# ECNL Expansion In Socal SW Division



## Royal26

Any thoughts if anything will happen? I believe it was around this time last year Beach and Legends got in. Thanks


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## LouSag

Nope.  

Beach and Legends served their 1 year penalty in ECRL for not supporting the switch from DA back to ECNL.
Unless your SCDSL coach is telling your team they are moving to ECNL..believe that for sure!


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## Royal26

My DD is already playing ECNL... Was just wonder if they will even out the brackets.


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## Nextbigthing

Royal26 said:


> My DD is already playing ECNL... Was just wonder if they will even out the brackets.


What do you mean by even out the brackets??


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## LASTMAN14

Nextbigthing said:


> What do you mean by even out the brackets??


There is an uneven number of teams in the SW.


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## Carlsbad7

What's the list of potential SW ECNL additions?


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## Sike

Pats thinks they are getting in.  This year or next.


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## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> Pats thinks they are getting in.  This year or next.


They may need to put up some better results.   Only team at or near the top of RL is their 18/19’s.


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## Sike

Kicker 2.0 said:


> They may need to put up some better results.   Only team at or near the top of RL is their 18/19’s.


I don't think they believe results this year will be a criteria.  They are the only SW RCNL team without ECNL and it evens out the number of teams in ECNL.  They didn't hire Dodge to build an ECRL program...they hired him because of is ties to ECNL leadership from his time with Blues.


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## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> I don't think they believe results this year will be a criteria.  They are the only SW RCNL team without ECNL and it evens out the number of teams in ECNL.  They didn't hire Dodge to build an ECRL program...they hired him because of is ties to ECNL leadership from his time with Blues.


So you think they (ECNL) changed their standards?  Beach and Legends just didn’t have to play a year and they were in, they had to perform.  
I’m not rooting against Pat’s, just curious as to ECNL’s motivation to let in another OC club (Slammers, Koge, Blues, Strikers)  that isn’t able to compete with many of these Clubs 2nd Teams.  
As we’ve seen with DMSC a DOC with “ties” to ECNL doesn’t always help the competitive nature of the League.


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## rainbow_unicorn

Pats getting in does not make sense since you already have two Slammers teams, Blues and Strikers all on top of each other in that area.  ECNL should look at LA Surf or somebody in the SGV/east SFV area where there is a void.


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## Venantsyo

rainbow_unicorn said:


> Pats getting in does not make sense since you already have two Slammers teams, Blues and Strikers all on top of each other in that area.  ECNL should look at LA Surf or somebody in the SGV/east SFV area where there is a void.


Exactly! Another ECNL club at Great park would be just silly (which means it's probably going to happen). The area mentioned above, as well as North OC should be better served on that front...


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## soccer dude

ECNL needs to incorporate relegation before I even think of bringing Pats in.  We played that Pats team and while they are so-so, they could not compete at the mid-top ECNL level but they are probably better than the bottom ECNL team at that age group.  Hence, why I mention relegation.


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## 05Parent

Hearing rumors about the Pateadores too, but we will see. Last year, I heard of them being mentioned with West Coast (in addition to Beach and Legends of course).


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## Sike

Kicker 2.0 said:


> So you think they (ECNL) changed their standards?  Beach and Legends just didn’t have to play a year and they were in, they had to perform.
> I’m not rooting against Pat’s, just curious as to ECNL’s motivation to let in another OC club (Slammers, Koge, Blues, Strikers)  that isn’t able to compete with many of these Clubs 2nd Teams.
> As we’ve seen with DMSC a DOC with “ties” to ECNL doesn’t always help the competitive nature of the League.


I am not sure that Beach and Legends performing last year was a determining factor.  They certainly did perform, but who is to say they wouldn't have gotten in after that first year regardless of performance?  And I never said the ties to ECNL would help the competitive nature of the league, but let's not be so naive to think that is what will determine the decision here.  If improving the competitive nature of the league was leadership's primary concern, then relegation would be on the table.


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## Carlsbad7

Sike said:


> I am not sure that Beach and Legends performing last year was a determining factor.  They certainly did perform, but who is to say they wouldn't have gotten in after that first year regardless of performance?  And I never said the ties to ECNL would help the competitive nature of the league, but let's not be so naive to think that is what will determine the decision here.  If improving the competitive nature of the league was leadership's primary concern, then relegation would be on the table.


The really good teams need a couple of "bad" teams to play against to look good. ;-)


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## myself

Carlsbad7 said:


> The really good teams need a couple of "bad" teams to play against to look good. ;-)


There are already plenty of those, check the standings...


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## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> I am not sure that Beach and Legends performing last year was a determining factor.  They certainly did perform, but who is to say they wouldn't have gotten in after that first year regardless of performance?  And I never said the ties to ECNL would help the competitive nature of the league, but let's not be so naive to think that is what will determine the decision here.  If improving the competitive nature of the league was leadership's primary concern, then relegation would be on the table.


I’m just going based on what I was told was going to be the parameters in 2020 when decisions on what direction the club was going in after DA shuttered.  

I just don’t see a valid argument for Pat’s to gain entry when there are other geographic areas that are underserved.


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## Footy30

Kicker 2.0 said:


> I’m just going based on what I was told was going to be the parameters in 2020 when decisions on what direction the club was going in after DA shuttered.
> 
> I just don’t see a valid argument for Pat’s to gain entry when there are other geographic areas that are underserved.



*I just don’t see a valid argument for Pat’s to gain entry when there are other geographic areas that are underserved.*

After reading this my first thought was well then they will probably get in lol (This is nothing against the Pats at all btw. )


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## Sike

Kicker 2.0 said:


> I’m just going based on what I was told was going to be the parameters in 2020 when decisions on what direction the club was going in after DA shuttered.
> 
> I just don’t see a valid argument for Pat’s to gain entry when there are other geographic areas that are underserved.


I agree that a different geo would be better for the league overall, but isn't Pats the only current ECRL team in the SW without ECNL?  I would bet that was part of the conversation that Pats had ("we are all in with ECRL, so we should be first in line when a new club from SoCal is admitted").


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## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> I agree that a different geo would be better for the league overall, but isn't Pats the only current ECRL team in the SW without ECNL?  I would bet that was part of the conversation that Pats had ("we are all in with ECRL, so we should be first in line when a new club from SoCal is admitted").


I guess the better question is does ECNL need to expand in the SW?  I hear what you’re saying, however why add a club just to add another club If it isn’t serving a geographical or a competition level need?


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## SoccerFan4Life

Cerritos/Downey /North OC  needs to get some type of representation in the future.   Too many parents from this area driving to the great OC.


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## Footy30

Kicker 2.0 said:


> I guess the better question is does ECNL need to expand in the SW?  I hear what you’re saying, however why add a club just to add another club If it isn’t serving a geographical or a competition level need?


So the number of teams can be even for my neurosis... 

I see your point btw, I wonder what would happen to all those commuters  if they provided ECNL to an area that needed it? hmmmm interesting.


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## timbuck

It would be interesting if another team or 2 were added in SoCal.
Would the current ecnl teams still field 22 player rosters?  Or would we see it more spread out?
Would those teams ecnl-rl teams become watered down?


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## From the Spot

timbuck said:


> Would the current ecnl teams still field 22 player rosters?  Or would we see it more spread out?
> Would those teams ecnl-rl teams become watered down?


Unfortunately I think we would still see rosters with 22 or more. Its a shame because it undercuts the whole idea that RL players have a pathway to ECNL if they want it/ work for it. I would like to see them cap ECNL rosters at 18 and then bring RL girls up if injuries or absences occur. I'm sure some do this already but I think they are the minority.


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## Carlsbad7

Sike said:


> I agree that a different geo would be better for the league overall, but isn't Pats the only current ECRL team in the SW without ECNL?  I would bet that was part of the conversation that Pats had ("we are all in with ECRL, so we should be first in line when a new club from SoCal is admitted").


ECNL and RL allow 30 to be rostered per team. 18 can play on game day.

ECNL recently changed the rules and both ECNL and ECRL players can play on an ECNL team. Still only 18 can play ECNL per game day.

What this means is technically a club can roster 60 players and choose 18 out of that pool to play ECNL on game day.


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## SoccerFan4Life

Carlsbad7 said:


> ECNL and RL allow 30 to be rostered per team. 18 can play on game day.
> 
> ECNL recently changed the rules and both ECNL and ECRL players can play on an ECNL team. Still only 18 can play ECNL per game day.
> 
> What this means is technically a club can roster 60 players and choose 18 out of that pool to play ECNL on game day.


Do ECRL teams have a chance to attend college showcases?   Do they have their own showcase or is it mixed with the ECNL teams?   Trying to determine how an ecrl player can get a path to a College scholarship.


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## Messi>CR7

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Do ECRL teams have a chance to attend college showcases?   Do they have their own showcase or is it mixed with the ECNL teams?   Trying to determine how an ecrl player can get a path to a College scholarship.











						ECNL Girls
					

Date: April 1-3, 2022 (Fri.-Sun.)  Age Groups: U15-U18/U19 National Event  Team List: CLICK HERE to view  Facility: Legacy Sports USA   	Facility Parking Fee: More information coming soon!  Schedule: CLICK HERE  Scout Attendance: CLICK HERE  Travel Information:   	Hotel Lottery:   Please...




					www.ecnlgirls.com
				




Some poster mentioned that ECRL league champion also has a path to one of ECNL's post season tiers (but not the highest tier Champions League), but I'm not familiar with the details.


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## Kicker 2.0

Messi>CR7 said:


> ECNL Girls
> 
> 
> Date: April 1-3, 2022 (Fri.-Sun.)  Age Groups: U15-U18/U19 National Event  Team List: CLICK HERE to view  Facility: Legacy Sports USA   	Facility Parking Fee: More information coming soon!  Schedule: CLICK HERE  Scout Attendance: CLICK HERE  Travel Information:   	Hotel Lottery:   Please...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ecnlgirls.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some poster mentioned that ECRL league champion also has a path to one of ECNL's post season tiers (but not the highest tier Champions League), but I'm not familiar with the details.


That is correct.  My DD’s team won the league and went on to play in FL in a lower division “championship”.


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## LouSag

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Do ECRL teams have a chance to attend college showcases?   Do they have their own showcase or is it mixed with the ECNL teams?   Trying to determine how an ecrl player can get a path to a College scholarship.


ECRL just had their own dedicated showcase in Florida last month for the first time.
They have another showcase in AZ for ECRL in early April.
This year, they have the first ECRL national playoff this summer.


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## COSMOS

How is this not the 'pool play' that has been discussed on other threads that seems to be contentious?


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## GT45

Because every club essentially has separate ECNL and ECRL teams with different coaches. The rules allow you to move players between the teams if injuries, absenses, etc require it, but they are separate teams.


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## #girldad

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Do ECRL teams have a chance to attend college showcases?   Do they have their own showcase or is it mixed with the ECNL teams?   Trying to determine how an ecrl player can get a path to a College scholarship.


There is an ECNL and ECRL Showcase April 1-4 in Arizona...ECNL is at the Reach 11 Complex and the ECRL is at the new Legacy Sports Park in Mesa...Where will the college scouts go? Strange they have it at the same time.


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## Kicker 2.0

#girldad said:


> There is an ECNL and ECRL Showcase April 1-4 in Arizona...ECNL is at the Reach 11 Complex and the ECRL is at the new Legacy Sports Park in Mesa...Where will the college scouts go? Strange they have it at the same time.


Not really.  Coaches will bring additional staff to scout multiple games.  If your DD is putting in the work, there will be resources there to scout her.


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## Speed

SoccerFan4Life said:


> Do ECRL teams have a chance to attend college showcases?   Do they have their own showcase or is it mixed with the ECNL teams?   Trying to determine how an ecrl player can get a path to a College scholarship.





SoccerFan4Life said:


> Do ECRL teams have a chance to attend college showcases?   Do they have their own showcase or is it mixed with the ECNL teams?   Trying to determine how an ecrl player can get a path to a College scholarship.


A player that wants a path for college soccer needs to make pave the way themselves. Sure a higher level team will help but there is a lot of footwork to be done by the player in reaching out to coaches. The best bet is to have good grades and get an academic scholarship and any athletic money is a bonus. Athletic money is very limited.


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## GT45

Kicker 2.0 said:


> Not really.  Coaches will bring additional staff to scout multiple games.  If your DD is putting in the work, there will be resources there to scout her.


Also, the ECRL showcase is Fri-Sunday.

The ECNL showcase is Sat-Monday.


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## LASTMAN14

GT45 said:


> Also, the ECRL showcase is Fri-Sunday.
> 
> The ECNL showcase is Sat-Monday.


Please remind me to not send you a holiday card. Because it’s so expected and after the fact.


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## GT45

LASTMAN14 said:


> Please remind me to not send you a holiday card. Because it’s so expected and after the fact.


I have no idea what this means.


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## Carlsbad7

Here's the G2010 Socal State Cup knockout bracket.


			http://www.socalstatecup.com/_element_display/#%2F74955%2Fschedules%2F106393470%2F106393571-br.html%3Frnd%3D1646253205893
		


For Non ECNL clubs...
- At the Semi Final level = CitySC
- At the Quarter Final level = Albion + 2x CitySC teams
- At the Fist Elimination level = Liverpool International + Ole + Arsenal + Albion + 2x CitySC teams

2010 is a good year to use a metric because after club top teams change paths into ECNL, GA, Socal, etc + players switch teams/clubs.


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## NoSouppForYou

Carlsbad7 said:


> Here's the G2010 Socal State Cup knockout bracket.
> 
> 
> http://www.socalstatecup.com/_element_display/#%2F74955%2Fschedules%2F106393470%2F106393571-br.html%3Frnd%3D1646253205893
> 
> 
> 
> For Non ECNL clubs...
> - At the Semi Final level = CitySC
> - At the Quarter Final level = Albion + 2x CitySC teams
> - At the Fist Elimination level = Liverpool International + Ole + Arsenal + Albion + 2x CitySC teams
> 
> 2010 is a good year to use a metric because after club top teams change paths into ECNL, GA, Socal, etc + players switch teams/clubs.


In case you are not aware, Duggan will never get ECNL. Applied every year before DA, has applied every year after DA. Fire Duggan, change the name to something that reflects Carlsbad (Carlsbad is a village not a city ), bring back the young coaches like AW and BG that developed the older girls at the club, and maybe you have a chance at ECNL. Then you might get the dozens of carlsbad girls at Surf, Blues, and Koge back to play in carlsbad.


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## Brav520

NoSouppForYou said:


> In case you are not aware, Duggan will never get ECNL. Applied every year before DA, has applied every year after DA. Fire Duggan, change the name to something that reflects Carlsbad (Carlsbad is a village not a city ), bring back the young coaches like AW and BG that developed the older girls at the club, and maybe you have a chance at ECNL. Then you might get the dozens of carlsbad girls at Surf, Blues, and Koge back to play in carlsbad.


the bigger roadblock is probably getting Surf, Blues , and Koge to agree


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## LASTMAN14

Brav520 said:


> the bigger roadblock is probably getting Surf, Blues , and Koge to agree


Did they agree to have Legends and Beach in?


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## Carlsbad7

NoSouppForYou said:


> In case you are not aware, Duggan will never get ECNL. Applied every year before DA, has applied every year after DA. Fire Duggan, change the name to something that reflects Carlsbad (Carlsbad is a village not a city ), bring back the young coaches like AW and BG that developed the older girls at the club, and maybe you have a chance at ECNL. Then you might get the dozens of carlsbad girls at Surf, Blues, and Koge back to play in carlsbad.


So... Shannon Mac is allowed to lose by 6+ goals across all age groups + play ECNL.

But, Duggan who wins more than he loses is not alowed to play ECNL.

Seems like an odd choice + not something that's in the kids best interest.


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## Brav520

LASTMAN14 said:


> Did they agree to have Legends and Beach in?


no clue


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## Goforgoal

Carlsbad7 said:


> So... Shannon Mac is allowed to lose by 6+ goals across all age groups + play ECNL.
> 
> But, Duggan who wins more than he loses is not alowed to play ECNL.
> 
> Seems like an odd choice + not something that's in the kids best interest.


You know full well that Sharks (and probably Rebels) gained ECNL solely because of the shift in power to GDA during those years and the ECNL vaccum it created in San Diego. Duggan was perfectly happy not applying to ECNL when his teams were competing in the DA.

In the end I'm still not sure what's more difficult, gaining ECNL inclusion or getting booted out.


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## LASTMAN14

Brav520 said:


> no clue


It’s a process that is no longer dictated by SoCal Clubs.


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## Sike

LASTMAN14 said:


> It’s a process that is no longer dictated by SoCal Clubs.


I'm not sure I agree.  If Pats gets in next year, I am going to feel pretty strongly that it is mostly just dictated by who the existing ECNL clubs want to allow in.


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## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> I'm not sure I agree.  If Pats gets in next year, I am going to feel pretty strongly that it is mostly just dictated by who the existing ECNL clubs want to allow in.


How does letting Pats in help any existing ECNL members?

I don’t think I understand the angle.


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## NoSouppForYou

Carlsbad7 said:


> So... Shannon Mac is allowed to lose by 6+ goals across all age groups + play ECNL.
> 
> But, Duggan who wins more than he loses is not alowed to play ECNL.
> 
> Seems like an odd choice + not something that's in the kids best interest.


Anyone can win in GA even despite pulling the Duggan anchor around.  Get rid of him and you might have a top ten club n the nation, get into the top 4 of SoCal with Surf, Blues, and Koge. Atleast 4 Carlsbad kids per age group at those three clubs, some age groups >10.


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## LASTMAN14

Sike said:


> I'm not sure I agree.  If Pats gets in next year, I am going to feel pretty strongly that it is mostly just dictated by who the existing ECNL clubs want to allow in.


DA changed the process. OC clubs said that Beach and Legends would take years. I recall them telling me. That didn’t happen.


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## GT45

Kicker 2.0 said:


> How does letting Pats in help any existing ECNL members?
> 
> I don’t think I understand the angle.


If Pats get in it is because ECNL forces it (they have boys ECNL). There is no way the So Cal teams want another ECNL club, most especially the Orange County teams. Nevada should have a second team, if one is added (for travel purposes). But, Heat wants the monopoly on Nevada kids and their director leads the SW conference.


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## Avanti

LASTMAN14 said:


> DA changed the process. OC clubs said that Beach and Legends would take years. I recall them telling me. That didn’t happen.


After the DA unfortunate debacle, the Slammer coaches expected these clubs to remain out of ECNL for a number of years. So somebody else got to decide the admission (at least that time).


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## Kicker 2.0

GT45 said:


> If Pats get in it is because ECNL forces it (they have boys ECNL). There is no way the So Cal teams want another ECNL club, most especially the Orange County teams. Nevada should have a second team, if one is added (for travel purposes). But, Heat wants the monopoly on Nevada kids and their director leads the SW conference.


That’s kinda my point.  Why would the SoCal Clubs want Pat’s in?


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## NewUser27

couple of name changes with clubs next year, wonder how that will effect ecnl/ecrl .


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## Carlsbad7

NoSouppForYou said:


> Anyone can win in GA even despite pulling the Duggan anchor around.  Get rid of him and you might have a top ten club n the nation, get into the top 4 of SoCal with Surf, Blues, and Koge. Atleast 4 Carlsbad kids per age group at those three clubs, some age groups >10.


I agree with you. 

I'm only highlighting the big secret that everyone knows but nobody wants to talk about. 

The Carlsbad area produces a lot of top talent + could easily field competitive ECNL teams.


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## Soccerhelper

Carlsbad7 said:


> I agree with you.
> 
> I'm only highlighting the big secret that everyone knows but nobody wants to talk about.
> 
> The Carlsbad area produces a lot of top talent + could easily field competitive ECNL teams.


I agree 100%.  Carlsbad City produces some really good talent.  I heard that their was bad blood with three clubs in socal before the GDA.  ECNL blocked three top clubs so they went all in with the fully funded GDA.  Slammers changed their mind at the last minute and got two teams from ECNL for that decision.  These men never ever thought about how hard this would be for the girls and their families.  They changed the age calendar to boot and added so much confusion in the leagues, there all watered down and the mental abuse came with it.


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## jimlewis

Carlsbad7 said:


> So... Shannon Mac is allowed to lose by 6+ goals across all age groups + play ECNL.
> 
> But, Duggan who wins more than he loses is not alowed to play ECNL.
> 
> Seems like an odd choice + not something that's in the kids best interest.


Aren't the Sharks turning it around?


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## Carlsbad7

jimlewis said:


> Aren't the Sharks turning it around?


MW's G2010s will likely be respectable.

I don't predict any major changes in the rest of the teams on the girls side.


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## Brav520

Carlsbad7 said:


> MW's G2010s will likely be respectable.
> 
> I don't predict any major changes in the rest of the teams on the girls side.


are any of the youngers moving  over to Surf to follow , sorry the name escapes me


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## Carlsbad7

Brav520 said:


> are any of the youngers moving  over to Surf to follow , sorry the name escapes me


Rumor is that with AW at Surf all the youngers are choosing to play Surf A B and C teams over Sharks A teams.

Amazing to hear that anyone would choose a Surf B/C team over XYZ club A team.

Hopefully AW can change the culture at Surf regarding B/C teams. (I think he will) Bringing up from within is logical + more players ='s more $$$.


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## Brav520

Carlsbad7 said:


> Rumor is that with AW at Surf all the youngers are choosing to play Surf A B and C teams over Sharks A teams.
> 
> Amazing to hear that anyone would choose a Surf B/C team over XYZ club A team.
> 
> Hopefully AW can change the culture at Surf regarding B/C teams. (I think he will) Bringing up from within is logical + more players ='s more $$$.


what about the CITY SC teams, any of the girls following him, specifically any off the 2012 team ?


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## Carlsbad7

Brav520 said:


> what about the CITY SC teams, any of the girls following him, specifically any off the 2012 team ?


I've heard yes some have.


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## GoldenGate

Soccerhelper said:


> They changed the age calendar to boot and added so much confusion in the leagues, there all watered down and the mental abuse came with it.


I remember exactly where I was standing when I learned the youth soccer age cut-off had changed from Sept to Jan, triggering perhaps the greatest mental health crisis in our nation's history.  And then they stole what l was little was left of our children's self-esteem by making them play in watered down leagues that were beneath their dignity. That's why I have always advocated for an annual soccer club day of remembrance.  Wanna donate to my foundation?


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## Soccerhelper

GoldenGate said:


> I remember exactly where I was standing when I learned the youth soccer age cut-off had changed from Sept to Jan, triggering perhaps the greatest mental health crisis in our nation's history.  And then they stole what l was little was left of our children's self-esteem by making them play in watered down leagues that were beneath their dignity. That's why I have always advocated for an annual soccer club day of remembrance.  Wanna donate to my foundation?


It was mental for sure for many 04s, and 05s coach Golden Gate.  Girls were trying out to play for the first ever U14 YNT.  How long have you been making dirty money sir?


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## Sike

Kicker 2.0 said:


> How does letting Pats in help any existing ECNL members?
> 
> I don’t think I understand the angle.


I am saying it won't be about a "process".  It will be about who Pats leadership is in with at ECNL leadership (which is the main reason Pats changed leadership on the girls side).  If it was about a real process, they wouldn't grant entry to a club with a bunch of bad teams in a location that already has plenty of teams.


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## Sike

LASTMAN14 said:


> DA changed the process. OC clubs said that Beach and Legends would take years. I recall them telling me. That didn’t happen.


I heard early on (this forum and elsewhere) that Beach and Legends were going all in on ECRL and expected to be granted ECNL within a year or maybe two.  I heard from other ECNL teams that it would take Beach and Legends years to get ECNL, which I think was primarily so they could try to take players from those clubs (which was successful in some cases).


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## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> I heard early on (this forum and elsewhere) that Beach and Legends were going all in on ECRL and expected to be granted ECNL within a year or maybe two.  I heard from other ECNL teams that it would take Beach and Legends years to get ECNL, which I think was primarily so they could try to take players from those clubs (which was successful in some cases).


True…the “carrot” was dangled for them to put their Top teams in ECRL, perform and the door may be opened.


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## Soccerhelper

Sike said:


> I heard early on (this forum and elsewhere) that Beach and Legends were going all in on ECRL and expected to be granted ECNL within a year or maybe two.  I heard from other ECNL teams that it would take Beach and Legends years to get ECNL, which I think was primarily so they could try to take players from those clubs (which was successful in some cases).


Not a rumor.  Ashley Sanchez and my dd left Legends to Blues the same year and Beach got poached big time, all the time before they got GDA off the ground in socal.  They also took the YNT list with them and all followed like sheep.  Like I said a million times, my kid was caught in the cross hairs.  Ashley was older and super good.  My little one was 11.  Losing top players when their 11 years old hurt clubs like Beach and Legends and I understand how angry they would be and why they needed to go all in with GDA.  Carlsbad had no choice either.  The kids got stuck in the middle of a turf war.


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## GoldenGate

Soccerhelper said:


> It was mental for sure for many 04s, and 05s coach Golden Gate.  Girls were trying out to play for the first ever U14 YNT.  How long have you been making dirty money sir?


Weird, it never got in the way of my kid playing for the YNT.  But just to make sure I have this straight, you're upset because you think your kid didn't make the YNT due to the age cut-off change, presumably because it forced your kid to play with the big girls, right?  You believe she was good enough to play for the U14 team but not to make the U15 team, so therefore it is a humanitarian crisis?   Do I have that right?  

It is really sad that your kid's youth soccer experience was so important but disappointing for you.  It must also must bug the heck out of you that mine did play for the YNT, now plays at her dream school, and both she and I loved every minute of her youth soccer experience, largely because we never took it that seriously and really just loved the time we were able to spend together while she grew up.  We lived through the exact same times, subject to the exact same youth soccer changes and the exact same pandemic.  In fact, my daughter's experience may have been harder than yours since yours didn't miss prom, graduation, much of her senior year, half of her freshman year that should have been at college, all on lockdown.  And you know what, those times were some of the best we ever had because we took responsibility for our own success and happiness instead of feeling sorry for ourselves and blaming everyone around us.  

It could not be more true that life is what you make it, and look what you made.  You squandered what could have been four of the best years you could ever hope to have with your kid. They are gone forever.  You spent the last four years doing nothing but complain about how your daughter's soccer was a disappointment for you.  How sure are you that she believed all of your lame excuses instead of actually hearing what I and pretty much everyone here believes but you won't admit, which is that you were disappointed in her for what she wasn't able to accomplish? Couldn't make the YNT, you have a lame excuse.  Couldn't carry her HS team to glory, more lame excuses.  Couldn't win another "national championship" after middle school, yet more ridiculous excuses.  Wasn't good enough to go pro after she turned 18, well that was a middle school club coach's fault, he brainwashed you into telling college coaches to go away. 

You have only a few months left before the two of you may never live under the same roof again.  What are you going to do?  More of the same?


----------



## Soccerhelper

GoldenGate said:


> Weird, it never got in the way of my kid playing for the YNT.  But just to make sure I have this straight, you're upset because you think your kid didn't make the YNT due to the age cut-off change, presumably because it forced your kid to play with the big girls, right?  You believe she was good enough to play for the U14 team but not to make the U15 team, so therefore it is a humanitarian crisis?   Do I have that right?
> 
> It is really sad that your kid's youth soccer experience was so important but disappointing for you.  It must also must bug the heck out of you that mine did play for the YNT, now plays at her dream school, and both she and I loved every minute of her youth soccer experience, largely because we never took it that seriously and really just loved the time we were able to spend together while she grew up.  We lived through the exact same times, subject to the exact same youth soccer changes and the exact same pandemic.  In fact, my daughter's experience may have been harder than yours since yours didn't miss prom, graduation, much of her senior year, half of her freshman year that should have been at college, all on lockdown.  And you know what, those times were some of the best we ever had because we took responsibility for our own success and happiness instead of feeling sorry for ourselves and blaming everyone around us.
> 
> It could not be more true that life is what you make it, and look what you made.  You squandered what could have been four of the best years you could ever hope to have with your kid. They are gone forever.  You spent the last four years doing nothing but complain about how your daughter's soccer was a disappointment for you.  How sure are you that she believed all of your lame excuses instead of actually hearing what I and pretty much everyone here believes but you won't admit, which is that you were disappointed in her for what she wasn't able to accomplish? Couldn't make the YNT, you have a lame excuse.  Couldn't carry her HS team to glory, more lame excuses.  Couldn't win another "national championship" after middle school, yet more ridiculous excuses.  Wasn't good enough to go pro after she turned 18, well that was a middle school club coach's fault, he brainwashed you into telling college coaches to go away.
> 
> You have only a few months left before the two of you may never live under the same roof again.  What are you going to do?  More of the same?


Is this all you do on here?  You know so much about me and my dd.  Enjoy telling evryone on here to get the jab.  I will not, ever loser!!!  Plus, my kid only went for one chance, the U14 team loser and you and all the other elitist coaches on here lied.  Who is your dd?


----------



## Soccerhelper

Plus, the greatest and most amazing thing in all this is she dodged a bullet and a nightmare by not having to take the jab, like some did because of fraud.  You will go down as the biggest liar and helper of death then anyone on this forum.  I am anti vax and I am anti boosters and I will never shrink from that asshole.  You are pushing death!!!  I'm sure you forced your dd to get the jab or else?  Nice move dad, if your telling the truth.  I think your a coach or a few avatars on here play Golden Gate.  You obviously have threaten my dd on here on numerous occassions.  She did try with the help of her friends.  When she started her HSS career, we were D3 and we had some hope.  Fast forward to her last year and well, she went big time D1 brah and missed playoffs by a tie breaker.  It happens.  I will let her know that monster man who is full of shit say's hi!!!


----------



## GoldenGate

Soccerhelper said:


> Not a rumor.  Ashley Sanchez and my dd left Legends to Blues the same year and Beach got poached big time, all the time before they got GDA off the ground in socal.  They also took the YNT list with them and all followed like sheep.  Like I said a million times, my kid was caught in the cross hairs.  Ashley was older and super good.  My little one was 11.  Losing top players when their 11 years old hurt clubs like Beach and Legends and I understand how angry they would be and why they needed to go all in with GDA.  Carlsbad had no choice either.  The kids got stuck in the middle of a turf war.


I heard the FBI investigated the incident, but the club DOCs managed to hide the incriminating YNT list in the same place they hid Hillary's emails.


----------



## Speedy

Carlsbad7 said:


> I've heard yes some have.


Just the ones willing to pay for extra training to keep their spot on the field


----------



## Soccerhelper

GoldenGate said:


> I heard the FBI investigated the incident, but the club DOCs managed to hide the incriminating YNT list in the same place they hid Hillary's emails.


Hahahaha.  Good one Golden Gate.  Listen, this is the last you will here from me.  I have ignored you.  Someone warned me about you and I will head their advice.  You are being watched, FYI!!!  Leave my dd alone is my best advice and stop threatening her.  You know way to much now about us and I have already let the Pros know about you and another one on here.  You are 100% being watched and so am I.  Let's see whose truth holds up a year or two from now.


----------



## GoldenGate

Soccerhelper said:


> Hahahaha.  Good one Golden Gate.  Listen, this is the last you will here from me.  I have ignored you.  Someone warned me about you and I will head their advice.  You are being watched, FYI!!!  Leave my dd alone is my best advice and stop threatening her.  You know way to much now about us and I have already let the Pros know about you and another one on here.  You are 100% being watched and so am I.  Let's see whose truth holds up a year or two from now.


Thank goodness, now I can make fun of you in peace without having you respond with more blathering.  But of course we both know you can't help yourself.


----------



## jimlewis

Carlsbad7 said:


> MW's G2010s will likely be respectable.
> 
> I don't predict any major changes in the rest of the teams on the girls side.


Sharks 2010 didnt do so well looking at league.  Hearing that they are bringing in some good players at older years.  Will be interesting to see what happens going forward.


----------



## LouSag

Carlsbad7 said:


> Rumor is that with AW at Surf all the youngers are choosing to play Surf A B and C teams over Sharks A teams.
> 
> Amazing to hear that anyone would choose a Surf B/C team over XYZ club A team.
> 
> Hopefully AW can change the culture at Surf regarding B/C teams. (I think he will) Bringing up from within is logical + more players ='s more $$$.


There are many ECRL players at Surf in the ‘05 to ‘08s that choose to play on Surf’s B team (as you put it) instead of playing at Sharks ECNL and losing by 6+ goals or other weaker ECNL teams.  The same thing happens at Blues and LAFC/Kobe.   I’m guessing it’s for the quality coaching, development, facilities, etc…


----------



## Carlsbad7

LouSag said:


> There are many ECRL players at Surf in the ‘05 to ‘08s that choose to play on Surf’s B team (as you put it) instead of playing at Sharks ECNL and losing by 6+ goals or other weaker ECNL teams.  The same thing happens at Blues and LAFC/Kobe.   I’m guessing it’s for the quality coaching, development, facilities, etc…


I agree, but I think you missed my point. 

Traditionally Surf isnt known for recruiting from within. It used to be if you play on a B team at Surf you stay on a B team.

I think its great that AW can bring in A, B, and C level players + Surf is supporting them. I hope the trend continues + I hope Surf starts bringing up from within.


----------



## Goforgoal

jimlewis said:


> Sharks 2010 didnt do so well looking at league.  Hearing that they are bringing in some good players at older years.  Will be interesting to see what happens going forward.


That was the original Sharks 2010s. The Albion  2010s that moved with MW played up with the 09s this past fall. I believe they added a couple from City and other clubs to round the new team out. They won't be beating Surf, Blues or Slammers anytime soon but should be much improved entering the age group's inaugural ECNL season.


----------



## Dan

Any truth to the rumor that the bigger ECNL clubs are going to get a second ECRL team?


----------



## Messi>CR7

Dan said:


> Any truth to the rumor that the bigger ECNL clubs are going to get a second ECRL team?


Second ECNL or second ECRL team?


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Messi>CR7 said:


> Second ECNL or second ECRL team?


I don’t know what’s worse, bigger clubs trying to sell the value of a 2nd ecrl team to parents or parents falling for this.  You dilute the product and  you dilute the overall program.


----------



## Carlsbad7

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I don’t know what’s worse, bigger clubs trying to sell the value of a 2nd ecrl team to parents or parents falling for this.  You dilute the product and  you dilute the overall program.


Why does it matter if a club has 2 ECRL teams? You're talking about 2x 2nd teams.

Last year ECNL made changes that allow coaches to play any rostered ECNL or ECRL player in an ECNL game. If you have 2x ECRL teams you have twice the amount of potential ECNL call ups.

Maybe having 2x ECRL teams will dilute the ECRL product. But who cares? Clubs with poor "diluted" ECRL teams will lose.

Personally I think allowing 2x ECRL teams is a trial balloon for allowing certain clubs to field 2x ECNL teams. Clubs like Surf or Blues could easily field 2 quality ECNL teams if given the chance.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

[/QUOTE]


Carlsbad7 said:


> Why does it matter if a club has 2 ECRL teams? You're talking about 2x 2nd teams.
> 
> Last year ECNL made changes that allow coaches to play any rostered ECNL or ECRL player in an ECNL game. If you have 2x ECRL teams you have twice the amount of potential ECNL call ups.
> 
> Maybe having 2x ECRL teams will dilute the ECRL product. But who cares? Clubs with poor "diluted" ECRL teams will lose.
> 
> Personally I think allowing 2x ECRL teams is a trial balloon for allowing certain clubs to field 2x ECNL teams. Clubs like Surf or Blues could easily field 2 quality ECNL teams if given the chance.



Why would I want my kid to be part of the Reserve team of the reserve team?   For the current ECRL players, why would they want more competition to play up on the ECNL team?        Keep in mind many of these poor ECRL teams can barely beat flight 1 teams.    How do you allow the 'top ECNL" teams to have more than 2 teams but not allow the "bottom" teams to add?    Why stop at 2 ECRL teams, go for 5!!!! 

  It's all a money making machine with no shame!!!


----------



## timbuck

Dan said:


> Any truth to the rumor that the bigger ECNL clubs are going to get a second ECRL team?


If this is the case- Say goodbye to local leagues/local clubs.


----------



## jimlewis

Carlsbad7 said:


> Why does it matter if a club has 2 ECRL teams? You're talking about 2x 2nd teams.
> 
> Last year ECNL made changes that allow coaches to play any rostered ECNL or ECRL player in an ECNL game. If you have 2x ECRL teams you have twice the amount of potential ECNL call ups.
> 
> Maybe having 2x ECRL teams will dilute the ECRL product. But who cares? Clubs with poor "diluted" ECRL teams will lose.
> 
> Personally I think allowing 2x ECRL teams is a trial balloon for allowing certain clubs to field 2x ECNL teams. Clubs like Surf or Blues could easily field 2 quality ECNL teams if given the chance.


while youre at it, just eliminate every club in ecnl except blues and surf and give each 10 ECNL teams.


----------



## Carlsbad7

jimlewis said:


> while youre at it, just eliminate every club in ecnl except blues and surf and give each 10 ECNL teams.


Why is 2 ECNL teams an issue if the club continues to field top level competitive teams?

If other clubs could field multiple competitive teams they should have the opportunity as well.

Limiting a club to 1 ECNL team seems like an arbitrary rule that's not in the kids best interest. It does seem like a way to give non performing clubs a way to suck and still make $$$.


----------



## jimlewis

Carlsbad7 said:


> Why is 2 ECNL teams an issue if the club continues to field top level competitive teams?
> 
> If other clubs could field multiple competitive teams they should have the opportunity as well.
> 
> Limiting a club to 1 ECNL team seems like an arbitrary rule that's not in the kids best interest. It does seem like a way to give non performing clubs a way to suck and still make $$$.


slippery slope.  why stop at 2? why not 10?  then they charge 10k a kid.  Slammers already have 2 anyways.  and you dont just magically create additional great soccer players.  who do you think makes up that 2nd ecnl team?  most likely kids from the "clubs that suck"...


----------



## Carlsbad7

jimlewis said:


> slippery slope.  why stop at 2? why not 10?  then they charge 10k a kid.  Slammers already have 2 anyways.  and you dont just magically create additional great soccer players.  who do you think makes up that 2nd ecnl team?  most likely kids from the "clubs that suck"...


I agree they would come from the clubs that suck. 

How is this a bad thing for top talent? They'd be able to play for a club that has the ability to win.


----------



## GoldenGate

jimlewis said:


> slippery slope.  why stop at 2? why not 10?  then they charge 10k a kid.  Slammers already have 2 anyways.  and you dont just magically create additional great soccer players.  who do you think makes up that 2nd ecnl team?  most likely kids from the "clubs that suck"...


I would recommend that you take a starter course in economics.


----------



## Squishy

Carlsbad7 said:


> I agree they would come from the clubs that suck.
> 
> How is this a bad thing for top talent? They'd be able to play for a club that has the ability to win.



A lot of the smaller clubs "that suck" do have one or two players that are significantly better than their teammates.  Those better players want to play with others that are at their level or higher.   In order to be the best you have to play with/against the best.  If you have a proven product and are able to recruit, you get a few of these players together and now you have yourself a very competitive team.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Squishy said:


> A lot of the smaller clubs "that suck" do have one or two players that are significantly better than their teammates.  Those better players want to play with others that are at their level or higher.   In order to be the best you have to play with/against the best.  If you have a proven product and are able to recruit, you get a few of these players together and now you have yourself a very competitive team.


I agree with you on all points. But what you're describing is not occurring at clubs that suck. Why should kids be penalized + forced to play ECNL for a poor club with poor coaching when the exact opposite would occur if winning clubs were allowed 2 ECNL teams?


----------



## FernandoFromNationalCity

ECNL GIRLS PROMOTES FIVE CLUBS FROM REGIONAL LEAGUE TO CLUB COMPETITION FOR 2022-23 SEASON
					

ECNL Girls is extremely excited to announce the addition of five new clubs into the Club Competition for the 2022-23 season: Beach FC (VA), Florida Premier FC, Florida West, Pateadores (CA) and Rockford Raptors (IL). Beach FC (VA) will be joining the Mid-Atlantic Conference, Florida Premier and...




					www.ecnlgirls.com


----------



## Kicker 2.0

FernandoFromNationalCity said:


> ECNL GIRLS PROMOTES FIVE CLUBS FROM REGIONAL LEAGUE TO CLUB COMPETITION FOR 2022-23 SEASON
> 
> 
> ECNL Girls is extremely excited to announce the addition of five new clubs into the Club Competition for the 2022-23 season: Beach FC (VA), Florida Premier FC, Florida West, Pateadores (CA) and Rockford Raptors (IL). Beach FC (VA) will be joining the Mid-Atlantic Conference, Florida Premier and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ecnlgirls.com


So now how many ECNL clubs train and play at OC GP?  4 or 5?


----------



## FernandoFromNationalCity

Kicker 2.0 said:


> So now how many ECNL clubs train and play at OC GP?  4 or 5?


4 I think..


----------



## Sike

Sike said:


> I don't think they believe results this year will be a criteria.  They are the only SW RCNL team without ECNL and it evens out the number of teams in ECNL.  They didn't hire Dodge to build an ECRL program...they hired him because of is ties to ECNL leadership from his time with Blues.


Pats are officially in for next year.


----------



## Kicker 2.0

Sike said:


> Pats are officially in for next year.


Happy for them!


----------



## 05Parent

FernandoFromNationalCity said:


> ECNL GIRLS PROMOTES FIVE CLUBS FROM REGIONAL LEAGUE TO CLUB COMPETITION FOR 2022-23 SEASON
> 
> 
> ECNL Girls is extremely excited to announce the addition of five new clubs into the Club Competition for the 2022-23 season: Beach FC (VA), Florida Premier FC, Florida West, Pateadores (CA) and Rockford Raptors (IL). Beach FC (VA) will be joining the Mid-Atlantic Conference, Florida Premier and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ecnlgirls.com


Congratulations to Pats.


----------



## timbuck

Does this put the nail in the coffin for West Coast's chances of ECNL?
GAL / DPL -  solid league outside of SoCal.


----------



## Calikid

timbuck said:


> Does this put the nail in the coffin for West Coast's chances of ECNL?
> GAL / DPL -  solid league outside of SoCal.


I believe that West Coast went all in on GA. Could be because they got the vibe that ECNL didn't want them.


----------



## Footy30

Congrats to Pats and the girls!! and now there are an even amount of teams! 
Win for neurotic people like myself!! It was killing me that the number was uneven.


----------



## Surf Zombie

So all five clubs, according to the press release, excelled in the ECNL regional league, just like Beach & Legends did last year, and that was the basis for their admission. 

I wonder if that influences the decisions of any current GA clubs who would prefer to be in ECNL but have thus far been denied admission? Is the formula to leave the GA, crush it for a year or two in the RL and hope the ECNL eventually lets them in?  

Take clubs like Top Hat, FC Virginia or Nationals, I’d have to imagine they would win every RL division with their top teams playing ECNL clubs second teams. They’d be calling the ECNL’s hand for sure.


----------



## Nextbigthing

Surf Zombie said:


> So all five clubs, according to the press release, excelled in the ECNL regional league, just like Beach & Legends did last year, and that was the basis for their admission.
> 
> I wonder if that influences the decisions of any current GA clubs who would prefer to be in ECNL but have thus far been denied admission? Is the formula to leave the GA, crush it for a year or two in the RL and hope the ECNL eventually lets them in?
> 
> Take clubs like Top Hat, FC Virginia or Nationals, I’d have to imagine they would win every RL division with their top teams playing ECNL clubs second teams. They’d be calling the ECNL’s hand for sure.


Pats in the Southwest division had only 2 teams in the top 4 of their age groups so far this year.  I wouldn't call that excelling in regional league considering they are playing against the 2nd team from Blues, Surf, Legends etc....  Be careful what you wish for. Its going to be a rough year for Pats in ECNL next year.


----------



## Larzby

Pateadores didn't do great at most age groups in RL, and now they have to play up another level, and to improve they have to compete for players with all the strong neighboring OC teams. Very tough.


----------



## ToonArmy

Definitely will be tough to compete but they will also definitely improve from this years teams. With ECNL rosters carrying upwards of 23 players i imagine many players on the local ECNL rosters that don't get much playing time will be trying out for Pats. Doesnt necessarily make them competitive in ECNL but will be improvement. Also I imagine the better players on west coast younger GA teams will also go over. Those two clubs have been passing players back and forth since Pats was given DA and offered fully funded. Most of the top players from both clubs already left for ECNL clubs once DA collapsed. Then west coast had the upper hand on the middle tier players at the clubs because GA was more attractive to them than ECNL regional league. Now Pats is more attractive. Again doesn't make them competitive in ECNL but probably better than they were this year. Really hurts West Coast youngers. too many better options in same backyard. One way to stick a fork in west coast is if Liverpool who has DPL got in to GA which im sure West Coast is begging GA not to let happen.


----------



## Sike

Larzby said:


> Pateadores didn't do great at most age groups in RL, and now they have to play up another level, and to improve they have to compete for players with all the strong neighboring OC teams. Very tough.


I agree that, on the surface, Pats should not be very competitive in ECNL at most age groups initially.  But what if they can recruit some coaches (and their current players) to come over.  If so, they could at least become competitive very quickly.  For instance, could they convince one of the Blues coaches to come over?  And I will throw this out there too, what if Dodge can convince Baker to come back to coaching? Baker taking over some of the younger ECNL teams at Pats would help them build a competitive ECNL club very quickly.


----------



## LouSag

Nextbigthing said:


> Pats in the Southwest division had only 2 teams in the top 4 of their age groups so far this year.  I wouldn't call that excelling in regional league considering they are playing against the 2nd team from Blues, Surf, Legends etc....  Be careful what you wish for. Its going to be a rough year for Pats in ECNL next year.


At least Sharks have a legitimate chance at one league win now.


----------



## Sunil Illuminati

LouSag said:


> At least Sharks have a legitimate chance at one league win now.


I think Pats are banking on that for their win.


----------



## Royal26

Nextbigthing said:


> Pats in the Southwest division had only 2 teams in the top 4 of their age groups so far this year.  I wouldn't call that excelling in regional league considering they are playing against the 2nd team from Blues, Surf, Legends etc....  Be careful what you wish for. Its going to be a rough year for Pats in ECNL next year.


Most of the PATS ECRL teams had players play up a year. The 06 team had mostly 07 players. 05 had a bunch of 06s. Still plenty room for improvement.


----------



## Royal26

Sike said:


> I agree that, on the surface, Pats should not be very competitive in ECNL at most age groups initially.  But what if they can recruit some coaches (and their current players) to come over.  If so, they could at least become competitive very quickly.  For instance, could they convince one of the Blues coaches to come over?  And I will throw this out there too, what if Dodge can convince Baker to come back to coaching? Baker taking over some of the younger ECNL teams at Pats would help them build a competitive ECNL club very quickly.


That would be a huge pick up for PATS. Long shot but Baker and Dodge buddies.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

South OC now has the following ECNL teams: Strikers, Pats, Blues, Slammers (2),    How much is too much?   This is going to dilute the RL teams significantly in that region.


----------



## Goforgoal

LouSag said:


> At least Sharks have a legitimate chance at one league win now.


I realize that you're just trying come off as funny, but that's a pretty douchey comment, especially for a huge Surf homer.


----------



## Footy30

ToonArmy said:


> Definitely will be tough to compete but they will also definitely improve from this years teams. With ECNL rosters carrying upwards of 23 players i imagine many players on the local ECNL rosters that don't get much playing time will be trying out for Pats. Doesnt necessarily make them competitive in ECNL but will be improvement. Also I imagine the better players on west coast younger GA teams will also go over. Those two clubs have been passing players back and forth since Pats was given DA and offered fully funded. Most of the top players from both clubs already left for ECNL clubs once DA collapsed. Then west coast had the upper hand on the middle tier players at the clubs because GA was more attractive to them than ECNL regional league. Now Pats is more attractive. Again doesn't make them competitive in ECNL but probably better than they were this year. Really hurts West Coast youngers. too many better options in same backyard. One way to stick a fork in west coast is if Liverpool who has DPL got in to GA which im sure West Coast is begging GA not to let happen.


I agree with you 100% there will definitely be a lot of movement amongst the current OC teams, and now even more will be commuting to the OC since there is _another_ ECNL team in OC. Only time will tell what the teams will look like next year.... one thing that will most likely stay the same are the large rosters sizes, which everyone playing ECNL needs to just accept. Best of luck to everyone!


----------



## GT45

Baker had success with the Blues and Slammers brands behind him. He would not have the same success at Pats. Does anyone here believe that he could have recruited Trinitiy Rodman or Reilyn Turner to Pats? He has only won ECNL championships with those two on his roster (not one, but both at the same time).


----------



## Swoosh

GT45 said:


> Baker had success with the Blues and Slammers brands behind him. He would not have the same success at Pats. Does anyone here believe that he could have recruited Trinitiy Rodman or Reilyn Turner to Pats? He has only won ECNL championships with those two on his roster (not one, but both at the same time).


Bakers to Pats =  Slammers and Blues biggest nightmare.


----------



## Messi>CR7

Footy30 said:


> .... one thing that will most likely stay the same are the large rosters sizes, which everyone playing ECNL needs to just accept. Best of luck to everyone!


Is this universally true?  When you said large, are we talking about 20, 22, or 25?


----------



## tabletop

GT45 said:


> Baker had success with the Blues and Slammers brands behind him. He would not have the same success at Pats. Does anyone here believe that he could have recruited Trinitiy Rodman or Reilyn Turner to Pats? He has only won ECNL championships with those two on his roster (not one, but both at the same time).


That X-treme Breakaway team was pretty darn good.


----------



## Nextbigthing

Footy30 said:


> I agree with you 100% there will definitely be a lot of movement amongst the current OC teams, and now even more will be commuting to the OC since there is _another_ ECNL team in OC. Only time will tell what the teams will look like next year.... one thing that will most likely stay the same are the large rosters sizes, which everyone playing ECNL needs to just accept. Best of luck to everyone!


not sure why you think there will be alot of movement amongst OC teams.  why would any current ecnl player move to Pats?  maybe a girl whos 18-22 on their current roster might move but what does that do for Pats. There simply is not enough talent to support 5 teams in the OC!!


----------



## oh canada

Swoosh said:


> Bakers to Pats =  Slammers and Blues biggest nightmare.


Bakers to Pats = Pats parents' biggest nightmare. Do the younger parents here need to be reminded of the mental abuse endured by players on those coached teams?


----------



## Sike

oh canada said:


> Bakers to Pats = Pats parents' biggest nightmare. Do the younger parents here need to be reminded of the mental abuse endured by players on those coached teams?


You're kidding, right? Dispite all of the warnings and reminders in the past, he still recruited as well as anyone out there. If he goes to pats, they will certainly be competitive immediately.


----------



## Sike

Nextbigthing said:


> not sure why you think there will be alot of movement amongst OC teams.  why would any current ecnl player move to Pats?  maybe a girl whos 18-22 on their current roster might move but what does that do for Pats. There simply is not enough talent to support 5 teams in the OC!!


Let me give you a hypothetical.  What if the 06 blues ecrl coach and most players move to pats? That team plus a few other good players would make them immediately competitive in ecnl. There is plenty of talent in oc.


----------



## dad4

Nextbigthing said:


> not sure why you think there will be alot of movement amongst OC teams.  why would any current ecnl player move to Pats?  maybe a girl whos 18-22 on their current roster might move but what does that do for Pats. There simply is not enough talent to support 5 teams in the OC!!


Why move to Pats?  Same reasons as people move to any other team.  Maybe you like the coach.  Maybe practice is convenient.  Maybe you have a friend on the team.  Maybe you want more playing time.   Maybe your current team has a toxic parent culture.  

OC has enough talent.  Benches might get a bit thinner.  More kids will get playing time.  Solar will have an easier time winning their five thousandth championship.  And life will go on.


----------



## Nextbigthing

Sike said:


> Let me give you a hypothetical.  What if the 06 blues ecrl coach and most players move to pats? That team plus a few other good players would make them immediately competitive in ecnl. There is plenty of talent in oc.


There is plenty of talent if you want to finish in the bottom half of the table.


----------



## Sike

Nextbigthing said:


> There is plenty of talent if you want to finish in the bottom half of the table.


If that's your take then I'm going to guess you haven't seen them play and the bottom half of the ecnl sw play. They wouldn't beat koge, surf, legends or blues, but they'd give everyone else a game.

To be clear, I don't think adding pats makes ecnl better.  They should've adding a team in another geo. I'm just providing an example at one age group of how pats could compete next year. There is plenty of talent, especially with the families from north sd willing to make the drive to the gp (crazy, but true).


----------



## GT45

But top players do not migrate to Pats. That was shown with DA. Even when they were offering it free they could not get top players.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Sike said:


> If that's your take then I'm going to guess you haven't seen them play and the bottom half of the ecnl sw play. They wouldn't beat koge, surf, legends or blues, but they'd give everyone else a game.
> 
> To be clear, I don't think adding pats makes ecnl better.  They should've adding a team in another geo. I'm just providing an example at one age group of how pats could compete next year. There is plenty of talent, especially with the families from north sd willing to make the drive to the gp (crazy, but true).


Parents in North SD drive to GP because Surf and now Sharks are the only ECNL options in San Diego. Unless you want to drive to the Rebels which is nearly impossible with traffic. Ironically with traffic GP is only a 15 minutes more than the Polo fields during the summer.


----------



## Sike

Carlsbad7 said:


> Parents in North SD drive to GP because Surf and now Sharks are the only ECNL options in San Diego. Unless you want to drive to the Rebels which is nearly impossible with traffic. Ironically with traffic GP is only a 15 minutes more than the Polo fields during the summer.


Some do for sure, but we all know families that have been doing that drive since u-littles before ECNL or DA were even available to them.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Sike said:


> Some do for sure, but we all know families that have been doing that drive since u-littles before ECNL or DA were even available to them.


The bigger question is North County SD is HUGE + always has a lot of talent why isn't there a local option?

We all know the answer to this. It's just unfortunate.


----------



## Goforgoal

Carlsbad7 said:


> The bigger question is North County SD is HUGE + always has a lot of talent why isn't there a local option?
> 
> We all know the answer to this. It's just unfortunate.


There was, but US Soccer managed to F it all up.


----------



## Calikid

What Pats getting ECNL does for the girls is it allows for the players that would otherwise not receive playing time on Slammers Koge, Slammers FC, Legends, Blues and even SD Surf to be on the field for college scouts and coaches to see play. That may very well help them receive an opportunity to play soccer in college. Thus, I am all for it. Anything that helps the girls is something I am all for.


----------



## oh canada

Sike said:


> You're kidding, right? Dispite all of the warnings and reminders in the past, he still recruited as well as anyone out there. If he goes to pats, they will certainly be competitive immediately.


There are a lot of dumb parents out there, some of whom regularly post on this forum. I can't imagine willfully subjecting my child to that treatment, all for the sake of winning a few more games than another team.

Just be sure to add the cost of future therapy sessions for your dd if it happens. Of all the things I've heard from opposing sidelines over 10+ years and 3 kids, nothing comes close to the personal insults and mental abuse from that sideline.


----------



## oh canada

Calikid said:


> What Pats getting ECNL does for the girls is it allows for the players that would otherwise not receive playing time on Slammers Koge, Slammers FC, Legends, Blues and even SD Surf to be on the field for college scouts and coaches to see play. That may very well help them receive an opportunity to play soccer in college. Thus, I am all for it. Anything that helps the girls is something I am all for.


Agree. Competition is good. Choices for players and families are good. Gone are the days where two clubs in OC and one club in SD control all player pathways.


----------



## oh canada

LouSag said:


> At least Sharks have a legitimate chance at one league win now.


Agree with @Goforgoal , you might consider that some Sharks girls read these posts too. But, I know, it feeds your Surf ego to put down teenage girls. Comments like yours usually come from parents with kids who warm the bench.


----------



## BIGD

Calikid said:


> What Pats getting ECNL does for the girls is it allows for the players that would otherwise not receive playing time on Slammers Koge, Slammers FC, Legends, Blues and even SD Surf to be on the field for college scouts and coaches to see play. That may very well help them receive an opportunity to play soccer in college. Thus, I am all for it. Anything that helps the girls is something I am all for.


The idea of being on a sports team and not playing is insane and I hope we see a shift in kids/parents accepting that in the future.  

Playing college soccer is not all it seems to be.  Its a good fit for a few, but not nearly the number of teens playing on top teams for this reason.  These clubs/leagues are selling a dream that isn’t achievable or the right path for most of its customers.

The youth are starting to realize that there is more to life than performing, achieving and competing and that doesn’t guarantee joy and happiness.  

Youth should be playing soccer, and other sports, because it brings them joy, not merely as a means to an end.  Parents will appreciate that in addition to joy, it provides character building.  If it also provides opportunities that are a good fit
For the player,  that’s just a bonus.


----------



## Larzby

BIGD said:


> The idea of being on a sports team and not playing is insane and I hope we see a shift in kids/parents accepting that in the future.
> 
> Playing college soccer is not all it seems to be.  Its a good fit for a few, but not nearly the number of teens playing on top teams for this reason.  These clubs/leagues are selling a dream that isn’t achievable or the right path for most of its customers.
> 
> The youth are starting to realize that there is more to life than performing, achieving and competing and that doesn’t guarantee joy and happiness.
> 
> Youth should be playing soccer, and other sports, because it brings them joy, not merely as a means to an end.  Parents will appreciate that in addition to joy, it provides character building.  If it also provides opportunities that are a good fit
> For the player,  that’s just a bonus.


So many people/organizations profit from families engaging in the relentless pursuit of that D1 scholarship that they've made it almost impossible to resist.


----------



## keeprunning

Another ECNL team SMH… if everyone is special, no one is.


----------



## dad4

keeprunning said:


> Another ECNL team SMH… if everyone is special, no one is.
> 
> View attachment 13138


The purpose of a league is to arrange interesting games, not to make parents feel special.


----------



## jimlewis

keeprunning said:


> Another ECNL team SMH… if everyone is special, no one is.
> 
> View attachment 13138


sounds like a GA parent


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Swoosh said:


> Bakers to Pats =  Slammers and Blues biggest nightmare.


Baker is an ahole!  Are parents that desperate to follow him regardless of how he treats the girls? Never mind the question.  It’s a resounding yes!!


----------



## BIGD

Larzby said:


> So many people/organizations profit from families engaging in the relentless pursuit of that D1 scholarship that they've made it almost impossible to resist.


When you really unpack what’s going on in these top leagues (ECNL, MLS Next), their whole marketing strategy is dependent on fear.  Fear of not keeping up, fear of missing out, fear of not being enough (via my kid), fear of my kid not being special.  Remove the carrot of a D1 scholarship or college admissions leverage and all the time and money these leagues require seems extreme to just have your kid play a team sport.  I’m not sure the leagues would exist as they are today if college sports suddenly went away.

Even if you and your kid are the outlier and are participating out of love for the sport and not based on an end goal, the platform you are playing within is still rooted in the capitalization of fear.  Kind of spoils the whole experience.


----------



## Lightning Red

Goforgoal said:


> There was, but US Soccer managed to F it all up.


That specific GA club that you are referring to has “13” D1 commits @ U19. Many Power 5 schools.  Not too shabby. If you can play, they will find you, no matter what the league. 
I only know of a few in the ECNL Southwest Conference that have more.  For the record, I have girls in both leagues.


----------



## jimlewis

Lightning Red said:


> That specific GA club that you are referring to has “13” D1 commits @ U19. Many Power 5 schools.  Not too shabby. If you can play, they will find you, no matter what the league.
> I only know of a few in the ECNL Southwest Conference that have more.  For the record, I have girls in both leagues.


Legacy DA teams dont count for GA teams.


----------



## Carlsbad7

jimlewis said:


> Legacy DA teams dont count for GA teams.


Why not? It's the same club, same leadership, same facilities, and often the same coaches.


----------



## Speedy

Lightning Red said:


> That specific GA club that you are referring to has “13” D1 commits @ U19. Many Power 5 schools.  Not too shabby. If you can play, they will find you, no matter what the league.
> I only know of a few in the ECNL Southwest Conference that have more.  For the record, I have girls in both leagues.


That U19 was a solid group that benefited from the DA and the club does not have the talent in the lower ages to keep that pace up.  They are losing their best kids on the younger teams.  Saying "many" of the girls going to P5 is misleading.  Do you know the number?  Whatever that number is I am guessing it will drop considerably in the next few years.


----------



## Speedy

Carlsbad7 said:


> Why not? It's the same club, same leadership, same facilities, and often the same coaches.


Because without the DA all of the items above are not good enough.  Most (not all) are reasons people are leaving the club.  People would tolerate it for the DA.


----------



## jimlewis

Speedy said:


> Because without the DA all of the items above are not good enough.  Most (not all) are reasons people are leaving the club.  People would tolerate it for the DA.


All GA clubs will be 2nd tier as soon as all their legacy DA teams graduate.  all talent at younger GA teams are leaving to play ECNL because that's where all the top DA clubs went.  GA clubs pointing at the past, while ECNL clubs are pointing at the future. Plain and simple


----------



## Code

Carlsbad7 said:


> The bigger question is North County SD is HUGE + always has a lot of talent why isn't there a local option?
> 
> We all know the answer to this. It's just unfortunate.


Del Mar is North County; you have two options already.  The region that has a vacuum is East County.  I've seen numerous East County players at SD Surf, Sharks, and Rebels in the G2008-G2006 groups.  Certainly enough East County talent currently playing in the three San Diego ECNL clubs to field competitive teams out of East County.  I agree having another ECNL club out of Great Park is ignorant.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Speedy said:


> Because without the DA all of the items above are not good enough.  Most (not all) are reasons people are leaving the club.  People would tolerate it for the DA.


I do agree that in Socal ECNL clubs are very good. 

However, I don't think it's a smart to write GA clubs off 100%. Sure some parents will chase whatever alphabet league they feel strongly about. But this is a marathon not a sprint. Going full tilt from youngers all the way through college isn't realistic for most players. There will be movement + over time the best players will get recruited no matter what club they play for.

Think about this potential outcome. Say your kid is on a top ECNL team but not getting minutes. Or what if they get hurt + need time to rehab + play at a lower level. Does it make sense to drive and hour+ for practice just to keep a spot on the bench? Maybe you could bump down to ECRL but parent egos wont allow that. Bam, suddenly you're trying to get on the #1 GA team that's local.

Like I said before GA coaches/leadership that were able to get players college looks during DA often hasn't changed. Just like bottom of the barrel ECNL clubs coaches/leadership that has problems getting players in the JCs hasn't changed.

Finally who do you think ECNL clubs are going to try and recruit from if they hear about a hot player. A top ECNL club they would never leave from or a top GA club where there's a good chance they would be happy to jump.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

Carlsbad7 said:


> Think about this potential outcome. Say your kid is on a top ECNL team but not getting minutes. Or what if they get hurt + need time to rehab + play at a lower level. Does it make sense to drive and hour+ for practice just to keep a spot on the bench? Maybe you could bump down to ECRL but parent egos wont allow that. Bam, suddenly you're trying to get on the #1 GA team that's local.


100% agree.  The goal for our kids has to be to get visibility when playing these college showcases.  What's the point of being a bench player on a top team if you are not getting the looks from the coaches?      Access to college scouts and visibility are available with both ECNL and GA.


----------



## crush

SoccerFan4Life said:


> 100% agree.  The goal for our kids has to be to get visibility when playing these college showcases.  What's the point of being a bench player on a top team if you are not getting the looks from the coaches?      Access to college scouts and visibility are available with both ECNL and GA.


100% brother.  ECNL was spot on at Silver Lakes yesterday.  I had no idea all the games were being played.  I thought it was really cool to see many of the top college coaches from all the top schools at Silver Lakes yesterday.  My dd finally got to play in a soccer game after her high school break to heal her body from all her injuries.  I was impressed with games and ganas   League games mean something more then the....."showcase the individual" in the games in AZ Showcase.  Fields looked good but not like in AZ.  I talked to one dad that said his dd was all ready to commit to a school in early Feb but the coach got whacked and she didnt feel any love from the new coach.  This weekend, she found a great coach and a great school and got a deal. Really smart and excellent kid too.  Lastly parents, your kid got's to be on the field to be seen.


----------



## Speedy

Carlsbad7 said:


> I do agree that in Socal ECNL clubs are very good.
> 
> However, I don't think it's a smart to write GA clubs off 100%. Sure some parents will chase whatever alphabet league they feel strongly about. But this is a marathon not a sprint. Going full tilt from youngers all the way through college isn't realistic for most players. There will be movement + over time the best players will get recruited no matter what club they play for.
> 
> Think about this potential outcome. Say your kid is on a top ECNL team but not getting minutes. Or what if they get hurt + need time to rehab + play at a lower level. Does it make sense to drive and hour+ for practice just to keep a spot on the bench? Maybe you could bump down to ECRL but parent egos wont allow that. Bam, suddenly you're trying to get on the #1 GA team that's local.
> 
> Like I said before GA coaches/leadership that were able to get players college looks during DA often hasn't changed. Just like bottom of the barrel ECNL clubs coaches/leadership that has problems getting players in the JCs hasn't changed.
> 
> Finally who do you think ECNL clubs are going to try and recruit from if they hear about a hot player. A top ECNL club they would never leave from or a top GA club where there's a good chance they would be happy to jump.


I agree with your assessment, the GA is a place for some kids that don't fit on the big club roster for whatever reason but are good enough to play in college.  

My response was more about your point about a certain North County GA club and that it could keep talent when they were with the DA.  They can't keep it now.  That is not necessarily because of the change in leagues (from DA to GA).  Some kids are getting recruited but more are leaving because of the leadership.  Families would overlook that when they were in the DA.  Not happening anymore.


----------



## Carlsbad7

Speedy said:


> I agree with your assessment, the GA is a place for some kids that don't fit on the big club roster for whatever reason but are good enough to play in college.
> 
> My response was more about your point about a certain North County GA club and that it could keep talent when they were with the DA.  They can't keep it now.  That is not necessarily because of the change in leagues (from DA to GA).  Some kids are getting recruited but more are leaving because of the leadership.  Families would overlook that when they were in the DA.  Not happening anymore.


1000% correct

The reason that club is able to get away with what they're doing is because on the Boys side they have MLS Next which is the doing much better against ECNL than GA.

In the end it doesn't matter, players/parents will gravitate to whatever solution they feel strongly about. I mean come on, if Southwest ECNL really wanted to be the super league certain clubs wouldn't have been invited to the party. On the other side if GA really wanted to be the "best of the best" they would just join ECNL. Take a step back and you'll see the reality is that leagues are about separating parents from their $$$. Competition is important but $$$ is importanter.

At least we have tournaments like Surf Cup + others where the big clubs show off their finished products.


----------



## GT45

"if GA really wanted to be the "best of the best" they would just join ECNL"

This is not a choice they have though. They created their own league for clubs that were victims of DA folding, and ECNL did not offer.


----------



## jimlewis

GT45 said:


> "if GA really wanted to be the "best of the best" they would just join ECNL"
> 
> This is not a choice they have though. They created their own league for clubs that were victims of DA folding, and ECNL did not offer.


Wonder why we haven't started a discussion topic of "expansion of GA in the SW".  Its because there is nothing on the horizon, and no one wants to join a dying league.


----------



## tjinaz

jimlewis said:


> Wonder why we haven't started a discussion topic of "expansion of GA in the SW".  Its because there is nothing on the horizon, and no one wants to join a dying league.


Actually.... FC Tucson and SC Del Sol are joining SW GA in the 2022 - 2023 season.  SCDS is moving from mountain and FC Tucson is new to GA/DPL.  The top girls were having to drive from Tucson to Phoenix for practice as there were no top level teams in the metro area.  FC Tucson will now capture all that talent for their GA teams.  There were many girls on ECNL and GA teams in phoenix that will now join that GA program.


----------



## Desert Hound

tjinaz said:


> Actually.... FC Tucson and SC Del Sol are joining SW GA in the 2022 - 2023 season.  SCDS is moving from mountain and FC Tucson is new to GA/DPL.  The top girls were having to drive from Tucson to Phoenix for practice as there were no top level teams in the metro area.  FC Tucson will now capture all that talent for their GA teams.  There were many girls on ECNL and GA teams in phoenix that will now join that GA program.


ECNL is still going to be the draw for the best girls in Tucson. 

That said there are not large numbers of girls in Tucson currently driving up to Phoenix to play for ECNL clubs. 

del Sol is struggling in the recruiting game as it relates to GA. With the advent of GA del Sol hasn't been able to recruit much. The best players in the area are going to the ECNL clubs. The 2 youngest age groups for del Sol in the GA show that. Neither team has a win. Between the 2 teams they have managed a total of 5 goals over 28 games.

GA doesn't seem to be of interest for those aging into the years where you can either join and ECNL club or a GA club.


----------



## Larzby

tjinaz said:


> Actually.... FC Tucson and SC Del Sol are joining SW GA in the 2022 - 2023 season.  SCDS is moving from mountain and FC Tucson is new to GA/DPL.  The top girls were having to drive from Tucson to Phoenix for practice as there were no top level teams in the metro area.  FC Tucson will now capture all that talent for their GA teams.  There were many girls on ECNL and GA teams in phoenix that will now join that GA program.


Also, FRAM was recently added to GA, so there doesn't seem to be a shortage of teams wanting in.
But I'd love to do a study to see what percentage of the GA haters on this board have kids playing on the struggling ECNL teams, as opposed to the top ECNL teams. Because I'm missing the point of bashing GA. Clubs seem happy to join GA, regardless of the relative strengths of the two leagues. If your kid is on the strongest team in the strongest league, I'm happy for you, but I doubt you'd see much point in bashing the "dying" league.


----------



## Desert Hound

Larzby said:


> Also, FRAM was recently added to GA, so there doesn't seem to be a shortage of teams wanting in.
> But I'd love to do a study to see what percentage of the GA haters on this board have kids playing on the struggling ECNL teams, as opposed to the top ECNL teams. Because I'm missing the point of bashing GA. Clubs seem happy to join GA, regardless of the relative strengths of the two leagues. If your kid is on the strongest team in the strongest league, I'm happy for you, but I doubt you'd see much point in bashing the "dying" league.


It certainly seems some clubs do want in. It also appears their showcases are well run and attended. 

That said in the SW it is a distant 2nd. In other parts of the country it may not be a distant second. 

In Phx based on where kids go, the GA club seems to be the 4th choice (the other 3 ECNL clubs being the top options). 

I am not bashing the league. Just observing that in Phx when kids age in, where they seem to prefer to go to.


----------



## Larzby

Desert Hound said:


> It certainly seems some clubs do want in. It also appears their showcases are well run and attended.
> 
> That said in the SW it is a distant 2nd. In other parts of the country it may not be a distant second.
> 
> In Phx based on where kids go, the GA club seems to be the 4th choice (the other 3 ECNL clubs being the top options).
> 
> I am not bashing the league. Just observing that in Phx when kids age in, where they seem to prefer to go to.


Can't argue with any of that.  (My comment was a response to someone else's post). Maybe someday we can get promotion/relegation, so this particular argument can end, and teams and players can "decide things on the field."


----------



## espola

Larzby said:


> Can't argue with any of that.  (My comment was a response to someone else's post). Maybe someday we can get promotion/relegation, so this particular argument can end, and teams and players can "decide things on the field."


It's not clear where you would promote from, since ECNL is a self-contained entity.


----------



## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> ECNL is still going to be the draw for the best girls in Tucson.
> 
> That said there are not large numbers of girls in Tucson currently driving up to Phoenix to play for ECNL clubs.
> 
> del Sol is struggling in the recruiting game as it relates to GA. With the advent of GA del Sol hasn't been able to recruit much. The best players in the area are going to the ECNL clubs. The 2 youngest age groups for del Sol in the GA show that. Neither team has a win. Between the 2 teams they have managed a total of 5 goals over 28 games.
> 
> GA doesn't seem to be of interest for those aging into the years where you can either join and ECNL club or a GA club.


I know our opinions on the fate of ol Del Sol are different, we'll just leave that where it is.  Their 06 and 07 teams are heads and shoulders better then the other 3 clubs.  Their youngers certainly struggle, especially their U13s ( they've never had to recruit in the past).  U14s apparently are an improvement from last year and a work in progress.  Del Sol tends to be a tough learn, with development/understanding occurring at U15.  It's also where they recruit best...not much patience in recruting younger than that.  Plenty can happen between 13-15 years of ag

With all of that said, interesting conversations with parents of U13s and 14s -  waiting to enter ECNL/GA at U15 is being seen as the smart thing to do. Parents are shying away from the expensive cost to drive to CA for a U13/14 game and seeking out more local clubs that offer great coaching.  Never mind how expensive ECNL/GA clubs are to begin with. U13 travel beyond 1 hr (without traffic) seems silly to me. 

RSL is certainly the best AZ ECNL club, Arsenal is a pleasant surprise, and the demise of Rising is interesting.  Increase in East Vally population and access to world class fcilities is nothing but good news for Arsenal. 

Unfortunately too many leagues and too many clubs in those leagues will always hamper talent consolidation in AZ.  Just the way it is I guess.


----------



## met61

espola said:


> It's not clear where you would promote from, since ECNL is a self-contained entity.


...just spitballing for girls side...it could probably start along the lines of combining top leagues, say ECNL & GA, under a national sanctioning body with regional leagues and a structured vertical ranking system of upward and downward movement based on record...culminating in a annual national championship.


----------



## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> Del Sol tends to be a tough learn, with development/understanding occurring at U15. It's also where they recruit best...not much patience in recruting younger than that. Plenty can happen between 13-15 years of ag


Actually I disagree on this point. 

When they were in ECNL they recruited heavily at the entry age groups. And quite frankly got most of the best kids. Sereno did a poor job. Those were the only 2 options in town for ECNL at the time. 

When they got DA, the gravy train continued.

The core of the teams were set and then what they did was add a key player here and there over the years. That isn't happening anymore. 

When they moved to GA and there were ECNL options in the Valley...the equation changed dramatically. And it shows in their 2 youngest age groups. Based on what is happening, I would be surprised if next years entry group is any good. And the 2 current youngest teams? Parents and kids looking around are not interested in joining teams that combined over 24 or 28 games have a combined total of 5 goals. The best kids will look to better clubs. Getting onto a team that gets smoked is not desirable. 

They also don't have any core group of kids internally. They have at most 1 team in all the APL leagues in AZ. Not many in the Open Leagues as well.

It isn't a recipe for success going forward.


----------



## crush

I say Socal just goes with three divisions; First Division, Second Division & Third Division and 100% no dads allowed to be involved, if you know what I mean.  Dad has stay off BODs and buying clubs and no more rubbing elbows with the Docs.  I do respect the ECNL and all it's done to help girls play in college.  The GDA Travel Across America League was insane and no way 99% of the rest of us could afford to pay to play in that league.  I would love to see three divisions is my point in Socal and we have the talent to pull it off.


----------



## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> Actually I disagree on this point.
> 
> When they were in ECNL they recruited heavily at the entry age groups. And quite frankly got most of the best kids. Sereno did a poor job. Those were the only 2 options in town for ECNL at the time.
> 
> When they got DA, the gravy train continued.
> 
> The core of the teams were set and then what they did was add a key player here and there over the years. That isn't happening anymore.
> 
> When they moved to GA and there were ECNL options in the Valley...the equation changed dramatically. And it shows in their 2 youngest age groups. Based on what is happening, I would be surprised if next years entry group is any good. And the 2 current youngest teams? Parents and kids looking around are not interested in joining teams that combined over 24 or 28 games have a combined total of 5 goals. The best kids will look to better clubs. Getting onto a team that gets smoked is not desirable.
> 
> They also don't have any core group of kids internally. They have at most 1 team in all the APL leagues in AZ. Not many in the Open Leagues as well.
> 
> It isn't a recipe for success going forward.


The U13s/U14s are certainy having a tough go, but their 07s were on a similar trajectory not too long ago, they are now the best team in the state, taking players from the other 3 clubs.   As the age groups progress and get passed on to the next coach, those coaches recruit.  

Since I've been here (really since the inception of the DA), the Del Sol teams have never been "core" teams.  They've been made up of recruited players.  Mind you, my oldest has aged out, and my youngest no longer plays soccer.  Both were migrants from another top club, as was most of the teams(s).  

Your points are logical but Del Sol has always been about quality, not quantity.  They don't consider representation in APL or the open leagues as a priority.  Is it a flawed model?  Maybe, I suppose we will find out next year when the 08s are U15s.  We will see who/what they recruit and how well they do.  The 07s struggled their first year.  With some recruiting from the other clubs, they are easily the #1 team in the state, and a top team in GA.  The real story I suppose is Rising, losing talent to every club and underperforming in every age group.

Opinions and parents vary in views but it seems like more parents are more reluctant to pay top dollar for U13s/14s to travel anywhere to get their collective butts handed to them.  It happens to AZ teams in both leagues.  

I do appreciate your perspective and logic though.


----------



## whatithink

what-happened said:


> The U13s/U14s are certainy having a tough go, but their 07s were on a similar trajectory not too long ago, they are now the best team in the state, taking players from the other 3 clubs.   As the age groups progress and get passed on to the next coach, those coaches recruit.
> 
> Since I've been here (really since the inception of the DA), the Del Sol teams have never been "core" teams.  They've been made up of recruited players.  Mind you, my oldest has aged out, and my youngest no longer plays soccer.  Both were migrants from another top club, as was most of the teams(s).
> 
> Your points are logical but Del Sol has always been about quality, not quantity.  They don't consider representation in APL or the open leagues as a priority.  Is it a flawed model?  Maybe, I suppose we will find out next year when the 08s are U15s.  We will see who/what they recruit and how well they do.  The 07s struggled their first year.  With some recruiting from the other clubs, they are easily the #1 team in the state, and a top team in GA.  The real story I suppose is Rising, losing talent to every club and underperforming in every age group.
> 
> Opinions and parents vary in views but it seems like more parents are more reluctant to pay top dollar for U13s/14s to travel anywhere to get their collective butts handed to them.  It happens to AZ teams in both leagues.
> 
> I do appreciate your perspective and logic though.


I'm not sure about your view on the DS 07s. DS won state cup at U11, then dropped 4/5 players & recruited half a team from CCV (who had won the league and didn't play state cup). That U12 team is their core group even now afaik. They have added/lost 1/2 players a year since then. They skipped U13, played up at U14, and then played U14 proper in GA etc. They may be the best 07 team in the state, but they don't play the other 07 teams and don't have as hard a schedule being in GA vs the SoCal ECNL division as those other teams have. So, I'm not sure why some people think they are (I've seen a few state that), and until they play the other teams (unlikely), we won't know.

IMV, middle schoolers on travel teams is just silly. U13/14 should be discounted. Royals had the "best" U13 (08) team last year .. they lost a couple of players & are the worse this year (of ECNL teams) - at that age, a year can make a huge difference in physical development, IQ and with some good coaching. As was said above, it doesn't matter until U15 or even U16, so I doubt DS care that much and are just building a core group and will recruit.

If they keep placing their players into good colleges, then they will attract good players - that is the point after all (for many).


----------



## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> As the age groups progress and get passed on to the next coach, those coaches recruit.
> 
> Since I've been here (really since the inception of the DA), the Del Sol teams have never been "core" teams. They've been made up of recruited players.


And again in the past del Sol didn't have to recruit hard. Kids/parents wanted to go there. It was the best club. They have the BEST platform and the best teams. 

They have issues now. 

1) Parents/kids know where the best platform for competition is. It is NOT the GA in this area. ECNL clubs will and are getting the top players. Remember the last year Royals were in the GA? They basically blew away the competition in most every age group. They had a ridiculously good record across age groups. Now that they are back in the ECNL? Lower half of the division in most cases. In other words they are facing far better competition and the record reflects it.

2) If you are going to get better you need to practice and play vs better competition. Kids/Parents will naturally gravitate towards that platform and clubs. 

3) The above issues show why the 2 most recent (youngest teams) at del Sol don't even have a win this season in a league that has weaker competition vs the ECNL in this area. They are not getting the good players anymore. 

4) The good players will not be interested in joining a team that cannot win and gets blown out when they can go to one of the ECNL clubs. Those 2 youngest teams are unlikely to make big improvements next year. There is a club in the SW ECNL division whose teams regularly get blown out. The best kids in the area are not looking to join those teams. If anything the best players on that club are looking to get out and get on a team that is competitive. 

5) It is unlikely the trend will change next year with del Sol's newest entry team suddenly full of talent. Those kids coming in next year are looking to play in the top league in the area and practice with and play against the best competition. Most of the best talent will flow to one of the three ECNL clubs. 

del Sol has the 2nd best league offering in the Valley. Their recruiting related to their 2 youngest teams reflects that. 

The reality is this. If your kid is good, you are not starting off your search with del Sol. You are looking to one of the 3 ECNL clubs in the area.


----------



## crush

Desert Hound said:


> And again in the past del Sol didn't have to recruit hard. Kids/parents wanted to go there. It was the best club. They have the BEST platform and the best teams.
> 
> They have issues now.
> 
> 1) Parents/kids know where the best platform for competition is. It is NOT the GA in this area. ECNL clubs will and are getting the top players. Remember the last year Royals were in the GA? They basically blew away the competition in most every age group. They had a ridiculously good record across age groups. Now that they are back in the ECNL? Lower half of the division in most cases. In other words they are facing far better competition and the record reflects it.
> 
> 2) If you are going to get better you need to practice and play vs better competition. Kids/Parents will naturally gravitate towards that platform and clubs.
> 
> 3) The above issues show why the 2 most recent (youngest teams) at del Sol don't even have a win this season in a league that has weaker competition vs the ECNL in this area. They are not getting the good players anymore.
> 
> 4) The good players will not be interested in joining a team that cannot win and gets blown out when they can go to one of the ECNL clubs. Those 2 youngest teams are unlikely to make big improvements next year. There is a club in the SW ECNL division whose teams regularly get blown out. The best kids in the area are not looking to join those teams. If anything the best players on that club are looking to get out and get on a team that is competitive.
> 
> 5) It is unlikely the trend will change next year with del Sol's newest entry team suddenly full of talent. Those kids coming in next year are looking to play in the top league in the area and practice with and play against the best competition. Most of the best talent will flow to one of the three ECNL clubs.
> 
> del Sol has the 2nd best league offering in the Valley. Their recruiting related to their 2 youngest teams reflects that.
> 
> The reality is this. If your kid is good, you are not starting off your search with del Sol. You are looking to one of the 3 ECNL clubs in the area.


Spot on Hound.  That's why the good players would bail on those old Legends and Beach teams before they got the GDA and skipped over all the others and were top clubs for two years or so.  Then they had to beg to get into ECRL and that was lame.  Surf was stuck between a rock and a hard place.  Because they were not winners in ECNL, they had an either us or them deal and it was high stakes youth soccer poker.  The parents or some like to say the customers, were stuck with the middleman.  Blues got both ECNL and GDA because they won.  Rodman, Turner and Jackson is not a bad front line.  Slammers had to go Either or as well and got two spots for the price of one and went all in ECNL.  Surf went all in GDA and got a 5 year contract for playoffs and DPL.  AZ was tossed around and now I have no idea who the best of the best is anymore.  It was a big time toxic war over here in Socal for three years.  I know a coach that was ECNL, then GDA, then GAL and now he's selling ECNL again.  My dd played first year of GDA and Del Sol was a very tough out.  Granted we had that 25% everyone starts rule so the not so good players who paid to play made it hard to figure out the best of the best.


----------



## soccermom74

whatithink said:


> I'm not sure about your view on the DS 07s. DS won state cup at U11, then dropped 4/5 players & recruited half a team from CCV (who had won the league and didn't play state cup). That U12 team is their core group even now afaik. They have added/lost 1/2 players a year since then. They skipped U13, played up at U14, and then played U14 proper in GA etc. They may be the best 07 team in the state, but they don't play the other 07 teams and don't have as hard a schedule being in GA vs the SoCal ECNL division as those other teams have. So, I'm not sure why some people think they are (I've seen a few state that), and until they play the other teams (unlikely), we won't know.
> 
> IMV, middle schoolers on travel teams is just silly. U13/14 should be discounted. Royals had the "best" U13 (08) team last year .. they lost a couple of players & are the worse this year (of ECNL teams) - at that age, a year can make a huge difference in physical development, IQ and with some good coaching. As was said above, it doesn't matter until U15 or even U16, so I doubt DS care that much and are just building a core group and will recruit.
> 
> If they keep placing their players into good colleges, then they will attract good players - that is the point after all (for many).


No doubt DelSol has some talented players (as you mentioned that same core group from U12/13 age group).  Their new players, and yes they have done well with them, but they are players cut from RSL and Rising.  They added an Arsenal player this year and one who  left for Rising came back mid-year.  They have not yet recruited a top player from one of the 3 ECNL clubs to come play for them.  Could it happen this year, maybe?  Their core group of players are without a doubt among the top girls in the state.  But if I was one of those parents, I would be moving my child to ECNL without question.


----------



## what-happened

whatithink said:


> I'm not sure about your view on the DS 07s. DS won state cup at U11, then dropped 4/5 players & recruited half a team from CCV (who had won the league and didn't play state cup). That U12 team is their core group even now afaik. They have added/lost 1/2 players a year since then. They skipped U13, played up at U14, and then played U14 proper in GA etc. They may be the best 07 team in the state, but they don't play the other 07 teams and don't have as hard a schedule being in GA vs the SoCal ECNL division as those other teams have. So, I'm not sure why some people think they are (I've seen a few state that), and until they play the other teams (unlikely), we won't know.
> 
> IMV, middle schoolers on travel teams is just silly. U13/14 should be discounted. Royals had the "best" U13 (08) team last year .. they lost a couple of players & are the worse this year (of ECNL teams) - at that age, a year can make a huge difference in physical development, IQ and with some good coaching. As was said above, it doesn't matter until U15 or even U16, so I doubt DS care that much and are just building a core group and will recruit.
> 
> If they keep placing their players into good colleges, then they will attract good players - that is the point after all (for many).


Great point about the 07 GA record VS others (which they don't have a track record against).  They did very well in Florida against other top GA teams.   They pass the eye test on the field but would be nice to see them play top ECNL 07 teams.  We will never know until they run into an ECNL 07 team at a tournament.  A few 07s traveled with the 06s during thanksgiving and played very well against ECNL teams, wining 2 of 3 games.  I'm pretty sure some families who left have come back to the 07 team after their experiences elsewhere.  

DS just doesn't place emphasis on their youngers.  U15 is where/ what they target.  Sometimes they miss, most of the time they hit.  College placements will continue and we will likley still be questioning their methods.  Matters not , until it does.


----------



## what-happened

soccermom74 said:


> No doubt DelSol has some talented players (as you mentioned that same core group from U12/13 age group).  Their new players, and yes they have done well with them, but they are players cut from RSL and Rising.  They added an Arsenal player this year and one who  left for Rising came back mid-year.  They have not yet recruited a top player from one of the 3 ECNL clubs to come play for them.  Could it happen this year, maybe?  Their core group of players are without a doubt among the top girls in the state.  *But if I was one of those parents, I would be moving my child to ECNL without question.*


I guess I would ask why?  They win, have a good coach, have good chemistry, and the club has a history of college placement.  Would you move just because of the letters?  Now, if DS was staying in the GA MW conference, that's a great reason to move.  Travel to NM and CO is just silly.

Both leagues are going to get exposure  via their showcases. But I get it if the letters matter, and it matters to some. Coaching also matters.  End of the day it comes down to the parents and how happy they are with their coach/club.  I don't have much insight but appears the 07 team (the 06s and 05s also) are quite happy where they and what the future looks like.  DS will be looking to recruit 08s and 09s for next year.  It's just what they do.  Until others do better than them, they will continue. 

Recruiting "cut" players is a great thing.  Sometimes kids need change and coaches who recognize/see something that others don't.  Those players tend to thrive and grow.  Sometimes you don't need to recruit the unicorns, you need to recruit team members.  Clubs spend a lot of time trying to recruit the unicorn and forget they have to build a team.


----------



## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> And again in the past del Sol didn't have to recruit hard. Kids/parents wanted to go there. It was the best club. They have the BEST platform and the best teams.
> 
> They have issues now.
> 
> 1) Parents/kids know where the best platform for competition is. It is NOT the GA in this area. ECNL clubs will and are getting the top players. Remember the last year Royals were in the GA? They basically blew away the competition in most every age group. They had a ridiculously good record across age groups. Now that they are back in the ECNL? Lower half of the division in most cases. In other words they are facing far better competition and the record reflects it.
> 
> 2) If you are going to get better you need to practice and play vs better competition. Kids/Parents will naturally gravitate towards that platform and clubs.
> 
> 3) The above issues show why the 2 most recent (youngest teams) at del Sol don't even have a win this season in a league that has weaker competition vs the ECNL in this area. They are not getting the good players anymore.
> 
> 4) The good players will not be interested in joining a team that cannot win and gets blown out when they can go to one of the ECNL clubs. Those 2 youngest teams are unlikely to make big improvements next year. There is a club in the SW ECNL division whose teams regularly get blown out. The best kids in the area are not looking to join those teams. If anything the best players on that club are looking to get out and get on a team that is competitive.
> 
> 5) It is unlikely the trend will change next year with del Sol's newest entry team suddenly full of talent. Those kids coming in next year are looking to play in the top league in the area and practice with and play against the best competition. Most of the best talent will flow to one of the three ECNL clubs.
> 
> del Sol has the 2nd best league offering in the Valley. Their recruiting related to their 2 youngest teams reflects that.
> 
> The reality is this. If your kid is good, you are not starting off your search with del Sol. You are looking to one of the 3 ECNL clubs in the area.


I appreciate your position and will continue to disagree with most of it.  Your premise is that the health of a club is based on the talent of their 13 year olds.  I disagree with that premise.  I will agree with you when the ECNL U15/16 teams in AZ are the best teams.  Today, and since the inception of the GA, those teams reside in DS.   Maybe there will be a mass migration of those players to Rising and RSL, but that is doubtful. The older teams have migrated talent between 3 clubs for the last few years, with RSL clearly on top.  

We will reconvene this time next year, after tryouts and a half season in the bag to see where the U15s/U16s are.


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## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> I appreciate your position and will continue to disagree with most of it. Your premise is that the health of a club is based on the talent of their 13 year olds. I disagree with that premise.


What I am saying is if you watch the club over many years, they used to have the top teams at 13 and 14. They started off strong and got stronger from there. The best players in the Valley knew they had the best teams and wanted to go there. 

Sereno picked up the scraps. There were no other clubs to choose from. 

They did this during the ECNL years...year after year. When they got DA it still happened...though at a reduced rate once Royals picked up there game. So they started off with a very strong foundation in their early year teams. That is a fact.

With GA it is a complete reversal. Now the top kids do not go there at the entry years. They go to the other ECNL clubs. That is where the majority will stay. 

A few years ago I said del Sol will suffer with only offering GA. Last years entry team showed that to be true. 

This year both the entry team and the 2nd year team are terrible. Bad beginning of a trend. 

I suspect next year they are not going to field a good entry level team, and neither of the current bad teams will improve much. The reality is there is not much interest in joining a team going into their 3 yr (next year) who has won I think 1 game in the past 2 yrs.

The perception and reality is that kids/parents are not looking at del Sol as a destination. They see the current entry teams being not even CLOSE to being competitive. They know GA in this area is 2nd tier vs ECNL. 

If you don't think that means trouble for del Sol...think again. 

I think likely next year you see the youngest 3 age groups with very poor records. There is nothing to indicate kids want to go to the current 2 teams, nor any reason for entry level kids who are the best talent would pick del Sol and a secondary league vs going with and ECNL club.

Here is the decision pattern del Sol is up against. 

- Parent looking around. What is the top league?  
- Why would I send my kid to a club that plays in a league with inferior competition?
- What clubs seems to have the majority of the best players coming in? 

All those questions and similar ones run against del Sol.


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## Desert Hound

Perception/reality hurts the del Sol offer. 

- Best kids are going to the ECNL clubs in the area right now
- When clubs in the SW GA have/had a chance they leave GA for ECNL. Royals didn't shut the door behind them they moved so fast. Beach/Legends preferred to play in ecRl last year in order to get into ECNL this year. Pats didn't bother with GA this year at all. They wanted and got ECNL. 

The reality is WHY would you pick del Sol right now if your kid is getting recruited by one of the local ECNL clubs? 

That is what they are up against.


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## crush

Desert Hound said:


> Perception/reality hurts the del Sol offer.
> 
> - Best kids are going to the ECNL clubs in the area right now
> - When clubs in the SW GA have/had a chance they leave GA for ECNL. Royals didn't shut the door behind them they moved so fast. Beach/Legends preferred to play in ecRl last year in order to get into ECNL this year. Pats didn't bother with GA this year at all. They wanted and got ECNL.
> 
> The reality is WHY would you pick del Sol right now if your kid is getting recruited by one of the local ECNL clubs?
> 
> That is what they are up against.


Hound, you sound like some of the old Docs trying to get me to leave my dd non ecnl club for the top Ecnl clubs in the county sales pitches.  The fact is, you're 100% correct.  The best will leave for greener pasture in 6th grade unless they have the best coach and program and just can't get invited to the top league.  Most of the Euro leagues have three or four divisions.  You don't get a rich dad buying his way into top division because he has some extra money.  No, the rich dad would have to start a club and find his way to Tier 4 and then win his way to top league by winning at each division and not paying to get to the top. However, I also believe the girls who stay at the non-ecnl club will improve because they can now get the playing time that would have been hard to come by with the top players who leave for ECNL.  I was sold about the DA before most of the parents even heard of it.  We have a few on here that knew but most had no clue.  You knew and that is obvious.  You know your stuff and AZ really well.  When the GDA was finally announced, ECNL became #2 over night and second class citizen and loser and why would anyone play in that ECNL league, just like GAL was and now GA is experiencing.   Everyone was begging to make the first cut of this new GDA.  It was the new shinny toy and parents with lot's of extra money love new things and 25% starts for their little one.  It was genius move to cause disruption and confusion to the masses.  Blues was told they have to fully fund their GDA program or or lose it all, plus have "A" License coaches that don;t yell and scream at females all day, stop playing kickball with the likes of Sanchez, Jackson, Rodman or Turner to runi them down and score goals.  On top of that, they better have their own fields.  The Ranch told Blues, "sorry, no more fields for you" at the same time so the timing was just horrible for all the top players going into 7th grade around OC and socal.  Galaxy and Pats were 100% fully funded and offering it to anyone who was willing to go all in 100% soccer player and no way can play high school soccer or other sports.  Nothing but soccer because the world was watching.  I also believe Legends was fully funded.  It was sold and told to all of us that all girls DA Program needed to be fully funded, just like the boys.  Equality was sold hard and the girls would be trained like the boys as well, full time soccer, 4 days a week and soccer soccer and more soccer all the time and no other sports or boyfriends for that matter and one game a week by the way ((originally was one game you guys but changed quickly, just like the waiver deal for girls at private high schools.  Surf was 50/50 fully funded but was told the following year need to be fully funded.  Fully funded went away quickly because 95% of the clubs would have lost serious money and some clubs bailed back to second class ECNL.  Today, It's ECNL or else.....


----------



## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> Perception/reality hurts the del Sol offer.
> 
> - Best kids are going to the ECNL clubs in the area right now
> - When clubs in the SW GA have/had a chance they leave GA for ECNL. Royals didn't shut the door behind them they moved so fast. Beach/Legends preferred to play in ecRl last year in order to get into ECNL this year. Pats didn't bother with GA this year at all. They wanted and got ECNL.
> 
> The reality is WHY would you pick del Sol right now if your kid is getting recruited by one of the local ECNL clubs?
> 
> That is what they are up against.


Pats are a really bad example.  CA reality is different than AZ reality.  Pats fielded OK teams in the DA, the GA, in ECRL, and now in ECNL.  

I'm not saying that the GA has overall better teams than ECNL. They don't, ECNL SW is much stronger than GA SW.  

 Your statement of best kids are going to ECNL clubs in AZ is just not correct.  If you are saying that in reference to 13 year olds, then fine, maybe, but not a marker of future talent or successfull teams.  You may use it as your own metric, but it's hardly a marker of what happens to them in the future. DS doesn't have in interest in flooding the valley with teams - like RSL and Rising do.  It's not their business model.  They recruit and do their best to retain a core group of players moving through the ranks. 

Royals did what they thought was right for them and maybe what their consituency wanted.  Good move on their part.  I don't know the behind the scenes with DS and ECNL and why they didn't make the move with Royals.  Were previous bridges burned?  don't know. Is there a plan to put a 4th team in PHX?  likley not but who knows. 

Anyway, this is a beat horse for sure.  Next year if DS U15s/16s aren't competitive, then you will have nailed this.  We should see mass migration to Rising and RSL.  I suppose we will see.


----------



## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> Good move on their part. I don't know the behind the scenes with DS and ECNL and why they didn't make the move with Royals.


I suspect there are some burned bridges and or bad blood between del Sol and ECNL. You can pretty much lay money that if they had an offer to go back to ECNL they would have already. 

The ages I will watch again next year will be the newly minted U13s and then look to see if the U14 and U15 do about the same next year vs their records this year as (u13/14s). 

That is where you will see how the club is doing. 

Right now the older teams are in many cases teams formed before the demise of DA. As in kids were there and didnt move after DA blew up. So I am not watching them per say. They are baked in. 

I am far more curious as to how the club performs bringing in fresh kids with just the GA offer.


----------



## jimlewis

Desert Hound said:


> I suspect there are some burned bridges and or bad blood between del Sol and ECNL. You can pretty much lay money that if they had an offer to go back to ECNL they would have already.
> 
> The ages I will watch again next year will be the newly minted U13s and then look to see if the U14 and U15 do about the same next year vs their records this year as (u13/14s).
> 
> That is where you will see how the club is doing.
> 
> Right now the older teams are in many cases teams formed before the demise of DA. As in kids were there and didnt move after DA blew up. So I am not watching them per say. They are baked in.
> 
> I am far more curious as to how the club performs bringing in fresh kids with just the GA offer.


This is and will prove out to be 100% correct.


----------



## Drifter

slightly off topic but is there a link to game results for the ECNL showcase in AZ this weekend?  i haven't been able to find it.
Thanks


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## what-happened

Desert Hound said:


> I suspect there are some burned bridges and or bad blood between del Sol and ECNL. You can pretty much lay money that if they had an offer to go back to ECNL they would have already.
> 
> The ages I will watch again next year will be the newly minted U13s and then look to see if the U14 and U15 do about the same next year vs their records this year as (u13/14s).
> 
> That is where you will see how the club is doing.
> 
> Right now the older teams are in many cases teams formed before the demise of DA. As in kids were there and didnt move after DA blew up. So I am not watching them per say. They are baked in.
> 
> I am far more curious as to how the club performs bringing in fresh kids with just the GA offer.


I agree there's likley some bad blood or a burnt bridge or two.  Maybe they are in the process of mending those..who knows.  

I will say that the 06s grew after the DA debacle and the 05s have traded players with Rising and RSL.  The 07s haven't been recruited away by the idea of ECNL. The 05s have had a bad injury run.  But yes, next year we will see how the current 08s/09s run.  DS will not be concernd with the 09s but will certainly focus their attention on 08s. In theory, their olders (04/05, 06, 07) next year will be very strong, stronger than at least two clubs in the state. 

 In those age groups, the greener pastures of ECNL haven't been enticing enough.  Moving back to the GA SW helps - CO and NM travels wasn't smart.


----------



## Desert Hound

what-happened said:


> In theory, their olders (04/05, 06, 07) next year will be very strong, stronger than at least two clubs in the state.


Yeah they might be stronger vs AZ Thunder and or Inferno. 

If you are talking about other ECNL clubs I am not sure what you base that on. 

Royals ripped through GA at most age groups. This year? Not so much. So you cannot possibly look at GA records and assume a win rate will then apply if playing in SW ECNL. 

I don't believe del Sol has played any of the local AZ ECNL teams this year.


----------



## Desert Hound

By the way I just looked that the record of the 05s. They have not won a game in their division. Most of the 04s are moving on. And you are making the claim that next years 04/05 team will be one of the best? 

I know you are a homer, but please. 

Lets review.

In division games.  Half of the clubs teams cannot even manage a win. And that is in a division weaker vs the SW GA division. That isn't the del Sol of old. That tells you that talent has left the club by and large. You sound like a parent whose team does well in the local state leagues and thinks that record would translate vs a lot tougher competition in other leagues. Year by year del Sol looks weaker. 

U13
0-7-0

U14 
0-5-2

U15 
7-0-0

U16 
4-2-1

U17 
0-4-3

U18/19 
3-3-1


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## VegasParent

Desert Hound said:


> By the way I just looked that the record of the 05s. They have not won a game in their division. Most of the 04s are moving on. And you are making the claim that next years 04/05 team will be one of the best?
> 
> I know you are a homer, but please.
> 
> Lets review.
> 
> In division games.  Half of the clubs teams cannot even manage a win. And that is in a division weaker vs the SW GA division. That isn't the del Sol of old. That tells you that talent has left the club by and large. You sound like a parent whose team does well in the local state leagues and thinks that record would translate vs a lot tougher competition in other leagues. Year by year del Sol looks weaker.


While I don't know all the ins and outs of AZ soccer, looking at the GA schedule you can see that DS 05's beat 2 SW teams last weekend, City SC and Albion SD, who are 2 and 3 in the SW division. Doesn't appear that the SW division is stronger like you suggest.


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## Calikid

Anyone have any insight as to who the various age groups coaches ECNL Pateadores?


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## Royal26

Calikid said:


> Anyone have any insight as to who the various age groups coaches ECNL Pateadores?


Only Rumors but 
08-Hammond
07-Dodge
06-Duerksen 
05/04-?
Definitely need to hire more coaches. They should try to get the Swanson Brothers from West Coast. Future isn't bright over there.


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## futboldad1

Pats will be able to draw much needed girls talent from Strikers as my source tells me Strikers won't be ECNL next season.....


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## Footy30

Royal26 said:


> Only Rumors but
> 08-Hammond
> 07-Dodge
> 06-Duerksen
> 05/04-?
> Definitely need to hire more coaches. They should try to get the Swanson Brothers from West Coast. Future isn't bright over there.


Can't comment on West Coast because I'm not part of the club,  but one of my kids trained with Dough Swanson a handful of times and he is really great!


----------



## Kicker 2.0

Footy30 said:


> Can't comment on West Coast because I'm not part of the club,  but one of my kids trained with Dough Swanson a handful of times and he is really great!


DS is a phenomenal coach!


----------



## Royal26

futboldad1 said:


> Pats will be able to draw much needed girls talent from Strikers as my source tells me Strikers won't be ECNL next season.....


I also just heard the Strikers rumor.


----------



## Sokrplayer75

Royal26 said:


> I also just heard the Strikers rumor.


When you say next year, is that 22-23 season or 23-34 season?


----------



## crush

Sokrplayer75 said:


> When you say next year, is that 22-23 season or 23-34 season?


Great question.  I was told the same thing last year that Strikers were out of ECNL and this ((last season)) year was it and no more ECNL and connections.  But here we are, still playing.  I'm so confused.  I feel bad for coaches, players and parents who are trying to play in ECNL and stuck in the middle.  I was told back in 2016 that Blues played Kickball, had only kickball coaches and will not get invited to the GDA and will be ECNL only.  I will see what I can find out and get back to you.


----------



## Sokrplayer75

I 


crush said:


> Great question.  I was told the same thing last year that Strikers were out of ECNL and this ((last season)) year was it and no more ECNL and connections.  But here we are, still playing.  I'm so confused.  I feel bad for coaches, players and parents who are trying to play in ECNL and stuck in the middle.  I was told back in 2016 that Blues played Kickball, had only kickball coaches and will not get invited to the GDA and will be ECNL only.  I will see what I can find out and get back to you.


Guess a rumor, is just that....a rumor. I assume they would of already announced it if it was for 22/23 season. Especially since ECNL already announced clubs that were added for the 22/23 season.


----------



## crush

Sokrplayer75 said:


> I
> 
> Guess a rumor, is just that....a rumor. I assume they would of already announced it if it was for 22/23 season. Especially since ECNL already announced clubs that were added for the 22/23 season.


It sucks if you follow a coach who is also chasing the ECNL or the highest letter league at the time, just like the parents and the player.  Do they have a "clubs that have been dropped for the 2022/2023 season?


----------



## Sokrplayer75

crush said:


> It sucks if you follow a coach who is also chasing the ECNL or the highest letter league at the time, just like the parents and the player.  Do they have a "clubs that have been dropped for the 2022/2023 season?


I dont think so, but not 100% sure.


----------



## crush

Sokrplayer75 said:


> I dont think so, but not 100% sure.


We all know what May means around here.  It's nice not to worry about next season as a customer.  Rumor mill and poaching all go together will hit the waiver wire soon and the rumors will be flying all over about next season.  Having the right bait on the hook is super important during Spring time as well.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

I wouldn’t be surprised if they kick out strikers girls from ECNL.  To my understanding, people in power are still mad when strikers boys went to mls next.    
Bottom line there’s too many ECNL teams already in south oc.   I  told some of the strikers coaches to find a new market and not be the 4th option in south oc.   I would bet 20% of the ECNL players come from north oc, Long Beach, and other cities  far from the great park region.


----------



## Carlsbad7

SoccerFan4Life said:


> I wouldn’t be surprised if they kick out strikers girls from ECNL.  To my understanding, people in power are still mad when strikers boys went to mls next.
> Bottom line there’s too many ECNL teams already in south oc.   I  told some of the strikers coaches to find a new market and not be the 4th option in south oc.   I would bet 20% of the ECNL players come from north oc, Long Beach, and other cities  far from the great park region.


Ahh... Lovin the drama + welcome to the world of regulation. (If the rumor is true )

The problem for ECNL is if Strikers feel like they're going to get booted from the club, they'll go to GA before ECNL has a chance to make the announcement. Sounds like they're 1/2 way there with MLS Next on thr boys side. 

Booting the sucky teams might seem like a good idea but good teams need bad teams to look good. If theres no bad teams it will become an arms race for all the top teams.


----------



## dad4

Carlsbad7 said:


> Ahh... Lovin the drama + welcome to the world of regulation. (If the rumor is true )
> 
> The problem for ECNL is if Strikers feel like they're going to get booted from the club, they'll go to GA before ECNL has a chance to make the announcement. Sounds like they're 1/2 way there with MLS Next on thr boys side.
> 
> Booting the sucky teams might seem like a good idea but good teams need bad teams to look good. If theres no bad teams it will become an arms race for all the top teams.


What makes you think good teams need to play weak teams at all?   99% of the time, it works out just like you expect.

It’s a waste of time for all kids involved, and demoralizing for kid on the down side.

The biggest problem with ECNL is the flying all over the place to play second rate teams.  At some point, you have to ask why the league wants parents to spend a thousand dollars per kid on travel, just to prove that a top team can wipe the walls with the 378th best team in the nation.


----------



## SoccerFan4Life

dad4 said:


> The biggest problem with ECNL is the flying all over the place to play second rate teams.  At some point, you have to ask why the league wants parents to spend a thousand dollars per kid on travel, just to prove that a top team can wipe the walls with the 378th best team in the nation.


We will get to a point where there will be a league to develop girls to play pro. The women’s game is growing fast especially in Europe. 92,000 fans watched Barca play Real Madrid last month. Trinity Rodman played 1 year in college and now singed a massive contract. We still have ways to go but eventually it can happen. 
NWSL will start developing their academies or linking up with some of the local youth clubs.
The whole college-scholarship value proposition from ECNL is a joke.  Dad4 is correct, the amount of money spent traveling over the years plus fees doesn’t really make sense unless you get 75% to 100% scholarship.


----------



## crush

SoccerFan4Life said:


> We will get to a point where there will be a league to develop girls to play pro. The women’s game is growing fast especially in Europe. 92,000 fans watched Barca play Real Madrid last month. *Trinity Rodman played 1 year in college* and now singed a massive contract. We still have ways to go but eventually it can happen.
> NWSL will start developing their academies or linking up with some of the local youth clubs.
> The whole college-scholarship value proposition from ECNL is a joke.  Dad4 is correct, the amount of money spent traveling over the years plus fees doesn’t really make sense unless you get 75% to 100% scholarship.


TR went pro out of high school, no?  I was sold pro when my dd was 12, 100%.  Meaning, she was asked if she too would like to go full time home school and full time soccer.  I even came on here to ask some questions about girls going pro and I got hammered and laughed at for saying my dd was sold pro.  She was sold fully funded by all the top clubs in socal and so much more.  The GDA thought high school soccer was horrible and college soccer was kickball and dangerous and no passing league and not pretty soccer and that the world was watching and something had to be done.  That's when the crazy travel ball started.  I'm telling you that the rich parents were all over this league.  Dad's bought clubs and dads got BOD positions. 25% of the games your kid is guaranteed to start and a chance to make the YNT Lsit so they can go to Big U and you as parent can brag on Insta and FB.  These were starts btw, not just a few minutes of play time.  Oh what money can buy....lol!  Elon just bought a seat at the table so we know how this sport is played.  The great OM went Pro before TR too so look at the future and the best will go pro and skip the brutal life of a top college soccer player.  Like the great Maps said, only the true Unicorns can handle the college girls soccer life at Big U.  You need to have the best GPA, best SAT, volunteers 10 hours week helping others, do all your homework, train 5 days a week to be the best of the best player, eat super perfect and don't gain weight, no real parties and no boyfriend.  BTW, I blushed when the Doc and top new coaches told me about the future for my 12 year old if she would go full time and move to great Northwest and live with the Pros and train with them.


----------



## crush

Hey soccer fan 4 life, keep in mind my goat was balling against Turner, Jackson, Rodman and OM when she was 11 and 12.  We scrimmaged every week bro and I saw with my eyes what a pro looks like and plays like.


----------



## Brav520

crush said:


> TR went pro out of high school, no?  I was sold pro when my dd was 12, 100%.  Meaning, she was asked if she too would like to go full time home school and full time soccer.  I even came on here to ask some questions about girls going pro and I got hammered and laughed at for saying my dd was sold pro.  She was sold fully funded by all the top clubs in socal and so much more.  The GDA thought high school soccer was horrible and college soccer was kickball and dangerous and no passing league and not pretty soccer and that the world was watching and something had to be done.  That's when the crazy travel ball started.  I'm telling you that the rich parents were all over this league.  Dad's bought clubs and dads got BOD positions. 25% of the games your kid is guaranteed to start and a chance to make the YNT Lsit so they can go to Big U and you as parent can brag on Insta and FB.  These were starts btw, not just a few minutes of play time.  Oh what money can buy....lol!  Elon just bought a seat at the table so we know how this sport is played.  The great OM went Pro before TR too so look at the future and the best will go pro and skip the brutal life of a top college soccer player.  Like the great Maps said, only the true Unicorns can handle the college girls soccer life at Big U.  You need to have the best GPA, best SAT, volunteers 10 hours week helping others, do all your homework, train 5 days a week to be the best of the best player, eat super perfect and don't gain weight, no real parties and no boyfriend.  BTW, I blushed when the Doc and top new coaches told me about the future for my 12 year old if she would go full time and move to great Northwest and live with the Pros and train with them.



this short little video is applicable jumping from youth to college , college to pro


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1512232497618178048


----------



## Keepermom2

Kicker 2.0 said:


> DS is a phenomenal coach!


In the club soccer world where nothing is consistent, the opinion of DS & CS has been consistent as long as we have been in the club soccer world (5 years).


----------



## Letsplaysoccer

From my understanding it was already announced that Pat’s would gain an ECNL spot for next season. Both ECNL and Pat’s posted about it not too long ago. Question is with them coming in... and the rumors roaming about Strikers being out...when will that announcement take place? ECNL has done a bad job demographically with balancing teams throughout SoCal... they’ve got Slammers, HB Koge (only program who continues to have 2 teams at the ECNL level) Blues, Strikers, (if they even keep they’re spot...rumor is the are now out) and now Pat’s all out of OC Great Park. I have to imagine Pat’s gained a spot in ECNL because of the strength on the boys side..not the girls.. They had a decent group but moved them to Arsenal when David Baille left and took players with him... lots of movement AGAIN with ECNL- should be interesting to see how all this plays out.


----------



## crush

Letsplaysoccer said:


> From my understanding it was already announced that Pat’s would gain an ECNL spot for next season. Both ECNL and Pat’s posted about it not too long ago. Question is with them coming in... and the rumors roaming about Strikers being out...when will that announcement take place? ECNL has done a bad job demographically with balancing teams throughout SoCal... they’ve got Slammers, HB Koge (only program who continues to have 2 teams at the ECNL level) Blues, Strikers, (if they even keep they’re spot...rumor is the are now out) and now Pat’s all out of OC Great Park. I have to imagine Pat’s gained a spot in ECNL because of the strength on the boys side..not the girls.. They had a decent group but moved them to Arsenal when David Baille left and took players with him... lots of movement AGAIN with ECNL- should be interesting to see how all this plays out.


It's hard to keep up.  The Strikers were the Laguna Hills Eclipse on the girls side back in the day and had a top girls program, just like West Coast.  Strikers and Pats were big time on the boys side and had a few ok teams on the girls side.  Eclipse did a deal with Strikers and AR killed it.  I can go on and on.  This is way to big for me to understand.  I will say this and this is just some moo from me.  I believe the PRO game will be what it;s all about and not college.  ECNL is all in for college and that won;t work in the future.  ECNL was for girls only but because of what the GDA did to them, they had to change like all companies have to who are about to be squashed like a little bug.  Good luck to all the girls right now and their parents.  The back and forth is insane.


----------



## Carlsbad7

crush said:


> It's hard to keep up.  The Strikers were the Laguna Hills Eclipse on the girls side back in the day and had a top girls program, just like West Coast.  Strikers and Pats were big time on the boys side and had a few ok teams on the girls side.  Eclipse did a deal with Strikers and AR killed it.  I can go on and on.  This is way to big for me to understand.  I will say this and this is just some moo from me.  I believe the PRO game will be what it;s all about and not college.  ECNL is all in for college and that won;t work in the future.  ECNL was for girls only but because of what the GDA did to them, they had to change like all companies have to who are about to be squashed like a little bug.  Good luck to all the girls right now and their parents.  The back and forth is insane.


I tend to agree with you. The reason MLS Next is competing with ECNL on the boys side is because it's specifically focused on developing pro players.

The problem with developing players for college is that unless you get a full ride scholarship (most don't) players have spent 10+ years getting better at soccer for 30k or so per year. (if you cost out the scholarship value) For true top level talent you might as well go for being pro just to see if you can make it vs 30k in scholarship $$$. If you have good grades you'll be able to get into colleges when you're 20-22.

For boys the decision is much more clear.


----------



## crush

Carlsbad7 said:


> I tend to agree with you. The reason MLS Next is competing with ECNL on the boys side is because it's specifically focused on developing pro players.
> 
> The problem with developing players for college is that unless you get a full ride scholarship (most don't) players have spent 10+ years getting better at soccer for 30k or so per year. (if you cost out the scholarship value) For true top level talent you might as well go for being pro just to see if you can make it vs 30k in scholarship $$$. If you have good grades you'll be able to get into colleges when you're 20-22.
> 
> For boys the decision is much more clear.


This was the GDA plan, moo.  I was sold this but I think at the end of the day it was always going to be a college sell.  I know people make fun of me and I'm ok with that.  The truth is the truth.  Girls don;t need to make millions of dollars to be happy.  They just want to be treated fair and with honesty.  The men saw a way to make a few bucks and that sucks.  We need a very clear path for all the top players who are the tops on the field, not the classroom.  For men, it's how good of a soccer player you are and for the girls its how smart you are ((GPA+SAT))+ super great kid and does what she is told and does not ask any questions or have any opinions and also plays really good soccer.  It's like the girls have to score high in three categories.  This has been my #1 complaint on the girls side.  The objection I get is always, "Their is no money in pro girls soccer and a college education is worth way more in the long run."  Something like that and most fathers do not want their kid playing over seas in front of 90,000 fans. No, daddy wants to watch on the SEC Network....lol.  That is satire and just for laughs.  Honestly, in other parts of Euro the top players at around 14 or 15 are told, "Yes, you have Pro written all over you, Go Pro   Please join our academy and we will train you and then sell you or just help you because.  They also have a good respect about loaning and selling players to each other because they have 4 top levels to reach.  The top level is very difficult to make and only those who got it will be able to hang.


----------



## Letsplaysoccer

crush said:


> It's hard to keep up.  The Strikers were the Laguna Hills Eclipse on the girls side back in the day and had a top girls program, just like West Coast.  Strikers and Pats were big time on the boys side and had a few ok teams on the girls side.  Eclipse did a deal with Strikers and AR killed it.  I can go on and on.  This is way to big for me to understand.  I will say this and this is just some moo from me.  I believe the PRO game will be what it;s all about and not college.  ECNL is all in for college and that won;t work in the future.  ECNL was for girls only but because of what the GDA did to them, they had to change like all companies have to who are about to be squashed like a little bug.  Good luck to all the girls right now and their parents.  The back and forth is insane.


There have been a ton of changes since the Strikers were Laguna Hills Eclipse. That seems like decades ago. And clubs and programs have certainly evolved. Additionally, Pro vs college doesn’t seem to be a question. ECNL has done a great job of getting girls into colleges playing at an NCAA level and I don’t see that going away. Most who go pro come from playing at the college level- very few go from playing pro out of high school. So that seems to be a null and void... I don’t see girls not going to college and opting to play Pro. Just not feasible nor realistic. Besides there are plenty of players wanting to play at the college level... most need something to fall back on and that’s why the platform of ECNL and collegiate play will stick around. ECNL also saw the opportunity to add in boys and expand the program when DA was ended.. MLS jumped in along with Academy seems to be some decent options on the boys side unlike the girls. What’s interesting is why the elimination of Strikers when currently the Southwest Region has an unbalanced number of teams? If ECNL is eliminating them because there’s too many clubs out of OC why add in another OC club? If the talent is in Orange County... than that’s where the teams should be. Appears these clubs don’t have a problem filling a roster or competing at that level. Just seems weird to eliminate an OC team to only add another OC team in. And now the disruption and movement of teams begin... if in fact Strikers is no longer ECNL. All these girls and boys at that level will need to find a home!


----------



## crush

Letsplaysoccer said:


> There have been a ton of changes since the Strikers were Laguna Hills Eclipse. That seems like decades ago. And clubs and programs have certainly evolved. Additionally, Pro vs college doesn’t seem to be a question.* ECNL has done a great job of getting girls into colleges playing at an NCAA level* and I don’t see that going away. Most who go pro come from playing at the college level- very few go from playing pro out of high school. So that seems to be a null and void... I don’t see girls not going to college and opting to play Pro. Just not feasible nor realistic. Besides there are plenty of players wanting to play at the college level... most need something to fall back on and that’s why the platform of ECNL and collegiate play will stick around. ECNL also saw the opportunity to add in boys and expand the program when DA was ended.. MLS jumped in along with Academy seems to be some decent options on the boys side unlike the girls. What’s interesting is why the elimination of Strikers when currently the Southwest Region has an unbalanced number of teams? If ECNL is eliminating them because there’s too many clubs out of OC why add in another OC club? If the talent is in Orange County... than that’s where the teams should be. Appears these clubs don’t have a problem filling a roster or competing at that level. Just seems weird to eliminate an OC team to only add another OC team in. And now the disruption and movement of teams begin... if in fact Strikers is no longer ECNL. All these girls and boys at that level will need to find a home!


That was the past and old school, moo   I also think the girls should get most of the credit for getting into college.  Mark my words and I said it here first.  The Pro game will be the holy grail for all the top top players and not go to college for four years and then go Pro at 22.  To each his own is my motto.


----------



## Letsplaysoccer

crush said:


> That was the past and old school, moo   I also think the girls should get most of the credit for getting into college.  Mark my words and I said it here first.  The Pro game will be the holy grail for all the top top players and not go to college for four years and then go Pro at 22.  To each his own is my motto.


I don’t know, I can see this on the boys side but not necessarily the girls.. who knows though.. I don’t follow boys soccer as much as I do girls, but that’s just because I have girls at this level.


----------



## Brav520

what you have on the boys side , at least at the very elite levels is some of the top academy players getting the chance to train with the first team . FC Dallas has been doing this for years, and look at the talent that has come out of there. 

I think you will start to see more girls jump to NWSL and forego college, are there opportunities for the truly elite to get the chance to train with professionals at 14 , 15 years old right now on the girls side?

I could see ECNL partnering with some NWSL teams that give some of the truly high level girls the opportunity pretty early on to train with professionals 

I do wonder if someone like Rodman was really being challenged during her high school years .


----------



## crush

Brav520 said:


> what you have on the boys side , at least at the very elite levels is some of the top academy players getting the chance to train with the first team . FC Dallas has been doing this for years, and look at the talent that has come out of there.
> 
> I think you will start to see more girls jump to NWSL and forego college, are there opportunities for the truly elite to get the chance to train with professionals at 14 , 15 years old right now on the girls side?
> 
> I could see ECNL partnering with some NWSL teams that give some of the truly high level girls the opportunity pretty early on to train with professionals
> 
> I do wonder if someone like Rodman was really being challenged during her high school years .


I watched Rodman and the others every week and they had a super team.  They made each other better everyday at practice and those practices were not for faint of heart.  It was intense to say the least.  My dd team did not give up a goal all season and won state cup in 2015.  To keep us hungry and humble, our coach made us scrimmage that team to show us what pro looks like.  We would lose 10-0, 12-0 and then the last game we ever played them, my kid got an early goal on a napping defender and we went up early.  I was beside myself and so proud of what my kid just pulled off at 11 years old.  TR and the others were 13 and 14.  Their coach was pissed off that my little one got behind their line on a sneak attack and that player was sent to the bench.  I saw what pro soccer looked like and sounded like.  TR was in a class all by herself.  Anyway, we lost 11-1 and I still make it one of my all time great goals by my kid.  The players on those teams have all gone on to college or pros and it's an honor to have watched them all battle to make each other better.


----------



## Letsplaysoccer

Royal26 said:


> Only Rumors but
> 08-Hammond
> 07-Dodge
> 06-Duerksen
> 05/04-?
> Definitely need to hire more coaches. They should try to get the Swanson Brothers from West Coast. Future isn't bright over there.


Or they can see about the coaches at Strikers since they lost their ECNL teams after this season!!


----------



## crush

Letsplaysoccer said:


> Or they can see about the coaches at Strikers since they lost their ECNL teams after this season!!


What a ride for coaches and the players for Pats and Strikers and all those trying to find a team so they can be showcased for college.  My kid bailed on soccer all day every week in 2018 and went for Track, Volleyball, soccer and the beach.  The only lie that pissed me off and made me come to this forum was that no hs soccer was allowed to be a member of the new top league for girls, the GDA.  I would have happily walked away but no, they lied one too many times.  They got waivers for the rich kids at private school and that was so wrong to do to the kids like my kid who opted out only to see the well to do get to do both.  She took fours years off but is looking to make a come back.  My dd worked her ass off during middle school years and walked away from a lot fun times, bday parties, sleep overs because of the commitment it took to be the best.  She did what was told and didnt make the U14 YNT.  BTW, do they even have a U14 YNT anymore because that's all it was, a list.  No games or camps.  She tried but they picked 25% of 05s instead because.  Any way, we talked as a family and told the Doc bye for next season and all the seasons of the GDA.  The GDA had no playoffs and gave 25% starts to the rich kids.  Do you see the problem?  How does one even start to figure things out with soccer?


----------



## myself

crush said:


> What a ride for coaches and the players for Pats and Strikers and all those trying to find a team so they can be showcased for college.  My kid bailed on soccer all day every week in 2018 and went for Track, Volleyball, soccer and the beach.  The only lie that pissed me off and made me come to this forum was that no hs soccer was allowed to be a member of the league, the GDA.  I would have happily walked away but no, they lied one too many times.  They got waivers for the rich kids at private school and that was so wrong to do to the kids like my kid who opted out only to see the well today get to do both.  She took fours years off but is looking to make a come back.  My dd worked her ass off during middle school years and walked away from a lot fun times, bday parties, sleep overs because of the commitment it took to be the best.  She did what was told and didnt make the U14 YNT.  BTW, do they even have a U14 YNT anymore because that's all it was, a list.  No games or camps.  She tried but they picked 25% of 05s instead because.  Any way, we talked as a family and told the Doc bye for next season and all the seasons of the GDA.  The GDA had no playoffs and gave 25% starts to the rich kids.  Do you see the problem?  How does one even start to figure things out with soccer?


Never miss an opportunity to make it about yourself do you? DA has been dead for 2 years, your daughter has what sounds like a great opportunity overseas (congratulations to her BTW), time to move on.

You said you were leaving the forum after you got into it with GoldenGate.


----------



## crush

myself said:


> Never miss an opportunity to make it about yourself do you? DA has been dead for 2 years, your daughter has what sounds like a great opportunity overseas (congratulations to her BTW), time to move on.
> 
> You said you were leaving the forum after you got into it with GoldenGate.


I did leave ((I know that made some happy)) but I came back because people asked me to come back to help them.  I know some hate me and I get that and I know why.  I have every right to change my mind to come back, right?  I flip and flop like the best and always look for a better and more honest way to treat people and their customers.  Look, this is serious mental BS for the players and the parents.  Every year myself, parents and players have to play musical chairs.  We can make soccer great for all players and all families, regardless if you have the dough or not.  I care for all the kids bro and the parents, believe me or not.  My beef today is she did get some nice deals but was not afforded the opportunity because she needed to get the ________________ ((I'm not allowed to say it here)) in order to get the free education.  This goes way deeper then soccer.  I am 100% happy for her and what "sounds" like the greatest thing since slice bread could also be super hard, lonely and just not fun.  Who knows, right?  All you can do is dream and go try out.   You really never know how things will work out when you make a big decision like hers.  I'm proud of her but sad she did not have options to look at like others except to obey to play.  Not cool dude but the majority is on your side and I should just please just go.  Dom has been super good to me.  I came here and no one was on these boards.  I brought up questions and the forum took off.  That is all good.  It's a forum for soccer takes and I have 11 years worth.  Thanks for the high five and we will see how this goes.


----------



## myself

crush said:


> I did leave ((I know that made some happy)) but I came back because people asked me to come back to help them.  I know some hate me and I get that and I know why.  I have every right to change my mind to come back, right?  I flip and flop like the best and always look for a better and more honest way to treat people and their customers.  Look, this is serious mental BS for the players and the parents.  Every year myself, parents and players have to play musical chairs.  We can make soccer great for all players and all families, regardless if you have the dough or not.  I care for all the kids bro and the parents, believe me or not.  My beef today is she did get some nice deals but was not afforded the opportunity because she needed to get the ________________ ((I'm not allowed to say it here)) in order to get the free education.  This goes way deeper then soccer.  I am 100% happy for her and what "sounds" like the greatest thing since slice bread could also be super hard, lonely and just not fun.  Who knows, right?  All you can do is dream and go try out.   You really never know how things will work out when you make a big decision like hers.  I'm proud of her but sad she did not have options to look at like others except to obey to play.  Not cool dude but the majority is on your side and I should just please just go.  Dom has been super good to me.  I came here and no one was on these boards.  I brought up questions and the forum took off.  That is all good.  It's a forum for soccer takes and I have 11 years worth.  Thanks for the high five and we will see how this goes.


I know of multiple young ladies who got 100% offers (and accepted) and never got called on "The List" as you call it. They were low level D1 and a mid-level D2. So the idea that you need to make the U14 List (or U15, 16 or 17) in order to get a 100% deal is factually incorrect. We all know the issue with those lists and the biases that go into making them.


----------



## crush

myself said:


> I know of multiple young ladies who got 100% offers (and accepted) and never got called on "The List" as you call it. They were low level D1 and a mid-level D2. So the idea that you need to make the U14 List (or U15, 16 or 17) in order to get a 100% deal is factually incorrect. We all know the issue with those lists and the biases that go into making them.


I agree and that list was 100% more about getting the players to the lucky clubs that got the early ticket to the GDA, because now the Doc had the pic(s) for the first time.  I'm talking Big U myself, not mid level or D2 or some far away school.  That list was important to my kid to try and make at that time of her young life and that was it.  Not for anything else, I promise.  That was the last list she tried out for and she fell short, oh well.  We were sold U14 team, not list by the way.  You know the drill and it's not sour grapes on my part, trust me.  It's more about the lying to little girls and then.......ah, I won;t bring up the past.  I also know many top players who did not make the list and all have full rides.  Some even got full ride for just their grades and got a spot on the team.   I love that   You need excellent GPAs and SAT and none that I know got full ride in soccer dollars only.  Grades added to the pot and that is how you get a full full ride at the top academies after high school.  40 players is not enough to give one of the 14 away to a super star unless your the best of the super stars and only one or two per class fit that bill, moo.


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## crush

May is around the corner but the Grapes on the Grapevine Rumor Mill are ripe to pick now.  Poaching Karma is now in full session.  Let the musical chairs begin.  My heart goes out to all the players and coaches stuck in the middle.  Good luck looking to play competitive soccer and then in college. This is a tough and cruel business and companies have to make tough decisions.  The kids are stuck in the middle again as the turf wars continue.


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## crush

I have a suggestion to the higher ups in all the "Elite" leagues.  If you boot a member, maybe allow the older teams to finish out the following season or two years, unless the boot is justified and just had to be done.  If it's for pure business reasons, then let's fix something right now for the players, who actually do ALL the heavy lifting and take all the chances of a career ending injury playing in these leagues.  For example, the U17s have built a team together and all the girls are looking to go play in college and are right now getting recruited.  Do what's best for the girls you guys and let that team and maybe the u16s finish and age out with respect.  Thoughts?  I will say the girls are learning about transferring, just like some do in college.


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## crush




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