"HANDBALL"

Discussion in 'C'mon Ref!' started by Surfref, Sep 29, 2016.

  1. watfly

    watfly Active Member

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    What's the proper call when a young player instinctively brings their arms in to block the ball and protect their body on a close range shot? Obviously, it's deliberate but I've seen refs not call it in the "spirit" of the game. Sometimes it seems a little harsh to call a handball but what's the correct call?
     
  2. timbuck

    timbuck Well-Known Member

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    From what I've seen- if the hands/arms are tight to the body, then no call. If the hands move forward to block, then it's a handling call.
    Also- if there is a chance to move out of the way or use your chest/head safely, but the arms come up in defense instead, then it's a handling call.
    But it's completely up to the ref to decide.
     
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  3. watfly

    watfly Active Member

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    I realize that proximity to the ball is a consideration, I'm thinking greater than point blank but not farther than it would be to reasonably play the with head or chest.
     
  4. Just a Parent

    Just a Parent Active Member

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    The correct call according to USSF interpretation is no call. Even for an older player. Reflexively protecting one's face or you know where is a natural reaction and it is clearly stated as such in the USSF instructions.
     
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  5. Just a Parent

    Just a Parent Active Member

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    The referee is to follow USSF/IFAB considerations and not decide arbitrarily.
     
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  6. watfly

    watfly Active Member

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    Thanks, I thought that was the case but apparently I had missed this previously:

    "Moving hands or arms instinctively to protect the body when suddenly faced with a fast approaching ball does not constitute deliberate contact unless there is subsequent action to direct the ball once contact is made."
     
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  7. Just a Parent

    Just a Parent Active Member

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    Thank you.
     
  8. coachrefparent

    coachrefparent Active Member

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    Nope. Arms not in a natural position, and moving your body and arms to deflect the ball is deliberate.
     
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  9. Just a Parent

    Just a Parent Active Member

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    Baloney.
     
  10. MWN

    MWN Active Member

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    As @Just a Parent pointed out, protecting a sensitive area in a reactionary manner is not deliberate handling under the USSF/IFAB rules. Also note that US Soccer issued a 2009 directive (https://www.massref.net/ussfdirectives/Handling_the_Ball.pdf) that acknowledges "The referee must take into consideration whether the defender’s reaction is purely instinctive, taken to protect sensitive areas of the body as the face."

    There are 5 primary considerations:
    1. Did the player make themselves bigger?
    2. Was the players hands/arms in an unnatural position?
    3. Did the player/or his team benefit?
    4. What was the reaction time? [this is where protecting a sensitive area, such as, face comes in]
    5. Was it hand to ball or ball to hand?
     
  11. watfly

    watfly Active Member

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    I hope you are not saying that it can be "handling" if only #3 applies. I think this is where some refs get tripped up.

    ATR:
    "The fact that a player may benefit from the ball contacting the hand does not transform the otherwise accidental event into an infringement."
     
  12. LBSoccer

    LBSoccer Member

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    Saw this just recently at a game in national cup, hands/arms tight to the body and ref said no handball. The parents were livid and some even ran onto the field in protest. I agree with the call.
     
  13. MWN

    MWN Active Member

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    Correct, I'm not saying that any one of the factors can override the "deliberate" component of a handling call. The factors are used to ascertain "intent" and/or deliberate action. If a player does not "deliberately" handle the ball by using his hands/arms to disrupt the trajectory of the ball, it can never be handling. Thus, if a defending player's hands, in a natural position is struck by a ball kicked at the player in a manner that would preclude the player from reasonably avoiding the contact, then its not deliberate. However, let's take a look two scenarios:

    1. Defending player moves hands to face to avoid ball striking his face, ball falls to feet and defending player passes to teammate. No handling, no foul. (Note, at least 8 dumbass parents (and likely 1 coach) on opposing teams section are going to be screaming at the top of their lungs "HANDBALL!!!, HANDBALL!!!, HANDBALL!!!.")

    2. Defending player moves hands to face to avoid ball striking his face, but at last moment slaps at ball, ball falls to opponent's feet who dribbles 5 yards and promptly loses ball to defender that handled ball. Advantage, then Whistle, handling, direct kick (assuming none of this occurred in penalty box). 2 dumbass parents for opposing team will yell "THANK YOU REF!!!" in a sarcastic tone and at least 2 (likely parents of player and goalkeepers parents) of team foul called against will yell "It was defensive, not intentional/deliberate" and at least 1 will yell "Come on Ref!!! Call it both ways" or some other nonsensical statement.

    For the record, (and this is highly misunderstood by parents and coaches) a good Referee also takes into account the relative skill/age of the players when applying the Laws. What might be a "red" card at the U16 level, is a yellow at the U10 and a verbal warning at U8. Tactical awareness and control of one's body makes applying the Law 12 is a bit fluid. U10's get much more latitude.
     
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  14. Socal United

    Socal United Active Member

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    Question for you. Goalkeeper has the ball, walks out of the box with the ball in his hand. Hand ball. Direct correct?
     
  15. espola

    espola Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but ... I have seen indirect kick called even to the point of calling back a goal scored from the kick.
     
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  16. Socal United

    Socal United Active Member

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    That exact thing happened today. Hand ball called by the ref. Told my kid to shoot, ref called it back when he scored and said it was indirect. Try explaining that to a 6 year old, even he knew it was a goal. :) Just wanted to make sure.
     
  17. coachrefparent

    coachrefparent Active Member

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    Deliberate handling aka "hand ball" is a direct kick:
    LAW 12: A direct free kick is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences:
    • handles the ball deliberately (except for the goalkeeper within their penalty area)


    That being said I can assume that a (single?) referee doing a game with 6 year old ("competitive :rolleyes:") soccer players just might not be the most experienced official out there.

    Other goalkeeper offenses (playing a ball with their hands that was passed from a teammate, handling the ball in the box after intentionally releasing it) are indirect free kicks, so I can see how a new referee would confuse these plays that are a bit uncommon. Many new referees and most parents (like you) don't clearly understand that a keeper is just like any other player outside the penalty area, and its simply a "hand ball."
     
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  18. Socal United

    Socal United Active Member

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    It was a single referee, I would say in his mid to late 20's. He carried himself like someone that had been refereeing for a while. I am the coach, and played professionally(a very long time ago), so I know the game what I like to think is pretty well and clearly understand the role of a keeper. I had never seen that called indirect, but with all of these new silly rules I thought maybe it was one of the myriad of changes and I had just glossed over it.
     
  19. Just a Parent

    Just a Parent Active Member

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    Where the heck do you see these things?
     
  20. Just a Parent

    Just a Parent Active Member

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    Some rec leagues like JUSA had it in their rules that for certain ages, all kicks for all offenses were indirect free kicks. Check to make sure you were not playing in one of those.
     

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