# Nomads Moving Their Thanksgiving Tournament To Tucson



## Patandpats (Oct 15, 2020)

Thanksgiving San Diego
					






					www.nomadssoccer.org
				




MLS teams are playing friendlies, everyone else is in a tournament, Friday to Sunday, two games on Friday.

Are people going to spend Thanksgiving down there just to play soccer or choose that over the tournament in Phoenix the same weekend.


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## Eagle33 (Oct 15, 2020)

Nomads *used to be* big. Is this even a thing anymore? anyone?


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## lafalafa (Oct 15, 2020)

Is/ was the November nights a Nomads production?

Can't remember but those seemed popular and the goalie wars where fun.   My son while not a keeper participatied one year for the heck of it  when he was down south for surf or another tournament and had a great time.

Mentioned this in the surf throw in the towel thread about all the Thanksgiving tourney's being out of state now.


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## Eagle33 (Oct 15, 2020)

lafalafa said:


> Is/ was the November nights a Nomads production?
> 
> Can't remember but those seemed popular and the goalie wars where fun.   My son while not a keeper participatied one year for the heck of it  when he was down south for surf or another tournament and had a great time.
> 
> Mentioned this in the surf throw in the towel thread about all the Thanksgiving tourney's being out of state now.


Yes, goalie wars were great and actually Nomads used to be The tournament for older players. But ever since they lost good fields and Surf started doing Thanksgiving tournament, Nomads became thing of the past. November Nights I believe is Carlsbad tournament, not Nomads.


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## BJ18 (Oct 15, 2020)

Patandpats said:


> Thanksgiving San Diego
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Where do you see it says MLS teams will be playing friendlies at Nomads?  I see it says MLS Next friendlies but that’s not quite the same since MLS Next has a lot of non-MLS clubs.


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## lafalafa (Oct 15, 2020)

BJ18 said:


> Where do you see it says MLS teams will be playing friendlies at Nomads?  I see it says MLS Next friendlies but that’s not quite the same since MLS Next has a lot of non-MLS clubs.


Inviting all the next teams from socal.

Local MLS teams only normally travel for major events and given the state of things, don't see them going for this one.

Next teams can play in the regular tournament or any of the other out of state tday tournaments so those playing friendlies are likely not playing league games yet, ready yet, trying to get some games in.


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## Patandpats (Oct 15, 2020)

BJ18 said:


> Where do you see it says MLS teams will be playing friendlies at Nomads?  I see it says MLS Next friendlies but that’s not quite the same since MLS Next has a lot of non-MLS clubs.


From that link:
We are excited to announce Nomads Tucson Arizona Thanksgiving Tournament 2020 & MLS Next Friendly Match Circuit. This one of a kind collaborative event which will feature a competitive soccer tournament for both boys and girls teams age U9-U19, in conjunction with separate friendly matches played amongst MLS Next clubs.


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## BJ18 (Oct 15, 2020)

Patandpats said:


> From that link:
> We are excited to announce Nomads Tucson Arizona Thanksgiving Tournament 2020 & MLS Next Friendly Match Circuit. This one of a kind collaborative event which will feature a competitive soccer tournament for both boys and girls teams age U9-U19, in conjunction with separate friendly matches played amongst MLS Next clubs.


My point was that it doesn’t say MLS teams will play.  It says MLS Next clubs will play friendlies.  There is a distinction.   So far, no indication that the LAG or LAFC are playing.


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## espola (Oct 15, 2020)

Eagle33 said:


> Nomads *used to be* big. Is this even a thing anymore? anyone?


I remember Dereck Armstrong at a club directors and coaches meeting during the Presidio website crisis referring to "real soccer people" giving me the feeling that he meant we weren't.  That didn't win him a lot of friends.  

When my kids got involved in club soccer (mid '90s) Surf was the best club for girls and Nomads for boys.  Those two clubs ruled the roos in Presidio Premiere, and ambitious parents wanted to sign their kids into Nomads, even if it was to be a bench spot on the B teams.  By my observation, the Nomads decline started with the beginning of PDA, perhaps because they believed it was real.  They put their best players in the PDA teams, which meant their Presidio teams were no longer so dominant.


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## outside! (Oct 16, 2020)

espola said:


> I remember Dereck Armstrong at a club directors and coaches meeting during the Presidio website crisis referring to "real soccer people" giving me the feeling that he meant we weren't.  That didn't win him a lot of friends.
> 
> When my kids got involved in club soccer (mid '90s) Surf was the best club for girls and Nomads for boys.  Those two clubs ruled the roos in Presidio Premiere, and ambitious parents wanted to sign their kids into Nomads, even if it was to be a bench spot on the B teams.  By my observation, the Nomads decline started with the beginning of PDA, perhaps because they believed it was real.  They put their best players in the PDA teams, which meant their Presidio teams were no longer so dominant.


Craziness and poor leadership didn't help that club.


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## Banana Hammock (Oct 16, 2020)

I remember hearing that a couple of years ago that Xolos (the ones from TJ) was going to buy Nomads when they wanted to move into US youth soccer.  Rumor was the the Armstrong's were holding out for a little more.  I bet that they wished they took the offer.


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## espola (Oct 16, 2020)

outside! said:


> Craziness and poor leadership didn't help that club.


Soccer America had an article this week teased as being about the importance of Dereck Armstrong, but it was behind their paywall so I couldn't read it.


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## watfly (Oct 16, 2020)

espola said:


> Soccer America had an article this week teased as being about the importance of Dereck Armstrong, but it was behind their paywall so I couldn't read it.


*The continual importance of youth soccer pioneer Derek Armstrong*

by Mike Woitalla @MikeWoitalla, Oct 10, 2020
Four decades ago, Englishman *Derek Armstrong*  arrived in San Diego to create a fully staffed, multi-team soccer club -- unique in the USA although the norm worldwide. Last night, Armstrong was at the Kinsell Field training the Nomads' U-19 defenders.





Thirty-three years ago, Armstrong coached the USA's U-20 World Cup team, which included four players who are now Hall of Famers. Three months into 2020, Armstrong connected with club directors around the nation to navigate a new era of American youth soccer as rumors spread that U.S. Soccer would pull the plug on its Development Academy. That would be 13 years after Armstrong's Nomads became the first club to commit to the DA. Nineteen years ago, Armstrong was among the founders of U.S. Club Soccer and served as its chair in the early years.
Armstrong, recruited by *Joe Hollow*, the real-estate developer who launched the Nomads in 1976 when he formed a youth all-star team, may have been the first salaried youth coach the USA. He took a part-time college coaching job in 1983 so as not to depend too much on his Nomads' salary, because he wanted to keep players' fees down. He won three DIII national titles with UC San Diego while at the helm through 2007.
In 2016, Armstrong coached the Nomads' U-18s to the DA national semifinals, where they lost 2-1 to eventual champion FC Dallas. That was five years after he "retired."
"Well, I am retired," says Armstrong, who turned 81 in March. "I just do some stuff."
That stuff includes helping coach the U-19s. "I don't go every night," he says. "I went the last two nights, but I didn't go tonight. I don't do four or five nights a week anymore."
But he is busy orchestrating a Nomads-hosted tournament in Arizona, because California COVID restrictions have forced the cancellation of the Nomads' Thanksgiving tourney. He and his wife, *Mary*, drove to Arizona and came back confident that the Nomads could pull of a safe three-day event that would be a hybrid of friendlies and tournament competition. He also serves as a Western Conference chair and on the Environment Committee for MLS Next.
"What MLS and the non-MLS clubs put together was magnificent," says Armstrong about MLS Next, the new league launched quickly after the abrupt collapse of U.S. Soccer's DA in April.





_*Derek Armstrong with Frankie Hejduk, one of the Nomads' most famous alums, who include Jeff Duback, Steve Cherundolo, Jovan Kirovski, Joe Corona, Gabriel and Michael Farfan, and Eric Avila.*_
In 2007, U.S. Soccer decided it necessary to play a larger role in what had become a wild west youth landscape -- myriad state, regional and national competitions, showcase tournaments and ODP events. A committee launched by U.S. Soccer President *Sunil Gulati* came up with the Development Academy concept.
"Sunil said to me at one of the meetings, what do you think?" says Armstrong. "I said, 'We're in.' We were the first club in, verbally."
Armstrong believed the fragmentation of the youth game in the USA impeded its progress despite its massive growth. He welcomed U.S. Soccer's commitment to invest significantly in the youth game, set high standards and upgrade the national team selection process. He tells the story of how one the most successful American players in history got into the national team:
"I called *Manny Schellscheidt* and told him he had to give *Steve Cherundolo* a chance, even though he was very small. That's how it was in those days. You had state cups, regional cups, ODP, tournaments, but it wasn't easy for national team staff to see players. The DA made it easy for players to be seen. The great thing about the Development Academy were the showcase events. You had national team staff, college coaches, pro scouts from Europe and South America at the DA showcases."
But Armstrong became somewhat disillusioned with the DA in the later years. "At the beginning, we had *John Hackworth*, a good, experienced leader, and *Asher Mendelsohn*, but they left." Still, Armstrong believed in the DA concept. "There were issues on how the academy was run, but we all put up with it. ... In spite of all the problems it was still a worthy effort. People got serious about youth development and we had some standards that certainly were a step up from the previous. You can see the improvement in player development in the success of the young American players."
What he didn't expect was U.S. Soccer quitting on it.






_*From the Derek Armstrong-coached 1987 U-20 World Cup team, Jeff Agoos, Tony Meola and Marcelo Balboa (middle of top row) and backup goalkeeper Kasey Keller, are in the National Soccer Hall of Fame.*_
"We threw everything, hook, line and sinker, into the Federation's academy and we were very disappointed it ended up like this," he says. "But things happen, and I think it's going to be better."
Armstrong says he and *David Richardson* (Sockers FC of Illinois) and *Jeffrey Saunders* (Met Oval of New York), and others who believed in the DA structure, "got the Zoom going" when it became clear U.S. Soccer was abandoning the DA. The aim was to somehow how forge ahead with a similar conference setup, with or without MLS.
"We really dove in and came together and created a plan in a short period of time," Armstrong says. "So if MLS came in, we were ready to go. If MLS came in with a heavy hand and we didn't like it, we could have gone on our own because we prepared. But MLS realized the experience we brought to table was a plus, not a minus. And MLS brought in professional leadership, while including us in the decision-making. That's a big difference from the Federation, which didn't allow us input, kept us on the outside."





Armstrong is confident about MLS's sincerity in working with the amateur clubs. He cites a talented 15-year-old Nomads player who is moving to LAFC with his blessing.
"There was an MLS club in the past that undermined us, called our players directly, and I didn't like that," he says. "But *Todd Saldana* at LAFC on the other hand set up a relationship with us. I sent the player to train frequently with LAFC all last year and I support him moving. Right now, we don't get anything out of it, but in our talks with MLS _they_ raised the possibility of coming up with a way to compensate [amateur clubs] in these situations. How that might work hasn't been thrashed out yet, but I'm pleased that they put it on the agenda."
Richardson says that Armstrong's leadership was crucial during the chaotic period of the DA's demise and pandemic disruption.
"When youth soccer shut down," Richardson says, "we needed Derek's skill sets. Those include understanding the evolution and culture of youth soccer in the United States, not panicking, talking to people and unifying them. During that time, Derek wasn't working for the Nomads, he was working for soccer. That's how he's always been, why he's so well respected, and why he is so important to the American game."


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## outside! (Oct 16, 2020)

Derek is not the problem at Nomads. His son however is volatile and hard to work with. I thought I heard that he is not as involved anymore, but I don't know for sure.


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## watfly (Oct 16, 2020)

outside! said:


> Derek is not the problem at Nomads. His son however is volatile and hard to work with. I thought I heard that he is not as involved anymore, but I don't know for sure.


Correct, Correct, Incorrect


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## Alika M (Oct 16, 2020)

This tournament is a joke.  I would not recommend to anyone.  the 2018 tourney, my son's LA Premier (at the time) 05 team made the final after destroying the weak group games (we were in top flight).  In the final we met up with a CSL Gold league opponent Autobahn SC.  Having played Autobahn in league earlier that year (drew 3-3 and won 2-0), they were very dirty and we knew their tactics.  We played our normal game.  It was unfortunate though that the referee given the game was very impartial to our boys, particularly our center forward.  In the early first half, he had a breakaway down the sideline and their center back, #12, (who by the way was the most carded player in all of CSL that year, any age group), slid tackled him from the back and nearly broke his ankle.  Ref called a foul on #12... our player got up and started jogging towards the box as the free kick was being set up.  Ref calls him back and gives our forward a yellow card... for what we have no idea.  I was standing right there videoing game and our player said nothing, but their coach was whining about something in Spanish and must have told the ref something, and he gave our boy a yellow.  Moving on, later in the half, again our forward has a breakaway just past midfield, same center back runs in front of our forward and just falls to the ground without being touched... probably in order to stop our forward who was the fastest kid on the field.  center back did not touch or come close to ball.  our forward tries to jump over #12 who is sprawled on field, and during this, #12 reaches up and grabs our forward back leg and causes him to fall.  then to make it seem like he did nothing wrong, #12 curls up in "pain".  Incredulously, Ref calls a foul on our forward.  We absolutely lost it right there. Those were 2 of about 7-8 terrible calls that were obvious and poor.  At the half, we discussed as a team just walking away from the game as it was clear the ref was not trying to protect our players at all.  

Derek, the guy you mention above, came to our field and asked why we were gonna forfeit the second half of a final.  We said ask the ref, and if he is doing the second half, we are walking away.  He said they couldn't change the ref mid game.  We said have your silly tournament, we are done.

I strongly recommend to anyone, don't do this tournament as its run piss poor, and worse now you gotta go to Tuscon?  Play it this year or in future years at your own risk.


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## outside! (Oct 16, 2020)

From my own experience, it seems that there are more injuries/game at tournaments than during league. Also from experience, long drives to tournaments don't seem to improve player performance. I don't believe an out of state tournament is the best way to restart soccer for a bunch of rusty players. I also see a good chance that home state teams will be somewhat biased against teams from California and willing to play a bit rough. Is it really worth a potential serious injury? We will wait until local league games resume rather than travel out of state and assume all of the increased off the field risks associated for very little gain.


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## SoccerFan4Life (Oct 16, 2020)

outside! said:


> From my own experience, it seems that there are more injuries/game at tournaments than during league. Also from experience, long drives to tournaments don't seem to improve player performance. I don't believe an out of state tournament is the best way to restart soccer for a bunch of rusty players. I also see a good chance that home state teams will be somewhat biased against teams from California and willing to play a bit rough. Is it really worth a potential serious injury? We will wait until local league games resume rather than travel out of state and assume all of the increased off the field risks associated for very little gain.


I’ve heard of teams traveling every other weekend to AZ for tournaments.  That’s a lot of wear and tear on everyone.   If pro athletes complain about traveling I can’t see how kids won’t get tired of this type of situation.


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## happy9 (Oct 18, 2020)

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I’ve heard of teams traveling every other weekend to AZ for tournaments.  That’s a lot of wear and tear on everyone.   If pro athletes complain about traveling I can’t see how kids won’t get tired of this type of situation.


Unless they change their policy between now and thanksgiving, the Kino facility is only allowing players and coaches into the complex - *zero spectators inside*. .  Some fields are viewable from certain vantage points, but many are not.    I don't see how it's possible to view games played in the older facility if you are not allowed into the complex.  

Great complex to play soccer in though, your players will dig it.

something to think and ask about.


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## pewpew (Oct 19, 2020)

We'll only agree to play Nomads AZ if they make us play all 3 of our group games at different locations like they did when we played in SD.
And only if we have to check in on Thanksgiving night. Who the hell thinks that's a good idea?! 

That same year my G03 GK's team made it to the semi-finals against one of the teams from Beach FC. Pouring rain. A late goal gets scored against us on a corner which was all but impossible considering where my kid was standing at near the post. Ball goes into the net. AR and CR both call for a goal. My kid shouts out "No way..there's a big hole right here!!"  CB pulls on the net and shows them a gaping hole. CR and AR have a quick pow-wow near the backline. My kid tells me later that the CR asks the AR if he actually saw the ball go into the net. AR says no..but the ball ended up in the net. Obviously. Rocket scientists these guys were.  We lose 0-1. After the game one of our dads is chewing out the refs for a piss-poor job asking why they didn't bother checking the nets before a semi-final game, or any game for that matter. A few Beach parents start running their mouths. I go to help pull him back. I turn around to see some guy has his arm around my kid's neck talking to her way to close for my comfort level..especially since I have no idea who he is. 
(I'll jump ahead a second to say it turns out to be Coach Gerry Pineda from Beach FC..unbeknownst to me..add to the fact things are still pretty heated.)

Me : Hey!! Who are you and why is your arm around my kid?!
GP: What did you say?
Me: Why are you standing with your arm around my kid talking to her so closely?!  I don't know you and I'm pretty sure she doesn't either!!
GP: What's your problem?
Me: My problem is you are a complete stranger with your arm around my kid's neck..and I have the problem?!
GP: I'm the coach from the other team..I was telling your kid she played a great game. Why the attitude?! 
Me: Oh. I'm sorry Coach Pineda. I didn't know who you were. I just saw some guy with his arm around my kid. My apologies.
GP: I just don't know why you're getting such an attitude.
Me: Well..I just tried to apologize..if you aren't man enough to accept that..you can just keep walking.
GP: Whatever dude.
Me: Like I said..sorry. But you better think twice the next time you walk up to some kid you don't know and put your arm around them and start talking to them so closely. Another dad might not be as forgiving as I was. 
GP: Whatever dude.
Me: Yeah..dude..start walking. (Wife grabs me by the arm)
As we walk away..my kid tells me that Coach Pineda tells her.."You know..I don't think it was a goal either..but these things happen"
I'm about to lose my $#!T after hearing that. F that guy..so much for integrity and sportsmanship. Karma must've kicked in because they lost in the Finals.

November Nights is a whole other joke of a "College Showcase" tournament. I asked the check-in desk on the second day if many coaches had been to the field. (These are HS kids mind you.) He said that he only knew of two. 

Given everything that 2020 has done to youth soccer and  youth sports in general and the fact my kid is a Senior..I told my wife recently that I think we may have already seen her last games...although maybe college will eventually turn that around.


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## outside! (Oct 19, 2020)

pewpew said:


> November Nights is a whole other joke of a "College Showcase" tournament. I asked the check-in desk on the second day if many coaches had been to the field. (These are HS kids mind you.) He said that he only knew of two.
> 
> Given everything that 2020 has done to youth soccer and  youth sports in general and the fact my kid is a Senior..I told my wife recently that I think we may have already seen her last games...although maybe college will eventually turn that around.


When I worked at the check-in tent at Poinsettia for November Nights in 2016 or 2017, I saw a lot of coaches. I didn't count how many, but easily more than a dozen. If coaches are in town for Surf Turkey, and there are players who have contacted them that the coaches want to see, they will make the effort to see them. During Surf Cup, DD's team played Legends one evening at Poinsettia and almost 50 coaches showed up.


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