My son has been playing club soccer for the past 4 years and it seems that the quality of ref's vary on a varity of things such as location, type of tournament etc. Lately I've noticed a steep decline of judgement and ability to control matches (BU13 playing up) which resulted in serious injuries and parents lashing out at players. How are referees held accountable for their supposed responsibility of ensuring fair and even play? Is there a system in place where formal complaints can be submitted for review? I know as the boys grow older they will be much more aggressive in their playing, but in certain instances we need solid ref's who aren't afraid to take controll of the game.
About that ref. . .
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Prior to U14, most players are fairly respectful to each other and play with the requisite "care." Once the testosterone kicks in (U15-U16) these kids become a little nuts, more reckless and sometimes just plain jerks. From a referee perspective, I can control the players ... provided (1) the coaches keep their mouths shut and stop challenging calls; (2) the coaches support the Referee by telling their players to stop challenging calls; and (3) the parents don't exacerbate the issue by going ballistic whenever little Timmy gets the worse end of a tackle. My experience is that the foregoing represents about 90% of the problem.
There are referees who are assigned the teenagers that shouldn't be, no question. There are also many good referees who lose control because they don't shut down the parents and coaches quick enough. These are about 10% of the problem.
When you go to a tournament, especially the smaller "less expensive" tournaments at community parks and schools you will likely get what you pay for, because the better associations and referees avoid these due to the fact the tournaments pay is on the bottom of the scale and there are no field marshals. Most of the referees that are more experienced also belong to multiple associations and are in high demand so they will work the higher level and more lucrative tournaments, leaving the newbies or old guys for the bottom of barrel tournaments. You also have some tournaments that have reputations for being run poorly and pull in teams from areas where the community/culture tolerates parents and coaches challenging and getting on the referee for calls they saw differently through their rose colored glasses.
Finally, your recourse is to notify your coach and let your coach handle it. Your coach should have a much better grasp of the rules (not as good as the referee). Complaints from parents go into the circular file.
There are referees who are assigned the teenagers that shouldn't be, no question. There are also many good referees who lose control because they don't shut down the parents and coaches quick enough. These are about 10% of the problem.
When you go to a tournament, especially the smaller "less expensive" tournaments at community parks and schools you will likely get what you pay for, because the better associations and referees avoid these due to the fact the tournaments pay is on the bottom of the scale and there are no field marshals. Most of the referees that are more experienced also belong to multiple associations and are in high demand so they will work the higher level and more lucrative tournaments, leaving the newbies or old guys for the bottom of barrel tournaments. You also have some tournaments that have reputations for being run poorly and pull in teams from areas where the community/culture tolerates parents and coaches challenging and getting on the referee for calls they saw differently through their rose colored glasses.
Finally, your recourse is to notify your coach and let your coach handle it. Your coach should have a much better grasp of the rules (not as good as the referee). Complaints from parents go into the circular file.
Maybe they have been watching too many no-call WC games.
baldref
GOLD
How are the coaches and players held accountable?
There are referees who should not be doing older games. In fact, there are referees who shouldn't be doing any games. But that doesn't take away the responsibility of the player who tries to hurt someone, nor the coach who should immediately pull that player off the field and tell them to knock it off. Especially when it's obvious the referee doesn't have that capability.
In a perfect world, I would do every single game and then this sort of thing wouldn't happen. But I just don't have that much time.......
The WC games have been, for the most part, great. The Referee crews have let these players play. Very physical, lots of players going to the ground and flopping around. Almost all (there are exceptions) have been called loose and represent great examples of letting the players play the game. If more parents watched the WC, maybe sideline hysterics would be less.
To answer the OP's original question:
http://media.calsouth.com/data/Down...reeDisciplinaryCommitteeOverview.pdf?rev=808F
http://media.calsouth.com/data/Down...reeDisciplinaryCommitteeOverview.pdf?rev=808F
Surfref
PREMIER
I am sure that I am going to hurt someone's feelings with this post. I am not a perfect referee and miss stuff in a game, but I have far more training on the LOTG and how to implement them than 95 percent of the parents sitting on the sidelines. This is focused on the youth game. Most spectators (parents) do not have a clue when comes to the LOTG and how they are interpreted and applied. One of the dumbest things I hear spectators yell is "you are calling more fouls on team (insert team name)" or "call it the same for both teams." No two teams play the same, foul the same or want the same fouls called against them. I had a game where the red team was fouling the crap out of the blue team and the blue team is committing no fouls, and what do I hear from the sideline, "come on ref you are calling everything against red" or "call it both ways ref." Then the red a red player starts to loudly yell at me the same BS said by the parents and I have to issue him a Yellow card for dissent. Then a red player commits a reckless tackle and I give that player a Yellow card. The parents then yell "Let them play." I think, "Idiot, if I let them play someone is going to get hurt." Then a red player (the one that got the Yellow for dissent) gets fouled in the Penalty area (10 yards in front of me) and before I can blow the whistle for the PK the red player grabs the blue player by his collar and throws him to the ground. Now we have a second Yellow and ejection for the red player and a PK for the red team. What do I hear from the sidelines, "you can't give a yellow card to a player that got fouled" and "Ref, you don't know what the f*#k you are doing." I call the Red coach onto the field and ask him to remove the parent wearing the blue Dodgers hat and explain to the coach what happened with the foul and card. Coach is calm and says thank you for the explanation and sends the parent to the parking lot. PK gets converted and I blow the whistle for halftime 10 minutes later only to have the referee coordinators waiting for me and telling me there were complaints that I don't have control of the game. I find out later from the field marshal that it was the parents that complained. So, yes the referee associations and coordinators do listen to complaints even though most are not valid complaints. The Referee coordinators watch the first 15 minutes of the second half and after the game came over to get the two Red card reports (red team got a second Red card for DOGSO). They said from what they saw I did a good job. SO, parents PLEASE just shut the F up and just cheer for your team since most of you clearly do not have a clue when it comes to the LOTG and their application.
Perfect - this is what I was looking for - thank you.
I think that overall what everyone has responded to fits in certain situations. It's difficult to keep my GK calm when the game get's super physical and actual contact gets made (1:1 collisions). As testosterone levels increase so do the attitudes and the desire to protect one's team (backend defense specifically). Our coach does a great job of keeping the focus on situational awareness and professionalism but even in the heat of the moment, we need ref's to step in and calm the water. I'm sure we can all agree, no matter what the age group, it's only going to get worse.
It's this type of example I can get behind. Attempting to corral the kid's and the removal of the volatile parent is what I'm more interested in seeing. Letting the "kids play" only goes so far. When it becomes physical and the development of the game is lost is really where I see the kids losing out the most. God help me if I have to hear another parent heckle or talk at field players or mock the refs. I get that in a perfect world it would be even playing but thats just not going to happen. Where I'm mostly concerned is that nothing is called. The blatant kick after the play, the extra shove while heading the ball. The stepping on the hands of the keeper to the point where his gloves tear open is where I draw the line.
coachrefparent
GOLD
More importantly, who won?
Surfref
PREMIER
Tie game 2-2. The two teams were from outside of Cali otherwise I would not have provided as many details.
Frank
GOLD
Had a crl game u13 boys. Had a parent that was just destroying his kid. Going on all game and the kid was clearly distracted and basically in tears. Finally, i had enough and I asked the kid so you want me to get rid of him. His reply, “ please sir”. I went to the coach and let him know what was going on and that he needed to deal with it before I did. Coach said this guy is a pain and went and told him to go.
Kid dominated the rest of the way and scored the game winner late.
Usually try and stay out of the sidelines business, however this was abuse.
Kid dominated the rest of the way and scored the game winner late.
Usually try and stay out of the sidelines business, however this was abuse.
GunninGopher
SILVER ELITE
U13 is about right for you to feel this way. This kids are getting bigger, faster and more aggressive. Just wait 2-3 years from now when the testosterone kicks in and the boys start to try to pick fights with each other. Hopefully you'll get to be a like most parents and chill out before then and don't make things worse.
Definitelynotanotherref
SILVER ELITE
I personally believe U13/U14 is the worst age to referee. You have the dumbest height and size differentials because puberty is hitting the kids at different times. Because puberty is hitting them, its their first dose of testosterone so half of them are wilder than their peers. They have the strength of older kids with the coordination of younger kids. Despite being old enough and big enough to do damage to each other, the parents still think its "their little boy/girl" so they are loud and try to get involved like parents of the youngers. (trust me, when they get to high school, your kid will tell you to shut up and stop embarrassing them, parents of older kids are better behaved because of this). Lastly, logic is not as developed in Middle schoolers than high schoolers, not a knock against them, just a pedagogical fact, that means I actually have an easier time controlling high schoolers than middle schoolers. I know how to man manage, but man managing middle schoolers is like trying to teach a parrot to talk, they kinda get what you are getting at, but have no idea what you really mean.
Just a Parent
SILVER ELITE
What's wrong with no-calls?
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/18/...edCoverage®ion=EndOfArticle&pgtype=article
Good read on crisis of referee numbers and abusive sideline behavior
Good read on crisis of referee numbers and abusive sideline behavior
Definitelynotanotherref
SILVER ELITE
Interesting thought experiment that is not verifiable:
Take an "average" referee that lets a game "get out of control."
Then go back in time and replace him with a "great" referee, but set the condition that the great referee has to make every single call exactly the same way that the average one did.
I believe the "great" referee would be able to use his superior personality and presence to "not let the game get out of control".
This means 2 things. 1. that it is ultimately the players that let the game get out of control, not the average ref. Just because the parents are out of town doesn't mean they can trash the house, just because the referee can't assert his authority properly doesn't mean players should act like animals. And 2: It is not the calls that the referee makes that determine how good he is. Great refs can call a physical or a tight game and manage each style with no problem with their personality.
Take an "average" referee that lets a game "get out of control."
Then go back in time and replace him with a "great" referee, but set the condition that the great referee has to make every single call exactly the same way that the average one did.
I believe the "great" referee would be able to use his superior personality and presence to "not let the game get out of control".
This means 2 things. 1. that it is ultimately the players that let the game get out of control, not the average ref. Just because the parents are out of town doesn't mean they can trash the house, just because the referee can't assert his authority properly doesn't mean players should act like animals. And 2: It is not the calls that the referee makes that determine how good he is. Great refs can call a physical or a tight game and manage each style with no problem with their personality.