say something like "Due to the repeated bullying behavior by Coach X we have decided to leave the club.  His behavior has taken away my son's/daughter's passion for the game and I'm very concerned that if we were to stay that it might negatively impact the long-term soccer development of my child"

Long answer:  As other's have pointed out yelling can run the spectrum from harmless to seriously impacting your child's self esteem.  We all have different ideas as to what constitutes abusive behavior. (SafeSport has formal definitions of what constitutes Emotional Misconduct and Bullying).  To really qualify it needs to be repeated behavior, and not just a random one off where they made your child cry.  Do your best to figure out where the coaches behavior fits on the spectrum before going up the chain of command.  Coaches that are abusive typically are compensating for their own lack of knowledge regarding the game and/or own inability to effectively teach children.  Too many coaches use the same methods for teaching adults as they do children.  Those coaches are idiots.  (Just FYI I don't care for the term "teach", I think soccer is a sport you "learn", but maybe that's just semantics).  Keep in mind that the DOC already knows that your coach is an asshole and has done nothing about it, so don't expect him or her to be very sympathetic to your complaint.  If you want to raise an issue, raise it with the board members.  Out of protocol you should probably address this issue with the coach first, but the odds of that being productive are slim to none.  Remember coaches think your an idiot parent that knows nothing about coaching soccer.  Further soccer clubs don't consider parents to be a customer, but instead only think of parents as an annoyance, which is only true for a small percentage of parents.  Also if others parents on your team have the same concerns don't expect them to voice those to the club as well.  Assume you are going it alone and be prepared for the club to do nothing about it.

One of the problems with bullying is that it often works...in the short term.  Which is all most coaches care about anyway.

The best way to avoid bullying is to do your own due diligence before joining a team.  Never, never, ever go to a tryout blind without knowing who the coach will be and having attended some of their practices.  This not only helps your child in the tryout process, but gives you a good idea of whether a coach is a good fit for your child.   Also check out your coaches bio on the clubs website (this is tongue and cheek), and if their bio says that they had a "a promising pro career derailed by a knee injury in college (usually Div II)" that's a red flag that they are going to try to live their glory through a bunch of U12's.

At the end of the day us parents really have only ourselves to blame for abusive coaches.  Of course my advice is easier said then done.  The most abusive coaches usually are coaching the top teams and parents have FOMO and/or fear of retaliation if they say anything.  But keep in mind there are dozen of top teams out there.

PS: If possible finish the season if your child can stand to do it, I think its a good lesson for the kids to overcome diversity.  I told my son, "look the coach is a total asshole, but try to ignore the demeaning comments and try to focus on what he is teaching soccerwise."


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## timbuck (Apr 29, 2021)

Giesbock said:


> Praise Publicly Criticize Privately
> 
> Questions I’d like to ask Coaches 1,2 3 and 4:
> 
> ...


That's a big part of the problem today.  A coach that played D1 soccer 20 years ago -  If you think college soccer is a crappy level now.  Have you seen a game from 20 years ago in the US?  Possession wasn't a word that anybody used.  Coaches were either foreign transplants or someone with very little soccer experience.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

lafalafa said:


> Some would say it's "tough love" other abuse. can be a thin line between the two
> 
> Now a days with all the camera phones coaches are being called on it more.
> 
> ...


I wanted to play for Bob Knight but I wasnt good enough.  Wooden would have been to my liking too but I needed a kick in the ass from a coach Knight, just being honest here fellas.  The girls don't need no Bob in their life, trust me.


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## lafalafa (Apr 29, 2021)

crush said:


> I wanted to play for Bob Knight but I wasnt good enough.  Wooden would have been to my liking too but I needed a kick in the ass from a coach Knight, just being honest here fellas.  The girls don't need no Bob in their life, trust me.


Yup our HS football coaches where like drill sergeants they called you every name in the book, some you didn't know about yet and cussed profusely like sailors.   No biggie we just thought that was normal and laughed about it later. 

In today's PC world,  language and people are a lot more sensitive so have to tone it down and use more sensible ways to get the messages across.


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## Speed (Apr 29, 2021)

My kids solution was to bully him back. Screamed at my kid and he turned around screamed back and dropped the F bomb multiple times. Parents said it shocked everyone and practice stopped afraid of what coach would do. his response? ‘Alrighty then let’s resume‘.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Apr 29, 2021)

Speed said:


> My kids solution was to bully him back. Screamed at my kid and he turned around screamed back and dropped the F bomb multiple times. Parents said it shocked everyone and practice stopped afraid of what coach would do. his response? ‘Alrighty then let’s resume‘.


Happens in the business world as well.  I had a boss that had an eating disorder (would only eat plain foods with no spices or sauces). 
 When he traveled he didnt eat well and would rage in meetings.  He was so mad one time that he dropped F bombs on me for 5 minutes.   I got up looked him down and said :" If you think it's ok to drop F bombs on me, than I will Fn drop it on you.  You need to Fn respect others and this is no Fn way to handle it"   The guy was shocked and perplexed that I didnt take shit from him.    He was fired, I am still here. LOL


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## NorCalDad (Apr 29, 2021)

timbuck said:


> That's a big part of the problem today.  A coach that played D1 soccer 20 years ago -  If you think college soccer is a crappy level now.  Have you seen a game from 20 years ago in the US?  Possession wasn't a word that anybody used.  Coaches were either foreign transplants or someone with very little soccer experience.


I think back then we still called the sport kickball.


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## Eagle33 (Apr 29, 2021)

timbuck said:


> That's a big part of the problem today.  A coach that played D1 soccer 20 years ago -  If you think college soccer is a crappy level now.  Have you seen a game from 20 years ago in the US?  Possession wasn't a word that anybody used.  Coaches were either foreign transplants or someone with very little soccer experience.


Requirement to coach college is a 4 year degree - soccer knowledge or coaching license is not.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

lafalafa said:


> Yup our HS football coaches where like drill sergeants they called you every name in the book, some you didn't know about yet and cussed profusely like sailors.   No biggie we just thought that was normal and laughed about it later.
> 
> In today's PC world,  language and people are a lot more sensitive so have to tone it down and use more sensible ways to get the messages across.


My HS Hoops coach was insane bro.  He kicked off the volleyball players because they wouldnt play summer league for obvious reasons.  Then, he invites the whole team to a super radical church and throws in a free steak dinner if you go with him and his wife.  I hated church back then but loved steak so I took him up on the offer.  So about half the team goes to Sunday church with coach and it was about, "your going to hell if you dont ask Jesus right now to come into your heart.  The pressure put on a 15 year old sinner was too much and I raised my hand like all the others.  I wont lie I did it so the coach would like me and if I went to church maybe I could bump the line and get the start over my atheist friend Paul.   I also told me sweet mama that her faith was all wrong and she's going to hell and why she didnt teach me this easy way into paradise.


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## Speed (Apr 29, 2021)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Happens in the business world as well.  I had a boss that had an eating disorder (would only eat plain foods with no spices or sauces).
> When he traveled he didnt eat well and would rage in meetings.  He was so mad one time that he dropped F bombs on me for 5 minutes.   I got up looked him down and said :" If you think it's ok to drop F bombs on me, than I will Fn drop it on you.  You need to Fn respect others and this is no Fn way to handle it"   The guy was shocked and perplexed that I didnt take shit from him.    He was fired, I am still here. LOL


Yes, I had similar work situation and I went off on my bosses boss. My boss was looking at me like I lost my mind and would be fired. I figured I would but didn't care. I didn't. From that day forward that a**hole deferred to me for all decisions in my area and respected me because I stood up for myself. I, like my kid, didn't plan on going off --its just an innate thing I have that I cannot turn off.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Happens in the business world as well.  I had a boss that had an eating disorder (would only eat plain foods with no spices or sauces).
> When he traveled he didnt eat well and would rage in meetings.  He was so mad one time that he dropped F bombs on me for 5 minutes.   I got up looked him down and said :" If you think it's ok to drop F bombs on me, than I will Fn drop it on you.  You need to Fn respect others and this is no Fn way to handle it"   The guy was shocked and perplexed that I didnt take shit from him.    He was fired, I am still here. LOL


I had a boss lady go off on me back when Yellow Pages were around.  She had a work ethic that was impossible to match and expected everyone to be just like her.  We called her, "Tara the terrible."  She was first in the office and last to leave.  She wanted your ass in the office everyday no later than 8am and back by 4 to make follow up calls.  Basically, get your "cheeks in your seat" and make calls so I can get a bonus every quarter.  She was just terrible to work for and had no kids at the time.  Told me she would never be a stay home mommy.  I told her she will be a stay home mommy because you lady are one big control freak.  Anyway, she went on some sales calls with me and told me my presentation sucked, that I was too nervous and actually was not the right fit to be a "consultative" sales person because I was all about price at Sparkletts water.  She told her boss to fire my ass.  I was getting married and she wanted me gone before my wedding day.  Her boss took me under his wing ((believed in me)) and I later became sales manager of the year and won a trip to Fiji.  Boss lady was not on the trip because she quit to become a stay home mom with her kids.  My favorite story ever in my life


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## Dominic (Apr 29, 2021)

One of the best trainers my son had was  verbally abusive. He put the kids under peer pressure to perform, and if you failed you heard about it  instantly, also gave positive reinforcement . This training under pressure helped him in school. Many on here dislike this coach because they feel uncomfortable, and im not talking about the Bakers.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

Dominic said:


> One of the best trainers* my son *had was  verbally abusive. He put the kids under peer pressure to perform, and if you failed you heard about it  instantly, also gave positive reinforcement . This training under pressure helped him in school. Many on here dislike this coach because they feel uncomfortable, and im not talking about the Bakers.


"My son" is not "My DD."


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## lafalafa (Apr 29, 2021)

Dominic said:


> One of the best trainers my son had was  verbally abusive. He put the kids under peer pressure to perform, and if you failed you heard about it  instantly, also gave positive reinforcement . This training under pressure helped him in school. Many on here dislike this coach because they feel uncomfortable, and im not talking about the Bakers.


We're had some very vocal trainers and that style can work, some take it as motivation and not personal others like you say do get uneasy or stressed eventually.

Can help with calmness, focus  and blocking out distractions but some get tired of the instant feedback and just want a "break" without that much constant critique.


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## The Godfather (Apr 29, 2021)

Carlsbad7 said:


> I have a funny story to tell about a coach that liked to yell at the players...
> 
> We were at one of those big tournaments where fields are right next to each other and multiple teams were playing at the same time. I had a splitting headache from the night before. In the field across from / next to us this coach was going off on what looked like U10 girls. The coach was being so obnoxious that I was getting annoyed. He was also being a complete ass saying negative things. About half way through their game I couldn't take it anymore + the headache was kicking in big time so I waited until a break in the action (he would take this time to dig even harder into the girls) and I yelled... (Hey $hithead stop yelling at the girls) Everyone from mutliple teams heard it and the parents in our group started to laugh. I'm sure other's were doing the same. The coach tried to stare me down but quickly realized it wasn't going to do anything. The rest of the game he was toned down enough to make my headache tolerable. I was expecting a "meet me in the parking lot" situation but it never happened.


Love this story, well done.


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## The Godfather (Apr 29, 2021)

Technician72 said:


> I suppose it’s always best to go into it thinking “Blue Sky” scenario and that a coach is going to change based on feedback, so depending on the players age a conversation should be had with the coach to address the specifics, either by the player or parent.
> 
> When my kids were younger I would usually have the initial talk about my players personality when bringing them to a new team or coach and share what works best for my kid with them.
> 
> ...


Let me be clear, it doesn't bother my kid but she doesn't respect him because he is an ASS.  He just says dumb stuff, doesn't provide constructive feedback (to the entire team), lies when you call him out, and believes being an asshole separates him from the rest of coaches.  Oh, every coach I know feels the same about him being an ass.  Hopefully the club figures it out soon so these girls can have a great final club season next year.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> Let me be clear, it doesn't bother my kid but she doesn't respect him because he is an ASS.  He just says dumb stuff, doesn't provide constructive feedback (to the entire team), lies when you call him out, and believes being an asshole separates him from the rest of coaches.  Oh, every coach I know feels the same about him being an ass.  Hopefully the club figures it out soon so these girls can have a great final club season next year.


I dedicate this song to the Ass that we all know Godfather.  I feel your pain bro.  Take out the word, "girl" in the song called, "Lies" and replace with "Coach" or "Doc."  I swear you will laugh your Ass off if watch the whole 2 minutes....lol.


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## crush (Apr 29, 2021)

BTW, looks like I have to STFU after tmrw.  Yup, I made a deal with ___________________________ and because of that, I need to lay low.  It's for the best.  I might come back as another avatar but I wont be able to say I'm EJ or Crush.  I know it sucks too, but I have to do it.  I made that promise and frankly, I got the word out about the lies.  This is serious soccer now and it's best I keep my big mouth shut and let it go once and for all.  Time to put up or STFU, right.............


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## Woodwork (Apr 29, 2021)

Is there some reason strong enough to justify keeping your kid under an abusive coach?  Assuming you aren't using the word "abusive" lightly,  I can't think of one, at least not in the supple club scene of Southern California.  Too many good coaches, teams, and clubs, all with great kids too, to spend your money and trust your kid with an abusive coach.  You may even try playing your kid up a year.


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## Grace T. (Apr 30, 2021)

Giesbock said:


> Praise Publicly Criticize Privately
> 
> Questions I’d like to ask Coaches 1,2 3 and 4:
> 
> ...



It’s been a few years now but for the lower level licenses they did a few minutes at best.  There was actually more time devoted to the children’s physical development and how it impacts training than the emotional.  Most of the time is spent with their training on philosophy, how to set up a practice and build from warm up to scrimmage, and how to use their stupid computer program to write practice notes and retrieve practice sessions (I have yet to actually meet a coach that uses their system). Virtually no time is spent on game management....it’s assumed you know how to do that already.


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## Giesbock (Apr 30, 2021)

crush said:


> BTW, looks like I have to STFU after tmrw.  Yup, I made a deal with ___________________________ and because of that, I need to lay low.  It's for the best.  I might come back as another avatar but I wont be able to say I'm EJ or Crush.  I know it sucks too, but I have to do it.  I made that promise and frankly, I got the word out about the lies.  This is serious soccer now and it's best I keep my big mouth shut and let it go once and for all.  Time to put up or STFU, right.............


Sounds like it must be a great deal.  Hopefully to your daughter’s benefit!  Good luck


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## crush (Apr 30, 2021)

Giesbock said:


> Sounds like it must be a great deal.  Hopefully to your daughter’s benefit!  Good luck


Satire brother Gies.  May 1st is open season again for club hoppers was my satire.  I talked to a dad last night and he told me his dd will be looking to join her fourth team in four years.  I'm still trying to get over all the mocking and making fun of my dd the last 4 years.  You do know the assholes who made fun of her and mocked me, her dad because I had to get her out of a bad situation.  She followed the rules while others did not.  "Chester the cheater" is what we had to deal with.  Hop until you drop is my motto


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## crush (Apr 30, 2021)

A dear friend I met on the forum a couple years ago just informed me that he has been placed on "Muzzle Jail."  I was told 5 years ago I was not allowed to share *MOO* ((Dont share shit on the forum about what's really going on in our family)) with other parents on the forum. It was the biggest muzzle I ever wore. Look below and see my muzzle  Stop talking on socal soccer forum or we will kick you out of our club ((family)) was what I was warned with. I obeyed for two years and then I ripped my muzzle off my mouth and never put one back on. Tomorrow is decision day so I might be forced to STFU as well, just like my pal was told. He did say that it was his choice to keep quite


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## twoclubpapa (Apr 30, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?  As you can imagine, there is always the fear of retaliation since coaches feel that they have all the power.  Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  Success stories?


There's a role for referees, too.  The U.S. Soccer Referee Education Resource Center has published guidance on what constitutes insulting, abusive or offensive language and/or gestures.  "The *main principle* in recognizing offensive insulting, or abusive language is that the referee must protect the safety and enjoyment of the participants as well as the fairness of the play."  

The LOTG permit sanctioning coaches using insulting, abusive or offensive language during games with a red card and dismissal. This kind of behavior impugns the dignity of the game.  Emotional abuse of players should not be tolerated.

We referees need to step up and do our part.  A few years ago I spoke to a high school girls junior varsity coach during a game about how he was speaking towards his players.  It probably didn't cross the line into the type of language the U.S. Soccer guidelines describe but I considered it demeaning and inappropriate for a leader of an interscholastic activity.  Later, other referees confirmed similar behavior during their games.  Thankfully, he was not the JV girls coach the next season.  In retrospect, I regret not having written to his principal after my experience.


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## Grace T. (Apr 30, 2021)

twoclubpapa said:


> There's a role for referees, too.  The U.S. Soccer Referee Education Resource Center has published guidance on what constitutes insulting, abusive or offensive language and/or gestures.  "The *main principle* in recognizing offensive insulting, or abusive language is that the referee must protect the safety and enjoyment of the participants as well as the fairness of the play."
> 
> The LOTG permit sanctioning coaches using insulting, abusive or offensive language during games with a red card and dismissal. This kind of behavior impugns the dignity of the game.  Emotional abuse of players should not be tolerated.
> 
> We referees need to step up and do our part.  A few years ago I spoke to a high school girls junior varsity coach during a game about how he was speaking towards his players.  It probably didn't cross the line into the type of language the U.S. Soccer guidelines describe but I considered it demeaning and inappropriate for a leader of an interscholastic activity.  Later, other referees confirmed similar behavior during their games.  Thankfully, he was not the JV girls coach the next season.  In retrospect, I regret not having written to his principal after my experience.


It's really hard, though, for a referee to do this.  Some of the referees really need the money and they are reluctant to get labelled as a problem referee, or have to justify the action to the assignor or to have to go to the problem of writing up a report unless it's clear and obvious, it directly impacts the game and unless CalSouth or other supervising org is going to actually back them up with an investigation and license suspensions (so they can't not only not participate in the game but in the practices).  Remember too the sanctions for a red card can be severe lasting several games which dissuade refs from issuing them except in clear and obvious situations.  Finally, there's so much trash talk in SoCal going out between the players themselves, parents on the sidelines, and the coaches that if the refs were really to be serious about doing this they'd be handing out the cards like candy.....it goes against the entire flow of the game thing that's been preached on the other side of things.


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## Eagle33 (Apr 30, 2021)

twoclubpapa said:


> There's a role for referees, too.  The U.S. Soccer Referee Education Resource Center has published guidance on what constitutes insulting, abusive or offensive language and/or gestures.  "The *main principle* in recognizing offensive insulting, or abusive language is that the referee must protect the safety and enjoyment of the participants as well as the fairness of the play."
> 
> The LOTG permit sanctioning coaches using insulting, abusive or offensive language during games with a red card and dismissal. This kind of behavior impugns the dignity of the game.  Emotional abuse of players should not be tolerated.
> 
> We referees need to step up and do our part.  A few years ago I spoke to a high school girls junior varsity coach during a game about how he was speaking towards his players.  It probably didn't cross the line into the type of language the U.S. Soccer guidelines describe but I considered it demeaning and inappropriate for a leader of an interscholastic activity.  Later, other referees confirmed similar behavior during their games.  Thankfully, he was not the JV girls coach the next season.  In retrospect, I regret not having written to his principal after my experience.


If this would be that simple we wouldn't have any coaches left


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## Mic Nificent (Apr 30, 2021)

We can’t control how people act or their emotions but we can control who our kids play for


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## crush (Apr 30, 2021)

I played volunteer surf ref today at the beach and I got yelled at by a stupid mom with her son.  Here's what went down: I went to the beach for some Vitamin D for two hours this morning.  Waves were nice size but they would come in long intervals.  There is this killer place where people think the waves are not coming so they go and walk on rocks that can actually become a death zone so fast your dead before you know it.  Sure enough, life guard gets his red flags out ((Yellow flag on beach but waves by rocks get the red flag automatically)) and signs that tell folks to stay the fuck off the rocks when red flag warnings are up.  Life guard cant be everywhere and I'm just watching to see who will break the rules. Well, a tourist mama bear came on the scene during a calm period with her two year old son.  This kid got away from her like all boys do and was cruising for a bruising.  I felt for the kid so I walked fast over to her and yelled at his mom, "mam, you need to get off the rocks.  The big waves will come and take your kid."  I swear she looks at me and tells me she can do whatever she wants and to mind my own businesses. I swear she said this to me and I got pissed off. I told her to get the fuck off the rocks now!!!! and read the fucking signs!!!! or your son will be fucking dead today!!!!  A big wave came after she listen to me and she gave me that look like, "wow, so sorry I was defensive with you, you just saved my kids life and I was a complete asshole to you sir." She gave me the thumbs up and a "thank you wink" and all is good.  Sometime you have to speak the fuck up, even when it's not popular.  I did it for the little boy.  Refs, make the calls now!!!


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## crush (May 1, 2021)

May the month of May be kind to everyone.  I believe much will be revealed that has not been laid bare for all eyes to see and will blow some of you out of here for good.  I know a soccer mama bear named Mae and she also said that the month of May will be filled with crazy asshats being revealed for the liars they were.  You may just want to be patient with big decisions is my advice to anyone who wants it.  Lot's of moving around in May traditionally and this month will be the biggest May ever


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## notintheface (May 2, 2021)

The Godfather said:


> What should players and parents do to stop verbally abusive coaches towards players?  As you can imagine, there is always the fear of retaliation since coaches feel that they have all the power.  Seeking thoughts on best ways to handle.  Success stories?


Leave. The market is big enough to support you moving clubs. Zero reason for player abuse at any age. These are kids.


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## Franco2020 (May 4, 2021)

notintheface said:


> Leave. The market is big enough to support you moving clubs. Zero reason for player abuse at any age. These are kids.


Agree.  Why do parents take it?  Who learns by scream and fear mongering?  Imagine if Biology, Math and Music were taught by teachers that abused the students verbally in order to learn?  Same principle applies to sports.


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## Grace T. (May 4, 2021)

Franco2020 said:


> Agree.  Why do parents take it?  Who learns by scream and fear mongering?  Imagine if Biology, Math and Music were taught by teachers that abused the students verbally in order to learn?  Same principle applies to sports.


Agree for most. Some people though do learn by being pushed or abused. It comes at a price though. See “whiplash” as an interesting study.


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## SoccerFan4Life (May 4, 2021)

How about verbally abusive coaches that cuss and swear at coaches from the competing  team.  Kids can learn a lot by sitting in the bench and watch their coach spew hatred to the other side.


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## GLangevinito (May 5, 2021)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> How about verbally abusive coaches that cuss and swear at coaches from the competing  team.  Kids can learn a lot by sitting in the bench and watch their coach spew hatred to the other side.


The worst thing is that the team starts to take on the personality/energy of the abusive coach. Kids yelling at each other, blaming each other, talking back to the ref. 

I wish I knew then what I know now, and I wouldn't have spent a few seasons putting up with bad behavior.


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## outside! (May 5, 2021)

Grace T. said:


> Agree for most. Some people though do learn by being pushed or abused. It comes at a price though. See “whiplash” as an interesting study.


My son is a drummer and we watched "Whiplash" together. He said that if a director threw something at him, he better start ducking because the drummer has more ammo. Sticks would be the first thing, then the throne and the cymbals. Don't mess with drummers, they are the most physically fit in the band.


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## Grace T. (May 5, 2021)

outside! said:


> My son is a drummer and we watched "Whiplash" together. He said that if a director threw something at him, he better start ducking because the drummer has more ammo. Sticks would be the first thing, then the throne and the cymbals. Don't mess with drummers, they are the most physically fit in the band.


Mine too!


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## SFR (May 5, 2021)

crush said:


> I swear she said this to me and I got pissed off. I told her to get the fuck off the rocks now!!!! and read the fucking signs!!!! or your son will be fucking dead today!!!!  A big wave came after she listen to me and she gave me that look like, "wow, so sorry I was defensive with you, you just saved my kids life and I was a complete asshole to you sir." She gave me the thumbs up and a "thank you wink" and all is good.  Sometime you have to speak the fuck up, even when it's not popular.  I did it for the little boy.  Refs, make the calls now!!!


Have you seen the scenes when referee tries to calm down a parent or a coach who are out of line? Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't but in all situations it's a circus. Stopping the game, walking to the parent/coach and trying to say something in a polite way when probably the F word is the only way to use. As a referee you can't use the vulgar language  Like I said it's a full circus and after that the game is not the same for referee. Now, imagine the ref is 13-16 years old.


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## focomoso (May 8, 2021)

Grace T. said:


> Mine too!


Mine three.


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## pokergod (May 8, 2021)

Mic Nificent said:


> We can’t control how people act or their emotions but we can control who our kids play for


Yes, I find this whole thread strange.  If a coach is really this bad, why are people staying?  Leave.  We are fortunate to live in a spot with tons of coaches and clubs.  There is not one coach or club holding the key around here.


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## OldSchoolFootballerDad (May 8, 2021)

timbuck said:


> That's a big part of the problem today.  A coach that played D1 soccer 20 years ago -  If you think college soccer is a crappy level now.  Have you seen a game from 20 years ago in the US?  Possession wasn't a word that anybody used.  Coaches were either foreign transplants or someone with very little soccer experience.


Uh, not sure where or when people didn't use the word possession in this sport....  Luckily, I played for really good transplants in the 80's and coached for 6 years in the 90's in Orange County.  Possession was a word, more so a fundamental concept, I learned as a young player, and regularly emphasized to varying degree (from indoor voice to yelling) while coaching. You're not giving good players or solid coaches from 20 to 40 years ago enough credit.  Back then most of the Nation's top talent came from SoCal.   Lol!  Loosing the ball or passing to the other team weren't good things to do back the either;-)  Cheers!


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## LASTMAN14 (May 8, 2021)

timbuck said:


> That's a big part of the problem today.  A coach that played D1 soccer 20 years ago -  If you think college soccer is a crappy level now.  Have you seen a game from 20 years ago in the US?  Possession wasn't a word that anybody used.  Coaches were either foreign transplants or someone with very little soccer experience.


I’ve been playing possession soccer since 1985. Yes, I am aging myself. The coach that introduced this form of the game to me was a Geordie.


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## pokergod (May 9, 2021)

notintheface said:


> Leave. The market is big enough to support you moving clubs. Zero reason for player abuse at any age. These are kids.


There is also an extremely fine line between abuse and tough coaching.  Part of that equation is age related.  We have left a team since coach was so weak and didn't correct problems on or off the field.  Parent knows the kid and knows what will work or will not work for that kid.  Either way, abuse is wrong but tough coaching may be right.


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## Trojan75 (May 15, 2021)

Started my daughter at ——— club with this certain coach who was verbally abusive. She was 10yrs old and decided to follow some friends with them to another club. Told me not to leave that i’m making the biggest mistake. She had  a great last 7 years. We made a decision to return to where we started and turned out to be the biggest mistake of her club career. No college support, they where told to figure it out .  told us one thing and did  the opposite. My DD finally had enough verbal abuse and she quit the team. Along with probably 7-8 + other girls. Some girls had been with this coach for years. All got tired of the BS. I said to my self.. why did we return to back to Shawshank when we worked so hard to escape!?Live and learn


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