# Recommendation to CSL and SCDSL- 40 mile rule



## SoccerFan4Life (Aug 12, 2018)

As I am waiting for SCDSL to post the schedules, I realized that in our age bracket, we will need to drive more than 50 miles several times for my u-little player for weekend games.

One way to kill the joy of club soccer for new parents is to hold games that are 40 or 50 miles away from home.

My advice to CSL and SCDSL is make a rule a 40 or 30 mile rule for the younger age groups to avoid a 2 hour drive one way to a weekend game.    Also maybe play at a neutral site in between both locations to avoid these long drives.

Maybe it's just me but I am wondering if others feel the pain of driving from San Diego to Orange county or LA to Temecula on a Saturday.   Definitely not fun to drive up to 4 hours (2 each way) to watch your U9 play a game when there's about 10 other teams that belong to the other league around you. 


Thoughts?!!?


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## jpeter (Aug 12, 2018)

We had 100 mile drives from LA to play single games in San Diego, Santa Barbara, CC aztecs in kern county, Temecula mutiple times same season so 40 sounds like a walk in the park but yeah can spend almost the whole day for single game.

Things have actually improved with more local league play but getting out to Norco,  San Bernardino,  Galloway downs from LA is a 1.5hr+ 40-100 miles from LA.   The higher up in competition level you get the more the travel out of the area it seems  but yeah for normal uliittles local play should be the normal but field space & costs play a big factor.


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## Dargle (Aug 12, 2018)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> As I am waiting for SCDSL to post the schedules, I realized that in our age bracket, we will need to drive more than 50 miles several times for my u-little player for weekend games.
> 
> One way to kill the joy of club soccer for new parents is to hold games that are 40 or 50 miles away from home.
> 
> ...


I get your frustration. Along with cost and practice commitment, this is one of the issues parents cite the most as to why they are not moving their kid to club (at least not yet).  It's also an argument for why it might have been better when club didn't start before U10, which was the practice of most clubs around 10 years ago or so.  One of the biggest advantages of rec soccer is it is community-based and travel typically isn't part of the program except at older ages when they form all star and spring tournament teams 

If there are 10 teams in your area that belong to another league, then you might want to consider moving clubs so you can play in that other league.  CSL and SCDSL have largely split on geographic grounds in recent years, but there are enough big club holdouts to make it more difficult.  Of course, as your kid ages and moves up in quality, then travel is kind of the price you pay.


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## Josep (Aug 12, 2018)

Lol.  Everyone wants the prestige of club but the comforts of AYSO.  

Consider the players in ECNL and DA that travel north, Vegas and Arizona for league games.  Sometimes they travel away in a Sunday after playing a Saturday game. 

Club soccer is a choice.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Aug 12, 2018)

Josep said:


> Lol.  Everyone wants the prestige of club but the comforts of AYSO.
> 
> Consider the players in ECNL and DA that travel north, Vegas and Arizona for league games.  Sometimes they travel away in a Sunday after playing a Saturday game.
> 
> Club soccer is a choice.


The elite teams will always travel.   Bronze, Silver, flight 3, flight 2 shouldn't have to travel so far. 

You are right about the parental choice but the stupid politics  between csl and scdsl doesn't make sense.    
Just make it one league and this issue will go away.
 Politics, parent entitlement,  and greed have diluted club soccer in the recent 5 years.  Just saying.


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## RedCard (Aug 12, 2018)

Josep said:


> Lol.  *Everyone wants the prestige of club but the comforts of AYSO.  *
> 
> Consider the players in ECNL and DA that travel north, Vegas and Arizona for league games.  Sometimes they travel away in a Sunday after playing a Saturday game.
> 
> Club soccer is a choice.


That quote basically sums it up perfectly. Traveling is a pain but is a big part of life within the club world. Being from the San Gabriel Valley, traveling down South has become 2nd nature to us. And the "40 mile limit" really won't cut down travel time cause sometimes it's faster to drive to Norco or Temecula than to the San Fernando Valley or the Westside of L.A. which is 10-20 miles thanks to good ol' L.A. traffic (I know OC and SD traffic is bad too). 
Also IMO, the better teams are probably 40+ miles from us so in order to get better friendly games, traveling those distances is a must.


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## Josep (Aug 12, 2018)

Take clubs like Real SoCal and Eagles and then surf and Albion.   They can’t play in the same league without travel - lots of travel.


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## LifeisGood (Aug 12, 2018)

It's an easy solution.  Just move your family to the center of OC, Irvine is a great central city ( and has the Great Park), and you have generally a fairly close drive to games/tournaments in any direction. Club soccer is worth it.  Your kid will likely get a soccer scholarship and as a parent you will have considerable bragging rights. Come on, just make the move.


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## Primetime (Aug 12, 2018)

We're calling it "CLUB" but remember to most it's called "TRAVEL BALL" which is just as accurate.   Whatever you wanna call it, it's not an easy thing nor should it be.   It's not for everyone nor should it be.   It hasn't changed and if anything it's got better Over the  years.  When I was that age there was only one or two clubs within driving distance that I even had an option to play on and travel for games was not convenient then either.   It's part of what you sign up for.   Not sure about you guys but I can't wait till my kids next game wherever is at.


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## Kicknit22 (Aug 12, 2018)

Primetime said:


> We're calling it "CLUB" but remember to most it's called "TRAVEL BALL" which is just as accurate.   Whatever you wanna call it, it's not an easy thing nor should it be.   It's not for everyone nor should it be.   It hasn't changed and if anything it's got better Over the  years.  When I was that age there was only one or two clubs within driving distance that I even had an option to play on and travel for games was not convenient then either.   It's part of what you sign up for.   Not sure about you guys but I can't wait till my kids next game wherever is at.


Enjoy it while it lasts.  I’m sure going to miss it when it all ends.


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## ItsCalledSoccer (Aug 12, 2018)

Yes, I guess everyone still prays for the day when the league structures combine. As I mentioned in another post, we are in South OC and unless you are a flight 1 team (which we are not), I see no reason to have to leave South OC to play games, there are enough here, when you include the CSL, SCDSL and AYSO Extra teams.

We have played roughly 30 games in spring and summer and the furthest we have gone for a scrimmage is Torrance, to play another AYSO United team. Apart from that, it's all been local to south or central OC and have found plenty of competitive games.


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## Josep (Aug 12, 2018)

Combining leagues will not cut down on traffic. 

And playing the same clubs over and over gets really old.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Aug 13, 2018)

Josep said:


> Combining leagues will not cut down on traffic.
> 
> And playing the same clubs over and over gets really old.


I would challenge this statement.  If you look at the lower levels (exclude Premier/Gold/Flight1), you have enough team in both leagues to keep it close.  You wouldn't play teams twice.  Just look at north OC, you have CSL: La Mirada, Fullerton Rangers, Brea, Anaheim FC, Canyon.  SDSL: Chelsea, Strikers, Slammers (4 cities) Pats, Anaheim Surf.   I am sure I am missing more.

San Diego would benefit as well if they can combine with Presidio.


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## Josep (Aug 13, 2018)

So flight 2 and 3 should be combined, but not the rest of them?   I don’t know what age your child is, but if you are slightly older and playing flight 2/3, perhaps AYSO select would be something to consider.  

The club structure isn’t perfect.  But, In my opinion, if you are able to fill a schedule in a 20 miles radius, I’d say that club soccer is over saturated in that area.  It already is over saturated. 

And teams like Eagles and Real SoCal probably would struggle to find enough close games. 

As things get more expansive, schedules get more competitive.  CRL requires some spread of games I believe, there’s NPL, and that’s without factoring in ECNL and DA that to our of state to play games. 

Club is supposed to be competitive, and unfortunately, just because there are a million club teams now, that doesn’t make it competitive in a hyper-localized area. 

I hope you find what you are looking for.


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## Number9Mom (Aug 13, 2018)

The driving has never really bothered me EXCEPT when it was for an 8 am game. I wish the rule was if a game is more than 30 miles away it can’t start before 9 or 10. Too hard to get my kid up at 5:30, then do the hour drive and then play soccer.


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## TangoCity (Aug 13, 2018)

Number9Mom said:


> The driving has never really bothered me EXCEPT when it was for an 8 am game. I wish the rule was if a game is more than 30 miles away it can’t start before 9 or 10. Too hard to get my kid up at 5:30, then do the hour drive and then play soccer.


THIS!!!
But I'd give them 45 miles.


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## espola (Aug 13, 2018)

Number9Mom said:


> The driving has never really bothered me EXCEPT when it was for an 8 am game. I wish the rule was if a game is more than 30 miles away it can’t start before 9 or 10. Too hard to get my kid up at 5:30, then do the hour drive and then play soccer.


For years Presidio has had what is known in club circles as the Fallbrook rule - any games between a team north of Fallbrook and a team south of Fallbrook cannot start at 8AM.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Aug 13, 2018)

That's a


espola said:


> For years Presidio has had what is known in club circles as the Fallbrook rule - any games between a team north of Fallbrook and a team south of Fallbrook cannot start at 8AM.


That makes a lot of sense.  Wish the others would follow their lead.


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## RedCard (Aug 13, 2018)

Number9Mom said:


> The driving has never really bothered me EXCEPT when it was for an 8 am game. I wish the rule was if a game is more than 30 miles away it can’t start before 9 or 10. Too hard to get my kid up at 5:30, then do the hour drive and then play soccer.


We have a winner !!!!! 

Those 8am games are tough. This Sunday we ( from LA ) have an 8am CRL game in Norco, but at least it not in Temecula. And I really don’t know how those Discovery League teams are going to handle going to Norco every weekend, especially teams like Eagles and Real SoCal. That’s a tough drive every weekend, but those teams also have DA and ECNL so it comes with the territory I guess. 
And then there’s beautiful Lancaster for you San Diego and OC teams if you play in the CSL League Cup ....


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## Messi>CR7 (Aug 13, 2018)

Kicknit22 said:


> Enjoy it while it lasts.  I’m sure going to miss it when it all ends.


Well said.

Think of the hour-long drives as the rare "uninterrupted" time you have with your kids.  Before you know it, they will be driving themselves.


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## younothat (Aug 13, 2018)

How about a drink  after the 40 mile drive,   that should be the new rule...refreshments as part of the league fees but for the parents:

If we had beer gardens at those games would the parents chill more or would we see the "angry" drinkers come out?







Self/driving cars are possibly the wave of the future so you might be the last of the generation of  "Taxi" parents before uber or whatever takes over.

After you seen hundreds or more of your kids games it does tend to get old and I only occasionally go to league games anymore, nice to have the kids driving them-self's as soon as their 16.  I don't miss it, rather be surfing, biking, catching up with friends & family some of the weekend instead.


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## outside! (Aug 13, 2018)

Speak for yourself. I try to never miss one of my kid's games. I also do not mind the early games since it helps with traffic and leaves me time to get home and go to the beach or ride my bike.


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## mirage (Aug 13, 2018)

RedCard said:


> ....I really don’t know how those Discovery League teams are going to handle going to Norco every weekend, especially teams like Eagles and Real SoCal.....
> 
> And then there’s beautiful Lancaster for you San Diego and OC teams if you play in the CSL League Cup ....


CSL Premier used to be all hosted at Oaks Polo Fields in San Juan Capistrano until the split w/SCDSL.  Now I believe its at UCI (after Rams leave and the grass to recover).

League Cup is usually played at the San Bernardino Sports Complex, not Lancaster....

Silverlakes has a nice facilities but ingress/egress is the pits. Weather is not joyful but it is what it is...


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## mirage (Aug 13, 2018)

There is a legitimate grip for Flight 2~3, and SE, Bronze level teams having to travel more than an hour to play their games.  Regionalizing it more would help parents, especially below U13.

I recall one year, LAG Bakersfield (FC Roadrunners) was in SCDSL.  We had to drive from OC to Bakersfield for one game.  I believe it was when my kid was U13 or 14.  Really was WTF....

The travel can be fun but it is a grind for the most part.  I've read over the years how great the travel time is to spend the time with your kids....If that's what one calls "quality time" or spending more time with your kids, then there's something else missing.  Not saying its not a good way to spend more time.  Its just one of many ways and ask your kids, if you're already spending time with them if they like the drives..... I think you already know the answer.


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## CaliKlines (Aug 13, 2018)

mirage said:


> The travel can be fun but it is a grind for the most part.  I've read over the years how great the travel time is to spend the time with your kids....If that's what one calls "quality time" or spending more time with your kids, then there's something else missing.  Not saying its not a good way to spend more time.  Its just one of many ways and ask your kids, if you're already spending time with them if they like the drives..... I think you already know the answer.


 I had a lengthy conversation with a current WNT forward about a myriad of topics, including her youth soccer experience, and she told me that her dad always loved the "quality, one-on-one time" with her in the car. She didn't know which car he was talking about, because she hated the drives. Loved her dad to pieces, but absolutely hated the drives.


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## futboldad1 (Aug 13, 2018)

RedCard said:


> We have a winner !!!!!
> 
> Those 8am games are tough. This Sunday we ( from LA ) have an 8am CRL game in Norco, but at least it not in Temecula. And I really don’t know how those Discovery League teams are going to handle going to Norco every weekend, especially teams like Eagles and Real SoCal. That’s a tough drive every weekend, but those teams also have DA and ECNL so it comes with the territory I guess.
> And then there’s beautiful Lancaster for you San Diego and OC teams if you play in the CSL League Cup ....


FYI both Eagles and RSC lost ECNL. Also I think Eagles are CSL not SCDSL but maybe it changed.

FWIW I enjoy the drives with my DDs. Them, maybe not so much!


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## ToonArmy (Aug 13, 2018)

CaliKlines said:


> I had a lengthy conversation with a current WNT forward about a myriad of topics, including her youth soccer experience, and she told me that her dad always loved the "quality, one-on-one time" with her in the car. She didn't know which car he was talking about, because she hated the drives. Loved her dad to pieces, but absolutely hated the drives.


That is funny I am sure that a lot of us dad's feel the same way that dad did and we probably dont realize how much our daughters dislike it. What always seems to help our rides home together is the In N Out drive thru double doubles and neopolitan shakes. That's probably the only time i shut up about the game.


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## mirage (Aug 13, 2018)

CaliKlines said:


> I had a lengthy conversation with a current WNT forward about a myriad of topics, including her youth soccer experience, and she told me that her dad always loved the "quality, one-on-one time" with her in the car. She didn't know which car he was talking about, because she hated the drives. Loved her dad to pieces, but absolutely hated the drives.


....And one doesn't have to be YNT level player to hate it.


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## Overlap (Aug 13, 2018)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> As I am waiting for SCDSL to post the schedules, I realized that in our age bracket, we will need to drive more than 50 miles several times for my u-little player for weekend games.
> 
> One way to kill the joy of club soccer for new parents is to hold games that are 40 or 50 miles away from home.
> 
> ...


Pretty funny looking back after our now 8th club soccer year, oldest DD aged out 2 seasons ago and this will be our youngest DD's final season. My first car had 158,000 miles after the first 2 soccer seasons, (I bought it with 48,000 miles ), that was rough between both girls playing, my second car had 148,000 miles after the 4th season, (bought that one with 49,000 miles ), have now have 2 other cars I use, I racked up 12,000 miles last year on 1 and didn't even look at the other. Looking back I've loved that time getting up before the sunrise, drinking coffee, sometimes talking, sometimes they just slept, it really didn't matter as it was the time I've been lucky enough to spend with both of my girls. The time goes incredibly fast, enjoy it, it's just miles on a car, one day you'll be like me and smile every time you think about a certain conversation, the car full of crazy funny kids and just being there. It's a lot different having to watch our oldest on a computer during the college season but, it sure makes me smile when I think of all the fun trips we've had driving all those miles together....


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## mirage (Aug 13, 2018)

Overlap said:


> .........It's a lot different having to watch our oldest on a computer during the college season but, it sure makes me smile when I think of all the fun trips we've had driving all those miles together....


We averaged 26K mi/yr on our family vehicle for soccer.  Not jus soccer but good 80% of those miles.  Our youngest is a junior in HS so we've got this and next season.  Our 10 months old car has logged almost 16k miles with mostly one kid playing. 

You probably know this already but just in case, the way we watch the streaming college games (our older) is by using iPad browser and Airplay to AppleTV connected to our home theater.  Its much better that way.....


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## focomoso (Aug 13, 2018)

ToonArmy said:


> That is funny I am sure that a lot of us dad's feel the same way that dad did and we probably dont realize how much our daughters dislike it. What always seems to help our rides home together is the In N Out drive thru double doubles and neopolitan shakes. That's probably the only time i shut up about the game.


I read an article a while back (that I suspect was talked about here, before my time) that the least favorite thing elite athletes remember about their childhoods was the rides home after losses. The article recommended that parents not talk about the game at all on the ride home which is a rule I follow.


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## jpeter (Aug 13, 2018)

Our family cars avg 30k+ of mles each year past 8 and we spent up to 6k per year just on gas.

When you have mutiple kids playing mutiple sports or activity there are literally 100s of events each year and without mutiple drivers or callpools with friends we couldn't manage to do this.

We have a calendar just for the kids they have to keep updated and im lucky to attend about  half the games,  I'm on location working in bunches so rely on talking with them or video more & more.

Quality talk time driving to get somewhere while your kids are tuning in something  else really not what I prefer.  In fact kids are more likely to be more open when you let them call you.  Had some great conversations with the kids that way, what they want to talk about what you want too sometimes  is two separate things or more.


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## Venantsyo (Aug 13, 2018)

Josep said:


> But, In my opinion, if you are able to fill a schedule in a 20 miles radius, I’d say that club soccer is over saturated in that area.


It is in North OC, where you have over 10 clubs in a 10 miles radius, although split between CSL and SDCSL. So this saturation makes it really hard for teams to field talented teams and yet we don’t enjoy local play and have (in our case) to drive all season to the Inland Empire for G09 games.
Doable of course but not ideal.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Aug 13, 2018)

Messi>CR7 said:


> Well said.
> 
> Think of the hour-long drives as the rare "uninterrupted" time you have with your kids.  Before you know it, they will be driving themselves.


*Top 10 things you say on a 2 hr quality time drive for club soccer  with your child:*
#10: Make sure you are ready to play well during the game (before the game)
#9:  You need to play better and more practice (after the team loses)
#8: Our coach stinks, my child should have played more minutes.
#7: Mom, don't you have other movies to play on the car DVD
#6: That In-N-out line is way too long, we are doing Carl's Jr.
#5: McDonalds again? We just had that for breakfast
#4: Did you bring your shin guards?
#3: Are we there yet?
#2: Stop talking about soccer dad!
#1:  Me : "How is school, tell me something son",  Them " it's good Dad, now leave me alone so I can watch videos on my phone"

So much for quality time!


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## Messi>CR7 (Aug 13, 2018)

CaliKlines said:


> I had a lengthy conversation with a current WNT forward about a myriad of topics, including her youth soccer experience, and she told me that her dad always loved the "quality, one-on-one time" with her in the car. She didn't know which car he was talking about, because she hated the drives. Loved her dad to pieces, but absolutely hated the drives.





SoccerFan4Life said:


> *Top 10 things you say on a 2 hr quality time drive for club soccer  with your child:*
> #10: Make sure you are ready to play well during the game (before the game)
> #9:  You need to play better and more practice (after the team loses)
> #8: Our coach stinks, my child should have played more minutes.
> ...


If you have two kids in the back, add "Stop touching me" to the list.


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## RedCard (Aug 13, 2018)

futboldad1 said:


> FYI both Eagles and RSC lost ECNL. Also I think Eagles are CSL not SCDSL but maybe it changed.
> 
> FWIW I enjoy the drives with my DDs. Them, maybe not so much!


I enjoy the drives too until she takes control of the radio....lol


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## Toch (Aug 13, 2018)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> As I am waiting for SCDSL to post the schedules, I realized that in our age bracket, we will need to drive more than 50 miles several times for my u-little player for weekend games.
> 
> One way to kill the joy of club soccer for new parents is to hold games that are 40 or 50 miles away from home.
> 
> ...


For u9/u10 40 miles is a bit of a drive. For parents (the ones that always ruin youth sports) it may be a drag, but isn’t it about the kids. From my experiences at those ages, kids love traveling outside their area for competitive games. The higher you get up in skill the farther you will have to travel. If your kid makes it National Cup the games may be held in a different state... oh what will you do?


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## Overlap (Aug 14, 2018)

mirage said:


> We averaged 26K mi/yr on our family vehicle for soccer.  Not jus soccer but good 80% of those miles.  Our youngest is a junior in HS so we've got this and next season.  Our 10 months old car has logged almost 16k miles with mostly one kid playing.
> 
> You probably know this already but just in case, the way we watch the streaming college games (our older) is by using iPad browser and Airplay to AppleTV connected to our home theater.  Its much better that way.....


My kids will say every once in awhile they miss the old volvo wagon,  it smelled like stinky shin guards and always had turf pebbles we couldn't get out, I think it was because we never cared about how dirty that car got. Thanks for the ipad browser / Airplay to AppleTV tip!...I bought a big 32" computer monitor, super high speed internet and it works pretty good but, will try your way! I'll actually be able to watch the game in the house, rather than my office.


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## coachsamy (Aug 15, 2018)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> As I am waiting for SCDSL to post the schedules, I realized that in our age bracket, we will need to drive more than 50 miles several times for my u-little player for weekend games.
> 
> One way to kill the joy of club soccer for new parents is to hold games that are 40 or 50 miles away from home.
> 
> ...


The leagues would continue to do that because people will make the stupid drives for a recreational soccer game. We are down in SoCal where competition is in every corner. People making it seem like they live in those rural states where there is nothing around and you HAVE to do those drives. 

At the end of the day the clubs cater to the needs of the customer and there is a demand for far far away games from the customer, so they will ensure the club delivers a schedule up to par to the driving requirements of the customer.


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## focomoso (Aug 15, 2018)

coachsamy said:


> At the end of the day the clubs cater to the needs of the customer and there is a demand for far far away games from the customer, so they will ensure the club delivers a schedule up to par to the driving requirements of the customer.


Just to be clear, you think parents, players and coaches (the customers) _want_ long drives? This seems pretty off to me. Customers will _tolerate_ long drives if they satisfy what they really want, which is evenly-matched competition. If they have to drive far to get it, they'll do it, but given the choice, I don't know too many people who would take a long drive over a short one - competition level being equal. If CSL and SCDSL were to combine into a single league that was reorganized for that reduced travel, I suspect just about every customer would approve.


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## Sons of Pitches (Aug 15, 2018)

Anyone looked at the CSL G02 Gold Bracket this year? South - Rebels Roget (Chula Vista) to North -SV Carter (Bakersfield) to East - Riverside MGFM (Riverside) to West - Santa Monica United (Santa Monica).  Just guessing here but I bet most teams will average over 120 miles each direction (240 round trip) for away games this year.


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## coachsamy (Aug 15, 2018)

focomoso said:


> Just to be clear, you think parents, players and coaches (the customers) _want_ long drives? This seems pretty off to me. Customers will _tolerate_ long drives if they satisfy what they really want, which is evenly-matched competition. If they have to drive far to get it, they'll do it, but given the choice, I don't know too many people who would take a long drive over a short one - competition level being equal. If CSL and SCDSL were to combine into a single league that was reorganized for that reduced travel, I suspect just about every customer would approve.


Parents are the customer. Players are dragged as parents say, coaches are the employee that facilitate the service to the customer. 

Does San Diego teams have the need to compete in CSL and SCDSL to go play 3rd tier competition? (Toss up DA/ECNL as 1/2 tier)

Same principle applies to the other areas.

However the solution is on the customer changing their mindset and requiring their 3rd tier services to be within reasonable distance. Until then people seem to be happy with their long drives and don't mind spending their Saturdays traveling 80+ miles, so there is the market.


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## outside! (Aug 15, 2018)

Sons of Pitches said:


> Anyone looked at the CSL G02 Gold Bracket this year? South - Rebels Roget (Chula Vista) to North -SV Carter (Bakersfield) to East - Riverside MGFM (Riverside) to West - Santa Monica United (Santa Monica).  Just guessing here but I bet most teams will average over 120 miles each direction (240 round trip) for away games this year.


Sad that the grown-ups cannot get along and are too busy protecting their fiefdoms to care about the families.


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## GKDad65 (Aug 28, 2018)

Josep said:


> Lol.  Everyone wants the prestige of club but the comforts of AYSO.
> 
> Consider the players in ECNL and DA that travel north, Vegas and Arizona for league games.  Sometimes they travel away in a Sunday after playing a Saturday game.
> 
> Club soccer is a choice.



Yep, it's a choice.
Older did all that BS, including DA, and in the end nobody cares.  Good grades is what they want.
Thankfully my younger left the DA nonsense and went all the way back to the first "rec" club to have "fun"- locally.


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## IntheknowSoccer (Aug 28, 2018)

RedCard said:


> We have a winner !!!!!
> 
> Those 8am games are tough. This Sunday we ( from LA ) have an 8am CRL game in Norco, but at least it not in Temecula. And I really don’t know how those Discovery League teams are going to handle going to Norco every weekend, especially teams like Eagles and Real SoCal. That’s a tough drive every weekend, but those teams also have DA and ECNL so it comes with the territory I guess.
> And then there’s beautiful Lancaster for you San Diego and OC teams if you play in the CSL League Cup ....


What are Discovery League teams? Eagles and RSC only play DA|DPL. Neither club competes in ECNL.  Eagles B and C teams compete play in CSL and RSC competes in SCDSL Only a few of their B & C teams compete in CRL.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Sep 1, 2018)

Club Soccer is a choice that parents make (fact), Having SCDSL and CSL leagues is not a choice (politics & greed).

Now that schedules are up, my point is stronger than ever of combining both leagues.  My U-little child at a flight 3 (errr. rec+) needs to travel from the OC to... Temecula, San Bernandino, Riverside, Temecula. 

My  flight 1 U16 child needs to travel only once to San Diego and all others are in the OC or Norco. (Makes sense)

How can we grow the sport when a new parent to club soccer gets a crazy schedule to take their flight 3 child all over the place.   

It's just stupid that SCDSL & CSL make us parents (Customers) go through this crap. It's worse that us parents don't organize ourselves to write a letter to US Soccer, Calsouth, and each of our club organizations to stop this stupidity.  We are the 5th or 6th viewed sport on TV yet the pride of these idiot organizers make it harder for the sport to grow.

I love the sport, I hate the politics and greed of CSL/SCDSL!


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## espola (Sep 1, 2018)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Club Soccer is a choice that parents make (fact), Having SCDSL and CSL leagues is not a choice (politics & greed).
> 
> Now that schedules are up, my point is stronger than ever of combining both leagues.  My U-little child at a flight 3 (errr. rec+) needs to travel from the OC to... Temecula, San Bernandino, Riverside, Temecula.
> 
> ...


Back in the good old days when Presidio had several localized AA-C circuits and county-wide AAA and Premier circuits, everyone wanted their kid's team to be in the big-geography group, but most were willing to settle for playing the team in the next school district 3 or 4 times a year if not.  Parents who felt that anything below Premier would stain their kid's career permanently could go try out for a double/triple-priced spot on the Surf or Nomads bench.


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## timbuck (Sep 1, 2018)

There seems to be some posters here who have some inside knowledge of what goes on a board meetings of clubs and leagues-
Does anyone know if there has ever been consideration of combining csl/scdsl (maybe even presidio) as has been suggested above?


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## espola (Sep 1, 2018)

timbuck said:


> There seems to be some posters here who have some inside knowledge of what goes on a board meetings of clubs and leagues-
> Does anyone know if there has ever been consideration of combining csl/scdsl (maybe even presidio) as has been suggested above?


In 2004 and 2005 when Presidio's Secretary quit and wiped out the league's web pages in a dispute over its quality and cost, some of the club leaders got together and invited Gary Sparks to expand CSL into SD County.  He declined.


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## timbuck (Sep 1, 2018)

Scdsl formed in 2011, right?
Has there ever been a meeting of the “families”? (Someone posted a godfather video in another thread. I imagine it would be a similar meeting). 
Has Cal-South ever tried to do anything with the leagues to make things sensible?


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## Josep (Sep 1, 2018)

timbuck said:


> Scdsl formed in 2011, right?
> Has there ever been a meeting of the “families”? (Someone posted a godfather video in another thread. I imagine it would be a similar meeting).
> Has Cal-South ever tried to do anything with the leagues to make things sensible?



The day those clubs (mostly) left CSL it changed everything.   There’s no reason to merge with CSL.  It really comes down to how long can CSL survive?  The big clubs are swallowing up more and more little clubs and that moves everyone to SCDSL.  

I’m very happy I’m not in this mess and almost done.


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## mirage (Sep 1, 2018)

After being in both SCDSL and CSL, the difference is immaterial for families and players.

My sense is that both are happy to coexist today.  The early competition between the league seem to have lost its meaning these days.

I was there at the beginning of SCDSL league start and why they split was widely discussed on the forum.  This forum even had a SCDSL section early on.

Today, both leagues are 2nd tier at best due to so many other options (e.g.,  DA, ECNL, NPL, CRL) in terms of top competition.  That said, both serve very important function in the community.  

If all we cared of the top competition, then that would leave out hundreds and thousands of kids playing soccer.  There is a huge distance between rec (AYSO/Signatures) to DA/ECNL. Glad all these other options exists.

At the end of the day, who cares if its Discovery, Premier, Flight 2 or Bronze.  The issue is not what bracket the kid plays at; rather, is the kid playing and having fun at it.  This zone constitutes the vast majority of the youth soccer players, including my own younger kid.

So if the kid's talent takes you to DA, and wants to commit to do so, go do it.  If the talent and interest just focuses on having fun and playing, go do that.

Just remember that in all this talk about development and college soccer, or professional soccer aspirations, the very thing at the core that cannot be taught by coaches and privates is the desire and the drive/motivation.  Kid has to do it for him/herself.  And if those attributes and characteristics are there, the kid will find the way to be in the right place.  Parents just need to facilitate that.


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## Dargle (Sep 1, 2018)

timbuck said:


> Scdsl formed in 2011, right?
> Has there ever been a meeting of the “families”? (Someone posted a godfather video in another thread. I imagine it would be a similar meeting).
> Has Cal-South ever tried to do anything with the leagues to make things sensible?


If SCDSL and CSL ever merged, it would likely start at the Premier/Discovery level as a way to bolster their top tier divisions from falling further behind some of the other options.  I doubt travel at the F3/Bronze/U-little level would be the motivating force.


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## focomoso (Sep 4, 2018)

Josep said:


> The day those clubs (mostly) left CSL it changed everything.   There’s no reason to merge with CSL.  It really comes down to how long can CSL survive?  The big clubs are swallowing up more and more little clubs and that moves everyone to SCDSL.


Are you in the OC or San Diego? This is definitely not the case for boys in LA where CSL has a much larger hold.


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## timbuck (Sep 4, 2018)

Dargle said:


> If SCDSL and CSL ever merged, it would likely start at the Premier/Discovery level as a way to bolster their top tier divisions from falling further behind some of the other options.  I doubt travel at the F3/Bronze/U-little level would be the motivating force.


I think combining the top levels would be a great idea.  Instead, we just have each league creating a new "top level" each year.  Discovery, Champions and Europa!!!!


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## Banana Hammock (Sep 4, 2018)

timbuck said:


> I think combining the top levels would be a great idea.  Instead, we just have each league creating a new "top level" each year.  Discovery, Champions and Europa!!!!


How about a end of season tournament between CSL Premier and SCDSL Discovery.


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## timbuck (Sep 4, 2018)

Banana Hammock said:


> How about a end of season tournament between CSL Premier and SCDSL Discovery.


Isn’t that called “National Cup”?


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## Josep (Sep 4, 2018)

timbuck said:


> Isn’t that called “National Cup”?


And it’s a tourney that’s missing the top two dozen or so teams from almost each age group.  

Should probably be named “the other teams Cup” but then nobody would buy a $70 sweatshirt with that on it.  

So we will pretend that these renamed divisions and partially fielded tournaments are important.


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## mirage (Sep 4, 2018)

timbuck said:


> Isn’t that called “National Cup”?


Its CRL.  The winner goes straight to Far West Regionals.

The rub is that all CRL teams, regardless of winning it or not, to be eligible, must play in Cal South National Cup.


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