Another US Soccer idea...

Discussion in 'SoCalScene' started by timbuck, Apr 5, 2018.

  1. timbuck

    timbuck

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  2. GKDad65

    GKDad65 Bronze

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    Next they'll create another damn league for the "Bio-Banded" teams.
    It'll be in the So. Cal. treasure chest region soon!

    Is there any hope for US Soccer?
     
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  3. Dummy

    Dummy Bronze

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    No.
     
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  4. toucan

    toucan Bronze

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    "Bio-banding" sounds like a good idea until you think about it carefully - and then you realize its a stupid idea. First - how do you determine what a person's "biological" age is? Apparently it goes by "early or late maturity." What does that mean?

    According to the article linked in the original post, it means kids born early or late in their birth year. So the DA will move some kids back to the "school-age" age groups of a couple of years ago, instead of the "calendar-year-age" which USSF switched to 2 years ago. Do we really need two different age groups to cover kids in the same "age group?" And doesn't this create a huge opportunity for kids to game the system, in the same way that some parents start their kids in school a year late so they will have an advantage over other kids in the same grade?

    When people talk about a kid's physical "maturity," they are usually referring to secondary sexual characteristics, like having a beard for boys, or breasts for girls. Is the DA going to start checking into kids' sexual maturity? Gee, what could go wrong there?

    Or should it just be based on height? Kids of vastly different ages have the same height, but not "physical maturity." That kid who is 17 years old and that kid who is 13 years old might both be 5'-7", but from a muscular standpoint, I'm pretty sure the 17-year old is far more advanced.

    The bottom line is that there is no objective test for a player's "maturity," unless you are going to check into their secondary sexual characteristics, and nobody wants to do that. So the DA will end up choosing players based on their subjective "soccer ability." There is nothing wrong with that, except it is already being done. Kids "play up" all the time. So what is the point?

    Bottom Line: Bio-banding is a solution without a problem.
     
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  5. Mystery Train

    Mystery Train Silver

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    I agree with all these sentiments. Like the OP, I appreciate their gusto for trying to improve and tweak. This is a wonderfully novel and idealistic concept that should have been killed in the meeting in which it was brought up. US Soccer defines "ambition without reality."
     
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  6. timbuck

    timbuck

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    Is this designed to help the bigger kid? Have them play with other bigger kids so they can't just rely on their size to make them "look like" a soccer star?
    Or for the smaller kid? Let them compete against kids their same size without getting "blown up" by the big kid?
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2018
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  7. Overlap

    Overlap Silver

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  8. oh canada

    oh canada Bronze

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    Thanks for sharing tb, wouldn't have seen this otherwise. I don't have any issues with it -- just a 1x event to gather some data and brainstorm ideas based upon it. If we make fun of out-of-the-box thinking then we will never get anything different. Sometimes new things work, sometimes they don't. But you can't be afraid to try. Ask Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos.
     
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  9. jayjay

    jayjay Bronze

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  10. ItsCalledSoccer

    ItsCalledSoccer Bronze

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    I applaud the US for finally bringing bio-banding to everyone's attention. It's growing rapidly in the UK. To those who haven't heard of it, a calculation is made of a player's potential future height, based on their gender, current age, current height and parents ages and heights. From there, a player is given a % based on how close they are to reaching their peak height velocity. Players are then grouped as such: 80-85%, 85-90% or even closer if the player pool is large.

    Its a great step in player development and helps those later developers to compete and not be cut from teams because of their height, and then at the other challenges those players who have matured early and just use their size and speed to beat players without learning the technical skills they will need when everyone evens out later down the road.
     
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  11. full90

    full90 Bronze

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    Saw this somewhere else regarding this: why not just keep single year teams in order to closely monitor all of the kids' development? But instead, they do double birth year teams so the smaller kids (who bio banding is really for) are pushed out for a year....it makes zero sense.
     
  12. timbuck

    timbuck

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    How about this?
    We alreay have several tiers/flights/groups.
    What we need are coaches that do a better job with all tiers.
    A small but skilled kid at 11 on a Flight 2 team should be getting good coaching so he/she can have a chance to compete when they are able to handle playing against bigger players.
    And/or we need referees to crack down on overly physical players at the younger age groups. Don’t let thug ball exist and coaches won’t recruit “enforcers” with poor skills.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2018
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  13. jpeter

    jpeter Bronze

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    Wow all we need is the special designation for these players so they can now wear the new patch:

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. full90

    full90 Bronze

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    Ugh. the snowflake label is so trite and shallow. Anyone with feelings or opinions is a snowflake? You can think something is wrong or unfair or poorly done and not be wrecked by it. Both things can exist. You can want something to change and also not be shaken when it isn't. Throwing the label of "snowflake" at something is so simplistic and overdone. Man up and have a conversation.
     
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  15. MWN

    MWN Silver Elite

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    I'm a little disappointed that many are taking a negative stance and poking fun on what is designed to help the USSF put kids in groups that are more commensurate with their physical maturity. If you watched the video and looked at some of the literature on the issue, the answer to your questions are:

    Yes, in that it will help the bigger kid (faster maturer) by putting that player with others of similar size, which will demand the bigger kid rely on skill rather than powering through their age group using just size and speed. On the negative side for this group, it will mean some of the early developers will be shown to be mediocre when playing against others of similar physical development.

    Yes, designed to help the smaller kid (slower maturer) by putting that player with others of a similar size, which will enable the smaller kids to continue to develop their skills/talent while they wait for puberty to kick in. These late developers are the primary beneficiaries of the bio-banding.

    In PopWarner Football, they have a designation called "Older but Lighter," which is essentially similar to the above USSF trial program in that is allows older players under a certain weight limit to play down on younger teams.

    This won't disrupt the current age matrix because the jury is still out. It will give the USSF some data as it implements these trial programs to see if making future changes are warranted.
     
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  16. *GOBEARGO*

    *GOBEARGO* Silver

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    Triggered.
     
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  17. InTheValley

    InTheValley Bronze

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    Seriously, can US Soccer do anything right? I can guarantee that any systematic implementation will make the girls side worse.

    Why? Because adversity makes players better. If you couldn’t cut it with your own age group peers, the simple fact of the matter is that you were never going to be a great soccer player. And who is to say that the embarrassment of being a mediocre 9th grade soccer player playing with middle schoolers, instead of your friends and emotional peers, is a better life experience than giving up soccer and filling that extra time with piano?

    Do you remember when the age cut off was July 31? It is no accident that most of the best players were born in the last four months of the age range. Perhaps the 3 best players the US currently has to offer (Rapinoe, Lloyd and Morgan) were all born in July. So were Dunn and McCaskill. At least 8 more were born in April-June (Dahlkemper, Horan, Pugh, Sauerbrawn, Ertz, Williams, and Heath). The list of players born in the first 4 months (Aug-Nov) is sparse, however (Klingenberg, Davidson, O’Hara, Short, Long). Shoot, even Wambach, Chastain, Solo and Lilly were born in June or July.

    Our best players obviously didn’t need bio banding. To the contrary, those kids who faced the most physical adversity have systematically become the best players overall, with very few exceptions. Removing that challenge is counter productive unless the goal is to try to make everyone happy. And we know that is not US Soccer’s goal. US Soccer’s goal is to destroy soccer in the US with one stupid idea after the next.
     
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  18. Sheriff Joe

    Sheriff Joe Silver Elite

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    I didn't know we had a U.S. Soccer High Performance Department, must be something new.
     
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  19. FlashDrive

    FlashDrive Bronze

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    can someone tell me when are the tryouts for flight 2 - Bio Band: Chubby - 65% Speed - Happy personality?

    and please tell me what bio band did Ronaldo, Messi, Suarez, Neymar belong to?

    and while you're at it, how many male world soccer stars has the US produced that only made it because of their physical advantage? actually please tell me about US male soccer stars period lol
     
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  20. Mystery Train

    Mystery Train Silver

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    Ok, I can get with that. True enough.

    and

    These two points are where I fail to see how bio-banding can be implemented in any realistic way in forms other than one off tournaments like this. Can you imagine the clusterf*#k that would ensue if this sort of process was implemented by our current pay-to-play club director geniuses who (like it or not) are as a group responsible for the products that US Soccer tries to form into international players? No, no, and no.
    I think the idea is actually very sound in itself. For years I have wished that schools didn't sort grades by birth year because everyone really does mature (physically and mentally) at different paces, and the ideal situation would be where all students were grouped according to bio-age. But implementing such a change in public schools would be a disaster. The key word is "ideal." Ideal and reality just don't share the same space. And I think US Soccer would be more well served to try to subvert the cancerous growth of pay-to-play than to keep feeding the latest age-group change solutions into an already malfunctioning piece of machinery.
     
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