# Player-Centric College Soccer Information



## clueless parent

I have become aware of the imbalance in power between colleges and athletes in the recruiting AND the retention process and/or transfer options (bad fits for many reasons - change in major, injury, change in coach, failure to develop as coaches predict, etc.).

Is there a published resource for athletes and parents to consult during the recruiting process through the end of the freshman or sophomore year?  For example, the differences between a four-year university commitment and a year-to-year scholarship commitment.  Also, the pros and cons of D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and JC.


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## Multi Sport

clueless parent said:


> I have become aware of the imbalance in power between colleges and athletes in the recruiting AND the retention process and/or transfer options (bad fits for many reasons - change in major, injury, change in coach, failure to develop as coaches predict, etc.).
> 
> Is there a published resource for athletes and parents to consult during the recruiting process through the end of the freshman or sophomore year?  For example, the differences between a four-year university commitment and a year-to-year scholarship commitment.  Also, the pros and cons of D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and JC.


It really depends on the student athlete. Hopefully you know where your kid fits in as far as D1-JC. But a useful start is collegefitfinder.com.

Hopefully your club can set you up with an account. My daughter was able to narrow her choices down once she knew what she wanted to major in.


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## Ricky Fandango

clueless parent said:


> I have become aware of the imbalance in power between colleges and athletes in the recruiting AND the retention process and/or transfer options (bad fits for many reasons - change in major, injury, change in coach, failure to develop as coaches predict, etc.).
> 
> Is there a published resource for athletes and parents to consult during the recruiting process through the end of the freshman or sophomore year?  For example, the differences between a four-year university commitment and a year-to-year scholarship commitment.  Also, the pros and cons of D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and JC.


The biggest thing that is overlooked in most of these kinds of questions, is consistency.
Look for it in the school, athletic program, and coach.
Our family was fortunate to have choices. In the end, it came down to a program with a coach that has a great reputation, and has been running the program for almost two decades.
We knew he wasnt leaving, and we knew he keeps his word.

If a coach guarantees playing time, run the other way.
Other things can be promised and kept, but not that.


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## clueless parent

Multi Sport said:


> It really depends on the student athlete. Hopefully you know where your kid fits in as far as D1-JC. But a useful start is collegefitfinder.com.
> 
> Hopefully your club can set you up with an account. My daughter was able to narrow her choices down once she knew what she wanted to major in.


Thank you multisport and rick fandango - My daughter has solid ball and field IQ.  She is small.  Very small.  

She is also academically talented.  We are trying to determine how to support her.


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## Multi Sport

clueless parent said:


> Thank you multisport and rick fandango - My daughter has solid ball and field IQ.  She is small.  Very small.
> 
> She is also academically talented.  We are trying to determine how to support her.


Solid grades will open more doors.


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## Ricky Fandango

clueless parent said:


> Thank you multisport and rick fandango - My daughter has solid ball and field IQ.  She is small.  Very small.
> 
> She is also academically talented.  We are trying to determine how to support her.


Some of the best players are small. Bri Visalli comes to mind.
Small players need to be realistic, however.
Players who are too light, with slight frames will have a very tough time in division 1.


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## Real Deal

Ricky Fandango said:


> Players who are too light, with slight frames will have a very tough time in division 1.


Tell that to Ashley Sanchez.


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## chargerfan

Ricky Fandango said:


> The biggest thing that is overlooked in most of these kinds of questions, is consistency.
> Look for it in the school, athletic program, and coach.
> Our family was fortunate to have choices. In the end, it came down to a program with a coach that has a great reputation, and has been running the program for almost two decades.
> We knew he wasnt leaving, and we knew he keeps his word.
> 
> If a coach guarantees playing time, run the other way.
> Other things can be promised and kept, but not that.



I’m clueless about this entire process. Why would you run if a coach guarantees playing time? Thanks for the info.


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## Justafan

Real Deal said:


> Tell that to Ashley Sanchez.


True, but she's the exception rather than the rule. If you're light and slight, your skills, touch, & IQ better be off the charts.  In her case they definitely are.


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## Fact

clueless parent said:


> Thank you multisport and rick fandango - My daughter has solid ball and field IQ.  She is small.  Very small.
> 
> She is also academically talented.  We are trying to determine how to support her.


Here is a tip.  If your dd is going to be the shortest player on the team by far, it probably is not going to be a good fit.  Look at the University of Washington team picture and guess which one is Nogoals dd.   Not bashing her as she is a great player, but ever coach has a picture of their ideal player and she definitely did not fit that profile.


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## NoGoal

Fact said:


> Here is a tip.  If your dd is going to be the shortest player on the team by far, it probably is not going to be a good fit.  Look at the University of Washington team picture and guess which one is Nogoals dd.   Not bashing her as she is a great player, but ever coach has a picture of their ideal player and she definitely did not fit that profile.


Actually, Shay Villanueva and Shannon Simone in the picture are both 5’3” but because of the angle the players were put in and both of them being in the front (Sr’s) they both look a lot taller than they actually are.  Those 2 players were on the team when my DD originally committed, so it’s NOT like they didn’t have smaller rostered players thus raising red flags at the time.  UDub also has another 5’2” SoCal player committed for their incoming class of 2018.

A red flag warning would be the rosters of Wazzu and Colorado where the vast majority of players are 5’6” and 5’7” (or taller) respectively.


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## Ricky Fandango

Real Deal said:


> Tell that to Ashley Sanchez.


She's not that small.
Im talking about really light players (under 110lbs)


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## NoGoal

Ricky Fandango said:


> She's not that small.
> Im talking about really light players (under 110lbs)


Ashley is really 5’3” (5’4” with cleats) and probably 115 lbs.  What many don’t know is Ashley is very very strong for her size.  I recall she already had a six pack when she was 10 years old.

I agree a smaller player needs to be at a minimum 110 lbs and quick.   IMO, what is more important for a smaller player is they need to have a low center of gravity...so they are not knocked of the ball and play in a possession oriented system.  It’s why the smaller rostered players at UCLA and Flordia are successful, because of their possession oriented play.


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## Ricky Fandango

NoGoal said:


> Ashley is really 5’3” (5’4” with cleats) and probably 115 lbs.  What many don’t know is Ashley is very very strong for her size.  I recall she already had a six pack when she was 10 years old.
> 
> I agree a smaller player needs to be at a minimum 110 lbs and quick.   IMO, what is more important for a smaller player is they need to have a low center of gravity...so they are not knocked of the ball and play in a possession oriented system.


Bri Visalli is about 5 feet tall, but solid.
Small size can be an advantage, but being too *light* in div. 1 is tough.
Small players need to be strong, and quick, both mentally and physically.
I mentioned very light players in response to CP, who alluded to his/her kid being extremely small.


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## Ricky Fandango

chargerfan said:


> I’m clueless about this entire process. Why would you run if a coach guarantees playing time? Thanks for the info.


They cant guarantee playing time without being dishonest to someone.
Either they are being dishonest to the player they "guarantee", or they are being dishonest to the other players who are told they have an equal chance to earn playing time.
Think about it.
What is the mission of the program and the team?
The best players play, regardless. It aint AYSO.
The kids on the team know who deserves to play, and who gives them the best chance of winning, and it is determined on the practice field and on gameday.
Sometimes the best players are the ones who just flat out work harder.


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## espola

Ricky Fandango said:


> They cant guarantee playing time without being dishonest to someone.
> Either they are being dishonest to the player they "guarantee", or they are being dishonest to the other players who are told they have an equal chance to earn playing time.
> Think about it.
> What is the mission of the program and the team?
> The best players play, regardless. It aint AYSO.
> The kids on the team know who deserves to play, and who gives them the best chance of winning, and it is determined on the practice field and on gameday.
> Sometimes the best players are the ones who just flat out work harder.


How do you know what they  have told  the other players?


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## Ricky Fandango

espola said:


> How do you know what they  have told  the other players?


If a coach is honest and promises to start and play player A, he would also need to tell player B that even though player B may work harder, and deserves to play, player A will play anyway because he promised player A.

Sounds like a winning strategy, lol.

For the record, nobody ever promised my kids playing time, nor did my kids ask.


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## NoGoal

Ricky Fandango said:


> Bri Visalli is about 5 feet tall, but solid.
> Small size can be an advantage, but being too *light* in div. 1 is tough.
> Small players need to be strong, and quick, both mentally and physically.
> I mentioned very light players in response to CP, who alluded to his/her kid being extremely small.


Exactly and what helps her is TW let’s her be as creative as she needs to be on the pitch.  If she was in a kick and run system.  She wouldn’t have been as successful as she was at Pepperdine.  Credit goes to the coaching staff for recognizing that.


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## espola

Ricky Fandango said:


> If a coach is honest and promises to start and play player A, he would also need to tell player B that even though player B may work harder, and deserves to play, player A will play anyway because he promised player A.
> 
> Sounds like a winning strategy, lol.
> 
> For the record, nobody ever promised my kids playing time, nor did my kids ask.


Why would he "need to"?


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## Ricky Fandango

espola said:


> Why would he "need to"?


Go find your old playmate JaP.
Im taking my ball and going home.


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## espola

Ricky Fandango said:


> Go find your old playmate JaP.
> Im taking my ball and going home.


You're running away just because I won't accept your nonsense?


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## Real Deal

NoGoal said:


> Ashley is really 5’3” (5’4” with cleats) and probably 115 lbs.  What many don’t know is Ashley is very very strong for her size.  I recall she already had a six pack when she was 10 years old.
> 
> I agree a smaller player needs to be at a minimum 110 lbs and quick.   IMO, what is more important for a smaller player is they need to have a low center of gravity...so they are not knocked of the ball and play in a possession oriented system.  It’s why the smaller rostered players at UCLA and Flordia are successful, because of their possession oriented play.


I know it's common in the US to judge soccer players by body types, but I think it is a big mistake.  This is not a one size fits all sport.  It's a sport made for... well... those who are good at soccer... regardless of body type.  

There is a dancer-like agility quotient to this sport which is what makes it "the beautiful game" in the rest of the world-- and I think that is often neglected here.


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## Real Deal

I mean really-- how big and heavy is Christen Press?  And Andi Sullivan looks to be tall and lanky-- definitely not heavy or a low center of gravity.  Both great soccer players.


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## espola

Real Deal said:


> I know it's common in the US to judge soccer players by body types, but I think it is a big mistake.  This is not a one size fits all sport.  It's a sport made for... well... those who are good at soccer... regardless of body type.
> 
> There is a dancer-like agility quotient to this sport which is what makes it "the beautiful game" in the rest of the world-- and I think that is often neglected here.


If your legs are long enough to reach the ground, you can play.


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## NoGoal

Real Deal said:


> I mean really-- how big and heavy is Christen Press?  And Andi Sullivan looks to be tall and lanky-- definitely not heavy or a low center of gravity.  Both great soccer players.


Christine Press and Andi Sullivan are not small.  They are both 5’7” they don’t need to have a low center of gravity.


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## NoGoal

Real Deal said:


> I know it's common in the US to judge soccer players by body types, but I think it is a big mistake.  This is not a one size fits all sport.  It's a sport made for... well... those who are good at soccer... regardless of body type.
> 
> There is a dancer-like agility quotient to this sport which is what makes it "the beautiful game" in the rest of the world-- and I think that is often neglected here.


I agree with you, unfortunately we live in the US though.


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## Ricky Fandango

Real Deal said:


> I know it's common in the US to judge soccer players by body types, but I think it is a big mistake.  This is not a one size fits all sport.  It's a sport made for... well... those who are good at soccer... regardless of body type.
> 
> There is a dancer-like agility quotient to this sport which is what makes it "the beautiful game" in the rest of the world-- and I think that is often neglected here.


I agree with you unless the kid is super light, and super small, in which case I would recommend division 2 or division 3 if they still want to play in college.
Even if they are good players, it will be hard for them to stay in one piece at the division 1 level.
I have a daughter who weighed 102 lbs when she showed up as a freshman, and despite trying to add weight, still weighs less than 110 going into her sophomore year.
She plays D-2 on a lower level team, and could handle the speed and power at that level because she is strong although, tiny.
I would not want to see her at D-1.
I have another daughter who plays D-1, who is in the 120 lb range, and 5-5 now (allegedly). The college D-1 game is physical.

btw, when you look on a roster and see their listed height, take it with a grain of salt. most of the shorter kids fudge it a little.


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## Dos Equis

NoGoal said:


> Christine Press and Andi Sullivan are not small.  They are both 5’7” they don’t need to have a low center of gravity.


Press also possesses elite speed, an asset that her college and pro coaches exploited, but one that seems either less valued and/or less effective on the USWNT (though I would argue a few more diagonal/direct balls to her and Pugh would destroy that high line Japan plays, or at least keep them more honest).

If you are going to be small in D1, you best have agility, speed and strength.  Ball skills and a high soccer IQ is only
part of the toolbox.


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## clueless parent

Excellent information.  I really appreciate the perspective on small-light players.


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## espola

clueless parent said:


> Excellent information.  I really appreciate the perspective on small-light players.


My son thought he was fast until he went to college, and his roommate (who was the smallest on the team) turned out to be the fastest player on the team (including all the upperclassmen).  The roomie also won the Freshman of the Year award at the team banquet after he set the school record for assists in one game near the end of the season.  So small and fast is good.


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## Multi Sport

Ricky Fandango said:


> I agree with you unless the kid is super light, and super small, in which case I would recommend division 2 or division 3 if they still want to play in college.
> Even if they are good players, it will be hard for them to stay in one piece at the division 1 level.
> I have a daughter who weighed 102 lbs when she showed up as a freshman, and despite trying to add weight, still weighs less than 110 going into her sophomore year.
> She plays D-2 on a lower level team, and could handle the speed and power at that level because she is strong although, tiny.
> I would not want to see her at D-1.
> I have another daughter who plays D-1, who is in the 120 lb range, and 5-5 now (allegedly). The college D-1 game is physical.
> 
> btw, when you look on a roster and see their listed height, take it with a grain of salt. most of the shorter kids fudge it a little.


My daughter is almost 5-7. The girl standing next to her on her team photo is listed at 5-8 yet my DD is taller then her, so yea,, take those listed heights with a grain of salt. But to your point, she is about 120, standing in the rain, but is normally the fastest on the pitch. Probably due to less wind resistance. 

Funny story. On her first club team she not only was one of the ligjtest but one of the shortest. They were doing parachute sprints on a windy day. The coach would not let her participate...


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## Soccerfan2

Keep the small player success stories coming. My player is smaller and lighter than most but speed, tenacity, IQ and great ball handling make up for a lot. Messi does ok for himself. Klingenberg does ok. The whole Japanese national team is about 5’2. She knows to expect discrimination based on her size, but also that there are lots of success stories despite small size so she should never let it be an excuse.


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## PitchMom20

clueless parent said:


> I have become aware of the imbalance in power between colleges and athletes in the recruiting AND the retention process and/or transfer options (bad fits for many reasons - change in major, injury, change in coach, failure to develop as coaches predict, etc.).
> 
> Is there a published resource for athletes and parents to consult during the recruiting process through the end of the freshman or sophomore year?  For example, the differences between a four-year university commitment and a year-to-year scholarship commitment.  Also, the pros and cons of D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and JC.


I left this link on the "College Recruiting" section today, but this will answer most of your questions and give good resources to other questions they don't answer directly....and it's free.   We learned a lot in this short read.
http://iawrrgoptin.pages.ontraport.net/


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