Deliberate handball to prevent a goal - OK or Not?

J

justneededaname

SILVER ELITE
In my son's game yesterday, a field player deliberately handled the ball to block a shot up and over the bar to prevent a goal. He was sent off with a red card. The goalie blocked the ensuing PK.

After the game, my son asked me if what the player did was the right thing to do. I did not know the answer.

He turned a certain goal into a possible goal (in the end, not a goal), but the team had to play down a man for the rest of the match. Which during that time they outscored the opponent 1-0 (although losing the match).

What does everyone think?
 
justneededaname said:
In my son's game yesterday, a field player deliberately handled the ball to block a shot up and over the bar to prevent a goal. He was sent off with a red card. The goalie blocked the ensuing PK.

After the game, my son asked me if what the player did was the right thing to do. I did not know the answer.

He turned a certain goal into a possible goal (in the end, not a goal), but the team had to play down a man for the rest of the match. Which during that time they outscored the opponent 1-0 (although losing the match).

What does everyone think?
Click to expand...

If he wants to play basketball, he can go to the gym.
 
I suppose it's a calculated risk, and late in the game being a man down may not matter.

Then you just have to hope that the keeper can stop the PK.

That being said, it is against the rules, thus the red card.
 
I think your answer to your son will reveal a lot about your worldview and what your expectations are for his behavior in the future. An important parenting moment!
 
This is much debated in our house but I think it's gamesmanship. It's a calculated risk with consequences. What about an intentional "professional" foul to stop a break away situation? Should a player not do that? Similarly with an intentional foul in basketball...would you not coach kids to foul late in the game to stop the clock? Or in football when you take a delay of game penalty on purpose...or in hockey to commit icing to clear your area...there are certain strategic plays you make to give your team a chance to win. Those plays have natural consequences within the framework of the rules. Now, if you are advocating cheating, or intentionally making plays outside the rules or in hopes not to be caught, then that's different to me.
 
When first presented with the question, I was thinking about it like twoclubpapa. Is this a life skills parenting moment? But also, my son is an astute soccer player. He definitely understands the concept of a professional foul. I think the question he may have been asking was "Dad, was that a good choice of moment and infringement type for a professional foul or was it not."
 
Learning to foul is something our U14 girls need to learn. First they had to learn to be more physical. Almost there. Knocking someone off the ball to slow them down in transition even when it draws a whistle is the next step. Or grabbing a shirt or arm. Do you let a 2 on 1 developed or take the whistle 40 yards out. Don’t see this as life lessons. Similar to basketball you have fouls to give.
 
justneededaname said:
When first presented with the question, I was thinking about it like twoclubpapa. Is this a life skills parenting moment? But also, my son is an astute soccer player. He definitely understands the concept of a professional foul. I think the question he may have been asking was "Dad, was that a good choice of moment and infringement type for a professional foul or was it not."
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If your boy understands the concept of a professional foul, then he would know then stopping the ball from entering the goal is no different. Just like any other professional foul it gives your team an opportunity not to get scored on. Whether it's right or wrong, it's the other question. If it's a World Cup game with team advancement in jeopardy (as I posted above), I would say go for it. If it's a youth game - it's just doesn't make sense.
 
Is it any different than a hard foul inside the 18 on a breakaway?
It’s a foul. There’s a penalty for that foul. I don’t necessarily see this as a “life lesson” or “poor parenting”.
 
Is the game the kid is playing in more important than his next game? Because you get the red, then you get the suspension.

Also, would have to clarify on the rules because I thought that would come under denying a goal scoring opportunity, which I believe has been changed to a yellow since the PK restarts the advantage for the attacking team. On this I could be very very wrong though.
 
Playmaker38 said:
Is the game the kid is playing in more important than his next game? Because you get the red, then you get the suspension.

Also, would have to clarify on the rules because I thought that would come under denying a goal scoring opportunity, which I believe has been changed to a yellow since the PK restarts the advantage for the attacking team. On this I could be very very wrong though.
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Yes, you are very wrong.
 
Playmaker38 said:
Is the game the kid is playing in more important than his next game? Because you get the red, then you get the suspension.

Also, would have to clarify on the rules because I thought that would come under denying a goal scoring opportunity, which I believe has been changed to a yellow since the PK restarts the advantage for the attacking team. On this I could be very very wrong though.
Click to expand...
You are correct, that you are wrong. Here's the language:

Sending-off offences
A player, substitute or substituted player who commits any of the following offences is sent off:
• denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)

Denying a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity
Where a player denies the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by a deliberate handball offence the player is sent off wherever the offence occurs.

Where a player commits an offence against an opponent within their own penalty area which denies an opponent an obvious goal-scoring opportunity and the referee awards a penalty kick, the offender is cautioned if the offence
was an attempt to play the ball; in all other circumstances (e.g. holding, pulling, pushing, no possibility to play the ball etc.) the offending player must be sent off.
 
It's a soccer decision and the life lesson (if any) here is to teach kids to make smart, informed (risk vs reward) decisions under pressure.

Let's say it's less than 5 minutes left in the final with scored tied, absolutely the right thing to do.

70 minute to go in any game, not the best decision.

I'm totally fine if it was my son that received the red card, but he needs to be able to explain the logic behind his decision.
 
coachrefparent said:
You are correct, that you are wrong. Here's the language:

Sending-off offences
A player, substitute or substituted player who commits any of the following offences is sent off:
• denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)

Denying a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity
Where a player denies the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by a deliberate handball offence the player is sent off wherever the offence occurs.

Where a player commits an offence against an opponent within their own penalty area which denies an opponent an obvious goal-scoring opportunity and the referee awards a penalty kick, the offender is cautioned if the offence
was an attempt to play the ball; in all other circumstances (e.g. holding, pulling, pushing, no possibility to play the ball etc.) the offending player must be sent off.
Click to expand...


Appreciate the clarification. I had seen a player (last man) take down a player in the box this season and only receive a yellow. I was a little perplexed and the ref explained to me that the PK restarted the advantage. I did not ask questions beyond that
 
If a kid/man has a pass interference call to save a touchdown and then on the next play, the other team fumbles the ball - Do we question the character of the defensive player?
Make the PK and nobody will be talking about the center back catching a ball on the goal line.
 
timbuck said:
If a kid/man has a pass interference call to save a touchdown and then on the next play, the other team fumbles the ball - Do we question the character of the defensive player?
Make the PK and nobody will be talking about the center back catching a ball on the goal line.
Click to expand...

In gridiron football, if a foul is so grievous that the referee's judgement is that a touchdown would have been scored if not for the foul, they can award the touchdown. See "palpably unfair act".
 
Slightly off topic, but I have a seen a player deliberately handle a ball and still fail to prevent the goal. (Goalkeeping is harder than it looks!) What is the ruling in this case? I think the goal was called off, a yellow card issued, and a penalty awarded. This seemed like the wrong call to me, but curious I'm what surfref and others think.

As to the OP's scenario, the player who committed the foul did so while knowing the consequences, and it sounds like it was the right choice. Fouling is part of the game- as long as no one is injured, I don't see a problem with it.
 
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