# Let Them Play CA



## dean

I imagine most of you are aware of all the rallies happening statewide this Friday. Most are being organized at local high schools, but not all. 

Check out their FB page or Twitter for more info.


----------



## Publius

dean said:


> I imagine most of you are aware of all the rallies happening statewide this Friday. Most are being organized at local high schools, but not all.
> 
> Check out their FB page or Twitter for more info.


Would love to attend but one of us needs to beat traffic to Bullhead City and the other to Coachella.  Seriously though...


----------



## EOTL

dean said:


> I imagine most of you are aware of all the rallies happening statewide this Friday. Most are being organized at local high schools, but not all.
> 
> Check out their FB page or Twitter for more info.


Brilliant.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Brilliant.


I would agree...it’s long overdue!  Just mask up as the CDC recommends.  Since NO ONE can place a link between cases/deaths and Youth Outdoor sports, there is no reason to be concerned.  If your over 65 and have concerns....Stay Home and be safe!


----------



## EOTL

l


Kicker4Life said:


> I would agree...it’s long overdue!  Just mask up as the CDC recommends.  Since NO ONE can place a link between cases/deaths and Youth Outdoor sports, there is no reason to be concerned.  If your over 65 and have concerns....Stay Home and be safe!
> 
> View attachment 9927


Arizona is totally slaying!


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> Brilliant.


If you want to argue about covid, go to the covid thread.   

I happen to disagree with Kicker on this, but there is no need to argue it yet again, here.


----------



## Chalklines

Nows not the time for this when covid's at its peak


----------



## outside!

Chalklines said:


> Nows not the time for this when covid's at its peak


I hope this is the peak.


----------



## forsomuch

EOTL said:


> l
> 
> 
> Arizona is totally slaying!


Great chart, totally accurate. But I can't find the chart where they break out the deaths of youth soccer players can you point me to it? Thanks in advance.


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> If you want to argue about covid, go to the covid thread.
> 
> I happen to disagree with Kicker on this, but there is no need to argue it yet again, here.


The point of the thread is about covid. So no.


----------



## EOTL

forsomuch said:


> Great chart, totally accurate. But I can't find the chart where they break out the deaths of youth soccer players can you point me to it? Thanks in advance.


A rally with youth soccer players playing soccer sounds more like a soccer game than a rally. 

Regardless, do these kids magically appear at games and then teleport out?


----------



## tjinaz

forsomuch said:


> Great chart, totally accurate. But I can't find the chart where they break out the deaths of youth soccer players can you point me to it? Thanks in advance.


m


EOTL said:


> l
> 
> 
> Arizona is totally slaying!


Interesting graph.  So that is from the New York Times and wikipedia not an actual medical source so you know.

Graph from the actual AZ dept of Health is about 1/3 of that.  Tops out at 122 on Dec 17 and where your graph shows 300 on Jan 6 the Az dept of health shows 61. 








						Page or Document Not Found
					






					www.azdhs.gov
				




Oh and by the way they tried to cancel High School Soccer in AZ.  They actually voted it down (AIA) and 43,000 signatures later its back but the kids have to wear masks.  We have been playing club soccer since early October.. if it was going to cause a spike it would have done so long ago.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> A rally with youth soccer players playing soccer sounds more like a soccer game than a rally.
> 
> Regardless, do these kids magically appear at games and then teleport out?


Magic.....just like trips to NYC, the grocery store, food delivery, etc.....

It is entirely possible to wear a mask while in the car as well.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> If you want to argue about covid, go to the covid thread.
> 
> I happen to disagree with Kicker on this, but there is no need to argue it yet again, here.


You disagree that we should be vaccinating the most vulnerable? Or was there something else? If you’d like to vent this dispute on another thread go right ahead.


----------



## full90

I want the kids to play. Great. But explain how this rally will help? The powers that be will see a bunch of people at a rally and realize “oh geez. We had no idea that people want their kids to play sports! Gosh. Well in that case! Ok!”

does anyone NOT want the kids to play? Everyone wants to play but the people in charge don’t think it’s safe. Sooo rally all you want. It won’t matter.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

outside! said:


> I hope this is the peak.


It will peak next week or the following.  I just hope it’s a quick trip from 50k cases to 5k cases so the kids can play in March.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> Magic.....just like trips to NYC, the grocery store, food delivery, etc.....
> 
> It is entirely possible to wear a mask while in the car as well.


Uh, last time I checked, people must eat or they will die. Maybe you think you’ll die if you can’t live vicariously through your middling child’s youth soccer exploits, but I can assure you that isn’t true.

As for masks, that’s great, but pretty much everyone who didn’t listen to Grace Karen is wearing them, yet people are dying in crazy numbers right now. The more interactions people have, the more it spreads. And we all know from this site that soccer parents are particularly dense and denialists are the ones who spread it while Kaitlyn, Caitlin and Caytlan are all practicing and playing.


----------



## EOTL

full90 said:


> I want the kids to play. Great. But explain how this rally will help? The powers that be will see a bunch of people at a rally and realize “oh geez. We had no idea that people want their kids to play sports! Gosh. Well in that case! Ok!”
> 
> does anyone NOT want the kids to play? Everyone wants to play but the people in charge don’t think it’s safe. Sooo rally all you want. It won’t matter.


They’re mostly magats, so fully expect them to storm the admin building and beat the poor janitor to death with an American flag.


----------



## Lavey29

We were notified high school soccer is a go starting 3rd week in February so maybe they are finally starting to think like 45 other states presently.  Sorry to bust your bubble Ewok.  Yes, pun intended.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> .....soccer parents are particularly dense and denialists are the ones who spread it while Kaitlyn, Caitlin and Caytlan are all practicing and playing.


Pretty self deprecating....not like you to implicate yourself like that, unless you’re not a soccer parent....hmmmm

Nevertheless,  cases may be surging despite not youth soccer. So it can’t be that.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> They’re mostly magats, so fully expect them to storm the admin building and beat the poor janitor to death with an American flag.


Frothing at the mouth over here...nice work yellow.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Frothing at the mouth over here...nice work yellow.


You’re so mean sometimes.


----------



## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> You disagree that we should be vaccinating the most vulnerable? Or was there something else? If you’d like to vent this dispute on another thread go right ahead.


Done venting, I think.  It wasn't helpful anyway.  

San Jose has had 3 days in a row below the 7 day average.  Hope this means we are (slowly) headed back towards orange.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> You’re so mean sometimes.


sorry


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> The point of the thread is about covid. So no.


Umm, No.  The point of the thread is youth sports.


----------



## N00B

happy9 said:


> Frothing at the mouth over here...nice work yellow.


Surprised you weren’t called ‘racist’ for using a color.


----------



## happy9

N00B said:


> Surprised you weren’t called ‘racist’ for using a color.


he's comfortable with yellow, same color family as marmalade.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Umm, No.  The point of the thread is youth sports.


What’s the point the rally? Start playing sports that have been shut down due to Covid?

Sorry not sorry that you don’t get to control the narrative. If you want to kill people playing kiddie sports, you will get deserved pushback.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> What’s the point the rally? Start playing sports that have been shut down due to Covid?
> 
> Sorry not sorry that you don’t get to control the narrative. If you want to kill people playing kiddie sports, you will get deserved pushback.


Yup, a protest against current policy.  Are you suggesting suppression of political protest is warranted due to COVID?  Please, do tell...


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Sorry not sorry that you don’t get to control the narrative.


Sorry, not sorry... neither do you.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

N00B said:


> Yup, a protest against current policy.  Are you suggesting suppression of political protest is warranted due to COVID?  Please, do tell...


Rally’s don’t work.  The governor is going to bury himself with his policy. He is too stubborn to make changes and right now covid is over the top.  Riverside county had 11k cases the other day. That’s as much as LA County which has 5x the population.        

We are at the end of this year long covid. Once February hits we will see a weekly drop.      

Just go play soccer and break the rules if you want to play.   Baseball and softball have not stopped playing.


----------



## tjinaz

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Rally’s don’t work.  The governor is going to bury himself with his policy. He is too stubborn to make changes and right now covid is over the top.  Riverside county had 11k cases the other day. That’s as much as LA County which has 5x the population.
> 
> We are at the end of this year long covid. Once February hits we will see a weekly drop.
> 
> Just go play soccer and break the rules if you want to play.   Baseball and softball have not stopped playing.


You know what works?   Recalls work.  Quickly heading to the required 1.5m

Petition to recall

Even when they try to go over the top in opposing it.

Backlash over calling it a coup


----------



## EOTL

tjinaz said:


> You know what works?   Recalls work.  Quickly heading to the required 1.5m
> 
> Petition to recall
> 
> Even when they try to go over the top in opposing it.
> 
> Backlash over calling it a coup


When they asked AZ magats to flatten the curve, they should have specified that they meant the X axis.


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> Done venting, I think.  It wasn't helpful anyway.
> 
> San Jose has had 3 days in a row below the 7 day average.  Hope this means we are (slowly) headed back towards orange.


Dang that's good.  San Diego is at 70 for the 7 day trailing.  You could be right for a March start for your neck of the woods.


----------



## Anon9

EOTL said:


> When they asked AZ magats to flatten the curve, they should have specified that they meant the X axis.
> 
> View attachment 9932


California is doing sooooo much better with their liberal policies. You buffoon.


----------



## Eagle33

Lavey29 said:


> We were notified high school soccer is a go starting 3rd week in February so maybe they are finally starting to think like 45 other states presently.  Sorry to bust your bubble Ewok.  Yes, pun intended.


Notified by who? What HS?


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> When they asked AZ magats to flatten the curve, they should have specified that they meant the X axis.
> 
> View attachment 9932


Pretty much a similar curve to 90% of the world right now.....even CA.


----------



## EOTL

Anon9 said:


> California is doing sooooo much better with their liberal policies. You buffoon.


Actually it is. 39th in death rate. Hey Buffoon of the Bronze Baboon, you do understand CA has a lot more people than any other state, right?

Of course, it’s people like you who are causing CA’s (not nearly as bad as AZ’s) problems. If CA were killing people at the same rate as AZ, that would mean another 27,000 people would need to be dead. Stated in simple terms for you, despite tour best efforts, CA’s policies have still saved at least 27,000 lives so far compared to AZ. It’s really a lot more than that, however, given CA’s much higher population densities.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> Pretty much a similar curve to 90% of the world right now.....even CA.


Nope.  AZ is killing people much more quickly and efficiently than just about anywhere.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> A rally with youth soccer players playing soccer sounds more like a soccer game than a rally.
> 
> Regardless, do these kids magically appear at games and then teleport out?


Well, if you had kids playing soccer, instead of being a bored loser with nothing else to do, you could tell soccer parents, on a soccer forum, what kids do after games.


----------



## Lavey29

Eagle33 said:


> Notified by who? What HS?


The school notified us. We are in the inland empire.  Division 1 league.


----------



## Lavey29

Eagle33 said:


> Notified by who? What HS?


Also a lot of schools in OC and other areas have been having various sports practice for some time but they also have hybrid in school education also
.


----------



## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> Pretty much a similar curve to 90% of the world right now.....even CA.


Where do you get this nonsense?  90% of the world has a covid death curve like AZ?

There are exactly three counties with worse covid deaths per capita than Arizona:  Belgium, San Marino, and Slovenia.   Together, they represent 0.2% of the world’s population.   The other 99.8% of the world is doing better than AZ; in most places by a wide margin.

Take your covid misinformation over to the covid misinformation thread.  And take 30 seconds to fact check your post before pulling numbers out of your butt.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> Where do you get this nonsense?  90% of the world has a covid death curve like AZ?
> 
> There are exactly three counties with worse covid deaths per capita than Arizona:  Belgium, San Marino, and Slovenia.   Together, they represent 0.2% of the world’s population.   The other 99.8% of the world is doing better than AZ; in most places by a wide margin.
> 
> Take your covid misinformation over to the covid misinformation thread.  And take 30 seconds to fact check your post before pulling numbers out of your butt.


Check what I said and show me where I mention per capita....you’re just looking to try to be right and put words in my mouth.  The CURVE is similar....dear lord please pay attention.


----------



## lafalafa

Eagle33 said:


> Notified by who? What HS?


Some private schools and districts are still doing conditioning.

Our LA county conditioning was suspended for January but the hope to resume in February.  School board decision.

As far as the season need to get to the orange tier before playing games as things stand now.  Jan 25 Southern Section is supposedly going to come out with a announcement about season #1 football and #2 soccer (mar-june)


----------



## Penalty Kicks Stink

Been hearing that if we get to play it will be Varsity level only.  No way to schedule all those field sports at all levels if we dont start until March.


----------



## Eagle33

Penalty Kicks Stink said:


> Been hearing that if we get to play it will be Varsity level only.  No way to schedule all those field sports at all levels if we dont start until March.


I don't think playing Varsity only can fly in Public HS.


----------



## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> Check what I said and show me where I mention per capita....you’re just looking to try to be right and put words in my mouth.  The CURVE is similar....dear lord please pay attention.


Ok.  I will agree that, for over 90% of the world, the curve is represented with an X and Y axis.  And, for many places, the December numbers are bigger than the February ones.

Is that your point?  I could have sworn you were making up some bullshit story that the covid response in AZ was in some way similarly effective to the covid response in other places.


----------



## Eagle33

lafalafa said:


> Some private schools and districts are still doing conditioning.
> 
> Our LA county conditioning was suspended for January but the hope to resume in February.  School board decision.
> 
> As far as the season need to get to the orange tier before playing games as things stand now.  Jan 25 Southern Section is supposedly going to come out with a announcement about season #1 football and #2 soccer (mar-june)


Conditioning is allowed, at least by CIF-SS
"Physical conditioning, practice, skill building, and training that can be conducted outdoors, with 6-feet of physical distancing, and within stable team cohorts are currently authorized for all sports regardless of county tier status."


----------



## lafalafa

Eagle33 said:


> Conditioning is allowed, at least by CIF-SS
> "Physical conditioning, practice, skill building, and training that can be conducted outdoors, with 6-feet of physical distancing, and within stable team cohorts are currently authorized for all sports regardless of county tier status."


Yeah but our school board decided to suspend  conditioning due to case rates in LA county


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> Is that your point? I could have sworn you were making up some bullshit story that the covid response in AZ was in some way similarly effective to the covid response in other places.


How effective has the covid response been in CA vs lets say TX and FL. Two states that have substantially different responses. 

The idea behind the covid response is to limit the SPREAD of the virus. 

As of today
CA 72k cases per million
TX 71k cases per million
FL 71k cases per million


----------



## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> How effective has the covid response been in CA vs lets say TX and FL. Two states that have substantially different responses.
> 
> The idea behind the covid response is to limit the SPREAD of the virus.
> 
> As of today
> CA 72k cases per million
> TX 71k cases per million
> FL 71k cases per million


At least you’re smart enough not to hitch your rhetorical wagon to AZ.  That catastrophe is a millstone when you’re trying to swim.  

It belongs in the covid denialism thread, though.   This thread is for talking about opening youth sports in CA.


----------



## texanincali

Desert Hound said:


> How effective has the covid response been in CA vs lets say TX and FL. Two states that have substantially different responses.
> 
> The idea behind the covid response is to limit the SPREAD of the virus.
> 
> As of today
> CA 72k cases per million
> TX 71k cases per million
> FL 71k cases per million


Finally a little data that makes sense.  Texas is now completing their HS football season.  While it apparently had a few cancellations, it’s ultimately going to finish without much issue at all.  They have been playing ECNL and MLS league without much issue either.

The idea that shutting down youth sports helps in any way is simply fallacy.  It’s a step too far to say keeping youth sports going is better, but is certainly is not worse than what CA has done.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> Check what I said and show me where I mention per capita....you’re just looking to try to be right and put words in my mouth.  The CURVE is similar....dear lord please pay attention.


The curve is similar?  The curve of your concave skull is also similar.  Any curve is similar to another curve by virtue of both being curves.

This is so incredibly stupid it could only come from a magat.  99.8 of all countries in the world are killing people at a much lower rate than Arizona, but they’re all similar because they have similar flags in that they’re all rectangular.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> Ok.  I will agree that, for over 90% of the world, the curve is represented with an X and Y axis.  And, for many places, the December numbers are bigger than the February ones.
> 
> Is that your point?  I could have sworn you were making up some bullshit story that the covid response in AZ was in some way similarly effective to the covid response in other places.


Yes...my point was most of the world has seen similar curves of one small peak followed later by a second larger.  I’ll accept this as your apology.

No...that was you looking to be right on something.


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> Ok.  I will agree that, for over 90% of the world, the curve is represented with an X and Y axis.  And, for many places, the December numbers are bigger than the February ones.
> 
> Is that your point?  I could have sworn you were making up some bullshit story that the covid response in AZ was in some way similarly effective to the covid response in other places.


He was making that point until you pointed out how stupid the point was, so then he claimed that he was just pointing out how lovely curves are.  Because who doesn’t want to talk about the beauty of curves in a thread discussing why it’s such a bad idea to play HS soccer right now.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> He was making that point until you pointed out how stupid the point was, so then he claimed that he was just pointing out how lovely curves are.  Because who doesn’t want to talk about the beauty of curves in a thread discussing why it’s such a bad idea to play HS soccer right now.


Let’s see what was said:



Kicker4Life said:


> Pretty much a similar curve to 90% of the world right now.....even CA.



Yep...Wrong again....damn it must suck to be so willing and able to troll people with your demeaning rhetoric but be wrong EVERY time you try your BS in my neighborhood.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Anon9 said:


> California is doing sooooo much better with their liberal policies. You buffoon.


As of last week.  AZ #1   CA#2   Rhode Island #3  in terms of the worse countries controlling COVID per capita. 









						These three states have the worst Covid infection rates of anywhere in the world
					

Arizona currently has the highest per-capita rate of new Covid-19 infections, with 785 cases per 100,000 people over the past seven days, followed closely by California and Rhode Island.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> At least you’re smart enough not to hitch your rhetorical wagon to AZ. That catastrophe is a millstone when you’re trying to swim.
> 
> It belongs in the covid denialism thread, though. This thread is for talking about opening youth sports in CA.


What is interesting is that cases per million do not line up neatly with deaths per million. As a matter of fact the numbers jump all over the place when looking at the 2.

There are countries with fewer cases per million vs other countries and yet have higher deaths per million. It works the other way as well.

Same thing with states. There are a number of states with fewer cases per million then lets say CA and yet have dramatically higher deaths per million. And the reverse is true. There are states with higher cases per million with less deaths per million.

Utah has 100k cases per million and yet has far fewer deaths per million vs CA.
Wisconsin has almost the identical cases per million as AZ and yet their deaths per million is just above CA.
Michigan has about the same deaths per million as AZ but cases per million are well south of CA

And so on.

That implies strongly that cases per million and deaths per million do not work in tandem. There are clearly other factors at play that play it seems a greater role.

And back to the point. CA idea was to limit the spread of the disease. They have not done any better stopping the spread compared to the 2 other largest states in the union who took vastly different approaches.

One might ask...why have we shut our schools, biz, sports, etc when the spread of the virus here is the same as TX and FL who have not done those things CA did.


----------



## EOTL

Desert Hound said:


> What is interesting is that cases per million do not line up neatly with deaths per million. As a matter of fact the numbers jump all over the place when looking at the 2.
> 
> There are countries with fewer cases per million vs other countries and yet have higher deaths per million. It works the other way as well.
> 
> Same thing with states. There are a number of states with fewer cases per million then lets say CA and yet have dramatically higher deaths per million. And the reverse is true. There are states with higher cases per million with less deaths per million.
> 
> Utah has 100k cases per million and yet has far fewer deaths per million vs CA.
> Wisconsin has almost the identical cases per million as AZ and yet their deaths per million is just above CA.
> Michigan has about the same deaths per million as AZ but cases per million are well south of CA
> 
> And so on.
> 
> That implies strongly that cases per million and deaths per million do not work in tandem. There are clearly other factors at play that play it seems a greater role.
> 
> And back to the point. CA idea was to limit the spread of the disease. They have not done any better stopping the spread compared to the 2 other largest states in the union who took vastly different approaches.
> 
> One might ask...why have we shut our schools, biz, sports, etc when the spread of the virus here is the same as TX and FL who have not done those things.


If CA had the same number of deaths per capita as AZ, that would be another 27,000 people dead. Yes, CA’s rules have been very effective despite the best efforts of magats.


----------



## Desert Hound

Since Nov 1

CA has seen a 203% increase in cases
TX has seen a 108% increase in cases
FL has seen a 87% increase in cases. 

Which state has the toughest measures in place?

AZ over the same time period has seen cases jump 159%

So objectively looking at the data, CA has not been successful in stopping the spread over the past 2.5 months despite having easily the most draconian lockdowns, right?


----------



## Kicker4Life

Desert Hound said:


> Since Nov 1
> 
> CA has seen a 203% increase in cases
> TX has seen a 108% increase in cases
> FL has seen a 87% increase in cases.
> 
> Which state has the toughest measures in place?
> 
> AZ over the same time period has seen cases jump 159%
> 
> So objectively looking at the data, CA has not been successful in stopping the spread over the past 2.5 months despite having easily the most draconian lockdowns, right?


But that’s everyone else’s fault....lol


----------



## EOTL

Desert Hound said:


> What is interesting is that cases per million do not line up neatly with deaths per million. As a matter of fact the numbers jump all over the place when looking at the 2.
> 
> There are countries with fewer cases per million vs other countries and yet have higher deaths per million. It works the other way as well.
> 
> Same thing with states. There are a number of states with fewer cases per million then lets say CA and yet have dramatically higher deaths per million. And the reverse is true. There are states with higher cases per million with less deaths per million.
> 
> Utah has 100k cases per million and yet has far fewer deaths per million vs CA.
> Wisconsin has almost the identical cases per million as AZ and yet their deaths per million is just above CA.
> Michigan has about the same deaths per million as AZ but cases per million are well south of CA
> 
> And so on.
> 
> That implies strongly that cases per million and deaths per million do not work in tandem. There are clearly other factors at play that play it seems a greater role.
> 
> And back to the point. CA idea was to limit the spread of the disease. They have not done any better stopping the spread compared to the 2 other largest states in the union who took vastly different approaches.
> 
> One might ask...why have we shut our schools, biz, sports, etc when the spread of the virus here is the same as TX and FL who have not done those things CA did.


I can see how you wouldn’t want to talk about your state.


----------



## EOTL

Desert Hound said:


> Since Nov 1
> 
> CA has seen a 203% increase in cases
> TX has seen a 108% increase in cases
> FL has seen a 87% increase in cases.
> 
> Which state has the toughest measures in place?
> 
> AZ over the same time period has seen cases jump 159%
> 
> So objectively looking at the data, CA has not been successful in stopping the spread over the past 2.5 months despite having easily the most draconian lockdowns, right?


Look at these distractions from the rate at which  AZ has killed people.

Everyone, even a Bronze Baboon, knows that the number of cases is based on what is reported, not what is actually happening. As we all know, the Mango Magat had explicitly instructed states to stop testing so that they would have fewer cases. 

We’ve already been through this magatly pathetic argument.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Look at these distractions from the rate at which  AZ has killed people.
> 
> Everyone, even a Bronze Baboon, knows that the number of cases is based on what is reported, not what is actually happening. As we all know, the Mango Magat had explicitly instructed states to stop testing so that they would have fewer cases.
> 
> We’ve already been through this magatly pathetic argument.


His comment was directed at panic over testing rather than deaths.  You were probably busy coaching your non existent kids that don’t play soccer and missed the context.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Look at these distractions from the rate at which  AZ has killed people.
> 
> Everyone, even a Bronze Baboon, knows that the number of cases is based on what is reported, not what is actually happening. As we all know, the Mango Magat had explicitly instructed states to stop testing so that they would have fewer cases.
> 
> We’ve already been through this magatly pathetic argument.


Then why has AZ’s testing rate daily average almost doubled from where it was in July? (Source azdhs.gov)

You’re running out of straws to grab for.......


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> His comment was directed at panic over testing rather than deaths.  You were probably busy coaching your non existent kids that don’t play soccer and missed the context.


Oh boy. No it was not. It was to deflect from how terribly AZ is doing compared to CA. Magats want to talk about anything other than how many people are dying. Maybe this os a good time for @MSK357 to tell us how 400,000 people have died of heartburn “with” covid.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> Then why has AZ’s testing rate daily average almost doubled from where it was in July? (Source azdhs.gov)
> 
> You’re running out of straws to grab for.......


Why are people dying at almost twice the rate per capita than in CA? Are they all running into cacti “with covid”?


----------



## EOTL

Did y’all hear how Magat Spawn Daughter refused to let the Secret Service  who was protecting them use any of their 6.5 bathrooms, so Obama and even Pence graciously agreed to let them use one of theirs?  Ultimately, the issue was resolved when Ickabod Kushner set up his buddy, who’s been renting them a toilet in a basement for $3,000 a month.


----------



## EOTL

Looks like McShit in his Pants is looting the WH on his way out.


----------



## EOTL

I love it. Donald Trump. Jenius. 


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349757597872697346


----------



## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> Then why has AZ’s testing rate daily average almost doubled from where it was in July? (Source azdhs.gov)
> 
> You’re running out of straws to grab for.......


Are you seriously trying to argue that AZ has a good record on covid containment?

Really?  Just do a quick web search for covid deaths in AZ, think a little, and pick something else to champion.  

Getting rid of the "unnaturally large" definition for handballs, perhaps.   Take a stand on VAR.  Tell us whether direct is better than possession.

Something else.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Why are people dying at almost twice the rate per capita than in CA? Are they all running into cacti “with covid”?


That’s a different question than the statement I already proved wrong.  Maybe, but it is true that more older people are dying with Covid by the day.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> Are you seriously trying to argue that AZ has a good record on covid containment?
> 
> Really?  Just do a quick web search for covid deaths in AZ, think a little, and pick something else to champion.
> 
> Getting rid of the "unnaturally large" definition for handballs, perhaps.   Take a stand on VAR.  Tell us whether direct is better than possession.
> 
> Something else.


Actually what I am pointing out is that despite CA having draconian lockdowns we see the following:

Cases per million in CA are about identical to FL and to TX. States that have taken a very different approach. Think restaurants, schools, sports, etc. 

Right? So besides screwing the pooch on education, biz, etc, what has CA lockdowns achieved when you compare them to the 2 other largest states? 

Isn't the theory that lockdowns etc are supposed to stop the spread of the virus? 

Explain why CA and FL and TX have the same cases per million? 

Explain why over the past 2.5 months CA despite draconian measures has seen their cases grow faster than almost every other state in the union. If masks and lockdowns were the key...why is CA experiencing what it is?


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> Are you seriously trying to argue that AZ has a good record on covid containment?
> 
> Really?  Just do a quick web search for covid deaths in AZ, think a little, and pick something else to champion.
> 
> Getting rid of the "unnaturally large" definition for handballs, perhaps.   Take a stand on VAR.  Tell us whether direct is better than possession.
> 
> Something else.


Are you confusing me with the voices in your head???  

How do you correlate proving AZ is testing more not less people with defending their response to Covid?  

That’s twice in 1 day (3 in 2 days) you have tried to argue with me about something that I’m not arguing.  

Holy dipshit Batman!!!!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Oh boy. No it was not. It was to deflect from how terribly AZ is doing compared to CA. Magats want to talk about anything other than how many people are dying. Maybe this os a good time for @MSK357 to tell us how 400,000 people have died of heartburn “with” covid.



Oh boy, I watched the video you reference.  People are dying everywhere.  The fact that you’ve posted 2,000 times on it makes me wonder if you have a point.  Your liberal governor ignored safety.  His liberal, drunken bag of bones auntie ignored the safety.  Dementia Joe has been photographed ignoring safety, numerous times, and yet you can’t stop obsessing about Trump.

Concerning, don’t you think?


----------



## WestOfFive

N00B said:


> Sorry, not sorry... neither do you.





N00B said:


> Sorry, not sorry... neither do you.





Kicker4Life said:


> But that’s everyone else’s fault....lol





Scott m Shurson said:


> Oh boy, I watched the video you reference.  People are dying everywhere.  The fact that you’ve posted 2,000 times on it makes me wonder if you have a point.  Your liberal governor ignored safety.  His liberal, drunken bag of bones auntie ignored the safety.  Dementia Joe has been photographed ignoring safety, numerous times, and yet you can’t stop obsessing about Trump.
> 
> Concerning, don’t you think?


----------



## EOTL

WestOfFive said:


> View attachment 9934View attachment 9934


Outlaw’s got a new burner account.


----------



## WestOfFive

EOTL said:


> Outlaw’s got a new burner account.


Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh....!!!


----------



## espola

EOTL said:


> Did y’all hear how Magat Spawn Daughter refused to let the Secret Service  who was protecting them use any of their 6.5 bathrooms, so Obama and even Pence graciously agreed to let them use one of theirs?  Ultimately, the issue was resolved when Ickabod Kushner set up his buddy, who’s been renting them a toilet in a basement for $3,000 a month.


They should have parked a FEMA portable toilet trailer on the street outside, one with a constantly-on diesel motor to provide lighting and leaky connections to the local water and sewer.


----------



## EOTL

Has anyone seen that Magat Jr. is being investigated for misusing daddy’s inaugural funds. 

Anyone wanna guess what he spent it on (besides coke, which is too easy)?


----------



## EOTL

WestOfFive said:


> Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh....!!!


How’s it feel to be castrated?


----------



## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> Are you confusing me with the voices in your head???
> 
> How do you correlate proving AZ is testing more not less people with defending their response to Covid?
> 
> That’s twice in 1 day (3 in 2 days) you have tried to argue with me about something that I’m not arguing.
> 
> Holy dipshit Batman!!!!


Care to clarify what you mean by saying the AZ curve is similar to 90% of the world?

Other than, "starts low and is higher later", I really don't see much similarity at all.  If nothing else, the area under the curve for AZ is an order of magnitude higher than the area under the curve for the non-US part of the world.  That doesn't sound very similar.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> Care to clarify what you mean by saying the AZ curve is similar to 90% of the world?
> 
> Other than, "starts low and is higher later", I really don't see much similarity at all.  If nothing else, the area under the curve for AZ is an order of magnitude higher than the area under the curve for the non-US part of the world.  That doesn't sound very similar.


Still trying to find an angle....smh.


----------



## dad4

Kicker4Life said:


> Still trying to find an angle....smh.


No, just pointing out that your "90%" comment was indefensible.  Which is why you aren't defending it- it wasn't true.

AZ isn't like 90% of the world on this.  AZ is in the worst half of the worst half of the worst 1%.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> Ok.  I will agree that, for over 90% of the world, the curve is represented with an X and Y axis.  And, for many places, the December numbers are bigger than the February ones.


First you agree, then you even paraphrase my point.  You then somehow correlate AZ increasing their testing to me defending AZ’s Covid response, are left with egg on your face so you go back to an statement I made earlier and change your POV to try to create another agreement cause.....why?

***rhetorical question....please don’t try to answer it***


----------



## Anon9

I guess @Dominic don't care about politics anymore. Why else is @EOTL still allowed to post?


----------



## Bubba

Read this article , I guess american football said f#@k it.




__





						Redirect Notice
					





					www.google.com


----------



## EOTL

Anon9 said:


> I guess @Dominic don't care about politics anymore. Why else is @EOTL still allowed to post?


As much as you snowflakes would love a safe space where you can constantly complain about social distancing requirements and demand the recall of Governor Newsom, too bad. If y’all are gonna demand Newsom’s recall and blame liberals for whatever next thing you lost, I think it’s perfectly fair to discuss Cadet Bone Spurs as well. Have you ever once discussed soccer at this soccer forum?


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> What’s the point the rally? Start playing sports that have been shut down due to Covid?
> 
> Sorry not sorry that you don’t get to control the narrative. If you want to kill people playing kiddie sports, you will get deserved pushback.


PLEASE!  For the love of God!  Get a job, get a hobby, just please go away!  There is no evidence that says that youth sports is a factor in the spread of Covid.  Ask the other 45 states that played in the fall.  Prove your statement with facts to GO AWAY.


----------



## Anon9

EOTL said:


> As much as you snowflakes would love a safe space where you can constantly complain about social distancing requirements and demand the recall of Governor Newsom, too bad. If y’all are gonna demand Newsom’s recall and blame liberals for whatever next thing you lost, I think it’s perfectly fair to discuss Cadet Bone Spurs as well. Have you ever once discussed soccer at this soccer forum?


Doooooooooom


----------



## dad4

Anon9 said:


> I guess @Dominic don't care about politics anymore. Why else is @EOTL still allowed to post?


If we ruin the site with covid talk, that's on us.

It's going to be a long wait for the numbers to drop enough for league play.


----------



## Anon9

dad4 said:


> If we ruin the site with covid talk, that's on us.
> 
> It's going to be a long wait for the numbers to drop enough for league play.


Who needs league play?


----------



## EOTL

TOSDCI said:


> PLEASE!  For the love of God!  Get a job, get a hobby, just please go away!  There is no evidence that says that youth sports is a factor in the spread of Covid.  Ask the other 45 states that played in the fall.  Prove your statement with facts to GO AWAY.


Are you talking to me or Gavin Newsom?

Enjoy no soccer because you parents are too dumb to keep it from spreading. You’d think at some point that you and your friends would figure out that maybe doing what you should would get this over earlier. But, nope, y’all are going to make this go on until everyone is vaccinated. And even that will take longer than it should ‘cuz anti-vaxxers?  Let me guess, you’re one of those too?

The irony is that those who whine the most about these restrictions happen to be the ones responsible for their existence.


----------



## dad4

Anon9 said:


> Who needs league play?




Hope your kid has fun at whatever side games you've found or created.


----------



## Anon9

dad4 said:


> Hope your kid has fun at whatever side games you've found or created.


Side games? Training my friend. You only need a ball, a wall, and love for the game.


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> Are you talking to me or Gavin Newsom?
> 
> Enjoy no soccer because you parents are too dumb to keep it from spreading. You’d think at some point that you and your friends would figure out that maybe doing what you should would get this over earlier. But, nope, y’all are going to make this go on until everyone is vaccinated. And even that will take longer than it should ‘cuz anti-vaxxers?  Let me guess, you’re one of those too?
> 
> The irony is that those who whine the most about these restrictions happen to be the ones responsible for their existence.


I am pretty far towards the pro-lockdown end of it, and even I think closing outdoor sports is counterproductive.

Even if 90% of people follow the rules, the other 10% will get together at Kaitlyn's house.  And, because it is indoors, 5 people at Kaitlyn's is worse than 50 people playing ball outdoors.


----------



## dad4

Anon9 said:


> Side games? Training my friend. You only need a ball, a wall, and love for the game.


Nah.  My kid plays for fun.  Training is only fun for her if she can imagine the game it is for.  

If you're really on month 10 of nothing but training, ouch.  I admire your willpower.


----------



## socalkdg

dad4 said:


> I am pretty far towards the pro-lockdown end of it, and even I think closing outdoor sports is counterproductive.
> 
> Even if 90% of people follow the rules, the other 10% will get together at Kaitlyn's house.  And, because it is indoors, 5 people at Kaitlyn's is worse than 50 people playing ball outdoors.


Been saying the same thing.   Science says 15X safer outside than inside.   Even our company sets up tables outside for breaks and lunches and shut down the inside.   Let the kids play outside, require masks for the parents, good to go.


----------



## Grace T.

A survey out of Minnesota on masks and sports...14 kids collapsed, 11 needed emergency care.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349385614106439688


----------



## TOSDCI

dad4 said:


> I am pretty far towards the pro-lockdown end of it, and even I think closing outdoor sports is counterproductive.
> 
> Even if 90% of people follow the rules, the other 10% will get together at Kaitlyn's house.  And, because it is indoors, 5 people at Kaitlyn's is worse than 50 people playing ball outdoors.


And it's significantly safer to play 10 minutes from your home than to travel every weekend to Arizona and Utah.  With that being said, my family has traveled to Arizona on multiple occasions including Surf Cup.  For Surf Cup, my kids played 8 games over 4 days during a huge spike in infections and none of the kids on the teams have gotten Covid as a result of soccer.


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> I am pretty far towards the pro-lockdown end of it, and even I think closing outdoor sports is counterproductive.
> 
> Even if 90% of people follow the rules, the other 10% will get together at Kaitlyn's house.  And, because it is indoors, 5 people at Kaitlyn's is worse than 50 people playing ball outdoors.


I really don't think what happens at the Jenner household is any of our business.


----------



## WestOfFive

Grace T. said:


> A survey out of Minnesota on masks and sports...14 kids collapsed, 11 needed emergency care.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349385614106439688


Thank you for sharing.....


----------



## EOTL

Grace T. said:


> A survey out of Minnesota on masks and sports...14 kids collapsed, 11 needed emergency care.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349385614106439688


Oh lord. Yes, if you wear the wrong masks, I can see how that might be a problem. But even as a fake lawyer, you should know that a post from a twitter account titled “letthemplay” that is unsupported by any support for their assertion, let alone a medical study, is a pathetic magaty way to spread ridiculous self-serving false propaganda. How hard and long did you have to google to find anything that told you what you wanted to hear? Probably a long tome since you claim you don’t even have twitter. I’m sure it would have been much easier to find nonsense if Parler were still a thing.

A better, legitimate source would be something like:









						Face masks don't hinder breathing during exercise, study finds
					

A new study has found that exercise performance and blood and muscle oxygen levels are not affected for healthy individuals wearing a face mask during strenuous workouts.



					www.sciencedaily.com
				




or this:









						Safety & Efficacy of Masks & Face Coverings During Exercise
					

More studies are revealing the effectiveness of wearing face coverings to stem the spread of COVID-19. Learn what researchers are discovering as you develop your health club's mask policy.




					www.ihrsa.org
				




or this:









						Face Masks Won't Hamper Your Workout, Study Says
					

The study did not find evidence to support the idea that vigorous exercise with a mask could compromise oxygen uptake or increase rebreathing of carbon dioxide, which could lead to a condition in which carbon dioxide displaces oxygen in the blood.




					www.webmd.com
				




or this:



			Redirect Notice
		


or this:









						All About Masks and Coronavirus
					

Does mask protect you from the coronavirus? Learn more about masks and how to stay safe in this pandemic.




					www.umms.org
				




or this:









						Tips for wearing a mask while exercising
					

You might think a mask is a barrier to working out. Read these FAQ to help you figure out the safest approach to staying active.




					www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org


----------



## EOTL

TOSDCI said:


> And it's significantly safer to play 10 minutes from your home than to travel every weekend to Arizona and Utah.  With that being said, my family has traveled to Arizona on multiple occasions including Surf Cup.  For Surf Cup, my kids played 8 games over 4 days during a huge spike in infections and none of the kids on the teams have gotten Covid as a result of soccer.


Did they not get it, or are they not showing symptoms?  Did they all get tested?  How many of them, like you, concluded that they didn’t have covid and are therefore acting accordingly?  How many of them quarantined for 14 days upon returning?


----------



## dad4

TOSDCI said:


> And it's significantly safer to play 10 minutes from your home than to travel every weekend to Arizona and Utah.  With that being said, my family has traveled to Arizona on multiple occasions including Surf Cup.  For Surf Cup, my kids played 8 games over 4 days during a huge spike in infections and none of the kids on the teams have gotten Covid as a result of soccer.


No one has done a study large enough to evaluate whether on field covid transmission does or does not exist.  Or, if it does exist, what the odds are.

Your statement is, essentially, “ I dealt one card from a deck.  It wasn’t the queen of spades.  Therefore the deck has no queen of spades.”

I happen to believe that on field transmission is a relatively low risk, the drive and hotel are medium risk, and the restaurant dinner is a high risk.  But only the restaurant part has strong data behind it.


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> Oh lord. Yes, if you wear the wrong masks, I can see how that might be a problem. But even as a fake lawyer, you should know that a post from a twitter account titled “letthemplay” that is unsupported by any support for their assertion, let alone a medical study, is a pathetic magaty way to spread ridiculous self-serving false propaganda. How hard and long did you have to google to find anything that told you what you wanted to hear? Probably a long tome since you claim you don’t even have twitter. I’m sure it would have been much easier to find nonsense if Parler were still a thing.
> 
> A better, legitimate source would be something like:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Face masks don't hinder breathing during exercise, study finds
> 
> 
> A new study has found that exercise performance and blood and muscle oxygen levels are not affected for healthy individuals wearing a face mask during strenuous workouts.
> 
> 
> 
> www.sciencedaily.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Awesome, 14 participants riding a stationary bike for 6 to 12 minutes.*
> or this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Safety & Efficacy of Masks & Face Coverings During Exercise
> 
> 
> More studies are revealing the effectiveness of wearing face coverings to stem the spread of COVID-19. Learn what researchers are discovering as you develop your health club's mask policy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ihrsa.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *WHO recommends no mask when exercising.*
> 
> or this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Face Masks Won't Hamper Your Workout, Study Says
> 
> 
> The study did not find evidence to support the idea that vigorous exercise with a mask could compromise oxygen uptake or increase rebreathing of carbon dioxide, which could lead to a condition in which carbon dioxide displaces oxygen in the blood.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.webmd.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Same study as the first one, 14 adults on a stationary bike.*
> or this:
> 
> 
> 
> Redirect Notice
> 
> 
> *Same bike study.*
> 
> or this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All About Masks and Coronavirus
> 
> 
> Does mask protect you from the coronavirus? Learn more about masks and how to stay safe in this pandemic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.umms.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tips for wearing a mask while exercising
> 
> 
> You might think a mask is a barrier to working out. Read these FAQ to help you figure out the safest approach to staying active.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org


Of your six links, 3 are from a stationary bike test for 6-12 minutes.  Two specifically say to take precaution during strenuous exercise and one I have no clue the point you were trying to make.

You're going to need to do more than google "mask while exercising" and pasting the first six links you see.  What a train wreck of a post.  You are an absolutely shambolic poster and really add zero value to this board.  You position yourself as some kind of intellectual when the reality is your posts vividly display otherwise. 

Do you not understand the difference between exercise and sport?  Is that a tough concept to grasp?  I am sure you don't have any issues when wearing a mask during your yoga session, but to compare exercise to sport is lunacy at best.  You want to wear a mask in a volleyball match, fine.  You want to wear one is a baseball game, fine.  I doubt there would much issue with these sports that don't require the level of aerobic performance as say, soccer, basketball, cross country, etc. 

Can you just stop with the disingenuousness you bring to this forum?  I can't speak for everyone, but you have been a complete disaster for months and are a shockingly bad poster.


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Did they not get it, or are they not showing symptoms?  Did they all get tested?  How many of them, like you, concluded that they didn’t have covid and are therefore acting accordingly?  How many of them quarantined for 14 days upon returning?


Ummm....we were tested and all were negative.  Good try though!


----------



## TOSDCI

dad4 said:


> No one has done a study large enough to evaluate whether on field covid transmission does or does not exist.  Or, if it does exist, what the odds are.
> 
> Your statement is, essentially, “ I dealt one card from a deck.  It wasn’t the queen of spades.  Therefore the deck has no queen of spades.”
> 
> I happen to believe that on field transmission is a relatively low risk, the drive and hotel are medium risk, and the restaurant dinner is a high risk.  But only the restaurant part has strong data behind it.


Here you go.....https://ortho.wisc.edu/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/COVID-19-in-Youth-Soccer.pdf


----------



## EOTL

TOSDCI said:


> Ummm....we were tested and all were negative.  Good try though!


That’s good. I am glad your child’s team handled it as they did. If only most others did the same.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> Of your six links, 3 are from a stationary bike test for 6-12 minutes.  Two specifically say to take precaution during strenuous exercise and one I have no clue the point you were trying to make.
> 
> You're going to need to do more than google "mask while exercising" and pasting the first six links you see.  What a train wreck of a post.  You are an absolutely shambolic poster and really add zero value to this board.  You position yourself as some kind of intellectual when the reality is your posts vividly display otherwise.
> 
> Do you not understand the difference between exercise and sport?  Is that a tough concept to grasp?  I am sure you don't have any issues when wearing a mask during your yoga session, but to compare exercise to sport is lunacy at best.  You want to wear a mask in a volleyball match, fine.  You want to wear one is a baseball game, fine.  I doubt there would much issue with these sports that don't require the level of aerobic performance as say, soccer, basketball, cross country, etc.
> 
> Can you just stop with the disingenuousness you bring to this forum?  I can't speak for everyone, but you have been a complete disaster for months and are a shockingly bad poster.


You’re criticizing my posts on comparison to an unsupported twitter post from an account that you cam tell from the name is biased?  Sure.  Rationalize however you want.


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> and the restaurant dinner is a high risk.  But only the restaurant part has strong data behind it.


Nope actually that's not true.  Very little evidence that restaurants are high risk, particularly outdoors dining.  That's why an LA judge and SD judge ruled against certain restrictions on restaurants.  While you might be able to argue that there isn't strong evidence that its safe, to say that there is strong data that its high risk is patently false. 








						Has Restaurants' Role in Spreading COVID-19 Been Exaggerated?
					

The evidence is limited and mixed, but data from New York, Minnesota, and California suggest that restaurants there account for a small share of infections.




					reason.com


----------



## EOTL

watfly said:


> Nope actually that's not true.  Very little evidence that restaurants are high risk, particularly outdoors dining.  That's why an LA judge and SD judge ruled against certain restrictions on restaurants.  While you might be able to argue that there isn't strong evidence that its safe, to say that there is strong data that its high risk is patently false.


This is so great. Nothing is high risk, so everything must be fine. So weird, though, that 400,000 people have died as a result of old people all spreading it from their nursing home beds.


----------



## socalkdg

dad4 said:


> No one has done a study large enough to evaluate whether on field covid transmission does or does not exist.  Or, if it does exist, what the odds are.
> 
> Your statement is, essentially, “ I dealt one card from a deck.  It wasn’t the queen of spades.  Therefore the deck has no queen of spades.”
> 
> I happen to believe that on field transmission is a relatively low risk, the drive and hotel are medium risk, and the restaurant dinner is a high risk.  But only the restaurant part has strong data behind it.


They have done studies on inside and outside transmission of covid.   Outside is safer by 18.7 times.  Yes, none of these studies are perfect but at least they are applying science.

Not sure why the drive isn't safe, it is after all, only our family.   The hotel could be an issue and why choosing a place to stay with outside entrances instead of a casino type place with indoor entrances is actually preferred.   Finally get all food to go, which is happening every place in California already.   Lastly let the kids play locally outside and you will see less travelling and happier people and no affect on virus numbers.









						Outdoor Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 and Other Respiratory Viruses: A Systematic Review
					

This systematic review found that while outdoor environments do seem at lower risk for transmission of SARS-CoV-2 and other respiratory viruses than indoor envi




					academic.oup.com


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> You’re criticizing my posts on comparison to an unsupported twitter post from an account that you cam tell from the name is biased?  Sure.  Rationalize however you want.


Biased?  As crazy as it sounds, we can probably agree that anything around this subject is biased.  I really don't think anyone needs a study to determine whether or not wearing a mask during a soccer game is detrimental.  The answer is quite obvious.  Did you know that the original recommendation from the NCAA was to make soccer teams train in their masks?  After numerous training staffs and coaching staffs told the NCAA there is no way they would make the players do that, the NCAA changed its stance.  

I can't believe you think its far fetched that playing soccer in a mask is detrimental.  Maybe the reason there isn't much data on this is because no one is willing to volunteer for something so stupid.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> This is so great. Nothing is high risk, so everything must be fine. So weird, though, that 400,000 people have died as a result of old people all spreading it from their nursing home beds.


So weird that you have ZERO evidence to support your claims of Outdoor ANYTHING transmitting Covid....so you predictably, systematically go straight to how many people have died with Covid thinking that is going to somehow change a point of view that is supported by science.  

I predict the next move is some sort of insult....tick tock....


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> Biased?  As crazy as it sounds, we can probably agree that anything around this subject is biased.  I really don't think anyone needs a study to determine whether or not wearing a mask during a soccer game is detrimental.  The answer is quite obvious.  Did you know that the original recommendation from the NCAA was to make soccer teams train in their masks?  After numerous training staffs and coaching staffs told the NCAA there is no way they would make the players do that, the NCAA changed its stance.
> 
> I can't believe you think its far fetched that playing soccer in a mask is detrimental.  Maybe the reason there isn't much data on this is because no one is willing to volunteer for something so stupid.


Nice use of the word “detrimental”, since that is very different than “dangerous”. Of course a mask will be detrimental to effectiveness, butnthere is nothing that suggests wearing an appropriate mask during exercise is dangerous. Also nice attempt to just ignore every actual study by every actual reputable source that it is not dangerous. Also nice circular argument that no one will volunteer for a study to determine whether something might be dangerous because it is dangerous. Especially when there have been numerous volunteers in numerous studies. This is just more anti-science denialism. Too bad the unsupported twitter post that you’re relying on that is contrary to what every reputable source is saying isn’t going to get what you want. And don’t tell me the Mayo Clinic, Science Daily, the IHRSA, WebMD, and the University of Maryland are biased. Bulls**t. You’re just another anti-science denialist who doesn’t lime what science and scientists say, you’re going to side with a tweet from an entity you’ve never heard of and whose name tells you exactly what agenda it has.

You seem like the type of person the believes the earth is flat and vaccines cause autism and spend hours on the net until you find a whackadoo who said it on twitter tocreinforce the crazy thing you already believed.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> So weird that you have ZERO evidence to support your claims of Outdoor ANYTHING transmitting Covid....so you predictably, systematically go straight to how many people have died with Covid thinking that is going to somehow change a point of view that is supported by science.
> 
> I predict the next move is some sort of insult....tick tock....


That’s great. It’s impossible to spread covid outdoors!  Is it because the sunlight gets inside you like the Mango Magat says?  Give me a break.


----------



## mccorn

I come on this site occasionally to see if there's anything pertinent to the state of youth soccer. Sadly, I can't find anything worth my time among all of the redundant dribble coming from a few people with nothing better to do than repeat the same personal opinions over and over.


----------



## WestOfFive

mccorn said:


> I come on this site occasionally to see if there's anything pertinent to the state of youth soccer. Sadly, I can't find anything worth my time among all of the redundant dribble coming from a few people with nothing better to do than repeat the same personal opinions over and over.



Wayne retires..........Manager for Derby...........


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> Nice use of the word “detrimental”, since that is very different than “dangerous”. Of course a mask will be detrimental to effectiveness, butnthere is nothing that suggests wearing an appropriate mask during exercise is dangerous. Also nice attempt to just ignore every actual study by every actual reputable source that it is not dangerous. Also nice circular argument that no one will volunteer for a study to determine whether something might be dangerous because it is dangerous. Especially when there have been numerous volunteers in numerous studies. This is just more anti-science denialism. Too bad the unsupported twitter post that you’re relying on that is contrary to what every reputable source is saying isn’t going to get what you want. And don’t tell me the Mayo Clinic, Science Daily, the IHRSA, WebMD, and the University of Maryland are biased. Bulls**t. You’re just another anti-science denialist who doesn’t lime what science and scientists say, you’re going to side with a tweet from an entity you’ve never heard of and whose name tells you exactly what agenda it has.
> 
> You seem like the type of person the believes the earth is flat and vaccines cause autism and spend hours on the net until you find a whackadoo who said it on twitter tocreinforce the crazy thing you already believed.


Lots of speculation on your part, but seems par for the course.  I'd be interested in your posts if it wasn't the same regurgitated drivel.  

We are just asking you to do better.  Give some effort.  Earth is round.  For the record, I'm not siding with some tweet, I'm siding with logic.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Has anyone seen that Magat Jr. is being investigated for misusing daddy’s inaugural funds.
> 
> Anyone wanna guess what he spent it on (besides coke, which is too easy)?


Is coke too easy?  Asking for a Hunter Biden.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> Lots of speculation on your part, but seems par for the course.  I'd be interested in your posts if it wasn't the same regurgitated drivel.
> 
> We are just asking you to do better.  Give some effort.  Earth is round.  For the record, I'm not siding with some tweet, I'm siding with logic.


If you want to do better, start by listening to medical experts and not twitter posts by “letthemplay”.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> As much as you snowflakes would love a safe space where you can constantly complain about social distancing requirements and demand the recall of Governor Newsom, too bad. If y’all are gonna demand Newsom’s recall and blame liberals for whatever next thing you lost, I think it’s perfectly fair to discuss Cadet Bone Spurs as well. Have you ever once discussed soccer at this soccer forum?


Have you?


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Is coke too easy?  Asking for a Hunter Biden.


I think you meant Donny Depends Jr.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I think you meant Donny Depends Jr.


You’re right... Hunter loves crack.  Well, that and tapping his dead brother’s widow.  No wonder he took the job in Ukraine.  Anything for daddy’s approval.  

Such moral high ground from the libtards.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Have you?


Sure. All the time before the magats tried to take this place over. ACL injury avoidance, explaining why ECNL is a better platform and why the GDA would fail, supporting the WNT and defending it against all the whiners complaining for the last eight years how they’ve been passed by. Supporting Cromwell against all the idiots claiming she would get fired over the Singer scandal. But unfortunately the trumpanzees decided to turn this forum into their safe space. But just like in real life, what magats want is not what magats get.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> You’re right... Hunter loves crack.  Well, that and tapping his dead brother’s widow.  No wonder he took the job in Ukraine.  Anything for daddy’s approval.
> 
> Such moral high ground from the libtards.


This is exactly why I’m here.


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> If you want to do better, start by listening to medical experts and not twitter posts by “letthemplay”.


I'm going to be speculative like you, but you quite obviously have never played sports or exerted yourself at a high level, outside those few minutes alone with your science journals and Dr. Fauci photos.  I'd be interested to see the medical experts that have said, "it is healthy/good/recommended to compete in aerobic sport with a mask on."  I mean even the WHO has come out and specifically said they do not recommend sport with a mask on.  To be fair, WHO has been a disaster and change their mind on lots of things, but.....science.

Masks should not be worn while exercising (yahoo.com)


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> If you want to do better, start by listening to medical experts and not twitter posts by “letthemplay”.


Like ALL the ones saying Outdoor Dining and Youth Outdoor Sports ARE NOT significant contributors the spread?

Still waiting for you to find ANYTHING showing otherwise.  Been a few weeks so I’m guessing your just gonna throw in the towel on this one.....or use your “teleportation” joke.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> This is exactly why I’m here.


No, you’re here because you have no place better to be and like telling soccer parents how smart you are.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Sure. All the time before the magats tried to take this place over. ACL injury avoidance, explaining why ECNL is a better platform and why the GDA would fail, supporting the WNT and defending it against all the whiners complaining for the last eight years how they’ve been passed by. Supporting Cromwell against all the idiots claiming she would get fired over the Singer scandal. But unfortunately the trumpanzees decided to turn this forum into their safe space. But just like in real life, what magats want is not what magats get.


So over a year ago.  Did you have a kid in soccer back then?


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> Like ALL the ones saying Outdoor Dining and Youth Outdoor Sports ARE NOT significant contributors the spread?
> 
> Still waiting for you to find ANYTHING showing otherwise.  Been a few weeks so I’m guessing your just gonna throw in the towel on this one.....or use your “teleportation” joke.


Oh so now they’re “not significant”?  How ‘bout soccer daddies hanging out and then getting into cars. The biggest problem is that you and your denialist friends are the stupid dangerous ones.


----------



## soccersc

mccorn said:


> I come on this site occasionally to see if there's anything pertinent to the state of youth soccer. Sadly, I can't find anything worth my time among all of the redundant dribble coming from a few people with nothing better to do than repeat the same personal opinions over and over.


I feel the same way...and you are correct, it is the same handful of people...hopefully when soccer starts up again the few that continuously and redundantly "dribble" will begin to disappear


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> I'm going to be speculative like you, but you quite obviously have never played sports or exerted yourself at a high level, outside those few minutes alone with your science journals and Dr. Fauci photos.  I'd be interested to see the medical experts that have said, "it is healthy/good/recommended to compete in aerobic sport with a mask on."  I mean even the WHO has come out and specifically said they do not recommend sport with a mask on.  To be fair, WHO has been a disaster and change their mind on lots of things, but.....science.
> 
> Masks should not be worn while exercising (yahoo.com)


I appreciate you finding a legitimate source, but if you are going to follow WHO guidance then follow it. WHO also says you should never get within a meter if someone else.  Of course you don’t need a mask if you actually follow their guidance, instead of discarding the parts you don’t like that make them unnecessary. This is the problem with magats and google.  They search for something to reinforce their opinion with zero interest in actually researching the right answer.

If you’re going to get within a meter of someone, wear a mask so you don’t kill someone, just like WHO says. Not a single person has ever died suffocating from a mask while exercising. But hundreds of thousands have died from not wearing them.


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> I appreciate you finding a legitimate source, but if you are going to follow WHO guidance then follow it. WHO also says you should never get within a meter if someone else.  Of course you don’t need a mask if you actually follow their guidance, instead of discarding the parts you don’t like that make them unnecessary. This is the problem with magats and google.  They search for something to reinforce their opinion with zero interest in actually researching the right answer.
> 
> If you’re going to get within a meter of someone, wear a mask so you don’t kill someone, just like WHO says. Not a single person has ever died suffocating from a mask while exercising. But hundreds of thousands have died from not wearing them.


You might want to try one of these.


			Amazon.com : mirror full length


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Oh so now they’re “not significant”?  How ‘bout soccer daddies hanging out and then getting into cars. The biggest problem is that you and your denialist friends are the stupid dangerous ones.


What have I denied?


----------



## dad4

texanincali said:


> Biased?  As crazy as it sounds, we can probably agree that anything around this subject is biased.  I really don't think anyone needs a study to determine whether or not wearing a mask during a soccer game is detrimental.  The answer is quite obvious.  Did you know that the original recommendation from the NCAA was to make soccer teams train in their masks?  After numerous training staffs and coaching staffs told the NCAA there is no way they would make the players do that, the NCAA changed its stance.
> 
> I can't believe you think its far fetched that playing soccer in a mask is detrimental.  Maybe the reason there isn't much data on this is because no one is willing to volunteer for something so stupid.


If we weren’t such weather wimps in CA, we’d know that people bike, run, and cross country ski in neck gaiters and balaclavas all over the upper midwest.  It has nothing to do with covid, and has been that way for decades.


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> I appreciate you finding a legitimate source, but if you are going to follow WHO guidance then follow it. WHO also says you should never get within a meter if someone else.  Of course you don’t need a mask if you actually follow their guidance, instead of discarding the parts you don’t like that make them unnecessary. This is the problem with magats and google.  They search for something to reinforce their opinion with zero interest in actually researching the right answer.
> 
> If you’re going to get within a meter of someone, wear a mask so you don’t kill someone, just like WHO says. Not a single person has ever died suffocating from a mask while exercising. But hundreds of thousands have died from not wearing them.


Hundreds of thousands dead from not wearing masks while exercising outdoors?  Really?  Even worldwide, I can’t see how you get anywhere near that number.  That would be 10 or 20 percent of all covid deaths in the world.

I’ll agree that hundreds of thousands of deaths could have been saved by early, worldwide, universal mask use indoors.  It’s right up there with not going to restaurants and avoiding unnecessary travel.   But the evidence is that outdoor is 15-20 times as safe.


----------



## N00B

Welcome to ‘off-topic’ Covid Forum thanks to EOTL.

Please tell me this came with a warning if the whole thread had to be moved based on that behavior.


----------



## dad4

N00B said:


> Welcome to ‘off-topic’ Covid Forum thanks to EOTL.
> 
> Please tell me this came with a warning if the whole thread had to be moved based on that behavior.


EOTL, and me, and Kicker.  plenty ofus.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

California is throwing unused vaccine away now.  That Gavin sure is a great leader.  I guess he proved you don’t need a lockdown to dine indoors without mask and survive.


----------



## N00B

dad4 said:


> EOTL, and me, and Kicker.  plenty ofus.


actually you redirected them to ‘off-topic’ a couple of times, but it was EOTL that drove the conversation before and after your request.


----------



## watfly

Scott m Shurson said:


> California is throwing unused vaccine away now.  That Gavin sure is a great leader.  I guess he proved you don’t need a lockdown to dine indoors without mask and survive.


Be fair guys, California is only 46th out of all states on percentage of vaccinations administered, so there is 4 states worse than Cali.  It must be because of population density.





__





						States ranked by percentage of COVID-19 vaccines administered: Nov. 30
					

Wisconsin has administered the highest percentage of COVID-19 vaccines it has received, according to the CDC's COVID-19 vaccine distribution and administration data tracker.




					www.beckershospitalreview.com
				



.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

watfly said:


> Be fair guys, California is only 46th out of all states on percentage of vaccinations administered, so there is 4 states worse than Cali.  It must be because of population density.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> States ranked by percentage of COVID-19 vaccines administered: Nov. 30
> 
> 
> Wisconsin has administered the highest percentage of COVID-19 vaccines it has received, according to the CDC's COVID-19 vaccine distribution and administration data tracker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.beckershospitalreview.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I’m happy to be fair.  Being fair means acknowledging Newsom is a piece of shit.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

Scott m Shurson said:


> California is throwing unused vaccine away now.  That Gavin sure is a great leader.  I guess he proved you don’t need a lockdown to dine indoors without mask and survive.


Damn, just mind-boggling.









						Thousands of Covid-19 vaccines winding up in the trash
					

It's unclear how many doses have wound up in the trash because many hospitals aren't reporting these numbers for fear of retribution, a leading public health doctor said.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> I appreciate you finding a legitimate source, but if you are going to follow WHO guidance then follow it. WHO also says you should never get within a meter if someone else.  Of course you don’t need a mask if you actually follow their guidance, instead of discarding the parts you don’t like that make them unnecessary. This is the problem with magats and google.  They search for something to reinforce their opinion with zero interest in actually researching the right answer.
> 
> If you’re going to get within a meter of someone, wear a mask so you don’t kill someone, just like WHO says. Not a single person has ever died suffocating from a mask while exercising. But hundreds of thousands have died from not wearing them.


I’m convinced your aren’t as obtuse as you come across.  I do think you like being the center of attention and have found a way to stay relevant on here.  As much as I’d like to put you on ignore, the laugh and entertainment factor your bring , keeps me from doing so.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> No, you’re here because you have no place better to be and like telling soccer parents how smart you are.


Actually I tell them how dumb they are. I don’t need to talk about myself since I’m not insecure like Grace Karen.


----------



## Grace T.

watfly said:


> Be fair guys, California is only 46th out of all states on percentage of vaccinations administered, so there is 4 states worse than Cali.  It must be because of population density.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> States ranked by percentage of COVID-19 vaccines administered: Nov. 30
> 
> 
> Wisconsin has administered the highest percentage of COVID-19 vaccines it has received, according to the CDC's COVID-19 vaccine distribution and administration data tracker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.beckershospitalreview.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I read somewhere as of today we are 49th (only behind Alabama.....yeah!) Meanwhile Florida has vaccinated 1/4 of its seniors.  By the beginning of March they expect to have more than 1/2 vaccinated (barring any snafus in vaccine manufacture).  My guess is by mid March Florida's IFR will be on the floor, with California's still high struggling to vaccinate seniors 65+ and a long list of essential workers unless something seriously changes.


----------



## NorCalDad

Grace T. said:


> I read somewhere as of today we are 49th (only behind Alabama.....yeah!) Meanwhile Florida has vaccinated 1/4 of its seniors.  By the beginning of March they expect to have more than 1/2 vaccinated (barring any snafus in vaccine manufacture).  My guess is by mid March Florida's IFR will be on the floor, with California's still high struggling to vaccinate seniors 65+ and a long list of essential workers unless something seriously changes.


Newsom is toast. I'm on the left...like Bernie Left...and I think Newsom is done. 

See @EOTL, here's the problem, draconian rules don't work.  Our rates are up because people are just done with the rules.  So given that, what would've been a better route he could've taken?  Let me tell you.  He could've looked at the MOUNTAINS of data from all the other states that didn't shutdown everything and looked at their contact tracing.  Guess what he would've found?  Let me tell you.  Outdoor activities are super low risk. This includes youth soccer as well as outdoor group basket weaving.  The left, which includes me, can't cherry pick science.


----------



## Glitterhater

NorCalDad said:


> Newsom is toast. I'm on the left...like Bernie Left...and I think Newsom is done.
> 
> See @EOTL, here's the problem, draconian rules don't work.  Our rates are up because people are just done with the rules.  So given that, what would've been a better route he could've taken?  Let me tell you.  He could've looked at the MOUNTAINS of data from all the other states that didn't shutdown everything and looked at their contact tracing.  Guess what he would've found?  Let me tell you.  Outdoor activities are super low risk. This includes youth soccer as well as outdoor group basket weaving.  The left, which includes me, can't cherry pick science.


Agree, 100%. He is toast, and any future political aspirations are dead in the water, (rightfully so.)

What's further annoying, is we are supposed to be going out of state 1x a month, (for soccer,) for 3 months in a row, starting in March! Completely unecessary.


----------



## Mossberg

Grace T. said:


> I read somewhere as of today we are 49th (only behind Alabama.....yeah!) Meanwhile Florida has vaccinated 1/4 of its seniors.  By the beginning of March they expect to have more than 1/2 vaccinated (barring any snafus in vaccine manufacture).  My guess is by mid March Florida's IFR will be on the floor, with California's still high struggling to vaccinate seniors 65+ and a long list of essential workers unless something seriously changes.


All you have to do is look at the leadership of each state. DeSantis vs. Newsom. I'd take DeSantis any day.


----------



## watfly

NorCalDad said:


> Newsom is toast. I'm on the left...like Bernie Left...and I think Newsom is done.
> 
> See @EOTL, here's the problem, draconian rules don't work.  Our rates are up because people are just done with the rules.  So given that, what would've been a better route he could've taken?  Let me tell you.  He could've looked at the MOUNTAINS of data from all the other states that didn't shutdown everything and looked at their contact tracing.  Guess what he would've found?  Let me tell you.  Outdoor activities are super low risk. This includes youth soccer as well as outdoor group basket weaving.  The left, which includes me, can't cherry pick science.





Glitterhater said:


> Agree, 100%. He is toast, and any future political aspirations are dead in the water, (rightfully so.)
> 
> What's further annoying, is we are supposed to be going out of state 1x a month, (for soccer,) for 3 months in a row, starting in March! Completely unecessary.


Since this is already in the Off Topic forum....when you say he is toast do you mean he will be recalled? Won't be reelected Governor? Won't be a viable Presidential candidate (realistically he can't run until 2028)?

While I wish he were toast, I just don't see it, but if the left is becoming disillusioned with him I could likely be wrong.  He's an incredibly savvy politician, but being caught dining out was a huge political mistake.  His greatest crime though is preventing kids from returning to school, despite the overwhelming evidence that it is safe with appropriate precautions.


----------



## Glitterhater

watfly said:


> Since this is already in the Off Topic forum....when you say he is toast do you mean he will be recalled? Won't be reelected Governor? Won't be a viable Presidential candidate (realistically he can't run until 2028)?
> 
> While I wish he were toast, I just don't see it, but if the left is becoming disillusioned with him I could likely be wrong.  He's an incredibly savvy politician, but being caught dining out was a huge political mistake.  His greatest crime though is preventing kids from returning to school, despite the overwhelming evidence that it is safe with appropriate precautions.


Good question- and I don't really have any answer! If you would have asked me 6 months ago, (hell- maybe even 3,) if he was going to be recalled, I would have said "no way". Now- I'm not so sure! 

And I just think that between the dining scandal, the problems with vaccine distribution, (whether that's his fault or not,) the lack of ongoing support for all the business he's shuttered, etc., I think any further political aspirations he may have had are going to be very difficult to pull off. 

I don't envy his job at all- he has a mess of a state to deal with. Homeless crisis, lack of afforable housing, a pandemic.. I could go on and on. We have a number of friends who own small businesses. Aid was very hard to get, (and often ran out.) Yet they said he always seemed to be focusing on his "Project Room Key" initiative, not understanding that problem was going to get larger if you let small business flail.


----------



## NorCalDad

watfly said:


> Since this is already in the Off Topic forum....when you say he is toast do you mean he will be recalled? Won't be reelected Governor? Won't be a viable Presidential candidate (realistically he can't run until 2028)?
> 
> While I wish he were toast, I just don't see it, but if the left is becoming disillusioned with him I could likely be wrong.  He's an incredibly savvy politician, but being caught dining out was a huge political mistake.  His greatest crime though is preventing kids from returning to school, despite the overwhelming evidence that it is safe with appropriate precautions.


Good question -- I think I made that statement out of anger versus having any real sense of what will happen to him.  That being said, I don't think a recall effort will happen, but I think his presidential hopes are over.  I think when we do a retrospective of everything it's going to be clear that he really screwed over Californians.  Let me be clear, I think if everyone followed the draconian rules we would have much better covid numbers.  Unfortunately, the rules are so strict and there's been no published contact tracing data that backs up the what he is asking 40 million people to do.  Sure, March-June I get it.  We all rallied and hit it out of the park.  He was looking pretty dang good back then.  But, as we saw other states suffer he and his team should've been looking at that data to determine where CA should go next.  The august 3rd youth sports guidelines are about as dumb as they come.  He literally had other states being guinea pigs and he should have leveraged those learnings.


----------



## MacDre

NorCalDad said:


> Newsom is toast. I'm on the left...like Bernie Left...and I think Newsom is done.
> 
> See @EOTL, here's the problem, draconian rules don't work.  Our rates are up because people are just done with the rules.  So given that, what would've been a better route he could've taken?  Let me tell you.  He could've looked at the MOUNTAINS of data from all the other states that didn't shutdown everything and looked at their contact tracing.  Guess what he would've found?  Let me tell you.  Outdoor activities are super low risk. This includes youth soccer as well as outdoor group basket weaving.  The left, which includes me, can't cherry pick science.


GTFOH.  I think your position is very odd.  Do you really think Newsom’s political career is ruined because of outdoor soccer and outdoor group basket weaving?  You’re talking loud but you aren’t saying anything.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> GTFOH.  I think your position is very odd.  Do you really think Newsom’s political career is ruined because of outdoor soccer and outdoor group basket weaving?  You’re talking loud but you aren’t saying anything.


No, I think Newsom’s career is suffering because we are 49th out of 50 in vaccine logistics.  People want this thing to be over, and leaving 3/4 of the vaccine in the freezers doesn’t sound good.  We should be putting it into arms, not obsessing over complicated rules about whose arm.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

MacDre said:


> GTFOH.  I think your position is very odd.  Do you really think Newsom’s political career is ruined because of outdoor soccer and outdoor group basket weaving?  You’re talking loud but you aren’t saying anything.


I voted for him but I already signed the recall petition.  

Soccer is the least of the reasons on why he is going to be out.  He is out because most small businesses have suffered too much.  Most restaurants are on the brink of termination.  Too many restrictions for small business and kids have created a big mess for his political future.  All of these closures going on yet the big box stores are printing money.

I’ve always said that it’s acceptable to ask everyone to quarantine for 3 to 4 months. We are now at almost 12 months and are breaking records in the wrong way. He doesn’t even follow the science that he supposedly claims he does.


----------



## NorCalDad

MacDre said:


> GTFOH.  I think your position is very odd.  Do you really think Newsom’s political career is ruined because of outdoor soccer and outdoor group basket weaving?  You’re talking loud but you aren’t saying anything.


Perhaps I needed to be more clear.  I put the basket weaving in there to capture that fact that this isn't just about youth soccer.  We should have been emphasizing outdoor activities as being safe and indoor gatherings as higher risk.  The left is all about science....yet in this case they're not using it.


----------



## MacDre

NorCalDad said:


> Perhaps I needed to be more clear.  I put the basket weaving in there to capture that fact that this isn't just about youth soccer.  We should have been emphasizing outdoor activities as being safe and indoor gatherings as higher risk.  The left is all about science....yet in this case they're not using it.


Agreed.  My kid spends about 4 hours per day at the skatepark and has become a decent skater in past year.  I initially thought some folks were embellishing about the mental health issues some kids are doing experiencing and then I recently received this:


----------



## tjinaz

MacDre said:


> Agreed.  My kid spends about 4 hours per day at the skatepark and has become a decent skater in past year.  I initially thought some folks were embellishing about the mental health issues some kids are doing experiencing and then I recently received this:
> View attachment 9950


See with EOTL logic that is a win.  So long as he was wearing a mask and protecting his grandparents.  Kids don't need to be outside and doing the things they love they will be fine.


----------



## CaliKlines

MacDre said:


> GTFOH.  I think your position is very odd.  Do you really think Newsom’s political career is ruined because of outdoor soccer and outdoor group basket weaving?  You’re talking loud but you aren’t saying anything.


And now Newsom is making the vaccine available to the homeless and incarcerated before most of the CA population can get it, including those with high blood pressure and diabetes. This state is so f’ed up.


----------



## MacDre

CaliKlines said:


> And now Newsom is making the vaccine available to the homeless and incarcerated before most of the CA population can get it, including those with high blood pressure and diabetes. This state is so f’ed up.


I’m not convinced the problem is limited to CA.  I have tried to get


CaliKlines said:


> And now Newsom is making the vaccine available to the homeless and incarcerated before most of the CA population can get it, including those with high blood pressure and diabetes. This state is so f’ed up.


I haven’t had any luck getting the vaccine through the VA hospital either.  I think John Muir hospital will be prepared to vaccinate me before the VA hospital.
On the other hand, my aunt and mother in law in FL are bragging that they went through a “drive through” vaccination and didn’t even have to get out of their cars.


----------



## Grace T.

MacDre said:


> I’m not convinced the problem is limited to CA.  I have tried to get
> 
> I haven’t had any luck getting the vaccine through the VA hospital either.  I think John Muir hospital will be prepared to vaccinate me before the VA hospital.
> On the other hand, my aunt and mother in law in FL are bragging that they went through a “drive through” vaccination and didn’t even have to get out of their cars.


Florida has been prioritizing the elderly.  It's easy...most folks have ID and it's hard for a 20 year old to pass for 65+ if they don't.  By focusing on people's jobs like california is it slows everything down because you've got to get organized by work place and get the word out to those people and if the word doesn't get out perfectly doses go to waste.

Glad you are coming along to the notion that this is really affecting kids.  In my own extended family there's been 2 breakdowns and a suicide attempt....all the kids have had at least a more minor issue happen with them.


----------



## texanincali

tjinaz said:


> See with EOTL logic that is a win.  So long as he was wearing a mask and protecting his grandparents.  Kids don't need to be outside and doing the things they love they will be fine.


Nah.  EOTL has been clear that mental illness is just like heartburn.  It wouldn’t be a win, just a pesky bother.


----------



## CaliKlines

Grace T. said:


> By focusing on people's jobs like california is it slows everything down because you've got to get organized by work place and get the word out to those people


Or in the case of the homeless and incarcerated, focusing on the lack of jobs!


----------



## CaliKlines

MacDre said:


> I’m not convinced the problem is limited to CA.  I have tried to get
> 
> I haven’t had any luck getting the vaccine through the VA hospital either.  I think John Muir hospital will be prepared to vaccinate me before the VA hospital.
> On the other hand, my aunt and mother in law in FL are bragging that they went through a “drive through” vaccination and didn’t even have to get out of their cars.


Indiana residents call 211 and enter their zip code on their phone. They are then connected to a live person in their county and that person asks them a few questions and then gives them an appt time/date. My 82 yr old parents spent <5 mins on the phone, and <10 mins having the shot administered. They were extremely pleased with the process for shot #1. I hope #2 is just as simple.


----------



## MacDre

CaliKlines said:


> Indiana residents call 211 and enter their zip code on their phone. They are then connected to a live person in their county and that person asks them a few questions and then gives them an appt time/date. My 82 yr old parents spent <5 mins on the phone, and <10 mins having the shot administered. They were extremely pleased with the process for shot #1. I hope #2 is just as simple.


According to my mother in law, the hardest part about getting the second shot administered was finding a place to laminate her immunization card afterwards.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> According to my mother in law, the hardest part about getting the second shot administered was finding a place to laminate her immunization card afterwards.


Other states spent the last 3 months planning logistics.

We apparently spent the last 3 months trying to second guess the federal drug approval process.


----------



## TOSDCI

dad4 said:


> Other states spent the last 3 months planning logistics.
> 
> We apparently spent the last 3 months trying to second guess the federal drug approval process.


Yeah, what happened with that?  Weren't California and New York going to get their own experts to make sure that the vaccine was effective and safe?


----------



## happy9

dad4 said:


> Other states spent the last 3 months planning logistics.
> 
> We apparently spent the last 3 months trying to second guess the federal drug approval process.


Heard a funny joke from one of my employees on Friday during a call - he's in CA.  

In regards to the vaccination plan in CA, they  going by the term *LAWgistics* VS *LOgistics*.  Kinda makes sense.  He finished the call with the comment that CA is a blue state held together by red tape.  He's a lifelong CA resident.


----------



## happy9

TOSDCI said:


> Yeah, what happened with that?  Weren't California and New York going to get their own experts to make sure that the vaccine was effective and safe?


Too busy looking cool in front of the camera.


----------



## dad4

TOSDCI said:


> Yeah, what happened with that?  Weren't California and New York going to get their own experts to make sure that the vaccine was effective and safe?


What happened is the vaccines worked.  You don’t need your own set of experts when the EU experts already said yes.


----------



## Jose has returned

EOTL said:


> When they asked AZ magats to flatten the curve, they should have specified that they meant the X axis.
> 
> View attachment 9932


who cares.  thats from the fiesta bowl


----------



## Jose has returned

Just a side note.  Has anyone noticed Sweden is no longer in the conversation about how horrible they handled this?


----------



## Jose has returned

Scott m Shurson said:


> I’m happy to be fair.  Being fair means acknowledging Newsom is a piece of shit.


no Scott that is not being fair you are being nice


----------



## espola

Jose has returned said:


> Just a side note.  Has anyone noticed Sweden is no longer in the conversation about how horrible they handled this?











						Covid Trends
					

Visualizing the exponential growth of COVID-19 across the world.




					aatishb.com


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> GTFOH.  I think





CaliKlines said:


> And now Newsom is making the vaccine available to the homeless and incarcerated before most of the CA population can get it, including those with high blood pressure and diabetes. This state is so f’ed up.


Newsom, and most liberal politicians in general, have put criminals, illegal aliens and bums ahead of taxpaying citizens.  Especially veterans. 

Why?  Votes.


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> Newsom, and most liberal politicians in general, have put criminals, illegal aliens and bums ahead of taxpaying citizens.  Especially veterans.
> 
> Why?  Votes.


You've never run for office, I take it. 

( That's not where the votes are. )


----------



## MSK357

dad4 said:


> You've never run for office, I take it.
> 
> ( That's not where the votes are. )


its well on its way to be that way. in certain places and conditions it already is.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> You've never run for office, I take it.
> 
> ( That's not where the votes are. )


Really?  Then why are wealthy celebrities suddenly paying fines for ex convicts so they can vote?  Why are liberals, especially in California, wanting to give illegals free healthcare, the ability to drive without a license and access to voting without proof of ID and citizenship?


----------



## Jose has returned

dad4 said:


> You've never run for office, I take it.
> 
> ( That's not where the votes are. )


those are votes indirectly.  The saps that think its so wonderful will keep voting with emotions rather than facts and reality.


----------



## notintheface

Scott m Shurson said:


> Really?  Then why are wealthy celebrities suddenly paying fines for ex convicts so they can vote?  Why are liberals, especially in California, wanting to give illegals free healthcare, the ability to drive without a license and access to voting without proof of ID and citizenship?


If your immediate assumption is "everyone who newly gets to vote is going to vote against my ideals" then maybe, just maybe, you're the baddies?


----------



## Lavey29

Scott m Shurson said:


> Really?  Then why are wealthy celebrities suddenly paying fines for ex convicts so they can vote?  Why are liberals, especially in California, wanting to give illegals free healthcare, the ability to drive without a license and access to voting without proof of ID and citizenship?


You cant reason or debate logically with sheep.


----------



## MSK357

notintheface said:


> If your immediate assumption is "everyone who newly gets to vote is going to vote against my ideals" then maybe, just maybe, you're the baddies?


lets put it into context, we are talking about convicts getting allowed to vote.  When we have liberal policies reducing sentences and letting criminals out early i wonder who they will vote for? If we have people breaking the law entering the country skipping the immigration line, i wonder if they will vote for liberals who are trying to get open borders and granting blanket citizenship.


----------



## dad4

Lavey29 said:


> You cant reason or debate logically with sheep.


Or, maybe, some people just disagree with you???

Nah, couldn't be that.  Everyone on the other side must be brainwashed.

EOTL has the same worldview.  You two should hang out more.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

notintheface said:


> If your immediate assumption is "everyone who newly gets to vote is going to vote against my ideals" then maybe, just maybe, you're the baddies?


The assumption is that criminals will continue to vote in support of you libtards that do everything possible to make their lives easier.  And that’s exactly why you do it.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> Or, maybe, some people just disagree with you???
> 
> Nah, couldn't be that.  Everyone on the other side must be brainwashed.
> 
> EOTL has the same worldview.  You two should hang out more.


Then how would you justify disagreeing?  How do you justify pampering criminals and encouraging people to break our laws?  What taxpaying, law abiding citizen would justify such behavior?


----------



## EOTL

This is a great self-pity party thread. So fun watching the magat losers feeling sorry for themselves. So much losing.


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> Then how would you justify disagreeing?  How do you justify pampering criminals and encouraging people to break our laws?  What taxpaying, law abiding citizen would justify such behavior?


Voting is a part of buying into the system.

If we release someone from prison, we want them inside society, not outside.  Stable job, kids in school, vote for city council, bake sales.  All those small life connections.  Whether he votes against me is immaterial.


----------



## Lavey29

dad4 said:


> Or, maybe, some people just disagree with you???
> 
> Nah, couldn't be that.  Everyone on the other side must be brainwashed.
> 
> EOTL has the same worldview.  You two should hang out more.


You sign the recall newsolini petition yet?  300k democrats have signed it now. That is great partisan unity huh?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> This is a great self-pity party thread. So fun watching the magat losers feeling sorry for themselves. So much losing.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> You sign the recall newsolini petition yet?  300k democrats have signed it now. That is great partisan unity huh?


There is no unity until y’all atone. So never.


----------



## MSK357

EOTL said:


> There is no unity until y’all atone. So never.


Atone?


----------



## notintheface

MSK357 said:


> lets put it into context, we are talking about convicts getting allowed to vote.  When we have liberal policies reducing sentences and letting criminals out early i wonder who they will vote for?


Have you ever smoked pot?


----------



## notintheface

Scott m Shurson said:


> The assumption is that criminals will continue to vote in support of you libtards that do everything possible to make their lives easier.  And that’s exactly why you do it.


Have _you_ ever smoked pot?


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> There is no unity until y’all atone. So never.


So let he/she that is without sin, cast the first stone!


----------



## Kicker4Life

notintheface said:


> Have _you_ ever smoked pot?


Did you forget you posted that?


----------



## N00B

notintheface said:


> Have you ever smoked pot?


False equivalence.  I’ve received a traffic citation, but am not a felon.  I believe the same would apply to your example... unless I was dealing drugs.


----------



## dad4

Lavey29 said:


> You sign the recall newsolini petition yet?  300k democrats have signed it now. That is great partisan unity huh?


Nope.  We differ on this one.  My complaint is that the closures hit the wrong things.  Your complaint is that the closures should not exist.

Why would I sign a petition to recall Newsom for actions which I believe were broadly correct?   Yes, wrong in some details.  But overall, it was the right idea.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> So let he/she that is without sin, cast the first stone!


The most overused excuse to be a**holes, and in the name of god!

Does your god book say anything about not being an a**hole? About accountability after you are?


----------



## N00B

dad4 said:


> Nope.  We differ on this one.  My complaint is that the closures hit the wrong things.  Your complaint is that the closures should not exist.
> 
> Why would I sign a petition to recall Newsom for actions which I believe were broadly correct?   Yes, wrong in some details.  But overall, it was the right idea.


Depends on how you weigh the details.  School closures are a big deal in our household.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> The most overused excuse to be a**holes, and in the name of god!
> 
> Does your god book say anything about not being an a**hole? About accountability after you are?


bigot


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Depends on how you weigh the details.  School closures are a big deal in our household.


Everything is a “big deal” in a whiny snowflake magat house.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> bigot


I figured you wouldn’t want to discuss the parts of your god book that don’t support your narrative.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Everything is a “big deal” in a whiny snowflake magat house.


Lol.. missed the magat mark on that one


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> I figured you wouldn’t want to discuss the parts of your god book that don’t support your narrative.


Don’t need a ‘god book’ quote to call you a bigot.  Just the definition.

Bigot

a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic toward a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Don’t need a ‘god book’ quote to call you a bigot.  Just the definition.
> 
> Bigot
> 
> a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic toward a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.


Nope. Holding people accountable for heinous behavior is not bigotry. Bit look at whiny snowflake casting stones ‘cuz he can’t take it. Or take responsibility for his abysmal behavior.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Nope. Holding people accountable for heinous behavior is not bigotry. Bit look at whiny snowflake casting stones ‘cuz he can’t take it. Or take responsibility for his abysmal behavior.


So you must have missed the point.  You may feel you are a righteous bigot... But you are a bigot, by definition.

As to ‘holding people accountable’, maybe you should reflect on your ‘abysmal behavior’, even if it is your self stated goal. It reflects poorly upon everything you’ve trying to convey.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> So you must have missed the point.  You may feel you are a righteous bigot... But you are a bigot, by definition.
> 
> As to ‘holding people accountable’, maybe you should reflect on your ‘abysmal behavior’, even if it is your self stated goal. It reflects poorly upon everything you’ve trying to convey.


Totally Righteous!

Unfortunately, whiny snowflake bigots only understand humiliation and mocking. Keep up the self-pity, it is so much fun to see.  

What’s next for Bone Spur Boy? Bankruptcy? Criminal prosecution? Divorce? Choking to death on his own feces trying to pull his depends off the wrong way? I can’t wait for his next chapter.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Totally Righteous!
> 
> Unfortunately, whiny snowflake bigots only understand humiliation and mocking. Keep up the self-pity, it is so much fun to see.
> 
> What’s next for Bone Spur Boy? Bankruptcy? Criminal prosecution? Divorce? Choking to death on his own feces trying to pull his depends off the wrong way? I can’t wait for his next chapter.


Did you actually reply to my post, or just quote it?  (Why do I feel compelled to mock you... you do it just fine by yourself. Please, keep speaking)


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> This is a great self-pity party thread. So fun watching the magat losers feeling sorry for themselves. So much losing.


You’re better off hiding.  You know, picking your “bigot” spots and less whimpering.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> Voting is a part of buying into the system.
> 
> If we release someone from prison, we want them inside society, not outside.  Stable job, kids in school, vote for city council, bake sales.  All those small life connections.  Whether he votes against me is immaterial.


Seems to me the liberals have created a system to buy more votes. 

Most criminals are like most homeless in that they don’t want help.  They don’t want to play by the rules.  That’s why most need to remain inside; especially when their actions speak louder than words.  They’ll tell you who they are if you listen.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> There is no unity until y’all atone. So never.


 First time you’ve been right.  There will be no unity.  You spent 4 years making sure of that.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

notintheface said:


> Have _you_ ever smoked pot?


Please don’t babble about being in prison for pot.  There isn’t a single person in jail or prison for smoking pot.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> Nope.  We differ on this one.  My complaint is that the closures hit the wrong things.  Your complaint is that the closures should not exist.
> 
> Why would I sign a petition to recall Newsom for actions which I believe were broadly correct?   Yes, wrong in some details.  But overall, it was the right idea.


What about his actions of deliberately defying his own orders and lying about it?


----------



## N00B

Scott m Shurson said:


> What about his actions of deliberately defying his own orders and lying about it?


His biggest lie may have been ‘we payed for our meal and left’.  By ‘we’ we mean the lobbyist settled the bill at the French Laundry.  Didn’t hear any follow-up questions on that.


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> What about his actions of deliberately defying his own orders and lying about it?


How many of us have been perfect in following the covid rules?

I agree he messed up.  I don't want to recall someone over a dinner, though.

The bigger problem is botching the vaccine rollout.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> The most overused excuse to be a**holes, and in the name of god!
> 
> Does your god book say anything about not being an a**hole? About accountability after you are?


That’s what I thought.  Little Mister Holier than Though’s only retort is name calling.  I feel for you.  “God book”, LOL....some variation of that phrase may exist in the Bible, don’t know, didn’t read it.  But I was raised on certain principles and that was one of them.  In other words, don’t attack someone for the same behavior you exemplify. 

Not that I didn’t expect it, your as predictable as the sunrise, however I was wrong in thinking that you’d admit that both sides are as guilty as the other....shocker.  

 again....you try to pin labels on people that don’t apply and make yourself look foolish. Can’t help but to call people names and exemplify the EXACT behavior you admonish.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> How many of us have been perfect in following the covid rules?
> 
> I agree he messed up.  I don't want to recall someone over a dinner, though.
> 
> The bigger problem is botching the vaccine rollout.


If you think it is just about the dinner, you haven’t been paying attention.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> How many of us have been perfect in following the covid rules?
> 
> I agree he messed up.  I don't want to recall someone over a dinner, though.
> 
> The bigger problem is botching the vaccine rollout.


He needs to be recalled for who he is, his dishonesty and hypocrisy and how poorly he’s handled all of this.  You know... the same way Dems went after Trump.  

Sounds familiar, doesn’t it?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> There is no unity until y’all atone. So never.


Mao much? Pol Pot much? Saddam much? Idi Amin much?

I'll stand by and wait for you to refer to the marmalade dictator.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> That’s what I thought.  Little Mister Holier than Though’s only retort is name calling.  I feel for you.  “God book”, LOL....some variation of that phrase may exist in the Bible, don’t know, didn’t read it.  But I was raised on certain principles and that was one of them.  In other words, don’t attack someone for the same behavior you exemplify.
> 
> Not that I didn’t expect it, your as predictable as the sunrise, however I was wrong in thinking that you’d admit that both sides are as guilty as the other....shocker.
> 
> again....you try to pin labels on people that don’t apply and make yourself look foolish. Can’t help but to call people names and exemplify the EXACT behavior you admonish.


Both sides are as guilty as the other eh?  B.S.  Like that god quote above, that is just a made up excuse to rationalize being an a**hole. That is what trumpanzees need to say to rationalize their behavior.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Mao much? Pol Pot much? Saddam much? Idi Amin much?
> 
> I'll stand by and wait for you to refer to the marmalade dictator.


I suppose that’s another way to rationalize your support of a horrible piece of s**t. Point to some other piece of s**t dictator. Magats will take no responsibility for their actions, ever.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> I suppose that’s another way to rationalize your support of a horrible piece of s**t. Point to some other piece of s**t dictator. Magats will take no responsibility for their actions, ever.


called it.  Nice job.  The predictability of a barn sour horse.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Both sides are as guilty as the other eh?  B.S.  Like that god quote above, that is just a made up excuse to rationalize being an a**hole. That is what trumpanzees need to say to rationalize their behavior.


Must have worked hard in that retort LOL......really put me in my place.


----------



## NorCalDad

Kicker4Life said:


> If you think it is just about the dinner, you haven’t been paying attention.


Didn't he literally just say that?


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> I suppose that’s another way to rationalize your support of a horrible piece of s**t. Point to some other piece of s**t dictator. Magats will take no responsibility for their actions, ever.


*points at Newsom*


----------



## Lavey29

dad4 said:


> Nope.  We differ on this one.  My complaint is that the closures hit the wrong things.  Your complaint is that the closures should not exist.
> 
> Why would I sign a petition to recall Newsom for actions which I believe were broadly correct?   Yes, wrong in some details.  But overall, it was the right idea.


The recall is not based on just his china virus response but overall failed leadership in all areas relating to state management and fiscal responsibility.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> *points at Newsom*


It’s interesting the animosity that people have towards Newsom. Although you may disagree with his means and effectiveness, there is no denying that he is trying to save lives. The hate y’all spew because someone is trying to save lives is in sharp contrast to your love of the Mango Magat, who is directly responsible for the majority of covid-related deaths die to his denialism and complete lack of caring. 

None of this is surprising, because this is who Magats are. They don’t care about anyone but themselves. They can’t see past their own short-term self-interest. And they’re too stupid to realize that their short-term interest is almost always contrary to their long term benefit. That’s why they’re losers. So much losing. So beautiful. They’re the best at losing.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> It’s interesting the animosity that people have towards Newsom. Although you may disagree with his means and effectiveness, there is no denying that he is trying to save lives. The hate y’all spew because someone is trying to save lives is in sharp contrast to your love of the Mango Magat, who is directly responsible for the majority of covid-related deaths die to his denialism and complete lack of caring.
> 
> None of this is surprising, because this is who Magats are. They don’t care about anyone but themselves. They can’t see past their own short-term self-interest. And they’re too stupid to realize that their short-term interest is almost always contrary to their long term benefit. That’s why they’re losers. So much losing. So beautiful. They’re the best at losing.


Hahahaha...you are too funny.  "At least Newsom is trying to save lives" that might be the funniest thing you have ever said. I really can't stop laughing!! I am imagining you probably were laughing as you wrote it.  The decisions Newsom makes are only to benefit himself!!! You know that


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> It’s interesting the animosity that people have towards Newsom. Although you may disagree with his means and effectiveness, there is no denying that he is trying to save lives. The hate y’all spew because someone is trying to save lives is in sharp contrast to your love of the Mango Magat, who is directly responsible for the majority of covid-related deaths die to his denialism and complete lack of caring.
> 
> None of this is surprising, because this is who Magats are. They don’t care about anyone but themselves. They can’t see past their own short-term self-interest. And they’re too stupid to realize that their short-term interest is almost always contrary to their long term benefit. That’s why they’re losers. So much losing. So beautiful. They’re the best at losing.


So this is your form of rationalizing or defending your dictator of choice?

hmmm... wonder how true all those wasted words apply to your example of leadership.

Keep speaking, please.  The oxymoronic/sycophantic hits keep coming.  No need to critique, you’re doing just fine by example.

How’s young adulting going for you?  Cause if your any older than that you didn’t get or learn enough from your life experience thus far.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Hahahaha...you are too funny.  "At least Newsom is trying to save lives" that might be the funniest thing you have ever said. I really can't stop laughing!! I am imagining you probably were laughing as you wrote it.  The decisions Newsom makes are only to benefit himself!!! You know that


The amount of brainwashing necessary to lead you to that conclusion is irreversible. The idea that Newsom personally benefits from the social distancing measures he has implemented is conspiracy theory bonkers. Like Ted Cruz’s dad murdered JFK kind of bonkers. Like there are only 12 people in the US who have covid and pretty soon it will be zero bonkers. Like believing a hurricane will reach Alabama because cadet bone spurs took out a sharpie to change its projected course on a map. Like believing there will be a beautiful new health care plan in two weeks, and then two weeks, and then two weeks, and then two weeks...Like Mexico will pay for the wall bonkers. Like windmill noise caused cancer. Like injecting disinfectant in your lungs and sunshine up your ass cures covid bonkers. 

Also a good reminder that the only effective way is to deal with magats is to mock them.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> The amount of brainwashing necessary to lead you to that conclusion is irreversible. The idea that Newsom personally benefits from the social distancing measures he has implemented is conspiracy theory bonkers. Like Ted Cruz’s dad murdered JFK kind of bonkers. Like there are only 12 people in the US who have covid and pretty soon it will be zero bonkers. Like believing a hurricane will reach Alabama because cadet bone spurs took out a sharpie to change its projected course on a map. Like believing there will be a beautiful new health care plan in two weeks, and then two weeks, and then two weeks, and then two weeks...Like Mexico will pay for the wall bonkers. Like windmill noise caused cancer. Like injecting disinfectant in your lungs and sunshine up your ass cures covid bonkers.
> 
> Also a good reminder that the only effective way is to deal with magats is to mock them.


I get it...so you were mocking Newsom....that makes sense then. Because I thought for a second you actually thought he wanted what is best for you


----------



## Kicker4Life

NorCalDad said:


> Didn't he literally just say that?


Yes....was simply stating the obvious, not refuting the statement.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Also a good reminder that the only effective way is to deal with magats is to mock them.


So labeling people (stereotyping) and mocking them is the solution.

Bigot


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> So this is your form of rationalizing or defending your dictator of choice?
> 
> hmmm... wonder how true all those wasted words apply to your example of leadership.
> 
> Keep speaking, please.  The oxymoronic/sycophantic hits keep coming.  No need to critique, you’re doing just fine by example.
> 
> How’s young adulting going for you?  Cause if your any older than that you didn’t get or learn enough from your life experience thus far.


You think Newsom is a dictator eh? Actually, more people voted for him than the other guy, unlike Cadet Bone Spurs, who has never participated in an election in his life in which his opponent did not receive more votes.

Whatcha gonna do on inauguration day?  Cry into your beer?  Maybe stand outside Target trying to get signatures for the recall campaign? Maybe go full Karen and walk into Costco without a mask just to make yourself feel better?


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> So labeling people (stereotyping) and mocking them is the solution.
> 
> Bigot


Actually, yes, it is the solution. It’s the only thing trumpanzees understand. Constantly humiliating them is the only way.


----------



## EOTL

Check it out!  Even Moscow Mitch admits Trumpy McSeditionist incited an insurrection and overthrow of the US government. 

Now back to magats losing their s**t because CA’s governor had dinner at the French Laundry...


----------



## EOTL

Also check it out. All the living real presidents will welcome Biden into the WH now that Mr. Steals From Children With Cancer and his s**tbag loser family have been kicked out of town.


----------



## EOTL

Oh, and don’t forget to pick up your Mein Pillow before they’re gone forever.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1351595044290109441


----------



## EOTL

EOTL said:


> The amount of brainwashing necessary to lead you to that conclusion is irreversible. The idea that Newsom personally benefits from the social distancing measures he has implemented is conspiracy theory bonkers. Like Ted Cruz’s dad murdered JFK kind of bonkers. Like there are only 12 people in the US who have covid and pretty soon it will be zero bonkers. Like believing a hurricane will reach Alabama because cadet bone spurs took out a sharpie to change its projected course on a map. Like believing there will be a beautiful new health care plan in two weeks, and then two weeks, and then two weeks, and then two weeks...Like Mexico will pay for the wall bonkers. Like windmill noise caused cancer. Like injecting disinfectant in your lungs and sunshine up your ass cures covid bonkers.
> 
> Also a good reminder that the only effective way is to deal with magats is to mock them.


When I was pointing out examples of the crazy b**lshit you magats believe, I should have included that the Stoneman Douglas HS shooting that left 17 dead was a “false flag” operation, and the 9/11 plane that flew into the Pentagon was staged.  



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1351572521913446401
What’s the next whackadoo conspiracy theory that you’ve got (other than Newsom sabotaged the CA economy so he could cut the line at the French Laundry?).


----------



## tjinaz

EOTL said:


> Check it out!  Even Moscow Mitch admits Trumpy McSeditionist incited an insurrection and overthrow of the US government.
> 
> Now back to magats losing their s**t because CA’s governor had dinner at the French Laundry...
> 
> View attachment 9958


right back at cha


----------



## Kicker4Life

@EOTL seems to be going the way of Crush, making up new arguments and then multi-posting a series of supporting “facts” about the argument he’s making that isn’t the topic being discussed.  

Simply can’t stay on topic bc he knows Newsome’s policies have started to run Big business OUT of CA , people are fed up with coddling to the Transients at the expense of tax payers, a miserable record of budget management and the list goes on.

Let’s see if he can make a single post that doesn’t:

A) reference Trump
B) call someone a name
C) over generalize

I’ve only seen it happen MAYBE 2x’s


----------



## EOTL

tjinaz said:


> right back at cha
> 
> View attachment 9960


Slapping a photo of Biden onto another photo doesn’t exactly state his position on an issue Q. But that’s what you Q magats do, because it’s all you got.

How intellectually challenged must you magats be to think that stealing a laptop from the Capitol building, and selling it to the Russians, would make you a "patriot”?


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> @EOTL seems to be going the way of Crush, making up new arguments and then multi-posting a series of supporting “facts” about the argument he’s making that isn’t the topic being discussed.
> 
> Simply can’t stay on topic bc he knows Newsome’s policies have started to run Big business OUT of CA , people are fed up with coddling to the Transients at the expense of tax payers, a miserable record of budget management and the list goes on.
> 
> Let’s see if he can make a single post that doesn’t:
> 
> A) reference Trump
> B) call someone a name
> C) over generalize
> 
> I’ve only seen it happen MAYBE 2x’s


Just following the lead of y’all. If you want to talk about soccer, we can do that.


----------



## NorCalDad

tjinaz said:


> right back at cha
> 
> View attachment 9960


Jesus effing christ. Do you even know how to use Google?









						Fact check: Joe Biden has condemned protest-related violence all summer
					

It's false to say the Democratic presidential nominee hasn't condemned rioting related to social justice protests, as he has done so since they began.



					www.usatoday.com
				




I don't like @EOTL's approach to any of this, nor do I agree with him on Newsom (as posted earlier), but come on.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> You think Newsom is a dictator eh?


Yep, that’s why I pointed to him.

You do realize this is a thread specifically about protesting his policies, right?

Oh..  I forgot, context like learning from life experience eludes you.

Keep up with your self righteous campaign to inform those magats through stereotyping and bigotry (Apparently anyone with a divergent perspective on policy is a magat in your view). I’m sure you’re making an impression...just not effectively supporting your position, unless that is to act a fool.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Just following the lead of y’all. If you want to talk about soccer, we can do that.


Nope, it was your non-soccer Covid hijacking of this thread and now political divergence that killed the ‘soccer talk’.

Maybe not being the pot when calling the kettle black would be advisable.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Just following the lead of y’all. If you want to talk about soccer, we can do that.


No...not following anyone’s lead but your own.  

All of a sudden you’ve developed a southern twang....did you visit the South East after your NYC trip?


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> When I was pointing out examples of the crazy b**lshit you magats believe, I should have included that the Stoneman Douglas HS shooting that left 17 dead was a “false flag” operation, and the 9/11 plane that flew into the Pentagon was staged.
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1351572521913446401
> What’s the next whackadoo conspiracy theory that you’ve got (other than Newsom sabotaged the CA economy so he could cut the line at the French Laundry?).


Funny, in a post where you say how much Newsom cares for the State you bring up the French Laundry.  By chance do you know why he was there? Do you know whose party he was celebrating? Do some research on that guy and then tell me again how much Newsom cares about you. My guess is you will have to google who the party was for, right about now!


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Yep, that’s why I pointed to him.
> 
> You do realize this is a thread specifically about protesting his policies, right?
> 
> Oh..  I forgot, context like learning from life experience eludes you.
> 
> Keep up with your self righteous campaign to inform those magats through stereotyping and bigotry (Apparently anyone with a divergent perspective on policy is a magat in your view). I’m sure you’re making an impression...just not effectively supporting your position, unless that is to act a fool.


Actually the thread is about magats feeling sorry for themselves. It is about how magats don’t care how many people die if it gets in the way of going to the Olive Garden. It is about magats denying how many people are dying. It’s about whiny snowflake karen magats who can’t accept that there are repercussions for abysmal behavior. So much fun.


----------



## NorCalDad

soccersc said:


> Funny, in a post where you say how much Newsom cares for the State you bring up the French Laundry.  By chance do you know why he was there? Do you know whose party he was celebrating? Do some research on that guy and then tell me again how much Newsom cares about you. My guess is you will have to google who the party was for, right about now!


You're basically pointing out an issue that pretty much ALL politicians are guilty of -- outside of a few that some consider to be evil "socialists".


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Actually the thread is about magats feeling sorry for themselves. It is about how magats don’t care how many people die if it gets in the way of going to the Olive Garden. It is about magats denying how many people are dying. It’s about whiny snowflake karen magats who can’t accept that there are repercussions for abysmal behavior. So much fun.


Again... it’s all about you and your point of view.  Not the original poster or the topic at hand. Of course

This is fun.  Like having a conversation with my teenager, being the only adult in the room.  

Now would be a good time to reflect on your own ‘abysmal behavior’.... oh you did that already!?.. And feel you were justified.  Quality introspection.

Grow up and get back to me (might be beyond your ability).


----------



## EOTL

NorCalDad said:


> You're basically pointing out an issue that pretty much ALL politicians are guilty of -- outside of a few that some consider to be evil "socialists".


Because the magat party is guilty of such extensive and ongoing atrocious behavior, all they can do to make themselves feel better is to claim that democrats do some minor things they don’t like, so therefore it’s ok to be racist and attempt to overthrow the government.


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> Also check it out. All the living real presidents will welcome Biden into the WH now that Mr. Steals From Children With Cancer and his s**tbag loser family have been kicked out of town.
> 
> View attachment 9959


Oh this picture deserves a "what was said" competition.  I'm going with:

"Hey guys, we don't look so bad anymore!"

or, "And we thought Jimmy was a bad president!"


----------



## soccersc

NorCalDad said:


> You're basically pointing out an issue that pretty much ALL politicians are guilty of -- outside of a few that some consider to be evil "socialists".


That is for sure...that is why I think it is funny this guy, @EOTL, thinks Newsom is different than all the rest...there is no more "Of the People, For the People" it is all about getting their own. @EOTL is naive enough to think thats its different, that Newsom is different, poor kid...hopefully he will learn one day.


----------



## NorCalDad

EOTL said:


> Because the magat party is guilty of such extensive and ongoing atrocious behavior, all they can do to make themselves feel better is to claim that democrats do some minor things they don’t like, so therefore it’s ok to be racist and attempt to overthrow the government.


Kowtowing to lobbyists is hardly a "minor" thing depending on your ideology -- certainly not enough to justify insurrection.  That said, neolibs are part of the reason we are where we are. For sure tea party republicans are at a level of dysfunction of their own, but that doesn't mean the left can't introspect where they're at.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> It’s interesting the animosity that people have towards Newsom. Although you may disagree with his means and effectiveness, there is no denying that he is trying to save lives. The hate y’all spew because someone is trying to save lives is in sharp contrast to your love of the Mango Magat, who is directly responsible for the majority of covid-related deaths die to his denialism and complete lack of caring.
> 
> None of this is surprising, because this is who Magats are. They don’t care about anyone but themselves. They can’t see past their own short-term self-interest. And they’re too stupid to realize that their short-term interest is almost always contrary to their long term benefit. That’s why they’re losers. So much losing. So beautiful. They’re the best at losing.



Trying to save lives?  You mean by sending his kids to private school, uninterrupted, and dining massless, drinking wine after rehab blaming his affair on alcohol, with a bunch of lobbyists?

Yeah... he’s really got his heart in the right place.  Are those HIS or my self interests?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Also check it out. All the living real presidents will welcome Biden into the WH now that Mr. Steals From Children With Cancer and his s**tbag loser family have been kicked out of town.
> 
> View attachment 9959


That picture was taken after Kamala the whore accepted Joe’s invitation to join him despite accusing him of racism and believing his sexual accuser.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> It’s interesting the animosity that people have towards Newsom. Although you may disagree with his means and effectiveness, there is no denying that he is trying to save lives. The hate y’all spew because someone is trying to save lives is in sharp contrast to your love of the Mango Magat, who is directly responsible for the majority of covid-related deaths die to his denialism and complete lack of caring.
> 
> None of this is surprising, because this is who Magats are. They don’t care about anyone but themselves. They can’t see past their own short-term self-interest. And they’re too stupid to realize that their short-term interest is almost always contrary to their long term benefit. That’s why they’re losers. So much losing. So beautiful. They’re the best at losing.


blah, blah, blah, MAGAT, blah blah blah, marmalade, blah blah blah, trumpanzee, blah blah, blah, magat, blah, blah - well , you get the idea.

I love it when you put your cape on and MAGAT on everything.


----------



## EOTL

NorCalDad said:


> Kowtowing to lobbyists is hardly a "minor" thing depending on your ideology -- certainly not enough to justify insurrection.  That said, neolibs are part of the reason we are where we are. For sure tea party republicans are at a level of dysfunction of their own, but that doesn't mean the left can't introspect where they're at.


Gavin Newsom had dinner with a lobbyist who has been a friend for a long time, so therefore ok to overthrow the government of the US.  And even if lobbying did occur, you do know what lobbyists do right? They lobby.  That is the whole point.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> That picture was taken after Kamala the whore accepted Joe’s invitation to join him despite accusing him of racism and believing his sexual accuser.


Racist. Misogynist.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Oh, and don’t forget to pick up your Mein Pillow before they’re gone forever.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1351595044290109441



Maybe they can be donated to the illegal aliens Joe invited from Honduras.  Get your checkbook out, Emperor, those holding cages Obama built aren’t going to furnish themselves.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Gavin Newsom had dinner with a lobbyist who has been a friend for a long time, so therefore ok to overthrow the government of the US.  And even if lobbying did occur, you do know what lobbyists do right? They lobby.  That is the whole point.


He shut the state down and was pictured drinking wine, with his mistress, after both whores went to rehab post blaming booze for screwing his best friend over.  He’s above the rules, but Trump offends you. 

Classy guy.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Trying to save lives?  You mean by sending his kids to private school, uninterrupted, and dining massless, drinking wine after rehab blaming his affair on alcohol, with a bunch of lobbyists?
> 
> Yeah... he’s really got his heart in the right place.  Are those HIS or my self interests?


Yes, he is trying to save lives, and there is no legitimate debate otherwise.  The fact that you are discussing his sex life years ago as “evidence” that he is trying to benefit personally from covid social distancing regulations says a lot about your brainwashing.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> He shut the state down and was pictured drinking wine, with his mistress, after both whores went to rehab post blaming booze for screwing his best friend over.  He’s above the rules, but Trump offends you.
> 
> Classy guy.


Wow, you have a real problem.  But of course you do. You’re a trumpanzee.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Racist. Misogynist.


Joe is the racist that said “ you ain’t black”, not me, dipshit.  And Kamala is a whore.  That’s what you call someone that has a sexual affair with a married colleague. 

Your heroes, not mine.  No wonder you cherish Gavin.  Same cloth.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Yes, he is trying to save lives, and there is no legitimate debate otherwise.  The fact that you are discussing his sex life years ago as “evidence” that he is trying to benefit personally from covid social distancing regulations says a lot about your brainwashing.


No, he wants to take credit for a low death rate when he runs for president.  He’s betting, by then, nobody will be talking about how he destroyed California’s economy to do it.

His sex life?  He screwed his best friend’s wife.  He’s a human piece of shit.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Wow, you have a real problem.  But of course you do. You’re a trumpanzee.


You never answered me, Emperor Of The Ladyboys.  Were you always picked last in P.E.?


----------



## NorCalDad

EOTL said:


> Gavin Newsom had dinner with a lobbyist who has been a friend for a long time, so therefore ok to overthrow the government of the US.  And even if lobbying did occur, you do know what lobbyists do right? They lobby.  That is the whole point.


Is that what you gleaned from what I wrote?  Where did I say anything about it being ok to overthrow a government?

Lobbyists are inherently bad.  The politicians represent those interests as opposed to their constituents.  And people wonder why the government isn't working for them.  As much as I'm going to get slammed for this here, AOC and Bernie are pretty much the only politicians that are actually trying to work for the people.


----------



## Kicker4Life

NorCalDad said:


> Is that what you gleaned from what I wrote?  Where did I say anything about it being ok to overthrow a government?
> 
> Lobbyists are inherently bad.  The politicians represent those interests as opposed to their constituents.  And people wonder why the government isn't working for them.  As much as I'm going to get slammed for this here, AOC and Bernie are pretty much the only politicians that are actually trying to work for the people.


That’s his MO....take something that was said, totally misconstrue it, then blast insults based on broad, over-generalizations that have nothing to do with the statement or question asked.  

It’s how he makes himself feel big and strong behind that jelly doughnut riddled keyboard of his.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> He shut the state down and was pictured drinking wine, with his mistress, after both whores went to rehab post blaming booze for screwing his best friend over.  He’s above the rules, but Trump offends you.
> 
> Classy guy.


Can you please explain how his sex life years ago proves that his social distancing regulations benefit him financially Mr. Magat?

If Newsom’s sex life makes him incapable of making rational decisions, what about f**king a stripper when your wife is pregnant?


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Gavin Newsom had dinner with a lobbyist who has been a friend for a long time, so therefore ok to overthrow the government of the US.  And even if lobbying did occur, you do know what lobbyists do right? They lobby.  That is the whole point.


You should just stop...the more you talk, the more evident it is how little you know.  Yes, he was out with a good friend, helping him and his friend make a LOT of money.  Please realize he doesn't care about you, he is in it for himself and the sooner you realize that the better off you will be.  

It is sad to see how brainwashed you have become!! You use to look at things through a clear lense.  What has happened to you???


----------



## EOTL

NorCalDad said:


> Is that what you gleaned from what I wrote?  Where did I say anything about it being ok to overthrow a government?
> 
> Lobbyists are inherently bad.  The politicians represent those interests as opposed to their constituents.  And people wonder why the government isn't working for them.  As much as I'm going to get slammed for this here, AOC and Bernie are pretty much the only politicians that are actually trying to work for the people.


Magats are inherently bad. Lobbying is a job. And an important one.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Magats are inherently bad. Lobbying is a job. And an important one.


Like lobbying to legalize marijuana so you, and your "friend for a long time," can make a LOT of money...yes, true, that is very important and once again I am sure he did that in YOUR best interest. Because Newsom cares about YOU


----------



## NorCalDad

EOTL said:


> Magats are inherently bad. Lobbying is a job. And an important one.


This is the mindset that is cancerous to the democratic party.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> *Yes, he is trying to save lives*, and there is no legitimate debate otherwise.  The fact that you are discussing his sex life years ago as “evidence” that he is trying to benefit personally from covid social distancing regulations says a lot about your brainwashing.


Putting aside your obvious lean - and yes, I agree he's trying to save lives (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt). 

The question is is he doing a good enough job in comparison to his peers in similar states.  And by lives I mean all lives, like lives associated with business, lives associated with shutting down schools and making socio-economic issues worse, lives in regards to forcing businesses to shutter, causing job loss.  Rate his performance.  What could he be doing better? 

I know you don't have a non-partisan bone in your body, but try.  You agree with the lockdowns, you agree with no schools, no youth sports?  Even though there is mounting evidence that shows that none of this is effective and only makes it worse for the targets of these lockdowns?  Even king cuomo is backpedaling.  NYC is in a bad way, a real bad way.  I know that LA and SF are becoming business deserts for many industries.  TX and FL on the other hand, businesses are much healthier, communities and neighborhoods are getting along.  And yes, CV19 is a persistent presence, but life cannot shut down for people like you.  Their lives matter just as much as grandma and grandpa, and others.  

I suspect that you don't run a business, or run one that is -19 immune (there are plenty).  So, maybe, no MAGAT retort and apply some intellect into a response. * Or not.  Cuz if you don't, we'll all laugh at you.*


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> You should just stop...the more you talk, the more evident it is how little you know.  Yes, he was out with a good friend, helping him and his friend make a LOT of money.  Please realize he doesn't care about you, he is in it for himself and the sooner you realize that the better off you will be.
> 
> It is sad to see how brainwashed you have become!! You use to look at things through a clear lense.  What has happened to you???


Newson goes to a birthday dinner for someone he has known for more than 20 years, and it’s wrong because he happens to be a lobbyist?

Y’all were claiming he was implementing social distancing regulations for personal gain, and your “proof” is that he had dinner with a friend who happens to be a lobbyist and also had an affair many years ago. And keep trying to pretend that your magat master didn’t f**k a stripper when his wife was pregnant.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Magats are inherently bad. Lobbying is a job. And an important one.


I’ll tell Big Tobacco and Gun Rights activists that you think ‘Lobbying’ is an important job.

Please, keep speaking.  Your now making even centrists mock and ignore you.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Newson goes to a birthday dinner for someone he has known for more than 20 years, and it’s wrong because he happens to be a lobbyist?
> 
> Y’all were claiming he was implementing social distancing regulations for personal gain, and your “proof” is that he had dinner with a friend who happens to be a lobbyist and also had an affair many years ago. And keep trying to pretend that your magat master didn’t f**k a stripper when his wife was pregnant.


I don't really care if he goes out to dinner or if he had an affair yesterday...doesn't affect me one bit. You were saying he has YOUR best interest in mind and I am telling you, he doesn't. Every decision he makes has a calculated outcome that is meant to help promote himself.  Perhaps it does help save lives, but don't try and believe for one minute he's doing it for YOU, he is all about himself, so don't get that confused.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Can you please explain how his sex life years ago proves that his social distancing regulations benefit him financially Mr. Magat?
> 
> If Newsom’s sex life makes him incapable of making rational decisions, what about f**king a stripper when your wife is pregnant?


Proves that in both examples the individuals are self-interested narcissists.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Putting aside your obvious lean - and yes, I agree he's trying to save lives (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt).
> 
> The question is is he doing a good enough job in comparison to his peers in similar states.  And by lives I mean all lives, like lives associated with business, lives associated with shutting down schools and making socio-economic issues worse, lives in regards to forcing businesses to shutter, causing job loss.  Rate his performance.  What could he be doing better?
> 
> I know you don't have a non-partisan bone in your body, but try.  You agree with the lockdowns, you agree with no schools, no youth sports?  Even though there is mounting evidence that shows that none of this is effective and only makes it worse for the targets of these lockdowns?  Even king cuomo is backpedaling.  NYC is in a bad way, a real bad way.  I know that LA and SF are becoming business deserts for many industries.  TX and FL on the other hand, businesses are much healthier, communities and neighborhoods are getting along.  And yes, CV19 is a persistent presence, but life cannot shut down for people like you.  Their lives matter just as much as grandma and grandpa, and others.
> 
> I suspect that you don't run a business, or run one that is -19 immune (there are plenty).  So, maybe, no MAGAT retort and apply some intellect into a response.  Or not.  Cuz if you don't, we'll all laugh at you.


Hey trumpanzees! Check out @happy9 making actual legitimate arguments.

You do know that this particular round of magat craziness started when I said there is no debate that he is trying to save lives even if you disagree with his means and effectiveness. That’s not even the least bit controversial a point. That was followed with a bunch of magat insanity in which a couple trumpanzee conspiracy theorists claimed that he’s actually doing it for personal gain. And that he had an affair. And dinner with a friend. And calling Kamala Harris a whore, because magats can’t help but throw in some gratuitous racism and misogyny. All very compelling proof that magats are incapable of rational debate. 

Your legitimate points don’t matter here amd are a waste if time, because magats refuse to even recognize that he’s trying to save lives even - as I said earlier - if you disagree with the means or effectiveness.  It is not possible to have a real debate with a magat, so let’s get back to all they’re capable of understanding, which is humiliation and losing.


----------



## Kicker4Life

N00B said:


> Your now making even centrists mock and ignore you.


Ha!  I’m a Centrist and I’ve been doing it for months....


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Can you please explain how his sex life years ago proves that his social distancing regulations benefit him financially Mr. Magat?
> 
> If Newsom’s sex life makes him incapable of making rational decisions, what about f**king a stripper when your wife is pregnant?


His social distancing regulations wouldn’t benefit him because, just like his Auntie, the rules don’t apply to him.  The rest of us better obey, though.  

You wanted Trump impeached, hypocrite.  Time to recall Governor slimeball.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> I don't really care if he goes out to dinner or if he had an affair yesterday...doesn't affect me one bit. You were saying he has YOUR best interest in mind and I am telling you, he doesn't. Every decision he makes has a calculated outcome that is meant to help promote himself.  Perhaps it does help save lives, but don't try and believe for one minute he's doing it for YOU, he is all about himself, so don't get that confused.


BS. I said he’s trying to save lives, even if you disagree with his means or effectiveness. Nothing more. You’re just blinded by your hatred.

Imposing social distancing regulations that hurt the economy, hurt his personal finances, and are resulting in a recall effort that hurts his political future doesn’t sound at all like he is doing this for himself. Or is he playing 4D chess?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Newson goes to a birthday dinner for someone he has known for more than 20 years, and it’s wrong because he happens to be a lobbyist?
> 
> Y’all were claiming he was implementing social distancing regulations for personal gain, and your “proof” is that he had dinner with a friend who happens to be a lobbyist and also had an affair many years ago. And keep trying to pretend that your magat master didn’t f**k a stripper when his wife was pregnant.


No, that’s not what we said.  Try again, Emperor.


----------



## NorCalDad

EOTL said:


> Hey trumpanzees! Check out @happy9 making actual legitimate arguments.
> 
> You do know that this particular round of magat craziness started when I said there is no debate that he is trying to save lives even if you disagree with his means and effectiveness. That’s not even the least bit controversial a point. That was followed with a bunch of magat insanity in which a couple trumpanzee conspiracy theorists claimed that he’s actually doing it for personal gain. And that he had an affair. And dinner with a friend. And calling Kamala Harris a whore, because magats can’t help but throw in some gratuitous racism and misogyny. All very compelling proof that magats are incapable of rational debate.
> 
> Your legitimate points don’t matter here amd are a waste if time, because magats refuse to even recognize that he’s trying to save lives even - as I said earlier - if you disagree with the means or effectiveness.  It is not possible to have a real debate with a magat, so let’s get back to all they’re capable of understanding, which is humiliation and losing.


Most every reasonable person on these boards believe he is trying to save lives.  Many of us, though, believe he's not going about it correctly.  There are some dudes here that wouldn't surprise me if they were in DC on 1/6.  Those folks I have muted and are generally in the minority.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> His social distancing regulations wouldn’t benefit him because, just like his Auntie, the rules don’t apply to him.  The rest of us better obey, though.
> 
> You wanted Trump impeached, hypocrite.  Time to recall Governor slimeball.


I get it, he’s imposed these rules on everyone else so he can cut the line at the French Laundry. 

Newsom didn’t incite and insurrection and the overthrow of the government. But I totally get how you’d equate that to having dinner with a friend to celebrate his birthday. It is because magats are stupid.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> BS. I said he’s trying to save lives, even if you disagree with his means or effectiveness. Nothing more. You’re just blinded by your hatred.
> 
> Imposing social distancing regulations that hurt the economy, hurt his personal finances, and are resulting in a recall effort that hurts his political future doesn’t sound at all like he is doing this for himself. Or is he playing 4D chess?


I don't really care what he does...I have come to the realization months ago that these restrictions aren't going away anytime soon...but I also realize politicians are in it for one reason, themselves.  It is their job, they don't do it for the people, they do it because that is how they get paid and make a living. A pretty good living I might add.  I just have to know though, do you really think Newsom has YOUR best interest in mind when he makes the decisions he does or perhaps does he have ulterior motives that will eventually lead to benefiting himself?


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> He needs to be recalled for who he is, his dishonesty and hypocrisy and how poorly he’s handled all of this.  You know... the same way Dems went after Trump.
> 
> Sounds familiar, doesn’t it?


When Newsom stands in front of a mob and encourages it to sack the statehouse, you’ll have my signature on the recall petition.

For now, the GOP is doing their best to make people like me into Democrats.  And, in states from Georgia to Arizona, it’s working.  

Trump is doing to the national GOP what Pete Wilson did to the CA GOP.  And you all are so busy shoveling more coal into the boiler you haven’t even noticed the train wreck.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I get it, he’s imposed these rules on everyone else so he can cut the line at the French Laundry.
> 
> Newsom didn’t incite and insurrection and the overthrow of the government. But I totally get how you’d equate that to having dinner with a friend to celebrate his birthday. It is because magats are stupid.


Neither did Trump, but if he did, he did it after he was impeached for winning.

You just fall deeper and deeper.  It’s because you’re the stupid guy trying to convince everyone else he isn’t stupid.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> When Newsom stands in front of a mob and encourages it to sack the statehouse, you’ll have my signature on the recall petition.
> 
> For now, the GOP is doing their best to make people like me into Democrats.  And, in states from Georgia to Arizona, it’s working.
> 
> Trump is doing to the national GOP what Pete Wilson did to the CA GOP.  And you all are so busy shoveling more coal into the boiler you haven’t even noticed the train wreck.


What exactly do you think Trump said?  And was it any worse than Kamala saying she hoped the protesters continued their violent protest in Kenosha because it was “a movement”?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> I don't really care what he does...I have come to the realization months ago that these restrictions aren't going away anytime soon...but I also realize politicians are in it for one reason, themselves.  It is their job, they don't do it for the people, they do it because that is how they get paid and make a living. A pretty good living I might add.  I just have to know though, do you really think Newsom has YOUR best interest in mind when he makes the decisions he does or perhaps does he have ulterior motives that will eventually lead to benefiting himself?


When you decide all politicians are only in it for themselves, it makes you part of the problem. There is a huge difference between corrupt politicians who are in it for their own benefit (Cadet Bone Spurs) and those who are not, but with whom you disagree on policies. It is this kind of cynicism that leads people to ignore facts and truth. It is an excuse for you to be intellectually lazy. You don’t want to put in the effort to have legitimate discussions about important policy issues, or figure out what is true and what is Q, so you just claim everyone is the same, everyone is corrupt, everyone is in it only for themselves. You’re just a intellectually lazy and dishonest f**k.


----------



## happy9

dad4 said:


> When Newsom stands in front of a mob and encourages it to sack the statehouse, you’ll have my signature on the recall petition.
> 
> For now, the GOP is doing their best to make people like me into Democrats.  And, in states from Georgia to Arizona, it’s working.
> 
> Trump is doing to the national GOP what Pete Wilson did to the CA GOP.  And you all are so busy shoveling more coal into the boiler you haven’t even noticed the train wreck.


Putting politics aside (I don't care for either side much), how much more can the state of CA take?  Even places like NJ and NY are backpedaling from lockdowns - they don't work and are killing local economies.  NJ has resisted imposing more severe constraints - their Governor has listened. NYC is literally deserted.  As a business, once you leave the city, hard to come back. Sucks for the local communities. I was in Sacramento in AUG, it was alarming to see the amount of  "out of business due to pandemic"  signs - and that was in AUG.

And yes, the virus is real, not going anywhere anytime soon, not even with a vaccine.  Local economies cannot sit it out.  You can't solve local economic issues with handouts.  They extend the runway a bit but eventually that runway ends and the cliff appears.  Just look around at the empty storefronts. 

Emotional voting is human nature but can lead to self destructiveness.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Hey trumpanzees! Check out @happy9 making actual legitimate arguments.
> 
> You do know that this particular round of magat craziness started when I said there is no debate that he is trying to save lives even if you disagree with his means and effectiveness. That’s not even the least bit controversial a point. That was followed with a bunch of magat insanity in which a couple trumpanzee conspiracy theorists claimed that he’s actually doing it for personal gain. And that he had an affair. And dinner with a friend. And calling Kamala Harris a whore, because magats can’t help but throw in some gratuitous racism and misogyny. All very compelling proof that magats are incapable of rational debate.
> 
> Your legitimate points don’t matter here amd are a waste if time, because magats refuse to even recognize that he’s trying to save lives even - as I said earlier - if you disagree with the means or effectiveness.  It is not possible to have a real debate with a magat, so let’s get back to all they’re capable of understanding, which is humiliation and losing.


You have as much depth as a power point slide.  Carry on......magat...blah blah, trumpanzee, blah blah.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> When you decide all politicians are only in it for themselves, it makes you part of the problem. There is a huge difference between corrupt politicians who are in it for their own benefit (Cadet Bone Spurs) and those who are not, but with whom you disagree on policies. It is this kind of cynicism that leads people to ignore facts and truth. It is an excuse for you to be intellectually lazy. You don’t want to put in the effort to have legitimate discussions about important policy issues, or figure out what is true and what is Q, so you just claim everyone is the same, everyone is corrupt, everyone is in it only for themselves. You’re just a intellectually lazy and dishonest f**k.


Trump took a pay cut for the job.  You think Senator Biden will donate his salary?

Lazy fuck.


----------



## Red card

EOTL said:


> Nope. Holding people accountable for heinous behavior is not bigotry. Bit look at whiny snowflake casting stones ‘cuz he can’t take it. Or take responsibility for his abysmal behavior.


you cant even hold a job. New York pedo with no kids in soccer


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Trump took a pay cut for the job.  You think Senator Biden will donate his salary?
> 
> Lazy fuck.


McShits Orange Like His Face more than made up for it with Hatch Act violations. If you believe that foregoing salary in exchange for graft is laudable, I am not surprised, because that’s what magats do.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> When you decide all politicians are only in it for themselves, it makes you part of the problem. There is a huge difference between corrupt politicians who are in it for their own benefit (Cadet Bone Spurs) and those who are not, but with whom you disagree on policies. It is this kind of cynicism that leads people to ignore facts and truth. It is an excuse for you to be intellectually lazy. You don’t want to put in the effort to have legitimate discussions about important policy issues, or figure out what is true and what is Q, so you just claim everyone is the same, everyone is corrupt, everyone is in it only for themselves. You’re just a intellectually lazy and dishonest f**k.


Okay, that was hyperbole to say all politicians are in it for themselves, clearly that is not the case. I gave you facts about Newsom that you ignored, but I realize you do not want to hear facts that are in opposition to your view... Your rhetoric gets old and you give no credence to actual facts that contradict your opinion, so I will not continue wasting my time with that.  

But you have still not answered the question.  Do you think Newsom has your best interest in mind when he is trying to save lives or do you think there is an ulterior motive that will benefit him in the future?


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Putting politics aside (I don't care for either side much), how much more can the state of CA take?  Even places like NJ and NY are backpedaling from lockdowns - they don't work and are killing local economies.  NJ has resisted imposing more severe constraints - their Governor has listened. NYC is literally deserted.  As a business, once you leave the city, hard to come back. Sucks for the local communities. I was in Sacramento in AUG, it was alarming to see the amount of  "out of business due to pandemic"  signs - and that was in AUG.
> 
> And yes, the virus is real, not going anywhere anytime soon, not even with a vaccine.  Local economies cannot sit it out.  You can't solve local economic issues with handouts.  They extend the runway a bit but eventually that runway ends and the cliff appears.  Just look around at the empty storefronts.
> 
> Emotional voting is human nature but can lead to self destructiveness.


It’s a shame that magats wouldn’t do their part with social distancing when they should have. We could have been much farther along if they’d taken this seriously at any point, instead of constantly whining at Costco about wearing a mask.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Okay, that was hyperbole to say all politicians are in it for themselves, clearly that is not the case. I gave you facts about Newsom that you ignored, but I realize you do not want to hear facts that are in opposition to your view... Your rhetoric gets old and you give no credence to actual facts that contradict your opinion, so I will not continue wasting my time with that.
> 
> But you have still not answered the question.  Do you think Newsom has your best interest in mind when he is trying to save lives or do you think there is an ulterior motive that will benefit him in the future?


You haven’t given one fact to support your bs nonsense that he is making social distancing decisions for personal gain. Not one. I’ve heard he had an affair a while back. I heard he had dinner to celebrate a friend’s birthday.


----------



## NorCalDad

EOTL said:


> It’s a shame that magats wouldn’t do their part with social distancing when they should have. We could have been much farther along if they’d taken this seriously at any point, instead of constantly whining at Costco about wearing a mask.


Trump supporters aren't the only ones breaking the rules these days.  I'd give you March - July.  Now, though, it's everyone.


----------



## Cruzer

EOTL said:


> It’s a shame that magats wouldn’t do their part with social distancing when they should have. We could have been much farther along if they’d taken this seriously at any point, instead of constantly whining at Costco about wearing a mask.


*could have been farther along*? You are going to blame the opposite political side as to why people have gotten sick? Unless you have stayed indoors, you have put yourself and others at _risk, _too, ya hypocrite.

It's human nature to be social and visit family. I know people who have passed it from one to another and their political affiliation did not play a part. So stop blaming the 'other side' as to why CA is shutdown. It's not just Trump supporters getting/spreading the virus!


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> It’s a shame that magats wouldn’t do their part with social distancing when they should have. We could have been much farther along if they’d taken this seriously at any point, instead of constantly whining at Costco about wearing a mask.


Link to the MAGAT study please.  I want to know how they impacted NYC and LA, SF? etc...askin for  friend.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> You haven’t given one fact to support your bs nonsense that he is making social distancing decisions for personal gain. Not one. I’ve heard he had an affair a while back. I heard he had dinner to celebrate a friend’s birthday.


I haven't heard you give one fact to support how well he's managing the state of CA. I want to know all about his tidal wave of success bruh..


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> You haven’t given one fact to support your bs nonsense that he is making social distancing decisions for personal gain. Not one. I’ve heard he had an affair a while back. I heard he had dinner to celebrate a friend’s birthday.


Dang!!! You are very good at twisting and manipulating the truth...you will be a good politician one day!! 
I never said he was making social distancing decisions for personal gain. I told you he has made decisions in the past that have benefited him financially and I gave you a specific one in his passing of marijuana. I then asked you if you thought the decisions he was making was for YOU or because it could some how benefit him in the future...and you have yet to respond to that question.


----------



## dad4

Cruzer said:


> *could have been farther along*? You are going to blame the opposite political side as to why people have gotten sick? Unless you have stayed indoors, you have put yourself and others at _risk, _too, ya hypocrite.
> 
> *It's human nature to be social and visit family. *I know people who have passed it from one to another and their political affiliation did not play a part. So stop blaming the 'other side' as to why CA is shutdown. It's not just Trump supporters getting/spreading the virus!


Not all of us.

Some of us cancelled our Thanksgiving and Christmas plans.  And now we are stuck waiting for numbers to drop back down after the spike that you all created.

In terms of politics, Republicans in congress are contracting covid at roughly 3 times the rate of Democrats in congress.  (22% versus 7.7%).   

Apparently the virus does care which party gives you advice on distance and masks.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Not all of us.
> 
> Some of us cancelled our Thanksgiving and Christmas plans.  And now we are stuck waiting for numbers to drop back down after the spike that you all created.
> 
> In terms of politics, Republicans in congress are contracting covid at roughly 3 times the rate of Democrats in congress.  (22% versus 7.7%).
> 
> Apparently the virus does care which party gives you advice on distance and masks.


In Ventura County, the biggest outbreaks are in the Oxnard and Ventura zipcodes.  Not as much in the Los Angeles burbs in the Conejo.  The reason isn't because the people in Oxnard were whooping it up on Thanksgiving and Christmas more than the people in the burbs.  It's because they've been forced to work while the people in the burbs can continue to zoom work.  Yes, there might have been a bump due to the partying, but that's not driving it.  If you look at the LA County numbers, for example, positivity was at its highest in the immediate time frame from Christmas to 4 days after new years.  If socialization really was the only thing driving this the numbers should be hitting their highs right now (as the infections make their way through families).


----------



## notintheface

Scott m Shurson said:


> There isn’t a single person in jail or prison for smoking pot.


tHoSe LiBtArD pOLiCiEs!!!!!1!!!!!!!!1!!!!


----------



## Grace T.

Grace T. said:


> In Ventura County, the biggest outbreaks are in the Oxnard and Ventura zipcodes.  Not as much in the Los Angeles burbs in the Conejo.  The reason isn't because the people in Oxnard were whooping it up on Thanksgiving and Christmas more than the people in the burbs.  It's because they've been forced to work while the people in the burbs can continue to zoom work.  Yes, there might have been a bump due to the partying, but that's not driving it.  If you look at the LA County numbers, for example, positivity was at its highest in the immediate time frame from Christmas to 4 days after new years.  If socialization really was the only thing driving this the numbers should be hitting their highs right now (as the infections make their way through families).


p.s. In our local neighborhood we've  been noticing a lot of temporary closures in our favorite takeout places.  There was a burger chain store, a BBQ place and our local Chinese restaurant.  VC doesn't publish work outbreaks (they keep saying they'll start any day now).  It's weird because the delivery services showed the 3 restaurants open.  In at least 1 of the places it turns out it was because of a COVID outbreak among the staff and because the VC rules require restaurants that have such outbreaks to close for a certain number of days.  The standard isn't as rigorous for the supermarkets and pharmacies.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Dang!!! You are very good at twisting and manipulating the truth...you will be a good politician one day!!
> I never said he was making social distancing decisions for personal gain. I told you he has made decisions in the past that have benefited him financially and I gave you a specific one in his passing of marijuana. I then asked you if you thought the decisions he was making was for YOU or because it could some how benefit him in the future...and you have yet to respond to that question.


Uh, the Governor doesn’t “pass marijuana laws”dumbs**t. Let’s start with the basics with respect to how government works. People elect legislators. Legislators write and pass laws. The Governor can sign or veto them. And CA has a special stupid initiative process that allows voters to directly implement laws. Here, the voters legalized marijuana by way of initiative process. A number of marijuana-related laws were subsequently written by the legislature, passed by the legislature and then signed by the governor. Or are you saying the majority of the CA legislators are part of the conspiracy to personally benefit the governor? Maybe this goes a lot deeper than we thought. Like DC pizza parlor sex trafficking tunnel deep.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> I haven't heard you give one fact to support how well he's managing the state of CA. I want to know all about his tidal wave of success bruh..


If Californians were dying at the same rate as in AZ, there would be almost 30,000 more dead Californians. I’m not sorry you can’t dine in at Applebee’s right now.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Uh, the Governor doesn’t “pass marijuana laws”dumbs**t. Let’s start with the basics with respect to how government works. People elect legislators. Legislators write and pass laws. The Governor can sign or veto them. And CA has a special stupid initiative process that allows voters to directly implement laws. Here, the voters legalized marijuana by way of initiative process. A number of marijuana-related laws were subsequently written by the legislature, passed by the legislature and then signed by the governor. Or are you saying the majority of the CA legislators are part of the conspiracy to personally benefit the governor? Maybe this goes a lot deeper than we thought. Like DC pizza parlor sex trafficking tunnel deep.


 Okay...now your being a dumbsh** if you can’t contextualize what I’m saying then your ignorance is worse than your rhetoric.  Once again you fail to answer questions directly asked of you as you’d rather get caught up in the semantics than the truth!

I will help you...you’ve got the disease boy, but there is still hope for you! Hopefully you will recognize your ignorance when you get a little older

To know that you do not know is the best. To think you know when you do not is a disease. Recognizing this disease as a disease is to be free of it.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> In Ventura County, the biggest outbreaks are in the Oxnard and Ventura zipcodes.  Not as much in the Los Angeles burbs in the Conejo.  The reason isn't because the people in Oxnard were whooping it up on Thanksgiving and Christmas more than the people in the burbs.  It's because they've been forced to work while the people in the burbs can continue to zoom work.  Yes, there might have been a bump due to the partying, but that's not driving it.  If you look at the LA County numbers, for example, positivity was at its highest in the immediate time frame from Christmas to 4 days after new years.  If socialization really was the *only* thing driving this the numbers should be hitting their highs right now (as the infections make their way through families).


Socialization isn't the only cause.   It’s the avoidable cause.

I know covid spreads at chicken processing plants.  Covid also spreads at chicken restaurants.  Covid spreads at dinner parties serving the chicken.

Of the three, the last one is completely avoidable.  The second can be limited by making full use of takeout and delivery.   Only the first should be a major problem.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> If Californians were dying at the same rate as in AZ, there would be almost 30,000 more dead Californians. I*’m not sorry you can’t dine in at Applebee’s right now.*


Huh, Applebees?  And still no answer.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Okay...now your being a dumbsh** if you can’t contextualize what I’m saying then your ignorance is worse than your rhetoric.  Once again you fail to answer questions directly asked of you as you’d rather get caught up in the semantics than the truth!
> 
> I will help you...you’ve got the disease boy, but there is still hope for you! Hopefully you will recognize your ignorance when you get a little older
> 
> To know that you do not know is the best. To think you know when you do not is a disease. Recognizing this disease as a disease is to be free of it.


I see. When you say “contextualize”, you mean just “make s**t up and hope I don’t get called out for it”.  How ‘bout you “contextualize” to us how the governor “passed” a marijuana law that benefited him personally? Or are we back to talking about his dining habits since you were lying about the marijuana thing?

Seriously, you lied that Newsom “passed a law” which is such a ridiculous lie because it is impossible.  Once I explained why what you are saying is a lie and impossible, you labeled it “contextualizing”.  Then, in the very same post you claim that “to think you know when you do not is a disease” without even realizing you are talking about yourself? This is so great.  When can I expect more lying, er, “contextualizing”?


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Socialization isn't the only cause.   It’s the avoidable cause.
> 
> I know covid spreads at chicken processing plants.  Covid also spreads at chicken restaurants.  Covid spreads at dinner parties serving the chicken.
> 
> Of the three, the last one is completely avoidable.  The second can be limited by making full use of takeout and delivery.   Only the first should be a major problem.


All true.

But you were trying to ascribe blame for the outbreak to socialization.  Yes, it contributed to an increase.  The indoor dining didn't because of the dining being closed.  What's driving the current outbreak is work.

And it's not just the 1 contact at the chicken processing plants.  It's the guy raising the chicken with his staff, the guy delivering the chickens to the processor, the chicken processing plant (all of whom are working in masks BTW), the sandwich truck feeding the processors during lunch, the guy delivering the chickens to the factory, the factory that prepackages the chicken in the 11 herbs and spices, the guy delivering the finished chicken to the restaurant, the chicken restaurant staff, and the clueless guy that walks up to the counter and asks what's good here. These folks then go home, including to some families with grandma watching the kids (who aren't in school) so that they can go to work.  Meanwhile, we're all here being key board warriors (while not practicing law or teaching math) and wondering why we are having outbreaks....not to mention that these guys are probably socializing while having a cigarette break given they don't have a Tom Cruise to rant at them.


----------



## Cruzer

dad4 said:


> Not all of us.
> 
> Some of us cancelled our Thanksgiving and Christmas plans.  And now we are stuck waiting for numbers to drop back down after the spike that you all created.
> 
> In terms of politics, Republicans in congress are contracting covid at roughly 3 times the rate of Democrats in congress.  (22% versus 7.7%).
> 
> Apparently the virus does care which party gives you advice on distance and masks.


'Not all of us' What? Want to be social? You must not be human or you are an introvert. That's on you and no one else. Humans, at our core, are social beings.

Stop lumping people into your narrative, some people are hypocrites, and others are worse. I can care less about the federal government and its infection rate. I care about my family and friends. *The fact is, the virus doesn't care about politics.*


----------



## EOTL

Cruzer said:


> 'Not all of us' What? Want to be social? You must not be human or you are an introvert. That's on you and no one else. Humans, at our core, are social beings.
> 
> Stop lumping people into your narrative, some people are hypocrites, and others are worse. I can care less about the federal government and its infection rate. I care about my family and friends. *The fact is, the virus doesn't care about politics.*


Apparently humans, at our core, are also selfish cold-blooded killers. The pumpkin pie is so worth it though.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> All true.
> 
> But you were trying to ascribe blame for the outbreak to socialization.  Yes, it contributed to an increase.  The indoor dining didn't because of the dining being closed.  What's driving the current outbreak is work.
> 
> And it's not just the 1 contact at the chicken processing plants.  It's the guy raising the chicken with his staff, the guy delivering the chickens to the processor, the chicken processing plant (all of whom are working in masks BTW), the sandwich truck feeding the processors during lunch, the guy delivering the chickens to the factory, the factory that prepackages the chicken in the 11 herbs and spices, the guy delivering the finished chicken to the restaurant, the chicken restaurant staff, and the clueless guy that walks up to the counter and asks what's good here. These folks then go home, including to some families with grandma watching the kids (who aren't in school) so that they can go to work.  Meanwhile, we're all here being key board warriors (while not practicing law or teaching math) and wondering why we are having outbreaks....not to mention that these guys are probably socializing while having a cigarette break given they don't have a Tom Cruise to rant at them.


Socialization IS a major cause.  Also totally avoidable.  Just meet people outside and wear masks.  Or play online games and talk over discord/zoom.  

The other change is that socal has a new variant.  Went from 0% in late summer to 50% of cases today.  (Likely more contagious.) Today's NYT.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I see. When you say “contextualize”, you mean just “make s**t up and hope I don’t get called out for it”.  How ‘bout you “contextualize” to us how the governor “passed” a marijuana law that benefited him personally? Or are we back to talking about his dining habits since you were lying about the marijuana thing?
> 
> Seriously, you lied that Newsom “passed a law” which is such a ridiculous lie because it is impossible.  Once I explained why what you are saying is a lie and impossible, you labeled it “contextualizing”.  Then, in the very same post you claim that “to think you know when you do not is a disease” without even realizing you are talking about yourself? This is so great.  When can I expect more lying, er, “contextualizing”?


California Governor Gavin Newsom signed into law *four cannabis bills that* will directly impact the state-legal marijuana industry. AB1525 and SB 67 


			News & Information | Monterey County, CA
		


If you look up Newsoms “good friend” and by chance also his campaign advisor, Jason Kinney, whose firm California Strategies had many partnerships with marijuana business’...Now Axiom Advisors, who Kinney is registered as a lobbyist for, and WeedMaps were big proponents of Prop 64.  

Boy, those lobbyists have such an important role...didn’t you say something about how important they are. But of course Newsom was not doing any of that for himself. That was all for the People.


----------



## Cruzer

EOTL said:


> Apparently humans, at our core, are also selfish cold-blooded killers. The pumpkin pie is so worth it though.


'Rules for thee, not for me', I believe is the saying. Apparently, humans like to stir the pot wherever they go, too.


----------



## dad4

Cruzer said:


> 'Not all of us' What? Want to be social? You must not be human or you are an introvert. That's on you and no one else. Humans, at our core, are social beings.
> 
> Stop lumping people into your narrative, some people are hypocrites, and others are worse. I can care less about the federal government and its infection rate. I care about my family and friends. *The fact is, the virus doesn't care about politics.*


Not all of us are socializing indoors during the pandemic.   I thought that was clear.   

The virus doesn't care about politics.  But, if you let Fox News convince you that indoor gatherings are safe, the virus will use the opportunity you created.


----------



## Grace T.

Cruzer said:


> 'Not all of us' What? Want to be social? You must not be human or you are an introvert. That's on you and no one else. Humans, at our core, are social beings.
> 
> Stop lumping people into your narrative, some people are hypocrites, and others are worse. I can care less about the federal government and its infection rate. I care about my family and friends. *The fact is, the virus doesn't care about politics.*


He's a math guy.  High es are not typically attracted to math...high es tend to be attracted towards subjects having to do with people.  While it's a generalization and not true all math types are introverts, it's a good bet he's lower on the e scale than the average person.  He's also in education.  People who enter education generally tend to be more risk adverse.  While it's a generalizationa and not true all teachers are scared of their own shadow, it's a good bet he is more risk adverse than the typical person.  So if I were to guess, given who he is, it's probably hard for him to understand the scope of the problem for most people.



dad4 said:


> Socialization IS a major cause.  Also totally avoidable.  Just meet people outside and wear masks.  Or play online games and talk over discord/zoom.
> 
> The other change is that socal has a new variant.  Went from 0% in late summer to 50% of cases today.  (Likely more contagious.) Today's NYT.


As I was saying....

p.s. if the variant were the driver LA County would be continuing to rise....it's not....at worst it might be plateaued slightly below the height....it's seasonality which is driving this thing, and the zip codes getting hit hardest are the ones that are working.  Once again, it's an illusion to think we can actually control this thing.  If you are fortunate enough to work from home, don't care about having your kids locked up, and are a low enough e that not socializing isn't a big deal, you might very well avoid getting it....but it's not a model that can be replicated across families.  Besides, if I'm being forced to work in a chicken plant 12/7 and my buddy asks me to share a beer after work (who I've been standing shoulder to shoulder for the last 8 hours) am I really going to say no?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> California Governor Gavin Newsom signed into law *four cannabis bills that* will directly impact the state-legal marijuana industry. AB1525 and SB 67
> 
> 
> News & Information | Monterey County, CA
> 
> 
> 
> If you look up Newsoms “good friend” and by chance also his campaign advisor, Jason Kinney, whose firm California Strategies had many partnerships with marijuana business’...Now Axiom Advisors, who Kinney is registered as a lobbyist for, and WeedMaps were big proponents of Prop 64.
> 
> Boy, those lobbyists have such an important role...didn’t you say something about how important they are. But of course Newsom was not doing any of that for himself. That was all for the People.


I see, so when you said Newsom benefits personally, you meant he doesn’t, it’s someone else who does. Uh, someone Gavin Newsom knows literally benefits from every single law that he signs. That’s what happens when you know a lot of people and your job requires that you either sign or veto laws.

But the best part about your ridiculous conspiracy theory (and bottomless stupidity) is this:  AB 1525 passed the assembly 70-0 and the Senate 28-2. SB 67 passed the assembly 73-0 and the senate 36-0. Do you know what a veto proof majority looks like? It’s a lot less than these numbers. Let me explain, because you clearly did not take my subtle hint the last time that you have no f**king idea how government works and should stop talking. “Veto proof majority” essentially means that Gavin did not and could not have any impact on the bills becoming law. He did not write the bills, he did not “pass” the bills as you stupidly claimed earlier, and he could not have changed the end result even he wanted to. He had no impact on the law’s passing (or not passing).

You may literally be the dumbest person alive not named @crush or grace karen. Do you have another fake example how Gavin is only in it for himself, or are you finally beginning to realize that the Qanon whackadoos who feed you these conspiracy theories are full of s**t?


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> In Ventura County, the biggest outbreaks are in the Oxnard and Ventura zipcodes.  Not as much in the Los Angeles burbs in the Conejo.  The reason isn't because the people in Oxnard were whooping it up on Thanksgiving and Christmas more than the people in the burbs.  It's because they've been forced to work while the people in the burbs can continue to zoom work.  Yes, there might have been a bump due to the partying, but that's not driving it.  If you look at the LA County numbers, for example, positivity was at its highest in the immediate time frame from Christmas to 4 days after new years.  If socialization really was the only thing driving this the numbers should be hitting their highs right now (as the infections make their way through families).


You seem to be saying that those who must go to work are more likely to get sick than those that stay home.

That looks like evidence to support a general lockdown.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> He's a math guy.  High es are not typically attracted to math...high es tend to be attracted towards subjects having to do with people.  While it's a generalization and not true all math types are introverts, it's a good bet he's lower on the e scale than the average person.  He's also in education.  People who enter education generally tend to be more risk adverse.  While it's a generalizationa and not true all teachers are scared of their own shadow, it's a good bet he is more risk adverse than the typical person.  So if I were to guess, given who he is, it's probably hard for him to understand the scope of the problem for most people.
> 
> 
> 
> As I was saying....
> 
> p.s. if the variant were the driver LA County would be continuing to rise....it's not....at worst it might be plateaued slightly below the height....it's seasonality which is driving this thing, and the zip codes getting hit hardest are the ones that are working.  Once again, it's an illusion to think we can actually control this thing.  If you are fortunate enough to work from home, don't care about having your kids locked up, and are a low enough e that not socializing isn't a big deal, you might very well avoid getting it....but it's not a model that can be replicated across families.  Besides, if I'm being forced to work in a chicken plant 24/7 and my buddy asks me to share a beer after work (who I've been standing shoulder to shoulder for the last 8 hours) am I really going to say no?


Math guys also hate deconstructivism, as it turns out.  A proof needs to stand on its own, without the author.

A highly infectious variant would not mean cases continue to rise.

For any given set of behaviors, a high R variant would raise the level at which you plateau, and steepen the curve while below the plateau.

This seems consistent with what LA has seen since September: a high peak, despite strong mask usage since summer.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> You seem to be saying that those who must go to work are more likely to get sick than those that stay home.
> 
> That looks like evidence to support a general lockdown.


That's because you are looking at it again only from the one side of the equation.  The next question then is the shut down worth the cost.  In the hypothetical being posed is that we shut down food production.  The question that needs to be asked then is whether the benefit of shutting it all down is worth everyone going without chicken.

There is an equity point here though.  People like you, or dad, or me have the luxury of being keyboard warriors.  The working class don't.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> He's a math guy.  High es are not typically attracted to math...high es tend to be attracted towards subjects having to do with people.  While it's a generalization and not true all math types are introverts, it's a good bet he's lower on the e scale than the average person.  He's also in education.  People who enter education generally tend to be more risk adverse.  While it's a generalizationa and not true all teachers are scared of their own shadow, it's a good bet he is more risk adverse than the typical person.  So if I were to guess, given who he is, it's probably hard for him to understand the scope of the problem for most people.
> 
> 
> 
> As I was saying....
> 
> p.s. if the variant were the driver LA County would be continuing to rise....it's not....at worst it might be plateaued slightly below the height....it's seasonality which is driving this thing, and the zip codes getting hit hardest are the ones that are working.  Once again, it's an illusion to think we can actually control this thing.  If you are fortunate enough to work from home, don't care about having your kids locked up, and are a low enough e that not socializing isn't a big deal, you might very well avoid getting it....but it's not a model that can be replicated across families.  Besides, if I'm being forced to work in a chicken plant 12/7 and my buddy asks me to share a beer after work (who I've been standing shoulder to shoulder for the last 8 hours) am I really going to say no?


I looked up e scale --



			https://www.piano-keyboard-guide.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/e-major-scale-treble-clef.png


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Math guys also hate deconstructivism, as it turns out.  A proof needs to stand on its own, without the author.
> 
> A highly infectious variant would not mean cases continue to rise.
> 
> For any given set of behaviors, a high R variant would raise the level at which you plateau, and steepen the curve while below the plateau.
> 
> This seems consistent with what LA has seen since September: a high peak, despite strong mask usage since summer.


I see you've settled into a an explanation for why masks aren't working in Los Angeles.  We all knew eventually you would (because you can't fathom the idea hey maybe masks don't work that much).


----------



## Scott m Shurson

notintheface said:


> tHoSe LiBtArD pOLiCiEs!!!!!1!!!!!!!!1!!!!


Good rebuttal.  You spend a bunch of time on that?  Another cop died today because another thug was on the street and shouldn’t have been.  Maybe you libtards will get it when you’re victimized.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> I looked up e scale --
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.piano-keyboard-guide.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/e-major-scale-treble-clef.png


e refers to one of the scales of the Myers-Briggs personality model.  The theory goes that by breaking people into the 5 (ne 4) scales you can determine how they are predisposed towards acting in the world.  "E scale" actually shows one of my prejudices: it's technically the e-i scale or extroversion/introversion.


----------



## EOTL

EOTL said:


> I see, so when you said Newsom benefits personally, you meant he doesn’t, it’s someone else who does. Uh, someone Gavin Newsom knows literally benefits from every single law that he signs. That’s what happens when you know a lot of people and your job requires that you either sign or veto laws.
> 
> But the best part about your ridiculous conspiracy theory (and bottomless stupidity) is this:  AB 1525 passed the assembly 70-0 and the Senate 28-2. SB 67 passed the assembly 73-0 and the senate 36-0. Do you know what a veto proof majority looks like? It’s a lot less than these numbers. Let me explain, because you clearly did not take my subtle hint the last time that you have no f**king idea how government works and should stop talking. “Veto proof majority” essentially means that Gavin did not and could not have any impact on the bills becoming law. He did not write the bills, he did not “pass” the bills as you stupidly claimed earlier, and he could not have changed the end result even he wanted to. He had no impact on the law’s passing (or not passing).
> 
> You may literally be the dumbest person alive not named @crush or grace karen. Do you have another fake example how Gavin is only in it for himself, or are you finally beginning to realize that the Qanon whackadoos who feed you these conspiracy theories are full of s**t?


Where’d you go @soccersc? Cooking up some “contextualizing” with your Q master?  It looks like my theory that Gavin the Gastronome sabotaged our entire economy so he could cut the wait list at the French Laundry is the least stupid of all the conspiracy theories.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> That's because you are looking at it again only from the one side of the equation.  The next question then is the shut down worth the cost.  In the hypothetical being posed is that we shut down food production.  The question that needs to be asked then is whether the benefit of shutting it all down is worth everyone going without chicken.
> 
> There is an equity point here though.  People like you, or dad, or me have the luxury of being keyboard warriors.  The working class don't.


"The working class"?

The reason I am no longer working is that I retired (and I would probably be judged to be disabled if back in the workforce anyway).  

Let me pull a hypothetical out of thin air -- you really can't help yourself.  Let's discuss that.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> e refers to one of the scales of the Myers-Briggs personality model.  The theory goes that by breaking people into the 5 (ne 4) scales you can determine how they are predisposed towards acting in the world.  "E scale" actually shows one of my prejudices: it's technically the e-i scale or extroversion/introversion.


Pseudoscience.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> It’s interesting the animosity that people have towards Newsom. Although you may disagree with his means and effectiveness, there is no denying that he is trying to save lives. The hate y’all spew because someone is trying to save lives is in sharp contrast to your love of the Mango Magat, who is directly responsible for the majority of covid-related deaths die to his denialism and complete lack of caring.
> 
> None of this is surprising, because this is who Magats are. They don’t care about anyone but themselves. They can’t see past their own short-term self-interest. And they’re too stupid to realize that their short-term interest is almost always contrary to their long term benefit. That’s why they’re losers. So much losing. So beautiful. They’re the best at losing.


Racist bigot feverishly typing away from his isolation bubble....lol


----------



## Grace T.

Grace T. said:


> e refers to one of the scales of the Myers-Briggs personality model.  The theory goes that by breaking people into the 5 (ne 4) scales you can determine how they are predisposed towards acting in the world.  "E scale" actually shows one of my prejudices: it's technically the e-i scale or extroversion/introversion.


My best guess BTW is that he's an ISFJ (though that last factor is always tricky)  Don't have enough data to pin you down yet but getting pretty close.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I see, so when you said Newsom benefits personally, you meant he doesn’t, it’s someone else who does. Uh, someone Gavin Newsom knows literally benefits from every single law that he signs. That’s what happens when you know a lot of people and your job requires that you either sign or veto laws.
> 
> But the best part about your ridiculous conspiracy theory (and bottomless stupidity) is this;  AB 1525 passed the assembly 70-0 and the Senate 28-2. SB 67 passed the assembly 73-0 and the senate 36-0. Do you know what a veto proof majority looks like? It’s a lot less than these numbers. Let me explain, because you clearly did not take my subtle hint the last time that you have no f**king idea how government works. “Veto proof majority” essentially means that Gavin did not and could not have any impact on the bills becoming law. He did not write the bills, he did not “pass” the bills as you stupidly claimed earlier, and he could not have changed the end result even he wanted to. He had no impact on the law’s passing (or not passing).
> 
> You may literally be the dumbest person alive not named @crush or grace karen. Do you have another fake example how Gavin is only in it for himself, or are you finally beginning to realize that the Qanon whackadoos who feed you these conspiracy theories are full of s**t?


Wow...they really got you all wrapped up. Not sure where the conspiracy theory exist, but you have shown me through your deep and quantitative research on how he has made our state better...and now I am convinced, you must be right...he does it for everyone else...he is selfless and is working hard for the people. How could I have been so blinded by all the good he does for others. I feel better now that I know Newsom wants what best for me and you.  I’m sure he will continue to make our lives great. Thank you for showing me so many ways he has made our State great. You must be so proud to be a follower of his.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Pseudoscience.


Then all HR is....which is fine...kind of agree with you, but it is very helpful in understanding people and what drives them.


----------



## notintheface

Scott m Shurson said:


> Good rebuttal.  You spend a bunch of time on that?  Another cop died today because another thug was on the street and shouldn’t have been.  Maybe you libtards will get it when you’re victimized.


Nooooboooodyyyyy carrreeessssss whaaaaattttt yyooooouuuuu hhaaaaaavveeeeee tooooooo saaaaaaaaayyyyyyy Scooooooootttttt....


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> "The working class"?
> 
> The reason I am no longer working is that I retired (and I would probably be judged to be disabled if back in the workforce anyway).
> 
> Let me pull a hypothetical out of thin air -- you really can't help yourself.  Let's discuss that.


Meh...to my knowledge you haven't said you are in a home (which given you've been pro-lockdown you think you would lead with since it would be a powerful rhetorical tool)....we know you have progressive views, have a mixed race family, know enough to be on the computer, know your kids care about you and have been looking in on you, read primary source history so you aren't a dumb dumb or completely destitute....you aren't exactly out there bagging groceries so maybe check your privilege a little?


----------



## Grace T.

notintheface said:


> Nooooboooodyyyyy carrreeessssss whaaaaattttt yyooooouuuuu hhaaaaaavveeeeee tooooooo saaaaaaaaayyyyyyy Scooooooootttttt....



You apparently care enough to type up long sentences.  The only thing worse you could have done to show how much he bugs you is write in all caps....just saying.

People who don't care tend to ignore.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> Then all HR is....which is fine...kind of agree with you, but it is very helpful in understanding people and what drives them.


This particular quackery starts from unsupported judgments and then uses them to prove themselves.  And not very well, at that - if a measure of a given population satisfies the original premise, then it is declared by the adherents to be a success, even if the level of success is less than 50%.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> This particular quackery starts from unsupported judgments and then uses them to prove themselves.  And not very well, at that - if a measure of a given population satisfies the original premise, then it is declared by the adherents to be a success, even if the level of success is less than 50%.


a. it doesn't try to prove anything.  It just measures where you are on 5 scales.  It's a way to sort people....it's not seeking to prove anything.
b. Guess you must feel the same way about implicit bias testing, which unlike MB actually sets out to prove something (e.g., that people are systemically racist),


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> Meh...to my knowledge you haven't said you are in a home (which given you've been pro-lockdown you think you would lead with since it would be a powerful rhetorical tool)....we know you have progressive views, have a mixed race family, know enough to be on the computer, know your kids care about you and have been looking in on you, read primary source history so you aren't a dumb dumb or completely destitute....you aren't exactly out there bagging groceries so maybe check your privilege a little?


My "home" is where I live with my wife. I can take care of myself but I am only good for an hour or two of vigorous labor at a time.

And my first paying job (other than picking produce or delivering papers) included bagging groceries, stocking the shelves, sweeping the floor, etc.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> I see you've settled into a an explanation for why masks aren't working in Los Angeles.  We all knew eventually you would (because you can't fathom the idea hey maybe masks don't work that much).


That's because most of the published data says masks do work.  Anomalies are interesting.

Data guy, remember?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Wow...they really got you all wrapped up. Not sure where the conspiracy theory exist, but you have shown me through your deep and quantitative research on how he has made our state better...and now I am convinced, you must be right...he does it for everyone else...he is selfless and is working hard for the people. How could I have been so blinded by all the good he does for others. I feel better now that I know Newsom wants what best for me and you.  I’m sure he will continue to make our lives great. Thank you for showing me so many ways he has made our State great. You must be so proud to be a follower of his.


Wow that’s some serious passive aggressive
tail between the legs. I do understand why you would try to mock actual facts. Magats never acknowledge when they are wrong; they lack the self-esteem needed for such a thing. 

Of course you do not see as a conspiracy theory Gavin Newsom benefited personally from a marijuana law he signed because he had a birthday dinner at the French Laundry with a lobbiest who apparently lobbies for the marijuana industry, and he also signed a marijuana bill at some point, which we know is shockingly rare in CA. For you it isn’t a conspiracy theory at all. It’s “alternative facts” aka “contextualizing”, aka a bald-faced lie that weak-minded people like you lap up from the likes of Parler.

The best part of all this is you have no idea what those laws are even about.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> a. it doesn't try to prove anything.  It just measures where you are on 5 scales.  It's a way to sort people....it's not seeking to prove anything.
> b. Guess you must feel the same way about implicit bias testing, which unlike MB actually sets out to prove something (e.g., that people are systemically racist),


It leads to semi-educated people spouting words like "he is high on the e scale" as if that actually meant something.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> My "home" is where I live with my wife. I can take care of myself but I am only good for an hour or two of vigorous labor at a time.
> 
> And my first paying job (other than picking produce or delivering papers) included bagging groceries, stocking the shelves, sweeping the floor, etc.


My first paying job (other than baby sitting or delivering papers) was serving drinks to people, doing inventory, sweeping up.  Doesn't tell much about how you ended up.  All the more impressive though given the breadth of your knowledge.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> It leads to semi-educated people spouting words like "he is high on the e scale" as if that actually meant something.


It does.  It's a descriptive of one aspect of his personality.

And if you think I'm semi-educated....wow....there must only be a handful of the truly educated for you out in the country (with 95% of us being ignorant to you)....nice.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> My first paying job (other than baby sitting or delivering papers) was serving drinks to people, doing inventory, sweeping up.  Doesn't tell much about how you ended up.  All the more impressive though given the breadth of your knowledge.


I graduated from high school in 1965 and got my ABCS in 1980.  I had a broad education, and I didn't stop learning then.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> That's because most of the published data says masks do work.  Anomalies are interesting.
> 
> Data guy, remember?



I'm much more sure of the J now.  ISFJ....am I right?  Close at least?


----------



## Red card

dad4 said:


> How many of us have been perfect in following the covid rules?
> 
> I agree he messed up.  I don't want to recall someone over a dinner, though.
> 
> The bigger problem is botching the vaccine rollout.


Recall not only a dinner, the refusal to get military hospitals set up for this surge, leaving his winery open while closing down everyone else business, flee to montana house instead of staying and suffering the restrictions he imposed. Failure to have a vax plan despite being told to prepare.  So ya RECALL


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> I graduated from high school in 1965 and got my ABCS in 1980.  I had a broad education, and I didn't stop learning then.


That was during Vietnam.  Did you serve?  My father came over the same year during the medical recruitment program to take care of all the boys who came back injured during those times.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Good rebuttal.  You spend a bunch of time on that?  Another cop died today because another thug was on the street and shouldn’t have been.  Maybe you libtards will get it when you’re victimized.


I guess too many posts in a row had gone by without a racist blaming black people for something.

I totally see why that justifies overthrowing the government of the U.S. and, in so doing, beating a cop to death with the American flag. I can also see why it justifies killing more Americans of Covid at an even higher rate than we already are. Totally relevant if you’re in an online Klan forum. Oh wait, you are.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> I'm much more sure of the J now.  ISFJ....am I right?  Close at least?


Remember what I said about not liking deconstructivism?

It's dehumanizing.  I am not simply a cishet white male INTJ FUMB.

I am a person whose opinions can stand or fall based on the arguments I can muster.  As are you.

So like my arguments, or don't.  But don't ask for my help putting me into a box.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> Check it out!  Even Moscow Mitch admits Trumpy McSeditionist incited an insurrection and overthrow of the US government.
> 
> Now back to magats losing their s**t because CA’s governor had dinner at the French Laundry...
> 
> View attachment 9958


Hey Ewok, the new asst health secretary in Bidens cabinet is stunning. Guess what?  That's a man DA...


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Remember what I said about not liking deconstructivism?
> 
> It's dehumanizing.  I am not simply a cishet white male INTJ FUMB.
> 
> I am a person whose opinions can stand or fall based on the arguments I can muster.  As are you.
> 
> So like my arguments, or don't.  But don't ask for my help putting me into a box.


O.k. I totally get the T (I was torn on that)....but an N really?  Intuition is not data.  If you really are a data guy it can't be an N!  How does that reconcile?  Data guy who thinks he's a data guy but isn't really (would also explain your political tendencies)?

In reality, truth is actually very fluid and subjective.  The box doesn't prove anything about you.  It does though help understand your tendencies and where you come from (such as predicting you'd settle on an explanation for Los Angeles and masks as opposed to being comfortable with maybe there isn't an explanation and I don't really need to have one)  It help understand the argument, because the argument itself is at best superficially only 50% of the answer.


----------



## dad4

Lavey29 said:


> Hey Ewok, the new asst health secretary in Bidens cabinet is stunning. Guess what?  That's a man DA...View attachment 9962


I don't really need my public officials to be eye candy.  

If you need photos of beautiful blondes, the internet is there for you.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> I don't really need my public officials to be eye candy.
> 
> If you need photos of beautiful blondes, the internet is there for you.


Agree, but in this case the more damning fact is that she ordered the ill people back into the care homes, but took her own mother out of it.  That alone should be disqualifying.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> O.k. I totally get the T (I was torn on that)....but an N really?  Intuition is not data.  If you really are a data guy it can't be an N!  How does that reconcile?  Data guy who thinks he's a data guy but isn't really (would also explain your political tendencies)?
> 
> In reality, truth is actually very fluid and subjective.  The box doesn't prove anything about you.  It does though help understand your tendencies and where you come from (such as predicting you'd settle on an explanation for Los Angeles and masks as opposed to being comfortable with maybe there isn't an explanation and I don't really need to have one)  It help understand the argument, because the argument itself is at best superficially only 50% of the answer.


That's because I am not looking for a single variable answer.  It isn't 100% socializing, or 100% masks.

But, socializing + workspace + masks + indoors + bars/restaurants + new variant + density begins to make sense.

In a way that "virus gonna virus" makes no sense.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Agree, but in this case the more damning fact is that she ordered the ill people back into the care homes, but took her own mother out of it.  That alone should be disqualifying.


It's a problem when you decide that at least one major appointee must be from each interest group.


----------



## Lavey29

dad4 said:


> I don't really need my public officials to be eye candy.
> 
> If you need photos of beautiful blondes, the internet is there for you.


Are you ok with a grown man dressed as a woman using the same restroom with your daughter inside?  That's the policy change on day 1 according to Bidens cabinet secretary there. Trump made it illegal.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> Hey Ewok, the new asst health secretary in Bidens cabinet is stunning. Guess what?  That's a man DA...View attachment 9962


Got jealous of your friend’s racist post so you had to go homophobic Outlaw?


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> That's because I am not looking for a single variable answer.  It isn't 100% socializing, or 100% masks.
> 
> But, socializing + workspace + masks + indoors + bars/restaurants + new variant + density begins to make sense.
> 
> In a way that "virus gonna virus" makes no sense.


Fair.  But, as we've seen in Australia/New Zealand, it is true that if you reduce all social movement to near zero, you can control the virus.  Anything short of that and you aren't going to control it.

Also if you look at it from your perspective: I'm at home and not going out much...socializing opens up a huge risk for me of potentially getting the virus.  If you look at it from the perspective of the chicken plant worker: I'm working 6 days a week, in long shifts, standing shoulder to shoulder with people...I'm going to get sick since the masks don't seem to stop anything in these plants.....my friend had a birthday and wants to get a beer...I'm going to get it at work anyways so why am I denying myself the beer.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> Are you ok with a grown man dressed as a woman using the same restroom with your daughter inside?  That's the policy change on day 1 according to Bidens cabinet secretary there. Trump made it illegal.


Your daugjter is already used to it. And also used to accepting that her daddy is a homophobic douche. How does it feel to know your child has no respect for you?


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> Your daugjter is already used to it. And also used to accepting that her daddy is a homophobic douche. How does it feel to know your child has no respect for you?


Mighty big words attacking my family from behind your keyboard Ewok. You have no kids in youth soccer yet you frequent the youth soccer forum 24/7. you are a F'n pedofile lurking the internet for victims.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> Mighty big words attacking my family from behind your keyboard Ewok. You have no kids in youth soccer yet you frequent the youth soccer forum 24/7. you are a F'n pedofile lurking the internet for victims.


I don’t need to know your kids to know how this will end for you. Estranged from your children without a doubt. From your defensive tone, I can tell even you know which way the wind is blowing.


----------



## Red card

Lavey29 said:


> Hey Ewok, the new asst health secretary in Bidens cabinet is stunning. Guess what?  That's a man DA...View attachment 9962


He stuffed elderly into care facility killing thousands.  Great pick creepy joe.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Fair.  But, as we've seen in Australia/New Zealand, it is true that if you reduce all social movement to near zero, you can control the virus.  Anything short of that and you aren't going to control it.
> 
> Also if you look at it from your perspective: I'm at home and not going out much...socializing opens up a huge risk for me of potentially getting the virus.  If you look at it from the perspective of the chicken plant worker: I'm working 6 days a week, in long shifts, standing shoulder to shoulder with people...I'm going to get sick since the masks don't seem to stop anything in these plants.....my friend had a birthday and wants to get a beer...I'm going to get it at work anyways so why am I denying myself the beer.


I don't think all the people in airports over Xmas paid for their plane tickets with poultry plant salaries.  Those were mostly white collar travellers.

You're trying to use low income essential workers to justify recreational social gatherings for the middle and upper class.


----------



## Glitterhater

Lavey29 said:


> Hey Ewok, the new asst health secretary in Bidens cabinet is stunning. Guess what?  That's a man DA...View attachment 9962


This is stupid. I do not agree with him but this makes you look ridiculous.


----------



## Speed

HOLY CRAP. I just went through 7 pages posted since yesterday morning under this _thread let them play_ and I do not believe the word 'soccer' was used in one post.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Your daugjter is already used to it. And also used to accepting that her daddy is a homophobic douche. How does it feel to know your child has no respect for you?


nice one dude, even for you.  Just couldn't help yourself.  we already know your intellect ceiling is very low.  At least your comfortable laying in the crap you spew.


----------



## happy9

Speed said:


> HOLY CRAP. I just went through 7 pages posted since yesterday morning under this _thread let them play_ and I do not believe the word 'soccer' was used in one post.


what is soccer?


----------



## Glitterhater

EOTL said:


> Got jealous of your friend’s racist post so you had to go homophobic Outlaw?


Maybe I'm wrong but I don't think that's Outlaw.


----------



## crush

Soccer will be back soon.  New Special Bleach is coming to clean up all the evil, bad and ugly.  We will come back soon with a fresh new appreciation for life   Soccer will be used as a healing for so many children.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> I don't think all the people in airports over Xmas paid for their plane tickets with poultry plant salaries.  Those were mostly white collar travellers.
> 
> You're trying to use low income essential workers to justify recreational social gatherings for the middle and upper class.


Err....in my circles its working class Latino kids that play soccer so check your privilege there.

I'm also not seeking to justify anything with low income workers.  1. I'm pointing to the unfairness of our policies that they disproportionately fall on the working class, and 2. pointing out that their work is what's driving the present outbreak, which you had originally blamed on socialization before expanding your definition.

We also know that the Xmas travel wasn't a huge driver because not everywhere in the US went up after Christmas (unless you are going to argue somehow uniquely SoCalers and certain others only traveled during Christmas).

p.s. please explain the N....very curious.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Err....in my circles its working class Latino kids that play soccer so check your privilege there.
> 
> I'm also not seeking to justify anything with low income workers.  1. I'm pointing to the unfairness of our policies that they disproportionately fall on the working class, and 2. pointing out that their work is what's driving the present outbreak, which you had originally blamed on socialization before expanding your definition.
> 
> We also know that the Xmas travel wasn't a huge driver because not everywhere in the US went up after Christmas (unless you are going to argue somehow uniquely SoCalers and certain others only traveled during Christmas).


You're doing too much single cause analysis there.

Why would you expect a Christmas spike in an area which is already in a decline caused by herd immunity?  You'd expect a mild change to the rate of decline.

Christmas spikes would be in the areas which have not yet peaked.


----------



## espola

Speed said:


> HOLY CRAP. I just went through 7 pages posted since yesterday morning under this _thread let them play_ and I do not believe the word 'soccer' was used in one post.


It's a wonder that this thread has not been kicked into the Off-Topic bucket.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> You're doing too much single cause analysis there.
> 
> Why would you expect a Christmas spike in an area which is already in a decline caused by herd immunity?  You'd expect a mild change to the rate of decline.
> 
> Christmas spikes would be in the areas which have not yet peaked.


You've gone to the other extreme.  If you had true herd immunity, we wouldn't need a vaccine.  But I think we agree....it's a factor that contributes....but it's not the sole driver (which is where we started where you blamed socialization).  If you remove the socialization, you still get basically what happened.  f you remove the X mas travel, you still get basically what happened.

p.s.  please explain the N....makes no sense if you are a data guy.


----------



## N00B

espola said:


> It's a wonder that this thread has not been kicked into the Off-Topic bucket.


It is in ‘off topic’ and has been for some time thanks to EOTL.


----------



## EOTL

Red card said:


> He stuffed elderly into care facility killing thousands.  Great pick creepy joe.


Magat desperation is palpable. So much losing. Bigly.

Lost the election. Lost congress. Lost everything they want in CA. Lost more than 60 lawsuits. Lost their coup. Lost their claim the election was stolen.  What a sorry bunch of sad sacks. Just like their sad loser leader who can’t even muster the “courage” to show up to the inauguration. So pathetic. And starting tomorrow they will be forced to endure complete sentences.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Magat desperation is palpable. So much losing. Bigly.
> 
> Lost the election. Lost congress. Lost everything they want in CA. Lost more than 60 lawsuits. Lost their coup. Lost their claim the election was stolen.  What a sorry bunch of sad sacks. Just like their sad loser leader who can’t even muster the “courage” to show up to the inauguration. So pathetic. And starting tomorrow they will be forced to endure complete sentences.


Does that mean you will soon display the ability to use complete sentences?  I’m doubtful.  

How is ’adulting’ going for you? Are you excited about your career options?


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> It is in ‘off topic’ and has been for some time thanks to EOTL.


Whiner thinks sad Gavin Newsom recall efforts constitute “soccer talk”.  I’m all for talking soccer if you want to do that.  But magats can’t help themselves, so whatevs.


----------



## Lavey29

Red card said:


> He stuffed elderly into care facility killing thousands.  Great pick creepy joe.


You're right, first IT removed ITs mother from the care facility and then IT stuffed covid patients into the homes for the elderly and killed them all, by the 1000s.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> You've gone to the other extreme.  If you had true herd immunity, we wouldn't need a vaccine.  But I think we agree....it's a factor that contributes....but it's not the sole driver (which is where we started where you blamed socialization).  If you remove the socialization, you still get basically what happened.  f you remove the X mas travel, you still get basically what happened.
> 
> p.s.  please explain the N....makes no sense if you are a data guy.


There is no true herd immunity.  Herd immunity always depends on behavior patterns.

A population might be herd immune under assumptions of mask usage and social distancing.  If that same population takes up karaoke and speed dating, cases will rise despite “immunity”.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> I don’t need to know your kids to know how this will end for you. Estranged from your children without a doubt. From your defensive tone, I can tell even you know which way the wind is blowing.


You're just jealous Ewok. I have 2 beautiful daughters. One is 17 and the other 11. One is an athlete with a 4.5gpa aspiriring to be a doctor. My little one loves music. Plays the clarinet and is also a straight A student.  They are intelligent beautiful young ladies but still have that little girl innocence that only a father can understand. They will both be very successful as they mature into adulthood and I cherish every minute with them something you will never have or be able to appreciate.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> I don't think all the people in airports over Xmas paid for their plane tickets with poultry plant salaries.  Those were mostly white collar travellers.
> 
> You're trying to use low income essential workers to justify recreational social gatherings for the middle and upper class.


If your looking at the CA Case demographics, yah.....


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Whiner thinks sad Gavin Newsom recall efforts constitute “soccer talk”.  I’m all for talking soccer if you want to do that.  But magats can’t help themselves, so whatevs.


We already know you have your own reality in which you feel like you’re doing some sort of public service with all of these magat posts.

Please take a moment to reflect again on who said what and when in this thread.

I believe it was you that justified your rants with “this is a COVID thread”... Only to spew more magat drivel before Dominic moved the topic due to your behavior.

‘Adults’ take responsibility for the consequences of their actions.


----------



## Kicker4Life

N00B said:


> We already know you have your own reality in which you feel like you’re doing some sort of public service with all of these magat posts.
> 
> Please take a moment to reflect again on who said what and when in this thread.
> 
> I believe it was you that justified your rants with “this is a COVID thread”... Only to spew more magat drivel before Dominic moved the topic due to your behavior.
> 
> ‘Adults’ take responsibility for the consequences of their actions.


Que the next violent, demeaning verbal attack.....only comes from one person.....


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> There is no true herd immunity.  Herd immunity always depends on behavior patterns.
> 
> A population might be herd immune under assumptions of mask usage and social distancing.  If that same population takes up karaoke and speed dating, cases will rise despite “immunity”.


Here's where the issue is....takes up karaoake, speed dating, or work....but someone has to work or we all die


----------



## N00B

N00B said:


> Please take a moment to reflect again on who said what and when in this thread.
> 
> I believe it was you that justified your rants with “this is a COVID thread”... Only to spew more magat drivel before Dominic moved the topic due to your behavior.


@EOTL 

Did you take the time to review your history here in this thread?  

Now... back to ‘adulting’. How’s that going for you?


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> @EOTL
> 
> Did you take the time to review your history here in this thread?
> 
> Now... back to ‘adulting’. How’s that going for you?


Actually it was @Kicker4Life who took the first personal swipe at someone in this thread. Magats didn’t like hearing that it’s a bad idea to hold a rally to support school sports, ‘cuz of all the death going on and all, so he decided to go at me. God forbid someone disagree with him.  Good thing I’m not a whiny magat snowflake.

BTW, did y’all remember to collect the wall money from Mexico?  I think tomorrow is the deadline.


----------



## N00B

Dad4 politely asked you to move your discussion to ‘off-topic’.  You were ‘trolling’ right out of the gate with Covid charts.

“ If you want to argue about covid, go to the covid thread. 

I happen to disagree with Kicker on this, but there is no need to argue it yet again, here.”

Your reply:



EOTL said:


> The point of the thread is about covid. So no.


Now you’re going all full tilt political bigot and acting a fool.

Seems there are a lot of questions you selectively ignore.  Not to dissimilar from your audience as you continue to neuter yourself with those that add you to their ignore list.

By all means keep speaking!

‘Adulting’ is hard sometimes.  What’s your experience been?


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Here's where the issue is....takes up karaoake, speed dating, or work....but someone has to work or we all die


Who is advocating for an end to work?

I am saying people should back off on the indoor social gatherings.  If you fill the ICU with dinner party victims, you have no room left for people who got sick at work.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Who is advocating for an end to work?
> 
> I am saying people should back off on the indoor social gatherings.  If you fill the ICU with dinner party victims, you have no room left for people who got sick at work.


Yeah, but where we started this....it's not what's filling up the ICU.  It might make the situation worse, but it's not driving it....otherwise the distribution would be more uniform across zip codes.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Dad4 politely asked you to move your discussion to ‘off-topic’.  You were ‘trolling’ right out of the gate with Covid charts.
> 
> “ If you want to argue about covid, go to the covid thread.
> 
> I happen to disagree with Kicker on this, but there is no need to argue it yet again, here.”
> 
> Your reply:
> 
> 
> 
> Now you’re going all full tilt political bigot and acting a fool.
> 
> Seems there are a lot of questions you selectively ignore.  Not to dissimilar from your audience as you continue to neuter yourself with those that add you to their ignore list.
> 
> By all means keep speaking!
> 
> ‘Adulting’ is hard sometimes.  What’s your experience been?


I disagreed with the idea that it is a good idea to hold a rally to return to school sports right now. I can see how you would think that relying on facts and data constitute trolling. Facts and data make it very clear how stupid it is to hold rallies about returning to school sports right now, and magats can’t handle facts and data.  Notably, I was not alone with my perspective. The entire point of this thread was covid. That was the point of the proposed rallies, it is the reason for not having HS sports right now that the rallies were intended to protest. Y’all just want a one-sided, fact free safe space.  So snowflakey. 

Like I said earlier, the first personal swipe was your buddy. I’m happy to play.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Yeah, but where we started this....it's not what's filling up the ICU.  It might make the situation worse, but it's not driving it....otherwise the distribution would be more uniform across zip codes.


Who said there is a single cause driving cases?

You have several factors each making the situation worse.  Some are essential, and some are completely unnecessary.

I am just saying it is important to minimize the unnecessary factors.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> I disagreed with the idea that it is a good idea to hold a rally to return to school sports right now. I can see how you would think that relying on facts and data constitute trolling. Facts and data make it very clear how stupid it is to hold rallies about returning to school sports right now, and magats can’t handle facts and data.  Notably, I was not alone with my perspective. The entire point of this thread was covid. That was the point of the proposed rallies, it is the reason for not having HS sports right now that the rallies were intended to protest. Y’all just want a one-sided, fact free safe space.  So snowflakey.
> 
> Like I said earlier, the first personal swipe was your buddy. I’m happy to play.


Aside from the fact you just denied the same, just a few posts ago.... “kicker started it”... mature, not.  

Ironic that it was a Dad that asked you to behave and follow the rules of the forum.  Your response was predictably juvenile.

Responsibility, like ‘adulting’ may be out of your grasp at present.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Who said there is a single cause driving cases?
> 
> You have several factors each making the situation worse.  Some are essential, and some are completely unnecessary.
> 
> I am just saying it is important to minimize the unnecessary factors.



As to the first sentence, you did when you said socialization was to blame.

As to the second, it shows your "i" bias thinking that socialization is completely unnecessary.  For a high e it's actually very essential and remote doesn't really cut it.

As to the third, that's been the issue all along....other people making the decision over what's a necessary or unnecessary factor (all along choosing to ignore those decisions when they go about their own business whether it's BLM protests, French laundry, haircuts, going to outdoor dining and then voting to ban it, or planning to go to out of state tournaments)


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> I’m happy to play.


The kids want to play too... as in Let Them Play.

Sometimes you just gotta know when you’re not the smartest person in the room.  I hear that kind of wisdom comes from an adult perspective.

.... or someone would need just enough self awareness to realize that they’ve lost their audience in an online forum.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Aside from the fact you just denied the same, just a few posts ago.... “kicker started it”... mature, not.
> 
> Ironic that it was a Dad that asked you to behave and follow the rules of the forum.  Your response was predictably juvenile.
> 
> Responsibility, like ‘adulting’ may be out of your grasp at present.


I’ll adult when magats adult. So probably never. Or maybe on inauguration day I will turn a new leaf and wait for the first trumpanzee to start making up s**t about Newsom, or making derogatory comments about race or sexual orientation. Or do you think we can safely dispense with formalities given the inevitability of their behavior?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Magat desperation is palpable. So much losing. Bigly.
> 
> Lost the election. Lost congress. Lost everything they want in CA. Lost more than 60 lawsuits. Lost their coup. Lost their claim the election was stolen.  What a sorry bunch of sad sacks. Just like their sad loser leader who can’t even muster the “courage” to show up to the inauguration. So pathetic. And starting tomorrow they will be forced to endure complete sentences.


In the meantime - 









						States ordered nursing homes to take COVID-19 residents. Thousands died. How it happened
					

Coronavirus has spread like wildfire through many nursing homes across the Northeast, and state officials are scrambling to better protect those most




					www.buckscountycouriertimes.com


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> I’ll adult when magats adult. So probably never. Or maybe on inauguration day I will turn a new leaf and wait for the first trumpanzee to start making up s**t about Newsom, or making derogatory comments about race or sexual orientation. Or do you think we can safely dispense with formalities given the inevitability of their behavior?


It’s off topic... you can be a juvenile fool all the time here.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> I’ll adult when magats adult. So probably never. Or maybe on inauguration day I will turn a new leaf and wait for the first trumpanzee to start making up s**t about Newsom, or making derogatory comments about race or sexual orientation. Or do you think we can safely dispense with formalities given the inevitability of their behavior?


You are quite the comedian.  You don't have the capacity to adult. But it will be fun to see you try.  I don't even think you can have an adult futbol conversation.   But anyway, I yield the floor... Enjoy the rest of your evening


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> I’ll adult when magats adult. So probably never. Or maybe on inauguration day I will turn a new leaf and wait for the first trumpanzee to start making up s**t about Newsom, or making derogatory comments about race or sexual orientation. Or do you think we can safely dispense with formalities given the inevitability of their behavior?


Reductio ad absurdum is beyond you.  You’re just proving in your own words that you won’t or can’t ‘adult’.  Yes, by extension that means there are magats and racists out there along with bigots like you that won’t change.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> As to the first sentence, you did when you said socialization was to blame.
> 
> As to the second, it shows your "i" bias thinking that socialization is completely unnecessary.  For a high e it's actually very essential and remote doesn't really cut it.
> 
> As to the third, that's been the issue all along....other people making the decision over what's a necessary or unnecessary factor (all along choosing to ignore those decisions when they go about their own business whether it's BLM protests, French laundry, haircuts, going to outdoor dining and then voting to ban it, or planning to go to out of state tournaments)


Who said you have to be indoors in order to socialize?   Most of us are healthy enough to survive a few minutes outside, despite the severe socal winters.

 So go outside.   Spend some time in the big room with the blue ceiling.  Take a walk and talk with friends.

You don't have to be inside with a plate of food and a drink in your hand in order to be social.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Who said you have to be indoors in order to socialize?   Most of us are healthy enough to survive a few minutes outside, despite the severe socal winters.
> 
> So go outside.   Spend some time in the big room with the blue ceiling.  Take a walk and talk with friends.
> 
> You don't have to be inside with a plate of food and a drink in your hand in order to be social.


Agree but like the indoor dining, the indoor gatherings aren’t what’s primarily driving it. If everyone were to listen to you you’d still have pretty much the same curve because: 1. Work (the worst outbreaks are in zip codes where people are working) and 2. Masks are imperfect...if your friend on the walk is sick and you two spend a significant amount of time together you might very well also get sick.  You are dealing with the margins, not controlling it.  On an individual basis per event going indoors and eating together is much more risky than an outdoor walk. On a macro basis it doesn’t make much of a difference because that chicken processor is spending overwhelmingly more time indoors working than hanging out so for him the marginal increase in risk is minuscule.

you are killing me with the n btw. How can you be mr data and still be an n?  It does explain the politics though. We’re you only borderline n?


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Agree but like the indoor dining, the indoor gatherings aren’t what’s primarily driving it. If everyone were to listen to you you’d still have pretty much the same curve because: 1. Work (the worst outbreaks are in zip codes where people are working) and 2. Masks are imperfect...if your friend on the walk is sick and you two spend a significant amount of time together you might very well also get sick.  You are dealing with the margins, not controlling it.  On an individual basis per event going indoors and eating together is much more risky than an outdoor walk. On a macro basis it doesn’t make much of a difference because that chicken processor is spending overwhelmingly more time indoors working than hanging out so for him the marginal increase in risk is minuscule.
> 
> you are killing me with the n btw. How can you be mr data and still be an n?  It does explain the politics though. We’re you only borderline n?


You'll understand me best as a center right math geek.   

Work is no more the single cause than anything else.   You would never have had a Thanksgiving spike if it were all about work.  You would have seen a nationwide dip in cases as workplaces shut down for a couple days.  The non-work factors are also major.

And you have the macro things flipped.  A 5% drop in single event individual transmission risk is small.  A 5% drop in transmissibility is huge.

Not sure how to explain it.   It's a question of difference equations and differential equations, not "shape of the curve" analysis.  You can't get there with precalc. You need the heavy machinery.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> You'll understand me best as a center right math geek.
> 
> Work is no more the single cause than anything else.   You would never have had a Thanksgiving spike if it were all about work.  You would have seen a nationwide dip in cases as workplaces shut down for a couple days.  The non-work factors are also major.
> 
> And you have the macro things flipped.  A 5% drop in single event individual transmission risk is small.  A 5% drop in transmissibility is huge.


you are not factoring in time. Let’s set the base line for the chicken processor for 1 hour as our unit of measure (it should probably be 15-20 minutes since that seems to be the time period over which masks break down and viral loads get sufficiently high, but let’s keep it simple). So at work the chicken processor over the course of a week is taking 8 risks per day in a high risk setting over the course of 5-6 days. So 40 rolls of the dice (and really you have to then factor in the number of people he is also interacting with over the course of that time). But if he goes to visit his buddy he is only taking 1 roll of the dice. Given the chances of exposure his work over time is significantly (by multiple factors) more risky than an indoor one off meeting with his buddy.

The n though is still blowing my mind.  If you were a high data guy the n shouldn’t be possible.  It would tend to indicate you think you are data guy but are really an intuitive guy and that’s affecting therefore how you are interpreting the data...it would explain a lot (when coupled with the j) of why you lean so heavily into data (and so often get it so smack right) but then the interpretation tends to skew. The theory is also elegant because it explains the politics (and that you think you  are center right but very clearly arent)


----------



## N00B

Grace T. said:


> you are killing me with the n btw. How can you be mr data and still be an n?  It does explain the politics though. We’re you only borderline n?


ENTP here to add some flavor. 

N and data driven are not incongruent.  Scientists need to assert the right hypnosis and use the right data sets to evaluate their hypothesis.  Solving equations is a form of logical proof, the thought process to approach an equation with a novel strategy requires intuition.  Picking the right data set or conditions/variables to explore a hypothesis, also intuitive in nature.  

Maybe Elementary Math Teacher is your frame of reference?  At higher levels, perhaps excepting statistics, things get a bit more abstract or theoretical where N is not a limiting factor, but a benefit.


----------



## N00B

N00B said:


> ENTP here to add some flavor.
> 
> N and data driven are not incongruent.  Scientists need to assert the right hypnosis and use the right data sets to evaluate their hypothesis.  Solving equations is a form of logical proof, the thought process to approach an equation with a novel strategy requires intuition.  Picking the right data set or conditions/variables to explore a hypothesis, also intuitive in nature.
> 
> Maybe Elementary Math Teacher is your frame of reference?  At higher levels, perhaps excepting statistics, things get a bit more abstract or theoretical where N is not a limiting factor, but a benefit.


I’d also say that for any application of Myers-Briggs personality types, you need to consider both natural and adaptive scoring.  Ie. One may answer questions differently when envisioning themselves in a neutral vs work environment.


----------



## espola

N00B said:


> I’d also say that for any application of Myers-Briggs personality types, you need to consider both natural and adaptive scoring.  Ie. One may answer questions differently when envisioning themselves in a neutral vs work environment.


Or if one recognizes the objective of the test.


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> You may literally be the *dumbest person alive* not named @crush or grace karen. Do you have another fake example how Gavin is only in it for himself, or are you finally beginning to realize that the Qanon whackadoos who feed you these conspiracy theories are full of s**t?


*I might be dum dum and still alive, but no one can say I dont love my dd.  I had to protect her from few naughty men who lied **every time** they spoke and were treating woman and girls like shit!!!*


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Lavey29 said:


> Are you ok with a grown man dressed as a woman using the same restroom with your daughter inside?  That's the policy change on day 1 according to Bidens cabinet secretary there. Trump made it illegal.


Gen X and older might have a problem with bathroom sharing.  Younger generations are more open to these changes going on.   My neighbors have 3 kids in their 20’s.  Husband and wife are pro trump.  Kids are completely against that.   Bottom line who cares what she/he looks like.  I just want someone that can communicate without insulting the reporters all the time.  I couldn’t stand watching the young lady with an attitude.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

With news that the new strain is more contagious to kids and the vaccine is not as effective, we are screwed!!!   We are far away from herd  immunity but then again some counties have a population of 1 of every 7 (8) with the virus.   Time to open up in March and let’s just move forward regardless of what happens.  Covid spikes will be here again in October (just like the flu but much stronger).


----------



## crush

SoccerFan4Life said:


> With news that the new strain is more contagious to kids and the vaccine is not as effective, we are screwed!!!   We are far away from herd  immunity but then again some counties have a population of 1 of every 7 (8) with the virus.   Time to open up in March and let’s just move forward regardless of what happens.  Covid spikes will be here again in October (just like the flu but much stronger).


We would have been controlled and abused for much longer, but that is not going to happen.  In fact, the demons WHO were doing all the controlling will be no more soon.  Dont fear, God is here


----------



## Grace T.

N00B said:


> ENTP here to add some flavor.
> 
> N and data driven are not incongruent.  Scientists need to assert the right hypnosis and use the right data sets to evaluate their hypothesis.  Solving equations is a form of logical proof, the thought process to approach an equation with a novel strategy requires intuition.  Picking the right data set or conditions/variables to explore a hypothesis, also intuitive in nature.
> 
> Maybe Elementary Math Teacher is your frame of reference?  At higher levels, perhaps excepting statistics, things get a bit more abstract or theoretical where N is not a limiting factor, but a benefit.


first, let me give you our secret handshake

oh I have no doubt an n can be a great scientist or mathematician. As an off the scale n myself I think it might actually be an advantage in pursuing some problems. However when making the decisions they tend to trust their guts rather than the observable data. They aren’t afraid the question things even when the data set seems absolutely correct. It’s why for example when everyone in January was saying oh things will be fine I went against the cw and started to sound alarms, or when the models came out and said shut it down I started to question it. But they aren’t “trust the data” or “trust the science” people. They, like we entp, have a big flaw in sometimes selecting data to try and win debates and warp it to our preferred realities. Sound like anyone we know?


----------



## Grace T.

SoccerFan4Life said:


> With news that the new strain is more contagious to kids and the vaccine is not as effective, we are screwed!!!   We are far away from herd  immunity but then again some counties have a population of 1 of every 7 (8) with the virus.   Time to open up in March and let’s just move forward regardless of what happens.  Covid spikes will be here again in October (just like the flu but much stronger).


I think this could very well be correct. My ped aap friend gave a talk yesterday. Time table for kids vaccines is 16+ not until summer and depends on when jj and az vaccines approved   12-16 not until summer to mid fall. Under 12 not until winter (testing for this set Has been very limited and they are being careful before injecting say babies). The eu authorization like continues for a year which means the “experimental” label won’t be removed for a year to two years which means (unless Congress changes the law and immunity shields and picks a huge fight which likely ends in physical violence) no mass mandate til then. Jobs might incentivize you to get it (you don’t have to take it but you can only come back if vaccinated).  Schools might do the same but it will result in lawsuits due to the huge data set surrounding unequal education received by remote students. Ticket providers theme parks and airlines might require it. But that’s as far as they can really go until the label is changed.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> you are not factoring in time. Let’s set the base line for the chicken processor for 1 hour as our unit of measure (it should probably be 15-20 minutes since that seems to be the time period over which masks break down and viral loads get sufficiently high, but let’s keep it simple). So at work the chicken processor over the course of a week is taking 8 risks per day in a high risk setting over the course of 5-6 days. So 40 rolls of the dice (and really you have to then factor in the number of people he is also interacting with over the course of that time). But if he goes to visit his buddy he is only taking 1 roll of the dice. Given the chances of exposure his work over time is significantly (by multiple factors) more risky than an indoor one off meeting with his buddy.
> 
> The n though is still blowing my mind.  If you were a high data guy the n shouldn’t be possible.  It would tend to indicate you think you are data guy but are really an intuitive guy and that’s affecting therefore how you are interpreting the data...it would explain a lot (when coupled with the j) of why you lean so heavily into data (and so often get it so smack right) but then the interpretation tends to skew. The theory is also elegant because it explains the politics (and that you think you  are center right but very clearly arent)


1- Your 40 rolls of the dice are not independent events.  A better analogy would be, you grab a new set of _loaded_ dice each month, then roll them 160 times.

2- the guy can still have the beer with his buddy.  He just should do so outside, and put his mask back on when he’s done drinking it.

3- You’re still having trouble understanding compound growth.  You want to understand this as “how do I protect myself in a world where the risk is fixed.”.  The society is protected, or not, based on “how do we limit covid risk over the next N viral host generations.”

Out of your league.  

As am I.  I have the DEQ modelling but my stats are too weak.  But at least I’m not standing on pre-calc and making declarations about differential equations modeling systems.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I’ll adult when magats adult. So probably never. Or maybe on inauguration day I will turn a new leaf and wait for the first trumpanzee to start making up s**t about Newsom, or making derogatory comments about race or sexual orientation. Or do you think we can safely dispense with formalities given the inevitability of their behavior?


Who needs to make anything up about dirtbag Newsom?  He and his drunken, babbling aunt write everything for us.


----------



## Lavey29

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Gen X and older might have a problem with bathroom sharing.  Younger generations are more open to these changes going on.   My neighbors have 3 kids in their 20’s.  Husband and wife are pro trump.  Kids are completely against that.   Bottom line who cares what she/he looks like.  I just want someone that can communicate without insulting the reporters all the time.  I couldn’t stand watching the young lady with an attitude.


That's fine for your opinion.  I dont want a grown man dresses as a woman in the bathroom with my 11 year old, sorry, call me old fashioned but no way. How you choose to live your life is your business and I'm fine with that but dont impact your lifestyle on me or my family.  That will lead to a problem for sure.


----------



## Lavey29

Scott m Shurson said:


> Who needs to make anything up about dirtbag Newsom?  He and his drunken, babbling aunt write everything for us.


Hes doing the same thing he did to San Francisco to California.  Making them both S holes now.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Who needs to make anything up about dirtbag Newsom?  He and his drunken, babbling aunt write everything for us.


Happy Inauguration Day!  We have a president who can speak in complete sentences and a governor committed to saving lives.


----------



## MacDre

Lavey29 said:


> That's fine for your opinion.  I dont want a grown man dresses as a woman in the bathroom with my 11 year old, sorry, call me old fashioned but no way. How you choose to live your life is your business and I'm fine with that but dont impact your lifestyle on me or my family.  That will lead to a problem for sure.


How would you feel if your 11 year old girl wants to be a man and dress like a man when she grows up but is scared to tell you because you’re “old fashioned?”


----------



## NorCalDad

MacDre said:


> How would you feel if your 11 year old girl wants to be a man and dress like a man when she grows up but is scared to tell you because you’re “old fashioned?”


Ignore this asshat.  This is the same dude that on another thread wanted to meet someone else on the board to presumably go fisticuffs.  He has a brain the size of a walnut.  The definition of meathead.


----------



## MacDre

EOTL said:


> Happy Inauguration Day!  We have a president who can speak in complete sentences and a governor committed to saving lives.


Glad to see him go.  I’m happy he pardoned my clients before he left office though.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> I have the DEQ modelling but my stats are too weak.  But at least I’m not standing on pre-calc and making declarations about differential equations modeling systems.


I like the loaded dice analogy

You questioned why it’s important. Here’s why it is. For me, the math is almost an irrelevancy. I’m not making declarations about modeling systems. I’m saying they are practically worthless and pointing out why the models are broken and why they are incongruous to what’s actually happening in the world. It’s why you and others here from time to time may accuse me of cherry picking sources or data.

the n is important because you are doing something similar (except you think you aren’t). You aren’t a “trust the data” or “trust the science” guy. You are bending the data to suit your own narrative. You are hunting for explanations to suit your narrative (which has always been there has to be a way we can control this thing because you seem to have a need to believe it can be controlled). The funny mechanism at work here is the j...when pushed into a corner you have a tendency to want to fall back on the operating mechanism for reassurance: “I’m a math guy...I can do DEQ modeling...look at me”. it would indicate at various times in your career you have made what was ultimately proven to be a wrong decision, but you justified based on following the data when in truth you were following your intuition, but have for whatever reason become sensitive to that effect.

here’s why else it matters and why I’ve just blown my own mind.  I’d speculate many people who enter public health are n’s as well but would psychologically want to classify themselves as being data driven. Why?  Because they were attracted to the feature of being presented a problem that can be analyzed but not necessarily solved (as opposed to a rocket ship that if the fuel equations aren’t perfect it go boom). Add to that a healthy j (fauci is all about the j) and we get why they’ve behaved as they’ve behaved to the bafflement of many of the rest of us...whether true data people or true intuitives.     In any case it explains a lot so much thanks for that insight....useful.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> That's fine for your opinion.  I dont want a grown man dresses as a woman in the bathroom with my 11 year old, sorry, call me old fashioned but no way. How you choose to live your life is your business and I'm fine with that but dont impact your lifestyle on me or my family.  That will lead to a problem for sure.


Don’t impact your homophobic lifestyle on others. Only use single stall bathrooms. Ha ha.

Like I said earlier, you are an embarrassment to your kid.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> I like the loaded dice analogy
> 
> You questioned why it’s important. Here’s why it is. For me, the math is almost an irrelevancy. I’m not making declarations about modeling systems. I’m saying they are practically worthless and pointing out why the models are broken and why they are incongruous to what’s actually happening in the world. It’s why you and others here from time to time may accuse me of cherry picking sources or data.
> 
> the n is important because you are doing something similar (except you think you aren’t). You aren’t a “trust the data” or “trust the science” guy. You are bending the data to suit your own narrative. You are hunting for explanations to suit your narrative (which has always been there has to be a way we can control this thing because you seem to have a need to believe it can be controlled). The funny mechanism at work here is the j...when pushed into a corner you have a tendency to want to fall back on the operating mechanism for reassurance: “I’m a math guy...I can do DEQ modeling...look at me”. it would indicate at various times in your career you have made what was ultimately proven to be a wrong decision, but you justified based on following the data when in truth you were following your intuition, but have for whatever reason become sensitive to that effect.
> 
> here’s why else it matters and why I’ve just blown my own mind.  I’d speculate many people who enter public health are n’s as well but would psychologically want to classify themselves as being data driven. Why?  Because they were attracted to the feature of being presented a problem that can be analyzed but not necessarily solved (as opposed to a rocket ship that if the fuel equations aren’t perfect it go boom). Add to that a healthy j (fauci is all about the j) and we get why they’ve behaved as they’ve behaved to the bafflement of many of the rest of us...whether true data people or true intuitives.     In any case it explains a lot so much thanks for that insight....useful.


Figuring out why rocket ships go boom is actually a classic data driven intuitive skill.  Tons of statistics to analyze the failure rate of each part.  And intuition to have a sense for which types of failure would cause which types of boom.

The intuitive part of math just doesn’t show up until mid college.  (except for AHSME/AIME/AMO or proof based geometry, if you took those in HS)


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Magat desperation is palpable. So much losing. Bigly.
> 
> Lost the election. Lost congress. Lost everything they want in CA. Lost more than 60 lawsuits. Lost their coup. Lost their claim the election was stolen.  What a sorry bunch of sad sacks. Just like their sad loser leader who can’t even muster the “courage” to show up to the inauguration. So pathetic. And starting tomorrow they will be forced to endure complete sentences.


OMG....go away!  We are trying to get our kids back to playing the sport they love and you constantly show your Trump Derangement Syndrome.  What are you going to do tomorrow?  You really need a hobby!


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> The intuitive part of math just doesn’t show up until mid college.  (except for AHSME/AIME/AMO or proof based geometry, if you took those in HS)


Wow that explains why I loved geometry when I couldn’t stand the rest of math and why geometry was the sorting ground for a lot of kids being ejected from the honors track when we hit that (though they had hung along all through elementary school). Mind blown again

So if you don’t get to the intuitive part until mid college, how’d you survive until then?  You’d have thought you’d be miserable with a math focus?  Or is it that you are only borderline n (I for example am borderline e and struggle to comprehend my kid or the burden lockdowns place on him, who is an off the scale e...he’s had a children’s book published due out in February which was his attempt to explain it to me and teachers...I have to say as a low e I don’t fully get it still)?


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> Who said you have to be indoors in order to socialize?   Most of us are healthy enough to survive a few minutes outside, despite the severe socal winters.
> 
> So go outside.   Spend some time in the big room with the blue ceiling.  Take a walk and talk with friends.
> 
> You don't have to be inside with a plate of food and a drink in your hand in order to be social.


Anecdotally from my experience, the vast majority of cases are coming from indoor socialization.  From my observations I don't see anything that indicates that outdoor socialization is of any material risk.

IMO if you socialize outdoors, keep your distance at Vons and the Home Depot, and enjoy some outdoor dining you're at very little risk for Covid while maintaining your mental health.  Only considering your Covid health is not healthy.


----------



## soccersc

Good news.  Social Distancing is no longer necessary!! But of course youth rallies about kids playing sports can be very dangerous, so don't do that!!
So does this mean if we wear mask groups of people together don't matter? Wonder if it will be alright to watch a sports event in California now? Of course we'll all be wearing mask so it should be okay? Finally!! Thanks Joe


----------



## NorCalDad

soccersc said:


> Good news.  Social Distancing is no longer necessary!! But of course youth rallies about kids playing sports can be very dangerous, so don't do that!!
> So does this mean if we wear mask groups of people together don't matter? Wonder if it will be alright to watch a sports event in California now? Of course we'll all be wearing mask so it should be okay? Finally!! Thanks Joe
> View attachment 9970


sigh....

You don't think they had a level above of NBA-style testing? 

Optics aren't great....but doesn't mean logic goes out the window.


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> Happy Inauguration Day!  We have a president who can speak in complete sentences and a governor committed to saving lives.


Yes, Happy Inauguration Day.  I wish Biden the best but I'm a skeptical (just as I was with Trump).  As far as the your second sentence goes that's 100% false, no matter how many times you repeat it, but I suspect you already know this.


----------



## soccersc

NorCalDad said:


> sigh....
> 
> You don't think they had a level above of NBA-style testing?
> 
> Optics aren't great....but doesn't mean logic goes out the window.


I agree, logic still should prevail...in my opinion it just doesn't look good, especially for those saying how bad it was to have a youth rally...but how hard would it have been to try and keep the distance...it just makes it look like "we can do what we want, but you have to do this" kind of mentality


----------



## NorCalDad

soccersc said:


> I agree, logic still should prevail...in my opinion it just doesn't look good, especially for those saying how bad it was to have a youth rally...but how hard would it have been to try and keep the distance...it just makes it look like "we can do what we want, but you have to do this" kind of mentality


For what it's worth...Bernie has kept his distance


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Happy Inauguration Day!  We have a president who can speak in complete sentences and a governor committed to saving lives.


LMAO!  Complete sentences?  Aren’t we still blaming all the stammering and babbling on his childhood stutter?

I would hope he can read a speech.  He’s had 50-years of practice.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> How would you feel if your 11 year old girl wants to be a man and dress like a man when she grows up but is scared to tell you because you’re “old fashioned?”


Can I still laugh at it like I do now?


----------



## EOTL

TOSDCI said:


> OMG....go away!  We are trying to get our kids back to playing the sport they love and you constantly show your Trump Derangement Syndrome.  What are you going to do tomorrow?  You really need a hobby!


Great. Wear a mask and social distance until people stop dying at the highest rate at any time during the pandemic.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

NorCalDad said:


> sigh....
> 
> You don't think they had a level above of NBA-style testing?
> 
> Optics aren't great....but doesn't mean logic goes out the window.


Maybe play soccer games at strip clubs.  Those are NBA endorsed venues.


----------



## Lavey29

MacDre said:


> How would you feel if your 11 year old girl wants to be a man and dress like a man when she grows up but is scared to tell you because you’re “old fashioned?”


How would you feel if the hardcore pedofile on your block decided to put on a blonde wig and lipstick and hang out in the girls bathroom at the park where your daughter plays?

My kids are brought up with morals and values and religion.  How they choose to live their adult lives as they get older is their choice and as I stated, I dont care how people choose their lifestyle,  straight, gay, trans, etc... but dont force it upon me or my family.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Great. Wear a mask and social distance until people stop dying at the highest rate at any time during the pandemic.


did you see the pic...no need to social distance anymore...Joe said it is okay


----------



## Lavey29

soccersc said:


> Good news.  Social Distancing is no longer necessary!! But of course youth rallies about kids playing sports can be very dangerous, so don't do that!!
> So does this mean if we wear mask groups of people together don't matter? Wonder if it will be alright to watch a sports event in California now? Of course we'll all be wearing mask so it should be okay? Finally!! Thanks Joe
> View attachment 9970


Lol, 47 people there and 25k troops guarding them...


----------



## Scott m Shurson

NorCalDad said:


> For what it's worth...Bernie has kept his distance


For what it’s worth, Bernie took his payoff from the DNC, like Buttigieg, Warren and Klobuchar, and is enjoying retirement so the babbler could be propped up.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> Don’t impact your homophobic lifestyle on others. Only use single stall bathrooms. Ha ha.
> 
> Like I said earlier, you are an embarrassment to your kid.


I hope I get the satisfaction of crossing paths with you someday Ewok. I have a cure for your big mouth syndrome.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> How would you feel if the hardcore pedofile on your block decided to put on a blonde wig and lipstick and hang out in the girls bathroom at the park where your daughter plays?
> 
> My kids are brought up with morals and values and religion.  How they choose to live their adult lives as they get older is their choice and as I stated, I dont care how people choose their lifestyle,  straight, gay, trans, etc... but dont force it upon me or my family.


If that is how you think kids get molested, you’re going to miss it happening right in front of you.  Clearly we need a law banning churches where it actually happens. If it weren’t so awful, it would be funny that the pastor sends everyone with pitchforks over to the park restroom and, in the meantime, induces their daughters into the backroom with a lollipop and the word of god. What a joke.


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> I hope I get the satisfaction of crossing paths with you someday Ewok. I have a cure for your big mouth syndrome.


A threat of violence from someone terrified of someone who wears a wig and lipstick. I’m sure your kid is very proud of you mister manly magat.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Great. Wear a mask and social distance until people stop dying at the highest rate at any time during the pandemic.


Come on buddy...I know you've got to have a great reason why it is okay for them not to social distance???


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> If that is how you think kids get molested, you’re going to miss it happening right in front of you.  Clearly we need a law banning churches where it actually happens. If it weren’t so awful, it would be funny that the pastor sends everyone with pitchforks over to the park restroom and, in the meantime, induces their daughters into the backroom with a lollipop and the word of god. What a joke.


Does it look like this hideous thing?

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjm0d7FhavuAhXxHjQIHV7gAiIQxfQBCBAwAQ&url=https://womensagenda.com.au/latest/joe-biden-appoints-transgender-woman-dr-rachel-levine-as-assistant-health-secretary/&usg=AOvVaw1AHvgrbYptUTF0xOxWlEX2


----------



## Desert Hound

soccersc said:


> Come on buddy...I know you've got to have a great reason why it is okay for them not to social distance???


And they are just getting warmed up for the after event parties. 

Rules are for the rubes, our "leaders" do not need to follow them.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> A threat of violence from someone terrified of someone who wears a wig and lipstick. I’m sure your kid is very proud of you mister manly magat.


Such a big tough guy in his basement on his keyboard waiting for mommy to bring him lunch.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Great. Wear a mask and social distance until people stop dying at the highest rate at any time during the pandemic.


Then why wasn’t the cross section of “most vulnerable”  (determined on the mortality rate by age/ethnicity) moved to the front of the vaccine line?

Hell your buddy Gavin put Inmates and Homeless above:

- Individuals 50 -64 years of age
- People 16-49 years of age who have an underlying health condition or disability which increases their risk of severe COVID-19

Go figure.


----------



## Lavey29

Scott m Shurson said:


> Does it look like this hideous thing?
> 
> https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjm0d7FhavuAhXxHjQIHV7gAiIQxfQBCBAwAQ&url=https://womensagenda.com.au/latest/joe-biden-appoints-transgender-woman-dr-rachel-levine-as-assistant-health-secretary/&usg=AOvVaw1AHvgrbYptUTF0xOxWlEX2


Key word is IT


----------



## Desert Hound

Scott m Shurson said:


> Does it look like this hideous thing?
> 
> https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjm0d7FhavuAhXxHjQIHV7gAiIQxfQBCBAwAQ&url=https://womensagenda.com.au/latest/joe-biden-appoints-transgender-woman-dr-rachel-levine-as-assistant-health-secretary/&usg=AOvVaw1AHvgrbYptUTF0xOxWlEX2


Why do we have to pretend that a guy who dresses as a woman is a woman? 

Our political correctness has gone to far. 

If someone wants to wear a dress and put on makeup have at it. Do not force me to pretend he is a she and call him a woman. 

And just because you want to pretend you are a women that doesn't give you access to womens bathrooms and locker rooms. 

Today I feel black. Do I get to apply to get loans or businesses that are directed at the minority community? Of course not. They would laugh at me and tell me to go home. Same thing when some guy wants to wear a dress and put on lipstick...I don't have to play along and neither should anyone else.


----------



## dad4

soccersc said:


> Good news.  Social Distancing is no longer necessary!! But of course youth rallies about kids playing sports can be very dangerous, so don't do that!!
> So does this mean if we wear mask groups of people together don't matter? Wonder if it will be alright to watch a sports event in California now? Of course we'll all be wearing mask so it should be okay? Finally!! Thanks Joe
> View attachment 9970


If you look closely, that is a photo of people 6 feet apart, taken with a telephoto lens.  The lens compresses the image.

The only people who are somewhat close to each other are the ones immediately behind the podium.   Reasonable bet they were all tested yesterday.  And it's outside.  And they have masks on.

I know you'd like some rose garden event scale hypocrisy.  This isnt it.


----------



## Desert Hound

Kicker4Life said:


> Then why wasn’t the cross section of “most vulnerable”  (determined on the mortality rate by age/ethnicity) moved to the front of the vaccine line?
> 
> Hell your buddy Gavin put Inmates and Homeless above:
> 
> - Individuals 50 -64 years of age
> - People 16-49 years of age who have an underlying health condition or disability which increases their risk of severe COVID-19
> 
> Go figure.


And that is what happens when politicians pander and do politics instead of doing the logical thing...ie putting the most vulnerable to the front of the line.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> If you look closely, that is a photo of people 6 feet apart, taken with a telephoto lens. The lens compresses the image.


Stop making excuses.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Great. Wear a mask and social distance until people stop dying at the highest rate at any time during the pandemic.





soccersc said:


> Come on buddy...I know you've got to have a great reason why it is okay for them not to social distance???


This article hit the nail right on the head...Biden wanting U.S. to be like California...he's already telling people to social distance but it's okay if he doesn't...kind of sounds like someone we know?  @EOTL how is this okay? Come on...I've got to know 








						Make America California Again? That's Biden's plan
					

President Trump tried to marginalize California. He failed. Now, with Joe Biden and Democrats taking power, no state is more influential in setting a policy agenda.




					www.latimes.com


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> If you look closely, that is a photo of people 6 feet apart, taken with a telephoto lens.  The lens compresses the image.
> 
> The only people who are somewhat close to each other are the ones immediately behind the podium.   Reasonable bet they were all tested yesterday.  And it's outside.  And they have masks on.
> 
> I know you'd like some rose garden event scale hypocrisy.  This isnt it.


They were all also required to get Covid tested.

Facts don’t matter to magats. They’re just looking for excuses to engage in their own abysmal behavior.

As if their kiddie soccer game is as important as the the inauguration. I’m sure they think it is, because they’re whiny sore losers about the election.


----------



## soccersc

dad4 said:


> If you look closely, that is a photo of people 6 feet apart, taken with a telephoto lens.  The lens compresses the image.
> 
> The only people who are somewhat close to each other are the ones immediately behind the podium.   Reasonable bet they were all tested yesterday.  And it's outside.  And they have masks on.
> 
> I know you'd like some rose garden event scale hypocrisy.  This isnt it.


Hahaha...what...that's what you're going with? a telephoto lens? did you not watch? there was singing, music, hugging, and those around the podium where in chairs next to each other...click on the pic or go back and watch on you tube...you are funny


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> This article hit the nail right on the head...Biden wanting U.S. to be like California...he's already telling people to social distance but it's okay if he doesn't...kind of sounds like someone we know?  @EOTL how is this okay? Come on...I've got to know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Make America California Again? That's Biden's plan
> 
> 
> President Trump tried to marginalize California. He failed. Now, with Joe Biden and Democrats taking power, no state is more influential in setting a policy agenda.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com


Can’t wait for the federal government to start doing things right. It is a very nice article.

The most interesting thing about the magats losing their minds on inauguration day is last week they were demanding that democrats try to “unify”.  No. Magats know nothing but hate and selfishness and have no desire for unity. So they get the horns.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> They were all also required to get Covid tested.
> 
> Facts don’t matter to magats. They’re just looking for excuses to engage in their own abysmal behavior.
> 
> As if their kiddie soccer game is as important as the the inauguration. I’m sure they think it is, because they’re whiny sore losers about the election.


That what pretty weak.   I was expecting more from you...was it a rapid test taken just before the entered? was the test yesterday?  and did the 100 or so around the podium all isolate themselves before they arrived?  I never said anything about a soccer game? Funny, how difficult it is for you just to admit fault...weak minded individual are unable to see their own shortcomings. They should have been distanced, don't make excuses for them, they are the example


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> If you look closely, that is a photo of people 6 feet apart, taken with a telephoto lens.  The lens compresses the image.
> 
> The only people who are somewhat close to each other are the ones immediately behind the podium.   Reasonable bet they were all tested yesterday.  And it's outside.  And they have masks on.
> 
> I know you'd like some rose garden event scale hypocrisy.  This isnt it.


Yes, if you look closely, the telephoto lens shows an angel on the shoulder of every libtard here, STANDING SHOULDER TO SHOULDER, just protecting them because libtards say and do all the right things.  

Libtards wanting and showing unity, because libtards want *unity* after being combative assholes for 4 years.


----------



## dad4

soccersc said:


> Hahaha...what...that's what you're going with? a telephoto lens? did you not watch? there was singing, music, hugging, and those around the podium where in chairs next to each other...click on the pic or go back and watch on you tube...you are funny


Nope.  Didn't watch.

Don't really care, either.  It is outdoors and masked.  Not a big deal.

I care more about the selection of someone involved with returning covid patients to nursing homes.  That is important.  A few politicians hugging at an inauguration is not.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Can’t wait for the federal government to start doing things right. It is a very nice article.
> 
> The most interesting thing about the magats losing their minds on inauguration day is last week they were demanding that democrats try to “unify”.  No. Magats know nothing but hate and selfishness and have no desire for unity. So they get the horns.


There will be no unity.  Why would there be?  All you libtards have done is reject cooperation and unity since 2016.  Why the fuck would you think you deserve it now?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> They were all also required to get Covid tested.
> 
> Facts don’t matter to magats. They’re just looking for excuses to engage in their own abysmal behavior.
> 
> As if their kiddie soccer game is as important as the the inauguration. I’m sure they think it is, because they’re whiny sore losers about the election.


Nice that the whore, her racist, sexually assaulting boss and their friends can get tested easily for their stroke show and millions of Americans can’t.  Well, unless you’re a criminal.  Then libtards make sure you’re tested.


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> There will be no unity.  Why would there be?  All you libtards have done is reject cooperation and unity since 2016.  Why the fuck would you think you deserve it now?


Why unity?

Because, if you double down on Trumpism, you'll give the suburban vote to the Dems permanently, instead of just once.

That is probably just fine with Bernie and AOC.  It means they can push harder on progressive issues without losing the house.

Why is it just fine with you?


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Nope.  Didn't watch.
> 
> Don't really care, either.  It is outdoors and masked.  Not a big deal.
> 
> I care more about the selection of someone involved with returning covid patients to nursing homes.  That is important.  A few politicians hugging at an inauguration is not.


I assume though you do have an issue with the inauguration parties.....they are VASTLY scaled down but still happening, some indoors.









						Inauguration parties lose the glitz and glamour in 2021
					

Facing a pandemic and the threat of violence, the glitz and glam-filled party scene in Washington that typically surrounds the presidential inauguration is poised to be as quiet as a statue tucked …




					thehill.com


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> I assume though you do have an issue with the inauguration parties.....they are VASTLY scaled down but still happening, some indoors.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Inauguration parties lose the glitz and glamour in 2021
> 
> 
> Facing a pandemic and the threat of violence, the glitz and glam-filled party scene in Washington that typically surrounds the presidential inauguration is poised to be as quiet as a statue tucked …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com


They are unnecessary.  Celebrate Biden's victory at home, Grace.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> That what pretty weak.   I was expecting more from you...was it a rapid test taken just before the entered? was the test yesterday?  and did the 100 or so around the podium all isolate themselves before they arrived?  I never said anything about a soccer game? Funny, how difficult it is for you just to admit fault...weak minded individual are unable to see their own shortcomings. They should have been distanced, don't make excuses for them, they are the example


This is how it will be with the whiny magat loser crowd. If they can’t live vicariously through their child’s soccer, if they can’t hang out in bars and restaurants and parade around Costco without a mask, then no one else should be allowed to do anything. To them it is “hypocritical” to hold the inauguration while taking every conceivable precaution if little Sally can’t play soccer right now. But the actual hypocrisy is that they don’t actually care about covid spread at the inauguration, and actually think it’s great to hold rallies with 6,000 people not wearing masks, although it was s**t like this and other magat crap that led to all the precautions taken at the inauguration. The only hypocrites are the ones who failed to do what they should and supported the things that got us to the point that there would be no spectators, everyone would need to wear a mask and get tested, and fewer people would be allowed on stage, and who are now whining that it isn’t safe enough. 

In the end, sufficient steps were taken to limit risk at the inauguration, which is an event of great importance and justifies some risk. You, on the other hand, are a nobody who wants to do nobody things without even remotely the same precautions.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> There will be no unity.  Why would there be?  All you libtards have done is reject cooperation and unity since 2016.  Why the fuck would you think you deserve it now?


Look, we agree on something. Now is time for magats to pay.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Why unity?
> 
> Because, if you double down on Trumpism, you'll give the suburban vote to the Dems permanently, instead of just once.
> 
> That is probably just fine with Bernie and AOC.  It means they can push harder on progressive issues without losing the house.
> 
> Why is it just fine with you?


But that's the quandry of the Republican party.  If they abandon Trumpism, they'll lost that group of voters who might actually split to a new Patriot Party.  It's not enough to bring the Patriot Party to power, but it is enough to send the Republican party to perpetual minority status.  And the establishment Rs have a huge problem: that rank and file view them as crony capitalist more in Washington for their own interests, and who have forgotten what it's like to be a regular Joe.

Speaking of Joes, the Ds have their own problem.  Biden is the only one holding their party together, and whether they want to see it or not, Biden just isn't fully 100% there.  When he dies (or loses the ability completely to control things), it's going to be open warfare too between the progressive and establishment wings.  The mechanism is the same as what's happening in the R party.

The house isn't really a concern for the Rs.  It's a protest vote.  The wins will unite against the D excesses.  You already saw that by how quickly the House Rs backed away from impeachment.  The extremes, not the center, control the House.  The Senate and the Presidency are different.  The key for Rs is if they are able to find someone who is able to be what Trump promised to be but wasn't, and that person too needs to have the endorsement of Trump.  I just don't see anyone on the horizon that fits that bill.  It's not Pence (who will be the establishment go to guy but will never be forgiven by the Trumpists), it's not Jeb!. it's not Christie, it's not Haley.  Maybe DeSantis???

p.s. please tell me....how'd you get through math to the intuitive part in college if you were an n?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> Why unity?
> 
> Because, if you double down on Trumpism, you'll give the suburban vote to the Dems permanently, instead of just once.
> 
> That is probably just fine with Bernie and AOC.  It means they can push harder on progressive issues without losing the house.
> 
> Why is it just fine with you?


Why?  Because the last 4 years could have been much better had the libtards not acted jaded and vindictive with everything Trump ever said or did.  The intent is to repay the favor and be as disruptive as possible.  Starting with impeaching Biden immediately, since Pelosi showed us that’s what you do, like tearing up a presidential speech on national television, when you don’t like someone and can’t get over losing an election.  

I’m perfectly good with that.  The libtards earned it.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> This is how it will be with the whiny magat loser crowd. If they can’t live vicariously through their child’s soccer, if they can’t hang out in bars and restaurants and parade around Costco without a mask, then no one else should be allowed to do anything. To them it is “hypocritical” to hold the inauguration while taking every conceivable precaution if little Sally can’t play soccer right now. But the actual hypocrisy is that they don’t actually care about covid spread at the inauguration, and actually think it’s great to hold rallies with 6,000 people not wearing masks, although it was s**t like this and other magat crap that led to all the precautions taken at the inauguration. The only hypocrites are the ones who failed to do what they should and supported the things that got us to the point that there would be no spectators, everyone would need to wear a mask and get tested, and fewer people would be allowed on stage, and who are now whining that it isn’t safe enough.
> 
> In the end, sufficient steps were taken to limit risk at the inauguration, which is an event of great importance and justifies some risk. You, on the other hand, are a nobody who wants to do nobody things without even remotely the same precautions.


Thata boy!!! That was much better!! HAHAHA You make me laugh and I really enjoy reading your responses.  When you have no rebuttal you then begin to attack character and start name calling!!! So funny! You will continually find an excuse for anything that might remotely be in the wrong.  My guess is that you are single, my advice would be to start realizing you are not always right, or you will continue to be single for a long time...but who knows, maybe you like be alone with no kids hanging out on soccer forums telling everyone they are magots?? Whatever floats your boat buddy


----------



## Grace T.

Scott m Shurson said:


> Why?  Because the last 4 years could have been much better had the libtards not acted jaded and vindictive with everything Trump ever said or did.  The intent is to repay the favor and be as disruptive as possible.  Starting with impeaching Biden immediately, since Pelosi showed us that’s what you do, like tearing up a presidential speech on national television, when you don’t like someone and can’t get over losing an election.
> 
> I’m perfectly good with that.  The libtards earned it.


He speaks some truth.  You can virtually guarantee if Republicans take the House in 2022 Biden and/or Harris and/or both will be impeached (but not removed).  This will become true virtually anytime the House is controlled by an opposite party since every President since Nixon has f'ed up something along the way and been involved in scandal....there's not one that's made it through 4 years Scott Free (hah!).  The R voters will be looking for revenge and won't tolerate gentlemen like Jeb! who don't know how to fight.

Even if you don't buy that the election was stolen, there's plenty in the R perception that it wasn't "fair": biased media, biased pollsters, tech company censorship, suppression of the Hunter story, mass mail in voting (sometimes without signature verification, done hastily citing COVID), the Russian conspiracy, the first impeachment, Nancy withholding aid for political purposes, the lockdowns.  Then there's the D overreach: the 2nd impeachment, Twitter censorship, calls for reconcilation committees, the villification of Trump voters, moves to ban books.  The R's won't be looking for a unifier...they will be looking for someone to burn it down (Pence ain't it).  The Rs will be looking for an Anthony to replace Caesar.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> Nice that the whore, her racist, sexually assaulting boss and their friends can get tested easily for their stroke show and millions of Americans can’t.  Well, unless you’re a criminal.  Then libtards make sure you’re tested.


You forgot vaccinated because all the “libtards” referenced above ARE vaccinated too.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> Look, we agree on something. Now is time for magats to pay.


What a moron. Man, I'd wish you go lurk a kids basketball forum instead of kids soccer. It's all the same to a pedofile like you right?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Thata boy!!! That was much better!! HAHAHA You make me laugh and I really enjoy reading your responses.  When you have no rebuttal you then begin to attack character and start name calling!!! So funny! You will continually find an excuse for anything that might remotely be in the wrong.  My guess is that you are single, my advice would be to start realizing you are not always right, or you will continue to be single for a long time...but who knows, maybe you like be alone with no kids hanging out on soccer forums telling everyone they are magots?? Whatever floats your boat buddy


I know it hurts that there is not a single person in elected office for whom you voted and that, no matter how much you whine, the vast majority of voters in both CA and the US share my sentiments, while you share yours with a guy who is terrified of people who wear dresses and lipstick.

Has Gavin “passed” any laws 100-0 lately that personally benefit him?


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> ...
> 
> p.s. please tell me....how'd you get through math to the intuitive part in college if you were an n?


Math was never hard.  It was where I did my other homework.

Also, if your math sense is good enough, your brain makes jumps for you.  Most students are plugging in x=18 to check it.  A mathy kid takes one look at the equation and says "x can't be even."


----------



## EOTL

MacDre said:


> You forgot vaccinated because all the “libtards” referenced above ARE vaccinated too.


You raise a very good point. But, like I said earlier, facts don’t mean anything to magats. Next, they’ll be whining that their little Sally hasn’t been vaccinated, and that’s Biden’s fault because he’s been president for like almost an hour.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> You raise a very good point. But, like I said earlier, facts don’t mean anything to magats. Next, they’ll be whining that their little Sally hasn’t been vaccinated, and that’s Biden’s fault because he’s been president for like almost an hour.


No, it’s Gavin’s fault, because he’s incompetent and California is throwing vaccine away because of it.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Math was never hard.  It was where I did my other homework.
> 
> Also, if your math sense is good enough, your brain makes jumps for you.  Most students are plugging in x=18 to check it.  A mathy kid takes one look at the equation and says "x can't be even."


The question isn't whether it was hard.  The question is whether it was interesting.  

Math was never hard for me either.  I kept getting pushed into math bowls because the school wanted the trophy but I wasn't interested.  I got an A in Hon Algebra II even though it was after lunch and kept falling asleep in class and never studied.  The other honors kids hated I wasn't into it.  Senior year a bunch of them went off to Pierce College to do whatever was after BC Calc but I wasn't interested (it was the last semester of senior year and sitting in a community college math class was neither my idea of interesting or fun or mentally stimulating) and they got furious with me accosting me in the halls because they need 1 more to make it work and get permission from the admin.

But given you are an n, and were doing your homework during math, how'd you get to the point where hey this is actually kind of interesting?  Or did you go that direction because you thought it was the easiest?


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> What a moron. Man, I'd wish you go lurk a kids basketball forum instead of kids soccer. It's all the same to a pedofile like you right?


Too bad, so sad magat loser. You know I’m right about your daughter. At 11, she is starting to realize her dad is a loser, a bigot and more than a little paranoid. By 15, she will absolutely detest you if you don’t turn things around, but there’s still time. I’m only trying to help you see what you can’t buddy. I want you to have a good relationship with your child.


----------



## Yours in futbol

Grace T. said:


> He speaks some truth.  You can virtually guarantee if Republicans take the House in 2022 Biden and/or Harris and/or both will be impeached (but not removed).  This will become true virtually anytime the House is controlled by an opposite party since every President since Nixon has f'ed up something along the way and been involved in scandal....there's not one that's made it through 4 years Scott Free (hah!).  The R voters will be looking for revenge and won't tolerate gentlemen like Jeb! who don't know how to fight.
> 
> Even if you don't buy that the election was stolen, there's plenty in the R perception that it wasn't "fair": biased media, biased pollsters, tech company censorship, suppression of the Hunter story, mass mail in voting (sometimes without signature verification, done hastily citing COVID), the Russian conspiracy, the first impeachment, Nancy withholding aid for political purposes, the lockdowns.  Then there's the D overreach: the 2nd impeachment, Twitter censorship, calls for reconcilation committees, the villification of Trump voters, moves to ban books.  The R's won't be looking for a unifier...they will be looking for someone to burn it down (Pence ain't it).  The Rs will be looking for an Anthony to replace Caesar.


Yeah.  That approach didn't work so well in 2018 or 2020.  No reason to think it will work any better in 2022.

The GOP will have to evaluate why their message is losing voters, and how they can reverse the trend without trying to disenfranchise millions of Americans.  Might be a good idea for them to finally come up with a healthcare plan or immigration reform.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> Too bad, so sad magat loser. You know I’m right about your daughter. At 11, she is starting to realize her dad is a loser, a bigot and more than a little paranoid. By 15, she will absolutely detest you if you don’t turn things around, but there’s still time. I’m only trying to help you see what you can’t buddy. I want you to have a good relationship with your child.


Kiss my ass Ewok. At least I have kids, something you will never experience.  You're a sick minded individual.


----------



## Lavey29

Scott m Shurson said:


> No, it’s Gavin’s fault, because he’s incompetent and California is throwing vaccine away because of it.


Except for homeless and those in prison who are at the front of the line.  I bet newsolini got his shot too.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I know it hurts that there is not a single person in elected office for whom you voted and that, no matter how much you whine, the vast majority of voters in both CA and the US share my sentiments, while you share yours with a guy who is terrified of people who wear dresses and lipstick.
> 
> Has Gavin “passed” any laws 100-0 lately that personally benefit him?


That's the difference between me and you...I am capable of giving people opportunity.  Y


EOTL said:


> I know it hurts that there is not a single person in elected office for whom you voted and that, no matter how much you whine, the vast majority of voters in both CA and the US share my sentiments, while you share yours with a guy who is terrified of people who wear dresses and lipstick.
> 
> Has Gavin “passed” any laws 100-0 lately that personally benefit him?


Doesn't really hurt at all, but thanks for your concern. If you had someone, other than yourself, to share your life with you'd realize there are things way more important.  Do I wish the outcome were different, sure, but its over now and I can go on a live my life. Unlike you who will be at home alone, on the internet, cheering on Joe and Gavin.  You live such a lonely life I actually feel bad for you


----------



## EOTL

Lavey29 said:


> Kiss my ass Ewok. At least I have kids, something you will never experience.  You're a sick minded individual.


I’m sick minded? For pointing out your kid is 10,000x more likely to get molested at church than by a guy wearing a dress?  Because I recognize what happens when a CA child faces the realization that their dad is a bigot? Nothing I am saying is the least bit controversial.

Scared of someone wearing a dress. What a pathetic douche.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

Yours in futbol said:


> Yeah.  That approach didn't work so well in 2018 or 2020.  No reason to think it will work any better in 2022.
> 
> The GOP will have to evaluate why their message is losing voters, and how they can reverse the trend without trying to disenfranchise millions of Americans.  Might be a good idea for them to finally come up with a healthcare plan or immigration reform.


Immigration reform?  What reform?  We have a system and it doesn’t involve encouraging people to risk death coming here for the free healthcare.  This country can’t take everybody and it damn sure shouldn’t take anybody that jumps the line.  We don’t need more wall, we need a catapult.

How do you pass healthcare, or anything else for that matter, when Democrats sabetoge everything you do... including stimulus relief?  One need only turn off CNN to realize the liberals have deliberately done damage to this country just to spite Donald Trump.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> That's the difference between me and you...I am capable of giving people opportunity.  Y
> 
> 
> Doesn't really hurt at all, but thanks for your concern. If you had someone, other than yourself, to share your life with you'd realize there are things way more important.  Do I wish the outcome were different, sure, but its over now and I can go on a live my life. Unlike you who will be at home alone, on the internet, cheering on Joe and Gavin.  You live such a lonely life I actually feel bad for you


It’s been two years that Gavin the Gastronome had been in office and you obviously can’t get over that.  You’re a magat, you’re not going away. You’ll be right back here tomorrow whining about efforts to save the environment and the horror of letting brown children out of their cages at the border.


----------



## Lavey29

EOTL said:


> I’m sick minded? For pointing out your kid is 10,000x more likely to get molested at church than by a guy wearing a dress?  Because I recognize what happens when a CA child faces the realization that their dad is a bigot? Nothing I am saying is the least bit controversial.
> 
> Scared of someone wearing a dress. What a pathetic douche.


You problem is you have no children.  You never got to experience the joy of being a parent.  You despise seeing kids having fun playing the sport they love and the smiles on their faces and the proud parents cheering them on. Family joy sickens you. The jealousy and anger you feel inside about never being able to experience the joy of being a father is clearly evident in your postings here.  You are filled with hatred and think you can get your retaliation with your posts here attacking children and their parents.  Your pain will never go away and that is because you reap what you sow.


----------



## Grace T.

Yours in futbol said:


> Yeah.  That approach didn't work so well in 2018 or 2020.  No reason to think it will work any better in 2022.
> 
> The GOP will have to evaluate why their message is losing voters, and how they can reverse the trend without trying to disenfranchise millions of Americans.  Might be a good idea for them to finally come up with a healthcare plan or immigration reform.


We can do the same with the Obama midterms and 2016 to the Ds.  That's not very useful.  The pendulum always swings and Biden is starting (based on his margins in Congress, the pandemic, the economy, the political divisions in the country) in an enormously week position.  Only true believers on one side or the other believe their side will achieve ultimate victory.

The reality is we are in the middle of the shakeup of the Reagan realignment.  Both political parties are a mess.  The Ds thought they would consolidate the Obama coalition of the ascendant and the Rs would be consigned to the dust bin of history due to demographic shifts.  The issue is that only Obama was able to weld that coalition and neither Biden nor Hillary were able to recreate it.  To some extent you can still see the outlines of it: Rs were the war hawk party, but now they are back to being isolationists (much to the annoyance of the McCain and NeoCon factions of the party).  The D's immigration coalition is a marriage, for example, of the rich and upper middle class that are looking for cheap labor and recent comer Latinos looking to expand their influence and/or bring over more friends and relatives and/or empower those already here with D politicians looking for votes.  The Rs won't make any inroads by reforming immigration because for example the long term Latinos already here which Trump built into aren't looking for more competition to come over and depress their salaries.  The realignment ball is in the R court.  They'd need to find someone capable of uniting both wings of the party but doing it more competently than Trump....Trump ain't it (though if Biden goes south enough and Trump isn't barred from office he could make a short term comeback a la Grover Cleveland), Pence ain't it....don't see anyone on the horizon capable of doing it other than maybe DeSantis.  But become Ds is not a good marketing policy for the Rs and sounds like the type of nonsense Jeb! and Christie pushed.


----------



## Yours in futbol

Scott m Shurson said:


> Immigration reform?  What reform?  We have a system and it doesn’t involve encouraging people to risk death coming here for the free healthcare.  This country can’t take everybody and it damn sure shouldn’t take anybody that jumps the line.  We don’t need more wall, we need a catapult.
> 
> How do you pass healthcare, or anything else for that matter, when Democrats sabetoge everything you do... including stimulus relief?  One need only turn off CNN to realize the liberals have deliberately done damage to this country just to spite Donald Trump.


Don't take this the wrong way, but you're not the kind of voter that the GOP needs to reach.  You're part of the solid 38% that the GOP will never lose.  As we've seen over the last 4 years, that's not enough.

The GOP needs to reach the kind of voter that doesn't use the word "libtard" and doesn't blame the Democratic Party for the GOP's failure to come up with a healthcare plan while it held the presidency, house, and senate.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> It’s been two years that Gavin the Gastronome had been in office and you obviously can’t get over that.  You’re a magat, you’re not going away. You’ll be right back here tomorrow whining about efforts to save the environment and the horror of letting brown children out of their cages at the border.


Where should I go? Why do I need to leave? I think you are confused about the whining though, you seem to be the one who is whining constantly.  Then like the a child, you begin to name call when you don't get your way or someone brings up a point you disagree with.  I'm all for saving the environment and bring as many kids over here as you want, the more the merrier. I am concerned for you though because your tantrums, name calling, and lashing out are going to make it very difficult for you to ever have a significant other.  Then you will never be able to enjoy the happiness of being a parent.  I really feel bad for you.  I hope that you will continue to grow and realize your childish ways will not get you anywhere in life.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> It’s been two years that Gavin the Gastronome had been in office and you obviously can’t get over that.  You’re a magat, you’re not going away. You’ll be right back here tomorrow whining about efforts to save the environment and the horror of letting brown children out of their cages at the border.


We’ve watched the adulterer destroy 2 families and once jewel of a city in San Francisco.  Now he’s destroying California.  The worst part is you’ll support his stammering, incompetent ass for president because you think he’s sexy.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

Yours in futbol said:


> Don't take this the wrong way, but you're not the kind of voter that the GOP needs to reach.  You're part of the solid 38% that the GOP will never lose.  As we've seen over the last 4 years, that's not enough.
> 
> The GOP needs to reach the kind of voter that doesn't use the word "libtard" and doesn't blame the Democratic Party for the GOP's failure to come up with a healthcare plan while it held the presidency, house, and senate.


The GOP needs to hold the deceitful media accountable because this nation already has enough stupid people that believe saying all the right things actually means something.  It doesn’t.  It means nothing because libtards never accomplish anything.  They simply raise taxes and endear the masses by making them think it’s only the evil, successful people that will pay everyone else’s “fair share”.  They think money solves problems. 

Trump didn't generate a healthcare plan because he spent all of his time fighting Dems.  Obama had to violate our Constitution, lie and STILL couldn’t come up with an effective plan in 8 years.  Liberals know creating sanctuary cities, open borders and free everything equals votes.  Unfortunately, enough voters are stupid enough to believe it.


----------



## tjinaz

Yours in futbol said:


> Don't take this the wrong way, but you're not the kind of voter that the GOP needs to reach.  You're part of the solid 38% that the GOP will never lose.  As we've seen over the last 4 years, that's not enough.
> 
> The GOP needs to reach the kind of voter that doesn't use the word "libtard" and doesn't blame the Democratic Party for the GOP's failure to come up with a healthcare plan while it held the presidency, house, and senate.


Not really sure about that.  Trump was a bit of a whackadoodle and not a very skilled political operative but had a message that resonated with large parts of the population.  They find someone who tones down the message and gets the fringes to heel they will be successful.  Already the raw Trump message is bringing in more minorities than it did in 2016, shocking as it seems.  The Latino's are starting to understand what mass immigration would look like for those already here and don't like where that goes.  Like Grace says the pendulum will swing.


----------



## EOTL

Yours in futbol said:


> Don't take this the wrong way, but you're not the kind of voter that the GOP needs to reach.  You're part of the solid 38% that the GOP will never lose.  As we've seen over the last 4 years, that's not enough.
> 
> The GOP needs to reach the kind of voter that doesn't use the word "libtard" and doesn't blame the Democratic Party for the GOP's failure to come up with a healthcare plan while it held the presidency, house, and senate.


Shh!  The few “Republicans” out there who aren’t mentally ill need to be constantly reminded who they’re in bed with and need to win elections. Racists, homophobes, white supremacists, domestic terrorists, conspiracy theorists and insurrectionists. Magats, in other words. These are the people the party courted but, although it was super fun until they took over the party, those days are over.

Maybe someday the 10% or so of republicans who aren’t horrible people will realize that even the gun nut, anti-choice religious extremists don’t get them enough votes to get them elected and will try to rebuild their party with sane people.


----------



## Grace T.

tjinaz said:


> The Latino's are starting to understand what mass immigration would look like for those already here and don't like where that goes.  Like Grace says the pendulum will swing.


This is totally true. The history of Latinos in the US have been the old Hispanos looked down on the Panchos of the early 20th, they in turn looked down on the Mexican Chicanos of the 60s, who in turn looked down on the Mexican arrivals of the 90s, who in turn looked down on the Central American waves of the 2000s, who in turn look down at the current crop. The contempt you hear from Latinos towards the newcomers (which coming from white people would be called "racist") is tremendous and it's totally a class thing.

That's the biggest limitation of the progressive left.  They think it's about race....it's not.  It's about class.  A lot of the origin of this story also comes from the Occupy Wallstreet movement of several years back....it freaked out the corporate bigwigs and D establishment seeing the Bernie Bros on the rise....rather than make it about class and bring about their own downfall, they started waiving the racial flag.  Better for the protestors to be crying racism in the streets and calling for an end to the cops (never a big D constituency) than tearing down the corporations and their political enablers.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> This is totally true. The history of Latinos in the US have been the old Hispanos looked down on the Panchos of the early 20th, they in turn looked down on the Mexican Chicanos of the 60s, who in turn looked down on the Mexican arrivals of the 90s, who in turn looked down on the Central American waves of the 2000s, who in turn look down at the current crop. The contempt you hear from Latinos towards the newcomers (which coming from white people would be called "racist") is tremendous and it's totally a class thing.
> 
> That's the biggest limitation of the progressive left.  They think it's about race....it's not.  It's about class.  A lot of the origin of this story also comes from the Occupy Wallstreet movement of several years back....it freaked out the corporate bigwigs and D establishment seeing the Bernie Bros on the rise....rather than make it about class and bring about their own downfall, they started waiving the racial flag.  Better for the protestors to be crying racism in the streets and calling for an end to the cops (never a big D constituency) than tearing down the corporations and their political enablers.


Coocoo.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> The GOP needs to hold the deceitful media accountable because this nation already has enough stupid people that believe saying all the right things actually means something.  It doesn’t.  It means nothing because libtards never accomplish anything.  They simply raise taxes and endear the masses by making them think it’s only the evil, successful people that will pay everyone else’s “fair share”.  They think money solves problems.
> 
> Trump didn't generate a healthcare plan because he spent all of his time fighting Dems.  Obama had to violate our Constitution, lie and STILL couldn’t come up with an effective plan in 8 years.  Liberals know creating sanctuary cities, open borders and free everything equals votes.  Unfortunately, enough voters are stupid enough to believe it.


Somebody doesn’t like the First Amendment very much.

It’s democrats’ fault Trump couldn’t pass a healthcare bill despite having both houses of Congress? Sure. He never even proposed a healthcare plan, and he couldn’t even repeal ithe ACA because John McCain flipped him the bird, thinly veiled as a thumbs down.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Coocoo.


Unless you are Latino yourself, I don't think you have much of a reasonable ground to interject here any more than I do explaining the cultural proclivities of African Americans.  You are engaging in what the progressives would call "cultural appropriation".  Check your privilege.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> If that is how you think kids get molested, you’re going to miss it happening right in front of you.  Clearly we need a law banning churches where it actually happens. If it weren’t so awful, it would be funny that the pastor sends everyone with pitchforks over to the park restroom and, in the meantime, induces their daughters into the backroom with a lollipop and the word of god. What a joke.


I suppose if you were a real parent you wouldn't  say stoopid crap like this.  Enjoy frothing at the mouth today, it becomes you.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Somebody doesn’t like the First Amendment very much.
> 
> It’s democrats’ fault Trump couldn’t pass a healthcare bill despite having both houses of Congress? Sure. He never even proposed a healthcare plan, and he couldn’t even repeal ithe ACA because John McCain flipped him the bird, thinly veiled as a thumbs down.


Come on guy....quit living in the past...Hakuna Matata! no more need to talk about Trump, that's over, we are focussing on the future.  Kids will be able to play sports again and you will still be alone.  There is a great new leader that will take us to the promise land, you should be excited! If only you had someone to share the excitement with, being alone is a bad place to be, perhaps that is why you liked quarantine so much, everyone was doing what you do every day.  Get out, go meet someone, just remember, you might not always be right, and it's okay to listen to others and value their opinion. I still have hope for you, I will not give up!!!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Shh!  The few “Republicans” out there who aren’t mentally ill need to be constantly reminded who they’re in bed with and need to win elections. Racists, homophobes, white supremacists, domestic terrorists, conspiracy theorists and insurrectionists. Magats, in other words. These are the people the party courted but, although it was super fun until they took over the party, those days are over.
> 
> Maybe someday the 10% or so of republicans who aren’t horrible people will realize that even the gun nut, anti-choice religious extremists don’t get them enough votes to get them elected and will try to rebuild their party with sane people.


They didn’t court domestic terrorists.  Those were rioting liberals, rioting in liberal cities, because of liberal “values”' and encouraged to do it by liberal leaders.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Somebody doesn’t like the First Amendment very much.
> 
> It’s democrats’ fault Trump couldn’t pass a healthcare bill despite having both houses of Congress? Sure. He never even proposed a healthcare plan, and he couldn’t even repeal ithe ACA because John McCain flipped him the bird, thinly veiled as a thumbs down.


Aren’t you one of the prosthetic-vagina monologues that says free speech isn’t free and Trump needs to know that?  Do we need a 1-1/2 Amendment that only supports liberal speech?  

John McCain lost the Trump war.  That’s because he didn’t become a little bitch until he left Arizona.  That’s his reward for picking a fight with Trump".


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> Unless you are Latino yourself, I don't think you have much of a reasonable ground to interject here any more than I do explaining the cultural proclivities of African Americans.  You are engaging in what the progressives would call "cultural appropriation".  Check your privilege.


That's not the coocoo part.


----------



## espola

soccersc said:


> Come on guy....quit living in the past...Hakuna Matata! no more need to talk about Trump, that's over, we are focussing on the future.  Kids will be able to play sports again and you will still be alone.  There is a great new leader that will take us to the promise land, you should be excited! If only you had someone to share the excitement with, being alone is a bad place to be, perhaps that is why you liked quarantine so much, everyone was doing what you do every day.  Get out, go meet someone, just remember, you might not always be right, and it's okay to listen to others and value their opinion. I still have hope for you, I will not give up!!!


The sad precedent is that Dick Cheney didn't go to jail.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> That's not the coocoo part.


Corporate America is embracing the systemic racism/unconscious bias mantra.  Look at the support for example on the BLM protests from the big corps.  It's an easy thing to embrace, and if it deflects the peon's concerns off of the class equality issues all the better.


----------



## MacDre

happy9 said:


> I suppose if you were a real parent you wouldn't  say stoopid crap like this.  Enjoy frothing at the mouth today, it becomes you.


I am aware of active current molesters currently teaching and PROTECTED at prestigious religious schools in NorCal.  Bill Gagen is a great defense attorney and their go to guy for defense work.  Be careful folks.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Shh!  The few “Republicans” out there who aren’t mentally ill need to be constantly reminded who they’re in bed with and need to win elections. Racists, homophobes, white supremacists, domestic terrorists, conspiracy theorists and insurrectionists. Magats, in other words. These are the people the party courted but, although it was super fun until they took over the party, those days are over.
> 
> Maybe someday the 10% or so of republicans who aren’t horrible people will realize that even the gun nut, anti-choice religious extremists don’t get them enough votes to get them elected and will try to rebuild their party with sane people.


Hey Buddy...looks like Newsom made some great decisions on shutting things down.  He's doing a great job, you should be proud








						Did shutting down outdoor dining contribute to California's COVID-19 surge?
					

The state has had one of the worst winter COVID-19 surges in the country, which begs the...




					www.sfgate.com


----------



## Glitterhater

I just have two things to add:

1. If you think your kid can only get molested in a public restroom then.. well? Good luck with that.

2. For those of you attacking another individuals physical appearance, shame on you. You better be the most gorgeous creature walking this Earth- and I know one of you IRL, (no- won't say who,) and you really have been disappointing to say the least. And have zero room to criticize someones appearance.


----------



## watfly

Glitterhater said:


> I just have two things to add:
> 
> 1. If you think your kid can only get molested in a public restroom then.. well? Good luck with that.
> 
> 2. For those of you attacking another individuals physical appearance, shame on you. You better be the most gorgeous creature walking this Earth- and I know one of you IRL, (no- won't say who,) and you really have been disappointing to say the least. And have zero room to criticize someones appearance.


We don't specifically teach our kids "stranger danger" in our youth programs because its rarely a stranger that commits the abuse.  We take a more holistic approach that includes self confidence since these vile animals tend to prey on the vulnerable.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Is it just me or does the rhetoric of a certain poster on this forum remind you a LOT of another prominent public figures juvenile rants (hint:  the one that lost his job today)?


----------



## dad4

soccersc said:


> Hey Buddy...looks like Newsom made some great decisions on shutting things down.  He's doing a great job, you should be proud
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did shutting down outdoor dining contribute to California's COVID-19 surge?
> 
> 
> The state has had one of the worst winter COVID-19 surges in the country, which begs the...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.sfgate.com


You are right to criticize him for closing outdoor activities.

Don't forget to praise him for the mask rule.


----------



## MacDre

watfly said:


> We don't specifically teach our kids "stranger danger" in our youth programs because its rarely a stranger that commits the abuse.  We take a more holistic approach that includes self confidence since these vile animals tend to prey on the vulnerable.


I have been confronted with this issue professionally twice.  Both times, it involved  what appeared to be a well adjusted kid who’s parents were going through a bitter divorce and both parents were “sleep at the wheel.”


----------



## happy9

MacDre said:


> I am aware of active current molesters currently teaching and PROTECTED at prestigious religious schools in NorCal.  Bill Gagen is a great defense attorney and their go to guy for defense work.  Be careful folks.


Let me clarify my point.  As a parent, be on the lookout, regardless of the environment.  I'm an equal opportunity pedophile hater, whether they reside in prestigious religious school or run of the mill public schools that common folk like me put their kids in. 

In general, @EOTL's rhetoric is slimy at best.  It's a free country and he (or she)  is protected under the constitution. 

But thanks for the tip.


----------



## watfly

Kicker4Life said:


> Is it just me or does the rhetoric of a certain poster on this forum remind you a LOT of another prominent public figures juvenile rants (hint:  the one that lost his job today)?


Cut from the same cloth.  That's part of the irony that I often refer to and why he is so entertaining to me on occasion.  Although more tiresome than entertaining at this point.


----------



## Grace T.

happy9 said:


> Let me clarify my point.  As a parent, be on the lookout, regardless of the environment.  I'm an equal opportunity pedophile hater, whether they reside in prestigious religious school or run of the mill public schools that common folk like me put their kids in.
> 
> In general, @EOTL's rhetoric is slimy at best.  It's a free country and he (or she)  is protected under the constitution.
> 
> But thanks for the tip.


As the twitter censorship showed though, it doesn't extend to private internet.  @Dominic can ban him at any time, and has grounds since he chiefly derailed the soccer conversation here.  True, like perhaps some others, he might come back in some other avatar.  But the schtick won't be as amusing to him second time around.


----------



## texanincali

happy9 said:


> In general, @EOTL's rhetoric is slimy at best.


It's not slimy.  It's entirely racist, homophobic and offensive.  Filth like that is best if ignored.  I find myself getting sucked in however hard I try not to be.


----------



## EOTL

Grace T. said:


> As the twitter censorship showed though, it doesn't extend to private internet.  @Dominic can ban him at any time, and has grounds since he chiefly derailed the soccer conversation here.  True, like perhaps some others, he might come back in some other avatar.  But the schtick won't be as amusing to him second time around.


This thread was never about soccer. It was about holding rallies to oppose covid closures. By its nature it was political.

I think you also forgot to mention banning the racists, misogynists and homophobes here. I don’t see you getting upset when your magat friends call the VP a whore, or mock an appointed government official’s appearance, or call black people thugs. Does all of that fit within your “sensibilities”?


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> This thread was never about soccer. It was about holding rallies to oppose covid closures. By its nature it was political.
> 
> I think you also forgot to mention banning the racists, misogynists and homophobes here. I don’t see you getting upset when your magat friends call the VP a whore, or mock an appointed government official’s appearance, or call black people thugs. Does all of that fit within your “sensibilities”?


Meh... 

If you’d shut it and stop being an intentionally obtuse Troll, then I don’t think we’d be seeing much of that.  It’s almost exclusively in response to your intentionally derogative posting.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> It's not slimy.  It's entirely racist, homophobic and offensive.  Filth like that is best if ignored.  I find myself getting sucked in however hard I try not to be.


I respond to someone who calls the VP of the US a whore, mocks a government official’s appearance and uses his phobia of transgender status as a means to insinuate that they’re pedophiles, and you claim I’m the racist, misogynist and homophobic.  Sure. 

What’s crazy is that I actually think you believe it. You actually believe that the guy who calls the VP a whore and mocks transgender people is a fine fella.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Meh...
> 
> If you’d shut it and stop being an intentionally obtuse Troll, then I don’t think we’d be seeing much of that.  It’s almost exclusively in response to your intentionally derogative posting.


Meh....

You’re wrong. It’s not my fault people are calling Kamala Harris a whore and mocking a government official’s appearance. They’re doing that of their own free will. I’m just making sure everyone knows what magats really are and what your party really is. It’s all so much fun when it’s coming from a magat but not so much from the other direction eh?


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> I respond to someone who calls the VP of the US a whore, mocks a government official’s appearance and uses his phobia of transgender status as a means to insinuate that they’re pedophiles, and you claim I’m the racist, misogynist and homophobic.  Sure.
> 
> What’s crazy is that I actually think you believe it. You actually believe that the guy who calls the VP a whore and mocks transgender people is a fine fella.


Correct.  I believe you are a racist and homophobe.  I've thought that for quite some time now.


----------



## crush

Kicker4Life said:


> Is it just me or does the rhetoric of a certain poster on this forum remind you a LOT of another prominent public figures juvenile rants (hint:  the one that lost his job today)?


Who lost his job?  I was gone.  Thanks


----------



## WestOfFive

EOTL said:


> Meh....
> 
> You’re wrong. It’s not my fault people are calling Kamala Harris a whore and mocking a government official’s appearance. They’re doing that of their own free will. I’m just making sure everyone knows what magats really are and what your party really is. It’s all so much fun when it’s coming from a magat but not so much from the other direction eh?
> [/QUOte


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> Correct.  I believe you are a racist and homophobe.  I've thought that for quite some time now.


That’s some twisted s**t you got in opposite world. But that’s magats for you.


----------



## EOTL

Check out this master class in magat snowflake whininess.  So pathetic.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Meh....
> 
> You’re wrong. It’s not my fault people are calling Kamala Harris a whore and mocking a government official’s appearance. They’re doing that of their own free will. I’m just making sure everyone knows what magats really are and what your party really is. It’s all so much fun when it’s coming from a magat but not so much from the other direction eh?


Nope  It’s you.  

Just like you hijacked this thread, while feeling sanctimonious about doing so.

Is that how your relationships tend to end?  With the opposite of ‘It’s not you, it’s me’?

Narcissists have a hard time ‘adulting’...


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Check out this master class in magat snowflake whininess.  So pathetic.
> 
> View attachment 9977


  - fake news


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> - fake news


Oh it’s true. Just dealt with one, and not for the first time.  Magats are easily parted from their money, in this case $12 at a time.









						Exemption Cards and Forms — THE HEALTHY AMERICAN™
					






					www.thehealthyamerican.org


----------



## EOTL

EOTL said:


> Oh it’s true. Just dealt with one, and not for the first time.  Magats are easily parted from their money, in this case $12 at a time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exemption Cards and Forms — THE HEALTHY AMERICAN™
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.thehealthyamerican.org


$39 for the online seminar!  And they claim it’s a “donation”, so you can get hit for tax fraud claiming it as a charitable deduction. Is cheating on your taxes a sin? How about lying that Jesus said “no masks!”


----------



## espola

EOTL said:


> Oh it’s true. Just dealt with one, and not for the first time.  Magats are easily parted from their money, in this case $12 at a time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exemption Cards and Forms — THE HEALTHY AMERICAN™
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.thehealthyamerican.org


"The cards are sold out. Please print a card by clicking on the photo above. Thank you."

Looks like my kind of religion - free-will (and free cards) non-baptist.


----------



## espola

EOTL said:


> $39 for the online seminar!  And they claim it’s a “donation”, so you can get hit for tax fraud claiming it as a charitable deduction. Is cheating on your taxes a sin? How about lying that Jesus said “no masks!”


I have seen some of these people in youtube videos.  Strangely, they are all named Karen -- even the men.


----------



## tjinaz

espola said:


> I have seen some of these people in youtube videos.  Strangely, they are all named Karen -- even the men.


So back on Track....

Has everyone signed the Newsom Recall petition that has interest?   If you like him good for you if you want your kids to be able to play now is your chance to go beyond complaining on a message board and actively participate in the democratic process. Make your voice heard!  Only need 400k more and deadline is March 10.

Recall Gavin


----------



## EOTL

tjinaz said:


> So back on Track....
> 
> Has everyone signed the Newsom Recall petition that has interest?   If you like him good for you if you want your kids to be able to play now is your chance to go beyond complaining on a message board and actively participate in the democratic process. Make your voice heard!  Only need 400k more and deadline is March 10.
> 
> Recall Gavin


Uh, any recall election won’t happen until this is long over. If you want your kids to play sooner rather than later, wear a mask and stay home whenever possible. God you people are so clueless.


----------



## tjinaz

EOTL said:


> Uh, any recall election won’t happen until this is long over. If you want your kids to play sooner rather than later, wear a mask and stay home whenever possible. God you people are so clueless.


The point of the recall is to show displeasure in how things are being done.  It gets on the ballot or even looks like it will get on the ballot your dear leader may change his "science" and decide that there has been overreach "through no fault of his own" and lift some restrictions.  It is not so much the removal of the governor as the change in policy that is the goal.


----------



## EOTL

tjinaz said:


> The point of the recall is to show displeasure in how things are being done.  It gets on the ballot or even looks like it will get on the ballot your dear leader may change his "science" and decide that there has been overreach "through no fault of his own" and lift some restrictions.  It is not so much the removal of the governor as the change in policy that is the goal.


Is Q telling you that the governor of the State of CA will bow to pressure to let kiddies play soccer to avoid getting recalled? Sure. And Mr. Frumpty Dumpty actually won the election.  Gosh, I’m sure it will be a huge surprise when Newsom learns for the first time that there is a recall petition out there.  

You know what is funny is all these magats claiming  that politicians only care about re-election while, at the same time, they’re whining that the governor doesn’t give a s**t about the potential political costs of his standing in principle.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Is Q telling you that the governor of the State of CA will bow to pressure to let kiddies play soccer to avoid getting recalled? Sure. And Mr. Frumpty Dumpty actually won the election.  Gosh, I’m sure it will be a huge surprise when Newsom learns for the first time that there is a recall petition out there.
> 
> You know what is funny is all these magats claiming  that politicians only care about re-election while, at the same time, they’re whining that the governor doesn’t give a s**t about the potential political costs of his standing in principle.


Who is this Q you keep talking about?  Bond? James Bond? 

G-money  is doing an amazing job - why would anyone recall such a man, a man of the people, by the people, and for the people.

He is leading from the front, enabling CA to fall further behind the rest of the country in employment.  I guess at this point, not even the mighty federal government will be able to sort things out for him until schools re-open, businesses come back to life, and those pesky vaccines get used.  I guess people with pesky kids at home can't go back to work until those poor, weak minded kids can make it back into a classroom.  Shame on those parents for not raising more resilient kids.  Those 5-12 year olds should be able to run things while their parents go to work - kinda like the old days. I'm sure by age 7 you were cranking out pamphlets and plastering them all over your neighborhood.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> You are right to criticize him for closing outdoor activities.
> 
> Don't forget to praise him for the mask rule.


Uh, the mask rule he pissed on?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> This thread was never about soccer. It was about holding rallies to oppose covid closures. By its nature it was political.
> 
> I think you also forgot to mention banning the racists, misogynists and homophobes here. I don’t see you getting upset when your magat friends call the VP a whore, or mock an appointed government official’s appearance, or call black people thugs. Does all of that fit within your “sensibilities”?


The VP is a whore.  She’s also a gutless coward, or don’t you find yourself concerned she no longer believes Biden’s accuser since her promotion?  

And does Joe no longer support his quote of “all women are to be believed”?


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> Uh, the mask rule he pissed on?


He tried to implement a statewide mask requirement back in April or May.

Some people threw a giant temper tantrum.  Death threats to the OC health department, and so on.

It turns out, he was right on that one.  We do need masks.

We do not, of course, need indoor dining at French Laundry.  He was wrong on that one.

Make sense?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> He tried to implement a statewide mask requirement back in April or May.
> 
> Some people threw a giant temper tantrum.  Death threats to the OC health department, and so on.
> 
> It turns out, he was right on that one.  We do need masks.
> 
> We do not, of course, need indoor dining at French Laundry.  He was wrong on that one.
> 
> Make sense?


How do you implement a mask requirement?  Gavin Newsom has done whatever he pleases, whenever he pleases, for a very long time and needs to go.

As much as I agreed with much of Trump’s actions, I never said I’d be his pal.  IMO, he was the far better choice than Hillary and that’s the choice we had.  If you support Trump’s exist, it’s tough to support the employment of either Newsom or Biden.  They both need to go.


----------



## Grace T.

Scott m Shurson said:


> The VP is a whore.


And after NOTF used sexist derogatory language with me, I was convinced anti-woman misogynistic language was just a lefty troll thing.  I get your complaints.  I agree she's not the most principled of the politicians out there.  Maybe watch the language?  Whether you or I like it or not she is the VP.  It demeans your argument and just proves the lefties right about the righties.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> And after NOTF used sexist derogatory language with me, I was convinced anti-woman misogynistic language was just a lefty troll thing.  I get your complaints.  I agree she's not the most principled of the politicians out there.  Maybe watch the language?  Whether you or I like it or not she is the VP.  It demeans your argument and just proves the lefties right about the righties.


I will advance the proposition that it is impossible to demean his arguments.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> I will advance the proposition that it is impossible to demean his arguments.


We'll see.  I prefer to give folks the benefit of the doubt.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Does it look like this hideous thing?
> 
> https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwjm0d7FhavuAhXxHjQIHV7gAiIQxfQBCBAwAQ&url=https://womensagenda.com.au/latest/joe-biden-appoints-transgender-woman-dr-rachel-levine-as-assistant-health-secretary/&usg=AOvVaw1AHvgrbYptUTF0xOxWlEX2


You know, I was thinking that since it’s fair game to mock people by their appearance, and no one seems to mind, we should start rating the moms of some of the kids who play youth soccer.  Who do you think we should start with? I’m thinking some Sacto clubs. Some real hags up there.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> You know, I was thinking that since it’s fair game to mock people by their appearance, and no one seems to mind, we should start rating the moms of some of the kids who play youth soccer.  Who do you think we should start with? I’m thinking some Sacto clubs. Some real hags up there.


Your next ‘big idea’ is to start a Sacto soccer moms ‘hot or not’?

Why not, it worked for Facebook, right?


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> Your next ‘big idea’ is to start a Sacto soccer moms ‘hot or not’?
> 
> Why not, it worked for Facebook, right?


Just the really ugly ones though. I’m talking like Huckasans ugly.


----------



## Glitterhater

Grace T. said:


> And after NOTF used sexist derogatory language with me, I was convinced anti-woman misogynistic language was just a lefty troll thing.  I get your complaints.  I agree she's not the most principled of the politicians out there.  Maybe watch the language?  Whether you or I like it or not she is the VP.  It demeans your argument and just proves the lefties right about the righties.


Thank you! It was wrong when (whomever?) called you a slur as well as this being wrong.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> You know, I was thinking that since it’s fair game to mock people by their appearance, and no one seems to mind, we should start rating the moms of some of the kids who play youth soccer.  Who do you think we should start with? I’m thinking some Sacto clubs. Some real hags up there.


Sure, but if you really want to cut to the chase, I’m thinking Stockton and low income clubs in the east bay.  That way you can really focus on the entire package.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Sure, but if you really want to cut to the chase, I’m thinking Stockton and low income clubs in the east bay.  That way you can really focus on the entire package.


Fat magats are the way to go, but there are so many to choose from.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> You know, I was thinking that since it’s fair game to mock people by their appearance, and no one seems to mind, we should start rating the moms of some of the kids who play youth soccer.  Who do you think we should start with? I’m thinking some Sacto clubs. Some real hags up there.


Speaking of hideous looking, Emperor, did you see that Biden is paving the way for ugly males in dresses and lipstick to compete in female sports?  Pretty soon all you have to do is identify as a labia and you can go from linebacker on the practice squad to hunchbacker on the cheerleading squad!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Fat magats are the way to go, but there are so many to choose from.


Can we go obese and toothless, like Stacey Abrams?  Not sure if she’s Magat.


----------



## tjinaz

EOTL said:


> Is Q telling you that the governor of the State of CA will bow to pressure to let kiddies play soccer to avoid getting recalled? Sure. And Mr. Frumpty Dumpty actually won the election.  Gosh, I’m sure it will be a huge surprise when Newsom learns for the first time that there is a recall petition out there.
> 
> You know what is funny is all these magats claiming  that politicians only care about re-election while, at the same time, they’re whining that the governor doesn’t give a s**t about the potential political costs of his standing in principle.


So now the press is actually noticing dear leader Newsom moving the lockdown goalposts.  What is Gavin trying to hide?  Shenanigans going on and I bet its for political gain.  Nothing to see here.. doing a great job keeping you afraid.. hmm,  I mean safe.

It's a secret: California keeps key virus data from public


----------



## NorCalDad

Not sure if folks saw this:



			https://www.mercurynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/Letter-to-Governor-Newsom-1-20-2021.pdf


----------



## soccersc

tjinaz said:


> So now the press is actually noticing dear leader Newsom moving the lockdown goalposts.  What is Gavin trying to hide?  Shenanigans going on and I bet its for political gain.  Nothing to see here.. doing a great job keeping you afraid.. hmm,  I mean safe.
> 
> It's a secret: California keeps key virus data from public


He's been moving the goal post for a long time, but don't worry @EOTL says he is doing it all for US, he cares about US and everything he does is for US and his friends @EOTL has assured me of this, so I'm not worried...I'm sure he is right and Newsom has nothing to gain here. I'm mean come on...Politicians don't get into this profession to help themselves, no way, it's all for the people

good article by the way!!


----------



## kickingandscreaming

tjinaz said:


> So now the press is actually noticing dear leader Newsom moving the lockdown goalposts.  What is Gavin trying to hide?  Shenanigans going on and I bet its for political gain.  Nothing to see here.. doing a great job keeping you afraid.. hmm,  I mean safe.
> 
> It's a secret: California keeps key virus data from public


Did you see the latest? I put it on the Bad News Thread as I try to avoid taking other threads into the abyss. I posted a similar article to the one you show above. One day later, there's a separate article that leads with, "A stunning turn with regional ICU availability numbers."









						'We're on the downslope': Bay Area ICU capacity dramatically improves but exiting stay-at-home order still unclear
					

"This could potentially be the beginning of the end," said UCSF Epidemiologist Dr. George Rutherford.




					abc7news.com


----------



## dad4

kickingandscreaming said:


> Did you see the latest? I put it on the Bad News Thread as I try to avoid taking other threads into the abyss. I posted a similar article to the one you show above. One day later, there's a separate article that leads with, "A stunning turn with regional ICU availability numbers."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'We're on the downslope': Bay Area ICU capacity dramatically improves but exiting stay-at-home order still unclear
> 
> 
> "This could potentially be the beginning of the end," said UCSF Epidemiologist Dr. George Rutherford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> abc7news.com


Not just ICU.  Daily cases and test positivity are both down.

Deaths are not falling yet, but they are the last thing to shift.

Goos news.

( This does not mean it is time to throw out your mask and hold a dinner party.   That is still on the stupid list.  )


----------



## NorCalDad

dad4 said:


> Not just ICU.  Daily cases and test positivity are both down.
> 
> Deaths are not falling yet, but they are the last thing to shift.
> 
> Goos news.
> 
> ( This does not mean it is time to throw out your mask and hold a dinner party.   That is still on the stupid list.  )


I'm shocked by the cliff in cases.  Sort of nutty.


----------



## soccer661

So if the stay home order is lifted--  do we think that will help/also lift the Santa Clara County travel restrictions (out of 150 mile radius have to quarantine for 10 days)...??


----------



## futboldad1

dad4 said:


> Not just ICU.  *Daily cases and test positivity are both down*.
> 
> Deaths are not falling yet, but they are the last thing to shift.
> 
> Goos news.
> 
> ( This does not mean it is time to throw out your mask and hold a dinner party.   That is still on the stupid list.  )


ICU availability is great news......but Surely the bolded is because super testing centers like Dodgers stadium closed to make way for vaccinations?..... less tests less positive cases...... lot  of mask wearing contributing though I think, many more in the valley are masked up.....lets get our DDs back playing SOON


----------



## NorCalDad

futboldad1 said:


> ICU availability is great news......but Surely the bolded is because super testing centers like Dodgers stadium closed to make way for vaccinations?..... less tests less positive cases...... lot  of mask wearing contributing though I think.....


I mean, 1 in 10 people in LA County have gotten the virus -- and I suspect most of those folks within the last 5 months.  I think you combine that with some people getting vaccinated, the numbers will inherently drop.


----------



## soccersc

kickingandscreaming said:


> Did you see the latest? I put it on the Bad News Thread as I try to avoid taking other threads into the abyss. I posted a similar article to the one you show above. One day later, there's a separate article that leads with, "A stunning turn with regional ICU availability numbers."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'We're on the downslope': Bay Area ICU capacity dramatically improves but exiting stay-at-home order still unclear
> 
> 
> "This could potentially be the beginning of the end," said UCSF Epidemiologist Dr. George Rutherford.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> abc7news.com


Newsom is all over the place...so worried about getting recalled he doesn't now what to do...ICUs are still full, but hey, lets open back up??? What? What a great decision maker









						California lifts regional stay-at-home orders as ICU crowding eases | CNN
					

California health officials ended the state's regional stay-at-home order on Monday, saying the latest projections for intensive care unit capacity allowed the restrictions to be lifted.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## NorCalDad

soccersc said:


> Newsom is all over the place...so worried about getting recalled he doesn't now what to do...ICUs are still full, but hey, lets open back up??? What? What a great decision maker
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California lifts regional stay-at-home orders as ICU crowding eases | CNN
> 
> 
> California health officials ended the state's regional stay-at-home order on Monday, saying the latest projections for intensive care unit capacity allowed the restrictions to be lifted.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com


I'm no fan of Newsom, but the article does say they're making this decision based on a 4 week projection.  Looking at the numbers and how they're dropping like a rock everywhere is likely what's helping here.  I just wish I better understood the drop in all regions.  LA County, Orange County, etc I totally get...other regions don't have nearly the same infection rates.  Has to be more to this.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Newsom is all over the place...so worried about getting recalled he doesn't now what to do...ICUs are still full, but hey, lets open back up??? What? What a great decision maker
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California lifts regional stay-at-home orders as ICU crowding eases | CNN
> 
> 
> California health officials ended the state's regional stay-at-home order on Monday, saying the latest projections for intensive care unit capacity allowed the restrictions to be lifted.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com


You get angry when he issues stay at home orders, you get angry when he lifts stay at home orders, you get angry when he “passes” marijuana bills that benefit him when he neither passes them nor benefits from them, you get angry when people die at a lower rate than AZ, TX and FL.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> You get angry when he issues stay at home orders, you get angry when he lifts stay at home orders, you get angry when he “passes” marijuana bills that benefit him when he neither passes them nor benefits from them, you get angry when people die at a lower rate than AZ, TX and FL.


I'm not angry, this is great news. I just think it's funny how inconsistent he is. I'm sure this decision doesn't have anything to do with political pressure or fear of the recall.  Because you have made it clear that he doesn't do anything for himself and the decisions he makes are for the people!! Thata boy Newsom, keep up the good work!!


----------



## dad4

futboldad1 said:


> ICU availability is great news......but *Surely the bolded is because super testing centers like Dodgers stadium closed to make way for vaccinations?..*... less tests less positive cases...... lot  of mask wearing contributing though I think, many more in the valley are masked up.....lets get our DDs back playing SOON


If case rates were down because they closed testing centers, you’d see test positivity go up.  

At least for my area, test positivity AND case rates are both down.  That’s a sign that the drop in cases is real.


----------



## dad4

soccer661 said:


> So if the stay home order is lifted--  do we think that will help/also lift the Santa Clara County travel restrictions (out of 150 mile radius have to quarantine for 10 days)...??


I hope not.  I want local games, and more travel makes that less likely.  The last thing I want is hourly nonstops to LAX.

(soccer families aren’t the only ones who would travel.)


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> I'm not angry, this is great news. I just think it's funny how inconsistent he is. I'm sure this decision doesn't have anything to do with political pressure or fear of the recall.  Because you have made it clear that he doesn't do anything for himself and the decisions he makes are for the people!! Thata boy Newsom, keep up the good work!!


Read the article. He doesn’t care that you’re standing outside Target trying to get him fired after all this is over.


----------



## soccer661

dad4 said:


> I hope not.  I want local games, and more travel makes that less likely.  The last thing I want is hourly nonstops to LAX.
> 
> (soccer families aren’t the only ones who would travel.)


I understand, local games would be fantastic but I have also have a DD in college there....they need those travel restrictions lifted to play their conference away games...


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> If case rates were down because they closed testing centers, you’d see test positivity go up.
> 
> At least for my area, test positivity AND case rates are both down.  That’s a sign that the drop in cases is real.


Great job Gavin!  Way to keep people dying at a much lower rate than AZ, TX and FL!


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Read the article. He doesn’t care that you’re standing outside Target trying to get him fired after all this is over.


Read the article? The part that says we are still at 0% ICU capacity and they are basing the lifting of the restrictions based on a 4 week projection? Oh, so now he is saying it is okay today to go to restaurants. movie theaters, and personal care services, but yesterday it wasn't safe. Even though the numbers are the same and we are still at 0%, okay. And he is doing this because he wants to keep everyone safe? Hmmm interesting, must have nothing to do with a recall.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Read the article. He doesn’t care that you’re standing outside Target trying to get him fired after all this is over.


I thought you'd also find this interesting as you have said before politicians are in it For the People.  I told you they are ALL corrupt and you said that was a cop-out.  Dude, they are not doing it for YOU, they are in it for themselves, at least a majority of them are! But of course Newsom is different and he cares about the people.

Senators and Representatives: The average increase in net worth in the Top 100 was 114% per year. *The average member saw his or her net worth increase by an average of 15.4 percent per year.* 






						Changes in Net Worth of U.S. Senators and Representatives (Personal Gain Index)
					

Ballotpedia: The Encyclopedia of American Politics




					ballotpedia.org


----------



## dad4

soccersc said:


> Read the article? The part that says we are still at 0% ICU capacity and they are basing the lifting of the restrictions based on a 4 week projection? Oh, so now he is saying it is okay today to go to restaurants. movie theaters, and personal care services, but yesterday it wasn't safe. Even though the numbers are the same and we are still at 0%, okay. And he is doing this because he wants to keep everyone safe? Hmmm interesting, must have nothing to do with a recall.


If you want the truth, it was unsafe yesterday and is still unsafe today.  Keep your mask on and stay outside.  But, if you want your favorite restaurant to be there in 6 months, order takeout and leave a tip.

I suspect the 4 week projection improved when they added the new lower case counts into the model.  So, part political and part science.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Great job Gavin!  Way to keep people dying at a much lower rate than AZ, TX and FL!


Doing a bang up job with that Vaccine distribution too!  2nd to last means there still someone worse!  Great job!

Also fantastic policy to vaccinate the Homeless and Incarcerated before those ages 50 - 64 (2nd highest age group in Mortality rate) and ages 16 -49 with conditions that make them more vulnerable to severe Covid symptoms.  Way to serve your community!


----------



## WestOfFive

Kicker4Life said:


> Doing a bang up job with that Vaccine distribution too!  2nd to last means there still someone worse!  Great job!
> 
> Also fantastic policy to vaccinate the Homeless and Incarcerated before those ages 50 - 64 (2nd highest age group in Mortality rate) and ages 16 -49 with conditions that make them more vulnerable to severe Covid symptoms.  Way to serve your community!


Did that really happen?


----------



## GeekKid

WestOfFive said:


> Did that really happen?


Yup....









						Vaccines
					

Booster shots now available for kids 5-11 Children should get a booster dose of the Pfizer vaccine if it’s been at least 5 months since their second dose. Schedule your child’s booster. Get vaccinated – it’s safe and effective. Vaccination is the most important tool to end the COVID-19 pandemic...




					covid19.ca.gov


----------



## dad4

GeekKid said:


> Yup....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vaccines
> 
> 
> Booster shots now available for kids 5-11 Children should get a booster dose of the Pfizer vaccine if it’s been at least 5 months since their second dose. Schedule your child’s booster. Get vaccinated – it’s safe and effective. Vaccination is the most important tool to end the COVID-19 pandemic...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> covid19.ca.gov


Homeless shelters have a large number of people sharing air in a single room.  if you don’t do something, you’re going to have outbreaks there.


----------



## EOTL

GeekKid said:


> Yup....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vaccines
> 
> 
> Booster shots now available for kids 5-11 Children should get a booster dose of the Pfizer vaccine if it’s been at least 5 months since their second dose. Schedule your child’s booster. Get vaccinated – it’s safe and effective. Vaccination is the most important tool to end the COVID-19 pandemic...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> covid19.ca.gov


I don’t know why anyone gives a s**t about homeless people. F**k them. We should be kicking them in the teeth instead of trying to help them. Just let ‘em spread it and die on the streets.

And so unfair that prisoners get vaccinated. I mean I know it’s inevitable in a prison that it will spread and many will die resulting in tens of millions of dollars in wrongful death suits, but the death penalty is what they deserve for stealing that car.  I’m tired of working from home and wearing a mask to Costco. Hey honey, can you order Doordash?


----------



## Glitterhater

EOTL said:


> I don’t know why anyone gives a s**t about homeless people. F**k them. We should be kicking them in the teeth instead of trying to help them. Just let ‘em spread it and die on the streets.
> 
> And so unfair that prisoners get vaccinated. I mean I know it’s inevitable in a prison that it will spread and many will die resulting in tens of millions of dollars in wrongful death suits, but the death penalty is what they deserve for stealing that car.  I’m tired of working from home and wearing a mask to Costco.


I'm with your satire in the first graf. However- wth should someone who has broken the law get vaccinated ahead of a law abiding citizen?? Sure- vaccinate them to stop spread. But ahead of others? Nah, don't agree there.


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> Homeless shelters have a large number of people sharing air in a single room.  if you don’t do something, you’re going to have outbreaks there.


Screw ‘em. Let them die.


----------



## NorCalDad

Glitterhater said:


> I'm with your satire in the first graf. However- wth should someone who has broken the law get vaccinated ahead of a law abiding citizen?? Sure- vaccinate them to stop spread. But ahead of others? Nah, don't agree there.


San Quentin was no joke....lots of innocent folks were impacted there. Not saying I agree with this prioritization, just pointing out it's not just criminals that are relieved here.


----------



## GeekKid

EOTL said:


> I don’t know why anyone gives a s**t about homeless people. F**k them. We should be kicking them in the teeth instead of trying to help them. Just let ‘em spread it and die on the streets.
> 
> And so unfair that prisoners get vaccinated. I mean I know it’s inevitable in a prison that it will spread and many will die resulting in tens of millions of dollars in wrongful death suits, but the death penalty is what they deserve for stealing that car.  I’m tired of working from home and wearing a mask to Costco. Hey honey, can you order Doordash?


Wow, you really can weave a story out of one word and a link.


----------



## EOTL

Glitterhater said:


> I'm with your satire in the first graf. However- wth should someone who has broken the law get vaccinated ahead of a law abiding citizen?? Sure- vaccinate them to stop spread. But ahead of others? Nah, don't agree there.


Because people in prison don’t have the ability to take action to protect themselves. Because a 3-5 year sentence is not the death penalty. Because there are these things called the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights that require that inmates be treated like humans. Because the alternative is to let about half of CA prison inmates out of prison to reduce the crowding, which may be worse.

Plus, like the magats here have been saying forever, it’s no problem for old or sick people to avoid getting it. They can just stay home until it’s over.


----------



## GeekKid

EOTL said:


> Because people in prison don’t have the ability to take action to protect themselves. Because a 3-5 year sentence is not the death penalty. Because there are these things called the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights that require that inmates be treated like humans. Because the alternative is to let about half of CA prison inmates out of prison to reduce the crowding, which may be worse.
> 
> Plus, like the magats here have been saying forever, it’s no problem for old or sick people to avoid getting it. They can just stay home until it’s over.


@dad4 asked a question and wanted to know about supporting reference material.  You can spin it anyway you want.  Glad to see you're back on the civil liberties track.  I was worried about you.


----------



## EOTL

GeekKid said:


> Wow, you really can weave a story out of one word and a link.


You don’t care about the homeless?  They don’t matter so just let them die? You don’t care about the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights? We can just ignore them if it means little Kaitlyn can play kiddie sports sooner?


----------



## EOTL

GeekKid said:


> @dad4 asked a question and wanted to know about supporting reference material.  You can spin it anyway you want.  Glad to see you're back on the civil liberties track.  I was worried about you.


IKR. Homeless people should die. They’re such a blight anyway. We can also dispense with the Constitution of the U.S. and Bill of Rights if we’re talking about people we don’t care about.


----------



## happy9

soccersc said:


> Newsom is all over the place...so worried about getting recalled he doesn't now what to do...ICUs are still full, but hey, lets open back up??? What? What a great decision maker
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California lifts regional stay-at-home orders as ICU crowding eases | CNN
> 
> 
> California health officials ended the state's regional stay-at-home order on Monday, saying the latest projections for intensive care unit capacity allowed the restrictions to be lifted.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com


Sciency, kinda.  Influency, maybe. Politiking - yes...


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> You don’t care about the homeless?  They don’t matter so just let them die? You don’t care about the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights? We can just ignore them if it means little Kaitlyn can play kiddie sports sooner?


He hasn't cared about them before, why start now?  Oh yea, science..


----------



## EOTL

Incarcerated People Should Get Priority Access to the COVID-19 Vaccine. It's the Smart and Humane Thing to Do. | News & Commentary | American Civil Liberties Union
					

If officials fail to prioritize incarcerated individuals for the vaccine, we will take them to court.



					www.aclu.org
				




OMG, CA is one of 10 states vaccinating prisoners in phase 1. The horror!









						Incarcerated people and corrections staff should be prioritized in COVID-19 vaccination plans
					

Some states are including correctional facilities in their rollout plans. All states and the BOP should do so - and put incarcerated people near the ...




					www.prisonpolicy.org


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Incarcerated People Should Get Priority Access to the COVID-19 Vaccine. It's the Smart and Humane Thing to Do. | News & Commentary | American Civil Liberties Union
> 
> 
> If officials fail to prioritize incarcerated individuals for the vaccine, we will take them to court.
> 
> 
> 
> www.aclu.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OMG, CA is one of 10 states vaccinating prisoners in phase 1. The horror!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incarcerated people and corrections staff should be prioritized in COVID-19 vaccination plans
> 
> 
> Some states are including correctional facilities in their rollout plans. All states and the BOP should do so - and put incarcerated people near the ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.prisonpolicy.org


both opinion pieces. This is good lobbyist stuff. Sounds like the burokrats need to roll up their sleeves and go to work, come up with a plan to prioritize everyone.


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Because people in prison don’t have the ability to take action to protect themselves. Because a 3-5 year sentence is not the death penalty. Because there are these things called the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights that require that inmates be treated like humans. Because the alternative is to let about half of CA prison inmates out of prison to reduce the crowding, which may be worse.
> 
> Plus, like the magats here have been saying forever, it’s no problem for old or sick people to avoid getting it. They can just stay home until it’s over.


Ummm....they did.  








						Amid COVID-19, California releases some inmates doing time for murder. Advocates push to free more
					

California has focused on freeing nonviolent offenders to combat the spread of coronavirus in prisons, but some have committed violent crimes.




					www.latimes.com


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> He hasn't cared about them before, why start now?  Oh yea, science..


Nice try with the snark, but it is very clear that you’re the one who doesn’t care about them. I know that because your buddies and now you have made it clear that you are perfectly happy with all of them dying of Covid, while he quite clearly is making efforts to get that high risk population vaccinated.


----------



## EOTL

TOSDCI said:


> Ummm....they did.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amid COVID-19, California releases some inmates doing time for murder. Advocates push to free more
> 
> 
> California has focused on freeing nonviolent offenders to combat the spread of coronavirus in prisons, but some have committed violent crimes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com


God you’re so f**king stupid. That was back in Aug when only 1,000 people a day were dying, not 4,000. You do understand that when you release the less violent inmates, you only have the more violent inmates left, right? Do you want to release them now too? Or do you want to violate the US Constitution and Bill of Rights that you don’t care about?

Or maybe he should have foreseen how stupid Americans are and built a lot more prisons in the last six months so that all those criminals could have their own spacious luxury pads to reduce transmission and comply with Constitutional requirements.


----------



## EOTL

This Constitution thing just keeps getting in the way of us magats. It prevents us from compelling companies to publish the speech we want to hear. It prevents us from stopping the “lamestream” media from publishing the truth. It keeps us from killing off homeless people and inmates. We should just get rid of it. F**k that thing, right? Who’s with me!


----------



## GeekKid

EOTL said:


> You don’t care about the homeless?  They don’t matter so just let them die? You don’t care about the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights? We can just ignore them if it means little Kaitlyn can play kiddie sports sooner?


I didn't state anyone of those words or thoughts.  Thanks for fabricating though, you're good at it.


----------



## dad4

Based on early outbreaks, prisoners and prison guards should be early, for the same reason that meat packing plant workers should be early.  Certain places breed covid, and they should be a high priority.

EOTL, pour yourself a nice cup of chamomile tea, and give up on the attempts at sarcasm.   It is neither funny nor persuasive.


----------



## EOTL

GeekKid said:


> I didn't state anyone of those words or thoughts.  Thanks for fabricating though, you're good at it.


Gosh, I’m glad to hear you are in favor of vaccinating the homeless and inmates then.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Nice try with the snark, but it is very clear that you’re the one who doesn’t care about them. I know that because your buddies and now you have made it clear that you are perfectly happy with all of them dying of Covid, while he quite clearly is making efforts to get that high risk population vaccinated.


Yep, that's what I said.  What "buddy" are you talking about?  But, I guess if you think about it, Darwinism does have it's upsides from time to time.  You would support that in the context of trumpanzees right?  

Clearly I said there needs to be a plan.  Not just sound bites from groups that are jockeying for political position, influencing burokrats to do their bidding.  At some point planning and execution needs to occur, not just windbag politiks.  Governments in general have already set the expectation so low.  Complete dosage vaccination of any high risk group would be a win.  But the bar is very low.  Maybe between Chick Fil A and Amazon, we could get something done.  We have to start somewhere.


----------



## watfly

happy9 said:


> Yep, that's what I said.  What "buddy" are you talking about?  But, I guess if you think about it, Darwinism does have it's upsides from time to time.  You would support that in the context of trumpanzees right?
> 
> Clearly I said there needs to be a plan.  Not just sound bites from groups that are jockeying for political position, influencing burokrats to do their bidding.  At some point planning and execution needs to occur, not just windbag politiks.  Governments in general have already set the expectation so low.  Complete dosage vaccination of any high risk group would be a win.  But the bar is very low.  Maybe between Chick Fil A and Amazon, we could get something done.  We have to start somewhere.


If Chick Fil A was running the vaccine program we'd be done by now, or close to done...ya know Sundays and all.


----------



## Glitterhater

NorCalDad said:


> San Quentin was no joke....lots of innocent folks were impacted there. Not saying I agree with this prioritization, just pointing out it's not just criminals that are relieved here.


Agree- but my answer is going to be that the state needs to figure out how to vaccinate them in parallel. If we're so concerned with optics, (which is what a lot of all this really is,) it looks awful to prioritize prisons over general population.


----------



## lafalafa

watfly said:


> If Chick Fil A was running the vaccine program we'd be done by now, or close to done...ya know Sundays and all.


Can I get a 12 piece with Chick-fil-A sauce and a vaccine on the side.  Cars always lined up so why not.


----------



## EOTL

Glitterhater said:


> Agree- but my answer is going to be that the state needs to figure out how to vaccinate them in parallel. If we're so concerned with optics, (which is what a lot of all this really is,) it looks awful to prioritize prisons over general population.


Complying with the Constitution and Bill of Rights is a wee bit more important than magat optics.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Complying with the Constitution and Bill of Rights is a wee bit more important than magat optics.


Is this opposite day?  your trumpy deity is not in office anymore...the new dog and pony show is in town, it's their optics now.  I think you need more organic tea.


----------



## Glitterhater

EOTL said:


> Complying with the Constitution and Bill of Rights is a wee bit more important than magat optics.


I have no desire to debate this with you. You make us libtards look really freaking bad.


----------



## happy9

watfly said:


> If Chick Fil A was running the vaccine program we'd be done by now, or close to done...ya know Sundays and all.


you have to admire the efficiency of their operations and in the manner in which they deliver their service.  Pair them with In n Out to cover Sundays and we'd be done in no time.  Leave it to little Bezos to solve the supply chain issues..


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Based on early outbreaks, prisoners and prison guards should be early, for the same reason that meat packing plant workers should be early.  Certain places breed covid, and they should be a high priority.
> 
> EOTL, pour yourself a nice cup of chamomile tea, and give up on the attempts at sarcasm.   It is neither funny nor persuasive.


After health care workers there are 3 ways to do it: by most vulnerable (e.g. aged, those with conditions), by those that spread it the most (in which case college kids are up first too and anyone not in a tight lockdown) or by most meritorious.  The first is relatively easy to police (everyone has ID, or if they don't it's hard for a 30 year old to pass as 75 and you can adjust by tier if you have surplus vaccine).  The first also is relatively easy to organize, to get out info and will knock the death rate down for everyone given how vulnerable the aged are.  The second can't fly because it will cause people who were careful (like my inlaws) to complain why are they being punished if they've been locked in the house for a year and you are vaccinating the worst behaved, least vulnerable people out there like college students.  The third has the problem that every group will lobby they are meritorious: racial groups, professions (teachers v. police officers v. correctional officers v. essential workers), the rich and powerful.  The third also has the problem that once you are passed confined spaces like correctional facilities and nursing home workers, it get's really hard to verify their employment status and to get the word out that x is eligible on such date, but not why....we've seen in this in the f'ed up reservation system in VC already.


----------



## happy9

Glitterhater said:


> Agree- but my answer is going to be that the state needs to figure out how to vaccinate them in parallel. If we're so concerned with optics, (which is what a lot of all this really is,) it looks awful to prioritize prisons over general population.


I think it is awful to prioritize.  Our government can barely plan delivery of the vaccine to high risk populations in a linear fashion.  Now other populations jump on board?  It's ludicrous. Parallel planning and execution is not in the wheel house of our governments.


----------



## Grace T.

happy9 said:


> I think it is awful to prioritize.  Our government can barely plan delivery of the vaccine to high risk populations in a linear fashion.  Now other populations jump on board?  It's ludicrous. Parallel planning and execution is not in the wheel house of our governments.


Yup this is the problem if you try to do it all 3 ways of distributing.  There's not enough and you are guaranteed to f it up.   VC is having a hard enough time doing the very broad definition of medical worker (which is not just people working front line ERS but doctors and dentists with private practices), and 75+ right now.  The were originally going to do 65+ but that load of demand just caused their servers to crash so they had to break up this phase into further sub tiers.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> I think it is awful to prioritize.  Our government can barely plan delivery of the vaccine to high risk populations in a linear fashion.  Now other populations jump on board?  It's ludicrous. Parallel planning and execution is not in the wheel house of our governments.


You are correct. It should be a total free for all. Definitely better to let rich people get vaccinated first.


----------



## Kicker4Life

happy9 said:


> you have to admire the efficiency of their operations and in the manner in which they deliver their service.  Pair them with In n Out to cover Sundays and we'd be done in no time.  Leave it to little Bezos to solve the supply chain issues..


He is the liberal Donald Trump persona is he not?


----------



## kickingandscreaming

Grace T. said:


> Yup this is the problem if you try to do it all 3 ways of distributing.  There's not enough and you are guaranteed to f it up.   VC is having a hard enough time doing the very broad definition of medical worker (which is not just people working front line ERS but doctors and dentists with private practices), and 75+ right now.  The were originally going to do 65+ but that load of demand just caused their servers to crash so they had to break up this phase into further sub tiers.


Age and zip codes of highest transmission?


----------



## Grace T.

kickingandscreaming said:


> Age and zip codes of highest transmission?


A. Newsoms rich friends will never tolerate being sent to the back of the line
B. You’ll have to weight each factor which is a fight


----------



## happy9

Kicker4Life said:


> He is the liberal Donald Trump persona is he not?


Ha, great comparison.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> You are correct. It should be a total free for all. Definitely better to let rich people get vaccinated first.


You crack me up - don't you see how little sense you make?  Have you ever heard the song by Adam Sandler ->> "They're all gonna laugh at you"

Your choice though, to be a slave to the burokrat...maybe slave is a little bit strong for a social justice warrior like yourself.  Enforced dependency on government.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Does anyone know if Newsom is announcing any changes to the youth sports criteria's this week.  I heard that Calsouth is waiting for some type of announcement to determine if they start the season in March


----------



## Kicker4Life

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Does anyone know if Newsom is announcing any changes to the youth sports criteria's this week.  I heard that Calsouth is waiting for some type of announcement to determine if they start the season in March


For what it’s worth, I heard there was supposed to be something announced today regarding youth/outdoor sports...


----------



## crush

Kicker4Life said:


> For what it’s worth, I heard there was supposed to be something announced today regarding youth/outdoor sports...


----------



## NorCalDad

Kicker4Life said:


> For what it’s worth, I heard there was supposed to be something announced today regarding youth/outdoor sports...


That differs what they announced in December?  Reliable source?


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

NorCalDad said:


> That differs what they announced in December?  Reliable source?


Ive heard that they will relax the rules or allow each county to make a decision on youth sports regardless of the color tiers.


----------



## NorCalDad

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Ive heard that they will relax the rules or allow each county to make a decision on youth sports regardless of the color tiers.


One can only hope.


----------



## lafalafa

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Ive heard that they will relax the rules or allow each county to make a decision on youth sports regardless of the color tiers.


Newsom meet with a coalition of coaches recently who urged him to remove tiers for youth sports and restart play.   With the stay at home lifted return to conditioning can at least resume and the coaches didn't get any promises from the governor after meeting with him twice besides future dialogue & discussion at later dates.

CIF guidelines for SS








						Updated Covid-19 Sport Guidelines [Updated 3.10.21] - CIF Southern Section
					





					cifss.org


----------



## MARsSPEED

I have some great news!!!!! We are entering the peak Flu season and the CDC said only 23 cases of flu nationwide were reported last week! Never in history has the common flu just up and left on this scale. Those masks must have really scared the flu virus away. Now, just that pesky CoVid that somehow has figured out how to make an Iron Man competition out of our masks. Perhaps if we wear, double, triple or even 10 masks at once, CoVid will pack it's bags and leave just like the flu did!

Or wait, I forgot about that more virulent form CoVid, complete with excavators to dig through your mask. Not sure how we'll scare that strain away.

Oh, and here is the link to the latest flu numbers:








						Weekly U.S. Influenza Surveillance Report
					

Learn more about the weekly influenza surveillance report (FluView) prepared by the Influenza Division.




					www.cdc.gov


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Read the article. He doesn’t care that you’re standing outside Target trying to get him fired after all this is over.


Oh, the home wrecker does care about his political career.  That’s exactly why he’s now contradicting all the bullshit he’s been preaching for 9 months.


----------



## lafalafa

Coach Gardinera gives an update on resuming youth sports in CA -
					

SAN DIEGO (KUSI) – Members from a statewide group called the Golden State HS Football Coaches and the Facebook page “Let Them Play,” which has nearly 30,000 followers are asking for a chance to have sports play out this academic year. Prep sports have not happened on high school campuses since...




					www.kusi.com
				









Rally tomorrow


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I don’t know why anyone gives a s**t about homeless people. F**k them. We should be kicking them in the teeth instead of trying to help them. Just let ‘em spread it and die on the streets.
> 
> And so unfair that prisoners get vaccinated. I mean I know it’s inevitable in a prison that it will spread and many will die resulting in tens of millions of dollars in wrongful death suits, but the death penalty is what they deserve for stealing that car.  I’m tired of working from home and wearing a mask to Costco. Hey honey, can you order Doordash?


I agree.  Offer them services and, when they refuse them because they’re bums, drive them to the edge of town and waive bye.  Sick and tired of my tax dollars being wasted on these losers begging because they don’t want to work.  

The death penalty is a prefect option for stealing a car and running from police.  You’d only have to execute one scumbag because the rest would learn in a hurry, wouldn’t they?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Gosh, I’m glad to hear you are in favor of vaccinating the homeless and inmates then.


Yes... liberals always put bums and criminals before good people.  Gotta keep that voter base happy!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> You are correct. It should be a total free for all. Definitely better to let rich people get vaccinated first.


Rich people?  You mean law abiding citizens that pay their own way, respect the rights of others and don’t shit on the sidewalk?


----------



## GeekKid

MARsSPEED said:


> I have some great news!!!!! We are entering the peak Flu season and the CDC said only 23 cases of flu nationwide were reported last week! Never in history has the common flu just up and left on this scale. Those masks must have really scared the flu virus away. Now, just that pesky CoVid that somehow has figured out how to make an Iron Man competition out of our masks. Perhaps if we wear, double, triple or even 10 masks at once, CoVid will pack it's bags and leave just like the flu did!
> 
> Or wait, I forgot about that more virulent form CoVid, complete with excavators to dig through your mask. Not sure how we'll scare that strain away.
> 
> Oh, and here is the link to the latest flu numbers:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Weekly U.S. Influenza Surveillance Report
> 
> 
> Learn more about the weekly influenza surveillance report (FluView) prepared by the Influenza Division.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cdc.gov


Read the same thing last week.  If you read the data it is astounding.  The flu has literally vanished!


----------



## dad4

MARsSPEED said:


> I have some great news!!!!! We are entering the peak Flu season and the CDC said only 23 cases of flu nationwide were reported last week! Never in history has the common flu just up and left on this scale. Those masks must have really scared the flu virus away. Now, just that pesky CoVid that somehow has figured out how to make an Iron Man competition out of our masks. Perhaps if we wear, double, triple or even 10 masks at once, CoVid will pack it's bags and leave just like the flu did!
> 
> Or wait, I forgot about that more virulent form CoVid, complete with excavators to dig through your mask. Not sure how we'll scare that strain away.
> 
> Oh, and here is the link to the latest flu numbers:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Weekly U.S. Influenza Surveillance Report
> 
> 
> Learn more about the weekly influenza surveillance report (FluView) prepared by the Influenza Division.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cdc.gov


There is a simple explanation for the flu numbers.   Masks, distance, and staying outside work well against respiratory viruses.

1 or 2 masks is fine.  Adding more just means air sneaks in and out around the edges instead of going through the mask.


----------



## MARsSPEED

dad4 said:


> There is a simple explanation for the flu numbers.   Masks, distance, and staying outside work well against respiratory viruses.
> 
> 1 or 2 masks is fine.  Adding more just means air sneaks in and out around the edges instead of going through the mask.


Oh my, there is a lot of material here....you really set this up for a homerun. I'm going to take a hard pass on this one as it's just too easy.


----------



## espola

MARsSPEED said:


> Oh my, there is a lot of material here....you really set this up for a homerun. I'm going to take a hard pass on this one as it's just too easy.


What did he get wrong?


----------



## dad4

espola said:


> What did he get wrong?


It is the usual problem here.  Almost none can distinguish error from disagreement.


----------



## lafalafa

Todays update, reporter asked specifically about a youth sports update along new cdc 4 foot spacing for students returning to schools






Short answer no change to tier basing for youth sports but the heath dept guidance does allow for some sports in the purple tier now that stay at home is lifted such as x country and those outdoors that maintain distancing and are considered low risk,  see there site for more info but same as CIF has already posted orange tier required for soccer


----------



## N00B

lafalafa said:


> Todays update, reporter asked specifically about a youth sports update along new cdc 4 foot spacing for students returning to schools
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Short answer no change to tier basing for youth sports but the heath dept guidance does allow for some sports in the purple tier now that stay at home is lifted such as x country and those outdoors that maintain distancing and are considered low risk,  see there site for more info but same as CIF has already posted orange tier required for soccer


Minor updates to youth sports guidance.









						Current safety measures
					

Steps you can take to protect yourself from COVID-19 and prevent its spread.




					covid19.ca.gov
				




Same tier based reopening based on sport.  No out of state tournaments allowed. 

This seemed new: “ Athletes and coaches should cohort by team, and refrain from participating with more than one team over the same season or time period ”


----------



## Grace T.

N00B said:


> Minor updates to youth sports guidance.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Current safety measures
> 
> 
> Steps you can take to protect yourself from COVID-19 and prevent its spread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> covid19.ca.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same tier based reopening based on sport.  No out of state tournaments allowed.
> 
> This seemed new: “ Athletes and coaches should cohort by team, and refrain from participating with more than one team over the same season or time period ”



Hmmm....so tryouts impossible unless you are completely new to the sport, or your team explodes or you get cut (since mass tryouts are also not possible right now)/no guesting for teams you might want to check out.


----------



## N00B

Grace T. said:


> Hmmm....so tryouts impossible unless you are completely new to the sport, or your team explodes or you get cut (since mass tryouts are also not possible right now)/no guesting for teams you might want to check out.


Technically, coaches shouldn’t have more than one team and players shouldn’t participate in multiple sports in the same time period.... Don’t see that happening.


----------



## NorCalDad

N00B said:


> Technically, coaches shouldn’t have more than one team and players shouldn’t participate in multiple sports in the same time period.... Don’t see that happening.


Hahahah -- yeah that's not happening. I actually thought kids could be in 2-3 cohorts (including non-sports activities). I wonder how this impacts side training or practicing with multiple clubs. 

These rules are so dumb.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Hmmm....so tryouts impossible unless you are completely new to the sport, or your team explodes or you get cut (since mass tryouts are also not possible right now)/no guesting for teams you might want to check out.


After about U10, who still does mass tryouts?

You call up the coach and tell him where you last played.  

Maybe some teams still use cattle call tryouts to fill out their bronze or copper teams.  

 I don't think they lose that much if they temporarily replace that with a beep test, a juggling contest, and a passing drill.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> After about U10, who still does mass tryouts?
> 
> You call up the coach and tell him where you last played.
> 
> Maybe some teams still use cattle call tryouts to fill out their bronze or copper teams.
> 
> I don't think they lose that much if they temporarily replace that with a beep test, a juggling contest, and a passing drill.


For starters AYSO United requires them.  There have also in SoCal been some ads for a handful of teams U14 U13 teams on the soccer boards (including a flight 1 team) advertising mass tryouts (or their ugly stepchild the "special training").  Agree it becomes less common as they get older, but they do happen.


----------



## MARsSPEED

I feel so bad for all of you. I truly do. I hope those making these crazy rules figure it out sooner than later.

Here in Maryland, we never stopped practicing. Full ECNL season (except NJ teams). Did a tournament in Virginia. There has not been a single report of a CoVid breakout from any youth tournament. Rules are simple, must wear mask at all times unless playing in game. Only one parent allowed per player. Absolutely zero problems.

Let them play!!!


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> After about U10, who still does mass tryouts?
> 
> You call up the coach and tell him where you last played.
> 
> Maybe some teams still use cattle call tryouts to fill out their bronze or copper teams.
> 
> I don't think they lose that much if they temporarily replace that with a beep test, a juggling contest, and a passing drill.


Mass tryouts are still very common in SD, I'm not aware of any clubs that don't have them.  Terrible way for a kid to find a team. Efficient way for clubs to fill rosters, but not effective for finding the best players.


----------



## GeekKid

MARsSPEED said:


> I feel so bad for all of you. I truly do. I hope those making these crazy rules figure it out sooner than later.
> 
> Here in Maryland, we never stopped practicing. Full ECNL season (except NJ teams). Did a tournament in Virginia. There has not been a single report of a CoVid breakout from any youth tournament. Rules are simple, must wear mask at all times unless playing in game. Only one parent allowed per player. Absolutely zero problems.
> 
> Let them play!!!


Same here in Texas!


----------



## lafalafa

NorCalDad said:


> Hahahah -- yeah that's not happening. I actually thought kids could be in 2-3 cohorts (including non-sports activities). I wonder how this impacts side training or practicing with multiple clubs.
> 
> These rules are so dumb.


For HS since all the season 2 sports are now in spring participating in soccer & volleyball now it's not possible or soccer and any other spring season 2 sports.  Cross country, swimming and soccer yes since those two are in season one.

not to mention you can't play clubs & high school at the same time would you be in two different cohorts


----------



## kickingandscreaming

GeekKid said:


> Same here in Texas!


There's a much longer list of states that continued or resumed play before the end of summer than states that did not.


----------



## Kicker4Life

kickingandscreaming said:


> There's a much longer list of states that continued or resumed play before the end of summer than states that did not.


At least triple or even quadruple the number that played versus didn’t.


----------



## Footy30

lafalafa said:


> For HS since all the season 2 sports are now in spring participating in soccer & volleyball now it's not possible or soccer and any other spring season 2 sports.  Cross country, swimming and soccer yes since those two are in season one.
> 
> not to mention you can't play clubs & high school at the same time would you be in two different cohorts


Right... and does this mean technically a coach can't coach more than one team?? (club) does that even exist?


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> I feel so bad for all of you. I truly do. I hope those making these crazy rules figure it out sooner than later.
> 
> Here in Maryland, we never stopped practicing. Full ECNL season (except NJ teams). Did a tournament in Virginia. There has not been a single report of a CoVid breakout from any youth tournament. Rules are simple, must wear mask at all times unless playing in game. Only one parent allowed per player. Absolutely zero problems.
> 
> Let them play!!!


Yes, zero problems if you don’t count the problems. 









						Popular MD Soccer tournament canceled after positive COVID case
					

Montgomery Co. officials rescinded approval for the Bethesda Premier Cup boy's tournament after a player tested positive in the girl's tournament last weekend.




					www.wusa9.com
				












						4 positive COVID cases tied to Potomac Soccer Association, health officials say
					

Montgomery County Health Officer Dr. Travis Gayles confirmed that 35 individuals were asked to quarantine following contact tracing.




					www.wusa9.com
				












						COVID-19 outbreak tied to soccer team in Montgomery County
					

NORTH POTOMAC, Md. (WDVM) — Health officials confirmed at least 4 people tested positive for COVID-19 all linked to a youth soccer game in Montgomery County. The county was notified of the ou…




					www.localdvm.com
				






			https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/youth-sports-coronavirus/2020/11/26/ad41f2e8-29dd-11eb-9b14-ad872157ebc9_story.html


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Yes, zero problems if you don’t count the problems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Popular MD Soccer tournament canceled after positive COVID case
> 
> 
> Montgomery Co. officials rescinded approval for the Bethesda Premier Cup boy's tournament after a player tested positive in the girl's tournament last weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4 positive COVID cases tied to Potomac Soccer Association, health officials say
> 
> 
> Montgomery County Health Officer Dr. Travis Gayles confirmed that 35 individuals were asked to quarantine following contact tracing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 outbreak tied to soccer team in Montgomery County
> 
> 
> NORTH POTOMAC, Md. (WDVM) — Health officials confirmed at least 4 people tested positive for COVID-19 all linked to a youth soccer game in Montgomery County. The county was notified of the ou…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.localdvm.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/youth-sports-coronavirus/2020/11/26/ad41f2e8-29dd-11eb-9b14-ad872157ebc9_story.html


sounds dire. 

I love how you sensationalize this and then attribute kid suicide as lack of resiliency and bad parenting.  Go look up the suicide #s for pre-teens and teens since the pandemic started.  I'm sure you'll rationalize their deaths in some stoopid, pundit kind of way.  

UR such a knucklehead. What are you afraid of?  And why the resistance to allowing kids to play sports?  Something we need to know?


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> sounds dire.
> 
> I love how you sensationalize this and then attribute kid suicide as lack of resiliency and bad parenting.  Go look up the suicide #s for pre-teens and teens since the pandemic started.  I'm sure you'll rationalize their deaths in some stoopid, pundit kind of way.
> 
> UR such a knucklehead. What are you afraid of?  And why the resistance to allowing kids to play sports?  Something we need to know?


Say hi to Grace Karen for me!

440,000 people have died so far because too many people want to do the things they want to do, each of which is individually “low risk”, but when you add up all that selfishness and lack of empathy and self-discipline, you end up with 4,000 people dying every day. This is exacerbated by constant lying by people claiming there haven’t been any problems. 

The reason we are here is because of people like you. Because you’ll never learn, you all get to pay the price for that until hopefully vaccines save us.


----------



## Cruzer

EOTL said:


> Say hi to Grace Karen for me!
> 
> 440,000 people have died so far because too many people want to do the things they want to do, each of which is individually “low risk”, but when you add up all that selfishness and lack of empathy and self-discipline, you end up with 4,000 people dying every day. This is exacerbated by constant lying by people claiming there haven’t been any problems.
> 
> The reason we are here is because of people like you. Because you’ll never learn, you all get to pay the price for that until hopefully vaccines save us.


You are in every post detracting.
You are seriously off your rocker.
You need help.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Say hi to Grace Karen for me!
> 
> 440,000 people have died so far because too many people want to do the things they want to do, each of which is individually “low risk”, but when you add up all that selfishness and lack of empathy and self-discipline, you end up with 4,000 people dying every day. This is exacerbated by constant lying by people claiming there haven’t been any problems.
> 
> The reason we are here is because of people like you. Because you’ll never learn, you all get to pay the price for that until hopefully vaccines save us.


And because of Governors who decide to go out to eat when they tell everyone to stay home.  What a great example.  Be careful when you throw rocks from the inside of a glass house.


----------



## EOTL

Cruzer said:


> You are in every post detracting.
> You are seriously off your rocker.
> You need help.


Sorry not sorry to get in the way of your fact free zone.  It is understandable that we are seeing an uptick in magats here given that people and companies exercised their 1st Amendment right to take down Parler.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> And because of Governors who decide to go out to eat when they tell everyone to stay home.  What a great example.  Be careful when you throw rocks from the inside of a glass house.


I love how that’s all you got. The governor had a nice meal once to celebrate his friend’s birthday, so it must be ok for you to do whatever you want and kill as many people as you want. That is a very compelling argument you are making.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I love how that’s all you got. The governor had a nice meal once to celebrate his friend’s birthday, so it must be ok for you to do whatever you want and kill as many people as you want. That is a very compelling argument you are making.


Why give him a pass? Leaders should be held to a higher standard!!!  Don't come in here and condemn some while you condone the actions of others. I guess you feel double standards are acceptable just like the leaders you follow.  Choose those you follow wisely!! Like all those in Hollywood that say a WALL is so terrible, BUT they live in gated communities, in million dollar houses, with security guards??? Hmm...no double standards here, but hey, those are the ones you like to follow.  Try being a leader and think for yourself instead of what others want you to believe.  I am still not giving up on you!!!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I love how that’s all you got. The governor had a nice meal once to celebrate his friend’s birthday, so it must be ok for you to do whatever you want and kill as many people as you want. That is a very compelling argument you are making.


He celebrated another friend by banging his wife and breaking up their family.  What a great leader!


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> He celebrated another friend by banging his wife and breaking up their family.  What a great leader!


I keep forgetting how that’s so much worse than banging hookers while your wife is pregnant.  Both have a lot to do with the pandemic.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I keep forgetting how that’s so much worse than banging hookers while your wife is pregnant.  Both have a lot to do with the pandemic.


There you go again!!! What makes one wrong and the other right? You have a very difficult time admitting TRUTH.  It's not about the pandemic buddie, it's about those trying to LEAD through the pandemic.  You're willing to ridicule some for their actions on this board, but you seem incapable of condoning your LEADERS when they do something wrong.  It's kinda sad, but often when kids look up to their leaders/hero they have a difficult time recognizing when they are causing harm, because they have set them on such a high pedestal.  Don't worry, I am here to help you


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Why give him a pass? Leaders should be held to a higher standard!!!  Don't come in here and condemn some while you condone the actions of others. I guess you feel double standards are acceptable just like the leaders you follow.  Choose those you follow wisely!! Like all those in Hollywood that say a WALL is so terrible, BUT they live in gated communities, in million dollar houses, with security guards??? Hmm...no double standards here, but hey, those are the ones you like to follow.  Try being a leader and think for yourself instead of what others want you to believe.  I am still not giving up on you!!!


I am not giving anyone a pass. You are giving yourself a pass to do whatever you want because he made a mistake for which he apologized. You don’t care that he had a dinner. You just want to pretend nobody is dying so you can do whatever you want, and that’s your excuse. It’s a pretty lame excuse. 

Your wall analogy is also ridiculous. Individuals in gate communities do not get to make immigration policy.  Plus, they’re paying for their own wall, whereas a majority of Americans who disapprove of the wall were paying for it. Gated communities aren’t falsely claiming to homeowners that Mexico will pay for it and then sticking them with the bill. And walls in gated communities actually work for the purpose for which they were constructed.


----------



## dad4

Does anyone know whether the MD case was a four case cluster tied to a game, or a 4 case cluster tied to a group of friends on the same team?

It is one thing if this is 3 cases of transmission on the field.

If the four are best friends and carpool together, it tells us a lot less.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> There you go again!!! What makes one wrong and the other right? You have a very difficult time admitting TRUTH.  It's not about the pandemic buddie, it's about those trying to LEAD through the pandemic.  You're willing to ridicule some for their actions on this board, but you seem incapable of condoning your LEADERS when they do something wrong.  It's kinda sad, but often when kids look up to their leaders/hero they have a difficult time recognizing when they are causing harm, because they have set them on such a high pedestal.  Don't worry, I am here to help you


This thread is about the pandemic, yet you’re talking about the governor’s love life to rationalize why you should he able to kill as many people as you want.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Sorry not sorry to get in the way of your fact free zone.  It is understandable that we are seeing an uptick in magats here given that people and companies exercised their 1st Amendment right to take down Parler.


Speaking of fact free zone.....you still owe me some facts.....so make sure you practice what your preach


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I am not giving anyone a pass. You are giving yourself a pass to do whatever you want because he made a mistake for which he apologized. You don’t care that he had a dinner. You just want to pretend nobody is dying so you can do whatever you want, and that’s your excuse. It’s a pretty lame excuse.
> 
> Your wall analogy is also ridiculous. Individuals in gate communities do not get to make immigration policy.  Plus, they’re paying for their own wall, whereas a majority of Americans who disapprove of the wall were paying for it. Gated communities aren’t falsely claiming to homeowners that Mexico will pay for it and then sticking them with the bill. And walls in gated communities actually work for the purpose for which they were constructed.


That's good to hear. So you are saying that Newsom has made some bad decisions throughout the pandemic? I have never heard you say that before, I knew you would come around!!! You have no idea what I have been doing by the way, so pretty short sided of you to speculate. I guess I can then speculate, you are on here saying don't go out, while in actuality, you are the one going to all the super spreader events without a mask.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> That's good to hear. So you are saying that Newsom has made some bad decisions throughout the pandemic? I have never heard you say that before, I knew you would come around!!! You have no idea what I have been doing by the way, so pretty short sided of you to speculate. I guess I can then speculate, you are on here saying don't go out, while in actuality, you are the one going to all the super spreader events without a mask.


You’ve made it pretty clear what you’ve been doing and how you would prefer to be doing even more to kill people around you.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I am not giving anyone a pass. You are giving yourself a pass to do whatever you want because he made a mistake for which he apologized. You don’t care that he had a dinner. You just want to pretend nobody is dying so you can do whatever you want, and that’s your excuse. It’s a pretty lame excuse.
> 
> Your wall analogy is also ridiculous. Individuals in gate communities do not get to make immigration policy.  Plus, they’re paying for their own wall, whereas a majority of Americans who disapprove of the wall were paying for it. Gated communities aren’t falsely claiming to homeowners that Mexico will pay for it and then sticking them with the bill. And walls in gated communities actually work for the purpose for which they were constructed.


You generalize way too much! How do you know people in the gated community want to pay for a wall or security.  There are some in the association that are fine with leaving the gates open and would rather not pay to have the gates closed!! Then there are some in the association that are willing to pay to keep the gate closed and pay for the guard to keep them safe.  funny thing is, the ones paying for the gate to keep them safe are the same ones that don't want to pay for another wall. Interesting! At least I know by your response that you have never lived in an association or a gated community.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> You’ve made it pretty clear what you’ve been doing and how you would prefer to be doing even more to kill people around you.


Have I? Preferring and actually doing are two totally different things. But now I know you are condoning people because you are the one going out and killing people.  More of that double standard that you love to live by, telling us we are wrong for going out while you are partying it up out on the town!! Shame on you


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> You generalize way too much! How do you know people in the gated community want to pay for a wall or security.  There are some in the association that are fine with leaving the gates open and would rather not pay to have the gates closed!! Then there are some in the association that are willing to pay to keep the gate closed and pay for the guard to keep them safe.  funny thing is, the ones paying for the gate to keep them safe are the same ones that don't want to pay for another wall. Interesting! At least I know by your response that you have never lived in an association or a gated community.


OK, you are justifying billions of dollars in taxpayer dollars on a border wall that doesn’t work because someone hypothetically might buy a house in a gated community where the walls do work, but wants to leave the gates open. That makes sense. Next you’ll rationalize the border wall because Gavin Newsom had dinner at the French Laundry


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> OK, you are justifying billions of dollars in taxpayer dollars on a border wall that doesn’t work because someone hypothetically might buy a house in a gated community where the walls do work, but wants to leave the gates open. That makes sense. Next you’ll rationalize the border wall because Gavin Newsom had dinner at the French Laundry


Walls don't always work, many cases, robberies, killings, have happened in gated communities, you are wrong again, but that shows me, you have never lived in one and are not aware.... so I will help you.  Isn't the money spent relative to the individual person and not the whole? People that live in a guarded gated community spend WAY more money on their own gate then they will ever spend in taxes on the building of another.  

Once again, I am not rationalizing the border wall, you assume way too much, I am just saying those leaders you follow live by a double standard.  You have a difficult time with the TRUTH so when you are wrong you try and change the narrative so it fits your argument


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I keep forgetting how that’s so much worse than banging hookers while your wife is pregnant.  Both have a lot to do with the pandemic.


How do you know Trump didn’t have an open marriage?  Same way you had access to his medical records?

Walking the talk has to do with the pandemic but you’d like to ignore that, too.  You’re fine with being above the rules as long as your name isn’t “Trump”.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I am not giving anyone a pass. You are giving yourself a pass to do whatever you want because he made a mistake for which he apologized. You don’t care that he had a dinner. You just want to pretend nobody is dying so you can do whatever you want, and that’s your excuse. It’s a pretty lame excuse.
> 
> Your wall analogy is also ridiculous. Individuals in gate communities do not get to make immigration policy.  Plus, they’re paying for their own wall, whereas a majority of Americans who disapprove of the wall were paying for it. Gated communities aren’t falsely claiming to homeowners that Mexico will pay for it and then sticking them with the bill. And walls in gated communities actually work for the purpose for which they were constructed.


He didn’t apologize.  He lied and said he should have made a different decision.  His only regret was getting caught.


----------



## dad4

Scott m Shurson said:


> How do you know Trump didn’t have an open marriage?  Same way you had access to his medical records?
> 
> Walking the talk has to do with the pandemic but you’d like to ignore that, too.  You’re fine with being above the rules as long as your name isn’t “Trump”.


Maybe EOTL will like Trump better if you point out that he is polyamorous, and therefore LGBTQ.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> He didn’t apologize.  He lied and said he should have made a different decision.  His only regret was getting caught.


That is an easily provable lie. How are you getting this bs now that people exercised their 1st Amendment right to kill Parler and Mein Pillow?


----------



## tjinaz

dad4 said:


> Maybe EOTL will like Trump better if you point out that he is polyamorous, and therefore LGBTQ.


Orange is a color of the Rainbow


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> Maybe EOTL will like Trump better if you point out that he is polyamorous, and therefore LGBTQ.


Speaking of ....Q, isn’t “queer” a derogatory term?  Or is it like the N-word?  Not offensive if certain people use it in a loving, jovial manner?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> That is an easily provable lie. How are you getting this bs now that people exercised their 1st Amendment right to kill Parler and Mein Pillow?


I listened to his stumbling, bumbling speech.  That’s how it’s provable.  I know all of his speeches are stumbling and bumbling but he first said it was outdoors.  Then again, it’s Gavin.  Same asshole that blamed his affair on alcohol, went to rehab and can be seen with a glass of wine at his “outdoor” dinner during the lockdown. 

You’re a clown show.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> I listened to his stumbling, bumbling speech.  That’s how it’s provable.  I know all of his speeches are stumbling and bumbling but he first said it was outdoors.  Then again, it’s Gavin.  Same asshole that blamed his affair on alcohol, went to rehab and can be seen with a glass of wine at his “outdoor” dinner during the lockdown.
> 
> You’re a clown show.


Thank goodness Gavin has kept you from killing more people for as long as he has.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Thank goodness Gavin has kept you from killing more people for as long as he has.


Your pal dined indo... uh, “outdoors”, without a mask.  He’s killed more people than I have.  Same way you’ve murdered a dozen threads here.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Your pal dined indo... uh, “outdoors”, without a mask.  He’s killed more people than I have.  Same way you’ve murdered a dozen threads here.


If you want an echo chamber of lies, Parler is your place.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> If you want an echo chamber of lies, Parler is your place.


hahaha...its so funny when you realize you are wrong because you just instantly go to insults and put downs rather than facts... maybe one time you could just admit you are wrong.  But then again you are like all the rest, dig yourself so deep in a hole you can't find your way out.  So instead of just coming clean you make it worse. Kinda like mask don't work, wait a minute, I lied, they do work, I just don't trust the people so I had to lie...kinda like that


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Yes, zero problems if you don’t count the problems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Popular MD Soccer tournament canceled after positive COVID case
> 
> 
> Montgomery Co. officials rescinded approval for the Bethesda Premier Cup boy's tournament after a player tested positive in the girl's tournament last weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you read the article it said that the player was sick prior to having played any games so the Covid infection was not the result of playing soccer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4 positive COVID cases tied to Potomac Soccer Association, health officials say
> 
> 
> Montgomery County Health Officer Dr. Travis Gayles confirmed that 35 individuals were asked to quarantine following contact tracing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This article does not specify if the 4 cases were the result of the game or because they were with each other in socially before or after the game.  It really doesn't say it they are on the same team or they played against each other.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 outbreak tied to soccer team in Montgomery County
> 
> 
> NORTH POTOMAC, Md. (WDVM) — Health officials confirmed at least 4 people tested positive for COVID-19 all linked to a youth soccer game in Montgomery County. The county was notified of the ou…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.localdvm.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/youth-sports-coronavirus/2020/11/26/ad41f2e8-29dd-11eb-9b14-ad872157ebc9_story.html


Grasping at straws again while taking liberty with the details.  Cue the name calling in 5, 4, 3, 2, ......


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Say hi to Grace Karen for me!
> 
> 440,000 people have died so far because too many people want to do the things they want to do, each of which is individually “low risk”, but when you add up all that selfishness and lack of empathy and self-discipline, you end up with 4,000 people dying every day. This is exacerbated by constant lying by people claiming there haven’t been any problems.
> 
> The reason we are here is because of people like you. Because you’ll never learn, you all get to pay the price for that until hopefully vaccines save us.


  - I guess the irony is lost on you that you,  out of all people are calling anyone a Karen.  I'm with you, it's likely that youth sports are the cause of 4000 deaths a day.  You are brilliant.

You also think that kids shouldn't be in school.  You are an ardent follower of science, I can tell.  But really, what I glean from your rhetoric is a deep sense of fear.  Which isn't even a bad thing, it's ok to be afraid, things can get scary.   


Nice job on not touching youth suicide though - maybe there is hope for you yet.


----------



## TOSDCI

dad4 said:


> Does anyone know whether the MD case was a four case cluster tied to a game, or a 4 case cluster tied to a group of friends on the same team?
> 
> It is one thing if this is 3 cases of transmission on the field.
> 
> If the four are best friends and carpool together, it tells us a lot less.


Exactly!  The details are not there.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> I keep forgetting how that’s so much worse than banging hookers while your wife is pregnant.  Both have a lot to do with the pandemic.


Yep, they are both dregs of society, next....I can see how you are blinded by partisan morals.


----------



## dawson

Per *Worldometer* today : For California 

*7 day* moving average on Jan 13, 2021 was * 44,087
7 day* moving average on Jan 26, 2021 was  *23,321*

And when you also consider these additional facts :

* A *high 8.2 *% of California's population have already has been infected per confirmed cases .The actual number is probably higher from
  people who had mild or no symptoms and never saw a doctor.
* There's been over 1/2 million *vaccine shots* already given and that should continue and increase significantly 

Seems like the *recent trend is pretty strong* and all things considered looks promising to continue.
Which should result in *restrictions* soon loosening up especially for most outdoor sports  .


----------



## soccersc

happy9 said:


> - I guess the irony is lost on you that you,  out of all people are calling anyone a Karen.  I'm with you, it's likely that youth sports are the cause of 4000 deaths a day.  You are brilliant.
> 
> You also think that kids shouldn't be in school.  You are an ardent follower of science, I can tell.  But really, what I glean from your rhetoric is a deep sense of fear.  Which isn't even a bad thing, it's ok to be afraid, things can get scary.
> 
> 
> Nice job on not touching youth suicide though - maybe there is hope for you yet.


I wonder if @EOTL gets tired of constantly being wrong and living a life of double standards.  You have to give it to him though, he is just like those he praises and follows!!!


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> Does anyone know whether the MD case was a four case cluster tied to a game, or a 4 case cluster tied to a group of friends on the same team?
> 
> It is one thing if this is 3 cases of transmission on the field.
> 
> If the four are best friends and carpool together, it tells us a lot less.


Yes, if we all pretended that players magically transported to the field and back, like all of you seem to be doing already, it would make a huge difference in the analysis.

There is no denying that youth sports is a big spreader of Covid, whether it is the inevitable carpooling, the dumbf**k magat dads hanging out together, the out of state trips, whatever. 

Claiming that an article does not identify the exact moment of transmission does not mean people can pretend that covid isn’t spread a. lot of different ways through youth sports.


----------



## EOTL

dawson said:


> Per *Worldometer* today : For California
> 
> *7 day* moving average on Jan 13, 2021 was * 44,087
> 7 day* moving average on Jan 26, 2021 was  *23,321*
> 
> And when you also consider these additional facts :
> 
> * A *high 8.2 *% of California's population have already has been infected per confirmed cases .The actual number is probably higher from
> people who had mild or no symptoms and never saw a doctor.
> * There's been over 1/2 million *vaccine shots* already given and that should continue and increase significantly
> 
> Seems like the *recent trend is pretty strong* and all things considered looks promising to continue.
> Which should result in *restrictions* soon loosening up especially for most outdoor sports  .


But the magats here think things are being loosened because Gavin the Gastronome is afraid of getting recalled, as opposed to the excellent job he is doing to get this outbreak under control despite the worst efforts of the trumpanzees.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> But the magats here think things are being loosened because Gavin the Gastronome is afraid of getting recalled, as opposed to the excellent job he is doing to get this outbreak under control despite the worst efforts of the trumpanzees.


Don't worry, your boy won't be around much longer. But lucky for you his replacement doesn't want YOU to pay any taxes so you gotta be all for that 









						Venture capitalist Chamath Palihapitiya eyes run for California governor
					

Palihapitiya is an early Facebook executive who went on to found a VC firm.




					www.axios.com


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Don't worry, your boy won't be around much longer. But lucky for you his replacement doesn't want YOU to pay any taxes so you gotta be all for that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Venture capitalist Chamath Palihapitiya eyes run for California governor
> 
> 
> Palihapitiya is an early Facebook executive who went on to found a VC firm.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.axios.com


Recalling Newsom does present wonderful opportunity for us libtards. Who’s the CA version of AOC?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Yes, if we all pretended that players magically transported to the field and back, like all of you seem to be doing already, it would make a huge difference in the analysis.
> 
> There is no denying that youth sports is a big spreader of Covid, whether it is the inevitable carpooling, the dumbf**k magat dads hanging out together, the out of state trips, whatever.
> 
> Claiming that an article does not identify the exact moment of transmission does not mean people can pretend that covid isn’t spread a. lot of different ways through youth sports.


I see plenty of science in your words - nice job.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> There is no denying that youth sports is a big spreader of Covid, whether it is the inevitable carpooling, the dumbf**k magat dads hanging out together, the out of state trips, whatever.


So you’re actually taking the position that “youth sports is a big spreader of Covid”? And that it is undeniable?  Please support your position. 

I mean, really support your position.... like with facts.  

Your assertions are about as valid as the magats that believe there was enough voter fraud to overturn an election.  Except, on an order of magnitude far greater.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Recalling Newsom does present wonderful opportunity for us libtards. Who’s the CA version of AOC?


Please, recruit as many candidates as possible... great political plan in a recall election.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> But the magats here think things are being loosened because Gavin the Gastronome is afraid of getting recalled, as opposed to the excellent job he is doing to get this outbreak under control despite the worst efforts of the trumpanzees.


So you’re telling us numbers in California are good enough to justify “loosening” up?


----------



## N00B

Scott m Shurson said:


> So you’re telling us numbers in California are good enough to justify “loosening” up?


Or that the infection rate has been so high, relatively speaking, that infection rate is declining?  Must be policy.


----------



## soccersc

N00B said:


> So you’re actually taking the position that “youth sports is a big spreader of Covid”? And that it is undeniable?  Please support your position.
> 
> I mean, really support your position.... like with facts.
> 
> Your assertions are about as valid as the magats that believe there was enough voter fraud to overturn an election.  Except, on an order of magnitude far greater.


@EOTL will ignore comments that make too much sense and then he quickly focuses on another topic that can detract from the fact that he doesn’t know what he is talking about. It’s funny though, because when you really get him going the more nonsense he speaks, showing his inability to admit truth and to fall further down the rabbit hole...once again, just like those he follows


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> @EOTL will ignore comments that make too much sense and then he quickly focuses on another topic that can detract from the fact that he doesn’t know what he is talking about. It’s funny though, because when you really get him going the more nonsense he speaks, showing his inability to admit truth and to fall further down the rabbit hole...once again, just like those he follows


Magat is so sad that his little girl can’t play soccer. He thinks nothing spreads Covid besides old people in their rest homes.

You can deny all you want, you still aren’t getting what you want. You really need to get back out to Target for more recall signatures. Dude will be financially ruined for sure. You are so going to teach him a lesson.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Magat is so sad that his little girl can’t play soccer. He thinks nothing spreads Covid besides old people in their rest homes.
> 
> You can deny all you want, you still aren’t getting what you want. You really need to get back out to Target for more recall signatures. Dude will be financially ruined for sure. You are so going to teach him a lesson.


Hahaha, you bring such joy to my day. You are like clock work, you make me look so good. I write down what you are going to do and just like that, bam, you do it. So predictable.


----------



## Savage

Can someone explain to me why the CA Blueprint metrics of positive rate and cases per 100K matter once we have our elderly citizens protected via the vaccines?

My concern is that the state will continue to use these ridiculously low positivity rate and cases per 100k threasholds to justify keeping us locked down.  Once the elderly are protected who cares about COVID?  And, I know there are other vulnerables but they can self-isolate, right?

I would rather see key metrics such as high hospitalizations be the key metric since that indicates that the risks are still substantial.


----------



## MARsSPEED

EOTL said:


> Yes, zero problems if you don’t count the problems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Popular MD Soccer tournament canceled after positive COVID case
> 
> 
> Montgomery Co. officials rescinded approval for the Bethesda Premier Cup boy's tournament after a player tested positive in the girl's tournament last weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4 positive COVID cases tied to Potomac Soccer Association, health officials say
> 
> 
> Montgomery County Health Officer Dr. Travis Gayles confirmed that 35 individuals were asked to quarantine following contact tracing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 outbreak tied to soccer team in Montgomery County
> 
> 
> NORTH POTOMAC, Md. (WDVM) — Health officials confirmed at least 4 people tested positive for COVID-19 all linked to a youth soccer game in Montgomery County. The county was notified of the ou…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.localdvm.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/youth-sports-coronavirus/2020/11/26/ad41f2e8-29dd-11eb-9b14-ad872157ebc9_story.html


"There has not been a single report of a CoVid outbreak from any youth tournament." 

That is what I said. All of your links have nothing to do with an outbreak at soccer tournaments dumbass. Absolutely fucking zero. 

I can't stand you. You don't even read what you post. Yeah, seeing how we live in Montgomery County, I'm going to know a little more than you on this.

"The Bethesda Premier Cup boy’s tournament was scheduled to take place this weekend at the Maryland SoccerPlex in Germantown. However, Montgomery County Health officials revealed Wednesday *ONE* player at the Bethesda Premier Cup Girl’s Tournament tested positive for the coronavirus after playing a game at the SoccerPlex last weekend." 

*One player.* FYI, that is not an outbreak you dumbfuck. Nor did it have to do with a tournament you dumbfuck. Nor was there any reports of an outbreak after. DUMBFUCK! Hey dumbfuck, I bet you didn't know that a family member tested positive which is why she was then tested and found to be positive. They didn't tell you that in your post did they??? 

The second story ironically involves a family we know at PSA. It was a teenager who was with his friends away from soccer at teen get togethers. These boys are all good friends and always together. Originally the plan was to shut down all of soccer in Montgomery County because of this case and then the facts came out. 

*FYI, that has nothing to do with soccer you dumbfuck.*

And then to top it off, you post a link to the exact same cases as your second link. DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN IT AGAIN????

*None of these have absolutely anything to do with soccer tournaments. NONE.

Again, let them play!!! Don't pieces of shit like @EOTL ruin it for all of you. It's people like him that post lies without even reading what they are posting, screwing it up for everyone. *

You should really go eat a ginormous dick sandwich. You are stupidest fucking person on this entire forum and I for one, am tired all of your bullshit.


----------



## Kicker4Life

N00B said:


> So you’re actually taking the position that “youth sports is a big spreader of Covid”? And that it is undeniable?  Please support your position.
> 
> I mean, really support your position.... like with facts.
> 
> Your assertions are about as valid as the magats that believe there was enough voter fraud to overturn an election.  Except, on an order of magnitude far greater.


Been waiting a little over 2 months for him to do that.....nothing but “do kids magically teleport to games magat?” Response.  Again, that’s how he concedes he’s lost...insults.


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> "There has not been a single report of a CoVid outbreak from any youth tournament."
> 
> That is what I said. All of your links have nothing to do with an outbreak at soccer tournaments dumbass. Absolutely fucking zero.
> 
> I can't stand you. You don't even read what you post. Yeah, seeing how we live in Montgomery County, I'm going to know a little more than you on this.
> 
> "The Bethesda Premier Cup boy’s tournament was scheduled to take place this weekend at the Maryland SoccerPlex in Germantown. However, Montgomery County Health officials revealed Wednesday *ONE* player at the Bethesda Premier Cup Girl’s Tournament tested positive for the coronavirus after playing a game at the SoccerPlex last weekend."
> 
> *One player.* FYI, that is not an outbreak you dumbfuck. Nor did it have to do with a tournament you dumbfuck. Nor was there any reports of an outbreak after. DUMBFUCK! Hey dumbfuck, I bet you didn't know that a family member tested positive which is why she was then tested and found to be positive. They didn't tell you that in your post did they???
> 
> The second story ironically involves a family we know at PSA. It was a teenager who was with his friends away from soccer at teen get togethers. These boys are all good friends and always together. Originally the plan was to shut down all of soccer in Montgomery County because of this case and then the facts came out.
> 
> *FYI, that has nothing to do with soccer you dumbfuck.*
> 
> And then to top it off, you post a link to the exact same cases as your second link. DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN IT AGAIN????
> 
> *None of these have absolutely anything to do with soccer tournaments. NONE.
> 
> Again, let them play!!! Don't pieces of shit like @EOTL ruin it for all of you. It's people like him that post lies without even reading what they are posting, screwing it up for everyone. *
> 
> You should really go eat a ginormous dick sandwich. You are stupidest fucking person on this entire forum and I for one, am tired all of your bullshit.


Why so mean to me Mr. Magat of Montgomery? The articles clearly relate to transmission because of youth soccer, including at a soccer tournament.

By your logic, if you know more about what is happening in MD because you live there, then I must know more about what is happening in CA. Either that or you’re just another idiot trumpanzee.


----------



## MARsSPEED

@EOTL is nothing but a little bitch who sits in front of CPU all day posting on forums. A horrible human being who is racist, uses religious slurs, an antitheist, who wishes harm and death among those who disagree with him. 

@EOTL is what an example of what a Left Wing Domestic Terrorist looks like. Make no mistake. He is no better than the terrible Right Wing Domestic Terrorists that invaded the Capitol Building. 

I might disagree with members like @Hüsker Dü or @espola among others but none of them show the blatant and ugly disrespect of @EOTL 

Just like Outlaw and others were banned from this site for their horrible racist and demeaning posts, EOTL should suffer the same for his awful derogatory, racist comments. SoCal would be a better forum there after. Again, many of us disagree, but for the most we remain civil with each, which is how it should be. 

I hope @Dominic does in fact read this. I've had enough!


----------



## Kicker4Life

MARsSPEED said:


> I hope @Dominic does in fact read this. I've had enough!


I believe he is either Dominic or on Don’s payroll to spark interaction and activity to drive up ad revenue. No other reason that he goes unchecked!


----------



## MARsSPEED

EOTL said:


> Why so mean to me Mr. Magat of Montgomery? The articles clearly relate to transmission because of youth soccer, including at a soccer tournament.
> 
> By your logic, if you know more about what is happening in MD because you live there, then I must know more about what is happening in CA. Either that or you’re just another idiot trumpanzee.


You didn't read the articles. I even just posted a quote from one of the articles for you. I'm sorry you don't believe me but these stories you posted directly affected my family and the club we are involved in, so yes, I do know the facts. Not WUSA 9. 

It's not like I am going to post any of the names of these individual or families that I ACTUALLY KNOW.


----------



## MARsSPEED

Kicker4Life said:


> I believe he is either Dominic or on Don’s payroll to spark interaction and activity to drive up ad revenue. No other reason that he goes unchecked!


I would hope that's not true but this is a private site so he can do what he feels is the right thing to do. Can't say I take any issue with that. But some things are obviously out of line.


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> @EOTL is nothing but a little bitch who sits in front of CPU all day posting on forums. A horrible human being who is racist, uses religious slurs, an antitheist, who wishes harm and death among those who disagree with him.
> 
> @EOTL is what an example of what a Left Wing Domestic Terrorist looks like. Make no mistake. He is no better than the terrible Right Wing Domestic Terrorists that invaded the Capitol Building.
> 
> I might disagree with members like @Hüsker Dü or @espola among others but none of them show the blatant and ugly disrespect of @EOTL
> 
> Just like Outlaw and others were banned from this site for their horrible racist and demeaning posts, EOTL should suffer the same for his awful derogatory, racist comments. SoCal would be a better forum there after. Again, many of us disagree, but for the most we remain civil with each, which is how it should be.
> 
> I hope @Dominic does in fact read this. I've had enough!


You can lie that I make racist comments all you want, but it’s still a lie. You can support blatant bigotry and transphobia all you want, but don’t expect people to let it slide.

All I did to you here is post articles refuting your assertion that there have been zero problems in MD.  It wasn’t mean-spirited, I didn’t call you a name. Go check it out. The next interaction between us was you calling me a dumbass, a dumbfuck a bunch of times, and a piece of shit. So I poked fun at you as Mr. Magat of Montgomery, which was pretty mild compared to your emotionally and expletively charged tirade.  You then you called me a little bitch, a horrible human being, etc. I would recommend a little self reflection.

If you want to be treated with dignity and respect, you should try doing it. When you aren’t, neither am I, and you can’t get under my skin no matter how offensive you get with me. Maybe you might also want to reign in your magat friends if you want to have civil conversation.

In the end, I get subjected to quite a bit of abuse despite the fact that the NCAA, the IOC, virtually every HS sports organization in America, the governor of the state of CA, the President od the United States and all the experts advising them all agree with me. It’s not my fault I cite evidence that you are wrong and you can’t handle it.


----------



## MARsSPEED

Kicker4Life said:


> I believe he is either Dominic or on Don’s payroll to spark interaction and activity to drive up ad revenue. No other reason that he goes unchecked!


LOL, just had a thought. Probably would be a load more traffic if..............................CA would Let them Play!!!


----------



## EOTL

EOTL said:


> You can lie that I make racist comments all you want, but it’s still a lie. You can support blatant bigotry and transphobia all you want, but don’t expect people to let it slide.
> 
> All I did to you here is post articles refuting your assertion that there have been zero problems in MD.  It wasn’t mean-spirited, I didn’t call you a name. Go check it out. The next interaction between us was you calling me a dumbass, a dumbfuck a bunch of times, and a piece of shit. So I poked fun at you as Mr. Magat of Montgomery, which was pretty mild compared to your emotionally and expletively charged tirade.  You then you called me a little bitch, a horrible human being, etc. I would recommend a little self reflection.
> 
> If you want to be treated with dignity and respect, you should try doing it. When you aren’t, neither am I, and you can’t get under my skin no matter how offensive you get with me. Maybe you might also want to reign in your magat friends if you want to have civil conversation.
> 
> In the end, I get subjected to quite a bit of abuse despite the fact that the NCAA, the IOC, virtually every HS sports organization in America, the governor of the state of CA, the President od the United States and all the experts advising them all agree with me. It’s not my fault I cite evidence that you are wrong and you can’t handle it.


Let me know when you’re ready to apologize for being mean to me @MARsSPEED.


----------



## crush

Kicker4Life said:


> I believe he is either Dominic or on Don’s payroll to spark interaction and activity to drive up ad revenue. No other reason that he goes unchecked!


Dom has been so kind to me over the years.  I can't imagine him making fun of me and my dd all the time.  I do see how my rants helped with ad revenue.  Also, Kicker vs Ellejustus drove up view ship as well as my talks with the great Maps.  It was fun going toe to toe with you and Lastman.  I swear it was to drive home the truth about socal soccer and all the dads and their egos.  I will miss it but all good things have to come to an end.  No way were coming back next year Kicker.  This is it.


----------



## MARsSPEED

EOTL said:


> You can lie that I make racist comments all you want, but it’s still a lie. You can support blatant bigotry and transphobia all you want, but don’t expect people to let it slide.
> 
> All I did to you here is post articles refuting your assertion that there have been zero problems in MD.  It wasn’t mean-spirited, I didn’t call you a name. Go check it out. The next interaction between us was you calling me a dumbass, a dumbfuck a bunch of times, and a piece of shit. So I poked fun at you as Mr. Magat of Montgomery, which was pretty mild compared to your emotionally and expletively charged tirade.  You then you called me a little bitch, a horrible human being, etc. I would recommend a little self reflection.
> 
> If you want to be treated with dignity and respect, you should try doing it. When you aren’t, neither am I, and you can’t get under my skin no matter how offensive you get with me. Maybe you might also want to reign in your magat friends if you want to have civil conversation.
> 
> In the end, I get subjected to quite a bit of abuse despite the fact that the NCAA, the IOC, virtually every HS sports organization in America, the governor of the state of CA, the President od the United States and all the experts advising them all agree with me. It’s not my fault I cite evidence that you are wrong and you can’t handle it.


Ugh, you have never been respectful to anyone who disagrees with you. You just resort to calling them one of your many Trump adjectives without knowing if they support Trump or not. And you also infer all conservatives are racist. It's called grouping a certain population together although they are different. Yes, it's not racism but it is still derogatory stereotyping or profiling. In my book, that's no different than anything you complain about.

As for Transgenders and Gays, I take 100% no issue with their choices. But, there is a scientific difference between male and female physicality that has absolutely nothing to do with inclusion. 

Peace. Out.


----------



## happy9

Cruzer said:


> You are in every post detracting.
> You are seriously off your rocker.
> You need help.


Don't mind him - he's your local confused and misguided trump fan, overcompensating for the whole of 2020. He has to adjust his cape every once in a while.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> *Sorry not sorry *to get in the way of your fact free zone.  It is understandable that we are seeing an uptick in magats here given that people and companies exercised their 1st Amendment right to take down Parler.


Who even says that out loud? Now I know for sure you don't even ball bruh....any kind of ball - ping pong, foosball, wiffle ball...


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> Ugh, you have never been respectful to anyone who disagrees with you. You just resort to calling them one of your many Trump adjectives without knowing if they support Trump or not. And you also infer all conservatives are racist. It's called grouping a certain population together although they are different. Yes, it's not racism but it is still derogatory stereotyping or profiling. In my book, that's no different than anything you complain about.
> 
> As for Transgenders and Gays, I take 100% no issue with their choices. But, there is a scientific difference between male and female physicality that has absolutely nothing to do with inclusion.
> 
> Peace. Out.


Let’s parse this out.

*Ugh, you have never been respectful to anyone who disagrees with you*. No, just people who have been disrespectful to me or others.  I’ve even apologized when I got someone confused with another poster. In fact, you should go back at read my support of the one guy who was able to state his opposition to transgender athletes without being an offensive jerk.  Certainly, I will up the animosity level to prove the point about how inappropriate it is.  Some get it, some don’t.

*You just resort to calling them one of your many Trump adjectives without knowing if they support Trump or not*. Yes, that is true sometimes.  As much fun as it is to be called a libtard all the time, I think it is appropriate to pay a similar amount of respect in return. If you have a problem with these characterizations, don’t call me names. Even better, by all means convince your buddies to reign it in so I can stop having to teach y’all what is inappropriate behavior by way of example. I’ve made it pretty clear why I do that, yet here I am doing it again.

*And you also infer all conservatives are racist. *Nope, never done that. I honestly think you believe that, but it’s a lie.

*It's called grouping a certain population together although they are different. Yes, it's not racism but it is still derogatory stereotyping or profiling. In my book, that's no different than anything you complain about.* Too bad. Calling out bigots is not bigotry,  Nazis are not a group deserving of respect. Nor are white supremacists, nor homophobes, nor racists, nor transphobes. They are only “groups” based on their shared hate of others. That shared connection does not deserve protection, or even respect.  Even assuming for the sake of argument that not wanting transgender athletes to play isn’t transphobic, go back and look at what I said.  I actually supported the one person who was able to present that argument in a non-pejorative or offensive manner. Where were you when you’re buddy Scotty boy was making one awful slur after the next, by the way?  Why are you focusing in me?

*As for Transgenders and Gays, I take 100% no issue with their choices. But, there is a scientific difference between male and female physicality that has absolutely nothing to do with inclusion.* You just can’t help yourself can you? There are also many legitimate reasons for allowing transgender athletes. I get that reasonable minds may differ about which ones outweigh the others, but we can’t have that conversation until you recognize they exist and they are legitimate. And since all but the one person can’t do that, they get the lack of respect they deserve.

*Peace. Out. *Did I just get canceled by someone who whines about cancel culture? Gosh, maybe you learned something.


----------



## Soccerfan2

If you all could just refrain from responding to him that would also improve the forum


----------



## crush

happy9 said:


> Who even says that out loud? Now I know for sure you don't even ball bruh....any kind of ball - ping pong, foosball, wiffle ball...


Happy, EOTL play no ball of any kind, no way he did and he has no kids so it's odd he came here to attack me and my dd.  BTW, I had the best dam whiffle ball field ever at my house in Fullerton back in 85' and 86'.   Better then this guys ((see attached youtube video bro)).  Mine was custom and was pure sport   It was so much fun. I played at Troy HS my senior year and all the fellas came over to my back yard for the most fun ever.  I had a pool too so we partied hard.  I had the nastiest knuckleball and then a sweeping whiffle curve that was insane and no one could hit.


----------



## dad4

MARsSPEED said:


> "There has not been a single report of a CoVid outbreak from any youth tournament."
> 
> That is what I said. All of your links have nothing to do with an outbreak at soccer tournaments dumbass. Absolutely fucking zero.
> 
> I can't stand you. You don't even read what you post. Yeah, seeing how we live in Montgomery County, I'm going to know a little more than you on this.
> 
> "The Bethesda Premier Cup boy’s tournament was scheduled to take place this weekend at the Maryland SoccerPlex in Germantown. However, Montgomery County Health officials revealed Wednesday *ONE* player at the Bethesda Premier Cup Girl’s Tournament tested positive for the coronavirus after playing a game at the SoccerPlex last weekend."
> 
> *One player.* FYI, that is not an outbreak you dumbfuck. Nor did it have to do with a tournament you dumbfuck. Nor was there any reports of an outbreak after. DUMBFUCK! Hey dumbfuck, I bet you didn't know that a family member tested positive which is why she was then tested and found to be positive. They didn't tell you that in your post did they???
> 
> The second story ironically involves a family we know at PSA. It was a teenager who was with his friends away from soccer at teen get togethers. These boys are all good friends and always together. Originally the plan was to shut down all of soccer in Montgomery County because of this case and then the facts came out.
> 
> *FYI, that has nothing to do with soccer you dumbfuck.*
> 
> And then to top it off, you post a link to the exact same cases as your second link. DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN IT AGAIN????
> 
> *None of these have absolutely anything to do with soccer tournaments. NONE.
> 
> Again, let them play!!! Don't pieces of shit like @EOTL ruin it for all of you. It's people like him that post lies without even reading what they are posting, screwing it up for everyone. *
> 
> You should really go eat a ginormous dick sandwich. You are stupidest fucking person on this entire forum and I for one, am tired all of your bullshit.


Thank you for clarifying the specifics of the cases.  It was helpful.


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> Ugh, you have never been respectful to anyone who disagrees with you. You just resort to calling them one of your many Trump adjectives without knowing if they support Trump or not. And you also infer all conservatives are racist. It's called grouping a certain population together although they are different. Yes, it's not racism but it is still derogatory stereotyping or profiling. In my book, that's no different than anything you complain about.
> 
> As for Transgenders and Gays, I take 100% no issue with their choices. But, there is a scientific difference between male and female physicality that has absolutely nothing to do with inclusion.
> 
> Peace. Out.


So no apology then?  Suit yourself.


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> Happy, EOTL play no ball of any kind, no way he did and he has no kids so it's odd he came here to attack me and my dd.  BTW, I had the best dam whiffle ball field ever at my house in Fullerton back in 85' and 86'.   Better then this guys ((see attached youtube video bro)).  Mine was custom and was pure sport   It was so much fun. I played at Troy HS my senior year and all the fellas came over to my back yard for the most fun ever.  I had a pool too so we partied hard.  I had the nastiest knuckleball and then a sweeping whiffle curve that was insane and no one could hit.


Are you sure you want to do this?


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> Are you sure you want to do this?


I'm just playing around.  Carry on.  I'm not your type anymore so keep going after Happy and Mars.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

Soccerfan2 said:


> If you all could just refrain from responding to him that would also improve the forum


It's not even "him". It's a single "persona" of many that he has on this board. Husker, thelonggame, eotl, notintheface. He even has several other innocuous ones that "upvote" the primary idiots' posts. Pathetic, but at the same time, pretty damn funny.


----------



## happy9

Soccerfan2 said:


> If you all could just refrain from responding to him that would also improve the forum


That would be the adult thing to do.  He's just too easy of a target.  Let's start tonight ---I'll take the DD to practice, go for a run, then do some work.  Refrain


kickingandscreaming said:


> It's not even "him". It's a single "persona" of many that he has on this board. Husker, thelonggame, eotl, notintheface. He even has several other innocuous ones that "upvote" the primary idiots' posts. Pathetic, but at the same time, pretty damn funny.


It is pretty funny, in a sad kinda way.  Provides for limited intellectual engagement from time to time.


----------



## crush

kickingandscreaming said:


> It's not even "him". It's a single "persona" of many that he has on this board. Husker, thelonggame, eotl, notintheface. He even has several other innocuous ones that "upvote" the primary idiots' posts. Pathetic, but at the same time, pretty damn funny.


I find it quite remarkable.  He is getting on Mars hard and Mars comes back with some strong takes as well.  Of course Happy is not happy with EOTL. Scott is not having any of this EOTL guy.  Grace can hold her own and then good ole Dad comes and plays math with all of us.  Another horrible day of club soccer, what else is new.


----------



## MARsSPEED

Good Morning West Coasters!10-4 on the recommendations! 

Good news! New infections are currently starting to take a hard nose dive. Deaths will obviously lag behind but that should start to follow the nose dive.

I would say that close to most states are now following the new (or the standard standard) PCR Concentration values at 20x rather than 40x. 20x is the value that has been used for the Flu for many years now. This is why we are seeing infections drop all of a sudden. The standard was put in place about a week ago. We are still in the dead of winter so not much should really change.

Fauci is saying he expects 90k CoVid Deaths for the month of February but in my opinion I think that is intended for worst case scenario. I think we will average less than 2k a day that pass who have been tested CoVid positive. 

Regardless, pending how today goes, we could see the lowest 5 day average since mid-November.

Have a great day!


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

MARsSPEED said:


> Good Morning West Coasters!10-4 on the recommendations!
> 
> Good news! New infections are currently starting to take a hard nose dive. Deaths will obviously lag behind but that should start to follow the nose dive.
> 
> I would say that close to most states are now following the new (or the standard standard) PCR Concentration values at 20x rather than 40x. 20x is the value that has been used for the Flu for many years now. This is why we are seeing infections drop all of a sudden. The standard was put in place about a week ago. We are still in the dead of winter so not much should really change.
> 
> Fauci is saying he expects 90k CoVid Deaths for the month of February but in my opinion I think that is intended for worst case scenario. I think we will average less than 2k a day that pass who have been tested CoVid positive.
> 
> Regardless, pending how today goes, we could see the lowest 5 day average since mid-November.
> 
> Have a great day!


Positivity rate is going down significantly and should be under 10% in Socal by next week.   The problem is that according to this dictator, to play soccer we need to be at a positivity rate of under 2%.  That has yet to happen in 1 year.    It's time for SCDSL and CalSouth to just break the rules or at least allow teams to scrimmage if they can find any facility.   It's ridiculous to think that 45 tates follow the science but Newsome has his own group of scientist.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Recalling Newsom does present wonderful opportunity for us libtards. Who’s the CA version of AOC?


Have you tried www.pickadumbbartender.com ?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

happy9 said:


> Who even says that out loud? Now I know for sure you don't even ball bruh....any kind of ball - ping pong, foosball, wiffle ball...


I beg to differ.  I guarantee you he’s hiding balls.


----------



## Desert Hound

"Most telling from the CDC/NFL paper was the fact that, according to Dr. Allen Sills, the NFL’s chief medical officer, “We have not seen any evidence of on-field transmission in NFL games or practices.” Dr. Sills added,"









						CDC/NFL Publish Revealing Wuhan Virus Paper
					

Multiple outlets have recently reported on a new “scientific paper” published by the CDC in partnership with the NFL. The paper was authored by “medical experts” from both the NFL and the NFL Players Association. The paper det...




					www.americanthinker.com


----------



## NorCalDad

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Positivity rate is going down significantly and should be under 10% in Socal by next week.   The problem is that according to this dictator, to play soccer we need to be at a positivity rate of under 2%.  That has yet to happen in 1 year.    It's time for SCDSL and CalSouth to just break the rules or at least allow teams to scrimmage if they can find any facility.   It's ridiculous to think that 45 tates follow the science but Newsome has his own group of scientist.


Is 2% correct?  I thought it was below 5% to get into the orange tier.  Pretty sure we will get to orange tier by mid to late Feb -- game on in March.

I will lose my shit if they require kids to wear masks while they play though.


----------



## watfly

NorCalDad said:


> Is 2% correct?  I thought it was below 5% to get into the orange tier.  Pretty sure we will get to orange tier by mid to late Feb -- game on in March.
> 
> I will lose my shit if they require kids to wear masks while they play though.


From what I've seen Orange is <5% and Yellow is <2%.

SD County has dropped from 70 cases per to 50 cases per in the last couple weeks.  Positivity rate is 12%.  ICU capacity 15%.  We still have a lot of ground to cover.  Not sure why this third wave has hit us so hard.  Start to finish we are doing much better than most large counties, particularly considering we're the largest border town.


----------



## dad4

NorCalDad said:


> Is 2% correct?  I thought it was below 5% to get into the orange tier.  Pretty sure we will get to orange tier by mid to late Feb -- game on in March.
> 
> I will lose my shit if they require kids to wear masks while they play though.


The new SCC order specifies masks for everything but water sports.

Doesn’t matter.  If we get to games in March, I’m happy.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

dad4 said:


> The new SCC order specifies masks for everything but water sports.
> 
> Doesn’t matter.  If we get to games in March, I’m happy.


A low bar is the key to happiness.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

kickingandscreaming said:


> A low bar is the key to happiness.


Backed by "science".

The key factor that explains this, and that differentiates Danes from Swedes and Finns, seems to be that Danes have consistently low (and realistic) expectations for the year to come.









						Why Are Danes The World's Happiest Nation?
					

Earlier this year, Denmark came top in a world map of happiness (the UK ranked 41st out of 178 nations). And for more than 30 years it has ranked first in European satisfaction surveys. So what makes Danes so content? Researchers in this week's Christmas issue of the British Medical Journal...



					www.sciencedaily.com


----------



## NorCalDad

dad4 said:


> The new SCC order specifies masks for everything but water sports.
> 
> Doesn’t matter.  If we get to games in March, I’m happy.


Obviously will take what we can get, but that rule absolutely has no science behind it.


----------



## happy9

NorCalDad said:


> Obviously will take what we can get, but that rule absolutely has no science behind it.


No science at all. 

 HS sports in AZ are requiring kids to be masked masks practice during games.  My oldest is now on soccer game #5 with a mask.  Some complaining, but not much.  The complaining centers around the annoyance of the mask not staying on.  I think we fixed the issue.  He's motivated to play his last year of HS, as many others are.  

The petition issue now is that parents are not allowed to travel to away games.  The rules that are plucked out of thin  without a logical assessment is silly.  Soccer games don't pack them in, plenty of room to have parents space out.  But parent attendance at home games are fine?  I guess the away stands are broken?  The logic applied by burokrats is mind boggling. 

Club soccer doesn't require masks


----------



## EOTL

Desert Hound said:


> "Most telling from the CDC/NFL paper was the fact that, according to Dr. Allen Sills, the NFL’s chief medical officer, “We have not seen any evidence of on-field transmission in NFL games or practices.” Dr. Sills added,"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CDC/NFL Publish Revealing Wuhan Virus Paper
> 
> 
> Multiple outlets have recently reported on a new “scientific paper” published by the CDC in partnership with the NFL. The paper was authored by “medical experts” from both the NFL and the NFL Players Association. The paper det...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.americanthinker.com


That’s what the porn industry said about STDs. The NFL is lying to you. 









						The virus' toll: How 32 NFL teams have been hit by COVID-19
					

The NFL has seen major COVID-19 outbreaks for the Titans and Ravens. Big stars and coaches have been stricken by the disease. There have been plenty of scheduling adjustments. Here’s a look at how each team has been affected by the coronavirus.




					apnews.com
				












						Decoding an Outbreak: How Covid-19 Ripped through the Baltimore Ravens
					

The NFL is using genomic sequencing to map out how coronavirus is spreading through its teams.




					www.wsj.com
				












						NFL fines Baltimore Ravens $250,000 for COVID-19 violations
					

The NFL fined the Ravens $250,000 for the team's COVID-19 violations. Baltimore was not docked a draft pick, however.




					www.nfl.com


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> That’s what the porn industry said about STDs. The NFL is lying to you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The virus' toll: How 32 NFL teams have been hit by COVID-19
> 
> 
> The NFL has seen major COVID-19 outbreaks for the Titans and Ravens. Big stars and coaches have been stricken by the disease. There have been plenty of scheduling adjustments. Here’s a look at how each team has been affected by the coronavirus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Decoding an Outbreak: How Covid-19 Ripped through the Baltimore Ravens
> 
> 
> The NFL is using genomic sequencing to map out how coronavirus is spreading through its teams.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wsj.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NFL fines Baltimore Ravens $250,000 for COVID-19 violations
> 
> 
> The NFL fined the Ravens $250,000 for the team's COVID-19 violations. Baltimore was not docked a draft pick, however.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nfl.com


The CDC, those liars....


----------



## Glitterhater

Scott m Shurson said:


> Speaking of ....Q, isn’t “queer” a derogatory term?  Or is it like the N-word?  Not offensive if certain people use it in a loving, jovial manner?


I can't believe I'm inserting myself here, but it sounds like at least right now, that is the preferred term. I seem to recall a time when it was not, (as you said.)


----------



## Glitterhater

NorCalDad said:


> Is 2% correct?  I thought it was below 5% to get into the orange tier.  Pretty sure we will get to orange tier by mid to late Feb -- game on in March.
> 
> I will lose my shit if they require kids to wear masks while they play though.


I understand that some athletes have done this and it doesn't bother them- buuut, it does bother quite a few!!! A teammate of my daughters gets panic attacks when she tries, it's awful. I hope they don't require them either, would make no sense.


----------



## Grace T.

Glitterhater said:


> I understand that some athletes have done this and it doesn't bother them- buuut, it does bother quite a few!!! A teammate of my daughters gets panic attacks when she tries, it's awful. I hope they don't require them either, would make no sense.


They are now talking about how every one needs to wear 3-4 masks even when after vaccinated, so it wouldn't surprise me if they require athletes to wear at least 2.  J/K....sort of.....









						What do coronavirus variants mean for your masks?
					

Experts say masks remain incredibly important — and that means making sure you have one that fits well and offers adequate protection.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## Glitterhater

Grace T. said:


> They are now talking about how every one needs to wear 3-4 masks even when after vaccinated, so it wouldn't surprise me if they require athletes to wear at least 2.  J/K....sort of.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do coronavirus variants mean for your masks?
> 
> 
> Experts say masks remain incredibly important — and that means making sure you have one that fits well and offers adequate protection.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com


Pretty soon they are going to ask us to tie plastic bags on our heads!


----------



## EOTL

Glitterhater said:


> Pretty soon they are going to ask us to tie plastic bags on our heads!


Honestly, if more magats would do this, most of our problems would be solved.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Honestly, if more magats would do this, most of our problems would be solved.


And if your dad would’ve just worn a condom this forum would’ve been a lot more enjoyable place to be!


----------



## Anon9

Kicker4Life said:


> And if your dad would’ve just worn a condom this form would’ve been a lot more enjoyable place to be!


Or if his mom would have swallowed him!


----------



## NorCalDad

Glitterhater said:


> I understand that some athletes have done this and it doesn't bother them- buuut, it does bother quite a few!!! A teammate of my daughters gets panic attacks when she tries, it's awful. I hope they don't require them either, would make no sense.


I went biking the other day up some steep climbs. I've got the covid-19lbs...so I was a bit winded. Plus it was surprisingly hot that day. Nonetheless, the neck gator absolutely had an impact on me. And as @dad4, rightfully pointed out elsewhere, if the air is blocked by the mask, it will just find its way out around the nose or somewhere else. 

Don't get me wrong, I believe in masks when it comes to indoor activities or areas where you can't socially distance and are standing next to people for an extended period of time.  There is science there.


----------



## Desert Hound

NorCalDad said:


> I went biking the other day up some steep climbs. I've got the covid-19lbs...so I was a bit winded. Plus it was surprisingly hot that day. Nonetheless, the neck gator absolutely had an impact on me. And as @dad4, rightfully pointed out elsewhere, if the air is blocked by the mask, it will just find its way out around the nose or somewhere else.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I believe in masks when it comes to indoor activities or areas where you can't socially distance and are standing next to people for an extended period of time.  There is science there.


The NFL/CDC just came out with a study looking at covid and NFL games. They found no instance of transmission during games.

At some point enough is enough. If you aren't catching on the field tackling people, you aren't getting it playing soccer, basketball, volleyball, etc.


----------



## Glitterhater

Desert Hound said:


> The NFL/CDC just came out with a study looking at covid and NFL games. They found no instance of transmission during games.
> 
> At some point enough is enough. If you aren't catching on the field tackling people, you aren't getting it playing soccer, basketball, volleyball, etc.


There was a basketball tournament in the news last fall that alledgedly caused an outbreak. However, basketball is indoors, and people are sitting in close quarters, maybe even eating, (this place has a snack bar,) and probably carpooling, (which is definitely more risky.) I wish they wouldn't spin it as "the tournament had an outbreak..."!


----------



## Soccer Bum 06

happy9 said:


> No science at all.
> 
> HS sports in AZ are requiring kids to be masked masks practice during games.  My oldest is now on soccer game #5 with a mask.  Some complaining, but not much.  The complaining centers around the annoyance of the mask not staying on.  I think we fixed the issue.  He's motivated to play his last year of HS, as many others are.
> 
> The petition issue now is that parents are not allowed to travel to away games.  The rules that are plucked out of thin  without a logical assessment is silly.  Soccer games don't pack them in, plenty of room to have parents space out.  But parent attendance at home games are fine?  I guess the away stands are broken?  The logic applied by burokrats is mind boggling.
> 
> Club soccer doesn't require masks


Sounds like your school boards, union and associations have been taken over by leftists idiots like California. The rules for Covid driven by the left for the most part are not based in science.


----------



## happy9

Soccer Bum 06 said:


> Sounds like your school boards, union and associations have been taken over by leftists idiots like California. The rules for Covid driven by the left for the most part are not based in science.


It's not ideal but at least they are playing.  Originally they had cancelled the season, with little to no science to back it up.  After significant public pushback, they reversed course.  The compromise was masks on the field and parents at home games only.  

I agree with zero of it.


----------



## dad4

Not sure why we are arguing about whether kids wear masks during games.  Whether we agree or not, there is nothing we can do.

In CA, the remaining issue is when we have games, and how best to organize games within the restrictions.  No tournaments and same/neighboring county makes it more difficult.


----------



## Glitterhater

dad4 said:


> Not sure why we are arguing about whether kids wear masks during games.  Whether we agree or not, there is nothing we can do.
> 
> In CA, the remaining issue is when we have games, and how best to organize games within the restrictions.  No tournaments and same/neighboring county makes it more difficult.


So we are supposed to be going out of state 1x a month for 3 months in a row, (starting in March.) 
I would much rather be restricted to local league play if it meant not such a large travel expense.


----------



## dad4

Glitterhater said:


> So we are supposed to be going out of state 1x a month for 3 months in a row, (starting in March.)
> I would much rather be restricted to local league play if it meant not such a large travel expense.


Do clubs even have that option?  I thought the state rules said no tournaments, no out of state travel.

To me, now is the time to get planning for league play.


----------



## Glitterhater

dad4 said:


> Do clubs even have that option?  I thought the state rules said no tournaments, no out of state travel.
> 
> To me, now is the time to get planning for league play.


I should have emphasized "supposed to"  

And I 100% agree.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Do clubs even have that option?  I thought the state rules said no tournaments, no out of state travel.
> 
> To me, now is the time to get planning for league play.


Yeah, I can tell you on the water polo and basketball fronts at least, lots of clubs are saying F it and going anyway.  There don't seem to be any sanctions from any of their parents orgs and from the postings on FB little fear of getting caught.


----------



## chiefs

Grace T. said:


> Yeah, I can tell you on the water polo and basketball fronts at least, lots of clubs are saying F it and going anyway.  There don't seem to be any sanctions from any of their parents orgs and from the postings on FB little fear of getting caught.











						Parents Sue Gavin Newsom over Youth Sports Restrictions
					

On January 28th a lawsuit was filed in San Diego Superior Court asking for all High School and youth sports to begin. Defendants include Governor Gavin Newsom, CDPH and local health officials. The …




					daygofootball.com


----------



## MARsSPEED

Wanted to post a contrast of States once again for you guys.

I live in Montgomery County, MD. Montgomery County is Democratic. Maryland is considered a Blue state although we have a Republican Governer. Policies are set forth by each county. Anne Arundel and Frederick Counties have the toughest regulations on youth sports currently. 

Restaurants were running at 75% Capacity up until Thanksgiving and are now at 50%. 

As for youth sports as a whole, everything outdoors except football are practicing and playing games. Even some indoor events are allowed (5v5, etc). No basketball is being played. This has pretty much been the case since last June.

As for masks, we had a couple weeks that kid had to wear masks while playing. It didn't last as it was found to be unhealthy by some counties in Maryland.

I would call Maryland's CoVid policy relaxed as compared to Pennsylvania and California. What has been pushed is wearing masks everywhere with the exception of physical activity. 

Now this is what is interesting...Maryland has the 5th highest density of persons per square mile of all 50 states however *Maryland is 44th out of 50 in CoVid cases per Million.* I really hope some of these states start looking at what is different for cases per million and what type of policies are different. Youth soccer games allowed including 11v11. Only one parent allowed per player at games. No masks while playing.

To make a closer comparison to California, *Florida* (and we all know about Florida's CoVid Policies) ranks 8th in population density and *30th out of 50 in CoVid cases per million. *That is actually pretty impressive for a State that has mostly remained open, similar to Maryland. Youth soccer games are allowed, even 11v11. More than one parent allowed. No masks while playing. 

And for those that are curious, California ranks 11th in population density and is *24th* *in CoVid cases per million *with some of the toughest policies in place. California also has the worse numbers of the "Big 3". Youth soccer games not allowed. 

Now, to play advocate for for tougher policies, New York, known to have the toughest, does beat both Florida and California in this metric.

In conclusion, from what I see, I think Maryland is the "Happy" medium here both with tough vs open policy and in youth sports. Outdoor youth sports with little physical contact does not spread CoVid and I think it's obvious at this point. 

Take it for what it's worth.


----------



## happy9

Glitterhater said:


> So we are supposed to be going out of state 1x a month for 3 months in a row, (starting in March.)
> I would much rather be restricted to local league play if it meant not such a large travel expense.


CA teams will be in AZ this weekend, at the Barca facility in Casa Grande playing against each other.  I don't know who, how many etc.  My source is pretty reliable, just terrible with the details.

We complain about driving that far to play against against local clubs, can't imagine driving from SOCAL to play a team down the street.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

dad4 said:


> Not sure why we are arguing about whether kids wear masks during games.  Whether we agree or not, there is nothing we can do.
> 
> In CA, the remaining issue is when we have games, and how best to organize games within the restrictions.  No tournaments and same/neighboring county makes it more difficult.


The irony of this is that in CA there are many soccer (or lacrosse) games without masks going on at parks where teams normally train, but if you have a uniform and a coach, your club could get in trouble. In fact, I haven't seen a single game at the park where the participants were wearing masks. Lots of jumping through hoops restrictions applied to organized sports for zero gain on any level. This type of "leadership" is just virtue signaling. And again, there is the myopic view that somehow, whatever they do when they aren't playing organized sports is a lower risk than participation in the sport. If it's not, we get further from the end of the virus.


----------



## happy9

kickingandscreaming said:


> The irony of this is that in CA there are many soccer (or lacrosse) games without masks going on at parks where teams normally train, but if you have a uniform and a coach, your club could get in trouble. In fact, I haven't seen a single game at the park where the participants were wearing masks. Lots of jumping through hoops restrictions applied to organized sports for zero gain on any level. This type of "leadership" is just virtue signaling. And again, there is the myopic view that somehow, whatever they do when they aren't playing organized sports is a lower risk than participation in the sport. If it's not, we get further from the end of the virus.


95% of governing is virtue signaling and pencil whipping, and that's during "normal" periods.  Throw in a pandemic, when burokrats need to bring their A game, the virtue signaling gets worse.

We will see how many CA teams show up in AZ for the Presidents Day Tournament.  It usually attracts 400+ teams from all over the country and England, with plenty of coaches in attendance.  This year likely looking at 300 or less and without City of Phoenix fields.  

Hopefully you guys sort this out soon and can get back to some semblance of normality.


----------



## dad4

MARsSPEED said:


> Wanted to post a contrast of States once again for you guys.
> 
> I live in Montgomery County, MD. Montgomery County is Democratic. Maryland is considered a Blue state although we have a Republican Governer. Policies are set forth by each county. Anne Arundel and Frederick Counties have the toughest regulations on youth sports currently.
> 
> Restaurants were running at 75% Capacity up until Thanksgiving and are now at 50%.
> 
> As for youth sports as a whole, everything outdoors except football are practicing and playing games. Even some indoor events are allowed (5v5, etc). No basketball is being played. This has pretty much been the case since last June.
> 
> As for masks, we had a couple weeks that kid had to wear masks while playing. It didn't last as it was found to be unhealthy by some counties in Maryland.
> 
> I would call Maryland's CoVid policy relaxed as compared to Pennsylvania and California. What has been pushed is wearing masks everywhere with the exception of physical activity.
> 
> Now this is what is interesting...Maryland has the 5th highest density of persons per square mile of all 50 states however *Maryland is 44th out of 50 in CoVid cases per Million.* I really hope some of these states start looking at what is different for cases per million and what type of policies are different. Youth soccer games allowed including 11v11. Only one parent allowed per player at games. No masks while playing.
> 
> To make a closer comparison to California, *Florida* (and we all know about Florida's CoVid Policies) ranks 8th in population density and *30th out of 50 in CoVid cases per million. *That is actually pretty impressive for a State that has mostly remained open, similar to Maryland. Youth soccer games are allowed, even 11v11. More than one parent allowed. No masks while playing.
> 
> And for those that are curious, California ranks 11th in population density and is *24th* *in CoVid cases per million *with some of the toughest policies in place. California also has the worse numbers of the "Big 3". Youth soccer games not allowed.
> 
> Now, to play advocate for for tougher policies, New York, known to have the toughest, does beat both Florida and California in this metric.
> 
> In conclusion, from what I see, I think Maryland is the "Happy" medium here both with tough vs open policy and in youth sports. Outdoor youth sports with little physical contact does not spread CoVid and I think it's obvious at this point.
> 
> Take it for what it's worth.


The biggest difference between MD and CA may be housing.

Our low income residents live 2 or 3 to a room.  We don't give them any choice.  Most cities are very restrictive about construction.

Baltimore has an excess of housing stock.  I would bet not many people there try to cram 6 people into a one bedroom. 

That may result in our in home clusters infecting more people than your in home clusters.


----------



## NorCalDad

dad4 said:


> Not sure why we are arguing about whether kids wear masks during games.  Whether we agree or not, there is nothing we can do.
> 
> In CA, the remaining issue is when we have games, and how best to organize games within the restrictions.  No tournaments and same/neighboring county makes it more difficult.


Arguing for the same reason we argue anything on these boards. But jeez you have a defeatist attitude here  

NorCal has already communicated they're read to roll whether it's intra-county or beyond.  Not sure how that would all play out, but considering teams self schedule, and clubs provide refs and fields, I'm not sure what there really is to do.  Probably all backend work.  Honestly I will just be stoked if our kids can have normal practices and scrimmage intra-club.


----------



## NorCalDad

kickingandscreaming said:


> The irony of this is that in CA there are many soccer (or lacrosse) games without masks going on at parks where teams normally train, but if you have a uniform and a coach, your club could get in trouble. In fact, I haven't seen a single game at the park where the participants were wearing masks. Lots of jumping through hoops restrictions applied to organized sports for zero gain on any level. This type of "leadership" is just virtue signaling. And again, there is the myopic view that somehow, whatever they do when they aren't playing organized sports is a lower risk than participation in the sport. If it's not, we get further from the end of the virus.


100% this!

Rules only work if people follow them.  You will have much better success getting large groups of people to follow rules if you make them as least restrictive as possible and backed by science.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

NorCalDad said:


> least restrictive as possible and backed by science.


Isn't this the correct path for a democratic society to take, anytime? We seem to have lost the first idea and bastardized the second.


----------



## NorCalDad

kickingandscreaming said:


> Isn't this the correct path for a democratic society to take, anytime? We seem to have lost the first idea and bastardized the second.


Yeah not sure what happened.  I mean the retrospectives in pretty much every area of academia is going to spawn thousands of Ph.D. thesis papers.  The completely disjointed public policy from the previous administration all the way down to local municipalities has been abhorrent.  From Trump and all his cronies downplaying the virus, to Fauci doing the media circuit like he's a rock star, to all the fake scientific "journalism", to Newsom dining at the French Laundry.....just a disgrace the whole thing.  And we wonder why people aren't following the rules?  We don't know our arse from our elbow. 

Honestly, I'm probably mostly upset at this because our family is a bunch of boring rule followers. We know people scrimmaging, breaking the rules, etc. It's really forced me to challenge my moral compass. I know deep down the rules have no grounding in science/data, so I can't be mad at them. At the same time we want to teach our kids that it's important to follow the rules. So damn frustrating.


----------



## Grace T.

NorCalDad said:


> Yeah not sure what happened.  I mean the retrospectives in pretty much every area of academia is going to spawn thousands of Ph.D. thesis papers.  The completely disjointed public policy from the previous administration all the way down to local municipalities has been abhorrent.  From Trump and all his cronies downplaying the virus, to Fauci doing the media circuit like he's a rock star, to all the fake scientific "journalism", to Newsom dining at the French Laundry.....just a disgrace the whole thing.  And we wonder why people aren't following the rules?  We don't know our arse from our elbow.
> 
> Honestly, I'm probably mostly upset at this because our family is a bunch of boring rule followers. We know people scrimmaging, breaking the rules, etc. It's really forced me to challenge my moral compass. I know deep down the rules have no grounding in science/data, so I can't be mad at them.At the same time we want to teach our kids that it's important to follow the rules. So damn frustrating.


totally not challenging your parenting (pls don’t take it as such...totally respect) at all but don’t we want to teach kids to follow rational Moral rules?  For example we wouldn’t want to teach them to support segregation if it was the order Of the day and applaud their decision to sit at a counter with a POC even if it violates the rules?  Or if a soldier, to disobey a rule that commits a war crime?  Or if it’s an order at work that is unethical or hurts someone?  arent the California rules immoral and hurtful when it comes to children?


----------



## NorCalDad

Grace T. said:


> totally not challenging your parenting (pls don’t take it as such...totally respect) at all but don’t we want to teach kids to follow rational Moral rules?  For example we wouldn’t want to teach them to support segregation if it was the order Of the day and applaud their decision to sit at a counter with a POC even if it violates the rules?  Or if a soldier, to disobey a rule that commits a war crime?  Or if it’s an order at work that is unethical or hurts someone?  arent the California rules immoral and hurtful when it comes to children?


100% agree with what you're saying here.  We absolutely teach our kids to challenge things.  In this case the communications around this whole thing have been so incredibly inconsistent.  I mean I can probably count 2-3 times where we thought the youth sports rules were going to change for the better.  Throw in an election and an insurrection, there just seemed bigger life lessons to teach.


----------



## watfly

Great comments by everyone today.

I believe what those of us that are sane are talking about is a balanced, or a targeted approach.  I don't think any of us are talking about just ripping the bandaid off with zero restrictions across the board. We can be open with restrictions, its been proven by all the creative measures that businesses have taken to protect their customers.  Is there a business out there that has said "I'm not going to open if have to put up a plastic barrier"?  I don't think so.  Is there anyone that has said "I'm not going to allow my kid to play a soccer if I have to stand 6 feet away from other parents?", not many, if any, I suspect.  While we may question the effectiveness of certain restrictions, I believe the vast majority of us are willing to compromise and comply with social distancing and mask wearing (with the exception of vigorous activity which is simply ridiculous), if our kids can go to school and play sports.

The problem is that not only is science being completely ignored for political reasons, but that politics have turned into this zero sum game.  Someone has to win and someone has to lose.  There is no middle ground.  In this case our children are the losers and they have shouldered a substantially disproportionate share of the burden both short term and most concerning, long term, particularly for those less privileged kids.  Ultimately, society will suffer because of what our politicians have done to kids.  Our children have very little risk for the virus and have little impact on the spread of the virus.

NorCalDad, I'm generally a rule follower and not typically a "question authority" guy, but these restrictions are about politics and control, not about science and good governance.  I'm ultimately responsible for my child's welfare and the mandates have crossed a line I can't accept.  Fortunately, my kids are capable of seeing through the BS.  Fortunately or unfortunately, they were born with the same natural skepticism that I have and question things regardless of source.


----------



## GeekKid

[


watfly said:


> Great comments by everyone today.
> 
> I believe what those of us that are sane are talking about is a balanced, or a targeted approach.  I don't think any of us are talking about just ripping the bandaid off with zero restrictions across the board. We can be open with restrictions, its been proven by all the creative measures that businesses have taken to protect their customers.  Is there a business out there that has said "I'm not going to open if have to put up a plastic barrier"?  I don't think so.  Is there anyone that has said "I'm not going to allow my kid to play a soccer if I have to stand 6 feet away from other parents?", not many, if any, I suspect.  While we may question the effectiveness of certain restrictions, I believe the vast majority of us are willing to compromise and comply with social distancing and mask wearing (with the exception of vigorous activity which is simply ridiculous), if our kids can go to school and play sports.
> 
> The problem is that not only is science being completely ignored for political reasons, but that politics have turned into this zero sum game.  Someone has to win and someone has to lose.  There is no middle ground.  *In this case our children are the losers and they have shouldered a substantially disproportionate share of the burden both short term and most concerning, long term, particularly for those less privileged kids.  Ultimately, society will suffer because of what our politicians have done to kids.  Our children have very little risk for the virus and have little impact on the spread of the virus.*
> 
> NorCalDad, I'm generally a rule follower and not typically a "question authority" guy, but these restrictions are about politics and control, not about science and good governance.  *I'm ultimately responsible for my child's welfare and the mandates have crossed a line I can't accept.*  Fortunately, my kids are capable of seeing through the BS.  Fortunately or unfortunately, they were born with the same natural skepticism that I have and question things regardless of source.


100% agree with your statement. This is an online forum about kid's soccer so the majority of the conversation centers on that. You are right, these kids have disproportionately shouldered this burden and I think people lose sight of that both in terms of short term and long terms affects.


----------



## dad4

watfly said:


> Great comments by everyone today.
> 
> I believe what those of us that are sane are talking about is a balanced, or a targeted approach.  I don't think any of us are talking about just ripping the bandaid off with zero restrictions across the board. We can be open with restrictions, its been proven by all the creative measures that businesses have taken to protect their customers.  Is there a business out there that has said "I'm not going to open if have to put up a plastic barrier"?  I don't think so.  Is there anyone that has said "I'm not going to allow my kid to play a soccer if I have to stand 6 feet away from other parents?", not many, if any, I suspect.  While we may question the effectiveness of certain restrictions, I believe the vast majority of us are willing to compromise and comply with social distancing and mask wearing (with the exception of vigorous activity which is simply ridiculous), if our kids can go to school and play sports.
> 
> The problem is that not only is science being completely ignored for political reasons, but that politics have turned into this zero sum game.  Someone has to win and someone has to lose.  There is no middle ground.  In this case our children are the losers and they have shouldered a substantially disproportionate share of the burden both short term and most concerning, long term, particularly for those less privileged kids.  Ultimately, society will suffer because of what our politicians have done to kids.  Our children have very little risk for the virus and have little impact on the spread of the virus.
> 
> NorCalDad, I'm generally a rule follower and not typically a "question authority" guy, but these restrictions are about politics and control, not about science and good governance.  I'm ultimately responsible for my child's welfare and the mandates have crossed a line I can't accept.  Fortunately, my kids are capable of seeing through the BS.  Fortunately or unfortunately, they were born with the same natural skepticism that I have and question things regardless of source.


I never found it hard to teach teenagers to challenge rules.

Teaching them _*when*_ to challenge rules, now that is more difficult...


----------



## Grace T.

I hear a lawsuit has been filed in San Diego to force the immediate resumption of high school sports.  The basis is apparently that the rules forbidding sports lack any rational scientific basis since there isn't evidence of outdoor transmission being a high vector.  Any one have any additional details?

BTW, with the efficiency of the J&J vaccine so low and with the under 16 not likely to receive the vaccine until fall (or for the under 12 into 2022), and with anywhere from 1/4-1/3 of pop not willing to get the vaccine (or a particular vaccine....don't want the Moderna for fear it's new....or don't want J&J for fear it's not good enough), I don't see us getting to a point where we don't have outbreaks.  Given the yellow tier especially and the orange tier too are so sensitive, even with herd immunity and seasonality effects, we may still have outbreaks into fall 2021 that will at a minimum disrupt sports.  Unless the rules get changed, I really don't see us getting back to normal until the spring of 2022 at the earliest.  We may have soccer in some places in the late spring...in most places in the summer...but especially those high density and low density counties will have play disrupted from time to time and have to deal with restrictions (county play, masks, no tournaments) for a very very long time as long as the current rules remain in place and I don't really see much hope for basketball except for maybe summer outdoor leagues.


----------



## Soccer Bum 06

chiefs said:


> Parents Sue Gavin Newsom over Youth Sports Restrictions
> 
> 
> On January 28th a lawsuit was filed in San Diego Superior Court asking for all High School and youth sports to begin. Defendants include Governor Gavin Newsom, CDPH and local health officials. The …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> daygofootball.com


Wouldn’t put any faith in judges to help. With no science judges have sat back and watched this governor shutdown schools and business. Besides a couple that sided to open up restaurants only to have the appeals courts stay the orders. Judges like teachers and government have failed our children. A lot of failure all around by all organizations and bureaucracies.


----------



## NorCalDad

Grace T. said:


> I hear a lawsuit has been filed in San Diego to force the immediate resumption of high school sports.  The basis is apparently that the rules forbidding sports lack any rational scientific basis since there isn't evidence of outdoor transmission being a high vector.  Any one have any additional details?
> 
> BTW, with the efficiency of the J&J vaccine so low and with the under 16 not likely to receive the vaccine until fall (or for the under 12 into 2022), and with anywhere from 1/4-1/3 of pop not willing to get the vaccine (or a particular vaccine....don't want the Moderna for fear it's new....or don't want J&J for fear it's not good enough), I don't see us getting to a point where we don't have outbreaks.  Given the yellow tier especially and the orange tier too are so sensitive, even with herd immunity and seasonality effects, we may still have outbreaks into fall 2021 that will at a minimum disrupt sports.  Unless the rules get changed, I really don't see us getting back to normal until the spring of 2022 at the earliest.  We may have soccer in some places in the late spring...in most places in the summer...but especially those high density and low density counties will have play disrupted from time to time and have to deal with restrictions (county play, masks, no tournaments) for a very very long time as long as the current rules remain in place and I don't really see much hope for basketball except for maybe summer outdoor leagues.


Presumably you're talking about CA here?  If by fall of this year our kids aren't back in school full time, we will likely look at moving out of the state, maybe out of the country.  Of course, this presumes no new variant that's spreading nationally.  I say this boldly knowing our kids will likely be back full time in the Fall.  Our district is already talking about changing things this spring, so that's good.


----------



## soccersc

Grace T. said:


> I hear a lawsuit has been filed in San Diego to force the immediate resumption of high school sports.  The basis is apparently that the rules forbidding sports lack any rational scientific basis since there isn't evidence of outdoor transmission being a high vector.  Any one have any additional details?
> 
> BTW, with the efficiency of the J&J vaccine so low and with the under 16 not likely to receive the vaccine until fall (or for the under 12 into 2022), and with anywhere from 1/4-1/3 of pop not willing to get the vaccine (or a particular vaccine....don't want the Moderna for fear it's new....or don't want J&J for fear it's not good enough), I don't see us getting to a point where we don't have outbreaks.  Given the yellow tier especially and the orange tier too are so sensitive, even with herd immunity and seasonality effects, we may still have outbreaks into fall 2021 that will at a minimum disrupt sports.  Unless the rules get changed, I really don't see us getting back to normal until the spring of 2022 at the earliest.  We may have soccer in some places in the late spring...in most places in the summer...but especially those high density and low density counties will have play disrupted from time to time and have to deal with restrictions (county play, masks, no tournaments) for a very very long time as long as the current rules remain in place and I don't really see much hope for basketball except for maybe summer outdoor leagues.


So I did some rough calculations.  The daily case rate has dropped by about 30% over the last couple weeks.  If we are lucky enough that it continues to drop at that rate it will take about 5 weeks to get to the Red Tier.  Then you have to stay in that tier for 3 weeks before moving to the next tier.  That means approx. 8 weeks before the Orange Moderate Tier.  I know this isn't totally scientific and there are a tremendous amount of variables, but at least it kind of gives you a picture of what could be.


----------



## watfly

NorCalDad said:


> Presumably you're talking about CA here?  If by fall of this year our kids aren't back in school full time, we will likely look at moving out of the state, maybe out of the country.  Of course, this presumes no new variant that's spreading nationally.  I say this boldly knowing our kids will likely be back full time in the Fall.  Our district is already talking about changing things this spring, so that's good.


Good luck getting a UHaul!


----------



## Grace T.

soccersc said:


> So I did some rough calculations.  The daily case rate has dropped by about 30% over the last couple weeks.  If we are lucky enough that it continues to drop at that rate it will take about 5 weeks to get to the Red Tier.  Then you have to stay in that tier for 3 weeks before moving to the next tier.  That means approx. 8 weeks before the Orange Moderate Tier.  I know this isn't totally scientific and there are a tremendous amount of variables, but at least it kind of gives you a picture of what could be.


The good news is the drop off in both positivity and cases is fairly steep so yeah we have a shot somewhere of hitting that orange tier in 8 weeks (LA County is also following the same projections and is doing better than VC).

The bad news, though, is given how sensitive the tier system is it's easy for a small outbreak to ruin things (particularly from yellow-orange, or orange-red) in a county.  Remember it's the worse of cases or positivity: so test a lot of people and cases get worse....test only people suspected of getting being sick and positivity goes up.  The high density counties could see localized outbreaks due to the packed living and conditions at work.  The low density county only need a handful of cases to get bumped up a tier since its adjusted based on population. Under the system, assuming better herd immunity and seasonality and no 3rd wave, it will be easy to get to red, a small bad outbreak (even if localized like the Orthodox outbreaks in NY or Israel) can get you bumped out of orange, and it's very hard to get to yellow.  The system also works in favor of mid size counties (like the OC and VC) to the detriment or larger and smaller ones.



NorCalDad said:


> Presumably you're talking about CA here?  If by fall of this year our kids aren't back in school full time, we will likely look at moving out of the state, maybe out of the country.  Of course, this presumes no new variant that's spreading nationally.  I say this boldly knowing our kids will likely be back full time in the Fall.  Our district is already talking about changing things this spring, so that's good.


Lucky for you you are in NorCal but I'd put it at more than 50% that LA County schools won't be open full time this fall (particularly not the middle school and high schools).  Under the tier system LA's high density makes it very easy for localized outbreaks to go and the tier system is overly sensitive.  The LA teacher's unions have really dug in and have said the vaccine is not enough (and now with the J&J vaccine at less than perfect efficiency they have that as well).  Neither the Biden nor the Newsom admin seems to show much political will to stand up to the unions.  Planning in LAUSD is already underway for at least a hybrid part time system that will limit the number of kids on campus.  Several employers have already told people we may be remote into 2022 unless the SoCal schools reopen and even then they don't expect a maskless return to normal until well into 2022.

I'm not saying this is the future we are locked into.  But barring some seismic political change (the recall, a parents rebellions, a court standing up to Newsom, intervention by Biden), I'm more bearish than bullish on a full time return to normal in LA County schools this fall.

If you lived in LA, I'd say you might want to try and get a Uhaul reservation now.   I hear they are hard to come by.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> If you lived in LA, I'd say you might want to try and get a Uhaul reservation now.   I hear they are hard to come by.


UHaul doesn't think so --









						U-Haul
					






					www.uhaul.com


----------



## Desert Hound

espola said:


> UHaul doesn't think so --
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U-Haul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.uhaul.com


Actually I think what she means is this. There is heavy demand to leave CA. Not much demand moving to CA. So when you look at pricing it tells the story. Note the difference in rates.


----------



## Grace T.

Desert Hound said:


> Actually I think what she means is this. There is heavy demand to leave CA. Not much demand moving to CA. So when you look at pricing it tells the story. Note the difference in rates.
> 
> View attachment 10019
> 
> View attachment 10020


I'm actually just kidding....but there is a lot of talk out there about Uhauls not being available or more expensive.  Don't know if it's still true or not, but we were unable to get one of the small little box trailers for when we went out to Utah for a month in the summer (closest avail was in Bakersfield which we didn't find worth it so just loaded up the SUV as best we could and hoped for the best).


----------



## Desert Hound

Grace T. said:


> Uhauls not being available or more expensive. Don't know if it's still true or not


Certainly MORE expensive. Those quotes above were just pulled from their site. 

And that then follows there is a bit of a supply problem. They are not getting as many back INTO CA as are leaving. Therefore the high prices going out.


----------



## watfly

Desert Hound said:


> Certainly MORE expensive. Those quotes above were just pulled from their site.
> 
> And that then follows there is a bit of a supply problem. They are not getting as many back INTO CA as are leaving. Therefore the high prices going out.


They should be paying people to move trucks back to California.

Can someone please help Espola sort out the difference between sarcasm and a serious argument.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

Glitterhater said:


> I can't believe I'm inserting myself here, but it sounds like at least right now, that is the preferred term. I seem to recall a time when it was not, (as you said.)


Insert away, it’s liberating and a fair question.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

Anon9 said:


> Or if his mom would have swallowed him!


You think there’s a mom and not an Anton with a tampon?


----------



## GeekKid

espola said:


> UHaul doesn't think so --
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U-Haul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.uhaul.com


Funny thing is though a 26' truck from LA to Dallas is roughly $4,700.  Same truck but going from Dallas to LA is $1,500.


----------



## crush

watfly said:


> Good luck getting a UHaul!


I see this type of move out truck more and more now.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

I’ve travelled all over the country for business.  We have the best weather and there’s plenty to do in california.  Let  them go, more space for the rest of us.    Today I’m in big bear where there’s plenty of snow.  Tomorrow back to sunny SoCal and next weekend bike ride at the beach.     Not too many states where you can do that.


----------



## GeekKid

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I’ve travelled all over the country for business.  We have the best weather and there’s plenty to do in california.  Let  them go, more space for the rest of us.    Today I’m in big bear where there’s plenty of snow.  Tomorrow back to sunny SoCal and next weekend bike ride at the beach.     Not too many states where you can do that.


And back to the lock down, awesome governor, highest taxes, choking business regulations, biggest homeless problem in America, failing public schools, worst roads and traffic and a year of no soccer or sports for the kids.  Been there, done that…enjoy the space.


----------



## MacDre

GeekKid said:


> And back to the lock down, awesome governor, highest taxes, choking business regulations, biggest homeless problem in America, failing public schools, worst roads and traffic and a year of no soccer or sports for the kids.  Been there, done that…enjoy the space.


If folks like you would quit bluffing and kick rocks, that would help resolve many of the above mentioned problems.  I hear that Texas, Arizona, and Utah welcome fleeing Californians with open arms.  Several options out there my friend.  No need to be unhappy in California when you can live in Utah... right?


----------



## crush

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I’ve travelled all over the country for business.  We have the best weather and there’s plenty to do in california.  Let  them go, more space for the rest of us.    Today I’m in big bear where there’s plenty of snow.  Tomorrow back to sunny SoCal and next weekend bike ride at the beach.     Not too many states where you can do that.


I just had argument with my buddy who moved to Vegas because he hated all the hate and all the back stabbing from all his friends.  Let's not forget all the snitches too.  I told him California will be Dreaming again and this time around it will be less crowded and that is a good thing.  See ya and don't let the smog hit you on the way out!!!!


----------



## GeekKid

MacDre said:


> If folks like you would quit bluffing and kick rocks, that would help resolve many of the above mentioned problems.  I hear that Texas, Arizona, and Utah welcome fleeing Californians with open arms.  Several options out there my friend.  No need to be unhappy in California when you can live in Utah... right?


I moved out of SoCal almost three years ago because of the above-mentioned issues. Best move our family ever made. Here we have great public schools, no state income tax, three times the size of yard and doubled the size of our house. My DDs been playing soccer since last June, going to in-person school since August, playing 6A High School and have been traveling around to a couple of ECNL & High School Showcases. As a matter of fact, as I type this, the family is packing the car and getting ready to head up to Oklahoma for a makeup game tomorrow. Going to take a look at Oklahoma State in Stillwater today since we already toured OU back in September on our way to Tulsa for her first ECNL game.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I’ve travelled all over the country for business.  We have the best weather and there’s plenty to do in california.  Let  them go, more space for the rest of us.    Today I’m in big bear where there’s plenty of snow.  Tomorrow back to sunny SoCal and next weekend bike ride at the beach.     Not too many states where you can do that.


The problem is it won’t stay that way.  Not in the direction we’re headed.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> If folks like you would quit bluffing and kick rocks, that would help resolve many of the above mentioned problems.  I hear that Texas, Arizona, and Utah welcome fleeing Californians with open arms.  Several options out there my friend.  No need to be unhappy in California when you can live in Utah... right?


So you’re response to Geek is, “ Yeah and that’s how we like it.  If you don’t, bye.”  

So tell me, is Geek wrong?  If so, how?  Because it all seems pretty accurate to me and none of it is desirable.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

GeekKid said:


> I moved out of SoCal almost three years ago because of the above-mentioned issues. Best move our family ever made. Here we have great public schools, no state income tax, three times the size of yard and doubled the size of our house. My DDs been playing soccer since last June, going to in-person school since August, playing 6A High School and have been traveling around to a couple of ECNL & High School Showcases. As a matter of fact, as I type this, the family is packing the car and getting ready to head up to Oklahoma for a makeup game tomorrow. Going to take a look at Oklahoma State in Stillwater today since we already toured OU back in September on our way to Tulsa for her first ECNL game.


Californians will eventually ruin things Texas does well, too.  Just give it time.


----------



## watfly

MacDre said:


> If folks like you would quit bluffing and kick rocks, that would help resolve many of the above mentioned problems.  I hear that Texas, Arizona, and Utah welcome fleeing Californians with open arms.  Several options out there my friend.  No need to be unhappy in California when you can live in Utah... right?


Two benefits I enjoyed when I lived in Utah were the slopes were always less crowded on Sunday and you could always find a designated driver.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> If folks like you would quit bluffing and kick rocks, that would help resolve many of the above mentioned problems.  I hear that Texas, Arizona, and Utah welcome fleeing Californians with open arms.  Several options out there my friend.  No need to be unhappy in California when you can live in Utah... right?


CA has some major problems.  Start with schools and housing, and move on from there.

Your response is, essentially, "CA, love it or leave it."

That's no way to fix anything.


----------



## crush

GeekKid said:


> And back to the lock down, awesome governor, highest taxes, choking business regulations, biggest homeless problem in America, failing public schools, worst roads and traffic and a year of no soccer or sports for the kids.  Been there, done that…enjoy the space.


Beach space brah is that all matters to me.  Stay over in Zooport or HB and all is good with me....lol, JK, not...lol!!!  If your stuck in LA, get the heck out and move to Texas.  I stopped counting how many people have moved in the last 8 months.


----------



## crush

GeekKid said:


> I moved out of SoCal almost three years ago because of the above-mentioned issues. Best move our family ever made. Here we have great public schools, no state income tax, three times the size of yard and doubled the size of our house. My DDs been playing soccer since last June, going to in-person school since August, playing 6A High School and have been traveling around to a couple of ECNL & High School Showcases. As a matter of fact, as I type this, the family is packing the car and getting ready to head up to Oklahoma for a makeup game tomorrow. Going to take a look at Oklahoma State in Stillwater today since we already toured OU back in September on our way to Tulsa for her first ECNL game.


Nasty weather though.  I would die in Texas.  Never, ever do it.  However, if my goat were 9, I would move to Texas so she could ball


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> CA has some major problems.  Start with schools and housing, and move on from there.
> 
> Your response is, essentially, "CA, love it or leave it."
> 
> That's no way to fix anything.


Philosophically I agree with you, but California has finally "jumped the shark".  This last year is absolute proof of that although there are many things that have led up to that.

Affordable housing is a unicorn in California.  I was in the business for a couple years and got out of it when you were effectively forced to pay prevailing wage for your projects because of the unions.  This adds 20% to your construction costs which basically wipes out the low interest public financing and the tax credits.  Further the municipalities still charge the same ridiculously high developer fees.  The only one that takes a haircut is the developer.

The California Teachers Union is also why our education is less than desirable.  We are a state that is controlled by unions and we were lucky to defeat prop 15 this past year.  Ultimately the unions will prevail overturning prop 13, its just a matter of time.

The whole pension debacle is also union driven and why municipalties have trouble providing  basic services.


----------



## dad4

watfly said:


> Philosophically I agree with you, but California has finally "jumped the shark".  This last year is absolute proof of that although there are many things that have led up to that.
> 
> Affordable housing is a unicorn in California.  I was in the business for a couple years and got out of it when you were effectively forced to pay prevailing wage for your projects because of the unions.  This adds 20% to your construction costs which basically wipes out the low interest public financing and the tax credits.  Further the municipalities still charge the same ridiculously high developer fees.  The only one that takes a haircut is the developer.
> 
> The California Teachers Union is also why our education is less than desirable.  We are a state that is controlled by unions and we were lucky to defeat prop 15 this past year.  Ultimately the unions will prevail overturning prop 13, its just a matter of time.
> 
> The whole pension debacle is also union driven and why municipalties have trouble providing  basic services.


I said housing shortage.  Not affordable housing shortage.  Just housing shortage.  Too few homes and apartments built every year.

Then, when they tell us to socially distance, we have these pockets where no one can distance because 2 or 3 families are crammed in a tiny apartment.

I can't really blame that one on pensions, CTA, or prevailing wage.   

Chances are, your city council helps make the problem worse.  Mine, too.


----------



## Glitterhater

We were just talking about the CA housing issue today. We are looking to move, (need more space,) and there is nothing that is a "step up" under 800k- and even then, it's a cookie cutter house, no character, no yard, and very narrow streets- so you have to pull over to let someon go by, (if they are coming towards you.)


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> I said housing shortage.  Not affordable housing shortage.  Just housing shortage.  Too few homes and apartments built every year.
> 
> Then, when they tell us to socially distance, we have these pockets where no one can distance because 2 or 3 families are crammed in a tiny apartment.


Same issues, development fees and the entitlement process aka ridiculous regulations.  Have you ever tried to develop real estate in California?  If you haven't you have no idea how difficult it is to do so.  When you add NIMBY neighbors to the equation its even more difficult.

The 2 to 3 families crammed into a tiny apartment has to do primarily lack of affordable housing supply and in some cases, its just cultural.  Lack of  immigration enforcement is also an element of the problem.

And yes, our city councils share some of the blame, particularly those members that are beholden to the unions.


----------



## watfly

watfly said:


> Same issues, development fees and the entitlement process aka ridiculous regulations.  Have you ever tried to develop real estate in California?  If you haven't you have no idea how difficult it is to do so.  When you add NIMBY neighbors to the equation its even more difficult.
> 
> The 2 to 3 families crammed into a tiny apartment has to do primarily lack of affordable housing supply and in some cases, its just cultural.  Lack of  immigration enforcement is also an element of the problem.
> 
> And yes, our city councils share some of the blame, particularly those members that are beholden to the unions.


You also have to understand that the anti-landlord attitude in California doesn't exactly motivate developers.  The absurd eviction moratorium isn't helping the RE situation either.


----------



## Grace T.

watfly said:


> Same issues, development fees and the entitlement process aka ridiculous regulations.  Have you ever tried to develop real estate in California?  If you haven't you have no idea how difficult it is to do so.  When you add NIMBY neighbors to the equation its even more difficult.
> 
> The 2 to 3 families crammed into a tiny apartment has to do primarily lack of affordable housing supply and in some cases, its just cultural.  Lack of  immigration enforcement is also an element of the problem.


child care/elder care too. Working class families can’t afford day care (not even someone in the house next door has a pod of kids in their basement day care) particularly with irregular essential worker hours.  If grandma is going to take care of the kids full time she may as well stay to reduce costs...trade off is when they get too old the teenagers take care of grandma.  Grandma also helps with the cooking (cobra Kai has a pretty good typical portrayal). Problem is essential worker mom or dad then brings the bug home to grandma and grandma can’t shelter in place alone (like my or the in laws folks) because she can’t afford a house alone, has to watch the kids (who aren’t in school) and will need to be taken care of later anyways.

It’s one of the big problems too with working class kids and club sports. They aren’t on campus in walking distance, grandma doesn’t drive or even have a car, parents work so coach has to pick up or they can’t come. My younger once tried out for an all Latino team....didn’t work out...practice kept getting cancelled when the coach’s car broke down and he couldn’t pick up 1/2 the team.


----------



## Glitterhater

watfly said:


> Same issues, development fees and the entitlement process aka ridiculous regulations.  Have you ever tried to develop real estate in California?  If you haven't you have no idea how difficult it is to do so.  When you add NIMBY neighbors to the equation its even more difficult.
> 
> The 2 to 3 families crammed into a tiny apartment has to do primarily lack of affordable housing supply and in some cases, its just cultural.  Lack of  immigration enforcement is also an element of the problem.
> 
> And yes, our city councils share some of the blame, particularly those members that are beholden to the unions.


Dare I ask what "NIMBY" neighbors are? 

The house directly accross from us is a Pakistani family. Their house is not big and they regularly have 10-12 people living there depending on who's her and who is back in Pakistan. They converted their single car garage into a kitchen because of the strong spices they use, (that's what the Grandpa told me.) He said that their food is too pungent to cook inside. I believe it, on a 110 degree day you can smell it from our yard. 

I have always thought man, if someone in that house got COVID, it would be so easy for it to run through the entire house.


----------



## watfly

Glitterhater said:


> Dare I ask what "NIMBY" neighbors are?
> 
> The house directly accross from us is a Pakistani family. Their house is not big and they regularly have 10-12 people living there depending on who's her and who is back in Pakistan. They converted their single car garage into a kitchen because of the strong spices they use, (that's what the Grandpa told me.) He said that their food is too pungent to cook inside. I believe it, on a 110 degree day you can smell it from our yard.
> 
> I have always thought man, if someone in that house got COVID, it would be so easy for it to run through the entire house.


NIMBY=Not In My BackYard meaning don't put "that" in my neighborhood.

Good luck with your home search, the prices can be discouraging.


----------



## Glitterhater

watfly said:


> NIMBY=Not In My BackYard meaning don't put "that" in my neighborhood.
> 
> Good luck with your home search, the prices can be discouraging.


Ahh, yes, ok. I can imagine that makes building/developing tough.

Thanks! It's been very discouraging- it boggles my mind when people are willing to pay a milllion dollars for nothing special. Close proximity to the Bay Area I think is what's doing it.


----------



## Grace T.

In Los Angeles, the Virus Is Pummeling Those Who Can Least Afford to Fall Ill (Published 2021)
					

Los Angeles County is one of the worst Covid-19 hotspots in the country. See how hard Angelenos have been hit, neighborhood by neighborhood.



					www.nytimes.com


----------



## dad4

watfly said:


> Same issues, development fees and the entitlement process aka ridiculous regulations.  Have you ever tried to develop real estate in California?  If you haven't you have no idea how difficult it is to do so.  When you add NIMBY neighbors to the equation its even more difficult.
> 
> The 2 to 3 families crammed into a tiny apartment has to do primarily lack of affordable housing supply and in some cases, its just cultural.  Lack of  immigration enforcement is also an element of the problem.
> 
> And yes, our city councils share some of the blame, particularly those members that are beholden to the unions.


I’ve been on a city council.

Unions are to blame for pension debt, prevailing wage, and ridiculous staffing requirements.  But they are not to blame for the housing shortage.  

The housing shortage is caused by local homeowners who pack the council chambers in opposition whenever someone tries to build significant amounts of new housing.


----------



## happy9

GeekKid said:


> And back to the lock down, awesome governor, highest taxes, choking business regulations, biggest homeless problem in America, failing public schools, worst roads and traffic and a year of no soccer or sports for the kids.  Been there, done that…enjoy the space.


Yea, that about sums it up.  Nice place to vacation though.


----------



## happy9

Scott m Shurson said:


> Californians will eventually ruin things Texas does well, too.  Just give it time.


And Arizona, and Utah, and...and...


----------



## dawson

Grace T. said:


> In Los Angeles, the Virus Is Pummeling Those Who Can Least Afford to Fall Ill (Published 2021)
> 
> 
> Los Angeles County is one of the worst Covid-19 hotspots in the country. See how hard Angelenos have been hit, neighborhood by neighborhood.
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com


Interesting that the authors fail to comment in their story that for the last 3 weeks new cases in LA County have dropped dramatically. He shows a few graphs for a few cities but makes no comment on the sharp downward trend .

They do give the impression that cases are currently “ soaring “ in LA County and LAC is the “ epicenter of the pandemic “ .


----------



## dad4

dawson said:


> Interesting that the authors fail to comment in their story that for the last 3 weeks new cases in LA County have dropped dramatically. He shows a few graphs for a few cities but makes no comment on the sharp downward trend .
> 
> They do give the impression that cases are currently “ soaring “ in LA County and LAC is the “ epicenter of the pandemic “ .


Sometimes the world moves faster than the author and the editors.

I think LA has a high fraction of recovered patients and an efficient vaccination program.  That is also a good story, but it is a different story than the high case load of 5 weeks ago.


----------



## Grace T.

happy9 said:


> And Arizona, and Utah, and...and...


already did to nevada


----------



## Glitterhater

dad4 said:


> Sometimes the world moves faster than the author and the editors.
> 
> I think LA has a high fraction of recovered patients and an efficient vaccination program.  That is also a good story, but it is a different story than the high case load of 5 weeks ago.


This is very true, (sometimes after an edit, stuff changes.) 

If we think logically, and how virus' work, places where population density is greater, and we have multi generational housing, would be the hardest hit places-right? I'm not that familiar with LA but it sounds like these "hot spots" are densely populated? Just musing here, don't mind me. 

Which if that is true would explain why being outside (ahem! Sports,) hasn't been an exponential risk.


----------



## Grace T.

Glitterhater said:


> This is very true, (sometimes after an edit, stuff changes.)
> 
> If we think logically, and how virus' work, places where population density is greater, and we have multi generational housing, would be the hardest hit places-right? I'm not that familiar with LA but it sounds like these "hot spots" are densely populated? Just musing here, don't mind me.
> 
> Which if that is true would explain why being outside (ahem! Sports,) hasn't been an exponential risk.


The other factor is that those are the places where people don’t have the option to remote work.


----------



## dad4

Glitterhater said:


> This is very true, (sometimes after an edit, stuff changes.)
> 
> If we think logically, and how virus' work, places where population density is greater, and we have multi generational housing, would be the hardest hit places-right? I'm not that familiar with LA but it sounds like these "hot spots" are densely populated? Just musing here, don't mind me.
> 
> Which if that is true would explain why being outside (ahem! Sports,) hasn't been an exponential risk.


I think it is less about the number of generations per home than the number of essential workers per home.  

The hot spots near me are high density, in terms of people per square foot of housing.  But they often have a low density, in terms of homes per acre.  Think multiple families sharing a single family home.

The Chinese and Indian families near me are often 3 generations, but those neighborhoods haven’t been hit hard.  Mom and dad both work by zoom these days, so not a lot of contact.

The hispanic neighborhoods have had a ton of cases.  You might have three or four outside the home workers in one house.  It doesn’t really matter if it is two families or four bachelors- that’s a lot of connections.


----------



## tjinaz

dad4 said:


> I think it is less about the number of generations per home than the number of essential workers per home.
> 
> The hot spots near me are high density, in terms of people per square foot of housing.  But they often have a low density, in terms of homes per acre.  Think multiple families sharing a single family home.
> 
> The Chinese and Indian families near me are often 3 generations, but those neighborhoods haven’t been hit hard.  Mom and dad both work by zoom these days, so not a lot of contact.
> 
> The hispanic neighborhoods have had a ton of cases.  You might have three or four outside the home workers in one house.  It doesn’t really matter if it is two families or four bachelors- that’s a lot of connections.


Yup its that racist Newsom.  His policies are killing so many minorities.  Its like he is targeting them.... right EOTL...   Problem with single party rule.  they get all the blame.

Newsom the killer


----------



## texanincali

tjinaz said:


> Yup its that racist Newsom.  His policies are killing so many minorities.  Its like he is targeting them.... right EOTL...   Problem with single party rule.  they get all the blame.
> 
> Newsom the killer


This is a really good post.  It’s so true, but won’t garner any media attention.  Newsom’s policies are completely racist in nature and he has played a role in disproportionately killing thousands of minorities.  He has a desire to protect those like him and @EOTL, but has no issue with the collateral damage, which is high mortality rates in the Hispanic and black communities.  No way he recovers from this amount of blood on his hands.


----------



## tjinaz

texanincali said:


> This is a really good post.  It’s so true, but won’t garner any media attention.  Newsom’s policies are completely racist in nature and he has played a role in disproportionately killing thousands of minorities.  He has a desire to protect those like him and @EOTL, but has no issue with the collateral damage, which is high mortality rates in the Hispanic and black communities.  No way he recovers from this amount of blood on his hands.


Its like Cuomo.  Hides all the bodies he stacked in the Nursing homes and the press just goes along.


----------



## happy9

texanincali said:


> This is a really good post.  It’s so true, but won’t garner any media attention.  Newsom’s policies are completely racist in nature and he has played a role in disproportionately killing thousands of minorities.  He has a desire to protect those like him and @EOTL, but has no issue with the collateral damage, which is high mortality rates in the Hispanic and black communities.  No way he recovers from this amount of blood on his hands.


State politics are local. Local politicians regurgitate what rolls down the hill.  People believe what their local politicians tell them.  That's where you start.  

But yea, Newsome is a dirt bag, just like most Governors of his ilk are dirt bags.  Newsome is particularly loathsome because he has national aspirations and will do anything to be in the spotlight.  He is a spotlight Ranger.  They reside on both sides of the aisle.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

texanincali said:


> This is a really good post.  It’s so true, but won’t garner any media attention.  Newsom’s policies are completely racist in nature and he has played a role in disproportionately killing thousands of minorities.  He has a desire to protect those like him and @EOTL, but has no issue with the collateral damage, which is high mortality rates in the Hispanic and black communities.  No way he recovers from this amount of blood on his hands.


Makes no sense... Biden even said poor kids are just as smart as white kids.  Why the disparity?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

tjinaz said:


> Its like Cuomo.  Hides all the bodies he stacked in the Nursing homes and the press just goes along.


Remember, Fredo was passed over because it’s what pop wanted.


----------



## NorCalDad

I really can't help but to feel that Newsom's "lock the world down" approach has pitted him against the teacher unions.  He created so much fear and anxiety.  I mean it's pretty ridiculous when I see people slamming kids on Nextdoor for playing pickup basketball.  Or that most of our public school fields are closed.  Or how someone will be on a hiking trail with a mask on and nobody near them.  The optics his public policy has created has really framed the discussions.  It's no wonder teachers don't want to get back into the classroom --  "Hey the sky is falling, but do you mind going back to the classroom, even though technically you can still do it remotely?" 

I guess my point is that it's easy to slam the teachers here, but the landscape was created by Newsom's policies.   I will give him March - July....after that he needed to refocus.  The 8/3 youth sports guidelines were incredibly misguided.


----------



## EOTL

NorCalDad said:


> I really can't help but to feel that Newsom's "lock the world down" approach has pitted him against the teacher unions.  He created so much fear and anxiety.  I mean it's pretty ridiculous when I see people slamming kids on Nextdoor for playing pickup basketball.  Or that most of our public school fields are closed.  Or how someone will be on a hiking trail with a mask on and nobody near them.  The optics his public policy has created has really framed the discussions.  It's no wonder teachers don't want to get back into the classroom --  "Hey the sky is falling, but do you mind going back to the classroom, even though technically you can still do it remotely?"
> 
> I guess my point is that it's easy to slam the teachers here, but the landscape was created by Newsom's policies.   I will give him March - July....after that he needed to refocus.  The 8/3 youth sports guidelines were incredibly misguided.


Teachers have not wanted to go back into the classrooms because they have a legitimate fear of dying. It is not because they were misled by Newsom into believing it is dangerous when it is not.  Almost half a million people have died. 

The social distancing guidelines were not misguided, they have saved lives and a lot of them.  Complain all you want. Fake speculate that no one would have died if we’d just pretended Covid-19 didn’t exist. Pretend that what you want (little Sally playing soccer) is more important than any of the million things that other people believe exceptions should be made for. You are where you are because you and people like you have never taken this seriously enough. Since the inception of the pandemic, people at this forum have done nothing but whine and oppose efforts to reduce spread. 

There’s @MSK357 who claimed no one was dying of covid-19, and who promised to leave this site forever if more than 12,000 people died. He still thinks no one is dying of covid because Q has apparently told him they’re all dying “with” covid, which is about as dumbf**king a thing I’ve ever heard. Then there are the likes of @Desert Hound who was whining about not being able to hit the bars as far back as May or June I believe.

Then there is grace karen who is still going around claiming masks don’t work, and who blithely ignored recommendations to avoid spread to take her kid to Utah and back to play kiddie soccer early in the pandemic before CA had to clamp down hard after idiots like her weren’t getting it. These idiots are complaining that CA has had to implement strict regulations when the reason we have them is because they refused to even follow far less strict recommendations. Then there have been a whole slew of people mocking anyone in support of social distancing by claiming they should hide in their basement. They also claimed (and still claim) that old people who got it and died deserve it since they should have just stayed home, as if that were a legitimate option for most.

By all means keep criticizing people who call out those who refuse to comply with even the most basic and obvious of social distancing guidelines. Maybe you’ll all keep passing it around until it mutates enough so that the existing vaccines don’t work. Or it just keeps spreading because anti-vax psychos like @crush keep it going. Or until everyone is vaccinated because that is what people like you have proven it will take.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Teachers have not wanted to go back into the classrooms because they have a legitimate fear of dying. It is not because they were misled by Newsom into believing it is dangerous when it is not.  Almost half a million people have died.
> 
> The social distancing guidelines were not misguided, they have saved lives and a lot of them.  Complain all you want. Fake speculate that no one would have died if we’d just pretended Covid-19 didn’t exist. Pretend that what you want (little Sally playing soccer) is more important than any of the million things that other people believe exceptions should be made for. You are where you are because you and people like you have never taken this seriously enough. Since the inception of the pandemic, people at this forum have done nothing but whine and oppose efforts to reduce spread.
> 
> There’s @MSK357 who claimed no one was dying of covid-19, and who promised to leave this site forever if more than 12,000 people died. He still thinks no one is dying of covid because Q has apparently told him they’re all dying “with” covid, which is about as dumbf**king a thing I’ve ever heard. Then there are the likes of @Desert Hound who was whining about not being able to hit the bars as far back as May or June I believe.
> 
> Then there is grace karen who is still going around claiming masks don’t work, and who blithely ignored recommendations to avoid spread to take her kid to Utah and back to play kiddie soccer early in the pandemic before CA had to clamp down hard after idiots like her weren’t getting it. These idiots are complaining that CA has had to implement strict regulations when the reason we have them is because they refused to even follow far less strict recommendations. Then there have been a whole slew of people mocking anyone in support of social distancing by claiming they should hide in their basement. They also claimed (and still claim) that old people who got it and died deserve it since they should have just stayed home, as if that were a legitimate option for most.
> 
> By all means keep criticizing people who call out those who refuse to comply with even the most basic and obvious of social distancing guidelines. Maybe you’ll all keep passing it around until it mutates enough so that the existing vaccines don’t work. Or it just keeps spreading because anti-vax psychos like @crush keep it going. Or until everyone is vaccinated because that is what people like you have proven it will take.


Please do tell us how Defunding the Police, Providing Universal Healthcare and a moratorium on Charter Schools has ANYTHING to do with a “legitimate fear of dying”?

Should we just que this one in with all of the other questions that you ignore because the fact based answer doesn’t fit your narrative?


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> Please do tell us how Defunding the Police, Providing Universal Healthcare and a moratorium on Charter Schools has ANYTHING to do with a “legitimate fear of dying”?
> 
> Should we just que this one in with all of the other questions that you ignore because the fact based answer doesn’t fit your narrative?


Asking for the other stuff also was certainly a stupid ploy by the LA teachers union back in June, but that has nothing to do with teachers not having a legitimate fear of dying. It’s incredibly asinine to claim that the LA union’s request from 7 months ago suggests that teachers aren’t worried about dying.  The fact that almost half a million people have already died is enough by itself to establish the legitimacy of their concern, and that they haven’t been duped by the Governor.   What you are doing is a typical Q/Fox News/OAN distraction.  Do you make stupid arguments like that because you are stupid and actually believe it, or is it because you’re embarrassed to admit you’re wrong?









						California teachers union wants schools in ‘purple’ counties to stay closed for 100 days; vaccinations for staff
					

The teachers union wants most California schools to remain closed for 100 days while the state comes up with a plan to slow the spread of the virus and vaccinate school staff.




					edsource.org
				






			https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article248846509.html
		










						Teachers must be vaccinated before L.A. schools can reopen, Beutner says
					

L.A. schools Supt. Austin Beutner says reopening K-12 campuses will require the vaccination of teachers and staff. But UTLA says virus case rates also must drop.




					www.latimes.com
				












						California teacher's unions worry about reopening schools
					

One of California's two powerful teachers unions is warning that reopening schools would be "reckless."




					www.ksby.com
				












						California school waivers will require detailed planning
					

The California Federation of Teachers and California Association of Private School Organizations spoke out about the waivers.




					www.abc10.com


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Asking for the other stuff also was certainly a stupid ploy by the LA teachers union back in June, but that has nothing to do with teachers not having a legitimate fear of dying. It’s incredibly asinine to claim that the LA union’s request from 7 months ago suggests that teachers aren’t worried about dying.  The fact that almost half a million people have already died is enough by itself to establish the legitimacy of their concern, and that they haven’t been duped by the Governor.   What you are doing is a typical Q/Fox News/OAN distraction.  Do you make stupid arguments like that because you are stupid and actually believe it, or is it because you’re embarrassed to admit you’re wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California teachers union wants schools in ‘purple’ counties to stay closed for 100 days; vaccinations for staff
> 
> 
> The teachers union wants most California schools to remain closed for 100 days while the state comes up with a plan to slow the spread of the virus and vaccinate school staff.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edsource.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article248846509.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Teachers must be vaccinated before L.A. schools can reopen, Beutner says
> 
> 
> L.A. schools Supt. Austin Beutner says reopening K-12 campuses will require the vaccination of teachers and staff. But UTLA says virus case rates also must drop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California teacher's unions worry about reopening schools
> 
> 
> One of California's two powerful teachers unions is warning that reopening schools would be "reckless."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ksby.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California school waivers will require detailed planning
> 
> 
> The California Federation of Teachers and California Association of Private School Organizations spoke out about the waivers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.abc10.com


How is it conspiracy theory to point out facts?  I mean the head of another prominent Teachers Union likened wanting kids to go back to school to “White Privilege”.  I never said some teachers weren’t afraid of death. Hell every teacher I know should prefer to be in class and many districts have offered for those who are afraid, to be in charge of virtual class rooms (cause some families don’t want their kids to go back for that same fear).

One can argue/debate the rationality of that fear, but options abound to address and accommodate those who are concerned (minority) without negatively impacting those who are not (majority). 

PS - have yet to hear the Cali Teachers Union reel back those demands.  Have you?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Asking for the other stuff also was certainly a stupid ploy by the LA teachers union back in June, but that has nothing to do with teachers not having a legitimate fear of dying. It’s incredibly asinine to claim that the LA union’s request from 7 months ago suggests that teachers aren’t worried about dying.  The fact that almost half a million people have already died is enough by itself to establish the legitimacy of their concern, and that they haven’t been duped by the Governor.   What you are doing is a typical Q/Fox News/OAN distraction.  Do you make stupid arguments like that because you are stupid and actually believe it, or is it because you’re embarrassed to admit you’re wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California teachers union wants schools in ‘purple’ counties to stay closed for 100 days; vaccinations for staff
> 
> 
> The teachers union wants most California schools to remain closed for 100 days while the state comes up with a plan to slow the spread of the virus and vaccinate school staff.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edsource.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article248846509.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Teachers must be vaccinated before L.A. schools can reopen, Beutner says
> 
> 
> L.A. schools Supt. Austin Beutner says reopening K-12 campuses will require the vaccination of teachers and staff. But UTLA says virus case rates also must drop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California teacher's unions worry about reopening schools
> 
> 
> One of California's two powerful teachers unions is warning that reopening schools would be "reckless."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ksby.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California school waivers will require detailed planning
> 
> 
> The California Federation of Teachers and California Association of Private School Organizations spoke out about the waivers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.abc10.com


Science, all science.  Classrooms bad, little kids bads, schools kill grandparents, bad.  

depression, anxiety, suicide, widening the education gap for minority/underprivileged  kids - not an issue.  Taking care of teachers is the priority - kids are collateral damage and political pawns.  Pretty disgusting as a society that we've let this go this way.  

*We know that keeping schools open is one of the least dangerous — and most important — things a society can do.  *

And yes, teachers deserve more $$ to do what they do.  This is not the way to go about doing it.  .  There is nothing honorable about the actions of teacher's unions in Chicago, LA, etc.   All political BS, at the expense of the kids they pretend to care about.


----------



## happy9

Kicker4Life said:


> How is it conspiracy theory to point out facts?  I mean the head of another prominent Teachers Union likened wanting kids to go back to school to “White Privilege”.  I never said some teachers weren’t afraid of death. Hell every teacher I know should prefer to be in class and many districts have offered for those who are afraid, to be in charge of virtual class rooms (cause some families don’t want their kids to go back for that same fear).
> 
> One can argue/debate the rationality of that fear, but options abound to address and accommodate those who are concerned (minority) without negatively impacting those who are not (majority).
> 
> PS - have yet to hear the Cali Teachers Union reel back those demands.  Have you?


Wonder how much time the teachers union's leadership has spent  shopping at target - and not for essentials.  I hear the Target Strain of the Virus isn't as strong.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> How is it conspiracy theory to point out facts?  I mean the head of another prominent Teachers Union likened wanting kids to go back to school to “White Privilege”.  I never said some teachers weren’t afraid of death. Hell every teacher I know should prefer to be in class and many districts have offered for those who are afraid, to be in charge of virtual class rooms (cause some families don’t want their kids to go back for that same fear).
> 
> One can argue/debate the rationality of that fear, but options abound to address and accommodate those who are concerned (minority) without negatively impacting those who are not (majority).
> 
> PS - have yet to hear the Cali Teachers Union reel back those demands.  Have you?


It isn’t the California Teachers Union that made the statement back in June.  You’re just lying. 

It is great t hear that you’ve spoken to a few teachers and from your conversations that a majority of teachers in CA are ok with the risk of dying.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> It isn’t the California Teachers Union that made the statement back in June.  You’re just lying.
> 
> It is great t hear that you’ve spoken to a few teachers and from your conversations that a majority of teachers in CA are ok with the risk of dying.


Classrooms are scary places - full of danger and stuff - sneaky kids, pulling down their face masks and spitting at their teachers to kill them. 

  I know you don't really believe this BS that you are spewing.  You "appear" to be smart enough to review sciency stuff and come to logical conclusions.  But maybe not.  

Regardless, kids should be in school.  But I know how much you hate kids and that you blame them for increase in suicide, depression, anxiety.  Kids just aren't tough enough to get through this pandemic, especially  when paired with equally weak parents that have to do this thinga ma jig called work.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> It isn’t the California Teachers Union that made the statement back in June.  You’re just lying.
> 
> It is great t hear that you’ve spoken to a few teachers and from your conversations that a majority of teachers in CA are ok with the risk of dying.


When I’m wrong...I admit it.  You are correct, I was wrong that it was the California Teachers Union.  It was the Los Angeles Teachers Union....









						L.A. Teachers Union Calls to Defund Police, Cap Charter Schools as Part of COVID Reopening Plan
					

The second-largest teachers union in the U.S. called to defund the police and place a moratorium on charter schools in a "research paper" recommending that Los Angeles city schools stay closed at the beginning of the fall semester.United Teachers Los Angeles released its study on school...




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Wonder how much time the teachers union's leadership has spent  shopping at target - and not for essentials.  I hear the Target Strain of the Virus isn't as strong.


Oh here we go with more denialism. A trip to Target does not involve 30 new people in a small classroom every hour,  And the kids in last class of the day have had at least 100 transmissible interactions since the school day started

It is heartwarming to know that you can’t transmit covid traveling to and from soccer tournaments, attending soccer tournaments, going to Target, going to school, going to work, going to bars, going to restaurants, or anywhere other than lying in bed in a nursing home.

How does it feel to be an idiot? To not understand that the limits on youth sports exist for a legitimate reason? That remote school exists for a legitimate reason? That transgender sports participation policies exist for a legitimate reason?  That virtually every single topic here involves you upset because you aren’t getting what you want?


----------



## happy9

Kicker4Life said:


> When I’m wrong...I admit it.  You are correct, I was wrong that it was the California Teachers Union.  It was the Los Angeles Teachers Union....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> L.A. Teachers Union Calls to Defund Police, Cap Charter Schools as Part of COVID Reopening Plan
> 
> 
> The second-largest teachers union in the U.S. called to defund the police and place a moratorium on charter schools in a "research paper" recommending that Los Angeles city schools stay closed at the beginning of the fall semester.United Teachers Los Angeles released its study on school...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com


I mean, come on, they are just the second largest union in the country.  No influence there, minor players, small kid population, mostly wealthy, etc..


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> When I’m wrong...I admit it.  You are correct, I was wrong that it was the California Teachers Union.  It was the Los Angeles Teachers Union....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> L.A. Teachers Union Calls to Defund Police, Cap Charter Schools as Part of COVID Reopening Plan
> 
> 
> The second-largest teachers union in the U.S. called to defund the police and place a moratorium on charter schools in a "research paper" recommending that Los Angeles city schools stay closed at the beginning of the fall semester.United Teachers Los Angeles released its study on school...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com


Yeah, just like I already told you. Now admit that it was just a stupid ploy from last June that is not even remotely what LA teachers are currently requiring before returning to work.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Oh here we go with more denialism. A trip to Target does not involve 30 new people in a small classroom every hour,  And the kids in last class of the day have had at least 100 transmissible interactions since the school day started
> 
> It is heartwarming to know that you can’t transmit covid traveling to and from soccer tournaments, attending soccer tournaments, going to Target, going to school, going to work, going to bars, going to restaurants, or anywhere other than lying in bed in a nursing home.
> 
> How does it feel to be an idiot? To not understand that the limits on youth sports exist for a legitimate reason? That remote school exists for a legitimate reason? That transgender sports participation policies exist for a legitimate reason?  That virtually every single topic here involves you upset because you aren’t getting what you want?


There ya go, change the topic to another less than intelligent opinion - more gibbersish.

Are you ignoring the science on schools?  Are scientist lying? Is the data incorrect.  Do your orange boogey man skew the data.

I get it, pivot to stoopid, it's how you roll. 

Kids should be in school.  It's the least we can do for our kids.


----------



## Kicker4Life

happy9 said:


> Classrooms are scary places - full of danger and stuff - sneaky kids, pulling down their face masks and spitting at their teachers to kill them.
> 
> I know you don't really believe this BS that you are spewing.  You "appear" to be smart enough to review sciency stuff and come to logical conclusions.  But maybe not.
> 
> Regardless, kids should be in school.  But I know how much you hate kids and that you blame them for increase in suicide, depression, anxiety.  Kids just aren't tough enough to get through this pandemic, especially  when paired with equally weak parents that have to do this thinga ma jig called work.


CDC even agrees....









						CDC Makes The Case For Schools Reopening
					

Federal researchers say, with proper safety precautions, schools don't seem to fuel outbreaks, with some exceptions such as indoor sports practices.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Yeah, just like I already told you. Now admit that it was just a stupid ploy from last June that is not even remotely what LA teachers are currently requiring before returning to work.


As soon as you show me where they pulled back from those requests....your argument is semantics.....LA is in California so a California Teachers Union made the demands.....next.....sarcasm is lost in shallow minds


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Oh here we go with more denialism. A trip to Target does not involve 30 new people in a small classroom every hour,  And the kids in last class of the day have had at least 100 transmissible interactions since the school day started
> 
> It is heartwarming to know that you can’t transmit covid traveling to and from soccer tournaments, attending soccer tournaments, going to Target, going to school, going to work, going to bars, going to restaurants, or anywhere other than lying in bed in a nursing home.
> 
> How does it feel to be an idiot? To not understand that the limits on youth sports exist for a legitimate reason? That remote school exists for a legitimate reason? That transgender sports participation policies exist for a legitimate reason?  That virtually every single topic here involves you upset because you aren’t getting what you want?


Dude...you really shouldn't talk about schools, because you have no idea what you are talking about.  You are once again short sided in your responses and only look at things through your pinhole of reality.  30 kids in a class would be secondary education, you are failing to recognize the millions of kids in an elementary classroom that are with the teacher the entire day, wearing mask, 6 feet apart, with shields around their desk and not being aloud to get out of their seat.  So your denialism, doesn't count for that


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> As soon as you show me where they pulled back from those requests....your argument is semantics.....LA is in California so a California Teachers Union made the demands.....next.....sarcasm is lost in shallow minds


Look, you lied about what California teachers are requiring and now you want me to prove you more wrong. Call UTLA and ask yourself.

Regardless, none of this has anything to do with your claim that Newsom brainwashed California teachers into believing there is a risk of death when there isn’t. Your nonsense was jist a distraction from your other lie. 

If you want to get back to school, stop whining and do your part to stop spread and also encourage others to do so. Or just wait until everyone had been vaccinated.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Dude...you really shouldn't talk about schools, because you have no idea what you are talking about.  You are once again short sided in your responses and only look at things through your pinhole of reality.  30 kids in a class would be secondary education, you are failing to recognize the millions of kids in an elementary classroom that are with the teacher the entire day, wearing mask, 6 feet apart, with shields around their desk and not being aloud to get out of their seat.  So your denialism, doesn't count for that


I guess it’s ok to kill off the elementary school teachers...

Look, I understand that there are different risk factors at play for elementary school, but no one here is talking about elementary school children. This thread is about older kids, you know, elite soccer players which is ostensibly the point of this forum.  If you are here with an elementary school child because you think they’re an elite soccer player, you are @crush level nut job. Or do we need to discuss pre-school and day care in order to satisfy your distraction? 

And if I know so little about schools, and you know so much, please explain to me why exactly public schools are still remote? Is it because you and your four Q friends here think you know what you’re talking about?  So whiny.


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> Teachers have not wanted to go back into the classrooms because they have a legitimate fear of dying. It is not because they were misled by Newsom into believing it is dangerous when it is not.  Almost half a million people have died.
> 
> The social distancing guidelines were not misguided, they have saved lives and a lot of them.  Complain all you want. Fake speculate that no one would have died if we’d just pretended Covid-19 didn’t exist. Pretend that what you want (little Sally playing soccer) is more important than any of the million things that other people believe exceptions should be made for. You are where you are because you and people like you have never taken this seriously enough. Since the inception of the pandemic, people at this forum have done nothing but whine and oppose efforts to reduce spread.
> 
> There’s @MSK357 who claimed no one was dying of covid-19, and who promised to leave this site forever if more than 12,000 people died. He still thinks no one is dying of covid because Q has apparently told him they’re all dying “with” covid, which is about as dumbf**king a thing I’ve ever heard. Then there are the likes of @Desert Hound who was whining about not being able to hit the bars as far back as May or June I believe.
> 
> Then there is grace karen who is still going around claiming masks don’t work, and who blithely ignored recommendations to avoid spread to take her kid to Utah and back to play kiddie soccer early in the pandemic before CA had to clamp down hard after idiots like her weren’t getting it. These idiots are complaining that CA has had to implement strict regulations when the reason we have them is because they refused to even follow far less strict recommendations. Then there have been a whole slew of people mocking anyone in support of social distancing by claiming they should hide in their basement. They also claimed (and still claim) that old people who got it and died deserve it since they should have just stayed home, as if that were a legitimate option for most.
> 
> By all means keep criticizing people who call out those who refuse to comply with even the most basic and obvious of social distancing guidelines. Maybe you’ll all keep passing it around until it mutates enough so that the existing vaccines don’t work. Or it just keeps spreading because anti-vax psychos like @crush keep it going. Or until everyone is vaccinated because that is what people like you have proven it will take.


You did not address the criticism that, by closing outdoor spaces, we have moved people indoors where it is more dangerous.

Sally is safer playing sports than she is playing Wii at Susie’s.

That doesn’t mean Sally’s dad should invite Susie’s dad over for beer and poker.   Nor does it mean that their coach should fly to New York for a party.  Nor am I talking about tournaments in Phoenix.  I‘m just saying that local outdoor sports are a good thing to keep open.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Look, you lied about what California teachers are requiring and now you want me to prove you more wrong. Call UTLA and ask yourself.
> 
> Regardless, none of this has anything to do with your claim that Newsom brainwashed California teachers into believing there is a risk of death when there isn’t. Your nonsense was jist a distraction from your other lie.
> 
> If you want to get back to school, stop whining and do your part to stop spread and also encourage others to do so. Or just wait until everyone had been vaccinated.


Didn’t lie, I misspoke and corrected myself.  For example....are you lying that I said Newsome brainwashed CA teachers or did you just misspeak (this confusing me with another poster)?

Now go play in the traffic above your bridge...


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Look, you lied about what California teachers are requiring and now you want me to prove you more wrong. Call UTLA and ask yourself.
> 
> Regardless, none of this has anything to do with your claim that Newsom brainwashed California teachers into believing there is a risk of death when there isn’t. Your nonsense was jist a distraction from your other lie.
> 
> If you want to get back to school, stop whining and do your part to stop spread and also encourage others to do so. Or just wait until everyone had been vaccinated.





EOTL said:


> I guess it’s ok to kill off the elementary school teachers...
> 
> Look, I understand that there are different risk factors at play for elementary school, but no one here is talking about elementary school children. This thread is about older kids, you know, elite soccer players which is ostensibly the point of this forum.  If you are here with an elementary school child because you think they’re an elite soccer player, you are @crush level nut job. Or do we need to discuss pre-school and day care in order to satisfy your distraction?
> 
> And if I know so little about schools, and you know so much, please explain to me why exactly public schools are still remote? Is it because you and your four Q friends here think you know what you’re talking about?  So whiny.


Older kids? Did you just make that rule? Once again, you change it to fit your argument instead of looking at the entire picture...you are constantly short sided and look at things from only one perspective, and if it doesn't fit, you just ignore it.  

I know you don't know what you are talking about because there are many elementary schools and high schools that are in person learning already. So wrong you are!!!  You heard on CNN that California schools are not in session so you jumped to another conclusion that all schools must not be in session.  Do you know how many districts in California are back in school learning? How many schools are hybrid? Do you even know what hybrid learning is? Do you know how many cases have been transmitted at school? You don't know about school, so please stop trying

You are so arrogant and misled..you use the CDC and Faucci for their opinions on staying at home and mask, but when they say something you don't agree with, you ignore their opinion.  Both Fauci and CDC said it is safe for kids to go back to school, but somehow you know more about it than they do. You are too much

“It's less likely for a child to get infected in the school setting than if they were just in the community,” Fauci said.


----------



## Desert Hound

happy9 said:


> There ya go, change the topic to another less than intelligent opinion - more gibbersish.
> 
> Are you ignoring the science on schools?  Are scientist lying? Is the data incorrect.  Do your orange boogey man skew the data.
> 
> I get it, pivot to stoopid, it's how you roll.
> 
> Kids should be in school.  It's the least we can do for our kids.


Don't poke the bear....I mean cockroach. He will scurry away for a second only to re-appear a comment or 2 later. RAID does not work.


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> Asking for the other stuff also was certainly a stupid ploy by the LA teachers union back in June, but that has nothing to do with teachers not having a legitimate fear of dying. It’s incredibly asinine to claim that the LA union’s request from 7 months ago suggests that teachers aren’t worried about dying.  The fact that almost half a million people have already died is enough by itself to establish the legitimacy of their concern, and that they haven’t been duped by the Governor.   What you are doing is a typical Q/Fox News/OAN distraction.  Do you make stupid arguments like that because you are stupid and actually believe it, or is it because you’re embarrassed to admit you’re wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California teachers union wants schools in ‘purple’ counties to stay closed for 100 days; vaccinations for staff
> 
> 
> The teachers union wants most California schools to remain closed for 100 days while the state comes up with a plan to slow the spread of the virus and vaccinate school staff.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edsource.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article248846509.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Teachers must be vaccinated before L.A. schools can reopen, Beutner says
> 
> 
> L.A. schools Supt. Austin Beutner says reopening K-12 campuses will require the vaccination of teachers and staff. But UTLA says virus case rates also must drop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California teacher's unions worry about reopening schools
> 
> 
> One of California's two powerful teachers unions is warning that reopening schools would be "reckless."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ksby.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> California school waivers will require detailed planning
> 
> 
> The California Federation of Teachers and California Association of Private School Organizations spoke out about the waivers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.abc10.com


I would like to apologize for calling you obtuse in a thread a couple of weeks ago.  It was a poor mischaracterization by myself.  Upon further inspection you are pretty much just plain ignorant.  Ignorant, racist and homophobic are not the best qualities in a person, but you carry your banner well. 

Do teachers in California have some sort of fear that teachers in states that have student on campus don't have?  California teachers are hiding behind their union to the detriment of those who they pretend to care so much about, the children.  If we assume that all teachers are between the age of 18 and 64, their legitimate fear of dying from Covid comes out to be .3%.  Take the 60-64 year old age group out of that and it drops to .19%. 

Teachers aren't back in school because their union is exploiting a pandemic in order to further their liberal circle jerk of an agenda.  Unfortunately, there are plenty of teachers that do want to be back in school, but their union is holding them back. These are teachers that are dedicated to their craft and genuinely care for the children they interact with.  Nothing like being a state that forces teachers to pay union dues whether or not they even want to be.



happy9 said:


> depression, anxiety, suicide, widening the education gap for minority/underprivileged kids - not an issue.


To be fair to @EOTL, he/she/it never said these things weren't an issue.  The analogy used was, these things are like "heartburn."  One can only logically conclude, the comparison was to show that these mental illness symptoms were merely mildly annoying and not something anyone should really worry about.


----------



## NorCalDad

dad4 said:


> You did not address the criticism that, by closing outdoor spaces, we have moved people indoors where it is more dangerous.
> 
> Sally is safer playing sports than she is playing Wii at Susie’s.
> 
> That doesn’t mean Sally’s dad should invite Susie’s dad over for beer and poker.   Nor does it mean that their coach should fly to New York for a party.  Nor am I talking about tournaments in Phoenix.  I‘m just saying that local outdoor sports are a good thing to keep open.


This times 1000. For example, all the school field space closed just means people are going to congregate at the few fields that are open. There's absolutely no logic in that decision, but Newsom has everyone freaked out so much they can't think clearly. It's like the policy became "do the exact opposite of what a red state or Trump would do". To be clear I loath Trump....he's the biggest asshat of all asshats...He's the King Asshat.  That doesn't mean policies in CA should be driven by partisan politics. Maybe I'm wrong here.

I do agree with @Grace T. that we're not China.  We can't force people to lockdown and stay away from other folks.  Again, March - July, I give Newsom a pass.  We were trying to figure things out.  In fact before the 8/3 youth sports guidelines everyone was abiding by the camp guidelines.  Our kids were able to attend camps without masks or worry about social distancing.  They had to stay with the same group of 12, but they could have normal practices.  There was very little, if any, transmission during these.  He had the data even in his own backyard.  On 8/1 he should've emphasized outdoor activities and stressed the risk with indoor activities.


----------



## watfly

You know who else is probably afraid to got to work, but still diligently going to work in environments that are in many cases less safe than schools?

Private school teachers
Grocery clerks
Fast food clerks
Retail clerks
Barbers
Hairstylists
Nail beauticians
Sanitation workers
Nurses
Cops
Firemen
Pet groomers
Tattoo artists
Cooks
Chefs
Food servers
Bus boys
Dishwashers
Bell hops
Front desk clerks
Baseball coaches
Soccer coaches 
Softball coaches
Football coaches
Volleyball coaches
Dance instructors
Gymnastic coaches
Lacrosse coaches
Pharmacists 
Pharmacy clerks
Mechanics
Car salespeople
Flight attendants
Pilots
Uber drivers
Lyft drivers
....etc, etc, etc

Since when did public school teachers become such a protected class?  Do private school teachers have some kind of odd immunity to Covid?


----------



## Grace T.

watfly said:


> You know who else is probably afraid to got to work, but still diligently going to work in environments that are in many cases less safe than schools?
> 
> Private school teachers
> Grocery clerks
> Fast food clerks
> Retail clerks
> Barbers
> Hairstylists
> Nail beauticians
> Sanitation workers
> Nurses
> Cops
> Firemen
> Pet groomers
> Tattoo artists
> Cooks
> Chefs
> Food servers
> Bus boys
> Dishwashers
> Bell hops
> Front desk clerks
> Baseball coaches
> Soccer coaches
> Softball coaches
> Football coaches
> Volleyball coaches
> Dance instructors
> Gymnastic coaches
> Lacrosse coaches
> Pharmacists
> Pharmacy clerks
> Mechanics
> Car salespeople
> Flight attendants
> Pilots
> Uber drivers
> Lyft drivers
> ....etc, etc, etc
> 
> Since when did public school teachers become such a protected class?  Do private school teachers have some kind of odd immunity to Covid?


The Lyft/Uber/taxi driver thing is especially scary.  You are in an enclosed space, for usually more than 15 minutes at a time.  Unless the parties are wearing an N95, it's the type of situation where a mask is going to do very little (particularly for the passenger who is breathing in the air not only of the driver who has been sitting there all day, but the people who have been in the car before).  And sick people have got to get to the hospital too (have read in the press more than 1 story of a sick person who took a ride in a rent-transport to the doctor....IIRC that's how the initial outbreak in the Philippines began).


----------



## MacDre

Grace T. said:


> The Lyft/Uber/taxi driver thing is especially scary.  You are in an enclosed space, for usually more than 15 minutes at a time.  Unless the parties are wearing an N95, it's the type of situation where a mask is going to do very little (particularly for the passenger who is breathing in the air not only of the driver who has been sitting there all day, but the people who have been in the car before).  And sick people have got to get to the hospital too (have read in the press more than 1 story of a sick person who took a ride in a rent-transport to the doctor....IIRC that's how the initial outbreak in the Philippines began).


I recently had to take an Uber after I dropped my car off for service.  The driver and I both had on mask and the driver let the windows down.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Older kids? Did you just make that rule? Once again, you change it to fit your argument instead of looking at the entire picture...you are constantly short sided and look at things from only one perspective, and if it doesn't fit, you just ignore it.
> 
> I know you don't know what you are talking about because there are many elementary schools and high schools that are in person learning already. So wrong you are!!!  You heard on CNN that California schools are not in session so you jumped to another conclusion that all schools must not be in session.  Do you know how many districts in California are back in school learning? How many schools are hybrid? Do you even know what hybrid learning is? Do you know how many cases have been transmitted at school? You don't know about school, so please stop trying
> 
> You are so arrogant and misled..you use the CDC and Faucci for their opinions on staying at home and mask, but when they say something you don't agree with, you ignore their opinion.  Both Fauci and CDC said it is safe for kids to go back to school, but somehow you know more about it than they do. You are too much
> 
> “It's less likely for a child to get infected in the school setting than if they were just in the community,” Fauci said.


Oh christ. Yes, of course some schools are back, which depends in a number of factors including, but not limited to whether they’re public, transmission rates in the region, stupidity level, and age cohort.
Keep in mind that I’m not the one whining that schools aren’t in person. I’m just explaining why there are legitimate reasons why the ones that aren’t (which are still the large majority) aren’t.

Seriously, WTF is wrong with you people?  You whine like little babies that Newsom has scared teachers into not wanting to go back to schools, I tell you why you’re idiots and there are legitimate reasons for their concern about dying, and the response is that kids are in school so therefore I’m wrong?

Do you want to talk about Newsom allegedly scaring teachers to not come back?  Do you want to talk about how almost half a million people have doed from covid?  Do you want to talk about how some schools are back in session and whether it’s a good idea? WTF do y’all wanna talk about?

Regardless, you should probably take @NorCalDad out to the woodshed because, like I keep saying, his attempt to blame Newsom for shutting down schools is simply bogus. If anything, the fact that some schools are open shows that there has been flexibility and there hasn’t been this monolithic approach to in person school attendance by someone who eats babies (albeit wonderfully seasoned at the French Laundry). Y’all are nuts. When you’re not whining Newsom isn’t letting kids back in school, you’re whining that I’m telling them they’re wrong, amd as proof that I’m wrong, you’re pointing out that Newsom is letting kids back in school.


----------



## happy9

watfly said:


> You know who else is probably afraid to got to work, but still diligently going to work in environments that are in many cases less safe than schools?
> 
> 
> 
> Since when did public school teachers become such a protected class?  Do private school teachers have some kind of odd immunity to Covid?


Private and charter school rona strains are less virulent.

It's unfortunate that some teacher unions are are painting themselves into a corner and taking well meaning teachers with them.  Not all teacher unions are bad, the big ones don't do any good on behalf of those they supposedly serve.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Oh christ. Yes, of course some schools are back, which depends in a number of factors including, but not limited to whether they’re public, transmission rates in the region, stupidity level, and age cohort.
> Keep in mind that I’m not the one whining that schools aren’t in person. I’m just explaining why there are legitimate reasons why the ones that aren’t (which are still the large majority) aren’t.
> 
> Seriously, WTF is wrong with you people?  You whine like little babies that Newsom has scared teachers into not wanting to go back to schools, I tell you why you’re idiots and there are legitimate reasons for their concern about dying, and the response is that kids are in school so therefore I’m wrong?
> 
> Do you want to talk about Newsom allegedly scaring teachers to not come back?  Do you want to talk about how almost half a million people have doed from covid?  Do you want to talk about how some schools are back in session and whether it’s a good idea? WTF do y’all wanna talk about?
> 
> Regardless, you should probably take @NorCalDad out to the woodshed because, like I keep saying, his attempt to blame Newsom for shutting down schools is simply bogus. If anything, the fact that some schools are open shows that there has been flexibility and there hasn’t been this monolithic approach to in person school attendance by someone who eats babies (albeit wonderfully seasoned at the French Laundry). Y’all are nuts. When you’re not whining Newsom isn’t letting kids back in school, you’re whining that I’m telling them they’re wrong, amd as proof that I’m wrong, you’re pointing out that Newsom is letting kids back in school.


I smell some backpedaling going on.  Now you are just splaining some details?


----------



## tjinaz

happy9 said:


> State politics are local. Local politicians regurgitate what rolls down the hill.  People believe what their local politicians tell them.  That's where you start.
> 
> But yea, Newsome is a dirt bag, just like most Governors of his ilk are dirt bags.  Newsome is particularly loathsome because he has national aspirations and will do anything to be in the spotlight.  He is a spotlight Ranger.  They reside on both sides of the aisle.





EOTL said:


> I guess it’s ok to kill off the elementary school teachers...
> 
> Look, I understand that there are different risk factors at play for elementary school, but no one here is talking about elementary school children. This thread is about older kids, you know, elite soccer players which is ostensibly the point of this forum.  If you are here with an elementary school child because you think they’re an elite soccer player, you are @crush level nut job. Or do we need to discuss pre-school and day care in order to satisfy your distraction?
> 
> And if I know so little about schools, and you know so much, please explain to me why exactly public schools are still remote? Is it because you and your four Q friends here think you know what you’re talking about?  So whiny.


Oh Noes...    Even His Royal Highness his excellency Gavin Newsom is saying send the kids to School.  What now EOTL?  what are you going to do?  

Nevermind.. sure one of your other personalities will come into play and you can argue with yourself.


Newson vs Unions


----------



## EOTL

[


watfly said:


> You know who else is probably afraid to got to work, but still diligently going to work in environments that are in many cases less safe than schools?
> 
> Private school teachers
> Grocery clerks
> Fast food clerks
> Retail clerks
> Barbers
> Hairstylists
> Nail beauticians
> Sanitation workers
> Nurses
> Cops
> Firemen
> Pet groomers
> Tattoo artists
> Cooks
> Chefs
> Food servers
> Bus boys
> Dishwashers
> Bell hops
> Front desk clerks
> Baseball coaches
> Soccer coaches
> Softball coaches
> Football coaches
> Volleyball coaches
> Dance instructors
> Gymnastic coaches
> Lacrosse coaches
> Pharmacists
> Pharmacy clerks
> Mechanics
> Car salespeople
> Flight attendants
> Pilots
> Uber drivers
> Lyft drivers
> ....etc, etc, etc
> 
> Since when did public school teachers become such a protected class?  Do private school teachers have some kind of odd immunity to Covid?


Yes, and many of them have died. Many others have been forced to endanger themselves because they don’t have any leverage to protect themselves, and their pay is too low that they don’t have savings to call back on. 

I get that magats hate unions. You’d rather that employees could not use any leverage to negotiate things lome pay, health insurance, and health and safety. Well, too f**king bad.  If anything, the pandemic has shown why we need them more than ever.

The fact that you seem to think everyone is the same, has the same risks, and the same need to do their job in person only establishes how much of a waste of time it is to even have a discussion with you. But I like explaining why braindead magats are so stupid, so here goes.

Many nurses and firefighters, for example, must take greater risks because their jobs save lives, unlike teachers, and they also have more access (and more important access) to PPE. 

Many others subject themselves to danger because they must, since they have low paying jobs and therefore no savings, and no leverage to hold an employer accountable for putting them in danger.

Many jobs simply cannot be done remotely, unlike teaching. Flying a plane, for example.  Putting out fires, washing dishes.

And some jobs can be structured to avoid having any dangerous interactions, like pharmacists, or even Uber drivers who have been setting up plexiglass barriers in their vehicles.

CA teacher unions can be cautious and protect the lives of their members because they can.  

The mere fact that we are having this conversation at all means you have zero interest in a thoughtful conversation.  You just want to have your kid back at school and playing soccer and ate willing to make up any stupid as f**k argument to support it. But I must admit that your argument that other people are working in person so therefore everyone must work in person if I want them to is a particularly stupid one.

Keep up the whining. The more you and your covid denier friends complain about everything instead of doing what you should, the longer it is going to take.  You can’t say I didn’t warn you 9 months ago and every month that followed.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Private and charter school rona strains are less virulent.
> 
> It's unfortunate that some teacher unions are are painting themselves into a corner and taking well meaning teachers with them.  Not all teacher unions are bad, the big ones don't do any good on behalf of those they supposedly serve.


Private and charter school teachers don’t have a union to protect them. It’s unfortunate that those teachers must subject themselves to such risk. They’ll learn soon enough why the teacher turnover at these schools is so high.


----------



## Desert Hound

MacDre said:


> I recently had to take an Uber after I dropped my car off for service.  The driver and I both had on mask and the driver let the windows down.


Well to be fair you didn't use deodorant that day. Lets not confuse the issue/reason


----------



## EOTL

This is just so great that people here think teachers are the enemy. Or brainwashed apparently.  Anything but legitimately concerned that being back to school in person might cause them to die of the same thing that caused 500,000 deaths already. 

Whatever happened to the crowd that was claiming we could make it work by reversing airflow in classrooms at hundreds of millions of dollars in costs? Or have them wear hazmat suits. Have you all just abandoned ship are taking the approach that you do with kiddie sports, which is “nothing I want to do spreads covid”?


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Oh christ. Yes, of course some schools are back, which depends in a number of factors including, but not limited to whether they’re public, transmission rates in the region, stupidity level, and age cohort.
> Keep in mind that I’m not the one whining that schools aren’t in person. I’m just explaining why there are legitimate reasons why the ones that aren’t (which are still the large majority) aren’t.
> 
> Seriously, WTF is wrong with you people?  You whine like little babies that Newsom has scared teachers into not wanting to go back to schools, I tell you why you’re idiots and there are legitimate reasons for their concern about dying, and the response is that kids are in school so therefore I’m wrong?
> 
> Do you want to talk about Newsom allegedly scaring teachers to not come back?  Do you want to talk about how almost half a million people have doed from covid?  Do you want to talk about how some schools are back in session and whether it’s a good idea? WTF do y’all wanna talk about?
> 
> Regardless, you should probably take @NorCalDad out to the woodshed because, like I keep saying, his attempt to blame Newsom for shutting down schools is simply bogus. If anything, the fact that some schools are open shows that there has been flexibility and there hasn’t been this monolithic approach to in person school attendance by someone who eats babies (albeit wonderfully seasoned at the French Laundry). Y’all are nuts. When you’re not whining Newsom isn’t letting kids back in school, you’re whining that I’m telling them they’re wrong, amd as proof that I’m wrong, you’re pointing out that Newsom is letting kids back in school.


You are an absolute nut job. You asked my why schools are still remote, I explain to you that there are schools in person and in a hybrid model, then you start going into a rant about something else. What legitimate concerns do teachers have of dying? Have there been teachers that have recently died because of exposure in the classroom?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> *Private and charter school teachers don’t have a union to protect them*. It’s unfortunate that those teachers must subject themselves to such risk. They’ll learn soon enough why the teacher turnover at these schools is so high.


That's right, they don't.  

And yes, traditionally charters have a higher turnover rate than public schools.  There are multiple reasons why, not all bad.  Charters and privates aren't the panacea  all by any means, but they've traditionally served low income kids better than public schools.  It's unfortunate that public schools can't claim that title. 

Bottom line is that keeping kids in school shouldn't be a political thing, it should be done in spite of politics.  Teacher unions using CV19 to scare their teachers is pathetic.  You seem to be on board with waging war on kids - no school, no sports, just stay home and wear your mask.   You should write a book.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> This is just so great that people here think that* LA teachers UNIONs is the enemy of our children.* Or brainwashed apparently.  Anything but legitimately concerned that being back to school in person might cause them to die of the same thing that caused 500,000 deaths already.
> 
> Whatever happened to the crowd that was claiming we could make it work by reversing airflow in classrooms at hundreds of millions of dollars in costs? Or have them wear hazmat suits. Have you all just abandoned ship are taking the approach that you do with kiddie sports, which is “nothing I want to do spreads covid”?


Fixed it for ya.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> [
> 
> 
> Yes, and many of them have died. Many others have been forced to endanger themselves because they don’t have any leverage to protect themselves, and their pay is too low that they don’t have savings to call back on.
> 
> I get that magats hate unions. You’d rather that employees could not use any leverage to negotiate things lome pay, health insurance, and health and safety. Well, too f**king bad.  If anything, the pandemic has shown why we need them more than ever.
> 
> The fact that you seem to think everyone is the same, has the same risks, and the same need to do their job in person only establishes how much of a waste of time it is to even have a discussion with you. But I like explaining why braindead magats are so stupid, so here goes.
> 
> Many nurses and firefighters, for example, must take greater risks because their jobs save lives, unlike teachers, and they also have more access (and more important access) to PPE.
> 
> Many others subject themselves to danger because they must, since they have low paying jobs and therefore no savings, and no leverage to hold an employer accountable for putting them in danger.
> 
> Many jobs simply cannot be done remotely, unlike teaching. Flying a plane, for example.  Putting out fires, washing dishes.
> 
> And some jobs can be structured to avoid having any dangerous interactions, like pharmacists, or even Uber drivers who have been setting up plexiglass barriers in their vehicles.
> 
> CA teacher unions can be cautious and protect the lives of their members because they can.
> 
> The mere fact that we are having this conversation at all means you have zero interest in a thoughtful conversation.  You just want to have your kid back at school and playing soccer and ate willing to make up any stupid as f**k argument to support it. But I must admit that your argument that other people are working in person so therefore everyone must work in person if I want them to is a particularly stupid one.
> 
> Keep up the whining. The more you and your covid denier friends complain about everything instead of doing what you should, the longer it is going to take.  You can’t say I didn’t warn you 9 months ago and every month that followed.


Wait haven't you been locked down?  

And yes, back at school and playing locally is totally the reasonable and prudent thing to do.


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> Oh christ. Yes, of course some schools are back, which depends in a number of factors including, but not limited to whether they’re public, transmission rates in the region, stupidity level, and age cohort.
> Keep in mind that I’m not the one whining that schools aren’t in person. I’m just explaining why there are legitimate reasons why the ones that aren’t (which are still the large majority) aren’t.
> 
> Seriously, WTF is wrong with you people?  You whine like little babies that Newsom has scared teachers into not wanting to go back to schools, I tell you why you’re idiots and there are legitimate reasons for their concern about dying, and the response is that kids are in school so therefore I’m wrong?
> 
> Do you want to talk about Newsom allegedly scaring teachers to not come back?  Do you want to talk about how almost half a million people have doed from covid?  Do you want to talk about how some schools are back in session and whether it’s a good idea? WTF do y’all wanna talk about?
> 
> Regardless, you should probably take @NorCalDad out to the woodshed because, like I keep saying, his attempt to blame Newsom for shutting down schools is simply bogus. If anything, the fact that some schools are open shows that there has been flexibility and there hasn’t been this monolithic approach to in person school attendance by someone who eats babies (albeit wonderfully seasoned at the French Laundry). Y’all are nuts. When you’re not whining Newsom isn’t letting kids back in school, you’re whining that I’m telling them they’re wrong, amd as proof that I’m wrong, you’re pointing out that Newsom is letting kids back in school.


So that's a yes that public school teachers are a special protected class different than all other occupations.  Thanks for confirming.


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> Private and charter school teachers don’t have a union to protect them. It’s unfortunate that those teachers must subject themselves to such risk. They’ll learn soon enough why the teacher turnover at these schools is so high.


Yes, heaven forbid anyone think for themselves.  Fortunately, they have the union groupthink to help them.  

Think how scary you'd be EOTL if you had to think for yourself and not follow a groupthink narrative script.

Grocery workers need a new union because they are getting screwed.  They're exposed to hundreds of strangers every day indoors that have touched items they are now touching.  Do you want to touch that grapefruit that has been fondled by some pedo?


----------



## Kicker4Life

Plus @EOTL has it backwards....Newsome isn’t brainwashing the Teachers Unions....they have Newsome by the short and curlies!


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> Teachers have not wanted to go back into the classrooms because they have a legitimate fear of dying. It is not because they were misled by Newsom into believing it is dangerous when it is not.  Almost half a million people have died.
> 
> The social distancing guidelines were not misguided, they have saved lives and a lot of them.  Complain all you want. Fake speculate that no one would have died if we’d just pretended Covid-19 didn’t exist. Pretend that what you want (little Sally playing soccer) is more important than any of the million things that other people believe exceptions should be made for. You are where you are because you and people like you have never taken this seriously enough. Since the inception of the pandemic, people at this forum have done nothing but whine and oppose efforts to reduce spread.
> 
> There’s @MSK357 who claimed no one was dying of covid-19, and who promised to leave this site forever if more than 12,000 people died. He still thinks no one is dying of covid because Q has apparently told him they’re all dying “with” covid, which is about as dumbf**king a thing I’ve ever heard. Then there are the likes of @Desert Hound who was whining about not being able to hit the bars as far back as May or June I believe.
> 
> Then there is grace karen who is still going around claiming masks don’t work, and who blithely ignored recommendations to avoid spread to take her kid to Utah and back to play kiddie soccer early in the pandemic before CA had to clamp down hard after idiots like her weren’t getting it. These idiots are complaining that CA has had to implement strict regulations when the reason we have them is because they refused to even follow far less strict recommendations. Then there have been a whole slew of people mocking anyone in support of social distancing by claiming they should hide in their basement. They also claimed (and still claim) that old people who got it and died deserve it since they should have just stayed home, as if that were a legitimate option for most.
> 
> By all means keep criticizing people who call out those who refuse to comply with even the most basic and obvious of social distancing guidelines. Maybe you’ll all keep passing it around until it mutates enough so that the existing vaccines don’t work. Or it just keeps spreading because anti-vax psychos like @crush keep it going. Or until everyone is vaccinated because that is what people like you have proven it will take.


EOTL, I'm honored to be on the list of the top three.  You picked me last, is that for a reason?  Check this bro.  My buddy, who owns a AC company, just lost his top Tech because his kids education is horrible and no sports.  Tech's wife works too so no one is watching their two dds.  He is so discouraged to lose #1 salesman to Texas.   Like I said a long time ago, this is a house a cards and everyone needs to forgive and forget.  It's the only way to live.  Most can;t forget because they haven;t learned the power of forgiveness.


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> I guess it’s ok to kill off the elementary school teachers...
> 
> Look, I understand that there are different risk factors at play for elementary school, but no one here is talking about elementary school children. This thread is about older kids, you know, elite soccer players which is ostensibly the point of this forum.  If you are here with an elementary school child because you think they’re an elite soccer player, you are @crush level nut job. Or do we need to discuss pre-school and day care in order to satisfy your distraction?
> 
> And if I know so little about schools, and you know so much, please explain to me why exactly public schools are still remote? Is it because you and your four Q friends here think you know what you’re talking about?  So whiny.


Why picking on Crush's DD again bro?


----------



## Anon9

crush said:


> Why picking on Crush's DD again bro?


Didn't you challenge him to a boxing match? What a wuss to not take you up. He feels very tough behind a keyboard, I wish he had the ovaries to come out of his basement..........


----------



## TheVirginian

Schools just have not been a factor in transmission.  But, to be fair, its something like 50% of the parents that don't want to send kids to schools.  I think the schools are just responding to parent fears.  If parents were 90% in favor of school opening, the schools would open.   I do not like teachers' unions, but this one isn't their fault.


----------



## crush

Anon9 said:


> Didn't you challenge him to a boxing match? What a wuss to not take you up. He feels very tough behind a keyboard, I wish he had the ovaries to come out of his basement..........


I did but he never took me up on the challenge.  Big boxing gloves and a ring and it was crickets on the response.  No hiding with me bro.  I'm ready for da match.  We can raise donations for the kids who need food.  I've been trainng with my wife at my buddies under ground UFC gym.  We actually do kick boxing and I'm getting good.  We can do a kick & boxing match. 3 rounds at 3 minutes each.  That's all I got.


----------



## happy9

TheVirginian said:


> Schools just have not been a factor in transmission.  *But, to be fair, its something like 50% of the parents that don't want to send kids to schools*.  I think the schools are just responding to parent fears.  If parents were 90% in favor of school opening, the schools would open.   I do not like teachers' unions, but this one isn't their fault.


Is that a CA stat or is that nationwide.  Would be interesting to compare/contrast that number regionally.


----------



## Soccerfan2

TheVirginian said:


> Schools just have not been a factor in transmission.  But, to be fair, its something like 50% of the parents that don't want to send kids to schools.  I think the schools are just responding to parent fears.  If parents were 90% in favor of school opening, the schools would open.   I do not like teachers' unions, but this one isn't their fault.


I’ve been back in the classroom teaching since Nov 4. My DD’s have both been in class as well. I’m lucky to be in a district and local union chapter that both supported returning (85% of our teachers voted to return) and worked together to make it happen. The parent community largely wanted back too. 75% of our families wanted to come back and 25% remain in distance learning by choice.
The district keeps stats on student and teacher cases. About .03% of staff/students are testing positive each week. This almost exactly matches the positives for the county as a whole. Cases in our county have been falling very very fast since the holidays. Schools being open do not seem to accelerate transmission based on our data.


----------



## Grace T.

TheVirginian said:


> Schools just have not been a factor in transmission.  But, to be fair, its something like 50% of the parents that don't want to send kids to schools.  I think the schools are just responding to parent fears.  If parents were 90% in favor of school opening, the schools would open.   I do not like teachers' unions, but this one isn't their fault.


You have a point. From the surveys I’ve seen it’s closer to 1/3 1/3 1/3.  1/3 are send the kids back full time come hell or high water. 1/3 are panicked and don’t want to go back. 1/3 are in between and go from returning to not depending on the level of protective (masks, pods, testing) and case loads out there. If 90.% of parents demanded the teachers reopen the schools would be open. But it’s also the teachers unions.  Their members are split among the same lines and the panicked 1/3 are the most vocal (hey why take a chance if you don’t have to not to mention the child care issues which might arise and some people prefer working from home). If the teachers wanted to go back, schools would be open regardless what the panicked 1/3 of parents would say. It’s both.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> You have a point. From the surveys I’ve seen it’s closer to 1/3 1/3 1/3.  1/3 are send the kids back full time come hell or high water. 1/3 are panicked and don’t want to go back. 1/3 are in between and go from returning to not depending on the level of protective (masks, pods, testing) and case loads out there. If 90.% of parents demanded the teachers reopen the schools would be open. But it’s also the teachers unions.  Their members are split among the same lines and the panicked 1/3 are the most vocal (hey why take a chance if you don’t have to not to mention the child care issues which might arise and some people prefer working from home). If the teachers wanted to go back, schools would be open regardless what the panicked 1/3 of parents would say. It’s both.


Help me out here -- which dictionary do you issue to find a fitting definition for your use of the word "panic"?


----------



## crush

espola said:


> Help me out here -- which dictionary do you issue to find a fitting definition for your use of the word "panic"?


Panic= "I scared"


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Teachers have not wanted to go back into the classrooms because they have a legitimate fear of dying. It is not because they were misled by Newsom into believing it is dangerous when it is not.  Almost half a million people have died.
> 
> The social distancing guidelines were not misguided, they have saved lives and a lot of them.  Complain all you want. Fake speculate that no one would have died if we’d just pretended Covid-19 didn’t exist. Pretend that what you want (little Sally playing soccer) is more important than any of the million things that other people believe exceptions should be made for. You are where you are because you and people like you have never taken this seriously enough. Since the inception of the pandemic, people at this forum have done nothing but whine and oppose efforts to reduce spread.
> 
> There’s @MSK357 who claimed no one was dying of covid-19, and who promised to leave this site forever if more than 12,000 people died. He still thinks no one is dying of covid because Q has apparently told him they’re all dying “with” covid, which is about as dumbf**king a thing I’ve ever heard. Then there are the likes of @Desert Hound who was whining about not being able to hit the bars as far back as May or June I believe.
> 
> Then there is grace karen who is still going around claiming masks don’t work, and who blithely ignored recommendations to avoid spread to take her kid to Utah and back to play kiddie soccer early in the pandemic before CA had to clamp down hard after idiots like her weren’t getting it. These idiots are complaining that CA has had to implement strict regulations when the reason we have them is because they refused to even follow far less strict recommendations. Then there have been a whole slew of people mocking anyone in support of social distancing by claiming they should hide in their basement. They also claimed (and still claim) that old people who got it and died deserve it since they should have just stayed home, as if that were a legitimate option for most.
> 
> By all means keep criticizing people who call out those who refuse to comply with even the most basic and obvious of social distancing guidelines. Maybe you’ll all keep passing it around until it mutates enough so that the existing vaccines don’t work. Or it just keeps spreading because anti-vax psychos like @crush keep it going. Or until everyone is vaccinated because that is what people like you have proven it will take.


You really don’t have anything else to do, do you?


----------



## kickingandscreaming

Soccerfan2 said:


> I’ve been back in the classroom teaching since Nov 4. My DD’s have both been in class as well. I’m lucky to be in a district and local union chapter that both supported returning (85% of our teachers voted to return) and worked together to make it happen. The parent community largely wanted back too. 75% of our families wanted to come back and 25% remain in distance learning by choice.
> The district keeps stats on student and teacher cases. About .03% of staff/students are testing positive each week. This almost exactly matches the positives for the county as a whole. Cases in our county have been falling very very fast since the holidays. Schools being open do not seem to accelerate transmission based on our data.


It's encouraging to see schools and communities working together to come to a solution that works for both "sides". It's a sliver of positive collaboration in a time of divisiveness.


----------



## crush

Scott m Shurson said:


> You really don’t have anything else to do, do you?


Hey Scott, I wonder why the great one, EOTL, kept you off his top 3?


----------



## crush

kickingandscreaming said:


> It's encouraging to see schools and communities working together to come to a solution that works for both "sides". It's a sliver of positive collaboration in a time of divisiveness.


Yes, if we all would think of the kids first and what is best for them, divisiveness goes away.


----------



## watfly

I must run in completely different circles than everyone else because I don't know any family that wouldn't put their kids back in class full time NOW.  That's families that cover the full political spectrum.   I do know I few people that don't have kids that don't want kids back in school but that's it.


----------



## happy9

Soccerfan2 said:


> I’ve been back in the classroom teaching since Nov 4. My DD’s have both been in class as well. I’m lucky to be in a district and local union chapter that both supported returning (85% of our teachers voted to return) and worked together to make it happen. The parent community largely wanted back too. 75% of our families wanted to come back and 25% remain in distance learning by choice.
> The district keeps stats on student and teacher cases. About .03% of staff/students are testing positive each week. This almost exactly matches the positives for the county as a whole. Cases in our county have been falling very very fast since the holidays. Schools being open do not seem to accelerate transmission based on our data.


shhhh, please, no science.  It's very confusing.


----------



## crush

watfly said:


> I must run in completely different circles than everyone else because I don't know any family that wouldn't put their kids back in class full time NOW.  That's families that cover the full political spectrum.   I do know I few people that don't have kids that don't want kids back in school but that's it.


I know a few teachers ((my friends tell me their true feelings)) that tell me the last 10 months has been amazing.  One of them now get's to be with her kids and teach other kids, all from home.  I like that for mom.   I know some dads who used to drive from Temecula up to Ontario to teach and it was hell for them driving up in the morning.  Life was so fast and no time spent with his family.  Now dad is at home and all is well.  I wouldn;t want to go back to driving on those IE freeways either.  I would use Rona 100% to stay home with my loved ones and not all the road ragers on the 15 fwry. Let's figure out a way to learn from the past and then reach for the stars.


----------



## dad4

watfly said:


> I must run in completely different circles than everyone else because I don't know any family that wouldn't put their kids back in class full time NOW.  That's families that cover the full political spectrum.   I do know I few people that don't have kids that don't want kids back in school but that's it.


At least for me, it depends on the number of unique contacts per day.

A single class of 30 that goes through all subjects?  Great idea, especially if it is outside.

A traditional schedule with 150 unique contacts?  No thanks.  

We had a split at the high school over this.  Parents of younger kids wanted stable groups, and parents of older kids wanted a standard class rotation.


----------



## NorCalDad

EOTL said:


> Teachers have not wanted to go back into the classrooms because they have a legitimate fear of dying. It is not because they were misled by Newsom into believing it is dangerous when it is not.  Almost half a million people have died.
> 
> The social distancing guidelines were not misguided, they have saved lives and a lot of them.  Complain all you want. Fake speculate that no one would have died if we’d just pretended Covid-19 didn’t exist. Pretend that what you want (little Sally playing soccer) is more important than any of the million things that other people believe exceptions should be made for. You are where you are because you and people like you have never taken this seriously enough. Since the inception of the pandemic, people at this forum have done nothing but whine and oppose efforts to reduce spread.
> 
> There’s @MSK357 who claimed no one was dying of covid-19, and who promised to leave this site forever if more than 12,000 people died. He still thinks no one is dying of covid because Q has apparently told him they’re all dying “with” covid, which is about as dumbf**king a thing I’ve ever heard. Then there are the likes of @Desert Hound who was whining about not being able to hit the bars as far back as May or June I believe.
> 
> Then there is grace karen who is still going around claiming masks don’t work, and who blithely ignored recommendations to avoid spread to take her kid to Utah and back to play kiddie soccer early in the pandemic before CA had to clamp down hard after idiots like her weren’t getting it. These idiots are complaining that CA has had to implement strict regulations when the reason we have them is because they refused to even follow far less strict recommendations. Then there have been a whole slew of people mocking anyone in support of social distancing by claiming they should hide in their basement. They also claimed (and still claim) that old people who got it and died deserve it since they should have just stayed home, as if that were a legitimate option for most.
> 
> By all means keep criticizing people who call out those who refuse to comply with even the most basic and obvious of social distancing guidelines. Maybe you’ll all keep passing it around until it mutates enough so that the existing vaccines don’t work. Or it just keeps spreading because anti-vax psychos like @crush keep it going. Or until everyone is vaccinated because that is what people like you have proven it will take.


So, @EOTL we probably have similar ideological views when you look at the root of the discussions here. I don't think the way you communicate is productive, but I agree with a lot of your foundations. Yes, I know you're not trying to be productive here in these soccer forums. Let me try this.

Do you think it's a fair statement to say that a significant percentage of Californians never planned on complying with the lockdown orders or other covid related guidelines? Just knowing that, doesn't that warrant looking at the situation differently? 

Look at the numbers in Texas. They're pretty spot on with California -- pretty much across the board. They have a slightly higher death rate per 100k, but California will likely match that in the coming weeks. Yet, the policies implemented in each state couldn't be anymore different. Don't you think we should look at that?


----------



## NorCalDad

watfly said:


> I must run in completely different circles than everyone else because I don't know any family that wouldn't put their kids back in class full time NOW.  That's families that cover the full political spectrum.   I do know I few people that don't have kids that don't want kids back in school but that's it.


I can confirm this sentiment.  Everyone I know wants their kids back in school.  Albeit, safely.  They want the teachers to be safe....PPEs, plexiglass, etc.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> At least for me, it depends on the number of unique contacts per day.
> 
> A single class of 30 that goes through all subjects?  Great idea, especially if it is outside.
> 
> A traditional schedule with 150 unique contacts?  No thanks.
> 
> We had a split at the high school over this.  Parents of younger kids wanted stable groups, and parents of older kids wanted a standard class rotation.


My teens have been back at HS full time since late aug/beginning of September. They run classes like they did last year. So lots of different contacts. There hasn't been any issues. 

The same has been seen in other places around the US and the world where they are back in school. It isn't an issue.


----------



## Desert Hound

NorCalDad said:


> Look at the numbers in Texas. They're pretty spot on with California -- pretty much across the board. They have a slightly higher death rate per 100k, but California will likely match that in the coming weeks. Yet, the policies implemented in each state couldn't be anymore different. Don't you think we should look at that?


CA cases per million: 84,251
TX cases per million: 83,430
FL cases per million: 80,414

The idea behind masks, biz shutdowns, no school, etc was to LIMIT the spread. CA has been one of the strictest in the nation in this regard. FL and TX completely opposite. 

If you live in TX or FL your kid has been back in school for months, you can go out to eat (inside or outside), your kids are playing sports. You can go to Disney World...etc. 

CA has inflicted economic pain and suffering, educational harm, etc all for nothing. 

The data above tells you all you need to know. 

And people wonder on this board hey if we get down to (whatever color) maybe kids can play sports and other stuff can open up. At some point people should look at the data and say screw that. Open up.


----------



## MacDre

watfly said:


> I must run in completely different circles than everyone else because I don't know any family that wouldn't put their kids back in class full time NOW.  That's families that cover the full political spectrum.   I do know I few people that don't have kids that don't want kids back in school but that's it.


I’m not ready for my kid to go back to school yet.  I think the Covid break has been very beneficial for her.  She has learned how to skate and hop a fence.  As a guy that grew up in 80’s, I tend to think that our kids lives are overly structured and many kids are socially inept because of it.  I have thoroughly enjoyed dropping my kid off at the skate park and watching her evolve socially by “playing outside” and developing those conflict resolution skills without adults and without bullying or being bullied.
I know the situation with my kid is different and she probably would’ve had to drop out of brick and mortar school anyways this year.  But, I have also met quite a few “lower class” dads that drop their kids off at our local park on their way to work and pick them up on their way home and they’re all happy that their kids have been able to experience what childhood was like in the 80’s.


----------



## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> CA cases per million: 84,251
> TX cases per million: 83,430
> FL cases per million: 80,414
> 
> The idea behind masks, biz shutdowns, no school, etc was to LIMIT the spread. CA has been one of the strictest in the nation in this regard. FL and TX completely opposite.
> 
> If you live in TX or FL your kid has been back in school for months, you can go out to eat (inside or outside), your kids are playing sports. You can go to Disney World...etc.
> 
> CA has inflicted economic pain and suffering, educational harm, etc all for nothing.
> 
> The data above tells you all you need to know.
> 
> And people wonder on this board hey if we get down to (whatever color) maybe kids can play sports and other stuff can open up. At some point people should look at the data and say screw that. Open up.


CA deaths per million: 1046
FL deaths per million: 1242
TX deaths per million: 1293
AZ deaths per million:  1836

Yep.  Close to identical.  Except for all the extra deaths in AZ.

I guess the takeaway is, don’t take advice from Arizona.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

crush said:


> Hey Scott, I wonder why the great one, EOTL, kept you off his top 3?


I’m holding out for Top 3 on one of his/her/its other profiles.

Congratulations to you, though!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> I’m not ready for my kid to go back to school yet.  I think the Covid break has been very beneficial for her.  She has learned how to skate and hop a fence.  As a guy that grew up in 80’s, I tend to think that our kids lives are overly structured and many kids are socially inept because of it.  I have thoroughly enjoyed dropping my kid off at the skate park and watching her evolve socially by “playing outside” and developing those conflict resolution skills without adults and without bullying or being bullied.
> I know the situation with my kid is different and she probably would’ve had to drop out of brick and mortar school anyways this year.  But, I have also met quite a few “lower class” dads that drop their kids off at our local park on their way to work and pick them up on their way home and they’re all happy that their kids have been able to experience what childhood was like in the 80’s.


She couldn’t do all of that after 3 pm everyday like the rest of  us did?


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> At least for me, it depends on the number of unique contacts per day.
> 
> A single class of 30 that goes through all subjects?  Great idea, especially if it is outside.
> 
> A traditional schedule with 150 unique contacts?  No thanks.
> 
> We had a split at the high school over this.  Parents of younger kids wanted stable groups, and parents of older kids wanted a standard class rotation.


Fair and I think you should have a choice to do what you think is best for your family, whether its based on emotion, or science.  I don't think your saying that you would take away that choice to go to school full time from other parents.  So I'm pretty sure you and I are on the same page.  I think we all agree that being back at school should be done with some common sense protections.



MacDre said:


> I’m not ready for my kid to go back to school yet.  I think the Covid break has been very beneficial for her.  She has learned how to skate and hop a fence.  As a guy that grew up in 80’s, I tend to think that our kids lives are overly structured and many kids are socially inept because of it.  I have thoroughly enjoyed dropping my kid off at the skate park and watching her evolve socially by “playing outside” and developing those conflict resolution skills without adults and without bullying or being bullied.
> I know the situation with my kid is different and she probably would’ve had to drop out of brick and mortar school anyways this year.  But, I have also met quite a few “lower class” dads that drop their kids off at our local park on their way to work and pick them up on their way home and they’re all happy that their kids have been able to experience what childhood was like in the 80’s.


My son's skating and surfing has improved dramatically during Covid, he has also caught a lot more fish than he normally would had he been in in-person school full-time.  If you were able to take advantage of them, there was some temporary benefits to the lockdown, but that was largely dependent on your socioeconomic status.  Just like vacations the Covid school break has to end at some point and we passed that point months ago.  It's not sustainable to not have kids in a proper learning environment.  It's a significant detriment to our communities in the short and long term.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> CA deaths per million: 1046
> FL deaths per million: 1242
> TX deaths per million: 1293
> AZ deaths per million:  1836
> 
> Yep.  Close to identical.  Except for all the extra deaths in AZ.
> 
> I guess the takeaway is, don’t take advice from Arizona.


Actually your the math guy. Tell me why cases per million do not stack up nicely with deaths per million? 

That is the part you overlook. Most people do. 

Utah about the same cases per million as AZ but deaths per million are less then a 1/3 of AZ
OR

OK about the same cases per million but half the deaths
Or

WI and MS having about identical cases per million but one has DOUBLE the deaths per million.

And so on.

Go look at the data for the states. Then do the same thing with countries.

It doesn't match up nicely...ie cases per million vs deaths per million.

So the take away I have looking at the data is that cases per million is not a good indicator of deaths per million.


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> CA deaths per million: 1046
> FL deaths per million: 1242
> TX deaths per million: 1293
> AZ deaths per million:  1836
> 
> Yep.  Close to identical.  Except for all the extra deaths in AZ.
> 
> I guess the takeaway is, don’t take advice from Arizona.


A disproportionate share of deaths come from the Native American communities in Arizona (and New Mexico) where access to healthcare is limited.  Not saying that makes up the entire difference but it is a factor.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> She couldn’t do all of that after 3 pm everyday like the rest of  us did?


No, because she had homework, soccer, dance, and/or swimming practice.  I also never saw kids playing outside before Covid.


----------



## NorCalDad

Desert Hound said:


> CA cases per million: 84,251
> TX cases per million: 83,430
> FL cases per million: 80,414
> 
> The idea behind masks, biz shutdowns, no school, etc was to LIMIT the spread. CA has been one of the strictest in the nation in this regard. FL and TX completely opposite.
> 
> If you live in TX or FL your kid has been back in school for months, you can go out to eat (inside or outside), your kids are playing sports. You can go to Disney World...etc.
> 
> CA has inflicted economic pain and suffering, educational harm, etc all for nothing.
> 
> The data above tells you all you need to know.
> 
> And people wonder on this board hey if we get down to (whatever color) maybe kids can play sports and other stuff can open up. At some point people should look at the data and say screw that. Open up.


I think we agree, but based on different reasoning.  It's not that the lockdown's and draconian rules didn't work...it's that not enough people followed the rules.  Again, as @Grace T. rightfully pointed out many moons ago, we're not China.  The rules were never enforceable.  I do believe, however, if we had a different federal administration that could've worked more collaboratively with the states on cohesive communication and policy we all would've collectively come out of this better.  We will never know the answer to that.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> No, because she had homework, soccer, dance, and/or swimming practice.  I also never saw kids playing outside before Covid.


All good stuff, but if she’s still in Tijuana, keep an eye on that “hop a fence” thingy.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> CA deaths per million: 1046
> FL deaths per million: 1242
> TX deaths per million: 1293
> AZ deaths per million:  1836
> 
> Yep.  Close to identical.  Except for all the extra deaths in AZ.
> 
> I guess the takeaway is, don’t take advice from Arizona.


The other thing I notice is that you avoid trying to explain why CA has more cases per million vs states you regularly talked about saying they were doing it wrong...TX and FL. I suspect the reason is you can't explain it. 

If the policies CA put in place and you were/are a fan of worked, we would expect to see substantially lower cases per million in CA vs TX or FL right? But we haven't.

And since you bring up AZ...

AZ is at 105k cases per million and CA is at 84k. And before you go see that proves CA did it right...*remember that just a few short weeks ago AZ was at 84k (where CA is today).* CA will be at 100k + in the near future.


----------



## crush

MacDre said:


> No, because she had homework, soccer, dance, and/or swimming practice.  I also never saw kids playing outside before Covid.


The old days sucked and I will never go back.  The free time we all have now is amazing.


----------



## dad4

watfly said:


> Fair and I think you should have a choice to do what you think is best for your family, whether its based on emotion, or science.  I don't think your saying that you would take away that choice to go to school full time from other parents.  So I'm pretty sure you and I are on the same page.  I think we all agree that being back at school should be done with some common sense protections.


I still don’t see infectious disease as a good place for individualism.

When we open things up, each person chooses whether to receive the benefits.  But we all get the costs, whether we like it or not. 

When restaurants opened up, cases went up.  Whether you went out for dinner or not, you had a higher risk.  The whole group gets the higher risk.

So we have to make our decisions as a group, based on the overall costs and benefits to everyone.  It is not just me doing what is right for me.

That’s why I feel it is important to get the rules right.  Those rules will limit our choices, just like any other rules.


----------



## Desert Hound

NorCalDad said:


> I do believe, however, if we had a different federal administration that could've worked more collaboratively with the states on cohesive communication and policy we all would've collectively come out of this better. We will never know the answer to that.


I think in a sense we do know. Just go look at the other major Euro countries. France, Germany, UK, Italy, Spain, Belgium and Netherlands. Collectively they have roughly the same population as the US. 

US has 454k deaths so far
Those Euro countries have 420k deaths

We were told by the press for months that the Euro countries got it right. Their governments worked with local areas and as such did a better job than the US. 

The reality is they have done no better vs the US. 

We are dealing with a virus that spreads easily. Gov policy won't change that fact. People have to work to survive. So they will be around people. People are social animals and will congregate despite various gov restrictions, etc.


----------



## Grace T.

NorCalDad said:


> I think we agree, but based on different reasoning.  It's not that the lockdown's and draconian rules didn't work...it's that not enough people followed the rules.  Again, as @Grace T. rightfully pointed out many moons ago, we're not China.  The rules were never enforceable.  I do believe, however, if we had a different federal administration that could've worked more collaboratively with the states on cohesive communication and policy we all would've collectively come out of this better.  We will never know the answer to that.


We know that hard lockdowns work.  Australia and New Zealand at least proved that.  It required extreme heavy handed steps of questionable Constitutionality (including on the left sealing the border....Biden has already halted work on the wall, tried to cease deportations, and is working on an EO that will revive asylum protocols....also on the left it would have required a brutal suppression of the BLM protests in arguable violation of the First Amendment).  The other problem is it would have required those heavy handed steps to go on for more than a year...in the middle of an election (or suspension of that election).

People are naturally socially.  For high es socializing is like air and water and food...it's a psychological need.  While the Trump administration was uniquely bad, I don't think things would have worked out better with a D admin (or even a Romney 2nd term).  The problem is states like Florida wanted to do what they wanted to do, and states like NY and CA wanted to do what they wanted.  No one would ever be able to corral those 2 points of view.  The communication might have been better, but only the margins....pick any other country in Europe and you'd see the results....best case we are Germany instead.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> I still don’t see infectious disease as a good place for individualism.
> 
> When we open things up, each person chooses whether to receive the benefits.  But we all get the costs, whether we like it or not.
> 
> When restaurants opened up, cases went up.  Whether you went out for dinner or not, you had a higher risk.  The whole group gets the higher risk.
> 
> So we have to make our decisions as a group, based on the overall costs and benefits to everyone.  It is not just me doing what is right for me.
> 
> That’s why I feel it is important to get the rules right.  Those rules will limit our choices, just like any other rules.


The problem is we will never agree because 1/3 of us are scared to death and want to hide under the bed forever.  1/3 of us want the vast majority of restrictions to go away either now or at least when the old folks are vaccinated.  

The other problem is that there isn't an objectively "right" answer here.  There's only trade offs...winners and losers.  Lock them up and you are going to cause enormous damage to the high es which they'll carry around for years, suicides, and ODs.  Open it all up and you kill all the grandmas.


----------



## Anon9

Desert Hound said:


> I think in a sense we do know. Just go look at the other major Euro countries. France, Germany, UK, Italy, Spain, Belgium and Netherlands. Collectively they have roughly the same population as the US.
> 
> US has 454k deaths so far
> Those Euro countries have 420k deaths
> 
> We were told by the press for months that the Euro countries got it right. Their governments worked with local areas and as such did a better job than the US.
> 
> The reality is they have done no better vs the US.
> 
> We are dealing with a virus that spreads easily. Gov policy won't change that fact. People have to work to survive. So they will be around people. People are social animals and will congregate despite various gov restrictions, etc.


Case numbers are not a good indicator of actual cases. Some states test more than others, and people in some states don't care to get tested. Deaths is more of an accurate indicator of total actual cases.


----------



## dad4

Hound, you’re about 8 months out of date with the claim that Europe did it right.

Europe was doing it right, and then they opened up the bars, restaurants, and everything else.  Once they did that, they got bad results, too.

Next you are going to give us a graph of North Dakota that only includes January.  

If you are going to contribute, please try to contribute something useful.  Not just something that says what you want to hear.


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> I still don’t see infectious disease as a good place for individualism.


Particularly individualism that is based on fear and emotion and not evidence.


----------



## Grace T.

watfly said:


> Particularly individualism that is based on fear and emotion and not evidence.


As I've said before, it goes a long way to explaining the "n" in his personality profile for what is otherwise a data guy.

All these choices are individualism.  It's just some people's individualism v. other people's individualism.  Collective action is impossible without either consensus or having somebody from the top down cram it down.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Soccerfan2 said:


> I’ve been back in the classroom teaching since Nov 4. My DD’s have both been in class as well. I’m lucky to be in a district and local union chapter that both supported returning (85% of our teachers voted to return) and worked together to make it happen. The parent community largely wanted back too. 75% of our families wanted to come back and 25% remain in distance learning by choice.
> The district keeps stats on student and teacher cases. About .03% of staff/students are testing positive each week. This almost exactly matches the positives for the county as a whole. Cases in our county have been falling very very fast since the holidays. Schools being open do not seem to accelerate transmission based on our data.


Prior to the start of the school year parents in my district were given a choice to choose if they wanted distance learning or return to on site instruction. More than 75% preferred distance learning over returning. This of course had to do with the rise in cases at the time. A questionnaire was put out earlier in the summer on their preference which was much different than.


----------



## dad4

watfly said:


> Particularly individualism that is based on fear and emotion and not evidence.


What do you think our individualism is based on?  Vulcan logic?  Of course it is emotion. 

Not sure why you think the anti-mask and pro-restaurant crowd is acting based on evidence, though.  Evidence on those is pretty solidly pro-mask and anti-restaurant.  



Grace T. said:


> As I've said before, it goes a long way to explaining the "n" in his personality profile for what is otherwise a data guy.
> 
> All these choices are individualism.  It's just some people's individualism v. other people's individualism.  Collective action is impossible without either consensus or having somebody from the top down cram it down.


True enough.  

Frustrating to watch other places handle this with a community spirit, while we still are still arguing about whether masks work.*

By now, we should be handing out N95 masks like candy.  It would cost us less than a billion a week.  Much cheaper than sending checks to everyone, and far more effective.

*- yes, they work. Some work better than others.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> What do you think our individualism is based on?  Vulcan logic?  Of course it is emotion.
> 
> Not sure why you think the anti-mask and pro-restaurant crowd is acting based on evidence, though.  Evidence on those is pretty solidly pro-mask and anti-restaurant.
> 
> 
> True enough.
> 
> Frustrating to watch other places handle this with a community spirit, while we still are still arguing about whether masks work.*
> 
> By now, we should be handing out N95 masks like candy.  It would cost us less than a billion a week.  Much cheaper than sending checks to everyone, and far more effective.
> 
> *- yes, they work. Some work better than others.


Even in Europe that community spirit is going to be tested.  Even in Germany it has been tested with protests and violence (in the low countries their governments going so far as to state they are on the brink of civil war).  With our political divisions, next to impossible.

The problem on the anti-lockdowner side is that it would have required compromise on that side of the aisle too away from the proposition that it's ever going to be 100% safe.  Meeting in the middle would have, for this country, ended up somewhere along the lines of Virginia (which given their vaccine rollout ain't going so hot).  It would also have required a repudiation of the BLM protests, which the left leaning health care experts weren't prepared to do, since that's the one event which shattered the "we're all in this together" consensus, particularly after the pro-lockdowners were critical of the lockdown protests.


----------



## Soccerfan2

LASTMAN14 said:


> Prior to the start of the school year parents in my district were given a choice to choose if they wanted distance learning or return to on site instruction. More than 75% preferred distance learning over returning. This of course had to do with the rise in cases at the time. A questionnaire was put out earlier in the summer on their preference which was much different than.


So crazy how different communities have such vastly different preferences.


----------



## Grace T.

Soccerfan2 said:


> So crazy how different communities have such vastly different preferences.


A survey done in my own town had the same swing from summer-winter.  The ends are pretty much firm in either panic mode or devil-may-care mode.  It's that middle portion which swings depending on the outlook at any particular time, and the drum beat in the media.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> Hound, you’re about 8 months out of date with the claim that Europe did it right.
> 
> Europe was doing it right, and then they opened up the bars, restaurants, and everything else.  Once they did that, they got bad results, too.
> 
> Next you are going to give us a graph of North Dakota that only includes January.
> 
> If you are going to contribute, please try to contribute something useful.  Not just something that says what you want to hear.


Actually not 8 months behind per say. Keep up 

I was responding to someone who thought we could have done it better. I pointed out Europe as what was pointed out before as doing it right, and basically our near peers so to speak today. 

As a nation be it T or a D in charge when this happened, I am pretty sure we would have about as many deaths as we do today either way. 

By the way I keep asking you for your response regarding CA vs TX/FL. You keep ignoring that for some reason. You know the states that have kids in school and playing sports vs the state that doesn't? And yet all 3 are infection wise and deaths wise very similar.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> What do you think our individualism is based on?  Vulcan logic?  Of course it is emotion.


Unfortunately, that emotion which drives the individualism is created and driven by the media....


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> What do you think our individualism is based on?  Vulcan logic?  Of course it is emotion.
> 
> Not sure why you think the anti-mask and pro-restaurant crowd is acting based on evidence, though.  Evidence on those is pretty solidly pro-mask and anti-restaurant.


I was speaking of schools. Never been anti-mask, mask skeptical a little bit but that's it.  As far as restaurants go, there is no evidence to suggest that outdoor dining is unsafe.  The jury is still out on indoor dining.  It's seems early on that it was more of a factor for infections, but not nearly as much lately.  Hence why the LA and SD judges ruled in favor of restaurants based on the evidence.

Again you can't look at every issue through a covid only lens.


----------



## watfly

BTW if my kids could go to school and play sports I'd be willing to wear a N95 mask in public.


----------



## LASTMAN14

Soccerfan2 said:


> So crazy how different communities have such vastly different preferences.


As do school districts. Ours has wanted to go back, but acquiesce to LA County. They have done what they can to start up. We have some of the most impacted students on campus in small cohorts, but that's it.


----------



## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> Actually not 8 months behind per say. Keep up
> 
> I was responding to someone who thought we could have done it better. I pointed out Europe as what was pointed out before as doing it right, and basically our near peers so to speak today.
> 
> As a nation be it T or a D in charge when this happened, I am pretty sure we would have about as many deaths as we do today either way.
> 
> By the way I keep asking you for your response regarding CA vs TX/FL. You keep ignoring that for some reason. You know the states that have kids in school and playing sports vs the state that doesn't? And yet all 3 are infection wise and deaths wise very similar.


I gave my response to TX/CA/FL.  My response is that the deaths rates were similar for those three, but AZ really screwed up royally.

If you want to understand it, you have to look beyond those three states.  Start asking why Washington, Oregon, and Jefferson look great, NorCal looks mediocre, and SoCal was a mess.  Even though Jefferson, NorCal, and SoCal all have exactly the same state policies.

It really looks like WA, OR, and Jefferson each have a working system.  SoCal, TX, Norcal, and FL all made some major mistakes.  But the TX/FL mistakes are quite different from the SoCal/Norcal mistakes.

And, as before, the AZ response was horrible.  No masks and open restaurants?  No wonder they have had so many deaths.


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> I gave my response to TX/CA/FL.  My response is that the deaths rates were similar for those three, but AZ really screwed up royally.
> 
> If you want to understand it, you have to look beyond those three states.  Start asking why Washington, Oregon, and Jefferson look great, NorCal looks mediocre, and SoCal was a mess.  Even though Jefferson, NorCal, and SoCal all have exactly the same state policies.
> 
> It really looks like WA, OR, and Jefferson each have a working system.  SoCal, TX, Norcal, and FL all made some major mistakes.  But the TX/FL mistakes are quite different from the SoCal/Norcal mistakes.
> 
> And, as before, the AZ response was horrible.  No masks and open restaurants?  No wonder they have had so many deaths.


Would you agree that CA might as well have done what TX/FL did? Your kid(s) would be in school full time. They would be playing ball. Businesses and individuals would financially be in much better shape, etc. 

All 3 arrived at the same outcome, yet are doing very different things.


----------



## happy9

Desert Hound said:


> My teens have been back at HS full time since late aug/beginning of September. They run classes like they did last year. So lots of different contacts. There hasn't been any issues.
> 
> The same has been seen in other places around the US and the world where they are back in school. It isn't an issue.


Same here.


----------



## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> Would you agree that CA might as well have done what TX/FL did? Your kid(s) would be in school full time. They would be playing ball. Businesses and individuals would financially be in much better shape, etc.
> 
> All 3 arrived at the same outcome, yet are doing very different things.


No, I would not agree.

Part of CA’s mistake is 40 years of overly restrictive housing policy.   We created these ghettos with 3 families per apartment, and then are surprised when those areas prove vulnerable to disease.

Now, could we have prevented it by copying TX or FL policies towards residential construction?  Absolutely.  

That doesn’t mean I think it would be smart to live in our ghettos, ditch the masks, and open up restaurants.  That would make it even worse.  We’d just copy the TX/FL mistake, without ever fixing the CA mistake.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> No, I would not agree.
> 
> Part of CA’s mistake is 40 years of overly restrictive housing policy.   We created these ghettos with 3 families per apartment, and then are surprised when those areas prove vulnerable to disease.
> 
> Now, could we have prevented it by copying TX or FL policies towards residential construction?  Absolutely.
> 
> That doesn’t mean I think it would be smart to live in our ghettos, ditch the masks, and open up restaurants.  That would make it even worse.  We’d just copy the TX/FL mistake, without ever fixing the CA mistake.


the virus wouldn't be getting into the ghettos if someone wasn't bringing it home with them (usually from work).  The problem in California is we neither locked down fully (which wasn't sustainable for a year) nor opened up near fully, with a result of little impact on cases and a whole lot of economic and secondary damage.


----------



## MacDre

dad4 said:


> Now, could we have prevented it by copying TX or FL policies towards residential construction?  Absolutely.


We have in places like Modesto, Tracy, Stockton, Manteca, Rancho Cucomonga, Corona etc.  The valley is the new ghetto and there’s more than enough urban sprawl there.


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Yeah, just like I already told you. Now admit that it was just a stupid ploy from last June that is not even remotely what LA teachers are currently requiring before returning to work.


Why would they EVER ask for these things?  Not now, not in June, not ever!


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> We have in places like Modesto, Tracy, Stockton, Manteca, Rancho Cucomonga, Corona etc.  The valley is the new ghetto and there’s more than enough urban sprawl there.


Works great for people like you and me.  

How well does it work for a 23 year old couple trying to find a place to live?  Or should they just cease to exist because rich people on the coast find them inconvenient?

You’re better than that, Dre.  People need homes.  Real homes.  If you effectively ban construction because it is sprawl, what happens to the people who were going to live there?  

And don’t tell me we are going to build taller, unless you have a state law to force it to happen.  We both know it won’t happen otherwise.


----------



## N00B

dad4 said:


> I gave my response to TX/CA/FL.  My response is that the deaths rates were similar for those three, but AZ really screwed up royally.


Or it’s something other than policy that differentiates death rates...

CA vs. AZ % of population over 65

Persons 65 years and over, percent CA 14.3% AZ 17.5%


----------



## tjinaz

N00B said:


> Or it’s something other than policy that differentiates death rates...
> 
> CA vs. AZ % of population over 65
> 
> Persons 65 years and over, percent CA 14.3% AZ 17.5%


And you are only counting full time residents.  AZ has tons and tons of snowbirds in the winter that are technically residents of other states but come here for the winter every year.


----------



## dad4

N00B said:


> Or it’s something other than policy that differentiates death rates...
> 
> CA vs. AZ % of population over 65
> 
> Persons 65 years and over, percent CA 14.3% AZ 17.5%


Fair.  It would be best to look at per capita death rates within age bands.  I don’t have that, but we can look at deaths per million residents over 65.

CA: 1051/0.143 = 7350 deaths per mil elderly.
AZ:  1836/0.175 = 10474 deaths per mil elderly.

Closer, but AZ is still not looking so great.  Still 42% above CA.


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Private and charter school teachers don’t have a union to protect them. It’s unfortunate that those teachers must subject themselves to such risk. They’ll learn soon enough why the teacher turnover at these schools is so high.


My kids have had in person learning with teachers on site since Sept. 1st.  Not one teacher has had Covid and there has been no Covid spread among the students as a result of being at school.  ZERO!  I have spent A LOT of money for private school over the years but I can tell you, it was money well spent especially this year.


----------



## Desert Hound

tjinaz said:


> And you are only counting full time residents.  AZ has tons and tons of snowbirds in the winter that are technically residents of other states but come here for the winter every year.


And they tend to be older/retired as well.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Fair.  It would be best to look at per capita death rates within age bands.  I don’t have that, but we can look at deaths per million residents over 65.
> 
> CA: 1051/0.143 = 7350 deaths per mil elderly.
> AZ:  1836/0.175 = 10474 deaths per mil elderly.
> 
> Closer, but AZ is still not looking so great.  Still 42% above CA.


As someone mentioned previously, I think you'd also need to do a deep dive into the Latino and Native American communities.


----------



## TOSDCI

TheVirginian said:


> Schools just have not been a factor in transmission.  But, to be fair, its something like 50% of the parents that don't want to send kids to schools.  I think the schools are just responding to parent fears.  If parents were 90% in favor of school opening, the schools would open.   I do not like teachers' unions, but this one isn't their fault.


Why would they want to send their kids to school when public school's solution is to send kids back to a classroom with a proctor in the room and the teacher on Zoom from home?  That is not the definition of in person learning.  You might as well stay home if your still learning via a Zoom meeting.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> *the virus wouldn't be getting into the ghettos if someone wasn't bringing it home with them (usually from work).  *The problem in California is we neither locked down fully (which wasn't sustainable for a year) nor opened up near fully, with a result of little impact on cases and a whole lot of economic and secondary damage.


True, but how do you avoid it?  

Pay them all to stay home?  Sounds great, until you try to buy some hamburger and there isn’t any.


----------



## watfly

TOSDCI said:


> My kids have had in person learning with teachers on site since Sept. 1st.  Not one teacher has had Covid and there has been no Covid spread among the students as a result of being at school.  ZERO!  I have spent A LOT of money for private school over the years but I can tell you, it was money well spent especially this year.


Well aren't you special  .  Bragging about how your kids are in school!  Just kidding, I'm just jealous.  Can't even get my kids into a private school if we wanted to at this point.  The waiting lists are huge.


----------



## MacDre

dad4 said:


> Works great for people like you and me.
> 
> How well does it work for a 23 year old couple trying to find a place to live?  Or should they just cease to exist because rich people on the coast find them inconvenient?
> 
> You’re better than that, Dre.  People need homes.  Real homes.  If you effectively ban construction because it is sprawl, what happens to the people who were going to live there?
> 
> And don’t tell me we are going to build taller, unless you have a state law to force it to happen.  We both know it won’t happen otherwise.


All valid points.  But, I don’t think more development is the solution.  Over the past 20-30 years I have seen lots of development in cities like Fremont, Newark, San Ramon, Pleasanton, Danville, Hercules, and the Peninsula but those areas are still unaffordable to the 23 y/o couple you referenced.  I also participated in meetings with developers wanting to shut down the Ashby flea market and develop high rises in the parking lot of the Ashby Bart of which none would be affordable for that 23 y/o couple.

I don’t know what the solution is, but it’s not development in the Bay Area.


----------



## TOSDCI

watfly said:


> Well aren't you special  .  Bragging about how your kids are in school!  Just kidding, I'm just jealous.  Can't even get my kids into a private school if we wanted to at this point.  The waiting lists are huge.


Yes, we are definitely grateful for the ability to put them in private school.  It's not easy but it's been worth the sacrifice.  Private school does not help us when it comes to going back to playing sports though.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> True, but how do you avoid it?
> 
> Pay them all to stay home?  Sounds great, until you try to buy some hamburger and there isn’t any.


You know my preferred solution is Florida.  But if you are going to go the lockdown route, short targeted regional lockdowns to control outbreaks in the areas which are being affected (we might not be able to go as far as Australia given constitutional limitations, but even they don't have their country in permanent high level lockdown), with only groceries, pharmacies and essential medical services operating.  Partial lockdowns forever including over summer months, with stupid things like outdoor dining schools and sports shut down, did very little to control the virus and very much to destroy the economy.


----------



## MacDre

TOSDCI said:


> Why would they want to send their kids to school when public school's solution is to send kids back to a classroom with a proctor in the room and the teacher on Zoom from home?  That is not the definition of in person learning.  You might as well stay home if your still learning via a Zoom meeting.


Not true.  School is more than the 3 R’s.  Kids can grow socially and in non-academic ways under this setup.  It also helps to solve the childcare, depression, and social isolation problems some are having.


----------



## crush

watfly said:


> BTW if my kids could go to school and play sports I'd be willing to wear a N95 mask in public.


Just curious, what else would you do in public so kids could play?


----------



## watfly

TOSDCI said:


> Why would they want to send their kids to school when public school's solution is to send kids back to a classroom with a proctor in the room and the teacher on Zoom from home?  That is not the definition of in person learning.  You might as well stay home if your still learning via a Zoom meeting.


That was effectively the situation for my son's twice a week hybrid option, which we ended up opting out of.  It was like an in class prison.  He got much more socialization in the neighborhood.


----------



## watfly

crush said:


> Just curious, what else would you do in public so kids could play?


A "Make America Great Again" hat or a Biden/Harris 2020 shirt.  I draw the line at wearing Lululemon though...not happening.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> All valid points.  But, I don’t think more development is the solution.  Over the past 20-30 years I have seen lots of development in cities like Fremont, Newark, San Ramon, Pleasanton, Danville, Hercules, and the Peninsula but those areas are still unaffordable to the 23 y/o couple you referenced.  I also participated in meetings with developers wanting to shut down the Ashby flea market and develop high rises in the parking lot of the Ashby Bart of which none would be affordable for that 23 y/o couple.
> 
> I don’t know what the solution is, but it’s not development in the Bay Area.


You think you’ve seen lots of residential development?  Go down to Cupertino and look at the parking lots for Apple.   Then go look at the parking lots for what you thought were big residential developments.  It will be about 1/100 as large.  Those developments that you thought were big?  They are small compared to the need, which is why we need a real solution.

You may not know what your solution is, but I do.

Your solution is that young poor families will live 3 to an apartment.  All six parents will work to pay rent, no one will be around to guide the kids, and you’ll have gang problems.  Because that is what will happen.


----------



## crush

watfly said:


> A "Make America Great Again" hat or a Biden/Harris 2020 shirt.  I draw the line at wearing Lululemon though...not happening.


How about a Che shirt?


----------



## crush

watfly said:


> A "Make America Great Again" hat or a Biden/Harris 2020 shirt.  I draw the line at wearing Lululemon though...not happening.


OH, btw, I got off the phone with a friend who owns four homes.  He rents three out and one has not paid a dime since March.  I was thinking of your mother's story and I asked him what he was doing.  I was blown away but his kindness.  The guy who rents lost his job and his job is non essential.  My friend told him not to worry because God will sort this all out once everything is laid bare before all to see.  Tell your mom not to worry


----------



## Grace T.

watfly said:


> A "Make America Great Again" hat or a Biden/Harris 2020 shirt.  I draw the line at wearing Lululemon though...not happening.


Hey at this point if it meant full resumption to soccer normal I'd:

1. I'd build an alter to @dad4, proclaim his math wisdom, and swear that masks are better than vaccines.
2. I'd go over to espola's house and give him a big kiss on the forehead
3. Go over to EOTL's (or whatever name he's calling himself these days) house and have an hour long conversation about social justice where all I tell him is how wise and brilliant he is.
4. Dedicate an entire day to crush, and tell him to tell me any and all stories he feels like.
5. Tell Husker Du that his band actually is the greatest ever (or alternatively that game from the 70s....his pick)
6. Lobby Dominic to have Sheriff Joe to come back to the forums
7. Promise to never make another COVID post on any soccer or other public forum ever again.


----------



## dawson

dad4 said:


> No, I would not agree.
> 
> Part of CA’s mistake is 40 years of overly restrictive housing policy.   We created these ghettos with 3 families per apartment, and then are surprised when those areas prove vulnerable to disease.
> 
> Now, could we have prevented it by copying TX or FL policies towards residential construction?  Absolutely.
> 
> That doesn’t mean I think it would be smart to live in our ghettos, ditch the masks, and open up restaurants.  That would make it even worse.  We’d just copy the TX/FL mistake, without ever fixing the CA mistake.


I believe India has a much higher density of population in big cities then CA  and their covid numbers as reported are much better . I assume they have a big reporting problem but I’m not sure . Can anyone please educate me .


----------



## Grace T.

dawson said:


> I believe India has a much higher density of population in big cities then CA  and their covid numbers as reported are much better . I assume they have a big reporting problem but I’m not sure . Can anyone please educate me .


The HDQ they are using may also have something to do with it, as well as the weather and as you note their testing has been horrible.


----------



## MacDre

dad4 said:


> You think you’ve seen lots of residential development?  Go down to Cupertino and look at the parking lots for Apple.   Then go look at the parking lots for what you thought were big residential developments.  It will be about 1/100 as large.  Those developments that you thought were big?  They are small compared to the need, which is why we need a real solution.
> 
> You may not know what your solution is, but I do.
> 
> Your solution is that young poor families will live 3 to an apartment.  All six parents will work to pay rent, no one will be around to guide the kids, and you’ll have gang problems.  Because that is what will happen.


Maybe some of those tech companies should move some of their operations to N. Bay cities like Vallejo.  Lot’s of available housing and great infrastructure but the city has been mismanaged since the departure of the Navy.  Vallejo needs jobs and young folks need housing-so attracting tech and bio-tech companies to Vallejo is more palatable for me than more urban sprawl.


----------



## MacDre

dawson said:


> I believe India has a much higher density of population in big cities then CA  and their covid numbers as reported are much better . I assume they have a big reporting problem but I’m not sure . Can anyone please educate me .


This is true.  I have a “back office” in Hyderabad in South India (silicone valley of India) and usually go there annually.
Funny thing is everytime I return the plane is full of engineers coming to work in the silicone valley.  So if the math teachers in the Bay Area would do a better job of education local kids we wouldn’t have to import so many engineers and that will help with the housing crisis.  Hey @dad4 what’s up with the math folks dropping the ball?


----------



## N00B

dad4 said:


> Fair.  It would be best to look at per capita death rates within age bands.  I don’t have that, but we can look at deaths per million residents over 65.
> 
> CA: 1051/0.143 = 7350 deaths per mil elderly.
> AZ:  1836/0.175 = 10474 deaths per mil elderly.
> 
> Closer, but AZ is still not looking so great.  Still 42% above CA.


If you felt so inclined to break down the numbers:





__





						COVID-19 Cases by Age Group
					






					www.cdph.ca.gov
				












						AZDHS | Epidemiology & Disease Control - Mosquito Borne
					

Working to monitor, prevent and control diseases in Arizona through education, immunization and research.




					www.azdhs.gov


----------



## N00B

N00B said:


> If you felt so inclined to break down the numbers:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 Cases by Age Group
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cdph.ca.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AZDHS | Epidemiology & Disease Control - Mosquito Borne
> 
> 
> Working to monitor, prevent and control diseases in Arizona through education, immunization and research.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.azdhs.gov


You would also have to find some means of accounting for when in the pandemic those deaths occurred due to improved treatment outcomes as we learn more about Covid.  (Maybe a ratio of deaths to cases in the summer vs winter surges)


----------



## N00B

N00B said:


> If you felt so inclined to break down the numbers:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19 Cases by Age Group
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cdph.ca.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AZDHS | Epidemiology & Disease Control - Mosquito Borne
> 
> 
> Working to monitor, prevent and control diseases in Arizona through education, immunization and research.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.azdhs.gov


In both states 74% of deaths were over 65.


----------



## Kicker4Life

dad4 said:


> Works great for people like you and me.
> 
> How well does it work for a 23 year old couple trying to find a place to live?  Or should they just cease to exist because rich people on the coast find them inconvenient?
> 
> You’re better than that, Dre.  People need homes.  Real homes.  If you effectively ban construction because it is sprawl, what happens to the people who were going to live there?
> 
> And don’t tell me we are going to build taller, unless you have a state law to force it to happen.  We both know it won’t happen otherwise.


Only helps if the state government prioritizes infrastructure development and heavy investment in better public transit.  

That isn’t gonna happen in SoCal unfortunately.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MacDre said:


> Not true.  School is more than the 3 R’s.  Kids can grow socially and in non-academic ways under this setup.  It also helps to solve the childcare, depression, and social isolation problems some are having.


Truth!!!


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> This is true.  I have a “back office” in Hyderabad in South India (silicone valley of India) and usually go there annually.
> Funny thing is everytime I return the plane is full of engineers coming to work in the silicone valley.  So if the math teachers in the Bay Area would do a better job of education local kids we wouldn’t have to import so many engineers and that will help with the housing crisis.  Hey @dad4 what’s up with the math folks dropping the ball?


Do you really want a five page rant about fractions?

Make sure mini-Mac can do 3/7 - 4/13.  Most kids can't, so no STEM career for them.


----------



## watfly

crush said:


> How about a Che shirt?


I'm dumb but not stupid.  No f'ing way.  I was playing soccer against some guy with a Che tattoo and told him he should try reading a history book.


----------



## Glitterhater

EOTL said:


> Oh christ. Yes, of course some schools are back, which depends in a number of factors including, but not limited to whether they’re public, transmission rates in the region, stupidity level, and age cohort.
> Keep in mind that I’m not the one whining that schools aren’t in person. I’m just explaining why there are legitimate reasons why the ones that aren’t (which are still the large majority) aren’t.
> 
> Seriously, WTF is wrong with you people?  You whine like little babies that Newsom has scared teachers into not wanting to go back to schools, I tell you why you’re idiots and there are legitimate reasons for their concern about dying, and the response is that kids are in school so therefore I’m wrong?
> 
> Do you want to talk about Newsom allegedly scaring teachers to not come back?  Do you want to talk about how almost half a million people have doed from covid?  Do you want to talk about how some schools are back in session and whether it’s a good idea? WTF do y’all wanna talk about?
> 
> Regardless, you should probably take @NorCalDad out to the woodshed because, like I keep saying, his attempt to blame Newsom for shutting down schools is simply bogus. If anything, the fact that some schools are open shows that there has been flexibility and there hasn’t been this monolithic approach to in person school attendance by someone who eats babies (albeit wonderfully seasoned at the French Laundry). Y’all are nuts. When you’re not whining Newsom isn’t letting kids back in school, you’re whining that I’m telling them they’re wrong, amd as proof that I’m wrong, you’re pointing out that Newsom is letting kids back in school.


You are calling out norcal Dad? Really? You really think that everyone here is wrong and you're right- don't you? He seems to be one of the more middle of the road folks!


----------



## soccersc

An interesting meeting coming this Thursday...coupled with the NFHS new guidelines, hopefully this is coming to an end








						Football coaches’ advocacy group has ‘really good meeting’ with governor’s office
					

The group is working with state officials to allow high school sports to start in California. ‘We’re moving in the right direction,’ one of the group’s leaders says after Tuesday&…




					www.dailynews.com


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> Maybe some of those tech companies should move some of their operations to N. Bay cities like Vallejo.  Lot’s of available housing and great infrastructure but the city has been mismanaged since the departure of the Navy.  Vallejo needs jobs and young folks need housing-so attracting tech and bio-tech companies to Vallejo is more palatable for me than more urban sprawl.


Nobody with means is moving to Vallejo until the crime rates are significantly reduced.  And then gentrification will be blamed.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> Nobody with means is moving to Vallejo until the crime rates are significantly reduced.  And then gentrification will be blamed.


Not true.  East Palo Alto, East San Jose, and the Fillmore district in San Francisco  (childhood neighborhood of Fillmore Slim) were all worse than Vallejo in the 80’s and 90’s.  Vallejo is similar to Alameda in that it has great infrastructure and well maintained homes because the Navy was there for so long.  Alameda has good leadership Vallejo doesn’t.  I imagine San Diego would be similar to Vallejo if all of the military bases closed.  Vallejo just needs good leadership to attract companies to fill the void that the Navy left when they departed.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> Nobody with means is moving to Vallejo until the crime rates are significantly reduced.  And then gentrification will be blamed.


There may be a problem with a few Hells Angels stomping out a few hipsters and yuppies, but Vallejo really ain’t the type of place where folks are gonna scream gentrification.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> There may be a problem with a few Hells Angels stomping out a few hipsters and yuppies, but Vallejo really ain’t the type of place where folks are gonna scream gentrification.


Any place screams gentrification when rents double and techies move in.  It happened to the west side of the bay and Rockridge first, because they’re closer to the source of the imbalance.

Dems gonna do anything about the housing shortage, or just wait for rents to double when Facebook or Twitter opens an office in Vallejo?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> There may be a problem with a few Hells Angels stomping out a few hipsters and yuppies, but Vallejo really ain’t the type of place where folks are gonna scream gentrification.


Hell’s Angels aren’t really the gang problem Vallejo has.  You know that.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> Hell’s Angels aren’t really the gang problem Vallejo has.  You know that.


The Bay Area doesn’t have gangs like LA.  The Bay Area has independent pimps, players, and hustlers.  And Hells Angels run shit in Vallejo.


----------



## MacDre

dad4 said:


> Any place screams gentrification when rents double and techies move in.  It happened to the west side of the bay and Rockridge first, because they’re closer to the source of the imbalance.
> 
> Dems gonna do anything about the housing shortage, or just wait for rents to double when Facebook or Twitter opens an office in Vallejo?


If Facebook and Twitter comes to Vallejo, I’m okay with the rent doubling.  Downtown Vallejo is depressing and it’s a damn shame considering it sits on the Bay with a direct ferry to the Embarcadero or Fisherman’s Warf.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

MacDre said:


> If Facebook and Twitter comes to Vallejo, I’m okay with the rent doubling.  Downtown Vallejo is depressing and it’s a damn shame considering it sits on the Bay with a direct ferry to the Embarcadero or Fisherman’s Warf.


No arguing with this.


----------



## tjinaz

soccersc said:


> An interesting meeting coming this Thursday...coupled with the NFHS new guidelines, hopefully this is coming to an end
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Football coaches’ advocacy group has ‘really good meeting’ with governor’s office
> 
> 
> The group is working with state officials to allow high school sports to start in California. ‘We’re moving in the right direction,’ one of the group’s leaders says after Tuesday&…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.dailynews.com


Newsome is screwed.  Facing an uprising due to lockdown policy and the unions won't budge.  He is caught between them.  Recall vs traditional ally.  Can't have it both ways and he is feeling the pressure.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> If Facebook and Twitter comes to Vallejo, I’m okay with the rent doubling.  Downtown Vallejo is depressing and it’s a damn shame considering it sits on the Bay with a direct ferry to the Embarcadero or Fisherman’s Warf.


Sounds great if your goal is purely to generate capital gains for existing homeowners.   I thought your goal included helping low income folks, too.

Apparently not.


----------



## tjinaz

OK calling this for my homie Desert Hound... he called it.  Weather a determining factor in COVID spread more so than mask or social distancing.  


The weather has a bigger impact on COVID spread than social distancing


----------



## Grace T.

tjinaz said:


> OK calling this for my homie Desert Hound... he called it.  Weather a determining factor in COVID spread more so than mask or social distancing.
> 
> 
> The weather has a bigger impact on COVID spread than social distancing


If true this puts to rest the entire the outbreaks were caused by thanksgiving and Christmas. While the holidays may have contributed a bump or slowed rates of decline, the weather and seasons were always the prime factor. It was also the height of stupidity for California to remain closed in summer/fall when it should have been saving that bullet for winter, if at all


----------



## MacDre

dad4 said:


> Sounds great if your goal is purely to generate capital gains for existing homeowners.   I thought your goal included helping low income folks, too.
> 
> Apparently not.


I think it will help low income folks too.  For example, the single mom living on a section 8 housing voucher that has to send her kids to Vallejo or Hogan H.S. will have better funded schools.  If the tech companies come the 23 y/o yuppie couple will have a bay area location where they can work AND afford to buy a house.  The low income folks that inherited houses that they can’t afford to maintain will gain equity to help.

And Vallejo also has a few nice trailer parks.  My niece is graduating college this year and will not make much money because she’s a do gooder committed to nonprofit work.  She can’t afford rent in Berkeley.  I am helping her purchase a trailer between the maritime academy police station and the coast guard facility.  We are paying 95k.  The place is much nicer than the average rental in Berkeley or Lake Merrit area in Oakland.  She can take daily walks over the Carquinez Bridge.


----------



## dad4

tjinaz said:


> OK calling this for my homie Desert Hound... he called it.  Weather a determining factor in COVID spread more so than mask or social distancing.
> 
> 
> The weather has a bigger impact on COVID spread than social distancing


Unless you have some way to control the weather, how does this help?





MacDre said:


> I think it will help low income folks too.  For example, the single mom living on a section 8 housing voucher that has to send her kids to Vallejo or Hogan H.S. will have better funded schools.  If the tech companies come the 23 y/o yuppie couple will have a bay area location where they can work AND afford to buy a house.  The low income folks that inherited houses that they can’t afford to maintain will gain equity to help.
> 
> And Vallejo also has a few nice trailer parks.  My niece is graduating college this year and will not make much money because she’s a do gooder committed to nonprofit work.  She can’t afford rent in Berkeley.  I am helping her purchase a trailer between the maritime academy police station and the coast guard facility.  We are paying 95k.  The place is much nicer than the average rental in Berkeley or Lake Merrit area in Oakland.  She can take daily walks over the Carquinez Bridge.


Sure, IF you already have a Section 8 voucher.

How does that help a young family who don't have a Section 8 voucher?

When we refuse to allow home construction, young families get screwed.  It might look ok to people who own or who already have Section 8 or rent control. But young renters are SOL.

Good luck to your niece.  Careful with the trailer parks.  Some park owners are all too happy to raise rents to squeeze the equity from your investment.   Others are decent.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Unless you have some way to control the weather, how does this help?


Sometimes the answer to "something must be done" is "nothing can be done" or "not much can be done"  Because if the prescribed policy doesn't actually do anything, you are just creating unintended consequences for no good reason (and which affect people's lives in very harmful and real ways)


----------



## Soccer Bum 06

tjinaz said:


> Newsome is screwed.  Facing an uprising due to lockdown policy and the unions won't budge.  He is caught between them.  Recall vs traditional ally.  Can't have it both ways and he is feeling the pressure.


Isn’t it sad our governor is caught between doing what is right for our kids and a special interest that supports his political career. He has no shame.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Sometimes the answer to "something must be done" is "nothing can be done" or "not much can be done"  Because if the prescribed policy doesn't actually do anything, you are just creating unintended consequences for no good reason (and which affect people's lives in very harmful and real ways)


How does “weather is a major factor” imply “not much can be done”?  

The real point of the article is that the models should account for weather.  Which is true.  

But you seem to want to use weather as an excuse for claiming that no policies do anything.  Which is false.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> How does “weather is a major factor” imply “not much can be done”?
> 
> The real point of the article is that the models should account for weather.  Which is true.
> 
> But you seem to want to use weather as an excuse for claiming that no policies do anything.  Which is false.


The article supports the position that many of us have been arguing that weather/seasonality is the primary driver of cases (much more than distancing or Npis...we don’t know the ratios...but from the curves we’ve seen the differences is likely on several orders of impact). You asked the question if you can’t control the weather how is it helpful. I point out why is the standard “helpful”? Sometimes it just points out (at least that aspect of) things can’t be controlled. You then answer your own question and say well the modeling (there’s another one too that flows from modeling....since you can’t lockdown forever if you must lockdown don’t do it during happy times like summer).

the fact though remains that beyond the hard lockdowns of China and Australia and isolated countries like Taiwan and New Zealand no where in the world has managed to control the virus with Npis. This article is just another explanation as to why. If seasonality is the primary driver, you can’t control the weather.

the npis at most help only on the margins...help you be Denmark instead of Sweden, California instead of Florida (oops...I meant Arizona). But the health experts never calculated the costs of their npis (only the benefits) especially among the easiest to target (the kids): whether resulting depressions, suicide, drop in health, abuse or substance abuse resulting from lost schools, closed playgrounds, closed activities, restricted socializing, and sports.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> The article supports the position that many of us have been arguing that weather/seasonality is the primary driver of cases (much more than distancing or Npis...we don’t know the ratios...but from the curves we’ve seen the differences is likely on several orders of impact). You asked the question if you can’t control the weather how is it helpful. I point out why is the standard “helpful”? Sometimes it just points out (at least that aspect of) things can’t be controlled. You then answer your own question and say well the modeling (there’s another one too that flows from modeling....since you can’t lockdown forever if you must lockdown don’t do it during happy times like summer).
> 
> the fact though remains that beyond the hard lockdowns of China and Australia and isolated countries like Taiwan and New Zealand no where in the world has managed to control the virus with Npis. This article is just another explanation as to why. If seasonality is the primary driver, you can’t control the weather.
> 
> the npis at most help only on the margins...help you be Denmark instead of Sweden, California instead of Florida (oops...I meant Arizona). But the health experts never calculated the costs of their npis (only the benefits) especially among the easiest to target (the kids): whether resulting depressions, suicide, drop in health, abuse or substance abuse resulting from lost schools, closed playgrounds, closed activities, restricted socializing, and sports.


single cause fallacy


----------



## Scott m Shurson

Soccer Bum 06 said:


> Isn’t it sad our governor is caught between doing what is right for our kids and a special interest that supports his political career. He has no shame.


It’s sad people voted for him after watching how he captained San Francisco into a downward spiral that continues today.


----------



## MacDre

dad4 said:


> Unless you have some way to control the weather, how does this help?
> Sure, IF you already have a Section 8 voucher.
> 
> How does that help a young family who don't have a Section 8 voucher?
> 
> When we refuse to allow home construction, young families get screwed.  It might look ok to people who own or who already have Section 8 or rent control. But young renters are SOL.
> 
> Good luck to your niece.  Careful with the trailer parks.  Some park owners are all too happy to raise rents to squeeze the equity from your investment.   Others are decent.


Are you advocating for high density low income housing in the Bay Area?  We can look at Harlem, south side Chicago, S.E. Washington D.C., Compton, The Jungle (LA), sobrainty park & the 6-9 village in East Oakland, and last but not least North Richmond to realize high density low income housing is a failed policy of the past.  The traffic would also get worse.

So when my daughter and I came back to the Bay Area for Covid, we watched Coach Carter.  After the movie, she asked me was I like Coach Carter and I said NO because I don’t go to Richmond anymore.  Then she asked why and I didn’t want to tell her but I felt guilty.  So, I decided to go to the hood and check in.  I was surprised to see that North Richmond is no more.  All of the low income housing is boarded up and empty now as we speak.  My research indicates many of the residents were bribed/offered new houses in Henderson, NV and accepted.  The crime rate will definitely be going up in Henderson soon if it hasn’t happened already.  I’d be pissed if I had purchased a McMansion at market value in Henderson.

So let the tech companies come to Vallejo.  The fancy folks can live in Vallejo, Napa, Sonoma, or Petaluma.  The lower income folks can stay in Fairfield, Vacaville, and Dixon with about a 15-40 minute commute back to Vallejo for their tech job.  The North Bay needs tech and tech needs the North Bay.  I am surprised it hasn’t happened yet.

Also, in Bay Area 100k is almost low income.  I have helped some disabled vets get housing at the affordable housing condos (as opposed to low income) the Warriors had to build to get approval for their stadium on the Embarcadero.  It seems affordable housing in San Francisco and Berkeley are targeting teachers and disabled vets only so not sure more affordable housing is gonna help young couples if they aren’t educators.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> It’s sad people voted for him after watching how he captained San Francisco into a downward spiral that continues today.


Are you blaming Newsom for problems caused by Reagan?








						Ronald Reagan's shameful legacy: Violence, the homeless, mental illness
					

As president and governor of California, the GOP icon led the worst policies on mental illness in generations




					www.salon.com


----------



## crush

MacDre said:


> Are you advocating for high density low income housing in the Bay Area?  We can look at Harlem, south side Chicago, S.E. Washington D.C., Compton, The Jungle (LA), sobrainty park & the 6-9 village in East Oakland, and last but not least North Richmond to realize high density low income housing is a failed policy of the past.  The traffic would also get worse.
> 
> So when my daughter and I came back to the Bay Area for Covid, we watched Coach Carter.  After the movie, she asked me was I like Coach Carter and I said NO because I don’t go to Richmond anymore.  Then she asked why and I didn’t want to tell her but I felt guilty.  So, I decided to go to the hood and check in.  I was surprised to see that North Richmond is no more.  All of the low income housing is boarded up and empty now as we speak.  My research indicates many of the residents were bribed/offered new houses in Henderson, NV and accepted.  The crime rate will definitely be going up in Henderson soon if it hasn’t happened already.  I’d be pissed if I had purchased a McMansion at market value in Henderson.
> 
> So let the tech companies come to Vallejo.  The fancy folks can live in Vallejo, Napa, Sonoma, or Petaluma.  The lower income folks can stay in Fairfield, Vacaville, and Dixon with about a 15-40 minute commute back to Vallejo for their tech job.  The North Bay needs tech and tech needs the North Bay.  I am surprised it hasn’t happened yet.
> 
> Also, in Bay Area 100k is almost low income.  I have helped some disabled vets get housing at the affordable housing condos (as opposed to low income) the Warriors had to build to get approval for their stadium on the Embarcadero.  It seems affordable housing in San Francisco and Berkeley are targeting teachers and disabled vets only so not sure more affordable housing is gonna help young couples if they aren’t educators.


This is great stuff Dre.  I have so many amazing ideas for folks.  I just need the selfish pigs to start sharing.  We have so much land that is not being used at all.  We should offer 1/4 acres to anyone with a good heart and a willing spirit to work and give back.  We could go to all the good folks who have tried and tried to make it, but are stuck in first gear.  I know Mr Gates bought up the remaining farm land in America before it could be given away.  What I swell guy he is.  He wants to provide food and vaccines for all of us.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> single cause fallacy


not single.  Primary, probably by several orders of magnitude.

you’re the math guy.  You know the difference between primary and single


----------



## Desert Hound

MacDre said:


> Are you blaming Newsom for problems caused by Reagan?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ronald Reagan's shameful legacy: Violence, the homeless, mental illness
> 
> 
> As president and governor of California, the GOP icon led the worst policies on mental illness in generations
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.salon.com


There hasn't been a Repub mayor in SF since the early 60s. Off the top of my head the last R city council member was in the late 60s/early 70s. What SF is today is as a result of decades of D mis-management.


----------



## Desert Hound

Scott m Shurson said:


> It’s sad people voted for him after watching how he captained San Francisco into a downward spiral that continues today.


Yeah but he looks good on TV and speaks in platitudes. And for most voters in CA that is all you need.


----------



## crush

Grace T. said:


> not single.  Primary, probably by several orders of magnitude.
> 
> *you’re the math guy. * You know the difference between primary and single


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> Are you blaming Newsom for problems caused by Reagan?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ronald Reagan's shameful legacy: Violence, the homeless, mental illness
> 
> 
> As president and governor of California, the GOP icon led the worst policies on mental illness in generations
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.salon.com


Reagan didn’t allow people to shit on the sidewalk.  He also didn’t provide them needles and safe houses to shoot heroin and smoke crack.  Gavin thought it was okay for taxpaying citizens to lose their businesses because patrons had to step over bodies of sleeping bums blocking their doors.  Typical, liberal mentality.  Just punish people doing it the right way so you can appeal to the voting flock of sheep headed to the slaughter. 

Let’s be honest here.  People need to have some accountability for becoming drug addicts.  And it doesn’t make sense to keep bashing Reagan for something that happened nearly four decades ago.  Are you telling me, if it was that egregious, nobody has been able to correct it?  Took Biden about 20 minutes to go back to flushing cash down the toilet on the climate accord.

You can’t force bums and junkies to get clean and stay clean.  You also can’t force them to get mental health and shelter, that IS available, if they don’t want it.  Blaming Reagan is a cop out, MD.  People can get help if they want it.  Coddling them has only made it worse.


----------



## crush

Scott m Shurson said:


> Reagan didn’t allow people to shit on the sidewalk.  He also didn’t provide them needles and safe houses to shoot heroin and smoke crack.  Gavin thought it was okay for taxpaying citizens to lose their businesses because patrons had to step over bodies of sleeping bums blocking their doors.  Typical, liberal mentality.  Just punish people doing it the right way so you can appeal to the voting flock of sheep headed to the slaughter.
> 
> Let’s be honest here.  People need to have some accountability for becoming drug addicts.  And it doesn’t make sense to keep bashing Reagan for something that happened nearly four decades ago.  Are you telling me, if it was that egregious, nobody has been able to correct it?  Took Biden about 20 minutes to go back to flushing cash down the toilet on the climate accord.
> 
> You can’t force bums and junkies to get clean and stay clean.  You also can’t force them to get mental health and shelter, that IS available, if they don’t want it.  Blaming Reagan is a cop out, MD.  People can get help if they want it.  Coddling them has only made it worse.


Scott, I'm curious to know who you think brought all that heroin, needles and all that crack to da states so the folks can get addicted?  I know who did but I stay quiet now because of threats to me to STFU.


----------



## crush




----------



## kickingandscreaming

dad4 said:


> single cause fallacy


Wearing masks?


----------



## Desert Hound

I think this article belongs in the Let Them Play section.

_"An 81-person orgy at a French warehouse was broken up by police last Friday for violating a coronavirus curfew, a report said."_

Are we surprised they were not wearing masks and not social distancing?

_“The event was in breach of the curfew, and there were also problems with masks and social distancing,” an investigator told the outlet."_









						81-person French orgy broken up for violating COVID-19 curfew
					

An 81-person orgy at a French warehouse was broken up by police last Friday for violating a coronavirus curfew, a report said. The sex party in Collegien — about 20 miles outside Paris &#8212…




					nypost.com


----------



## crush

Desert Hound said:


> I think this article belongs in the Let Them Play section.
> 
> _"An 81-person orgy at a French warehouse was broken up by police last Friday for violating a coronavirus curfew, a report said."_
> 
> Are we surprised they were not wearing masks and not social distancing?
> 
> _“The event was in breach of the curfew, and there were also problems with masks and social distancing,” an investigator told the outlet."_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 81-person French orgy broken up for violating COVID-19 curfew
> 
> 
> An 81-person orgy at a French warehouse was broken up by police last Friday for violating a coronavirus curfew, a report said. The sex party in Collegien — about 20 miles outside Paris &#8212…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nypost.com


81 has a nice ring too it.  Is this Club 81 that my pal was sharing about?  He told me about this place that was  a warehouse of sex.  Basically, whatever your little heart desires can be found at the 81 French Warehouse?  Whatever the imagination, you can have your dreams come true.


----------



## tjinaz

dad4 said:


> How does “weather is a major factor” imply “not much can be done”?
> 
> The real point of the article is that the models should account for weather.  Which is true.
> 
> But you seem to want to use weather as an excuse for claiming that no policies do anything.  Which is false.


That is a fallacy.  All policies should be a balance or risk and reward.  The key point is if weather is the primary driver of surges and not social distancing and masks then... you have to weigh the impact of social distancing and lockdown vs the negative impact of its use. 


Grace T. said:


> The article supports the position that many of us have been arguing that weather/seasonality is the primary driver of cases (much more than distancing or Npis...we don’t know the ratios...but from the curves we’ve seen the differences is likely on several orders of impact). You asked the question if you can’t control the weather how is it helpful. I point out why is the standard “helpful”? Sometimes it just points out (at least that aspect of) things can’t be controlled. You then answer your own question and say well the modeling (there’s another one too that flows from modeling....since you can’t lockdown forever if you must lockdown don’t do it during happy times like summer).
> 
> the fact though remains that beyond the hard lockdowns of China and Australia and isolated countries like Taiwan and New Zealand no where in the world has managed to control the virus with Npis. This article is just another explanation as to why. If seasonality is the primary driver, you can’t control the weather.
> 
> the npis at most help only on the margins...help you be Denmark instead of Sweden, California instead of Florida (oops...I meant Arizona). But the health experts never calculated the costs of their npis (only the benefits) especially among the easiest to target (the kids): whether resulting depressions, suicide, drop in health, abuse or substance abuse resulting from lost schools, closed playgrounds, closed activities, restricted socializing, and sports.


Not to mention the economic impact of the npis which in turn feeds the depression, suicide, abuse cycle.  Basically saying the economic and mental health risk of implementing the npi outweighs the benefit received.   Remember when we were just flattening the curve?  I miss those days.


----------



## MacDre

Desert Hound said:


> There hasn't been a Repub mayor in SF since the early 60s. Off the top of my head the last R city council member was in the late 60s/early 70s. What SF is today is as a result of decades of D mis-management.


I agree and that’s why SF is one of the best cities in the world.  The problems in San Francisco date back to problems associated with R.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

crush said:


> Scott, I'm curious to know who you think brought all that heroin, needles and all that crack to da states so the folks can get addicted?  I know who did but I stay quiet now because of threats to me to STFU.


Yes... I know the conspiracy stories.  The FBI, the CIA, Elvis... they all dropped drugs into the ghettos.  It’s all their fault.  Just like the idiotic commercial I saw, over the weekend, with some black girl babbling a rhyme about how cigarette companies continue to prey upon black people.  As if black people didn’t know, back in Reagan’s tenure, that smoking was deadly.  Yet again, my man, it’s always someone else’s fault.  Is there anyone alive that doesn’t know tobacco and crack are bad?

Any good parent teaches their kid about “accountability”.  Yet all I ever see and hear now, especially from liberals, is how people not doing well are just victims.  We’re going in the wrong direction as a society.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> I agree and that’s why SF is one of the best cities in the world.  The problems in San Francisco date back to problems associated with R.


It used to be.  It isn’t anymore.


----------



## crush

MacDre said:


> I agree and that’s why SF is one of the best cities in the world.  The problems in San Francisco date back to problems associated with R.


Those stupid R folks.  Rich, Racists Republicans and so Rude, Right?  Just paint those fools all the same.  If white, then of course they will be labelled R unless whitey can prove their not an R by wearing a mask and kneeling and asking for mercy.    The D group is so fair and loving and so nice to. That T dude might have been unto the future and for sure the Q guy has made some interesting predictions that only one WHO knew the future could predict.  If we can get the math corrected and stop playing color games, then we who can get along will be left to clean up the mess left by greed.  I can;t wait.  This is so easy to do.  If we all agree to get the cheaters to stop cheating and all the evil assholes to once and for all leave this great planet earth, then well, we will have bliss.  This planet was made for love and to reproduce life.  Space Force has special spacecraft to send those who want fear & death to another planet called, "Death Star."


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> Yes... I know the conspiracy stories.  The FBI, the CIA, Elvis... they all dropped drugs into the ghettos.  It’s all their fault.  Just like the idiotic commercial I saw, over the weekend, with some black girl babbling a rhyme about how cigarette companies continue to prey upon black people.  As if black people didn’t know, back in Reagan’s tenure, that smoking was deadly.  Yet again, my man, it’s always someone else’s fault.  Is there anyone alive that doesn’t know tobacco and crack are bad?
> 
> Any good parent teaches their kid about “accountability”.  Yet all I ever see and hear now, especially from liberals, is how people not doing well are just victims.  We’re going in the wrong direction as a society.


Funny.  My grandparents lived and farmed tobacco in Danville, VA the last capital of the confederacy before it fell.  I doubt there is a more conservative place in the US.  Gun safety is a mandatory class in sixth grade.  All of my teachers white or black were conservative Christian’s and farmed “bacca” as they call it in the south.  Many kids didn’t start school until after October because they had to pull bacca.  These folks were lied to and fooled.  They didn’t have a clue about the adverse health consequences of bacca.


----------



## MacDre

crush said:


> Those stupid R folks.  Rich, Racists Republicans and so Rude, Right?  Just paint those fools all the same.  If white, then of course they will be labelled R unless whitey can prove their not an R by wearing a mask and kneeling and asking for mercy.    The D group is so fair and loving and so nice to. That T dude might have been unto the future and for sure the Q guy has made some interesting predictions that only one WHO knew the future could predict.  If we can get the math corrected and stop playing color games, then we who can get along will be left to clean up the mess left by greed.  I can;t wait.  This is so easy to do.  If we all agree to get the cheaters to stop cheating and all the evil assholes to once and for all leave this great planet earth, then well, we will have bliss.  This planet was made for love and to reproduce life.  Space Force has special spacecraft to send those who want fear & death to another planet called, "Death Star."


I believe most African Americans have conservative Christian values, especially in the southern states.  So, I don’t see it as a white and black thing.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> Are you advocating for high density low income housing in the Bay Area?  We can look at Harlem, south side Chicago, S.E. Washington D.C., Compton, The Jungle (LA), sobrainty park & the 6-9 village in East Oakland, and last but not least North Richmond to realize high density low income housing is a failed policy of the past.  The traffic would also get worse.
> 
> So when my daughter and I came back to the Bay Area for Covid, we watched Coach Carter.  After the movie, she asked me was I like Coach Carter and I said NO because I don’t go to Richmond anymore.  Then she asked why and I didn’t want to tell her but I felt guilty.  So, I decided to go to the hood and check in.  I was surprised to see that North Richmond is no more.  All of the low income housing is boarded up and empty now as we speak.  My research indicates many of the residents were bribed/offered new houses in Henderson, NV and accepted.  The crime rate will definitely be going up in Henderson soon if it hasn’t happened already.  I’d be pissed if I had purchased a McMansion at market value in Henderson.
> 
> So let the tech companies come to Vallejo.  The fancy folks can live in Vallejo, Napa, Sonoma, or Petaluma.  The lower income folks can stay in Fairfield, Vacaville, and Dixon with about a 15-40 minute commute back to Vallejo for their tech job.  The North Bay needs tech and tech needs the North Bay.  I am surprised it hasn’t happened yet.
> 
> Also, in Bay Area 100k is almost low income.  I have helped some disabled vets get housing at the affordable housing condos (as opposed to low income) the Warriors had to build to get approval for their stadium on the Embarcadero.  It seems affordable housing in San Francisco and Berkeley are targeting teachers and disabled vets only so not sure more affordable housing is gonna help young couples if they aren’t educators.


I am advocating for housing.  My preference is high density, but I’m not that picky.   

Market rate.  CA is a few million homes short.  You’d bankrupt the state if you tried to subsidize it all.  Even then you wouldn’t make a dent in the problem.  4 million homes * 500K per subsidized init.  = 2 trillion dollars.  That’s not going to happen, so let’s stop pretending.

The people in power seem to think like you.  Invite in lots of corporations.  Build a big office building.  Rich people will move in, and poor people will move...... somewhere.  

On the rare occasions when they do think about housing, it goes something like this:  We just displaced another 50K people.  Maybe we’ll build 500 low income units and call it square.  

Now, I have no problem with inviting tech companies to Vallejo.  But, when you do it, don’t forget to build enough housing for all the techies you just asked in.  Otherwise, people like me will bid up prices and young poor folks get screwed.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> It used to be.  It isn’t anymore.


I couldn’t tell by how much prices have gone up.


----------



## crush

MacDre said:


> Funny.  My grandparents lived and farmed tobacco in Danville, VA the last capital of the confederacy before it fell.  I doubt there is a more conservative place in the US.  Gun safety is a mandatory class in sixth grade.  All of my teachers white or black were conservative Christian’s and farmed “bacca” as they call it in the south.  Many kids didn’t start school until after October because they had to pull bacca.  These folks were lied to and fooled.  They didn’t have a clue about the adverse health consequences of bacca.


Bacca?  I've learned more in two years on this forum then I did in all my years in school.  I think we have some super smart and educated folks here.  What a free education   I love reading about all of our backgrounds.  Dre, I got with my in laws this last weekend.  Gramps finally let it all out after knowing this guy over 24 years.  Both of them have always thought I was British for some reason.  Can you imagine that?  Alzheimer's has set in and I had to correct the record.  I went all Scottish Highlander on him and let him know to stop having false perceptions of me because I have blond hair and green eyes.  He told me the stories of growing up in Guatemala and all these rich blond hair green eye folks took all the wealth away back on the day.  He is 100% Myian and lets me know.  He now know I'm 100% Scottish Highlander and not British and my peeps land was taken away as well.  We now have common respect for each other and I love him more today then ever.


----------



## TOSDCI

MacDre said:


> Funny.  My grandparents lived and farmed tobacco in Danville, VA the last capital of the confederacy before it fell.  I doubt there is a more conservative place in the US.  Gun safety is a mandatory class in sixth grade.  All of my teachers white or black were conservative Christian’s and farmed “bacca” as they call it in the south.  Many kids didn’t start school until after October because they had to pull bacca.  These folks were lied to and fooled.  They didn’t have a clue about the adverse health consequences of bacca.


My grandfather who was born in the early 1920s had a cigarette pack holder in his closet for years.  It said " Smoke Coffin Nails" on it.  He smoked Pall Malls for 50 years.  There were concerns about the health risks of smoking beginning in the 20s.  The first scientific studies regarding the dangers of cigarette smoking began to emerge in the 1950s with the studies being published in 1964 clearly linking smoking to lung cancer and other health risks.  By the 1980s, there were warnings on packaging and the risks were well known.  If you started smoking after these reports and warnings came out, that's kinda on you.


----------



## dad4

tjinaz said:


> That is a fallacy.  All policies should be a balance or risk and reward.  The key point is if *weather is the primary driver of surges and not social distancing and masks then...* you have to weigh the impact of social distancing and lockdown vs the negative impact of its use.
> 
> Not to mention the economic impact of the npis which in turn feeds the depression, suicide, abuse cycle.  Basically saying the economic and mental health risk of implementing the npi outweighs the benefit received.   Remember when we were just flattening the curve?  I miss those days.


That’s the single cause fallacy.  You are arguing that, if weather causes covid surges, then masks must not prevent them.  There is no logic there.  Weather increases transmission, masks and distance reduce transmission.

You’re just looking at a system with multiple causes.  As soon as you say “_*the primary driver“*_, you’re going to get it wrong, because in the next step you will ignore the impacts of all the secondary drivers.

I suspect that’s the goal.  People don’t want to trade their restaurants and dinner parties for hikes and tennis.  So they are searching for a way to pretend that the restaurants and dinner parties are not a problem.  Blame everything on weather is an easy way to take no blame ourselves.

Now, if you want to argue whether a specific NPI is worth the cost, we may have some agreement.  Some NPI have been useless or counterproductive, and we should drop them.  But other NPI work, and it’s long past time to get with the program.


----------



## EOTL

Grace T. said:


> The article supports the position that many of us have been arguing that weather/seasonality is the primary driver of cases (much more than distancing or Npis...we don’t know the ratios...but from the curves we’ve seen the differences is likely on several orders of impact). You asked the question if you can’t control the weather how is it helpful. I point out why is the standard “helpful”? Sometimes it just points out (at least that aspect of) things can’t be controlled. You then answer your own question and say well the modeling (there’s another one too that flows from modeling....since you can’t lockdown forever if you must lockdown don’t do it during happy times like summer).
> 
> the fact though remains that beyond the hard lockdowns of China and Australia and isolated countries like Taiwan and New Zealand no where in the world has managed to control the virus with Npis. This article is just another explanation as to why. If seasonality is the primary driver, you can’t control the weather.
> 
> the npis at most help only on the margins...help you be Denmark instead of Sweden, California instead of Florida (oops...I meant Arizona). But the health experts never calculated the costs of their npis (only the benefits) especially among the easiest to target (the kids): whether resulting depressions, suicide, drop in health, abuse or substance abuse resulting from lost schools, closed playgrounds, closed activities, restricted socializing, and sports.


This is crazy. The weather does not spread Covid-19, people do. The weather only makes it far more spreadable. It is all the more important to socially distance when the weather makes Covid-19 more dangerous. All of you act like this is some “it is what it is” problem. 

As for last summer, it is ludicrous to claim that Governor Newsom should have known it was not a big deal for many reasons. First, it was still a big deal. Second, so little was known, and is still unknown, about the virus, so blaming any leader for being cautious even before it came clear how spreadable it is stupid.  Third, even if he had been certain that things would get bad as the weather got worse, the weather gets pretty bad as fall semester wears on. Sending everyone back in person with no idea how bad the weather might make it, how virulent it would get, how mutations would make it even more spreadable, is stupid compared to trying to create an online plan with the entire summer to prepare, instead of just having to do it in November.


----------



## dad4

kickingandscreaming said:


> Wearing masks?


Masks aren’t “the primary driver’ either.   Masks are one of many variables.

Masks, distance, and being outdoors are some of the the variables we can control.  

Age, variant, and weather are some of the variables we cannot.


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> Masks aren’t “the primary driver’ either.   Masks are one of many variables.
> 
> Masks, distance, and being outdoors are some of the the variables we can control.
> 
> Age, variant, and weather are some of the variables we cannot.


Hey, check it out. Silent transmission is the primary driver. 



			https://www.usnews.com/news/healthiest-communities/articles/2020-07-07/silent-coronavirus-transmission-the-primary-driver-of-covid-19-outbreaks
		


No, it’s children, except when go to school or soccer tournaments because they become impervious there. 









						Health experts: children primary driver of COVID transmission
					

About 13 percent of the cases of COVID-19 in Douglas County are in children.




					www.3newsnow.com
				






			https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/who-warns-young-people-are-emerging-as-main-spreaders-of-the-coronavirus/2020/08/18/1822ee92-e18f-11ea-b69b-64f7b0477ed4_story.html
		


No, it’s young adults









						Governor: Young Adults Are ‘Primary Driver’ of Coronavirus as Iowa’s Cases Become Worst in Nation
					

DES MOINES, Iowa — Younger people are a significant reason for Iowa’s current standing with the Trump administration as the worst state in the country for the spread of the coronavirus,…




					who13.com
				




No, it’s traveling









						Worldwide COVID-19 spreading explained: traveling numbers as a primary driver for the pandemic - PubMed
					

The spread of SARS-CoV-2 and the distribution of cases worldwide followed no clear biogeographic, climatic, or cultural trend. Conversely, the internationally busiest cities in all countries tended to be the hardest hit, suggesting a basic, mathematically neutral pattern of the new coronavirus...




					pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




No, it’s stupid people in Southern California, which we all know has some of the worst winter weather anywhere. 





__





						Southern California is a main driver of state’s record COVID-19 deaths, with no signs of a letup
					

Los Angeles Times, Dec. 10, 2020




					news.uci.edu
				




No, it’s going to restaurants and the gym. 









						How to stop restaurants from driving COVID infections
					

US mobile data suggests restaurants, gyms and cafes can be COVID hotspots — and reveals strategies for limiting spread.




					www.nature.com
				




No, it is Marmalade-a-lago









						Study Finds ‘Single Largest Driver’ of Coronavirus Misinformation: Trump (Published 2020)
					

Cornell University researchers analyzing 38 million English-language articles about the pandemic found that President Trump was the largest driver of the “infodemic.”




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## crush

*Let them play.  Great Park last night was amazing with beautiful sunset.  Place was packed again   Play Ball!!!!!

*


----------



## MacDre

TOSDCI said:


> My grandfather who was born in the early 1920s had a cigarette pack holder in his closet for years.  It said " Smoke Coffin Nails" on it.  He smoked Pall Malls for 50 years.  There were concerns about the health risks of smoking beginning in the 20s.  The first scientific studies regarding the dangers of cigarette smoking began to emerge in the 1950s with the studies being published in 1964 clearly linking smoking to lung cancer and other health risks.  By the 1980s, there were warnings on packaging and the risks were well known.  If you started smoking after these reports and warnings came out, that's kinda on you.


I disagree.  You can lead a horse to water but you can’t force it to drink.  People in this community take advice from their religious leaders not from corrupt nerds that write biased reports for companies that hate small businesses.  You see those reports were put out by liberals because they want you to come work in their factories etc. etc. Many of these folks prefer to pray and “leave it in god’s hand” rather than seek medical treatment.  So the fact that there were reports of adverse health effects way back is meaningless if you don’t analyze it in the proper context.


----------



## soccersc

More strong signs we might be back soon!! Hopefully Newsom is not telling another story. @EOTL says Newsom cares about us and wants what's best for us, so hopefully he is right about this one, because he @EOTL hasn't been right about too many things!!! Newsom said, “I share that and we are processing that, and I am very hopeful, very hopeful — I really mean this — I am very, very hopeful that we can find a compromise here and I believe that’s possible as long as these case rates continue to move in the direction they’re moving.” He even said I REALLY MEAN THIS, so he must be telling the truth.  There is a coaching group meeting with Dr. Ghaly today so we'll see.









						COVID-19: Gov. Newsom addresses prep sports lawsuits, return-to-play status
					

Gavin Newsom on prep sports: “I really mean this, I am very, very hopeful that we can find a compromise here”




					www.mercurynews.com


----------



## crush

soccersc said:


> More strong signs we might be back soon!! Hopefully Newsom is not telling another story. @EOTL says Newsom cares about us and wants what's best for us, so hopefully he is right about this one, because he @EOTL hasn't been right about too many things!!! Newsom said, “I share that and we are processing that, and I am very hopeful, very hopeful — I really mean this — I am very, very hopeful that we can find a compromise here and I believe that’s possible as long as these case rates continue to move in the direction they’re moving.” He even said I REALLY MEAN THIS, so he must be telling the truth.  There is a coaching group meeting with Dr. Ghaly today so we'll see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19: Gov. Newsom addresses prep sports lawsuits, return-to-play status
> 
> 
> Gavin Newsom on prep sports: “I really mean this, I am very, very hopeful that we can find a compromise here”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mercurynews.com


All we have is hope and prayer.  Some have hope and wish for luck.  Hope plus good vibes works as well.  Hope and fairness is all I want.  I do pray for peace but that is personal choice.  I dont like hate and division.  I want love & mercy taught to all.  Love others and teach with mercy is one hell of a place to live.


----------



## texanincali

soccersc said:


> More strong signs we might be back soon!! Hopefully Newsom is not telling another story. @EOTL says Newsom cares about us and wants what's best for us, so hopefully he is right about this one, because he @EOTL hasn't been right about too many things!!! Newsom said, “I share that and we are processing that, and I am very hopeful, very hopeful — I really mean this — I am very, very hopeful that we can find a compromise here and I believe that’s possible as long as these case rates continue to move in the direction they’re moving.” He even said I REALLY MEAN THIS, so he must be telling the truth.  There is a coaching group meeting with Dr. Ghaly today so we'll see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> COVID-19: Gov. Newsom addresses prep sports lawsuits, return-to-play status
> 
> 
> Gavin Newsom on prep sports: “I really mean this, I am very, very hopeful that we can find a compromise here”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mercurynews.com


Good to see he may be coming around.  Unfortunate that he has waited until his political career is in possible tatters.  My guess is that kids get back on the field, but I think this has come too late in the game for him to save himself.


----------



## crush

texanincali said:


> Good to see he may be coming around.  Unfortunate that he has waited until his political career is in possible tatters.  My guess is that kids get back on the field, but I think this has come too late in the game for him to save himself.


I heard a few Seniors who missed out in recruiting this school year are looking to file.  45 states playing ball and all these kids are getting deals, but not the average Cali athlete.  The California kids are getting left behind and told by coaches:  "I need to see you play live and in person."  Plus recruit would like to visit campus as well but can;t visit.  Basically, we've all been locked out of the process except the very very best.  Not all of us are the best so we need fairness to make it fair for all.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Masks aren’t “the primary driver’ either.   Masks are one of many variables.
> 
> Masks, distance, and being outdoors are some of the the variables we can control.
> 
> Age, variant, and weather are some of the variables we cannot.


Yeah, but now we are arguing about if we are going to have pepperoni or vegetarian pizza.  We are still going to have pizza no matter what we do.

The next step is to figure out how much of a primary driver.  My guess is (from all the curves we seen around the world) it's a lot....it's the pizza, not the toppings.   So we have to subtract the portion that we can't have any impact on (short of a mass lockdown Australia style which means keeping people separated in their homes).  To that remaining portion we have to apply a cost/benefit analysis.  E.g., cloth masks indoors for going to the market (marginal benefit for little cost, particularly if you don't force the screaming 3 year olds on airplanes or the autistic kids to wear them); closing schools (very little benefit for an enormous cost). The health experts and politicians didn't do that....they assumed we could get to zero (remember the hits? "masks are better than vaccines"....."lockdown for 6 weeks and it will go away"....."this will be over by summer") and they failed to apply costs (instead just whacking at the low hanging fruit in an effort to do something.


----------



## Grace T.

texanincali said:


> Good to see he may be coming around.  Unfortunate that he has waited until his political career is in possible tatters.  My guess is that kids get back on the field, but I think this has come too late in the game for him to save himself.


1.4 million today baby (and several regions are holding back signatures collected but not turned in yet).....need about 100,000 more since Newsom's people will no doubt fall in love with signature verification and hanging chad the thing out of it.


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> All we have is hope and prayer.  Some have hope and wish for luck.  Hope plus good vibes works as well.  Hope and fairness is all I want.  I do pray for peace but that is personal choice.  I dont like hate and division.  I want love & mercy taught to all.  Love others and teach with mercy is one hell of a place to live.


It is God’s will whether or not one dies of Covid-19. So don’t worry about it. Get back to the gym, The bar. Wherever. There is no better way to unify than to get Covid because you don’t care about others and then spread it. 

It does make one wonder why he likes the Chinese so much better than Americans though. He isn’t killing any of them.


----------



## EOTL

Grace T. said:


> Yeah, but now we are arguing about if we are going to have pepperoni or vegetarian pizza.  We are still going to have pizza no matter what we do.
> 
> The next step is to figure out how much of a primary driver.  My guess is (from all the curves we seen around the world) it's a lot....it's the pizza, not the toppings.   So we have to subtract the portion that we can't have any impact on (short of a mass lockdown Australia style which means keeping people separated in their homes).  To that remaining portion we have to apply a cost/benefit analysis.  E.g., cloth masks indoors for going to the market (marginal benefit for little cost, particularly if you don't force the screaming 3 year olds on airplanes or the autistic kids to wear them); closing schools (very little benefit for an enormous cost). The health experts and politicians didn't do that....they assumed we could get to zero (remember the hits? "masks are better than vaccines"....."lockdown for 6 weeks and it will go away"....."this will be over by summer") and they failed to apply costs (instead just whacking at the low hanging fruit in an effort to do something.


I love how people think that social distancing is all or nothing. If you lock down completely it works, but if you allow anything, you may as well just allow everything because, you know, the weather. 

The simple truth is that the more aggressive the social distancing, the fewer interactions that contribute to spread, the more lives get saved. Period.


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> It is God’s will whether or not one dies of Covid-19. So don’t worry about it. Get back to the gym, The bar. Wherever. There is no better way to unify than to get Covid because you don’t care about others and then spread it.
> 
> It does make one wonder why he likes the Chinese so much better than Americans though. He isn’t killing any of them.


The folks dying with Corona are not at the gym or bar.  Their all alone at the "end of the line" hospice care, where one dies all alone. The other ones all got whacked by a car, a gun, heart burn or had a heart attack or a stroke.  Something like that is where the true deaths comes and then if a Doc has a suspension they have the Rona, they get tagged "Rona Death."  Next month is our 1 year anniversary of Covid 19 BTW.  Can you believe it;s been 11 months of this?


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> The folks dying with Corona are not at the gym or bar.  Their all alone at the "end of the line" hospice care, where one dies all alone. The other ones all got whacked by a car, a gun, heart burn or had a heart attack or a stroke.  Something like that is where the true deaths comes and then if a Doc has a suspension they have the Rona, they get tagged "Rona Death."  Next month is our 1 year anniversary of Covid 19 BTW.  Can you believe it;s been 11 months of this?


Ooh, @crush has gone full Q Covid denier. Amazing how it spontaneously generates in hospice care facilities.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Yeah, but now we are arguing about if we are going to have pepperoni or vegetarian pizza.  We are still going to have pizza no matter what we do.
> 
> The next step is to figure out how much of a primary driver.  My guess is (from all the curves we seen around the world) it's a lot....it's the pizza, not the toppings.   So we have to subtract the portion that we can't have any impact on (short of a mass lockdown Australia style which means keeping people separated in their homes).  To that remaining portion we have to apply a cost/benefit analysis.  E.g., cloth masks indoors for going to the market (marginal benefit for little cost, particularly if you don't force the screaming 3 year olds on airplanes or the autistic kids to wear them); closing schools (very little benefit for an enormous cost). The health experts and politicians didn't do that....they assumed we could get to zero (remember the hits? "masks are better than vaccines"....."lockdown for 6 weeks and it will go away"....."this will be over by summer") and they failed to apply costs (instead just whacking at the low hanging fruit in an effort to do something.


Your search for the single cause continues.  You won’t find it.

That is because it is a complicated system.  There are at least six major variables: age, variant, weather, masks, distance, indoor/outdoors.  You don’t get to pick one and ignore the others.

The next step is not to latch onto of those and ask “is this _*the primary driver*_?”

The next step is to get with the program.   

Mask, distance, outdoors.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Your search for the single cause continues.  You won’t find it.
> 
> That is because it is a complicated system.  There are at least six major variables: age, variant, weather, masks, distance, indoor/outdoors.  You don’t get to pick one and ignore the others.
> 
> The next step is not to latch onto of those and ask “is this _*the primary driver*_?”
> 
> The next step is to get with the program.
> 
> Mask, distance, outdoors.


Nah, you can't do that without a cost/benefit analysis of each NPI.  Just "get with the program" is what got California in the mess that it's in: doing something without thinking just for the sake of doing something, and as a result causing enormous ruin yet still getting an out of control virus.

And BTW, from a macro point of view, age is not a variable.  The age dispersion is a particular population is, but not the age of any particular person.   Variants may not be a variable for much longer depending on the breath of dispersion.


----------



## TOSDCI

texanincali said:


> Good to see he may be coming around.  Unfortunate that he has waited until his political career is in possible tatters.  My guess is that kids get back on the field, but I think this has come too late in the game for him to save himself.


I wish that were true.  I am concerned that voters will forget about all this come election time or sooner if he is recalled.   Or they just replace Newsom with someone advocating the same policies.  I think it would be difficult to get anyone that does not have a big D by their name elected in California.


----------



## Desert Hound

Grace T. said:


> is what got California in the mess that it's in: doing something without thinking just for the sake of doing something, and as a result causing enormous ruin yet still getting an out of control virus


Instead of creating all the harm to biz, families, kids, CA may as well have just done with FL and TX did. 

Just image schools full of kids. Lower unemployment, tax revenue, people not getting wiped out financially. CA screwed the pooch on their lockdown approach.


----------



## TOSDCI

MacDre said:


> I disagree.  You can lead a horse to water but you can’t force it to drink.  People in this community take advice from their religious leaders not from corrupt nerds that write biased reports for companies that hate small businesses.  You see those reports were put out by liberals because they want you to come work in their factories etc. etc. Many of these folks prefer to pray and “leave it in god’s hand” rather than seek medical treatment.  So the fact that there were reports of adverse health effects way back is meaningless if you don’t analyze it in the proper context.


So are you saying that the church leaders are in cahoots with the tobacco industry to keep people addicted to cigarettes?  That's messed up!


----------



## Grace T.

Desert Hound said:


> Instead of creating all the harm to biz, families, kids, CA may as well have just done with FL and TX did.
> 
> Just image schools full of kids. Lower unemployment, tax revenue, people not getting wiped out financially. CA screwed the pooch on their lockdown approach.


I get why the politicians do it, but it still strikes me as fascinating that some health experts and informed people have grabbed a hold of this idea that "something's got to work" and won't let go of it, despite the mountain of evidence building to the contrary.


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> Ooh, @crush has gone full Q Covid denier. Amazing how it spontaneously generates in hospice care facilities.


I know more about this then you, that's for sure.  I learned from @Desert Hound @happy9 @MacDre @Kicker4Life @watfly and so many others I lost track.  My all time fav is @Grace T.  T=Trump or Truth?  She is my #1 Corona expert here, my sweet Grace.  Grace is raw and honest and that's what makes her amazing to me.  @dad4 , his math is full of dog sh*t and just wrong and makes me not trust his numbers.


----------



## Speed

TOSDCI said:


> I wish that were true.  I am concerned that voters will forget about all this come election time or sooner if he is recalled.   Or they just replace Newsom with someone advocating the same policies.  I think it would be difficult to get anyone that does not have a big D by their name elected in California.


I hope you are right I am fearful that most of those supporting the recall and re election of a more moderate governor have left the state


----------



## Grace T.

crush said:


> I know more about this then you, that's for sure.  I learned from @Desert Hound @happy9 @MacDre @Kicker4Life @watfly and so many others I lost track.  My all time fav is @Grace T.  T=Trump or Truth?  She is my #1 Corona expert here, my sweet Grace.  Grace is raw and honest and that's what makes her amazing to me.  @dad4 , his math is full of poop sometimes and just wrong and makes me not trust his numbers.


I actually think Dad's math is quite brilliant and he has an amazing mind.  I actually really respect him.  When it's a pure data analysis he's the king.  I think his analysis of what's likely to happen is actually pretty spot on (I'm probably slightly more pessimistic but those are my priors).   Where he runs into issues is the conclusion.  The "N" in his personality indicates he's not really a true "data guy".  Ns are very intuitive...the problem is that with intuition your are subject to your priors (in his case the idea that something, anything, must work) and unless you've achieved a very high level of self-awareness it's hard to check your priors.


----------



## texanincali

TOSDCI said:


> I wish that were true.  I am concerned that voters will forget about all this come election time or sooner if he is recalled.   Or they just replace Newsom with someone advocating the same policies.  I think it would be difficult to get anyone that does not have a big D by their name elected in California.


I agree.  There is a list of Democrats a mile long that are better than Newsom.  Policies in CA are what they are and that isn't going to change.  How those policies are laid out and how they are accomplished is something entirely different.  There is just too much blood on his hands to survive this.


----------



## crush

Grace T. said:


> I actually think Dad's math is quite brilliant and he has an amazing mind.  I actually really respect him.  When it's a pure data analysis he's the king.  I think his analysis of what's likely to happen is actually pretty spot on (I'm probably slightly more pessimistic but those are my priors).   Where he runs into issues is the conclusion.  The "N" in his personality indicates he's not really a true "data guy".  Ns are very intuitive...the problem is that with intuition your are subject to your priors (in his case the idea that something, anything, must work) and unless you've achieved a very high level of self-awareness it's hard to check your priors.


OK then, I will take back that dad's math is sh*t.  I see things clearly but no one believes me.  I sit back now and just read and try and help everyone to relax and calm down.  The good in all this is Grace is we have been forced to look inside our shadows and see what's really their.  I have much to share but most are not ready   I can say 100% a new kind of fun and life is coming.


----------



## MacDre

TOSDCI said:


> So are you saying that the church leaders are in cahoots with the tobacco industry to keep people addicted to cigarettes?  That's messed up!


Danville, VA is also known as the city of churches.  Many K-12 educators also had bacca farms too. So i’d say both religious leaders and educators were involved with actively misleading the masses.  But, considering how our country got rich off of bacca it easy to imagine why there was a misinformation campaign regarding the safety of bacca use.


----------



## crush

MacDre said:


> Danville, VA is also known as the city of churches.  Many K-12 educators also had bacca farms too. So i’d say both religious leaders and educators were involved with actively misleading the masses.  But, considering how our country got rich off of bacca it easy to imagine why there was a misinformation campaign regarding the safety of bacca use.


Leaders leading the sheep to the slaughter suck!!!


----------



## soccersc

Speed said:


> I hope you are right I am fearful that most of those supporting the recall and re election of a more moderate governor have left the state


I think you are right on...too many Ds and not only that California is actually becoming anti-R...so chances of having him removed or a more conservative take his place is pretty far fetched, but at least if it does get to recall he can realize he is somewhat accountable


----------



## crush

It's time we make love out of nothing at all!!!


----------



## Desert Hound

Grace T. said:


> I get why the politicians do it, but it still strikes me as fascinating that some health experts and informed people have grabbed a hold of this idea that "something's got to work" and won't let go of it, despite the mountain of evidence building to the contrary.


The thing that just boggles the mind is...

We have known since the first month or 2 the real at risk people. A small age segment of the population makes up 70-80% of all deaths. And yet our experts opted for blanket measures covering people who have essentially little to no risk. 

Instead of focusing on them, we pretend kids going to school are at risk and shut that down. CDC shows as of today about 730 people under the age of 24 have died because of covid. IF you divided that equally by state (yes I know...this is just for illustration purposes) you are at 14.6 per state. Think about that. We shut down schools/colleges youth sports? They are not at risk.


----------



## Grace T.

Something at least....the problem is the wheels of govt move really slowly, but hopefully the recall lights a fire under him...that's why even if you are going to vote against recalling Newsom, it's important to sign the recall if you want youth soccer back in California: it will pressure him to move quicker:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1356777557127950337


----------



## Desert Hound

By the way...CA has more cases per million vs FL. 

Here is a recent photo from FL with the press freaking out of course.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

dad4 said:


> single cause fallacy


Maybe our traditional flu has morphed to now COVID.  It's interesting that flu numbers are non existant and also that COVID numbers sky rocketted around the same months as the typical flu peaks.   I know this is not a scientific view but if you look at the numbers it kind of makes sense.


----------



## dad4

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Maybe our traditional flu has morphed to now COVID.  It's interesting that flu numbers are non existant and also that COVID numbers sky rocketted around the same months as the typical flu peaks.   I know this is not a scientific view but if you look at the numbers it kind of makes sense.


If you think of covid as a super flu, you’re not far off.

The biology is completely different.  Covid can’t mutate into the flu any more than you can give birth to a hippo.

But, in terms of how it affects us, it’s a good model.

The flu is still around.  It just can’t spread much in a world of zoom and masks.  So it hides out, gets people sick in ones and twos, and waits for us to get back to normal.  

Whenever we finally rid of masks and distance, then we will have a proper flu season again.


----------



## N00B

dad4 said:


> Whenever we finally rid of masks and distance, then we will have a proper flu season again.


I fear we will have a particularly bad flu season when things open up.  It may be a game of Russian roulette guessing which flu strain will be prevalent at that time and gearing the appropriate flu vaccine with current case counts for flu as low as they currently are.


----------



## MacDre

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I know this is not a scientific view but if you look at the numbers it kind of makes sense.


Fuck that!  Bro-science is legit.


----------



## lafalafa

Hopefully CDPH comes out with updated youth sports guidance some this month.

The football lobbying could work to the other sports benefits and/or cause a field log jam in the spring as High schools scramble to cram in all the sports within short time frames.

The original YS guidance from Aug 3rd had sports classified as low, moderate, and high contact with a distinction between outdoors and indoors.   Soccer was in the moderate class. Sports training and conditioning was back on if the physical distancing and other guidance was followed.

The Dec 14th update put sports in the tier jurisdiction with soccer being moved to high contact and needing the moderate or orange tier for competition to resume. Cohort restrictions where introduced to refrain from participating with more than one team over the same season or time frame.

The regional state at home orders in Dec prohibited competitions and scrimmages and out of state tournaments.

The Jan 26th update allowed competition between two team that meet the tier requirements for some sports and Inter-team scrimmages but out of state tournaments not permitted and the wearing of face covering during conditioning, practice, or competition should be implemented.

For the Feb update hoping soccer gets moved back down to moderate and somehow the comprise is reached where the tiers go away to some extent.  Not sure they will completely go away but perhaps just a two layer approach: outdoor low to moderate risk at the discretion of local health and indoor or high risks another set of parameters without having the whole state or a county lumped together.


----------



## Grace T.

Gov. Newsom’s approval rating drops to 31 percent: Poll
					

A new poll conducted by the University of California at Berkeley’s Institute of Governmental Studies found that Gov. Gavin Newsom's job approval rating plummeted by 18 percentage points in three months. In October, he had a 49% approval rating; in January it dropped to 31%.




					www.washingtonexaminer.com


----------



## tjinaz

dad4 said:


> Your search for the single cause continues.  You won’t find it.
> 
> That is because it is a complicated system.  There are at least six major variables: age, variant, weather, masks, distance, indoor/outdoors.  You don’t get to pick one and ignore the others.
> 
> The next step is not to latch onto of those and ask “is this _*the primary driver*_?”
> 
> The next step is to get with the program.
> 
> Mask, distance, outdoors.


I agree but when your "mitigation effort" has a 100% chance of financial ruin and mental health issues for a large segment of the society and does not seem to provide a substantial decrease in your infection/death rate you may want to change your policy.  I don't doubt that masks and social distancing help but it seems like the weather has a much larger impact in when surges occur.


----------



## crush

*Ditto this.  Zero+Zero=0*

*California high school football player goes viral after calling out Newsom for 'wasted final year'*

"*Zero* offers, *zero* looks,* zero* commitments, *zero *time on campus,* zero *homecoming, *zero *prom, *zero* traditional graduation. What a wasted final year of school," tweeted Isaiah Navarro, who attends Paraclete High School in Lancaster, Calif., according to his bio. 

"Worked hard and dedicated for absolutely* ZERO*. Big shout out to @GavinNewsom!  You got what you wanted," he continued. 

"I know there are thousands in my shoes across this State. I do not want anything given to me, just a chance to show my value and be an asset. Gray shirt, red shirt, grass, turf or dirt.* I will play anywhere, God willing*," Navarro said in a subsequent tweet.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> Funny.  My grandparents lived and farmed tobacco in Danville, VA the last capital of the confederacy before it fell.  I doubt there is a more conservative place in the US.  Gun safety is a mandatory class in sixth grade.  All of my teachers white or black were conservative Christian’s and farmed “bacca” as they call it in the south.  Many kids didn’t start school until after October because they had to pull bacca.  These folks were lied to and fooled.  They didn’t have a clue about the adverse health consequences of bacca.


Fine... 50-years ago.  You haven’t even been able to run a cigarette ad in how many decades?  What is the level of stupidity we’re suggesting here?  At what point do we acknowledge any 10-year old knows smoking is deadly?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> I couldn’t tell by how much prices have gone up.


Did you notice people moving away?  Everyone else has.

Tourism is up but a 75% reduction in mortgages and 25% reduction in salary seems to look good to people.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> This is crazy. The weather does not spread Covid-19, people do. The weather only makes it far more spreadable. It is all the more important to socially distance when the weather makes Covid-19 more dangerous. All of you act like this is some “it is what it is” problem.
> 
> As for last summer, it is ludicrous to claim that Governor Newsom should have known it was not a big deal for many reasons. First, it was still a big deal. Second, so little was known, and is still unknown, about the virus, so blaming any leader for being cautious even before it came clear how spreadable it is stupid.  Third, even if he had been certain that things would get bad as the weather got worse, the weather gets pretty bad as fall semester wears on. Sending everyone back in person with no idea how bad the weather might make it, how virulent it would get, how mutations would make it even more spreadable, is stupid compared to trying to create an online plan with the entire summer to prepare, instead of just having to do it in November.


“So little was known, and is still unknown, about the virus...” but Gavin good and Trump bad.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> I disagree.  You can lead a horse to water but you can’t force it to drink.  People in this community take advice from their religious leaders not from corrupt nerds that write biased reports for companies that hate small businesses.  You see those reports were put out by liberals because they want you to come work in their factories etc. etc. Many of these folks prefer to pray and “leave it in god’s hand” rather than seek medical treatment.  So the fact that there were reports of adverse health effects way back is meaningless if you don’t analyze it in the proper context.


So we are or we aren’t blaming white government for dropping drugs into the ghettos?  Who forced those horses?


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> “So little was known, and is still unknown, about the virus...” but Gavin good and Trump bad.


Oh lord. It was appropriate to take a cautious approach because anyone with half a brain knew this was going to be bad. It was irresponsible to assume only 12 people had it and it would go away like a miracle, or that injecting bleach would help, or sunshine up your ass, or that masks and social distancing don’t help. Your complete willingness to be an idiot and say idiotic things that you know full well are stupid, well, that’s what magats do. I guess you’ll just have to bend the knee to Marge, your new Q master.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Oh lord. It was appropriate to take a cautious approach because anyone with half a brain knew this was going to be bad. It was irresponsible to assume only 12 people had it and it would go away like a miracle, or that injecting bleach would help, or sunshine up your ass, or that masks and social distancing don’t help. Your complete willingness to be an idiot and say idiotic things that you know full well are stupid, well, that’s what magats do. I guess you’ll just have to bend the knee to Marge, your new Q master.


I quoted you, hypocrite, so that makes you the idiot.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> I quoted you, hypocrite, so that makes you the idiot.


You also skipped the important part. It’s hard to figure out with you trumpanzees whether you’re really that stupid or intentionally making frivolously stupid false equivalencies because you know there are magats even dumber than you.


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> *Ditto this.  Zero+Zero=0*
> 
> *California high school football player goes viral after calling out Newsom for 'wasted final year'*
> 
> "*Zero* offers, *zero* looks,* zero* commitments, *zero *time on campus,* zero *homecoming, *zero *prom, *zero* traditional graduation. What a wasted final year of school," tweeted Isaiah Navarro, who attends Paraclete High School in Lancaster, Calif., according to his bio.
> 
> "Worked hard and dedicated for absolutely* ZERO*. Big shout out to @GavinNewsom!  You got what you wanted," he continued.
> 
> "I know there are thousands in my shoes across this State. I do not want anything given to me, just a chance to show my value and be an asset. Gray shirt, red shirt, grass, turf or dirt.* I will play anywhere, God willing*," Navarro said in a subsequent tweet.


Wahh. If he could play, someone would have seen him last year. Maybe he needs to start looking at the obits to gain some perspective.


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> Wahh. If he could play, someone would have seen him last year. Maybe he needs to start looking at the obits to gain some perspective.


I see how much you care about all the kids.  This guy is from Lancaster and was hoping to land a nice deal somewhere.  The blue Chippers will always find a home early one.  Lawsuit city is coming to a town near you.  Assholes like you ruin it for everyone.  You cause me to puke!!!


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> Oh lord. It was appropriate to take a cautious approach because anyone with half a brain knew this was going to be bad. It was irresponsible to assume only 12 people had it and it would go away like a miracle, or that injecting bleach would help, or sunshine up your ass, or that masks and social distancing don’t help. Your complete willingness to be an idiot and say idiotic things that you know full well are stupid, well, that’s what magats do. I guess you’ll just have to bend the knee to Marge, your new Q master.


Like your LA Teachers Union and their demands?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> You also skipped the important part. It’s hard to figure out with you trumpanzees whether you’re really that stupid or intentionally making frivolously stupid false equivalencies because you know there are magats even dumber than you.


The important part?  Oh, you mean where Trump had the crystal ball and Gavin didn’t.  I get it.  After all, it was an “early dinner” so you forgive him.  

I just hope Gav doesn’t let his daughter play sports.


----------



## Glitterhater

crush said:


> 81 has a nice ring too it.  Is this Club 81 that my pal was sharing about?  He told me about this place that was  a warehouse of sex.  Basically, whatever your little heart desires can be found at the 81 French Warehouse?  Whatever the imagination, you can have your dreams come true.


You sure have a lot of "pals"


----------



## crush

Glitterhater said:


> You sure have a lot of "pals"


I only have one true best friend and that is my wife.  I have so many pals though.  I asked my sweet wife to marry me in Paris.  Guess where?


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> It is God’s will whether or not one dies of Covid-19. So don’t worry about it. Get back to the gym, The bar. Wherever. There is no better way to unify than to get Covid because you don’t care about others and then spread it.
> 
> It does make one wonder why he likes the Chinese so much better than Americans though. He isn’t killing any of them.


now you’re starting to get it...I kinda wonder why you haven’t advocated more of this approach early on...just think, if all the people who didn’t care about anyone would have just went out and lived their life, they would have all gotten Covid and died.  There would be no more “maggots” and the country would be in so much of a better place.  What were you thinking? You should have been a proponent this whole time, instead you have tried to convince everyone how wrong they are for going out. Bet you wish you could do that over


----------



## dad4

tjinaz said:


> I agree but when your "mitigation effort" has a 100% chance of financial ruin and mental health issues for a large segment of the society and does not seem to provide a substantial decrease in your infection/death rate you may want to change your policy.  I don't doubt that masks and social distancing help but it seems like the weather has a much larger impact in when surges occur.


I think masks and distance explain the difference between AZ death rates and death rates in less mask resistant states.

That is, going mask-optional and opening restaurants cost you about 4000 dead.  

Other NPI are different questions, with different answers.   Opening open air dining was much lower cost, and opening parks was probably beneficial.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> You also skipped the important part. It’s hard to figure out with you trumpanzees whether you’re really that stupid or intentionally making frivolously stupid false equivalencies because you know there are magats even dumber than you.


It’s also hard to tell if you’re intentionally so myopic, or if that’s just a reflection of your struggle to ‘adult’ in the real world.

Want to make the world a better place? You can start by making yourself a better person... it’ll help with those relationship struggles as well.


----------



## EOTL

N00B said:


> It’s also hard to tell if you’re intentionally so myopic, or if that’s just a reflection of your struggle to ‘adult’ in the real world.
> 
> Want to make the world a better place? You can start by making yourself a better person... it’ll help with those relationship struggles as well.


Being nice no longer makes for a better America. People like you have tolerated these magaty Q conspiracy theorists for years, and look where it’s gotten you.  Well, it’s not going so well for them now that enough people don’t play nice anymore. 



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/media/2021/02/04/smartmatic-fox-lawsuit/
		










						House votes to remove Marjorie Taylor Greene from committee assignments
					

The House voted Thursday evening to remove Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene from her committee assignments, a decisive step that comes in the wake of recently unearthed incendiary and violent past statements from the congresswoman that have triggered widespread backlash from Democrats and...




					www.cnn.com


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> I think masks and distance explain the difference between AZ death rates and death rates in less mask resistant states.


Yeah that is a bit of a stretch. 

Utah has been far more open vs AZ. When AZ had restaurants closed, my buddies were hanging out up there having cold beers. 

They have slightly more cases per million vs AZ, but substantially less deaths. 

NM a state you praised has about the same cases per mil as CA, but not much lower deaths per million vs AZ...and much higher vs CA. 

Cases per million and deaths per million do not necessarily work in tandem. 

Nor of course does masks and distance and closing. I present to you CA vs TX and FL as 3 of our largest states. 

If it were as simple as distance/masks/closing the data would clearly show a difference between the various states. It doesn't. Nor does it on a country by country basis.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Being nice no longer makes for a better America. People like you have tolerated these magaty Q conspiracy theorists for years, and look where it’s gotten you.  Well, it’s not going so well for them now that enough people don’t play nice anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/media/2021/02/04/smartmatic-fox-lawsuit/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> House votes to remove Marjorie Taylor Greene from committee assignments
> 
> 
> The House voted Thursday evening to remove Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene from her committee assignments, a decisive step that comes in the wake of recently unearthed incendiary and violent past statements from the congresswoman that have triggered widespread backlash from Democrats and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com


Tolerance- “the ability or willingness to tolerate something, in particular the existence of opinions or behavior that one does not necessarily agree with.”

‘People like you’ need to learn how to ‘adult’, it requires tolerance.  It does not mean one has to condone such behavior.  Maybe you confuse the two like you do with equality and equity.

Being a better person always improves the world by at least one and ideally more by example.  

It’s ok. I tolerate your angsty nihilism, but don’t condone it.  One day you’ll lean to ‘adult’.


----------



## TOSDCI

Grace T. said:


> Gov. Newsom’s approval rating drops to 31 percent: Poll
> 
> 
> A new poll conducted by the University of California at Berkeley’s Institute of Governmental Studies found that Gov. Gavin Newsom's job approval rating plummeted by 18 percentage points in three months. In October, he had a 49% approval rating; in January it dropped to 31%.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.washingtonexaminer.com


Wow!  31% seems pretty generous.  I would have guessed lower.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Being nice no longer makes for a better America. People like you have tolerated these magaty Q conspiracy theorists for years, and look where it’s gotten you.  Well, it’s not going so well for them now that enough people don’t play nice anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/media/2021/02/04/smartmatic-fox-lawsuit/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> House votes to remove Marjorie Taylor Greene from committee assignments
> 
> 
> The House voted Thursday evening to remove Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene from her committee assignments, a decisive step that comes in the wake of recently unearthed incendiary and violent past statements from the congresswoman that have triggered widespread backlash from Democrats and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com


We don't need “nice”.  We need a leader that puts our nation first.  Like Trump.  Remember when Mexico and Canada ran their mouths about Trump?  You don’t hear them anymore, do you?  Trump revised NAFTA and reminded them who daddy is.  But you spineless liberals can bend old grandpa Joe over for the oncoming train all the world leaders are going to run on his senile ass.  But you ladies can sit around and cry to each other about how we took the high road.  

Morons.


----------



## Grace T.

Global analysis suggests COVID-19 is seasonal | College of Agricultural, Consumer and Environmental Sciences | UIUC
					

URBANA, Ill. – With cities around the globe locking down yet again amid soaring COVID-19 numbers, could seasonality be partially to blame? New research from the University of Illinois says yes. In a paper published in Evolutionary Bioinformatics, Illinois researchers show COVID-19 cases and...




					aces.illinois.edu


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

[





Grace T. said:


> Global analysis suggests COVID-19 is seasonal | College of Agricultural, Consumer and Environmental Sciences | UIUC
> 
> 
> URBANA, Ill. – With cities around the globe locking down yet again amid soaring COVID-19 numbers, could seasonality be partially to blame? New research from the University of Illinois says yes. In a paper published in Evolutionary Bioinformatics, Illinois researchers show COVID-19 cases and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aces.illinois.edu


I’ve been saying that for months. It’s a seasonal trend and it won’t go away anytime soon.  We will see covid for the next 3 to 5 years.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> We don't need “nice”.  We need a leader that puts our nation first.  Like Trump.  Remember when Mexico and Canada ran their mouths about Trump?  You don’t hear them anymore, do you?  Trump revised NAFTA and reminded them who daddy is.  But you spineless liberals can bend old grandpa Joe over for the oncoming train all the world leaders are going to run on his senile ass.  But you ladies can sit around and cry to each other about how we took the high road.
> 
> Morons.


Here you go @N00B.  It doesn’t matter how incompetent, how terrible, how much it hurts even their own best interests, trumpanzees refuse to acknowledge it. All they understand is being a**holes. They will never stop until they are too humiliated to talk like this in public. He probably is, but s**tbag losers like him need to be reminded constantly about how dumb they are. How they are losers. How it is over for their racist, misogynistic, homophobic ways.


----------



## happy9

Scott m Shurson said:


> We don't need “nice”.  We need a leader that puts our nation first.  Like Trump.  Remember when Mexico and Canada ran their mouths about Trump?  You don’t hear them anymore, do you?  Trump revised NAFTA and reminded them who daddy is.  But you spineless liberals can bend old grandpa Joe over for the oncoming train all the world leaders are going to run on his senile ass.  But you ladies can sit around and cry to each other about how we took the high road.
> 
> Morons.


Sadly "nice" is seen by many in government as a tool of foreign policy.  "Nice" is what NATO, the UN, and other 2-3 letter international agencies prefer so we can line their pockets and fund their frivolous expeditions across the globe.  They need us to be nice so they can blow smoke up our 4th point of contact and make us feel good about funding some program that hasn't worked for 30 years.  So hang on to your seats, we are going to be nice for the near future.   We will host heads of states via zoom, grip and grin, and write checks - so much winning.  Gubment  at it's finest.


----------



## Desert Hound

happy9 said:


> Sadly "nice" is seen by many in government as a tool of foreign policy.  "Nice" is what NATO, the UN, and other 2-3 letter international agencies prefer so we can line their pockets and fund their frivolous expeditions across the globe.  They need us to be nice so they can blow smoke up our 4th point of contact and make us feel good about funding some program that hasn't worked for 30 years.  So hang on to your seats, we are going to be nice for the near future.   We will host heads of states via zoom, grip and grin, and write checks - so much winning.  Gubment  at it's finest.


What much of the world likes, the Dems like, and many Rs like is the idea of getting together to "talk" and create meaningless resolutions or treaties. Things that have no enforcement mechanisms, etc. Things however they can go back and say to their sheep we had a productive meeting. Nothing gets done, but you see it is the process that matters most. The meetings, saying nice things, etc.

None of the nations in the Paris treaties have done their part. The US without being in it has reduced emissions. But I guess we need to join a toothless treaty so when our peeps go to Europe they can say he we are in this together. What about China and India? They don't count despite China increasing emissions steadily.

NATO? For decades our leaders have asked the Euro nations to step up and pay more. They ask and the Euros say no. Trump pushes it and makes some of them pay more and he is derided.

We have had 50 plus years of saying peace in the Middle East is tied to the Palestinian issue and that other countries will not recognize Israel until that happens. That has been the gold standard in the US, Canada and Europe in dealing with the issue. Watch the vid below regarding Kerry. This is the type of thinking permeating our Gov and the Euros for decades regarding Israel and the Middle East.

<a href="



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1306586536956157954">September 17, 2020</a></blockquote>

What then happens? The US deals directly with various Arab governments and lo and behold Israel now has deals with 4 of the countries.

The idiots who cheer the closure of the Keystone Pipeline? Most want us to move to electric cars, etc and soon. What pray tell will power these cars? Oh yeah, fossil fuels. We would need to build a lot more plants to power these electric cars. These plants will need some type of fossil fuel. People seem to forget that "minor" detail. By the way anyone like the idea that with a stroke of a pen, one person can put thousands of people out of work?

And it goes on.

We can live in fantasy world were guys can play in womens sports because it isnt fair that they can't. Or we can deal with the world as it is on that issue and a range of other political and economic issues.

Look at CA. Essentially a one party state. A state that is for the "little guy". And yet what are the policies coming out? Higher gas prices, higher food costs, higher fees, higher property taxes, higher vehicle taxes, restrictions on new construction of housing which means higher prices. All of those things affect low income / middle class people adversely. And yet people mindlessly vote for these people because they seem cool, and when they give a speech they claim to want to help the little guy. And yet their policies make life far more expensive for the little guy.

These are the same idiots who instead of giving out the vaccine to the most vulnerable, start making plans to pass out the vaccine based on race, etc in order to be more equitable. WTF?

Then you heard the stuff, the world doesn't respect the US with T as Prez.  As if people worry about this on a daily or monthly basis. Hell most people cannot identify exactly where most countries are in the world anyway. But will dutifully repeat the mantra...we are less respected.

Most of our "leaders" are economically illiterate. Economics wise if you spotted them the C and the T, they still couldn't spell CAT. Case in point the proponents of the Green New Deal.


----------



## MacDre

happy9 said:


> Sadly "nice" is seen by many in government as a tool of foreign policy.  "Nice" is what NATO, the UN, and other 2-3 letter international agencies prefer so we can line their pockets and fund their frivolous expeditions across the globe.  They need us to be nice so they can blow smoke up our 4th point of contact and make us feel good about funding some program that hasn't worked for 30 years.  So hang on to your seats, we are going to be nice for the near future.   We will host heads of states via zoom, grip and grin, and write checks - so much winning.  Gubment  at it's finest.


One dimensional thinking.  We need bad assess but we also need diplomacy.  This position reminds me of how Marines tend to think that Airmen are useless non-hackers that wear a fancy post office uniform.  We need both.


----------



## MacDre

Desert Hound said:


> What much of the world likes, the Dems like, and many Rs like is the idea of getting together to "talk" and create meaningless resolutions or treaties. Things that have no enforcement mechanisms, etc. Things however they can go back and say to their sheep we had a productive meeting. Nothing gets done, but you see it is the process that matters most. The meetings, saying nice things, etc.
> 
> None of the nations in the Paris treaties have done their part. The US without being in it has reduced emissions. But I guess we need to join a toothless treaty so when our peeps go to Europe they can say he we are in this together. What about China and India? They don't count despite China increasing emissions steadily.
> 
> NATO? For decades our leaders have asked the Euro nations to step up and pay more. They ask and the Euros say no. Trump pushes it and makes some of them pay more and he is derided.
> 
> We have had 50 plus years of saying peace in the Middle East is tied to the Palestinian issue and that other countries will not recognize Israel until that happens. That has been the gold standard in the US, Canada and Europe in dealing with the issue. Watch the vid below regarding Kerry. This is the type of thinking permeating our Gov and the Euros for decades regarding Israel and the Middle East.
> 
> <a href="
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1306586536956157954">September 17, 2020</a></blockquote>
> 
> What then happens? The US deals directly with various Arab governments and lo and behold Israel now has deals with 4 of the countries.
> 
> The idiots who cheer the closure of the Keystone Pipeline? Most want us to move to electric cars, etc and soon. What pray tell will power these cars? Oh yeah, fossil fuels. We would need to build a lot more plants to power these electric cars. These plants will need some type of fossil fuel. People seem to forget that "minor" detail. By the way anyone like the idea that with a stroke of a pen, one person can put thousands of people out of work?
> 
> And it goes on.
> 
> We can live in fantasy world were guys can play in womens sports because it isnt fair that they can't. Or we can deal with the world as it is on that issue and a range of other political and economic issues.
> 
> Look at CA. Essentially a one party state. A state that is for the "little guy". And yet what are the policies coming out? Higher gas prices, higher food costs, higher fees, higher property taxes, higher vehicle taxes, restrictions on new construction of housing which means higher prices. All of those things affect low income / middle class people adversely. And yet people mindlessly vote for these people because they seem cool, and when they give a speech they claim to want to help the little guy. And yet their policies make life far more expensive for the little guy.
> 
> These are the same idiots who instead of giving out the vaccine to the most vulnerable, start making plans to pass out the vaccine based on race, etc in order to be more equitable. WTF?
> 
> Then you heard the stuff, the world doesn't respect the US with T as Prez.  As if people worry about this on a daily or monthly basis. Hell most people cannot identify exactly where most countries are in the world anyway. But will dutifully repeat the mantra...we are less respected.
> 
> Most of our "leaders" are economically illiterate. Economics wise if you spotted them the C and the T, they still couldn't spell CAT. Case in point the proponents of the Green New Deal.


To hell with diplomacy.  No National teams or Olympics either.  Let’s just pistol whip and/or drop bombs on those that don’t do what we want when we want.


----------



## Desert Hound

City of San Francisco Sues Its School District for Not Even Having a Plan to Reopen Schools
					

“This is hurting the mental health of our kids and our families."




					legalinsurrection.com
				




By the way they voted to change the name of this school and 40 some others. When they re-name it, I wonder how many extra languages they will put on the sign. Got to virtue signal inclusiveness eh?


----------



## happy9

MacDre said:


> One dimensional thinking.  We need bad assess but we also need diplomacy.  This position reminds me of how Marines tend to think that Airmen are useless non-hackers that wear a fancy post office uniform.  We need both.


No doubt balance is required, not arguing that.  The dollars spent and national treasure invested  over the last 20 years show that the balance is not in our favor

Any US service member who's served in vacation destinations all over the world the last  15 years clearly understands what the Air Force brings to the fight, even Marines.  Even though at times, they struggle to understand it.  That is to be expected (I say it tongue in cheek, having shared many a foxhole with Marines over the years).


----------



## happy9

MacDre said:


> To hell with diplomacy.  No National teams or Olympics either.  Let’s just pistol whip and/or drop bombs on those that don’t do what we want when we want.


Diplomacy is a shell word used by career politicians to line their own pockets and kiss babies.


----------



## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> What much of the world likes, the Dems like, and many Rs like is the idea of getting together to "talk" and create meaningless resolutions or treaties. Things that have no enforcement mechanisms, etc. Things however they can go back and say to their sheep we had a productive meeting. Nothing gets done, but you see it is the process that matters most. The meetings, saying nice things, etc.
> 
> None of the nations in the Paris treaties have done their part. The US without being in it has reduced emissions. But I guess we need to join a toothless treaty so when our peeps go to Europe they can say he we are in this together. What about China and India? They don't count despite China increasing emissions steadily.
> 
> NATO? For decades our leaders have asked the Euro nations to step up and pay more. They ask and the Euros say no. Trump pushes it and makes some of them pay more and he is derided.
> 
> We have had 50 plus years of saying peace in the Middle East is tied to the Palestinian issue and that other countries will not recognize Israel until that happens. That has been the gold standard in the US, Canada and Europe in dealing with the issue. Watch the vid below regarding Kerry. This is the type of thinking permeating our Gov and the Euros for decades regarding Israel and the Middle East.
> 
> <a href="
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1306586536956157954">September 17, 2020</a></blockquote>
> 
> What then happens? The US deals directly with various Arab governments and lo and behold Israel now has deals with 4 of the countries.
> 
> The idiots who cheer the closure of the Keystone Pipeline? Most want us to move to electric cars, etc and soon. What pray tell will power these cars? Oh yeah, fossil fuels. We would need to build a lot more plants to power these electric cars. These plants will need some type of fossil fuel. People seem to forget that "minor" detail. By the way anyone like the idea that with a stroke of a pen, one person can put thousands of people out of work?
> 
> And it goes on.
> 
> We can live in fantasy world were guys can play in womens sports because it isnt fair that they can't. Or we can deal with the world as it is on that issue and a range of other political and economic issues.
> 
> Look at CA. Essentially a one party state. A state that is for the "little guy". And yet what are the policies coming out? Higher gas prices, higher food costs, higher fees, higher property taxes, higher vehicle taxes, restrictions on new construction of housing which means higher prices. All of those things affect low income / middle class people adversely. And yet people mindlessly vote for these people because they seem cool, and when they give a speech they claim to want to help the little guy. And yet their policies make life far more expensive for the little guy.
> 
> These are the same idiots who instead of giving out the vaccine to the most vulnerable, start making plans to pass out the vaccine based on race, etc in order to be more equitable. WTF?
> 
> Then you heard the stuff, the world doesn't respect the US with T as Prez.  As if people worry about this on a daily or monthly basis. Hell most people cannot identify exactly where most countries are in the world anyway. But will dutifully repeat the mantra...we are less respected.
> 
> Most of our "leaders" are economically illiterate. Economics wise if you spotted them the C and the T, they still couldn't spell CAT. Case in point the proponents of the Green New Deal.


All true.  And yet, despite that, you lost Georgia 3 times in a row.  

It’s almost as though you lose votes when you spend 4 years advertising yourself as the nation’s asshole.


----------



## Kicker4Life

MacDre said:


> One dimensional thinking.  We need bad assess but we also need diplomacy.  This position reminds me of how Marines tend to think that Airmen are useless non-hackers that wear a fancy post office uniform.  We need both.


Walk softly yet carry a big stick!


----------



## Desert Hound

MacDre said:


> To hell with diplomacy.  No National teams or Olympics either.  Let’s just pistol whip and/or drop bombs on those that don’t do what we want when we want.


We were not pistol whipping anyone the last 4 yrs.

Matter of fact in the last 4 yrs we didn't start anything new.

We did renegotiate NAFTA. We did negotiate energy deals with Europe. We are much closer to India as a counter to China. We helped Israel sign peace deals with 4 Arab nations. 

And so on.


----------



## dad4

Desert Hound said:


> *We were not pistol whipping anyone the last 4 yrs.*
> 
> Matter of fact in the last 4 yrs we didn't start anything new.
> 
> We did renegotiate NAFTA. We did negotiate energy deals with Europe. We are much closer to India as a counter to China. We helped Israel sign peace deals with 4 Arab nations.
> 
> And so on.


It’s embarrassing that you have to qualify the time frame in that sentence.

It’s kind of like saying “I didn’t beat my wife yesterday.”.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Here you go @N00B.  It doesn’t matter how incompetent, how terrible, how much it hurts even their own best interests, trumpanzees refuse to acknowledge it. All they understand is being a**holes. They will never stop until they are too humiliated to talk like this in public. He probably is, but s**tbag losers like him need to be reminded constantly about how dumb they are. How they are losers. How it is over for their racist, misogynistic, homophobic ways.


I’m a loser because you’re a little bitch?


----------



## MacDre

Desert Hound said:


> We were not pistol whipping anyone the last 4 yrs.
> 
> Matter of fact in the last 4 yrs we didn't start anything new.
> 
> We did renegotiate NAFTA. We did negotiate energy deals with Europe. We are much closer to India as a counter to China. We helped Israel sign peace deals with 4 Arab nations.
> 
> And so on.


So you really believe what’s reported?  I’d like to send a shout out to my close friends in the Hank family, Groupo Caliente, and Club Tijuana.  I heard the food at the White House was delicious though.

Israel is more complicated.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> I’m a loser because you’re a little bitch?


Have you had your morning cup of coffee yet?


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Sadly "nice" is seen by many in government as a tool of foreign policy.  "Nice" is what NATO, the UN, and other 2-3 letter international agencies prefer so we can line their pockets and fund their frivolous expeditions across the globe.  They need us to be nice so they can blow smoke up our 4th point of contact and make us feel good about funding some program that hasn't worked for 30 years.  So hang on to your seats, we are going to be nice for the near future.   We will host heads of states via zoom, grip and grin, and write checks - so much winning.  Gubment  at it's finest.


Ha ha. Our standing and authority around the world was irreparably crushed over the last four years. The entire world laughed at your Magat Master’s ineptitude. The US has no power with anyone. Why?  Because you and the pathetic GQP are a joke.  The biggest laughingstock in world history.  

You seem to think marmalade-a-lago crashing a clown car loaded with your magat friends increased our standing, our authority, our ability to get favorable trade deals?  Sure. Under S**t for Brains and In His Pants’ watch, our federal deficit and the number of federal employees bloated out of control even before Covid. Unemployment is through the roof. The stock market was floundering until he lost. There is not one single thing that he has done to anyone’s benefit, other than he got you some judges to take away the rights of women to control their own bodies.

There has also never been a president so nice to repressive regimes and out enemies. Russia, North Korea, Saudi Arabia. Ridiculous. Enjoy more losing.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> I’m a loser because you’re a little bitch?


No you are a loser because you are. You haven’t done well in life. Virtually everyone you vote for loses. Almost nothing you want is happening. So much losing for you. Beautiful losing. The best losing.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> All true.  And yet, despite that, you lost Georgia 3 times in a row.
> 
> It’s almost as though you lose votes when you spend 4 years advertising yourself as the nation’s asshole.


Trump spoke like a CEO and the sheep couldn’t handle it.  Those of us that are educated and work didn’t shit the bed over it.  We didn’t like everything he said, but many of us are sick of watching the Clintons, the Obamas and the Biden’s get wealthy because they told the sheep what they wanted to hear and accomplished nothing.  To the point of sheep refusing to acknowledge things Biden said over the years that we’re every bit as offensive as Trump.  To the point of sheep refusing to admit Kamala Harris believed Biden’s accuser until he bribed her with a job.  To the point of refusing to admit Obama is on video saying illegal aliens need to be caught and shipped back.  The hypocrisy of hating Trump for saying the same shit is an absolute joke.  

I get DC is corrupt, but fucking admit the liberal party is every bit as corrupt, if not more so, than conservatives.  And, at some point, the sheep need to admit they don’t want to know anything.  Just stand on the podium and only spew nice things that help the flock feel better about things.  You know, right before the slaughter.  We can’t pay for everything.  We can’t pay for everyone.  We’re trillions in debt.  Trump tries to bring soldiers home from an endless war and liberals piss themselves.  Black people dying by the dozens in Chicago, every weekend.  Trump tries to help and what does that hideous bitch of a mayor do?  Calls him a racist and tells him to stay out.  Huh?  You’d rather let them keep dying to save racial face?  Fair enough.  To this day, they continue dying and the sheep don’t give a shit. 

Fucking moronic.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Ha ha. Our standing and authority around the world was irreparably crushed over the last four years. The entire world laughed at your Magat Master’s ineptitude. The US has no power with anyone. Why?  Because you and the pathetic GQP are a joke.  The biggest laughingstock in world history.
> 
> You seem to think marmalade-a-lago crashing a clown car loaded with your magat friends increased our standing, our authority, our ability to get favorable trade deals?  Sure. Under S**t for Brains and In His Pants’ watch, our federal deficit and the number of federal employees bloated out of control even before Covid. Unemployment is through the roof. The stock market was floundering until he lost. There is not one single thing that he has done to anyone’s benefit, other than he got you some judges to take away the rights of women to control their own bodies.
> 
> There has also never been a president so nice to repressive regimes and out enemies. Russia, North Korea, Saudi Arabia. Ridiculous. Enjoy more losing.


Nice novel, you whiny little bitch.  Nobody gives a shit if we aren’t popular.  This isn’t 5th grade.  Sorry that you were always picked last in P.E., but in the real world of grownups, we live with real life issues and we need a strong leader.  Your pussification of society is the problem, not the solution.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> To hell with diplomacy.  No National teams or Olympics either.  Let’s just pistol whip and/or drop bombs on those that don’t do what we want when we want.


Trump tried diplomacy and liberals cried about that, too.  Liberals cried about everything Trump ever said or did since the day he humiliated them and their spineless Hillary.  He couldn’t win no matter what he did.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> It’s embarrassing that you have to qualify the time frame in that sentence.
> 
> It’s kind of like saying “I didn’t beat my wife yesterday.”.


It’s embarrassing that you won’t acknowledge the facts he posted.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> No you are a loser because you are. You haven’t done well in life. Virtually everyone you vote for loses. Almost nothing you want is happening. So much losing for you. Beautiful losing. The best losing.


You’re so fucking stupid.  You know nothing about me, who I voted for or what I want to happen.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> Have you had your morning cup of coffee yet?


Now you need to defend the ladyboy?


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> Trump tried diplomacy and liberals cried about that, too.  Liberals cried about everything Trump ever said or did since the day he humiliated them and their spineless Hillary.  He couldn’t win no matter what he did.


The Bloated Mango “tried diplomacy”?  Sure, if by “diplomacy” you mean “appeased our enemies”.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> The Bloated Mango “tried diplomacy”?  Sure, if by “diplomacy” you mean “appeased our enemies”.


He tried something different because the alternative wasn’t working.  You also choose to ignore he put sanctions on them.  

Goddamn, he’s so deep in your head it’s embarrassing.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> Being nice no longer makes for a better America. People like you have tolerated these magaty Q conspiracy theorists for years, and look where it’s gotten you.  Well, it’s not going so well for them now that enough people don’t play nice anymore.







__





						Redirect Notice
					





					www.google.com


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Scott m Shurson said:


> Trump spoke like a CEO and the sheep couldn’t handle it.


Trump spoke like a CEO and he did some good things but a lot of failures: 
- Our GDP didnt grow by 6% as he committed to doing this. 
- Mexico didnt pay for the wall. 
- Manufacturing grew but it didnt sustain after 2 years. 
- He did slap China's hands and I applauded that but ultimately China won
- Foreign politics was a complete failure and China is now gaining stronger ties with countries in South America and Middle East. 
- COVID was a failure (Then again no president could have done a good job)
- Covid vaccine launch was a failure
- His personal businesses are taking a beating and he owes tons of money to banks (default is coming soon)
- Failure to replace Obama care (
*
Accomplishments: *
- Unemployment rate was low and more people gained jobs. 
- Tax Reform
-He got the looney's to support his agenda (Proud Boys, Qanon, conspiracies)

For the record, I am voting for any republican but Trump in 2024.  I am also voting to get rid of Newsome.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Trump spoke like a CEO and he did some good things but a lot of failures:
> - Our GDP didnt grow by 6% as he committed to doing this.
> - Mexico didnt pay for the wall.
> - Manufacturing grew but it didnt sustain after 2 years.
> - He did slap China's hands and I applauded that but ultimately China won
> - Foreign politics was a complete failure and China is now gaining stronger ties with countries in South America and Middle East.
> - COVID was a failure (Then again no president could have done a good job)
> - Covid vaccine launch was a failure
> - His personal businesses are taking a beating and he owes tons of money to banks (default is coming soon)
> - Failure to replace Obama care (
> 
> *Accomplishments: *
> - Unemployment rate was low and more people gained jobs.
> - Tax Reform
> -He got the looney's to support his agenda (Proud Boys, Qanon, conspiracies)
> 
> For the record, I am voting for any republican but Trump in 2024.  I am also voting to get rid of Newsome.


Yes, he had some failures.  Imagine if he didn’t have 4 years of Democrats deliberately undermining everything he said or did.


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> Yes, he had some failures.  Imagine if he didn’t have 4 years of Democrats deliberately undermining everything he said or did.


Imagine if I was handsome and a little taller.  You have to play the hand that you’re dealt.


----------



## watfly

The problem with the left's method of negotiating is they bet against themselves, and eliminate any leverage the US may have.  Prime examples are the Paris Climate Accord and the Bergdahl trade for terrorists.

The Left selling a car listed for $3,000 wanting to get at least $2,500.  Buyer "What's your best price?", the Left "I can't go below $2,500", Buyer "That's a deal"

The Right selling a car listed for $3,000 wanting to get at least $2,500.  Buyer "What's your best price?", the Right "$3,000 is my asking price", Buyer "Will you take $2,800?", the Right "Yep, deal".

Say what you want about Trump,  he was an expert at using leverage and the bully pulpit with other nations.  (Unfortunately, he bullied certain Americans as well).  All the while the left were adamant that he was going start another World war by bombing Russian jets in Syria and taking out Soleimani in Iraq.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> Imagine if I was handsome and a little taller.  You have to play the hand that you’re dealt.


I am handsome.  Doesn’t make anything easier.

It was bullshit how jaded and immature the democrats acted.  Obama had to deal with some of that but nothing like Trump.  Them trying for a 2nd impeachment shows you what a bunch of pathetic losers they are. 

Historical pandemic, people losing jobs, can’t provide food for their families and these assholes are wasting more focus, time and money with Trump. 

Democrats are a disgrace to this country.


----------



## happy9

Kicker4Life said:


> Walk softly yet carry a big stick!


Not something politicians over the last 20 years have been able to do.  Good slogan though.

The walking is either loud and the stick is a twig, or the stick is big but the talking is unintelligent.  Just take a look at where we are today around the world and how we got there.  Anyway, not like it matters to a kid soccer forum.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Ha ha. Our standing and authority around the world was irreparably crushed over the last four years. The entire world laughed at your Magat Master’s ineptitude. The US has no power with anyone. Why?  Because you and the pathetic GQP are a joke.  The biggest laughingstock in world history.
> 
> You seem to think marmalade-a-lago crashing a clown car loaded with your magat friends increased our standing, our authority, our ability to get favorable trade deals?  Sure. Under S**t for Brains and In His Pants’ watch, our federal deficit and the number of federal employees bloated out of control even before Covid. Unemployment is through the roof. The stock market was floundering until he lost. There is not one single thing that he has done to anyone’s benefit, other than he got you some judges to take away the rights of women to control their own bodies.
> 
> There has also never been a president so nice to repressive regimes and out enemies. *Russia, North Korea, Saudi Arabia*. Ridiculous. Enjoy more losing.


Tell me more about these countries, please.  You seem to be an expert and well connected.

The rest of your schtick is tiresome


----------



## happy9

dad4 said:


> It’s embarrassing that you have to qualify the time frame in that sentence.
> 
> It’s kind of like saying “I didn’t beat my wife yesterday.”.


I think I'd quantify it as a consistent, but a very unpopular policy in places like the middle east over the last 4 years.  The yo yo policy from 2006 - 2016 was unsettling to say the least.  Timelines, surges, remove troops, reinsert troops, draw red lines , fake threats.  Consistency has not been our strength.  
Not one country in the middle east trusted us after 2008, and that includes our NATO friends who 100% took advantage of us in lovely Afghanistan.  For whatever is said of trump, the middle east is something that should receive  little criticism.  Realignment of NATO, while unpopular, has shown success.  For all of the russia cronyism that's been sent trumps way, the re-shaping of the middle east and easter europe is a serious thorn/threat to russian influence.

The political rhetoric is all bs, i just don't listen that much and could care less what some washed up pundit (on either side)  says to support their partisan view.


----------



## NorCalDad

watfly said:


> Say what you want about Trump,  he was an expert at using leverage and the bully pulpit with other nations.  (Unfortunately, he bullied certain Americans as well).  All the while the left were adamant that he was going start another World war by bombing Russian jets in Syria and taking out Soleimani in Iraq.


Curiously, what do you think Trump achieved internationally using his expertise?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> The Bloated Mango “tried diplomacy”?  Sure, if by “diplomacy” you mean “appeased our enemies”.


How so?


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> I am handsome.  Doesn’t make anything easier.
> 
> It was bullshit how jaded and immature the democrats acted.  Obama had to deal with some of that but nothing like Trump.  Them trying for a 2nd impeachment shows you what a bunch of pathetic losers they are.
> 
> Historical pandemic, people losing jobs, can’t provide food for their families and these assholes are wasting more focus, time and money with Trump.
> 
> Democrats are a disgrace to this country.


Democrats immature?  Your Magat-in-Chief spent virtually all day every day tweeting immature nonsense for four years. The current face of the GQP claims school shootings are a false flag operation by Democrats and that 9/11 was a hoax. Teddy Boy Cruz runs reelection ads where he claims to make machine gun bacon. Your entire party is a pathetic joke. Compare that to our current president, a real one, who hasn’t said a single immature thing.  Neither did Obama in eight years. 

You claim that this historical pandemic has been mishandled by democrats despite a GQP president and Senate is a sad joke. People lost their jobs and can’t put food on the table because our federal government was incompetent. It spent months lying to you while Covid-19 spread like crazy. It botched the vaccine implementation and delivery. It failed to provide assistance to people that was desperately  needed. We would not be in this mess, and states would not be forced to take unilateral action, if our federal government had provided even the slightest degree of competence or had national policy that involved mote than “don’t wear masks” and maybe look into whether injecting bleach into your lungs and sunshine up your ass is not leadership. 

You’re just a typical Excremento magat loser. You’ll blame Newsom for whatever it takes if it means you can keep sucking your master’s cheeto-flavored (and sized) penis.


----------



## dad4

happy9 said:


> I think I'd quantify it as a consistent, but a very unpopular policy in places like the middle east over the last 4 years.  The yo yo policy from 2006 - 2016 was unsettling to say the least.  Timelines, surges, remove troops, reinsert troops, draw red lines , fake threats.  Consistency has not been our strength.
> Not one country in the middle east trusted us after 2008, and that includes our NATO friends who 100% took advantage of us in lovely Afghanistan.  For whatever is said of trump, the middle east is something that should receive  little criticism.  Realignment of NATO, while unpopular, has shown success.  For all of the russia cronyism that's been sent trumps way, the re-shaping of the middle east and easter europe is a serious thorn/threat to russian influence.
> 
> The political rhetoric is all bs, i just don't listen that much and could care less what some washed up pundit (on either side)  says to support their partisan view.


Half I agree with, but there are some Syrian Kurds who might question your use of the word “consistent”.


----------



## NorCalDad

Going back the virus and letting kids play.....It's going to be curious to see what happens after the super bowl.  I'm guessing a lot of folks will end up having super bowl parties.  It will be interesting to see if get a bump 10-14 days from this weekend.


----------



## dad4

NorCalDad said:


> Going back the virus and letting kids play.....It's going to be curious to see what happens after the super bowl.  I'm guessing a lot of folks will end up having super bowl parties.  It will be interesting to see if get a bump 10-14 days from this weekend.


Are we really that stupid?

I suppose so.  

<beats head against table>


----------



## EOTL

NorCalDad said:


> Going back the virus and letting kids play.....It's going to be curious to see what happens after the super bowl.  I'm guessing a lot of folks will end up having super bowl parties.  It will be interesting to see if get a bump 10-14 days from this weekend.


I have an idea. People should have Super Bowl parties at schools. I hear that you can’t get Covid-19 at a school.


----------



## watfly

NorCalDad said:


> Curiously, what do you think Trump achieved internationally using his expertise?


-Far and away his biggest achievement is energy independence.  Geopolitically that can't be underestimated.
-Wiped out ISIS (to some extent I believe Obama got the ball rolling, but you don't get credit for putting out fires you started)
-Release of hostages and political prisoners without giving up much
-Elimination of Soleimani, Baghdadi
-Brought troops home, no new wars
-Made NATO partners more accountable
-Normalized relations between certain Arab countries and Israel (although those aren't major countries in the Middle East conflict, that was far more than what his predecessors accomplished
-Made some inroads on the trade abuses of China
-The Paris Accord whether in it, or out of it, is really meaningless to me.

I didn't agree with his reversal of Cuba policy.

I won't claim he is a foreign policy genius, he is not.  Other than energy independence, most of his foreign achievements were modest.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> I have an idea. People should have Super Bowl parties at schools. I hear that you can’t get Covid-19 at a school.


It’s not that you can’t get it, but CDC seems to have the stance that students in school is safe and they should re-open. 

Are your saying that The CDC is full of Q conspirators too?


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Are we really that stupid?
> 
> I suppose so.
> 
> <beats head against table>


In California, do we really care this year (on our call this morning, only 1/20 colleagues would confess to doing something for the superbowl, and that consisted of going over to his folks house)?  Now Florida...considering Florida (like most of the rest of the country) is on a downward slope, and considering its probably too early to really get started the coming 3rd variant-caused wave), and considering Florida is mostly open, we'll get to see exactly how much of a bump these behaviors really create.  There hasn't been a bump up in testing either in LA County so it doesn't appear a ton of people are rushing out for precautionary testing before visiting grandma for the superbowl


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> In California, do we really care this year (on our call this morning, only 1/20 colleagues would confess to doing something for the superbowl, and that consisted of going over to his folks house)?  Now Florida...considering Florida (like most of the rest of the country) is on a downward slope, and considering its probably too early to really get started the coming 3rd variant-caused wave), and considering Florida is mostly open, we'll get to see exactly how much of a bump these behaviors really create.  There hasn't been a bump up in testing either in LA County so it doesn't appear a ton of people are rushing out for precautionary testing before visiting grandma for the superbowl


People only get tested to protect grandma.

Protecting Bob, Patty, and Larry at the Superbowl party sounds less important.  Besides, Larry is tough.  He'll be fine.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> It’s not that you can’t get it, but CDC seems to have the stance that students in school is safe and they should re-open.
> 
> Are your saying that The CDC is full of Q conspirators too?


You misrepresent the CDC’s stance. Yes, like everyone it wants schools open safely as soon as it is safe. It does not mean that it can be done safely everywhere.

There are different factors that affect different schools in different regions very differently. Claiming that we should just reopen all schools because the CDC says so and nobody gets Covid there, let alone spreads it to others, is irresponsible and borderline brain-dead.


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> You misrepresent the CDC’s stance. Yes, like everyone it wants schools open safely as soon as it is safe. It does not mean that it can be done safely everywhere.
> 
> There are different factors that affect different schools in different regions very differently. Claiming that we should just reopen all schools because the CDC says so and nobody gets Covid there, let alone spreads it to others, is irresponsible and borderline brain-dead.


So who misrepresents their case more you or me?










						CDC Makes The Case For Schools Reopening
					

Federal researchers say, with proper safety precautions, schools don't seem to fuel outbreaks, with some exceptions such as indoor sports practices.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> People only get tested to protect grandma.
> 
> Protecting Bob, Patty, and Larry at the Superbowl party sounds less important.  Besides, Larry is tough.  He'll be fine.


Shocking.  Charge you with ageism and antifeminism: the assumption that grandma doesn't love football (at least my kids does)


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> So who misrepresents their case more you or me?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CDC Makes The Case For Schools Reopening
> 
> 
> Federal researchers say, with proper safety precautions, schools don't seem to fuel outbreaks, with some exceptions such as indoor sports practices.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org


Go to the CDC website and read what they actually say.


----------



## watfly

dad4 said:


> Are we really that stupid?
> 
> I suppose so.
> 
> <beats head against table>


There goes your invite.


----------



## NorCalDad

Grace T. said:


> Shocking.  Charge you with ageism and antifeminism: the assumption that grandma doesn't love football (at least my kids does)


I'm not a big american football fan, but when my grandparents were alive, I never once went to a super bowl party where they were in attendance.  That's just one data point


----------



## EOTL

watfly said:


> -Far and away his biggest achievement is energy independence.  Geopolitically that can't be underestimated.
> -Wiped out ISIS (to some extent I believe Obama got the ball rolling, but you don't get credit for putting out fires you started)
> -Release of hostages and political prisoners without giving up much
> -Elimination of Soleimani, Baghdadi
> -Brought troops home, no new wars
> -Made NATO partners more accountable
> -Normalized relations between certain Arab countries and Israel (although those aren't major countries in the Middle East conflict, that was far more than what his predecessors accomplished
> -Made some inroads on the trade abuses of China
> -The Paris Accord whether in it, or out of it, is really meaningless to me.
> 
> I didn't agree with his reversal of Cuba policy.
> 
> I won't claim he is a foreign policy genius, he is not.  Other than energy independence, most of his foreign achievements were modest.


Gosh, Mr. Apologist, there were two things Cadet Bone Spurs did not completely screw up, so let’s ignore his actual abysmal record, the worst in history. 



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/23/trumps-foreign-policy-report-card-is-full-failing-grades/


----------



## dad4

NorCalDad said:


> I'm not a big american football fan, but when my grandparents were alive, I never once went to a super bowl party where they were in attendance.  That's just one data point


Grace was just giving me grief.  The point on no testing sure for bowl parties still stands.

Besides, grandma can't go to the party because she's in Texas, reviewing HS tapes and recruiting a new WR for the 'Huskers.


----------



## happy9

dad4 said:


> Half I agree with, but there are some Syrian Kurds who might question your use of the word “consistent”.


The Syrian Kurd scenario is quite complex.  They straddle both sides of the fence and have often been their own worst enemy and a great ally (situationally driven).  Their conditions didn't spiral out of control as badly as most western, hysterical media and pundits predicted.  We still enjoy a healthy relationship with them on the ground.  Strategically, it's likely easier for them to leverage their influence without having us right there.  They prefer to leverage our existence in the form of bombs, missiles, and the occasional SOF raid.  They like us over the border in Iraq, keeping the Turks in check.  They are a savvy bunch.

Kurds in general are complex, spread across 4 countries.  Even with their abandonment in  1991, the Iraqi Kurds enjoy the most power and stability in the region, insulated from much of the general drama that is a characteristics of their people.

The complexity of the entire situation exceeds MSM's  ability to explain.  It certainly exceeds the capacity and capability of your average congressmen and senator.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Gosh, Mr. Apologist, there were two things Cadet Bone Spurs did not completely screw up, so let’s ignore his actual abysmal record, the worst in history.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/23/trumps-foreign-policy-report-card-is-full-failing-grades/


Ha...an opinion piece..


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Ha...an opinion piece..


Uh, anonymous @watfly giving his opinion regarding the foreign “policy” of Mr. Can’t Hold a Glass of Water or Walk Down a Ramp is an opinion “piece”.  The Washington Post’s opinion piece, however, is based on actual fact. Go back to your fact free Parler if you need to make yourself feel better.


----------



## EOTL

EOTL said:


> Uh, anonymous @watfly giving his opinion regarding the foreign “policy” of Mr. Can’t Hold a Glass of Water or Walk Down a Ramp is an opinion “piece”.  The Washington Post’s opinion piece, however, is based on actual fact. Go back to your fact free Parler if you need to make yourself feel better.


Never mind about Parler. Still down.  Maybe you can get the “real” scoop on Twitter from the Mein Pillow guy instead.


----------



## dad4

happy9 said:


> The Syrian Kurd scenario is quite complex.  They straddle both sides of the fence and have often been their own worst enemy and a great ally (situationally driven).  Their conditions didn't spiral out of control as badly as most western, hysterical media and pundits predicted.  We still enjoy a healthy relationship with them on the ground.  Strategically, it's likely easier for them to leverage their influence without having us right there.  They prefer to leverage our existence in the form of bombs, missiles, and the occasional SOF raid.  They like us over the border in Iraq, keeping the Turks in check.  They are a savvy bunch.
> 
> Kurds in general are complex, spread across 4 countries.  Even with their abandonment in  1991, the Iraqi Kurds enjoy the most power and stability in the region, insulated from much of the general drama that is a characteristics of their people.
> 
> The complexity of the entire situation exceeds MSM's  ability to explain.  It certainly exceeds the capacity and capability of your average congressmen and senator.


It’s the mid east.  Of course it is complicated.

That does not explain why we spent years building a relationship with them, only to abandon them without warning.  

“it’s complicated, you wouldn’t understand” is rarely used by someone whose policy is defensible.  It’s used by someone who doesn’t want to have to defend a mistake.  So they change the subject, throw around some FUD, and claim it is too complicated for mere mortals to think about.


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> It’s the mid east.  Of course it is complicated.
> 
> That does not explain why we spent years building a relationship with them, only to abandon them without warning.
> 
> “it’s complicated, you wouldn’t understand” is rarely used by someone whose policy is defensible.  It’s used by someone who doesn’t want to have to defend a mistake.  So they change the subject, throw around some FUD, and claim it is too complicated for mere mortals to think about.


It isn’t complicated when they’re woot wooting b.s. “progress” between Israel and nobody countries that have no actual impact on Middle East relations. Hey look!  The Tangerine Tantrum in (former) Chief stayed within the lines in his coloring book, therefore he is a better artist than Picasso!


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Democrats immature?  Your Magat-in-Chief spent virtually all day every day tweeting immature nonsense for four years. The current face of the GQP claims school shootings are a false flag operation by Democrats and that 9/11 was a hoax. Teddy Boy Cruz runs reelection ads where he claims to make machine gun bacon. Your entire party is a pathetic joke. Compare that to our current president, a real one, who hasn’t said a single immature thing.  Neither did Obama in eight years.
> 
> You claim that this historical pandemic has been mishandled by democrats despite a GQP president and Senate is a sad joke. People lost their jobs and can’t put food on the table because our federal government was incompetent. It spent months lying to you while Covid-19 spread like crazy. It botched the vaccine implementation and delivery. It failed to provide assistance to people that was desperately  needed. We would not be in this mess, and states would not be forced to take unilateral action, if our federal government had provided even the slightest degree of competence or had national policy that involved mote than “don’t wear masks” and maybe look into whether injecting bleach into your lungs and sunshine up your ass is not leadership.
> 
> You’re just a typical Excremento magat loser. You’ll blame Newsom for whatever it takes if it means you can keep sucking your master’s cheeto-flavored (and sized) penis.




Did you look me up, stalker ladyboy?  Hey, since Trump is gone and you can’t get pregnant, why are you here?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I have an idea. People should have Super Bowl parties at schools. I hear that you can’t get Covid-19 at a school.


I hear you can’t be within 100-yards of a school.


----------



## happy9

dad4 said:


> It’s the mid east.  Of course it is complicated.
> 
> *That does not explain why we spent years building a relationship with them, only to abandon them without warning. *
> 
> “it’s complicated, you wouldn’t understand” is rarely used by someone whose policy is defensible.  It’s used by someone who doesn’t want to have to defend a mistake.  So they change the subject, throw around some FUD, and claim it is too complicated for mere mortals to think about.


Can't disagree more.  The Syrian  Kurds weren't abandoned, we pulled out of the terrain that Turkey intended to seize.  NATO alliance (unfortunately) is more important than the shaky alliance forged with Kurd factions that are designated as terrorists groups by a NATO ally.  The Kurds often do these things to themselves.  They in fact have conducted terrorist operations into Turkey.  We remained in place throughout  northern syria, except where Turkey decided to plant their flag.  To this day, we partner with all of the SDF Kurds.  To what end?  no one really knows or cares.  Just another way to spend american taxpayer dollars without a strategy.

The MSM puts out crap that is inherently wrong, vauge, or advantageous to their position.  It's unfortunate.

Beyond that, failed policy and inadequate decision making back during the "red line" tough talk debacle put us in the backseat in Syria early on.  But that's a whole other story.  We haven't had a coherent policy in the middle east in...well...forever.  Leaving in a coherent manner is a start.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Go to the CDC website and read what they actually say.


I thought you had changed your view and were going to start advocating people get back out there.  Then you can get rid of all the "maggots" that way.  What happened? 

Your responses continue to prove that you just don't get it, I will continue to try and teach you. Those kids who are not in school are going to be the ones you giving food stamps to in a few years or ones that become lifers at McDonalds.  The ones in zoom class with a black screen or can't get on zoom because their internet is constantly going out.  But hey, keep them at home where they are safe.  Guess what dude, kids that are in a better socio-economic environment don't have those problems.  They are at a private school in class (one reason public school enrollment is so low,) they are getting tutoring, and they have the equipment to be able to learn virtually (like dual monitors, not some tiny laptop that you can't even see the screen) 

I told you not to mention schools and you continue to think you know.  Sure, keep them at home, but remember that is how the rich get richer and the poorer get poorer.... you are going to see such a big learning gap between those that continued their education and the ones that missed a year and a half of school....they are going to be so far behind, no way they can catch up....especially if they are a junior or senior.  









						PACE - COVID-19 and the Educational Equity Crisis
					

From the day California schools closed in March, researchers, policymakers, and educators alike have been concerned about the impact that the pandemic would have on student learning, and worried that our most vulnerable students will experience this so-called “learning loss” more than others...




					edpolicyinca.org
				











						California public schools suffer record enrollment drop
					

The COVID-19 pandemic has led to a record one-year enrollment drop of 155,000 students at California public schools, per state projections.




					calmatters.org


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> I hear you can’t be within 100-yards of a school.


One of the most widely-accepted theories behind why trumpanzees fixate so much in alleging pedophilia by others is “fever dream projection.”









						Why Is the Far Right Obsessed with Pedophilia?
					

The right demonizes liberals and Democrats as "pedophiles" by inventing or misrepresenting facts.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Uh, anonymous @watfly giving his opinion regarding the foreign “policy” of Mr. Can’t Hold a Glass of Water or Walk Down a Ramp is an opinion “piece”.  The Washington Post’s opinion piece, however, is based on actual fact. Go back to your fact free Parler if you need to make yourself feel better.


Parler?  really.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> One of the most widely-accepted theories behind why trumpanzees fixate so much in alleging pedophilia by others is “fever dream projection.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why Is the Far Right Obsessed with Pedophilia?
> 
> 
> The right demonizes liberals and Democrats as "pedophiles" by inventing or misrepresenting facts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com


Not democrats.  You.


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> It isn’t complicated when they’re woot wooting b.s. “progress” between Israel and nobody countries that have no actual impact on Middle East relations. Hey look!  The Tangerine Tantrum in (former) Chief stayed within the lines in his coloring book, therefore he is a better artist than Picasso!


Most analysts view the recent agreements as progress.

Give the Cheeto his due.

Then vote to convict.  I certainly don’t want him back.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> It isn’t complicated when they’re woot wooting b.s. “progress” between Israel and nobody countries that have no actual impact on Middle East relations. Hey look!  The Tangerine Tantrum in (former) Chief stayed within the lines in his coloring book, therefore he is a better artist than Picasso!


Nonsensical gibberish again.  Stick with whatever you think your strengths are.


----------



## EOTL

dad4 said:


> Most analysts view the recent agreements as progress.
> 
> Give the Cheeto his due.
> 
> Then vote to convict.  I certainly don’t want him back.


Sorry, but no. Forcing Iran to go nuclear and ratcheting up even more Sunni v Shiite animosity makes his Middle East foreign policy an an abject disaster, and just another mess that will need to get cleaned up.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> Nonsensical gibberish again.  Stick with whatever you think your strengths are.


Ok magat.


----------



## Glitterhater

EOTL said:


> Democrats immature?  Your Magat-in-Chief spent virtually all day every day tweeting immature nonsense for four years. The current face of the GQP claims school shootings are a false flag operation by Democrats and that 9/11 was a hoax. Teddy Boy Cruz runs reelection ads where he claims to make machine gun bacon. Your entire party is a pathetic joke. Compare that to our current president, a real one, who hasn’t said a single immature thing.  Neither did Obama in eight years.
> 
> You claim that this historical pandemic has been mishandled by democrats despite a GQP president and Senate is a sad joke. People lost their jobs and can’t put food on the table because our federal government was incompetent. It spent months lying to you while Covid-19 spread like crazy. It botched the vaccine implementation and delivery. It failed to provide assistance to people that was desperately  needed. We would not be in this mess, and states would not be forced to take unilateral action, if our federal government had provided even the slightest degree of competence or had national policy that involved mote than “don’t wear masks” and maybe look into whether injecting bleach into your lungs and sunshine up your ass is not leadership.
> 
> You’re just a typical Excremento magat loser. You’ll blame Newsom for whatever it takes if it means you can keep sucking your master’s cheeto-flavored (and sized) penis.


I would love some eye bleach right about now. Did you really need to put that last sentence out into the universe??


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Sorry, but no. Forcing Iran to go nuclear and ratcheting up even more Sunni v Shiite animosity makes his Middle East foreign policy an an abject disaster, and just another mess that will need to get cleaned up.


splain please.  You are completely out of your depth here.  Iran already went "nuclear", have you looked at Syria lately?  Have you even read what the Iran nuclear deal allowed Iran to do?  Sunni and Shia animosity has been spurred more so by governments.  They've lived together, peacefully, for centuries..And still do in many places. 

The Iran nuclear deal is 100% abdication of US responsibility in the region and lines the pockets of the mullahs and Europe.  It also forces Saudi Arabia, the emirates, and Turkey to get into an arms race with Iran.  The Iran nuclear deal did not address long range ballistic missile development and gave them the technology for advanced centrifuges.  But you can continue to listen to talk show jockeys for your in your info.  

The Iranian government is in for the long haul, the Israelis know this, as do the Jordanians, the Saudis, etc.  It's not coincidence that Iranian scientists are being assassinated and facilities are blowing up.   But you already know all of this and think it's a great idea to appease Iran and suck up to Europe.  Makes sense..


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> One of the most widely-accepted theories behind why trumpanzees fixate so much in alleging pedophilia by others is “fever dream projection.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why Is the Far Right Obsessed with Pedophilia?
> 
> 
> The right demonizes liberals and Democrats as "pedophiles" by inventing or misrepresenting facts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com


Odd... kinda like you being fixated on magats.

Please continue.


----------



## soccersc

happy9 said:


> splain please.  You are completely out of your depth here.  Iran already went "nuclear", have you looked at Syria lately?  Have you even read what the Iran nuclear deal allowed Iran to do?  Sunni and Shia animosity has been spurred more so by governments.  They've lived together, peacefully, for centuries..And still do in many places.
> 
> The Iran nuclear deal is 100% abdication of US responsibility in the region and lines the pockets of the mullahs and Europe.  It also forces Saudi Arabia, the emirates, and Turkey to get into an arms race with Iran.  The Iran nuclear deal did not address long range ballistic missile development and gave them the technology for advanced centrifuges.  But you can continue to listen to talk show jockeys for your in your info.
> 
> The Iranian government is in for the long haul, the Israelis know this, as do the Jordanians, the Saudis, etc.  It's not coincidence that Iranian scientists are being assassinated and facilities are blowing up.   But you already know all of this and think it's a great idea to appease Iran and suck up to Europe.  Makes sense..


Problem is this guy @EOTL doesn’t really know in depth about anything.  He reads an article here and there and thinks he really KNOWS...like his terrible takes on school...these are the kind of guys that cause so many problems in our society, they think they know and they don’t, and then they spread their nonsense to people who really have no idea and are uneducated, and our country continues to spiral. People that vote because they heard something on TV without researching for themselves, they listen to guys like @EOTL and end up being repressed because they really don’t understand what they are voting for


----------



## kickingandscreaming

dad4 said:


> It’s the mid east.  Of course it is complicated.
> 
> That does not explain why we spent years building a relationship with them, only to abandon them without warning.
> 
> “it’s complicated, you wouldn’t understand” is rarely used by someone whose policy is defensible.  It’s used by someone who doesn’t want to have to defend a mistake.  So they change the subject, throw around some FUD, and claim it is too complicated for mere mortals to think about.


You mean like this? 









						It's a secret: California keeps key virus data from public
					

Experts in infectious disease and public access are criticizing California’s secrecy in how it calculates when to lift stay-at-home orders




					www.baynews9.com


----------



## MacDre

Scott m Shurson said:


> But you spineless liberals can bend old grandpa Joe over for the oncoming train all the world leaders are going to run on his senile ass.


Come on you young wipper-snapper, how are you gonna teach your team how to defend if you keep eating up the fake.  Joe ain’t senile, he’s the quiet DON.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Problem is this guy @EOTL doesn’t really know in depth about anything.  He reads an article here and there and thinks he really KNOWS...like his terrible takes on school...these are the kind of guys that cause so many problems in our society, they think they know and they don’t, and then they spread their nonsense to people who really have no idea and are uneducated, and our country continues to spiral. People that bore because they heard something on TV without researching for themselves, they listen to guys like @EOTL and end up being repressed because they really don’t understand what they are voting for


For a guy who knows nothing, I seem to he supported by what is actually happening. Almost half a million Covid deaths.  CA public schools closed. Transgender athletes running.  It’s pretty remarkable how delusional and whiny magats are. Enjoy the continued losing on everything. Maybe someday you will learn that the reason you keep losing on everything is that you are the stupid one.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> For a guy who knows nothing, I seem to he supported by what is actually happening. Almost half a million Covid deaths.  CA public schools closed. Transgender athletes running.  It’s pretty remarkable how delusional and whiny magats are. Enjoy the continued losing on everything. Maybe someday you will learn that the reason you keep losing on everything is that you are the stupid one.


Trolls gonna troll.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> For a guy who knows nothing, I seem to he supported by what is actually happening. Almost half a million Covid deaths.  CA public schools closed. Transgender athletes running.  It’s pretty remarkable how delusional and whiny magats are. Enjoy the continued losing on everything. Maybe someday you will learn that the reason you keep losing on everything is that you are the stupid one.


You continue to show your inability to understand the Truth and EVERY time you have no answer you begin to berate and name call. Very mature... Being supported by what’s happening doesn’t mean it’s right, just means that you agree with someone that is making the decisions.

Does that mean those that supported slavery were correct because it was legal...hmm...wondering who are the stupid ones, those that support people that suppress them or ones that really aren’t affect by the bad decisions that the people you follow make??? wondering how you’re doing with that, those people you support making your life better?


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> For a guy who knows nothing, I seem to he supported by what is actually happening. Almost half a million Covid deaths.  CA public schools closed. Transgender athletes running.  It’s pretty remarkable how delusional and whiny magats are. Enjoy the continued losing on everything. Maybe someday you will learn that the reason you keep losing on everything is that you are the stupid one.


  - high five...Enjoy your weekend


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> You continue to show your inability to understand the Truth and EVERY time you have no answer you begin to berate and name call. Very mature... Being supported by what’s happening doesn’t mean it’s right, just means that you agree with someone that is making the decisions.
> 
> Does that mean those that supported slavery were correct because it was legal...hmm...wondering who are the stupid ones, those that support people that suppress them or ones that really aren’t affect by the bad decisions that the people you follow make??? wondering how you’re doing with that, those people you support making your life better?


I see.  So whining about schools being remote, whining about transgender athletes, whining about social distancing requirements, wearing masks, soccer tournaments getting canceled, people getting “cancelled”, denying people getting Covid, denying people dying of Covid, means you know what you are talking about.  Is the lamestream media part of the conspiracy? Biden, the NCAA, and NYT are conspiring to end women’s sports forever?  The Governor is trying to intentionally sabotage the economy so he can benefit financially from marijuana sales by farms he doesn’t own?  

It’s hard to predict what y’alls next Q conspiracy will be. You seem a bit out of sorts now that Parler is down and your main source of info, Mein Pillow, got banned from Twitter. Can you give us a hint? Maybe  GameStop stock went up because all the stores are really making a fortune from child trafficking by way of a network of underground tunnels and the Clintons’ insatiable baby eating appetites?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> You continue to show your inability to understand the Truth and EVERY time you have no answer you begin to berate and name call. Very mature... Being supported by what’s happening doesn’t mean it’s right, just means that you agree with someone that is making the decisions.
> 
> Does that mean those that supported slavery were correct because it was legal...hmm...wondering who are the stupid ones, those that support people that suppress them or ones that really aren’t affect by the bad decisions that the people you follow make??? wondering how you’re doing with that, those people you support making your life better?


And by the way, an easy tell that someone is a Qanon whackadoo is that they capitalize the word “truth”.  They think that it makes whatever crazy f**king thing they’re saying sound more believable.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> And by the way, an easy tell that someone is a Qanon whackadoo is that they capitalize the word “truth”.  They think that it makes whatever crazy f**king thing they’re saying sound more believable.


 - This is happening to you.

spin me right 'round, baby
Right 'round like a record, baby
Right 'round, 'round, 'round
You spin me right 'round, baby
Right 'round like a record, baby
Right 'round, 'round, 'round


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> - This is happening to you.
> 
> spin me right 'round, baby
> Right 'round like a record, baby
> Right 'round, 'round, 'round
> You spin me right 'round, baby
> Right 'round like a record, baby
> Right 'round, 'round, 'round


Sounds like your GF Margie Q. Whiny little girl threw quite the fit after getting kicked off all congressional committees eh? She’s gonna be such the spokesperson for you and the rest of the GQP.


----------



## dad4

MacDre said:


> Come on you young wipper-snapper, how are you gonna teach your team how to defend if you keep eating up the fake.  Joe ain’t senile, he’s the quiet DON.


He's senile.

But he is also a decent man with a competent supporting cast.  So he had my enthusiastic vote, and I wish him well.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> And by the way, an easy tell that someone is a Qanon whackadoo is that they capitalize the word “truth”.  They think that it makes whatever crazy f**king thing they’re saying sound more believable.


you are so smart...you know the difference between Truth and truth...you can do whatever you want with the capital letter I don’t care...I’m just saying you try to act like you know about things that you don’t and it’s clear by your responses that have no intellectual dialect, just ridicules and name calling
I told you about school and what it’s going to do the the less fortunate, but I guess you don’t care about them...not sure why you care if they get Covid and don’t care if they get an education...strange how you care about them sometimes but not others, not really sure how that works with you...you are more interests in trying to put people downthan help anyone out...that’s the problem with so much of the youth today, social media has destroyed them and they have no parents to regulate them...I'm sure you’re parents were “hands off” and that probably has a lot to do with why you are the way you are...but I’m still not going to give up on you


----------



## Scott m Shurson

MacDre said:


> Come on you young wipper-snapper, how are you gonna teach your team how to defend if you keep eating up the fake.  Joe ain’t senile, he’s the quiet DON.


Joe is either senile, stupid or both.  

“All women are to be believed initially...” during Brett Kavanaugh’s ordeal.
“poor kids are just as smart as white kids...” during his tenure
“If you don’t vote for me, you ain’t black.”

He’s not a Don, he’s a dipshit and the libtard media gives him a pass.


----------



## texanincali

You guys shouldn’t let @EOTL wind you up so much.  It’s difficult to take her seriously at all, but understand how she gets under our skin.

She is the one who would smoke in the high school wash room, pick on the special needs kid and give bjs out like candy...basically anything to feel part of the crowd.  Once the crowd grows up and outgrows the childish antics, she’s left all alone.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

dad4 said:


> He's senile.
> 
> But he is also a decent man with a competent supporting cast.  So he had my enthusiastic vote, and I wish him well.


What has Joe Biden ever said or done that makes you think he’s decent?


----------



## Desert Hound

dad4 said:


> It’s embarrassing that you have to qualify the time frame in that sentence.
> 
> It’s kind of like saying “I didn’t beat my wife yesterday.”.


I mention that because when T became Prez there was an abundance of news articles worrying about him with regards to starting something.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> you are so smart...you know the difference between Truth and truth...you can do whatever you want with the capital letter I don’t care...I’m just saying you try to act like you know about things that you don’t and it’s clear by your responses that have no intellectual dialect, just ridicules and name calling
> I told you about school and what it’s going to do the the less fortunate, but I guess you don’t care about them...not sure why you care if they get Covid and don’t care if they get an education...strange how you care about them sometimes but not others, not really sure how that works with you...you are more interests in trying to put people downthan help anyone out...that’s the problem with so much of the youth today, social media has destroyed them and they have no parents to regulate them...im Sure you’re parents were “hands off” and that probably has a lot to do with why you are the at you are...I’m still not going to give up on you though


Oh, I guess I should listen to an anonymous magat whiner about how the world is ending if we don’t stop remote education right now. You really sound like you know what your talking about. So persuasive with your track record of not getting what you want with anything, whether it’s schools, elections, kiddie soccer, transgender athletes, whatevs. Maybe a little more whining and everything will be different by Monday.


----------



## EOTL

Desert Hound said:


> I mention that because when T became Prez there was an abundance of news articles worrying about him with regards to starting something.


The Spray Tan Tangerine Man did not end the world through nuclear war, that is true. But we should probably expect maybe a little more from our commander in chief, don’t you think?  I mean, the highest budget and trade deficits in history, the most bloated federal government in history, plus almost half a million dead and a trashed economy in less than 12 months should mean something right?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> The Spray Tan Tangerine Man did not end the world through nuclear war, that is true. But we should probably expect maybe a little more from our commander in chief, don’t you think?  I mean, the highest budget and trade deficits in history, the most bloated federal government in history, plus almost half a million dead and a trashed economy in less than 12 months should mean something right?


So your dumb ass still blames him for Covid killing people.  I wonder how all other countries avoided loss of life.

Can you enlighten us?


----------



## soccersc

texanincali said:


> You guys shouldn’t let @EOTL wind you up so much.  It’s difficult to take her seriously at all, but understand how she gets under our skin.
> 
> She is the one who would smoke in the high school wash room, pick on the special needs kid and give bjs out like candy...basically anything to feel part of the crowd.  Once the crowd grows up and outgrows the childish antics, she’s left all alone.


that’s probably true, but I feel so bad.  I actually feel they/she/he keep coming back because they want to be changed.  They are just having a hard time dealing with everything, so I am patient


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> that’s probably true, but I feel so bad.  I actually feel they/she/he keep coming back because they want to be changed.  They are just having a hard time dealing with everything, so I am patient


Nothing else has worked, so why not try this new approach. Trying to make someone feel bad and slink off because they have a sad, unsuccessful life only works if they actually have a sad, unsuccessful life. You’ve seen that tactic work with @crush for example, albeit only temporarily. You’ll need to find another way for me.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Nothing else has worked, so why not try this new approach. Trying to make someone feel bad and slink off because they have a sad, unsuccessful life only works if they actually have a sad, unsuccessful life. You’ve seen that tactic work with @crush for example, albeit only temporarily. You’ll need to find another way for me.


I will not give up on you!!! But don’t you think it’s funny...I learned that tactic from you...spew nonsense and try to make people feel bad, call them names and put them down...guess you didn’t reach me very well.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> I will not give up on you!!! But don’t you think it’s funny...I learned that tactic from you...spew nonsense and try to make people feel bad, call them names and put them down...guess you didn’t reach me very well.


You raise a fair point, although it isn’t nonsense I spew, just what you don’t want to hear. I agree that it is effective when used on the right person.


----------



## N00B

soccersc said:


> I will not give up on you!!! But don’t you think it’s funny...I learned that tactic from you...spew nonsense and try to make people feel bad, call them names and put them down...guess you didn’t reach me very well.


----------



## MicPaPa

EOTL said:


> The Spray Tan Tangerine Man did not end the world through nuclear war, that is true. But we should probably expect maybe a little more from our commander in chief, don’t you think?  I mean, the highest budget and trade deficits in history, the most bloated federal government in history, plus almost half a million dead and a trashed economy in less than 12 months should mean something right?


Forgive me, I didn't have a crucifix or garlic handy...

Marjorie Taylor Greene remarkable floor speech… – CITIZEN FREE PRESS


----------



## EOTL

MicPaPa said:


> Forgive me, I didn't have a crucifix or garlic handy...
> 
> Marjorie Taylor Greene remarkable floor speech… – CITIZEN FREE PRESS


It really makes one wonder how despicably a POS someone must be to defend someone who denies 9/11, claims schools shootings are hoaxes, and stalks survivors.


----------



## MicPaPa

EOTL said:


> It really makes one wonder how despicably a POS someone must be to defend someone who denies 9/11, claims schools shootings are hoaxes, and stalks survivors.


Shhhh...take a deep breath and pet the cats.


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> Nothing else has worked, so why not try this new approach. Trying to make someone feel bad and slink off because they have a sad, unsuccessful life only works if they actually have a sad, unsuccessful life. You’ve seen that tactic work with @crush for example, albeit only temporarily. *You’ll need to find another way for me.*


If you are looking for another way....

You could try being polite and not insulting people or assuming they are racist.

Just a thought.  

Good luck finding your path.


----------



## NorCalDad

dad4 said:


> If you are looking for another way....
> 
> You could try being polite and not insulting people or assuming they are racist.
> 
> Just a thought.
> 
> Good luck finding your path.


Couldn't agree here more with @dad4.

What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation. 

Let me get some popcorn


----------



## kickingandscreaming

NorCalDad said:


> Couldn't agree here more with @dad4.
> 
> What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation.
> 
> Let me get some popcorn


I'd argue that "calling out" on what is basically an anonymous message board is not the best method to address bad behavior. Ignore them. Give them nothing in return for their bad behavior. I'm speaking specifically of those who consistently exhibit "bad" behavior. I'll give people a break for occasional rants assuming I don't judge them to be "over the line" that I have in my head. If you really want to help someone, PM them with insights. Making a public show of one's higher virtue on a message becomes is just that, and I've never seen it change bad behavior.


----------



## crush

NorCalDad said:


> Couldn't agree here more with @dad4.
> 
> What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation.
> 
> Let me get some popcorn


Hey bro from socal originally, I hear ya.  I'm not going to call out anyone for what they believe, left or right.  I lean right sometimes and I lean left sometimes.  I'm a switch hitter politically I guess. I say we all just need to calm down and not pick a group, left or right.  Pick love, peace, kindness, mercy and forgiveness.  If EVERYONE agrees to play this way and with no more blackmail, then we can live free.  Free is free and it should be an all out free for all, for all of us willing to play fair.  Not perfect, but justice in the center.


----------



## espola

kickingandscreaming said:


> I'd argue that "calling out" on what is basically an anonymous message board is not the best method to address bad behavior. Ignore them. Give them nothing in return for their bad behavior. I'm speaking specifically of those who consistently exhibit "bad" behavior. I'll give people a break for occasional rants assuming I don't judge them to be "over the line" that I have in my head. If you really want to help someone, PM them with insights. Making a public show of one's higher virtue on a message becomes is just that, and I've never seen it change bad behavior.


Some people (trolls) just post outrageous things for their own amusement.  Unless it is a direct personal attack, just chuckle and then ignore it.


----------



## Grace T.

[/QUOTE]





NorCalDad said:


> Couldn't agree here more with @dad4.
> 
> What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation.
> 
> Let me get some popcorn


Meh.  Over the summer those of us who were quick to condemn Sheriff Joe's rants said the same thing about you left leaners and EOTL.  It actually took quite a while for you guys to get sick of him. For example, we have not seen much of NITF around here since dropping the "c" word, but I don't recall much outrage there either.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Some people (trolls) just post outrageous things for their own amusement.  Unless it is a direct personal attack, just chuckle and then ignore it.


No doubt you speak from experience.


----------



## NorCalDad

Grace T. said:


> Meh.  Over the summer those of us who were quick to condemn Sheriff Joe's rants said the same thing about you left leaners and EOTL.  It actually took quite a while for you guys to get sick of him. For example, we have not seen much of NITF around here since dropping the "c" word, but I don't recall much outrage there either.


In my defense, I just joined in September of 2020.  Took me a bit to get my bearings straight.  So perhaps there is some history I haven't really seen.


----------



## Grace T.

NorCalDad said:


> In my defense, I just joined in September of 2020.  Took me a bit to get my bearings straight.  So perhaps there is some history I haven't really seen.


You missed all the good parts then.  

It began with "it's just the flu and we don't need to worry about it" v "this is very serious and we're all going to die".

Then it went into we antilockdowners screaming at the prolockdowners "you all are hysterical" v. the prolockdowners telling us "we wanted to kill grandma".  

Things really went off the rails when some of the prolockdowners supported the BLM protests as special (and that was when EOTL came to prominence defending the protests when some of us were saying they would shatter the consensus of the lockdowns and being accused of being racist for not supporting the protests).  Those events really did break everything because until that moment were really more or less all in it together.

Things are relatively more harmonious now since the prolockdowners were convinced this wasn't particularly harmful to kids (that really did take forever) and the consensus here at a minimum is that kids should be allowed to play.


----------



## dad4

NorCalDad said:


> Couldn't agree here more with @dad4.
> 
> What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation.
> 
> Let me get some popcorn


There were a couple on the right who got called out, but they mostly got themselves banned.

I think it mostly just reflects the national mood.  You have a few principled conservatives, like Cheney and Romney.  But they get drowned out by tribalism. 

How do you not bust a gut laughing at the idea that Cheney is a RINO?  It's like saying Bernie is a hawk.

Same happens on the left.  You have to be extremely careful with your wording if you want to think any more deeply than blaming "systemic racism" for everything under the sun.  

So people take the safe path.  It just leads nowhere.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> There were a couple on the right who got called out, but they mostly got themselves banned.
> 
> I think it mostly just reflects the national mood.  You have a few principled conservatives, like Cheney and Romney.  But they get drowned out by tribalism.
> 
> How do you not bust a gut laughing at the idea that Cheney is a RINO?  It's like saying Bernie is a hawk.
> 
> Same happens on the left.  You have to be extremely careful with your wording if you want to think any more deeply than blaming "systemic racism" for everything under the sun.
> 
> So people take the safe path.  It just leads nowhere.


Agree but the Cheney thing is similar to the George Will, Bill Kristol and even George Bush thing.  That split is less RINO/populist than neocon/populist.  Trump populism leaned away from foreign interventionism (of the modern President, Trump put us into the fewest entanglements) and away from multilateralism in favor of America first.  The neocons despise Trumpism for that because they view it as walking away from our responsibilities as a superpower.  Trumpism was not just a rejection of the way Obama ran the country, but also of the Bush version of the Republican party, both in its "compassionate conservativity" and the neocon foreign policy that led to the Iraq war.


----------



## texanincali

NorCalDad said:


> What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation.


This is a very level headed post.  However, their is really no reason to discern left or right.  If we all agree to call out the idiots, life will be much better.  It may not always happen as quickly as we like, but the idiots always end up stepping on their own feet around here.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> This is a very level headed post.  However, their is really no reason to discern left or right.  If we all agree to call out the idiots, life will be much better.  It may not always happen as quickly as we like, but the idiots always end up stepping on their own feet around here.


No one is calling out magats, and don’t pat yourself on the back for your appeasement. Who has called out @Lavey29 for calling Covid China virus for no reason other than he knows it is offensive?  Just me. How many of you have called out Scotty S**t for Brains for his offensive comments about transgender people?  Me and one other person. 

The truth is virtually all of you trumpanzees are fine to go after me, but are notably silent when your magat friends say one offensive thing after the next.  No worries. That’s why I am here.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> No one is calling out magats, and don’t pat yourself on the back for your appeasement. Who has called out @Lavey29 for calling Covid China virus for no reason other than he knows it is offensive?  Just me. How many of you have called out Scotty S**t for Brains for his offensive comments about transgender people?  Me and one other person.
> 
> The truth is virtually all of you trumpanzees are fine to go after me, but are notably silent when your magat friends say one offensive thing after the next.  No worries. That’s why I am here.


You are here because you are bored at work and have nothing else to do, so you troll all day.  The life!! Must be nice to be single and have no responsibilities and have a job that you sit on chat boards all day


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> No one is calling out magats, and don’t pat yourself on the back for your appeasement. Who has called out @Lavey29 for calling Covid China virus for no reason other than he knows it is offensive?  Just me. How many of you have called out Scotty S**t for Brains for his offensive comments about transgender people?  Me and one other person.
> 
> The truth is virtually all of you trumpanzees are fine to go after me, but are notably silent when your magat friends say one offensive thing after the next.  No worries. That’s why I am here.


I'm going to regret this, but trying to understand the "other" side.  Why is calling it the China Virus offensive? (And yes I understand that Scott is saying it to get under you skin.)  But why does it get under your skin so much?

Why is that different then calling variants, the UK Variant, Brazil Variant, South African variant?  In all cases it just refers to the origination of the virus.


----------



## crush

Grace T. said:


> You missed all the good parts then.
> 
> It began with "it's just the flu and we don't need to worry about it" v "this is very serious and we're all going to die".
> 
> Then it went into we antilockdowners screaming at the prolockdowners "you all are hysterical" v. the prolockdowners telling us "we wanted to kill grandma".
> 
> Things really went off the rails when some of the prolockdowners supported the BLM protests as special (and that was when EOTL came to prominence defending the protests when some of us were saying they would shatter the consensus of the lockdowns and being accused of being racist for not supporting the protests).  Those events really did break everything because until that moment were really more or less all in it together.
> 
> Things are relatively more harmonious now since the prolockdowners were convinced this wasn't particularly harmful to kids (that really did take forever) and the consensus here at a minimum is that kids should be allowed to play.


Let's not forget about Crush and his adoption story


----------



## EOTL

watfly said:


> I'm going to regret this, but trying to understand the "other" side.  Why is calling it the China Virus offensive? (And yes I understand that Scott is saying it to get under you skin.)  But why does it get under your skin so much?
> 
> Why is that different then calling variants, the UK Variant, Brazil Variant, South African variant?  In all cases it just refers to the origination of the virus.


Thank you for asking. You could do your own research to determine why it is offensive, it is not hard. And, of course, the sole reason he uses the term is for the specific purpose to be offensive. And although he is trying to be offensive to me, the reality is that it is offensive to Asian-Americans and that is the problem. There is a name for the virus, and that is not it. 









						“Chinese” Virus is a Racist Take — Here’s Why
					

The “Chinese




					diversity.ncsu.edu
				












						Calling COVID-19 a “Chinese Virus” or “Kung Flu” Is Racist
					

President Trump doubles down on a racist term, endangering Asian Americans




					www.psychologytoday.com
				












						America’s long history of scapegoating its Asian citizens
					

When leaders call COVID-19 the “China virus,” it harkens back to decades of state-sanctioned discrimination against Asian Americans.




					www.nationalgeographic.com
				












						Why it is NOT the ‘Chinese virus’
					

Have you ever walked into a crowded movie theater late? The lights are dim and you need to find a seat. You wait until there’s a bright scene, then sheepishly t…




					theundefeated.com
				












						'You have Chinese virus': 1 in 4 Asian American youths experience racist bullying, report says
					

A group of high school students interviewed nearly 1,000 young Asian Americans to explore how youths are dealing with the pandemic-fueled rise in racism.




					www.nbcnews.com
				



And no, they are not calling anything UK Virus or South Africa Virus. And racists aren’t calling it a Chinese Variant of Covid-19 or the coronavirus in general, although that is exactly what it is. Furthermore, putting UK or South Africa in front of it does not cause racist magats to treat Brits or South Africans like crap, because they can’t pick them out of a crowd and also never would once they hear an accent they don’t have a problem with. But many of them actually do treat rhe Chinese like s**t using that as an excuse, or any Asian American because they’re too f**king dumb and racist to care or know the difference, or are just looking for the excuse. Anyone with half a brain should understand that calling it China Virus opens the door for trumpanzees to blame Asian Americans for causing this, and that some are actually doing this. Refusing engage in the most basic form of decency - calling something by its actual name - instead of pinning a race to the incorrect and improper name for the express purpose of offending people, or even opening the door to others using it as an excuse to treat a race like shit is pretty f**king racist.

Ask yourself why you are ok calling something that is not the actual, or even common, name of a virus, although you know that many consider it offensive AND it is contributing to Asian-Americans being harassed?  If you keep doing it, it is only because you’re an a**hole racist.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Thank you for asking. You could do your own research to determine why it is offensive, it is not hard. And, of course, the sole reason he uses the term is for the specific purpose to be offensive. And although he is trying to be offensive to me, the reality is that it is offensive to Asian-Americans and that is the problem. There is a name for the virus, and that is not it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> “Chinese” Virus is a Racist Take — Here’s Why
> 
> 
> The “Chinese
> 
> 
> 
> 
> diversity.ncsu.edu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Calling COVID-19 a “Chinese Virus” or “Kung Flu” Is Racist
> 
> 
> President Trump doubles down on a racist term, endangering Asian Americans
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.psychologytoday.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> America’s long history of scapegoating its Asian citizens
> 
> 
> When leaders call COVID-19 the “China virus,” it harkens back to decades of state-sanctioned discrimination against Asian Americans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nationalgeographic.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why it is NOT the ‘Chinese virus’
> 
> 
> Have you ever walked into a crowded movie theater late? The lights are dim and you need to find a seat. You wait until there’s a bright scene, then sheepishly t…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> theundefeated.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'You have Chinese virus': 1 in 4 Asian American youths experience racist bullying, report says
> 
> 
> A group of high school students interviewed nearly 1,000 young Asian Americans to explore how youths are dealing with the pandemic-fueled rise in racism.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And no, they are not calling anything UK Virus or South Africa Virus. And racists aren’t calling it a Chinese Variant of Covid-19 or the coronavirus in general, although that is exactly what it is. Furthermore, putting UK or South Africa in front of it does not cause racist magats to treat Brits or South Africans like crap, because they can’t pick them out of a crowd and also never would once they hear an accent they don’t have a problem with. But many of them actually do treat rhe Chinese like s**t using that as an excuse, or any Asian American because they’re too f**king dumb and racist to care or know the difference, or are just looking for the excuse. Anyone with half a brain should understand that calling it China Virus opens the door for trumpanzees to blame Asian Americans for causing this, and that some are actually doing this. Refusing engage in the most basic form of decency - calling something by its actual name - instead of pinning a race to the incorrect and improper name for the express purpose of offending people, or even opening the door to others using it as an excuse to treat a race like shit is pretty f**king racist.
> 
> Ask yourself why you are ok calling something that is not the actual, or even common, name of a virus, although you know that many consider it offensive AND it is contributing to Asian-Americans being harassed?  If you keep doing it, it is only because you’re an a**hole racist.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


>


Not surprised magat.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Not surprised magat.


tuff guy! my feelings be hurt.

Did the virus not originate in China?  I have nothing against the Chinese people.  Not their fault they are manipulated each and every day on behalf and for the benefit of their  wonderful government.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> tuff guy!


Thx!  Needless to say, obviously someone with such a small penis that they feel compelled to use or support racist language is not the least bit tough.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Thx!  Needless to say, obviously someone with such a small *penis* that they feel compelled to use or support racist language is not the least bit tough.


are you allowed to use that word?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

NorCalDad said:


> Couldn't agree here more with @dad4.
> 
> What I find interesting on these boards is how many of us on the left (not sure where @dad4 stands, but @Glitterhater is a good example) are willing to call out @EOTL's shenanigans, but very few of the folks that lean right here won't call out some of the extreme right dudes. I mean some of them are really bad -- racist, homophobic, etc. But even more generally, I just rarely see people calling out GOP/conservatives. It's like republicans are untouchable here and can do no wrong. Just an observation.
> 
> Let me get some popcorn


What is there to bash republicans for?  I’m an independent and have fundamental issues with the GOP in any year, but if you’re looking to say republicans have behaved badly, compared to what I’ve seen from Dems the last 4 years, I’d love to hear that argument.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> No one is calling out magats, and don’t pat yourself on the back for your appeasement. Who has called out @Lavey29 for calling Covid China virus for no reason other than he knows it is offensive?  Just me. How many of you have called out Scotty S**t for Brains for his offensive comments about transgender people?  Me and one other person.
> 
> The truth is virtually all of you trumpanzees are fine to go after me, but are notably silent when your magat friends say one offensive thing after the next.  No worries. That’s why I’m here.


You’re here to be offended.  Everything gets your panties in a bunch.  Calling a virus, that originated in China, the “China Virus” offends you.  Conservatism offends you.  Religion offends you.  Amendments offend you.  Me saying “trannies” offends you".  Anyone with a differing opinion offends you.  

You’re the kid even nice kids wanted to pummel.[/QUOTE]


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> No one is calling out magats, and don’t pat yourself on the back for your appeasement. Who has called out @Lavey29 for calling Covid China virus for no reason other than he knows it is offensive?  Just me. How many of you have called out Scotty S**t for Brains for his offensive comments about transgender people?  Me and one other person.
> 
> The truth is virtually all of you trumpanzees are fine to go after me, but are notably silent when your magat friends say one offensive thing after the next.  No worries. That’s why I am here.


What you seem to missing is the fact that no one is going after you because of your opinion.  You being a complete and total arrogant prick is the basis for the attacks.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> What you seem to missing is the fact that no one is going after you because of your opinion.  You being a complete and total arrogant prick is the basis for the attacks.


I get why people here don’t like me. If you want to call out idiots as you claim, you should probably do that with the bigots here. If you got them to stfu and to state their opinions about social distancing in a non-offensive manner, you’d have no problems with me.  The real problem, though, is that most of the people here who aren’t blatant in-your-face racists don’t have a problem with those who are. The other problem, of course, is that you can’t make them stop by being polite, which makes my way the only one.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> I get why people here don’t like me. If you want to call out idiots as you claim, you should probably do that with the bigots here. If you got them to stfu and to state their opinions about social distancing in a non-offensive manner, you’d have no problems with me.  The real problem, though, is that most of the people here who aren’t blatant in-your-face racists don’t have a problem with those who are. The other problem, of course, is that you can’t make them stop by being polite, which makes my way the only one.


You’re a bigot.  You support boys in dresses competing against girls but called out female, college athletes raising awareness to possible abuse by their coach!

How the fuck do you NOT see what a hypocrite you are?


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> I get why people here don’t like me. If you want to call out idiots as you claim, you should probably do that with the bigots here. If you got them to stfu and to state their opinions about social distancing in a non-offensive manner, you’d have no problems with me.  The real problem, though, is that most of the people here who aren’t blatant in-your-face racists don’t have a problem with those who are. The other problem, of course, is that you can’t make them stop by being polite, which makes my way the only one.


I really don't think you do.  I appreciate the reduced tone, but its relatively easy to see through.  The issue with most narcissists is they can't separate from their reality long enough to see other things.  I will stand right by your side and call out any racists, homophobics or misogynists right along with you if it is warranted.  Your issue is, these are the terms you define people with for simply disagreeing with you.  We could go back through all the threads you have ruined and find example after example.  In your mind, someone who wants a border wall or doesn't support BLM is a racist.  You think anyone that disagrees with the USWNT is a misogynist.  You think someone who takes issue with a girl who has a cock wanting to play girls sports is transphobic.  

Ultimately, the issues most of us have with you don't have much to do with any of the hot button topics or buzz word bingo you get involved in.  Most of us understand people have different opinions and that is what makes this country great.  Our main issue with you is you are just pretty shit at being a human.

As for non-offensive manners, that is solely in the eye of the beholder.  Remember, being offended is a choice someone makes.  I have neve once been offended with anything you have posted, despite seeing the world completely differently.  Mainly because I choose not to be, but also because I dealing with people like you becomes very tiresome.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> You’re a bigot.  You support boys in dresses competing against girls but called out female, college athletes raising awareness to possible abuse by their coach!
> 
> How the fuck do you NOT see what a hypocrite you are?


Because I am not a hypocrite. There is nothing wrong with questioning the motivations of any person who makes dubious and vague allegations of abuse, especially when what is alleged does not constitute abuse. If a transgender athlete made dubious allegations of wrongdoing that led to understandable concerns about the veracity of what she was saying, I would hold her accountable as well.

There mere fact that you would try to equate the two is, well, transphobia. I should also add that I did not use offensive terminology to describe them.  That is all you magat.


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> Because I am not a hypocrite. There is nothing wrong with questioning the motivations of any person who makes dubious and vague allegations of abuse, especially when what is alleged does not constitute abuse. If a transgender athlete made dubious allegations of wrongdoing that led to understandable concerns about the veracity of what she was saying, I would hold her accountable as well.
> 
> There mere fact that you would try to equate the two is, well, transphobia. I should also add that I did not use offensive terminology to describe them.  That is all you magat.


The mere fact you can’t see it means, well, you’re narcissistic.  And who the fuck are YOU to decide what a dozen women find abusive?  If it was 3 chicks with dicks, you’d shit the bed.  

HYPOCRITE!


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> I really don't think you do.  I appreciate the reduced tone, but its relatively easy to see through.  The issue with most narcissists is they can't separate from their reality long enough to see other things.  I will stand right by your side and call out any racists, homophobics or misogynists right along with you if it is warranted.  Your issue is, these are the terms you define people with for simply disagreeing with you.  We could go back through all the threads you have ruined and find example after example.  In your mind, someone who wants a border wall or doesn't support BLM is a racist.  You think anyone that disagrees with the USWNT is a misogynist.  You think someone who takes issue with a girl who has a cock wanting to play girls sports is transphobic.
> 
> Ultimately, the issues most of us have with you don't have much to do with any of the hot button topics or buzz word bingo you get involved in.  Most of us understand people have different opinions and that is what makes this country great.  Our main issue with you is you are just pretty shit at being a human.
> 
> As for non-offensive manners, that is solely in the eye of the beholder.  Remember, being offended is a choice someone makes.  I have neve once been offended with anything you have posted, despite seeing the world completely differently.  Mainly because I choose not to be, but also because I dealing with people like you becomes very tiresome.


Nope, wrong you are. If you want to hold people accountable for bigotry, do it. Don’t blame me for ruining threads when others already started down that road.  It seems to me that you suffer from bias if you don’t see it already happening and then blame me for pushing y’all the rest of the way down the rabbit hole. 

Being offended is not a choice one makes when they are being discriminated against or harassed btw. You’re just victim blaming.


----------



## EOTL

Scott m Shurson said:


> The mere fact you can’t see it means, well, you’re narcissistic.  And who the fuck are YOU to decide what a dozen women find abusive?  If it was 3 chicks with dicks, you’d shit the bed.
> 
> HYPOCRITE!


So @texanincali, you gonna jump in and tell this fella to pipe down over the transphobia?


----------



## Scott m Shurson

EOTL said:


> So @texanincali, you gonna jump in and tell this fella to pipe down over the transphobia?


Are you back to playing the victim, now?


----------



## Anon9

Scott m Shurson said:


> You’re a bigot.  You support boys in dresses competing against girls but called out female, college athletes raising awareness to possible abuse by their coach!
> 
> How the fuck do you NOT see what a hypocrite you are?


Trannies hate women, duh!


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> So @texanincali, you gonna jump in and tell this fella to pipe down over the transphobia?


Maybe.  What’s transphobic about it?


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> eing offended is not a choice one makes when they are being discriminated against or harassed btw. You’re just victim blaming.


Wrong.  It’s always a choice.  Your just wanting to play the victim.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> Maybe.  What’s transphobic about it?


Can you read?  If you can’t find the offensive reference to transgender individuals, you have a real problem.


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> Wrong.  It’s always a choice.  Your just wanting to play the victim.


BS.  If someone isn’t hired because of their transgender status, that is not their choice. If. someone is berated, spit on, assaulted, that is not their choice. The fact that you’re ok with people treating others lime s**t due their transgender, or racial, or gender status, well, that is pretty f**ked up. It makes you a collaborator.  All the more reason for me to be here since you’ll just let people be as offensive as they want and, in fact, only get on the case of those who don’t let it pass. Sorry not sorry to get in the way of your substitute for Parler.


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> Can you read?  If you can’t find the offensive reference to transgender individuals, you have a real problem.


Is it the "chick with dicks" part that's bothering you?  That's what you are hanging your transphobic hat on?


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> BS.  If someone isn’t hired because of their transgender status, that is not their choice. If. someone is berated, spit on, assaulted, that is not their choice. The fact that you’re ok with people treating others lime s**t due their transgender, or racial, or gender status, well, that is pretty f**ked up. It makes you a collaborator.  All the more reason for me to be here since you’ll just let people be as offensive as they want and, in fact, only get on the case of those who don’t let it pass. Sorry not sorry to get in the way of your substitute for Parler.


Where in any of the drivel you just spent time typing are you discussing being offended.  If someone isn't hired because they are transgender, that is wrong...unless its a strip club.  If someone is assaulted, spit on or berated because they are a certain race or sex, that is also wrong.   I'm not sure what that has to do with being offended.  There are plenty of people this happens to every day that choose to ignore the idiots and get on with it.  Being offensive is a choice, just like being offended.


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> The fact that you’re ok with people treating others lime s**t due their transgender, or racial, or gender status, well, that is pretty f**ked up.


No clue where this is coming from.  I'm relatively certain this doesn't apply to one single person on here.  Again, the issue is you only see through your lens when defining these things.


----------



## Chelsea dad g09

texanincali said:


> Is it the "chick with dicks" part that's bothering you?  That's what you are hanging your transphobic hat on?


Think I've seen the red hot chili peppers hang socks on them once.


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> I should also add that I did not use offensive terminology to describe them.





EOTL said:


> That is all you magat.


The irony here is not lost on most of us.


----------



## MicPaPa

Grace T. said:


> Agree but the Cheney thing is similar to the George Will, Bill Kristol and even George Bush thing.  That split is less RINO/populist than neocon/populist.  Trump populism leaned away from foreign interventionism (of the modern President, Trump put us into the fewest entanglements) and away from multilateralism in favor of America first.  The neocons despise Trumpism for that because they view it as walking away from our responsibilities as a superpower.  Trumpism was not just a rejection of the way Obama ran the country, but also of the Bush version of the Republican party, both in its "compassionate conservativity" and the neocon foreign policy that led to the Iraq war.


Agreed, good summary.


----------



## EOTL

Chelsea dad g09 said:


> Think I've seen the red hot chili peppers hang socks on them once.


Check it out @texanincali, you’re making the bigots believe it’s fun to mock people who are transgender. Are you going to step in, or are you ok with it? How bad are you willing to let this get?


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> There were a couple on the right who got called out, but they mostly got themselves banned.
> 
> I think it mostly just reflects the national mood.  You have a few principled conservatives, like Cheney and Romney.  But they get drowned out by tribalism.
> 
> How do you not bust a gut laughing at the idea that Cheney is a RINO?  It's like saying Bernie is a hawk.
> 
> Same happens on the left.  You have to be extremely careful with your wording if you want to think any more deeply than blaming "systemic racism" for everything under the sun.
> 
> So people take the safe path.  It just leads nowhere.


Principles conservatives?Specifically, which Trump actions, policies and nominations weren't solidly concervative?


----------



## Glitterhater

EOTL said:


> Check it out @texanincali, you’re making the bigots believe it’s fun to mock people who are transgender. Are you going to step in, or are you ok with it? How bad are you willing to let this get?


I think this was an album cover- how is he (or she) mocking anyone?
You are reeeaching, stretch!


----------



## dad4

MicPaPa said:


> Principles conservatives?Specifically, which Trump actions, policies and nominations weren't solidly concervative?


If you genuinely can't see any difference between Bush and Trump, there not much I can do to help you.

Enjoy your *little* party.   Remember to host the big celebration when you win the primaries.  November will be a more somber affair for you.


----------



## Chelsea dad g09

Glitterhater said:


> I think this was an album cover- how is he (or she) mocking anyone?
> You are reeeaching, stretch!


They did multiple shows wearing only socks. In fact it's how they made their name when they were first starting out.


----------



## kickingandscreaming

espola said:


> Some people (trolls) just post outrageous things for their own amusement.  Unless it is a direct personal attack, just chuckle and then ignore it.


From my perspective, if it's a direct, personal attack, it's even more reason to chuckle and ignore it.


----------



## Grace T.

kickingandscreaming said:


> From my perspective, if it's a direct, personal attack, it's even more reason to chuckle and ignore it.


Nonsense


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> Check it out @texanincali, you’re making the bigots believe it’s fun to mock people who are transgender. Are you going to step in, or are you ok with it? How bad are you willing to let this get?


Debates are much easier when the other side inadvertently proves your point.  Thanks.


----------



## MARsSPEED

Two nights ago between 3:30am and 4:30am Mahomes found the way to find 10 more touchdowns giving an amazing victory to the Chiefs. No one knows where and how this happened as there's not even one proof of happening but a win is a win. Who cares? TB defense was at their homes sleeping when this happened thinking they had won this easy but they're so wrong.

Anyone who questions this in any way will be called racist, bigot, conspiracy theorist, domestic terrorists and a traitor.

Anyone saying anything about it on social media will be censored and their profiles will be deleted. Crazy stuff, but don't you dare dispute it

Best come back ever. Congrats.

PS. Brady is still the GOAT regardless


----------



## MARsSPEED

@EOTL - Just wanted to educate you on your favorite word. Please read below, but first make sure to gather your feeling about Christians or Trump Supporter before doing so. Please report back with your findings after reading. I'm sure many here would like to know!

*Definition of bigot*
_Noun_
1. a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic toward a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group. 

2. a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion. 
especially *: *one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> If you genuinely can't see any difference between Bush and Trump, there not much I can do to help you.
> 
> Enjoy your *little* party.   Remember to host the big celebration when you win the primaries.  November will be a more somber affair for you.


With all do respect, I felt my question was clear and this does not answer the question...but, as for Bush/Trump the response from @Grace T. above is solid, so I'll defer to that. As for the rest, it was gibberish and I have no response.

Back to my original question...you raised principled conservatism and I was sincerely interested in your ideas of what it is. So I'll ask again: Specifically, which Trump actions, policies and nominations weren't conservative?


----------



## dad4

MicPaPa said:


> With all do respect, I felt my question was clear and this does not answer the question...but, as for Bush/Trump the response from @Grace T. above is solid, so I'll defer to that. As for the rest, it was gibberish and I have no response.
> 
> Back to my original question...you raised principled conservatism and I was sincerely interested in your ideas of what it is. So I'll ask again: Specifically, which Trump actions, policies and nominations weren't conservative?


I have no intention of going deep into the weeds with someone who can't tell the difference between "the shining city on the hill" and "find 12,000 votes".

Two core principles of conservatism are responsibility for your own actions and a respect for the rule of law.   Trump's actions on Jan 06 violated both of those. 

It is not a conservative act to assemble a mob, tell them to fight, and pretend to be surprised when your violent mob beats a man to death.  That is what mobs do; there is no reason to be surprised.  

And, if you are still pretending that Trump's speech played no role in the murder, I really can't help you.


----------



## texanincali

MARsSPEED said:


> @EOTL - Just wanted to educate you on your favorite word. Please read below, but first make sure to gather your feeling about Christians or Trump Supporter before doing so. Please report back with your findings after reading. I'm sure many here would like to know!
> 
> *Definition of bigot*
> _Noun_
> 1. a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic toward a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.
> 
> 2. a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.
> especially *: *one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance


Not sure if it was intentional or not, but you bring up a really good point.  There was a time when bigot, racist, homophobe, etc all carried legitimate meaning and were reserved for those that truly held those views.  These words have basically lost all their meaning and significance because they have become part of the everyday vernacular and are thrown out without any thought.  This has done nothing but put the real bigots and racists into a much larger group that ultimately diminishes their terrible beliefs.  If we can get back to calling out true bigots, racists, etc, we might start making some headway again.


----------



## Grace T.

]





dad4 said:


> I have no intention of going deep into the weeds with someone who can't tell the difference between "the shining city on the hill" and "find 12,000 votes".
> 
> Two core principles of conservatism are responsibility for your own actions and a respect for the rule of law.   Trump's actions on Jan 06 violated both of those.
> 
> It is not a conservative act to assemble a mob, tell them to fight, and pretend to be surprised when your violent mob beats a man to death.  That is what mobs do; there is no reason to be surprised.
> 
> And, if you are still pretending that Trump's speech played no role in the murder, I really can't help you.


I'd be o.k. with this if you hold Kamala Harris and some of the Ds responsible for the mob violence and murder which took places in the April-June riots.  If the standard is you can't work up and encourage a crowd which may become a mob, the same standard has to apply across parties.

p.s. populism (as opposed to conservativism) is not necessarily big on responsibility for your own actions.  It actually builds into the politics of resentment which the left pioneered, only in this case against the elites, the moneyed, and the powerful.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> ]
> 
> I'd be o.k. with this if you hold Kamala Harris and some of the Ds responsible for the mob violence and murder which took places in the April-June riots.  If the standard is you can't work up and encourage a crowd which may become a mob, the same standard has to apply across parties.
> 
> p.s. populism (as opposed to conservativism) is not necessarily big on responsibility for your own actions.  It actually builds into the politics of resentment which the left pioneered, only in this case against the elites, the moneyed, and the powerful.


Kamala Harris incited a mob in an effort to overthrow democracy?


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> ]
> 
> I'd be o.k. with this if you hold Kamala Harris and some of the Ds responsible for the mob violence and murder which took places in the April-June riots.  If the standard is you can't work up and encourage a crowd which may become a mob, the same standard has to apply across parties.
> 
> p.s. populism (as opposed to conservativism) is not necessarily big on responsibility for your own actions.  It actually builds into the politics of resentment which the left pioneered, only in this case against the elites, the moneyed, and the powerful.


I thought I was pretty clear in my opposition to last summer’s mob violence.  Anyone who attends a riot is partly responsible for the violence inherent in the riot.  That goes ten or a hundred fold if you are a public figure and allow your image to be used to promote the riot.  

For example, by putting yourself at the front of the march during the peaceful phase- then somehow being invisible when it’s time to ask everyone to go home instead of looting Target.   

“a crowd which may become a mob”?  Don’t kid yourself.  It’s a mob as soon as it has been gathered.  If you don’t have sufficient security in place to disband your mob, don’t host the event.


----------



## dad4

espola said:


> Kamala Harris incited a mob in an effort to overthrow democracy?


It was pretty common for left wing leaders to join the BLM marches.  They like to get out in front so the base knows they were there for the struggle.

I don’t remember many of them out there with bull horns at 5PM asking people to disperse and go home.  Kudos to those that did.  

I think most showed up for the photo op, then made sure to get out before the looting started.  Did you think Trump was clever enough to think of that trick on his own?


----------



## crush

dad4 said:


> I have no intention of going deep into the weeds with someone who can't tell the difference between "the shining city on the hill" and "find 12,000 votes".
> 
> Two core principles of conservatism are responsibility for your own actions and a respect for the rule of law.   Trump's actions on Jan 06 violated both of those.
> 
> It is not a conservative act to assemble a mob, tell them to fight, and pretend to be surprised when your violent mob beats a man to death.  That is what mobs do; there is no reason to be surprised.
> 
> And, if you are still pretending that Trump's speech played no role in the murder, I really can't help you.


You guys getting in some games?


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> I thought I was pretty clear in my opposition to last summer’s mob violence.  Anyone who attends a riot is partly responsible for the violence inherent in the riot.  That goes ten or a hundred fold if you are a public figure and allow your image to be used to promote the riot.
> 
> For example, by putting yourself at the front of the march during the peaceful phase- then somehow being invisible when it’s time to ask everyone to go home instead of looting Target.
> 
> “a crowd which may become a mob”?  Don’t kid yourself.  It’s a mob as soon as it has been gathered.  If you don’t have sufficient security in place to disband your mob, don’t host the event.


At least you are consistent.  I respect that.  Under the definition you just made, even the peaceful BLM protests would constitute a mob because they had no means of controlling it if it went out of control and they were significantly large enough that a few bad elements could make the thing go out of control quickly.  Not sure I agree, because I think the right to protest is a fundamental American right that should be exercised responsibly, but I appreciate the consistency.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Kamala Harris incited a mob in an effort to overthrow democracy?


Apparently espola believes mobs are only bad if they try to overthrow democracy, never mind the body and injury count of the spring-summer riots is higher than the riot at the Capitol.  Apparently, whether a mob is bad or good, depends on the motives of a mob (which BTW, is a recipe for mob rule).


----------



## Desert Hound

Grace T. said:


> Apparently espola believes mobs are only bad if they try to overthrow democracy,


Well he also believes like many what happened was an insurrection. It wasn't close to one. But it is something dutifully repeated on the news and by D leaders, so the followers follow along with that thought process.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> Apparently espola believes mobs are only bad if they try to overthrow democracy, never mind the body and injury count of the spring-summer riots is higher than the riot at the Capitol.  Apparently, whether a mob is bad or good, depends on the motives of a mob (which BTW, is a recipe for mob rule).


You didn't answer the question.


----------



## espola

Desert Hound said:


> Well he also believes like many what happened was an insurrection. It wasn't close to one. But it is something dutifully repeated on the news and by D leaders, so the followers follow along with that thought process.


The sitting President sent a mob to the Capitol to disrupt the process of replacing him, thus overturning a Constitutional process as practiced since George Washington was first elected.  How is that not an insurrection?


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> I have no intention of going deep into the weeds with someone who can't tell the difference between "the shining city on the hill" and "find 12,000 votes".
> 
> Two core principles of conservatism are responsibility for your own actions and a respect for the rule of law.   Trump's actions on Jan 06 violated both of those.
> 
> It is not a conservative act to assemble a mob, tell them to fight, and pretend to be surprised when your violent mob beats a man to death.  That is what mobs do; there is no reason to be surprised.
> 
> And, if you are still pretending that Trump's speech played no role in the murder, I really can't help you.


I cannot say I blame you for not wanting to get into the weeds when holding a weak hand. Unless you have been in a coma for over 30 years, you would understand the days of taking the high road, political civility, and “The Shining City on the Hill”, are long gone. Actually, the ones in need of help are the weak-kneed and spineless (R)’s like; Bush, McCain, Romney, Cheney’s Daughter and those who support and yearn for them and their...continue to lose, BUT with grace, approach to election, all while seeking...the never to be had acceptance...by the left and their acolytes.

Let me add to the @Grace T. comment below...So, if I follow your point, I guess because “Bush lied people died” it makes him a murderer? (not to mention all the dark evilness of his VP Darth Cheney)…and thus, all those who voted for him support a murderer, do I have it right? I do acknowledge that you and I have common ground…as we have been told at every turn for many years Bush, McCain, Romney et al., are racist, sexist, homophobic etc., along with anyone who supports them. Although, the left has added the following to Trump and 74+ million citizens: nazi, white supremacist, insurrectionist, and domestic terrorist worth of reeducation camps and drone strikes…to which you appear to shrug shoulders at, if not tacitly agree with.

Since you continue to avoid providing any nominations or policies that are not solidly conservative and continue playing small ball…I’ll assume your main issue with Trump is probably something like: “the bad orange man says and texts mean things”…which is the same mental derangement the left and never-trumpers continue to have failed to come to grips with even to this day. Aside from maybe grade school, popularity & personality contests have no place in presidential elections …especially not for battling in the current savage political environment. You see, it is you and your type of Republican who gave rise to the election of Trump…and continue to prove you are no match for the brand of politics the leftist and their media puppets play…which in turn will be utterly useless in stopping the damage they have already done, and will continue to do, to this Great Country.

I am seriously interested in your thoughts on all of Trump's nominations and policies...but will admit, I am not be holding my breath.

BTW, if I am to understand your shallow "*little* party" comment correctly, I'd say the below NBC poll from January 13, 2021 would clearly support your point... although, with the only exception being, you would be the one hosting a “*little* party.”


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> It was pretty common for left wing leaders to join the BLM marches.  They like to get out in front so the base knows they were there for the struggle.
> 
> I don’t remember many of them out there with bull horns at 5PM asking people to disperse and go home.  Kudos to those that did.
> 
> I think most showed up for the photo op, then made sure to get out before the looting started.  Did you think Trump was clever enough to think of that trick on his own?


...and then there is this:

Mitt Romney marches with Black Lives Matter protesters, becoming first GOP senator to join them - CBS News

Maybe Mitt should be on the hook for all BLM's atrocities, eh? Funny to watch so-called "principled conservatives" and ilk pretzel themselves.


----------



## dad4

MicPaPa said:


> ...and then there is this:
> 
> Mitt Romney marches with Black Lives Matter protesters, becoming first GOP senator to join them - CBS News
> 
> Maybe Mitt should be on the hook for all BLM's atrocities, eh? Funny to watch so-called "principled conservatives" and ilk pretzel themselves.


Was that protest one of the ones that dispersed, or one of the ones that ransacked the local stores?

It matters.


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> Was that protest one of the ones that dispersed, or one of the ones that ransacked the local stores?
> 
> It matters.


Nice try my friend...you see, I was in CA on 01/06/2021...yet I am on the hook for everything DT says and does according to the rules by those you  willingly, and in my opinion grossly, follow and have aligned yourself with. DT showed (R)'s and Romney how to deal with the left and their media tools...and I can assure you, it was not to become a tool.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> Was that protest one of the ones that dispersed, or one of the ones that ransacked the local stores?
> 
> It matters.


I thought you said the protests though weren't o.k. if they didn't provide adequate security to anticipate things going bad?  Isn't that the relevant question....were proper steps taken at the Romney protest to ensure things remained orderly?


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> I thought you said the protests though weren't o.k. if they didn't provide adequate security to anticipate things going bad?  Isn't that the relevant question....were proper steps taken at the Romney protest to ensure things remained orderly?


That is exactly the question.  Did Romney attend a riot or a rally?

If he was there in support of a crowd that looted Walmart 4 hour later, then my respect for him falls.


----------



## espola

dad4 said:


> That is exactly the question.  Did Romney attend a riot or a rally?
> 
> If he was there in support of a crowd that looted Walmart 4 hour later, then my respect for him falls.


More to the point -- did he stand in front of the crowd and tell them to go to Walmart and demand free stuff?


----------



## Desert Hound

espola said:


> More to the point -- did he stand in front of the crowd and tell them to go to Walmart and demand free stuff?


Trump didn't incite a riot. Read or watch the speech.

On the other hand we had months of riots and plenty of Dems not willing to town down their rhetoric.

If those Dems now want to try to pin something on T, then by their own standards, many of them have to go.

Consistency is key. You can't explain away one side, and demand the other abide by rules you don't impose on your preferred group.

Just recently you had Schumer on the steps of the Supreme Court telling them if they vote a certain way, they will pay.

There are many examples of Da using terminology they now try to say is out of bounds.


----------



## espola

Desert Hound said:


> Trump didn't incite a riot. Read or watch the speech.
> 
> On the other hand we had months of riots and plenty of Dems not willing to town down their rhetoric.
> 
> If those Dems now want to try to pin something on T, then by their own standards, many of them have to go.
> 
> Consistency is key. You can't explain away one side, and demand the other abide by rules you don't impose on your preferred group.
> 
> Just recently you had Schumer on the steps of the Supreme Court telling them if they vote a certain way, they will pay.
> 
> There are many examples of Da using terminology they now try to say is out of bounds.


Sorry, wrong. The correct answer is "no".


----------



## Bruddah IZ

Mandatory Vaccines?
					

Join me - and see the series you’ve heard about - but hurry, it’s FREE just for a limited time.



					upvir.al


----------



## N00B

espola said:


> Sorry, wrong. The correct answer is "no".


The correct answer is that they tacitly condoned the looting of Walmart, small businesses, fast food restaurants, etc. by not condemning it and by making comments like “That’s what insurance is for”. From my perspective, knowing someone who’s small business was looted in La Mesa, CA during these events... it’s the same thing.

Sorry, it’s not that black and white.  While the relative virtue of the two are in no way equal (complaining about election results vs. social justice issues), the standards regarding free speech and accountability under the law (accepting that impeachment doesn’t have the same jurisprudence as what most perceive as the legal system) shouldn’t differ under the blind eye of the law, nor in application between political party affiliations.


----------



## Glitterhater

I would like to know too, (as someone who is a more moderaate liberal,) how anyone on the far left can justify looting and demolishing mom & pop shops in the process. Like, WTF? How is that ok?

We have a very dear friend whose longtime deli in the downtown Sac area was just straight up demolished- for no other reason that it being located in an area that riots were taking place. The oldest member of that family is elderly- that's his baby, his nest egg. Just fking flattened for  no good reason other than some thugs trying to posture. 

I think a soccer store was also robbed and looted during that time. IMO, those people are no better than those who took over the WH. A thug is a thug is a thug....


----------



## espola

N00B said:


> The correct answer is that they tacitly condoned the looting of Walmart, small businesses, fast food restaurants, etc. by not condemning it and by making comments like “That’s what insurance is for”. From my perspective, knowing someone who’s small business was looted in La Mesa, CA during these events... it’s the same thing.
> 
> Sorry, it’s not that black and white.  While the relative virtue of the two are in no way equal (complaining about election results vs. social justice issues), the standards regarding free speech and accountability under the law (accepting that impeachment doesn’t have the same jurisprudence as what most perceive as the legal system) shouldn’t differ under the blind eye of the law, nor in application between political party affiliations.


Who said "That's what insurance is for"?


----------



## happy9

espola said:


> Who said "That's what insurance is for"?



BLM activist and leadership have repeatedly stated that looting is a form of reparations and that looting doesn't really hurt anyone since most businesses have insurance.  Google Ariel Atkins, she'll drop some knowledge on ya.  Social media was ripe with the idea  of  "That's what insurance is for".

Pathetic behavior on both sides of the aisle. Small business did in fact suffer from the Summer of Love.  Add to it reduced revenue from the pandemic and you effectively ended the life cycle of many small businesses.  Shameful to say the least.  It's no wonder people armed themselves to protect their properties.  Koreans on rooftops is a real thing.


----------



## N00B

espola said:


> Who said "That's what insurance is for"?


look it up... I hear google is an effective tool.


----------



## espola

happy9 said:


> BLM activist and leadership have repeatedly stated that looting is a form of reparations and that looting doesn't really hurt anyone since most businesses have insurance.  Google Ariel Atkins, she'll drop some knowledge on ya.  Social media was ripe with the idea  of  "That's what insurance is for".
> 
> Pathetic behavior on both sides of the aisle. Small business did in fact suffer from the Summer of Love.  Add to it reduced revenue from the pandemic and you effectively ended the life cycle of many small businesses.  Shameful to say the least.  It's no wonder people armed themselves to protect their properties.  Koreans on rooftops is a real thing.


Will t's lawyers be subpoenaing Ms. Atkins?


----------



## crush

espola said:


> The sitting President sent a mob to the Capitol to disrupt the process of replacing him, thus overturning a Constitutional process as practiced since George Washington was first elected.  How is that not an insurrection?


Coo Coo and full of nonsense!!!!


----------



## Bruddah IZ

There Are More Viruses on Earth Than There Are Stars in the Universe And yes, they’re alive


----------



## happy9

espola said:


> Will t's lawyers be subpoenaing Ms. Atkins?


There ya go, revert to the evil T.  I gave you an adult answer and some research homework.  Invoking "T" is cooocooo and lazy.


----------



## crush

happy9 said:


> There ya go, revert to the evil T.  I gave you an adult answer and some research homework.  Invoking "T" is cooocooo and lazy.


Hahahahaha.  Happy, you get it bro.  I love you man and I appreciate all you do for mankind. * Man *needs to learn to be *kind *


----------



## espola

happy9 said:


> There ya go, revert to the evil T.  I gave you an adult answer and some research homework.  Invoking "T" is cooocooo and lazy.


I thought I was following the sense of the thread.


----------



## crush

espola said:


> I thought I was following the sense of the thread.


All these wars bro?  Death, fear & destruction.  No more.  We will never forget!!!


----------



## Soccer Bum 06

happy9 said:


> BLM activist and leadership have repeatedly stated that looting is a form of reparations and that looting doesn't really hurt anyone since most businesses have insurance.  Google Ariel Atkins, she'll drop some knowledge on ya.  Social media was ripe with the idea  of  "That's what insurance is for".
> 
> Pathetic behavior on both sides of the aisle. Small business did in fact suffer from the Summer of Love.  Add to it reduced revenue from the pandemic and you effectively ended the life cycle of many small businesses.  Shameful to say the least.  It's no wonder people armed themselves to protect their properties.  Koreans on rooftops is a real thing.


It is not a harmless crime even if insurance covers the loss. Business owners can expect rates to rise as claims rise. Insurance companies don’t lose money in the long term.


----------



## happy9

Soccer Bum 06 said:


> It is not a harmless crime even if insurance covers the loss. Business owners can expect rates to rise as claims rise. Insurance companies don’t lose money in the long term.


Woke crusading politicians who've never ran a business in their life just don't get it.  They'd rather sip lattes and ponder the plight of the artic moth.


----------



## Glitterhater

happy9 said:


> Woke crusading politicians who've never ran a business in their life just don't get it.  They'd rather sip lattes and ponder the plight of the artic moth.


One small correction- "alternative nut milk" lattes


----------



## Red card

EOTL said:


> Magat desperation is palpable. So much losing. Bigly.
> 
> Lost the election. Lost congress. Lost everything they want in CA. Lost more than 60 lawsuits. Lost their coup. Lost their claim the election was stolen.  What a sorry bunch of sad sacks. Just like their sad loser leader who can’t even muster the “courage” to show up to the inauguration. So pathetic. And starting tomorrow they will be forced to endure complete sentences.


----------



## Bruddah IZ

https://vrevealed.com/covid/trailer/?ref_id=sa52458456


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Magat desperation is palpable. So much losing. Bigly.
> 
> Lost the election. Lost congress. Lost everything they want in CA. Lost more than 60 lawsuits. Lost their coup. Lost their claim the election was stolen.  What a sorry bunch of sad sacks. Just like their sad loser leader who can’t even muster the “courage” to show up to the inauguration. So pathetic. And starting tomorrow they will be forced to endure complete sentences.


But do you soccer much?


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> But do you soccer much?


So frustrating that I don’t talk about myself, and that my self esteem does not depend on how well my kid(s) play(s) soccer. 

If people wanted to talk about soccer instead of whining about the governor and making racist, misogynistic, homophobic and transphobic comments, I’d do that. But that is clearly not the case.


----------



## espola

EOTL said:


> So frustrating that I don’t talk about myself, and that my self esteem does not depend on how well my kid(s) play(s) soccer.
> 
> If people wanted to talk about soccer instead of whining about the governor and making racist, misogynistic, homophobic and transphobic comments, I’d do that. But that is clearly not the case.


And, since this is supposedly not an off-topic post, how little soccer content there is in it.


----------



## EOTL

espola said:


> And, since this is supposedly not an off-topic post, how little soccer content there is in it.


Magat snowflakes want a new safe space to discuss their non-soccer Q conspiracy theories now that Parler is gone. I wonder which of these fools is the Mein Pillow guy.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> So frustrating that I don’t talk about myself, and that my *self esteem* does not depend on how well my *kid(s) *play(s) soccer.
> 
> If people wanted to talk about soccer instead of whining about the governor and making racist, misogynistic, homophobic and transphobic comments, I’d do that. But that is clearly not the case.


You'd have credibility if you had one, the other, or both.


----------



## EOTL

happy9 said:


> You'd have credibility if you had one, the other, or both.


Ooh, you figured out how to put things in bold. Pretty sophisticated - for a magat.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> Ooh, you figured out how to put things in bold. Pretty sophisticated - for a magat.


Took me while, but I figured it out...Amazing what happens when you put your mind to something. Don't know about the magat thing though, have no association with them.   you seem to be always hot and bothered by them.


----------



## TOSDCI

EOTL said:


> Magat snowflakes want a new safe space to discuss their non-soccer Q conspiracy theories now that Parler is gone. I wonder which of these fools is the Mein Pillow guy.


You may want to get some new material.  Yawn!!! The same old lack luster responses are getting stale.


----------



## happy9

TOSDCI said:


> You may want to get some new material.  Yawn!!! The same old lack luster responses are getting stale.


Not easily adaptable - give em a year or so.  He'll figure it out.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> So frustrating that I don’t talk about myself, and that my self esteem does not depend on how well my kid(s) play(s) soccer.
> 
> If people wanted to talk about soccer instead of whining about the governor and making racist, misogynistic, homophobic and transphobic comments, I’d do that. But that is clearly not the case.


“How your kids?” You don’t have kids so how do you even know? Serious question, what sports have you played? Did you play any sports in High School or beyond?

Let’s get to talking about sports. My guess is you didn’t play sports, but here is your chance to come clean.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> “How your kids?” You don’t have kids so how do you even know? Serious question, what sports have you played? Did you play any sports in High School or beyond?
> 
> Let’s get to talking about sports. My guess is you didn’t play sports, but here is your chance to come clean.


If y’all could keep it to soccer instead of whining about how mean Governor Newsom is to you, you would have your wish.  In the meantime, how ‘bout magat snowflake Karen Gina Carano getting what was coming to her? Love people exercising their First Amendment rights to help get her fired. Maybe she can get a gig hawking Mein Pillows if anyone would even let them advertise on their platform.


----------



## N00B

EOTL said:


> If y’all could keep it to soccer instead of whining about how mean Governor Newsom is to you, you would have your wish.  In the meantime, how ‘bout magat snowflake Karen Gina Carano getting what was coming to her? Love people exercising their First Amendment rights to help get her fired. Maybe she can get a gig hawking Mein Pillows if anyone would even let them advertise on their platform.


If you could respond to a post you quoted with an answer, that would be noteworthy.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> If y’all could keep it to soccer instead of whining about how mean Governor Newsom is to you, you would have your wish.  In the meantime, how ‘bout magat snowflake Karen Gina Carano getting what was coming to her? Love people exercising their First Amendment rights to help get her fired. Maybe she can get a gig hawking Mein Pillows if anyone would even let them advertise on their platform.


Come on @EOTL I know you aren’t afraid to call people out or put them down!! I asked you very specific questions and you didn’t answer one. I don’t want to talk about politics I told you let’s talk about sports!! Are you incapable of talking about sports? I didn’t bring up snowflake Karen or Newsom, I simply asked you about sports!!! Did you ever play sports in high school or higher? What sports did you play? Let’s talk sports, anything, basketball, baseball, or what about soccer. I asked you a specific question why can’t you answer?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Come on @EOTL I know you aren’t afraid to call people out or put them down!! I asked you very specific questions and you didn’t answer one. I don’t want to talk about politics I told you let’s talk about sports!! Are you incapable of talking about sports? I didn’t bring up snowflake Karen or Newsom, I simply asked you about sports!!! Did you ever play sports in high school or higher? What sports did you play? Let’s talk sports, anything, basketball, baseball, or what about soccer. I asked you a specific question why can’t you answer?


I don’t talk about myself.  I made that very clear in the very post that you followed up asking me personal questions. I do not need to talk about my sports history or my kid(s) because my self esteem does not depend on it.  I have discussed soccer many, many times here, whether it involved differences between ECNL and GDA and why those differences would lead to the eventual demise of GDA. I have discussed ACL injury prevention many times. I discuss the WNT quite frequently.

You wouldn’t get any of the other stuff from me if others were capable of having grown-up discussions about Covid including how the governor is handling it, or transgender athletes, or anything for that matter. They can’t, so I’m happy to jump in and respond to their stupid, biased and often mean-spirited behavior in a way they understand. Try directing your concerns to them. Often when I respond, even to your post, I’m not directing my comments to you, I’m just playing the magats’ game.


----------



## crush

I love soccer soccer, soccer and more soccer.  Soccer 24/7. 7 days a week, 365 days a year.  I also love sports.  The only thing I hate is cheaters and folks buying spots so their kid can make the grade.  I just like good old competition, win or lose.  Go sports forever!!!


----------



## crush

Also, a friendly reminder to all you nuts!!!


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> I love soccer soccer, soccer and more soccer.  Soccer 24/7. 7 days a week, 365 days a year.  I also love sports.  The only thing I hate is cheaters and folks buying spots so their kid can make the grade.  I just like good old competition, win or lose.  Go sports forever!!!


You should be happy that some parents actually pay, because otherwise you wouldn’t get to freeload.


----------



## crush




----------



## crush

Remember in 2016 when most of the top socal clubs said that all GDA clubs need to be fully funded everyone?  It's no lie and we should all stop and reflect back.  I was told by TB, JH, MS, WC, BH and HH that all GDA clubs had to be fully funded within a year or two.  Plus, all coaches had to be "B" level talent and trained at the highest level of coaching soccer.  It was sold as a free for all who make the top GDA squad. This was all supposed to be free.  It never happened and I'm still scratching my head why it didnt work out.


----------



## Kicker4Life

crush said:


> Remember in 2016 when most of the top socal clubs said that all GDA clubs need to be fully funded everyone?  It's no lie and we should all stop and reflect back.  I was told by TB, JH, MS, WC, BH and HH that all GDA clubs had to be fully funded within a year or two.  Plus, all coaches had to be "B" level talent and trained at the highest level of coaching soccer.  It was sold as a free for all who make the top GDA squad. This was all supposed to be free.  It never happened and I'm still scratching my head why it didnt work out.
> 
> View attachment 10080


Must have only said it to you because I never heard that.....


----------



## crush

Kicker4Life said:


> Must have only said it to you because I never heard that.....


I have all the emails and videos bro.  I guess Beach was the only not offering free rides.  I'm not making this up.  LA Galaxy and Pats ring a bell? LAFC? The only club not free in GDA Socal was Blues and Beach.  They stood true to their ways and always charged a fee for coach to help player become better citizen.


----------



## Kicker4Life

crush said:


> I have all the emails and videos bro.  I guess Beach was the only not offering free rides.  I'm not making this up.  LA Galaxy and Pats ring a bell? LAFC? The only club not free in GDA Socal was Blues and Beach.  They stood true to their ways and always charged a fee for coach to help player become better citizen.


Showing your ignorance (or your I canning ability to over exaggerate, I can’t tell) again, LAFC was not Fully Funded, only partial.  Galaxy and Pat’s were the ONLY 2 in the SW.  So Eagles, Real SoCal, Blues, Surf, Beach Legends, Del Sol, Albion, Galaxy San Diego, OC Surf, Utah Royals....should I continue?  ALL, not funded.  

There many be a sprinkling of other Clubs around the country that were Fully Funded, but they are by far the exception.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I don’t talk about myself.  I made that very clear in the very post that you followed up asking me personal questions. I do not need to talk about my sports history or my kid(s) because my self esteem does not depend on it.  I have discussed soccer many, many times here, whether it involved differences between ECNL and GDA and why those differences would lead to the eventual demise of GDA. I have discussed ACL injury prevention many times. I discuss the WNT quite frequently.
> 
> You wouldn’t get any of the other stuff from me if others were capable of having grown-up discussions about Covid including how the governor is handling it, or transgender athletes, or anything for that matter. They can’t, so I’m happy to jump in and respond to their stupid, biased and often mean-spirited behavior in a way they understand. Try directing your concerns to them. Often when I respond, even to your post, I’m not directing my comments to you, I’m just playing the magats’ game.


You're full of it. What does talking about your sports history or your kids have to do with self esteem? Is that what you think its about? The more I learn about you, the more I really feel sorry for you.  Your thinking is all out of whack! This is a site to talk about sports, specifically soccer, informing readers on past playing experience would add to your credibility. Knowing that you have kids, and they actually play soccer, would help the reader understand where you are coming from and perhaps you add some of your experiences to help someone out.  That is what this board was originally intended for and it is kind of sad it has lost that and you do nothing to try and preserve it.  The only credibility you have is you like to name call, twist facts, manipulate others words, and just try to cause chaos. Is your confidence so low that you are afraid to admit who you really are? 

Looking back at all your post, you have never brought up a topic, but you are always the one to try and start conflict.  That is fine, if you genuinely disagree, but what info have you EVER brought to this board.  Listen, you can disagree ALL you want, I don't even care, but try and bring something positive to the group ONE time, just once, but my guess is that you have never played sports or have kids, so you have nothing valuable to add to the board.  So all you do is look for topics that you can disagree with and try and get people bothered. Sad life dude! That is why people are tired of you, not because of your takes, but because you bring nothing good to the group, ever,  Too much of the same thing is never good, don't be afraid to mix it up!


----------



## crush

Kicker4Life said:


> Showing your *ignorance* (or your I canning ability to over exaggerate,* I can’t tell*) again,* LAFC was not Fully Funded*, only partial.  Galaxy and Pat’s were the ONLY 2 in the SW.  So Eagles, Real SoCal, Blues, Surf, Beach Legends, Del Sol, Albion, Galaxy San Diego, OC Surf, Utah Royals....should I continue?  ALL, not funded.
> 
> There many be a sprinkling of other Clubs around the country that were Fully Funded, but they are by far the exception.


That's not nice to say that but I understand your kind very well.  It was preached in 2016 that ALL clubs need to be fully funded, just like the boys.  That is a fact.  The fact is, it was BS and one big BS lie and you know it.  
WC told everyone ((when they were GDA before they got two for one to go all in ECNL when everyone was bailing and drink kool aid at GDA)) they are fully finded by Mia and Magic and all that glamour.  That is 100% true.  How many players are getting free today at these clubs?  What my investagation actually told me it was the top goats getting free and then the super rich parents paying so they can play with the goats and look good and brag,
Surf was fully funded, trust me.......
Eagels bailed after first year because they couldnt do the fully funded game.


----------



## MacDre

soccersc said:


> You're full of it. What does talking about your sports history or your kids have to do with self esteem? Is that what you think its about? The more I learn about you, the more I really feel sorry for you.  Your thinking is all out of whack! This is a site to talk about sports, specifically soccer, informing readers on past playing experience would add to your credibility. Knowing that you have kids, and they actually play soccer, would help the reader understand where you are coming from and perhaps you add some of your experiences to help someone out.  That is what this board was originally intended for and it is kind of sad it has lost that and you do nothing to try and preserve it.  The only credibility you have is you like to name call, twist facts, manipulate others words, and just try to cause chaos. Is your confidence so low that you are afraid to admit who you really are?
> 
> Looking back at all your post, you have never brought up a topic, but you are always the one to try and start conflict.  That is fine, if you genuinely disagree, but what info have you EVER brought to this board.  Listen, you can disagree ALL you want, I don't even care, but try and bring something positive to the group ONE time, just once, but my guess is that you have never played sports or have kids, so you have nothing valuable to add to the board.  So all you do is look for topics that you can disagree with and try and get people bothered. Sad life dude! That is why people are tired of you, not because of your takes, but because you bring nothing good to the group, ever,  Too much of the same thing is never good, don't be afraid to mix it up!


For the record, I like EOTL and I agree with much of what he has to say.  He makes my life easier because “but for” EOTL I’d be labeled the angry black man of the forum.  Lot’s of ass backwards weirdos emboldened by the anonymity of the forum here.


----------



## watfly

It appears that the Let Them Play CA group is gaining some traction, but whether its enough to influence Newsom is anyone's guess.   What I find discouraging is that Cal South doesn't appear to be playing any roll in the Let Them Play coalition.


----------



## crush

*COMMENTARY*
*Girls Development Academy promises to be less expensive for players than ECNL*

by Mike Woitalla @MikeWoitalla, Feb 23, 2016
*By Mike Woitalla*
The U.S. Soccer Federation made it official on Tuesday:
It will launch the Girls Development Academy (GDA) in fall of 2017 -- a nationwide league with 60 to 80 clubs fielding teams at the U-14/15, U-16/17 and U-18/19 age groups.
Having launched a boys DA in 2007, the USSF will thus be in control of the highest level of youth soccer for both genders.
Since 2009, the U.S. Club-sanctioned ECNL laid claim to running elite soccer for American girls. The ECNL has 79 clubs nationwide that field teams at five age groups, from U-14 to U-18.
One great achievement of the boys DA, thanks in large part to fully funded MLS academies, is that it vastly increased the number of elite boys players participating at no cost or reduced cost.
*So will the GDA be less expensive for players than the ECNL?*
“It’s our plan that the cost will be reduced to play in the league,” said U.S. Soccer Technical Director *April Heinrichs*. “In general, *U.S. Soccer is going to pick up a lot of the expenses *in terms of running the league, so the cost will be less for the players.”
*Ryan Mooney*, U.S. Soccer’s Director of Sport Development, said that in premier leagues such as the ECNL and the Development Academy that require vast amounts of travel, per-player costs can range significantly from one club to the next.
*“We want to make sure that we’re mindful of the cost impact that is reaching the end-user, both the player and their parents,”* said Mooney. “Whether that’s through the cost we cover from an event perspective, whether it’s a reduction in registration fees, *whether it’s scholarship program funding*, etc. Those are all things we’ll look to contribute to the program to try to help minimize costs.
*“At the same time I think it’s fair to say that there will still be a pay-to-play component*, certainly from the onset, and we’ll see how that changes over time. It was no different eight years ago with the launch of the boys Academy and how that cost now has changed between then and now.”
Heinrichs said that the Federation has been discussing a Girls Development Academy for years and that a recent influx of financial commitment makes the timing right.
“For me it was quite simple,” she said. “When we looked at all these new resources post-World Cup win [in 2015] that want to invest in, be a part of and integrate with our youth national team program on the girls side – this was an easy decision. An exciting decision for us as well.
“Five years ago, we had two full-time employees in the girls youth national team program. Now we’re looking to hire potentially 10 to 15 new people to be involved and committed on a full-time, daily basis to improve the women’s game. And then there’s going to be a large budget to run the [GDA] ... and the full force of U.S. Soccer’s leadership and the ability to run a national league -- we’re already running the NWSL and the Boys Development Academy.”
*A key difference between the GDA and the ECNL is that while the ECNL is age pure and requires clubs to field five teams, GDA teams will field three combined age group teams.  *((when I was in talk with all the socal clubs, I was told only three teams and all three have to be fully funded))
*“The use of combined age groups will require clubs to form teams with a balanced roster of players from two distinct birth years,” reads the U.S. Soccer statement.*
Heinrichs calls it a way “to get players playing up more naturally.”
*“If I had a list of player development initiatives that help players grow, one of the top, top, top things on that list is playing up,” she said.*
((This quote rubs me wrong Kicker.  Surf told my dd and me that no one is allowed to play up unless the scouts say so.  That was the biggest lie I fell for and I'm still pissed off)).
In the age-pure setup, clubs may resist moving players up because it decreases their changes of winning trophies. In the DA setup, for example, a team’s star player one year will be among the younger players every two years. Fewer teams can also mean fewer roster-fillers -- players who might not be suited for the elite level but are needed to round out the squad.
Moreover,* by having to field only three teams*, Heinrichs believes the GDA will be more inclusive to smaller clubs. ((Three teams. ya right))
“Let’s say there’s a super club out there and they’ve got 60 girls teams under their umbrella,” she said. “It’s quite easy for them to put a team out there in every age group. But with a smaller club that’s doing it well -- and this is where I think our model is pretty attractive -- all they have to do is put out three really good age groups.
“I have seen non-ECNL doing things really, really well but they’re not a super club. They don’t have a business model that’s so huge that they’re all about making money. But they’re doing it well from the leadership standpoint. They don’t have so many teams, but their focus would be on getting the three age groups right.
“Having birth-year every other year with the Girls Development Academy makes it more elite and more inclusive of clubs that aren’t a super club.”
*The other big difference compared to the ECNL or U.S. Youth Soccer leagues is that the GDA will ban players from participating in high school ball.* *That, Heinrichs said, will only affect “1 percent” of the players in girls youth soccer. And she expects players with college and national team ambitions to be OK with skipping high school ball.  *((She was wrong on this and so was GDA.  This also destroyed your league because more than 1% wanted to play HS Soccer April))
That it doesn't ban kids from high school ball will no doubt be a selling point from the ECNL when it starts competing for players with the GDA, which begins taking applications this May for the fall 2017 launch.
The applications will be evaluated by U.S. Soccer technical staff on:
• Leadership of the club and quality of the coaching staff;
• Desire to embrace and promote the core values of the program;
• U.S. Soccer license levels of coaching staff;
• Infrastructure of the club and the resources currently being invested in development (facilities, scholarships, staff to player ratio, etc.);
• History of player production for youth national teams, the senior women’s national teams, and professional leagues;
• Market and depth of the player pool, geographic location and travel implications, and proximity to other elite clubs.


----------



## crush

MacDre said:


> For the record, I like EOTL and I agree with much of what he has to say.  He makes my life easier because “but for” EOTL I’d be labeled the angry black man of the forum.  Lot’s of ass backwards weirdos emboldened by the anonymity of the forum here.


I love you Dre.


----------



## soccersc

MacDre said:


> For the record, I like EOTL and I agree with much of what he has to say.  He makes my life easier because “but for” EOTL I’d be labeled the angry black man of the forum.  Lot’s of ass backwards weirdos emboldened by the anonymity of the forum here.


For the record, I didn’t say I don’t like him, I don’t even mind some of his takes...what I said is people get tired of hearing him rant the same stuff over and over again. He doesn’t bring anything to the forum, he just wants to disagree and argue...I’m looking to see if he can ever post something on his own that can help the group, not always just the negative!!!


----------



## MacDre

crush said:


> I love you Dre.


Bromance!!  I love you too Crush.


----------



## watfly

MacDre said:


> For the record, I like EOTL and I agree with much of what he has to say.  He makes my life easier because “but for” EOTL I’d be labeled the angry black man of the forum.  Lot’s of ass backwards weirdos emboldened by the anonymity of the forum here.


For the record, you seem very reasonable to me in general even without comparing you EOTL.  You provide valuable opinions from a perspective most of us don't have.  Whether I agree with you, or not, is largely irrelevant.


----------



## MacDre

soccersc said:


> For the record, I didn’t say I don’t like him, I don’t even mind some of his takes...what I said is people get tired of hearing him rant the same stuff over and over again. He doesn’t bring anything to the forum, he just wants to disagree and argue...I’m looking to see if he can ever post something on his own that can help the group, not always just the negative!!!


I think he’s usually replying to fairly offensive post.  Liberals are generally passive.  It refreshing to see a liberal stand up for what he believes.


----------



## espola

watfly said:


> It appears that the Let Them Play CA group is gaining some traction, but whether its enough to influence Newsom is anyone's guess.   What I find discouraging is that Cal South doesn't appear to be playing any roll in the Let Them Play coalition.


The President of Cal South, Bob Turner, was one of the organizers of the "What About Us" youth sports rally in San Diego in October.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> For the record, I didn’t say I don’t like him, I don’t even mind some of his takes...what I said is people get tired of hearing him rant the same stuff over and over again. He doesn’t bring anything to the forum, he just wants to disagree and argue...I’m looking to see if he can ever post something on his own that can help the group, not always just the negative!!!


I get tired of people ranting about the same stuff too. I wonder why some people here don’t care that others repeatedly post the same tired nonsense, even blatantly bigoted crap, yet they only get mad when I respond? Is it because they support the bigotry or offensive commentary when it aligns with their views? Is it because they’re too chicken to stand up to them?  Either way, I don’t care. So long as people make offensive comments, so long as they refuse to accept the legitimacy of views other than their own even if they disagree with the, I’m perfectly happy to play their game right back atcha.  Most of the folks here want to behave like children, so I indulge them. I know magats aren’t accustomed to a libtard playing their game, but how many times do I need to tell people that playing nice with the trumpanzees doesn’t work because it is always one-sided.

If you want me to behave differently, you might want to ask your friends to do so also. Grace actually did that not too long ago and, go figure, I’ve laid off her ever since (more or less), other than when she has a go at me.


----------



## Kicker4Life

crush said:


> That's not nice to say that but I understand your kind very well.  It was preached in 2016 that ALL clubs need to be fully funded, just like the boys.  That is a fact.  The fact is, it was BS and one big BS lie and you know it.
> WC told everyone ((when they were GDA before they got two for one to go all in ECNL when everyone was bailing and drink kool aid at GDA)) they are fully finded by Mia and Magic and all that glamour.  That is 100% true.  How many players are getting free today at these clubs?  What my investagation actually told me it was the top goats getting free and then the super rich parents paying so they can play with the goats and look good and brag,
> Surf was fully funded, trust me.......
> Eagels bailed after first year because they couldnt do the fully funded game.


You do understand the definition of ignorance is a lack of knowledge, right?

WC was never fully Funded, period.   Ask LAFC parents about the sticker shock when they left GDA!  I’m not here to argue, only to point out that GDA was NEVER fully funded for every Club. May have been an initial desire from US Soccer when it was conceived, but it was never a requirement.  

Funny, I know several families within Surf who paid fees during the DA years.  I’m sure some got “scholarships” (which I’m sure you know about), but not 100% of the DA roster for sure.


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> That's not nice to say that but I understand your kind very well.  It was preached in 2016 that ALL clubs need to be fully funded, just like the boys.  That is a fact.  The fact is, it was BS and one big BS lie and you know it.
> WC told everyone ((when they were GDA before they got two for one to go all in ECNL when everyone was bailing and drink kool aid at GDA)) they are fully finded by Mia and Magic and all that glamour.  That is 100% true.  How many players are getting free today at these clubs?  What my investagation actually told me it was the top goats getting free and then the super rich parents paying so they can play with the goats and look good and brag,
> Surf was fully funded, trust me.......
> Eagels bailed after first year because they couldnt do the fully funded game.


Yes, Qanon says right there in its manifesto that there is a conspiracy that includes the most elite youth girl soccer players, fat cat dads, and youth soccer clubs, to lock out kids who, uh, don’t pay.


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> For the record, I didn’t say I don’t like him, I don’t even mind some of his takes...what I said is people get tired of hearing him rant the same stuff over and over again. He doesn’t bring anything to the forum, he just wants to disagree and argue...I’m looking to see if he can ever post something on his own that can help the group, not always just the negative!!!


I also think people confuse negativity with disagreement. For example, I spent the entire existence of GDA explaining why ECNL was a better platform and how GDA would eventually fail, only to get mocked incessantly for it. That wasn’t negativity, it was the truth. I spent years defending the WNT explaining how they had never been “passed by” and will not get passed by any time soon, only to get repeatedly mocked for that too. I got mocked for pointing out that holding a GDA showcase in CO in April is a bad idea, only to get mocked for that right up until everyone got there and it got snowed out. I once made a completely innocuous post about ACL injury avoidance, only to get incessantly mocked for that advice right up until the a**hole’s daughter tore her ACL. Even then he and others continued to come after me for whatever reason. I have constantly defended kids being able to have the option of playing HS without getting kicked out of their club or league, and got mocked even for that. I explained why no one would ever learn about the full extent of Amanda Cromwell’s (probable lack of) role in the Singer scandal. I explained why McGuire won’t get fired over highly hyperbolic, and often exaggerated or misleading allegations leveled against him.

The problem here ain’t me. The problem is virtually everyone here is just dumb, doesn’t want to hear what they don’t want to hear, and have no respect for different opinions. I played nice for a while, but that doesn’t work with the magat crowd that congregates here, so let’s do it their way. If you’re going to say something bigoted, disrespectful, or mind-bogglingly stupid, I’m perfectly happy to ratchet up the lack of respect a couple notches to prove my point or lay waste to a thread in which people can’t get it together.


----------



## Glitterhater

crush said:


> That's not nice to say that but I understand your kind very well.  It was preached in 2016 that ALL clubs need to be fully funded, just like the boys.  That is a fact.  The fact is, it was BS and one big BS lie and you know it.
> WC told everyone ((when they were GDA before they got two for one to go all in ECNL when everyone was bailing and drink kool aid at GDA)) they are fully finded by Mia and Magic and all that glamour.  That is 100% true.  How many players are getting free today at these clubs?  What my investagation actually told me it was the top goats getting free and then the super rich parents paying so they can play with the goats and look good and brag,
> Surf was fully funded, trust me.......
> Eagels bailed after first year because they couldnt do the fully funded game.


But- didn't you just describe literally every soccer club around? I can't speak to any club being fully funded, (I have never seen nor heard of one,) but everything else you say is like- duh, that's how it works, right?


----------



## texanincali

EOTL said:


> I also think people confuse negativity with disagreement. For example, I spent the entire existence of GDA explaining why ECNL was a better platform and how GDA would eventually fail, only to get mocked incessantly for it. That wasn’t negativity, it was the truth. I spent years defending the WNT explaining how they had never been “passed by” and will not get passed by any time soon, only to get repeatedly mocked for that too. I got mocked for pointing out that holding a GDA showcase in CO in April is a bad idea, only to get mocked for that right up until everyone got there and it got snowed out. I once made a completely innocuous post about ACL injury avoidance, only to get incessantly mocked for that advice right up until the a**hole’s daughter tore her ACL. Even then he and others continued to come after me for whatever reason. I have constantly defended kids being able to have the option of playing HS without getting kicked out of their club or league, and got mocked even for that. I explained why no one would ever learn about the full extent of Amanda Cromwell’s (probable lack of) role in the Singer scandal. I explained why McGuire won’t get fired over highly hyperbolic, and often exaggerated or misleading allegations leveled against him.
> 
> The problem here ain’t me. The problem is virtually everyone here is just dumb, doesn’t want to hear what they don’t want to hear, and have no respect for different opinions. I played nice for a while, but that doesn’t work with the magat crowd that congregates here, so let’s do it their way. If you’re going to say something bigoted, disrespectful, or mind-bogglingly stupid, I’m perfectly happy to ratchet up the lack of respect a couple notches to prove my point or lay waste to a thread in which people can’t get it together.


I would like to thank you for posting this.  What didn't make a whole lot of sense has now become crystal clear.  Absolute tosser.


----------



## crush

Kicker4Life said:


> You do understand the definition of ignorance is a lack of knowledge, right?
> 
> WC was never fully Funded, period.   Ask LAFC parents about the sticker shock when they left GDA!  I’m not here to argue, only to point out that GDA was NEVER fully funded for every Club. May have been an initial desire from US Soccer when it was conceived, but it was never a requirement.
> 
> Funny, I know several families within Surf who paid fees during the DA years.  I’m sure some got “scholarships” (which I’m sure you know about), but not 100% of the DA roster for sure.


WC was bought by Surf so they had no way of offering rides for all.  Before LAFC got the twofer for being loyal, they were advertising fully funded with Mia and Magic.  Trust me.  I never said every club pulled it off.  This was when they only needed three teams to fully fund so it seemed durable on paper.  Get you over to the promise land and then see if fully funded sticks.  You can always switch on the parent and oh well, sol parent, right?  Be honest bro.  Then many 04s started shopping to jump on that 03 band.  Then, they had 4 and then 5 ages I think.  In socal, the top dogs were offering fully funded and advertised as such, trust me.  My dd was ok back then but she was not the only one getting fully funded offers in socal, trust me.  Pats, Galaxy, Legends, Surf, LAFC.  Blues said, "sorry, you have to pay to stay."  Because of the great age change, a mass exoduse of goats were released from their pins and fully funded phone calls were out in force, trust me   I took the fully funded offer.  I soon realized it was more like 50/50 fully funded, if that makes sense.  So after a hop away for another fully funded, I soon relized free is not good so we hopped back for friends sake and natty win and decided to fully pay and never take a free handout  again.  That is a true story, trust me.  About Surf, it was promoted that GDA clubs had to be fully funded and that is why you need to leave Blues in da dust.  No fields, no coaches license, only guys who yell or say nothing, no money to offer free rides and only kick ball soccer.  We already went through all this before.  I did find out later.....hahahah.....lol, hahahahah jokes on me that only a few got free funding at Surf.  Guess what else was tangled before me eyes???   Hahahaha.  Its all good bro.  I let it go.  It;s funny were all going to be together for one last go at it.  No more division in socal, just one #1 league.  I like what coach buck has to say.  Keep the rest local, moo.  Do you have a top 5 for 2021/2022 for SW?


----------



## crush

Glitterhater said:


> But- didn't you just describe literally every soccer club around? I can't speak to any club being fully funded, (I have never seen nor heard of one,) but everything else you say is like- duh, that's how it works, right?


Socal top dogs only and I bet Earthquakes.  Anyone from old the Quakers want to chime in?  I know Vegas Albion was tangling free rides and other goodies.  No more is good.  I'm just bringing up the facts


----------



## EOTL

texanincali said:


> I would like to thank you for posting this.  What didn't make a whole lot of sense has now become crystal clear.  Absolute tosser.


You’re welcome.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> I also think people confuse negativity with disagreement. For example, I spent the entire existence of GDA explaining why ECNL was a better platform and how GDA would eventually fail, only to get mocked incessantly for it. That wasn’t negativity, it was the truth. I spent years defending the WNT explaining how they had never been “passed by” and will not get passed by any time soon, only to get repeatedly mocked for that too. I got mocked for pointing out that holding a GDA showcase in CO in April is a bad idea, only to get mocked for that right up until everyone got there and it got snowed out. I once made a completely innocuous post about ACL injury avoidance, only to get incessantly mocked for that advice right up until the a**hole’s daughter tore her ACL. Even then he and others continued to come after me for whatever reason. I have constantly defended kids being able to have the option of playing HS without getting kicked out of their club or league, and got mocked even for that. I explained why no one would ever learn about the full extent of Amanda Cromwell’s (probable lack of) role in the Singer scandal. I explained why McGuire won’t get fired over highly hyperbolic, and often exaggerated or misleading allegations leveled against him.
> 
> The problem here ain’t me. The problem is virtually everyone here is just dumb, doesn’t want to hear what they don’t want to hear, and have no respect for different opinions. I played nice for a while, but that doesn’t work with the magat crowd that congregates here, so let’s do it their way. If you’re going to say something bigoted, disrespectful, or mind-bogglingly stupid, I’m perfectly happy to ratchet up the lack of respect a couple notches to prove my point or lay waste to a thread in which people can’t get it together.


Got it!! So let me get this straight...you used to post and nobody agreed with you, and you felt like you were being mocked....So you couldn’t handle people disagreeing and not seeing your side and instead of being okay with that, you decided to start mocking everyone and putting them down instead. Wow, what good character.

Were you the last one picked on the playground so you still hold it against those that play sports or whose kids play sports?


----------



## EOTL

soccersc said:


> Got it!! So let me get this straight...you used to post and nobody agreed with you, and you felt like you were being mocked....So you couldn’t handle people disagreeing and not seeing your side and instead of being okay with that, you decided to start mocking everyone and putting them down instead. Wow, what good character.
> 
> Were you the last one picked on the playground so you still hold it against those that play sports or whose kids play sports?


Y’all wanted to know if I’ve ever posted about soccer, and I gave you the answer. I behave the way I do here because being nice is not effective with magats. It’s pretty simple. Magats getting upset with me for playing by their rules is pretty funny. Certainly they aren’t accustomed to libtards playing by their rules, but it’s not my problem that they’re snowflakes who were hoping this would be a safe space.


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> Socal top dogs only and I bet Earthquakes.  Anyone from old the Quakers want to chime in?  I know Vegas Albion was tangling free rides and other goodies.  No more is good.  I'm just bringing up the facts


Earthquakes were not fully funded. You want to talk about soccer for a change, here you go.

XOXOXO


----------



## Kicker4Life

soccersc said:


> Got it!! So let me get this straight...you used to post and nobody agreed with you, and you felt like you were being mocked....So you couldn’t handle people disagreeing and not seeing your side and instead of being okay with that, you decided to start mocking everyone and putting them down instead. Wow, what good character.
> 
> Were you the last one picked on the playground so you still hold it against those that play sports or whose kids play sports?


No....he was always rude and condescending.


----------



## EOTL

Kicker4Life said:


> No....he was always rude and condescending.


There is some truth to that, but it takes one to know one.  Are you still upset that I went Eliot Ness on your precious GDA Mafia?


----------



## crush

Does anyone else besides you know who know if the top Quake players got free rides.  It amazes me how many people are a big shhhhhhhhhhhhh on this subject.  Who cares.  I see it as a promise that the boys made to the girls back before they got off the ground.  Fully funded like da boys.  Three age bands only.  No hs.  So if you could hang playing up with the 03s and offered a free spot because your kid is good, you went for that.  Then they changed the rules.  Those fools who change the rules when it looks bad you.  I get it.


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> Does anyone else besides you know who know if the top Quake players got free rides.  It amazes me how many people are a big shhhhhhhhhhhhh on this subject.  Who cares.  I see it as a promise that the boys made to the girls back before they got off the ground.  Fully funded like da boys.  Three age bands only.  No hs.  So if you could hang playing up with the 03s and offered a free spot because your kid is good, you went for that.  Then they changed the rules.  Those fools who change the rules when it looks bad you.  I get it.


Oh come on. It’s ok to just call me Voldemort. 

So you ask me to talk about soccer, but then you don’t want me to talk about soccer?


----------



## MacDre

crush said:


> Does anyone else besides you know who know if the top Quake players got free rides.  It amazes me how many people are a big shhhhhhhhhhhhh on this subject.  Who cares.  I see it as a promise that the boys made to the girls back before they got off the ground.  Fully funded like da boys.  Three age bands only.  No hs.  So if you could hang playing up with the 03s and offered a free spot because your kid is good, you went for that.  Then they changed the rules.  Those fools who change the rules when it looks bad you.  I get it.


My impression was that maybe some lower income girls from Salinas were paying little to nothing at Earthquakes.  I would have paid double for my kid to play at Earthquakes to support some of the low income kids.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> I get tired of people ranting about the same stuff too. I wonder why some people here don’t care that others repeatedly post the same tired nonsense, even blatantly bigoted crap, yet they only get mad when I respond? Is it because they support the bigotry or offensive commentary when it aligns with their views? Is it because they’re too chicken to stand up to them?  Either way, I don’t care. So long as people make offensive comments, so long as they refuse to accept the legitimacy of views other than their own even if they disagree with the, I’m perfectly happy to play their game right back atcha.  Most of the folks here want to behave like children, so I indulge them. I know magats aren’t accustomed to a libtard playing their game, but how many times do I need to tell people that playing nice with the trumpanzees doesn’t work because it is always one-sided.
> 
> If you want me to behave differently, you might want to ask your friends to do so also. Grace actually did that not too long ago and, go figure, I’ve laid off her ever since (more or less), other than when she has a go at me.


Kinda like Team America - world police?


----------



## Anon9

crush said:


> Does anyone else besides you know who know if the top Quake players got free rides.  It amazes me how many people are a big shhhhhhhhhhhhh on this subject.  Who cares.  I see it as a promise that the boys made to the girls back before they got off the ground.  Fully funded like da boys.  Three age bands only.  No hs.  So if you could hang playing up with the 03s and offered a free spot because your kid is good, you went for that.  Then they changed the rules.  Those fools who change the rules when it looks bad you.  I get it.


Seniors that are already committed to a school got free rides. Only them, other than players that needed financial aid.


----------



## crush

Anon9 said:


> Seniors that are already committed to a school got free rides. Only them, other than players that needed financial aid.


Thanks.  It's none of my business.  I just wanted to make sure my dd wasnt the only one getting free ride offers back in the day for the soon to be fully funded GDA.  I must have been the only dad pitched that by 5 socal Docs.  I guess I should feel even more proud of her accomplishments.  Any who, I will slowly go away because we now have some fairness and kids can play club and hs soccer and that's all I really wanted Anon.  I know me to be crazy sometimes.


----------



## met61

dad4 said:


> There were a couple on the right who got called out, but they mostly got themselves banned.
> 
> I think it mostly just reflects the national mood.  You have a few principled conservatives, like Cheney and Romney.  But they get drowned out by tribalism.
> 
> How do you not bust a gut laughing at the idea that Cheney is a RINO?  It's like saying Bernie is a hawk.
> 
> Same happens on the left.  You have to be extremely careful with your wording if you want to think any more deeply than blaming "systemic racism" for everything under the sun.
> 
> So people take the safe path.  It just leads nowhere.


Romney Republicans:


----------



## dad4

met61 said:


> Romney Republicans:


Suit yourself.

Plenty of us liked Romney, McCain, Bush, Dole, and Reagan.

If you want us to help elect Harris in four years, just keep it up.  All you have to do is nominate the twitter man child, and we'll vote Democrat again.


----------



## met61

dad4 said:


> Suit yourself.
> 
> Plenty of us liked Romney, McCain, Bush, Dole, and Reagan.
> 
> If you want us to help elect Harris in four years, just keep it up.  All you have to do is nominate the twitter man child, and we'll vote Democrat again.


You sound like a 12 year old...does Daddy know your using his account?


----------



## NorCalDad

met61 said:


> Romney Republicans:
> View attachment 10092


Real talk with @met61 

Bringing the issues front and center.


----------



## dad4

met61 said:


> You sound like a 12 year old...does Daddy know your using his account?


Yeah, you got me. 

We 12 year olds are big Reagan fans.  My little brother disagrees; he has almost worn out his AuH2O t-shirt.

By the way, my English teacher says to use "you're" when you mean "you are".  I lose points on my paper if I write it the way you did.

Are you in 6th grade, too?  Hope you get the hang of contractions.  They can be tricky.


----------



## NorCalDad

met61 said:


> You sound like a 12 year old...does Daddy know your using his account?


lame


----------



## met61

dad4 said:


> Yeah, you got me.
> 
> We 12 year olds are big Reagan fans.  My little brother disagrees; he has almost worn out his AuH2O t-shirt.
> 
> By the way, my English teacher says to use "you're" when you mean "you are".  I lose points on my paper if I write it the way you did.
> 
> Are you in 6th grade, too?  Hope you get the hang of contractions.  They can be tricky.


Yeah, you got me.

Nothing like grammar policing forums, it is won of the last vestiges of a losing argument.

I provided an error to pounce on Professor, so you can sleep tonight.

We 6th graders follow Reagan's 11th, as do our opponents.


----------



## met61

NorCalDad said:


> lame


original.


----------



## NorCalDad

met61 said:


> original.


lame


----------



## met61

NorCalDad said:


> Real talk with @met61
> 
> Bringing the issues front and center.


lame


----------



## dad4

met61 said:


> Yeah, you got me.
> 
> Nothing like grammar policing forums, it is won of the last vestiges of a losing argument.
> 
> I provided an error to pounce on Professor, so you can sleep tonight.
> 
> We 6th graders follow Reagan's 11th, as do our opponents.


I am not a believer in the 11th commandment; I am no longer a Republican.

As a wise man once said, I did not leave my party;  my party left me.

Enjoy winning your primaries.


----------



## NorCalDad

met61 said:


> lame


lame


----------



## met61

dad4 said:


> I am not a believer in the 11th commandment; I am no longer a Republican.
> 
> As a wise man once said, I did not leave my party;  my party left me.
> 
> Enjoy winning your primaries.


Good riddance. I hear The Lincoln Project has openings, I'm sure it is your cup of tea *bag*


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> Suit yourself.
> 
> Plenty of us liked Romney, McCain, Bush, Dole, and Reagan.
> 
> If you want us to help elect Harris in four years, just keep it up.  All you have to do is nominate the twitter man child, and we'll vote Democrat again.


...now that's "principled conservatism"


----------



## crush

I know this is off topic, but USL is starting today.  Soccer rules!!!


----------



## dad4

MicPaPa said:


> ...now that's "principled conservatism"


It is.  

What you are thinking of is called tribalism.

It is a question how you order person, country, party, and democracy.

For me, person < party < country < democracy.

For you, it seems you have the order reversed.


----------



## crush

dad4 said:


> It is.
> 
> What you are thinking of is called tribalism.
> 
> It is a question how you order person, country, party, and democracy.
> 
> For me, person < party < country < democracy.
> 
> For you, it seems you have the order reversed.


For me it's Soccer, go pro, travel, play soccer, retire, travel and teach.  Go to beach and lay around and surf, spear fish, surf some more.  Go sking and then travel


----------



## espola

dad4 said:


> It is.
> 
> What you are thinking of is called tribalism.
> 
> It is a question how you order person, country, party, and democracy.
> 
> For me, person < party < country < democracy.
> 
> For you, it seems you have the order reversed.


Why does party matter?


----------



## kickingandscreaming

espola said:


> Why does party matter?


How can you ask this question after a week of work? You must be retired.


----------



## crush

espola said:


> Why does party matter?


USL score update.  3-2 in a close one.  ZZ got a pass from YY and YY hit BB for the Gooooooooaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> It is.
> 
> What you are thinking of is called tribalism.
> 
> It is a question how you order person, country, party, and democracy.
> 
> For me, person < party < country < democracy.
> 
> For you, it seems you have the order reversed.


I just note you don’t have god or family in there. Also we aren’t a democracy but a republic and even the ancients understood that a democracy does not equal liberty since a democracy can without check turn into mob rule and the oppression of a minority

our family motto is: “God, country, family, service”. It’s inscribed in the crests hanging in the boys room.


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> It is.
> 
> What you are thinking of is called tribalism.
> 
> It is a question how you order person, country, party, and democracy.
> 
> For me, person < party < country < democracy.
> 
> For you, it seems you have the order reversed.


FWIW...party not on my list, I'm an Independent

For you, voted for a "democratic socialist",  leftist, Marxist agenda.

For me, Never!

For all "tribalist", SEE BELOW:


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> I just note you don’t have god or family in there. Also we aren’t a democracy but a republic and even the ancients understood that a democracy does not equal liberty since a democracy can without check turn into mob rule and the oppression of a minority
> 
> our family motto is: “God, country, family, service”. It’s inscribed in the crests hanging in the boys room.


 The old pedantic democracy/republic thing again?

Most words have multiple meanings.  I thought it was clear that I was using the generic definition of democracy meaning any system of self-rule, not the narrower definition meaning a direct vote on every issue.

Putting God in the list leads to bits of nastiness like the 30 years war.  Count me as not a fan.


----------



## MicPaPa

Grace T. said:


> I just note you don’t have god or family in there. Also we aren’t a democracy but a republic and even the ancients understood that a democracy does not equal liberty since a democracy can without check turn into mob rule and the oppression of a minority
> 
> our family motto is: “God, country, family, service”. It’s inscribed in the crests hanging in the boys room.


Exactly, I noticed God and family (especially a traditional one) never make the list on the left.


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> The old pedantic democracy/republic thing again?
> 
> Most words have multiple meanings.  I thought it was clear that I was using the generic definition of democracy meaning any system of self-rule, not the narrower definition meaning a direct vote on every issue.
> 
> Putting God in the list leads to bits of nastiness like the 30 years war.  Count me as not a fan.


...more "principled conservatism"


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> The old pedantic democracy/republic thing again?
> 
> Most words have multiple meanings.  I thought it was clear that I was using the generic definition of democracy meaning any system of self-rule, not the narrower definition meaning a direct vote on every issue.
> 
> Putting God in the list leads to bits of nastiness like the 30 years war.  Count me as not a fan.


Well I’d sooner put the constitution over any ideas of self rule.  The south in the civil war was all about self rule...didn’t make them right


----------



## dad4

MicPaPa said:


> Exactly, I noticed God and family (especially a traditional one) never make the list on the left.


Wonderful.  Now list some of the religious wars in the 200 years preceding 1776. 

There is a very good reason to leave God off the list.


----------



## Grace T.

MicPaPa said:


> Exactly, I noticed God and family (especially a traditional one) never make the list on the left.


my family isn’t a particularly traditional one.  I’m the Lorelei Gilmore of the clan

and I’d taking an AA higher being in lieu of God.  Just a notion that basic morality trumps (hah bad pun) even notions of the state (the nazis and their genocide orders), the constitution (the 3/5ths thing and slavery) and democracy/self-rule (the south during segregation). That ultimately we have a responsibility to do what’s right, with the humility that people often gets “what’s right” wrong.


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> my family isn’t a particularly traditional one.  I’m the Lorelei Gilmore of the clan
> 
> and I’d taking an AA higher being in lieu of God.  Just a notion that basic morality trumps (hah bad pun) even notions of the state (the nazis and their genocide orders), the constitution (the 3/5ths thing and slavery) and democracy/self-rule (the south during segregation). That ultimately we have a responsibility to do what’s right, with the humility that people often gets “what’s right” wrong.


Agree on the first two.

The South's claim to self rule was philosophical Swiss cheese.  It relies on saying some people do not have a self.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> I just note you don’t have god or family in there. Also we aren’t a democracy but a republic and even the ancients understood that a democracy does not equal liberty since a democracy can without check turn into mob rule and the oppression of a minority
> 
> our family motto is: “God, country, family, service”. It’s inscribed in the crests hanging in the boys room.


Our republic is a democracy.  I am surprised that any person with any pretense of legal training does not understand that.


----------



## espola

kickingandscreaming said:


> How can you ask this question after a week of work? You must be retired.


You didn't answer the question.


----------



## espola

dad4 said:


> Wonderful.  Now list some of the religious wars in the 200 years preceding 1776.
> 
> There is a very good reason to leave God off the list.


The  First Amendment plays it both ways -- you are free to practice your religion, but you are not free to impose your religion on me.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Our republic is a democracy.  I am surprised that any person with any pretense of legal training does not understand that.


no it’s not. In a democracy the citizens directly vote for the issues.  In a republic you vote for your reps. Plus in ours the reps are constrained by federalism, the courts, the bill of rights. For a smart guy you sometimes are awfully dumb. Oh I forgot...Magoo.


----------



## crush

Grace T. said:


> I just note you don’t have god or family in there. Also we aren’t a democracy but a republic and even the ancients understood that a democracy does not equal liberty since a democracy can without check turn into mob rule and the oppression of a minority
> 
> our family motto is: “God, country, family, service”. It’s inscribed in the crests hanging in the boys room.


God, family and then soccer Grace.  Lots of USL going on today all over socal Gracie.  I was down in Laguna Niguel again this morning and sure enough, all the adult males are playing soccer again at the park.  No Copes or health officials saying a word.  These are just Americans enjoying some exercise.  It sucks my dd can;t play a legal match here in socal.


----------



## crush

espola said:


> The  First Amendment plays it both ways -- you are free to practice your religion, but you are not free to impose your religion on me.


USL final.  1-0.  HH the GK made 10 saves.  GG got fouled in the box and the parents went ape sh*t Espola.  TT made her PK and the other team lost.  It was heart break city for the player who made the foul.  One side of parents thought the player faked her foul and should be kicked out with a red card.  The other half thought it was a foul.  I just saw the replay on the play and the defender clipped the smaller player who was faster.  Good call by the ref


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> no it’s not. In a democracy the citizens directly vote for the issues.  In a republic you vote for your reps. Plus in ours the reps are constrained by federalism, the courts, the bill of rights. For a smart guy you sometimes are awfully dumb. Oh I forgot...Magoo.


Democracy -- "a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives."

Source -- Oxford Languages


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Democracy -- "a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives."
> 
> Source -- Oxford Languages


that’s funny. Gov 101 teaches the difference between the 2.  Looks like there’s a hole in your education


----------



## crush

espola said:


> Democracy -- "a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives."
> 
> Source -- Oxford Languages


Another update from USL U9 game in the IE.  14-1, need I say more.  Recruiters were there from some new ECNL clubs looking for the next Mia. Parents from the winning team were shielding their star players parents from the grey hair guy and the other clubs coaches looking to build their club at the youth level.  It makes sense to me and I would be out there scouting too.  Well guess what, one of them got to the mom in the parking lot and told her how amazing her player was and in fact, she was too good to score 7 goals in 10 minutes because that doesnt happen in real soccer where everyone is faster or as fast and quick and taller and smarter and in better condition and this is how the cream rises to the top in pure soccer cream language.  Anyway Espola, mom and dad have a meet up this week and their being offered free everything.  No club fees, no uniform fees, no team fees, free shoes, air travel paid for and get this, per diam for food and shopping when on the road.


----------



## crush

Grace T. said:


> that’s funny. Gov 101 teaches the difference between the 2.  Looks like there’s a hole in your education


Grace, any USL scores up in Ventura?


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> that’s funny. Gov 101 teaches the difference between the 2.  Looks like there’s a hole in your education


My education taught that there are many flavors of democracy, including the one we enjoy in our republic.


----------



## crush

espola said:


> My education taught that there are many flavors of democracy, including the one we enjoy in our republic.


My education was insane.  You remember Kojak?  Who loves you, baby?  Well, his brother was my speech therapist all through grade school.  I told you before and I will tell you again, i could not speak or read at to save the life of me.  Oral reports or reading books out loud was manatory.  No escape unless I tell them I feel sick or have to go #2 and will be a long time in the stall.  I got out of it most of the time but not showing up to school or lying.  I mean that bro.  However, the teachers were told to force me to speak and stand in front of the class as they all laughed at me because I, I, I, ,I eye, eye, coo, coo, coo, say roster without saying freaking woo woo woo woster.  Talk about things to over come as a youth.  They forced me to publicly speak when i had a handicap dude.  It's really like asking someone to walk in front of the class with legs.  Anyway, Kojak's bro helped me through some of my most darkest of times as a youth.  I had so much revenge and pay back in my blood that I got in trouble for lashing out at the nerds in class who laughed at me.  This all happen outside and on the playground where kids took care of real business.  Inside, i was a big moron and idiot.  Melvins, pink bellys, trash cans, run past you all day, score on you, make sure your picked last as we all laugh at you.  Hahahahaha.  Kids will be kids and I'm sorry for how I handled my revenge. I was ADDDDHHDDSTFU and needed special help and back then, no one could help me except the Lord himself.  PM me Espy and I'll fill you in.  Most cant handle what I hear and see.  I was told I was a dumb mute and will fail.  Disruptive in class, speaks out of turn and just did naught stuff.  Made teachers earn their money.  We need a whole new system to help ALL kids learn.  Rich, poor and all in between.  Each baby born and each child needs to be protected and educated in a custom way that is just for that child and their brain.


----------



## Grace T.

crush said:


> Grace, any USL scores up in Ventura?


Oh crush. You and your soccer


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> My education taught that there are many flavors of democracy, including the one we enjoy in our republic.


you pulled another magoo by using a colloquial definition when dad and I were having a discussion re political philosophies. Pat on the head. Now run along....your car’s over there.


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> you pulled another magoo by using a colloquial definition when dad and I were having a discussion re political philosophies. Pat on the head. Now run along....your car’s over there.


Your magoo tell is showing again.


----------



## Grace T.

As is your legal stuff which you led off with....


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> As is your legal stuff which you led off with....


By "led  off" do you mean the point where I attempted to correct your error about republic vs. democracy in our government?


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> By "led  off" do you mean the point where I attempted to correct your error about republic vs. democracy in our government?


When you choose to go off the road at least you commit to it!


----------



## espola

Grace T. said:


> When you choose to go off the road at least you commit to it!


Does your avoidance of the question indicate your submission to my viewpoint?


----------



## kickingandscreaming

espola said:


> You didn't answer the question.


Check out the first definition  (Lexico, powered by Oxford, since you seem to like them)

*party1*
*Pronunciation /ˈpärdē/ /ˈpɑrdi/ *
See synonyms for party
Translate party into Spanish
*NOUNparties*


1A social gathering of invited guests, typically involving eating, drinking, and entertainment.
_‘an engagement party’_
More example sentences
Synonyms
2A formally constituted political group, typically operating on a national basis, that contests elections and attempts to form or take part in a government.
_‘the party's conservative mainstream’_


----------



## espola

kickingandscreaming said:


> Check out the first definition  (Lexico, powered by Oxford, since you seem to like them)
> 
> *party1*
> *Pronunciation /ˈpärdē/ /ˈpɑrdi/ *
> See synonyms for party
> Translate party into Spanish
> *NOUNparties*
> 
> 
> 1A social gathering of invited guests, typically involving eating, drinking, and entertainment.
> _‘an engagement party’_
> More example sentences
> Synonyms
> 2A formally constituted political group, typically operating on a national basis, that contests elections and attempts to form or take part in a government.
> _‘the party's conservative mainstream’_


Perhaps you misunderstood my question, so let me elaborate - why do you include the word "party" in your hierarchy at all?


----------



## dad4

espola said:


> Perhaps you misunderstood my question, so let me elaborate - why do you include the word "party" in your hierarchy at all?


My hierarchy, I think.

For governance questions in modern democracies, a party represents a group of people with a similar philosophy working towards a common set of policy goals.  

That common set of goals is important.  You can argue whether the parties of today actually keep to their own principles.  At the moment, I’d have to say that, this year, the Dems more or less do and the Reps more or less do not.


----------



## espola

dad4 said:


> My hierarchy, I think.
> 
> For governance questions in modern democracies, a party represents a group of people with a similar philosophy working towards a common set of policy goals.
> 
> That common set of goals is important.  You can argue whether the parties of today actually keep to their own principles.  At the moment, I’d have to say that, this year, the Dems more or less do and the Reps more or less do not.


I have said this before -- I was a Republican until I figured out they were crooks, then a Democrat until I figured out they were fools, and a Libertarian until I figured out they were hypocrites.  Now I generally don't bother about a person's party allegiance except in some cases where  I am attempting to understand their motivation for a particular position.


----------



## dad4

espola said:


> I have said this before -- I was a Republican until I figured out they were crooks, then a Democrat until I figured out they were fools, and a Libertarian until I figured out they were hypocrites.  Now I generally don't bother about a person's party allegiance except in some cases where  I am attempting to understand their motivation for a particular position.


Kind of simplistic.  Where do Eddie Edwards and Rod Blagojevich fit into your story?  Democrats, but crooks.

And plenty of hypocrisy exists in the top two parties.  How many Democrats support increasing tax deductions for rich people in blue states?  How many law and order Republicans just voted to acquit a man who instigated a riot?


----------



## espola

dad4 said:


> Kind of simplistic.  Where do Eddie Edwards and Rod Blagojevich fit into your story?  Democrats, but crooks.
> 
> And plenty of hypocrisy exists in the top two parties.  How many Democrats support increasing tax deductions for rich people in blue states?  How many law and order Republicans just voted to acquit a man who instigated a riot?


By the time they came along, I wasn't a Democrat.

I thought the Libertariansmight be a fresh breath of air, but they weren't.


----------



## Grace T.

espola said:


> Does your avoidance of the question indicate your submission to my viewpoint?


Nah it just means you are sufficiently off the road now that I can’t even see your question. Again it’s gone totally beyond you


----------



## MicPaPa

US is best described as a constitutional republic - primarily local decisions made by democratic processes and sum state and most federal decisions bye democratically elected representatives.

Note: Professor, I left a few grammar nuggets so you can beat-your-gills for all to see.


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> Wonderful.  Now list some of the religious wars in the 200 years preceding 1776.
> 
> There is a very good reason to leave God off the list.


America is a majority Christian nation, founded on Judeo Christian principles, and never fought religious wars. 

Oh wait, a 1619 truther, right?


----------



## MicPaPa

met61 said:


> Romney Republicans:
> View attachment 10092


LOL! please forward me a copy of this pic.


----------



## MicPaPa

Grace T. said:


> my family isn’t a particularly traditional one.  I’m the Lorelei Gilmore of the clan
> 
> and I’d taking an AA higher being in lieu of God.  Just a notion that basic morality trumps (hah bad pun) even notions of the state (the nazis and their genocide orders), the constitution (the 3/5ths thing and slavery) and democracy/self-rule (the south during segregation). That ultimately we have a responsibility to do what’s right, with the humility that people often gets “what’s right” wrong.


I have no issue with living your best life, key word being "your"... it's freedom and liberty. Unfortunately, they are currently under attack by the left...it's a matter of Right vs. Wrong and must be pushed back. Yet, these party purist have been completely mentally and morally broken by DT, thus failing to see the gains and ushering in serious damage for the next four years. It was always bigger than DT, he was just the much needed spark. The left is playing for keeps, not a time for weakness.


----------



## dad4

MicPaPa said:


> America is a majority Christian nation, founded on Judeo Christian principles, and never fought religious wars.
> 
> Oh wait, a 1619 truther, right?


1619?  Nah.

Prof Dad says that the whole 1619 project is at best misnamed and at worst dishonest.

The people on that boat were enslaved in Africa, sold to Portuguese traders, captured by English pirates, and sold in Virginia as indentured servants.  The Virginia sale was a step up in an otherwise wretched story.

Virginia didn't even have slavery until decades later, when a black man named Anthony Johnson misused the courts to enslave a black indentured servant named John Casor.  Casor was assisted in his appeals by a white farmer named Robert Parker.  A second white farmer also testified on Casor's behalf.  They failed.

Of course, that history didn't actually fit the NYT narrative.  So they went with 1619 instead of 1655 or 1661.


----------



## MicPaPa

dad4 said:


> 1619?  Nah.
> 
> Prof Dad says that the whole 1619 project is at best misnamed and at worst dishonest.
> 
> The people on that boat were enslaved in Africa, sold to Portuguese traders, captured by English pirates, and sold in Virginia as indentured servants.  The Virginia sale was a step up in an otherwise wretched story.
> 
> Virginia didn't even have slavery until decades later, when a black man named Anthony Johnson misused the courts to enslave a black indentured servant named John Casor.  Casor was assisted in his appeals by a white farmer named Robert Parker.  A second white farmer also testified on Casor's behalf.  They failed.
> 
> Of course, that history didn't actually fit the NYT narrative.  So they went with 1619 instead of 1655 or 1661.


Well done! There you go, we agree on something. Good night.


----------



## crush

espola said:


> By the time they came along, I wasn't a Democrat.
> 
> I thought the Libertariansmight be a fresh breath of air, but they weren't.


I learned to be an American first and then love each other.  Dont pick a side bro, trust me.  Be a good human and treat kids right and all should go well with your soul.


----------



## nextgenathletics

This whole notion that democrats are the party of morality but are just stupid...is in and of itself, moronic. 

The democrat establishment is evil on the surface, underneath the hood and within each nook and cranny. No, they aren't fools...they are intentional. 

Period. 

That being said, Republicans are no better.


----------



## espola

dad4 said:


> 1619?  Nah.
> 
> Prof Dad says that the whole 1619 project is at best misnamed and at worst dishonest.
> 
> The people on that boat were enslaved in Africa, sold to Portuguese traders, captured by English pirates, and sold in Virginia as indentured servants.  The Virginia sale was a step up in an otherwise wretched story.
> 
> Virginia didn't even have slavery until decades later, when a black man named Anthony Johnson misused the courts to enslave a black indentured servant named John Casor.  Casor was assisted in his appeals by a white farmer named Robert Parker.  A second white farmer also testified on Casor's behalf.  They failed.
> 
> Of course, that history didn't actually fit the NYT narrative.  So they went with 1619 instead of 1655 or 1661.











						Where the Landing of the First Africans in English North America Really Fits in the History of Slavery
					

It was in 1619, "about the latter end of August," that an English privateer ship reached Point Comfort on the Virginia peninsula—and changed history




					time.com


----------



## EOTL

espola said:


> Our republic is a democracy.  I am surprised that any person with any pretense of legal training does not understand that.


Well, it is only a pretense after all.


----------



## MARsSPEED

And the Flu takes the win!

2019 Flu Deaths Ages 0-17
*434*
[link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]

2020-2021 Current CoVid Deaths Ages 0-17
*204*
[link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]

2020-2021 Flu and CoVid Deaths Combined Ages 0-17
*382*
[link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]

I guess we should have home schooled and played sports for the past 100 years.

I'd like to thank all of the Teachers enjoying themselves while Little Julie and Little Joey don't come to online class and are set back one or two years based on your selfishness. The reason why Little Julie and Little Joey don't have any responsibility is because there parents are either doctors, nurses, policemen or may be even working at the grocery store. Funny thing is, since my kids do attend online class and are intelligent, they ask me that very question. "Why are we not at school when all of these other people are working?"


----------



## Desert Hound

MARsSPEED said:


> And the Flu takes the win!
> 
> 2019 Flu Deaths Ages 0-17
> *434*
> [link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]
> 
> 2020-2021 Current CoVid Deaths Ages 0-17
> *204*
> [link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]
> 
> 2020-2021 Flu and CoVid Deaths Combined Ages 0-17
> *382*
> [link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]
> 
> I guess we should have home schooled and played sports for the past 100 years.
> 
> I'd like to thank all of the Teachers enjoying themselves while Little Julie and Little Joey don't come to online class and are set back one or two years based on your selfishness. The reason why Little Julie and Little Joey don't have any responsibility is because there parents are either doctors, nurses, policemen or may be even working at the grocery store. Funny thing is, since my kids do attend online class and are intelligent, they ask me that very question. "Why are we not at school when all of these other people are working?"


Yes the data has been out for a long time. 

Young people essentially have ZERO risk. 

We know that. It is frustrating to know that and then hear these people about schools not safe, youth sports not safe, what if a kid catches, it, etc.


----------



## Kicker4Life

Desert Hound said:


> Yes the data has been out for a long time.
> 
> Young people essentially have ZERO risk.
> 
> We know that. It is frustrating to know that and then hear these people about schools not safe, youth sports not safe, what if a kid catches, it, etc.


Even the President has said this about on a CNN townhall....yet here we are.


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> And the Flu takes the win!
> 
> 2019 Flu Deaths Ages 0-17
> *434*
> [link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]
> 
> 2020-2021 Current CoVid Deaths Ages 0-17
> *204*
> [link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]
> 
> 2020-2021 Flu and CoVid Deaths Combined Ages 0-17
> *382*
> [link to www.cdc.gov (secure)]
> 
> I guess we should have home schooled and played sports for the past 100 years.
> 
> I'd like to thank all of the Teachers enjoying themselves while Little Julie and Little Joey don't come to online class and are set back one or two years based on your selfishness. The reason why Little Julie and Little Joey don't have any responsibility is because there parents are either doctors, nurses, policemen or may be even working at the grocery store. Funny thing is, since my kids do attend online class and are intelligent, they ask me that very question. "Why are we not at school when all of these other people are working?"


More than half a million Americans have died from Covid-19.  Teachers and staff at schools are not 0-17 years of age. The health care providers needed to treat those with Covid are not 0-17. The parents of the kids in school are not 0-17. Accusing teachers of being lazy and selfish is utter bs. Your moronic magat point of view is all the more reason they need to be cautious and continue teaching remotely until there is no longer a risk.  If anyone is being selfish, it’s the person demanding that others put themselves at risk, because you’re too lazy and inept to make up for the educational gaps caused by covid. The American Way. Make everyone else do the heavy lifting because you’re too lazy and refuse to take responsibility for your own children. 

Dumbf**kery must be genetic. Ask your moronic spawn whether it is possible to undergo surgery remotely? Whether law enforcement can respond to emergencies by zoom? Whether the fire department can put out fires  from their home office? Ask your magat children what they have done to make up for the gaps caused by remote learning, or are they just lazy s**ts? Ask them whether healthcare providers have been moving to remote visits when it is feasible to do so?


----------



## MARsSPEED

EOTL said:


> More than half a million Americans have died from Covid-19.  Teachers and staff at schools are not 0-17 years of age. The health care providers needed to treat those with Covid are not 0-17. The parents of the kids in school are not 0-17. Accusing teachers of being lazy and selfish is utter bs. Your moronic magat point of view is all the more reason they need to be cautious and continue teaching remotely until there is no longer a risk.  If anyone is being selfish, it’s the person demanding that others put themselves at risk, because you’re too lazy and inept to make up for the educational gaps caused by covid. The American Way. Make everyone else do the heavy lifting because you’re too lazy and refuse to take responsibility for your own children.
> 
> Dumbf**kery must be genetic. Ask your moronic spawn whether it is possible to undergo surgery remotely? Whether law enforcement can respond to emergencies by zoom? Whether the fire department can put out fires  from their home office? Ask your magat children what they have done to make up for the gaps caused by remote learning, or are they just lazy s**ts? Ask them whether healthcare providers have been moving to remote visits when it is feasible to do so?


All I hear is "Blah, blah, blah, I'm a dirty Trans, uh, I mean Tramp"


----------



## MARsSPEED

EOTL said:


> More than half a million Americans have died from Covid-19.  Teachers and staff at schools are not 0-17 years of age. The health care providers needed to treat those with Covid are not 0-17. The parents of the kids in school are not 0-17. Accusing teachers of being lazy and selfish is utter bs. Your moronic magat point of view is all the more reason they need to be cautious and continue teaching remotely until there is no longer a risk.  If anyone is being selfish, it’s the person demanding that others put themselves at risk, because you’re too lazy and inept to make up for the educational gaps caused by covid. The American Way. Make everyone else do the heavy lifting because you’re too lazy and refuse to take responsibility for your own children.
> 
> Dumbf**kery must be genetic. Ask your moronic spawn whether it is possible to undergo surgery remotely? Whether law enforcement can respond to emergencies by zoom? Whether the fire department can put out fires  from their home office? Ask your magat children what they have done to make up for the gaps caused by remote learning, or are they just lazy s**ts? Ask them whether healthcare providers have been moving to remote visits when it is feasible to do so?


Just read this again and the fact you mentioned my “moronic spawn” did actually catch my eye. My moronic spawn is a straight A student, a 6th grader currently in 8th grade AP classes and has already been asked to join the international baccalaureate program. Currently I am watching her in small group training with one of the Nations Top Skills trainers who also trains USWNT players and top MLS players. And no, he doesn’t take just anybody, you must be invited.

Not bad for a irresponsible lazy magat parents who risk themselves everyday.

Good Day Sir.


----------



## Grace T.

MARsSPEED said:


> Just read this again and the fact you mentioned my “moronic spawn” did actually catch my eye. My moronic spawn is a straight A student, a 6th grader currently in 8th grade AP classes and has already been asked to join the international baccalaureate program. Currently I am watching her in small group training with one of the Nations Top Skills trainers who also trains USWNT players and top MLS players. And no, he doesn’t take just anybody, you must be invited.
> 
> Not bad for a irresponsible lazy magat parents who risk themselves everyday.
> 
> Good Day Sir.


He gets a kick out of attacking people's kids.  Lovely human being.


----------



## espola

MARsSPEED said:


> Just read this again and the fact you mentioned my “moronic spawn” did actually catch my eye. My moronic spawn is a straight A student, a 6th grader currently in 8th grade AP classes and has already been asked to join the international baccalaureate program. Currently I am watching her in small group training with one of the Nations Top Skills trainers who also trains USWNT players and top MLS players. And no, he doesn’t take just anybody, you must be invited.
> 
> Not bad for a irresponsible lazy magat parents who risk themselves everyday.
> 
> Good Day Sir.


"8th grade AP classes"?  I didn't know there was such a thing. What topic?

And congratulations to all those 8th graders doing college work.


----------



## MARsSPEED

espola said:


> "8th grade AP classes"?  I didn't know there was such a thing. What topic?
> 
> And congratulations to all those 8th graders doing college work.


My bad. “Honors” classes. I was never a Straight A student and chose to play basketball every waking hour instead. I did have irresponsible parents which is why I put such a high value on education. Basketball got me into college but my poor education got me out of basketball and college...


----------



## EOTL

MARsSPEED said:


> Just read this again and the fact you mentioned my “moronic spawn” did actually catch my eye. My moronic spawn is a straight A student, a 6th grader currently in 8th grade AP classes and has already been asked to join the international baccalaureate program. Currently I am watching her in small group training with one of the Nations Top Skills trainers who also trains USWNT players and top MLS players. And no, he doesn’t take just anybody, you must be invited.
> 
> Not bad for a irresponsible lazy magat parents who risk themselves everyday.
> 
> Good Day Sir.


Gosh, it sounds like kids aren’t being set back two years by lazy selfish teachers after all. It sounds like you’re just making s**t up. Apparently kids can keep up with remote schooling AND teachers and staff get to stay alive. Sounds like a win/win to me.

So, have your brilliant kids figured out how to put out fires by zoom yet?  Self-deliver babies? Undergo surgery?


----------



## Zeke

espola said:


> "8th grade AP classes"?  I didn't know there was such a thing. What topic?
> 
> And congratulations to all those 8th graders doing college work.


Oh, 8th graders in AP exist.  More often they take JC versions.  You'll also find a few who take a college class directly at that age.  

"No 8th graders can handle college work" is kind of like saying "no 12 year old can curve a corner kick into the goal".  There's always that one kid who does it.


----------



## MARsSPEED

EOTL said:


> Gosh, it sounds like kids aren’t being set back two years by lazy selfish teachers after all. It sounds like you’re just making s**t up. Apparently kids can keep up with remote schooling AND teachers and staff get to stay alive. Sounds like a win/win to me.
> 
> So, have your brilliant kids figured out how to put out fires by zoom yet?  Self-deliver babies? Undergo surgery?


I’m not here to hold your hand just like thousands of parents aren’t home to hold their kids hands or tell them to get on their Chromebook (if they can afford it) or the single moms who can’t watch over their kids either because they are working three jobs.

The facts are out there about virtual learning. Again, I don't have to hold your hand.

No need to debate or argue with Radicals. Its a waste of time.

Goodnight Sir!


----------



## espola

Zeke said:


> Oh, 8th graders in AP exist.  More often they take JC versions.  You'll also find a few who take a college class directly at that age.
> 
> "No 8th graders can handle college work" is kind of like saying "no 12 year old can curve a corner kick into the goal".  There's always that one kid who does it.


I believe there are 8th graders who can handle college work.  I only pointed out that I had never heard of an AP course for 8th graders, at least not in the traditional sense of Advanced Placement courses that can be used or college credit, and administered under the College Board AP program with specific course material and nationwide uniform testing.

I attended a 6-year Junior-Senior high school, so 8th graders good at math could take the usual 9th-grade math course.  It wasn't called AP-anything, just Algebra I.

I'm not sure what a "JC version" is.  First-year classes at a JC and a UC are in many respects equivalent, as can be observed in the cases of students who study two years at a JC and then transfer to UC schools with Junior-class status.


----------



## soccersc

EOTL said:


> Gosh, it sounds like kids aren’t being set back two years by lazy selfish teachers after all. It sounds like you’re just making s**t up. Apparently kids can keep up with remote schooling AND teachers and staff get to stay alive. Sounds like a win/win to me.
> 
> So, have your brilliant kids figured out how to put out fires by zoom yet?  Self-deliver babies? Undergo surgery?


You really have no clue. You say you won’t talk about your kids, that’s because you don’t have any.  It is very clear you have no kids by the ludicrous comments you make that show you have no idea. You don’t know how zoom classes are working or if hybrid learning actually works. You only know conceptually, you’ve never even seen it...so how can you even comment or argue with someone who has a kid that is actually doing it. So stupid!! It actually makes me laugh how little you actually know compared to how much you think you know! Smart guy...kids that are successful in school right now are the ones that have parents that actually parent and make sure their kid keeps up on their work, parents that don’t, their kids fail, simple. Of course there are a few outliers that figure it out on their own, but they are few and far between. There is a reason Newsom sent his kids to a school that only does in person learning, it’s because it’s the only way that works!


----------



## kickingandscreaming

soccersc said:


> It actually makes me laugh how little you actually know compared to how much you think you know!


Yes, that alias and the various other ones he has regularly violate the First Law of Dirty Harry, "A man's gotta know his limitations."

It's a shame online boards can't limit individuals to one alias. We'd see that there really aren't as many angry, broken little trolls as it appears.


----------



## crush

kickingandscreaming said:


> Yes, that alias and the various other ones he has regularly violate the First Law of Dirty Harry, "A man's gotta know his limitations."
> 
> It's a shame online boards can't limit individuals to one alias. We'd see that there really aren't as many angry, broken little trolls as it appears.


He has at least 4 avatars, maybe more.  He makes fun of kids who decided to wait until senior year to make the big decision, instead of 7th grade.  It was not popular and bad for business four years ago.  He has no kids playing the game so he's a coach, just like the other coaches who use the "C" word on parents and tell parents their morons.  These same coaches find TMs and rich parents who want something more then just playing soccer game to win.  Their kind of winning is not played on the field.


----------



## notintheface

crush said:


> tell parents their morons.


_I don't even need to say anything, you moron._


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> More than half a million Americans have died from Covid-19.  Teachers and staff at schools are not 0-17 years of age. The health care providers needed to treat those with Covid are not 0-17. The parents of the kids in school are not 0-17. Accusing teachers of being lazy and selfish is utter bs. Your moronic magat point of view is all the more reason they need to be cautious and continue teaching remotely until there is no longer a risk.  If anyone is being selfish, it’s the person demanding that others put themselves at risk, because you’re too lazy and inept to make up for the educational gaps caused by covid. The American Way. Make everyone else do the heavy lifting because you’re too lazy and refuse to take responsibility for your own children.
> 
> Dumbf**kery must be genetic. Ask your moronic spawn whether it is possible to undergo surgery remotely? Whether law enforcement can respond to emergencies by zoom? Whether the fire department can put out fires  from their home office? Ask your magat children what they have done to make up for the gaps caused by remote learning, or are they just lazy s**ts? Ask them whether healthcare providers have been moving to remote visits when it is feasible to do so?


Huh? zero risk? Just wondering how zoom is working out for some kids.  I'm sure you've done your research and can provide the data on how effective zoom classes are when zoom isn't available.  I'm sure your interweb system is top notch.  I hope you are a pod leader, providing interweb access for many of these lazy ass kids.  So much winning in your world.  Your social justicing is so inspiring - I bet you are featured on a wheaties box..


----------



## met61

EOTL said:


> More than half a million Americans have died from Covid-19.  Teachers and staff at schools are not 0-17 years of age. The health care providers needed to treat those with Covid are not 0-17. The parents of the kids in school are not 0-17. Accusing teachers of being lazy and selfish is utter bs. Your moronic magat point of view is all the more reason they need to be cautious and continue teaching remotely until there is no longer a risk.  If anyone is being selfish, it’s the person demanding that others put themselves at risk, because you’re too lazy and inept to make up for the educational gaps caused by covid. The American Way. Make everyone else do the heavy lifting because you’re too lazy and refuse to take responsibility for your own children.
> 
> Dumbf**kery must be genetic. Ask your moronic spawn whether it is possible to undergo surgery remotely? Whether law enforcement can respond to emergencies by zoom? Whether the fire department can put out fires  from their home office? Ask your magat children what they have done to make up for the gaps caused by remote learning, or are they just lazy s**ts? Ask them whether healthcare providers have been moving to remote visits when it is feasible to do so?


Speaking of "dumbfuckery;" you and a gaggle of "woke" lobotomized lemmings elected a senile old dumbass as President of the free world. You may consider sitting it out, Numb Nuts!


----------



## EOTL

met61 said:


> Speaking of "dumbfuckery;" you and a gaggle of "woke" lobotomized lemmings elected a senile old dumbass as President of the free world. You may consider sitting it out, Numb Nuts!


U Dub has a bunch of kneelers. Thought you should know.


----------



## crush

*Newsom sued by California students over indoor high school sports restrictions*
*'I’ve been working hard all this quarantine and then we just keep getting canceled,' a student said*


----------



## crush

*Coronavirus: As of March 1, hospitalizations in Orange County down 81%, 14-day cases down 91% from their highs*


----------



## tjinaz

Well looks like its happening...

Newsom going to be recalled for general incompetence.

Petition hits 1.95M signatures


----------



## kickingandscreaming

tjinaz said:


> Well looks like its happening...
> 
> Newsom going to be recalled for general incompetence.
> 
> Petition hits 1.95M signatures


Is Schwarzenegger available? Total Recall Meets Back to the Future.


----------



## Bruddah IZ

Poor California.  Second only to New Zealand in their population of sheep.


----------



## Speed

n


tjinaz said:


> Well looks like its happening...
> 
> Newsom going to be recalled for general incompetence.
> 
> Petition hits 1.95M signatures


not general incompetence but major incompetence


----------



## WestOfFive

Speed said:


> n
> 
> not general incompetence but major incompetence


Doesn't Newsome have a buddy in charge of counting the Recall Signatures?............................this one will be a Doozy!


----------



## EOTL

WestOfFive said:


> Doesn't Newsome have a buddy in charge of counting the Recall Signatures?............................this one will be a Doozy!


It’s never too early for magats to start making excuses for losing. Is his buddy the long dead South American dictator Hugo Chavez, who also “stole” the election from the deranged cheeto?


----------



## WestOfFive

EOTL said:


> It’s never too early for magats to start making excuses for losing. Is his buddy the long dead South American dictator Hugo Chavez, who also “stole” the election from the deranged cheeto?


I like that....


----------



## EOTL

The B.1.1.7 variant now spreading across the U.S. is the most contagious and deadly variant yet. Should we wait for peer reviewed studies to determine exactly how much more easily it can be spread on soccer fields, and more dangerous to kids, refs, coaches and parents?


----------



## Kicker4Life

EOTL said:


> The B.1.1.7 variant now spreading across the U.S. is the most contagious and deadly variant yet. Should we wait for peer reviewed studies to determine exactly how much more easily it can be spread on soccer fields, and more dangerous to kids, refs, coaches and parents?


You’re so cute....


----------



## dad4

EOTL said:


> The B.1.1.7 variant now spreading across the U.S. is the most contagious and deadly variant yet. Should we wait for peer reviewed studies to determine exactly how much more easily it can be spread on soccer fields, and more dangerous to kids, refs, coaches and parents?


On the field, it spreads about 60% to 70% more easily than not much.

As before, avoid team dinners, carpools, and out of area trips.  Wear your mask and enjoy the games.


----------



## dawson

The graph from worldometer shows new cases per day as of March 19, 2021 for the UK . B.1.1.7. which is supposed to be much more contagious then the version in the US was first discovered in Dec in the UK . The graph seems to show a significant decline in new cases over the last 2 months . UK is far from herd immunity so what accounts for this decline from a virus that is so contagious and appeared in the UK in Dec or before .


----------



## dad4

dawson said:


> The graph from worldometer shows new cases per day as of March 19, 2021 for the UK . B.1.1.7. which is supposed to be much more contagious then the version in the US was first discovered in Dec in the UK . The graph seems to show a significant decline in new cases over the last 2 months . UK is far from herd immunity so what accounts for this decline from a virus that is so contagious and appeared in the UK in Dec or before .
> 
> View attachment 10440View attachment 10440


You’re right that it is not not herd immunity.  For the last three months, UK has been taking this seriously, in a way that we have not been.

Remember Boris Johnson asking the whole country to cancel Christmas plans?  It wasn’t just Christmas.  They closed the restaurants, the pubs, the indoor gyms, and so on.   

List of what they are and are not allowing:








						Covid: What is the guidance across the UK now?
					

Almost all of the UK's Covid rules have ended, two years after they were introduced.



					www.bbc.com
				




Turns out, if you close the stupid stuff, numbers go down.


----------



## crush

dad4 said:


> You’re right that it is not not herd immunity.  For the last three months, UK has been taking this seriously, in a way that we have not been.
> 
> Remember Boris Johnson asking the whole country to cancel Christmas plans?  It wasn’t just Christmas.  They closed the restaurants, the pubs, the indoor gyms, and so on.
> 
> List of what they are and are not allowing:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Covid: What is the guidance across the UK now?
> 
> 
> Almost all of the UK's Covid rules have ended, two years after they were introduced.
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbc.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turns out, if you close the stupid stuff, numbers go down.


You sir are a liar!!!


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> You’re right that it is not not herd immunity.  For the last three months, UK has been taking this seriously, in a way that we have not been.
> 
> Remember Boris Johnson asking the whole country to cancel Christmas plans?  It wasn’t just Christmas.  They closed the restaurants, the pubs, the indoor gyms, and so on.
> 
> List of what they are and are not allowing:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Covid: What is the guidance across the UK now?
> 
> 
> Almost all of the UK's Covid rules have ended, two years after they were introduced.
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbc.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turns out, if you close the stupid stuff, numbers go down.


Honest question:  what you think about South Africa?  Despite the variant., a vaccine debacle, winter they are at the bottom of the bell curve.  Second lockdown not as widely respected as first due to economic collapse of the country....corner stone was a curfew and alcohol ban.... religious services, political gatherings continued. You think they are at herd immunity?


----------



## dad4

Grace T. said:


> Honest question:  what you think about South Africa?  Despite the variant., a vaccine debacle, winter they are at the bottom of the bell curve.  Second lockdown not as widely respected as first due to economic collapse of the country....corner stone was a curfew and alcohol ban.... religious services, political gatherings continued. You think they are at herd immunity?


I don't know much about SA and SA policies.

In particular, I have no idea how good their data is, or how much of their normal civic life is indoors.  

The bell curve doesn't convince me by itself.  They are at the end of summer.  USA looked pretty good back in September, too.  

Then you hit winter, people go inside, and Rt goes back up.  Higher Rt means higher herd immunity threshold, so even if they are "herd immune" now, that may not be true in July.


----------



## crush

crush said:


> You sir are a liar!!!


@dad4 I'm not laughing.  You are a joke and a liar.  This is not funny anymore.  Do you understand the pain and death your attitude is causing?  I would be very very careful what you preach dude.  This is worse than junk science.


----------



## dad4

crush said:


> You sir are a liar!!!


I didn't think people here would like that answer.

UK does seem to have managed the variant with vaccines, a ban on indoor gatherings, and closures of high risk places.  

Case counts there are too low for it to be herd immunity, but NHS is reputable enough for us to trust their data.  And I don't see any other viable explanation.

We just disagree.  Have a great day.


----------



## crush

dad4 said:


> I didn't think people here would like that answer.
> 
> UK does seem to have managed the variant with vaccines, a ban on indoor gatherings, and closures of high risk places.
> 
> Case counts there are too low for it to be herd immunity, but NHS is reputable enough for us to trust their data.  And I don't see any other viable explanation.
> 
> We just disagree.  Have a great day.


The media in our country dos not show what is really happening in London.  You sir are also controlled by your own fear and the news you watch.  Trust me dude, you are brainwashed.  The issue here is I think your trying to mislead people because you hate t.  It was political for you and then you went all in with your bs.  Now and very soon, you will be xposed.  Its the truth liar.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

dad4 said:


> I didn't think people here would like that answer.
> 
> UK does seem to have managed the variant with vaccines, a ban on indoor gatherings, and closures of high risk places.
> 
> Case counts there are too low for it to be herd immunity, but NHS is reputable enough for us to trust their data.  And I don't see any other viable explanation.
> 
> We just disagree.  Have a great day.


 Question.   California had its own variant and to my understanding it was 20% to 30% more contagious than the original strain.    This is why our numbers were so high in the Dec-June.    Wouldn’t this help us manage theUK variant better than other regions?     Again this could be a very dumb question but it seems like we might make it through given that our weekly vaccination  rates are increasing every week.  

San Diego County still continues to worry but their case count has stayed under 500 daily cases despite them having so many uk variant cases in January.


----------



## crush

Winter of Darkness is over?  Spring forward to Justice, honor, love and fairness?  

@dad4, @espola @thelonggame @Hüsker Dü and least but not least, t has a message for you @EOTL.....lol.  This is just for a fun Saturday and not being serious.  I'm driving home a point though.  Dont hate the leader.  Have compassion on the leader of the world.  This is satire and not from me and a pal sent it to me.  He was afraid you guys would go ape shit when were all just trying to be fair and honest with each other.  You know, tell the truth.  I just thought the four of you would get a kick out of this meme.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> The B.1.1.7 variant now spreading across the U.S. is the most contagious and deadly variant yet. Should we wait for peer reviewed studies to determine exactly how much more easily it can be spread on soccer fields, and more dangerous to kids, refs, coaches and parents?


yes.


----------



## dad4

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Question.   California had its own variant and to my understanding it was 20% to 30% more contagious than the original strain.    This is why our numbers were so high in the Dec-June.    Wouldn’t this help us manage theUK variant better than other regions?     Again this could be a very dumb question but it seems like we might make it through given that our weekly vaccination  rates are increasing every week.
> 
> San Diego County still continues to worry but their case count has stayed under 500 daily cases despite them having so many uk variant cases in January.


The CA variant should help us relative to the UK variant, to the extent that CA immunity confers UK immunity.

The vaccine is also helping, as is summer weather.

The decision to reopen dining and stadiums is definitely counterproductive.  This is why I think we will stabilize, instead of continuing to see cases drop over the next few weeks.


----------



## watfly

EOTL said:


> The B.1.1.7 variant now spreading across the U.S. is the most contagious and deadly variant yet. Should we wait for peer reviewed studies to determine exactly how much more easily it can be spread on soccer fields, and more dangerous to kids, refs, coaches and parents?


Nope, play on.


----------



## dad4

crush said:


> The media in our country dos not show what is really happening in London.  You sir are also controlled by your own fear and the news you watch.  Trust me dude, you are brainwashed.  The issue here is I think your trying to mislead people because you hate t.  It was political for you and then you went all in with your bs.  Now and very soon, you will be xposed.  Its the truth liar.


Dude, that wasn't from our domestic media.  The link was a local news story from the BBC.

I don't think BBC is trying to brainwash people about what is and is not open in London.  If the BBC says their pubs are closed, it's because their pubs are closed.


----------



## Grace T.

dad4 said:


> The CA variant should help us relative to the UK variant, to the extent that CA immunity confers UK immunity.
> 
> The vaccine is also helping, as is summer weather.
> 
> The decision to reopen dining and stadiums is definitely counterproductive.  This is why I think we will stabilize, instead of continuing to see cases drop over the next few weeks.


The good news out of the uk is that even though covid cases have plateaued the death rate has continued to fall and is headed to the floor. Something similar may be happening in the us but it’s still about 2 weeks to early to tell for sure (because deaths are a lagging indicator). It’s likely because all the old people are almost all vaccinated with at least a single dose. If so, the case counts probably don’t matter as much if the ifr is on the floor.


----------



## crush

This is real folks.  WTFU&SBAP!!!!  Get the kids out of the house and let them play.  We were born to play and have fun and work hard and have more fun. 

*Doctors: Child Suicide Becoming “International Epidemic” Thanks To Tyrannical Restrictions






*


----------



## crush




----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> @dad4 I'm not laughing.  You are a joke and a liar.  This is not funny anymore.  Do you understand the pain and death your attitude is causing?  I would be very very careful what you preach dude.  This is worse than junk science.


An anti-vaxxer really just complained about “junk science”?

How’s your daughter’s future pro soccer career shaping up?


----------



## crush

EOTL said:


> An anti-vaxxer really just complained about “junk science”?
> 
> How’s your daughter’s future pro soccer career shaping up?


Why don't you ask her yourself.  You give me the creeps and I already warned her about you and she knows your kind in the industry all to well in the industry you once controlled.  Liar liar and more lies you liar and weirdo.  Dom?


----------



## EOTL

crush said:


> The media in our country dos not show what is really happening in London.  You sir are also controlled by your own fear and the news you watch.  Trust me dude, you are brainwashed.  The issue here is I think your trying to mislead people because you hate t.  It was political for you and then you went all in with your bs.  Now and very soon, you will be xposed.  Its the truth liar.


Fear?  You are afraid of a mask and terrified of getting vaccinated/science. 

Brainwashed?  You listen to Jenny McCarthy over every legitimate scientist in the US.


----------



## happy9

EOTL said:


> An anti-vaxxer really just complained about “junk science”?
> 
> How’s your daughter’s future pro soccer career shaping up?


It is very strange and disturbing that you continuously target his DD.  I don't see anyone else on this forum targeting anyone's child in this manner. Usually if a parent on this forum specifically mentions a DD, it's with praise. Its not a good look and not close to being funny.  

At some point you have to look at yourself in the mirror.  It's creepy and not appropriate.  And using the excuse that he puts his DD out there doesn't justify the passive aggressive rhetoric directed at a minor by an adult - assuming you are an adult.

Sometimes cancel culture is your friend, maybe it's time for you.


----------

