# LA Times: U.S. losing soccer prospects as California talent head back to Mexico in search of opportu



## Azzurri (Sep 21, 2018)

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-mexican-soccer-dream-20180920-story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true


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## Grace T. (Sep 22, 2018)

Great article.  One of the more misleading headlines written by an editor either too ignorant about the sport, or with a political ax to grind.  If our concern is building a US National Team (as opposed to getting a college degree for every kid), then it seems we should be encouraging (not discouraging as the lead implies) more stories like this.  Playing for a Mexican team instead of a college team, even if second division, would make him more likely to play pro.  Playing for a college team, as the article acknowledges, means by the time he gets out he is "past his prime".  If the goal is a US National Team, I don't see the issue here.  

If anything the issue is no more Jonathan Gonzalez's...how to avoid players picking the Mexican team over the US team....but that's likely a function of winning and the more coin tosses you get, the sheer number of heads results you get also increases.  If anything, a bigger technical question for US Soccer is how do you incorporate the Mexican style into U.S. play going forward...anyone who's ever seen a Sunday Mexican League play or whose gone up against a Latino-majority club team with a Latino coach can tell you: the Mexican style is a lot more physical than the type cultivated by the MLS and the English-influenced US club teams...but then the US is really struggling to find a national style so first things first.


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## Azzurri (Sep 23, 2018)

*Novel approach to youth academy paying dividends for LAFC*
http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-lafc-academy-baxter-20180922-story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true

Keeping the focus on fewer teams and fewer players — LAFC has about 90 in the academy now — has paid off. Top Drawer Soccer ranked LAFC’s U-13 and U-14 teams as the best in the nation last May while six academy players — defenders Armando Avila, Beau Yantz and Tony Leone, midfielder Dylan Presto, forward Christian Torres and winger Kevin Jimenez — spent time in the U.S. youth national team camp this year. Another, goalkeeper Donovan Palomares, trained with Mexico’s youth national team.


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## PaytoplayinLancaster? (Sep 23, 2018)

I bet if the National team coaches were at Galaxy the talent would magically gravitate over to Carson.  Not such a novel approach when you dangle free Soccer, a competitive practice environment, and a shot to impress the National team coach every time you lace them up.  But, I love how humbly they explain that they started with nothing.


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## Fishme1 (Sep 23, 2018)

Azzurri said:


> *Novel approach to youth academy paying dividends for LAFC*
> http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-lafc-academy-baxter-20180922-story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true
> 
> Keeping the focus on fewer teams and fewer players — LAFC has about 90 in the academy now — has paid off. Top Drawer Soccer ranked LAFC’s U-13 and U-14 teams as the best in the nation last May while six academy players — defenders Armando Avila, Beau Yantz and Tony Leone, midfielder Dylan Presto, forward Christian Torres and winger Kevin Jimenez — spent time in the U.S. youth national team camp this year. Another, goalkeeper Donovan Palomares, trained with Mexico’s youth national team.


There is ALOT more players to be recognized on that team.


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## Coach Carlito (Sep 23, 2018)

But if they're "heading back to Mexico", doesn't that mean they are originally from Mexico? How is U.S. losing anything if they're Mexicans to begin with???


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## younothat (Sep 24, 2018)

Interesting article and brings back the topic of how US soccer is missing out including this demographic and: 

"FIFA's Regulations on the Status and Transfer of Players (RSTP) are enforceable in North America.

To recap, RSTP stipulates that when a soccer player signs his first professional contract, the pro club is obligated to pay training and development costs to every club that developed that player between the ages of 12 and 21. Training compensation is also due when the player moves to a club in a different country prior to his 23rd birthday.

Additionally, when a player transfers to a club in another country before the expiration of his contract, five percent of the transfer fee is to be allocated to the club (or clubs) that developed the player with what is called a "solidarity payment". This is spelled out in Articles 20 and 21 in RSTP, as well as Annexe 4 of that document"

So far U.S. Soccer Federation, MLS , &  Soccer United Marketing (Sum) have manged to prevent the clubs from receiving compensation.   Although MLS and been taking a cut and giving out some of the RSTP to MLS club members only on a case by case basis.

Is the US  spending money to subside youth soccer only to see others take advantage and swoop up players free of charge?


Coach Carlito said:


> But if they're "heading back to Mexico", doesn't that mean they are originally from Mexico? How is U.S. losing anything if they're Mexicans to begin with???


Parents from mexico not necessarily the kids





__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=541628169610387


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## focomoso (Sep 24, 2018)

Coach Carlito said:


> But if they're "heading back to Mexico", doesn't that mean they are originally from Mexico? How is U.S. losing anything if they're Mexicans to begin with???


They're both Mexican _and_ American.


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## outside! (Sep 24, 2018)

Technically, residents of North, Central and South America are Americans. Citizenship is a different issue.


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## Not_that_Serious (Sep 24, 2018)

That's a real bad headline. Not losing prospects. One thing you get out of the article is how many kids lose their way due to a failing grade in HS or failing out of Community College. One class stopped a kid from getting into SLO? Then talks about coaching and getting a job to help parents - means his mind wasnt in the books. A lot of this is cultural. My friends (more female than males) were told they could not go to college and had to get jobs to "contribute" to the household. Making up the class is a simple fix, but many kids dont feel confident enough to succeed in college - as many families dont emphasize education and dont support kids being the best students they can be. In most of these cases kids are going to MX as final opportunities - well at least in their minds. Some bring up academy teams but teams they have been on seem to have access to high level competition. Then its them figuring out if Liga MX D2 is better than USL or other domestic leagues. This isnt any different than non-MX kids going to Europe D2 or D3 leagues to improve their skill level - except the kids already know the language.


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## Not_that_Serious (Sep 24, 2018)

I also forgot to mention, local college coaches I know tell me they see a lot of academic ineligibility going on - one coach says they almost have to flip an entire roster every year. Often its not just about ditching classes because they just dont want to go, but often its players having to take care of younger siblings (see more with female players) because parents are working two jobs each or pressure to help support the families financially. Most of what is going on nothing to do with US Soccer or them not paying attention to talent.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2018)

younothat said:


> Interesting article and brings back the topic of how US soccer is missing out including this demographic and:
> 
> "FIFA's Regulations on the Status and Transfer of Players (RSTP) are enforceable in North America.
> 
> ...


This is soooo rediculous. So let me get this straight.. us parents have been paying for little johny since the age of 5... all the arcane travel... hotel... flights... turney fees... club dues...  their gear.... odp..
pdp... ussda... camps... indiv training.... AND THE CLUBS GET COMPENSATION????

No they have already been paid... pay us parents. We are the ones who navigated this 3 ring circus... and supported our kids emotionally, physically, and financially. 

The clubs shouldnt get a dime


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## Not_that_Serious (Sep 26, 2018)

Jace said:


> This is soooo rediculous. So let me get this straight.. us parents have been paying for little johny since the age of 5... all the arcane travel... hotel... flights... turney fees... club dues...  their gear.... odp..
> pdp... ussda... camps... indiv training.... AND THE CLUBS GET COMPENSATION????
> 
> No they have already been paid... pay us parents. We are the ones who navigated this 3 ring circus... and supported our kids emotionally, physically, and financially.
> ...


Thats a comment out of ignorance. Its okay I use to hold the same thought until I researched and found out where soladarity payments actually go. MLS keeps the money. They convinced the MLS players that by keeping the 5% the players will make more money - truth is the players dont get much of anything but players fight for scraps that fall under the table floor. In the past MLS clubs were able to lock up player rights & force players to play in the league - not allow them to transfer to leagues around the world. Play domestically or dont play at all. Google Taylor Twellman and youll find others. The system worked until parents wised up & stuck with non-MLS club teams. Now you see clubs having to take chances, actually invest in developing players, since they now have to sign them at younger ages to pro contracts. They cant just rely on parents putting up the cost - since they cant attract elite talent with ignorant parents who drink the kool aid. Parents cant and never will ever be paid soladarity payments. Given this, the alternative is to leave the system as is and let MLS keep the money. This doesnt help development in this country and can be argued it inhibits it. Pay to Play costs could be reduced since clubs could use soladarity payments to offer scholarships and get people to invest. Could even pay coaches a living wage, would have more full time coaches and quality of coaching pool would increase. This can lead to other issues, but would be better than the existing system


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## timbuck (Sep 26, 2018)

Jace said:


> This is soooo rediculous. So let me get this straight.. us parents have been paying for little johny since the age of 5... all the arcane travel... hotel... flights... turney fees... club dues...  their gear.... odp..
> pdp... ussda... camps... indiv training.... AND THE CLUBS GET COMPENSATION????
> 
> No they have already been paid... pay us parents. We are the ones who navigated this 3 ring circus... and supported our kids emotionally, physically, and financially.
> ...


I think it’s supposed to work out so that the clubs get the money and the parents no longer have to pay for their kid to play. 
Imagine if westcoastsurfstrikersslammetspateadores were each getting a few million a year for a player or 2 that played for them at 13 and got a fat pro contract at 20. 
And imagine how different the clubs would act if “developing pros” was what paid the bills and not telling Little Mrs Range Rover that Johnny has a chance for a partial dII prscholarship at WhoGivesAShit University if only he would sign up for private training and attend a club camp for “exposure”.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2018)

If the parents did not pay the club... and the club actually developed the player then fine... they should get paid. 

But what are we kidding... 99% clubs dont develop the player.


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## Not_that_Serious (Sep 26, 2018)

Jace said:


> If the parents did not pay the club... and the club actually developed the player then fine... they should get paid.
> 
> But what are we kidding... 99% clubs dont develop the player.


Yes thats the point. Current system is flawed. Its been manipulated to centralize the power and thus their (mls/us soccer/sum) ability to make money increased - nothing to do with development. By taking away some of the money and putting it into clubs, you will incentive clubs to improve. You will also see bad clubs fade away in part. The ones focused in developing players will grow. Community based clubs might even grow because they will have another possible source of income and municipalities might not have to subsidize them as much. Big Clubs dont dev because they arent about dev and just about number$ - this system is kept in place by MLS/SUM/US Soccer. If no one rocks the boat, all stays the damr, and everyone keeps the money flowing. Short-sided views but no one wants to risk a proven model that makes them money


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2018)

Listen i understand what you are saying. But there are very very few places where there is even a system in place to even begin to address developing players.

And us parents of elite (i hate that term) players have had to navigate this soup of money driven scams... and basically act as psuedo managers. 

My kid has been fortunate... he plays and has played at very hi level within and outside the states. And the only reason why is that we believed in him and supported him.

He has met some great folks and mentors and coaches along the way.... but there is no system in place in states as you agree.

And frankly, the current generation of kids coming up... who by some outlier chance can go pro.. well the clubs should not see a dime.

First put an actual system in place that actually begins to develop players... then we can talk about solidarity payments


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2018)

I dont think giving clubs solidarity payments will just create a system. Its too much of a mess... major structural changes has to be made by.us soccer first.


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## Not_that_Serious (Sep 26, 2018)

Jace said:


> Listen i understand what you are saying. But there are very very few places where there is even a system in place to even begin to address developing players.
> 
> And us parents of elite (i hate that term) players have had to navigate this soup of money driven scams... and basically act as psuedo managers.
> 
> ...


That becomes chicken or the egg argument. System cant be changed if not allowed to. Soladarity would stop some of the collusion going on and possibly take some of the centralized power away from us soccer who is 100% not worried about dev. So if governing body isnt making it priority, the clubs that help them maintain the structuere arent. There are many clubs who do care but dont have the finances to do things on their own term. Easier to "quit" or not comply if you are self-reliant or have power to say "no thanks". ODP works in So Cal but a lot of parents never heard of it or think DA is the end all - also costs next to nothing. But it doesnt make ppl $ so it isnt expanded


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